GDTV 2005 TRANSCRIPT Russia and the U.S. in the Age of Terrorism

Moderator:

Dr. Peter Krogh Dean Emeritus of the Edmund Walsh School of Foreign Service at Georgetown University

Guest:

Sergey Lavrov Minister of Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation

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Krogh>> ALONG WITH THE U.S., RUSSIA IS FACING ITS OWN AGE OF TERROR AND THREATS FROM WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION. WHERE WILL THEY GO FROM HERE? RUSSIA AND THE U.S. IN THE AGE OF TERRORISM: COMING UP NEXT ON "GREAT DECISIONS 2005."

>> GREAT DECISIONS IS PRODUCED BY THE FOREIGN POLICY ASSOCIATION IN ASSOCIATION WITH GEORGETOWN UNIVERSITY'S WALSH SCHOOL OF FOREIGN SERVICE. FUNDING FOR "GREAT DECISIONS" IS PROVIDED BY THE STARR FOUNDATION, THE MORSE FAMILY FOUNDATION, THE WILLIAM AND KAREN TELL FOUNDATION, AND CITIGROUP PRIVATE BANK.

AND NOW FROM OUR WASHINGTON D.C. STUDIO, HERE IS PETER KROGH.

Krogh>> IN DECEMBER OF 1991, THE WORLD WATCHED IN AWE AS THE SOVIET UNION DISSOLVED INTO 15 INDEPENDENT NATIONS. THE GLOBAL GEOPOLITICAL LANDSCAPE WAS TRANSFORMED. AND WITH THE COLLAPSE OF ITS FORMIDABLE ADVERSARY, THE UNITED STATES WAS FACED WITH THE CHALLENGE OF REFORMULATING ITS FOREIGN POLICY FROM THE GROUND UP.

AT THE SAME TIME, THE NEWLY FORMED RUSSIAN FEDERATION, THE LARGEST COUNTRY IN THE WORLD TODAY, FACED AN EVEN GREATER

CHALLENGE, THAT OF NATION BUILDING. IN TRANSITIONING TO DEMOCRACY AND A FREE MARKET, RUSSIA HAS ALSO HAD TO CONTEND WITH STRUCTURAL CHALLENGES, REGIONAL CONFLICTS, RUNAWAY MIGRATION, AND ORGANIZED CRIME, AMONG MANY OTHER ISSUES. ON THE FOREIGN RELATIONS FRONT, RUSSIA IS STILL STRUGGLING TO FIND ITS PLACE AMIDST MOUNTING GLOBALIZATION.

IN JANUARY OF 2001, PRESIDENT VLADIMIR PUTIN OUTLINED A NEW RUSSIAN FOREIGN POLICY AIMED AT CREATING STABLE CONDITIONS IN THE REGION THROUGH INTEGRATION INTO THE WORLD COMMUNITY. AT THE TIME, PUTIN STRESSED THE DANGER OF INTERNATIONAL TERRORISM AND FUNDAMENTALISM OF ANY TYPE. RUSSIA, HE REALIZED, WOULD HAVE A DIRECT STAKE IN HELPING TO CREATE EFFECTIVE MECHANISMS OF INTERNATIONAL COOPERATION TO COMBAT TERRORISM. IN LATE SUMMER OF 2004, TERRORIST ATTACKS IN RUSSIA ESCALATED.

EXPLOSIONS AT TWO BUS STOPS IN JULY WERE FOLLOWED BY TWIN AIRLINER ATTACKS ON AUGUST 24. ONE WEEK LATER, A SUICIDE BOMBER DETONATED HERSELF OUTSIDE A CROWDED MOSCOW SUBWAY STATION, KILLING 8 PEOPLE. RUSSIA WAS LEFT REELING FROM THIS SERIES OF ATTACKS, BUT THEY WERE ONLY A PRELUDE TO THE HORRIFYING BESLAN SCHOOL SIEGE.

ON SEPTEMBER 1, 2004, ARMED NATIONAL TERRORISTS HELD OVER 1,000 PEOPLE CAPTIVE IN A SCHOOL IN THE RUSSIAN TOWN OF BESLAN IN NORTH OSSETIA. A 3-DAY STANDOFF CULMINATED IN A SHOOTOUT BETWEEN THE HOSTAGE-TAKERS AND RUSSIAN SECURITY FORCES. 335 CIVILIANS WERE KILLED, HALF OF THEM CHILDREN. RUSSIANS WOULD COME TO CALL BESLAN THEIR OWN 9/11.

IN THE AFTERMATH, PRESIDENT PUTIN PLEDGED TO MOBILIZE THE NATION AGAINST THE "TOTAL, CRUEL, FULL-SCALE WAR" BEING WAGED ON RUSSIA BY "INTERNATIONAL TERRORISM." HE INTRODUCED A PLAN TO DRASTICALLY CHANGE THE FACE OF RUSSIAN POLITICS BY GRANTING GREATER CONTROL OF REGIONAL GOVERNMENTS TO MOSCOW. WHILE MANY ENDORSED PUTIN'S PROPOSALS, OTHERS CRITICIZED THEM AS AN OPPORTUNISTIC POWER GRAB.

WILL REFORMING THE ELECTORAL STRUCTURE IN RUSSIA BE AN EFFECTUAL MEASURE AGAINST TERRORISM?

OR IS IT A STEP BACKWARDS FOR DEMOCRACY?

WE NOW GO TO THE FOREIGN POLICY ASSOCIATION'S WORLD LEADERSHIP FORUM, WHERE RUSSIAN FOREIGN MINISTER H.E. SERGEY LAVROV DEFENDS PRESIDENT PUTIN'S PLAN AS NECESSARY TO ENSURE

THE SAFETY AND SECURITY OF RUSSIA AND ITS CITIZENS. HE ASSERTS THAT THE INTENDED REFORMS ARE IN LINE WITH DEMOCRATIC PRINCIPLES AND FULLY WITHIN THE BOUNDS OF THE RUSSIANCONSTITUTION.

LAVROV DRAWS MANY PARALLELS BETWEEN SEPTEMBER 11th AND THE BESLAN HOSTAGE CRISIS. HAVING BEEN IN NEW YORK DURINGTHE WORLD TRADE CENTER ATTACKS, HE OBSERVED FIRSTHAND THE SWIFT AND FORCEFUL AMERICAN REACTION DURING A TIME OF CRISIS. LAVROV BELIEVES THAT THIS KIND OF RESPONSIVENESS HAS NOW BECOME THE FOUNDATION FOR AND INDEED A REQUIREMENT OF A SUCCESSFUL INTERNATIONAL COUNTER-TERRORIST COALITION.

Lavrov>> I BELIEVE THOSE ARE THE DAYS WHEN WE DO HAVE TO MAKE SOME REASSESSMENT OF WHAT WE WANT TO ACHIEVE AND HOW WE WANT TO ACHIEVE THIS IN FOREIGN POLICY AND INTERNATIONAL AFFAIRS IN GENERAL. THE COLD WAR IS BEHIND US. THIS WAS THE CASE FOR BASICALLY MORE THAN ONE DECADE ALREADY. BUT WE STILL LIVE THROUGH A TRANSITION, I WOULD SAY. AND THE TRANSITION IS SUPPOSED TO BE TOWARDS A NEW INTERNATIONAL SYSTEM, A NEW INTERNATIONAL ORDER, WHATEVER YOU CALL IT.

BUT WE CANNOT REALLY SAY THAT WE KNOW WHAT THIS NEW SYSTEM WOULD LOOK LIKE. WE CAN ONLY BE VERY MUCH CONCERNED THAT THE MODERN WORLD BECOMES NOT ONLY MORE INTERDEPENDENT, BUT ALSO MUCH LESS MANAGEABLE. AS IT USED TO BE AT THE TIMES TO WHICH THE INTRODUCER REFERRED, WHEN THE COLD WAR NEGATIVE BALANCE--LET ME PUT IT THIS WAY--BETWEEN THE TWO SUPERPOWERS, BETWEEN THE TWO BLOCS WERE KEEPING THE GLOBE IN RELATIVE QUIET. IT'S MUCH DIFFERENT NOW, AND THE THREATS AND CHALLENGES WHICH WE ALL FACE REQUIRE SOME COMMON STRATEGY, BUT SO FAR IN MY VIEW, WE ARE ABLE JUST TO REACT TO THEM, NOT TO PREVENT THEM, NOT TO MANAGE THEM.

AND THE SCALE OF THESE THREATS AND CHALLENGES IS GROWING. THE FIRST QUESTION TO ASK IS WHETHER THE INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY CAN, IN A CLEAR AND ACCEPTABLE TO ALL LEGAL BASIS, THROUGH A MULTILATERAL COLLECTIVE EFFORT, TO FIND A WAY TOWARDS A MORE STABLE AND MORE SAFE WORLD ORDER. UNFORTUNATELY, IF ANY PROOF WAS NEEDED THAT TERRORISTS DON'T HAVE ANY SCRUPLES, DON'T HAVE ANY MORALITY, DON'T HAVE ANY ETHICS, THEN THE TRAGEDY IN BESLAN REMOVED ALL THOSE DOUBTS. AND WE ARE PROFOUNDLY GRATEFUL

TO PRESIDENT BUSH, TO AMERICAN ADMINISTRATION, TO THE AMERICAN PEOPLE WHO IN THESE TRAGIC DAYS EXPRESSED THEIR SOLIDARITY

WITH THE RUSSIAN PEOPLE. AND PRESIDENT BUSH STOOD, AND STILL STANDS, SHOULDER-TO-SHOULDER WITH US. WE SHOULD REALLY DROP THE COLD WAR HABITS TO DIVIDE TERRORISTS INTO GOOD TERRORISTS AND BAD TERRORISTS, FREEDOM FIGHTERS, OUR TERRORISTS, YOUR TERRORISTS. IF WE HAVE THIS INERTIA, WE WOULD LOSE THIS WAR.

AND THE RESPONSE TO THIS THREAT COULD BE ONLY COMMON--ONLY VERY CONSISTENT, WITHOUT ANY COMPROMISES, WITH THOSE WHO PLAN, SPONSOR, INSPIRE AND OF COURSE EXECUTE TERRORIST ACTS. I WOULD ALSO HIGHLIGHT THE NEED TO FIGHT THOSE WHO PROVIDE FINANCING FOR ALL THESE ACTIVITIES. THERE CAN BE NO DOUBLE STANDARDS IN THIS FIGHT. AFTER BESLAN, WE MADE VERY SEVERE CONCLUSIONS FOR OURSELVES.

AND I THINK THAT AMERICANS, ESPECIALLY NEW YORKERS, WHO LIVED THROUGH THE TRAGEDY OF SEPTEMBER 11, MAYBE BETTER THAN OTHERS CAN UNDERSTAND THE MEANING OF THOSE MEASURES WHICH THE RUSSIAN GOVERNMENT IS UNDERTAKING IN ORDER TO ENSURE THE SECURITY AND SAFETY OF THE COUNTRY AND ITS CITIZENS. I WOULD REMIND YOU ONCE AGAIN, AS PRESIDENT PUTIN SAID, THOSE MEASURES ARE GOING TO BE UNDERTAKEN ON THE BASIS OF THE RUSSIAN CONSTITUTION AND HE CLEARLY STATED THAT RUSSIA WOULD REMAIN A DEMOCRATIC COUNTRY -- AND THAT ONLY AS A DEMOCRATIC COUNTRY WE CAN GET THE DIGNIFIED PLACE IN THE INTERNATIONAL SYSTEM WHICH IS BEING FORMED THIS VERY DAY.

FOR US, WITH OUR HUGE TERRITORY AND LARGE POPULATION, WHICH IS MULTINATIONAL AND MULTILINGUAL, MULTICULTURAL, MULTI- RELIGIOUS, THE VERY IMPORTANT THING IS TO STRENGTHEN THE UNITY OF THE COUNTRY AND NOT TO ALLOW THE TERRORISTS TO UNDERMINE IT. AND THIS REQUIRES A VERY EFFECTIVE STATE POWER; OTHERWISE WE DON'T SEE HOW WE CAN DEFEAT THE TERRORISTS WE MUST NOT ONLY JUST ADAPT THE EXECUTIVE BRANCH TO BE ABLE TO BETTER REACT TO EMERGENCIES, BUT WE MUST RESTRUCTURE IT IN ORDER TO EFFECTIVELY COUNTER THE TERRORIST THREAT, PREVENTING IT IF POSSIBLE. AND IT IS EXACTLY THE MEANING OF THE MEASURES, WHICH HAVE BEEN ANNOUNCED BY PRESIDENT PUTIN AND WHICH WOULD BE ENACTED THROUGH THE PARLIAMENT, INCLUDING THE CHANGING OF THE WAY IN WHICH THE HEADS OF EXECUTIVE BRANCHES OF THE REGIONS ARE ELECTED--AND I WOULD STRESS ELECTED, NOT APPOINTED. HE WOULD BE PROPOSING HIS CANDIDATES TO THE REGIONAL LEGISLATURES AND IT WOULD BE THE LEGISLATURES WHO WOULD HAVE THE FINAL SAY IN WHOM THEY WANT TO ELECT AS THE HEAD OF THE EXECUTIVE.

AT THE SAME TIME WE CERTAINLY UNDERSTAND THAT THE FIGHT AGAINST TERROR COULD ONLY BE EFFECTIVE IF IT IS SUPPORTED BY THE CIVIL SOCIETY. ONE OF THE KEY ELEMENTS OF THE CIVIL SOCIETY ARE NATIONAL PARTIES, POLITICAL PARTIES.IN ORDER TO STRENGTHEN THE POLITICAL PARTIES IN RUSSIA, IT IS GOING TO BE PROPOSED TO CHANGE OUR LEGISLATION SO THAT ELECTIONS TO THE RUSSIAN PARLIAMENT TO THE DUMA, TO THE STATE DUMA OF THE RUSSIAN FEDERATION, BE CONDUCTED ON THE BASIS OF PROPORTIONAL SYSTEM. THIS WOULD NOT CHANGE, BY OUR ASSESSMENT, THE CORRELATION OF POLITICAL FORCES INSIDE THE PARLIAMENT BECAUSE GIVEN THE DEPUTIES, THE MEMBERS OF THE DUMA WHO ARE INDIVIDUALLY ELECTED UNDER THE CURRENT SYSTEM, 99% OF THEM JOIN ONE OR ANOTHER POLITICAL FACTION IN THE DUMA.

AND BESIDES, WE THINK THAT THE MULTI-PARTY SYSTEM, WHICH IS THE BASIS OF MODERN DEMOCRACY, WOULD CERTAINLY BE STRENGTHENED. WHAT WE WANT TO ACHIEVE BY THIS IS TO CREATE IN RUSSIA A STRONG DEMOCRATIC AUTHORITY, WHICH WOULD BE ABLE TO PROTECT THE COUNTRY FROM EXTREMISTS OF ANY KIND. AND, IN FACT, WE DON'T WANT TO

HAVE MORE THAN YOU HAVE IN THE UNITED STATES, NAMELY AN EFFICIENT AND EFFECTIVE ADMINISTRATION, WHICH IS STRONG NOT ONLY BY THE GOVERNMENT AGENCIES, INCLUDING LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCIES, BUT WHICH IS ALSO STRONG BY THE VIGILANCE OF ITS PEOPLE. THE FUNDAMENTAL DEMOCRATIC VALUES ARE COMMON. THEY ARE UNIVERSAL, BUT OF COURSE THEY ARE IMPLEMENTED AND TRANSLATED INTO PRACTICAL LIFE IN EACH COUNTRY NOT IN THE SAME MANNER.

Krogh>> MOST AGREE THAT THE ADMINISTRATIVE STRUCTURES AND THE SECURITY FORCES IN RUSSIA HAVE LONG HAD PROBLEMS OF INEFFICIENCY AND CORRUPTION, ESPECIALLY AT THE REGIONAL LEVEL. LAVROV ARGUES THAT PUTIN'S PROPOSED MEASURES ARE SQUARELY AIMED AT REFORMING THE BUREAUCRACY, NOT DEMOCRACY. HE BELIEVES THAT BUILDING DISCIPLINE AND ACCOUNTABILITY INTO THE POLITICAL POWER STRUCTURE OF RUSSIA IS ABSOLUTELY ESSENTIAL IN ORDER TO COUNTER THE TERRORIST THREAT.

IN RUSSIA, JUST AS IN THE U.S.,LAVROV ACKNOWLEDGES THERE IS A TENSION BETWEEN PRESERVATION OF CIVIL LIBERTIES AND VIGOROUS DEFENSE OF NATIONAL SECURITY. BUT HE ENDORSES A POLICY OF TOUGH PROACTIVENESS IN MAKING SECURITY CONCERNS FIRST PRIORITY. LAVROV ALSO URGES GREATER MULTILATERAL COORDINATION AGAINST TERRORISM, WITH UNIVERSAL STANDARDS AND EFFECTIVE ENFORCEMENT MECHANISMS.

WE NOW GO BACK TO HIS ADDRESS AT THE WORLD LEADERSHIP FORUM, AS HE CALLS FOR THE UNITED NATIONS TO BECOME THE UNIFYING AUTHORITY FOR THESE INTERNATIONAL EFFORTS.

Lavrov>> WE BELIEVE THAT WE MUST, WE, THE INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY, WE MUST BE ON THE OFFENSIVE AGAINST THE FIGHT ON TERROR. AND I FULLY SHARE WHAT PRESIDENT BUSH SAID YESTERDAY REGARDING THE NEED FOR ALL OF US TO PUT THE COUNTER-TERRORIST FIGHT ON TOP OF OUR AGENDA. I WILL BE ADDRESSING THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY TOMORROW AND I WILL BE MAKING THE SAME POINT. AND WE MUST MAKE SURE THAT TERRORISTS DON'T HAVE ACCESS TO WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION, ESPECIALLY TO THE NUCLEAR MATERIAL.

WE MUST STRENGTHEN THE NON-PROLIFERATION REGIMES. WE ARE PROPOSING QUITE A FEW MEASURES TO THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY TO MAKE THE COUNTER-TERRORIST COMMITTEE OF THE SECURITY COUNCIL, CREATED AFTER 9/11, MORE EFFICIENT BY ENLARGING ITS COOPERATION WITH REGIONAL ORGANIZATIONS, BY ASKING REGIONAL ORGANIZATIONS ON ALL CONTINENTS TO PAY MORE ATTENTION TO THE COUNTER-TERRORIST FIGHT, INCLUDING PREVENTING THE FINANCING OF TERRORIST ACTIVITIES.

IT IS ABSOLUTELY ESSENTIAL TO HAVE THE UNITED NATIONS AS THE COORDINATING CENTER, WHICH COULD BE USED, IN VERY GOOD SENSE OF THIS WORD, COULD BE USED BY ALL OF US, ESPECIALLY BY THE UNITED STATES AND RUSSIA AND THE EUROPEAN UNION AS THE UNITING MECHANISM AND AS THE DISCIPLINING MECHANISM IF ONE ORANOTHER COUNTRY WOULD NOT LIKETO FOLLOW THE UNIVERSAL STANDARDS, WHICH ARE VERY HIGH AND WHICH HAVE BEEN DEVELOPED IN THE LAST FEW YEARS, ADDITIONALLY.

ONCE AGAIN, I WOULD LIKE TO REITERATE OUR GRATITUDE TO THE GOVERNMENT AND THE PEOPLE OF THE UNITED STATES FOR THE SOLIDARITY SHOWN REGARDING THE TRAGEDY IN BESLAN AND, IN SPITE OF OBVIOUS DIFFERENCES--WHICH WE STILL HAVE QUITE A NUMBER OF ISSUES-- DURING THE LAST YEARS OUR COUNTRIES MANAGED TO BUILD A NEW MODEL OF RELATIONS, WHICH ALLOWS US, IN SPITE OF THE NEGATIVE DEVELOPMENTS IN THE WORLD, DESPITE DIFFICULTIES TO KEEP A VERY POSITIVE DYNAMISM IN RUSSIAN-AMERICAN PARTNERSHIP.

I DO BELIEVE THE UNITED STATES IS IN THE SEARCH OF ITS OWN MISSION. RUSSIA IS IN THE SEARCH OF THE WAYS TO KEEP AND STRENGTHEN ITS IDENTITY AND ITS UNITY. BUT WE ARE IN QUITE DIFFERENT ECONOMIC SITUATIONS INSIDE THE WORLD ECONOMY. BUT I STILL BELIEVE THAT

THE PARTNERSHIP BETWEEN THE UNITED STATES AND RUSSIA IS THE KEY TO THE SUCCESS OF COUNTER-TERRORIST COALITION. IT IS A KEY TO THE STRENGTHENING OF THE UNITED NATIONS AND OUR COMMON INTERESTS AND IT'S THE KEY FOR PROMOTING A MULTILATERAL PARTNERSHIP OF KEY PLAYERS IN THE GLOBAL ARENA, INCLUDING EUROPE, CHINA, JAPAN, INDIA, BRAZIL, THE LEADING COUNTRIES OF RESPECTIVE CONTINENTS.

Krogh>> LAVROV SEES A PARTNERSHIP BETWEEN THE UNITED STATES AND RUSSIA AS CRITICAL TO THE SUCCESS OF A COUNTER-TERRORIST COALITION. ONE KEY REASON IS THAT THESE TWO COUNTRIES HAVE 96% OF ALL THE WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION AND MATERIALS IN THE WORLD. THE UNITED STATES AND RUSSIA BOTH BEAR A SPECIAL RESPONSIBILITY TO REDUCE STOCKPILES AND ENSURE THAT THEY DO NOT FALL INTO THE HANDS OF TERRORISTS. IS ENOUGH BEING DONE? ARE THERE SUFFICIENT SECURITY AND MONITORING SYSTEMS IN PLACE FOR NUCLEAR MATERIAL IN RUSSIA?

INCREASINGLY POROUS BORDERS, ALONG WITH RAMPANT CORRUPTION AND ECONOMIC DESPERATION, HAVE LED TO CONDITIONS WHERE WEAPONS THEFT HAS OCCURRED. HOW CAN THIS BE PREVENTED IN THE FUTURE?

Lavrov>> THE GOVERNING BOARD OF THE INTERNATIONAL ATOMIC ENERGY AGENCY JUST A FEW DAYS AGO, LAST SATURDAY ACTUALLY, ADOPTED A RESOLUTION, WHICH WAS SUBMITTED BY THE EUROPEAN COUNTRIES OF BRITAIN, FRANCE AND GERMANY AND WHICH WAS THE BASIS FOR NEGOTIATIONS. WE ARE ALL ON THE SAME POSITION. NEITHER THE UNITED STATES NOR THE RUSSIAN FEDERATION NOR THE EUROPEANS NOR I BELIEVE AND HOPE ANYBODY ELSE WANTS TO HAVE ANOTHER NUCLEAR POWER.

WE RECOGNIZE THE RIGHT OF ALL COUNTRIES, INCLUDING IRAN, FOR PEACEFUL USES OF NUCLEAR ENERGY BUT WE CANNOT BE COMPLACENT IN A SITUATION WHEN WE DON'T UNDERSTAND THE REASONS WHY IRAN, FOR EXAMPLE, WANTS TO ENRICH URANIUM AND MAYBE EVEN TO GET PLUTONIUM WHEN IT SAYS THAT THIS WOULD BE FOR PEACEFUL PURPOSES. FOR PEACEFUL PURPOSES THEY HAVE ONLY ONE NUCLEAR POWER STATION BEING BUILT WITH RUSSIAN ASSISTANCE. FOR THIS STATION WE INSISTED TO HAVE A PROTOCOL SIGNED THAT THE FUEL WOULD BE PROVIDED BY RUSSIA AND THE SPENT FUEL WOULD BE RETURNED TO RUSSIA. THIS WAS AN IRON-CLAD CONDITION AND THEY ACCEPTED. AND THIS STATION OF COURSE IS UNDER THE FULL SAFE GUARDS OF THE IAEA. ENRICHMENT FOR THE PURPOSES TO PRODUCE FUEL EVEN IF THEY WOULD BUILD NEW POWER STATIONS, NUCLEAR POWER STATIONS, IN THE FUTURE IS NOT ECONOMICALLY VIABLE. IT'S MUCH MORE EXPENSIVE THAN TO GET FUEL FROM ABROAD. AND WE

TOLD OUR IRANIAN COLLEAGUES, EUROPEANS TOLD THEM THE SAME, THAT IF YOU NEED THE FUEL FOR FUTURE POWER STATIONS, WE CAN SIGN A GUARANTY THAT WE WOULD PROVIDE THIS FUEL, THAT WE WOULD TAKE BACK THIS SPENT FUEL, BUT YOU DON'T NEED ENRICHMENT.

SO THESE ENRICHMENT ACTIVITIES, WHICH IRAN IS RESUMING, IT'S NOT A TREATY OBLIGATION. IT'S NOT A LEGAL OBLIGATION OF IRAN BUT IT'S A POLITICAL COMMITMENT, WHICH IT UNDERTOOK SOME TIME AGO. AND WE WOULD KEEP IRAN TO THIS COMMITMENT AND WE--IF, YOU KNOW, YOU ASK ME WHETHER WE WOULD BE HAVING SECOND THOUGHTS IN THE EXPECTATION TO GET SOME COMMERCIAL BENEFIT FROM PROVIDING NUCLEAR POWER STATIONS TO IRAN, I CAN ASSURE YOU THAT ANY PROFIT WE CAN GET FROM THIS, ANY COMMERCIAL PROFIT, IS NOTHING COMPARED TO THE THREAT OF HAVING ANOTHER NUCLEAR POWER AND WE WOULD NEVER ACCEPT THIS. AND WE WOULD BE--WE ARE UNITED WITH THE U.S., EUROPE, AND OTHER MEMBERS OF THE GOVERNING COUNCIL OF THE IAEA. WE JUST ADOPTED A RESOLUTION SAYING THAT IRAN MUST STOP ENRICHMENT.

Krogh>> SPEAKING AGAIN TO QUESTIONS ABOUT THE DIRECT RELATION BETWEEN PUTIN'S PLAN FOR RESTRUCTURING THE RUSSIAN GOVERNMENT AND THE WAR ON TERROR, LAVROV GOES INTO GREATER DETAIL ON THE EXACT MEASURES AND THEIR IMPLICATIONS. UNDER PUTIN'S PLAN, FOR INSTANCE, REGIONAL GOVERNORS WOULD BE NOMINATED BY THE PRESIDENT AND CONFIRMED BY LOCAL LEGISLATURES. AT PRESENT, THESE REPRESENTATIVES ARE ELECTED BY POPULAR VOTE. IN A VAST COUNTRY WITH 89 REGIONAL GOVERNORSHIPS HOWEVER, CORRUPTION AND AFFILIATION WITH ORGANIZED CRIME IS NOT UNCOMMON AT THE REGIONAL LEVEL.

LAVROV ARGUES THAT APPOINTING THE GOVERNORS WILL ALIGN PRIORITIES WITH THOSE OF THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT TO RESPOND TO AND FIGHT TERRORISM MORE EFFICIENTLY.

Question>> COULD YOU PLEASE ELABORATE ON HOW TAKING ELECTORAL CONTROL OUT OF THE VARIOUS FEDERAL STATES AND CENTRALIZING IT IN MOSCOW CONTRIBUTES TO THE WAR ON TERROR?

Lavrov>> I SPECIFICALLY SAID THAT IT IS NOT THE APPOINTMENT WHICH PUTIN SUGGESTED. IT IS THE ELECTION BY THE NATIONAL LEGISLATURE INSTEAD OF DIRECT ELECTION BY THE REGIONAL POPULATION AND IT IS ALSO THE ELECTION ON THE BASIS OF CANDIDATURES, WHICH WOULD BE SUBMITTED BY THE PRESIDENT.

WE NEED THE EXECUTIVE BRANCH, WE NEED IT AT THIS STAGE, I DON'T KNOW WHAT WILL BE THE REQUIREMENTS LATER, BUT AT THIS STAGE WE ABSOLUTELY NEED THE UNIFIED EXECUTIVE FROM MOSCOW TO THE REGIONS. AND TODAY'S PRACTICE VERY OFTEN THE GOVERNORS ARE ELECTED ON THE BASIS OF NOT VERY GOOD PRACTICES, WHICH VIOLATE THE CONSTITUTION, WHICH VIOLATE THE NORMS.

CORRUPTION IS A FACTOR. CRIMINAL GROUPS ARE A FACTOR, WHO WOULD LIKE THEIR REPRESENTATIVES IN TOP PLACES AND THOSE PEOPLE OF COURSE WOULD BE MORE CONCERNED ABOUT MAKING MORE MONEY THROUGH ILLEGAL BUSINESS RATHER THAN ABOUT A UNITED STANCE AGAINST TERRORISM. ILLEGAL BUSINESS, WHICH VERY OFTEN IS RELATED TO THE ELECTED HEADS OF THE REGIONS, IS CONNECTED TO THE FINANCING OF SOME OF THE ACTIVITIES WHICH ARE RELATED TO TERRORISM. IT'S AN ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY STEP. IT'S TOTALLY WITHIN OUR CONSTITUTION, WHICH DEMANDS FROM THE PRESIDENT TO ENSURE THE UNIFIED SYSTEM OF THE EXECUTIVE. SO THIS IS AN ELECTION STILL, UNLIKE, FOR EXAMPLE, INDIA, WHERE GOVERNORS ARE APPOINTED BY THE CENTRAL GOVERNMENT. IT'S VERY MUCH CLOSE TO THE GERMAN SYSTEM, I THINK. AND OF COURSE IT'S INTERESTING THAT THESE ISSUES WERE NEVER ADDRESSED FROM THE POINT OF VIEW OF THE RUSSIAN UNITY. WE WANT TO BE STRONG AND DEMOCRATIC. WE SHOULDN'T BE AFRAID OF THIS.

Krogh>> SINCE THE DISSOLUTION OF THE SOVIET UNION, THE WORLD HAS HAD TO ADAPT TO A NEW BALANCE OF POWER. IT IS ARGUED THAT TWO OF THE COUNTRIES THAT HAD THE GREATEST CHALLENGE OF COMING TO GRIPS WITH THIS ADJUSTMENT HAVE BEEN THE UNITED STATES AND THE RUSSIAN FEDERATION.

AS THE NATIONS OF THE WORLD BECOME INCREASINGLY INTERDEPENDENT, THEY HAVE ALSO HAD TO RETHINK FOREIGN POLICY APPROACHES. FOR THE U.S. AND RUSSIA, THIS HAS MEANT A SHIFT FROM POLICIES BASED ON CONTAINMENT AND CONFRONTATION TO POLICIES DIRECTED AT A RANGE OF ISSUES, MANY OF WHICH DO NOT DERIVE FROM NATION STATES AT ALL.

INTERNATIONAL TERRORISM IS ARGUABLY THE MOST EVIDENT AND PRESSING OF THESE ISSUES FACING THE U.S. AND RUSSIA TODAY. BOTH NATIONS WILL NO DOUBT MOVE TOWARD DEVELOPING COLLECTIVE STRATEGIES IN PARTNERSHIP TO MEET NEW THREATS TO GLOBAL STABILITY AND SECURITY.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US FOR THIS EDITION OF "GREAT DECISIONS 2005."

I'M PETER KROGH.

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FUNDING FOR "GREAT DECISIONS" IS PROVIDED BY THE STARR FOUNDATION, THE MORSE FAMILY FOUNDATION, THE WILLIAM AND KAREN TELL FOUNDATION, AND CITIGROUP PRIVATE BANK.