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Home , Dante Fascell, George Pataki, Jerry Grafstein

Interview: The -US Inter- Parliamentary Group at 50

In May 2009 the Canada- Inter-Parliamentary Group marked its 50th anniversary. Senator Jerry Grafstein has been Co-Chair of the Canadian Section of the Group for fourteen years, the longest serving Chair in the history of the Group. He spoke about his reflections on the Group in April 2009 with Gary Levy.

What is the Canada-United United States. The standard of bit unusual in that it took place States Inter-Parliamentary living and well being of individu- entirely aboard one of the Alaska Group and why is it important? als on both sides of the border de- Marine Ferries as it travelled from pends on good political and eco- Prince Rupert to Alaska. At one The Group owes its origins to two nomic relations between the two point we were passing an iceberg American Congressmen, Brooks countries. and the captain announced he was Hays and Frank Coffin. During sending members of the crew over the 1950s they undertook a study When and how did you first to the iceberg to bring back some mission to Canada. They discov- become involved with the ice that would be used for the ered a lot of irritants ranging from Group? cocktails that evening. I told him Defence procurement to trade that in Canada we do ourselves issues. One of their recommen- The first meeting I attended was what you send crew to do and I dations was for an association of in 1987 in Vancouver. I also attend- insisted that I accompany them. legislators from the two countries. ed the 1995 meeting in Huntsville, He was reluctant to put me in all Every year since 1959 approxi- . Senator Bud Olson who the safety gear but I did not want mately 24 legislators from each was Co-Chair said he was retir- to miss the opportunity to set foot country get together to discuss ing and encouraged me to stand on an iceberg. matters of mutual interest. for the Executive Committee of the Canadian Section. He told me John Chafee, the Senator from The importance of the Group is I had the necessary interest and Rhode Island, (former Secretary obvious. Canada and the United energy to be a successful co-chair. of the Navy under Richard Nixon) State have an integrated economy. He said the Canadian Section overheard the conversation and Billions of dollars in goods cross needed someone with the right said he wanted to go as well. To the border every day and some chemistry to get along with the the consternation of the Captain estimate that 50% of all the jobs Americans. a half dozen Canadian and in Canada are related to our trade American legislators piled into the with the United States. We are the My first Conference as Co- lifeboat and headed off to the ice- largest suppliers of energy to the Chair was in 1996 and it was a berg. I am not sure if that is what

CANADIAN PARLIAMENTARY REVIEW/SUMMER 2009 43 Senator Olson had in mind when Representatives had just passed That sounds like the job of he talked about getting along with a bill with significant protection- the Canadian Embassy in the Americans but that certainly ist measures that might be harm- Washington? made me well known among the ful to Canadian manufacturers. I have worked with a number of Group. Such experiences go a I called the Canadian Embassy Canadian Ambassadors and they long way to cementing relation- and discovered that they had were all very capable individuals. ships that come in handy in politi- been unsuccessful in making the Alan Gotlieb in particular recog- cal life. Canadian case directly to legisla- nized the importance of work- tors about the dangers of this bill. ing with Congress as well as the Are you concerned about criti- I called Senator Charles Grassley, Executive. In fact, Canada has set cism that such trips are junkets a long-time member of the Group up an Advocacy Secretariat in the and a waste of money? and asked to see him. He briefed Canadian Embassy with a senior me on the background and said it Anyone who makes that argu- official and staff to deal with looked like the Bill had the votes ment does not understand the Congress and to facilitate con- to pass in the Senate that week. importance of personal and social tacts between Canadian legisla- He helped me set up a meet- contacts in making public policy tors, both federal and provincial, ing with Senate Minority Leader decisions. In 2000, the annual con- and American legislators. But the Mitch McConnell who was sym- ference took place aboard another Embassy is part of the Executive pathetic but told me they were a ship, the Delta Queen, a Mississippi and Congressmen are very suspi- couple of votes short of being able riverboat. As we steamed down cious of their own Executive let to filibuster the Bill. the river, the Canadians were alone representatives of foreign struck by the immensity and emp- With the division bells ringing countries. So it is much better to tiness of the American heartland. in the background I met a couple have Canadian parliamentarians In Natchez we stopped for a bus of Democratic Senators in the make the case to Senators and tour of the city and an old plan- corridors. I knew them very well Congressmen, provided they do it tation. My wife noticed the two from the Canada-United States effectively. Black members of Congress sit- Group meetings and I tried to ting at the back of the bus and she convince them to oppose the pro- How effective is the Canadian asked them to accompany her on tectionist clause. In this case I did Section? the plantation tour. not manage to change the bill, but When I started in 1987 the Group After the tour we were met by without the contacts made over was a vehicle for pleasant annual Trent Lott who was the Senate many years with the Group, I exchanges with our American Majority Leader and one of the would not have had the opportu- counterparts. Two factors altered most powerful individuals in nity to try. In any event, you have the context of the relationship. Congress. Not all conference itin- to look at politics over the long The first was the Canada-US Free eraries are as exotic as those two term and draw lessons from your Trade Agreement (later expand- boat trips but each one includes experiences. ed to the North American Free opportunities for legislators to see What lesson did you draw from Trade Agreement) which vastly parts of the North American con- that experience? increased the complexity of the tinent they might not otherwise relationship. The second was the be familiar with, to meet national, Anyone who understands terrorist attacks of September 11, state and local leaders, and to dis- American politics knows that if 2001, which added security as an cuss in both formal and informal you want to have any influence, important new element in the mix. settings whatever issues are of you must build alliances and dis- When I became Co-Chair I concern to their electors and their seminate information long before concluded that we needed more country. issues get to Congress. We need opportunities to meet between an early warning system to iden- the annual meetings. We also How does this help in your role tify issues that could potentially needed opportunities for our as a legislator? be harmful in Canada. We need Canadian members to partici- to make friends and allies inside Let me give you a recent example. pate in meetings with state leg- and outside of politics in order to I was on my way to Washington islators, governors, mayors and make our case in Washington. for some meetings when my private organizations devoted to staff told me that the House of Canadian-American relations. I

44 CANADIAN PARLIAMENTARY REVIEW/SUMMER 2009 the job of co-chair and he was very knowledgeable about energy and oil sands issues. He was also ap- pointed to Cabinet and once you are in Cabinet you can no longer attend meetings of the Group. The most recent Canadian co-chair is Gord Brown, elected in March 2009. He comes from a riding that is on the US border so I am sure he will be very active and energetic in the work of the Group. Aside from the co-chairs, Wayne Easter has been a long-time member and one of his main areas of interest is agriculture. He has become very good friends with The Co-Chairs of the Canadian Section of the Canada-United States Inter- Parliamentary Group in March 2009. Senator Grafstein (l) and Gordon Brown, Representative Collin Peterson MP. of Minnesota, Chair of the House Agriculture Committee. Over the years with the Group, I have seen worked to obtain a change in the National Governors Conference, many Canadian and American point system used for members’ Bill Richardson (New Mexico), legislators develop close personal travel. Now Senators and MPs (former Governor relationships. I believe this can can use some of their points for of ), Tim Pawlenty only help their professional work- trips to Washington provided it is (Minnesota), ing relationship as well. in relation to parliamentary busi- (former Governor of Arkansas), ness. This has greatly facilitated Jim Douglas (Vermont), Brian Who have been the most influen- the work of the Canadian section Schweitzer (Montana), John tial Americans in the Group? and we now send members to Baldacci (Maine), Haley Barbour Two Senators from Alaska, Frank meetings of state legislators, gov- (Mississippi, Timothy Kaine Murkowski and Ted Stevens ernors and other public and pri- (Virginia), Jon Huntsman (Utah), have both been very active in the vate bodies working on Canada- Jennifer Granholm (Michigan), Group serving as Chairs of the US Relations. Mark Sanford (South Carolina), US Section. Other Senate Chairs Martin O’Malley (Maryland), Achieving influence is an ardu- during my time include Daniel Sarah Palin (Alaska), and ous task which requires energy, Akaka of Hawaii, Mike Crapo Christine Gregoire (Washington continuity and resources. I think of Idaho and Amy Klobuchar of State). These Governors represent the Canadian Section is more Minnesota. From the House of States that have an active trading active and more effective than Representatives I have worked relationship with Canada. when I first took office. with Donald Manzullo of Illinois, Amo Houghton of New York and Why focus on American Are there Canadian parliamen- James Oberstar of Minnesota. Mr. Governors? tarians on the House side who have been as active as you? Oberstar has been involved with Governors are particularly im- the Group for almost 27 years portant political players and key I have worked with four House making him the Doyen of our to Canada’s economic and trade co-chairs. For several years it was Association. interests. Joe Comuzzi. He had a particu- lar interest in transportation and A frequent participant, al- In the last five or six years we issues relating to the St. Lawrence though never Chair, was Sam have met and developed working Seaway. He was succeeded Gibbons of . He attended relationships with more than 50 by Greg Thompson of New twenty meetings over three de- of the U.S. Governors including Brunswick who was later appoint- cades and during much of this Edward Rendell (Pennsylvania), ed to Cabinet. Rob Merrifield time he was Chair of the Trade currently Chairman of the brought a western perspective to sub-committee of the US House

CANADIAN PARLIAMENTARY REVIEW/SUMMER 2009 45 Committee on Foreign Relations. Surely there are some Congress- and on crutches, the day I met At any point, there could be many men who not so friendly to him. He immediately asked me if protectionist bills at various stages Canada? I was the author of the so called of Congress and he exercised a “anti-Helms” Bill which tried to Of course there are many areas degree of control over which of undo some of the provisions of the where the interests of the two these pieces of legislation reached Helms-Burton legislation insofar counties are opposed. We have the floor of the House. He was a as Canadian companies dealing some animated discussions where friend of Canada and a self-pro- with Cuba were concerned. He we can only agree to disagree. claimed free trader. expressed a grudging admiration Softwood lumber is one such for the Act and asked me what I was also some- issue. You must keep in mind wanted. I told him I did not want what of a mentor to me when I was that members of the US House anything except to help him and a young Canadian Senator trying have to face election every two his state. to figure out how the US Congress years. Some are under tremen- worked. He told me that cordial- dous pressure to defend the US He was somewhat taken aback ity, collegiality and respectfulness position of softwood lumber. We by this opening. Then I told him were the key to a successful career. were unable to completely resolve Ontario was South Carolina’s He emphasized the importance of the softwood lumber dispute but leading trade partner and pulled social interaction in getting things so were numerous governments, out some cards prepared by the done in Washington. West Virgina quasi judicial tribunals and ar- Canadian Embassy that showed Senator emphasized bitrators. Our efforts eventually the figures. He called in his Chief the same approach. helped bring about a “softwood of Staff, the person who had been Dante Fascell, also of Florida, agreement”. refusing my requests for a meet- ing for years, and asked him if was a frequent participant. His I want to emphasize, however, these figures were true. I told knowledge of foreign policy was that it is extremely important that him that we should work together phenomenal. Another Floridian, we not just associate with friends to organize some exchanges and , made a great impres- of Canada. I tried for years to ar- build upon the huge trading re- sion on me. He was a brilliant in- range a meeting with Jesse Helms lationship between Ontario and dividual and was later appointed of South Carolina, who was Chair South Carolina. He liked the idea Head of the Central Intelligence of the Senate Foreign Affairs and I think some such exchanges Agency. I also met at Committee. He was author of the actually took place. one of the meetings of the Group. Helms-Burton law that made it He was a Senator from Delaware an offence for companies, even I also asked him to consider and now is Vice President of the Canadian ones, to do business coming to one of our Canada-US United States. Other American with Cuba. Neither my office meetings and although he never legislators who have taken a spe- nor the Embassy could arrange a did, I knew the five minute meet- cial interest in Canada during meeting with him. ing was worth the effort. We must my time include be able to interact civilly with our On one trip to Washington I of Florida, George Voinovich of adversaries. made a courtesy call to Senator Ohio, Patrick Leahy of Vermont, Frank Murkowski. He asked me Fred Upton of Michigan, Mark How much of your time is de- if there was anything he could Souder of Indiana, Louise voted to the Canada-US Inter- do for me. I said, “Yes, see if Slaughter of New York and David Parliamentary Group? you can arrange a meeting with Drier of California. It is a long, Senator Helms.” A few minutes I do not compartmentalize my long list. later he called me to say I should time like that. Let me give you Sometimes Canadians com- be in Senator Helms office at an example. After the events of plain that Americans are ignorant 2:00. “Anything else”, he asked? 9/11 I organized a “Canada Loves about Canada and this may be “Yes”, I said, “Get a photographer NY” rally in . It true to some extent but we must because no one will believe me.” was intended to show Canadian also remember there are a number solidarity with New Yorkers in of American legislators who are How was the meeting with the face of their difficulties. I very well informed about Canada Senator Helms? booked the Roseland Ballroom in mid town which holds and we must make every attempt He was an imposing figure al- about 3,500 people. We invited to engage them. though he was over 80 years old

46 CANADIAN PARLIAMENTARY REVIEW/SUMMER 2009 a number of famous Canadians. How have your efforts been Chris Smith (New Jersey), Diane Even Prime Minister Chrétien recognized? Watson (California) and former came to New York for the event at Congresswoman Hilda Solis now I have received a number of the last minute. Labor Secretary in the Obama honours. One of the greatest Cabinet. The idea took on a life of its were being made an Honourary own and between 25,000 and Commandant of the US Marine At other meetings I have met 30,000 Canadians showed up. A Corps and given the Marine Gary Ackerman and huge screen was set up on 53rd Commandant’s coveted hat. of New York; Barney Frank Street to accommodate the over- Another was being made an of Massachusetts; Bart Stupak flow crowd. My friend from the Honourary Fire Chief of the New of Michigan; Henry Brown of Canada-United States Group, York Fire Department and given South Carolina; John Dingle and Amo Houghton, helped me to the Chief’s fire hat. I do not think Thaddeus McCotter of Michigan; get the , many Canadians can say they Henry Waxman and Loretta George Pataki, and Mayor Rudy are both an Honourary Marine Sanchez of California, all senior Guliani to address the rally. The Commandant and an Honourary Democrats in the House. Mayor presented us with a dec- NYPD Fire Chief! I have met with key mem- laration called: “Canada Loves bers of the Congressional Black Do you think Canadian interests New York Day”. I even convinced Caucus including its Chair, are known and appreciated in the White House to get President Carolyn Kilpatrick of Michigan the US? Bush to send our volunteer group and Democratic House Majority a letter. No. But it is up to us to make them Whip, James Clyburn from South It was a tremendous, moving known. I read US newspapers Carolina. experience. History buffs quipped every day and regularly watch I always seek out men and that it was the largest invasion of U.S. TV news channels. I speak, women from across America the USA since the War of 1812. and e-mail to Americans about who can be counted upon to be Was it part of the Canada-US Inter issues affecting Canada/US affairs sympathetic recipients of argu- Parliamentary Group? No. Could almost daily, seven days a week. ments affecting Canada’s vital in- it have been done without the con- That is the only way to keep up terests. For example, at a recent tacts and knowledge I had picked with issues large and small in the international meeting in Vienna up as a result of my work with the United States affecting Canada. attended by American Members Group? I do not think so. Even my activities in other in- of Congress, I was invited to join The Canada-US Inter-Parl- ternational organizations like the them in a spirited discussion iamentary Group combines Organization for Security and hosted by their Ambassador about official business and personal Co-operation in has wid- the future policy of Afghanistan friendships in a way that is unique ened Congressional contacts and where, once again, a wider circle among legislators from different helped advocate Canada’s inter- of Congressmen, both members countries, that is why it would be ests with Congressmen like Steny and staff, were debating a foreign very hard to single out or isolate Hoyer (Maryland) now House policy question deeply affecting what percentage of my time is Majority Leader; Canada. devoted to it. (Florida), Ben Cardin (Maryland),

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