Bjorn Berge Interview The Guitar Channel www.theguitarchannel.biz

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Questions By Pierre Journel ([email protected]) ‐ 21/10/10 Transcribed by Jenn at Random Chatter Music (metalichicka.wordpress.com) Note: the full audio recording of this interview is available on www.theguitarchannel.biz http://theguitarchnnl.wordpress.com/2010/10/21/lcg‐078‐bjorn‐berge‐interview‐ english/

Bjorn Berge Interview www.theguitarchannel.biz

PJ: So, I am very happy to have with me on The Guitar Channel, Mr. Bjorn Berge. So, first, did I pronounce correctly,your last name?

BB: Yes, it was perfect.

PJ: Okay. So it's not Bjorn Borg, it's not the tennis man. We are talking about a guitar player here.

BB: Yes, a guitar player. I don't play that much tennis.

[laughs] Okay. Traditional first question for me: What was your first guitar?

BB: My first guitar was an, it was a cheap, cheap model of Ibanez, even. It's called a Cimar, with like [spells it out]. It was a Les Paul copy. Electric, and it was... Terrible guitar, it was. I still have it. It's impossible to get in tune, and it's impossible to play, but it looks very nice.

PJ: Okay. But you still survived this first guitar, it seems.

BB: Yeah. I survived. But the thing is, when I got it, after 6 months, I traded it for a banjo. So I got me a banjo, I started to play banjo. But when I was 15 years old, I bought the guitar back.

PJ: Okay.

BB: So I still have it. It's not a good guitar, but it looks really cool.

PJ: Okay. So can you tell us, what were the main milestones between the first guitar and now ‐ your latest album?

BB: The biggest thing is, when I started to play like I play now, I started to play like this when I was around 20­21. So, but the thing is... I was very young when I discovered acoustic music, like Leo Kottke and Robert Johnson, or these. But uh, as a milestone, I think there is... I think the thing is, when I discovered Leo Kottke's album, that was kind­of... I got this *wow*!

PJ: So, very early on, it was a 12‐string love affair for you, with Leo Kottke's (work)?

BB: Yes, it was. But, I didn't buy one. Because it was, if you want to have a decent 12­ string guitar, it costs a lot of money. So I just bought when I was around 20 or something. I first heard Leo Kottke on record when I was like 16.

PJ: And it's a very unusual choice for a guitar. Usually, especially when you're young, you want to play electric guitar, 6‐string guitar [unclear]. But no, you went to the 12‐string, very early on.

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Bjorn Berge Interview www.theguitarchannel.biz

BB: Yeah, I went, and I ...

PJ: Is it because it was more more strings?

(laughter)

BB: I'm not sure but the thing is, I discovered it when I was younger, playing electric guitar. There was no more chicks then there used to be... The girls in my area were more into football players.

(laughter)

So uh... But the 12 string guitar was fascinating because it had a lot of things going on. I started to play more electric guitar, now that I'm getting older, so. Normally I should just play electric guitar in the beginning, and then acoustic guitar, but I'm the opposite.

PJ: Okay. (laughter) So can you tell us a little bit more... what's the story behind the latest album?

BB: The latest album is... what can I say? I've done a lot of CD's and albums, like in Norway and in Scandinavia. Recently I have just released an album called "I am the [unclear]" ­ a bunch of cover songs. And I released a live album. So this time, I decided I wanted to play my own songs. And I started to write these songs last year, when I was on tour in Europe.

And also, I wan to show my fans that I can do something else ­ not just play fast and hard. And when I started to write the songs, instead of being really bluesy, some of the songs went the other way ­ more like folky songs. Stuff like that. So it was like... I didn't have any pressure on me. I was relaxed when I wrote the album. I was really relaxed when I recorded it, so it's... I think that's the reason the album have this good atmosphere. 'Feel good', I call it.

PJ: And there's some really interesting Ry Cooder sound, accent in that album. I mean, was that a definitive idea, or just came up like that, or...?

BB: It's not an idea... the thing is, um, my favorite slide guitar player is Ry Cooder. So, I guess, again I'm getting 'colored' by him. Because every time I play a slow song with slide guitar, I think of him, because he has, for me, the most perfect slide tone. So, I guess I'm *trying to* express that. To get close to him. But I think for every slide guitar player, Ry Cooder is *somewhere*, watching you. So I even lost purpose, and that's fine.

In 'Paris', it has nothing to do with Ry Cooder ­ I was not thinking about him. And that song is (an) instrumental song, and I was just thinking of Paris when I wrote it. And got fascinated by the... if you look at Paris, like 2 ways. I look at it when I'm here with 3/10 04/08/11

Bjorn Berge Interview www.theguitarchannel.biz my girlfriend. I feel that Paris is a romantic city with good food and good wine. But when I'm working here, I have to move fast between clubs and radio stations and whatever. It's very hectic. Lots of traffic. So that song, 'Paris', is like... 2 ways. A slow part, and a hectic part, and that is describing what I feel about Paris. But really, I love Paris, and I thought it was nice to give it a song.

PJ: It's a nice homage to Paris. I'm born in Paris, so you see, I love the song.

BB: Yes, and you know, also my feelings, when you know the traffic jams, so.

(laughter)

PJ: And... was it difficult to learn to play slide on the 12‐string? Because to play slide... seems easy, but in fact it's not, because it's very difficult to play in tune. So is it even a worse nightmare, to play correctly on the 12‐string, or, with a slide?

BB: It can be. And I feel that guitars are like people. You know ­ sometimes they're in a good mood, and sometimes they are not in a good mood.

(laughter)

BB: And that is typical with 12­string guitars. Sometimes, when you play slide on it, you have like 'well this sounds beautiful.' Sometimes you play slide on it and it sounds awful. But the thing is, I started to play slide on a normal guitar. But when I started to play 12­string guitar, also inspired by Leo Kottke, who is playing slide on a 12­string...

I said, 'if he can do it, I can *try* it.' So, I don't play ­that much­ slide on 12­string guitar, I just used a slide on a 12­string, more as a pick, then small notes, because there are lots of things going on in a 12­string, you know. 12­string starts out like [makes some noise]. Then you put the bottleneck on it and it goes [makes noise again, sounds like whirring wings]. So, you have to focus when you play slide on 12­ string guitar.

PJ: Are you playing it in an open tuning, or just standard tuning?

BB: Uh... when I'm on tour, I have both my guitars in open tunings. Different tunings though. Um, it's more convenient for me, because I can play in both, so I play lots of songs in open tuning without the bottleneck. People think I'm playing like standard tuning, but I'm not. I'm just... pretending. I'm making the guitar sound like a standard tuning. But when it was cheaper to bring guitars on airplanes, I used to have with me, a standard­tuned guitar, also.

But now it's so expensive, so I just have with me, 2. And the 12­string is tuned down to C. Very low, and really heavy strings, and the 6­string is sometimes down­tuned in 4/10 04/08/11

Bjorn Berge Interview www.theguitarchannel.biz tuning, and sometimes D. And I use a capo to have this modulation.

PJ: You're well‐known for your 12‐string, but you still actually do play the 6‐string, or do you go back and forth for different songs, different moods...?

BB: Yeah. It's like... now, on these shows, it's like, 60% 12­string and 40% normal 6­ string. It also depends on which kind of songs I'm choosing for the evening, and sometimes I like it better to play the 6­string, and then I'll play more songs on that. And sometimes I'll just want to play 12­string, because I'm really happy with the sound that evening and stuff. So... that's also a nice part about being a solo artist. You can just switch ­ it's not a problem.

(laughter)

PJ: I was at the concert for the Dixie Frog party last Thursday, and I was really amazed to see the reaction of the crowd. You only had to play 3 songs, because it was many artists playing at that night. It must be quite a feeling to engage the people like that.

BB: Yeah. It is. Definitely. That is the kick, you know, like a real kick of playing music. But also, French people are, it seems to me, that they are very open when it comes to my music, because I travel around in France and play in all kinds of different clubs. Small clubs, like this one, and big clubs.

And it seems like the French people like my way of playing, and that makes me feel very, very lucky. And I'm very happy that I can play and see that people like it, and also... Le Bataclan, last week. The thing about that: there was lots of traditional blues artists, and when I came in, playing my kind of blues, and the audience responded that well, it was a *big* satisfaction.

PJ: So, you would qualify your guitar ‐ your style, I mean ‐ as blues?

BB: I like to describe my music like this. I have one foot in the traditional Delta bottleneck blues guitar, and the rest of my body in all kinds of music, because I try, all the time, to listen to other musicians. I try to go to concerts when I have time off. I listen to the radio. I like to see and hear what's going on. And that is infecting my playing.

Because, when people are talking about my last albums, some people say it's a wonderful blues album. Some say "oh! it's like experimental folk." Some say it's like... very touched by Kottke. So, I like that. I like when people are having (these) different opinions of my music. Because I really love blues music, and I love jazz ­ all kinds of music. But the thing is, the blues was the reason I started to play acoustic slide guitar also. So I think

I'm... very in to the acoustic blues, because the acoustic blues, from the beginning, 5/10 04/08/11

Bjorn Berge Interview www.theguitarchannel.biz was like story­telling music. It was not like 12­bar blues, it was very open. It was almost like rap music ­ you could play like a riff [sings some of this]. They can just tell a story like a rapper. Like [speaks a rhythm].

So, for me, blues is a very open music. But, other people, might say... 'blues it's, it's so... narrow. You have to do just like this.' I say, the simpler and easier the music (is), they have to be better players, to make it sound good. So, one foot in the blues, and the rest of the body in all kinds of music.

PJ: Yeah, and you really bring an intensity... a rock intensity to your playing. I mean, it's quite a feat to see what you were able to do, just with your voice and with your guitar, to create such reactions... to the people, it is very difficult to... I guess, right from the start, you had this right mix between your intensity, your composition, or was it lots of work to have this kind of direction?

BB: It was not like this in the beginning. No, no no no no. Because, in the beginning, I was playing more traditional blues. Without the bottleneck, just like picking, like fingerpicking. I was always trying to make it sound just like the original. But then, I was playing at noisy pubs and stuff, and places like that, back in my hometown.

And people could listen to me for say, 10 minutes, and then they fall off. They started walking. And then I decided "ok, how can I get the people's attention?" How can I get that? Because I wanted to play solo. I had played in a band at the same time, and we didn't make any money, and everyone was moving away to schools and jobs. And I said "okay, what can I do to get the attention?" I started with the bottleneck. Then people were like "wow!" "That is cool."

Bottleneck is always cool. Okay, and then (the) next step, to get more attention, is trying to play these acoustic blues and folk numbers, just a little bit faster then the original, a little bit more intensive. And I switched the strings on my guitar to heavier strings. And I started to use my foot, to just give the beat. And I started to play just slightly louder then normal. And then, suddenly, things started to happen. I got the attention from the audience, and then I said "okay.

Now, when I get the attention, now I can play softer songs." And when I discovered that softer songs were too soft for them, I just put some dynamics in to the soft songs. Just playing them soft, but giving them this dynamic. Kicks, you know. So, that's the reason I learned about dynamics. How important that is, in music. And the rest... is history. I'm here now.

(laughter)

BB: And was it some kind of provocation from your part to play tunes like Motorhead's 'Ace Of Spades', or tunes from Iron Maiden, Black Sabbath, or Red Hot Chili Peppers on the 12­string? It can be a real challenge, and you are really succeeding in this kind of crazy adventure. 6/10 04/08/11

Bjorn Berge Interview www.theguitarchannel.biz

Yes. That is also another story, because, when... after I turned professional, I got this offer from the school in my part of Norway, what do you call it... the west coast. And they wanted me... they wondered if I could make a school program, to tell the students the link between traditional blues, country, and folk music, and modern music.

So I just played like an old blues song ­ a normal one, and then instead of doing anything... I just switched the words. Instead of singing "I woke up this morning..." I was like [sings some Red Hot Chili Peppers]. Like "Give It Away". And then the kids were like "wow... what's happening?

He was just playing a traditional song, and now he's playing, like a hit." So that was the reason. And I played this at schools. And when I got back to the club circuit, I tried it on my "grown up" audience, and they were like "YES! Cool cool." And then I thought to myself, 'Why cannot I play like another song... like Sabbath, in my style of playing? Because with the 12­string guitar, it would sound very cool.' So, I just tried it, and played it.

So, the covers just came along, as I wanted to surprise my audience. But now, I don't play many covers (anymore)... I had the most famous ones, and mixed them with my own songs. So, sometimes it's cool to play cover songs, and sometimes it's not. But I always try to make the cover songs in to my style.

So, in the next issue of Guitar Part, I'm showing there, on the DVD, some small riffs, how I make them on acoustic guitar. So, it's like... playing cover songs, is like an effect, too. It gets people's attention. And, see, good music can be played (whatever) whenever (way) you like.

PJ: Yeah. It's a good trick, because people know the songs, so they can relate to them, but it's also, there's a back side to that, because if you play your composition, then your composition has to be up to the standards (of) those huge hits.

BB: Yeah. And that's also a reason to pick... 'not so huge' hits, then.

(laughter)

That... the thing is, my audience is very open­minded, so they love it when I play 'Ace Of Spades'. I guess I'll play that 'til the day I die. So, they also take... I get very good reviews also on my own songs, but I think I have to find a balance. But if you do too (many) cover songs, it can be like you said. A back side of the metal, and they can just expect you to play these famous songs. But I think it's finally the right balance.

PJ: I saw on your website that you use many different guitars. Is there really one magic 12‐ string that you are using, or it depends if you are on tour, or recording? 7/10 04/08/11

Bjorn Berge Interview www.theguitarchannel.biz

BB: I have different... I have this endorsement deal with Takamine, so I use those 12­ strings for many, many years. They are great live guitars. And then, for a while, I used a Taylor ­ Leo Kottke signature model. Very expensive, very nice guitar. But the guitar I'm using now, is Australian. Cole Clark is the name. And those guitars are the coolest live guitars I ever played on. They have like 2 microphone sources. One, under the bridge, as normal. And a big one, that is like a transducer, going through the length of the guitar body. To capture the wood... And I never tried cooler guitars in my life.

And I bought them on the Internet. Just by reputation. Last December, I decided I wanted to buy myself a present, a Christmas present. And I found out about these guitars in this guitar forum for people discussing what guitar is best, and coolest, and price... I got this Cole Clark and I like this.

They are really good guitars ­ they have a good body sound, a natural, fat, warm dynamic, range... exceptional, and clarity, and all that stuff. And I found them on the Internet from a shop in England. It's a 12­string guitar. And I just... I gambled "let's see if it works."

PJ: So you never played the guitar before buying it, right?

BB: No, I never seen it! Or... never heard it.

(laughter)

BB: And then I bought the 12­string guitar, and put my strings on it, plugged it in to my acoustic amplifier back home, and was totally blown away. And then, in January this year, I bought the 6­string at the same Internet shop. Really good. They had this good dynamic range ­ fat, good without... normally, with many, many acoustic guitars, when you plug them in, they are very 'nasal'. [pinches his nose ­ "they're like this"] But this one was the opposite.

They are very open. And last week, I played at the festival, the Blues [unclear], and when I was going in to my concert, I was looking at the right side of me. The distributor of Cole Clark in France brought along a bunch of guitars to my show, so I could try them. So, for the first time, I tried other guitars from the same brand.

PJ: Did you play everything, or...?

BB: No. I wanted to. I wanted to, because they have different guitars with different wood combinations. And I found some guitars that were the black wood inside and back of them. I was totally in love (?). So I have to talk to him and see if he can give me a nice price or something.

Because it's... I normally don't recommend guitars to anyone, because I think it's a very, very personal choice. But these guitars, I can recommend, because they have 8/10 04/08/11

Bjorn Berge Interview www.theguitarchannel.biz this great pickup system, and I think everybody... especially if you are an acoustic guitar player and you play a lot, to check them out, because they have this... as I say, this big sound, that you normally have to use equalizers to boost up. But here, you can just... When I'm doing sound tonight, and the rest of the tour, I just put the equalizer on the mixing console. Flat. Open it... the guitar is there.

PJ: So it's very easy for you to get your sound from night to night, and no discrepancies from venues, and so on?

BB: No problem. It's never... because normally, how an acoustic guitar is, you have to take off some mid, raise some treble, take off some bass... or give more bass "I need more bass, I need more body in the guitar". On these guitars, I just... And I don't have an endorsement deal. Nobody's paying me for saying this.

(laughter)

I only have 2 guitars, and I bought them on the Internet. I was lucky.

(laughter)

PJ: Okay. To finish the interview, what advice would you give to younger guitar players, especially in the acoustic world? I mean, it's very difficult to live, from your art, right?

BB: First of all, if you are a young guitar player, and you are deciding to play acoustic guitar, get a nice guitar. And get it set up properly. So your fingers don't get too much beating. And then, when it's set up the right way... when I was young and started playing, there was no Internet. But now if you go on the Internet and YouTube and pick out the guitar players you like, if you find some people you like really (well), Google them.

And most of them have like teaching books, or tablature, or whatever... so it's just... start that way. And when you're ready to play more, if you want to make a living out of it, or be a professional or whatever, it's important to find your own way of playing it. Don't look too much. Look at the good ones, and take the best of the good ones, but try to create your own style. I did that very early: tried to create my own style so I could stand out from the rest of the acoustic guitar players.

But these days, there are so many good acoustic guitar players. I'm looking at YouTube and (there's) this young Korean guy. Sungha Jung. His first clips on YouTube are when he was like 7 years old, and he's playing like I will *never* do! So there are lots of inspirations to find, but the most important: find a good guitar, so you don't get off before you actually start to play.

PJ: And right from the start, did you sing while playing the guitar, or was it after that, where 9/10 04/08/11

Bjorn Berge Interview www.theguitarchannel.biz you said, well, 'there are things that make this guitar good, but it's not good enough? I want to entertain people.' Or... what was your mind behind that?

BB: I saw... I started to sing right in the beginning, 'cause when I started playing guitar, I was just playing like typical singalong songs, like The Beatles and stuff like that. So I needed something. It was very boring, just to strum the guitar in a D, a G, and A. But I'm not considering myself as a singer. I just sing because the songs need to be sung. But that's important: try it when you're a singer and a guitar player. Try to find the range o your voice which is working best.

Because it's nothing worse then a guitar player trying to play guitar, and sing in another key. That his voice is like ['too light': sings falsetto] or too dark. And just pick songs that suit you. And I always do that. When I write my own songs, it's natural, because my voice is like this. But also when I pick cover songs, I pick cover songs that I can sing ­ not try to sing.

(laughter)

I really like Sting's voice, and Robert Plant's, in Led Zeppelin. Of course, my voice is more like Tom Waits. Down, down there. Ugly, but... necessary.

(more laughter)

PJ: OK, well thank you very much, Bjorn, for your time. I hope you will enjoy your time here in Paris, and best of luck for the rest of your career.

Thank you very much.

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