Pf. SIll., Vol. I No. 11
LOK SABHA DEBATES (English Version)
JIInt Sel"••
(Yof./ COIIIIIiIJI N08. 110 11)
LOK SABII~ S&Clt.ETAIllA·r NEWDIUII PrIce : b 4.Qt) PREFACE
This is the first volume of the Lok Sabha Debates for the Eighth LOk Sabha. U pto the end of Seventh Lok Sabha, two versions of Lok Sabha Debates we're brought out viz·, 0) Original Version containing the proceedings of the House in the languages in which they took place except that in the case of speeches made in regional languages, their English/Hindi translation was included and the Urdu speeches were put in Devnagri script and their Persian script was also given within brackets, and (ii) Hindi Version containing the Hindi proceedings, Urdu proceedings in Devnagri script and Hindi translation of English proceedings and also of specches ma 2. With effect from the First Session of Eighth Lok Sabha, in pursuance of a decision of the General Purposes Committee of Lok Sabha. two versions of Lok Sa bha Debates are being brought out, viz· (i) English Version containing Lok Sabha proceedings in English and English translation of the proceedings which take piace in Hindi or any regional language, and (ii) Hindi Version in its present form except that Urdu speeches are being put in l)evnagri script and their persian script is also being given within brackets· 3. In addition, Original Version of the Lok Sabha proceedings is being prepared and kept in Parliament Library suitably bound for purposes of record and reference only. 4· In both the English and the Hindi Versions, an appropriate indication is being given to specify where a particular part of the proceedin~s is original in Engh::.. Hindi or a translation. 5. It b hoped the two independent Hindi and English versions will be found useful by Members and others interested· NEW DELHI; SUBHASH C· KASHYAP, Jahuar),. /(j85 Sec.:re lary-Gelleral CONTENTS No. JJ, Wednesday, JtlIIIIQI'y JO. J9851 Mtl6ho 10, 1906 (Saka) CoIUIDDI Obs~rvancc of Silence in Memory of Martyrs 1-3 Papers laid on tbe Table 3-31 Mattcrs under rule 377 (i) Need to declare certain areas in Pithoragarh and Chamoli districts of U.P. as Scheduled Tribe arcas Shri Harish Rawat 32 (ii) Need for streamlining the 20-Poiot Programme Shri Ramashray Prasad Singh 32-33 (iii) Need for regular supply of fUDd~ through Government ageocies to P. J. Textile Mills aDd Yamuna Mitis Shri Ranjit Singh Gaekwad 33 (iv) Need to set up a Low Po"er Television Relay Centre at Balasore Shri Chintamani Jena 34 (v) Need to provide employment to at least one person in each family displaced by acquisition of land by the Vi_kbapatnam Steel plant project Shri Bbattam Sreerama Murthy 3S (vi) ~ecd for settiog up an Electronic telephone industry at Bbubaneswar Shrimati Jayanti Patnaik 3S - 36 (vii) Need to set up a Low Power Television Transmitter at Nagareoil Sbri N. Dennis 36 (viii) Need for stren8theninl B.S.F. posts OD tbe India-Banaladab border in certain areas of West Dioajpur district in West BenpJ to preYeDt daeoi.y aod cattle-lirting by Ban,ladeshis 31 Dr. Golam Yazdani 0'') Need to ,rop .ransfer of coal workcrs workio, io RaDch; area to Talcher Unit of Central Coalfield Ltd. Shri SribalJav PMniarabi 37-38 (x) Need to eX\lOrt l)Otatoes and tnsutt s\\\')port \')t\Ct to potato ~ •. " ~~:~r;, in West Bengal Shri Ani) Basu 38-39 (iii ) ( iv ) Columns (xi) Need to re-opeD be S.K.J. Sugar Factory iD Lauria (West ChamparaD, Bihar) and clear oues of employees and C8negrowers. Shri Bhola Raut 39 (xii) Need to create 8 post of DJ.G. of PoJice for Purnea (Bihar) Shrimati Madhuri Singh 40 (xiii) Irrelularities jn implementation of I.R D.P./N.R.E.P. programmes in Weat Bengal Sbri Priya Ranjan Das Munshi 40 (xiv) Need for review of freight equalisation scheme Sh ri Basudeb Acharia 41 (xv) Need (or boldiDa talk with All-India Kerldriya Vidyalaya Teachers Association for solvin. their problems Shri C. Madb.v Reddy 41-42 (xvi) Need to investigate into tbe reported black-marketing in Maruti Cars Shri Sanat Kumar Mandai 42 (xvii) Need to establish a Divisional Office of Life Insurance Corporation at Srinapr Prof. SaifuddiD Soz 43 (:tvjjj) Theft of a Wireless SigDlal Book from Bokaro aod Deed to check such incidents Shri C. P. Thakur 43 (xix) Need to provide railway crossinp in Ganlanqar diatrict in Rajasthan Sbri Birbal 43-44 (xx) Need to make provision in the Sevelllh Five-Year Plan for settin, up a Paper Mill in Tripura Shri Ajoy Biswas 44-4S (xxi) Shortaae or electricity in Jammu an d Kashmir Shri Abdul Rashid KabuB 45 (:uii) Need to set up a television transmit ter at Navada io Bihar Shri KUDwar Ram 4S-46 (uiii) Need to expedite construction ,eX an overbridlc Dear Morad,bad on Moradabad·Cbandauli rail line Shri Hafiz Mohd. Siddiq 46 ( v) Columns Constitution (Fifty-second) Amendment Bill 46 Motion to cODside r Shri A. K. Sen 46-53 Shri Bhattam Sreeramamurthy S4-6O Shri Sharad Dighe 60-65 Shri Bhlgwat Jha Azad 65-68 Prof. Madbu Dandavatc 6&-75 Shri Zaiou) Ballihcr 75-78 Sbri Ama) Datta 78-82 Sbra Vljay N. Patil 82-84 Shri Giridhar Gomango 84-86 Shri K. R. Natarajan 86-87 Sbri Bheravadan K Gadhavi 87-91 Shri G.G. Swell 91-93 Shri K. P. UDoikrishnan 93-99 Shri Vishnu Kumar Modi 99-100 Shrimati Geeta Mukherjee 100-104 Shri Chintamani lena 104-106 Shri Rajesh Pilot 106-108 Sbri Abdul Rashid Kabuli 101-112 Shrimati Vidyawati Chaturn, 112-114 Shri Mool Chand Dap ]14-111 Shri Piyush Tiraki 118-119 Sbr i Balk.vi Bairali t20-121 Sbri C. Madhav Reddy 121-124 Shri Shantaram Naik 124-126 Shri Lalit Maken 126-128 Sbrimati VyjaYlothimala Bali 128-130 ( vi ) Columns. Sbri Amar Roypradban 130-132 Sbri Kamal Nath 132-138 Sbri Japnaatb Kaushal 139-146 Sbri P. Kolandaivelu 146-147 Prof. SaiCuddin Soz 147-J5O Shri G. L. Dogra 150-1S3 Shri Suresh KuruI' 153-155 Shri Nissankara Rao Venkataraman 156 Sbri Dharat Singh 157 Shri Chiotamanl Panigrahi 158-159 Shri Sudioi Jaipal Reddy 159-J63 Sbri Ramas~ray Prasad Singh 163-164 Shri Yogeshwar Prasad 164-165 Shri Devineni Narayanaswamy 165-167 Shri Brajamobao Mohanty ]67-169 Sbri V. Kishore Chandra S. Dco 169-171 Shri K. Ramacbandra "'Reddy 171-173 Shri Ram Pyare Panika 173-174 Shri P. Appalanarasimbam 174-176 Shri MeijinJ)uDa Kamson 176-180 Sbri H. M. Patel 180-181 Sbri Rajiv Gandhi 182-184 ClauIes 2 to 6 aDd 1 Motion to pass, as amended Shri Albok Sen ]84-186, 2S7-S8, 264- Sbri Priya Ranjan Das MUDShi 258-26 ) Sbri C. H. Srihari Rao 260-261 Sbri Uttam Rathod 261-262 Shri p. K. Thungoo 262-26l ~ vii ) Colam«M Member Sworn 201 Shri K. N: Pradhan M~sages (rom Rajya Sabha 201--202, 278--280 BiUs laid on the TabJe Appropriation (Railways) Bill, 1985 203, 280-281 Motioo to cQosider amendment recommended by Rajya Sabha Shri Bansl LEi I 2&1-281 Motion to a~ept Shri Dansi Lal Appropriation (Railways) No. 2 Bill, 1985 282-83 Motion fo consider 4mendment recommended by Raj)'a Sabha Shri Bansi LaJ 282 Motioo to accept Shri Bansi Lal Appropriation Bill, 1985 283-284 Motion to consider amendment recommended b) Rajya Sabha Shrt lanardhaoa Poojary 283 Motion to accept Shri Jaoardhaoa Poojary Appropriation (No.2) Bill, 1985 284-28' Motioo to ,Consjder amendment recommended by Rajya Sabha Sbri Janardhana Poojary 284 Motion to accept Shri Janardh30a Poojary 2M Punjab Appropriation Bill. 1985 285--281 MOlion to coo.icier ameodment recommebded by Rajya Sabha Sbri Janard~aD.a Poojary Motion to accept Sbr; Janardhana Poojary 286 MOtion re Six-Nation summit on Nuclear DisarmamcQl 287 CODcludio8 Remarks -_ • LOK SABHA DEBATES LOK SABHA Minister, there 1S a very important event. which t he Treasury Benches and the House must take Dote or ... (interr£:ptions). MR SPEAKER: I Wtdnesday. Januarv 30, 1985/Magha 10, 1906 am Dot aoing to aHow it. (Saka) PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: The violent events ... (Interrupt;o,,~). Tht £Ok Sabha met at fifty-tight minutes MR. SPEAKER: I am not 10iDI to /HUt ten of the Clock. allow it. Nothing will go on record. ADY· body can come to his own conclusion. They [M R. SPEAKER In the Chair J can blame you RDd you can blame them. 11.00 ...... (Interruptions)·· OBSER VANCE OF SILENCE IN MR. SPEAKER: Not allowed. Noth- MBMORY Of MARTYRS iDg lacs OD record. [Englilh] (/"t~rruptions)·* MR. SPEAKER: HOD. Members, as MR. SPEAKER: Order, order. Irrele· you are aware, tbe nation is observing two vant; absolutely irrelevant. minute. silence today. in memory of those wbo laye their live. in the Itrul.le for India's freedom. We ,ball DOW observe .i1ence for two minutes. Memben may MR. SPEAKER : Anybody can appoint Please Itand in silence in their places &lid a committee and make a report. Not allowed. coDtinue to do 10 till the IUD sound, ror tho MCODd time. (lmerruptiolU)*· (TIw Me","", ,1M. stood i. silence for lM'O mbultu) MR. SPEAlC.ER = I am not lOiDa to aUow it; not at a1l It is Dot retevaat. Not allowed. I am not aUowiDa it. Thia is irre1e- vant. I am not aoing to Itand it. It II a bioI a- MR. SPEAItER: Papers to be Laid on tel, irrelevaut. Anybody caD appoint bit OWD t .. Table. Shri NuaaJmba Rao. committee. They can blame tbis party or that pu1y. I am Dot lOiq to allo" lbil. 'ROP. MADRU DANDAVATE (Rajlpar): Sir, before you call the boa. l JANUARY 30, 1985 Laid 4 MR. SPEAKER : No. I am loinl to Motor Vehicle on Insurance. (Placed In 10 by my own conscieoce. I am not goiD, Library. See No. LT-349/85). to allow C8atina of aspersions 00 anyone party. It is jrre~aol. No. Not allowed. Review on and Annual Report of Rural Electri- 8eatiOD CorpontiOD Ltd.• New Deihl for 1983- (Interruptioru)·· 84, National Projects Construction CorporatJon Ltd. New Delhi for 1983-84 etc. THE MINISTBR OF IRRIGATION AND 11.04 In. POWER (SHRI B. SHANKARANAND): I beg to Jay on the Table PAPERS LAID ON THE TABLE (1) A copy each of the followiol papers lHiDdi and English ver- sions) under sub-section (1) of section 619A of the Companies NotI8c:atioaa UDder Natioaal Cadet COI'pI Act, 1956 :- Ad (a) (j) Review by tbe Govern- THB MINISTER OF DEFENCE (SHRI ment OD tbe workiDI of p.V. NAllASIMHA RAO): I bea to lay OD tbe Rural Electrificatioo die Table a copy each of the rollowiDa Noli- Corporatioo Limited, IcatioDa (Hindi and BOil ish version a) under New Delhi, for the year lUb-lection (3) of section 13 of the ~ational 1983-84 CacIot Corps Act, 1948 :- (ii) AODual Report of tbe (J) Tho National Cadet Co.". Amend- Rural .EJectrificatioa ment Rules, 1985 published in Corporation Limited, Notification No. S.R.O. 2 in New Delhi, for the year Gazette of India dated tbe 19th 1983-84 alonl with January, 1985. Audited Account, and the commeots of tbe Comptroller and Auditor (2) National (Girl•. The Cadet Corps General thereon. (P/ac.d DivilioD) Amendment Rules, 1985 in Library. See No. LT- publiabod in Notification No. 350/85). S.R.O. 3 in Gazette of IDdia dated tbe 19th January, 1985. (Plaud ill Library. Sa No. LT- (b) (i) Review by the OoYel'D- 34/85). men t on the workin. of the National Project. Coostruction Corpora. aalldnd ud Slxda Report of Law tion Limited. l'tew Delhi. CCJID1PIeeIoe for the year J 983-84. THE MINISTER OF LAW AND (ii) Annual Report of the JUSTICE (SHRI A.K. SEN) : I bel to la, 011 National Project. CODS- the Table a copy of Hundred aDd Sixth truction Corporation Report (Hindi and BnaJi.h venioo.) of Law Limited, New Delhi, Commilsion OIl Section lOlA, Motor Vebicles for the year 1983-84 Act, 1939 reprdinl effect of Tranlfer or a alooa with Audited -Not recorded. 5 Papers MAGHA ]0. ]906 (SAKA) Laid 6 Accounts and the (ii) Annual Report of the comments of the Comp- Water and Power Con- troller and Auditor sultancy Services (India) General thereon. (Placed Limited, for the year in Library. See No LT- 1983.84 aloog with 351 ;85). Audited Accounts and the comments of tbe Comptroller and Auditor (C) (I) Review by the Govern- General thereon. (Placed ment on the working of in Library. See No. the North Eastern LT-354(85), Electric Power Cor- poration Limited, Shillong, for the year (fJ (i) Review by the Govern- 1983-84. ment OIl the workiDB of the National Hydro- electric Power Cor.. ( i i) Ann ua I Report of the poration Limited, for NOMh Eastern Electric the year 1983-84. Power Corporation Limited. Shillong, for the year 1983-84 aloog (ii) AnnuaJ Report of the With Audited Accounts National Hydro electric and the comments of Power Corporation the Comptroller and limited, for the year Auditor General tbereon, 1983-84 along with the (Placed Library. See Audited Accounts aod So. L T -352 Po_'.). the comments of tbe Comptroller and Auditor Gt"neral thereon. (d) (i) Review by lhe Govern- ment on the working of (2) A statement (Hindi and English the National Thermal versions) showing reasons Cor delay Power CorporatIOn in l~ying the papers mentioned Limited, New Delhi, for at (e) of item (1) above. (Placed in the year 1983·84, Library See So. LT-35585). (il) Annual Report of the (3) (i) A copy of the Annual Report National Thermal Power (Hindi and English veniODS) Corporation Limited. of the Central Power Research New Delhi, for the Institute, Bangalore~ for the year 198:)-84 along with year 1983-84 along with AudIted ACCOUDts and Audited Accounts. the comments of the Comptroller and Auditor (ii) A copy of the Review General thereon. (Placed (Hindi and English versions) in Library, 5'ee \'(1, by the Government on the -353 85). L T worktng of the Centra) Power Research Institute. (e) (I) Review by the Govern- Banga'ore, for the year men t on the working of 1983-84. (Placed in Library. the Water and Power Set .Vo. L T -35685). Consultancy Services (Iodia) Limited t New (4) (i) A copy of the ADnual Report Delhi. for the year (Hindi and English versions) 1983- 80l of the National Institute of JANUARY 30. 1985 8 Hydrology, Roarkee, for the ~ Report of aDd Re.iew on Ceatnl year 1983-84 alool with Ca.dl for R __reb I. U ....I MediCine, New Audited ACCOUDtl. DeIbI for 1983-84 of Central coaocU 01 lad... MedJcIoe, New DeIhl for 1983-84 etc. (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi aud Bullish versions) by the THE MINISTEJt OF HEALTH AND Government OD tbe workiol FAMILY WBLFARE(SHRIMATI MOHSINA of the National Institute of KiDWAI): I bea to lay on tbe Table- HydrolOl)', Roorkee, for the year 1983-84. (Placed in Library. See No. LT- (1) (i) A copy of the AnDual Report 3S7/8S). (HindI and EOllllh ver.iool) of the Ceotral Council for Raearch io Uo.oi Medicine. (5) A statemeDt (Hindi aad En,lish New Delhj, for the year wniODS) (i) correcting tbe reply 1983-84 aloo, with Audited pveD on the 23rd July, 1984 to ACCOUDt •. UDIWred Queltioo No. 1 by Sbri Atal Dibari Vajpayee reprdiD. reviled COlt of Irri.. lioD Projects, (ii) A copy or the Revjew (HiDdi &Del (ii) ,;villl reuons for delay in and Eoglish venioDI) by tbe correctiol the reply. (PIDctd in Government 00 tbe workiol LibrQTY. S. No. LT-3S8I8S). of the Central CouDcil for Reearch io Unaai Medicine. New Delhi for tbe year ~ ...... A-a AeeoatI of ... 1983-84. [Placed in Library...... NadoMI Co-opiraCift Detelop•• t See. No. LT-360I8S). ~, New DeIaIlor 1983-14 (2) (i) A copy of the ADDual THB MINISTER. OP AGR,ICULTURE Repon (RiDCIi aad Bu,lish AND RURAL DBVBLOPMENT (SHRI veniODl) of tbe CenaraJ OD tbe BUTA SINGH) : I bel to lay Table- Council of Indian Medicine, New Delhi, for tbe year (I) A copy c4 tbe AaDuaI Report 1983-84 alool with Audited (HiDdi aad EoaJiab ....iona) or ACCOUDtI. the NatioDaI Cooperative One- IopmeDt CorporatioD, New Delhi, (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi for the ,.,..1983-84. aod Ballim ver.iool) by the OOYenameDt OD tbe workin. (2) A CCJpJ of the ADDual Accouatl of ,be Central CouDCiI of (HiDdi aDd BDaliIh veraioDI) ot IndiaD Mediciae. New Delhi. tbe N.tioDal Cooperative One- for the year 1983-84. (Placed JopmIDt CorporatiOD, New Delbi, in LlbrG!Y. See No LT- for tile ,.., J 913-14 tOll(ber willi 361/85). Aadit Report tbcreoo. (3) A .catemeac (Hindi aod &.Iilh (3) A copJ or tbe Rmew (HiDdi aDd veniooI) aplliDiDi tbe reaIOaa BDeliIb wnioGI) '" the GcMrD- for Dot laylDa tbe ADDU&) Report meat OD the wortiq of tbe aod Audited ACCOUDtI or lbe NatioDal Cooperatift DevelopmeDt Ceotrai Relearcb IDtdlu&e for Corporatioa. New Delhi, tor tbe Yap, New Deihl. for tbe yelr ,.., 1913-84. (Plilced I" LlbrlUY. 1983-84 tritbiD the ltipollted period s.. No. LT-359/1S). of niDI mootba after the clote of 9 Papers MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKAl Laid 10 the ACCouDtinl Year. (Plac~d in (ii) Annual Report of tbe Madras Library. See. No. LT-362/8S). Fertilizers limited, Madras, for tbe year ] 983-84 along ReYlew on and AaDual Report of HfDdustaD witn Audited Accounts and ADtJbiotlca Ltd. PllDprj for 1983-84, Indian the comments of tbe Comp- Drup aDd Pbarmaceulicall Ltd. Garpon for troller and Auditor Gene.1 1983.84, Madru Fertlillen Ltd., Madras for thereon. (Placed in Ub,.y. 198.1-84 etc. See. No. LT-36Sj8S). THE MINISTBR OF CHEMICALS (d) (i) Review by the Government AND FERTILIZERS AND INDUSTRY on the working of the AND COMPANY AFFAIRS (SHRI Projectl aDd Development VEBRBNDRA PATIL : I beg to lay on the India Limited, Sindri, for the Table a copy each of tbe foliowiDg papers year 1983·84. (Hindi aDd Enllilb versions) under sub- sectioo (1) of section 619A of tbe Companies Act. 19S6:- (ii) AnDual Report of the Project!\ and Development India Limited, Sindri, for the year (a) (i) Review by the Government 1983-84 along with Audited on the working of the Accounts and tbe comments HindUltJUl Antibiotics Limi- of the Comptroller and ted. Pimpri, for the year Auditor General thereoD. 1983-84. (P/aC«l;1I Librtuy. See No. LT-3(6185). (ii) AnDual Report of the Hinduslan Antibiotics Limi- (e) (i) Review by the Government ted, Pimpri, for the year on tbe workinl of the 1983-84 aloog witb Audited Fertilisers a nd Chemicals Accouatl and tbe comment. Travanoore Li."ited, for the of tbe Comptroller and Auditor General thereon. year 1983-84. (Pltlced in Library. See. No LT-363/8S). (ii) Annual Report of tbe Fertilisers and Chemicals (b) (i) Review by the Government Travancore Limited, for tbe on the workin. of tbe IDdian year 1983·84 along with Drull and Pharmaceuticals Audited Accounts and tbe Limited, Gurpoo. for the comments of tbe Comptroller year 1983-84. and Auditor Gcoeral tbercoo. (Pltlced in Library. See No. LT-367185). (ii) ADDual Report of the Indian Drup and Pbarmaceuticals Limited, GurpoD. for tbe (f) (i) Review by tbe GovernlDCDt year 1983·84 alonl with on the workinl of tbe Audited Accounts and the Ralhtriya Chemicals and comment. of the Comptroller Fertilizers Limited (or tbe and Auditor General thereon. year 1983-84. (P/Qced in Library. See. No. LT-364/85). (ii) AnDual Report of the Rub- triYI Chemicals and Fertilizen (c) Review by the Government Limned for the year 1983-84 on tbe work in, of the alonl with Audited Accounts Madra Fel1i1izen Limited. and abe comments or the Madra, for the year 1983·84. ComptroUer and Auditor 11 JANUARY 30, 1985 12 General thereoD. (Placed iff Ophthalmic Glass Limited t Library. S~e No. LT-368J Durgapur, ror the year 1983- 85). 84. (I) (i) Review by the Government on the working of Fertilizer (ii) Annual Report of the Bharat Corporation of india Limited Ophthalmic Glass Limited. , New Delhi. for th~ year) 983- Durgapur. for the year 1983- 84. 84 along with Audited Accounts and the commenb of the Comptroller and (ii) Annual Report of the Ferti- Auditor General thereoD. lizer Corporation of India (Placed in Libran, See No. Limited. New DeJhi, for the L T - 372/85). year 1983-84 along with Audi- led Accounts and the com- menlS of the Comptroller and Revie~ on and Annual Report of Mogul Line Auditor General thereon Ltd. Bombay for 1983·84 and Annual Report (Placed in Library. See \'0. of Cochin Dock Labour Board Cochin (or LT-369,85). 1983-84 (h) (i) Review by the Government THE MINISTER OF STATE OF THE on the working of the Smith MINISTRY OF SHIPPING AND TRANS· Stanistreet Pharmaceuticals PORT (SHRI Z R. A~SARI): I beg to Limited, Calcutta, for the lay on the Tablc- year 1983-84. (ii) AnnuaJ Report of tbe Smith (l) A copy each of the followiog Stan istree t Pharmaceuticals papers (Hindi and English vers· Limited, CaJcuua. for the ions) under sub-section (I) of year 1983-84 along with Audi· seclioo 619A of the Companies ted Accounts and the com- Act. 1956 :- ments of Comptroller and Auditor General thereon (Placed in Library. See ;V". (i) Review by the Government on LT-370 85). the working of the Mogui line Limited. Bombay, for (i) (i) RcYiew- by the Governmeor the year 1983·84. 00 the working of the Para- deep Phosphates Limited, Bbubanesl\71f, for Ihe ye~lr (il) AnnuJI Report of the Mogut 1983-84. Line Limited. Bombay, for the year 1983·84 along with Audited Accounts aDd the (ii) Annual Report of tl'le Conun~nts of the Comptro .. Paradeep Phosphates Limited. lIer and Auditor General Rhubaneswar for tbe year thereon. (Placed in Librar), 1983-84 along with Audited See No. LT-373/85). Accounts and the comments of the Comptroller and A udJ- tor General thereon (Placed (2) A copy of tbe Annual Report in Library. See No. L T -371 (Hindi and English versions) of the 85). Cochin Dock Labour Board, .,- Cochin, for the year 1983-84. (j) (i) Review by the Government (Placed In Library. Sl't No. L1'- on the working of the Bhatat 374,'85). 13 Papers MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) Laid 14 NotJ8catioa UDder CompaDies Act, Industries 2ht January, 1985 regarding (De,elopment RealaUon) Act, ReYlew aad maoagcmCnl of messrs Bn- OD aad Report of Hlndustan Photo ADD__ taonla Engineering Company FIIDII Manufac_iaa Co" Ltd. Octacamuud for Calcutta, (Titagarh Unit). 1983-84, etc. THE MINISTER OF CHEMICALS (il) s. O. 39 (E) published in AND FBRTILIZERS AND INDUSTRY Gazette of India dated the AND COMPANY AFFAIRS (SHR) 21st January, 1985 regarding VEeRENDRA PATIL): On behalf of management of Messrs Shri Arif Mohammad Khan 1 beg PriyaJaxmi Mills, Baroda, to Jay on the Table- Gujarat. (Placed in Library, See No LT - 376:85). (1) A copy each of the following papers (Hindi and Enlli~h vers- (3) A copy each of the following ionl) under sub-section (3) of papers (Hindi and Enghsh vers- section 642 of the Companies Act t ions) under sub-section (I) of 1956 :- section 619 A of the Companies Act, 1956 :- (i) G. S. R. 1152 published In Gazette of India dated the (a) (i) Review by the Government 17th November, 1984 contai- on the working of the ning corrigendum to Noti- Hindustan Photo Films fication No. G. S. R. 767 ManufacturiDI Compaay published in Gazette of India Limited, Ootacamund. for dated the 21sh July, J 984. the Year 1983-84. (ii) G. S. R. 1205 published in Gazette of India dated ~be (ii) Annual Report of the 8tb December, 19S4 contain- Hindustan Photo Films Manu- ing corrigendum to Not, ;('a- facturing Company Limited. tion No, G. S. R. 6EZI rubli- OOlacamund, for the year shed in Gazette of India 1983·84 aloog with Audited dated the 7th July, 1984. Accounts and the comments of the Comptroller and Auditor General thereon. (Placed in (iii) The Coast Accounting Reco- Library. See No. LT-377!85. rds (Cotton Textiles) Amend· ment Rules, 1984. publtshed in Notification No G, S R. (b) (i) Review by the Government 1206 in Gazette of India on the working of tbe Natio- dated the ~th December, nal Newsprint aod Paper 1984. !P/aced in Library Stt Mills Limited, for the year No. LT-J7S/85). 1983-84. (2) A copy each of the following (ii) Annual Report of the NotikatioDI (Hindi and EDllish National Newsprint and \,ersiool) UDder sub-section (2) of Paper Mills Limited. for tbe section 18A of the lnduslrir.s year 1983·84 aloDg with (De~elopment and Regulation) Audited Accounts and the Act, 1951 :- commenls of the Comptrol. ler and '_uditor Gener! (i) S. O. 38 (E) published in thereon. (P/ac«i ill LIbra Gazette of India dated the See No. LT-378/85). IS Papns JANUARY se, 1985 Laid 16 (c) (\,I, Review by the Governroeat Audited Accounts and the on the working of the comments of the Comptroller I Cement Corporation of India and Auditor General thereon. Limited, for till; year 1983-84, (Placed in Library. See No. LT-382j85). (ii] Annual Report of the Cement Corporation of India Limited. (g) (i) Review by the Government for the year 1983-84 along on the working of the Hindus- with Audited Acceunts and tan Cables Limited, for the the comments of the Comp.':; year 1983-84. troller and Auditor General thereon. (Placed in' Library, (ii) Annual Report of the Hindus- See No. LT-37918j~. tan Cables Limited, for the year 1983-84 along witb (d) (i) Review by the Government Audited Accounts and the on the working of the And- comments of the Comptroller rew Yule and Company and Auditor General thereon. Limited, for the year 1983-84. (Placed in Library. See No. 1,1'.-383/85). (ii) Annual Report of the And. rew Yule and Company (h) (i) Review by the Government Limited. for the year 1983-84 on the working of the Min- along with Audited Accounts ing and' Allied Machinery and tile comments of the Corporation Limited, Durga- Comptroller and Auditor pur, for the year 1983-84. General thereon, (Placed in Library, See No. f-T-380!85). (ii) Annual Report of the Mining and Allied Machinery Corpo- ration Limited, Durgapur, (e) (i) Review by the Government for the year 1983·84 along on the working of the Jessop with Audited Accounts and and Company Limited, the comments of the Compt- Calcutta, for the year 1983-84. roller and Auditor General thereon. (Placed in Library. (ii) Annual Report of the Jessop See No. LT-384185). and Company Limited, Calcutta for the year 1983·84 0) (i) Review by the Government along with the Audited on the working of the Hindus- Accounts and tbe comments tan Paper Corporation Limi- of the Comptroller and Audi- ted and its subsidiaries viz. tor General thereon, (Placed Hindustau Newsnrint Limited in Library, See No. LT- and Nagaland Pulp and Paper 381185). Company Ltmited, for the and year 1983-84. (f) (i) Review by the Government OD tbe workinl of tbe Natio- (ii) Annual Report of the Hindus- oal Small Industries Corpora- tan Paper CorpOration Limi- tion Limited, for tbe year ted and its subsidiaries viz. 1983-84. Hindustan Newspriftt Limited and Nagaland Pulp and Paper (ii) AIlould Report of the Company Limited, for the National Small Industries ycar 1983-84 along with Audi- Corporation Limited, for the ted Accounts and the com- year 1983-84 aloDI with ments of the Comptroller and 11 MAGHA 10, 19G6 (SAK.4) 11 Auditor General thereon. Corporation Limited, New (Placed in Library. See No. Delhi, for tbe year 1978-79. LT-385/85). (ii) Annual Report of the Delhi (j) (i) Review by the Government State Industrial Development on the workinR of the Corporation Limited. New National Inltruments Limited Delhi, (or the year 1978-79 Calcutta, ror tbe year 1983-84. along with Audited Accounts and tbe comment. of the (ii) Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General thereon. National Instruments Limited, Calcutta, (or the year 1983-84 along with Audited Accounts (4) Two statements (Hindi and English and the comments of the versions) showing reasons for delay ColLptroller and Auditor in laying the Papers mentioned at General thereon. (Placed in (L) and (M) of item (3) above. Library. See No. LT--386/85). (Placed IfJ Library. See No. LT- 388/85). (k) (i) Review by the Government (5) (i) A copy of the Annual Report on the working of the Instru- (Hindi and English versions) mentation Limited. for the of the Central Pulp aDd year 1983-84. Paper Research Institute, Dehra Dun, for tbe year (ii) Annual Report of the Instru- 1983-84 along with Audited mentation Limited, for the Accounts. year 1983-84 along with Audi- ted Accounts and the com- (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi ments of the Comptroller and EngJilh versions) by and Auditor General thereon. tbe Government on the (Placed in Library. See "Vo working of the Central Pulp LT-387'85). and Paper Research Institute Dehra Dun, for the y~ar (I) (i) Review by the Government OD 1983-84. (Placed in Library. the working of the Delhi See No. LT-389/85). State Industrial Development Corporation Limited, New (lnterruptions)** Delhi, for the year ] 979·80. MR. SPEAKER : Absolutely nothing (ii) Annual Report of the Delhi doin.- State Industrial Development Corpol alion Limited New (In terruptions) ** Delhi, (or the year ]979·80. along with Audited Accounts MR. SPEAKER : I will name you, and the comments of the Professor Sahib, ir you continue. Please Comptroller and Auditor sit down. Take your scat. I am absolutely (Jeneral thereon. certain on my ground I am nol going to do it. (m) (i) Review by the Government on the working of the Delhi PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: Let Sate Industrial Development the Home Minister make a stalement. ··Not recorded. 19 Papers JANUARY 30, 1985 Laid 20 MR. SPEAKER : There is no queslio~ R•• iew on aad Anoual Report of Madhya of Home Minister makiog a statement. I caD- Pradesll RaJy. Vaa Vlbs Nigam Ltd., Bhopal Dot take anybody', commentary like this. No. for 1978-79, Andaman and NicObar hlaadl Forest a~ pl.ntation Development Corporation Ltd., Port Blair for 1983-84 etc. THE MINISTER OF STA.TE IN THE MR. SPEAKER ~ There is no question. MINISTRY OF ENVIRONMENT AND 1bia House is not a public meetinl to tr ade FORESTS (SHRI BIR SEN) : I beg to lay' cbarps bore. on the Table :- (/1IterruptiofLS) (I) A copy each of tbe (ollowing papers (Hindi and Enalish versions) under sub-section 619A of tb: PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: Sir, Companies Act, ) Q56 : - you are very harsh. (a) (i) Review by the Govern- ment on the working of MR. SPEAKER: There is no question tbe Madhya Pradesh of beiDa barsh. I am going to be very impa- Rajya Van Vikas Nigam rtial and very fair. U' somebody is Boin. to Limited. Bhopal, for the cut aspcnions I am goiDg to follow the year 1978-79. same norms and do the same thing to you aDd tbe same tbing to him. lli) Annual Report of the Madbya Pradesh Rajya SHRI SADINI JAIPAL REDDY: Sir, Van Vikas Nigam Limi- I want to make a submission. ted, Bhopal, for the year 1918-79, aloDg with Audited Accounts and MR. SPEAKER : No submission on the comments of the this subject. If you have got anything else Comptroller and Auditor to say, you can say. General thereon. (Placed in Libra,.y. See No L T -390/85). SURf SUDHIRI JAfPAL REDDY = Yes, Sir, 1 have got something else to say. (b) (i) Review by the Govern- ment on the workinl of PROF. SAIFUDDIN SOZ: Sir, tbe the ADdaman and Nico- Business Advisory Committee decided that bar Islands Forest and .- OD tbe Jast day the hon. Home Minister Plantaljon DeveJopmtD', will issue a statement. Corporation Limited. Port Blair, for the year • 1983-84. MR. SPEAKER : H there is any more thiDI to add, he will add. That was what .... said. (ii) ADDual Report of the Andaman and Nicobar Islands Forest and Plan- PROF. SAIFUDDIN SOZ : No. tatioD Development Corporation Limited, MR.. SPEAKER : We bad lot ever,- Port Blair, lor the year thiDa daa.ed. Ir tben: wu anytbinl more 1983·84 alooa with A~j~ to be said, it ... decided tbat be would in- ted Accouotl and ,be ',,_ the HOUle. That i. all. comment. 01 the Comp- 21 PIJPUS MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) Laid 22 troller and Auditor AD~INISTRATJVt REFORMS AND Genera I thereon. (Placed CULTURE (SHRf K P. SINGH OEO) : I i" Library. See No. LT beg to lay on Ibe Table:- -391/85). (1) (i) A copy of the Annual Report (c) (i) Review by the Govern- (Hindi and English versions) of ment on the working of the Delhi Public Library, Delhi (or the West Bengal Forest the year 1983-84 along With Audited Dev~lopment Corpora- Accounts. I ion Limited. C~Jcutta for the year 1974-75, ) 975.76. (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi and English versions) by the Govern- ment on the working of the Delhi (ii) Annnual Report (Hindl* Public Library Delhi, for the year version) of the West 1983-84. (Placed in Library, see No- Bengal Fore~t D~velop LT-394/85). ment Corporation Limi- led, Calcutta, for the (2) (i) A copy of the Annual Report year 1974-75, 1975-76 (Hindi and English versions) of the and 1976-77 along with Gandhi Darshan Samlti, New Audited Accounts and Delhi, for the year 1983-84 along the comments of the with AudIted Accounts. Comptroller and Audi- lor General thereon. (H) A copy of the Revjew (Hmdj and English versions) by the (2) A statement (Hindi and English Government on the working of the versions) showing reasons for delay Gandhi Darshan Samiti, New Delhi in laying the papers mentioned at for the year 1983-84 (Placed in (a) of ih:m (1) above. (Placf'd ;n Library. See No. LT-395 ;85). Library See No. LT-392 85). (3) (i) A copy of the Anuual Report Notificati~n reo floating of market loan (Hindi and EngJJsh versions) of tbe Raja Rammohan Roy Library THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE Foundation. Calcutta. for the year *, MINISTRY OF FINANCE (SHRI JANAR- 1983-84 aJong with Audited D~ANA POOJARY) : 1 beg to la) on the Accounts. - fable a capy of NOfification No. F. 4(S)-W&M/84 (Hindi aDd English versions) , dated the 28th January, 1985 regarding (ii) A copy of the Reyiew (Hindi and floatation of market loan. (Placed in Librar)'. Enalisb versions) by the Govern- ment tbe workiol the See No. LT-39JI85). on or Raja Rammohan Roy Library Pounda- tiOD. Calcutta, for the year 1983-14. Annual Report of ancl Review on Delhi Public (Placed in Library, S« No. LT· Library, Delbi 1983-84, Gandhi Darsban 396/85). Sa.iti ,New Delbi for 1983-84, Raja Ram Moun Roy library Foundation, Calcutta for (4) (i) A copy of tbe Annual Report 1983·84 etc. (Hindi and English versions) of tbe Sahitya Akad~mi, New Delbi, THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE for the year 1983-84 along with DEPARTMENTS OF PERSONNEL AND Audited ActOunts. .Bu,lish version was Jaid on 8th May, 1978. 23 JANUARY 30, 1985 Laid 24 (ii) A copy of tbe Review (Hindi thereon. (P/ac,d in Library. S" aDd Bnaliah versions) by the ND. LT-399/85). Gowmmeot on tbe workina of tbe Sabitya At.demi, New Delhi, for (b) (i) Review by the Government the year 1983-84 (PI(Jt:ed III LlbrQl')'. OD tbe working of tbe Viaakba- SH No LT-397/85). patnam Steel Project Rubtriya lapat Nipm Limited, Visatba- (5) A copy each of tbe follo"ina Notifi- patnam, for the year 1985·84. cation. (Hindi and Enalith venions) UDder .ub-aection (4) of aection 28 (ii) Annual Report of tbe of tbe K.huda Bakh.h Public VisakbapatDam Steel Project Library Act, 1969 :- Rubtriya hpat Niaam Limited, Viaakhapatnam, for the year (i) The Duda Bakhsh Oriental 1983-84 alonl with Audited Public Library, (Administration) Account. ad the commootl of R.eplatioa., 1984 publiabed in the Comptroller and Auditor Notification No. 11·01.- Rea. Geoeral thereon. (P/aat/ ill Library. (Adam.) /84 in Gazette of India S_ No. LT-400/8S). dated tbe 22Dd September, 1984. (c) (i) Review by tbe Goyernment on (ii) The Khuda Bakhlh Oriental tbe warkin. of tbe Bbarat Refra- Public Library (Board Meetinp) ctories Limited, Obanbad, for the RqulatioD., 1984 published in year 1983-84. Notification No. II-KBL-Rea. (Bcl. MeetiD,)/84 in aazette of (ii) Annual Report of tbe Bberat ladia dated the 22nd September, Rcfractoricl Limited, DbaD~d, 1984. (Pftad ill Library. SH No. for tbe year 1983-84 alon, with LT-398J85). Audited AccouDtI and tbe comm- ent. of tbe Comptroller and aetlew _ ... ~ Report of Natto.J Auditor Genera) tbereon. (P/acM ...... De ••,EII. Corporadoe lAd., ill Library, Sn No. LT-40J/85). 1fJ*nW'" IJD.I4, V... kIw ..... Steel Pra'il'. Rs ' It.". llllat NIpa Ud., VIIatba· (d) (i) Review by the Government ...... fer 1913-14 etc. on the worki I, of the Stoel Autbority of Iodia Limited, New TBB MINlBrBR OF STATE IN THE Delbi. for tbe year 198~. DEPARTMENT OF STEBL (SHRI K. NANA.. SINGH): I bea to lay on tbe Table (U) Annual Report of tbe Steel • copJ eacb of abe folJGWio, papen (Hindi Authority or India Limited, Ncw aDd EDaliIh "'01) under sub.loction (1) Delhi, for tbe year 1983-84 aloDI of IeCdoD 6I'A of the Compania Act, with Audited Accounb ADd tbe 1956 :- commenta of tbe Comptroller and Auditor General thereon. (Plac.d (a) (i) Review by the OO\'enu:aent on ill Lilwary, ~ No. LT-402/85). the .orkin. of the National Mineral Development Corporation Umited, Reriew OD aad A.aal Report etc. of Nora H,derabad.. lor the year 1983-84...... HudJcnft ... Haadloc.m DeYeIop- .. CorpontloD LId...... fer 1911-83, ~ (h) ADDu) Report of the National SIlk ud RaJOD Tesd" Export Pro.odoa MiDeraJ Development Corpora- CoaacU. Bomba, lor UI.1-I4 etc. dOD Umited. Hyder.bad. for tbe year J 983-84 alOD, with Audited AccoUDtI aDd tbe commelltl of the THB MINISTER or STATS IN THE Comptroller aocJ Auditor GeDeral MINISTRY OP COMMBR.CB AND 25 MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) Laid 26 SUPPLY (SHRI P.A SANGMA): I bel to (ii) A copy or tbe Review (Hindi 4.y Ob tbe Table. and English venionl) by the Government on tbe worklDI of tbe Cotton Textiles Export (I) A copy each of the following Promotion CouDcil, Bombay, papers (Hindi and English versionl) ror the year 198,3.84. (Pklcet/ hi under lub-section (1) of sectjon Library. See No. LT-405j85.). 619A of the Companies Act, 1956 :- (5) (i) A copy of tbe Annual Report (Hindi and EngJish versiODl) of (i) Review by the Government on tbe Export Inspection CoUDCiI aDd the working of tbe North Eastern Export IDspection Apnca, New Handicraft. and Handloom Deve- Delhi. for tbe year 1983-84 aloul Jopment Corporation Limited, with Audited Accountl, under IUb- SbilJona. (or the year 1982·83. rule (3) of Rule 16 of tbe Export (Quality Control and Inspection) Rules, 1964. (ii) Annual Report of thle North Eastern Handicrafts and Hand· looms Development Corpt\ration (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi Limited, Shillong, for thle year and English versionl) by tbe 1982-83 along with Audited Government on the workiol of tbe Accounts and the commetlts of Export JDlpection Council aDd tbe Comptroller and Auditor Export Inspection Aacocies. New Geoeral thereon. Delhi, for the year 1983-84. t'Placed ira Library. SH No. LT- 4t'>6/85). (2) A state~t (Hindi and EoaJish yersionl) Ihowinl reason. for deJay in layiDg tbe papers mcntione~ at (6) (i) A copy of tbe •.t\Doual Report (1) above (Placed In Library. See (Hintii and English venioDl) of No. LT-403j85). the ~~pices Export Promotioa CouDci I. Ernakulam. CocbiD, ror (3) (i) A copy of tbe AnDual Report the Ylear 1983·84 alODI witb (Hindi and English versions) of the Audited Accounll. Silk and Rayon Textile Expolrt Promotion Council, Bombay, felr (Ii) A cop.y of the Review (Hindi the year 198,3.84 along with and En~,Hsh versioo.) by the Audited Accoun~s. GovernmeD t on the workiq of the Spices Export PromotiOD~ (ii) A copy of tbe Review (Hindi CouDcil. Ern'akulam, Coc;blD, ror and ED,Ii.b verlions) by the the year 1983·h'~. Government on tbe workiDI of tbe Silk and Rayon Textiles Export Promotion Council (7) A Statement (I Hia41 aDd EqliIb Bombay, for the year 1983·84. versio.. ) showiD, reuooslor deJay (~/Qced in L;brary. See No. LT· in layin& the pa~'Ora maal~ at 404/85). (6) above (PID«d ill LiJII'.zry. S. No. LT-407(85). (4) (i) A copy of the Annual Report (HiDdi and Enali'b venioDI) of the (8) (i) A copy of tbe AL 'Dual Report Couon Textiles Export Promotion (Hil7ldi and Boalilb vel\ \iOOS) of the Council, Bombay, for the year lodi aD COUDen of. 'rbhrItiae. 1983-84. .'UDI With Audited Ne'H Delbi. for the yt'" 1983-84 Ac:couor •. alo"ll wJlb Audited ACCO UDtI. 27 Papers JANUARY 30 1985 Laid (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi hilitation Plantations Limited, and English verSiCln\) by the Punalur, for the year Government on the working of the 1982-83. lnd ian Council of Arbitration, New Delhi. for the year 1983-84. (Placed in Lihra"y. See .Va. L T- (ii) Annual Report of the 408185). Rehabilitation Plantations Limited. Punalur, for the year 1982-83 aloog with AudilC'd (9) (i) A copy of the Annual Repon Accounts and the comments (Hindi and English versions) of of the ComptroJJer and the Jndian lnstitute of Foreign Auditor General thereon. Trade, New Delhi, for the }ear 1983-84 alGng with Audited Accounts. (4) A statemenl (Hindi and English versions) showing reasons for delay in laying the papers mentio- (ii) A copy of the Review (HlOdi and ned at (3) above. (Placed in English versions) by the Govern- Library. See No. LT-4 ll/85). ment 00 the working of the Indian Institute of Foreign Trade, New Delhi, for the year 1983·84 (Placed Aaaual Report or and Review on Pharmacy in Library. See No. LT-409 '85), Council of Jodie. l'\ew Delhi for 1983-84 and Audited Accounts thereon Report of Deputy Commissioner for Lin guistic \Iinorities io lodia for period from Juh'~ 1981 THE MINISTER .oF STATE IN THE to JUDe, 1982 Review 00 and Annua'. Report DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH (SHRI of Rehabilitation Plantations Ltd. P'Lloalur for YOGENDRA MAKWANA): I b:g to lay 1982-83 aod a statemeot on the Table: THE MINISTER OF HOM''':: AFFAIRS (1) A copy of the Annual Report (SHRI S.B. CHAV AN) : 00 behalf of (H iodi and EnaJish versions) of Shrimati Ram Dulari Sioha) : I beg to lay on the Pharmacy Council of India. the Table: New Delhi, for the year 1983-84 along with Audited Accounts. (J) A copy of the Twenty-Second Report (Hindi and Engli,h (2) A copy of the Review (Hindi aDd versions) of the 1Aleputy CommissI- English versions) by the Government oner for Linv,uistic Minorities in on the working of the Pharmacy India for the period July. 1981 10 Couccil of India. New Delhi, for June 1982. the year 1983-84. (Placed in Library. See No. LT-412185. (2) An expla.natory Note (Hindi and English versions) in regard to the PROF. SAIFUDDIN SOZ Repon. (Placed in LI brary. See (Eiaramulla) : have ao adjournment No. LT-410/85). Mlotion (3) A copy each of th e following MR SPEAKER No adjournment papers (Hindi aod English ~"olion. versions) under SUb-51 :ctioo (I) of Section 619A of the Co mpantcs Act, (Interruptions) J956 :- SHRI SUDINI JAIPAL REDDY (i) Review by the ( iovcrnment . (Mahbubnagar): 1 h.ve something else OD tbe working 0 f the Reha- to say. I have a pOilU of order. 29 Papers MAGHA 10, .1906 (SAKA) Laid 30 MR. SPEAKER: What is your po;nt of PROF. MADHU DANDAVATB order, Mr. Reddy'? (Rajapur): We should at least know on what you ha ve given your Tuling, Sir. SHRI SUDINI JAIPAL REDDY: Mr. Speaker, Sir. when Y\JU were not in the Chair, MR. SPEAKER: I have already told the other day, one Member of the House him. He understands It. He said that an hOD. made an allegation. Member cast as~rsJOns on somebody in the House and I said I will look into that. MR. SPEAKER: It has been brought to my notice, I have already done that. SHRr SUDINI JAIPAL REDDY: Not that Sir. You have Dot heard me. My point SHRI. SUDINI JAIPAL REDDY: No, IS that the other day a senior Member of tbe Sir. Let me speak. ruling party on the floor of the House, when you did not happc:n to be In the Chair, made MR. SPEAKER' There is nJ question an allegation that Members belonging to the of your speaking when I have already slated Opposition parties durmg their speeches in the that it ha, been done. Sev~nth Lok Sabha had supported the Anandpur Sahib Resolu(10D. SHRI SUDINI JAIPAL REDDY: Not that, Sir. I want that to be expunged. MR. SPEAKER: There IS nothing to JL) recording that. MR. SPE<\KER . All right. We will PROF. SAIFUDDIN SOZ : It is a very 'See. important point. It was said by Shri Girdhari Lal Vyas. SHRI SUDINI J AIPAL REDDY: YOll ha ve not heard me, Si r . PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: It was referred to you. MR. SPEAKER: I have already heard you. MR. SPEAKER: I will see to that SHRI SUDINI JAIPAL REDDY: But SHRI BASUDEB "CHARlA. you allow me to submit, Sir. (Bankura) : Will the Hon. Home Minister make a statemenr regard 109 tbe spy case? MR. SPEAKER: What is there to Everyday one or the other pe!"son is being submit DOW'? arrested. The House should be taken IDto confidence. SHRI SUOtNI JAIPAL REDDY: You have not beard me. Sir. MR. SPEAKER: I shall see. If there is anythlDg more he will add. MR. SPEAKER : I have already heard you. PROF. SAIFUDDIN SOZ: I have liven notice of an Adjournmc:nt Motion. I do not SHal SUDINI JAIPAL REDDY~ know whether i [ has been accepted. ... How can you live your ruling without hear- me~ ing MR. SPEAKER : Not allowed. Shrj Harish Rawat : MR. SPEAKER : What is there? You have referred to the matter regarding casting (Interrupt tOrts) uperaioDI iD tbe House. 31 Paptrs Laid JANUAR Y 30, 1~S5 32 11.11 brs. MR. SPEAK.ER : I have told you that I will look into it. Sit down. MATTBRS UNDER RULE 377 (Interruptions) [TrQlU/atloil J MR. SPEAKER ; I have to see the (I) Need to declare certain areas in PJtbora- record. Sit down now. You have raised your ga rh and Cbamoli districts of U. P. as point. I have already noted it. 1 have already Scheduled Tribe areas done it. Sit down. Take your seat DOW. SHRI HARISH RAWAT (Almora) Mr. Speaker, .sir. the demand for declaring (Interruptions) certain areas of Munsyari and Dharcbula in Pithoragarh district and Joshimath and MR. SPEAKER : This is a1l right. Jaunsar in Chamolj in Uttar Pradesh as Please lit down. Yes, what do you want to scheduled tribe areas is being continuously say ? made for quite a long time. The local representatives of the people have allo raised this demand many a time. In both these SHRI SAIFUDDIN CHOUDHURY: We areas, while certain castes having tbe same have raised the matter regardina the espionage economic, social, cultural background and ring. conditioDs have been dcclared as scheduled tribes. Other castes like Janwal, KuthaJia, Vora, Gandhar',a etc. have not been MR. SPEAKER : We have already done Jecognised as scheduled tribes. The State it. If there is anything more to add. it wiJI be Government has already recommended to added. I cannot anow a thing which injures the Centre to include these castes in the the defence of this country. And I am taking Scheduled Tribes List. care of it. We are doing whatever is possible and whenever t here is anything .nore to be I, therefore, request that the present added, he wi)) do it. norms to declare an area as scheduled tribe area should be relaxed and certam castes of (Interruptions ) the above mentioned areas should be declared as scheduled tnbes at an early date. PROF. SAIFUDDIN SOZ : Are you (ii) Need for litreamlining the 20· point not tbe 8uardian of tbis House? Programme MR. SPEAKER : Yes, I am. I am SHRI RAMASHRA Y PRASAD doing my duty. Sit down now. Take your SINGH (Jahaoabad): Mr. Speaker, Sir, in seat. India under the Dew economic programme, a scheme was launched to bring the people above the poverty line through the 20. Point (Interruptions) Programme. The Programme was slarted by the former Prime Minister, late Smt. Indira Gandhi but the corruption has bc:come so P PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE ' Sir rampant from block level to the banks under today you are "pressing your 8nger wil h thiS ProBramme tbat the intended retrospective effect. beneficiaries have been only partially. benefited. The object of bringing the people above the poverty line has remained on MR. SPEAKER : Yes, Sir. Professor is paper only. The Government bas been only too astute to notice everything. partially successful in this Programme. To achieve complete success in tbis regard, tbe 33 Mailers U"., MAGHA 10. 1906 (SAKA) It.ru.J77 ,OlIO, Prime MiDister of Iudia Ibould take (") Need to .. up a low p..,. T...... effective stepl. To make tbe Procrammc Relay Ceatre at ...... lucceaful. Committees cOO,iJtiDI of thote penooa who are lOin, to be benefited. should be formed at Paocbayat, Block u well u at SHRI CHINTAMANI IBNA tbe Dlitrict level. (Balasore) : Mr. Speaker, Sir, Baiuol1l District in the State of OriU1 is cbroaau, affected by natural calamitia where lbe S.c. and S. T. population is more thaD 35 Fe: CIDI of the loral popularioll in tbe district. n. (01) Need for reaular Sappl, of fundi tIIroIIP Union Government bas declared thi. Baluore (;o9erDlDeDt aleneles to P.J. TestOe MI. district as "~o Industries Distdct". So mao, big, medium and severallmall scale ioduatric. and ValDuna MUIs arc in operation and many induatricl are under conslruction. The Dcfeoce Min_t,., SHRI RANJIT SINGH GAEKWAD is establishing National Test RaDle in this (Baroda) ~ Sir. the two textile mills, P.J. district which would cost mere thaD RI. 300 Textile and Yamuna, arc both facing hardship crores. This will be the second binest due to irregular supply of funds through one in the world. Aparc (rom this Asia's bil- Government agencies. gest and Prestigious Proof and Experimental Establishment which is functioning in tbi' district from British days has been Rs. 1.88,149,00 from the provident fund tremendously expanded. But it j, astonishing is outstandiol in the case of Yamuoa mill. and very unfortunate that in spire of several And t he mill is ready to repay it in demands from all sections of people fot instalments if on)y tbe bank guarantee is establishment of a Jow power T.V. Relay waived. Centre at BalaJore, the district headquarters, the Government are not yet agreeable to it, The financial position of both the mills The Ministry'. contention is that Ihe proposed is 80 poor that they are not able to pay the High Power T. V. Relay Centre at Cuttack 'arse provident fund amounts. The same is will cover some portioo of Balasore district. the case of E.S.I. payments ; both the mills But actually the proposal has not materialised have not been able to pay the instalments yet. Even if the High Power 10 K.W:r.V. Relay Centre is established at Cuttack tbi. for two to three years. An amount of Rs. . ' 20,000 was paid to Yamuna mills prior to will not cover even 1 per cent of the total closure. population of Balasore district and tbe question of covering the Sub-Divisional Headquarters at Bhadrak and Nilgisi in The mills ha ve to pay Central excise at Balasore district as well u the diltrict yarn stage as well as at cloth stase. The hcadquarttr in BaJasore does not arise at all. There is a microwave tower in Balasore town Central excise should be deferred (or at least which can be utilised for establishment of two years. low power T.V. Relay Centre at Baluore before erecting separate tower for it. The Janata cloth that was bought from P. J. Textile mills last year has not yet been paid for. The workers are working at half Therefore, I would very earnestly tbe salary and arc facing tremendous request t~ Information and Broadcasting hardsbip. Their children are also facing Ministry to establish a low power T.V. Relay difficulties since tbe yarn processing unit has been closed down. Immediate steps to look Centre of 2 K. W. at Balasore before the end aftet the welfare of the miJI workers should of the curre,nt financial year which will fulfil be taken to save the workers aod their thol! Joog cherished demand of many fakhs of families from starvation aDd ultimate death. people. Mall~1 Under JANUARY 30, 1985 Rule J77 36 y) Need to prmide employment to at least Bhubaneswar is ideally suited for the ODe penoa ia each family displaced by location of this telephone industry. It bu Dot Kquisition of land by the Vtsakbapatnam only got atl infrastructuraJ advantasea. but Steel Plant Project itl clear climatc is immensely suitable for setting up any type of etectronic industry. As the State is backward in electronic industry, SHRI S.M. BHATTAM (Visakha· the setting up of this industry at Bhubanc- tbe Visakhapatnam Steel Plant !)Imam) : Sir, swar will help in the establishment of alar. authorities required 25.780 acres of Project number of ancillary and downstream electro· 'and for purposes connected with the various nic industrial units around it and belp the Steel PJant. As against this, about 20,000 Irowth of industrialisation in the nucleus tcres have already been acquired and industrial complex in the Cbandaka area. ttansfcned to them because of which the displaced families relatio& to lst and 2nd pbases came to 1 ~IOOO. The Government of Orissa has been pre!sing for the setting up of a unit of elec- tronic telephone industry in the State for a In spite of the fact tbat the policy of long time. Therefore. I urge upon the Gove- the Government is to provide employment to rnment of India to take an early decision at least one member of each displaced family, and expedite the setting up of an electroni..: oo)y 1,276 persons out of 12,000 families telephone industry at Bhubaneswar forthwith bayc so far been employed even though several years back they lost their houses and lands. The Steel Plant authorities have (vii) ~eed to put up B Low power Television expm5ed their inabilIty to provide employ- Traosmitter at Nagercoil ment to not more tban 5,000 persons which leaves a large balance of 7,000 persons who SHRI N. DENNIS (Nagercoil) : Kanya· will be Jeft in the lurch in spite of the solemn kumari District and adjoining regions sho.lld a.lurance of the Government of India. be covered by telecast. Television sets m There docs Dot seem to be any immediate large numbers are functioninl in Kanya- prospect of absorbing any significant kumari District. The telecast from either section of tbe displaced persons. During the Trivandrum or Kodaikanal is not likely to course of discus4iions, the Steel Plant cover effectively Kanyakumari District due authorities expressed their inability to state to the peculiar terrain and shielding by the wben at least these 5,000 personS will be hills. So. the viewers of this area have no absorbed in the Steel Plant .. alternative but to view Sri Lanka telecast. But the adverse effect and damage to our nation through the Sri Lanka telecast recently Under these circumstances, the displaced persons are greatly agitated. I has forced the viewers to stop viewinlZ the would urge that tbe problom is tackled and Sri Lanka telecast. The Government have proposed a high power transmitter for Tri· satisfactorily solved before the situation takes vandrum and tbus the prcsent low power an unrortunate and avoidable serious tUrD. transmitter at Trivandrum is likely to be a surplus. So, it is appropriate to instal the (vi) Need for 5ettiog up an Electronic Tele- low power transmitter at Nagercoil consi- pbone Industry at BhubaDeswar dering the prevailing difficult experience and circum~tances faced by the viewers. Instal- lation of the above referred transmitter at SHRIMATI JAYANTI PATNAIK Nagercoil. the southernmost part of our (Cuttack) : The electronic industry is cons- country, would/promote national integration picuously absent in the ea~tern region and too and luch instalJation would benefit the Particularly in Orissa. Government of India large number of national and international bad taken a decision to remo\le regional imbalances in respect of setting up of elec- tourists ftowins ioto Kanyakumari. tronic industry in tbe country. Therefore, the location of the Electronic Telephone So. Government may be pleased to take Factory at Bbubaneswar will go a long way immediate steps for tbe inltallation or a 1.0 reme ,jDg the reaionaJ imbalances. low power t ransmiuer at Nalcreoil. 37 Matte" Under MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) Rule 377 38 (vW) Need for Strengthening D.S.F. posts nent basis_ Employment prospects of the 011 tile IDCIJa Bangladesb border in Certain local unemployed youth and unemployed areas of We~t Dinajpur district in West Bengal cbildren of the local Coal workers are beinl to preveat decolty and Cattle lifting by adversely affected by this and resentment Bangladesbis among the public and coal workers is moun- ting UP. DR. GOLAM YAZDANI (Raiganj} : Dissatisfaction is already prevailing in The whole of Chopra P.S. and Islampur P.S. this area on account of inadequate amount and Goalpukur Block I Raiganj, and of compensation paid to the people for acqui- Kaliaganj p.S. of \ft:st Dinajpur District in ring their land for extension of the coal- Wcst Bengal situated along with Bangladeshis field and non-fulfilment oC assurance of giving border is very vulnerable to all sorts ofanti- jobs to the displaced people and also keeping social activities'by Bangladeshis who cross this unit under the CCL with headquarters the border at night at unguarded points and at Ranchi instead of forming a separate divi- carry on dacoitiea iD the houses of the sion in Oris,a with the vast coal-fields in IB Indian villagers and carry away looted pro- valley and Talcher area taken together. perty and cattlc also. The cattle-lifting oc- Against this background, the present deci- cun vcry frequently by ganls of Bangladesh sion oC sending about 1200 workers from Thc B.S.F. posts are situated at along dista- Ranchi to Talchcr is like adding insult to the nes and night patrolling by them is not injury. as desired. Hence, the Bangladeshis can cross the border undetected and can also safely go back with looted property. There May I, therefore, draw the kind atten- il also free traffic of smugglers from Bangla- tion of the hon. Minister of Steel. Mines and desh at certain poin ts of tbe border, These Coal to the aforesaid grievances of the people gangs from Bang! adesh go about 3-4 Kilo- of this area with a request to take necessary metres deep into Indian territory to loot remedial measures immediately. cattle and other things. People on the Indian side feel vcry Insecure and he/pless because (x) Need to export Potatoes and easure the police cannot protect their life or tbeir support price to potato producers in West property and cattle. To prevent such anti- Bengal social acts by Bangladeshis, more B.S.F. postsshould be let up along the border or alternatively C.R.P. camps should be set up SHRI ANIL BASU (Arambagh): The in between two B.S.P. posts along all aloog the production of potato in West Bengal as in border the strength of the B.S F. camps sbo- some other parts of our country is expected uld also be increased and continuous patrol- to surpass all past records. However, due liog 01 the whole border at night arranged. to very limited storage facilities available as also for tbe reason that only a small portion of this huge production can be CODS- I draw the attention of the hon. Home umed internally. the potato producers are Minister to tbis vital problem oC the people seriously concerned now over their future. and request him to take necessary steps soon. There is already a marked decline in the price of potato cven before the produce has (ix) Need to stop transfer of Coal workers started coming to the market, The existing working in Ran chi area to Talcher unit of Cen- price of potato has crashed down to all tral Coal field Ltd .. alarming low level of Rs, 4S per quia tal. In these circumstances the only couno SHRI SRIBALLAV PANIGRAHI left to protect the Potato producers i. to (Deogarh) : Sir, I was given to understand while a••Talchcr a few days before that take immediate meuures for the export of about 1200 (twelvo hundred) coal workers the commodity. presently working in Ranchi area of Bibar are being sent to Talcher unit of the Central Reports published in some national Coal Field Ltd for working there 0:1 perms- dailies reveal that countries like Japan are i9 JANUARY 30, 198' RII/~ 371 mterested in purcbuinl potato to tbe tune of (Tl'aruiatiotl; ., mDJioD toones or eYeD more. (sil) Need to ereate 8 post of DIG at Polla I urp upon the Uaion Government Co for PlII'llea ~Blbar) take tbe ronowing Dracut measures to save the potato produanl farmers of our SMT. MADHURI SINGH (Puroea): COUD"'. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would like to point out to the Minister of State for Home Affairs, tbat a5 District Purna touches tbe borders or maoy ,a) to mate immediate arran8ementl countries like Nepal, Bangladesh and otbers for ensuriug support price to the anti·sociaJ elements or these countrie. potato proouc:ers tbrousb State contiouously infiltrate into this area. Governments by providing nece" Nary lundl to tbem (or the pur- Nepal beina adjacedt to tbit area, it hat posc. become havcn for smugglers. People from Bangladesh al!O infiltrate and takG away cattle or tbe local people. (b) to make immediate arrangements for e~port of the c:ommodity. West Bengal and Sikkim, being contiguoul people (rom those State, have easy access to this dj'trict and commit (xl) Need to re-CJpftl tile S.K.J. Sugar Fac- tory, Lauria (West Cbamparan Bibar) crimes like dacoity t murder etc. They also bring and sell mesal arms and ammunition. aad clear dues of employees and caae growers Keepiog aU the~e things in view, it i! very necessary to ~rtatc a post of DIG of SHRI BHOLA RAUT (Ba,aha): A Police for Purnca lupr factory known as S.K.J. Sugar is located in Lauria, District We!t Champarao (Bihar) which is employing about 3,000 I urge upon the Minister or State ror people. Tbis sugar factory is 'yin! closed Home Affairs to issue necessary orders in for the last 6 months and the employees this regard at the earliest so as to provide bave been rendered unemployed. Their !Orne rdief to the peoplc of Purnea. salary for ~ months is due to be paid to them. The cane growers who supplied their SUiar cane to the factory have Dot been paid [English) dues to the extent of about Rs. 31 ~rore! for tbe last 2 t years. (xiii) Irregularities ia implementation of I.R.D.P./N.R.E.P. Programma in WCit· Bengal The plight of the employees is jU5t pathetic for non .. payment of their salaries far ~ month, and same j, the pliabt of the cane SHKI PRIY A RANJAN DAS Irowers whose arrears are mountina ovcr a MUNSHI (Howrah) : The serious irregulari .. ties in the implementation of IRDP/NRBP period of 2! yean. prosrammc in West Bengal have created problems for the poor. Rural Development It is imperative now for the Govern .. Ministry must appoint an EDquiry Committee to find out the facts and take appropriate ment to take a serious view of tbe affairs of action in this matter. Politi,al discrimination this factory and get (he dues cleared by the in distribution of aid to tbe poor should bo owncr to both employees and the sugar caoe Ifowen. Any delay in taking necessary action removed. will adveree]y affect the people. 41 Ma'"rJ U"d" MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) SHIll B~SUDEB ACHARIA : How If it materialisel, die will has he been allowed to raise tbis iove of render out of lear the edUCldoa.-IOB of three NREP and IRDP bere 1 lakhs of Itudents of five bundred ICeodriya Vidyalayas spread all over the country on the even of Board examination. (xi.) Need for ref'_ of freight equallsadoD Scheme Their eieven.point demands Deed immediate discussion between Union Govern- SHRI BASUDEB ACHA.RIA ment and tcachers association. The EducatiOD (Bankura): Mr Speaker, Sir, freight Minister must take the initiative and try to equalisation and its impact on location of solve their problems thereby saviog the industries and regional development was academic career of the students staudioa in examined in depth by Marathe Committee. these paccaletting iostitutions. SubsequentlY, National Transport Policy Committee, headed by Shri 8 D Pande also examined the issue of freight equalisation (xvi) Need to In,estigate iato the reported including the need for extending it to tbe black in marud Car articles of mass consumption. SHRI SANAT KUMAR MANDAL It was reported tbat the proposal of the (Joy nagar) : The much-awaited Maruti car Paode Committee to phase out freight long last came on the road, but as a equalisation scheme in industrial cJmmodilles potential money spinner. It is said that this was accepted by !he Central Government but car is being sold at a premium of Rs. 30 to has not yet been implemented. 40 thousands of rupees and this has resulted in generating some crores of black money. The If the freight equalisation ~cheme in unsocial dements are making a fast buck of respect or IroD. Steet. Cement. Petroleum black money. Government are belples)y product, coal etc, is followed and selective watching the situaticn as under the exi~tinl non-equalisation of freight rates continues, Rules, there is no control OD the sale of then West Bengal alongwilh other Slates of these cars. In many cases, the delivery is eastern region will continue to suffer, taken directly by the interested parties on the basIs of the allotment letters. In case Government are unable to regu) ate the The freight equalisation scheme for resale of these cars within a period of 2 selected raw materials shculd be abolished as years of their original sale to the allouees, recommended by Pandc Committee or all the they should at Jeast move in the matter by raw materials of national importance like asking the Income Tax Department to Cotton, industrial alcohol etc. should be made investigate the source of income of both tbe available to States at controlled rates. original -allottees and the buyers and even the A rticJes of mass ...co.o~on sboufd be benami sales as to who are these buyers and supplied at uniform price throughout the seUers and how they are manipulating such country as recommended,by the Committee. transactions. Government should move immediate]y to mop up all this bJack money. Further. in case of Maruti vans, the premium (:u) Need for holding talks with All-India ranges between Rs. SO to 60 thousands on Kendriya Vldyalaya Teaclaer's Association the salc by the original allottees. Some for soiling their Problems regulation should be made against transfer withm the initial penod of two years. Even SHRI C. MADHA V REDDY benami transactions should be got cleared by tbe Income tax Department. It is high time (AdiJabad) : Me Speaker, Sir, it is gathered that all this modus operandi of generati'ng from newspaper reports that All India black money is investigated and delinqueot Kendriya Vidyalaya Teachers AssoCiation is and un~ocia} elements takeD to task.. to re~umens theIr Indefinite fast aod other fCJrms of agitation, 43 JANUAR Y 30. 1985 (.,11) NellI ...... 01'...... 08Iee railway-croasioJl in.the rural at•• with tbe of lIf. 11ISIII'8DCe· CorporatioD at result tbat accidents occur quite ofteD aad tbe ...... (J"IC) vill_Jen bave to face maay ditBcultia. I. tberefore, urI" upon the Miail_or of Ran ..,. PIlOf. SAIFUDDIN SOZ (Baramulla) : to make immediate arraolemcotl to provide there it a problem which cao be resolved railway-crolSiDI at Hsnumaoaarb-BbaliDda with ease by the Finance Minister. It must RaiJway lioe to facilitate mowlDCDt of traflic be known to tbe Finance Minister that there between Nawan GaoD. Tehan HaDumullrb arc Div.ional Offices of LIC in .very big aod Nawan By. stIDd of HanumaDgarb cit, in lDdia and these offices transact a lot Saolaria Road and another cronin, aD of bulineu incJudinl Iraot of Joan. to policy Hanumanlarb-Saalpur Railway ) ine for holden. There are 'ten sllCh offices in Uttar smooth traffic from Hanuman.arb T.V. Road Pradesh aod similarly in other Stat:s. Jammu to Nandram Ki Dhaoi aDd viJJall Jbambar. and Kuhmir is perhaps the only State in Immediate provision may also be made to lodia which does not have a divisional office provide railway crouiDg in the rcaWDina of tbe LIC The policy holden from Kubmir rural areas in the wbole of tbe district so al wbOM CUCI arc reco~mendcd by LIe's to avoid railwa, accidents aDd provide relief Branch ofIke at Srinapr. have to come all to villaFR. tbe way from Srinagar to JulluDdar and ~unue their caleS. The plight of the people *tlo beJool to tbe rural sector is far more [English} a:ute. I am told that because of the distance many prospective borrowers do not aet (xs) Need to make provialoo 1D the Se,eatb benefit from the JoaDI of tbe LIC which are File year plaD for Settiag up a Paper available on easy terms. The reault is that Mill ia Tripura the field is left only to a section of busioCII commuo!ty who have monopolised tbis coocession. Therefore, I bring tbis anomaly SHRI AJOY BISW AS (Tripura Welt) : to the notice of tbe Finance Minister "ith the Tripura is rich in bamboo and hardwood. hope tbat be would look into it and ask LIC The Tripura Government decided to set U}.I " to establisb a Divisional Office at Srinagar Paper Mill at Fatikray considering tbe (Kashmir). proximity of natural bamboo forests, availa- bHity of sufficient water from Manu river (I,m) Theft of a Wireless SigDal Book from and easier uansportation of raw materials by Bouro aDd Need to check such river. Besides, the exrension of railway line incidents upto Kumarghat is in progress and the area is well conDected by National High way. There.. fore, Jand. raw materials and transport SMRI C.P. THAKUR (Patna). : The facilities are easily available for the Project. tbeft of a wireless signal book from Bokaro The Project Report also is in lavour of is a serious matter. This book: contains vital seuing up of a Paper Mill in Tripura. The information on defence mattera, movements Jetter of iDtent was also issued but subsequen, of troops etc. Similar theft bas occurred tly cancelled. The need of I Paper Project three times before. I urac the Government to in Tripura beiDg a backward and under- take necessary Iteps to prevlnt lucb thefts. devel0Pt:d state requires no explanation. Unemployment problem has been acute in MR. SPEAKER: Only the approved Tripura and already 90 tbouland educated text will 10 on record. youths bave registered their namel in the employmcnt excbanlcs. Moreover, the [Translation] Central Government have extended help to aet up four Paper MiIIl io the North Eastern (xix) Need to provide raUway-crou1ags hi region including Cacbar. The apprehension Gaagaoagar diltrict of Rajasthan , is that the natural forelt reIOurces or Tripura will be used as raw materials in tbose pape~ SHRI BIRBAL (Gan'aDapr), : Mr. miJJs of North Eastern rtlinn and Tripura Speaker. Sir, in my CODltitQCoCJ, tbert.re no 45 Matters Under Rule 377 MAGHA 10. 1906 (SAKA) Co",rilutio. (52nd .4mdtJ BUI 46 will lose ita around or setting up or a Paper "'Navada di.trict (Bihar) has a ~pe1ation of Mill as proposed. I shaH urge upon the about 14 lakh.. the peopJe of this district Central Government to include a Paper have Dot been provided television Project for Tripura in Seventh Five Year tranlmi.. ion facility, I. therefore, urge upon Plan aDd remove tbe anxiety of the people of the OoveremcDt to provide a teJevision a small and backward State like Tripura. tranlmillio'l tower at Navada in 1985 under tbe special Television Extension Programme. (:lsi) Sbortage or Electricity in Jammu and More so, because it il the policy of Kashmir Government of India to provide television transmission facility to more and more people or the country. SHRI ABDUL RASHfD KABULI (Srinagar) : Jammu and Ka5hmir IS facing tbe worst kind of power shortage this winter, (xxiii) Need to expedite co~tnIctJoa of an with frequent shortfalls and non-availability, overbridge near Moradaba' on Morada- in supply of electricity. Industrial units, bad-Cbaodausi railway liae besides handicrafts industry in Kashmir Valley have virtually come to a stand-still, SHRI HAFIZ MOHD. SIDDIQ affecting not only normal life and students (Moradabad) : Mr. Speaker, sir, a railway preparedness for the examinati0ns. but also bridge was to be constructed at a distance of crippling the overall economy of the State. about 2 kms from Moradabad Railway This has rendered arti~ans and small Station on Moradabad-Chandausi- industries units-holders jobless. The deficiency Saharanpur-Rampur line under Moradabad in supply of electricity has assumed alarming Railway Division. For the last S years this proportions this year; only 18~'~ of the total propo!al bas remained pending. In the requirement is ava ilable, which includes absence of this bridge, tbe people have been electricity impor'ed from the northern grid. facing a lot of dIfficulties. The railway crossing remains closed for bours witb the: The present power famine has come re!lult tbat not only work of the people closely on the heels of absolute failure of suffen but there is wastage of time also tourilt trade. Therefore, keeping in view the genuine demand of the people, work on this overbri- The Centre must rile to t~e occasion, dge should be started immediately to remove aDd give a helping hand to the State in the inconvenience to the public. present power crisis, by increaling adequate supply of electricity from northern grid, so 11 44 hrs. that difficulties are lessened. Also , the Centre must finance and start work on the Uri. Dool Hasti and other power projects in the State. CONSTITUTION (FIFTY-SECOND AMENDMENT) BILL The State hal great potential in electricity. Its river resources, if properly English' tapped and expioited, can besides meeting tbe State's own requirement. also provide Mr. SPEAKER: Now Shri A.K. Sen. electricity in abundance to the rest of the country. THE MINISTER OF LAW AND JUSTICE (SHRI A.K. SEN) : 1 beg to move: (Translation] "That the, Bill further to amend lbe (nii) Need to instal a television transmitter Constitution of India, be taken into at Navada in Bibar consideration. " SHRI KUNWAR RAM lSawai This Bill is in onc way a redemption of Madbopur): Mr, Speaker, Sir. althouah our long elpectations. expect.tioal raised 4' Coutila/lo" JANUARY 30, 1985 (52nd Amdl.) Bill 48 aiDce tbe fourth Lok Subba was elected. The our politicl, it would briol not only discredit HoUle wiJl recalJ that the phenomcoa of to our democracy but also doom tbe future defection became acute and apparent after growth of mature and healthy political tbe Fourth Oaaeral Elections in J967 about conventions, which ,lone, apart from the which I have the fiauret bere, and tbe figures constitutional provisions, sustain a stronl will speak ror themselves. Wbereu upto democrac):. Why is it that parliamentary 1967, there have been only-about 400 democracy has Foundered all over the World, defection., within ODe year from the election all over old colonial World, in Africa, in tbe of IM7, tbere were SOO-odd ~erections, of Far East I do not want to meDtioo C\)untries wbom, the fiJures also say, ) 18 were by and also very close to us in Pakistan and io persoo' wbo became Ministers or Ministers BangJadesb? Why is it that this country alone of State. The problem became so important of the emergiog world. of tbe entire old from tbe point of view of prcscrving the colonial world, succeeded in eSlablishlDI best t""'" of democracy and of setting the healthy convenuon of dcmo=ratic functioD- certaiD 0.- of political behaviour tbat the ing, notwithsta:tding the fact that we had a House will recall tbat under the chairmanship massive majority of the fuling party until 1967 of tbe late, Shri Y.B. Chavan A Committee not only in the Cenlre but also in the on Defection. I think, was set up some time States? One reason alone justifies it. 1 in ()c:tober 1967 consisting of eminent jurists remember SIIiI now how Pandit Nehru used to like Mr. Daphtary, Mr. Scerval and also come here. used to go to t he Opposition first and then to the Speaker. The lesson of mdlrc.ecl=Dtt and Members of . different honouring dissent and of tolerating opposi- poJi&iCal pMties represented in Parliament. tion in a democracy was laid down by that That Committee made certain recommenda- great, leader~ and I have said. so 'lot onl), tioDi and those recommc:ndations were here but everywhere else also that without a considered when tbe ) 973 Constitution great leader. democracy never becomes (AmendmeDt) Bill was introduced fir,st; and established firmly. tbat Bin, for the first time, took cognizance of tbis phenomenon of what has Come to be termed .a "Aya Ram and Gaya Ram" It was George Wasbington who refused People crossed Floor without any intelligible to stand for the third term as the PreSident, principle, but crossed the Floor mainly who laid the foundations of the American actuated by opportunise or for tbe purpo~e democracy. He :::aid that we did Dot fight of gainiol a political advantage or a personal the monarchy to establish another monarchy advantage. This phenomenon was noticed in a new world. Pandilji was a person who in India for tbe first time, as I told you, in could have wielded the greatest of authority. 1967; and tbe problem of crossing the Floor The peopie obeyed him, trusted him and emerged only after the of· defeat of confided in him They trusted that the Congress Party in some States. At the maximum power giv!n to· him would never emerICnce of small parties who were coales- be misused. He tried to used it neither for ced only for tbe purpose of forming a one political party nor for one particular Ministry aDd who had no political principle individual. When h.e died, millions paid him to combine together, it mu~t be said to the tributes not only outside this House near credit of the Congress Party that so long as Rajghat but also on the floor of the House Congress remained on the saddle in the States when the tnbutes to the founding father of until] 967 including the State of West Bengal t our ·democracy were truly proclaimed to the the phenomenon of .• Aya Ram and outside ","orld. I recall tbe words which Gaya Ram" was almost unknown. In West came from· one of our great opposition Bengal and in certain other States. from leaders, a great parliamentarian, Prof. Hiren 1968 onwards, we saw this phenomenon of Mukherjee, who was the leader of the quickly crossing the Floor, changing 'side, Communist Party of India-Prof. Ransa As we said "Chola badalne ki kala shuru /10 might remember the words that he uttered Kai" the drama of changing colour of the with such a solemnity from that side-who mantle started then; and every section of the said that here was a man who strode the House and every section of the people was world like a colossus but he had no Achilles unanimously of the view that unless this heel to guard. He wielded a bow which DO phenomenon was completely obliterated from one could wield. Yet he referred to tbe 49 Constitution MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52nd ..tmdt.) Bill opposition eVery time when the OPPosHlon [Trans/at ion} was to be consulted. Here was a man who used bis powers not for himself but for the MR SPEAKER: Please don't interrupt. country and for our democracy. Now, it is You may speak When your tum comes. for upholding those principles that all parties were pledged from 1967 to outlaw this outra- geoul phenomenon of Ayarams and ( Interruptions)** Gayanml. It is true that we hale been a little late in proceeding with the matter. I do not agree with maoy of tbe recommenda- tions of the Committee 00. MR. SPEAKER: Nothing goes OD record. Not allowed. No. questiOD of clarification. Defectiolls because, as I go through their recommendations, I find tbat those SHRI A.K. SEN: I do not miod tbe recommendations could Dot possibly succeed two new Hon. Members who arc offerves- in tackling sucb a problem. The very cent lD their enthusiasm but I do mind the definition of a political party was outmoded. in,erruption of Prof. Soz who is quite It ooly confined itself to those parties which expenenced as a parliamentarian. got symbols. Bllt there were maDy parties (Interruption). He ougbt to know that tbe who could not get indiVIdual symbols before time for IDterruption comes after tbe speech elections like Te)ugu Desam and they Yet is over and that is the parliamentary traditioa became parties and on tbelr tickets which are trying to cherish ....(llllerruption). members were elected. PROF. SAIFUDDIN SOZ (Baramulls): I will wait, Sir. In 1973 the BilJ which was introduce=! in Lok Sabha went to a Joint Select Committee consisting of sixty Members. SHRI A.K. SEN: Very well. I will be That Bill was never passed. Tbat Lok very happy, Sabha came to a close 10 1977. After 1977 Jaoata Government ,,;ame. They started MR. SPEAKER: It is not he who experimentlDg with the matter and brought enforce~ the rules, It is me, tbe Speaker, who a Bill which could not ev~n be Inlroduced. does so. It is Dot the Minister. The Cabinet Sub-Committee headed by PROP. SAIFUDDIN SOZ : I approach the then Prime Minister Shri Morarji Desai. bim through you, Sir. never finalised their recommendations. I do not blame anyone. It is a problem which Mr. SPEAKER: Yes, tbat is is really gigantiC in its impljcalioDs~ and yet a somethlOg. problem which should have been tackled with the utmost of speed, because we were having ejections every two or three years. When SHRI A.K. SEN: What I said was tbat tbe Janata Government broke up in the the Congress party was not a victim to middle of the term. we had the elections defections; those. who became victims to asain in three years. Fortunately, I must defections are the ones who are injured today. say, again witbout taking undue credit for For Chem we are Dot responsible. If they the party to which we all belong to this delect or jf they split, we are not responsible. side of the House, that ever since the return But the very fact ..... (1nterruption). You are of Shri:.nati Gandhi, we did not encoLirage again breaking tbe rule Mr. Cboubey . defections at all. (Interruptions) Now, as 1 said, tbe very fatt tbat we. witb •• Not recorded. COIUtitllli_ JANUAR Y 30, 1985 (52l1li Ifmdl.) Bill • massive majority on this side, hnve brought Join some other party, or dilObey tbe milldale this anti-defection Bill and we want to pass of tbat party, aD the floor of tbe House. it in this se9ioo ..... (lnterruptio'u). This is Here I b'ave to explain immediately tbat the the: expression of tbe lensc of disappointment other day some controversy wat raised witb for which they alooe are responsible. regard to clause (c) of sub-paragraph (I) of paragraph 6, which soupt to disqualify persons, who were expelled by their party for SURI NARA Y AN CHOUSEY conduct outside tbe House. Now I may (Midnaporc): We support this Bill. immediately tell the hon. Members tbat the Government having regard to the ~ODsensus SHRI A.K. SEN : If you do. tben you arrived at,' not only witbin our party but keep quiet and listen to us ....(lnler'"pliOrls). also with a view to accommodatiog the views or quite a large number of opposition parties, SHRI SUDINI JAIPAL REDDY including Shri Narayan Choubey'. party and (Mahbubnagar) : On'y yesterday two MLA, the CPM, we agreed to bring in, at the have: split from Nagaland party to Coolress appropriate moment, at amendmcnt deleting (I) •••••. (Interruptions). this provision. But some of your colleague! will not welcome it, as you know, because they are more afraid of defections than our- SHRI A.K.. SEN: We can take care of selves of ••• (lnterruptions) ourselves, you take care of yourself. Now, Sir, Mr. Narayan Cboubey foHows the logic of Wizard of Oz when he says we shaH listen to you when you talk sense. Wizard of Oz 12.00 brs. also was asked in "Alice in Wonderland" : "why must it be so and why do you say that In paragraph 2, sub-paragraph (1) (b). it is right." He said, "1 said so because I say there will be a slight amendment, We are seek ~ so and it is rigbt because I said so," There· ing to disqualify persons who disobey the man- fore, it is sense when Mr. Chou bey thinks it date of the party, either by voting contrary to is sense but it is not sense when Mr. Choubey the mandate of the party or by abstaining does Dot think it is sen5C. That is the logic from voting contrary to the mandate. There with which we cannot agree ... (Interruption), may be cases where a man may be ill, or the ]f he wants to sp:ak in Bengali, let him carry train may be delayed and he cannot come and 00. obey the mandate by voting. In such cases, he cannot be regarded as having abstained from He speaks Hindi and Bengali equally weJl voting. So, we are tryiog to add the words and I am jealous of him because of that be- "without prior permiS6ion, or subsequent cause my Hindi is Dot as good as my B~ngali condonation by the political party or authority Now, Sir, this is the position and I think we within a month of such voting or abstention", can take legitimate pride in this fact that That will take care of unwiJful abstention, our party, with such a mas§ive majority, has where a person is prcvented by circumstances thought it fit to bring, as tbe first measure in beyond his control from comins to the House the very first session of this parliament, thi! in time and voting, accor<'iog to the mandate anti-defection Bill which has the object of of hi. party. With the deletion of lhis, I think preventing defections which have pJagued our it will possibJy not be necessary to So iota politics, more the other parties than us. any bitter controversies over this Bill. AI this Bill is of such a nature and founded aD The basjc feature. ot tbjs BiJJ may be principles of universal acceptance, I am e"pJained in a few words. We have brought hoping that it will then have unanimous every political party within the Bill. We have acceptance in this House. It will bave the not coDtioued the Bill to parties havins best impact on the people outside the House, symbols or receivins recognition (rom the' 10 that not only the peopJe of India, but the EJection Commissioo. I( any party puts up a people outside wm know what are the firm caqdidate, and that candidate lets elected OD rocks on which our democray is founded aDd that party ticket, it will be impermissible for what are the principles, which are ananimou· that pelIOn to miln from that party and I\Y accepted by the people in this country. If " MAGnA 10, 1906 (S,4K~) (5211t1 btdI.) Bill • this Bill it paned with the unanimous appro- PROF. SAIPUDDIN SOZ: I waat to val in thit HoUle, it will be the best certifi- speak rigbt DOW. cate tbat tbit Bill caD obtaiD. MR. SPBAKBR .peak 08 With these words, I recommend this You wiD bebalf of your party. Bill with the further clarification that there may be disputes as to whether a man is really elected OD. parly ticket, or whether he haa PROF. SAIFUDDIN SOZ: lOlli, waat really voted COIItrary to the mandate. or some clarification. wbether the maadate had reac:bcd bim before he voted. All these decisions are bcinl left, Dot in tbe bands of the court, or the Election MR. SPEAKER: You may ask for abe Commission, or the Governor the Prcaident, clarification when your tura comes. as the case may be, but io t he hands of the Speaker, or the Chairman of the particular [EnglisJr} House cooocmed. so that it will mean ••• (I kIIIl) "te,.,up' Sarvubri K. P. UnnitrishDaa and C. Madhav Reddy have Jiven Dotic:e9 s of _ MR. SPEAKER : I will note tbat. amendment each to the consideration Motioa before the HoUle. I find tbey are Dot here. So, SHRI SUDINI JAIPAL REDDY: We J sball call upon Sbri Bbattam SreeramamUf'- would not like you to say anything'" thy to speak. SHRI A.K. SEN: Once it goes outside SHRI S.M. BHA TTAM (Visakba. the control of the House, it wiJI take years patnam) : Sir, (rise to support tbe maio and yean for the court to come to a decision, aims and objectives of the Bill which is DOW becaUJe there will be appeals and further before the House. appeals and the matter wiJI be forgotten, like the Anti-Defection Bills of the past. There- THE MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE fore, if we mean business, we must give AND RURAL DEVELOPMENT (SURI authority to decide this serious matter to the BUTA SINGH) : Sir, wheu wm the votioa Speaker or the Chairman of the House take place? concerned, who hal been elected by tbe majority vote of the House concerned. With {Translation] these words, I recommend to the House the unanimous acceptance of this BiU. MR. SPEAKER ; You have to wait the whole day. MR. SPEAKER : Motion moved : ·'That the BiU further to amend the [English) Constitution of India be taken into consideration." We will cross th: bridge when we come to it. PROF. SAIFUDDIN SOZ : I want to seek a clarificatioD. SHRI BUTA SINGH: How much time be for the consideration of MR. SPEAKER : I will give you time wHi takeD the '1 to speak. Bill (TrGtl.mtiOlf) [Translation] MR. SPEAKER: You ml)' speak, when MR. SPEAKER: You ha'·e to wai, ,.... permined. ~hok dav. " CmutltllliDII JANUARY 30, 1985 (52nd Amdl.) Bill -- floor crossing. Tberefore, Sir, I urp dlat tbe Government may have a secood look at tbe matter. Now, this unfortunate pbc..-on bas SHRI S.M. BHATT&\M : The spirit j~ been obtaining in several partl or tbe COUD- "bid» it was introduced was agreeable to U3 try, particularly in tho5e areas "bere the and tbe leader of our Parliamentary Party ruling party in tbe State happens to be Don- also at length expressed the stand of tt:c ConlreS! Party. Recently in ADdbra, owina Party during the course of the informal to tbe phenomenon of split enlioecred from discussions \\'ith the Prime Minister held with above, the tben rulins party bad to come all tbe political parties. dowD, had to be thrown out aDd bad to vacate tbe office. Througb tbe instrument of Governor, the institution of· Governor HaYinl said that I would like to men- this has also been managed. ADd there- tion certain things in regard to the Bill. It is fore, I sincerely urge that the BHI should Dot merely a piece of legislation, It is a be sucb that would Dot encouraae split which legislation to amend tbe Constitution to curb is Dot lood for democracy. This fragmenta- defections. The political parties as such should tion of po1itical party, spJit of poJitical part)'. be able to come together, periodicaBy, disintegration and deterioration of political deliberate over this issue and arrive at some party bas got to be avoided and prevented. consensus and evolve a code of conduct We have to take necessary precautions to see among themselves so that they establish that - such a phenomenon does not occur. healthy Dorms and standard 5 (or t heir parties. Instead of doing it, we are indirectly encoura- They shoold meet periodically not only for ging defection, promoting and protecting and stock-taking and (or exchanging views but also s~ving them from tbe provision of dis- also for receiving complaints wherever divisi- qualification which other people in a similar ons or diversenccs are there and when people position should bave incurred. So, now Sir, it are against these checks and controls or when appears to me that** are going to be fostered it becomes necessary to obtain sanctions in and strengthened. And this thing is going to regard to the code of conduct which are be done, voluntarily agreed upon. For instance, in tbe case of a defection, any othrr party can admit a Member of another party. In case it MR, SPEAKER : ~o names please. is done, it should be obligatory for tbe Election Commission to withdraw its recogni- SHRJ S.M. BHATTAM : So, some such tion to that political party. Some such sanct- phenomenon which obtained in Punjab and a ions have to be imposed. Therefore, besides similar situation which obtained sometime its being within the ambit of the Bill which is back in Andhra should be prevented. But before this House, I propose tbat such a those are the things v)hich ttJe ruling pany consensus should be arrived at amongst the wants to recur and to take place again and various political parties. again. I urge that such things should Dot happen again. Now, I come to another important aspect which needs our utmost attention. In Sir, this has been deliberately kept in the case of .an indivjduaJ who crosses the the Bill with a view to cause destabilisatioD floor after the election, OD that basis be incurs in the existing Government whenever they disquali fication: bu+ in the case of say, a happen to belong to political parties from the group of persons when there is a !imilar Opposition. Therefore, this is our obj~ction. crossing of the floor, it is a conspiracy by an organised group. It should be considered more dangerous. In such a case also, those people .We rai5e another important point. When- should, similarly stand disqualified. They ever the Chief Minister of a State owing to should not be exempt from the ambit of the such organised spl it happens to Jose his velevant clause which disqualifies persons for , majority, in that C~5et the Cbief Minister Constitution '7 MAGHA 10, 1906 (St4KA) (52nd """".) Bill 58 should be empowered, should have the right to soek for dissolution of the House and seek for tbe dcciaioa c r Ibe President • fresh mandato (rom the people and it is and his decision thaD be final.'· not open for the Governor to exercise his right of discretion under the Constitution and So, tbe m'ttter bas got to be referred to disagree with the Chief Minister. And it is a the President. That i. bow the original deliberate act on the part of certain vested Constitution contains tbe provision. EvCQ interests. people from above who engineer here, the President takes action before giving such defection. My amendment which I have any decision, Article 103(2) reads: giveD'~ notice of, was not allo\\ed on the ground that it touches upon other aspects which bave no relevance to the Bill in "Before giving an, decision on any questiOD, because it touches/apon the powers such question, the President shaJl obtain of the Governor. Therefore, it is not allowed. the opinion of the Election Commission I can very well see the reason. But all the and shall act according to such same. I want the Governmen t to understand opinion," the implicatrons of the question which we have sought to raise on the floor of the House. The Election Commission is invariably Therefore the split cannot be tolerated and the consulted in all such matters before the persons who have caused split. fragmentation. President takes a final decision in tbis disintegration and breaking-away of the party regard. cannot be encouraged and therefore they have to automatically suffer a similar dis- qualification as in the case of any individual Now, instead of the President, the Member of the House. They should not be Speaker is vested Wllh special powers, extra- protected. should not be saved under the ordlOary powers. to deal with the matter proviSions of the Constitution, under the under this Bill, The Speaker is the guardian provisions of this Bill, This is what we would of the powers and privileges of the members like to urge. of tbe House and, that being the case, let him not be reduced to a position of merely Secoodly, Sir. when J do that. my point carrying OUf the executive fUDction in regard is this. . They protect the spiJtters. I say. to this matter vis-a-vis the members of the this is a Bill for p~rpetuatioo of fragmenta- House. That is why I want the Speaker to tion of political parties, That is how it be saved from thiS embarrassment, I suggest appears to me, that this specific prOVision be deleted and this question may be considered by the House, Now, Sir, I come to the powers of the Speaker. With all respect to you, I would like to mention tbat it is not In the best As far as the Speaker is concerned. I mterest and traditions of this House that the may point out that the Speaker has got an Speaker should be given extraordinary and optiOD open before him, that is, he may super powers so as to disqualify a Member voluntanly res'gn from the Party or he may "n certain grounds. So, the powers of continue to be 10 the PArty. But my view is djsquahficatioD are not to be exercisable by that the Speaker who is occupying the august the Speaker. It will be done Dot by the office of the Speaker should necessanly Speaker but by the Chief Election Commis- cease to be a member of any political party $ioner. I may in this connection refer to to which he may have originally belonged article 103 of tbe Constitution : prior to hi~ election to the office of the Speaker. This is a healthy practice which o~her state legislatures may also adopt. I "(1) If any question arises as to have been a member of the other House for whether a member of either House tbe last 20 years. of Parliament has become subject to any of the disqualifications mentioned in clause (1) of article As far as my knowledge goes, some 102, the question shall be referred Speakers coniinue to be members of political 59 COlUlilUl;on JANUARY 30, 19&' (5211d Amdt.) Bill partin even after occupying the august office it So many People have spokeD OD lbe of the Speaker. • floor of the House on this subject. But they have not followed it uP. There bas bela a Mr. SPEAKER : It has to be a two- difference between sayina and dom.. That way traffic, both for the opposition and the difference has to be elimioated. That it rulin, side. It is for the House to decide, all. otherwise, tbe Speaker himself is in a quandary. SHRI S.M. BHATTAM: Before concluding, I would like to invite your SHRI S.M. BHATTAM : It is a sugge- attention to anotber Clause and tbat is about stion for you to cODsider. the privileges an~ amenities of Parliament and its members. Article lOS (3) reads: MR. SPEAKER: It is for the House to consider. It has been suggested so many "In other respects, the powers, tbe times. privileges and immunities ot each House of Parliament, and of the members and the committees of each House, shall be SHRI S.M. BHATTAM : There should such as may from time to time be be • healthy convention. It is in the hands defined by Parliament by law, and. until of the Speaker, not in the bands of tbe so defilled, shall be those of that House House. Whatever is done by you will be aDd its members and committees the pace-setter and others will emulate you immediately before the coming into and follow you. These are the beahhy force of section 15 of the Constitution conventions and traditions whIch may go to (Forty-fourth Amendment) Act, 1978." strengthen the democratic process and the progress of democracy in the country. So, we enjoy only such powers as were enjoyed by tbe House of Commons before Here again, there is a provision that the Constitution came into effect in this the Speaker may, after he ceases to be the c,Juntry. Therefore, no extra powers can be Speaker, rejoin the same party or any other enjoyed by this House unless there is a political party. In tbe case of other members specific provision amending this. If we want also, a member can also join any other to take more powers tban whatever is avail- political party after he ceases to be a able to the House of Commons, tben you member of the House. But in the case of will have to amend tbis particular provision; the Speaker also he may continue to be a otherwise, we will not be entitled to this member of the party after he cea~es to be the under the Constitution. So, I draw the Speaker or he can rejoin the party to wh ich he attention of tbe bon. Minister to this belonged or he can rejoin any otber political particular clause. party. Such vast and wide options need not be given to the Speaker. MR SPEAKER: The Law Minister wilJ take note of it. Mr. Digbe. MR. SPEAKER: Your Party has given the names of other members also to take part in the debate. You take your time SHRl SHARAD DIGHE (Bombay, accordingly; you keep some time for other North Central): Mr. Speaker, Sir, I rise to memeers of your Party also. support this Bill wholeheartedly; not only that, I also welcome this piece of legi~lation. It is a bold step to ensure that the political SHRI S.M. BHATTAM: Instead of system in this country maintains lOme rubbing you on the wrong side, I would sembJance of decency and etbics. In fact, it like to resume my seat, but before doing is in conformity with the assurance given by that. our Prime Minister for a clean administration and a clean public life. From this point of Mr. SPEAKER: It is a good suggestion view, I was very happy when even in the I dOD't mind it. I have a)50 been advocating PresideDt's Address it was mentioned that aD 61 CtJlUlirutloll MAGEl A 10, 1906 (SAKA) (5111d A_,., .n 62 Anti-Defection Bill would be brought and Therefore, as I said, th.. Jeaidatioo passe I in chi. Session itself, There was was overdue and, as I .tated earlier, there widespread concern over the problem of was alao a demand from tbe public that political defection in this country, and [ some such legialation should be made. tbink, from the public also, there have been consiltent delDand$,. that some punishmont should be liven to those who defect from Now, two attempts were made to their political parties. Now we are, in a introduce such Billa. Before tbat, there was way, bonourin8 that demand and honouring a committee appointed under tbe Clairman- ship of Jate Shri Yeshwantrao Cbavan and OUf commitment by bringing in this Ie.ialation. the Committee al.o made certain recommen- dations. Ultimately Constitution (Tbirty- second) Amendment Bill of 1973 wu 12,23 brs. introduced in this House. but, for some reason or the other, it could Dot be ultimately passed. The second attempt, al [MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER in the Chair] was stated by tbe Law Minister, was in the regime of the Janata Party-the Constitution MR. Deputy-Speaker, Sir, [ would say (Forty~ighth) Amendment Bill of 1978. that defection is an old disease. Even though Due to stiff opposition from the Party itself the Law Minister has mentioned some recent ultimately that Bill had to be withdrawn. instances. from 1967, in fact, it appears, when One attempt has been made in the States I go through the record, that even in the also. The Jammu & Kashmir State passed pre-Independence period there were at least the Jammu & Kashmir Representation of one or two occasions when there were some People's Amendment Act of ]979. So an defection.. After iDd~peDdence, States like attempt was made there also to prevent these Tamil Nadu, Andhra Pradesh and Kerala defections. were among the first bastion of defection polities in India. After 1967, the whole southern part or, as a matter of fact, any As far as the legal prOVISIons are other large part of India has not been concerned. I may also say that there is completely immune from defection. nothing wrong in passing such legislation. No provision of the Constitution also is violated. The Jammu & Kashmir Act was I came across a very learned exposition. challenged in the High Court of that State 'Politics of Power' wruten by our Secretary- and it has been thoroughly scrutinised and Genera I, Dr. Subhash C. Kashyap; from that held that such a legislation does oot hit I will read out only four or five lines which provisions of Article 19 (1) a and 19 (1) (c) or give I complete picture of this defectioD; Article 14 of the Constitution. Therefore, he says: there should be no difficulty as far as the constitutional provisions are concerned. "Since the Fourth General Elections in 1971, from among 4 000 and odd Now , there have been severa) clauses in Members of Lok Sabha and Legislative this Bill and I am happy that the Law Assemblies of States and Union Territo- Minister has also annouDced that two of the ries. thefe have been some 1,969 cases clauses are to be amended. As far as clause of defection, Thus, by the end of 2 sub-clause (l) paragraph (c) is concerned. March, 1971, approximately 50 percent that has to be deleted and paragraph (b) has of legislators changed their affiliation. to be amended suitably It was very much Several legislators did so more than necessary to delete paragraph (c) because if a oncc. 10- the case of Slate Assemblie!l, Member has to be expelled from a political as much as 52. S per cent of the total party in accordance with the procedure for membership has been involved or, in anything done out5ide the House, it would other words, more than balf of the have created several practical problems and State legislators cbaDlcd their politica' it would have given a handle especiaJJy to .liliation at least once," the bosses of smaller parties; whore this 63 ConJlitMtion JANUARY 30, 1985 (52nd Amdt.) Bill 64 paragraph would have created some difficul- Lastly. this Bill gives the authority or ties. Therefore, the main principle of this the power, to decide to the Speaker, or the disqualification is that for someth ing which a Presiding Officer. But you will see that this Member does in this House, in the presence power is also sufficiently circumscribed because of this House, in the presence of the as provided in Clause 8, rules have to be Presiding Officer such as voting against the framed, and not only they have to be framed, Party or abstaining from voting against the but they have to be Placed before the House direction of the Party. Now this is someth- and the House has to approve those rules ing which is proved beyond doubt. No regarding the procedure for expulsion etc. other enquiry is necessary by any other Therefore, the criticism tbat the Speaker will committee or anybodyelse. So it is very bave very large powers and that some other clear that any act done by a member in the authority should be appointed for this, has presence of a Presiding Officer, namely. no substance because ultimately this power is voting or abstaining from voting would left to the House to frame Ihe rules and entail him to this disqualification. So there those rules will have to be followed. If it is no chance of any injustice being done nor is left to judges and courts, even if it is left to ia there any scope for any doubt whether he the Chief Election Commissioner, it will take bas committed that act or not. Therefore, a long time as is our experience and the very from that point of view, acts done outside purpose of tbis measure will be lost. From thd House have been deleted or are proposed this point of view, it is appropriate that to be deleted now because there would have this power is given to the Speaker and the been the question of proving them. Some rules to be made are placed and approved by doubt may arise and there will be questions the House. of giving a hearing to that Member also and rules of natural justice would have also to be followed. With these words, I SUPPC;l !h;, h;;: whole-heartedly, and congratulc.e .>< Ll>w Minister for this amending Bill. ~Olrtber. Secondly, according to me, any act of a for the fact that the Bill will be passed in Member which brings down the Government this session and today itself, I specially has to be punished because he has already congratulate the Leader of the House. 10 11 given a commitment his voters that he would stand by that party, he would stand I1 THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE by their manifesto and discipline of that MINISTRY OF PARLIAMENTARY party. Therefore, voting against the party or AFFAIRS (SHRI GHULAM NABI AZAD) : abstaining from voting has not been allowed. Mr. Deputy-Speaker, Sir, since there are a These things may bring the party in power large number of Members, who want to ... to trouble, and from that point of view, the speak on this Bill, I propose that we skip limited. scope, that is kept and it is very over the lunch hour today and continue essential. to sit throughout. If Clause 2 (I) (c) was also to be retained, that would have created several MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: Is it the other practical difficulties and it would have pleasure of the House that we sit continuo- led to injustice sometimes to the Member usly without lunch hour. also. SEVERAL HON. MEMBERS: Yes, yes. Then, mergers and splits have also been taken care of. In the case of split, one- third Members have to declare that there MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: We will is a split, and in the case of merger, two- sit without breaking for lunch. Further, I third Members are required to merge. For would request to the hon. Members to be the first time, independents as also nominated brief, so that there is sufficient time to cover Members have been covered and no loopho- all the Members, who want 10 participate on les have been left. All loopholes are sought this Bill. I hope, each Member will take five to be plugged in this Bill. to eight minutes. '( 65 COlIJtituliolt MAGH.\ 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52nd Amdt.) Bill 66 SURf A.K. SEN: Will you kindly indi- example was about the Hindu Code Bill. cate the approximate time when the voting We were sitting in the Executive Committee. will take place. Panditji wanteo that the share in the father's property should be equal for both daughttr and son. )f there are two sons and MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: That one daughter, the property should be shared depends on the Members It will be at equally among the three, i. e. one-third each. 4.00 P.M. tentatively. But then there were men like Late Katju and o N. Tiwari, who thought otherwise. There SHR( K.P. UNNIKRISHNAN (Bada- were only two members, myself and one lara): Do not announce the time. Let it more who agreed with Pandi!j,'s views. But be fixed after six O'clock. There are so the majority were of the view that only one- many Members who want to speak. ninth should be given to ,the daughter. Panditji thought that it was nonsense and MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I have wanted as to go to a party meeting. He announced four 0 clock tentatively. appealed to the pany against the Executive Committee. We went to the Party mecling. In the Party meeting also, there were agam SHRI BHAGWAT JHA AZ-\D members who believed in the old though t (BhagalpUl) : Mr. Deputy Speaker. Slf, I and tradition. Daughter and soo were quite whol~-hearredly welcome this Bill. I have different for them. So there also, we were seen in this House since ]952 upto now overruled Panditjl said that though it was how barring one and a half years, defections nonsense, he \\ould agree to the majority hud go- in this country in Legislatures been opinion and then came .the Hindu Code ing on and how a new word has been added Bill. to the Indian Dictionary, namely, Aaya ~am and Gaya Ram. Thanks to those members who have brought at least a new word, That PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE is the only contribution of theirs in the good (Rajapur) : Ddughter IS let down even there! politics of this country. SHRl BHAG\\/AT JHA AZ-\D: I Sir, we have tried, from the beginning know several orh;![ examples like this. Once when this disease came, to have suitabl~ it was 12.30 almost lunch time. A particular mea'-ures. but we could not succeed. Even firm \\'anted the loan to be coverte" into the Janata Party during their regime had a shares. BiU came from the Finance Minister committee under the Prime Minister. We had I sent 15 members requisitions to tbe Party during our time also many times appointed leader. to call a party meeting. It was said committees. One committee was under Shri that the Bill had already come. We said Darbara SlDgh, whIch went on for hours and that we had strong vle\o\s. Pandit Nehru hours and hours, but the difficulty was that called a meeting at one 0 'clock, i. e. in we could not agree about this because IUDch time. in Room No. 63 and we came to there was no set precedents to decide about the House with a deci~lon that the Bill be the way to do such a thing. Therefore, Sir, I amended and the clause was amended and congralulate the hon. Prime Minister for thr. loans were converted into shares. I can immediately bringing this measure as the first quote from my memory, instance after ins- measure during his tenure in his Session. Sir, tance where Nehru Ji, inspite of his views, I support this Bill, but I have my apprehens- agreed with the majority rarty opinioo I ions from the beginning, about Clause 2 (c) must say that to-day this Bill w~s discussed I have stood up only to speak and counsel it was discussed earlier also in the party. Jt the Prime Minister to accept that thi~ Clause was discussed with the Opposition. The 2 (c) be dropped. young Prime Minister di~cussed it with the members of the opposition also. He discussed it with us, he asked for our opinion. We , "" ... Sir, I remember instances galore of Late spoke out our opinion. and the young Prime Paodit Jawahar Lal Nehru. In spite of his Minister immediately stood up and in one own strong views, he was amenable to the hour he said that he found that the m!jority Members' and Party's opjnions. One such of persons in the party bad asked for this 67 CtIIIItlllltftl1l JANUAR Y 30, 1985 (S2nd I4mdl.) Bill " cla_ to be dropped. And 10. be laid, this our role a,ain as we have done on this da_ was beiDa dropped. I say that thit is happyoccasioc. My leader and my Minister iD the Nehru traditioD. I told him. 10. and have aareed to our reqUelt to drop it. So, ~tll1atecl blm. nus it Nehru's democ:racy what I wish to .ay is this: I know that ....iaa. I hope that iD future allo, be will amoDg tbe opposition, one par1y called itt caItiDae witb hi, tradition. memben and asked: 'Why do you waal thit amendment? yO\! ba\e come on our ticket. Therefore, do this'. They are on this TIaia Bill on defection will be enough afound. As alainst tbis. look at the demo- to make Members desist from defecting. i. e. cratic method. of the Conpen Party. ttac.e who come on a party ticket. If they cbOOII otbcrwiIc, they mUI' resip. If tbey defy the party whip, tbey mull naiaD. The Wil h these words, 1 IUpport Ihis Bill .at must be vacated. wholeheartedly. It will be a ,feat thiDg 10- inl iDIO the Statute Book of tbis country. Ihia is the first measure of the YOUDa Prime But I want to say one thins: I could Minister. I hope the rules tbat will be fra- Dot mate this point in the party meeting. I med under clause 8 givinS Powers to tbe WlDI Shri Aaoke Sen kindly to consider Speaker, i.e. to the Speaker and Cbairmen, thiI. He kDOWS that I am an old parliamen- will be exercised properly. With these words, tarian iD this House. There have been occa- I wholehartedly support this Bill and congra- sioua, once or twice when Members had tulate the Prime Minister for droppins Clause bcca aiven the right of conacience votinl. 2 (c), which was the mOlt pernicious clauBe. There was Mr. GcmDd Du littmg in tbat beach, aad abo Shri Purusbottam Da. TandoD. There were otbers also wbo told PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE Jawabarlal Nehru that tbey bad a conscien- (Rajapur): At eleven O' clock tail morning tOUS objection to a r a lieular Bill and so we all stood in silence to offer our tribute they should be permitted to act accordingly. to one of 1he greatest martyrs of our J only say tbat if a Member strongly f"ls country. i.e. the Father of our Nation. But and wants tbat he should b! allowed to that was only a ceremonial tribute, but the yote apiDit a Bill.. he may be permitltd -of real tribute will come when the Anti-Defe- course, unless the party permits it. nobody ction Bill will be passed in this House, and will be allowed to do it. But Jet this also be an era of clean politics will begin. Therefore, • tradition that if on any measu~e a Member I wholebartedly welcome thiS move, for strongly feels so, and begs the party leader bringing this MOlion for Consideration of to allow him to vote against tbe measure and ,his important Anti-Derection Bill. the whip, on lhe around of conscience, that might be considered by Mr. SeD. That ",HI I may just remind this House that in be an occasional thing. It wi)) not be the the last Lok Sabha I bad initiated two rule it will be an exception. Exception will debates, discussions under 193, demanding always lend charm to the rule. Therefore, I immediate introduction and passing of an ..y: let this also be considered. Let this Anti-Defection Bill. J would like to remind tradition also grow. tbis House that in 1980, in the very first week of the sessioD. I had tabled and intro- AI I said, I was not interested in small duced and also moved for consideration partia. I belong to the congress from 1952, an Anti-Defection Bill. I remember very in this House. I lay that democracy has well. I think, I would like to remined the been nurtured, it has been defended by my preHDt Law Minister that the then Union party. I do not lay that olbers have not dere- Law Minister, while intrrveoiog in the debate, nded it. But wbat I say is tbat as a Member bad said that Pro'. Madbu Daadavate', in 1952 I wu in opposition witbin the Anti-Defection Bill "at commendabJe, but ConlfCll party. When Conarets had a hup the time wu not ,et ripe for the majority, •• had played our role. The present adoption of thlt Bill. Probably, it wal felt- ~ Viu-Prlllident, Yr. Venkataraman and the' then that tbe historic role of defectioD was late Mr. Ie.P. Tripatbi were in this HoulC. not yet over. ud have played that role. We shan play 69 Constitution MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52l1li ..Inuit.) B.n 70 Fortunately, we find a balance in tbe country with cooperation between the opposi- House today, because, as my friend, Me. tion and the treasury bencbet; there caa be Azad said that sometimes even small is no better tribute to the memory of Mahatma beautiful and, therefore, I do not see the Gandhi tban this ; in order that the tnbute imbalance in the House. unnecessary should be meaningful aDd cempJete. certain imbalaDce in the views ; and I am happy to aspects of the BiU mUlt be properl)' taken find out that we are able to strike a consensus note of. on the Anti ..Defection Bill. I would like to point out here that as far as this BiIJ is concerned. there is a certain background. I would like to point out that aa effort bad beguo in this House on 8th December. The defection polluted the political climate 1967. The old parliamentarians will recall. for a very long time aDd it also threatened Shri P. Venkatasubbaiah bad IDOftd the very basic structure of parliamentary resolution in this House recommeDdiDa tbe democracy. I would like to iDdicate bere, formation of tbe Committee of Defection what happened between 1967 and 1968. Some headed by Shri Yesbwantrao Cbavan. That of the old veteran parliamentarians are here Committee was constituted in cooperation in the House and they may recall tbat the with the representatives of political parties period. J 967 to 1968 was the period of and also cODstitutional experts. What was the precursor to political defection in the weight and strength of tbat Committee ? country; and duriDg tbose 10 months, 1967-1968, you Will be shocked and surprised to know tbat there wele 438 political That Committee had as members defections. What was the motivatioD of that eminent men like the late Jayaprakub defection that brings us to the base of this NarayaD, Shri H.N. Kunzru, Shri Dupbtary. Anti Defection Bill? Out of 438 political and eminent leaders of political parties. At defection that took place between 1967 and that time the first effort was made to for- 1968, what was the fate of those 438 defec- mulate the very definition of political tors ~ You will be surprised and shocked to d\.fectioDs. I am glad that thread which was know that out of 438 defectors who defected jnitiated by Lok Nayak Jayaprakash as early from one party to another, 210 defectors be- as in 1967, bas again been picked up. came members of tbe Council of Ministers in Therefore, I would again feel that it will be various States. That indicates what was the the best tribute not only to Mahatma Gandhi but also to the late Lok Nayak layaprakasb motivation of political defection. We have 9 found in Andhra, in KasbftJir, iD Kamatakat with whom you migbt have political in Haryana and in Sikkim. wholesale defec- dlffereDces, but none in this House had ever tion. differed that be was tbe spokemen of clear politics and social welfare in tbis countrY. Therefore I am glad that his definition tho entire House is act:epting today. On that As far as defection and use of money occasioD the Committee was assisted by Lok pnwer is cODcerned. there is a retail Nayak Jayapraicasb in formulating a fine trade and wholesale trade. Retail trade in defiDitioD of what is catled defection. What politics does not result into any disstabilisa did Jayaprakashji say about defection? tion of the government, but the wholesale trade based on large scale defection in a legislature, that leads to the very change of "AD elected member of a legislature the basic structure and the composition of who had been allotted the reserved the legislature and therefore the source of symbol of any political party can be the Ministry as well. Now, such defections said to have defected. if after beinl are taking place. I am VCiY happy, forgetting elected as a member of either House all the political loyalty. members of parlia. of Parliament or of Legislative Assembly ment, from both sides of the House, sat or Legislative Council of a State he , together aDd thrashed out the issue-not all voluntarily renounces allegiance to, or the issues- and tried to evolve a conscnsus; association with such political party. and 1 am glad that OD the day of the death provided his action is Dot in conse- anniversary of Mahatma Gandhi" we are quence of a decision of the pan, loiDI to beain aD era of clean politics in tbe concerned." n CtRIItltutio" JANUARY 30, 198' ($2nd A.mil) Bill 72 Of coune some alternatioDs bave been of the working of out parlillbelttary made to tighten tbe Anti-Defection Bill. But democracy we should be prepared to make basically this particular connotation and those alteratioD! in times to come, I hope definition put forward by Jayaprakashji bas that will be the broad approach tbat ..ould been accepted. I am bappy about it because be adopted. tbis was tbe root of aU trouble in our political life. The BiIJ must Dot be a bandle in tbe hands or the party caucus expellini party While we finany adopt this Bill. if it members arbitraBy for their honest dissent. becomes an Act. there are certain cautions to The basis of our Constitutional Bill must be be taken. We must see to it that tbe definition the basis of British Jurisprudence. What does between dissent aDd defection is not allowed it assume 1 The Britis" Jurisprudence assumes to be blurred. I am sJad tbat my friend and that sometimes even if a single 4uilty man goes colleague, Mr. Azad, bas put forward be- scotfree does not maUer, but why a Single fore the House the historical perspective innocent man must be punished? I think, as to what happened in this august body tbat is tbe spirit in which Gandbiji's India and how dissent wa! not mbled up with has understood the problem. I am glad that defection. I would like to recall that in in that direction we are already making the times of war when Herbert Morrison had progress. That is wny I was extremely bappy. moved an adjournment motion in the House Probably the amendment may com~ forward of Commons, to express dis-satisfaction from the Treasury Benches themselves but about the weakneed war and defence policy in a meeting with the Opposition leaders 8 of Chamberlain's Government in U.K., a consensus has been evolved on that particular number of Members of his own party, Mem· clause 2(c) of the Tenth ScheduleJ of the bers of tbe ruling party. voted With the Constitution (AmendmeDt) Bill which wanted opposition on the adjournment motion and to extend the jurisdiction of defection to Chamberiaio had the grace to declare that what happens outside the Legislature. For since a number of Members of his party bad instance, if some Member has been expelled voted for the adjournment motion which outside the House, that would also attract amounted to censure of Government he disqualification in Parliament or in State would resign from the Government taking Legislature. We urge upon the Prime Minister cognisance of the desire of the people and tbat this is likely to be misused and exploited parliament that the defence and war policy by the caucus in. various parties Unfortuna· must be strengthened. Then came the tely. we have to accept the fact tbat as yet Natioual Government headed by Winston we have to evolve a real democratic and Church!]}, These are some of the glorious healthy structure of political parties in the instances in the history of world parliament- country. We have number of instances •••••• ary democracy. We cannot afford to forget (Interruptions). them. Therefore. in our anxiety to see that defection are total1y eliminated and their DR. KRUPASINDHU BHOI (SambaJ- polluting influence on politics is totally dest- pur) : Physician beal thyself. royed, we should not allow the distinction between dissent and defection to be blurred .completely. In that direction considerable PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: I prO~5S has been made. Still a number of will beal if I suffer from any disease. Doctor, fields are Jeft unexplored. But I take it for I can aSlure you tbat. And if I become a granted that this is only the beginning of patient, I will come to you al a doctor. the exercise. I said in ODe of the meetiotS of tbe opposition leaders with the prime Minis- DR. KRUPASINDHU BBOI : No, Sir, ter : It is better tbat we work on tbe Bill. Some changes have beeD accepted. Let us with great humility I have said 10. You not misunderstaDd see how tbe Act works aDd on .the basis of' should me. our experience if we find that further tighte· niDI of this particular legislation is necessary PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: Sir, or certain provisions are required to be if be 8aYI 'physician beal theyaeJr I am dropped on the basis of empirical know:edae prepared to heal thyeeU. Bat if 1 become I 73 COII"lturio1t MAGHA 10, 1906 (SALt) 74 patient, I will 10 to him since he is a doctor, beiDa evolved that if, for .....nee, somebody but be should Dot act like a veterinary votes apinst or abstato. in 'Pito or the whip doctor, he should act like a human doctor. giveD by the part)' to act ia a particular manner and vote in a particular maDnert and if that action of the Member is condoned by Sir. I do not want to mention the name the party, it should not attract disquali. of a leader X or a lead!!f Y, but tbere arc ficatioD. I would welcome that particular enough instances jn lhis poJitical life of our change. The Bill must Dot be stricter in a country where mere)y for the eKpression of manner by which either its Constitutional or political dis~ent from a leader, people have legal or legislative competence cae be been expeJled and some leaders of some challeoged. I hope and trust thar once more partie! are so non-vegetarian that they are the draft can be properly gone through and Dot, satisfiod unless they ~wallow one leader if there are any loopholes that my attract the per week, Number of persons have been sent question of legislative or Constitutional out of that party. r do Dot want such competence. that particular aspect should be members to suffer. They happen to be the gone through. Members of parliament and of State Legislature. Therefore,. I am extremely glad that a consensus has been evolved that this 13.00 hrs. Clause 2( c) whIch refers to action to be taken as a result of !iome action of Members outsic'e and for \\ hJCh lhey have been With these ieservations, I completely suppon the BIll, oot my expelled from the rarty, IS going to be These are reser· dropped Formal amendment I hope will vations, but these are the improvements come and I welcome that. \\-hich we suggest, so that the Bill can be further strengthened, I did not move aoy amendment deliberately because, with the Then, Sir, I would like that Speaker experience of mme of the las~ 13 years, I should not be involved in controverSIes at have come to the conclusion that the all. Already Some changes are likely to be defi!lltlon of an amendment m Parliament is made For lostance, If you refer to clause an amendment which is always lost. That is 6(2J, it says whatever the Speaker does in the definition that I have got Therefore, I connection with the uctlODS to be taken. prefer to persuade my colleagues on the that will be deemed as the proceediogs of the Treasury Benches. in some confabulations House. If they are deemed to be the procee- outside thiS House so that through the dings of the House in which the Members of process of persuasion. we CQuid try to mo\-e the House will not be able to say anything our amendments through them. so that there on the Floof, in that case we are unnecess- IS a greater chance of tbe amendment being arily involvIDg the Speaker in a lot of accepted. I think my strategy has succeeded. controversies and Speaker should be kept If I were to move :hese vely amendments, -above that. Therefore, some Members have then you \vould have said "Madhu put forward an amendment that instead of Dandavate fought gloilously and died gloriously", Beyond that, nothing would the Speaker being 1D that position, some sort of a committee of the House can be have happened. I am happy, through formed or a joint committee can be formed this type of confabulations. we have been which win go into the problem. Of course. able to bring the Treasury Benches aod the this is one aspect which has beeu explored. opposition to some sort of common ground. Still, some grounds are left unexplored. But, since we must also have some work in Regarding the violation of the whiPI it Parliament in the future, we will continue to was suggested that every violation of the make suggestions on both grounds. Some of whip should r,ot result in disqualification of the consequential changes in other Bills will ~the Member concerned, ooly that viola lion have to be made. The draft rules wiil have of the whip which results in an action against to be framed. The Union Law Minister was the Memb~r by the party. should result in just telling us that, consequent on this Bill, action of disqualification. Even there also certalD rules will have to be framed for I am gJad that some sort or a consensus is implementation. They will be framed, Wbco 75 Constitutiolf JANUARY 30. 1985 (52nd Amdt.) Bill 76 those rules are beingjramed, I hope similar our political life. The Prime mlnlllCf aDDouncecl CODsultation wHl be available, so that we that he would ensure a neat and clean public wiJI be able to ensure proper implementa- life and he has made a beginninl to achieve tion. this end in the first Session of the Ei,hlh Lot Sabha for which he deserves congratulatioDl. I do not want to say anything more. Once apin, I would say, on the Death Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. democratic Anniversary of Mahatma Gandhi, we are system functions on tbe basil of political 01feriDa a IV I tribute "'., GIIaD politics to parties and a member has no place in it as Gandbiji, and I tbiDk Q Fiori soul will ao individual. When a Member is unable to rest in peace thal .bere is a House which, adjust himself within tbe PartY. he bu DO aIaaoI& b.r. unanimity, is accepting the Anti- rilht to continue to be the Member of that De~ Bill, and the chapter of dirtiness Party. Elections are not won on individual in politics will come to an end for PWCI'. basis. There are a very few cases where independent candidates win the election. Most of the successful candidates belonl to [Tranllation I parties. It is the party and not the individual who wins. If we glance at the results or SUR) ZAINUL BASHER (Ohazipur): this election. we will see tbat top national Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, we welcome the leaders have lost to penons who had DO step taken by OUr Prime Minister to ensure a .tandinl· neat and clean public Hfe. The evil of derection had polluted the entire political The President of Janata Party, Sbri atmosphere ever since tbe inception of Chandra Shekbar, lost eJection in Balli •• democratic system in our country. A lot of Sbri Atal Dihari Vajpayee, who is a national discussion took place to eradicate this evil, leader and President of his party, was also but no way-out was found. Several Commi- defeated. Bahugunaji wa~ also defeated. The ttees were set up. After 19n, Janata Party stature of the candidate belonging to ODr part~ Government bad announced the enactment wa, very low in comparison with his stature. of lqislalion to curb defections. Some aClion In this way it was the victory not of our can- was laken but jD vain. All the political didates but of our ideology and the Election parties, whether it is tbe ruling party or the symbol of our Party (lnte"upt;ons) ... I was Opposition parties, are responsible for saying that yoor top leaden were defeated defectionl. No sincere efforts were made by us. If after wioning the election with either to curb defections or not to take the support of tbe party, we defect from that advantage of def«Jions. Every party-ruling party, it is a areat fraud. That way we do well as opposition parties-tried to take as not deceive ourselves or the government or advantaae of this evil of derection. I have the party but we deceive those people who seen tbat when the leaders and Chief eJect us. We stab in the back those Ministers, againtt whom the Opposition had people, who have voted for a particular'" levelled charaes of corruption and organised member keeping in view the ideology, election agitations for their removal, were expelled manifesto and the symbol of his party. If from the Congress, the) were absolved of aJl he defects from his party and joins the other, these charges by the leaders of same he stabs his voters in tbe back OpPOSition Parties and -Nere included in their He deceives those voters. In such circums- respective partiel. have seen in this very I tances, this Bill was very necessary. Hence, House certain Member. or the Opposition, it has beeo broulht forward. Ihiltinl their loyalties to as many as five partie. in a period of S years. I have seeD wholesaler defection allo when a Chief Mini.ter aloD,- We salute our Prime Minister tbat he with his entire political party left ODC party has adopted a democratic way to brill. and joined the other aDd continued to be the forward this DiU. He discussed tbis BilJ;. Chief Minister and the leadet· or his party. with tbe Opposition leaders. There wall rhis evil hu been with aU of 01. Now, the credit deadlock in the discussion with the political ton to our youn, Prime Minister who has parties about the retention of SectioD 2e, taken ,bil ••p to eradate thi. eyjJ prey,lent in Secbdule-JO. Ultimately, the Prime MiDiltv 17 COtUIIIIlI/OII MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52nd Amdl.) BII/ 78 called a meetiD8 of the Congress Parliamen· be removed after introduction of an tbae ta,., P.rty and souaht the opinion of the reforms. Members in this retard. In/the meeting the consensus wu for the deletion of this clause With these words. I IUpport this and our Prime Minister, being a great Bill. democrat, announccd tbat it would be dropped. For it. he deserves praise. [ English} Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, we feel that SHRI AMAL DATTA (Diamond with this Bill a beginning has been made to Harbour) : Sir, this Bill is welcome a first ensure a neat and clean public l.fe and it will u step towards cleaning up political life in this have far-reach ina results. People like me country Defections have been there, inside would have been happy, had luch conven· and outside the House. They have made tions been established earlier. Had there threats to Governments of being brouaht been a convention that if a Member defected down and Government have, in fact, been from his Party, he would have to resign his brought doWn. We have been discussing seat in Parliament or the State Legislative about passing an anti-Defection Bill for a Assembly also, there would have been no very long time. I understand that in 1967 t need to bring forward such a measure. it was first mooted. Discussion was first mooted in this Parliament and thereafter But in the entire polil ical history several attempts have been made to introduce of our democratic country, there are Bills; Bills have been referred to Select very few instances where a Member Committee and the)' have not come back; after resigning from his party, also rt.signed Bill have been introduced but not pressed. his seat in Legislative Assembly simultaneou- But now at last, it seems we are going to .. sly. In most of the cases, the Memb.!r hav.! a ConstlL.1tional amendment to stop resigned from his party but continued to be defections inside the House and that is, at a Member of the Legislative Assembly. least defections in a manner which will to Hence, there was no alternative but to bring some extent remedy the ills from which we forward this Bin. are suffering, I am using the words "to iome extent" because, it possibly does not go and possibly cannot in the present situa- Mr. Madhu Dandavate has given some tion go rar enough. It is because, if people 100d suggestions in his speech. Afler the vote a~ainst the Party whip and if they Bill is passed today, a great deal will depend happen to be ; /3rd of that party't legislature on the Members about the conventions that strength or above and If they happen to split are established hereafter. If we sincerely also outside the House, then irrespective of establish a good convention. I feel, there Will the fact wht:ther there is a national split or a no need to introduce many legal reforms. be State split, the splitters will remain there and .We have not established such a convention they Will not be disqualified. It they disobey so far that after resigning from the party, the the whip. go aga.nst the political party on Members must resign his seat from· the whose sponsorship they have got elected, Lelislature also. Hence, it was felt ne~e"sclfy they will be disqualified, if they are small in to enact this law. There is no such prOVision number. But lhey will be able to do so in any democratic country of the world where with impunity if they arc large in number. Parliamentary form of goverament exists. Now, of course, there is a saving clause here We have established a new convention for that the split of 1i 3rd shall also arise the first time by enacting this law and we are because of a split outside the House. loinl to make a beginning to ensure a neat and clean public life. I hope, our democra- tic set·up will further prosper in future. A~ If one-third of the members of a party _per tbe assurance given by the Pdme Mmister, in the HOllse decide for motjve" otber thaD reft'ortl would be made to introduce electoral ideological motives. namely which are for reforms in the next five years and laws would material lains and thry want to split, tbey can ·bt amended suitably. Whatever shorf';omings still do it provided they can engineer the are there in our democratic St' 'IP, 1 'Je will split of the party outside also. I do Dot find 79 JANUARY 30, 1985 (Slnd Amdt.) Bill 80 rault with the Government ror not being able constitution, the Governor'. powers have not to do aaythia. further. But this is really a been defined. They have been liven aD refloctioD OD tho political life of the country. undefined powe", that is to say. tbe Ministry Tbe way it haa ·deveIoped durin. the last 37 is to funclIon through tbe wi) I or tho yean, it hiS DOW become oecessary to bring Governor. Therefore the Governor can Itill rorward sucb a Bill and even tben we cannot bring down a Ministry for whatever reasons realI, to fir enoulh to promo te poll tical and put someb()dy In office: whether or not be morality Or prevent political immorality in has got the maj.uilY in the House. As 10D, the country. inaide or lutside tbe legislature. as that power remiins witb the O.)vernor, it 1bit is • very sad reflection on the democratic will not be very difficult for t he Governor prOOlll iD abe country. to en.ineer a defection eveD after the pasliD. of this Coost itution Amendment. In 37 yean. we should have been abJe to build up lOme healthy democratic conven- J In this case, the Governor will .have tions. 10 countries which follow parliamen- only to see tha t at Jeast one-third of the tary wbere tbe rules and procedures system, people are there who defect from a party. arc not codified, the way a member is suppo- one-third of the people can stil) defect aDd sed to behave is often aD uDwritten conven- with the help of lhe Governor who is conni- tion aod these unwriUeD conventions are ving with them, they caD stiJJ bring down a quite ofleD more important than the written Ministry, This sort of a siluation can be oncs. In Enlland, (rom where we have taken removed only by further amendment to the the model of parliamentary democracy, they Constitution by which the Governor's powers do not have eveD a written Constitution. And wiU be specified, hh powers wiIJ be curtaiJed yet they are abJe to carry through Without a and he will not be in a position to choose written constitution. Dependmg on unwntten conventions. they are able to carry through. this man or that 'man as Chief Minister. There is no fall of the Governmen, by The trial of strength between tbe political defections or because the people are shIfting parties, after shifting of allegiance. should take their aUegiance for material gains. It does place only on the floor of the House. It is DOt happen there. only in that situation that tbe ills which have been created by defections can be fully cured. other~ise. it cannot be done. It will only In fact, we are today plagued wilh mean Ihat instead of)O or 12 persons or this situation and the Goveromeot is in a instr:ad of ) 15th or ) 14th of members, the hurry to pass this Bilt. Perhaps, it is a good shifting of allegiance bas to be by 1/3rd of thins. But the Government is in a hUfry members. for iLs own sake because they will be able to present a dean image to the people befOle the Assembly elections which are gOIOI to be TheD. of course, it says that the split held in March. That explains to some extent has to be outside. That can also be of tbe hurry. But the maio thiDI is that engineered : there is not much difficultyl"i Government, the present ruling party, had in Ideological reasons can always be aiven. " fact itself incurred a good deal of odium by its activities during the year 1984 for bringing The other point or idea is to clean U) down the State Government in Jammu and the political life of this country. Very woU. Kashmir and in Andhra Pradesh and that they WIDt to cleaDse themse1ves, purge In tbe political life of this COUDtry, ODe or the ills is defection. But is it olly themselves, of that odium by briDling for- tbo politicaJ ill? I have mentioned duriol the ward this Bill. It may serve the purpose to debate on the Motion of Thanks OD lOme extent but not fully. President's Address that, in this Parliament, we have 80 per ceot of the Memben elected The ill. of defection which arise out of by SO per cent of tbe electorate. A popular these defections are not entirely baptISe .overnment requires that the compositiOD oft lOme . people sbifted tbeir allegiance for' the House should properly rellett tbe wiJI 01 materia] laiDS but it was larae)y b~~~: the the electorate and tbat the GovcrnnlCDt mould OowtDOr·. aCftd arbitrarily. In Our be respoDsive to the nced~ or tbe people. 8t CD1IItitlllioli MAOHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52rrd Amdt.) Bill 12 TheM two criteria which are buic to any and Dot at a fiDal ste,. Some of tbe boa. democralJc .ovemmeDt caD be fulfiJJed aiyeo MembeR from abe other ,i. bave weJcomr:d the coodltioal prevaillnl iD our country with tb. al i, it will clean up tbe poIiUcal life of ilS wide divcrlity, cuUuraf, economic. etbnic aU the i111. I lay that it will not, but I WeI- and all kinds of tbiD.. only by havinl a ~ome it because tbil is a .ood beaiooiDl. But different electoral proceSi 'rom what we have It must be followed up by other Itepa today we have the limple majority SY$lem sub!tequently. which it prevailinl in Bnlland and other Commonwealth countries which bave follo- wed .he Enlli.b .y.lem, where tbere ;s a SURI VIJAY N. PATIL (EraadoJ): homoleoeity within the population and where Sir, I welcome the Bill wholeheartedly •• bas divenity is not 10 much as we have. Haviol been done by my friend sinin. in the Opposi- reaard 10 the diy~nilY we have, our Party tion .. Prof. Madhu Daodavate. Tbi. is • new has always been recommendinl tbat there step taken by our YOUDI Prime Minister, should be proportional representation. There aad I feel myte'f fortunate to be ia this are various models in front of UI from House when the BIJI is beiDI passed boca.. whicb we can take the inlredients and put 1 bave ~en that in 1978-79 only tome half- tOlether and have a new system with propor- hearted measures were adopJed to try to tional representation which will suit out pass this ant.·defection legislalion. country's diverse nuds. Ir tbat is done tben the other ills which are today pJaluing the polilicallire of this country, the money In a democracy we have become mature power, the muscle power, aJl these will no as far as the voters are concerned. but tbe Jonger be there, all these wiJI no Jonger be political parties will require lome maturity. of any consequeoce after this So, I suggest OtberwJlsc, tbis BiIJ was not necessary. In • that this may be only the first step_ It is a democracy, since the programma of tbe welcome step, but welcome only as a fint parties are published. disciplinary action is step towards some further innovative mea- taken against candi4atet goinl against the sures for cleaning up .ahe political life of party. 1 have seen disciplinary action taken thil COUDtry. One is ccrtailinl and specify- apiost candidates and party members are ina the powers of Governor so as to prevcDt expelled for 6 yean but the very same per:- him from choosio. any person who happens soos are taken back into the party within lix to claim to have the majorlty-whict} was months That is why as my friend, Mr Datta wbat happeDed in Andhra Pradesh IDd there has ~aid jUlt now, tbis will not be a complete measure to stop defection or brinl which ~bouDdcd bact and the political party, the rutinl Party today, had to suffer cleanliness in the body politic. There are an odIum because of that; perhaps that is a certain more thin.. which are required to reason for bringin. this particular Amend- be done. ment to the Constitution. But this is Dot loing to bo cured unlels the further amend- Since Independence we have seen the mentl suaacsted by me are brought and unless birth of so parties and their tbe electoral proceu itself is changed. The many also disappearancc. There are more of Parties GeDeral Elcctionl which we have lone than tbe States and surprisingly eno.. throu.b have SbOWD. aDd for .the first time barriol poJitical parties, of made it very clear. unprecedentedly clear~ as a (ew the Jeaden tbe otber parties old CODlrenmen. to what is the wei,bt of money power, what were is the Itrenlth of money power, what is tbe .trenlth of muscle power and what is the In this Bill it ia mentioDed tbat it is Dot atreo.tb of the media which, apin aTe cont- considered u defection but it will be conli· roJled by money power. These ill. have to deted as a split if more than one-third mem • ..., takon out of tbe politic:al life if we are to bers decide to cross over to the other side. have a proper democracy. But what about Patties which are in a very small Dumber in the House? What about Therefore, while welcomina the BiU - I Parties wbich are in a microscopic: minority am Dot lOins into the differeDt ClaUlei DOW either in the Lok Sabha or in the Assembly? ... t., tlist it is welcome 0D1y as a Int step If there ar: only two memben or lay , if 83 COllatitlllion JANUARY 30, 1985 (52nd Arndt.) Bill 84 there are 4 IDftmben in a party and 2 defect SHRI VIJAY N. PATJL : Whea Sbri or one defects, bow do you calculate tbe one Daodavate was sittinl 00 this side of tbe -tbird , I fc*ll there also the Itl'CDltb s~ould House. aDd I aDd Shri UODikrisbnaD were f be '" if the party reprcaents S% or more litting OD that lide, wo know bow a MiDisler of the House ••• spcakina in support of tbe Government at 1 O·clock resiaDed tbe samo day at 8.00 p.lD. Sucb thinls happened when sucb a measure SURI AM&4.L DATTA: That will Dot wu not there. topple tbe lo.crnment. What does it matter? In view of tbis. this is a welcome measure. It would have been still better if SHRI VIJAY N PATIL: It il not a one thin, more would have bocn added. question of topplins, it il a question of Defections take place mainly OD two discipliniol the parties. In a democracy if occasions; one at tbe time of cbanlC of there are only 4 or 5 major parties, tbe Government, under money power, of if tbe person is after becoming a MlDiscer or Jike voters can bave a good choice. But, unfor- that, and secondJy, defections take place at tUDatel,. the Parties are splitting whether they the time of elections. One or two months are in power or are not in power. It is before ejections, people see which way the understandable if the party splits if it is in wind is blowiol and wbich party is goiD, power, but tbey are splitting in the Opposi- to get majority, aod seeing that wind. one tion Mlso. month before tbe elections they even re5ian and join tbe other party. III view or this, PROF. MADHU DANDAVA1E : The if we want to curb defections in such cases division is between quality and quantity. also aad maintain the party Itrenlth. tbe idcolo,ical stren&th oC each party, ODe additional provision should be made that SHRI VUAY N. PATIL: Even tbeo luch a persoo, wlft> defects at thi' ItaIC they split. Wo have seen the history of 1980- would be debarred from atandin, jn tbe 1984 in the Janata party. Sitting in the election on that party's ticket (or one year. Oppoaition there wu a Iplit several times. Only in tbat Cilse, there would be SOlDO Tbat is wh, I am mentioniDa this point. deterrent Cor this kind of defections. Witb these few luuestions, I laain M, friends on this lide bave mentioned welcome this measure aDd whole-bearted11 that a person comins to Parliament as an IUpport. it. elected reprcteDtative has to have a party- bale. Seldom independent members ,et elected. That is very true of the Parliament SHRI GIRIDHAR GOMANOO u also of the Assembly. Hence, to defy the (Korap'ut) : Mr. Deputy-Speaker, Sir, J rile voten and crOSI over to tbe other lide is a to support this constitutional amendinl Bill. treachery and it mUlt be punisbed by Definitely, this Bin is a blow to the politi- diaqualilcatioo from tbe Membership of tb. cians, who have been crossina or changiDI HoUle. This is a welcome meuUfC. But. at the floors, have been relortina to carpet tbe same time, let me tell you that defections crossinl. political turD-coatism, the politiCi of musical chair, the politica of opportunism take place mainly at two times. Of course, and tbe politics of defection. Tbere are what as Daodavatdi laid. tbere are derectioa. Cour aroups in politics, namely tbe spectator and wboleaale defections. I would I ike to aroup. tbo factor ,roup, the defector aroup add-there are defectors, master defector. and and that aroup which is more dana.rous tbaa defectioo-lDUtera. Wholelale defection took others baa liven SOlDO coacealion lor Iplitten. place in tbe hiJtory of Parliament alao which This Bill will definitely chock all those kinds wu witocaed by Dandavatoji .... of political aroups. !Bal K.. p. UNNIKRlSHNAN : ADd In our democratic eet-up. after thil Bill alto mail defection. is paned, the politica of iDltability will 10. IS Constitution MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52nd .4nu1I.) Bill 86 the politics of survival, specially the politics what will be tbe future of the democracy as of confusion, the POlttlCS of deviation and the well as the legislature or the party. politics of transition will also stop. In a democratic set-up, we have free and frank There are a number of suggestions ha~e discussions, we debate,,; We have to put given by OUf bon. friends. I am not adding up with dissent and differences, but we any suggestions. This is the Bill to which cannot tolerate defectlonc;. we have to give not only our mind, but our heart as well. We, the younger generation This Bill is not meant for the people, the younger politicians, we who are thinking but for the legislators themselveli. Due to to go ahead in politices. we who want to some historical reasons, or vested interests, have some change in the country as well as the politicians lost purity, as well as in politics, we have to keep In mind this. "principles in politics. Therefor!!, Sir, we are When the duty. the responsibility and the legislating the law for ourselves. to make power were given by the people to a represe- ourselves disciplined politicians. Sir. there ntative whom they have elected. whether he are four things which lead a person to defect has to disharge this duty and responsIbility from one party to another. FIrst is the by focussing the problems of the people in comparison Second comes competition. To the House or through different ~hannels. He compete. th~re will b;! motivatIOn. And la~t should have b:ilance of mind, because sometimes the balance of mind may not be is ambition. What the ambition IS, the defector knows. there due to some motivation. But it is very important for the younger generation to keep in mind that we have to maintain mental Sir, in a democracy we have to fight and democratic balance, to keep the balance for the cause of the people because we have of Administration and of pol ities. Indian been elected by the people We have to democracy is not a develop'ng democracy; it work for the people and we are representing is a developed democracy. the people and hence we are of the people. But then the question comes as to witb WIth these words, I support the Bm. whom. for whom and in which way we have We have gIven a new thing to the country to fight ID a democracy. We have to fight not which is good for its future. We bow to with gun but wIth pen. not with ammuDltlooS the past. and go to the future with hope. but wilh arguments not wllh weapons, but with words Here I emphasIs the welghtage of 13.41 'word'. The words which a member utters. the commitment which he gives, he owes It SHRI K.R. NATARAJAN (Dindigul): to the people as well as to hImself On behalf of the AIADMK and on my behalf, I support the Constitution (Flfty- Now} there are polJtlclan-;. ~ome who second Amendment) Hill. I appreciate and belong to the older generation and some congratulate the young, energetic and belong to the younger generation What are dynami.; Prime MiDlster for baving br:>ught the dlffer~nces between young and old? The this will, in spIte of the fact that normaJly old have got the past, whereas the young there is no questi;::m of defection by any have got the future. The old work in the Congress Member of this august House. present with past basis, the young WOl k in There is a possibilIty of defection by a the present for future. Th! old have got member from the opposition party to the experience. We have no experience at all. ruling party, as it was usual in the earlier But we are the instruments of experiment. times. We have got the future. which is unseen Past is also unseen, but past eltperience is As I have und!rstood it. the hone relevant only if it is relevant to the present Prime Minister is a disciplined mao, as a and the Cuture. Future, wheth:r it is relevant Pilot. So, naturally he wants to have or irrelevClnt, will come only later on. So, discipline everywhere, He ~ h:>wed himself Sir, when we have to work in politics, especi- as a dIsciple of Swami Vivekananda. As our any the younger generation, we have to see great Prime Minister Nehru bad put it. what was the past, what is the present and Swami J i was a great force, and a source of '1 Cmuti'lftfoft JANUARY 30, 1985 (52nd Amdt.) Bill 88 iospiratioQ for himself and for other leaders thi~ Bill. This i~ a very important document, of the country. Swamiji was pure in word, I would term it is a r~n4issanc~ or pOlitical thought and deed. So, I hope that our morality in IndIa. It should be a matter of young Prime Minister waDts to be pure in concern for all of ut when we make a little word, thought and deed. So, naturally he introspection and have a glance over the intends to eradicate the evil of political defe- history of our country. particularly our ctions. Hence the Bill has b~en brought history prior to lodep:ndence. Prior to here. So, anybody who wants discipline in independence also, we had legislatures, and life would naturally wolcome this Bill. So, if we read bistory, we can certainly find that I welcome it. times c!me when political parties gave a mandate to tbeir persons sitting in the Legislative Assemblies to resign, they resigned Tbe late Chief Minister of Tamil Nadu, from those Assemblies; when political parties Perarignar Anna, allowed every member of gave a mandate to their persons to contest the General CouDcil of the DMK to have elections or to refrain from contesting his say either fOf, or against any resolution, or elec(ions, they received it in a disciplined view or opinion of anybody in any matter manner; they accepted tbe mandate of the under discussion. He never expeUed any parties. member of the party, even though some members indulged in anti-party activities. Even in luch circumstances, he used to It is really an irony that today, after persuade them not to indulge in such anti- having been in a free position for the last 36 party activities. My leader, Puratchi years situation is created warranting this Thalaivar M G.R. has also adopted the Bill. We are shouting from the housetops same method, and never expelled anybody about having a legacy of Mahatma Gandhi for anti-party activities, of course. some aod so many great people, who have not penons were sent out of the party, when they only laid a vcry solid foundation of demo- were found engaling themselves in destroying cracy in this country hut also shown to the tbe party itJelC. world a beacon as to which direction the democratic fUDctioninl of the country ahould 10. But from 1967. as the han. Law Minister We have got a very aenerous, sympathe- rilhtly stated, when the Congress was ousted tic aDd democratic leader. We have absolute from power in about 7 States and SVO faith aDd confidence in our leader. He will were formed, the horse trading by the Dever be vindictive or dictatorial in dealinl legislators is going on. Even tbe Members oC with members. Parliament are Dot spared. Once apin I congratulate the youthful Tbe custodians of the faitb of tbe Prime Minister who leeks to introduce people arc selling away the faith of tbe discipline in all spberes, and to put an end people in a very cheap and mean manner. It to political defectors. I have absolute faith has really broulht a disgrace to the people; aDd confidence in the bon. Prime Minister it has really brought a Itigma to our u the leader of the House and the leader or political life. But, now, I am very happy to the Conaresa (I) Party. and iD the Hon, say tbat this Bin aims at eradicating and Speaker, and in my leader, Puratch i removinl that political Iti,ma tbatia attached Thalaivar M.O.R. aDd in the leaders or to all oC us aDd, therefore, 1 welcome this other opposition parte. in ~ealing with thl memben, after enactment of this Bill. measure. So, I support the Bill whiclt leek. to It i. lood tbat some amendments have eradicate tbo eriI of political defections whie. been proposed by tbe Law Minister himself. are bbl, to 1IDdormine the.cry fouudatioal becauae of clause l(c). A penon due to hi. or cIeIDOc:rICJ. lDiJconduct outside tbe Houte or removal rrom the part" would be rendered liable to vacate Iris ..t. Sometimel it does laappee SHRill. E. GADHVI (Buukutlaa): daat altbou.h a person i. eoj07iDI • majority Mr Deputy Speaker, Sir: I rile t. upport ••pport of the party or tho MPa or tbe 89 ConMitution MAGH 1\ 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52nd Amdr.) Bill 90 legislators, as well as support of the people, I do not understand any rationale behind a coterie of a few people engineer to manage this. If some change IS not done here. then ~xpulsion of such persons. In history, we five or six Independents in a State may tift have got a glaring eumple of Shram.Hi the balance this side or that side and there Indira Gandhi. That syndlc.ate io those days WIll again be tbe menace of 'Ayarams' and Wilh no majority in Parll.menc, with no 'Glyarams·. Thl!reforc, when a man is majorilY in the party, with no confidence on elected independenlly, he has got the verdict the people. had the coura~e and audacity to of the people on hiS own account. If a expel Mrs. Indira Gandhi even from the person is elected as an independent with the party, Therefore, I say amendment is welcome tacit or active support of any polItical party, this is not a document which is of a tem- then it is Justified to say that he cannot be porary measure. We are incorporatmg thiS allowed to jom any poillical party. But once measure in the basIc document. namely, the a person wins independently. then his right Constitution of the country from where all to act independently also exists along with laws flow. Therefore, ] on<.,:e again congratu- hiS position. I thmk it would not be proper late Ihe Law Mlnist~r for propoilng the to curtail or to put feHers on the right of an amendments that he had promlsc=d us in the independent persoD. My humble submil'sio!} morning, for the con·ideration of the hon. Law Minister is that in the case of Independents As far as split is concerned, it has been we should not put any fetters of their later contemplJted ID the Bill that If one-third of jOlOmg an}, political party. th .. people want to go away from the party in the name of a SpIlt, then they small not be The objectives of this Bill are JaLJdable disqualified. I am surprised to see that If one and it WIll definitely act as a deterrent against member commits a theft, it is an offence but defecllons But the baSIC aim and idea of if a n'lmber of members together commit a the Bdl is thal with a view to create a healrhy theft, it IS not an offence. If one-third of democracy in (he country, independents, noo- the memb~r~ commit a spilt, then we can recognised political parlie~, small parochial certalDly allow, because after all. there should aDd regional parties are Qot conducive to the be room for growth or development of growth of democracy. Therefore. our aim is ideologies of a party which is in Its infancy that If we want to maintain and develop or inception. If there is a difference on that democracy, national parties of equal calibre account tben certainly tbat split could be and contest should be developed. Unfortuna- tolerated but split simpliciter for gains should tely. It is not happening. The blame can be Dot be allowed. In Congress Parity, if we put on the other side. But I am not goioa ICC it. past history, there were parties into that aspect. Since democracy is a within the party like Swaraj Party led by sine qua 110'1 for a healthy nation, there MOlilal Nehru. Some groups like aocialist should be national parties all over the aroups were created by even Pandit country of good matching strength. Until J Jawabarlal Nehru within the Congress Party. it is developed. democracy in the true sense But one thing was common there. All would not be developiag. TherefoJe. my those groups or the persons who were submission would be that witb a view to lpecially advocatinl a particular idlea) of the discOUI age the Independents with a view to party, were in the party and thek thinkinl discourage some small Teg'-nal or parochial was based on the ideological concept. groups to contest and come n tbe forefront Therefore, I would say that when we contem- of the democratic forum or nena of this plate to allow a split to be toler Ited tbat country, some measures ougbtto be adopted. Iplil sbould necessarily be on ideotolical If there are Independents, tben tacitly people coocept and not merely by one-third of the would try and the Indeperdents would people in tbe party, because tl it lin an Act become an instrument of horse-tndin, wbich will remain on tho Stahlt. Book not because they will be voting ona on this 5idc t for ftye yean or tcn years but for all ti.es tG and at aootber time on tbat aide. When como. tbore 1S a crucial moment, when there il a narro'Wer contest between the .ival parties in It is stated that independents el.:cted by tile House, theD they would be playinl tbeir the people cannot join uy politic:al party. role and horse-tradinl cannot be eli.iDated 91 Comtilurion JANUARY 30, 1985. (52nd Amdt ) Bill 92 for which we aim in this Bill: We are proud this opportunity, again, to congratulate the that this Bill which is long chetished by the Prime Minister, for having been responsive, people of this country. which is long cheri- and the Congress party for the effective shed by the elite of our coun try . the iotelli- working of its inner democracy. It was as gentsia of our countl)" the wJiters. everybody, a re:.ult of the expression by many members has been brougbt. W~ ha\e teerr ~ble to fulfil in the party meeting. that the Prime Minister their aspmllicns, their desires, ilnd the credit accepted (be desire of the majority of the goes to our Prime Mini~tt:r, Shri I.~aji\' Gandhi members of t he party. because since a long time there w;as a d~rr;and for this. There was a thinking 0 vcr thill but 14.00 hI'S. somt: bc\\ or other. it could not be materia- )i~ed. Jan~lta Party tried but the:y themselves enginetled s~bota£c with it ano that is how I would like to congratulate you also the m}th about the,r holk'r-than-thou Sir, and the Speaker, through you, that attitude \\~S exploded before the pt:ople. your task has now become much easier. You do not h3v~ the problem of making rules. of registering the parties and their consti- One more aspect I would suggest is that tutions and the rules and regulations govern- when a Merr,ber is e>.pelJed from thl! House ing their working, in order to determine becau~c he showed disobedience to the party whether the expulsioi of a member has been whip or was voting again~t, a provision has done a~cording to the rules and regulations got t('l be inserted that in futme at least for or not. That chore you hav.e been saved. six months or at least for the new term he cannot contest the eloection because suPpcsioi after four and a half years he crosse~ the Still, I wuuld like to go on record floor and joins another party, he will again that a Member of this House has been contest. So, some provi~ion of debarring eJected by tens or hundreds of thousands him has got to be put. That is my submission of voters, the electorate. 't was a danger- and it is for the hon. Mioist';;r to consider ous provision to make, whereby you could it. I think too much is 'lleeded for too have the possibility that five people sitting bad things. in a caucus, controlling the party machinery in the Stale, for one reason or another, decide to exrel a Member, and they decide SHRI G.G. SWELL (ShiIJong): Mr. to undo the demo~ratic wish of hundreds Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would just like to go of thousands of people, who have voted on record that I support this Bill and to say this paTliculJr Ml!mber. So I think it has that it has not corn.e a day too soon. beeD a vel y goed decision to drop thi., During the last twenty ~ lears, 1 have had provisi()n. tbe privilege of sitting i jn this House on three past cccasio[l~. The question was being As a result of it. I think this Bill will talked about tbe l.nenace of defections • ill become much cleaner and stT0nger and deVOid caused to the politic al ~tructure. thp. politICal of contro\'er~y. So, I would appeal to my fabric of tlii~ cou ntr). Efforts were made, friends in the oPPosition Dot to unneceSsa~ attempts were ma(je on more than one acca- rily take lh~ time of the House, let us agree sian but there wei-e r:treats after that. There- to pass It with a few minor amendments fOle, I \\ould take this opportunity of COD~ra- hel c and there if necessary. tulating our you ng Prime Minister for having grasred tht! net'de or for having seized the bull by the horns, IDd taving this Bill prepared Even so, I pose a number of questions and brought bf,!fore the Hou~e Shri Bh<1gwat to lhe La\\ Mioi~\t:r. There is a provision in Jba Azad, my' good friend, ~hen he spoke thi~ Bill for the merger of ~ party ~ith 1 think ha:- conveyed fO the House, (hat the another party. I think you have &tafed that C('ngress Pari ia;mentary Party and (he Prime if two-thirds of the membelS of a Legisla, Minister had 1:greed to drop a certain cont. ture Party decide for merger, that merger roversial pro\-rjsion of the Bill, whereb't a would b~ effected and .he Member would Member WO", d lose his membership, if he not COll"C ·under the mischief of disquali- is expelled t~y his party. I wouJd like to take fication. 93 Corutitul;o" MAGHA 10, 1906 (S..4KA) (51"" Amdt.) Bill But I would like to point out to him Aya Rams and Gaya Ram. descended OD that iD the country today we have a lup: the political SCCD~. number of very small parties, lome of them regioDal parties, with not more tban I welcome in particular tbe ioitiative , or 6 Member. ia tbe A,sembly, or ODe or showo by tbe new Prime Minister. io his two Members in Parliament. Suppose it declared intentioo to cleanse the political life bappens that the two Members of thi! House and also the approach "he bas showA while belonginl to a particular party decide to discussing the BiJI with the Opposition. merge. The merger would be effective and quite legal. But the organisational machinery of the party is not merging. What happens? I am also conscious that we have And that party, as a reS!.l1t of the number of io our new Law Minister, a cus- votes that it ,ot in the elections, is a recog- todian of our Constitutional ri,hls an emin- nized party, with it. own symbol, allotted cot. Constitutional lawyer tbat be ii, I am by the Blection Commission. Here you ha ve sure as loog as he is tbere, he shall not allow a case, where the elecred members of that our basic and . Fundamental Riahtl to be party have left the party. and merged with snuffed out. some other party, but the organisation of the party remains. What happens? Will that It is not the occasion to apportion party incur de-recognition from the Election blame and most of tbe parties represented Commission? We would like the Law Minis- there are guilty" U oasbamed display of enco- ter to clarify the position? uragement of defections is a pbeoomenOD which is in India since 1967 aDd more recently and more blatantly durio. the last I think that is the only thing that I two years, as in 'the cue or Sikkim .... have got to say. Otherwise I see no obj!ction Pondicberry and Jammu and Kashmir aDd to it at aU. I wouJd repeat my rrquest to the Ancb a Pradesh. It is difficult to beliew-and Members of the opposition to cooperate in bowever much you may welcome tItis meas- passing this Bill today. We need discipl· ure-that people wbo have encouraged•• inc in this country, we need to go forward clique io Jammu aod Kasbmir and the aDd each member should taken upon himself infamous·. of Aodhra Pradesh ..• tbat it is tbe minimum basIc task to respect tbe wishes of the people who have elected MR. DEPUTY-SPBAKER : Plcaac do him. As a matter of fact, it is rather sad nOl mention names. tbat we have got to provide this in this maD- ner by way of a legislation. I am sure. if elected Members, the representatives of the SHRI K.P. UNNIKRISHNAN : No, people in this country. had behaved in a the mentioning of names bas been a\towed. proper manner, bad kept up to certain It has already been mentioned and it bu standards, this kind of measure would been discussed. not have been necessary. But since conditi- ons in India are what they are today, I SHR1 RAM PY ARB PANIK.A (llober- think this measure has not come a day too tsgaoj) : Words like linfamous' are not allo- loon. wed. SHRI K P. UNNIKRISHNAN: WeJl SHRI K.P. UNNIKRISHNAN (Bada- that will be looked ioto. lafa) : Mr. Deputy-Speaker, Sir, it is tbe most silniflcant to the CODstitution of India with rar-re&-:hiog consequences thlt bas come SHRI S. JAIPAL REDDY (Mahbub- nagar): 1t is Dot unparliamentary. up before the House today. I welcome tbi. belated realisadoo or tbe rulinl party of tbe danaer of defections which has beeD SHRl K.P. UNNIKRISHNAN: Welt. eatina into tbe vitals of our polity, since the do not interrupt. Let me have my sa" ·.Not recorded. JANUARY 30, 1985 (52nd Amdt ) Bill 96 then you can contradict and say -that it was that the problem of defections baa eOla- a Ilorious record. led the attention of this House or of the fuling party. Sir, in early 70s, I recall tbe debates in this very House or even in the. The then Home Minister who still adorns Congress Parliamentary Party and a group the Treasury Benches and wh" had put up was formed with Shrj H.R. Gokhale as COD- a brave defence of the conspiracy to oust vener and Shri Mohan Kum'aramanlalam the elected Government or Shri N.T. and olhers. And I happened to be one of Rama Rao is there in this very House. the members and in pursuance of our reco- mmeDdalions, a Bill was intr(\duced in 1973 SHRI RAM PYARE PANIKA: Sir, which uDfortunately lapsed. And durinl the every body knows these names. There il no Jaoala phase, aoother Bill was intrOduced uae of mentioniDg th_ names. which died iD the storm generated by tbe historic split iD the Janata Pany. MR. DEPUTY·SPEAKER That is what ] have told him. So, Sir, provisions to eliminate defec- tions are essentiaJJy a part of the much-nre- SHRI K.P. UNNIKRISHNAN : In ded electoral reforms and I do not think It spite of the historic majority, the political caD be separated, except for political conti- piracy continues. ngencies. That was the thinking of even the previous government headed by Shrimali MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: You are Indira Gandhi. ADd in aDswer to numcrow unnecessarily mentioning the namu. questions in this House. tbey u~pcaledJy , said as early as 1983 and J 98.$ that tbe problem of dtfectioos formed a r t of the SHRI Ie.P. UNNIKRJSHNAN: WrI'l ra larae issue of electoral reform!! sr·d H could whether it is necessary or unnecessary should not be viewed iD isolation. Sir, diat is why be left to me. What is Parliamentary aDd I thought that the proposal made by the .nparliameotary is left to you. Chief Election Commissioner, Shri Trivedi, after due consul tatlon" with the' polttical MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: You sho- parties for brining certain changes in the uld DOl mention any penon's name. Peoples Representation Act wOt 1Jd itself have guaranteed. But they are now seeking it (InterruptiolU) througb a Constitutional amendment. Now, Sir. articles )02 (e) and 191 (e) make it very clear that it is wide open for Parliament to SHRI K.P. UNNIKRISHNAN: What make such amendments as are necessary. is ParlialDClltary and unparliamentary is left But what is being dODe now is not a simple to him. Bill to ban defection but it goes far beyond. It might, in the case of particularly, clause 6 In spite of all this, attempts are still (2), affect the very struc ture of the Constitu- beiDg made. For exampleJ in Bihar, the tion and the structure of priVileges UDder other day there was a case of political article lOS which affect the very ethos of piracy where a Jharkband Mukti Morcha our system. Sir, this Bill has introduced a Member was forced to Je!ve his party aDd new element. I hope it would not legitimise join the ruling party. Therefore, one should the tyranny of the party and the boss and be rorgiven jf people look at certain harsh attempts to stifle dissent. Had this Bill been provisions of this Bill which seeks to amend operative in 1969, would Shrimati Indira the Constitution with deep misgivinlS. Do Gandhi have cODtinued a$ Prime Minister? I take it that this Government is afraid of Sir, am I to believe that parties in IDdia are to itt own ahado. and lhe substance of this be dominated only by Parliamentary Jeaders majority in itself aDd that it is giving anxi- or mass movements whose alternati\e Out moment. to it. leadership? Neverthe- policy JiDes are punued and debated be- less, we welcome the determination to race cause in the Indian context. Parties would the problem of derection. and certaio out- cootinuc to be eSICDtially complex coalitions? bunt of concern. It is not for the first time Coming to decisive nature of our policy , 97 CD"n;tlll;oll MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52lfd Amdt.) BiU 98 pauioa for cbeDp or form CADDot be atm- itself has certain importence. It iI Dot to sa, pithed u JawabarJaJ Nehru remarked : tbat there should be DO Parameters for healthy Jl'owth of party IJIteID but to lUI- pst that a limple Bill bumiDl defectiODl ·The Conlrcu ha. widaiD ita fold many would have met the requirementa of the arODpI, widel, differin, in their view- lituatioo rather tban I'OIOrtiDa to tbil pofDtl and idcoJolicl. This it natural CoDltitutioD Amendment Bill. and ioeyitable if tbe Coaareu i. to be tbe mirror of the nation.' Sir, I would like to invite ,our atten- tion and throu.h you, tbe attention of the It would ceate to be the Coaarcu if it HoUle to a veJY imponaat thina. There iI doca not do 10. And, Sir, yet anotber perce- euentially a differeoce betweeo a parliaa.- ptive observer of tbe Indian eonltitutional tary democracy and countries which have ICene remarked and empbatically laid. tokeD cJemocracica aDd in fact, which are that tbe Indian Constitution itself ex- basically dictatorshipa. Thil is what Ivor prel1let tbe will of tbe many rather than the Jenninp hal said: ncedI of the few, because of thil acc:eptaDc:e of the disscDt within tbe Conlress system it- self. "Tbe real diffcreuce between Britain and countries with dictatonhip i. tbal with us there is not onc faction IeCkin, Sir, anotber question arises whether in to maintain itself in power by penua- a parliamentary democracy of tbe Westmini- sion, fraud or force, but at least two Iter type, you Cln rretze a political situation faction. eacb trying to achieve and obtaininl a majority in the House il only maintain power by penuaaioa. These half the job. The Government in spite of the factioDI are bued on differeDt view. majority has to be accouDtable to Parliament of the national interest, and each aad what i. more. continuously responsive to appeals to public opinion to uphold the chanlinl moods of public opinion. Sir, ita policy.·t in tbis, back-bencher. of the ruhnl party have a tremendoul role to perform apart from the Opposition. Take for example. the Once you accept tbis basic approach fate and fortunes of Edward Heath's lovern- it would be possible to briq about .... ment in tbe U,K. in 1970-74 which was ...., cbanlCl. Democratic Partiel cannot be defeated six times durinl these yean. But it buill by legislation, more so in a lirae lOb- did not lose oflice. It was compelled to continental polily like India. It can only respoDd to public opinion aDd the revolt be built up on the basil of certm commit- o( the back-benchers had forced them to meDt to ideology, principles and program- withdraw certain unpopular mellures. Any ma and, what is more, toierence (or dissent leljslation which seeks to overcome dissent Internal democracy. more particularly. in the i. committinl an alsault on the basic princi- ruling Party or the dominant Part, is impor- ples of accountability and rcsponsiveness. tant because if a dissent i. allowed to be In other words jt would assault the very extin,uilbed in tbe dominant Party. it ethOi of the .ystem. Therefore, thc question overtakes tbe .,.tem, u bistory shows. baa allo to be debated, to whom a Member Therefore, tolerencc and moderation are the of Parliament is rrimar'ly responsible. mOlt important democratic values. to his electorate or to hi, party bosses. It is • cootroveny "hich ha! never been settled. Is he a del~gate or is he a free aaent in the House? I would end by quotina. what Law That brinl~ UI to tbe problem of structure Minilter should be familiar with a judament of privilege. auarentm under Article lOS or the JudlC, Learned Hand : or tbe Con~titution evolved arter Jonl yean of Parliamenta" history. 'A tociety so aiven that the spirit of I'DOCkration is lODe. DO court can It recoauiltl tblt the memben are free save, a society where that spirit flouri- .pats ad that the Boor of tbe House shes, no court need save in. society 99 Conslitlltion JANUARY 30, 1985 (52nd Amdt.) Bill 100 which evades its responsibility by otber parties and in tbis way tried to weaken thrusting upon the courts to nurture of their own party and the country. Efforts that spirit, that spirit in the end will were made several times to bring forward Perish. What is the spirit of modera- anti-defection Bill here, but in vain. I would tion ? It is the temper which does not Jike to say that tbe 8th SOD of Dcvaki, press a partisan advantage to its bitter Lord Knshna, had brought revolution in end, whIch can understand and will this country. SimiJar role is being played by respect the otller side.' tbe Eighth Lolc' Sabba and the leader of this ParJiameL', a son of Bharat Mata This spirit is none too evident in our He had said that he was committed to estab: Polity today. Its absence affects not only lish a clean government in the country. He the standards of pOlitical morality but also is practising what he professed' and is commi- the viability of the Party system on which tted to get this Bil1 passed. Nobody knew our Constitutional structure Jargely Gepends. how the basic problems in this country would be solved. The steps taken to eradi- cate corruption and curb defections indicate I welcome this Bill with my reservations. the shape of things to come in this country. Our young Prime Minister has proved in this International Year of the Youth tbat he [Translatio,,] will do what be says. The people live their mandate on the basis of some policy and SHRI VISHNU MODI ideology but Members after gettinl elected (Ajmer): Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, while defect to other parties. keeping in view appreciating the spirit of this Bill, I would their petty interests and try to briDa dOwn Jike to submit that there has been a their own party and goveromtnt. Ie wu practice in OUf country to work against necessary to put a curb on o:his practice one's own side. It started during the time because India is the biglest democratic of Nadir Shah. When he came to India country in the world. After 1967, there was and his army was starving outside a fort, a spate of defections and Members tried to he had decided to retreat. At tbat time, one bring down the lovemment of their OWD Diaht tbe perSOD guarding the fort appro- party. It is a good thing that Memben ached him and said if he: was paid ten of the OppositJ90 have welcome1 tbis Bill. thousand dinars, be would open the gate Thougb their number is less, yet it should of the fort during the night. Nadir Sbah not dwindle furtber. Tbe Prime Minister pve ten tbousand dinars to him and promi- has said tbat whIle workini (or the progress sed another ten thousand dinars to be paid of the country tbe Opposition will be taken later on. The guard opened the late of the into confidence. He envisages the India of fort at the appropriate time and Nadir Shah tbe twcoty-tirst century and desires that our lucccedcd iD capturing that fort. We all are country should find a place amoDa tbe aware or the price India had to pay there- developed countries of the world. I under- for. Nadir Shah has ·.·.Titten somewhere stand that it is the first Bill which is beiDg that army is Dot needed to capture the passed in this Session and there could not Indian forts. For this purpose take gold have been a better beainaing. With these dinars on ponies and you will succeed in words I support this Bill. capturinl tbe Indian forts and will also get back those dinars. After him, another [Englllh] Hindu king of India, Prithviraj Chauhan, bad also fought battles with foreign invaders. SHRIMATI GBETA MUKHERJBE Bverybody knows what Jai Chand had done (PaD skura) : Like mOlt other Members of in this country. Everybody knows the role the Opposition. I, on behalf of my ParlJ, played by Mir Jafar in tbe Battle of Plas!iCY· aenerally welcome the Bill. Tbi. attempt to There have been penonI like Jai Cband and clean up tbe political life of tbis country i, Mir Jafar, who have cau&ed tremendous barm beinl eulolised. Well, I appreciate the SCD- to the COUDtry. Similarly, after indepcn- timents and tberefore. I am layinl tbat it is deoce, political leaden of this country disre- realJy a welcome .tep. This Bill i. beinl prdccl the people." mandate and defected to prcaented and it beiDI ru.h.d tbrOiJlb today JOI CO",'ilMlion MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52nd Amdl.) Bill 101 to which I have no .objection. But I am just to ono of our sugestiOlll. That it about at a loss to understand one thing. This Bill taking out sub.clause (c) from here aDd wiJI become effective after it is passed. But puetin. it in a different place and jn. in the meantime, after the last Oeneral differant conlext. We feel naturally Od Lhat. Elections, I find, in Meghataya. a few I need oot go into that (Interr.tioru) What is independents have been quietly aHowed to the trouble? I have not yielded ... join tbe rulina Party. and thereby a govern- ment of the roliDa Party is beiDg formed. Then, Ilain. today I hear 1 have not yet 14.27 m. been able to properly verify-that in Nagaland allo •.. [SHRI ZAINUL DASHAR in lite Cltai,l SHRI 0 O. SWELL : I would like to MR. CHAIRMAN: Please don't correct the hon. Member. Jt is true that disturb her .•. Please take your seat. there has been admission to the Megba)a),a Congress Legislature Party. But it is not SHRIMATI GBETA MUKHERJEE: that Government is beina formed as a result Wn .• t bappened in their meetiol is their of that. The Government was there with business. I am only speakinl what the fun majority. Only a few more Members Prime Minister said in the meeting we bad wanted to be admitted. witb him. The. Government i, not being formed SHRI O.G. SWELL: We are not inter- by these two new members joining them. rupting you. We are only pointinl out a few thinas. The Prime Minister did not yield in the meeting with you. He yielded to the SHRIMATI GEETA MUKHERJEE argument at the Members of the Party. My hon. colleague, Mr. G.O. Swell bas pointed out that the Government was SHRIMA TI GEETA MUKHERJEE: already there. I admit that it was there. But For that you are taking so much time? the fact is that these two people were Wbat prevented you from saying tbat ? admitted to tbe ruHng party country to the That was up to you. provisions of this BtU. I do not know whether these twO people are admitted for future stability of the government. The fact Anyway, I come back to the subject. 1 of independent joining the ruhng party quite understand in this very affable atmos- remains. Here what has been contemplated phere •.. is tbat no independent also will be joinina the parties and that is also defection. 1 (Interruptions) would at least appreciate if it was said that these provisions will be effective from 1985 Both cannot go tOlether. Any... y. eleclions at least. That would really usher probably, I hope before that, the whole in a clean drive for a clean administra- situation will not change. tion.' I would not have said this even had not aJl these euologies been going on. Anyway tbe point is tbat what we fccl Even then, as I told you. I generally strongly is that while we are very much support the idea of the Bill and it is wel- against defection, we also want that the right come tbat such an attempt is made thouah of dissent should be given serious thought to it is true that at one go, probably all prob- in our deJllocracy of thie kind. That is why lems of the kind whith may present itself we did oot want $ub-clause (c) &0 be there in the future cannot be always foreseen. In that relation, as is aaid now, tbat From that point of view, I will just poin\ it bema taken that part split. I would out a few things. will be in of like to particularly hear from tbe Prime Minister what would he do and when. about It is good that in the morning meetinl actually what is tbe most pertinent tbina to we had witb the Prime Minister, he agreed stop defoction (if there; is a defection which 1'03 COlUtJIIdI01l JANUARY 30, 19B5 (J2NJ "mdl.) Bill UN can be called a split and not defection) in of the lovernmeot. I am taJkina of the that case, how wiJI the majority of tbe size. Government pany be ascertained and by wbom ? I particularly want to stress tbat it muat not be left to the Governors at their SHRIMATI GEETA MUKHERJEE: will to decide these thinp. Therefore, a very The size of the Council of Mioister should quick and catcaortcal provilion for alCCrtain· be limited to one-tentb or the number of ina the majority of a Government in case of members or tbe House. That was also the any split. is called for. How lOOn tbe recommendation made by the Committee )caislature will be calJed to live its verdict during 1967. If it is a drive towards really about the majority or minority of the lovern- clean admiDiitratioD, then on very many ment concerned. "1 This is very important. fronts thit will have to be faced. I am As my friend. Shri Amal Datta referred pointinl out one luch spbere. The question about the Governor's powers in tbis reprd. of tbe size or the Ministry, may be, cannot I allO want that this sbould be taken out be put down in tbe Act itself but through altogether. J want tbat this Bill should make rules and directives etc. this should be a provilion clearly stating that witbin two or positively covered. tbree days of such happeniDgt the concerned IoIislaturc will be called and tbe majority Laltly. I would like to submit that we will be ascertained. This is very important are in favour of living a very fair trial to tbe to prevent wholesale defections for tbe lure Bill. I believe throulh our practical ex- 0( mouey or office. This in my opinion will periences many otber facets will get revealed be ftl"Y important because wbo knows what and we may have to review it in future in tbe will happen with the AssembJy ejections that )ight of our experiences luaranteeinl that are ,oiDa to take place. So, I would like there should be DO defection for opportuni· that thit quntion be settled in tbit Session stic reasons and guaranteeing also tbat itlelf for all the 80vemmeDti which will be dissent be allowed in every party for proper· formed in future; it will be in their iDtcre8t democratic functioning. aDd it ia in the intorett of botb the rulin, party .. well 81 tbe Opposition if tbit queltion of uc:ertaiDinl the majority on the SHRI CHINTAMANI lENA - 800r of the HoOle witbin the quickest poIIible (Baluore): Mr. Cbairman, Sir, I rise to time it _tled. support tbis Constitution Amendment Bill wbole-heartedly. Mr. OJairmaD, I would aIIo like to MY • few words about the aize of the MiDiitry, At tbe outset, I must CODlratulate our AItbouab-u I bave been told-it dCJel Dot dyDamic ,oonl Prime Mini.ter, who on taU within tbe purview of thit CoDltitutioD tatio, over the reaponsibiJity of tbis natioD amendment, yet I feel that eveeywbere the OD hi, IhouJden is lOilll to implement in lize of the Council of Ministers beiJll made rilbt camest one by ODe aU tbe anno~" ia _., tMa. That aivee aD alibi for luriD. ments made in our party'. election manl litO. otber people to defect. The Indian National Conlrcas bad announced to eradicate corruption from tbe GovernlDcot u well u from pu~lic life and to brinl di.- SBlU PRlYA RANJAN DAS cipliDc in public life. Thil il a bold step IlUNSB1 (1Iowrab) : IDdudiDa tho preleDt ta'teo for the fint time in the hiltory or .,..-DIDIIIt of Welt BeD",. india and in tbe history of tbe wbole world. Nobody could dare to briD' such a dynamic SlllUMATI OBITA MUDIElUSB : ameodment to the ConttitutioD carli. witb • view to briD, about dilcipline and eracfjcate Sir, I .... the CODOII'D of the boD. Member for oar 10..... bat I would like to ..... corruption from political life. Jd8 tbat it will .... fall tbrOIIIh delectioDl. While .apportin. tho Bill, I want to IBRI PUYA RANJAN DAB draw tbe attCDtioD of tbe bOD' ble Law MUNSBI : I am Dot talk", .boat the fall Mlailter to • particular clause...... , lOS CfllUtlrul;oll MAGHA to. 1906 (SAKA) (52. Amdl.) Bill 106 clause 6, pertaining to decision on questions encoura.e tbit type of musbroomin. ,rowth as to disqualification on afound of defection. of relioqal parties wbich ia a daaler 10 our It has been correctly mentioned in the Bill : Dation'. inlesrity and iodepeadeoce too. Sir, I am Dot mentioniol about Telulu Deum or anybody. ·'If any question arises al to whether a member of a House hal become lubject to disqualification under this' Schedule, MR. CHAIRMAN: Plelle cooclude. the queltion shall be referred for the decision of the Chairman or, as the cue SHRI CHINTAMANI IBNA: Sir, ODe may be. the Speaker or luch House and more point please. Some of our bon. mem- his dec;:ision sball be final." bers in the Oppo'itiOD arc clitisiziDl tbe Coogren Party for Dot blvin. brougbt tbis 1 his is correct but we should also think Bill in the palt. I Ihould point out tbat out of the other aspect of this issue. What beloved late Prime Minilter Sbrimati Indira happens if tbe Speaker or the Chairman, who Gandhi, knowinl full well the dao,en tbat hal be~n elected al luch, i. to quit the party come in the Irowth of democracy, broulbt on whose ticket he was elected to the House. this BIU, but it could not be paassed iD thi' On the otber hand, I am apprehending one HouiC. Similarly, I should allO blame the more thing. After the term is over, the Opposilion members. In theIr relime also. Chairman or the Speaker. has to seek the they broulbt this Bill, but it could Dot be party ticket either of his r f.!vious pany or of pas&ed because or their disinterest or rather another pohtlcal party to contest the elections, their rear that if this Bill were to be pUled so that he can be elected to Ihe House. For in the Hous~ they miahl not be able to rule this, he may have ~ome inclination towards a the country in future. That is why it could particular party. In my humble opinion, I Dot be passed. So, they should Dot blame us. would luggest to hOD Law MiDlsrer to brinl Now our beloved Prime MlDlster Shri Raji'lji forward an amendment that once a perlon aod his Government ha,e tbree-fourth majo- is elected as Speaker' or Deputy-Speaker, rity in tbe House. Chairman or Deputy-Chairman, he would be ejected to tbe House unopposed. He need MR. CHAIRMAN : You ba" pat Dot contest OD the ticket of any political party. your points 0( view. Now please coaclude. There sbouJd be lueh a provi!lliod in our law, io tbat tbe decilions by tbe Cbairman. the Speaker, the Deputy-Chairman or the saRI CHINTAMANI JBNA : Ia lpite Deputy-Speaker, are very very impartial aDd of that, some of the members from abc will be accepted by all of us. Oppositioo want to join us. KDowm, tbal too fuUy well, in spite of tbat, we haw broulht lhis 8ill her~ All aectiool of tbe I also COD.ratulatc tbe Law Minister HOUfoe and all parties abouJd joiD me ill COD- that be has kept tbese cateI outside the juri.. ,ratulatiD. tne Law Minister lor thia dictioo oC tbe courts of Law. Tbis is a very meuUfe. welcome measure, and I bope, the wbole House would accept it. I am srateful to abe members on tbe other .ide for tbeir accep- SHRI RAJESH PILOT (0.... ) : Mr. taDce of tbe amendment to Clau.e 2(1) (c), Chairman, Sir, after beariDa ICIlior coDeaupa piloted by tbe Law Minister. But at tbe lame like Prcl. Madbu DlDdavale .d 8bri dme. IUCh dd'ectioo. came ioto beiba becaute Bblpat Jba ADd. aDd 01 coune. n:c:;eiwilll after 1967. tbe muabroomiDI aroYtth of amCDdmeo( from the ao.fl'DlDflDt aide juIt ftIIioGaI partieI bepD. I Ibould say that BOW, amcadiDl paraanpb 2(cJ liael 35 to 31. lie mlllhroomiDl arowlh of .ueb I'eIioDal there it hardiJ aDJlbiIlI to add. putiet in the name of Janluaae, in tbe nalDO 01 roIiaiOD aad in the name of reaiOD, abould lie blaDed, 10 tbat a Il~ ,~, democ::rlll:Y IDA, Sir, I cooaratu1ate the OovennDeDt for OOIDO about In future In our COWl",. No takioa a major Iteo in improviDI the political cIoabt, I mow lbat our democracy it for character in thit COUQtry. I remember ill 19lOt .ultiple poUtical part_. But we abouJd aOC alter lettia~ deaecl 10 Lot Sabha.. the 107 Constitution. JANUARY 30, 1985 (5Jnd Amdt ) Bill 108 Second Sessit)n when r met our Late Prime launched a regional party. To-day, regional- Minister, Shrimati lndira Gandhi she asked ism is growing. We have to stop this. I me a question, "How do you feel after jOinin& think that with this Bill. there will be some politics '1" I replied to her : "After touring lessening of it. all over the country and gaining some ex- perience, I pers0'i'aJly feel that two steps are Clause 2(c) has been amended suitably. to be taken immd:liately." . J explained to her I am happy. I do not have much to add, that defection was one problem, and the except to tell the law Minister that this Bill lecond one was to make legislators declare will be fruitful and helpful only if he briDgs their assets. She asked me to take some in another Bill for the bedaration of assets steps. I c(lDsulted some senior persons here by aU legislators, both in Parliament and in and there. and moved two private I Bills, the A~semblics. We can then hope that the Members' Bi1ls in 1980. The first dealt with political atmosphere in the country will im- defections, and the second with declaration prove. It is deteriorating now day by of assets by legislators. The first one did not day. come in the ballot. The second one was discussed for 6 to 8 hours, but met with its natural fate. Frankly speaking, I find that not many who had indulged in defection have come back to Parliament this time. Citizens have I am very happy that Government bas noted their activities with Ireat concern. They taken this step to improve our political at- have taken it seriously. They seem to have mosphere. I think that this discussion espe- felt that if they did not improve matters, cialJy should have gone above party lines. politicians will not improve. That is why People who are most experienced in the sub- they have rejected such people. ject should have been given priority, because in the debates experience counts. But to-day, experienced people are not very much vhible, With these words, I support this, and the debate has started with people havins measure. no or little experience. People who have maximum experience on the subject are not [ Translation] even in Parliament to-day. SHRI ABDUL RASHID KABULI I went to the Reference Library to (Srinagar): Mr. Chairman, Sir, so far as thi~ educate myself on the . subject. I was just BiII is concerned, the National Conference going through books to see how defe;tion had made its opinion clear on the very started, \\oho reaJJy initiated this, and wbich day \lrhen thi.., Bill was introduced in this party violated the principle first. J could august Hou:-.e. The Nationa1 Conference coUect the information that one legislator suppotts this legislation and hopes that this left the congress in the early '60s along with anti-defection law would be implemented some MLAs, and formed a party called the strictly so that dishonesty and unscrupu- Congress Kranti Dal. That was initiated by lousness in the politics of the countty might one legislator. He changed it then to BKD. be done away wilh I think that in totality Then it became Lok Dal; tben it became this Bill contain... all the features of the Janata Party. Now] think it is called DMKP Historic legislation passed by Jammu and or by anotper name. After this, this game Kashmir Legislature in 1979 under the leader has become so popular in our country, parti- ship of Sheree-Kashmir, Sheikh Abdullah. cularly in political circles that if you really when he was Chief Minister and the leader Itart looking for whom 10 blame, it will not of the masses and a foundation was laid in be a successful effort. Everyone is to blame. this direction. This foundation was laid so To-day, a stale has come when the Govern- that such a leli~latioll sbou'd also be passed ment has had to bring in this Bill. for the whole of the nation I remember the speech which was made by the Sher-e-Kashmir in the Assembly. He had said that he was sow- Anybody who could not become a ing a seed that day and that the only solution of national leader moved to the regions and wha t was going 00 in the country and of the 109 Constitution MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52nd Amdt) Bill 110 corruption and unscrupulou'iness in po]itie\ 26 Congress (I) members pledged their was the anti-defection law. At that time. the support to them. Now I appeal to the con- leaislation which was passed had one short- science of the hoo. Minister and the ruling comina. At that time all the powers were not party aod would like to know their approach delegated to the Speaker and he was authori- to the sequence of eventS which began in sed to refer a case to judIciary if he deemed Kashmir in 1984. WIth a view to give effect it fit and tbe judiciary could d~cide the case. to the events of 2nd July, eleven members I think that shortcoming has now been were made to defect and every member was removed io this Bill. I would also like to made a minister. Even an independent mem- make a submission tbat when we go through ber was also made a minister ...... (Interrup- tbis Ielislation aDd analyse it there is a lions) lurkinl fear that the Speaker may have b~en liven authoritarian powers. The Speaker or SHRI RAM PY ARE PANIKA (Rober- the Chairman is elected through due process tsganj) : What does 'made to defect' mean? and he belonl' to a party. He is elected on •••.•• (Interruptions) the ticket of a particular party and when he seeks re-eICllCtion. he has to look to that party alain. A legislation should be brought MR. CHAIRMA~: Now you please in the Parliament that in future nobody Sit down. Would contest aaainst the Speaker and once his non-political character has b:en recogni- SHRI ABDUL RASHID KABULI: I sed. he wiIJ have to seve all connections \\ auld like to tell you that 26 memb.!rs of with hi. political party so that nobody may CO::lgres! (I) pledged their unconditional contest election against him. Then he will 5upport to these eleven members ltnd it is a contest election as an independent candidate matter of great regret that though 26 mem- and return as an independent candidate to bers of Congress (I) pledged their support to this House. Otherwise. if such privileges are them yet they did not accept any port folio Dot liveu to tbe Speaker and he is under for themselves and administration of the pressure from the rulinl party, it is feared State was handed over to these eleven mem- tbat the rilhts of the Opposition may be bers. I would like to tell you that this was adversely affected. the gre&test tragedy of our democratic history and t he country. The Government So far .5 terminatioD of membership is which was imposed on the people of Jammu concerned, I 1m afraid that undue powers and Kashmir on 2nd July was led by Chief are beiDI deleaated to the Speaker. In this Minister, Shri G M. Shah, who has never cODnection, I would also like to welcome contested any Assembly electlOB. He had Dot tbe initiative 00 tbe part of the Government even contested any Panchayat elections •••• in accepting the clear demand of the opposi- ( Int~rruptions). tion parties that clause 2 (c) should not form part this Bill and now clause 2 (c) or Mr. Chairman, Sir, I would like to tell been deleted from the Through hal Bill you that this event must shake ooe's cons- your lood offices, I would like to tel] the cience. You have iotroduced this anti· bon. Minister tbat the aim of this Bdl is to defectioD legislation and Conlress Party has curb defections. far as Jammu and So accepted it and we have welcomed it. It is Kashmir is concerned. have drawn your I your moral responsibility that a lovernment attention to tbe fact that this law was passed which is b!ing run with the strength of hardly in the State in and a popular lovern- 1979 13 MLAs and in which Congress Party is ment was formed in 1983 under the leader- not a partner except that one of its M.L A.s ship of Dr. Farooq Abjullah. The people has been made the Speaker, should be diS- of Jammu aod Kashmir lave a majority missed ... (Int,r,.uptiolU) to the National Conference at a reault of which • lovcrnmcnt wu torm~ there. Conspiracies were hatcbed to [EngIUJr] pull dOWD hi' lovcromcDt Unfortunate1y. the conspiracy luccceded when eleven mem- SHRI RAM PYARE PANIK.A ben of our party were made to defect and (RobensIIDj) : Mr. Chairman, I want tf 111 JANUAR Y 30, 1985 (52l1li Amdt.) Bill 112 cIIrify that a Riah Court verdict has been party should undo the iajustice done to the sheD. people of Jammu and Kashmir. who are equal citizeas of tllia country. SHRI ABDUL RASHID KABULI : I am DOt JieJdiDI. The National Confereace unreserveclJy supports this Bill. It ii, therefore, tbe duty of MR. CHAIRMAN : He is not yieldinl. the rulinl party as alao our party. the National Please take your seat. Conference, to update the Peoples Represen- tation Act, which was amended by Sheikh Saheb in 1979 to check defectioD. [TrllllllatloPl] after the enactment of this leaialatioD, It iI moral responlibility of aU of us. It is the SHRI ABDUL RASHID KABUU : So responsibility of the National Conference u far as the spirit of tbis Bill is CODceroed, in allo of Cousreas (I) to brio. the law of tbe Bill which bas been introduced in tbis Jammu and Kubmir in line with thll law, au lust House and is proposed to be passed, and to remove the limitations of that law. there is a provision that if one third Members of a party leave the party. then it will be treated as a split. If, just for a Mr. Chairman, Sir, Jammu and IDOIDeDt, I accept your contention that a Kashmir has a CoaltitutioD of ita own and in part of NatiODII Confereuce had left the the Conldtution of the country, the State has PlfeDt orpaisation theD at least 16 lot a distinctive and special statuI. We waDt members were required for causinl a split in that the Constitution of the State should be the party. But the number of MLAs who amended in the liaht of this law. I would bad parted company with the party is bardly also like once again to congratulate the 12 at present and 12 members do not come ruling party and Shri Rajiv Gandhi lor witbiD the purveiw of the legislation wbich bringing forward luch a leaislation here. is proposed to be passed. I would also like to Wbile congratulatinl them, I once apiD ..y that the political tragedy of 2nd J ... ly led request that the Government or Jammu and to a .eries of incidebtl in which dozens of Kashmir be dismissed to undo the injustice people were subjected to latbi charge and done to the people of Jammu aDd Kashmir firiDa and curfew bad to be imposed in and Assembly be dissolved and that thele SriDqar Iud other areas of the State for steps be taken forthwith. three aDd a half months. The Government bad to reaort to lathi charse and firiol to SMT. VIDYAWATI CHATURVEDI supprelS the people there, u stated by me (Khajuraho) : Mr. Chairman, Sir, the aoti- ear1ier in this ausust House, J would like to derection Bill brought forward in the House, conaratulate Shri Rajiv Gandhi for res- h8~ become quite essential in a democratic pondiDa to the demand of tbe time by bring- set up. I would like to congratulate the hone illl forward this Bi1J which hu been Minister aod the Prime Minister for briDliD. supported unanimoUily by bolh sidet of the forward this Bill in this very Session. Both 0(4 HoUle. But I would Ilso like to add tbat this them deserve CoolratuJations. J welcome this piece of JeaiaJation would stiDd the acid test Bill. only when it is implemented in letter and apirit aad the ,ovemmcnt cf defectors in ,'Jammu lad Kubmir is dism:ssed There is Before I Ipeak on thit Bill. I would :;;: DO justi8catiCJD for c(lntin~ of the I ike to 18y that our Member from pemmeat 01 defecton there. They Ibould Kat-hmir used some words in be broupt UDder tbe pur vi( w of this the heat of the moment apintt CODlres. law aDd membenbip 01 def'ec101'1 lbould be which were Dot proper. I would bumbly tmDillated, AIICIDbIJ Ihould be diIsolved lad remind him of the proverb "Sweep before elcc:tioDi IK Jd afresh. your own door" al Iiso aslc him to recollect how electioDS were held there. bow booths wre captured, and other UDfair meaD, ~ 15.00 In. I'eIOrted to. ID this coancctioa. it II DeCal." tbat ter If the liD Ill' bec8 ..-eI, tbe ruIiDa llJ COMtit llIio. MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52nd Amdt.) Bill 114 MR. CHAIRMAN : You please lit Pradelh also. Today, it is the demand not dOWD. When you were speakiDI, .be had Dot only of politics but of human reeliDis and disturbed you. morality also that such a measure should be adopted. This will have a salutary effect on the SMT. VliJYAWATI CHATURVBDI: I coming leneration. Some people let votes on never disturb aDy Member when be is apeak. the basis of a particular party's policies aDd ina. Therefore, I humbly request the hOD. ideology and are elected and thereafter for Member not to interrupt while I am speaking their personal interests, the)' defect to another party in uttar disregard of thOle policies and ideoloay and the electorate is not taken into Our party bas taken this step keepiD, iD confidence. view the pOlitical aDd moral respoDsibility which we owe to the society. While welcominl this measure, I would like to say tbat our hone Minister bas pro- Mr. ChairmaD, Sir. you afe aware that posed an amendment to clause 2 (c) of this when we go to the people which is a pre- Bill which is very useful and appropriate. requisite in the democracy we go to them with our respective election symbols. Each party has some ideology, some programmes Now-a-days' within each party there arc and policies. We go to the people with the groups who either want to Jet down the other ideology and programmes and we are elected group or try to lower the imase of the party on that very ideology, policies and symbol. by making falle allegations due to personal Tbe people do not yote for us as individuals malice. Therefore, I would like to congratu- but tbey vote (or us on a party ideoloiY, its late the hon. Minister for the proposed policies and its symbol. amendment. Such moments are very delicate and these fine moments are rare when there 15.05 hn. is unanimity in the House about a matter of morahty or of the nation or of buiJding character in the society. It carries a very (SHRIMATI BASAV A RAJ ES\V ARI good impression of our representatives on the in the Chair). public. I am grateful to all the hon. members for this and I express my thanks to them. If a Member deceives the entire electorate and defects. amounts to betrayal it Mr. Chairman, I \\.ould like to subl1llt of the whole electorate. To check this betra- that such traditions should be established in yal is a big responsIbility. Here, we talk of the House as may leave an impression on eradicating corruptioD, and our young Pnme the people, on the visitors to this House and Minister has embarked upon the task of on the commg generation that we are disci- eradicating of corruption. This is also a klDd plined and that we work according to the corruption and this also bemg eradIcated. of is procedure. There should Dot bo! BDy curb on !Che people leave one party and join another one's liberty or freedom of expressioD. We and are called "Aya Ram, Gaya Ram". It is will have to see how we can exprcts our vie\u also allcged that every politician has a price- in a disciplined manner within the Parlia- tal. It sullies our image aDd that of our mentary practice and procedure which may parties. causes moral degradation. ThIS It add to the dignity of the House and may al50 measure has the .reatest relevance now. As be a guiding factor for the posterity. With hal been said, this measure should have been these words, I thank the Prime Minister, the brouaht long back, but better late than never. Law Minister and those who have supported However, efforts for this were intiated long lhi'J Bill. back I was a member of Rajya Sabha from 1966' to 1978 At that time, the late Prime M,nister. Smt Indira Gandhi thouaht many a SHRI MOOL CHAND OAGA (Pali): "'rime about curbing defections. In some States Mr. Chairman, Sir, only two or three days Gove-rnmeDts changed and S.V.D. Governments are left. The persons who want to defect may were formed. of which we lOO had an experi- do so. Rajya Sabha WIlt pass this Rill eDce. Something happened in Madhya tomorrow and the President WIll .ive hi' t 15 Comtjtlltior. JANUARY 30, 1985 (5]"d Ali/dr.) Bill assent tomorro"" night itself. So, decide \\ilh- cleared its position. We also , .. anted that in a day or two which party to join. There- these amendments should be made. The after, the doors will be closed .. (Interruptions) views \\ hich are convincing ,\- ill be allowed to be cxpr:.!ssed by the party. Every person lEng/islr] should have tbe liberty to express his views. Party discipline should be a must for the members. A person who makes a statement SHRI S. JAIPAL REDDY : It is a or speaks his mind should not be expelled case of projection. He is projecting his o\\n from the party simply on this ground and anxiety to the oppo~ition members. thus lose his membership. Howe\'er, if party whip is issued, it mllst be obeyed. Every l Trans/ation] person should have the right to liberty and frecdcm of e:ltpression. At the same time he SHRI MOOL CHAND DAGA : I am should obey the party whip and abide by only giving an advice. You have to preserve the party disCipline. [welcome the amend- the unity and integrity of the country. ment which you have accepted in this regard (Interruptions) I am talking to y.ou in the and you also deserve congratulations for interest of the nation. The parties ,\-hose having accepted my amendment in toto bUI strength has been reduced to one or two I want to add another point here ... members should join together to form one (Inter, lIptions) ... It is their sweet will if th~y party. accept my suggest ion or not. but I put m} suggestion before you, and that suggestion [En~/ish] is. MR.. CHAIRMAN: Please address the [ English] Chair. "Provided further that the House by a SHRI S. JAIPAL REDDY: Your resolution passed by a majority of th~ boat is likely to sink because of the members present and voting, may overload. exempt any member from the provisi- ons of this schedule, if it is of the [Translation] opinion that genuine hardship will be caused jf he is not ,0 exempted." ,..' SHRI MOOL CHAND DAGA : I am giving a very good advice (Interruptions). Bharatiya Janata Party has only two members [Tram/ation] coHum Do Hamare Do". You should respect people's wishes. If you want to add to the Sometimes a person j ~ convicted inrd honour of the country, you should leave your murder case and a mercy petition is filed ... respective parties based on narrow considera- (Interruptions) I am Dot creating a loophole tions and join a strong party. This is an but my submission is that ~ometimes there is invitation. The defection is a curse. During a hard case ""herein we do know jnjustice has the period 1967 to 1973 at least 1832 been done. In such a case, if by moving a members crossed the floor aDd 144 out of resolution, the House on the basis of them became Ministers. This law will put majority of votes exempts that person, then an end to horse-trading in politics and the he should be exempted. Somftimes, "uch dubious means of becoming Ministers. situations are created .. (Interruptions) .. SHRl RAM PYARE PANIKA: 210 have become Ministers. [ Eng/ish] SHRI MOOL CHAND DAGA: I It may happen sometimes and not think you were not oile of them. The always. Kindly read it. What I have sugges- amendments moved by the Government have ted is : 117 Constitution MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52nd Arndt.) Bill 118 'Provided further that the House by a It is a historical day today It was on resolution passed by a majority oC the this very day that Mahatma Gandhi became members present and voting, may a martyr and today the Indian Parliament is exempt any member from the provisions p,ssing a Bill which will ensure that the of tbis schedule, if it is of the opinion politicians do not show disregard to idt:Jlugy that genuine hardship will be caused if and rules and there wilI be no rr.[1r~ Jete~~jonl. he is not so exempted" I whole heartedly welcome this Bill. As the amendment moved by me has already been accepted, I would not like to speak [Translation} more about it, This is not applicable to all cases l SHRI PIYUS TIRAKY (A!;~\Jrd~ar) : everybody will not be exempted, but, some- this Mr. Speaker. SIr. 1 welcome times when there is a hard case, then w: must Bill ar.d would like to point out some consider it. This is my personal view. I t is facts. During elections, our political parties in upto you to accept it or not, but I have the country whether in North, South, East or put this suggestion before you. West-make promises to the electorate. ( Interruption.,) Duriog elections the voters are influenced by many factors like caste, religion, language, [ English] culture etc. and all the major political parties, especially the rulina party. try to take advantage of these factors and this has now MR CHAIRMAN: Please don't become a practice. This Bill will cast great interrupt. Let him continue. responsibility on tbe Government because there are many castes in our country. [Translation] If injustice is done to a community or a SHRl MOOL CHAND DAGA : Some- caste and the person representing that . times such things do happens as I have seen community fails to protest for fear of party- a hundred times in Priviieaes MOlion. Once, post, then there can be great resentment in somebody was convicted and given punish- that community and also in the country. ment for 7 days in a privilege case. That case came for discussion in the House. In the Likewise there are regional feelings too course of the discussion in the House, I Althoulh in North and South we have differ- expressed my dissent and keeping in view an ent ideas about the causes of Assam agita- the circumstances, the punishment was tioD in the East yet the Assam agitation has reduced. That is why I have said that some- been due to regional imbalance and times we come across such cases whicb tbis imbalance is found every- compel us to think that such cases should be where. The tulioS party will have to see considered ... (Interruptions)... I am not say- to it that these regional imbalances do Dot ina this in relation to all cases. but in rela- exist any more and injustice is DOt.cJOae tf aD)' tion to some exception,) cases. relisious or linluistic minority because if tbe members of a certain community, .... This day, when we are wiping out the which atrocities are bein, perpetrated. do oot protest for fear of party discipliae, tben there political curse of defecti~n (or ever will be may be outburst in tbe country wllic:h may be remembered as a lolden day in the annals difficult to control and of Jndian history, history of politics and may rault in bloodshed. history of our Parliament. Hereafter, people will say tbat now defection cannot take pJace, the dools to defection and floor crossiu. have There has been no Prime Minister from ~'Dce been closed. We passed this resolution south so far. For tbe Jast 37 ycan, Uttar in 1968 and today after so many years we are Pradesh bas mODOrolised aDd oDly ODe loina to adopt it. family is ruliog since tbea. • 119 CO"~/itul;on JANUARY 30, 1985 (S2nd Amdt.) Bill 120 These are tbe problems before this vast SHRI BALKAVI BAIRAGI (Mandsaur): country aod people in every reaion and Mr. Cbairmaa, Sir, I thank you for livinl me beIooain. to various communities are ulled to ao opportunity to speak 00 this important tbink on tbese lines. The rulins party will Bill. I am a victim of the defections that bave to brlDi an tbae thiDls tOietber aDd took place in 1967 in Madhya Pradesh allO brinJ about a harmonious compro- Assembly. I feel tbe pinch or it as 1 had beeD mise. If split aDd meraer are permitted, tbeD throulh it. Some members or our party this 'eaisiation may not be effective. It is c:rossed tbe floor and the process which started for cooaideratiol'l wbether lucb paradox caD in Madbyat Pradesh spread to other parts of cODtinue and whetber Con,reas (I) would be tbe country Jike caDCCI'. in a position to watch the interests of tbe poor minorities as also tbe linluiltie minority who might be adversely affected with tbe Tbrouah tbis House, J would like to eDactment of this leaisJation. coavey my conaratulat:oae to you, and iD particular to our YOUD, an,d dynamic Prime Minister. Shri Rajiv Gandhi, as Shri Dala and As everyone bas welcomed this BiU so Shrimati Vidyawlti have already Ita ted, who do I, but I would tite to warn tbe Govern- hu aelected an appropriate day to briDI ment that tbe people from different regions forth this leaillatioD. i.e., lOth laDuary, which fiabt elections sometimes apm!t Conpess (1) is martyrdom day of Mahatma GaDdbi. It aDd IOmetimea they make all iaDce witb appears we will succeed in our Objective. Coqress (I) aDd manage to let majority. These thinp should be brouaht to the notice or the people aDd this tendency sbould be I also thank the hone Law Minister who curbed. I( this Bill is able to socceed in these has accepted aU reasonable amendments and objectives. tbCD tbe unity of the country wi] DOW they stand part of tbe DiU. Now this be strenathened. A Bill sbould also be intro-l Bill will blve DO loopholes. duced to divest religion and caste from politicl. There were many apprehensioDi abou this Bill durin. the last eiabteen years Many important people spoke on it but that. Uarortuutely, tbe assassin, of Sbrimati idea could not find manifestation iD coDCfCtee Indira Gandhi were two siths. As a result, form. I am reminded of a couplet:- there is a fcelina of illwill .pinst tbe whole f1I the Sikhs community and they are looked at with IUspicioD. They cannot even express froM iHJndhlG hun, lollG hUll, loti .taJu,ua themselves. They SAy that tbey will Dot live Kahill Gi8G "G ho Jay. J(Qhi" vaila "a Ito jay•• in lodia any more. This is their ianer fcelina. with a ItroDl will and determinatioD even the No aikb is iavolved in whatever is impouible can be Kbievecl. Thil baa beeo,.~ 6appeaiq ill the Prime Minister'S and proved dorin, tbe ODe month leadership of Presideat's oIice. They beloq to HiDda, Sbri Rajiv Gaoom. We are proud of this. Tbe JaiD or other reliaioa' but these communi- future aeneratiODs will remember tbit aDd ties are Dot beiDa blamed therefor. Is the will thank Shri Rajiv GaDdhi for Fttinl this aatire Sikh COIDDWDity responsible for BiU passed. Yau have responded to tbe Iadira Gaoclbits assassioatioD? A complet. lcelin.. of the people. 1 know that tbe picture should be preseDted to tbe HODle in commOIl man outside tbis HolUc bu bit own this reprd. Wby are the Home Minister and .oubtt. When we travel ill tail aad tampoa tbe Prime Minister maintaiDiD, silence over tbey uk UI whether we will be able to pall this iJeue? Tha'elore. tbere should be a tbil Bill. Thi' it the Brat time when we could separate departmcat for liviD, assistance to declare with our beads held biah tbat tbis cvay perIOD. COIIUDQnity.linauistic ,roap or Bill will certain), be peuod. WbeD poople rCllioD aocl oal, tbeD the object of this Bill will bear OD tbe radio thit ~eDial tbat lAr WIll be adaien4 aDd t'e iot.ity of the SabOl hu paIIICI tbll Bill, we will certaia1, OOUIltl'1 will be IftIIDtaiaed. rile hiah in their IItI_tion. We must tbaak 121 ClJt71tit.titllf MAGHA '0, 1906 (SAKA) (52nd Amdt.) Bill 122 the House for the special riahts siveD moved by the Govemment because I thint &0 us. by deletiDI a part of the Bill throuah tbn ameadment. ,he Bill will JOIO its objective. We had boped that by brinlinl such a Bill, the I would like to submit that a man phenomenon or defections, splits win be pIIt adopts throe attitudes. i.e., criticism, protest to aD eod and consolidation of parties iD aDd reyolt. I am hiShly obliged to Shri Sen India win Itart, but it is like big cry little tbat he bas kept alive criticism and protest w~I .. It is of course correct that throuah but bas been able to control revolt. Members thiS lifeless Bill lome beaiDnioa baa beca behave differently iD the HouCie but eveD then made. they let re.pect outside. Now tbey will not let that respect. Dagaji has protested and behiDd that protC$t there was respect for the {Ellg/is"} best tradition. of democracy and I believe tbat (rom today oDwards there will be polari- It is a first step and I Itep in the rilbt lation of ideas in this country', democracy. direction and I laope it it DOt 10iDi to be I heard Prof. Dlndavate carefully. Tbis is our tne last. first step in the directioD of polarisatioD. People are uking why tbis Bill was not passed earlier to dea1 with the :Aya Rams, and [Translation] Oaya Rams' The reason is that we needed a '8alram' to deal with them and today we Many cfauses in thil BiU require impr0- have Balram in the chair. We also have a leader vement, which will be done by and by. 0l1I' like Shri Rajiv Gandhi. Through this amend- party tbinks on these lines because- ment, Sen Sahib has kept alive freedom of ~xpression and we are, therefore, bighly [Engli.rh] obliged to him. It is our firm conviction that the rebels within the Party, who sullied -we are stHl tide in , our wouods. democracy. will be discarded by the public. [ rrQIIslatitJlI] The wounds of our boD. friend Madbll I do DOt wish to name anybody but tbe Danda'l&teji and othen healed up aa Similar is the case of the provision that every step we take is tbe consequence of regarding split. Split, J think. is a purified the precfedina steps. defection. When one Member leaves the party. then it is called defection and when 40 [Translation] Members leave the party en masse then it is called split. This means that you .are giving licence to the 40 Members. 1 think tbat- You have taken only wrona steps till DOW. At least this step is correct and I hope that the followioa steps will also be correct. As has [English] been mentioned in tbe President's Address, the election law will be amended and many -It is a hjstory of splits and mergers thinls will be included in it. The media is and there are more splits than mergers. utilised by only a single party. Now everyone will get a chance. Mention has been made about providing fundi for the election so [Trans IQlion] tbat money·poIitics is put an end to. Of course. some mergers took place but I want to repeat two tbinas wbich I every time tbere \\85 split in the party. The mentioned earlier while supportiDa the BiIl- Party of which I was a member, split into I oppose the amendment to clause (2)(c) and three parties 3S years ago. That party split secondly. the claule pertaininl to the split into four parties. Every party then split into should be deleted. This is my submission. one or two parties. The party was formed and then it split. Again it was formed Ind alain it split. This process of split and merger was [English"' quite painful but we could not do any thiDa. SHANTARAM NAIK (Panaji): We could not develop two party system SHRI Madam Chairman, this CoDstilution Amend- or three party system in this country. On the ment BIll is not only going to be unique other band the process of forming and but historical one also. I do Dot think in spIittinl of parties went OD. It is ea.y to form the entire world or Jeaislativc history there a pany. People like Haji MastIn also form is any Parliament where in a democratic a party. A party can be formed with one country, a democratically elected leader with- man. There wm be a manifesto of the party in three weeks of his p.ining power bad and he wjJ) on making statements. There ,0 brought lelislation of such historical impor· is no discipline in the matter of forming a party. tance I don"t think either in European cont- inent or America there i. atly paraUel to tbis legislation. Therefore, not' only the cntire country but also the entire world is 10iDI to look to Rajivji for brinling forward this For the fint time in the COUDtry, 'We are legislation. tryina to create lome discipline in the party system. I think even opposition members altho- Ulh in tbe guise of lupportinl the Bill bave [Translation] lot of criticism y~t in tbeir heart of heart. they will be Ippreciatinl tbe efforts of And you do not want that. You want tbat Rajivji to brioK in this lClislation. Some say we should be content with wbatever we are because we are 400 here we do not mind aettiOI DOW. brinliDa this lelislatfoD. Yet it mUlt be remembered that Auembly elections are [Engllah] aoin. to take place very .hortly aDd on the threAhold of the Allombly eJection. we are briDaiDI forward thlllqlllltiOD. That proves But .s I aaidlit is • ri&bt step aDd in the riaht the bonlfides or tbe lII_r. aDd tbe party directioD. I know that Albert Einstein said for brinaial I" IIItl"lioD. 12S Constitution MAGHA 10, 1~ (SAKA) (52nd Arndt.) Bill 1~6 I \\oul" also like to submit that this SHRI SHANTARAM NAIK: Secon- diflease of def~ction is not only limited to dly. tbis Bill is partial towards Speaker or India but in 1931 Sir MacDonald in order Chairman in the sense that the Speaker or to remain Prime Minister defected to oth~r ChaIrman is authorio;ed by thIS Bdl to resign side with three MPs. This happened in U.K. from the party to which he or she belonged which is considered to be (tIe mother of when he or she assumed office. Similarly, democracies. Subsequently peopl~ like William when he ceases to be the Speaker, he i~ Gladstone, v. ho were considered to be cham- entitled to join back his party, but there I pions of liberal Party defected for the pur- suggest that some lime limit should be tilted. pose of getting the post on the Board or For instance, afler the Speaker is elected and Trade althougn later on he becam~ the Prime \\ Ithln a short lim~, say one year, he ceases Mini:;ter aim. ( am told that even Mr. Chur· to be the Speaker, there will be four years ~hiJJ defe\:ted. Why I am saying all this IS for him to think, \\-herher to join his parent to point out that it is not only our party or not. ThIS option is against the spi- country \\ hich is prone to thIS disease but it rll of Ihis law. The Law minister ml)' kindly is there io other countries as \\ell consider Ihis SHRI A.K. SEN: Churchill never defe- Further, there IS a conflict between cted. He stood from the Conservative Party Clause 15 of the Election Symbols (Reserva· after he Jefr the Liberal Party. tion and Allotment) Order, 1968 and the provi~ion in this BIll, because when a split takes place in a Partkular political party, SHRI SHANTARAM NAIK : May be the Election Commission is authorised to be did on certain principles. What I am trying take a decision under Clause 15 of the Elec- to dJive at ;s that this di5Case IS nOl only tion Symbols (Reservation and Allotment) prone to India but is there in other count- Order, 1968, and when a split lakes place ries also. within the meaning of this Bill, it will be decided by tbe Speaker. Two kinds of splits Secondly, I had moved an amendment are to be decided by two different authorities to 1 \\ hich the hon La\.. MiD~~ter has been I appeal he Law Minister to consi- pleased to accepr. This amendment pertains der it. to the point that suppo.~ng I am in Goa on Saturday ~nd fall sick and there is a "hip Trnnslation ..' for me to be present OD Monray as per the earlier Bill I could stand dl!lqualified. If \ am absent even 00 this account. Therefore. SHRI LALIT MAKEN (South Ddhl) : my friend Shri Priya Ranjan Das Mun'hi and Mr. Speaker. Sir, I want to congratulate myself propl1sed the amendment \\ hich the the Pnme MiDlstcr and the Law MiDISler for hon. M iOisler has been pleased 10 accept. both brin~mg tbis Bill as well as makinl However thel e is one as,::ect to \\ hich amendmeDt to clause 2 (1) (c) Just now some would like the hon. Minister to pay attention. friends sallJ that by bringing this amend- As per the amendment prcposed. e\'en voting ment. the objective of the Bdl would be defe- against the party's proposa)) or dIrection ated. I do not agree wllh t his view. Had can be condoned by Ihe political parl~. this amendment not been agreed to, I thICk What J want (0 per§ooally propose is that the democratic sel-up about which we talk only abs~ention should be condoned and not and which we have accepted would not have voting. existed. If internal democracy in political parties is not allowed In the country, the democracy as such cannot survive. For the PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: survival of democracy. it is necessary that That is meant for conscience voting. there should b: internal democracy in th~ party. If the president or some other autho- rity of the party expels a Member or Parlja- SHRI A.K. SEN: Panditji gave per- ment for his actions outside the Parliament. mission to many Members to resort to cons- this will give a fatal blow to the internal cieDce votina aDd it ill in that context. democracy of a pat ty. This historical 127 Constitutio" JANUAR Y 30, 1985 (52"d Arndt.) Bill ]28 Itep pro\'es that our leader and members for his activities outside the House, his of OUf parly have faitb i. democracy and the membership wiU Dot be terminated tben there amendlDeDt which haa been brought is realJy a historical step and (or this I congra- remains no need of retaining sub-clauses (b) tulate the Minister of Law aDd the Prime and (c) of clause 8 whkh require that thf' Minister, J feel sorry that aU of our opposi- parties have to submit their rules and regula- tion partie~ could Dot agree on it aDd they tions. How can you terminate the member. could not reach unanimous decision in this ship of a Member when )'ou have deJeted reargd. All the lime, a)legations have been the provision that expulsion from the party will result in the termination of the member- made tbat the Congress Party has DO faith in democra","Y. But the big step taken by the ship? This has rendertd sub-clauses (b) aod leader of the Congress Party and the dele- (c) of clause S as irrelevant. I therefore. tion of the clause a, well as the amendment submit that both these sub-clauses be omi- tted, to clause 2 (I) (c) show that the Congress Party has faIth in democracy and it believes in the iDternal democracy of a party and it has also proved that some opposition [English] parties themselves do Dot believe in internal democracy. SHRIMATI VYJAYANTHIMALA B4Ll (Madras South): Madam Chairma~, Besides, I would like to say something I would like to congratulate our dynamiC about lub-clause (2) of clause 2 in respect Prime Minister Shri Rajiv Gandhi for pro- of independent Members. It says that if they mising the people of our country a clean join some political party, they wilJ forfeit Government. It can only be possible if we their membership. I am not agreeable to aU have the Decessar.v cooperation and assis- this, The Bill which has been brought here tance of our people. The iostrument to is (or curbing defection. I want to ask how guide the people is our sacred Constitution, the Question of defection arises in respect of The Government has now sought to bring tbose Memben who have no party affiliation? this amendment in this House. An independent Member belongs to no party and I think it is unfair and illegal to termi. nate his membership. The Member who com~s 1554 hI'S. here after winning as an independent candi- date represents the people who elect him and his election is not based OD any ideology, [MR. SPEAKER in the C~air] So he should be permitted to join any party of his liking. His joining any party shouJd Dot be treated as defection. I, there- Mr. Speaker, Sir. I am grateful to you. fore, want to submit that an amendment This amendment is the first step to bring in shouid be brought to the Bill under which a major reform in the very cooduct of the 'he question of defect jon should not arise if Members of this august House. a Member who has been elected not on the ticket of any party and does not belong to any party. joins any polirical party, In the Defection is always undesirable. I do case of independent candidates \\ ho want to not want to educale the hon. members. But join any party after being elected. this should I would just like to say what it means. Defe· not be treated as defection. ction is a word which comes from defect,. Defect means 'to cause to desert, to make defective, to fail, wanting, deficient', ••• _. Now ( want (0 draw the attention of ( I"terruptions) the Minister of Law to sub.clauses (b) and (c) of clause 8. It is imperative to make amendment to sub-clause (b) and (e) of MR, SPEAKER: Desertion means so clause 8. When the lub-clause (c) of clause 2 hal been deleted in which it is provided many things. There are so many CODDota- tbat if a Member is expelled from the party tions, Madam. 119 COnJtilution MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (5llld Amdt.) Bill 130 SHRIMATJ VYJAYANTHIMALA BALI: SHRIMATI VY JA Y ANTHIMALA I have written it down Sir. I have taken BALI: It affects the party, and it affects great pains. Defection means 'the action or the political functioning; And so. this amend- act of failing or falling short of or falting ment is most welcome and it is to the away from the leader, party or cause' Sir, all benefit of all. At this point I would Jike to these are negative and derogatory qualities. I mention that one of our hon. Members-I do would like to say that this amendment will not see him here-from the OPPOSition had surely make the members of every political mentioned that the Government was brinllDg party to b: more dependable for their party this Bill because most of tbe fishes were in and to their voters. Floor -crossIng and the net. I would like to enlighten all the changing parties are not very desirable, Members, especially opposition Members, because this has ruined many a politician in that the fishes are not in the net. but are the past. There have been politicians an a freely, happily, and nicely swimming in the party who have gone to sleep ID the night ocean of Congress Actually I think that and got up next morning to find themselves the opposition needs the net because they are in another party. thanks to the horse-trading so scattered. and therefore few, that they have that was done. all to be collected and put into one so that they do not defect. MR. SPEAKER: I agree with you. They have nol only ruined our partie'i They have MR. SPEAKER: You said that it was ruined the political sct-up. an epidemic Now this is the vaccinatioD. It will clean the society of the epidemic. SHRIMATI VYJAYANTHIMALA BA II : Between breakfast. lunch and dinner SHRIMATI VYJAYANTHIMALA they have changed three parties, It has BALI: There are two opinions on this BIll: become such a mockery. Everybody knows one is of those who want it stronger, and the :hat defection epidemIC hit the Janata party other of those who would like it soft, I like the Asian Flu; and the people were so believe that the Bill should be there in such fed up with their defection tamasha that in a way that no lacuna or loophole. should be 1980, they thre" out these jumping JacKs, left for the Memben or for partiei to bend and brought back the real leader, our or t",ist it in any way they like for their own beloved Sbrimati Indira Gandhi with a selfish and political motives Unless we sweeping majority. make strong lawl and definite rules, imple- mentalion would suffer; and hence I would welcome this amendment, so that it helps So, what credibility do these opportun- everybody. and so that the vested interests, ists have? What respect to they have in the these opportunists do not take advantage eyes of the people? of i! and use the convenience of argument in their own favour and hoodwink the makers AN HON. MEMBER : Who gav~ of the law. So, I once again endorse this support to Mr Charan Singh •••.•••••.•• amendment, and would like to thank all the hon. Members of the Opposition including even the ones \\ ho may not agree-an(f SHRIMATI VYJA YANTHJMALA request them to unanimously pass it. BALI : It reflects very poorly ••••.• I am sorry I would like to speak without interr- uption. SHRI AMAR ROYPRADHAN (Cooch Behar); I rise to welcome .•••• MR, SPEAKER: 1 he interruption and also the appearance of this hon. Member is MR, SPEAKER : Do you rise to a maiden one, welcome Mrs Vyjayanthimala Bali? SHRI A.K. SEN: She is a lady; tbere SHRI AMAR ROYPRADHAN: To is no chivalry. welcome all the Members. 131 Constitution JANUARY 30t 1985 (5:!nd Amdl.) Bill 132 16.00 brs. MR. SPEAI{ER: That was epidemic and this is a vaccinatioD. I welcome this Bill and rise to lend my support to this Bill. I congratulate SHRI AMAR ROYPRADHAN : I think it the hon. YOUDI Prime Minister for taking would have been better if you had taken into the initiative to briDg this Bill forward in consideration some suggestions of Tarkunde this House for clean politics, to develop Committee Report regarding electoral a healthy democracy. \Vet all of us, who reforms This Bill does not contain the long are rea)}y in politics; who are dedicated to po- standing demand for the right to recall. There litics, want clean politics we do not like game is no scope for the right to recall and also of "Aya Ram and Gaya Ram"; we do not proportional representation, which is very like to have a Ram like .' Aya Ram essential for the development of healthy and Gaya Ram"; we do not like to have democracy. horse trading in this country; \O\e do not like aa baa been mentioned by Shrimati Vyjayan- There are chances that the inner thimala Bali that one member in the morning democracy of [he party will be curtailed was in one party, in the afternoon in another down. For the proper development of party, in the evening in some other party democracy, this should Dot be so. I hope and in the night still in some other party. all the sugge!tions will be given due consid- (Intrrrupt;ons) . eration by the bon. Law Minisler. I also hope that the government y,.i11 come up very SHRIMATI VYJAYANTHIMALA soon with further Constitution AmendmeDt for healthy democracy and we must be caut- BALT : That is true. (I"t~rruptions) ious that inner party democracy should not be curtailed in any way. SHRI AMAR ROYPRADHAN : Is the hon. Minister and his leader the younl Prime SHRI KAMAL NATH (Chhindwora) : Minister are really ready to have Mr. Speaker, Sir, we did not see you very a clean slate clean politics for often. I hope you are not getting fed up with tbe bealthy democacy? If it is so, us. We are not getting fed up with then I mUlt say tbat it is not corrcct because you. For several days, we have not seen you of tbe defections in certain parts of the in the Chair; and it is always a privilege to country panicularly in Jammu and Kasbmir- speak when you are in the Chair. a defectors' lovernment (/"t~rrupt;onl) There are instances where all the members defected, (Interruptions) What happened in MR. SPEAKER : \Vhere \\ere you in Haryana? (Interruptions) the morning? SHRI RAM PYARE PANIKA: This is a SHRI KAMAL NATH : Sir! the Const- split. It was declared by tbe Hilb Court. itution (Fifty-second) Amendment Bill (interrupliolU ). which we are discuSSinl today and which seeks to .•... SHRI AMAR ROYPRADHAN : So I warD MR. SPEAKER: I will treat you also you again tbat you should not encourale it; as I treated Vyjayantimala. You must discourage topp~ing of governments. You cannot control toppling of governments only by passing this amendment. Prof. SHRI KAMAL NATH : I am honoured. Madhu Dandavate reminded us about 1967 and 1968 period. All tbe members who were MR. SPEAKER: I hope you do not membeR or tbe Sixth Lok Sabha know it mind. very well. What bappened even in tbis AUlUlt House-one member from this side defected to that side and one member Crom SHRI KAMAL NATH : Sir, she may tbat aide defected to thit 'ide. stand on a point of order. 133 Co",titution MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52nd Amdt.) Bill 131 MR. SPEAKER: My House does not world countrics~ its survival in India is itself discriminale. It gives equal oPPQrtuoity to all. a tribute to our party which has been the major political force for keeping democracy alive in this country for the last three and a SHRI KAMAL NATH : Sir, the constI- half decades, for drawing millions and miJJi- tution (Fifty-second) Amendment Bill which ons of uneducated people into the democratic we are discussing today, which seeks to process. both electoral and political. rectify the problems arising out of defection from political parties has been a matter I the time has come for us to ~hich has engaged the attention of polit:cal think parties and poittical functionaries over the examme our experience, our wide and varied experience in our three a half decades last 20 years, Most of the political panies and democracy, and the and funclioDaraes \\bo were onginally the of in electoral process. participants in discussions for curbing We ha\le to harvest, this experience, we have to learn from this expenence of the last defections do not eXist DOW. We had the PSP the SSP the BJS, the Bharatiya Janata party, three and a half decades. And v.e must bring about ~banges and amendments not in and so on. only our Constitution-because the Constitution covers only one facet of the electoral AN HON. MEMBER: The Congre~s. process-but we also have to bring about changes and amendments in all other SHRI KAMAL NATR : Some parties do enactments concerned with the political not exist now, and somehow, .. (lnttrruptions) process and the democratic process. Sir, whenever I stand up they are always on thEir feet. Sir, tne Constitutional amendment which we are discussing today IS only the farst AN HON ME'ABER: Con~ress SHRI KAMAL NATH : I do not want SHRI KAMAL NATH : In the Se'.. enth to be disturbed, In 1968 a committee was Lolc Sabha, of which I had the privilege of constituted on defections UDder the Chairma- being a Member, I had raised rna ny issues nshIp of the late Shri Y.B. Cha\'an, and there concerning electpral reforms. I had raised were emiDe01s member on it. like Shri Ma- issues relating to cleaner public life so that dhu Limaye, and the late Shri Jaya Prakash Members of Pafliament and State legislatures- Narayan. And we have had introduced 00 many of my friends OD both sides who were the floor of this House in the past, many jn the Seventh Lok Sabha would perhaps proposals for curbing defections, but all recall this-enjoy an image above public these were shot down for one reason or the rep!'oach and porI ray integrity of rublic other. The eJectora) process is one of tbe Jife. On 23rd February, 1983 I had asked foundations of our democratic process. In that a scheme be introduced that all Members the face of failure of dcmocracy aU around of Parliament and Stare LegisJatufts be re- the sub-contincnt as well as in many third quired to file with their respective Speakers 135 Constitutiolf JANUARY 30, 1985 (51nd Amdt.) Bill 136 [ Sbri Kamal Natb ] or confuse this with ideological polarisation and clarity. Because, any political person, annually a statement showing their and tbeir who seck. an elective office, should have kith and kiD'S income and assets. ADd the already his political ideololY, his polilical Speaker of tbe respective Houses sbould thought, his political view, clearly imbedded publish those statements in tbe newspapen. and imbided in him, The root of the problem Sir, I bad myself come to your Cbamber to of defection is the absence of ideological file sucb a statement but you did not accept roherent and cohesive parries. This tendency it and turDed me away by askiog as to uode:- has grown in tbe last ) 5 year•. what rules I was doing that. There has been criticism in tbe press and elsewhere that some of the country's lelislators live beyond their One point which can be raised is that a means. I think now that we have taken the political parry is unknown [0 the Indian first step towards cleanliness in public, we Constitution, only an elected representative is should enact such legislation. known to the CODstitution and not his alle- giance to a political party. It can also be On 17th of November, 1983 speakiog on said that in relation to the constituency the floor of this House. I had again spoken which elects him, the candidate is a repre- on the subject of electoral reforms and the sentative, and not a deleaate, and that we immediate need for action in tbat direction. have to distlOguish between a "representative" Within a few days of the formation of the aod a "delegate". This is only technically Government under the Prime Ministership of or acadomically correct, because under the Shri Rajiv Gandhi, we today are discussing a Conduct of Election Rules, tbe Represent- Constitutional amendment which seeks to ation of the People Act and the notification curb the problem of defection. Some opp- issued in terms thereof, the candidate speci- osition parties are unhappy, but unhappiness fically makes a declaration in the nomination is, many a time, a product of procrastination. form as to which party has sponsored him. For 20 years there have been debates, dia- In fact, be has to produce a letter, signed by logues, discussion, Committees formed an office-bearer of the party. This, in itself, and reports submitted. Those reports is the recognition of the bOdd which exi!'ts are lying in various libraries with ants between the candidate and his party. When over them. And even today we have an tbis bond is terminated on the floor or the amendlMDt moved by some Members of the House, it automatically briDls about a termi- opposition that this Bi)) be referred to a Joint nation of what that bond yielded. So. the Committee. I do not know the fate of it. point which I am trying to make in tbis case But tbis would agaio' be giving the whole is, whln the bond, which is on his nomination aspect of defection a sleeping pill, Now, we paper and his consequent election, is termi- should not give a sleeping pill. but we must nated, it also terminates what that bond inject antibiotics 50 that we can do away with yielded. 20 yearl experience of discussions, debates, comm'ttee report and all that once and for al)' So, I think this is tbe time to act. This Tbere has been increasing cynicism affection for defection sometimes becomes towards political life or the country as such, patently inherent when we hear some of our it is imperative that we hold the bull by the frionds adopting delaying tactics. The pro- borns and enact a legislation to curb tbe posed Act and the atep being taken in today's problem of defection straightway. Bill is that tbe representative elected on a party ticket commits a breach of faith to the electorate by sbifting biB party loyalties on I will make one suggestion and point the floor of tbe House and tberefore, becomes out one loophole. My suagestion is thai this inelilible to continue as a people·s represent- amendment should apply to all elective offices. ative. This is based on the analogy that tbe contested 00 party .ymbols, inc1udinl the very praces of election creates a tie or municipal elections. We must cover the alleJiance in the eye of the electorate between entire spectrum, the entire gamut. of elective tbe representative and what be .tood for at office Then only can we move towarda curb.. the time be contested election.. We should ina the ICnsil of this polilkal ovil. This is not confaue this with change of conviction, important. Thil dort is not merely to help 137 COfUtitulion MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKI4) (52nd Amdt.) BIU 138 ODe party or anotber party. This is Dot a The problem is that they are oDly Ie political move, this is for all or us. When one Stale. So, what I am sayinl is atfcain. we pass this Bill, it will be a moral move. him not a financial, economic or locial move, It will be a moral move which we will be My suggestion is that on'y those partie. makina. should contest tbe Lok Sabba poUs which are represented in at least three States aDd Coming to the loophole, the disqualifi- also that in each of these States tbey must cation arising out of defection in this Bill is have a minimum of five percent leata to only a partial deterrent to a person who enable them to contest the Lok Sabha poll. defects because of inducement of office for the defector can be appointed a Minister for SHRI NARAYAN CHOUBEY: What six months, without contesting any election. he says and what he will say, on tbat _ It is true he wiJ) have to seek election within should be consistent. lose his seat after six montH. But he can be appointed as Minister for six months by the party, which may be in office, to which he SHRI KAMAL NATH : We mUlt Dot has defected. This is an inberent weakness allow our party system to get splintered. of this Bill. We have not fully and totally This is important because events will overtake prevented what we are trying to .tem, In us and fragmentation of political constitUCDta the short run, anYODe can avail of tbis in parliament will take place opportunity. I would suggest that there 5houl~ be some sort of deferreDt, that he can- not hold a Government office, or that he Everybody has condemned def'ectiODl. cannot seek re-election for a couple of years, 1 he press has condemned it, the political say, six or eight years. parties have condemned it, the political functionaries and tbe poluical lumioaria bave condemned it. but up till now DOlbina The problem of immorality in political was done towards curing this cancer. It is tife requires to be attacked on all sides. on our Government under the leadenbip or the political, legal and ethical plain as well. Shri Rajiv Gandhi whach has taken the fint We must prevent the mushrooming of step towards cleaner public life. So let us small parties aDd State parties. Standing on all join hands irrespective of which aide of the floor of this House-when one of the the House we belong. debates was going on the 17th of November, 1983,-1 had made a suggestion tbat only those parties should contest the Lok Sabha MR. SPEAKER: You address me. polls which have got representation in at least three States, bel.ause we cannot make the Lok Sabha into a District Board. SHRI KAMAL NATH : Sir, I .... thinking of the ruture; tbey are tbiakiq 01 the past. I am letting your sIgna I. J will just concJude. Maoy years later wben our proaeay enter the library and archives of Lot Sabba, SHRI NARYAN CHOUBEY : I do not to look for nUlgets of wildon let them DOt know why he has to refer to the earlier find that the miles of proceedmp are jOlt period of 1981. 1982 and 1983. emplY invectives and outpouring from OOD- constructive minds. But let tb(m Ind that me MR. SPEAKER: Don't you appreciate Eighth Lok Sabha in its initial days root the Mr. Cboubey, bow consistent he is first step towards stemming and cotr.:ctiDl tbe malady of political immorality and degeoera.. tiOD. SHRI KAMAL NATH: Sjr, it takes times for them to understand. If tbey had understood it earlierJ that would ha'le lolved M~. SPEAKER. : DoD't loot bact, the problem. when you speak. Look at me. Don't look 139 Constitution JANUARY 30, 1985 (5Jnd Amdt.) Bill 140 back. You say you don't talk or the past. So won as a member.of tbat party. It was a look rorward. controversial clause althoulh the framers of the BiJI had kt'pt that clause. Much could be said for that clause also. Even tbe oppo- SHR.I JAGAN NATH KAUSHAL sition Pa.rties are not united on that matter. (Cbandigarh) : Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am 5peak- Even today one hone Member from the iog almost at the fageend of the debate. opposition has said that this clause should have been retained in the Bill itself. He feels MR. SPEAKER : Valedictory ? that without that clause, the Bill dO\!s not go the whole hog. But as I said. it is a matter of controversy. The hone Prime Minister SHRf JAGAN NATH KAUSHAL: assured the OppOsition leaders that either As bas bern stated on both sid~s of the there should be unaoimit,), on this clause or HOWIe, this problem was before the count. y he would think over it. And the hone Prime prominently since 1967. Attempts were made Minister as the Jead~r of the Congress-J to frame a law and, in fact, two Bills were Party put that matter in his own Party. As I iDtroduced-One Bill could not become the said, there was a difference of opinion even law, because the Lot Sabha was dissolved and in our Party. His assessment was that more the second BiIJ which was introduced duriog people wanted that clause to be withdrawn . •be Janata time, also could not become law, Therefore, he, as a Hue democrat. accepted because of the opposition within the Janata that this clause be dropped because some Party. Opposition Parties do not want it aDd some Members of our Party do Dot want it. S(l, later on the matter was aaain examined he has thought that there is no unanimity IJODg with orber electoral reforms. And wheD there. I was in charge of tbe Ministry of Law and JUitice, I held an assurance to the House that so far as 'his particular matler of curb- PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE in, ddection was crncerned, the sub-Com- (RajapuT) : Even difference Cllt across party mittee of the Cabinet had formed ilS tenlan- lines. live opinion. And we wiJI discuss this mailer "jlh the orposi.ion Parlies along witb the other electoral reforms which were also b:ing exa- PROF. :N.G. RANGA (Gunlur): Yes. there is democr3cy. mined by the Cabinet Sub-Committee. I am glad, Sir, tbat UlUrancc has been fulfilled today. I toDaralulate Sbri Ashok Sen, the MR. SPEt\ KER That is what present Law Minister. But IIKlre credit is due democracy is. to the boo. the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister was very teen about it. In fact, this fOlmed ODe of the items in tbe President's PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE : I am , Addrcu and allhou&}t we all koew that this con&ratulaling him. Mr. Ranga, don', be present session would be a session of a very aDlry. abort duration, it was categorically said in the PresideDt'. Address itself tbat this woold be passed iDto law in the preleDt lCIIiOD. SHRI JAGAN NATH KAUSHAL : Sir, ADd Sir, toda, it is tbe culmination of the the very basic fact which was appreciated deliberations for the last 20 yearl. and formed the foundation of tbe presrnt Bm is that for the first time, politka) party How, Sir, as has been stated by both is being recognised in the Constitution itself. sides of the House, it is a very we Icome Otherwise, the Coostitution was always talk- measure. The couDtry as a whole will appre- iDg of a Member of Parliament or a Member ciate and the controversial clause has DOW of a State I.egislature. The Constitution did been dropped by an of6cial amendment which Dot talk as to which party he belollsed to. illoml to be moved presently. That clause But now, for the first time, in the Schedule .. was, if a penon was expelled from a politiral it bu heeD stated what was inherent in the part" be should allo IDle hi. _t wbich be Representation of People, Act. 141 COlUtilutlon MAGHA 10. 1906 (SAKA) (12nd Am",.) Bill 142 Now, if I draw ,our kind attention to where we are borrowing most of the things, Ef.2. in Clause 2, there is an Explanation it is the part)' which fights the election. which reads : I was lookir:g into a very cekb1a1c4 , '~D elected member of a House shall be author, Sir Ivor Jennmgs, who gives a very deemed to beloDg to 1he political party, graphic descnption as. 10 what part IS pJa)ed jf any, by which be was set up as a dunng the election by polilical parti.:s and, candidate for election as spch member;" with your permissioD, Sir, because I cannot Imprlwe upno his language, J would like 10 lead a few IIn':.s which he has- written. The It has been pointed out on the floor of large part played by the party in the election tbe that fiks House when any person his of a candidal~ has been Je~cribed by Sir Jvor DOmination paper, he has also to file a decla- JennIngs as f~JJows : ration as to wbether h~ has been set up by .any political part)' aod, if so, the name of that party has to be mentioned. That party "The ~uccessfuJ cacdidafe is almost in- bas to give a certificate that that person is variabJy rc[Urned tl) Parliament. nC't their official candidate. Then, a symbol has because of his personolity nor because also to be aHotted which is reserved for that of his judgment aDd capacity, but party. Therefore, it is now recognised that because of hiS part)' Idcel. His persona- tbe persons beloog to those p01itical lity and his cap3city are a like unknown parties. to the great mass of his constituents. A good candidate can secure a number of votes becallse he is good; a bad candi- MR. SPEAKER: What happens jf 10 date can lose a few because he is bad. or 11 Independents wanl to form a group or Local party organisation~. therefore, do something like that '! their best to ~ecure a candidate of force and character. But his appeal js an appeal on his party's policy. He asks JAGAN NATH KAUSHAL : I SHRI his constituents to support ihe funda· am at the first stlge when a nomination paper mental ideaJ which his party accept~ 1S beiDa filed. His own electioneering is far le~ impor- tant than the impre!slon which his party PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: Do creates in the minds of electors. They 'YOU propose to become aD Independent, vote for or against the G·JVcrnment or Sir? ror or against the pany to wtlich he belongs. The 'national' speaker who COUlCS to a constituency to urge electors MR. SPE.o\KER : If you make me so. to support the candidate probably knows nothing of him. He commends the candidate be.;ause he supports the SHRI JAGAN NATH KAUSHAL . party; be would condemn him with equal You are already Independent in 8ction. pl~a5ure, jf he di~ not. Many of tbe I am at the St8gc of filing the nomina- posters are prepared and circulated by tioD paper. When .he nomination paper has party headquarters. The candidate's been filed aDd a symbol has been issued. then tbe elections, as we alllcnow. are fought on own posters ernpbasizl! his party affilia- those symbols. tion. He poss-:~ses an organisation because ,th.: party supporters in the local.ty - stimulated. if necestary by the I! is rutile for anybody to say that lakhs party headquarters -believe in the plrty and lakhs of voters vote ror an individual. affiliation sufficiently strongly to give Tbey vote for the party; tbey vote for the time and trouble to its work." pany symbol and tbey vote lor the party proarammes, ror the party manifesto. We all tao. that Dot onl), in this country but even This is more true in our country whele to tile couDtries outside, like. U.K. from the size of a constituency, as we aU know, 143 COMt; lutiQ,. JANUARY 30, 1985 (5211d Amdr.) Bin )44 [ Shri JI.In Nalh Kaushal ] All other provisions Ire, reaardilll ~pliL. merler eiC. I do nor thiok much criticism variel from 7 ]akhs to 10 lakhs of people. It has been made on them. In fact. no criti- R, in fac:t, the party which 6ahhi the election. cism has been made on them because split Therefore. it is but inhcc.:nt in the situation aDd metier are two realities which we have that people who come to rarliament or State to face and we hav~ laid down in the Bill leaislatures as a nominee of a parry should that for a split, at least one-third of the .coDtinuo to belon. to that party. people should form that opinion and for a merger, at least two-thir J of the people In fact, it ii a very simple Bill, as it should form an opinion. .tands. The controversial Clause has been takcn out. Now the Bill is very simple If he resiao! from that polilical party, on the I think it is a very valid measure. label of which he won thc eleclion, the least Regarding the rule of thumb, earlier the what should be done is lhat he should forfeit Janata Government had looked into it They hiS" seat. Some hon. Members are even iaid 2S}; is good ('nough. We said "No. SUI,estin. that Dot only he should forfeit his Not 25% but one-third," Somebody may seat. be sbould be disqualified for a number say one-third is not enouah, it may be more. of year. more. Some people have lone to Thele are all matters of policy and rules of tbit Jeo,th. They .ay mere!y because.be loses thumb and we have to work and afler work- hit leat, it is not enoulh punishment, he ina. if we feel that the results we want to Ihould be dilqulli6cd for a number of years. achieve arc not beina achieved, Parliament is But we have Dot looe to that leglth. For supreme. Parliament can again come back with another measure. tbe moment. we are OD this that he should 10Ie hi. leat aDd ,0 back to the electorate by cellini them uI have renounced that party. One or two more points were raised. Now I am comins OD the ticket of another My senior colleague Mr. Ashok Sen will reply par.,'., or "I am cominlas an independent to them. person, Would you elcct Ole 1" ODe poiDt was raised as to why there Now the Iccond Clause which again, are two authorities under the constitution. ~iDa to us, is I very simple one and it the Ejection Commission, for deciding some tWI can: of what Prof. Madhu Dandavate disqualifications and the Chairman or the Aid. namely "Do Dot kill dissent comple- Speaker, tbe presidin& Officer of the te., because dissent is the Cl5Cnce of demo- House, for deciding some other disqualifica- cracf' and we have taken care of it in the tions. It is much too simple a measure, It aause itself. Clause (b) says; jf you vote has only to be decided whether he has voted qainst the mandate of the party, then, surely against the party. It has to be decided you are violatinl the party dilcipline and you whether be has resigned from the party. are actinl alainst the party mliOdate. But, I do not think we should give this matter for surely, there can be lome penon who says the decision of tbe so.calJed authority, the "well, what you are doina is alainst the vcry courts or the Ejection Commission, which ideoJo,y of the party. WiIJ you permit me ultimately is again subject to the jurisdiction to vote against the party but I will see the of the court. I think it is a much simpler Goyernment docs not faU r' The party may measure and Mr. Ashok Sen was very right permit him, I say party may. Or even if he While saying "Do oot prolong this matter, vote. aDd latufies tbe party later on that "I This matter should come ,to an end within di.1 not do loythinl for my personal gain but the quickest possible time." 1 do not think it i. my comcieDce which did not permit me there is something monstrously wron, in to IUpport thi. particular staod of yours io puttioa this burden on the Speaker. Speaker the Parliament", and he satisfies the party, is a high dignitary from aU angles, He is the party may condone the .apse. totally independent. He may belong to a political party, But while decidiD, luch It is a very simple measure so far as it matters, he 15 independent. And we expect Joet aDd that il why there is an almost un- such a high dilnitary to briDa about imparti- anlmoUl welcome from all sides of the House. a!ity in a decision on this matter. 145 ConstitutIon MAGHA 10, 1906 (S,fKA) (52nd Amdt.) Btll 146 One of my hon friends just raised the SHRJ P. KOLANDAIVELU tGoviche- question: way have you brought in indepen- ttipalayam) : Respected Mr. Speaker, Sir. on dents in this not11ndependcnt is an indepen- behalf of my party, the All India AnD a dent. He forgets the base. The basic idea is DMK I I welcome this Bill; we welcome the this. When he went to the electorate, he told spirit, the aim and the purpose of thiS Bill. everybojy t I do not like any of these political parties these political parties are so arrogant that they did not ai\'e At the outset I would say that. as soon to a person jike me the party ticket and, as the Bill was introduced in this august therefore , I will fight independently.. Now House, the ruling party got a victory: in let him stick to what he told his electorate. Madhya Pradesh, the State Unit of the He has fought independently; he has secured DMKP has decided to merge unconditionally the verdict of the electorate as an indepen- with Congress-I. So, the ruling Party has dent candidate. Therefore. he must got its first victory. In India, politics has continue as ao independent candidate The degenerated into manoeuvricp, leg-pulling. moment he loses his independence. he is back-stabbing, spJitril'lg and defection. all subject to this law because the very base is for t!le sake of power, all for the sake of the promise he made to the electorate tbe; money. electorate was the fjnal authority which decided that he was a fit porson to be Here I have to appreciate and congra- elected because he was independent ... tulate the Prime Minister for having fulfilled the promise he made. On the first day of MR. SPEAKER: What about m,y query assumption of his offJce as prime Minister, about 15 Independent ~.1embers getting he told the peopJe that he would give a clean together ... government. I would like to quote here Robert Frost's verse. I would remind Mr. Speaker and other han. Members that, when SHRI JAGAN NATH KAUSHAL: Panditjl was the Prime Minister whenever Now this is impermissible he went to his office, he would' first read Robert Frost's verse and then only begin his MR. SPEAKI:R : He IS giving a ruJjng~ work. Robert Frost's verse read: PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: If "The woods are lovely, dark and deep, they do that, they will be made independent But have promises to keep or Parliament. And miles to go before I sleep And miles to go before 1 sleep." SHRI J"-GAN NATH KAUSHAL: , Now this IS impermissIble. Therefore, I So, the promise is being kept, tbe alrec with the .... promise is being fulfiJIed, by the young Prime Minister. I have to say that the Prime Minister has given enough time to the Opposition SHR1 S. JAI PAL REDDY Parties for discussion, for deliberation, with (MnbbubnalaJ): Can) setk a clarification? regard to this Bill. SHRI JAGANN~TH KAUSHAL: I am not yieJdiDI. I thank once again the Prime Minister for having given such In opportunity for all the Members. 1 have to sayan old sayinl-~o I conclude by saying whal Prof. Madhu before-warned is to be fore-armed. So ,. Dandavate ha~ said. On this sol.mn day we such saying would be appropriate at this have taken a step and that is a step which juncture because a warnio. has already certainly will brin. credit to this ParJiament been given, not now but for the last 20 that they have taken a very bold step. which years back So, according to the warniDI. could not be taken for 'he last 20 years, in you are fore-armed with tbis Bill. But this order to clean the public life. is the right timet tbe time is ripe enoulh for 147 COlUli,,,,;oll JANUARY 30, 1985 (52N1 AmdI.) Bill 148 [ Shri P. KolaDdaivelu ] In opportunity to say a fe.. thinas about this Bill. brinaiDl ,hi. Bill. But this Bill ouaht to bave been passed in this aUIUS' House some Political defections have polluted our years back. but, unfortunately, the BiU was parliamentary democracy and it is, therefore, Dot paned. Actually it ha' come in the that we were the first in the counlry in Jammu proper time aDd that too in the year of and Kashmir that we enacted a law on youth. 1985 is tbe year of the youtb. So the younaest and the youna Prime Minister who political derections aDd when I came to tbe has brou,bt tbis Rill is tbe correct person Seventh Lok Sabha, J moved a Bill, the Anti- to deal with the BiU and the BiU is ,oin I Defection Bill al a private Members' Bill be passed. wbich met the usual fate which all private Member's Bills meet Moreover, I hive to say thi. yelr happeD. to be tbe CODtenary year of the MR. SPEAKER But your wish i. ConIfOll Party. Por the last 100 yean beinl fulfilJed now. both sidea of the politiCS blve been silted with mud and it has been silted with dirt PROF. SAIFUDDIN SOZ; Now that Ind all that dirt i, being washed away by lhe Central Government has brought this Bill this Bill in order to live a clean government. here, I rise here to welcome tbit measure aDd I once alain.... heartily cODgratulate the Prime Minister for particularly having prolonged djscussiOlls SHRI S. JAI PAL REDDY: with the Opposition Partiel. Since the Bill Let the AIADMK merge with the was deferred for to-day in order to arrive at (I). Conaresa a consensus, I feel particularly happy and wben our learned Law Minisler made the SHRI P. KOLANDAIVELU : Nat nQ. statement earlier and broke the lood news It is not. that they had come forward for the deletion of sub-clause 2{J) (c) because I do Dot know Actually, our young Prime Minister how tbis proviso had been allowed in the started in his life a. a pilot, Perhapl the pilot BHl becaufC that would kill all democracy in him will briDS a freab breeze of profess- witbin the bouDdaries or a political party. ionalism into Indian politics and I also tell But .ince the Prime Minister rose to the the hOD. Member. tbat chanling party is no occasion and held cODsu)lation. witb the IOJace unleu it lives a definite footbold. So political parties, it shows the intention of the defection certainly will not help aDydody Prime Mini.ter aDd I conaratulate him for aDd moreover I would luaest to the Law this measure. When I make a comparative Minilter that with retard to tbe electorate study or the law that we have produced in there i. no mention in tbe Bill. Blectorate Jammu and Kasbmir and the Bi1I that il il the best' judae and electorate bat to be before me I find that this Bill i, compreheD- mentioned in the Bm and I think proper live particularly in three ways. Firstly, this and luitable action will be tlken by the Law Bill brinal UDder it. purview nominated Miniatey. Membefl. Secoedly, it provides for aplit. Thirdly, it has broulht in Independents also. I thank once apiD. All tbe tbree measures are very welcome and the law that we have in Jlmmu aDd Kashmir PROP. MADHU DANDAVATE : Now State wa. lackiol in .Abele areas and we can tbe voter. have defected. improve it DOW. MR. SPEAKER: II it '} Should we Mr. Speaker, Sir, chore are certain pass a Bill ror that too ? That will be couDter lbinp which require clarificatioD and I would productive to you, Profeuor. Mr. Soz. request tbe bon. Minister to kiDdly clariCy. Pint)y, could we Dot add diaqualificatiODI PROF. SAIPVDDIN SOZ (BaramuJJa): for member.hip wboD tbe parJiameat it TbaDk y~ very much for havin. aiven me competent to create additional diaquIU8catiODI J~9 ConstitutioIJ MAGHA 10 J 1906 (SAKA) (52nd Amdt.) Bill ISO under Article 10:(1) (e) and Article 191(1) (e),? SHRI P. C SETHI (Indore) : lhele J t may be (or my person or for others also. arc derogatory remarks and these should be So. was it necessary to amend the Consti- expunged. tution in the manner in which you have come forward. Secondly. in Jammu and Ka~hmir PROF. SAIFUDDIN SOZ: Su~h are State w~ have a law in force. We hav~ an their qualifications some: of them are illiterate Bnti-defection law and th~t law has not been people. A)) of them have beer. made Cabinet subjected to scrutiny by Supreme Court by Ministers and I say that they do not consti- way of a petition by liS. That I';w is before tute a split and they are defectors. Will the the Suprcrr.e Court for expressing its opinion. government come forward to withdrawing What will happen to that law?' I admit that support. They will have to withdraw support the law we are producing is comprehensive from Shah Ministry. but already we have a law on defeclion. What about that Jaw becauf'c you did not refer to that in your speech 1 Jammu aDd ( lnterruplions) 1C* Kashmir is an integral part of this country. It has its own Constitution and the legislature MR. SPEAKER: The hon. Member is empowered to produce the law and we did. may please take his seat. Nothing goes OD It was PJlssed by our legislature and again record. I have called the next speaker. it became Jaw. It has gone to the Supreme Court for its opinion as we found that J and K High Court's decision on f Tram/aliolll defection law was not in order. I would like the Law Minister to clarify on this. SHRI G L. DOGRA (Udhampur): Mr. Speaker, Sir, 1 am grateful to you that )'OU have provided rue an opportunity to Thirdly, now that we know the intention pa rl icipate in this deb.;ne and to express my of the government-particularly the intention \'ie ws. This is a very important Bill for of the Prime Minister-I would lIke the wh.ich our Prime Minister, Law Minister Congress members were not to let down their and Government of India must be congratu- Prime Minister and come forward and express the;r opinion about the def(ctor government lated. All the se..:tions of the House have weic,omed this Bill and the entire House is in Jammu and Kashmir. (Interruptions) J am unan imcus that this should be passed. Now, only asking for clarifi<:alion becaLKc according 1 would like to say something about th~ to this Bill even all the defectors in J &. K do not constitule a split in our party. point 5 raised by Shri SOL in his spe~ch. According to this law also they are defeclOr ~ and they stand disqualified. (Interruptions.) Shri Soz is a\\are of the fact that this Bill (:ould be extended to Jammu and SHRI RAM PYARE PANIKA: Higl, Kashr n'r only with the consent of the Stale •' Court ruling is there. Gover nment . PROF. SAIFUDDIN SOZ: We ha\e M8.. SPEAKER: Tht-- ha, already been gone to the Supreme Court. That is why I ,ald. If you h3ve an~ thing new to say, you have asked the Law Minister to eX('Ilain. rna: mak~"! your point. Apart from legal question there is a moral question attached to that defe:tion. Among those defectors there are many \\'ho are SHRI ,-:; L. DOGRA : I am raising an ministers but as per their Qualifications they important iss,u: could not become.· MR SPE AKER : This ic; a matter 01 (lnt~,,.uptio,u) the rtasf. You "hould speak about the future * Expunled 8S ordered by the Chair . • ·Not recorded 151 Constitution JANUARY 30, 1985 (5lnd AlIldt) Bill 152 SHRI G, L, OOGRA : This Bill would away Janta Party and this time it has defeated not apply to the State of Jammu and all the leaders of defectors. Thus we are Kashmir, as residuary powers apply to the lagging behind our electol ate. Therefore, a State of Jammu aod Kashmir to a limited pro\ ision has been made in this Bill that if extent only. \1oreover, this is also a cons- any Member defects before completion of his titutional amendment aDd it would Dot apply tenure of five yean" Mr. Speaker, Mr. Chair- (0 the State of Jammu and Kashmir wlIhout man or whosoever is the presiding officer of the consent of the State Government. He the Legislature will take action against him must ha"e gone through the entire Bdl. Split in a party would be defined according and it is a wl!Jcome slep. to the law. There was a split in' your party and 1 would lIke to say that the persons who Our Law Minister has stated that he is cannot ~ontrol the members of their party have removing the irritants and DO Dotice would be no fight to blame others. If they come her~ taken of the expulSion out~ide the House. An and blame the Congre5S Party, raIse hue and amendment ha~ also been brought forward cry her~, it is of no use at all. If you could for safeguarding the interest of a member not cJntrol your party men, they broke away wh,') is unable to be present at the time of from you, there was a split and your party voting due to certain compulsions. Thus was divided into two groups, theo we are Dot this is a Bill which would not be opposed by to be blamed for this (Interruptions) ... they any s?nsible person and he would rather are your own people They split your party sllpport It. We should improve our be- as they were dIsgusted wIth you and your haviour, respect the office which we hold. parry \\ as divided into two 5.eparate groups .. ' raise our morals and awaken our conscience (I11'errllptlVm) , after all they are your own so Ilia! we do not tread the wrong path people. ThOle members were disgusted \\ itll and the people also think that their repr. you due to your actions. which led to a splIt sen!atives are really ideal representatives. in the party and we helped the group whir:h we found to be better. We dId Dot partiC'.i. PROF. SAIFUDDIN SOZ : You with pate in the government. We, therefore, draw support to Ghulam Mohammad Shah. cannot take any action there. You yourself are responsible for the situation prevaleot SHRI G. L, DOGRA : Whom shall we there. support? You? Sir, nobody has paid an)' attentiolJ to PROF. SAIFUDDIN SOZ: You are ODe aspect of this legislation, After thi:s RII talking or values, has been passed, the people of the I!ntire world including India would wonder a t the SHRI G, L, OOGRA : We neither like morals our legislators had on account of you nor them, but we prefer the lesser evil. which thiS measure had to be brought for the We have no other options. present legj~lators as also for future legislators, (lnterruplions) MR. SPEAKER: This Bill wUI be MR SPEAKER: Mr. Soz, you get it passed for the same reason. recommended through me. SHRJ G. L. DOGRA : If we Jool.: at PROF. SAlFUDDIN SOZ : He is talking this aspect, we should not be very happy of values. about it, It means that we do not have an y seir-control, self-respect or political integrit! J SHRJ G. L. DOGRA : We have vaJues. and ~e are least concerned about loyalty aod faithfulness to our party. The people have given their verdict from time to time and our PROF. SAIFUDDIN SOZ : You do Dot electorate has proved to be more intelJiaeDt have values. today. On one occasioD, it removed the Congress and on aaother occasion it threw (In terruption,) IS) Constitution MAOHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (S2nd Amdt.) B 11 154 SHRI O. L. DOGRA: At a place MR. SPEAKER : That is wby I want where therts are quite common and people you to be heard. live in constant daDler, if somebody raises his voice against it, then you call him I lood person ..(Interruptions). How much money SHRI SURESH KURUP: I represcot disappeared from there, where did it 10? a geDtration who are born and brOulht up Why do you compel me to say all these durinl the p:>.t-Independeoce era. All these thinas. years. we have been witnesllO, the ugly twistl and turns in our political life. Sir defection is ooly a part of the disrise that ;ffects our SHRI ABDUL RASHID KABULI body politic. You can check defec.tion to a (Srinaaar) : You do ~I! thb because you will certain exten t by passinl a lelisl&lioo. But lose your security deposit. you cannot raise the quality of nur day-to-day polittcal life by paSlinl a mere lelillation. (interruptiolls) What we n~ed today is that. For that , a general political awakening of the muses is necessary. We. the people of Indil, witneued MR. SPEAKER: This is not the way. such an awakeninl only during the struggle Mr. Kabul;: you are doing a wrong thing It for Ind~pendence and during the struggle will not look nice, what are you doing? aaainst Emergtncy. (Tn terrllptiol1s) Sir, one of my friends here mentioned SHRI G L DOGRA: I would not that the Question of defection came in Indian have mentioned that, but they are un- politics only in the si.cties. I would like to necessarily compelling me to place all these correct him. 1 he question of defection things before you. came in Indian politiCS when the Rutin, Congress belan losinl elections even aftn the first General Elections in i 952 and a Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am thankful to you veteran national leader Shri Rajalopalachari for havinl liven me an opportunity to speak, formed hiS mInistry in the erltwhile Madras I do not want to create bitterness but when State usio& def'!ctors. And I would like to they compel me, I have to reply to their mentIon about the iocident in 19S7. points. MR. SPEAKER: I shall bring about a Sir, I am proud that I beloDI to compromise later on CPI (M) which, all tbroulh these years took a principled stand in IndiaD politics. In 1957, when the first Communist Ministry iD [ English; Kerala w~s formed in fact with a majority of only one member, the Rutinl Conlrcss in SHRI SURESH KURUP (Kottayam): the Cl!ntre tried all the ways to Jure away I thank you for givlnS me thiS opportunity legislators from our fort, but failed. Only to speak .... thcn they o'ganised the infamous liberation struggle, usinl extra-constitutional means, alianing with all the communal and MR. SPEAKER: Speak loudly. casteoist politics in the State aDd at last it culminated in the dismissal 01 that State [Translation] Government. We are ,lad that this Bill has been broupt in by the very same forces You are a youo. man, speak Joudly. which had co,ineered 8J1 the defections durina all these past yeats. BvcQ a day before this particular Bill wa. brQulht before the HOUlt, the Baroda MunicipaJ Council controlled by the Janlta Party wu oulted by SHRI SURESH KURUi': This is my the Conlrelt 1I). usinl defect on. EYeDlS in majden speech, Sir, Sikkim, JclK and Aodbra Pradesh are already 155 Co Jli!lItion JANUARY 30. 1985 (J21td Amdl,) Bill JS6 l Shri Suresh Kurup 1 SHRJ N. VENKATARATNAM (Tenali) Mr. Speaker. Sit, we mentiC'ned here I would fell the Tuling party extend our qualified support to this Bill. Members: 'Now you are painting our Prime Even though the idea of defection carre to Minis1er. Mr. Rajiv Gandhi a~ Mr Clean in the Congress Party in J967 by way of A our politics. But everyone knows th'at his Private Bill, the report of (he committee was the:: 111ind which worked behind the hea\~ed by Mr. Chavan was submitted in curtain. in toppling all these Ministries 19(\9; from 1969, fer long IS years, the •. ' (Interr uptio11 ~) Congress farled to ~et this Bill through. Even though it is too latc, the Congress (I) for I would also like to say that if the the first time, got 3 geod name. ruling party has honesty in bringmg this Bill, it should withdraw its support to the Ministry of Shri G. M. Shah, who is the king defector in our country. The continued As an advocate, I have gOt some doubts. !\UDPort given by the Congress to the abollt thi cally, it win be harmful to our country. I Nov. I in r his Bi II, I he S"eaker and the wonder about the \'ote of il legislator in a Chairman, wh()c\'cr it may be, is the autho. party where elections are not conducted rity that dec'des, a~~ut if. h there not a democratically. and whele all the powers arc contradiction bel"un Ankle 103 and the c(,Deentrated in one hand~ provisions of this Bill? It is \0 be clarified by the hon. La" Minister, Instead of going In this connection. I would like to through this difficult task of amending the repeat something "hich some olher hCln. Constitution, will it nOI be easy for lhe Members have already mentioned. That IS government to amend the Representation of about Article 3S6 of the ConstitutIon "'hich the people Acr, because it disqualifies a allows those at the Centre to dismiss a State member for corrupt practices? There can be Ministry which does not follow its political no more corrllpt practices than promisina line. If we are going to begin a new chapter one thing to the peorle aod doin.. another in our politi(·s, this undemocratic provision thing. eltcted from one party and joining the ~hould be deleted from our ConstitutioD. In other part~. lhen ~ou kindly see section 6. this ,onnectioD, I would also like to mentkn section 7, section 8 (a) and t.ection II(a). that if our SYSlem should be truly demoCTatil:. So, I would venture to ~ugge5t to the Law If our electicn system is (0 be truly demo Minis1er. why can't he amend the Represen- cratic, the ~}'stem or proporti, nal represent- tation or the people Act? The Constitution alion :::hould be intloduced in cur land. In has been acctpted by 'the callier legislators. all these eJections during all the .. e years the government c,n ~\'ojd amrnding it. ex\.ept in one election, the present system ha~ helped the Julirg Congress party to win the elections with a small pelt:entage of votes, The authorilY is given 10 the Chairman and secure a majority of seats. Even in this and the Speaker to decide about thii. I ".-cl- election. wich 50% of the votes, Congress (I) come it. On recejpt of the report from th~ party secured 80% of the seats. So, I request leader of the "arry - we are gOiDI ro diEt;' the Prime Minister and his coJleagues to plioe the parly, 1'101 the House-the Speater introduce proporttonal representation in our goes into the matter. Asain Article 103 comes election system. and start a new ch.pter to ioto effect. So, I would like to remind the ~ur democratic polity. hon. Min;ster to IhiDk over this matter. 157 Constitution MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52nd Amdt.),. Bill IS. [Translation] [English} SHRI SHARAT SINGH (Outer Delhi): SHRr CHINTAMANI PANIGRAHI Mr. Speaker, Sir, 1 rise to support the Bill (Bhubaneswar) : Sir, I am grateful to you that you have given me this opportunity to introduced io the HOllse today and I am participate in this debate. Sir, am bappy thaDkful to our Prime Minister, Shri Rajlv r and ( stand to support and welcome this Gandhi that this aoti·defection Bill has come Bill \\Ihich has been introduced in this House up in the House. Debate OD this Bill is during the first session of the Eighth Lok going on since morning There are no two Sabha. opinions about it that the electorate used to feel very bad about the members who used to cross tbe floor after baving been elected and I am reminded of the poetry of a great the electorate used to ponder as to what type of poet, Robert Forst : members they had elected who betra}ed them and joined another party. but elected repre- sentatives u'Ced to neglect the people because Two ways lead into wooes of their greed and personal interests. They thought of benefitinl themselves somehow or I take to the road least travelled .:her; they used to illd II! in defecliors for their penonal benefit. We are discussing and that makes all the difference. tbis Bill to check defection. I want thar this Bill should be pasxd with overwhelming maj- Sir, there are countries in the world which ority and no loopholes should be left in it. have accepted democracy, but they have DUl accepted socialism as theIr way of Jife. There are countries in the world which have There was a reference to Jamrnu and accepted socialism but not democracy as their Kashmir jUlt now. We know that there was way or life. I t is only India which has aD infilhtiog in their party and in this in- accepted both democracy and socialism. This fiabting the group at relatively less fault was is the unique path that IDdia has chosen an\l given support. Therefore. they, who were we are trying to achi'! ~e this goal of estab!i- involved in infighting are themselves to blame. ~hlng a de(!:~rl'!ic society and socialist order They ahould have taken care of their party. of socitty. In this proctss it is very much They should have run their parry properly. nece~~:try that we uphold the democratic None else is to blame for it. values and democratic inslitlllion~. Thu~ it has been established and it has tClckled down iDto the vitals of our political and public life Another Ihing I want to say is that with to contin~ democracy. It was neces.ssry the J)as~ins of this BiIJ, defection would be that this defl!ction should have been stopped. checked. entire corruption will come to an But during all these years. thouah efforts were end the nation would be strengthened. At and made, they had not succeeded in bringing the would also like to add that same time. I in this legislation till today. tbere ,hould be a check on a party frequently changing its nomenclature sometimes to Lok Oal. sometimes to D.M.K p. thcn B.I{ D., We are very happy lhat the Prime JaDefa Party and Bbarti),a Janata Party. The Mir.ister. Shri RajiY Gandhi had tried to question of such parties meraing into one achieve a kind of conscnsus-rather he has party and fi8hlina election with one symbol taken a rational attitude towards this Bill. should also be settled. He has con§uhed aU lh: Opposnion parties again and again Bnd he has also obtained consensus in the party itself. This shows I tbaaJc you r~r giving me time to apeak. that the Indian National Congress which f' aDd hope thlt tbe country will benefit rrom stood for democratic way of lifc, has done this nMtUUre. I am al.o qmito tMDktul to our its best after it obtained a massive mandate ,oun. Prime Minister for this. by brio.iDI this Bill. I am very happy that 159 COilltitution JANUARY 30, 1985 (5211d Amdl.) Bill 160 Shori Chintamani Pnnigrahi ] keynote address delivered by the Election Commissioner in 1983, between 1967 and everybody concerned has welcomed it. I 1983 there were 2700 defections and 212 hope that the consensus of the OpPosItion defectors had become Ministers and JS Cbief will be utilised. I am happy that the Clause Ministers. Since mornina we have beeL: :i~l.,n 2( c) has been removed-it has been deleted- ina to th e phrase of Ayaram and Gayaram. as the hon. Law Minister has told the House: That is an oUl-datt"d phrase. It is now just DOW. Therefore, it is a non controver- Ayalal and Gayala!. Both the Lals aod Rams sial Bill and I hope: everybody will accept it found their birthplace in Haryana. and without any criticism or amendments it would be passed. But here, I would like to Fortunately, we have Shri Ashok Sen, a submit that 'his kind of defection has be- leading jurist of our country. a. our Law come rampant, only after ]967, though some Minister. So. J would like to know whether members are saying that it started earlier. clause 6 is within the legislative competence But it become rampant why? The Indian of our Parliament. If you go 'hrouah clause National Congress had the majorilY all 6, the procedure suglested therein is summary. through tiJI 1967 both in parliament and 1t is almost analogo~s to Preventive Deten- Stale Legislatures. It was only in 1967 when tion Act. If you refer 10 clause 6(2) the deci- the rightist opposition aDd leftist opposition sion of the Speaker will be deemed to be combined together though having different proceedlDls of the House. 1 welcome the ideologies and yet only one· common pro- ouster of the jurisdiction of the courts under gramme i. e. to ouH the Congress parly out clause 7. When claulie 7 is there, 1 would of power, that thIS malady became so acute. like to know whether clause 6 (2) is required. 1 am very happy that at least all political ]n my view, clause 6 (2) would violate the parties today have agreed that we shall have core of the Constitution, the basic theory of to adopt this Bill. The Bill is before the the Constitution, which has been propounded House and if would be adopted by the House. and enunciated by the Supreme Court io Both Therefore, I extend my whole-hearted support K.eshavansnda Bharati case and in Minerva to :hjs Bill. M ills case. Therefore. I would like tb~ Law Minister to throw some light on this aspect. SHR) s. JAfPAL REDDY (Mahbubnagar): I ri5~ to extend m)' warm welcome to tbis historic rVI rhoulh I have Coming to clause 2 (1) (c), I am really some reservations on certain Clb',lSU of this happy that the Leader of the House and the Bm ruling party were lood enoulh to .aree to delete it, So, I do Dot waot to spend more time on that. MR. SPEAKER : Some resenations even after the consensu~? So far as clause (2) (I) (b) is concerned. SHRI S. JAIPAL REDDY Yes, it should be so amended as to confine itself Sir. to money Bills. it should not be e~tcnded to coyer all kinds of Bills. So. I would request the Law Mainistl!f to ha\e another look My leader, Prof. DandavateJ has rightly pointed out in the morning that this would be at it. a flttinl tribute to tbe revered memory of Mahatma Gandhi and Lok Nayak Jayprakash I am happy that a provision bas been Narayan. I may add that it will also be a made in rcaard to split. But split should not fitting tribute to the memory of Acharya be aHowed to take pJace for personal aain to Narendra Dev, because he had voluntarily members of the break-away ,roup Many resianed his leat in the Lelislature following hon. Members have referred to the reco- hi' resi,nation from the Conaress party. mmendations of the Y. B. Chavan Committee. That Committee had The maJady of defection, as has been made a recommendation tbat a Member' ri,htly pointed by our Law Minister, bas been quittiDI his orilinaJ party should not be deeply affiictiDI the Indian democracy for the allowed to occupy any ministerial office for Jast two decades particular)'. AccordiDI to the at Jeast one year. In Jammu and Kuhmir 161 C.nstilution MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52nd Amdt.) Bill 16~ the split has taken place in the National Secondly, the Speaker should not be assisted Conference. What is the relult? All the 14 by an) of the Committee of the House. To l1Iembers, who quit the National Conference, Jeave luch a grave matter to the individual's have been made Ministers. This Law would discreation of the Speaker is daDproul. not be applied with retrospective effect. So, Apart from tbe penonalllY of the Speaker, it will not cover such cases ... (Interruptions) what is the position of the Speaker? Speaker Therefore, a provision must be inserted in il alwa)s at the command of the majority tbe Bill to see that members of the break· party in the House. away group would nN be allowed to enjoy any ministerial position for at leats one year. MR. SPEAKER That is absolutely wroDI· I have one more point in re,ard to spli t, Logically speakina, no ideological split can SHRI S. JAIPAL REDDY : How be confined to a single House. Such a split is it wrong? f will explain my point. I did II not horizoDtal; it is vc:rtical. )t encom· not mean to cast any aspersioDs. passes both Houses of Parliament and a number of State Legislatures. I am Dot MR. SPEAKER : Before making a referring to· the recent split, because it is Speaker, it might be in the hands of the highly controversial. I alll referring to the ruling gro __ p because they are in the majo. split in the Communist Party in the mid- rity. fifties and mid-'sixties. which were genuine ideological splits. In both those SplIts, the number of Members in the break·away group SHRI S. JAIPAL REDDY But he can be thrown out. in the State Legislature, did not form one. third of the group. Take our own Parliament. While in Lok Sabha a break-away group may MR. SPEAKER : Yes, he can be bave one-third of the members, they may not thrown out. But ras long as one sits on the be one·third in the Rajya Sabha. In such Chair, he is supposed to uphold the lood cases, are they to lose their scats? Therefore. traditions. the concept of split should be so defined as to cover aH the legislatures in the country. I SHRI S. JAIPAL REDDY would request the Law Minister to have a When the Speaker's pOSition iC\ undependable. look on this point. how can we leave such a dehcate matter to the office of the Speaker? The majority of the House i~ commanded by the rullol party Coming to the authority, I am of the ihe majority in the ruling party is alwa~~ con~ide,ed view that tbe procedure laid down commanded in terms of the ruling clique of in article ] 03 would suffice. I do not want the ruling party. In the uJtimate analysis (he the office of the Speaker to be involved in Speaker is at the command of the ruling this Bill at all. Sir. I hold you in great esteem. clique of the ruling party. I am lure, you are not interested in assuming this onerous respomibility. MR. SPEAKER : You are trying to cast aspersions on the Chair, Mr. Reddy. MR. SPEAKER: I am not enamoured of it at all. SHRI S. JAIPAL REDDY : No, SHRI S. JAIPAL REDDY : There are speakers aDd Speakers. In the Andhra SHRI K.P. UNNJKRISHNAN : He is Auembly we hid one Speaker, wbo himself talking of the Office of the Speaker. chanted hi. par.y. He framed a rule that only the ideatity card i ••ued" by him will be SHRI S. JAIPAL REDDY You vaUd. Therefore, _ have Speakers and are an exception to the rule, Sir. As an ex- Speaker.. To involve Speakers in this busin- ception, you are tbe charm of the rule. I ess would be a hi.hly dangerous business. en lay Ihat we have OD)Y one BaJ Ram. J63 Constitlltion JANUARY 30. 1985 (5211d An/dr.) Bill 1~ [Shri S. Jaipal Reddy] Members of Rajya Sabba extraneous 00 considerations. Is it not a bold We do Dot have so many Bal Rams in aU tbe step? I would, therefore. like to State Legislatures. They are tbe Aya Rams thank our youog Prime Minister that aDd Oaya Rams, not Hal Ram. Tberefore, he is not allowin& such perSODS who haye you have to hive that into consideration. My b~n rejected by the people to remain plea is .. oUlside Parliament ! MR. SPEAKER : I am very thankful that you have projected me in such away, 1736 hr!. but there are otber Speakers in the country. That migbt cast aspersions on tbem. Let them live up to their reputation. [SHRI SHARAD DIGHE in Iht Chair] SHRI S. JAIPAL REDDY : But SHRI YOGESHWAR PRASAD I can refer to the role of tbe Speaker. Our (Cbatra) : Mr. Cbairman. Sir. on this day of National Conference fri~nds would not object the death anniversary of the Father of the to tbat. They know what happened there. Nation, Mabatma Gandhi a new measure Tberefore. w: must keep such Speakers in view has been brought bere ar{d it is a very co- when we leaislate that. We must alia keep mmendable step. During the discussion today, tbat class of Speakers in view. Therefore, I both the ruling party and the Apposition have am of the considered view that when the supported the Bill. It would bave been procedure Jays thar down, the Law Minister apprnpriate if the Opposition bad availed of should agree to our proposaJ for tbe forma- tbis opportunity and brought this Bill bef\)re tion of a Judicial Committee on Disquali- the House. They would have ,ot a pat on fications, which could against the Speaker in their back for this. the matter. [Tran&lation_" It i. true tbat durina the discussion to- day, tbe Opposition Members supported the SHRI RAMASHRA Y PRASAD SINGH Bill but they also laye Ycnt to their feelings (Jahanabad) : Mr. Speaker, Sir. the Bill which of opposition to the Bill, though it became has been brought here is being termed both clear that their opposition was weak. by the ruling party and the OpPOSition as a historic Bill. This BiU docs Dot make aov Mr. Chairman, Sir the representatives difference to a person like me, It ha-s , of the people are givcD high reBard and their been broulht at a tlDle wben the situatIOn office is considered respectabJe but today in has started wOfSeoinl. The need to bring this public tbeir name bas become an object Bill has arisen because Members haye life. of reidieule. The character of these represent- started defcctinl and this bas caused Insta- atives of the people was detcrioratin. and bility in politics. it was nccessary to curb this treod. I was a Member of the Bibar Assembly ;n 1967. At that time the Conlress Party In Indian politics, Mabatma Gandhi tried its best to bring dow~ the SVD Goyern- was tbe first person who advocated hlah ment by offering money and allurement of character and aaid lbat tbe representatives office. I was aJso offered an allurement but of tbe people should be of high character so I did Dot rail victim to the same. This Bill tbat the people at larae could follow tbem. . has been brou,bt for tbose Members who This bad become a casualty. But today our rail victim to allurement and cross the floor. Prime Mini.ter bas made a Dew attempt Thil Bill is a courqeous step. In addition to which bas inspired the people afresh and tbis. our YOODI Prime Minister bu taken ao- common maa has appreciated it very mucb other historic and bold step tbat tbc perlOns Wheneyer t durinl elections, we 10 to the who have been rejected by tbe people. i.e., people. there il aD apprehensioD in their who have been defeated in the eJection for mind. whether tbe persoD tbey were aoinl to Lot )a~ha have been al10wed to become elect would come up to the ideal$ be bad 165 Conllitut;on MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52nd Amdl.) BIll bee .. profesliDa for aDd would be able to fulfil OWD brother-iD-Ia,,; the IOD-iD-law .... the promilea he had mlde in his manif.to. alaioet tbe father-in-Jaw aDd aD daat. People are bappy witb this Bill .Ind tbey Ire feeling Itroo,. We are ,raduaUy makina the nation feel that we are ,OiD, to create a c).a All tbil, I mOlt M,. it OD ~ .: atmosphere io the country. Tbil work Ibould the noo·practilinl of health, vaI_ of .... be done with the cooperatioD of everyone and cracy by the rufiDl party. TbeIe II • ..,.. should be welcomed by everyooe. I felt IOrty in Teluau. ·'AI tbe kiDa. 10 it the .....tt. II when my friends from tbe National Cooference the kin, practices moral val .. 01 Ure, up made certaio' aHept ionl wbicb created an boldl digDity, chati., and e\'eI7 ot.. tinge impralion Ihal tbey themselves were not Itronl theD tbe people also "ill pr'llCdle all •• and 8' if it wat the reapoDsibility of tbe But, OD abe otber band, if lbe tiaa II .... CoDlress Goycrnment to run their Govern- io tbe opposite man .., tbe peopIe..wiIl .... ment. There wal a time wben they had come beba YO in tbat maD ocr. to power because of the Conll'CSl Govern- ment but tbeir deeds have brouaht them to this polition. And al luch who it to blame So, . in this WI)'. they ba. DO ....to for tbi.? Our Tcluau DeIsm friendl bave fecI 10 elated oa the introductioD of .. tried to crilicilC in lome other way. They BiU. Havinl damapd the IDdiu po""" a110 tried to criticise our leader in one way or so lonl a time. perhaps, tbey tboaablll tbII be other. They bave made this Amendment juncture at leut, if they do DOt ..... ill ..... the basil or lheir criticism. Thi. Amendment direction, there will be &reater 4n='. 1M gives the ri,bt to say correct tbiDP within tbey hive awakened at leut DOW. ~. and outside the party. Mahatma Gandhi bad I rccl bappy tbat tbi. Bill bas beoD .... said : duced. But I must say that it does DOt aatillJ the Telugu Deaam because the pall of topp. [English} lin. can be cuil, continued n'ID DOW. It dOC! not prevent it It all. It is oaJy. haIr- If tbe world 10CS alainlt tbe Truth, I will hearted measure becaUIC evea if • penoa_ 10 aaainat tbe world. disqualified, afterwards he caD pt e.... 10 the otber House, tbe COuncil, or tbe", Sabba, or some such thiD&. or tome o&bIIr [Tram/alio.,.' position caD be aiven to that penoa. It iI ooly a baJf-bearted measure which .... He WU 8 ·staunch supporter of Truth. reali, 10 to help to prevent defectioaa ID4 A parry Ihould allow ill memben to say brin. cleanliness aDd put healtb iato &bo rilht thiolS. This will livcs stren,tb to all Indian polity. members. With these words, I support the Bill. The second ;>aiDt is about tbe IpIittlDa of the 30% voten. Thil i. ODe way of eacour· aainl defection. You .hould oot allow aplk- SHRI D. NARAYANA SWAMI tiD. at all. If they split, Jet it be by ~ (AnaDtapur) : Mr.. Chairman, Sir, when I see vote. If one maD defects, be mean ditqualj. the eltction of hol". Members on the oppoaite ficatlon OD tbe arouod of immonlit)' .... sicfe OD the introduction of tbis Bill. I unetbical behaviour. fa tblt case, II' 3r.l. til wonder what to say OD it. For the last 3S the voters spUt. would it Dot be UDelhicar? yean, there bas been toPplinl lame encoura- OD what ethical arouod, on wbat priDcipIe, gi"l def(ctions. On account of alJ that, it i. can we say Ibat spJirlina caD be allowed? M evrrybody', knowledge how even iD our Telulu Desam Members, we object to Ibit society there is moral degradation. in every splittiDI also. walk of our activiry. The ,\on rebels a&aiDst the father; the wife has taken in a large mClls- ure to behave unrea,onably towards the There sh ould be no splitliq at all Ira hllSband; the brorher fights against his owo this country. Whoever defects should be cffs- brotho:r; tbe brother.in-law rcbels against his qualified. 167 Constitution JANUARY 30, 198' (52nd Amdt.) Bill 168 [ Shri D. Narayana Swami] So far as this amendment is concerned, 1 should lay that it will go a long way to Therefore, I think that this meaJure is stabilise our system of Government and to GDly balf-bearted. It will not prevent defec- clean our public life. tioD to the full measure. We heartily wel- come a measure wbich would prevent defec- tiOD completely. Whatever it may be, for the We have to remember that political present, we do welcome luch a measure. conscioulDess and popular mandate were reflected in tbe last general election and if SHRI BRAJAMOHAN MOHANTY that continues. politics will remain clean. (Puri) : Sir. tbit Bill introduced by tbe hon. Why could not this Bill be passed earlier ? Minister for Law is commendable and I con- Why did the Government and the Opposition gratuate tbe Government aod the new Prime parties and everybody agree to this broad Minister for the bold step they have taken. proposition only today? It is because the popular cOD5cioulncss is now clearly in its favour. Cleanliness in public and political life is very much necessary. But the problem is it is Dot that easy as we think. Simply by I was listcning to the comments of the amending the Constitu tion and by introduc- opposition Members. I did not like tbem. ing disqualifications, we cannot achieve our I was fecling restless on this account. objective. We can achieve our objective if the public opinion is built up and if popular up- We have now introduced this Bill. Let aurae is created so that we can clean the us all cooperate to stabilise this democratic public tife. system. As a matter of fact, politics was never considered an honourable profession. As the What is happening in the United States sayiog goes, it is tbe last resort of the scoun- of America? Both the Republican party drel. But here in India, we have established and the Democratic party make a commit- a different heritage, a very commendable ment to the people during every election tradition of suffering and sacrifice in politics. that tbey would clean tbe White House. But 1t is the laintly people, the noblest of how far bas it been cleaned? It remains in personalities who lej the political movement the same unclean condition. in Ihis country. Those noblest personalities Jed tbe political movement in our country That is why I say that it is a great task. and we introduced a new definition of politics Our Prime Minister deserves congratulations here. They htive built up noble heritage in by the nation. By this process, he is trying tbe past and today we are attempting to to stabilise the system and we all should stabilise the democratic system in the country. coopetate. The Prime Minister's efforts are directed So rar as this Bill is concerned. I want toward. not only cleanina the public life but to point out one or two inadequacies i. the alsO to stabilise the democratic system in this Bill which the hon. Law Minister should take cOUDtry. The democratic system itself i. not care of. a perfect system. But it is the best avaiJable system. Not only our country, but all the democratic countries of the world including About meraer, my submission would be: tbe United States of America and the United why should you allow merger of political K._!oldom are confronted with problems now a parties which do Dot have, by and large, days. They arc also struggling for their broadly. common features in their election existencc and for stabilising the system. manifestoes'? The metger should be aHowed Tberefore, the democratic form of Govern- only where the election manifestoes of tbo ment is Devcr conaidered a pedect ,system of respective political parties contain similar Government. Butt as I said, it is the best broad features and similar promises to the ayailable form of Government. Human electorate. I, Otherwise, it will be aD act elemeat is necessary to make it succeuful. behind the back of the ocople, it will be a 169 Constitution MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (51nd Amdr.) Bill 170 deal wttich should not be tolerated by us, inlended to prevent defections aod not to Therefore, my submission would be lhal, control the activitiet within a political party. unleu the election manifestoes of the dlffe- This would have been the most Draconian reDt political parties, those who desire to measure if thll particular cJause had been mcrae, contain broadly limilar features and inclucied. J congratulate the rulan& party and they also .,ree. the meraer should nol be the Prime MIDIS(er for having alrced to allowed, the merler should be considered a~ remove thb. a disqualification aDd they must be compelled to SO to the people again, My submission would be that the Law MiDister should This Bill has been brought after IODg consider this. This is the first Bill or thIS years of deliberation, cspecially whcn our nature, aod the inadequacies should be re- body politic was being eatcn away aDd dest- moved in due course. royed by the events that we have seen. All that I would like to mention is that this Bill alone is Dot enough to cleaDse our politics Another apprehension of mine relates from what has been happenina. If a person to interfereDce by the courb iD the functions leaves a political party and join, another or of the Speaker under this statute. As you if an iD4ependent joins a political pany, he know, the privileges of the House, the internal would lose his membership of the HOUle. sovereignty of the House, is beang interfered But here a provision has been made that, if with by the courts very often. What will one.tbird of the members of a polJlical parry happen if, after the Speaker takes a decision. deCide to leave a party even for reaSODS which it is questioDed by the courts? are opportunistic. they Will not be conSidered defectors. No,", what is the purpose of thiS Blll ~ It is to plevent unethical politics or Another apprehension of mine would be opportunistic polItiCS of a Member leavlDg whether it will stand the test of the eOLst1- one party from which he has been elected tution. The limitations of this aug\lst Hou!)e and Joming another party. It one mdivldual In ameDdinl the Constitution ha\e been does It even for ~nuine reasons. for Ideolo- enumerated by the Supreme Court. I would gical reasons, he would lose hiS membership ltke that tbe Law Minister should en'ighten of the House. But when a larger number of tho HoulC tbat the Bill will Itand the tClt of members ciwose to do so, they would get thc Conltitutiou aud, particularly, that the sanctity as per the f')fovisions of this Bill. Speaker'l functionl under thiS statute Will Thl~ is a lacuDa which eXlsh 10 thiS proVIsion Dot be iDterfered with by courts. which is made for a split I know io a democracy, well, a split can (al...e place. But a spilt can be due to various reaSODS. \\o'e With these words. I ODce alain cong- have seeD what happened in recent years in ratulate the Govcrnment (or brlDllDg forward Jammu & Kashmir, In ADdhra Pradesh in tbi. Bill and I liupport the Bill. Sikl(Jm and m many other pi aces. Some of these could be called spht~ because more IHRI V, KISHORE CHANDRA member5 were Involved in them. But when S, DEO (Parva,hipuram, : Sir, 1 nse to wel- we look at it In the prop~r rerspeclIve, these com. tbil Bill wbi,h hal bien introdu~.d JR were nothlDg else b.ut defections dODe en a thii Houw after )'ea,~ of diICU\::'IOQ and ma-;s scale for cltpturmg power or position, delaber.,ioa. W. welcome thiS Bill OlOre '" ha l~~er I he reltson may be. "Pfeil"), b.cfW5C thi!! hcls ~ome at a (1m • • fter hlv, Hen the spale of polilicat w. C'all~o fl 'It \Ij,;h eVIDh. in the lilit couple of )ear~ mvoj~ IOi ,"volve, the Speaker ~ir,ctly ~xpul~lon a member polilici of dtt'ecltoQ and opportunl~m. regiHt,n, elf from the HOUle, I would personally feei that IDill!ad of tn, (lh Ine the Speaker in this 1 would first like to congr:n ~1aLe I~"~ "-mJ of a nuttet which I:ould be controver:'lal Mlntih.r for Law aDd also (be Prime I Ii.: I aw M ,ulsler .,;:ould ~tC' .. c:r[ the \uggestlon MiDi!ltter (ofhavina a,reed to el:mmate or t~l"l i!ll!le lohould l~\: ,\ .... 0mmlttee, an elected rem"", Clause 6. sub·d61u~e :(1) (::). from committoc of the Members of the Houae thl1 BBI. ..\I I ucderstand, thl~ Oi:1 was where thert need nl.lt necessarily bc a part, J71 CorutilllliOll JANUARY 30 1985 (5Jnd Amdt.) Bill 172 [Shri V. Kishorc ChaDdra, S. Deo] expressioD aDd rreedom of auociatioa. WhID whip. Tbere caa be a free election and there suc:b a thiDI is there, it all" tlw provWoaa Ibould be a committee of eiected members of Art 19 of the Constitution like ....,. of chaired by the Speaker whicb can decide the speech. Section J9 luaraDtea fl'lldom 01 matter. There have been several cases-I do speech, auoc:iatioD and expreuion bat t" not want to quote them-where members are Dot savrd by Seclioo 19 (2) (a). So. even in the House or Cnmmons which is there is possibility of cou,.. iDler,.,. iD known as the Mother of Parliament, have this measure. What it tbe .. 01 ...... a voted against .he party whip, after getting legislation without tatJa. care of aU tbele permission (rom the party. Though this thiDgS? ..... riction can be made as rar as censure motioDI or money Bills Ire concerned, I 11.00 Iars. thick in extreme cases prOYisidD should be made where a conscieoce votina can be allowed to a Member after lakina permission SeCODdJ)" the BtU does DOt mate a from his party. J would urp upon the Law distiDctioD between lft1uioe dilleDt aad Minister and the Prime Minister siDce be is defectioa. Natural., a defector baa 10 be present bere, to kindly coDlider tbis and puaished but Dot. maD wbo maUl lIDuiDe include this provision as part or this Bitl so ditSCDt. tbat dissension made by a member would DOl lead to his becominl vklimised as a defcclor. Thirdly, the Speaker', roJe here is ODe which lomehow I am GOt able to .... , just wanted 10 make these few poiots. Speaker is supposed to be a UlID who is Once alain I would like to ~ongratulate this above party and above controwrsy. Tbis government for having brouaht forward this bilt brings the Speater's role into a contro- Bill in whatever limited manner it is. This, versy and tbe speaker is c:xpa:tcd to decide as I said, can only be a beaionina and can who is a def~lor or wbo it DOt. defector ooly partly control the kinc2 of politics that and give a judgement over the defectors. hal been goinl on, but moral standard! will have to be evolved in coune or time Wilb these reservations I IUpport this Bill. ID our Coastitutioo .. arc &loatial 0\'01' tbe fact thal we ,,-we lOt au iadopeodeot judiciary. todependenl aeeutM ad fade.. SHR( K. RAMACHANDRA REDDY dent leai~lalure but DOW the le8islature hal (Hiodupur) ; J rise to "eJcome this BiU. It is bec:D asked to .nome the fuOClioal of a measure which should have been brought a judiciary. Same is tbe ease witb tbe 1001 time bac.:k •.Anyhow better late (han Speaker's role which hal bceD tbrowD iD never. I appreciate the Goveromeot brinliDK coatroveny. It is oot a sood provisioD. this measure. Some other 8sencY ,hould be l"ouabt out to decide w..... a maD bas actually defeeted Althouah I ag,ree with the "pirit of the or not defected. measure, I would doubt about the form aDd content of tbe Bill. When we brin, a Bill of this type it is likely to be taken to the Speaker ,is now apeetcd to take actioD ~oun and coosideraDI the various provisions 1110 """II. It 1Chould DOt be IeIt to die dit- in the Bill, I am afJJid it is likely to be cretioo of the Speaker. It abouId be till part, leader who must make a rIpon to the struck down ?J the ~ourt a~ "I'fa "iftl the Con~tilllljon. Speaker that his party man hal defecte4 lad theD the Speaker caD mnova lbe penon. About defcdion (rom a political party. nowhere ha" it heen defined what a •political Lastly the PTivilqea liVID to the party' is. So to 'ay who is a defector or Speaker should not be given to' the Deputy, who i! not a d:(e~ for ~annot be judged SJ)C8ker because the Deput, SpDker ia a ~ easily. member of tbe House aod takes part in tho deliberations of the House. He tak .. part This Bill l.'lJ':u a nnmber of const· io votiuJ and is not npected to resiao ftom raints on flcedvfJl of ~peech. freedom or tbe part,. As per con~DtiOD the Speaker 173 ConSI;lutio1'l MAGHA 10, ]906 (S.4KA) (52nd AmelI.) Bill 174 hal fo resip from the party. So, both of view tbat if the ideology of political parties them should not be equated. The very lame is identicil and they have expressed provisioDS liveD to the Speaker should Dot identical views in their respective manifestoes, be Jl)&dc available to the Deputy Speaker. only theD merger aDd split -should come into the picture. If i!lsues placed by them tn election are different. if th("ir programmes AI far as Sections 6 and 7 are coo- are different and merler and split are c:orncd tbe courts will playa big role in allowed then it would be a fraud on the tryina to say that the provisions in the cons- people wbo have voted for UI. tltutioD have beeD violated. So, I request the Law MIDister tu consider Sec. 6 and 7 Today, an atmosphere has beeo created and if there can strict SCfutlDY see be of law. in wbich lome political Dorms wjJ1 be H thele provisions do Dot iland the scrutiny observed. As reaards the demand by of law the Act itselC Will become iofructuoul. Members of the Opposition for withdrawal of the Bill passed io Jammu & Kashmir, the I thank you aaain for giving me the Supreme Court has already glv("n ilS verdict that it is not defection, but it is a split. opportunity to speak 00_ -this Bill. Choudhary Charan Sin&h is nOL present in the House today. I remember that black {Trarrslation' day of 18th March, 1967. I would like to conl£fatulate the pepople of Icdia who have SHRI RAM PYARE PANIKA (Robe- rejected those who indulged in' defections rtsgaDj): Mr. Chairman, Slf, I am very and changed their ideology. Their grateful to you for liviag me an opportunity number has beeD minimised. There are onfy to speak on this important Bill. I have two or three such Members DOW. Two of listened to all the Members who have them be'ong to Jana Sangh and three to an- spoken from this side and from that other party. Out of 338 dc:fectlons. 210 de- 'id~. It is a historic Bill because when fections took p14ce for gelling minl~tership Mr. Dandavate was speaking, he became only. The peop'e who bl;'lIeved in morality very sentimental and IBid that this Bill and did not believe In opportunism were was coming up on the day of Gandhiji's confronted with a situation where they had to death anniversary. He a150 said that it would decid~ whether the sole purpose of politlCS in be a memorable event in the history of the IDdia would be to grab power or it would be based OD some ideology. I am happy that Con81'e1S because this Bill was being brought Government have brought forward this in the centeaary year of the Congress. Hon. important Bill to put an end to politics of President bad also made a mention of tbis opportunism. Bill in bi. Address and it is a lOad thiDg that tbis Bill has been brouaht forward iD this very ...ion for which I cODlratulate tbe This Bill should be passed unanimously, GovorDlDCnt. tbe Prime MiniJter and the keeping in view how democracy WWlS estalJJis· Minister of Law. There was some minor hed in lodia. controversy in the Bill which bas sincc been removed. It is in accordance with the tradili- I alain 'CODgratulate the Government onl of Conlress Party which have been in and conclude my spe~h. e'tI!slcnce from I hL! lime of Pl. Nehru. I would hke to mention one or two things. So rar as merger and split are concerned, thl." number of members speCified 10 the case of 1MI. SPJi.-\KER 1'1'1 rhe Chltiri. merler is OD the higher side, whereas in the case of split, the number specified is ODe-third. I am of the VIC\'\ that the unmber *SHRI P. APPALANARASIMHAM in calC of split should be more than half. (ADakapa1l1) : Me. Speaker, Sir. we are di~· The hon. Mmister is in aareemtDt wuh the cUSIiog anti-defection Bill today. ReaUy it is ·The Speach was original: delivered in Telugu. 17S Conltilnlioll J.,.NUARY 30, 198' (51nd Amdt ) Bill 176 rShri p. AppaJanarasimham J you this Parliament, to recoasider tbe clicis .. ion of omittinl Clause 2( I) (c) of tllil BilL Kindly do remember what bal bapptDOd in a historic event. Since 1969 we have seeD our State Jast AUlust and ....Iier ill Jammu how the dJssicklns have cros!ed the ftoor, and Kashmir. How many li\'es have boto lItterly disregan1iDl the verdict of the people JOlt and property worth forty crores hal beeD caosiDi the collapee of maoy a State Govern- destroyed. Near'y 30 peopJe were killed. It ment These dissideDts, forsenio, the fact was all due to the large scale defec:tioDl tbat . they are the elected representatives of which had taken place in these States. Heace the people and that tbey bave been eJected to once again I request JOu to adopt tbe tlac State L~sJatures to carry on the Bill in its ori,inal form without omitioa OoYeI'lUDeDt for five years, bave cbanged Clause 2 (J) (C). Is it justioo their loyalty for power and pelf. Now tbat to take cognisance if ooe member is a sad chapter in the history of India. So, crosses the floor and ilnore if 30 members Sir, we have been seeing many State Govern- switch their loyahy ? Defection is a detec- ments falling due to tbe defection, by tion whether one crosses tbe floor or 30 dissidents. So in order to curb the people do it. It is better to abide by menace of defection, the Janal Party majority decisions in ln3tanccs wbeD tbere is Government at the Centre made a bold a difference of opinion in the party. So igDor. attempt during 1978 and 1979 to bring for. ing or condoniog 30 per cent of the members ward anti defection legislation. Unfortuna- switching O\lcr their loyalty is not aood. tely they could Dot succeed. So also, io my Otherwise I am afraid it may lead to some own State of Andhra Pradesh our party unhappy events in our State Leaislaturcs by under the leadership of Shri N.T. Rama Rao omitting this clause 2(1 J (c). Prolrammes etc. has passed a resolution and forwarded the will be formulated and carried out outaide same to tbe Central Government to take the Parliament or State Legislatures where immed iate steps to curb defection. Our there can be some difference of opiniqD. So younl and dynamic Prime Minister, S?ri once again I plead (or the retention clausc Rajiv Gandhi has now come forward WJth or 2(1) (c) as envisaged JD the original HiJI. tbis Bill. I laUd his efforts. I congratulate Then only we can do justice to this aDti- bim for taking the bold step to bring for- defection Bill. Only I hen, the State Govern- ward this legislative measure. Sir, I want to ments can function for full term witbout the point out ODe thing in this connection. Our fear of collapse due to defections and work beloved leader Sbri N.T. Rama Rao bas for the progrc:ss of the people. askcd us to extend our sincere cooperatIon in alliood measures taken up by the Union Government and Shri Rajiv Gandhi and thank you very much for giviDg me oppose any injustice vehemently. This is the an opportunity to speak on thie epOcb- fundamental policy of Telugu Desam party. making Bill. Sir, it would have been better haj we [English) accepted the entire Bill as it wa~ presented to PROF. KAMSON MEIJINLUNG this House. But it is unfortunate that clause (Outer Manipur) : I am aIad tbat you bave 2 (1) (c) of the Bill is going to be dropped. given me an opportunity .•••(In,.',.uplioru) Tbis itl not lood. People would have wel- comed the Bill wholeheartedly With clause 2 MR. SPEAKER : Yes. We alwa)ls en- (I) (c). But by omitting Clause 2( I) (c) of tourage new.comers. tbe Bill, I am afraid the situation may revert back to the old position where legislators can IbameleslJy cross the floor, Sir, this august AN HON. MEMBER : He miabt be body knows too well the sufferlDgs we had pulling your lea. undcraoDe very recently in our State due to maul defection. Many hon. Members belong- PROF. XAMSON MEIJINLUt\G: ing not only to my party. but also other You have liven me an opportunit, ,o.peak partalike Janata know only too well in the last hour of the lalt day of tbe SeII- how our Government was pulled do\VD in tbe iOD. I would like to mention here tbat out State. Hence I request you Sir, aDd throush of the 50s Lok Sabha scats declared, my 117 MAOHA )0, J906 (S.4K.4) (521111 14md1.) BIN 1,. rtIUk Wat tbe last to be dklwtd. Also, I that our Prime Minister bas put q ,.d to .... beeG allotted leal a. tIae last eo4 of the this now. Cbambor bore perbapl becaU'IC I come from !be last Scate at tbe Eattem ODd of this Secondly. this Bill will dleck ioItabilit, ClOUD rry. Anyway, I am very happy tbat J have of the Government arising due 10 the threat lot thit ()pportunity to speak. I rise to auppon the Constitutioa (Fifty-Second of defection. This tbreat is more real in the north-ea~lem States where the members of Ameodmenf) Bill, J985 which is now popu- tbe legislatures pre fewer in number" In tbe larly known as the ADti .. ncfectiOD Bill. smaller Mates such as In Mizoram. NagalaDd. I .hate tbe vieW! of many Members Mantpur, Tnpura and wbo have said lbat thl) Rdl i. a histroic one Arunachal Pradesh. where there are only 60 five I also believe that this Bill Will remain as ~ members. if way· ward members come out and pose landmark in tbe history of democratic India. a threat to the Government it naturally becomes un- bctause this DiU is likel, to restore tbe true stab1e. When thIS JOstablity comes~ atten.. spirit or democracy, and the values of demo .. the tlon of the merr.ber is diverted to the main.. cracy which have been eroded by the iUs of defection. Now we are putting an end to the tenance of the Government. Attention is away from development of tbe State evil practice C'tf defection; and it is very likely taken and divt"Tted to the countinu&DCe of that a clean political habn wiIJ come to our tm; country. Government. So, this Bill will ensure tbat more atLenLll}n JS given to developmental aC(l\ Illes. It is also a happy cOlDcidcDce that this year marks tbe Centenary year of the TIll! db. I would like to refer to the Congress party. this year our Prime 10 , institution of rtcatl Smce 1975, jf I am Dot Minister is goang to clean the Congress Party mlsraken, elder staresmen and politIcians as wrU as ottler parties through this Antl- have be~n 1.llk.lng about recall. That is they derection Bill. dieslre rhe Institution of Recall of the legis- Jator. Blit J thml-.. Recall Will not serve the pur- This Bm is going to restore many pose as good as the Bill of to-day will. because democratic prinC1ples. In every electioD, whenever pressure I~ put by the electorale on wheD we go to the electorate we make pro- a Membn, he ~tarts losing his own free mises about our ideoolgy and our allegiance judgement. for f~(1r of being recaJled. The to a political party. As soon as the election legislator \\ ould be danCing to the tune of IS over, some people forget this and start the changmg moC'd of the electorates. There- defecting. It is a betrayal of the electorate. fore, the quail' y of the representatives will II cuts at the root of democracy, in which go do",n and lhey cease to be representa- people have faith So. I say, that this Bill tive.;. rather thl'\ bec('lme delegates. This will Rsult in the restoratIon of the trut" House IS nm deemed to be a HOUle of tbe ~jrit of democracy. delegates, It IS mCJnt to be lbe House of tbe representatlve~ We are supposed to have our own JlJdgem~nt on every issue witb earlier Some Members who had spokeD natIonal perspeCllVC So, If due to this insti. said that defection came to \h15 country 10 tullon of Recall."e are put u.Qder the pres.- 1961 when Congress was losiog. J would like ure of the ekl..lur.lIes \\ohose mood may be to uy that this is not a fact. Defc:ctJoD IS a chang:rg every time: on every issue, tben. jUWQl1e charactertJltic of all democrauc cerla,"i), membeu, "ould )o~e their indepen- becau~e countries, there are some records in dence of Judpt"menl : I mean the quality of history, eveo of Western democraCIes, whether the represenrarjvt's will go down. Therefore, it is United Kingdom or United Stales. ludi- thIS B Jl JS beller than that recall of whicb catio. tbat there was defechon in the 18th of I ba ve b~en taking Chh ceotury But in cour.e of time the 'fitctOrate 8S wen as the legislators be~arne malure, Cd \bey saw throuSh this game of Now, I would refer to section 2. Clause deft'crion. We csn arto wait for tbe time I, sub-clause 3 of the Bm under discussion . .,heft we will mature and rlee ouraelves from ) think the Prime Mini.ter has rileD to tbe 'hi:. ju\'coUo b&bll. Ao)'way. we are lucky occasion in tune. ThiS particular clause was 179 Constlttnioe JANUARY 30,198~S (52nd Amdt } Bill 180 [Prof. Kamson Mijin&luni] tb~ style of the United Kinldom. Now, this Bill Jives iDCOlltivCl rathe!r creates a aituntion for the opposition pcrtics to pt drafted in such a way that it deserves to be them,~lye. unified ~d form an .hcmame dropped o.t of the Bill. I am thinkioi from party. And in this respect I should .ay that the aagle of democratic principle because lhe our Prime Minister is daring enou:h in bon, members of the House al well as taking risks in tbe interest of democracy aDd members of the state legislatures are elected for the .ake of the country, thou,b be know. by tbe people wbo are, accordiag to the thst if this Bill be passed or if tbr. Acl principle of democracy, their fuadameata! comes fbe Opposition is likely to become uoi- sources of power and the basis of the consti- fied Still, for the sake of democracy he h•• tution. These people elected us. But why done it. He has succeeded in brinlina foe- Ihould the legislators elected by the people ward t hi.s Bill, and he has penuaded our be subjected to expulsion by a sin~;e Chair- party to rail in line with it, the best tradit- man or President of the party'? If that goes ions of democracy so that the future of tbe on, the party may as well expel also a very country may be set in the right course, good representative, for personal prejudices OD some pretext. Therefore, that risk should not have been taken, and I think: our Prime MR. SPEAKER: Shri H.M. Patel. Minister has taken to the point of dropping clause 2 (1) (C) . 18.26 hrs, What would be the position of the SHRI H.M. PATEL (Sabarkantha) : elected members If their party is dis.alved by Mr. Speaker, Sir. I am very much grateful themselves unanimously? Can they retain the 10 YOll for calling me even at this lata membership in the House'! (Interruptions), hour. In the case of a political party which has set up a candidate and that candidate gets elected due to some activity of the party, that party's MR. SPEAKER : Hour is never late, aim is declared outiawed. After that, what Sir. would be the positson of the members, because it is not the fault of tbe members: SHRI H.M. PATEL: I want to meat- it is due to some activity of tbe party which ion only two points, One is, I do not under- may not be responsible to the members; In stand why splitting, when a par~y splits, tbat that case, after outlawing of such parties, is exempted from the provisions of this what would be the position of members? Bill. When one person defects tbat leads to bil disqualification, but when you have a larso Lastly, I will come to the question of number of people g')ing cut together, tbea an alternauve party in Indian democracy. that is not defection. Everybody knows that without a good alter- native party democracy is not successful. MR. SPEAKER: Have you heard tbo However it is unfortunate that there is no people in political science saying. "Power sucb big party in India even after 35 years of corrupts; and absolute power absolutely"? our independence to counter-balance with the Congress-I Parry, For the first time, they would have a chance and a situation in SHRl H.M.PATEL: I understand all which they would develop themselves into a that. It is perf~ly true that opportunism single party; if so, we are coming closer to has always been there. I am Ilad the Prima the parliamentary system and the two party Minister bas brought in tbis Bill. He deservCl system prevailing under the democratic style our ccagratulations, as well as the Govern- of the United Kingdom or America. We can- ment deserves congratulations. Neyertbeleu, Dot 10 to tbe monolithic and authoritarian when a right tbing is proposed to be dODO, style of the socialist countries; that we may it mi,bt as well be done fully in a compcehca- not like here because the basic structure of sive way. And in tbat view wben a ,roup 0( our COllltitution does not permit tbat style people defect, they also should bo reprdcd of party system. We are very much akin to as bavina defected. E 181 Constrt ution ••..1·\(j\-.'.\ io, 1<)06 (S.HA) (5 .'1Il1 .~U;"i.) ntn PROF N.G RANGA : No MR. SPEAKER: Hon. Prime Minister. SHRI H '\1 PATU.: After all what i, THE PRIME MINISTER (SHRI R/\JIV the princlpe under lying the concept of de- GANDHI) : Mr. Speaker, Sir, this Ann- fection? It i-, that you are breaking the Defection Bill has been pending for a very pledge that you have given '0 t+re ekt'!oratc. long time. I think it was first mentioned You go to the electorate witil certain policies, almost seven years ago. We have taken it up certain progr ammex and il is on this ground as one of our first major tasks because we that when you change yZhi! P;'f' y defe .• ;00 ,eelt that this IS an area where public life is caused. If ;, large number of people also needs cleaning up As rightiy promised break their pledge together, that also must during the debate on t he Presidentia l be regarded as defection. I th.ink this is Address, our Government has the politi cal something. iha: may be considcre d, if not \\ ill t (1 implement what \' e promise. We al ,0 today, at a later date. j suggest chat ihe Pr uue ha ve promised that we will carry the Minister may her t hi-, point at tll< ~ hack of opposition with us, And I am happy to say, his mind, so that some day he may consider Sir, tha t we carried almost al! of the 01'1"0,,- that even he must give effect to H If{)e,hillg lion with m. There are only one or two that is admittedly desirable. e xceprions. Tile other [Joint rna: I would like to PROf. MADHU I);\NDAVATE: Wc make is this: it used to he the prac.ice , have prorr-ised that we "'dl carry the Govern- normally in the old days, to issue Uy I 'eOlo\'ing clat.se :( I )(e) one lacuna come-. I « ould like one; again to congratulate out <. ind that is that if 'he House ··-ellha lillS the Government cm hav ing decided to r ring House : or a Stale Leg"Ia!ure--,'i no: in s~,,;,'n in this Biil because it certainty will help and the !re is a defection or ~I ,nllt or howeve r greatly in cleaning up the administration, I it may he defined, bUI "'e Government ;, will nOI refer today about other mat ter s soon 10, 'ose it, majority. t he n there would he which the Prime Minister proposes to clean a long tin le h~fnre the nc xt se-sion H"J< 10 l c up, called an" I Ihis could l-a d t,' a la! of hw,e 1'83 Corutitution JANUAR Y 30, 1985 (j2ttd A",lt.) Bill 184 [Shri Rajiv Gandhi] PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: It is because, after some years, we will SO to the tradina. This wal ODe of the reasons why -'Upper House". clause 2(1) (c) was there. I am lure tbat this was one of the reasons why one of tbe saRI RAllV GANDHI: Sir, we are opposition Parti. was very keen-more than not ill a rush to send him to the uUpper one-was very keen that this clause be main- House". Hut we arc glad that he acknow. tained. We are looking int'.) how to close ledges that the Congress will be replaciD. tbe tbit lacuna. We have nJt b:en abl~ to do it Opposilion Icaders in those Benches, wbco in tbis Bill itself. But in my dis ;ussions with they leave. the opposition we have fouod a method which we are looking into and hopefully we will be ablo to put some time-limIt, possibly a AN HON. MEMBER: You will be in minimum time-limit, between thc= suspicion of the Opposition. a Government losing its majority and the test of its strength in the House. We will see SHRI RAJIV GANDHI: Tbis Bill ia whether this can be put in. either in this Bill. the first step towards cleaning our public life. may be in the next session, or, If it has to b~ We Will taking other Slepl;. electoral reform" put in elsewhere, we can do it there as well. other reforms, and you have my assurance, Sir, that we WIll carl y the whole opposition with us in these forthcoming deci,ionl tbat I do not want to take too much time of the House, because the opinion on thIS Bill we will have to takc:. is more or less unani-nous, and there is not much to debate. Sir. I commend this Bill for adoption. I thank the OPPOSition for co-operating with us in formulating tbe HiJJ and for $uPl'Qrtiog One point was raised: "What is tbe it. hurry in having this Bill? We have been waiting 7 years to have this Bill and a Jot of damage has been done. This BilJ should have THE MINISTER OF LAW AND· come yesterdaYt should have come last yeact JUSTICE (SHRl A .K. SEN): Sir, I want to should have come 7 years ago." We are express my gratitude to the House, to the doing it the fasteat tbat we can do. I feel Prime Minister aod to the members of my that anybody wbo does not want this Bill party for the strong support which they have bas to have hit own integrity examined. given for making this a reality. This proves once again, if proof was needed. the maturity and the stability of our democracy. Amidst Sir9 it bas been said that this Bill is tbe clash of arm~ and bickeriDgs of parties, being brought to keep tbe Congress Party when the calJ of the nation bas gone out, the intact, to Itreo.tben the Congress Party. I people, irrespective of paI1ies, bave closed would like to poiDt out tbat the defections their ranks aod come and Ilccded to the carr are invariably to tbe Congress Party, and not of the nation. I remember, in this very from tbe Congress Party. We do not have a House, when the Chinese attacl tame, wben problem with people leaving the party; we our late leader. Shri Jawaharlal Nehru, was have a problem with peopl~ wanting to join speaking on the proclamation of EQl(fgency. our party. We do Dot need this to strensthen be uttered these great words, whicb are .till our party. You can see the strength of our riDging in myean : "This is our finest hour. party in front of you. We must aU stand like a solid rock and repel tbis invasion." ADd the CouDtr), did SHRI H.M. PATEL: Lookingabcad. stand like a solid rock. Tbe Opposition here and outside and everywbere rallied round tbe tlag of India. I remember the Vijay Chowt, SRkI RAlIV GANDHI: I am looking proceuioo of that year on tbe Republic Day. abead. You will lee in 1990.today we are wben tbe entire Opposition turned out &JOD, occupying almost the whole of that row-we with our areal leaden and marched bare- will tben be occupyio& even that row. footed alDOl tDe patb of tho Vij., Qaowk. ISS CtJfUIilutitJtt MAGHA to, 1906 (SAKA) (5Jnd AmdtJ BiU 186 I remember wbcG the Patktaoi attack came Certaio other mi~appreheD5jons have in 1971 Iud IRdita Gandhi gave a darioo call been expressed about the Election Commi- to lbe aatioo again to rally round. tbis nation '\§ion's authority and the Speaker'~ authority did tal., rouod and ami Our friend from Kuhmir a~ked whatt SHRI A,K. SEN: That is al,o lh~rc about the Kasbmir Bill. Kashmir bas its Please read the Bill. We have provided for own Constitution and we cannot amend that that also. ThiS IS your difficulty, Mr. Constitutioo. We arc amending our Coos·· Choubey. You are so Ignorant yourseJf that titution; aDd if you choose to amend your you never read the Bill even. Constitution. follow our e"ample and do so qWckJy bccaUie your Bill has nOI been as perfect u it could have been Your fights in The other question,> arc about the the courts have shown that the split that was Speaker's authority, It \\a'\ our clear illten- KCepted there was not a one-third split. tlon from the very begioDlDg that \\t! are Dot nterefore. try to follow this law and Iflake it going to allow thiS matter to be dilly-dallied a better law. and tossed about ID the courts of la"" or in the Election CommiSSion'" Office. I had my- PROF. SAIFUDDIN SOZ: In order self appeared 10 the Courts along \\Jtb late Kanhal),a Lal MI..,hra J I for \\ Inning our to eDible us tQ ifDJ)l'OYe on that, you kindly ,,-ymbo!. Babuji IS there. He \\a~ the withdraw )'OU1' support to the Jammu and lC.uhmir Government. Preo;;iden t of our party then. We used to go very re,gularly and Shri Siddhar&ha Shankar Ray was assisting me at that time. But the SHRI A.K. SEN : That is for the Prime time we won back our symbol. it become MiDister. worthless, because we had already won the election not on a pair of bullocks, but OD a SHIU ABDUL RASHID KABUL) : We cow and a calf. Therefore, that type of WaDi YOU tD t'OOpCralt wltb us ID alI'JClldinl delay shou Id not be tolerated an), more. We the Constitution of th~ State. \\ant a qu~ck decl'>loo. 1t (hiS Hili 1<" 10 be effectIve, and If defcctlon I~ to ~c oUlia\\~d effectIvely. rhen \\c must choo:"e a forllm ~dOt PROE SAlFUDDIN SOZ : We which \\ III deCide thl.! matter feark~"ly k) Wllhdraw 101 the St~\l~ ,au ,our support and CXPldICI(..)uSly Thl.... IS I h~ ofliy forum Ooverament. that IS possible. \A'lth lhe,e words I comm-:nd the tMolion for conslderallon. SHill A.K. SeN: If you have not ')(;Cn tbe d~ .·tluQI on lhc wall. thea we cannot hell) it~ Prof.~. YO\l &DiIhl Stlill b.: myopK; SHRI SUl\>INI JAIPAl REDDY: I ia JOUr 'l&ioa. waDt a c1arifkatio\n. COfutitlltknt ~jJ1III AIf'IIII.} Bils.' MR. SF£AKER : If.,.. oate &,.n the ,andoJa' & bo~ then it win JIOt, eM. [T,_.tiltum] SHltl SUDJNl JAIPAL REDDY: Sir, J want a clarificatioo. Here is another pleasaDt aoaoumamen'. AlraJnlemen's )lave been made for the Jinncr at 8.00 P.M. ion Room Nos. 70 and 73. This. MR. SPEAKER : I shan now put t 1\c is to celebrate ttle occasion of your US"'I tnc motioo for considerattoD 10 dle vote of the automatic ""lmr; dcykc lot the NSI timr.~ House" Tms being a Constitutional Amend- ment Bin, vOlin, has to be doI'Ie by divisi®. Le1 tbe lobbies he cleared. PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: 00 Now, I \\oukJ requeH ea(b Member thal also, the Oppo~itiOD will fully coopera'c. ~o make sure tbat he it slltmg in his assigned seat. Each Member is required to take special care to record his vole (Tru1Isfation l correctly as 'Aye' 01 'No' orr -Amtain' as the case may be 10 that there is no ~ion for MR. SPEAKER: Today there is unani- making correclioos. I may briefty recall that mif.y aDd cooperation in every matter. a~ soon as the automatic vote recording equipment i~ made active on announcemcnt [English] by the Chair-now Division, that is what I wiJI say-a gong sound which is the signal to Tbe Lobbies havc been cleared. \fembcn to cast their votlCS. eacb Member bas to press the push button switch and then operate one of the three push buttons. for The question is : 'Aye', ·No· or 'Abstain', They are allm coloured, namely greeD for -Aye' or yellow "That [he Bill further to amend the for' Aye'--here it is yelJo\\--red for 'No' and ConstitutioD of India, be taken \010 black for 'Abs.'ain', according '0 his choice. Consideration." Th e Lok Sabha Divided : The push switch and the push buttoo must be kept pressed simultaneously umtil tbe ~ong sounds for the second time after 10 18.53 hrs. lceonds. That must be correctly under- '\000. [Division No.1] Immediately after the yates have been AYES recorded by the machine and flashed on the field indicator board, the membter who has A voted from a wronl seat or WbclSe vote ha5, not been recorded by machine or who has b~f Abbasi, Shri K.J. mistake voted ""rongly and desire;s correctio D in tbe result as flashed on the fJeld indicat·or Abdul Ghafoor, Shri board should rise in hi" scat whereupon a Ach aria, Shri Basudeb Division Cierk will hand over to him one or Adai."alaraj, Shri L. the four slips as the membf:r may ask f'or. The member desiring correclio,n may fill ill the Adlyodi, Dr. K.G. correction slip prociseJy and c;ompletely i['J all Agarwal, Sbri Jai Parkash respects and then hand it oVer without d,elay to the Divi~jon Clerk. \\!'hile filJing in the Ahmad, Shri Sarfaraz correction siip the portions of the correction Ahmed, Besum Abida slip which are not applicable shoul d be .truck off clearly. AI"'ha Ram, Shri 119 190 AnneS S.... Shri Bttbal, Sbri A ... Nambi ... Stv. &. llil'fllldra Siolb, It..o Ansari, Ski Ab411( H_uaa IIi ..... Sbri Aja, ADta~ Silri Z.1t. llrah.. o.tt, SbN AMGIIy... $tIri P.A. Bula Sioab, sa,,; AIwdat••• Sllti M~ A "chi., Shri ' ..dish AIM, Sbri Bhacwat Jill Q.anc1ra MOnaD, SbN A~ Slvi Ohula.. Nabi tChaodra .pRlUp Nlr.in Sinlh, SIDi 'Cbanoratar. Sbr~ Oband.lai B 6ChatlCtrawttllrr, Sbrimati M. h Baa ", B. Sbri Pratap Sial" 'ChlGdrasbek'harappa, Ibn T.V. aqua SUWlbrui~ Sbri 'Cbllldresh 1(umari., S8rima&i Bairaai. Sbri Balklvi 'Cbattes, Sbri ~ Blna, Shri Banwari Lai 'Cbaturved~ Sltri Nare6 tQn4ta Bait"a.. Stan D.L. 'Cbat~edi. Sbrim.ati Viclyawati Bajpai, Dr. Ilajendr.i Kuman 'Chaedhury., Sllri Ma~l .ii.,1l BalaTamau, Shri L. rChaudhury, Shti A.B.~. Ghaai Ktlln Bali, ~rimati Vyjayanthimala 'Chavall, Shrimati (P.renaala_i Banerjee, Shrimati Mamt. 'Cbayart. Sltri S.B. Bani Lal. Shri ~hidamba ...., Shri .p. Bum., Shrj Palas ~hokka Illo, Sirri ,. Barrow, Shri A.E.T. 'Choube)', SAri Na~YaD Basavarajeswari. Shrimad 'Choucibafi, Shri Nandlal Bh3,at, Sbri B.R. ~Cboudbari, Sl!rimeti ~ai IPntkd: Bbagat, Shri H.K.L, tCbowdilary, Shri lJalADIlalh Bbakta, Sbri Manoranjan 'Cltowdbury., Sbri SaifJuCli. Bbanu Pratap Siaah, Shri Bbaradwaj, Sbri Pararam Dbarat Sinab, Shri Dabhi, Shri )\jitstnn Bhoi, Dr. Rrupasindbu Oap, Shpj MGoJ. ChaiM! Bhosalc, Shn Prataprao Baburao oDalbir 'Si~h, 'Shti Bhoye, Shri R. M. Dalbir Siop, Sbri lJhoye, Shri Sltaram Sayajl O.awai, Shei Ruslain Bhurl.~ Shri Dllccp Singh Damor, SllFi Somjibhei Bjr Sen, Sbr i .o.odavase, £Prof. Madba 191 .ft Das, S!lri Aaadi C.... GIIosIt, Shri Tanm ~ ..ti Du, ~ri aI. GohiJ. Slu'i O.D. DImti..... N. GoInaftao, Sbri Giridbar nco, Sbri ". EidMnc a..t. s. Gopnhwlr, Sbri Dcora, SbJi Mur5 GoIwatDi, Shrh_ti Bibb. GhoJ. DIMi. SflJi a v. GoDDder, Sibr; A. Scnapat. DeY•• , Sini B. Gowda. Sbri H.N. Nanje DeYi, Sbrirwati, a..ma am. Guba, Sb,itaati Phulrenu Dbaranbir Sia"" ~ Gupta, Sbrimali Prabbawati Dbaram Pat SinJh, Sbri H Dbariwall, Sbri Suad x.um- Halder. Sbri Maootanjao Dip" Shri ltadtJaiEanta Haanao MoUu, Shri o;p.. Sbri Sbarad Hard.. ri Lal, Shri DigYija, Sin,,, Sbr' Harpa) Sinab. Sbri D;pja, Siah, Sbrj, Dinesh Siagh,. Shei. HClDbram. Sbri Seth Dogra, Shri O.t. J Dube. Shri Bbishma '[)cot Jadeja, Shri D.P. If Jaffer Sharier, Sbri C.K.. Jaljjyan Ram, Shei 'aleiro. Silr; Eduardo Jaidccp Sioah, Shri Fonaaodcs, Shri Oscu JaiD, Shri Bakbandcr G Jaia, Sbri Nihel SiD,it Gad.iJ. Sbri V.N. Jain, Shri Virdhi Cbandcr GatihaYi, Sbri Bhcravadan L Jangcie, Sbri Khelan Ran) 0 ...... , Sbri Ilanjit SiD&h Jatav, Shri K.ammodilal Gaikwad, 5bri UdayaiAlraQ ~ Jena, Shri Chiotamaoi Sbrimati Gamit, Shri C.D. JhaDsi Ukshmi. M.P. Jitftdra Prase4, Sbri (Judhi. Shri RajiY .fitendta Sinsb. Shri OaD" Ram, Shr; Jujber SJoP. Shri Gavit, Shri MaDikrao HoeU,. Gdllot, Shri Ashot Gbolap, Sbri S.G. KabuUtSbri Abdul Rashid Gbeaal. Shri Debi Kaipaoa Devi. Dr. T. Ghosh, Prof. Dima) Kanli KaUtat Nalb. Sbri 193 COlllllturion MAGMA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52nd ,4mdt.) Bill Kamal, Shri Gurudas Mahajan, Shri Y.S. Kamble, Sbri Arvind Tulshiram Mahata, Shri Cbittaraojan Kanda Kumari, Shrimati Mahendra Sin.b. Sbri Kamla Prasad, Sbri Makeo, Shri Lalit Kamla Prasad Singh, Shri Makwana, Shri Nanioh Kaul, Shrimati Sheila Malik, Shri Purna Chandra KaushaJ, Shri lagan Nath Mal lick, Shri Laklhman Ken, Shri Lala Ram Manda), Shri Sanat Kumar Keyur BhusaD. Shri Mane, Shri Murlidhar Khao, Shri Arif Mohammad Mane, Shri R.S. Khan, Shri Aslam Sher Manvendra Singh. Shri Khan, Shri Mohd. Ayub Masudal Hossain, Shri Syed Khan, Shri Rablm Mehta, Shri Haroobbai Khan, Shri ZuJf)quar Ali MeijingIuoI, Prof. Kamson Khatri, Shri Nirmal Mishra, Shri Gargi Shankar Khirhar, Sbri R.S. Mishra. Dr. Prabhat Kumar Kidwai. Shrimati Mohsina Mishra, Shri Ram Nalina Kinder La', Shri Mishra. Shri Urna Kant Kolaodaivelu. Shri P. Misra, Shri Nityananda Konyak, Shri Cbingwang Mjsra, Shri Satya,opaJ Krishna Pratap Singh, Shri Modi. Shri Vishnu Kumar Krishna Singh, Shri Mohandas, Shri K. Kshirsagar, Shrimati Kesharbai Mohan LaJ, Shri Kuchan, Shri Ganghadhar S. Mohanty. Shri Brajamohan Kujur, Shri Maurice More, Prof. Ram Krishna Kumaramangalam, Shri P.R. Motila! Sinah. Shri Kunwar Ram. Shri Mukherjee, Shrimati Geet. Munshi. Sbri Priya Ranjan Kuppuswamy, Shri C.K. Das Murmu, Shri Sidba Lal Kurieo, Prof. P.l. Murthy. Shri M.V. Cbandrasbckara Kurup. Shri Sureab Murulaiah, Shrj A.R. L M u ttemwar, Shri Vilas Law. Shri Asutosh Lowans,Shri VVanghpba N M Naik, Shri G. Devaraya Madhuri Sinlh, Sbrimati Naik. Shri Shantaram 195 Corutitutlon JANUAR.Y 30, 1985 (52"d Amdt.) BIU 196 Naikar, Sbri O.K.. Patil, Shri Prakuh V. NarayaDan, Shri K.R. PatiI, Sbri Shi"raj V. Natarajan, Sbri K.R. hliI, Sbri UUamrao N.'war Singh, Shri Patit, Sbri Veerelldra Nehru, Shri ArUD Kumar Patil, Shri Vijay N. N.'.m~ Shrj Arvjnd Patil, Shri YubwaalraG Oadakb Nikbra, Shri Ramesb war Patnaik, ShrirDati JayaDti Pattnaik, Shri JaganDath o Pawar, Shri Balcsaheb Odedra. Shri Bbarat KlIma,. Pawar, Shri SalyaDareyan Odey.r. Sbri Cltaaaaiah Pcruman, Dr. p. Valla] p Pilot. Shri Rajcsh Pad.,acbi, Shri S,S. Ramatwamy PGojary, Shri Janardhana Meer Mohamed, Shri E.S. M. Potdukhe, Shri Shantaram Pande, Shri Raj Mansat Prabhu, Shri R. Palldey, Shri Damador Pradhani, Shri K. PaDdey, Shri Madan Prakash Chandra, Shri 'aade" Shri Manoj Puran Chandra, Shri Purohit, Shri Banwari Lal 'aDigrabi. Shri CbiDtammi Panill'abi, Shri Sriballav Q Panika, Shrf Ram Pya:re Qureshi, Sbri Aziz Pallja, Sbri A.K. Plot, Shri K..C. R Papircd4y, Sbri Bczawada Raghuraj SiD,b, Shri Parallaar, Prof. NaraiD ChaM RI i, Shri I. Rama Pardhi, Sari Kesbaorao Rai, Shri Ramdeo hawaa, Sbri Ram Dh .... Raj lCaran SiDlh, Shri PalC)~ Ski Ahmed M. Ilajeabwaran. Dr. V. Pate), Shri C.D. Rajbaoa, Dr. G .S. Patel, Sbri G.l. Ilam, Sbri Ram RataD Patel, S)trl H. M. Ilam. Shri Ilama_aroop Pate), Shri Molian LaI JlaIIl Awadb Pr&lad, Sbri .aiel. IIlrI RaID Po. Ram DhlO, Shri Patol, Sui UU&lllbt.i II. Ram ~uwar, Sbri ~ 8bri CbaDdra ~ Ram Parkuh, Shri ~. 9bIi B&1I.uc. V~ Ram Samujbawaa. Sbri 191 MAGHA to, 1906 (SAKA) (52"d Amdt.) Bill J98 RalDUDurth1, Sbd It.. Sen. Shri Ashok Ram.,.1 Siaall, Bbrl SeD. Shri Bhola Nath RamrataD, ShrJ KaUcharaa Sethi, Shri AlWlta Pruad RUHlla. Sbri H.G. Sethi, Sbri P.C, Raila Vir SiDIh. Illri Shab, Sbri Anoopcbaad Ran .., Prof. N .G. Shutawat, Prof. Nirmala lC.umari RaalAnatb, Shri K.H. Shankaranaad. Shri B. Rao, Shri Aitbabathula Joaeawara SbaDmulam, Shri A.C. VeDkata Butcbi Maheswara Sbanmulam.. Shri P. Rao, Sbri C.R. Srihari Shanti Devi, Sbrimati Rao, Dr. O. Vijayarama Sharma, Shri Nand Kisbore Rao, Sbri J. Venlala Sharma, Shri Nawal Kishore Rao, Shrl x..S. Sharma, Shri Pratap BhaDu Rao, Sbri P.V. Narasimba Shutri, Shri Hari Krilhaa Rao, Shri V. Krilhna Shervani, Shri Saleem I. Rath, Shri Somnath Shin,da, Shri D ,B. Ratbawa. Shri Amarsinlr Shivendra Bahadur SiDah, Shri Rathod, Shri Uttam Shukla, Shri Vidya Charan Raut, Sbri Bhola Siddiq, Sbri Hafiz MaheL Ravani, Sbri Navin Rawat, Sbri Harisb Sidnal, Shri S.B. Rawat, Sbri PrabhulaJ Singaravadivel, Shri S. Riyan, Sbri Baju Ban Sinah, Shri D.O. Roy, Shri Sudhir Siogh, Shri X.N. Roypradban. Shri Amar Sinah, Shri Lal Vijey Pratap s SiDlb, Kumari Puabpa Devi Singh Sbri K P. Saha, Shri Ajit Kumar Deo, Sinha, Shri Ati.h Chandra Saha. Shri Gadadbar Sabi, Shrimati Krishna Sinha, Shrimati Ki.hori Sabu, Shri Sbiv Prasad Sinha, Sbrimati Ram Dulari SaDlma, Sbri P.A. Sodi, Shri Maokuram Santra Prasad, Dr. SoJanki, Sbri Xalyan Sinah Sateadra Chandra, Sbri Salanti, Shri Natav.lninh Sathe, Sbri Va.ant Soren, Shri Haribar Scindia, Sbri Madbamlo Soundararajao, Shri N. ~JY(ndraD. Shri P. Soz, Pror. Saifuddm 199 ConslituJiOll JANU4RY 30, 1985 (52nd Arndt.) Bill 200 Sreeoivasa Pruad, Shri V. v Subburamao, Sbri A.G. VairaJe, Sbri Madhu5udan S~dia, Sbrimati Indubala Van, Sbri Deep Narain Sultanpuri, Sbri K.D. Vankar, Sbri Punam Chand Mitbabbai Suman, Shri R.P. Vcnkataratnam, Shri Nissankara RIo Sundararaj. Shri Vcokatessn, Shri P.R.S. Sunder La}, Shri Verma, Dr. C.S. Sunil Dun, Shri Verma. Sbrimati Usba Sureodra Pal Singb, Shri VijayaraghavaD. Shri V.S. Naningrao Suryawansbi, Shri Vyu, Sbri Girdhari Lat Swami Prasad Singh, Shri Swell, Sbri G. G. w T Wadivar t Sbri Srikaotha Datta Wasnik, Shri Mukul Tapesbwar Singb, Sbri Wasnik. Shri Balkrishoa Taradevi, Kumari D.K. Tariq Anwar, Shri y Teary, Prof. K.K. Yadav, Sbri Kailash Thakkar, Shrimati UshabcD Ragbavji Yaday, Sbri Mababir Prasad Thakur, Shri C.P. Yadav, Shri R.N. Thambi Durai, Sbri M. Yaday, Shri Ram Singh TbaDpraju, Shri S. Yadav, Sari Shyam Lal Thomas, Prof. K. V. l'adav, Shri Subbash Tborat. Sbri Bhausabeb Yadav t Shri Bal Ram Sinah Thota Goral. Ktiahna t Shri Yaday, Sbri D P. Tbanlon. Shri p. K. Yazdani, Dr. Golam Tiaga. Sbri Simon Yeshpal Singh, Shri 1 ilakdhari Slosh, Shri Yogesbwar Prasad, Shri Tirti, Shri Piyuab Tomar. Shrimati Usba Rani z Tombi Sinsb, Sbri N. Zainal Abcdio t Shri Tripatbit Shrimati Chanda Zaioua} Basher, Sbri Tripatbi, Dr. Chandra Shekbar Tytler, Shri Jaadilb NOES U Sinha, Sbri Satyendra Narayan UOIIikrisboao, Shri It.P. Tul.iram, Sbri V. 20l Ititt.lQgu 110m MAOBA I~ 1906 (.sAKA) 202 MR.. SPBAKElt : Subject to conectioa. ~ in the Reba Sablla, I ~ the resoIC- 01 tbt divistoo is : ~ to «twa hncwitb the APOfOPttatioo (Railways) B&U, Ayes-398; Noes-2 1985. wtWdl was passed by tbe Lot Sabha at its sitting held on tho ~4th ....uary. 1985» and transmit.. 1'be motion iI carried by • IIlIjori" or tbe total membersbip of the House aDc1 (cd to the Rajya Sabb. lor its by a majority of Dot less than two- fCCOmcn«tdatioos 00 tbe same day thirds 01 the memben present and aDd. to State that the Rajya Sabha 9fotin•• ac ttt stu.. bdcI on tbe JOlla laouary, 1985, ~mmdcd tbat tbe following .meodmcm be mack: The motiOfl "'" ado,,". •• tfae aid Bilt :- PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: You can cotr«t the fIaute ud auoounce lbat it is ENACI'ING FORMULA uoaoimouS)y Idopted. That at pqe I, line I for the MR. SPEAK.Bll : 1'bo adoptiOD. by word "Thlrt~.fiflh", tile woul urwrimouI YOfa. C4Daratulatton. to JOU. ··Tbict)-liath" be sMbJtitMtu.' • ._ ~"' tbe provisions 11.55 In. of sub-rule (6t or Rwle 1i6 of lAc: R.ules of Procedure and CoDd~t of MBMBBIt SWORN Busioess .. (fie Rajya Sabba. I am dlrected to return herewith the Shri K.N. PradhaD (Bhopal). API'rapriation (Railways) No. 2 Bill, 1985, otl the 2«11 J.anuary., 198'. and transmitted to the Rajya Sabtta for its recommeodatioos on 18.56 lin. the same day aDd to scare thai tbe Rajya Sabha ~ t ks sitting bdd 011 MESSAGES PllOM llAJY A SABHA (be 30th January, 1985, recommea- ded that the f • The fOilotriDl Membcrl aJIo reconW tllcir voteI for Ayes ! ShrA T. AnJiab, Sbri R. Jcevara'boam, Sbri A. JayamobaD, Sbn JalUDath PrasId Shri Laliteswar Sbabi, Shri Shaakar Dayal SiDah, Sbrimati IDdulDaii Bbattachalna. Sbri Mobar SjDlb. Shri Azee& Sail, Sbrimati Suo4erwati Naval Prabb~ar, Sbrimati &&maben R. Mavani, Sbri G.S. Baaavarli, Dr. S. J.p.tbratshakaD. Shd Bapulel MalYi" • Sbri S.K. SiDlb, Sbri N.R. Jaoar4hanao, Sbri C. MacSbav Reddy, Shri Manda OajapaU , Reju. Sbri Vadde SobbaJJCdrteswaro Rao, ~bri S.Y. Bbatlam. Shri Jaipal Reddy. Shri NarayaoaswanU. Sbri IC... Ramacbaodra Reddy, Sbri Vi"', Kumar Raju. Sbri P. ~alaiab, Sbrt M. Rqhuma Red~y, Shri K.N. SwaIDY. Sbri Mlnik Reddy, Dr. China. Mohan. Shri Aoil Basu, Sbri P.A. NarsimlwD, Sbri C. Saabu, Shrimati Sblila Dixit, Sbri Sat,... Naraio Sinha ID4 Sbri V. Tullita& 203 Co"stitutlo. JANUARY 30, tn, (,2rti ..4""".) Btli 2)\ APPROPRIATION .,.(LULWAYS) BILL, 1985 1'.04 ..... [ D... 1sIoa No.2] APPROPIUAnOJI (aAILWAYS) NO.2 "LL, 1985 AYES [Eng/is"] A SECRl!TARY.GENEllAL : SIr... lilly on tbe Table the followiol Bill. wbida blve Abbasi Sbri, LJ. been returned b)' Sabha with recom- a'jy, Abdul Obaroor. Sbri meDd ..lioos :- Acharia, Shri Buudeb J. The Appropriatioo (Railways) BiU, Adaikalaraj, Sbri L. 1985. Adiyodi, Dr. K.G. 2. The AppropriatioD (Railways) NO.2 Bill, 198'5. Agarwa], Shri Jai Prakash Ahmad, Shri Sarfaraz 19.00 hra. Ahmad, Beaum Abida CONSTITUTION ~FIFTY.SECOND Altha Ram, Shri AMENDMENT), BILL-CoPltd. Anand Sinlb. Shri [English) Anjiab, Shri T. Anoa Nambi. Shri R. MR. SPEAKER: Now we take up the Bill Clause by Clause. ADsari, Shri Abdul HaDDan Before I put Clauae No. 2 to Ansari, Shri Z.R. the . vote of the House, tbis beinl a CODstitution Amendment DiU, voting baa to AntODY, Shri P.A. be done by division. Let tbe lobbiel be Arunachalam, Shri M. cleared. Awasthi, Shri Jagdish Now the lobbies have been cleared. Azad, Shri Bhaawat Jha There are no alT'eodments given notice of to Azad. Shri Ohulam Nabi claules 2. 3. 4 and S. If the House agrees, 1 will put all tbese Clauses toaetber to tbe vote B of tbe Houle. Tbe result will be applicable BqbeJ, Sbrf Pratap SinJ}l to each of these Clauses •••••• Balun Sumbrui, Shri SEVERAL HON. MEMBERS: Yes. Bairagi, Shri Balnv( MR. SPEAKER : Now I put ClaUlel Bairwa. Shri Banwari Lal 2, 3, 4 and S togcther to tbc voce of the Baitba, Shri D.L. House. Bajpai. Dr. Rajendra Kumari Tft question is : Balaraman, Sbri L. "That Clauses 2, 3, 4 and 5 stand part Bali. Shrimati Vyjayantbimala of tbe Bill". Banerjee. Shrimati Mamt. The Lok Sahha Divided: Danli La', Shri MAGHA 10. 1906 (SAKA) (52,,1 ATltdt.) Bifl 206 Barman, Sbri Palas ChaV!.ll, Shrimati PremaJabat Barrow, Sbri A.B.T. Chavan, Shri S.B. Basavarajeswari, Sbrimati Chidambaram, Shri P. Buavaraju, Shri G.S. CbiDta Mohan, Sh" Basu, Shrl Anil Cbokta Rao, Shri J. Dbagat, Sbri B.R. Cboubey, Shri Narayan Bhapt, Shri H.K.L. Choudhari, Shri Mand1al Bhakta, Sbri Manoranjao Choudbari, Shrimati Ushatai Pratasta Bbanu Pratap Sinab, Sbri Cbowdbary, Sbri Iagannath Bharadwaj, Shri Parasram Cbowdhary, Shri Saifi'udlO Dbarat Sinlb, Sbri D Bhoi. Dr. Krupa.iDdbu Dabhi, Shri Ajit Singh. Bhoopathy, Sbri G. Dal&, SAri Moot Chan4 Bhosale, Shri Prataprao Debutao Dalbir Singh, Shri Bhoye, Shri R. M. Dalbir Sinp, Shri Bhoye, Shri Sitaram 5ayaji Dalwai, Shri Hussain Bburia, Shri Diteep SiDah Damar, SMi Somjibhai Bir Sen, Shri Dan4a.ate, Pn1f'. Madha Birbal, Sbri Das, Shri Anaeli Cbaraa Birencira Singh, Rao Daa, Sbri R. P. Biswas, Shri Ajoy Dennis., Sbri N.. BrahI;D& Dult, Shri Oeo, SAri V. Killuue OIanlra S. Buta SiDp, Sbri Deora, Sbti t.ludi c Deui, Skri B. V.. Chaodra M"han Sinlb. Shri Devara581l, Slui 1;. Chandra Pratap Nataln Singh. Sbrf Devi, Shrimati Chandra Biln. Cbanckakar, Sbri CbaDdulal Dhram"ir Sinah, Shri CbaDdrllekhar, ShrimaU Maraathut Dhal1llpaI SiDth, Shri OaDcItuhekharappa, Shri T, V. Dbariwal, Skri Shanti KumaT Cbandreab Kumari, Shrimatj Diaal, Stiri Radhakaota Charles, Shri A. DigAc, SAri Stlarad Cbalurvedi, Slui Nardh Cbaftdra Oiavijay SIDaR. Shri Cbaturvedi, Shrimati Vidyawati Dig\'ijay iingh, Sbri Q."dbar). SIIlf Maapbool Sinp D,kshlt, Shnmali She~. Cbaydhar1, Shri A.lI.A~ Gilui Khaa Dioeah Sioab, Sbr.i Con.JlitUlicm JANUAR Y 30, 1985 (52"d Amdt.) Bill 201 Dogra, Shri G. L. J Dubc, Shri Bhisbma Ow Jadeja. Shri D. P. Jaffer Sbarief. Shri C. K. Jagan Nath Prasad, Sbri FaJdro, ShTi Eduardo Jagatbrakshakan. Shri S. FerDail4es, Shri Oscar Jagjivan Ram, Shri Jaideep Singh, Shri G Jain, Sbri Dal Chander GadgiJ, Shri V. N. Jain. Shri Nihal Singh Gadhavi, Shri Bheravadao K Jain, Shri Virdbi Chander Gaekwad, Shri Ranj;t Singh Janardbanan, Sbri M. R. Gaikwad, Shri VdaYS)Dgrao Nana!aheb Jangde, Shri Khelan Ram Gami', Shri C. D. Jatav, Shri Kammodi Lal Gandhi, Shri Rajiv Jayamohan, Shri A. Ganga Ram, Shri Jeevarathinam. Shri R. Gavit, Shri Mallikrao Hodlya lena, Shri Chintamani Gehlo[, Shri Ashok Jhansi Lakshmi, Shrimati N. P. Gholap, Shri S. G. Jjtendra Prasad, Shri Ghosal, Shri Debi Jitendra Singh, Shrj Gho!lh, Prof. Bimal Kant; Jujhar Singh, Shri Ghosh, Shri TaTun KalJti K GOhll, Shri G. B. Kabu]i, Shri Abdu] Rashid Gomango, Shri GiridPlar Kalpana Devi, Dr. T. Gopeshwar, Shri Kamal Nath, Shri Goswami, Shrimali Blbha Gbosb Kamat, Shri Gurudas Goundcr, Shri A Senapatb.i Kamble, Shri Arvind Tullhiram Gowda, Shri H. N. Nanje Kamla Kumari, Shrimati Guha, Shrirnati PhuJrenu K.amla Prasad~ Shri Gupta, Shrimoti Prabhawat; Kamla Prasad Singh, Sbri H Kaul, Shrimati Sheila Kaushal, Shri Jagan Nath Halder, Shri ManoranjaD Ken, Shri Lala Ram HanD an Mo\lah, Sbri Hardwari La I, Shri Keyur Bhusan, Sbri Harpa\ Singh, Shri Khan, Shri Arif Mohammad Hembram. Shrj Seth Khan, Shri A.lam Sher 209 COlUtitutio" MAGHA la, 1906 (SAKA) (52nd Amdt.) Bill 210 Khan, Sbri Mohd. Ayub Mane, Shri R. S. Khan, Shri Rahim Manvendra Singh, Sbri Khan, Shri Zulfiquar Ali Masudal Hossain. Shri Syed Khatri, Shri Nirmal Mavani Ramjibhai, Shrimati Patel Ramaben Khirhar, Shri R. S. Mehta, Shri Haroobhai Kidwai, Shrimati Mohsina MeijinglungJ Shri Kamson Kinder Lal, Shri Mishra, Shri Gargi Shankar Kisku, Shri Prithvi Chand Mishra, Dr. Prabhat Kumar Kolandaivelu, Shri p. Mishra, Shri Ram Na~a Konyak, Shri Chingwang Mishra, Shri Uma Kant Kri~han pratap Singh, Shri Misra, Shri Nityananda Krishna Singh, Shri Misra, Shri Satyagopal Kshirsagar, Shrimati Kesharbai Modi. Shri Vishnu Kumar Kuchan, Shri Gangadhar S. Mohandas, Shri K. Kujur, Shri Maurice Mohan Lal, Shri Kumaramangalam, Shri P. R. Mohanty, Shri Braja Mohan Kunwar Ram, Shri More, Prof. Ram Krishna Kuppuswamy, Shri C. K. MotilaI Singh, Shri Kurien , Prof. P. J. Mukherjee, Shrimati Geeta L Munshi, Shri Priya Ranjan Das Murmu, Shri Sidha Lal Law, Shri Asutosh Murthy, Shri M. V. Chandrashekara Lowang, Shri Wanghpha Murugaiah, Shri A. R. M Muttemwar, Shri Vilas Madhuri Singh, Shrimati N Mahajan, Shri Y. S. Naik, Shri G. Devaraya Mahata, Shri Chittaranjan Naik, Shri Shantaram Mahendra Singh, Shri Naikar, Shri D. K. Maken, Shri Lalit Narsimham. Shri P. A. Makwana, Shri Narsinh Malik, Shri Purna Chandra Narayanan, Shri K. R. Mallick" Shri Lakshman Natarajan, Shri K. R. Ma\viya, Shri Bapu\al Nehru, Shri Arun Kumar MandaI, Shri Sanat Kumar Netam, Shri Arvind Mane, Shri MurJidhar Nikhra, Shri Ramcshwar 211 COIUtilllliilll JANUARY 30, 1985 (52l1li ~mdt.) Bill 212 o Pattnaik, Sbri JaganDath Odedra, Shri BIlarat Kumar Pawar. Shri Balesaheb Pawar, Sbri Sa~,aDarayan Odeyar, Shr; Channaiab Peruman, Dr. p. Vallal p Pilot, Shri Rajesh Pada1lChi, Sbri S. S. Ramaswamy Potdukbe, Shrl Shaataram Pakeer Mohamed, Shri E. S. M. Prabhu, Shri R. Pande, Shri Raj Mansal Pradhani. Shri K. Pande,,. Shri Damodar Prakash Chandra, Shri Pandey, Sbri hladan Puran Chandra, Shri Pandey,Shri ~anu1 Panigr&bi. Sb,; Cbintamaoi Q PanipaRi,. Sbri SribalJav Qureshi, Shr; A%iz Panita, Shri Ram "are R PaDja, Sbri A. K. Raghuraj Singh. Shri 'ant, Sbri K.. C. Rai. Sbri ,. Rama "pileddy, Shri B"ezawada Rai, Shri Ramdeo Paraabar, Prof. Nania ChaDd Raj' Karan Singh, Shri Pardhi. Sbli Kesbaorao Rajeshwaran, Dr. V. Paswan, Shri Ram Bbap' Rajhans, Dr .. O.S. Patel, Sbrt Akmed M. Ilaju. Shri Anand O~pati Patel, Sbri C. D. Ram, Sbri Ramswaroop 'atel~ ibn G, 1. Ram Awadh Prasad. Sbri Patel, Sbli H. M. Ram Oban, Shri Patel, Sbri Mohan !.aJ Ram Kuwar, Sbri Pater, Sbri Ram PUjaA Ram Prakash. Sbri Patet, SIIri Uttambbai H. Ram Samujhawan, Sbtf "that, Sflti Chandra lCi.lIor.. hmamurtb" Slni K. PatiT, Sftri BlJasabeb yw. RampaI Sinlb, Sbri Patil, Smt Prakasb V. RamrataD, Shri Kalicbarad PatiI, Sbri Sbivntj V r Jt.amu~ Sbri H.G. latil. Sbri Uuamrao- R.ana ~jr SiDab. Shri Pad.... Sbri. Yceroodra. Ran.. , Prof. N.G. Patil, Sbri Vija)' N. It.aDpoaili., Sbri K..H. htil, Sbri Yashwantrao- Gadakb: bop Sbri C.B. Sribari fttD&i~ Shrimati ta,aau. R.ao, Dr. G.Vijay.rama 213 Coutltullon MAGHA 10. 1906 (SAKA) (52nd Amdt.) Bill 214 Rao, Sbri J. Vcngala Sbab, Shri Anoopchand RIo, Shri K.S. Shutawat, Prof. Nirmala Kumari Rao, Sb ri P. V. Narasimha Sbankaraoand, Shri D. Reo, Shri Vadde Sobhanedreeswara Shanmugam, Shri A.C. Rath, Shri Somnath Sbanmupm. Shri P. Rathawa. Shri Amarsinh Shanti Devi, Sbrimati Ratbod, Shri Uttam Sharma, Shri Nand Kilhore Rathore. Shri Mohar Singh Sharma, Sbri Nawal Kishore Raut, Shri Dhola Sharma. Shri Pratap Dhanu Ravani, Shri Navin Shastri, Sbri Hari Krishna Rawat, Shri Harish Shervani. Shri Saleem I. Rawat, Shri Prabhulal Shingda, Shri D.D. Shivendra Babadur Sioah, SOO Reddy, Shri S. Raghuma Shukla, Sbri Vidya Charan Reddy. Shri Sudini Jaipal Siddiq, Sbri Hariz Mohd. Riyan, Shri Baju Ban Sidnal, Shri S.B. Roy, Shri Sudbir Singaravadivel, Shri S. Roypradhan, Shri Arnar Singh, Shri D. G. s Singh, Shrj K.N. Saba, Sbri Ajit Kumar Singh, Shri Lal Vi;'y Pratap Saba, Shri Gadadhar Singh, Kumari Puahpa Devi Sabi, Shrimati Krishna Singh, Shri S.D. Sabu, Shri Shiv Prasad Singh Deo, Sbri It.P. Sait, Shri Azeez Sinha, Sbri A tisa. Chandra Sambu, Shri Chimata Sinha, Sbrimati Kishori Sangmar, Shri P.A. Sinha, Sbrimati Ram Oulari Sankta Prasad, Dr. Sinha, Shri Satyendra NaraYID Santosb, Sbri Socii. Shrj Mankuram Satendra Chandra, Shri Solanki, Shri Kalyaa SiDab Satbe, Shri Vasant Soren. Shri Haribar SouDdararajan. Sbri N. Scindia, Shri Madhavrao So%. Prof. Saifuddin Selvendran, Shri P. Sreenivasa PrQad, Sbri V. Sen, Sbri A.K. Sen, Shri Bho]a Nath Sreeramamurthy, Sbri Bhattam Sethi, Sbri Anaota Prasad Subburaman, Sbri A.G. Sethi, Shd P.C. Sukhadia. Shrimati IDdubala 215 Constitution JANUARY 30, 198~ (52"d Amdt.) Bill 216 Sultanpuri, Shri K.D. v Suman, Shri R. P. Vairale, Shri Madhusudan Sundararaj, Shri Van , Shri Deep Narain Sunder Lal, Shri Vankar, Shri Punam Chand Mithabhai Sunil Dutt, Shri Venkataratnam, Shri Nissankara Rao Surendra Pal Singh, Shri Venkatcsan, Shl i P.R.S. Suryawanshi, Shri Narsingrao Verma, Dr. C.S. Swamy, Shri K.N. Verma, Shrimatl U~ha SwelJ, Shri G.G. Vljayaraghavan, Shn V.S. T Vyas. Shri Glrdhan Lal Tapeshwar Singh, Shri w Taradevi, Kumari D.K. Wadiyar Shri Srikanta Datla 4 Tariq Anwar, Strri Narasemnaraja Tewary, Prof. K.K. Wal;nik, Shri Mukul Thakkar, Shrimati Ushaberr RaJba"'.:l Wasnik. Shri Balkrishna Thakur, Shri C.P. y Thambi DUTai, Shri M. Yadav, Shri Kaila5h Tbangaraju, Shri S. Yadav , Shri Mahabir Prasad Thoma!, Prof. K.V. Yadav, Shri R.N. Thorat~ Shri Bhausabeb Yadav, Sbri Ram Singh Thota Gopala Krishna, Sh,j Yadav, Shri Shyam La) TbDIlgon, Sbri P.K. Yadav, Shri Subhash Tigga, Shri Simon Yadav, Shri Bal Ram Sinsh TiJakdhari Singb, Sbri Yadav, Shri D.P. Shri Piyusb Tirki, Yazdani, Dr. Golam Tomar, Shrimati Ushe Rani Yeshpal SioSh, Shri Tombi Singh, SlKi N. YOlesbwar Prasad, Shri Tripathi, Sbrimati Chanda z Tripatbi, Dr. Cbandra Sbektlar Tulsiram, Sbri V. Zainal. Abedio, Sbri Tytler, Sbri Ja&disb Zainul, BaMler, Sbri u NOES Uooikrisboao,. Shei LP'.. NIL 217 COlUtltutioft MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52nd Arndt.) Bill 218 MR. SPEAKER : Very good. Remar. without application of any whip by the Irablc achievement. The teacher mu.t be members of the respective Houses, to be congratulated. known as the 'JudIcial Commiaee 00 Disqualifications, and their decisIOn shall be final. n Subject to correction, the result ** t of the Division is : Ayes-417; Noes-Nil. (ii) Omit lines 32 to 40 (4) • Page 4,-- The Motion is carried unanimously, by a majority of the total membership of the House and by a majority of not Jess than omit lines 41 to 43. (5) two·thirds of the Members present and voting. Page 4, line 45, - The Motion was adopted. for Chairman or the Speaker of a House" substitute" Judicial Committee Clauses and were added to the Bill. 2, 3, 4 5 on Disqu41lifications" (6) Clause 6 (Addition to tenth Scbedule) Page 5,- SHRI K.P. UNNIKRISHNAN omit lines 3 to 11. (7j (Badagara) : I beg to move : Page 5, lioe IS, - Page 4,- (i) lines 30 and 31,- for "Chairman or the Speaker of for •'Chairman or. as the case ma;y be, the House" substitute "Judlcial Committee Speaker of such House aod hill decision on Disqualifications" (8) shall final :" be Page 5, - (i) lioe 24, -- iub.titule- for "Chairman or the Speaker of House" sllbstitut~ Ie] lIdidai Committee -'Joint Committee of the two Houses OD Disqualifications" with Dot less than four members to be elected from Lolc: Sabha and three (ii) line 26, - members to be elected from the Rajya Sabba, with Dot less than two members from LOIc: Sabha and one member from Rajya Sabha belonging to the Opposi- tioo, aad the Chait'mao to be appointed SHRI SUDINI JAIPAL REDDY ~ tbe Speaker from amon~: tbe (Mahbubnagar) : I beg to mov: : members of such Committee , all IIICIDbers of the Committoe to be elected Page 2, -- **1 be reault of tbia DivisioD it ap~.licable tOt eadl of the claulCl 2. 3, 4 aoci S .."acateI7. t Tbe following members also tee ordod their yotes for A YES: Sb.. Ram Rataa aam, 811. Talit' esbwar Sllabi, Sltrimati lnduwal i Bhattacbaryya, Shrimati SUBderwati Nawal Prabhakar. Shri Swami Prasad Singb, Sbri S,ripati Misbra, Shri Natwar SiJlgll Solaaka, Shri V. Krishna Ileo, Shri Ajay Narain Mu~.llran, Sbri Dcyinem Narayanaswamy, Shri K. Ramchaadra Reddy, Shri Vijay Kumar Ra:Ju. Sbri p. Peachalaiah, Sari Manit Reddy, sari A.J.Y.B. Meliesw.... RIo a04 Shri K.' N. Pradbu. 219 C0"3tll utio" JANUARY 30, 1985 (52l1li Amdt.) Bill 220 .mit lines 3S to 38. (62) substitute-- Page 3, Jine ~t - "a committee of not Jest than ten members to be constituted for luch for 'one-third' substitute 'one-fourtb' (64) purpose by the Chairman or the Speaker, as the case may be reflecting the party- Pale 4, linel 30 and 31, -- wise composition of the House with himself as Chairman of 8uch Committee for "Chairman or, as the case may be, the and its decision shall be final." (74) Speaker of such House and his decision Page 4, lines 34 and 3S, -- -hall be final ." for "such member of the HOUle as the substilute-- House may elect in this behalf and his decision shall be final." "Joint Committee or (he two Houses witb not less than four members to be substitute-- eJecled from Lot Sabha and three members to be elected from Rajya "a Committee constituted for the pur- Sabha, with not less than two members pose by the Chairman or the Speaker from Lok Sabha and one member from as the case may be and itl decisfon Rajya Sabha belongin g to the Opposi- shall be final. tion, and the Chairman 10 be appointed by the Speaker from among the Provided rurther that the members of such Committee and all Speaker or the Chairman shall not be members of the Committee shall be present during the deliberations of tbe elected without application of any whip Committee." (75) by tbe members of the respective Houses to be knowD, as tbe 'Judicial SHRI AMAR ROYPRAOH AN : I bel Committee on DiaqualificatioDa' and to move: tbeir decision sball be final :" (65) Pale 3, line 34, -- Page S, - for "one-tbird" subltitute "one-fifth" (i) omit lines 3 to 11 (91) (ii) line 12,-- Pale 4, lines 30 and 31,-- for U(d) substitute "(b)" (67) for "tbe Chairman or, as tbe ca. may SHRI BASUDEB ACHARIA (Bankura): be, the Speaker of such HoUle and- ) be, to move : his" Page 3, line 3S, -- ,ubstitute "a committee consiatinl of tbe Leader of the House and the leaden of add at the end- all parties and Groupa in the House witb Speaker or Chairman, u tbe cue "and nODe of the said group take any may be, its Chairman and it." (93) oftice at Minister for a period of one year from date of split" (73) SHRI A.K.. SBN : I heg to move: Pale 4, linea 30 and 31,- Page 2.- for lines 3S to 38, substilute- for "tbe Chairman or, a. tbe case may be, tbe Speaker of such House and his "and such voting or abstention has Dot decision .ball be finIJ." been condoned by such political party, 221 COllltl,lItkm MAOfIA 10, lt06 (SAKA) (521td Anrdt.) BIll penon or authority within fifteeD days MR. SPEAKER : It is aI. ripl. , ..14 from tbe date of such votiDa or do it. Me. UnoikrilhDaD ma, tpeak oa bis abstention." (111) amendment. Pap 3.- SHaI K. P. UNNIKRISHNAN (Badalara) : Mr. Speaker. Sir, J dOt1ot want for linea 36 to 42, JubJtltute- to take much time ot the House cscepl lbat I have strong reservations aboat Itt. Qause 6 (2). AI I have explaiiled earlier r,. a tyItem "ea) he shall Dot be disqualified under of parliamentary democracy the ~ of the paraltapb OD sub-paragraph (1) of 2 Speaker is the moat crucial ODe. 'n.re are the .roulMl- pawm attached to this o8Ioe; dilaletioos attached to tbis office and lrave fOlC*llibiJj.. (i) tbat be hal voluntarily given up his ties attached to tbis of6co. To clOthe tbe membership of his orilinal political office of the Speaker in the preICIIt context party; or witb this power to allow him to ovenee .~ ther a Member bas disqualified himself from beiDI a member would be rather ~Dnate (ii) that be has voted or abstaioed from because the office 0( ahe Speaker .. JOu are votiDg in such House contrary to any very well aware, is 'olded witb responsibili- direction issued by luch party or by ties of kind which no ordioary morw can any person or a:Jthority authorised by fulfil. So Speaker being tbe symbol of the it in tbat behalf without obtaining the authority of the HoUle, you are also aware pric'r permission of sucb party. person or the 10Delineas that you have and also how or authority and such voting or abstene remote you are. Therefore. in this kind of a tion has not been condcned by 8uch legislation which is specially a Dew attempt- party. person or autbority within fifteen a very welcome attempt at that-I would not days from the date of such voliDa or went to have excessive load OIl the o8ice of abstention; and". (112) the Speaker. Sar. your office Aotdd be left free to attend to your I.... e area of respoou- bility in conducting this HoUle which itself Page S,- is a very onerous coastitutioaal respGDJi- bility t and to be fair to thOle, who hold oOice omit linea 3 to 7. (113) I do Dot wIDt to cast upcrsion. thole Speakers in tbe State Le,islarures, who may Plac 5, line 8,- have .trayed from the path-_' and laqe, it .1I0uld be admitted, aDd I do admit., tile of6oe of tbe Speaker hu t.. held in areat lor "Ce)" 8u/JllitJd. "(b)" (114) dianity and occupied b, people of lreal emineoce riabt from the days of the Ccotral Pap S, line 9.- Allembly here u well at ill the State Leais- lative Auemblics. Thercfore, I "ave suuet- ted that it should be left to a Joint Commi- omit uexpulaiOD rro~ or" (115) ttee of both HoulCI with you as the Chair- man, or it s"ould be left to you to DOmiutc Page 5, liDe 12,- • a..inDIa. for "(d)" subltitute ''(c)U (116) I am sl'Cakina OR all the amendmcats that I want to pre.. SHIU G G. SWELL : Mr.. Speaker~ Sir, we are unanimous on this Bin and we Secondty~ I want lints ~ t'() 40 on paae have spoken enough. If you qree we -4 to be deleted. While I do not yield to any- CID put all tbe amendments, other tbllll one in matters whidt \:oncem priviIeaCi fA Goverameat amendments. tOlctber. tlUl Hovsc, I must.., ~at a Member.as aa 223 Constitution JANUARY 30, 1985 (52nd Amdl.) Bill 224 individual has certain rights. The involve- can a decision taken by the Speaker in his ment of the use of the words 'proceedings of personal discretion without reference to any the House' is well-known to this House. House Committee or proceedings of the House be deemed as the proceedings of the House? Therefore, Sir, either the Govern- There are several Supreme Court judge- ment should agree to spare the office of the ments which have upheld and said that it Speaker of this onus responsibility or they shall not involve itself into the rightness or must at least see that 6(2) is eliminated when otherwise of the proceedings of the House. this Clause 7 is retained. Since the Member has no recourse to remedies under Articles 32 or 226, it would be good if this is deleted and left to the good SHRI A.K. SEN: It ia disastrous to sense of the House. As the Prime Minister leave this in the hands of Committee of the has pointed out, there are certain lacunae, two Houses. The hon member has not and there should be certain built-in reserva- provided in his amendment for the Legisla- tions also. It would be better if we delete tures of the States because paragraph 6 this provision and allow healthy conventions provides for those in Parliament and Legisla- to evolve themselves, With these words, I tures in the States. If you leave it to a commend my amendments to the House. Committee, it is like voting on party lines and it will again be endless litigation. There- SHRI S. JAIPAL REDDY : Sir, fore, it is best to leave it to the Speaker or I have also tabled certain amendments. the Chairman. Anrl the Speaker will only have to find out whether in fact a person has resigned or he will have to find out whether Shri Unnikrishnan has rightly observed infact he ha, voted or abstained from voting and I am also of the considered view that contrary to the mandate of the party. the august office of Speaker should be kept above the din of dispute for disqualification of Members. SHRI S JAIPAL REDDY ; The Law Minister has not answered our query why Sub-clause (2) of Clause 6 should be retained In regard to clause 7, I am in when he was Clause 7. agreement with the Government and I am of the view that the jurisdiction of courts must SHRI A.K. SEN : Because paragraph 7 be ousted specifically, otherwise it would bars the jurisdiction of the Court, we should entail very lenghty litigation and cumbersome give a remedy to the person aggrieved. procedure. When Clause 7 is there, I do not see any reason why sub clause (2) of Clause 6 must be retained. The idea is very simple. SHRI BASUDEB ACHARIA : Sir, We bave lot a very experienced Law Minister I have .•• _ and be knows that even when the jurisdiction of courts is ousted, an affected person can MR. SPEAKER : I would have given take recourse to Article 226 or Article 32 of you time if you had risen earlier. Now, the Constitution. It would patently impolitic, you have missed the bus. You are just left unconstitutional and unwarranted to prevent standing ri@ht on the platform. an affected person. even from taking resort to Articles 226 and 32 of the Constitution. Therefore, I have two suggestions to make in I shall now put all this connection. One, either the Government the amendments moved to Clause 6, barring should accept our suggestion that a Commi- the Government amendments, to tbe vote of ttee on Disqualifications should be entrusted the House. with the authority in this regard or if the office of Speaker is to be necessarily involved Amendments No. 4 to 9, 62, 64, 65, 67, 73 10 let not the decision of the Speaker b~ deemed to re the proceedings of the House. 75, '/1 and 93 were pul and negatived. It will be terribly unfair because the Speaker will take a personal decision without SHRI A.K. SEN: 1 am not moviDI reference to discussion in the House. How amendment Nos. 114 and ] 16. But I am 22S Constitution MAGHA )0. 1906 (SAKA) (52nd Amdt.) Bill 226 putting a new amendment 113 which I will will come to the others later. The questioo put in the Rule Making Section. And I will is ; give you the copies. I will read out. I tell you why in a moment. Sir, the point is this -Page 2,- that we found out that condonation is a clause which saves disqualification. We have not provided for how evidence as to condon- for lines 35 to 38, sltbstitute- ation is to be furnished to the Speaker and under the rules we have to provide for it. "and such voting or abstentioo has Dot been condoned by such political party, I beg to move : person or authority within fifteen day. from the date of such voting Ol' absteG& lion." '(Ill) Page 5,-- for lioes 3 to 7. substitutt- Page 3,- H(b) the report which the leader of a legisla- for lines 36 to 42, Jubstitute- ture party in relation to a member of a House shall furnish with regard to any ·"(a) ~e shan not be disqualified under condonation of the nature referred to sub-paragraph (I) of paragraph 2 in clause (b) of sub-paragraph (1) of on the ground- paragraph 2 in respect of such member. the time within which and the authorny to whom such report shall be furnished" (i. that he bas voluntarily gjYen (113 as revised). up his membership of his original political party; ()f' PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE Provided the leader has not defected! (ii~ that he hn voted or abstai- ned from voting in such SHRI A.K. SEN : Amendments No. HQu5e contrary to any direct- J 14 and 116 may be withdra\\n; and instead 'ion issued by such party 'Or of amendment No.1 13, this may be moved. by any person or authority authorised by it in that behalf without obtaining tbe prior SHRI 0.0. SWELL: Any amendment pet"mission of such party, moved, if it is to be withdrawn, has to be person or authority and such withdrawn by the leave of the House. votic! or abstention ha~ not been condoned by such party" MR. SPEAKER: Yes. person or authority within fifteen days from the date of ~uch voting or abstootion; SHRI 0.0. SWELL: Secondly, each n and "(112) one of the Om,ernment amendments has to be voted by division, because it is going to stand part of the Bill. The Motion was adopted. MR. SPEAKER : No; it is not necess- MR. SPEAKER: Now we put amend- ary for amendments. ment No. 113, as revised. The Minister bas just read it out. I can ask bim to read it PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE out again for YOU. ~ Ooly for tbe ClauleS. SHRI A.K. SEN : May 1 read out! MR. SPEAKER : Now I will first go ahead with Amendment. No, 111 and 112. I (InterrMptio"s) 227 JANUARY 30, 198! (52nd Amdt.) Bill 228 MR. SPEAICER : No; this is something Tbe question is : else. That will come later. Pap 5, line 9.- SHRI A.K. SEN : If the hOD. Member omit "expulsion from. or" (US) sees it, be will know that tbis is with a view to allay cenain apprehensions tbat condona- tioD saves disqualification. Now, the fact of Tht Motio" was adopted. COddonatioo bow ·it is to be reported, to wbom it is to be reported, is provided for in MR. SPEAKER : Before I pllt clause 6, the rule-makml -powers. So, instead of as amended, to the vote of tbe House, tbis IJDeDdmeot No. 113, this new amendments being a Constitution Amendment Bill, yoting .m 10 in. has to be by division. Let the lobbies be cleared- MR. SPEAKER : Now amendment No. 113, as I'tvised by Shri Sen. The question Now, .he Lobbies have been cleared. is: The question is : 'Pale S, for lines 3 to 7, substitult- "That ciause 6, as amended, stand part of the Bill." "(b) the Tepan which the leader of a legislature party in relation to a The Lok Sabha divided. member of a House shall furnish with regard to aoy condonation of the nature referred to in clause (b) 1935 hrs. or sub-paraaraph (1) of parasrapb 2 in respect of such member, the Division No.3 time withia which and the authority to whom $Ucll report sball be AYES furnisbed;" '(113 as revised) A The Motion was adopted. Abdul Ohafoor. Shri MR. SPEAKER : Mr. Sen. do you Acharia, Shri Basudeb want to withdraw amendments No. 114 and Adaikalaraj, Shri L. 1161 Adiyodi, Dr. K.G. SHRI A.K. SEN : Yes. Agarwal, Shri Jai Parkash Abmed, Shri Sadaraz MR. SPEAKER: Is it the pleasure of the ·House that amendments No. 114 and Ahmed, Begum Abida 116, moved by Sbri Sen, be withdrawn? Alkha Ram, Shri Anand Singh, Shri SEVERAL BON. MEMBERS: Yes. Anjiab. Sbri T. Amt"dme1J1S Nos. 114 and 116 wtre, by Anna Nambi, Shri R. leave, withdrawn. Ansari, Sbri Abdul Hannan Ansari, Shri Z. R. MR. SPEAKER: Now amendment No, 11 S which bas already beeD moved. Antony, Shri P,A. CQIIstiUltioll MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (5Jntl Ifmdl.) Bill Arunachalam, Shri M. ·C Chandra Mohan Singh. Sh~i Awasthi, Shri Jagdish Chandra Pratap Narain Singb, Shri Azad, Sbri Bhagv.at Jha Chaodrakar. Shri Chaodulal Azad. Shrj Ghulam Nabi Chandrashekharappa, Shri T.V. B Clu~ndresh Kumari, Sbrimati Baghcl. Shri Pratap Stngh Charies, Shri A. Bagun Sumbrui, Shri Chaturvedi, Shri Naresh Chandra Bairwa. Shri Banwari Lal Chaturvedi, Shrimati Vidyawatl Baitha, Shri D.L. Chal,ldhary, Shri Maophool Siogh Bajpai, Dr. R3_iendra Kumari Chaudhary, Shri A,BfA Ghani Khan Balaraman, Shri L. Chavan, Shrimati Premalabai Bali. Shrimati Vyjayanthimala Chavan, Shrj S.B. Banerjee. Shrimati Marota Chidambaram, Shri P. Bansi Lal, Shri Chinta Mohan, Shri Sbri J. Barmao, Shri Palas Cbokka Rao. Cboubey, Shri Narayan Barrow,. Shri A.E.T. Choudbari, Shri Nandlal Basavarajeswari, Shrimali Chaudbari, Shrimati Ushatai Prakash Basavaraju. Shri G.S. Chowdhary, Shri Jagannath Basu, Shri Ani! Chowdhury, Shri Saiffudin Bhagat, Shri B.R. Bhagat, Shri H.K.L. o Bhakta, Sbri Manoraojan Dabbi, Shri Ajil$inb Bhanu Pratap SiDlh, Sh ri Dala. Shri Mool ChaDd Bharadwaj, Shri Parasram DaJbir Sinah, Shri Bharat SioSb, Shri Dalbir linah, Sbri Bboi, Dr. Krupasindhu Dalwai, Shri Huuaan Bhosale. Sbci Prataprao Baburao Damor, Shri SoaUibbai Bhoye, Shri R.M. Dudavate. Prof. Madbu ahoye, Shri Sitaram Sayaji D4S. Shri ADadi Charao BbUlia, Shri Dileep Singh Du, Shri R.P. Birbal, Shri Donnis, Sbri N. Biswas, Shri Ajoy Dear&, Shri MurJi Brahma Dult, Shri Desai. Shri B.V. Buta Singh, Shn Dcvarajao, Shri B. 2)1 CDftltitutio" JANUARY JO, 198' (S2nd AIIId,.) Bill 2'% Devi, Sbrimati Chandra Bhanu Guha, Shtimati Pbulrenu O.apta Shrimati Dharambir SiDgIJ, Sllri f Pnlbhawatf Dharam Pal Singh, Sbri H Dhariwaf, Sbri Shantl Kumar Halder, Shri Manoranjao Digal, Shri Radtlakanta Hannan Mollah, Shri Digfie, Shri S'harad Hardwari LaJ , Shd Digvijuy Sinh, SMi Harpal Singh, ~P:'ri Dilyijay 5in~h, Shrr lkmbram l Shri Seth Ditshit, Shrimati Sheifa Dinesh Singh, Shr: Dogra, Shri G.L, Jadeja, Shri D. P. Dube, S~"i Bhi~hma Oeo Jaffer Sharief, Shri C.K Jagan Natp Prasad, Shl'~ F Jaideep Singh, ghr; P'alciro, Shri Eduardo Jain, Sbri Balchander fernandes, Shri Oscar Jain, Shri Nihal Singh G lain, Shri Virdhi Chandef Gadhavi, Shri Bheravadan K. lanardbanan, Shri M.R. Oitekwad, Sbri Ranjit StDgh JaDgde, Shri Khelafl Ram Gaikwad~ Shei Udaysingrao Naoa3ah.r;. Jata". SIlr. Kammodila-l Gamit, Shri C.O. Jayamohan, Shri A. Gandhi, Shri Rajiv Jccvarathioarn, Shri R. Ganga Ram, Shri 1ena, Sllri Chintamani Gavit, Shri Manikrao Hoc!~a· Jhansi Laksbmi, Shrimati S:.p r Gehlot, Shrf Ashok J1tendra Prasad. Shti Gholap, Sbri S:O. Jitendra Singh, Shri Ghosa~, Shri Debi Jujhar S;Dih, Shri Gbash, Prof, Bimal K.aatt K Ghosh, ShYi Tarun Kant; Gobil, Sbri G.B. Rabuii, Shri Abdul Rashicf. KaJpan8 [)evi, Dr. T. Gomango, Shri Giridhar Gopcsbwar, Shri It.amal Nath, Shri Goswami, Shrimati Bibha Ghosri lC.amat. Shri Guruda, Gounder, Shri A. Senapathi Kamble, Shri Arvind Tulshlrarr> GQwda, Sbri H.N. Nanjo Kamla Kumari, Shrimati· MAOHA 10, 1_ (I.4KA) kamla Prasad, Shrt Mabelldra Si'DIb, Shri kamla Prasad Siblb, Shrt Makeo, ShI'i Latit kaul, Shrimati Sheila Makwana, Shri Narsinh Kaushal, Sbri Jalan Natb Mallik, Sbri PtH'Il8 Ctlandl'a Ken, Shti Lala Ram Malick, Slui Lakmma1l Keyur Bhusab, Shrl Malviya., Sllri Rat>uJaI Khan, Shri Arif Mohammad 'Manaai, Sbri Sanat Kumar Khan, Sbri Allam Sher MaDe, SRr~ MurlicUlar Khan, Shri Mobd. Ayub Msne. 'Shri R"S. Khan, Shri Zulfiquar Ali Manvendra Siotih, Sbri Khetti, Shri Nirmal Masudal Rossa~ Sbri Syod Khirhar, Shri R.S. MavalM :Ramjibbai ShrimAti Pa~d Ranta"" Kidwai, Shrimati Mohsina Mehta, Sbri Haroobhlli Kinder Lal, Shri 'Mei-jinlguo8, Shri Kaml'>ll I<.isku, Sbri Prithvi Chand Misbeay Shei Gargi Shankar Ko]andaivetu, Sbri P. M 18Ma, Dr. -Pr.abhat Kumar J(onyak, Shri Chingwang ·Misbra, Sbri Ram Nagina lCrishao Pratap Singh, Shri Mishra, SOO Shripatl krishna Singh, Sbri Mishra, Sbri U'ma Kal1t Khirsagar, Shrimati Kesbarbal Misra, SAri Nityanaada Kuchan, Shri Gangadhar S. 'Misra, Shri Satyagopal Kujur, Sbri Maurice 'Modi, Shri Villlnu Kum. kumaramangalam, Sbri P.R. Mohandas, Shr~ K. Kunwar Ram, Shri Mohan Lat, Shri Kuppuswamy, Shri C.K. 'Mohenty, Stlri Brajamobaa Kurieo, Prof. P.l. 'More, 'Prof. Ram Krisnoa L 'MotUal Singh, Shri law, Sbri Asut~h "Muk)terjee, Shrimltti Geeta lowani, Shri Wanghph'a 'MuDsbi, Shri Priy. Raojan 0 .. Murmu, Sbri Sidha Lal M Murthy, Shri M.V. Chandrashck&* Madburi Singh, Shrimatt Murugaiab, Shri A.& Mabajan, Shri Y.S. 'Musbran, Sftri AJay Narayan Mabate, Shri CbiUaraojalt :tduUemwar, ShFi VUa 235 COll8litution JANUARY 30, 1985 (jhtd Arndt.) ,Bi.ll 236 N Patel, Shri Mohan Lal Patel, Shri Ram Pujan Naik, Shri G. Devaraya Patel, Shri Uttambhai H. Naik. Shri Shantaram Pathak. Shri Chandra Ki5hore Naikar, Shri D. K. Patil. Shri Balasaheb Vikhe Narsinham, Sl:tri P.A., Patil, Shri Prakash V. Narayanan, Shri K.R. Patil, Shri Sbivraj \'. Narayanaswarny Sbri Devincni NatarajaD. Shri K R. Patil, Shri Unamrao Natwar Singh. Shri Patil, Shri Veercndra Nehru. Shri Arun Kumar PaUl, Shri Vij~y N. Nctam, Shri Arviod PatH, Shri Yas h\\3ntrc GadOikh Nikbra, Shri Rameshwar Patnaik, Shrimati JayaDt! Pattnaik. Shri Jagaonath o Pawar, Shri Balesaheb Odedra. Shri Sharat Kumar 'Pawar, Shri Satyanara)ao Odayar~ Shri Chanoaiah Penchalaiah. Shrj PucbatapaJli p Peruman, Dr. P. Vdlal Pilot. Shri Raje!!.h Pak.eer Mohamed, Shri E.S.M. Potdukhc, Shri Shantaram Paodc, Shri Raj MaDlal Prabhu, Shri R. Pandey, Sbri Damodar Pradbaui, Shri K. Pandey, Shri Madan Prakash Chandra, Sbrj Pandey, Shri Maooj Poran Chandra, Shri PaDiarahi, Shri CbiQ~ni Purohit, Sbri Banwari Lat Paniarahi, 5hri Sriballav Panika, Shri Ram !»yare o PaDja, Shri A. K. Qureshi, Shri Aziz Pant, Sbri K.C. Papintddy, Sbri Bezawada R Parasbar. ~of. Nataio Cbaod RaaburaJ Slosh, Sltri hrc1bi, .ri KeIbaorao Rai. Sbri I. RIma Patel. Shri Ahmed M. Rai, Sbri Ramdeo Patel, Sbri c..o. Raj Karan Siqb, Sbri Patel. Shri 0.1. Rajesbwarao, Dr. V. Patel, Sbri H.M. Rajbaos, Dr. G.S. 237 CotUlitlltioll MAGHA 10, 1906 (S.4K..4) (5211d Amdt.) Bill 238 Raju, Shri Anaact Gajpati Riyan, Shri Baju Ban Ram, Shri Ram Ratan Roy. Sbri Sudhir Ram, Shri Ramswaroop Roypradhan, Shri Amar Ram Awadh Prasad, Shri Ram Dhan, Shri s Ram Parkash, Shri Saha, Sbri Ajit Kumar Ram Samujhawan, Shri Saha, Shr; Gadadhar Ramamunhy, Shri K. Sahi, Shrimati Krbhnu Rampa) Singh, Shri Sahu, Shri Shiv Prasad Ramratan, Shri Kalicharan Saito Shri Azeez Ramulu, Shri H.G. Sambu, Shri Chimata Rana Vir Singh, Shri Sangma, Shri P.A. Rang~, Prof N.G. Sankt:l Prasad, Dr. Ranganath, Shri K H. Santosh, Shri Rao, Shri Aithabathula Joges\\ lra Venkata Satl.:ndra Chandra, Shri Butchi Mahes\\'ara Sathe, Shri Valiant Rao, Shri C.H. Srihari Scindia, Shri Madhavrao Rao, Dr. O. Vijayarama Selvendran, Shri P. Rao, Shri J. VeDlala Sen. Shri A.K. Rao, Shl'i K.S. Sen, Shri Bhola Nath Rao, Shri P V. Narasimha Sethi, Shri AnanIa Prasad Rao, Shri V. Krishna Sethi. Shri P.C. Rao. Shri Vadde S()bhanedrl!e~\\ara Shah, Shri Anoopchand Rath, Shri Somnath Shahi. Shri Lalitesbwar Ratha\\a, Shri Amarsinh Shakta\\ar Prof. Nirmala Kumari Rathod, Shrl Uttam ShankaranaDd, Shri B. Ratbore, Shri Mohar Singh Shanmupm, Shri A.C. Raut, Shri Bbola ShaDmu8am. Shri P. Ravani, Shri Navin Shanti Devi. Shrtmau Rawat, Shri Harish Sharma, Shn Nand Kbhore Rawat, Shri Prabhulal Sharma, Shn Nawal Ki!)hore Reddy, Shri K. Ramachandra Sharma. Shri Par tap Bhan II Reddy, Shri p. Manik Sbervani, Shri Saleem I. Reddy, Shri S. Ragbuma Shivcndra Bahadur Singh. Shri Reddy, Shr; Sudioi Jaipal Shukla, Shri Vidya Charan JANUARY 30, 1985 (52"d Amdt.) Bill 240 Siddiq. Shri Hafiz Mohd. Taradevj, Kumari. O.K. Sidoal, Shri S.B. Tariq Anwar. Shri SiDpravadjye}, Sbri S. Tewary, Prof. K.K. Thakkar, Shrimati Usbaben Singb, Sbri D.O. Raghavji SiDgb, Sori K.N. Thakur, Sbri C.P. Sin"" Sbri Lal Vijay Pratap Thambi Durai, Shri M. Singhr Kamari Pusbpa De~i Thangaraju, Sbri S. Thomas, Prof. K. V . Singhr Shri S.D. Sinlb Deo, Sbri K.'P. Thorat, Shri Bbausabeb Singha, Shri Atish Cbandra 1 hota Gopa!a Krishna, Shri SiDha, Stllimati Kisoori Thungon, Shr; P.K. Sinha, Sbrimeti Ram Dulac; Tigga, Shri Simon SiDba, Sllli Satyendra NalaYaD TiJakdbari Singh, Shri Sodi, Sbri MaDkuram Tirki, Shri Piyusb Sotanki, Sbri Kalyan Singh Tomar, Shrimati Usha Rani Sotanki, Shri Natayanm!h Tombi Singh, Shri N. Soren, SIl,j Haribar Tripathi, Sbrimati Chanda Soundararajan, Sbrj N. lripathi, Dr. Cbandra Shekbar Sreenivasa Prasad, Shri V. Tulsicam, Shri V. Sreeramamuthy, Sbri Bbattam Tytler, Shri Jagdish Subburamaa, Sbri A.G. u Sukbadia, S~imati Indubala Unnikrisbnan, Shri K. P. SuhaDpori, Shri K.D. v Suman, Sbri R.P. VairaJe, Shri Madhusudan SUDdararaj, Shri Van, Shri Deep Narain SUDder La), Shri SunU Dutt, Shri Vankar. Shri Punam Chand Mithabhai Venkatesan, Shri P.R.S. Smeadr. Pal Singh, 8bri Suryawansbi, Sbri Narsingrao Verma, Dr. C.S. Swami Prasad SiUlb, Sbri Verma, Shrimati Usha Swamy,8bri K,N. Vijayaraghavan, Shri V.S. Swell .. Shri G.O. Vyas, Shri Girdhari Lal T W Wadi,ar, Shri Srikantba Datta Tapeahwar Sin,b, Shri Naralimharaja 241 Constitution MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAK") (52ncl Amdt.) Bill 242 WasDik, Shri Mukul PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: I think. by mistake, Shri Jaipal Reddy's WasDik. Shri Balkrishoa amendment has also been passed. y MR. SPEAKER [ was asking about Yadav, Shri Kailash Clause 2 (l)(c). Yadav, Shri R.N. Yadav, Shri Ram Singh SHR) A.K. SEN: Paragraph 2 (1) (c). Yadav, Shri Sbyam Lal This bas been subsitituted by Amendment No. Ill. Yadav, Shri Subhash Yadava, Shri Bal Ram Singh MR. SPEAKER: That is what I said. Yadava, Shri D.P. I stand corrected. It was moved. I gave an Yazdani, Dr. Golam assurance to Sbri Jaipal Reddy that it would come later. Yeshpal Singh, Shri Yogeshwar Prasad, Shri SHRI S. JAIPAL REDDY : I have a point. Firstly Clauses 2 to S are z adopted. Then Clause 6 is adopted. The amendment is taken after clause 2(lXc). How ZaiDll Abedin, Shri is the procedure reconciled? Zainul Basher, Shri MR SPEAKER : We have adopted all. NOES Thank you, Mr. Reddy. I stand corrected. NIL PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE when be moved the amcndmeot and it ;'_'as MR. SPEAKER: Subject to correction, passed automatically) it was adopted. the result * of the Division is : Ayes: 412; MR. SPEAKER : Now, we take up clause 1. There are amendments to clause 1. Noes: Nil. Sbri D.B. Patil-Not present ; Shri Narayan Cboubey-not present: Sbri Vijay Kumar The motion is carried by a majority of V.dav.:....not present. The lobbies are already tbe total membership of the House and cleared. The question is: by a majority of not less than two-third! of tbe members prescnt and voting. "That clause 1 stand part of the Bill" Tile Motion was adopted. TM Lok SablUJ divided. Clollse 6, as omended, JI,'as added 10 the Bill. • The followiog Members recorded their votes ror AYES : Sbri V. N. Gadgil, Shri Bir SeD, Sbrimati Chandrasheker Margatham, Shrimati Indu,mati Bbattacbaryya, Sbrimati Sunderwati Nawal Prabhaker, Shri Mababir Prasad Yadav. Sh(i Rahim KhaD, Shri D. B. Sbingda, Dr. S. Jagatbrakshakar, Shri Kazi JaliJ AbbaSI. Shri ' Balkavi Bairsg;, Sbri Nj$S8Dkara Rao Venkatarafham. Shrj Vijay Kumar Raju; Prof. Saifuddin Soz and Shri K. N. PradhllD. 243 Comfitu' ion JANUARY 30, 1985 (521fl1 Amdt.) Bill 244 19.44 hn. Barman, Shri Palas Barrow, Sbri A.B.T. Division No. 4 Basavarajeswari, Shrimati AYES Basavaraju, Shri G.S. Basu, Shri Anil A Bhagat, Shri B.R. Abbasi Sbri, K.J. Bhagat. Shri H.K.L. Abdul GhafooT, Shri Bhakta, Shri Manoranjan Acharia, Sbri Basudeb Dhanu Pcatap Sinsh, Shri Adaikalaraj, Shri L. Bharadwaj, Shri Parasram Adiyodi, Dr. K.G. Bharat Singh. Shri Agarwal, Shri Jli Prakash Bhoi, Dr. Krupasindhu Ahmad, Shri Sarfaraz Bhoopatlly, Shri G. AhmJId, Begum Abida Bhosale, Shri Prataprao Baburao Altha Ram. Shri Bhoye, Shri R.M. Anand Singh, Shri Bhoye, Sbri Sitaram Sayaji Anjiab, Sbri T. Bhuria, Sbri Dilcep Singh Anna Nambi, Shri R. Bir Sen, Shri Ansari, Sbri Abdul HannBn Birbal, Shri AD ....i, Shri Z.R. Biswas, Sbri Ajo), Antony, Shri P.A. Brahma Duu, Sbri Anmachalam, Shri M. Buta Singh, Shri Awasthi, Shri Jaldish Azad, Shri Bbaawat Jha c Azad, Shri Gbulam Nabi Chandra Mohan Singh, Shri B Chaodra Pratap Narain Singh, Sbri BapJ, Shri Pralap Singh Chandrakar, Sbri Cbandulal BaIUll Sumbrui, Shri Chandralekbar, Sbrimati Marptham Bairaai, Shri Balkavi ChaDdlashekharappa, Shri T.V. .Bairwa, Shri Banwari La) Chandresb Kuman, Shrimati Baitha, Sbri D.L. Charles, Shri A. Bajpai,. Dr. Rajcndra Kumari Chaturvedi, Shri Naresh Chandra Balaraman, Shri L. Chaturvcdi, Sbrimati Vidyawali Bali, Sbrimati Vyjayantbimala Chaudhary. Sbri ManpbooJ Siogh Banerjee, Shrimati Mamta Chaudhary, Shri A.B.A. Ghani Khan BaDJj LaJ" Shri Chaven, Shrimati Premalabai Con'litUlion MAGHA 10,1906 (SAKA) (52nd Arndt.) Bill 246 Chavan, Shri S. B. Chidambaram, Shri P. Faleiro, Shri Eduardo Chinta Mohan, Sbri Fernandes, Shri Oscar Chokka Rao, Shri J. G Cboubey, Shri Narayao Choudhari, Shri Nandla) OadgiI, Shri V. N. Chaudhari, Shrimati Usbatsi Prakash Gadbavj, Shri Bbersvadao K. Cbowdbary, Sbri Jagannath Gackwad, Shri Ranjit SiDah Chowdhary. Shri Saifl'udin Gaikwad, Shri UdaysinlTao Nanasaheb D Gamit, Shri C. O. Gandhi. Sbri Raji v Dabhi, Shri Ajit Singh Ganga Ram, Shri DllIa, Shri Mool Chand Dalbir Singh, Shr; Gavit, Shri Maoikrao Hodlya Oalbir Singh, Shri Gehlot, Shrj Asbok Dalwai, Shri Husltain Gholap, Shri S. G. Damar, Shri Somjibhai Ghosal, Shri Debi Dandavate. Prof Madhu Ghosh. Prof. Bimal Kanti Das, Shri Anadi Charao Ghosh, Shri Tarun Kanti Das, Shri R. P. Gobi), Shri G. B Dcnnj~. Shri N. GomaDgo. Shri Giridhar Deora, Shri Murll Gopeshwar, Shri Goswami, Shrimati Bibha Gho . Desai, Shri B. V. Gounder, Shr; A. Senapathi Devarajan, Sbri B. Gowda, Shri H. N. Nanje Devi, Shrimati Chandra Bhanu Gu~ Shrimati PhulreDU Dhrambir Singh, Shri Gupta, Shrimati Prabbawati Dharmpal Siogb, Shri Dhariwal, Shri Sbanti Kumar H DipI, Sbri Radbakanta Halder, Shri Maooranjan Dishe, Shri Sharad Hannan Monab, Sbri Digvijay Singh, Shri Hardwari Lal. Shri Diav;jay Singh, Shri Harpai Singh, Shri Ditshit, Shrimati Sheila Hembram, Shri Seth Dinesh SiDlh, Shri Dotra, Sbri G. L. J Dube. Shri Bh,.bma Deo Jadeja, 8bri D. P. 247 COPlltitutio" JANUARY 30, 1985 (52nd Amdt.) Bill 248 Jaffer Sbarief, Shri C. K. Khatri, Shri Nirmal Japu Nath Prasad, Shri Khirhar, S~ri R. S. Japtbrabhakan, Sbri S. Kidwai, Sbrimati Mohsina Jaideep Singh, Shri Kinder LaJ, Shri Jain, Shri Dalchander Kisicu, Sbri Prithvi Chand JaiD. Shri NihaI Singh KoJanldaivelu, Shri p. Jain. Shri Virdbi Chander Konyak, Shri Chingwang Janardbanan, Shri M. R. Kri~han pratap Singh, Shri Janlde, Shri Khelan Ram Krishna Singh, Sbri Jatav, Shri Kammodi Lal Kshirs.agar, Shrimati Kesharbaj Jayamohan. Shri A. Kucha n. Sbri Gangadhar S. Jeevaratbinam .• Shri R. Kujur, Sbri Maurice Jena, Shri Chintamani Kumaramangalam, Shri P. R. "hamsi Lakshmi, Shrimati N. P. Kunw8r Ram, Shri .litendra Prasad, Shri Kup"puswamy, Shri C. K . Jitendra Singb, Shri Kurien. Prof. P. J. Jujhar SiDlb, Sbri L Lowarlg, Shri WaDshpha Kabuli, Shri Abdul Rashid Kalpana Devi, Dr. T. M Kamal Natb, Shri Madh &lri Singh, Shrimati Kamat, Sbri Gurudas Mahajta.n, Shri Y. S. Kamblc, Sbri Arvind Tulsniram Mahatia, Shri Cbittaranjan Kamla Kumari, Shrimati Mabendl'a Singh, Shri Xamla Prasad, Shri MakeD, Hhri Lalit Kamla Prasad Siuah, Sbri Makwan,., Shri Narsinh XauJ, Shrimati Sheila Malik, Sb,ri Puroa Chandra KaushaJ, Shri Jagan Nath MaUick, Shri LaksbmaD Ken, Sbri Lala Ram Malviya, Sh ri BapuJaJ Keyur Bhusan, Sbri Mandai, Shrli Sanat Kumar }{ban, Sbri Arit Mohammad MaDe, $hri M!urlidbar Khan, Shri Allam Sher Mane, S bri R.. S. Khan, Sbri Mohd. Ayub Manven.dra Sinllh, Shri Khan, Shri Rahim MasudaJ Hossain', Sbri Syed KhaD, Shri Zulfiquar Ali Mavani Ramjibba;, Shrimati Patel Ram 249 Coulltution MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (52nd Amdt.) Bill Mehta, Shri Haroobhai o MeijiDglung, Shri Kamson Odedra, Shri Bharat Kumar Mishra, Shri Gargi Sha nkar Odeyar, Shri Channaiah Mishta, Dr. Prabbat Kumar Mishra, Shri Ram Nagina p Mishra, Shri ~hripati Pakeer Mohamed, Shri E. S. M. Mishra, Shri Uma Kant Pande, Shri Raj MangaJ Misra, Shri Nityananda Pandey, Shri Damodar Misra, Shri Satyagopal Pandey, Shri Madan Modi, Shri Vishnu Kumar Pandey. Shri Manoj Mohandas, Shri K. Panigrahi, Shri Chintamani Mohan Lal, Shri Mohanty, Shri Braja Mohan Panigrahi. Shri Srib~lIav Morc, Prof. Ram Krishna Panika, Shri Ram Pyare Paoja, Sori A. K. Motilal Singh, Shri Mukherjee, Shrimati Geeta Pant, Shri K. C Munshi. Shri Priya Ranjan Das Papireddy, Slui Bczawada Murmu, Shri Sidha Lal Parashar, Prof. NJrain Chand Murthy, Shri M. V. Chandrashekara Pardbi, Shr; Keshaorao Murugaiah, Shri A. R. Patel, Shri Ahmed M. Mushran, Shri Ajay Narayan Patel, Shri C. D. Patel, Shri G. I. Muttemwar, Shri Vilas Patel, Shri H. M. N Patel, Shri Mohan LaJ Naik, Shri G. Devaraya Patel, Shri Ram Pujan Naik, Shri Shantaram Pater, Shri Uttambhai H. Naikart Shri D. K. Pathak, Sbri Chandra KishoTe Narayanan, Shri K.R. Patil, Shri BaJasahe~ Vikhe Narayanaswamy, Sbri Devineni Patil. Shri Prakash V. Natarajan, Shd K. R. Patil, Shri Shivraj V. Nat"ar Singb, Shri PatiI, Sbri Uttamrao Nawal Prabbkar, Shrimati Sundarwati Patil. Shri Veereodra Nehru, Shri Arun Kumar Patil, Shri Vijay N. Netam, Shri Arvind Patil, Shri Yashwaotrao Gadakh Nithra, Shri Rameshwar Patnaik, Shrimati Jayanti 251 Constitution JANUARY 30, 1985 {521ld Amdl.) Bill Pattnaik, Shri Jagannath Rao, Shri Ailhabathula Joges\\'ara VCDkata Butchi Maheswara Pawar, Shri Balcsaheb Rao, Shri C.H. Srihari Pawar, Sbri Satyaoarayan Rao, Dr. G.Vijayarama Pcruman, Dr. p. Vallal Rao, Sbri J. Veogala Pilot, Shr; Rajesh Rao, Shri K.S. Potdukbe, Shri Shantaram Rao, Shri P.V. Narasimha Prabhu, Shri R. Rao, Sh r i V. Krishna Pradbani, Shri K. Rath, Shri Somnath Praka~h Chandra, Shri Ratha\\a. Shri Am,¥sinh Puran Chandra, Shri Ratbod, Shri Uttam Purohit, Shri Ban\\ari Lal Rathore, Shri Mohar Singh Q Raut. Shri Bhola Ravanl, Shri Navin Qureshi, Shri Azi? Raw~lt, Shri Hari'.h R Ra\\-al, Shri Prabhulal Reddy, Shn C. Madha" RaghuraJ Singh, Shri Reddy, Shn K. Ramacbandl a Rai, Shri I. Rama Reddy, Shri P. Manlk Rai, Shri Ramdeo Reddy, Shri S Raghuma Raj Karan Singh, Shri Reddy, Sbri Sudinl Jaipal Rajeshwaran, Dr. V. Riyao, Shri Baju Ban Rajhans, Dr. G.S. Roy, Shri Sudhir Raju, Shri V. K. Roypradhan, Shfl Amar Raju, Shri Anand Gajpati Ram, Shri Ram Ratan s .Ram, Sbri Rams\\-aroop Saha. Sbn Ajil Kumar Ram Awadb Prasad, Shri Saba, Sbri Gadadhar Ram Dhan, Shri Sahi, Shrimati Krisl)na Shri Ram Prakash, Sahu, Shri Shiv Prasad Ram Samujhawan, Shri Sait, Shri Azee7 Ramamurthy, Shri K. Sangma, Shri P.A. Rampal Singh. Shri Sankta Prasad. Dr. Ramulu, Shr; H.G. Santosh, Shri Ranga, Prof. N.O. Salcndra Cband(a, Shri Ranganath, Sbri K.B. Sathe, Shri VasaDl 253 COnltitUlioll MAGHA 10. 1906 (SAX,f) (52nd Amdt.) Bill Scindia, Shri Madhavrao Soren, Shri Haribar Sclvcndran, Shri P. SouDdararajaD, Sbri N. Sen, Shri A,K. Soz, Prof. Saifuddio Sen, Shri Bho)a Nath Sreenivasa Prasad, Shri V. Sethi, Shri Ananta Prasad Sreeramamurthy, Shri Bhattam Sethi, Shri P.C. Subburaman, Sbri A.O. Shah. Shri Anoopchaod Sukhadia, Shrimati Indubala Shahi. Shri La!ite~hwar Sultanpuri, Shri K. D. Shaktawat, Prof. Nirmala Kumari Sumao, Shri R.P. Shankaraoand. Shri B. Sundararaj, Sbri Shanmugam, Shri A.C. Sunder Lal. Sbri Sbanmugam, Shri P. Sunil Dutt, Shr; Shanti Devi. Shrimati Sharma, Shri Nand Kishore SUrendra Pal Sinah. Shr; Sharma, Shri Nawal Kishore Suryawanshi, Shr; Narsio,rao Sharma. Shri Pratap Bhanu Swami Prasad SiOlh, Shri Shastri, Shri Hari Krishna Swell, Shri G.G Shcrvani. Shri S:deem 1. T Shinada, Shri O.B. Shivendra Bahadur Singh. Shri Tapeshwar Singh, Shri Shukla, Shri Vidya Charan Taradevi, Kumari D.K. Siddiq, Shri Hafiz Mohd. Tariq Anwar, Shr; SidnaJ, Shri S.B, Tewary # Prof, K.K. Singaravadivel. Shri S. Thakkar, Shrimati Ushaben Ragblvji Singh, Shri D.G. Thakur, Shri C.P. Singh, Shri K. N Thambi Durai, Shri M. Sinah, Shri Lal Vijay Pratap TbaDgaraju, Shr; S. Singh. Kumari Pusbpa Devi Thomas. Prof. K.V. Singh, Shr; S,D, Thorat, Shri Bhausaheb Singh Deo. Sbri K.P. Thota Gopa)a Krishna Shri Sinha, Shri Atish Chandra , Thunlon. Shri P.X. Sinha, Shrimati Kishori Sinha, Shrimati Ram Dulari Tigga, Shri Simon Sieha, Shri Satyendra Narayan Tilakdhari Singh, Shri Sodi. Shri Manturam Tirk;, Shri Piyush Solanki, Shri Kalyan Singb Tomar, Shrimati Usha Rani SoJanki, Shri Natawarsinh Tombi SiDlh. 8hri N. 255 Constitution JANUARY 30, 1985 (52nd Amdt.) Bill 256 Tripathi, Sbrimati Chanda Yadav, Shti Subbash Tulsiram. Sbri V. Yadava, Shri Bal Ram Singh Tytler. Sbri Jagdisb Yadava. Shri D.P. Yazdani, Dr. Golam u Yeshpal Singh. Shri UnnikrishnaD, Shri K.P. Yogeshwar Prasad. Shri v z Vait.ale, Shri Madhusudao Zainal Abedjn. Shri Van, Shri Deep Naraio ZainuJ, Basher, She; Vukar, Sbri Punam Chand Mithabhai NOES Ventataratnam, Sbri Nissankara Rao Venkatesan. Shri P.R.S. NIL Verma. Dr. C.S. MR. SPEAKER: Subject to correctioD. Verma, Shrimati U,ha the result* of the division is : Vija,araahavan t Shri V.S. Ayes: 417 V,as, Shri Girdhari Lal Noes: Nil w The Motion is carried unanimously by a majority of the total membership of tbe Wadiyar Shri Srikantha Datta, House aDd by a majorilY of not Jess .than Naraaimharaja two-thirds of the members pr"eot and voting. Waanik. Shri Mutul Wunik, Shri Balkrishna The MOlion ",as adopted. y Clause 1 "'as added to tlte Bill. Enacting Formula Ylday. Shri KaiJasb SHRI A.'K. SBN : I bel to move: Yaday, Sbri Mahabit Pruad Yadav. Shri R.N. Page 1, Jioe J,- Yada", Sbri Ram Siqh /0(' UTbirty-fiftb" ,ubJltlute "Tbirty- YIda". Sbri Sb,am LaJ si&tb" (37) • TIle followiDa Member. alto recorded their votes for AYES : Sbrimati V,jaotimaJa Bali. Sbrimati Iodumali Bhaltlcbaryya, Dr. ChaDdra Sbckbar Tripatbi. Sbri ILaDa Vir SiDah, Ibri Asbutosh Law, Shri Kahcbarao Ram aaiu. Sbri Vadde ~ Rao, Shri P. Peocbalaiah, Shri O. Bhoopathi. Shri K.M; Swamy: Sbti P.A. Narsimham, Slui C. Sambu and Sbri K.N Pradhan. 1.57 COnJlillit Ion MAGHA 10, 1906 (S.4K~) (52nd Amdt.) Bill 258 This is only a clerical amendment; we princjples, on the basis of which we have are enacting this Bill after the 26th of beeD elected. Secondly, we shall not be play- January, that is why this amendment is ing false to the electorate, which hu elected necessary. us on certain principles and on certain ideo.. Jogies. MR. SPEA.KER : The question IS : II is not necessary for me to say any- thing more. I commend the Bill for accep- "Page I, line 1,- tance of the House unanimously. for "thirly-fifth" substitute "Thirty- MR. SPEAKER: Motion moved: sixth" "That the Bill. as amended, bep used." Tile Motion was a ..''1pled. SHRI PRIYA RANJAN DAS MUNSHI : Mr. Speaker, Sir, tbi. is a very MR. SPEAKER: The question is: historic day, not because of the fact that we have adOPted tbis historic document in this House. but because India is entering into a "That the Enacting Formula, as amen- new horizon by adopting this Bill. Our Prime ded, stand part of the Bill" Minister. who is Dot only the leader of the nation but is also one who is symbolising the The A1 ntiun was adapted. Indian Renaissance, has extended tbe demo- cratic processes within the political parties ••• (interruptions) This historic process will have The Enacting, formula. OJ amended. was added to go on for a :oog time. to Ihe Bill. When we talk of defection, defiance The Tille was added 10 the Bill. and dissent, there are some distinctive and qualitative differences. In India the basic lesson of our society is tbat we believe in SHRI A.K. SEN: I beg to move: unity in diversity. These diverse trends are combined within the country by the social . 'That the BilJ, as amended, be passed:' and political forces in "Various forms . ... I want to say only a few words. 1 have When somebody defies for tbe cause of already said what I have to say and the hon. the people, for something accepted by the Prime Minister bas explained the entile people, then the people decide tbat is not gamut of the BiU. defection but rebellion. Wheo people think tbat somebody is trying to defect for. his personal ends, people oppose and accuse. It is a historic occasion, when this Tbat is defection. If I draw the bistory from House is passing this Bill unanimously. It Ramayaoa, when Vibhisbna sided with Ram has responded to the call of the nation, to Chandra people might say be defected, but purify the politicallire of the country. I t is hc rebelled for a just cause and it proved to a historic day for us because, from now 00 be correct. But that does not come now-a- II wiU be said very clearly and unequivocally days in our view in the modem world. I can that our political lire has no pollution, un- cite the fate of Kama. who did Dot flabt with "deanliness. no indecency and that our demo- the K.auravas. but with the Pandavas. The cratic structure rests on solid pillars. One religion we call the mighty power has influe- piUar is the purity of the party and otber is nce on our society. influence on our iaoguaae. tbe faith and trust of the electorate. These on our culture. Now, in the mighc, reliaion are the two foundatioos on which our entire which we call the Hindu relision we have fabrj~ rests. We must be -true to tbe party two clans havina constant confrontation. It 259 Constitution JANUARY 30, 1985 (52"d Amm.) Bill 260 is there till today. One is the Sbaktas and Now. in regard to a dispute regarding a the otber the Vaishnavites. I have seen it in member, the matter will be referred to the many parts, we have oae Jesus Christ. but Presidin. Officer, but no time Jimit has been we have Roman Catholics and the Protes- fixed. I would request in th~ next session the tants. We have pure Islam, but we have the time limit should be fixed within which the Shias and the Sunnis. We have one LeDin Speaker has to announce his deCIsion. If he and one Karl Marx, but you have many keeps it pending for three to four months, it parties in the world with divergent views should Dot be allowed. not only in India, but all over the world. Now, we have one Mahatma Gandhi. lTranS/Olion) Congress claims to have ioherited its tradi- tions But sometimes I find Members in the Opposition like Prof. Dandavate and others *SHRI C.H. SRIHARI RAO (Rajamun- think also that they are following the tradit. dry) : Mr. Speaker, Sir, I welcome this Bill. ions of Mahatma Gandhi. So, these are the It is unprecedented in the annals of the diversities which should be taken into view history of Indian Parliament. But adopling in regard to defection. which are natura) this Bill we are trying to respect the wisbes differences and dissentioDs. When dissention or 70 Clores of our people. Our young tantamounts to defence and defiance for Prime Mmister hiS reli1y display ted couage personal aim. Ther.e he ~oses his accounta- to bring forward this anti defecion Bill. I bility to the people. congratulate him and commend his devotion. But r could not understand why he thought Now. 1 will refer to this matter because of dropping clause 2(1){c) from tht! Bill. It we are here in the Indian democracy. We are has b~en our intention to retain the clause. Dot in Europe; we are not in the United We are DOl for its deJetion. We see many stal- States. Cleansing of the Ganga is not impor- warts adorning this great House today. On tant and that cannot be done because the the slightest prtetext, Members defct from Ganga is already pure. one party to another. That is whye I plead for a fool proof arrangement. It is our opinion that the leader and the party should (Interruptions) be vested with all powers to take action against the defectors. That is what the MR. SPEAKER: Order, Please, people want. It is the fulfilment of their wishes. People vote for the party and its SHRI PRIY A RANJ AN DAS leader but not for the individual candidates. MUNSHJ : Mr. Speaker, Sir, let me fioish. Many sp~akers who have proceeded me menti- I think when our Prime Miolster said this, oned this point. So when these individuals he was not meaning purifying tbe Ganga, but switch tbeir loyalty, the party leader must cleaning the pollution of the Ganga. While have every right to punish such erring indivi- he said cleaning of pollution of the Gloga, duals. This has been tbe unanimous stand of tbe Ganga carries the heritage of the Indian our party. And also we oppose the omission civilisation. I mean Indian civilisation of this particular clau\e which takes away the can be cleaned by passing the Bill power of the leader to punish his party that is berore us. By adopting it, tbe Gaoga members when they change sides. responds morc to this Bill, because the Ganga knows how much pollution has come into Sir. under the present provision in this our democracy, Bill. an individuaJ can be punished when he crosses over to another. But if one-third I personally fccl that after baving the members of party cross over, you are letting .lIurance from our leaders in this HOUle them off without any punishment under the tbat lome loOpboles wiH be looked into after garb of split. This is injustice. It should this Session. we can make further changes in not be so. If majority members cross over t the Bill. then only it should be treated as a split. *The speech was originany delivered in Telugu. 261 Constitution MAOHA 10, 1906 (SAKA) (5Jnd Arndt.) S,ll 262 Even if 49% members break away from tbe .'.58 brl. main group. the party PJ'e1ident must have the power to take action against them. Take SHRI P. K. THUNGON (Aruoachal (or example, in a constituency where there West) : Sir, thank you. I have been waiting are 4,00,000 voter5J, a candidate who secures right from the morning to speak. 2,00,001 votes is being declared as elected in a Pal liamentary election and the candidate MR. SPEAKER: Now you see tbe who secures 1,99,999 votes is defeated. The pleasure of those who wait and get their turn. difference betwet:n the victor and the vanqui- -;hed is jU~l one vote. So also a party which enjo) 5. majority shouid stay in power. The SHRI P. K. THUNGON : I am en· defecror~ even if they have 49~~ of the joying the pleasure of waiting. members have no right to form Government and rule. A split should be recognised as MR. SPEAKER: Now, you have the such If it is SO~~ or more. That is all. If pleasure of speaking. 33~~ or 40~o of tht! members defect it should not be called a split a ~ d the action of minority group should not be condoned. SHRI p. K. THUNGON : Sir, first of They are defectors even if th~y constitute a. II , I would like to congratulate the bon. 49% of the party and hence are liable for Prime Minister and the Law Minister on punishment. Even if I hey arc one short of havmg brought thiS Bjll before the House. majority they should be treated as a minority This is, no doubt, a historic Bm. In fact, and be I reated as defectors so as to att ract there are two control system in a society. t hI: provision \\ ilh regard to cxpu I~ion. One is external control and the other is internal cODtro] When a person has not lOt the morality to control himself, external Thanking you very much for giving me contrClI is required. In our political life, thi, 0PPllrtunity. in our public life. it has been noticed that day by day the standard has been falling down. Realising this at the I £nglillt] appropnate time. our young and dynamic Prime Minister has brought forward this BiU MR. SPEAKER : No\\. hon Memhers. and has created a means for an external pleil~c don'l leave. W(; have a v~ry impor- control for tbose who cannot control them. tant motion. Rut before that, I have to call selves with morality. three or four Members more to speak. Shri VI tam Rathod. 20.00 hrs. SHRI UITAM RATHOD (Hingoli) : Sir, I come from tbe north-eastern Mr. Speaker Sir, before the adoption of the region where we have got so many small Constitution Amendment Bill, I would like regiona1 parties also. 1 do not want to 10 to say that it must be perhaps the first occa- into details. But I would limply like to uk sion when the Constitution Amendment Bill one thing. In certain cases when sucb ha~ come up before the House, the rulinB opponunist regional parties lOt diJsolved. Party as well 35 the Oppos ilion Parties, with what will be tbe position of members of all solemnity. have accepted it unanimously. tbMC rcaionll part~s? That should also be Sir. on th is occasion, have to add that you J kept in mind. will be expectiDI the unp1easant work of deciding lhe fal~ of political person~. So. I would suggest that you better prefer to have MaDY of the boo. Members have ex- a sub-committee which will be able to advice pressed in thi. lugust Houte about the you in such mallers. This is aU I wanted to desirability of aIJowiD8 Independent candi- say. Aner all, parliamentary democracy exists dates or Independent members to joio which- on checks and balances. So, it is essential ever party they I ike. I t has been very ably that you mUSl have a sub-committee. Tbis explained by our former Law Minister, Sbri is &til. I wanted to say. Jagan N8tb Kaushal. that during the elections 263 ( _"'111;011 JANUARY SO. 1985 (52ttd Arndt.) Bill' 264 when tbe IDdepeDdent c&Ddidates speak about THB MINISTER OF LAW AND political partlee, tbey speak u if they are JUSTICE (SHRI A. K. SEN): I can oaly die ooJ, people who will clean the society. express our happiness and, in doml 10. I . There are some Independent members in my have no doubt I shall expresl the happiness area. eveD at tho level of State legislature, ot the entire House and the country for who are tryina desperately and frantically, at choosiDI this da, as the most appropriate this mOlDent, to joiD this party or that pany day for passillg this memorable BiH. Today while we are disc~8SiDg this very historic and we remember Mahatma Gandhi and thousands imponaot Bil) ill tbe HoUle. of lreat beroes who have laid down their lives so that we and our children may be It bas been very rightly suggested by free. On this hallowed day. we are passiag some of the boD. Members that the defections this great Bill. It will guide for ever the generally take place at tbe time of elections. destiny of our dcmocracy. Jf this Bill is It bas also been rightly suggested by some passed, surely and surely, only a decent of the boo. Members tbat there should be pOlitical life sball tbrive in this country of ours for all times to come. It is extremely lOme control system, some time-limit Ot preecribed time-limit as to upto what time remarkable that this measure has gODe or bet~ what limit of time they can stand through absoJutely unarlrmously. It shows as caodidates or aoy otber political party. the strength of our nation and tbe strengt h In case a member resigns just at the time of of our solidarity, and the resolve of our people that in all times of need when the tbe elections, 00 the eve of the elections, at that time, if this time-limit is not kept, he country needs the united effort of all of us, will join any political party and may stand we forget our boundaries, we bury our tbereby in the way of cleaning the public batchets and we cut across the pany barriers and through the entire national ]ire, one Ufe. Kolden thread runs namely. that tbis country sbull not perish nor our democracy. Lastly. I hope the bon. Law Ministcr will use his good offices to in8uence tbc MR. SPEAKER: Before I put the State Government~ and the State legislatures motion that the Bill, as amcndeJ, be passed to enact tbe law in sucb a way that eVCD at to the vote of the House, this being a Cons~ level of ZiJa Parishads. Anchal Samitis tho titution Amendment Bill. voting bas to be by and Municipal Committees there is no sucb division. Let the lobbies be cleared- 4efectioD, DO such activity. which can go scot-free. I have experienced that at the Zila Parishad level and even at tbe level of Now the Lobbies bave been cleared. AnchaI Samitis, the members defect and thereby create inatabHity rigbt at tbe gr&ss- Thc question is ; roote and, in tbi. way, the morality of tbe people it spoiled. Tberefore, 1 would like to request the hon. Law Minister to use his .tThat tbe Bill. as amended, be passed." good 01Bcea to influence tbe reapective State GoYCI'DtDentl and the State Leaislatures to eoact tbe Jaw quickly so u to control such kind of defections. 20.06 bn. ID conclusion, I would like to say that Di.tsion No.5 the pauiDa of this Bill is the vindication of the promise made by the Prime Minister to the people of India thAt he will live a clean AYES aDd efficient administration and a clean public life. Let UI take this Bill as a bia step A ill dJat direction, a aift to tho nation by this auaust House through our hon. Prime Abbasi, Sbri K.J. MiDister in memory of the CoDlteSS Centenary. Abdul GhaCoort Sbri MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAKt4) (52"d Amdl.) Bill 266 Co/l$llllltloPl Dhllat, Shri H.K.L. Acharia. Shri Basudeb Bbakta, Shri ManoranjaD Adaikalaraj. Shri L. Bbanu Pratap Singh, Sbri Adiyodi, Dr. K. G. Bbaradwaj, Shri Para'\ram Agarwal, Shri Jai Parkash Bharat Singh, Sbri Ahmed, Begum Abida Dhoi, Dr. Krupasindhu Altha Ram, Shri Bhoopathy, Shri G. Anand SinGh, Shri Bbo5a]e, Shri Prataprac Baburao Anjiah, Shri T. Bhoye, Shri R.M. Anna Nambi. Shri R . Bhoye, Shri Sitaram Sayaji Ansari, Shri Abdul Hannan Bhuria. Shri Dileep Singh Ansari, Shri Z.R. Bir Sen, Shri Antony, Shri P.A. Birbal, Shri Arunachalam, Sbri M. Biswas, Shri Ajoy Awasthi, Shri Jagdish Brahma DuH, Shri Azad, Shri Bhagwat Jha Buta Singh, Shri Azad, Shri Gulam Nabi c B Chandrli Mohan Singh, Sbri Baghel, Shri Pratap Singh Chandra Pratap Narain Sinah , Shri Chandrakar, Shri CbanduJal Bagun Sumbrui, Shri Bairagi, Shri Datkavi Chandrasekhar, Sbrimati Margalham Bairwa, Shri Banwari Lal Chandrasbekbarappa, Sbri T.V. Baitha, Shri D.L. Chandresb Kumari. Shrimati Bajpai, Dr. RajeDdra Kumari Charles, Sbri A. B:1Jaraman, Shri L. Chaturvedi, Shri Naresh Chandra Bali, Sh.rimati Vyjayanthimala Chaturvedi, Sbrimati Vid,awati Banerjee, Shrimati Mamta Chaudhary, Shri Maopbool SiD'" Bansi Lal. Shri Chaudhury, Shr; A.B.A. Gbaoi Khan Barman, Shri Palas Chavan, Sbrimati Ptemalabai Barrow. Shri A.E.T. Chavan, Sbri S. B. Basavarjcswari, Shrimati Chidambaram, Sbri P. Basavaraju, Shri G S. Chokka Rao, Shri J. Choubey, Shri Narayan Baau, Shri AnU Choudhari. Shri NandlaJ Bhagat, Shrj B.R. 167 Co",litlltiOIl JANUARY 30. 1985 (52nd Amdt.) Bill 268 Chaudbari. Sbrimati Usbatai Prakash G Chowdhary t Shri JagaDDath GadsiJ, Shri V:N. Chow-:ihury. Shri Saift'udin Gadbavi, Shri Bheravadan K. Oackwad, Sbri RaDjit Sinah D Gaikwad. Shri Udaysingrao Nanasahcb Dabhi, Shri Ajitsinh Gamit, Shri C.D. Da.at Shri Mool Chand Gandhi, Shri Rajiv Dalbir Singb, Shri GaDla Ram, Shri DaJbir Singh. Shri Gavit, Shri Manikrao Hodlya Dalwai, Sbri Hussain Gehlot, Shri Asbok Damor, Shri Somjibhai Gholap, Shri S G. Dandavata, Pror. Madbu Ghosal, Shri Debi Das, Shri Anadi Charan Ghosh. Prof. BimaJ Kantl Da., Shri R. p. Ghosh, Shri Tarun Kant I Dennis, Sbri N. Gohil, Shri G.B. Deora, Shri MurH Gomango. Shri Glridhu! caai, Shri B. V. Gopeshwar, Shri Devarajao, Shri B. Goswami. Shrimali Bibha Ghosh Gowda. Shr; H.N. Nanje Devi. Shrimati, Cbandra Dbanu Guha, Shrimati Phulrcnu Dbarambir SiDlh. Sbri Gupta. Shrimati Prabbawati Dbaram PaJ Sinlb, Sbri Dhariwal, Shri Sbanti Kumar H Djp), Shri RadbataDta Diabe. Shei Sbarad Halder, Sbri Manofanjao Diavijay Sinb, Shri Hannao Mollab, Shri Hardwari Lal, Shri Dipija, Siaah. Sbri Harpal Sin.b, Shri Dibbit, Sbrimati Sheila Hembram, Shri Seth om.b SiD,b, Sbri Dopa, Sbri G.L. J Dube. ibri Bbisbma Dco Jadeja, Shri D.P. F JaB'er Sbarief. Sbri C.K. Japo Nath Ptuad. Shri FaJoiro. Shri Bduardo Japduakshakau, Shri S. Feroaodes, Sbri Oscar Jai Ja". Shri B\lcbaDder Kolaadaivelu, Shri P. Sain, Shri Nibal Siftlh Ko nyak, Sbri Chinawang Jain, Shri V,rdhi Chander Kris hDa Pratap Singh, Shri J_agde, Shri "helao Ram Krishna Singh, Shri Jatlv, Shri Kammodilal Kshirsagar, Shrimati Kesharbai Jayamohan. Shri A. Kuchan, Shri Gangadhar S. Jeevarathinam. Shri R. Kujur, Shri Maurice Jena, Shd Chiotamafti Kumaramangalam, Shri P.R. JhaDsi Lakshrru, Shrimati N. P. Kunwar Ram, Shri Jitcndra Prasad, Snri Kuppuswamy, Shri C.K. Jitendra Singh, Shri Klirien, Prer. P.J. Jujhar Singh, Shri L Law. Shri Alutosh K towang. Shri Wanghpha Kabuli, Shri Abdul Rashid 1\1 Kalpana Devi, Dr. T. I Kamal Nath, Shri Madhuri Singh, Shrimali Kamat, Shri Gurudas ~ahaJan, Shri Y.S. Kamble, Shri Arvind Tulshiram ~ahata, Shri Chittaranjan Rami. Kuman, Shrimati Mahendra Sinsh. Shri Kaad. Prasad, Shri Maken, Shri Lalit Kamla Prasad Singh, Shri Makwana. Shri Narsilth Kaushal, Shri Jagan Nath Malik, Shri Purna Caandta Ken, Shri Lala Rant Mallick. Shri lakshman Keyur Bhusan, Shri • Malviya, Shri Bapulal Khan, Shri Arif Mohammad Mandai, Shri Sanat Kumar Khan, Shri Aslam Sher MaDe. Shri Murlidhar Khan, Shri Mohd. Ayub Mane, Shri R S. Khan, Shri Rahim MaDVCDdra Singh, Shri Khan, Shri Zulfiquar Ali Masudal Hossain, Shri Syed Khatri, Shri Nirmal Mavaoi Ramjibhai Shrimati Patel Ramaben Khirbar, Shri R.S. Mehta, Shri Haroobhai ~idwai, Shrimati Mohsioa Meijinglung, Shri Kamson KiDder lal, Shri Mishra. Shri Gargi Shankar lCJsku, Sbri PritbYi ~Chand Mjshra, Dr. Prabhat Kumar 211 (j21ft1~_ Mishra, Shri lam Nqina , p Mura,. Star; Shripati Palrec, ~ Sbri £.1.... Mishra, Shri Uma Kant Paade~ Sbtt a.J Mae", Misra, $bri Nityananda PaDdeJ. Shri Damador Misra. Shri Satyaaopal Pauder.Shri ~adad Modi, Sbri Vishou Kumar Pandey. Shri Manoj Mohan Lal. Shri Paailrahi. Shrf Chi.,tamat2i Panigrahi, Shti Srtballav Mobanty. Shri Btajamohan Panika. Shrf Ram Pyare More. Prof. Ram Krishna Panja, Shr; A.K. Notita! SiIIlh, Sbri Pa"" Shri K.C. Mukherjee. Shrimati Geettl Papiredd,. Ihri Demwada Mua$hi, Shri Priya Ranjaa Oas Parasbar, Prof. MaraiD ChanJ Mutmu, Shri Sidha Lar Pard hi. Shri ~shaorao Murthy, Sbri M.V. Cbandrasbcka .. :a Paswan, Shri Raft') Bhagar Murogaiah. Shri A.R. Patel. Shri Ahmeli M. Muttemwar. Shri Vilas Patel, Sbri CO. PateJ, Shri G,I. Patel, Shri H.M. Naik. Shri G. Devaraya Patel, Sbri Mohan Lal Naik, Shri Shantaram Palel, Shri Ram Pujan 'Naikar. Shri D.K. Patel, Shri Uttambhai H. Narsimbam, Shri P. A. Pathak, Shri Chandra Kishor: Narayanan, Sbri K.R. PatH. Shri Bal~saheb \'ikhc Narayanaswamy, Shri Deviaeni Patil, Shri Prakash \'. Natarajan. Shri K.R. Patil, Shri Shivraj V. Naty,ar SiDlh. Sbri Pali). Sbrj Uttamrao Hawal Prabhakar. Shtimati SUDderwati Patil, Shri Veerendra Nehru, Sbri Arun Kumar Patil, Shri Yashwantra.o Gadakll • Shri Arvind Net_ Patnaik, Shrimati JayaDti Nikbra, Shri Ramesbwar Pattoaik, Shri JacanDath Pawar, Shri Ba)esa~eb o Pawar. Shri Satyan.raYan Odedra, Shri Bhara' ICt'mar Penchalaiah. Shri Puchalapa1ji Odeyar, Sbri Channaiah Peruman, Dr. p. VaUat MAOIh\ 10, 1906 (I.tI'A) 274 Pib. Shri Rajah lID. Ibri K.S. Pooja" • ...,..JaoardhlDa kao. Ibri P.V. Narasimba Poldulhe, SlatJ..:sbantararn Rao, Sbr; V. Krishna P__ ..... 1<.. Rao, Shri Vadde Sobhanedreeswara Pradhani, Shri K. Rath, Shri $OroDath Praka&h Chandra, Shri Ratbawa. Sbri Amarsinh Pucan Chandra. Shri Rathod, Shrj Uuam Purohit. Shri Banwari LaJ Ratbore, Sbri MOMf Sioah Q Raut. Sbri DhoJa Ravani, Sbrj Navin Qureshi. Shri Al.iz Rawat, Sbrj Harisb R Rawar, Snri Prabhural Raghuraj Singh, Shl i Reddy. Shri C. M:dhav Rai. Shri I. Rama Reddy. Sbri K. Ramacbandra Rai, Shri Ramdeo Reddy, Shr; Raahuma Raj Karan Sing~. Shri Reddy, Stu; Sudini Jaipal Rajeshwaran, Dr. V. kiyao, Ibri Baju Ban Rajhans. Dr. G.S. Ro,. Shri Sudhir Raju. Shri V. K. Roypradhan. Sbri Amar Raju, Shri Anand Gajpati s Ram, Shri Ram Ratso Ram. Sbri Ramswaroop Saha. Shri Ajit Kumar Ram Awadh Prasad, Shri Saha. Shri Oadadhar Ram Dhan, Shri Sahi, Sh.r1lO3ti Krishna Ram Samuj hawan, Shri Sahu. Slni Shiv Prasad Ramamurchy, Shri K. Sait, Shri Azcez Rampal Singh, Shri Sambu, Shri Chirnata RamrataD, Shri Kalicbaran SanJf1l8, Shri P.A. Ramulu, Shrj H.G. Sankta Prasad. Dr. Raoa Vic Singh, Shri Santosh. Shri Rania, Prof. N.O. SatcDdra Chandra. Shri ~ RaDpDathJ Shri K.H. Sathe, Shri Valaot Rao, Shri C.H. Sribari Sciodia, Shri Madhavrao Rao. Dr. G. Vijayarama Sclvcodran, Shri P. Rao, Shr; J. Venp)a Sen, Shri Ashok 275 JANUARY 30, 1985, (SW AIItdI.) Bill 276 SeD, Shri Shola Nath SoundararajaD. Shri N: Sethi, Shri Aauta Prasad Soz, Prof. Saifuddin Sethi, Shri P.C. Sreeuivasa Pruad. Shri V. Shah, Shri AnoopchaDd SreeramalDurtby, Shri Bbattam Shahi, Sbri Laliteshwar Subburaman, Shri A,a. Shaktawat, Prof. Nirmala Kumari SukhadiB, Shrimati Indubala Shankaranand, Shrj B, SuJtaDpuri, Shri K.D, SbllDmualm. Shri A. C. Suman, Sbri ft.P. SbaDmupm, Shri P. Sundararaj, Shri Sbuti Devi, Sbrimati Sunder I..al, Shri Sharma, Shri Nad K~sbore SUDii Dult, Shri Sharma, Sbri Nawal Kishore Surendra Pal Sinab, Shri Sharma, Shri Pratap Bhanu Suryawansbi, Shrj NaniD,rao Swami Prasad SiDlb, Shri Shastri, Shri Hari Krilhna Swamy, Shri K.. N. Sbervani, Shri Saleem I. SweU, Shri G,G. 8hinldB, Shri D. B. Shivendra Babadur SiDgh, Shr:i T Shukla, Shri VidYB Charao Tlpeshw'llf SiDgb, Sbri Siddiq, Shri Hafiz Mohd. Taradevi, Kumari D.K, SidDal, Shri S .B. Tariq Anwar. Shri Sinpravadivel. Shri 8. Tewary, Prof. Ie.K. SiDlh .. Sbri D.O. Thakkar, Shrimati UsbabeD Raabavji Sioah, Shri K.N. Thakur, Shri C.P. Siqh, Shri Lal Vija:,. Pratap Thambi Durai, Sbri M. Siap, ltumari Pusbpa Devi Tbaqaraju, Shri S. Siaab, Sbri .I. D Thomas, Prof. X.V. SiDab 000, Shri K P. Thorat, Shri Bhausaheb Sinha, Shri Atish Chandra Thota G opat. Krishna. Shri SiDba, Shrimati Kilbori ThuDaOn. Shri p.K. Sinha. Shrimati Ram Dulari Ti&ga. Sbti SimoD SiDah. Sbri Satyendra Narayan Tilakdbari ,Singb. Shri SocIi, Shri Mankuram TjTkj~ Shri IPiyusb Solaki, Shri Kalyaa Sinp Tomar, Sbdmati Usba Rani SoJaDki, Sbri NatavtniDll Tom'i Singh.. Shri N. Sorea, ..sbri Harihar Tripatbi, Shritnati ChlDda 2TI COUIIlIllIolt ($1l1li AmtII.) Bill MAGHA 10, 1906 (SAXA) Me..,., froRl. b)ya SIIbhtI 27. Tripathi, Dr. Chndra Shekbar Yadav. Sbri D P. Tulsiram, Shri V. Yazdani. Dr. Golam Tytler. Shri la,dish Yesbpal Smah, Rbri Yopwar Prasad, Shri v z UnnikrishnaD. Shri .It P. Zainal "bedin, Shri v l.ainual Basher I Shri NOES Vairale. Shri Madhusudan Van, Shri Deep Narain NIL Vankar Sbri ChaDd Mithabhai , Puoam MR. SPEAKER. : Subject hl correctioD, the result· of the Division is: A,.., 418; Noe, VenkataratDam, Shri NissaDkara Rao Nil. Vcnkatcsao. Shri P.R.S. Verma, Dr. C.S. The Motion is carried by a majority of the total membership of the Houie and by a Verma. Sbrimati Usha majority of not Jess thaD two-thirdl of the Members present and volin•. The Bill. as Vijayaralhavan. Shri V.S. amended. is passed by the requisite majority Vyas, Shri OirGhari lal in accordance with the provisions or Article 368 of the Constitution. \V The Motio" WQS adopted. Wadivar. Shri Srikantha Dalla PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: Sir, Wasnik, Shri MukuJ what about obituary reference to defecton? Wasnik. Shri Balkrishna [Translation] MR. SPEAKER : The palsinl of this BiU is itself an obituary to defectors Yada~, Shri Kailash 10.11 ..... Yadav, Shri Mahabir Prasad Yadav: Shri R.N. MESSAGES FROM RAJY A SABHA-Co.td. Yadav, Shri Ram Singh [Englilh] Yadav, Sari Sbyam La) SECRETARY-GEN.ERAL: Sir9 I haft \'adav, Shri Subbuh to report the foUo.ina metl.PI receiYed * The . (ollow;o. Members also recorded their votes for A YES : Sbrimati Sbeila KauJ, Sbri A. Senapatbi, Ooundcr, Sbrimati Induwati Bhattachary)'a, Sbri Sarfarz Ahmed, Sbri M.R.. Janardtfauan, Sbri Mauit Reddy, Dr. Chinta Moban, 8hri K.~. Pradbao and Sbri A.J,V.B. Mabeswara Rao, from the Secretary. Geoeral of R,ajya am directed to J1IIIWD ....h the Sabba:- Punjab APPrOPriatklb ail~ J98S. which wal "..d by tbe Lok Sabha at ils littio, ~1cI OD tbe (t) 'In accordance with the provisions 24th January,) 985, and transmi- of sub-rule t 6) of Rule 186 of the t ted to the Rajya Sabha for its re- Rules of Procedure and Conduct commendations on the same day of Business in the Rajy. Sabha, I and to state that the Rejya SatNta aCD djrectod to return herewith the at its sitting held on tbe lOth Appropriation .111, 1985, which January. 1985. recommended that was passed by the Lok Sabhl at the (onowina amendment be made ita sitdOl held on the 24th in the said Bill ;- Jaooary, 1985~ aod transmitted to the Rajya Sabha for Its recomm- eudabons on the same day and to ENACTING FORMUI A state that tbe Rajya Sabba at its silting held on the 30th January, That at Pile i. hne 1 for tbe word 1985, recommended that the "Thjrty-fifth" the word uThirtY_I;xth" following amendment be made In be substituted. the said Bill :- ENACTING FORMULA 2. Sir,) lay on the Table the followiaa Bills which have been returned by .... Sabba with recommendations :- Tbat at pale I, line 1, Jor the word "Thirty-fiftb''. the word ·'Thirty-sixth" be substituted. (I) The Appropriation BiU, J9IS (0) la accordance witb tbe provisions (2) The Appropriation (No.2) Bill. of lub-rule (6) of Rule 186 of the 1985 R ulc:l of Procedure and Conduct of BusiDeu in the Rajya Sabba, I am directed to return herewith (3) The Puajab AppropriatioD BiU, the AppropriltiOD (No.2) BiU, 1985 1985, wbich was puled by tbe Lolc Sabba at itl sittiDI held on lhc 24th January, 1985, and transmi- tted to the Rajya Sabha for il" recommendationl on the same day 20.13 hrs- and to state that the Rajya Sabba at itl siuinl held on the 30th APPROPRIATION (RAILWAYS) BILL, January, 1985, recommended that • 1985 the followin. amendment be made in the said Bill :- -£.,1;,11] ENACTING FORMULA Amendment reconzmn.detl by RQj)'Q SqbJ. 'That at pale I, line 1 for the word uThirty-fifth" the word "Thirty-sixth" THE MINISTER OF RAILWAYS be substituted: (SHRf BANS I LAL) : Sir, I ~I 10 move: (iii) lIn accordance with the provisions UTbat 1he (oUowin, amendment, rcco- of .ub-rule (6) of Rule 186 of tbe mmeaded by tbe Rajya Sabba in the R ulcs of Procedure and COnduct Approprialioa (Railways, Bill, 1915. be of Business in the Rajya Sabha, r taken into coDlideraliOD~- III ~ (.",.) l1li41985 MAGHA 10. 1906 (SAKA) 'SI'4ACTlNG FORMULA 2014 In. APPROPRIAnON (RAILWAYS) NO.2 "That at paae J, line I, for the word ~'Thirty.flrtb" the word uTlllrty-.th·· mLl.J985 be,"blliruttd". . Eng/Is/I] MR. SPEAKER: The que!tion is : Amendment Tecommelll/ecl by R{lj),o Sa"'. "that the follow iDa amendnaeDC. ,co- mmeoded by the Raj,a S,bha in the THE MINISTER GF RAILWAYS Appropriatioo (RaHway.) Bill, 1985, be (SH RJ BANSI LA!,) ; Sir, I beg to mow: taken ioto consideration:- "That Ihe follo\\;ng amendaJeot. reco- 'ENACTING FORMULA mmended by the Rajya Sabba in the AppropriatIon (Railways) No. 2 Bill, J 985, be taken in!o cODsidcration:- "That al pap I. line 1,1M' the word word "Thirt)"'Stxth" ''Thirt1-fir,h'' the 'ENACTING FORMULA be silbstitll"d". That at page 1.ltne I,forthe word Til, .\lotion wcu adopttd "Thlrty-firlh" the \\ord "Thirty-sisth~' be !:ubstifllteli". MR.. SPEAK.ER : We shall DO\\ take up question is: the amendment recommended by the Rajya MR. SPEAKER: The Sabha. "That the following amendmcnt, reco- mmended by the Rajya Sabha in the Appropriation (RaiJways) No 2 Bill, 1985, be taken into cODsideralioo:- cENACfING FORMULA 'ENACTING FORMULA nit at page 1, hne 1, for the word . 'That at page I, Hoe 1, for the \\ord "Thirty-fifth" the word "Thirty-sixth" "Thirty-fifth" the word ·'Thiny-sixth" be SlIlntitll"d. be substituttd". Tile .\lotion was ac/opted. Th, MOlioll was adoptee/. SHRI B.'NSI LAL : Sir, 1 bel to MR. SPEAKER = We shan DOW take up move: the ameDdmcot recommended by the Rajya Sabha. "Thal the am~Ddmcnt recommended by the Rajya Sabha be accepted. The question is : 'ENACTING FORMULA MR. SPEAKER : The question js: "That at page 1. line 1, for the word "That the.: am~ndmcot re~omml.!ndcd by "Tbirty-fifth" the word ·'Thirty-silltb" be the Rajya Sabha be aee~pt~d ., 5Ilb\tilmed:' Til, .'-Ioflon "'m at/opted. The Motioll was adopted. 213 ANWfJII'iGliDII BIO, 1985 JANU"gy 30, 1915 AfJll'(ltHlUlkM (No.1) lill J9B5 ~ SHRI BANSI LAL : I bel to move: MR. SPEAKER : We lball DOW take up tbe ameDdmen t recommeDded ." tbe "Tbat tbe recommendation made by Rajya labba. Rajya Sabba be accepted.n The question is : MR.. SPEAKER : Tho question is : ENACTING PORMULA "That the recommead.tion made by the Rajy. Sabha be accepted."' •'Tbat at paae J, line 1 t for the word "Thirty-firth" the word "Thirty-sixth" be lubJtllllt~. '. TI" Motion M'as adopted. _.Ist brl. APPROPRI ... TION BILL. .'" SHRI JANARDHANA POOJARY: I beg to move: [English] "That the recommendation made by the Rajya Sabha ~ accepted.·· Amadmell' recomm~utkd by Rajya Sahlla MR. SPEAKER: The question js : THB MINISTBR OF STATE IN THE MINISTR Y OF FINANCE (SHR I JA~ARDHANA POOJARY) : I beg to -'That the recommendation made by the move : Rajya Sabha b~ accl!ptcd.·· (i) "(I) "That tbe followinl amend· The Al()/w1/ was adopttd ment, recommended by the Raj)a Sabba in tbe Appropriation B11I~ 1985, be taken into considera- 2017 hrs tion :- APPROPRIATION (NO:!) BJLL, 1985 'ENACTING FORMULA [English ''That at pile I, liDe I./or tbe word "Thirty-tifth" tho word "1birty-sixth·· if mendme"t recOlllllltlUleti b., Rajya Sah"a be ,lIbst;tuJed.·' THE MINISTER Of" STATE IN THE MR. SPBAKER. : The question is : MINISTRY OF PI NANCE (SHRI JANARDHANA POOJA~Y) : I beg to c&(l) That the rollowiDI ameadment. move: recorDIDeIIded by tbe Ilajya Sabba in tbe Appropriation Bill, 1985, be taken (i) "That the fo)lO\\ iua amendment. into consideratioD :- recommended by the Rajya Sabba in the Appropriation (No.2) Bill, J985, be 'ENACTING FORMULA taken mto consideration :- "That .t J)IlIe J. Jioe 1, for the word ENACTING fORfwfULA Tbirt,..fiftll" tbe- word ulhirty-sixth" be IlIbnituted." That .t pap 1, tine 1.lor the 'wOrd HTbil11·6fth·' the 'hrd ' Thitty.. ixth·· be Itrbltil ltlttr" . P'IIIjDb AJlPropriDliOll MAGHA 10. 1906 (SAKA) Bill, 1985 MR. SPEAKER: The questiOD is : JANARDHANA POOJARY) : I bea to move : "(i) Tbat tbe foUowina amendment, recommended by tbe Rajya Sabha in ., (i) 'fhat tbe followiol amendmellt, ~e Appropriatioo (No.2) Bill. 1985, be recommended by the Rajya Sabba;D ukcn ioto consideration :- ,he Punjab Appropriation BiU. 1985, be ta~en into consideration :- "ENACTING FORMULA Th.t pqe 1. )lot' 1, for the word 'ENACTING FORMULA "Thirty.firth'· the word "Thirty-sixth·' be Illbslilllted':' That at page 1. line 1. for lbe word "Thirty-fifth" the word "Tbirty-satl\l' TIH> ,\10';0" K"aS adf)p'~d. be subJtilllt~d':' MR. SPEAKER: We shall now take up MR. SPEAKER: The question is : tbe amendment recommended by the Rajya Sabha. "(i) That the followiDJ ameadmcGt. The question is : recommended by the Ra,;,a Sabba In the Punjab Appropriation Bill, 1985, tie -ENACTING FORMULA taken into consideralion ;- • Thai at paae I. t inc J .10' the word 'ENCATING FORMULA ·-Thirty-firth" tbe word ·'Thirty... s;xth" be sllb,tiIMt«I~. " That at pap 1, line 1, for tbe word. "Thirt,-fiftbu the word ·,TbirtJ.. si&tl{;' TIl~ .\lolion was adopted. be sllbJlil".et/'." SHR) JANARDHANA POOJARI: I Th~ AIOIio" was adoPI«I. bel to moft : ·'That lbe remmmendation made by abe MR. SPEAUR : We sball now take RQa Sabba he acc:epaed'." up tbe amendmeat ~ by tbe Ra,;,a Sabha. MR. SPEAKER: The ql.leSlion is : The QuestioD is: "That ahe rec:omlDCDdatioD made by the Rlj,. Sabba be accepaecI." 'ENCATING FORMULA TIt~ Motioll ..... "',aJ. That at pafc 1, JiDe I, /. tbI word "Tbirty-Mtb" tbe word "11airtY-siath" 11.1' .... be 6I1bstlt",«I." PUNJAB APPROPRIATION BILL, J9IS The Motioll WilS odo,,_. ·~··~/W.] SHRI JANAIlDHANA POOJARY:.J A,lfftIInJftl rmJ~ by RAjya ~ bea to move: I.~ THE MINJSTER OF STATE IN THE "That the recomlDendatioD made b, •• MINISTRY OF FINANCE (SHRI R.jy. Sabba be ,capaN. ,. 281 Motion rI. Six-Nation Summit on JANUARY 30, 1985 Cm,cludi"g Rnfllllks 288 NucletJF Di'Qrmam,,,, MR. SPEAKER: The question is : Skte by side the role and effectiveness. of tbe United Natioos should also be "That the ameodment made tly 1he strengthened. The House sttongly Raba Sabba be accepted." reamrms tbe call made in the Dedaratior that people, Parliaments aDd Go~rn The Motion was adopt~d. IDeots aU the world over. lend forcefu\ support to the appeal. 20.19 hrs. MOnON RE : SIX .. NATION SUMMIT ON The House request the Govern- NUCLEAR DISARMAMENT ment of India '0 convey jts tbank. and appreciation to the Heads of State or (E"g1is~ . Government who, through their presence and positive contribUliOD. MR. SPEAKER: Now I have 8 motion ensured the success of the Summit, It to place before the House. It is as alao place!) 00 record its appreciation follows : of the work done by the Indiao delega- tion aDd the leadersbip provided by tbC "This House notes with satisfaction and Prime Minister of Jndia. Shri Rajiv pride that the sil-Nation Summit 00 Gandhi. ., "uclear Disarmament held in new Delhi on January 28, 1985, has hope the House accepts this unani- successfully concluded ilS deliberations. mously and recommends it. The Delhi Declaration issued at the conclusion of this Summit Rprescnts a HON. MEMBERS: Yes. major contribution to the world-wide movement for a bait to the nuelear arms The .Motion WQS adopted race and for concreate measures to pre- veot the outbreak of a nuclear war wbich ~ould result in the extinction of CONCLUDING REMARKS human civilisatioo and life on tbis planet. [FAglish) The House wel~mes tbe Delbi MR. SPEAKER: Before I adjourn the Iiloclaration wbicb reiterated the call for House I bave to thank all the Membcn-tbe an aJl-embracing bait to tbe testing, DeW ones and tbe old ooes witb all tboir production and deployment of nuclear IUsto and eotbu~iasm tbat they have beeD so weapons and tbeir delivery .,.se .. as cooperative aod. I think we have learnt a lot well as measures aimed at substaotial and the new Mem~n ha~ ensu~ that the,- ~ and eventually tbe complete caD work a5 well as the old ODeS. elimination oC DUCIear weapooa. II welcomes io particular the spocifIc steps Witb tbis DeW Bill which we have just caUecl for in the declarat~ the ptOVeO- tion or an arms race in the .pace paued, I thiok, we are goiD. to start a new 011_ cbapter the history Indian politiCs. I aad a comprehensive treal, probibitioa in or coaaratulale )'ou aU aad also thank you all. the testiDg of Duclear weapons. The House stands adjourned sine die. It it urporJy occasal'1 tbat the precious r-.oun::es preseody WIlted io dlilitary cxpcoditure be dircctecl towards zo.n .... SOcial add economic dewelopme&t parti- cularly of the developinl countries. The Lok SabIuJ the" adjourned ,i. die PIS..I.u.• • ., 1985 BY IDE SAIBA SlCRB'l'AlUAT Published 1IDCfer RuIeI379 and 382 or the Rules of Prucodure aDd CoDClact of BusiDess in Lot Sabba (Sixth Edition)