Interview with Robert F. Bacher
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ROBERT F. BACHER (1905–2004) INTERVIEWED BY MARY TERRALL June–August 1981, February 1983 ARCHIVES CALIFORNIA INSTITUTE OF TECHNOLOGY Pasadena, California Subject area Physics Abstract An interview in ten sessions, 1981 and 1983, with Robert F. Bacher, chairman of the Division of Physics, Mathematics, and Astronomy (1949-1962), Caltech’s first provost (1962-1969), and professor of physics, emeritus. He recalls his education at the University of Michigan and graduate work in physics at Harvard (1926-27) and Michigan, where he got to know J. R. Oppenheimer and the European physicists who joined the faculty and/or came for the summer sessions in physics: Goudsmit, Uhlenbeck, Fermi, Bohr, Ehrenfest, Dirac and others. Recalls postdoc year at Caltech (1930-31) working on atomic spectra; Oppenheimer’s lectures; Millikan’s cosmic-ray work. Spends 1931-1932 at MIT working with John Slater; Chadwick’s discovery of the neutron. Spends the next two years as a postdoc at Michigan, working with Goudsmit. Instructorship at Columbia, 1934; association with I. I. Rabi. Moves to Cornell in 1935; recollections of Hans Bethe; cyclotron work on neutron energies. Early 1941, joins the Radiation Laboratory at MIT, of which Lee DuBridge was director. Recalls start of Manhattan Engineer District; contacts with J. R. Oppenheimer and General Leslie Groves. Joins Los Alamos in June 1943 as head of experimental physics division; recollections of bomb work. Returns to Cornell in January 1946. Postwar development of high-energy physics; Acheson-Lilienthal Report on international http://resolver.caltech.edu/CaltechOH:OH_Bacher_R control of atomic energy. Establishment of the Atomic Energy Commission, fall 1946; he becomes a commissioner; moves to Washington, D.C. Recalls weapons testing in the Pacific and the development of nuclear reactors. In 1949, he becomes chairman of the Division of Physics, Mathematics, and Astronomy at Caltech. Called back to Washington to testify at Hickenlooper hearings; warns the British about Klaus Fuchs. Discusses the postwar buildup of physics at Caltech; comments on the mathematics and astronomy departments. Debate over tactical vs. strategic nuclear weapons. Service on President’s Science Advisory Committee; the McCarthy era; comments on his service as Caltech provost. Comments on establishment of Fermilab; participation in the International Union of Pure and Applied Physics. Recalls advent of Harold Brown as Caltech president in 1969; comments on reorganization of NASA contract with the Jet Propulsion Laboratory. Comments on current setup of Caltech’s Faculty Board and on his own activities since his retirement. Administrative information Access The interview is unrestricted. Copyright Copyright has been assigned to the California Institute of Technology © 1983, 2004. All requests for permission to publish or quote from the transcript must be submitted in writing to the University Archivist. Preferred citation Bacher, Robert F. Interview by Mary Terrall. Pasadena, California, June-August, 1981, February 1983. Oral History Project, California Institute of Technology Archives. Retrieved [supply date of retrieval] from the World Wide Web: http://resolver.caltech.edu/CaltechOH:OH_Bacher_R Contact information Archives, California Institute of Technology Mail Code 015A-74 Pasadena, CA 91125 Phone: (626) 395-2704 Fax: (626) 793-8756 Email: [email protected] Graphics and content © 2004 California Institute of Technology. http://resolver.caltech.edu/CaltechOH:OH_Bacher_R CALIFORNIA INSTITUTE OF TECHNOLOGY ORAL HISTORY PROJECT INTERVIEW WITH ROBERT F. BACHER BY MARY TERRALL PASADENA, CALIFORNIA Caltech Archives, 1983 Copyright © 1983, 2004 by the California Institute of Technology http://resolver.caltech.edu/CaltechOH:OH_Bacher_R Bacher–ii TABLE OF CONTENTS INTERVIEW WITH ROBERT F. BACHER Tape 1, Side 1 1-11 Childhood and early education in Ann Arbor; high school science courses; first exposure to modern physics in university chemistry library; decision to pursue career in physics. University of Michigan; graduate work at Harvard (1926-1927); quantum mechanics with J. Slater; graduate work at Michigan; upgrading of theoretical physics at Michigan; arrival of O. Laporte, G. Uhlenbeck, S. Goudsmit, and D. M. Dennison. Tape 1, Side 2 11-21 Work with Laporte and Goudsmit on atomic spectra; Michigan summer session in theoretical physics; thesis research on quantum-mechanical problems of hyperfine structure of spectra. Marriage to Jean Dow (1930); summer at Cavanaugh Lake; getting to know E. Fermi; National Research Council Fellowship at Caltech; cross-country drive to Pasadena. National Academy of Sciences meeting at Mt. Wilson Observatory; experimental spectroscopy at Caltech, I. S. Bowen, W. V. Houston; compendium of energy states of elements; working in observatory library, Santa Barbara St.; contact with various Caltech faculty. Tape 2, Side 1 22-31 Attending J. R. Oppenheimer’s lectures (1930-1931); spectroscopic work; contact with R. A. Millikan; Millikan’s cosmic ray work; Millikan’s attitude toward theoretical physics and quantum mechanics; C. Anderson’s high-energy research as outgrowth of earlier cosmic ray physics; C. C. Lauritsen and nuclear physics (Kellogg Laboratory) in 1930s; dedication of Athenaeum (1931). Reflections on year at Caltech; comparison of Caltech and Michigan physics departments; move to MIT for second year of fellowship to work with Slater. Tape 2, Side 2 31-39 Comparison of MIT and Caltech; journal club at which Chadwick’s discovery of neutron was discussed; initial skeptical reaction to Chadwick’s work by MIT physicists; implications of neutron for problems of nuclear moments. Return to Michigan; moving into experimental spectroscopy; working with no money and homemade equipment; theoretical work on energy states with Goudsmit; Goudsmit and Uhlenbeck. http://resolver.caltech.edu/CaltechOH:OH_Bacher_R Bacher–iii Tape 3, Side 1 40-49 Move to Columbia as instructor (1934); associations with I. I. Rabi, J. Kellogg, J. Zacharias, S. Millman; job offer from Cornell; experimental nuclear physics started at Cornell by S. Livingston; comparison of Cornell and Columbia; revitalization of Cornell’s physics department; beginning of friendship and collaboration with H. Bethe. Discovering Cornell’s unused equipment and setting up high-resolution spectroscopy; moving into nuclear physics; inheriting small cyclotron from Livingston (1938); using cyclotron for neutron work. Revising Cornell’s introductory physics course to include modern physics; teaching summer school; building up cyclotron research group—M. Holloway, C. Baker, B. McDaniel; refining equipment to measure time of flight of neutrons; developing new kind of detector; measuring neutron absorption spectra for various elements. Tape 3, Side 2 50-59 Relevance of theoretical background for experimental neutron work. Move to MIT’s Radiation Laboratory (1940); history of magnetron development and use; establishment of Radiation Lab; invitation to join; work on radar problem while continuing neutron work at Cornell. Pearl Harbor attack; cooperation of industrial laboratories on radar work; development of improved cathode-ray tubes for signal display; relations with the military; funding from National Defense Research Committee (NDRC); first successful detection of radio echoes; use of radar to chase submarines from Atlantic Coast; importance of radar for the war. Disparity between results from Cornell neutron work and Fermi’s results on thermal neutrons as a result of incorrect figure for boron cross section; discussing results with Fermi and preparing for publication; decision not to publish for security reasons. Cornell equipment moved to Los Alamos; decision to move nuclear reactor research (including Fermi’s group) to Chicago after Pearl Harbor; McDaniel’s expertise on fast circuits applied to bomb work at Los Alamos. Tape 4, Side 1 60-70 Running indicator group at Radiation Lab; Oppenheimer asks for advice on starting nuclear weapon lab (1942); planning discussions with Oppenheimer and Maj. L. Groves; objections to Oppenheimer’s agreement to set up lab as a military project; eventual change of plan; Groves- Conant letter; first trip to Los Alamos (1943); preliminary Los Alamos meeting on technical problems of building bomb. Invitation to join lab; initial refusal and more precise offer to come as head of experimental physics division; acceptance on condition that lab remain civilian project; question of whether bomb could be developed fast enough to be used in war; support of Radiation Lab for bomb project; moving to Los Alamos with family. Oppenheimer as director of lab; personal relationship with Oppenheimer. Tape 4, Side 2 70-81 Oppenheimer’s doubts about his own performance; Oppenheimer’s relationship with Groves; http://resolver.caltech.edu/CaltechOH:OH_Bacher_R Bacher–iv Oppenheimer’s clearance problems. Trip to Berkeley to inspect isotope separation (August 1943); finding samples of partially separated uranium-235; problems to be solved before bomb could be built; decision to use implosion method; technical problems associated with implosion. Preparing for first bomb test; test site; Hiroshima and Nagasaki bombs; work on next core assembly; trip to Washington with Oppenheimer; V-J Day; problem of ending project. International control of atomic energy; moving back to Cornell; postwar Cornell physics group. Tape 5, Side 1 82-92 Return to Cornell; setting up new high-energy physics lab there. Acheson-Lilienthal Report on atomic energy; scientific