1604 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. MARcH 5, .

my feelings. But when he intimated that I was responsible for an pany and Stephen W. Wood, inventor and patentee--to the Committee amendment, I wanted to set him right. on Patents. .Mi. RANDALL. The criticism was general. By Mr. HENLEY: Petition of wool-growers of the State of Califor­ Mr. COX, of New York. But the amendment did come from the nia, for the restoration of the tariff of 1867-to the Committee on Ways gentleman from Indiana. andMeans. • Mr. DORSHEIMER. Will it be in order for me, Mr. Chairman, to By 1t1r. HITT : Memorial of George S. Fisher, late consul at Bei­ offer an amendment? rut-to the Committee on Foreign Affairs. The CHAIRMAN. It will not be in order now. By Mr. HOLMES: Petition of citizens of Lehigh, Webster County, Mr. DORSHEIMER. I will reserve what! have to say until another and of Angus, Boone County, Iowa, relative to the Chinese restriction opportunity. aet--to the same committee. Mr. KASSON. I withdraw the formal amendment. By Mr. HUNT : Papers relating to the claim of Cora A. Slocumb, Mr. WHITE, of Kentucky. I rise to renew the amendment. Ida A. Richardson, and Caroline A. Urquhart-to the Committee on The CHAIRMAN. The Chair has recognized the gentleman from War Claims. New York [Mr. HUTCHINS] who is in charge ofthe bill. By Mr. KASSON : Petition of citizens of Marion County, Iowa, rela­ Mr. BLOUNT. Will the gentleman from New York yield to me for tive to the Chinese restriction act-to the Committee on Foreign A.ffairs. a single moment to give a statement as to the excess of revenues over By Mr. LIBBEY: PapersrelatingtotheclaimofBenjaminP. Loyall­ expenditures for a single year? to the Committee on Claims. Mr. HUTCHINS. I yield to the gentleman for that purpose. By Mr. CHARLES O'NEILL: Remonstranceofcitizensandmercan­ Mr. BLOUNT. I quote from adocumentfurnished by the Treasury tile associations, relative to bridging the Ohio River and the Great Ka­ Department showing the amounts of estimated revenues and expend­ nawha-to the Committee on Commerce. itures of the United States in eooh year from 1863 to 1884 inclusive. Also, memorial of the Franklin Institute of the State of Pennsylvania, The gentleman from Illinois stated that the Forty-sixth Congress found for the appointment of a commission of experts for testing iron, steel, a large surplUs of money out of which they might have enlarged the &c.-to the Committee on Appropriations. Navy. I find that during the year 1879 the excess of revenue over the By Mr. PETERS: Resolution of the Kansas Cane-Growers' Associa­ expenditures was $6,879,000; and not until several months had elapsed tion, against the reduction of the tariff on sugar-to the Committee on after the expiration of that Congress did there appear to be any great Ways and Means. excess. After that Congress expired there appeared in 1880 to be sixty­ Also, petition for the passage of the bill (H. R. 2125) equalizing home­ five millions of excess for the first time and no one had any guarantee steads-to the Committee on the Public Lands. of the permanency of that large excess. Also, petition of citizens of Barton County, Kansas, relative to the Mr. WHITE, of Kentucky. I ask the gentleman from New York Chinese restriction act-to the Committee on Foreign Affairs. [Mr. HUTCHINS] to yield to me. . By llfr. POLAND: Petition of Dr. J. W. Copeland, asking for a Mr. HUTCHINS. I do not yield further. I move that the commit­ pension for Mrs. Elizabeth A. Randall-to the Committee on Invalid tee do now rise for the purpose of obtaining an order from the House to Pensions. limit debate. By Mr. PUSEY: Resolutions of Fuller Post, Grand Army of the The motion that the committee rise was agreed to. Republic, Logan, Iowa, asking for a pension for all Union soldiers-to The committee accordingly rose; and the Speaker having resumed the Select Committee on Payment of Pensions, Bounty, and Baek Pay. the chair, l\fr. CoNVERSE reported that the Committee of the Whole By Mr. RIGGS: Papers relating to the claim of Capt. J. H. Estes­ House on the state of the Union had had under consideration the bill to the Committee on Claims. (H. R. 4716) making appropriations for the naval service for the fiscal By l'lfr. ROBERTSON: Papers relating to the claim of Mary A. Hoi­ year ending June 30,, 1885, and for other purposes, and had come to no mead-to the Committee on War Claims. resolution thereon. By 1lfr. CHARLES STEWART: Memorial of citizens of Harrisburg, Mr. HUTCHINS. I move that when the House shall again resolve Tex., and of citizens of Houston, Tex., relative to the Chinese restric­ itself into Committee of the Whole House on the state of the Union for tion act-severally to the Committee on Foreign Affairs. the further consideration of the naval appropriation bill all debate on By Mr. STOCKSLAGER: Papers relating to the claim of JesseDur­ the first paragraph of the bill, concluding with line 38, and all amend­ nell-to the Committee on Claims. ments thereto, be limited to fifteen minutes. By Mr. WEMPLE: Petition of citizens of New York, relative to the The motion was agreed to. importation of aliens under contract-to the Committee on Labor. Mr. HUTCHINS moved to reconsider the vote just taken; and also By Mr. MILO WHITE: Petition of ?tlrs. Susie L. Strong and 133 · moved that the motion to reconsider be laid on the table. others, of Rev. C. F. Blume and 135 others, and of Sarah R. Crawford The latter motion was agreed to. and 102 others, citizens of Minnesota, for a sixteenth amendment to Mr. HUTCHINS. I move that the House donowadjourn. the.Constitution-to the Committee on the Judiciary. The motion was agreed to. By Mr. JAMES WILSON: Petition of citizens of Iowa City, Iowa, And accordingly (at 4o'clock and 50 minutes p.m.) the House ad­ relative to rebate on tobacco tax-to the Committee on Ways and journed. Means. By Mr. W. L. WILSON: Petition for the reliefof ZadockWilliams­ to the Committee on the District of Columbia. PETITIONS, ETC. By Mr. WOOD: Resolution of HenryS. Lane Post, No. 76, Grand . The following petitions and papers were laid on the Clerk's desk, Army of the Republic, relative to pensions, bounty, &c.-to the Select under the rule, and referred as follows: Committee on Payment of Pensions, Bounty, and Back Pay. By l\fr. ALEXANDER: Petition of citizens of Mooresville, Mo., rel­ Also, resolutions of Bennett Post, No. 183, Grand Army of the Repub­ ative to the Chinese restriction act-to the Committee on Foreign lic, Department of Indiana, on the same subject-to the same commit­ Affairs. tee. By Mr. BROADHEAD: Resolutions of Farragut Post, No.3, relative By Mr. WORTHINGTON: Petition for the amendment of the Chinese to a pension for Mrs. Nina M. Gwynn-to the Committee on Invalid restriction act-to the Committee on Foreign A.ffairs. Pensions. By Mr. YAPLE: Petition of W. A. Fuller and others, of J. Wood­ By Mr. FELIX CAMPBELL: Petition of John Lundy and others, hans and others, and of E. U. Irish and others, all citizens of Kalama­ for the improvement of Sheepshead Bay, New York-to the Committee zoo, Mich., relative to the establishment of a branch of the National on Rivers and Harbors. Soldiers' Home in Michigan-severally to the Committee on Military By Mr. CONVERSE: Petitions ofF. E. Stalezand18 others, of H. E. Affairs. Ashley and 24 others, of S. H. Dill and 65 others, of S. L. Scott and 28 By Mr. YOUNG: Papers relating to the claim of Louis Morat--to the others, of J. G. Russell and 217 others, citizens and wool-growers of Committee on War Claims. Ohio; of C. D. Luce and 36 others, of E. J. Ames and 34 others, of H. Colister and 11 others, of C. J. Colby and 24 others, of E. J. Foster and 40 others, ofW. M. Fair and 53 others, ofHon. J. M. Neasmith and 72 SENATE. others, citizens and wool-growers of Michigan; of A. Symes and 15 . others, wool-growers of Texas, and of J. T. Monroe and 34 others, wool­ WEDNESDAY, March 5, 1884• growers of California, praying for the restoration of the tariff of 1867 on Prayer by the Chaplain, Rev. E. D. HUNTLEY, D. imported wool-severally to the Committee on Ways and Means. n:' By Mr. S. S. COX: Memorial of James M. Brady, administrator, The Journal of yesterday's proceedings was read and approved. &c.-to the Committee on the Judiciary. PETITIONS AND MEMORIALS. By 111r. DIBRELL: Papers relating to the claim of Martha M. Bird­ Mr. HARRISON. I present the petition of Will H. Johnson and a sail-to the Committee on Pensions. large number of other citizens of Montgomery County, Indiana., pray­ By M:r. FIEDLER: Petition of Anthony G. Kroehl and others, em­ ing that Congress take favorable action upon various relief measures ployes of W. V. Headly, of Newark, N.J., relative to the Chinese re­ in behalf of soldiers of the late war. I move that the petition be re­ striction act-to the Committee on Foreign. Affairs. ferred to the Committee on Pensions. By Mr. GREENLEAF: Memorial of the Pneumatic Elevator Com- The motion was agreed to. .1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. , 1605 Mr. HOAR. I present the petition of W. P. R. Estes, late private Mr. CONGER introduced a bill {S. 1738) to provide for the construc­ Company D, Nineteenth Massachusetts Volunteers, and 18 other per­ tion of a public building at the city of Jackson, in the State of Michigan, sons, who were prisoners of war in the rebellion, praying for the pas­ for a post-office and other Federal. offices; which was read twice by its sage f Senate bill No. 44, pensioning prisoners of war. I move that title, and referred to the Committee on Public Buildings and Grounds. the petition be referred to the Committee on Pensions. Mr. McPHERSON introduced a bill (S. 1739) granting a pension to The motion was agreed to. the widow and children of the late Byram Pitney; which was read :Ur. HOAR. I present a petition of 928 citizens of Cambridge, Mass., twice by its title, and refen-ed to the Committee on Pensions. praying the passage of the bill favored by theNational Civil Service Re­ Mr. 1tfiLLER, of New York, introduced a bill (S.1740) for the erec­ form League, repealing the four years' limitation upon the term of serv­ tion of a public building at Troy, N. Y.; which was read twice by its ice of certaiu offices. Among the petitioners are the names of a large title, and referred to the Committee on Public Buildings and Grounds. number of persons highly distinguished in letters, public life, and the PAPE RS WITHDRAWN AND REFERRED. various professions, representing, I should think, about equally mem­ bers of both the principal political parties of the country. I move that On motion of Mr. ALLISON, it was the petition be referred to the Committee on Civil Service and Retrench- Ordered, That the papers relating to the claim of the officers and others, sur­ vivors of the Farragut fleet, for payment of bounty for destruction of enemy's ment. ' vessels below New Orleans in April, 1862, be taken from the files of the Senate The motion was agreed to. • and referred to the Committee on Appropriations. Mr. HOAR presented a petition of the Woman's Christian Temper­ On motion of Mr. HOAR, it was ance Union of Massachusetts, officially signed, representing 10,000 mem­ Ordered, That the papers in the case of 1\Iary Hopperton be taken from the bers, praying for a commission of inquiry concerning the alcoholic liquor files of the Senate and referred to the Committee on Pensions. traffic; which was referred to the Committee on Education and Labor. On motion of Mr. HARRISON, it was Mr. RIDDLEBERGER presented the petition of Alice Crawford, Ordel·ed, That the papers in the case of David G. Porter be taken from the files widowofWilliam Crawford, late private Twenty-third Regiment United and referred to the Committee on Pensions. States Infantry, praying to be reimbursed for certain losses incurred by her while under the protection of the Government; which was referred DISTRICT INDUSTRIAL HOME SCHOOL. to the Committee on Claims. The PRESIDENT pro tempm·e. The Chair lays before the Senate, Mr. HAWLEY presented the petition of James W. King, chief engi­ under the eighth rule, Order of Business 134. neer, United States Navy, praying thatcertainofficersofthe Navy may M1·. CONGER. Would it be in order at this time to move to take have the rank on the retired-list which they held on the active-list; from the Calendar for its p~age a bill? which was referred to the Committee on Naval Affairs. The PRESIDENT pro tem,pore. It is in order. Mr. MILLER, of New York, presented the petition of2,500 citizens Mr. CONGER. I move, then, that Senate bill No. 1519, reported of the city of New York, praying for the repeal of the act, and act sup­ yesterday by t he Senator from Michigan [Mr. PALMER J, be taken up. plementary thereto, by which the terms of many administrative offices Mr. HARRIS. Let the bill be read by its title for information. were changed and :fixed at four years; which was referred to the Com­ The PRESIDENT p ro tempore. The Senator from Michigan moves mittee on Civil Service and Retrenchment. that the Senate now proceed to the consideration of the bill (S. 1519) REPORTS OF COMMI'ITEES. to regulate the powers and duties of the board of trustees of the Indus­ Mr. GARLAND, from the Committee on the Judiciary, to whom were trial Home School of the District of Columbia in respect to infant wards referred sundry petitions and memorials in reference to the interests of and scholars, and for other purposes. Th~ question is on the motion of the United States in certain property upon which it bas liens, reported the Senator from Michigan. a bill (S. 1733) to provide for protecting the interests of the United Mr. CONGER. I made the motion when the chairman of the Com­ States in respect of any incumbrances on property wherein they have an mittee on the District of Columbia [Mr. INGALLS] was not here, be­ interest; which was read twice by its title. cause I am very anxious to have the bill considered to-day. He would He also, from the same committee, to whom were referred sundry have made it probably if I bad not. I ask that the bill may be read. petitions and memorials in reference to the collection of statistics touch­ The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The ques~ion is on agreeing to the ing marriage and divorce, reported a bill (S. 1734) providing for the motion of the Senator from Michigan to now proceed to the considera­ collection of statistics touching marriage and divorce; which was read tion of the bill. twice by its title. I Mr. CAMERON, of Wisconsin. I should like to know what special l!r. JACKSON, from the Committee on Claims, to whom was re­ reasons there are, if any, for taking the bill up out of its order. ferred the bill (S. 788) tor the relief of Warren Hall, submitted an ad­ Mr. CONGER. I think if the bill can be read the Senator will see verse report thereon, which was agreed to; and the bill was indefinitely a reason for it or. I can explain it very readily myself. postponed. Mr. CAMERON, of Wisconsin. I prefer to know the reasons before Mr. CAMERON, of ~isconsin, from the Committee on Claims, to I am called on to vote on the question of taking it up. whom was referred the bill {S. 444) for the relief of Edward Fenlon, Mr. CONGER. The bill is to give power to the Industrial Home reported it without amendment, and submitted a report thereon. School of this District to receive by an instrument in writing from par­ He also, from the same committee, to whQm was referred the bill{S. ents children that they propose to take and educate, waifs that they 1366) for the relief of Mrs. Sarah Elizabeth Holroyd, widow and ad­ pick up, as they have heretofore done. It provides for some instru­ ministratrix of the estate of John Holroyd, deceased, asked to be dis­ ment in writing by which the parents may assign to them the control charged from its further consideration, and that it be referred to the of the children. The necessity for the meMure is that children are Committee on Patents; which was agreed to. taken by this institution, clothed and educated for a particular time, Mr. HAMPTON, from the Committee on Military Affairs, to whom and then the freak of the guardian or parent takes them away and puts was referred the bill (S.1361) giving a military record to Thomas Miller, them again upon the streets exposed to vice. There are several cases reported it without amendment, and submitted a report thereon. of that kind which have occurred lately, and in order that this bill may Mr. DOLPH, from the Committee on Claims, to whom was referred go to the other House and have consideration there it is very desirable the bill {S. 1031) for the relief of W. C. Marsh, reported it with an to pass it at once. The Industrial Home School is one which Congress amendment, and submitted a report thereon. for some years bas given an appropriation to aid, and to that extent it He also, from the same committee, to whom was referred the bil1 {S. is a public institution. I think the reading of the bill will show the 1118) for the relief of Mrs. Louisa H. Hasell, reported it without amend­ propriety of it. ment, and submitted a report thereon. Mr. CAMERON, of Wisconsin. Very well. Mr. FAIR, fron the Committee on Claims, to whom was referred the The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The question is on agreeing to the bill (S. 1170) for the relief of Richard Hawley & Sons, reported it with­ motion of the Senator from Michigan to proceed to the consideration of out amendment, and submitted a report thereon. the bill at this time. The motion was agreed to; and the Senate, as in Committee of the BILLS INTRODUCED. Whole, proceeded to consider the bill. . Mr. ANTHONY introduced a bill {S. 1735) for the benefit of the legal The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The Chair will suggest to the Sen­ representatives of Asbury Dickins; which was read twice by its title ator from Michigan that in line 4 of the first section there is evidently and referred to the Committee on Claims. ' a misprint. It reads "an instrument of writing;" the Chair thinks it Mr. COCKRELL introduced a bill (S. 1736) to amend section 985 and should read '' in writing.'' · to repeal section 986 of the Revised Statutes of the United States of Mr. CONGER. Yes, sir. ' America; which was read twice by its title, and referred to the Com­ The PRESIDENT pro tempore. If there be no objection that clerical mittee on the .Judiciary. error will be corrected. Hr. Mc:MILLAN introduced a bill (S. 1737) to restore to certain Mr. HOAR. I heard the bill read imperfectly. I desire to ask the scouts and soldiers of the United States Army of the Sioux Nation of Senator from Michigan if the bill provides for the care of any property Indians the money and annuities belonging to them confiscated and the wards may happen to have. forfeited to the United States under ''an act for the relief ofpersons for Mr. CONGER. No, sir, not at all. It provides that either by the damages sustained by reason of depredations and injuries by certain courts or by an instrument i.it writing duly acknowledged children may bands of Sioux Indians," approved February 16, 1863; which was read be delivered to the custody ofthe trustees ofthe Industrial Home School twice by its title, and referred to the Committee on Claims. for such length of time as the parent or guardian in writing may agree. 1606 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. MA.ROH 5,

The trouble about it heretofore has been th3.t little waifs are taken taril~ residing in a house of prostitution, may be sent under arrest and may be reqwred to labor at some smtable employment, and to receive instructions and up, saved from vice and exposure to vice and crime, and taken to this pr~tical traini?g in ~glish branches and industrial pursuits, and may be re­ institution, and clothed and educated for a particular length of time, qmred to rema.m until the boardoftrnstees shall deem reformation complete. and just at the time when their education is the best perhaps their This is a legislative precedent.which has been acted upon in this Dis­ paren~ or guardians remove them from it. The trustees have no power trict and has been found to be fruitful of beneficial results. This was to keep them in the institution. the precedent. It was from the language of this act that the amend­ Mr. HOAR. I suppose the Senator does not propose to have the cor­ poration intrusted with the guardianship of the property of wards. ment was drawn, and which I thought I had submitted to the honora­ ble Senator from Kansas [Mr. INGALLS] who is at the head of the Would it not be well to limit the second section by inserting after the District Committee, and which I had the impression received his ap­ word '• guardianship," in the sixth line, the words "so far as relates proval individually. Besides, .there w~ an act of Congress passed on to the person of such wards?'' the 6th of May, 1870, and which proVIdes with respect to boys under Mr. CONGER. I have no objection to that amendment. There is the age of 16, whose constitutional rights are just as carefully to be none of this class ever known to have property. It is because they are guarded as those of a greater age, and who in fact from their tender utterly helpless that they are provided for. years are more particularly entitled to thoughtful protection. Mr. HOAR. Still the :first section authorizes any parentor guardian The law to which I refer provi4ies: to surrender the custody of an infant to the board of trustees. The next section provides that the corporation may be appointed guardian. Any bo;YS u~der the age of eixteen Y.eB.!S who shall or may be liable to punish­ ment by ImpriSOnment under any eXIStmg law of the District of Columbia or There is no limit as to waifs or children without property. any law; that may be enacted_ and in force in sai? District. Second. Any boy Mr. CONGER. Say "guardian of the person." under sixteen years of age, With the consent of his parent or guardian a!!11.inst Mr. HOAR. I move to amend in the sixth line of the second sec­ whom any cha:rge of committing :any crime or misdemeanor shall h~v:been ~de, the P!1mshment of which, ~m conviction, would be ~nfinement in jail or tion by inserting after "guardianship" the words " so far as relates to pnson. Third. Any boy under sixteen years of age who lS destitute of a suita­ the person of such ward.'' ble h?me and adequate ~eansofobtainingan hon.estliving, or who is in danger of bemg brought up, or IS brought up, to lead an Idle and vicious life. Fourth. Mr. CONGER. There is no objection to that. Any boy under sixteen years of age who is incorrigible or habitually disregards The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The amendment will be reported. ~he commands of his pa~en ts , father or mother, or guardian; or who resorts to The CHIEF CLERK. In line 6, in section 2, after the word ''guardian- Immoral places or practiCes; or who neglects or refuses at the request or com­ mand of his parents, father or mother, or guardian, to perform labor suitable to ship," it is proposed to insert " so far as relates to the per8on of such his years and condition, or to attend school. ward;" so as to read: SEc. 2. That whenever any boy under the age of sixteen years shall be brought And the said corporation may take and exercise said guardianship so far as before any court of reC?rd of the District of Columbia, or any judge of such relates to the person of such ward to the same extent and under the same obli­ court, and shall be conviCted of any crime or misdemeanor punishable by im­ gations and conditions as is now provided by law in the case of natural·persons. prisonment, other than imprisonment for life, such court or judge in lieu of sentencing such ~oy to imprisonm~nt in the county jail, may, with the consent The amendment was agreed to. of such boy or hiS ~arent ox; guardian. suspend the sentence of punishment in the case, and coiDmJ.t the sa1d boy to the care, control, and custody of the said The bill was reported to the Senate as amended, and the amendments trustees, to be taken to the said reform school, to remain until he shall arrive at were concurred in. the age of twenty-one years, unless sooner discharged by the board of trustees. The bill was ordered to be engrossed for a third reading, read the And in all cases where a. boy, under the age of sixteen years. shall be brought !third time, and passed. before any such court or judge upon the charge of crime or misdemeanor when t~e accu~tion against him .is deemed supported by evidence sufficient to put him on trml, such court or Judge shall have full power to stay all proceedings PROTECTION OF CHILDREN. in the case, and to commit him, in like manner, for such period as such court or The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The Chair lays before the Senate judge may determine, but not less than six months. SEc. 3. That the mayors of the cities of Washington and Georgetown, and the •Order of Business 134 under Rule VIII, being the bill (S. 729) for the president of the levr court of the District of Columbia., respectively, shall have protection of children in the District of Columbia. The bill has been full power to comm1t to the care, control, and custody of the board of trustees .already read, and the question is on agreeing to the amendment pro­ of said reform school, with the consent, and at the proper expense, of his parent or guardian, for such term as the board of trustees may determine, any boy JK>Sed by the Senator from Delaware [Mr. BAYARD]. such as is described in the third and fourth clauses of section one of this act. :JUr. VEST. I should like to inquire what has become of the bill pro­ -viding for the government of the Yellowstone Park. I understood that I read this to show that the present amendment is simply following "that was to come up in advance of this bill. in the line of a wholesome, moderate, and entirely safe precedent in Mr. GARLAND. That comes under the ninth rule. legislation in this District. I hope that Senators will give their ap­ The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The Yellowstone Park bill stands proval to this attempt practically to aid a disinterested effort, founded next. The bill now under consideration went over, the Chair under­ upon private organization, and sustained up to this time by private stands, to stand at the head of the Calendar this morning. means. I trust they will give it their approval by allowing this species Mr. HARRIS. By unanimous consent the bill that the Chair has of semi-parental control, discretionary in the magistrate, where these just laid before the Senate was passed over informally to co~e up this vagrant women and girls shall be found hanging upon the .very verge of morning. ruin, so that there may be the authority to commit them to a safe, The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The Chair so~dersta.nds. kindly, and. careful ministration and custody, where they will be shel­ Mr. HARRIS. The bill that the Senator from Missouri refers to was tered from immoral associations and be taught the means of earning an taken up afterward and was being proceeded with when I chanced to honest livelihood. The 4tstitutions are here. They speak tor them­ leave the chair yesterday morning. selves. They have been eng~ged in this work. The PRESIDENr. pro tempore. The question is on agreeing to the The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The time of the Senator from Delar­ amendment proposed by the Senator from Delaware. ware has expired. We are now under the five-minute rule. 1\Ir. BAYARD. Mr. President, yesterday there was a very short dis­ Mr. COCKRELL. I ask unanimous consent that the Senator from cussion limited by the rule we then were under, and I presented.this Delaware may be allowed to proceed. amendment as one appealing strongly to the favor of every thoughtful 1\fr. BAYARD. Are we proceeding under the five-minute rule? man. There is a class of females referred to in the amendment who are The PRESIDENT pro tempore. On this bill. not yet criminals, but who are on the border line of criminality, when Mr. BAYARD. I do not know that there is anything further for any measure that can arrest their downward course is one of great im­ me to say. I hope the Senate will adopt the amendment. portance, and certainly should be taken if lawfully we may take it. Mr. COCKRELL. I ask unanimous consent that the Senator from The objection was raised yesterday that the amendment was an in­ Delaware may be allowed to proceed. vasion of personal liberty, that it permitted imprisonment without prior The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The Senator from Missouri asks condemnation, to prolonged punishment not measured by law; but I unanimous consent that the Senator from Delaware be allowed to pro­ think the gentlemen who made that objection have not considered the ceed. condition of existing law or the practical facl of that discretionary police 1\Ir. INGALLS and others. Consent. power which must be deposited somewhere in every well-regulated com­ Mr. RANSOM. I hope he may be allowed to go on. munity for thepurposeof arrestingtheperpetration of crime, not simply The PRESIDENT. Is there objection? The Chair hears none, and to punish it when committed, but to anticipate and prevent its accom­ the Senator from Delaware will proceed. plishment. Mr. BAYARD. I have a note here from a gentleman who was once the Wben this matter was brought before me by some ladies, residents of chief of police of this city and afterward one of the commissioners of this Distriet, warmly interested in the charities of the District and in the District, a well-known and highly-respected citizen of this city for the amelioration of the condition of the more helpless classes, I found the last thirty years at least. I refer to Maj. Thomas P. Morgan. He a legislative precedent, and the amendment was drawn chiefly in imi­ wrote me this note: tation of an act of the District Legislature to establish an industrial MY DEAR SENATOR: I am glad to know that you favor the movement in be­ home for women and children, passed on the 26th of June, 1873. That half of the unfortunate and are giving your assistance to obtain the proper legis­ lation to accomplish the great end. I am and always have been an earnest ad­ .act created an establishment called the Industrial HomeforWomenand vocate of the proposed establishment of the House of the Good Shepherd. If I Children, described its purposes, and the third purpose stated was in can give you or the committee any information touching this important matter .these words: I would be pleased so to do. . A reform school for girls and womeri, where. any in\)orrigible, corrupt girl or I could confirm this with other letters of a similar tenor. Bnt of this woman of known evil repute and lifE1, who, after the opening of the industrial my home, refuses to avail herself of the opportunity for reformation, and refuses I am satisfied, and this it is that has enlisted -yoice in behalf of the ~mployment, and is found soliciting vice upon the street or elsewhere or volun- amendment. 1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. 1607

I for one am only too grareful when I can discover intelligent, active, with. This, sir, is the reason that I oppose the amendment, and if it organized benevolence performing those duties toward the unfortunare be put upon the bill I can not conscientiously vote for the bill as it classes of society to which I and every other man in this Chamber feel would stand if amended. The bill in terms is a bill to prevent the ab­ that we owe a debt of duty. Public spirit so far as I have been able duction of children. That was the object of the commitree, that was to observe, disinreresred effort to serve the public without pecuniary the object of the gentlemen who framed the bill, it was the object of the reward and simply for the sake ofperforming a dutyofhumanity that judge of the police court who conferred with us about it; and I take it rests upon each of us which oughtto rest upon all of us and yet which that when we have reached that point we can not go any further, we is so seldom atrended to by any, is rare. I mean to say that whenever can not say that we will arrest these people and imprison them without I find upright, inrelligent persons devoting themselves and their means trial. That we can not do, but we can use the preventive which this to a public charity I feel my elf personally indebted to them, I think bill offers to the Senate and to the District of Columbia. society as a whole is greatly indebted to them. Here we have two Mr. BAYARD. Mr. President, I merelywish to sa.ythattheamend­ charitable institutions that I propose Congress should now aid, and in ment provides nothing new touching the liberty of any of these un­ what I consider a duty of Congress, organized charities founded upon fortunare people to whom it relates. If the Senator'~ mind is greatly privare means, sustained byprivatemeans, who have neveryetbadfrom wrought up to protect the personal liberty of the unfortunate class men­ Congress a farthing in aid of the meritorious acts to which they have so tioned in the amendment he will find himself fUlly occupied by the zealously devoted themselves. rerms of existing law. The power of arrest of this class of people exists Now, when the opportunity comes under the form of a wise and benefi­ to-day, and this amendment does not enlarge it. • cent police regulation to strengthen the hands of those who are engaged Mr. RIDDLEBERGER. Will the Senator permit me to ask him in well-doing, when it is justified by the legislative precedents which whether this power to arrest subsists anywhere except in the legally I have before me and have read to the Senare, I trust there may be no constituted authorities of the District, and whether this amendment hesitation, considering the condition of this District, considering the does not give that power to anybody and everybody in the District? anomalous form of its government, that it bas no representative in 1\fr. BAYARD. The questionis too large to be answered whether it either branch of Congress, that the people have no powers of local self­ exists anywhere. I say it exists in this District under the authority government, that they can not tax themselves and they can not refuse of acts of Congress. I have them before me, and have read them, show­ to pay the tax that others and strangers lay upon them, the duty upon ing a discretion far grearer in the court than any proposed by my amend­ Congress is more manifest. I think there have been few propositions ment. The Senator misapprehends the scope of this amendment. appealing to just discretion and benevolence regulated by law than the Mr. RIDDLEBERGER. Permit me to ask the Senator further proposition which I have had the honor to make to the Senare and which whether the act of Congress allowed arrest in a house and whether it I hope will receive their approval. goes to the exrent of allowing any citizen of the District of Columbia The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The question is on agreeing to the to make that arrest; and is not that the scope of the amendment? amendment of the Senator from Delaware, on which the yeas and nays Mr. BAYARD. No; thescopeoftheamendmentwill be foundsim­ have been ordered. ply to allow the usual mode of arrest and committal by the magistrare, Mr. SHERMAN. I should like to have it read. instead of sending one of this unfortunare class to jail, sending her The PRESIDENT pro temp6re. The amendment will be read. where contamination will be stamped upon her, to commit her to a The CHIEF CLERK. It is proposed to add to the bill: gentler, less degrading, and more merciful custody, where her morals That whenever any female vagrant or incorrigible corrupt girl or woman of and well-being will be prorected in a way that no jail can provide for. known evil repute and life is foundsolicitingviceupon the streets or elsewhere, That is as I understand the only effect of the amendment. or residing in a house of ill-fame, she may be sent under arrest either to the Home of the Good Shepherd, or to the Home of the Association for Works of Mercy, Mr. BUTLER. The house to which they a~e to be sent is not a and required to labor at some suitable employment, and receive instruction penal institution. and practical training; and the sum of $10,000, or so much thereof as may be Mr. BAYARD. Not at aJl. Itisnotapenal institution. They are necessary, be, and the same is hereby, appropriated out of any money in the Treasury not otherwise appropriated, to pay for the support of such class of fe­ not sent there for punishment. They are sent there for safety and pro­ males in the said institutions, one-half of said sum being applicable to each of tection. Privare benevolence bas provided Magdalen asylums for those the said institutions. . who have fallen; and this is a proposition simply to stretch out a Mr. RIDDLEBERGER. I suppose we are all in accord with the Sena­ friendly hand and to prevent their falling, the ounce of prevention that tor from Delaware in the accomplishment of the object of his amend­ is worth ten thousand pounds of cure. This is not punishment; it is ment, but I undertake to say that if that amendment is ingra:fted upon protection. It is not the deprivation of liberty beyond that which the this bill no Senator who reflects upon it can vote for the bill. It vir­ lawto-dayibelieveineverywell-regulatedcommunitypermits. When tually destroys the bill, and I put my objection upon high constitu­ these people are found in the condition described by the amendment, tional ground. The Senator from Delaware, if he is within the Con­ Any female vagrant or incorrigible corrupt girl or woman of known evil re­ stitution, by this amendment will a2complish much more than the cor­ pute and life is found soliciting vice upon the streets or elsewhere- rection of some of the evils that prevail in the District of Columbia. Certainly she is a subject for legal arrest then and for that cause­ If you can without warrant and without process arrest one citizen, man or woman, of the District of Columbia and confine him or her in any or residing in a. house ofill-fa.me. place, call it what you please, a prison or a place of charity, and there Then comes the provision of the amendment that she may be sent compel him or her to labor, as the amendment provides, without trial where? To prison? To the association of people more vicious than by jury, then I say you can go into Salt Lake City, make the United herself? Not at all. This does not provide for that. She is not to be States Army a police organization, and arrest every polygamist there sent to jail; she is not to be shut in a cell; she is to be placed in the and confine him without trial, and you can break up polygamy by this merciful custody of. these charitable institutions where she shall be same process. ' prorecred and receive food, clothing, shelrer, and instruction in the arts Sir, we have to consider these matters from a higher point of view of practical industries suitable to her sex, taught to be a good laundry­ than I have heard the Senator this morning advance. We have no more woman, taught to be a good seamstress, fitting her for honest and gain­ right to invade a house in the District of Columbia and take out people ful occupation in life, so that when she goes forth, and--at an1time can and confine them in a prison and subject them to labor-for such are go that she is fit to go, not to resume the evil practice and danger from the words of the amendment, save only that for ''prison'' here is sub­ which she once had been rescued, that she shall be enabled to go forth stituted a charitable institution-than we have to go out into the States without shame to add to the respectability of society and not to its of this Union and take people and confine them without triaJ. danger and degradation. If there is any privilege guaranreedin this countrythatishigberthan It is a mistake to suppose that there is a curtailment of liberty under another, it is first that no person shall be arresred without due process this proposed amendment. Every curtailment of the liberty of this of law, and second that every one arrested shall have the right to bail, class exists to-day under the laws of the DistTict. It is simply a ques­ and certainly shall not be put on trial without indictment or informa­ tion as to whether the persons in such danger or so offending shall be tion, and certainly sh~ll not be confined in a prison-house of any sort committed to the charge of these benevolent institutions, or whether I care not what the name of it may be, without a trial by a jury of~ they shall be sent to the prisons of the District where all the dangers pe.ers. The amendment goes beyond all that, and asks every Senator from which they were sought to be rescued are inrensi:fied and where on this floor to vore that for some peculiar immoral practice which ob­ the criminality from which this amendment is inrended to rescue them tains here, as it obtains everywhere, this fundamental principle of the will become a. fixed fact. Constitution than which there isnothing higher and which I regard as Mr. President, I apprehend that my regard for personal liberty is as · the foundation upon which the whole superstructure of our institutions great as that of any man. I have never willingly or inrentionallyvio­ is built shall be violated. lared the principles upon which laws must rest for their justification in I can indorse all the object, all the purpose of this amendment; but restraint of human action; but there is a discretionary police control I care not what the offense may be, I care not who may commit the of­ essential for the arrestation of crime ~efore its commitment, applied to fense, I will always hold that there shall first be process for arrest, next certain unprotected classe..q, and in regard to which every magistrarefit there shall be indictment. on information, and next there shall be all for his place must be invested with a certain discretion. I could state 'the incidents ot trial, the right to bail, to a speedy, a public, and not illustrations of this as given to me· by worthy police officers of this city. an inquisitorial trial, and that finally there shall always be the pre­ They become aware that some child of tender years has been brought sumption of innocence, and there shall be no conviction except by a to this city, has fallen into evil associatio~ away from her home, from jury, and no imprisonment until all these forms have been gone through all the prorecting influences of kindred and affection, and that she has

• 1608 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. MARCH 5,

been inveigled into the ery jaws of death. What can he do? Must trict and for other purposes had a well-defined and ascertained object. he wait until her ruin is complete, or may he not take that homeless, It was intended to prevent on the part of unnatural parents and cruel he1pless young creature and commit her, not to a jail or place of degra­ guardians theill-treatmentofinfants, to prevent their being abandoneil, dation but commit her to the friendly, the womanly, the protecting hands neglected, mistreated, employed in wicked occupations, or permitted and sheltering arms that these two charitable institutions hold out in · to inhabit houses of ill-fame, and providing that in such cases these such a case? One of the two the Senate will decide upon, the commit­ little unfortunate waifs should be taken care of and that tho e who per­ ment to the jail under the laws as they now stand or the commitment mitted them thus to be mistreated should be punished by penalties to the protection of one of these two benevolent associations. I prefer provided by law. I sympathize fully with the objects that the Senator the latter, and I hope the Senate will. from Delaware has in view, and I shall not permit him to exceed me in Mr. RIDDLEBERGER. The Senator will permit me to ask him admiration for the self-denying efforts ofthe noblemenandwomen who whether the bill does not provide for all he is discussing except­ have devoted their means and their time in this District, 'vithout other Ur. BAYARD. It does not, because these two institutions I have compensation than that which comes from the consciousness of well-do­ named are the only two that provide for the ki'nd of oversight and ed­ ing, to the amelioration of the inevitable evils that always attend hu­ ucation of which these poor creatures so especially stand in need. man society and that have been particularly apparent in this District. Mr. RIDDLEBERGER. They are the only two that ask pay for it, He states that his amendment is intended to care for that class which the only two that ask any appropriation. We have been able to :find needs the tender hand of charity rather than the severe arm of the law. some other places to put them just as convenient and just as well cal­ It seems to me, Mr. President, that the Senator from Delaware can culated to accomplish the great object in view without the appropria­ hardly have studied t he language of his amendment. Ifthe first four 'tion of 10,000. lines of this amendment do not describe hardened and abandoned crimi­ Mr. B.A. YARD. Mr. President, much more than $10,000 have been nals, I think that the dictionary would be searched in va,in for epithets: · paid by private hands in these institutions. To-day I am not prepared That whenever any female vagrant or incorrigible corrupt girl or woman of to state how many cases, but enough to make Congress see the earnest known evil repute and life is found soliciting vice upon the street or elsewhere, and excellent and the valuable work that has been done without the or residing in a house of ill-fame, she may be sent under arrest to either the aid of a stiver from Congress; and nbw the question is, is the amount Home of the Good Shepherd, or to the Home of the Association for Works of unreasonable or is the object unworthy? I do not think the Senate will Mercy. vote either to be the case. Mr. President, language would be scrutinized in vain for words that Mr. GARLAND. Mr. President, I wish to offer an amendment to the would more definitely describe the outcast, the hardened, abandoned, amendment of the Senator \from Delaware. In line 4, after the words and reckless charaeters that infest our streets and that constitute one '' may be,'' I move to insert: of the most dangerous classes of modern society; and yet the Senator Arrested under a warrant duly issued from the policecourtofthe District of says that the intention is, by his amendment, to deal gently with the Columbia, and upon conviction thereof by such court shall be sent. erring, to uphold and sustain those who are in danger of falling, and to Striking out the words "under arrest." place under them the sustaining hand of mercy in order that they may Yesterday, when I suggested that this bill had better go over, it struck be reformed without being subjected to the dangers of continued evil 1 me, on heal"ing the amendment of the Senator from Delaware read, that life. · there were two things to be considered. The first was that the amend­ The amendment, even as modified by the Senator from Arkansas, is ment enlarged the scope ofthe bill considernbly, and the second, that the entirely inconsistent with the purpo es of the bill reported by the com­ amendment itself should be more fully considered than the five-minute mittee. It has no connection with the subject-matter of it. It deals limit of debate would allow the Senate to devote to it. If the Senator with a different question and with a different class of criminals, and I from Delaware will examine the original bill he will see that provision submit that it opens the door to one or two very dangerous propositions. is made for different classes, for arrest on warrant and for confinement In the first place, as has been significantly pointed out by the ena­ after conviction by a court. His amendment, however, omits that, and tor from Arkansas and the Senator from Virginia, it is unquestionably permits a party, as he uses the language himself, to be arrested, and one of the most absolutely indefensible invasions of personal rights that that necessarily carries with it the deprivation of liberty of the party. could possibly be put in language. Without previous information, with­ It is not worth while to say for how longitshall be done, orwhetherit out any of the preliminary steps required by law, without requiring .-;hall ·be done with a rough hand or with a soft hand; still the liberty of arrest by any officer of the law, absolutely without definition of au­ the party is interfered with bytheverytermsoftheamendment, "shall thority, it authorizes, if I can read the language of the amendment cor­ be arrested.'' rectly, any person to invade any house that may be alleged to be of evil While it is true that sending a person to these beneficent institutions repute and seize upon any female person that may be a resident thereot~ might not be termed a punishment, yet it comes in the way of a con­ and without trial and without conviction send her to one or the other demnation of the conduct of the party. It may be true that one of of these two houses of refuge for an indefinite period of time It is an these homes to which she is to be sent is better than other places; it incarceration. It says these persons shall be required to labor at some might be a better place than the Senate; it might be a better place to suitable employment and receive practical :i.ru;truction and training; and be in than the House of Representatives; but I expect none of us would when that incarceration is to end, or when the objects of the law are like to be taken up and sent there even for a supposed crime that we to be held to have been accomplished, is left entirely, so far as I am able might have committed. This is based upon theideaofsnpposed crimes, to perceive, to the discretion of the trustees or governing agents of these to be judged by whom? By a set of police officers, not j ndicial in their two institutions. character; but when they imagine that a person is in a house guilty of Mr. President, that is going too far. No one has a stronger desire ill-conduct or upon the streets guilty of it, all they have to do is to than I have to uphold and sustain all great reformatory measures. The simply seize her and carry her off to this home of correction or what­ object of these statutes is the reformation of the oft'ender and the pro­ ever it may be called. That is not '' due process of law'' as we under­ tection of society. God alone has to do with punishment. .A.nd how stand it in this country. .A.ll the States have laws of vagrancy; but no the Senator from Delaware can justify upon either of these great objects one can be committed without a conviction according to due process of of remedial and reformatory statutes the course that he proposes I am law. N~one can be condemned for vagrancy or any of the crimes or not able to understand. supposed crimes mentioned here in any of the States without a trial Again, Mr. President, this is an unsavory subject to· deal with. It as we understand it at common law and a conviction had upon it. is not a delicate matter to discuss. It deals with matters that are not Now, the evils are great; there is no mistake about that; and! sym­ fragrnnt and that are not agreeable to contemp1ate. But it appears to. pathize entirely with the Senator from Delaware, as the Senator from me, speaking plainly upon this subject, that the result of this amend­ Virginia said he did, but we must pause a moment and not vest these ment would be to turn overall thatimmoralclass to which theamend­ police officers, however good they maybe, with this great power on mere ment refers, all the harlots and prostitutes of this District, absolutely suspicion to seize a woman or girl and send her without trial or with­ without limitation, to the care of these two institutions at the expense out a bearing even to elysium or to any place better than this home if one of the Government of the United States. That is a pretty large con­ could be imagined better. It will not do. It is contrary to the entire tract. It is a matter that I presume the Senator from Delaware would theory, to the entire system of our government. When women are not think it within the purview of appropriate legislation to endeavor seized and sent to an institution in this way without trial, the brand is to accomplish ; and yet the terms of his amendment are so broad, the upon them; you do not avoid the stamp that the Senator from Dela­ language is so sweeping, that there is no escaping from this conclusion~ ware would seem to intimate you avoid under t~ process of sentencing There is no woman who comes in this category, no woman who has led to a pla-ce of that character. Under this law any policeman, through an evil life, who is corrupt, incorrigible, of evil repute, who solicits.· caprice, through prejudice, throughmalice, orthroughhatred, can strike vice upon the street or resides in houses of ill-fame, whether they be­ down the :finest girl in the District. It will not do. I think the Sena­ ten or whether they be a thousand, that may not be immediately taken tor from Delaware has put in his proposition rather prematurely. If into custody and turned over to the governing agencies of these two­ the law as it now stands is as he reads and interprets it-I have not institutions and supported and ma.intained for an indefinite period ex examined it-it should be repealed at once. I think with the amend­ time at the expense of the United States Government. ment I have suggested all the good is aecomplished that can be reached Mr. President, that certainly is a dangerous principle to recognize. in this matter and under doe forms and ceremonies of law. I believe with the Senator from Delaware in the reformation of offenders, Mr. INGALLS. Mr. President, the bill reported by the Committee that those who are in danger of falling should be protected, that those· on the District of Columbia for the protection of children in the Dis- who are exposed tQ temptation should be fortified, and that every pos.--

• Jt.884. OON.GRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. 1609

sible bulwark and barrier and rampart should be built up not only to remedy is immediate, and the punishment would follow. But you · protect society from theSe evils but to reform the offenders; and that must deal with faets pra.cticaUy-- we attempt to do in the bill which the committee have reported. This The PRESIDING OFFICER (Mr. HARRIS in the chair). The Chair juvenile class, these young girls, children, who are wandering abroad must call the attention of the Senator from pelaware to the fact that upon the streets without shelter and without meansofsupport, who are his :five minutes have expired. liable to become inmates of houses of ill-repute, society takes hold of Mr. BAYARD. I understood, if the Chair pleases, that we were not with gentle hand, and they are to be turned over to these various in­ proceeding in this case under the :five-minute rule. I was so assured stitutions of charity for reformation and for care. But that in a bill by the Senator who preceded the honorable Senator in the occupancy of this kind, without due process of law, in violation of every one of of the chair. _ the safeguards that surround personal liberty, we should be called upon The PRESIDING OFFICER. This bill has not been relieved from in this summary manner to take charge of this dangerous class of our the operation of Rule VIII; and under Rule VIII no Senator can ex­ population is something that I believe on reflection the Senator from ceed :five minutes, nor can any Senator speak upon the same question Delaware will admit ought not to be done. The subject should be oftener than once. dealt with in some other bill. I hope that he will see his way clearto Mr. BAYARD. May I inquire whether there was not permission enable us, without embaiiT3SSmentand without the difficulties that will asked and given by unanimous consent that I should exceed the time? arise in the minds of some who desire to support this bill, to adopt this The PRESIDING OFFICER. Upon another occasion the Senator's measure, which I am sure will commend itselfto his own judgment, to time was extended by unanimous consent to any extent the Senator his own sense of right, and to his own desire to protect society against chose to proceed, but that unanimous consent can not be considered to those evils which his amendment deals with. That amendment exposes apply to a second, or a third, or a :fifth speech. us to dangers and difficulties of such a nature that to my judgment the 1tfr. BAY.A.RD. This is, I believe, the second, and not the third or proposition ought not to be appended to this measure. fifth; but I bow to the construction of the Chair. Mr. BAYARD. Mr. President, when this subject was brought to my The PRESIDING OFFICER. The question is on the amendment attention by residents of the Districb entirely entitled to my respect, I proposed by the Senator from .Arkansas to the amendment of the Sena­ approved warmly of the idea of committing this unfortunate class of tor from Delaware. people, not to prison, not to a penal institution, but to a wise practical Mr. INGALLS. In order to obtain the sense of the Senate on this charity, and for that purpose that the Government should lend a portion proposition without requiring two votes, I move to lay the amendments of the public money to eke out private expenditures. It was difficult on the table. to find the precise nomenclature for this class of people, difficult to de­ The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Senator from Kansas moves to fine the class whom it was intended to include, and I turned to the prece­ lay the amendments on the table. dents of the legislation of this District, and I found in 1873 on the 26th of Mr. B.A. YARD. On that I ask for the yeas and nays. June, the Legislative .Assembly of the District had provided for the care The yeas and nays were ordered; and the Secretary proceeded to call and for the compulsory restraint of a large class of girls and women who the roll. were to be committed to the Reform. School. The language there used Mr. HOAR (when his name was called). I am paired with the Sena­ was: tor from Delaware [Mr. SAULSBURY]. I do not know how he would .A reform school for girls and women, where any incorrigible, corrupt girl or vote. Of course there is no politics in this question, but I will abstain woman of known evil repute, &c.- from voting, as this is an amendment of his colleague's. Shall be committed. So in order to include another class not so vicious Mr. S.A WYER (when his name was called). I am paired with the I interpolated the word ''vagrant,'' and I believed then, and with due Senator from West Virginia [Mr. CAMDEN]. Ifhewerehere, I should submission to my friend from Kansas I believe now, that the term '' va­ vote ''yea.'' grancy '' does not necessarily impute vice. I find in a leXicographer of The roll-call having been concluded, the result was announced-yeas authority that a vagrant is ''a wandering, idle person, one who lives 36, nays 18 i as follows: idly; no settled home; a strolling beggar." Now I apprehend that all YEAS-36. .Aldrich, Garland, L<>gan, Pike, of these descriptions may apply to a young girl or woman who is not Blair, Groome, Jt1cMillan, Pla.U, vicious but who, as we all see from these descriptions, is very apt to be­ Brown, Harris, Mahone, Riddleberger, come so. Cockrell, Harrison, Manderson, Sherman, Coke, Hawley, Maxey, Slat-er, The effect of the amendment of the Senator from .Arkansas, to a great Conger, Inga.lls, Miller of Cal., Vance, part of which I take no exception but to a part of which I do take ex­ Cullom, .Jonas, Miller ofN. Y., VanWyck, ception, is that he would require conviction to precede the relief which Dawes, .Jones of Nevada., Mitchell, Vest, I design to procure. With due respect to him, that would defeat the Frye, Lapham, Morrill, Walker. very object I have in view. It is not where the sin has been com­ NAY8-18. Bayard. Colquitt, Hampton, Pendleton, mitted, it is not where the vice has been irreclaimably established, it Beck, Dolph, .Ja-ckson, Pugh, is for those who are about to be and in the very nature of things will Butler, Fair, Kenna, Williams. become vicious that this relief is sought to be extended. If it be thought Call, Farley, Lamar, proper that warrant in"due form should issue upon the statement of a Cameron of Wis., George, McPherson. police officer or any citizen who knows the fact, I have no objection; and ABSENT-22. .Allison, Gibson, Morgan, Sawyer, in truth, considering that this would run in with the rest of the bill .Anthony, Gorman, Palmer, Sewell, and be subject to the constTuction of the former sections, I took it for Bowen, Hale, Plumb, Voorhees, granted that this would not be a mere summary verbal execution of the Camden, Hill Ransom, Wilson. Cameron ofPa., Ho~. Sabin, power without limit; I took it for granted that the issue of process in Edmunds, .Jones of Florida, Saulsbury, due form was implied in this additional section of the law which I pro­ pose. The PRESIDING OFFICER. The motion of the Senator from Kan­ While I will not say that reflection might not provide a definition sas to lay the amendment on the table is carried. The bill is still in more accurately suited to the class contemplated for relief, yet I do be­ Committee of the Whole and open to amendment. lieve that the word there used, ''vagrant,'' will include a class not yet Mr. INGALLS. I think there are some amendments reported by irredeemably vicious. If that be so, the fa-ct that it will also include the committee. The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Chair is informed by the Secre­ tho~ who are vicious and whose reformation we also seek, does not weaken the force or the valueoftheamendment that I have proposed. tary that the bill has been reported to the Senate and the amendments I take it the whole force and meaning, certainly the objP.ct I had in made as in Committee of the.Whole have been concurred in. view, was that there should not be a commitment to the common jail, The bill was ordered to be engrossed for a third reading, read the which ought only to occur after conviction, but that there might be the third time, and passed. commitment upon due examination of the case, as h~ been provided MESSAGE FROM: TH.E HOUSE. by the act which I have read in relation to the youth of the other sex. A message from the House of Representatives, by Mr. CLARK, ita The law of 1870, approved by the President, and passed of course by Clerk announced that the House had passed the joint resolution (S. Congress, provides: R. 64) providing for the addition of $1(),000 to the contingent fund of .And in all cases where a boy, under t.he age of sixteen years, shall be brought the Senate, with an amendment, in which it requested the concurrence before any such court or judge upon the charge of crime or misdemeanor, when of the Senate. the accusation against him is deemed supported by evidence sufficient to put The message also announced that the iiouse had passed a bill (H. him on trial, such court or jud~e shall have full power to stay all proceedings in the case, and to commit him, In like manner, for such period as such court or R. 5462) making appropriation to supply deficiency in amount required judge may determine, but not less than six moJ?.ths. · for expenditure toJune 30, 1884, for examination and surveys required by acts of March 3, 1875, and June 19, 1878, to ascertain depth of water That a commitment to a penal institution. I propose nothing of is and width of channel of South Pass of Mississippi River, also for gaug­ the kind. If it should turn out that there has been misapprehension, if the extravagant illustration which has been nsed of the entry into ing the waters of the Mississippi River and ita tributaries; in which it respectable houses in this city should prove true, if the liberty of worthy requested the concurrence of the Senate. and refined and excellent people should be sought to be imperiled by THE YELLOWSTONE PARK. the outrage, for such it would be, of a false charge of this nature, the The Senate, as in Committee of the Whole, resumed the considerntion 1610 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. MARcH 5,

of the bill (S. 221) to amend sections 2474and 2475 of the Revised Stat­ Mr. HARRISON. I do not think that the section as it stands is at utes of the United States, settingapart a certain tract oflandlyingnear all susceptible of the interpretations which the Senator from Minne­ the headwaters of the Yellowstone River as a public park. sota places upon it. The offense prohibited is the killing within the Mr. VEST. For myself I have no doubt of the correctness of the park. Certainly the possession is a possession within the limits where statement I made yesterday, that under that clause of the bill which the killing is prohibited, even as the section reads. The Senator as a extends the laws of Montana over the park for the protection of life and judge-and if his ambition runs that way I hope he may be-l ..think property neither the county nor the Territorial authorities of Montana would hardly decide that under this section the possession of a part of would have a right to establish a license for gambling or for a dram­ a buffalo or deer here in the District of Columbia was intended to be shop within the limits of the park; but in order to put that question made prima facie eVidence of a violation of the law against killing a beyond a doubt I have drawn an amendment which I will now offer to buffalo or a deer in the National Park. Still, if his amendment only the sixth section of the bill. I have been informed by the Delegate makes it clearer and he desires it, I have no objection. from Montana that it is contemplated at the next session of the Terri­ 11Ir. McMILLAN. I think it had better be inserted as a construc­ torial Legislature to create anewcountyoutofthat portion of the county tion of the act. I think there would be a very great difference of opin­ of Gallatin which lies immediately north of the National Park and ad­ ion on the position taken by the Senator from Indiana upon the language joining it, and in order that this jurisdiction may be vested in that new as it stands. county adjacent to the park the amendment deals with that subject also. The PRESIDING OFFICER. The question is on the amendment The amendment is, after the word ''provide,'' in the seventh line of the proposed by the Senator fro!u Minnesota [Mr. McMILLAN] to the amend­ sixth section-- · ment made as in Committee of the Whole. The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Chair will state to the Senator The amendment to the amendment was agreed to. from Missouri that an amendment in the nature of a substitute having Mr. INGALLS. I move to strikeout section 3 beginning at the words been already agreed to in Committee of the Whole, no change in that "and the Secretary of War," in line 11 inclusive, to the close of the amendment can be made while the bill remains in committee. Amend­ section. Let the Secretary report the part to be stricken out. ments by way of additional sections would be in order, but no change The SEORETARY. In section 3, after the word "act, " in line 11, it or modification of the former amendment. When the bill is in the Sen­ is proposed to strike out the words: ate, then it will be open to amendment in every, respect. And the Secretary of War is hereby directed to make such details of troops as Mr. VEST. I was not aware of the fact that the amendment reported the Secretary of the Interior, with the approval of the President, may require had been adopted. for the purpose of preventing trespassers or intruders from entering the par-k with the object of destroying the game therein or other illegal purposes, and The bill was reported to the Senate as amended. for removing such persons from the park. The PRESIDING OFFICER. The question is on concurring in the amendment made as in Committee of the Whole. Now the amendment Mr. INGALLS. Mr. President, the amendment of the committee proposed by the Senator from Missouri will be in order. places this territory, as I understand, under the jurisdiction of Montana Mr. VEST. I move, then, to amend the amendment by inserting in or Wyoming-- section 6, line 7, after the word "provide:" Mr. VEST. Montana. Or of such county as may be hereafter created out of that part of Gallatin Mr. INGALLS. Montana. In addition to that it is placed. under County immediately north of the pa.rk and adjoining thereto; and it is hereby ex­ the control of the Secretary of the Interior; and as if that were not pre sly provided that nothing herein contained shall empower the county or Territorial authorities of 1\Ionta.na to license gambling or dra.m-shopl!l within the sufficient, the Secretary of the Interior is directed to call on the Secre­ limits of the park or in any manner to interfere with the control of the Secre­ tary of War to use the Army for still further protection of this region. tary of the Interior over the same. 'While I doubt the propriety of the Government going into the show The PRESIDING OFFICER. The question is on the amendment business, or engaging in the protection and exhibition of geysers, still proposed by the Senator from Missouri to the amendment. as it appears to meet the approbation of the committee that this shall The amendment to the amendment was agreed to. be done, I suppose nothing further can be said except to suggest that Mr. McMILLAN. In line 17 of section 4, after the word" posses­ the provisions for the regulation of this territory are anomalous. If sion,'' I move to insert ''within the said park.'' offenders against the laws of the United States are to be punished, it Mr. VEST. I hope that amendment will not be adopted, because would seem that there should be some reason more than has been given e if adopted it would nullify the object of the section entirely. Dead why in addition to being subjected to the penal statutes of Montana bodies of the game killed in violation of this law would be taken out­ they should also be subjected to the arbitrary directions of the Secre­ side of the limits of the park, and the parties having possession of them tary of the Interior, and still further than that, put under martial re­ would not be amenable to any punishment. There is another portion straint and expelled by the Army of the United States. I can not un­ of the bill which prohibits railroad companies and express companies derstand why this extraordinary..aggregation of power should be created fru1p carrying these· bodies within the park. It simply amounts to with regard to this particular portion of the territory of the United nothing, I will say to the Senator from Minnesota, to say that ·these States. Practically it places it under martial law. I can not conceive persons shall be punished if the bodies are found in the park, because that there is any such great danger of invasion, or insurrection, or viola­ as soon as they kill the game and load their wagons they would imme­ tion of the primal rights of man, that the ordinary tribunals of the land diately hurry to the limits of the park, and when they were over in the will not be sufficient to punish those who may offend against the pro­ adjacent territory there would bean end of it; they could laugh at the visions of this proposed act. law, take their game to market, and freely commit the very offense we Mr. VEST. As to the propriety of Congress having passed the act propose to prevent. setting apart the National Park originally I have very little to say. Mr. McMILLAN. I think the Senator from Missouri does not appre­ The park was created by Congress before I was a member of this body, hend the effect of this amendment. The portion of the section to which and the act was passed, I believe, with great unanimity. The ques­ my amendment applies affects the question of evidence merely, and not tion presented now to the Congress ofthe United States is whether the of the commission of the offense. The bill, as it is reported by the com­ park shall be abandoned and left without law, without control, and mittee, provides that: given up to the vandals who go in for the purpose of destroying the game and the objects of curiosity and wonder in the park. Possession of the dead bodies, or any part thereof, of any of the animals or birds hereinbefore mentioned shall be prima facie evidence that the person or As long as it is a park and as long as the statute remains unrepealed persons having the same are guilty of violating this act. which created it it ought to be protected, and it ought to be made This is only a question 9f evidence, and as the bill now stands any what the act M,ys it should be, a place of recreation and resort for the person found in possession of the dead bodies, or any part thereof, of Amerjcan people. If it is proposed to turn it back into the public any of the animals or birds killed in any place, would be presumptively domain, then the act should be repealed and the geysers and all the guilty of having committed the offense within the park. Persons in other objects of wonder and curiosity in the park should be put up to possession of these dead bodies of birds or animals at any place in the be grabbed by the first p..'trty who can enter them at the General Land vicinity would be presumed to have killed them in the park. The bill Office of the Government. I take it for granted, as the act is unre­ presumes guilt outside of the limits of the park. This is certainly a pealed, that Congress proposes to protect the park. burden which should not be thrown on any citizen. It is a violation Heretofore there has been no legal jurisdiction over the park. There of the presumption of innocence where a person is charged with a crime, have been three murders committed there within the last eighteen and the amendment only qualifies the provision with respect to the months, and the offenders. have gone unwhipped of justice. Wyoming effect of the possession as evidence. Of course the fact of guilt may be has no jurisdiction over it, because the terms of the original act set it proved by any other evidence. apart as a national park and takeitoutofthepublicdomain. If there Mr. HARRISON. May I ask to have the amendment reported for is any analogy to this statute upon the statute-book of the United States information? it is the act creating the District of Columbia. The courts of Wyoming The PRESIDING OFFICER. The amendment will be read. have no jurisdiction, the courts of Montana have no jurisdiction, the The CHIEF CLERK. On page 9, section 4, line 17, after the word Federal courts have no jurisdiction over this territory; and the resu]t "possession," it is moved to insert "within the said park;" so that has been that no punishment can be inflicted for any crime known to the clause will read: the criminal law. This state of things of course can not continue. Re­ Possession within the sai(l pa.rk of the dead bodies, or any part thereof, of any cently the park has been largely visited. Hotels have been constructed of the animals or birds hereinbefore mentioned shall be prima facie evidence there, against my judgment, but they have been constructed, and a pop­ that th~ person or persons having the same are guilty of violating this act. ulation has gone there, temporary in-its nature it is true, but a popula- 1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. 1611

tion among which crime cari be and is committed, and there must be required to detail an officer from "the Corps of Engineers, whose duty it some punishment provided for U. shall be to survey and lay out suitable roads in the park, to select the While the bill which the Committee on Territories reports puts the proper location for bridges, and his estimates as to the cost of all these park under the jurisdiction of the laws of Montana, the park itself is improvements are to be submitted to Congress through the Secretary . so far removed almost from civilization that parties of men have gone of War, with other recommendations in regard to improvements that in there continually and are in the habit of going in there in numbers are to be made. <>f five and ten and even twenty, armed to the teeth, for the purpose Mr. President, we are on the threshold of a very large and constantly <>f destroying the game in order to ship it to market. Two thousand increasing annual expenditure for the improvement of this property. .elk were killed there in one season. There has been no authority there I have not been able to compute yet the amount that will be necessarily to resist these men. The Superintendent of the park, with ten assist­ expended under the terms of this bill, but it will be many thousand ants, men unused-- dollars, in addition to the indefinite amount that is to be appropriated The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Chair will state to the Senator on the suggestion of the Engineer Department with regard to permanent from Missouri that, the hour of 2 o'clock having arrived, it is the duty improvements which are to be made there for the purposes of pleasure <>f the Chair to lay before the Senate the unfinished business of yester- and recreation hereafter. I should be glad, as I said before, if this whole project would be aban­ daifr. VEST. I move that the consideration ~f this bill be continued. doned. There are other great natural objects of interest in this conn­ Mr. PENDLETON. I should like to ask the Senator from Missouri try, the caiions of the Colorado, and inaccessible mountain summits, how long the consideration of the bill will take. and cataracts, and caverns in the earth, and other objects and places Mr. VEST._ It will take only a very short time. that it would be agreeable to visit and that it would be acceptable to l\fr. PENDLETON. I have no objection to giving unanimous con­ the people in the neighborhood to have protected and cared for and sent for the consideration of the bill for a few minutes, iftha.twill an- decerated and ornamented at the expense of the Government of the -swer the purpose of the Senator. • United States. I think the original segregation of this territory from The PRESIDING OFFICER. Is there objection to continuing the the public domain was a mistake, a mistake that is becoming more ap­ .consideration of the bill by unanimous consent, for what length of time? parent as time goes on and as we see the great expense which is ulti­ Mr. PENDLETON. Subject to the call that I shall make if it is not mately to be involved; but in any event I should hope that until there .soon disposed of. is greater evidence of necessity for departure from the ordinary consti­ The PRESIDING OFFICER. Subject to the call of the Senator from tutional protections which sniround the citizen that portion of the -()hio. The Chair hears no objection. The Senator from Missouri will hill which authorizes martial law to be declared and the Secretary of proceed. War to order the Army turned in for the purpose of expelling offend­ Mr. VEST. I was about to say that the force at the command of the ers might be omitted from the bill. superintendent of the park under the amendment to the sundry civil Mr. VEST. If the Senator will permit me before he takes his seat, :appropriation act which we passed at the last session, that force consist­ I will say that that can only be done upon the approval of the Presi­ ing often assistants, is utterly inadequate to cope with the hunting par­ dent, who is at the head of the Army, and only in extraordinary cases. ties that go in in sufficient numbers and so armed that they can bid That is the provision of the bill. defiance to the superintendent and to his assistants. Mr. HARRISON. I think the suggestion made by the Senator from The park as organized to-day has within it 3,300 square miles. If Missouri [Mr. VEST] is quite an adequate answer to a good deal that the bill passes 2,000 more square miles will be a-dded to it, and every has been said by the Senator from Kansas [Mr. INGALLS]. The pro­ Senator will recognize at once the propriety of giving to the Secretary of vision of the bill which it is now sought to strike out is not one belong­ the Interior the power to call upon the Secretary of War in addition to ing to the ordinary administration of power. It is an extraordinary the civil authorities for such number of troops as may be necessary to remedy, one that never would be invoked unless a case should arise protect the game in the park and to resist trespassers and marauders such as ha.·~ been suggested. within its limits. It is no extraordinary power, because the National Mr. INGALLS. Such as what? Park is in such a condition that at times nothing but the Army amounts Mr. HARRISON. Such as the Senator from Missouri has suggested. -to anything, and it is absolutely necessary to have such a provision in If an armed body of men, fifteen or twenty men, as he said, armed as ·order to protect it. those men are, and desperate as some of them are, should go in, defying Mr. INGALLS. The bill is -an illustration of the mischiefs that the laws which have been made for the park and should enter upon a .always attend the undertaking by Government of any work which wholesale slaughter of the game there, then under this provision, which .should be left to individual enterprise. In my judgment the best thing could only be put in force by an appeal to the power of the President that could be done with that Territory would be to remand it to public as the head of the Army, those men might be removed from the park. domain, and allow the curiosities that exist there, the game that lives It may be t~t we shall never need to call into exercise the power con­ -there, and the waters that :flow there, to be taken care of as the other ferred in this provision of the bill. Perhaps I should not be going too great objects of interest in this country are, by men who feel a special far if I said probably we never shall; but the time may arrive when it individual interest in them. would be needful, and as it is not likely to result in harm I think it We are entering upon what will eventually be a department of this would be Wise to leave the provision in the bill. Government in the control of the Yellowstone Park. We have already I do not feel disposed, any more than the Senator from Missouri, tA> placed it under the control of the laws of the Territory of Montana and follow the Senator from Kansas in the wider discussion which he sug­ made it an appanage of the county of Gallatin. In addition to that, gests, whether we have not made a mistake in establishing theNational :as I said, the Secretary of the Interior is authorized to make and pub­ Park. It has been done. I believe I would be willing to go further. lish rules and regulations for its government, for the management and Indeed, I did at the last Congress introduce a bill setting apart and

Secretary of the Interior should make, subject to the approval of the As the Senator from Massachusetts [Mr. DAWES] very well said, if President of the United St.'\tes; and if it were necessary in order to_pre­ we ha.ve the park let us treat it as a national -park. If, on the othe-r serve them from trespasses committed by night and by stealth or tres­ hand, we are to adopt the idea advanced by the Senator from Kansas passes committed in defiance of regulations, I would resort under the and throw it open n.s a part of the public domain, then as a matter of • Constitution to such necessary force as is at the command of the Presi­ course not a dollar should be expended upon it for any purpose. For dent of the United States, there being authority somewhere under the myself I .am not afraid to say that every dollar expended on the N &­ Constitution of the United StateS to make all needful rules and regu­ tional Park judiciously will be money well expended. It would be an lations touching the public property and the territory of the United outrage upon the American people, in my judgment, to say that any States. I would consider at the outset whether it were worth while to mai1 should be permitted to go there and put his homestead upon those do anything, and if I thought it worth while to do anything then I geysers, or upon that incomparable scenery of the great Yellowstone would use all the means necessary to carry it out, if you are to have Canon, or upon the Yellowstone Lake. Nowhere else upon this con­ a park, if it be worth while not to turn this all over to anybody, through tinent certainly, and I believe not in the whole world, is such scenery pre-emption laws or homestead laws or tree-culture laws or some other fu be seen. • mysterious laws in reference to the public domain, which I do not un­ I have not yet come to that materialistic state of mind when I think derstand, whereby a man comes up all of a sudden with a thousand that the Natural Bridge in Virginia should be macadamized, that the acres of public domain without having spent a dollar. I do not know great Mammoth Cave of Kentucky should be used as the incipient how it is done; I only know it is done. I only know that we have ter­ point for rui underground railroad, or that the water-power of Niagara ritories of 100,000 or 150,000 square miles to-day every foot of which should be used for a mill. I believe that the people of the United almost is in the possession of somebody under the homestead, pre-emp­ States are entitled, on account of the magnitude and grandeur of their tion, and tree-culture laws, and the whole population amounts to only possessions, to have just such a place as it was intended should be set a few thousand. apart by the original act, and while the act remains upon the statute­ If it is best to turn over this National Park to that sort of adminis­ book there is but one duty for us to ·perform, which is to preserve that tration of the law and let the land be preserved or dealt with, to use the park and to carry out the intent and purpose of the legislation already language of the Senatorfrom Kansas, as would be certainly the cn.se, had. somebody would have a homestead on Old Faithful before night. Then The PRESIDING OFFICER. The question is on agreeing to the I would suggest, as the Senator from Kansas very properly does, to amendment proposed by the Senator from Kansas [Mr. INGALLS] to the take the vitality out of the bill, not permit the protection of the park. amendment made as in Committee of the Whole. I would not go through the vain and emptypretense ofpreservingthis The amendment to the amendment was rejected. grand scenery, the like of which hardly exists in the world; I would The PRESIDING OFFICER. The question is on concurring in the­ not go through with the pretense of it before the world, unless I was amendment made as in Committee of the Whole. prepared to take care of it and preserve it. I would make haste to an­ The amendment was concurred in. nounce to everybody that the first who can light on it shall under some The bill was ordered to be engrossed for a third reading, and was read homestead or pre-emption right appropriate it to himself. the third time. The PRESIDING OFFICER. The question is on the amendment Mr. INGALLS. The Senator from Kentucky [Mr. BECK] asked the proposed by the Senator from ~ansas [Mr. INGALLS] to the amend­ Senator from Missouri yesterday to state this morning why this terri­ ment made as in Committee of the Whole. tory, which is wholly within the area of the Territory of ·wyoming, . The amendment to the amendment was rejected. should be atta-ched to the Territory of :Montana, and he promised t()o M:r. INGALLS. I move to strike out section 8 of the bill. give an answer, but the reply has not yet been made. I should like to­ The PRESIDING OFFICER. The section proposed to be stricken hear that. · out will be read. Mr. VEST. With the greatest pleasure. As the Senator from Ken­ The Secretary read n.s follows: tucky did not repeat the question, I did not, having charge of the bill~ SEC. 8. That the Secretary of War shall detail an officer from the Corps of En­ think it was good parliamentc1.ry practice to intrude the subject; not gineers, whose duty it shall be to survey and lay out suitable roads in said park because I sought to avoid it. and select the proper location for bridges therein; and the Secretary of War All those familiar with the approaches of the National Park know shall, upon the report of said officer, make annual estimates for the cost of such improvements, and communicate the same to Congress, with such other recom­ that the travel to it comes in from th~ north. I have a map, which :f mendations in regard to the park as he may deem proper; and all sums received wish could be seen by each Senator in order that the subject might be by the Secretary of the Interior from rents in the park, or arising from fines or fully understood, which shows that a-ccess from any other adjacent Ter forfeitures for violations of the laws and regulations made for the government of said park and protection of the game and public property therein, shall be ritory except from the north is almost impossible. I use this, of course;. applied to the improvements hereinbefore mentioned; and the officer or officers in the limited sense. collecting said fines and forfeitures shall pay the same to the superintendent of Wyoming, from which this park was taken, has the seat of govern­ the park, to be accounted for by him to the Secretary of the Interior. ment at Cheyenne, on the Union Pacific Railroad. If the park is made The PRESIDING OFFICER. The question is on this amendment for jurisdictional purposes a portion of the Territory of Wyoming, thea proposed by the Senator from Kansas [Mr. INGALLS]. [Having put criminals or persons arrested under the laws of Wyoming would have the question.] The noes appear to have it. to be taken over the mountains, t'he Wind River l\Iountain, the Sho­ Mr. INGALLS. I presume that if the amendment were understood shone, the Teton range, a distance of from one hundred and fifty to one­ it would probably receive assent. I can not suppose that after having hundred and seventy-five miles, on horseback, it being impo ible t~ reserved this property the Senate desires immediately to enter upon a travel there by vehicles, involving a. trip of from three to four weeks, series of improvements without any information or suggestion as to under guard, before they could be lodged in jail or brought before an I what is to be done or the amount of money to be expended. officer; or, if not taken in this manner, they would have to be carried This section provides that the Secretary of War shall at once detail to Cinnabar, which is on the limits of the park; then out to Living­ an officer to survey and lay out suitable roads in the park and select the ston, upon the North Pacific road; then east upon the North Pacific to proper location for bridges, and upon that report being made annual es­ where the Union Pa-cific could be connected with, and then carried down. timates are to be communicated to Congress, with recommendations for the Union Pacific to Cheyenne, a distance of several hundred miles. action, which involves, of course, the expenditure immediately of an A great deal has been said about this portion of the bill. I have bee_n. indefinite sum of money. It appears to me that considering there­ assailed in the newspapers of Cheyenne for attacking the Territorial' mote region and the few that are likely to visit it Congress would hardly sovereignty ofthat people. Itis:tidiculous, Mr. President. I have no­ be ~og at this time to enter upon a system of improvements the personal interest in the matter. I could have no prejudice politicaUy amount of which no one can understand and about which no compu­ or personally against the Territory of Wyoming. All that I sought to­ tation whatever has been made. It would be sufficient, it appears to do was to save expense to the Government and to bring about a speedy me, if for the present this property is protected from "danger by invasion administration of justice. and by the killing of game and by the destruction of the natural ob­ As the matter now stands the Northern Pacific road has constructed jects of interest. a branch from Livingston down to Cinnabar, which is within five or six Ur. VEST. The Senator from Kansas is mistaken. I hold in my miles of the great mammoth Hot Springs hotel. All the crimes will, hand now the printed report of the engineer officer who has been en­ of course, be committed around the geysers and around the hotels. Il gaged in surveying the park and laying out roads and locating bridges, the park is added to :Montana the criminals could be taken to the rail­ and the entire amount, as he specifies, of the improvementa that are to road in less than an hour, carried over to Linngston, the county seat be made, if all of them a,re made, will re.:1.-ch $210,000. of Gallatin County, lodged in jail, and brought to a speedy trial, with­ If there is any portion of the bill reported by the Committee on Ter­ out expense, without delay; but, on the other hand, if attached to ritories which it seems to me should commend itself to the Senate it is Wyoming, you are bound, as I said, to carry them six hundred or more the eighth section. Thousands of persons are visiting the park, and the miles by rail or one hundred and fifty or one hundred and seventy~:five increase will be beyond calculation in the future. There were thou­ miles through the mountains, with all the dangers of escape and all sands there during the last summer, and it is fair to presume that there the extraordinary expense attending such transportation. That is the will be a great many more during the next and at each recurring sea­ whole of it. If any Senator at all familiar with the region will look at. son; and not to improve the roads in the park would be simply to say the map he will appreciate the absolute necessity of giving this juriE­ that persons should not travel in any comfort or with any convenience diction to :Montana instead of Wyoming. within its limits. The bill was passed. 1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD- SENATE. 1613

PRESIDENTIAL APPROVALS. most all these buildings are obtained by the Government at an exceed­ A message .from the President of the United States, by Mr. 0. L. ing low rate, there being a great desire, in view of its effect on the busi­ PRUDEN, one o:f his secretaries, announced that the President had on ness part of a growing town or city where the post-office is situated, to the 3d instant approved and signed the following act and joint resolu- geii the post-office in a particular spot. In a very considerable number tion: . of growing towns and cities where therearen6 United States courts and An act {S. 1490) to complete a statue of the late Rear-Admiral Samuel no Government buildings are built for the purpose, if the lease is only Francis DuPont, United States Navy; and for four years in all cases it would be impossible to get persons to erect Joint resolution (S. R. 58) filling an existing vaeancy in the Board buildings or to lay out very large sums in fitting them up for post-office of Regents of the Smithsonian Institution. purposes on terms which would be advantageous to the Government. It seems to me that the Postmaster-General can be trusted (as it is pre­ POST-oFFICE LEASES. sumed that every officer of the Government bas at heart the interests The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Chair lays before the Senate the of the Government) to have this discretion, and no doubt the Govern­ unfinished business of yesterday, being Senate bill No. 343. ment would be a great loser by limiting the lease to four years. !tfr. SAWYER. I ask unanimous consent to take up the bill (S. Mr. INGALLS. I suggest to the Senator from Wisconsin who intro­ 1508) to authorize the Postmaster-General to lease premises for use of duced the bill that a discretion extending to one hundred years would post-offices of the first, second, and third classes. It is a very short bill, be still more valuable than one extending to ten years. The Postmas­ authorizing the Postmaster-General to rent buildings for the first, sec­ ter-General could undoubtedly get better terms for the Government if ond, and third class post-offices for a term not exceeding ten years. The he were authorized to make a lease for a hundred years. That would difficulty about the matter is that the Court of Claims have decided that be something worth havrng. post-offices can not be rented beyond the lite of the appropriation, be­ Mr. SAWYER. I think that would be too long. yond a year. That embarrasses the Department very much. A little Mr. INGALLS. If that is the object in view, I suggest to the Sena­ over a year ago we passed an act readjusting the salaries of postmasters, tor that if the discretion can be allowed it should be extended so as to and cut down the third class very severely, and it puts them under very give the Government the full benefit of it. great inconvenience. I do not think any man can object to the bill, There is a natural limitation in all these matters, and that is the and I have stated all that is in it. · duration of an administration. If the lease were extended to ten years The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Senator from Wisconsin asks the great inconvenience might often result to a community. The center of unanimous consent of the Senate that the unfinished business be laid business might change. The Postmaster-Gt>neral might accept a loca­ aside, in order that the Senate may consider the bill indicated .by him. tion and make a lease for ten years and the entire current of business Is there objection? might change in th.e town; railroads might be constructed, business Mr. INGALLS. Let it be read for information. might move away mto other localities, and great inconvenience result. The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Secretary will report the bill for It seems to me that the objections are obvious, but of course the information. Senator, having introduced and reported the bill, bas given it due con­ The Chief Clerk read the bill, as follows: sideration, and I therefore make these suggestions for him to reply to, Be it enacted, &c., That the Postmaster-General may lease premises for use of if he thinks best. posf,.Qffices of the first, second, and third classes, at a reasonable annual rental, Mr. SAWYER. We considered this matter in committee very care­ to be paid quarterly; but no lease shall be made for: a term exceeding ten years; fully, and all those questions came up. If we :fix the term of the lease and whenever any building, or part of a building, under lease, becomes unfit for at four years the leases would not all be made at the commencement use as 8. posf,.Qffice, no rent shall be paid until the same shall be put in a satis­ factory condition for occupation as a posf,.Qffice, or the lease may be canceled, at of an administration; they would run over. the option of the Postmaster-General ; and a. lease shall cease and terminate Mr. INGALLS. I did not say the commencement of an administ!'a­ whenever a post-office can be moved into a Government building. tion, but the period of an administration. !tlr. INGALLS. It appears to me that the time named for the lease, Mr. SAWYER. I am very decidedly of the opinion that the bill tc::l years, is unusual. If I remember correctly-·- ought not to be changed, and that ten years is not too long a time. The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Chair will state to the Senator Mr. INGALLS. Would not a hundred be better? from Kansas that the question now is, is there objection to laying the Mr. SAWYER. No, I think not. I believe that ten years is long tmfinished business aside informally to consider the bill? enough, giving the Department a right within ten years to lease the Mr. PENDLETON. I shall make no objection provided it is certain property. I hope there will be no amendment made to the bilL that the bill will not take much time and if I can have the liberty of Mr. MAXEY. The rea on which actuated the committee was our displacing it by calling for the regular order in case it shall do so. desire to secure the best building pra~ticable upon the best terms. The PRESIDING OFFICER. Is there objection t{) the request of the Every one who has had experience in matters of rent knows that we Senator from Wisconsin, subject to the call of the Senator from Ohio can get a better building put up ifthe party who puts up the building in charge of the unfinished business? The Chair hears none. The bill obtains a long lease than if the lease is quite short. In a great many has been read and will be considered as in Committee of the Whole. towns where there are no public buildings it is a matter of importance Mr. INGALLS. I was about to suggest that the timenamedforthe to the community to have the best post-office building that can be pro­ duration of the lease, not exceeding ten years, I think is not consistent cured. We believed that if we should authorize the Postmaster-Gen­ with the e:risting provisions of law with reference to the hiring of build­ eral to lease for a period not exceeding ten years it would secure a better lings for post-offices of a higher class. My recollection is that such leases building and would be better adapted to the convenience of the com­ m-e limited to four years. munity than where the leage should be for one year or at the outside Mr. SAWYER. I will state for the benefit of the Senator from Kan­ four years. Therefore I think the bill is proper and that the limita­ sas that the Department has been in the habit of making leases for ten tion of ten years is not unreasonable. years. I know of a great many leases made for ten years. But a case The bill was reported to the Senate without amendment, ordered to came up before the Court of-Claims some time during last year, from be engrossed for a third reading, read the third time, and passed. Pennsylvania., for rent, and thecourtdecidedthat the Department could not rent the building beyond the time for which the appropriation was MESSAGE FROM THE HOUSE. made. A message from the House of Representatives, by Mr. CLARK, its 1\Ir. ALLISON. Beyond a year. Clerk, announced that the House had passed a joint resolution (H. Res. 1\Ir. SAWYER. It embarrasses the Department very much. In a 191) for the printing of certain eulogies delivered in Congr~ upon the great many instances they can get a building fitted up and rent it for late Dudley C. Haskell; in which it requested the concurrence of the -six, eight, or ten y~ars at a very low rental, when if they could only Senate. •rent it for one year they could not probably get it fitted up at all. It ·embarrasses the Department in the whole arrangement. I think the JUDICIAL JURISDICTION OUTSIDE THE UNITED STATES. tbill ought to be left as it is in re~ard to the term of the lease. The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Chair now lays before the Senate Mr. INGALLS. I should be unwilling to allow the officers of one the unfinished business of yesterday. administration to make a lease extending over the period of two admin­ The Senate, as in Committee of. the Whole, resumed the considera­ istrations to follow and the half of the next. It seems to me that upon tion of the bill (S. 343) to provide for the exercise of the jurisdiction the mere suggestion the difficulty is obvious, that the power is too conferred upon the United States in places out of their territory and great. The discretion ought not to be allowed by the bill. Hitherto dominion and to repeal the Revised Statutes from section 4083 to sec­ the leases have been, as the Senator from Iowa suggests, limited to tion 4130, inclusive. -one year, or the period of the appropriations, which would be two, al­ Mr. HOAR. Has the bill been read at length? though I have known instances wh'ere the term has been four years. I The PRESIDING OFFICER. TP.e bill has been read at length. It should like to have an amendment made to the bill which would limit is now as in Committee of the Whole and open to amendment. it to four years at the outside. Mr. INGALLS. I msh the Senator from Ohio [Mr. PEKDLETON], Mr. SAWYER. I know that a great many leases have been made before we are called up0n to vote on this bill, turning to seet;on 12, for ten years, ~nd that colll'Se has worked well. would explain under what provision of the Constitution of the United Mr. HOAR. If the Postmaster-General is honest, it is very impor­ States Congress can appoint "two district judges of the United States tant, it seems to me, that he should have a discretion such as the bill for China and a district judge of the United States for Japan, whose ·.gives him to in proper cases make a lease not exceeding ten years. Al- terms of office shall be eight years, respectively." The clau.se of the 1614 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. MARcH 5,

Constitution with regard to the judicial power of the United States, The PRESIDING OFFICER. It will be read for the information ot article 3, section 1, is as follows : the Senate. The judicial power of the United States shall be vested in one Supreme Court.~ The SECRETARY. In line 1, section 12, after the wo;:d " that," in­ and in such inferior courts as the Congress may from time to time ordain ana sert "for the purposes of this act;" in line 2, after the word "two," establish. The judges, both of the Supreme and inferior courts, shall hold their offices during good beha.vioriland shall, at stated times, receive for their services strike out "district;" after the word': judges," in line 3, strike out "of a compensation which sha not be diminished during their continuance in the United States;" after the word "judge," in the same line, strikeout office. the words'' of the United States;" so that the clause will read: If, and I suppose it is true, this power is sought to be conferred under That for the purposes of this act there shall be appointed by the President, by R.nd with the advice and consentoftheSenate, two judges for China a.ad ajudg& the clause of the Constitution that I have read, I am unable to see, in for Japan. • the first place, how a district judge of the United States can be ap­ pointed for a district beyond i~ jurisdiction; and, in the second place, Mr. PENDLETON. I ask the Senator from Kansas whether if those­ how his term of office, if he be a district judge, can be limited to eight amendments be adopted his objection totheconstitutionalityofthe bill years, when the Constitution says that the office shall be held during is relieved? good behavior. Mr. INGALLS. It still appears to me, 1\Ir. President, to be an open Mr. PENDLETON. I will ask the Senator from Kansas whether question, and a very interesting one, whether under the Constitution his objection goes to the appointment of judges other than consuls in Congress has the power to provide for the appointment of judges for a. the consular districts in countries beyond the limits of the United country beyond its own juriely this whole subject, and pertinent and to which, perhaps, there will be no objection. came to the conclusion also that the authority was to be found in the Mr. INGALLS. May I make a suggestion at this point to the Senator treaty-making power and the clauses of the Constitution which define from Ohio? the authority of treaties made in pursuance of the Constitution as being Mr. PENDLETON. Certainly. thesupremelaw. ThehonorableSenatorfrom Vermont [Mr. EDMUl\"'DS] Mr. INGALLS. I suggest to amend section 12 by inserting after the expressed an opinion that it was derived from the same source. The word "that," in line 1, the words " for the purposes of this act;" after judge of the circuit court of the United States for California, in an ex­ the word " two," in line 2, by striking out the word " district;" after amination of this same question which he made with a good deal of the word "judges," in line 3, striking out the words" ofthe United care, found it in the provision of the Constitution which authorizes States;" in line 3, before the word "judge," at the close of the line, Congress to regulate commerce with foreign nations. striking out the word "district ;" andaftertheword " judge," striking While gentlemen undertake to derive this authority from these vari­ out the words ''of the United States.'' ous clauses of the Constitution, I have to say that I have not found in The PRESIDING OFFICER. Does the Senator propose this as an a single instance that any gentleman in Congress or in the courts or in amendment? the Executive Departments intrusted with the duty of ascertaining the Mr. INGALLS. I suggest it as an amendment to the Senator from clause under which this power could be found has ever come to the

Ohio. conclusion that it does not exist. The late Senator from Wisconsin7 1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORJD-SENATE.• 1615

:Mr. Carpenter, after arguing this question at very gre;.~.t length and Mr. INGALLS. On page 37 of the bill it is declared: with very great ability, denied that he was in a condition to dispute the In all criminal prosecutions the a

partial, fair, and speedy trial, and if it is impossible to obtain a jury ment--is to submit hereafter to the enormities, as I venture to call of twelve men who are citizens, then you must do the next best thing them, of our own penal and civil codes which are now enforced in the you cap. not prohibited by the Constitution. administration of the courts within those countries. Mr. HOAR. May I ask the honorable Senator from Ohio if he in­ Mr. JONES, of Florida. · Will the Sell.fl,tor permit me to ask a ques­ tends to concede the question of the Senator from Kansas that when an tion? American has offended a~ainst a Chinese law and is tried in China for Mr. PENDLETON. Certainly. a Chinese offense, the right to a trial by jury attaches to him and that Mr.JONES, of Florida. I think it will be conceded that there are more our Constitution has anything whatever to do with it? subjects of Great Britain in China and Japan than we have citizens :Mr. PENDLETON. I knew that when the time came I ccmld hand there, at least in China; and I would ask the Senator what system she that question over to my friend from Massachusetts, whom I have heard has adopted in reference to matters of this kind, and so of the other discuss it very learnedly once or twice or perhaps oftener on this floor; great nations of the continent whose relations with these countries are but, with all deference to. him, the argument he made did not meet the even more intimate than our own? entire assent of my judgment, although I have grave doubts whether Mr. PENDLETON. The British system of the administration of law he is not right. But I maintain that under this cl..'tuse of the Consti­ under treaties somewhat similar, if not exactly similar, to ours is very tution, when we attempt to administer justice in these countries, if we much more elaborate and intricate than the system provided in this bill. impanel a jury known to the Constitution as such, a jury, if you please, They have extended the trial by juryto thesecountrie8; they have done of :five impartial men, then we have not only done the best we can, but everything they could within the last thirty or forty years to improve we ha~e fulfilled the obligation of the Constitution of the United States. the system which existed at the time when our consular-court system I am fully aware of the position which the honorable Senator from was first adopted, in 1848. They have provided for juries of five and for Massachusetts has taken heretofore on this subject. I am fully aware appeals to their higher courts, very much as is done by this bill. They that he believes-and of course I do not desire to misstate him-that have taken away from their consuls in many if not in aU these countries all this jurisdiction is assumed and exercised by the Government of the all judicial functions, and have provided judges, whose duty it shall be United States outside of the Constitution and without a warrant ex­ not to attend to commercial affairs at all, but to attend to the adminis­ pressly given in it; but I prefer to keep myself a little closer in to shore; tration of the law and judicially sit in judgment upon their citizens. I prefer to believe that it is possible to exercise this jurisdiction in con­ They have imported all the ameliorations that were possible from the formity with the principles and provisions of the Constitution of the humane and wise system of the administration of the criminal and civil United States, and believin.~ that, I think it is our bounden duty, while laws which has existed for many years in England and which are being we conform to the principles and provisions of the Constitution, and in introduced every year. The French Government has done the same no instance violate them, that we should go as far as it is possible and thing. It has made amelioration ·of the imperfect provisions of their under all existing conditions to extend them to those communities. system, imperfect, but sufficient perhaps for the population fifty or eighty I do not believe, at least I do not for the present purpose of the ar­ years ago in these countries. They have improved these systems, I say, gument I have now with the Senator from Kansas, that this jurisdiction and suited them to a population numbering thousands and thousands is exercised outside of the Constitution. I believe that it is exercised in many of the countries and ports. This is an honest attempt on the within it. I believe that under theConotitution you may have ajury part of the Congress of the United States to introduce some of these im­ which does not consist of twelve men. I believe you may have a jury provements into our very rude and barbarous consular-court system, in which does not consist of citizens of the United States. Believing that order to make it conform more to our notions of the proper administra­ there is no inhibition upon juries of that kind, I maintain that we have tion of justice as we find it in our own country, in order that when our fulfilled the provisions of the Constitution when we provide that these citizens leave their homes they shall not leave also all the protections courts shall impanel a jury of :five. That only takes a less advanced of life and property to which they have been accustomed here. position than the Senator from Massachusetts is waiting to take, who Mr. GARLAND. Mr. President, the question of the power to pass believes that citizens of the United States can be tried without a jury, bills of this character, after considerable reflection since the bill was without indictment, without presentment by a grand jury, and with­ read yesterday, seems to me to rest entirely on the treaty-making power out the guards provided }?y the clause in the Constitution which the or on the authority which grows out of the treaty-making power under Senator from Kansas has read. article 2 of the Constitution. It can not come from the commercial That answers, Mr. President, so far as I remember, the suggestions of power, because without a treaty we could do nothing in the way ofcom­ the Senator from Kansas. mercial regulations abroad in the territory of foreign countries. So Mr. HOAR. I wish to disclaim the opinion which the Senatorfrom whatever authority you look at under the Constitution the power to pass . Ohio has imputed to me, that these trials are without the Constitution. sucp a bill as this must, in my judgment, rest on the power to make I think they are very clearly within the Constitution of the United treaties. In other words, the jurisdiction that we have in China or States. That the Constitution of the United States applies to offenses Japan is just exactly what those people may have given us and no more. committed in China against the Qhinese law, that it extends the methods We get it by a treaty with them. It is something like the power of <>fproceeding which it provides for offenses committed on our own soil passing laws for extradition. In the very early history of this Govern­ against American law, I do not believe; and I desire to ask the Senator ment the State of Vermont objected to the power of Congress to pass from Ohio if he does not agree that offenses committed on shipboard extradition laws, and attempted to withhold by her State officers a per­ may be constitutionally tried by the Government of the United States, son who was arrested as a criminal under the extradition laws of the although certainly they are not tried in the State or district where the United States. I refer to the case of Holmes vs. Jackson in 14 Peters, oftense was committed nor in any district previously ascertained by law? which came to the Supreme Court of the United States. Holmes was Mr. PENDLETON. Does the Senator mean other offenses than those ordered by the governor of Vermont to be sun·endered to the authori­ · provided for in the clause which give.S jurisdiction over piracies and ties of Quebec, and on habeas corpus bythe supreme court of Vermont felonies on the high seas ? he was not discharged, and the proceeding was claimed to be under Mr. HOAR. I mean all offenses on shipboard. State law and State authority. But the Supreme Court of the United Mr. PENDLETON. Wherever the ship may be? States, the opinion being delivered by Judge Taney, held that it was Mr. HOAR. Yes, sir. - not by virtue of any State law that this could be done, but it was only Mr. PENDLETON. That is another question. This answers, Mr. national authority under the power to make trea.ties with foreign powers President, as far as I propose to do at this moment, what the Senator under article 2 of the Constitution, and that where such treaties had from Kansas has said in reference to the constitution of the juries. I been made and a law passed in pursuance thereof the national j urisdic­ say very frankly that I would prefer to constitute the juries in these tion took charge of the person instead of the State jurisdic~ion. That fthe United States, then we must commit our citizens to the jurisdic­ trial of persons who commit crimes on the high seas, that by analogy ti-on of the native tribunals and laws. This is the alternative before us­ come under this same power or authority. It is not a question of en­ either to find power somewhere to erect these tTibunals for the admin­ forcing a constitutional provision within the territory of this Govern­ istration of civil and criminal law under the authority ofthe United ment; but it is a question of enforcing rights and obligations in a for­ States or to commit our citizens to the administration of the local law eign territory conceded to us by treaty, which the President has authority by the native tribunals. The alternative to passing a bill of this kind­ to make under article 2 of the Constitution, two-thirds of the Senate I do not say this bill with these specific provisions without amend- concurring. That, I think, is the whole case; and whether we take i884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. 1617

.five jurors or three or no jurors at all, it is permissible for us to do it, very well, and at the same time I can see in it enough that might lead because we are exercising a jurisdiction there given to us by the treaty­ to terrible complications of jurisdiction. We know, after au experience .making power. of nearly a century under our own Government, bow difficult it bas If Senators will examine consular courts already established they been to draw the line between the jurisdiction of the Federal Govern­ will find that even that law gives power and authority and jurisdiction ment and the States, and nearly every controversy of a serious char­ o our consuls that no one man could exercise constitution..1.lly in the acter that bas arisen under our system has grown out of the difficulty territory of this country. Consuls alone are made courts for many pur­ of marking distinctly the lines of jurisdiction which separate the au­ :po es; they are made conrls for many purposes for which upon the ter­ thority of the Union from the authority of the States. ritory of the UniteQ. States we employ jurors, twelve men, good and When you undertake to establish in a country like China or Japan lawful men of the bailiwick. These consuls exercise many powers of a judicial system like this, with a code oflaws provided as herein, with :that sort, such as levying large fines and arresting persons and depriv­ judges created by yourselves, who can tell the moment that you will .ing them of liberty and confining them, because we there exercise au­ be brought face to face with tho e domestic tribunals and jurisdictions, .thoritythat is given us by the foreign power under the authority granted and international complications of a serious character arise? If you ·by the Constitution to make treaties. So much for that. simply give to a consul the power, as I understood was the form of the There is one difficulty in my mind about this bill. The Senator from law formerly, to administer the foreign law for the benefit of your own ·Ohio states for example that we take :five jurors because we can not citizen, that is one thing, and I believe that is about as far as -we have _get twelve. Is not this, then, too much machinery ? Is not this too ever gone in that direction hitherto. -complicated a system? Is not this too unwieldy a piece of business for I appreciate the effort the Senator from Ohio is making to remedy the small amount really that is at stake or for the small object in view difficulties that may now exist, but I say the usage of nations in such in organizing this cumbrous and unwieldy machinery? cases is that the foreign officer should do nothing more than administer - Mr. PENDLETON. I do not know that the Senator from Arkansas the foreign law that has been violated by his own citizens; and when .quite understood me or whether I expressed myself clearly. The pro­ you undertake to establish a code of laws, as this bill does, under the TI.sions of this bill are that juries shall consist of :five men. There is municipal authority of your own GoTernment, and put them in opera­ no attempt under the provisions of the bill to secure a jury of twelve tion within the confines of another state, you may possibly at some time :men. The juries are limited to five in the bill because of the difficulty have a clash of jurisdiction. ' _ -w hkh is known to exist of getting juries of twelve men in many of these I understand the provisions of this bill in some respects to extend to ;places. In places provided for in this bill the jury is to consist of :five cases where a Chinese and an American citizen are involved in contro­ -only. versy-admiralty, equity, civil jurisdiction-and it will be readily seen Mr. GARLAND. That is not precisely as I understood the Senator. how a conflict between a domestic subject there might arise against an I must have misunderstood him. But it illustrates the point! have in American citizen. But I do not say this except with the view of show­ my mind, that it occurs to me that we are establishing too large an or­ ing that this subject is very full of complications. ganization, too big a system, too unwieldy a system for the object in Mr. EDMUNDS. May I interrupt the Senator from Florida to cor­ view. Of course as the committee, as I understand, had this under rect a misapprehension that I think he is under in respect to the previ­ examination for a long time and gave it constant and serious attention, ous practice under treaties with China. and Japan for instance, and very I should dislike to oppose anything they have done; but it does seem likely other nations ? I think be will :find on looking at the treaties ·to me, conceding the power under the Constitution, as I attempted to that the arrangement has always been in substance that the citizen or­ :show, to do this with the consent of the foreign nation, that this is too subject of the other country in a controversy, either criminal or civil, big a machine for the business in view. Still I have no amendment to should be tried in mixed courts or in the con.Sular courts on the princi­ ,offer and no suggestion beyond this to make. That we can do this I ples of the law of his own country. If, therefore, aCbinesesubjectha.d have convinced myself on examination of the statutes in connection done a wrong to an American citizen, the Chinese subject was to be ad­ ·with the Constitution and the decisions of the court. Of that there is judged, although tried in the same courts, according to the Chinese law; .no doubt in my mind. if the American was accused of doing any wrong be was to be tried on Mr. PENDLETON. Mr. President, iftbeSenatorfromArkansaswill the principles of the American law. But all that has been conventional, .examine somewhat the code of practice which is in force in the consu- · just as t.his bill is really exerting a power under the authority of the Jar courts under a provision of the Revised Statutes, and w hicb comprises sovereign dominion of the country where it is to be exercised, because nine-tenths of the book that I bold in myhand, he will find a compli­ that sovereign dominion is just as great-in China or Japan as it is in .ca,ted syst-em, enormous in extent, without harmony anywhere, in com- the United States. parison with which the provisions of this bill are simplicity itself; and _ Mr. JONES, of Florida. That I admit. I have not examined the this complicated system of existing law is put in force at the sole will of treaties to see how far the concessions have extended, but then I do -the ministers in the respective countries under the provision of the Re- not subscribe to the doctrine laid down by my friend from .Arkansas -vised Statutes, which by this bill is repealed. a while ago that under a government like ours we are at liberty to ex­ Mr. McPHERSON. May I ask the Senator from Ohio, before he ercise every power that may be conceded to us by a foreign country in takes his seat, a question? My mindrunsratbertotbepractical work­ a treaty. I say that the limitations attending the exercise of our power ing of the bill than to its constitutionality, although that is a very in­ must not be looked for in the concessions of a forei~ power. If you teresting question. I wish to know what is the necessity for the exer­ undertook to do that you might extend the powers of this Government -cise of this extraordinary power, as it has been properly characterized. all over the globe and do things beyond the confines of the Union which The question I wish the Senator to answer is: What bas been the abuse you would not be permitted to do here. When it comes to the con­ under the present system? What are the defects of the present sys­ cession of the right to try an American citizen who has violated a foreign tem? Have they been of a character to justify legislation of the de­ law before a consul in one of these barbarous countries I think it is a .scription here proposed, which may be deemed by some to go even to wise thing to do, and I said that in my place when objection was made the verge of unconstitutionality? Is this legislation necessary (sup- to it, I think by my distinguished friend from Ohio because it did not posing it to be constitutional) in order that we may have safety and go far enough, I think be thought, in throwing around that citizen the justice on the part of our courts in the Eastern countries? benefit of trial by jury and all those constitutional safeguards that we Mr. JONES, of Florida. Mr. President, I do not think that I can find in our own Constitution. I think I s,aid on that occasion, as I say be accused of a spirit of opposition to a measure of this kind, for I re­ now, that when a citizen goes abroad to any country he has no right to member a year or two ago there was a very interesting debate in the claim that the Constitution of his country shall follow him. Senate on the subject, when my distinguished friend from Ohio made a Mr. B.A. YARD. May I ask one thing here? I submit to my friend motion to strike out of an appropriation bill a sum of money to pay for from Ohio whether, so far from this act of Congress constituting a cur­ these consular courts. I remember that debate; and I remember very tailment of the constitutional rights or other rights of American citi­ distinctly that I was one who admitted to the fullest extent possible zenship, it does not in point of fact enlarge them to the degree that the the right of any foreign sovereign to concede to the representative of law extends over such rights as he would have by the permission of the another sovereign the power to try one of the latter's su~ects for an in­ foreign nation? In other words, it is just so much granted in addition fra{)tion of the laws of the foreign country. And when the late Sena­ to what we have under the admitted rules of international law. So far tor from Wisconsin, who was always so able and clear upon topics of from having his liberty abridged or the right of protection denied, this that kind, contended, as did the then Senator from New York, who was international code--for that is what it is-simply gives him that which so highly distinguished in this body, ]l,fr. Conkling, that such trials but for that code he would be absolutely deprived of. were contrary to the Constitution of the United States, and that our Mr. JONES, of Florida. Mr. President, it was said by a great law­ citizen in these foreign countries was entitled to the protection of the giver that the forms of law are the repositories of its grandest princi­ -safeguards of our organic law, I dissented, as I now do, from that en­ ples. I believe a good deal in the forms of law, and when you go out of tire doctrine. I do not think that the Constitution of the United States them it will always have a bad effect upon the public mind. bas any ·extraterritorial operation. I do not think that it ever was I confess on reading this bill at :first I was struck with the unusual (.re:otted to confer powers upon us to legislate for any foreign country; character of its provisions; and still after the very elaborate and clear ;tnd that when it comes to the exercise of these powers relating to for­ statement made by the Senator from Ohio much of my prejudice to it ~\ign countries and intercourse with them we are confined to the pro- wa removed; but when I fiTst looked at ection 12, wherein it is J ro­ ;i ions of the organic law. vided that district judges of the United States for Japan and China. _ ow, I can very readily see how this y tern could be made to work hall be appointed and that judicial dicstricts shall be carved out of the XV--102 1618 - CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. MAUCH' 5,.

ta-ritory of those countries for all judicial purpo es, it seemed to· me· The bill (H. R. 5462) making appropriation to supply deficiency in. that this was going a little beyond the usual consular and diplomatic amount required for expenditure to June 30, 1884, for examination and. line. It looked to me that under whatever power it might be claimed surveys required by acts of March 3, 1875, and June 19, 1878, to as­ it was the exercise of the municipal authority of one country within certain depth of water and width of channel .of South Pass of ML i­ the confines of another, and the doubt in my mind has been whether, sippi River, also for gauging the waters of the !tlississippi River and admitting all that has been said touching the power given by the treaties its tributaries, was read twice by its title. with Japan and China, those countries can empower us to exercise mu­ Mr. JONAS. I move the reference of the bill to the Committee on nicipal authority within their boundaries. That is the point. I do Commerce. not question for a moment the right of those countries to permit our The motion was agreed to. consuls to take jurisdiction over offenders tP..ere who may violate the .JUDICIAL JURISDICTION OUTSIDE THE UNITED TATES. foreign laws; butwhenin a treaty it is concW.ed that the United States may legislate over that territo1'Y which forms a distinct and integral The Senate, as in Committee of the Whole, resumed the considera­ foreign soil, whether under the limitations of the power contained in tion of the bill (S. 343) to provide for the exercise of the jurisdiction our organic law we can do that thing is a question in my mind. That conferred upon the United States in places out of their territory and this bill does that I do not think there can be any question, because it dominion and to repeal the Revised Statutes from ection 4083 to ec­ institntesacodeoflawsto be applied in foreign territory. I have said re­ tion 4130, inclusive. peatedly on this subject the Constitution of the United States was made Mr. PENDLETON. Mr. President, thehonombleSenatorfromFlor­ for our own country, and we are not in the position of those powers of ida [Mr. JoNES] has stated substantially the po ition that he occupied Europe who have no defined authority, who can do anything they please two or three years ago in debate on this subject, although he did not in foreign lands on questions of this kind. But whether the legislative then limit quite so closely as he does now the power of the Government poweroftheUnitedStates-ldonotspeakofthetreaty-makingpower­ to establish tribunals for the trial of citizens. He seem..:; now to limit is not necessarily a constitutional power, confined to our own territory, the authority of the Government of the United States to try before con­ is the fundamental question, and whether we have any right to legis­ sular and other courts, certainly consular courts, citizens of the United la1 e for Japan or Chlna even though those countries may say that we may. States for infractions of the law of the foreign country in which they What is the character of our power? Suppose, according to the argo­ are, and that there i.e no power on the part of the Government to pass ment of my distinguished friend from Arkansas, Mexico to-morrow laws, or municipal regulations as he chooses to call them, upon otther should make a treaty and say, " We want you to legislate for this whole subjects. country on everything; we are utterly unable to provide for our own l\fy honornble friend, if he will look to the praetice which has pre­ people; yours are mixed up with ours, and we will give you jurisdiction vailed for forty years, more or less-thirty-eight, to be exact-will fi.nu under the treaty to legislate for us and institute courts of law, courts of that the practice has been that these courts administer the whole body equity, and common law and criminal law;" the question is whether of law made under the authority of the Government of 1he United under the exercise of the legislative power of the United States that au­ States, and that they have not confined their jurisdiction to the trial of thority could be exerted. offenses against the laws of the country in which these courts were sit­ I merely throw out this, not by way of opposition to the bill, because, uated. If he will look-and I call the attention of the Senator from as I indicated in the debate before when others were opposed to any New Jersey to this public document that I have in my hand-he will consular trials at all, I advocated them and admitted that it was fully find that, under the authority of section 4086 of the Revised Stature , competent for consuls to t1'Y American citizens who had violated the law. here is a code of laws established by the minister to China, comprising nearly fifty pages of this volume. Here is another code established by SENATE CONTINGENT FUND. the minister or consul-general to the Ottoman dominions, compri ing a Ur. PENDLETON. Mr. President-- very large number of pages of this volume. He will find also a code of Mr. SHERMAN. Will my colleague allow me to ask the action of laws for Japan, which comprises over forty pages of this volume. the Senate on a bill returned from the House of Representatives with Mr. McPHERSON. DoestheSenatorsavtheministermadethe law ? an amendment? Mr. PENDLETON. Yes, sir; and I am proceeding to an wer th Mr. PENDLETON. For reference? question which the Senator put to me in relation to the necessity of thl 1\ir. SHERMAN. No; to concur in the amendment. It will only measure. I wish to call his attention to section 40 6 of the Revised take a moment. Statutes- Mr. PENDLETON. I will yield for an instant. But in all cases where such la.ws a.re not adapted to the object, or a.re deficient Mr. SHERMAN. If any Senator objects I will not ask it. I ask in the provisions necessary to furnish suitable remedies, the common ln.w a nd the law of equity a.nd admiralty shall be extended in like manner over such unanimous consent of the Senate to act on a Honse amendment to a Sen­ citizens and others in those countries; and if neither the common law, nor tbe ate joint resolution. law of equity or admiralty, nor the statutes of the United State , furnish ap­ The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Senator from Ohio asks unani­ propriate and sufficient remedies, the ministers in those countries, respectively, shall, by decrees and regulations which shall have the force of law, supply sach mous consent of the Senate that the Chair at this time lay before the defects and deficiencies. Senate Senate joint resolution No. 64 providing for the addition of $10,000 to the contingent fund of the Senate. Is there objection to the Under that clause of the Revised Statutes this volume of laws and of Chair laying the resolution before the Senate at this time? regulations in each of these countries have been adopted and promulgated .Mr. PENDLETON. If the consideration of the amendment will lead by the ministers to th~ countries; and under the clause of the Revised to debate, I shall have to object. Statutes they have the force and effect of laws. Mr. SHERMAN. I will not press it if there is a single objection. Mr. McPHERSON. Do I understand that that power is also given The PRESIDING OFFICER. Is there objection to the Chair laying to the consular agents or do they exercise that power? the resolution before the Senate at this time? The Chair hears none. Mr. PENDLETON. The ministers. The amendment of the House of Representatives will be read. Mr. McPHERSON. Butsupposethereisno minister resident in the The Chief Clerk read the amendment of the House of Representatives, country, then the qustion is, do the consular agents have the power? which was to add to the joint resolution: Mr. PENDLETON. The consul-general has the power. Which sum shall be available only for the expenses of investigations hereto­ Mr. M:cPHERSON. Then, ifI understand aright, they not only have fore ordered. the power to make laws in addition to those already upon our statute­ l\1r. BUTLER. What do I understand to be the object of the Senator book, but they have the exclusive power of administering and executin~ from Ohio? and interpreting their own laws. The PRESIDING OFFICER. To move to concur in the amendment Mr. PENDLETON. Yes, sir; you have it P.xactly. of the House of Representatives. Mr. McPHERSON. That is extraordinary. Mr. BUTLER. I object to that. Mr. PENDLETON. You have it exacily; a.nd in a. communication The PRESIDING OFFICER. Is there objection to considering the made by the Secretary of State he says-I adopt his language: resolution at this time? This brings me naturally to a. fourth consideration, in regard to the codification of the enactments themselves pertaining to consular jurisdiction. Sections 4083 Mr. BUTLER. My reason for objecting is that a qualification is at­ to 4130 of the Revised Statute.~ are a rearrangement and continuous compilation tached which I do notthinktheHouse has any right to put upon it. I of the laws on the subject since 1860. The result is, unfortunately, to render the do not object to the $10,000. statute ill-digested, disconnected in its parts, and obscure a.-;; a. whole. Intended for the guidance of officers not as a. rnle versed in jurisprudence, it would seem The PRESIDING OFFICER. Does the Senator from South Carolina that the utmost clearness and precision would have been sought, with di tinct object to the present consideration of the joint resolution? definitions of their powers and dutie . In practice, however, an examination ot Mr. BUTLER. Yes, sir. the questions of interpretation referred to the Department of State by our diplo­ matic and consular officers shows a latitude of con truction and a diversity of The PRESIDING OFFICER. Objection being made, the matter conclusions not entirely unwarranted by the text of the law. All, however , must go over. agree in the complete liberty of the officer conducting a. criminal or civil pro­ ceeding to decide within his own discretion touching the assistance of a.sse. or , IIOUSE BILL REFERRED. the adm.i ibility of testimony, the rehearing of the parties, the granting of uew Mr. JONAS. With the consentofthe Senator from Ohio (Mr. PEN­ trials, the exercise of the right of appeal, and, iu a word, nearly every matter DLETON], I w'ould ask consent to take from the table a House bill for pertaining to his own administration of the la.w. the purpose of reference to a committee which meets to-morrow. And thereupon-- The PRESIDI.l.~G OFFICER. Is there objection to the Chair laying Mr. McPHERSON. Does the bill reported by the. enutorlimittlw before the Senate at this time the House bill referred to by the Senator courts which the bill proposes to establish to the Jaws of the Unit d from Louisiana? The Chair hears none. States found on the statute-book ? ·1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 1619

• Mr. PENDLETON. To the laws of the United.States, and the com­ Mr. SPEAKER. The Chair thinks so, too, after ascertaining the con­ mon law, and a code of laws hereafter to be prepared under the au­ tents of the bill. If there be no objection the bjll will be taken from thority of the President and submitted to Congress for its enactment. the Calendar of the Committee ofthe Whole on the state of the Union Now, sir, in relation to the administm.tion of the criminal law: and placed on the Private Calendar. I regard a reform in this sense as especially indispensable in capital cases. There was no objection, and it was ordered accordingly. As at present organized, doubts must arise in the mind of every constitutional jurist touching the power of a consular court, or rather of a minister or consul UNDERVALUATIO:N OF IMPORTED WOOL. acting judicially under the authority of Congress, to legally and constitutionally The SPEAKER laid before the House a letter from the Secretary of deprive a fellow-being of life. Since the existing statute was framed in 1848 and modified and extended in 1860 at least seven capital convictions have oc­ the Treasury, making additional statements concerning alleged under­ curred thereunder, all in China and Japan. These instances are worthy of valuation of imported wool; which was referred to the Committee on note, especially as in one of them actual execution of the sentence followed. Ways and Means, and ordered to be printed. First. David Williams, claiming to be a British subject, was, in November, 1863, at Shany;hai, convicted by Consul-(rtmeral Seward, acting judicially with FREEDMAN'S HOSPITAL AND. ASYLUM, DISTRICT OF COLlThlliiA. assessors, of 'piracy and murder," in the robbery of a Chinese craft on the Yangtse. The sentence was approved by the secretary of legation, acting as The SPEAKER also laid before the House a letter from the Secre­ minister, and a death-warrant signed by him. A few hours before the time fixed tary of the Interior, transmitting letters from the First Comptroller of for execution Williams committed suicide in the consular jail. the Treasury, suspending certain items in the accounts of disbursing Second. James White was in like manner convicted of murder by the consular court at Shanghai November 23,1863. Mr. Burlingame, the minister, issued a officers of the Interior Department for the Freedman's Hospital and warrant for the execution, but before the sentence could be carried out White es­ Asylum of Washington, D. C.; which was referred to the Committee on caped from jail and was not recaptured. Appropriations, and ordered to be printed. '.rhird. John D. Buckley, claiming to be a British subject, was in like manner convicted of murder by the consular court at Shanghai on the 1st of February, PRINTING ADDITIONAL COPIES OF PUBLIC DOCUMENTS. 1864. His cause was ably defended by his counsel, l\1r. J . B. Eames, who argued the unconstitutionality of a trial without indictment or jury. The SPEAKER, in pursuance of the statute, laid before the House The minister, l\lr. Burlingame, approved the sentence of the consular court and the following concurrentresolutionsofthe Senate; which were referred issued a warrant of execution. Writing to the Department of State, Mr. Bur­ to the Committee on Printing: lingame said, June 3, 1864, "A vigorous effort was made by l\1r. Eames, the counsel of the prisoner, to secure a reference to the President, but I could not Resolved by the Senare (the House of Representatives concur-ring), 'l'hat the report see my way clear to grant his request;" thus giving the prosecution and not the of theNa.tional Academy of Sciences, with its appendixes, be printed in the usnal prisoner the benefit of the doubt. Buckley was hanged at the United States octavo form, but that the four accompanying memoirs be printed in quarto consulate on April!, 1864. form; and that1,000additionalcopies ofthe report and memoirs be printed for the use of the Senate, 2,000 copies for the use of the House of Representatives, There are other cases: and 1,500 copies for the use of the Academy of Sciences. Fourth. James Webb, an American seaman, wa.s, in December, 1878, by the Resolved by the Senare (the House of Represen-tatives concurring), That there be consular court·at Nagasaki, Japan, convicted of murder. * * * My prede­ printed 3,000 extra copies of the report of Julius E. Hilga.rd, Superint~ndent of cessor, Mr. Secretary Evarts, found himself confronted by the question of the the Coast and Geodetic Survey. showing the progress made in said survey d Ul'­ constitutionality of a death sentence without indictment and trial by jury, and ingthe year ending June30, 1883, for distribution by said Superintendent. the President was counseled by him and by the Attorney-General to exert his LEAVE OF ABSENCE. prerogative of clemency. Webb's sentence was accordingly commuted to that of imprisonment for life. . By unanimous c.Onsent, leave of absence was granted as follows: Fifth. Before the consular court at Osaka and Hiogo, Japan, on the 9th of To Mr. KELLEY, from evening sessions, during this Congress. April,1880- To Mr. CANDLER, for ten days, on account of important business. As late as that- To Mr. KING, for two days. William Dinkelle, an American citizen and seaman, was convicted of murder on shipboard in the port of Hiogo. The minister, Mr. Bingham, withh~ld the IMPORTS A..'n> EXPORTS. issuance of a death-warrant, and referred the case, with recommendation of Mr. MILLS, by unanimous consent, submitted the following ~In­ clemency, to the President, who remitted Dinkelle's sentence on condition of undergoing imprisonment for life. Dinkelle refused to accept this conditional tion; which was refeqed to the Committee on Ways and Means: pardon, and is still in jail under indefinite postponement of the execution of the Resolfled, That the Committee on Ways and Means be authorized to inquire !len.tence of the consular court. and report as to the propriety of procuring for the use of Congress and printing Senate Document No. 46, first session Forty-sixth Congress, wit.h additional data I submit to the Senator from New Jersey whether I have not made to be furnished by the compiler thereof, showing the imports and duties from out the fa-ct that as to the administration of both the criminal and the 1867 to 1883 inclusive, and a compilation of exports, the growth, produce, and civil ,law under the present consular code there is the greatest po~le manufacture of the United States, from 1879 to 1883, inclusive, in which the quan­ tity, value, and unit of quantity of each article is given by fiscal years and de­ necessity for amendment. cades, also the value exported to each country and value from eat'h Stat-e, pre­ Mr. McPHERSON. Anything seems an improvement. pared by Charles H. Evans, of the Treasury Department. 1-h. PENDLETON. Yes, sir, anything is an improvement. NANCY E. DAY. Mr. CALL. Mr. President-- Mr. WAIT, by unanimous consent, introduced a bill (H. R. 5679) for MI. INGALLS. Will the Senator from Florida yield to me for a the relief of Nancy E. ·Day, administratrix of James L. Day, deceased;. motion to proceed to the consideration of executive business? which was read a first and second time, referred to the CoiDIDittee on. Mr. CALL. I will, sir. Claims, and ordered to be printed. Mr. INGALLS. I make that motion. The motion was agreed to. DEBORAH S. EARL. ROOMS FOR COMMITTEES. Mr. WAIT, by unanimous consent, also introduced a bill (H. R. 5680) granting an increase of pension to Deborah S. Earl; which was read a Mr. JONES, ofNevada. Whilethedoorsare being close~ I ask unani­ first and second time, referred to the Committee on Invalid Pensionsr mous consent to report back from the Committee to Audit and Control and ordered to be printed. the Contingent Expenses of the Senate a resolution submitted by the Senatorfrom Massachusetts [Mr. DAWES], authorizingtheSergeant-at­ EXAMINATION AND SURVEY OF SOUTH PASS MISSISSIPPI RIVER, ETC. .A.rms and Architect of the Capitol to rent suitable rooms for the use of Mr. BLANCHARD. I am instructed by the CoiDIDittee on River& Senate coiDIDittees, and I ask that the resolution be put on its passage. and Harbors to bring to the attention of the House at this time a mat­ The PRESIDING OFFICER. Is there objection to receiving the res- ter of emergency and to ask that House bill No. 5462 to be taken from olution at this time? The Chair hears none. . the Calendar of the Committee of the Whole on the Sta.te of the Union _ Mr. ALLISON. Let the resolution be read. and considered now. I ask one moment to make an explanation of the Mr. INGALLS. No; let it go on the Calendar. measure. This bill is a deficiency appropriation of $8,100, specially The PRESIDING OFFICER. The resolution will be plaeed on the asked for by the Secretary of War. Calendar. The SPEAKER. It. is not in order to debate the proposition until EXECUTIVE SESSIO_. the House has determined whether it will consider it at this time or not. The Senate proceeded to the consideration of executive business. Mr. BLANCHARD. I desire a word of explanation before objection .After five minutes spent in. executive session the doors were reopened: is asked for . and (at 4 o'clock and 20 IDIDutes p. m.) the Senate adjourned. The SPEAKER. The title of the bill will be read. The title of the bill, which was read, is as follows: ~ bill (H. R. 5462) making appropriation to supply deficiency in amount re­ qwred for expenditure to June 30, 1884, for examination and surveys required by acts of March 3 1875,and June 19,1878, to ascertarn depth of water and width HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES. of channel at South Pass of Mississippi River, also for gauging the waters of the Mississippi River and its tributaries. WEDNESDAY, March 5, 1884. The SPEAKER. The gentleman from Louisiana [Mr. BLANCHARD J The House met at 12 o'clock m. Prayer by the Chaplain, Rev. JOHN asks unanimous consent that the Committee of the Whole on the state S. LINDSAY, D. D. of the Union be discharged from the further consideration of the bill The Journal of the proceedings of yesrerday was read and approved. the title of which has just been read, and 'that it be now considered in the House. CHANGE OF REFERENCE. Mr. HOLMA...~. Let the bill be reported . .Mr. POLAND. . ~ reported a b~l yesterday morni.H.g from the Com­ The SPEAKER. The bill will be read, after which, if there be no nnttee on the Judiciary for the relief of the Metropolitan police force objection, the gentleman from Louisiana [Mr. B LANCHARD] will be of the District of Columbia, which was referred to the Committee of allowed to make a brief explanation. the Whole on the state of the Union. I think it should have gone to Mr. RA..l~DALL. If I am conectly informed, the passage of thi bill the Committee of the Whole on the Private Calendar. - immediately wm save the Government a large snm of money. 1()20 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. MARon 5., ------~------M1·. BLANCHARD. That is the explanation which I desire to make. in the Treasury not otherwise appropriated, to be added to the contingent fund of the Senate for expenses of special and select committees for the fiscal yea r The SPEAKER. The bill will be read. ending June 30, 1884. The bill wa read, ·as follows: lfr. RANDALL. I ask that the report of the Committee on Appro­ B e it enacted, &c., That the following sums be, and the same are hereby, ap:pro­ priated out of any money in the Treasury not otherwise appropriated, to w1t: priations accompanying the joint resolution be read. To supply deficiency in amount required for expenditure to June 30, 1884, for The Clerk read as follows: examinations and surveys required by the acts of 1\>Iarch 3, 1875, and June 19,1878, The Committee on Appropriations, to whom was referred the Senate joint t.o ascertain the depth of water and width of channel secured and maintained resolution (S. R. 64) providing for the addition of$10,000to the contingent fund of from time to time by James B. Eads at South Pass of the Mississippi River, and the Senate, report the same back to the House with a recommendation thn.t the to enable the Secretary of War to report to Congress during the maintenance of same pass with an amendment as follows: the work, $6,000. At the end of the last line of said joint resolution insert the following: "Which To supply deficiency in amount required for expenditure to June 30, 1884, for sum shall be available only for the expenses of investigations heretofore or­ gauging waters of lower Mississippi and its tributaries: For annual expense of dered." gauging the waters of the Mississippi River and its tributaries, continuing ob­ servations of the rise and fall of the river and its chief tributaries, as required Mr. RANDALL. I ask the previous question on the amendment by joint resolution of February 21, 18U, $2,100. SEC. 2. That the moneys hereby appropriated shall be immediately available. and upon ordering the joint resolution to a third reading. The previous question was ordered; and under the operation thereof The SPEAKER. Is there o~jection to the present consideration of the amendment reported by the Committee on Appropriations was this bill? agreed to; and the joint resolution as amended was ordered to a third 1\Ir. REED. What is the total amount involved in the bill? reading. Mr. BLANCHARD. It is $8,100. The joint resolution was read a third time, and passed; there being­ The SPEAKER. Thegentlemanfrom Louisiana [Mr. BLANCHARD] ayes 116, noes 12. asks leave to make a brief statement, subject to the right of members Mr. RANDALL moved toreconsiderthevote by which the joint reso- to object to the consideration of the bill after his statement is concluded. 1uti on was passed; and also moved that the motion to reconsider be laid There was no objection, and leave was granted accordingly. on the table. Mr. BLANCHARD. By the act of Congress of March 3, 1875, and The latter motion was agreed to. the act of J nne 19, 1878, it is made the duty of the Secretary of War to have annually made at the jetties at the month of the Mississippi River RELIEF OF SUFFERERS BY OVEBFLOW AND CYCLONE. certain surveys and examinations, with a view of determining whether Mr. ELLIS, from the Committee on Appropriations, reported back ad­ or not Captain Eads is carrying out his contract with the Government versely joint resolutions of the following titles; which were severally and also with a view of enabling the Government to ascertain whether laid on the table, and the accompanying reports ordered to be printed: said Eads has or has not earned his compensation under such contraet. Joint resolution tH. Res. 162) making an appropriation for the relief This matter has been brought to the attention of the Committee on of sufferers by overflow in the lower Mississippi Valley and the rivers Rivers and H arbors by the Secretary of War in a special communica­ tributary thereto; tion, and also by the Chief of Engineers, who has appeared before us. Joint resolution (H. Res.180)forthereliefofsniferers bythelatecy­ We were given to understand that if this deficiency appropriation be not clone in North Carolina; and made at this time the Secretary of War will not be able to discharge Joint resolntion (H. Res. 183) making an appropriation for the relief the duty imposed upon him by existing law; will not know whether of persons rendered destitute by the overflow of the Mississippi River and to meet the payments provided for in the contract with Captain Eads its tributaries. .at the time when they fall due. We are further informed by the coun­ MISSISSIPPI VALLEY FLOODS . sel of Captain Eads, who appeared before the committee, that unless Mr. ELLIS. Acting under instructions of the Committee on Appro­ this appropriation be made, so as to provide for these surveys and exam­ priations, I present a resolution, which, is offered in lien of several re­ inations, Captain Eads, under his contract, will have the right to demand ferred to that committee, arid I ask it be read for present consideration. payment in bonds of the Government, instead of currency. Bonds are The Clerk read as follows: worth about 20 per cent. premium. Therefore the passage of this bill Resolved, That the Secretary of War be requested to furnish this House from will save to the Government a large amount of money. time to time with information of the progress of the flood in the valley of the Mississippi, and to report if at any time in his judgment there exists such suf­ Mr. RANDALL. I wish to ask the gentleman from Louisiana [Mr. fering in consequence of said floods as to justify measures of relief on the part BLANCHARD J whether it is not necessary to make this appropriation of Congress, and if so the measure of such relief. • .. now, in order to give the War Department sufficient time to make its The resolution was adopted. anrveys to ascertain whether Captain Eads has earned this money or not? Mr. ELLIS moved to reconsiderthevote by which liheresolntion was Mr. BLANCHARD. That is the fact. adopted; and also moved that the motion to reconsider be laid on the Mr. RANDALL. Ifhe has earned the money he gets it; otherwise not. table. Mr. BLANCHARD. Yes, sir. The latter motion was agreed to. , l!Ir. DINGLEY. Is this appropriation recommended by the Secre­ tary of War? EULOGIES ORDERED TO BE PRINTED. Mr. BLANCHARD. It is. Mr. RYAN, by unanimous consent, introduced a joint resolution (H. Mr. DUNN. Is the passage of this bill necessary in consequence of Res. 191) for the printing of certain eulogies delivered in Congress upon the failure of the last river and harbor bill? the late Dudley C. Haskell; which was read a first and second time.. l\fr. BLANCHARD. It is. These appropriations have heretofore The joint resolution is as follows: been made in the river and harbor bill; but at the last session of the Resolved, That there be printed of the eulogies delivered in Congress upon the late Dudley C. Haskell, a. R-epresentative-elect to the Forty-eighth Con­ last Congress that bill failed; hence the necessity for this deficiency gress from the State of Kansas, 12,500 copies, of which 3,000 copies shall be for appropriation. the use of the Senate and 9,500 for the use of the House of Representatives. Mr. BROWNE, of Indiana. Will thegentlemanallowmeaqnestion? And the Secre~ry of the Treasury be, and he is hereby, directed to have printed a portra1t of the said Dudley C. Haskell to accompany said eulogies, Mr. BLANCHARD. Yes, sir. · and for the purpose of engraving and printing said portrait the sum of $500, or Mr. BROWNE, of Indiana. Had we not better pass the bill and so much thereof as may be necessary, is hereby appropriated out of a.ny moneys quit talking about it? [Laughter.] · · in the Treasury not otherwise appropriated. Mr. · BLANCHARD. I think so. The joint resolution was ordered to be engrossed and read a third time; Mr. DUNN. We want to know who is responsible. and being engrossed, it was accordingly read the third time, and passed. The SPEAKER. 'The question is on the request of the gentleman Mr. RYAN moved to reconsider the vote by which the joint resolu­ from Louisiana that the Committee of the Whole on the state of the tion was passed; and also moved that the motion to reconsider be laid Union be discharged from the further consideration of this bill, and on the table. that it be brought before the Honse for action. If there be no ob­ The latter motion was agreed to. jection that order will be considered as made. There was no objection. SWINE PRODUCTS. The Honse then proceeded to the consideration of the bill; which Mr. HATCH, of Missouri. I am requested by the Committee on was ordered to be engrossed for a third reading, was accordingly read ..Agriculture to ask unanimous consent that the resolution which I send the third time, and passed. to the Clerk's desk may be considered at this time. Mr. BLANCHARD moved to reconsider the vote by which the bill was Mr. CLAY. I demand the regular order of business. passed; and also moved that the motion to reconsider be laid on thetable. Mr. ROBERTSON. Before we go to the regular order of business I The latter motion was agreed to. have a privileged report to submit. Mr. HATCH, ofl\1issouri. Iasktointroduceajointresolutionfrom SENATE CONTINGENT FUND. the Committee on Agriculture, and if its consideration be objected ta . Mr. RANDALL. Under instructions from the Committee on Appro­ at this time I will ask that it be printed in the RECORD and referred priations, I report back the joint resolution (S. R. 64) providing for the to the Committee on Printing. If the gentleman from Kentucky ha.d addition of $10,000 to the contingent fund of the Senate. I propose, waited until the resolution was read I am sure he would not have ob­ when the resolution and accompanying report have been read, to ask the jected to it. previous question. 1\Ir. CLAY. I thought it was time we should proceed to the consid­ The joint resolution was read, as follows: eration of the regular order of business. Resolved by the &nate and Bouse of Representatives, &c., Tkat the sum of SIO,OOO, The SPEAKER. Does the gentleman objoot? or so much thereof as may be necessary, is hereby appropriate~, outofa.nymoney Mr. CLAY. I do not object to the resolution, for I do not ~ow what 1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD- HOUSE. 1621

reference to the evidence that in many places the names of tho!!e pretended to it is, as it has not been read, but I must insist upon the regular order have voted are wholly fictitious or of persons long since dead, of eminent Ameri­ of business. I do not object to its being introduced for reference to the can statesmen who have been dead many years; the name of Frank James, the Committee on Printing. notorious bandit, is found recorded as voting at one of the precincts of Valencia County. :Mr. H.A.TCH, of Missouri, from the Committee on .Agriculture, re­ It will also appear that at some precincts the whole reported vote was a for­ ported joint resolution (H. Res. 192) for the printing of extra copies of gery, there being no uch persons as the pretended judges, clerks, or voters. documents concerning swine products of this country; which was read There is also one precinct in Socorro County, adjoining Valencia County, where the pretended poll was taken on Monday, the 6t.h, instead of the 7th of a first and econd time, and referred to the Committee on Printing. November. The resolution is as follows: Your committee make the following summary: Resolved, &e., That there be printed 60,(l00copies of the report ofthe Secretary Wlwle 11ote in the Te-rritory .for Congress as certified by fhe returning boards. of State and a{)Companying report made by the commission lately designated by the President to examine and report upon the asserted unbealthfulness of the Manza­ swine product of this country, together with the me sag:e of the President trans­ Counties. · Luna. mitting the same to the House of Representatives; 45,000 copies thereof for the nares. use of the members of the House of Representatives, 10,000 copies for the use of the Senate, and 5,000 copies thereof for the use of the Department of Agriculture. Valencia...... 4,193 66 CONTESTED-ELECTION CASE-NEW 1\I:EXICO. Socorro ...... 1,088 1,153 1r. ROBERT~O~, from the Committee on Elections, submitted the Lincoln ...... 454 338 Doiia A.fi.a •...... •...... •...... ••.•.•....•.••.••..••...... ••.....••••••..••..•...... 1,061 601 following unanimous report: Santa Fe ...... 957 L149 Froneisco A . .iJianzanares, contestant, vs. Tl"anquilino Luna, contestee, from the Ter­ Rio Arriba...... 996 1;310 -ritory of Ne:w 3fexieo. Grant...... 534 891 Colfax ...... 258 1,007 Your committee, to whom was refened th~ above case, beg leave to report: 358 1,419 '.rhat on the 29th day of November, 1882, the acting governor of the Territory ~fora...... · ...... Taos ...... 674 772 of 1 ew Mexico · ued his certificate of election in due form to the sitting Dele­ gate. That on the 23d day of December, 1882, the contestant erved a copy of Bernalillo...... 2,469 1,465 hi notice of contest on the wife of the contestee at his re idence in the Terri­ San Miguel ...... 1,602 3,054 tory of New Mexico, the contestee not being found at home. That on the 20th day of December, 1 '>,the conte~ttant sent a copy of his aid notice of contest by 14, 644 1 13, 225 express to the ' ergeant-at-Arms of the Senate of the United States to be served on contestee, and on the same day sent by mail, by a regi tered Jetter, another Majority for Luna, 1,419. copy addressed to conte. tee, directed to the city of,Vashington, where contestee Below will be found the whole vote of Valencia County, as made by there­ was then in attendance upon the session of Congre . Ttmt contestee an wered in full on the 29th day of January, 18R3. turning board of that countv: The contestee claimed that the notice was not served in time; but your com­ mittee are of opinion that the notice was ample and served in time and in ac­ Manza­ In Luna. conlance with the statute law of New :Mexico; and for the further rea~onsthat the cow1ty of Valencia. nares. the sheriff who erved the notice of contest upon conte tee' wife testrfied con­ testee wa.s ab ent from the Territory of New Mexico, and, besides, he mailed a registered letter containing notice of contest to conte tee at the city of Washing­ 1 ...... 443 ton, where contest<.'e was, and that the Jetter reached the city within the time 2 ...... •....•...... •...... •...•.....•...•....•...... ••.•...• 349 prescribed by Jaw for the notice to be served. 3 ...... 381 The notice of conte t charges fraud in various counties in the Territory; the 4 ...... 70 au wer denies <.'ach chnrge specifically and makes counter-cha1·ges. The contest­ 5 ...... •...... 82 ant only took t timony in one county, Valencia, in regard to nineteen precinct 6 ...... 182 in that county and one precinct in Socorro County; the conte tee took note ti­ 7 ...... •...... •.•...... •... 63 mony, but appeared by coun el at each sitting of the taking of depositions, and 68 in most every instance cross-examined the witne es. 8 .. ························································································· 9 ...... • ····················································· 267 Every voting p1·eci net in the Territory of New :uexico, in each county, is known 10 ...... 295 by its number. 11 387 In thecountyofValenciayourcommittee think it.i clearly proven that fraud 216 were committed in everal of the precincts, and were uch as to compel your Ps ::::::::::::::::::::: :~·::: ::·:·:·:::·:: ::·:·:·::::·::: :::·:·:·:·: ::::·:·:·:·:·::::::::::::::::::::::::: :::::: 169 committee to throw out the whole vote of said precinct!s; the fraud being so great 14 ...... 161 and the returns so entirely in disregard of law and fair conduct on the part of 15 ···························································································· 12-5 thE'! election officers that it is impossible to separate the good from the bad vote. 16 ·················· ...... 121 Before going into any detail of the evidence your committee will state that 17 ...... 48 the cen us of 1880 shows the whole number of male adults capable of voting in 18 ...... ' ...... 101 that county to be 2,636, while the vote certified and counted for contestee is 28 4,193. 1\Ioreover, while the ce11-ificat6 from that county gave the contestee that 19 ···························································································· 20 ···························································································· 152 remarkable vote, it did not give even one to the contestant, although the returns 87 before them showed he bad received 66 vote . Youx committee deem it appro­ 153 priate to refer the House to the vote for Delegate in Congress of the two political ~ :::~:~::::::::::::::::::.:_:_:_:_::_:_:_:_:::.:_:_:_:_:_:_:_:_:_:_:_:_:_:_:::·:·:·:·:·:·::·:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: 38 parties in this Territory from 1873 to 1882 inclusive, which is as follows, to wit: 2-! ...... ····································:······································ 'lffl Aggregate vote : ' ------Total...... 4,193 ...... •

From which deduct the fraudulent votes as per evidence, which are found to : :::::::::::: :: : :::ii:::t:::::::::::::::::::::::.::::::::i::::::::-;:::::::::::::::::: :: :::::::: be2,357; and under this state of facts, giving the contestee the benefitofthedoubt­ ~ ~: mful and actual votes cast in Valencia County, namely, 1,836, we submit the fol­ 'ee certified returns. l<.Jwing statement, to "vit: 'Ve will now give the Democratic vote received in that county for each of the Whole number of votes returned for contestant as per certified copies of years just named : returns of each county...... 13, 225 Whole number of votes returned for contestee as per certified 1873 ...... 629 copies of returns of each county ...... 14, 644 1875 ·················································································································· 285 From which subtract the illegal and fraudulent vote, as above...... 2, 357 1876 ...... : ...... 521 187 ...... 642 Leaves the vote of contestee ...... 12,287 1880 ...... 373 ~ 1 2, none certified or counted, but the addition shows...... 66 Showing majority for conte tant...... : ...... - 938 It will thus be seen that the vote of 1882 was 4,259, while the largest vote ever polled before in that county was 2,136. It will moreover appear thatdurinoothe ti:fn~~refore your committee recommend the adoption of the following re olu- period referred to, to wit, from 1873 to 1882, the Democratic candidates received Resolved, That Tranq~lino Luna was not.elected a_Delegate to the Forty-eighth the vote a above et forth, and at this election the poll-books showed he re­ ceived 66, but the county board certified him none. These are very pregnant ~~~~~:.-om the Terntory of New Me:nco, and lS not entitled to the seat he evidences of frau_d taken in connection with the evidence, which shows no in­ .Resolv_ed, That Francisco A. Manza~ares was duly elected a D elegate to the crease of populatwn from 1880 to 1882. Forty~Ighth Congress from the Terntory of New Mexico, and is entitled to be Your committee will now proceed to notice several of the preaincts wherein sworn 1n as such. they think the fraud was uch that the pretended vote of each must be thrown out. These are referred to as a fair sample of the rest. The report was adopted . .Precinct No. 2.-At this precinct there were counted and certified for contestee Mr. ROBERTSON moved to reconsider the vote bywhich the report .n9 votes; for contestant 3. The evidence shows that there were only 121 votes was adopted; and also moved that the motion to reconsider he laid on ~~e~~f t~~ ~f:C~~~~er were fictitious names placed on the polL-books by the the table. Precinct No. 3.-There were 381 votes counted for contestee while the evidence The latter motion was agreed to. &-nows only 160 votes were cast; the balance were fictitious.' P!"eeinct No. 4.-seventy votes for contestee and none for contestant. The evi­ On motion of Mr. ROBERTSON, the report was ordered to be printed. dence shows that after the polls were closed the ballot-box was not opened, the 1\fr. FRA .,.CISCO A. MANZANARES then appeared at the Speakers votes were not counted, but ballot-box, tally-sheet , regi tration-list and all were desk and was duly qualified by taking the oath pr cribed by ection ent to the county eat in that condition, nothing certified. ' Precinct No. 10.-The vote certified for contestee was 295 when the evidence 1756 of the Revised tatutes of the United State . show that only 84 votes were cast at that precinct. ' · ORDER OF BUSITESS. Precinct No. 11.-There appear 387 votes certified for contestee, and evidence shows that only about 55 votes were actually cast. . 1\Ir. H TCHINS. Mr. Speaker, I move to dispense with the rnorn­ . Pl"er:j,nct No. 1.-Vote certified for contestee 443, none for contestant; this pre­ m~ hour for the call of committees for the purpose of going into Com <"mct 1 the home of contestee, and the only evidence of fraud is the voters' names being recorded in the poll-books to a great. extent alphabetically as if nuttee of the Whole to further consider the naval approprbtion bill. copi d from some index or registration-list. ' Mr. KEIFER. I ask the gentleman to withhold his motion long Prcdnct No. 14.-Thc vote counted and certified for conte tee was 161 and e,·i- dence show total vote polled at that precinct to be 40. ' enough for me to ask the reference of a bill to the Committee ou Ap- . Your cornn1ittee deem it unnecessary to follow the facts in each particular pre­ propriations. ~ cJr'"t: suffice to ~

~Ir. KEI:J?ER. Mr. Speaker, I ask unanimous consent to take from porate the Texas Pacific Railroad Company: approved March 3, 1871, the Speaker's table House bill N a. 4971, making appropriations for the declaring the forfeiture of the lands granted therein, and for other pur­ support of the Military Academy for the fiscal year ending June 30, poses; which was read a first and second time, referred to the Ho~ 1885, and for other purposes, with Senate amendments thereto, and that Calendar, and, with the accompanying report, ordered to be printed. the same, with said amendments, be referred to the Committee on Ap­ Mr. OATES. I desire, Mr. Speaker, permission to file the report of propna.tions. the minority in connection with the bill just reported from the Com­ Ther~was no objection, and it was ordered aecordingly. mittee on Public Lands. I will file the report during the day, not Mr. HUTCHINS. I now renew my mo~on to dispense with the having had an opportunity of conferring with other gentlemen on the morning hour. committee who may wish to sign it. The SPEAKER. That requires a two-thirds vote. The SPEAKER. There being no objection, the gentleman from Ala­ The House divided; and there were-ayes 88, noes 48. bama will have permission to file the minority report during the day. So (two-thirds not having voted in the affirmative) the motion was UNIFORM SYSTEM OF BA..l\TKRUPTCY. not agreed to. Mr. COLLINS, from the Committee on the Judiciary, reported baek, OBSTRUCTIONS TO NAVIGABLE WATERS. in lieu of House bills 485, 742, 1082, 1055, and 1058, a bill (H. R. 5683) Mr. DUNN, from the Committee on Commerce, reported, in lieu of to establish a uniform system of bankruptcy throughout the United House bills 1754, 2343, and 2913, a bill (H. R. 5681) to provide for the States; which was read a first and second time, referred to the Com­ removal of obstruction to the free navigation of the navigable waters mittee of the Whole Honse on the state of the Union, and, with the ac­ of the United States; which was read a first and second time, referred companying report, ordered to be printed. to the Committee of the Whole House on the state of the Union, and, The SPEAKER. Without objection the other bills will be laid on . with the accompanying report, ordered to be printed. the table under the rule. The SPEAKER. In the ab ence of objection the ot~r bills will be laid upon the table. GEORGE J. TA.NNARD. Mr. RAY, of New Hampshire, from the Committee on Invalid PeD­ NATIONAL 1\ULITARY CEMETERY, SPRINGFIELD, MO. sions, reported baek with amendments the bill (H. R. 2839) to increase :Mr. MORGAN, from the Committee on Military Affairs, reported the pension of George J. Stannard, late a major-general of volunteers; back with amendments the bill (H. R. 3274) making appropriation to which was referred to the Committee of the Whole House on the Pri­ construct a road from the city of Springfield, Mo., to the national mil­ vate Calendar, and, with the aecompanying report, ordered to be itary cemetery; which was referred to the Committee of the Whole printed. House on the state of t.he nion, and with the a-ccompanying report, ROBERT CARRICK. ordered to be printed. ~i:r . MURRAY, from the Committee on Military Affairs, reported ACCOUNTS OF ARMY AND NAVY OFFICER. . baek with an adverse recommendation the bill (H. R. 1536) for there­ l\fr. LAIRD, from the Committee on Military Affairs, reported back lief of Robert Carrick; which was laid on the table. and the accom­ with amendments the bill (H. R. 2388) to authorize the continuance in panying report ordered to be printed. force of an act approved Jnne23, 1870, entitled "An act to continue the aet to authorize the settlement of the aecounts of officers of the Army TELEGRAPH OPERATORS DURING THE WAR. and Navy;' which was referred to the Committee of the Whole House Mr. MURRAY, from theCommitteeonUilitary ..Affairs, also reported, on the state of the Union, and, with the accompanying report, ordered in lieu of House bills 145and 246, a bill (H. R. 5684) for the relief of tel­ to be printed. egraphoperatorsduringthewar; which was read a:fi.nst and second time, referred to the Committee of the Whole House on the state of the Union, HORSE-RAILWAY, DAVENPORT TO ROCK I LAND. and, with the accompanying report, ordered to be printed. Mr. LAIRD, from the Committee on Military Affairs, also reported House bills 145 and 246, having the same title, were laid on the table, back with amendments the bill (H. R. 445) to empower the Secretary and the accompanying report ordered to be printed. of War to permit the establishment, under certain conditions, of a horse-railway upon and over the island of Rock Island and the bridges MARY ANN KING. erected by the United States connecting the cities of Davenport and Mr. ROSECRANS, from the Committee on Military .Affairs, reported Rock Island; which was referred to the House Calendar, and, with the back the bill (H R. 1595) for the relief of Mary Ann King, mother of accompanying report, ordered to be printed. Andrew King, deceased, and moved that the committee be discharged EXCHANGE OF CERTAIN NORTH CAROLINA BONDS. from the further consideration of the same and that it be referred to the Select Committee on Payment of Pensions, Bounty, and Back Pay. Mr. SKINNER, of North Carolina, from the Committee on Indian The motion was agreed to . ..c\Jfairs, reported back with amendments the bill (H. R. 1154) to au­ thorize the exchange of North Carolina bonds now held by the United BOYS E..'II1'LISTED IN THE NAVY. States Government; which was referred to the House Calendar and, Mr. RANDALL, from the Committee on Appropriations, reported with the accompanying report, ordered to be printed. back a letter from the Secretary of the Navy recommending that the NEW YORK INDIAN LANDS, KANSAS. number of boys to be enlisted in the Navy be increased from 750 to 1,000, and moved that the committee be discharged from the further Mr. PERKINS, from the Committee on Indian Affairs, reported back consideration of the same and that it be referred to the Committee on with amendments the bill (H. R. 2047) to provide for the sale of cer­ Naval Affairs. tain New York Indian lands in Kansas; which was referred to the House The motion wa agreed to. Calendar and with the accompanying report, ordered to be printed. TRAINING SHIPS. ISABEL CAl\fPBELL. Mr. RANDALL, from the Committee on Appropriations. also re­ 1\Ir. LEFEVRE, from the Committee on Invalid Pensions, reported ported back a letter from the Secretary of the Navy, in reference to back the bill (H. R. 1171) granting a pension to Isabel Campbell; which building two new training ships, and moved that the committee be dis­ was referred to the Committee of the Whole House on the Private Cal­ charged from the further consideratiOn of the same and that it be re­ endar, and, with the accompanying report, ordered to be printed. ferred to the Committee on Naval Affairs. ANN A M. WEHE. The motion was agreed to. Ur. LEFEVRE, from the Committee on Invnlid Pen ions, also re­ CEMETERY SITE AT KIRWIN, KANS. ported back the bill (H. R.l197) granting a pension to Anna M. Wehe; which was referred to the Committee of the Whole House on the Pri­ Mr. ANDERSON, from the Committee on Public Land , reported vate Calendar, and, with the accompanying report, ordered to be printed. back with a favorable recommendation the bill (H. R. 577) to donate a · cemetery site on the public lands to the dty of Kirwin, in the State of ELIZABETH BAUER. Kansas; which was referred to the Committee of the Whole House on Mr. LE FEVRE, from the Committee on Invalid Pensions, also re­ the state of the Union, and with the oocompanying report, ordered to ported back the bill (H. R. 1403) granting a pension to Elizabeth Bauer; be printed. which was referred to the Committee of the Whole House on the Private NAVAL APPROPRIATION BILL. Calendar and, with the accompanying report, ordered to be printed. Mi·. HUTCHIN . I move that the House resolve itself into Com­ DAVID W. STOCKSTILL. mittee of the Whole House on the state of the Union for the further Mr. GEDDES, from the Committee on War Claims, reported ba{!k the consideration of the naval appropriation bill. bill (H. R. 4962) for the relief of David W. Stockstill; which was re­ The motion -was agreed to. ferred to the Committee of the Whole House on the Private Calendar, The House accordingly resoh·ed itself into Committee of the Whole and, with the accompanying report, ordered to be printed. House on the state of the Union, Mr. CoXVERSE in the chair. The CHAIRMAN: The House is in Committee of the Whole Honse NEW ORLE..L~S, BATON ROUGE AND VICKSBURG RAILROAD COMPANY. on the state of the Union, and resumes the consideration of the bill (H. M:r. LEWIS, from Committee on the Public Lands, reported, as a R. 4716) making appropriations for the naval service for the fiscal year substitute for so much of H. R. 292 as refers to the forfeitru:e of the ending June 30, 1885, and for other purposes. The question pending land grant to the New Orleans, Baton Rouge and Vicksburg Railroad is upon the amendment offered by the gentleman from Tennessee [Mr Company, a bill (H. R. 1682) to repeal section 22 of the oot to incor- McMILLIN] which the Clerk will report. 1884. · CONGRESSIONAL RECORD- HOUSE. 1623

The Clerk read as follows: that it may prepare, print, and circulate suitable documents illustrating the ~ sues which distmguish the Republican party from any other and may meet all Add at the end of the amendment adopted, at the end of line 38, the following: proper expenses incident to the campaign the committee feels authorized to ap­ "That the number of captains shall be reduced to thirty, and the number of ply to all citizens whose principles or interests are involved in the struggle: Un­ commanders be reduced to fifty, and no more promotions shall be made to der the circumstances in which the country finds itself placed the committee these grades until the numbers are reduced below the numbers herein men­ believes that you will esteem it both a privilege and a pleasure to make to its rtioned." fund a contribution, which it is hoped may not be less tha.n $-. The commit­ The CHAIRMAN. The House has limited debate on the pending tee is authorized to state that such voluntary contribution from persons em­ ployed in the service of the United States will not be objected to in any official .clause of the bill and amendments thereto to fifteen minutes. The Chair quarter. recognizes the gentleman from New York [Mr. HUTCHINS] in charge The labors of the committee will affect the result of the Presidential election -of the bill. in 1884 as well as the Congressional struggle; and it may therefore reasonably hope to have the sympathy and assistance of all who look with dread upon the Mr. HUTCHINS. I yield five minutes~ my colleague from New possibility of the restoration of the Democratic party to the control of the Gov­ York [M:r. Cox]. ernment·. Mr. COX, of New York. If I understand, Mr. Chairman, the scope Please make prompt and fA.>orable response to this letter by bank check or draft or postal money-order, payable to the order of .Jay A. Hubbell, acting of the amendment of my friend from Tennessee, it is to cut down the treasurer, P. 0. lock-box 589, Washington, D. C. number of supernumeraries now in our Navy. At least it has that ef­ By order of the committee. fect to some extent. In that connection I desire to call the attention D. B. HE~'"DERSON, &.cretary. of the committee to a statement which is veritable as to the number of Mr. HUTCHINS. I now yield five minutes to the gentleman from naval officers who ha>e been around Washington city since 1868. My New Jersey [M:r. McADoo]. .colleague on the Committee on Naval .Affairs, the gentleman from Illi­ Mr. JI.IcADOO. Mr. Chairman, it seems to me that this question of .nois [Mr. THOMAS], has already told the House how many are on sea­ the staff and line officers of the Navy, and the question of consolidating service, how many are on land-service, how many are waiting orders. the bureaus of the Navy Department, and the other minor questioM He obtained this information from official sources. He showed to this which have been brought up in this debate, ought all to be subordinated. House that there was a great need of cut1ing down this enormous sur­ to the great question whether we shall build up a navy or not. plusage. The history of the American Navy from the days of its pristine But look at the number of these naval officers around Washington glory to its present humiliating condition is a step from the sublime to city. In the year 1868, ofthe line there were 20, of staff officers42; a the ridiculous. I have before me the letters of Sir Charles Napier on total of 62. In the year 1870 there were line officers 57, staff officers The Navy: Its Past and Present State (London, 1851). He said in 1816 46; a total of 103. In 1872 there were 47 line officers and 45 staff offi­ that the English navy of that day could not contend with the Ameri­ .cers; a total of 92. In 1875 there were 47 line officers and 44 staff can Navy. Let me read from him: officers; a total of 91. In 1882 there were 91 line officers and 53 staff They- officers; a total of 144. Last year, 1883, we had 113line officers and 56 The English ship15- .staff officers, making a total of 169 as the number of officers on duty in would have beat a French or Spanish ship who were worse than themselves, Washington city; showing an increase since 1868that is perfectly enor­ but I will stake my existence had an American line-of-battle ship fallen in with Jnous. one-half of them they would have been taken. No man can justify the keeping up of this great service without at And again: the same time increasing the force of our ironclads or our cruisers. Things are now changed. We have an enemy (for though at peace I coni!idel· There we may take issue. The gentleman from Iowa, Mr. KASSON, I America our bitterest enemy), I fear, as courageous as ourselves, and one who think it was, made a strong speech here, in which he said he believed will have the advantage over us as long as their Navy keep in proportion to every man who knew anything of the history of mankind of late years their population or rather as long as it is so much inferior to ours as to oblige believed there were only two ways of either keeping the peace or making them to act upon the defensive. war-Blut undEisen, as he called it, which, translated. into the vernacu­ He also reluctantly admits the superiority of our officers and men. lar, means, I suppose, blood and iron. And yet, at the same time, the We had, it eems, at that time the finest navy in the world; But gentleman sneered at the conduct of the Democracy on this bill. Why, to-day the American humorists are all poking fun at our officers, and sir, the gentleman refers to Bismarck, the grand vizier of German tyr­ saying that a young lieutenant who recently married a great heiress can .anny, the man who insults republics, and the gentleman quotes him here now plug up the holes in his ship at his own expense before going to as our model. I thought the Republican party of late years were recom­ sea. That is the condition of our Navy to-day. mending the am·icabilia of arbitration as the way of settling disputes This side of the House is not responsible for the present condition of among nations. our Navy. The dominant party in this land had ten years in which to And now, instead of treaties, instead of commissions, instead of ami­ build up the Navy. It spent 385,000,000onit. I venture to say that cable modes, we are commended by the elegant gentleman from Iowa, the English people have not spent as much in proportion for their navy by the elegant diplomat who was once in Germany, to the mode of as we have, and that for an excuse for one in the worm-eaten cheese­ blood and iron. The gentleman from Iowa postpones the millennium, boxes that ·are d..isoorneing our flag, parading it before the nations of the which was intended to usber in another and a somewhat better era, for earth. the era of blood and iron, not the era of civilization, when better days If we need a navy, and I think we need a moderate and fair navy hall dawn for mankind. to keep together our admirable corps of officers and men, the great qu~ ­ Gentlemen on the other ide haye reproached our side of the House be­ tion is, How shall we get it? In what manner shall we build up this cause we do not at once vote their adllitional seven cruisers; yet for ten navy? Shall it be by the contract system, or in our own nary-yards? years of legislative life they themselves failed to do so. The Forty-sev­ What kind of ships shall we have? enth Congress never touched the matter, except to begin the construction I want to impress upon this House the fact that all naval architect­ .of four cruisers, and we are following out that policy thus far. During ure is groping in the dark. The nations of the earth could to-dary, with the ten years when gentlemen of the other side had power here they advantage to themselves, pass around the hat, a.s it were, and take up did not do anything to enhance or improve the Navy. a contribution for the purpose of enabling two great naval powen; to I know that they did a great deal to draw money from the employes engage in wa.r in order to demonstrate how far naval architecture and in the navy-yards. I hold here an assessment circular of the Repub­ the science of explosives have advanced. lican committee, signed by my good friend from Iowa [D. B. HENDER­ The Committee on Appropriations of this House have been criticised SON], who levied these contributions on the employes. because they have not appropriated money to continue the buildin~ of The CHAIRMAN. The time of the gentleman has expired. the monitors. I think in that they have done wisely. I hold in my Mr. BROWNE, of Indiana. I would ask the gentleman from New hand the official journal of the Army and the Navy, a respectable news­ York [Mr. Cox] if that is the same &."'Sessment which he referred to six paper, representing both arms of the service. I find in the current num­ or eight times last year? ber of that journal an article which I will ask the Clerk to read, and Mr. COX, of New York. Yes; and I will refer to it until I die. request that the time taken up in its reading shall no~ be taken from Mr. BROWNE, of Indiana. It is the same one? me. ~Ir. COX, of New York. Yes; and every-time I shoot it off at you The CHAIR-IAN. The time required for the reading of the article you duck under. [Laughter.] I ask consent to print with my remarks must be taken out of the gentleman's time. the assessment circular to which I have referred. Mr. McADOO. Then I ask leave to print it with my remarks. There was no objection. [The article referred to is as follow : The cil'cular is as follow : The thickness of the armor of the 1\Iiantonomoh consists of a single plate 1 inches thick, the latter [the Inflexible] consisting of two plates together 24. inches [Jay A. Hubbell, chairman; D. B. H enderson, secretary; executive committee, thick. , Hon. W. B. Allison, Hon. Eugene Hale, Bon. Nelson W. Aldrich, Hon. Frank Hiscock, Hon. George I. Robeson. Hon. William 1\fcKinley,jr., Hon. George Sir Thoma~t Brassey, in his great work, The British Navy, furnishes elaborate R. Davis, Hon. Horatio G. Fisher, Hon. Horace F. Page, Hon. W. H. Calkins, tables showing the penetrating power of the guns of the royal navy. Refer­ l-Ion. Thoma Ryan, Hon. William D. Washburn, Ron. L. C. Houk, Hon. R. ri_ng ~o the~e tabl~s, it will be seen that the 9-ton 8-inch caliber gun is cnpable of T. Van Horn, l-Ion. Orlando Hubbs.] . p1ercmg 7-tnch th1ck wrought armor, and that t11e modeTate caliber of 1()-inch and 18-ton weight penetra.tesl2-inch thick armor; while the 16-incb caliber 0-ton HEADQUARTERS OF THE ' gun of the Inflexible pierces armor plates of 22-inch thickne -·. TLe 7-inch armor REPUBLICAN Co"8GRESSIONAL Co!llMITTEE, 1882, of the Miantonomoh i therefore vulnerable· to all cla es of British ironclads 520 THIRTF..ENTH STREET, NORTHWEST, the majority of whose guns will put their projectiles clean through both 8-ides of Washi ilgton, D . C., May 15, 1882. such turret ,·essels. In the face of this fact theNary Depart. men ten rn(',.;l !v r E-('om­ SIR: This committee i- organized for the protecti of the interests of theRe­ mends their completion, "as they will provide floating harbor del'eu,;t_·,. 'i·u tli;c•ic nt IPublican part.y in e.ach f the Congre."'Sional districts of the Union. In order for pre nt p•trposes, and may justify us in further postponin:;:- tlw o.:onst1·u <: tiotl. 1624 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. MARCH 5, of any such expensive broadside armored ships ashav~soheavil~bu_rd~ned the float them with honor to the country. It would take twenty years ro treasuries of other nations." The sum asked for the ~d completiOn IS, m round numbers $3 598 000 which if granted by Congress, will be worse than wasted, as reorganize, once disbanded, such a body as we have to-day. There are the only ~eshlt~ill 'be to hill the nation into false security. It is indisputable that thousands of able, brave, patriotic American sailors in our Navy who­ a conpie of firsfr.class ironclads can send the whole fleet of the overrated'' harbor­ would shed glory upon our flag in any emergency. defense monitors" to the bottom. Congress, instead of a.dopting the "ear1?-est" recommendation of theNavy Department, should forthWith order.the unfiniShed Let us build the Navy from the bottom upward on solid foundationsr monitors to be disposed of, and suitable harbor-defense vessels built for the three but above all, in the light of past events, let us be sure we build it hon­ and three-quarter millions saved. . . estly. The Democratic party can safely go to the country if it is retarded The cost of the Miantonomoh thus far is given !iS $1,219,~84.26; ortgmal cost of the vessel, 51,190,852.84; repairs, $28,931.42.. She IS now lymg a~ the Brooklyn in building a navy by a well-founded distrust of public servants over­ navy-yard where the building of her turret frames and alteratiOn to the hull whom they have no control. will be pr~ceeded with in a short time. Proposals for her steel plates have been The CHAIRMAN. The time of the gentleman has expired. advertised for, and the plans and specifications f?r the work ~ave been com­ pleted iii detail by the naval Bureau of ConStructiOn and Repau.] Mr. l\IcADOO. I ask leave to print additional remarks. There was no oQjection, and leave was granted accordingly. I want to say this about it: there is a diagram accompanying the 1t1r. HUTCHINS. I yield two minutes to the gentleman from Mary­ article showing the strength and thickness of the armor of ~he Eng~h land [l\Ir. TALBOTT]. Inflexible and of the Miantonomoh of our Navy. The article, as Will 1\Ir. TALBOTT. 1t1r. Chairman, I wish merely to say that this be seen, says that t he ordinary guns of the English navy, the or?Jnary attack upon the line and staff of the Navy is in my judgment unwar­ rifled cannon of the English navy, can penetrate through both s1des of ranted. In respect to our Navy, we are in exactly the same crmdition the armor of our hlp, the l\fiantonomoh, on which we have spent a large as eyery other nation of the world that is at peace. We have a number sum of money. Gentlemen say 1-:here is a popula~ demand for a n~vy of naval officers who are enjoying themselves and drawing pay, and I and that it must be met by building a fleet of crmsers and completing do not blame them. We have in the service a class of gentlemen who these monitors before either has been tested. are as brave as any in the world-who are perfectly willing to enjoy Now, sir, with regard to these ~ers I am a?:aid n;tembers may be themselves now in time of peace, but willing also to be shot to pieces i:n misled. Steel cruisers sound foriDldable, but m reality these ves els defense of this nation if any emergency requiring it should arise. I are to be but steel shells which can be as readily penetrated by pro­ am tired of all this nonsense, this everlasting attack upon the line and jectiles as a tin box by a bullet of sufficient calibre. Now, again, the staffofthe Navy. This is alliwanttosay. argument that they can prey on commerce and run away from an enemy Mr. HUTCHL'TS. I yield the residue of my time to the gentleman is doubtful when we reflect that foreign governments, under a subsidy from Illinois [~fT. THOMAS]. system alien to our institutions, have fine mercantile ships, like the Mr. TH0~1AS. In the very short time conceded to me by the gentle­ Alaska and Oreaon and hundreds of others, that, with slight alterations, man from New York [l\I.r. HuTCHINs], for which I thank him, I can at her best ca: meet our will-be Chicago and, with better guns, ad- say only a word or two upon three or four topics, each of w hlch deserves Tantage her in fight and on~ her in speed. . . at least half an hour. Sir because we need a navy 1s no argument for runmng mto the net It has been stated time and again that the monitors now in course of .fa~orite contractors and scheming politicians. Let us at least test of construction and in an incomplete condition will not float. I assert the cruisers we are now building before we contract for more. Our here that no respectable engineer can be found from one end of the highest naval officers have condemned in advance. t he Chlcag~; the country to the other who if he knows anything about the subject will leading English engineers have <:>ndemned her e~gmes. Even if s~e deny that those monitors are the best vessels of their class in the world, meets the best wishes of her proJectors she can Slmply make a credit­ and if completed according to the present plan will be the most effective able display, wl;J.ile of doubtful utility.. As the gentleman from Ne-yv war vessels for our harbor and coast defenses that could be devised by York [Mr. Cox] said the ot.her day, th1s 1s the ag~ of guns. The ship mortal man. . is but the gun-carrier; all depends on the gun earned. We are utterly I am tired of hearing this unfounded statement that these vessels. behind in the matter of guns; ours are antedated. The old smooth­ will not float. The· Puritan, the largest of the class, has been attacked bores bear the same relation to the monster rifled cannon of recent date time and again by the newspapeN bent upon breaking down the Ameri­ as the old flint-lock shotgun to the modern Winchester rifle. Let us, can Navy. The charge has been reiterated that she would not float. if we must have a navy, begin first to build guns. Then, with good Sir, when launched by the builder she floated sixteen inches higher­ guns, let us under favorable auspices and honest gov~~ent ~uild ves­ than the specifications called for, showing that she had that much more sels that can go outside andy Hook to thunder therr rron hail on the buoyancy than had been anticipated. sides of a Lepanto or a Duilio and receive in return their fire unscathed. As to the new cruisers, it was stated here yesterday that they are To-day we are at the mercy of almost every power, and spend more wholly ineffective as vessels of war. The statementisnot true. They than most. A glance a.t the following table is instructive. are the best vessels that modern skill and experience have brought for­ The navies of the world. ward, and armed with high-power guns they would J:>e most eff~tive [Compiled from official documents.] against the largest ironclads of the world. The question to-day 18 not .... a question of ships but a question of guns. If these cruisers are armed '0 0 with proper guns, they can wit hout fear meet in single combat any ves­ ~aj ell ..... sel of any nation in the world. Countries. ~ell l~ Sir, the question is not one of armor; for no armor can be put upon ~~ ~a z~ vessels which can not be pierced by modern guns. Hence the question z arises how little armor we can put on our war vessels, and what other means we can employ to make our vessf'ls buoyant. Following this Argentine Republic ...... •...... '1:7 991 $550,439 Austria-Hungary ...... •...... 68 6,369 4,633,669 idea these vessels have been built with water-tight and air-tight com­ Belgium ...... 10 172 part~ents, so that they may be pierced t~ongh and t~ough, and. still 4, 984 Brazil ...... • 41 ····5;898;132 be as buoyant as they were in the first msta?-ce; while heavy rro~­ Canada (Dominion) ...... 7 Chili...... 23 ...... (468" :::::::::::::::::: clads if once pierced, as they can be, by the high-power guns now m China ...... •...... •..•....•...... 56 use ~ould go to the bottom as quickly as solid shot. There is no in­ ··············· ·····i;ooo;ooo telligent naval officer in our service or in the service of any foreign 1,383,940 government who would not prefer to go to war in one .of these new ····48;283· ···32;267;498 steel cruisers to going to war in any ironclad of anynavym the world; 15, 815 9, 722, 721 for these cruisers are more effective than any other war vessels. 58,800 51,607,175 &52 1, 056, 536 The statement that the Chief Constructor of the Navy bas said these 16,~40 9, 2Z7, 132 vessels are a failure is a misstatement. He did not say anything of the 5, 551 3, 015, 000 kind. He said that they could be improved in some particulars; and when we reach the proper stage in the consideration of this bill, I pro­ pose to offer an amendmep.t which will, I think, improve them vastly, ······3;569· ····1)m;ru as it will substitute full sail power for two-thirds sail power, as pro­ 530 posed, and will substitute a telescopic smoke-.stack for the standing 30,194 """i9:268;755 one, thus enabling the vessels to employ full sail power. 15,179 6,429, 163 [Here the hammer fell.] 5925 1,424, 250 23:000 2,816,000 The CHAIR IA..t.~. The question is upon the amendment of the 11,115 ]5,686,671 gentleman from Tenne ee [l\I.r. McMILLIN], which will be read. 200 •••••..•.. •• ..•.•• The Clerk read as follows: Add to the paragraph as amended the following: It is well to remember in connection with this table that our one hun­ "That the number of captains hall be reduced to thirty, and the number of commanders be reduced to fifty; and no more promotions shall be ~ade to dred and thirty-nineve elsinclude, excepting the Trenton (woo4en), not these grades until the numbers are reduced below the n111mber herem men­ one really first-class ship, while navies having less vessels in number are tioned." vastly superi01· in quality. . . . Mr. HUTCHIN . If I may be indulged a moment I will say that. 1 a.m in favor of keeping together, even under these discouragmg crr­ this matter was considered by the committee, who concluded-- cnmstance the hest part of our officers and men until we have ships to The CHAIRMAN. Debate is exhausted. 1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 1625

Mr. IDSOOCK. I move to amend the amendment by adding the word "none" for "one-half." It would also defeat the proposition clause which I send to the desk. inserted in reference to the staff. ·rn other words, the effect would be, The Clerk read as follows: so far as this Committee of the Whole House on the state of the Union Prooided, That reductions in the grades of captain and commander may be is concerned, to leave the_question precisely where it was, at one-half made by voluntary retirement, and that those officers so retired shall receive of the line and staff. the same pay on the retired-list as do those officers of t.he staff with whom they Let me go further and inquire whether when that comes to be re­ have assimilated rank. ported to the House are we not entitled to a vote by the yeas and nays Mr. THOMAS. I suggest that in order to perfect this amendment on the change of the word ''none '' for ' 1 one-half.'' the word " relative" should be substituted for the word " assimi­ Mr. CALKINS. We would have that benefit if it is stricken ont. lated." Mr. RANDALL. I mean striking out the portion of the bill indi­ 1 The question being taken on Mr. HiscocK'S amendment to the amend­ cated would not bring us to a naked vote on the ubstitution of ' none , ' ment, it was not agreed to; there being-ayes 59, noes 64. for 1 1 one-half.'' - Mr. HOPKINS. I move to amend the amendment by adding the Mr. CALKINS. If stricken out the vote would be on the substan­ following: tive proposition. Provided, however, That such officers !!hal!~~ re?red witl? the s~e pay as if Mr. RANDALL. If we adopt this it will have the effect of striking r tired from age, or from wounds or disabilities mcurred m the hoe of duty. out, as I have already said, what we put in yesterday. The question I understand discu ion is exhausted. is presented to the House, it seems to me, by striking out everything The CHAIRUAN. Debate is exhausted. done yesterday but the substitution of t he word" none" for ' 1 one­ The question being taken on the amendment of Mr. HOPKIN , there half.'' were, on a division-ayes 44, noes 61. Mr. CALKINS. I think the proposition might be divisible in the Mr. THO.UfAS. No quorum has voted. House, but I do not know about that. But that is not material, Qe­ The CHAIRMAN. The Chair will appoint as tellers Mr. HoPKINS cause, the proposition having beenamended, it is nowin order to strike and Mr. THOMAS. out, although in striking out we may include words which have already The committee divided; and the tellers reported-ayes 46, noes not been inserted. counted. Mr. TALBOTT. Let me ask the gentleman from Indiana if that is Mr. THOMAS. I do not ask for a further count. stricken out if it will not leave the law as it is provided under the act The amendment to the amendment was rejected. of August 5, 1882? Ur. McMILLIN's amendment was then disagreed to. ~1r . 1 CALKINS. Yes, ir. Mr. CALKINS. I now move to strike out all after the word ' here­ Mr. THOMAS. I beg the gentleman's pardon; the act of 1883 will after,'' in line 31 of the bill, including all the amendments which have be in force. been adopted, and in lieu thereof to submit a substitute. Mr. TALBOTT. Yes, sir; March, 1883. The CHAIRMAN. The Clerk will first report the portion of the bill Mr. THOl\fAS. Under the act of August 5, 1882, promotions were proposed to be stricken out. prohibited; but the act of 1883 provided for one promotion for eTery The Clerk read as follows: two vacancies. None of the vacancies in the various 2rades in the line and in the staff corps ~fr. TALBOTT. That is it. of the Navy shall be filled by promotion until such grades shall be reduced to the numbers fixed for the several grades of the line and staff corps of the Navy Mr. THO~fA.S. Now, the triking out of this provision will leave the by the act of August 5, 1882, making appropriations for the naval service for the law of 1883 in force, and also cut out the reduction made by the adop­ fiscal year ending June 30, 1883, and for other purposes. tion of the amendment on yesterday. The President of the United States is hereby directed, on the 1st of July,1884, or as soon thereafter as practicable, to reduce the staff corps of the Navy on the Mr. HUTCHINS. I twill be a reversal of the action of the collli11t­ active-list as follows: 1\Iedical directors, from fifteen to five; medical inspectors, tee on yesterday. from fifteen to five; pay directors, from thirteen to five; pay inspectors, from Mr. CALKINS. On one branch only. thirteen to five; chief engineers, from seventy to fi.ft.y, by selecting from the The CHAIRMAN. The Chair does not believe that the point of or­ said grades such of the officers as can best be spared from the service~ and placing them on the retired-list with the rank they shall respectively bola at the time der was made against the amendment. of retirement; and after the number of officers in the said grades shall be re­ Mr. CALKINS. No, sir; not against this. duced as above provided, the number in each grade shall not exceed the re­ duced number which is fixed by the provisions of this paragraph for the several The CHAIRMAN. The question is on the adoption of the amend- grades: Provided, That the highest relative rank of chief engineer shall be lieu­ ment proposed by the gentleman from Indiana. tenan~mmander. The committee divided; and there were-ayes 66, noes 64. The CHAIRMAN. The Clerk will now report the sub titute moved Mr. Ucl\fiLLIN. Let us have tellers. . by the gentleman from Indiana. Mr. HOLMAN. No quorum has voted. The Clerk read as follows: The CHAIRMAN. The point of order being made that no quorum That a special joint committee, to consist of three Senators to be designated has voted, the Chair will appoint tellers. by the President of the Senate, and four Representatives to be designated by Mr. McMILLIN and Mr. CALKINS were appointed tellers. the Speaker of the House, be appointed to consider the present condition of the Navy, and who eduty it shall be to report at the next session of Congress some The committee 3.oo-ai.n divided; and the tellers reported-ayes 88, plan of organization to meet the exigencies of the service and to give stability noes 65. to the system of law regulating the same, and avoid the necessity of special and So (no further count being demanded) the amendment was agreed to. personal legislation in regard thereto. Mr. THO~IAS. I offer the amendment I send to the desk, to come Mr. McMILLIN. I make the point of order that changes exi ting in after the word dollars, in line 31 . Ia.w and does not retrench expenditure. The Clerk read as follows : Mr. REED. I would like the gentleman to state wherein it changes Provided, That the pay and allowance of officers of the same rank and rela­ the existing law. tive rank in the line and staff shall be the same, and shall be governed by the Mr. McMILLIN. It creates a commission which the law does not pa~ and allowance of officerli1 of the 1\farine C<>rps of corresponding rank. now recognize. Mr. RANDALL. I reserve the point of order upon that amendment. Mr. REED. It creates a commission for the purpose ·of inquiring I would like to have the gentleman explain what it is. whether a change should be made, and that is alL It does not change The CHAIRMAN. By order of the House all debate upon the pend­ any law. . ing clause and amendments thereto has been closed. Mr. McMILLIN. Does that board exist by law now? l\fr. R.A.NTI.A.LL. Then I make the point of order that it is new leg­ Mr. REED. It is a joint committee of both Houses. islation and does not on its face retrench expenditures. Still I want an Mr. McMILLIN. But a joint committee which does not exist by explanation from the gentleman, if he is permitted to give it. law now, for in this act you provide for its creation. Mr. THOMAS. I ask unanimous consent to make a statement as to Mr. REED. But the power to create it exists in the Senate and the the charay re­ Mr. HUTCHINS. I reserve the point of order on that motion. ceives 1,500 more pay on hore-dutythan the man who commands the Mr. RA1~DALL. I wish to call the attention of the gentleman from ship. And so, also, with reference to payma ters. It is high time, si.r, Indiana to the fact that if his motion be agreed to by the House it in my judgment, to regulate the pay-table of the Navy and put all oi would reverse all that was done yesterday as to the ub. titution of the our officers upon the same 1ooting-that i. to say, all commande• , ----- 1626 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD'-HOUSE. MARcn .5,. whether of the line or staff, shall receive the same pay as is accorded to Mr. CALKINS. I yield two minutes to the gentleman from Ken­ -officers of the Army; that captains shall receive the same pay, whether tucky, reserving time in which to reply. -of the line or staff, as in the Army, -and also with lieutenants. There Mr. WHITE, of Kentucky. The letter continues: is no reason whatever for a difference between the pay of officers of sim­ The law of 1882 reduced the 288 engineers to 170, which is the present legal ilar grades in the Army and Navy. Now, in the Army line and staff allowance-a totally inefficient number-which has to be increased by the em­ ployment of machini t on the vessels whose names do not appear on the Regis­ -officers of the same rank receive exactly the same pay, and I respect­ ter, but whose large pay appears on the paymasters' rolls. fully suggest that it is about time we should bring into our legislation The present insane attempt to reduce the number of engineers and their posi­ the same state of affairs with reference to the Navy, and equalize the tion is greatly to the detriment of the naval service, and results from o. most irrational jealousy on the part of the line officers. I sincerely trust that Con­ pay of officers of similar rank. gress can discriminate between the motive of all this personal legislation a nd This amendment proposes to accomplish that result. It will not cost the propriety of it,. .anything in addition to the present expenditures, for the reason that I read also the following; the staff officers of the Navy are not allowed to reach above a certain When you asked him if the staff officers are not exposed to the same dangers point, and therefore they can not draw as much pay as officers of the aslineofllcershe aid, "Oh,no." Now, sir, thatisnotso,fortherearealwaystwo line who attain to this high rank; and the effect of this amendment, if engineers on deck in battle, one at the bell-pull and one at the fire-hose. In the battle of Port Royal one engineer was instantly killed and another dangerously .adopted, will be to equalize the pay all along the line without any wounded on one ship; so they are not only exposed to the same danger on deck increase of expenditures. as line officers, but are liable to be scalded to death below by shot entering the Mr. RANDALL. I must insist upon the point of order. boilers. Take the case of the ltichmond and Oneida, in the Mississippi River, and hundreds of other cases. I have no doubt there were more engineers killed The CHAIRMAN. The Chair is of opinion that the point of order than line officers. As to the table that there were more line officers in 1842 than is well taken. staff officers, you must remember there were no steamers then. Now engineers Mr. THOMAS. Will the Chair be kind enough to state the grounds d esign and superintend the building of engines and ships, and the ships of to­ -on which the amendment is held to be out of order? day are vast steam-machines, requiring men of ability t-o manage them. ltlr. RANDALL. I make the point of order for the reason that the I desire to say to the gentleman from Indiana that that appears to .amendment is new legislation, and is not shown to be in the line of. me quite a sufficient answer to the tatement he made a few days ago. retrenchment. The gentleman himself admit.s that it raises certain Mr. CALKINS. I hold in my hand a letter from the Secretary of salaries. the Navy, in which the information with reference to the line officers Mr. THOMAS. It raises some and redu~ others. in 1842 is given to the Senate Committee and also to t he Committee on The CHAIRMAN. The Chair is of opinion that it changes the law Appropriation<; of the House. A reference to it will show I was en­ .and does not reduoe expenditures. The Clerk will read. tirely accurate in my statement. The Clerk read as follows: Now, I want to congratulate the committee that so far as personal legislation is concerned with reference the staff and the line it has For pay of the retired-list, namely: For forty-three rear-admirals, twenty to .commodores, eleven captains, twelve commanders, sixteen Ueutenant-com­ been stricken out of the bill already. But I want to say to the friend manders,twenty-seven lieutenants, seven ensigns, twenty-two medical directors, of my friend from Kentucky, that ju t such agitation as this, just such two medical inspectors, four surgeons, five passed assi.stant surgeons, seven as­ remarks as tho e contained in the letter which has been read, have kept sistant surgeons, nine pay directors, two pay inspectors, four paymasters, two the line and the staff constantly fomenting and fermenting. I would J>assed assistant p aymasters1 one assistant paymaster, eleven chief engineers, twenty passed assistant engmeers, twenty-six as.

small boat under fire at Fort Fisher and conveyed the wounded off to the ship, introduced here, nearly every clause in this appropriation bill has been .and another was himself wounded severely in the same adion; one commanded ..a gunboat in the action in Roanoke Sound; one was in tantly killed with his devoted to striking a blow at some part ofthe naval service. It seems {l()mmanding officer on the monitor Catskill off Fort Sumter while acting as to me that the effect of the legislation here proposed is to tear down ignal officer; one brought from Brazil the news of the capture of the Florida; and destroy, instead of to improve and build up, the American Navy. -one commanded the powder di"\"ision of the Kearsarge when she captured the Alabama; and it was a frequent custom for that important division of ships in Let us look at this matt.er of the personnel of the Navy. I believe it action to be in charge of the paymaster and his clerk throughout the late civil is claimed by the gentlemen who are in the habit of deriding our naval war. The losses of the Pay Corps by shipwreck include every vessel lost at sea, establishment that we have nothing left but the personnel of the Navy. the latest examples being the ill-fated Oneida and Huron·, and of those now on the active-list not less than five have been wrecked at sea. I desire tQ say to them that while we have that left we have the most IL is not a fact that the duties of pay officers are imply clerical. They com­ important part of a naval establishment. bine all the functions of the Quartermaster's, Commissary's, and Pay Depart­ Gentlemen seem to think that we can strike from the rolls and put ments of the Army, and require in one single naval corps the same integrity, bu ine knowledge, and varied experience as tho e three army corps do. out of the service the officers who have been educated throngh years of faithful devotion to duty and through an unprecedented experience in :L\fr. THOMAS. The rea on for offering thi amendment is this: the peace and in war, and that when the time shall come that we may need present appropriation for the retired-list oftheN a vy amounts to $713,450. them to maintain the honor and glory of the nation as they have in the I have given some time to the investigation of that reth·ed-list, as well past we can contract to be furnished with naval officers as we may con­ :as of the active-list. of the Navy. I find that under the law now when tract to he furnished with guns and with ships. I desire to impress upon ..an officer comes up for promotion if he fails to show himself either this House the fallacy of that idea. We can not afford to ignore the fact morally, phy ically, or }lrofessionally fitted for promotion he goes on that we have no longer a splendid merchant ma1ine from which to call .the retired-list. He is r6ported against if found deficient in any one of the trained and skilled seamen that might be needed to officer and man those requirements, and then, without regard to his age, in tead of be­ a large naval force in time of emergency. l.ng kept on the active-list to perform duty, be is shoved off on there­ The most important thing which the American Congress can do to­ -tired-list. day, in the depleted and disorganized condition of our naval service, is There are any number of officers to be found on the retired-list to-day to retain the officers who know howto man and sail and tofightanavy young men who were placed there some because they were drunkards, when we shall build one. others because their moral character was such as to disqua1 ify them for Mr. Chairman, there is another element involved in this discussion. .promotion. Without having any other disability than that which they There is an element of fair play and justice involved here. I find on have brought upon themselves by their own immorality, by their lack the one side propositions to cut down sweepingly whole sections of the -of attention to their profession, they are shoved off on the retired-list staff department of the Navy, and on the other to reduce by dozens and .and pensioned at two-thirds of their full pay. bythirtiesvarious grades ofthe line corps oftheNavy. I submit, Mr. I tell you thatthisretired-listougbtto beweeded out. At least one­ Chairman, that it is not seemly; it is not proceeding decently and in third of the offi

means if there is so much need of economy that we must turn adrift Mr. RANDALL. I reserve the point of order. men ~ho have given the very flower ~nd fruit of their lives to ~he Mr. WARNER, of Ohio. Mr. Chairman, we have heard a good deal count1:y's service, it should be done ~th some. kind of syste~, ~th during the discussion of this bill about the officers of the Navy. I some kind of deliberation and thoughtfulness, With some sort of Justice would like to say a word about the seamen and enlisted men in the ....omen who by steadfast devotion and glorious achievements deserve naval service, the men who, when the conflict comes, are expected to better of us than would seem to be the disposition of the Honse, so far hold the deck and man the guns. us disclosed in this discussion. I should like to inquire, first, ofthe gentleman in charge of the bill Mr. ADAUS, of Illinois. 111r. Chairman, I have sent to the desk an how many of this class there are and what is meant in the bill by '' ea­ amendment to the amendment. I ask that it be read. men, ordinary seamen, landsmen, and boys?" Who are-included in Mr. KASSON. I think I must now insist on my point of order. the word "landsmen?" I find no such class 41. the Naval Register, The CHAIRMAN. The Chair will direct the amendment to the but I find in the Official Register 3,600 men reported as on duty at our· amendment, as sent up by the gentleman from illinois [Mr. AD.AMS], navy-yards and naval stations, serving in various capacities. Are these to be read for the information of the Committee of the Whole. the "landsmen " referred to in the bill? They seem to be appropriated. The Clerk read as follows: for nowhere else, and so I suppose they are included here. St.rike out all after the word "for," in the sixth line, and insert "disabilities Mr. HUTCHINS. They are men who are enlisted, but not skilled arising out of the intemperate or immoral habits of such officers shall be sailors. tricken therefrom." nir. WARNER, of Ohio. These 3,600 men employed at navalyards Mr. R4-NDALL. I insist that the point of order be now considered and naval stations-civil employes I should think they were-and 200· and decided. in the CoaSt Survey service, and 700 boys, and it leaves but about 3 500 The CHAIRMA~. The gentleman from Iowa [Mr. KAssoN] makes · seamen and enlisted men in the naval ervice proper. That makes one· a point of order, which he will st.a.te. officer to every two, or at most three, seamen or enlisted men in this :M:r. KASSON. I call the attention of my friend from Pennsylvania ervice. And yet we are told there are not too many officers. [Mr. RANDALL] to this clause of Rule XXI: The gentleman from Iowa [Mr. KASSON] the other day seemed to· Nor h all any provision in any such bill ~r amendment thereto .changing ex- assume that in proposing restrict the number of officers and cut 1 ting law be in order except such as, bemg germane to the subJect-matter of to the bill, shall retrench'expenditures by the reduc::tion of the number ~nd salary down the expense in this direction we were attacking the Navy itself. . · of the officers of the United States, by the re?uctwn of the compensat.wn ?f any I did not suppo e our Navy consisted wholly of officers, or that its person paid out of the Treasury of the Uruted States, or by the reduction of strength and efficiency depended on its officers alone. I had upposed amounts of money covered by the bill. an efficient navy required hips and seamen as well. What are the· That this propo ition is germane may be admitted; but that is not facts? Why, we have now sixty officers to every vessel in commis­ It enough. must, according to the rule, retrench expenditures. A sion, and yet we are told that there are none too ~ny. Ther are­ proposition to organize a commission of ~quiry was ruled a little while eight to ten engineers to a vessel, and yet we must not reduce the taff_ ago by the present oc~upant of ~~e charr to be out of o~der. Now, the No matter if there are more officers to a hip than can stand on the point is that the pending proposition does not necessarily retrench ex­ decks, we must go on increasing their number. This bill appropriates. penditures. It may possibly have such a re~ult .. But it aS;Sllmes t~t $4,645,000 for pay of officers alone. The pay of eamen and enlisted there is a certain class of officers on the retired-list of which, as this men, deducting civil employes at navy-yards and the Coast Survey question is now presented, the Honse has no knowledge. The propo­ service, I take to be not over 1,750,000, or abontone-third of the pay sition is to make inquiry, and if there be such officers then the result of the officers. And I find of the 385,000,000 that have been ex­ is to follow. .... Tow, by looking at the Digest you will find this comment pended ince the war 100,000,000 has gone to pay the officers. on the rule: The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman's time has expired. This ru1e is rigidly enforced so far as relates to amendments offered in the House and in committee. Mr. GEORGE D. WISE obtained the floor and yielrled his time to Mr. W .ARNER, of Ohio. And many members of the Home will remember that at the last ses­ ~Ir. WARNER, of Ohio. I am very much obliged to my friend from sion this rule was in a case similar to this rigidly enforced; and the Virginia. Committeeofthe Whole sustained the ruling of the Chair that it must I was saying 1\Ir. Chairman, that of the entire expenditure connected appear po itively that the n~ effect of.t~e propositio~ is tore-. withtheNavysince the war 100,000,000ofithad been expended for pay trench expenditures. If the pendmg propoSltion be ruled m order, of officers and about one-third as much for the enlisted men. How much there miaht with equal propriety be presented a proposition for an in­ of the balance has been expended or wastedatournavy-yard I am not quiry in~ the number of ships we J;tave and 'Y~ether any of them are able to state, although I have been endeavoring to get this information, sufficiently decayed to be sold, and if so, proVIding that they shall be but it must be a large part of the remaining sum; and I ay to gentle­ sold. Thus the thing might go on to any extent. Consequently, as men on the other side of this Honse that you can not trace thirty mill­ the Digest says, the rule is rigidly enforced that it must appea-r that ions out of the three hundred and eighty which have been appropriated the particular proposition will retrench expenditures. for the Navy to the constructionofvessels. It has gone in other direc­ Mr. HOLMAN. I rise to inquire whether thispointoforderwasre­ tions; a small part of it to pay seamen and enlisted men and nearly served in the first instance. a hundred millions to pay officers. The rest of it has gone where? The CHAIRMAN. It was. Largelytowaste; andthatisthereason whywehavenonavynow. We Mr. THOMAS. It is manifest the object, scope, and clear intent of have officers, but neither seamen nor hips to correspond; that is our this amendment are to reduce expenditure, and that its effect will be situation. If there had been more of the money appropriated in pa t to reduce expenditure is clear to any o:ne who will read it. It does not years judicionsly applied to the construction of ships our Navy would tand on the same footing as the amendment proposed organizing a not be o top-heavy with officers as it is. We would have more hip . joint committee of the Honse and Senate to take into consideration the The fault has been in the administration. I give here a single item to system ofrehabilita?ng.and rebuil~g theAmerica~ Nayy-. It has~ illustrate navy-yard expenditures and ship-building by the Government its object the investtgation of a subJect-matter of thlS bill. The bill in the past. I t is taken from Admiral Porter's testimony before a Sen­ provides for an appropiation of $713,450 for a certain class of officers. ate committee: This proposition has as its object the reduction of that amount by eliminating from the service a part of the beneficiaries. Therefore the Senator BuTLER. Is there a navy-yard in the United States that could build a. ship out and out now? effect affirmatively ·appears that it does retrench expenditures to the Admiral PORTER. There is. I had one built in a navy-yard once, a.nd !assure extent of the number of officers who may be dropped from the Register. yo• when I got through with her I weighed a.boutforty pounds less than I did The CHAIRMAN. The Chair is of the opinion that the creation of when I started; but we cou1d build these in case of necessity. Senator JoNES. Whose fault was that? the commission does not necessarily involve the expenditureofmoney, Admiral PoRTER. She was a. very small vessel. She cost $460,000 built at a. because the officers are already paid by the Government. And the scope navy-yard, and she could have been built at an outside establishment for of the amendment, if such officers can be found on the retired-list, their $200,000 without any trouble at all. I know this certainly, because they charged everything to that small ve el. They charged one item alone of $80,000, work being dropped would retrench expenditure by taking them out of the put on the Trenton, and other things of the same kind. One item, I think, was Navy. The amendment is therefore ruled to be in order. a. hot-house for some one in the navy-yard. Mr. ADAMS, of Illinois, rose. Senator BuTLER. That becomes a very important fa-ct, it seems to me. Admiral PoRTER. You can never ascertain what a ship co ts in a navy-yard. The CHAIRMAN. Debate is exhausted. Senator Jo~. What do you attribute that difference in co t to? Mr. AD~S, of illinois. Let my amendment to the amendment be Admiral PORTER. Politics. That is about the fact of it. The navy-yards are again read. very much used for political purposes, and very naturally. If I was a politician I suppose I would do the same thing. If I could get my friends into the nary­ The amendment to the amendment was again read. yard I presume I should do as others do; but at the same time, if I was in Mr. THOMAS. I accept that as a modification of my amendment. charge of the yard I would do all I could to stop it. But what I say i the fact, The question recurred on Mr. THOM.AS'S amendment as modified, and and it causes agreat deal of the expense. it -.,as disagreed to. Cicero says, "economy is itself a great revenue." If that principle The Clerk read as follows: had been applied in the administration of our na>al affairs for the last For pay to petty officers, seamen, ordinary seamen, landsmen., and boys, in­ twentyvearsand there>enueresultingfrom wise economy applied to the ~I uding men in the engineers' force and for t.he Coast Survey service, not exceed­ ing 8,250 in all, $2,490,000. constrnctionof vesseLs, in tead of having. as now, twenty-five or thil·ty Ir. W AR~ER, of Ohio. I move the following amendment: third or fourth class vessel , we might have eYeral what mjght be Prodded The total number of officers shall not be increased above the pre ent called respect.a.ble ship ; and in thi regard I am glad to. see signs of im­ number u~til there are at least five seamen and enlisted men to every officer. provement in the administration of na>al affairs. I hope it will con- 1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD- HOUSE. 1629

-tinue and I think the Committee on Appropriations is moving in the change in the dates of commi ~on or i~ the relative rank of such officer~: Pro­ yould be folly. Our geographi~l or regulation that governs it. This is simply to prescribe the manner m position on the globe does not reqmre 1t. It has never been our policy which it shall be done. It does not increase the pay of any of these to interfere in the affairs of other countries· and if we keep clear of parties and does not increase expenditures. ·entangling alliances and are just in our dealin~ with other countries Mr. KASSON. I think that is right. in we are no danger of external war. No nation can afford to attack ~fr. RANDALL. Does it affect the longevity-pay? us and will not if we are not ourselves at fuult. But should we at any Mr. MORSE. I do not know about that. ~e determine on a different policy, and determine to become a great Ur. RANDALL. I feel compelled to insist upon the point of orrler, naval power, it would be necessary to star~ out, not with a half-dozen for the reason that I would like, for one, to be able to examine this -cru:isers but to build at least a hundred ships, equal to the largest and matter as I think it may possibly increase the pay of some of these best afl~at, at a cost probably of three or four hundred ~ons of dol­ parties: It may, however, be a j~t a~d propera~en~ment, and~ ~nly lars. But I do not think it our policy to attempt anythmg of that insist upon the point of order to gam trme toexamme 1t. I am willing, 'b..Tid. If we had started out on such a policy twenty years ago the therefore, if it meets the views of the gentleman from Massachusetts, to ships we should have built and the guns we should have put on them ask unanimous consent that we may go on with the consideration of would be of little use now. Naval architecture and naval gunnery the bill, and afterward revert to this matter when we shall have had 'have been and still are in a formative state. Europe has wasted more time to examine it. money on navies and naval armamenta in the last half century than in Mr. MORSE. I have no objection to tha.t. . .any other way since the Crusades. Mr. RANDALL. I am willing, then, that it may go over until to­ We need, no doubt, to add somewhat to the nu~ber of our vessels morrow. ..and to improve their character, adopting the latest rmprovements, go­ Mr. CALKINS. Until we have concluded the bill. ina from wood and iron to steel, and in other ways increasing the effi­ Mr. RANDALL. I am quite willing, as I have said, that it shall go · ci~ncy of our Navy to the extent required to protect our commerce and over, and will ask unanimous consent that when w_e have finished the -give us relatively more ships andmoreseamentothenumberofofficers. consideration of the bill we may return to this subJect. I know it is not the fault of the officers of the Navy that we have not The CHAIRMAN. Is there objection to passing this matter over in­ more ships and more seamen, nor am I casting any reflection upon formally, to return to it after the remainder of the bill has been com­ the personnel of the officers. Far from that. We have as efficient offi­ pleted? -cers as any other country. What I say is that we have too man;r rela- There was no objection. -tively to seamen and ships. We want fewer officers or more sh1p . I The Clerk read the following pamoornph: .find in referring tQ the ·English naval service, from data I find in the For all emergencies and extra{)rdinary expenses, arising at home or abroad, Reform Almanac, a high authority, which gives the latest official pub­ but impossible to be anticipated or classified, exclusive of personal services in lication upon that subject, that with two hundred and forty-three naval the Navy Department or any of its subordinate bureaus or offices at Washing­ vessels Great Britain has 57,000 seamen, including marines, and 4,000 ton, D. C., $15,000. ·officers, being an average of one officer to about fifteen seamen and sev­ Mr. BELFORD. I move to amend by striking out '' $15,000 '' and -enteen officers to a ship, while in our service we have one officer to two, inserting in lieu thereof "$50,000,000." ·or at most three, seamen and enlisted men-the men who do the fighting Here the Democratic party intend to make an appropriation for all when the struggle comes, if it shall ever come-and sixty officers to a emergencies and confine its amount to the enormous sum of $15,000! ·ship. . Mr. HUTCHINS. I rise to a point of order. The amendment has I ask now to be allowed to add some figures and include a few items not been reported to the committee. -covering some of the points to which I have thus briefly alluded. The Clerk read the proposed amendment, as follows: There was no objection. In line 94 strike out "315,000" and insert in lieu thereof "$50,000,000." The CHAIRMAN. Does the gentleman from Pennsylvania make the :point of order upon the amendment? Mr. BELFORD. In 'View of all possible emergencies coming from Mr. RANDALL. I do not. any quarter of the world this great Democratic party, with a majority The CHAIRMAN. The question is upon agreeing to the amendment of seventy on the floor of this House, proposes to appropriate the mag­ proposed by the gentleman from Ohio. nificent sum of $15,000. That is the measure of your generosity and The amendment was not agreed to. the measure of your capacity in dealing with great national questions. The Clerk read as follows: (Laughter.] For two secretaries, one to the Admiral and one to the Vice-Admiral, clerks I had occasion yesterday to refer to the fact that when it became -to paymasters, clerks at inspections, navy-yards, and stations, and extra pay to necessary to protect the great wool interest of this country you but­ men enlisted under honorable discharge; commission and interest, transporta..- toned up your coats and ran out of this House like political cowards. ion of funds, exchange; mileage to officers while traveling under orders in the United States, and for actual personal expenses of officers while traveling abroad What have we done here? Bismarck, the vizier of Germany, has sent under orders, and for traveling expenses of apothecaries,yeomen, and civilian you an insulting message, and in the very fuce of it you declare before -employes, and for actual and necessary traveling expenses of naval cadets while the country that if Germany makes war on America you will, to per­ ,proceeding from their home to the Naval Academy for examination and ap­ -pointment as cadets, and for the payment of any such officers as may be in serv­ petuate and protect our honor, vote the magnificent sum of $15,000. ice, either upon the active or retired list, during the year ending June 30, 1885, (Laughter.] The gentleman from New York assumes credit for having in excess of the numbers of each class provided for in this act, and for any in­ reduced the estimates for the naval service from twenty-two millions to crease of pay arising from different duty, as the needs of the service may require; for rent and furniture of buildings and offices not in navy-yards i expenses of fifteen millions-a Teduction of seven millions. The gentleman from courts-martial and courts of inquiry, boards of investigation, exam ming boards, Pennsylvania told me the other day, with the assurance that charac­ with clerks' and witne_ses• fees, and traveling expenses and costs; stationery terizes a citizen of Pennsylvania, that I was a member of a decaying and recording; expenses of purchasing-paymasters' offices at the various cities, including clerks, furniture, fuel, stationery, and incidental expenses; newspa­ party. I never went to the city of Philadelphia to make a speech for pers and advertising; foreign po tage; telegraphing, foreign and domestic; the Democratic party, followed by a defeat by 13,·000 majority, as that telephones ; copying ; care of library; mail and express wagons, and livery and gentleman did. Probably it is he who belongs to a decaying party. -express fees; co ts of suits; commissions, warrants, diplomas, and discharges; relief of vessels in distress, and pilotage; recovery of valuables from shipwrecks; Pittsburgh has loomed up against him. Philadelphia has fro ted and quarantine expenses; care and transportation of the dead ; reports, professional benumbed his Presidential aspirations, and he is as dead as Lazarus was investigation, cost of special instruction, and information from abroad and the. without Jesus in sight to resurrect hint. [Laughter.] -collection and classification thereof, $375,000. Mr. COX, of New York. l\fy friend from Colorado I know did not M:r. MORSE. Mr. Chairman, I wish to offer an amendment in this refer to me a.s "the gentleman from New York;" though I have gath­ ·connection. ered from eertain expressions of his that he really regards me as a gen­ The Clerk read as follows: tleman. The gentleman said yesterday that I ought not make speeches And all officers of the Navy shall be credited with the actual time they may from manuscript but improvise them; and he paid me an elegant com~ have served as officers, clerks, or enlisted men in the regular or volunteer Army pliment. I know of but one little drawback to my making speeche ·01· ,.avy or both, and shall receive all the benefits of such actual service in all respects in the same manner as if all said service had been continuous and in the after the manner of my friend from Colorado. They get to ~ so diffu­ 1 1 8 0 sive and expensive to the public. But I know that my frien

The CHAIRMAN. The question is on the amendment offered by the tion of them have become impaired, while the appropriation has steadily de- creased. . 'd gentleman from Colorado. The appropriation at no time since 1866 would have been suffiCient to provt e Mr. BELFORD. I withdraw it. our vessels with proper outfit , had w e not had on hand a supply purchased dur- The Clerk read the following paragraph: ing the civil war. . . By the second ection of the act approved Augu t :>, 1882, reqwrmg all stores. BUREAU OF NAVIGATION. and supplies found by a board of app~i. ers to be "~ervieeab~e" to be sold, the supplies, which might have l?een utilized ~o a certa.m extent m the ab nee For foreign and local pilotage and towage of ships of war; services and ma­ of more improved and better arttcle , were st1ll further reduced. . terials in correcting compasses on board ship, and for adjusting and testing com­ Such an inadequate supply is now on hand that the bureau felt obliged ~ passes on shore; nautical and astronomica1 inst.ruments, nautical books, I!lap , submit an estimate for the navigation outfit of the four new steel cruisers now charts, and sailing directions, and repairs of nautical instruments for ships of building. . . war; books for libraries of ships of 'Yar; . naval sign~ls and apparat. ~s, name~y, In consequence of the order from tl.lc ~a>y Department directmg command­ signal-lights lanterns, rockets, runnmg-hghts, drawmgs, andengravmgsforstg­ ing officers not to employ pilots except when the naviga_tion was excep~i.onn.l!Y nal-books; ~mpass-fi.ttings, including ?innaeles, triponders bad not the amount paid for pilotage been greatly reduced in consequence of and navigators of vessels of war and for use of courts-martial; muslcalmstru­ the Department' order. ments and music for vessels of war; steering-signals and indicators, and speak­ The amount reported from the .Appropri9:tions Committee for" navigation and ing-tubes and gongs for signal communication on board vessel~ of war; ~d navigation supplies" for tQe fiscal year endmg June 30,1885, 1s $75,000, an amount for introducing electric lights on board vessels of war, not exceeding 85,000; m entirely inadequate for the purpo e for wl~ich it .is to ~e appropriated. A proper all, $75,000. administration of the bureau would reqUire tWice this amount, and should the appropriation bill as reported become a lawt.here mustinevitablyresultalarge Mr. HUTCHINS. By instructions of the Committee on Appropria­ deficiency. tions I offer the amendment which I send to the desk. The Clerk rend as follows : Mr. CALKINS. This is the item which has been cut down sub tan­ On page 6 on line 120, after the word "war," insert "civil esta.blislmlent." tially 25,000. Therewasan appropriation last year for this bureau of .And in line~ 121 and 122 strike out "875,000" and insert "$80,000." $100,000, of which 37,000 wa.':! saved on account of p~lotage, and ~x­ Ur. HUTCHINS. The effect of this will be to add $5,000 to the ap­ pended in purchasing charts, comp e , &c., for the eqm pment of sh1ps propriation for the civil est.abHshment. of war. The reason why there wa an effort on the part of the chief of Mr. .MORSE. I move to amend the amendment by triking out this bureau to save this money was that he might be enabled to pur­ chase these necessary article! for the equipment of the vessels. " 0, 000," and inserting " 110,000." . He made an extraordinary effort to save it, did save it, and expended I simply wish to state that I ~m _assured by th_e gentleman rn cha:rge of that bureau that you m11ry just as well appropnate 10 as appropnate it in that way. The Committee on Appropriations of this House found 75,000 or 80,000. It is impossible for him to do the work which he it out, and they now propo e to deprive him of 25,000 of the _savin~ he is required to do during the next year unless be can have the whole made which is simply to take o much from the amount wh1cb nught 110 000. I simply make that statement on his behalf because be as­ be exi>ended for chart~ , appamtus, &c., £or which he would otherwise sur~ me there must be a deficiency. It is impossible for him to do the expend the savings. work which it is intended he shall do with the amount appropriated by ~1r: RANDALL. They are operating under the 20 per cent. clause. this bill. i\1r. CALKINS. :Not if we pass this bill. .Mr. RANDALL. The committee discussed this subject and gave Mr. RANDALL. The law is 20 per cent. careful examination to the matter. We differed with the chief of the Mr. HI.SCOCK. This bill will be the law for next year, and you bureau. We gave $12,000 above what was expended last year for the propose to ehange it to 30 per cent. purposes enumerated in the paragraph. It will also be observed that Mr. RANDALL. Two of the largest vessels of the Navy are likely the next paragraph appropriates $30,000 for the navigation outfit of the to go off the Register even with the 30 per cent. clause. four new steel cruisers. There is therefore an adequate amount it does M:r. HISCOCK. I do not desire to discuss this matter at any length. seem to me for the purpose of fitting out what is to be the active Navy I wish to ask the gentleman from Pennsylvania [Mr. R.A.NDALL] this in the future service of the country. question: Will not the effect of this reduction be to reduce the number . Mr. .MORSE. I send to the Clerk's desk, not to be read, because it of ships in commission? i\1r. would take too much time, but that it may be prrnted as a part of my RANDALL. I think not.. On the contrary, there is no defi­ ciency this year. remarks, a statement showing the appropriation for every year from 1866 until the present time for this branch of the Department and the 1rlr. HISCOCK. I understand there is no deficiency this year, but I purpose for which it has been used. ask, if we give a less sum for next year than was given for this will it The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman from l\Iassaehusetts asks that the not reduce the number of hip in commission? memorandum to which he refers be printed in the REcoRD. The Chair i\1r. RANDALL. There is no decrease of the amount that was ex­ bears no objection. pended for the things included in this paragraph; in fact, we increase The memorandum is as follows: ' the amount by 12,000. Mr. HISCOCK. Is the gentleman willing to assure the committee Amounts appropriated unde:r appropriation, "NavigatiO'n and navigation that the effect of this reduction will not be to reduce the number of suppli.es, '' frmn 1866 to 1884 inclusiVP.. ships in commission? ~1r . RANDALL. Then, why did you not give$137,000 last year? Mr. HISCOCK. We made our appropriations upon· the basis of re­ taining a certain number of ships in commission. The question was taken upon the amendment of Mr. MoRSE to in­ crease the appropriation to 110,000; and upon a division tberewere­ ayes 58, noes 87. lr:::~;;);)~:;:J:::;~:~-t:::::r~ lllllt~r)::;:::(:~~;);:r:r:~:J!::::~: i\f.r. ii So (no further count being called for) the amendment of MORSE *.And purposes incidental to navigation. was not agreed to. It will be seen from the above amounts that the appropriation for supplying The amendment of Mr. HUTCHINS to increase the appropriation to. naval vessels with the necessary articles of navigation outfit has steadily been $80,000 was then agreed to. • decreased from $192,500 for 1866-'67 to '1.00,000 for 1883-'84. The Clerk resumed the reading of the bill, and read the following: In consequence of the large amount of navigation stores of an imperi ha.ble nat.ure on hand at the expiration of the civil war of 1861-'65, and the great re­ For navigation outfit of the four new steel cruisers, $30,000. duction in the number of vessels in commission, the Bureau of Navigation has For erection of compass-testing house, $7,000. been able to continue to supply our vessels with instruments for navigating, which though not always of the most improYed forms, still answered the pur­ i\1r. THOMAS. I move t.o insert as an additional p~aoraph that pose f~r which they were originally purchased. which I send to the Clerk's desk. The steadily decreasing appropriation from year to year has pre>ented the The Clerk read as follows: bureau from obtaining better and safer but at the same time more costly appa­ ratus for deep-sea and coast sounding, improved compasses, and more durable For the publication of professional papers, $10,000. binnacles for mounting them, better appliances for illuminating purposes; has prevented our ships from being supplied with professional information so nec­ Mr. HUTCHINS. I reserve all points of order on that amendment. essary both for officers and men, and ha.s not permitted this bureau to keep pace i\1r. RANDALL. I make the point of order absolute; we willlo e with the great changes which have taken place in naval warfare since our own too much time otherwise. civil war. • Navigating implements, although of metal, will become useles:; in tiu;te from Mr. THOMAS. ·r think we had better discuss the point of order now. the casualties incident to the service, or ob olete because of the mvent10n and I want to say, however that this amendment is offered at the reque tor adoption of ·more improved forrus. . · Compasses, on which the safety of the hip depends, will not last forever. the Department, which says that it is necessary to have this money to They lose their directive force and are useless. publish the reports and professional paper required to be put into the CI.Jronometersare expensive, and their lifetime is put by expert at thirty years. bands of officel'8 going to ea. In consequence of this limit, and it Reems a. wise one. the number of chronom­ l\Ir. RANDALL. I n an wer the gentleman from illinois [ lr. eters which werP. serviceable in 186.5 L<;;much decreased in lBS!, and new ones are to required. THOltf.A ], I will say that ifthatwere even true, which I do npt know, The quantity of stores has gradually grown les from year to year, and a por- the item should not come in here. It ought to come in the bill pl'O- - 1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 1631 viding for printing. There is a deficiency in the appropriation tor print­ The Clerk read as follows: ing for the Navy Department which the committee is now considering. Amend, in lines 199 and 200, by adding, after" purposes," "and for building a.. We desire to break up this general system of printing in the Depart­ first-class ice-boat to keep open the Potomac River to the navy-yard at Washing­ ments. ton, not to cost more than $100,000," and substitute for "$200,000" "$300,000." Mr. THOMAS. This printing is not done, as the gentleman inti­ Ur. HUTCHINS. I make a point of order on that amendment. mates by the printing bureau ; it is done by the Departments only when The CHAIRMAN. The Chair sustains the point of order. specially ordered. It is for that purpose, a;nd th!lt alone, that the amen~­ The Clerk read as follows: ment is offered. It was sent here m the 1dentical words I have used m BUREAU OF liiEDICTh'E A->a> URGERY. the amendment, and I was asked by the Department to offer it, as it was For support of the l\Iedical Department: For surgeons' necessaries for ve515els in commission, navy-yards, naval stations, Marine Corps, and Coast Survey~ absolutely necessary. $40,000. . Mr. RANDALL. In the allotment of the appropriation for public printing there is given to the Navy Department 75,000. Wehavenow ~h. HUTCHINS. I am instructed by the Committee on Appropria­ before us an estimate for deficiency for the current yearforthatDepart­ tions to move the following amendment: mentof $20 000, I think; certainly for $10,000, and! think for $20,000. Strike out the words " SiO,OOO" and insert " and for the civil establishment ai the several naval hospitals, navy-yards, naval laboratory, and Naval Academ,-, Ifthisite~shouldgoinanywhereit shouldgo into the bill providing $60,000." for printing; but I do not. think it should go in anywhere; it was not in The amendment was agreed to. last year. I will say ·agam that so far as I can understand the purpose The Clerk read as follows : of the Printing Committee of this House and of the Committee on Appro­ For the maintenance of the civil establishment at the several naval hos11itals. priations, it is their desire to break up this wholesale printing by t he navy-yards, naval laboratory, and Naval Academy, $20,000. Departments, for which t hese enoril?-ous sums of money are expend~. Mr. HUTCHINS. By direction of the Committee on Appropriations, I think we will have the co-operation of the Secretary of the Navy m I move to strike out the clause just read. As the committee will ob­ that respect. He himself has stated-I do not think I violate any con­ serve, this appropriation of $20,000 is, by the amendment just agreed fidence in so saying-he himself has stated to the subcommittee on ap­ to, transferred to the p~araph relating to the support of the Medical propriations co~sidering the subject of deficiencie:;, as the gentle~an Department. The adoption of this amendment will not make any re­ from Indiana will temember, that he has stopped this character of pnnt­ duction of the amount appropriated by the bill. mg in the Navy Department. Therefore we have the Committee on The amendment was agreed to. Printing of this House, the Committee on Appropriations of this House, and the Secretary of the Navy all working in the same direction. MESSAGE FROM THE PRESIDENT. Ur. CALKINS. I would ask the chairman ofthe CommitteeonAp­ The Committee of the Whole rose informally; and Mr. HoLMAN hav­ propriations [Mr. RANDALL] in what bill the printing for the Depart­ ing taken the chair as Speaker pro tempore, a message, in writing, from ments is provided for? the President of the United States was communicated to the House by 1\fr. RANDALL. In th~ sundry civil appropriation bill. This. item :Mr. PRUDEN, one of his secretaries, who also announced that the Presi­ was not provided for last year at all. dent haa approved and signed a bill and joint resolution of the follow­ The CH.AIRMAN. The Chair is of opinion that the point of order ing titles: is well taken. An act (H. R. 1482) making all public roads and highways post- The Clerk read as follows: roads· and · BUREAU OF ORDNA}'ICE. _ Jofu.t resolution ( ~. Res. 186) for the relief of Frank Galt. For procuring, producing, and preserving ordna nce material; for the arma­ NAVAL APPROPRIATION BILL. ment of ships ; for fuel, tools, materials, and labor to be used in the general work of the Ordnance Department; for furniture at magazines, at the ordnance dock, The Committee of the Whole House on the state of the Union re­ New York, and at the naval experimental battery, $100,000. sumed its session. The Clerk read as follows: Mr. HUTCHINS. By instruction of the Committee on Appropria­ tions I offer the amendment which I send to the desk. BUREAU OF CONSTRUCTION Al>-x> REPAIR. For preservation and completion of vessels on the stocks and in ordinary; The Clerk read as follows: purchase of materials and stores of all kinds; labor in navy-yards and on for­ Aft,er the words " Ordnance Department," in the paragraph just read, insert eign stations; preservation of materials; purchase of tools; wear, tear, and "for the civil establishment; " and change the amount of the appropriation from repair of ves els afloat, and for general care, increase, and protection of the $100,000 to $105,000. Navy in the line of construction and repair and incidental expenses, namely, advertising, foreign postage, telegrams, photographing, books, plans, stationery, The amendment was agreed to. and instruments for drawing-room, $1,000,000: Pro1;ided, That no part of this The Clerk read as follows: sum shall be applied to the repairs of any wooden ship when the estimated cost of such repairs, to be appraised by a. competent hoard of naval officers, shall BUREAU OF EQUIPMENT AND RECRUITING. exceed 30 per cent. of the estimated cost, appraised in like manner, of a new :::_:i'or equipment of vessels: For coal for steamers and ships' use, including ship of the same size and like material: PrO'Vided f urther, That nothing herein expenses of transportation, storage, and handling; hemp, wire, hides, and other contained shall deprive the Secretary of the Navy of the authority to order materials for the manufacture of rope and cordage; iron for the manufacture of repairs of hips damaged in foreign waters or on the high seas, so far as may anchors cables, galleys, and chains; canvas for the manufacture of sails, awn­ be necessary to bring them home. ings bags, and luu:nlnocks; heating apparatus for recei ving-shl ps; and for the parchase of all oth~ articles of equipment at home and abroad, and for the pay­ lli. CALKINS. I rise to make a point of order. ment of labor in equipping vessels and manufacture of equipment articles in the Mr. HUTCHINS. I desire to offer an amendment. several navy-yards, $700,000. ~h. CALKINS. I will reserve my point of order until the amend­ :Mr. HUTCHINS. I am instructed by the committee to offer an ment of the gentleman from New York [Mr. HUTCHINS] shall have amendment, which I ask the Clerk to read. been submitted and acted upon. The Clerk read as follows: :Ur. HUTCHINS. .By instructions by the Committee on Appropria­ Insert, after the words "receiving-ships," in line 161, the words "for the civil tions I offer the amendment which I send to the desk. establishment," and change the amount of the appropriation ft•om $700,000 to The Clerk read as follows: $707,000. After the words "drawing-room," in line 262, strike out "$1,000,000" and in­ The amendment was agreed to. sert" and for the civil establishment, $1,020,000." Mr. CALKINS. In my general remarks on this bill I stated that in The amendment was agreed to. my judgment this bureau ought to be consolidated with the Bureau of Mr. CALKINS. I now make a point of order against the first pro­ Provisions and Clothing. But I shall offer no amendment now for that viso of the p~araph just read: purpose. Provid~, That no part of this sum shall be applied to the repairs of any wooden The Clerk read as follows: ship when the estimated cost of such repairs, to be appraised by a competen\ BUREAU OF YABDS AND DOCKS. board of naval officers, shall exceed 30per cent. of the estimated cost appraised in like manner, of a new ship of the same size and like material. ' For general maintenance of yards and docks, namely: For freights and trans­ portation of materials and storesJ books, models, maps, and drawings; purchase My point of order is that this proviso changes the existing law which and repair of fire-engines; macninery; repairs on steam fire-engines, and at­ tendance on the same; purchase and maintenance of oxen and horses, and driv­ fixes 20 per cent. instead of 30 per cent., as here proposed; ~d the ing teams, carts, and timber-wheels, and all vehicles for nse in the navy-yards, proviso also increases expenditures. When I made a point of order and tools and repairs of the same; dredging; postage on letters and other mailable ~crainst the first clause in this bill the Chair held-- matter on public service, and telegrams; furniture for Government houses and will offices in the navy-ya rds; coal and other fuel: candles, oil, and gas; cleaning Mr. RANDALL. The gentleman recollect, I think-- and clearing up yards and care of public buildings; attendance on fires, lights, Mr. HOLMAN. limy colleague (Mr. CALKINS] will permitme-­ fire-engines and apparatus; for clerical and incidental labor at navy-yards; Mr. CALKINS. The gentleman will wait till I finish my sentence. water-tax, and for toll and ferriages; rent of four officers' quarters at League Island; pay of the watchmen in the navy-yards; and for awning and packing­ The Chair held that an incidental reduction would bring a provision i boxes, and advertising for yards and dock purposes, 8200,000. within the rule. I want the same rule applied all the way through the bill. 1\Ir. HUTCHINS. By direction of the Committee on Appropriations, ~- ~OL~f.A.N.. The provisi?n of law referred to by my colleague I move to amend by inserting, after the words ''pay of the watchmen proV1ding for reparrs not exceeding 20 per cent. is, jf I understand the in the navy-yards," in lines 197 and 198, the words "for the civil es­ matter, a provision of the current navy appropriation bill and is not tabli hment;" and by changing the amount of the appropriation from applicable to each successive appropriation. Now I do not think my 200,000 to $220,000. colleague will say there is a Jaw on this subject except a law of inci­ The amendment was agreed to. dental appropriation. ~- MAYO. I offer the amendment which I send to the desk. J\fr. HISCOCK. The gentleman from Indiana i ~ mi'itaken. In the 1632 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. MARCH 5

:a.ppropriation bill it was fixed at 20 per cent., and that only applied to Bu~eau of Construction and Repair. t J;le bill passed at that year and for the fiscal year during, which that ltnll ran. .A.ppropri- Extraordinary Ordinary Mr. HOLUAY. That is exactly what I have said. Year. ated. expenses. expenses. Mr. III"COCK. While the provision ingrafted in the present appro­ ;priation bill for the next fiscal year is a permanent provision applying {Building Alaska, AI- not only to that but to all succeeding years. 1868-'69 ...... $3,000,000 00 $3,000,000 goma, Omaha, Ply- Ms. RANDALL. That is because it is not the law now. 1869-'70 ...... 4.,000,000 00 ···si;593;us·oo· 2,405,884 mouth. .M:r. HOLMAN. But merely an incidental appropriation for the cur­ 1870-171 ...... 4, 830, 000 00 1, 104, Ill 00 3, 725,889 1871-'72 ...... 3, 500, 000 00 181,719 00 3,318,281 .rent fiscal year. 1872-73 ...... 3,300,000 00 ...... 3,300,000 Building Alarm and In- M:r. HISCOCK. .As I remember it, and I believe I am correct, the trepid. 1873-'74...... 5, 500, 000 00 2, 031, 000 00 3,469,000 Building Enterpri e, provision in the appropriation bill for the current fiscal year applies Alert, Huro·n. tOnly to the expenditure of the money carried by that bill. That is for 1874-'75 ...... 3, 300, 000 00 ...... 3,300,000 Building Ranger, Ad- the present fiscal year; while on the. contrary the provision contained ams, E sex, Alliance, in the pending appropriation bill is not only permanent legislation for Trenton. {Rebuilding P=il&n, the money carried by that bill, hut is also permanent legislation for 1875-'76 ...... 3, 300, 000 00 1, 606, 250 00 1,693, 750 Terror, Miantono- the future. 1876-'77 ...... 1, 950, 000 00 200,000 00 1, 750,000 mob, .Amphitrite, 1\Ir. CALKINS. Let us see how this matter stands, for we might as Monadnock. 1877-'78 ...... 3, 123, 447 28 1, 373, 447 28 1, 750,000 Deficiency bill. well understand it now as at any other time, and it will prevent dis­ 1878-'79 ...... 1, 500, 000 00 ...... 1,500,000 .agreeme nt hereafter. 1879-'80 ...... 1, 500, 000 00 -~ ...... -~ .... 1,500,000 Mr. HOLMAN. One word in answer to the gentleman from New 1880-'81 ...... 1, 725, 000 00 250,000 00 1,475,000 1881-'82 ...... 1, 350, 000 00 ...... ~ ...... 1,350,000 York. 1882-'83 ...... 1, 825, 850 00 ...... 1,825,085 :Mr. CALKINS. One word, and I will yield to my colleague. I do 1883-'84...... 1,100,000 00 ························ 1,000,000 not believe there is any dispute between us. My recollection is the ·················· ...... 100,000 Balance on hand. same as that of the gentleman from New York [Mr. HiscocK], that 16years...... 44, 803, 532 28 8, 339, 64.3 28 36,463,889 last year the provision in relation to the 20 per cent. limit was applied to the amount carried by that bill, and in this bill it is a permanent law fixing it for all time. It will be seen that some $44,803,532.28 has been expended by the Mr. HUTCHINS. It does reduce expenditure for, according to the Bureau of Construction and Repair and $21,315,512.67 by the Bureau gentleman's own interpretation if you do not retain the provision con­ ofSteamEngineering, making in all a sum of between 65,000,000 and -tained in this bill there will be then no restriction on the expenditure $66,000,000which has been expended in repairofwooden ships, which of the amou.n,t appropriated, and the whole appropriation may be used annually require of us still other repairs. The question which now for repair of wooden ships. · confronts the committee is whether we shall go on pouring out our ?lir. HOLMAN. .M:y friend from New York is mistaken. The bill Treasury in the repair of these ships, or place on the bureaus here a law making appropriations for the Navy for the present year uses this lan­ so that we may drift into the making of steel cruisers and change the guage: entire construction of our Navy. If this clause restricting the repairs PrO'Vided, That no part of this sum shall be applied to the repairs of any wooden to 30 per cent. be allowed to stay in the bill, then I say t~e amount ap­ ship· when the estimated cost of such repairs, to be appraised by a competent propriated is entirely inadequate to the necessities of the service. There !board of naval officers, shall exceed 20 per cent. of the estimated cost, appraised is under the 20per cent. clause 400,000 of deficiency. Yon propose to in like manner, of a new ship of t.he same size and like material: PrO'Vided fur­ ther, That nothing herein contained shall deprive the Secretary of the Navy of give the sum this year you gave last year, and yet to increase the amount the authority to order repairs of ships damaged in foreign waters or on the high from 20 to 30 per cent., which will increase the expense one-third, or .-seas, so far as may be necessary to bring them home. else all our vessels will go out of commission. .As a matter of course that last clause has no application to this, and If you leave this 30 per cent. clause in, the only thing you can do the limit of 20 per cent. provided for in that bill applies only to the logically is to provide for $400,000, which makes up the deficiency, and current :fiscal year. In that view of the matter there is then no 1.'\w on add one-third, making $300,000 more, or $1,700,000 in all, instead of the subject. In the present bill it is proposed to make it permanent, the amount you provided by the bill. That is all you can do to act .and certainly the effect must inevitably be to reduce the expenditure. wisely. If you leave it at 20 percent., then $1,400,000 is required, be­ Mr. CALKINS. I will withdraw the point of order, and will move cause, as the Secretary of the Navy informs us, there will necessarily to strike out "thirty" andinsert "twenty;" and this, Mr. Chairman, be $400,000 deficiency. brings the House face to face with this single proposition whether we Mr. WARNER, of Ohio. Let me ask the gentleman from Indiana ;are to go on as we have in the last thirty or forty years expending the how long it would be under the 20 per cent. rule before all of the money we appropriated for the naval establishment in the repair of wooden vessels of the Navy would go out of commission? wooden ships which are now in commission. Mr. CALKINS: That of course would be only guess, and the gentle­ I have a statement here prepared by the Secretary of the Navy show­ man from Ohio can doubtless give as ready an approximation to the mg the amount the Bureaus of Construction and Repair and Steam­ time as I could. Engineering have expended since 1867 in the repair of these wooden Mr. WARNER, of Ohio. I have heard it stated that four years ·ships which now belong to the Navy. would suffice, and that by the end of that time we would have no It is as follows: wooden vessels. Mr. CALKINS. That I think is a mistake. It would ta.ke a con­ Memoranda of Bureau of Steam-Engineering. siderably longer period-perhaps ten or twelve years. Mr. REED. Mr. Chairman, I believe that this 30 per cent. clau e Date of warrant. Appropriation. Extraordinary Ordinary ex- ought to be retained, and I entertain that belief because I perceive ou expenses. penses. the other side of this House an unwillingness to create or help to create a steel navy. MeantimewearegoingtofindoU.tselves under the opera­ .July 2,1868 ...... $650,000 00 $31,500 00 $618,500 00 tion of the 20 per cent. clause without the vessels which are absolutely .July 1, 1869 ...... 650,000 00 62,970 00 1, 087,030 00 necessary for the ordinary purposes of a navy in times of peace. l\iarch 10, 1869 ...... 500, 000 00 } As I am informed, the 20 per cent. clause is not in the interest of ..July 31,1870...... 1,000,000 00 '1:1,334 00 972,666 00 ..July 1,1871 ...... :...... 1, 160,000 00 232,750 00 927,250 00 economy, if we intend to repair wooden ships at all. We are practi­ August '1:1, 1872...... 1, 650,000 00 174.,600 00 1, 475, 400 00 cally voting to throw.away 80 per cent. of the value of our wooden ships. August 25, 1873...... 2, 300, 000 00 For myself I do not believe that is wise economy. I believe th~t 30 ..January 24, 1874 ...... 335,000 00 } 1, 262, 212 00 1,372, 788 00 July 30,1874 ...... I, 800,000 00 773,200 00 1, 026, 800 00 per cent. is as low a level as we ought to strike for in this matter; but .July 17,1875 ...... 1, 800,000 00 898,000 00 902,000 00 I believ~, on the other hand, with the gentleman from Indiana, that August 31, 1876 ...... 942, 500 00 462,700 00 4.79,800 00 with the 30 per cent. clause we ought to have an increase of the appro­ ..July 31 1 1877 . ,. ,.,,,.,.,. "'"", ,,,. ,,.,, 9421 000 00 199,000 00 743,000 00 .June '1:l, 1878...... *1, 423, 876 67 *1, 423, 876 67 priations, because by retaining that clause we declare a policy that we July 24, 1878 ...... ,...... 800,000 00 19,750 00 ...... 7&i .·250·oo shall repair such vessels as retain 70 per cent. of their value; and if we ..July 22,1879 ...... 800,000 00 800,000 00 repair such ships we will need an appropriation of a million and a half August 2, 1880...... 800, 000 00 ...... 52;sis·oo· 74.7,184. 00 April15, 1881...... 75, 000 00 dollars at least. April15, 1881...... 75, 000 00 40,000 00 910,000 00 I am in hopes that the House, after voting in the 30 per cent. clause, .July 29, 1881...... 800,000 00 } will recognize the logical result of its own action and vote a million and ~ugust 31, 1882...... *212, 000 00 *212,000 00 ctober 4, 1882...... 1, 600, 000 00 105,000 00 ... i:'495:ooo·oo a; half of dollars for repairs, instead of the sum proposed by this bill...... 136 00 Mr. HUTCHINS. The Committee on Appropriations inserted that J~~b~~ ~~::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: 1,000,~ ~ 15,000 00 985,000 00 clause in consequence of a recommendation on the part of the chief of Total of sixteen years...... 1-21-,-31-5-,-5l2-6-7-l------:----- 5, 992, 708 67 1 15, 322, SO! 00 the Bureau of Construction and Repair. The committee thought if the 20 per cent. clause was retained that in the course of the next three • Deficiency appropriation. years there would be a large reduction in the number of wooden v - 1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD- HOUSE. 1633 sels, some of which we can ill afford to spare; and in the course of the l\fr. RANDALL. I rely upon what I have read as showing the nature next five or six years, from natural causes, a large number-in fact, of his testimony; and I suppo e he said the same as he would have nearly all of the wooden vessels would be blotted from the Register. done if under oath. That is the substance of the report which has been made to us, and I Ur. THOMAS. After looking at the printed evidence on which the need not quote from it further. gentleman from Pennsylvania based his statement, I see he was en­ But, l\ir. Chairman, I wish also to call attention to the fact that the tirely warranted in what he did say. At the same time I make this Senate, in voting for the construction of seven additional steel cruisers, explanation as to the source from which I received my information, has inserted a section, the fourth section of their bill, incorporating this not having read the report of the Chief Constructor's evidence. Hav­ 30 per cent. limit, which bill passed the Senate by a large majority. I ing seen certain reports in the newspapers that he had made such state- believe $1,000,000 is enough to appropriate for the repair of such ships ments, he said to me he had not. . as may need repair, and still retain this 30 per cent. clause. l\1r. H TCHINS. If the gentleman will read on further in the Now, the gentleman from l\Iaine [l\Ir. REED], in his few remarks, testimony of the Chief Constructor he will find that he made other ob­ stated that be was in favor of it because this side of the House had an­ j e~tions to those cruisers. nounced a determination not to proceed with the construction of steel l\Ir. HISCOCK. I want to ask the gentleman from Pennsylvania a cruisers. I am sure the gentleman did not mean to be unfair-- question. Does he believe the amount carried by this bill for con­ 1\Ir. REED. If the gentleman will permit me, I meant to say that struction and repair will be sufficient for the bureau if the percentage the action of this side of the House on the bills presented here shows be raised to 30 ? that to be true, and from those bills my inference was drawn. l\Ir. RANDALL. I believe an economical administration of the l\Ir. HUTCHINS. Then if the gentleman and his side of the House million dollars appropriated will be adequate at the 30 per cent. rate, when they voted last year for the construction "'f four steel cruisers which really affects but a few vessels. thought it so imperative that that number should be larger, why, when 1\Ir. HISCOCK. That is a general expression. they had the power to do so, did they not pass a bill increasing the 1\fr. RANDALL. I am not a nautical man, and do not know that I number? can be more definite. l\ir. REED. If I may interrupt the gentleman to respond I will say l\Ir. HISCOCK. I understood the gentleman from Indiana [I\ir. that our side of the House intended to go on and add another four this CALKINS] to say that 400,000 would besufficientto repairthevessels, year, if we had been providentially assisted in retaining the control of only expending 20 per cent. upon them for the current year. this House. l\ir. RANDALL. . The gentleman last year-- l\Ir. HUTCHINS. Thenwehavenowa billforseven in placeoffour, Ur. HISCOCK. I ask the gentleman to hear me out. I know what and therefore the gentleman ought to be satisfied, because he gets three we gave last year. But. I understood the gentleman from Indiana to more than he expected. say that if the Secret.:'lry of the Navy repairs those vessels only upon Now, we appropriated tor these steel cruisers everything that the Sec­ which 20 per cent. ca,n be expended, then there is a ufficiency to com­ retary of the avy declared was necessary. Why, then, should the gen­ plete the repairs to the amount of 400,000. tleman from l\1aine make uch a statement? It is not right. It is made Mr. CALKINS. It has been so reported to me. for effect. It is made to go out to the country as an intimation of an in­ Mr. HISCOCK. Now, as I understand it, you reduce the appropria­ correct allegation that the Democratic party is opposed to the building of tion 100,000, increasing the rate to 30 per cent. If this be true will the steel cruisers. It is not true that they are in tavor of withholding there not be a deficiency-that is, a' failure to repair up to the limit you the appropriations for that purpose. The Democratic side of this House have fixed? is in favor of appropriating all that is necessary for carrying on the con­ Mr. RANDALL. I voted in the committee for a million dollars, be­ struction of these vessels and the putting of the Navy in proper shape. lieving that that would be adequate for all the repairs necessary under The present bill gives all of the money for the completion of these cruis­ the increase of 10 per cent. as provided in the bill. But I also want to ers that is necessary for their completion in all respects in accordance insert in this bill, and have asked the Secretary of theNavy to prepare with the purpose for which they are now being built. an amendment, which he has prepared and which I have in my hand, to But, Mr. Chairman, let me say to the gentleman from :Maine now prevent the Secretary of the Navy spending in seven months the allot- that the Navy Departmentitselfis adividedhouseuponthisveryques­ ments by this Congress for twelve months. · tion. We have a report here of testimony from the Chiefof the Bureau Mr. HISCOCK. l\Ir. Chairman-- of Construction and Repair, giving a statement that in his judgment Mr. RANDALL. Will the gentleman just keep calm? I want to these cruisers will be failures, and he stands at the head of the depart­ add after line 272 a proviso that this amount shall be apportioned in ment. monthly installments during the next fiscal year, and the apportion­ 1\Ir. HISCOCK. Then why do you appropriate a dollar for them? If ment shall be adhered to except in some emergency. I am willing to you believe they are failures, why not stop and not give a cent for them? give the Secretary a discretion in case of emergency, but not otherwise. l\fr. RANDALL. We make up our own appropriation bills. Mr. HISCOCK. I understand the practice in the Department is pre­ 1\Ir. HUTCHINS. The gentleman from New York asks why we do cisely what the gentleman's amendment provides for. That is the prac­ not stop appropriating for these steel cruisers. This is the reason: It tice there this year. is an experiment, and we propose to go on with the experiment and test Mr. RANDALL. I think there would be no deficiency if that was the question. And the other side will be responsible. They com­ law. menced these cruisers. They passed the first enact-ment in regard to l\Ir. HISCOCK. Oh, well, let us understand about this deficiency. them. They et them on the stocks. They have gone so far with the Let us have it fully understood by the committee. I say, and assert construction of them, and if they are to be a failure we propose that the that the practice of this bureau is to divide the appropriation into other side shall be responsible for it and not we. monthly allowances, and that this amendment which the Secretary of 1\fr. RANDALL. I move to strike out the last word. A few min­ the Navy has sent here will not change the practice at all. utes ago there was some controversy as to what the Chief Constructor Mr. RANDALL. I say that they have not done that this current did say in reference to these cruisers. I hold in my hand the testimony year or there would not be a deficiency. taken by the Sena.te committee and printed by order of the Senate. l\I . HISCOCK. Will the gentleman hear me out? .As to the defi­ Here is what he says, and gent.lemen can draw their own inferences as ciency, I say there is no deficiency. I say the money has not been ex­ to what he means. When Chief Constructor Wilson was being exam­ pended. Now, what is the condition of things? ined as to these cruisers the chairman of the Senate committee asked Mr. RANDALL. But the gentleman- - him the following question: Mr. HISCOCK. Hear me, and we will have no misunderstanding You think they will be failures practically? about it, for I believe I am right. The SecretaryoftheNavysaysthat Chief Constructor Wil on replied: if he repairs all the ships in the service under the law which allows him I think these vessels will practically be failures as sea-going vessels. In smooth to expend for repairs 20 per cent. of the appraised value of the ships he water there is no question but that they will have speed and that they will go ·will require $400,000moreforthat purpose than wa.s given him. Does along very nicely; but in a sea I believe they will be a failure. the gentleman understand me and follow me? I wish the gentleman Now the gentleman from Illinois [Mr. THOMAS] contradicted me a to understand me upon this point. I say there no deficiency in that moment ago and thought I was mistaken as to the testimony given by bureau. that officer. I do not think I was. It will be seen that my remark in ~ir. RANDALL. That is a. mere quibble. that respect was warranted by the actual testimony gi>en. 1\Ir. HISCOCK. Oh, no. l\lr. THOMAS. l\fy tatement was ba d npon the statement of the 1\ir. RANDALL. There will be a deficiency. Chief Con tructorhim elf. In a conversation had with me be said it bad ir. HISCOCK. Wait a moment. I ·am sorry that the gentleman been reported that he had denounced the new cruisers a failures, and from l\Iaine [Mr. REED Jtook the attention of the gentleman from Penn­ he said he bad not done anything of the sort; that what he meant to sylvania [l\lr. RA}]"DALL J so that he bas not followed me in my remarks. say wa that he had some objections to them; that. he thought they I hope that, if I require it, some gentleman will give me a portion of should have orne more sail power and that they were objectionable in his time. some respects; but he did not mean to say they were failures at all. It Mr. REED. I will do so, after your reference to me. was on his statement that I made the remark I did, without having read Mr. HISCOCK. What I say is this: This money is expended by that his testimony before the Senate committee. bureau in monthly allotments. There is no deficiency there. There XV--103 1634 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. MARCH 5, is the a:ppropria tion, and the portion of it for the remainder of the year is for the Mohican) was appropriated for this work of repair and construc­ there now. But what the. Secretary of the Navy says is that if here­ tion. The Secretary of the Navy went on under the 20 per cent. J>ro ­ pairs all the ships which he has the right under the law to repair, pro­ vision: and when the h.t of January came he found he bad but $ , 000 vided he has money enough for it under the law permitting him to ex­ left, with a number of ships still unrepaired and unfit for se..'l<-senice. pend for repairs 20 per cent. of the appraised value of the ships, he will He reports that $400 000 in addition to the one million already appropri­ need 400,000 more to do the work than we have given him. That is ated will be required to finish those ships now in the dock for repair­ what be says. to do the work of the current year. The CHAIH.MAN. The time of the gentleman bas expired. Mr. RA.l~DALL. Did not the gentleman understand the Secretary Mr. REED. I will take the floor and yield my time to the gentle­ of the Navy to say that the whole amount is gone? man from New York [Mr. HISCOCK]. l\Ir. CALKINS. Yes; thewholeamountis gone. Now, ifyourai e Mr. HISCOCK. That is the condition of things. There is no defi­ the percentage from 20 to 30, and give only $1,000,000, you must have cienc·y there, and there can be no deficiency there. The only question a de:fidency next year of 8700,000 instead of 400,000 if this work of re­ is, how many ships do you desire to have repaired and kept in commis­ pairing is to be done. That is the whole of it. sion? That is what I desire to impress upon the gentleman from Penn- l\1r. REED. That is a good argument in favor of increasing the sylvania [1\Ir. RANDALL]. . amount ofthe appropriation. The Secretary of the Navy can spend no more money than you give Mr. CALKINS. One word further. My friend from New York say!:> him. He has no objection to your making this requirement for monthly there can be in fact no deficiency, because just at the moment the allotments for the next fiscal year. I understand that from the Secre­ money runs out, if only six months of the year have expired, work will · tary of the Navy. But the point I make is that for the current year be suspended and the hands discharged. he has not money enough to repair all the ships within the limit of the [Here the hammer fell. J law of the current year. The CIIAIR IAN. lf there be no objection, the Chair will tre~t the And now, when you change that limit and provide that a larger num­ formal amendments as withdrawn. The Chair hears no objection. The ber of shlps may be repaired and at the same time do not increase the question is now upon the amendment of the gentleman from Indiana amount of the appropriation, certainly your bill is subject to the objec­ [Mr. CALKINS] to strike out "thirty" and inert "twenty.' tion made to it by the gentleman from Indiana [Mr. CALKIXS]. The amendment was not agreed to. 1\ir. RANDALL. The gentleman last year, or the committee oYer lli. RANDALL. I now moYe to amend by adding at. the end of which he presided, reported an appropriation of $1,000,000 for this pur­ line 262, on page 12, the following: pose. The bill went to the Senate and that body added 100,000 mak­ And this amount shall be apportioned in monthly in tallments during the ing the appropriation $1,100,000, with the verbal understanding. orne­ next fiscal year; and the apportionment shall be adhered to, except in orne where, not of record in the statute, that the increased amount was to emergency. be expended at Mare Island in the further construction of the 1ohican, The amendment was agreed to. I think, a wooden steamer. We have gi>en in this bill the necessary Ir. REED. I move to amend by striking out ''twenty'' and in­ money to finish it. serting "five hundred;" so as to make the amount of the appropriation I say that the Secretary of the Nary, in a communication which I $1,500,000. hold in my band, informs us that on the 1st of January, 1884, there Mr. Chairman, I submit that this amendment ought to follow as a was in the Treasury available of that appropriation of $1,000,000 the matter of course after the other. The fact as they have been de­ sum of $88,678. Now, gentlemen will see at once that w hetber it be the Yeloped and as they are admitted by both sides are sufficient to enforce­ rule or not the Secretary of the Nary bas not adhered to the system of what I have said. It is admitted upon both sides that it is probably monthly allotments which the gentleman from New York speaks of. not proposed to go on at present-in any large way, at least-with t he If that is the rule in the Department, I want to make it the l~w. construction of a steel navy. Even the gentleman from New York says The Secretary of the Navy goes on further and states that he will re­ only that the Senate has pa ed a. bill proposing to build seven teel >e els;. quire further money to complete the repairs on the vessels that he has be­ he says nothing as to the disposition of this Rouse; and it is commonly gunto repair with the million of dollars which was appropriated ]a t year. expected that the bill will be defeated here. Mr. HISCOCK. Oh; yes. Now, we are approaching such a couditionof affairs that unle ·orne­ Mr. RANDALL. I will state what I know of my own 1..-nowledge, thing be done we shall have neither a steel nor a wooden navy. The that out of that million of dollars the Secretary of the Navy proceeded ground I take is that we ought to repair our wooden ships and keep. with the repairs of the Ossipee at League Island navy-yard. And in them going until we get a sufficient steel navy to take their place. the list of items given for which this additional amount of money is It has been shown on all sides that under the 20 per cent. clause wanted is included the urn of 14,000 for that vessel. ,. 1,000,000 is not sufficient for these repairs. On the contrary, every I think that I have established clear1ythat the million of dollars ap­ dollar of that appropriation has been expended and . the shlps which propriated last year has not been expended under any system of monthly were to be repaired under tha,t provision have not been repaired. When allotment&>; but, on the contrary, ha been exhausted, or nearly so in instead of 20 per cent. you insert 30 per cent., you of com e increase the fiTst six months of the current year. the number of ships to be repaired; and if an appropriation of 1,000,00(} Mr. CALKINS. If my colleague on the committee is through-- was not sufficient under the 20 per cent. provision, it follows a fort ion 1\Ir. RANDALL. I want to add that we deem a million of dollars that 1,000,000 can not be enough after we have adopted a 30 per cent. adequate for this purpose for the next year. If there were twenty ves- provision. Hence we ought to appropriate, a my ameijdment proposes, . sels repaired last year, that is no reason why there should be twenty ve - one million and a half of dollars. sels to be repaired next year; it may be necessary to repair only ten. Ir. HUTCHINS. The gentleman from Uaine [Mr. REED] assumes We simply say that the Secretary of the Navy shall have for this pur­ that under this 30 per cent. provision more money will be needed. The· pose the same amount which wa ap}'ropriated last year for expenditure Committee on Appropriations are of opinion that, in view of the work under the 20 per cent. regulation, and we do not helieve that the in­ which has been done and the present condition of the sill p to be repaired, creased percentage should require any additional money. 1,000,000 will be sufficient to dotbe work. This is my answertothe And we want to proYide further that the money shall be e;q~ended gentleman. under the system of monthly allotments, so as if possible to cut off the The question recurred on ~1r. REED's amendment. possibility, when the second session of this Congress or the first ses ion ilr. REED demanded a division. of the next Congress shall convene, of being called upon to appropriate The committee dirided; and there were-ayes 54, noes 89. in excess of the amount agreed upon by Congress to be expended for So the amendment ""as rejected. this purpose. The Clerk read as follows: 1\lr. CALKINS. In my judgment it does not make any difference BUREAU OF STEAM-ENGINEERING. whether the Secretary of the Navy makes monthly allotments of the For repairs, completion, and preservation of machinery and boilers, including· amount which we appropriate for this purpose or whether he expends it steam-steerers, steam-capstans, steam-windlasses, &c. , in vessels on the stocks. and in ordinary; purchase and preservation of all materials and tore ; pur­ all in a few months. Here is a lot of ships that come in and are out of cha e, fitting, and repair of machinery and tools in the navy-yards and tations; repair. The board examines them and finds that certain of them can wear, tear , and repair of machinery and boilers of naval vessels; incidental ex­ be repaired within the limit fixed by law, anQ. they are immediately sent. pense , such as foreign postages telegrams, advertising, freight, photographing, books, stat.ionery, and insu·uments, ~IDO ,OOO; and the unexpended balance or to the navy-yards for repairs. the appropriation of $1,000,000 made by the act approved l\larcb 3, 1883, for Now, if you make an allotment of the amount appropriated, it is .-ery engines and ma

M:r. CALKINS. I make the point of order against the provision in 1\Ir. RANDA.LL. Certainly. line 283, commencing with the word '' and,'' in reference to the engines Mr. GLASCOCK. What defense would this wooden vessel be against and machinery for the double-turreted ironclads. a Chilian cruiser or an ironclad of any other nation on earth ? Before I state the point of order I may as well relate to the Chair the Mr. RANDALL. For that matter, just about as much as if you sent history of the appropriation. Last year there was 1,000,000 appro­ the l\Ionadnock to ea. priated, to be allotted between the four monitors, Puritan, Terror, Am­ ir. GLASCOCK. We do not expect her to go to sea, but to be usetl phitrite, and Monadnock. The Secretary of the Xavy, under the act, for coast defense. That is all we ask. alloted certain moneys to each of these vessels, and made a contract for 1\.ll·. CALKINS. Will the gentleman from Pennsylvania permit me completing so far as it wentthe:firstthree, Puritan, Terror, and Amphi­ to state lio him that under the point of order, if sustained, the same trite, which leftabout$1 2,000or 183,000tocompletethe:Monadnock, amount of money is appropriated, and in that respect it amounts totbe which is the monitor on the Pacific coast. Congress convened before same thing, as far as this provision is concerned, precisely as if it was he made a contract under that law for the work on the Monadnock. The overruled. Tbe only difference is that it diverts the amount from one claus~ against which I have made the point of order seeks to di,ert the channel to another. The proposition in its present form changes ex­ appropriation made last year for this fiscal year from the purpose for isting la.w. which it was appropriated, and to put it into the general fund for the 1\Ir. HANDA.LL. It provides that the money shall not be expended building of other vessels. In other words, it is to stop the work on the in the construction of machinery. It saves expenditmes to that extent. Monadnock and put the money into the general fund, and then to re­ ::\Ir. CALKINS. Certainly not. It appropriates the $750,000 for appropriate it. For instance, the Secretary of theNavy at any time up the e pmposes specified in the preceding part of this paragraph and to the 1st day of next July could have made a contract under the law diverts into another channel the remainder of the unexpended appro­ for work upon the 1\Ionadnock, but this clause seeks to stop that and priation. It will lea.ve the amount precisely as I have aid; precisely divert the money into the general fnnd. My point of order is it does as it is now with the proYision in. not reduce expenditure, and is obnoxious to the rule in changing exist­ l\Ir. HISCOCK. The only way the gentleman from Pennsy~vania ing law. can reach the point of saving expense in that respect is by suspending 1\Ir. RANDALL. A million of dollars was appropriated for machin­ the expenditure of that money. ery and engines of four ironclads. Three were contracted for, and they 1\Ir. RANDALL. That is the practical effect of the provision. are now under way and nearing completion. For the other no contract Ir. HISCOCK. .._To; not in its pre ent form. You provide for its was made, and the policy of the committee is to save the money, some expenditme but diYert it. · 172,000, by preventing it being expended on the iron-cladmonitorat 1\Ir. UA~TD.ALL. We confen-ed with the Secretary of the" Navy upon l\Iare Island, because they believed there isnooccasionwhatevertoput that point, and were informed by him that he did not propose to enter an engine in a \essel for the completion of which this bill does not pro­ upon the contracts for the engines. He conceded that position to the vide. subcommittee. As will be observed, the bill does not provide for completing any of Mr. HISCOCK. But the manner, lsay, if the gentleman will permit the ironclads, and if we had not been brought face to face with a con­ me to go on, in which he can reach his point is to put into the bill a pro­ tract as to the other three ironclads we would not have appropriated vision suspending the power of the Secretary of the Navy to expend for them. As I make out by my arithmetic, it is a clear saving of that money. 172,000. Ir. RAYDA.LL. The present provision does that. Let us have a Ur. GLASCOCK. l\Ir. Chairman, as a Representative from the Pa­ ruling on the point of order. cific coast, I wish to call the special attention of this House to the present The CHAIRMAN. The Chair is of opinion that this clause is a defenseless condition of that coast. We have not there atthis time any change of existing law, because it diverts a former appropriation from war vessel which could successfully compete with any ironclad or other its former purpose to a new one. In that diversion, however, it saves war vessel of a fifth-rate power. This should not be, and I am in favor of the expendib;· · of whatever that sum of money may be. establishing a different and better condition of things as soon as possible. The Chair would be of opinion that it does retrench expenditmes to I believe, sir, the policy we are now pursuing in refusing to finish this extent, that it &'Wes the necessity of appropriating again money to the ironclads is a bad one, and I will not support it,. I believe in the same extent in this bill. economy and reform, but I do not believe in that economy and reform The Chair therefore feels called upon to overrule the point of order. which would leave IO,OOOmilesofseacoastin theUnitedStatesentirely Mr. CALKINS. Provided they would do it. defen~eless and 200,000,000 ofproperty at the hazard of war, which 1\Ir. BUDD. I move to strike out of that section the words begin­ may happen at any moment. ning with ''and,'' in line 283, down to and inclusive of the word ''par­ The fact in relation to these ironclads have been stated both by the agraph," in line 290. gentleman from Indiana and the gentleman from Penn ylvania. There The CHAIRl\IAN. The amendment propo ed by the gentleman from were four ironclads, steel-turreted monitors, authorized to be built. California will be read: One million of dollars wa appropriated for them in the naval appro­ The Clerk read as follows: priation bill of the last Congress. About 830,000 of this sum has al­ And the unexpended balance of the appropriation of $1,000,000 made by the l'eady been contracted for to finish the machinery for three of them, act approved March 3, 1883, for engines and machinery for the double-turreted and there is still a hundred and seventy-odd thousand dollars which ironclads be, and the arne is hereby, reappropriated and made available dur­ ing the fi cal year ending June 30, 1885, for the purposes enumerated in this remains to be used in that same direction unless it be diverted into other paragraph. channels, as it will be if the present provision of thia bill shall pass in" this form. Mr. BUDD. ~Ir. Chairman, I desire to indorse and emphasize the 1\Ir. Chairman, ail that we on the Pacific coast ask is to have an oppOT­ remark made by the gentleman from California [1\-Ir. GLASCOCK] who tunity of being placed upon a footing in respect to these ironclads as spoke a few moments ago. The amount required for the completion of the rest of the country. All that we ask is that you place the 1\Ionad­ these monitors i. about the same as the amount we voted as the rebate nock in ~he same position and condition that you place the other iron­ on tobacco. It i an insignificant un1 when compared with the re­ clads. Pnt it on an even keel with the other vessels of the same sys­ sources of this Government. tem. Complete her to the extent of putting her maehinery in, and then I speak in faYor of the :Monadnock. The Pn.cific coast is almost de­ if you choose to do so let her be laid up in ordinary, so that if this Gov­ fensele...<:8. ·we are orne 3,000 miles away from the .Atlantic seaboal"d. ernment shall ever be required to meet an emergency, if you shall be We are expo ed to the attacks of any vessel of war that might come called upon here in Congress to take steps to provide for the defense of there. The harbor defenses are not sufficient to tmn aside or keep out. the nation, she will require no more work to complete her and put her even a second-rate wooden vessel of war. And I say it will benoecon­ upon a war footing than the balance of the ship of the same cla . I omy, bnt an outrage to pre\ent the completion of this \e...<;.Sel designed. ask this in behalf of the Pacific coast. It i a small request that we for the defense of the Pacific coast. make in consideration of the vast interests at stake on that coast. 1\Ir. HUTCHIXS. I sympathize with the gentleman from California [Here the hammer fell.] [1\Ir. BUDD] in this matter, and am willing to act with him in that l\Ir. RANDALL. I can readily understand why the gentleman from line of policy that would lead to some sort of defense for our eacoas1. California should be so zealous in his advocacy of the completion of What the committee would desire, or at any rate speaking for my elf this vessel; but I submit that if these vessels are not to be finished there what I should desire, would be to see the amount that would be appro­ is no earthly occasion for spending this $172,000 remaining of last year's priated, ifthe gentleman's amendment should be adopted, for the com­ appropriation in putting machinery and engines into the ::\Ionadnock. pletion of the e monitors-to see that amount saved and applied to The gentleman from California says we have left the Pacific coast de­ coast defense. The trouble is that if the monitors were completed to­ fenseless. He is entirely mistaken in that particular. The last Con­ day they would be perfectly worthless. Every dollar expended upon gress provide~ a hundred thousand dollars for the completion of the them would be o much thrown away. Mohican which is a wooden steam-vessel, and we have provided enough Mr. BUDD. What is the gentleman' authority for that statement? money in this bill to finish her, which is an adequate protection against Mr. REED. Why does not the gentleman from New York order those any incursion which I think the Pacific coast may apprehend from any vessels to be broken up if that is the case and preven~ the possibility quarter. of more money being wasted upon them? ' Mr. GLASCOCK. Will the gentleman from Pennsylvania let me :Mr. HUTCHL~S. Because the gentleman from New York has not ask him a question? , the power to do it. 1636 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. l\1ARCH 5,

Mr. RANDALL. The Army and Navy Journal recommends them fnlness. The active little Condor at Alexandria was as useful as the to be sold. great, heavily-armored tubs. Mr. REED. Then why do you not sell them? I say this matter of pretended economy is not true economy. It is Mr. RANDALL. We require legislation to do that. parsimony. What we want on the Pacific coast is a vessel that will Mr. REED. Whycouldyou not have recommended that legislation protect us. here? I speak for the benefit of the Pacific coast. Do not leave a million M:r. HUTCHINS. When by the action of this House the policy to of people, a billion of property, and a commerce of nearly a hundred be pursued in relation to this matter is known then we can follow with million a year open to the attacks of every fourth-rate power and at the some proposition. mercy of third-rate wooden war ships. Build the monitors and we will :Mr. REED. 1\fr. Chairman-- risk the seven to nine inches of steel and iron on them. l\1r. HUTCHINS. I give way to the gentleman from 1\Iaine [Mr. 1\Ir. RANDALL. I do not think the Committee on Appropriations REED] to offer an amendment himself in the line of what he is indi­ of this House can justly claim any originality in refusing to make this cating. appropriation to complete these ironclads. The Committee on Appro­ fr. BUDD. I would like the gentleman from New York to name his priations of the last House did not recommend anything in the way of authority for the statement that these vessels would be useless when completing the ironclads, either for the machinery or for the engines. constructed. That appropriation was inserted by the Senate and finally forced through Mr. HUTCHINS. Will the gentleman from California tell me how in the conference report, much against the will, as I believe, of the ma­ thick the armor upon these vessels is to be? jority of the House of the last Congress. I remember that the other side l\Ir. BUDD. I have not made special investigation as to that, and were a great deal divided upon this very question. There were distin­ can not say to the half-inch the varying thickness of the different guished leading men on the other side who resisted altogether any ap­ parts. propriations for the engines and machinery of these ironclads. Yet we Mr. HUTCHINS. The thickness of the armor is seven inches. And are invited by the gentleman from Maine [Mr. REED] to go now beyond will the gentleman tell me how many inches of armor on the steel ves­ thecourse followed last year and make this appropriation, although we sels can now be pierced by modem guns, the last constructed? may be certain it will ultimately require the expenditure of nearly if Mr. BUDD. Not exactly. Can you? not quite $4,000,000. l\Ir. HUTCHIN . I will tell tile gentleman. It can be pierced Mr. REED. If the Chair will pardon me I will say to the gentleman twenty-two inches, more than three times the thickness of this armor, from Pennsylvania [ fr. RANDALL] thatidonotinvitehim to make any and you might as well line them with wood or burn the money as ap­ appropriations, but to take one course or the other. If his conviction propriate it to these ve els. is that these ships should not be completed, then let him bring forward Mr. GLASCOCK. Will the gentle~an from New York yield to me a proposition requiring them to be broken up. a moment? l\fr. RANDALL. The po ition which tho gentleman from Maine Mr. HUTCHINS. Yes, sir. wishes me to occupy is one in regard to which I can not please him any­ Mr. GLASCOCK. The armor of the M:onadnock consists of seven way; whether I suggest an appropriation or whether I propose to break inches of iron faced with two inches of steel. up the ships. ~1r. BUDD. Would a vessel so armored be useless? 1\Ir. REED. I must say that the gentleman has not been remarkable 1\fr. HUTCHINS. I say certain guns are now being constructed that for pleasing me at any time: [Laughter.] would pierce three times that thickness of armor. Then what is the Mr. SUMNER, of California. In this age of progre , when the in­ use of going on with the const.ruction of vessels of that class? ventive genius of the race is stimulated to the highest tension with a 1\fr. BUDD. Why not say, what is the use of building any vessels? view to warlike artifice and preparation, if we are to withhold any large Any vessel invulnerable would be ponderous, unmanageable, and unsea­ naval-construction appropriations or outlays for the completion of half­ worthy. finished or half-furnished vessels until an absolutely in'lpenetrable ca ing Mr. HUTCHINS. We go on experimenting to find out what vessels shall have been made, we might as well say at once that we will stop will be capable of resisting modern guns. business in the frigate and gunboat and cruiser yards altogether. It is Mr. BUDD. What, then, is the use of building these steel cruisers? notorious that just so soon as the proclamation has gone abroad that an Mr. HUTCHINS. For the purpose of cruising. They are not for impervious, indestructible iron plate has been discovered and tested, defense. capable of defying every known piece of ordnance, some whittling or Mr. BUDD. Ah! rifling Yankee or some English mechanic has come forward with an ir­ Mr. REED. The gentleman from New York [l\1r. HUTCHINS] offers resistible projectile, before which the last tough target presents no ad­ to allow me to make an amendment to break up these vessels. Now, equate resistance. The new armor, that was to be the perfect shield for I submit to the House that that offer is entirely in line with the usual all. time to come, is perforated as though it was brown paper or shattered policy of the Democratic party. When anything has got to be done as though it was window-glass. Then iron sides give place to steel, and they always want a Republican to do it. Now, I beg to say to the gen­ somanyinchesinthicknessaresupersededbyduplicatedandquadrupled tlel.mn that the reason why I do not offer the amendment is because I sheet.c; of the finest metal for resistance, the weight and force of the can­ do not believe in it. The question I ask him is why, when he says non rising in proportion. Have we not about reached the end of this these vessels are failures-why does he not offer the amendment? alternating advantage of ship-armor and battery might? And, besides, I yield the remainder of my time to the gentleman from California in contests between vessels in harbors or on the ocean there are other ele­ [~lr. BUDD]. ments or qualities to be considered. The victory is not always with the Mr. BUDD. Though I do not know the exact number of inches of thickest skull or the stoutest fist. In the naval engagement omething iron or steel in this vessel, I do know it will float; I know it will have is always due-sometimes the final result is due-in greatest proportion, speed and the points essential in an ironclad; l know it will carry if not entirely, to the accuracy of the marksmen, the relative power of guns; I know it will carry a. crew; and I know its guns will throw as the engines, or the dexterity of the man at the helm. The Monadnock, ,, large a ball and throw it with as much force as those of any other like furnished with the latest improvP.d machinery and carrying the most vessel. And if the gentleman from New York says he does not wish to effective rifled guns, may be, and we insist will be, a formidable an­ appropriate any money unless the steel armor of the vessel will turn tagonist. We ask for the expenditure upon her of the legitimate appro­ aside the balls of the most powerfUl guns of the world, then he may priation, and we protest. against it being taken away. We acknowledge as well say that no ironclad should ever be built, for that is the logic no adequate or fit substitute in the devoting of a small sum of money of his statement; because experience and experiment and the evidence on a wooden vessel. of experts prove that no matter how thick the armor may be built a It is notorious that California is without any suitable defense for her gun will be made that can drive a ball through it. harbors against a threatening foe. You must know that there is no Why do you not withhold your appropriations from Alcatraz, Fort kind of preparation to ward off an enemy save at San Francisco. Point, and Black Point? There is not a single one of these that can There is a little brick wall on one side of the Golden Gate, with some re ~ ist balls from the most powerful guns. There is no fort in the United side batteries, which have been pronounced by unanimous military States that conld not be battered down by guns planted to command opinion-so that here there can be no mistake-wholly insufficient to 1 it. And simply to say that a. ball can be projected with such force as stay an incoming Chilian ironclad. Indeed, these '~defenses, ' so called, to penetrate the armor of these monitors is begging the question. would hardly afford a half hour's amusement to the new monitors No invulnerable vessel can be constructed that will be seaworthy. of the deep. We have great natural advantages for defense at Bluck Such an ironclad would be ponderous and unmanageable. As experts Point and Alcatraz in a contest when a face-to-face or stationary say, it would be sluggish and a plunger, and as the thickness of the enemy is to be encountered. So one would think. And yet the power plates increased the ship would be sunk deeper in the water and ren­ and efficiency there lodged might be spoken of too highly. For on the dered more unwieldy, more deficient in speed, and defective in those centennial Fourth of July the artillery there posted continued to fire points essential to succe.<~s in maneuvering around a superior force. Ce­ for hours at an old barge or schooner, situated a few thousand yards lerity of motion, great speed, and grea.t facility in turning appear to be distant, without causing serious damage, until some volunteer vessel­ some of the most important elements in ships of war. Absolute pro­ perhaps propelled to close quarters on orders that sprang from pity or tection by plates is incompatible with sailing qualities. We can not shame-moved into close proximity a.nd discharged au effective broad­ fully protect a. ship against heavy guns and retain one element of use- side. 1884. OONG RESSION A.L RECORD- HOUSE. 1637

We have not heard the efficiency of the Monadnock impeached to that The CHAIRMAN. The question is whether it does in fact reduce degre.~ that would set her aside. With all due respect, the critici"ms of expenditures. navala,nd military officers must be taken with much allowance. They 1\Ir. CALKINS. When, at the outset of the consideration of this bill do not agree with regard to these subjects among themselves; and for under the :five-minute rule, I made a point of order upon one. of its pro­ one I have ceased to pay much re.o:;pectful attention to them, since if visions, the Chair held, becau e I said that indirectly in the far future many of them are to be believed the Government ought to break up the provision might benefit the Treasury, it came within the rule. This all her ships and throw aside as useless all the weapons in its arsenals, case comes precisely under that ruling, because the amendment prondes and proceed to manufacture entirely from new patterns for ordnance, that until the number of these officers shall be reduced to :fifteen there and for lock, stock, and barrel. shall be no more appointments, and this corps shall remain thereafter I have seen the M:onadnock, which up to the opening of this debate I at that number. supposed was to besetin orderforus. Tomylayman's.eye,comparing The CHAIRMAN. Does the gentleman claim that this amendment her with many I have seen of her kind elsewhere, comparing her so well now reduces expenditures. as I could with vessels of her class that are said to be still approved by 1\Ir. CALKI;NS. I claim that it reduces expenses in this way: lt the most competent judges, she has the appearance of a powerful boat, provides that the appointments to this corps shall be suspended until well adapted for battle, and capable of being :fitted and used as a worthy the number is reduced to :fifteen, and that this shall remain as the messenger of defen e within and off the harbor of San Francisco. Ifyou number. In this way I submit the amendment comes directly within will let us have this sufficient fund to supply her with engines and place the ruling already made by the present occupant of the chair upon this on her the stoutest cannon that she can carry, we think the money will be bill. But I go further, and say that there is a direct saving of ex­ justly expended. We insist again that you commitan injustice if you penditures in this way: There are now two heads of bureaus. This divert this appropriation from this object. makes a reduction of one; it takes one out. The gentleman from P ennsylvania [l\fr. RANDALL] has t:l.ken occa­ 1\Ir. l\IORSE. He remains in office just the same. sion to remind us that ''there is not a speck of war '' in the distance. Ir. TALBOTT. The amendment does not legislate anybody out of That may be so, aecording to report from the keenest vision. Yet I will office; it only provides that the duties now performed by two men shall venture to say-even if I do seem to run counter to so sharp an out­ devolve upon one man, without reducing the salary of the officer whoso look and judgment-that if there is now a ''speck'' anywhere of war­ duties are thus diminished. The amendment does not reduce expend­ like import it can be discerned in the far East-in China. I do not say itures and does not change the law. It merely gives to one man the there is a sign of war anywhere, but of a possibility I will dare to hint work that two men now do. But the two will still receive the same in this direction. Gentlemen may smile at the presumed audaeity or . alary as at present. folly of such a conflict as I intimate. But stranger things have hap­ Mr. MORSE. They are in the same building and the same office. pened. .And cm·tain it is, if common report is to be believed, China The CHAIR1\IAN. The Chair is not familiar enough with this sub­ could within two months or forty days send from her ports vessels of ject to determine what is the fact, a gentlemen disagree in their state­ war that would easily pass all our land defenses and take their ran..c:;om­ ments. The Chair is therefore inclined to take the sense of the com­ demanding position between the cities of Oakland and San Francisco, mittee upon the point. and what a humiliation there would be! Certain it is, past all ques­ 1r. THO~IAS. Just a word upon the point of order. tion, that this could be done by the ironclads of our South American As the law now stands there are two heads of bureaus, eaeh having neighbors, whose preparedness and character and impetuosity of dis­ the rank of a commodore by reason of being the chief of a bureau. If position leave that possibility entirely within the admission of every one of these beads of bureaus be abolished the difference between the thinking man. pay of the rank of a commodore and that of a captain is saved directly. An iron-clad vessel of waris in our Pacific navy-yard and can readily I make this remark upon the point of order, while at the same time I be put in :fighting trim. You do not propose to abandon naval prep­ am opposed to the amendment. arations altogether. In this our request is moderate, judged by your The CHAIRMAN. The Chair will take the gentleman's statement intentions for expenditures of the nature referred to elsewhere. San and overrule the point of order. The amendment will be submitted Francisco is entitled to this defense; and in this instance in speaking to the Committee of the Whole, and can be voted down if the commit­ for San Francisco and its bay we speak for California and the whole tee so desire. country. The question being taken, the amendment of 1\ir. CALKINS was not :h!r. RANDALL. A word in reply only. This is not a proposition agreed to. to equip any of the four ironclads. It is simply a proposition to put ~Ir. McADOO. I submit the amendment which I send to the desk. engines and machinery into the Monadnock at an expense, with what The Clerk read as follows: has been appropriated for that purpose heretofore, of $200,000 in all, On page 13, after line 296, add the following: and with the avowed purpose not to equip her. That from and after the passage of this act all war vessels not then contracted for, and the repair of a.Il war ve els, all steam-engines, boilers, and machinery The question was then taken on the amendment offered by Mr. BUDD; for war vessels in commission, or to be put in commission, shall be built, made, and upon a division there were-ayes 75, noes 103. or repaired at the Government navy-yards by the Government and under the Before the result of the vote was announced, supervision of its authorized agents and officers. Mr. BUDD called for tellers. Mr. McADOO. Now, Ir. Cbairman- - Tellers were ordered; and Mr. BUDD and Mr. HUTCHINS were ap- Mr. CALK.IKS. I make a point of order upon the amendment, but 11ointed. am willing it shall bereserved till the gentleman from New Jersey [Mr. The committee again divided; and the tellers reported that there McADoo] has been heard. were-ayes 80, noes 10 . Mr. McADOO. I insist, Mr. Chairman, tha.t this amendment does So the amendment was not agreed to. not come under the prohibition of the rule, and that it is in the in­ 1\Ir. CALKINS. I desire to offer an amendment, which I send to terest of reform and retrenchment in the Navy Department. It is ad­ the Clerk's desk, to come in after line 294 of the bill. mitted on both sides of this House that there have been extravagant The Clerk read as follows: expenditures in that Department. The larger part of the money ex­ On and after the 1st day of July, 1884., the BUl'eaus of Construction and Repair pended has gone to contractors. I propose by this amendment that and of Steam-Engineering shall be consolidated, and the President of the United hereafter the work, instead of being done by contraetors, shall be done States shall appoint a chief of said bureau, who shall, under the direction and control of the Secretary of theNavy, be responsible for the management thereof; in the yards of the Government. and h ereafter no person shall be appointed to the grade of naval constructor There is another feature about this matter. We are unfortunately, till the number is reduced to fifteen, which number shall not thereafter be in­ creased. by reason of unjust laws or other causes, not an iron-ship building peo­ ple. We have not, as Great Britain has, a large number of private 1\Ir. TALBOTT. I make the point of order that the amendment ship-building ya,rds. Hence the Government, when it asks for bids, changes existing law and does not retrench expenditures. is restricted to tho e of one or two ship-builders. The result of this Mr. CALKINS. It does retrench expenditures. paucity of bidders is that there is not honest, wholesome competition. 1\:Ir. TALBOTT. Not at all. So that the Government is obliged almost to accept the offer of one l\Ir. CALKINS. It provides for a diminution of this corps to :fifteen; contractor; and that contractor is the one who has built most of the so that there is a reduction upon the face ofthe amendment. vessels and received most of the money of the Government. When we The CHAIRMAN. The Chair will direct theamendmentto be read authorize a ship to be built we are compelled to go hat in hand to Mr. again. Roach and say, "Please, good Mr. Roach, name your own :figures and The Clerk again read the amendment. treat us honestly ifyou wi.llll Now, Iadmircl\Ir. Roach's ability and 1\lr. TALBOTT. I insist upon the point of order. The amendment pluck, and can hardly blame him for taking advantage ofthe situation; does not reduce the number of officers. It provides merely a rule as to but at the same time we will be derelict in om duty if we do not cur­ promotions, a matter which is already :fixed by law. tail his advantages over the Go,ernment. We, I trust, represent thA The CHAIRMAN. The Chair would be glad to hear from the gentle­ people, not Mr. John Roach. man from Inmana [Mr. CALKINS] in answer to the suggestion of the There is another feature of this amendment which prevents it from gentleman from Maryland [Mr. TALBOTT]. coming under the rule: that it is not in the interest of economy. We 1\Ir. CALKINS. I have only to say that the amendment is not ob­ have a large number of professional engineers under pay, whether on noxious to the rule, because it does not. increase expenditures. board .or waiting orders or on shore-duty. If you open the navy-yards 1638 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. MARCH 5,

you may put this professional skill to work and receive some service for communication and contact with the eething population of the Old the salary which is paid. ·world. The American citizen must be protected in every land. Our I am not alone in this argument, for the Bureau of Steam-Engineer- flag, which istheday-st;.;'l.r of humanity and the beacon-light to mankind ing says in its report that such will be the case should our navy-yards struggling upward to freedom and a higher civilization, must be made be opened. The report reads as follows on that point: respectable the world o•er, and, if necessary, behind its moral force must I am of the opinion that the assistant engineer officers who have finished rest the hand of power. Our Con titution preaches ''peace o» earth, cruisesatseashould be utilized toaverymuchgreaterextentinournavy-yards, good-will to men," but the rights of our citizens and the honor of this and be ordered, not for clerical services, for which they are not trained es- t .l' d t' f f s.j.~tes t b . .j. , . d . t .c. • pecially, but as far as practicable to have charge as heads of the several shops, grea J.e era IOn O ree Ld mus e mam..arne agams JOreign ag- for which their profession fits them, in the place of the master workman or fore- gression. man of such sllops, thus dispen ing- with one very considerable source of ex- Ur. CALKINS. I make the point of order. pense for yard maintenance, and with but. t_he small increa. e for their pay as The CHAIRMA...~ The Chair sustains the point of order as he is officers on shore-duty rather than on wait mg order . 'Ih1s would uot only • • · ' be a great saving in the cost for organization, but be a practical chool for the e 1 not satisfied the abandonment of the contract ystem would promote offic~~. traiD:in~ them co.n tantly in t.l~e.line of the!-r profession, in th_e minuter economy by diminishing public expenditure. det~ulsof destgnmg, makmg, and repaumg t~e vartou · parts of machme~y, &c., The Clerk read as follow . which are used on naval "Vessels, together with the tools, methods, apphances, · &c., for the work. INCREASE OF THE NAVY. For obvious reasons the bureau would not recommend a general and sweep- ing change in this direction at once, thereby dischargiu~ a large cla s of skilled For completing the three new steel cruisers and one dispatch-boat authorized and faithful mechanics, but as vacancies occu1· from time to time that they be by a{)t of Congt·e. s approved March 3, 1883, as follows : Chicago, $349,133.45; filled by these engineer officei"S. Boston, $231,853.2 ; Atlanta, $231,853.27; Dolphin, 108,660; in all, $921,500. The bureau is also of the opinion that there would result a very considerable .1 fr. HUTCHINS. I mO\ethat the committeedonowri e. saving in the expenditures for the making, care, repair, and attendance of the team generators, andappliancesoftheseveralkind and uses in thenav-y-y~rds, The motion was agreed to. if they were all placed under the general charge and control of the engineer offi- . The committee accordingly ro e · and the peaker having resumed cers of the yards, the expense of each to be paid from the appropriations of the th h · .M Co~R E rted th t th Co 'tt f th Wh 1 bureaususingthesame, asnow; thusgivingapracticalopportunityandpossi- e carr, r. - repo a e rnml eeo e 0 e bility to carry out another recommendation of the navy-yard commis ion. that House on _the state of the Union had, according to order, bad under con­ one general steam-generating establishment be providerl in each yard to furnish sideration the bill (H. H. 4716) making appropriations for the naval steam for all motive power and steam-heating purpo es, thereby ecuring "econ- service for the fiscal year ending June 30 1885 and for other purposes, ~;~~!~~}!• reduced expen e ofatt":ndance, and anincrea eofconvenienceand and had come to no resolution thereon. The various shops under cognizance of this bureau at the several navy-yards, with their present equipmentsand appliances, are in good working order, and REL"'\HARDT WAGXER. equal.to any present requirement for repair of enginest boiler , &c., or for the rapid and economical con truction of new modern macninery of fir t-class de­ The SPEAKER, by unanimou consent, la.id before the House the fol­ sign and workmanship. lowing message of the President of the United States; which was re­ The boiler-shops at Tew York, \Vashington, Norfolk, and :Mare Island yards ferred to the Committee on Foreign Affairs, and ordered to be printed: have been greatly improved by the addition of a few modern machine tools, and are now producing first-class boile1'S from very la.rge and heavy steel plates, at To the House of Representatives: a less cost per pound than has ever before been done in our navy-yards or ob­ In further response to the resolution of the Hou e of Repre entatives of the tainable under contract. 15th January last, calling for copies of corre pondence on file in the Department of State in relation to the reported arrest at Lodz, in Russia, of Reinhardt Wag­ I am aware the honorable Secretary of the Navy advocates the contract ner, a citizen of the United States, I transmit, in addition to the papers sent you system and inveighs against the yards. But his argument against the on the 7th ultimo, a copy of a di patch sub equently received. yards in his current report seems to me lame and inconsistent. He ex­ CHESTER A. ARTHUR. EXECUTIVE l\IANSIOX, presses a horror of political influence in the yards, which does him credit Washington, March 5, 1884. in the expressing it, and would cover him with infinite glory in the practice of its suppression. We on this side of the House must cer­ LF-A VE OF ABSENCE. tainly be allowed to share his fears, and some of us, maybe, could nar­ Mr. PEELLE, of Indiana, by unanimous consent, was granted leave rate moving tales of the awful realization of the honorable Secretary's of absence for ten day , on account of important business. suspicions. He says, on page 1 : FORFEITURE OF MICHIGAN" LA...~D GRANTS. The question whether all the steel naval ve els of the future shall be con­ structed by contract, or some of them by contract and some in the navy-yards, l\Ir. HEKLEY, from the Committee on Public Land , reported back it is not necessary immediately to determine. Assuming that the hull of such with an amendmentthe bill (H. R. 1 0) todeclareforfeitedcertainlands ships might be judiciously and economically built in the yards, it i doubtful whether the machinery will ever be so constructed. All the engines for the in the State of Michigan granted to aid in the construction of railroads; British navy are built in private shops. But conceding that, wherever the ships which was referred to the House Calendar, and. with the accompanying may be originally built, it is de irable for the Government to po~ es shops fitted report, ordered to be printed. · ' · for uch repairs as may ft·om time to time be found necessary, it is due to truth to declare that the Government repair shops under the present sy tern ought Ur. BELFORD presented the views of the minority and Mr. OATES not to be intrusted with them. submitted an amendment; which, by unanimous consent, were also or­ The e establishments must first be thoroughly reorganized in such a way as dered to be printed with the majority report. to exclude all political considerations from their management, otherwise bad and expensive work will be the result. We can not afford to destroy the speed E.KATE BILL REFERRED. of our naval engines in order to make votes for a political party. :Mr. MATSON, by unanimous consent, submitted the following reso­ If the yards have been used to influence elections may we not in­ lution; which was read, considered, and agreed to: quire who was in fuult? Is it not a plea of guilty fur a great political Resolved, That the pen ion bills from the Senate now on the peaker's table be party to make this statement? We certainly can not be blamed, for it taken thereftom and properly referred. is so long since the Democratic party had anything to do with the navy-yards, :!ave through this House, that it bus almost forgotten their The following bills were accordingly severally refened to the Com- location. Of course when we will that work shall be done in the yards mittee on Invalid Pensions: we mean that it shall be honestly performed, without regard to partisan A bill (S. 494) for the relief of Nancy .Miller; and considerations or political influences. The contract system can be as A bill (S. 777) granting a pension to Albert Jehle. readily abused. Will not favorite contractors come down handsomely The following bill was refened to the Committee on Pensions: to Hubbell committees and coerce employes or only employ those who A bill (S. 1056) granting an increase of pension to Sally Mallory. are desirable politically ? ORDER OF BUSIXESS. I ask the attention of the House to another fact. The Navy of the Mr. WHITE, of Kentucky. I ask leave to present and have printed United States, mostly now under the contract system, embraces one in the RECORD the memoria] of the citizens of Franklin County, Ken­ hundred and thirty-nine vessels, and most of them are of a very poor tucky, concerning the improvement of the Kentucky River. class. The navy of Spain is composed of one hundred and thirty-nine Mr. HOL IAN. How long is it? vessels, and the ma:i ority of them are superb ironclads. It is a further Mr. WHITE, of Kentucky. About half a column. fact that while it costs over $15,000,000 a year to maintain the United Mr. O'NEILL of Missouri. Here is one on the Mississippi River I States Navy, it only costs a little over $6,000,000 a year to maintain wish to go with it. the first-class navy of Spain. Mr. WARNER, of Ohio. I object. In conclusion: Immunity from war-perpetual pea~e-is no more M:r. HUTCHINS. I move that the House do now adjourn. granted to nations than terrestrial immortality to man. The same curse The motion was agreerl to. that spread weeds and briers among the flowering vistas of Eden and And accordingly (at 4 o'clock and 45 minutes p. m.) the House ad­ shadowed its bowers with poison-dripping vines gave over man to epi­ journed. deinics, disease, '' wars and rumors of wars.'' We should seek to spread 11eace, but be reasonably prepared for war. Our coast, which fringes PETmONS ETC. the fairest and richest land on earth has been protected from the mo­ 1 narchial freebooters of Europe by shifting sands and tortuous channels; The following petitions and papers were laid on the Clerk's desk, a few million wisely spent will make it in vulnerable. Our people come under the rule, and referred as follows: from all lands and go everywhere. The bed of the Atlantic is threaded By Mr. BARBOUR: Petition of R. S. Lacy and 15 others, citizens of and its bosom is furrowed by the wires and prows that bring it in hourly Virginia, ask'ing that a portion of the grounds of the Arlington estate 1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD- SENATE. 1639 may be set apart for experimental grounds for the use of the Agricult­ SENATE. ural Department-to the Committee on Agriculture. By Mr. FELIX CAMPBELL: Petitionfortheimprovementof John­ THURSDAY, Ma'rch 6, 1884. . on's Inlet, New York-to the Committee on Rivers and Harbors. Prayer by Rev. WILLI.Al\I P.ARET, D. D., of the city of Washington. By Mr. CURTIN: Papers relating to the claim of the heir of Gen­ The Journal of yesterday's proceedings was read and approved. eral Count Casimir Pulaski-to the Committee on Foreign Affairs. By :\Ir. G. R. DAVI : PetitionofBenjamin W. Goodhue and 51 others, HOU E BILL REFERRED. citizen of Chicago, relative to the Chinese re triction act-to the same The joint resolution (H. Res. 191) for the printing of certain eulogies committee. · delivered in Congress upon the late Dudley C. Haskell was read twice By Mr. DORSHEIMER: Petition of Catherine Hoey, for a pension­ by its title, and referred to the Committee on Printing. to the Committee on Invalid Pensions. PETITIONS .AND MEMORIALS. Al o, petition of citizen of New York, for schools in Alaska-to the Committee on Education. The PRESIDENT pro ten~pore presented a joint resolution and me­ By Mr. FINERTY: Petition of Louis Emery relative to 11ounties, morial of the Eighth LegislativeAssemblyofthe Territory of Wyoming, pensions, &c.-to the Committee on Invalid Pensions. in favor of the establishment of an independent postal telegraphic sys­ By Mr. HALSELL: PaperrelatingtotheclaimofW. N. Crewdson­ tem, to be owned, controlled, and operated by the United States; which to the Committee on Pen ion . was referred to the Committee on Post-Offices and Post-Roads. By Mr. D. B. HENDERSON: Petition of James H. Price, relative 1\fr. CALL. I present a petition of the legal representatives of Mat­ to pensions, &c.-to the Committee on Invalid Pensions. thew Smith, late deputy adjutant-general in the Virginia Continental By Mr. HOBLITZELL: Papers relating to the claim of Mary J3. line during the war of the Revolution, praying for uch legislation as Hook-to the Committee on Pensions. will enable them to obtain a bounty claimed under the laws of the By Mr. HOPKIN : Petition of Pittsburgh manufacturers, against the United States. The petition is accompanied by the draught of a bill passage of the Moni on tariff bill-to the Committee on Ways and which I shall introduce when that order is rea.ched. I move tpat the Means. petition be referred to the Committee on Private Land Claims. By M:r. B. W. JONE : Communication of D. K. Tenney, 1·elative to The motion was agreed to. bill H. R. 4944-to the Committee on the Judiciary. 1\lr. MITCHELL. I present a petition of the National Wholesale By Mr. KLEINER: Petition of citizens of Evansville, Ind., relative Drug Association and other citizens of the United States, praying for to the Chinese restriction act-to the Committee on Foreign Affairs. the repeal of all internal taxes. These petitioners number 1,118, and By Mr. LONG: Petition of Charles E. Roberts and others, and of C. represent one hundred and twenty-nine cities and towns. I move the F. Fisher and others, citizensofBrockton, Iass., relativetotheChinese reference of the petition to the Committee on Finance. restriction act-to the same committee. The motion was agreed to. By Mr. LORE: Petition of D. B. Morris and 233 others, of Sussex Mr. l\IITCHELL. I present a memorial of the Philadelphia Board County, Delaware, for the improvement of navigation of Indian River, of Trade, remonstrating against the renewal of the patents for steam in said county-to the Committee on Rivers and Harbors. grain-shovels. The bill in relation to this matter has been reported By 1r. McADOO: PetitionofcitizensofNewJersey,againstChinese from the Committee on Patents, and I move that the memorial lie on immigration-to the Committee on Foreign Affairs. the table. By ~h. MAYBURY: Petition of Mrs. NelJie Tate and 50 others and The motion was agreed to. of Mrs. Emma Dingle and others, favoring a ixteenth amendment­ l\Ir. MITCHELL presented the petitition of l\Irs. Catharine Page, severally to the Committee on the Judiciary. widow of Thomas Page, late private Company K, Seventh Pennsylva­ AJ o, petition of Thoma H. Walsh, .Alfred Cheesebrough, and other nia Emergency Volunteers, praying to be granted a pension; which was residents of Detroit, for an appropriation for a breakwater at Marquette referred to the Committee on Pensions. Mich.-to the Committee on Rivers and Harbors. ' He also presented a memorial of members of the Chambers of Com­ By Mr. S. H. MILLER: Petitition of 600 wageworkers, of Mercer merce of Cincinnati and of Louisville and other citizens and business County, Pennsylvania, against the importation of laborers under con­ men, remonstrating against the passage of any bill which repeals or tracts n1ade abroad-to the Committee on Labor. mo~~ the act of Congress so far as it refers to the bridging of the By Mr. MULLER: Memorial of Charles Blanke and others, for edu­ Ohio R1ver and of the Great Kanawha River between certain limits; cation in Alaska-to the Committee on Education. which was referred to the Committee on Commerce. Also, petition for the relief of Rudolph Tanszkay-to the Committee He also presented a petition of the Franklin Institute, of the State of on Military A.ffail-s. Pennsylvania, praying for the passage of an aet for the appointment of By Mr. J. J. O'NEILL: Petition of Columbus Council of Knights a commission of experts for the testing of iron, steel, &c.; which was of Labor, of Saint Louis, Mo., relative to the Chinese restriction act­ referred to the Committee on Commerce. to the Committee on Foreign Affairs. . He also presented a resolution of the Philadelphia Maritime Exchange, A1 o, memorial of the labor organizations of Saint Louis, Mo., 3.oo-ainst rn favor of the redemption of the trade-dollar at its par value; which the importation of foreign laborers under contracts made abroad-to the was referred to the Committee on Finance. Committee on Labor. He also presented the petition of Burnham, Parry, Williams & Co. AJ o, peti·.;ion of Bricklayers' Union, No. 1, of Saint Louis against and others, citizens of Philadelphia, praying that an appropriation be the importation of foreign laborers under contracts made abroad-to the made for Indian education; which was referred to the Committee on sa.me committee. Indian Affairs. Also, resolutions of D. 0. S. C. L. A., No. -2522, Knights of Labor He also presented the petition of J. Thomas Welham, of San Fran­ of Saint Loui , relative to the Chinese restriction act-to the Commit: ci co, Cal., executor of the estate of Thomas Welham, deceased, pray­ tee on Foreign Affairs. ing for the extension of a siphon water-wheel patent; which was re­ Also, petition of citizens, asking for the appointment of a committee ferred to the Committee on Patents. to investigate the Oklahoma land question-to the Committee on the l\Ir. SHERl\IAN presented a petition of Boon Po t, No. 1, Grand Public Lands. Army of the Republic, of Edon, Williams County, Ohio, praying for the Also, protests ofmanufacturersofvinegar, fruit-growers, &c. relntina passage of certain bills for the benefit of soldiers of the Union Army; to the tariff on vinegar, &c.-to the Committee on Ways and iieans. o which was referred to the Committee on Pensions. . Also, petition of D. L. Payne and others, in regard to abuses and ex­ Mr. COCKRELL. At a regular meeting of the repre: entatives of the pulsion from Oklahoma by the United States Army-to the Committee labor organizations of the city of Saint Louis, Mo., the subject of the on Military Affairs. importation of foreign labor under contract for the purpose of displac­ By Mr. PAYNE: PetitionofcitizensofCayugaCounty New York rel­ ing American labor when it seeks to protect itselfthrough the power of ative to the Chinese restriction act-to the Committee on Foreign Affairs. organization against repeated attempts of American employers to re­ By Ir. REED: Petition of W. & C. R. Millican and 65 others citi­ duce it to the level of pauperized labor of the Old World, as shown in zens and business firms of Portland, Me., in favor of the bill H. R. the late conflict between the Window-Glass 1\Iakers' Association and 4483-to the Committee on Military Affairs. the manufacturers engaged in that industry, was discussed and the pres­ By :Mr. RIGGS: Petitionforthereliefof S. A. St. John-to the Select ent and future evils to result from such importation if unchecked or Committee on Payment of Pensions, Bounty, and Baek Pay. unregulated by wise and patriotic legislation were forcibly portrayed, By 1\fr. CHARLES STEWART: Petition of the Good Templars of and that discussion terminated in the unanimous adoption of this res­ Hono~ and Temperance of Texas, relative to alcoholic liquor traffic­ olution: to the Select Committee on the Alcoholic Liquor Traffic. That our Senators and Representatives in Congress be respectfully requested to advocate and support by voice and vote all measures tending to prohibit the By Mr. TUCKER: Papers relating to the pension claim of David L. importation of foreign labor under contract into the United States, thereby se­ Pool-to the Committee on Invalid Pensions. curing to .American citizens, as far as effec~ive legislation can secure to them, B:y .Mr. WAKEFIELD: ~etition of. citizens of Redwood County, and the sacred and inalienable right to labor and to just remuneration for that labor of c1t1zens of New Ulm, Mmn., prayrng that the head of navigation as against the low-priced and inadequately-paid labor of the Old World. of t.heMinnesota River be fixed at New Ulm-severally to the Com­ This resolution has been transmitted to the Senators and Representa­ mittee on Commerce. tives from that State, and was evidently intended to be presented to