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Ggácmnmu Rmhvisambaøkñúgtulakark C M 00370628 E1/67.1 ŪĮйŬď₧şŪ˝˝ņįОď ďij Њ ⅜₤Ĝ ŪĮйņΉ˝℮Ūij GgÁCMnMuC RmHvisamBaØkñúgtulakarkm<úCa Kingdom of Cambodia Nation Religion King Extraordinary Chambers in the Courts of Cambodia Royaume du Cambodge Chambres Extraordinaires au sein des Tribunaux Cambodgiens Nation Religion Roi Β₣ðĄеĕНеĄŪņй⅜ŵřеĠР₣ Trial Chamber Chambre de première instance TRANSCRIPT OF TRIAL PROCEEDINGS - KAING GUEK EAV “DUCH” PUBLIC Case File Nº 001/18-07-2007-ECCC/TC 24 August 2009, 0907H Trial Day 63 Before the Judges: NIL Nonn, Presiding Lawyers for the Civil Parties: Silvia CARTWRIGHT YA Sokhan MOCH Sovannary Jean-Marc LAVERGNE TY Srinna THOU Mony HONG Kimsuon YOU Ottara (Reserve) Alain WERNER Claudia FENZ (Reserve) Fabienne TRUSSES-NAPROUS Jessica FINELLE Trial Chamber Greffiers/Legal Officers: For Court Management Section: SE Kolvuthy DUCH Phary UCH Arun Natacha WEXELS-RISER Matteo CRIPPA For the Office of the Co-Prosecutors: SENG Bunkheang Vincent DE WILDE D'ESTMAEL William SMITH The Accused: KAING Guek Eav Lawyers for the Accused: KAR Savuth Francois ROUX Heleyn UÑAC 00370629 E1/67.1 Extraordinary Chambers in the Courts of Cambodia Trial Chamber - Trial Day 63 Case No. 001/18-07-2007-ECCC/TC KAING GUEK EAV 24/8/2009 Page i I N D E X CIVIL PARTIES MS. CHUM NEOU: Questioning by Mr. President resumes ............................................................................................ page 8 Questioning by Mr. Hong Kimsuon commences ............................................................................ page 19 Questioning by Judge Lavergne commences ................................................................................ page 26 Questioning by Mr. de Wilde D'Estmael commences .................................................................... page 29 Questioning by Mr. Seng Bunkheang commences ........................................................................ page 32 Questioning by Mr. Roux commences ........................................................................................... page 37 MS. CHHIN NAVY: Questioning by Mr. President commences .................................................................................... page 47 Questioning by Mr. Kong Pisey commences ................................................................................. page 79 Questioning by Mr. Seng Bunkheang commences ........................................................................ page 86 MR. TOUCH MONIN: Questioning by Mr. President commences .................................................................................... page 88 Questioning by Mr. Hong Kimsuon commences .......................................................................... page 102 00370630 E1/67.1 Extraordinary Chambers in the Courts of Cambodia Trial Chamber - Trial Day 63 Case No. 001/18-07-2007-ECCC/TC KAING GUEK EAV 24/8/2009 Page ii List of Speakers: Language used unless specified otherwise in the transcript Speaker Language MS. CANIZARES French JUDGE CARTWRIGHT English MS. CHHIN NAVY French MS. CHUM NEOU Khmer MR. DE WILDE D'ESTMAEL French MR. KAR SAVUTH Khmer JUDGE LAVERGNE French MR. ROUX French MS. SE KOLVUTHY Khmer MR. SENG BUNKHEANG Khmer MR. SMITH English THE ACCUSED Khmer THE PRESIDENT (NIL NONN, Presiding) Khmer MR. TOUCH MONIN Khmer MS. TRUSSES-NAPROUS French MR. WERNER English 00370631 E1/67.1 Extraordinary Chambers in the Courts of Cambodia Trial Chamber - Trial Day 63 Case No. 001/18-07-2007-ECCC/TC KAING GUEK EAV 24/8/2009 Page 1 1 1 P R O C E E D I N G S 2 (Judges enter courtroom) 3 [09.07.50] 4 MR. PRESIDENT: 5 Please be seated. The Court is now back in session. 6 According to our schedule, the revised version as announced last 7 week, today the Chamber is going to hear the civil party, Chum 8 Neou. We continue to hear her testimony because we have not 9 heard the full statement of hers because of the technical 10 glitches in relation to the audio recording. 11 And to make sure the parties to the proceeding clearly understand 12 this, actually on Thursday afternoon because of the technical 13 problems occurred in the courtroom, the Chamber had already 14 announced the adjustment to the existing scheduling of the 15 hearings. And since the public and the parties might not have 16 got the full message of that pronouncement, then the Chamber 17 would like to, once again, inform the parties that, due to the 18 progress of the proceedings and the withdrawal of the request to 19 hear a number of civil parties in the last few days, the Chamber 20 has rescheduled the hearings for this week and next week. 21 This Monday, the Chamber will continue to hear Chum Neou and will 22 hear three other civil parties, including Chhin Navy, Touch Monin 23 and Ros Men. After hearing these civil parties, the Chamber will 24 break for the day because of internal meeting. 25 On Tuesday morning, the Chamber will hear expert CP2/5 on issues 00370632 E1/67.1 Extraordinary Chambers in the Courts of Cambodia Trial Chamber - Trial Day 63 Case No. 001/18-07-2007-ECCC/TC KAING GUEK EAV 24/8/2009 Page 2 2 1 relating to the suffering of the civil party. On Tuesday 2 afternoon, the Chamber will start hearing the challenges of civil 3 party applications by the defence and responses of civil parties 4 thereto. The Chamber will hear such challenges and responses for 5 approximately two days. The Chamber will then start questioning 6 the accused on his character. 7 The following week the Chamber will start hearing experts and 8 witnesses on the character of the accused. The Chamber reserves 9 the right to change the schedule and will keep the parties 10 updated if further amendments are required. The witnesses, and 11 also civil parties, will also be notified if further amendments 12 are required. 13 [09.12.00] 14 So this is just the reiteration of the content of our schedule 15 for the hearings as revised for this week and next week. 16 The Co-Prosecutor, you take the floor. 17 MR. SMITH: 18 Good morning, Mr. President. Good morning, counsel. 19 Mr. President, in relation to the scheduling we just have two 20 brief requests. Firstly, now that the accused's character will 21 be questioned by the Trial Chamber, I think it would be useful 22 for the parties to understand how much questioning time they 23 would have of the accused. 24 Obviously, this is the probably last substantive time that the 25 accused will be questioned as to his role in S-21, or certainly 00370633 E1/67.1 Extraordinary Chambers in the Courts of Cambodia Trial Chamber - Trial Day 63 Case No. 001/18-07-2007-ECCC/TC KAING GUEK EAV 24/8/2009 Page 3 3 1 in relation to his personality, and we would ask that, given the 2 scheduling timeframe Your Honours have, that the prosecution at 3 least have one hour but, if preferable, an hour-and-a-half on 4 this particular issue, and the other parties be given questioning 5 time in balance with that. 6 The second point is in relation to a filing that the prosecution 7 filed with the Trial Chamber on the 29th of April this year, and 8 it was a notice to the Chamber to put before it some documents in 9 relation to armed conflict. 10 As Your Honours are aware, at that time the procedure for putting 11 documents to the Chamber was quite cumbersome and time consuming. 12 Now, since Your Honours have issued that guideline to streamline 13 the proceedings, it is now a lot easier of course for parties to 14 put documents to the Chamber efficiently. 15 [09.14.09] 16 So we would ask that a spot of time, a period of time, be given 17 over this week or next week where the prosecution can briefly 18 summarize the documents and explain the purpose and the relevance 19 of the armed conflict documents. We would submit it would take 20 no more than say 25 minutes, half-an-hour, and then parties could 21 make their comments on that. 22 Perhaps also that time could be used for other parties that may 23 wish to put other documents before the Chamber as well, but at 24 this stage the purpose would be to put the armed conflict 25 documents before the Chamber. We would be available to do that 00370634 E1/67.1 Extraordinary Chambers in the Courts of Cambodia Trial Chamber - Trial Day 63 Case No. 001/18-07-2007-ECCC/TC KAING GUEK EAV 24/8/2009 Page 4 4 1 at any time. Thank you. 2 MR. PRESIDENT: 3 Mr. Hong Kimsuon, you take the floor. 4 MR. HONG KIMSUON: 5 Mr. President, Your Honours, thank you very much. 6 First, to begin with I would like to inform the Chamber the 7 absence of my co-colleague, Ms. Silke Studzinsky, who is now 8 being hospitalized and cannot come to attend this hearing. And 9 the civil party, Ros Men, does not waive his right to attend in 10 the hearing but he is sick. 11 [09.15.59] 12 My civil party, Touch Monin, although his time is not yet ready 13 for him to testify, but we just obtained a document in relation 14 to him on the 22nd of August, which was during the weekend, and 15 the translation of the document was not made available during 16 such time. And the head of the genocidal museum also satisfied 17 that the document is genuine and true. 18 I would like, with Mr. President's leave that Madam Chhin Navy 19 testify after Madam Chum Neou because she needs for her religious 20 practice to have lunch before 12 and that she requests that she 21 would be testifying before that. 22 MR. PRESIDENT: 23 Mr. Alain Werner, I note you are on your feet. You take the 24 floor. 25 MR. WERNER: 00370635 E1/67.1 Extraordinary Chambers in the Courts of Cambodia Trial Chamber - Trial Day 63 Case No. 001/18-07-2007-ECCC/TC KAING GUEK EAV 24/8/2009 Page 5 5 1 Good morning, Your Honours. Good morning, Mr. President. 2 Just a word to tell you that we went yesterday to visit Ms.
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