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9582. (Jo MAKOENA) the first time, I don't know him well. After this Freddy Adams, who spoke? A Coloured, Lionel Morrison. Do you know this man Lionel Morrison? Ido. The next speaker? — Lilian Ngoyi. 5 Is this the Lilian Ngoyi you referred to previously? Yes, My Lord. Then there was a speaker E. Malele and after that speaker, who was the next speaker? Alfred Mahlangu. 10 Who interpreted this - his speech? Elmon Malele. That concludes the evidence of this witness - I am sorry, of this meeting. The next meeting is a meeting of the 17th June, 1956. I hand you a document marked G. 271,15 together with a transcript of it, and a document marked G. 27^. G. 271, what does that refer to? These are my notes. Of what meeting? Advisory Board meeting held at Dube Square, 17th June, 1956. 20 Would you refresh your memory from your notes. You have a speaker there Mr. Nkosi? BY MR. FISCHER : My Lord, just "before my learned friend breads, I am quite certain that this statutory body, if it is what 25 I suspect it is, is not mentioned in the Indictment, and I think with respect that my learned friend should lay some basis for introducing the minutes of a statutory body. BY MR. TRENGOVE : 30 I'll ask the witness to refresh his memory from his notes. Now, would you have a look at your notes 1 9583. (J. MAKOENA) and tell Their Lordships if this refers to a meeting of the Advisory Board itself or whether it refers to a meeting of members of the Advisory Board reporting to people who attended this meeting? This was a meeting that was called and arranged by the Advisory Board, but 5 what was said at the meeting hadn't anything to do with the Advisory Board. Was it a meeting held in a hall or in the open or where was it held? On an open square. By whom was it attended? The people who, 10 attended the meeting were members of the public of the township. The people who held the meeting were members of the Advisory Board, and those same people were also members of the African National Congress. Have you a note of a speaker at this megting 15 by the name of L. Ma3ina? Yes. Do you know whether or not he was a member of the Advisory Board at Dube at that stage? He was. Do you know this L. Masina? I do. Do you know whether or not he is connected in 20 this case in any way? Could you identify him if you see him in Court? Yes, he is here as a matter of fact. Would you turn to the report that you made to what Masina said? Yes, My Lord. I'll read and you can say whether it is 25 correct. He said, "Is true these Native detectives before hey could go away we must first know what they are writing on those note books. I think we must leave them because once we try to find out we shall be causing a lot of trouble, but in most cases you will find that those 30 people who are causing more troubles, they are not detectives. I now move that we must forget about these people who are taking notes. Most of our people said * 958$. (j. MAKOENA) f Bantu Education is good but you will find that such people are nothing else but government spies and members of school t \ boards too. This government of Verwoerd and Strydin has bitten, they try to ban those people who are fighting for freedom. They have got no other means except to ban our 5 people. All Advisory Boards has come to a conclusion that l:hey must work together with A.N.C. because is only the party which is fighting for freedom, is now high time that we must all work for our freedom. Today these are parties like Africanist and Masezekake Party they are 10 against the A.N.C., but the fact remains we know that they are on the government side, that is why I have told that they are - that is why I have told you that thesi people who are taking notes they are not so bad, only those people who are not detectives are really bad people 15 to us. You must not listen to anything from such people." And then he refers to the passes, and he protests against the issue of passes to women. He called upon the people to attend a meeting at Kliptown on the 24th June, 1956. He concludes by saying "We are sure to get our freedom, 20 we don't care whether we can be arrested. In place like China the people are free because they had to fight for their rights. Prime Minister Strydom is going overseas on Monday where he will meet some black Ministers too at their conference. I now say we must go forward to 25 our freedom". Is that correct? Yes, My Lord. That concludes the evidence on this meeting. I want to refer ycu to a document marked G. 990, handed in at the Preparatory Examination under that Exhibit number. Can you identify this document? Yes, My Lord. 30 What is it? It is a Freedom Charter document. 9585. (J- MAK03NA) I also want to refer you to your pocket book dealing with this date, the 21st June, 1956. Can you tell the Court if you on that day observed people distri- buting this pamphlet? Yes, I did. Did you make a note of that in your pocket 5 book? Yes, I did. And will you refresh your memory from your pocket book and tell Their Lordships who these people were? L. Masina, Aaron Mahlangu, Sidwell Botani (?), Where was this pamphlet being distributed? 10 They were distributing them to the different houses in Dube Township. It is a pamphlet headed "Freedom Charter Day", "Come to Kliptown, Sunday 24th June, 1956", and it says that "Since 25th June - June 26th has been observed as a 15 National Day by the liberatory and democratic movements". Then it deals with the history of June 26th in the libe- ratory struggle, it refers to the Freedom Charter and quotes a passage from it, and it states at the bottom that it was issued by the Transvaal Consultative Commit- 20 tee of the African National Congress, Transvaal Indian Congress, South African Coloured People's Organisation, South African Congress of Trade Unions and South African Congress of Democrats. I ask leave to hand this in. BY ME. JUS TIC ij B2KKER ; 2 5 How do you know that these people distributed a pamphlet like that? Because I saw them and made a note in my pocket book. Wh.~t did you see? I saw them go and put them in different houses, from one house to another. 30 Where did you get this copy? I took it at a place where they had already been and left. 9583. (J. MAKOENA) BY MR. TRENGOYE s You have during the course of your evidence referred to the following people. P. Selepe, L. Masina, L. Ngoyi, R. Resha and S. Tyiki? Yes. When you mentioned the names of these people, 5 are they always the same people? Yes, My Lord. If you see them in Court, can you identify them? Yes, My Lord. Will you step down and if you can identify P. Selepe? (WITNESS IDENTIFIES ACCUSED NO. 18) 10 The next one is L. Masina? (WITNESS IDEN- TIFIES ACCUSED NO. 7) . The next is L. Ngoyi? (WITNESS IDENTIFIES ACCUSED NO. 14) R. Resha? — (WITNESS IDENTIFIES ACCUSED 15 NO. 17). S. Tyiki? — (WITNESS IDENTIFIES ACCUSED NO. 21). I want to mention the names of certain other speakers who spoke according to your evidence at those 20 meetings, and I want to know if you can tell Their Lord- ships whether or not those people wore Accused at the Preparatory Examination. If you are not certain you must say so. L. Nkosi? Yes, he was an Accused. Obed Motsabi? He was also an Accused. 25 M. W. Shope? He was also. N. Sejake? He also. J. Matlou? Yes, he also. Jerry Kumalo? Yes, he also. E. Malele? Yes, he was also. 30 A. Mahlangu? Yss, Alfred Mahlangu also. NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MR. TEENGOVE.t 9583. (J. MAKOENA) CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. FISCHER 3 You told us that you joined the Security Branch of the Police in 1948? — No, in 1954. And since then you said you had been attending meetings and taking notes? Yes. 5 I would like you to tell the Court in what parts of Johannesburg and the Reef have you attended meetings? Sophiatown, Orlando, Mroko, Dube. Any ethers? No, no others. I went to other places off the Reef, like Klerksdorp. 10 Give me a list of the other places as well? Klerksdorp is the only place. Very many meetings were held between 1954 and 1956, weren't they? Yes. You must have attended two or three meetings 15 every week? About two a week. Sometimes more? No. And did you take notes at these meetings? Yes. I am now talking about the years 1954, 1955, 20 1956, is that correct? Yes. You know you have been looking at the notes in front of you what has been read to you has only been a very small part of the notes which you had in front of you? Yes. 25 When you write down notes, you told us that if the speaker speaks in English, then you write it down in English? I was always writing in English.