SFUND RECORDS CTR 0217-00055

SFUND RECORDS CTR 88004723

PHOENIX-GOODYEAR AIRPORT AREA

SUPERFUND SITE

FINAL REMEDY

REPORTER'S TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS

Goodyear, Arizona June 21, 1989 7:00 o'clock p.m.

BRUSH AND TERRELL, P.C. Court Reporters PREPARED FOR: 3120 West El Caminito Drive Phoenix, Arizona 85051 ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION (602) 246-2132 AGENCY (602) 973-1771

REPORTED BY: DONNA TERRELL 1 PHOENIX-GOODYEAR AIRPORT AREA 2 SUPERFUND SITE 3 FINAL REMEDY 4

5 taken at 7:00 o'clock p.m., June 21, 1989^ in the Goodyear 6 Community Center, 420 East Loma Linda, Goodyear, Arizona,

7 before DONNA TERRELL, a Notary Public in and for the County

8 of Maricopa, State of Arizona.

9 10 Goodyear, Arizona June 21, 19 89 11 7:00 o'clock p.m. 12

13 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Go ahead, Mr. Mayor. 14 MAYOR CARL GOW: Thank you, Jeff. We want to 15 welcome each one of you and thank you for taking the time to 16 come out in this heat and all and braving this weather. We 17 appreciate your coming. 18 The purpose of this meeting tonight is very 19 important. It's to inform you of the status and the 20 progress that's been made in this program here over in what 21 used to be Goodyear. I refer to it as Goodyear, but it's 22 Sarival now. So -- and we want to keep abreast of this 23 thing so that we can inform our citizens, and they'll know

24 what's going on as far as the water is concerned. 25 So we want to again say welcome to you. DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 1 We're going to keep our hand in this thing to see that 2 progress is made and that our citizens are protected. Thank 3 you. 4 Jeff? 5 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: What you have in front of 6 you is the agenda for this evening's presentation. My name 7 is Jeff Rosenbloom. I'm with the Environmental Protection 8 Agency up in San Francisco. The region — I represent 9 Region Nine, which covers California, Arizona, now Hawaii 10 and Guam. Not Hawaii now, but maybe that's — when you get 11 a little more seniority. 12 I'll try and keep xny presentation as brief 13 as possible and leave more time for questions and answers. 14 I have the first agenda item which is introductions. 15 We have — there are a number of 16 representatives here tonight from agencies and from 17 companies that have been working on the problem for a number 18 of years: The Department of Environmental Quality, 19 Department of Water Resources, Goodyear, Unidynamics, and as 20 well as other folks like yourself who have been with us for 21 a number of years. 22 I'd like to just sort of get into the 23 presentation. It's going to last about 20 minutes. It's 24 going to be technical in nature, but I'll try and keep it as 25 specific as possible without getting into too much technical DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 1 jargon. 2 We do have time set aside for questions and 3 answers. So if during the presentation, you need 4 clarification, that's fine. But if you can hold like for

5 broader questions until the end, that would be great.

6 Also when I'm nervous I tend to talk

7 quickly. So if I ever start losing you, just flag me and

8 I'll slow down. 9 This is your first — your second handout. 10 It's sort of an overview of the site boundaries. It's all 11 pretty familiar to you. The official site boundaries are 12 Litchfield Road on the east. Buckeye on the south. Highway 13 85. It's I-IO on the north, although the actual boundary up

14 here is a little fuzzy. And on the west, it's Sarival. 15 Although these are the official boundaries,

16 our goal is to determine the extent of contamination. And 17 as I mentioned, if the contamination goes beyond those 18 boundaries, we'll track it. So we do have some 19 contamination that potentially is up above 10. 20 We've got about 40 square miles we have to 21 take a look at and it's taken us awhile. But we've finally 22 come to the end of the process. The goal we'll be 23 discussing tonight is the final remedy for the site, both

24 for groundwater and for soils. 25 What I'd like to do is give you a quick DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 1 overview of the groundwater system and familiarize you with 2 some terms that I'll be using. 3 Y'all get your drinking water from the 4 ground. The groundwater in the area flows in from the east, 5 comes along and there is a natural groundwater divide along 6 Y\ama Road. 7 With all these lights on, can people see 8 this? How are we — is that better? 9 VOICES: Better. 10 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Okay. Good. There's a 11 natural groundwater divide along Yuma Road. It causes the 12 groundwater to turn to the south and to the north in this 13 approximate area. 14 What that's done — what that's done is 15 allowed us to split the site in two, to allow to us focus 16 our investigations in two distinct areas: to really the 17 northern area and the southern area. 18 Okay. That's an aerial view. That's which 19 way the water flows. What I'd like to do with this next 20 slide is show you what the groundwater looks like in a cross 21 section. 22 This is your third slide. No, fourth slide. 23 The geology in the area, we've divided into three large 24 sections: The upper alluvial \inits, the middle fine grained 25 units and the lower conglomerate units. DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 1 They reach about 360 feet or so in depth. 2 Drinking water for the City of Goodyear comes from mostly 3 the lower parts of subunit B, subunit C and from middle fine 4 grained units. There is water up in subunit A is where it's 5 shallow and that water provides recharge for the areas below 6 it and is high in salts and is not used for drinking. 7 I'll refer to this as subunit A and then 8 down here we have subunit B and C. This dashed line 9 represents the fact that these two aquifers are very, very 10 similar and are highly interconnected. We find groundwater 11 at about 360 feet deep — about 60 feet deep. I'm sorry. 12 We met here about two years ago to discuss 13 the first remedy for the site, a partial remedy called an 14 Operable Unit, which is a horribly bureaucratic term for an 15 end-term remedy. Let me just tell you what that remedy is 16 and the status of it. 17 The remedy was to pump subunit A — that's 18 shallow groundwater -- beneath the — what we called section 19 16, which is the area where the Goodyear-Phoenix Airport is 20 located and the Loral Corporation. The water is to be 21 pumped out, treated with air stripping to remove the 22 volatile organics. And the water, since it can'.t be used 23 for any other purpose since — because of its high salts 24 content is to be reinjected back into the aquifer. 25 Let me give you — your next slide shows DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 1 where that's located. This is the southern area. An 2 agreement was entered into between E.P.A. and Goodyear Tire 3 and Rubber to conduct these activities. Goodyear has taken 4 the lead — Goodyear has taken the lead and begun work on 5 installing the system. The extraction wells and injection 6 wells have just gone in. The treatment plant is being 7 constructed and should be in operation in December of this 8 year. 9 One interesting note is that when we met 10 last time, we talked only about Section 16, which is this 11 boundary right here, which contained the higher 12 contamination. Goodyear's taken the initiative and gone 13 beyond that and will be addressing all of the contamination 14 in this upper subunit. And that reaches down to the 15 southern end of the airport so that will involve more 16 pumping and far more water can be treated. 17 What I'm going to do from now is talk — is 18 continue to talk about the south area and then I'll go to 19 the north area, rather than bouncing back and forth, so it 20 keeps it a little more consistent. It keeps me from being 21 confused. 22 So let's continue talking about .the 23 groundwater in the south area. This slide, your slide 24 number seven — the groundwater underneath the — in this 25 area, in the southern area, this is in subunit B/C. This is DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 1 the aquifer that provides water that is of drinking water 2 quality. 3 What this figure does is it shows you the 4 extent of contamination. What we've done here is we've 5 broken this into two areas: One, the concentrations of the 6 contaminants we found are above background. That ground in 7 the inner circle is where we detected contaminants above 8 ARARs. 9 Let's me explain what that term is. ARAR is 10 a term that was developed when the Superfund law was 11 reauthorized in 19 85. And what that law — what that 12 portion of the law said was that when we go to clean up a 13 site, we have to consider all of the laws that are 14 applicable. So for drinking water, we have the Clean Water 15 Act, which states — which gives us drinking water 16 standards. That's to ensure your health. 17 There are some chemicals though that do not 18 have standards associated v?ith them yet. E.P.A. is 19 constantly trying to develop new standards for these 20 chemicals, but it takes a long time to go through both the 21 technical evaluation and the process of gathering public 22 comment and finalizing those standards. 23 So in the meantime, we've developed 24 alternative standards. And so a combination of the official 25 drinking water standards and these other health — health DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 1 base numbers maybe ARARs. So when you see the word ARARs, 2 just think of all the appropriate standards that can be 3 applied for whatever we're talking about. In this instance,

4 it's drinking water. 5 So with that large introduction, this area 6 delineates the water that's contaminated above ARARs. You 7 want to keep that in mind when we get to the preferred

8 remedy for this portion of the site. 9 Let me give you the next couple slides which

10 are the sources of contamination in the area. This is slide 11 number eight. This is just a quick rundown of what some of 12 the potential sources of contamination were in the southern 13 area: Utility pits, solvent storage, solvent handling. It 14 would run the gamut. 15 Contaminants were also moved around in the

16 sewer system in different drainage areas on the airport, 17 which is your next slide. This is not — this is only of 18 interest to you if you sort of, you know, want to know how 19 the contaminants moved around and how they got so far. Now, 20 there are different mechanisms that were around. Drainage 21 lines that moved water that was contaminated, drainage lines

22 that leaked. 23 This next slide — this slide and the next

24 three slides will talk about soil contamination. So we 25 leave groundwater for just a second. DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 10

1 We conducted extensive soil sampling out 2 there for the past three, four years. We pretty much made 3 Swiss cheese out of the place. What this figure is 4 attempting to do is to show you where VOC's are detected. 5 VOC's is another — we love to use acronyms. VOC stands for 6 volatile organic compounds, which are solvents. Carburetor 7 cleaner is a type of solvent. The type of solvents that 8 we're concerned with are chlorinated or has chlorine in 9 them, which we found are a significant health risk. 10 The next three slides show different target 11 areas. At this point, there are no clean-up levels mandated 12 by Congress for soils. So when we go to determine a 13 clean-up level, we have to look at it on a site-by-site 14 basis. And there are many different ways of looking at it. 15 You can look at the amount of contaminants actually in the 16 soils. You can look at the amount of contaminants in the 17 soil gas, which is — they're in a vapor form imderground. 18 So let me show you those three target areas. This will take 19 just a quick second. 20 The first area shows a target area that 21 shows where soils contaminant above Arizona Department of 22 Health Services health-based clean-up levels. The ADHS 23 levels are based on human health — based on hxoman health 24 exposure. But what we also have to be concerned about here 25 are these contaminants making it to the groundwater. So DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush £c Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 11

1 there is something to be considered besides just health 2 concerns: Immediate contact. 3 The next slide shows the areas that are 4 above background. And the next area shows area that's 5 contaminated by soil gas. Soil gas occurs here — the soil 6 gas is contaminated with organic compounds because the 7 compounds that were disposed of are volatile. They 8 vaporize. So they're in the ground. They're in the 9 groundwater. And they vaporize and they exist in a vapor 10 form, as well as in a liquid form, and we have a technique 11 of finding that. And we've seen that over a larger portion 12 of the area. 13 The reason I went through what this, you 14 probably think is a very boring exercise is to talk about 15 our preferred remedy because it's very important when we go 16 to clean up a site — once you clean up anything, you've got 17 to figure out what are we going to clean up? What are our 18 boundaries? 19 This is one tool we've used to try and 20 assess that. So what I'd like to do over the next, I guess 21 three or four slides, is show you the alternatives that we 22 looked at, the costs associated with those remedies and 23 which remedies at this time E.P.A. prefers and that we'd 24 like your comment on. Let's get rid of this jumble up here. 25 Okay. We'll flip back to groundwater real DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 12

1 quick. As I mentioned, there were two target areas we 2 looked at. One is the groundwater that's contaminated above 3 background concentrations; the second is groundwater that's 4 contaminated above ARARs or above drinking water standards

5 and health-based standards. So that's our first two points

6 here. 7 The second two, as we looked at — okay. We 8 know where -- what our target areas are. Now, we have a 9 choice. I don't know how many of you are familiar with 10 groundwater, but you could pump it at different rates, 11 depending on how fast you're willing to pump. 12 So we looked at two different pumping

13 scenarios. We could p\imp it at current rates or we could 14 pump a little bit faster or pump more at an accelerated 15 basis. So what we're trying to do here is get a range of 16 options; what's the best way to look at this. 17 The next chart lays it out in a little bit 18 better fashion. Okay. I'm going to take it — take a 19 second and walk through this. 20 We were talking about groundwater and 21 between the last slide and this slide, a decision was made 22 the water in this area is of drinking water qual.ity. And, 23 therefore, the target area we're going to be concerned with 24 at this time is drinking water standards or ARARs. So 25 that's why our target area is going to be pumping within DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 13

1 those boundaries at a current rate and an accelerated rate. 2 They're are a couple of ways of which to 3 treat the water. You can do air stripping, which you've 4 heard of. You can also use carbon absorption, which is 5 using activated carbon to take it out of the air. And that 6 can include treatment with and without air emission 7 controls, where it has the asterisk, and evaluate the air 8 stripping using air emission controls and without air 9 emission controls to control the amount of contaminants that 10 come off these airstripers. 11 Let me simplify that. When there's 12 contaminated water that comes into the treatment plant, 13 these solvents which are volatile will come off the water. 14 And you have a choice. You can either let those go up into 15 the atmosphere or you can collect them and destroy them 16 later usually by incineration. 17 End use. Okay. We know where the water is

18 that we want to get out of the ground. We know about how we 19 want to treat it. What do you do with it after you treat 20 it? And there are a number of different options we looked 21 at. 22 Current use. There are many people out in 23 this area that have agricultural wells. POTW is another 24 expression for your local treatment plant that treats the 25 sewer water. Municipal use drinking water; for instance, DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 14

1 the City of Goodyear. The next is irrigation and then 2 reinjection. So as you can see, it's sort of a complex 3 matrix we have. We have all these different options we can

4 look at. 5 For soils, we have the same problem. There

6 are many different ways to look at the problem. Let's move

7 this up a little bit. 8 Okay. There are two technologies we can use 9 to deal with the contaminants in the ground. The first is 10 -- as I mentioned, these contaminants are volatile. They 11 vaporize. Therefore, we can collect them with not very 12 sophisticated — it's basically a vacuum cleaner. We stick 13 holes in the ground and we stick a vacuum cleaner on it and 14 we suck out the contaminants. And that's called soil vapor 15 extractions. And it's a very complex name for a very simple 16 technology. 17 The other way we could deal with the 18 contaminants is by capping. And there are two types of cap. 19 One is an asphalt cap. You see it on your roads all the 20 time. The second is called a RCRA cap. I'm sorry for all 21 these acronyms. 22 RCRA is another federal law: the Resource 23 Conservation Recovery Act, which tries to deal with current

24 facilities. And they have some standards for putting a cap 25 on top of contamination. One of the problems that we ran DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 15

1 into was a RCRA cap is four feet tall by the time you add on 2 clay and asphalt and all sorts of ground cover. And the 3 airport wasn't too happy about us putting four-foot caps all 4 over and then coming to a runway. So that wasn't one of the 5 more feasible options. 6 And as I mentioned, there were three target 7 areas that we could have looked at which are mentioned here. 8 This next slide looks at groundwater. The reason this slide 9 — the reason this slide is interesting is people say, 10 "Well, how do you know if it's better to pump slow or fast? 11 How do you make that decision?" And it's a difficult one to 12 make. 13 And one piece of information is how fast do 14 you clean things up. So what this tries to do is show you 15 when you pump, you are removing contaminants. Here you have 16 80 percent left in the ground, 60, 40 and 20 percent. And 17 this shows you the amount of time that you need to achieve 18 that. And in this one instance, I can consider it fairly 19 dramatic, the amount of time it takes to remove the 20 contaminants if you do it in an accelerated fashion. 21 Okay. The basic question that comes out of 22 all this: What's the bottom line? How much is it going to 23 cost? That's what this slide does. Let's take a second to 24 go over it. Let's talk about groundwater. 25 For pumping current rates, we're looking at DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 16

1 approximately 3.3 million dollars. That's the cost to build 2 the facilities, the piping, the pumps, the wells. To pump a 3 little bit faster means installing some additional wells. 4 4.9 million dollars. So it's about 1.6 million dollars more 5 to achieve a little bit faster clean-up. 6 The cost of treatment. Treating with air 7 stripping is $800,000. It's about twice that if you put air 8 emission controls. And it's about six million dollars to 9 use carbon. Carbon is a very expensive technology. 10 The end use, I have here zero dollars because 11 we are assuming, hoping that those folks that are currently 12 using their water can continue to use it, although that may 13 change in the future, and we have to have a contingency for 14 that. 15 One interesting note here — and this is 16 what we're going to be soliciting your comments on — air 17 emissions, pounds per day. Because the concentrations are 18 fairly low in this aquifer and we're pumping a fair amount 19 of water — because the concentrations are low, we have a 20 very low amount being emitted on a pounds-per-day basis. 21 Let me give you an example. The Maricopa County Air 22 Pollution Control Board has a standard: If you emit more 23 than 40 pounds a day, you need air emission controls, 24 Pima County is a little more aggressive. 25 They have a two-pound-per-day limit. Right now, Maricopa DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 17

1 County is considering modifying their standards. And if you 2 feel strongly, you're welcome to contact them with your 3 input. The point I'm trying to get across is, given the

4 concentrations we have, we have a fairly low emission rate.

5 Okay. 6 Under acceleration, we're pumping more 7 water. It's going to cost more to treat it. You can look 8 over the numbers. Over under the end use, you see a number 9 of different cost figures and potential uses. And you're 10 probably wondering why don't they just pick one and go with

11 it. 12 The problem is we're going to be extracting

13 a lot of water and as there are a number of different users,

14 one of the biggest users being the City of Goodyear. The

15 city is growing, and we'll have an increased demand in the

16 years to come. 17 The concern that we have is bridging the 18 growth of the city and the timing concerns that they have — 19 that we have with bringing that much water to them on a 20 schedule that they can accept it. So in the meantime, we 21 may need to do something else with the water. So when we go 22 to actually implement this remedy, we might have a number of 23 choices. 24 We'll look at the municipal. If the City 25 can't handle it yet, we might reject it and we might send it DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 18

1 to Agriculture. It's going to have to be a flexible 2 decision — a flexible document that embodies that decision. 3 Okay. Groundwater. We'll move on to soils 4 for the south area. You know, you can read the cost 5 figures. They're pretty self-explanatory. The bigger area 6 you have to deal with, the more expensive it is. 7 For the vacuuming I talked about, it's about 8 three to ten million dollars, depending on the size of the 9 area that you're going to work with. Capping, once again is 10 also about three to ten million dollars. It was interesting 11 in this analysis that we came out pretty even or comparable, 12 I should say. 13 Okay. Preferred remedy. The next slide, 14 which is slide number — it's your 18th slide. Okay. I 15 need to also mention that in the fact sheet we sent out, the 16 preferred remedy was italicized. The problem was that the 17 wrong one is italicized, and I apologize for that slipping 18 through. 19 What we're recommending and we're soliciting 20 comments on is the target area. And the rate of piomping is 21 an accelerated pumping schedule within ARARs, within those 22 boundaries delineated by drinking water standards and 23 health-based standards. The treatment air stripping because 24 it was more cost effective than carbon. And here, we've 25 made an initial preference to not use air emission controls DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 19

1 because the amount being emitted is very low, whereas with 2 the operable unit, air emission controls will be on the

3 final plant. Those volimies — the volume being emitted

4 there is much higher. 5 The end use, as I mentioned, it's not going

6 to be a priority of uses. We're going to have to be talking

7 with the City continually and the current users of water as

8 to who can take it when and what's the best method. And the

9 technology we've chosen is that very high-tech approach of

10 vacu\iming the soils. 11 We did a pilot out there, and we removed a 12 tremendous amount of soil or contaminants in a very short 13 time by vacuuming the soils. It was astounding. So we're 14 going to continue that approach. 15 The target area was target area two, which

16 was the middle of those two areas. We figured that was a 17 good balance and removed a good percentage of the 18 contaminants, upwards of 90 percent of the contaminants. 19 And we'll protect the groundwater in the future from ever 20 exceeding any of the health-based nijmbers. 21 This is enough. This is enough for this out 22 there. Let's just move to the north area. But let me just 23 say that all this information is embodied in a very huge 24 document known as the Remedial Investigation Feasibility 25 Study, which is found in your local library and can be — it DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 20

1 can be taken a look at. It's huge. It's three feet long, 2 four feet long. It's definitely not nighttime reading. All 3 this is in there except for the preferred remedy. That's 4 what you're going to need to take your handouts for. And 5 we'd like your comments on this remedy. 6 Okay. With that, I've got ten minutes to go 7 through the north area, which I'll do right now. Okay. The 8 north area is a plant operated by the Unidynamics Phoenix 9 plant. And there is some soil contamination, which has the 10 resulted in some groundwater contamination. 11 These numbers just show the levels of, in 12 this instance, Trichlorethylene or TCE, which is one of the 13 volatile organics that we found at the site. At this site, 14 as in the south, TCE always tends to show up in the highest 15 concentrations. So we tend to track that. Although we've 16 always — when a new well goes in, we always test for all 17 the contaminants. And whatever contaminants show up, that's 18 what we test for, for the balance of the investigation. 19 In this case, there were other contaminants 20 that showed up at lower concentrations in that same boimdary 21 of chlorinated volatile organics. As you can see here, we 22 do go past I-IO and moving to the north. 23 This is in subunit A, which is the shallow 24 drinking — shallow aquifer. It is not used for drinking. 25 It is highly saline. The lower aquifer subunit C which is DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 21

1 of drinking water quality, has only once, I think, or twice 2 ever crept above the drinking water standard for TCE at five 3 parts per billion. In fact, right now, I think it's just 4 below it. The reasons for that, I'm not quite sure. 5 There are far fewer wells in this area, old 6 wells that were — could have been conduits where 7 contaminants could be slower. There are a number of 8 reasons. But albeit to say that the concern we have in the 9 north, although there are higher concentrations, we're 10 fortunate that they are in an aquifer that is not being used 11 for drinking water, although it has demonstrated a 12 possibility of being in contact with the lower drinking 13 water aquifer. 14 On to soils. This is an overview of the 15 site. These are very dull slides. I'm sorry about that. 16 No colors or anything. This is showing Unidynamics using 17 solvents over the years. We took a number of samples. 18 Actually, we didn't. Unidynamics has taken the lead on all 19 their activities to date, both the investigation and the 20 feasibility study, which is also in the library. This 21 showed where — it is hot in here. Sorry about that. 22 A VOICE: This is Arizona, Jeff. 23 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Oh, that's right. This 24 shows all the soil boring locations. Also, the soil gas was 25 done on the site. And the next three figures show the DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 22

1 target areas for the three different levels. Solvents in 2 the soils above ADHS levels, health-based leveled, soils 3 above background and soil gas. 4 The interesting thing to note about this 5 facility is it's fun to do with overviews. If you overlap 6 them, they literally overlap. They're very, very close to 7 each other. 8 Okay. Let's get down to which alternatives 9 were looked at and what E.P.A.'s preferred remedy is at this 10 time. I've lost track which have slide we're on. 11 25. The alternatives looked at are very 12 similar to the south, so I'm just going to sound like a 13 broken record here. The first one was well-head treatment 14 at point of use. This is a bureaucratic way of saying the 15 drinking water well comes up contaminated. You put a 16 treatment plant right out in the — a treatment plant right 17 on that well, and you clean it up.

18 The next is pumping within the 100 part per 19 billion TCE contour. Then they looked at pumping in those 20 two subunits within ARARs and pumping in the subunits above 21 background levels. And there are various pumping rates. So 22 it's analogous to what we did in the south. 23 Treatment. They looked at air stripping 24 with air emission controls. Carbon was — carbon is part of 25 the feasibility study, but was screened out a little earlier DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 23

1 than in ours, also based on a cost factor. 2 End use is similar. Current use, municipal 3 use and reinjection. 4 Under soil vapor — under soils technology, 5 very similar. They looked at soil extraction and they also 6 looted at capping. And they looked at another option here 7 called excavation and treatment with rotary kilns, and that 8 is because, one, that's an alternative looked at for the 9 solvents, but there are also some contaminants on the 10 property which may not be amenable to being vacuumed up. 11 And we have to go out and take a look at that during the 12 remedial — during the remedial action. But there is a 13 possibility that excavation and some treatment may be 14 required. 15 Once again, the bottom line. These are some 16 of the cost figures that have been worked out. Here's — I 17 put the number in the — for activated carbon there for 18 those that were interested. It's an efficient technology. 19 It's just very, very expensive. 20 There's a note here that says at this time, 21 there is no need for well-head treatment, and that's 22 something I haven't been reiterating enough, and that is, no 23 water is being provided to anyone that exceeds any of the 24 ARARs or any of the standards to the citizens. 25 So that's why there's this wide range here DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Si Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 24

1 for well-head treatment if there are any wells that do — 2 are contaminated in the future, they would require 3 treatment. But at this time there aren't any in the 4 drinking water aquifer, both to the south and up near 5 Unidynamics. So that's why there's this widespread 6 contingency. 7 And the various costs for the different 8 pumping rates. It's pretty obvious the more you pump, the 9 more it's going to cost. Down below is also a spread for 10 the different soil options. Waste facility one, I'm sure — 11 I should have stated this before — was a location on the 12 facility that there's known disposal. It's a point source. 13 There were some dry wells where contaminants 14 went down. And for a comparison purposes, I looked at right 15 there, and then looking at the soils all over the site. As 16 you can see, there's another widespread of costs. 17 Preferred alternative. Consistent with the 18 north, we'll be pumping out of subunit A and C within ARARs. 19 Subunit C is sort of a difficult one because right — right 20 now, it's hovering at standard. So it will have to be 21 monitored very closely. The treatment will be air stripping 22 with air emission controls. The concentrations are much 23 higher and will require those controls. 24 The end use. As with the Operable Units, 25 they're going to reinject that water from subunit A, which DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 25

1 is pretty salty water. It can't be used for anything else, 2 not even a water slide. The subunit C, there are a couple 3 of options: Either drinking water or reinjection. And 4 they'll be working with the City and working with other 5 people in the area to determine the best use as things get 6 under way. 7 As I stated here, well-head treatment is a 8 perfectly legitimate option for wells that are contaminated 9 a great distance away from a central treatinent plant. If 10 they choose to put a treatment plant on their facility — on 11 the facility if the well is a mile away, it doesn't make 12 sense to pipe that water a mile. So you can just treat it 13 right at the well-head. 14 Soils. We've chosen to go with soils that 15 are above background levels. This one — this target area 16 was — they all overlap, so it's sort of an arbitrary 17 distinction. They're all about the same and using soil 18 vapor extraction. And there's a chance that soil vapor 19 extraction may not work with some of the contaminants. We'd 20 like to give it a shot, go in, and see if we can excavate 21 and do it, but I'd rather not. I'd rather not see it in 22 place. 23 I should also mention that the soil vapor 24 extraction will have carbon in it to absorb the contaminants 25 as they come out of the ground. Unidynamics prepared their DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 26

1 own feasibility study, and that is included with ours with 2 the one, which was prepared by E.P.A., which is in the 3 library. It's volvime eight — I think eight — seven, nine. 4 Volume seven. So you can look at it there. 5 Okay. Schedule. We talked about money. 6 Let's talk about time. Here we are June 21st, having a 7 public meeting. Your comment — there's a 30-day Public 8 Comment Period, which started June 7th. We're about half 9 way through. It runs to July 7. 10 The address to send the comments on this are 11 on this fact sheet. We're up in San Francisco. When your 12 comments are received, we will respond to them, and then 13 Norm will go over how that will be done. 14 We'll have a record of the decision about 15 the site, which is when the head of our region. Region Nine, 16 signs a document stating that — what the remedy is. He's 17 looked at our study. He's looked at the public comments. 18 He'll look at our response to your comments and say, "Okay. 19 Let's go with this option. 20 That will happen in September. We will then 21 begin talking with the companies to see who will implement 22 the remedy and the timing of that remedy. And that will 23 happen October through April. 24 Then starting April, 1990, we'll begin to 25 design the final remedy and finally build it by May. DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 27

1 I've talked 25 minutes. Sorry about running 2 over. That was a lot of material. What I'd like to do now 3 is have Norm just give you a short presentation on the 4 process and how the comments get incorporated into what 5 we're doing. 6 We'll then go into a question-and-answer 7 period where I will, and whoever I think is the most 8 appropriate person to respond to your questions. We'll then 9 take a break and the people will sort of figure out what 10 comments they'd like to make. And that will be the Public 11 Comment Period, which is the last section. 12 I should mention we do have a court reporter 13 here. This is all being taken down and will be part of the 14 official record. Please ask all your questions during the 15 question-and-answer period because during the Public Comment 16 Period, I can't respond to you. It's just you're making a 17 comment, and the comment goes into the record. And then I 18 respond to it. So keep that in mind. I think that's about 19 it. With that, I'm going to turn it over to Norman. 20 MR. NORM CALERO: Good evening. My name is Norman 21 Calero. I'm the community relations coordinator for the 22 E.P.A. site. I just wanted to talk a little bit about the 23 community relations because we think it's a very important 24 part of the Superfund process. 25 Through community relations, our objectives DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 28

1 are to try to inform and give the public an opportunity to 2 comment and provide input to cite remedies. E.P.A. does 3 this through fact sheets, which are distributed throughout 4 the milestones and Superfund process, 5 And by the way, 2 80 fact sheets were sent 6 out for the PGA site. Also through public comment periods, 7 as we're in right now, which closes July 7, and through such 8 meetings as the one we're having tonight. 9 At the close of the Public Comment Period, 10 E.P.A. will prepare written responses to all comments 11 received. These responses will be contained in a document 12 called the Response Summary. The Response Summary will be 13 available in the Avondale Public Library. 14 After the Response Summary, E.P.A. will 15 determine the final theme of decision for the PGA site. 16 E.P.A.'s final decision is reflected in a record of 17 decision, or ROD, which E.P.A. will sign in mid September.

18 After the ROD is signed, a fact sheet or a ROD fact sheet 19 will inform the public of the final decision of the site. 20 Also the Community Relations Plan will be updated. And in 21 that, it will address any new or changing community 22 concerns. 23 Also I wanted to mention TAGS, which are 24 Technical Assistance Grants that are available. It's an 25 opportunity for p\iblic involvement, and TAGS are designed to DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 29

1 assist community groups in interpreting technical 2 information. One eligible community group at the Superfund 3 can apply for a grant of up to $50,000. And I brought some 4 TAG brochures in case anyone is interested. There's one

5 left? 6 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: One left. 7 MR. CALERO: So I can get some more if anyone else

8 wants to know about that. And we'll be talking about

9 community relations in general. Thanks. 10 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Okay. Since Donna will be

11 taking all this down, even for the question-and-answer

12 period, it would be great if you could give your name just 13 for the record. And if it's a strange spelling, if you 14 could give the spelling, that would be great. 15 A VOICE: Could we ask if you guys can speak up so

16 we can hear back here? 17 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Sure. During the 18 question-and-answer period, if you could state your name, 19 that would be great for Donna, the court reporter. 20 I'll be responding — I'll try and respond 21 to your questions. Other people here have been working on 22 the site as well who may be more appropriate to respond to 23 those questions, but they haven't given a presentation yet. 24 I also have with me Gwen Eng, who is from 25 the Agency for Toxic Substance Disease Registry, which is DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 30

1 the agency who Congress mandated should be looking at health 2 estimates or assessment for the site, and I thought those 3 questions might surface tonight, so I thought it best to

4 bring her. 5 With that, I'd like to open it up to any

6 questions that you have. 7 MS. PAMELA SWIFT: Pamela Swift, Chairwoman of

8 Toxic Waste Investigative Group. We haven't talked about 9 the health ramifications of any of this, and these sites 10 have been polluted for quite a few years. 11 And I always mention the fact that I'm quite

12 amazed that you're not lining up along with the CDC and the

13 Department of Health Services, some sort of health survey in 14 order to pick up any victims that were harmed from working 15 at least onsite around these chemicals and drinking the

16 water that had these chemicals in them. 17 Now, at what point are you going to be 18 concerned about the health of the people that worked at

19 these companies for years? 20 MR, JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Okay. Do you want to — I 21 have sort of a thought on that, but do you want to— 22 MS. GWEN ENG: My name is Gwen Eng. It's spelled 23 E-n-g. I'm with the Agency for Toxic Substance and Disease 24 Registry, which is part of the U.S. Piiblic Health Service. 25 We used to be with the Center for Disease Control, but we DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 31

1 did split off. 2 Our agency has always looked at the 3 potential public health concerns on the E.P.A. site. And we 4 review the data that E.P.A. gathers, and we did identify 5 some public health concerns that were addressed in the 6 preliminary health assessment. And I think Jeff can state 7 what the outcome is. 8 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Yeah, as far as the — 9 onsite, E.P.A. doesn't work with OSHA, although we have no 10 jurisdiction for onsite worker exposure. When our employees 11 go on to a site, they have to follow OSHA regulations for 12 protective clothing and proper procedures. 13 As far as exposure that occurred within the 14 companies, that's another thing OSHA would have to respond 15 as to. It's not within my jurisdiction. It's sort of a 16 bureaucratic response, but it's just that Congress didn't 17 give me that authority. 18 MS. PAMELA SWIFT: Well, I know we've talked about 19 this before. And I know that the E.P.A., if they are 20 suspect of an area, can turn it over to the Center for 21 Disease Control, and then they can start their stonewalling 22 program. 23 But as you know, I've attended every one of 24 these meetings here and I hear from the victims, from the 25 people that worked there that really believe that their DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 32

1 health problems are a result of the extensive pollution, 2 where they worked. 3 Now, last time, you had a CDC man here who 4 said that they didn't see any imminent health problem. And 5 then I had to remind him that they hadn't looked for a 6 health problem. And the only way that somebody is going to 7 pick this up is from getting the names of the employees and 8 then running a health survey on them to see if they're still 9 alive. 10 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Why don't I talk about that 11 on how we — on how that kind survey gets done. Gwen, do 12 you want to? 13 MS. GWEN ENG: To initiate that, if there is a 14 potential — if there is a problem that — 15 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Gwen, can you speak up just 16 a little bit? 17 MS. GWEN ENG: Sure. If there is a problem 18 that's been truly identified by a resident or an employee, 19 if you could bring that to our attention, we'll be glad to 20 take a look at it and what it is, is we'll bring all the 21 data back to the center. It's the Agency for Toxic 22 Substance and Disease Registry and doctors, 23 environmentalists, toxicologists, they all take a look at it 24 and see if there is a public health concern. 25 MS. PAMELA SWIFT: But wouldn't you just suspect DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 33

1 that because they were drinking the polluted water — and

2 the water was polluted, the drinking water onsite — they

3 were handling this — these chemicals without protective 4 clothing. They were in federal violation from pouring it

5 into the sewer. 6 That wouldn't you say that since there's all 7 of this concern about cleaning it up and all of this concern 8 about the pollution, that on the other side of that, is 9 health, that there almost would have to be some health 10 problems from these chemicals? I mean, wouldn't you just 11 say it just has to be because how polluted — the 12 extensiveness of the pollution on these sites? 13 It just stands to reason. I don't think 14 that we need to walk through the cemetery and go victim for 15 victim on this, although I do have a few. The last woman I

16 talked to is now — she passed away. 17 MS. GWEN ENG: Is her data still available for us

18 to take a look at? 19 MS. PAMELA SWIFT: Yes. 20 MS. GWEN ENG: Why don't you send it to me. I'll

21 give you my card. 22 MS. PAMELA SWIFT: Okay. I'll be more than happy 23 to do that. But then you should start taking the initiative

24 on your own because this is for our health. All of this

25 involves our health. DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 34

1 MS. GWEN ENG: Well, that's why we're here. We

2 are concerned. 3 MS. PAMELA SWIFT: It involves the money and the

4 clean-up. And the whole thing about these chemicals is

5 they're killing people. And that seems to be the last thing

6 that anybody involved in this wants to address on any level.

7 And that should be one of the first things. You see why I'm

8 concerned? 9 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Okay. 10 MS. GWEN ENG: Yes, but I am new to this working 11 on this site. And so if you do have specific information, 12 if you would send it to me, 13 MS. PAMELA SWIFT: Yes, I will. 14 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Okay. Thanks.

15 Next? Please. 16 MR. CHUCK BINGHAM: Is it safe to work at the

17 airport? 18 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: We have done soil gas work 19 and air monitoring. The reason we undertook the air 20 monitoring was we had that concern. We had done soil gas 21 surveys, which is — in two minutes, you take a steel pipe 22 and you drive it into the ground about five feet and you

23 pull out some gas and see what — if there's any

24 contaminants in there. 25 And we found some locations that were DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 35

1 contaminated — of concern. So we went back to those same

2 locations and did air monitoring, both right at groundwater

3 and in the breathing zone; it's about four or five feet.

4 And the results pointed out that there was no elevated level 5 — elevated risk-in that area — in those areas. 6 We were monitoring wind. We were monitoring 7 upgradient, downgradient, to be sure cars didn't go by and 8 we found it the accumulations of background normally found 9 in the Phoenix area; that it didn't pose a threat. 10 So at this point, no. There will be 11 activity at the airport. In fact, that's a chance they will 12 be expanding some of the facilities there. Lufthansa is 13 expanding the flight training center. And we had extensive 14 discussion with them because they want to dig in the area 15 where we found contaminants, and we were adamant that if 16 they go and they start digging, they've got to monitor 17 closely. 18 They've got to have an approved health plan, 19 and they have to use proper health and safety controls. And 20 that is, if they go and they find contaminants, their 21 workers have to get in proper protective gear. 22 There's a chance of digging down, they will 23 encounter some contaminants. So when these occur, I would 24 definitely recommend staying away from those areas. But 25 it's only when disturbing the soil that there's that DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 36

1 concern. 2 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Yeah. 3 MR. DEWAYNE NOLIN: DeWayne Nolin of FAA. We have 4 some concerns about the soil contcunination and the amount of 5 dust that's blowing out aroimd the air traffic control 6 tower, and you made a statement that the soil gases are 7 constantly evaporating; is that correct? 8 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Yeah, that's what we found 9 when we did the air surveys; that we weren't finding 10 anything just off the ground surveys. 11 MR. DEWAYNE NOLIN: And the blowing dust, what is 12 the health risk to our employees there when the dust is 13 picked up by, let's say, our air conditioners and put inside 14 the building? 15 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: On our — we did the air 16 survey. We did get particulates and didn't find anything, 17 The only area of concern is a ways away before the airport, 18 and there are some areas that do have some — that were used 19 for chromium disposal which we're taking care of right now. 20 And that's right now imder a moderate cover. 21 So at this point, I would assume there would

22 be no health concerns. 23 MR. DEWAYNE NOLIN: Okay. Our other concern is the

24 transportation of this material from the Lufthansa site. 25 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: M'hum. DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 37

1 MR. DEWAYNE NOLIN: And is the contractor going to 2 have that in enclosed containers when he transports it? 3 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: That's a good question.

4 Actually I got a call on that before, and it's something I'm

5 taking a look at. I'm not sure what Department of 6 Transportation regulations are on it because the Department 7 of Transportation handles the movement of most anything, 8 including hazardous waste. And they have — you have to have

9 certain placards,

10 And I was wondering if during the transport,

11 did they have to — I mean, what you do when you do want to

12 cover it or were there some steps you had to take. And

13 that's something I'm still following up on, so I have to get

14 back to you on that gain, 15 MR, DEWAYNE NOLIN: Okay. One more question and

16 I'll leave you alone. 17 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: That's okay. His is going

18 to take a few minutes. 19 MR. DEWAYNE NOLIN: I understand they're going to 20 transport it to the other end of the airport, the west end 21 of the airport and stockpile it down there. 22 Will that area be covered, capped or — 23 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Okay. What they're doing

24 now is they're picking up all material and moving it to one 25 central location. They're going to put this green or a DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 38

1 plastic down and put the material on top of it and cover it, 2 and what they're going to do is test it before they 3 transport it off site because if it's clean, they can use it

4 for clean fill. 5 If it's contaminated, it's got to be taken

6 to a proper disposal area, which right now is in Utah. And

7 so — but it takes time to do those tests. So as you're 8 excavating, you have to be able to put it somewhere.

9 So once again, it sort of falls in the same

10 — your same question as proper controls, either wetting the

11 material down or covering it. It's going to be covered from

12 below. But there's legitimate concerns to also look at

13 covers. 14 MR. DEWAYNE NOLIN: Thank you. 15 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Thanks a lot, Dewayne. Any

16 other question? 17 How about this other one, and I'll get back

18 to you. 19 ^ MR, RICHARD PARK: I was wondering if you can tell

20 me just how safe— 21 MR, JEFF ROSEtJBLOOM: Can you give your name? 22 MR, RICHARD PARK: My name is Richard Park, and I 23 was wondering if you could tell me just how safe the

24 drinking water is and how do you determine that? 25 MR, JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Right now, the City of DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 39

1 Goodyear's water supply comes from east of the airport and 2 east of the facility. The groundwater flows in from the 3 east, so all the contaminants are downgradient of the City. 4 The City has not provided any water that 5 exceeds any of those standards. They're tested on a — I

6 haven't checked in a week on the chlorine basis. I'm not 7 sure exactly what basis it's done, but a volatile organic

8 scan is done for determine what, if any, concentrations are

9 detected. So it's dependent on a fairly frequent basis. 10 MR. RICHARD PARK: When you say concentrations, 11 are you referring to specific things you're looking for

12 or — 13 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Right. They have to do a

14 scan of all the contaminants we're interested in, not just

15 specifically just TCE. They do an entire scan.

16 MR. RICHARD PARK: That is correct. Thank you. 17 MR. JEFF R0SE1©L00M: And whenever we drill a

18 well, we do that same scan. 19 Yes? 20 MR. DENNIS MYERS: Dennis Myers of the F.A.A.. 21 When was the airport designated the Superfund site and when 22 was the City of Phoenix notified? 23 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: City of Phoenix? 24 MR. DENNIS MYERS: Yeah. They're the owners of

25 the airport. DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 40

1 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: I don't know. The site was 2 initially proposed for the national priorities list, which 3 is the federal Superfund list in 1983. It was finalized in

4 September of '84. 5 I started working on the site September of

6 '85 — '86. I am not sure exactly whether the City was

7 notified. Jannet, if you — all right. I'm not sure

8 exactly when the City was notified. 9 MR. DENNIS MYERS: Who has that information in

10 the City and what department? 11 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Yeah, Susan Keith is with

12 the City, and she's been involved in other sites throughout

13 the Phoenix area so you could get it from her. I don't know

14 where she is. 15 Yes? 16 MS. FILOMENA DURAZO: My name is Filomena Durazo. 17 I knew it was between 19 83 and '84. Why in the world did 18 they wait over six and five years to do something about it? 19 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Well, the answer to that is 20 it's taken an incredibly long time to figure out the exact 21 location of all these contaminants. It's been a long, hard

22 haul. 23 MS. FILOMENA DURAZO: Well, they used to say the

24 same about casting in Maryvale and Glendale almost in the

25 same year, and they all stopped until somebody start messing DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 41

1 around, then brought it back in, and the same thing with

2 this one. 3 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Right. When the problem was

4 first, you know, first found, they determined if there were

5 any immediate threats and dound the drinking water still of

6 good quality.

7 And we started what we call our remedial

8 investigation, which is a big term for, you know, a

9 long-term study. We can also — we also did take actions at

10 the site relatively immediately which was to clean up the 11 sewers in the area, to remove contaminants that were — 12 contaminants that were exposing people directly. And after 13 that action was taken, we felt we could take the time 14 necessary to properly look at the problem without — 15 MS. FILOMENA DURAZO: You took too long. It's

16 cost you more. 17 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: It has taken a long time,

18 and we're trying to do it faster every day. 19 Any other questions? I'll get to you in a

20 second, Pam. 21 MR. MIKE BOONE: Mike Boone. I'm a resident. 22 I've got a few questions. Is that stuff that you pull out 23 of the ground, you know, out of the water, and you airstrip

24 it and then are you going to have a tall stack and let it — 25 how high are you going to blow it up in the air before you DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 42

1 — it gets away from the site (o r how are you going — what 2 are you going to do from there ? Just let it go into the air 3 at ground lev el?

4 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Well, that's what we're —

5 MR. MIKE BOONE: Or ]no t have on a stack to take it 6 away. 7 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: No, we will have a stack. I 8 don't know about the exact hei ght. Currently, a treatment 9 plant is going in at the airport, and the tower is going to 10 be 40 or so feet. 11 MR. MIKE BOONE: Because my concern is — and you 12 probably know yourself -- that the wind always blows that

13 way.

14 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: M'hum.

15 MR. MIKE BOONE: So with Avondale and Goodyear, 16 we'll be expo sed to it constantly. 17 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: M'hum. 18 MR. MIKE BOONE: Now , I don't know if that stuff 19 settles to the ground. Some of it would rise, I guess, TCE 20 and some Of i t evaporates from the air. But there probably 21 are some contaminants in there that you're going to extract

22 that may not. I don't know. And they will be falling on us

23 and bombarding us for the five years that it takes to do

24 it—

25 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Right. DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Si Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 43

1 MR. MIKE BOONE: — which could be a greater 2 health hazard to the people standing over here right now 3 than it would be if they went over and started digging in 4 the ground. So you're exposing them to an unnecessary 5 hazard that they wouldn't have if you didn't do this 6 clean-up. 7 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: M'hum. 8 MR. MIKE BOONE: And especially on the north site. 9 You said it was a lot higher concentration. You're going to

10 captivate it and take it off and burn it. 11 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Right. 12 MR. MIKE BOONE: But down there, you're going to 13 have a constant bombarding just like the reclamations down 14 there. When the wind is right and it blows over and you can 15 smell it for five or ten miles, the same thing with it. We 16 may not be able to smell it, but we'll get it. 17 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Right, and that's why I'm 18 asking for comments today. On one of the charts I showed 19 that by our initial calculations, we show about one to two 20 pounds a day being emitted from all of the treatment plants, 21 whether they're at the well-head or a central plant. The 22 current county standard calls for a 40-pound-per-day limit, 23 although we have asked for and gotten air controls when

24 there's less emissions than that. 25 MR. MIKE BOONE: The thing I see about this is DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 44

1 right now, unless we go over there, we're not exposed to it. 2 But when you start that, then everybody in, say, Avondale 3 and Goodyear is going to be exposed to it somewhat, and they

4 weren't unless you do that. 5 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Right. And that's what I

6 was driving at. The current — the amount that is being

7 released, one or two pounds, we feel is such a low rate as

8 to not significantly affect the residents. 9 If you feel strongly, please provide a 10 public comment, and we'll respond to that. 11 MR. MIKE BOONE: Okay. If you— 12 I^. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: He's still working on it. 13 MR. MIKE BOONE: If you talk about taking the 14 water out and letting the City use it— 15 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: After it's been treated. 16 MR. MIKE BOONE: — after it's been treated. Are 17 you going to treat it for salt, as well as the other 18 contaminants? Are you going to just airstrip it and put it 19 into the system and mix it and give us not too salty, but

20 somewhat salty water? 21 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: No, actually any water 22 detracted from the upper water table, if it's real salty,

23 won't go into the City municipal system. It will only be 24 water from the lower imits, which are much less salty and — 25 MR. MIKE BOONE: Well, how far are you going to DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 45

1 pull it? Down about 300? 2 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Yeah, as I mentioned, the

3 wells go down to about 360 feet. So any water that's

4 extracted there won't be treated for solvents, but those

5 meet what are called secondary drinking water — there are

6 standards for salts.

7 MR. MIKE BOONE: The highest contamination is

8 around 90 to 60 feet where your surface water is. It hasn't

9 migrated down and gotten into the other wells yet because

10 the casing hasn't crusted out or anything.

11 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: We have some contamination

12 onsite and some sporadic points offsite. But for the most,

13 it stayed in the upper aquifer. 14 MR, MIKE BOONE: You're going to pull the hardest

15 from the top where the salty water is, 16 MR, JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Right,

17 MR. MIKE BOONE: But you'll have a way to separate

18 the salty water from the better water? 19 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: We'll have treatment plants, 20 MR. MIKE BOONE: So you'll have one pulling deep 21 and one pulling shallow so you can separate it, otherwise 22 you wouldn't be able—

23 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Exactly.

24 MR. MIKE BOONE: Our water is getting saltier as

25 all water is in the whole country, as it is, but it won't DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 46

1 become more salty as a result of this, if you should use 2 that. And then the other one was on the wells, you've got 3 one that's real close over here like 500 feet from us.

4 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Right. 5 MR. MIKE BOONE: And then you've got one across

6 from Unidynamics about 300 feet. If you found that they 7 started picking up contaminants, which they could very well, 8 if the casing leaks or something, then would you put a plant 9 on there and give it to us free in the future because it was 10 a Superfund gift and treat that water from now imtil it no 11 longer is contaminated?

12 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: What you're talking about is 13 — what's going to happen is when we go to implement the 14 remedy, we're going to go negotiate with the companies to 15 see how the remedy will be implemented. And what we do is 16 we sign a legal document called a consent decree. 17 And in there, there are reopenings. If 18 something new arises that was unknown before, we get to go 19 back and renegotiate with them and look at it and look at 20 the problem and see what the proper solution should be. 21 So we're going to leave that option

22 available to us. 23 MR. MIKE BOONE: After five years, if you pull

24 off and then they start picking up, oh, five parts per 25 billion in these two or three wells that are north that we DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 47

1 rely on heavily, and it picks up a higher content, then you 2 would use your powers to cause Goodyear or whoever it is 3 that is held responsible, to come in here and clean that

4 water up and then give that water to us? 5 MR. JEFF.ROSENBLOOM: We would — we would make it

6 part of the remedy in place. As far as the end use of that

7 water, you know, we could talk to the City, because water 8 rights is a very big issue here. We would check with the 9 Department of Water Resources. Exactly. So all the parties

10 would continue to be involved. 11 Ed? 12 MR. ED KUCHARSKI: Actually— 13 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Give us your name. 14 MR, ED KUCHARSKI: Ed Kucharski with the City of 15 Phoenix, Part of the attraction — or the reinjection 16 process in essence is the recommended remedial action here, 17 You're talking about end use. By end use, you mean once the 18 water has been reinjected? 19 MR, JEFF ROSENBLOOM: No, before it's been 20 reinjected. End use is like it comes out of the treatment

21 plant and then— 22 MR, ED KUCHARSKI: Wouldn't you slow down the 23 process if you do not reinject? Wasn't part of the process 24 to act at a modifier and have lesser concentration? 25 MR, JEFF ROSENBLOOM: And that's why we looked at DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 48

1 reinjection for the last Operable Unit because we didn't 2 want to dewater the unit. And we can set up a circle. But 3 when you're pulling — when you were pulling out water from

4 subunit B and C, one of the options is municipal, but the

5 other option is reinjection and I guess in the remedial

6 design, we'll be deciding on that. But it's a concern. 7 MR. ED KUCHARSKI: Whose legal right is that water

8 once you treat it? 9 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: That's a very good question, 10 and I'm not side-stepping it, but we're working on it. It's 11 — that's going to have to be a discussion, a discussion 12 between the airport, the City, Department of Water 13 Resources. It has to do with service areas and stuff that

14 I'm not incredibly familiar with.

15 MR. ED KYUCHARSKI: The judge, the federal judge,

16 not necessarily the state level, will say that the City is

17 the obvious owners of it. 18 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: My first preference is to 19 have the local folks settle it before we have to allocate

20 it. 21 MR. ED KUCHARSKI: But the judge does decide. 22 It's his signature that says what's going to be done. 23 MR. JEFF ROSEl^ffiLOOM: Right. That's why the

24 wording in this legal document will have to be very, very 25 exact as to — because the judge may sign a document that DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 49

1 says the City, the DWR and Phoenix will get in a room and 2 lock the door and nobody comes out alive until it's decided. 3 I'm sorry. You had another question? 4 MR, DEWAYNE NOLIN: Dewayne Nolin, F.A.A.. Yes, 5 is the treatment plant going to be located on the airport 6 proper? 7 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: There's a treatment plant 8 going in right now. That one will be on the airport. Any 9 future ones, I couldn't tell you. 10 It has to do with the available land. It 11 has to do with the — if the airport is willing to give us 12 land. It has to do with where the wells are located. You 13 know, if we have a number of wells off the airport property, 14 it doesn't make sense to run with that pipe. So it really 15 depends on the design. And plus, the airport is undergoing 16 expansion, so you have to take that in consideration. So 17 the answer is I don't know yet. 18 MR. DEWAYNE NOLIN: Keep in mind, you made the 19 statement that you can have towers, and these air stripping 20 towers will be about the 40-foot level. And that air 21 traffic control tower has people in it at the 75-foot level. 22 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Right. Yeah. Definitely, 23 Pam, you had another question. Sorry. I 24 was going to get back to you. 25 MS. PAMELA SWIFT: I'm really concerned about DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 50

1 this air stripping. 2 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Okay. 3 MS. PAMELA SWIFT: First of all, the Maricopa 4 County Air Pollution Department is in shambles. They always 5 plead poverty. That's why tJiey don't have the 24-hour 6 service, and a lot of our industries that are in the 7 Maryvale catch area, Slst Avenue, Buckeye Road, Van Buren, 8 emit pollutants at night. And it's anybody's guess on if 9 they're staying within the 40-pound limit. 10 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: M'hum. 11 MS. PAMELA SWIFT: Probably not. We have the 12 Benzenta Farms. We have Anderson-Clayton, ATSiT. All of 13 them have been in constant violation. But the Air Pollution 14 Department can never seem to get their equipment out there 15 to catch these people with any consistency because they lack 16 manpower and they lack proper funding. Now, if we have the 17 40-poimd a day set here— 18 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: M'hum. 19 MS. PAMELA SWIFT: — and if there's this air 20 stripping — and we do have a very bad inversion problem 21 here in the valley, then the air stripping is going to come 22 off, and as this gentleman said, it blows into Tolleson, 23 Avondale, into Phoenix, mixes with those other chemicals. 24 If this was the only one, we could say, "Yeah, that's safe. 25 Go with it." DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 51

1 But we really have a serious air pollution 2 problem here. And it appears to me that with going the 3 cost-effective way that you're going is going to be — have 4 adverse health — you know, it's adverse to our health and 5 environment. 6 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: You reminded me of something 7 I should mention also. Besides the — is it getting warm in 8 here? 9 Besides the Maricopa County standard, the 10 issue you raise is important. And E.P.A. headquarters both 11 — thank you — Office of Air and Office of Superfund have 12 put put a joint policy paper right now, and the policy paper 13 is looking at three options for air emission controls. 14 I can tell you what those options are. They 15 are looking at the air emission controls strictly based on 16 risk. The second option is based strictly on any local 17 laws. The third option is if the Superfund stripper is 18 within a nonattainment area — that's a term used for an 19 area that has ozone problems, which Phoenix is one of them 20 — you will meet a certain pound-per-day limit. 21 And although I'm not here to say what that 22 pound-per-day limit is, it is less than 40. So the message 23 is getting up to Washington now. Some more stringent 24 controls may be required. 25 MS. PAMELA SWIFT: But let me — let's don't look DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 52

1 to Washington. Really, you could set the standards. You 2 can be below our county standards. You could set the 3 standards to be three pounds a day or two pounds. 4 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Right. 5 MS. PAMELA SWIFT: You could do this. 6 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: In fact, with the 7 negotiations with Goodyear, their final Operable Unit will 8 have air emission controls and they were less than 40 pounds 9 a day. So, yes, in fact — 10 MS. PAMELA SWIFT: Okay. 11 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: And that's what I'd like to 12 — during the public comment period, you know, if you feel 13 like adressing that, please. 14 MS, PAMELA SWIFT: Let me ask you this: If we 15 took a vote right now and no one here would want air 16 stripping, would you guys say, "Hey, no problem, we'll go 17 turn to carbon"?

18 MR, JEFF ROSENBLOOM: I couldn't answer that, but 19 I presume my administrator would, 20 MS. PAMELA SWIFT: Is there someone who here 21 could? You know, you're going to get on the plane and 22 bye-bye. But, I mean, if we that live here and know what 23 the air pollution problem is already — if we took a vote 24 right now, would you change your mind? Because you seem to 25 already have it made up. DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Si Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 53

1 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: No, that's what I'm saying. 2 It's a preferred remedy and instead of a vote, I'd like to 3 sort of do it in a more official manner. If during the 4 public comment period, if you're opposed to it, state your 5 name, your oppositions, and my rezone administrator does 6 take public comments very seriously, and we have to take 7 those into account. 8 Any other questions? Yeah. 9 MR. MIKE BOONE: Is it imperative that this be 10 cleaned up or could you subsidize the people that clean the 11 water and do it for them? You know, you're talking 12 12 billion or I don't know how many billion dollars, whatever, 13 if you just right now say the water is not below — above 14 limits, if you just set the money aside and let it draw 15 interest and make sure that nobody can get it for anything 16 but that, and then let it subsidize the cleaning of our 17 water, we could not only get — we could get rid of the 18 salt; we could get everything out of it and get free water. 19 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: The concern — I'm with the 20 Environmental Protection Agency, and my mandate is to 21 protect the resources. And there's a resource east of you 22 that is contaminated. And there's potential growth by the 23 City could that encompass that area, and they need that 24 resource in the future. 25 So it's really imperative to me to take care DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Si Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 54

1 of that problem now so the people in the future have a clean 2 water source to go to. So that's one approach. So I'd like 3 to get it done now rather than later. 4 Any other questions? Okay. Let's take ten 5 minutes to gather your wits. Take some notes if you'd like, 6 and I'd like to go to Public Comment Period when we convene. 7 And as I mentioned, I won't be able to 8 respond to you. It will be — you'll be standing up in 9 front of the court reporter speaking your peace, and it will 10 go in the record. So I have 8:10. Why not 8:20 let's 11 reconvene. 12 (Whereupon, a recess was taken from 8:10 13 p.m. to 8:20 p.m..) 14 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Thanks for putting up with 15 the heat. There are a couple of bureaucrats that can go and 16 take care of. There is a mailing list or a sign-up sheet 17 that I hope everyone signed so we can keep our mailing list 18 current, so if you could remember to sign that. 19 If you need extra copies of this 20 (indicating), let me know. We'll try and get them to you 21 and any other materials that were handed out. 22 There's also a phone number on the fact 23 sheet that you can call E.P.A. for free, a toll-free number. 24 We're going to start the Public Comment Period. The Public 25 Comment Period is an official part of the record. It will DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 55

1 go into our administrative record. All these legal terms. 2 But it's very important because this 3 administrative record is used to decide on the Final Remedy, 4 Donna is our court reporter, and she'll be taking down your 5 comments. So what I'd like is for to you step forward, say 6 your name clearly, speak clearly for her. 7 And I'd like to open up the floor. And we 8 have a request that — Pam has some other engagements. 9 MS. PAMELA SWIFT: My name is Pamela Swift. And 10 I'm still very concerned about the health problems here and 11 of the employees that used to work here. So once again, 12 this is the fourth time they have been here and the fourth 13 time I've requested for health surveys, I do not want to 14 see air stripping because of our air quality laws. And even 15 if we didn't have that, when these chemicals are mixed with 16 other chemicals that are being emitted mostly at night from 17 our industries here, I think it's very dangerous. We do 18 have inversion here, so that's going to be very harmful if 19 there's any of the air stripping. 20 Also, since it appears that Goodyear and the 21 Environmental Protection Agency has their mind made up to go 22 ahead with this air stripping, because it is cost-effective, 23 it's not health-effective, but it's cost-effective — I 24 would hope that they would put scrubbers on, which I doubt 25 if they will because scrubbers are very expensive. DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 56

1 But I do not want to see air stripping, and 2 I think it's going to be very dangerous for us to do that. 3 Thank you. 4 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Next? Any other public 5 comments? Okay.- This is not the only opportunity. At any 6 time during the Public Comment Period, you can submit 7 comments. They will be responded to appropriately. 8 Yeah. 9 MR. MIKE BOONE: I might as well. 10 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Please. 11 MR. MIKE BOONE: I'm for cleaning up the 12 environment. 13 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Can you state your name 14 again? I'm sorry. 15 MR. MIKE BOONE: Boone, Mike Boone. And I've 16 lived in Arizona all my life, and I'm very concerned about 17 the environment. I love the outdoors. And I think that we 18, need to do all we can to clean it up and for the future and 19 for the present. 20 But I would be opposed to any type of 21 emissions put into our air unless you're certain that it 22 won't affect the people in the town of Goodyear and 23 Avondale. Other than that, I think it's a good plan, and I 24 support it. 25 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Thanks. Anyone else? DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 57

1 MR. DENNIS MYERS: F.A.A. will respond with 2 written correspondence during the allotted time. 3 MR. JEFF ROSENBLOOM: Okay. Any other comments?

4 Okay. Once again, our mail boxes are open, and I'd like to

5 thank you all for coming. That's it for the evening. Thank 6 you very much.

7 (Whereupon, the hearing terminated at 8:30

8 p.m.) 9 10 11 12

13 14

15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24

25 DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush & Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132 58

1 STATE OF ARIZONA ) 2 COUNTY OF MARICOPA) 3 BE IT KNOWN that the foregoing hearing was 4 taken before me, DONNA TERRELL, a Notary Public in and 5 for the County of Maricopa, State of Arizona; that the 6 foregoing 57 pages are a true and correct transcript of 7 all proceedings had upon the taking of the said 8 deposition, all done to the best of my skill and ability. 9 DATED at Phoenix, Arizona, this 26th day 10 of June, 1989. 11 12 13 NOTARY PUBLIC 14 My commission expires: 15 December 11, 1989 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 DONNA TERRELL, RPR, CP, CM Brush Sc Terrell Court Reporters (602) 246-2132