Place: Sun Liang studio in Shanghai Interview by Biljana Ciric Date: 2009 Length: Unknow
HISTORY OF EXHIBITIONS: SHANGHAI 1979-2006
Interview with Sun Liang
BC: You were born in Hangzhou? SL: Yes. At first it was nothing serious. The factory organized classes for us to learn some basic painting skills. I SL: Yes. My family is from the north but I never went back. never learned painting before and found I had a liking for it. My father was a military officer and my family moved to I was not sure what to learn or from whom to learn. I liked Fujian Province when I was two. We lived there for ten years Chinese painting. A classmate’s father was a Chinese painter and then came to Shanghai. so sometimes I went to his home to find some paintings to imitate. BC: When was that? BC: Did you still work in the factory then? SL: 1969. SL: I worked in daytime and painted in the evening. BC: The Cultural Revolution already started then? BC: Who were among your classmates? SL: Yes, it was in the middle of the Cultural Revolution. We lived in an air force neighborhood compound in the Pudong SL: Most of them stopped painting. A subordinate of my area. In the 70s we moved out, because I was too naughty. father once came to my home and saw me painting. He introduced me to a teacher, Meng Guang. Chen Yifei and Xia BC: You were about fifteen and in middle school, right? Baoyuan were his students. I’m very grateful to teacher Meng. My classes were not always on a regular SL: Right. I was about that age and studied at Xin Feng basisschedule. Sometimes I only took one class in two Middle School. The school was demolished later due to the months and he didn’t have objection for that. There were construction of a viaduct. I studied there for two years, and always some good sketch works on his desk, by painters like then spent a year in a hospital. In 1979 I started working as a Chen Yifei, Xia Baoyuan and Wei Jingshan. I never thought carver at a carving factory for jade. I worked there for 6 of learning western painting. Later I started to learn from years, from 1973 to 1979. After that I got the offer from Qiao Mu, a Chinese painter. Both teachers gave me great Shanghai Light Industry College and started studying there. help.
BC: Did you start your learning of painting when you were BC: From early 70s to early 80s, which teachers did you working at the factory? work with most often? Place: Sun Liang studio in Shanghai Interview by Biljana Ciric Date: 2009 Length: Unknow
SL: Through teacher Meng Guang I met Zhao Yifu, Chen SL: Mainly exercise work. Chen Yimin was our drawing Chuan, Wu Gang and Hong Jijie, who were a bit older than teacher. I became very good at drawing. It took my some me, and Ni Yan, Meng Qingguo, Wang Zheng and Ye Delin, efforts to improve my skills with color. I often painted in the who were about my age. I was very much concentrated on evening and sometimes went to other schools to audit Chinese painting. Entrance examination to college was classes. I also invited students at other schools to do some resumed in 1977. If we wanted to enter an art college, we painting together. I got to know something about modern art had to take drawing exam. In 1978 I applied for Fine Arts since then. Literature journals had a great influence on me. I College of Shanghai Normal University but failed. I learned saw some modern artworks from the covers and back covers my lesson and was determined to improve my drawing of those journals. skills. I often went to Shanghai Cultural Palace to take classes. Zhang Peichu was the teacher there. I also went to BC: When did you start your exploration in the realm of Putuo District Cultural Palace to learn. After a year’s effort painting? my skills were significantly improved. In 1979 I got the offer from Shanghai Light Industry College, majoring in design. I SL: I remembered once I bought some biochemistry test guess it’s safe to say I read a lot in school, including books paper. The mottled effect inspired me to paint something introduced from the west and art journals. expressionistic. Just lately a classmate brought me some works I created during 1981 and 1982. I also found some in BC: In your college years, who were you close to? my studio. These are quite interesting to look at.
SL: There were 30 students in my grade. I easily became the BC: Did you start your exploration of expressionism in late center of communication. Also we made friends with 70s and early 80s? students at other colleges like Shanghai Fine Arts School. SL: Back then I was still a student and the school didn’t BC: Who was studying at Shanghai Fine Arts School at the approve of such exploration. After graduation, originally I time ? should have been assigned to Shanghai Fine Arts School but the department dean at my school didn’t let me. As a result, I SL: Zhao Yifu, Chen Chuan and Hong Jijie. We also was assigned to Yimin Food Factory. I was not a good networked with Shanghai Theatre Academy and Shanghai employee there. In early 1983 my mother managed to Normal University. transfer me to teach at Shanghai College of Gardening. My job there was easy, just teaching some basic painting and BC: Are any of your college classmates still engaged in design skills. There were three art teachers. The elder one painting? didn’t paint. The other teacher was young, like me, and liked oil painting. His name was Wu Huizhong. It was at that time SL: Yes. Wang Zheng, Ni Yan, Wang Yida and Ji Jianjie. I produced my first oil painting.
BC: What did you paint during your college years? B: Which was the first exhibition you participated in? Place: Sun Liang studio in Shanghai Interview by Biljana Ciric Date: 2009 Length: Unknow
SL: It was a Shanghai College Students’ Art Exhibition at more of my works. A sense of mystery was seen in my work. Shanghai Workers’ Cultural Palace in 1981. In late 1981 and Actually my liking for mysticism could be traced back to early 1982 my school also organized some design and art that period. In 1986 we started to organize some activities. Li exhibitions on campus. From late 1983 and early 1985, I Shan, Ding Yi, Song Haidong and I did some performance stopped painting as my father was seriously ill. After 1985 I art. But most of our ideas and proposals didn’t have the participated in many exhibitions. I also did some chance to be realized. experimental exploration, redoing typical painting works of each art school in a chronological manner but a smaller BC: You got in touch with Chinese modern art scene since scale. 1986. Who were you more familiar with?
BC: When did the shift emerge in your practice and how SL: Li Shan. We lived close to each other so we often paid long did it last? each other a visit. We exchanged ideas about exhibitions and proposals and found we shared much in common. SL: From 1985 to late 1986, and early 1987 could be seen as a transitional period when I started to figure out my own BL: Just now you mentioned the inaugural exhibition of style. In mid 1987 some important works of mine, such as Shanghai Art Museum. Was it curated by Zhang Jianjun? Howl, were created. SL: Yes. He was assistant director of the museum and BC: After 1985 did you start to get in touch with many curated the exhibition. You know what was interesting about newly emerging Shanghai-based artists? this exhibition? Originally he decided not to invite senior artists. They were so furious. When the exhibition opened, SL: During 1985 and 1986 there were several important young artists were featured on the first floor, and senior exhibitions, including Shanghai Youth Art Exhibition at artists, upstairs. Shanghai Art Museum and the inaugural exhibition of Shanghai Art Museum. Both had a profound influence on B: Did you submit a proposal for selection or participate in may of us young artists. These exhibitions were like a upon invitation? gathering of previous small exhibitions and artists got the chance to present their work outside schools. Also, artists got SL: I don’t quite recall. more opportunities to communicate with each other. It was at that time I got to know Li Shan. BC: What inspired you to work on the paintings about dreams in 1986? BC: How did you two meet? SL: Actually my work always gave out a sense of dreams. SL: He wanted to find some good painters to present their Traces of dreams could be seen in my early works, even in work at the Slide Art Show in Zhuhai. As I participated in the those realistic works. I guess that’s something in my blood. Youth Art Exhibition, he saw my work and thought it was quite good. He gave me a call and went to my home to see BC: Were you presented at the Concave-Convex Exhibition
Place: Sun Liang studio in Shanghai Interview by Biljana Ciric Date: 2009 Length: Unknow
in 1986? SL: It started with speeches by representatives from different regions. Li Shan and I were representatives of Shanghai. SL: No. But I was involved in the preparation and discussed Some showed slides. Some, like Fei Dawei, introduced a bit with Song Haidong and Ding Yi about how to present the about French art. It was not very systematic. I skipped some exhibition. seminars and enjoyed some leisure time with Li Xu and Zhang Furong. BC: Did you attend any exhibitions in 1987?
SL: In 1987 there was the anti-bourgeois liberalism movement. Many exhibitions were called off. 1988 The Last Supper Shanghai Second Concave-Convex Exhibition BC: Did you attend the exhibition in the museum called Today Art Exhibition in 1988? B: Then there was the Last Supper. SL: It was curated by Wang Jingguo, a friend of mine and then assistant director of Shanghai Art Museum. Most S: Yes. The preparation and production took us quite a long established artists were presented in the exhibition, including time, at least half a year. We discussed the proposals Ding Yi, Yu Youhan, Wang Ziwei, Xu Hong, Pei Jing, Tang together. Song, Meng Luding and many others from Zhejiang Province and Beijing. The work I presented was called BC: Some participants were from Shanghai Art Museum, Suitor. Wang Jingguo was a good friend of mine, so I also right? helped with the preparation. SL: Right. Eleven I think, including Xiao Xiaolan, Wang BC: Did you attend any exhibitions outside Shanghai Jingguo, Zhang Jianjun, Song Haidong, Li Shan, Zhou between 1986 and 1988? Changjiang and Li Xianting. Before that we had proposed many exhibition concepts but each time there were many SL: I attended the Painting and Sketch Exhibition of Six problems. This time, with the venue provided by the art Provinces and One Municipality of Eastern China. It was an museum and the funding we raised, the exhibition was made official exhibition. possible. The exhibition structure was quite loose. We wanted to involve some art critics. So we invited Wu Liang. BC: Did you attend any important meetings during this We wanted to draw people’s attention to art. period? BC: After that you attended the China Avant-Garde SL: I attended the Yellow Mountain Meeting in 1988 with Li Exhibition in Beijing. What did you present there? Shan, Zhang Furong, Li Xu and Xu Hong. SL: An installation called Daily Myth. Originally I wanted to BC: How did the meeting go? bring Last Supper, but the idea was rejected. So Pei Jing,
Place: Sun Liang studio in Shanghai Interview by Biljana Ciric Date: 2009 Length: Unknow
Zhang Furong and I did some improvisational work: a wood BC: Was there a foreword? ladder painted in red was glued with many hairs, mental wire and silk stockings. It could be seen as an installation about SL: I don’t think so. The overall atmosphere was not quite sex. liberal so we wanted to keep it low key, making it into a communication among insiders. Now that I look back, I feel BC: Let’s talk about the Garage Show. it was a pure exhibition. That was a goal we wanted to achieve for the Shanghai art scene after 1989.
BC: Were you still at Shanghai College of Gardening? 1991 Garage Show SL: No. I started to work at Fine Arts College of Shanghai University in 1986.
SL: Song Haidong, Hu Jianping, Zhang Peili, Geng Jianyi, BC: How many years did you work there? Nie Haifeng, He Yang, A Da, Yang Xu, Zhou Tiehai and I discussed about the concept and structure of the exhibition SL: I worked there for 14 years, from 1986 to 2000. together. BC: In 1993 you attended the Venice Biennale, right? BC: Who was the main organizer? SL: Before the Venice Biennale, there was a very important SL: Song Haidong. exhibition, Encountering the Others – K18 International Art Exhibition in Kassel. Shanghai-based artists such as Li Shan, BC: What kind of exhibition did you want to present? Qiu Deshu and I, Beijing-based artists like Lu Shengzhong and some Taiwan-based artists were invited to participate. It SL: There were few good modern art exhibitions back then. was held in 1992 and could be seen as the first time Chinese We wanted to present an exhibition featuring pure and artist were presented in western exhibitions as a group. genuine art. BC: Who organized the event? BL: What did you present? SL: It was an interesting story. I think the curator was from SL: I made five pieces of expressionistic oil paintings, India. Originally he intended to go to Taiwan but for some including and . reason didn’t make it. He came to Shanghai instead to meet with Shanghai-based modern artists. After several meetings BC: How long did the exhibition last? he selected some of our works.
SL: A couple of days. BC: Any other exhibitions?
Place: Sun Liang studio in Shanghai Interview by Biljana Ciric Date: 2009 Length: Unknow
SL: In 1989 I participated in an exhibition in a gallery in some painters started to think about individuality and worked Tokyo. Many works Ullens collected were created during harder on that. That’s my view of the art scene back then. that period. BC: Were you presented at the 1st Shanghai Biennale?
SL: I was involved in the preparation for the 1st Biennale in 1993 Venice Biennale 1996. But my proposal was rejected before the biennale opened.
BC: Why was that? BC: Achille Bonito Oliva came to China in 1992? SL: I suggested that the biennale should pay more attention SL: Yes, Francesca Dal Lago brought him here. Three of my to artists and art of Shanghai. But I felt that it focused too works were presented at the Venice Biennale. But they were much on celebrity effect and official feedback instead of the lost during their way back. I was very upset about that. development of art. It was kind of made into a tourist site. Moreover, I felt that Chinese artists tried too hard to cater to Due to the disagreement, I was not presented in the biennale. the west and relied too much on western standards to judge their own work. An artist should always be himself first. BC: Did you participate in the exhibition curated by Zhu Qi? There’s no need to regard western standards as the universal golden rule. During an interview by Reuters, I was asked if I SL: No. It featured artists emerging in the 1990s and most of felt honored to be presented at the exhibition. I said that them were engaged in installation art. I held a highly critical before the exhibition I was already painting very well. It was attitude towards Chinese art. I thought it catered to the west, not my presence at the exhibition that made my painting didn’t have its own feature and paid little attention to the good. Perhaps, I was a bit too cynical. In 1993 The First Asia discussion of art itself. During that period, abstraction played Pacific Triennial of Contemporary Art was presented at a prominent role in my work. No specific shape was to be Queensland Art Gallery and several Shanghai-based artists perceived. Some people might ask if it would turn to including myself participated. The triennial is still presented minimalism. I thought it was highly possible but I would on a regular basis now. I also participated in the Chinese choose the right timing to stop. I believe art should be Modern Art Exhibition, a collection show, presented in Hong flexible and shouldn’t be stretched to the extreme. That’s Kong in 1994 and Grand Modern Ink Art Exhibition in why after 1996 I went back to my previous style, quite like Taiwan. After coming back from Italy, I actually held a what you would see now. I wanted to delineate with as much critical view about Chinese contemporary art. I thought delicacy and refinement as possible. I wanted to show in my Chinese art took too much effort to please the west and to painting my vision of aesthetics. I held on to my practice for attract attention from the west for political purposes. New many years and wanted to achieve the ideal aesthetics in my trends started to be seen in the Shanghai art scene in 1990s. mind. At my age back then, I thought it’s important for art to Installation art emerged. More diverse artistic practice was go wild and even weird, to show the greatest power of encouraged. Young artists came to the fore. In the meantime, imagination. That’s what I wanted to achieve.
Place: Sun Liang studio in Shanghai Interview by Biljana Ciric Date: 2009 Length: Unknow
BC: Did you ever do some self-portrait or works about yourself?
SL: Yes, I did some, but not many, when I was young. Those were all exercise works. But my paintings contained my personal emotions.
© Full version of this interview was published in the book Abridged Version , edited by Biljana Ciric and published by Shanghai People’s Fine Arts Publishing House 2010.