THE SECOND MEETING OF THE SECOND SESSION OF THE TWELFTH PARLIAMENT THURSDAY 11 FEBRUARY 2021

ENGLISH VERSION HANSARD NO: 201 THE NATIONAL ASSEMBLY SPEAKER The Hon. Phandu T. C. Skelemani PH, MP. DEPUTY SPEAKER The Hon. Mabuse M. Pule, MP. (Mochudi East)

Clerk of the National Assembly - Ms B. N. Dithapo Deputy Clerk of the National Assembly - Mr L. T. Gaolaolwe Learned Parliamentary Counsel - Ms M. Mokgosi Assistant Clerk (E) - Mr R. Josiah CABINET His Excellency Dr M. E. K. Masisi, MP. - President

His Honour S. Tsogwane, MP. (Boteti West) - Vice President Minister for Presidential Affairs, Governance and Public Hon. K. N. S. Morwaeng, MP. (Molepolole South) - Administration

Hon. K. T. Mmusi, MP. (Gabane-Mmankgodi) - Minister of Defence, Justice and Security Hon. Dr L. Kwape, MP. (Kanye South) - Minister of International Affairs and Cooperation Hon. E. M. Molale, MP. (Goodhope-Mabule ) - Minister of Local Government and Rural Development Hon. K. S. Gare, MP. (Moshupa-Manyana) - Minister of Agricultural Development and Food Security Minister of Environment, Natural Resources Conservation Hon. P. K. Kereng, MP. (Specially Elected) - and Tourism Hon. Dr E. G. Dikoloti MP. (Mmathethe-Molapowabojang) - Minister of Health and Wellness Hon. T.M. Segokgo, MP. (Tlokweng) - Minister of Transport and Communications Hon. K. Mzwinila, MP. (Specially Elected) - Minister of Land Management, Water and Sanitation Services Minister of Youth Empowerment, Sport and Culture Hon. T. M. Rakgare, MP. (Mogoditshane) - Development

Hon. A. M. Mokgethi, MP. (Gaborone Bonnington North) - Minister of Nationality, Immigration and Gender Affairs Hon. Dr T. Matsheka, MP. (Lobatse) - Minister of Finance and Economic Development Hon. F. M. M. Molao, MP. (Shashe West) - Minister of Basic Education Minister of Tertiary Education, Research, Science and Hon. Dr D. Letsholathebe, MP. (Tati East) - Technology Minister of Mineral Resources, Green Technology and Hon. L. M. Moagi, MP. (Ramotswa) - Energy Security

Hon. P. O. Serame, MP. (Specially Elected) - Minister of Investment, Trade and Industry Minister of Employment, Labour Productivity and Skills Hon. M. Balopi, MP. (Gaborone North) - Development

Hon. M. Kgafela, MP. (Mochudi West) - Minister of Infrastructure and Housing Development

Assistant Minister, Presidential Affairs, Governance and Hon. D. M. Mthimkhulu, MP. (Gaborone South) - Public Administration Assistant Minister, Local Government and Rural Hon. K. K. Autlwetse, MP. (Specially Elected) - Development Assistant Minister, Local Government and Rural Hon. S. N. Modukanele, MP. (Lerala -Maunatlala) - Development Assistant Minister, Agricultural Development and Food Hon. B. Manake, MP. (Specially Elected) - Security

Hon. S. Lelatisitswe, MP. (Boteti East) - Assistant Minister, Health and Wellness

Hon. N. W. T. Makwinja, MP. (Lentsweletau-Mmopane) - Assistant Minister, Basic Education

Hon. M. S. Molebatsi, MP. (Mmadinare) - Assistant Minister, Investment, Trade and Industry Assistant Minister, Youth Empowerment, Sport and Culture Hon. H. B. Billy, MP. (Francistown East) - Development Hon. M. R. Shamukuni, MP. (Chobe) - Assistant Minister,Tertiary Education, Research, Science and Technology MEMBERS OF PARLIAMENT AND THEIR CONSTITUENCIES

Names Constituency

RULING PARTY (Botswana Democratic Party) Hon. L. Kablay, MP. (Government Whip) Letlhakeng-Lephephe Hon. Dr U. Dow, MP. Specially Elected Hon. P. Majaga, MP. Nata-Gweta Hon. J. S. Brooks, MP. Kgalagadi South Hon. C. Greeff, MP. Gaborone Bonnington South Hon. T. Letsholo, MP. Kanye North Hon. T. F. Leuwe, MP. Takatokwane Hon. T. Mangwegape-Healy, MP. Gaborone Central Hon. S. N. Moabi, MP. Tati West Hon. T. Monnakgotla, MP. Kgalagadi North Hon. P. K. Motaosane, MP. Thamaga-Kumakwane Hon. O. Regoeng, MP. Molepolole North Hon. J. L. Thiite, MP. Ghanzi North Hon. P. P. P. Moatlhodi, MP. Tonota Hon. A. Lesaso, MP. Shoshong OPPOSITION (Umbrella for Democratic Change) Hon. D. Saleshando, MP. (Leader of the Opposition) Maun West Hon. M. G. J. Motsamai, MP. (Opposition Whip) Ghanzi South Hon. D. L. Keorapetse, MP. Selebi Phikwe West Hon. Y. Boko, MP. Mahalapye East Hon. Dr K. Gobotswang, MP. Sefhare-Ramokgonami Hon. C. K. Hikuama, MP. Ngami Hon. K. K. Kapinga, MP Okavango Hon. G. Kekgonegile, MP. Maun East Hon. T. B. Lucas, MP. Bobonong Hon. K. Nkawana, MP. Selebi Phikwe East Hon. O. Ramogapi, MP. Palapye Hon. Dr N. Tshabang, MP. Nkange Hon. D. Tshere, MP. Mahalapye West Hon. M. I. Moswaane, MP. Francistown West (Botswana Patriotic Front) Hon. T. S. Khama, MP. Serowe West Hon. L. Lesedi, MP. Serowe South Hon. B. Mathoothe, MP. Serowe North Hon. M. Reatile, MP. Jwaneng-Mabutsane (Alliance for Progressives) Hon. W. B. Mmolotsi, MP. Francistown South TABLE OF CONTENTS THE SECOND MEETING OF THE SECOND SESSION OF THE TWELFTH PARLIAMENT THURSDAY 11 FEBRUARY, 2021

CONTENTS PAGE (S)

LEADER OF THE HOUSE’S QUESTION TIME...... 1-10

QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER...... 11-18

TABLING OF PAPER Botswana Geoscience Institute Annual Report, 2020...... 19 STATEMENT Status of the Total Estimated Cost of the National Development Plan (NDP) 11...... 19-24

Appropriation (2021/2022) Bill, 2021 (No. 2 of 2021) Second Reading (Resumed Debate)...... 25-55

iv Hansard No 201 Thursday 11th February, 2021 LEADER OF THE HOUSE’S QUESTION TIME

Thursday 11th February, 2021 Honour, is it right to refurbish Office of the President during these trying times where people are losing jobs, THE ASSEMBLY met at 11:00 a.m. where we are telling Batswana that we have shortage of (THE SPEAKER in the Chair) funds to an extent that we want to increase levies? These are the points that I want the Vice President to address. P R A Y E R S Thank you.

* * * * MR SPEAKER: Honourable Leader of the House.

MR SPEAKER (MR SKELEMANI): Order! Order! … Silence… Honourable Members, good morning. May we start our business of today with the Leader of the House’s MR SPEAKER: The Leader of the House! question. … Silence …

LEADER OF THE HOUSE’S QUESTION MR SPEAKER: Honourable Member, can you unmute TIME yourself?

THEME: PURCHASE OF ARMOURED … Silence… VEHICLES MR SPEAKER: Vice President (VP), can you unmute To ask His Honour the Vice President to confirm if yourself? indeed His Excellency the President issued a Directive for the purchase of five armoured vehicles for his use as …Silence… reported in the media and if so, to state: MR SPEAKER: Nothing is happening. (i) whether the vehicles had been budgeted for; … Silence… (ii) the department or ministry accounts that were utilised for the procurement as well as the agents MR SPEAKER: VP, you are supposed to press the if any, that were used for the procurement; button on your side. Press the button on your side.

(iii) how much was paid to the agents and the total …Silence… costs associated with the transaction; and MR SPEAKER: VP, they are going to send a signal (iv) if there are plans to refurbish the Office of the which will appear on your screen and you click on President for P42 million as also reported by the that icon which they are going to send. Click on that, media. something is going to pop up on your screen, click on it.

MR D. SALESHANDO (MAUN WEST): Thank …Silence… you Mr Speaker. I have a question that I have directed LEADER OF THE HOUSE (MR TSOGWANE): to His Honour the Vice President. What I want to do Thank you Mr Speaker. today is to address headlines that we came across in some newspapers, headlines which indicated that the MR SPEAKER: Thank you VP. President issued a directive for the purchase of five MR TSOGWANE: Mr Speaker, can you hear me? armoured vehicles, to strengthen his security. I want His Honour the Vice President to tell us if the President MR SPEAKER: I can hear you Honourable VP. issued that directive and if so, I want him to tell us what triggered that decision during trying times where there MR TSOGWANE: I think a strong message must are shortage of funds in the economy. Why did they not be sent to the people who are muting us that side Mr follow the procedure of informing Parliament when Speaker. Even the most idiotic person cannot unmute they required those funds? themselves when the thing is locked. This thing is locked from that side. So, can you send a strong message to It is reported that P42 million is going to be used to those people who are locking us. As soon as Parliament refurbish Office of the President. If at all this is true His sits, they must unlock us. You keep on saying unmute,

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press this button, this thing we are used to it. They are as you are aware, it is an old building. I must muted, they tell you and they communicate. They tell emphasise Mr Speaker that at the time of project you that you cannot unmute yourself. Thank you Mr conceptualisation, this was actually a priority. I Speaker. thank you Mr Speaker.

MR SPEAKER: Okay VP, continue. As I said, an upgrade version in Setswana would help those who are listening from home. Just briefly if you MR TSOGWANE: Thank you Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker, allow Mr Speaker. the question before me is written in English. So since the person who asked the question presented it in Setswana, …Silence… I will first answer it in English. I will summarise it in Setswana so that Batswana can understand it. HONOURABLE MEMBER: Mr Speaker, I do not think others can hear him but I cannot hear anything. Let me just start with the question, it is not long Mr Speaker. I appreciate it because it will explain a lot of MR SPEAKER: Honourable Member, you are not out things. of the rule…

(i) Mr Speaker, media reports, if any, suggesting that MR TSOGWANE: Am I audible? His Excellency the President issued a Directive MR SPEAKER: Yes, I hear you. for the purchase of five armoured vehicles are wrong, misleading and malicious. HONOURABLE MEMBER: Mr Speaker, we cannot hear him. (ii) Mr Speaker, the said vehicles were purchased by the Directorate of Intelligence and Security (DIS) MR TSOGWANE: No, why is it that only Opposition in fulfilment of its established mandate to provide cannot hear me? protective security services to His Excellency HONOURABLE MEMBER: We can hear him. the President, His Honour the Vice President, visiting Heads of State and other Very Important MR TSOGWANE: Why is it that only Opposition Persons (VIPs). The procurement of the vehicles cannot hear me when I want to speak in Setswana? When had nothing to do with COVID-19 as the tender I speak English, ‘the learned Opposition members’ hear was awarded before the pandemic outbreak on 20th me and when I speak Setswana they cannot hear me. September, 2019 by Public Procurement and Asset HONOURABLE MEMBER: We can hear you. Disposal Board (PPADB). MR TSOGWANE: No, ‘the learned Opposition (iii) Mr Speaker; it should be noted that the vehicles in members’ cannot hear me. Honourable Saleshando, do question were purchased by the Directorate from its you hear me? budget at a total cost of USD 1,015,533.28 having followed PPADB procurement requirements. MR SALESHANDO: I hear you Honourable Member, Finally Mr Speaker, the Directorate’s preferred I am sorry, I did not know it was I you were referring to method of procurement is to deal directly with as learned Opposition member.’ service providers and not middlemen; and as such, saving costs. MR TSOGWANE: I was referring to Boko sir, not you. Thank you. (iv) Mr Speaker, the proposal to refurbish the Office of the President (OP) building is not new, it was In short, if those reports were there in newspapers, they actually decided in 2019. However, the actual are false. Secondly, the said vehicles were purchased works started on the 21st February 2020 before by the DIS in fulfilment of its established mandate to we even had one case of COVID-19, with the provide protective security services to His Excellency initial completion date set for July 2020. This the President. Since they have been purchased in refurbishment project is at an estimated cost of Dollars, maybe translating that into Pula will affect the P43 million, and it is basically intended to deal exchange rates. In Dollars, it is USD 1, 015, 533.28. I with the structural defects, old fittings for which also pointed out that the Office of the President has been replacement parts are no longer easy to get, refurbished for P43 million.

2 Hansard No 201 Thursday 11th February, 2021 LEADER OF THE HOUSE’S QUESTION TIME

These projects were made before the outbreak of MR RAMOGAPI: Thank you Mr Speaker. My COVID-19. By that time it was befitting because that question to the Minister is, does he know that when he building is old and its fittings are no longer available says they were hoping… in the market. That is why that refurbishment was MR SPEAKER: Order! Which Minister are you necessary. That is my statement in brief. Thank you. asking?

MR SALESHANDO: Thank you Mr Speaker. I am MR RAMOGAPI: I cannot hear you. also thankful for His Honour’s response. I want to put MR SPEAKER: Which Minister are you asking? it to him that although the decision was made before Corona, they made these decisions at a time where there MR RAMOGAPI: Pardon? was budget deficit. Is their message to the nation saying, MR SPEAKER: Which Minister are you asking? although there was budget deficit, they saw it fit to spend over P12 million on the President and Vice President’s MR RAMOGAPI: Am I not audible that side? vehicles? What threatened them to buy armoured car? MR SPEAKER: I can hear you. That is why I am Secondly, even the funds spent at OP, they made a asking, which Minister are you asking? decision to refurbish the office even with budget deficits. MR RAMOGAPI: Oh! Sorry, thank you Mr Speaker. Are they satisfied that it is value for money when they Are we still on Honourable Tsogwane’s statement? use P43 million to refurbish Office of the President and more than P12 million to purchase vehicles at this time MR SPEAKER: Yes sir. when we have a deficit? Thank you. MR RAMOGAPI: Alright, my question to His Honour MR TSOGWANE: Thank you Mr Speaker. Like I said, the Vice President is, as he is saying the financial I answered the question the way it was asked and deficit situation was better, is he aware that for the past five has always been there, it just depends on that when we years we have never had budget surplus? We had budget have projects, we would know that we will generate deficit. income from diamonds and other income generating sources. The second question is, why did they not see it fit to build our projects in villages like the hospital in Palapye Sometimes at the start of a budget, we may have a deficit rather than deciding to carry on with these projects? and at the end of a financial year that deficit would be cleared by the availability of funds. So the financial Lastly; let me remind him that the Former President Mr projection by then did not show or project the situation Mogae once refused to get a new vehicle, he decided we are in right now. to continue using the old one instead. The Former President Khama also refused to get a new vehicle Moreover, we must know that when we talk about the but decided to continue to use the old one on the basis protection of the President, we are talking about the that our economy was not stable. Moreover, this office security, stability and the peace of a country. We can see was occupied by Former President Khama. They could what is happening in other countries. Just recently after have saved money because we are greatly challenged elections, there were uproars and concerns that elections financially. Thank you Honourable Speaker. were rigged. These talks were threatening the peace and even the President’s security was compromised. We have MR TSOGWANE: Mr Speaker, you should have also witnessed this happening in America which is the allowed the Honourable Member to ask the Minister. He oldest country when it comes to democracy. Therefore, knows that we have a Minister who is responsible for we cannot take the security of the President lightly. I these questions. He was trying to remind Honourable have also told you that the office is old and its fittings Saleshando that we actually have a Minister who are no longer available in the market. Therefore, it was is responsible for financial issues and the one from befitting that we do those things. We do not dispute the Office of the President. He was not wrong. Thank you issue of deficit but the projections were there because Honourable Ramogapi for reminding us that, we have the situation was different from our current one. Thank to direct these questions to the relevant Minister so that you Mr Speaker. they can address these supplementaries accordingly.

Hansard No 201 3 Thursday 11th February, 2021 LEADER OF THE HOUSE’S QUESTION TIME

Moving on to the questions that he asked; we agree not allowed here but focus on supplementary questions that we have had budget deficits, that we do not have instead. If he asks supplementary questions which are pending projects. We are also saying, the security of not in line with how Honourable Saleshando phrased the both the President and the country is very important. question, I will address them and it will appear like I am This means that even though we have had some budget out of order, even though I will be addressing questions deficits, we were not having a similar situation to what form the Honourable Members. Thank you. we are dealing with today. Right now, we were told that we spent some of the money that we have in our DR GOBOTSWANG: Thank you Mr Speaker. reserves. It was possible to spend the money that we Honourable Vice President, President Khama occupied have in our reserves as well as get loans during that the State House, I believe it was renovated with an time. When things were difficult, we also implemented amount worth P17 million. Thereafter, before President some of our projects through getting some loans. The Masisi occupied the State House, it was renovated with situation was suitable and allowed us to get a loan. The an amount worth P10 million. You are now telling us situation we had then was not similar to what we are that it is going to be renovated with an amount of P43 dealing with today; we cannot compare it to the project million. Honourable members, you have renovated the where we have to buy a vehicle. I do not think the cost State House with an amount of P17 million, then P10 of that vehicle was enough to build the hospitals which million, and you are now saying P43 million, how far we do not have across Botswana. I really do not believe are you going to keep renovating it? If it is dilapidated, that. If we need a hospital, we consider how we have why do we not build a new one instead of renovating it? arranged our projects and get a loan to build it if the Honourable, how much do you think building a new one situation was not like this. I am saying this because even is going to cost? though we were financially challenged, we have been getting loans to implement other projects. So clearly, Secondly, you usually allude that the life of President we are comparing two things which are very different. Masisi is in danger. Vice President, can you confirm this He mentioned that the Former President Mr Mogae issue? I am saying this because no one has ever appeared refused to get a new vehicle. So I do not know which before the courts on the basis that they threatened the vehicle he is referring to nor the model. I do not know life of the President? Thank you. whether it was an armoured car or his personal vehicle. He also mentioned that the Former President, Mr Khama MR TSOGWANE: Thank you Mr Speaker. I believe all also refused a new vehicle. I do not know when that the Honourable Members, how many are we 67, right? happened. There is only one Member of Parliament (MP) who does not know what the question is all about. There is only one Let me remind members of Opposition that they were MP in this House who does not know what this question the first to say the Former President Mr Khama was the is asked in relation to and that is Dr Gobotswang; the most expensive Vice President this country ever had. Vice President of the Botswana Congress Party (BCP). They used to report cases at the office of Ombudsman Sir, go and discuss it with Honourable Saleshando, on the basis that Mr Khama was using flying machines ask him what we are talking about. We are not talking which belong to the Botswana Defence Force (BDF). about the State House but renovation of Office of the They pointed out that a certain caravan was purchased President. There is a difference between an office and for Mr Khama at that time. They fought to a point where an accommodation facility. I will not respond to that one President Khama… because it might disturb our debate. So before asking questions…these questions are listed on the Order Paper HONOURABLE MEMBER: On a point of order Mr and the Honourable Members have Order Papers. If you Speaker. can read the Order Paper, the yellow one, even the green MR TSOGWANE: …is the most expensive Vice one which is the Notice Paper, it is there. It is given to President or President that we have ever had. When saying Members of Parliament many days before the question is these things, Honourable Ramogapi must understand asked. So I am wondering why the Member of Parliament that there is a history, and some of us are old enough for Sefhare-Ramokgonami is confused. We will have in this Parliament to know what has been happening in to find a way of addressing virtual meeting because it the past. So he is new here and does not know what has is greatly confusing the Honourable Members. In that been happening. He must stop raising issues which are manner, I will not respond to that question sir, because

4 Hansard No 201 Thursday 11th February, 2021 LEADER OF THE HOUSE’S QUESTION TIME

I am not talking about the State House Mr Speaker. The Francistown South is popular for and it is his trademark nation out there is aware that we are not talking about to say unnecessary things when serious issues are the State House but Office of the President. being discussed. So Batswana should be aware of this behaviour and know that they did not make a good You also asked me to confirm whether the life of the choice. Honourable Members, I do not want to respond President is in danger. We are not talking about what to that one, I said at the time it was a priority and the the newspapers are saying concerning this issue. If you procurement of those vehicles will not halt service are worried about that, bring a question concerning that delivery to Batswana or implementation of any project. or do you think the question that we are addressing is I even indicated that this was planned before the current not important? If so, keep quiet instead of bringing new situation we are in, so we have to acknowledge that. We issues which are not part of our current debate. I thank know that back then people were promising people a you Mr Speaker. lot of money and I wonder if they can deliver on their promises to pay P3 000 old age pension. These are MR MMOLOTSI: Thank you Mr Speaker. VP, looking the things we should inform ourselves as to why they at the state of the economy of Botswana in relation to happen. It is not wrong to have implemented such a the fact that we purchased vehicles which are worth P12 plan Mr Speaker. If there are any more questions, I will million for one person, the President and the renovation allow them but they should be related to the topic … of P43 million, in a situation where the rate of youth (Inaudible)… unemployment is high, where we do not increase old age pension and where we are dealing with the pandemic, MR MANGWEGAPE-HEALY: Thank you very does the VP think it is justifiable to improve living much Mr Speaker and good morning. Your Honour conditions of the President at the expense of many Vice President, we thank you for your update because lives of Batswana, those who are living in excruciating there has been a lot of confusion, the allegations were poverty? Are we saying that as a country, we made a that P70 million was spent and there were agents paid good decision since we spent more than P50 million on for this exercise. So we thank you Your Honour for one person, the President, and in one year? I am referring clarifying these allegations. Your Honour, as you have to a person who swore that he is going to be a servant of given the background, please note that we recently held the people? Does the VP think this decision will move elections which were surrounded by a lot of allegations our county forward? and petitions, so there was a lot of insecurity. We have seen on social media that those vehicles are at Walvis In conclusion, do you think these vehicles are worth Bay Port and they were recorded while on the flatbeds. it because you may still use them in future when the There is another video circulating from Dubai and the President retires? allegations are that these are the vehicles we are referring MR TSOGWANE: The security of the President is the to now. I now want to know that are we satisfied with the responsibility of the DIS. kind of contractors we engage looking at how sensitive these issues are, looking at the security aspects of it? This is an intelligence security matter, it is not a Are we vetting properly the companies awarded these food security issue or social security matter, it is an tenders so that they do not publish such high security intelligence security issue. So you cannot understand a things? The moment they start publicising the features lot of aspects. We cannot understand DIS that through of the vehicles, is that not in a way compromising their special knowledge about security, why that was the security we are trying to achieve as they are now a priority for them. It was their mandate. I said at the publicised. Finally, if some members had not walked out beginning of my statement that the allegations that the of the Committee of Intelligence Vice President, they President is the one who issued a directive to procure could have gotten an update on that forum and be able to those vehicles are false. It was DIS who fulfilled their understand. Thank you. mandate to provide security services for the President, thus the need to procure such vehicles. We can also see MR TSOGWANE: Thank you Honourable Member of the current situation, as I indicated that the country is Parliament for Gaborone Central. Social media concept unstable. He asked if I will be using these vehicles, I is done by people, it is just like a movie, one shows do not understand what he means by that? So those are whatever he/she wants to show, it does not mean that is just political remarks that the Member of Parliament for the reality. So we do not take that as the truth. I should

Hansard No 201 5 Thursday 11th February, 2021 LEADER OF THE HOUSE’S QUESTION TIME

assure you that as I mentioned in my response, the go and read Standing Order 40 (b). It allows for him to Directorate preferred method of procurement to procure be asked questions. Every time he is asked a question… directly with service providers and not middlemen. I heard him answering Honourable Ramogapi in passing So those people are just claiming, no middleman was saying they could have gone somewhere else. I promised engaged. It was procured directly from the service him in the past that I will keep on asking him questions provider. So those are just pictures by people who have until he admits that it is his responsibility to answer. an agenda just like you see them alluding a different figure. Since we do not dictate what one reports, our Two questions that I want the Vice President (VP) to hands are tied. The only thing we can do is to give the answer; he said these cars were bought because there nation an update about the facts so that they do not was a concern about the President’s safety after 2019 believe these allegations on social media which are elections, looking at the petitions. He says the tender false. So that is the case, even the members you were to buy these cars was awarded in September 2019. Is advising that they should be part of DIS oversight; you the Vice President saying they have been advised before should continue to enlighten them so that they can ask the elections that there was going to be issues after the directly at that forum. Thank you. elections, and they bought cars to protect themselves because they were afraid that after the elections there MR KEKGONEGILE: Thank you Mr Speaker. Mr was going to be issues of petitions? Is that what he Speaker, His Honour the Vice President mentioned wants us to believe right now? Secondly, earlier on he that close to P11/12 million was spent towards the was talking about the most expensive Vice President. I procurement of these vehicles. One can wonder if want to ask him that according to his knowledge since he says he also wants to travel in an armoured car, this amount is the procurement of vehicles only or is apart from him, which other Vice President has ever inclusive of transportation costs, if it is not inclusive been bought an armoured vehicle? What is it that is how much is the transportation cost? Sometimes, an threatening him, which makes him think that his life is airplane or containers can be used to transport them, so under threat? What is it that you see that is threatening which mode was used, was it the cheapest? The second your life? Thank you. question, you mentioned that DIS was engaged a lot for (VIP) Protection Units. So the question is, are VIP MR TSOGWANE: When you answer a question Protection Units under DIS or the Botswana Defence Honourable Members you answer it in what in English Force? Why is it under DIS, when are you intending is called “in the context.” It does not mean that when to make it an independent unit if it is under DIS given I have indicated other examples they are the ones that DIS has its own special high security issues? Do which caused that. I was giving an example that when you not think you are involving VIP Protection Unit in we talk about the President’s safety, we are looking at complicated issues surrounding DIS? different factors. I was not necessarily saying they were bought because we knew this is how it was going to MR TSOGWANE: Thank you Honourable Member of be after the elections. That was not the answer. I read Parliament for Maun East, I do not want to dwell on the answer and those were supplementaries. So, stick VIP Protection Unit issues as I indicated that I want to to my text which I have read to you because this one of focus on the question. Perhaps we can bring in a better supplementaries is “Maokaneng” (by the way/extras). explanation next time regarding VIP Protection Unit. You then take what I am saying here and there and at the We know that the President’s security does not only end of the day you want to say this is what we said. The involve…(Inaudible)…DIS, it involves all different answer I have given you is the one I have written down forces. Like I am saying, that is a question that needs which is detailed. You must stick to it, the way you more research or information on it. So you asked another have asked the questions. Also supplementaries have question of whether the amount includes transportation; nothing to do with the Standing Order. Supplementary I think that is the question you asked. The budget as it is just asking, and adding onto what you have asked. stands, they only mentioned the budget at a total of that It is not that it orders that it necessarily has to be there amount, my belief is that it is inclusive of all other costs. as supplementaries. The question is the one you have Thank you Honourable Member. asked. That is the one I am supposed to answer. The MR SALESHANDO: Thank you Mr Speaker. I have supplementary is just by the way. Supplementary is two questions, and I want to advise the Vice President to similar to someone saying, “I did not hear you, can you

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explain here because I did not hear you properly.” That President’s security is important at all times; whether is the purpose of a supplementary. That is why it is not there are elections or what. This is what I am saying. If I necessary to bring a supplementary as a new question. were to give an example, should I go and boil the ocean If it comes as a new question, the Minister or anyone to give the example? I should not. who is answering should indicate that is a new question, and it is not a supplementary. I answered the question MR SALESHANDO: Is it that we should now take it the way it is. that he has failed Mr Speaker? He does not intend to answer. There is the other one of the Standing Order. I was advising Honourable Ramogapi, I agree with him. I am HONOURABLE MEMBER: No, he has answered. even the first person in your first question to say I want those questions of yours to come in more numbers. I am MR REATILE: Thank you Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker, happy to answer you and it gives me an opportunity to let me thank you and the Vice President for the answers tell the people the truth, not the rhetoric that we always he is providing and the Leader of the Opposition for hear every day. I like these questions, they help me to asking a question so that Batswana can know what is tell the truth. If you bring what you have heard from the happening in our country. Your Honour, the way these newspapers without any truth and ask about that, I will vehicles were bought, do you not realise that it is what answer so that Batswana can know the truth, not what is causing concern for Batswana because you know, was written by a newspaper which is not the truth. I do you are one of the oldest people in Botswana and in not have any problem with your questions Mr Leader of Parliament, that even at the time when the OK1 was the Opposition (LOO). You can bring as many questions bought, it is an issue that was discussed by Parliament as you want. I thank you. whether it was okay or not based on the reasons that The other one you were talking about armoured cars. were given? So why is it that buying a vehicle for the It was never said the Vice President is going to use an President is kept a secret Your Honour because this armoured car. There is nowhere I am using an armoured issue was supposed to be discussed and then Members car. I was giving an example that these security things of Parliament were supposed to agree that it is necessary are bought knowing that even the future Presidents need to do so? to have those things. All the security for President, Vice President and Very Important Persons (VIPs) lies with We are not Americans, but right now we know the the Directorate of Intelligence and Security (DIS) to see security features that President Joe Biden’s car has. how they protect them. That does not necessarily mean I We know that his blood groups have been incorporated have been bought armoured cars. There are no armoured into the car. Why is it that issues that concern us are so cars for VP among them. I thank you. secretive Mr Speaker? Do you not think that is what has begun the concern because we know about the budget LEADER OF THE OPPOSITION (MR of DIS vehicles because when we take the Annual SALESHANDO): Point of order Mr Speaker. The Vice Statement of Accounts (ASA), you will see that in the President says a supplementary is a ‘by the way,’ it does past financial year which ended in March 2019, they not need to be answered. When I asked him what the budgeted P5, 374,118.00? Those are the cars they have concerns for security were, he gave only one reason. bought saying these are “DIS vehicles.” So these ones He said their main concerns for security is that after the for the President, where can we see that where it is stated results of the 2019 elections there were petitions. He that these are “the Presidential vehicles,” so that we can gave one reason that they are concerned about the life of know that indeed this budget of P12 million that we are the President. My question is that since the tender was told about was spent there? Thank you Mr Speaker. awarded in September 2019, did they already know that there was going to be petitions? If he is saying that is not MR TSOGWANE: Thank you Mr Speaker. It is the reason, can he please tell us what has changed that important and befitting the way you are asking sir. has concerned them about the President’s life for them What is important as I and you are both veteran MPs to want to buy five armoured vehicles that are used by is to know that we discussed these things at the DIS one person? Thank you. oversight forum without getting into their operations, we discussed things like these and we were able to be MR TSOGWANE: I think I have answered that one briefed properly by the Director of DIS. We have an that the President’s security is not situational. The oversight committee, they should be briefed about an

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issue like this one so that they can understand it, as they Mr Speaker, the second one is that you explained to us are our eyes and ears. If DIS has a budget for vehicles, the procedure of raising hands; that we lift our hands and then there is another budget in which they need to and once the question has been answered, we drop them. buy something for the President or Vice President, it We are trying to drop them down, those of us who are becomes part of that budget. It does not come isolated, complying, and it seems this procedure is not putting saying this item is for so and so, and this one is for so and us at an advantage because when the question is being so, it becomes a plan for their fleet as the DIS because answered we put our hands down, when we try to raise even though these are Presidential vehicles, they belong our hands there would be those who would have long to the DIS. So, that we should understand. Thank you. raised their hands before us. I am not sure if you are paying close attention to this issue, how are things MR MOTSAMAI: I thank you Mr Speaker. First and going? I thank you. foremost, let me just inform Honourable Saleshando that there is no single answer we are going to get here. Let MR SPEAKER: I will pay close attention to it because me continue to say Mr Speaker, Honourable Ramogapi the Members are not supposed to remain on screen, and asked how many clinics could be built with those funds it appears as if they raised their hands first. that were used to purchase these vehicles? Mr Speaker, As for the answers that are given by the Leader of what I would like to highlight is that the lives which are the House, there is no answer that can be deemed as being lost are not the same as the luxury vehicles which unserious. I understood him to say some questions are are being bought. People are dying in our constituencies not in line with the Standing Orders, and that some because there are no health amenities, so this is not an of them would have already been answered; hence issue that could be just watered down. there would just be a bit of elaboration for a Member The second one Mr Speaker, the Vice President is saying to understand, not that he is not being serious with people should ignore the issues as mentioned on social his responses because no one is allowed to respond to media and in the papers because they are not true. I questions without effort …(Inaudible)… would like to say to him that we heard through social MR TSOGWANE: Thank you Mr Speaker. Good, you media and the newspapers that he was going to be the explained to Honourable Hikuama very well, and he next Vice President. If I may ask him, is he not the Vice is someone who understands quickly. The ones from President? The other one is that we heard via social Honourable Motsamai, after asking you all heard the media that Honourable Majaga and Honourable Reatile whole House bursting into laughter, it means I am not were going to be suspended, were those members not the only one who is surprised and even laughing, the suspended? That is what social media said. whole House was laughing after he mentioned what the HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Laughter!)... newspapers once said. Honourable Motsamai, when a paper says something and it actually turns out to be HONOURABLE MEMBER: Mr Speaker, on a point true, just know that there has been what we call ‘leaks,’ of procedure. meaning the information would have been leaked. Someone like Motsamai would go and steal information MR SPEAKER: Leader of the House. from the office and give it to the papers. That is the only MR TSOGWANE: As you hear Honourable Members… case when the paper can say what is true. Otherwise, (Inaudible)…Mr Speaker… they are not prophetic, they cannot prophesy that this is going to happen, and this is not going to happen. That MR HIKUAMA: Procedure. I thank you Mr Speaker, is what we always talk about saying the information I am rising on a point of procedure. The first point is which is not meant for those who are not supposed to that the Vice President is saying when he responds to the hear it, should not be relayed to them by people who are supplementary questions he just answers without much not even supposed to relay it. In any case, Honourable effort. Is it procedural for us to ask questions which are Motsamai can explain better how they know what is not recognised and we continue using up time, allowing going to happen, we can ask him that question. We know the Vice President to just answer as he wants because that most of the things that they say, they are many, we supplementaries are not main questions? That is my first can also cite examples in which they were just guessing question and I would like you to explain the procedure and it never turned out to be the case. In the case where to me. they are spot on, there would have been something that

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happened. One person once said it in our sessions that buy those Gripens, considering the fact that we cannot “it is an intelligent guess,” so there is what is called an pay for those in three financial while the country is in a intelligent guess, maybe that is the category they would crisis. be in. You know that we did not buy those gripens. Those I thank you Mr Speaker. Honourable Motsamai, we who were there are aware of the gripens issue, we even shall continue probing and looking into the allegations went there to go and see them because the plan was to that are written. We will also continue answering. I make arrangements to purchase them. After President thank you. Dr Masisi observed the situation and realised that it is not important to purchase gripens, we withdrew the plan MR NKAWANA: I thank you Mr Speaker. Let me to purchase gripens. Thank you. also appreciate the answers as given by His Honour the Vice President, although they are not satisfactory. DR TSHABANG: Thank you Mr Speaker. Your My question is, did I get him clearly that that decision Honour, my question is in relation to funds… was taken when things were still going well? Right MINISTER OF MINERAL RESOURCES, GREEN now as we are facing the COVID-19 pandemic and TECHNOLOGY AND ENERGY SECURITY (MR shortage of funds, does the Vice President not see it MOAGI): On a point of procedure. Thank you Mr fit to review their decisions, because those funds were Speaker. I was looking at the Order Paper and it says not yet utilised? Your Honour the Vice President, I am that Leader of the House’s question time is up to 11:45. asking this question because, unless we are a suicidal I was just checking whether we are on track. Thank you nation, when you are on your way to Francistown and Mr Speaker. you find that a river is overflowing, realising you have no place to even put your foot to pass; can you just say MR SPEAKER: I will check. The agreement from I long decided to go to Francistown before it started the General Assembly was that today; two hours are raining, so I will just dive in? Can you not retreat and devoted to question time. Only if we finish earlier, we say, let me wait for the water to pass first, or let me first are going to look for other things. address the challenge we are facing now? I believe you have understood my question Your Honour the Vice DR TSHABANG: Thank you Mr Speaker. Your President, thank you. Honour, you are saying that P12 million was used to purchase vehicles; so my question is, is that all the MR TSOGWANE: Honourable Nkawana I understand funds because there are reports that modifications are you, your question is very relevant. The only difference still going to be done on those vehicles, some gadgets is that when you buy things like armored vehicles, are yet to be installed in those vehicles hence raising they are designed at your own specifications that are the money to about P70 million. So, are we not going to fit for the job. You submit your specifications for the spend more money on top of the P12 Million that you vehicle, and you would have paid a deposit prior. Now just stated? Is that all or we are still going to spend more as for succumbing to a pandemic, sometimes it becomes money inserting extra modifications that DIS requires in difficult, unless you negotiate the payments to say you order to raise the money to amount P70 million as stated would pay in instalments, because a pandemic has by the reports? Thank you. befallen you. Therefore, to cancel that order one would know that they are going to lose the deposit money they MR TSOGWANE: Honourable Dr Tshabang, in would have already popped out. That vehicle would my understanding, I do not think that if there are be specifically designed for you, it is different from modifications that are going to be done, they can go to a car that is bought from Motor Centre, displayed in that margin of reaching P70 million, no. It does not make a showroom, and then I just point at it and say I am sense. At least to me, it does not make sense. If there is buying this vehicle; then I buy it. That is the difference. going to be an increase, it is not going to be too much. All in all, the total budget… when you budget, you know The other thing is that there are some decisions that we what you are going to do or the modifications that you backed out on Honourable Member, and the nation has are going to do to the vehicle. So if the modifications are to know. There are Gripens that were once talked about, not done there, obviously there is going to be an extra which were supposed to be bought during the tenure of amount, if they were not supposed to be altered before the just retired President. We reversed the decision to coming this side. The same papers that you are citing,

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some are saying that they saw the alterations that were HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Inaudible)… done on the vehicles as well as what is inserted in that vehicle. So that again is confusing. So when I talk about MR SPEAKER: VP! the DIS budget for purchasing vehicles, I just gave you HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Inaudible)…Explain the total amount. So if extras are going to be P70 million, it would not really make sense to me. Thank you. the role of committees to the Ambassador.

MR SPEAKER: Honourable Kapinga followed by… …Silence… the next person does not qualify. Honourable Kapinga HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Inaudible)… would be the last one. HONOURABLE MEMBER: He does not know these MR KAPINGA: Thank you Mr Speaker. Your Honour things. Vice President, we agree that you appreciate that these questions are asked on the basis that we want good HONOURABLE MEMBER: Honourable Healy, you governance in our country; that is the first thing. So His are the Chairperson of the Committee…(Inaudible)… Honour, I heard you saying that when these vehicles MR TSOGWANE: Mr Speaker, the sound is not were purchased, the arrangement was made by DIS. audible and the last one was not clear but what I heard So when you say it was the DIS arrangement, are you is that he was asking if Batswana are not supposed to saying that when they informed the President that they hear about these issues when they are brought up as are going to purchase these vehicles, the President did questions. We are not against that and that is why these not have the power to say, “no do not do that, you will be issues are bought up. misusing government funds?” That is my first question. …Silence… Secondly, apparently the President’s life is under threat, so has he not been informed about those threats? As MR TSOGWANE: Am I audible Mr Speaker? the President, can he not take a decision and say, “no, MR SPEAKER: Yes, sir. I do not think that the threats that you are talking about justifies misusing funds like this…” MR TSOGWANE: Yes, although the last one was not clear, I was saying that no one is against these questions HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Inaudible)… or for Batswana to hear that questions pertaining to their MR SPEAKER: Who gave you the floor? concerns are being asked. Let me explain so that people can understand why some steps are taken. MR KAPINGA: …(Laughter!)… This man is too playful. Mr Speaker, my question was if the President is When we talk about security, Honourable Kapinga ever informed about these threats when they are there, is one of the people who understands it more than so that he can take a decision on his own about whether everyone here in Parliament. He also knows how many those threats are there and if they are threats that can times he has advised Presidents and the decisions they justify the expenditure. took when he advised them and those that they did not take. So he must know better than anybody else. Lastly, you are saying that people should have made When I try to answer his question, I will just be tiring part of the DIS committee and that they could have myself. I believe that he understands that when you are been informed about these issues at the Committee. Are advised about security, and you are not in security or you saying that the DIS Committee is more important intelligence, you have to listen to those advisors. Unless that Parliament of Botswana and that it is the one that you have other sources of information that counter what should be informed about certain things? Parliament is being said. Otherwise, security is very important. I of Botswana is made up of people who were voted by take it that he knows that security of the President is a Batswana, so are you saying that they do not have the security of the nation. There are a lot of instabilities that right to ask about these kind of issues on behalf of the can be caused by security issues and I will give him an nation? Thank you Mr Speaker. example. You know better Honourable Kapinga about MR SPEAKER: Leader of the House! September 11 that Intelligence Service officials of that country warned the government and they did not take …Silence… action hence September 11 happened. Only later to say,

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the Intelligence Service warned us about this. So these like muting. Thank you Mr Speaker. Question number things, we must know them better as politicians, that 1. you cannot just oppose security issues. That is why I cited it as an example; September 11, the United States …Silence… of America (USA). It is not like security services did HONOURABLE MEMBER: This is uncalled for, not warn them about that, so when you are advised by… even today!

…Silence… …Silence …

MR SPEAKER: We have a problem here. What is HONOURABLE MEMBER: It will pass. happening to the VP? MR SPEAKER: Honourable Minister of Finance and …Silence… Economic Development! MR TSOGWANE: …about time and the situation …Silence … where now vehicles are used. They are devices which are used and they change with the times. We must know UNIVERSAL ACCESS TO GENERAL that people who are a threat to security keep informing PRACTITIONERS themselves. They are advanced. We are not talking about an ordinary person. We must match with times MR T. LETSHOLO (KANYE NORTH): asked the and then ensure that the President is safe. Anyway, it is Minister of Health and Wellness whether subject to Batswana’s decision to make, whether they want their managing conflict of interest, it is feasible for the purpose President to live the way he has been living like some of enabling universal access to General Practitioners are saying. Opposition members are saying they do not for the ministry to allow private General Practitioners care even if he is killed. It is upon Batswana, they are to consult at Government clinics and hospitals; and to the voters, they know how stable they want their country further state: to be. I do not understand this thinking. Thank you Mr Speaker. (i) what viable best practice examples he can share from other countries for this model; and QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER (ii) what retention incentives exist for talented doctors, MR SPEAKER: Let us move on. Honourable Member nurses and other professionals in Government for Palapye, Honourable Ramogapi. healthcare.

…Silence… ASSISTANT MINISTER OF HEALTH AND MR SPEAKER: Can you unmute yourself Honourable WELLNESS (MR LELATISITSWE): Thank you Ramogapi? Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker, Honourable Member of Parliament (MP) asked if it is feasible, and consistent …Silence… with our ongoing efforts to facilitate Universal Healthcare Coverage (UHC). MR SPEAKER: Honourable Ramogapi, you should unmute on the… We believe that this strategic direction is the most sustainable way forward when one considers the MR RAMOGAPI: …(Inaudible)… Botswana Government’s policy framework. The MR SPEAKER: Listen! Listen first! Listen! framework embraces partnerships and collaboration in delivering cost-effective services and products. MR RAMOGAPI: …(Inaudible)… A general limitation of resources, plus the importance of MR SPEAKER: Listen! Unmute on the icon which has using any excess capacity in either, or both, the public been sent to you. Something has been sent to you. Click and private sectors makes it imperative that favourable on that one which has been sent to you. It has just been consideration be made and applied sooner, rather than sent to you. later.

MR RAMOGAPI: Thank you Mr Speaker. Mr In this context, it is worth noting that specialist services Speaker, we have been trying to unmute. These people like cardiac surgeries, cardiology or oncology consults,

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orthopaedics and nephrology have been performed by MR W. B. MMOLOTSI (FRANCISTOWN private medical specialists in Government facilities. SOUTH): asked the Minister of Mineral Resources, Green Technology and Energy Security to update this The strategic direction to which I have just alluded is Honourable House on progress of identifying and work in progress. So, I cannot answer conclusively at getting an investor for Tati Nickel mine. this point, but can update as follows: - MINISTER OF MINERAL RESOURCES, GREEN (i) The ministry is aware of, but does not have any TECHNOLOGY AND ENERGY SECURITY (MR specific working knowledge of best practices MOAGI): Thank you Mr Speaker. Hopefully I am examples from other countries, in respect of audible that side. a mixed model. This is something that we are working on. MR SPEAKER: You are.

(ii) In line with Government employment policies MR MOAGI: Thank you for the question Honourable specifically the Attraction and Retention Directive Mmolotsi. I will quickly go through it in English and No. 2 of 2008, all Government doctors are paid a then a small summary in Setswana at the end. scarce skill allowance at 40 per cent and private practice at 10 per cent. Nurses who hold a post Mr Speaker, BCL Group of Companies comprising basic qualification are paid an allowance at 10 per BCL Limited, BCL Investments and Tati Nickel Mining cent of the salary. Other health care professionals Company, were placed under provisional liquidation such as pharmacists, dietitians, laboratory by the High Court of Botswana on the 9th of October scientists, and physiotherapists etcetera are also 2016 as a result of low mineral commodity prices and paid scarce skill allowance. other economic reasons. BCL Limited was put in final liquidation on the 15th of June 2017, while Tati Nickel MR LETSHOLO: Supplementary. Thank you Mining Company was only placed in final liquidation Honourable Minister for that answer. My question on the 27th of February 2019. In July of 2019, the initial is, according to you, when should the residents of liquidator for BCL Group of Companies resigned, and Ranaka, Mmasenyetse, boora Kgokgonyane, who the Master and Registrar of the High Court appointed have Government premises but do not have medical new liquidators. The liquidators then opened the data practitioners expect to see this system in their areas? room for potential investors to access information so as Secondly, looking at the initiative to use more state- to submit offers. The liquidator set end of June 2020 as owned assets on infrastructure for example, how much deadline for submission of offers. will health generate in terms of income to Government Mr Speaker, the liquidators for BCL and Tati received when used by private doctors as per the example you three indicative offers for the assets and completed used? Thank you. evaluation of the offers in order to recommend a MR LELATISITSWE: Thank you Mr Speaker. preferred bidder who would then be granted a period The Honourable Member of Ranaka is asking for his of exclusivity within which to conduct a due diligence villages that using this system when could they get before concluding the purchase agreed. The liquidators medical assistance. At the moment Botswana has acute have had preliminary engagements of the preferred shortage of doctors both in Government and private bidder who requires an exclusive period of about six sector. We continue to search for private doctors in months to carry out detailed due diligence in order to rural areas which are far from services, or those who submit a firm of the liquidators. It is expected that the have opened there, we can still use them. When we firm offer would be submitted by September 2021. It plan for our strategy as a ministry, we want to try to use must be noted Mr Speaker, that this period of exclusivity technology to assist where the situation is bad. When involves going beyond the data room and could include we talk of using Government premises from the health but not limited to legal due diligence drilling, sample sector, I believe it can generate income for Government tests, metallurgy, engineering audits on all structures to rent them out to private practices. We welcome that etcetera, in a press to move quickly into production. To initiative. Thank you. assess the authenticity of the structures that have been standing for a long time is very key for the safety of INVESTOR FOR TATI NICKEL MINE people and machinery.

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In short Mr Speaker, the liquidator located someone metallurgical tests or anything at all which they will who require a period of six months so they can deal be doing, they are going to do it individually until they with it. At first, they considered the documents that we are satisfied. We decided to choose one because they have and our plans, now they will have to do tests, take indicated what they are going to do, that they already samples, drill there and there, make metallurgical tests have enough money to do that with due diligence for as well as find out whether the structures are still in good six months. Others did not indicate that, they simply condition, identify pipes which have to be maintained, wanted the mine but did not indicate what they bring for and ultimately give us an offer. We believe all these us. So, that is what differentiated their offers. things would be carried out by September 2021. I thank you Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker, we do not believe a person can waste our time by claiming that they want a mine even though MR MMOLOTSI: Supplementary. Thank you Mr their intentions are shallow. A situation where they Speaker. Minister, are you satisfied with the person have indicated, especially their budget on the indicative that you chose, the one who is going to give us an offer offer, where they indicated the account that this money ultimately or, is the liquidator satisfied and have enough is kept in, the expo account. This thing encourages and money to buy? Apart from having enough money to gives us hope that this company will surely do what they buy, do they have money to operate the mine or, are they promised, even if they do not occupy the entire mine, going to look for money to start operating the mine after they are surely going to occupy some parts of it. giving them an offer, and after paying? I am referring to a situation where operation of the mine is going to delay, Another thing which will be done through the liquidator I am saying this because it happened to a certain mine is that, we are not going to do what we usually do with which we sold at Tswapong. others, you gave an example of Lerala and another ...(Inaudible)… scheme in South Africa, after getting Secondly, since you have not finalised concerning the a mine, they went on to focus on things which could liquidator who is evaluating the mine, do you not think generate income within a short period of time, then left. it would be better if you could have engaged all the So we are going to introduce some sections in the law, three preferred companies on that stage so that we do even on any agreement whatsoever to ensure that we do not delay the process but engage the remaining two if not suffer from that, so that we benefit something from one of them fails? selling the mine. Thank you Mr Speaker.

I am saying this because if we wait for another one for MR KEORAPETSE: Thank you Mr Speaker. two years, the condition of these mines will continue Honourable Minister, this preferred bidder, are you to get worse. If someone buys them at that time, they referring to North American Nickel? Secondly, do you would be in a very bad condition and very difficult to think North American Nickel has the capability to buy start operating. Thank you. and operate a mine? Also elaborate how many stages are to be observed to confirm that they are going to buy MR MOAGI: Thank you Mr Speaker. Thank you it; that is, how many stages are there that will determine Honourable Mmolotsi. Let me start with the last finality that this company will buy and operate the question. The liquidator engaged the three of them; they mine or not? I will link it to Honourable Mmolotsi’s each gave an offer concerning what they found out at the question that, why not have more than one who carry mine. It showed that looking at what they saw and the out metallurgical tests so that if I conclude that I am plans given to them, they believe they can deduce this stopping here, I cannot move forward, then we are sure and that. So they were expected to indicate their offers, that one of them is going to give a better offer, that how much they are going to invest on those projects they are indeed carrying on? The most important thing as well as indicate how much they are going to spend. that I want to know is, what do you know about North So I am saying, I am going to choose one from these American Nickel and investment in Premium Nickel three, the one who is going to give a better offer. This Sources? is what happened here because when competing, only one is chosen. As such, they are now at the stage where MR MOAGI: Thank you Mr Speaker. Thank you one of them has to be chosen, the one who is going to Honourable Keorapetse for that question. Let us start with be given time, they are not going to be disturbed by the principle which allows us to invite investors; you all other competitors. So as they will be drilling, doing get same things at the start, you then start evaluating all

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that are listed there. The three preferred bidders you are (ii) such protracted delays in appointing them does talking about were handed this information including not demotivate and heavily frustrate them. this preferred bidder. They were given the chance to submit their proposals and they indicated that we want MINISTER OF DEFENCE, JUSTICE AND to buy the mine for this much. Others indicated that they SECURITY (MR MMUSI): Thank you Mr Speaker. will include one, two or three in the purchase of BCL or Mr Speaker, I am aware that the position of Chief Tati. So this is what informs you to award to this bidder Executive Officer (CEO) of Legal Aid is vacant, and the as he has good intentions. Chief Legal Counsel has been appointed to act as Chief Executive Officer pending appointment of the CEO. There is a criteria sir which includes a lot of things from the technical, as well as from the financial side to inform (i) The appointment of Chief Executive Officer assessments. The main thing is that Curriculum Vitae of Legal Aid Botswana is the prerogative of (CV) should highlight experience in the mining field, the Minister responsible for Defence, Justice and the length of experience. All these were assessed and and Security, in consultation with the board as were not carried out by the liquidator but rather experts provided in Section 19 of the Legal Aid Act. in the mining sector were employed. They managed to submit that report which met our expectations. (ii) The delay in filling the vacancy is due to previous protracted recruitment processes, which had to In conclusion, North American Nickel; I thought by now be invalidated and restarted because the process there will be a communication. However, since there are was not satisfactory. However, I am happy to other processes to be followed at the liquidator and from inform this Honourable House that Legal Aid Master of the High Court, even at the ministry, we are Botswana has forwarded recommendations for still to conclude on it. The bottom line is the preferred my consideration, and I am confident that the bidder is Premium Nickel Resources, who through recruitment will be finalised by March 2021. I their proposal explained where they will be getting thank you. money from. Furthermore, after they do this job of due diligence in the exclusivity period, they will indicate MR MMOLOTSI: Supplementary. Thank you Mr how they reach financial close including capital for their Speaker. Minister, why does it take such a long time recurrent budget. This is the one which will be awarded to fill in these positions either after the people who and will do within six months. occupied them left or existed because of different reasons? Why does it take two years for such positions There is another possibility Honourable Keorapetse to be filled? Why is there such delay, where is the gap in and Honourable Mmolotsi; as to whether at the end the the system? This affects service delivery. bidder might say I am continuing or not continuing with the project. My point is, we do not expect a company MR MMUSI: Honourable, regarding this specific issue after expressing interest, going through all these to avoid generalising, process of interviews was not processes and even showed that they have secured the properly followed from the onset and we were compelled funds, to withdraw. If it happens then the Government to start it again in order to appoint the proper CEO. So is the one with that mining licence, so we will know as expected, we followed the process and I believe that which move to make thereafter. Let us keep the faith. in March, the CEO will be appointed. Thank you Mr Thank you. Speaker.

ACTING APPOINTMENT AT LEGAL AID MILK DEMAND IN BOTSWANA BOTSWANA MR A. LESASO (SHOSHONG): asked the Minister MR P. P. P. MOATLHODI (TONOTA): asked the of Agricultural Development and Food Security: Minister of Defence, Justice and Security to confirm (i) how much is the milk demand in Botswana per whether he is aware of two officers at Legal Aid day; Botswana who have been acting as Chief Executive Officer and Chief Legal Aid Counsel respectively for (ii) how much of the domestic market is supplied by almost two years and if so: local suppliers;

(i) what is the hold up in appointing them; and (iii) how much is imported; and

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(iv) what is Government doing to close the gap and collection centres in strategic locations to improve ensure self-sufficiency. market accessibility for small scale farmers among others. MINISTER OF AGRICULTURAL DEVELOPMENT AND FOOD SECURITY (MR • Government is also promoting private investment GARE): Good afternoon Mr Speaker. Thank you in the dairy sub-sector, not only to improve the Honourable Member for the question. The answer is productivity of the sub-sector but also to create that; employment. Examples of these projects are Sunnyside Dairy Farm, Deo Volente Investments (i) The annual demand for milk in Botswana is 65 and Milk Afric at Lobatse. I thank you Mr Speaker. million litres, which translates to 178,000 litres per day. MR LESASO: Supplementary. Mr Speaker, I heard the Minister’s response but he is talking about issues (ii) The local suppliers supply 22,192 litres per day to of FAP dating as far back as 2000. So I want to know the domestic market. This is as per the 2019/2020 that from 2000, what did FAP do to assist them so that figures. the shortage that has been there for so many years could be reduced. Today I also hear him talking about Milk (iii) The monthly milk imports are 4, 4 million litres, Afric which at the moment is still looking for people which is about 146,685 litres of milk per day. who can be able to start the business of providing milk Again, this is also as per the 2019/2020 figures. in Botswana. How long will it take Milk Afric to start (iv) Government has initiated the following to facilitate bringing milk to Botswana? The question is that the development of the dairy sub-sector: small scale cooperatives that you are talking about that are there in Botswana, how did Government assist them • Small scale dairy farmers have been facilitated so that they can be able to increase the production of to form Dairy Cooperatives and Agricultural milk in Botswana, because it seems like this shortage Management Associations throughout the districts, is growing? As I am speaking right now, this example to facilitate collection and marketing of their is there at Serowe… (Inaudible)… the Serowe plant milk. These cooperatives include Mmadinare, was supposed to provide around 8 000 litres of milk Thamalakane, Gaborone, Pitsane and Serowe. per day, but at the moment we are at 350 litres. I want • Government has also through the Financial to ask whether this is an indication that this shortage is Assistance Policy (FAP), assisted farmers to reducing or increasing? I request that he answers those purchase dairy cattle, feed, milking equipment and questions. Thank you Mr Speaker. construction of milking parlours. The majority of MR GARE: Thank you Mr Speaker, thank you the existing small scale dairy projects were funded Honourable Member. Let me start by admitting that through the FAP programme, which ended in the the dairy sub sector is one of the sectors that are faced year 2000. with a lot of challenges. One of those challenges is that • The Government through Article 26 of Infant as Botswana, we are not able to produce dairy cattle, Industry Protection of the Southern African Customs because obviously for us to be able to have cattle that Union (SACU) Agreement, is imposing a 40 per cent can produce a lot of milk, maybe we should be able to tariff on imports of Ultra-High Temperature (UHT) conduct their multiplication or increase them locally. processing milk from the region. This is meant to For example, Milk Afric at some point were supposed reduce external competition against the local dairy to buy about 2 000 dairy cattle from South Africa or let sub-sector and promote its growth. This dispensation me say outside Botswana, but because of the challenges has been in place for the past 13 years. that were there at time which include things like Foot and Mouth at South Africa, they could not facilitate. I • Implementation of the Dairy Development Strategy can attribute not meaning that I am taking the job of the of 2013 is on-going and several initiatives are being Ministry of Trade, I can attribute that the delay by Milk undertaken to facilitate the growth of the dairy sub- Afric to facilitate was due to challenges like that because sector. These include sale of female sexed semen we stayed for a long time not being able to import cattle at subsidised cost to improve the genetic merit and from South Africa because of Foot and Mouth. Those increase dairy cow herd and construction of milk are some of the challenges that are there. Like you were

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asking Honourable Member that I am talking about the do not have information at the moment. I request the old FAP, yes that was a long time ago, but like I was Honourable Member to give me time to check for him saying, we did not stop there as I indicated in my answer how the efforts are going. Thank you Mr Speaker. that we impose the 40 per cent tariff on the imports of Ultra-High Temperature (UHT) milk. In an effort to FIGHT AGAINST GBV encourage the local or the subsector locally to be able MR G. KEKGONEGILE (MAUN EAST): asked to grow, we have reduced their competition. We are also the Minister of Defence, Justice and Security to brief implementing Dairy Development Strategy of 2013 this Honourable House on measures by the ministry which we believe will help, as I indicated that through to facilitate an effective fight against Gender Based the said strategy, we are selling the female sexed semen Violence (GBV) by the Botswana Police Service and at a subsidised cost. We believe that this is assistance on the Judiciary, in particular: its own to be selling it to them at subsidised cost, as an effort to increase the dairy cattle that we have. (i) initiatives put in place to have a fully-fledged GBV department within the Botswana Police He asked about the issue of small scale farmers Service; and particularly at Serowe, let me say, we are aware of the challenges that are there. As I was saying, some of the (ii) initiatives put in place to have independent and challenges do not rest only with the ministry, some of fully operational Youth and GBV courts within them need us to look even beyond borders for us to be the Judiciary. able to fully drive our agenda to try and grow those businesses. We also have the Economic Recovery and MINISTER OF DEFENCE, JUSTICE AND Transformation Plan (ERTP), in that plan we have a SECURITY (MR MMUSI): Thank you Mr Speaker, budget which we believe we can be able to include some let me thank you Honourable Kekgonegile. resources in these small scale farmers for us to increase (i) Mr Speaker, as I had indicated to this Honourable and enhance their production. Thank you Mr Speaker. House during the last Parliamentary Session, all DR GOBOTSWANG: Supplementary. Thank you Mr police stations across the country deal with cases Speaker. Honourable Minister, you were talking about of Gender Based Violence (GBV) and always the dairy strategy, but in that strategy there was supposed strive to protect victims. GBV reports are attended to be a Dairy Board. I want to ask if there is a board, to in secluded rooms and victims are treated with is it operational, and if it is not there what has caused respect and empathy. the delay to have it? Secondly, there are people who are The Botswana Police Service has embraced the need to making an effort to establish these milk businesses, it come up with Child-Friendly Police facilities to cater for seems like there were efforts at Maunatlala, where your victims of child abuse. On the 10th December, 2020, a ministry and Honourable Molale’s ministry did a study Child-Friendly Police facility was completed and opened with community resilience projects. I am asking how far for use at the Broadhurst Police Station, Gaborone as a that project at Maunatlala is, really where is Honourable pilot project. Mr Speaker, Training curriculum for the Modukanele? Thank you. Botswana Police Service has various modules to equip MR GARE: Thank you Honourable Member. Yes it is officers on how to deal with different types of crime, very true... (Inaudible)… which indicates that the Dairy including GBV. In-service training on specialised skills Board there should be. I will be lying if I tell you that continues to be offered throughout their career. We there is a board, but what I understand… I request the anticipate that a fully-fledged GBV Unit, within the Honourable Member to give me time to investigate and Botswana Police Service will be established during the find out how far they are. I do not want to stand here 2021/2022 Financial Year. The envisioned Unit will be and say the establishment of the board is at this stage or dedicated to dealing with gender based and child related at that stage, as in future it may be found that I did not offences. tell you the truth. I know that there are plans or they are (ii) Mr Speaker, on 9th November 2020, the Honourable being made for a board to be established. That is why Chief Justice, reacting to the increased rate of I am saying, please give me time Honourable Member GBV cases, issued Practice Directive No 9 of 2020 to see how far they are, I will get back to you with an and declared that effective 1st December 2020, all answer. Also on the issue of Maunatlala Mr Speaker, I

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GBV cases shall be treated as urgent applications MR MMUSI: Thank you Mr Speaker. On the first one, for expedited management, set down and disposal. which you were talking about the pilot project, the pilot In line with the CJ’s Practice Directive in question, project like the one in Broadhurst is not going to be inside such cases shall upon registration be dealt with the police station. There is going to be a room next to the urgently without following the normal scheduling police station where this unit is going to be established. of cases. The Honourable Chief Justice has So even in other places, suitable places will be chosen. therefore established specialised courts dedicated In the meantime, where we have not identified places, to GBV cases, in all Chief Magistrate stations. In we shall temporarily look for a room; but the aim is to stations with no Chief Magistrate, GBV cases will identify suitable places next to police stations, maybe a still be prioritised in line with the dictates of the room there would be taken and converted as it was done Practice Directive. in Broadhurst.

Finally Mr Speaker, all these intervention measures by Inter-Ministerial Committee as you were saying, the both the BPS and Administration of Justice (AOJ) are men are maybe four Ministers and one woman. The sub-committee has more women, and the NGOs are also steps in the right direction which are expected to bear represented. It is a high committee, and it has a sub- fruits when coupled with the recently launched Inter- committee which includes NGOs, more ministries and Ministerial GBV Committee and the highly anticipated Permanent Secretaries who will be coming up with these implementation of the Sex Offender’s Register. I thank terms of reference. I am not too sure, when it comes to you Mr Speaker. the terms of reference of Dikgosi that did not go too far, MR KEKGONEGILE: Supplementary. Thank you but I believe things are going on very well, and that it Mr Speaker, thank you Minister. On the issue of police has already been launched officially and it has a fully- stations, you talked about a pilot project at Broadhurst, fledged team. The Chairperson is Minister Mokgethi, and that all police stations will have GBV Units in the she is the one leading. Thank you Mr Speaker. 2021/2022 budget. Honourable Minister, to have units LAND ALLOCATION IN BOTETI SUB- as personnel and fully-fledged units that consist of DISTRICT personnel and where they are operating from, is the only way we can make GBV to be attended to effectively MS T. MONNAKGOTLA (KGALAGADI NORTH): in police stations. Considering the shortage of office asked the Minister of Land Management, Water and accommodation in all our police stations, do you have Sanitation Services to provide an update on land any plan that in this financial year of 2021 you will fulfil allocation in the Boteti Sub-District and to state: the fully-fledged GBV Units in all police stations, are you going to erect buildings or will it only be officers (i) the number of applicants who have not been who will be operating where they have been working all allocated residential plots in the last five years; along, where it is not conducive for GBV victims? That (ii) the number of applicants for business plots not is the first one. allocated in the last five years;

You talked about an Inter-Ministerial Committee; we (iii) the percentage of youth applicants in both cases at saw it being launched officially by the Vice President. (i) and (ii) above; and It comprises of four men and one woman. The question is, why do we have more men in this committee and (iv) what measures are in place to clear the backlog only one woman when women are mostly the victims? If their number could be more than that of men, maybe MINISTER OF LAND MANAGEMENT, WATER this committee could actually function. AND SANITATION SERVICES (MR MZWINILA): Thank you Mr Speaker. Secondly, are their terms of reference similar to that one of Dikgosi that was once formed, which we have no idea (i) Mr Speaker, Boteti Sub-District composes of where it vanished because it was never published? two Sub-Land Boards, Letlhakane and Rakops. Letlhakane and Rakops Sub-Land Boards have 26 Lastly, why are Non-Governmental Organisations 567 and 3 702 applicants respectively who have (NGOs) not represented in this Inter-Ministerial not been allocated residential plots during the last Committee? Thank you. five years.

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(ii) Ngwato Land Board does not have a waiting list used to finance medical supplies, food hampers, for business plots, as the practice is not to keep contact tracing expenses and wage subsidy costs. waiting lists of business plots but rather advertise Donations to the fight against COVID-19 were them once they become available. mostly in kind as detailed in annexure that I will share with the Honourable Member. (iii) In Letlhakane Sub-Land Board, 13 780 or 52 per cent of the applicants are youth and have not yet (ii) Mr Speaker, following the pronouncement of been allocated residential plots in the last five the State of Public Emergency in April 2020, years while in Rakops Sub-Land Board, 2 195 Government congregated a total of P4.3 billion youths who represent 59 per cent of the applicants for COVID-19 mitigation measures and its have not been allocated residential plots. aftereffects. Specifically, the funds are distributed as follows; the initial amount of P2 billion was (iv) Mr Speaker, currently 1 653 plots have been earmarked for health supplies, wage subsidy, surveyed in Letlhakane Sub-Land Board’s area psychosocial support and relocation of Batswana of jurisdiction and will be ready for allocation in the diaspora. A further sum of P2.3 billion was during the first quarter of 2021/22 financial year approved through the Supplementary Budget, (Letlhakane village will have 982 plots and Financial Paper No.1 of 2020-2021 for furtherance Mmatshumu will have 671 plots). Draft layout of the fight against the COVID-19 pandemic. Out plans for Mmea (380 plots), Mokubilo (829), of this amount, P1.3 billion was provided under the Letlhakane Phase 3 (1 190) and Makgaba (411) Ministry of Finance and Economic Development are in place and will be ready for allocation during for stabilisation of businesses. P1 billion under the third quarter of the same financial year. As the Ministry of Health and Wellness was used for regards Rakops Sub-Land Board, 378 plots will procurement of Personal Protective Equipment be ready for allocation during 2021/22 financial (PPE) for frontline staff, laboratory commodities year and it should be done in the first quarter of the which are test kits and the reagents, and other financial year. I thank you Mr Speaker. equipment to be used at the ports of entry and COVID-19 FUND DONATIONS isolation centres.

MR O. RAMOGAPI (PALAPYE): asked the Minister Mr Speaker, details of spending from the COVID-19 of Finance and Economic Development to state: Pandemic Relief Fund are provided in another annexure which I will share with the Honourable Member. I also (i) the amount, equipment and any other assistance wish to indicate that there are other COVID-19 related donated to the COVID-19 Fund and how it has expenses which were incurred across various sectors of been utilised; Government which are not part of the fund. Examples of such are assistance to the sports, culture and arts sub- (ii) how much Government contributed or set aside in sector under the Ministry of Youth Empowerment, Sport the fight against COVID-19 and how it has been and Culture Development and freelance tour operators expended (spent); and under the Ministry of Environment, Natural Resources, (iii) when Parliament will be availed an audited Conservation and Tourism. financial report on the COVID-19 Fund, which (iii) Mr Speaker, the Office of Auditor General has is a public fund and should be audited for the undertaken a performance audit of the COVID-19 purposes of transparency, accountability and good Fund. The exercise has been completed and the governance. report is being finalised with the intention to MINISTER OF FINANCE AND ECONOMIC submit and present to Parliament during the first DEVELOPMENT (DR MATSHEKA): Thank you quarter of 2021/22. I thank you Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker. MR SALESHANDO: Supplementary. Thank you Mr (i) Mr Speaker, an amount of P139, 620, 913.00 has Speaker. Minister Matsheka, you once announced that been donated to the COVID-19 Pandemic Relief Government purchased medical equipment worth P2.4 Fund as at 8th February, 2021 and it forms part billion. On the figures that he is stating here today, he is of the overall credit to the fund. The funds are saying that P1.3 billion was used on medical equipment.

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Minister Matsheka, what did the P2.4 billion that you Ramogapi, let me assure you that guidelines to purchase once talked about purchase and why is it not in your goods and direct appointment are in accordance with the response today? Public Procurement and Asset Disposal Board (PPADB) Act. We believe that when these records are inspected, DR MATSHEKA: Mr Speaker, I am not too sure which we will see what really transpired. one he is referring to. I have answered this question to the best of what I have in front of me. It may be The question pertaining to the Auditor General, it is necessary to reconcile the references to anything that I important for us to know the situation that we are in, have said in the past much more specifically. Thank you. Auditor General is the one who audits government accounts. Until we change that arrangement, the Auditor MR RAMOGAPI: Supplementary. Thank you Mr General will continue auditing government accounts. Speaker. Mr Speaker, I want to ask the Minister if As I said, the Auditor General has completed the audit he is aware that Batswana are concerned, they want and at the moment, relevant people are finalising the accountability for these funds. Even when he tries to report for it to be presented in Parliament so that the account for these funds, Batswana do not see what he Honourable Members can assess it and ask questions. has done. For example, he is saying that funds were You will call the Auditor General to your Committees so used to purchase medical supplies but some of us who that they can answer you on what they found out in this are on the ground can tell you that it is said that we have audit. Thank you Mr Speaker. ran out of testing kids. Where are the things that you are saying you purchased? Batswana want you to settle this. MR SPEAKER: Thank you Minister. Order! Order! Honourable Members, the time has struck, we should The second one; Minister, is there a guideline on how adjourn for tea break and try to be back at 2 p.m. sharp. funds are going to be used at the Office of the President Thank you very much. Let us adjourn. since we are concerned about the fact that people were appointed using direct appointment? PROCEEDINGS SUSPENDED AT 1:00 P.M. FOR APPROXIMATELY 1 HOUR The other question pertaining to audit; why is the audit not carried out by private companies instead of being PROCEEDINGS RESUMED AT 2:00 P.M. carried out by the Auditor General who is appointed and can be dismissed by the President? How can they audit MR SPEAKER: Order! Order! Honourable Members, Office of the President? Minister Matsheka, this thing good afternoon. Let us resume the meeting. troubles Batswana. Thank you for your answers. TABLING OF PAPER

DR MATSHEKA: Thank you Mr Speaker, thank you The following paper was tabled: Honourable Ramogapi. I think the fact of the matter is that, where we sit as a ministry, we have provided BOTSWANA GEOSCIENCE INSTITUTE resources to be able to finance the acquisition of testing ANNUAL REPORT, 2020 kits, and I can confirm that a lot of them have been used, and there may be shortages because of the continuous (Minister of Mineral Resources, Green Technology and usage of such equipment. Therefore, it is not necessarily Energy Security) the case to say that they were never purchased and STATEMENT saying that only after they finish. I believe that we are going to continue looking for them in order to assist STATUS OF THE TOTAL ESTIMATED Batswana. COST OF THE NATIONAL DEVELOPMENT PLAN (NDP) 11 As for the second question, I also have to explain that there are guidelines which are used to purchase MINISTER OF FINANCE AND ECONOMIC government resources. We hope and believe that these DEVELOPMENT (DR MATSHEKA): Mr Speaker, I guidelines are being followed, the only thing that we stand in terms of Standing Order 41.2 (2) to provide facts can do to inspect what was happening is to say that we about the allegations made by Honourable Reatile, that will inspect government records in order to see if these the Total Estimated Cost of the National Development funds were used efficiently and if they paid reasonable Plan (NDP) 11 has been changed without the authority amounts as a way to save government funds. Honourable of this House. I had listened, and continue to listen, to

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the inputs by Members of Parliament on the Budget want to focus on one; which is the allegation that I have Speech I presented on the 1st February 2021 as part of changed the Total Estimated Cost of NDP 11, without the Appropriation (2021/2022) Bill, (No. 2 of 2021). I authority, which he described as “irregular, unprocedural will be responding in detail to Members’ comments and and unethical.” You will agree with me Mr Speaker views at a time to be decided by you Mr Speaker, as that, these are strong words, especially directed to the provided as well in Standing Order 86.2 of the Standing Minister responsible for finance. The other issues raised Orders of this Parliament. by the Honourable Members will be addressed when I respond to the general debate in a few days’ time. However Mr Speaker, Honourable Reatile’s allegations that I have changed the Total Estimated Cost of NDP What is the issue here Mr Speaker? The Honourable 11 without the authority of Parliament are very serious, Member alleges that I have increased the Total as they border on the integrity of the Government of Estimated Cost of the NDP 11 from P101 341 000 000 Botswana, the Ministry of Finance and Economic and this is inaccurate number as well that he has quoted, Development (MFED) and indeed, on myself. Much as approved in the Mid-Term Review of NDP 11 to P101 Honourable Members have the right to debate the budget 479 000 000 in the current Budget before Parliament. the way they see fit, it does not absolve them from telling To respond to this, I wish to refer the Honourable House the truth, especially where figures are involved. I could to three related documents: NDP 11; MTR of NDP 11 not help but recall the perplexed nature of the face of and the 2021/2022 Estimates of Expenditure from the the Member of Parliament, Honourable Saleshando on Consolidated and Development Funds. the remarks that were made. I am sure even the whole nation was surprised by the remarks. Mr Speaker, the original Total Estimated Cost of NDP 11 was P101 406 300 000 approved by this House in Mr Speaker, I have respect for Honourable Reatile, as November 2016. This was reduced to P101 341 000 an old member of this House, who should guide some of 000 in the MTR of NDP 11 approved by this House in the new Members on the documentation that accompany September 2020. Following the approval of the MTR the Budget presentation. I also expect the Honourable of NDP 11 in September 2020, I have presented annual Member to be familiar with the basic planning Estimates of Expenditure from the Consolidated and documents such as the NDPs, Mid-Term Reviews Development Funds for financial year 2021/2022 on (MTR), Supplementary Estimates of Expenditure, the 1st February 2021 with a proposed revised Total Annual Estimates of Expenditure from the Consolidated Estimated Cost of P101, 479,200,000. and Development Funds and the Annual Financial Statements, Tables and Estimates of the Consolidated The difference between the MTR of NDP 11 figure and and Development Funds Revenues. All these documents the figure mentioned in the 2021/2022 Estimates of are at the disposal of Members to consult and if need Expenditure is an increase in TEC of P138, 000,000. be, seek clarification from the Ministry of Finance and This is part of the budget proposals contained in Economic Development. With regards to the Estimates the 2021/2022 Estimates of Expenditure from the of Expenditure from the Consolidated and Development Consolidated and Development Funds and presented as Funds, it was availed to Honourable Members on the 6th part of the current Appropriation Bill. January 2021, almost a month before presentation of the Mr Speaker, I wish to highlight some of the ministries st Budget to Parliament on the 1 February 2021. This is that contributed to the P138 million variance cited meant to afford Honourable Members time to study the above as follows: Budget as they prepare for the debates. (a) Ministry for Presidential Affairs, Governance Mr Speaker, in order to further improve the Budget and Public Administration (and not the Office of the preparation process, we may have to look at our Standing President as was said by Honourable Reatile) is P67, Orders with a view to consider utilising the Clear Day 214,446: This constitutes the proposed TEC increase of to discuss the Budget and clarify issues which may be National AIDS and Health Promotion Agency (NAHPA) raised by Honourable Members before debates resume programme. This proposed increase in the NDP 11 TEC and enhance understanding. was offset by a transfer TEC for HIV/AIDS programme Mr Speaker, there are several issues raised by under the Ministry of Health and Wellness following the Honourable Reatile in his debate. In this statement, I transfer of NAHPA to this ministry.

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(b) Ministry of Finance and Economic Development MR REATILE: Thank you Mr Speaker. I do appreciate (MFED) - P110, 000,000: The TEC of MFED Statistical the statement by Honourable Matsheka for being able to Survey and Studies programme was not sufficient to come to Parliament to address the nation. Mr Speaker, cater for the 2021 Population and Housing Census, Honourable Matsheka and I agree in terms of figures. hence the proposed increase. The issue is that, Honourable Matsheka believe it is a proposed Total Estimated Cost (TEC) to this Honourable (c) Ministry of Youth Empowerment, Sport and House. When he gave the Budget Speech on the 1st of Culture Development (MYSC) - P24, 100,000: There February Mr Speaker, I can quote paragraph 138... is a proposed TEC increase of P3, 100,000 in order to provide for the Botswana Government’s contribution MR SPEAKER: Please do. towards library project implemented by the Robert and Sarah Rothschild Foundation. In addition, there MR REATILE: Yes, Mr Speaker. Honourable is a proposed TEC increase for MYSC Infrastructure Matsheka indicated that, “Mr Speaker, while we are by P21, 000,000 for the Francistown Stadium. Other expecting economic recovery during the coming fiscal reasons for the variance are contained in Annexure 1 to year, this does not mean our fiscal challenges will be distributed with this statement. disappear anytime soon. As the Mid-Term Review of National Development Plan (NDP) 11 pointed out, the Mr Speaker, I wish to emphasise that the P101, decline in fiscal revenues is a long-term structural trend 479,200,000 cited above is not an approved TEC as not just a short-term problem; in essence, therefore, alleged by Honourable Reatile but it is a proposed TEC the pandemic has simply accelerated an ongoing trend. to be considered by this House. I also wish to indicate We now have one or two years to respond and adjust to that during budgeting, it often happens that additional achieve a fiscal sustainability, rather than a five to 10 priorities come to the fore and necessarily compete for years that we might have had otherwise”. I just want resources with already existing commitments. It is at to compare the two statements Mr Speaker, I will take this stage that these are assessed and in instances where one of the Budget Speeches by Mr Matambo, on the 7th the budget allows, are included in the main budget February, 2011. I will quote paragraph 79… proposals for consideration by Parliament. MR SPEAKER: Yes, please do. Mr Speaker, as I conclude my statement, I wish to indicate that traditionally, my ministry holds a MR REATILE: I quote Mr Speaker… Budget Pitsos for Honourable Members as part of the MR SPEAKER: Yes sir. consultative process prior to presentation of the Budget to Parliament. Regrettably, the 2020 Budget Pitso was MR REATILE: “We are demonstrating that not held due to complications caused by COVID-19. Government has the discipline to limit its expenditure Some of the issues arising from the debate could have and therefore, the Budget deficit. I wish to reemphasise been clarified at the Budget Pitso. that the total deficit approved by Parliament for the Lastly Mr Speaker, I wish to assure Honourable entire NDP 10 must not be exceeded”. Mr Speaker, I am Members that there is no desire not to be transparent trying to show Honourable Matsheka that if he has any about the Budget Preparation Process. The Budget intention to increase TEC, he should communicate in Documents are deposited in the ministry website for his Budget Speech. He is talking about the adjustment. the public to access. In addition, copies are available in Mr Speaker, in the expenditure book, he adjusted two Public Libraries and Village Reading Rooms primarily ministries which I have never mentioned here. He to cater for people who do not have access to the adjusted funds for the Ministry of Agriculture and website. My ministry will continue to find ways to Ministry of Basic Education which I have never talked enhance accessibility of the Budget information. I thank to because he has already informed us about adjustment you Mr Speaker. but he did not inform us that he is intending to increase TEC. He has just informed us that he increased TEC to MR SPEAKER: Order! Order! Honourable Members, P138 million and did not communicate in his speech. at this stage, we should allow questions and clarifications Mr Speaker, there is nowhere I misled the country with regarding the statement made by the Honourable this issue. If there are any misleading documents, then Minister of Finance and Economic Development, if any. it is the Budget Speech because it does not indicate

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the intention to increase or to request the House to Secondly Honourable Matsheka, Motswana was increase TEC. That is what I was saying Mr Speaker, listening to you when you responded to the question that we cannot increase TEC without the authority of about the difference between P2 billion and P2.4 billion Parliament. It would not be an issue if it was included in relation to COVID-19, so they might question you. in the speech because I will know that everything is in Are you insinuating that they have to study these tables order. I thank you. for themselves? I am saying this because in future, you might claim that you do not recall talking about P2.4 MR SPEAKER: Thank you Honourable Reatile. billion? We wonder whether our economy is on good Honourable Dr Matsheka, you want to add to that? hands because you keep on denying everything that you DR MATSHEKA: Yes Mr Speaker. said. Thank you. DR MATSHEKA: Thank you Mr Speaker. Honourable MR SPEAKER: Please do. Kekgonegile, are you saying Motswana should read DR MATSHEKA: Honourable Reatile, I mentioned through these documents whereas they have Members that it is important to take time to teach and make one of Parliament from various constituents as their representatives, who are supposed to assist them and another aware of all the documents which I presented. explain the tables to them? If you are the ones who It is clear that people do not read and understand all misinterpret these tables and fail to understand what the tables and the Budget Speech like we wanted. You the adjustments are, then it is a problem. We believe mentioned that they are irregular, unprocedural and that as Honourable Members, you have to study these unethical, and that alone is to belittle and to simplify documents and understand them. You have to seek the procedure that we are following as a Government, clarity where you do not understand so that we can as a Ministry of Finance. The fact that I did not include assist you, by so doing, you will not mislead Batswana. it in the Budget speech does not mean you cannot go I foresee the danger of the leadership that does not read, through the tables for yourself, maybe we must set aside that makes assumptions and handles issues in a political a particular day, where you will get a chance to ask manner. It is dangerous to have leaders who do not questions because this Budget was given to you in the study, those who assume things, those who handle issues form of tables, not a speech. You have to read the Budget in a political manner without reading what is written in so that you can see where the adjustments are made. The the budget. So Honourable Kekgonegile I urge you to fact that you rushed to paragraph 38 and the speech by read the tables provided so that when you comment on Mr Matambo also indicates that you do not understand the Committee of Supply, you do not just rush through, what the economy is made up of and the sections which you should read and understand where this country is must be followed. It does not mean this Parliament will heading, otherwise we are going to sit here responding not get the chance to assess this proposal. We have not to allegations which the initiator is disputing, he is yet finalised our Budget. The truth is, as Parliament, changing statements that he did not read the figures. you are the ones who make decisions as to whether you support what is tabled before you, you have to discuss The second issue is the P2.4 billion, we explained that it and make the final decision. You are the only ones the P2.4 billion you are talking about was a submission who can adjust this TEC therefore, it is inappropriate for as a budget number. So today I am giving you the final you to stand here and tell people that you have adjusted figures which were agreed on. If you are now following without the approval of Parliament. That is not true. allegations regarding the Personal Protective Equipment Thank you Mr Speaker. (PPE), That is why I responded to Honourable Saleshando earlier that, I do not recall that issue but MR KEKGONEGILE: Thank you Mr Speaker. Thank when I get to the office I will try to find out where that you Honourable Matsheka. Honourable Matsheka, are P2.4 is because there are a lot of figures and they are you saying Motswana who is listening at home must confusing. Thank you. not know when your Budget figures change? The truth is, this Budget is not only made for Parliament, it MR TSHERE: Thank you very much Honourable was also made for Batswana. Are you suggesting that Speaker, and thank you very much Honourable Batswana must read through these tables so that they Matsheka. I am worried as well that your ministry all can understand that figures from your three documents the time keeps us guessing what is happening with the have changed? figures. Last time when SONA (State of the Nation

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Address) was addressed, they talked about P4 billion people, who rather than understanding first, they throw being used for COVID-19. Now you are coming up with allegations before asking questions. a figure, and at that time they talked about P2.1 billion only, we had no idea where the other amount was. You So, I fully agree with you my colleague that, it is came back again and explained that the figures are P4.3 important to explain these things because the reason billion, P2 billion is allocated to Health, P2.3 billion I came here I know that Batswana were going to get was a supplementary budget, P1 billion ended up being confused that issues on financial management are not allocated to Health, we have currently procured P1.3 followed up, whereas that is not the case. So I agree million worth of equipment. My question is, Honourable with you Honourable Member that, we have to improve Matsheka, I do not know whether it is the nature of your and work harder in terms of information dissemination ministry to hide figures and only give Parliament figures more than the Office of the President (OP). when on a need to know. If Members of Parliament do Let me also indicate that we have translated the Budget not ask, you do not tell us the truth. You keep quiet and Speech to Setswana so there are booklets available let us swim in a pool of confusion so this is a concern for the public so that they can know how the Budget Honourable Minister. Is that the nature of your Ministry was allocated. Those who can manage can access the to do that? website of the ministry and read the Setswana version. Thank you Mr Speaker. MR SPEAKER: Honourable Tshere, the reason I allowed questions was to clarify the statement by the MR SPEAKER: Honourable Lesedi! Minister in relation to the increase in the …(Inaudible)… So if you take us back to the previous figures of P1.2, …Silence… P4.3, then I do not know what your deal is. If you want MR SPEAKER: Honourable Lesedi, you are supposed to ask the Minister on his statement, I will ask you to to look at your screen, and you will see something on do so. If you want to ask about the other things, I will your screen which you should click to unmute yourself. then ask you to find another time. So, I am not going to allow those questions to be answered because they are MR LESEDI: Thank you Mr Speaker. I actually wanted irrelevant. to understand. It shows that there is an increase of P138 million so the understanding was that Minister should MR MANGWEGAPE-HEALY: Thank you Mr explain to us in this House in order to be on the same level Speaker. Thank you for your update Honourable of understanding as he indicated that we are clueless. Matsheka. My short question is, do you not think it is We want to be on the same level of understanding necessary that on a regular basis, you must have press regarding the P138 million. Honourable Reatile noticed conferences with the media to explain these issues to these figures and that is when our attention drew to them bring Batswana into confidence because the era we and we realised that indeed they have increased by P138 are living in, there is a lot of fake news and political million. My point is, he should not respond to convince posturing which ends up confusing Batswana. Do us, he should first explain this P138 million increase you not think it is high time that you had regular press so that we can be on the same level of understanding. briefings, and for Batswana to expect an update after My argument is that, he should explain to this House as every quarter, they will get an update and get facts Honourable Reatile indicated that there is disparity in rather than political issues? Thank you. terms of the figures which are written at the approved midterm review National Development Plan (NDP) 11 DR MATSHEKA: Thank you Honourable Healy. The and the current budget, why is there such a disparity. truth is, a lot of information is necessary to address That is my main question Mr Speaker. Thank you. lack of knowledge therefore, I agree with you that it is important to provide regular updates when time allows. DR MATSHEKA: Mr Speaker, I explained that perhaps Let me assure you that last week, we invited the media we have to improve on our engagement with Members unfortunately the majority were unable to connect as we of Parliament so that they understand the reports had anticipated. Therefore, I requested my officers as presented. That is why I suggested that sometimes you saw the Permanent Secretary, Dr Mandlebe doing if you do not understand ask. Maybe we should have interviews to try and explain these issues. Otherwise organised a workshop for you but now you are calling we are going to find ourselves being led by clueless for a workshop so that we can go through the entire

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table. I explained what the difference is, the problem is, of Parliament are not experts on issues of finance, when you do not understand, you do not ask. So there which is very true. I would like to know what went is nothing wrong with asking Honourable Lesedi when wrong because the culture has been, a week before the you notice such things. There was no time to explain presentation of the Budget in this House, the Finance to you which columns to look at to be able to see the and Estimates Committee is supposed to meet to discuss difference. Thank you Mr Speaker. it. The other culture is that a week before Parliament sits, the Minister can address Members of Parliament in MR REATILE: Thank you Mr Speaker. Let me thank a workshop. What could have gone wrong Honourable Dr Matsheka once again for his explanations but let me Member to avoid issues of pointing fingers at each other assure him that some of us do not need a workshop … because really our common goal is to have the Budget (Inaudible)…on issues of the Budget in Botswana not at all. We have read these estimates up to the last page; approved? Thank you. Page 30. That is why you see in Page 27 Honourable DR MATSHEKA: Thank you Honourable Moswaane. Matsheka indicated that he took P65, 114, 446 of HIV I think the truth is that I do not control the program which does not have a vote. In the Government of of Parliament, we submit the papers to Parliament Botswana, we operate with votes, you cannot say you took P165 million without stating which vote you took according to the prescribed law. So, maybe it could it from. All the other figures you have stated from which have been better if things were done the way you put votes you have vired the funds, so stop undermining it to avoid issues that, we were not able to have the Honourable Members by saying they are clueless. same idea. So let me say I agree with you that it will be Members of Parliament came here with the knowledge important in future to not leave out such because they to peruse the documents as you have submitted them. cause confusion and lack of understanding of what has Also, you should know that there is nowhere you have been put before you. Thank you Honourable Member. requested from Parliament, I still repeat that there is nowhere in your Budget where you made a request to MR TSHERE: Thank you Honourable Speaker. Getting Parliament to increase the Total Estimated Cost (TEC) back to that issue because on my side I am not able to by P138 million. I do not know who read the figures raise a point of procedure or anything. Mr Speaker, I upside down because they are the same figures which was introducing my debate. My issue is, is the Minister you have talked about. That is why I am not talking telling Parliament that if they need clarification they about the figures of P104 million of Agriculture, P20 will request for it, is he not explaining anything? He million of Basic Education because you have talked has left us guessing in his ministry because I see this about adjustments, so we are following what you said. pattern developing, whereby you are given an answer We have a culture Honourable Matsheka, of how we do only when you want it, when you do not ask the just things in this country and this House. I thank you. keep quiet and it is assumed that you understand. I want to know if that is the procedure we are going to proceed MR SPEAKER: No, he has heard you. I am not sure with? Thank you. whether you want to add to that Minister before we call Honourable Moswaane. MR SPEAKER: Honourable Tshere, let us ask you to repeat yourself again because there is some interference DR MATSHEKA: You can call Honourable Moswaane. with what you were saying. Please repeat your question again, so that we do not interfere, and you can be clear. MR SPEAKER: …(Inaudible)... MR TSHERE: Oh! Thank you Honourable Speaker …Silence… and I thank you for giving me the opportunity again. MR SPEAKER: …(Inaudible)… gadgets are slow. It was not like I was deviating from the topic earlier Honourable Moswaane, they are going to send an icon on, I was making an introduction. What I realise is that, on which you should click. in this Parliament, when a Minister comes here to give us the figures, he does not mention other figures, and MR MOSWAANE: Mr Speaker, am I audible? then the assumption is that, we will just understand. So only when Honourable Members ask questions and MR SPEAKER: Yes Honourable Member. probe him, that is when he provides answers. So I am MR MOSWAANE: Let me humbly comment on saying, is that the right procedure that every time the the issue by Honourable Matsheka that Members Honourable Minister comes here, he just comes with

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empty promises, without clearly explaining to us what is have been refusing when we say we are not going to happening with the funds? That is my concern and I want have an official 30 minutes break at 4:00 p.m. when to know if that is how they operate, will we continue to we are trying to save time because as things go, at least see this, whereby he conceals some of the figures so that 11 Members of Parliament are not going to be able we cannot have the full information whereas we have to to debate the Second Reading, unless somehow, we approve Budget Mr Speaker. Thank you. agree to extend the hours, a day by one hour, until the tenth day of the Second Reading. So I think we have MR SPEAKER: Honourable Tshere, before the done justice, let us go back to the budget. Thank you Minister answers, I thought he said due to COVID-19 Honourable Minister. and other things, they would have liked to have the Pitso after the papers have been given to you the Members APPROPRIATION 2021/2022 BILL, 2021 of Parliament (MPs), so that these things are explained. (NO. 2 OF 2021) He agrees that there is need to have a day, even after his speech, to go through this Budget so that Members can Second Reading ask questions relating to anything, that may be in the (Resumed Debate) figures or in his speech. MR SPEAKER: Order! Order! Honourable Members. Thirdly, that he has no intention of hiding any figures, The debate on this Bill is resuming. When the House indeed that the figures are before you, it is a matter of adjourned yesterday Honourable Molebatsi was on interpretation so that we understand in the same way. the floor debating and he was left with 13 minutes 24 But I cannot do the honours of explaining when Minister seconds. After Honourable Molebatsi we will call upon is right here. the Honourable Minister of Local Government and DR MATSHEKA: Thank you Mr Speaker. Let me Rural Development Honourable Molale, who has been thank Honourable Tshere for asking that because it is interrupted by technology. important to discuss, especially the Budget Speech, and ASSISTANT MINISTER OF INVESTMENT, the Budget itself. We should differentiate between the TRADE AND INDUSTRY (MR MOLEBATSI): Mr Budget Speech and Budget. Budget Speech talks about Speaker, I just wanted to say before I start my debate, the Budget as it has been presented, and we cannot read I made a request yesterday and from the Clerk, for my it all like some were saying, we did not include some time to be increased. I had yielded for Honourable of the paragraphs, we could have read it the whole Minister Manake to make a clarification, however due day if everything was included. So the importance of to technological issues she was not able to connect, but commenting on that Budget Speech with due respect, my time was deducted. Therefore, I kindly request for is to enable the asking of questions from those who extra five minutes to compensate for the time that she understood and those who did not understand. That took, the 13 minutes should be increased by five more is why we allow Members to ask questions and minutes. I thank you Mr Speaker. clarifications because when you do that, you know that they are asking the right question, and they want to MR SPEAKER: You are even using up more minutes, understand. The problem is where you stand here and take the floor please. say there is corruption and people are unethical. MR MOLEBATSI: Mr Speaker, I cannot hear you, is So the way this Budget is, where you can, you have to it not possible? ask a question about anything you do not understand, in that case there is no one who will not understand. MR SPEAKER: Please continue, I will see. We will explain. As you ask questions, when you realise MR MOLEBATSI: Thank you Mr Speaker, you are our something and you want to ask, we will answer. Thank leader, you will definitely see. Mr Speaker, where I had you Mr Speaker. stopped yesterday, I spoke at length particularly putting MR SPEAKER: I think Honourable Members you have more emphasis on what should be done in the rural areas done justice to what Honourable Reatile had observed. that, the budget should focus on schools, hospitals, the health sector as we can see that it is overwhelmed due to We still have a budget to go through and as I have COVID -19. It should focus on infrastructure, because observed on the past two days, Honourable Members we are no longer able to source the funds from where

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we used to. Mr Speaker, I will leave most of the issues Result Based Budgeting is the one that can help us. for my colleague at the ministry, issues dealing with Countries are far ahead, countries under Organisation business, she will discuss them in her presentation. Now for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) coming to the Budget Mr Speaker, we do realise that are using it, the United States of America, many States Honourable Dr Matsheka came up with a new type of have already come up with a law called budgeting for budgeting which we welcome with open hands called results which they implemented in 2010, and they are Zero Based Budgeting... basically referring to Result Based Budgeting. When the public funds have been disbursed, let us ensure that MR SPEAKER: Honourable Molebatsi, you are being they are used prudently. Mr Speaker, I also said when interrupted, I do not know what is happening, your voice a budget is drafted, we should make sure that it covers is not flowing as I know it. There is some turbulence everybody. I know that funds cannot be enough to cover somewhere, try again please. Your connections are not the whole country. appearing to be what we expect them to be. There is what is called value for money, that we should MR MOLEBATSI: Mr Speaker, what I have observed ensure that it is efficient and effective. It should be this side as I am debating is that, there is someone who ensured that where the funds are taken to, it is effective. is unmuting and muting me as I continue debating. The We should not just inject funds in there. I always give point I was still on Mr Speaker was that, Honourable an example of the Integrated Support Programme for Matsheka has come up with a new initiative that we are Arable Agriculture Development (ISPAAD), in our area not used to, called Zero Based Budgeting. When you in Mmadinare, if I may give an example, people would look at what is written, the literatures available and be enrolled for ISPAAD and we would be sure that they experiences of those who practiced it, it is fast and it are going to plough, after ploughing, after getting the has good results. The way it is, it has what is called Government funds, they run away, they would be afraid effectiveness, it shows how the funds are going to be of elephants, so basically we are ploughing for elephants. used, execution of plan task. Most of the time it shows These are things that going forward, we would consider the funds that are going to be used, the correctness that there should be efficiency and effectiveness in the ...(Inaudible)…estimated expenditure, and how true that use of funds belonging to Batswana. The other thing is going to be. It is going to be efficient, and it yields fast that I would like to emphasise it the three Es; Economy, results, but he did not explain where Zero Budgeting Efficiency and Effectiveness, I have the fourth E which was used in major companies like Ford Motor, Kellogg is Equity and inclusiveness. Going forward we should Corporation, and the United Nations, it came with the ensure that the budget covers what I mentioned, where programmes reform of the United Nations, brought by everyone benefits from the budget; I mentioned here Kofi Annan, may his soul rest in peace. This programme yesterday that it has been a while since we saw some does not come alone, it has a Result based Management, developments in my area. The Honourable Member of it has to show that it has positive consequences. It Parliament for Boteti last time also said that their area it goes hand in hand with what I said yesterday that is also dry. If you were listening, there is one Member maybe we should change the way we think, how we of Parliament who said in their constituency they are do things, starting from the leadership and do what is expecting five clinics from the National Development called Result Based Management. Anyone who has Plan 11, and this could bring confusion among people; been given assignments by the Government should be so going forward we have to look at this matter carefully. checked to find out whether they produce results. We In the United Kingdom, they have what is called Whole should not consider the qualifications or experience of Government Approach (WGA), the Government that one has. Therefore, Zero Based Budgeting goes covers everyone and everyone tells themselves that hand in hand with what I am talking about of Result they are part of it. Unlike now whereby when there is Based Budgeting, as well as Result Based Management. budget, some areas would just be spectators, and we I still want to emphasize the fact that, we should look would see that clinics are built in some places, storm at whether people are productive, if they are not then water drainages in one village, phones being connected, they should account. This is the only way we can move and so forth; yet some of us would just be watching. I forward as Government to achieve what we have been know that it is the type of planning that we have been talking about. Therefore I am reiterating this point whilst using since time immemorial. Maybe going forward we Honourable Matsheka is listening that in Botswana, should consider budgeting in that manner. Let there be

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what is called a value for money office, so that once MR MOLEBATSI: Mr Speaker, I am complaining the funds are issued, there should be a Government about this, there is someone who mutes me. I am office which is looking into these things. I am talking being muted when I debate. Go ahead Honourable Dr about these things in advance, they might not be there Gobotswang. at the moment. When there is a value for money office, it would be ensured that the Government funds are DR GOBOTSWANG: Mr Speaker, Honourable utilised effectively. Assistant Minister, sorry. Assistant Minister Molebatsi, there is a common statement which is made by some Mr Speaker, we were saying there are no funds. We members of the ruling party that developments are have insufficient funds, we are no longer generating reserved for Constituencies which are led by Members revenue and it means we should make some cuts on of Botswana Democratic Party (BDP). I know that how the Government is spending money. Yes, it is Mmadinare has been self-governing for the past 54 years, even though it was under Botswana Democratic indeed true, one of things that was said was downsizing Party (BDP) so, what are you saying about that issue the public service, their numbers are high. We can no Honourable Assistant Minister? Thank you. longer afford to have a huge public service and I support that. I believe that you can get into an office and find MR SPEAKER: Honourable Molebatsi, is that your someone stamping papers, move to the other one and issue? find someone stapling papers, sometime you will find that it is unnecessary to have many people. MR MOLEBATSI: Hey! The answer is that it is not the case because you can see that as I said, developments Minister, I know that our fellow Honourable Members are lagging behind, which means that developments might not support the idea of downsizing employees are not reserved for Members of Botswana Democratic even though it is true, so where should we take them after Party as you were saying. Let me proceed Mr Speaker. cutting them from work? I long said that programmes are MS MONNAKGOTLA: On a point of clarification Mr there, we should just revise the available programmes Speaker. Thank you Mr Speaker and good afternoon. like Citizen Entrepreneurial Development Agency Minister, are you saying that public servants who are (CEDA) so that we can have a programme which is your age mates can be given packages and leave public specifically for the public servants who have quit their service and that programmes can be established for jobs. More especially supporting elderly people who them? I would also like to ask him whether all the are 50 years upwards so that when they volunteer to officers are business minded, who will all venture into leave public service, we give them something, it can be business when they leave the public service? Minister, funds or to train them to start businesses. This is very are you saying that after they retire, they should be important. given packages to go and start businesses? Thank you MR SPEAKER: Dr Gobotswang, you have your hand Mr Speaker. up. MR MOLEBATSI: Thank you Honourable …Silence… Monnakgotla. No, it is still not wrong for one to take the package and go and stay at home. What I am MR SPEAKER: Honourable Reatile, your hand is also saying is that, we should reduce the burden that comes up, what for? Honourable Monnakgotla, everyone in with a huge public service. I assure you Honourable row three, why are your hands up? Monnakgotla, most of the public servants love this idea. People are just in the offices because if they can go HONOURABLE MEMBER: Mr Speaker. outside, they will not have anything to do. Some are still MR SPEAKER: Dr Gobotswang. paying mortgages and school fees for their children. If they can go and wok for themselves, their lives will go DR GOBOTSWANG: Yes, it jammed Mr Speaker. on and we would have alleviated this huge burden from I wanted clarification from Honourable Assistant the government. Minister. Mr Speaker, we were talking about State Owned MR SPEAKER: Honourable Molebatsi, Honourable Enterprises (SOEs), that we should also reduce the Dr Gobotswang is asking for clarification. financial burden that the government is carrying, more

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especially the underperforming enterprises. We said the President Dr Masisi, the government that Minister that we should discard others and so forth. I loved the Matsheka and I are part of, PPP policy is going to be idea where he said that we should privatise them. If implemented. It is going well in other countries. If you we can discard them all, maybe that will increase the can look at countries like Algeria, Angola, Benin and unemployment rate and if they can be handed over to Burundi, PPP has implemented a lot of developments. the private sector they will continue employing people. This is something that we have to consider.

We should pay attention to it. For example, if the We were saying that the government should generate consideration was to discard SPEDU, and then someone income through tax, as we saw an increase in the Value or Mr Molosi shows interest in SPEDU, he can discuss Added Tax (VAT). It is important and there is nothing we it with the government and then take over and see how can do. We knew that it is going to happen because our he can generate income. Someone who is interested in VAT is the lowest when compared to other countries. I Air Botswana can take over and so forth. was going to understand if someone said that we should wait for COVID to pass just like in other countries. VAT Let me highlight that the remaining ones should be was reduced in Kenya because of COVID. We should handed over to SOEs so that they can manage them. come to a situation whereby we tax people in such a way Public servants like me and others are not all into that the country can benefit. businesses. We must fully corporatize those SOEs… It is only befitting that he includes the Carbon tax like HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Inaudible)… he did. Plastic levy; let us generate income through it. MR SPEAKER: On what point Honourable Ramogapi? We should collect tax by all means. When one buys petrol at P8.00 per litre, they pay storage and handling MR RAMOGAPI: Thank you Mr Speaker. levy charged at 8 thebe if my memory serves me well. Ever since it was introduced maybe the Government has MR SPEAKER: On what point? not been collecting it. Dr Matsheka should enforce the MR RAMOGAPI: Can you hear me Mr Speaker? collection of that levy and those who owe it must be followed up to pay as they are big companies. I think MR SPEAKER: Yes, on what point? it was introduced in 2009 and people have not been MR RAMOGAPI: Oh! I thought you were saying that paying it… I should debate Mr Speaker. MR SPEAKER: Honourable Molebatsi, one minute left. MR SPEAKER: No, you are wasting the Minister’s time. Honourable Molebatsi procced. MR MOLEBATSI: Thank you Mr Speaker. I must emphasise on the need to produce results that as we MR MOLEBATSI: Mr Speaker, I was saying that SOEs strive forward. Everyone must produce results, failure should be given all the powers. As the government, as to do so, the person must be given their package and let Ministers, if it is for our ministry, we should just do go, rulers included. Thank you Mr Speaker. oversight. Give the board powers to appoint Chief Executive Officer (CEO) and monitor SOEs. We should MINISTER OF LOCAL GOVERNMENT AND not appoint people for them going forward, these are RURAL DEVELOPMENT (MR MOLALE): Thank some of the things that we should assess. Maybe they you Mr Speaker. Yesterday I was interrupted from can be effective and produce good results. debating due to technical challenges. That is why I am grateful for the opportunity you have given me to debate We also said that the government is transforming so here with you at the Chamber. that we can see how we can carry out projects, for example Public Private Partnerships (PPPs). We have Mr Speaker, yesterday when I started debating I indicated been talking about this thing from way back, the my support for Dr Matsheka’s budget. The Budget he truth is that the PPP policy was long drafted in 2000. has set before us is almost similar to what we debated It was there in the 2002/2003 budget. I am telling the in the last Parliament sitting when we welcomed and truth, it was there. We talked about it in the National approved the Economic Recovery and Transformation Development Plan (NDP) 9. We are hoping that it will Plan (ERTP); recovery since COVID-19 has struck. be implemented under this government which is led by When you go through the pages of his budget, you can

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see that it is a response to the effects brought about by and thoughtfulness on the part of the mover of this COVID. There are two things that one has to consider, Appropriation Bill. He thought, evaluated, reviewed that is the social welfare of Batswana especially those and saw that we are treading a narrow path, and for us who are disadvantaged and the economy. Although to cross over this bridge what should be done without there are some who are denying, I have gone through necessarily disadvantaging the majority. Dr Matsheka’s budget and I am monitoring it that when it comes to social welfare, he has done a lot. I can cite Mr Speaker, we must realise like I said that, the examples Mr Speaker, he has allocated P1.3 billion to economy has not been affected in Botswana only. All Industry Support Fund so that the economy does not the countries are trying to engage in recovery. I can give collapse. I do not know if that is misusing Government an example of how our relationship with those countries funds. He has allocated funds to welfare, which I used is. Right now in America, the incoming President is and still using not only to take care of the destitutes talking about $1.9 trillion recovery. He is talking about but also to ensure that at primary schools they are in a increasing the purchasing power of America. Now link position to control the spread of COVID-19 to pupils. that with us this side, purchasing power means there These things Mr Speaker are an indication that our will be more purchasing our diamonds and the income ERTP is on track and it is being implemented. It might will increase. Those are the things we should consider not be covering the whole country yet or all sectors of instead of appearing as if we are opposing mindlessly. economy but there is always a first step to everything. I want to talk about something which was mentioned I believe we should support Dr Matsheka and BDP by one Honourable Member. There is one who wanted Government so that all that is available in ERTP can be to mar with contempt that the reason why sugar tax is implemented swiftly. introduced is to discourage old women from adding The funds that I am talking about must be sourced sugar to their tea and soft porridge. That is cheap somewhere. We know that diamonds have been politics. When you read Paragraph 134, it talks about responsible for our income revenue and due to beverages that, for some of us who have been taught COVID-19, the sale of diamonds has not been that healthy habits have learnt that we should not consume much. The only income available is tax. I want to too much sugar. They tell us that a 300ml tin of coke has hasten to disagree with those who are saying the poor a cupful of sugar. When an old woman adds sugar to her are taxed while the rich are not. If we could have read tea, she puts in two teaspoons in that cup. Therefore, it Dr Matsheka’s Budget Speech, he said we are moving is wrong to compare two different things. It confuses from 36 to 48 thousand per annum. The current system people and makes them to conclude that Government is is that when one earns more than P36 000 per annum, not doing justice to them. So I encourage us to say these that is P3, 000 per month, that person is eligible to things accordingly, instead of belittling them. pay tax. Right now he is saying we are going to start taxing people who get P4, 000. Most of us know that I will move on to the second issue Mr Speaker. He the majority of our employees are not eligible to pay talked about public service rightsizing, I support it but tax. Most of us are there which means he is sensitive to not what others are saying about it. There are sections the needs of the lower income bracket. There is no how and procedures observed when downsizing the public it can be said that he is taxing the poor and leaving out service so that it does not become challenging for them. the rich. We have what is known as Early Exit Policy which was implemented in 2004, it allows us to have discussions We are also aware that in Value Added Tax (VAT), there with unions and the affected, public servants. Normally are some things which are zero rated, this enables the when a person retires, they had already accumulated a disadvantaged to afford them at lower prices. I oppose pension and if it is an early exit, it specifies the amount this thing that only the poor are taxed and not the rich. It that can be added to their package. Additionally, I would is misleading Motswana. like you to note the interconnectedness of this issue. We must also realise that be it petrol price, VAT or When processing the package for early exit, if we give a levy, in the region of Southern Africa, Botswana is still person more than what they would get when they retire, charging lower than these countries. Even when we they have to go through counselling as well as advise increase, we are still going to be lower than most of the them to venture into business or find other ways through countries I am talking about. This shows understanding which they may earn a living. So we have programmes

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which offer public servants training on programmes taught about community score card last time, so these they can use to earn a living before they go. It is not like are the tools which we have to use to ensure that people this process is done haphazardly. from villages make sufficient profit as well as ensure that Government assist them in that manner. I usually We have procedures which allow us to freeze the vacant tell residents of my constituency that, Government posts like Honourable Matsheka mentioned, no one will be affected or fired on this account. We also have MR SPEAKER: Honourable Saleshando, you had your other posts which some progressed from, so we are also hand up. going to freeze them. The most important thing which I would like to emphasise is that, most of the posts …Silence… which will not greatly affect our work flow if no one is MR SALESHANDO: Yes, Mr Speaker, but he already appointed for them are those which are usually found in passed the point which I wanted to ask about, so let me the Government enclave here. This is mainly because not disturb him. we have not achieved our staffing norms in our villages. MR MOLALE: Thank you. We usually tell villagers For example, a clinic with maternity ward, it has been that Government stated that those who are engaged stipulated that for it to function effectively, it must in SMMEs, Company Registration and Income Tax have a certain number of midwives or nurses, operate Returns are not required from them because they 24 hours and so on and so forth. As it is now, we have operate small businesses, they are assisted so that not yet reached that level. So we must strike a balance their businesses may grow, so they are only required between rightsizing and meeting the requirements of to register to supply schools. The only requirement is staffing norms of the services that we provide. It will that, they have to supply them with quality food because assist us, we must also note that it may be that, it is not they feed children who are vulnerable. This is going to like the public service is oversubscribed, that is there assist because they are not going to develop foodborne is a skewness towards administrative and other support diseases. So there is a confusion because they are usually staff but the relevant skills at the clinics, agricultural asked to give Company Return or register company or demonstration and elsewhere are short staffed. That is pay Income Tax Returns, but that is not required. why I am saying, we actually follow some procedures as Another issue is delaying payments at Councils. I far as rightsizing is concerned. A discussion is engaged discussed it with them time and again last year that, if a and there are many channels which may be used when person supplied you with their goods and you have used rightsizing public servants. them, ensure that you pay them. It must not take four to Moving on Mr Speaker, I want to address the economy nine months because sometimes that particular person and its growth. The heartbeat of any economy, borrowed some inputs from somewhere. So Batswana especially in Africa is the Small, Medium and Micro must know these things such that they can inform us Enterprises (SMMEs) and Botswana is no exception. whenever the procedures which I listed today are not This Government has made efforts and is still trying observed, we will assist them. by all means to promote the SMMEs so that they may Mr Speaker, let me briefly talk about… generate income. In my ministry, we have a strategy called Local Economic Development Strategy, which MR SPEAKER: Honourable Healy! says; we have SMMEs so Government has to buy from HONOURABLE MEMBER: Clarification Mr them and take those goods to Government institutions Speaker. like schools. We also changed school menus to suit what they produce. The only challenge is, some procedures MR MOLALE: Granted. are sometimes not observed but have to be corrected because our strategy is clear. We sometimes have MR MANGWEGAPE-HEALY: On a point of situations where we have some middleman who mostly clarification. Thank you Honourable Molale for this cheat farmers. I am referring to situations where you response. Honourable Molale, you mentioned the will find that an egg cost P2.50 at school but you will issue of timely payments but Government is already find that a farmer actually sold it to someone forP1. committed to paying those who run businesses within You will wonder, who benefited from P1.50? we were two weeks. Since your ministry also deals with SMMEs

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like you mentioned, how far are you in terms of paying further decentralise nearer to where the services are them in a period of two weeks? If at all you are still far, provided. what are you doing to ensure that you pay within the set time frame? Thank you Honourable. The other thing Mr Speaker is interconnectedness of the things we have been discussing concerning the public MR MOLALE: Thank you Honourable Healy. We service and services at the constituencies. In most cases decided to pay them within that period because we when public servants are transferred to the villages there know that taking long to pay others may collapse is no accommodation. We have indicated that Ipelegeng their businesses. That is why I and those assisting me has been transformed, it can construct infrastructure and compliment constituency projects. In some cases committed ourselves to visit Councils and make them Ipelegeng can pay labour for constituency projects and realise this thing as well as assess things through constituencies can only buy materials, that is what we monitoring and evaluation to see if we fall into that discussed and I implore you Members of Parliament category. The problem is that, companies with pending to work as a team and share this information with the payments are threatened that since they reported, they public. will never be awarded a tender. This practice has to be reproached. I appeal to Batswana that they should not In conclusion, I will repeat what I once said, there are sit back and be afraid to report because they might not actually two things we need; it is water at Goodhope- be awarded tenders as it is the same thing just because Mabule. We know that in the previous Parliament in they are going to be paid after 12 months and their 2019, people misled others when the budget for water business is going to be affected. Honourable Healy, reticulation project for Morolong and other areas was supposed to be passed alleging that, it is the Botswana we are still trying to fight this practice because it is a Democratic Party’s tactics to buy campaign materials. I mindset issue. It is not the issue of lack of funds or that responded by saying that people facing that challenge those who can process payments are not there. Or that are the ones feeling the pinch. However I am happy as the Government does not care. It is a mindset issue of Honourable Mzwinila has started the project, there will the client and those providing a service. As I indicated, be water supply at Morolong. I am talking to Honourable the Community Score Card (SCC) which Mr Speaker Segokgo regarding the road issue. On Sunday we agreed taught us about recently should take us a long way in we would tour to see how he can assist more especially ensuring that we check in a civil manner to see if they at Borobadilepe, Sekhutlane and Gathwane. are being implemented because they affect household level economies. MR SPEAKER: Thank you very much Honourable Minister. Mr Speaker, the other point is infrastructure at the constituencies. We are in a situation where most of our MR MOLALE: Thank you sir. infrastructure is deteriorating, the current budget did not MR SPEAKER: I should give the floor to a Member of cater for such. We should see streetlights being repaired. the opposition. I implore that in this year’s Budget we should not throw away this zero-based budgeting. We should focus on the MR RAMOGAPI (PALAPYE): Thank you Mr existing infrastructures and repairing them because if Speaker. Let me start by thanking you for affording we do not do that we will be destroying our foundation. me this opportunity and this time. First let me thank People are not going to be happy to see that the things Honourable Matsheka. As the opposition we have been which used to benefit them no longer do. accused of not being grateful. I thank him for three things. The first thing is that Honourable Matsheka was The other issue is decentralisation; I recently indicated transparent when delivering his speech. He indicated and even promised that, I have started decentralisation that there is no money, the country’s coffers are in a consultations across Councils. If it was not the COVID deficit. If it were some people they could have hidden surge in December I could be carrying on with the this fact in all ways possible. Although I do not agree consultations. I have already covered North East, with the concept that we are running at a deficit, I thank Ghanzi and Kgalagadi; they agree with the Draft him for communicating such. Decentralisation Policy. Our target is that in June sitting, we should present this draft policy to Parliament for Secondly, I thank him for relaying such things in public review and see how we can implement it. We should that the country is infested with corruption. He backed up

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this statement with figures that if there are 100 projects, recently already have internal roads and hospitals. 40 will go to the dustbin or there are demolished, Taxis are not there in Palapye. Ambulances which which translates to 37 per cent. Such high rate of transport patients, vehicles of the Fire Department corruption which he disclosed that the Government of which extinguish fires Mr Speaker cannot go anywhere the Botswana Democratic Party is partaking in, if it was because there are no roads. There are severe potholes, someone else, he could have swept it under the rag but and like right now that it has rained, the situation is bad. he publicly announced that Botswana Democratic Party is corrupt. So I want to thank Honourable Matsheka for When we talk about roads, on their sides Mr Speaker, that. He also indicated that there will be downsizing of there are supposed to be storm water drainage; trenches the public service. He said that regardless of the fact for storm water. Mr Speaker, this water is getting into that the Government of the Botswana Democratic Party people’s homes, but no, people are just relaxed, and promised that it will create a lot of jobs, more than 200 when we try to say anything we know that they are going 000. I thank him for mentioning that issue and informing to use COVID-19 as an excuse saying no, we are still Batswana. dealing with COVID-19. Some of them are enjoying themselves while we are dealing with COVID-19. In the body of my debate Mr Speaker, I want to start with my constituency; I want to update the Minister Mr Speaker, I was saying we should agree on the time, concerning the huge challenge we are facing at Palapye. so that they do not use my time, I started at 3:30 p.m. I At our hospital, old women, women and men, come as have timed myself here. early as 6 o’clock and stay the whole there, they leave at When I get into education Mr Speaker, let me thank the 3 o’clock in the morning. In other words, a person comes in at 6 a.m. then queue outside, this is disheartening. teachers of Palapye. Let me start with Palapye Secondary We lodged a complaint to Dikoloti and Lelatisitswe School (PSS) which obtained position number 1, I thank went to view the situation, all he said was, ‘ah! How the Headmaster Mr Kefilwe and his staff including the embarrassing.” After saying that, I thought he will cleaners and cooks because they worked together to initiate a programme to address the situation. The most achieve this sterling performance. Let me say people painful thing is, they are refusing to build a hospital. It of God, you worked hard amidst the difficult situation, has long been requested during the time when Former when there were no funds, books; there was nothing, President Mogae was still a Member of Parliament. Just but you managed to utilise the available resources to imagine that, if Former President Mogae was a selfish achieve your goals. That has really made me happy as a person he could have those developments distributed Member of Parliament. to his constituency during that time. It has long been Let me also thank Mmaphula Community Junior included in NDP during Former President Mogae’s era. Secondary School, they also made an effort. They have Honourable Sebetela followed and he complained about a Merit. You tried despite the situation you are in ladies it. After him it was Goya also complaining about it. I am and gentlemen, and that is impressive. Let me say to now here and I am still complaining about it but I am not those at Mabogo Community Junior Secondary that, it is going to let it slide. I am going to make noise about this not like your results are poor. I understand the situation hospital until it is built. you are in, I will come back and give you support, and The disheartening part is that, there is no doctor or see what we can do to do better than this. nurse or any other health care worker. I want to inform Mr Speaker, I have to address this issue of poor working residents of Palapye to stop blaming nurses and doctors conditions for teachers. It is painful for teachers to work that they are not offering better health services. The for 30 years without getting a promotion. The poor problem is with the Botswana Democratic Party, not people are just there, they are determined to do their with nurses and doctors. The problem is with Dikoloti, job every day, and they are told that we want results the Botswana Democratic Party so do not blame nurses. as the target is 85 per cent. How will the people see There is nothing nurses and doctors can do because results when there is no accommodation? Just imagine they are understaffed. The situation is disheartening Mr in this situation of COVID-19 Mr Speaker, six of them Speaker. staying in one house! These things are heart-breaking. Mr Speaker, the problem of Palapye is roads Honourable There are no books and classrooms. Mr Speaker, in Member, smaller villages which just came into existence my constituency, like I was saying a few days ago, in

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primary schools, the numbers are very high that some Mr Speaker, let us talk about hotel and tourism. We students attend classes on tents and churches. The have a serious problem, people at my constituency at situation is bad. That is why I am saying, even though Palapye, are working in one of the hotel that is also they are working in these difficult situations, students, here in Gaborone, called Avani. This hotel Mr Speaker, teachers and the Headmaster have managed. The results does everything they feel like with the employees. Even they obtained I am saying my children, hold on, I will when they are given a subsidy and told to pay their support you forever. employees, they do not do that, they spend that money. They do not care about our people, and nothing is not Mr Speaker, I want to quickly address the issue of land done because we are told that Members of Parliament allocation. It is very overwhelming that people were last were accommodated there and the hotel has some allocated plots in 2004/2005. Someone has to wait for associations with Domkrag (Botswana Democratic a plot until they get old. When that person is given a Party). We are saying, Batswana can see these things Mr plot, they are old and do not have the strength to develop Speaker, and what these people are doing is not okay by that plot. That is why there is poverty which is created creating a sect, and they are associated with the ruling by Domkrag (Botswana Democratic Party), in that even party. when land is available, and it has been identified, they Mr Speaker, I want to thank Citizen Entrepreneurial still fail to allocate plots. These people of Domkrag Development Agency (CEDA), even if it may have (Botswana Democratic Party), we are saying may God problems, for the little that it gives to the people, to help us to take them out of power because it seems like create jobs. That is something. It they could have been they will do something, if God can assist us maybe we given more funds, because there are no jobs. They can go somewhere. Mr Speaker, employment and human should at least give more funds to businesspeople so resource; Honourable Matsheka indicated that 24.5 per that, they can create more jobs. cent of the people, and closer to what we call quarter Mr Speaker, I always say that, many jobs can be created of Batswana, are unemployed. Are they not wondering at Morupule because there is coal; it can produce where the Domkrag (Botswana Democratic Party) that everything. Also when I talk about Morupule Mr they voted for is, which promised them employment, Speaker, let me thank the General Manager who was where are they at the moment and what are they there Mr Kgoboko, who is now at Botswana Power saying? They are just bragging that no, unemployment Corporation (BPC), and say you have worked hard, if is growing, it is continuing and it is getting worse. they can treat him well at BPC, and not harass him, he These things Mr Speaker, we are saying they are not will be able bring them the results I know him. good, they are very evil. Batswana should realise these things, and turn their backs on Domkrag (Botswana Mr Speaker, the reason why some parastatals fail to Democratic Party) because what they are doing is to produce results is because they employ people with a ridicule Batswana, in a way we have never seen. Domkrag (Botswana Democratic Party) membership card. If we can stop that Mr Speaker, and employ people Mr Speaker, a graduate who has a Degree is not working, based on their competence then there will be good results. is this a year where a lot of students are going to go to Mr Speaker, Government said there will be inclusivity, the brigades and technical colleges because it has been and as we present a budget like right now, we want to stated that the Form 3 results are poor; they are thrown be able to see the share that has been allocated to people into the streets, Domkrag (Botswana Democratic Party) with disabilities. We have many people with disabilities does not care about them. If you can assess this, you will in our constituency. I have a person who is living with find that many of them have failed, and where do they a disability in my constituency who is trying to make go, they are just thrown in the dustbin, they do not care. ends meet, but they cannot even be offered a tender for Domkrag failed to create 200 000 jobs. When Umbrella erection of a fence or shoe making. Let us include all for Democratic Change (UDC) was saying we are people in the budget, and even the youth Mr Speaker, going to create 100 000 jobs, they said do not bother so that when we speak about the Budget we would be yourselves with UDC, we are going to create even more able to know how much the youth will be allocated. Mr jobs. Show us! Right now they are just ashamed, even Speaker, let the elderly people of the country be given when we see them, they do not know where they can loans so that they can do projects, when they go to banks hide, and they are really avoiding us. to ask for loans, they are told that they do not qualify

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because of their age. When we talk about the issue of MR RAMOGAPI: Mr Speaker, I cannot hear. What are pension Mr Speaker, we are really pleading, the old age you saying? Hello! pension should be increased to P1500.00. Mr Speaker, you should see how... MR SPEAKER: Honourable Moswaane is asking for clarification. MR SPEAKER: Honourable Rakgare, your hand is up, on what point? MR RAMOGAPI: What are you saying Mr Speaker? Mr Speaker! …Silence… MR SPEAKER: I can hear you. MR SPEAKER: On what point? MR RAMOGAPI: Did you say I should continue? …Silence… MR SPEAKER: I was saying Honourable Moswaane MR SPEAKER: Continue Honourable. is asking for clarification.

…Silence… MR RAMOGAPI: Moswaane, 30 seconds quickly Honourable Member. MR RAMOGAPI: They are starting Mr Speaker. Who is muting me? MR MOSWAANE: Clarification. You were right on track. I heard you saying a quarter of Batswana are not HONOURABLE MEMBER: Mr Speaker! working; did you not want to say three quarters is the one that is not working? I just wanted to clarify that MR RAMOGAPI: Hello! Can you hear me Mr point. Thank you so much. Speaker? MR RAMOGAPI: Yes, thank you Honourable MR SPEAKER: Yes sir. Moswaane. You are spot on Honourable Member. When MR RAMOGAPI: They keep pressing that side, Mr Honourable Matsheka compiled the statistics, he made Speaker. I thank you Mr Speaker. I was still explaining it a quarter because he took it to 25 per cent. When you that… look at it, he is only looking at the youth. If we include adults, who are not working it makes it three quarters HONOURABLE MEMBER: I have also pressed this sir. You are telling the truth indeed, you are spot on. side. So, this issue that I am talking about pertaining to tax MR RAMOGAPI: Mr Speaker, I was still explaining is very sensitive, and it means the old men and women the issue of tax, that if someone earns P80, 000 and then back at home should know that they are going to pay we add 14 per cent Value Added Tax (VAT), and another tax. As they are going to pay tax like this Mr Speaker… earns P500 as a pensioner; and then they both go and they have used up my time, that is not my correct time. buy combos, it means the one who earns P500, the 14 per cent VAT is going to deduct about P30. Let me round As they would be paying tax like this Mr Speaker, the it, from P30, this amount of P30 is going to come out issue is that, they are going to be taxed for the little from the little P400… food combo which they buy, just the same amount as the Permanent Secretary (PS). This means tax does not MR SPEAKER: Honourable Moswaane. segregate. It is not right because according to how tax should be done, one has to pay tax based on the fact MR RAMOGAPI: …being counted with those of that… others as VAT. You should realise that… MR SPEAKER: Honourable Monnakgotla, your hand MR SPEAKER: Honourable Moswaane. is up, on what point? MR RAMOGAPI: …is going to be taxed… MS MONNAKGOTLA: Thank you Mr Speaker, MR MOSWAANE: Mr Speaker, clarification sir. clarification.

MR SPEAKER: Yes, Honourable Moswaane. MR RAMOGAPI: My Sister I am not denying you a Honourable Ramogapi, you are the person on the floor, chance, my time is up as you heard me lamenting that Honourable Moswaane wants clarification. they have used up my time.

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Mr Speaker, it means the elderly are in trouble with Honourable Members, alcohol makes the economy regards to tax, their old age pension of P400 is going to move. If you are not going to open for the sale of be taxed an amount of 14 per cent. Mr Speaker it means alcohol, you should give them subsidies so that they can out of P400, when they buy a combo worth P240, they be able to pay loans and salaries. will pay Government P30. When you deduct this from a PS or a Minister who earns P80 000, a tax for P30 Mr Speaker, I wish to also say this practice of closing is nothing Mr Speaker. This tax should be selective; it churches is not good. In churches, we have what is should say those who are in this bracket should not be called Sunday school, and these children have not been taxed. There is no way it could be said they cannot pay going to church ever since the outbreak of COVID-19. tax because they will be going to the shops, and VAT is We want churches to open, so that they can pray for going to be requested from them. I am passing that point this pandemic; they should arise. If we bar them from Mr Speaker. praying, saying they should only open for two hours, what is that? For a country to function it needs prayer In regard to reserves Mr Speaker; it is embarrassing Mr Speaker, and what is currently happening now is and this is the first time this is happening. I would like something else, and we have no idea what we can call it. Dr Mogae to take his role as a senior citizen to give advice and remind them that it has never happened Mr Speaker, I would like to take this time to say the in Botswana that funds would be depleted in such a Minister of Finance should be given authority. When manner. What we are seeing now Mr Speaker, that the President comes to him and he says he wants this, funds would be devoured like marijuana or wild berries; or saying they have planned for this, the Minister of just taking and throwing into the mouth, we have never Finance should be able to refuse; he should be given seen this anywhere before Mr Speaker. This is a first in the authority to say ‘the country has no money, hence our country. These people have gotten our country into we cannot buy vehicles for the President. The country trouble. I am asking Dr Mogae, to please take his role has no money so we cannot renovate the Office of the and arise. I am requesting Dr Khama to take his role as President.’ If we do not give the Minister of Finance a senior citizen and arise as well, and give counsel to authority, our country is going to be in big trouble, it is the Government because we have to advise each other going to collapse Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker, as we keep doing these things, we should Mr Speaker, the issue of cattle, although we are already remember that we once said we should have Citizen talking about taxes, they are taxed many times. There Economic Empowerment (CEE). When we talk about is a livestock tax and VAT. One pays tax at the ranch Citizen Economic Empowerment, we should ask and at the abattoir. After paying the abattoir the 10 per ourselves why all construction jobs are given to the cent livestock tax, when they get to the butchery they Chinese. What is happening in Botswana? Look at all the pay some more tax, the14 per cent. A lot of money Mr round-abouts in Gaborone; the Chinese are refurbishing Speaker. This is not good for this country. them. Mr Speaker, this is very disheartening, it is not good for our own people to be watching our economy Mr Speaker, I wish the Honourable Minister of Local being devoured by foreign nationals. Mr Speaker, why Government could declare that Palapye is a town, so are filling stations owned by the Indians? All filling that we could assist in collecting revenue, and stop stations! Mr Speaker, people are watching these things, saying he is decentralising yet we would not have any they are painful and they are not good at all. Why idea what exactly he would be seeking to do. After he is are chickens owned by Indians? All the chickens, no done, he will not declare that Palapye should be a town. matter how hard you try, there is a nationality which Palapye is a town sir; please declare it to be so as soon is dominating that industry. These things are not good as possible. Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker, why is education led by the Kenyans in Botswana? Mr Speaker, these things are I would like to talk to Honourable Serame, that she not good, they are painful and they are not good for our should be serious because alcohol revives the economy. country. She should ensure that bars are opened, the bar owners are suffering. These bar owners have employed our Mr Speaker, Batswana want Citizen Economic people, and some of the bars are rented. We cannot just Empowerment, they want the economy to be in their sit back and believe we will halt alcohol sales forever. hands. We are beginning to be suspicious Mr Speaker,

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because there is something that was called Belt and and after ploughing they sell produce and then supply. Road, and the Minister for Foreign Affairs was asked to What do they want small scale farmers to do? There is sign; he was made to sign by the Chinese. We suspect a new unappealing trend where someone is a distributor that the reason why the Chinese are given these many and also a retailer. They would be retailing and also projects is because of this Belt and Road that we have take care of all transport issues. Batswana are keeping no idea what it meant, what it sought. These things Mr an eye on these things, they are not right and they have Speaker, are not right. to be corrected.

Mr Speaker, I want to quickly touch on issues concerning Mr Speaker, I cannot conclude my debate without COVID-19. May the soul of my neighbor at Palapye Mr addressing an important point where it is said that Bright rest in peace. We have lost a good coach, he was public servants are going to be downsized. Even if our neighbor at Palapye. Minister Molale can try to beautify it by saying this and Mr Speaker, let me also say that this COVID-19, that! They are going be reviewing it, freeze posts. Mr Speaker, their main argument is the right size, no matter teachers are in trouble because at Mmaphula School in what the name you are trying to use, whether you are my Constituency, a lot of leaners have tested positive saying right size, transformation or engineering, at the for COVID-19. While that is the case, it seems like the end of the day public servants are going to be cut from situation has gotten out of control because we have ran work. We are saying that you are not supposed to cut off out of testing materials, there are no testing kits. I was public servants from work in the middle of COVID-19 just asking the Minister to account for the donations and pandemic. Public servants pensions are not doing well he said that they purchased medical supplies, medical this time, so when you start cutting them from work supplies which are not available as we speak. during a time like this, what do you expect these people Mr Speaker, we are aware of some issues, we asked to benefit because their pensions are not doing well questions and they are lining up. We are aware that where they are saved, they are on zero- zero? This is a there is a certain service kit which was purchased, some time for you to wait, do not cut off public servants, we testing kits which are dumped at the medical stores are begging you, cutting public servants from work is despite having been bought with so much money. The more like pointing a gun at them. These people support question is in the line, it is waiting for Honourable the economy, they take their children to school, and they Dikoloti to give us answers about the antigen testing are sponsors somewhere. They are looking after their kits. There are reports that they are even considering to parents, some are sick and you are considering to cut burn them. We are keeping an eye on them, they should them from work after using them and telling them that it not think that we do not know. We have questions is going to be enjoyable in Botswana and that their lives which are lined up, I have already tabled it because we will improve. God is watching you. At this point in time, hear about these issues and we can see that funds were it is not right for us to relax and say that we are going diverted elsewhere. to downsize the public service. Mr Speaker, this is not right and it cannot take us anywhere. Mr Speaker, when it comes to COVID-19, we have realised that in Botswana, it is more like some people Lastly Mr Speaker, let me point out that the President of are using it as an opportunity to benefit. One of the Botswana has to be limited in the Budget. The President days Batswana are going to ask you to account for their should also be governed at a time like this because if funds. We can hear that there are no answers and even you can give him all the powers...I am adding on to when you try to give answers, they do not make sense. what Honourable Kenny Kapinga said, that if you can Hey! We are clever, do not think that we do not see these give an African President all the powers for him to do things because we do see them. One day we are going everything, to be the one who appoints the Minister of to seek justice for these things. No one can just be calm Finance and Economic Development and fire him or forever, the time will come for a revolution that no one her when he wants, hey! The country will be in trouble. can stop. The Constitution has to be reviewed so that we amend these things and remove Auditor General from Office Mr Speaker, I want to quickly move on to investment of the President. It is not right for the Auditor General trade and say, Choppies, Spar, Sefalana are not doing to audit Office of the President even though he or she things right. These chain stores plough for themselves, is appointed by Office of the President. It is not right

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for Ombudsman to be the one who investigates the …Silence… President even though he is the one who appoints him or her. Mr Speaker, we are saying that these are the MR SPEAKER: Honourable Kablay has disappeared. institutions that promote a rich democracy. Let us try Honourable Motaosane. MR MOTAOSANE (THAMAGA-KUMAKWANE): In conclusion, I would like to thank people of Palapye Thank you Mr Speaker. Let me thank you for giving for sending me to Parliament, for being happy that I am me an opportunity to also comment on Dr Matsheka’s advocating for them and I am doing a good job. They Budget Speech. Thank you Mr Speaker. Let me start said that I should not forget our fellow countrymen by with health particularly looking at the full report brought Tswapong in Maunatlala, and I told them that I will by Dr Matsheka on the effects of COVID-19. I know shake my fellow Honourable and that there is absolutely that he was crafting the current budget under immense no problem. With those words Mr Speaker, I thank duress where the country has no finances as some you. Let us unite and work tirelessly for Batswana. Honourable Members have also commented that even We should know that there are issues which should foreign reserves have been depleted. I want to applaud not be politicised. It seems like we want to politicise him that he has brought this report before us even under everything but that is not how a country is governed, the difficult situation that we are faced with instead of we should sometimes put politics aside. Let me give complaining that there is nothing that can be done. you an example; Koma recommended that there should Mr Speaker, we are all aware that currently no country be dams and they were constructed, the founder of can boast about anything in the absence of developments Botswana Peoples Party (BPP) advised that there should because the economy of all African countries was be a Defence Force and it was formed. Mr Saleshando mostly used to fight against COVID-19. I want to once advised that Value Added Tax (VAT) should be applaud Dr Matsheka though we are still going to get a reduced on food substances and it was indeed reduced. detailed report of how and when we are going to procure This time around it seems like Opposition is regarded the vaccine, he gave us a report that we as Honourable as a party that is not supposed to be listened to. Hey! Members should go and share with our constituents and Listen to us, we are here to give you advice. Thank you update them on the situation, telling them nothing else Mr Speaker. but the truth. We should tell them the truth that we are MR KABLAY (LETLHAKENG-LEPHEPHE): not going to get some of the things and some we will get ...(Inaudible)… budget first. Mr Speaker, let me them because at the moment health is our top priority. It highlight that when our constituents hear that their will be useless to procure some things when we do not Member of Parliament is attending the Budget meeting... know who is going to use them if the nation of Botswana (Interruptions!)... They get excited knowing that their is wiped out by COVID-19. Member of Parliament is going to come with a better Still on COVID-19 by Dr Matsheka, maybe as a request, life for their constituency. They give you a message I think looking at the current economic status, the time that you should go to the Budget meeting bearing in has come that the little we have be used to refurbish mind that their lives depend on you, that whatever is Government buildings all over the country. For example; going to be discussed there, you should know that your the old Scottish Livingstone buildings could be used constituency...(Interruptions!)... which would be the as a quarantine area. The truth of the matter is, we cake of the nation which is shared amongst Batswana. might know that protective clothing and other medical As leaders, we wish that every Motswana can get a equipment are expensive but when you look at the piece of this cake, be it a small slice or whichever size, amount used to book hotels to be used as quarantines, it the cake... is beyond the Government budget. Even those payments …Silence… are not made on time. These people on quarantines are not really living there comfortably. Hotel owners also MR SPEAKER: Honourable Kablay. provide them with meagre meals because they can go …Silence… unpaid up to four months. This is not right because he or she is also forced by circumstances to give these people MR SPEAKER: Honourable Kablay. Honourable those meagre meals. The people on quarantines are Kablay, can you unmute yourself? always complaining and this is caused by late payments

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to these people who provide quarantine services. to at least ensure that every constituency has a major Moving on from that one, Dr Matsheka, I thank you sir. ongoing project when deducing the budget. I heard you well, you want us to stop funding bit by bit. Those are I thank you that this afternoon you stood and clarified not your words, they come from certain members like some points which might leave some feeling offended. It is indeed true that not all of us are good with figures Secretary General whom I love, he mentioned that we especially in relation to the systems they were made should consider some roads like A1. No, he was not under. Yes, you can add 1 + 1 and get 2. However, the way wrong to say that but I am saying, let us divide the little Government systems operate is not easy for everyone that we have according to all our constituencies. We do to understand. Like other Honourable Members said, it not want a situation whereby we find that there is actually is important that maybe before we come and debate a a constituency that has nothing to do, for the entire Motion or your report here, we should go for a workshop development plan like we were reviewing National so that we understand and notice errors well in time and Development Plan (NDP) 11. There is no sign which not just come and single them out when we are debating shows that something is going to be done. Honourable in Parliament. I thank you for the way you presented Matsheka, if we approach these things in that manner, your report. we are going to permanently leave others behind and Dr Matsheka, I only wish that when you present your they are never going to have any developments in their speech, you should do it in such a way that it will villages. We need equal distribution of the national cake. improve the economy. I am very worried because Still on the issue of roads, in relation to your presentation mostly when we talk of developments, big projects will Dr Matsheka, we have long pointed out through you Mr be set aside for one part of the country according to Speaker, that a time has come for us to start operating your assessments. This is a disadvantage to others. It tollgates, so let us prioritise them. according to me, disadvantages us because we might not have salt that since you intend to fund rail line projects that side, no, is transported by rail from its source. We do not have let us build tollgates before implementing that rail line. roads which connect Botswana to other countries. We We can generate a lot of income from every border, have shortage of roads that when we talk of recovering especially that they are mostly used by horse and trailers the economy everywhere in Botswana, all of us should which damage our roads. We chose to ignore them but have something that can contribute to resuscitating the we pay a lot of money at the tollgates when we travel to economy. If you take all the projects there, there is no countries like South Africa. how the other part of the country will manage to improve or resuscitate the economy. Otherwise we are going to “EXCHANGE OF SPEAKERSHIP” be spectators of economic revitalisation. MR SPEAKER (MR PULE): Good afternoon Therefore, when we talk of big projects, we should Honourable Members. Honourable Lucas, your hand is remember that we spent years requesting for certain up, what point are you standing on? projects for our constituencies and they can also resuscitate the economy. For example; our constituency MR LUCAS: Elucidation Mr Speaker. has a challenge in terms of roads. My constituency in MR SPEAKER: Honourable Motaosane, he is asking general has a challenge when it comes to roads but if for elucidation. those road projects could be included, my constituents could also contribute to recovering the economy. In so MR MOTAOSANE: Granted Honourable Speaker. doing, they will have buying power in their villages and the economy improves in homes thereby contributing MR LUCAS: Elucidation. Honourable Motaosane, you also to the country because obviously people will pay mentioned an issue of great importance that, we have tax since we have been talking about taxes. It will be to at least ensure that every constituency has a major very painful if we talk about taxes, where we increase ongoing project when deducing the budget. Honourable tax for others even though they do not generate enough Motaosane, it is currently a concern because you will income which may improve the economy. find that a constituency has many projects while other constituencies like Bobirwa and Thamaga-Kumakwane Dr Matsheka, I encourage you to reassess this issue. do not have at least one major project. This is a concern Honourable Members, a time has come where we have and it might divide us as a country. Thank you.

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MR MOTAOSANE: Thank you sir. I agree with you Maybe a time has come for you to call the Ministers Honourable Lucas, looking at our current situation, that who are responsible for these ministries so that they can is the way we should be distributing the developments. account for not using these funds. It is really painful and For example; in my Constituency, Thamaga- hurting for people to fail to use their funds while other Kumakwane, we never had projects for the past 15 years ministries need funds to proceed with their projects. but every six years, they approach us with the bottom-up These things are not good and we have to pay attention planning claiming that they are releasing a project, none to them. We also have other ministries which get funds, of them gets funding. We have developed bad spirits they engage some contractors who never finish their because of these things, especially concerning the issue of roads. As I am standing here today as Honourable projects or never finish them during the stipulated time Motaosane, members like Reverend Dr Seakgosing frames. Obviously, this is what is going to happen; they and Honourable Mabeo came here and complained are going to experience some cost escalations which about roads like Kubung, Gakgatla-Gamodubu. These could have been avoided if contractors could have roads may improve the state of the economy in that implemented their projects accordingly. I encourage area as well as in Botswana at large. If we do not divide you to closely assess these things. For example; we have these projects accordingly, we will end up suspecting Economic Stimulus Programme (ESP), none of these that people prioritise some roads which are in their projects were finished on time. Some of those that were constituencies. It is very painful because this speech finished, their structures are not being used. This thing indicates that some areas, not that I am not envious reduces Government income because even if they charge of them, their internal roads are financed. Really a public servant P250 for rental, at least something will Honourable Members! When you talk about internal be generated. We also have some structures which were roads and other roads which link villages such that finished at Thamaga, they have been there for the past those who live in areas which are far from services may four years but have never been used up to now. They be able to access them nearby. For example; a person say that Botswana Power Corporation (BPC) has not may come from Kubung, Moshaweng, Kotolaname or connected electricity to them. This is very wrong. There Gamodubu, a situation may arise where they want to is also a house at Kumakwane, only a minor thing is buy something from a bigger village which has services missing before it can be used. So Minister, as our which are not provided where they come from. So, they financial manager, you have to assess and ensure that fail to go there because they do not have a good road, these things are done on time so that they can help you while others are expecting internal roads. That is luxury to generate income. to them whereas it would be a necessity if those roads are provided to us, as well as improved health. When we As you moved on with your presentation, you also talk about provision of health services at Kubung; we do indicated that you intend to change National Employment not have a hospital, a maternity wing or a clinic. If an Policy (NEP) so that it can help to create jobs, especially expectant mother has to travel to Thamaga, they might end up giving birth along the way and on those cars. through private sector. I urge you to reassess it Dr We also have to consider the size of the economy of Matsheka because we have a very small population people who live in that area. What are we saying about in Botswana. If you consider the private sector, they situations where they hire someone to transport them in also depend entirely on Government tenders for jobs. the middle of the night, where the car gets damaged on If that is the case and if they are the ones who fail to the way even though they paid the little that they had? finish projects that are given to them on time and within We have to discuss these things Honourable Matsheka, budget, are they not going to drain the little resources you also have to compassionately look at them. I know that you have Dr Matsheka? Before giving projects that we will discuss them further at the Committee of or money to these people, different ministries have to Supply. closely supervise them to ensure that they finish projects on time. You have this National Monitoring System and One of the issues which I am concerned about is Strategy which you are still trying to build, if we fail to that Honourable Matsheka, you are right, we have supervise the projects we award to companies so that insufficient funds but some ministries do not use the they meet the standards. You will realise that if projects funds given to them. We have been enquiring about are not completed on time, it means we are not bringing these things in our various portfolio committees. services to the communities we are representing.

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Secondly, if there is constant price inflation, it means Procurement and Asset Disposal (LAPAD) Act, there there is no how the economy will grow so kindly is a certain clause which allows the project to continue monitor these things. while the case is at court. As long as you are convinced that it will follow the right processes and procedures, On page 9 Mr Speaker, he talks about… so the project can continue. However, Government MR SPEAKER: Honourable Motaosane, Honourable Ministries never implement this Clause. Projects should Moswaane’s hand is up. Honourable Moswaane, what continue, we stop wasting Government funds through are you standing on? that practice. Perhaps using your specials skills, you can see how we can implement projects within budget. MR MOSWAANE: Elucidation. State-Owned Enterprises (SOEs); no Honourable MR SPEAKER: Honourable Motaosane, he is asking Minister I want to implore you that you should have no to elucidate. fear because I suspect that you do when it boils down to a decision to dissolve or merge them. If you take …Silence… Botswana Development Corporation (BDC), I saw an MR SPEAKER: Honourable Motaosane, are you advertisement that Milk Africa is looking for…hey! allowing him to elucidate? Are you yielding? We were on a trip as the Committee on Agriculture. Out rightly we informed them that the project is not MR MOTAOSANE: I am yielding. going to yield any results. Within the blink of an eye, they are already advertising for a post. We always raise MR MOSWAANE: On a point of elucidation. these issues and it does not seem like SOEs are doing Honourable Motaosane, you are on the right track. I enough to ensure that they take care of Government’s heard you talk a lot about private companies which are investments. awarded Government tenders but fail which leads to cost overruns. While on this subject Honourable Member, It is quite surprising that there are reports about insufficient what is your opinion regarding the issue of wastage and supply of milk in Botswana. Honourable Matsheka, I corruption where prices are inflated from the onset during implore that you give us funds to establish cooperatives. the planning stage up until even implementation prices Each constituency should have a cooperative which by some of the Government officers? An example; as supplies milk, we can get this milk from our farmers. you heard Honourable Rakgare complaining about the They can deliver milk to the cooperative where it will be pasteurised and sold to the market. Hey! Batswana P1 million toilets that they should have cost something have a lot of cattle so they can supply large milk like P600 000, but P1 million was spent. The question quantities. If you were to visit my constituency right is, how was that P1 million approved? What is your now, each farmer can produce close to 20 litres per day. view regarding this issue Honourable? Thank you. So if we can ride on this wave and use this milk, you MR MOTAOSANE: Thank you Honourable know that in Kenya if a person has two cows, they can Moswaane, that is exactly my point. This wastage and milk them and sell the milk wherever they want. So let corruption is birthed by the fact that as Ministers or us set up these things in order to assist; make a bold as Government, we are ruling but we gave the public decision that every village where there are farmers, you servants the platform to rule because there is lack of should collect milk from small scale farmers rather than supervision. I am still saying if these people are not sourcing from commercial farmers breeding dairy cattle supervised and monitored to ensure that they implement like Simmental and Charolais which produce large Government projects following the right procedure, quantities but do not meet the demand because our focus we will keep complaining about the same situation is on these commercial farmers, so please let us initiate Honourable Moswaane. This corruption was birthed new methods. by allowing public servants to venture into businesses during the time when they were complaining about their Honourable Minister, BDC should be the first enterprise salaries. There is no how they can establish businesses to be dissolved including National Development Bank and not benefit from the system. That is why tender (NDB) because NDB is also a huge burden which does cases are always at the courts. I would like to advise not serve any purpose. Every financial year NDB is Dr Matsheka that in the Public Procurement and Asset allocated funds but you will never know what happens. Disposal Board (PPADB) Act or Local Authorities They are always complaining but do not generate profit,

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they refuse to fund people when they apply for loans. because they know that their tax system of vehicles is that This bank should be privatised completely, Government the older the vehicle becomes, the more tax the owner should no longer give it subvention because there is no pays. So it has brought pollution to the country. I am not use, every financial year they are given funds yet there disputing the fact that they have created employment for are no returns. our people but it is only right to charge tax so that when there is pollution of the environment, we can be able to Since time is not on my side Mr Speaker, my desire is that pull those taxes to address the situation. as we speak about transformation of Integrated Support Programme for Arable Agriculture Development Still on taxes, I am really saddened by the issue of Value (ISPAAD), we were totally unfair this year Mr Speaker Added Tax (VAT). VAT affects everyone, those who are that in the last hour, we informed Batswana that we working and those who are not working. That is where will no longer plough five hectares and even after all I am deeply saddened Honourable Dr Matsheka. I know these changes, we refuse to pay for tractor services for that as a general rule, those are the ways the Government uses to collect revenue. I agree with you. Let us wait farmers who managed to buy their own seeds. No, we first until we see how the COVID-19 situation is going. were totally unfair to Batswana. I personally say we did Then the 14 per cent tax will begin when the COVID-19 not cooperate properly with Batswana, let us learn to situation has improved. So that means that if I give give people some kind of grace period if there are any someone who is not working P200.00, obviously, I changes in future so that they can gradually adapt to have already taken a lot from that money, and he or she these changes. cannot buy toiletry with that money. I am not against it, In conclusion, I would like to talk about Molepolole I agree with tax. In this financial year, we should delay road Mr Speaker. Minister, I implored on numerous increasing VAT. That is going to save every Motswana occasions that we go together to see that road because it even those who are not working. So what we pay them, is now causing deaths by road accident. People are now is not going to be enough, not saying that it is wrong. attacking me on social media regarding the Molepolole- Honourable Member, as you review taxes as time Thamaga road and the Kubung-Moshaweng and is already gone, the Plastic Levy should begin to be Gakgatla-Gamodubu road. Minister, this project was collected from the day it was approved. They should said to be at a tender stage for the past three and a half start it there. People know that they have been using the years. Up to now, there is no update on the tender, what Plastic Levy carelessly. Let us go and find it, we should do I say to the people? Minister, kindly give an update know when it started. You can find it because they have about this road, how far along is it, which company has been collecting the Plastic Levy from us and they are been awarded so that residents of Molepolole-Thamaga still taking it right now. If that was not the case, they can hear because I have now become a scapegoat could have been stopped for some time and told that that I am the reason the road is not constructed, I was they should not collect the Plastic Levy for that time. misleading people. Minister, if you did not fund this They have been collecting it and we do not know where road because I know that it was long allocated funds it goes. So I agree with you that let it be collected but let back in 2017 yet the project has not been implemented. us start from the time it was agreed that the Plastic Levy If that is the case Minister, please include it in the plan. should be introduced.

The same goes for Mogoditshane-Thamaga road, A10 Honourable Molale has been talking about Government road. Its tender was long released in 2019, up to now we employees that we are told are going to be right sized do not know its progress. Who are we trying to award Honourable Member. Let us wait. At Thamaga we need these tenders to? What are the guidelines for tenders, a sub-district. We have no workforce at all. Let us take what is the duration of implementation after awarding those who are supposed to be right sized so that they can the tender? Who are we reserving these tenders for? work at a sub-district at Thamaga. We have a problem of Let us address these things in order to ensure smooth lack of resources and nothing is happening at Thamaga implementation of Government projects and stop village. You can realise that there is no administration making road users who pay taxes suffer. centre, so they must establish what the Thamaga- Kumakwane Constituency needs. Minister, I agree with you when you talk about taxes of used vehicles. When these vehicles are imported from Honourable Rakgare, I heard that your budget has been these other countries, they are basically disposing them increased. We request for a library at Kumakwane.

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Honourable Member, when you allocate that money, do allocated properly. We cannot be promised things and not forget that Kumakwane needs a library. With that when they are supposed to be implemented, we do not said, let me stop there because time is not on my side. know where they go. We are not supposed to do that because you are making people to be angry with us. MR SPEAKER: Thank you Honourable Motaosane. We do not know what to say to the people when their I do not know if Honourable Kablay is ready, is his projects are not implemented. connection okay? If everything is okay Honourable Kablay, the floor is yours. We were promised that there was going to be an increment…(Inaudible)…at Malwelwe and Boatlaname. MR KABLAY (LETLHAKENG-LEPHEPHE): Right now there is nothing happening. So even if we Thank you Mr Speaker. Honourable Member, earlier on are not allocated anything in these Budgets, we should when I was speaking, I lost connection. I was saying give the people what we promised them because they that when Batswana at home hear that there is a Budget also deserve developments. So I do not want to end up Speech, they are happy that developments are coming saying words that are tribalistic, which in future can to their areas, or that their lives are going to change. make people say that Honourable Kablay is beginning Honourable Member, this Budget is similar to a cake. to talk tribalism when it comes to developments. People This cake, belongs to a Motswana, and when it is will say why is it that our developments are not being divided, it has to be divided equally so that they can all implemented whereas in other constituencies, they are get something. That is what I was saying when I began continuing to implement projects. Mr Speaker, let us Honourable Member. review these developments, so that every constituency for a Member of Parliament receives them. Mr Speaker, you will find that in most areas, nothing is happening. Sometimes you will find that people are I do not want to end up asking, but every constituency promised that this and that will be implemented in their for a Member of Parliament should be allocated its own constituency. When these things are supposed to be budget, and they facilitate their own developments. implemented, then Honourable Matsheka says, “there We will be waiting while you are saying, Budget, is no money.” When there is no money, that means Budget, when the time comes to allocate money, our that developments will not be implemented. We were constituencies are not allocated anything. So it is better promised so many things at our constituency; hospitals we do what we did with the P10 million because right and junior secondary schools. At the moment, projects now they have plans. Our Councils are determined, they are not being implemented, we are told that there is no have plans about the P10 millions of developments. So money. Their expectation is that, if there is no money in future, Governments should forget about its Budgets today that means that the next day it will be available, and let us allocate every constituency with its budget to and their projects can be implemented. It takes a lot facilitate its own developments because that is effective. of time for our developments to be implemented Mr So this issue of always allocating developments and Speaker. budgets, whereas they are not included is something that we cannot have many explanations to. Our constituency of Letlhakeng is always unfortunate. Since the time of Mr Mokgothu, he was promised Mr Speaker, Honourable Matsheka said we are going projects that in a particular financial year, we are to be taxed for other people’s livelihood. We know that going to build a certain school, we are going to do this people have been retrenched from their jobs and when and that. Then when the projects are supposed to be someone has two or three cattle, and then he or she sells implemented, Mr Mokgothu will be told that there is no them to buy a mini truck to make a living, then they are money, and those projects could not be implemented. told that they should pay tax, that is not right. Mr Speaker, This thing Honourable Member, is also happening to we are faced with a great challenge of the pandemic, me. I am promised developments, like I was saying people’s lives are ruined, their jobs and everything is that we were promised a hospital. We have a show ruined and then when someone tries to make a living, ground, we relocated it to another place fast so that then we say Government …(Inaudible)…this tax Mr our primary hospital could be constructed there. We do Speaker, we should stop it. Let us leave Batswana to not know where the hospital is. Mr Speaker, one of the live the way they have been living. They can make a Assistant Ministers said that they do not know why their living with their mini trucks and Honda Fits. You can developments are allocated this way and they are not transport people’s cattle and at the end of the day, you

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have something to eat. So if we are going to prevent inconsolably. We want to thank the President because them from doing that with our taxes, whereas we know we gave him the powers, and he used them to ensure the problems Batswana are facing…Ah! We will not that the virus does not spread. be doing the right thing. In future, we will not know how to explain this. We are a political Government, We have a challenge because currently in my we should not make people lose hope on us just from constituency, we have Mphuthe Junior Secondary the beginning. They will say, no, they are making our School. This disease is rife in that school. We are lives hard. Let us not give the Opposition issues to use begging that the workers involved in the fight against during campaigns at freedom squares. When they are COVID-19 should be increased in my constituency, so at freedom squares, they will say you can realise that that they would be able to help those who are affected. Domkrag has started taxing even the poor. As a political Ventilators should be there at Letlhakeng clinic, because Government, we need to look forward to these things to Letlhakeng is the centre in that constituency. When one see how they can disadvantage us in future. is coming from Salajwe, Kaudwane or Maboane, they Mr Speaker, we are in trouble, it is time for the have to go through Letlhakeng. So the machines should Government to borrow funds to build roads. The whole be there in Letlhakeng sir, so that people could be of Botswana has no roads. In this rainy season, it has assisted when the virus gets worse, so that by the time been proven that indeed there are no roads. These tarred they are taken to Sir Ketumile, things would be better; roads that were built, the contractors were just joking, having been assisted with breathing because this virus there are no roads. Mr Speaker, it is time for funds to be affects the lungs. borrowed so that all roads in Botswana could be built. These are things we were requesting for because our In my constituency, if you go to Malwelwe, Botlhapatlou, constituency is remote sir, Molepolole is far; consider Ngware, Moshaweng or Monwane, there are no roads. Sir Ketumile Masire and Gaborone. So when a person is Now one wonders how we live because there is water coming from Letlhakeng or Salajwe, being in a critical everywhere. When people are sick, they have no way condition, it is going to be problematic. We have even of going to the hospitals, doctors’ appointments, those registered a COVID death, so we are scared in my who have tuckshops have to go and get their stock; they constituency. We want the Government to bring services have nowhere to pass, their vehicles get stuck. There is closer; all the machinery that can assist in this disease. water all over the roads. Roads have turned into ponds Mr Speaker, we appreciate the fact that the Ministry of Mr Speaker. Education was given a budget to assist in addressing Minister Segokgo has to arise, he should do his best. He the challenges they are facing in education. We would is actually doing his best; him and his Director, Modise appreciate it if it could manage to improve itself. Under Segokgo. They found this ministry in a total mess. It this ministry, there was no equipment in schools and they was previously led by people whom when you talked kept saying there are no funds; and I believe now they to, they did not even bother to listen, they actually did will have funds; photocopiers, books, everything will not want to listen. This then made the ministry worse. be there, everywhere at the Macheng junior secondary Right now, Minister Segokgo has no idea where to start; schools and primary schools, where there are challenges you are doubting him and pointing accusing fingers at they will address them Mr Speaker. him. My people as we speak sir are in serious trouble We are also saddened by the fact that our schools are in relation to roads, they have no idea what happened not doing well in examinations. It is not like we do not Mr Speaker. We are requesting that it should be ensured have teachers who can teach, they are there; qualified that our roads are refurbished and tarred. Even if they teachers. Now the challenges are their lamentations are not tarred, they should be upgraded with graders, all that there are no machines Mr Speaker. As for us whose holes should be covered so that people would be able to constituencies are remote, it is a challenge. How can commute. students be able to learn when there is no chalk or Mr Speaker, there is this disease called Corona. We are anything that can be used to facilitate their learning? in trouble sir, we thank the President for trying his best There are no photocopying machines which teachers to prevent it and stop it from spreading to the extent can use to photocopy tests so that they can be able to of us having numbers whereby we would be crying assist students here and there. What can a teacher do

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when they are in Shadishadi, Sojwe, Letlhakeng or up, what was your point of raising your hand? Salajwe? This is the reason why our students are not doing well Mr Speaker. ...(Silence)...

We want students from schools in our area to be seen on MR SPEAKER: Honourable Motsamai, your hand was television as well as in the papers, that Mphuthe, Sojwe up. and Salajwe did well. Unlike now whereby every year ...(Silence)... when the results come out, as Members of Parliament from those areas, we would bow our heads in shame, MR SPEAKER: Is he back? Honourable Kablay, our colleagues chastising us, laughing at us, celebrating Honourable Monnakgotla, is asking for clarification. their victories and rightfully so. We also want to ...(Silence)... celebrate like them Mr Speaker. My request is that this ministry should be serious. MR SPEAKER: Honourable Kablay, we cannot hear you. Mr Speaker, also back at the constituency the teachers are complaining that they have overstayed there. The MR KABLAY: Yes sir, she may proceed sir. Promotion of Deputy Head teacher, Head teacher... MR SPEAKER: Okay, Honourable Monnakgotla, go (Interruption)…a person will be taken from somewhere ahead. else and it would be said that person is the Head teacher, yet they would be well versed with the area and the type MS MONNAKGOTLA: Thank you Mr Speaker. I heard the Honourable Member as he was talking about of students there… schools like Shadishadi School. You are debating MR SPEAKER: Honourable Kablay! brilliantly Honourable, that schools are not performing well, more especially schools which are found in MR KABLAY: So Mr Speaker... settlements like Hunhukwe, Ukhwi, Zutshwa and Ngwatle. Honourable, I can hear that your grievance is MR SPEAKER: Honourable Kablay, I can see the same as mine, so what do you think should be done Honourable Monnakgotla and Honourable Motsamai’s about the situation where learners in settlements are not hands. Honourable Monnakgotla on what point are you performing well? Thank you. rising on? MR KABLAY: Honourable, we have a challenge when MS MONNAKGOTLA: I am seeking clarification it comes to our schools which are in remote areas. That from Honourable Kablay. is why I am pleading with the Minister that I can see their share of the budget, so they should take action, MR SPEAKER: Honourable Kablay, she is asking for his ministry personnel should leave offices and go and clarification. Are you yielding? find out about challenges and how our schools can be ...(Silence)... assisted. Honourable, learners in our schools are not performing well, they stop as far as Form 3 and then they MR SPEAKER: Honourable Kablay, oh no, he has start working at Ipelegeng. We do not want out children now disappeared. Honourable Kablay! Honourable to work at Ipelegeng anymore. I want the Minister and Monnakgotla, can you hear me? the ministry to take action and see how learners can be assisted in order for them to pass, including learners in ... (Silence)... hostels. MR SPEAKER: Honourable Kablay, can you go ahead Mr Speaker, I proceed… with your presentation? Go ahead with your debate Honourable Kablay. MR SPEAKER: Honourable Kablay, Honourable Motsamai’s hand is up. Honourable Motsamai, is your ... (Silence)... hand up? MR SPEAKER: Will he come back? MR KABLAY: Yes sir. ...(Silence)... MR SPEAKER: Honourable Motsamai, explain which MR SPEAKER: Honourable Motsamai, your hand was point you are rising on.

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MR MOTSAMAI: Thank you Mr Speaker. There is a MR MOSWAANE: Mr Speaker, I am rising on a point challenge that side, you call us when we are on mute this of order. I long raised my hand five minutes ago. side, when we cannot get through. MR SPEAKER: Honourable Moswaane, can you go So I want to ask Honourable Kablay to allow me to ahead. elucidate on what he said about the issue… MR MOSWAANE: Point of order. Mr Speaker, MR SPEAKER: Okay. Honourable Motsamai we Honourable Kablay was talking about Minister heard you, point of elucidation. Honourable Kablay, are Segokgo’s ministry, saying that everything has been you yielding? destroyed, it is a total mess and that those people failed. I believe that this… MR KABLAY: I yield sir. MR SPEAKER: Honourable Moswaane, is that out of MR MOTSAMAI: Elucidation. Mr Speaker, order? Honourable Kablay is telling the truth, more especially on the issue that concerns schools and clinics. We are in a MR MOSWAANE: He is out of order because people COVID-19 pandemic, so does he not find it important to who he is accusing of destroying everything there have not been prosecuted nor have they been found guilty. expand teams that work in remote areas more especially How are they going to defend themselves here? to assess if there is any special arrangement in relation to the spread of the virus. I am looking at the issue of MR SPEAKER: No Honourable, just wait. Honourable hostels where our children are crowded. Mr Speaker, PPP. these issues raise a concern because there are two or three schools in my constituency, primary and junior, ...(Silence)... which have reported positive cases. Thank you. MR SPEAKER: PPP! MR KABLAY: Thank you Mr Speaker. Honourable ...(Silence)... Motsamai is telling the truth sir. This is what I was also requesting, that teams should be expanded. If at all it MR SPEAKER: Honourable PPP! is alleged that our learners have tested positive, they should be home. Action should be taken Mr Speaker, MR KABLAY: He is not here sir, let me proceed. they should be visited to see where they are, how they MR SPEAKER: Honourable Kablay, go ahead. live and if they have food because the COVID-19 team is not managing because they are not enough. If they MR KABLAY: Thank you Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker, are many, some can be accompanied around, others I was saying that people who were at Ministry of can go around visiting people to see if they are okay, Transport and Communications, even when a Member if their temperatures are fine and if they follow health of Parliament tried to tell them that there is no road… practitioners’ orders. MR SPEAKER: Honourable Kablay, I have made a Mr Speaker, we all have to fight this virus. The ruling. Do not revisit those points. Government wants to defeat this virus, so we have to do everything in our power to fight this virus so that we can MR KABLAY: I am sorry Mr Speaker. defeat it. If some developments have to be implemented Mr Speaker, you have given the President Dr Masisi but we realise that there are monetary constraints, powers so that if things do not go well during this we should take funds which were budgeted for those pandemic, he can take action. He should speak out so developments and use them to fight the virus because that we give him powers again, for him to carry on. So developments are not taking place in our constituencies Mr Speaker, let me advise that it would not be wrong if because apparently funds are diverted to the fight against the President can come here today and say… this virus. There should be uniformity. HONOURABLE MEMBER: Mr Speaker! MR SPEAKER: Honourable Kablay, Honourable Moswaane’s hand is up. Honourable Moswaane, and MR SPEAKER: Honourable PPP, who gave you then Honourable PPP. permission to talk? No one is allowed to speak.

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MR KABLAY: If the President realises that it is not in relation to protecting public servants, leaders who enough, that we have not done enough to fight this virus, are said to have failed and that Minister Segokgo does it is not wrong to extend the State of Emergency (SoE) not even know where to start. This is quite damaging to yet again because what we want Mr Speaker, is to get rid other people. of this virus in our country. We have been told that here and there we are not going to be able to do things as we MR SPEAKER: Honourable Moswaane... have been doing them. So I was… MR MOSWAANE: I want you to explain your ruling MR SPEAKER: Honourable Saleshando’s hand is up so that it can be very clear Mr Speaker. Honourable Kablay. MR SPEAKER: No, wait, I am going to be very clear MR SALESHANDO: Thank you. If Honourable with you. Clear! clear! clear! mind. Honourable Kablay Kablay permits, I request that he should clarify one never said so and so is corrupt. He said, there is a lot of point that he is talking about now. corruption which he knew has been there at Transport, which right now the Minister is fighting to address. MR SPEAKER: Honourable Kablay, Leader of the From that statement, you cannot say somebody is out Opposition is asking for clarification. of order, because he was saying his view in terms of MR SALESHANDO: Clarification. Thank you what he has gathered as information. So that is why I am Honourable Kablay. Quickly, why do you believe that saying, you cannot say, Kablay is out of order. State of Public Emergency can reduce the spread of MR KABLAY: Thank you Mr Speaker, lastly let me the virus even though there is no country that managed talk about the powers conferred on the Director of to reduce the spread of virus by using State of Public Health. She needs to take action Mr Speaker when she Emergency? In Botswana, the numbers are still sees things going awry. When things are not going well escalating, we are still in our first wave. The first wave as we are talking about this disease, if we see that we go has passed in other countries, their cases are dropping, around spreading it… and they are curbing the virus. Why do you believe that State of Public Emergency can reduce the spread of the MR SPEAKER: Honourable Kablay, Honourable PPP virus while we are not managing now? is up again, I tried calling him earlier and I could not locate him. MR KABLAY: Mr Speaker, I believe that SoE helped us. If it was not compulsory for people to wear masks, MR MOATLHODI: Point of procedure. Thank you Mr no social distancing, we would not be amongst the Speaker. I rise on a point of procedure but you will guide lowest. It is said that this virus is contracted when one me sir. I have got nothing against Honourable Kablay’s is not wearing a mask. When one is wearing a mask, it submission. I am asking from you because the whole is possible for him or her to prevent the virus. I believe afternoon my hand has been up … the whole afternoon! that SoE helped us when things were getting out of It is only now that you recognised me. Now this new control. Sometimes when there is no order at the bars, system where we are muted from control tower, I am we close them in order to put things back in order before finding it very unfair more especially on some of us and we can open them. These are the things that we want … I plead with your good self Mr Speaker, let us go back (Inaudible)…people are not allowed to do as they please to the old system, where we could mute and unmute like some people wanted. I strongly believe in SoE, and ourselves. I know that it was discontinued because I am one of the people who can support it Mr Speaker. others kept interfering. No, I need to be fair and frank, it is Honourable Molale who kept interjecting. Do not MR SPEAKER: Honourable Kablay, Honourable punish us on the basis of one person, I plead with you Moswaane’s hand is up again. Mr Speaker. Thank you sir.

MR MOSWAANE: Mr Speaker, it is a point of MR SPEAKER: Your point is noted sir, but the truth procedure. is, we saw it as a better way of managing people who MR SPEAKER: Go ahead Honourable Moswaane. interrupt even you Honourable PPP. I do not think it is only Honourable Molale, maybe you are just singling MR MOSWAANE: I raised a point of order, you did not him out. Most people were interfering and that is the tell me what you are saying about the point that I raised best way of managing them. Your point is noted, we

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will re-look at it. This is our first time to use this virtual expect is that virtual Parliament is different from a system. So we are looking at its teething problems with physical one where we could have met, interaction will a view to improving it. So in the process, maybe we will not be the same, whether we like it or not. So when see what to do to manage all of you. Right now, let us we do virtual and others keep interrupting and making leave Honourable Kablay to go on with his debate. noise, we fail to hear the one given a chance to speak. So it is a problem. If it is physical, it is better you might MR KABLAY: Thank you Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker, I hear two voices. Therefore it becomes very disruptive. was talking about Director of Health Services, that she That is why we have resorted to this one. Like I said, we should… are experiencing this, it is a noted point. We will look MR LEUWE: Point of procedure. Thank you Mr into it and see what can work for us as we continue but Speaker, it was procedure, but you have covered it, but I know that this one that Honourable Members should I beg to differ Honourable PPP with due respect. To behave themselves is going to fail. manage this situation, it is not only Honourable Molale MINISTER OF LOCAL GOVERNMENT AND who interferes if at all he does, I did not hear him but RURAL DEVELOPMENT (MR MOLALE): Mr he is not the only one. Most Members when you speak Speaker, I stand on a point of order to say, this House interfere, even when I was debating last time, they were will be out of order if I am said to be interfering interfering but I believe the system is fine the way it is whereas I spent two days without being able to access right now. What I can request as a solution to Honourable this Chamber. I find that to be out of order; accusing a Moatlhodi is that we should not take long to recognise Member who did not do anything wrong and Honourable a raised hand. Mr Speaker, I support the system that we Moatlhodi is falsely accusing me. are using. It manages Parliament very well. MR SPEAKER: Honourable Molale, I heard you and MR SPEAKER: Thank you Honourable Leuwe. I have reprimanded. I said, he is not telling the truth Honourable Molale what point are you rising on? when he says you are the one interfering, that is if at all you interfered. He said you are the only one who ...Silence... interferes but we know that there are many who do so MR SPEAKER: Honourable Members, let us respond who forced us to implement this restriction because it quickly because now we are eating up on our time. was a bit disruptive. We know them. I have reprimanded Honourable Mmolotsi, are you there if Honourable and I believe he heard me. I do not think you are putting Molale does not appear? me under pressure to ask him to withdraw but when you have reprimanded someone, especially an elder like MR MMOLOTSI: Mr Speaker, I think Honourable PPP, he takes heed. Moatlhodi has a point. I do not think this is bad. Then again Mr Speaker, we must understand that we cannot MR KABLAY: I thank you Mr Speaker. Lastly Sir, have deathly silence in Parliament. We are requesting Director of... that you unmute us and ask Honourable Members to be MR SPEAKER: We are going to disturb you sir. responsible enough not to disturb the proceedings of Honourable Members are raising their hands in droves. Parliament. Sometimes one raises a hand for 10 minutes without being recognised but if you could allow us to MR THIITE: Thank you Mr Speaker. Going back to the be unmuted, it could help because you may also forget. issue of raising hands virtually, I heard you saying you Thank you. know people who are bringing disruptions in Parliament. Why not observe people who bring disruption from the MR SPEAKER: No, we have never forgotten. Actually control room and then mute them right now instead of it is me and the Clerks who are always watching the muting all because I had my hand raised almost the screen. So if it happens that I miss any activity, they whole day, but I have not been recognised? Thank you remind me. I do not remember waiting for 10 minutes sir. for a raised hand, I do not remember that case, not even more than a minute. Now to say Honourable Members MR SPEAKER: I think Honourable Thiite you are should behave themselves, I do not agree with that one repeating what has been said. Like I have said, we are Honourable Mmolotsi because they failed. That is why learning, because the system is new. In any project there we came up with this restriction. Now what we should are teething problems and then when they rise you come

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up with interim solutions, to come up with long term every member is going to give their opinion and we solutions. So that is why I am saying, it is a noted point, will disturb a member’s debate but he has a lot of good we will look at it. news. Please, I plead with you, let us allow Honourable Kablay to continue and conclude his debate. MINISTER OF TRANSPORT AND COMMUNICATIONS (MR SEGOKGO): Thank MR SPEAKER: Thank you very much Honourable you Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker, I also want to comment Minister. Like I said, we are not a closed institution. on this issue of muting all the microphones. We are accepting those comments in a view to try to MR SPEAKER: Is it a point of procedure honourable? incorporate some of them to improve our system. So, do not look at us as people who are closed. Like I said, MR SEGOKGO: Mr Speaker, I think we have all been we have got Clerks here who are watching the screen. trying to give some useful information on this matter As human beings, yes here and there we can take one of procedure raised by Honourable Moatlhodi. That is or two seconds without seeing the hands. Nevertheless, what I am speaking on. we are trying our best to be very watchful. Honourable Kablay, go ahead. MR SPEAKER: Okay, go ahead but you should state that you are standing on a point of procedure. MR KABLAY: Thank you Mr Speaker. Thank you Minister Rakgare. The last point is that Mr Speaker, MR SEGOKGO: Thank you Mr Speaker. I apologise the Director of Health Services and his officials who for that. I also wish our microphones should not have were assigned for this job, have the power sir. Since the been all muted. I think we have a good history of how holidays are around the corner and if he realises that we arrived there. I am one of the persons that have the lives of people are endangered by this pandemic, complained on several occasions about the interference that if people move or travel to other areas which are and what it even does to the virtual meetings audio. not greatly affected by this pandemic in large numbers, What I also want to add Mr Speaker is that, Honourable where he realises that they are going to spread it there, Moatlhodi does have a point, the virtual hand should he has the power to restrict permits. This exercise will really work properly. It should not really be that help us to control this pandemic because it will ensure somebody has to wait that long. I know I experienced that everyone stays wherever they are. Mr Speaker, we it myself. So, it is a plea that you should be always are crying today because we allowed people to move watchful so that you respond quickly to the virtual hand. during Christmas holidays but we were advised to avoid Then the last point Mr Speaker, it is just to try and inform unnecessary movements and call our family members. members that once you have been muted in that manner We were also reminded that we are still going to have and locked, there will be a pop-up at the time when the many Christmas holidays in future, but Batswana did control or the host unmutes you. Something pops-up not listen. Some of us travelled on the basis that they on your screen. When that pop-up pops-up, it asks you, miss their families; our mothers, fathers and siblings. “do you want to stay muted or do you want to unmute? What happened after that? We are crying today. There Please click the unmute.” Very often when people keep are some who were infected by this pandemic, those saying that this technology is not working, it is either who did not know about it. As we speak, this pandemic they are not responding to pop-up or it is because they is rapidly spreading in areas that we never expected. are just clicking on the stay muted. The pop-up has two So, I urge them to use their powers. There is no one who options and one of them is to say “unmute.” Thank you will do anything to them because they will be trying to Mr Speaker. shield the lives of Batswana, our very lives. We cannot MR SPEAKER: Thank you Honourable Segokgo. enjoy on a daily basis. So we must understand that we Honourable Rakgare, I hope you are not repeating the are no longer going to enjoy like we did in the past same words which have been said by others. years, as a result of this pandemic, not Government or the Director of Health. I thought to clarify that point Mr MINISTER OF YOUTH EMPOWERMENT, Speaker. SPORT AND CULTURE DEVELOPMENT (MR RAKGARE): Procedure. Yes sir. Mr Speaker, can we Lastly, I commend Honourable Moagi’s Ministry, the allow Honourable Kablay to continue? We will talk Ministry of Mineral Resources, Green Technology and about this issue at the General Assembly. Otherwise, Energy Security. Sir, we finally got electricity in our

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villages. It is connected in my constituency. There is MR BROOKS: Sorry Mr Speaker, I thought I was only one area which does not have electricity yet. This the next person to speak after Honourable Kablay but is a clear indication that Government is making efforts Honourable Tshere managed to catch your eye. Thank to patch here and there. So we want the Government to you. tackle other developments in our country in the same manner. Batswana are happy because you supplied MR SPEAKER: No, the arrangement is we are going them with electricity, candles are things of the past to take two and one. So, we took Honourable Kablay Honourable Members. We thank you Mr Speaker. and Honourable Motaosane, so we now move to the other side. Honourable Tshere, go ahead. Mr Speaker, we have to closely assess the issue of rightsizing public servants. We are expecting many MR TSHERE: Thank you Honourable Speaker. I think things in our constituencies. We expect Letlhakeng to be we are setting the time afresh. Thank you for giving upgraded from a sub-district to a district. This means, it me the opportunity to respond to the speech presented requires us to increase our workers there. We have been by Minister Dr Matsheka to thus deliver a message depending on Molepolole for a very long time. So it is from residents of Mahalapye. Let me also thank the time for us to be independent as residents of Letlhakeng, Opposition Whip, Honourable Motsamai who was you have to give us sufficient funds so that we can appointed recently, because our members kept saying, develop our constituency because it is big. Depending ‘we are going to snatch anyone who will be appointed on Molepolole is not working for us because some of the as the Opposition Whip.’ So we managed to appoint things which our people could be benefiting from, they him. I challenge you to snatch Honourable Motsamai cannot benefit from them because they will claim that away. That is our choice. Let me move on to commend Molepolole, Kweneng Council took this much while the sub-district got this much which is insufficient. the Member of Parliament for Gaborone Central who is also a political veteran, the founding President of We need staff sir. Just like Honourable Monnakgotla Botswana Congress Party (BCP), Comrade Michael said, we are not all business people. If we are asked Kitso Dingake, happy 93 years. You can see that it is to start businesses, the funds which Government give a journey well-travelled, “long live Comrade Dingake, to us are not going to be sufficient. So we might spend long live.” them in such a way that we cannot account for, where we will start bothering the Social Workers thereafter. Going back to Honourable Dr Matsheka’s report… That is why I am saying sir, some of us who come from growing constituencies need more and experienced MR SPEAKER: Honourable Healy’s hand is up, staff, not those who failed from other constituencies. Honourable Tshere. What point are you rising on We need responsible staff, those who can work hard and Honourable Healy? improve our constituencies. Those are the kind of staff MR MANGWEGAPE-HEALY: Thank you Mr that we need Mr Speaker. Thank you Mr Speaker. Speaker, clarification.

MR SPEAKER: Thank you very much Honourable MR SPEAKER: Honourable Tshere, he is asking for Kablay. clarification, are you yielding? MR TSHERE (MAHALAPYE WEST): Thank you MR TSHERE: No, there is no clarification Mr Speaker. very much Honourable Speaker. Earlier on, the previous Let me continue, I will yield tomorrow. Honourable Speaker mentioned that I was not audible enough that side. So, I do not know if I am audible MR SPEAKER: Go ahead Honourable Member. enough right now Honourable Speaker? MR TSHERE: Thank you very much. Let me focus MR SPEAKER: You are very loud and clear. on Dr Matsheka’s address as the Minister of Finance and Economic Development. Mr Speaker, this is my MR TSHERE: Thank you very much. This means I second time sitting in this House in my freshman term can proceed. Firstly, let me thank you for giving me the as Member of Parliament for Mahalapye West listening opportunity… to this speech. One thing I already realised as the MR SPEAKER: Sorry Honourable Tshere before you Honourable Members already alluded is that it is clear go on. I can see Honourable Brooks’ hand is up. What that the resources of the country are not proportionally point are you rising on Honourable Brooks? distributed. We have to be careful of this, they are not

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distributed proportionally. I have been here for two years, remove this thing although Mr Seretse says there is this is the second budget speech and there is no mention something which pops up, it takes time for it to pop so of Mahalapye and the challenges we face at the village. that one may be assisted. In any case… This is the reason I emphasise on the statement of those who say resources of the country are disproportionally MR SPEAKER: Honourable Members, we seem to distributed. At Mahalapye we are at a disadvantage when be having a technical problem, we cannot hear you it comes to the distribution of resources of this country. I properly. wonder what we ever did to deserve this as Mahalapye residents. For example; people of Mahalapye have been MR TSOGWANE: Procedure Mr Speaker. waiting for a bus rank for a long time. If I may offer you a historical background Mr Speaker; Mahalapye Bus MR SPEAKER: We cannot hear you properly Rank which was there, was built in 1985/86, somewhere Honourable Leader of the House. around that time and it was fit for purpose back then. As MR TSOGWANE: Procedure Mr Speaker. A1 road developed, it displaced Mahalapye Bus Rank. That is when there was a suggestion to move it to its MR SPEAKER: You are cutting, we cannot hear you. current location which was supposed to be temporary. Go ahead Honourable Leader of the House.

MR SPEAKER: Honourable Tshere, it seems like there MR TSOGWANE: I am audible Mr Speaker, do you is interruption in your system. Is there perhaps an expert hear me? who can assist you clarify your system, but go ahead. MR SPEAKER: That is better, that is better, yes. MR TSHERE: I do not know if it is better or should I move in closer? MR TSOGWANE: No, ask them to assist you that side. I am actually raising a point of procedure. Honourable MR SPEAKER: It is even worse. Tshere was audible, we were hearing him. It means there is a problem with your system that side because MR TSHERE: Really! Okay, then I do not know, let me call them. I do not know what you are going to do we heard Honourable Tshere when he was talking and in the meantime, do we freeze the clock while I call you kept saying he is not audible. Perhaps they can Information Technology (IT) officers Mr Speaker? assist you that side because…

MR SPEAKER: Honourable Tshere, can we give the MR SPEAKER: If the Chairperson cannot hear… floor to Honourable Brooks. Once you have clarified MR TSOGWANE: That is why I am saying, they your system, you will take the floor maybe tomorrow. should assist you with your system that side because MR BROOKS (KGALAGADI SOUTH): Thank you we are going to keep calling different Members of Mr Speaker for giving me the time to comment on the Parliament. They are not going to flow and it is going to Minister’s speech of Financial Year 2021/2022. Let me be problematic when their debates have to be broadcast also comment and thank the Minister for having put at Botswana Television (BTV). When a Member together the budget amidst the advent of COVID-19 Mr debates, he/she will do so for ten minutes then you call Speaker. I want to say… another one, people are not going to follow. Thank you Mr Speaker. MR SPEAKER: I can see the Leader of the House’s hand up, Honourable Brooks. Leader of the House, what MR SPEAKER: I hear you Honourable Leader of the point are you rising on sir? House, but what I am saying is that if the Chair cannot hear, then it is a problem. That is why I did not allow …Silence… him, because I have to manage the meeting, so if I cannot hear you, then there is no way I can allow you MR SPEAKER: Your Honour the Vice President, on to continue. That is why I have allowed Honourable what point are you rising sir? Brooks to take over. I hope the system will correct and …Silence… would not repeat that thing again.

LEADER OF THE HOUSE (MR TSOGWANE): MR BROOKS: Thank you Mr Speaker, I believe I am Thank you Mr Speaker, it takes quite some time to clear. Am I clear Mr Speaker?

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MR SPEAKER: You are very clear. I want to be clear Mr Speaker, I support the frontline workers who are fighting the COVID-19 virus, MR BROOKS: Thank you sir. I believe the effects especially those at Kgalagadi South District Health which befell us, most of us… Management Team (DHMT) and let me also say this MR SPEAKER: I can see Honourable Mmolotsi’s to the stakeholders; I have realised that in the past days hand up Honourable Brooks. Honourable Mmolotsi, the virus had taken a drastic turn in Kgalagadi District your hand is up, which point are you rising on? and you stood up, without looking at how the resources were. The little that you had, you used for the good and MR MMOLOTSI: Procedure. Mr Speaker, I agree necessary things and you worked hard. Keep working with Leader of the House that Honourable Tshere was hard so that you can be able to save lives of the nation. very audible, we heard him, I think IT officers should Mr Speaker, when I get into the Budget, let me be clear assist you that side because I suspect that if we keep and say when you look at page 20 of the current Budget, interrupting Members of Parliament, asking them to debate tomorrow, like the Vice President (VP) said, it I am not against it and how Honourable Matsheka has will affect their flow and therefore they will not conclude presented it. I am saying my contribution when I looked properly. I think we should deal with this problem so that at it Mr Speaker, maybe it would be better in a way Members of Parliament can flow properly and conclude if we did it the way it is or how I thought it. In that their presentations. way, I am not disputing what the Honourable Minister brought before us but actually, I am adding on whatever MR SPEAKER: I totally agree with you. I realised can maybe work for us better.

MR MMOLOTSI: Furthermore Mr Speaker, if we Mr Speaker, I want to indicate that when we look at were able to unmute ourselves we could advise you health, the disaster that has befallen us at the moment, I that we hear Members of Parliament so that you deal believe that an intense war has begun, which needed us with your system that side and not close out audible to be determined, prepared or we should be preparing for Members of Parliament. without hesitation. With that said, we were supposed to MR SPEAKER: How do I deal with my matter? think that the Ministry of Health, should have been the I totally understand you, your point is noted, but if I second one to be allocated that kind of money instead of do not hear you I mean, how can I continue with the the Ministry of Defence, Justice and Security. That is my debate? I have to close the Member and then get the observation as Honourable Member of this Honourable one who is audible. Let us allow this to go on, we will House, Mr Speaker. When we look at this war, it needed try to engage our IT experts to manage the situation. us to stand up and fight it without hesitation, but we Like I have said earlier, we are experiencing teething have to consider the rollout programme that the Minister problems, so let us be patient Honourable Members. I talked about recently on how he intends to proceed. I think BTV will forgive us if there is no flow. believe that he put before us a law and how he wants us to intervene, so that we can assist him and give each MR BROOKS: Thank you Mr Speaker. I want to start other ideas on how we can expand it. my debate by saying that I believe COVID-19 is one of the worst disasters to hit Botswana and the world at Mr Speaker, what made me say that the Ministry of large. Some of us have just started feeling the effects of Health should have been the second in the allocation COVID-19 pandemic. With that said Mr Speaker, for us of the budget is that, I am looking at our clinics in to maybe make reference of past events, it is going to be Botswana, especially those at my constituency, that if tough. We should be aware or realise the situation we tomorrow we are told that the vaccine is here, first of find ourselves in Mr Speaker. all where are we going to store it? Secondly the people we are supposed to vaccinate, since we are going to Mr Speaker, I want to begin by offering my condolences vaccinate everyone in the country, where are we going to all those who lost their loved ones in Botswana and to vaccinate them? When you take the Bokspits Clinic the whole world during COVID-19, especially those or the Bokspits, Rappelspan, Vaalhoek and Struizendam from Kgalagadi South Constituency. Let me offer them (BORAVAST) Cluster, we are talking about a lot of my condolences and also stand with them during their people Mr Speaker. The cattle posts that are around the time of grief and say, sorry people, God is there. Bokspits area, for their clinic…

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MR SPEAKER: Order! Honourable Brooks, I can see MR BROOKS: I yield Mr Speaker. Honourable Motsamai’s hand. Honourable Member, what point are you standing on? Honourable Motsamai, MS MONNAKGOTLA: On a point of elucidation. your hand is up. Thank you Mr Speaker. Let me thank Honourable Brooks, he is right, especially when he talks about MR MOTSAMAI: Mr Speaker, I had raised my hand clinics of areas like Bokspits, Ukhwi and Hunhukwe. before you called the clerk when he was advising you They are small Honourable Member to an extent that there. we do not know how we are going to vaccinate these people. Minister of Health, should look into that, those MR SPEAKER: Honourable Motsamai, say what you clinics are supposed to have social distancing and even want to say. fridges. Thank you Mr Speaker. MR MOTSAMAI: My point Mr Speaker, was a MR BROOKS: Thank you Mr Speaker. That is what correction on Honourable Brooks’s statement. He said I am saying. I was still emphasising that when we take something that may end up being taken the wrong way Bokspits Clinic, I was through with that one. When by people. we look at Tsabong Primary Hospital, even the basin MR SPEAKER: Honourable Motsamai, are you that receives all the patients from Kgalagadi, under 25 standing on a point of correction? villages I mentioned recently Mr Speaker. I believe that we can realise that and I am disappointed that even MR MOTSAMAI: Thank you Honourable Member. now no Honourable Minister has been there. Let me MR SPEAKER: Honourable Brooks, are you yielding? not talk about Ministers never going there, but let me talk about the situation of the virus that the Honourable MR BROOKS: I am yielding; I am listening to the Minister put before us, and what he really thinks we correction that Honourable Motsamai wants to bring before this House. can do to assist him. Let me also say when you take Middlepits Clinic, which its cluster includes areas like MR SPEAKER: Honourable Motsamai, go ahead. Khawa, Gakhibane, Kolonkwaneng, Bogogobo and the cattle posts around those villages, the likes of Lobu MR MOTSAMAI: On a point of correction. Mr Speaker, when he said he is offering condolences to and so on, all of them get services there. When we talk the people who lost family and friends because of the about Werda Clinic, it is a clinic that services places epidemic virus. He indicated that he is specifically like Hereford, Banyana Farms, Makanyane, Kokotsha, offering condolences to the people of Kgalagadi District. Draaihoek, Makopong, the surrounding villages and I am saying he should withdraw the word ‘especially’ the cattle posts. Mr Speaker, when you look at the because death is just death, it does not matter if you state of those clinics, consider that since the outbreak are in Kgalagadi, Ngami, or wherever. He should just of COVID, we were compromising and how hard we say he is offering condolences to all Batswana families worked hard. The health workers of my constituency Mr who lost their lives, since I know that he is someone Speaker, did not sleep because of the state of clinics, the with a good heart, he should not include the statement way the virus was contracted and how it spread, it was ‘especially Kgalagadi.’ Thank you. a problem. So right now they are really still in that kind of situation. We are now ordering vaccines; where and MR BROOKS: Thank you Mr Speaker. The concern how are they going to store them? I think that right now is noted. as we are making the Budget, we could have included the mobile clinics which will augment the challenges MR SPEAKER: Honourable Brooks, let me say this, I in those clinics, back in the villages. People would rush can see that there is also Honourable Monnakgotla there there on time to get the vaccine to avoid these many who is raising her hand. You have to take them all. deaths which are befalling us. Mr Speaker, we have to MR BROOKS: Is it not that they are consuming my talk about these issues wholeheartedly, considering the time Mr Speaker? challenges that the Ministry of Health and Wellness is facing. Considering how the pandemic is ravaging and MR SPEAKER: No Honourable Member. She is making the human race disappear. These are things I am asking for elucidation. taking into consideration.

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Mr Speaker, some Members of Parliament have talked the services to Banyana farms, so that people could be about retired nurses and doctors; some left work through assisted timeously. I can see that you are showing me illness and other various reasons. We have to ask them the time that you have been allowing the Honourable to come back to work, to come and assist us in this Members to devour. pandemic. We will not be doing this for the first time. We once did that during the cattle lung disease (CBPP) Mr Speaker, at this point in time, the Honourable and Foot and Mouth Disease (FMD). When times are Ministers have to congratulate the employees. I made hard, we call retired doctors and veterinarians to assist a plea that other year that Ministers should go to in the pandemic. Mr Speaker, we know that when it is Kgalagadi. I am talking about the Ministers of Health hard, or when we have been hit by certain diseases, we and Wellness in this regard. They should go and motivate ask for help from retired nurses and social workers to the workers who are working tirelessly on their behalf. assist in this exercise. They should go and congratulate them and say keep it up! That would encourage the employees and make Mr Speaker, one of the things we have to consider in them work even harder without growing weary. health is that, how many Emergency Medical Service (EMS) ambulances do we have back at constituencies Mr Speaker, going to the issue of Citizen Entrepreneurial to assist. Here we are talking about a war that does Development Agency (CEDA), we launched the new not have a boundary; we cannot just say this war is guidelines. I am sorry to say this; we were elated and we just in cities and towns. We are talking about a war in ululated because they increased the threshold of what which even when there are permits, it just ravages. The could be acquired. The help we can get from CEDA at Honourable Minister should have calmed us down by the same time brings challenges that can prevent access telling us how many EMS ambulances he is planning to those funds. I am talking about the people in my to distribute at a constituency like Kgalagadi South, constituency, when they submit today one is told, ‘we Kgalagadi North, Ghanzi North and Ghanzi South; and need you to bring the grass assessment.’ The Kgalagadi the whole country of Botswana. This is why I believe area is renowned for livestock rearing for all these without a doubt that we are in a dicey situation. We want years, so when someone applies for funding they should to combat this enemy that wants to make the human race not be told, ‘go and bring us a report which shows us vanish, COVID-19. All of us as Members of Parliament the type of grass that is found here.’ Mr Speaker, this is can arise and agree that EMS ambulances and their not right, who is this person going to find to assist them, service providers should go to the constituencies. and where, concerning that assessment. Mr Speaker, the other thing which is wanted is the water analysis. One of the Members of Parliament said, “By now our We have been giving water to cattle that are running eyes should have been opened, because we do not know the economy of Botswana; water from our boreholes what tomorrow will bring. Today is COVID, what is for many years and then it is said one should come up next?” Let us arise and ensure that we increase training with a water analysis. We cannot tell the people that for nurses and doctors. When funds permit, we should we are helping them and at the same time we make call back our own people who are abroad so that they things hard for them. We are going nowhere. I want the can come back and serve in Botswana, to augment the Ministers of Investment, Trade and Industry to move numbers. We should give them incentives so that they out of their comfort zone and go to the people and see can find themselves in their own country to come and why CEDA is making them suffer like this. We cannot assist to fight the enemy who is messing up things so just sit in offices in Parliament when people are having much. challenges to access CEDA funding through which the Government thought which they would create jobs, find Mr Speaker, I have an area which seems to be forgotten, jobs and produce food for the country and doing serious the Banyana Farms. We used to have a clinic at Banyana businesses. Mr Speaker, it is high time we walked the Farms. When Banyana Farms was liquidated, I would talk. We should not just talk when we are here, yet the like to point out that, it is only the administration that people out there are in trouble. was discharged, but the personnel from the Ministry of Agriculture is still there. When we talk about the This issue of grass has really affected me. I have about Molopo and Harvest Group farms, the people who were 16 applicants who came to the Parliament office in there during a time when we had the clinic are still there. Tsabong who have asked for water from me. I believe They still need the services from a clinic. Let us take I am one of the cattle barons in Kgalagadi, and I was

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told, ‘go and bring us the grass report.’ Mr Speaker, are still lagging behind. I want to plead with Minister that is not how things can work. Those who want to Molale that, as he will be allocating funds towards improve their businesses for P50 000 are asked to come building houses for the less privileged people, he should with their financial statement, even if one wants P50 mainly focus on Kokotsha area Mr Speaker because 000 to increase their stock. Mr Speaker, some of these there is misery there. That tarred road passes through Kokotsha, but there is poverty surrounding Kokotsha things cannot be allowed. Please show me the time I am and BORAVAST. Let us arise and pay attention to these remaining with as regularly as possible. issues. We are sent here by elders from these areas Now going to Local Government; I appreciate the with the hope that our voices will land in the ears of budget we are going to give them. My problem is with our leaders or different ministers. By saying that, when the Constituency Community Projects (CCP). Currently we ask for assistance from these ministries, they should we submitted the project memorandum of 2020/2021 for arise and go to these constituencies for them to see what the CCP; they have been withheld because apparently we are talking about if they want the truth behind the there are some funds that we did not utilise. When we issues that we are raising Mr Speaker. go to our Councils in Kgalagadi, they say we have As for building teachers houses at McCarthy’s Rust Mr made use of the funds. When we come here to make use Speaker, we cannot expect results to improve if teachers of…It is like a game of football between Gunners and still commute 30 kilometres (km) every morning in Gaborone United (GU), the ball being kicked to and fro, cold weathers, rains and using bad roads between as Members of Parliament. Mr Speaker, who is telling Tsabong and McCarthy’s Rust. We cannot say that the truth? Going back to the constituencies, planners we are expecting good results Mr Speaker. Children showed me a report to say, ‘sir the funds for the financial at Phepheng still travel 15 km every morning to go to projects that are said to be owed have been utilised. The school at Bopaganang which is in Draaihoek, but we problem is that the ministry does not update their reports expect good results Mr Speaker. on time. That is why on the system it appears as if we are owing, when in fact we are not.’ Mr Speaker, let us Mr Speaker, there is no region without a leader. We improve how we are doing things, to advance during the made a request, I have said and pleaded that applications five-year period that we would still be in Government. which are made by Werda and Vaalhoek Dikgosi should Batswana have lent us this time so that we could make be considered. May I be straightforward and say that, developments for them as we have promised. that is my plea because they had asked for an extension, I am not saying that there should be an extension. It When we talk about Ipelegeng, I really want to give should not take this long because it is not similar to the thanks. I fully agree with what Minister Molale case in which Dikgosi left work because of old age. That just said, that we have to transform Ipelegeng. Mr is where we can assess and say, we are in the middle of Speaker, in previous years, most of the young people COVID-19 pandemic hence consultation is going to be a in my Constituency trained to be builders through the bit of a challenge. We are talking about Dikgosi who are Ipelegeng Programme in which schools, bus shelters already there, they have submitted that they plead for an and other infrastructures were constructed. Today they extension. There is a Setswana idiom which says “naga are able to sustain themselves by doing manual work e e senang khudutlou, bo lebeto ba ipha naga” which which they learnt at Ipelegeng. Mr Speaker, let us adopt means that when there is no leader or an elder, people that initiative although I am having doubts because tend to do as they please. Mr Speaker, every community we have long talked about this issue since last year, is strengthened by having a Kgosi, be it by right of birth what is hindering us? What is holding us back from or an appointed one. For as long as there is a Kgosi in implementing this as we will be starting the financial that area, people tend you feel proud Mr Speaker. That year? As January 2021 just began, Ipelegeng programme is why I thought that I should address it Mr Speaker, is starting so we should seize seeing people cutting grass that we should pay attention to it. I still want to point and instead they should be building houses, things that out that in my constituency, there are still some Dikgosi are in accordance with Ipelegeng. What is holding us whose overtime allowance has not been paid since the back Mr Speaker. first lockdown to date. They have not received their overtime allowance and this is a challenge Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker, my Constituency which consists of Bokspits, Rappelspan, Vaalhoek and Struizendam (BORAVAST) Mr Speaker, my constituency has many challenges. We and Kokotsha areas is one of the constituencies which have long had a sub-district since 10 years back but we

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have never had a District Commissioner at sub-district level. The present District Commissioner who is also acting… I work with elderly people. I thank them for doing a good job, even though they are all acting. When will I have a permanent District Commissioner at my Constituency? Where will we go if we are still operating with acting staff? I get scared when I hear that some posts are going to be frozen Mr Speaker. Are they not going to freeze the position of a District Commissioner for Tsabong Sub-District?

MR SPEAKER: Order! Honourable Members, time is up. You are still left with a minute but time is up Honourable Member. At this juncture, let me call upon the Leader of the House to move a Motion of adjournment.

MOTION

ADJOURNMENT

LEADER OF THE HOUSE (MR TSOGWANE): Thank you Mr Speaker. The Honourable Members can now go and rest. You are making an effort to use this technology, you are really trying.

Question put and agreed to.

The Assembly accordingly adjourned at 6:00 p.m. until Friday 12th February, 2021 at 9:00 a.m.

Hansard No 201 55 HANSARD RECORDERS Mr. T. Gaodumelwe, Mr T. Monakwe, Ms T. Kebonang HANSARD REPORTERS Mr M. Buti, Ms Z. Molemi, Mr J. Samunzala, Ms N. Selebogo, Ms A. Ramadi, Ms D. Thibedi, Ms G. Baotsi, Ms N. Mokoka

HANSARD EDITORS Ms K. Nyanga, Ms C. Chonga, Mr K. Goeme, Ms G. Phatedi, Ms B. Malokwane, Mr A. Mokopakgosi, Ms O. Nkatswe, Ms G. Lekopanye, Ms T. Mokhure, Ms B. Ratshipa HANSARD TRANSLATORS Ms B. Ntisetsang, Ms M. Sekao, Ms B. Mosinyi, Ms V. Nkwane, Ms N. Kerobale, Ms K. Motswakhumo, Ms T. Motsau, Ms O. Phesodi, Mr K. Setswe

LAYOUT DESIGNERS Mr B. B. Khumanego, Mr D. T. Batshegi, Mr K. Rebaisakae

56 Hansard No 201