Podcast Episode

Season 1, Episode 15: In Conversation with Theo Koll From the ULI Germany: Real Estate ??? Cities ??? People Date: September 04, 2020

00:00:00 --> 00:00:04: Real estate provided people of the USA Germany Podcast co-creators 00:00:04 --> 00:00:06: of the built environment, 00:00:06 --> 00:00:10: creators of the real estate industry 00:00:10 --> 00:00:12: and personalities who shape our cities. 00:00:12 --> 00:00:18: Real estate, cities, people this common thread runs through our 00:00:18 --> 00:00:18: programs, 00:00:18 --> 00:00:22: our podcasts and of course also through the evening song 00:00:23 --> 00:00:27: Sammet what distinguishes the Julei from other organizations? 00:00:27 --> 00:00:33: We consistently look at all real estate issues in an 00:00:33 --> 00:00:37: urban context and always focus on people. 00:00:37 --> 00:00:42: The actions of the industry of all of us are 00:00:42 --> 00:00:44: socially relevant. 00:00:44 --> 00:00:48: So who, if I do the Julei, should also examine 00:00:48 --> 00:00:52: all socially relevant topics and not only look outside the 00:00:52 --> 00:00:52: box, 00:00:52 --> 00:00:55: but also think and act? 00:00:55 --> 00:00:59: The world is not only in turmoil since today, 00:00:59 --> 00:01:07: but today, in September 2020, we feel this particularly intensely. 00:01:07 --> 00:01:10: I am very pleased to have the present conversation with 00:01:11 --> 00:01:11: a man who, 00:01:11 --> 00:01:14: since his studies in politics, history, 00:01:14 --> 00:01:18: sociology and state law, has always been and is always 00:01:18 --> 00:01:19: where 00:01:19 --> 00:01:22: it is governed. About Washington and Tokyo 8 years in 00:01:22 --> 00:01:23: London, 5 00:01:23 --> 00:01:26: years in Paris and for a year and a half 00:01:26 --> 00:01:30: in Berlin as head of zdf's capital studio.

1 00:01:30 --> 00:01:33: He says the world is not just in turmoil. 00:01:33 --> 00:01:36: Since Corona, it has also accelerated in transition. 00:01:36 --> 00:01:39: We are experiencing a turning point in which in a 00:01:39 --> 00:01:43: very short time a great deal of future is decided 00:01:43 --> 00:01:44: warmly theo Koll. 00:01:46 --> 00:01:55: What, please, is it? When we first spoke to each 00:01:55 --> 00:01:57: other on the 00:01:57 --> 00:02:00: phone last December, we quickly agreed on the title of 00:02:00 --> 00:02:01: the world in turmoil. 00:02:01 --> 00:02:04: It was a world of multiple conflicts, 00:02:04 --> 00:02:08: but in which Corona has not played a role at 00:02:08 --> 00:02:08: all. 00:02:08 --> 00:02:13: The pandemic is a global and political social stress test. 00:02:13 --> 00:02:18: Countries with capable, responsible governments are doing comparatively well by 00:02:18 --> 00:02:23: starting with weak institutions, and incompetent or corrupt leadership must 00:02:23 --> 00:02:24: be stagnation. 00:02:24 --> 00:02:28: Instability and impoverishment fear we start with a look at 00:02:28 --> 00:02:29: Germany have said that 00:02:29 --> 00:02:33: the world is in turmoil and we spoke to each 00:02:33 --> 00:02:34: other last week 00:02:34 --> 00:02:36: saying we are now going out and from the outside 00:02:36 --> 00:02:39: to the inside and now we are going from the 00:02:39 --> 00:02:39: inside out. 00:02:42 --> 00:02:46: Germany and if the view of Germany and the local 00:02:46 --> 00:02:50: perception in the last 12 years we had 4 big 00:02:50 --> 00:02:51: crises 00:02:51 --> 00:02:53: that somehow ever seemed as 00:02:53 --> 00:02:57: if they had suddenly fallen from the sky. 00:02:57 --> 00:03:01: These crises have in the public perception of a common 00:03:02 --> 00:03:05: one they seem to have evaded any prevention and then 00:03:06 --> 00:03:10: are eerily quickly almost exponential have they unfolded? 00:03:10 --> 00:03:15: The financial crisis, the so-called refugee crisis, the corona crisis, 00:03:15 --> 00:03:15: of 00:03:15 --> 00:03:18: course, the climate crisis, which somehow always runs along so 00:03:18 --> 00:03:18: constantly. 00:03:18 --> 00:03:20: And what do you perceive? 00:03:20 --> 00:03:25: A policy of alternativelessness and a state of emergency naturally 00:03:25 --> 00:03:30: fuels conspiracy theories and the irrational part of society Mr

2 00:03:30 --> 00:03:30: Koll. 00:03:30 --> 00:03:33: What can politics do differently, 00:03:33 --> 00:03:38: that they are perceive differently from the one just described? 00:03:38 --> 00:03:40: Good question, then, I think 00:03:40 --> 00:03:44: this crisis is different from other crises before, 00:03:44 --> 00:03:49: and so it is a greater opportunity for politics. 00:03:49 --> 00:03:54: Something else can and we all I 00:03:54 --> 00:03:57: believe this pandemic. 00:03:57 --> 00:04:04: More closely goes to all of us social coordinate system 00:04:04 --> 00:04:07: and therefore all of us. 00:04:07 --> 00:04:13: Are and must be more prepared for change the financial 00:04:13 --> 00:04:17: crisis of the affected certain areas 00:04:17 --> 00:04:20: yes, that had to be 00:04:20 --> 00:04:24: borne financially, but the KO? Fit 19 Crisis is 00:04:24 --> 00:04:28: something that goes on in 00:04:28 --> 00:04:32: all areas of life, and it has a very peculiar 00:04:32 --> 00:04:33: dialectic. 00:04:33 --> 00:04:37: On the one hand we have all been slowed down, 00:04:37 --> 00:04:43: so a psychologist, has described the time Germany disintegrates into 00:04:43 --> 00:04:47: 2 areas into the floodplain and into the grey country. 00:04:47 --> 00:04:51: I would suggest that everyone in this Chamber is more 00:04:51 --> 00:04:53: in the floodplain, 00:04:53 --> 00:04:56: so we have seen this as a slowdown. 00:04:56 --> 00:05:00: Many trips many way, many 00:05:00 --> 00:05:03: appointments, many way. Suddenly you had time. 00:05:03 --> 00:05:06: The President of the Federal Republic of Germany told me 00:05:06 --> 00:05:08: in the summer interview that he would have cleaned up 00:05:08 --> 00:05:10: his cellar for days, whether it was true or not. 00:05:10 --> 00:05:14: But I think that's what many of us have done, 00:05:14 --> 00:05:16: so if you want to put it 00:05:16 --> 00:05:19: nasty, we've fallen into a kind of Biedermeier. 00:05:19 --> 00:05:22: For a few months a few weeks. 00:05:22 --> 00:05:29: but. It has changed our all coordinate system and at 00:05:29 --> 00:05:32: the same time is 00:05:32 --> 00:05:35: besides this acceleration, that's what I just meant with that 00:05:35 --> 00:05:37: with the dialectic. 00:05:37 --> 00:05:42: Has there been an acceleration of change and will still 00:05:42 --> 00:05:46: bring it I believe that this year 2020 man is 00:05:46 --> 00:05:51: always somehow inclined to pull any superlatives and. 00:05:51 --> 00:05:54: And looking ahead, you can do it very easily and 00:05:55 --> 00:05:57: be a bit irresponsible, but I

3 00:05:57 --> 00:06:01: really believe that this year will be a turning point 00:06:01 --> 00:06:02: when we 00:06:02 --> 00:06:07: look back. Then, in 2020 and corona is likely to 00:06:07 --> 00:06:08: lead to 00:06:08 --> 00:06:12: us seeing much more serious processes of change in our 00:06:12 --> 00:06:17: society and we are bringing them in ourselves than, for 00:06:17 --> 00:06:20: example, the financial crisis. 00:06:20 --> 00:06:25: The refugee crisis also had major changes. 00:06:25 --> 00:06:30: However, we now have the AFD in Parliament and many 00:06:30 --> 00:06:33: other social upheavals. 00:06:33 --> 00:06:37: Covid captures all of us in Germany in a very 00:06:37 --> 00:06:40: special way, but of course worldwide. 00:06:40 --> 00:06:43: I believe that this will bring about change. 00:06:43 --> 00:06:46: I don't know how your company is doing. 00:06:46 --> 00:06:51: With us on ZDF, this is not a modern start-up, 00:06:51 --> 00:06:56: but we have nevertheless gone into digitalization in one in 00:06:56 --> 00:06:57: huge steps. 00:06:57 --> 00:07:00: So that went something from 00:07:00 --> 00:07:02: quickly that colleagues. 00:07:02 --> 00:07:06: Ready to make mobile office we cut movies from the 00:07:06 --> 00:07:08: kitchen from home, transferred 00:07:08 --> 00:07:11: with cameras into the cutting room. 00:07:11 --> 00:07:14: The pictures will be seen, films will 00:07:14 --> 00:07:18: be mounted, the colleagues will discuss this on the iphone 00:07:18 --> 00:07:20: so all of a sudden it went all the way 00:07:20 --> 00:07:22: and that would have been colleagues. 00:07:22 --> 00:07:27: Colleagues in this would have taken years 00:07:27 --> 00:07:30: of persuasion to even touch them. 00:07:30 --> 00:07:33: So the theme is all these the Zoom Meetings and 00:07:33 --> 00:07:33: and. 00:07:33 --> 00:07:36: The Culture Conference has become a different 00:07:36 --> 00:07:40: one, so alone, it has brought about 00:07:40 --> 00:07:43: incredible changes when you get back to politics. 00:07:43 --> 00:07:46: If we assume that the Corona 00:07:46 --> 00:07:49: crisis is not a one-off pandemic, 00:07:49 --> 00:07:52: but the introduction to a pandemic phase, 00:07:52 --> 00:07:55: so it will be a state of emergency. 00:07:55 --> 00:07:57: Once again, what kind of policy do 00:07:57 --> 00:08:01: we need when control measures become permanent measures? 00:08:01 --> 00:08:05: What do you think we in this country of politics? 00:08:05 --> 00:08:08: This would have to be experienced in order to be

4 00:08:08 --> 00:08:09: able to deal with it better. 00:08:09 --> 00:08:14: I believe that last weekend, for example, 00:08:14 --> 00:08:18: showed that we must make policy transparent, 00:08:18 --> 00:08:21: very clear. Why is the measure in place? 00:08:21 --> 00:08:24: X or Y? 00:08:24 --> 00:08:28: And perhaps even more than it has been so far, 00:08:28 --> 00:08:32: the refugee crisis in 2015 has basically already shown 00:08:32 --> 00:08:35: that politics explains too little, 00:08:35 --> 00:08:39: so the chancellor's word we can do it, 00:08:39 --> 00:08:42: that was not enough as an 00:08:42 --> 00:08:45: explanation, and we were not prepared for it either. 00:08:45 --> 00:08:49: Anyone who knew a little bit about Syria, who 00:08:49 --> 00:08:52: knew what was happening, what 00:08:52 --> 00:08:55: is likely to be a thing of the past. 00:08:55 --> 00:08:59: Because UN support had been reduced, it 00:08:59 --> 00:09:01: was clear that the pressure would grow 00:09:01 --> 00:09:04: for people to leave the country. 00:09:04 --> 00:09:08: But we have not been prepared for 00:09:08 --> 00:09:12: it, as a society, and it has also been explained 00:09:12 --> 00:09:13: insufficiently 00:09:13 --> 00:09:16: in hindsight, and I believe that 00:09:16 --> 00:09:19: we must avoid, in the event of 00:09:19 --> 00:09:23: a pandemic in measures that become so much in the 00:09:23 --> 00:09:24: lives 00:09:24 --> 00:09:29: of all interventions, closed, people must stay at home and 00:09:29 --> 00:09:32: raise the children, now this whole thing is 00:09:32 --> 00:09:36: quarantined back and forth, right? If you 00:09:36 --> 00:09:37: come back from risk areas, it's a test and so 00:09:38 --> 00:09:38: on. 00:09:38 --> 00:09:39: So I believe that we 00:09:39 --> 00:09:41: must, we must have clear guidelines, 00:09:41 --> 00:09:44: and above all we must explain them well. 00:09:44 --> 00:09:46: Can politics now be in crisis mode? 00:09:46 --> 00:09:50: It feels as if we are permanently in crisis mode, 00:09:50 --> 00:09:52: and we have been there for months now, to 00:09:52 --> 00:09:55: what extent can we still be shaped? 00:09:55 --> 00:09:59: Is there still room for manoeuvre in politics? 00:09:59 --> 00:10:03: Yes, interestingly, more is being done than before the interesting 00:10:03 --> 00:10:05: to what extent, well, they look at this, 00:10:05 --> 00:10:09: so what was basically decided in a very short time 00:10:09 --> 00:10:10: in Berlin.

5 00:10:10 --> 00:10:14: Now, even in the Grand Coalition, the values for the 00:10:14 --> 00:10:19: grand coalition are high shots, especially for the Union, 00:10:19 --> 00:10:21: and this was partly due to the 00:10:21 --> 00:10:26: fact that, after a long time, government was also possible 00:10:26 --> 00:10:26: again. 00:10:26 --> 00:10:32: So many things have been decided together in the coalition 00:10:32 --> 00:10:36: and of course this had something to do with crisis 00:10:36 --> 00:10:37: awareness. 00:10:37 --> 00:10:40: So, to the extent that I believe that. 00:10:40 --> 00:10:44: State of crisis in itself. 00:10:44 --> 00:10:46: Can have something good, so 00:10:46 --> 00:10:49: the Chinese have a letter, 00:10:49 --> 00:10:50: I have been told, 00:10:50 --> 00:10:55: which means crisis and opportunity at the same time, and 00:10:55 --> 00:10:56: this pandemic has both 00:10:56 --> 00:11:00: is a crisis, yes, but it is also an opportunity 00:11:00 --> 00:11:03: and I believe that this is an opportunity, is for 00:11:03 --> 00:11:04: change. 00:11:04 --> 00:11:06: Mhm, what do you believe, it is 00:11:06 --> 00:11:11: that the Germans, who have come through the crisis comparatively 00:11:11 --> 00:11:11: well, 00:11:11 --> 00:11:14: have already taken to the streets in May? 00:11:14 --> 00:11:18: In contrast to the Italians and the French, the protest 00:11:18 --> 00:11:18: tends to 00:11:18 --> 00:11:23: In this I say peoples who have endured their much 00:11:23 --> 00:11:27: more intrusive restrictions relatively quietly. 00:11:27 --> 00:11:29: It is a very good question 00:11:29 --> 00:11:32: to which I do not have a good answer. 00:11:32 --> 00:11:37: So it is interesting that we are basically much more 00:11:37 --> 00:11:41: disciplined people and behave in this way. 00:11:41 --> 00:11:45: I have only been back in Germany for a year 00:11:45 --> 00:11:46: and a 00:11:46 --> 00:11:49: half now, I have been in France for a long 00:11:49 --> 00:11:52: time and the French are known to go on the 00:11:52 --> 00:11:55: streets first and in the end they try to 00:11:55 --> 00:11:58: find a solution somehow, which is already very impressive in 00:11:58 --> 00:12:01: the collective bargaining negotiations, so that before 00:12:01 --> 00:12:04: you even talk, you go to demonstrate first. This is 00:12:04 --> 00:12:07: different in Germany and so I think it is also 00:12:07 --> 00:12:09: an interesting phenomenon. 00:12:09 --> 00:12:16: The irritated Heid in the population is surprisingly high overall

6 00:12:17 --> 00:12:20: and perhaps that is also one. 00:12:20 --> 00:12:25: Part of it I experienced from abroad in 00:12:25 --> 00:12:28: 2015, but I feel 00:12:28 --> 00:12:36: that since 2015 a not insignificant part of the population. 00:12:36 --> 00:12:41: An increasing potential for aggression is felt and lived out. 00:12:41 --> 00:12:47: Today we have the new study of the Bertelsmann Foundation, 00:12:47 --> 00:12:52: which interestingly says that the proportion of the . 00:12:52 --> 00:12:57: But the population prone to populism has 00:12:57 --> 00:12:59: declined, if you look at the numbers. 00:12:59 --> 00:13:01: It is now only one in five. 00:13:01 --> 00:13:04: There was once one in three people 00:13:04 --> 00:13:07: in Germany, so that's already massive proportions of the population. 00:13:07 --> 00:13:11: That was, they speak, which is very interesting, 00:13:11 --> 00:13:13: the irritated heid and the perception. 00:13:13 --> 00:13:18: We are living a radical protest with absurd constellations, but 00:13:18 --> 00:13:24: in the end these hardcore critics face a clear social 00:13:24 --> 00:13:25: majority. 00:13:25 --> 00:13:28: Nevertheless, the radical protest seems to many to be an 00:13:28 --> 00:13:30: expression of a majority will. 00:13:30 --> 00:13:33: Or maybe that's a lot more than 00:13:33 --> 00:13:37: it actually is. The media echo plays a rather big 00:13:37 --> 00:13:38: role here. 00:13:38 --> 00:13:42: Do I think how can journalism bring relations back a 00:13:42 --> 00:13:44: bit more straight? 00:13:44 --> 00:13:47: This is always the problem of us media, that 00:13:47 --> 00:13:51: of course we report on certain things more than on 00:13:51 --> 00:13:53: other normality is less reported. 00:13:53 --> 00:13:56: So the dog that is not biting. 00:13:56 --> 00:13:58: It's usually not a story, 00:13:58 --> 00:14:00: that's the old phenomenon. 00:14:00 --> 00:14:05: Nevertheless, one simply always has to make the proportions clear 00:14:05 --> 00:14:09: in the reporting, so we had, for example, the day 00:14:09 --> 00:14:12: before yesterday at frontal 21 an 00:14:12 --> 00:14:16: excellent report, which took out a pair of the protagonists 00:14:16 --> 00:14:17: and showed, 00:14:17 --> 00:14:19: who are what for people, where 00:14:19 --> 00:14:23: do they come from? We have in the political barometer 00:14:23 --> 00:14:24: in the current. 00:14:24 --> 00:14:27: About 10% of people who say 00:14:27 --> 00:14:30: that the Corona measures are too strict,

7 00:14:30 --> 00:14:33: so perhaps not now say that 00:14:33 --> 00:14:36: they are completely against all measures, 00:14:36 --> 00:14:39: but who find them too strict. 00:14:39 --> 00:14:42: However, this means, conversely, almost 90% say 00:14:42 --> 00:14:47: they are exactly right or should be even stricter, so 00:14:47 --> 00:14:47: you 00:14:47 --> 00:14:51: basically have to say as a journalist i want to 00:14:51 --> 00:14:55: say but immediately restrictively also admit that 00:14:55 --> 00:15:00: of course. The force of a visual 00:15:00 --> 00:15:03: impression, and this was also part of the excitement of 00:15:03 --> 00:15:04: one group, 00:15:04 --> 00:15:08: the stairs that stormed the steps to the 00:15:08 --> 00:15:12: Reichstag building, in quotation marks, was a deliberate action. 00:15:12 --> 00:15:16: This had been prepared on the net you could read 00:15:16 --> 00:15:18: it in certain groups. 00:15:18 --> 00:15:20: This also has something to do with 00:15:20 --> 00:15:24: the fact that you are basically a symbol of 00:15:24 --> 00:15:27: plural society, that is, where democracy 00:15:27 --> 00:15:33: is played out, where different opinions are represented and basically 00:15:33 --> 00:15:34: democratically 00:15:34 --> 00:15:37: confronting the storms in quotation marks. 00:15:37 --> 00:15:43: He basically has something symbolic for a group in society 00:15:43 --> 00:15:44: that. 00:15:44 --> 00:15:49: No longer wants to discuss. I stood in front of 00:15:49 --> 00:15:54: the chancellery and have with a few people from this. 00:15:54 --> 00:16:00: Group discussed. Since it was complete. 00:16:00 --> 00:16:03: Unreachable by arguments you could no longer, 00:16:03 --> 00:16:06: I was insulted as a liar. 00:16:06 --> 00:16:10: Back asked yes, tell me a proof example where I 00:16:10 --> 00:16:14: lied to you as rapporteur you are just lying. 00:16:14 --> 00:16:18: They're just there that's just out of reach and that 00:16:18 --> 00:16:22: basically confirms the growing phenomenon that 00:16:22 --> 00:16:26: people are also using social media. 00:16:26 --> 00:16:28: In blow lives in 00:16:28 --> 00:16:32: bubbles that confirm themselves where you feel 00:16:32 --> 00:16:37: because I only basically read confirmation for this position. 00:16:37 --> 00:16:43: That's a majority position, so there was at saturday's at 00:16:43 --> 00:16:44: this club. 00:16:44 --> 00:16:47: There was a speaker, 00:16:47 --> 00:16:51: this naturopath, who then called 00:16:51 --> 00:16:53: for the Reichstag to be stormed?

8 00:16:53 --> 00:16:58: That was the one. Speech speech has said so Donald 00:16:58 --> 00:17:02: Trump has just landed and they were really convinced that 00:17:02 --> 00:17:03: they 00:17:03 --> 00:17:05: are now taking over the power, 00:17:05 --> 00:17:09: that Merkel will soon be fleeing from the roof of 00:17:09 --> 00:17:13: the chancellor's office by helicopter, as in Vietnam. 00:17:13 --> 00:17:17: This was really a closed world of thought and that 00:17:17 --> 00:17:19: is, of course, a problem. 00:17:19 --> 00:17:25: So I am sitting here as a representative of 00:17:25 --> 00:17:27: public legal television, we are 00:17:27 --> 00:17:32: still imforming ourselves that we have a plural. We have 00:17:32 --> 00:17:34: discussion in society 00:17:34 --> 00:17:35: and basically, if you 00:17:35 --> 00:17:37: look at me, if 00:17:37 --> 00:17:41: I say so, we have something that other nations no 00:17:41 --> 00:17:42: longer have 00:17:42 --> 00:17:44: in form, but there will be, for example, as in 00:17:44 --> 00:17:46: the United States. 00:17:46 --> 00:17:49: Yes, the scissors are falling 00:17:49 --> 00:17:54: further and further apart, because the individual bubbles only intensify 00:17:54 --> 00:17:55: in one 00:17:55 --> 00:18:02: direction or another, but none. Common democratic platform. 00:18:02 --> 00:18:05: Are you giving the dissidents, if it is not really 00:18:05 --> 00:18:06: completely 00:18:06 --> 00:18:08: surreal, do they really give 00:18:08 --> 00:18:11: them enough space to really discuss their other theses? 00:18:11 --> 00:18:14: In the so-called reputable media. 00:18:14 --> 00:18:17: They said they are in the bubble of the social 00:18:17 --> 00:18:18: media bubble. 00:18:18 --> 00:18:20: There, of course, they are so among themselves, 00:18:20 --> 00:18:22: but we also have to discuss them. 00:18:22 --> 00:18:26: Either you don't want to, you can't, or they've started 00:18:26 --> 00:18:28: the experiment and just 00:18:28 --> 00:18:32: described it, but aren't we maybe a little too arrogant 00:18:32 --> 00:18:35: and say the coyotes and whatever that is? 00:18:35 --> 00:18:39: Are we also trying to have a discussion in the 00:18:39 --> 00:18:41: media, perhaps 00:18:41 --> 00:18:44: to prevent violence and extreme violence? 00:18:44 --> 00:18:48: So I think That I regularly receive letters of complaint 00:18:49 --> 00:18:50: from the AFD Group, 00:18:50 --> 00:18:54: which accuses me of exactly that, we do not come

9 00:18:54 --> 00:18:56: up with enough of 00:18:56 --> 00:18:59: you, then I will again have 00:18:59 --> 00:19:02: statistics drawn up on how often, for example, the AFD 00:19:02 --> 00:19:04: is in our programme and. 00:19:04 --> 00:19:07: It has no basis at all 00:19:07 --> 00:19:11: for complaining, so they occur more or less 00:19:11 --> 00:19:16: proportionally in the broadcasts as they are represented in Parliament. 00:19:16 --> 00:19:20: There are discrepancies, there are other parties, which 00:19:20 --> 00:19:22: also occur less, but 00:19:22 --> 00:19:24: where they occur less 00:19:24 --> 00:19:26: is in the talk shows. 00:19:29 --> 00:19:33: There is often the reasoning of the colleagues 00:19:33 --> 00:19:35: who do this the talk 00:19:35 --> 00:19:40: shows that they do not have competent interlocutors on the 00:19:40 --> 00:19:41: subject matter. 00:19:41 --> 00:19:44: But so, that is a 00:19:44 --> 00:19:47: matter of taste, may be so, can we go back 00:19:47 --> 00:19:52: to the original politics for another year and a whole 00:19:52 --> 00:19:56: 7 state elections before the Bundestag election Mr Kolwe? 00:20:00 --> 00:20:04: I would be foolish to make a prediction here. 00:20:04 --> 00:20:08: We have a situation, and that is what I meant 00:20:08 --> 00:20:10: by the period of 00:20:10 --> 00:20:13: change, which extends to a great deal. 00:20:13 --> 00:20:16: We are now going into the last 00:20:16 --> 00:20:20: year, so on Monday, ends. 00:20:20 --> 00:20:26: The parliamentary pause and we are going into the last 00:20:26 --> 00:20:31: year Merkel and it begins the post-Merkel era. 00:20:31 --> 00:20:38: In my opinion, the CDU is completely leaderless at 00:20:38 --> 00:20:41: the moment, so we have 00:20:41 --> 00:20:44: a party that has three candidates. 00:20:44 --> 00:20:49: That's what we're trying to do. 00:20:49 --> 00:20:54: Perhaps one candidate will dismiss his co-candidate from the prison 00:20:54 --> 00:20:56: of this partnership, so that 00:20:56 --> 00:20:59: the then CDU will become chairman, so 00:20:59 --> 00:21:04: that perhaps the Bavarian Prime Minister will become a 00:21:04 --> 00:21:07: candidate for chancellor, so that is one of the cards 00:21:07 --> 00:21:07: in Berlin. 00:21:07 --> 00:21:11: But there are no signs of pulling back at the 00:21:11 --> 00:21:11: moment. 00:21:11 --> 00:21:15: So that means we are in a situation where 00:21:15 --> 00:21:19: the big governing party or the Union?

10 00:21:19 --> 00:21:22: Don't know what's going on you don't even know if 00:21:22 --> 00:21:25: they can hold the party congress in December and they 00:21:25 --> 00:21:26: don't know 00:21:26 --> 00:21:28: what the mechanics are supposed to be? 00:21:28 --> 00:21:33: It is reasonable to position oneanother for the party leadership 00:21:33 --> 00:21:38: of the CDU and for the chancellor's candidacy thereafter quite 00:21:38 --> 00:21:40: difficult situation. 00:21:40 --> 00:21:43: The SPD has decided very early on, 00:21:43 --> 00:21:48: now has a candidate who will also be employed by 00:21:48 --> 00:21:53: a committee of inquiry throughout the year. 00:21:53 --> 00:21:58: Viacard won't be happy either. 00:21:58 --> 00:22:02: The SPD party leaders dream of a left-wing coalition the 00:22:02 --> 00:22:06: left, on the other hand, has just lost its two 00:22:06 --> 00:22:10: leaders its leaders do not yet know what will happen 00:22:10 --> 00:22:12: and above all they do not know 00:22:12 --> 00:22:16: whether they will be able to make themselves able to 00:22:16 --> 00:22:21: form a coalition say they will change foreign and security 00:22:21 --> 00:22:21: policy. 00:22:21 --> 00:22:25: Many more moderates in the Left Party 00:22:25 --> 00:22:27: dream of this, but there 00:22:27 --> 00:22:29: are strong voices that will prevent this. 00:22:29 --> 00:22:33: In other words, we have an extremely complicated 00:22:33 --> 00:22:37: situation, where a great deal still needs to be decided, 00:22:37 --> 00:22:40: and this under difficult conditions in Corona. 00:22:40 --> 00:22:44: In so far as I would not dare to predict. 00:22:44 --> 00:22:48: Do you see signs of a coalition idea 00:22:48 --> 00:22:48: red, green, yellow? 00:22:51 --> 00:22:54: Well, this is not a model of thinking in view 00:22:54 --> 00:22:58: of the state election in Rhineland-Palatinate. 00:22:58 --> 00:23:04: And interesting ly the traffic light coalition in Rhineland- Palatinate since 00:23:04 --> 00:23:09: will be elected next year before the Bundestag election has 00:23:09 --> 00:23:12: a relatively successful run and the hope of the 00:23:12 --> 00:23:15: protagonists who want such a traffic 00:23:15 --> 00:23:20: light, the Rhineland Palatinate can basically serve as a 00:23:20 --> 00:23:22: litmus test, that one can say look 00:23:22 --> 00:23:27: here, that would work after all, that would be 00:23:27 --> 00:23:31: a good way to be honest. The Greens and the 00:23:31 --> 00:23:31: FDP. 00:23:31 --> 00:23:35: Could hardly be further apart.

11 00:23:35 --> 00:23:39: They are not really green or yellow, and 00:23:39 --> 00:23:43: so this is not a natural coalition, 00:23:43 --> 00:23:49: but are they all open in terms of numbers, but 00:23:49 --> 00:23:50: is it the most 00:23:50 --> 00:23:54: unlikely coalition if you look at what do people want? 00:23:54 --> 00:24:00: We ask that he regularly in the political barometer the. 00:24:00 --> 00:24:05: Coalition, which by a greater margin most Germans want, 00:24:05 --> 00:24:11: is black green. Mhm, that's also the most likely okay. 00:24:11 --> 00:24:16: Let's look at the big wide world from Germany. 00:24:16 --> 00:24:20: One issue is that Germany is at the centre of 00:24:20 --> 00:24:20: a 00:24:20 --> 00:24:23: conflict that concerns us more than is apparent at first 00:24:23 --> 00:24:23: glance. 00:24:23 --> 00:24:28: It is about the deterioration of relations between America and 00:24:29 --> 00:24:29: China. 00:24:29 --> 00:24:32: For Germany, this is about security and prosperity. 00:24:32 --> 00:24:35: And how do you view the current situation of the 00:24:36 --> 00:24:39: two nations with each other, and Germany's role in this 00:24:39 --> 00:24:43: complex is crumbling an old world order here? 00:24:43 --> 00:24:48: Yes, crumbling is such a very destructive word. 00:24:48 --> 00:24:55: It is changing dramatically. The U.S. is in a way. 00:24:55 --> 00:24:57: sputnik. 00:24:57 --> 00:25:03: Situation There was the famous moment with the Russians in 00:25:03 --> 00:25:06: the conquest of space, 00:25:06 --> 00:25:11: when the Russians have the edge Sputnik and that was 00:25:12 --> 00:25:17: an absolute shock for the far superior USA at that 00:25:17 --> 00:25:18: time. 00:25:18 --> 00:25:21: And has had dramatic consequences. 00:25:21 --> 00:25:23: Huge sums have been 00:25:23 --> 00:25:28: invested to be the first in space and this basically 00:25:28 --> 00:25:33: this Sputnik moment is the US is experiencing again with 00:25:33 --> 00:25:36: China, but in a much 00:25:36 --> 00:25:42: more dramatic way, because the Chinese are now 00:25:42 --> 00:25:47: not just economic competitors, 00:25:47 --> 00:25:50: but. they. Also aspire 00:25:50 --> 00:25:54: to be the greater superpower, and that has the American. 00:25:54 --> 00:26:01: Massive psychological follow they see the Chinese as great competition. 00:26:01 --> 00:26:06: Pompeo, the foreign minister, recently spoke of the 00:26:06 --> 00:26:12: tyranny that prevails in China. So one really declares China 00:26:12 --> 00:26:12: as an 00:26:12 --> 00:26:17: opponent, which is the old approach of next and subsequent

12 00:26:17 --> 00:26:22: of the cooperation and commitment behind it is basically the 00:26:22 --> 00:26:23: old thesis. 00:26:23 --> 00:26:28: Change through trade and rapprochement, that, if they are well 00:26:28 --> 00:26:29: enough, 00:26:29 --> 00:26:31: the Chinese are basically made into 00:26:31 --> 00:26:34: a kind of liberal. 00:26:34 --> 00:26:39: Autocracy or something like that? Washington has realised 00:26:39 --> 00:26:43: that this is not happening, and so we are now 00:26:44 --> 00:26:47: entering into massive competition. 00:26:47 --> 00:26:52: Serious. Dangers, then, if you look 00:26:52 --> 00:26:58: at the Chinese, a very aggressive foreign policy now not 00:26:58 --> 00:27:00: only this structural 00:27:00 --> 00:27:04: one, which we have all learned 00:27:04 --> 00:27:09: in Africa, that they secure raw materials, etc. but they 00:27:09 --> 00:27:12: have just threatened the Czechs 00:27:12 --> 00:27:16: with great consequences, because a leader 00:27:16 --> 00:27:22: has allowed himself to travel to Taiwan. The Czech you. 00:27:22 --> 00:27:25: threaten. 00:27:25 --> 00:27:28: Countries if they don't take 00:27:28 --> 00:27:32: Huawei that has massive consequences. 00:27:32 --> 00:27:36: They are, of course, threatening Taiwan. They are 00:27:36 --> 00:27:41: trying to seize islands in the South China 00:27:41 --> 00:27:44: Sea that are in no way in any way under 00:27:44 --> 00:27:45: international law. 00:27:45 --> 00:27:49: So, there's a bulli on the 00:27:49 --> 00:27:54: way, a country that knows what it does and. 00:27:54 --> 00:27:57: On the other hand? Is there a 00:27:57 --> 00:28:04: concern that Americans will psychologically feel this Sputnik effect and 00:28:04 --> 00:28:06: react accordingly? 00:28:06 --> 00:28:08: And in so 00:28:08 --> 00:28:14: far as they have mentioned, it is time for us 00:28:14 --> 00:28:15: Germans 00:28:15 --> 00:28:17: (Europeans now to reposition themselves. 00:28:17 --> 00:28:23: We Germans are, of course, in a dramatically difficult situation. 00:28:23 --> 00:28:26: No other Western country benefits. 00:28:26 --> 00:28:30: So much of China, of the rise of China. 00:28:30 --> 00:28:33: I mean, let's not forget, 00:28:33 --> 00:28:39: I don't know if any of them is invested in 00:28:39 --> 00:28:43: China, but Volkswagen generates 40% of sales 00:28:43 --> 00:28:49: in China, Mercedes, Daimler 30%. Last year, we made USD

13 00:28:49 --> 00:28:50: 95 billion. 00:28:50 --> 00:28:56: Export to China, then. We have become dependent on this 00:28:56 --> 00:28:58: market in a certain way. 00:28:58 --> 00:29:04: and? Nevertheless, the Federal Government has now sat down in 00:29:04 --> 00:29:11: recent months and devised a new strategy to diversify, because 00:29:11 --> 00:29:15: of course that is exactly what they come to depend 00:29:15 --> 00:29:19: on China and B gets into the mill between the 00:29:19 --> 00:29:21: two big ones, that is, 00:29:21 --> 00:29:24: one has to develop a position, not 00:29:24 --> 00:29:27: the equidistance to both, because 00:29:27 --> 00:29:30: we will remain closer to the USA for the foreseeable 00:29:30 --> 00:29:31: future. 00:29:31 --> 00:29:34: And yet we need to be able to develop our 00:29:35 --> 00:29:36: own position and an 00:29:36 --> 00:29:39: independent position than we have now. 00:29:39 --> 00:29:41: This is reassuring that 00:29:41 --> 00:29:45: the Germany, that they really have politicians on their 00:29:45 --> 00:29:49: screen, because it is a hugely complex challenge. 00:29:49 --> 00:29:52: After all, the question is with whom does Germany do 00:29:52 --> 00:29:53: business 00:29:53 --> 00:29:55: when the world breaks down into two trading blocs? 00:29:55 --> 00:29:58: And you have just outlined 00:29:58 --> 00:30:01: it, but how important are both of them, but the 00:30:02 --> 00:30:04: US is also on whose side is the EU? 00:30:04 --> 00:30:09: In this show of strength, it will have to position 00:30:09 --> 00:30:10: itself somehow. 00:30:10 --> 00:30:15: So why often do we lack a European foreign policy? 00:30:15 --> 00:30:17: This is clear to all 00:30:17 --> 00:30:22: involved, but we are always seeing that, of course, individuals 00:30:23 --> 00:30:24: cook their soup, 00:30:24 --> 00:30:29: so the Greeks then sell a port to the Chinese 00:30:29 --> 00:30:33: because they need money. We have also seen it with 00:30:33 --> 00:30:35: Russia, Macron, who 00:30:35 --> 00:30:37: wants to make great world 00:30:37 --> 00:30:42: politics, sits down and wants a special relationship with Putin. 00:30:42 --> 00:30:48: Building it made it clear some time ago and we 00:30:48 --> 00:30:52: are now again not only through Mr 00:30:52 --> 00:30:55: Navalny, but basically through. 00:30:55 --> 00:30:58: Also the murder in the zoo and many other things 00:30:58 --> 00:31:03: in the difficult precarious situation is in some ways

14 comparable 00:31:03 --> 00:31:05: to the dilemma with China 00:31:05 --> 00:31:09: that we do business with Russia on the one hand, 00:31:09 --> 00:31:12: see Nord Stream 2 is about to be completed. 00:31:12 --> 00:31:16: The chancellor said no at a meeting in her constituency 00:31:17 --> 00:31:19: on Tuesday at a meeting in her 00:31:19 --> 00:31:21: constituency, we are building the pipeline. 00:31:21 --> 00:31:23: We must also separate this from 00:31:23 --> 00:31:28: all the other things. And at the same time, yesterday, 00:31:28 --> 00:31:32: in the strongest terms, she made it clear 00:31:32 --> 00:31:35: to Putin that this is not 00:31:35 --> 00:31:39: the way forward, and that is a situation. 00:31:39 --> 00:31:43: A dualism, which the coordinates are shifting, so we have, 00:31:43 --> 00:31:48: of course, in German foreign policy, that was quite often 00:31:48 --> 00:31:48: the 00:31:48 --> 00:31:52: case that we basically did one thing and the other 00:31:52 --> 00:31:52: did. 00:31:52 --> 00:31:55: We kept channels of dialogue with Putin open 00:31:55 --> 00:31:59: because we Germans felt a special role to the Russians 00:31:59 --> 00:32:03: and at the same time, of course, we also criticized 00:32:03 --> 00:32:05: Russia and opposed 00:32:05 --> 00:32:08: it, but a little less strongly. We have always been 00:32:08 --> 00:32:10: more flexible than many other nations. 00:32:10 --> 00:32:15: And at the moment, Germany and Europe are in a 00:32:15 --> 00:32:16: situation 00:32:16 --> 00:32:19: with which we are not yet familiar, 00:32:19 --> 00:32:24: where we must have more of our own position. 00:32:24 --> 00:32:26: It also costs a lot 00:32:26 --> 00:32:32: of money when you look at how arms spending is 00:32:32 --> 00:32:36: distributed, so the US is spending a total of USD 00:32:36 --> 00:32:38: 750 billion on armaments. 00:32:38 --> 00:32:42: We just under 50 French and about 50 00:32:42 --> 00:32:48: the British, even if you pull these big three great 00:32:48 --> 00:32:50: European nations 00:32:50 --> 00:32:55: together, that's still only a fifth of what the 00:32:55 --> 00:32:57: US is raising. In other 00:32:57 --> 00:33:00: words, we are far 00:33:00 --> 00:33:04: from standing on our own two feet militarily. 00:33:04 --> 00:33:07: And if we are honest, 00:33:07 --> 00:33:09: if we want to have 00:33:09 --> 00:33:15: an independent, large foreign policy, we need to redistribute much

15 00:33:15 --> 00:33:17: more wealth in this 00:33:17 --> 00:33:19: area, whether we are prepared 00:33:19 --> 00:33:20: to do so, I dare to doubt. 00:33:22 --> 00:33:25: Do we stick with the EU for a 00:33:25 --> 00:33:27: moment before we look across the big pond? 00:33:27 --> 00:33:31: What about the two major players or the most important 00:33:31 --> 00:33:33: players in the EU? 00:33:33 --> 00:33:36: What is the relationship between Germany and France? 00:33:36 --> 00:33:41: Do we see Merkel Macron again in familiar unity? 00:33:41 --> 00:33:48: Yes, so Korona basically created a Merkel Macron 2.0 situation, 00:33:48 --> 00:33:48: I 00:33:48 --> 00:33:53: saw it from a Parisian point of view. 00:33:53 --> 00:33:57: Macron was the superstar. 00:33:57 --> 00:33:59: It was really like. 00:34:02 --> 00:34:06: Phoenix from the ashes so I went to France, 00:34:06 --> 00:34:10: so I was told so if you need to know 00:34:10 --> 00:34:12: a legality about this 00:34:12 --> 00:34:15: country, then it is the French 00:34:15 --> 00:34:18: can revolution, but they can't reform. 00:34:18 --> 00:34:23: With this basic law I went there and then Macron 00:34:23 --> 00:34:28: came and wiped it away and basically wiped away the 00:34:28 --> 00:34:31: party system and started reforms and 00:34:31 --> 00:34:35: also made big plans for the European Union. 00:34:35 --> 00:34:37: And to reform there, 00:34:37 --> 00:34:42: the great speech before Bonn and then came nothing I 00:34:42 --> 00:34:43: have then. 00:34:43 --> 00:34:48: Asked in Berlin for months and said you actually have 00:34:48 --> 00:34:48: a plan? 00:34:48 --> 00:34:50: Is there a plan B, 00:34:50 --> 00:34:54: which was now because it was there, the coalition negotiations 00:34:54 --> 00:34:55: here ran for months. 00:34:55 --> 00:35:00: Nothing happened, there was no government and. 00:35:00 --> 00:35:04: My question was there now a prepared plan 00:35:04 --> 00:35:06: that as soon as 00:35:06 --> 00:35:11: a government stands, it is immediately? There was 00:35:11 --> 00:35:15: no immediate response to Macron, and he basically lost a 00:35:16 --> 00:35:16: lot 00:35:16 --> 00:35:19: because he always ran into the void, 00:35:19 --> 00:35:23: now triggered by Corona, there was this very big answer 00:35:23 --> 00:35:25: with the reconstruction plan. 00:35:25 --> 00:35:28: In many respects, this is in line

16 00:35:28 --> 00:35:31: with what Macron has called for. 00:35:31 --> 00:35:33: Is there also this connection? 00:35:33 --> 00:35:37: Merkel, Macron, now much clearer again. 00:35:39 --> 00:35:44: Today is the 3 September in 2 months is elected 00:35:44 --> 00:35:45: in the USA. 00:35:45 --> 00:35:51: America is in four simultaneous historical crises. 00:35:51 --> 00:35:53: We have the pandemic, recession, 00:35:53 --> 00:35:58: racism and climate change. The United States of 2020 is 00:35:58 --> 00:36:00: a shattered country with a, let's 00:36:00 --> 00:36:04: say, misguided president of Covid 19 and paralyzed by its 00:36:04 --> 00:36:07: economic consequences, politically 00:36:07 --> 00:36:12: barely capable of action and internally hostile to itself. 00:36:12 --> 00:36:15: What do you think were the drivers of this devastating 00:36:15 --> 00:36:16: situation? 00:36:19 --> 00:36:23: Yes, the President is wrong. 00:36:23 --> 00:36:26: We should not underestimate this. 00:36:26 --> 00:36:30: I have now once again in anticipation of our 00:36:30 --> 00:36:34: conversation, talking to some election research. 00:36:34 --> 00:36:38: The United States is also well-watched. 00:36:38 --> 00:36:43: There is an old German professor Helmut Norpoth, 00:36:43 --> 00:36:50: who has developed a model experienced teaching in the USA. 00:36:50 --> 00:36:55: And he has correctly predicted 24 out of 26 elections 00:36:56 --> 00:36:56: so far. 00:36:56 --> 00:37:04: By the way, we didn't really say trump's first victory 00:37:04 --> 00:37:06: in 2016. 00:37:06 --> 00:37:09: And he calculated with his model, 00:37:09 --> 00:37:12: but that's a single voice. 00:37:12 --> 00:37:17: 91% likely to be re-elected, 00:37:17 --> 00:37:20: who looks at the primaries, 00:37:20 --> 00:37:26: doesn't give as much attention to the polls as both 00:37:26 --> 00:37:29: of them have done, and he expects 00:37:29 --> 00:37:34: Trump to be re-elected and Trump himself? 00:37:36 --> 00:37:39: This morning we had the news from the New York 00:37:39 --> 00:37:40: Times that he 00:37:40 --> 00:37:44: happened to be coming to the beginning of November. 00:37:44 --> 00:37:49: The vaccine had been announced, first for risk groups and 00:37:49 --> 00:37:51: for medical staff, etc. 00:37:51 --> 00:37:55: In other words, he will go to 00:37:55 --> 00:38:00: the polls with this positive message that could then 00:38:00 --> 00:38:05: push his Corona management into the background. Rather, we all

17 00:38:05 --> 00:38:08: see it in the news as a law and order. 00:38:08 --> 00:38:14: President, although he also acts as an arsonist and. 00:38:14 --> 00:38:19: For example, in Wisconsin, which was a very important state 00:38:19 --> 00:38:20: at the time, 00:38:20 --> 00:38:25: that is, part of this blue wall of the famous. 00:38:25 --> 00:38:30: Several states going to the Democrats. 00:38:30 --> 00:38:35: He got Wisconsin back then and it's quite. 00:38:35 --> 00:38:38: It cannot be ruled out that he will repeat this 00:38:38 --> 00:38:41: and in that respect I would not underestimate them. 00:38:41 --> 00:38:44: Trump is someone who. 00:38:44 --> 00:38:51: Familiar coordinate systems. has been overturned. 00:38:51 --> 00:38:53: We have. 00:38:53 --> 00:38:55: In the. 00:38:55 --> 00:38:58: There is a column in The Washington 00:38:58 --> 00:39:03: Post that is always updated. The number of his 00:39:03 --> 00:39:06: lies and half-truths that he 00:39:06 --> 00:39:10: says in public is only the public one, and there 00:39:10 --> 00:39:14: are about 20,000 since Forbes took office, 00:39:14 --> 00:39:18: that he lies publicly 24 times a day, and that's 00:39:18 --> 00:39:19: basically, as 00:39:19 --> 00:39:22: we all kind of rub our 00:39:22 --> 00:39:28: eyes, obviously don't find a criterion. SK is a criterion 00:39:28 --> 00:39:29: of assessment 00:39:29 --> 00:39:31: among a large number of people who speak up for 00:39:31 --> 00:39:32: him. 00:39:32 --> 00:39:34: The US is 00:39:34 --> 00:39:37: famous for doing so-called negative campaigning. 00:39:37 --> 00:39:43: In other words, those who are standing for election are 00:39:43 --> 00:39:48: heavily criticised and accused by the other side. 00:39:48 --> 00:39:52: What else should Trump do? 00:39:52 --> 00:39:55: Which is not already in the world, 00:39:55 --> 00:39:59: which is terrible for our ears unsustainable. 00:39:59 --> 00:40:03: For both, however, negative campaigning will do a lot of 00:40:03 --> 00:40:04: damage. 00:40:04 --> 00:40:09: This is the great honored old vice president. 00:40:09 --> 00:40:13: Trump and his campaign can do a lot of damage 00:40:13 --> 00:40:15: to that, by whatever means. 00:40:15 --> 00:40:20: Trump is no longer hurt and obviously it doesn't hurt 00:40:20 --> 00:40:23: him, so what's known is 00:40:23 --> 00:40:28: that if I had to bet, I'd say pretty good 00:40:28 --> 00:40:29: chances 00:40:29 --> 00:40:33: of him being re-elected right now. Now we have a

18 00:40:33 --> 00:40:35: candidate on the other side. 00:40:35 --> 00:40:38: He will be 78 2 weeks after the election is 00:40:39 --> 00:40:40: anything but vital, 00:40:40 --> 00:40:41: there is an old man, 00:40:41 --> 00:40:45: there is nothing to feel of the departure mood of 00:40:45 --> 00:40:46: Grandpa from Obama's. 00:40:46 --> 00:40:49: On the contrary. How could 00:40:49 --> 00:40:55: it be that in four insane years, the Democrats have 00:40:55 --> 00:40:58: not managed to build 00:40:58 --> 00:41:03: a candidate to emerge with a strong counter-figure? 00:41:03 --> 00:41:06: And to hold against and that we are not in 00:41:06 --> 00:41:07: this situation. 00:41:07 --> 00:41:15: So, before I criticise a nation for this, I 00:41:15 --> 00:41:21: would look at ourselves and we had the clear message 00:41:21 --> 00:41:22: that Mrs 00:41:22 --> 00:41:25: Merkel would be. 00:41:25 --> 00:41:33: We no longer have any natural candidates or the selected 00:41:33 --> 00:41:35: candidates, 00:41:35 --> 00:41:37: so the mechanisms in. 00:41:39 --> 00:41:44: In parties are curious and are also such 00:41:44 --> 00:41:45: that. 00:41:47 --> 00:41:51: Perhaps also through us media, 00:41:51 --> 00:41:57: which is no longer the most coveted career path to 00:41:57 --> 00:42:03: go into politics and in this respect the elixir of 00:42:03 --> 00:42:05: power is one thing. 00:42:05 --> 00:42:09: Film in the USA there are also special situations. 00:42:09 --> 00:42:13: They need huge funds because they need to be able 00:42:13 --> 00:42:15: to run a billion-dollar 00:42:15 --> 00:42:21: campaign that they will win presidential election. Fighting the country 00:42:21 --> 00:42:24: is torn into many subgroups. 00:42:24 --> 00:42:28: Candidates who are for one group. 00:42:28 --> 00:42:33: Extremely selectable, so for many of the other groups they 00:42:33 --> 00:42:33: are not. 00:42:33 --> 00:42:37: Difficult Mhm the country is armed to the teeth, 00:42:37 --> 00:42:43: So this America firearms obsession gets a huge boost in 00:42:43 --> 00:42:47: these times with a wave of crimes. 00:42:47 --> 00:42:50: If Trump doesn't win, you think 00:42:50 --> 00:42:54: is there a civil war to fear? 00:42:54 --> 00:42:56: Well, that's a big 00:42:56 --> 00:43:01: word, but we already have civil war-like developments in some 00:43:01 --> 00:43:02: cities.

19 00:43:05 --> 00:43:09: If you look at what is 00:43:09 --> 00:43:14: happening, I openly take a civic defence to the streets 00:43:14 --> 00:43:21: and defend the country 117-year-old with a semi-automatic weapon, 00:43:21 --> 00:43:26: then put down two people because he has fallen down 00:43:26 --> 00:43:28: in panic and panicked. 00:43:28 --> 00:43:31: So these are situations that 00:43:31 --> 00:43:35: are unimaginable, that is, civil war. 00:43:35 --> 00:43:40: Is a big word, but it will be interesting in 00:43:41 --> 00:43:42: many ways, even 00:43:42 --> 00:43:48: if now. On 3 November X or Y is chosen, 00:43:48 --> 00:43:53: will it be very interesting again what happens then? 00:43:53 --> 00:43:56: Trump has been building several times now, 00:43:56 --> 00:44:00: he has massively discredited the entire postal vote. 00:44:00 --> 00:44:04: He last night called on his constituents 00:44:04 --> 00:44:09: to vote several times. So you should not only 00:44:09 --> 00:44:14: choose a letter, but also go in person and just 00:44:14 --> 00:44:15: test it out. 00:44:15 --> 00:44:18: I want, let us imagine, that 00:44:18 --> 00:44:24: the president-elect of a nation is calling for electoral fraud. 00:44:24 --> 00:44:27: It doesn't hurt him. So that is incomprehensible, 00:44:27 --> 00:44:30: so i am afraid that after 00:44:30 --> 00:44:34: 3 November we will see from one side or the 00:44:34 --> 00:44:35: other that they are 00:44:35 --> 00:44:39: questioning the election result, that you are 00:44:39 --> 00:44:41: questioning the result of the election. 00:44:43 --> 00:44:49: So what does the outcome of the election mean for 00:44:49 --> 00:44:56: us here in Germany, even if the democrats are elected, 00:44:56 --> 00:44:56: I 00:44:56 --> 00:45:02: believe, one should not expect a massive change in policy. 00:45:02 --> 00:45:07: The US has been much more Pacific. 00:45:07 --> 00:45:13: Europe is out of focus. 00:45:13 --> 00:45:19: Dissatisfaction, for example, with our low defence. 00:45:19 --> 00:45:23: Spending in NATO is extremely pronounced in both parties. 00:45:23 --> 00:45:27: So that's no different for Democrats. 00:45:27 --> 00:45:32: The tone will certainly be different, and this pronounced 00:45:32 --> 00:45:37: hatred that Trump seems to feel about Germany, and Angela 00:45:37 --> 00:45:39: Merkel in particular. 00:45:39 --> 00:45:43: That is likely to disappear among democrats, 00:45:43 --> 00:45:45: of course, but it is 00:45:45 --> 00:45:49: not that there would be a complete 00:45:49 --> 00:45:53: change of policy, including the position, by the way. And

20 00:45:53 --> 00:45:55: on China, Democrats are similarly critical. 00:45:55 --> 00:45:58: So it would mean for us, in 00:45:58 --> 00:46:00: Europe and in Germany, too. 00:46:00 --> 00:46:04: We need to find a different position on the US. 00:46:04 --> 00:46:08: Has a strong word from where does Trump's hatred of 00:46:08 --> 00:46:10: Angela Merkel come from? 00:46:10 --> 00:46:12: I can't answer you 00:46:12 --> 00:46:13: when I don't think 00:46:13 --> 00:46:18: he has a problem with strong women. 00:46:18 --> 00:46:21: The way we treated Theresa May 00:46:21 --> 00:46:24: was Deplorable, as the British 00:46:24 --> 00:46:28: said, so did she take her hand and somehow 00:46:28 --> 00:46:34: run that little stupid and then insulted her sometime weeks 00:46:34 --> 00:46:38: later because some measure didn't please him and he found 00:46:38 --> 00:46:39: it foolish? 00:46:39 --> 00:46:42: But I think that's gut now, 00:46:42 --> 00:46:47: psychology I think that's a problem with women and definitely 00:46:47 --> 00:46:49: with women like Angela Merkel. 00:46:49 --> 00:46:51: How did Mrs Merkel think 00:46:51 --> 00:46:56: she reacted internally? That is, of course, a difficult 00:46:56 --> 00:46:58: question when he refused to hand her up. 00:46:58 --> 00:47:00: So you could see very 00:47:00 --> 00:47:03: clearly that she was there, that she was 00:47:03 --> 00:47:06: really frozen, so that was. I only saw it in 00:47:06 --> 00:47:07: the pictures, 00:47:07 --> 00:47:08: but it was very clear 00:47:08 --> 00:47:11: that she found it totally inappropriate. 00:47:11 --> 00:47:13: That is the first thing to be. 00:47:13 --> 00:47:16: I have to go back one step, 00:47:16 --> 00:47:21: you have just listed how many lies the President has 00:47:21 --> 00:47:24: already made of himself. 00:47:24 --> 00:47:29: How can it be that a nation knows this and 00:47:29 --> 00:47:30: yet? 00:47:30 --> 00:47:34: Contrary to all this knowledge about the missteps surrounding all 00:47:35 --> 00:47:39: these lies, a president may be re-elected and that is 00:47:39 --> 00:47:42: not at all true for us here in our circumstances. 00:47:42 --> 00:47:44: conceivable. 00:47:44 --> 00:47:50: So a superficial answer to a superficial facet is 00:47:50 --> 00:47:54: that Trump is less a politician than an entertainer. 00:47:54 --> 00:47:57: So, it has become known, 00:47:57 --> 00:48:03: not as real estate. specialist. And

21 00:48:03 --> 00:48:06: entrepreneurs, but above all through seeing 00:48:06 --> 00:48:09: Brandes, i.e. through his appearances on television. 00:48:09 --> 00:48:15: That made him popular and basically this entertainer stayed in 00:48:15 --> 00:48:17: a certain way, 00:48:17 --> 00:48:19: and that's when you 00:48:19 --> 00:48:23: look at how the whole world sees 00:48:23 --> 00:48:27: them, he has, you can call and find 00:48:27 --> 00:48:30: the clown, but he has that element. 00:48:30 --> 00:48:34: In this respect, the essential thing is actually to get 00:48:34 --> 00:48:38: out of the classical assessment system, but 00:48:38 --> 00:48:44: I believe that it is. All of us. The basis 00:48:45 --> 00:48:47: of the assessment 00:48:47 --> 00:48:51: tries to take, we all. Operate on the basis of 00:48:52 --> 00:48:53: truth and facts. 00:48:53 --> 00:48:56: We have a coordinate system in 00:48:56 --> 00:48:59: life with which we can judge things. 00:48:59 --> 00:49:02: You can be left, you can be right, 00:49:02 --> 00:49:06: you can find it one way or another for it. 00:49:06 --> 00:49:11: But we basically have a common basis for the de 00:49:11 --> 00:49:12: facto world. 00:49:12 --> 00:49:19: Trump travels that one of his press secretary who 00:49:19 --> 00:49:23: goes now, that's the term invented. 00:49:23 --> 00:49:31: Alternative facts, that is, with his lies and with the 00:49:31 --> 00:49:33: way reality. 00:49:33 --> 00:49:44: differently. Representing rather many of the usual behavioral patterns 00:49:44 --> 00:49:48: and reaction patterns that when they 00:49:48 --> 00:49:54: hear Trump's talk, he says, the sentence often starts with 00:49:54 --> 00:49:56: Some People say Water. 00:49:56 --> 00:49:59: If he does, pushes others 00:49:59 --> 00:50:01: forward, then expresses an opinion, 00:50:01 --> 00:50:08: which he basically brings in in fact he claims something. 00:50:08 --> 00:50:13: This is rarely true or often not true. 00:50:13 --> 00:50:17: With the cautious assessment is not of me at all, 00:50:17 --> 00:50:21: but that is what some say. Whoever that is, but 00:50:21 --> 00:50:24: he basically travels with it. 00:50:24 --> 00:50:26: We got the carpet away, the 00:50:26 --> 00:50:28: carpet on which we all. 00:50:28 --> 00:50:34: Act and live and the new media? 00:50:34 --> 00:50:39: And also many of the classic media USA play along 00:50:39 --> 00:50:39: with the 00:50:39 --> 00:50:44: ones that create the filter bubbles that arise.

22 00:50:44 --> 00:50:49: Staying in this world and reinforcing that again so I, 00:50:49 --> 00:50:51: as a journalist, 00:50:51 --> 00:50:54: bleed my heart because I believe 00:50:54 --> 00:50:57: that something will happen when we think 00:50:57 --> 00:51:00: that forward, he will really be re-elected. 00:51:00 --> 00:51:04: We then have a generation in the USA and not 00:51:04 --> 00:51:07: only in the USA was above all there. 00:51:07 --> 00:51:12: They have. Nothing else they have experienced have grown up 00:51:12 --> 00:51:14: with the leader of 00:51:14 --> 00:51:17: the world, the most powerful man 00:51:17 --> 00:51:21: in the world, who behaves in such a way 00:51:21 --> 00:51:24: that the coordinate system, which one 00:51:24 --> 00:51:26: must then also say, is 00:51:26 --> 00:51:30: basically almost the value system that is given as an 00:51:30 --> 00:51:32: example and that is fatal yes. 00:51:32 --> 00:51:35: But now we really had a nice 00:51:35 --> 00:51:38: day, everyone is happy that they can meet 00:51:38 --> 00:51:41: again, and we definitely don't want to stop with the 00:51:41 --> 00:51:42: turmoil of the world. 00:51:42 --> 00:51:44: What encourages us at this time? 00:51:44 --> 00:51:47: I'm very involved in that. 00:51:47 --> 00:51:49: So I'm an optimist and I think 00:51:49 --> 00:51:53: the world spirit will judge it. 00:51:53 --> 00:51:58: I believe that we, that we. 00:51:58 --> 00:52:00: Jones, I think, should 00:52:00 --> 00:52:05: be used as an opportunity and I think 00:52:05 --> 00:52:07: it's a great opportunity, 00:52:07 --> 00:52:10: it's obviously a terrible 00:52:10 --> 00:52:14: challenge, but I think we should all make 00:52:14 --> 00:52:17: an effort to use it for ourselves. 00:52:17 --> 00:52:21: Thinking about what is really important, 00:52:21 --> 00:52:24: what we want as a society, 00:52:24 --> 00:52:29: we, our our circle has become smaller, we 00:52:29 --> 00:52:32: are no longer travelling as much, 00:52:32 --> 00:52:36: we are reduced to other social contacts, 00:52:36 --> 00:52:39: much more intense and I think 00:52:39 --> 00:52:43: it really is an opportunity. 00:52:43 --> 00:52:45: To redefine ourselves as a society, to 00:52:45 --> 00:52:49: define more intensively where do we really want to go? 00:52:49 --> 00:52:52: Ecology, for example, is 00:52:52 --> 00:52:56: now, almost the whole climate debate

23 00:52:56 --> 00:52:59: has sunk, but I think it is 00:52:59 --> 00:53:01: ultimately the origin, if 00:53:01 --> 00:53:06: it really is, that we have intervened in the habitat 00:53:06 --> 00:53:10: of the bats on the market and since the virus 00:53:10 --> 00:53:13: has been transmitted, it is when you think it to 00:53:13 --> 00:53:13: the end. 00:53:13 --> 00:53:19: Of course, a consequence of our non-ecological behavior we take 00:53:19 --> 00:53:22: the habitat of animals, we 00:53:22 --> 00:53:26: change things and it does not always lead so quickly 00:53:26 --> 00:53:29: and so dramatically, but in the 00:53:29 --> 00:53:35: long term of course much more dramatic to change the 00:53:35 --> 00:53:37: world in the climate. 00:53:37 --> 00:53:42: And I think that, maybe Corona should be a pointer 00:53:42 --> 00:53:43: to us 00:53:43 --> 00:53:46: that we do that. As. 00:53:46 --> 00:53:51: Take as a reminder and then see it as 00:53:51 --> 00:53:53: an opportunity if they allow 00:53:53 --> 00:53:58: me, I would like a story. 00:53:58 --> 00:54:01: Albert Einstein is said to be the one. 00:54:01 --> 00:54:04: But I don't know if it's proven. 00:54:04 --> 00:54:09: I have only read it several times Albert Einstein has 00:54:09 --> 00:54:14: taught at the university and when he is told at 00:54:14 --> 00:54:18: least the questions for the new semester 00:54:18 --> 00:54:23: his secretary has given, has looked at it and said, 00:54:23 --> 00:54:23: but 00:54:23 --> 00:54:27: Professor, these are the old questions? 00:54:27 --> 00:54:31: What Einstein is said to have said yes. 00:54:31 --> 00:54:34: The questions are old, but the 00:54:34 --> 00:54:38: answers are new and I believe. 00:54:38 --> 00:54:40: We should take this to heart, 00:54:40 --> 00:54:42: that is a nice closing 00:54:42 --> 00:54:45: word, dear Coll, thank you very much for the conversation. 00:54:45 --> 00:54:48: It was a great joy and a great honour for 00:54:48 --> 00:54:48: me.

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