The Skating Lesson Transcript 2013 World Championships Men’s Recap

Jenny Kirk: Hello, and welcome to The Skating Lesson Podcast. I'm , a former US ladies competitor and a three-time world team member.

Dave Lease: I'm David Lease. I'm the figure skating blogger and adult skater. And this week I brought Jennifer Kirk into the world of a diehard skating fan.

Jenny: I am such a fan girl! I was such a fan girl. I was like, tweeting with everybody, I loved it. Okay we're going to jump right into it in this recap show. We have to discuss the men because that was really the event of the competition. So Dave everybody is talking about 's victory. I want to know from you: what do you think of the judging, what you think about how it portends where the sport is heading, what do you think needs to change, and just what do you take on the top two, Chan versus Ten?

Dave: I'm sweating a little bit.

Jenny: You're pitting out!

Dave: I'm pitted out, in the words of Rudy Galindo. Oh man! The judging, the men’s event! You know, in my heart of hearts, I’m really honestly glad that it happened. And it’s not that I’m happy that I feel that Denis Ten didn’t win…

Jenny: Wait, do you think like an addict, we have finally reached bottom? Do you think this is bottom?

Dave: I think this is a coming to bottom because we’ve been discussing this throughout the season, and – first of all before we even get into this judging, we were watching figure skating, an event that is very popular in Canada on LATVIAN television. There was no Canadian feed online. We were watching – we became very Latvian. I feel like my passport got stamped this week! We visited Latvia, it was wonderful. So we talked about – there’s that situation, I think, that ties into the judging actually. In 2002, which all like to the new judging system, we thought we had hit bottom because – oh my goodness, the world was ending! If you watch the 2002 pairs broadcast on NBC or the other networks around the world, the Canadians obviously didn’t win that night, and the announcers were so upset and so erupting! And the world was ending, Sandra Bezic was embarrassed for the sport, yada yada, you know, the news programs – it was an international outrage. And if you look at it, there were a couple of bobbles that the Russians had in that performance. There were like a few minute bobbles you know, and Anton Sikharulidze on one of the jumping passes. And that was outrageous! And really a lot of people felt that Berezhnaya and Sikharulidze had superior skating skills that they just – they had it. And they were superior to Canadians. And it only took a couple little bobbles. Fast-forward 11 years to the world champions on Latvian television, and Patrick Chan just – two beautiful quads, one in combination, and then the rest of the program… wow.

Jenny: Well, you see the rest of program and I think that’s really – for me, that summed it up. You didn’t see it in the rest of the jumps. The program did suffer with it. Watching that program back, it was the entire program that went downhill after that. And that wasn’t reflected.

Dave: I think is wonderful skating skills, just to start. I think he is great skating skills. I do think he can get a bit out of control. Like we saw after the , he is going into that lutz, and he doesn’t have himself…

Jenny: The cruise ship! It’s like… Dave: Well, yeah! Because he goes so – and he looks a little out of control on the landing, which is a problem with the construction of the program, to begin with. But, the fact that he is missing a triple Lutz after he did two beautiful quads, and he looked like he wasn’t physically, mentally, you know, ready. He’s flying into it. And to me that’s not great skating skills when you can’t control your power. To me, that’s part of skating skills.

Jenny: Yeah, you have to control your edges. Control what’s going on the ice.

Dave: Control your body weight, moving, your edges, everything. And that’s – you know, to me, to see him get a 9.11 for skating skills after that – I was shocked. Well, not shocked because we’ve seen this happen before. But, I mean, it was startling. Okay, his falls were bad falls. It wasn’t a hand down, it wasn’t wonderful. You know, a skating performance that’s wonderful can survive one fall the program, especially if it’s the ends, usually, it’s not a big deal. It’s still a great program. Oh, man, in the old system, you know you would knock them down from a 6.0 to a 5.9. The problem with Patrick’s marks that he received is that there was no little ding that happened. And it wasn’t just one jump. Then he goes into – there were four errors in his program that were visible. You watch, you know one of them was a double, but you watch, you know, he does a triple Axel fall. And these were bad falls. He went on his back, Jenny Kirk. Like, this was not – these were small deductions. So to see him get these marks, I’m just – I don’t understand. You know, maybe-something has to be done. It was wrong I think as a viewer, you know. The person who helps us in Final Cut Pro watched it, tuned in because he was so excited – he has been part of the show and, you know, tuned in and watched it. And he felt, he felt outraged by it. He felt…

Jenny: Well he said, and I think this is so true – I don’t mean to cut you off – he said that Patrick Chan could have showed up, stood in the middle of the ice eating a Snickers, and he still would have won. Like, basically, that’s what it came down to. And I think my biggest gripe about this new system is – when we look at this event, Denis Ten did a magnificent short program. He was in second place, and I know a lot of the feedback that we got after the nationals recap show when we talked about feeling outraged that Gracie didn’t win the event was – it’s a two-part competition. If you’re off in the long, you should be able to win. Denis didn’t bomb. He skated a magnificent short and a magnificent long. If you’re in the top three after the short program and you in the long program, I think you should be able to win the entire event, that that qualifies you as somebody who’s been able to come to the event, show that you can skate these two different parts. I also think that there needs to be some sort of weight in terms of the long program. It still is four and a half minutes for the men. It’s a longer portion of the competition. That needs to be reflected in the marks. And we had so many people, people in skating message boards, also on , bloggers, saying, “well, we to tweak the math. Certain things need to be weighted more if you fall.” What is your take on the math, because the sport is so mathematical as it is. Tony Wheeler recently, I think it was this morning, he put it out an article, or yesterday, talking with the men’s event, saying we should add more math in. Do you think this is really the root we need to go? What would you do in terms of just scoring of events in skating?

Dave: I think that it’s a huge problem. I look back at skating, and we made a mistake in the national program. We said that we didn’t understand what was going on. We understand what was going on, we just – it’s baffling that, to me it’s baffling that I can watch a skating event as a long time skating viewer, and I see what I see. And then you have to then watch and wait for the protocols to be posted. And then that’s like that version of the events. If you want to look on, you know, an Adobe PDF of what happened. And it’s really, it’s wrong. There’s something going on that’s missing the viewers, and it’s like almost like the only people who are really into skating are Rayman now, because it’s – I mean, it’s really outrageous. And I think people talk about the math. And I had a discussion with someone last night where – yes, we’ve been trained to now look for underrotations and edge calls like the Nazis. You know, that is Lutz – that is what is doing the sport, these – flutzing is ruining the sport and these under rotations. Well, what about leg wraps? There is no deduction for leg wraps, should there be a deduction for leg wraps? I mean, should there be a deduction for too much arms, how the tools in the air? What’s – when will it end and when will it just, you see what you see and you judgment you judge, and the replays and everything – I think it’s alienating the viewers, drowning of them out and bringing us to Latvian television. And I honestly believe that. I know that PJ Kwong thinks that, “oh, you know, that, frankly like there’s so much social media support.” Well, there’s some people that used to go to events, and they are small fraction of what the general public is. The general public has forgotten about skating. It’s not that they didn’t even like it, it’s that they might tuned off, and now it’s so far out of the lexicon but it’s gone.

Jenny: Well, and the thing is, even, I think the problem – there’s all the back stories or whatnot. But I think one of the problems was that when it was on, ABC before switching to NBC and even in NBC and Universal now, that when you’re saying the skater in the kiss ‘n cry, we don’t see that PDF as a viewer. We just see this number. We don’t understand when somebody like…

Dave: And it’s like this.

Jenny: Yeah! Something like a Murakami, skate the clean long program and – but she gets, I mean, this is the ladies event, but she gets, you know, poor technical scores. And you think – well, she didn’t fall, you don’t see what’s going on. You don’t see the under rotations, you don’t see what’s going on. So, I think…

Dave: And I don’t know that that’s right for the viewer, either, to like have that come up. I think the viewer’s going to be like, “WHAT!”

Jenny: What are all these things, and these, like, little carrots and e’s and…

Dave: Can you imagine the Olympics, when everyone’s watching, and this pops up? I think maybe so the components on the bottom, but I think it’s just a whole overhaul of the system, and if they’re not going to go to 6.0, maybe a new system is really what needs to be in order, you know. Because, it’s just, it’s not…

Jenny: With less numbers, you would say.

Dave: Yes, yeah, because I think you see what you see, and that that. So – and going and talking about these components, there’s always that Patrick is superior. Well, he didn’t have his best skate. And you’re going to say that he was much better than Denis Ten. Whatever. Denis doesn’t have the reputation of Patrick. I think he has good edges, I don’t think they’re Patrick’s level, but Patrick wasn’t perfect. Well, comparing – and, you know what, there are five components. It’s not just skating skills, and I think that people get a little bit – Christine Brennan talked about you’re thinking. Well, it’s funny how the skating skills mark seems to be the only one that matters, sometimes, in artistry I don’t see the people are really judging the interpretation and the choreography on a certain level. I personally feel that when I watch Patrick, it’s someone that study to do these movements, and I don’t get the sense from his soul like when I’m watching . No one knew – now it’s funny, because Patrick got 89.28 for components, but does okay got 85 even. Patrick beat him in skating skills, whatever. You want to give, you know, a 9.11 to an 8.54, you know, for skating skills, Patrick is better, you want to call it that, that’s fine, whatever, I’ll give you that. Transitions – they both have difficult programs. Again you want to give Patrick harder transitions, fine. You know what, I think you could make a legitimate case for that. But when you go into the choreography and the interpretation, Patrick got a 9 for choreography. Daisuke Takahashi got an 8.5. I view myself as one judge in an imaginary panel of life, and I don’t know about you, but to me, the fact that he is beating him on choreography, I thought was ludicrous. I’m like – here’s a person who has great edges, he has very good choreography. Not only do I think that Daisuke has better choreography, but he was somehow judged as having, like, half a point less than Chan, that gets doubled so that’s another point on, Patrick’s inflated marks. And then the interpretation – I was watching Takahashi’s program again and again. The last 90 seconds of it are so brilliant, you know, where he goes into that forward edge and that glide and goes around that circle and he’s, you know, coming to the spins, and it’s so amazing. And have Patrick get in a little bit higher on interpretation, too – to me, I don’t feel a soul connection to Patrick Chan. I don’t feel that we’re watching an artist. I think he’s worked very hard to improve his presentation, and to, you know, connect more with his movements. But to me, I don’t feel he interpreted that program, and neither of them were clean, so I think it’s really interesting to see the marks that happened. What do you – what is your take on the artistic or whatever?

Jenny: Well, yeah, and I think we need to move on to other men or else this will be a four hour show if we go back and forth about this. But I definitely, I agree with you. I think skating is a subjective sport, but I would say that Takahashi is more of an artist on the ice. He does skate from his soul, he skates from within. Patrick has beautiful edges, and I think one of the things that I do want to talk about though is – when people, and I just see this with skating fans, when people are outraged by results, or feel like someone shouldn’t win, I just, and I can speak for myself, it’s not that we’re saying that Chan is a bad guy, or that we don’t like him. I think this outrage is about when people are booing, it’s more about the fact that the judges are doing their job, or the direction that the sport is heading. And Patrick Chan maybe is a nice guy I’ve never met him. Hopefully, he’s a nice guy. But I think people also have to understand that when there is such fervor and anger, it’s not directed at Chan. And I’ve seen that this week, where people will fight back, and say, “well, you don’t like this skater, you don’t like him, da da da,” and – I don’t think, it’s not personal, at all. Would you agree or disagree?

Dave: I agree. I think that some fans might not like Patrick’s interviews, and they think that perhaps he’s overconfident and he’s been getting big marks for a long time, and he appears to believe that he deserves them, which is fine. And you know, that’s his right. I think that some people are just outrage at the whole thing, they just take it out on him, they don’t like his interviews. He’s also put in a difficult position in his interviews to kind of almost defend his win after, which is really I think uncomfortable. And with him, it happens again and again and again. So, I think that, you know…

Jenny: Right, we’re just, we’re tired of it. But let’s move on to some of the other men. Denis Ten was such a surprise at this event. Nobody really, I mean, we watched him in the past, but he came out of nowhere for so many people, some people not even knowing about his skating. Recently, he paired up with Frank Carroll, and you could just see that in the technique. That linear technique, that’s what I love so much, and his focus. And it was so impressive to see somebody who has never been at this top, tip-top level to keep it together for that long program, skating at the end of the event. And just, the choreography, I love the short program. Usually arm flailing is not my thing, but I thought it worked for his short program. And just the technique on the axel and the quad were really superior. What do you think about his performances?

Dave: Well, I really think that Frank Carroll has done it again. He obviously, I think that Denis Ten came to Frank Carroll after the 2010 Olympics. He was one of a few skaters who moved to work with Frank Carroll after, and it’s really starting to really work out for him. I think, obviously he has been a bit of a technique change, it’s either Frank’s way or no way, or really the highway, and I think that it’s really working out for Denis. And Frank’s theory of skating is really working. You know, it came down to perhaps the fact that he did a double flip-double toe instead a triple flip-triple toe within the program, but I really don’t feel that that should have been the difference. I think that he really had the performance, really, the weekend, when you add both programs together, and you talked about waiting. I do think that, you know, the components, you know, the to get factor, but there’s something that’s not clicking, and I don’t know if falls need to be two points instead of one point, you know. Is it going to be two points for the fall, one point for a hand down like rap, you know? And then you get into underrotations, you know…

Jenny: It’s the percentages that drive me crazy, like, times 0.12, da da da, it’s like – oh my gosh, where’s my graphing calculator?

Dave: You know, it’s really dangerous. And I think the fact that Denis didn’t win – you know, you look at what happens, and this would be great, almost, if it happened at the Olympics because that could be true bottom, you know. Like, we think were hitting bottom, but…

Jenny: The press and the world attention.

Dave: Yeah. But at the same time, that’s future skaters who might not go into the rink. So I think at the same point, you have to kind of look at that. But skating may need to actually have what’s happened in the absurdity, really…

Jenny: Yeah, but not to negate what Ten did, and I think that he put, I’m talking about this event, he put, he skated magnificently. He handled of the pressure being a newcomer in some sense to this top echelon, like I said earlier really, really, and I think he is definitely a contender heading into . But the bronze medalist… Dave: Your little crush.

Jenny: During the short program, I was heartbroken to see him miss that triple axel, and I think that this event, it was such an up and down in his free program, up-and-down than for him. He did – he is a fighter, he did fight to the end, but I think when you miss some of those jumps, that’s when weaknesses of his skating really come forward, that he doesn’t have the skating skills that Patrick Chan or Denis Ten – he is little bit hunchy is footwork – he didn’t have that kind of excitement and tjuz that he had in the European championships. But nice to see him on the world podium, and those quads, when he lands them, you can’t beat the flow in and out of those jumps.

Dave: Yeah, I definitely still see him. I thought is going to pull it off this time, I still see him as a world champion of the future. And like Denis Ten, he is not new to skating, but he is new to going for that world title. He is new for being in that position of, perhaps putting the event. And I think perhaps, I think it was a real testament to his competitive mindset and Brian Orser’s coaching that he did come back in the long program and move up so much and do – he didn’t do perfect long, but he did a very good long. And when he made a mistake on the first quad sal, he didn’t let it get away from him. He fought back on the second, and he really never gave up on that performance. And he wound up moving up and did a very good job. And I think he is someone in the future that, now that he has this experience of being at the top, again, it’s another mental adjustment, but I do think that he is someone that we will see in the future. He with his moving in the right direction, and I feel that he did a good program.

Jenny: I do, too, and another skater who came back, another Brian Orser skater who came back, – that long program was phenomenal. Particularly, I think one of the surprises of the event for me was seeing him miss two jumps in the short program. It was shocking after he skated fairly clean short programs – or, not clean, but good short programs, I should say, particularly at Four Continents, winning that short program throughout season. But having him come here and missed to elements in the short – obviously, it just, mentally, it must have been that difficult for him to overcome that, the great long program. It’s a little weird to see him so tired at the end. I was so worried that he needed his inhaler, that something was going on. He was just exhausted, but I think it was that emotional release. But, wonderful to see him come back, just thought that was nice.

Dave: I think – not to pick on him at all, I think, but stamina is an issue. And we hear that he has asthma, so it’s always curious that you don’t see the inhaler out, you know, before and after the program, it’s interesting, because some skaters, when they have asked know, the inhaler has to be there. I there has to be there for medical reasons, or its approach, or, you know, we don’t see that, but we did hear that perhaps he was little bit beat up. Perhaps he was also doing with the flu, so I don’t think he had the best approach to the world championships, but, you know, the judges don’t compare when you compete at the worlds. So, and I think that within you know you have a little under-rotation on the quad sal. I think in the future, he just-he has to figure out that stamina issue, whatever it is. I think they have to really look at what it is, because he did – I mean, he’s very thin. I mean, he is a very slight guy. So when you see someone like that running out of breath, you really worry for them.

Jenny: Well someone tweeted us that he needs some iron. Given the stake, something to get into those last two minutes!

Dave: Something – I mean, he’s a very slender person, you know. And I think that it's just, you know, and you watch it because-well, and it’s been a problem for the season with the long program. I mean, these programs are very, very difficult. He didn’t – he wanted Junior world title, and that was fine, but I think moving up, the program is a little bit…

Jenny: Adding the quads, more parts of that program, it takes it up. But overall, would you say a strong competition for him? Dave: Yes! Strong – I think he is about where he was last year. I don’t know if he really – he has gotten so much more experienced this year, I don’t know if his skating has really, if I see a marked difference. I think that, again, he’s still in there for the Olympics, and he needs to take the next step. And I think that, you know, this was a telling championship for him. It was really wide open for him to be on the podium. It didn’t happen, and I think it’s something that they’re going to have to address over the summer, coming so close. But again, great to see him come back in the long program. I think Brian Orser didn’t really good job with both Javier and Hanyu, getting them, you know, to deliver in the long. So I think that that was…

Jenny: Yeah, and it’s all learning experiences heading into an Olympic season. Another skater with learning experience, Kevin Reynolds, from Canada – third after the short, great short program, handling that pressure of skating on home ice so well. The long program had some under rotations. It seemed like he was tight. We saw at Four Continents, he skated with such attack and abandon, and he really wanted to win that event. And here, understandably skating at the end of the flight, I think it just seems like he tensed up a little bit, those jumps didn’t have the abandon. But he strikes me as I watch him, he is someone who kind of reminds me of in terms of – he is that some threat, while I think he could really be a surprise next year, he seems like somebody who isn’t like a Chan, as we talk about earlier, who isn’t going to go out and self-promote. He seems more introspective, he’s going to kind of take this all in. This was a great experience for him, I think, and take it and use it next year and be a surprise medalist, I feel, at the Olympics next season. What do you think?

Dave: I was a little surprised to see him have underrotations especially because he has done multiple quads for a long time, and they’ve never been an issue. But I think, you know, it’s a little bit different for Kevin now. He won Four Continents, he really had the skate of the event at nationals. He didn’t get the title, but you know, he escaped there, he backed it up at For Continents. Perhaps mentally, I don’t know if he was running out of gas as opposed to going for this, it’s a little more pressure. He did sneak into the top five, and I think that that’s a real test, a real stepping point in his career that he is now in a whole new group of men, when you make the top of the world. And I think that, in the future, he is that silent threat, when you look, you know, past Sochi, he is someone, I do see him contending for all sorts of titles because of his ability and he is really, you know, he proved this components. He looks to be trying to continually improve them, and I see him as a hard worker. I think, obviously, I think anybody who’s doing multiple quads, I don’t think that they’re lazy life. But I think that she – you get the sense that he really is focused and putting is all into this, and I think in the future, you know, we seeing improvements, and I expect to see more with him.

Jenny: Yeah, and he proved the season that he is a fairly consistent competitor. So briefly judging upon two men before we head into the Americans, Daisuke Takahashi skated okay here. It’s just heartbreaking. I love his footwork, I can watch and do that footwork the entire competition, but, we just talked about it before the event. It seems like he’s tired a bit, his legs don’t have that snap that they need on some of the quads. And it is heartbreaking because, again, he is a beautiful skater. What do you think?

Dave: Yeah, the Eurosport commentators referred to him as the most popular skater in the world the men’s event, and I really, I do believe that. We – they even showed on Latvian TV in between the ice breaks, we would say performances from exhibitions last year, and it was, you know, you really just got to appreciate the beauty of his skating. I know you tweeted about it at one point, and watching the end of this program to Pagliacci – it was magnificent. And it’s so sad that I really do feel like his body is just breaking down. The snap of the jumps, there are these little under rotations, and under these rules, they’re very unforgiving and I think that, it’s really hurt him. I think that, you know, he was at the height of his career, he had a horrible injury that really probably prevent him from being the Olympic champion, and really he was on the comeback trail as opposed to the forefront. And last year, many people felt that he deserved to be the world champion. He, you know, won the silver medal, and this year, people were really gutting for him to get that world title, and it looks like the body is just getting out of it. But, this program and his future in skating, I see him in shows for a very long, long time. I think that people would love to see him skate. He looks like he puts his soul into skating and absolutely loves to perform, excite the crowd, and really interpret music. And I loved watching him skate. He didn’t have the best performance, but he was my favorite long program of the event just because I think that – and he has a great use short as well to Moonlight Sonata. But I think that just watching that long program, I loved it. At the end, he’s going on that edge, and going into that – it’s just, oh my God, it was just fantastic. And I think that that’s really the heart of skating and I would hope the judges reward him more for it, but that’s life. But I really enjoyed his program, and it’s heartbreaking.

Jenny: And heartbreaking competition, many would say for Amodio as well. Missing that spin in the short program was hard to watch, he got up and is little cha-cha, but it just – it wasn’t, I don’t think, the world championship that he was hoping for coming here. And in a weird way, though, it was expected. He’s not someone who really is known for his focus and for putting together to the programs in an event like this. What do you think about his performances?

Dave: Well, he had such a great season in 2011 when, you know, you really skated from programs – some people loved it, some people he did it. But he was really moving ahead in skating and making a real name for himself, and he had been, you know, using the year before as a stepping stone. To me, he looks like he has kind of stumbled and wasted two years of his careers, you know. I know he has done some acting, and it’s great to see someone get other opportunities, but you have to wonder if the focus is there, if the training is there because he is someone with outrageous potential. Physically, he is…

Jenny: So much talent! Just natural talent!

Dave: Raw talent, he has the body for it, he has the right proportions, you know, he’s a good size, he has good technique. But you see, it’s lacking, and he’s not pushing himself. He takes those breaks in his program, and he is really – he is stalling in his career, and I think that what happened – it’s not shocking. It’s not shocking at all, and I think that it’s, you know, we saw Philippe Candeloro back in ‘98 after some season, but she had already been to the highest level. You know, you can’t really coast when you’re trying to climb in the skating world, and I see that happening with him. And it’s unfortunate, but I think it’s a learning experience. It’s something – he has now had to use the haven’t really panned out very well for him, and you know, I think what you put in is what you get out. So…

Jenny: Well, had a phenomenal first world championship skating two exceptional programs. What was – I like the most about his skating is that he has that killer instinct. I think he has what somebody like a lacks and what US men need. He is going to go out there. He can be like this [arm tilted] in the air, and he will still went on his feet, Tai, double toe loop, and still keep going in the program. The performance components – not there, really not there at all. But speed and the jumps and – it’s an exciting performance, and you have to respect him as a competitor. Just…

Dave: I love watching him in competition. He’s not someone who I would go back then watch. You know, I don’t put this program on before bed at night and get inspired to you now get good juju. But, I think when I watch him, I have such a fun time. I laugh a bit because Max Aaron used to play hockey, and he kind of has those short forward crossovers, and before he goes around the corner, he – you see him, figure like, where’s the stick, where’s the puck? It really looks like that, like you can tell, like you cannot take the hockey player out of him! And he goes into it, like, the way he does with his body…

Jenny: He attacks it, though! That kid is like on it!

Dave: I love it! I think he is not artistic at all, and I don’t care. Like I’m just – it’s so much fun to watch, and I really respect someone who puts it down like he did. And unfortunately, he did double the second quad – I would love to see him do three quads next year, you know, I think he can do it. And I think he has the attack to go for it.

Jenny: Yeah, and I think for next season, to just – Monday new choreographer, somebody, because I think he has the work ethic, that he can bring out that artistry skating and work on some this crossovers. And finally, Ross Miner. Tough competition. He said after the event, and I want to know your opinion on this, that he felt distracted because his goal was to come in top six, and he felt like maybe he had focused on that goal a little bit too much. What do you think about that, and what do you think about his performance? Dave: Looking at the top, I don’t think that Ross Miner is a top six skater in the world. I think of the men’s event, they are all very talented, and is not lost. I don’t think his skating is there yet. I think there are so many top men that to really put him in the top, I think, is unrealistic. I think that if he thought that, I would be very curious that he discussed that with his coaches, that he wanted to be top six, and I think someone needs to have a reality check. I also think that, you know, Ross, he’s not moving up in the skating world. He’s kind of stayed right under the top ten, but when he was at worlds, and he’s kind of not really progressing in the sport. He did have a medal on the Grand Prix this year when he skated his best. He skated bought nationals, but to me, I don’t see his career progressing unless he makes some big changes. New coach, new choreographer, new mindset because someone who – she is upgraded top six in the world, you know. It would have to be quite the competition for Ross Miner to be in the top six, and you know, I think that he did good at nationals, but there needs to be reality check there.

Jenny: Yeah, I think with junior worlds that took place last month, the crop of men that are coming up, I worry that Ross not even be top six at US nationals next year. I mean, that is a very real possibility. He needs to work on that technique, it’s very, on the quad the triple axle. But again, he seems like a very hard worker and somebody who, I believe with a coaching switch, I think he can bring his skating to the next level. So, as we wrap things up with the men’s event, Dave, I want to know, what is your number one takeaway of the event, good or bad, when you look back on it? I probably can predict your answer, but what would you, summing it all up at this event?

Dave: Unfortunately, it all goes back to Patrick. I mean, just the number of emails, text messages, Facebook statuses, tweets that have happened, but I go back to Christina Gao’s Tweet that this was #BSWorlds2013. She really made a name for herself and shocked a lot of people, and we’ve all fallen in love with her from that tweet, and I really, I stand by that, I think. It’s unfortunate, but it happened, and you know, Patrick now has two of his three world titles that are really dubious. And I think that that’s – it’s unfortunate, but it’s not his fault, but it does say something about the state of the sport, and it’ll be interesting to see what happens in the future.

Jenny: I agree, #BSWorlds2013 – hopefully, we’ve hit bottom, because I don’t want to see what bottom of look like if this is not it.

Dave: I know, it’s like skating with Lindsay Lohan, you know?

Jenny: yeah, you just – dadadadadada, like you keep going down and down. Let’s make this bottom, let’s see some changes in the off-season, and come back feeling better. Well, thank you guys for tuning in, and we’d also like to thank Kevin Kwasneski for our graphics. As always, you can email us, tweeters – oh! And we wanted to showcase these lovely an incredibly narcissistic mouse that Kevin Kwasneski so gratefully – we are so grateful, he was so that was to make us these and just send them. But it is cool – on the one side, it says “The Skating Lesson.”

Dave: I know, I want to scare some people at work with this, so…

Jenny: You should go and be like, the biggest d-bag ever. Anyway, thank you Kevin, we love it, and there will be no more soda cans in our videos.

Dave: Yes. And as always, we’d like to remind you to hold an edge…

Together: And look sexy! Bye, guys!