OFFICIAL RECORD of PROCEEDINGS Friday, 28 October
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LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ─ 28 October 2011 1131 OFFICIAL RECORD OF PROCEEDINGS Friday, 28 October 2011 The Council continued to meet at Nine o'clock MEMBERS PRESENT: THE PRESIDENT THE HONOURABLE JASPER TSANG YOK-SING, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE ALBERT HO CHUN-YAN IR DR THE HONOURABLE RAYMOND HO CHUNG-TAI, S.B.S., S.B.ST.J., J.P. THE HONOURABLE LEE CHEUK-YAN DR THE HONOURABLE DAVID LI KWOK-PO, G.B.M., G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE FRED LI WAH-MING, S.B.S., J.P. DR THE HONOURABLE MARGARET NG THE HONOURABLE JAMES TO KUN-SUN THE HONOURABLE CHEUNG MAN-KWONG THE HONOURABLE CHAN KAM-LAM, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE MRS SOPHIE LEUNG LAU YAU-FUN, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE LEUNG YIU-CHUNG 1132 LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ─ 28 October 2011 DR THE HONOURABLE PHILIP WONG YU-HONG, G.B.S. THE HONOURABLE WONG YUNG-KAN, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE LAU KONG-WAH, J.P. THE HONOURABLE LAU WONG-FAT, G.B.M., G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE MIRIAM LAU KIN-YEE, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE EMILY LAU WAI-HING, J.P. THE HONOURABLE ANDREW CHENG KAR-FOO THE HONOURABLE TIMOTHY FOK TSUN-TING, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE TAM YIU-CHUNG, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE ABRAHAM SHEK LAI-HIM, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE LI FUNG-YING, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE TOMMY CHEUNG YU-YAN, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE FREDERICK FUNG KIN-KEE, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE AUDREY EU YUET-MEE, S.C., J.P. THE HONOURABLE VINCENT FANG KANG, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE WONG KWOK-HING, M.H. THE HONOURABLE LEE WING-TAT DR THE HONOURABLE JOSEPH LEE KOK-LONG, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE JEFFREY LAM KIN-FUNG, G.B.S., J.P. LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ─ 28 October 2011 1133 THE HONOURABLE ANDREW LEUNG KWAN-YUEN, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE CHEUNG HOK-MING, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE WONG TING-KWONG, B.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE RONNY TONG KA-WAH, S.C. THE HONOURABLE CHIM PUI-CHUNG PROF THE HONOURABLE PATRICK LAU SAU-SHING, S.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE KAM NAI-WAI, M.H. THE HONOURABLE CYD HO SAU-LAN THE HONOURABLE STARRY LEE WAI-KING, J.P. DR THE HONOURABLE LAM TAI-FAI, B.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE CHAN HAK-KAN THE HONOURABLE PAUL CHAN MO-PO, M.H., J.P. THE HONOURABLE CHAN KIN-POR, J.P. DR THE HONOURABLE PRISCILLA LEUNG MEI-FUN, J.P. DR THE HONOURABLE LEUNG KA-LAU THE HONOURABLE CHEUNG KWOK-CHE THE HONOURABLE WONG SING-CHI THE HONOURABLE WONG KWOK-KIN, B.B.S. THE HONOURABLE IP WAI-MING, M.H. 1134 LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ─ 28 October 2011 THE HONOURABLE IP KWOK-HIM, G.B.S., J.P. THE HONOURABLE MRS REGINA IP LAU SUK-YEE, G.B.S., J.P. DR THE HONOURABLE PAN PEY-CHYOU THE HONOURABLE PAUL TSE WAI-CHUN, J.P. DR THE HONOURABLE SAMSON TAM WAI-HO, J.P. THE HONOURABLE ALAN LEONG KAH-KIT, S.C. THE HONOURABLE LEUNG KWOK-HUNG THE HONOURABLE TANYA CHAN THE HONOURABLE ALBERT CHAN WAI-YIP THE HONOURABLE WONG YUK-MAN PUBLIC OFFICERS ATTENDING: THE HONOURABLE STEPHEN LAM SUI-LUNG, G.B.S., J.P. THE CHIEF SECRETARY FOR ADMINISTRATION THE HONOURABLE JOHN TSANG CHUN-WAH, G.B.M., J.P. THE FINANCIAL SECRETARY THE HONOURABLE WONG YAN-LUNG, S.C., J.P. THE SECRETARY FOR JUSTICE THE HONOURABLE MICHAEL SUEN MING-YEUNG, G.B.S., J.P. SECRETARY FOR EDUCATION MR LAI TUNG-KWOK, S.B.S., I.D.S.M., J.P. SECRETARY FOR SECURITY LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ─ 28 October 2011 1135 DR THE HONOURABLE YORK CHOW YAT-NGOK, G.B.S., J.P. SECRETARY FOR FOOD AND HEALTH THE HONOURABLE DENISE YUE CHUNG-YEE, G.B.S., J.P. SECRETARY FOR THE CIVIL SERVICE THE HONOURABLE TSANG TAK-SING, G.B.S., J.P. SECRETARY FOR HOME AFFAIRS THE HONOURABLE MATTHEW CHEUNG KIN-CHUNG, G.B.S., J.P. SECRETARY FOR LABOUR AND WELFARE PROF THE HONOURABLE K C CHAN, S.B.S., J.P. SECRETARY FOR FINANCIAL SERVICES AND THE TREASURY THE HONOURABLE MRS CARRIE LAM CHENG YUET-NGOR, G.B.S., J.P. SECRETARY FOR DEVELOPMENT THE HONOURABLE EDWARD YAU TANG-WAH, G.B.S., J.P. SECRETARY FOR THE ENVIRONMENT THE HONOURABLE EVA CHENG, G.B.S., J.P. SECRETARY FOR TRANSPORT AND HOUSING THE HONOURABLE GREGORY SO KAM-LEUNG, J.P. SECRETARY FOR COMMERCE AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT THE HONOURABLE RAYMOND TAM CHI-YUEN, J.P. SECRETARY FOR CONSTITUTIONAL AND MAINLAND AFFAIRS PROF LAU SIU-KAI, J.P. HEAD, CENTRAL POLICY UNIT MISS ADELINE WONG CHING-MAN, J.P. UNDER SECRETARY FOR CONSTITUTIONAL AND MAINLAND AFFAIRS 1136 LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ─ 28 October 2011 CLERKS IN ATTENDANCE: MRS CONSTANCE LI TSOI YEUK-LIN, ASSISTANT SECRETARY GENERAL MRS JUSTINA LAM CHENG BO-LING, ASSISTANT SECRETARY GENERAL MRS PERCY MA, ASSISTANT SECRETARY GENERAL LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ─ 28 October 2011 1137 PRESIDENT (in Cantonese): Council shall now resume the meeting and continue with the debate on the fourth session. MEMBERS' MOTIONS MOTION OF THANKS Continuation of debate on motion which was moved on 26 October 2011 DR LEUNG KA-LAU (in Cantonese): President, I will speak on the healthcare initiatives featuring in the Policy Address. There will be nothing new in my speech as most of it has already been covered by other Members. Besides, the paragraphs on healthcare in the Policy Address are mostly devoid of new ideas. I have thought of starting with the land for hospital development. However, after hearing yesterday that many Members were very concerned about healthcare manpower and the development of medical services industry, I shall begin with manpower issues. Mr CHEUNG Man-kwong and quite a few Members have expressed grave concerns over the healthcare insurance system and development of the private medical sector. They are worried that the latter will lead to high manpower wastage in public hospitals. While the situation seems dire, another issue has crossed my mind. Most Members, I believe, have taken out medical insurance on their own and visit private doctors. Some 10 years ago, the Harvard Team published a consultancy report on healthcare reform. The survey conducted revealed that 75% of the people in Hong Kong preferred private hospitals while those preferred public hospitals only accounted for 25%. As for family doctors, 85% of the respondents chose private doctors. Why do so many Members ― Mr CHEUNG Man-kwong has just come back ― seek private medical services for themselves but pushing other members of the public to public hospitals? Coming back to the manpower issues, the considerable public relations efforts made by the Hospital Authority (HA) recently give us an impression that HA has lost all its doctors. But in fact, after checking with the statistics, we find that the number of HA doctors increases every year and has reached some 5 270 this year, representing a 37% increase as compared with that of 10 years ago. The authorities claimed that doctors were in oversupply 10 years ago and 1138 LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL ─ 28 October 2011 encouraged them to leave their jobs with the implementation of the voluntary retirement scheme in 2003. Why do the authorities now insist that there is a "shortage of doctors" when their number has already risen more than 30% over the past 10 years? Moreover, some Members have mentioned about the long waiting time for certain out-patient medical services ― almost two years for urology services. What shall we do? Must there be a problem with manpower supply? I have some statistics at hand. Let me cite an example. For ear, nose and throat services, the waiting time in the New Territories West Cluster is 92 weeks, which I find unacceptable, but the waiting time in Kowloon Central Cluster is just one week. Would the Secretary please explain the reasons? For ophthalmology services, the waiting time in the Kowloon East Cluster is 135 weeks, which is way too absurd, but the waiting time in Kowloon West Cluster is just six weeks. Mr Vincent FANG mentioned yesterday that the waiting time for some urology services might take two years. If Mr FANG runs a business consisting of two departments, and one of them faces severe manpower shortage and asks the boss to hire more staff while the staff of the other department just read newspapers and enjoy coffee every day, will Mr FANG, as the employer who has to pay, consider this as manpower shortage? Recently, the issue of doctors with limited registration has given rise to extensive public discussions. According to an article written by HA's Chief of Service (Accident and Emergency) published in Ming Pao Daily two days ago, the service volume of various accident and emergency (A&E) departments has increased by 5% over the past four years while the number of his colleagues, that is, A&E doctors, has dropped by 4.6%. The work pressure has become so immense that the proposal of recruiting doctors with limited registration gives no cause for much criticism. After checking with the statistics, however, I discover that although the number of A&E doctors has dropped by 5% over the past four years, the total number of doctors has increased by 5%. Why has HA not allocated resources to each department on an equal basis? If we look at the real picture, it is simply because A&E departments are being bullied.