H9464 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — HOUSE October 23, 1997 STEPHEN HORN, PRIVILEGES OF THE HOUSE—DIS- Whereas, Contestant Robert Dornan has As additional conferees from the Committee MISSING CONTEST IN 46TH DIS- not shown or provided credible evidence that on House Oversight, for consideration of sec- TRICT OF CALIFORNIA UPON the outcome of the election is other than tion 543 of the Senate amendment, and modi- THE EXPIRATION OF OCTOBER Congresswoman Sanchez’s election to the Congress; and fications committed to conference: 29, 1997 WILLIAM M. THOMAS, Whereas, the Committee on House Over- BOB NEY, Mr. GEPHARDT. Mr. Speaker, I rise sight should complete its review of this mat- As additional conferees from the Committee to a question of the privileges of the ter and bring this contest to an end and now therefore be it; on the Judiciary, for consideration of sec- House, and I send to the desk a privi- Resolved, That unless the Committee on tions 374, 1057, 3521, 3522, and 3541 of the leged resolution (H. Res. 276), pursuant House Oversight has sooner reported a rec- House bill, and sections 831, 1073, 1075, 1106, to rule IX, and ask for its immediate ommendation for its final disposition, the and 1201–1216 of the Senate amendment, and consideration. contest in the 46th District of California is modifications committed to conference: The SPEAKER pro tempore (Mr. dismissed upon the expiration of October 29, HENRY J. HYDE, LAHOOD). The Clerk will report the res- 1997. LAMAR SMITH, olution. b 1600 As additional conferees from the Committee The Clerk read as follows: on Resources for consideration of sections The SPEAKER pro tempore (Mr. H. RES. 276 214, 601, 653, 1021, 2835, 2901–2914 and 3404 of LAHOOD). The resolution constitutes a the House bill, and sections 234, 381–392, 601, Whereas, Loretta Sanchez was issued a cer- tificate of election as the duly elected Mem- question of the privileges of the House, 706, 2819, and 3158 of the Senate amendment, and must be considered at this time. and modifications committed to conference: ber of Congress from the 46th District of California by the Secretary of State of Cali- Pursuant to rule IX, the gentleman DON YOUNG, fornia and was seated by the U.S. House of from Missouri [Mr. GEPHARDT] and the BILLY TAUZIN, Representatives on January 7, 1997; and gentleman from California [Mr. THOM- Provided that Mr. Delahunt is appointed in Whereas A Notice of Contest of Election AS] will each control 30 minutes. lieu of Mr. Miller of California for consider- was filed with the Clerk of the House by Mr. The Chair recognizes the gentleman ation of sections 2901–2914 of the House bill, Robert Dornan on December 26, 1996; and and sections 381-392 of the Senate amend- from Missouri [Mr. GEPHARDT]. Whereas the Task Force on the Contested Mr. GEPHARDT. Mr. Speaker, I yield ment. Election in the 46th district of California WILLIAM DELAHUNT, met on February 26, 1997 in Washington, D.C. myself such time as I may consume. As additional conferees from the Committee on April 19, 1997 in Orange County, California Mr. Speaker, this resolution which is on Science for consideration of sections 214 and has not met since that time; and brought on the privileges of the House and 3148 of the House bill, and sections 234 Whereas the allegations made by Mr. Rob- is designed to try to bring to a conclu- and 1064 of the Senate amendment, and ert Dornan have been largely found to be sion now the question of whether or modifications committed to conference: without merit: charges of improper voting not LORETTA SANCHEZ was elected in F. JAMES SENSENBRENNER, from a business, rather than a resident ad- the 46th District of California. Jr., dress; underage voting; double voting; and Mr. Speaker, this contest has been KEN CALVERT, charges of unusually large number of indi- viduals voting from the same address. It was going on now for all of this year and al- GEORGE E. BROWN, Jr., found that voting from the same address in- most 11 months into the proceedings Provided that Mr. Rohrabacher is appointed cluded a Marines barracks and the domicile there has not been evidence or proof in lieu of Mr. Calvert for consideration of of nuns, that business addresses were legal presented by the committee or the task section 1064 of the Senate amendment. residences for the individuals, including the force which would indicate that Ms. DANA ROHRABACHER, zoo keeper of the Santa Ana zoo, that dupli- SANCHEZ was not elected by a majority As additional conferees from the Committee cate voting was by different individuals and on Transportation and Infrastructure for of the people voting in the 46th District those accused of underage voting were of in November 1996. consideration of sections 345, 563, 601, 1021, age; and 2861, and 3606 of the House bill, and section Whereas the Committee on House Over- Mr. Speaker, in the last few days, at 601 of the Senate amendment, and modifica- sight has issued unprecedented subpoenas to my request, the Speaker and the chair- tions committed to conference: the Immigration and Naturalization Service man of the Committee on House Over- BUD SHUSTER, to compare their records with Orange Coun- sight has submitted a memorandum of WAYNE T. GILCHREST, ty voter registration records, the first time understanding that would bring us to a ROBERT A. BORSKI, in any election in the history of the United point where we would attempt to bring As additional conferees from the Committee States that the INS has been asked by Con- this case to a close before we finish on Veterans’ Affairs for consideration of sec- gress to verify the citizenship of voters; and this year’s session of Congress. I must Whereas the INS has complied with the tions 751, 752, and 759 of the House bill, and report to the Members that in my view sections 220, 542, 751, 752, 758, 1069, 1074, and Committee’s request and, at the Commit- tee’s request, has been doing a manual check this memorandum of understanding is 1076 of the Senate amendment, and modifica- not acceptable and not appropriate. tions committed to conference: of its paper files and providing worksheets containing supplemental information on Mr. Speaker, it suggests that we turn CHRISTOPHER H. SMITH, that manual check to the Committee on a whole set of records that have come MICHAEL BILIRAKIS, House Oversight for over five months; and from the Immigration Service to try to JOSEPH P. KENNEDY, Whereas the Committee on House Over- Managers on the Part of the House. determine if a whole great number of sight, subpoenaed the records seized by the residents of the 46th District, and peo- STROM THURMOND, District Attorney of Orange County on Feb- JOHN WARNER, ruary 13, 1997 and has received and reviewed ple outside the 46th District, were reg- JOHN MCCAIN, all records pertaining to registration efforts istered citizens and legal citizens of DAN COATS, of that group; and the United States and whether they BOB SMITH, Whereas some Members of the House Over- voted in this race, and turn it over to DIRK KEMPTHORNE, sight Committee are now seeking a duplicate the Secretary of State of California to JIM INHOFE, and dilatory review of materials already in make a determination as to whether or RICK SANTORUM, the Committee’s possession by the Secretary not everybody who voted was a citizen. OLYMPIA SNOWE, of State of California; and First, let me say that it is totally un- PAT ROBERTS, Whereas the Task Force on the Contested Election in the 46th district of California and acceptable to turn this decision about CARL LEVIN, whether or not this election was valid, TED KENNEDY, the Committee have been reviewing these and whether LORETTA SANCHEZ was JEFF BINGAMAN, materials and has all the information it needs regarding who voted in the 46th dis- elected, over to the Secretary of State JOHN GLENN, trict and all the information it needs to ROBERT C. BYRD, of California. I understand what the make judgments concerning those votes; and CHUCK ROBB, Committee on House Oversight may be Whereas the Committee on House Over- JOE LIEBERMAN, trying to say. They would like to turn sight has after over nine months of review this over to a third party. Unfortu- MAX CLELAND, and investigation failed to present credible Managers on the Part of the Senate. evidence to change the outcome of the elec- nately, the Constitution gives the re- tion of Congresswoman Sanchez and is pur- sponsibility and the obligation to the suing never ending and unsubstantiated House of Representatives, and only the areas of review; and House of Representatives, to decide and October 23, 1997 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — HOUSE H9465 to judge the election of its Members, them prove their citizenship. Again, if Mr. THOMAS. Mr. Speaker, I yield not to the Secretary of State of Cali- this is the precedent we are going to myself 10 minutes. fornia or any other State or any other follow in any close or contested elec- Mr. Speaker, first of all, let me group or any other body. In fact, the tion in the future, these issues can be thank the majority leader for bringing Secretary of State of California has raised and we will then have to either the resolution to the floor. We frankly certified Ms. SANCHEZ’s election to this go personally or hire people to go and have had some difficulty in getting a body many, many months ago. make this kind of a determination over number of people to understand exactly Second, I want to reiterate that after months and months and months of what is going on. It is difficult when we almost 11 months of inquiry, the com- work. And even after all of that is try to follow the rules and the proce- mittee has not presented to the House done, we are not sure we are going to dures properly; we cannot go out and of Representatives, or to the public, know the facts on the citizenship of ev- demagog what we are trying to do. So facts, proof, evidence which would erybody that voted in a particular race this is an opportunity for us to once show that Ms. SANCHEZ was not validly in any particular congressional elec- again review the facts, and I appreciate elected in the 46th District of Califor- tion. the minority leader providing us with nia. The burden of proof is on the con- Finally, Mr. Speaker, let me say that the opportunity. testant. The contestant is the former what is going on here is totally unique, Mr. Speaker, the minority leader Member, Bob Dornan. unprecedented. It has never been done suggested the possible alternative of Mr. Speaker, Bob Dornan made cer- before in any election contest case. If going door to door. He knows and I tain representations to the committee. we send these records off as has been know and all of us know that going The committee has had these 10 suggested, which I think is totally in- door to door is wrong. It is just as months to look at those representa- appropriate, against the Constitution wrong as offering a resolution which tions and to date, no facts, no proof, no of the United States, this thing could will shut down the process before it is evidence has been presented that indi- be going on in May, June, July of next completed. cates that Ms. SANCHEZ was not elected year. It could be going on after the We owe it to those people who know or any proof that would indicate that election in 1998. they cast legal votes in this contested we should look beyond the certification Now, I appreciate the concern of the election to make sure that all the peo- of the State of California that Ms. majority that we should be concerned ple who cast illegal votes are deter- SANCHEZ was elected. that every Member of this House mined. Would we have liked to have Third, the procedure that the House should have validly won their election done it in the first week of the con- Committee on House Oversight major- to come here and represent approxi- tested election? Of course. Would we ity is suggesting is an unreasonable mately a half a million people in every like to do it in the time frame that he procedure. If we go forward and agree district in the country. The most im- is indicating? Of course. In fact, we of- to a procedure that looks at the citi- portant thing we have to do is to make fered an agreement that would have fa- zenship of everyone who votes in any sure that every one of us got validly cilities doing just that. election in the United States, I must elected and that there was not fraud or Mr. Speaker, the gentleman from tell my colleagues the work of the Con- there was not abuse or there were not Missouri also knows that we are not gress on any other subject will have to inappropriate procedures that went on turning over the determination of who end because we will have to spend all of in an election. That is our responsibil- legally voted in California’s 46th to the our time searching through the citizen- ity and that is our job and we take it Secretary of State. He knows that, but ship papers of everybody who has voted seriously. I know the majority takes it that is a useful rhetorical argument. in any certainly close election, maybe seriously. What we thought might help us ad- But, Mr. Speaker, after 11 months in every election, to make sure that ev- vance the finding of the facts was to and numerous hearings and thousands erybody who voted was a citizen. use those people who are involved in of records and numerous meetings and Now, this is maybe a thing we would this process every day. In fact, that is communications all over the country want to do. I do not think this is the what their job is. The Secretary of and the world, if we cannot now finally way we want to spend our time. The State is the chief election officer of decide whether or not LORETTA records of the Immigration Service, California. SANCHEZ was elected in the 46th Dis- and they have said this to the commit- Interesting enough, in the first trict, I do not believe sending off the tee, will not indicate on their face ‘‘whereas’’ they cite the Secretary of records to somebody else and letting whether or not people were actually State having issued a certificate. My them start off on this wild goose chase citizens on the date that they voted. It assumption is they believe he does a is going to make it any different or any is not the job of the Immigration Serv- pretty good job of carrying out his role better. ice to produce such information. They Mr. Speaker, the time has come to as the chief election officer. We do not always have it in each case. let this go. The time has come to do thought we could use him as an assist That is not their duty. It is not their the right thing. The time has come to in making decisions; that is, there al- responsibility. decide that the facts are not there that ready has been a discussion as to who So if we send to the Secretary of anything went wrong in this election. can vote when one becomes a citizen. State all of the papers that have been The time has come to say to the people We believe that the decision should amassed on the however many people of the 46th District of California, ‘‘You be made under California law, not that are suspected by somebody of not ran a valid election. LORETTA SANCHEZ under some agreement agreed to by a being citizens on the date the vote was was elected in this district.’’ It is time partisan majority or even a unanimous taken, neither the Secretary of State, to let this go and stop this unreason- task force, to take from California its nor anyone else, can find out from able procedure. legal laws under their election code looking at the paper whether or not ev- Sending these records to the Sec- and substitute an artificial one, which erybody who voted was a citizen or who retary of State of California will ac- has been done in the past. they voted for. So, Mr. Speaker, we complish no end of any kind whatso- Mr. Speaker, the gentleman from would be sending off materials to the ever. Let us make sure that we can say Missouri says this is unprecedented. Secretary of State that could lead to to the people of this country that we The gentleman is right. What we are no further conclusion than the com- have discharged our responsibility, we trying to do here is reverse past his- mittee has been able to reach. Why in have looked at the facts, the facts are tory, and that is do not make a politi- God’s green Earth would we want to do not there. cal decision on how we count the votes, that? Mr. Speaker, I urge my colleagues to but rely on the people who are legally Mr. Speaker, I am told that the only vote for this resolution. Let Ms. charged in the State to do it. way we could finally make that deter- SANCHEZ serve her constituents as she The gentleman from Missouri says mination would be to actually phys- came here to do and let her do it begin- we are going to have the Secretary of ically go door to door to everybody ning tonight. Vote for this resolution. State determine the citizenship. He who is suspected of not being a citizen Mr. Speaker, I reserve the balance of knows that is not true. The document on the day they voted and making my time. we gave him showed that the INS H9466 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — HOUSE October 23, 1997 would be involved. In fact, the INS has information. You folks do not know a decision? I think that is good. I do already been involved in the Western and apparently you do not want to not think it is bad. you seem to think region because the Western region took know what he is going to be forced to that it drives to a conclusion that we the names that the Orange County dis- say. should end all of this. trict attorney had subpoenaed and the The Orange County district attorney What amazes me is that you now in- Los Angeles region of the INS exam- currently has a criminal investigation dicate in whereas No. 9 that we have ined them and, working with the Sec- of conspiracy against Hermandad and got all the evidence that there needs to retary of State, determined that ap- Nativo Lopez is the head of that orga- be gathered. Fairly ironic that you proximately 300 people were not citi- nization. You do not care what happens could come to that conclusion, since zens but were on the voting roll. That there. You want to end it. I think those not one staff member of the minority was done with a sample. people who cast their votes legally and has been willing to sign a confidential- Mr. Speaker, what we are suggesting who would like to know if their votes ity statement to share, to look at the is perhaps they should look at a large were canceled out by illegal votes materials that we have. None of them sample. That does not mean that we would not want to. have been willing to sign. They will not have to agree to what they say, but it The whereases go on to indicate in enter into a confidentiality agreement would certainly be nice to use people the sixth whereas that the INS has not to leak the material. So how in the who were professionals and who do that complied with the committee’s re- world do they know what we have been job every day as a resource so that this quest. As a matter of fact, if you really doing? They refuse to sign a confiden- committee could use that information knew what was going on, you would tiality statement to join with us with- as it sees fit under the Constitution. know that the INS has not complied. out leaking. At least I admire their Mr. Speaker, anyone who knows me They still have names. They turned in honesty in not signing the statement. or who knows the gentleman from 200 just this week additional. They It just seems to me that if you come Michigan [Mr. EHLERS] or the gen- have hundreds more to turn in. They to the conclusion that we ought to end tleman from Ohio [Mr. NEY] knows we have not given us the complete list. this on October 29 based upon those would not turn any final decision over Remember, they only began giving us whereases, you are saying you want to to someone else. That decision is ours the lists when the committee subpoe- dismiss us, even if the INS has not pro- and we guard it jealously. But what is naed the Immigration and naturaliza- vided all the records, even if material wrong, for heaven’s sake, in using peo- tion Service to begin providing us with people who may be indicted for crimi- ple who are professionals in what they those documents. That was not 9 nal conspiracy have not provided infor- do to help us make a determination? months ago. We only have begun the mation to the committee, that you Let us look at the resolution that is process and we have not completed it. want to end it even if we do not know in front of us. The first ‘‘whereas’’ indi- When you take a look at the whereas how many people voted illegally. It is cates that the Secretary of State is No. 7, indicating that we already have not ‘‘if,’’ do not think it is ‘‘if.’’ It is someone who issued the certificate. I all the records because we placed a sub- how many. And to do ti right and to do already indicated that if he is held in poena on the evidence that the district ti properly takes time. high esteem by virtue of what he did attorney gathered, remember, our sub- I appreciate the gentleman offering before there was any hint of fraud or il- poena was on top of the district attor- the resolution. I think it is fairly clear legal voting in this particular race, ney’s subpoena to protect that mate- that based upon the facts of the case as what would be wrong with using him to rial so that we would not lose it. We we have moved forward that this reso- help us come to a conclusion? did not issue the initial subpoena. lution is not timely. The call for dis- The district attorney did. it was a missal on October 29 is premature, and b 1615 limited subpoena. kit was only for the I look forward to joining with you, not- It is interesting also that in the third materials that were in the offices of withstanding the fact that you reject whereas they talk about the fact that Hermandad. it is not all of the records. use of experts to assist us in determin- the task force met early and it has not That whereas is simply factually inac- ing what actually happened, in signing met recently. As a matter of fact, the curate. There could very well be more confidentially statements so we can task force, I understand from the records out there. We need to find out work together to get to the bottom of chairman, is going to meet on Friday. what Nativo Lopez knew and when he it. Let us review briefly why the task knew it. He refuses to respond to the Mr. GEPHARDT. Mr. Speaker, I yield force has not met. There were people, committee. We will continue to make 4 minutes to the gentlewoman from including the Congresswoman, who re- sure that he does not defy the commit- California [Ms. SANCHEZ]. fused to comply with the Federal Con- tee. Ms. SANCHEZ. Mr. Speaker, my tested Election Act in terms of the sub- We would love to have the minority thanks to the Democratic leader for poenas that were issued under that act. join us in supporting the Constitution giving me this opportunity to appear She believed they were unconstitu- and the laws in requiring people who before the full House to set aside any tional and wanted to fight it all the we have decided need to provide infor- doubts about my full cooperation in way to the Supreme Court. mation to us, that if they refuse to do this election contest. I supported her right to fight it all it, we compel them to do it. There I A few uninformed individuals have the way to the Supreme Court, if she would love to have you join us in sup- made accusations of stonewalling. In thought it was wrong. But I doubt if porting the Constitution and the laws. my case, the sooner this ordeal is you folks would, based upon this reso- It seems to me that when you say ended, the better. That is why I took lution, wait until she fought that all that, in whereas No. 8, we are seeking the affirmative action back in Feb- the way to the Supreme Court. We did duplicative and dilatory review of ma- ruary to invite the task force to Or- have the judge who issued the subpoe- terial already in the committee’s pos- ange County for a field hearing. At nas indicate that he certainly thought session, that you mean we want to that 9-hour hearing, I voluntarily ap- that the law was valid and subpoenas really make sure that we achieve the peared and testified under oath. I an- could be issued. So the committee is- highest level of verification where swered each and every question put to sued interrogatories. It was the com- someone’s vote is concerned. hey, I do me by the majority and by the minor- mittee that had to move in and begin not think that is bad. I think double- ity. Ten days later, I provided this task to act under the committee power. checking is good. I think being accu- force with the complete results of my The gentlewoman from Orange Coun- rate is proper. own field investigation of the so-called ty has, in fact, responded to the inter- I have a hard time understanding 303 voters that the Secretary of State rogatory. There are people who have why that is bad. if we are dealing in of California alleged were not lawful not responded to the interrogatory. We such an area of sensitivity that you voters. have communications from Nativo have indicated your concern, what is I gave the names, the addresses, and Lopez, who said he will not respond to wrong with checking the list twice or voter registration information on near- the interrogatory. In all probability we three times or using those officials who ly 200 of those individuals that we were will have to subpoena him to get the do it every day to help us in coming to able to interview or research and we October 23, 1997 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — HOUSE H9467 had proof, they showed us proof that There was no objection. that there were enough legitimate vot- they were naturalized or native born Mr. THOMAS. Mr. Speaker, it is my ers in this election to say that the gen- U.S. citizens, some for many decades. privilege to yield 3 minutes to the gen- tlewoman from California [Ms. In a detailed brief, I showed the task tleman from Texas [Mr. BONILLA]. SANCHEZ] should remain in Congress force each and every instance where (Mr. BONILLA asked and was given and serve her constituents the way she our field investigation demonstrated permission to revise and extend his re- has been doing, hardworking, with in- that the INS data is simply wrong, marks.) tegrity and conviction, like she has wrong, wrong. I have complied with Mr. BONILLA. Mr. Speaker, I do not demonstrated so far, then more power Mr. Dornan’s subpoenas except those think anyone can dispute the fact that to her. And, hopefully, she will have a that the Committee on House Over- the gentlewoman from California [Ms. long time here, if she continues to sight quashed as not relevant to this SANCHEZ] has served this institution serve her constituents well. election contest. My campaign has with honor and dignity. She is hard- But what is wrong? What are we turned over thousands of pages of fi- working, by all accounts, and I think afraid of in finding out the truth and nancial records. she should be commended for that in getting to the bottom of it? Before we We filed thousands of pages of briefs her remarks that she has just made be- get to that point, we should explore and evidence which have refuted every fore this body. But this dispute is not every opportunity to make sure that one of Mr. Dornan’s allegations, includ- about the gentlewoman from California every voter was qualified in this elec- ing his charge that U.S. Marines and [Ms. SANCHEZ], or Mr. Dornan, the tion. Catholic nuns residing in my district former Member that used to hold this Mr. HOYER. Mr. Speaker, will the were illegal or suspicious voters, and seat. gentleman yield? the committee has never issued a sub- This is about potential voter fraud Mr. BONILLA. I yield to the gen- poena to me or to my campaign. The that has existed in this particular con- tleman from Maryland. Mr. HOYER. The answer to the gen- only subpoena the committee has is- gressional district. tleman’s question, Mr. Speaker, is sued has been to the INS. I come from south Texas. It is notori- there is absolutely nothing wrong, and A few weeks ago the committee ously known for elections that have we want to make sure that we get to asked me, my campaign manager, and been stolen over the years and we all the bottom of it. However, as the reso- my campaign chairman to respond know, we have read our history books, lution points out, I tell my friend from under oath to a handful of questions. about how LBJ got his first Senate vic- We fully complied in the time frame Texas, we have been at this 11 months, tory and zoomed up to the White House the committee requested with over with all the information necessary. rather quickly because dead people 1,800 pages of sworn statements and We know everybody who voted and voted for him in Duval County in south evidence. I have cooperated with this we can check every one of them. That Texas. committee at every step, even while I has not been done. In 1990, we had a situation of a judi- exercised my right to argue before the Mr. Speaker, I yield 3 minutes to the cial race. A Republican candidate won. district court, which had issued sub- gentleman from Connecticut [Mr. The Republican candidate goes to bed poenas about the constitutionality of GEJDENSON], the ranking member of one night thinking that she had won, this process and the burden that it has the Committee on House Oversight. waking up the next day where they placed on innocent parties. Mr. GEJDENSON. Mr. Speaker, I re- Even though the Federal Contested suddenly found in a border town that gret that Speaker GINGRICH is not in Election Act requires that all parties, they had discovered 1,000 ballots that the Chair today. He was here earlier that all parties file with the Clerk of somehow did not get counted the night and left. But Speaker GINGRICH was the House copies of all depositions in before. elected to this Chamber with fewer compliance with all subpoenas, neither Then my colleague, the gentleman votes than the gentlewoman from Cali- Mr. Dornan nor the committee has from Louisiana [Mr. TAUZIN] cited the fornia [Ms. SANCHEZ]. It was a demo- filed any evidence with the Clerk or other day a Louisiana newspaper that cratically controlled House. We let has shown it to me. Eleven months tried to find out how easy is it to reg- Speaker GINGRICH be seated without into this investigation and months ister false names, names that are just question. after the INS has complied with the made up to see if they can register peo- If Bob Dornan had won this seat by 10 committee subpoena, I have not been ple to vote, had 25 names that they votes, I daresay we would not be here provided with one ounce of information submitted to the local election offi- today, a year after the election, having on a single individual on this list of cials, 19 qualified somehow to be reg- an inquisition about the citizens of over 5,000 people you continue to talk istered voters; one was a dog. that district. Let somebody on that about. In each of these cases, somehow local side stand up and say they would vote The committee has never offered me communities turn their back and say, to keep this thing going if Bob Dornan or my lawyers the opportunity to sign hey, well, let us just forget about it had won by 10 votes not by 1,000 as the any confidentiality agreements nec- and move on. LBJ won the Senate race. gentlewoman from California has. essary so we can take a look at any of The judicial seat was decided one way. What is this all about? I think it is the lists, let alone any evidence or de- In Louisiana, there are 19 new reg- about paranoia of the Hispanic-Ameri- tails you might have about the truth. istered voters. cans coming over the border and voting The investigation has been conducted But should we as Americans turn our illegally and taking over our country. in secret, despite the fact that the stat- back on the possibility that there was Give me a break. Anybody in this coun- ute calls for full and open sharing of enough fraud committed in this par- try that is on the lam is not running discovery in filings with the Clerk of ticular race to just turn our backs on down to get registered to have the the House that must be shared and it? This is 1997. You would think that whole world look at them. They are should be shared with all parties in this kind of occurrence that has hap- trying to avoid official contact. this dispute. pened, could have happened in Califor- And following procedures, the gen- This is a status report of what I have nia, could not happen in this day and tleman from California [Mr. THOMAS] done and this is what I offer to my col- age when we have high-technology op- and the committee are now, I think, in- leagues in the House. I hope this fully erations, when we have the ability to capable of a fair decision in this proc- sets aside the notion of any effort on police what people are doing in elec- ess. The law says Mr. Dornan has to my part to stonewall this investiga- tions, when we should have the tech- prove his case. What we have here is tion. nical expertise to find out who is really the committee on a course trying to do Mr. GEPHARDT. Mr. Speaker, I ask qualified to vote in this country. all of the work and going after the gen- unanimous consent that the gentleman tlewoman from California. b 1630 from Maryland [Mr. HOYER] be allowed Illegal voters? We talk about illegal to manage the rest of my time. We cannot turn our backs on that. voters. There is no evidence that is The SPEAKER pro tempore (Mr. I ask my colleagues what is wrong near the significant nature to reverse LAHOOD]. Is there objection to the re- with getting to the bottom of this in- this election. Here is one of their ille- quest of the gentleman from Missouri? vestigation? And if we find out one day gal voters, one of those notorious 305, H9468 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — HOUSE October 23, 1997 with her naturalization certificate, an and assure every Member of Congress done enough work on these. Rather, we American citizen who voted legally in that I do not in any way question her are seeking verification, because we that election. actions. I have never accused her of want to have as few errors as possible. What are we all about here? We are stonewalling. I do not intend to. I am And that is why we are presenting going to try to create enough smoke to sure she wants to resolve this. I want what we have uncovered in the inves- steal this election. If we cannot do it to resolve it. And I think we will both tigation, in great confidentiality, to here, maybe we can get the Secretary be well served if we can resolve it as the Secretary of State and to the INS, of State to do it. There may be even quickly as possible. with whom we have been working, ask- debtors from the past, anger over pre- However, it is not that simple when ing for verification of various factors vious actions of this House. We are one has to deal with all the details we there. here talking about this race today. have had to deal with, and I will try to Another comment, that no credible And, frankly, I address the Members outline a few of the aspects of that. evidence has been provided. Well, first of the House who have not been in- First of all, a few comments on the of all, I would relate to everyone that volved in this effort. We need 12 honest resolution presented. The chairman of our task is somewhat similar to that of men and women on the other side to the committee has already indicated a the Committee on Standards of Official stand up and join with us to put this number of issues that we would dis- Conduct. The Committee on Standards mockery to an end. agree with. I simply want to say, al- of Official Conduct has to work in a The Constitution says we make this though the task force has only had a confidential atmosphere. We do, too. decision. The Constitution says we few official meetings since the start of We do not release information. And have to make this decision here and the year, we have had several informal that is why we have confidentiality now. In America there is an old saying meetings discussing the quashing or agreements for anyone who works on that justice delayed is justice denied. modification of subpoenas and, further- the information. We are now through almost 12 months more, we have had four meetings of the Some numbers are public, and I will of her term. When will we make a deci- full committee where we have dealt mention those. My colleagues have sion? Will we make a decision after the with those same questions. So we have heard them referred to. The California next election? Will we have to create not been inactive on the meeting front. Secretary of State initially stated that enough turmoil to intimidate other In addition to that, we have been 303 out of the list of 1,150 registrants, Hispanics from voting so that Repub- very active in analyzing the data and the list from Hermandad, had voted il- licans can win that election because information, and I will, if time per- legally. The Secretary of State’s office they are afraid to show up? mits, get into some of the details of has taken the information provided by We have to end this now. It brings that later. the minority. We have worked with disgrace on this House. I do also want to comment on the them. The California Secretary of Mr. THOMAS. Mr. Speaker, I yield ‘‘whereas’’ clause which states that the State has now, through careful scru- myself 15 seconds. Committee on House Oversight has is- tiny of the entire list, verified that 305 I tell my friend from Connecticut, he sued unprecedented subpoenas to the individuals voted illegally. In other brought the same lady on the floor the INS; and also that this is the first time words, these are noncitizens who voted. other day, she is no longer on the list, in any election in the history of the In addition to that, the Registrar of obviously. That is why we need to go United States that the INS has been Elections in Orange County has veri- through and carefully check. But in asked by Congress to verify the citizen- fied that 124 individuals voted illegally. trying to preserve people’s privacy, ship of voters. This has nothing to do with a nonciti- does she really need to be exhibited First of all, I do not believe the sub- zen issue. It is illegal use of absentee this often, as some kind of a poster poenas are unprecedented, and, frank- ballots. So we have approximately 430 child? ly, the reason they were issued is that, known, publicized illegal votes in that Mr. Speaker, I yield 7 minutes to the although the INS initially agreed to district. gentleman from Michigan [Mr. cooperate at the local level, they were Furthermore, one other number that EHLERS], chairman of the task force. stopped by the officials in Washington, has become public is that our examina- And I am sorry the minority leader is and we had to resort to subpoenas be- tion of INS and Orange County reveals not on the floor. He was here earlier cause they simply refused to cooperate there are approximately 4,100 potential but I guess he left, because I would with us. I believe if my colleagues look noncitizen voters. That is, of course, a have liked for him to be here so he back through the records, they would huge number. And we have, through could hear the chairman of the task find the INS has been more cooperative months and months of staff effort, force. in the past. tried very diligently to try to find out Mr. EHLERS. Mr. Speaker, I share Furthermore, they have been asked a which of those individuals might pos- the regret expressed by the chairman number of times, or their predecessors sibly have citizenship that did not of the Committee on House Oversight have been asked, to verify citizenship show on the initial search of the INS that the minority leader is not here, not just of voters but of candidates for records. because not only would I like to have the office. I find it interesting, looking After all this work, that number of him hear my remarks but, frankly, I through some of the previous files in potential noncitizen voters is now wanted to compliment him on the man- the last century, more of the questions much smaller. And we are asking the ner in which he presented his state- about citizenship were raised about the California Secretary of State to verify ment and his case, in a very straight- winners of the contest than about the our work so that we can have the most forward manner, dealing with the facts. voters in the contest. But, clearly, this precise possible number. Verification is And that is what we are trying to do in is an important issue and they have what we are seeking from the Califor- this case. been involved in this issue before. nia Secretary of State, and I think it is In response to the gentleman from Furthermore, I happen to think it is very important to do that. Connecticut, I will answer just one of not bad to verify citizenship of voters. I believe it is also very important to his questions. He asked if someone here I think that it is extremely important, note that this Congress did seat the would stand up and say how we would because the law requires that voters be gentlewoman from California [Ms. deal if Mr. Dornan had won by 10 votes. citizens. I have no problem whatsoever SANCHEZ]. She has performed her du- I do not care how many votes he might with ensuring that voters of this Na- ties, insofar as I can tell, and she has have won by, he would have been treat- tion are citizens of this Nation. performed them well. She has all the ed the same way as the present Just a comment about the resolu- rights and duties of a Congressperson coutestee and the case would have been tion’s phrase that we are now seeking a and she is exercising them. There was handled the same way. duplicate and dilatory review of mate- no attempt to deny her the seat. There In regard to the contestee in the rials already in the committee’s pos- is no attempt to unseat her without case, the gentlewoman from California session by the secretary of the State of sufficient information. We want to [Ms. SANCHEZ], I commend her for her California. We are not asking for a du- make sure that we have verified all the statement, and I want to assure her plicate or dilatory review. We have facts in this case before we act. October 23, 1997 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — HOUSE H9469 Is it taking too long? It is certainly gally. Because if you did, you would who voted legally or who voted ille- taking longer than I would like. I had not only have to invalidate her elec- gally. hoped we could resolve it sooner, but tion but you would have to invalidate Mr. Speaker, I yield 1 minute to the there is a great deal of detailed work the election of the two assembly seats gentleman from Long Beach, CA [Mr. that needs to be done and we are near- won by Republicans at the same time. HORN]. ing the end of that process. One won by 93 votes in California. You (Mr. HORN asked and was given per- We are trying to keep it nonpolitical, would have to invalidate the municipal mission to revise and extend his re- and I know that is very, very difficult elections in 3 major cities. You would marks.) in this atmosphere. I have chided one have to invalidate the judicial elec- Mr. HORN. Mr. Speaker, with the ex- member of our committee for wearing tions that were held, school board ception of Representative SANCHEZ, I an orange ribbon in committee meet- races that were held would be held in have heard a lot of shouting on the ings and on the floor. I think that is in- question, and even initiatives that other side of the aisle. Because one appropriate, but that is his choice. I were passed in California. Yet it is in- shouts does not mean that one is seek- am just saying that I have tried to be teresting that you pick on Ms. SANCHEZ ing the truth. very evenhanded in my handling of this but we remain silent about all those I think most people in this Chamber issue. Republicans who won those elections know that I would vote for the person We simply have turned to the chief and you do not question the names of who has the evidence on their side and election officer of the State of Califor- individuals who allegedly voted in it would have nothing to do with their nia to verify what we have done. That those elections as well. It is okay to party. I would not do as a Democratic official issued a Certificate of Election, count them towards the victory but colleague of mine and friend of long- which we accepted, but we also want not towards her victory. standing did a decade ago when the evi- further verification of the numbers we The fact of the matter is you say we dence was very clear that a Republican are dealing with. do not care about finding the truth. We had won and he voted strictly the party Mr. HOYER. Mr. Speaker, I yield 4 do. We are willing to depend upon the line against that Republican. I do not minutes to the gentleman from New U.S. Attorney to pursue Hermandad tend to follow that kind of a precedent. Jersey [Mr. MENENDEZ]. and find out whatever the truth is. You Ms. SANCHEZ has not been denied her (Mr. MENENDEZ asked and was say that we were not going to shift this seat. She sits in this Chamber. The given permission to revise and extend to the Secretary of State, yet the list gentleman from Texas [Mr. BONILLA] his remarks.) that you want the committee members said quite well what a lot of us feel. Mr. MENENDEZ. Mr. Speaker, a year to adhere to that you are going to pro- We have heard a lot about what is ap- was more than enough for the Iran- vide the Secretary of State is flawed. It propriate. What is not appropriate is contra investigation to gather docu- inaccurately portrays who is a citizen. this resolution. ments, issue subpoenas, call witnesses, It cannot prove who is native born or The Gephardt resolution is simply an hold hearings, and issue a final report naturalized. It cannot prove that I as attempt to deny the truth to this on a probe that stretched into the born in this country who might be on House, and everyone here knows it. White House, the CIA, the military and that list, it cannot prove my citizen- Frankly, the resolution shows that over several continents. Here it is, all ship because only my birth certificate maybe this investigation is on the 42 chapters, 690 pages of it, covering ev- can prove that citizenship. You know, right track. Let us wait and let us get erything from detailed constitutional the only way to do this is to go door to at the truth. analysis to the tracing of complicated door, but that would be an outrage, and Mr. GEPHARDT. Mr. Speaker, I yield covert arms shipments involving sev- so you are going to make this last for- 2 minutes to the gentleman from Cali- eral foreign governments. ever. fornia [Mr. FAZIO]. But the majority on the Committee Everyone in this Chamber should Mr. THOMAS. Mr. Speaker, I yield 15 on House Oversight would have us and consider the precedent that would be seconds to the gentleman from Califor- the American people believe that near- set if this resolution does not carry, nia [Mr. FAZIO]. ly 1 year, the same time it took to do that any Member, Republican or Demo- The SPEAKER pro tempore (Mr. this, is not enough time; and after hun- crat, engaged in a close race could LaHood). The gentleman from Califor- dreds of thousands of taxpayer dollars, spend their entire 2-year term defend- nia [Mr. FAZIO] is recognized for 21⁄4 that it is not enough funding to con- ing a victory duly certified by their minutes. clude their investigation into the 46th home State. The simple justice for Mr. THOMAS. Mr. Speaker, will the Congressional District election. We do Congresswoman SANCHEZ, for the peo- gentleman yield? not accept that assertion. ple of the 46th District of California Mr. FAZIO of California. I yield to If Bob Dornan and the Republicans she represents and for millions of His- the gentleman from California. want to challenge the election, it is panic Americans who are watching Mr. THOMAS. I thank the gentleman their burden to prove the election across the country, what you are doing for yielding. I tell the gentleman from should be invalidated, not the burden to her and to us as a community who New Jersey that in my term of of the gentlewoman from California are waiting and watching, is to simply ‘‘machismo,’’ being from the South- [Ms. SANCHEZ] to prove she won the vote for this resolution, which says ei- west in terms of the way we describe election. ther put up or shut up. Show us the feelings that in fact if that did come proof or end the charade. That is what across, as someone came up to me and b 1645 the resolution asks for. That is what indicated, a remark that is not accept- The Republicans and Mr. Dornan our colleagues should be voting for. able on your side, I would then sub- have had nearly a year to meet that Mr. THOMAS. Mr. Speaker, I yield stitute the words ‘‘emotion’’ and ‘‘pas- burden of proof. Yes, she has been seat- myself 30 seconds. I appreciate the sion,’’ because I rely on the gentleman ed, but what you are doing is bleeding machismo of the gentleman from New from Massachusetts [Mr. FRANK] to as- her of thousands and hundreds of thou- Jersey, and of course challenging us to sist me at times in terms of sensitiv- sands of dollars. She has spent nearly a provide names or to create some kind ity, and in my reaction if he would half a million dollars in legal costs just of a fatally flawed decision is some- allow me I would not use the term simply to maintain her process, her thing that is devoutly wished on his ‘‘machismo,’’ I would use the term rights in this process. That is what you side. We will not. Our job under the ‘‘emotion’’ and ‘‘passion.’’ are doing to her. If you had cold, hard Constitution is to examine the congres- Mr. FAZIO of California. Mr. Speak- evidence to overturn the election, it sional race that came to us as con- er, I would like to remove the emotion would be in all of our hands, each and tested. If in fact the results of that in- and the passion for a minute and use a every Member of the House. But you do dicate that there are other races that bit of analysis that appeared in a Cali- not. You do not have a list of voters come under question, then that should fornia newspaper about two weeks ago who you can give and prove beyond a be dealt with by the proper authorities. on this subject. The article was enti- shadow of a doubt or even a preponder- That is never an argument nor should tled, ‘‘Who Abandoned Dornan? Repub- ance of the evidence that voted ille- it ever be an argument not to find out lican Voters.’’ H9470 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — HOUSE October 23, 1997 Ever since the election, Bob Dornan gally in that election, enough to provide man Robert Zemel, who has retained former has insisted that unregistered Latinos Sanchez’s margin of victory. An analysis of Christian Coalition executive director Ralph voted illegally enough to provide LO- that race done for Republicans, however Reed to run his campaign. (more on the analysis later), asserts that If the House calls for a special election be- RETTA SANCHEZ’s margin of victory. An Dornan lost not because of surplus Latino fore June, Dornan, because of superior name analysis of that race done for Repub- votes but because Republicans stopped vot- recognition, has the best shot of winning. licans, however, asserts that Dornan ing for him. Then he will likely lose again to Sanchez. lost not because of surplus Latino vot- Even though he had no national base and That’s why some Republicans would like to ers but because Republicans stopped no chance, Dornan spent most of 1995 and see Dornan step aside for another Repub- voting for him. early 1996 running for the Republican nomi- lican. The analysis goes on to point out nation for president. It was his second futile Good luck. They don’t call him ‘‘B–1 Bob’’ that Bob Dornan ran 6 percentage attempt. He was far more interested in ideo- for nothing. points behind two Republican assembly logical combat elsewhere than in serving his Mr. THOMAS. Mr. Speaker, I yield 2 constituents. Ultimately, they got tired of minutes to the gentleman from Florida victors who ran in a coterminous area, his act. 96 percent of which was in his congres- Dornan is demanding that the House of [Mr. MICA], a member of the commit- sional district, his at the time, LORET- Representatives invalidate the election and tee. TA SANCHEZ’s today. Had he racked up set a Dornan-Sanchez rematch. The House Mr. MICA. Mr. Speaker, this debate among Republicans the same percent- Oversight Committee has so far spent some and this matter is not about Bob Dor- age that they achieved, he would have $300,000 to investigate the charges that non- nan and it is not about Ms. Sanchez. won by some 10,000 votes. citizens voted. This debate is really about the Com- Investigators have concluded that there mittee on House Oversight, on which I The fact is in the strongest Repub- may have been some voter fraud and are con- lican precincts, assembly candidate tinuing to examine it. Whether it’s enough serve, finding the facts in this case. Jim Morrissey got 75 percent, Bob Dor- to make a difference, no one, besides Dornan, Why could this matter not and why nan got 56 percent. He ran in the is prepared to say. At the convention, Dor- can this matter not be concluded? It is strongest Republican districts 20 per- nan charged that he has ‘‘bulletproof’’ evi- simple. We found as a committee that cent behind his own colleague on the dence that between 1,200 and 1,500 people agencies have dragged their feet in ballot. The bottom line is the people of voted illegally, but he did not offer it. compliance with requests that we have ‘‘As far as I’m concerned, we’ve won,’’ he Orange County, certainly the Repub- made, simple requests to get to the announced at an Orange County lunch facts. This House just a few weeks ago, licans, were tired of his buffoonery. Thursday. ‘‘I don’t want to step on anybody’s They got tired of him calling people glory, although it’s my life and I have the September 30, passed a resolution to lesbian spear chuckers. They got tired seat and I won and I am the congressman- the Department of Justice asking the of his explaining bounced checks at the elect, the longest congressman-elect in the U.S. Attorney to do their jobs, to help House bank and his interminable presi- history of our country 11 months and three us get the facts. So what we have been dential campaigns. days.’’ faced with is stalling, delay, a lack of Bob Dornan ran out of support in his House Democrats say they are outraged information. that Dornan has had such a sympathetic own party in Orange County, and I This is not a complex issue if our hearing before the Republican-controlled committee has the facts. The facts that think he has run out in this precinct as committee, including the use of subpoenas. well tonight because as we look at the Sanchez says she is some $400,000 in debt for we have in fact indicate that a signifi- Republican side of the aisle, there may legal fees defending himself. Many Repub- cant number of voters who voted ille- be five Members here to defend him. licans say they don’t want to fall on their gally. We heard the minority leader Democrats are here in large numbers sword defending a man whose very existence say that we need the facts, we need the to defend LORETTA SANCHEZ and her exacerbates their electoral problems with proof, and we need the evidence, and right to claim this seat. Yes, Bob Dor- women and Latinos, even if they do have a that is exactly what we need and that duty to probe potential voter fraud. is all we are asking for. nan has lost Republican support in Or- But a detailed statistical analysis of the ange County and in Washington, DC. Sanchez-Dornan election concluded that Re- There is no intent to go through the Mr. Speaker, the editorial referred to publicans in Republican precincts abandoned citizenship of every voter. However, we in my remarks is as follows: Dornan in droves. have reason to be concerned about the [From the Sacramento Bee, Oct. 7, 1997] Overall, Dornan ran 6 percentage points validity of a significant number of vot- below the two Assembly Republicans, Curt WHO ABANDONED DORNAN? REPUBLICAN ers in a contested election. Pringle and Jim Morrissey, whose Assembly VOTERS Ms. Sanchez has been seated and districts include more than 95 percent of (By John Jacobs) treated fairly by this side of the aisle Dornan’s 46th congressional district. Among and by our committee. Again, this is One of the enduring images of the recently Democrats and Republicans, Dornan got 49.46 concluded Republican state convention in percent of the vote. Among Democrats and not about Ms. Sanchez, it is not about Anaheim was of former Rep. Robert Dornan, Republicans, Pringle and Morrissey got 55.55 Mr. Dornan. I agree that the time has a wild-eyed look about him, careening percent of the vote. come to conclude this process with one around the convention hall hounding report- If Dornan had racked up the same vote to- caveat, that we have the facts. ers and anyone else who would listen with tals in his race that fellow Republicans Mr. GEPHARDT. Mr. Speaker, I yield tales of how he has been wronged. Pringle and Morrissey got in their Assembly 2 minutes to the gentleman from Cali- Dornan, a bombastic conservative who races, according to this analysis, Dornan fornia [Mr. BECERRA]. once called feminists ‘‘lesbian spear-chuck- would have defeated Sanchez by 9,365 votes. (Mr. BECERRA asked and was given ers’’ and who ‘‘explained’’ his bounced check Because he lost by 984 votes, Pringle and from the House bank by saying he used the Morrissey ran more than 10,000 votes better permission to revise and extend his re- money to build a shrine to the Virgin Mary than Dornan. marks.) in his backyard, has finally become a buf- This analysis also looked at the strongest Mr. BECERRA. Mr. Speaker, I thank foon, even to the many formerly sympa- (and weakest) Republican precincts in the the gentleman for yielding me this thetic Republicans. congressional district. In precinct 68069, time. There are a lot of folks in Orange Dornan went on so long at his press con- which has a Republican registration of 58.51 County who are going to have a chance ference that the local PBS camera crew as- percent, Dornan got 56.6 percent of the vote. to watch this. I am glad. I hope this is signed to cover him that day ran out of vid- Morrissey got more than 75 percent. eotape. At that point, Boston Globe col- Precinct 68106 is the weakest Republican well-reported, because it is time for the umnist Marty Nolan asked the crew, only district in Santa Ana, with a GOP voter reg- voters in Orange County to know what half-jokingly, ‘‘Which PBS show are you istration of just 11.44 percent. Morrissey got evidence there is that their Congress- from, Nova?’’ just a few more votes here than Dornan, 16.8 woman, LORETTA SANCHEZ, did not Dornan was defeated by 984 votes last No- percent to Dornan’s 15 percent. But really win this election. vember when he ran for what would have Morrissey was able to win re-election with Unfortunately, in the hour or so that been his 10th term in Congress from the very huge majorities in the Republican precincts, I have been listening to this debate, I Disneyland district in which the state con- something Dornan couldn’t do, must tell the voters that I have yet to vention was held. The victor was Loretta The conclusion: The seat is still winnable Sanchez, a Latina Republican-turned-Demo- for a Republican. Three Republicans are in- hear one shred of evidence that LORET- crat now serving her first term. terested in the June 1998 primary: Pro-choice TA SANCHEZ did not win the votes of Ever since the election, Dornan has in- divorce lawyer Lisa Hughes; Superior Court the majority of the people in Orange sisted that unregistered Latinos voted ille- Judge Jim Gray; and Anaheim City Council- County. October 23, 1997 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — HOUSE H9471 What I have heard is that we want to exceeds the difference that made the think we would tolerate that, and I do move this forward and apparently now difference in the election, then it is ap- not think we ought to allow it to be the majority, which has for 11 months propriate to consider a new election. done to her. and after hundreds of thousands of dol- No one, certainly me least of all, is in- Mr. THOMAS. Mr. Speaker, I yield lars investigated this matter, now terested in seating Robert Dornan by 11⁄2 minutes to the gentleman from wants to move this over to the Sec- fiat. I think it is only fair to point this Michigan [Mr. EHLERS], the chairman retary of State to do what we can do. out. But the numbers are very serious of the task force. Well, you have had 11 months, hun- cause for us to concern ourselves about Mr. EHLERS. Mr. Speaker, just to dreds of thousands of dollars, you have whether the constitutional processes clarify a few points and respond to a put at stake the representation of the were followed. The numbers are 4,100 few items mentioned by the last two 46th Congressional District and LORET- from which we build the case that speakers, the two gentlemen from Cali- TA SANCHEZ’S ability to represent. You there may have been more people vot- fornia on the minority side. ing than should have to make the mar- have put in an indicted stage the votes First of all, the statement was made of thousands of voters in Orange Coun- gin of difference in this election. Mr. GEPHARDT. Mr. Speaker, I yield that they have not seen one shred of ty. You have run this game, you have evidence. Apparently they did not hear taken the ball, and now you want to 1 minute to the gentleman from Cali- fornia [Mr. CONDIT]. my comment that, independent of our punt. You are saying, this political work, there are 305 illegal voters iden- football has been too much, let us send (Mr. CONDIT asked and was given permission to revise and extend his re- tified by the Secretary of State, and it to the Secretary of State. 124 illegal absentee ballots identified The Secretary of State cannot do marks.) Mr. CONDIT. Mr. Speaker, I rise by the Registrar of Elections in Orange anything more than you have already County. That is a substantial number done. They can only look at the same today to tell Members that I think that we ought to put an end to this. right there, certainly more than a names, same numbers, same addresses shred. In addition to that, of course, we and tell us what you can tell us. It is The American people have lost faith with our ability to analytically and have the other areas we are investigat- our duty. Do not punt. Let us decide. If ing. you have got proof, show it. If you do systematically look at each other and not, close down this investigation. investigate issues that are important I also want to respond to the re- There are people at stake, the first of to all of us and the citizens of this peated comments, both on the floor country. We look at these things. This and off the floor, about the length of whom is LORETTA SANCHEZ, the second of whom are all the people in the 46th has taken 11 months, 11 months, and time this is taking. Let us get a little Congressional District who deserve rep- we have no conclusion to this. reality in here. I would hope that the resentation. It has been 11 months. Let b 1700 Members of this House would look back this woman go. Let her represent her in history and look at what has hap- I think that that is enough. We have pened in the past. district. been disruptive to the House, and we I have in my hands a chart, which I Mr. THOMAS. Mr. Speaker, I yield 1 have not allowed Ms. SANCHEZ to do will be happy to share with anyone, minute to the gentleman from Califor- her job and represent the people of her going back to approximately 1930, of all nia [Mr. CAMPBELL]. district. (Mr. CAMPBELL asked and was We can debate about the technical the contested elections that had real given permission to revise and extend things, and I believe that the commit- substance to them, such as this one, his remarks.) tee has looked at that. I think it is where an investigation was required. Mr. CAMPBELL. Mr. Speaker, as time that they render a decision to us The first one was 22.75 months dura- best as I have understood the debate, and let us make that decision. I think tion; then we have a series of over 12 there are 4,100 names that match first that is important for us to do that. months duration; two of 16 months du- name, last name, and date of birth Enough is enough. Let us make a de- ration; several more of 12 months dura- from those who were registered to vote, cision, and let us let the committee tion; 131⁄2 months; 161⁄2 months; 19, 22, were in the process of becoming citi- bring it to the floor so that we can de- 161⁄2, 181⁄2, 191⁄2. And you think this one zens, but were not yet citizens. The cide whether or not she should be able is too long? Look at the history. Look next process that has to be taken is to to represent the people of her district. at what we have had in the past. compare these 4,100 names which That is important for us to do that. This case has not taken too long. If match first name, last name and date I would just call upon my colleagues we would decide this contest today, it of birth and see if they match up to think just for a moment about if would be one of the earliest decisions against those who voted. If as a result this happened to any one of us. She has made on an issue of substance in the of that process there is a number that had a great financial burden. I do not history of contested elections. EXAMPLES: DURATIONS OF SUBSTANTIVE HOUSE CONTESTED ELECTIONS CASES

Final vote Congress and contest Outcome supports Party of Majority Committee on House Duration in seated party action 1 months floor 2

104th—Anderson/Rose (NC) ...... Contestee ...... D R 10/25/95 9/26/96 22.75 98th—Archer/Packard (CA) ...... Contestee ...... R D 10/25/83 11/15/83 12.25 98th—Hendon/Clarke (NC) ...... Contestee ...... D D 10/25/83 11/15/83 12.25 96th—Wilson/Leach (LA) ...... Contestee ...... D D 2/12/80 3/4/80 16 96th—Thorsness/Daschle (SD) ...... Contestee ...... D D 2/12/80 3/4/80 16 95th—Dehr/Leggett (CA) ...... Contestee ...... D D 9/21/77 10/27/77 11.75 95th—Hill & Panasigui/Clay (MO) ...... Contestee ...... D D 10/13/77 10/27/77 11.75 95th—Lowe/Fowler (GA) ...... Contestee ...... D D 10/13/77 10/27/77 11.75 94th—Young/Mikva (IL) ...... Contestee ...... D D NA 12/19/75 13.5 94th—Mack/Stokes (OH) ...... Contestee ...... D D NA 12/19/75 13.5 94th—Wilson/Hinsh (CA) ...... Contestee ...... R D NA 12/19/75 13.5 94th—Ziebarth/Smith (NE) ...... Contestee ...... R D NA 12/19/75 13.5 86th—Maloney/Smith (KS) ...... Contestee ...... R D NA 3/24/60 16.5 85th—Cater/LeCompte (IA) ...... Contestee ...... R D NA 6/17/58 19.25 85th—Oliver/Hale (ME) ...... Contestee ...... R D NA 9/12/58 22.25 82d—Osser/Scott (PA) ...... Contestee ...... R D NA 3/19/52 16.5 82d—Macy/Greenwood (NY) ...... Contestee ...... D D NA 3/19/52 16.5 81st—Stevens/Blackney (MI) ...... Contestee ...... R D NA 5/23/50 18.5 80th—Wilson/Granger (UT) ...... Contestee ...... D R NA 6/19/48 19.5 79th—Hicks/Dondero (MI) ...... Contestee ...... R D NA 12/12/45 13.25 78th—Clark/Nichols (OK) ...... Contestee ...... D D NA 2/16/44 15.25 78th—Moreland/Schuetz (IL) ...... Contestee ...... D D NA 2/17/44 15.25 78th—McEvoy/Peterson (GA) ...... Contestee ...... D D NA 5/5/44 18 78th—Schafer/Wasielewski (WI) ...... Contestee ...... D D NA 3/29/44 16.75 78th—Thill/McMurray (WI) ...... Contestee ...... D D NA 1/31/44 14.75 78th—Sullivan/Miller (MO) ...... Contestee ...... G D NA 11/24/43 12.5 76th—Swanson/Harrigton (IA) ...... Contestee ...... D D NA 3/11/40 16 76th—Scott/Eaton (CA) ...... Contestee ...... R D 3/14/40 NA 16.25 75th—Roy/Jenks (NH) ...... Contestant ...... D D 4/28/38 6/9/38 19 H9472 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — HOUSE October 23, 1997 EXAMPLES: DURATIONS OF SUBSTANTIVE HOUSE CONTESTED ELECTIONS CASES—Continued

Final vote Congress and contest Outcome supports Party of Majority Committee on House Duration in seated party action 1 months floor 2

74th—Lanzetta/Marcantonio (NY) 3 ...... Contestee ...... R D NA 6/20/36 19.5 74th—McCandless/King (HI) ...... Contestee ...... R D NA 6/2/36 18.75 74th—Miller/Cooper (OH) ...... Contestee ...... R D NA 3/11/36 16 73d—Reese/Ellzey (MS) ...... Contestee ...... D D NA 2/24/34 15.5 73d—Brewster/Utterback (ME) ...... Contestee ...... D D NA 5/28/34 18.75 73d—Gormley/Goss (CT) ...... Contestee ...... R D NA 4/20/34 17.5 73d—Chandler/Burnham (CA) ...... Contestee ...... R D NA 5/15/34 18.25 73d—Ellis/Thurston (IA) ...... Contestee ...... R D NA 4/25/34 17.5 73d—Fox/Higgins (CT) ...... Contestee ...... R D NA 5/28/34 18.75 73d—Lovette/Reece (TN) ...... Contestee ...... R D NA 5/25/34 18.5 73d—McAndrews/Britten (IL) ...... Contestee ...... R D NA 4/26/34 17.75 73d—Weber/Simpson (IL) ...... Contestee ...... R D 5/4/34 NA 4 18 67th—Paul/Harrison (VA) ...... Contestant ...... R R NA 12/15/22 13.25 1 Date which the Committee made its recommendation to the full House, usually in the form of a House Resolution. 2 Date that the House voted on the resolution of the contested election case. 3 Although the election was held Nov. 6, 1936, the case was not filed with the Clerk of the House uhtil the early part of 1936. 4 No record of its being called up for passage found.

Mr. THOMAS. Mr. Speaker, I yield 1 naive, innocent freshman, who had prompt response it should have had, minute to the gentleman from Califor- never been in a legislative body, even and the work is not completed. nia [Mr. HUNTER.] insofar as having attended the gallery. But make no mistake about it. For Mr. HUNTER. Mr. Speaker, I want to In a very few short weeks after I was all these years I have thought about speak to my colleagues who have asked here, I saw a young gentleman from In- the McIntyre case. I always knew it us to have consideration for Ms. diana named Mr. McIntyre refused his was important. I always knew that the SANCHEZ. There have been a number of seat in Congress and his election over- majority was then dedicated, but I al- debates on this issue, lots of speakers turned by the actions of this body in a ways wondered, was it in fact the truth on both sides, and one thing that I very short period of time. which was gotten to? I never knew. think has been consistent on the Re- At that time there was a heated de- I think maybe a few more months, an publican side is that nobody has spo- bate on this floor. There was anger. My extra amount of time, a more full and ken derogatorily about Ms. SANCHEZ. eyes bulged out. I had not seen people complete verification of what it is we Nobody has spoken in a mean way, no- act this way toward one another, out- found and how we found it that brought body has attempted to personalize this side of a faculty lounge, in my lifetime. us to this conclusion might have made with respect to Ms. SANCHEZ. I think I knew it was exciting, and I under- me more comfortable throughout all we have all attempted to be polite and stood there were good points made on these years that this body was a body attempted to look at the major issue, both sides. of honor and duty fulfilling its obliga- which is the voting issue. I remember the then majority, that tions under the Constitution. I would I cannot say that with respect to was acting definitively to deny Mr. like to have been comforted by no what people who do not like Mr. Dor- McIntyre his seat in the House, made doubt on that point. nan have said on the other side. My the point that it is our solemn respon- I do not want somebody sitting here friend, Mr. FAZIO, I am pretty dis- sibility, given to us by the Constitu- on this side of the aisle as a freshman, turbed that you have gotten up and tion; we can do no less, we must act celebrating in their own mind the won- simply made a personal attack on Mr. with discipline and integrity. And, in 3 derful responsibility and privilege of Dornan. or 4 weeks, they did so. getting to be in this body, 10 years Both of the principals have been Now here we have a committee ad- from now wondering, in 1997, even if it through a lot here for a lot of months. dressing the same kinds of question, took us into 1998, did we dare to take We should give consideration to both of the same kinds of issues. They are tak- the time to do the job completely, these principals; not just Ms. SANCHEZ, ing their time, they are being thor- fully, thoroughly, in full respect to our but to Mr. Dornan. Let us decide this ough. duty and the wisdom of the Constitu- case on the facts, and see that the per- We have the gentleman from Michi- tion that endowed us with that duty? son with the most votes wins this gan [Mr. EHLERS]. Mr. EHLERS, I be- We all deserve, 10 years from now, to thing. lieve, is a physicist. He is some kind of have no reservation about that, and I Mr. FAZIO of California. Mr. Speak- hard scientist, a careful man. He wants believe we all ought to dare wait for er, will the gentleman yield? the facts to be clear. He does not rush Mr. HUNTER. I yield to the gen- the facts to be fully known. to judgment, checks and double-checks Mr. GEPHARDT. Mr. Speaker, I yield tleman from California. Mr. FAZIO of California. Mr. Speak- his work, needs all the data; we have the balance of my time to the gen- er, this is not a personal attack on Bob the gentleman from Ohio [Mr. NEY], tleman from Maryland [Mr. HOYER]. Dornan. This is the result of Bob Dor- hardly a rabid partisan, a very thor- The SPEAKER pro tempore. The gen- nan’s career and reading of the voters ough-going man; the gentleman from tleman from Maryland [Mr. HOYER] is of Orange County, CA. Maryland [Mr. HOYER], certainly none recognized for 4 minutes. Mr. THOMAS. Mr. Speaker, it is my of us would think of Mr. HOYER as a Mr. HOYER. Mr. Speaker, the major- privilege and pleasure to yield the bal- partisan; all of whom have said we need ity leader is correct. We stand in those ance of my time to the gentleman from to be sure we do this thoroughly, pro- seats and we raise our right hand and Texas [Mr. ARMEY], the majority lead- fessionally, and in light of all the data. we swear to preserve, protect, and de- er. It is not about Congresswoman fend the Constitution of the United The SPEAKER pro tempore [Mr. SANCHEZ, it is not about former Con- States. There is no more sacred right LAHOOD]. The gentleman from Texas is gressman Dornan; it is not about your that the people have than to select recognized for 21⁄2 minutes. party, and it is not about my party; it their representatives, and to select Mr. ARMEY. Mr. Speaker, I thank is not about race, it is not about sex; it them in an election that is fair and the gentleman for yielding me time. is about whether or not this body has does not dilute in any way their votes. Mr. Speaker, this is the second time the discipline to do its duty thoroughly Therefore, I tell you that it is appro- in my brief career in the House of Rep- and completely down to the last detail priate that if those who voted illegally resentatives that I have seen the House before they come to the determination affected this election, this election take up this responsibility, mandated of judgment about who does in fact should be scrutinized carefully and ap- on the House by the Constitution, to have the legal, legitimate right to rep- propriate action taken. But in the determine the legitimacy of the elec- resent 500,000 people. same vein, the voters of the 46th Con- tion of its Members. There is evidence that demands more gressional District have the right to When I was elected in 1984, when I thorough investigation. The committee expect us to conduct that process in a came here I was a bright-eyed and has not had the full and complete and manner befitting of that oath. October 23, 1997 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — HOUSE H9473

I tell my friends in this House, sadly, from California [Mrs. SANCHEZ] or we NAYS—222 as the minority member of this task dismiss this case, which is without Aderholt Gilchrest Pappas force, that that has not been done. I merit. Archer Gillmor Parker asked early on that we proceed in a bi- Armey Gilman Paul Mr. GEPHARDT. Mr. Speaker, I Bachus Gingrich Paxon partisan fashion to establish process, move the previous question on the res- Baker Goodlatte Pease to establish the way that we would olution. Ballenger Goodling Peterson (PA) reach a decision, in an orderly, fully Barr Goss Petri The previous question was ordered. dispositive, timely way. Barrett (NE) Graham Pickering The SPEAKER pro tempore (Mr. Bartlett Granger Pitts I tell my friend, that has not been Barton Greenwood Pombo done. In point of fact, as the resolution LAHOOD). The question is on the resolu- Bass Gutknecht Porter points out, the task force has not met tion. Bateman Hansen Portman since April of this year. I asked in Feb- The question was taken; and the Bereuter Hastert Pryce (OH) Bilbray Hastings (WA) Quinn ruary in a letter to the chairman of the Speaker pro tempore announced that Bilirakis Hayworth Radanovich task force, let us meet together to the noes appeared to have it. Bliley Hefley Ramstad come to agreement on the process. No Mr. GEPHARDT. Mr. Speaker, on Blunt Herger Redmond such meeting has ever occurred. Boehlert Hill Regula that I demand the yeas and nays. Boehner Hilleary Riggs I tell my friends that I asked to be The yeas and nays were ordered. Bonilla Hobson Riley fully apprised of the information we The vote was taken by electronic de- Bono Hoekstra Rogan were seeking and the information we Brady Horn Rogers were receiving. I tell you sadly, that vice, and there were—yeas 204, nays Bryant Hostettler Rohrabacher Bunning Hulshof Ros-Lehtinen has not occurred. 222, answered ‘‘present’’ 1, not voting 7, as follows: Burr Hunter Roukema In fact, my friends, this very day I Burton Hutchinson Royce found out at 4:15 that there will be the [Roll No. 525] Buyer Hyde Salmon Callahan Inglis Sanford third meeting of the task force since YEAS—204 the beginning of this year, tomorrow at Calvert Istook Saxton Abercrombie Goode Murtha Camp Jenkins Scarborough 10 o’clock. No prior notice. And I tell Ackerman Gordon Nadler Campbell Johnson (CT) Schaefer, Dan my friend, the gentleman from Michi- Allen Green Neal Canady Johnson, Sam Schaffer, Bob gan [Mr. EHLERS], the chairman of the Andrews Gutierrez Oberstar Cannon Jones Sensenbrenner task force, he and I talked for approxi- Baesler Hall (OH) Obey Castle Kasich Sessions Baldacci Hall (TX) Olver Chabot Kelly Shadegg mately 45 minutes this morning at 10 Barcia Hamilton Ortiz Chambliss Kim Shaw o’clock, and I was never informed that Barrett (WI) Harman Owens Chenoweth King (NY) Shays there would be a task force meeting. Becerra Hastings (FL) Pallone Christensen Kingston Shimkus No, my friends, this process has not Bentsen Hefner Pascrell Coble Klug Shuster Berman Hilliard Pastor Coburn Knollenberg Skeen been fair, it has not been open, it has Berry Hinchey Payne Collins Kolbe Smith (MI) not been directed at fully getting out Bishop Hinojosa Pelosi Combest LaHood Smith (NJ) the information that is necessary to Blagojevich Holden Peterson (MN) Cook Largent Smith (OR) fairly determine this election. Blumenauer Hooley Pickett Cooksey Latham Smith (TX) Bonior Hoyer Pomeroy Cox LaTourette Smith, Linda Now, my friends, I tell you, the Re- Borski Jackson (IL) Poshard Crane Lazio Snowbarger publican Secretary of State in latter Boswell Jackson-Lee Price (NC) Crapo Leach Solomon March or early April said there were Boucher (TX) Rahall Cunningham Lewis (CA) Souder 303 votes that were in question in this Boyd Jefferson Rangel Davis (VA) Lewis (KY) Spence Brown (CA) John Reyes Deal Linder Stearns election. You heard the testimony from Brown (FL) Johnson (WI) Rivers DeLay Livingston Stump the gentleman from Connecticut say- Brown (OH) Johnson, E. B. Rodriguez Diaz-Balart LoBiondo Sununu ing many of those votes have already Capps Kanjorski Roemer Dickey Lucas Talent been found to be registered, valid vot- Cardin Kaptur Rothman Doolittle Manzullo Tauzin Carson Kennedy (MA) Roybal-Allard Dreier McCollum Taylor (NC) ers. Clay Kennedy (RI) Rush Duncan McCrery Thomas The Secretary of State of California, Clayton Kennelly Sabo Dunn McDade Thornberry two weeks ago, had a press conference Clement Kildee Sanders Ehlers McHugh Thune and he said, after 6 months, he now be- Clyburn Kilpatrick Sandlin Ehrlich McInnis Tiahrt Condit Kind (WI) Sawyer Emerson McKeon Traficant lieved there were not 303, there were Conyers Kleczka Schumer English Metcalf Upton 305. That is a third of a voter a month. Costello Klink Scott Ensign Mica Walsh I tell my friend from California, at that Coyne Kucinich Serrano Everett Miller (FL) Wamp rate it would take us 160 years to get to Cramer LaFalce Sherman Ewing Moran (KS) Watkins Cummings Lampson Sisisky Fawell Morella Watts (OK) 984, and then you would have to assume Danner Lantos Skaggs Foley Myrick Weldon (FL) that every one of those voters voted for Davis (FL) Levin Skelton Fowler Nethercutt Weldon (PA) [Ms. SANCHEZ], and our precedents do Davis (IL) Lewis (GA) Slaughter Fox Neumann Weller not allow that, and logic does not com- DeFazio Lipinski Smith, Adam Franks (NJ) Ney White DeGette Lofgren Snyder Frelinghuysen Northup Whitfield pel it. Delahunt Lowey Spratt Gallegly Norwood Wicker My friends, this resolution says, as DeLauro Luther Stabenow Ganske Nussle Wolf the two bipartisan individuals who Dellums Maloney (CT) Stark Gekas Oxley Young (AK) were counsel for the Republicans and Deutsch Maloney (NY) Stenholm Gibbons Packard Young (FL) Dicks Manton Stokes ANSWERED ‘‘PRESENT’’—1 counsel for the Democrats in March of Dingell Markey Strickland this year said, let MARY LANDRIEU go, Dixon Martinez Stupak Sanchez Doggett Mascara Tanner because they have not made a prima NOT VOTING—7 facia case. And, very frankly, the Re- Dooley Matsui Tauscher Doyle McCarthy (MO) Taylor (MS) Cubin McIntosh Visclosky publican leadership rejected that. It Edwards McCarthy (NY) Thompson Gonzalez Ryun took them 51⁄2 months. Engel McDermott Thurman Houghton Schiff I tell my friend from California, the Eshoo McGovern Tierney b 1735 distinguished legal professor, to come Etheridge McHale Torres Evans McIntyre Towns Mr. BONO and Mr. GREENWOOD to exactly the same conclusion. Why, Farr McKinney Turner MARY LANDRIEU twisted in the wind Fattah McNulty Velazquez changed their vote from ‘‘yea’’ to and had to spend money and had to Fazio Meehan Vento ‘‘nay.’’ have her focus diverted to defend a case Filner Meek Waters Mr. FROST and Mr. OBERSTAR Flake Menendez Watt (NC) changed their vote from ‘‘nay’’ to that Republican counsel and Demo- Foglietta Millender- Waxman cratic counsel 5 months ago said had Forbes McDonald Wexler ‘‘yea.’’ no merit. Ford Miller (CA) Weygand So the resolution was not agreed to. Frank (MA) Minge Wise The result of the vote was announced b 1715 Frost Mink Woolsey as above recorded. Furse Moakley Wynn I ask that this resolution pass; that Gejdenson Mollohan Yates A motion to reconsider was laid on we decide the case on the gentlewoman Gephardt Moran (VA) the table.