Wednesday Volume 538 11 January 2012 No. 246
HOUSE OF COMMONS OFFICIAL REPORT
PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES (HANSARD)
Wednesday 11 January 2012
£5·00 © Parliamentary Copyright House of Commons 2012 This publication may be reproduced under the terms of the Parliamentary Click-Use Licence, available online through The National Archives website at www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/information-management/our-services/parliamentary-licence-information.htm Enquiries to The National Archives, Kew, Richmond, Surrey TW9 4DU; e-mail: [email protected] 159 11 JANUARY 2012 160
that there are no current plans to reduce the number of House of Commons MOD police. I hope he will also be able to assure the House that the Government will never adopt any plans Wednesday 11 January 2012 to reduce security at Faslane and Coulport, given the importance of the nuclear installations there.
The House met at half-past Eleven o’clock Michael Moore: As I have said, national security and the defence of our security installations are our highest priority, and we will do nothing that would compromise PRAYERS that security.
[MR SPEAKER in the Chair] Child Tax Credits 2. John Robertson (Glasgow North West) (Lab): What assessment he has made of the effect of the Oral Answers to Questions autumn statement on child tax credit payments in Scotland. [88252]
SCOTLAND The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Scotland (David Mundell): The welfare system must remain fair and affordable, while protecting the most vulnerable. The Secretary of State was asked— Most working-age benefits, benefits for disabled people and the basic state pension will increase by 5.2% in Ministry of Defence Police April. In order to remain on course with the debt consolidation plan and meet their fiscal mandate, the 1. Dr Eilidh Whiteford (Banff and Buchan) (SNP): Government will increase the child element of child tax What discussions he has had with the Secretary of credit by the rate of inflation. State for Defence about Ministry of Defence police numbers in Scotland. [88251] John Robertson: According to the House of Commons Library, the Government’s decision not to proceed with The Secretary of State for Scotland (Michael Moore): the £110 increase in the child element of child tax credit We have regular discussions with ministerial colleagues will take £41 million away from nearly 400,000 children on defence matters relating to Scotland. The Under- in Scotland alone. Worst hit in Scotland will be Glasgow Secretary of State for Scotland, my right hon. Friend city, where 44,000 children are set to miss out on the Member for Dumfriesshire, Clydesdale and Tweeddale £4.8 million. When will the Secretary of State stand up (David Mundell), last spoke about the issue to the for the children of Scotland? Under-Secretary of State for Defence, my right hon. Friend the Member for South Leicestershire (Mr Robathan) David Mundell: The Government are standing up for —who is responsible for defence personnel, welfare and the children of Scotland. That is why our priority is veterans—earlier this week. sorting out the mess that the Labour Government made of our economy. The hon. Gentleman would do well to Dr Whiteford: As recently as November last year, the heed the words of the former Secretary of State for Prime Minister said that Scotland, the right hon. Member for East Renfrewshire “there are no current plans to reduce the number of Ministry of (Mr Murphy): Defence police at the Faslane or Coulport naval bases.”—[Official “The truth is the Labour party would have to make cuts if we Report, 23 November 2011; Vol. 536, c. 295.] were in power.” Since then, however, the Government have confirmed plans to cut the MOD police budget by 50%. I am John Stevenson (Carlisle) (Con): We all accept that curious to know whether the Prime Minister’s assurances these are difficult economic times, but does the Minister hold water. May I ask the Secretary of State what agree that one of the most effective ways of helping the proportion of that cut will fall in Scotland, and whether lowest-paid families is raising the income tax threshold he believes that the threats to our national security have to £10,000 and beyond? diminished sufficiently in recent months to justify a 50% cut? David Mundell: I entirely agree. The measure has had a significant impact in Scotland, and more than 2 million Michael Moore: What the Prime Minister said stands. basic-rate taxpayers will benefit from it during the There are no current plans for the MOD to reduce the current Parliament. core police role relating to the security of our national institutions, such as nuclear safety at Coulport or Faslane. Anas Sarwar (Glasgow Central) (Lab): After another National security, including the security of our defence week that has been dominated by political debate and installations, is our highest priority. The reason we have headlines relating to Scotland’s constitution, we must so many MOD police in Scotland in the first place is not ignore a report by End Child Poverty showing that our huge defence imprint, which would be put at risk 50% of local authority areas in Scotland contain wards immediately if the country were to become independent. in which 30% of children are living in poverty, and that in some wards in my constituency the figure is 50%. Mr Alan Reid (Argyll and Bute) (LD): I am delighted What action is the Secretary of State taking, along with by what the Secretary of State says about the importance the Scottish Government, to ensure that every child in of security at Faslane and Coulport, and by his assurance Scotland is given the best start and opportunities in life? 161 Oral Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Oral Answers 162
David Mundell: The hon. Gentleman raises important Mr Speaker: Order. Let me just point out to the issues, such as the fact that many of the levers relating Minister that I do not have my own Scottish Government. to child poverty rest with the Scottish Government. As a result of the autumn statement, the Scottish Government Mr Philip Hollobone (Kettering) (Con): Does my received more than £500 million in additional revenue. I hon. Friend believe that were Scotland to become separate should have thought it would be better if they focused from the United Kingdom, and were it to be forced to on how to deploy that revenue to deal with such problems join the eurozone as a condition of re-entry into the as child poverty than to obsess about the constitution. European Union, that would hinder or help inward investment into Scotland? Inward Investment David Mundell: Uncertainty over Scotland’s position 3. Alun Cairns (Vale of Glamorgan) (Con): What in the EU, and uncertainty over which currency Scotland steps he is taking to promote Scotland as a destination would use if it were ever to become independent, would for international inward investment. [88253] certainly hinder inward investment into Scotland.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Scotland NEETs (David Mundell): My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State and I firmly believe that Scotland is the ideal destination for international inward investment, and we 4. Mr Brian H. Donohoe (Central Ayrshire) (Lab): have taken a range of actions to promote such investment. How many young people are not in employment, My right hon. Friend recently led the largest ever Scottish training or education in Scotland. [88255] trade delegation to Brazil to promote closer business links with a key emerging market for the Scottish economy. The Secretary of State for Scotland (Michael Moore): The annual population survey of 2010 estimates that Alun Cairns: Does my hon. Friend accept that, in an 36,000 18 to 19-year-olds in Scotland were not in education, ever more competitive world, uncertainty about employment or training between 2009 and 2010. independence has not helped the cause of Scotland or any other part of the United Kingdom that is seeking to Mr Donohoe: I thank the Secretary of State for that attract much-needed inward investment? response, but it does not really answer the question of what is happening between the ages of 16 and 18, which David Mundell: I entirely agree with my hon. Friend, is as important, if not more important. What is he which is why I believe it is better that a referendum on doing to encourage youngsters to enter industry and to Scottish independence be held sooner rather than later. enable them to take up apprenticeships as joiners, electricians and plumbers, because this Government have failed to Angus Robertson (Moray) (SNP): In contrast to the attract people into those industries? Does he agree that previous intervention, will the Minister acknowledge the idea, which I suggested to him at a meeting, of that international companies investing in Scotland since setting up schools-industry liaison committees is worth the re-election of the Scottish National party Scottish supporting? Government include INEOS, PetroChina, Dell, Gamesa, Amazon, Hewlett Packard and Mitsubishi Power Systems? Michael Moore: The hon. Gentleman rightly continues Does he acknowledge that and welcome the investment? to focus on this issue. We are all deeply concerned about youth unemployment. I have visited his constituency, David Mundell: I acknowledge that those companies and I have also had other meetings in Ayrshire and have invested in spite of the uncertainty. We should elsewhere, and it is right that we should join the Scottish consider the level of investment that Scotland could Government, employers and all the agencies to help achieve if there was not that uncertainty. young people—aged between 16 and 18 and of any age—to find work or support. The youth contract that Angus Robertson: That is the usual mantra that we we announced before Christmas will bring £1 billion of hear from the Government Benches. Will the Minister extra investment into supporting the young unemployed, respond to Scotland’s leading entrepreneur, Jim McColl, whether through wage incentives, additional work who said on this very subject that business is “not experience and opportunities or money to the Scottish concerned” about the Government. That money could also be used to create “independence referendum…What many of us in business are the school-industry liaison groups the hon. Gentleman convinced about is that a productive and prosperous future for wants. this country depends on securing real economic powers for the Parliament through constitutional change”? Jo Swinson (East Dunbartonshire) (LD): As the Secretary Will the UK Government drop their foolish conditions, of State says, youth unemployment is a huge concern so that we can secure that change in the autumn of for Members of all parties and for people across Scotland. 2014? The youth contract will help by providing 40,000 opportunities for young people in Scotland, but this David Mundell: I am sure the hon. Gentleman will problem will not be solved easily, so what will my right agree that Mr McColl is entitled to his opinion, as is any hon. Friend do to bring together people from the UK other citizen of Scotland. I am sure you will encourage Government, the jobcentres and the Scottish Government, them, as your own party’s Scottish Government already as well as business employers and education representatives, have, to contribute to our consultation on the independence to offer the opportunities that young people in Scotland referendum. need? 163 Oral Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Oral Answers 164
Michael Moore: Over many months now, I have been told that the company had gone into administration, bringing together exactly those groups in different parts without any consultation whatsoever. I am told that of Scotland—including Ayrshire, Falkirk and the borders. Scottish Enterprise and the trade unions were not even At the end of March, I, along with the Secretary of aware of this. The MSP was not aware of it, and the MP State for Work and Pensions and the Scottish Finance certainly was not. The company was taken over by a Secretary, will bring everybody together so we can focus venture capitalist more than two years ago, when it had as two Governments and as all the interested parties on a turnover of £100 million. It has now been run into the tackling this scourge that we must get rid of. ground and the executives have run away with the money. Will the Minister meet me to discuss what we Mr William Bain (Glasgow North East) (Lab): The can do to save as many of these 700 jobs as possible? problem with the Secretary of State’s complacent answers This is a disgraceful situation. is that he simply does not grasp the scale of the crisis of slumping demand, employment and confidence that David Mundell: Obviously, as a fellow South Lanarkshire grips Scotland’s economy due to the crushing austerity MP I am very disappointed to hear what the hon. being imposed by this Government. Does he not share Gentleman has to relate, and I should be very pleased to the real fears of young people that, with youth meet him to ensure that employment continues to be unemployment at over 21% and seven people chasing secured in south Lanarkshire. every vacancy in Scotland, there simply are not enough jobs to go around, and is it not time to change course by Work Capability Assessment boosting demand through a cut in VAT now, before this Government’s failing economic plan plunges Scotland into the misery of another downturn? 6. Tom Greatrex (Rutherglen and Hamilton West) (Lab/Co-op): What discussions he has had with the Michael Moore: I think it is wrong for the Labour Secretary of State for Work and Pensions on the work party to be complacent about its record on the economy, capability assessment in Scotland. [88257] which landed us in this mess in the first place. The shadow Defence Secretary, one of my predecessors as The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Scotland Scottish Secretary, said this week that Labour has to (David Mundell): My right hon. Friend the Secretary of face up to the realities of the economy and the deficit, State and I are in regular contact with Ministers from and the hon. Gentleman should do that, too. We want the Department for Work and Pensions on a range of to work with everybody so that we can reduce youth issues concerning welfare reform. We also recently met unemployment, and I invite him to look at the youth Professor Malcolm Harrington to discuss his second contract in more detail. review of the work capability assessment.
Poverty Tom Greatrex: I thank the Minister for that answer. I am sure he will be aware of a report published today by 5. Cathy Jamieson (Kilmarnock and Loudoun) (Lab/ Citizens Advice entitled “Right First Time?”, which Co-op): What assessment he has made of the effect of examines the high level of incorrect and inaccurate the autumn statement on levels of poverty in Scotland. decisions made in the work capability assessment. Given [88256] the amount of money that Atos Healthcare receives from the public purse for undertaking these assessments, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Scotland is it not now time for the Government to consider the (David Mundell): The Government took action at the report’s recommendation that financial penalties be autumn statement to build a stronger and more balanced imposed on Atos for a number of those incorrect economy. As a result, more than £500 million has been assessments? [Interruption.] added to the existing Scottish budget by the UK Government, which provides the Scottish Government David Mundell: This was one of the issues that the with additional resources in these uncertain times. Secretary of State and I discussed with Professor Harrington, and as he prepares his further report, this is Cathy Jamieson: I thank the Minister for that answer. inevitably one of the issues he will address. [Interruption.] Does he agree that one of the most important ways of tackling poverty is ensuring full employment? Does he therefore share my concern that Mahle Engine Systems Mr Speaker: Order. There are far too many noisy in my constituency seems set to remove jobs from an private conversations taking place in the Chamber. I area hit by high unemployment, taking those jobs out would like to hear Dame Anne Begg. of Scotland and out of the UK? Dame Anne Begg (Aberdeen South) (Lab): Now that David Mundell: I would be very disappointed if that the move from incapacity benefit to employment and were the case. I know that the hon. Lady is a doughty support allowance is well under way, anecdotally, it campaigner for employment in her constituency. We would appear that Atos is finding it very difficult to must continue to stress the benefits of employers remaining carry out the necessary work capability assessments, so in Scotland, which is why the current constitutional there could be extra delays. Will the Minister please uncertainty is so damaging. engage with his fellow Ministers in the DWP to make sure that Atos can deliver on the contract? Mr Jim Hood (Lanark and Hamilton East) (Lab): On Monday, when 700 of my constituents employed by David Mundell: I can certainly assure the hon. Lady WJ Harte Construction returned to work, they were that I will pass on her concerns to the Department. 165 Oral Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Oral Answers 166
Independence Referendum Mark Menzies: Has my right hon. Friend had any conversations to establish what impact an independent Scotland would have on our relationship with the European 7. Iain Stewart (Milton Keynes South) (Con): What Union and the euro? representations he has received from the Scottish Government on the holding of a referendum in Scotland Michael Moore: My hon. Friend is focusing on some on independence from the UK. [88258] of the central issues that we need to be able to get on to debate in the decision about whether Scotland should 8. Fiona Bruce (Congleton) (Con): What representations go its own way or continue to be part of the most he has received from the Scottish Government on the successful multi-nation state in the history of the world, holding of a referendum in Scotland on independence as I think it is vital it does. So let us get on and devolve from the UK. [88259] the power to make it a legal referendum. Let us have a fair referendum and let us make sure it is decisive. 10. Mark Menzies (Fylde) (Con): What representations he has received from the Scottish Government on the Lindsay Roy: The Select Committee on Scottish Affairs holding of a referendum in Scotland on independence has already embarked on an inquiry to identify those from the UK. [88261] issues, such as defence, which need to be resolved before a referendum is held. Does the Secretary of State plan to contribute to that debate with the Select Committee? 11. Lindsay Roy (Glenrothes) (Lab): What recent discussions he has had with the First Minister for Scotland on the referendum proposed by the Scottish Michael Moore: I certainly do. What is really important Government on Scotland’s independence from the UK. is not just our debate now about the future of Scotland, but ensuring that everybody in the country gets the [88262] opportunity to participate in the consultation on the shape of the referendum, and I hope that people will The Secretary of State for Scotland (Michael Moore): respond to that. I hope that everybody across the country— Yesterday, I made a statement announcing a consultation not just politicians—will get involved in debating defence, to seek views on how any referendum can be made welfare and the state of our economy, all of which, I legal, fair and decisive. I discussed this yesterday with believe, are much safer within the United Kingdom. the First Minister, and I hope to have further discussions [Interruption.] with the Scottish Government, along with other politicians and people from across Scottish civic society, during the Mr Speaker: Order. We are discussing extremely consultation. important matters and we should do so in an atmosphere of mutual respect. Iain Stewart: The House of Commons Library has given me strong evidence to show that the economies of Pete Wishart (Perth and North Perthshire) (SNP): Quebec and Canada as a whole suffered in the 1990s We now know that there will be an independence due to constitutional uncertainty. For the sake of jobs referendum in the autumn of 1914—[Laughter.] That, in Scotland and England, does my right hon. Friend of course, was the year that the great war started. There agree that the last thing we need is a prolonged period will be an independence referendum in 2014, designed of constitutional uncertainty, and that the First Minister and decided by the people of Scotland. If the Secretary should stop playing politics and get on with it? of State is so concerned about the legal powers for the referendum, why does he not just devolve the powers, Michael Moore: My hon. Friend is correct to point to through section 30, without condition? I see that the that independent analysis and the experience of Quebec Prime Minister has walked into this debate. I really and the rest of Canada. It is vital that the economic hope that the Secretary of State can encourage the uncertainty we now face because of the referendum is Prime Minister to come to Scotland as much as possible resolved, which is why we have brought forward proposals in the next two weeks, because the Prime Minister is the to make the referendum legal, fair and decisive. I want it best recruiting sergeant for a “yes” to independence to happen as soon as possible. vote that we have. Michael Moore: My right hon. Friend the Prime Fiona Bruce: Can my right hon. Friend confirm that Minister will be a full participant in the debate, as will if the UK Government do not facilitate an independence all people across the United Kingdom. For us, it is referendum, one cannot take place? important that we have a referendum that is made in Scotland for the people of Scotland about our future in Michael Moore: The central issue arising from the Scotland. The First Minister and now the hon. Gentleman consultation that I launched yesterday is that, as things —who gave a slightly different date—have put forward stand, the Scottish Parliament does not have the legal their preference for when that referendum should be, power to hold a referendum, regardless of how that is but before we can get anywhere near it we must ensure described, and we need to provide that power by working that it is legal. I hope that the Scottish Government will with it. I am committed to working with the Scottish work with us to ensure that that is the case. Government, and with people from across the country, so that we can get the power devolved to Scotland, the Margaret Curran (Glasgow East) (Lab): Does the Scottish Government can then develop the question Secretary of State recognise that following this week’s and we can get on with the referendum, which will be important developments, the referendum campaign on made in Scotland, for the people of Scotland. Scotland’s future is now effectively under way and it is 167 Oral Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Oral Answers 168 time to get on to the substance of the issue? What is Mr Speaker: Order. I apologise for interrupting more, given that the Scottish Government have said the Secretary of State, but we are discussing youth that they have been involved for some time in considering unemployment in Scotland, a very important matter, the details of the prospects for Scotland, will the Secretary and I want to hear his answer. of State tell the House whether any UK Government officials have been involved in any discussions on the Michael Moore: The Government have committed future of the Scottish economy and, in particular, on £1 billion over the next three years to implement the whether a separate Scotland will keep the pound, join youth contract. Our package of support includes wage the euro or have a separate currency? incentives for employers to recruit 18 to 24-year-olds from the Work programme and increased work experience Michael Moore: The hon. Lady is right to focus on opportunities for that age group. Other support is also those key issues about the future of Scotland. I believe available. that Scotland is best served by continuing to be part of the United Kingdom, where our economy is stronger Katy Clark: I thank the Secretary of State for that and our defence more secure, where we have much answer. He is well aware of the rising levels of youth greater clout internationally and where our welfare unemployment in North Ayrshire and I know that he system will be more generous and better. I hope that the has received strong representations about it from all Scottish Government will publish their plans about the Ayrshire MPs. What more does he think that this what they think should happen in an independent Scotland Government can do at Westminster to increase public and in the meantime, as the hon. Lady says, let the and private investment in North Ayrshire? debate commence. Michael Moore: I acknowledge the work that the Margaret Curran: I thank the Secretary of State for hon. Lady has done and the fact that we recently met to that answer. Does he agree that one of Britain’s greatest discuss this very serious issue. It is important that the achievements was the creation of the welfare state? youth contract, which my right hon. Friend the Deputy Have any discussions taken place about the implications Prime Minister visited Scotland to discuss on Friday, is of separation for welfare spend in Scotland, particularly taken advantage of by people across the country. I look as recent figures reveal that it was three times greater forward to coming to the hon. Lady’s constituency in than oil revenues in 2010? the near future to meet those very people so that we can discuss how to implement it most effectively. Michael Moore: The hon. Lady makes an important point about the contrast between the level of spending Public Subsidies to support some of the most vulnerable in our society in Scotland and, indeed, the rest of the country and the volatility of oil revenues. I believe that we can have a 12. John Mann (Bassetlaw) (Lab): What comparative more secure and generous welfare system by sharing the assessment he has made of the level of subsidy from risks and resources across the whole of the United the public purse for postal, transport and health Kingdom, which has helped Scotland through difficult services in Scotland and the north of England. [88263] times in the past and at present. The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Scotland Gordon Henderson (Sittingbourne and Sheppey) (Con): (David Mundell): Health and large aspects of transport Does my right hon. Friend agree that all Scots should are devolved areas, and it is for the Parliament in be entitled to vote in any referendum on independence, Scotland to decide how to allocate its budget. The whether or not they live in Scotland, including my dad, Government have provided an annual subsidy to Post who is a proud Scotsman who happens to live in England Office Ltd of £150 million for the last financial year and and thinks of himself first and foremost as British? £180 million for this financial year. The subsidy is not distributed by country or region.
Michael Moore: I pay tribute to my hon. Friend’s John Mann: Does the Minister think it would help dad’s sense of patriotism and I am sure that he, like the forthcoming debate if all the figures were made many other Scots around the country and around the public so that my constituents and others can fully world, will wish to contribute to our consultation. Like participate? me, they will want to see this referendum on the most historic decision we will ever take in Scotland carried out legally and fairly, on a straightforward and decisive David Mundell: I absolutely agree that the debate on basis. Let us get that sorted and let us get on with the the independence of Scotland should be based on facts debate. and on the issues. That is why we need to move on from the process and get on with the referendum. Youth Unemployment Andrew Percy (Brigg and Goole) (Con): The question of the referendum on Scotland is not a matter just for 9. Katy Clark (North Ayrshire and Arran) (Lab): the Scottish Government or for the Scottish people. What steps he has taken to address youth unemployment How and when will my constituents in England be in Scotland. [88260] consulted on this important matter?
The Secretary of State for Scotland (Michael Moore) Mr Speaker: I remind the Minister that the question rose— is with reference to postal, transport and health services. 169 Oral Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Oral Answers 170
David Mundell: My hon. Friend’s constituents have courage and bravery. They have made sacrifices on our the opportunity to be represented on these issues through behalf, and our deepest condolences go to their families him in this House. and friends. In the autumn statement the Chancellor said that train fares would rise by only 1% above inflation. Can the Prime Minister therefore explain why rail companies PRIME MINISTER this month on some of the busiest commuter routes have increased their fares by up to 11%?
The Prime Minister was asked— The Prime Minister: The power to do that was given Engagements to them by the last Labour Government. Edward Miliband: No, Mr Speaker, the Prime Minister Q1. [88196] Mr Graham Stuart (Beverley and Holderness) is wrong. The last Labour Government stopped them (Con): If he will list his official engagements for doing that, and this Prime Minister, when he came to Wednesday 11 January. office, reversed that policy, which we introduced. That is why the companies are able to rig the fares. That is why The Prime Minister (Mr David Cameron): I am sure someone travelling from Northampton to London will that the whole House will wish to join me in paying see a rise on the season ticket of more than £300. Will tribute to the servicemen who have fallen in the service he now stand up to the train companies, get a better of our country since we last met for Prime Minister’s deal for commuters and change his policy? Question Time—Captain Tom Jennings from the Royal Marines, Squadron Leader Anthony Downing from the The Prime Minister: I know that the right hon. Royal Air Force, Private John King from 1st Battalion Gentleman has had a difficult start to the year, but I am the Yorkshire Regiment, and Rifleman Sachin Limbu afraid he has made it worse by getting the facts wrong. from 1st Battalion the Royal Gurkha Rifles, who died Labour, in 2009, allowed fare increases of up to 11%, after a long period in hospital where he was much loved because they introduced the idea of flexibility of 5% over by the staff who looked after him in Birmingham. Their and above the RPI plus 1% that was the case. What was outstanding courage and selflessness will never be forgotten. the case in 2009 is the case today, but the key issue is They have given their lives serving our country and this: there are only two places that money for railways making our world more secure, and our thoughts should can come from. It can come from the taxpayer or it can be with their families and friends. come from the traveller. What really matters is whether This morning I had meetings with ministerial colleagues we are going to put money into rail investment, and this and others, and in addition to my duties in this House I Government are putting that money in. We are building shall have further such meetings later today. Crossrail, we are electrifying the Great Western main line, we are electrifying the line between Manchester Mr Stuart: The whole House will wish to associate and Liverpool, we are putting £308 billion into Crossrail, itself with the Prime Minister’s tribute to the fallen. and of course, as my right hon. Friend the Secretary of May I ask the Prime Minister to join me in congratulating State for Transport announced yesterday, we are building Cranswick Country Foods on its £15 million investment High Speed 2 as well. creating a state-of-the-art facility in my constituency, which is licensed for exporting to the US Department of Edward Miliband: I am afraid the Prime Minister is Agriculture, exports throughout the EU and employs just wrong about the facts. The Labour Government more than 1,200 people? Unfortunately, the Food Standards saw that train companies were taking advantage of Agency is blocking exports from that excellent plant to consumers, ripping them off by increasing fares more the far east. Can my right hon. Friend assure me that on the busiest routes, and we stopped it. We took that job-destroying and unnecessary regulation will not be power away from them. He came to office and brought tolerated by his Government? the power back. He made the wrong decision. And as for his idea that this is all to help the passenger, only last The Prime Minister: I certainly join my hon. Friend month the National Audit Office warned that the problem in congratulating the company in his constituency on its was that the money would probably result in increased expansion and on the welcome new jobs it is bringing. It train operating company profits. I ask the Prime Minister is vital that we rebalance our economy, with greater again: will he now go back and reverse his policy? emphasis on business investment and on exports. Exports to China went up by 20% last year. I shall certainly do The Prime Minister: We originally set out an RPI everything I can to help to resolve the situation, and I plus 3% policy for train fares. We found money in the shall be happy to ask a Minister from the Department autumn statement to reduce that to RPI plus 1%, but if for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs to meet my the right hon. Gentleman wants to see more money hon. Friend to discuss this issue. go into our railways—presumably he supports the electrification of the Great Western main line and Edward Miliband (Doncaster North) (Lab): May I the railway lines in the north-west—he will be touring join the Prime Minister in paying tribute to Captain the country telling us that he supports these things, but Tom Jennings from the Royal Marines, Squadron Leader he is never prepared to take difficult decisions in order Anthony Downing from the Royal Air Force, Private to support them. It is time—[Interruption.] John King from 1st Battalion the Yorkshire Regiment, and Rifleman Sachin Limbu from 1st Battalion the Mr Speaker: Order. The answers from the Prime Royal Gurkha Rifles? All of them showed enormous Minister will be heard. 171 Oral Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Oral Answers 172
The Prime Minister: It is time for the Leader of the Q2. [88198] Luciana Berger (Liverpool, Wavertree) Opposition to listen to his shadow Defence Secretary, (Lab/Co-op): Over 80,000 pensioners in Liverpool will who wrote very candidly over Christmas: lose up to £100 this winter following the Government’s “There is a difference between populism and popularity”— cut in winter fuel allowance. Will the Prime Minister adopt Labour’s policy of ensuring that energy and that difference is called credibility. Time to have companies automatically put elderly customers on the some, I think. cheapest tariff for gas and electricity?
Edward Miliband: Instead of his pre-prepared lines, The Prime Minister: I am afraid that, as with the hon. the right hon. Gentleman should get his facts right Lady’s party leader, there seems to have been an outbreak about his own policy. He is just wrong. He says that he of collective amnesia on the Labour Benches, because is continuing the policy of the Labour Government, we have kept the previous Government’s policy on the and he is simply wrong on the facts. The Labour winter fuel allowance and are meeting in full all the Government saw what the train companies were doing promises that she and her party made on the winter fuel and said that we would put an end to it. The Prime allowance. We have gone one further, because they Minister said at the weekend that he wanted to take introduced higher cold weather payments only for election action against crony capitalism. He has failed at the year, but we have made them permanent. first hurdle. I ask him for the last time: will he now reverse the policy? Sarah Newton (Truro and Falmouth) (Con): The Prime Minister will have experienced at first hand the quality The Prime Minister: We are now on to the issue of of nursing at Treliske. What steps are the Government higher pay. On the issue of the rail fares, let me be taking to ensure that patients across the country receive absolutely clear. Labour introduced the policy of 5% the highest possible standards of nursing care from the flexibility. They changed it for one year only—for an NHS? election year—but with no intention of making that permanent. If the right hon. Gentleman does not know The Prime Minister: My hon. Friend is entirely right. that, he should. [Interruption.] If he wants to get on to I well remember—indeed, I will never forget—the time I the issue of executive pay, he is entirely right to raise it. spent at the Royal Cornwall hospital and the happy Unlike a Government who did nothing—[Interruption.] days I had there, and it was a great privilege to go back again last year. We have very high standards of nursing Mr Speaker: Order. I want to hear the answer, and care in our country and the overwhelming majority of however long it takes—[Interruption.] Order. However nurses do a fantastic job, but I do not think that we long it takes, I will. would be serving our constituents properly if we did not highlight those few cases where it goes wrong, and we have seen in the Care Quality Commission reports that The Prime Minister: Thank you, Mr Speaker. The there are areas where it has gone wrong. I think that it is Leader of the Opposition is right to raise the issue of incumbent on the Government to try to remove the executive pay—and unlike the previous Government, bureaucracy that can get in nurses’ way, but it is also who did nothing for 13 years, this Government will act. important for us to highlight best practice in the best hospitals in our country—I visited an excellent hospital Sir Roger Gale (North Thanet) (Con): I understand in Salford last week—and say, “Let’s copy that right that my right hon. Friend recommended me for one new across the country,” so that we have high standards of present, and I am about to ask him for another. The care and look after the nutritional needs, indeed all the Leader of the Opposition is talking drivel, I am afraid. needs, of vulnerable people in our hospitals. My constituents on the Kent coast line had been paying up to 10% increases under the previous Government for Edward Miliband: I want to ask the Prime Minister the last four years, until they lost office. I congratulate about Scotland. We on this side of the House believe this Government on their courageous decision to pursue that the United Kingdom benefits the people of Scotland High Speed 2. May I ask my right hon. Friend to turn and the people of the rest of the United Kingdom in his attention now to a piece of unfinished business left equal measure. We are stronger together and weaker by the previous Government? High Speed at present apart. Does he agree that we must make the case for the runs, in effect, only from St. Pancras to Ashford. Could Union—not simply a case against separatism, but the he see it driven through to Thanet, so that we can enjoy positive case about the shared benefits to us all of the sort of benefits that in the future will be enjoyed by Scotland’s part in the United Kingdom: the shared Birmingham? economic interests, the shared institutions such as the NHS, the defence forces and the BBC, and above all the The Prime Minister: First, I congratulate my hon. shared values we hold together? Friend on his well-deserved honour for his many years of service to his constituents. He is entirely right about The Prime Minister: I am happy to say that this is an what happened under the previous Government, when area where the right hon. Gentleman and I will be in regulated fares went up by over 18% and unregulated 100% agreement. I passionately believe in the future of fares went up by over 23%. I will certainly look into our United Kingdom, and passionately believe that we what he says about High Speed 1, but I think that it is are stronger together than we would be by breaking an advertisement for what we can get by linking up our apart. Frankly, I am sad that we are even having this country with high-speed rail, shortening commuter distances debate, because I support the United Kingdom so strongly, and helping to change the economic geography of our but we have to respect the fact that Scotland voted for a country so that we can build a stronger economy. separatist party in the Scottish parliamentary elections, 173 Oral Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Oral Answers 174 so the first thing that it is right to do is make clear the Q3. [88199] Lilian Greenwood (Nottingham South) legal position about a referendum, which is what my (Lab): Nottinghamshire police serve areas of deep right hon. Friend the Scottish Secretary has been doing. deprivation, face some of the highest crime levels in the We have made the offer to devolve the power to hold country and, rightly, have ambitious crime reduction that referendum so that it can be made in Scotland and targets, but Her Majesty’s inspectorate of constabulary held in Scotland. Frankly, I look forward to having the says that Nottinghamshire is one of five forces facing debate, because I think that too many in the Scottish the most significant challenge to protect their front National party have been happy to talk about the lines, and senior officers tell me that Government cuts process but, do not want to talk about the substance. I will impact on front-line policing. Is it not time to sometimes feel when I listen to them that it is not a implement the police funding formula in order to give referendum they want, but a “neverendum”. Let us my local police the resources that they need? have the debate, and let us keep our country together. The Prime Minister: I shall look carefully at what the Edward Miliband: May I agree with the Prime Minister? hon. Lady says, but all police forces are having to make This is not a fight about process between the Westminster efficiencies, and I praise chief constables for the steps Government and the Scottish Government, or between that they have taken to deliver those efficiencies without the British Prime Minister and the Scottish First Minister. affecting front-line policing, while at the same time still The way to tackle this issue is to have immediate cross-party delivering a reduction in crime levels. talks in Scotland about the timing of the referendum, In Nottinghamshire police there are still 47 officers the nature of the single-question referendum and the working in back-office jobs, there are still trained police vital involvement of the Electoral Commission. Does officers working in human resources, finance and corporate the Prime Minister also agree with me that we need as development, and there is still further work to be done soon as possible, as he said, to get beyond process and to civilianise those parts of the police force and make have that discussion about the substantive issues? This sure we get all our police officers out on the front line. is a momentous decision that our children and grandchildren will have to live with if we get it wrong, Q4. [88200] Andrew Stephenson (Pendle) (Con): Following so we need a serious, thoughtful and inclusive debate the murder of my constituent Jane Clough by her about the choices and the benefits to Scotland of staying former partner, a rapist, Jonathan Vass, I presented the in the United Kingdom. On this important issue, the Bail (Amendment) Bill to the House, and in October people of our country deserve nothing less than that the Ministry of Justice team agreed to change the law. serious debate about the benefits of the United Kingdom. Can the Prime Minister confirm to the House, and to The Prime Minister: The right hon. Gentleman is Jane’s parents, who are in the Public Gallery today, right on those three points. On the process of negotiation, when that will happen? which is very important now, particularly given that the SNP has come out and made more clear what it wants The Prime Minister: First, on behalf of the House, to do, I am very happy for the UK Government and the may I pay tribute to my hon. Friend for his work on the Westminster Parliament to speak directly to the Scottish issue and, indeed, on that case? Our sympathies go out Government and the Scottish Parliament, and let us to the family, who have suffered so appallingly. I accept, come to a conclusion about the best time and the best and the Government accept in principle, that there way to hold the referendum. But it must be clear, it must should be a right of appeal against Crown court decisions be legal, it must be decisive and it must be fair. Those allowing bail. There is of course that right in magistrates are the absolute keys. I absolutely agree with the right court cases, so there is a strong case for changing the hon. Gentleman: as soon as those process questions are law, and we will table an amendment in the Lords to the settled, we need to get on to the substance. [Interruption.] Legal Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of Offenders The only point I would make about the timing— Bill, creating a right of appeal to a High Court judge [Interruption.] As SNP Members, who cannot seem to against the granting of bail by a Crown court. I hope keep quiet, are so keen to leave the United Kingdom, I that that will improve the law, be more helpful to do not quite understand why they want to put off victims and give some satisfaction to the family whom putting the question for so long. my hon. Friend is representing so well. Mrs Helen Grant (Maidstone and The Weald) (Con): Angus Robertson (Moray) (SNP): The Scottish What action will the Prime Minister take to tackle the Government were elected with an overwhelming mandate appalling issue of forced marriage both in the UK and to deliver an independence referendum in the second globally? half of this parliamentary term—[Interruption.] They were. It is a fact. In contrast, the Conservative party has The Prime Minister: My hon. Friend is absolutely fewer Members of Parliament in Scotland than there right to raise that issue. We have taken some steps, as are giant pandas in Edinburgh zoo. Why is the Prime the previous Government did, to try to crack down on Minister trying to emulate Margaret Thatcher by dictating the practice of forced marriage, which, tragically, does to Scotland? take place in too many communities and too many places in our country. We are looking specifically at The Prime Minister: Quite the opposite: we want to whether we should take further legal powers and make give Scotland the power to hold a legal referendum. it a criminal offence, and I am taking a personal interest Right across this House there is a uniform belief that in the issue, as I think we should be taking every that needs to happen. Discussions can now be entered available step to say that it is simply unacceptable, in into about the timing of the referendum and its precise 2012 in a civilised country such as ours, to have such a nature, so that we can ensure that it is fair and decisive. barbaric practice. The people of Scotland deserve nothing less. 175 Oral Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Oral Answers 176
Q5. [88201] Greg Mulholland (Leeds North West) (LD): The Prime Minister: The position is very straightforward. Care of our older people is one of the most pressing We did not sign the treaty because we did not get the issues facing this country today. Will the Prime safeguards that we wanted to receive. That situation is Minister join me in welcoming Age UK’s Care in Crisis not going to change. What coalition partners want to campaign, which was launched on Monday? Will he put in their manifestos at the next election is entirely up commit to ensuring that the White Paper due in the to them. spring will present a way forward on this vital issue? Q9. [88205] Andrew Jones (Harrogate and Knaresborough) The Prime Minister: I pay tribute to my hon. Friend (Con): Does the Prime Minister agree that people should for his work on this issue, and to the Age Concern pay their taxes, keep their businesses onshore and not campaign. We have a huge challenge to rise to this live as tax exiles in Switzerland, leaving pensioners high agenda and we want to do so through the White Paper. and dry? What is he doing to stamp out such predatory There are three elements: we must do something about business practices? the rising costs of domiciliary care, improve the quality of the care that people receive, and address the issue of The Prime Minister: My hon. Friend makes an interesting people having to sell their homes and all their assets to point. For all the lectures about predatory capitalism pay for care. We are looking hard at all those issues and taxing different businesses in different ways, the to work out a way forward that is right for our system, one person the Leader of the Opposition has chosen to and that the country can afford. advise him on this issue has based all his companies in the British Virgin Islands. Q6. [88202] Mr Michael Meacher (Oldham West and Royton) (Lab): The Sunday Times showed that in the past two years the 1,000 richest persons in Britain got Q10. [88206] Valerie Vaz (Walsall South) (Lab): The richer by £137 billion—enough to pay off the entire funding for the United Kingdom Resource Centre for deficit. Will the Prime Minister therefore tax them to women in science, engineering and technology has been fund the creation of 1 million jobs, which would be a cut. Given that 1 million women are unemployed and far better way of cutting the deficit than prolonged that women make up only 12.3% of people in science, austerity? engineering and technology, will the Prime Minister look again at funding for the UKRC, and at thereby The Prime Minister: For a minute, I thought that the restoring Britain’s leading role in science, which nurtured right hon. Gentleman was talking about the Prime the talents of Dorothy Hodgkin and Rosalind Franklin? Minister he served under. It is essential that as we reduce the deficit and take difficult decisions we are fair, The Prime Minister: I will certainly look at the case and are seen to be fair. What we have done so far has that the hon. Lady sets out. As she knows, despite seen the top 10% of the country paying 10 times more having to make difficult decisions across a range of than the bottom 10%. Crucially, the top 10% in terms of public spending areas we did not cut the science budget. earnings are paying more not only in cash terms, but as Indeed, in the autumn statement the Chancellor provided a percentage of their income. As we go ahead with this a series of enhancements for specific science-based projects. agenda, I want to ensure that people behave responsibly, I will look at the specific one that the hon. Lady and that the Government do too. mentions and get back to her.
Q7. [88203] Dr Thérèse Coffey (Suffolk Coastal) (Con): Mike Crockart (Edinburgh West) (LD): Today, I am sure that you, Mr Speaker, and the Prime Minister unfortunately, is the 10th anniversary of the opening of will want to congratulate Mr Tony Whatling, who has Guantanamo Bay, a despicable institution that to this served as postmaster in Westhall for more than 60 years day still holds one UK national. Will the Prime Minister and has still not retired. However, residents in Wangford commit to do all he can to see that 2012 is the last year and Walberswick are being let down because there is no in which that institution operates? post office outreach provision. Will the Prime Minister encourage the Post Office to use its generous subsidy to ensure that rural villages are served, not left stranded? The Prime Minister: My right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary is working very hard with the United States to The Prime Minister: I certainly join my hon. Friend try to secure the issue and bring this chapter to a close. in paying tribute to Mr Whatling. To run a village store As the hon. Gentleman will know, we have also taken and post office for 60 years is a huge achievement. It is steps as a Government and as a country to try to achieve people like him who keep our country going. The some closure to what happened in the past, through a Government have committed £1.3 billion to improve settlement with the people who were in Guantanamo the network. As a condition of that funding, the Post Bay and through setting up a proper inquiry to ensure Office must maintain at least 11,500 branches, but the that the British Government were not complicit in any point that my hon. Friend makes about mobile post way in the torture of people in Guantanamo Bay or offices is a good one. That is a way to serve many elsewhere. communities and to ensure that elderly and vulnerable people in particular get the services that they need. Q11. [88207] Gregg McClymont (Cumbernauld, Kilsyth and Kirkintilloch East) (Lab): A moment ago, the Prime Q8. [88204] David Simpson (Upper Bann) (DUP): The Minister was clear that it is crucial that Government Deputy Prime Minister is reported to have said in the economic policy be fair and be seen to be fair. Can he past few days that in due course the UK will sign up to therefore confirm that the 50% tax rate on incomes the EU treaty that the Prime Minister rejected a short above £150,000 will remain in place for the duration of time ago. Was the Deputy Prime Minister correct? this Parliament? 177 Oral Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Oral Answers 178
The Prime Minister: We take pretty much the same Q13. [88209] Tony Cunningham (Workington) (Lab): The point of view as the former shadow Chancellor who, Cumbrian health economy is in crisis—real crisis. How when he introduced that rate, said that it should be a does the Prime Minister propose to deal with it? temporary measure. I think we should also make a judgment about how much money the tax is actually The Prime Minister: The first and most important raising. The purpose of the tax system is to raise money thing is that we are committed to year on year increases for the funds that we need to put into our public in NHS spending. I am afraid that that position is not services, and it is very important that we look at how it backed by the hon. Gentleman’s party. Alongside the works in practice. extra money, we also need to make sure that there is reform so that we give clinicians a leading role in the Heather Wheeler (South Derbyshire) (Con): Will the health service. We also have to do more on the public Prime Minister congratulate the Secretary of State for health and health promotion agenda, because that is the Transport and the good workers of Bombardier on best way to reduce demands on our NHS. There is also securing a £188 million contract on 28 December, and one extra thing that we need to try to achieve: looking on the announcement on the Toronto stock exchange, at the links between alcohol and crime, and alcohol and which was so important to the workers in Derbyshire? hospital admissions, which put massive pressure on our NHS. That is an issue that I want this Government to The Prime Minister: I congratulate everyone at deal with. Bombardier on winning that contract. As I have said before from the Dispatch Box, I want the Government Sir Bob Russell (Colchester) (LD): Ethnic cleansing to be a good customer of British firms and work with and apartheid are evil. Sadly, successive Governments their supply chain, and not to make the mistakes that have supported a country where those vile actions are the last Government made. They drew up the contract inflicted on indigenous people. We welcomed the Arab for the railway service that Bombardier did not win. spring, but the long Arab winter continues for Palestinians. Last Tuesday the Israeli Government said that they would proceed with the forced eviction of 30,000 Bedouin Q12. [88208] Tony Lloyd (Manchester Central) (Lab): Arabs from their historic lands. Is it not time we treated The Prime Minister will probably be aware that a chief Israel as we did apartheid South Africa? executive of a stock exchange top 100 company is paid 35 times as much as a hospital consultant who keeps The Prime Minister: What I would say to my hon. people healthy and saves lives. If the Prime Minister is Friend is that first, we should respect the fact that Israel going to act tough on high pay, and if he really does get is a democracy. It is a country that has a right to exist it, will he give a date—a year from now, or within the and that has frequently been threatened by its lifetime of this Parliament—when we will see that neighbours—but also, we are a country that should obscene 35 times multiple come tumbling down? stand up for clear human rights and clear rights and wrongs in international relations. This Government have The Prime Minister: I do think that we should make been very clear that we do not agree with the Israeli progress on the issue of pay ratios, and we can start Government’s practice on settlements. I raised the issue with the Government setting out their own pay ratios as myself with the Israeli Prime Minister in a new year an act of leadership. I think this Government have telephone call, and this Government will continue to shown some leadership, not least by cutting and freezing act and vote on illegal settlements. Ministers’ pay and having total transparency on pay across Government. On the specific case that the hon. Q14. [88210] Liz Kendall (Leicester West) (Lab): Bethany Gentleman raises, this year we have seen a 49% increase Mickleburgh, a 14-year-old girl in my constituency, has in pay yet only a 4% increase in the FTSE. I am not leukaemia and desperately needs a bone marrow transplant. against people running great companies being paid lots Despite an incredible campaign by her family to get of money if they are growing and expanding them and more people to join the blood stem cell register, Bethany succeeding, but we should not have rewards for failure. still does not have a match and is having to look Frankly, the last Government had 13 years to deal with overseas. What plans do the Government have to improve this, and did sweet nothing. public awareness of that vital issue and increase the number of potential bone marrow donors in the UK? Nick Boles (Grantham and Stamford) (Con): Does the Prime Minister think that it can ever be fair for a The Prime Minister: The hon. Lady is right to speak single family to receive £100,000 a year in housing up for Bethany specifically, but also for all bone marrow benefit alone? cancer sufferers. The need to get more people on to the register, because of the importance of trying to get a The Prime Minister: My hon. Friend makes an important match, is not widely enough understood. The Government point. The issue of top people’s pay and this issue are, in will spend about £4 million this year to help promote many ways, linked. We need to get rid of a something- that and make it happen. However, all of us, in our for-nothing culture in this country. We inherited an constituencies and in our own ways, can promote the out-of-control benefit system in which there were families idea and encourage people to do as the hon. Lady says. on many tens of thousands of pounds of housing benefit. We had an out-of-control immigration system Mr Julian Brazier (Canterbury) (Con): May I draw in which it paid to cheat, and we also had an out-of-control my right hon. Friend’s attention to the excellent paper banking system in which reward was not linked to that ResPublica published this morning, which seeks to success. Unlike the last Government, we are going to build on the Government’s initiatives both to build up deal with all those things. cadet forces and to get more former military personnel 179 Oral Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Oral Answers 180 into schools as teachers? It proposes that we set up in the Prime Minister think is most likely: that her landlord some of most deprived communities military academies will reduce the rent by 50% or that she will be made and free schools administered by the reserve forces and homeless? cadets associations. The Prime Minister: I congratulate the right hon. The Prime Minister: I pay tribute to my hon. Friend, Lady on her preferment in the new year’s honours list. who does so much to speak up for our reserve forces Although I profoundly disagree with many of the things and our cadet forces, which are incredibly valuable that she has tried to do over her political career—mostly assets to our country. It is worth noting that this year to disarm Britain one-sidedly—I praise her for her the cadet forces will do a huge amount to try to save and persistent efforts. No one can accuse—[Interruption.] I preserve our war memorials from the appalling crime of am sorry; let me answer the question very directly. As I metal theft that they have been suffering. I will look understand it, all parties are committed to reform housing very carefully at the ResPublica report that my hon. benefit. That was Labour’s commitment before the election. Friend mentions. We should empower our cadet forces The housing benefit bill is completely out of control. to expand and perhaps to go into parts of the country Labour’s own welfare spokesman said last week that, at where they have not always been present. The link that £20 billion, it was unacceptable and had to change. my hon. Friend makes between them and schools is a What we have seen so far, as housing benefit has been very good idea, which we should promote and support. reformed and reduced, is that rent levels have come down, so we have stopped ripping off the taxpayer. Dame Joan Ruddock (Lewisham, Deptford) (Lab): My constituent Miss S, who is 32, has lived alone for Mr Speaker: We now come to a statement by the eight years and was forced on to housing benefit because Secretary of State for Health. Will Members who are of redundancy. That benefit has just been cut by nearly leaving the Chamber do so quickly and quietly so that 50%, to the shared accommodation rate. Which does we may hear this very important statement? 181 11 JANUARY 2012 Breast Implants 182
Breast Implants to PIP implants than other implants, or that they result in increased long-term health risks. Therefore, they have not recommended routine removal of the implants. 12.35 pm Fourthly, there are risks inherent in the removal of The Secretary of State for Health (Mr Andrew Lansley): breast implants, just as with any surgery, and these risks With permission, Mr Speaker, I would like to make a should be taken into account when taking any clinical statement about PIP breast implants. The House will be decisions. However, for this particular group of women aware that approximately 40,000 women in this country the risk is very low. Fifthly, the expert group recognises, have had implants manufactured by the French company as we have throughout, that women with PIP implants Poly Implant Prothese, and that these implants could will be understandably concerned that they did not have have been made of a non-medical grade silicone gel. My the character of implant that they thought they did. concern throughout has been for the safety and well-being The expert group advises, as we have, that we should of all these women. I wish now to update the House on give every woman an opportunity to secure advice, what happened; how we are looking after the women investigation and remedy. concerned; and the further actions required. The women who received the implants did so on the In 1997, PIP received a European CE mark for its understanding that the implants met the requirements silicone breast implants. The CE mark was overseen by of the CE mark and were safe. That was not the case, the German notified body, TUV Rheinland. The Medicines and every provider has a responsibility to put things and Healthcare products Regulatory Agency adverse right. Although the majority of women will have received incident centre received a number of reports annually their implants privately, some—such as those who have about PIP implants. Based on such reports, in 2008, the had reconstructive surgery following mastectomy—will MHRA raised its concerns with the German regulatory have received PIP implants through the NHS. All those authorities and the manufacturer. The MHRA was patients will receive the highest possible standard of reassured by the notified body that the number of care. First, they will be contacted to inform them and adverse reports was adequately explained by changes in give them all the relevant information and advice. Women the company’s reporting practices and by the increasing who wish to will be able to speak to their GP or the number of implants sold. surgical team that carried out the original implant to However, in March 2010, the French regulator discovered get advice on the best way forward for them. If the that rather than using medical grade silicone gel in the woman chooses, that could include an examination by implants, PIP had in fact been using unauthorised imaging. If, when informed by an assessment of clinical silicone gel. This is in clear violation of the CE mark. need of the risks involved and the impact of any unresolved The mark was promptly withdrawn and all EU member concerns, a woman decides with her doctor that it is states immediately alerted. The MHRA immediately right to do so, the NHS will remove and replace the issued advice to stop using PIP breast implants in the implants, if the original operation was done by the NHS. UK. The French authorities are currently investigating Last week the NHS chief executive wrote to the service, this as a criminal matter, and the UK government will and Dame Sally Davies, the chief medical officer, wrote help in any way we can with their investigation. to GPs and relevant health professionals. Copies of Initial toxicology tests in both France and the UK those letters are available in the Library. found no significant health risk to women with the It is right that those who received their care privately implants. Also the MHRA could find no evidence of an should also receive a similar level of service and reassurance increased risk of cancer. However, on 23 December from their care provider. However, I do not think it fair 2011, following an increase in the number of reported to the taxpayer for the NHS to foot the bill for patients ruptures, the French Ministry of Health announced who had their operation privately. Eight private health that it was advising women, as a non-urgent precautionary care companies, including Nuffield Health, Spire Healthcare measure, to consider having their PIP implants removed. and BMI, have confirmed that they will follow the same The MHRA’s advice was that there was no scientific guidelines as those that I have set out for NHS patients. basis for recommending routine removal of implants in However, I want to be absolutely clear that the NHS the absence of symptoms. will continue to be there to support any woman. If a The available data, however, were incomplete. For clinic that implanted PIP implants no longer exists or this reason, I asked Sir Bruce Keogh, the NHS medical refuses to remove the breast implants, where that patient director, to form an expert group and to review the is entitled to NHS services, the NHS will, in consultation available data, including information from the French with their doctor, support the removal of PIP implants authorities, and to offer more definitive advice. I received in line with the guidance that I have just outlined. Any the group’s interim report on Friday 6 January and a NHS service in that instance would cover only the copy has been placed in the Library. I would like to removal of the implant, which would not include the thank the experts and members of the profession for replacement of private cosmetic implants. In such cases their hard work and commitment in producing this the Government would pursue private clinics to seek rapid report. recovery of our costs. The main findings of the expert group were, first, that These events highlight the need to ensure the safety there is no causal link between these implants and of people having cosmetic interventions. It is clear from breast cancer. Secondly, the evidence on the rate of the information that we have received from the industry ruptures for PIP implants compared with other implants that the safety information that it collects and provides is incomplete and so this risk cannot be assessed definitively. to the regulator is of variable quality. Without good Thirdly, although the rupture of implants or leakage of data, we have no way of knowing when problems arise. material can result in inflammation, there is no clear I believe that there are a number of things that we now evidence that these problems are more serious in relation need to do. First, lessons need to be learned from this 183 Breast Implants11 JANUARY 2012 Breast Implants 184 case and incorporated into the ongoing review of the an urgent review on new year’s eve, then giving an EU medical devices directive. I spoke to Commissioner inconclusive statement late last Friday evening. This Dalli yesterday, and can confirm that this European has left the people affected struggling to make sense of work is under way. We also need to understand what what it means. For the vast majority whose implants happened in this instance in the United Kingdom. A were fitted privately, there was precious little practical review for that purpose will be led by the Minister for advice or help from the Department of Health as they Quality, Earl Howe, with expert advice, and will shortly began approaching their private providers. Many women put its terms of reference in the Library. That review were unable to access their records or told that long will investigate and report rapidly. The blame for what delays would be involved. Others have been asked to happened lies with PIP, but the review will enable us to pay large fees to access their records. Many have simply learn lessons to improve future regulatory effectiveness hit a brick wall when they have sought medical advice and will feed into the Commission’s review. or removal, even where there is evidence of rupture. In addition, the Care Quality Commission will conduct What people needed at the earliest stages was a a swift review of private clinics. That review will look at strong statement from the Government of what was evidence of compliance, patient safety and clinical quality, expected of all private providers—namely, that records and the information and support given to their patients. should be provided without delay and without charge; Where a provider does not meet those requirements, the that consultations should be arranged when people CQC has a wide range of enforcement powers that it were worried; and that removal should be arranged can use to protect the safety of patients. The findings of urgently when there was evidence of rupture. The reality that review will be published before the end of March. is that the Government’s failure to provide that leadership Looking to wider issues of clinical safety and regulation, from the outset has left people fending for themselves in I have also asked Sir Bruce Keogh to reconstitute his the face of a self-serving and unaccountable industry. expert group to look at how the safety of patients considering cosmetic interventions can be better ensured The Health Secretary was right, however, to establish in the future. That will include treatments such as an urgent review of the evidence by the NHS medical cosmetic surgery and dermal fillers. I expect his review director, Professor Sir Bruce Keogh. We welcome the to consider whether cosmetic products and interventions speed with which that review was conducted, and we are appropriately regulated and have strong clinical echo the Health Secretary’s thanks to the members of governance; whether patients and consumers can be the review panel. We accept the Government’s judgment confident that the people who carry out procedures on the advice to women regarding the removal of implants have the skills to do so; and whether the settings in on the basis of the data that they have seen, but what which such procedures take place are able to ensure the confidence can we have in the evidence and data on care and welfare of people who use their services. That which those decisions were reached? review will consider issues of governance, data quality, We note the Secretary of State’s public comments record keeping and surveillance, as well as ensuring that about the industry’s failure to provide quality information proper information is provided to secure patients’ informed in a timely fashion, and the interim report’s finding that consent. the evidence is subject to “considerable uncertainty”. I expect the review also to include consideration of The review concludes that it should reconvene in “about an outcomes-based register of frequently implanted four weeks time” to examine any new evidence, and to devices, covering everything from breast implants to consider whether to update its recommendation on heart valves and replacement joints, in order to provide removal. I have to tell the Health Secretary, however, the United Kingdom with a valuable asset for further that that feels way too vague and ad hoc. May I press innovation and safety improvement. There is already him to give a clearer timetable for this further process of considerable clinical support for such a comprehensive review on whether to change the recommendation on register. The Government’s commitment is to provide removal? People need absolute clarity on when further effective reassurance and remedy for women with these statements will be made, so that they can make informed implants, and also to learn the lessons to deliver safety decisions. This is of course a separate matter from the and quality for the future. I commend this statement to long-term reviews that he has announced today. the House. This is particularly important in the light of the different decisions that other Governments are beginning Andy Burnham (Leigh) (Lab): I thank the Health to make in response to the situation. Yesterday, the Secretary for his statement, and for the steps that he is Welsh Government announced that all women who taking to help the thousands of women who have found received PIP implants, including those treated privately, themselves in this worrying situation. We welcome much will be offered replacement implants on the NHS. That of what he has just announced, including the further is of course different from what the Health Secretary reviews that he has commissioned. I assure him that we has announced today. What discussions did he have will support him in his efforts to reach a resolution as with his counterpart Minister in the Welsh Assembly quickly as possible for all those people who are affected, Government before their announcement was made? but I have to tell him that he has a lot of work to do, and Will he assure the House today that all the data that a lot of ground to recover, as his response to date has were available to Welsh Ministers and officials were also not helped to build those people’s confidence. available to, and considered by, the Keogh review? Over the Christmas break, the mixed messages coming Governments around Europe have responded sooner, from the Government did not go unnoticed. They only more decisively and with greater clarity than the coalition added uncertainty in what has been an anxious time for has done. By contrast, people here have found the many people. The Health Secretary has gone from Government’s statements in response to be both inconclusive downplaying the dangers on 23 December to announcing and ambiguous. 185 Breast Implants11 JANUARY 2012 Breast Implants 186
[Andy Burnham] Mr Lansley: I am grateful to the shadow Health Secretary for his welcome of my statement and the We support the decision to help NHS patients to have principles behind what we are setting out to do to look PIP implants removed and replaced, but does the Secretary after the women affected by these implants. of State appreciate how that decision has added to the I do not share the right hon. Gentleman’s view that confusion that many people feel and was interpreted as there were any mixed messages. I am sure he would have contradictory to the review’s overall finding? The clear been the first to complain if I had not identified the lack implication of the Keogh review is that the best course of available and consistent data and not asked an expert of action is, in fact, to have the implants removed, but group to look into this. As we look at countries across again no practical help was offered beyond the statements the world, we can be confident that we have set an of expectation for private providers to match the support exemplary standard in looking after women through on offer from the NHS and the reference made to the NHS and in bringing together an expert panel fully “moral duty”. to understand what would be the best advice for women. I, too, commend the private providers, such as Nuffield, The advice that no identified specific safety concern Spire and BMI, that have done the right thing by their justified the “routine removal” of these implants was patients, but in recent days we have heard how some of true on 23 December and it remains true today. As we the leading cosmetic surgery clinics have simply ignored have recognised from the outset and as I said on the Health Secretary’s appeal. Transform, which used 23 December, if women are worried or concerned about PIP implants on over 4,000 patients, has said that all the possibility of not having the implant they thought women affected will have to pay £2,800 for removal, while they had, that provides a perfectly reasonable basis on the Harley Medical Group, which has 13,900 patients which to seek advice and investigation. It would be right with PIP implants, has offered to pay for the cost of the for some women to ask for removal, but we should not new implant, but only if the NHS pays the far greater assume that women are choosing to have these implants bill for the surgery. I am sure the whole House will agree removed on the basis of clinical advice—even in France. that this is an appalling response to this situation, and The chief medical officer spoke to a clinical counterpart that the failure of these companies to face up to their in the Welsh Assembly Government before the publication duty of care for their patients leaves everybody, including of the expert group’s work. I have made sure that they the Government, in a difficult position. It is simply are informed, but I have to say that the Welsh Government unacceptable for any woman in England to be left in a made an announcement yesterday without previously position where she is worrying about her health and informing us. thus has no peace of mind, but is unable to afford to do anything about it. Paul Flynn (Newport West) (Lab): It’s called devolution. I appreciate what the Health Secretary has said today about helping people out of this predicament. I agree with his decision where private clinics no longer exist, Mr Lansley: It may be called devolution. I respect the but in accepting that the NHS will provide private devolved Administrations and always inform them of treatment where private providers refuse to, is he not in what I am doing, where it is relevant to them. We do not danger of letting those providers off the hook? May I recognise the advice that Wales received. Sir Bruce remind him that most people will not accept that the Keogh’s expert group, which included some of the NHS should subsidise the failures of private companies, foremost experts in plastic surgery, made clear and will look to him to pursue them to the nth degree to recommendations last week for patients in England and get any costs back? For instance, has he fully explored concluded that there was no significant increased clinical the insurance position of these private providers as a risk in cases where implants are not replaced. means of recovering costs? He says he will pursue them, If the shadow Secretary of State commends what the but what assumptions has the Department of Health Welsh Government have done—[Interruption.] Perhaps made about the likelihood of his success, and how he did not, but if he or anyone were to commend it, they much money is expected to be recovered? Has he fully would need to recognise that it runs the risk of letting explored the position of the French Government and the private providers off the hook. I am very clear that considered whether there is any residual liability on the they should provide an equivalent standard of care. As device manufacturer in that company? the right hon. Gentleman made clear, there are limitations Let me turn briefly to questions of regulation. Can on what can be done. I do not have powers and I did not we support what the Secretary of State said today about inherit powers to control what the private providers do the wider review of regulation of the cosmetic surgery in the private sector. I have to tell the right hon. Gentleman, industry? If there are any loopholes, we will support however, that I have reflected on the Health and Social him in closing them down. Care Bill, which is a positive legislative step forward. Just as it allows Monitor as a health and social care Finally, the right hon. Gentleman’s Health and Social sector regulator, on which we are consulting, to look at Care Bill envisages a much expanded role for the the prudential regulation of private providers in social private sector in the delivery of health care. I make no care, so it would allow us to consider the role of Monitor comment about that, but has he reflected on the Bill as a health sector regulator in licensing private providers and revisited the assumptions behind it? Will he assure of private health care. It is thus a positive not a negative us that issues of quality and safety will be safeguarded step forward. There is no comparison, as the right hon. in the NHS that he seeks to create? We want to be Gentleman will recognise, between the role of the private assured that he is giving careful consideration to all sector providing private care and the private sector in these issues, as he considers his response to this worrying the NHS, which is subject to the same duties and situation. obligations as an NHS provider. The Bill does not lead 187 Breast Implants11 JANUARY 2012 Breast Implants 188 to an increase in private sector provision, but in so far Mr Lansley: I completely understand the right hon. as there are private sector providers, they will be properly Lady’s point, but this activity is not unregulated. For regulated in the NHS. example, the Care Quality Commission is responsible On the role of private providers, they may be insured for the registration of providers, and for ensuring that and there may be warranties relating to these implants. they meet essential standards of safety and quality. We do not have data on this aspect, but I am clear that However, for precisely the reasons cited by the right these providers have legal and, indeed, moral obligations. hon. Lady, I am asking Sir Bruce Keogh’s group to I particularly commend a letter issued this morning by consider wider issues relating to the regulation of cosmetic the leaders of the profession—the two principal professional surgery and cosmetic interventions. associations—to their surgical colleagues. Having talked The registry to which the right hon. Lady referred about the standard of care in the NHS, the letter went was discontinued in 2004 because a substantial number on to say: of women were not consenting to the addition of their “Those working in the private sector are urged to support in names to the register. I believe that, given the positive similar fashion. We would hope that implanting surgeons would experience that has followed the establishment of the honour requests for replacement surgery free of surgical charge”. National Joint Registry, we can reassure women that The private providers that have not made this offer to their data can be entered without prejudicing their the women for whom they are responsible can see that patient confidentiality. their surgical associates are willing to carry this out free I should make clear that as yet we have no evidence of surgical charge, so I see no reason why they should demonstrating any significant difference between the not now step up and deliver the standard of care that rupture and leakage rates of PIP breast implants and women have a right to expect. those of other implants. Last June the American Food and Drug Administration published the findings of a Mr Stephen Dorrell (Charnwood) (Con): May I welcome study of normal implants, two of which had a 10% to my right hon. Friend’s statement and the prompt action 13% rupture rate over a 10-year period. It is important he has taken over the last few weeks to address this to appreciate that implants in themselves pose a distinct issue? Does he agree that the first priority when these risk of rupture and leakage. concerns came to light was to ensure that the women who have had these implants had clear, authoritative advice based on the evidence of the right way to treat Dr Sarah Wollaston (Totnes) (Con): I welcome the them, and that the process he established under Sir clear commitment to putting women’s health needs first Bruce Keogh has provided and will continue to provide in this context, but is not the heart of the problem the exactly that authoritative evidence-based advice? Does obvious conflict of interests for private clinics when it he further agree that there are some longer-term policy comes to the provision of long-term safety statistics? issues around the regulation of this industry that need Will my right hon. Friend ensure that any future system to be addressed, but in a more considered way and not allows women to self-report to the registry—albeit with tied up in the emotions of this immediate concern? a follow-up from specialists for confirmation purposes—so that we can have a complete picture of the long-term Mr Lansley: I am grateful to my right hon. Friend complications caused by devices of this kind? and agree with all his points. I would add that when the French Government informed us of their prospective Mr Lansley: My hon. Friend is right. When Sir Bruce announcement—I spoke to the French Health Minister and his colleagues are considering the establishment of the day before it—we gave the best advice to date, based a wider registry, they will consider not only the possibility on the MHRA’s knowledge of the toxicology tests and of self-registration but the possibility of making clinical its discussions with the French regulator. What we have professionals responsible for the publication of such to do is to establish the extent to which surveillance of data. The responsibility should not rest solely on providers these implants over a number of years should have led or manufacturers. to any different conclusion. It remains true, however, that there is no evidence of long-term health effects that Barbara Keeley (Worsley and Eccles South) (Lab): I would give rise—and would have given rise at that understand that a number of private clinics will not time—to a different recommendation from the one that even scan a patient with PIP implants without charging. we made. However, these goods were counterfeit. They were not of a medical standard, and they could be injurious to Ann Clwyd (Cynon Valley) (Lab): This is not a new health. Should not the NHS be prepared to help women issue, as the Secretary of State must know. Twenty years who must be worried sick, and perhaps cannot even ago I raised the case of a constituent who had to have a afford to have a scan to reassure them? I cannot believe double mastectomy because silicon implants had leaked that the NHS would turn its back on a patient who was in her body. As a result, we set up an organisation called suffering after drinking counterfeit vodka, so why should SOS—Survivors of Silicon. We worked with Which? it turn its back on these patients? magazine and the Department of Health, and we helped to set up the register of implants, which was unfortunately Mr Lansley: I am sorry that the hon. Lady framed not made compulsory. That is why the data are missing. her question in that way, because I thought I had made This is part of a wider issue, that of the proper clear that the NHS would always be there to support regulation of the cosmetic surgery industry, 70% of women. We will seek to recover the cost to the NHS if which is virtually unregulated. I hope that the Secretary the original provider was a private provider: that approach of State will insert an amendment into the Health and has been adopted for years, and I am sure that it would Social Care Bill to ensure that there is proper regulation have been adopted by my predecessors. No woman should of the whole industry. have to feel that she will not be looked after, but I am 189 Breast Implants11 JANUARY 2012 Breast Implants 190
[Mr Lansley] Government’s commitment to a review. Does my right hon. Friend expect to be able to charge the private making a different point—namely that, in the first sector for the costs of any additional regulation that the instance, women should be looked after by the original review group may deem necessary? providers, who have a continuing duty of care. They also have legal obligations—as well as the moral obligations Mr Lansley: I am grateful to my hon. Friend for what to which I have referred—but it is not for me to advise she said about the NHS. I think that before considering on those. whether there is a cost associated with regulation and how it might appropriately be met, we should consider John Pugh (Southport) (LD): If the Government are what is necessary to assure patients of safety and quality. paying for something that is needed, it is logical to assume that some private firms must be dodging their Grahame M. Morris (Easington) (Lab): I welcome responsibilities. If those firms are not indemnified against the statement, but may I caution the Secretary of State the risks of surgery or willing to accept responsibility against placing additional burdens on the Care Quality for its consequences, why on earth do we allow them to Commission without providing it with additional resources? practise? Does the remedy not lie in our hands? May I also urge him to heed the advice of my right hon. Friend the Member for Leigh (Andy Burnham), and Mr Lansley: I entirely understand my hon. Friend’s pause to listen and reflect on what lessons can be learnt point. The position we have inherited is that I have no and what safeguards can be provided for the future? I powers in relation to the provision of private health am thinking both of the protection of patients’ safety care by private companies. As I said to the right hon. and of future NHS liabilities when surgical procedures Member for Leigh (Andy Burnham), the Health and or treatments are carried out by the private sector, Social Care Bill provides for the establishment of Monitor which is likely to become more frequent as the privatisation as a health sector regulator that will license such providers. provisions of the Health and Social Care Bill are I am not making any judgment at this point on whether implemented. it would be appropriate for conditions to be attached to such licences in relation to the continuity of service to Mr Lansley: For reasons that I have already explained, patients, but it is one option that we can consider. the hon. Gentleman is simply wrong about that. It is nonsensical to attempt—as the editor of The Lancet did Chris Bryant (Rhondda) (Lab): May I suggest to the this morning—to compare the regulation of private Secretary of State that the problems in the cosmetic providers of private care with that of private providers intervention industry may be far more extensive than of NHS care. There is no comparison at all. we have known thus far? A few years ago, I had my eyes The CQC will inspect a sample of providers of cosmetic lasered. I visited five clinics, four of which seemed to be surgery to check that they are meeting registration trying to sell me an intervention rather than trying to do requirements, and will undertake a number of unannounced anything that would be in my general health interest. inspections as part of that. We expect the inspections to Will the Secretary of State add laser surgery clinics to be completed by the end of the month, and expect the his list, and also private dentists, many of which are CQC to have published its report by the end of March. encouraging patients to undergo operations that they It has confirmed that it has enough resources to undertake certainly do not need? the inspections within its existing budget.
Mr Lansley: I will reserve my position on dentistry, Dr Daniel Poulter (Central Suffolk and North Ipswich) because there is a very wide range and cosmetic intervention (Con): I add my support and thanks to the Secretary of constitutes a substantial proportion of overall dentistry State for what he is doing on this very important issue activity, but I will happily consider whether there is an which has caused so much distress to so many women. issue to be dealt with. As for laser eye surgery, I will ask Does he agree that this episode flags up a wider issue in Sir Bruce’s group to consider not only the establishment the cosmetic surgery industry, in that some practitioners of a registry in relation to implants and devices, but performing medical procedures do not have any medical cosmetic interventions more generally. I hope that we qualifications or knowledge of anatomy? Does he also shall be able to reassure the hon. Gentleman when we agree that it is a problem that there is not psychological publish the terms of reference. counselling and that a holistic look at patients is not taken, as this is an on-demand industry? Finally, does Several hon. Members rose— he agree that there must be a proper paper trail and record system in the industry, so that we can consider Mr Speaker: Before I call Margot James, let me wish what is in the best interests of patients and so that there the hon. Member for Rhondda (Chris Bryant) a very is proper accountability for all providers? happy birthday. Mr Lansley: My hon. Friend makes a number of Margot James (Stourbridge) (Con): I commend the important and perceptive points. It is, and will continue Black Country Partnership NHS Foundation Trust on to be, one aspect of NHS advice that psychological conducting 517 breast implant operations in the decade assessment can form an important part in the management before 2008 without the use of a single PIP implant. of patients referred for low-priority procedures, including What this furore has revealed to me is the existence cosmetic surgery. However, although we will look at of a growing private sector offering a vast array of cosmetic interventions and their regulation more widely, cosmetic surgery that extends well beyond breast implants. we must recognise that the issue in this instance related I fear that the need for tighter regulation of the industry to what was a criminal act—seeking to adulterate the will prove widespread, and I therefore welcome the material in the implants. Many private providers were 191 Breast Implants11 JANUARY 2012 Breast Implants 192 using what they regarded as properly certified implants back to points I made earlier, the Health and Social for a perfectly proper procedure. To that extent, they Care Bill gives us an opportunity to look more were not engaging in any improper behaviour. However, systematically at continuity of care for patients both in they have legal and moral obligations to their patients, the NHS and the private sector and at the responsibilities and I am asking them to discharge those obligations. of providers under their licence.
Fiona Mactaggart (Slough) (Lab): It saddens me Valerie Vaz (Walsall South) (Lab): I thank the Secretary that, despite previous reports recommending more effective of State for coming to the House and making this regulation of the cosmetic surgery industry, it has taken statement. How many clinics will the CQC be reviewing, this crisis, causing so much distress to so many women, and what will happens in respect of any clinics that are for the issue to be taken seriously. I am nevertheless glad no longer practising? Presumably the CQC will not have that it is being taken seriously. Will the Secretary of access to their records. State consider ensuring that people seeking cosmetic procedures must have independent counselling and advice Mr Lansley: I cannot tell the hon. Lady how many from a body that will not make a profit from that clinics the CQC will visit, but it will be a sample of procedure, and whose whole concern is the health of the providers, not all of them. As she may know from the patient? material we published last Friday, there were 93 private providers. The operations were heavily concentrated in Mr Lansley: I am grateful to the hon. Lady for that that a lot of them were carried out by a small proportion suggestion, and I will ask Sir Bruce’s group to consider it. of providers, but about 87 other small providers, or even single-handed providers, are involved and accessing Penny Mordaunt (Portsmouth North) (Con): I welcome data from all of them will be difficult. I also recognise the statement. What has the Secretary of State learned that, as the hon. Member for Edinburgh East (Sheila from this episode about the quality and take-up of Gilmore) said, some may not be in business any longer, routine insurance products offered by private companies or there may be surgeons who have retired. to protect both patients and providers when cosmetic surgery goes wrong? Paul Uppal (Wolverhampton South West) (Con): I Mr Lansley: I am grateful to my hon. Friend for her also thank the Secretary of State for making the statement. welcome for the statement. Those seeking cosmetic Following on from a vein of questioning that has already interventions must ask serious questions about not only been explored, will he elaborate on the point about the the nature of the procedure but the quality and reputation Government pursuing firms to recover costs and explain of the provider organisation, and ask it how it would what mechanisms are available to the Secretary of State protect their interests if things went wrong. to recover costs?
Sheila Gilmore (Edinburgh East) (Lab): The Secretary Mr Lansley: I will do so to an extent. It depends on of State referred in his statement to the possibility that the nature of the legal contract between a woman and an organisation that had carried out operations had her private provider. I hope that in many cases the legal gone out of business. As there are long-term implications obligations derived under that contract or under sale of from such surgical interventions, has the Secretary of goods and services legislation will clearly mean that the State considered instituting some form of levy or fund woman will get redress from her private providers or her that would have to be paid into—nor do I want to let insurers. If the NHS becomes involved, there may be the private sector off the hook—so that if organisations compensation through the injury costs recovery scheme, go out business there would be a sum of money from so if the NHS incurs costs, we can go on to seek to which people could claim? recover them.
Mr Lansley: As I hope the hon. Lady will appreciate Yasmin Qureshi (Bolton South East) (Lab): I thank from what I said to the right hon. Member for Leigh the Secretary of State for his statement. As has been (Andy Burnham), the Health and Social Care Bill introduces said, most of the cosmetic surgery industry is not for the first time a comprehensive continuity of service regulated. What time frame are he and his staff working regime for the NHS, and it also creates, through the towards? health sector regulator, the potential for us to consider whether such continuity of service needs to be extended Mr Lansley: Given the nature of the work I am beyond the NHS. asking Sir Bruce Keogh and his group to undertake, it will take them some time to look at the range of Ian Swales (Redcar) (LD): If the NHS stands behind cosmetic interventions and make any recommendations. private providers in such cases, it is effectively providing They are coming together as rapidly as they can. Many free indemnity insurance. Will the Secretary of State of them have given up a great deal of time over the past look at the insurance position of providers of such two weeks to help us in this work. We must recognise services and ensure that the taxpayer does not face that there are things we need to do rapidly to ensure open-ended liabilities? that there is support and reassurance for any woman affected by PIP implants, and we are acting rapidly. Mr Lansley: As my hon. Friend points out, to that extent There are lessons and wider implications to be learned. the NHS has always stood behind the private sector This particular area of cosmetic surgery was not without provision of health care. If things go wrong, people regulation. The question is to what extent things were have the right to access NHS treatment as they must be properly regulated with surveillance and enforcement looked after on the basis of clinical need. Referring over a number of years. 193 Breast Implants11 JANUARY 2012 Breast Implants 194
Steve Brine (Winchester) (Con): I welcome the Secretary the scrutiny of these implants, including proper testing. of State’s statement. As he knows, I co-chair the all-party The European review must look at whether that surveillance, group on breast cancer and we will want to monitor including unannounced inspections and appropriate testing, how women are treated by the NHS and private providers, gives us the level of assurance we are looking for. and we will certainly feed that into the Department. For women who have fought breast cancer and been through Heidi Alexander (Lewisham East) (Lab): Yesterday, I the trauma of reconstructive surgery, this will bring it was contacted by a constituent who had PIP implants all back and be tremendously upsetting. Does the Secretary inserted by the Harley Medical Group in 2006. She of State therefore agree that speed is of the essence in said: respect of replacement surgery where it is wanted, so “There is so much conflicting information at the moment, I that those women can again put this nightmare behind feel as though I’m being pushed from pillar to post. To add them? absolute insult to injury nobody is keen on helping us, they are saying the NHS should help…or they say they will perform the Mr Lansley: I am grateful to my hon. Friend and I procedures on us for an extra fee.” completely recognise the points he makes. As he will Can the Secretary of State tell me precisely what further know, the overwhelming majority of the approximately representations he will be making to private providers 3,000 women who had PIP implants through the NHS to ensure that all women get access to the advice and will have had them as breast reconstruction surgery treatment they need? following mastectomy. From day one, we were clear that we wanted all those women to be able to get advice, Mr Lansley: We have been very clear about the advice investigation and remedy, and removal and replacement, we have given to women, and I hope that, through the should they wish. If the NHS was responsible for the NHS, any woman in those circumstances would go and original operation, we will be responsible for the replacement see their general practitioner, who will have full access, with new implants, if that is what is wanted. from the chief medical officer, to the expert advice we have disseminated. I know that the Harley Medical The NHS is very clear about this issue in the advice Group has not shared with others the view that it can that was presented. I welcome the fact that my professional match the NHS’s standard of care; but given that, the colleagues in the associations are making it clear that, professions are suggesting to surgeons that they should through the NHS, replacement procedures for these honour requests for replacement surgery free of surgical women should be possible rapidly, but it should not charge. I hope that gives a basis on which more of the prejudice the availability of urgent referral for cancer, private providers will now meet their full obligation of a which will continue to be an operational requirement in duty of care. the NHS. Mr Philip Hollobone (Kettering) (Con): What is the Ms Gisela Stuart (Birmingham, Edgbaston) (Lab): Department of Health’s central estimate of the number The question arises of access to records in both the of women who have had breast implants through private private and NHS sectors. Is it not time to look again at clinics who will seek their removal through the NHS? who is the keeper of medical records? Should it not be the patient—therefore bringing together the NHS and Mr Lansley: I am sorry to disappoint my hon. Friend private provision, where applicable—rather than the but I cannot offer him such an estimate. We know that institutions? some 37,000 women had PIP breast implants. Clearly, not all those will necessarily want removal, and on Mr Lansley: Of course, as the hon. Lady knows, we advice, it might be any proportion of those; I cannot tell have been thinking hard about precisely this issue. The him what that figure would be. As we see in France, NHS Future Forum made further recommendations to recommending the removal of implants does not mean us only yesterday about achieving access for patients that all women will have them removed. to their own records by 2015 across the NHS. The NHS should keep records, but the patients themselves should Mark Durkan (Foyle) (SDLP): I acknowledge the have access to them. We will pursue that issue in the Secretary of State’s commitment to engaging proactively NHS, although frankly, I am not in a position to with the devolved Administrations on this issue. However, mandate that in the private sector. However, any patient in his statement he used somewhat clumsy language would be well advised to say, “Why can’t I hold my own regarding the third main finding of the expert group, record from a private provider?” saying that “there is no clear evidence that these problems are more serious in relation to PIP implants than other Bob Blackman (Harrow East) (Con): I welcome the implants, or that they result in increased long-term Secretary of State’s statement, but PIP is not the sole health risks.” Is he not concerned that, put so clumsily, supplier of breast implants across the industry. What that will not only fail to reassure those with PIP implants assurances has he received from the industry that no but extend concern and alarm to those who have received other company has embarked on the practice of using other implants? non-medical grade silicon in its breast implants, so that women who have had such implants can feel safe? Mr Lansley: I am afraid that absence of evidence does not mean evidence of absence. We can be very clear, Mr Lansley: I have no evidence of such behaviour on on expert advice, that there are no specific safety concerns the part of other companies. My hon. Friend is right: that routinely require the removal of these implants, PIP is only one of a number of suppliers, and in this nor identification of any increased long-term health country probably only one in seven breast implants risks, in precisely the way I have described. I cannot go were PIP implants. Other countries have looked at this, further and provide, on advice, absolute assurance, and and across Europe the regulatory process should ensure the expert group was clear about that. That is why the 195 Breast Implants11 JANUARY 2012 Breast Implants 196
French Health Minister, whom I was talking to last by the shadow Secretary of State. Regardless of that, week, and I were clear that we should undertake additional does my right hon. Friend not agree that the Harley toxicology tests on implants when they are explanted, in Medical Group, or any other company, should step up cases where they were implanted over a period of time, to the plate, take full responsibility and work to make to begin to understand the extent to which they had sure that it gives the people involved complete satisfaction, adulterated filler material and what was in it. without any cost to the individual concerned?
Andrew George (St Ives) (LD): I commend my right Mr Lansley: My hon. Friend will understand that I hon. Friend’s initiative. However, he said the following, cannot speak about the precise details of the situation which may have been sloppy wording: “those who have with the Harley Medical Group. All I can say is that the had reconstructive surgery following a mastectomy, will group has told the media that it does not feel it can offer have received PIP implants through the NHS.” Of course, that standard of care completely, but that will have been the majority will not have done so, and I have confirmed before the professional associations wrote to their members with surgeons in Cornwall that PIP implants have never asking them to support replacement surgery free of been used in the NHS in Cornwall. Given that the surgical charge. I know that the group has told members Medicines and Healthcare products Regulatory Agency of the media that it is willing to offer to the Government issued advice to stop using PIP implants in the UK in that if we are responsible for the removal of implants, it March 2010, can the Secretary of State confirm that will pay for implants to be available for replacement this advice was acted on, no doubt within the NHS but purposes. Frankly, if surgeons are willing to waive the across private clinics as well? surgical charge and the group is willing to pay for the implants, it is not too much to ask for it to be responsible Mr Lansley: I hope I did not say what the hon. for removal and replacement, where it is in the woman’s Gentleman ascribes to me. Some 3,000 women, we best interests to do that. think, had PIP implants, and of course, that is only a fraction of the number having breast reconstruction Paul Flynn (Newport West) (Lab): Does the Secretary surgery. I think I can offer him reassurance. The MHRA of State not regret failing to react to the call made last withdrew authorisation in March 2010, and given that May for British patients to have the same protection there was only one distributor of these implants in this against failures of all medical devices as that enjoyed in country—Cloverleaf—they will not have been distributed the United States? Is the real scandal here not, again, for use after that date. the chronic under-reporting by the industry and the MHRA of failures of devices and drugs? Is not the Toby Perkins (Chesterfield) (Lab): A constituent in answer for this probe to look into the possibility of Chesterfield contacted me who is at her wits’ end. She having a genuinely independent regulatory authority, has been in considerable pain since having a PIP implant instead of one that is entirely funded by the industry, fitted, and has been told by the private provider that she because self-regulation is often no regulation? will have to pay £3,600 to have it replaced. What more can the Secretary of State do to ensure that her private Mr Lansley: The hon. Gentleman says that this body provider follows the example of the other eight providers is entirely funded by the industry. It is true that in that are doing this free of charge? Let us put some relation to pharmaceuticals the MHRA is funded by pressure on these companies to make sure that all of levies on the pharmaceutical industry, but much of the them do the same as the NHS and replace the products cost of the regulation of medical devices is actually met they have fitted. by the taxpayer. I regard the MHRA as operating in an independent fashion and its expert and scientific advice Mr Lansley: I think I have made it clear that not only as independent from Ministers. None the less, as he the Government but, helpfully, the professional associations says, the review that Earl Howe will lead will examine are looking to give no reason why private providers the lessons to be learned, including those about the should not match that standard of care, especially if the effectiveness of regulatory surveillance and enforcement implanting surgeons are willing to offer replacement in this country, albeit that the regulatory failure occurred, surgery free of surgical charge themselves. It would be in essence, in Germany, in the first instance, and in very helpful if the hon. Gentleman and other Members France. gave us details of such cases on behalf of their constituents. Clearly, his constituent will have had that implant before Richard Burden (Birmingham, Northfield) (Lab): The March 2010. The adverse incident centre has had 478 uncertainty that many women face relates to not only reports of ruptures over the whole period, which extends the level of risk associated with PIP implants, but back many years. One of the things we want to understand whether the implants they had fitted were PIP implants. as part of our review is why, if there were ruptures and, I accept what other hon. Members have said about more to the point, adverse health effects associated with problems with record keeping in the private sector, and these implants, they were not disclosed to the adverse that needs to be taken up. The Secretary of State said incident centre. As yet, we have not seen a range of that the estimated 3,000 NHS patients will be written health effects over a period of time that, in themselves, to. If they are to receive such a letter, will he reassure distinguish these implants from other, normal implants. them about when that will be?
Mr Marcus Jones (Nuneaton) (Con): I contacted the Mr Lansley: The chief executive of the NHS wrote to Harley Medical Group on behalf of a concerned constituent the NHS bodies last week. As the hon. Gentleman will this morning and was told that it would be making a realise, the numbers concerned in each organisation will decision on its response to this issue by Friday, although not be very large, so I am looking for what he describes that is somewhat contradicted by the comments made to happen rapidly. 197 Breast Implants11 JANUARY 2012 Breast Implants 198
Mr Denis MacShane (Rotherham) (Lab): Will the Mr Lansley: I refer the hon. Gentleman to what I said Secretary of State send officials to investigate the Birkdale in my statement: if women are entitled to NHS treatment clinic in Rotherham and its executive, Mr Promod in those sorts of circumstances, they should come to the Bhatnagar? Scores of women have had PIP implants at NHS and we will provide the standard of care that the clinic and are now being told that they have to pay I outlined. £2,900, in cash, to be screened and looked at again. Mr Bhatnagar has threatened groups in south Yorkshire Ian Mearns (Gateshead) (Lab): The Secretary of State with “unimaginable consequences” if they raise this has demonstrated his obvious concern for the women issue. After his very unclear statement, will the Secretary affected by this situation. Does he accept that they are of State finish by saying that as in every other European gravely concerned about the difference of opinion that country, and standing with the women of Britain, taxpayers is emerging between Governments in the countries where do not mind paying for a few hundred women to be properly these implants have been used, in particular, the difference investigated? My constituents have contacted me saying between our Government’s advice and that of the country that the women of south Yorkshire should be able to go where the implants were manufactured, France? Will he to their general practitioner, go straight into hospital also reflect on whether companies in the private sector and be seen to, and we should clear up all the fuss about that are giving either cosmetic or other treatments of bills afterwards. this nature to women are properly insured, so that even if they go out of business the insurer will cover women Mr Lansley: I think I have been absolutely clear about for future treatments should something go wrong? what I expect to happen, in relation both to women treated through the NHS and what I expect of private Mr Lansley: On the hon. Gentleman’s final point, I providers. I have also made it clear that if private providers refer him to what I said earlier about how we might deal will not or are unable to meet that standard of care, the with that in the future. On the point about other countries, NHS is available to support women. It is absolutely I have spoken to Commissioner Dalli and I have spoken wrong to say that we are somehow responding to women to my French counterpart twice. What I want to be clear differently from other European countries, because across about is that the French authorities did recommend Europe countries affected by this are taking exactly the routine removal of implants, but from any individual same view that we take. woman’s point of view we are, in effect, recommending that the same thing should happen: any individual woman should see the clinician responsible, should be Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP): I thank the Secretary examined—by imaging, if necessary—and should consider, of State for his statement and I again highlight the in the light of that and in a clinical decision with her concerns that a great many ladies have. Just today, I adviser, what is right for her. That will be true in France have been made aware that constituents of mine, as well and in Britain. I wish to emphasise that we have not as those from other regions of the United Kingdom, seen, on advice, scientific evidence that justifies the have had PIP breast implants carried out privately in recommendation of the routine removal of these implants. the Republic of Ireland. When they contacted the firm, We are not saying to women that we think they should they found that it had gone bust, so what help can he have them removed; we are saying that women should give ladies, both financially and physically, who were have access to imaging. Clearly, women with symptoms, NHS patients in the United Kingdom but had operations or women for whom evidence of rupture or leakage has carried out outside the United Kingdom, specifically in been provided through imaging, may well choose to the Republic of Ireland? have the implants removed, and we would support that. 199 11 JANUARY 2012 Trade Union Officials (Refund of Pay 200 to Employers) Trade Union Officials (Refund of Pay to should it be allowed without proper processes of competitive Employers) tender and public accountability? My own answer to these questions would be, in general, a resounding no. Motion for leave to introduce a Bill (Standing Order No. 23) Taxpayers’ money should be spent, as far as possible, on the front line of public services. In general, private organisations should not be subsidised by the state. 1.38 pm Moreover, the fundamental principle of no payment without accountability is already observed throughout Jesse Norman (Hereford and South Herefordshire) the public sector in other areas. Public procurement is (Con): I beg to move, supposed to be competitive and transparent, and so is That leave be given to bring in a Bill to provide that pay for commissioning of services in the NHS and across local hours worked on behalf of trade unions by trade union officials government. In exactly the same way, there should be during hours when they are paid by an employer should be refunded to the employer by the trade union; and for connected proper transparency and accountability in public funding purposes. for trade unions. The Bill addresses an issue that has recently attracted I myself have just waged a long campaign to recover great public attention: the funding by the taxpayer of some £1.5 billion for the taxpayer on the private finance public sector employees who in fact work not as nurses, initiative—only a small portion, so far, of the money teachers, social workers, local government officers or overspent by the previous government on PFI. In effect, civil servants but as trade union representatives. It was PFI included a massive subsidy to the financial and raised in an Adjournment debate last year by my hon. construction sectors. The principle is exactly the same Friend the Member for Cannock Chase (Mr Burley) here: taxpayers’ money should not be used to subsidise and I pay tribute to him for that, to my hon. Friend the private organisations without proper transparency and Member for Witham (Priti Patel) for her work in the accountability. Why should the unions be any different? area and to other colleagues for their support today. There is an important further argument. Subsidising The number of my colleagues in the Chamber attests to the unions with taxpayers’ money is not ultimately in the importance of this issue. the interests even of their own members. Indeed, it will This is not an area where definitive information is tend to undermine the services those unions provide. available, because adequate records have not been kept. All subsidies distort incentives. This subsidy encourages The facts so far, taken from freedom of information union leaders to lobby politicians for hand-outs, rather requests to some 1,300 public sector organisations, are than focus on doing the jobs their members pay them as follows. In 2010-11, trade unions received £113 million to do. from public sector organisations. If extended over the Finally, taxpayer funding creates huge conflicts of lifetime of a Parliament, that would amount to the interest. Inevitably, some union reps will be tempted to extraordinary sum of more than half a billion pounds engage in political activity during time funded by the in payments. An estimated 2,840 full-time equivalent taxpayer. That was the problem with Ms Jane Pilgrim, public sector employees worked for the trade unions in the former nurse turned union rep at St George’s hospital, 2010-11, paid for by taxpayers. That is equivalent to Tooting, who denounced the Secretary of State for 2,840 public servants whose work has to be done by Health on the basis of a meeting she had never attended. others: teachers who are not teaching, nurses who are That was politicking pure and simple, but the conflict not nursing and social workers who are not assisting between political activity and taxpayer funding would their clients. The Department for Work and Pensions be removed if unions were required to refund public alone has 308 full-time equivalent staff working on money received, as this Bill would demand. trade union activities paid for by taxpayers, while Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs has 181, to give just Various defences have been made of such payments. two examples. These facts are quite unknown to most It has been suggested that they actually save money, people in this country and they deserve much wider that union reps are needed for pay negotiations and that publicity. It will be a source of huge anger to my union reps must be employees, but those arguments constituents in Herefordshire, who must fill in their tax entirely miss the point. The issue is not whether the forms this month in very difficult economic times, to unions provide valuable services, whether they should learn that they are subsidising nearly 200 tax officials be paid for doing so or whether public servants may not who do no tax work at all—all the more so as under the also be union reps; the issue is why they should be paid previous Government the Revenue drastically cut back in that role by the taxpayer. its office in Hereford. There is a wider point as well, which is that of It is important to be clear about one thing, however. transparency itself. Last week, my office called seven of The Bill is not about attacking the unions. The trade the biggest unions, asking for their latest financial reports union movement in this country has an often distinguished and accounts as background research. The response history of supporting and protecting working men and was extraordinary. Some unions, such as the National women and their families. Many unions do very good Union of Rail, Maritime and Transport Workers and work for their members today. I recognise these things the Union of Shop, Distributive and Allied Workers, do and I welcome them. In a similar spirit, the House will not put this information online at all—USDAW kindly know that I am a great supporter of co-ops, mutuals, invited me to write to its treasurer with a request. credit unions and other organisations whose purpose is Others, such as the NASUWT, make it available only to to empower and support people who are often on very members. Unison had its 2009 statements online, and modest incomes. The issue here is one of basic principle: the National Union of Teachers had a summary. Only is it appropriate for the taxpayer to subsidise any such the Public and Commercial Services Union had a full large-scale activity by private organisations? If it is, recent report and accounts online. 201 Trade Union Officials (Refund of Pay 11 JANUARY 2012 Trade Union Officials (Refund of Pay 202 to Employers) to Employers) [Jesse Norman] their colleagues by giving advice, by supporting them at grievances and discplinaries and by negotiating with Matters only become murkier on further investigation. managers. That is difficult and demanding work, but The unions are regulated by the relatively little-known many of those representatives are also ready to take on certification officer, who requires them to file an annual extra, special responsibilities for improving health and return. In the case of Unite, that reveals that the union safety, equality, training and environmental standards. had income in 2010 of £141 million and made a pay-off The Bill is a personal attack on people such as Kevin of more than half a million pounds to its outgoing joint Maggs, a GMB learning representative at A & P ship general secretary, Derek Simpson— repairers in Cornwall. He organised open learning days for his colleagues at work and encouraged them on to Mr Denis MacShane (Rotherham) (Lab): Is this in courses. He says that some of them have been able to order? gain qualifications for a job they have done for years, whereas others have been able to understand their pay Mr Speaker: Order. Stop the clock. The right hon. slip for the first time because of their improved literacy Member for Rotherham (Mr MacShane) should behave and numeracy. The hon. Member for Hereford and not like a trainee rabble-rouser but rather like the elder South Herefordshire might not be able to understand statesman that at his best he can be. that, but Ministers do. Let me quote the Minister for Further Education, Skills and Lifelong Learning, who Jesse Norman: Astonishingly, there is no management said last year: report in Unite’s annual return, no historical comparison “I want to pay tribute to union learning reps, who have made of income and expenditure, no discussion of the year’s so much difference to so many lives, and to such effect. Trade activities, no analysis of the current environment or unions can play an invaluable and immeasurable role in improving future prospects, no biographies of senior officials and skills in the workplace.” not even any photographs. The impression given by that That is why the Government are rightly investing £33 million annual return is one of contempt for the union’s to support union learning. It is part of the £110 million membership. Members should ask themselves what would condemned by the TaxPayers Alliance. be required if Unite were a charity like, to choose an example at random, the Sheffield Hospitals Charity. Its Many trade union reps rightly receive paid time off annual report and accounts is a model of detailed and from their other work to carry out those duties. Many clear presentation, full of information about the also devote much of their own time to that work. A organisation, its people and its work. There is a very recent Government survey showed that reps in the clear sense of public commitment and purpose. Its page public sector contribute up to 100,000 unpaid hours on the Charity Commission’s website is packed with each week to carry out their duties. Our union reps are accessible information and graphics, but there is nothing the unsung heroes of the long, proud British tradition especially unusual about that report and accounts or of volunteering. They are the workplace wing of the that disclosure. It is simply that the standards for public Prime Minister’s big society. There should be receptions disclosure and the standards of treatment for donors in Downing street to pay tribute to their work. They are much higher for charities than for unions. support their colleagues and they save employers and the Exchequer millions of pounds each year by reducing The Sheffield Hospitals Charity had income last year the number of employment tribunals and days lost of just £2 million; Unite is seventy times larger. It is through illness and injury. By improving productivity Britain’s biggest union, with more than 1.5 million and training, they help organisations to get through members, and wields enormous political power. If this periods of great pressure and great change. I looked at is how it treats its membership and the taxpayer, the the new year’s honours list this year and saw there were case for greater union accountability and for more hundreds of civil servants, charity workers and business transparent regulation could hardly be clearer. I commend people on it—especially civil servants—but I found the Bill to the House. only one person, Mr Charles James from Leeds, who was honoured for the service he has given to his union 1.48 pm and to his community. We should see many more ordinary John Healey (Wentworth and Dearne) (Lab): This workplace reps being honoured in future like Mr James. Bill attacks the most basic and most benign feature of I think that the House will have recognised that the trade union work—the day-to-day support for staff at hon. Gentleman did not quote one single employer. work by their colleagues who are prepared to volunteer Employers are not calling for this attack; it does not as trade union representatives. even feature on the CBI’s 11-point checklist of curbs it Last time, the attack was led by the hon. Member for wants to see on trade unions. Many of our biggest and Cannock Chase (Mr Burley) in this Chamber. I had best British companies work with trade unions and thought he might be detained elsewhere. I have to say to recognise them—Rolls-Royce, Tesco, Virgin Media, Odeon the hon. Member for Hereford and South Herefordshire cinemas, the HSBC bank and Jaguar Land Rover. Those (Jesse Norman) that I am surprised to hear him attempt names are known worldwide and those companies know to bring in this Bill. He is gaining a growing reputation the benefit of working with trade unions and know the for hard work and intelligent comment, but his speech benefit of trade union representation. was a cheap-shot speech based on ignorance, ideology If we accept that employers as well as employees and inaccurate briefings from the TaxPayers Alliance. benefit from union representation, it is entirely right to He talks about trade union accounts and public service, expect employers to make a contribution towards the but the Bill is a broadside against trade union organising cost. That is why the hon. Gentleman’s Bill is wrong. in both the public and the private sectors. It is a personal Let me say one final thing to him and his colleagues. attack on around 200,000 people who are ready to help Many trade unionists voted Conservative at the last 203 Trade Union Officials (Refund of Pay 11 JANUARY 2012 Trade Union Officials (Refund of Pay 204 to Employers) to Employers) general election—too many—and some even voted Lib Walker, Mr Robin Whittingdale, Mr John Dem. They do not deserve this and the Bill does not Weatherley, Mike Wollaston, Dr Sarah deserve support from any part of this House. Wharton, James Zahawi, Nadhim Question put (Standing Order No. 23). Wheeler, Heather Tellers for the Ayes: White, Chris Matthew Hancock and The House divided: Ayes 132, Noes 211. Whittaker, Craig Guto Bebb Division No. 419] [1.55 pm NOES AYES Abrahams, Debbie Evans, Chris Afriyie, Adam Latham, Pauline Ainsworth, rh Mr Bob Farrelly, Paul Aldous, Peter Leadsom, Andrea Alexander, Heidi Fitzpatrick, Jim Amess, Mr David Lee, Dr Phillip Ali, Rushanara Flello, Robert Andrew, Stuart Leigh, Mr Edward Anderson, Mr David Flynn, Paul Bacon, Mr Richard Lewis, Brandon Ashworth, Jonathan Fovargue, Yvonne Baker, Steve Lewis, Dr Julian Austin, Ian Francis, Dr Hywel Baldwin, Harriett Lilley, rh Mr Peter Bailey, Mr Adrian Gapes, Mike Baron, Mr John Lopresti, Jack Bain, Mr William Gardiner, Barry Binley, Mr Brian Lord, Jonathan Bayley, Hugh George, Andrew Blackman, Bob Lumley, Karen Beckett, rh Margaret Glass, Pat Bradley, Karen Main, Mrs Anne Begg, Dame Anne Glindon, Mrs Mary Brine, Steve Maynard, Paul Beith, rh Sir Alan Goggins, rh Paul Bruce, Fiona McCartney, Jason Benton, Mr Joe Goodman, Helen Burley, Mr Aidan McCartney, Karl Berger, Luciana Greatrex, Tom Byles, Dan McCrea, Dr William Betts, Mr Clive Green, Kate Campbell, Mr Gregory McIntosh, Miss Anne Blackman-Woods, Roberta Greenwood, Lilian Carswell, Mr Douglas McPartland, Stephen Blenkinsop, Tom Griffith, Nia Chishti, Rehman Mercer, Patrick Blomfield, Paul Gwynne, Andrew Clifton-Brown, Geoffrey Metcalfe, Stephen Blunkett, rh Mr David Halfon, Robert Coffey, Dr Thérèse Mills, Nigel Brennan, Kevin Hamilton, Mr David Colvile, Oliver Mordaunt, Penny Brown, Lyn Hamilton, Fabian Crockart, Mike Morris, Anne Marie Brown, rh Mr Nicholas Hanson, rh Mr David Davies, David T. C. Morris, David Brown, Mr Russell Harris, Mr Tom (Monmouth) Morris, James Bruce, rh Malcolm Havard, Mr Dai Davies, Philip Mosley, Stephen Bryant, Chris Healey, rh John Dinenage, Caroline Murray, Sheryll Buck, Ms Karen Hemming, John Dodds, rh Mr Nigel Newton, Sarah Burden, Richard Hendrick, Mark Donaldson, rh Mr Jeffrey M. Nokes, Caroline Campbell, Mr Alan Hepburn, Mr Stephen Dorrell, rh Mr Stephen Norman, Jesse Campbell, Mr Ronnie Heyes, David Drax, Richard Nuttall, Mr David Caton, Martin Hillier, Meg Ellis, Michael Offord, Mr Matthew Chapman, Mrs Jenny Hilling, Julie Elphicke, Charlie Paisley, Ian Clark, Katy Hodge, rh Margaret Eustice, George Parish, Neil Clarke, rh Mr Tom Hodgson, Mrs Sharon Evans, Jonathan Pawsey, Mark Clwyd, rh Ann Hood, Mr Jim Field, Mark Percy, Andrew Coffey, Ann Hopkins, Kelvin Fox,rhDrLiam Phillips, Stephen Connarty, Michael Horwood, Martin Freer, Mike Pritchard, Mark Cooper, Rosie Hosie, Stewart Fullbrook, Lorraine Raab, Mr Dominic Corbyn, Jeremy Howarth, rh Mr George Gale, Sir Roger Reckless, Mark Crausby, Mr David Hunt, Tristram Garnier, Mark Redwood, rh Mr John Creasy, Stella Irranca-Davies, Huw Gilbert, Stephen Rees-Mogg, Jacob Cryer, John Jackson, Glenda Glen, John Reevell, Simon Cunningham, Alex James, Mrs Siân C. Goldsmith, Zac Reid, Mr Alan Cunningham, Mr Jim Jamieson, Cathy Gray, Mr James Robertson, Mr Laurence Cunningham, Tony Jarvis, Dan Griffiths, Andrew Rosindell, Andrew Dakin, Nic Johnson, rh Alan Gummer, Ben Rudd, Amber Danczuk, Simon Jones, Graham Gyimah, Mr Sam Ruffley, Mr David David, Mr Wayne Jones, Helen Harris, Rebecca Sandys, Laura Davies, Geraint Jones, Susan Elan Hart, Simon Shannon, Jim De Piero, Gloria Joyce, Eric Heaton-Harris, Chris Simpson, David Denham, rh Mr John Kaufman, rh Sir Gerald Henderson, Gordon Smith, Henry Dobbin, Jim Keeley, Barbara Hinds, Damian Spencer, Mr Mark Docherty, Thomas Lavery, Ian Hollingbery, George Stevenson, John Donohoe, Mr Brian H. Lazarowicz, Mark Hollobone, Mr Philip Stewart, Bob Doran, Mr Frank Leech, Mr John Holloway, Mr Adam Stewart, Iain Doyle, Gemma Leslie, Chris Jackson, Mr Stewart Sturdy, Julian Dromey, Jack Lloyd, Tony Jenkin, Mr Bernard Syms, Mr Robert Durkan, Mark Llwyd, rh Mr Elfyn Johnson, Gareth Tomlinson, Justin Edwards, Jonathan Long, Naomi Jones, Mr Marcus Truss, Elizabeth Efford, Clive Love, Mr Andrew Kirby, Simon Turner, Mr Andrew Elliott, Julie Lucas, Caroline Knight, rh Mr Greg Tyrie, Mr Andrew Ellman, Mrs Louise MacNeil, Mr Angus Brendan Kwarteng, Kwasi Uppal, Paul Esterson, Bill MacShane, rh Mr Denis 205 Trade Union Officials (Refund of Pay 11 JANUARY 2012 206 to Employers) Mactaggart, Fiona Roy, Mr Frank Mahmood, Shabana Roy, Lindsay Opposition Day Malhotra, Seema Ruane, Chris Mann, John Russell, Sir Bob [UN-ALLOTTED DAY] Marsden, Mr Gordon Sanders, Mr Adrian McCabe, Steve Sarwar, Anas McCarthy, Kerry Seabeck, Alison Rail Fares McClymont, Gregg Sharma, Mr Virendra McDonnell, Dr Alasdair Sheerman, Mr Barry 2.7 pm McDonnell, John Sheridan, Jim McFadden, rh Mr Pat Shuker, Gavin Maria Eagle (Garston and Halewood) (Lab): I beg to McGovern, Jim Skinner, Mr Dennis move, McKechin, Ann Slaughter, Mr Andy That this House believes that the scale of increases to rail and McKenzie, Mr Iain Smith, rh Mr Andrew bus fares and the high cost of fuel are significantly increasing the McKinnell, Catherine Smith, Angela transport sector’s contribution to the cost of living crisis facing Meacher, rh Mr Michael Smith, Nick households up and down the UK; notes that, despite the Chancellor’s Meale, Sir Alan Smith, Owen announcement in his Autumn Statement that rail fares would rise Mearns, Ian Smith, Sir Robert this month by 1 per cent. above inflation, many commuters have Michael, rh Alun Spellar, rh Mr John found their tickets have gone up by as much as 11 per cent.; Mitchell, Austin Stringer, Graham recognises that this is a direct result of the decision to give back to Moon, Mrs Madeleine Stuart, Ms Gisela train companies the right to add a further increase of up to 5 per Morden, Jessica Sutcliffe, Mr Gerry cent., resulting in the cost of getting to work rising to more than Morris, Grahame M. Tami, Mark the cost of monthly mortgage or rent payments for many families; (Easington) Thomas, Mr Gareth notes with concern the National Audit Office’s warning to the Department for Transport that higher rail fares are likely to lead Mudie, Mr George Timms, rh Stephen to higher profits for train operating companies; deplores the Munn, Meg Twigg, Derek Government’s decision to levy even higher increases of 3 per cent. Munt, Tessa Walley, Joan above inflation for 2013 and 2014; and calls on the Government Murphy, rh Paul Watson, Mr Tom to end the right of train companies to increase regulated tickets Murray, Ian Watts, Mr Dave by more than the cap set by Ministers, so as to prevent fare Nandy, Lisa Weir, Mr Mike increases of up to 13 per cent. that could otherwise hit passengers O’Donnell, Fiona Whitehead, Dr Alan in each of the next two years. Onwurah, Chi Williams, Hywel This has not been a happy new year for many commuters. Osborne, Sandra Williams, Mr Mark Owen, Albert Having been promised by the Chancellor in his autumn Williamson, Chris statement that he was keeping increases in rail fares at Pearce, Teresa Willott, Jenny just 1% above inflation, many had a nasty shock as they Perkins, Toby Wilson, Phil returned to work last week—not fare rises of 1% above Pound, Stephen Winnick, Mr David Qureshi, Yasmin Wishart, Pete inflation, but increases of up to almost 11%. Season Reed, Mr Jamie Woodcock, John tickets between Chester and Crewe are up by 10.6% on Reynolds, Emma Wright, David a year ago, and tickets between Llandudno and Bangor Reynolds, Jonathan Wright, Mr Iain hiked by the same double-digit increase, 10.6%. Return Riordan, Mrs Linda tickets are also up—Exeter to London, for example, up Robertson, John Tellers for the Noes: by 9.6%, Cardiff to London by 9.7% and Plymouth to Rogerson, Dan Valerie Vaz and London by 9.7%. Rotheram, Steve Sheila Gilmore But what did the Chancellor tell the House in November? He said: Question accordingly negatived. “RPI plus 3% is too much. The Government will fund a reduction in the increase to RPI plus 1%. This will apply across national rail regulated fares, across the London tube and on London buses. It will help the millions of people who use our trains.”—[Official Report, 29 November 2011; Vol. 536, c. 810.] He was right—it would have done, except that the Chancellor forgot to say that his Government had quietly given back to train companies the right to add up to another 5% on fares, provided the increases averaged out at the cap that he had set, giving the train companies back the right to fiddle the fares.
Mr John Redwood (Wokingham) (Con): Given that we all would like lower rail fares, does the hon. Lady think that there should be a bigger Treasury subsidy out of taxpayers’ pockets in order to achieve that?
Maria Eagle: Our position is that we would have continued in this Parliament, as we did in 2009, to put a stop to the power train operating companies have to fiddle the fares—
Stephen Hammond (Wimbledon) (Con): Will the hon. Lady give way? 207 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 208
Maria Eagle: If the hon. Gentleman will allow me to Maria Eagle: I will give way, but then I must make finish answering the last intervention, I might get around some progress, because the debate already has to be to giving way to him. As the previous Labour Transport shorter than we had hoped. Secretary made clear, we would not have given back to train operating companies the power to fiddle the fares Mr Evennett: I am extremely grateful to the hon. by hiking them by more than the cap on the most Lady and am listening to her with great interest, but she profitable routes and getting away with it by introducing is attempting to rewrite history. Does she feel any guilt much lower increases on the routes that do not rake in about the huge fare increases that took place under the the cash. That is something we put a stop to in government Labour Government, because commuters in my once times got tough. constituency had a really rough time?
The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Mrs Maria Eagle: The reality is that when the previous Theresa Villiers): Will the hon. Lady give way? Government saw what train operating companies were doing with the power that flex gave them to game the Andrew Gwynne (Denton and Reddish) (Lab): Will system and clobber some commuters far more than my hon. Friend give way? others, we banned it. This Government have reintroduced Maria Eagle: I will give way to the Minister, who I it. Times are still tough and the Government should not expect will be winding up the debate, and then to my have caved in to pressure from train companies, but hon. Friend. they seem to be unwilling, or perhaps incapable, of standing up to vested interests on behalf of commuters, Mrs Villiers: The hon. Lady claims that Lord Adonis, who are now paying the price. I have made it clear that a previous Transport Minister, would have continued we would have strictly enforced the 1% above inflation the suspension of the fares basket, but the reality is that cap and not allowed the increases of up to 11% that he did not renegotiate that with the train operators; he commuters have faced at ticket offices since the new year. negotiated for a one-year contractual suspension. If he had intended to carry on with that, he would have The Secretary of State for Transport (Justine Greening): negotiated the period into the franchises, but he chose Perhaps the hon. Lady would like to finish the other not to. part of her phrase, which is that she would not have allowed rises of above RPI plus 1%, just as she would Maria Eagle: The right hon. Lady is wrong to say not have allowed below RPI plus 1% flexibility. Will she that there was no intention to continue with that. She confirm that that is the position and that many commuters can try to rewrite our policy as much as she wishes, but would face fare increases under her proposals? my noble Friend Lord Adonis made it perfectly clear in oral and written evidence to the Transport Committee Maria Eagle: What we are not seeing from train that the ban on flex would continue into subsequent operating companies or the Government are proposals years, and that remains our policy. to reduce fares. The technical position is of course that Andrew Gwynne: My right hon. Friend is right to if an average cap is applied to each fare, the fare rise will point out that it was the previous Labour Government apply to each fare. The Secretary of State is right about who got rid of train operating companies’ ability to that, technically speaking. fiddle the fares. Was she as astounded as I was at the lack of knowledge displayed earlier by the Prime Minister, Ms Karen Buck (Westminster North) (Lab): On the who did not even know that it was his Government who commitment to reduce fares, is my hon. Friend aware had reinstated the right for those companies to clobber that the Labour candidate to be Mayor of London hard-working commuters? intends to bring forward a package to reduce fares, given that Boris Johnson’s increase in the cost of a Maria Eagle: I must say that I was quite surprised zones 1 to 4 travelcard equals a 21% rise, despite the fact that the Prime Minister did not seem to have that that Transport for London has a £729 million operating information. It was only after my right hon. Friend the surplus? The Labour party has a commitment to cut Leader of the Opposition had asked him three times fares. that the Prime Minister managed to claw his way towards an accurate answer, but that is what we have come to Maria Eagle: I am aware of that and thank my hon. expect from him. Friend for making that point. At least Labour’s candidate understands how hard it is for ordinary, hard-pressed Dr Julian Huppert (Cambridge) (LD): While we are commuters to afford the kind of fare rises that the discussing the rewriting of policies, what message would Government are not only allowing, but promoting. It is the hon. Lady give to a previous Transport Secretary no good Ministers hiding behind the deficit, because who in 2007 allowed Stagecoach South West to raise this is not a simple case of bringing additional money fares by 20%, or indeed to the Transport Secretaries into the Treasury; it is also about bringing additional who allowed that to happen in the 10 years before that? money into the profits of private train companies. The Does she agree that that was a huge mistake and that National Audit Office report on the Department for fares went too high? Transport’s spending settlement warned: Maria Eagle: If the hon. Gentleman will wait, I will “There is a risk that the benefit of the resulting increase in passenger revenues will not be passed on to taxpayers fully, but move on to say a little more about our current policy will also result in increased train operating company profits.” thinking later in my speech. High fares equal increased profits in an industry that Mr David Evennett (Bexleyheath and Crayford) (Con): relies on subsidies of more than £4 billion of taxpayers’ Will the hon. Lady give way? money every year. It is no wonder passengers in Britain 209 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 210
[Maria Eagle] Thirdly, passengers have told us that they want the cheapest fares to be available wherever tickets are sold, are paying three and a half times more for their rail yet the cheapest fares often appear to be available only tickets than those in France, Germany and Holland, all online. Should not the same fare structure apply to countries that do not have the costly and fragmented tickets purchased at train stations and other outlets as rail industry structure that is the legacy of the Tories’ applies to those bought online, ending the digital divide botched privatisation of our railway industry. The French, that is arising and increasing costs for older passengers, German and Dutch state railways are so successful that in particular? they are now bidding for and winning franchises to run Fourthly, what really annoys rail users is when they rail services in Britain. The Government are step by step make a genuine mistake or are forced to change their nationalising our rail services—it is just that it is not travel plans but find themselves treated as a common our nation. The profits will be helping to keep down criminal in front of other passengers and required to fares in France, Germany and Holland for their own get out their cheque book and cough up. Of course we domestic passengers. It is no wonder that fares are so have to protect revenue, but we also have to have some high under our broken system. common sense. Within the same period of the day, there Therefore, we would enforce a strict cap on fare rises, has to be greater flexibility to vary plans, even on but I believe that we need to go further and make fares pre-booked tickets. Trains are not airlines, and we do fairer. Because the system has lost all credibility, passengers not wish to go down the road of airline-style ticketing, feel ripped off and know that they are being ripped off. with no cheap walk-on option. They feel that the system does not work in their interests Finally, passengers told us— and that it is designed to catch them out. That is what I have been told by passengers as I have travelled across Alok Sharma (Reading West) (Con): Will the hon. the country over the past year. In addition to getting Lady give way? spiralling rail fares under control, here are five other ideas that passengers have said would make a real Maria Eagle: If the hon. Gentleman will just let me difference. First, why is there no single national definition get to the end of my points, I may give way to him. of peak time? Why are train companies allowed to set Finally, passengers told us that they understand that different rules so that passengers have to know precisely sometimes a track has to close, such as for essential which company they are travelling with or risk facing a work, to keep our railways safe, but when a rail replacement fine for travelling on the right ticket at the wrong time? service makes their journey longer, often adding considerable Why are the companies allowed to chop and change inconvenience, they want to know why their ticket costs peak time, stretching it out simply to hike their profits? the same. They can apply for a discount if their train is delayed, but not if it turns out not even to be a train and Mrs Villiers rose— ends up being a bus. Those are all ideas that we are looking at seriously, Dr Huppert rose— because for too long Governments have let the train companies get away with treating passengers in a way Maria Eagle: I have already given way to the right that would not be permitted in other industries. hon. Lady and to the hon. Gentleman, so I will make some progress in my speech. At the very least, rail Paul Maynard: Is the hon. Lady seriously arguing passengers would like tickets to state clearly the precise that peak hours on the west coast main line should be time restrictions that apply instead of simply being the same as those on Merseytravel lines? referred to some obscure part of a website that they do not have access to when purchasing a ticket. Maria Eagle: I am arguing that it is important to have a national understanding of peak hours, so that passengers Paul Maynard (Blackpool North and Cleveleys) (Con): are not clobbered and do not have to wait until what Will the hon. Lady give way? seems like a long time after normal peak hours in order to get on a train home. That would be an improvement, and it would clarify the system. People would not be Maria Eagle: I want to make a few points about what caught out as they frequently are, and they would not I have heard from passengers and will try to give way to be inconvenienced by having to wait for hours after the hon. Gentleman later. their meeting has finished in order to get on a train Secondly, passengers want a legal right to be offered home. the cheapest ticket for the journey they wish to make, If this Government are not going to stand up to the and they do not think that it is too much to ask that the train companies and take on vested interests, we will. cheapest fare must be clearly advertised. Should passengers Those are all ideas that we are looking at seriously. not be entitled to a refund if they have not been sold the cheapest ticket? Charlie Elphicke (Dover) (Con): Will the hon. Lady Under this Government, it is to become harder to give way? buy the cheapest ticket if plans to replace staff with machines and close all 675 category E station ticket Maria Eagle: No, I am going to make some progress. offices are implemented, yet that is what Ministers are considering, along with cutting the opening hours of Alok Sharma: On that point? 302 category D station ticket offices. All the evidence suggests that many people are not sold the cheapest Maria Eagle: I said that I am going to make some ticket when they buy a ticket online or from a machine. progress. 211 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 212
For too long, Governments have let the train companies Charlie Elphicke: Will the hon. Lady give way? get away with treating passengers in a way that would not be permitted in other industries. The previous Transport Maria Eagle: No. This is a shortened debate, and I Secretary described rail fares as eye-watering and rail want to give people time to make their speeches, so I services in Britain as a “rich man’s toy”, yet he failed to hope that the hon. Gentleman will forgive me if I make understand that the policies of his own Government are some progress. I have already spoken for a little longer making the situation worse. than I would have hoped, and that is partly because I have taken interventions. Alok Sharma: Will the hon. Lady give way? The Government need to be tougher not just on train companies, but on private bus operators. While train Maria Eagle: No. fares grab the headlines, most people’s experience of Next year’s fare increases are set to be even higher—not transport is in fact the local bus. For many, the bus is a 1% but 3% above inflation, with the same again in 2014. lifeline: for those without a car; for older people who no Unless the Government are willing to stand up to the longer drive or may never have done so; and for our train companies, and unless they are willing to take on young people, for whom the bus is their only way to get the vested interests and remove the right to add another around, especially if mum or dad do not have a car or increase of up to another 5% on top of this year’s work all hours. Yet quietly, and without much fanfare, so-called cap, commuters next year will face fare rises of throughout the country there is a catastrophe facing up to 13%, with another 13% the year after. That is bus services, with services being cut and fares rising. happening at a time when average incomes are plummeting. Again, that is thanks to decisions made by the Government. Over three years, some tickets will rise by almost one Their unwillingness to take on the vested interests in third as people’s real incomes fall by 7.5%, yet the our transport industry is holding back the reform that is Government seem completely out of touch with the required. impact of that on households. In the spending review, the Government have made Season tickets are heading rapidly towards £10,000 a three decisions that have hit bus services. First, they year on some routes into London once underground have cut councils’ local transport funding by 28%—and travel is included; families are now paying more on front-loaded it. that has meant the end of support for commuting costs than on the mortgage or rent; and many subsidised routes, and the end of ring-fencing has ticket price rises are outstripping wage increases several placed further pressure on councils—[Interruption.] times over, if people are fortunate to see a wage increase at all. That is the cost-of-living-crisis facing households Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo): Order. It throughout the country. Rent levels are going up; energy really is not necessary for the Secretary of State to keep and water bills are rising relentlessly; bank charges are shouting across the Dispatch Box. She is about to extortionate, as the cost of living means overdraft limits address the House, and I am sure that she expects are breached; and the cost of transport is rising. everybody to listen to her as well. While I am on my feet, increasingly in the Chamber Justine Greening: I am listening very carefully to the there is the behaviour whereby Members shout and heckle hon. Lady, who is raising what we all recognise as constantly when somebody else is speaking, and it is not important issues, but I want to double check something, really acceptable, so I hope that Members will stop it. because earlier in her speech she talked about getting more money into Government coffers through the RPI Maria Eagle: The end of ring-fencing has placed plus 5% flexible policy. Does she recognise that the further pressure on councils to divert funds from bus policy she is announcing today is a spending commitment? services in order to protect other front-line services such If so, how does she set it against what her shadow as Sure Start or social care budgets. Chancellor said yesterday, when he stated: The Government’s second decision has been to cut “I can say to you unequivocally we can make no commitments the funding available to bus companies in order to to reverse any of the Government’s tax rises or spending cuts”? reclaim some of their fuel costs, particularly in rural areas where otherwise they would simply not run the Maria Eagle: I do not know the spending commitment service. Thirdly, the Government have changed the formula to which the Secretary of State says I have referred, by which local authorities are reimbursed for the cost of because there is no spending commitment, and it is delivering the concessionary fares scheme for older complete nonsense for her to say that there is people, leaving councils with a funding shortfall that —[Interruption.] I understand her point, but if she has led to new restrictions on when passes can be used, wishes to try again I will give way. and to cuts in services. Justine Greening: Clearly, the money for that policy On the impact, the Campaign for Better Transport has to come from somewhere, and it is from the taxpayer. calculates that one fifth of supported bus services The hon. Lady obviously accepts that point, so the throughout England now face the axe; more than 1,000 policy is a spending commitment. Will she simply confirm bus services have already been lost; and many surviving the reality of that? routes have seen fares hiked significantly. The Public Transport Executive Group, which represents Maria Eagle: What I have said is that we would stop all the passenger transport executives, serving 11 million the operation of the flex system, as the Secretary of people throughout the metropolitan areas of England, State’s Labour predecessor did. We said before the calculates that as a result of the Government’s policies election that we would do so, but the Government have bus usage and patronage will decline by 20%, fares will reversed that policy, and commuters are being clobbered increase by 24% above the rate of inflation and the as a result. That is quite clear. added congestion alone will cost £68 million. 213 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 214
[Maria Eagle] Cumbria, Somerset and Devon, all of which have Tory leaders. Norfolk alone has calculated a £4.5 million Ministers fail to understand that, when they cut a bus shortfall in funding for the concessionary bus scheme. route, they cut an opportunity for young people to stay Up and down the country, pensioners are asking what is on in education, for people to travel further afield to the point of a free bus pass if there is no bus. The Prime take up employment, and for older people to remain Minister has failed to honour the spirit of his election connected to family and friends, with all the quality of pledge and has left many older people isolated. life and, even, mental health benefits that that can bring. That impacts not only on those who rely on their Dr Huppert: Will the hon. Lady give way? local bus services, but on our ability to reduce the deficit. When those who want to travel further to take Maria Eagle: I hope that the hon. Gentleman will up work find that they cannot afford to do so or that the forgive me, but I have given way to him once and I need bus service is no longer there, those opportunities simply to conclude. cannot be taken up. Young people who get the grades The issue is not only about the level of spending; we that they need to give them a chance in life and to find a need the proper regulation of bus services, not least good job will find that they simply cannot get to where when they rely on public subsidy. Having made these they want to go for work or to continue their education. cuts, the Government are powerless to influence bus The Government have said that those who are out of fares or to protect bus services because they are unwilling work should be willing to travel for up to 90 minutes to to stand up to the private bus operators and to take on take up a reasonable job offer or else lose their jobseeker’s the failure of bus deregulation outside London. In allowance. However, they are also taking away the only London, we have control over fare levels and we can affordable means for people to do so. That is a total regulate bus routes, or we could if we had a Mayor of failure of joined-up Government. London who was not choosing to let bus fares spiral out The Government are telling young people to stay on of control. It is time to consider what is the right way to in education post-16, yet they have not only axed the reverse bus deregulation across England. We should education maintenance allowance, but failed to protect give new powers to local communities to deliver bus the local bus services that enable young people to get to services in the way that best suits them. college. The scale of the cuts faced by councils is leading to restrictions on concessionary fare schemes Charlie Elphicke: Will the hon. Lady give way? for young people. Some councils are telling us that they may have to axe schemes altogether. It is no wonder that Maria Eagle: I am coming to a conclusion so I will the UK Youth Parliament chose to debate the need for not. cheaper fares and more accessible public transport for Whether it is the increase in rail and bus fares or the all young people during its annual sitting in this Chamber, rise in the cost of fuel, this Government are allowing following a vote by 65,000 people across the country. the costs of transport to spiral, adding to the cost-of-living The Association of Colleges has warned of a drop in pressures faced by families. The Government have failed further education enrolment and 60% of colleges have to tackle those increases not because of the deficit, but reported a drop in transport spending by their local because they are unwilling to stand up to vested interests. authority. On average, students travel between 9 and They are failing to stand up to the train companies, 35 miles to get to college, with 72% of them relying on letting train fares rocket by up to 11%. They are failing the bus to get there. That is another total failure of to stand up to the bus companies and to look at the best joined-up Government. The consequence will be added way to re-regulate the industry outside London. They pressures on family budgets or young people simply are failing to stand up to the banks and impose a bonus being unable to take up the opportunities that they need tax, adding to the high cost of fuel. As a result there are to reach their potential. That is a tragic waste for those rising transport costs, which are adding to the pressure young people. It is an idiotic policy because it will lead on households up and down the country.This Government to higher welfare costs and less tax take in the future. It are too out of touch to do anything about it. is a knee-jerk cut that will make it harder to reduce the deficit. 2.34 pm Cuts to school transport support for younger pupils The Secretary of State for Transport (Justine Greening): are adding to the burden on families, with parents I am delighted to be back at the Dispatch Box for the struggling to afford the fuel costs of the school run or second day in a row. I am also delighted to be debating having to juggle getting children to school with getting this important issue with the Opposition who have left to work. Figures obtained by the Campaign for Better the country with such debts, that the Government have Transport show that council spending cuts have led to little leeway to do what the hon. Member for Garston almost three quarters of local education authorities and Halewood (Maria Eagle) is proposing, which is to making cuts to school transport. add more debt on to a debt crisis. The loss of bus services has also had a devastating The Opposition talk about how they feel about train impact on older people. Despite the Prime Minister’s services and rail fares and I will respond to the particular election pledge on the free bus pass that we introduced points that the hon. Lady has made. However, many in government, he has axed £223 million from the people who are listening will find it galling that the day scheme in this year alone. That has an impact on the after the Leader of the Opposition made his relaunch viability of many bus services. Do not take my word for speech which talked about responsibility, his party is it; Tory-controlled Norfolk county council is leading instantly engaging in an Opposition debate that shows the campaign for fair funding from the Government for no responsibility whatever and is making more unfunded concessionary fares. It has support from councils in commitments that would only add to the debt levels 215 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 216 with which it has already burdened our country. The Maria Eagle: Given that the Secretary of State has Labour party left this country with the highest structural said that she is interested in reducing the costs of the budget deficit of any major economy in the world and railway industry, does she accept that she needs to with the highest deficit in our peacetime history. Those examine its structure? One of the big causes of excess debt levels are costing us £120 million a day. We would cost in the industry is the fragmentation that was left to much rather invest that money in our transport system us after the botched privatisation that the previous Tory and other public services. The debt levels that the Labour Government carried out. party left us are crippling the country and we have to tackle them first. As we regain control of our country’s Justine Greening: I think many people watching the finances, we are aware of how difficult the economic debate will wonder why the hon. Lady’s party did situation is for many people. That is why the Government nothing in 13 years. I will shortly publish a Command have taken tough decisions to restore credibility to this Paper setting out our approach to tackling a number of country’s economic policy. the broad challenges that exist. Mrs Anne Main (St Albans) (Con): I am pleased that Mr Tom Harris (Glasgow South) (Lab): I am the Secretary of State is drawing attention to the history disappointed that the Secretary of State is being so behind this matter. My constituents experience the highest churlish and saying that the last Government did nothing rail fares in the country at nearly 30p a mile. Those fares to reduce costs. Is she even aware that in the five-year did not get to that level overnight. In his speech on control period ending in 2009, they forced Network Monday, the Leader of the Opposition described Rail to improve its efficiency by 33%? Why has she not Hertfordshire as one of the cheaper places to live. That admitted that that was a major achievement, or that shows that the Opposition are completely out of touch further efficiency savings were included in the next with my constituents. control period ending in 2014?
Justine Greening: The Opposition are out of touch. Justine Greening: I do not think there is any way in The speech largely failed to talk about how we can which the hon. Gentleman can dress up the outcome of tackle the underlying problem in the rail industry, which the McNulty report, which set out very clearly just how is the cost. The hon. Member for Garston and Halewood expensive our railway industry is compared with those touched on that point and I will come to it later. The in mainland Europe. industry was passed over to this Government with a high cost. I want to tackle that cost, but the previous I understand that rail fares are a large part of household Government did nothing to tackle it in 13 years. One of expenditure for many people, particularly commuters, the most important things that the Government and I who often travel significant distances to go to work and have to do is to get to grips with the high cost of the earn a living. Of course, the taxpayer subsidises the rail railway industry. That must be part and parcel of the industry alongside rail fares, and thanks to difficult Government’s overall approach to getting a grip on our decisions that the Government took in the emergency public finances. Budget and the spending review, the Chancellor was able to announce in the autumn statement that we At the heart of the Government’s clear determination would fund a reduction in the planned increases in fares to do that is giving ourselves the best possible chance of so that regulated fares would increase by RPI plus 1%. keeping interest rates as low as possible for as long as That reduction is helping millions of people who use possible to help families and businesses with loans and our trains. mortgages. It is not just the taxpayer who is paying through the nose for debt. We must keep interest rates Mr Edward Leigh (Gainsborough) (Con): Will my as low as possible for people across this country who right hon. Friend say something about rural fares? The rely on that for their household finances to make sense. anytime weekly return to London from Market Rasen, Let us be clear: if we had taken the advice of the which is not in the frozen north, is £150, and the average Opposition to spend more and borrow more, which is weekly wage in Market Rasen is £561. That means that what they have been talking about in this debate, we people are paying 26% of their weekly salary just to get would be talking not about the cost of rail and bus to London and back. That is not acceptable, and something fares, but about an International Monetary Fund bail-out must be done. We must have less emphasis on the to keep our country afloat, and we would be living in a high-speed rail link and all those wonderful projects country facing bond yields and interest rates like those and more emphasis on helping ordinary people in rural of European countries such as Greece. That is the areas. situation that the Opposition want to swap for. Kwasi Kwarteng (Spelthorne) (Con): Does my right Justine Greening: My hon. Friend is right to set out hon. Friend have any idea why the perennial problem of the very difficult balance that we have to strike. On one rail costs was not tackled in 13 years under Labour and hand we have to ensure that we keep rail fares affordable, why she and her Department have had to deal with it? and I am determined to do what I can to do that in spite of the fiscal straitjacket within which the Government Justine Greening: My personal view is that there were are having to operate. On the other hand, we have to two key reasons—a lack of ability to tackle the problem, ensure that we can balance investment in the short because Labour simply did not understand how to do term. I am sure that many Members were delighted to so, and a lack of willingness. Tackling the problems see Bombardier agree the contract with Southern for more means that we need to have some difficult discussions carriages, and we are putting unprecedented investment about the work force, and as we saw in the vote that has into the existing railway lines. We have to strike a just taken place in the House, the Labour party shows balance between working out who pays for the hard no willingness ever to stand up to its party pay leaders, work that is going on today and ensuring that we have a the unions. railway network that is fit for service in the future. 217 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 218
[Justine Greening] I find it incredibly frustrating and galling, as I think many other people do, to hear on one day the leader of I know that some passengers on particular routes the Labour party—the party that left this country in a have faced higher increases than others, and I listened worse financial state than any other Government ever to what the hon. Member for Garston and Halewood have—profess that we must be responsible, even though said about the 5% flex in rail fares. I am bound to point Labour was irresponsible and did not have the custodian out, however, that it was the last Labour Government values that it needed in looking after our public finances, who introduced that flex in 2004. then the day after, to hear Labour talk about more spending and more debt in the middle of a debt crisis. Maria Eagle: I accept that it was introduced by the The very people who let this country down the most Labour Government, but it was then stopped by the and left our public finances in their worst state ever are Labour Government and reintroduced by the current now the ones talking about responsibility. Most people Government. outside will see that for exactly what it is—absolute political gibberish. Andrew Jones (Harrogate and Knaresborough) (Con): It was stopped for one year. Ms Buck: Will the Secretary of State give way? Maria Eagle: No, permanently. Justine Greening: No, I am going to make some more Justine Greening: I am pleased that the hon. Lady has progress now. made that intervention, because I have with me an exact I ask the hon. Member for Garston and Halewood, extract from the franchise agreement that the last Labour or perhaps the shadow Minister who winds up the Transport Secretary put in place. I shall quote from it, debate, to come clean and talk about how their spending to remove any uncertainty, and then maybe the hon. commitment would be funded. If the hon. Lady wants Lady would like to intervene on me again. It states: to go against what the shadow Chancellor is saying “With effect from 1 January 2010, Schedule 5 of the Franchise about there being no more spending, she must accept Agreement will be amended as set out in the Appendix to this that her suggestion represents a spending commitment. notice.” It is time to talk about how she would fund it, otherwise That is the change that she has talked about. However, she has to accept that it would lead to more debt at a it continues: time when we are right in the middle of a debt crisis. “On and from 1 January 2011, the amendment to the Franchise There is no point in the Leader of the Opposition Agreement set out in this notice of amendment shall be reversed.” promoting responsibility when his own party continues Does she want to intervene to correct the record? to show absolutely none. The hon. Lady also has to admit that the flexibility Maria Eagle: I am very happy to intervene. Of course that she wants to take away from train operating companies I will not contradict what the legal agreement states, but has meant some passengers benefiting from lower increases the last Labour Transport Secretary made it perfectly or decreases. For instance, passengers on the Birmingham clear to the Transport Select Committee in 2009, in oral to London route via High Wycombe have seen their and written evidence, that the policy was to continue. It annual season ticket price reduced by 7%, and the had not been negotiated, but that is different from the Gatwick to Bournemouth saver return has been reduced policy having been changed. Negotiations go on all the by 28%. She is proposing to raise the cost of those time in government, as the Secretary of State will be passengers’ travel. Presumably she is quite happy to finding out. I do not think that quotation makes the confirm that—she can intervene if she wants. point that she thinks it does. The bottom line is that for all the bluster that we Justine Greening: I really suggest that the hon. Lady heard from the hon. Lady, she would abandon the stops digging the last Labour Transport Secretary into long-term investment in capacity improvements that a deeper hole than he is already in. The contract is depends on continued funding from both the taxpayer absolutely clear-cut, stating categorically in black and and the fare payer. She talks about 11% fare increases, white that the flexibility levels introduced by her party’s but the last Government also allowed such increases. It Government would be reintroduced the year after their is worth reminding ourselves of their record on rail abolition. fares and value for money. The Labour-led Transport Committee in the last Parliament stated: Mr Tom Harris: Irrespective of what the legal agreement “Neither passengers nor tax payers are getting value for their was, does the Transport Secretary personally believe money…The value for money of rail travel has deteriorated by that it would have been a good idea to renegotiate a most yardsticks over the past decade.” further period for which the flex would not have been in I have listened carefully to the comments of the hon. force? Member for Garston and Halewood, and I hope that we both accept that the real driver of rising costs for Justine Greening: I do not, because I believe that the fare payers and taxpayers is the inefficiency of the rail train operating companies need flexibility, so I support system that we inherited from the Opposition. She my predecessor’s decision. If I did agree with negotiating mentioned other European railways, and Sir Roy McNulty’s a further period, it would represent a spending commitment. independent review of our railway network found that I agree with the shadow Chancellor that now is not the the system that we inherited from the previous Government time to make any further spending commitments, even is 40% less efficient than those of our best European if the hon. Member for Garston and Halewood does comparators. Taxpayers and fare payers must shoulder not. We can see the absolute disarray that the Labour that huge cost burden because of the previous Government’s party is now in. failure to reform our railways. 219 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 220
Unless we are prepared to get to grips with the opportunity to demonstrate whether they are serious underlying causes of the inefficiencies, we will never about reducing costs to passengers or whether their make the progress that I am so passionate about achieving. policy review is limited to tinkering at the edges with That means getting different parts of the industry to uncosted commitments drawn up on the back of an work more effectively together, as we are doing through envelope. the rail delivery group, which has been set up, as Roy McNulty proposed. It means aligning incentives better Mrs Main: I have written to the Secretary of State and increasing transparency—I absolutely agree with about Network Rail, which has fundamentally failed that. However, it also means tackling some of the many of the train operators—67% of all delays and work-force issues, which, we must all accept, have driven stoppages are to do with Network Rail. It is time to up costs. When we reach those difficult discussions in have a debate about it. Network Rail, which is with the the coming weeks, months and years to tackle rail Office of Rail Regulation now, has been deeply inefficient industry costs that are too high, I hope that the Labour in the amount of money that it costs the taxpayer. party will step up to the plate and join us in making the necessary decisions to bring rail costs down for the Justine Greening: That is what I mean when I talk longer term and relieve the fare rise pressures that we about the need to align financial incentives better so have experienced year after year. that people are pulling in the right direction and so that, when performance is not good enough, it costs the Kelvin Hopkins (Luton North) (Lab): The Secretary people who cause the inefficiency in the first place. of State rightly draws attention to the difference in cost between continental railways and ours. The only major I want to move on to the second aspect of the comments difference between them and us is that theirs are publicly of the hon. Member for Garston and Halewood —bus owned and integrated and ours are privately owned and fares. Although every sector and Department have had fragmented. to play their part in deficit reduction, the Labour party still does not accept that, even after yesterday’s speech Justine Greening: That is an over-simplification. However, by the Leader of the Opposition. Nevertheless, we are the hon. Gentleman is right to point out that Sir Roy determined that, even in the difficult economic conditions McNulty identified in his report a need for the different that we face, buses will continue to receive their fair parts of the rail industry to work together much better. share of funding. Yes, it is constrained by the terrible Network Rail is already doing that with many of the legacy that the Labour party left us, but we are determined train operating companies. That was to be a key way of to encourage more people on to buses and to make bus driving costs down—not through worsening services travel more attractive. That is why we set out in a but by running the system better in the first place. spending review our commitment to continuing our financial subsidy of bus operators. The bus service Stephen Hammond: If we are comparing privatised or operators grant remains untouched for this financial denationalised and nationalised railways, perhaps the year, with savings to be introduced only from April, Secretary of State would like to reflect on the point of alongside others that we have had to make across history that, in the last 15 years of British Rail, fares Government as part of tackling the deficit that the rose faster than in 15 years of denationalised railways. Labour party left us.
Justine Greening: As ever, my hon. Friend, for whom Ms Buck: Does the Secretary of State therefore think I have huge respect and who is obviously an expert in that the Mayor of London was wrong to raise a single the House on the subject, makes an incredibly powerful bus fare by 50% since 2009? point. It is worth complementing that with the point that we also experienced unprecedented increases in Justine Greening: Many Londoners will not forget passenger demand since privatisation. that the current Labour candidate for Mayor increased bus fares in 2004 by a huge amount. I simply do not Julie Hilling (Bolton West) (Lab): When the Secretary accept that his proposals for London will mean anything of States talks about reducing costs in the industry and other than catastrophically undermining the essential staff numbers, does she mean cutting the salaries of investment, on which so many Londoners count, in the people who work in ticket offices on basic wages of transport system. It is financial jiggery-pokery, and it £16,000 or £17,000, or of train dispatchers, who are on does not add up. I believe that Londoners will see right basic wages of £14,000—not big, but low salaries? Is through it in May. she saying that those people should have their salaries We must tackle the deficit, but we continue to ensure reduced? that funding goes into our bus services. Indeed, we spoke to the industry as part of the spending review Justine Greening: I do not think that I have talked about how we could get more out of the bus service about reducing salaries. Many people might say that a operators grant. After difficult spending decisions, the train driver on a salary of £40,000 or more had a industry said that it felt able to absorb the reduction well-paid job compared with them. without raising fares or cutting services. Nevertheless, Clearly, we need to address important issues that we are protecting the concessionary bus travel scheme. relate to the costs of the railway industry. That is why we will publish the rail Command Paper early this year Lilian Greenwood (Nottingham South) (Lab): I can to set out how to meet the challenge. That is the real assume only that the Secretary of State is out of date, prize. The long-term way of reducing pressure for relentless because the Confederation of Passenger Transport UK fare rises is by tackling the underlying driver: the industry’s told me that, although it initially felt that it could cost base. As I said, that will also give the Opposition an absorb the 20% cut in the bus service operators grant, 221 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 222
[Lilian Greenwood] Government, I wish to make one brief point first. As an Opposition Member, she was a member of the shadow the combination of that and the cuts to concessionary Treasury team and, up until November 2007, the travel repayment and local transport was a perfect Conservative party’s policy was to support every penny storm. of spending made by the Labour Government. If she is claiming that the deficit that the Government inherited Justine Greening: The hon. Lady should apologise to was created in the last 18 months of the Labour that organisation more than anyone else because her Government, that is something that the House would Government left the country’s finances in a state that like to debate. She cannot pour scorn on the spending means that we have to make very difficult decisions. of that Government when she sat on the Opposition There is not a day when I do not come into the office Front Bench and supported every penny. That is double wishing that the state of the public finances that the standards. The Secretary of State shakes her head, and Labour party handed us was better. The reality that we I am more than happy to give way if she wants to must all, apparently apart from Labour Members, face explain why she did not tell the then shadow Chancellor is that we have got to tackle that problem. That means that he should not support Labour’s spending plans. making some difficult decisions. The Labour party is in complete disarray. Justine Greening: Everybody in Britain knows exactly which party got the country into the financial mess. It is Several hon. Members rose— precisely why Labour Members are on the Opposition Benches now: it was them. Justine Greening: Until the Opposition speak with any sort of single voice, it is pointless taking further Mr Harris: That says quite a lot about the Secretary interventions. Most hon. Members would accept that I of State’s reluctance to accept her own culpability for have taken an awful lot and it is time for constituency supporting the spending plans of the previous Labour Members of Parliament to have their say on behalf of Government. their communities. I do not believe that the railway industry is broken, or We are committed to investing in bus travel. In the a basket case. I was proud to serve as a railway Minister past two months, we have also announced nearly in the last Labour Government, and I understand the £100 million of additional investment in buses as part successes that have grown from 13 years of Labour of the growth review. governance of the railway industry. We have more people We are committed to investing in the transport travelling on the railways than at any time in their infrastructure—not only HS2, as we announced yesterday. history outside of wartime. We have more services every We are putting unprecedented investment into rail working day than ever before, and punctuality is at an infrastructure. Even in these tough times, the Government all-time high. Those were achievements that this are taking action to help people with the rising cost of Government have managed to continue—and I hope living at the same time as dealing with the massive that that continues—but fares are a fundamental weakness. budget deficit that the Labour Government left us. That They are the crucial interface between the travelling is why we are helping keep interest rates low for families public and the railways and—irrespective of the public and businesses, freezing council tax for the second year subsidy to the railways—if we do not make rail travel running, cancelling this month’s fuel duty increase on affordable for ordinary people, it will not be surprising top of last year’s fuel duty cut. It is why we are funding if they feel that the railways are letting them down. a reduction in the planned increase in regulated rail The previous Secretary of State for Transport, the fares and continuing our financial subsidy of bus operators right hon. Member for Runnymede and Weybridge while implementing a massive programme of investment (Mr Hammond), famously described the railways as a in our transport infrastructure, not just for passengers “rich man’s toy”. A few weeks ago, I challenged the today and in the next 10 years, but for those in the Secretary of State in the Transport Committee about decades to come. Our determination to reduce the cost whether she agreed with that assessment and, of railways in the long term to fare payers and taxpayers understandably, she did not want to commit herself. She means that we will introduce proposals for substantial told the Transport Committee that she wanted to see reform in the rail Command Paper early this year. the balance between the taxpayer and the fare payer That is the significant action that we are taking. The move towards the latter. She also said that in the long Labour party talks about responsibility at the top, but term she wanted the fare payer to pay less. Well, she can in reality that means difficult decisions. We are making have one or she can have the other, but she cannot have them, and that stands in stark contrast to the Labour both. It is clear that unless the taxpayers’ contribution party’s tinkering, unfunded and, in so many cases, is increased, fares will not come down. The Secretary of unworkable proposals. State refused to answer that point at the time.
Several hon. Members rose— Paul Maynard: The hon. Gentleman raises the interesting question of whether the burden can be switched to the Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo): Order. I fare-paying passenger at the same time as reducing have to inform hon. Members that a time limit of six fares. Does he agree that if we do what McNulty minutes has been placed on Back-Bench contributions. recommends and try to reduce the overall cost base of the railways, that conundrum could be solved? 3pm Mr Harris: I am sure that the hon. Gentleman, who Mr Tom Harris (Glasgow South) (Lab): Since the also sits on the Transport Committee, is as much of an Secretary of State spent some time talking not about rail expert as any other Member, and I will agree to consider fares but about the economic legacy of the last Labour his comments. 223 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 224
The Prime Minister was wrong today and failed to 3.8 pm give the facts about the policy of the last Labour Stephen Hammond (Wimbledon) (Con): I direct the Government and the policy of this Government. Even House to my entry in the register. It is a great pleasure if it was for only one year, Lord Adonis managed to to follow the hon. Member for Glasgow South (Mr Harris), challenge the rail industry on the so-called basket of who is the joint chair of the rail group and was of fares and whether the RPI plus 1% policy should apply course a distinguished rail Minister. to individual fares or to a basket of fares. He got a lot of support on both sides of the House for insisting—against The motion makes four contentions. First, it is critical the arguments of his own officials and the resistance of of the scale of fare increases overall. Secondly, it contends the industry—that that policy should apply only to that the scale of rail fare increase has added individual fares. As we know, if it is applied to a basket disproportionally to the increase in the cost of living for of fares, some can go up by 6%, instead of 1%. Whether us all. Thirdly, it says that the flex mechanism should be or not that was a temporary agreement for one year, stopped, and fourthly that the profits of the rail companies surely when a new franchise is let the Minister has a are too high. I wonder whether, in my short contribution, responsibility to challenge the industry and set such an we might look at some of the facts rather than the arrangement in stone at the very start. hyperbole. When the railways were first privatised, the policy—it First, as the hon. Gentleman pointed out, there can was then RPI minus 1%—was applied to a basket of fares, be no discussion of rail fares without accepting that as agreed with Ministers. That was what Lord Adonis there is always a balance between what is funded by the succeeded in challenging, but sadly only for one year. taxpayer and what is funded by the fare payer. Successive Will the Secretary of State give a commitment that, in Governments since 1945 have chosen to subsidise both future new franchises, the Adonis approach will be the operating and the capital costs of rail expenditure, applied to fares to protect fare payers and to ensure that so there has been an implicit subsidy of fares from the train operating companies take money out of their own taxpayer. That equation has been long recognised. It pockets, rather than the pockets of fare-paying passengers? was Lord Adonis who, in the later years of the Labour Government, decided that the balance had swung too Mrs Villiers: Will the hon. Gentleman give way? far from taxpayer support and needed to swing back to the fare payer. Therefore, if we want to start talking Mr Harris: I only have six minutes and the Minister about why rail fares are increasing and taxpayer subsidies will have plenty of time to wind up at the end of the are decreasing, let us all be absolutely clear. History debate. shows that the change in the slant of that equation I hope that the Secretary of State will not take the happened post 2004, and certainly accelerated from same path as has been followed in Scotland, where the 2006, so that the £10.5 billion overall operating costs of SNP Government—for the first time since the 1960s the industry are now split, with 62% coming from the and Beeching—are threatening to close stations, including fare payer and 38% from the taxpayer. The bulk of that Kennishead in my constituency, even as passenger numbers change happened between 2005 and 2010. are increasing there and throughout the network. That Secondly, when it comes to the system of regulated is a disgraceful approach for any so-called progressive and non-regulated fares, it was the last Government Government to take, and I hope that the Secretary of who introduced the policy of RPI plus 1, which is why State will make a commitment that she will not close regulated fares are increasing this year by RPI plus 1. stations or lines in the rest of the country. Are Opposition Front Benchers saying that they have It is too easy to criticise rail services and forget some changed their attitude towards regulated and non-regulated of the major advances that have been made since fares? Are they saying that they will not operate RPI privatisation, but at the crucial interface between train plus 1 in future? The motion is of course stoically silent and customer, there is a growing crisis of affordability—on about that. Let us look at the relative contribution of the personal level, rather than the national taxpayer level. different sectors to the increase in our cost of living. The motion’s claim does not bear too much examination, Charlie Elphicke: The hon. Gentleman says that the for it is not rail or bus fare increases that are contributing Adonis policy was for one year only. Was that not an most to our increased cost of living. The World Bank election year? I am sure that most people would agree global food index has gone up 19% over the last year, that that is the kind of cynicism that used to characterise while Green Flag says that the costs of motoring and the previous Government and it is a good thing that we car insurance are up 21%. The average fare increase this have got rid of that. year—I accept that it is an average; we will come to that point in a moment—is 5.9%, so the motion fails when it Mr Harris: Most fare-paying passengers would not says that there is a disproportionate increase from transport. agree that it is a good thing that that policy was got rid As my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State has of, because they are paying more as a result. Perhaps the already pointed out, no one wants to see excessive price hon. Gentleman represents constituents who are very increases. Also, I accept that we are talking about an wealthy and can afford to pay unlimited increases in average and that some people have seen rather larger fares. If he is claiming that it was a cynical manoeuvre fare increases, but that is also the point about flex, is it by Lord Adonis, he has clearly never met him. It was not? Flex is a weighted average increase—a device, officials who recommended that the agreement should introduced by the last Labour Government and suspended be for one year. Is the hon. Gentleman really saying that for one year only, to manage demand. If the Labour a Secretary of State should ignore legal advice? That is Opposition are going to get rid of flex, they have to say disgraceful and completely misrepresents what the then whether the shadow Secretary of State will write to Secretary of State and Labour Government were doing every commuter whose rail fare increase was less than for rail passengers. the average and tell them why she is doing it. Is she going 225 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 226
[Stephen Hammond] Mr Robert Buckland (South Swindon) (Con): Does the hon. Gentleman not agree, however, that the terms to put in place another tool or mechanism to manage of reference for the previous Great Western franchise demand? Let us not forget that although she talked put the service at the wrong stage, in effect applying a about demand in peak hours, rail markets, like many lower common denominator and thereby regressing the other markets, are localised markets around cities or in service? The new franchise needs to start from the rural areas. That is why the last, Labour Government current level and quality of service, so that we can agreed and negotiated differing peak hours with the rail encourage value for money and progress, instead of the companies, to ensure that localised demand could be rather problematic issues that we have encountered with managed over peak and “shoulder” hours. If she is First Great Western in recent years. going to get rid of flex, she has to stand up and say how she will accept that challenge and demand. Owen Smith: I am grateful for that intervention, which Finally, there is a lot of talk about the huge profits gives me the opportunity to say that it was, of course, earned by the rail companies, but their operating profit the Labour Government who managed that franchise, margin has been absolutely constant over the last 10 years, such that we called in Great Western and demanded the at approximately 3%. Let us look at some of the other changes that it made and demanded that it adopt special companies around—say, that mouthpiece of the Labour measures. party, the Daily Mirror, whose operating profit margin is 16%. It is absolutely clear—it is also implicit in RPI Mrs Villiers: The Labour Government did make some plus 3—that any extra contribution will go back into attempt to fix the problems, but they created them, the rail industry, not the profits of the rail companies. because they let the franchise in the first place. Today’s motion is interesting, but it fails the test of fact. That is why I hope the House will reject it. Owen Smith: In truth, the problems we have with the railways are in large measure precisely due to the 3.14 pm fragmentation that resulted from the botched privatisation Owen Smith (Pontypridd) (Lab): Transport infrastructure of our rail industry. That is the reality. is one of the most important and pressing aspects of The way we have debated this issue today—in particular, economic renewal. It is one of the keys to seeing the real the way the Secretary of State took the opportunity, improvements in our economy, the growth in jobs and uncharacteristically perhaps, to make a lot of heavy-handed the economic development that we all need. That is party political points—does not serve our constituents perhaps particularly true in some of the, as it were, and rail travellers well. This is too important an economic post-industrial parts of Britain, such as my constituency issue, as she will know from her time on the Treasury in the south Wales valleys. Rail there has always enormously Bench, for us to play knockabout politics with it. The important. Indeed, it is perhaps more important right key issue that the Opposition are raising today is now than during any period in the last century, and affordability. Very simply, given that it is so important arguably since the 19th century. for many of our constituents that they are able to take That is why I welcome the Government’s infrastructure advantage of the improved, more efficient and cleaner investment decisions. I welcome the announcement about train services that are now available, those services must electrification of the Great Western line between London be affordable. That is why we are concerned about the and Cardiff, although I deplore the fact that the large fare increases in the recent round, although Arriva Government have not recognised the excellent business Trains Wales has commendably kept down a lot of its case for going as far as Swansea. I also welcome the fares across parts of my patch to RPI plus 1. On the decision to take forward, in conjunction with the National Great Western line, however, there has been a worrying Assembly Government, a business case to consider increase of 10% in the cost of travelling between Cardiff electrification of the valleys and the creation there of a and London, as my hon. Friend the Member for Garston so-called metro system. The reason that is so important and Halewood (Maria Eagle) said. That will make is that travel to work in urban metropolitan centres such businesses and commuters think hard about whether as Cardiff from their hinterlands is the key to the they can continue to travel on that vital line for commerce economic regeneration of places such as Pontypridd, and commuting. the seat I represent. I urge the Minister to consider that It is important that the public understand that this business case carefully when it comes forward and to Government took a decision to repeal the ban on look on it favourably, because doing so would be a flexing fares that the Labour Government put in place. genuinely bold and imaginative step, and a key to That measure was introduced as a result of the economically change. straitened times in which we found ourselves in 2009. Secondly, I agree with my hon. Friend the Member Lord Adonis made that decision to try to address the for Glasgow South (Mr Harris), the former Transport issue of affordability, and it is party political point Minister, that we cannot say that all is ill with our scoring to suggest that the fact it was negotiated as a railways right now. They are, without a doubt, more legal contract for one year was indicative of a longer-term efficient, cleaner and less dangerous than they were intention. There is no read-across in that respect, and before the Labour Government. It is Labour investment the Secretary of State would do well to take Lord and Labour management of the rail system that led to Adonis at his word when he put it in writing to the those changes, in particular the way we effectively negotiated Select Committee that he intended to continue the franchises, which—not always, but in the main—led to practice while we remained in economic difficulty. investment and improvement. Indeed, I commend the What has changed since 2009? People are harder up current Government for taking forward that infrastructure than they were. Things have not got easier for my legacy. constituents or for those of the Secretary of State; they 227 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 228 have got harder. That is why the Government should Moving on, may I point out that some of the key have thought long and hard about how they could stations on the west coast main line, such as Preston justify taking a decision that might be in the interests of and Wigan, are in desperate need of serious capital the train operators but is not in the interests of the investment? For many years, they have been given a lick travelling public. That was fundamentally the wrong of paint and nothing more. I urge the Secretary of State decision for them to take. to ensure that whoever operates that line focuses on I welcome the common sense that we have heard such investment. We also need to be clear about how from my hon. Friend the Member for Garston and that investment will be paid for. We cannot keep asking Halewood today about the need for a cross-party review the taxpayer to put their hand in their pocket; we must of our rail services. The fares are too complicated, and accept that if we want stations in the north-west and the system is too complicated. The flexing at peak times elsewhere in the UK that we can be proud of, some of across different parts of the country is also too complicated. the cost must fall on the travelling public. Many people end up paying higher fares than they Many of us will have received letters and postcards ought to, because the system is engineered in such a way about the increase in rail fares, and in the current that they cannot access the cheapest fares. We have seen climate we must do everything possible to ease the this with the energy companies as well. They rig the stresses on people’s living expenses. They face not only market in their favour by making it utterly impenetrable higher rail fares but higher household fuel bills, for to ordinary people, and it is the same on the railways. example. The Government are not insensitive to that, My hon. Friend is absolutely right to say that we must and we need to recognise that they are doing everything look into those issues, and at the underpinning question in their power to keep those costs to a minimum. In of the nature of the structure—the ownership principles—of launching such large-scale, ambitious projects, my right the railway industry. We cannot simply say that there is hon. Friend the Secretary of State is to be congratulated no alternative, and we cannot get into a tawdry, tedious on doing everything that she can to keep price increases knockabout over whether this or that issue represents a down to RPI plus 1%. That is significantly less than the spending commitment. That is just point scoring, and increase of RPI plus 3% that was expected before the we need a much more fundamental discussion on the autumn statement, which should be welcomed. We are a nature of our rail services. We need a Government who railway nation, but if we want railways that we can be are going to act in the interests of the people, not just proud of, we need to be prepared to pay for them. The those of their people. taxpayer does not have a limitless cheque book.
3.23 pm 3.27 pm Mark Menzies (Fylde) (Con): May I start by welcoming Tom Blenkinsop (Middlesbrough South and East the biggest rail investment programme that the country Cleveland) (Lab): I want first to talk about how the has seen? It was clear to all of us who were in the Government have increased fares with no added visible Chamber yesterday that the Secretary of State has benefit to Teesside and the rail users of the north-east. shown great leadership and vision in taking these difficult The Secretary of State has mentioned unprecedented decisions on the future of the railway network. There is funds being put into rail lines, but sadly, that has not cross-party consensus on High Speed 2, but that was happened on Teesside. As the hon. Member for Fylde the kind of difficult decision that Governments can (Mark Menzies) said, the announcement in the Chancellor’s sometimes be tempted to kick into the long grass. I autumn statement that the trans-Pennine route from therefore welcome the fact that this Government have Manchester to Leeds and York would be electrified has decided to press ahead with the project with such vigour. been greeted with enthusiasm in the north. However, Such capital projects have to be paid for, however, and that enthusiasm has been tempered with concern that they cannot always be paid for solely from the public the move could risk fragmenting the highly successful purse. Unfortunately, we also have to be prepared to ask trans-Pennine network. The plans for partial electrification the travelling public to make a contribution. have opened a can of worms, as they could leave many The electrification of the triangle of routes between major towns and cities of the north worse off than they Manchester, Preston and Liverpool represents a great were before. step forward for the north of England, Mr Deputy The TransPennine Express franchise covers a network Speaker. I know that you, too, care passionately about of routes across the north and into Scotland, and the railways, because you are a north-west MP. That currently uses an all-diesel fleet. With Manchester as its investment will no doubt have substantial benefits for hub, the TPE network serves Manchester airport, Liverpool, businesses in the north-west, and I am sure that the Blackpool, Barrow, Windermere, Glasgow and Edinburgh whole House will welcome it. on the west side. Liverpool and Blackpool are to be For the foreseeable future, the west coast main line electrified under previously announced plans, leaving will be the main artery connecting the north-west to Carnforth, Barrow, Oxenholme and Windermere unwired. London, and, as I know the Secretary of State is aware, To the east from Manchester, the TPE operates to the franchise is now up for renewal. May I take this Leeds, Hull, York, Scarborough, Middlesbrough and opportunity to urge her, when she is looking into the Newcastle. The core route between Manchester and franchise, to take into account not only the quality of Leeds is used by all the TPE’s eastbound services, with a the bids but the proposed fare structures? Will she pattern of four trains an hour. The Hull route diverges ensure that low-cost, flexible fares remain available for east of Leeds, while the Scarborough line branches off the people who do not always have the luxury of being at York, and the Middlesbrough trains leave the electrified able to book many days in advance? We must ensure east coast main line at Northallerton. The busy section that people on low incomes who have to travel at short between Manchester and Leeds is ideal for electrification notice are not priced off the railways. with lots of trains operating over a steeply graded route. 229 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 230
[Tom Blenkinsop] providing no infrastructure support. That has been backed up by the civil engineering association in my The northern hub strategy would see the core route’s region, which recently met me and reiterated that argument. frequency increased from four to six trains an hour, with many services running west from Stalybridge into Several hon. Members rose— Manchester Victoria. The new Ordsall curve will, when completed, allow Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Lindsay Hoyle): Order. I trains to continue to Piccadilly and the airport, while now have to announce the result of the deferred Division Liverpool services would head west over Chat Moss, on the question of the carry-over for the Local Government but what happens to the routes such as Hull, Scarborough Finance Bill. The Ayes were 329, the Noes were 207, so and Middlesbrough to the east and Barrow and the Ayes have it. Windermere to the west, which are not currently down [The Division list is published at the end of today’s to be electrified? I have already asked parliamentary debates.] questions about the future prospects of the service to Manchester airport, expressing the concern that Teesside could be left to languish on a “non-electrified branch 3.32 pm line”. Rail campaigners I know in Cumbria have expressed Dr Julian Huppert (Cambridge) (LD): Rail fares in worries about Barrow trains terminating at Lancaster this country are far too high. Under the last Labour and about Windermere becoming a self-contained branch. Government we saw year after year of fare rises, and we The route in my area has massively increased in now have one of the most expensive railways in the popularity, largely due to the huge benefits brought by world. From 1997, 13 years of Labour government saw the previous Cleveland Labour authority, which invested rail fares going up by 66% in cash terms. I welcome, heavily in the local rail line in 1993 and formed new however, some of the shadow Secretary of State’s comments train stations such as Yarm. about people wanting simple ticketing, as they want to It is ironic, given the recent Government announcement understand what is going on. I welcome that, although after fantastic campaigning by my hon. Friend the it is somewhat belated. I and many others have been Member for Sedgefield (Phil Wilson) for the delivery of arguing for that for many years. I hope we can go the Hitachi plant at Sedgefied, that dual-use—both further; it is a shame that it did not happen during those diesel and electrified—trains made by Hitachi will be 13 years. built in an area that would not benefit from those Most recently, thanks to pressure from the Liberal self-same carriages. Network Rail has been asked by the Democrats—both inside government, such as the Under- Department for Transport to look at the business case Secretary of State for Transport, my hon. Friend the for electrifying the line to Middlesbrough, Scarborough Member for Lewes (Norman Baker) and outside it—and and Hull, and I believe an announcement is expected in arguments won by a new Secretary of State and Minister July. for the railways, fares have risen by 1% above inflation All this comes down to basic economic arguments this year rather than the planned 3%. I welcome that, when we have a Government who are evacuating the and I hope it will not revert to 3% in future years. public sector and public sector spending and trying to We in the Liberal Democrats believe that fares should implement regionalised pay and to change local business fall in real terms rather than rise even further above rates supposedly to attract private investment. Industry, inflation, as happened year on year under Labour. As however, particularly that using freight in my area, has the shadow Secretary of State confirmed today, Labour no market certainty about how this Government are policy is for fares to go up by more than inflation every developing their transport plans. What makes me and year. That is something that the British public should be people in my area angry is that at a time when concerned about; they have heard it from the shadow manufacturing is in the doldrums, with statistics showing Secretary of State today. The Conservatives have also a potential recession, and despite the fact that the argued for similar increases. We need to reduce the fares north-east is bucking the trend through its chemical and to understand how we can reduce them, we first industry, local steel industry and the agricultural industries need to look at how fares have become so high. in the region, we are nevertheless not getting any of the infrastructure benefits of the positive measures coming Justin Tomlinson (North Swindon) (Con): With pressure from industry and local workers in my region. to raise revenue to offset fare rises and reduce overcrowding, The Secretary of State said that the previous Government why not give greater freedoms to train conductors to had left a terrible legacy and that this Government’s sell spare capacity in first-class carriages during peak fiscal measures were amending that position. I beg to times? differ. The reason why we are able to lend at better rates at the moment has absolutely nothing to do with the Dr Huppert: I would have to look at the details, but it fiscal measures of this Chancellor—the Secretary of is an interesting idea that is worth looking at. There is State knows this—as it is really due to quantitative also the question of how much spare first-class capacity easing and Bank of England policy since 2008. That there should be so that potentially everybody could can be measured by the fact that foreign market purchasing afford to use it. I am sure that the responsible Minister of our bond yields has not increased since 2008. The will look at that. Secretary of State can talk as she wishes about the Why are rail fares so high? Why do commuters suffer economic changes being made by this Government’s from some of the most expensive tickets in Europe and policies, but the truth is that this Government have no some of the most crowded services? The main reason is plan for growth. As I have said, manufacturing is delivering chronic underinvestment and mismanagement of the for this nation in my region, yet the Government are railways. Over the last 50 years, for example, the length 231 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 232 of our rail network has roughly halved, but even just I could give a number of examples. In 2007, fares on since 1980, the number of passenger journeys has doubled. Stagecoach South West Trains rose by 20%. In January That is good, but it puts pressure on those railways. 2009, when the retail prices index was 0.1%, fares rose Government after Government have invested far too little by 6%: 60 times as much as inflation, which was a huge in our most important transport network. Infrastructure amount. Some comments were made about Ken spending simply has not kept up with demand, and that Livingstone earlier. Londoners will not forget that, pressure on the railways has caused a downward spiral. having promised in his manifesto An overcrowded, inefficient and unreliable service is far “I will freeze bus and tube fares in real terms for four years”, more expensive to run. The Office of Rail Regulation Ken Livingstone raised bus fares by 43 per cent. in estimates that UK railways are up to 40% less efficient January 2004. They will know what to believe when he than their European counterparts, despite the cost of makes similar promises again. tickets. That puts fares up, and reduces the amount of investment that is available from them. The real casualties of all that are the rail system and the passengers whom it is there to serve. The masking of The network has become increasingly expensive to the cause of the fare rises, the predicted income and the run as it has deteriorated, and Government after pricing structures has meant that the real issues have Government have shifted the spending burden on to not been dealt with for too long. We are letting the passengers. I believe that a large chunk of the 30% public down by continuing down that route and not savings identified by the McNulty review should be taking the steps that I have outlined. We should pay passed on to passengers in the form of lower fares as attention to what is happening throughout the country soon as possible, with the rest being spent on infrastructure. at present, not just to the extremes—the highest and I hope that the Secretary of State and the Minister will lowest figures. Overall, fares are rising by 5.9%, which is accept that those are the priorities. below the “1% above inflation” cap. That is good, but What is key is significant and well-targeted investment the fares are still too high and they need to come down. in the railways. That is why the Liberal Democrats were We should focus today on the overall burden on so thrilled by the announcements made by the coalition passengers, on the causes of that, and on how we can Government towards the end of last year. Despite the reduce those causes. Unless we invest and deal with the eye-watering public deficit that we face and the ongoing problem now, we shall never be able to achieve our goal eurozone disaster, we managed to find the £1.4 billion of a cheap, efficient and sustainable transport network. of investment in our railways that was announced in the I hope that Liberal Democrats in Government will be autumn statement—£400 million more than was announced able to make those tough decisions in order to give for the roads, which represents a very good rebalancing Britain the efficient and sustainable network that we towards sustainability—and yesterday we heard the excellent deserve, and I hope that we will be successful in our news about High Speed 2. pressure for fares to go down in real terms and not up, up, up. The public deserve a good, reliable and affordable If we have managed to find those funds now, in such rail system. difficult times, just think what could have been done in the boom years. That opportunity was missed. It is deeply regrettable that the necessary investment was not 3.39 pm made sooner. Funding would have been easier, decisions Alison Seabeck (Plymouth, Moor View) (Lab): Rail would have been much easier to make, and the fares that travel is vital to the far south-west. It takes nearly three we face now would be lower. It is a great shame that that and a half hours to travel from London to Plymouth, did not happen when the money was available. and five hours to travel further down the Penzance main As well as what can be done in the longer term, there line. We have ever-diminishing air travel options—Plymouth is more that we can do now. For years the Liberal airport has just shut—and only two strategic road routes, Democrats have called for rail fares to be more open, and there is no motorway leading down to Cornwall. transparent and rational—so that people can understand Rail and its affordability are therefore incredibly important. what they are buying, why they are buying it and when Over the 15 years since privatisation, rail travel in the they can use it—and for franchise agreements to be south-west has boomed. There have been 85% more more flexible. On both those fronts, the Government journeys, 40% of them to London and the south-east. are making significant progress by reforming franchise The number of journeys in Plymouth has increased agreements and opening up Government data. Nevertheless, over the past 10 years, despite the recession, and we there is more to do, and I am sure that the Minister will have seen the fastest rate of travel-to-work growth—about say more about it later. 4.6% each year. Without accountability and openness, there can be A major capacity gap is looming, however. The decisions no reform and no incentive for fare reductions. It is taken on High Speed 2 will not help the south-west as because of the lack of transparency that successive much as we would like. It is especially expensive for Governments have employed in rail policy that the people in the south-west to travel around the country, as debate has become so fractious and fares are so stubbornly we pay more per mile than those in other areas. That is high. We see politicking and individual fares being part of the legacy of botched privatisation. There is a picked on in various quarters. We can all do that. Today deep sense of unfairness. I fully accept that rail passengers we heard the Labour party present the fare rises as have to pay towards the service they use, but there though they were a new phenomenon, but fares have should be fairness in the system and that does not exist. risen above inflation since 2003. Some fares have always Local authority figures and development plans suggest been allowed to rise more than others as long as they fit that the number of rail passenger journeys will increase the average cap. That was the system established by further, and in excess of Network Rail’s figures—I urge Labour in 2004. the Government to compare the figures of Network 233 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 234
[Alison Seabeck] is a huge sum of money to come out of people’s pockets after tax. I acknowledge that that is a huge cost, but we Rail with those of the local authorities—but passengers need to have a sensible debate about how we move will still face historically high fares, and in particular forward from here, rather than just engaging in cheap those travelling from the south-west. Why are standard point scoring across the board. I hope that the Select anytime single fares that are priced per mile so much Committee on Transport, on which I serve, will turn its higher for our region than for any other region? A attention to this issue at some point this year, once the standard open ticket down to Plymouth will now cost Government have published their fares review and response £252, up by 9.7%. to McNulty. The Government put forward the idea that people In the short term, it is important that we do what we can commute for 90 minutes into work. The 90-minute can to cap fares, and I welcome the announcement in journey out of Plymouth to Taunton is a fair stretch, the autumn statement that we are scaling back from and a young person doing their first job will have to pay RPI plus 3 to RPI plus 1. However, it is also important £170 a week if they cannot afford to buy a season ticket. that passengers see something for what they are paying. That simply is not realistic, and it is certainly not I applaud what the Government have done to prioritise affordable. investment in the rail industry, and we have seen some A number of Members touched on the economic examples of that on the line I use. It is far from perfect, significance of the rail network for regional and city but there are measures to tackle overcrowding. We have growth. Its importance to the south-west cannot be a new fleet of trains, and just this week, Virgin Trains overestimated. So much potential could be unlocked if announced that an extra three of its fast trains will stop our rail services were efficient, on time and, importantly, at Milton Keynes during the evening peak. That will go affordable. In yesterday’s local government finance debate, some way towards relieving overcrowding, and many of we talked about how local authority budgets might the Pendolino trains are being lengthened. Some tangible grow, such as through increasing business rate revenues. improvements are therefore happening, although not as Those revenues will not grow if a decent infrastructure fast as I would like—I would like more trains to stop is not in place and if fares are not affordable, as under during the peak morning period—but, this is a welcome those circumstances businesses will not want to invest in first step. cities that are distant from the central hub of London. As always, we in the south-west and Plymouth are Also welcome is the announcement in the autumn concerned about our peripherality. Following the HS2 statement about the East West Rail line, which will connect announcement, we are increasingly concerned that the my constituency westwards to Oxford, and southwards south-west’s links to London are not being looked at to Aylesbury and on to London. I hope that, in the and that we are not getting a strategic overview of fullness of time, we will extend eastwards towards exactly how the benefits of HS2 will pan out in terms of Cambridge, so that I can go and see my hon. Friend the access to and from the south-west. We have also received Member for Cambridge (Dr Huppert) in record speed. no reassurances about affordability, and we see no However, I suspect that that is a little while off. The key fairness in the fares structure. We need a fares structure point is that these are tangible improvements in the that is simpler, too. We have a new franchise coming up, short term that passengers can see for the extra money and fares structuring and pricing must be taken into they have to pay. account at that time. I also urge the Minister to take on board the concerns of the people of the south-west. However, there are long-term structural issues within the rail industry, and we need to have a frank and My hon. Friend the Member for Garston and Halewood honest debate about how we move forward. We should (Maria Eagle) was right to call this debate, as we should look not just at this country, but overseas to what other highlight the policies of the Government, which do not countries do. During the summer recess, I had the great tackle the rail companies and therefore, in effect, acquiesce privilege of travelling to Switzerland as the guest of the in the unacceptably high rail fares. I urge Members to Swiss railway to examine its system. It has increased vote for our motion. cost pressures, as well. We hold up the Swiss railway example as nirvana—the goal that we want to achieve—and 3.44 pm in many respects it is, but it is having a big argument at the minute about putting up rail fares to pay for increased Iain Stewart (Milton Keynes South) (Con): I am infrastructure investment in order to increase capacity. disappointed by the text of the motion. We could have So, this problem is not unique to this country. had a sensible and mature debate on the future of the rail industry, its costs and the appropriate balance between However, there are certain parts of the Swiss system revenue from the fare box and from the taxpayer, but that we should look at. In the one minute and 50 seconds instead we have merely had cheap political point making, remaining to me, I do not have quite enough time to go which does no one any service. From listening to some into that issue in depth, but the Swiss have what they contributions, one would have thought that train fare call the general access card, which covers public transport increases occurred for the very first time in January of costs across all modes, be they rail, tram, ferry or bus. this year, whereas there have, of course, been increases We should encourage measures in this country to improve for many years. transport integration, which has long been talked about. For many years before I was elected, I commuted The former Deputy Prime Minister, now Lord Prescott, daily up and down the west coast main line between proclaimed that we would have a committee for integrated Milton Keynes and Euston. Every year, the season transport; however, 13 years on, little has been achieved. ticket went up a couple of hundred pounds. Now, it is We need to address such issues and to look at the about £5,000, and if one adds on parking charges, that long-term costs within the rail industry. Our rail costs 235 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 236 are among the highest in the world, and we should not authorities can no longer support them; young people just accept that the existing situation must be preserved dropping out of college or not applying to go because in aspic for ever. they no longer get education maintenance allowance to Some tough issues have to be addressed and it is not pay for the fares; people no longer able to get to their going to be easy, but I am looking forward to having a place of work or to afford the fares to get there; the sensible debate. I hope the Transport Committee will unemployed unable to afford fares to seek work; young tackle these key issues when we conduct our inquiry, people unable to get to youth projects and left with hopefully later this year, and that we can have a sensible nothing to do; and the elderly and other vulnerable debate, rather than the petty and pointless political groups left isolated on their homes. It is no wonder that point scoring that has happened today. There are many the UK Youth Parliament chose public transport as its sensible Opposition Members with whom I serve on the No. 1 issue for 2012. Transport Committee, and I hope we can have a decent One of my constituents, Sandra, wrote to me about discussion and explore all the issues. the increase in cost for children on the bus last April, saying that the cost of getting her two children to 3.49 pm school had gone up by 50%. The weekly fare for both girls was £16 and it has risen to £24, or £96 per month, Julie Hilling (Bolton West) (Lab): I start with the so she will have to find an extra £32 a month just for point that I wanted to make to the Secretary of State their transport. She said: during her speech. There was a global financial crash; “What option do I have but to pay these amounts, this is the although the previous Prime Minister may have been a nearest school my girls can attend however it is too far for them to very powerful man, he did not cause a financial crash in walk especially as it would involve crossing the busy A6 junction America, Japan, Germany, Europe and the rest of the which has seen so many fatalities. world. The other option is for me to drive them there and pick them In my postbag and in my surgeries I increasingly up which in this day and age of trying to do our bit for the encounter stories from ever more desperate constituents. environment is very negative, plus it would mean taking away I hear from those who are losing their homes and their their independence which they gained since attending high school. jobs, from those who are terrified about losing their Surely the knock on effect will be that more parents will drive disability benefits and about the changes to housing their children, congestion will increase and the bus company will benefit, and from those who are having to give up their see a reduction in people using their services which will ultimately college courses because they can no longer afford to get see the service itself being cut due to lack of use….Working parents are feeling very stretched at the moment and all these to them. I hear from ordinary people who are paying extra costs seem very harsh. the price of the failure of the banks and of this coalition Government’s economic policy. I know many parents I have spoken to feel the same”. The rise in gas and electricity prices means that many Michelle contacted me in a similar vein, saying: people are choosing between heating and eating, and “As hard working parents who are really struggling to make some people cannot even afford food. Last year, the ends meet in the current economic climate we don’t qualify for Trussell Trust fed more than 60,000 people who were any financial help from anyone, and there is a limit to how much experiencing food poverty, and the number of people we can afford to pay. I am aware that there such a thing as a seeking help because they simply do not have enough Junior Saver Pass which can be bought weekly—but it would cost me even more to buy this pass than it will be to pay the increased money to feed their family is growing. These people bus fare! So, to put it bluntly, I am stuffed!!! have lost their jobs or faced an unexpected bill, have had their benefits cut or fallen ill, their relationship has I wonder, are we going back to the dark times that Orwell wrote about not many miles away when many working families ended or they have simply not received a pay increase were living and working well below the breadline?” for a number of years. These are ordinary people facing devastating circumstances simply because they are poor. Of course, it is not just children who face unaffordable increases in bus fares. First Bus will put up its fares this Transport costs are yet another problem. Even in this month by more than 7% and some providers are increasing age of the car, many people are totally dependent on fares by even more. public transport. That could be because they are too young or too old to drive, because they have disabilities, Let me turn finally to rail. UK rail fares are already because they are young and cannot afford thousands of the highest in Europe, with some season tickets costing pounds for car insurance or because they are on low pay a fifth of the average UK salary. We are forcing those and cannot afford to own and drive a car. The bus is an who have cars to go back to driving, increasing congestion essential part of most people’s travel on public transport. and carbon emissions, and forcing those who do not Twice as many people use buses as use trains, with bus have cars into unemployment and isolation. The Secretary use particularly common in the lower income bracket, of State talks about the cost of our rail services but does and 25% of households do not have access to a car. not address the fundamental problems of botched There has been a perfect storm in the bus industry: a privatisation in the first place. We clearly need to look at 20% cut in the bus service operator grant; a 28% cut to how we can reduce costs, but we should not do that at local government funding for transport; and changes to the expense of rail users. the way funding is provided for concessionary fares for I want to ask a final question: is public transport a older people, which cost local authorities £223 million public service? No public transport network in the in 2011-2012. world is not subsidised, but if the Government continue What has been the result of that? It has been as along the path of expecting the user to pay the full cost follows: children’s fares rising in my area to half the of any public transport service, people of ordinary adult fare, rather than being the flat rate of 80p that means and the poor will be driven off public transport. they were before; bus services disappearing because local Indeed, trains will become simply rich men’s toys. 237 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 238
3.55 pm Government in our usual courteous way, and that will be a good thing. Hon. Members have to recognise that Paul Maynard (Blackpool North and Cleveleys) (Con): there is a Command Paper coming out that will look at It is a pleasure to speak in this debate. Paragraph 13 of the structure of our railways and that there is a fare the final McNulty report states quite clearly: review coming out that will also address the issues. “Fares structures do not send efficient pricing signals, particularly The hon. Member for Garston and Halewood illustrated in terms of managing peak demand, and are extremely complex.” a useful point when she confirmed to me that one of her As a frequent user of the west coast main line I can only core beliefs is that the peak period should be the same in concur with that diagnosis, but what has struck me Euston as in Merseyside. I should think that would about today’s debate has been the lack of any praise for raise some very interesting problems. Anyone who uses what the Government are doing to tackle it. I am not the west coast main line, as I am sure she does to get just talking about RPI plus 1 rather than RPI plus 3, or back to Liverpool, must realise that at peak hours on a about the fact that we have more passengers on our Friday the place is a hell hole. Passengers have to be put railways than we did in the 1920s, but I find it strange in cattle pens; it is not acceptable. Is she suggesting that that the Opposition find it difficult to recognise our we should reduce the standard national peak time? That investment, particularly in the north-west with the Ordsall would just cause that problem at Euston every day of chord, which is the first stage of the northern hub, and the week and make it worse. Is she suggesting that we the electrification of the line to Blackpool—and that is should have a much longer national peak hour? That before we get on to High Speed 2; I am told than those would make it quite hard for many of our parents and on both Front Benches are suffering a degree of HS2 neighbours who travel from Runcorn into Lime Street fatigue. to do their shopping in Liverpool One to get there and I listened to the speech from the hon. Member for back in a day on an off-peak ticket. That is an example Garston and Halewood (Maria Eagle), the shadow of how the policies that the hon. Lady has suggested Secretary of State, and I began to ask myself whether today have not really been thought through. that was the new reality and the new approach for tough I would far rather that the hon. Lady recognised that times or whether it was just about borrowing a bit the Government are taking relevant steps and are making more—the same old story and the same old solution— a difference. They are bringing forward the fares review without saying where it would come from. That is not and the Command Paper on the structure of the rail just a knockabout point, as it goes to the heart of industry that we need to see. I have a feeling that this transport policy. The previous Labour Government, debate might have been plonked on Opposition Members rightly in my view, wanted to shift the burden of paying from above. I know that that happens sometimes— for our railways from the taxpayer to the fare-paying Members do not always choose to have a debate but passenger, a policy that this Government are continuing. might be told, “You’re having one.” They have done I am not quite sure I understand why the Labour their best to cobble together a press release but I am Opposition do not want to continue with that approach. afraid that although they get A-plus for effort, they get I began to get a bit confused. As I listened to the hon. D-minus for homework. There is a debate to be had, but Lady, I felt like I was watching a game of what I call I am not sure that today’s debate was the one we wanted policy Twister, where a Front-Bench team try to contort to be having. themselves into new poses to fit the leader’s latest re-launch. As someone who spent many years in an 4.1 pm opposition front-bench team, I know what it feels like. I have been there, done that and bought the T-shirt. Heidi Alexander (Lewisham East) (Lab): Let me start by picking up on the last point that the hon. Member I do not want to denigrate the hon. Lady’s proposals, for Blackpool North and Cleveleys (Paul Maynard) as I thought that some of them made a lot of sense. For made. He suggests that this debate was thrust on our example, I have concerns about the digital divide and Front Bench. Far from it; I believe that a number of the availability of fares only online, and she was right to Members desperately want to discuss this issue—[HON. raise that. I feel, however, that in the wider debate we MEMBERS: “Where are they?”] Well, I am here and if need a slightly more coherent understanding of what hon. Members will grant me the courtesy of listening, I the McNulty review recommends. I am concerned that will tell them that my constituents e-mail and write to the debate seems to focus on what is said in the latest me on a weekly basis about this issue, and when I knock RMT or Transport Salaried Staffs Association press on their door they talk to me about the affordability of release. This is not just about ticket offices—and, by the the railway. My constituents depend on the railway far by, I share many people’s concerns about the loss of more than most Members’ constituents, partly because ticket offices. We need to understand that McNulty there are not a huge number of locally based jobs in the goes much further than that. area of Lewisham that I represent. Most of my constituents Somewhere within rail policy, we must discuss where who work—70%—travel into central London, down to the burden lies and where the balance falls between the Croydon and out to Bromley using the railway, not the fare-paying passenger and the taxpayer. Given that tube, and sometimes the bus to go about their daily life. McNulty called for a fare review and we are delivering a The railway and the affordability of train fares are fare review at the end of the year, I am a little perplexed critical to my constituents. That is why we are having as to why the Opposition could not wait to see what is in this debate today. the fare review. I am proud to serve on the Select I was struck by the comments of the hon. Member Committee on Transport and I am looking forward to for Milton Keynes South (Iain Stewart), who said that our cross-examination regarding the documents when train fares have been increasing for a number of years. they come forward. I have no doubt that we will finds That certainly has been my experience as a London some flaws and will communicate those flaws to the Member of Parliament, but the real difficulty this year 239 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 240 is that the train fare increases are particularly hard to candidate for Mayor, Ken Livingstone, on fares policy. stomach given that they come on top of so many other She suggested that in some way the 7% cut in fares that increases in the cost of living, such as in utility bills and Ken Livingstone is promising for October this year food. Constituents are coming to us and saying that would fundamentally destabilise Transport for London their housing benefit is being reduced, and it is a real budgets. TfL has costed the proposal at £215 million. kick in the teeth when train and bus fares are being At present TfL works with an operating surplus of hiked by such considerable amounts this year. £727 million. It is possible and it can be done. That is why it is the right policy for Ken Livingstone to pursue. Iain Stewart: The two issues that the hon. Lady has I conclude by saying that it has always interested me just mentioned are not separate points, because trains that we view public money spent on roads as an investment, require energy to run on and if energy costs go up the yet public money spent on railways as a subsidy. For me, operating costs of the railways also go up. One cannot the sooner that changes, the better. simply differentiate those two issues.
Heidi Alexander: Energy was just one of the things that I mentioned. Most people would recognise that the 4.8 pm cost of living is going up considerably. However, I agree Lilian Greenwood (Nottingham South) (Lab): We with the hon. Gentleman when he says that, with fares have heard this afternoon exactly how the cost-of-living going up, our constituents—the public—expect to see crisis is hitting households up and down the country. an improvement in service, getting some bang for their My hon. Friend the Member for Bolton West (Julie buck. When the trains roll into stations in my constituency, Hilling) described the devastating circumstances faced they are rammed full of people. This morning I tried to by some of her constituents. This debate is not about get on the 8.32 train from Lewisham and had to wait for point-scoring. It is about the lives of the people whom the next one to come along. The previous Government we represent—the people who went back to work after put in place a number of measures to increase capacity the Christmas holidays and suddenly found that they on some of the suburban lines coming into London. had to pay almost 11% more to catch the train. As my hon. Friend the Member for Pontypridd (Owen Smith) Henry Smith (Crawley) (Con): Will the hon. Lady noted, passengers travelling from Cardiff to London give way? face increases of 9.7%. My hon. Friend the Member for Plymouth, Moor View (Alison Seabeck) highlighted the Heidi Alexander: I am afraid I will not give way; I frightening cost of fares to and from the south-west. have limited time. With the railways Minister present, I would like to make the point that that increase in As usual, there were plenty of warm words from the capacity, lengthening trains to 12 cars, is incredibly hon. Member for Cambridge (Dr Huppert), but I remind important. Also, the new rolling stock on the suburban him that his party is part of this Government and their lines is critical. The new rolling stock has much more policy is to increase fares in this Parliament by RPI plus standing room, which my constituents are calling out 3%. for. Dr Huppert: Will the hon. Lady give way? My problem with the increase in train fares is that it is making it much more difficult for my constituents to find work. A single man on low pay working in central Lilian Greenwood: I will not give way at the moment. London came to my surgery recently. He said that he We have heard about shoppers finding that they have was gravely worried about how he could afford to get to less to spend when they get to the shops or the market work. If people are not able to stay in work or have to because bus fares have gone up, about small businesses look for other jobs, that will add to the bill that the struggling with the high cost of petrol, and about mums Government are paying out in jobseeker’s allowance. I and dads having to find more money from the family have fundamental concerns about the impact of rising budget to help teenage sons and daughters pay to travel fares on people’s ability to stay in work. The Campaign to college because they have lost their education for Better Transport has estimated that in London, if maintenance allowance and the fare concessions they two parents are working and have two children in child used to get have been cut. Parents are having to get the care, that can swallow up 40% of the household’s income. car out to take their children to school, even if they Hundreds of pounds added each year to the cost of cannot really afford to, because school transport has getting about in London will make a significant difference been cut. As has been said, that does nothing to contribute to household budgets. to the green agenda. Not only is it important that train fares are affordable The cost of living crisis is hitting hardest those who so that people can go about their daily lives, get to work are least able to withstand it and is made worse by the and stay in jobs, but everyone in the Chamber would decisions that the Government have made, which show recognise that ultimately we need to do more to get that they are out of touch with the concerns of ordinary people on to public transport. The environmental benefits families. When so many people are struggling to pay of getting people out of their cars, reducing congestion their bills and make ends meet, only a Government who and pollution by getting them on to the trains and are completely out of touch with these concerns would buses, are key. If people do not believe that public allow inflation-busting increases in rail fares, yet that is transport is affordable to them, we will not see that exactly what this Government have done. They were change in behaviour that all of us in the Chamber want. forced to back down on their original plan to increase In the few minutes remaining to me, I shall pick up on rail fares by inflation plus 3% this year, but passengers some of the remarks made earlier by the Secretary of will still face those rises in January 2013 and January State about the proposals put forward by Labour’s 2014. 241 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 242
[Lilian Greenwood] done to help bus users, many of whom are among the least well-off in society? They have cut transport funding When passengers heard the Chancellor’s autumn to local councils by 28%, a loss of £95 million in statement, they understandably expected that the most 2011-12 alone. They have changed the way in which the they would have to pay this year was an extra 1% above concessionary fares scheme is funded, taking a further inflation, but they soon found that they were wrong, £223 million away from local authorities in the past because the Government gave private train companies year, and they have decided to cut the bus service the right to increase some tickets by an additional 5%, operators grant, the fuel rebate to bus companies, by something that Labour banned in government precisely 20% from April. because we understood the pressures commuters face in If we add those changes together, we find that the tough economic times. result is devastating. Fares are going up, one in five supported bus services has been scrapped and the Campaign Alok Sharma: At the start of the debate the hon. for Better Transport has collected examples of more Member for Garston and Halewood (Maria Eagle) than 1,100 bus services that have already been lost in the made a spending commitment to keep fares down. Will English regions. Whole communities have been left the hon. Lady tell us where the money for that would isolated without access to public transport, and almost come from and, assuming she does not wish to increase three quarters of local authorities have been forced to the national debt, what she would cut to fund that cut or to review school transport provision. commitment? Older people, who are protected from fare rises, having Lilian Greenwood: I am not making any spending benefited enormously from the free bus pass introduced commitments this afternoon. The real question needs by the previous Labour Government, are finding additional to be addressed by the Minister, which she might do restrictions on when they can travel and, particularly in when summing up. She needs to address the point, rural areas, that the service they relied on has disappeared. made by the National Audit Office, that rather than The Prime Minister may have promised to keep the free protecting taxpayers or paying for the investment described bus pass, but it is of little use if people have no local bus by the hon. Member for Milton Keynes South (Iain to travel on. Stewart), the flexibility will boost the profits of train Time and again we see this Government choosing to operating companies. How will she tackle that? implement policies that have a disproportionate impact As my hon. Friend the Member for Glasgow South on the very people who most need to be protected in (Mr Harris) rightly said, rail services flourished under harsh economic times: older people and disabled people, Labour, with more services, more passengers and better who often do not have the choice to use a car; and the punctuality than ever before. He also noted that Lord unemployed, who are already paying the price of this Adonis stood up to train operators and removed this Government’s economic failure. Some 64% of those flex. Lord Adonis stated in evidence to the Transport seeking work do not have a access to a car, so they rely Committee: on buses to get to interviews and jobs. As my hon. Friend the Member for Lewisham East (Heidi Alexander) “In a time of economic stringency I do not think it acceptable for individual commuters to face significantly above-average fare said, how will they access job opportunities or stay in increases. The Government’s intention is, therefore, that in future work without public transport and how can work pay if the cap should apply to individual regulated fares, not just to the travel to work is not affordable? average of each fares basket.” We heard about young people, 72% of whom rely on He said “in future” and nothing about it being for one buses to get to college and to give them independence. year. They are already struggling without their education The Prime Minister might say that he wants to tackle maintenance allowance, or are facing a three-fold increase crony capitalism, but actions speak louder than words. in tuition fees, so it is little wonder that colleges report a His Government have shown that they are on the side of fall in admissions, and that the UK Youth Parliament private train operators, rather than passengers, letting made cheaper, fairer and more accessible public transport them increase some fares by as much as 11% with no its number one issue for 2012. guarantee that the money will lead to a better deal for For the one in 10 people in rural areas who do not taxpayers. As I have said, the NAO has warned that that have access to a private car, a bus is essential to get to could simply result in higher profits for train companies. the nearest shop, doctor or post office—not that car The Government also know how difficult it is for passengers users have done much better. For all the Government’s to navigate their way around complex fare structures to talk of fuel stabilisers in opposition, one of their first find the cheapest tickets, but they will not rule out acts was to increase VAT to 20%—immediately putting getting rid of the very ticket office staff who can help petrol prices up by 3p a litre and adding an extra and advise people, particularly those who are unable to £1.35 to the cost of filling up the average car. find the best offers online or by using a ticket machine. The Government claim that those changes are all in If things are bad for rail users this January, bus users the name of deficit reduction and there is no alternative. might say, “Look at the year we’ve already had.” The That is not so. What is required is the determination to Transport Committee called the 2010 comprehensive stand up to vested interests and to powerful lobby spending review groups. We have already set out how we would ease the “the greatest financial challenge for the English bus industry for a pressure on households from the rising costs of transport— generation”. not by increasing spending, but by banning private train Alongside rising fuel prices and a depressed economy, companies from averaging out the cap on fare rises. many bus operators have had no option but to raise That would mean a maximum increase of inflation plus fares, cut services or both. What have the Government 1% this year, not increases of up to 11%. 243 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 244
My hon. Friend the Member for Garston and Halewood Within those constraints we are of course striving to also set out how we are considering other options to help those who are facing hardship with the cost of ensure that passengers are protected from unfair pricing, living. including a single definition of peak and off-peak; a My hon. Friend the Member for Blackpool North right to the cheapest ticket; a right to a single price for and Cleveleys (Paul Maynard) pointed out the the same ticket; a more flexible way of changing one’s impracticalities of having a single uniform peak throughout travel plans; and a right to a discount when a rail the country and that the Opposition transport team replacement bus service is put on. appear not to have read the speeches made by their Labour’s policy review is looking at all options for leader or the shadow Chancellor. I particularly liked my reforming the structure of Britain’s rail industry. We hon. Friend’s reference to the game of policy twister need root and branch reform of its costly fragmented that they have unfortunately had to play today. structure, and we need a better deal for taxpayers and passengers. We also want to devolve more transport The hon. Member for Lewisham East (Heidi Alexander) responsibilities, so that more decisions are made locally commented on the concern about the effect of inflation by integrated transport authorities with powers to deliver and fare rises. That is exactly the concern that the local bus services in a way that best suits each community, Chancellor responded to in his autumn statement in ensuring that the needs of local people are met and that putting the limit on the average rise in national rail, fares are affordable. For young people who are aged 16 tube and bus fares at RPI plus 1. That help for people to 18 and in education, we want to see a concessionary struggling with the cost of living was welcomed by my fares scheme delivered by the major bus companies in hon. Friends the Members for Fylde (Mark Menzies), return for the subsidies that they have received. for Cambridge and for Milton Keynes South. We ought to pay tribute to the Secretary of State for her role in In the transport spending review, the Government that. We were able to do that at the same time as recognised: delivering a major investment programme only because “Transport provides the crucial links that allow people and of savings made elsewhere in government to tackle the businesses to prosper”. deficit—the kind of spending reductions that Labour Well, people and businesses are suffering as a result of has consistently opposed. their poor decisions. Yesterday, we, like the hon. Member for Fylde (Mark Menzies), welcomed the good news about High Speed 2 and the Government’s commitment Mr Tom Harris: “Many families are feeling the pinch to long-term investment in our infrastructure, but they because of stratospheric fare increases—racing ahead must face up to the here and now. They need to listen to of inflation—inflicted by the Department.”—[Official passengers and start taking action to tackle the quiet Report, 24 July 2007; Vol. 463, c. 691.] Those are not my crisis facing people the length and breadth of this words, but those of the Minister in this House. Can she country. point out any improvements that have been made since then? 4.19 pm The Minister of State, Department for Transport Mrs Villiers: The former rail Minister has made my (Mrs Theresa Villiers): Time is too short to refer to point for me. The Opposition must be suffering from every contribution to today’s debate, but I welcome all collective amnesia if they think that this problem suddenly those that have been made. appeared in May 2010 when the coalition took over. In 2006, a Labour-dominated Select Committee described The hon. Member for Glasgow South (Mr Harris) the Labour Government as “breathtakingly complacent” criticised a fares system that he presided over as rail on value for money in fares. The truth is that concern Minister. My hon. Friend the Member for Wimbledon about rail fares has been growing for years, as my hon. (Stephen Hammond), along with many others, pointed Friends the Members for Bexleyheath and Crayford out that RPI plus 1 and above-inflation fare increases (Mr Evennett), for St Albans (Mrs Main) and for were introduced under the Labour Government and did Milton Keynes South have said. not start under the coalition. The hon. Member for Pontypridd (Owen Smith) A major reason for the increases is that under Labour commented on the Government’s continuation of a the cost of running the railways spiralled and hard-pressed major investment programme and called for a simpler passengers and taxpayers were left to foot the bill. It is ticketing system. My hon. Friend the Member for fair that passengers contribute to the cost of running Cambridge (Dr Huppert) also welcomed our commitment the railways and to the massive programme of upgrades to a programme of rail improvements that is probably that we are taking forward, but neither fare payers nor the biggest since the Victorian era. He welcomed the taxpayers should have to pay for industry inefficiency. fact that we had been able to prioritise it despite the This Government understand how vital it is to get the deficit because of the difficult decisions that we have cost of running the railways down and to tackle the made in other areas. My hon. Friend the Member for legacy of inefficiency that we inherited from Labour. Milton Keynes South (Iain Stewart) welcomed the progress That is the long-term, sustainable solution to delivering on east-west rail and made some important points better value for money for taxpayers and fare payers. about how fares operate. The hon. Member for Bolton West made a moving Lilian Greenwood: The point that we are seeking to speech about the hardship that her constituents are make is that when the Government say that fares will go feeling. As for buses, we are of course doing all that we up by inflation plus 1%, that is what they should go up can within the constraints of the fiscal straitjacket by, not by up to 11%, which is what many people face created by the deficit that we were left by Labour. this year as a result of the Government’s decisions. 245 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 246
Mrs Villiers: The hon. Lady need not worry as I will explanation of how Labour would pay for the change, come on to the fares basket in a moment. Before I do, it and whether it would come from higher fares, higher is crucial to say that we are determined to deliver our taxes, cuts in services, the cancelling of extra carriages goal of ending the era of above-inflation fare rises. The or upgrades or more borrowing. only long-term, sustainable solution to delivering better Just one day after the Leader of the Opposition value for money for taxpayers and fare payers is to get finally acknowledged that dealing with Labour’s deficit the cost of running the railways down, not the short-term, means that there is no more money left to spend and uncosted, poorly thought-through proposals that we said that the Opposition would take a more responsible have heard from the hon. Member for Garston and approach, the shadow Secretary of State stood at the Halewood (Maria Eagle) this afternoon. Dispatch Box making spending commitment after spending We have started reform already, with the reform of commitment on rail fares, concessionary bus travel, the franchising system and our commitment to further local government funding, school transport, VAT—the electrification to reduce costs. We are also determined list goes on and on. She and the shadow Minister, the to see the rail industry working together better, with a hon. Member for Nottingham South (Lilian Greenwood), strong shared incentive to reduce costs and deliver made several billion pounds of commitments today. better outcomes for passengers. The truth is that when it comes to the cost of living Another key plank of getting the cost of the railways and the economy, Labour just does not get it. It must be down is making working practices on the railways more just about the only political party in the world arguing efficient. When Labour was in charge, pay in the rail that the way to get out of a debt crisis is by borrowing sector rose more than twice as fast as it did in the more money. Whether it is a credit card bill or the economy more widely. Difficult decisions may lie ahead, international gilts market, that simply does not work. and I do not believe Labour is capable of taking those There is no way that interest rates could have stayed at decisions where the interests of the unions conflict with today’s low levels without the action that we have taken the goal of getting better value for money for passengers. to deal with the deficit and avert the crisis enveloping other European countries with public finance positions Mr Tom Harris: Will the Minister give way? almost as bad as ours. In government, Labour brought this country to the Mrs Villiers: No. brink of bankruptcy, leaving Britain with one of the Labour failed to deal with the problem in government, biggest structural deficits in the developed world. Today’s and its heavy dependence on union funding would debate demonstrates that, contrary to what the Leader make it utterly incapable of dealing with it if the of the Opposition said, Labour has learned nothing in country were unwise enough to return to a Labour opposition. The biggest threat to the cost of living in Government. If the Opposition were really serious about this country is the spiralling interest rates that we would getting better value for money for passengers, they get if we gave way to the demands that Labour makes would not be making glib announcements in the House; every single day in the House for more and more they would be remonstrating with their friends in the spending. rail unions about a responsible approach to pay, from It is clear that if Labour had won the last election— the boardroom to the platform. thankfully it did not—it would have utterly failed to I turn now to the fares basket and the flat cap on take the tough decisions needed to get the deficit under prices. Frankly, the shadow Secretary of State was in all control. That would have had disastrous consequences sorts of trouble on the matter. The claim made by her for the cost of living for millions of families right across and the Leader of the Opposition that the suspension the nation. I urge the House to reject the motion. of the cap was an ongoing policy, representing a dramatic Question put. change of heart by Lord Adonis, is simply not borne The House divided: out by the facts of what Lord Adonis did in government. Ayes 251, Noes 319. Division No. 420] [4.29 pm Mr Harris: Will the Minister give way? AYES Mrs Villiers: No. The hon. Gentleman did not do Abbott, Ms Diane Benton, Mr Joe anything about the flat cap in his entire time as a rail Abrahams, Debbie Berger, Luciana Minister, so I will not take his intervention on the Ainsworth, rh Mr Bob Betts, Mr Clive matter. Alexander, rh Mr Douglas Blackman-Woods, Roberta Alexander, Heidi Blears, rh Hazel Lord Adonis inserted in the franchise contracts a Ali, Rushanara Blenkinsop, Tom one-year suspension of the flat cap. That conflicts with Allen, Mr Graham Blomfield, Paul what the shadow Secretary of State said today. Anderson, Mr David Blunkett, rh Mr David Ashworth, Jonathan Bradshaw, rh Mr Ben Mr Harris: I promise it is the last time, but will the Austin, Ian Brennan, Kevin Minister give way? Bailey, Mr Adrian Brown, rh Mr Gordon Bain, Mr William Brown, Lyn Balls, rh Ed Brown, rh Mr Nicholas Mrs Villiers: No. Banks, Gordon Brown, Mr Russell More important, the shadow Secretary of State has Bayley, Hugh Bryant, Chris given us no indication of just how much repealing the Beckett, rh Margaret Buck, Ms Karen fares basket provision would cost. Amazingly, she did Begg, Dame Anne Burden, Richard not even seem to understand that it would have a cost. I Bell, Sir Stuart Burnham, rh Andy can assure her that it would. She has given no credible Benn, rh Hilary Byrne, rh Mr Liam 247 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 248
Campbell, Mr Alan Harman, rh Ms Harriet Mudie, Mr George Smith, Owen Campbell, Mr Ronnie Harris, Mr Tom Munn, Meg Spellar, rh Mr John Caton, Martin Healey, rh John Murphy, rh Mr Jim Straw, rh Mr Jack Chapman, Mrs Jenny Hepburn, Mr Stephen Murphy, rh Paul Stringer, Graham Clark, Katy Heyes, David Murray, Ian Stuart, Ms Gisela Clarke, rh Mr Tom Hillier, Meg Nandy, Lisa Sutcliffe, Mr Gerry Clwyd, rh Ann Hilling, Julie O’Donnell, Fiona Tami, Mark Coaker, Vernon Hodge, rh Margaret Onwurah, Chi Thomas, Mr Gareth Coffey, Ann Hodgson, Mrs Sharon Owen, Albert Thornberry, Emily Connarty, Michael Hoey, Kate Pearce, Teresa Timms, rh Stephen Cooper, Rosie Hood, Mr Jim Perkins, Toby Trickett, Jon Cooper, rh Yvette Hopkins, Kelvin Pound, Stephen Turner, Karl Corbyn, Jeremy Hosie, Stewart Qureshi, Yasmin Twigg, Derek Crausby, Mr David Howarth, rh Mr George Raynsford, rh Mr Nick Twigg, Stephen Creagh, Mary Hunt, Tristram Reeves, Rachel Umunna, Mr Chuka Creasy, Stella Irranca-Davies, Huw Reynolds, Emma Vaz, rh Keith Cruddas, Jon Jackson, Glenda Reynolds, Jonathan Vaz, Valerie Cryer, John James, Mrs Siân C. Riordan, Mrs Linda Walley, Joan Cunningham, Alex Jamieson, Cathy Robertson, Angus Watson, Mr Tom Cunningham, Mr Jim Jarvis, Dan Robertson, John Watts, Mr Dave Cunningham, Tony Johnson, rh Alan Rotheram, Steve Weir, Mr Mike Curran, Margaret Johnson, Diana Roy, Mr Frank Whiteford, Dr Eilidh Dakin, Nic Jones, Graham Roy, Lindsay Whitehead, Dr Alan Danczuk, Simon Jones, Helen Ruane, Chris Wicks, rh Malcolm Darling, rh Mr Alistair Jones, Susan Elan Ruddock, rh Dame Joan Williams, Hywel David, Mr Wayne Jowell, rh Tessa Sarwar, Anas Williamson, Chris Davies, Geraint Joyce, Eric Seabeck, Alison Wilson, Phil De Piero, Gloria Kaufman, rh Sir Gerald Shannon, Jim Winnick, Mr David Denham, rh Mr John Keeley, Barbara Sharma, Mr Virendra Winterton, rh Ms Rosie Dobbin, Jim Kendall, Liz Sheerman, Mr Barry Woodcock, John Dobson, rh Frank Khan, rh Sadiq Sheridan, Jim Woodward, rh Mr Shaun Docherty, Thomas Lammy, rh Mr David Shuker, Gavin Wright, David Dodds, rh Mr Nigel Lavery, Ian Simpson, David Wright, Mr Iain Donaldson, rh Mr Jeffrey M. Lazarowicz, Mark Skinner, Mr Dennis Donohoe, Mr Brian H. Leslie, Chris Slaughter, Mr Andy Tellers for the Ayes: Doran, Mr Frank Lewis, Mr Ivan Smith, rh Mr Andrew Mark Hendrick and Dowd, Jim Lloyd, Tony Smith, Angela Yvonne Fovargue Doyle, Gemma Llwyd, rh Mr Elfyn Dromey, Jack Long, Naomi NOES Dugher, Michael Love, Mr Andrew Durkan, Mark Lucas, Caroline Adams, Nigel Brooke, Annette Eagle, Ms Angela Lucas, Ian Afriyie, Adam Browne, Mr Jeremy Eagle, Maria MacNeil, Mr Angus Brendan Aldous, Peter Bruce, Fiona Edwards, Jonathan MacShane, rh Mr Denis Alexander, rh Danny Bruce, rh Malcolm Efford, Clive Mactaggart, Fiona Amess, Mr David Buckland, Mr Robert Elliott, Julie Mahmood, Shabana Andrew, Stuart Burley, Mr Aidan Ellman, Mrs Louise Malhotra, Seema Bacon, Mr Richard Burns, Conor Esterson, Bill Mann, John Baker, Steve Burns, rh Mr Simon Evans, Chris Marsden, Mr Gordon Baldry, Tony Burrowes, Mr David Farrelly, Paul McCabe, Steve Baldwin, Harriett Burstow, Paul Fitzpatrick, Jim McCarthy, Kerry Barker, Gregory Burt, Alistair Flello, Robert McClymont, Gregg Baron, Mr John Burt, Lorely Flint, rh Caroline McCrea, Dr William Barwell, Gavin Byles, Dan Flynn, Paul McDonagh, Siobhain Bebb, Guto Cairns, Alun Francis, Dr Hywel McDonnell, Dr Alasdair Beith, rh Sir Alan Campbell, rh Sir Menzies Gapes, Mike McDonnell, John Bellingham, Mr Henry Carmichael, rh Mr Alistair Gardiner, Barry McFadden, rh Mr Pat Benyon, Richard Carswell, Mr Douglas Gilmore, Sheila McGovern, Jim Beresford, Sir Paul Cash, Mr William Glass, Pat McGuire, rh Mrs Anne Berry, Jake Chishti, Rehman Glindon, Mrs Mary McKechin, Ann Birtwistle, Gordon Clappison, Mr James Godsiff, Mr Roger McKenzie, Mr Iain Blackman, Bob Clark, rh Greg Goggins, rh Paul McKinnell, Catherine Blackwood, Nicola Clarke, rh Mr Kenneth Goodman, Helen Meacher, rh Mr Michael Blunt, Mr Crispin Clifton-Brown, Geoffrey Greatrex, Tom Mearns, Ian Boles, Nick Coffey, Dr Thérèse Green, Kate Michael, rh Alun Bone, Mr Peter Collins, Damian Greenwood, Lilian Miliband, rh David Bottomley, Sir Peter Colvile, Oliver Griffith, Nia Miliband, rh Edward Bradley, Karen Crabb, Stephen Gwynne, Andrew Mitchell, Austin Brady, Mr Graham Crockart, Mike Hain, rh Mr Peter Morden, Jessica Brake, rh Tom Crouch, Tracey Hamilton, Mr David Morrice, Graeme (Livingston) Bray, Angie Davey, Mr Edward Hamilton, Fabian Morris, Grahame M. Brine, Steve Davies, David T. C. Hanson, rh Mr David (Easington) Brokenshire, James (Monmouth) 249 Rail Fares11 JANUARY 2012 Rail Fares 250
Davies, Glyn Haselhurst, rh Sir Alan Menzies, Mark Shelbrooke, Alec Davies, Philip Heald, Oliver Mercer, Patrick Shepherd, Mr Richard Davis, rh Mr David Heaton-Harris, Chris Metcalfe, Stephen Simmonds, Mark de Bois, Nick Hemming, John Miller, Maria Simpson, Mr Keith Dinenage, Caroline Henderson, Gordon Mills, Nigel Skidmore, Chris Djanogly, Mr Jonathan Hendry, Charles Milton, Anne Smith, Miss Chloe Dorrell, rh Mr Stephen Herbert, rh Nick Moore, rh Michael Smith, Henry Dorries, Nadine Hinds, Damian Morgan, Nicky Smith, Julian Doyle-Price, Jackie Hoban, Mr Mark Morris, Anne Marie Soames, rh Nicholas Drax, Richard Hollingbery, George Morris, David Soubry, Anna Duddridge, James Hollobone, Mr Philip Morris, James Spelman, rh Mrs Caroline Duncan, rh Mr Alan Holloway, Mr Adam Mosley, Stephen Spencer, Mr Mark Duncan Smith, rh Mr Iain Hopkins, Kris Mowat, David Stephenson, Andrew Dunne, Mr Philip Horwood, Martin Mulholland, Greg Stevenson, John Ellis, Michael Howell, John Mundell, rh David Stewart, Bob Ellison, Jane Hughes, rh Simon Munt, Tessa Stewart, Iain Ellwood, Mr Tobias Huhne, rh Chris Murray, Sheryll Stewart, Rory Elphicke, Charlie Huppert, Dr Julian Murrison, Dr Andrew Streeter, Mr Gary Eustice, George Hurd, Mr Nick Neill, Robert Stride, Mel Evans, Graham Jackson, Mr Stewart Newmark, Mr Brooks Stuart, Mr Graham Evans, Jonathan James, Margot Newton, Sarah Stunell, Andrew Evennett, Mr David Javid, Sajid Nokes, Caroline Sturdy, Julian Fabricant, Michael Jenkin, Mr Bernard Norman, Jesse Swales, Ian Fallon, Michael Johnson, Gareth Nuttall, Mr David Swayne, rh Mr Desmond Farron, Tim Johnson, Joseph O’Brien, Mr Stephen Swinson, Jo Featherstone, Lynne Jones, Andrew Offord, Mr Matthew Syms, Mr Robert Field, Mark Jones, Mr David Ollerenshaw, Eric Tapsell, rh Sir Peter Foster, rh Mr Don Jones, Mr Marcus Opperman, Guy Teather, Sarah Fox,rhDrLiam Kawczynski, Daniel Ottaway, Richard Thurso, John Francois, rh Mr Mark Kelly, Chris Parish, Neil Timpson, Mr Edward Freeman, George Kirby, Simon Patel, Priti Tomlinson, Justin Freer, Mike Knight, rh Mr Greg Paterson, rh Mr Tredinnick, David Fullbrook, Lorraine Kwarteng, Kwasi Owen Truss, Elizabeth Fuller, Richard Lamb, Norman Pawsey, Mark Turner, Mr Andrew Gale, Sir Roger Lancaster, Mark Penrose, John Tyrie, Mr Andrew Garnier, Mr Edward Lansley, rh Mr Andrew Percy, Andrew Uppal, Paul Garnier, Mark Latham, Pauline Perry, Claire Vara, Mr Shailesh Gauke, Mr David Laws, rh Mr David Phillips, Stephen Vickers, Martin George, Andrew Leadsom, Andrea Pickles, rh Mr Eric Villiers, rh Mrs Theresa Gibb, Mr Nick Lee, Jessica Poulter, Dr Daniel Walker, Mr Charles Gilbert, Stephen Lee, Dr Phillip Prisk, Mr Mark Walker, Mr Robin Gillan, rh Mrs Cheryl Leech, Mr John Pritchard, Mark Wallace, Mr Ben Glen, John Lefroy, Jeremy Pugh, John Watkinson, Angela Goldsmith, Zac Leigh, Mr Edward Raab, Mr Dominic Weatherley, Mike Goodwill, Mr Robert Leslie, Charlotte Randall, rh Mr John Webb, Steve Gove, rh Michael Letwin, rh Mr Oliver Reckless, Mark Wharton, James Graham, Richard Lewis, Brandon Redwood, rh Mr John Wheeler, Heather Grant, Mrs Helen Lewis, Dr Julian Rees-Mogg, Jacob White, Chris Gray, Mr James Lidington, rh Mr Reevell, Simon Whittaker, Craig Grayling, rh Chris David Reid, Mr Alan Whittingdale, Mr John Green, Damian Lloyd, Stephen Rifkind, rh Sir Malcolm Wiggin, Bill Greening, rh Justine Lopresti, Jack Robathan, rh Mr Andrew Willetts, rh Mr David Grieve, rh Mr Dominic Lord, Jonathan Robertson, Mr Laurence Williams, Mr Mark Griffiths, Andrew Loughton, Tim Rogerson, Dan Williams, Stephen Gummer, Ben Luff, Peter Rosindell, Andrew Williamson, Gavin Gyimah, Mr Sam Lumley, Karen Rudd, Amber Willott, Jenny Hague, rh Mr William Macleod, Mary Ruffley, Mr David Wilson, Mr Rob Halfon, Robert Main, Mrs Anne Rutley, David Wright, Simon Hames, Duncan Maude, rh Mr Francis Sanders, Mr Adrian Young, rh Sir George Hammond, rh Mr Philip Maynard, Paul Sandys, Laura Zahawi, Nadhim Hammond, Stephen McCartney, Jason Scott, Mr Lee Hancock, Matthew McCartney, Karl Selous, Andrew Tellers for the Noes: Hands, Greg McIntosh, Miss Anne Shapps, rh Grant Mark Hunter and Harper, Mr Mark McLoughlin, rh Mr Patrick Sharma, Alok Jeremy Wright Harris, Rebecca McPartland, Stephen Hart, Simon McVey, Esther Question accordingly negatived. Harvey, Nick Mensch, Louise 251 11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 252
Energy Prices He went on to say that [Relevant documents: The Fourth Report from the “sympathy from the sidelines is not enough. It is our responsibility to do everything we can to help.”—[Official Report, 19 October Energy and Climate Change Committee on Electricity 2011; Vol. 533, c. 944.] Market Reform, HC 742, and the Government’s response thereto (Sixth Special Report, HC 1448), and the Sixth Today, however, the scale of the Government’s failure Report from the Committee on Ofgem’s Retail Market is clear. More families are in fuel poverty and struggling Review, HC 1046, and the Government’s response thereto to heat their homes. Consumer Focus says that a quarter (Eighth Special Report, HC 1544.] of all households in England and Wales—5.7 million in all—are now in fuel poverty. National Energy Action fears that the figure could be as high as 6.6 million. 4.44 pm These are levels not seen since the dog days of the last Conservative Government. The number of households Caroline Flint (Don Valley) (Lab): I beg to move, in debt to their electricity and gas suppliers is up, too, That this House believes that soaring energy bills are driving but energy companies’ profit margins are still in excess up inflation, contributing to a cost of living crisis afflicting of £100 per customer per year. millions of families, and that the energy market is not serving the public interest; notes the motion passed by this House on 19 October Alok Sharma (Reading West) (Con): It is all very well 2011 calling on the Government to investigate mis-selling, simplify for the right hon. Lady to lecture the Government, but tariffs, increase transparency of trading data, require energy in the last six years of the Labour Government, the companies to use their profits to help with bills this winter and reform the energy market to increase competition and drive down number of households in fuel poverty rose by 2.8 million. energy bills; regrets that since then the Government has failed to Is she proud of that record? deliver on any of these measures; further notes that consumer efforts to control their energy bills have been undermined by cuts Caroline Flint: I am proud of the fact that, by the to the Feed-in Tariff and Warm Front scheme, and that there are time we left government, there were 1 million fewer serious concerns about whether the Green Deal will be taken up people in fuel poverty. That included 500,000 in the by, and work for, consumers; notes that over 90 per cent. of eligible families will not receive the Warm Homes Discount in most vulnerable households. The fact is that we took 2012; calls on the Government to require energy companies to measures to tackle fuel poverty. Is there more to do? provide the lowest tariff to over 75s and use their profits to ensure Yes. But what is happening now is that the figures are that all families eligible for Cold Weather Payments receive the going up and, as I will demonstrate, this Government Warm Homes Discount; and further calls on the Government to are not helping; they are hurting. reform the energy market to make it competitive and responsible, to cut VAT on home improvements to 5 per cent. for 12 months Confidence in the energy companies is at a near and to ensure that the Green Deal is offered on fair terms to record low. Less than half of the public are satisfied consumers which will deliver real savings in energy bills. with their energy supplier, yet energy company bosses have awarded themselves huge pay rises and bumper May I wish you a happy new year, Mr Deputy Speaker? bonuses totalling millions of pounds. Complaints to the Less than three months ago, the Opposition warned energy companies have soared, often over dodgy tariffs that soaring energy bills were driving up inflation, squeezing or incorrect billing or meter readings. There have been household budgets and contributing to the cost of 4 million complaints in the past year alone, and the living crisis afflicting millions of families. We warned, figure has gone up by 26% in the last three months. too, that trust in the energy sector had fallen to dangerously Today’s Which? report shows that one in five customers low levels as people grew sick and tired of the energy who have had problems with their energy supplier did companies’ sharp practices. We set out a clear plan to not even make a complaint, and that nine out of provide real help now, as well as to reform the way in 10 complaints are unresolved and never make it to the which our energy market works. We called on the energy ombudsman. As much as £4 million pounds in Government to investigate the scandal of mis-selling, compensation is going unclaimed. There are real concerns and to ensure that people were properly compensated. about whether the watchdogs, the consumer groups, and We also urged them to simplify tariffs, in order to put organisations such as the energy ombudsman and Ofgem an end to the disgrace of four out of five families have the powers that they need to protect the public. We paying more for their energy than they needed to. We need to think clearly about the kind of infrastructure asked for more transparency on energy companies’ that is needed to ensure that those organisations do trading data, so that the public could see for themselves their job. how much the companies were paying for their energy, Time and again, we see a Government who are not as well as how much they were charging for it. We just out of touch but completely unable to stand up to argued for a radical overhaul of the way in which our vested interests in the energy industry. Far from doing energy market was structured, to break the dominance everything they can to help, this Government are making of the big six and increase competition in order to drive things worse, not better, for millions of hardworking down bills for families and businesses. We also called on families. Their failing economic policies mean that the the Government to make the energy companies use average family faces the worst squeeze on income since their record profits to help people with their bills this records began in the 1950s, with families and children winter. hardest hit. The Government did something unusual—so unusual What, then, are the Government doing to help people? that the Government Whip on the Front Bench at the What have they done for pensioners forced to choose time seemed surprised by it. They backed our motion. this winter between heating their homes and having a They agreed to support our plans. Indeed, commenting hot meal? They have cut the winter fuel allowance, on the Labour motion, the Secretary of State said that despite promising not to. We have been honest that “there is nothing we disagree with”. under a future Labour Government that might be 253 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 254
[Caroline Flint] Mr Dave Watts (St Helens North) (Lab): Does my right hon. Friend agree that it is not what people say, something that we cannot reverse, but let us be clear but what they do? The last Labour Government took about the facts. Before the election, we warned that the pensioners and families out of poverty, while introducing Conservatives wanted to cut the winter fuel allowance. help and assistance for fuel costs. This Government In response, the Prime Minister said: have cut fuel cost assistance and are putting more “We would keep the winter fuel allowance. Let me take this people into poverty. Is that not the difference—not opportunity to say very clearly, to any pensioner who is watching what we say, but what we do? this or reading any of these reports, I know that you are getting letters from the Labour party saying the Conservatives would cut Caroline Flint: My hon. Friend is absolutely right: the winter fuel allowance…Those statements from Labour are actions speak louder than words. The actions going on quite simply lies.” at the moment mean that the number of people in fuel Our 12.7 million pensioners now know that we were not poverty is going up and there is less support coming lying. forward to help the most vulnerable. We are heading for The Government, however, have tried to change the a car crash when the Warm Front scheme ends and we story. Now they like to say that the decision had already wait to see whether the green deal will happen in a way been taken by the last Government. Even today, the that will help people. I shall say a little more about that Prime Minister repeated that allegation. It is simply not later, and I am sure my hon. Friends will want to make true. When Labour left office, the decision had not yet some points about it in their contributions. been taken. It was perfectly within the Government’s Let us talk about helping low-income families with power to continue with the extra payment, as Labour their energy bills. The Secretary of State likes to boast Chancellors had in previous years, but they chose not about the warm home discount scheme. He says it is a to. This Government took the decision in last year’s statutory scheme and that Labour had only voluntary Budget—and they should take responsibility for it. agreements—never mind that those voluntary agreements secured £375 million to help almost 1.6 million households with their energy bills over three years. What the Secretary Several hon. Members rose— of State forgets to say is that the present scheme exists only because Labour legislated for it when we were in Caroline Flint: The difference between Labour Members office. When the present Government decided to take it and Government Members is that we do not just give on, we warned that, on the basis of their plans, they up; we look to find other ways to help pensioners with could exclude hundreds of thousands of people from their fuel bills. Nobody should have to pay more for the help that they needed. their energy bills than they need to. This is especially In Committee, my hon. Friend the Member for important for pensioners over 75 who are more susceptible Liverpool, Wavertree (Luciana Berger) said to the cold and least able to take advantage of online “there are concerns about the make-up of the broader group and deals. That is why my right hon. Friend the Leader of the discretion given to energy companies to fund it.” the Opposition announced yesterday that, to start with, She asked for assurances we would ensure that all pensioners over 75 got the lowest tariff on offer, saving them up to £200 a year—on “that the Government will evaluate how effective the discretionary nature of the broader group will be and, if necessary, take steps to the Government’s figures, not ours. There might be less expand the core group if households are falling through the money around, but for those 4 million pensioners, Labour gap”.—[Official Report, Third Delegated Legislation Committee, can still deliver fairness in these tough times—not by 28 March 2011; c. 6.] spending more money, but by saying to the big six The Government did not heed those warnings, and, as energy companies that, at a time when people are struggling research by Save the Children revealed last week, only yet they are enjoying strong profits, they must act in a 3% of families who are eligible for help from the warm way that is responsible and fair to the public. home discount scheme will receive the support to which they are entitled this year. Andrew Percy (Brigg and Goole) (Con): Does the The Secretary of State may try to tell us that more shadow Secretary of State agree that whatever the situation people will be helped as the scheme develops, but those with the winter fuel allowance, one thing that would families need help now, not in three or four years’ time. have put a lot more money into pensioners’ pockets is This is not about spending more money or adding to the restoration of the link between pensions and earnings— customers’ bills; it is about standing up to vested interests something Labour promised in 1997. They failed to in the sector, and telling them that they have a responsibility deliver that yet we delivered in our first Budget, which to their customers and to the public. will bring about a record rise in pensions this year? The Government are not only cutting help for people in need, however. They are also hitting families who Caroline Flint: One of the first actions taken by the want to do their bit—who want to do the right thing, to Labour Government after winning in 1997 was to look have more control over their energy bills, and to make at the situation of the poorest pensioners in our country, their homes more energy-efficient. The Government’s many of whom were women who had never been able to disastrous and chaotic cuts in the feed-in tariff for solar earn enough to have a second pension. We had priorities power will be back in court on Friday. In defence of in respect of what we were going to achieve—pension their plans, Ministers have been forced to resort to ever credit, the winter fuel payment, other support through more outlandish claims about how much it is costing the Warm Front scheme: we did more for pensioners the public. First it was £26 a year, then it was £40, then than any Government for generations. What is happening it was £80. The actual figure—what it is really costing is that we are now going backwards, not forwards. consumers—is just 21p per household per year, compared 255 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 256 to average bills in excess of £1,300. What the Government issues of feed-in tariffs and the cost, but it cannot do not seem to understand is that one of the reasons understand why it was given six weeks to complete why so many people, especially pensioners, chose to projects that were going to take five weeks to bring in. install solar was the fact that it enabled them to control their energy use and cut their bills. Caroline Flint: It is always very helpful to hear of real Guy Opperman (Hexham) (Con): Today the Select examples. We have listened to many smaller businesses Committee on Energy and Climate Change heard some in this sector of course, but even the big six energy of my constituents give evidence on the issue of off-grid companies have concerns about the way the Government energy. May I ask a simple question? Is the Opposition’s have gone about changing the rules on solar. Sadly, policy to regulate it—yes or no? about 100,000 social homes may not get solar in the future because of these changes. We all agree that the Caroline Flint: We have had a number of debates on tariff should come down, but, aside from that point, if the subject. One of the problems with off-grid energy is the Government’s plans go ahead, people will only be that some of the schemes that the Government are able to have solar if their home is a category C residence coming up with do not help the people who are affected in terms of efficiency, and therefore about nine out of by it. I shall say more about that later in the context of 10 homes in England will no longer have the option of the green deal. There are real questions about who will having solar even under the changed rules and tariff. be excluded, but we are talking today about energy This is another example of bad management of a prices, and about what we can do to make the market project that was clearly popular among the public and more competitive and responsible. that has created jobs—the sector is one of the few that I look forward greatly to learning what the Select has experienced growth. Committee has discussed in relation to off-grid energy, In the long run, we know that the most sustainable and will think about some of its recommendations. We way for people to cut their bills is for them to use less will make up our own minds about what we should do, energy. but I acknowledge that there is a problem. During the “Energy efficiency is a no-brainer because it makes homes three months for which I have had my present job, it has warmer and cheaper to run.” arisen many times in debates. I also acknowledge that there are insulation problems for many people in rural Those are not my words; they are the words of the communities whose homes have solid walls. I am afraid Secretary of State from back in September, but what that I cannot give the hon. Gentleman chapter and verse has actually happened on his watch? The number of today, but he can be reassured that the issue is on families getting help to insulate their homes or make my radar. them more energy efficient has plummeted. Let us take the month of April as a point of comparison. Barry Gardiner (Brent North) (Lab): The witnesses In April 2010, the month before the general election, who gave evidence to the Select Committee made it more than 15,000 households got insulation measures clear that the statutory protections that exist under the through Warm Front. In April 2011, just six households licences for mains gas or electricity supply do not exist got insulation through Warm Front—not 6,000, 600 or for off-grid gas customers, who are the vulnerable customers. even 60, but just six. The Minister of State, the hon. Will my right hon. Friend at least consider committing Member for Bexhill and Battle (Gregory Barker), has the Opposition to regulation if the code of practice that said that this year he expects 50,000 households to get the industry is seeking to introduce on a voluntary help with insulation through Warm Front, but so far basis is inadequate to secure such protections for those fewer than 15,000 properties have been helped—not customers? even a third of what the Minister promised. On the Caroline Flint: I feel that the time has come for us to current trend, fewer than 20,000 households will get take stock of our position. The first line of the motion refers help with insulation this year, a fall of more than to an energy sector that works in the public interest. 90% on what we delivered in our last year in office. That does mean that we can still support competition, and I think there should be more competition in the The Minister of State, Department of Energy and sector. For all types of energy—on-grid and off-grid—it Climate Change (Gregory Barker): Unfortunately, the is time that we had another look at what is happening in right hon. Lady is making completely the wrong point. the market. For me, energy is not like buying a phone or Warm Front does not deliver insulation; it introduces a car; rather, it is essential to life, and therefore a higher heating systems for people who do not have heating order of accountability is required. I will be very happy systems. Insulation is primarily the responsibility of to look at the issues raised by the Committee. Select CERT, the carbon emissions reduction target, and CESP, Committees are useful for the Opposition as well as the the community energy saving programme. Warm Front Government. I will be very happy to talk to my hon. is not primarily an insulation programme. Perhaps she Friend and to the hon. Member for Hexham (Guy would like to try again? Opperman) and to see what the Select Committee comes up with, but I think the time for standing by has past. Caroline Flint: Well, I have to say that some of my Robert Flello (Stoke-on-Trent South) (Lab): In Blurton constituents have had help with things such as boilers, in my constituency, there was the fantastic sight of heating and also insulation. houses having photovoltaic panels erected on their roofs, but the project that E.ON had with Stoke-on-Trent city Robert Flello: I am deeply troubled by the Minister’s council covering thousands of houses across the city intervention. If he visits my constituency, I will take has now been cut short. E.ON said to me that it him to houses that have had loft insulation put in understands why the Government were looking at the through the Warm Front scheme, and to properties that 257 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 258
[Robert Flello] Caroline Flint: The warmth issue is not really part of the equation. The question of what this measure should have had replacement boiler systems fitted, not systems mean has been discussed in Committee. The “golden fitted for the first time. That is not the point he made a rule” is about people saving money. With all due respect moment ago, as he will see if he checks Hansard. to the hon. Lady, the problem is that the scheme should be far further forward than it is. We already know from what has happened with solar that a number of businesses Caroline Flint: The truth is that the Government are doubt whether they are going to enter the field to work not on the same planet as most of the rest of us. within the green deal. For example, those involved in What the Minister did not answer is why the number insulation are worried about the measure’s impact on of homes being fitted with insulation went down from the work they do, an issue I will say a little more about 15,000 to six within a year. That is the question the later. Government should answer today. Let us be clear: when So many questions have been left unanswered, and Warm Front is finally abolished next year, this will be any Government scheme that allows anyone to go out the first Administration since the 1970s not to have a and say that they are Government-backed has to stand Government-funded energy efficiency programme in up to scrutiny. We have to make sure, first, that the place. That is disgraceful. But, it is okay, because they public are not priced out of taking part, but we must say, “Don’t worry, we’ve got the green deal.” However, also ensure that they do not become the victims of real questions have to be addressed about whether the cowboys involved in the scheme. green deal will be offered on fair terms and will actually deliver real energy bill savings, and whether it will really Several hon. Members rose— work for the public. Caroline Flint: I am going to make a bit of progress. Let us start with the interest rates. Time and again, The Department of Energy and Climate Change website Ministers have been asked what sort of finance will be actually states: available to households interested in taking up the green deal. Time and again, they have failed to provide a “The Warm Front scheme provides heating and insulation improvements to households on certain income-related benefits”, straight answer. The reality is that if the level of interest is too high, given all the other pressures that families and it goes on to refer to grants for loft insulation and face at the moment, they will just not be interested in draught-proofing—I rest my case. taking it up. Polling conducted by the Great British Perhaps the Government will also respond to firms, Refurb Campaign found that only 7% of home owners such as those I have met, undertaking cavity wall insulation, would be interested in taking up the green deal if the which provide a sensible, professional product under interest rate was 6% or more. However, we are hearing the carbon emissions reduction target—CERT—scheme. that the rate could be as high as 8% or 10%, so I ask the Some 6 million homes have cavity walls without insulation, Secretary of State again today whether he can assure us and 10 million lofts do not have insulation. That provides that the green deal will be offered on fair terms and at a enough work for a whole industry to do—work that is fair rate to the public. good both for the public and for the environment. However, I understand that, under Government proposals, In the autumn statement, the Chancellor also announced if this work is to be undertaken under the green deal, a £200 million to provide incentives for the green deal. We full assessment of the property will have to be made—the still do not know what that money will be spent on or householder’s lifestyle and behaviour will be included in how it will encourage take-up. Most important of all, this. The assessment sounds as if it will have to be paid the fundamental idea behind the green deal—the “golden for by the consumer, yet the work that they wish to have rule”, as the Government like to call it—is that the done may be blindingly obvious. I hope that the savings from better energy efficiency should cover the Government will ensure that the public and businesses costs of the green deal. That is the promise being made are still able to improve the energy-efficiency of homes to the public, but on looking at the small print, it is without being forced through a bureaucratic and clear that the golden rule is not so golden after all. unnecessarily costly process. There is no guarantee that bills will not be higher after the green deal. If there is no guarantee, there is a real With the end of the Warm Front scheme, and of the concern about the potential for mis-selling. The danger community energy saving programme and CERT, what of what might happen out there is obvious: people will will happen to families in fuel poverty, or in hard-to-treat say, “We’re a Government-backed scheme—we promise homes, for whom the green deal might not be suitable? you this”, but down the road they will not deliver. This The Government’s solution is the energy company measure will not balance out the costs that people are obligation—ECO—but only a quarter of the money having to pay. In the light of stories about people not from ECO will help households in fuel poverty; the rest saving money or unwittingly inheriting higher energy will go to able-to-pay households. So the Government’s bills after buying a green deal property, any credibility promise that ECO will do more to tackle fuel poverty the scheme had will be shot to pieces. than either CERT or the Warm Front scheme just does not stack up. In what way is ECO’s £325 million a year for fuel-poor homes greater than last year’s Warm Front Tessa Munt (Wells) (LD): Will the right hon. Lady budget of £370 million or the CERT spending of nearly consider the fact that after a green deal installation, £600 million on priority groups? people might find themselves in a home that is at least We know that as well as coming up with policies, even warm, even if their bill is the same? They might not in these tough times, to help families with spiralling have saved any money, but they will for the first time be energy bills now, we must also reform the energy industry warm in their homes. to secure a new bargain in the future. I have said it 259 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 260 before and I am going to say it again: to start with we defending the companies’ atrocious record in dealing have to deal with the sheer number and complexity of with people’s complaints? I would not stand in his shoes tariffs on offer. We have 400 tariffs, with about 70 new and make that case. The truth is that prices need to be ones in the past year. They are confusing and unfair, transparent and we need to know how they are arrived and they must be reformed. At his infamous energy at. It is quite clear—it has been proved by an Ofgem summit in the autumn, the Secretary of State implored report and the Secretary of State might back me up on people to switch. Perhaps he could tell us today exactly this point—that there is evidence that when prices go up how many people took his advice and switched, and the bills go up far quicker than they come down when how much they have saved. The problem is not that prices fall. people are not shopping around enough; the real problem is that there are too many tariffs on offer, that they are David Mowat: Will the right hon. Lady give way on too complicated to understand and that even when that point? people do switch, they do not always get a better deal. Caroline Flint: No, I will not give way to the hon. Mr Watts: Does my right hon. Friend agree that it is Gentleman again. clear that the energy companies have made the tariff The bigger issue is how we carry out a root-and-branch system as complicated as they can? Is it not a fact that reform of the energy market for the future. even when people do switch and take the Prime Minister’s advice, they often find that they get a worse deal than Mr Mike Weir (Angus) (SNP): I thank the shadow the one they started with? Secretary of State for giving way, and she is making a very good point. Rather than asking EDF why it is Caroline Flint: I am afraid that that is the case. I have reducing the price by 5%, should we not be asking why met a number of the energy companies over the past it is doing so two months after putting it up by 15%? few months and they are obviously hurting as a result of Caroline Flint: It was actually 15.4%, but I do not the public criticism being directed their way. However, want to be churlish. I am pleased that the prices have when we examine today’s Which? report, we find that come down, but part of what we are seeing from the 4 million people complained in the past year and that energy companies is due to the fact that they are starting the number of complaints rose by 26% in the past three to smart from the criticism levelled at them. The problem months, so something is seriously not right. The real is getting worse and, as I have said, complaints have problem is that there are too many tariffs on offer. gone up and prices, which went up steadily over the past Having more than 400 tariffs is not about competition few years, have soared in the past year. We are not the or choice, and it does not serve the public interest; it establishment—the Government are, they are in the serves only the interests of the energy companies. So we driving seat and they have the tools to do something need, as we have said before, a simple new tariff structure about it. I only wish they would. that is clearer and fairer, and that will help all customers to get a better deal. I know that consultations are going We must ask the fundamental questions and the on at the moment, but the Government really need to fundamental problem in defining whether prices are step up the pressure. We should not be unable to knock reasonable and fair and considering the other pressures a few heads together, and we need to do that sooner on those prices is the fact that we are hampered by the rather than later. We must keep the pressure on as that lack of transparency in the market. The energy companies is the only way to make the companies change. The that generate energy sell it on to themselves and then on Which? report has highlighted the terrible situation to customers. If the few big dominant firms were forced with bills that were overestimated or incorrect as well as to sell the power they generate to any retailer, companies the mis-selling that went on in the past. We need a such as supermarkets and other independent retailers—like proper investigation and proper compensation for people Good Energy, which came top of the poll for customer who have been ripped off. Only then will we start to service in the Which? report—could play more of a role rebuild trust in our energy companies. in the market. There would then be more competition and the upward pressure on prices would be eased. As well as a more responsive energy industry, we need Times are tough, we all know that, and we know that a more competitive energy market. The energy market it means difficult decisions must be made. When times is dominated by just six firms that supply more than are tough, fairness is our first priority but, unfortunately, 99% of electricity and gas. Today we heard that EDF for the Government fairness is the first casualty. Millions will cut its gas prices by 5%, but the public will ask why of families and pensioners across the country are struggling energy companies are still so quick to put up people’s with their energy bills and a cost of living crisis, but the bills when wholesale prices go up but slow to bring Government are so out of touch that they are making them down when they fall as well as when the other big things worse rather than better. They are cutting the energy companies will follow suit. help people get with their energy bills and scaling back on energy efficiency. By failing to stand up to the energy David Mowat (Warrington South) (Con): I have in companies, they are letting down the public. We know front of me a copy from the EU website of the gas that people need real help now and a more responsible prices for every country in Europe and it would appear and competitive energy market for the future. For those that the UK has the fourth lowest gas price of the 27. reasons, I commend the motion to the House. What is the right hon. Lady’s analysis of why that has happened? Several hon. Members rose—
Caroline Flint: First, that is not about the point I was Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans): Order. The making, but is the hon. Gentleman defending the way wind-ups will start at about 6.40 pm. As hon. Members in which prices have soared in the past year? Is he can see from the clock, we do not have a lot of time for 261 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 262
[Mr Deputy Speaker] campaign. Big energy week is designed to connect consumers who are struggling to cope with energy bills the debate so if people could have in their mind a with the support available to help them to reduce their five-minute limit and aim to make a four-minute speech energy costs and maximise their income. More than we will be able to accommodate more Members. Brevity 100 events will take place across the country, reaching has to be the order of the day. out to people who might not know about those schemes. In December, Ofgem published for consultation radical 5.20 pm proposals to require suppliers to simplify their tariffs The Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change and billing information so that consumers can compare (Chris Huhne): Thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker. I shall suppliers’ deals much more easily. Currently, as the try to take on board your injunction for brevity. right hon. Member for Don Valley (Caroline Flint) has pointed out, more than 400 different tariffs are available. Last year, we saw a big energy price rise, which came Frankly, this leads to confusion rather than to greater on top of increasing petrol and food costs. With the choice. I suggest that is part of the reason why the cost of gas imports now falling, I welcome today’s switching of rates in the UK has declined over time. announcement from EDF, which has responded to the Ofgem’s proposals should help consumers to identify smaller companies leading the way such as Co-op and more easily the best deal for them. I support Ofgem’s Ovo by joining them in cutting domestic gas prices. work in this area and will continue to work with it to Some of the big energy suppliers were quick to pass on boost the transparency of bills and competition in the rising costs last year and it is only right that they should energy market. now pass on cost reductions to hard-pressed householders It should be quick and easy to switch supplier. As as quickly as possible. I urge the remaining five large part of our implementation of the EU third energy energy suppliers to follow suit and give consumers some package in November, we have cut to just three weeks respite this winter. If suppliers do not reduce prices, the time it takes to switch. Citizens Advice and Ofgem consumers can send them a clear message by voting have received the highest level of funding yet from with their feet and taking their business elsewhere. suppliers for the energy best deal campaign, which helps vulnerable consumers to shop around for the best Mr Watts: On that point, has the Secretary of State available deal. Even without changing supplier, millions contacted those energy companies and made it absolutely of households could save just by switching tariffs or clear that if they do not drop their prices, he will take payment method. action to force them to do so? As agreed at our consumer energy summit, suppliers Chris Huhne: I have been very rapid in my reaction to are placing messages on the front page of all bills to the EDF announcement and I have been pressing the encourage consumers to phone them or visit a website energy companies and saying that they need to act to to find out if they could be saving money. They are also inform their customers about the cheapest tariffs. writing to about 8 million customers who pay on receipt of their bill to tell them that they could save up to The House last debated this topic in October, when I £100 a year if they move to direct debit payment. said that simply expressing concern and sympathy for Nearly all of these letters have now been delivered. those who are struggling to pay their bills is not enough. It is our responsibility to do everything we can to help. Tessa Munt: Has my right hon. Friend made any The clear steps we have taken to increase competition progress in sorting out the situation faced by people are working and it is right that energy companies should who have prepayment meters and therefore do not feel the pressure to keep bills down. We are not complacent receive a bill? It is difficult for them to establish what and I can report that the action I promised then to help they are paying over any period, and the most vulnerable people with their bills is taking place now. customers are often in that situation.
Mr Tom Clarke (Coatbridge, Chryston and Bellshill) Chris Huhne: I am grateful to my hon. Friend for the (Lab): In the objectives that the right hon. Gentleman concern about prepayment meters. It is one thing that has set for himself and no doubt for the Government he we have been looking at closely. Thankfully, people on makes the point about keeping energy prices down. Is prepayment meters are not paying more than was previously he satisfied that Ofgem, the regulator, is exercising the the case, and that is a step forward. I am sure there is powers that it has? Are those powers insufficient? more work to be done and we are looking at it closely.
Chris Huhne: I am grateful to the right hon. Gentleman Luciana Berger (Liverpool, Wavertree) (Lab/Co-op): for raising that issue, which I shall address in greater The hon. Member for Wells (Tessa Munt) raised the detail. Ofgem is working closely with us on this and I issue of people on prepayment meters. There are two think it is tackling many of these issues. I will give other key issues concerning people. One million households further detail on that. across the UK do not have access to a bank account so Following the consumer energy summit, at which my they cannot have direct debits; likewise, there are those right hon. Friend the Prime Minister and I brought who do not have access to the internet—the digital energy suppliers, consumer groups and Ofgem together, divide. we have been working together to make sure that consumers Further to the point that the Secretary of State made know about the help that is available and about how about the energy companies that are writing to their they can cut their energy bills this winter. In October customers, I received one of those letters asking me to the Government launched the “Check, switch, insulate go on to direct debit. I called my energy company, E.on. to save” campaign on the Directgov website, and next It wanted to put me on to a monthly payment, which week Citizens Advice is co-ordinating a big energy week would have cost me at least a third more and I would 263 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 264 have had to wait until May before I could reassess the Mr Weir: Following up on the Secretary of State’s situation. So even when energy companies are writing answer to the hon. Member for Wells (Tessa Munt), I to their customers, myself included, they are not offering note that Ofgem stated in its briefing for the debate: consumers the best deal. I cannot move on to direct “The number of gas and electricity customers paying by debit because the company wants to charge me more prepayment meters has increased compared to the same quarter than I pay already. in 2010, by 6% and 4% respectively”. Those are worrying statistics indicating that people are Chris Huhne: I can only recommend that the hon. moving to prepayment meters and falling through the Lady look at switching energy supplier to see whether gaps despite the Government’s attempt to contact them she can find a better deal. We know from Ofgem that and get them on to cheaper tariffs. people can save substantial sums of money by doing that—£200 a year. Her particular case is obviously regrettable. Chris Huhne: I agree with the hon. Gentleman. Sadly, during tough times people tend to fall behind with Barry Gardiner: The Secretary of State rightly talked energy bills and so can be moved on to prepayment about the simplification of tariff structures. Will he give meters. One of the things that it is very important the a commitment to the House to look carefully at the Department does is try to ensure that those who no possibility of enforcing a rising block structure? In an longer need to be on prepayment meters, from a credit era of rising energy costs, it seems inequitable that the point of view, are moved back so that they pay more highest per unit cost should be paid for the first tranche, directly and can take advantage of those schemes. which of course the poorest families have to use. We should be applying the polluter pays principle, which Bob Stewart (Beckenham) (Con): If the Government means that as we use more energy, we pay more per unit are writing to so many vulnerable people, can we not for it. Please will the right hon. Gentleman look at that? make it as simple as possible? When we start talking about the elderly shopping around, why can we not just Chris Huhne: The hon. Gentleman makes a good say, “Here are two or three very good deals that will point. One of the first things I did on becoming Secretary work for you”, and then use that to ensure that energy of State was to ask for a serious look at the issue. It is providers bring their prices down? We should say to unfortunately much more complicated than one might energy providers, “We are going to recommend this, so suppose at first glance, not least because there is such an you had better bring your prices down.” That is what we enormous variation in energy use in different income need. We want to keep it as simple as possible. groups. For example, among the poorest people measured by income, the variation in energy use, off the top of my head, was as much as a multiple of six. There could be Chris Huhne: I entirely agree with my hon. Friend on dramatically different effects from a rising block tariff, the need to continue the whole process of clarifying which do not correspond neatly to what the hon. Gentleman energy bills and making them simpler so that they are and I would want. absolutely transparent and people find it easier to switch. That applies to all age groups. Compared to those of us We want the companies to take more account of the in our 50s, those in their 60s and 70s—the silver surfers— wholesale market. Up like a rocket and down like a actually do more on the internet, so we should not feather—that was the old days, and it must end. I agree underestimate the ability for that to happen. with the right hon. Member for Don Valley in her points on that, although I note that Ofgem did not find My hon. Friend the Member for Beckenham (Bob evidence that that was the case. We are helping, through Stewart) might be interested to know that the letters the greater competition, to get the consumer the best deal Government are sending out direct customers to a and we have done a great deal to defend the consumer dedicated independent helpline as part of our programme interest over the past 20 months—rather more, I would to ensure that an extra 3.5 million homes are properly say, than the right hon. Lady’s Government did in insulated by the end of 2012, and later this year we will 13 years. be rolling out the green deal to help even more households save money through energy efficiency. We are ensuring Caroline Flint: Can the right hon. Gentleman answer that extra support is available this winter for the most my question? How many consumers have switched since vulnerable households. We are requiring energy companies the energy summit? to provide help to around 2 million low-income households through the warm homes discount, at a cost of £250 million Chris Huhne: I will let the right hon. Lady know the for 2011-12, which is 40% more in cash terms than last information as soon as we have it. When it is available, I year under the voluntary arrangements operated by the will write to her. previous Government. It is important to get the message across that households The right hon. Member for Don Valley made much can save money not only by switching supplier, but by of our apparent meanness on this exercise, but I do not using less energy. Insulating lofts and walls can cut see how the Government can be accused of being mean energy bills. The six largest energy suppliers all offer to those in the most vulnerable groups when it comes to free or cut-price insulation, yet many households still energy bills when we are increasing the warm homes have not taken up the offer. That is why the Government discount by 40%. The scheme will help around 600,000 are writing to 4 million of the most vulnerable energy of the poorest pensioners with a core group discount of customers to tell them that they are eligible for free or £120 this winter. We are spending £110 million on heavily discounted loft or cavity wall insulation, and I heating and insulation for low-income and vulnerable am pleased to say that the initiative has been funded by households living in energy-inefficient housing through suppliers. the Warm Front scheme. We will also provide winter 265 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 266
[Chris Huhne] Chris Huhne: My hon. Friend is absolutely right. The story of energy policy under the previous Government fuel payments to pensioners and cold weather payments is one of stopping and starting, and of failing to face up to some households in areas that have extended periods to the need for many years to deal with the problem of of very cold weather. renewing our energy infrastructure. But we are not dithering or delaying any longer: we in this Government Robert Flello: Many of the houses in my constituency are biting the bullet. We are determined to proceed with and others were built without cavities. Often people what is necessary to ensure that we have clean, green take the opportunity to insulate their roofs and loft and secure energy for our nation. spaces but cannot do more because there are no more Our proposals to reform the electricity market will cavities to fill. What will the Secretary of State do about deliver the best deal for Britain and for consumers, that? ensuring secure, low-carbon electricity supplies, and Chris Huhne: The hon. Gentleman’s constituency is providing green jobs. clearly a perfect place for the green deal, because the ECO subsidy will in part subsidise solid-wall homes Malcolm Wicks (Croydon North) (Lab): This is not with solid-wall insulation. That will be a very substantial the point that I was going to make, but I recall the step forward for many people who have not been in a previous, Labour Government making the difficult decision position to benefit from energy efficiency because they on nuclear so convincingly that even the Liberal Democrats have not had cavities to fill. A very large number of are now in support. people in housing built before the first world war, and in On the long-term issue, however, what is missing more recent housing built quickly after the second from this debate is the global dimension, although the world war, are in that position, and this measure will Secretary of State has touched on it. Given that world help. energy demand is going to increase by 30-odd% in the coming years, with consequences for pricing, has the Chris Heaton-Harris (Daventry) (Con): There was a Department made any forecast of the implications for ten-minute rule Bill yesterday on park homes. Will they British energy prices and costs over the next 10 or benefit from the green deal? 15 years? Chris Huhne: Park homes will be eligible for the green deal. We in the ministerial team are very keen to ensure Chris Huhne: I very happily exempt the right hon. that park homes, which are often the Cinderella of the Gentleman from my strictures about the previous housing stock, are looked after, and we are trying our Government’s policy, because when he was in the post best to ensure that they are eligible for the full array of of Energy Minister he certainly took some tough decisions, measures that are available elsewhere. but sadly the record over the 13 years is not one of which Labour Members can be proud. The new energy company obligation, alongside the green deal, will include support not just for solid-wall On energy prices, the right hon. Gentleman is absolutely insulation, which I mentioned to the hon. Member for right, and we have of course produced a forecast in the Stoke-on-Trent South (Robert Flello), but provide annual energy statement. Like all forecasts, it gets more “affordable warmth” to low-income and vulnerable uncertain the further out it goes, but it does point to a households, through heating and insulation measures. rise over time in oil and gas prices worldwide because of That is the direct replacement for the Warm Front increased demand from, in particular, the far east. One scheme, so the right hon. Lady’s charge that we are the of the current environment’s most striking features, first Government not to pay for help through public about which there ought to be much greater public expenditure is disingenuous, because there will be help, awareness and debate, is the sharp recovery in oil, gas but it will be delivered in a different way through the and other commodity prices, despite continued relatively ECO subsidy, and with greater targeting and, I believe, slow growth in Europe, the United States and Japan. greater help. This is the first time that that has happened in the Those policies will make a difference this winter and post-war period. That shows the influence that the next, but, as I said in October when I addressed the rapid growth and catch-up in the far east will have on House on this topic, we also need to take the right world commodity prices. long-term decisions so that energy does not become unaffordable. We must keep the lights on in the cheapest, Guy Opperman: I merely reiterate the point that with cleanest way to ensure that households get the best deal 24% of the north-east in fuel poverty, the situation in in the long term. Over the next 10 years, we need relation to heating oil and liquefied petroleum gas for £110 billion of investment in power plants and another off-grid customers is clearly unsatisfactory. Does the £90 billion of investment in energy infrastructure to Secretary of State accept that and what specifically does avoid the risk of blackouts. We must invest now not only he intend to do about it? to improve our energy efficiency, so that we do not need to produce as much energy to keep warm, but to reduce Chris Huhne: My hon. Friend makes a good and our dependence on fossil fuels in the long term, so that important point. People who are off-grid have traditionally we do not have to rely on ever-more expensive imports. had to deal with substantially higher costs than those who are on grid, and that continues to be the case. The Alec Shelbrooke (Elmet and Rothwell) (Con): I wonder case for regulating off-grid is weak, because as long as whether we are in the position we are in today because the market is competitive, it ought to deliver a reasonable of the previous Administration’s inability to take the result for consumers. I was surprised, as were other decisions needed to ensure that we had a firm energy members of the ministerial team, that when we asked future. the Office of Fair Trading to look at the market, it was 267 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 268 given a clean bill of health on competition grounds. We Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans): Order. Please need to continue to watch this situation and we are very keep in mind the need for brevity, as we have less than much on the case. With the renewable heat incentive an hour before the wind-ups. and the green deal, it will be important that people who are off-grid think about other options rather than being reliant on heating oil, such as ground source heat pumps 5.44 pm and biomass, which can already be cheaper than on-grid Albert Owen (Ynys Môn) (Lab): It is always a pleasure options. to follow the Secretary of State. I, too, welcome the debate, and I congratulate my right hon. Friend the Graham Stringer (Blackley and Broughton) (Lab): Member for Don Valley (Caroline Flint) on calling it The Secretary of State correctly points out that all and on keeping up the pressure on the energy companies, projections on future energy prices show an upward which is very important. As she said, the Government trend. There is a debate about how much of that is agreed to a motion in October calling for investigation down to renewables. One interesting difference between of mis-selling, the simplification of tariffs and improved the UK and European market and the United States transparency, and for energy companies to use their market is that there has been a decoupling of the gas profits to help with bills. We have not seen a lot of price from the oil price in the north American market action yet on the points in that motion, but I acknowledge because of the intense use of shale gas that has been that there has been some progress, which can be laid at developed. What will the right hon. Gentleman do to the door of the regulator, which has been more proactive, develop shale gas in Lancashire and elsewhere in this and of the consumer groups. I pay tribute to Consumer country to change the projections so that the price of Focus, Citizens Advice and Which?, which have highlighted gas goes down? many of the issues involved. The House and politicians from all parties can also take credit, because we have Chris Huhne: I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for embarrassed many of the energy companies into taking his question. Shale gas is potentially an exciting development action. I welcome today’s 5% price reduction, but I that could bring enormous prosperity to the parts of agree with other Members that it does not in any way the country where it has been found, such as Lancashire. make up for the previous double-digit rises. Provided that all the environmental safeguards are properly Although we have had a mild winter—[Interruption.] in place, it presents the opportunity to reduce the cost I know that there are exceptions, such as the wind in of gas. Of course, for the same calorific value, gas is Scotland, but compared with last year we have had a about half as polluting in carbon terms as coal. Used mild winter. However, that does not disguise the fact with carbon capture and storage, it may be a long-term that there will be huge rises in the bills that people source of electricity generation. We are looking closely receive in January. at this issue. We have been in contact with Cuadrilla, the I wish to concentrate my remarks on those who are energy company that has been involved in exploration not on the gas grid. I make no apologies for doing so in Lancashire. I hope that we will be able to make again and again. They are not a fringe group but some progress. Crucially, we must learn the lessons from the 2 million households in Britain alone, which does not mistakes that were made in the United States. I do not include Northern Ireland, where 80% are off-grid. Those want to see water tables contaminated; nor do I want families do not get the same protection as those who are the industry to be exempted from the provisions for on-grid when it comes to simple matters such as help clean water, which is what happened in the United with prices. I make a direct plea to the Government to States. There will be a different regulatory environment. help those people. I cannot overstate that case. They In that context, I am sure that we can see success. ruled out social tariffs for those off the grid, I believe in As so many people want to speak, I will curtail the June 2010, and I ask them to reconsider that. remarks that I was going to make about our work with The Energy and Climate Change Committee is Ofgem. I will simply say again that we are considering undertaking a mini-inquiry into fuel poverty and off-grid giving Ofgem powers to order companies to provide gas, and we heard evidence today from the Office of redress to consumers who lose out as a result of a Fair Trading. Unlike the Secretary of State, I was not company’s regulatory breach. As a result of our surprised that the OFT came to the conclusions that it implementation of the EU’s third energy package, did, because it has a very narrow remit. The people who companies are no longer able to block action by the undertook the inquiry did not look at the matter in energy regulator, Ofgem, by forcing it to seek a second enough detail to conclude what we all know—that opinion from the Competition Commission. We are people off the grid have been ripped off in many ways. determined to be on the side of the consumer in ensuring It is not enough to refer the matter to the Competition that the market is as competitive as we can make it. Commission. The problem of higher prices is real, but We are doing everything that we can to help households anecdotal evidence that we have received from consumer with their energy bills this winter. On tariffs, bills and action groups such as the one from the constituency of insulation, we are making it easier for people to save the hon. Member for Hexham (Guy Opperman) that money and energy. We are taking action to help the gave evidence today, and from the constituents who most vulnerable households cope with rising bills and write to us, suggests that people off the grid are being inefficient properties, and from the green deal to the treated unfairly. There might be four companies in an reform of the electricity market we are making the right area providing fuel, but they are all selling at very high long-term decisions to ensure warm homes and affordable, prices. secure energy for the future. Fuel poverty in off-grid areas is going up. I have some figures from Consumer Focus that I will share with the Several hon. Members rose— House. Some 28% of fuel-poor customers in England, 269 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 270
[Albert Owen] simply state that everything is the fault of the existing Government. Many people feel that the Labour party 34% in Scotland and 37% in Wales are not connected to likes to be in perpetual opposition—my constituents the grid. To be fair to the Minister of State, the hon. certainly feel that, and I see nothing to disprove the Member for Wealden (Charles Hendry), he has met theory. The right hon. Member for Don Valley (Caroline Members representing off-grid customers since the last Flint) was very clear about the reforms that she wants debate. I urge him to give Ofgem the responsibility to to make, so why was she not clear when she was in treat customers who are off the grid equally. As I said, government only two years ago? Perhaps the comment there are 2 million such households, and they deserve about window dressing goes a lot further than we the same treatment and the same protection as those thought. who are on the grid. Of course, we are trying to move forward in our I urge the Secretary of State to consider radically proposals for energy consumption in this country, and extending the gas mains. The renewable heat incentive the Secretary of State is right to say that we have bitten may be a good thing, but it is a long way in the future. the bullet on how to generate energy. Let us be honest: We could create jobs in construction and help to alleviate we are in a coalition and we know that the Liberal fuel poverty if we extended the gas mains to off-grid Democrats had views on nuclear power. They held a areas. They include not just isolated areas but those perfectly acceptable view in their manifesto, and I greatly very close to the original gas mains that supply towns respect the work that the hon. Member for Wells (Tessa and cities. Such an extension could be done relatively Munt) has done throughout her life as a member of quickly and would be real action, which is what our CND—they were her beliefs, but we had to move forward. constituents demand.
5.49 pm Tessa Munt: They still are my beliefs. Alec Shelbrooke (Elmet and Rothwell) (Con): The motion’s opening line states: Alec Shelbrooke: Quite right—the hon. Lady corrects “That this House believes that soaring energy bills are driving up inflation”. me from a sedentary position. However, we had to bite the bullet and make decisions to secure this country’s No one can argue with that. There has been a massive energy future. All those things have a knock-on effect. increase in energy bills, and before we continue with the The Labour Government’s dithering, delay and debate, we should assess the reasons for that. All the unwillingness to make those decisions because of the independent financial analysts recognise that there has fright their Back Benchers gave them have been shown been a double-digit inflationary rise in energy bills, and up massively by the two parties that came together to that has spread to the economy. We live in a dangerous run the country after the mess left by the last lot, with world, where there is much instability. The European one coalition partner making a decision that it did not Union recently approved sanctions on oil exports from want to take, but realising that it was right for the Iran. All that has a knock-on effect on energy prices in country. That is what is important: what is right for the this country. It is important, when setting the scene for country. the debate, to understand why energy prices have increased and that the Government can do something, but not The right hon. Member for Don Valley said much everything. about the Government’s cutting the winter fuel allowance In the summer I was in the United States when for 2 million pensioners; there was a lot of “We told you Michele Bachmann amusingly commented that she would so.” Later in her speech, however, the right hon. Lady reduce the price of fuel back to $2 a gallon. Perhaps said that the proposed legislation was initiated by the that is why she has polled only 5% in the primaries—one Labour Government and we have picked up on it. She simply cannot say, “We’ll reduce it back”: that flies in cannot have it both ways. Labour was quite clear in its the face of dealing with the world crisis. There has been manifesto and previous decisions that it would do exactly discussion for many years—certainly when I was at the same thing on the winter fuel allowance. In these school, but it is now coming to the fore—about whether austere times, it is the Government who are resisting the we have reached peak oil. Whether we have or not does populist pressure, coming perhaps from some of the not matter because the markets believe that we have more right-wing media, to means-test the winter fuel reached that position. allowance, and we are ensuring that it is all there. The There has been a 30% increase in energy demand in tax bribes that Labour was giving out at the last election the recent past. As the Secretary of State pointed out, were seen through, which is why it suffered the worst there are forecasts, but the further into the future they defeat since 1918. go, the more unreliable they are. I have already outlined the need for a coherent policy on energy futures, which will help to bring prices down. Mr Mark Spencer (Sherwood) (Con): Yesterday, the The situation with the feed-in tariffs is difficult, but we Leader of the Opposition said that the previous need to ensure that progress is made. We have done Administration had not made enough progress, and he many other things to help people with their pensions, was Energy Secretary at the time. Is my hon. Friend as including introducing the triple lock, and ensuring that relieved as I am that we now have a ministerial team pensioners this year will receive the highest cash settlement that is taking action to deliver real change, not only on that they have received in the last 100 years—it is huge. lowering prices but on securing our energy future? There is every chance that the Opposition motion Alec Shelbrooke: I am most grateful for that intervention. would lead to more borrowing, less tax, and disaster. Half the problem with such motions is that they ignore When people cannot pay their bills, it is because of the the facts that I outlined in my opening remarks and economic incompetence of the Labour party. 271 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 272
5.56 pm John Robertson: I will not give way. There are a lot of people wanting to speak. John Robertson (Glasgow North West) (Lab): I shall try to talk to the subject that we are here to discuss, My constituents are grossly disadvantaged. The Secretary unlike the hon. Member for Elmet and Rothwell (Alec of State talked about going on the internet, but the low Shelbrooke). internet uptake in Glasgow—we have one of the lowest Last year, the average household saw energy costs rise uptakes—will not allow that to happen for my constituents. by about £300 and Ofgem announced last October that However, I was pleased to hear that he has taken on the profit for energy companies had risen to £125 per board the point about severe housing, which is what we customer per year, from £15 in June. My contention is have. Efficiency savings cannot be made in concrete not that the cost of energy is rising, but that the big six housing blocks. In fact, all my constituents seem to do do not have a great track record of passing on wholesale is pay to heat up the concrete blocks in the winter and decreases as quickly as increases. cool them down in the summer. I therefore look forward to hearing more from the Minister. I hope he will look Today’s wholesale energy prices are lower than they at the prices, go back to the companies, give Ofgem the were a few years ago—and lower than they were only a teeth that it needs and ensure that the fines that should few months ago. According to Bloomberg, the wholesale be imposed on the companies in question are indeed price for gas in autumn 2008 hit over 70p a therm. If we imposed. compare that with 59p per therm last October, we see that wholesale gas prices have actually dropped 15% since then. Similarly, prices in the wholesale electricity market 6.1 pm reached £120 per megawatt-hour in autumn 2008. Today, they are just over £50 per megawatt-hour—less than Simon Wright (Norwich South) (LD): In October we half the price back then. But gas prices have dropped by saw the launch of the “Check, switch, insulate to save” only 15% and electricity prices by only 11% since last campaign. There is a clear need to raise awareness of May’s peak. According to Bloomberg, in December what people can do today to reduce their bills. Many natural gas futures declined by 30% compared with people can go online, check around for better deals and 2011. Today, energy companies can buy their gas for switch suppliers or change to a cheaper tariff, but three 53p per therm, some 9% cheaper than even last October. in every five consumers say that, in fact, they have never The reason for this is sadly apparent. European demand switched supplier. There are perhaps a number of reasons is going down as the continent is moving towards a why not, one of which is that there remains a digital downturn and productivity is declining. This may be divide, which means that the information is not as easily why EDF announced today a 5% cut, but—as my right or quickly available to all. What is more, many of the hon. Friend the Member for Don Valley (Caroline best deals are for online-only web accounts. Many Flint) pointed out—the company raised its gas prices households could save around £100 immediately by last year by 15.4% while future gas derivative prices simply moving to an online account, but this is little were falling, and while current market prices are down help to those who have not embraced the internet, on previous years. which in many cases also includes poorer households. As a result, there is great suspicion among many, Those who are not online include more than half the including Ofgem, that the big six have not been passing UK’s over-65 population. on wholesale market price reductions, not only last year Other households tend to avoid doing too much of but this year. These are clear acts of anti-competiveness their business online, because they have poor quality in themselves, especially towards smaller energy companies, internet access where they live. I strongly welcome the let alone customers and small businesses. For example, Government’s investment in better broadband for Norfolk. section 2 of the Competition Act 1998 prohibits the Better communication links will allow more people to abuse of a dominant position in a market by one or search online for the cheapest services and, as a result, more undertakings which may affect trade within the become more powerful consumers. However, even with UK. I will quote competition law guidelines again as it 100% broadband coverage, many households will still seems that the Secretary of State did not hear me the not connect to the internet. It is therefore vital that last time I did so. They state: every effort be made to ensure that support is available “Conduct may be abusive when, through the effects of conduct for offline consumers to ensure that everyone can access on the competitive process, it adversely affects consumers directly the cheapest tariffs, not just the internet-savvy. I welcome (for example, through the prices charged) or indirectly (for example, the work that citizens advice bureaux and Ofgem are conduct which reduces the intensity of existing competition or doing to help. potential competition). A dominant undertaking is under a special responsibility not to allow its conduct to impair undistorted competition.” Bob Stewart: Is that not the very point that we were I strongly suspect that one reason behind the price rises making earlier? Citizens advice bureaux and the is probably that the companies have grossly failed to Department, in sending out these letters, should advise stockpile their energy reserves to hedge adequately against vulnerable people exactly what they think is best for future prices. That could explain why, when future them. That should make it as simple as possible for very prices have fallen by almost a third, the companies are vulnerable people, and that is our duty. not passing on the reduction. There may be numerous reasons for that—one reason is probably ineptitude—but Simon Wright: That is a very good point, and I thank I feel that the main answer lies more in the lack of any the hon. Gentleman for making it, but given the sometimes incentive to pass on substantial price rises. huge price differential between online and offline accounts, I hope that Ministers can work with Ofgem and the David Mowat: Will the hon. Gentleman give way? suppliers to seek to narrow the gap. 273 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 274
[Simon Wright] prices, how many of their customers will go elsewhere? Promoting competition now is vital, and I welcome the In recent years, competition for new customers seems emphasis that Ministers, working with Ofgem, have to have been increasingly focused on price comparison given to this issue. websites. That has meant that those who use such tools Today’s debate is important. The issues are not simple, can find massive discounts for web-only accounts, while but the public rightly expect Ministers to intervene, and the majority, who do not, end up paying more. To I welcome the progress that has been made in recent improve competition, we need simpler tariffs. Over 70% months. We are heading in the right direction, and I of consumers tested in Ofgem’s market research said urge Ministers to continue. that they would be more likely to switch if tariffs were made clearer. With a bewildering 400 or so tariffs available, only 44% of people in Ofgem’s research were 6.7 pm able to select the cheapest tariff, even under a simplified Mr Tom Clarke (Coatbridge, Chryston and Bellshill) form of the current arrangements. (Lab): My objective today is, as it has been in similar We also need tariffs to be structured in a way that debates under the previous Government and this one, encourages energy conservation. A system of rising to speak up for my constituents who are getting a very block tariffs—which was mentioned earlier—where raw deal from the energy suppliers. Energy companies customers pay less for the initial blocks of consumption are renowned for using fluctuations in wholesale prices and a rising amount for subsequent blocks, would provide as an excuse for unacceptably high domestic energy an additional financial motivation for households to bills. The issue affects every household in my constituency, consider energy conservation. Low energy users would particularly those of pensioners and families on low be rewarded for their efforts. At present, intensive energy incomes with young children, and it causes financial users pay proportionately less. misery to consumers. I recognise that there are concerns about the unintended I have written to Ofgem, and met representatives of impacts that such a system could have on households the organisation. I have sought to remind it of its duty that necessarily consume high amounts of energy, such to consumers. Likewise, I have been in touch with the as those of people with long-term health conditions Office of Fair Trading, which has a duty to ensure that a who need to keep their house at a higher temperature. cartel is not operating against the public interest. I Perhaps we could consider other forms of social tariffs remain to be convinced about that. The problem that for such households, and examine whether extra support we are discussing today will not simply go away, and my could be made available for housing insulation activity will continue until pressure is brought to bear improvements, possibly through the green deal and on energy suppliers to reduce the inflated prices that are through energy company observation. I know that Professor being unfairly charged to all households. Hills’s fuel poverty review will consider tariff structures As I travel round my constituency, I find that the in its final report, and I hope that energy conservation issue uppermost in the minds of my constituents is the will be seen as an important part of that work. rocketing price of gas and electricity. The price of both I also want to mention smart meters, which could has gone up substantially, leaving those consumers helpless play a massively important role for consumers. Every or in debt from dealing with the problem. Food inflation household should have one by the end of this decade. is up by 6.2%. Electricity prices have risen by 10%, and As well as encouraging more efficient energy use and gas prices are up by as much as 17.4%. allowing for more precise billing, these meters will I was hoping that during this debate we might be provide consumers with billing information on what spared the fool’s bargain solution of asking the public they are paying for, at the touch of a button. There is to switch providers. By heavens, we have heard that so great potential for people to use that information to often. This has not, is not and never will be the solution. ensure that they are getting a good deal. For households I have a sense that the Government know, deep down, to get the maximum benefit, consideration must be that what I am saying is perfectly true. given to how best to inform, engage, and motivate There is no need for extensive research into the domestic consumers to use their meters to the best effect. The energy supply industry. The man and woman in the consumer engagement strategy, which I hope to see street are absolutely convinced that energy companies being developed and implemented during this year, will are simply leapfrogging one after another when it comes have a vital role to play in that regard. to increases. An unregulated energy market that allows Simplifying and reforming tariffs and improving consumer prices to soar while wholesale prices are transparency are all necessary short-term steps required decreasing is unjust, irresponsible and is hitting the to increase competition. There are a few encouraging poorest households hardest. The rip-off continues unabated, signs of competition in what is, overall, a difficult and I think we are right to challenge it today. market for consumers. Today’s announcement by EDF Let me issue this challenge to the Minister: can he of a reduction in its customers’ gas bills in response to name any other product or commodity that has risen in the falling cost of imported gas, following similar moves price so steeply not just during last year, but during the by smaller suppliers such as Ovo and the Co-op, will be last decade? This explains why energy prices have, frankly, welcomed by many of my constituents. Last year, however, become a national scandal. I am in constant touch with rising costs were passed on to customers very quickly, ordinary decent people in my constituency who are and I now want to see—on behalf of all of my struggling against extraordinary energy price increases. constituents—action being taken by the other big five Consumers need energy to keep themselves warm and energy suppliers to reduce their prices. Whether or not to cook meals, and they need hot water. Wholesale price they do so will be an indicator of how competitive the fluctuations have largely been blamed on the energy market is for consumers. If suppliers do not reduce supply from the continent, but there is a healthy scepticism 275 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 276 about this rationale. I am not against companies making A Secretary of State does not call for a reform of the a profit. What I am against are the profits of energy energy market, or of the electricity market. The right companies rocketing while consumers are facing human hon. Gentleman’s purpose should have been to do misery. something about the situation, but far from doing something Clearly, we need to ask whether competition is working about it—or even calling for something to be done as it should. Are companies becoming too comfortable about it—he issued the following warning to the then in this small sector in which the price-setter, British Gas Opposition Front Bench during a 2009 debate on the seems more keen to keep its prices up than to keep its Energy Bill: customers? I am not especially concerned with the “I have to say that the alarmism... is of no help at all.”—[Official profits that those companies are making—obscene though Report, 7 December 2009; Vol. 502, c. 43.] I believe them to be. Nor am I concerned about whether It was not alarmism, however. We understood that the they should face competition inquiries or fines, because market was broken, and we understood that fundamental fines will be of no use whatever to low-income families changes were needed. That is why it is we who are in my constituency. My concern is that those people introducing the changes that need to be made now that should get a fairer deal—no less and no more than that. we are in power. The previous Government made huge strides to combat My first problem with the proposals in the motion is fuel poverty through the winter fuel payment and other that they do not have the agreement of even small measures such as pension credit. The tragedy is that energy providers, who say that the right hon. Lady’s those efforts are being completely undermined and devalued pooling mechanism would not work. by the scandalous energy prices that consumers are being— Caroline Flint: How do you know? Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans): Order. Ben Gummer: I can tell the right hon. Lady, in answer 6.12 pm to her sedentary question, that even the small providers have put that on record. Ben Gummer (Ipswich) (Con): It is always a great pleasure and honour to follow the right hon. Member Secondly, the right hon. Lady alluded to a series of for Coatbridge, Chryston and Bellshill (Mr Clarke), reforms that she believes would combat fuel poverty. whose defence of his constituents is always reasonable That suggested that the last Government’s attempts had and valiant. I think he is right to this extent—that somehow been successful, or would be successful were appealing to people to switch supplier will not be the they to be continued. In that earlier debate, the right entire cure for problems in the energy market. The hon. Lady also said: reason for that is that the energy market is broken, so “we had the most ambitious programme to help people in fuel competition will not work entirely. It can work to a poverty deal with their bills”. —[Official Report, 19 October certain extent, but not entirely, if the market cannot 2011; Vol. 533, c. 932.] deliver what the consumer wants. Let me remind her of that policy. Between 2000 and To understand how to fix the market, we have to look 2008 the last Government spent £20 billion on abatement at the history of the market and why it went wrong. If of fuel costs, and what happened to fuel poverty during we look at energy prices, we find that they have moved that period? It increased by 333%. That was indeed since the privatisation of the late ’80s. They fell consistently ambitious. It was ambitious to the extent that for every beneath the retail prices index every year from the late household the Labour party put into fuel poverty, the ’80s and the early 2000s. They did so over a longer taxpayer paid £5,700. The taxpayer paid £5,700 to period than at any time since records of energy prices reduce a household to fuel poverty, yet Labour Members began. Then, from the mid-2000s they levelled out, and have had the cynicism to come to the House and claim from 2005 to 2007 they increased further than RPI until that their policies would work again, and that the brave 2010 when the last Government left office. and principled position of Her Majesty’s Government is somehow misguided. It is a hypocrisy which lays bare I am fully aware that this is often not a moment to a party that has no ideas of its own, and is reduced to talk about the previous Government’s record, but they attacking its own record. had a fundamental hand to play in the reasons why we are in the position we are in now. It is also incumbent on us to point out that much of the responsibility lies with 6.17 pm the man whose name stands at the head of the motion who seeks to lead the British public as Prime Minister Pat Glass (North West Durham) (Lab): I have spoken after the next election. He is responsible for the complete in every energy debate in the House since my election. lack of action taken to do anything about the broken That is because my constituency is largely rural and is in energy market, which has caused the problems from the north-east, and because 25% of my constituents are which our constituents, including those of the right living in fuel poverty. Many of them are on low incomes, hon. Member for Coatbridge, Chryston and Bellshill, there is high unemployment in the constituency—it has suffer today. doubled in the last 12 months—and we have an ageing population. Any suggestion of an increase in fuel costs In a debate earlier in the Session, the right hon. always causes real fear and anxiety in constituencies Member for Don Valley (Caroline Flint)—who is now such as mine. shouting from a sedentary position—said that reform of the electricity market was I listened carefully to what the Secretary of State had “what my right hon. Friend the Member for Doncaster North to say. While apparently guiding us carefully through (Edward Miliband) has been calling for ever since he was Energy the complexities of the energy industry, he seemed to Secretary, including now, as leader of the Labour party.”—[Official me to be doing so from the point of view of the chief Report, 19 October 2011; Vol. 533, c. 931.] executive of an energy company, and I found that 277 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 278
[Pat Glass] I am pleased that the Prime Minister seems recently to have woken up to the public’s anger about irresponsible incredibly disappointing. I thought it was complacent capitalism. We have a culture in which obscene profits in the extreme, and I believe that my constituents would are made and consumers are suffering as a result. However, be rightly angered by it. The Secretary of State spoke of I do not believe that the Prime Minister is serious about dithering and delay in the last Government, but in the this; rather, I think it is just focus-group rhetoric. If he two years in which I have been in the House, I have is really serious about doing something about irresponsible witnessed a master class in dithering and delay. We need capitalism, the energy industry in this country is a good to get on with doing something about the present place to start. situation. In my brief speech, I want to raise two issues. As a 6.23 pm past student of economics, I want to discuss the artificial economy created by successive Governments in the Sarah Newton (Truro and Falmouth) (Con): I simply energy industry, and I also want to return to the issue of do not accept the criticism we have heard this afternoon off-grid and heating oil prices. from the Opposition that the Government are sitting on Successive Governments have created and modified their hands and letting people die in their homes this the artificial market in the industry, but that artificial winter. In the few minutes available to me, I shall market has failed to establish safeguards that would demonstrate that, as Opposition Members have said, prevent companies from manipulating the market in actions do, indeed, speak louder than words, and I shall order to achieve massive profits at the expense of the describe a fraction of the things that are being done in consumer and at virtually no risk to themselves. It has my constituency to tackle fuel poverty now, as we speak. failed to prevent an oligopoly in which these companies Cornwall council and the council of the Isles of Scilly can operate with impunity. We now have few suppliers have led a successful bid to the Department of Health in the market and entry into the market is almost for more than £140,000 for a campaign called “Warm impossible, and the actions of those few suppliers have homes, healthy people”. It is estimated that each year a disproportionate and negative impact on consumer about 300 people in Cornwall die as a result of living in prices. cold homes, which is, of course, 300 too many. Partners Most of our strategic energy companies are also now in this campaign include the NHS in Cornwall and the foreign-owned. I sat through the previous debate on Isles of Scilly, Age UK, Community Energy Plus, the transport, and I heard the shadow Secretary of State citizens advice bureaux, Cornwall Voluntary Sector Forum, tell us how the rail industry is being gradually renationalised Truro Homeless Action Group, the home improvements and returned to Government ownership, but, unfortunately, agencies, St Petroc’s, the Cornwall drug and alcohol not British-Government ownership; foreign companies team, New Connection and the councils’ own housing and Governments now own our rail industry, and the and adult social care teams. All of them are combining same is happening in our energy industry. their efforts to tackle this problem. They will identify those most at risk of fuel poverty. They are going to On off-grid and off-gas, I was stunned by the Secretary make sure that people access all the advice and support of State’s remark that the Office of Fair Trading report that is already available for them. As the right hon. gave a clean bill of health to the industry. It is clear to Member for Don Valley (Caroline Flint) said, millions me that he has not read that report. I accept that the of pounds go unclaimed in benefits and compensation report said there was no monopoly in heating oil, but I from energy companies. This practical programme will think that is because its remit was far too narrow so the make sure that the people who need support actually investigation was too limited. access it. Guy Opperman: I am the hon. Lady’s constituency neighbour and we share a great deal of common ground Mr Watts: Will the hon. Lady give way? on the issue of off-grid problems. So far as my constituents are concerned, there is no genuine competition and Sarah Newton: I will not, because I want to allow fairness of pricing in respect of off-grid, so from their more colleagues to join in. point of view the report by the OFT, which was only a The programme is going to give people really good market study, is manifestly insufficient and not right. advice on how to protect themselves from the risks of Do her constituents convey the same concerns? high humidity and on insulating their homes, and it will make sure that they are taking up the available grants. It Pat Glass: Yes, exactly the same issues are raised in is also going to make sure that people really take my constituency surgeries. The OFT accepted that in advantage of the many existing free programmes. some parts of the country there are fewer than three This programme has had widespread support from suppliers, but in practice even though there may be people in Cornwall. The council cabinet member responsible three advertised suppliers, sometimes only one company for health and well-being has said: is prepared to deliver. That is certainly the case in parts “This is a great example of community and voluntary organisations of my constituency, and I am sure that is also the case coming together with the public sector to offer a joined up elsewhere. That may not be a monopoly in the view of approach to a big issue. The funding is very welcome indeed as it the OFT, but for my constituents it is definitely a will help all the agencies involved target support to those in most monopoly. Some of my constituents were faced with need and at most risk. By working together, frontline workers and increases of almost 100% in heating oil prices in the volunteers will have systems in place to make sure that vulnerable run-up to Christmas last year, and only one company people are directed to the service most able to help them.” was prepared to deliver. I call that a monopoly. I urge Our director of public health for Cornwall and the Isles the Government, and my party’s Front-Bench team, to of Scilly has also warmly welcomed this investment, look again at the regulation of this sector. saying that it will be used alongside money that Cornwall 279 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 280 council and the NHS already spend in subsidising the I note that Labour’s motion suggests that we should Warm Front scheme to ensure that all the costs of “require energy companies to provide the lowest tariff to over insulating people’s homes are met. 75s”. In addition, the council cabinet member responsible That, in itself, is a good idea, but the problem is that it for housing has said that this funding is “great news” will work only if the tariffs are lower; there is no point and is going to back up the money already being putting people on the lowest tariff if all the tariffs are received from the Government to tackle homelessness. high, which tends to be the position at the moment. At People who are homeless or living in very poor quality the Scottish Government’s energy summit last November, accommodation—in the mobile homes and park homes Scotland’s six largest energy providers pledged to help that we have heard about; in poor quality, poorly insulated vulnerable customers transfer to their most efficient private rented sector accommodation—will be able to tariff, so there has been some movement on this issue top up the money the Government are already giving to and it should be encouraged. However, the previous people at risk of homelessness, which will actually make system of higher winter fuel allowances for elderly a difference this winter. people is a much better option, because it reduces the In addition, I have been working with all these different amount they have to pay out, irrespective of what bill voluntary sector organisations, and together, along with they are on, and I am slightly disappointed that Labour Church groups and poverty forums, we have come up seems to be moving away from that approach. with a practical guide that will be widely distributed to I wish to make the point about off-grid customers, of people. Anyone and everyone who is worried about whom my constituency has many and about which heating their homes this winter will have the full range other hon. Members have spoken. I have previously of advice about all the benefits and services available to raised this prospect, but the Government should consider, them. at the very least, making the winter fuel payment earlier I challenge my colleagues on the Opposition Benches. to vulnerable people who are off-grid, as that would Yes, actions do speak louder than words, and rather allow them to fill up their tanks in the summer or early than spending hours in these sterile and futile debates, autumn, when the price tends to be lower, although it is why do they not roll up their sleeves, go back to their not always. That is a no-cost and positive option, so I constituencies and work with those who really want to urge the Minister at least to consider it again. make a difference to people this winter?
Several hon. Members rose— 6.30 pm David Mowat (Warrington South) (Con): I have been Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans): Order. I want sitting here for a few moments trying to work out to allow some people who have been here throughout whether to talk quickly in the next few minutes or to the debate to get at least something on the record. I do curtail my remarks. I wish briefly to say something not like dropping the time limit to three minutes, but I about the structure of the UK gas and electricity industries. am afraid I have to. I call Mike Weir. First, I shall discuss the gas industry. I heard the comments made by hon. Members from both sides of 6.28 pm the House, but particularly by Labour Members, about Mr Mike Weir (Angus) (SNP): In the brief time the predatory nature of the industry, cartels, price fixing available I just want to make a few comments. Rising and so on. I return to my earlier intervention by saying energy prices are obviously causing huge problems for that this country has the lowest gas prices in Europe, many families. Every 5% rise puts a further 46,000 leaving aside three small countries. I am not defending households into fuel poverty. It is not a completely grim these organisations and if the prices could be lower, picture. For once, there is some good news in Scotland. they should be lower. However, if that situation is the The Scottish house condition survey, which measures result of predatory pricing and the operation of a fuel poverty, published in November, shows a reduction cartel, the companies are not very good at it. in the number of homes in fuel poverty in 2010, although, like the rest of the UK, the figure remains far too high. Ben Gummer: Is my hon. Friend aware that the probe The current average dual fuel bill is now £1,345 a year, initiated by the previous Secretary of State found that an increase of almost 50% over the past four years. the energy companies were not acting as a cartel and Today, EDF trumpeted the decision to reduce gas prices that there was indeed price transparency between them? by 5%, but that comes on top of an increase only a couple a months ago of 15.4%. David Mowat: I was aware of that, and I shall finish There are other related issues. I raised with the Secretary on this point by saying that if Labour Members have of State in an intervention the issue of prepayment evidence of directors operating a cartel, which is a meters. There is great concern about the huge increase criminal offence, they should come forward with it. in the number of people moving over to prepayment Alternatively, they should just stop making the accusation, meters—presumably, people who are unable to meet which is becoming increasingly silly. their energy bills—and there is a real danger of self- I was somewhat disappointed by the Secretary of disconnection when that happens. We do not always State’s answer to the question about shale gas, because know when some of these people are doing this. That is it has the potential to be a game changer. In the United a real worry and we need to do something about it. States gas prices have reduced by a factor of three and, The mantra of switching simply does not work. The in 2015, the US is going to start exporting shale gas, and energy companies appear to be doing a “follow my if we do not have it here, that could well have a major lead” on rising prices; I very much doubt whether that impact on the structure of the industry and how it will will necessarily occur when prices start to go down. work in the future. For the first time, we are seeing the 281 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 282
[David Mowat] bills over the next decade. That is because it expects electricity consumption to drop by 50%, meaning that decoupling of gas and oil prices, and once that has per unit costs of electricity will skyrocket. The most happened, all bets are off. The price of gas in Europe—in important thing we can do, therefore, is achieve energy the European balancing hub—is three times what it is in efficiency. the US. If a fraction of what happened in the US On that point, I want to challenge the Secretary of happens here, the results could be very radical and State on ECO. He will know that the Fuel Poverty could create some issues to address in terms of the debt Advisory Group and National Energy Action have said strategy. that ECO spends only 25% of its funds on the fuel poor Whereas we have nearly the lowest gas prices in and 75% of its funds on trying to reduce carbon emissions, Europe, the same cannot be said for electricity prices. which could be better directed at targeting solid-wall We have structural issues to address in our electricity insulation for the fuel poor in the private rented sector. I market. We do not have cheap nuclear power, as France ask him please to consider that, as it can achieve his does. We have missed the opportunity on that, although energy emissions objectives and increase the benefits to we are doing our best to catch up. the fuel poor. In the minute remaining, I want to suggest to the Minister one area that I believe we have got wrong in 6.38 pm policy terms. The Climate Change Act 2008 sets a very Andrew Percy (Brigg and Goole) (Con): As many ambitious target of 80% decarbonisation, and I accept other Members have said, this is an issue of huge that, but I believe we have confused the need to decarbonise concern to constituents across the country, and my with the need to go for renewables. The 20-20-20 directive constituents have some particular concerns that make from 2009, which imposes a renewables target over and the impact of rising energy prices much greater. We above what we could have done to reduce carbon, has have a lot of properties that are off-grid, which is a huge confused the issue. As a result, we have gone into issue particularly in the marshland villages, and I also nuclear more slowly than we should have done and, represent in the Scunthorpe part of my constituency a frankly, we have gone more slowly into carbon capture large number of park homes, which other Members and storage, which is an alternative. Will the Minister have mentioned. A lot of people in my constituency live assure us that the Green investment bank will be concerned in single-skin properties, many privately rented, where with decarbonisation, not just renewables, and that the landlords, despite their legal right, require them to be money available from it will therefore be available to the on energy meters. That was an experience I had for nuclear industry, which is in as much need of it as other about three and a half years before I was able to buy my parts of the decarbonisation chain, and the CCS industry? house. I lived in a rented property with one of those meters and I know the added costs. Like other Members, 6.35 pm I am getting increasing amounts of casework about this matter. I hope the Secretary of State will act on the Barry Gardiner (Brent North) (Lab): Since 2004, gas concerns about private rented landlords, park homes and electricity bills have increased more than six times and single-skin properties. faster than household incomes, meaning that a quarter There is not a great deal of time to go into casework of all households in England and Wales are now in fuel issues, but another issue I want to discuss is switching. I poverty. Increasing energy bills and stagnating incomes was saddened by the comments of the right hon. Member also mean that an additional 25% of people now face for Don Valley (Caroline Flint) and I remind her that, energy debts and more than 850,000 electricity consumers under her Government, in the region we represent, and more than 700,000 gas customers are now in debt Yorkshire and Humber, fuel poverty went from 7.7% of to their energy supplier. households in 2004 to 19.9% in 2009, so this issue has I would dearly love to give the hon. Member for not appeared overnight. It is wrong to pooh-pooh the Ipswich (Ben Gummer) a lesson in the history he so idea of switching. One thing that I have done—my hon. eloquently went into earlier, but I shall defer that to Friend the Member for Truro and Falmouth (Sarah another occasion. I would point out, however, that Newton) said that she had done something similar in although he accused the previous Government of not her constituency—is to produce a book and guide for having tackled structural reform in the energy market, my constituents to assist them as best I can by informing they did so on two occasions with the new electricity them about how they can switch and how they can trading arrangements, or NETA, and the British electricity make use of the social tariffs and their replacements. trading and transmission arrangements, or BETTA. We There are practical things that we can do, but I do not will save the rest of that debate for another day. deny that it is sometimes incredibly confusing. I had a The point that I most wish to make is that the costs of lady in her 80s at my constituency surgery the other environmental and social measures, such as CERT and week. She explained that she was unable to switch the renewables obligation, now account for about 4% because she did not have access to the internet and her and 10% of gas and electricity bills respectively. This is children lived a long way away. We need to do more for an unpopular thing to say—and certainly unfashionable, such individuals. coming from me—but it is the truth and we have to face I want briefly to address a point made by the right up to it: developing a low-carbon energy infrastructure hon. Member for Don Valley. I intervened on her about will require long-term planning and significant investment. it but it is worth saying again. If a point is worth Whereas 84% of recent energy price rises were unrelated making once it is worth making twice. Never mind the to low-carbon measures, the remaining 16% were and nonsense about the winter fuel allowance and the fact the Committee on Climate Change estimates that policies that Labour would probably have raised it—even though to achieve a low-carbon economy will add about £110 to she committed today to not raising it, which tells us all 283 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 284 we need to know—the one thing that would have helped households face, the profits of the big six, which supply pensioners in my constituency previously, instead of 99% of our households, have risen to more than £100 per giving them that disgusting 75p rise, would have been customer. Labour making good on its 1997 election pledge to link The Government are exacerbating the situation by pensions to earnings. I am proud that we have done making the wrong choices for Britain’s bill payers. They that, and it should put £5 or more into the pockets of are wrong to withdraw support from the most vulnerable pensioners. consumers when they need it most. They are cutting winter fuel payments by £50 for the over-60s and by 6.41 pm £100 for the over-80s despite having promised before the general election not to do so. They are also running Luciana Berger (Liverpool, Wavertree) (Lab/Co-op): down the successful Warm Front scheme before they I am pleased to respond to this very important debate. scrap it completely next year. That scheme was introduced At the start of the debate, my right hon. Friend the by Labour and has helped more than 2 million households Member for Don Valley (Caroline Flint) reminded the to save money by improving their homes’ heating systems House of the last time we debated rising energy prices—in and energy efficiency. October, just three months ago. In that debate, the Ministers are quick to lecture consumers about the Government supported our motion calling on them to importance of energy efficiency, yet at a time of soaring investigate mis-selling, simplify tariffs, improve the energy costs they are cutting help for those who are transparency of trading data, reform the energy market trying to install those vital measures, be it insulation or to increase competition and drive down bills, and to more affordable and energy- efficient heating systems. demand that energy companies use their profits to help In 2009-10, during the last year of the Labour Government, with bills this winter. over 200,000 homes received new heating and insulation Since then, the Government have failed to deliver on under the Warm Front scheme. By November last year, every one of those promises. No action has been taken fewer than 15,000 households received such help—a to address the chronic lack of trust between energy staggering reduction of 85%. The hon. Member for companies and their customers. There has been no Truro and Falmouth (Sarah Newton) must be receiving action to increase transparency and competition and no the majority of the Warm Front support in her constituency. action to help with the soaring cost of bills. Today, we It shows just how out of touch this Government are have heard in speeches of Members from across the that, when they should be supporting those who are House about the consequences of the Government’s trying to do the right thing, they are instead making it failure. They have told us about constituents who have more difficult. They are wrong, too, because as well as been let down and who are struggling to keep warm this scrapping existing successful schemes, they have introduced winter. Families and pensioners are facing a cost-of-living new programmes which are not delivering. I am pleased crisis. They are being squeezed by huge increases in to see the hon. Member for Elmet and Rothwell (Alec prices at a time when their incomes are decreasing in Shelbrooke) back in his place. He did not know the real terms. In the latest round of price increases, electricity difference between the warm home discount and winter has gone up by 10% and gas has gone up by more than fuel allowance. It is a shame that he was not able to stay 17%, and that has come on top of high fuel prices and for the debate, because he might have learned about it. food inflation at 6.2% as well as the Government’s VAT rise, which is costing the typical pensioner around £275 a The new warm home discount is failing to help those year. in fuel poverty. We warned the Government that the scheme was too narrowly focused and would not deliver Several hon. Members have talked about unfairness. the support needed. It seems that those warnings went My hon. Friends the Members for Ynys Môn (Albert unheeded. Research by Save the Children which came Owen) and for North West Durham (Pat Glass) raised out last week highlighted the huge shortfall in funding the issue of the 2 million customers who are off-grid, provided by energy companies for the schemes, which which is a specific issue in their constituencies. Those means that only 25,000 of the 800,000 households households suffer specifically from the monopolistic eligible for the warm home discount will get help this situations in their area and do not have choices about winter. That is just 3% and it is not good enough. electricity and gas when such services are not available When pensioners and low-income families are struggling to them. to make ends meet, it is time the Government got tough The hon. Member for Norwich South (Simon Wright) with the energy companies. We would provide real help rightly talked about people who do not have access to now by making the energy companies ensure that all the internet as a means of identifying the cheapest vulnerable pensioners and low-income families with deals. A number of Members talked about the scandal children at risk of fuel poverty who receive cold-weather of prepayment meters and the high costs incurred for payments automatically receive the warm home discount. those customers. When in government we took action to help consumers, My hon. Friend the Member for Brent North (Barry thanks to measures such as Warm Front and the winter Gardiner), my right hon. Friend the Member for fuel allowance, which the Government are now cutting. Coatbridge, Chryston and Bellshill (Mr Clarke) and my The number of households in fuel poverty fell by 1 million. hon. Friend the Member for Glasgow North West Of course we would have liked to have reduced that (John Robertson) all highlighted that at a time when even further, but now fuel poverty is rising and things their constituents are being squeezed by record rises are getting worse, not better, as a direct result of the in their bills, energy companies are seeing record rises in decisions being made by this Government. their profits. It cannot be right that while the cost of a At the same time as cutting support, the Government’s typical dual fuel bill now stands at more than £1,300, plans for the new schemes, the green deal and the energy thereby making energy bills one of the biggest costs that company obligation, will not deliver either. We have just 285 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 286
[Luciana Berger] As well as taking action to protect the most vulnerable in our society, we must ensure that everyone benefits heard that at a meeting in the other place, the Energy from fairness and responsibility in our energy market, Minister there said that the regulations for the green so we would go further by introducing real reform to deal would be delayed. We wait to hear how long that increase competition and drive down prices. For too delay will be. long the market has been dominated by a handful of companies. Today’s debate has shown once again that The Minister of State, the hon. Member for Bexhill the market is broken and that we need to fix it. I hope and Battle (Gregory Barker), told the House in 2010 that the House will vote for action today and I urge that the green deal would be the game-changer for fuel Members to support the motion. poverty, but his figures revealed that only 350,000 to 550,000 households would be lifted out of fuel poverty by 2020. These are derisory ambitions. His plans mean 6.50 pm that the Government will be gifting three times as much The Minister of State, Department of Energy and subsidy to households that can already afford to improve Climate Change (Charles Hendry): I am delighted to their homes, compared with those in fuel poverty who have the opportunity to respond to the debate, which I cannot even afford to keep theirs warm. To echo my think we all would agree has dealt with some extremely hon. Friend the Member for Brent North, why, when important issues that concern us all. I think we should money is tight, is the Minister not prioritising support start with the recognition that there is no monopoly of for those who need help most? care when it comes to fuel poverty. Every Member of the House, regardless of party allegiance, cares about We have seen a clear choice emerge in this afternoon’s their constituents being able to pay their bills and debate. On the one hand, there is an out of touch, out of worries about how they can do more to assist them. date Government unable to stand up for hard-working This is a long-term concern. Fuel poverty started to consumers—out of touch because when energy bills are come down in the 1990s under the Conservative rising, millions are struggling to keep warm and fuel Government and continued to decline until 2002. It poverty is rising, their only answer is to cut support and then increased from 2 million households living in fuel tell consumers to shop around. Although it is refreshing poverty to almost 6 million over the course of the to hear from the hon. Member for Ipswich (Ben Gummer) Labour Government. As prices have continued to rise, that he believes that the energy market is broken, the fuel poverty has continued to go up. It is an issue that Government are out of date because they are wedded to no party can claim to have addressed, but one that every an orthodoxy which for too long has allowed utility Member cares about finding the right solutions to. companies to do what they please at the expense of their customers. On the other hand, the Labour Opposition Important issues were raised in the course of the have plans to deliver fairness in tough times, to provide debate. The hon. Member for Glasgow North West real support for struggling households this winter, even (John Robertson) talked about the difficulty of insulating when Government have less to spend, and to take on the types of housing found in his constituency and the the vested interests, reforming the energy market so that hon. Member for Angus (Mr Weir) referred to the it benefits the many and not just the few. problems faced by people on prepayment meters. We heard the continuing debate about off-gas grid customers. We heard throughout the debate how the huge rises We welcome the progress and the interaction we have in gas and electricity prices mean that bills are one of had with the hon. Members for Ynys Môn (Albert the biggest costs that households face. The Government Owen) and for North West Durham (Pat Glass) and my lecture consumers, telling them that it is possible to save hon. Friend the Member for Hexham (Guy Opperman) up to £200 on an annual bill by shopping around. In to try to ensure that constituents who are off-gas grid some cases that might be true, but Ministers are out of get a better deal than they have had so far. We have touch if they think that it is easy for consumers. We ensured that the warm home discount will be payable to have heard from many about the 400 different tariffs. It those who are off-gas grid and have seen good engagement is those who need help most, Britain’s pensioners, who with the Office of Fair Trading, which said following its are losing out from the Government’s failure to force market study that if there was evidence of market abuse companies to introduce simpler tariffs. Research by it would carry out a full investigation in that area. Ofgem has shown that elderly customers are much less I have asked Members on both sides of the House to likely to investigate cheaper tariffs or switch suppliers, provide evidence of how the market is working in their compared with the average consumer. It is crucial that constituencies and, if they find that there is not the at times like these, when money is tight and people right range of market providers that the OFT suggests, ensure across the country are struggling to get by, the Government that that is brought to my attention. If there are problems do everything they can to help them. with delivery in some areas or with advance payments Yesterday my right hon. Friend the Leader of the being required, I want cast-iron evidence so that we can Opposition showed that Labour will deliver fairness for decide on the most appropriate way to go forward on elderly people struggling with soaring fuel bills as well those issues. as taking action to cut the deficit. The plan he set out in We have heard discussions about the green deal, today’s motion would cut gas and electricity bills for up which the right hon. Member for Don Valley (Caroline to 4 million elderly pensioners, not by spending more Flint) raised. I well remember a discussion with the money, but by getting energy firms to show greater right hon. Member for Lewisham, Deptford (Dame responsibility towards their most vulnerable customers. Joan Ruddock) in 2010, when she was Energy Minister, We want energy companies to move their customers after we had put forward an amendment to the Energy who are over 75 automatically to the cheapest tariff Bill. She said that the green deal was not possible and they offer for gas and electricity. the Labour Government voted it down. We could have 287 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 288 had the green deal in place 18 months ahead of where We are also clearing Labour’s backlogs. Last year, the we are now and delivering the sort of help we want to highest number of planning consents since the Electricity see. It is the most ambitious programme this country Act was passed in 1989 were granted to get those new has ever seen for insulating our homes, with the ambition projects under construction, and the highest number of of 14 million homes having good energy insulation over oil and gas licences for more than a decade were approved, the course of the next decade, which knocks into oblivion as we try to get the most out of our indigenous resources. any other scheme that has been tried by previous We have already brought forward by 12 months the Governments. I well remember the current leader of the roll-out of the smart meter programme, because of its Labour party, when he was Secretary of State for Energy importance in giving consumers control over their bills, and Climate Change, telling the House in December so it was no wonder that Steve Holliday, the chief 2009 that their ambition was to have five pilots in executive of National Grid, when interviewed on television different parts of the country. We have taken it from five a week ago said that we were closer to having an energy pilots to a nation-wide scheme delivering on a level that policy now than at any time in his lifetime. has never before been possible. My hon. Friend the Member for Ipswich (Ben Gummer) My hon. Friend the Member for Elmet and Rothwell also highlighted the role of the Leader of the Opposition (Alec Shelbrooke) was absolutely right to draw our in the issue. It is worth looking at what he has said and attention to the upward pressure on prices. Indeed, the where his policy has gone. It has not been a good week Leader of the Opposition, in his Labour party conference for the right hon. Gentleman, and it may not get any speech last year, said that better now. In government, he said that there should not “over time there is going to be upward pressure on energy prices.” be a Competition Commission inquiry, yet the Labour Yet from the right hon. Lady there was not a word party in August said that there should be, and now it is about the global picture—the fact that towards the end silent. We do not know its view on that issue now. In of last year gas prices were 40% up on the year before, government, he said also that the energy companies after the world’s worst oil incident in the gulf of Mexico, should not be broken up, but in his conference speech the world’s worst nuclear incident in Japan and a war in he talked about breaking the dominance of a market the middle east. She wrote that out and acted as if the that has clearly failed. Now, a few months later, he is only reason for prices going up is the greed of the silent on that as well. energy companies, saying that we in this debate have to The right hon. Gentleman talked about pooling electricity get a sense of reality. generation, yet he did not agree with that in government, What the Government have been doing, however, is and now the Labour party is silent. Ahead of his working to remove some of the levies that Labour put conference speech, he talked about cutting energy bills in place. Indeed, over the course of this decade we will for four out of five families, but that has been lost. All have reduced people’s energy bills by £100 compared we hear today is that people who are over 75 years old with what they would have been if Labour’s levies had should be given extra support: bizarrely, a Labour party stayed in place. The renewable heat incentive is now to giving more support to wealthy 75-year-olds than to be paid from general taxation, rather than from a levy; 74-year-olds who are struggling to pay their bills. and the carbon capture and storage levy, which, in the As my hon. Friend the Member for Truro and Falmouth words of the leader of the Labour party, was going to (Sarah Newton) said, we have in place measures that are cost £9.5 billion over the coming years and be paid for working. We have simplified tariffs, and we have helped by consumers, is no longer on consumers’ bills. with switching, although there is more to be done, as my Introducing the green deal, the warm home discount hon. Friend the Member for Norwich South (Simon and electricity market reform, rebanding the renewables Wright) said. We have introduced the biggest energy obligation and changing the feed-in tariffs will all help efficiency initiative ever, and there is more help to to bring down consumers’ bills by £100 when compared encourage new entrants— with what they would have been under Labour’s levies. So where Labour put in place stealth taxes on bills, this Ms Rosie Winterton (Doncaster Central) (Lab) claimed Government have now removed them. to move the closure (Standing Order No. 36). As my hon. Friend the Member for Warrington South Question put forthwith, That the Question be now (David Mowat) said, the issue is not just one of global put. energy prices, but whether there is enough electricity Question agreed to. generation to meet demand. There was not a word from Main Question accordingly put. the Opposition about the need to rebuild our energy infrastructure—the £200 billion that is necessary, or the The House divided: Ayes 248, Noes 323. fact that during this decade we have to secure twice as Division No. 421] [6.59 pm much investment as Labour achieved during the previous decade. In reality, if we do not secure that investment, AYES the lights in this country will go out. The leader of the Abbott, Ms Diane Bailey, Mr Adrian Labour party, when in government, referred to that as Abrahams, Debbie Bain, Mr William “energy demand unserved”, whereas all of us know that Ainsworth, rh Mr Bob Balls, rh Ed in ordinary people’s language it means power cuts. That Alexander, rh Mr Douglas Banks, Gordon is why we have started the most ambitious programme Alexander, Heidi Bayley, Hugh of market reform—things that Labour in government Ali, Rushanara Beckett, rh Margaret told us were not necessary. The carbon floor price, the Allen, Mr Graham Begg, Dame Anne capacity mechanism and market reform more generally Anderson, Mr David Bell, Sir Stuart have all been put in place in less than two years by this Ashworth, Jonathan Benn, rh Hilary new Government. Austin, Ian Benton, Mr Joe 289 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 290
Berger, Luciana Gardiner, Barry McKenzie, Mr Iain Shuker, Gavin Betts, Mr Clive Gilmore, Sheila McKinnell, Catherine Skinner, Mr Dennis Blackman-Woods, Roberta Glass, Pat Meacher, rh Mr Michael Slaughter, Mr Andy Blears, rh Hazel Glindon, Mrs Mary Meale, Sir Alan Smith, rh Mr Andrew Blomfield, Paul Godsiff, Mr Roger Mearns, Ian Smith, Angela Blunkett, rh Mr David Goggins, rh Paul Michael, rh Alun Smith, Nick Bradshaw, rh Mr Ben Goodman, Helen Miliband, rh David Smith, Owen Brennan, Kevin Greatrex, Tom Miller, Andrew Spellar, rh Mr John Brown, rh Mr Gordon Green, Kate Mitchell, Austin Straw, rh Mr Jack Brown, Lyn Greenwood, Lilian Morden, Jessica Stringer, Graham Brown, rh Mr Nicholas Griffith, Nia Morrice, Graeme (Livingston) Stuart, Ms Gisela Brown, Mr Russell Gwynne, Andrew Morris, Grahame M. Sutcliffe, Mr Gerry Buck, Ms Karen Hain, rh Mr Peter (Easington) Tami, Mark Burden, Richard Hamilton, Mr David Mudie, Mr George Thomas, Mr Gareth Burnham, rh Andy Hamilton, Fabian Munn, Meg Thornberry, Emily Byrne, rh Mr Liam Hanson, rh Mr David Murphy, rh Mr Jim Timms, rh Stephen Campbell, Mr Alan Harris, Mr Tom Murphy, rh Paul Trickett, Jon Campbell, Mr Ronnie Hendrick, Mark Murray, Ian Turner, Karl Caton, Martin Hepburn, Mr Stephen Nandy, Lisa Twigg, Derek Chapman, Mrs Jenny Heyes, David Nash, Pamela Twigg, Stephen Clark, Katy Hillier, Meg O’Donnell, Fiona Umunna, Mr Chuka Clarke, rh Mr Tom Hilling, Julie Onwurah, Chi Vaz, rh Keith Clwyd, rh Ann Hodge, rh Margaret Owen, Albert Coaker, Vernon Hodgson, Mrs Sharon Pearce, Teresa Vaz, Valerie Coffey, Ann Hoey, Kate Perkins, Toby Walley, Joan Connarty, Michael Hood, Mr Jim Pound, Stephen Watson, Mr Tom Cooper, Rosie Hopkins, Kelvin Qureshi, Yasmin Watts, Mr Dave Cooper, rh Yvette Hosie, Stewart Raynsford, rh Mr Nick Weir, Mr Mike Corbyn, Jeremy Howarth, rh Mr George Reeves, Rachel Whiteford, Dr Eilidh Crausby, Mr David Hunt, Tristram Reynolds, Emma Whitehead, Dr Alan Creagh, Mary Irranca-Davies, Huw Reynolds, Jonathan Wicks, rh Malcolm Creasy, Stella James, Mrs Siân C. Riordan, Mrs Linda Williams, Hywel Cruddas, Jon Jamieson, Cathy Robertson, Angus Williamson, Chris Cryer, John Jarvis, Dan Robertson, John Wilson, Phil Cunningham, Alex Johnson, rh Alan Rotheram, Steve Winnick, Mr David Cunningham, Mr Jim Johnson, Diana Roy, Mr Frank Winterton, rh Ms Rosie Cunningham, Tony Jones, Graham Roy, Lindsay Wishart, Pete Curran, Margaret Jones, Helen Ruane, Chris Woodcock, John Danczuk, Simon Jones, Susan Elan Ruddock, rh Dame Joan Woodward, rh Mr Shaun Darling, rh Mr Alistair Jowell, rh Tessa Sarwar, Anas Wright, David David, Mr Wayne Joyce, Eric Seabeck, Alison Wright, Mr Iain Davies, Geraint Kaufman, rh Sir Gerald Shannon, Jim De Piero, Gloria Keeley, Barbara Sharma, Mr Virendra Tellers for the Ayes: Denham, rh Mr John Kendall, Liz Sheerman, Mr Barry Nic Dakin and Dobbin, Jim Khan, rh Sadiq Sheridan, Jim Tom Blenkinsop Dobson, rh Frank Lammy, rh Mr David Docherty, Thomas Lavery, Ian NOES Dodds, rh Mr Nigel Lazarowicz, Mark Donaldson, rh Mr Jeffrey M. Leslie, Chris Adams, Nigel Bone, Mr Peter Donohoe, Mr Brian H. Lewis, Mr Ivan Afriyie, Adam Bottomley, Sir Peter Doran, Mr Frank Lloyd, Tony Aldous, Peter Bradley, Karen Dowd, Jim Llwyd, rh Mr Elfyn Amess, Mr David Brady, Mr Graham Doyle, Gemma Long, Naomi Andrew, Stuart Brake, rh Tom Dromey, Jack Love, Mr Andrew Bacon, Mr Richard Bray, Angie Dugher, Michael Lucas, Caroline Baker, Norman Brine, Steve Durkan, Mark Lucas, Ian Baker, Steve Brokenshire, James Eagle, Ms Angela MacNeil, Mr Angus Brendan Baldwin, Harriett Brooke, Annette Eagle, Maria MacShane, rh Mr Denis Barker, Gregory Browne, Mr Jeremy Edwards, Jonathan Mactaggart, Fiona Baron, Mr John Bruce, Fiona Efford, Clive Mahmood, Shabana Barwell, Gavin Bruce, rh Malcolm Elliott, Julie Malhotra, Seema Bebb, Guto Buckland, Mr Robert Ellman, Mrs Louise Mann, John Beith, rh Sir Alan Burley, Mr Aidan Esterson, Bill Marsden, Mr Gordon Bellingham, Mr Henry Burns, Conor Evans, Chris McCabe, Steve Benyon, Richard Burns, rh Mr Simon Farrelly, Paul McCarthy, Kerry Beresford, Sir Paul Burrowes, Mr David Fitzpatrick, Jim McClymont, Gregg Berry, Jake Burt, Alistair Flello, Robert McDonagh, Siobhain Binley, Mr Brian Burt, Lorely Flint, rh Caroline McDonnell, John Birtwistle, Gordon Byles, Dan Flynn, Paul McFadden, rh Mr Pat Blackman, Bob Cairns, Alun Fovargue, Yvonne McGovern, Jim Blackwood, Nicola Campbell, rh Sir Menzies Francis, Dr Hywel McGuire, rh Mrs Anne Blunt, Mr Crispin Carmichael, rh Mr Alistair Gapes, Mike McKechin, Ann Boles, Nick Carswell, Mr Douglas 291 Energy Prices11 JANUARY 2012 Energy Prices 292
Cash, Mr William Hammond, rh Mr Philip McPartland, Stephen Simmonds, Mark Chishti, Rehman Hammond, Stephen McVey, Esther Simpson, Mr Keith Clappison, Mr James Hancock, Matthew Mensch, Louise Skidmore, Chris Clark, rh Greg Hands, Greg Menzies, Mark Smith, Miss Chloe Clarke, rh Mr Kenneth Harper, Mr Mark Mercer, Patrick Smith, Henry Clifton-Brown, Geoffrey Harris, Rebecca Metcalfe, Stephen Smith, Julian Coffey, Dr Thérèse Hart, Simon Miller, Maria Smith, Sir Robert Colvile, Oliver Harvey, Nick Mills, Nigel Soames, rh Nicholas Crabb, Stephen Haselhurst, rh Sir Milton, Anne Soubry, Anna Crockart, Mike Alan Mitchell, rh Mr Andrew Spencer, Mr Mark Crouch, Tracey Heald, Oliver Moore, rh Michael Stanley, rh Sir John Davey, Mr Edward Heaton-Harris, Chris Morgan, Nicky Stephenson, Andrew Davies, David T. C. Hemming, John Morris, Anne Marie Stevenson, John (Monmouth) Henderson, Gordon Morris, David Stewart, Bob Davies, Glyn Hendry, Charles Morris, James Stewart, Iain Davies, Philip Herbert, rh Nick Mosley, Stephen Stewart, Rory Davis, rh Mr David Hinds, Damian Mowat, David Streeter, Mr Gary de Bois, Nick Hoban, Mr Mark Mulholland, Greg Stride, Mel Dinenage, Caroline Hollingbery, George Mundell, rh David Stuart, Mr Graham Djanogly, Mr Jonathan Hollobone, Mr Philip Munt, Tessa Stunell, Andrew Dorrell, rh Mr Stephen Holloway, Mr Adam Murray, Sheryll Sturdy, Julian Dorries, Nadine Hopkins, Kris Murrison, Dr Andrew Swales, Ian Doyle-Price, Jackie Horwood, Martin Neill, Robert Swayne, rh Mr Drax, Richard Howell, John Newmark, Mr Brooks Desmond Duddridge, James Hughes, rh Simon Newton, Sarah Swinson, Jo Duncan, rh Mr Alan Huhne, rh Chris Nokes, Caroline Syms, Mr Robert Duncan Smith, rh Mr Iain Hunt, rh Mr Jeremy Norman, Jesse Tapsell, rh Sir Peter Dunne, Mr Philip Huppert, Dr Julian Nuttall, Mr David Teather, Sarah Ellis, Michael Hurd, Mr Nick O’Brien, Mr Stephen Thurso, John Ellison, Jane Jackson, Mr Stewart Offord, Mr Matthew Timpson, Mr Edward Ellwood, Mr Tobias James, Margot Ollerenshaw, Eric Tomlinson, Justin Elphicke, Charlie Javid, Sajid Opperman, Guy Tredinnick, David Eustice, George Jenkin, Mr Bernard Ottaway, Richard Truss, Elizabeth Evans, Graham Johnson, Gareth Parish, Neil Turner, Mr Andrew Evans, Jonathan Johnson, Joseph Patel, Priti Tyrie, Mr Andrew Evennett, Mr David Jones, Andrew Paterson, rh Mr Uppal, Paul Fabricant, Michael Jones, Mr David Owen Vaizey, Mr Edward Fallon, Michael Jones, Mr Marcus Pawsey, Mark Vickers, Martin Farron, Tim Kawczynski, Daniel Penrose, John Villiers, rh Mrs Theresa Field, Mark Kelly, Chris Percy, Andrew Walker, Mr Charles Foster, rh Mr Don Kirby, Simon Perry, Claire Walker, Mr Robin Fox,rhDrLiam Knight, rh Mr Greg Phillips, Stephen Wallace, Mr Ben Francois, rh Mr Mark Kwarteng, Kwasi Pickles, rh Mr Eric Walter, Mr Robert Freeman, George Lamb, Norman Poulter, Dr Daniel Ward, Mr David Freer, Mike Lancaster, Mark Prisk, Mr Mark Watkinson, Angela Fullbrook, Lorraine Lansley, rh Mr Andrew Pritchard, Mark Weatherley, Mike Fuller, Richard Latham, Pauline Pugh, John Webb, Steve Gale, Sir Roger Laws, rh Mr David Raab, Mr Dominic Garnier, Mr Edward Leadsom, Andrea Randall, rh Mr John Wharton, James Garnier, Mark Lee, Jessica Redwood, rh Mr John Wheeler, Heather Gauke, Mr David Lee, Dr Phillip Rees-Mogg, Jacob White, Chris George, Andrew Leech, Mr John Reevell, Simon Whittaker, Craig Gibb, Mr Nick Lefroy, Jeremy Reid, Mr Alan Whittingdale, Mr John Gilbert, Stephen Leigh, Mr Edward Rifkind, rh Sir Malcolm Wiggin, Bill Gillan, rh Mrs Cheryl Leslie, Charlotte Robathan, rh Mr Andrew Willetts, rh Mr David Glen, John Letwin, rh Mr Oliver Robertson, Hugh Williams, Mr Mark Goldsmith, Zac Lewis, Brandon Robertson, Mr Laurence Williams, Stephen Goodwill, Mr Robert Lewis, Dr Julian Rogerson, Dan Williamson, Gavin Gove, rh Michael Lloyd, Stephen Rosindell, Andrew Willott, Jenny Graham, Richard Lopresti, Jack Rudd, Amber Wilson, Mr Rob Grant, Mrs Helen Lord, Jonathan Ruffley, Mr David Wollaston, Dr Sarah Gray, Mr James Loughton, Tim Rutley, David Wright, Jeremy Grayling, rh Chris Luff, Peter Sanders, Mr Adrian Wright, Simon Green, Damian Lumley, Karen Sandys, Laura Yeo, Mr Tim Scott, Mr Lee Greening, rh Justine Macleod, Mary Young, rh Sir George Selous, Andrew Grieve, rh Mr Dominic Main, Mrs Anne Zahawi, Nadhim Griffiths, Andrew Maude, rh Mr Francis Shapps, rh Grant Sharma, Alok Gummer, Ben Maynard, Paul Tellers for the Noes: Shelbrooke, Alec Mr Shailesh Vara and Gyimah, Mr Sam McCartney, Jason Shepherd, Mr Richard Mark Hunter Hague, rh Mr William McCartney, Karl Halfon, Robert McIntosh, Miss Anne Hames, Duncan McLoughlin, rh Mr Patrick Question accordingly negatived. 293 11 JANUARY 2012 294
Business without Debate Khat Motion made, and Question proposed, That this DELEGATED LEGISLATION House do now adjourn.—(James Duddridge.) Ordered, 7.15 pm That the Motion in the name of Sir George Young relating to the Electoral Commission shall be treated as if it related to an Mark Lancaster (Milton Keynes North) (Con): I am instrument subject to the provisions of Standing Order No. 118 delighted to have secured this debate, and I would like (Delegated Legislation Committees) in respect of which notice of to start by paying tribute to the attempts by successive a motion has been given that the instrument be approved.— Governments to deal head on with specific issues (James Duddridge.) encountered by minority communities—as we heard only today with the Prime Minister’s commitment to address forced marriage. I must admit, however, to being slightly disappointed that, as a Member of a party that raised the expectations of my constituents by pledging to ban the drug khat while in opposition—a commitment made by no fewer than three members of the shadow Cabinet on three separate occasions—I stand here yet again calling on the Government finally to fulfil their very clear commitment. This is not a partisan issue. Indeed, as I sense we shall see tonight, it unites the House, and it is time that the Government acted. I have three main points to make but I shall give first a little background, which I hope will mean that the Minister in his response will not need to dwell on the past, but can focus on the future actions his Department intends to take. The distinctive customs and traits of other cultures constitute the vibrant country that we live in today. East African culture has had a particularly far-reaching effect on our society. The religious dedication and hard-working ethos that colour the characters of east Africans have been something to admire over recent years, with independent businesses and community leaders flourishing across towns and cities in the UK. However, with the highs come the lows. One element of east African culture which has long been disputed is the legality of the native east African drug khat. Given the frequency with which khat has been discussed over the past year, I know that most hon. Members are now familiar with the drug, but for the benefit of those who are not, I shall explain in more detail. Khat plants are grown in Africa and the middle east, and are chewed primarily amongst Somali, Ethiopian and Yemeni communities. The effects of khat are varied but as a stimulant it creates euphoria and increased sociability—hence its popularity at social gatherings such as weddings. However, the paranoia, aggression and hallucinogenic effects make it extremely disruptive not just to the individual and their health, but to their family and wider society. Khat is a barrier to inclusion and integration, and it was my sincere impression— and more importantly that of my constituents—that this Government intended to act. This is the second time I have raised the subject of khat in this Chamber and I was deeply encouraged when the Lord Commissioner of Her Majesty’s Treasury, my hon. Friend the Member for Kenilworth and Southam (Jeremy Wright). confirmed in response to the first debate that in February last year the Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs was ordered to carry out a full review of the available evidence on khat, and to reconsider the question of controlling it. One year on, and with no report to speak of and none expected anytime soon— indeed, this week the Department confirmed that it will be at least another year—the same amount of limited research is available to us. 295 Khat11 JANUARY 2012 Khat 296
From the first mention of khat in Parliament 16 years we are still uncertain about the overall long-term health ago to this very day, Members on both sides of the effects. Problems range from the need for substantial House have shared their evidence. From Portsmouth to dental treatment, owing to the quantity of sugar and Glasgow, councils and local authorities are standing in cigarettes consumed, to more serious conditions, such isolation, but what we need is a joined-up, united front. as liver failure and psychosis. It is clear that health My debate today has been sparked by the frustration of practitioners are clueless about how to advise users. my constituents that after 19 months of the coalition Those wishing for a fresh start are stranded, with little Government we appear to be no further forward. or no support—no addiction services or pharmacological In seeking to progress the matter, I wish to highlight agents who can treat khat dependence. Essentially, there three distinct points. First, I wish to remind my hon. are few ways out. Friend the Minister, for whom I have enormous respect, The last review of khat surmised that usage is not of the detrimental impact that khat has on issues ranging prevalent. That may be true for the mainstream population, from health to crime. This will demonstrate how simply but not for the demographic concerned. It has been put kicking this issue into the long grass with further to me that the Government are not interested because “monitoring” is simply unacceptable. Secondly, I want this is perceived as a minority issue. I know that this is to revisit the pledge that we made in opposition to act not the case, but it is in the Minister’s hands to demonstrate on khat, and to ask why we now seem to be shying away to my community that he does care, as actions, as we all from this pledge. Lastly, I will suggest that tackling khat know, speak louder than words. fits in with this Government’s recent accomplishments in determinedly facing up to the problems that divide Eric Ollerenshaw (Lancaster and Fleetwood) (Con): I our minority communities. congratulate my hon. Friend on securing this important debate. On that very point, when the Advisory Council Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP): The hon. Gentleman on the Misuse of Drugs reported in 2005, it said: has outlined some of the side effects of the drug, which “On the basis of the evidence, the Council recommends that also include insomnia and depression. Does he feel that Khat is not controlled”. those two health effects are sufficient reason to ask However, the following sentence, to which I think he is that the legislation be changed urgently? Does he agree referring—this is the pertinent one—says: that it is important that any legislative change should “Use of the substance is very limited to specific communities affect all the regions, in conjunction with the devolved within the UK, and has not, nor does it appear likely to, spread to Administrations, so that it applies UK-wide? the wider community.” Does it not appear to him that there is no equality Mark Lancaster: The hon. Gentleman makes an under the law in this case? The last time the issue of important point; indeed, I will come to the health khat was analysed, it seems that the ACMD advised effects in greater detail shortly. However, let me be that we not ban it, simply because it applied only to that absolutely clear that I am pressing for this Government minority community. to act in the manner that he suggests. Mark Lancaster: My hon. Friend makes a powerful In my constituency, there are more than 6,000 Somali point, which simply underlines what I said earlier. I residents. One of the leaders of the Milton Keynes know that the Minister is committed to equality, which Somali community, Adan Kahin, has shared many alarming is why I am sure he will address the issue when he stories with me. His biggest concern is that khat is at the responds to this debate. Khat does easily not fit a root of family breakdown, owing to issues such as pre-existing drugs profile, given that its use is limited to unemployment, economic hardship or aggression arising certain ethnic communities. That is precisely why we from heavy usage. Adan has expressed explicit concern must give it special attention. about the number of teenage boys whose fathers are absent from the home, instead spending all day chewing Let me move on to my second point. The Government’s in a mafrishi, or khat house. If the Government are silence on this issue prompted me to re-read our manifesto, truly concerned about the antisocial behaviour witnessed to make sense of the khat conundrum, but it holds no last summer, it is vital that we shine a light into those evidence of a U-turn, with other evidence actually corners of society. Adan has warned of usage spreading pointing to the contrary. In a 2008 article in The Guardian, to female members of the community—women who are the co-chair of the Conservative party, the noble Baroness left alone all day with large numbers of children and Warsi, claimed that khat was little escape. What links all users, however, is the common “far from harmless and should be banned”. belief that turning to khat will alleviate the destitution Indeed, the title of that article was “Conservatives and stress that permeate their lives. I am even aware of will ban khat”—not “Conservatives might ban khat”, instances in well regarded British institutions where not “Conservatives will consider banning khat”, not khat has been chewed inappropriately during working “Conservatives will seek advice from the ACMD and hours. There have also been complaints about disturbances then ban khat”, but “Conservatives will ban khat”. In a caused by delivery of the plant and violence outside 2006 report entitled “The Khat Nexus”, the then shadow mafrishis, with one incident even leading to the death of Home Secretary, my right hon. Friend the Member for a seller in my constituency. Haltemprice and Howden (Mr Davis), claimed that a Our hands-off policy means that there is absolutely Tory Government would zero quality control. One box of khat checked by port “schedule khat as a class B drug.” health at Heathrow contained such high levels of pesticides Those were watertight pledges, made regardless of an that it was unfit for human use, and that is just one box ACMD review. So if nothing else, can the Minister out of the 10 million tonnes arriving each week. Because explain to my constituents why we now appear to have of the lack of information held on hospital admissions, had a change of heart? 297 Khat11 JANUARY 2012 Khat 298
[Mark Lancaster] That is not all. I was encouraged to read in the Conservative manifesto that we would be promoting This Government have, however, made a beeline for improved community relations for minority ethnic new legal highs. It is right that we award legal highs that communities, which action on khat will help to deliver. attention, but we cannot ignore the fact that khat, by its In my own constituency, good work is being done to very nature, also fits the description of a legal high. I address those marginalised, sometimes controversial, was shocked to learn that cathine and cathinone, two issues; acting on khat will not be out of step with the components of khat, are members of the same group of current momentum. We can prove to those who doubt drugs as mephedrone. As components, cathinone and our intentions that when we make promises, we stick to cathine are illegal, as is mephedrone, yet contradicting them, which is why I am sure the Minister will agree all common sense, khat, which contains those same that it is important, given our previous promises, that substances, is legal. I would like to know how we can we are seen to act on khat. continue to promote the hypocritical message that cathinone Finally, I want to bring the debate right up to date. is okay in one substance but not in another? Just We are standing here today, almost one year on from because a drug is legal does not mean it is safe. Tackling the report being ordered, with no new evidence from the new legal highs cannot be a flag-waving policy; we must Advisory Council on Misuse of Drugs. Since its appearance not forget the question of khat, which has languished in on the British crime survey of drug misuse, the usage of this Chamber year after year. As we take action on khat has increased. We are unaware of the percentage of those powerful synthetic drugs, khat users and their khat imports that are being used to extract cathinone families watch from the sidelines as their plea goes and cathine, and in turn, being illegally re-exported. unheard yet again. Also, we have only anecdotal evidence that usage is spreading to the indigenous population. Why have we Another reason for my keen interest in this topic is not commissioned a report to explore that threat? that it is a cross-party point of concern. Wherever large immigrant groups of Somalis settle, the problem of Today, I want to know why my Government’s previous khat is never far behind. This is an issue that the whole enthusiasm for acting on khat has waned so suddenly. House can support, and we should therefore be working May I ask the Minister to consider how I should towards an integrated solution. It does not help that respond when my constituents ask again what the councils and local authorities are standing alone on the Government are doing to protect future generations issue. I commend Hillingdon council’s recent report, from the dangers of khat? And—if I may have the produced in 2011, which was forthright enough to make audacity to predict his response—may I ask whether he recommendations to the Government on matters ranging realises that, in order to get the evidence that his Department from classification to temporary bans. repeatedly demands, procedures have to be put in place first, in order to reap that information? Banning khat is Unlike the UK, some countries are acting. As of unfailingly the end-state that I and the community want yesterday, even the Netherlands—a country renowned from this Government, as previously promised, but I for its liberal drugs policy—has banned khat. The UK wish to outline other possible interim measures. is now the only legal point of entry for khat into Europe, and that is an embarrassing position to find Jim Shannon: The drug khat is controlled in America, ourselves in. The Dutch Government have clearly stated Canada, Norway and Sweden, to mention but four that 10% of users, who are predominantly Somali, examples. Does the hon. Gentleman feel that the develop problems with khat. I want to ask the Minister Government could make contact with those countries what is preventing us from safeguarding our citizens in to ascertain how they went about criminalising the the same fashion. The most disturbing comparison drug? Might this not provide a way forward on the basis comes from Somalia itself: even that war-torn country of information that might be helpful for the Government? has made moves to control khat. Islamist courts there are working to put a stop to the khat scourge, and to Mark Lancaster: I thank the hon. Gentleman for that promote a more stable and cohesive society. What we suggestion, which underlines the ridiculous point that, need is joined-up thinking, and top-down leadership to following the Dutch move only this week, khat is controlled reassure councils and communities that they are not everywhere in the western world apart from in the alone. This is an ideal opportunity for the Government United Kingdom. to prove to our communities that we recognise— and, indeed, will tackle—the problems on their These are the interim suggestions I would make to doorstep. the Minister—hopefully to be implemented before we get around to banning khat. Better provisions must be That leads me nicely on to my third and final point, made for addict support. The most effective way of which is the commendable way in which this Government delivering this would be to provide targeted training to have faced up to issues that traditionally effect ethnic those already working within areas affected by khat, to minority communities. We have not shied away from deal with it in a culturally acceptable way. Community those problems, which are so often left to rot at the core mobilisers who already assist with housing, health and of our society. We have rightly begun to take steps to education are incredibly well placed to co-ordinate this. address forced marriage in this country—an issue that Evidence suggests that heavy users are unlikely to seek has shocked the nation and that works directly against help, which means that we must do more to reach them. the values and self-worth that we teach our young Secondly, a full health practitioners’ guide to khat women, of every background, in British schools. The and its health effects should be prepared and delivered work that we are promoting on the subject of domestic to GPs and pharmacists nationwide. Thirdly, greater violence will have a direct effect on majority and minority attention must be given to the importation of khat at ethnic communities. ports. Finally, the disruption caused by khat houses and 299 Khat11 JANUARY 2012 Khat 300 mafrishi congregations can be controlled through licensing. Mark Lancaster: Will my hon. Friend confirm that A minimum age should be introduced to protect young the Government are under no obligation to follow the British citizens from the harm caused by the drug. ACMD’s advice? The last Government did not do so Checks must be carried out on premises to ensure that when it came to the reclassification of cannabis. they comply with health and safety standards. After years of talk on khat, if my Government wish James Brokenshire: The Government will consider to retain the trust of the east African community, the the evidence and recommendations supplied to it by the time has come to follow the rest of the western world ACMD. The ACMD has an advisory role in that context and act on khat. and Ministers make the ultimate decision, but we have stated in our working protocol with the ACMD that we should properly consider the advice that we are given, 7.31 pm and I think that that is the appropriate course. The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the The FRANK service provides information and advice Home Department (James Brokenshire): This has been on khat and harms associated with its use and misuse, an interesting and impassioned debate, and I would like directed at young people, their parents, and those working to take this opportunity to thank my hon. Friend the with them. Treatment for khat misuse typically consists Member for Milton Keynes North (Mark Lancaster) of psycho-social interventions and talking therapies to for continuing to raise this issue. I am mindful that this help change behaviour, and drug action teams are expected is the second debate he has secured, having previously to review commissioning of local services in order to spoken on the same topic in a pre-summer recess debate respond in the best way to the diverse needs of their last year. He represents well and effectively his constituency local communities. My hon. Friend has specifically and these particular parts of the community in it in sought to draw attention to that diversity this evening. seeking to draw attention to this issue this evening. My hon. Friend said that there was some kind of Mark Lancaster: Will the Minister give way? formal commitment and he drew attention to statements of shadow Ministers in the Opposition prior to the last James Brokenshire: I will give way once more. general election. I would say to him, however, that there was no specific manifesto commitment and no provision Mark Lancaster: Can the Minister confirm that FRANK was made in the coalition programme for government offers that information and advice in the native languages for the classification of khat. I would like to assure my of the east African communities? hon. Friend, the community he represents and other communities and interested parties that the Government James Brokenshire: I am told that a leaflet has been are concerned about this serious issue. It is a matter we published in English and Somali, that a range of other want to investigate properly and effectively by closely drug information leaflets have also been published in examining the problems highlighted this evening; we do Somali, and that the helpline is equipped to take calls in not want to kick this into the long grass. Somali via a translator. However, I understand my hon. We have heard today about real public concerns over Friend’s wish to ensure that the service is provided in a health issues—sleep deprivation, loss of appetite, oral way that makes it accessible to those who may be in the hygiene and mental health—and particularly about the greatest need of its support, and I agree with him that social harms associated with the use of khat. Although more needs to be done. its use has a cultural context and can be socially The Government are concerned about khat use— accepted among Somali, Yemeni,Ethiopian and Kenyan particularly among young people—and about the societal communities in the UK, many concerns have been impact on the most affected communities, and they raised within these communities. Higher prevalence of adopt a serious approach to their role in taking appropriate khat use among them and its potential for misuse might action to protect all sections of the community from well disproportionately affect the social cohesion around harms caused by drugs. Since the ACMD’s last review khat users and their families, as well as their quality of in 2005 there has been an advance in the evidence base, life within wider UK society. We need fully and properly which is why I requested the ACMD to undertake a to understand this dimension. comprehensive review to update its 2005 assessment. Under the Misuse of Drugs Act 1971, the Government The chair of its khat working group has told me that the are required to look to the Advisory Council on the planned process of evidence-gathering for the review Misuse of Drugs to provide advice on drug-related will be rigorous, and will include engagement with issues, including on the case for control based on available communities and stakeholder organisations and a public evidence at the time of its consideration. evidence-gathering meeting. As my hon. Friend knows, the ACMD last formally The ACMD review will cover issues including considered the misuse of khat in 2005, when it advised classification of khat under the 1971 Act, reporting the against bringing the plant under the control of the 1971 prevalence of khat use, identifying key khat-using Act and made recommendations for health and prevention populations, identifying and quantifying harms associated approaches responding to local community needs, which with khat use—specifically social harms—developing the last Government accepted. In the light of those an understanding of responses to khat use through 2005 recommendations, the handling of khat-related services and public information campaigns, and considering issues has focused on the tailoring of health and education the nature of the khat trade, including international responses to local community needs, such as the availability trafficking. The chair of the working group has indicated of appropriate drug prevention materials and information that he would be pleased if my hon. Friend put him in to raise awareness among practitioners and khat-using contact with constituents who have evidence to contribute communities. to the review. Furthermore, the ACMD would welcome 301 Khat11 JANUARY 2012 Khat 302
[James Brokenshire] were perceptions of social harms among the UK’s immigrant Somali, Yemeni and Ethiopian communities sharing its terms of reference for the review and its although there was little evidence of a clear causal planned process for evidence collation. I would certainly relationship to support this view. Reference was made encourage my hon. Friend and other Members present to stronger evidence on the health harms of khat to get involved and support that. My right hon. Friend consumption. the Home Secretary will emphasise in her annual The Government have made clear in our drug strategy commissioning letter to the ACMD, which will be issued a commitment to a drug policy that is based on evidence shortly, the priority that this work should now continue and outcome. We have placed proper consideration of to have as part of the ACMD’s work programme in the advice provided by our independent experts, the order to ensure its advice is delivered on time. ACMD, at the heart of enabling the delivery of the We have published two studies on khat, one in October strategy. The Government and the ACMD have also 2010 and the other in July 2011. They reviewed perceptions agreed a new working protocol, which has been placed and international evidence on the link between khat use in the House Library, setting out a framework for and social harms, and included an overview of the mutual engagement in line with statutory duties. I am evidence in respect of legislative approaches adopted sure that my hon. Friend shares my anticipation at the abroad. These studies have been shared with the ACMD publication of the ACMD’s findings and appreciates to inform its review. We identified research gaps, which the importance of considering the advice of our experts was why those two studies were commissioned. We before deciding on next steps, in particular any legislative anticipate that they will help inform the ACMD’s review. intervention. My hon. Friend will not expect the Home We will ensure that there is appropriate information and Secretary to prejudge the outcome of this advice and we encourage others to participate in the review. preclude the consideration of evidence that will be The October 2010 study of perceptions of social available then. I take this opportunity to invite Members harms found that khat use was widely socially accepted to direct any representations and evidence in respect of within Somali, Ethiopian and Yemeni communities, khat to the secretariat of the ACMD, based at the and that there was an increased prevalence of use Home Office. including among women and young people. There was We take this issue very seriously. I commend my hon. widespread support for some level of Government Friend on the way in which he has approached it and his intervention, but there was no consensus, although continued focus on it. We will not kick it into the long there was a range of suggestions, including regulation grass. We remain focused on this matter and will take of trade, local investment in tailored services and more action if that is judged appropriate. research and better statistics, and some called for control. Question put and agreed to. The July 2011 review of literature on social harms found no robust evidence either for or against in respect 7.44 pm of the link between khat and social harms, but there House adjourned. 303 11 JANUARY 2012 Deferred Division 304
Deferred Division Gyimah, Mr Sam Maynard, Paul Hague, rh Mr William McCartney, Jason Halfon, Robert McCartney, Karl LOCAL GOVERNMENT FINANCE BILL (CARRY-OVER) Hames, Duncan McCrea, Dr William That if, at the conclusion of this Session of Parliament, proceedings Hammond, rh Mr Philip McIntosh, Miss Anne on the Local Government Finance Bill have not been completed, Hammond, Stephen McLoughlin, rh Mr Patrick they shall be resumed in the next Session. Hancock, Matthew McPartland, Stephen The House divided: Ayes 329, Noes 207. Hands, Greg McVey, Esther Division No. 418] Harper, Mr Mark Mensch, Louise Harrington, Richard Menzies, Mark Harris, Rebecca Metcalfe, Stephen AYES Hart, Simon Miller, Maria Adams, Nigel Colvile, Oliver Harvey, Nick Mills, Nigel Afriyie, Adam Crabb, Stephen Haselhurst, rh Sir Alan Milton, Anne Aldous, Peter Crockart, Mike Hayes, Mr John Mitchell, rh Mr Andrew Alexander, rh Danny Crouch, Tracey Heald, Oliver Moore, rh Michael Amess, Mr David Davey, Mr Edward Heath, Mr David Mordaunt, Penny Andrew, Stuart Davies, David T. C. Heaton-Harris, Chris Morgan, Nicky Arbuthnot, rh Mr James (Monmouth) Hemming, John Morris, Anne Marie Baker, Steve Davies, Glyn Henderson, Gordon Morris, James Baldry, Tony Davies, Philip Hendry, Charles Mosley, Stephen Baldwin, Harriett Dinenage, Caroline Herbert, rh Nick Mowat, David Barker, Gregory Djanogly, Mr Jonathan Hinds, Damian Mulholland, Greg Baron, Mr John Dodds, rh Mr Nigel Hoban, Mr Mark Mundell, rh David Barwell, Gavin Donaldson, rh Mr Jeffrey M. Hollingbery, George Munt, Tessa Bebb, Guto Dorrell, rh Mr Stephen Hollobone, Mr Philip Murray, Sheryll Beith, rh Sir Alan Dorries, Nadine Holloway, Mr Adam Murrison, Dr Andrew Bellingham, Mr Henry Doyle-Price, Jackie Hopkins, Kris Neill, Robert Benyon, Richard Drax, Richard Horwood, Martin Newmark, Mr Brooks Beresford, Sir Paul Duddridge, James Howell, John Newton, Sarah Binley, Mr Brian Duncan, rh Mr Alan Hughes, rh Simon Nokes, Caroline Birtwistle, Gordon Duncan Smith, rh Mr Iain Huhne, rh Chris Norman, Jesse Blackman, Bob Dunne, Mr Philip Hunter, Mark Nuttall, Mr David Blackwood, Nicola Ellis, Michael Huppert, Dr Julian O’Brien, Mr Stephen Blunt, Mr Crispin Ellison, Jane Hurd, Mr Nick Offord, Mr Matthew Boles, Nick Elphicke, Charlie James, Margot Ollerenshaw, Eric Bone, Mr Peter Eustice, George Javid, Sajid Opperman, Guy Bottomley, Sir Peter Evans, Jonathan Johnson, Gareth Ottaway, Richard Bradley, Karen Evennett, Mr David Johnson, Joseph Paisley, Ian Brady, Mr Graham Fabricant, Michael Jones, Andrew Parish, Neil Brake, rh Tom Fallon, Michael Jones, Mr David Patel, Priti Bray, Angie Farron, Tim Jones, Mr Marcus Paterson, rh Mr Owen Brazier, Mr Julian Featherstone, Lynne Kawczynski, Daniel Pawsey, Mark Field, Mark Brine, Steve Kirby, Simon Percy, Andrew Flynn, Paul Brokenshire, James Knight, rh Mr Greg Phillips, Stephen Foster, rh Mr Don Brooke, Annette Kwarteng, Kwasi Pickles, rh Mr Eric Fox,rhDrLiam Pincher, Christopher Bruce, Fiona Lamb, Norman Francois, rh Mr Mark Poulter, Dr Daniel Bruce, rh Malcolm Lancaster, Mark Freer, Mike Prisk, Mr Mark Buckland, Mr Robert Lansley, rh Mr Andrew Fullbrook, Lorraine Pritchard, Mark Burns, Conor Latham, Pauline Fuller, Richard Pugh, John Burns, rh Mr Simon Gale, Sir Roger Laws, rh Mr David Raab, Mr Dominic Burrowes, Mr David Garnier, Mr Edward Leadsom, Andrea Randall, rh Mr John Burstow, Paul Garnier, Mark Lee, Jessica Reckless, Mark Burt, Alistair Gauke, Mr David Lee, Dr Phillip Redwood, rh Mr John Burt, Lorely George, Andrew Leech, Mr John Rees-Mogg, Jacob Byles, Dan Gibb, Mr Nick Lefroy, Jeremy Reevell, Simon Cable, rh Vince Gilbert, Stephen Leslie, Charlotte Reid, Mr Alan Cairns, Alun Gillan, rh Mrs Cheryl Lewis, Brandon Rifkind, rh Sir Malcolm Cameron, rh Mr David Glen, John Lewis, Dr Julian Robathan, rh Mr Andrew Campbell, Mr Gregory Goldsmith, Zac Lilley, rh Mr Peter Robertson, Hugh Campbell, rh Sir Menzies Goodwill, Mr Robert Lloyd, Stephen Robertson, Mr Laurence Carmichael, rh Mr Alistair Gove, rh Michael Llwyd, rh Mr Elfyn Rogerson, Dan Carswell, Mr Douglas Graham, Richard Lopresti, Jack Rosindell, Andrew Cash, Mr William Grant, Mrs Helen Lord, Jonathan Rudd, Amber Chishti, Rehman Gray, Mr James Loughton, Tim Russell, Sir Bob Clappison, Mr James Grayling, rh Chris Luff, Peter Rutley, David Clark, rh Greg Green, Damian Lumley, Karen Sanders, Mr Adrian Clarke, rh Mr Kenneth Greening, rh Justine Macleod, Mary Sandys, Laura Clifton-Brown, Geoffrey Grieve, rh Mr Dominic MacShane, rh Mr Denis Scott, Mr Lee Coffey, Dr Thérèse Griffiths, Andrew Main, Mrs Anne Selous, Andrew Collins, Damian Gummer, Ben May, rh Mrs Theresa Shannon, Jim 305 Deferred Division11 JANUARY 2012 Deferred Division 306
Shapps, rh Grant Tredinnick, David Evans, Chris McKechin, Ann Sharma, Alok Truss, Elizabeth Farrelly, Paul McKinnell, Catherine Shelbrooke, Alec Turner, Mr Andrew Fitzpatrick, Jim Meacher, rh Mr Michael Simmonds, Mark Tyrie, Mr Andrew Flello, Robert Meale, Sir Alan Simpson, David Uppal, Paul Fovargue, Yvonne Mearns, Ian Simpson, Mr Keith Vaizey, Mr Edward Francis, Dr Hywel Michael, rh Alun Skidmore, Chris Vara, Mr Shailesh Gapes, Mike Moon, Mrs Madeleine Smith, Miss Chloe Vickers, Martin Gardiner, Barry Morden, Jessica Smith, Henry Villiers, rh Mrs Theresa Gilmore, Sheila Morris, Grahame M. Smith, Julian Walker, Mr Charles Glass, Pat (Easington) Smith, Sir Robert Walker, Mr Robin Glindon, Mrs Mary Munn, Meg Soubry, Anna Wallace, Mr Ben Goggins, rh Paul Murphy, rh Mr Jim Spelman, rh Mrs Caroline Ward, Mr David Goodman, Helen Murphy, rh Paul Spencer, Mr Mark Watkinson, Angela Greatrex, Tom Murray, Ian Stephenson, Andrew Weatherley, Mike Green, Kate Nandy, Lisa Stevenson, John Webb, Steve Greenwood, Lilian O’Donnell, Fiona Stewart, Bob Wharton, James Griffith, Nia Onwurah, Chi Stewart, Iain Wheeler, Heather Gwynne, Andrew Osborne, Sandra Stewart, Rory White, Chris Hain, rh Mr Peter Owen, Albert Streeter, Mr Gary Whittaker, Craig Hamilton, Mr David Pearce, Teresa Stride, Mel Whittingdale, Mr John Hamilton, Fabian Perkins, Toby Stuart, Mr Graham Wiggin, Bill Hanson, rh Mr David Pound, Stephen Stunell, Andrew Willetts, rh Mr David Havard, Mr Dai Qureshi, Yasmin Sturdy, Julian Williams, Mr Mark Healey, rh John Reynolds, Emma Swales, Ian Williams, Roger Hepburn, Mr Stephen Reynolds, Jonathan Swayne, rh Mr Desmond Williams, Stephen Heyes, David Riordan, Mrs Linda Swinson, Jo Williamson, Gavin Hillier, Meg Robertson, John Swire, rh Mr Hugo Willott, Jenny Hilling, Julie Rotheram, Steve Syms, Mr Robert Wilson, Mr Rob Hodge, rh Margaret Roy, Mr Frank Tapsell, rh Sir Peter Wollaston, Dr Sarah Hodgson, Mrs Sharon Ruane, Chris Teather, Sarah Wright, Jeremy Hood, Mr Jim Ruddock, rh Dame Thurso, John Wright, Simon Hopkins, Kelvin Joan Timpson, Mr Edward Young, rh Sir George Howarth, rh Mr George Sarwar, Anas Tomlinson, Justin Zahawi, Nadhim Hunt, Tristram Seabeck, Alison Irranca-Davies, Huw Sharma, Mr Virendra NOES James, Mrs Siân C. Sheerman, Mr Barry Jamieson, Cathy Sheridan, Jim Ainsworth, rh Mr Bob Coaker, Vernon Jarvis, Dan Shuker, Gavin Alexander, Heidi Coffey, Ann Johnson, rh Alan Skinner, Mr Dennis Anderson, Mr David Connarty, Michael Jones, Graham Slaughter, Mr Andy Ashworth, Jonathan Cooper, Rosie Jones, Helen Smith, Angela Austin, Ian Cooper, rh Yvette Jones, Susan Elan Smith, Nick Bailey, Mr Adrian Corbyn, Jeremy Jowell, rh Tessa Smith, Owen Bain, Mr William Crausby, Mr David Joyce, Eric Spellar, rh Mr John Balls, rh Ed Creagh, Mary Kaufman, rh Sir Straw, rh Mr Jack Banks, Gordon Creasy, Stella Gerald Stringer, Graham Bayley, Hugh Cruddas, Jon Keeley, Barbara Stuart, Ms Gisela Beckett, rh Margaret Cryer, John Khan, rh Sadiq Sutcliffe, Mr Gerry Begg, Dame Anne Cunningham, Alex Lammy, rh Mr David Tami, Mark Bell, Sir Stuart Cunningham, Tony Lavery, Ian Thomas, Mr Gareth Benn, rh Hilary Curran, Margaret Lazarowicz, Mark Thornberry, Emily Benton, Mr Joe Dakin, Nic Leslie, Chris Timms, rh Stephen Berger, Luciana Danczuk, Simon Lloyd, Tony Trickett, Jon Betts, Mr Clive Darling, rh Mr Alistair Long, Naomi Twigg, Derek Blackman-Woods, Roberta David, Mr Wayne Lucas, Caroline Twigg, Stephen Blears, rh Hazel De Piero, Gloria Lucas, Ian Umunna, Mr Chuka Blenkinsop, Tom Denham, rh Mr John Mactaggart, Fiona Vaz, rh Keith Blomfield, Paul Dobbin, Jim Mahmood, Shabana Vaz, Valerie Blunkett, rh Mr David Docherty, Thomas Malhotra, Seema Walley, Joan Bradshaw, rh Mr Ben Donohoe, Mr Brian H. Mann, John Watson, Mr Tom Brennan, Kevin Doran, Mr Frank Marsden, Mr Gordon Watts, Mr Dave Brown, Lyn Doyle, Gemma McCabe, Steve Whitehead, Dr Alan Brown, rh Mr Nicholas Dromey, Jack McCarthy, Kerry Williams, Hywel Brown, Mr Russell Durkan, Mark McClymont, Gregg Williamson, Chris Bryant, Chris Eagle, Ms Angela McDonagh, Siobhain Wilson, Phil Burden, Richard Eagle, Maria McDonnell, Dr Alasdair Winnick, Mr David Campbell, Mr Alan Edwards, Jonathan McDonnell, John Winterton, rh Ms Rosie McFadden, rh Mr Pat Woodcock, John Campbell, Mr Ronnie Efford, Clive McGovern, Jim Wright, David Caton, Martin Elliott, Julie McGuire, rh Mrs Anne Wright, Mr Iain Chapman, Mrs Jenny Ellman, Mrs Louise Clark, Katy Engel, Natascha Clarke, rh Mr Tom Esterson, Bill Question accordingly agreed to. 77WH 11 JANUARY 2012 North Korea 78WH
a peaceful resolution as regards the relationship between Westminster Hall North and South Korea. “Building Bridges Not Walls” also states that the APPG had Wednesday 11 January 2012 “the opportunity to see some encouraging developments, including the establishment of a Russian Orthodox Church in which Russian diplomats freely worship; a Protestant seminary; the work of British Council teachers; English-language teaching at Kim il-Sung [PHILIP DAVIES in the Chair] University…a newly opened e-Library at Kim il-Sung University; and the establishment of the impressive Pyongyang University of North Korea Science and Technology (PUST), with a faculty of teachers from the United States, the United Kingdom and the Netherlands. Motion made, and Question proposed, That the sitting These are welcome developments which we hope will…contribute be now adjourned.—(Mr Newmark.) towards the establishment of a more open and prosperous society for all the people of North Korea.” 9.30 am I believe that I speak on behalf of many people in this Fiona Bruce (Congleton) (Con): It is a pleasure to country who fervently hope that the accession to leadership speak under your chairmanship, Mr Davies, and to of Kim Jong-un will further pave the way for that. have secured this debate at such a momentous time, so The APPG delegation also voiced concerns that cannot soon after the succession of Kim Jong-un, the new be batted away with diplomatic niceties about the need leader of North Korea, following the death of his to discuss grave human rights issues in North Korea father, Kim Jong-il, last month. It was even more gratifying through a process of constructive, critical engagement. to hear, only yesterday, of the North Korean Government’s That should be done in the same way that President announcement that they will grant an amnesty for Ronald Reagan and Margaret Thatcher established the prisoners to mark the birthdays of those two leaders. Helsinki process with the Soviet Union. The APPG We look forward to hearing more news about the prisoners reports says: to be released. “It is time for peace, and ‘it is time for Helsinki with a Korean face’.” Jeremy Lefroy (Stafford) (Con): On that amnesty, In other words, as the human rights researcher David does my hon. Friend hope for the release of Dr Oh, who Hawk says, a process is to be encouraged that would has not seen his wife and daughters for 15 years? “pursue peace, engagement, and reconciliation in association with the promotion and protection of human rights”. Fiona Bruce: I thank my hon. Friend for raising that That sums up more eloquently than I ever could the very important case, on which a number of my colleague process that many in Britain desire to see develop in this parliamentarians have made representations. I believe new era. I would appreciate the Minister’s comments on that the Minister is aware of that case, and I look how the British Government can help to facilitate dialogue forward to hearing his comments. I also hope that to that end. further representations can be made to the North Korean Government about the release of Dr Oh’s family as part I turn to the protection of human rights, on which it of the amnesty. has to be said that North Korea has, by any international standard, a deplorable record. I was stirred to call for The amnesty announcement emphasises what many this debate by a visit two months ago to the UK see as a fresh opportunity, at the start of a new era, to Parliament by a remarkable young man who is now in forge further relationships with the people of North his late 20s, Shin Dong-hyuk. I understand that he is the Korea. That is the hope of many people in Britain who only person ever to have escaped from a North Korean have often worked for years to develop relationships, prison camp. On hearing Shin’s story, I was moved, by and indeed friendships, with people in North Korea to compassion for the North Korean people, to highlight share knowledge, understanding and support. Several their dignified suffering in order to encourage support of my parliamentary colleagues from the all-party group for them in their plight. May I record that I called for on North Korea have visited the Democratic People’s this debate holding no hatred of the people of North Republic of Korea—the DPRK—in recent years, as Korea? I am motivated by a deep love for the North have many other delegations from the UK. Interestingly, Korean people, and by concern for their needs and their in 2010, that included the Middlesbrough Ladies football deep suffering over decades. team, who apparently attracted a 20,000-strong crowd of spectators. Mr Robert Buckland (South Swindon) (Con): Will On a more modest level, but no less importantly, my hon. Friend give way? the Speaker of the House of Commons has met the Speaker of the North Korean Assembly, Choe Thae-bok. Fiona Bruce: I will certainly give way to my hon. Mr Speaker was able to raise human rights concerns Friend, particularly as he is chairman of the Conservative with his DPRK counterpart in a very constructive party human rights commission, of which I am privileged discussion. Most recently, the DPRK authorities extended to be a serving member. an invitation to the Archbishop of Canterbury to visit their country soon, and I hope that he accepts. Mr Buckland: I congratulate my hon. Friend on The most recent visit of the all-party parliamentary securing the debate. May I reinforce her remarks about group was in autumn 2010, after which it produced a the evidence of Shin Dong-hyuk, which was not only report, “Building Bridges Not Walls: the Case for moving but informative? He taught us that life in the Constructive, Critical Engagement with North Korea”. prison camps was very often the only way of life that The report describes a welcome commitment from DPRK families who had been born into captivity knew. When officials to dialogue, with particular reference to negotiating he came to the west, he learned for the first time about 79WH North Korea11 JANUARY 2012 North Korea 80WH
[Mr Buckland] stabbing the sole of my foot when I passed through the wire. I almost fainted but, by instinct, I pushed myself forward through the Nazi holocaust, and it instantly reminded him of the fence. I looked around to find the barbed wire behind me but some of his experiences in North Korea. Is that not very Park”— powerful testimony of the depth of deprivation of human his friend— rights from which the people of North Korea are suffering? “was motionless hanging over the wire fence! At that desperate moment I could afford little thought of my poor friend and I was Fiona Bruce: My hon. Friend makes an excellent just overwhelmed by joy. The feeling of ecstasy to be out of the point. If you will indulge me, Mr Davies, I shall shortly camp was beyond description. I ran down the mountain quite a way when I felt something wet on my legs. I was in fact bleeding go into further details of Shin Dong-hyuk’s testimony from the wound inflicted by the barbed wire. I had no time to stop to us. but sometime later found a locked house in the mountain. I broke It was in meetings with the Conservative party human into the house and found some food that I ate, then I left with a rights commission, and at an event that I chaired on small supply of rice I found in the house. I sold the rice at the first behalf of the Henry Jackson Society, that Shin Dong-hyuk mining village I found and bribed the border guards to let me told his life story. It is the personal testimony of someone through the North Korean border with China with the money from that rice.” who was born into a North Korean prison camp, lived there for 23 years and then escaped. As my hon. Friend Shin described to us first seeing the country of North says, his story was authoritative, valuable and deeply Korea outside the prison camps, and said that, to him, moving. it looked like paradise. Shin Dong-hyuk was born in camp 14 in 1982. Shin Shin’s story will be published in March this year, in a described the conditions he endured for the first 23 years book called “Escape from Camp 14”. I hope that many of his life. When he was 14 years old, his mother and of us will read it. I am aware that the Minister met Shin, brother were executed in front of him because they tried and I look forward to hearing his reflections on their to escape. He was held for seven months in solitary discussions. The Archbishop of Canterbury and Mr Speaker confinement. The torture he faced was unimaginably also met Shin, and expressed what an impact that inhumane. With extraordinary dignity and lack of encounter had on them. Shin, however, is by no means bitterness, he described to us how he was hung upside the only North Korean defector to have spoken in down by his legs and hands from the ceiling, and on one Parliament; earlier this year, Kim Hye-sook addressed a occasion his body was burned over a fire. His torturers meeting organised by the APPG. She spent 28 years in pierced his groin with a steel hook; he lost consciousness. the North Korean prison camps, and was first jailed at the age of 13. Kim was forced to work in coal mines On another occasion, Shin was assigned to work in a even as a child, and witnessed public executions. garment factory. Severe hard labour is a common feature of North Korea’s prison camps. He accidentally dropped What Shin Dong-hyuk and Kim Hye-sook have in a sewing machine, and as a punishment the prison common is that they were victims of North Korea’s guards chopped off his middle finger. According to appalling “guilt by association” policy, which punishes Shin, couples perceived by the authorities to be good people for three generations for the alleged crimes of a workers are arbitrarily selected by prison guards and family member. Kim’s grandfather had gone to South permitted, even forced, to get married, with a view to Korea during the Korean war, and for that reason her producing children who could, in turn, become model family were regarded as hostile elements by the regime, workers. Children born in the prison camp are, like and jailed. According to lists of detainees, which I have Shin, treated as prisoners from birth. As a child in the been sent, many others in the camps are jailed for being prison school, Shin recalled the teacher, who was also a Christian. prison guard, telling the children that they were animals It is estimated that there are approximately 200,000 whose parents should have been killed. He told them prisoners in such camps, and over the years human that, by contrast, he, the teacher, was a human, and that rights reports by organisations including Amnesty they should be grateful to be alive. International, Human Rights Watch and Christian Shin also recalled seeing, while at school, a seven-year-old Solidarity Worldwide have catalogued stories from survivors girl in his class being severely beaten because she was of the camps, who testify to the widespread use of discovered to have picked up a few grains of wheat on forced labour, executions, torture, rape, sexual violence, the way to school. The beating continued for two hours, forced abortions, infanticide and religious persecution. and her classmates had to carry her home. She died the One, Kim Wu-yeong, told CSW: next day. “Christianity is public enemy number one in North Korea. If In 2004, at the age of 22, Shin met a fellow prisoner someone is a Christian in North Korea they are a political enemy and will be either executed or sent away to a political prison who had seen life outside the camp. This prisoner camp.” described the wider world to Shin. Initially, Shin did not believe him. His entire life until then had been spent Further information can be found in the book “North behind the barbed wire of the prison camp, and he Korea: a Case to Answer, a Call to Act”, published by thought that this was the extent of life. Eventually, the CSW in 2007 and available on the internet. other prisoner convinced him, and Shin’s curiosity One of the most remarkable books I have ever read is developed. Together, they decided to try to escape, and “Nothing to Envy: Ordinary Lives in North Korea” by in 2005 they put their plan into action. What then Barbara Demick. If hon. Members read just one book followed is a story of agony and ecstasy. In a written on North Korea, I would recommend this one. It is testimony available on the internet, Shin recalls: available from the Library and tells the life stories of “I had no fear of being shot at or electrified; I knew I had to several escapees from North Korea to South Korea—people get out and nothing else mattered at that moment. I ran to the who have not lived in prison camps, but who have none barbed wire. Suddenly, I felt a great pain as though someone was the less suffered greatly over the past several decades in 81WH North Korea11 JANUARY 2012 North Korea 82WH many ways, in a country where freedom of speech and annual gap of about a million metric tons in the amount movement is minimal and malnutrition is commonplace. of food needed, according to the DPRK’s own targets. I remember reading and being so saddened by one People live mainly off maize, cabbage and occasionally mother’s story; I identified with her. In the 1990s, when rice. There is no oil, although if people live near the sea, there was a severe famine in the country, she was forced there is occasionally fish, but no meat. She asked some to search the countryside for grass and bark, which she mothers when they last had an egg: no one could tell would mash up and feed her family. Both her husband her. So there is virtually no protein for people in need of and her loved son died during that famine. food aid. In fact, there are hardly any animals to be Despite the passing of that terrible famine, malnutrition seen. still affects many millions of people who live in North The nutritional deficit in children is acute, and there Korea. The current humanitarian situation is dire and are major structural problems with food production, food aid is desperately needed. The World Food Programme with severely low production from land and an almost and UNICEF conducted an assessment last year that total lack of mechanisation. Indeed, another visitor to shows that food needs are acute. The problem has North Korea, who went last month, told me this week continued over many years with such serious implications that she had seen only three tractors over several days of for growth that the North Korean army has, I understand, travelling across the countryside. now reduced its height requirement for men from 4 feet Transport is a major problem. Baroness Amos reported 8 inches to 4 feet 3 inches. Our fellow men and women seeing steam lorries—something she had never seen are living at this time, in the 21st century, when there is anywhere else in the world—where coal is burnt on the so much plenty in so many other countries, but they live back of lorries to create steam and three out of four of in another part of the world with such shortages in a them appeared to be broken down. country that, as the book “Nothing to Envy” describes, Food for much of the population comes from the was once a developing nation but is now going backwards. public food distribution system and is obtained on Compassion should surely move us to do all that we can production of ration cards. People receive about 200 grams to provide food aid and to support international aid of food a day, on average, although the DPRK’s own agencies that are willing to help. target is about 600 grams. Needs are particularly acute outside the capital Pyongyang. People living in Pyongyang Mr Gregory Campbell (East Londonderry) (DUP): I rarely travel out of it, and vice versa, so the desperate congratulate the hon. Lady on securing the debate. She needs of those outside the capital are perhaps not as is moving on to one of the most important issues on well understood as they could be. this subject—humanitarian assistance. As well as making Will the Minister advise us about the endeavours it very clear to the new regime in North Korea that the of the British Government to facilitate the provision of brutality and the other matters that we are all very food aid to North Korea, either directly or through deeply concerned about need to stop, we need to ensure international aid agencies? Will he press for unrestricted that humanitarian assistance gets to the people of North access for humanitarian aid organisations to all parts of Korea, as opposed to the Government and the regime, the country and inform us what the British Government which could well be entering a new, dangerous phase. are doing, by themselves or through the European Union or United Nations, to address the crisis? What Fiona Bruce: The hon. Gentleman makes a good efforts have been made to ensure monitoring of aid and point. One of the issues that I will ask the Minister to what assessment have the Government made of the address is the monitoring of humanitarian food aid effectiveness of international aid and the ability of across the country. Currently, food rations are distributed international humanitarian organisations to reach North by the DPRK under the North Korean Government’s Korean people in need? food distribution programme, on which millions of I want to highlight two other concerns: the situation people are dependent, but it meets less than half the of abductees and the plight of refugees. The Minister daily calorific needs of most recipients. will, I hope, be familiar with the case of Dr Oh, who has To underline the urgent need for food, I will relate been mentioned. There are many other cases. Will the some of the descriptions given to the APPG at a meeting Minister tell us what the latest position is regarding here in Parliament, just a few weeks ago, by Baroness Dr Oh’s family and what efforts the British Government Amos, the UN Under-Secretary General for Humanitarian are making to press the North Korean authorities to Affairs and Emergency Relief Co-ordinator, after she account for the large number of foreign abductees, visited the country late last year. I hope to report what believed to run into several thousand, and to release Baroness Amos said accurately. She stated that the them? What steps can the British Government take to background to her visit was that in 2011, for the first work with Governments of countries whose citizens time in 16 years, the North Korean Government made have been abducted and with international organisations an international appeal for assistance—welcome news. such as the UN to secure their release? By a UN assessment, she said that 16 million people in Additionally, what steps can be taken to urge China the DPRK are now in need of food aid and that the to desist from the forcible repatriation of North Korean number is increasing because of the growth rate, especially refugees and to tackle the plight of refugees who in women and children. subsequently suffer at the hands of human traffickers? Baroness Amos recounted that during her visit she The number of women affected in that way runs into was at pains to stress to the North Korean Government tens of thousands. that humanitarian aid is impartial. She visited a hospital, a market, a biscuit factory, a Government food distribution Andrew Selous (South West Bedfordshire) (Con): I point and a co-operative farm. She reported a situation congratulate my hon. Friend on her speech, which I am of chronic poverty and under-development, with an listening to with interest. Does she agree that there has 83WH North Korea11 JANUARY 2012 North Korea 84WH
[Andrew Selous] I thank the Minister for meeting Shin Dong-hyuk personally. I believe that that is an indication of his been quite a lot of discussion in the media about sincere concern about these issues. Will he also consider nuclear and military issues and the backward economic meeting Dr James Kim, a remarkable man who has situation, but that human rights in Korea has had little founded Pyongyang university of science and technology— exposure? Does she agree that that needs to be remedied PUST—within the past two years, when he visits Parliament urgently? on 15 February? Perhaps after hearing of the wonderful story of hope that the establishment of that university provides, the Minister may consider making representations Fiona Bruce: I agree. I hope that this debate will raise to the Department for International Development to awareness of those two key issues. give support to PUST, if not on a wider basis for North The former UN special rapporteur for human rights Korea. in North Korea, Mr Vitit Muntarbhorn, has called on It is encouraging that the UK Government have the international community to developed, over the past 10 years, diplomatic relations “mobilise the totality of the UN to promote and protect human with the DPRK. I pay a particular tribute to our rights in the country”. diplomatic staff in North Korea, especially our new Will the Minister advise us whether the British Government ambassador, Karen Wolstenholme, who I am sure will would consider taking a lead to seek the establishment follow in an equally exemplary manner her immediate of a UN commission of inquiry in this respect on the predecessor in the British embassy in Pyongyang, Mr Peter subjects that my hon. Friend mentioned? In particular, Hughes, whose ongoing concern for the people of North what steps is the Minister taking to press the new Korea has been evident to me whenever I have had the leadership to open up access to international human pleasure of meeting him. rights monitors, including the UN special rapporteur What a positive step it would be if the United States for human rights, who has repeatedly been refused established diplomatic relations with the DPRK and access? Can the Minister say whether any progress has thereby effectively formally ended the Korean war. Can been made in negotiation and dialogue with the DPRK the Minister advise us what steps, if any, the British authorities by the new UN special rapporteur to the Government may be taking to encourage the Americans DPRK? in this respect? With reference to the prison camps, such as the one Shin Dong-hyuk told me that the North Korean Shin Dong-hyuk described, I understand that the North people cannot change their situation by themselves. Korean authorities regularly say that these are not They need help from the international community. I prisons as described. Will the Minister, through a process hope that the Minister gives us an indication of what we of Government engagement between the two countries, can all do to give more hope to the people of North endeavour to arrange access to some of the camps for Korea. British parliamentarians, such as those from the APPG, who have already sensitively endeavoured over several 9.58 am years to build constructive relationships with North Korean people? In this regard, I pay tribute to the Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP): I congratulate the chairman and founder of the APPG for North Korea, hon. Member for Congleton (Fiona Bruce) on securing Professor Lord Alton of Liverpool and his colleague in this debate and on bringing this matter to Westminster the House of Lords, Baroness Cox. Hall for consideration. I also commend her on her passion and compassion on behalf of the people of I welcome the British Government’s improved funding North Korea and for making some salient, pertinent support, despite their austerity programme, for the British points about conditions in North Korea. Council’s English teaching work within North Korea. It is particularly pleasing to note that English is now being I wish to focus on human rights, specifically how taught as the second language in the DPRK. I should people with Christian beliefs are affected. Perhaps the particularly like to offer my congratulations on the only subject at school that I excelled at was history. I recent acceptance of the first two scholars to study at was interested in the history of the second world war Cambridge university, which is to the credit of our and the Korean war. In my constituency there are still Government, the Foreign Office and those scholars. some Korean war veterans, who tell stories about the critical battles that they fought and how they came I welcome the Minister’s thoughts on what can be through. No one could fail to be horrified by the stories done to encourage the flow of information from the they told. Today, when we look at North Korea, we see outside world into North Korea, perhaps through support things getting progressively worse, and I want to focus for radio broadcasting. on that. I understand that there are some 400 North Korean Yesterday, just before I left the hotel where I was refugees here in the United Kingdom. The book, “Nothing staying, on one of the TV news channels there was a to Envy”, which I have mentioned more than once story about the new leader of North Korea, Kim Jong-un. already, describes how difficult modern life, with all its There was this guy on a horse galloping around, looking choices and complexities, is for North Korean refugees. well fed—there is certainly no shortage of food in his What support is available for them in the UK to help house—surrounded by immense numbers of people, them prepare for a better future for themselves and who were supportive, all smiles and cheering him on. their country? Is there dialogue between the Government They were all wearing army uniform which tells us a lot. and those refugees to aid our country’s understanding He appeared to be a confidante of many people, and he of North Korea and in turn help build relationships was looked on as a leader for change, perhaps to change with that country? things for the better. That, however, was a persona for 85WH North Korea11 JANUARY 2012 North Korea 86WH
TV, a story that the North Koreans wanted to put masses through propaganda, revolutionary zeal, ruthless forward. The reality in North Korea is very different for elimination of opposition and the sacrifice of large people who do not necessarily accept his leadership or numbers of the population to starvation due to economic the authoritarian regime that he supports. mismanagement. He used a philosophy known as juche— Any number of charities working to end the persecution self-reliance and permanent revolutionary struggle—to of Christians highlight what happens in North Korea as achieve a national unity that has produced an isolated some of the most horrific acts of persecution anywhere nation that many call the hermit kingdom. His son, in the world. Open Doors and Release International Kim Jong-il, the so-called dear leader, continued his have a chart of countries in the world, giving their level father’s policies but, if anything, more destructively. of persecution. In No. 1 position, at the top of the After decades of economic mismanagement and resource chart—not the championship or premier league winners, misallocation, North Korea has relied heavily on but at the top of the persecution league—is North international aid to feed its population since the mid-1990s. Korea, in the persecution of its people and how it Chronic food shortages and widespread malnutrition affects them. are rampant. My hon. Friend the Member for East Londonderry (Mr Campbell), in his intervention, spoke Dr William McCrea (South Antrim) (DUP): I join about food aid and how it could best be used. North my hon. Friend in congratulating the hon. Member for Korea’s history of regional military provocations, the Congleton (Fiona Bruce) not only on securing the proliferation of military-related items, the development debate but on her choice of subject. My hon. Friend has of long-range missiles, programmes for weapons of raised his concerns about rights and so on, but on mass destruction and massive conventional armed forces, 19 December, the UN passed a resolution by majority, is of major concern to the international community. We with 51 abstentions, that expressed the Assembly’s in this country cannot ignore the effects of that. “very serious concern at the persistence of continuing reports of systematic, widespread and grave violations of civil, political, As juche becomes increasingly weak and deluded, economic, social and cultural rights”. North Korea and its regime appear ever more vulnerable. Is my hon. Friend concerned that there is no mention of We are now in a state of limbo after the death of Kim religious rights? Jong-il as to the intentions of his son, Kim Jong-un, who was educated in the west but, according to The Jim Shannon: I thank my hon. Friend for bringing Wall Street Journal, is depicted by US intelligence as that matter to my attention, and to the attention of “a volatile youth with a sadistic streak who may be even more everyone in the Chamber. I am concerned about that, unpredictable than his late father”. and I hope to use this opportunity, as others in the House will do today, to highlight the issues on behalf of The last and most extreme of the world’s dictatorships Christians, who need to know that their human rights seems set to run as before. The dictatorship is certainly and individual needs are being represented by people on not over with the demise of his father. Citizens are the other side of the border who have not forgotten obliged by law to display portraits of the late Kim about them. Il-sung and Kim Jong-il in their homes. It is considered highly subversive to have a religious faith and, as stated Release International has stated that North Korea by the hon. Member for Congleton, anyone refusing to has one of the most repressive regimes in the world, and accept the Korean leader as the supreme authority is the extent of that repression is unknown because the likely to be punished with imprisonment, death or simply country is fiercely independent, politically isolated and disappearing. closed to all countries except China and Russia. The hon. Member for Congleton suggested what our The precise number of Christians in North Korea is Government might be able to do on behalf of people in unknown. Before the communists came to power, numbers North Korea whose human rights have been violated, were higher than today but, during the Korean war of and perhaps we need to ask Russia and China to be the 1950 to 1953, many fled to South Korea or were martyred. main players in any process. Those said to remain in North Korea are forced to hide Defectors describe a society in which human rights their faith or face terrible consequences. The debate do not exist and freedom of association, worship, movement information pack included many press stories of those and even thought are denied. Such claims are credible in who tried to escape and who were shot and killed as a the light of the fact that North Korea can make use of result. People have reportedly been executed merely for the world’s fifth largest army, of 1.2 million soldiers and owning a Bible. Every one of us has a Bible in the 8.3 million reservists—9.5 million people. The hon. house, probably more than one, and we have that freedom Lady referred to the height requirement being reduced, of expression. In some countries people do not, and but one thing we always see when the soldiers are North Korea is one of those countries. Many Christians marching is that they are fit, healthy and determined. have been sent to concentration camps as political North Korea has a state monopoly of the media—TV, prisoners for their beliefs—for having a belief in God—and radio and the press—that indoctrinate the population have been subjected to brutal treatment in appalling with party propaganda, and the country also has conditions: torture, abuse, execution or simply being 14 concentration camps, some of which hold as many as worked to death. There are an estimated 50,000 people 50,000 prisoners. One has to feel compassion for people in those concentration camps. in those prison camps who might feel that they are The regime still maintains the facade of religious forgotten, so it is important to ensure that they are not freedom, and in 1998 opened three churches in Pyongyang. forgotten. However, they are widely considered to be showcases North Korea’s founder, Kim Il-sung, referred to as for the benefit of foreigners and those who visit the the so-called great leader, is comparable to Joseph Stalin country, demonstrating a façade of religious opportunity, or Mao Tse-tung as an ideologue who controlled the and sermons contain political material supporting the 87WH North Korea11 JANUARY 2012 North Korea 88WH
[Jim Shannon] China during Mao’s terrible “great leap forward”. To those traditional state crimes can be added terrorist acts regime. Christianity as we know it, and as is expressed that bear comparison with those of al-Qaeda, abductions in the Churches of the United Kingdom and elsewhere like those by Somali pirates, and a nuclear programme in the world, is not what happens in North Korea. that is as threatening as anything in Iran. Harsh regime and grinding poverty have forced thousands That is an extraordinary list, and in many ways it of North Koreans to try to escape to China. It is probably adds up to the most completely ruthless estimated that as many as 350,000 North Koreans live dictatorship in modern history. That poses a bit of a in China as illegal immigrants, with many more in problem for those trying to focus opposition, or to South Korea and other countries. The Chinese authorities support those campaigning for any sort of freedom in stubbornly uphold their policy of repatriating defectors North Korea. In Burma, attention can be focused on a found in their territory, even though repatriated North figure such as Aung San Suu Kyi; in eastern Europe, Koreans face notoriously harsh treatment. The North there were figures such as Walesa and Václav Havel, Korean authorities allegedly pay Chinese informants to and there was Nelson Mandela in South Africa, but denounce defectors, so defectors in China are forced their equivalents in North Korea were annihilated long into hiding and, often, into the clutches of ruthless ago, or imprisoned and forgotten. That poses a problem. individuals who trap them into forced labour or the sex industry. Some time ago, I watched a TV programme— Mr Buckland: To reinforce the point that the hon. again, a news item—that showed how people escaping Gentleman is making so eloquently, the last special North Korea left one set of horrific circumstances for rapporteur of the UN Human Rights Council classified another, and were exploited by those who take advantage human rights abuses in North Korea as sui generis—that of the vulnerability of such people. Pressure needs to be is, as a completely separate category from any other applied, so can the Minister, if possible, outline clearly abuses in the world. The hon. Gentleman has encapsulated what discussions have taken place with China and how why the rapporteur’s findings were absolutely right. we intend to help more? Thankfully, some of those who escape have turned to Christ after meeting missionaries Martin Horwood: The hon. Gentleman’s point is who share the gospel with them. We as a nation must be absolutely correct. ever mindful of those who are less well off and those It is important to focus on the people who have who need help and support. The House and MPs who managed, extraordinarily, to escape from the regime, represent areas such as mine, and many others, have a such as Mr Shin. I am pleased that the Minister has met duty to ensure that we do our best for them. We should Mr Shin personally, and that the Government are taking apply any pressure we can on China and Russia to play seriously the views, opinions, testimony and witness of their part in ensuring that change is brought about in those who manage to escape from the regime. North Korea. The hon. Member for Congleton asked us to focus on I will continue, as will many other hon. Members, to humanitarian and human rights issues, and rightly drew pray daily for people in North Korea. I hope that attention to Baroness Amos’s report of her visit last something practical can be done, and it should be done year, which highlighted that, on the humanitarian front, if there is a possibility of success. I commend the hon. there is chronic poverty, underdevelopment, poor Lady on introducing the debate, and I look forward to infrastructure, and indicators of widespread malnutrition the support of the House for the issue. and stunted growth in the population. Daily diets are deficient even in basic protein and essential fats. Previous 10.10 am UN assessments of the food supply suggested that it Martin Horwood (Cheltenham) (LD): It is a pleasure was very poor, with poor management of land, and as to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Davies, in a the hon. Member for Congleton suggested, there is debate on a subject other than Europe. I pay tribute to poor access to basic mechanical farm equipment. That the hon. Member for Congleton (Fiona Bruce) for seems extraordinary in the 21st century. Add to that a securing the debate, and for the passionate and near total breakdown in the management of public compassionate way in which she introduced it. Her health, and vulnerability to human trafficking and perhaps speech was one of the most moving that I have heard even the exploitation of children, in which agents of the this Parliament, and some of the points were very well state may be complicit, and the picture is truly apocalyptic. made. The story she told of Shin Dong-hyuk was inspiring The picture is little better on the human rights front. and horrifying in almost equal measure. We have heard about the widespread use of torture and Many international comparisons have been made of possibly rape, and certainly about the regime’s use of the regime in North Korea. The hon. Member for extrajudicial beatings, imprisonment and execution in South Swindon (Mr Buckland) said that it stood the many prisons camps. There is persecution not just comparison with the Nazis, and the re-education and of what the regime deems to be criminal acts, but of prison camps do indeed bear comparison with those wrong thinking in a souped-up version of the Maoist under Hitler. In North Korea, there are disappearances, red guards’ worst excesses. There is absolutely no freedom torture and violent repression, carried out with as much of belief, of the press, of thought or of political expression. ruthless efficiency as there was under any of the old That poses the problem for democratic Governments Latin American military dictatorships. We see there the of how to deal with such regimes. How can influence be “duce” ideology, as totalitarian and intolerant as that of exercised over a regime that is so totally beyond the pale the Khmer Rouge. The cult of personality is as extreme that it is, as the hon. Member for South Swindon as that of Ceausescu or Bokassa. The reckless suggested, almost in a class of its own? There are some mismanagement of the food supply has caused a self- avenues. There is the traditional diplomatic pressure induced famine as devastating as that experienced by that the Government exercise through diplomatic contact 89WH North Korea11 JANUARY 2012 North Korea 90WH with the North Korean embassy here in this country, are to be players in international relations and participate our embassy in North Korea, and the embassies of our responsibly as part of the international community, European Union partners. Clearly, we should continue they cannot be seen to be complicit in the survival of to use those channels. We should also continue the such an appalling regime. pressure to encourage North Korea to allow access for The kind of instability that I am sure the Chinese fear the UN special rapporteur on human rights. We should more than anything is a possibility in North Korea. As certainly support a commission of inquiry, but there is we have seen in north Africa and all over the world, clearly a problem in the UN Security Council, and we repression leads in the end to a kind of instability. In an may not be able to obtain widespread support, which utterly dysfunctional society, a repressive regime will seems incredible. If China and Russia are not minded to fall in one way or another, and it is surely better for that support that, it is a damning indictment of their foreign to happen through a process of international action policy. I should be grateful to hear the Minister’s latest and intervention than in a chaotic way that may cause report of any discussions that he may have had on that instability on China’s doorstep. I would be interested to front with Chinese and Russian colleagues, or the UK’s hear what the Minister has to say about any discussions representation at the UN. he has had with China. As the hon. Member for Congleton There is also an issue with refugees. Some 300,000 has said, there is a moral case for not being tempted to refugees have allegedly made their way from North forget and dismiss the situation in North Korea. Inaction Korea to China. Apart from the logistical and social is simply unacceptable in the face of such an appalling problems that that might cause, if they are caught, they situation, and we should be grateful to the hon. Lady are apparently routinely repatriated to North Korea, for pointing that out. where they face almost certain torture and execution. A few refugees seem to reach countries such as Vietnam, Several hon. Members rose— Laos and Mongolia. What discussions has the Minister had with China and other regional Governments, and Philip Davies (in the Chair): Order. Two more speakers organisations such as the Association of Southeast are seeking to catch my eye, and I intend to call the Asian Nations, on the treatment of North Korean shadow Minister no later than 10.40 am. refugees and the protection of their human rights and their right to asylum, which are extraordinarily important in the current situation? 10.21 am Beyond that, there is the exercise of what is traditionally David Simpson (Upper Bann) (DUP): It is a pleasure called soft power. It is difficult to make humanitarian to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Davies, and I aid relationships conditional, and that seems a brutal assure you that I will be brief. and inhumane approach, but some conditionality or I congratulate the hon. Member for Congleton (Fiona attempt to ensure that food aid gets to the right people Bruce) on obtaining this timely debate, and on the time and is not being used as a political tool is important. I that she has spent in this House looking at human should be interested to hear the Minister’s thoughts rights issues. She has also looked, from a faith position, about his Department’s latest approach to that policy, at the persecution of Christians across the globe, and I and the approach taken by the Department for International pay tribute to the outstanding work that she has done Development. since becoming a Member of the House. The hon. Member for Congleton referred to the During my time in the House, many debates on British Council and the language-teaching programme, human rights have been held in this Chamber, including which is a positive step. I should be interested to hear on Somalia and on Burma, where some changes are whether the Minister has any news about penetration of taking place. North Korea probably has one of the the BBC World Service or other language services into worst regimes that the world has seen in recent years. North Korea. I know that it is standard practice in According to recent press releases and the Financial North Korea to solder the tuning dial of radios, so that Express of Bangladesh, North Korea has told the they can be tuned only to North Korean stations. The international community not to “expect any change”. It extraordinary levels to which the regime goes to try to would seem, therefore, that we are in for more of the repress its people are astonishing, although it does not same persecutions and human rights violations that we require a mechanical or electrical genius to undo solder, have seen from that bitter regime in the past. so perhaps messages are getting through. My hon. Friend the Member for Strangford (Jim There are limits to soft power when a regime is totally Shannon) mentioned the persecution of those who hold unresponsive to that approach. We must try to find a a particular faith. In this great United Kingdom, we means of exerting pressure. We could hope that a new claim the privilege of civil and religious liberty for all. regime and a new leader might lead to some change, but We may not practise that liberty too well, but we I think that may be as futile as the hope that Saif certainly claim it and state it as our position. Many al-Islam Gaddafi or Bashar al-Assad would be a new years ago, people in the United Kingdom were burned influence on their countries. The likelihood is that, in at the stake because of their faith and what they believed. reality, Kim Jong-un is much less influential in the Thank God that day has passed, and people have the exercise of power than even his father, and certainly his freedom to practise their faith in whatever way they grandfather. desire. That is not the case, however, under North The key relationship in the region, and the only one Korea’s brutal regime. As the hon. Member for Congleton that could make a material difference, is that between said, it has been estimated that up to 200,000 people North Korea and China. China’s tacit tolerance of the have been consigned to the prison camp system because appalling regime in North Korea is allowing it to survive, of their faith, and that of those people, between one and it is crucial to emphasise to the Chinese that if they quarter and one third have been sentenced for religious 91WH North Korea11 JANUARY 2012 North Korea 92WH
[David Simpson] One point that has perhaps not been touched on in the debate is the regimented nature of the North Korean reasons. The lower end of that estimation places the regime, which is extraordinary. One morning, we got up total number somewhere between 40,000 and 70,000 and walked along the pavement with other people. It people, the majority of whom profess Christianity. was eerie; thousands and thousands of people were Religious people who engage in evangelism, or who walking to work in complete silence. In North Korea, have been in contact with foreigners or missionaries, people tend to work from 6 o’clock in the morning until have been arrested and subjected to harsh penalties, 6 o’clock at night, and then go home and do two hours including imprisonment or execution. There are frequent of self-improvement. How about that as a policy for the reports of the execution of Christians in North Korea, United Kingdom? and the United States Commission on International We were in North Korea shortly after its latest famine, Religious Freedom has stated: and we saw extraordinary poverty. One day, we were “Severe religious freedom abuses occur regularly, including: taken out of Pyongyang, even though not many people discrimination and harassment of both authorized and unauthorized are allowed to leave the capital. We were taken to see religious activity; the arrest, torture, and possible execution of something that the North Koreans were quite proud of: those conducting clandestine religious activity.” a new latrine block—not a toilet block, but a latrine I urge the Minister to do whatever possible to help and block—in a hospital in a city about an hour and a half to alleviate the difficulties experienced by those who are north-west of Pyongyang. They showed us this persecuted because of their faith under that brutal extraordinary thing that we would have condemned in regime. the 1950s. That is just an example of how far behind There are also issues of malnutrition, and the they are. imprisonment of people who do not bow down and Sometimes people say to us that politics is not important. worship their leader. I believe, however, that there is a One of the abiding reflections that I have is that down in deep-rooted problem in that society, and we hope to see the South are people who are broadly free and broadly some changes in the not-too-distant future. I urge the prosperous, but in the North—it is not a small country; Government to do what they can, and to use their it has a population of 25 million people—the people are influence through international development or aid. very much not free and not prosperous. Many of them The hon. Member for Congleton mentioned that a are in poverty, and all of them are in oppression, apart request for aid had been made by North Korea, and from the ruling elite. The only difference between the that is perhaps an area in which pressure can be used to two—these are the same people—is the political system alleviate the difficulties experienced by people in that and structure, so we must never let anyone tell us that country. politics is not important. It is crucial in underpinning freedoms. 10.27 am My visit to North Korea was an extraordinary experience, Mr Gary Streeter (South West Devon) (Con): It is a and one that I thought hon. Members might like to hear pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Davies. about. I believe that it is right for the Government to I pay tribute to my hon. Friend the Member for Congleton engage with North Korea, despite all the problems that (Fiona Bruce) for securing this debate, and for the tone we have heard about today. We are all scratching our of her speech. She achieved the right balance between heads as to what we can do about that, and perhaps raising legitimate concerns about human rights, and there is a glimmer of hope with a new leader coming in. reflecting a positive way forward and underlining the As the hon. Member for Cheltenham (Martin Horwood) importance of engagement, and I warmly congratulate suggested, we do not know the extent to which people her. are secretly listening to certain radio stations or hearing I would like to share a few personal reflections. Seven news from the outside world. Of course, there is no or eight years ago, I visited North Korea with Michael internet access for the ordinary masses. However, we do Bates, who is now in the upper House—actually, he is not know the extent to which there is awareness of how not there, as he is walking from Mount Olympus to life is different outside North Korea, and how there London on a 3,500-mile journey to raise awareness of might well be an opportunity in the future. My instinct the Olympic truce, which again is about peace and is that if there is change in North Korea, it will come human rights. We went to North Korea of our own quickly and suddenly and from who knows where, so I volition, and it was an extraordinary experience. think that it is right for the British Government to engage positively with North Korea in the meantime. What hon. Members have said in this debate is correct: I have been to many countries in the world, but nowhere One thing that I did while in Pyongyang was vote in is quite like North Korea. One of my most striking the Conservative party leadership election taking place memories, which I will carry with me to my grave, is of at that time. My hon. Friend the Member for South being woken at 5 o’clock in the morning in the state-owned West Bedfordshire (Andrew Selous), who is sitting beside hotel in which we were staying. We were woken by me, had my proxy vote, which I exercised by telephone military music blaring not from a radio, but from from a hotel in Pyongyang. I am probably the only loudspeakers on street corners. It continued for about person ever to have voted in Pyongyang. Whether I 10 minutes, after which the odd light would turn on in made the right decision, history will decide. apartment blocks all over Pyongyang. The music started I just wanted to share those reflections. North Korea again at 6 o’clock, and as we looked out of the window, is an extraordinary country, and I believe that we are we saw people filing down in silence from their apartment right to engage with it positively. I pay tribute to Christian blocks, walking three abreast along wide pavements. Solidarity Worldwide, which has been mentioned several There was not a car to be seen and the roads were times, for the excellent work that it does in banging the empty; people were walking silently to work. drum and raising awareness of human rights abuses in 93WH North Korea11 JANUARY 2012 North Korea 94WH
North Korea, but also in other countries. Whatever in all their schools as the second language. They have attitude our Government take in terms of positive universities that are broadly staffed by English lecturers. engagement, it is very important that British non- They have an interest in English literature and in English governmental organisations are raising awareness, fighting culture. If I may say so to the Minister, he should work for the causes and championing human rights around with the British Council and with his own Department the world. They do a fantastic job, and long may that to continue to build links, bridges and relationships. continue. That is about looking forward. It may seem fruitless, As for the attitude of the North Koreans to outside but I believe that in the long term it will pay off, and I pressure, one thing that we have to realise is that they very much encourage him to continue down that road. have lived for 50 years with hostility from outside. All over Pyongyang are billboards, and almost all of them 10.35 am show North Korean soldiers squeezing the life out of an American soldier or bombing the Japanese. They hate Kerry McCarthy (Bristol East) (Lab): It is a pleasure the Japanese and they hate the Americans, for all sorts to speak under your chairmanship, Mr Davies; welcome of historical reasons, and there are billboards proclaiming to your position. I congratulate the hon. Member for their hatred of those countries, so in one sense external Congleton (Fiona Bruce) on securing the debate. As has pressure simply bolsters the regime. It is already saying been said—by the hon. Member for Cheltenham (Martin to its own people, “Look, it’s us against the world.” Horwood), I think—her concern about the plight of the As has been mentioned, China is the key relationship, people in North Korea shone through in everything in the way that I guess the relationship with the USA is that she said. It is important that we discuss this issue in key for Israel. I suspect that it suits China quite well to terms not just of criticising the regime in North Korea, have this slightly odd regime on its doorstep, almost like but of the compassion that I am sure we all feel for the a buffer zone. Is it not extraordinary that there is a people of North Korea. country on earth that can make the Chinese human I, too, had the pleasure of meeting Shin Dong-hyuk rights record look quite good? It happens to be right when he was in Parliament recently. The hon. Lady alongside it, in North Korea. spoke in detail about the account that he gave. No one who met him could fail to have been moved by his Andrew Selous: Does my hon. Friend agree that when personal story. The thing that stuck with me particularly our Government quite properly raise human rights was his account of the young girl who had been caught issues with the Chinese authorities in relation to what is with some grains of rice in her pocket and was eventually going on China, they should at the same time mention beaten to death—she died because of her injuries. What the situation in North Korea, given that it is a country struck me was the fact that he said, “Actually, we of 25 million people where there is such widespread regarded this as commonplace. We weren’t horrified by abuse of human rights? it, because it was so common for that sort of horrific scenario to be enacted in the prison camps.” He had no Mr Streeter: Yes, I do agree, and I am sure that the awareness of life outside his camp, or of the fact that Minister will touch on that in his response. there was an alternative, until he escaped. What he had to say made a very powerful impression on me. Christian As we are paying tribute to the Government’s position, Solidarity Worldwide is to be congratulated on its efforts which I think is absolutely right, and to non-governmental to ensure that we get to hear about such examples. organisations for raising awareness, I think that we ought not to let the opportunity pass to pay tribute to Obviously, the situation in North Korea at the moment, Lord Alton, who has been mentioned a couple of times. with the death of Kim Jong-il and Kim Jong-un’s He has done an extraordinary job as chairman of the succession, has created a great deal of uncertainty all-party group on North Korea. I am privileged to among the international community. Whether we can serve as one of the vice-chairs. He has done an extraordinary treat it as an opportunity to try to put the international job in getting the balance right between entertaining spotlight on North Korea and highlight some of the people from North Korea when they come over here opportunities for change is a moot point. Certainly, we and organising all kinds of meeting and so on, and would all be united in hoping that it does present an being robust and firm about human rights abuses. I opportunity, but, as has been said, there is not just one wish him every success in the future. issue to tackle in North Korea. The hon. Member for I have the privilege of chairing the Westminster Cheltenham talked about this. There are humanitarian Foundation for Democracy, and I have had a couple of concerns and concerns about the repression of free meetings with members of the Korean Workers’ party speech and lack of democracy. There are the kidnappings when they have come over here in recent delegations. It and the prison camps. There are so many issues to be is extraordinary to be talking about that kind of democracy tackled, but we need to do all that we can to try to keep with people from a one-party state, where people really the focus on North Korea and to keep diplomatic have no understanding of it at all. However, it is important efforts to engage with North Korea at the forefront of that those discussions continue, because all the time we what is being done. are sharing our values and our pitfalls and mistakes—we As the 2010 Foreign and Commonwealth Office report always talk about our own mistakes along this journey on human rights and democracy highlighted, towards democracy. Although that is a very long-term “Human rights, as understood by the rest of the world, do not venture, it is important. exist in the DPRK.” One way to get into the heart of the regime is to The former UN special rapporteur on human rights in support education initiatives in Pyongyang and elsewhere North Korea described the situation as “horrific and in North Korea. The English language is increasingly harrowing”. As has been said, the outside world lacks valued by the North Koreans. It is now taught, I think, reliable information about life in North Korea. The fact 95WH North Korea11 JANUARY 2012 North Korea 96WH
[Kerry McCarthy] I very much support the World Food Programme’s emergency operation, which was launched in April, but that we have to rely on the accounts of the few people there are concerns. The UN has reported that it has who have managed to defect—it can take them many received only 31% of the resources needed, and the years to reach a safe place where they feel able to talk assessment is that there is still a serious crisis. about their situation—shows how dire the situation is. Countries face a difficult dilemma when providing It is difficult to imagine the sheer scale of the restrictions humanitarian aid to North Korea, not least because of on freedom of speech, freedom of information, freedom the difficulty of ensuring that aid reaches the people of movement and freedom of association. The hon. who need it most. We also get into the whole debate Member for South West Devon (Mr Streeter) gave a about whether aid should be used as leverage on the fascinating account of his visit to North Korea and of human rights issue. However, the UN has warned that just how different it is. I have visited many countries aid to North Korea should not be politicised when the where there are real concerns about human rights, but humanitarian situation is so dire, and I subscribe to that the scale of what he was talking about was very different view. from that in any of the countries that the rest of us have Can the Minister tell us whether longer-term plans visited. will be in place once the World Food Programme operation As has been said, external media are prohibited, and ends in March? Do the Government agree with the there are indications that the restrictions are being UN’s statement that aid to North Korea should not be enforced even more stringently. There is no freedom of politicised? In that context, what can we do to support religion, and several Members have talked particularly the humanitarian programme in North Korea? about the persecution of Christians. The rights of women Will the Minister assure us that the Government are are enshrined in the constitution, but sexual harassment making every effort to work with the EU and the UN and violence are reportedly widespread, while victims to send a clear message to North Korea and to ensure of human trafficking are treated as criminals. There are that the transition to the new leadership presents an also reports of forced abortions and infanticide, and opportunity rather than a danger? What discussions child labour is not uncommon. have UK representatives had with international partners— The punishments associated with even minor particularly North Korea’s neighbours—and representatives transgressions against the restrictions are harsh and of the North Korean regime since Kim Jong-il’s death? arbitrary. Although the numbers are not known, for the Does the Minister share my concern that efforts to reasons that we have discussed, the death penalty, including cement the new leadership in place could lead to a public executions, and torture and other forms of inhumane deterioration in the human rights situation? If the new treatment are used routinely. leader is not secure in his position, that could trigger a Even more worryingly, Amnesty International reports greater crackdown on anyone seen as a potential opponent that, in preparation for Kim Jong-un’s succession, officials of the regime. deemed a threat to him were executed. Although it is Following Kim Jong-il’s death, the Foreign Secretary difficult to secure completely reliable figures, Christian indicated that the UK’s priority was the resumption of Solidarity Worldwide notes there was a 58% increase in the six-party talks. Any engagement between North reports of human rights violations between 2010 and Korea and the international community would be welcome, 2011. The populations of the prison and political labour but will the Foreign Office seek to broaden its efforts camps also seem to have increased, with estimates that beyond denuclearisation to include a human rights agenda? 200,000 people are now held in them. One significant obstacle to progress is North Korea’s The hon. Member for Congleton did not touch only refusal to admit external observers, so we support continuing on the human rights abuse, and it is important to note efforts to press for a visit by the UN special rapporteur. that the debate is also about the humanitarian situation, Can the Minister advise us on any recent diplomatic which the UN special rapporteur has described as absolutely discussions on the issue? dire. As we have heard, there are severe food shortages, Finally, last September, the International Coalition which, along with the lack of proper health care, are a to Stop Crimes against Humanity in North Korea, led serious danger for the people of North Korea. There is by Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch and minimal medical care outside Pyongyang, and any facilities the International Federation for Human Rights, was are of a poor standard. The food shortages are acute launched to campaign for the establishment of a UN and chronic, and inefficiencies in the public distribution commission—something that the European Parliament system are exacerbated by floods and harsh winters. It has called for previously. The Government have indicated is estimated that 1 million people have died since the that they are not against a commission, but there are mid-1990s because of the lack of food, and millions are doubts that it would be possible to secure UN Security suffering from malnutrition. Council support. Will the Minister advise us whether Of course, the situation is exacerbated by the fact there are any active negotiations on the issue and whether that the regime is not prepared to admit just how bad he takes a positive view of whether a commission can be things are or to engage with the international community achieved? to the extent that it needs to on the issue of aid. China and South Korea have provided the most humanitarian 10.46 am aid, but with the deterioration of the bilateral relationship with South Korea since 2008, its contribution has fallen The Minister of State, Foreign and Commonwealth drastically. I was in China just before Christmas and Office (Mr Jeremy Browne): Thank you, Mr Davies, for took the opportunity to talk to the Chinese authorities giving me the opportunity to conclude the debate. It is a about what more they could do to provide support for pleasure to serve under your chairmanship for the first the people of North Korea. time. 97WH North Korea11 JANUARY 2012 North Korea 98WH
Let me start—not just because it is the convention to freedom of assembly and freedom of movement within do so, but because I want to—by congratulating my a country, do not exist. Even freedom of religion, hon. Friend the Member for Congleton (Fiona Bruce) which is enshrined in the North Korean constitution, is on raising this subject and giving us an opportunity to restricted, with the state prosecuting all illegally held debate it at some length. As well as having responsibility religious services and missionary activities. The Government in the Foreign Office for Asia, I have a thematic also impose pervasive everyday restrictions on their responsibility for human rights policy, and, over my population, such as the ban on listening to or watching year and a half as a Minister, I have observed that many foreign radio and TV programmes and the requirement serious human rights causes around the world, which to display portraits of Kim Il-sung and Kim Jong-il in although they certainly deserve our attention, receive all homes. far more attention in the House and among campaigning organisations in Britain than North Korea does. In my The judiciary is not independent and the legal view, North Korea receives insufficient attention, considering system is not transparent, so citizens have no protection the gravity of the situation in that country. In a small from the state. Ordinary citizens are not able to get way, we have, I hope, started to address that deficit this advice from defence lawyers and many endure ad hoc, morning. I therefore pay tribute to my hon. Friend not onsite public trials. There are also continued reports only for raising this subject, but for doing so with such of public executions, with some indication that their evident decency, humanity and passion. frequency is increasing. Also deeply worrying is the current estimate that there are about 150,000 to 200,000 I also pay tribute to the hon. Member for Upper political prisoners serving terms in prison camps. Accounts Bann (David Simpson) and the hon. Member for Strangford continue to emerge from defectors of torture and beatings (Jim Shannon), to whom I should apologise, because I in correctional centres, labour training camps and called him the Member for Shannon in a previous detention centres across the country. Inmates are believed debate—I think that I got it right this time. My hon. to endure inadequate meals, hard labour and a lack of Friend the Member for Cheltenham (Martin Horwood) medical care. got to the nub of many of the political questions underlying the human rights problems in North Korea. As has been mentioned, like other hon. Members, I He was quite right to focus some attention on China’s also had the opportunity to meet Shin Dong-hyuk role, and I will seek to come to that. during his visit to the UK in October. I greatly appreciate We heard a fascinating speech from my hon. Friend the efforts of Mr Shin to raise awareness throughout the Member for South West Devon (Mr Streeter), who the world of the appalling conditions and the seemingly was quite right to draw a stark contrast between North inhumane treatment of people in North Korean prison Korea and South Korea to illustrate the importance of camps. His personal testimony brought home the human politics. An amazing transformation has taken place in suffering in a way that statistics could never manage, South Korea, which has, in my lifetime, been poorer but it is worth mentioning that I am afraid that a lack of than North Korea, but which now has the 12th largest transparency and independent verification means that economy in the world. It is a member of the G20; it has we are unable to get a full and accurate picture of the big companies such as Samsung, LG and Kia; it has the conditions in the camps. I am unable to inform hon. UN Secretary-General; and it will host the winter Olympics Members of how widespread the maltreatment that in a few years. You name it—South Korea has an Mr Shin experienced is, because we are unable to obtain amazing success story to tell, but it shares the peninsula information that it as clear as we would wish it to be, with people who, although ethnically and linguistically but the situation is obviously extremely serious indeed. the same, are in radically and shockingly different circumstances. As the hon. Member for Bristol East mentioned, the rights of women and children continue to be of I, of course, pay tribute to the hon. Member for concern. Although women’s rights are enshrined in the Bristol East (Kerry McCarthy). This certainly is a cross- North Korean constitution, sexual harassment and party issue, and I am sure that everyone wishes to treat violence—both domestic and in detention—is still it in that way. She was right to point to the most recent widespread. Human trafficking remains one of the Foreign and Commonwealth Office human rights and gravest crimes against North Korean women. Victims democracy report, which lists North Korea as a “country are often treated as criminals rather than helped by the of concern”. She gave the report’s crucial quote, which authorities. The welfare of children is of equal concern, is that with many having no access to education and children “human rights, as understood by the rest of the world, do not under 16 routinely used as cheap labour. exist in” North Korea. The Foreign Secretary has made it clear We also have serious concerns about North Korea’s that human rights failure to guarantee the right to eat and their management of the food sector. The North Korean Government’s “are part of our national DNA and will be woven into the prioritisation of the military budget and their 1 million- decision making processes of our foreign policy”. strong army means that the state does not spend nearly As such, we treat human rights and the humanitarian enough in support of food production and imports. In plight in North Korea with the utmost seriousness. recent decades, that has led to serious health issues North Korea is a secretive society with limited access among their population and humanitarian catastrophes, to outsiders. Verification of the real situation in the including the severe famine in the 1990s that caused up country is difficult, but, as my hon. Friend the Member to 2 million deaths. International food aid and development for Congleton and others rightly noted, civil liberties aid have reduced the number of famine deaths, but are severely curtailed there. Fundamental freedoms that North Korea still requires international assistance to we take for granted, such as freedom of expression, feed its population. 99WH North Korea11 JANUARY 2012 North Korea 100WH
[Mr Jeremy Browne] Andrew Selous: The UK Government recently tabled a resolution on Syria at the UN. It was unsuccessful, We work bilaterally and multilaterally, in partnership but they nevertheless tried. Why do the Government with the United Nations, European Union and non- not take the same approach to North Korea? governmental organisations, to improve the situation in North Korea. Bilaterally, we take every opportunity to raise concerns on North Korea’s human rights record Mr Browne: At the UN, one always has to assess how via its embassy in London and our embassy in Pyongyang. one can be most effective. There is a place in politics for Most recently, our ambassador in Pyongyang raised dramatic statements of intent and a place for trying to human rights as an area on which the UK and North achieve the objectives that we all share. Our approach Korea disagree, when she called on Kim Yong-nam, the has sought, as much as we are able, to bring about those President of the Presidium of the Supreme People’s objectives, but we keep an open mind about how we can Assembly—one of the most senior figures in the North best achieve them in future. Korean Government—in October 2011. Through our The succession of Kim Jong-un brings with it an embassy in Pyongyang, we also contribute to a series of opportunity for us to push the new leadership to small-scale humanitarian projects, but it is one of the acknowledge the need for greater respect of their citizen’s hardest countries in the world in which our diplomats human rights. However, that will be difficult in the next serve. few months, as it is likely that those who have recently On large bilateral funding, the UK does not give aid assumed power in Pyongyang will take some time to directly to North Korea, owing to the difficulty in establish policy priorities and a modus operandi for agreeing acceptable access and monitoring controls with dealing with foreign countries. On 5 January 2012, the the Government. We therefore believe that the Department Presidium of the Supreme People’s Assembly issued a for International Development’s contribution to various decree to implement an amnesty of prisoners to mark multilateral organisations in North Korea represents the 100th birthday of Kim Il-sung and the 70th birthday the best way to contribute financially. Such commitments of Kim Jong-il. We will push for further details and include subscriptions to various UN and Red Cross encourage transparency, but if it goes ahead, it will be a funds. Multilaterally, we continue to work through the welcome small step forward for human rights. UN and the EU to raise concerns about human rights abuses. We will need to be mindful of the increased risk to stability on the Korean peninsula, as the new leadership I assure my hon. Friend the Member for Cheltenham in Pyongyang establishes its security credentials. To that that I have personally raised the Government’s and my end, we continue to be in very close contact with key concerns about the Chinese Government’s role in North allies, including South Korea, the United States, Japan Korea directly with the Chinese Government. The point and our partners in the EU. Despite that important has been made in the debate that the current condition work, we will ensure that we and international partners of North Korea might suit China. That might or might continue to prioritise all the justifiable human rights not be the case, but for the reasons that he spelled out, I concerns that have been articulated in this debate. do not accept that analysis. Even if one believed that its condition was in China’s narrow political interest, the I again thank my hon. Friend the Member for Congleton Chinese need to take account of a moral dimension, for raising the topic this morning. I assure all Members which is that the most appalling degradation of human present that the situation in North Korea is as grave and life is taking place on their doorstep and any country as big an affront to our common humanity and decency that does not devote its energies to addressing such an as that in any country in the world. The British Government issue needs to reconsider its political priorities and and Parliament will continue to work to bring about responsibilities. radical change. 101WH 11 JANUARY 2012 Empty Property Rates (SMEs) 102WH
Empty Property Rates (SMEs) The previous Labour Government reformed the empty non-domestic property rate relief in 2007 in an alleged attempt to encourage more commercial properties to be 11 am brought back into use throughout the supposedly never- Julian Sturdy (York Outer) (Con): It is a privilege to ending boom years. The Rating (Empty Properties) be granted time to hold this debate here today and to Act 2007 increased rates on empty properties from 50% serve under your chairmanship, Mr Davies. As all Members to 100% of their occupied rate. It also removed the present know, the rating of empty properties is a contentious exemption for storage and industrial premises, which and sensitive issue. was recommended by Kate Barker and Sir Michael Lyons in their independent review ahead of the 2007 Budget. Let me start by outlining the situation of a couple of As one would expect, the plans were controversial at the farmers in my constituency who have lived and worked time. It was said that the 2007 Act would lead to on their land for decades. After the previous Government constructive vandalism. However, the vast majority of strongly encouraged them to diversify their land, they property owners would not deliberately hold back empty decided to develop a couple of small business premises properties from the marketplace. If I had been an MP at to rent out to local entrepreneurs and small and medium- the time, I would have said that such properties were sized enterprises. They undertook substantial developments most often empty as a result of the poor planning and put tenants in place. The future looked bright until system or a simple lack of demand for commercial the financial crisis broke and the recession hit. As a properties within specific locations. result of the subsequent turmoil in the financial market, Appreciating that the new policy introduced unnecessary many of my constituents’ tenants were forced to downsize burdens on businesses in recessionary times, the pre-Budget and move out. In some unfortunate cases, their tenants’ report of November 2008 outlined a temporary increase small businesses collapsed, as bank lending sadly dried to the threshold for exemption from such rates to £15,000 up. The limited three or six-month exemption from and then later to £18,000 for a two-year period. That empty property rates has now expired, with the threshold provided much-needed relief for many affected individuals returning to its original £2,600 level. As a result, my and was greatly appreciated. The Business Centre constituents now face bills totalling thousands of pounds. Association estimates that that measure saved its members Like all rational and sensible politicians, I have a about £10 million. However, the problem has returned. great deal of sympathy for my constituents. In a letter to On 1 April 2011, the empty property threshold returned me, they said: to £2,600, which is a remarkable and dramatic drop “We have worked hard all our lives to get what we have today... from the temporary £18,000 figure. the price we are paying now is the price of progress and it is like a As a loyal supporter of the coalition, I appreciate lump of concrete around our necks.” that the Government cannot afford to tackle every issue One of my core principles in life is that every person has and reduce the vast deficit simultaneously. Furthermore, the absolute right to aspire and achieve without unfair I understand that some issues must take priority over burdens being placed on their shoulders. others. I accept that the reckless economic legacy of the In the current economic climate, our inherited policy previous Government has largely tied our hands. Thankfully, of rating empty properties is unfair. We seriously run though, this Government are intent on spending only the risk of driving small business men and women into what they can afford, and long may that approach the ground, particularly in rural areas, where a number continue. of small retail and commercial properties have been The previous Government are responsible not only developed on diversified land. The owners are not wealthy for the creation of the empty property tax rates, which property tycoons and often possess only limited experience they designed and implemented, but for the inflexibility of property management. It is wrong to believe that of the coalition’s fiscal options. Having to spend £120 million every property owner can take the hit of tax on empty a day to pay off our country’s debt interest payments properties; many simply cannot. To lay the blame for hinders the present Government’s ability to reform as such a situation at the door of the coalition Government broadly as they might otherwise do. None the less, is entirely foolish and short-sighted. empty property rates should be higher on the Minister’s list of priorities. Gavin Williamson (South Staffordshire) (Con): I Property owners in rural villages across the country congratulate my hon. Friend on securing this debate. are beginning to be hurt by this policy. They now feel let I must declare an interest as outlined in the Register of down by successive Governments. Such sentiments have Members’ Financial Interests. Does my hon. Friend been summed up well by Liz Peace, chief executive of agree that the previous Government introduced this the British Property Federation, who said: scheme with the good intention of ensuring that all “If the Government is pinning its hopes on a private-sector led redundant properties were redeveloped? However, it has recovery, then this is a damaging and retrograde step. Empty rates been an incredibly blunt instrument, and with the economic are a tax on hardship at the worst possible time. The majority of downturn, it has effectively caused chaos for many the properties affected by this announcement will be in areas small investors. We need to consider a more subtle which are already economically disadvantaged, and so this will be a further blow.” approach to encourage the regeneration of areas. Jason McCartney (Colne Valley) (Con): I congratulate Julian Sturdy: As my hon. Friend has said, the scheme my hon. Friend on securing this important debate. On is a blunt instrument that has had unforeseen consequences. Friday, I visited a mill complex on the outskirts of It is also a barrier to investment and regeneration, Huddersfield that is home to many thriving and positive which particularly affects the north, but I will go on to businesses. I saw at first hand the disincentive for the that point later in my speech. owners of that complex to bring back some of the units 103WH Empty Property Rates (SMEs)11 JANUARY 2012 Empty Property Rates (SMEs) 104WH
[Jason McCartney] Sadly, nothing has happened and according to Government replies to my written questions on this into habitation and to make them ready to show off to matter, there are no plans in the short term to review the new businesses. He has talked about the Business Centre situation. Consequently, I want to focus the rest of my Association. Does he agree with its idea of allowing an speech on three main points. If they are taken further, I exemption period of three years for all new and refurbished firmly believe that the Minister will urge the Government units to try to get them back into use as an incentive to to review their position sooner rather than later. stimulate small businesses? First, I have already outlined my concerns about the impact of empty property rates on small businesses in Julian Sturdy: I appreciate those comments. The BCA rural areas. In addition, I briefly want to discuss my was also talking about returning to the threshold figure fears about the specific impact that this tax has across of the recessionary times of £18,000. Given the tough the whole of the north of England. As a Member of economic times that we face, those two policies would Parliament for the north, I have always been interested help the situation. in the economic north-south divide. My first question at Prime Minister’s questions was to ask the Prime Mark Pawsey (Rugby) (Con): On the exemption period, Minister specifically about that gap. After all, it is does my hon. Friend agree that six months is too short a statistically the case that the economic divide between period in which to find a new tenant? The commercial the north and south of England actually increased property market is difficult. Six months between one during Labour’s rule. tenant leaving and the finding of a new tenant is insufficient On many fronts, the coalition should be commended to do the necessary marketing, to show people round for its introduction of the regional growth fund and and to get people into the accommodation. At the very local enterprise partnerships, which are specifically aimed least, the exemption period needs to be increased. at addressing regional imbalances. However, such positive measures run the risk of being undermined if negative Julian Sturdy: I entirely agree with my hon. Friend. policies, such as empty property rates, are allowed to The six-month exemption period—indeed, it is only strangle many SMEs in the north. three months for retail premises, which is obviously Recently, Horncastle Group—a property developer even shorter—is incredibly burdensome for property based in Yorkshire—wrote to me about that issue. Its owners. He is right that the short exemption period is chairman, Mr Andrew Horncastle, has been lobbying difficult when marketing these properties and looking against this regressive taxation for years. Discussing the for new tenants. issue with me, Mr Horncastle said: We have to accept that there must be churn within the “This empty rates property tax is a tax on failure, and as such it market. No one will ever say that we will get 100% of discriminates between the prosperous south and hits weaker such properties filled up. Even in the best of times, we regions, particularly in the north. It is a short-sighted, ill-thought are perhaps talking about filling 80% to 85% of properties, through socialist-style tax grab, and it does not sit in any proper and there must be that effective churn within the market growth strategy.” to allow flexibility within businesses. Frankly, I could not agree more with those comments. Those areas that are directly outside new enterprise Guto Bebb (Aberconwy) (Con): I congratulate my zones will be hit further by this form of regressive hon. Friend on securing this debate. The specific point taxation. At a time when we are genuinely attempting to about churn is crucial. In my constituency, there is a rebuild and rebalance our northern economies, it seems very successful small business park in the town of somewhat foolish that we are continuing to operate Conwy and its proprietor feels that he is being penalised, such negative rates on empty properties. because he tried to develop an incubator unit-style Secondly, I fear that empty property rates carry with approach. In effect, he is now being penalised because them unintended consequences. A number of Members of the churn. He is providing a service to the local have already touched on this issue. In 2009, the Royal business community and allowing people to have easy Institution of Chartered Surveyors showed that empty options to come in and out of the business park, which property rates are the key driver behind decisions to is vital for new business development, but he is actually demolish empty properties and they act as a barrier to being penalised by the system. investment in new property. Likewise, with an increased work load—owing to the higher vacancy rates—the Julian Sturdy: I entirely agree with my hon. Friend. cost of administering this tax within local authorities He is absolutely right that we need the churn within the has already started to mount. Demolitions, higher market to allow new investment and new businesses to administrative costs, additional financial demands on start up. As I said in my initial remarks, there are small businesses and a stagnating commercial property unforeseen consequences to this measure and it seems and flexible space sector are the consequences of this to be a barrier to investment and regeneration within regressive policy. certain areas. My third point relates to the very simple principle of As I have already said, the British Property Federation fairness. My right hon. Friend, the Prime Minister, has has expressed such sentiments, and it is not alone in himself talked passionately and genuinely about “enemies doing so. Ahead of the Budget last year, the TaxPayers of enterprise” that act as unnecessary hurdles for Alliance urged the Chancellor to scrap this tax altogether. entrepreneurs and SMEs. The empty property tax is a In addition, ahead of the pre-Budget report last year, perfect example of an enemy of enterprise. For a country almost 50 regional chief executives of the British Chambers targeting a private sector-led recovery, it is not right that of Commerce signed a letter to the Chancellor that such rates are imposed upon the very small businesses highlighted the perverse consequences of the policy. whose success we are counting upon. Indeed, it is not 105WH Empty Property Rates (SMEs)11 JANUARY 2012 Empty Property Rates (SMEs) 106WH only not right; it is not fair. I believe passionately that Mark Pawsey: Mr Davies, I have spoken to my hon. no Conservative would view the policy as being desirable Friend who secured the debate, but not the Minister. or fair. Could I have two minutes to speak? Actions speak louder than words, and if we admit that something is wrong but fail to reform it, we are Philip Davies (in the Chair): You can speak very badly letting down all those who are affected by it. I briefly, because we want to hear the Minister’s response also firmly believe that any cost of tackling empty to the debate. property rates would be far outweighed by the investment in premises, jobs and training that would follow in a 11.19 am rejuvenated market. Mark Pawsey (Rugby) (Con): Thank you, Mr Davies, for calling me to speak. Paul Uppal (Wolverhampton South West) (Con): I congratulate my hon. Friend on securing this debate I declare my entry in the Register of Members’ Financial and I apologise—I would very much have liked to have Interests and I remind the Chamber that I raised this been here at the beginning of this debate. The point that issue in Westminster Hall in November 2010. Interestingly, he has just made is very important. Regarding regeneration, Mr Davies, you were in the Chair then too. Equally in my constituency, I have found that empty property interestingly, there was no attendance at that debate by rates often make individuals who own commercial or any Opposition spokesmen, which perhaps indicated industrial property view that property as a problem. the Opposition’s level of concern about matters affecting Consequently, they will sometimes consider measures business. to try to mitigate the empty property rate tax. So the tax At that time, I raised a constituency case, as my hon. actually changes the mindset of property owners; it Friend the Member for York Outer (Julian Sturdy) has changes how they view the property. They do not view it done today. My constituent had a commercial property as an opportunity but as a millstone around their necks. as an investment, which he had acquired after selling his business that had been located there. In recent months Julian Sturdy: I entirely agree with my hon. Friend. If I, too, have visited constituents who have been very he had been here for the beginning of my speech, he much affected by the changes including, most recently, would have heard me quote one of my constituents who an engineering company that has a vacant unit on its said almost exactly the same thing. site, is unable to find a tenant and is liable to pay the The coalition should be commended for pursuing a commercial rates. In his reply to me a year ago, the fairness agenda, but let us now extend the principle of Minister spoke of support to small business generally, fairness to the empty property rates tax, because there is but regretted the fact that the Government were unable nothing fair about increasing taxes on property owners to offer the concession that property owners would like. who are already suffering due to high vacancy levels. My hon. Friend the Member for York Outer drew attention to the fact that the situation has become Rebecca Harris (Castle Point) (Con): On fairness, one worse rather than better as a consequence of the fall in of the small business owners in Castle Point said that he the exemption limit from £18,000 to £2,600, which would be very happy to pay tax on income that he was means that the large majority of properties are now earning. He supports local businesses; he often has very included. My hon. Friend spoke about the need for a good deals to help local businesses to get going; and he private sector-led recovery from the recession we are contributes enormously to the local community and suffering. Critically, at a time when we are demolishing local economy. He says that he would be delighted to perfectly sound industrial premises to avoid paying the pay even more on income that he was genuinely receiving, vacant commercial rate, and developers are not developing but he feels that it is incredibly unfair to be penalised new industrial and commercial premises because if they when a property is empty. do so they might be left vacant, we are making it more difficult for small businesses to get started. There are Julian Sturdy: I entirely agree with my hon. Friend strong reasons why the Government need to address the and that point is very well made. In fact, the whole hub issue, and I very much look forward to the remarks that of the argument is about fairness. People are completely the Minister may make to be able to assuage the fears of prepared to pay tax on income earned, but this tax on businesses in this sector. empty properties could be seen as a tax on failure and it is just simply unfair. 11.21 am Similarly, there is nothing fair about forcing entrepreneurs The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for to consider selling, abandoning or even demolishing Communities and Local Government (Andrew Stunell): their premises because of the threat of excessive taxation. It is good to serve under you today, Mr Davies. I To penalise a property owner whose property falls commend the persistence of my hon. Friend the Member vacant in recessionary times is not a prescription for for York Outer (Julian Sturdy) in getting this matter economic recovery but a recipe for economic stagnation. before the House. It is interesting to see how many other Our stance on empty properties requires a fundamental colleagues share his concerns. review. I want to begin and, bearing in mind the time, it might be very nearly where I finish as well, by picking Mark Pawsey rose— up one of the points that my hon. Friend the Member for York Outer made about the financial situation facing Philip Davies (in the Chair): Does the hon. Gentleman the country. He drew attention to the fact that £120 million have permission from both the Member who secured a day is spent servicing the interest on the outstanding the debate and the Minister to speak? public sector debt; I wish that that was the whole story, 107WH Empty Property Rates (SMEs)11 JANUARY 2012 Empty Property Rates (SMEs) 108WH
[Andrew Stunell] We are, however, also providing targeted support on business rates, and there is an overriding need to reduce but unfortunately it is not even half of it—it is only a public expenditure and support the economy generally quarter. In the 2009-10 fiscal year, the signed-off accounts by reducing the deficit. Had any Labour Members been showed a deficit accumulation of £164 billion of extra here today, and that is perhaps something of a statement debt added to the national debt for that year. That in itself, I can imagine that they might have said, “Why sounds like a lot of money, but people find it very don’t you do it anyway, it’s only another day’s deficit difficult really to understand how much it is. Looked at borrowing?” Restoring the relief would cost somewhere on a daily basis, it is £450 million added to the national between £400 million and £500 million a year—just debt for every day of that financial year, and it was in another day’s borrowing. I believe that those of us that context that the right hon. Member for Birmingham, present are more mature and responsible than that, and Hodge Hill (Mr Byrne) left his famous note: the money would not simply say, “Oh yes, it’s just another day. has all gone. Let’s do it.” That is the challenge the Government face I want to make it very clear that the Government because, as my hon. Friend the Member for York Outer recognise the vital role that small businesses play in made clear, the Government have to balance getting the building a sustainable economy, but a sustainable economy economy straight financially and fiscally with providing depends on having a sustainable financial system and the springboard for business growth. sustainable public expenditure. I am sure that my hon. I have a long list of the very wide range of help we Friend the Member for York Outer, and our other hon. have provided to businesses, and had time permitted I Friends who have contributed to the debate, would be would have read it out, but I would be happy to pass it even more enthusiastic than I am, as a member of the on to Members who have contributed to the debate. The coalition Government, to see the fiscal and financial help focuses on getting new businesses started and on situation brought under control. We have a coalition getting existing businesses to expand. We have to set commitment to rebalance the economy and to support priorities. Although changes to the empty property rate businesses to provide the growth and jobs that the are currently unaffordable, we recognise that the problems country needs, and Members have eloquently pointed caused by the previous Government’s reforms are still out the particular role of small start-up companies in there, and we will certainly keep the matter under doing so. This Government have made an excellent start review. and are doing a great deal, but there is always a balance We have already taken some major actions, particularly between putting the finances right as a short-term necessary on business rates, to demonstrate our commitment to foundation and providing the right springboard for providing targeted support for the business community. growth. Yesterday, the Local Government Finance Bill, which This Government fully recognise the problems that reforms business rates, received its Second Reading. were caused by the outgoing Government’s so-called When the measure comes into force, it will give every reform of empty property rates. Members have spoken local authority the capacity to rebate business rates at eloquently today about the problem, and have allocated their discretion in their local area. I hope that Members the blame correctly to the outgoing Government. From here today will support that legislation with great 2008, the exemption period was restricted to three months enthusiasm, and that they look forward to the day, in for non-industrial property and six months for industrial April next year when the measure comes into force, property, with ratepayers being liable for full rates once when they can go to their local authorities and make as that period had lapsed. The previous Government claimed eloquently as they have today the case for empty property that the purpose of the reforms was to increase the cost business rate relief, which can then be targeted and of holding empty property and thus to encourage owners shaped to local circumstances. to relet or redevelop empty commercial properties, or to Although I would like to spend time on the long list sell them on to people who would do so. That argument of good things that the Government have done to was based on an economic theory that was, and still is, support business, I hope that in the limited time available not fully accepted by the business community; hon. I have been able to explain why the Government have Members have pointed out that even in good times it set rigorous priorities and feel obliged to stick to them would be unrealistic to think that every commercial through these 12 months. I hope that there is a glimmer property in the country would be full—there would of light at the end of the tunnel, when the Local always be churn and vacancies. Government Finance Bill becomes law, for my hon. The Government fully understand and appreciate Friends to approach their local authorities and put their that ratepayers would like us to undo the previous case strongly to them. Government’s so-called reforms, or to continue with the temporary measures, but our ability to take action 11.29 am needs to be balanced against the very high costs involved. Sitting suspended. 109WH 11 JANUARY 2012 Iran (Human Rights) 110WH
Iran (Human Rights) In May 2011, another series of raids was held on 39 Baha’i homes in Tehran, Karaj, Shiraz, Gohardasht, Sari and Zahedan. In the ensuing weeks, eight people [DR WILLIAM MCCREA in the Chair] were released, but 11 remain imprisoned. The charges were of conspiracy against national security and conspiracy 2.30 pm against the Islamic Republic of Iran by establishing the Dr William McCrea (in the Chair): Before I call the illegal Baha’i Institute for Higher Education, an online hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside (Mrs Ellman), programme to support Baha’i youth barred from may I wish right hon. and hon. Members a very happy universities. I have raised the persecution of the Baha’is new year? previously.
Mrs Louise Ellman (Liverpool, Riverside) (Lab/Co-op): Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab): I pay tribute to my I am pleased to be conducting this Adjournment debate hon. Friend for securing this afternoon’s debate. Canadian under your chairmanship, Dr McCrea. Senator Dallaire, a former commander of the UN mission in Rwanda, recently drew attention to the escalation This debate draws attention to Iran’s horrendous of attacks on Baha’is and others in Iran, which he human rights record. The abuses affect a wide range of described as people—women, gay people, dissidents and the human rights lawyers who try to defend those people, including “a slow-motion rehearsal for genocide”. the lawyer Abdolfatah Soltani, held since September Does my hon. Friend agree that such comments from 2001 for creating propaganda against the system. Last such a distinguished observer of human rights are a September, three Iranian men were executed after being great cause of concern, as are the issues that my hon. found guilty of charges relating to homosexuality. Last Friend outlines? week, the daughter of Akbar Hashemi Rafsanjani, the former President of Iran, received a six-month jail Mrs Ellman: I agree with my hon. Friend. Those sentence for allegedly spreading propaganda against the comments show how the situation is escalating. They regime. Sakineh Mohammadi Ashtiani, an Iranian woman should lead not only to increased concern but to increased who was due to be sentenced to death by stoning for action. I intend to refer to that comment later, and will alleged adultery, may now be hanged; we are told that say what I think should be done to address the situation. the change of punishment from stoning to hanging is some kind of progress. Mr Mark Williams (Ceredigion) (LD): I pay tribute However, I wish to focus on an area of persecution to the hon. Lady’s work on behalf of the Baha’i community. that has received too little public notice and attention: We are both members of the all-party friends of the the long-standing and ongoing persecution of the Baha’is, Baha’is group, which tries to advance the cause of the adherents of the Baha’i religion founded in Iran in the Baha’is. Does she agree that one of the big problems mid-19th century. The persecution is not widely with Iran is raising awareness of the human rights issue acknowledged, although it is pervasive and is escalating in Iran? I am thinking of the case of Madam Ashtiani, dangerously. There are thought to be more than 300,000 of the 600 people who have been executed over the past Baha’is in Iran and 188 Baha’i communities worldwide. year, and most definitely of the Baha’i community in Following the Iranian revolution in 1979, 200 Baha’is general. That is where contributions from Canadian were expelled and thousands were imprisoned. The senators and others are particularly important. There 1991 memorandum of the Supreme Council of the has been a huge awareness deficit across the world of Cultural Revolution set out what still remains official the extent of human rights violations in Iran. policy towards what is ominously called the Baha’i question. The memorandum makes it clear that official Mrs Ellman: I agree with the hon. Gentleman. It is policy is repression of the Baha’is in an effort to crush extremely important to raise awareness, knowledge and the religion and its adherents—in the words of the consciousness of these atrocities. It is important that Iranian Government’s official policy, to block their people take action to prevent or stop persecution, but progress and development. The repression takes a number unless they become aware of it, it is less likely that of forms in an ongoing and systematic persecution. It action will be taken. Contributions such as his are means arbitrary arrest and imprisonment and the denial important in increasing that awareness. of access to higher education and areas of employment. The homes and businesses of Baha’is have been subject Mike Gapes (Ilford South) (Lab/Co-op): Reference to arson attacks, cemeteries have been destroyed, and has been made to members of other faiths. Has my children have been harassed. hon. Friend read the report of the United Nations There are 102 Baha’is imprisoned in Iran. One current special rapporteur, which condemned the actions issue of major concern is the trial of the seven former taken against Arabs, Azeris, Baha’is, Balochs, leaders of the Baha’i community of Iran: Fariba Christians, Kurds, Sufis and Sunni Muslims? The report Kamalabadi, Jamaloddin Khanjani, Afif Naeimi, Saeid was published in September by the special rapporteur, Rezaie, Mahvash Sabet, Behrouz Tavakkoli and Vahid Ahmed Shaheed, who was appointed by Secretary-General Tizfahm. They were detained in 2008 without charge Ban Ki-moon. and were denied access to lawyers for a year. In January 2010, they appeared in court on charges that could have Mrs Ellman: That report is extremely important in led to their execution. In August, they received sentences documenting the wide range of persecution in Iran. It is of 20 years. Although the sentences had been reduced important that the report is made known more widely to 10 years following international condemnation, the and leads to action. I congratulate my hon. Friend on length has since been restored. his work during the previous Parliament as Chair of the 111WH Iran (Human Rights)11 JANUARY 2012 Iran (Human Rights) 112WH
[Mrs Ellman] Last July, the popular Iranian comedian, Omid Djalili, wrote in The Guardian about the plight of the Baha’is Select Committee on Foreign Affairs, which considered and, indeed, his own experience as a Baha’i. He wrote human rights in Iran and specifically referred to some about his experience as a member of an Iranian football of these issues, including the Baha’is and other groups team in Northern Ireland. He was a valued and successful to whom he referred. The Select Committee’s work in member of the team, but when his colleagues discovered drawing public attention to the situation is extremely that he was a Baha’i, he was cold-shouldered and important, but what also matters is that the information dropped from the team, which is an example of absolute is used and followed by action, in this country and prejudice against Baha’is. internationally. I note that both the present Government and the previous Government have taken the issue of Mr Robert Buckland (South Swindon) (Con): The general persecution against a range of people in Iran hon. Lady referred to the 1991 memorandum. Does this seriously and have raised it. Their work has been good, not go beyond a culture? It is an actual black-and-white but much more still needs to be done. policy, as laid out by the Supreme Council of the In March 2011, the United Nations Human Rights Cultural Revolution. The memorandum needs to be Council appointed a special rapporteur to monitor withdrawn so that there is not a policy in black and Iran’s compliance on human rights, and last December white, with expulsion from universities, exclusion from the General Assembly expressed deep concern about a employment, and general exclusion from life in Iran. wide range of abuse that is continuing and, in some cases, escalating. It stated that the abuse includes a Mrs Ellman: I agree with the tenor of the hon. “dramatic increase” in the use of torture, the systematic Gentleman’s remarks. In the context of the whole field targeting of human rights defenders, pervasive violence of human rights in Iran, we are talking not about against women, and continuing discrimination against persecution by individuals, and something that is minorities, including members of the Baha’i faith. inconsistent with the general tenor of the way in which the Government operate, but about state-sanctioned Regrettably, those representations, and the work done persecution, which is what makes it so ominous and by our Government and others in the United Nations—and, horrendous. That is why it so important that action is indeed, in Europe—have not had a great deal of effect. taken, not just nationally—we cannot achieve very much Persecution continues and concerns are escalating. My on our own—but internationally. It is extremely important hon. Friend the Member for Scunthorpe (Nic Dakin) that people understand what is happening—that this is referred to the concerns expressed by the Canadian part of the state apparatus, not an anomaly. Senator, Roméo Dallaire, who has drawn attention to Omid Djalili wrote a number of interesting things in the rise in atrocities in Iran, both generally and specifically his article. He wrote about his own experience. I was against the Baha’is. It is extremely important that the privileged to hear him speak about it directly at the world does not wait until there is a genocide. It should House of Commons only a few months ago when he heed warning and take further action to put pressure on addressed a meeting held by the all-party friends of the the Government of Iran to stop what they are doing. Baha’is group—of which I am the treasurer—about The Minister does good work in this area, but what human rights in general. In his Guardian article, he took further representations does he intend to make? Will he the issue further than his individual experiences. He make representations to those members of the UN wrote about the general situation in Iran in relation to Human Rights Council who did not feel able to join in Baha’is and how he felt that their plight had been the condemnation of the atrocities, in order to persuade ignored for far too long in Iran as well as outside it. He them to increase the pressure and join that widespread wrote: condemnation? “Nowadays, the climate feels different. In February 2009 a I have a specific request: will the Government call for group of Iranian intellectuals, writers, activists and artists signed Dr Bielefeldt, the UN special rapporteur on the freedom an open letter to the Bahá’ís stating their regret concerning the of religion or belief, to be granted a visa to visit Iran, so Iranian government’s treatment of its Bahá’í minority. They made an open apology for their silence during Iran’s long-running that he can compile a new report on freedom of religion persecutions: ‘a century and a half of oppression and silence is or belief there? Dr Bielefeldt’s comments in October enough’. This letter was welcomed by the Bahá’ís, who have 2011 on the extreme nature of the persecution of the always made it clear they are humanitarians, not political activists, Baha’is in Iran are extremely alarming. Will the Minister working towards social transformation for all at a grassroots do all that he can to support the issuing of a visa from level, not concerned with overthrowing governments.” Iran to allow Dr Bielefeldt to visit and conduct further It is important that people understand that the nature investigations? of the Baha’is is peace-loving. They want to unify Too little is known about the plight of the Baha’is. people and do not seek division and dissent. It is Some Members may be aware of it only from their important that that gentle approach is not misunderstood, constituency work and their work with refugees. Many that people understand what is happening to the Baha’is of us find that people in our constituencies are and, indeed, to other groups, and that they are willing seeking asylum on grounds of persecution following to take action about it. their experiences in Iran. I have met a number of such I hope that this debate will focus attention on Iran’s people. Indeed, I am in the process of making deplorable record on human rights across the board. representations on behalf of two Baha’is from Iran who The abuses affect far too many people. I hope that it will are seeking asylum following persecution in their homeland, shine some light on the position of the Baha’is, whose in this case for their work in the field of the arts. That plight is little known and little understood. What matters demonstrates the Iranian regime’s repression of its whole most, however, is that action is taken. I look forward to population. hearing the Minister’s response. 113WH Iran (Human Rights)11 JANUARY 2012 Iran (Human Rights) 114WH
2.47 pm Iran, Ayatollah Khamenei, for his opinion. However, the ayatollah has so far avoided commenting on the Mr Stewart Jackson (Peterborough) (Con): I am grateful issue and no official final decision has been reached. for the opportunity to contribute to this vital debate. It Pastor Nadarkhani remains in Lakan prison. is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship for the first time, Dr McCrea, and I warmly thank the hon. On 23 December, the sanctioned Assemblies of God Member for Liverpool, Riverside (Mrs Ellman) for church in the city of Ahvaz was raided during a Christmas bringing this issue to the Chamber. I am indebted to service. Everyone in the building, including children Christian Solidarity Worldwide for assisting my preparation attending the Sunday school, was detained, interrogated, for this debate. I could not speak in front of a more threatened and eventually released. However, the church’s apposite ministerial representative than the Under-Secretary, senior pastor, Pastor Farhad, remains in detention along who has taken a great interest in the issue throughout with some of the church leaders. Although direct attacks his years in the House. on sanctioned churches were rare in 2011, a large number This is a period of unprecedented tension between of unsanctioned or underground house churches were the west, broadly speaking, and Iran, but that should violently raided, items confiscated and members arrested not mean that we resile from confronting Iran with the and interrogated. More than 300 members of house reality of the human rights abuses and persecution that churches are known to have been arrested and interrogated it is inflicting on many of its citizens. In the context of in at least 48 cities throughout Iran in 2011. However, human rights, I would like to focus specifically not on the complete figure is almost certainly significantly the Baha’i faith, but on the wider Christian community higher. The majority of those arrested were released and the suffering that it endures at the hands of the following questioning and a short incarceration, but state. many have been recalled for further questioning, and at least 41 have spent a month to a year in prison. Some of Iran has witnessed a steep rise in the persecution of those arrested have not been formally charged and religious minorities during 2011, principally of Christians many of them face long periods of solitary confinement. belonging to both the sanctioned Churches and the unsanctioned house-church networks. The most worrying Farshid Fathi-Malayeri, who was arrested on forms of persecution include regular raids on gatherings; 26 December 2010 in Tehran, is still being held in Evin harsh interrogations and torture of Christians, including prison. He has not been formally charged and a court demands for the recantation of faith and for information date has not been set. That evangelical church leader on the identities of fellow Christians; detention for long and father of two young children has been kept in periods without charge and other violations of due solitary confinement for a large part of his incarceration. process; convictions for ill-defined crimes or on falsified The equivalent of £120,000 was demanded as bail for political charges; the economic targeting of the Christian his release, and his family eventually managed to raise community through the demand of exorbitant bail that, yet the authorities still refused to release him. On payments; and the threat of imminent execution of a one occasion, as a form of psychological torture, Farshid house-church pastor. was told to pack a bag and get ready to leave. The guards led him as far as the outer gate of the jail where Both evangelical Christians and Christians within the other prisoners were being released, but he was then traditional Armenian and Assyrian Churches who conduct suddenly ordered back to his cell. Noorollah Ghabitzadeh, services or church activities in Persian are deemed a a church leader arrested in Dezful on 24 December threat to the Islamic integrity of the nation and live 2010, is also believed to be still detained, although little increasingly in an atmosphere of instability. Targeted is known of his condition. persecution has been undergirded by a proliferation of anti-Christian rhetoric from senior figures in Iran and, Detainees regularly face solitary confinement, sleep as the hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside has said, deprivation, illness as a result of privations, denial of has been accompanied by the continuing repression of medical treatment, unsanitary conditions in prison and the unsanctioned Baha’i religious community. forms of psychological and physical torture during interrogation. Torture is used to pressure individuals to I particularly want to raise the very worrying case of make confessions and to provide information on others. Pastor Youcef Nadarkhani, which I have previously As I mentioned, exorbitant bail postings secure the brought to the Minister’s attention. Pastor Nadarkhani release of individuals, along with illegal documents that was sentenced to death for apostasy—abandoning religious detainees are forced to sign. Such documents Islam—in 2010 and was involved in two further court demand an end to participation in Christian activities, cases last year. The case went to appeal at the supreme the renunciation of faith, and compliance with further court in June 2011, and the verdict of the lower court questioning when summoned. Laptops and mobile phones was not overthrown. However, the supreme court requested are often confiscated during raids on private Christian a re-examination of whether Pastor Nadarkhani had homes and are used to obtain information on the activities practised Islam as an adult before his conversion to and identities of other Christians. Christianity. The re-examination took place in September last year, and it was ruled that although the pastor had Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP): I congratulate the never practised as an adult, he was nevertheless guilty hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside (Mrs Ellman) on of apostasy due to his Islamic heritage. bringing the matter to the House today. One of the In a series of hearings from 25 to 28 September, the repercussions of the issue being discussed relates to pastor was given three opportunities to recant his faith employment and the owning of property. It is not just to secure his acquittal and release. He refused very about being hit for worshipping God in church; there courageously each time and was returned to prison to are repercussions beyond that. Does the hon. Gentleman await a final written verdict from the court. A significant know whether the Government have made any international outcry raised the profile of the case and representations to the Iranian authorities to reduce and the courts have twice referred to the supreme leader of minimise the threats to Christian people? 115WH Iran (Human Rights)11 JANUARY 2012 Iran (Human Rights) 116WH
Mr Jackson: I pay tribute to the hon. Gentleman, the clause would be implemented in the case of Pastor who has taken a great interest in these issues. If he will Nadarkhani without warning at any time and would bear with me, I will make some key requests of the endanger other Christians. Minister when I conclude. I certainly agree with the The persecution of Christians has been accompanied tenor of his comments. by a proliferation of anti-Christian rhetoric from authority The majority of Christians arrested in the past year figures in Iran. In October 2010, Supreme Leader Ayatollah have been released and are either on bail awaiting trial Khamenei declared from Qom that Christianity was or have been issued with severe warnings and threats being deliberately spread by Iran’s enemies as a means against other Christian activity. The Church of Iran to weaken Islam within Iranian society. Likewise, on evangelical denomination has been particularly targeted 4 January last year, Mr Morteza Tamaddon, governor with legal action in the past year. Pastor Behnam Irani of Tehran, made a speech in which he openly threatened is a pastor from that network who has been imprisoned further arrests of Christians. He declared that evangelical since May 2011. He is currently serving a five-year Christians had inserted themselves into Islam “like a sentence in Ghezel Hesar prison in Karaj for action parasite” with the backing of the west. We must think against national security. The verdict against him includes back to the vile propaganda of the Nazis before the war text that describes Pastor Irani as an apostate and and the way in which Jews and others were characterised reiterates that apostates “can be killed”. when we consider the appalling comments that have According to Christian Solidarity Worldwide sources, been made by leading figures in the Government of Pastor Irani is sharing a cell with criminals who regularly Iran. beat him and, as a result of injuries sustained during In August 2011, Ayatollah Hadi Jahangosha echoed these assaults, he is now having difficulty walking. this sentiment in a presentation on Mahdivism—belief Christian Solidarity Worldwide was informed that, during in the twelfth Imam. He declared that the first few months of his imprisonment, he was held “the West is trying to devour our youth by publishing and incommunicado in a small cell, where guards would advertising false Gnostic books…our enemies have noticed that repeatedly wake him from sleep as a form of psychological Satanism and false Gnosticism are not popular in Iran and torture. He was moved into a cramped room where because of that they are taking a religious approach to expand inmates could not lie down to sleep, before being transferred Christianity.” to his current cell. He identified the house-church movement as a deviant sect by stating that Jo Swinson (East Dunbartonshire) (LD): The hon. “the ‘real Christians’ do not believe in this distorted Christianity- Gentleman is making a compelling contribution about Protestantism.” the distressing persecution of the Christian minority in Furthermore, following the seizure of a consignment of Iran, as the hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside 6,500 bibles in Zanjan province in mid-August, Dr Majid (Mrs Ellman) did about the Baha’i. Does he agree that Abhari, adviser to the Iranian Parliament’s social issues it is bizarre that the Iranian Government claimed to committee, declared that Christian missionaries were support the Arab spring, when people were demanding attempting to deceive people, especially the youth, with democracy, freedom and human rights, while they oppress an expensive western-backed propaganda campaign. In their citizens and abuse their human rights in the most seeking to portray evangelical Christians as part of a appalling way, whether on the basis of religion, sexuality foreign conspiracy against Iran, the regime seeks to or for daring to express a political viewpoint? justify its continuing crackdown on house churches and individual Christians. Mr Jackson: The hon. Lady is absolutely right. It is I had intended to speak on the Baha’i faith persecution, more than distressing; it is of extreme concern to anyone but it has been covered admirably by the hon. Member who values freedom, liberty and democracy. We are for Liverpool, Riverside. I will, however, conclude by seeing the beginnings of a systematic approach that way of putting questions to the Minister. Perhaps he sometimes prefaces genocide, and our Government—and will respond by saying what action is necessary by the other Governments—are starting to realise that. international community, and by the Foreign and I am mindful that other hon. Members want to Commonwealth Office and the Government. We should speak, so I will make some progress. The Islamic Penal urge the Iranian Government to uphold their obligations Bill, which would amend the Islamic penal code, is under their own constitution and penal code, which do expected to be passed into legislation by the Iranian not codify the death penalty for apostasy, and their Parliament this year. The Bill will almost certainly obligations under international law, including provisions increase the severity of human rights abuses in Iran. for freedom of religion or belief, contained within the The initial approval of the Bill by the Iranian Parliament international covenant on civil and political rights, to on 9 September 2008 was a worrying development, as which Iran is a state party. the original draft stipulated the death penalty for male We should urge the Iranian Government to ensure apostates and life-long hard labour or imprisonment the removal of the clause stipulating the death penalty for female apostates. In June 2009, Ali Shahrokhi of the for apostasy from the draft Bill for the amendment of Parliament’s legal and judicial committee reportedly Islamic penal code in light of Iran’s human rights told the Iranian state news agency—the Islamic Republic obligations, and to make the amended draft publicly News Agency—that the committee had decided to remove available. the reference to the death penalty from the Bill as it was not Mr Gregory Campbell (East Londonderry) (DUP): “in the interest of the regime”. On the point about the possible amendment within However, it is possible the death penalty clause may still Iran, I, like others, was lobbied regarding the pastor. be in the text. There were fears that, if that was the case, Thankfully, the death penalty was not used. Does the 117WH Iran (Human Rights)11 JANUARY 2012 Iran (Human Rights) 118WH hon. Gentleman agree that our Government should, at change within Iran is more likely come from internal every level possible in the immediate future, in the next opposition and internal organisation than from anything weeks and months, ensure, as far as we can, that pressure that is done from outside or any outside pressure. is applied to the Iranian Government, and that we To add to the list of people affected, I draw attention should not pre-emptively take any action that would to an early-day motion that I tabled early in December: endanger the life of the pastor about whom we are all “That this House is alarmed at the re-arrest of Ebrahim concerned, as well as the lives of other Christians and Madodi from the Vahed Trade Union Syndicate in Tehran; calls Baha’is in Iran who could suffer a fate similar to that for his release and that of fellow trade unionist, bus workers’ which has, unfortunately, been hanging over the pastor’s leader, Reza Shobabi immediately; and supports the rights of head? independent trade unionists in Iran to represent their members without the threat of imprisonment.” Mr Jackson: I thank the hon. Gentleman. It is important Ebrahim Madodi was released after an international to make the point to the Iranian Government and campaign mounted by the TUC in this country and Iranian parliamentarians that the world is watching and supported by many other unions. Indeed, campaigns that they cannot inflict their vile regime, systemic torture have been mounted on behalf of Christians who have and abuses of human rights without very serious been under threat in Iran. The regime responds when ramifications on the part of the international community. there is enough international pressure. They do not We should urge the Iranian Government immediately send an e-mail straight away saying, “Thanks for your to release all Baha’i detainees held on account of their representations; it has all changed.” What one notices is beliefs and to end official discrimination, monitoring that subtly, over a period of a few months, usually some intimidation and other hindrances to their freedom of kind of change happens. It is therefore well worth religion. raising these issues, and it is very important that we continue to do so. A comment was made earlier by the hon. Member for Ilford South (Mike Gapes) about Mr Ahmed Shaheed, I should like to draw attention to a couple of other who must to be able to continue and complete his work points, but I am mindful of what you said about time, unmolested. He is newly mandated as the UN special Dr McCrea. The UN special rapporteur on extradition rapporteur on the situation of human rights in Iran. He and summary executions in Iran, supported by Amnesty needs to continue to monitor the regime’s compliance, International and Human Rights Watch, drew attention specifically with respect to international human rights to the very large number of executions that have taken standards, including freedom of religion or belief. place in Iran, either for alleged drug dealing or alleged consumption of drugs. This country has a policy of Finally, the motto of Christian Solidarity Worldwide absolute opposition to the use of the death penalty. I is, “Be a voice for the voiceless”. This debate is vital. pay tribute to our representatives at the UN Human Again, I pay tribute to the hon. Member for Liverpool, Rights Council, who routinely and absolutely assiduously, Riverside, because at least in this Chamber in our whenever a peer group review comes up of the human Parliament, the voiceless do have a voice this afternoon. rights in any country, immediately raise the issue of the death penalty if it is applied in that country. When the Several hon. Members rose— Minister replies, I hope that he will be able to assure us that, when the next opportunity arises at the council, Dr William McCrea (in the Chair): Order. It is normal the death penalty in Iran will be mentioned again and to call the Opposition Front Bencher at 3.30 pm, followed complaints will be made about it. by the Minister. A number of hon. Members are seeking to catch my eye. I should like to allow as many of them In the context of what is happening in Iran, it is as possible to speak, so I ask colleagues to be mindful of worth referring to documents from the Iran Human that when they are making speeches. Rights Documentation Centre, as well as to its campaigns for media freedom, for film makers and for legal representation to be available to all those who have been 3.6 pm arrested or detained by the Iranian state. We recognise Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Lab): I welcome that work, and we want to put pressure on the Iranian the debate and the opportunity to raise the issue of Government to ensure that the centre can carry out its human rights in Iran and, from that, our relationship work without let or hindrance. with Iran. I deplore intolerance. I deplore the attacks on It is also worth recognising that there is a problem in the human rights of religious people and religious minorities, Iran beyond that which has been mentioned so far. A dissidents within Islam or, indeed, linguistic minorities number of bombings and assassinations of scientists— in Iran. Most countries in the world, including our own, nuclear scientists and others—employed by the Iranian have gone through periods of the most grievous intolerance Government are taking place in Iran, and mysterious towards minorities. One hopes that at some point Iran explosions are taking place at military bases. I do not will come through this. know, any more than anybody else in the Chamber The current intolerance towards many dissidents in knows, who is perpetrating those attacks, but there is Iran is not particularly new. Indeed, it has gone on since clearly a pattern. I do not believe that any country, the 1950s. The high point of freedom in Iran was the whether Iran or anywhere else, should have nuclear nationalist Government of the early 1950s. The coup of weapons. Iran is still a signatory to the nuclear non- 1952 brought in the Shah’s regime and his secret police. proliferation treaty, and I hope that it remains one. I The revolution of 1979 brought in the Islamic Republic also hope that we take steps to achieve a nuclear-free and a great deal of repression of its opponents, particularly middle east. in its early days and more latterly. We should recognise The British Government were obviously concerned that large numbers of people in Iran stand up for when the attack on the British embassy took place, and human rights, democracy and their own rights. Any all diplomatic representation has now been withdrawn 119WH Iran (Human Rights)11 JANUARY 2012 Iran (Human Rights) 120WH
[Jeremy Corbyn] there is a lot of evidence that the early Church in Iran went back to the early centuries after the birth of from Iran. I should be grateful to the Minister if he Christ, and to people such as Tatian the Assyrian. explained what options are now available to people in Any idea that the regime in Iran tries to put out that Iran who want to contact British representatives, because Christians are somehow not intrinsically Iranian, not I have constituents of Iranian origin with family members patriotic or not part of the country is therefore historically in Iran who want, quite legitimately, to visit family in wholly untrue and is not borne out by the facts, even this country. Under normal circumstances, they would though Christians are few in number in Iran. Their be perfectly able to do so, but they now find it extremely numbers are growing, however, and there is considerable difficult to know how to apply for the appropriate visa. growth in the Church. That is despite the fact that eight I should be grateful to him if he explained how they Christian leaders have been murdered for their faith could do that. since 1979. Open Doors, another excellent charity, which In this country, we have considerable freedoms to looks at religious freedom around the world, says Iran speak, as well as protection for minorities and tough is the second-worst country in the world in which to be anti-discrimination and anti-racist legislation. All that a Christian, after North Korea. Some colleagues in the is absolutely right and proper, and I would want the Chamber were at this morning’s debate on North Korea, same for everyone in every country in the world. I in which we looked at the position of minorities—Christians therefore support those in Iran who are doing their best and others—in that country. to stand up for rights, democracy and accountability in I was delighted by the Foreign Secretary’s intervention their society. However, I am not convinced that such in the case of Pastor Nadarkhani, which was bold and rights will be won for Iranian people by imposing clear, and it was heard in this country and around the isolation and sanctions on Iran’s Government, threatening world. I agree with the hon. Member for Islington military action or, indeed, attacking Iran. That will not North (Jeremy Corbyn), who said that our interventions bring about change but make the situation considerably do have an effect. Things may not change immediately, worse for people in Iran. but countries do not like justified, evidence-based Will the Minister therefore explain exactly dialogue is international criticism. Such debates are worth while in taking place with the Iranian Government and what a small way, because when we mention the names of dialogue took place with civil society before the withdrawal people who have been wrongly treated for whatever of British diplomatic staff? Dialogue with civil society reason, we show our concern for them, and that has an can be helpful in protecting people, but it can also be effect. Those of us who are privileged to have a platform helpful in promoting changes in society. I want to see from which to speak in this place are called to be a voice changes, but I also want to see peace. The presence of for the voiceless, as my hon. Friend the Member for US warships in the region and sanctions against Iran Peterborough rightly said. will not necessarily bring about those changes; in many ways, such things are probably strengthening the regime It is right that we go on raising the case of Pastor and its intolerant side, rather than its more tolerant Nadarkhani, and that of Pastor Fahad, who is in side. detention. Pastor Fahad’s Christmas service was raided on 23 December, when many of us were enjoying the We should pay tribute to those who demonstrated freedom to go to carol services and so on in our during the election process to call for free and fair communities. Children in the Sunday school were arrested elections, those who stand up in universities demanding and taken into detention—what an appalling thing to intellectual freedom and those who stand up for plurality do to children. in society. Surely, that is really what the Persian tradition is about—not the intolerance and oppression that all Members in the Chamber have rightly drawn Jeremy Corbyn: Will the hon. Gentleman confirm attention to. that intolerance in Iran towards Christians and, indeed, other religious minorities, including Jewish people, is outwith the traditions of Persia before the Shah’s time, 3.14 pm when there was considerable religious tolerance of a wide variety of faiths? Andrew Selous (South West Bedfordshire) (Con): It is a pleasure to serve under you, Dr McCrea. I congratulate the hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside (Mrs Ellman) Andrew Selous: That is a good point, and it adds to on securing this important debate. She may be interested some of the historical context that I was trying to give to know that Michael Nazir-Ali, a Member of the earlier. I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for quite House of Lords and formerly Bishop of Rochester, was properly putting that on the record. very active on behalf of the Baha’i community in Iran Like my hon. Friend the Member for Peterborough, I in his recent travels to that country. want to mention the case of Farshid Fathi, who was I want to echo some of the remarks made by my hon. imprisoned just over a year ago, on 26 December 2010. Friend the Member for Peterborough (Mr Jackson), He is still in Evin prison, and I have not met him, but I who talked about the persecution of Christians in Iran, have met Dr Tony Sargent from the International a subject I have raised on the Floor of the House with Christian College in Glasgow, who knows him well. the Minister. It is important to say at the start that Farshid Fathi is a very bright and dynamic young man Christianity in Iran is as old as Iran itself. We know who is the life and soul of the party, but he is languishing from the New Testament that Parthians, Medes and in prison when he should be free to nurture a Church, as Elamites—all tribes from Iran—were present on the he feels called to. Similarly, Pastor Behnam Irani was day of Pentecost. Furthermore, some of the earliest imprisoned in May 2011, and he, too, is someone we Christian missionaries to China were Iranians, and should not forget. I agree with the concerns my hon. 121WH Iran (Human Rights)11 JANUARY 2012 Iran (Human Rights) 122WH
Friend raised about the Islamic Penal Bill. There is still his hand to the Iranians when he came to office in early the possibility that the death sentence could appear in it 2009 and being snubbed. How do we deal with a country for apostates. of that kind? In mid-August last year, 6,500 Bibles were seized in Zanjan province. It is illegal for Christians in Iran to Fabian Hamilton (Leeds North East) (Lab): I, too, print or sell Persian Bibles, such as the one that I am was in the delegation to Iran in November 2007. Would holding. Bibles have been seized, and there have been my hon. Friend agree that we were given privileged reports of some having been burned. Christians around access to, among other things, some of the dissenters? the world rightly condemned the threatened burning of Following on from the point made by my hon. Friend a Koran by a rather fringe and slightly lunatic pastor in the Member for Islington North (Jeremy Corbyn), there Florida some years ago, so some condemnation by are quite a number of dissidents who stand up for the Muslims of what we have heard from Iran on the things that they believe in—a free, open, democratic burning of Bibles would be welcome and would give us and pluralist Iran—despite being oppressed day in, day a bit of reciprocity. out. I have had meetings with diplomats from the Iranian Mike Gapes: I accept my hon. Friend’s point, but I embassy, but I do not think that there will be many think that we were not “given privileged access”; rather, more, because they are back in Tehran at the moment. I our diplomats made it possible for us to engage with met Mr Mousavi and Mr Sahabi, and got the impression some people. It was a privilege for us, but those people that they were personally slightly uncomfortable with were taking great risks in contacting us, and some of what is going on in Iran, which is perhaps a glimmer of them are no longer in Iran and are not allowed to hope for the future. When I met them in the Pugin return, due to their activities at that time and because Room, they gave me a document, which I have with me they would not be secure and safe. today, called “Minorities in the Islamic Republic of I want to conclude be making a contrast. BBC journalists Iran”. It reads very well, as documents from Governments are not allowed to report in Iran, and the Iranian with poor human rights records tend to, and it says that authorities make systematic efforts to jam international Christians in Iran should broadcasts and satellites, including the BBC World “Enjoy freedom in holding religious ceremonies and rites.” Service Persian television service, which has been very We know from what my hon. Friend the Member for popular with the Iranian people. The regime tries very Peterborough eloquently said that that is not the case hard to keep from the people the truth about the at all. atrocities in June 2009, when protestors against the It is right that we keep raising such matters and do rigged election were on the streets in huge numbers, and not give up. History tells us that the cause of freedom about what subsequently happened to protestors’ families. shines through in the end. Whether one is in Islington, Propaganda is broadcast to Iranian homes by state- Bedfordshire or any other part of the world, such controlled Press TV, including broadcasts from London rights, as the hon. Member for Islington North said, are of people who claim that the demonstration against universal. We will continue to raise these cases for as tuition fees was parallel to the protests of June 2009. long as it takes. Will the Minister say something about the anomaly of the BBC not being allowed in Iran and foreign broadcasts systematically being prevented from getting 3.21 pm through to Iran—so far as the regime is able to prevent Mike Gapes (Ilford South) (Lab/Co-op): During the that—when we allow representatives of the Iranian previous Parliament, the Select Committee on Foreign Government, through their mouthpiece, Press TV, to Affairs went to Iran in autumn 2007, and in February broadcast propaganda about this country that completely 2008 it published a report that went into considerable distorts what is happening in the world? Given the detail on many issues, including the human rights situation. current crisis, and the fact that diplomatic relations are The Select Committee concluded that Iran is a complex broken, I find it difficult to see why we do not take steps and diverse society ruled by a theocratic regime. My to prevent Press TV from behaving in such a way. impressions are of a young country that wants to Would we have allowed Nazi media to broadcast from engage with the rest of the world, but is prevented from London in 1939? I ask that question as a serious point doing so by the policies of the ruling clique. However, for us to think about for the future. another problem is that there is not one ruling group; that touches on the point about how the authorities 3.26 pm sometimes move in unexpected ways, because decisions Martin Horwood (Cheltenham) (LD): It is a pleasure are not taken in a way that is transparent from our to serve under your chairmanship, Dr McCrea. point of view. How we deal with a country such as Iran is a dilemma. Dr William McCrea (in the Chair): Order. Perhaps I On the one hand, we try to encourage a process of might be helpful: the Front-Bench spokespeople have openness and reform, but on the other, we recognise been flexible about time, so I will not cut off Back-Bench its appalling behaviour, whether in systematically speakers at half-past 3, as I originally said I would. breaching obligations under the non-proliferation treaty; sponsoring terrorist actions in other countries; Martin Horwood: I am now even more grateful to or defending the autocratic, repressive Syrian regime, serve under your extremely lenient and enlightened as it is doing at the moment. We and the European chairmanship, Dr McCrea. Union had problems with the policy of so-called I congratulate the hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside “constructive engagement”, which has run into the (Mrs Ellman) on choosing a subject that is even more sand. We saw the newly elected President Obama extending topical today than she probably realised it would be 123WH Iran (Human Rights)11 JANUARY 2012 Iran (Human Rights) 124WH
[Martin Horwood] sanctions on officials—those identified as responsible for particularly grave human rights abuses—was exactly when she secured the debate. It is clear that the human right. The sanctions regime is interconnected with the rights situation has worsened since the contested elections nuclear programme in Iran, but targeted sanctions relating in Iran in 2009. Amnesty International’s recent report to human rights are every bit as justified, in my view, as states: those relating to the nuclear programme. “The authorities maintained severe restrictions on freedom of It is important, as the hon. Member for Islington expression, association and assembly. Sweeping controls on domestic North (Jeremy Corbyn) mentioned, that we do not and international media aimed at reducing Iranians’ contact with pursue a path that leaves the regime no escape route and the outside world were imposed. Individuals and groups risked arrest, torture and imprisonment if perceived as co-operating inadvertently strengthens the hands of the hard-liners with human rights and foreign-based Persian-language media in the regime. Iran is not North Korea. Iran is not a organizations. Political dissidents, women’s and minority rights monolithic society; it has human rights defenders, activists and other human rights defenders, lawyers, journalists courageous and independent-minded writers, filmmakers, and students were rounded up in mass and other arrests and journalists, bloggers, lawyers and young campaigners; it hundreds were imprisoned. Torture and other ill-treatment of does, in effect, have opposition; and, above all, it has a detainees were routine and committed with impunity. Women young population that is quite aware of what has happened continued to face discrimination under the law and in practice. in the neighbouring Arab countries in the Arab spring, The authorities acknowledged 252 executions, but there were credible reports of more than 300 other executions.” and is aware of what democracy really looks like—and what oppression looks like. It is almost inevitable that the true total is higher. Of course, Iran has a tradition of vigorously contested The situation for human rights defenders, lawyers, elections, even though they are not democratic in the protestors, trade unionists and ethnic minorities seems sense that we would recognise. That tradition of independent to be getting worse. The regime’s intolerance of not thought and resistance should be reinforced and supported only dissenting political beliefs, but, as many hon. Members wherever possible. That means that the exercise of soft have pointed out, dissenting personal beliefs is increasingly power can have some effect, can still be deployed and is clear: secular teachers at universities have been purged; likely to have positive effects. Ahwazi Arabs have been sentenced to death for enmity to God; and Amnesty has drawn attention to the plight The jamming of international radio and TV of Sunnis, dissident Shi’as, Christian converts and broadcasts—I cannot remember which hon. Member evangelists, and the Dervish and Sufi communities, who mentioned that—is an important issue. I draw attention all suffer discrimination, arbitrary detention and attacks to it again and ask for ministerial support to raise it at on community property. the International Telecommunication Union world radio conference in Geneva, which begins on 23 January. The By drawing attention to the plight of those of the jamming of the BBC Persian TV service has resulted in Baha’i faith, the hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside that service being taken off the Hot Bird satellite, which has shown that she is particularly well informed. The is the main satellite for the region. That illegal censorship faith is not even recognised as a legitimate religion in is, in effect, denying freedom of information and human Iran, so the hon. Member for Peterborough (Mr Jackson) rights to the Persian-speaking population. I welcome was right to say that discrimination against the Baha’i is Ministers raising the profile of that issue in advance of systematic and institutionalised. My small group of the conference. Baha’i constituents have shown me great hospitality in my constituency, and I promised them that I would take The Persian people, like their Arab neighbours, have every opportunity to support the rights of the Baha’i in the potential to tackle the human rights issue once and Iran. I am happy to fulfil that pledge today. for all themselves, through their own resistance and traditions of championing freedom. We should do everything we can to support them. Jo Swinson (East Dunbartonshire) (LD): My hon. Friend reads out a devastating roll-call of abuses. However, the situation is even worse than he outlined. He mentioned 252 executions, but in 2011 that number included the 3.33 pm execution of a juvenile. There are currently 143 juvenile Kerry McCarthy (Bristol East) (Lab): It is a pleasure offenders on death row in Iran, in complete defiance of to serve under your chairmanship, Dr McCrea. international law. I, too, thank the hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside (Mrs Ellman) on securing this debate. I do not intend to Martin Horwood: My hon. Friend makes a devastating touch on the issues that she raised with regard to the point in support of her argument. Baha’i faith, because she did comprehensive justice to The last faith group in Iran that I shall mention is the those and we will hear the Minister’s response. We also Jewish community, which is extremely long-established. heard from the hon. Members for Peterborough There is a history of tolerance of the Jewish community (Mr Jackson) and for South West Bedfordshire (Andrew in Iran, but there is increasing evidence that anti-Semitism Selous) about the plight of Christians. Both issues have is growing there, and that the small Jewish community been raised with me on a number of occasions by local there is being blamed for the actions of the Israeli campaigners, including members of the Baha’i faith Government. Those actions are beside the point; an and the Christian community in Bristol on a wider unfair collective punishment is, in effect, being imposed. scale. I support the consistent calls from the United Kingdom I join hon. Members in paying tribute to the work of Government and the European Union for an improvement Christian Solidarity Worldwide, which was also mentioned in the human rights situation in Iran. Certainly, the earlier today during a debate on human rights in North decision by the EU in October to increase targeted Korea. CSW does sterling work campaigning there, as 125WH Iran (Human Rights)11 JANUARY 2012 Iran (Human Rights) 126WH well. It is testament to that organisation’s powerful The UN special rapporteurs have difficulty coming campaigning on this issue that so many hon. Members up with authoritative statistics. Figures show that 252 have mentioned it. officially announced executions were carried out in I was going to mention the BBC World Service 2011. However, Amnesty International, the International Persian TV service being jammed, but that has already Campaign for Human Rights in Iran, and the UN have been mentioned by hon. Members. Will the Minister reported that more than 300 people were secretly executed comment on what representations have been made? in Iranian prisons in 2011. There is a strong suspicion That has been going on for a couple of years, and since that the real figure is probably far higher. 2009 there has been almost consistent jamming of the Among those secretly executed were women and a service and only intermittent ability to broadcast. I great number of foreign nationals, particularly from should be grateful if the Minister said a few words Afghanistan, the majority of whom were accused of about that. drug trafficking offences. Testimony from relatives and other inmates reveals that the majority of the victims It is 17 years since Iran last submitted a report to the were not informed of their sentence until a few hours UN human rights committee. As we have heard, the before the execution was carried out and that most scale of human rights abuses in the country is vast. It is executions occurred without families being given prior not just people of religious faith who have come under notice. Most deplorably, as has already been mentioned, threat: political activists, women and ethnic and sexual Iran continues to execute children, who are widely minorities live under the real and ever-increasing threat reported to have been tortured into making confessions. of arbitrary arrest, torture and even death. The UN has It is suggested that 143 children remain on death row. called on the Iranian Government to engage with the international community in strengthening human rights safeguards and we fully support this approach. Jim Shannon: In respect of the figures that the hon. Lady mentioned, approximately 550 and 600 people A key area of concern is the deplorable attack on the were executed in Iran last year—and probably every British embassy in Tehran last November. The Iranian year for a period of time. Iran is second only to China in Government have blocked access to the embassy’s website, that regard. Does its being number two in the world which detailed Iran’s human rights obligations and league of executions lead to concern? important information about how Iranians could travel to the UK. Given that the Government have now closed Kerry McCarthy: We oppose the use of the death our embassy in Iran—a measure that Labour spokespeople penalty in any circumstances, but the crucial starting supported—will the Minister say how they intend to point is that information on executions that are carried continue to monitor human rights violations in the out should be transparent. We should know the figures country? Does the Minister accept the concerns of for what people have been convicted of and how many some human rights campaigners that the embassy’s executions have been carried out—half the executions I closure will inevitably have an impact on the UK’s mentioned were carried out secretly, and most people ability to appeal to the Iranian Government regarding would regard it as inappropriate that offences such as ongoing and future human rights abuses? Will he also drugs trafficking should carry the death penalty. The say what impact the closure of the embassy will have on issue is significant, and one on which we should continue our work with civil society groups within Iran? to put pressure on the Iranian Government. Although the attack on the embassy was utterly deplorable, we should not allow that to deter us from Mr Stewart Jackson: The hon. Lady is giving a good trying to find ways to continue to promote human overview of the difficulties. Does she concede that, rights and hold the Iranian Government to account for because of its role as a state sponsor of terrorism and their abuse of those rights. The campaign to save Sakineh other activity in the middle east, in particular in support Mohammadi Ashtiani from being stoned to death has of despotic regimes, Iran is in many ways exporting already been mentioned; that is a compelling example human rights abuses throughout the region? of how international pressure can have an effect on the regime. Asmy hon. Friend the Member for Islington Kerry McCarthy: There is certainly concern about North (Jeremy Corbyn) said, there are small signs that the international role played by Iran. I do not want to such things have an impact, even though they may not stray into the territory of its foreign policy, particularly deliver overnight the ideal situation that we would like. because Iran does not fall under my brief in the shadow The campaign to save her life continues. There is still a foreign affairs team, but I share the hon. Gentleman’s threat of death by hanging. It is important to try to concern about the influence of the Iranian regime, in mobilise international opinion on such issues. particular in the region, and the wrong message being sent to other regimes. Jeremy Corbyn: At some point, Iran will have to We have not debated in much detail today the impact submit itself for an in-country review of human rights of human rights abuses on women in the country. at the UN human rights council. I do not know when Officially, under article 20 of the Iranian constitution, that will be, but it cannot be that far away, because it is there is equality between men and women. It states: near the end of the first tranche of in-country reviews. “All citizens of the country, both men and women, equally That would be an ideal time for the concerns that hon. enjoy the protection of law and enjoy all human, political, economic, Members have raised here to be rearticulated by the social, and cultural rights, in conformity with Islamic criteria.” British representative in Geneva. As a recent report by the UN confirms, however, Iranian law provides an insurmountable barrier to gender equality. Kerry McCarthy: It is important that Iran is subject To give a few examples, under Iranian law, a woman’s to such intense international scrutiny. testimony is worth only half a man’s testimony; the age 127WH Iran (Human Rights)11 JANUARY 2012 Iran (Human Rights) 128WH
[Kerry McCarthy] expression is an important human right, and that access to the internet and to social media is now a fundamental of criminality starts at the age of nine for girls, whereas freedom that should be protected. it is 15 for boys; mothers may never have guardianship of their children, even if they are widowed; and women do not have equal inheritance rights. For some time 3.46 pm there has been growing concern about the crackdown The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Foreign on women who fail to adhere to the traditional dress and Commonwealth Affairs (Alistair Burt): I echo the code in public. For example, the number of women sentiments of others, Dr McCrea, that it is a great applying to university has declined since measures taken pleasure to serve under your chairmanship. I thank all by the regime to enforce the dress code there. colleagues who have spoken, in the spirit of a collective Parliament speaking across party lines on matters about Disturbingly, Iranian authorities blame women who which we think similarly. I appreciate the challenge have been raped for inducing their attackers to sexually offered by one or two colleagues and will do my best to assault them. In June 2011, 14 women were kidnapped respond. and gang-raped, but the Government claimed that the women had brought the attack on themselves and that I congratulate the hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside the manner in which they had been dressed was reason (Mrs Ellman)—an old friend in such matters over the enough not to bring the attackers to justice. Recently, years—on securing the debate and on how she raised we have seen the imprisonment of women’s rights activists the issues, from deep knowledge. She mentioned a series who signed the “One Million Signatures” campaign to of individual cases, and I might touch on some during repeal discriminatory laws. One activist was sentenced my remarks, although there were too many for me to to nine and a half years in jail for assembly and collusion comment on them all. She spoke for all of us when she against the regime and to a further two years for hoped that such debates shone some light on the situation participating in a protest against laws discriminating of the Baha’i community for instance, or others under against women. Another women’s rights activist was pressure in Iran. As my hon. Friend the Member for given three and a half years in one of Iran’s most Peterborough (Mr Jackson) said, we collectively act as a notorious prisons in May 2011. voice for the voiceless and for those minorities known and unknown to us, in what we do here. Colleagues have Three gay men are known to have been hanged in certainly lived up to such obligations. Iran in 2011, and two teenage boys, in a case that drew The human rights situation in Iran continues to widespread international attention, were hanged in 2005 deteriorate sharply. The United Kingdom, together with for the same offence. Some observers report that that is the international community, continues to urge the Iranian only the tip of the iceberg, because in many cases the regime to respect its human rights obligations and to families are not prepared to make public the fact that improve the situation of its people. Our efforts and their relatives were executed under the sodomy laws. those of Iranian and global civil society ensure that the I finish with a few words about the role of social international spotlight remains on the serious human media in Iran. We heard from the hon. Member for rights violations taking place in Iran today. Before I Cheltenham (Martin Horwood) about how a fairly well comment on some of the individual items that came up, organised, well educated opposition movement exists in let me refer to one or two general issues raised by Iran, and how it is struggling to break free from the colleagues. regime’s grasp. According to Harvard university, the Concern is not felt simply by those outside Iran, and rate of growth of internet usage is higher in Iran than in I pay tribute to the bravery of those operating in Iran. any other country in the middle east. An estimated In September last year, The Times ran a good seminar 700,000 active blogs come from the country. In 2009, entitled “Imprisoned in Iran”, to raise awareness of the the regime was quick to blame the use of the internet, plight of victims of human rights abuses. The event was social networking sites in particular, for the outbreak of well attended, raised a large number of issues and was protests following the disputed presidential election. addressed by my right hon. Friend the Secretary of Today, the regime does all it can to block access to State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs. Among websites promoting democratic change. For example, in his remarks, he said: September last year, a blogger received a nineteen-and-a-half “2011 has shown that demands for human dignity are irrepressible. year prison sentence for propaganda against the regime, Iranians should take solace from this… Iran is very different from and the UN’s recent report on the state of human rights its Arab neighbours. But the lessons of the Arab revolutions hold in Iran gives numerous examples of bloggers and journalists true for Iran just as they apply to repressive countries across the imprisoned for similar activities. world. Simply refusing to address legitimate grievances about human rights or attempting to stamp them out will fail. It has now been reported that internet cafés have While some governments across the region are waking up to been asked to record customers’ online footprints and this truth, Iran is moving in the opposite direction. The actions of to install security cameras. As recently as Monday this the Iranian regime are holding Iran back, isolating its people and week, the Iranian regime announced that it intends to suffocating their immense potential, and preventing Iran from introduce its own internet operating system, to enable it enjoying normal and productive relations with the outside world.” to block websites considered unsuitable and to monitor My right hon. Friend conveyed the sense of how well online activity. As we saw in other countries during the we understand the dynamics. Iran is a complex society, Arab spring, social media are incredibly important in not a monolithic one. At one and the same time, we can spreading democratic ideas and in enabling people to condemn the activities of the regime and express support mobilise opposition to human rights abuses and for the Iranian people. When relations with the regime undemocratic practices. I urge the Minister, in his discussions have necessarily to be rather more restricted than they on human rights in Iran, to stress that freedom of were, it is still possible to engage the Iranian people and 129WH Iran (Human Rights)11 JANUARY 2012 Iran (Human Rights) 130WH to have contacts with the regime itself. Colleagues said Ashton, the EU High Representative, because we will that they wanted the United Kingdom Government to not be caught out by the Iranians saying that they have be aware of that sentiment, so let me elaborate. been backed into a corner. The opportunity exists for I thank the hon. Member for Bristol East (Kerry them to talk. We oppose the killing of civilians, and we McCarthy) for her support and that of her Front-Bench want a negotiated solution to the problem. We are also colleagues in relation to the appalling attack on the alert to the fact that human rights issues in Iran may embassy. When there is a problem and an embassy must often be more powerful than the nuclear one, which is be evacuated, neighbours step in to provide support. why we are concentrating on the matter today. We are working actively to find a country that will take I shall respond to some of the specific issues raised. on the obligations and we are in negotiation, but until The hon. Member for Bristol East mentioned the situation that is done, under the Lisbon treaty—if a Minister may of women in Iran. In 2010, we opposed Iranian membership mention that—EU partners can provide support for of a specific UN women’s committee because of Iran’s one another in such circumstances. We are grateful to discriminatory practices in relation to women. In June other EU member nations that have been able to provide last year, my right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary support. spoke out about the arrest of women activists and praised those whose conscientiousness and achievements Jeremy Corbyn: If a family of Iranian origin living in should be celebrated but instead are behind bars. We Britain wants to invite a family member to an occasion will continue to highlight and to encourage Iran to here, or the other way round, to which specific embassy address gender discrimination in Iranian law. in Iran should that family address its inquiries? Iran’s excessive use of the death penalty is a major cause of concern. In 2011, reliable sources reported that Alistair Burt: At the moment, they can take the about 650 people were executed, although because of matter up with any other EU embassy. In due course, the opacity of the Iranian judiciary and penal system, it one designated embassy will take on responsibility as a is quite possible that the number is much higher. That protecting power. That process must be negotiated not maintains Iran’s inauspicious record as the country only with the country willing to take that on, but with witnessing the highest number of executions per capita Iran—that may explain the time that has been taken—but in the world. Iran’s use of the death penalty shows little for the time being a partner EU nation can take on that regard for minimum international standards in the request. I hope that that explanation is helpful. application of the death penalty, including a lack of fair Despite the invasion by regime-backed paramilitaries trial and the execution of juveniles. We should not and the subsequent closure of the embassy, our wish to forget other brutal punishment methods, including stoning. maintain strong support for and friendship with the Fourteen people still live under sentence of stoning. Iranian people remains. We have always stated that our On freedom of speech and assembly, last year Iran disagreement with Iran on human rights is with the was described by the Committee to Protect Journalists Iranian leadership regime, not the people. Human rights as the are universal, and Iran’s failure to meet its obligations is punishing and stifling the fulfilment of the wishes and “biggest prison for journalists anywhere in the world”. aspirations of millions of people. It finished the year with more journalists and bloggers Dialogue continues, and the hon. Member for Liverpool, in prison than anywhere else, including China. The Riverside and others, including my hon. Friend the traditional forms of media in Iran are all run by the Member for Cheltenham (Martin Horwood), spoke state, with satellite television banned and most foreign about the importance of continuing a dialogue using journalists denied entry. The hon. Member for Ilford social media and the like. Again, the Government are South (Mike Gapes) raised that matter. Iran blocks well aware of that. We have a good system of direct more than 10 million websites and is pursuing a separate contact with people in Iran. We have a Farsi service and and highly censored Iranian internet, disconnecting can communicate directly with people in Iran. They are Iran from the world wide web. savvy and open to the world; they know what is going The hon. Gentleman referred to the contrast between on; and they know the limitations of their own regime. Press TV and everything else. The contrast is this: we do We are also aware of how we can continue to contact not control and we do not censor through Government and work with them. We have a Farsi spokesperson to as such. The law does that. Press TV may be investigated speak directly to the Iranian people, so colleagues may by Ofcom. ?That is the appropriate regulatory body. be absolutely sure that we will do that. That is how we do it here, not through Government The embassy is not the only way in which to make diktat. That is the contrast between the two nations. representations to Tehran. The hon. Member for Liverpool, Press TV must obey the laws of this country, but is Riverside was right to raise the matter, because closure handled independently, as we all know. of the embassy makes that more difficult but not impossible. In 2011, we have again seen brutal crackdowns by the Our contacts through other channels and with other Iranian state. During the first one in February, several agencies will certainly be kept up. The balance is difficult people were killed by the security forces. In April, more to maintain, but we are endeavouring to do so. than 30 people reportedly died during protests in Ahwaz The hon. Member for Islington North (Jeremy Corbyn) in southern Iran. In August, security forces attacked speaks with a deep background of the issues and raises people who were protesting peacefully against the neglect the awkward and realistic ones that need to be raised. of a natural salt lake in Azerbaijan province in northern It is clear from our contact with Iran on the nuclear Iran, and several deaths were reported. The range of issue that an offer of negotiation is available. We activities that a repressive regime may clamp down on is urge Iran to respond to the latest letter from Catherine extensive. 131WH Iran (Human Rights) 11 JANUARY 2012 132WH
[Alistair Burt] Sergei Magnitsky The majority of colleagues wanted to raise the issue of minorities, including the Baha’i and Christian 4pm communities. In 2011, we saw increasing patterns of Mr Denis MacShane (Rotherham) (Lab): It is a great violence and intimidation against minorities. The authorities pleasure to initiate this debate under your chairmanship, have continued to crack down on Kurdish and Baluchi Dr McCrea. Today I want to deal with the tragedy of a groups, as well as those mentioned today. Religious lawyer who worked closely with and for a British minorities have been subject to arrest and intimidation, company—and its British chairman who is present in as we have heard. Christians and Baha’is in particularly Westminster Hall—and who was done to death under have suffered harassment, and I am grateful to my hon. the most atrocious circumstances. If a British lawyer Friends the Members for Peterborough (Mr Jackson) working for an overseas firm had been arrested and so and for South West Bedfordshire (Andrew Selous) for mistreated in the UK, all hell would break loose. This their remarks. I echo the tribute to Christian Solidarity tragedy, however, happened in today’s Russia, and my Worldwide. charge is that the British Government have been singularly We have spoken in the House about both issues a lax in dealing with the case, and lacking in adequate number of times, and the Government have made and necessary measures, not only to obtain justice but representations on them. I have met the Baha’i community to send a clear message that putting to death a lawyer in the United Kingdom, and I made representations who represents British interests is not cost free. I do not direct to Iranian representatives when they were here. claim a new policy of “advocatus Britannicus sum”, but We continue to raise the matter, and we have done so the idea of civilisation and the rule of law, as well as the also in relation to Christian persecution, about which clear rules in the European convention on human rights colleagues spoke movingly. We particularly deplore the to which Russia is a signatory, provide a special place pressure that has been put on the Baha’i community in for lawyers to represent their clients without facing Iran, and the attacks on the Baha’i Institute of Higher prosecution or persecution unto death. Education, and its closure. We will continue to raise all The details of the tragic death of Sergei Magnitsky those issues. are somewhat well known. Mr Magnitsky was the A general point about the protection of religious Moscow lawyer of British businessman William Browder. minorities is that protection of an individual minority Mr Browder was born American and is the grandson of must be done in company with all. In our experience, Earl Browder who was leader of the Communist party those who oppress one minority usually oppress others, in the United States during the 1930s until he fell out and it is collectively safer if we raise the issue on behalf with Stalin in 1945. Earl Browder’s grandson decided of all—the lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender that capitalism was a better bet than communism, and community, women, Christian minorities, Muslim sect over a decade beginning in the 1990s he built up the minorities and Baha’is. If we seek to protect the rights largest investment fund in Russia with billions of dollars of all, we are doing the best that we can. of assets. However, not all went well for young Browder On UK action at the UN and through the Human when he started publicly complaining about endemic Rights Council, colleagues can be assured that we press corruption in Russian state companies, and in 2006, other countries to support resolutions that we have President Putin expelled him from Russia as a “threat to co-sponsored. The result of a vote in December showed national security”. I would like to recommend to the how effective lobbying had been because the margin House the remarkable documentary by Ms Norma was the largest ever in relation to a country-specific Percy on the early Putin years. It will be shown on resolution against Iran. That showed how successful BBC 2 next Thursday and it illustrates the interface some of the work had been, and we will continue with between politics, state bureaucracy and business. that. The next periodic review when Iran must deal with Once the Putin regime decides that it does not like a the issues will be in 2014, and we will press at the business leader, it does not operate in half measures, Council in March, as we do at every Council, for Iran to and when it decides to turn on someone, it does so in deal with the record against it that colleagues have spectacular fashion. After Browder’s expulsion, Putin’s spoken about. There is no doubt that the issues raised tax police raided his offices in Moscow, seized all his here will continue to be raised by colleagues, but they company stamps and seals and stole his investment may rest assured that their concerns are echoed by the holding companies. Browder hired a bright young Russian Government. We will continue to stand up for the rights lawyer, Sergei Magnitsky, to try to stop this continuing of those who are oppressed in Iran. state-sanctioned crime. Magnitsky investigated all the police actions and discovered that Browder’s companies had not only been stolen but had subsequently been used by the tax police to fraudulently refund from Government coffers the $230 million in taxes that Browder’s firm had paid in the previous year. Magnitsky did what any lawyer would do on behalf of his client: he filed criminal complaints and testified on the involvement of the tax police in that enormous theft. That was a big mistake. He was subsequently arrested by the same tax police officers against whom he had testified, and blamed for the fraud himself. The scams that the Putinocracy arranges are not just for a few high-up people—everyone gets a cut. To shut him 133WH Sergei Magnitsky11 JANUARY 2012 Sergei Magnitsky 134WH up, Magnitsky was flung into one of the roughest from the Russian Interior Ministry was named in prisons in Russia and essentially held a hostage. Because Magnitsky’s testimony as having orchestrated the theft the Russian state could not get at Mr Browder, who, as a of the Hermitage fund’s investment companies. Kuznetsov British citizen was now safe in London with his family, was also accused of perpetrating the $230 million tax they went for his lawyer to send a signal to other firms fraud, as well as Magnitsky’s false arrest and persecution operating in Russia saying that when the tax police—or in detention. Public records—let me stress that—show anyone else demanding a cut—knock at the door, that shortly after the $230 million was paid from the co-operation is wiser than insisting on the rule of law. Russian Treasury, Kuznetsov’s family acquired $3 million worth of high-end apartments in Moscow, land plots Sergei Magnitsky was brutally treated in prison. He outside the city and several luxury cars. Kuznetsov was tortured for 358 days by sleep deprivation, freezing travelled to the UK twice in 2006. temperatures, the withholding of food and other torments left over from the Stalin era of torturing people whom Major Pavel Karpov, also from the Russian Interior the Kremlin did not like. After six months of such Ministry, was named by Magnitsky as a close accomplice treatment he became extremely sick and was systematically of Kuznetsov. Karpov initiated the criminal case against denied any medical treatment. Eventually, Magnitsky’s Mr Magnitsky that was used as a pretext for his false beleaguered body began to give way and his condition arrest. Public records in Russia—again, I stress that—show became critical. Instead of sending him to the emergency that Karpov’s family acquired $1.3 million in real estate room, his jailers put him in an isolation cell and allowed assets and luxury cars following the completion of the eight riot guards with rubber batons to beat him until fraud. Mr Karpov travelled to the UK four times between he was dead. In November 2009, he was found lying in a 2006 and 2007. pool of his own urine, dead on the cell floor at the age Dmitry Klyuev is the owner of Universal Savings of 37. bank through which the $230 million proceeds of the Since then, the Russian Government have tried to fraud were laundered. He was previously involved in a cover up the cause of Magnitsky’s death, and a network number of other tax-refund frauds, and in 2006 was of named officials in the tax, police, public prosecution convicted of a $1.6 billion fraud relating to the attempted and prison departments of the Russian state has been theft of shares from Mikhailovsky GOK, a Russian identified as part of that cover-up. Many of those iron ore company. Mr Klyuev also travelled to the involved have bought property abroad at prices that United Kingdom at least five times in 2008. As I have would be impossible on their declared salaries. said, all these names are on the record in Russia and on Capitol hill in Washington. None of those facts are secret and they have been The following Government officials also played a role reported by journalists in Moscow, as have the details in the tax fraud that Magnitsky uncovered, his subsequent and names of those involved. The names have been arrest and imprisonment, the persecution of Hermitage listed by US Senators, Congressmen and Congresswomen, lawyers and executives, Magnitsky’s continued detention, and by parliamentarians in some EU member states the denial of medical care, torture, the denial of fair and in the European Parliament. The Magnitsky affair hearings, and finally his death in custody and the subsequent has also been the subject of a Council of Europe report. cover up: from the courts service, Judge Yelena Stashina, I, together with a number of right hon. and hon. Judge Alexei Krivoruchko, Olga Egorova; from the Members, as well as Peers, have asked questions in Interior Ministry, Mr Oleg Silchenko, Oleg Urzhumtsev, Parliament and sought to highlight this assault on a Alexei Anichin, Oleg Logunov, Boris Kibis, General respected British business, and show the terrible insight Major Tatiana Gerasimova; from the FSB—the Russian that the Magnitsky death gives us into how Russia secret service and the successor to the KGB—Mr Viktor operates. I had the luck to secure this debate, but that Voronin; from the tax offices, Olga Stepanova and could have happened to any number of interested colleagues Elena Khimina; from the prison services, Dmitri Komnov, who support me on this affair, some of whom are Fikhet Tagiev and Yuri Kalinin; and from the General present in the Chamber. Prosecutor’s Office, Andrey Pechegin. Vasily Aleksanyan was another young lawyer, and I ask the Minister to agree that those people should former general counsel to Yukos. In 2006, Mr Aleksanyan now be banned from entering the UK and their names was arrested as part of the persecution of those involved circulated via Interpol and Europol. We need to sharpen in Yukos. He rapidly developed serious health conditions up our diplomatic tools by declaring that the functionaries due to AIDS-related illnesses, but was denied antiretroviral linked to Magnitsky’s death are unwelcome as visitors treatment or chemotherapy in prison. In 2008, the in Britain, thus copying what the US State Department European Court of Human Rights intervened and ordered has done under pressure from the US Congress. Russian authorities to release Aleksanyan. The damage done to his body during his detention was too great, Mr Dominic Raab (Esher and Walton) (Con) rose— however, and he died last year as a direct result of the denial of treatment in jail. Chris Bryant (Rhondda) (Lab) rose— That is the Magnitsky story. We must now turn to the Whitehall story and ask the Minister why the Foreign Mr MacShane: I give way first to my hon. Friend. Office and Home Office have been so lax in taking up the Magnitsky case, and unwilling to take action against Chris Bryant: The hon. Gentleman and I are probably the named officials who were involved in theft via the about to say exactly the same thing. Does my right hon. tax system and the crime that Magnitsky sought to Friend agree that there is not much point in just banning reveal. Will the Minister explain why some of the principals these people secretly behind closed doors? It is important involved have been allowed to enter the UK without let that we say publicly that they are not welcome in this or hindrance? Lieutenant Colonel Artem Kuznetsov country. 135WH Sergei Magnitsky11 JANUARY 2012 Sergei Magnitsky 136WH
Mr MacShane: I think that I may just have hinted at stole the money that Magnitsky was investigating and that. then colluded in his death should not be given a permanent status of impunity by Whitehall fiat. Mr Raab: I congratulate the right hon. Gentleman on In an earlier reply to a parliamentary question from securing the debate. Does he agree that in addition to me on 13 July 2011, the Minister for Immigration—I highlighting the tragic case before us, it is time for a welcome the Under-Secretary from the Foreign and British equivalent of the US Sergei Magnitsky Rule of Commonwealth Office, but this is as much a matter for Law Accountability Act, which would hold to account the Home Office as it is for the FCO—confirmed the more generically foreign officials responsible for grotesque following: human rights abuses, through travel bans and asset “The Secretary of State for the Home Department…does have freezes, and also that, as in the US, this a matter not just the power to exclude foreign nationals whose presence in the UK for the Executive, but for Members of this House and she judges would not be conducive to the public good”, for Parliament? but he added that “the duty of confidentiality means that the Government are Mr MacShane: I would support that. Perhaps some unable to discuss the details of individual immigration cases.”— right hon. and hon. Members present might combine to [Official Report, 13 July 2011; Vol. 531, c. 398W.] ask the Backbench Business Committee for a longer debate, which might allow a slight pause for breath and I am sorry, but that will not do and it is not true. Her more development of some of these themes. In particular, Majesty’s Government have regularly published the names it would show the Russian authorities that this is a of those to whom they deny visa entry. They include or cross-party affair, with support from a considerable included the TV cook Martha Stewart, the actor George number of Members of both Houses. Raft, the Scientologist L. Ron Hubbard and even a Nobel laureate, the Chilean poet Pablo Neruda, who wrote: Mr Robert Buckland (South Swindon) (Con): I just want to add Canada to the list. It has also passed “Death is the stone into which our oblivion hardens.” legislation in similar terms to the United States, so it is It is the wish of the Russian authorities that Magnitsky’s not just one country but many countries taking a strong death hardens into oblivion, but as another great writer stand against these appalling acts. who lived under communism, Milan Kundera, wrote: “The struggle of man against power is the struggle of memory Mr MacShane: Poland and, I believe, the Netherlands against forgetting.” have done so as well, but the addition of Canada, which Let us not hear from the Minister today that the is a great beacon of democracy and a Commonwealth Government cannot publish the names of the people country, is most welcome. whom they ban. We should not allow Magnitsky to be Yes, I believe that we should be doing what has been forgotten. If the Home Office can publicly ban a cook, set out. We should not need to have a debate, because I an actor, a loopy and a poet, surely it can ban those hope that when the Minister replies, he will tell us that Russian officials named as associates in this massive he fully accepts that the Foreign and Commonwealth theft, then the arrest and ill- treatment to the point of Office will put a statement, a note, in the Library death of a lawyer representing a British citizen and his tomorrow, with those names on it, saying that they are company. not welcome in the UK, and will pass the names on Modern Russian apparatchiks like to visit, buy flats to Europol and Interpol. So far, the FCO has resisted in and educate their children in London. If we name that idea and has constantly sought to downplay the and shame and announce that they will lose those Magnitsky affair. The FCO position or, more accurately, privileges if they break the law and allow a lawyer the Whitehall position has been to shelter behind Russian representing a British firm to die in agony for having bureaucracy. defended his client’s interest, diplomatic pressure will be On 15 November 2011, the Minister for Immigration focused and sharp and will send a clear state-to-state finally replied to a letter that I sent him in August on the signal that Russia cannot live above the law. idea of a visa ban. That was a very discourteous gap between my letter and his reply. He wrote: This is not just about Russia, however. We need to find ways of sending signals to mid-level officials in “The Russian Presidential Council on Human Rights presented other authoritarian regimes that when they break the to President Medvedev its report on Mr Magnitsky’s arrest and treatment” law, the doors of Britain are not easily open to them. A new approach is required to create a new tool of democratic and the diplomacy—namely, the precisely targeted travel ban “Minister of the Interior has announced that its own internal that is made public so that all law-abiding state officials investigation has not found any evidence of abuses by their in Russia and elsewhere can see that corruption and officials”. collusion in murder are no longer crimes without sanction. Well, that is a surprise—a bureaucracy defends its own That is what more and more decent Russian citizens people. Nevertheless, want. “the Investigative Committee of the Russian Federation chaired A further signal could be sent. Just as Mr Putin is not by Alexander Bastrykin” welcome on the streets of Moscow today, Britain should would report by 24 November. To my knowledge, no such say that he is not welcome at the opening ceremonies of report was issued, and it is time for the FCO and Home the London Olympics. In 1980, Mrs Thatcher had the Office to stop parroting Russian excuses for inaction guts to say no to a formal British endorsement of the and instead to follow the example of the United States, Moscow Olympics after the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. Canada and Poland and make it clear that those who If the Prime Minister wants to emulate the Iron Lady, 137WH Sergei Magnitsky11 JANUARY 2012 Sergei Magnitsky 138WH he should say no to Mr Putin, who will use the London Our embassy in Moscow is providing financial Olympics and the winter Olympics in two years’ time as support to the important work of the Social Partnership events for self-promotion. Foundation—a human rights non-governmental Of the 20 years since the end of communism, Russia organisation—to look at the underlying causes of such spent the first decade being plundered by oligarchs and cases and to help prevent further cases occurring. the second decade being robbed by state functionaries The right hon. Gentleman referred to the Government up to the highest level. It is time that Russia became a subjecting Russian officials allegedly implicated in normal rule-of-law nation and its tax collectors levied Magnitsky’s death to punitive measures in the form of taxes for the good of the people, not their own offshore visa bans. He will be aware that the immigration rules bank accounts. enable us to refuse a visa where information on an individual’s character, conduct or associations makes entry into the UK undesirable. However, the UK has a 4.17 pm long established global practice, which has been followed The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Foreign by all recent Governments, including the one of which and Commonwealth Affairs (Mr Henry Bellingham): I he was a member, of not commenting routinely on congratulate the right hon. Member for Rotherham individual cases. (Mr MacShane) on securing this very important The right hon. Gentleman named a number of debate. The high-profile case of Sergei Magnitsky is of individuals whom he says were involved in the case. The serious concern to Her Majesty’s Government and one Home Office and I will look into the cases of those in which there is a clear need for Russia to act. As the individuals and will write to the right hon. Gentleman right hon. Gentleman made clear, Mr Magnitsky, a in due course. Russian lawyer, went into pre-trial detention and died in state custody nearly a year later. Before his arrest, Chris Bryant: I hope the word “routinely”was important he had been working to uncover an alleged tax fraud against in that sentence. The Minister for Immigration has, on the Russian state by certain Russian law enforcement several occasions, done a nudge, nudge, wink, wink to officials, a number of whom are alleged to have been me to say, “Look, these people aren’t going to be involved in the investigation and detention of Mr Magnitsky. coming into the country.” Frankly, though, we need In July 2011, the Russian presidential council on more than that. If the Minister was prepared to provide human rights published a report that found that a list of people who would not be welcome in this Mr Magnitsky had been denied medical treatment and country, that would be a significant step forward. had been beaten while in detention, which directly Mr Bellingham: I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman contributed to his death, yet no one has been held to for making that point. It is not something on which I account by the Russian authorities. It is deeply disappointing can give a guarantee this afternoon, but we will be in a that the Russian investigative committee appears to better position to do so once the investigative committee have made little progress. The publication of its findings has issued its report on 24 January. in relation to Magnitsky’s death was postponed a number of times during 2011. They are currently due to be Dr Julian Lewis (New Forest East) (Con): There is issued on 24 January. It is vital that the Russian authorities nothing routine about a murder closely connected with complete a thorough and transparent investigation into a British enterprise. Although Mr Magnitsky was not a his death without further delay, as the case has wider British citizen, this case really is on a par with the implications for the rule of law and respect for human Litvinenko murder. The reason why these things keep rights in Russia. happening is well known: these people are crossing the Russian state. If the Russian state does not want to be Jo Swinson (East Dunbartonshire) (LD): What seen as a gangster, surely it should stop killing journalists, confidence does the Minister have that the Russian lawyers and dissidents. authorities will be able to complete that kind of transparent, thorough and fair investigation in this case? Mr Bellingham: My hon. Friend makes a powerful point in his own inimitable way. I would not want Mr Bellingham: I am grateful to my hon. Friend for anyone to have the impression that I was describing this intervening. Of course, it is disappointing that the Russian case as routine, because obviously it is not. What I said investigative committee has made so little progress. It is was that the Government have a policy of not commenting also very disappointing that its report has been postponed routinely on individual cases. Obviously, this is an incredibly on three occasions, but we are putting on all the pressure serious case, and I take on board what he has said. that we can and understand that the report will be On visa action taken by other countries, we are aware issued on 24 January. We will keep up the pressure and of media reports that the US has imposed sanctions on look forward to publication on that date. implicated officials and added them to a visa application On HMG action, we have made our concerns very watch list. Although Bills have been introduced in the clear to the Russian Government. I should like to point US Congress and some other countries’ Parliaments, out to the right hon. Member for Rotherham that the such as in the Netherlands and Canada, and motions Prime Minister discussed this case with the President have been passed in support of visa bans against Russian during his visit to Moscow in September, when he also officials allegedly implicated in Mr Magnitsky’s death, outlined the need for confidence in the rule of law in we are not aware that those states have taken such Russia. This case is an unfortunate reminder that action. Mr Magnitsky’s death in pre-trial detention is not an What we ultimately want—as all Members will agree, isolated incident in Russia: approximately 50 to 60 people I believe—is the Russian Government to take the initiative die in pre-trial detention facilities annually. in ensuring that justice is achieved in this case and in 139WH Sergei Magnitsky11 JANUARY 2012 Sergei Magnitsky 140WH
[Mr Bellingham] not make it clear that pluralism requires a much more open access to democracy than is currently available in putting in place measures to prevent further such cases Russia? occurring. To that end, we are urging the Russian Government to conduct a full and transparent investigation Mr Bellingham: I am grateful to my right hon. Friend into Mr Magnitsky’s death, and we continue to raise the for making that strong point. In light of what he says, I case at the highest levels. can tell him that our wider work on human rights in Russia focuses on a number of key areas: democratic Fabian Hamilton (Leeds North East) (Lab): I am rights, including supporting free and fair elections, freedom grateful to the Minister for what he says about the of expression and freedom of the media; support for action that the Foreign Office is taking and to my right those seeking to resolve conflict in the north Caucasus; hon. Friend the Member for Rotherham (Mr MacShane) support for those seeking to increase monitoring, reporting for raising the issue in the first place. This case is of the and prosecution of human rights abuses; better support utmost importance. Will the Minister act in concert and protection for human rights defenders; support for with his European colleagues, so that all the nations of those seeking a stronger rule of law with improved the European Union can show their anger at the way in access to justice; and making progress towards greater which this lawyer has been treated and at the abuse and equality and reduced discrimination. violation of human rights in Russia today? Jo Swinson: I thank the Minister for giving way; he is Mr Bellingham: I will certainly make sure that the being very generous. In early 2010, I visited Chechnya hon. Gentleman’s strong comments are passed on to the with Lord Judd to investigate the human rights situation. Minister for Europe, so that he will speak to his European Will the Minister, in his discussions with Russian colleagues counterparts about this case at the next appropriate and his ministerial colleagues, impress upon the Russian Council. He has already raised it with them, and similar Government that this is also an issue of security? It was action has been taken by other European countries. In clear from our trip to Chechnya that, without the the light of what the hon. Gentleman says, we will proper upholding of human rights, the security situation ensure that the case is raised again. and the terrorism issues faced there would not be resolved. I should like to say a few words about the wider situation in Russia. The FCO’s annual human rights Mr Bellingham: I thank my hon. Friend for making report makes it clear that we remain concerned about that point. I agree with what she says, and we will the rights afforded to Russian citizens and the strength ensure that that is taken up at the highest level. of democracy. The Russian Government’s support for In addition to the Magnitsky case, it is important that human rights often appears ambivalent. As President the Russian Government fully investigate the unresolved Medvedev has acknowledged, there is a pressing need murders of journalists and human rights defenders. We to strengthen the rule of law in Russia. Legislative remain concerned at the lack of progress in prosecuting changes to reduce corruption represent a tentative step those responsible for the 2009 murder of Natalya in the right direction. Reports of grave human rights Estemirova. The murder of Russian journalist Anna abuses in the north Caucasus continue, and Russian Politkovskaya remains one of the most worrying cases human rights defenders and journalists remain at high of recent years. More than five years after her tragic risk. In some cases, though, we have seen some minor death, the case still remains to be concluded. In October, positive developments. Russian prosecutors announced new charges against suspects allegedly involved in organising her murder. The state Duma parliamentary elections have been The Prime Minister raised this case with President the key recent test of Russia’s democratic credentials. Medvedev during his recent visit to Moscow, calling on The conduct of those elections confirmed our concerns the Russian authorities to take further steps to bring all about human rights and democracy in Russia. Before perpetrators to justice. There is a low success rate in the elections, NGOs and media organisations were routinely investigating and prosecuting these crimes, thus perpetuating harassed. The Organisation for Security and Co-operation the perception of impunity, which undermines freedom in Europe was permitted to observe the elections. The of expression and human rights in Russia. Office for Democratic Institutions and Human Rights concluded that they had been Mr Raab: I thank the Minister for giving way again. “slanted in favour of the ruling party”. He is eloquently making the case for the kind of legislation As my right hon. Friend the Minister for Europe said that the US wants to enact. He mentioned the Bill that on 6 December, those conclusions underline the need has gone through Congress. It looks likely to become for alleged electoral violations to be investigated rapidly law and is unlikely to be vetoed by the President. Given and transparently and to ensure that all democratic the evidence that he has adduced here before us today, institutions, including the media, civil society and opposition would he be open to that kind of Bill being introduced political groups, can operate freely in Russia. in the House of Commons?
Malcolm Bruce (Gordon) (LD): I apologise for being Mr Bellingham: If that Bill gets through Congress, we slightly late. I very much appreciate this debate. Does will certainly look at it very carefully. We will look at the Minister acknowledge that it is not just the conduct whether there are any appropriate lessons for this country, of the elections but the whole functioning of democracy and we will consult parliamentary colleagues from all in Russia that prevents anyone who could challenge the parts of the House. I cannot give any guarantees, but we system from getting nominated, never mind elected, as need to watch very carefully to see whether the Bill a presidential candidate? Will Her Majesty’s Government becomes law in the US. 141WH Sergei Magnitsky 11 JANUARY 2012 142WH
In conclusion, I hope that what I have covered today Technology (Primary Schools) illustrates the Government’s concern and action, both on the wider issue of human rights in Russia and on the specific case of ensuring justice for Sergei Magnitsky. 4.43 pm As my right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary said: John Pugh (Southport) (LD): I begin by apologising “Human rights are part of our national DNA and will be to the Minister of State, Department for Education, the woven deeply into the decision-making processes of our foreign hon. Member for Bognor Regis and Littlehampton policy at every stage”. (Mr Gibb) and his Parliamentary Private Secretary, the That applies to our dealings with Russia as much as hon. Member for Grantham and Stamford (Nick Boles), with any country. We will continue to engage Russia on because they have had to listen twice in a week to my human rights through bilateral contacts, including our meanderings on the curriculum. I also apologise the annual human rights dialogue, which will take place in people who have advised me on this debate and London this year—in the summer, we hope—as well as might be reading it in Hansard, because I have to through multilateral channels, such as the EU, the UN confess that on this subject I am relatively untutored. and the Council of Europe. However, I do speak with passion and enthusiasm, I thank the right hon. Member for Rotherham for which might to some extent compensate for my lack of bringing Parliament’s attention to this issue and giving precise knowledge. me the chance to explain the Government’s position. It is sometimes helpful to put things in an We will continue to push for the respect of human autobiographical context. I am the victim, as many rights and the rule of law in Russia and achieving people are, of the traditional British approach to design justice for Sergei Magnitsky. and technology. Like you, Dr McCrea, in primary school I did craft, the rationale for which was always slightly 4.29 pm fuzzy, the practice somewhat varied, and the results Sitting suspended for a Division in the House. certainly diverse. In my case, the only achievement of note that I can remember was a papier-mâché giraffe that my mother loyally put on the mantelpiece for a few years until, presumably, it toppled off. Then one went on to grammar school, and although some traditional craft skills were always put in one’s way in the early years, if one was considered to be relatively clever one went off and did Latin and Greek. Pupils continued with practical subjects only if, in some sense, they were not making the grade. I was brought up in Kent, where there were three categories of school: grammar school for those people who passed the 11-plus; secondary modern schools for those who failed it; and technical schools for those who were somewhere in the middle. The theory was, essentially, that pupils did the hands-on, practical stuff if they were not academic, even if they were highly numerate. It was rather like the Confucian model of education that they had in China in centuries gone by, which had a disdain of things that had a technical aspect to them. Consequently, we ended up with the problem we are all familiar with, and about which I will not go into any depth, which is that we have a dearth of engineers in the country, a decline in manufacturing, and even a loss of some basic craftsmanship at many levels. That is not entirely due to the school system; it has something to do with how the workplace has reacted to apprenticeships and financial pressures. However, the school system certainly plays a part, and it differs markedly from the German one, in which there has been a better element of technical education for some time. We have woken up to this mistake, but to some extent we still see technology as an escape route from serious academic study for the less able—something that is bolted on to or plugged into the curriculum as we get towards the school-leaving years. There are very adverse consequences of that line of thought. Fundamentally, we fail to recognise that human intelligence is very diverse, and that people have enormous undiscovered potential. Even people who have been academically very successful—those who, in the schools’ terms, are successes—have latent abilities that they have not had the chance to explore. We deprive children, including 143WH Technology (Primary Schools)11 JANUARY 2012 Technology (Primary Schools) 144WH
[John Pugh] It is not my supposition that every child will be technically gifted in the same technologies. There is a the academically able, of the challenge that technology huge diversity of potential and of things to be good at, presents, and to some extent we allow the academically which is why we want the curriculum to be as varied and able to consider it not a failure to be bad at technical imaginative as possible. I do not think that that is matters. There are people, certainly of my acquaintance, disputed; there is wholesale agreement right across the who would be appalled at some minor slip of grammar, board that that is a worthy ambition—one that I think but who openly own up to not being able to put on a the Minister would be perfectly happy to own and plug or do anything of practical utility at all. espouse. More contentiously—this is the more difficult bit of The difficult thing is the technical question. Although what I want to say—we alienate some children, particularly we can all agree that fulfilling every child’s potential some boys, from the education process, or if we do not and stimulating their talents is a laudable ambition, alienate them we do not adequately engage them. I was there is an interesting debate about how to do that, and reading recently the biography of Steve Jobs, who was a what the Government and the forthcoming curriculum disruptive and singly uninspired pupil in the early years review can do to encourage it. There is excellence in of his education. technical education, but it is fair to say that although there is a constant stream of improvement in both Rehman Chishti (Gillingham and Rainham) (Con): I primary and secondary schools, there is also some congratulate the hon. Gentleman on raising this important patchy performance. Errors can be made. If we look at matter. I want to make a point about aspiration, and information and communications technology teaching, about inspiring boys and girls. It comes down to the fact which the Secretary of State touched on today, we see that the curriculum provides the opportunity under that quite a few significant errors have been made in aspects of science for the creative teaching of design how ICT is used in the classroom. I will return to that in and technology. For example, Byron primary school in a minute or two. my constituency was the winner of the 2007 design and technology competition for schools. It built go-karts, We must also acknowledge that, however good design with the help of BAE Systems, and raced them and technology might be, there are other equally good competitively—so there was competitiveness in there, things, such as numeracy, literacy, imagination, music and working with outside technology departments as and all sorts of other things, that the Government wish well. It all came down to having excellent teachers and to encourage and schools wish to incorporate in their to using the curriculum to provide creativity. That is a curriculum. A further dimension to the problem is that clear example of how the curriculum can provide even if we have the most laudable ambitions, we still opportunities, if they are taken to a greater extent, to need a work force who are trained to implement them inspire people in technology. Byron school has excellent effectively. Of course, the poor old primary school teachers, including the head, Jim Fernie. teacher is meant to be a jack of all trades and to be equally good at an astounding number of things, which John Pugh: I thank the hon. Gentleman very much is a tough call. for that intervention, because there is a need to pay In passing, looking at the wider implications, some of tribute to the awful lot of very good practice in this the greatest successes in technical development often area. I have been inundated with exemplars of schools take place outside the school curriculum, rather than in that have done astounding things under the banner of the classroom. Reading about the development of the design and technology. IT industry in California, we find that boys leaving The point I wanted to make with my reference to school and going off to things such as the Homebrew Steve Jobs was that technology can be a catalyst in a Computer Club—Bill Gates and Steve Jobs were among child’s education, in the early years. In pre-school education, them—made significant developments that ultimately that should be a fairly familiar concept to us, because had spin-offs for the whole culture of California. That we recognise that as well as introducing little children to was not necessarily in the curriculum, and it could not books to encourage their development, there is also a necessarily have been easily incorporated. need to introduce them to constructive toys and toys out of which they can make constructs. Technology, The design and technology sector has genuine fears almost from the word go, plays an appreciable part in a of the educational world. The principal fear is that, in child’s general cerebral and educational development. slimming down the curriculum, technology may suffer. In other words, if we reduce the demands of the national A point that eluded me before I started looking curriculum in total, which most people would support, further into the subject—a point that is not particularly technology may drop out or be put on the back burner. well understood—is that technology is a catalyst. It not Some people argue that the absence of a standard only gets people into technology, but gets them comfortable assessment test or rigorous measurement will not do with areas of education with which they had previously much to improve the overall quality of the subject. not been comfortable—mathematics and literacy, for There are complementary and opposed fears that heavy- example—because the design elements of the design handed state intervention or diktat will have perverse and technology curriculum have a real drive on effects, particularly if, as we all believe, design and presentational as well as constructive skills. Many additional technology is a blend of both technical skills and genuine gains, aside from pure technological ability, are driven creativity. by good design and technology education. There are many excellent examples of that, including those mentioned There are certain dilemmas involved in ensuring that by the hon. Member for Gillingham and Rainham present good practice is further built on and developed. (Rehman Chishti). Ofsted has recorded significant progress in recent years, 145WH Technology (Primary Schools)11 JANUARY 2012 Technology (Primary Schools) 146WH but I worry that that might be lost in curriculum revisions suggesting that much of what I will go on to say is simply because it is not fully assessed or seen to be mythology, and that in fact boys and girls approach the assessed. curriculum in broadly similar ways. The similarities are I turn to two other connected issues. One is the far more important and prevalent than the differences, speech by the Secretary of State today on the state of but I am not convinced by the argument that there are the ICT curriculum. I entirely echo his sentiments. In a no differences. Although some views can be challenged, Guardian article I wrote after tabling an early-day motion, they are not necessarily refuted. I said: It is a basic biological fact that male and female “we will end up with second-rate education for pupils, who will brains are structurally different—males and females have no understanding about how IT is developed or is likely to are, obviously, hormonally different as well—and that, progress. The future of IT in business in the UK is not going to be irrespective of social conditioning, the two behave quite just about using PowerPoint presentations.” differently. That can be evidenced not only by anecdote, Pupils must but by the performance of girls at any linguistic task; “become innovators of software, rather than people who just their abilities are far in excess of the abilities of boys, punch data into keyboards.” both in the UK and elsewhere. We have to recognise That article was published in 2007, so I like to think that and ask ourselves whether technology, if properly that I am five years ahead of my time. construed, might do something to balance out the attainment levels of the sexes in that respect. I make Mr Graham Stuart (Beverley and Holderness) (Con): that proposal in the knowledge that, to some extent, it is The picture that my hon. Friend paints is an accurate controversial, but I think that it would benefit from and grim one. There are 100,000 IT vacancies in this some examination. country at the moment, and the people are not there to The essential problem remains that if we want design fill those posts, because the number of people taking and technology to be embodied adequately in the computer science courses at university has halved since curriculum, as we do, and if we genuinely want to the year 2000, and the number of drop-outs has risen. spread good practice as best we can, how will we do it That is because the basic science in schools is not being within a narrowing curriculum, and in an environment taught, which is why I think the Secretary of State’s where teachers face a variety of demands? Moreover, speech today is timely, if not long overdue, as my hon. how will we do it at a stage at which it is immediately Friend would say. relevant to children? My supposition is that some children who attend primary school, and who are not naturally John Pugh: I certainly subscribe to the general view bookish or who do not come from bookish homes, may that a crash-course in Boolean algebra is probably more find it difficult at times to engage with what they are useful to the future of IT in this country than learning offered and therefore detach themselves from the how to use Word or any other Microsoft product, but curriculum. That will eventually lead to poor attainment the insistence that ICT and technology education are and to them being transferred to secondary school as about using applications shows how sometimes, when underperformers. Giving them a series of other activities the state or organisations associated with it weigh in, simply because they are not very good at what the they can get things wrong. school has to offer is less likely to be successful than A lot of what we have is in part, although not finding out at an early stage where their talents lie and entirely, a consequence of distinctly poor procurement, giving them an opportunity to explore them through encouraged by the defunct Becta—Bringing Educational design and technology. I believe that that opportunity Creativity to All—which the Secretary of State had the exists, and we have to capitalise on it. wisdom to abolish. There are lessons to be learned. I I will be interested to hear the Minister’s response, genuinely think that when we intervene to advise schools, particularly on how he sees D and T fitting into the we must accept that schools, from their own practice, curriculum and its revision, as planned. might wish, for good reasons, to be diverse and different, rather than aligning themselves with some common curriculum idea that could perish as rapidly as it emerged. 5.2 pm The second issue is a little contentious as well. Part of The Minister of State, Department for Education what I wanted to say today and might not have expressed (Mr Nick Gibb): I congratulate my hon. Friend the adequately involves gender. I suggest, tentatively, that Member for Southport (John Pugh) on securing this boys in general might benefit a little more than girls important debate and on his interesting opening speech. from good technical education. That might play some He need not apologise to my hon. Friend the Member part in addressing the problem of children leaving schools for Grantham and Stamford (Nick Boles) or me for a without any qualifications, a disproportionate number second contribution on educational matters—these are of whom are boys. important issues and it is always a pleasure to hear what In saying that, I accept that girls are and can be he has to say. excellent technologists, and that technology is much My hon. Friend the Member for Southport is right to more varied than the sorts of thing that boys first fixate say—we need to reiterate this—that design and technology on. I accept that gender is a spectrum and that boys and is absolutely not just an alternative for those young girls are all different. I also accept that the Department people who are not academically inclined; it is an important for Education has invested in efforts to prove that I am subject in its own right. Indeed, the expert panel that we speaking nonsense, and that what I say can be both appointed to look into evidence from around the world challenged and refuted. I have studied the Department for our national curriculum review recommended in the for Education’s website, which has some excellent report that we published before Christmas that design documents, largely written by female members of staff, and technology should become a basic curriculum subject, 147WH Technology (Primary Schools)11 JANUARY 2012 Technology (Primary Schools) 148WH
[Mr Nick Gibb] not necessarily best placed to define the knowledge that pupils need to acquire. As my hon. Friend has said of with greater freedom for schools to teach what they the early career of Bill Gates, he did not learn the skills want, free from the constrictions of a programme of that he used to build the Microsoft empire from technology study, to encourage innovation and an individual approach. lessons at school. He had a general, good education and The national curriculum review will consider that before he used it to develop his own work in understanding providing final recommendations to the Secretary of computers and software. State. I have been fortunate over the past few months to My hon. Friend has strong views about the importance meet representatives of those who work in the industry, of technology in primary schools and schools in general, particularly the ICT industry, who are concerned about and has voiced his concerns about the risk that too rigid the lack of a rigorous foundation in programming and a policy on the provision of technology to schools can the consequences of that for the wider economy. They stifle the very innovation that we all seek. Of course, are persuasive advocates and their detailed submissions technology can never supplant good teaching, but the to the national curriculum review have been very welcome. effective use of digital technology can support good As my hon. Friend has mentioned, the Secretary of teaching and help raise standards in schools. We need to State addressed the BETT technology show and took support the effective and innovative use of technology the opportunity to announce that the Department for in schools, with good practice being developed and Education will shortly open a consultation on the shared between them. That means not only exposing withdrawal of the existing national curriculum programmes children to technology and encouraging them to feel of study for ICT from September this year. This is an comfortable with it, but promoting technology as a interim measure that is intended to give schools more useful tool in itself and as a means to help develop flexibility to develop their own programmes of study to general teaching in schools. meet the needs of their pupils more effectively. This We do not seek to micro-manage the application of move may have come as a surprise to many people, and technology. As we stressed in the schools White Paper, it we recognise that we are taking a wholly new approach. is for individual schools to identify their own needs and to address them as they think best. We need to encourage and enable teachers to take better advantage of the Mr Graham Stuart: Will the Minister give way? great opportunities presented by the burgeoning range of digital technologies, and to use them to improve their Mr Gibb: I will happily give way to my hon. Friend, teaching and efficiency. the Chairman of the Select Committee on Education. As my hon. Friend has said, the Secretary of State emphasised the fact that technology is a priority in his Mr Stuart: I am grateful to the Minister. I, too, have speech to the Schools Network conference last month met, in recent months, representatives who have made and at the BETT technology show this morning. Like an impressive case. Can he explain—because I do not me, he wants to encourage the innovative use of technology know the answer—why, until last year, there was not a both within and beyond the classroom. We need to single computer science GCSE? All we had were equip our pupils with the technical skills and the knowledge programmes of study and qualifications in, as he has to meet the needs of the 21st-century workplace. said, operating programmes. The actual educational This country has an exemplary record on the use of material was not in the courses. Why was that? How did technology in schools. There is on average one computer we get into that position, and how will we make sure for every seven primary school pupils, and one for every that we will not allow such things to happen in future? three in secondary schools. Primary schools spend an average of £12,400 each year on information and Mr Gibb: My hon. Friend is right and that situation communications technology, and an additional sum of undermines the status of ICT. We have seen that in the almost £1,500 on software and content. No one should GCSE figures. In 2000-01, something like 95,200 people doubt the importance that we attach to the use of took the GCSE in ICT, and last year that figure went technology to support our teachers. down to 31,800, so something has gone very wrong with I recognise that some will fear that the passing of the content of the specification in ICT GCSE and in the Becta, to which my hon. Friend referred, has left a gap programmes of study that were in recent reviews and in the provision to schools of specialist advice on technology. that have led to this problem. There is a widespread We are in a period of transition, but this should be seen belief that the existing programmes of study for the as an opportunity for the commercial sector and subject lack ambition, and that they serve to inhibit professional organisations to adapt their services to fill schools from engaging with innovative and inspiring that gap. ICT initiatives. We have heard that from so many sources— My hon. Friend has spoken about the curriculum. from teachers and pupils, from industry and, indeed, We are in the process of reviewing both the national from my hon. Friend just now. curriculum and the suite of qualifications. I think that Some of the biggest names in the computer-related we all agree that the current ICT curriculum, to which industries have told us that, in its current form, ICT is he has referred, is in need of an overhaul. It is outdated turning pupils away. That, in turn, is hampering the and needs to be reformed. We see the teaching of development of more relevant ICT-related GCSEs, with technology-related knowledge and skills as an important a focus on the more rigorous disciplines of computer part of a broad and balanced curriculum that schools science programming. That has had disastrous consequences offer their pupils, but it is also our belief that, in a for our digital industries, which face ever-increasing fast-moving and continuously evolving area such as competition from emerging economies all around the ICT and technology in general, central Government are world. 149WH Technology (Primary Schools)11 JANUARY 2012 Technology (Primary Schools) 150WH
Eben Upton, a computer science academic at Cambridge choose from. I know that industry and specialist university, was reported in yesterday’s Guardian as saying organisations, such as the British Computer Society, of applicants for degree courses whom he was interviewing: e-skills UK and Naace are already working on an “None of them seemed to know enough about what a computer alternative ICT and computing curriculum. really was or how it worked…Children were learning about applications, which are pretty low-value skills. They weren’t John Pugh: The worry is that we will go from one being properly equipped to think about how computers are phase of prescription to another phase of prescription. programmed…Computing wasn’t being seen as the exciting, vibrant We will not get back the days when young men came in subject it should be at school—it had become lack-lustre and even and programmed BBC Micros on BASIC and such boring.” things, and got very excited about it. Technology is Our proposed change to the ICT curriculum will offer a changing enormously. Years ago, if someone in the chance for the subject to be rejuvenated, freeing teachers computer industry was asked about the key skill required, to explore and innovate, and hopefully to inspire a new they would have said, “Keyboard skills,”yet touch-screens wave of pupils to pursue computing and ICT. We need and so on will make those very skills obsolete. The highly-skilled programmers if we are going to continue model that the Minister is suggesting, which involves to compete in today’s and tomorrow’s markets, which not only advice from above but interaction from below, will be increasingly dependent on, and driven by, the is probably the right way forward. new digital technologies. Mr Gibb: I am grateful for my hon. Friend’s support That is why the Secretary of State made the for the radical notion of removing the programme of announcement that he did this morning. Pending the studies. As the Secretary of State said this morning: outcome of the national curriculum review, ICT will remain compulsory at all key stages in schools and it “Imagine the dramatic change which could be possible in just a few years, once we remove the roadblock of the existing ICT will be taught at each stage of the curriculum. The curriculum. Instead of children bored out of their minds being existing programmes of study will no longer be compulsory, taught how to use Word and Excel by bored teachers, we could but they will still be readily available for reference have 11 year-olds able to write simple 2D computer animations purposes on the web, although no school in England using an MIT tool called Scratch”— will be required to follow them. Subject to the consultation, from September this year, all schools will be able to use 5.13 pm whatever resources they choose to teach the subject, Sitting adjourned without Question put (Standing Order and there is a wide-range of excellent materials to No. 10(11)).
13WS Written Ministerial Statements11 JANUARY 2012 Written Ministerial Statements 14WS
to take a more proactive approach to tackling tenancy Written Ministerial fraud. This would free up valuable social homes that can then be allocated to those in greatest need. Statements There is a clear case for reform. Social housing is an enormously valuable national asset, providing essential support for millions: yet while there are over 1.8 million Wednesday 11 January 2012 households on social housing waiting lists, estimates of the number of social homes in England being unlawfully occupied range from 50,000 to 160,000. The National Fraud Authority estimates that tenancy fraud costs TREASURY £900 million per year. Replacing these unlawfully occupied social homes—to house those who have effectively been Equitable Life Payment Scheme displaced by those who commit tenancy fraud—would cost several billion pounds. Most forms of tenancy fraud are civil matters rather The Financial Secretary to the Treasury (Mr Mark than criminal offences. This means that while abusing a Hoban): The Treasury can confirm that the Equitable social tenancy can be extremely lucrative, the consequences Life payment scheme is making high volumes of automated for those caught breaking the rules tend to be relatively payments—10,000 this week alone. minor—in most proven cases the legal tenant is simply The Equitable Life payment scheme is due to make in required to give back the keys to a property in which the region of £1.5 billion worth of payments. This they do not live. Existing legislation does not allow for a represents a significant logistical exercise, which requires criminal prosecution for sub-letting or most other types complex systems to be established to not only make of tenancy fraud. payments but also respond to the resultant policyholder In addition to the lack of an effective deterrent, queries. The Government met their commitment to tenancy fraud investigators argue that they do not have start making payments by the middle of last year and sufficient investigatory powers, meaning that they can high volumes of automated payments are now being only detect a fraction of the homes being unlawfully made. occupied. Recent Government investment has seen an Many thousands of payments a week are being made increase in the number of social homes being recovered, and the volume will continue to be ramped up. This but it is apparent that stronger measures need to be means that over the coming months hundreds of thousands considered. more eligible policyholders will receive their payment My proposals would introduce new legislation so that from the scheme. These payments will be made in social tenants who abuse their tenancies could be subject accordance with the recommendations of the Independent to criminal sanctions with a maximum penalty of a Commission on Equitable Life payments. The Treasury £50,000 fine and two years’ imprisonment. They would has also confirmed that the first payments to with-profits also allow for any profits made from tenancy fraud to annuitants have also commenced, and over 3,000 annuitants be confiscated, a restitutionary payment to be made to have already had their first payment issued. the landlord, and would give local authorities the power to prosecute for matters related to tenancy fraud. The scheme is making good progress in paying out the £500 million provided for this financial year by the We are also proposing to remove the discretion a 2010 spending review, and as part of the Government’s court has when it comes to evicting tenants of housing commitment to transparency, the scheme will be publishing associations who have been proven to have sub-let the a more detailed report on the scheme to date. This whole of their homes. This would bring housing association report will be made available via the scheme’s website in tenants into line with council tenants. I will also review the coming weeks. the “intention to return” defence often used by tenants, which has meant that a tenant can live away from the Eligible policyholders that have not received payment property for a substantial period of time, sometimes yet need not do anything—the scheme has policyholders’ years, and still maintain their tenancy by arguing in details from Equitable Life and the Prudential and will court that they intend to return to the home. contact all the eligible policyholders it can by June 2012 These proposals would be in addition to rather than at the latest. in place of the existing powers social landlords have, and in my view are sensible and practical measures that would rectify the anomalous situation whereby the incentive COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT to cheat the system is so much greater than both the risk of detection and the eventual penalty incurred. Social Housing EDUCATION National Curriculum in England (Information and The Minister for Housing and Local Government (Grant Communication Technology) Shapps): I announced in the Government’s housing strategy my intention to tackle social housing fraud and I am today launching a consultation that sets out my The Secretary of State for Education (Michael Gove): proposals in this area. These proposals would increase I am today announcing my intention to launch a the deterrent to tenants considering cheating the system, public consultation on my proposal that the national enable those who do to be detected more easily and curriculum programmes of study and associated attainment punished more severely, and encourage social landlords targets and assessment arrangements for information 15WS Written Ministerial Statements11 JANUARY 2012 Written Ministerial Statements 16WS and communication technology (ICT) in maintained the ICT programmes of study, attainment targets and schools in England should not apply from September assessment arrangements, it will represent an interim 2012. measure that will be effective from September 2012 There is a significant and growing base of evidence, until September 2014, when the outcomes of the national not least from Ofsted inspections, that demonstrates curriculum review will come into force. The status of that there are persistent problems with the quality and ICT within the school curriculum is currently being effectiveness of ICT education in schools. Evidence considered by the national curriculum review alongside indicates that recent curriculum and qualifications reforms that of all other national curriculum subjects (aside have not led to significant improvements in the teaching from English, mathematics, science and PE), and I will of ICT, and the number of students progressing to bring forward proposals later this year. further study in ICT-related subjects is in decline. The public consultation on this proposal will commence Furthermore, the ICT curriculum in its current form is shortly and run for 12 weeks. A consultation document viewed as dull and demotivating for pupils. Its teaching containing full details of this proposal and how interested may not equip pupils adequately for further study and parties can respond to the consultation will be published work, may leave them disenchanted or give rise to on the Department for Education website. Copies of negative perceptions that turn them off the subject that document will also be placed in the House Libraries. completely. At the same time we know that the demand for high-level technology skills is growing, and many employers in the IT industry are concerned that the way in which ICT is taught in schools is failing to inspire young people about the creative potential of ICT and ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL AFFAIRS the range of IT-related careers open to them. However, we also know that ICT teaching in schools can be done well. There are numerous positive examples Single Payment Scheme of schools that are leading the way in developing new and exciting visions for ICT, and of industry-led initiatives which are invigorating ICT teaching in schools. In order The Minister of State, Department for Environment, to facilitate more innovative ICT provision in schools, I Food and Rural Affairs (Mr James Paice): As explained am proposing to make provision under the 2002 Education in my statement of 8 November 2011, Official Report, Act to disapply the existing ICT programmes of study column 12WS, one of the performance indicators I set and attainment targets at all four key stages, and the the Rural Payments Agency (RPA) for the 2011 single associated statutory assessment arrangements at key payment scheme (SPS) was to pay 78% of the total stage 3, from September 2012. estimated fund value to a minimum of 86% of eligible Under this proposal ICT would remain a compulsory claimants by the end of December 2011. I can now subject within the national curriculum, subject to the confirm to the House that those figures were reached outcomes of the national curriculum review. However, and exceeded. schools would be freed of the requirement to adhere to By the end of 31 December 2011, RPA had made the existing programmes of study, attainment targets payments totalling some £1.427 billion (82.5%) to and statutory assessment arrangements. 92,066 English farmers (87.8%). These figures represent By disapplying the ICT programme of study from the highest ever proportion of SPS payments made by September this year schools will be able to offer a more the agency in the opening month of the payment window. creative and challenging curriculum, drawing on support As such, it is a good example of the progress being and advice from those best positioned to judge what an made at RPA as it strives to deliver an improved level of ambitious and forward-looking curriculum should contain. service for English farmers in its administration of the I am encouraged by the work of subject organisations scheme. and others on how universities and business can develop The focus now is on validating the remaining claims high quality computer science qualifications. I am keen and making the related payments as soon as possible. I to explore how Government can continue to facilitate expect further progress in that regard over January, with this. a view to ensuring that the second SPS 2011 performance If, having listened to the views expressed in the public indicator (to have paid a minimum of 95% of both consultation and subject to the will of the House, I the eligible claimants and the total estimated value by decide to proceed with the proposed disapplication of the end of March 2012) is also met. 249W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 250W
Service Compensation Scheme in (a) 2009-10 and (b) Written Answers to 2010-11; and if he will make a statement. [87138] Questions Mr Maude [holding answer 19 December 2011]: Lump sums payable under the Civil Service Compensation Scheme are recorded in the Notes to the Tuesday 10 January 2012 Resource Accounts for Cabinet Office: Civil Superannuation (which are available in the Library). [Continued from Column 248W] The resource accounts for 2010-11 will be published in early 2012. The figure for lump sums payable includes any additional pension lump sums payable as a result CABINET OFFICE of exits under the former compensation scheme terms.
Charity Commission: Public Appointments Deloitte: Government Departments Nicholas Soames: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Office when he expects to appoint a new Chairman of John Robertson: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Office pursuant to the answer of 14 November 2011, the Charity Commission. [89059] Official Report, columns 537-8W, on Government (a) (b) Mr Hurd: The current Chair of the Charity departments: Deloitte, what the net value and Commission’s term of office is due to end on 31 July individual value was of each of the Government 2012. The recruitment of a successor will begin shortly. contracts awarded to (i) Deloitte and (ii) associates of As a public appointment, the recruitment process will Deloitte since May 2010. [85945] be conducted in line with the requirements of the Commissioner for Public Appointments. Mr Maude: The following table summarises contracts that are listed on Contract Finder. The total Civil Servants: Redundancy potential value of these contracts exceeds £1.47 billion; actual net value will depend on usage, particularly of Mr Thomas: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet framework agreements. Further information is held by Office how much was paid in lump sums from the Civil individual Departments.
Supplier Procuring authority Contract Value (£)
Ingeus Deloitte Department for Work and Pensions Work Programme—CPA8 Scotland—Ingeus Deloitte 141,761,075 Ingeus Deloitte Department for Work and Pensions EnglishWork Programme—CPA16 West Yorkshire—Ingeus 75,893,060 Deloitte Ingeus Deloitte Department for Work and Pensions Work Programme—CPA5 North East—Ingeus Deloitte 111,509,095 Ingeus Deloitte Department for Work and Pensions Work Programme—CPA1 East of England—Ingeus Deloitte 117,887,335 Ingeus Deloitte Department for Work and Pensions Work Programme—CPA3 West London—Ingeus Deloitte 102,846,725 Ingeus Deloitte Department for Work and Pensions Work Programme—CPA2 East Midlands—Ingeus Deloitte 116,576,495 Ingeus Deloitte Department for Work and Pensions Work Programme—CPA6 North West—Merseyside, Halton, 107,089,660 Cumbria and Lancashire—Ingeus Deloitte Deloitte LLP Northern Ireland Audit Office Financial auditing services 264,000 Deloitte LLP Skills Funding Agency Cloud Readiness 120,000 Deloitte Humber NHS Foundation Trust Auditing services 1— Deloitte LLP Calderdale and Huddersfield NHS Internal audit services 1— Foundation Trust Deloitte LLP Fabrick Housing Group Auditing services 16,000,000 Deloitte LLP One Vision Housing Ltd Auditing services 25,000,000 Deloitte National Audit Office Accounting and auditing services 2,450,000 Deloitte MCS Ltd. Doncaster Metropolitan Borough Council Business and management consultancy and related services2 400,000,000 Deloitte LLP (local Audit Scotland Statutory audit services 2,439,000 authorities) Deloitte LLP (health Audit Scotland Statutory audit services 1,896,000 bodies) Deloitte LLP Coventry City Council Financial consultancy services2 20,000,000 Deloitte LLP University of Leeds Statutory audit services 1— Deloitte and Touche North Devon District Council Internal audit services 33,000,000 Public Sector Internal Audit Ltd Deloitte Herefordshire Council Auditing services2 3,000,000 Drivers Jonas Deloitte NHS Shared Business Services Ltd Property management services of real estate on a fee or 1— contract basis2 Deloitte LLP The Pensions Regulator Pension services2 1— Deloitte LLP The Pensions Regulator Business and management consultancy and related services21— Deloitte LLP Buying Solutions Computer-related professional services2 50,000,000 Deloitte LLP Buying Solutions Computer-related professional services2 50,000,000 Deloitte LLP Buying Solutions Computer-related professional services2 50,000,000 Deloitte LLP Buying Solutions Computer-related professional services2 50,000,000 251W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 252W
Supplier Procuring authority Contract Value (£)
Drivers Jonas Deloitte Swan Housing Association Ltd Architectural, construction, engineering and inspection 1— services2 1 No data 2 Framework agreements rather than individual contracts.
Departmental Civil Proceedings £
Mr Jenkin: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Case 1 5,937.05 Office which organisations that have received funding Case 2 632.22 from his Department have brought legal proceedings Case 3 283.33 against his Department in the last five years; which Case 4 10,000 such organisations were not successful in their actions; Case 5 362.37 and whether his Department (a) applied and (b) was Case 6 94,968.77 paid for costs in respect of such cases. [83881] Case 7 5,208.48 Case 8 133,689.52 Mr Maude: The information is not readily available Case 9 8,914.94 and could be obtained only at disproportionate cost. Case 10 21,935.33 Case 11 6,774.51 Departmental Judicial Review Case 12 571.50 Case 13 237,958.83 Mr Jenkin: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Costs were applied for in all five of the unsuccessful Office what applications for judicial review have been applications, were awarded in total or in part for all (a) made against his Department in the last five. Parliament and (b) since May 2010; whether each such application (i) succeeded, (ii) failed and (iii) remains Costs were ordered against the Department in pending; what legal costs were incurred by his respect of the two successful applications. Department for each such application; in each failed application whether he applied for costs against the Departmental Manpower applicant and whether they were (A) awarded and (B) paid; whether his Department (1) paid for and (2) Luciana Berger: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet offered to pay for the legal costs incurred by each such Office (1) how many people were working in his applicant; and what the total cost to the public purse Department on (a) 11 May 2010 and (b) 8 December was of payment of the legal costs for each such 2011; [87355] applicant. [80707] (2) how many people were working at No. 10 Downing street on (a) 11 May 2010 and (b) 8 Mr Maude: During the relevant period, Treasury December 2011. [87356] Solicitors has moved from paper to electronic record keeping. Records indicate that during the relevant time Mr Maude: The Prime Minister’s Office is an integral period, there have been 13 judicial review cases against part of the Cabinet Office and is included in the figures the Cabinet Office recorded on the electronic system for the Cabinet Office. and nine using the older recorded paper filing system. Our records report upon the position at the end of The additional information requested on cases held any given month and, on that basis, the number of staff using the older paper filing system could be obtained working in my Department is shown in the following only at disproportionate cost. table. The following information is provided in relation to the 13 applications for judicial review mentioned above. Prime Minister’s These 13 cases are comprised of: Cabinet Office total Office three cases where judicial review was threatened, but not At 31 May 2010 1,344 181 subsequently pursued, At 30 November 2,172 168 one case was withdrawn, 2011 five applications against the Department were unsuccessful, The rise in total headcount for the Cabinet Office two applications against the Department were successful, should be set in the context of machinery of one case was settled, government changes that took place during the two cases are either pending or awaiting an appeal (this intervening period resulting in the transfer of 1,187 includes one unsuccessful application which is being appealed). additional staff from other Government Departments The legal cost incurred for each, to date, for the into the Department. Cabinet Office is shown in the following table. (Fee notes are outstanding in many of these cases, the Departmental Temporary Employment figures do not include estimates for accruals, and in many cases the legal costs were split between several Jon Trickett: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Departments, as the case had multiple defendants. The Office how many temporary staff have been recruited figure given is for the Cabinet Office share of the costs to his Department between September and November where known.) 2011. [87965] 253W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 254W
Mr Maude: Cabinet Office recruited 25 temporary In addition, figures for the registered electorate may be employees during the period 1 September to inflated because people who have more than one address may 30 November 2011 of which 10 were graduate interns register in more than one place (e.g. students may register at and five were apprentices. parental and term-time addresses) and electoral registration officers vary in how quickly they remove people from the registers after they have moved away from an area or died. This Disadvantaged may lead to percentages of over one hundred per cent and can affect the comparability of figures across local authorities. Jon Trickett: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Ms Buck: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Office Office what representations his Department received what proportion of eligible households were registered from voluntary and community organisations on social for voting purposes in each English parliamentary exclusion. [88758] constituency in (a) 2009 and (b) 2010. [88350] Mr Hurd: I receive numerous representations from Mr Hurd: The information requested falls within the voluntary and community organisations that cover a responsibility of the UK Statistics Authority. I have wide range of topics. The information sought is not asked the authority to reply. available in the format requested and could be obtained only at disproportionate cost. Letter from Stephen Penneck, dated December 2011: As Director General for the Office for National Statistics, I Jon Trickett: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet have been asked to reply to your Parliamentary Question asking Office what discussions he had with external what proportion of eligible households were registered for voting purposes in each English parliamentary constituency in (a) 2009 organisations on social inequality between June and and (b) 2010 (88350). December 2011; and with which organisations any such ONS does not have the data required to answer your question. discussions took place. [88778] To calculate the requested proportion, both the number of households registered to vote and the number of households Mr Hurd: I meet with a wide range of stakeholders eligible to vote are required by parliamentary constituency. to discuss different policy priorities, including relating ONS collect data on the number of individuals who are to social inequalities. registered to vote in each English parliamentary constituency, The latest details available of meetings between but no data are collected on the number of households registered Ministers and external organisations are on the to vote. Cabinet Office website at: The Department for Communities and Local Government produce projections of the number of households at local http://www.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/resource-library/ministerial- authority level but these are not available by parliamentary gifts-hospitality-travel-and-meetings-external-organisations- constituency as they are based on the ONS subnational april-june population projections which are only available down to local authority level. Furthermore, any estimate of the number of Electoral Register households could only provide an approximation for the number of, households who are eligible to vote as some households where no one is eligible to vote will be included. Ms Buck: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Office what proportion of the eligible population was registered for voting purposes in each English local Employment: Private Sector authority in 2005-06; and what the percentage change in registration was between 2005-06 and 2010-11. Phil Wilson: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet [88349] Office what the net change in the number of private sector jobs was in each region in the third quarter of Mr Hurd: The information requested falls within the 2011. [87951] responsibility of the UK Statistics Authority. I have asked the authority to reply. Mr Hurd: The information requested falls within the Letter from Stephen Penneck, dated December 2011: responsibility of the UK Statistics Authority. I have asked the authority to reply. As Director General for the Office for National Statistics, I have been asked to reply to your Parliamentary Question asking Letter from Stephen Penneck dated December 2011: what proportion of the eligible population was registered for As Director General for the Office for National Statistics, I voting purposes in each English local authority in 2005-06; and have been asked to reply to your Parliamentary Question asking what the percentage change in registration was between 2005-06 what the net change in the number of private sector jobs was in and 2010 (88349). each region in the third quarter of 2011 (87951). The table shows the number of people aged 18 and over who The table below contains the non-seasonally adjusted were registered to vote in local government elections as a quarterly growth in private sector jobs between Q2 and Q3 2011. percentage of the estimated resident population aged 18 and over These figures are derived using total employment for each region for each local authority in England in 2006 and 2010. The and official regional public sector employment data. percentage change between these two time points is also given. Copies of the table have been placed in the House of Commons Private sector employment quarterly change by region 2011 Q2 to Library. 2011 Q3 Thousands The estimated resident population aged 18 and over is the closest available approximation of the population eligible to vote North West 23 in each English local authority. However, these figures should not North East -7 be interpreted as the electoral registration rate as the population eligible to vote excludes foreign citizens (from outside the British Yorkshire and The Humber -40 Commonwealth, Republic of Ireland and European Union) West Midlands 29 resident within the UK. East Midlands -7 255W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 256W
Private sector employment quarterly change by region 2011 Q2 to Unfortunately estimates of flows between sectors are not 2011 Q3 sufficiently reliable for measuring the number of people moving Thousands from the public sector into the private sector.
East of England London -26 Public Sector: Females London 40 South East -2 Jessica Morden: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet South West 31 Office pursuant to the answer of 14 December 2011, Wales 2 Official Report, column 760W, on private and public Scotland -3 sector: females, how many women who work in the Northern Ireland 4 public sector in Wales earn (a) below and (b) above Notes: £21,000; and how many women who earn above 1. Derived from LFS total regional employment estimates and public £21,000 have reached the top of their pay band. [87803] sector employment 2. Based on non-seasonally adjusted data. Mr Hurd: The information requested falls within the 3. Rounded to the nearest thousand. Source: responsibility of the UK Statistics Authority. I have Business Statistics Division, ONS asked the authority to reply. Letter from Stephen Penneck, dated 3 January 2012: Food: Prices As Director General for the Office for National Statistics, I have been asked to reply to your recent Parliamentary Question Laura Sandys: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet which was pursuant to the Answer of 14 December 2011, Official Office what estimate he has made of the proportion of Report, column 760W, on private and public sector: females, how November 2011’s inflation rate which can be attributed many women who work in the public sector in Wales earn (a) below and (b) above £21,000; and how many women who earn to the rising cost of food. [88327] above £21,000 have reached the top of their pay band. (87803) Annual levels of earnings are estimated from the Annual Mr Hurd: The information requested falls within the Survey of Hours and Earnings (ASHE), carried out in April each responsibility of the UK Statistics Authority. I have year, and are provided for all employees on adult rates of pay asked the authority to reply. who have been in the same job for more than a year. ASHE Letter from Stephen Penneck, dated December 2011: methodology cannot be used to provide estimates of the numbers of employees whose earnings is less than a specific amount, but As Director General for the Office for National Statistics can be used to provide estimates of percentage of employees in (ONS), I have been asked to reply to your recent Parliamentary that category. Question asking what estimate has been made of the proportion of November 2011’s inflation rate which can be attributed to the In April 2011, 58 per cent of all female employees working in rising cost of food (88327). the public sector in Wales earned less than £21,000 and 42 per cent earned above £21,000. The consumer prices index (CPI) 12-month rate stands at 4.8 per cent for November. Food, excluding non-alcoholic ONS does not collect data on employees that have reached the beverages, contributed 0.37 percentage points or around 8 per top of their pay band. cent of this total. Public Sector: Morale You may be interested to know that this data is available for high level series in table 11 of the detailed briefing tables on our website. The tables for November can be found at: Jo Swinson: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Office what recent assessment he has made of the level http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/cpi/consumer-price-indices/ november-2011/consumer-price-indices--detailed-briefing- of morale among public sector workers. [88718] note.pdf Mr Maude: The Cabinet Office does not collect Job Creation: Private Sector information on the level of morale among all public sector workers. The Cabinet Office carries out an annual survey of Frank Dobson: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet staff attitudes across the civil service. The high-level Office how many of the additional jobs in the private results of the 2011 Civil Service People Survey were sector in 2010-11 were transfers from the public sector; published on the civil service website on and what the equivalent figure is for 2011 to date. 23rd November 2011: [87521] http://www.civilservice.gov.uk/about/improving/employee- engagement-in-the-civil-service/people-survey-2011 Mr Hurd: I have been asked to reply on behalf of the Department for Work and Pensions. Public Sector: Pensions The information requested falls within the responsibility of the UK Statistics Authority. I have Bill Esterson: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet asked the authority to reply. Office what plans he has to meet representatives of Letter from Stephen Penneck, dated December 2011: public sector staff to discuss proposed changes to their pensions. [86056] As Director General for the Office for National Statistics, I have been asked to reply to your Parliamentary Question asking how many of the additional jobs in the private sector in 2010-11 Mr Maude: The Chief Secretary to the Treasury, the were transfers from the public sector; and what the equivalent right hon. Member for Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch and figure is for 2011 to date (87521). Strathspey (Danny Alexander), and I have been jointly Estimates of labour market flows, that is, the measurement of leading discussions with a TUC delegation, as people moving between different labour force categories, are representatives of public sectors workers, since derived from Labour Force Survey (LFS) longitudinal datasets. February 2011. 257W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 258W
I refer the hon. Member to the Chief Secretary to the Public Sector: Trade Unions Treasury’s statement to the House on 20 December 2011, Official Report, columns 1201-17, regarding 2011 Priti Patel: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet the conclusion of public sector pension talks. Office pursuant to the answer of 6 December 2011, Official Report, column 272W, on public sector: trade Public Sector: Procurement union officials, when he expects the consultation to commence; whether the consultation will be open to the general public; when he expects to publish his Jon Trickett: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet recommendations for change to be included in the Office whether he plans to review the level of private consultation document; and when he expects a new sector involvement in the procurement of public framework for facility time to be implemented. [86325] services; and if he will make a statement. [88775] Mr Maude: The Government intend to commence Mr Maude: The Government are committed to consultation in the new year with civil service trade implementing best practice throughout public sector unions on facility time. procurement. To that end, I recently announced a package of measures that will change how Government Third Sector buys from the private sector, to support business and promote growth. Jon Trickett: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet In implementing these measures, we will provide an Office what visits (a) he and (b) Ministers in his open door for current and future suppliers to discuss Department made to voluntary and community upcoming procurement opportunities; we will publish organisations in each month between June and rolling medium-term pipelines of procurement December 2011. [88785] opportunities (pipelines for ICT, facilities Mr Hurd: As the Minister for Civil Society, I management, construction and infrastructure are frequently visit voluntary and community sector already online); and we will work with industry to organisations across all regions of the country. I also identify and address any key capabilities needed to host regular meetings with various organisations as meet future demand. well as continuing the practice of inviting all MPs to In addition, we have implemented a two-way bring local voluntary sector organisations to the commercial interchange pilot programme with industry Cabinet Office for meetings. Between June and to bring private sector expertise into government and December, I have visited over 35 such organisations in interchange with our procurers who will benefit from the UK. experience of private sector best practices. The latest details of meetings between Cabinet Office Ministers and external organisations are available on Jon Trickett: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet the Cabinet Office website at: Office if he will publish information on how his http://www.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/resource-library/ministerial- Department intends to break down public service gifts-hospitality-travel-and-meetings-external-organisations- procurement contracts into smaller contracts and april-june ensure that voluntary and community organisations benefit from any such activity. [88776] Trade Unions
Mr Maude: The decision to break up contracts into Jonathan Edwards: To ask the Minister for the lots has to be taken on a case by case basis. In this Cabinet Office what meetings he had with respect, the Cabinet Office will work with Departments representatives of trades unions in 2011. [87544] to look at their future contract pipelines to see what Mr Maude: Details of ministerial meetings with can or should be broken down. external organisations are published on the Cabinet From January 2012 Departments will be introducing Office website at: Lean procurement techniques to both speed up http://www.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/resource-library/ministerial- Government procurement and drive greater value. This gifts-hospitality-travel-and-meetings-external-organisations will include greater focus on pre-procurement activities including looking at opportunities to break contracts Voluntary Work: Young People down to ensure that SMEs, and voluntary and community organisations can compete for more Mr Thomas: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Government contracts. Office what estimate he has made of the proportion of young people eligible to take part in National Citizens Public Sector: Stress Service pilots who have taken part in such pilots; and if he will make a statement. [87957]
Jo Swinson: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Mr Hurd: Approximately 8,400 young people took Office what recent assessment has been made of the part In the first National Citizen Service pilots in 2011. rates of (a) stress, (b) depression and (c) anxiety In August 2011 there were an estimated 619,000 disorders among public sector workers. [88708] 16-year-olds in England. In 2012, there will be 30,000 places on National Citizen Service and in 2013 there Mr Maude: The Cabinet Office does not collect the will be 60,000 places. The Government are committed information requested for the public sector. With to expanding the number of places available every year regard to the civil service, this is a matter which is in order for an increasing proportion of 16-year-olds to delegated to individual Departments to determine. be able to take part in National Citizen Service. 259W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 260W
Mr Thomas: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet of their own development and engagement with the Office what estimate he has made of the number of community but it is for them to decide which young people from hard-to-reach families eligible to organisations they wish to work with. take part in National Citizens Service pilots that have The Department is also continuing to provide core taken part in such pilots. [87958] funding to the Citizenship Foundation to enable it to continue its work to help build a culture of giving in Mr Hurd: Officials are currently working with the schools through its Go-Givers programme, for primary independent evaluation team to compile data on the age school children, and Giving Nation Challenge numbers, profile and background of young people programme aimed at secondary schools. taking part in NCS in 2011. This information will be published as part of the independent research findings Wales in February 2012. Jonathan Edwards: To ask the Minister for the Mr Thomas: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Cabinet Office how many posts in Wales in Office what assessment he has made of the (a) departments which are the responsibility of the UK socio-economic background, (b) gender and (c) Government there were on 5 May (a) 2010 and (b) region of residence of participants in the National 2011; and what estimate he has made of the number of Citizens Service; if he will publish the results of that such posts in (i) 2012, (ii) 2013 and (iii) 2014. [88440] assessment; and if he will make a statement. [87959] Mr Hurd: The information requested falls within the responsibility of the UK Statistics Authority. I have Mr Hurd: Officials are currently compiling data on asked the authority to reply. the numbers, profile and background of young people Letter from Stephen Penneck, dated January 2012: taking part in NCS in 2011. This information will be published as part of the independent research findings As Director General for the Office for National Statistics, I have been asked to reply to your recent Parliamentary Question in February 2012. concerning how many posts in Wales, in departments which are the responsibility of the UK Government, there were on 5 May Jon Trickett: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet (a) 2010 and (b) 2011; and what estimate he has made of the Office what assessment he has made of the (a) social number of such posts in (i) 2012, (ii) 2013 and (iii) 2014. 88440 and (b) ethnic backgrounds of those who participated Estimates of regional Civil Service employment are published in the National Citizen Service in 2011. [88768] annually by the Office for National Statistics on the National Statistics website. The data available refer to the survey reference Mr Hurd: Officials are currently compiling data on dates as at 31 March 2010 and 31 March 2011. the numbers, profile and background of young people The number of people employed in Wales by home Civil taking part in NCS in 2011. This information will be Service departments, excluding Welsh Government and Estyn, published as part of the independent research findings was 29,254 in 2010 and 27,581 in 2011. in February 2012. The Office for National Statistics is unable to provide forecasts for future years. Jon Trickett: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Office whether he has any plans to encourage representatives from voluntary and community JUSTICE organisations to visit schools and further education Chief Coroner colleges to raise awareness of volunteering amongst students. [88782] Mr Jim Murphy: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice what estimate he has made of the likely cost to Mr Hurd: Promoting social action amongst all age the public purse per annum of the post of Chief groups, including volunteering, is a key part of the Coroner. [87857] Government’s vision for the Big Society. The Giving White Paper, published in May 2011, Mr Djanogly: We are still in discussions with the outlined a number of measures that will support the judiciary about the implementation of the office, creation of a culture of giving both time and money including whether the Chief Coroner will be a High among all age groups. These include over £40 million of Court judge or a Circuit judge and what support he or funding over the next two years to support she will require, which will determine the annual volunteering, giving and volunteering infrastructure by running costs. way of the Social Action Fund, Challenge Prizes and Bail and Accommodation Support Service: Thanet Local Infrastructure Fund. Furthermore there is £1 million to support Youthnet which runs the Laura Sandys: To ask the Secretary of State for volunteering website: Justice whether his Department has let any contracts www.do-it.org.uk for (a) approved premises and (b) bail accommodation and support services for the Through National Citizen Service we are providing re-homing of ex-offenders in Thanet. [88519] support to young people to participate in .a programme of personal and social development Mr Blunt: The information is as follows: culminating in a social action project which they design (a) I can confirm that there are no approved premises in and deliver in their local area. This rewarding Thanet. experience has awakened in many an interest in (b) The contract for the bail accommodation and support contributing to the life of their community through service is a national contract. I can confirm that there is no voluntary activity. Schools also encourage their pupils property for this service available in my hon. Friend’s to participate in activities in and out of school, as part constituency. 261W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 262W
Contempt of Court: Non-Molestation Orders The arrests collection held by the Home Office covers arrests for recorded crime (notifiable offences) only, broken down at a main offence group level, Mrs Grant: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice covering categories such as violence against the person, (1) what arrangements his Department makes to record sexual offences and robbery. From these centrally the numbers of (a) convictions, (b) prosecutions and reported categories it is not possible to separately (c) arrests for an offence of contempt of court where identify offences relating to breaches of non- the offence related to a breach of the terms of a molestation orders. Offences of contempt of court are non-molestation injunction order; [88133] summary offences and do not form part of the arrests (2) how many (a) convictions and (b) prosecutions collection. for offences of contempt of court where the offence There are currently no plans to record the number of related to a breach of the terms of a non-molestation arrests for breaches of the terms of non-molestation injunction order there were in each year since 2001; orders. [88138] The offence of breaching a non-molestation order (3) how many (a) convictions and (b) prosecutions under section 42A of the Family Law Act 1996 as for breach of a non-molestation injunction order there added by section 1 of the Domestic Violence Crime were in each year since 2005. [88139] and Victims Act 2004 states: sub-section (3) where a person is convicted of an offence under this section in Mr Blunt: Information on proceedings and findings respect of any conduct, that conduct is not punishable of guilt are routinely collected by the individual as a contempt of court; and (4) a person cannot be magistrates courts and the Crown court. This convicted of an offence under this section in respect of information is then collated centrally to provide an any conduct which has been punished as a contempt of overall picture for England and Wales. However, as in court. the answer I previously gave on 16 November 2010, The number of defendants proceeded against at Official Report, column 669W, there were issues in the magistrates courts and found guilty at all courts for central recording of offences resulting from a breach of breach of a non-molestation order in England and a previously imposed court order. These issues have Wales in 2009 and 2010 (latest available) can be viewed now been resolved allowing information on in the table. prosecutions and convictions for breach of a non- Annual court proceedings data for 2011 are planned molestation order to be collated from 2009 onwards. for publication in the spring of 2012.
Number of defendants proceeded against at magistrates courts and found guilty at all courts for breach of a non-molestation order1, England and Wales, 2009 and 20102, 3 Proceeded against Found guilty5
20094 1,933 2,279 2010 2,257 2,626 1 Includes offences under Family Law Act 1996, S.42A as added by Domestic Violence, Crime and Victims Act 2004, s.1. 2 The figures given in the table on court proceedings relate to persons for whom these offences were the principal offences for which they were dealt with.Whena defendant has been found guilty of two or more offences it is the offence for which the heaviest penalty is imposed. Where the same disposal is imposed fortwoor more offences, the offence selected is the offence for which the statutory maximum penalty is the most severe. 3 Every effort is made to ensure that the figures presented are accurate and complete. However, it is important to note that these data have been extracted from large administrative data systems generated by the courts and police forces. As a consequence, care should be taken to ensure data collection processes and their inevitable limitations are taken into account when those data are used. 4 Following publication of Criminal Statistics, England and Wales, 2009 data have been revised. 5 Persons found guilty In a given year may exceed those proceeded against as a defendant may be prosecuted for a different offence at the magistrates courtfrom that which they are later found guilty of at the Crown court. Source: Justice Statistics Analytical Services—Ministry of Justice
Co-operatives working with Co-operatives UK on the support of mutuals and has had regular meetings with the Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Mutuals Taskforce, including the chair and vice chair. what steps (a) his Department and (b) those bodies The Ministry of Justice is actively exploring for which his Department is responsible are taking to opportunities to encourage public service mutuals mark UN Year of the Co-operative 2012; and if he will across its services. make a statement. [88600] Courts
Mr Kenneth Clarke: The Ministry of Justice will Sadiq Khan: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice work closely with Cabinet Office, the Mutuals what proportion of trial outcomes were (a) effective, Taskforce and Co-operatives UK to develop and (b) ineffective and (c) cracked in each year from 1997 celebrate the achievements of co-operative to 2010. [87925] organisations during the United Nations International Mr Djanogly: Table 1 provides the percentage of all Year of Co-operatives. listed trials that were recorded as either “cracked”, The Mutuals Taskforce recently indicated it will play “ineffective” or “effective” for each year from 2003 to a co-ordinating role for Government Departments to 2010 for the magistrates courts. Table 2 provides the support the International Year of Co-operatives, with same statistics for the Crown court from 1997 to 2010. Co-operatives UK leading the taskforce’s work in this Data prior to 2003 were not recorded for the area. The National Offender Management Service is magistrates courts and are therefore not available. 263W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 264W
Table 1. The magistrates court Proportion of listed trials which were “ineffective”, “cracked” or “effective”, England and Wales, 2003 to 2010 Ineffective trial Effective trial Ineffective trials rate Cracked trials Cracked trial rate Effective trials rate Total listings for trial Number Percentage Number Percentage Number Percentage
2003 177,485 52,179 29 67,103 38 58,203 33 2004 193,608 50,386 26 72,070 37 71,152 37 2005 182,500 39,634 22 67,193 37 75,673 41 2006 180,950 35,044 19 66,858 37 79,048 44 2007 189,830 35,150 19 72,565 38 82,115 43 2008 183,511 33,423 18 70,366 38 79,722 43 2009 179,858 33,609 19 68,080 38 78,169 43 2010 179,794 32,376 18 69,445 39 77,973 43 Note: Percentages may not sum to 100% due to rounding and those that would round to 0% have been given to one decimal place. Source: Cracked and ineffective trials monitoring form. Business information Division, HM Courts and Tribunals Service HM Courts and Tribunals Service Performance Database (OPT)
Table 2. The Crown court Proportion of listed trials which were “ineffective”, “cracked” or “effective”, England and Wales, 1997 to 2010 Ineffective trial Cracked trial Effective trial Ineffective trials rate Cracked trials rate Effective trials rate Total listings for trial Number Percentage Number Percentage Number Percentage
1997 54,233 15,063 28 16,760 31 22,410 41 1998 53,806 14,105 26 17,393 32 22,308 41 1999 50,791 12,444 25 16,502 32 21,845 43 2000 51,209 12,407 24 17,224 34 21,578 42 2001 52,041 12,556 24 17,877 34 21,608 42 2002 53,766 12,559 23 19,505 36 21,702 40 2003 52,066 11,311 22 19,820 38 20,935 40 2004 46,856 7,859 17 18,305 39 20,692 44 2005 38,244 5,216 14 14,575 38 18,453 48 2006 36,659 4,571 12 14,398 39 17,690 48 2007 37,285 4,511 12 15,507 42 17,267 46 2008 35,985 4,169 12 14,772 41 17,044 47 2009 39,262 4,926 13 16,437 42 17,899 46 2010 43,261 5,921 14 18,389 43 18,951 44 Note: Percentages may not sum to 100% due to rounding and those that would round to 0% have been given to one decimal place. Source: HM Courts and Tribunals Service CREST system
Tom Brake: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Service (HMCTS) is responsible for the year ended 31 what his policy is on the recommendation in the Civil March 2011 were as follows: Justice Council’s recent report on Access to Justice by Litigants in Person that the Personal Support Unit £ network should be extended to more courts across England and Wales. [87940] Crown court 2,080 High Court—regional 1,926 County courts 1,619 Mr Djanogly: The Ministry of Justice is currently considering the Civil Justice Council’s recent report Magistrates courts 1,323 and is also liaising with the Council on how best to take forward their recommendations for dealing with Costs comprise all judicial and administrative litigants in person, including those relating to the costs directly incurred by courts, including Personal Support Unit. accommodation. In addition HMCTS is responsible for the Mr Brady: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice operation of the High Court and Court of Appeal what estimate he has made of the average unit cost of a comprising the Royal Courts of Justice. The sitting day in each court for which his Department is management structure of the Royal Courts of responsible in the latest period for which figures are Justice and the complexity of cases heard make it available. [88344] difficult to attribute costs to the specific divisions comprising the Court of Appeal and High Court. As a Mr Djanogly: Cost is not available by individual result HMCTS does not evaluate average costs for the location but the average costs of a sitting day in the divisions and an overall Royal Courts of Justice courts for which Her Majesty’s Court and Tribunal average is not considered meaningful. 265W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 266W
Debt Collection The Ministry continues to recognise the importance of apprenticeships and has encouraged the use of Robert Flello: To ask the Secretary of State for modern apprenticeships among our current work force. Justice (1) when he expects to conclude his consultation We now have 1,700 trained apprentices working in the on proposals to protect people from aggressive bailiffs; Ministry and its constituent bodies. We intend to [87363] return to the provision of good quality apprenticeship opportunities as soon as we have recruitment needs to (2) what plans he has to bring forward legislative permit it. proposals to (a) consolidate and (b) reform laws relating to bailiffs. [87365] Departmental Equality
Mr Djanogly: We expect to consult on proposals to Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice protect people from aggressive bailiffs shortly. It will be what equality impact assessments his Department has a full public consultation which will run for 12 weeks. carried out since May 2010; and for what purpose in We will publish the Government response and our each case. [88587] intended next steps following a detailed analysis of the responses received to the consultation. Mr Djanogly: The Ministry of Justice (MOJ) considers equality issues in exercising its functions, to Robert Flello: To ask the Secretary of State for comply with equality legislation and to ensure it Justice how many meetings his Department had with understands how its activities will affect different bailiff organisations in the last 18 months; and what people. It provides information about this the (a) date and (b) attendance list was of each consideration in various ways. In the specified period, meeting. [87367] this information was sometimes published in the form of an equality impact assessment, although there has Mr Djanogly: The Ministry of Justice holds regular never been a legal requirement to produce such a meetings with bailiff organisations to discuss the document. development of policy proposals and the potential impact of new policy on the enforcement industry. HM Information about the number of such documents Courts and Tribunals Service holds regular meetings published by the MOJ is not held centrally and could with bailiff organisations that are contracted to enforce be obtained only at disproportionate cost. orders of the court. These meetings are used to Departmental Manpower monitor performance. Details of the meetings that have taken place in the last 18 months are provided in a table which has been deposited in the Library. Luciana Berger: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice how many people were working in his Defamation Bill: Draft Department on (a) 11 May 2010 and (b) 8 December 2011. [87341] Robert Flello: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice when he plans to publish his response to the Mr Kenneth Clarke: The Office of National Statistics report by the Joint Committee on the Draft (ONS) publishes the number of staff employed by Defamation Bill, HC 930-I. [87364] central Government Departments on a quarterly basis. The Ministry of Justice provides workforce reports for Mr Djanogly: We intend to publish the Government the ONS to meet common publication dates. response to the report of the Joint Committee as early The staff figures for the Ministry show that there as possible in the new year. were 78,620 employed as at 31 March 2010 and 74,560 employed on 30 September 2011 (the latest published Departmental Apprentices information). The staff numbers provided add together civil Mr Umunna: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice servants from the following: how many apprentices were employed by each public Ministry of Justice (excluding agencies), National Offender body for which his Department is responsible between Management Services, HM Courts and Tribunals Service, The (a) April 2010 and March 2011 and (b) April and Office of the Public Guardian, Scotland Office (for 31 March December 2011; and how many apprenticeships he 2010 only) and Wales Office (for 31 March 2010 only). expects each public body to sponsor between (i) January and March 2012 and (ii) April and March Departmental Recruitment 2013. [88735] Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Mr Kenneth Clarke: April 2010 to March 2011 and how much his Department spent on recruitment April 2011 to December 2011 were periods of major agencies in each month since September 2011. [87987] restructuring and downsizing in the Ministry of Justice. We were unable to run any external apprentice Mr Kenneth Clarke: The Ministry of Justice only recruitment campaigns as we did not have any commits to the use of temporary staff through vacancies which were suitable for apprenticeships recruitment agencies when there is an operational during this period. The Ministry aims to employ two necessity to do so. Recruitment agencies supply external apprentices in the period January to March contractors, interims and agency staff for a fee, which 2012. Officials are currently working with Civil Service includes the cost of the sourced labour and an element HR and Civil Service Learning to agree our for their administration. These external resources are commitment for the period April 2012 to March 2013 only sourced to meet skills, capacity and capability 267W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 268W shortages in frontline and business critical roles. They contacting each MOJ prison, court and office are deployed in temporary positions when it has been individually and asking them to check their records for established that there are no suitable internal resources any data on secondments during the relevant period. available. When doing so the Ministry ensures that it Each case would need to be investigated to identify the receives value for money and complies with source of the secondees, plus the purpose and the procurement legislation, HM Treasury’s rules and duration of each secondment. This would incur Cabinet Office Efficiency and Reform Group disproportionate cost. requirements. The amount of monies paid to recruitment agencies to cover their fees and costs for temporary staff, such as Departmental Temporary Employment agency (clerical and administrative) staff, interim managers, specialist contractors together with the fees Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice incurred for sourcing staff for the Ministry has how many temporary staff were recruited to his significantly reduced since 2009-10. They are over Department between September and November 2011. 50% less. For the months of September 2011 to [87986] November 2011 the monies spent is given in the following table. Mr Kenneth Clarke: Currently, a recruitment freeze is £ in place, which affects all external recruitment into the civil service, with exemptions allowed for business September 2011 5,159,768 critical and frontline posts. For the period September October 2011 4,886,987 to November 2011, the Ministry of Justice and its November 2011 5,651,547 agencies (National Offender Management Services, Note: HM Courts and Tribunal Service and the Office of All figures are inclusive of VAT. The above figures also include the Public Guardian) recruited a total of 297 temporary Ministry of Justice’s executive agencies. staff (fixed-term employees) into civil service posts. These figures amount to £15.69 million, which is less The majority of these fixed-term employees are junior than 3% of the total employee pay bill for this period. frontline staff. Departmental Redundancy Pay The Ministry both recruits people in line with the Civil Service Commissioners recruitment principles and is committed to recruitment on merit through fair Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice and open competition. how much redundancy pay was paid to civil servants in his Department in each month between September and November 2011. [87985] Domestic Violence, Crime and Victims Act 2004 Mr Kenneth Clarke: The Ministry of Justice (including National Offender Management Service, John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for HM Courts and Tribunal Service and the Office Justice (1) how many restraining orders under of Public Guardian) spent £1,924,475 on civil section 12 of the Domestic Violence, Crime and servant redundancies in the period between September Victims Act 2004 have been made by a court on its own and November 2011. The majority of those volition since September 2009; [87522] redundancies were at senior management levels (2) how many restraining orders under section 12 of (Grade 7 and above). the Domestic Violence, Crime and Victims Act 2004 The breakdown by month was £1,027,760 in have been breached since September 2009; and in how September 2011; £794,195 in October 2011; and many cases the breach led to a (a) prison sentence and £102,520 in November 2011. (b) fine; [87524] This does not include costs associated with the (3) how many people have been jailed for more than Ministry’s Voluntary Early Departure Scheme, which 12 months following a breach of a restraining order provides the same terms as Voluntary Redundancy under section 12 of the Domestic Violence, Crime and under the Civil Service Compensation Scheme. Victims Act 2004 since September 2009. [87525] Departmental Secondment Mr Blunt: The number of restraining orders imposed at all courts in England and Wales under Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State sections 5 and 5A of the Protection from Harassment for Justice what secondments there have been to his Act 1997 (as amended and inserted respectively by Department from (a) industry and (b) the third sector section 12 of the Domestic Violence, Crime and since May 2010; what the (i) purpose and (ii) duration Victims Act 2004) can be found in table 1 for the year is of each secondment; and whether each secondment 2009-10 (latest available). Centrally held data do not was to a policy development role. [86131] identify if a restraining order was imposed solely on the court’s volition. Mr Blunt: The data requested are not held comprehensively, centrally. Secondments can be agreed Table 2 provides information on the number of locally between managers and external organisations, restraining orders under sections 5 and 5A breached, and staff seconded into MOJ may remain on the by number fined and number given immediate custody. payroll of their own organisation. To answer the Annual court proceedings data for 2011 are planned question on the scale requested would require for publication in spring 2012. 269W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 270W
Table 1: Number of restraining orders issued at all courts under the Protection from Harassment Act 1997, England and Wales, 2009-101, 2 Description 2009 2010
Restraining Order Section 5 5,073 10,094 Restraining Order Section 5A3 0 647 1 The figures given in the table on court proceedings relate to persons for whom these offences were the principal offences for which they were dealt with. When a defendant has been found guilty of two or more offences, it is the offence for which the heaviest penalty is imposed. Where the same disposal is imposed for two or more offences, the offence selected is the offence for which the statutory maximum penalty is the most severe. 2 Every effort is made to ensure that the figures presented are accurate and complete. However, it is important to note that these data have been extractedfrom large administrative data systems generated by the courts and police forces. As a consequence, care should be taken to ensure data collection processes and their inevitable limitations are taken into account when those data are used. 3 Came into force 30 September 2009. Source: Justice Statistics Analytical Services: Ministry of Justice.
Table2: Number of defendants sentenced at all courts for breach of a restraining order issued under the Protection from Harassment Act 1997, by number fined and number given immediate custody, England and Wales, 2009-101, 2 2009 Sentence breakdown Of which: Immediate Up to and including 12 Description Sentenced Fined custody months Over 12 months Other sentence3
Breach of a restraining 1,329 141 457 430 27 731 order section 5 Breach of a restraining 00 0 0 0 0 order issued on acquittal section 5A4
2010 Sentence breakdown Of which: Immediate Up to and including Description Sentenced Fined custody 12 months Over 12 months Other sentence3
Breach of a 2,798 321 904 863 41 1,573 restraining order section 5 Breach of a 10 0 0 0 1 restraining order issued on acquittal section 5A4 1 The figures given in the table on court proceedings relate to persons for whom these offences were the principal offences for which they were dealt with. When a defendant has been found guilty of two or more offences, it is the offence for which the heaviest penalty is imposed. Where the same disposal is imposed for two or more offences, the offence selected is the offence for which the statutory maximum penalty is the most severe. 2 Every effort is made to ensure that the figures presented are accurate and complete. However, it is important to note that these data have been extracted from large administrative data systems generated by the courts and police forces. As a consequence, care should be taken to ensure data collection processes and their inevitable limitations are taken into account when those data are used. 3 Includes: absolute/conditional discharge; community sentence; suspended sentence and otherwise dealt with. 4 Came into force 30 September 2009. Source: Justice Statistics Analytical Services: Ministry of Justice.
John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for manual inspection of individual case files held by the Justice in how many cases has a defendant appealed the courts only at disproportionate cost. imposition of a restraining order under Section 12 of Statistics are published on the number of appeals the Domestic Violence, Crime and Victims Act 2004 received and dealt with against sentences in England since September 2009; and how many were upheld. and Wales, from 2006 to 2010, in the Ministry of [87523] Justice’s statistical bulletin “Judicial and Court Mr Djanogly: The Ministry of Justice holds Statistics”, the most recent edition of which was statistical information in relation to the number of published on 30 June 2011. The number of appeals appeals dealt with in the criminal courts (including the against sentences dealt with in the Crown court can be Crown court and the Criminal Division of the Court of found in table 4.10 and those dealt with in the Court of Appeal). However, central administrative databases for Appeal in table 7.6. The report is available on the courts do not store information on the number of these ministry’s website at: defendants who have challenged the imposition of a http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/statistics-and-data/ restraining order under section 12 of the Domestic courts-and-sentencing/judicial-annual.htm Violence, Crime and Victims Act 2004. While such appeals will be logged onto the John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for administrative computer systems used in the Crown Justice what training (a) police and (b) prosecutors court and the Court of Appeal, they cannot be receive in the implementation of section 12 of the distinguished from other types of appeals. As such, the Domestic Violence, Crime and Victims Act 2004. information requested can be obtained through the [87526] 271W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 272W
Nick Herbert: I have been asked to reply on behalf of article 6 ECHR for a police officer to serve on a jury. the Home Department. We therefore do not envisage bringing forward A Home Office circular on the implementation of legislative proposals in this area. section 12 was issued to all chief constables of police Fisheries: North West and chief crown prosecutors in September 2009. It is for the individual police forces to decide whether any specific training is required on section 12. The Mr Hanson: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice e-learning programme that is available to prosecutors how many people were prosecuted for illegal cockle and associate prosecutors on domestic violence has fishing in the North Western Inshore Fisheries and been updated to include information regarding the Conservation Authority area from May 2010 to implementation of section 12 of the Domestic 30 November 2011. [87375] Violence, Crime and Victims Act 2004 and is available on the Home Office Website. In addition to this Mr Blunt: The Ministry of Justice Court Proceedings training, the legal guidance on restraining orders has Database holds information on offences provided by been updated and circulated to all Crown Prosecution the statutes under which proceedings are brought but Service (CPS) staff. This is available on the CPS not all the circumstances of each case. It is not possible website. to identify from this centrally held information, of those proceedings under the Marine and Coastal Email Access Act 2009, those specifically related to the North Western Inshore Fisheries and Conservation Authority Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice area. what guidance his Department provides to Ministers, The Department for the Environment, Food and special advisers and officials on the use of personal Rural Affairs (DEFRA) advise that the management of email accounts to conduct official business. [88536] the cockle fishery is the responsibility of North Western Inshore Fishery and Conservation Authority Mr Kenneth Clarke: I refer the hon. Member to my (IFCA). The IFCA is responsible for the enforcement answer given on 17 October 2011, Official Report, of fishery byelaws in its waters. It is our understanding column 667W, to the hon. Member for Birmingham, that there have been no prosecutions for illegal cockle Erdington (Jack Dromey). fishing between May 2010 and November 2011 in this The Ministerial Code, the Code of Conduct for area. Special Advisers, and the Civil Service Code set out how Ministers, officials and special advisers should Harassment conduct Government business. Mr Llwyd: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice European Court of Human Rights how many police information notices or harassment warnings have been issued by each police force in Priti Patel: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice England and Wales in each of the last five years. with reference to the judgment of the European Court [87517] of Human Rights in the case of Hanif and Khan v. the United Kingdom, what his policy is on police officers Lynne Featherstone: I have been asked to reply on serving on juries. [88659] behalf of the Department for Justice. Mr Kenneth Clarke: Lord Justice Auld carefully The information requested is not recorded centrally. considered this issue in his ‘Review of the Criminal The Home Office launched a consultation in Courts of England and Wales’ (2001). He concluded November 2011 which seeks views on how we can that no-one should be automatically ineligible for jury protect victims of stalking more effectively, including service simply because of their job. He did not consider the use of police information notices. it likely that people who worked in the criminal justice system would unduly influence fellow jurors or bring Homicide: Life Imprisonment to bear any special degree of prejudice. His recommendations were implemented by the Criminal Rehman Chishti: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Act 2003, and additional safeguards were Justice what assessment he has made of the Homicide introduced following the House of Lords judgment in Review Advisory Group’s report on public opinion and R v. Abdroikof and others [2007] UKHL 37. the penalty for murder; and what assessment he has The Government are currently considering the made of the implications for his policy on mandatory decision in Hanif and Khan v. United Kingdom. life sentences of the recommendations in the report. [87810] Priti Patel: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice what assessment he has made of the judgment of the Mr Blunt: The Government remains of the view that European Court of Human Rights in the case of Hanif the offence of murder should be marked with the most and Khan v. the United Kingdom; and whether he has serious of sentences and it has no plans to abolish the any plans to bring forward legislative proposals in this mandatory life sentence for murder. area. [88660] Human Trafficking Mr Kenneth Clarke: The Government are currently considering the judgment, however the European Mr Clappison: To ask the Secretary of State for Court of Human Rights was very clear that they were Justice what the (a) nationality and (b) gender is of not deciding whether it is, in general, compatible with each suspected victim of trafficking referred to in the 273W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 274W
Trafficking Victim Support Scheme of the Salvation Referring Army in the last five years; in which parliamentary Nationality Gender Region organisation constituency each such case was located; and which agency referred each case to the scheme. [87546] Romanian Male West Midlands NHS Nigerian Female East NGO Mr Blunt: The Government-funded support service Slovakian Male Yorkshire NGO for adult victims of human trafficking in England and Slovakian Female Yorkshire NGO Wales administered by The Salvation Army Slovakian Male Yorkshire NGO commenced on 1 July 2011. The information provided Slovakian Female Yorkshire NGO in the following table covers the period 1 July to Slovakian Female Yorkshire NGO 15 December 2011. In the interests of victim safety, the Philippine Female South East Police region in which the victim was encountered is provided, Ghanaian Female South East Self-referral rather than the specific parliamentary constituency. Nigerian Female South East Self-referral Prior to the commencement of the current Thai Male South East Police arrangements, support services for adult victims of Ugandan Female South East Legal human trafficking were provided by the charities Eaves representative Housing for Women and Migrant Helpline. The Nigerian Female South East Legal requested information is not available for this period. representative Benin Female West Midlands NGO
Referring Nigerian Female South East Legal Nationality Gender Region organisation representative Sierra Leone Female South East NGO Nigerian Female South East NGO Ethiopian Female West Midlands Social services Slovakian Male South East NGO Nigerian Female South East NGO Hungarian Male West Midlands Police Nigerian Female South East Social services Vietnamese Male West Midlands Youth Justice Rwandan/ Female South East NGO UK Male West Midlands Police Ugandan Irish Male West Midlands Police Czech Male North West Police Romanian Female West Midlands NHS Czech Male North West Police Slovakian Male North West Police Czech Male North West Police Czech Male North West Police Hungarian Male South East NGO Lithuanian Male Yorkshire Police Brazilian/Italian Female South East NGO Lithuanian Male Yorkshire Police Russian Female South East UK Border Nigerian Female South East NGO Agency Czech Female South East Police Polish Female Yorkshire NGO Sierra Leone Female South East Police Indonesian Female South East UK Border Vietnamese Female East Midlands Legal Agency representative Lithuanian Male North West Police Lithuanian Female South East Police Lithuanian Male North West Police Kenyan Female South East Police Albanian Female South East NGO Togolese Female South East NGO Indonesian Female North West Police UK Male East Police Hungarian Female Yorkshire Self-referral UK Male East Police Lesotho Female South East NGO Romanian Female South East Police Lithuanian Female South East NGO Romanian Female South East NGO Romanian Female West Midlands NHS Nigerian Female East UK Border Agency Romanian Female South East NHS Albanian Female South West Legal Polish Male Yorkshire NGO representative Slovakian Female^ South West Social services Nigerian Female South East Prison service Slovakian Male North West Police Sri Lankan Female Yorkshire NGO Romanian Female South East NGO Indian Male West Midlands Police Nigerian Female South East Prison service Ugandan Female South East Legal representative Slovakian Male Yorkshire NGO Lithuanian Male South East Police Slovakian Male Yorkshire NGO Lithuanian Male South East Police UK Male East Police Romanian Female South West Police UK Male East Police Romanian Female South East Police Polish Male East Police Nigerian Female South East Self-referral Polish Male East Police Czech Male Yorkshire Police UK Male East Police Ugandan Female South East Police Polish Male East Police Ghanaian Female South East Legal UK Male East Police representative Latvian Male East Police Chinese Male East Police Polish Male East Police Polish Female South East Police UK Male East Police Nigerian Female South East Legal representative UK Male East Police Nigerian Female North East NGO Lithuanian Male East Police Romanian Female West Midlands NHS UK Male East Police 275W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 276W
Referring Referring Nationality Gender Region organisation Nationality Gender Region organisation
UK Male East Police Vietnamese Female North West Legal representative UK Male East Police Romanian Male South East Police Nigerian Female South East Prison service Slovakian Male Yorkshire NGO Nigerian Female South East Police Romanian Male South East Social services Slovakian Male Yorkshire NGO Romanian Male South East Social services Slovakian Male Yorkshire NGO Romanian Male South East Social services Slovakian Male Yorkshire NGO Albanian Female South West UK Human Polish Male Yorkshire Social services Trafficking Czech Male Yorkshire NGO Centre Czech Female South East Self-referral Guinean Female South East UK Border Agency Polish Male Yorkshire NGO Slovakian Female South East NGO Polish Male Yorkshire NGO Polish Male Wales NGO Hungarian Male South East Police Nigerian Female South East Social services Hungarian Male South East Police Ugandan Female South East UK Border Hungarian Male South East Police Agency Hungarian Male South East Police Ghanaian Female East NGO Czech Male West Midlands Police Ugandan Female South East NGO Slovakian Male South East Police Albanian Female South East Legal representative Romanian Female South East Police Guinean Female East Prison service Nigerian Female South East Police Chinese Female Yorkshire NHS Nigerian Female Wales Legal representative Romanian Female Yorkshire Police Romanian Female West Midlands NHS Polish Male Yorkshire NGO Polish Male Yorkshire NGO Romanian Male West Midlands NHS Polish Male Yorkshire NGO Chinese Female South West NGO Italian Female Yorkshire NGO Romanian Female West Midlands Police Nigerian Male South East NGO Vietnamese Male South East Legal representative Polish Male Yorkshire NGO Ghanaian Female South East NGO Polish Male South East NGO Slovakian Male Yorkshire NGO Slovakian Female Yorkshire Police Vietnamese Female South East Police Nigerian Female Yorkshire NGO Romanian Female South East NGO Nigerian Female Yorkshire NGO Romanian Female South East Police Sri Lankan Female South East NGO Albanian Female South East Self-referral Romanian Female South East Police Ghanaian Female South East Self-referral Chinese Female South East UK Human Trafficking Slovakian Male South East NGO Centre Slovakian Female South East NGO Malawi an Female South East Legal Chinese Female South East Social services representative Lithuanian Male South East NGO Polish Female South West Police Hungarian Male South East Police Nigerian Female East UK Border Nigerian Female South East UK Human Agency Trafficking Latvian Female South West Police Centre Slovakian Male Yorkshire Police Nigerian Female East Self-referral Nigerian Female East NGO Nigerian Female South East Self-referral Cameroon Female South East NGO Bangladeshi Female South East NGO Polish Male Yorkshire NGO Chinese Female East Police Vietnamese Male South East Social services Hungarian Female East Midlands Police Albanian Female Wales Legal Polish Male Yorkshire NGO representative Chinese Male South East NGO Vietnamese Female London Social services Latvian Female North West Police UK Female London NGO Latvian Female North West Police Hungarian Female Leicestershire Police Albanian Female South East Social services Romanian Female London Police Romanian Female South East NGO Vietnamese Female West Midlands Legal representative South African Female South East NHS Czech Male Manchester NGO Nigerian Female South East NGO Slovakian Male North West Police St Lucian Female South East Police Czech Female North West Police Jamaican Female South East Social services UK Male East Police Ugandan Female South East Police UK Male West Midlands Media Ghanaian Female South East NGO Nigerian Female London Legal Guinean Female Yorkshire NGO representative Ugandan Female Wales UK Border Ugandan Female London NGO Agency Latvian Female South West Police 277W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 278W
Non-Governmental Organisations Referring Nationality Gender Region organisation Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Polish Male South West NGO how much direct funding of £100,000 or more his Polish Female South West NGO Department provided to each partner organisation (a) Romanian Female West Midlands Police 2010-11 and (b) 2011-12; and if he will make a Polish Male Yorkshire NGO statement. [87932] Albanian Female West Midlands UKBA Somali Female South East Social services Mr Kenneth Clarke: The Department has provided Not known Female South East Self-referral funding of £100,000 or more to each of the following Romanian Female West Midlands NHS arm’s length bodies for the periods (a) 2010-11 and Albanian Female Yorkshire UK Border (b) 2011-2012. Agency Equatorial Female East NGO Guinean/ £ million Spanish Name of the arm’s length body 2010-11 2011-12
Youth Justice Board 418.0 393.9 Information Commissioner Criminal Injuries Compensation 278.0 202.2 Authority Parole Board 10.2 10.0 Robert Flello: To ask the Secretary of State for Administrative Justice and 1.3 0.7 Justice what assessment he has made of the savings Tribunal Council required to be made by the Information Commissioner Official Solicitor and Public 5.0 5.2 to meet the budgets for 2011-12. [87464] Trustee Judicial Office 14.2 19.5 Mr Djanogly: The Information Commissioner’s HM Chief Inspectorate if 3.8 3.6 Office is funded by two streams of income. Data Prisons HM Chief Inspectorate of 4.0 3.8 protection work is funded by notification fees paid by Probation Data Controllers. Freedom of information work is Criminal Cases Review 6.5 6.1 funded by grant in aid from the Ministry of Justice. Commission For the financial year 2011-12 there will be a Independent Monitoring 2.8 2.5 £0.7 million reduction in grant-in-aid, which forms Boards Office of the Information 6.4 4.6 part of a four-year projected profile to make savings Commissioner required by the Department over the course of the Judicial Appointments 6.86 5.5 current spending review. Commission Judicial Appointments and 0.6 0.5 Japan Tobacco Conduct Ombudsman Law Commission 3.8 3.2 Legal Services Commission 2,229.3 2,251.4 Mr Hain: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Prisons and Probation 5.7 5.5 whether any (a) Ministers and (b) special advisers in Ombudsman his Department have received hospitality from Japan Sentencing Council for England 1.8 1.6 Tobacco International since May 2010. [87601] and Wales Commissioner for Victims and 1.4 1.1 Witnesses Mr Kenneth Clarke: Information about hospitality received by Ministers and special advisers is published The Department has also provided funding of quarterly by Departments. Information for the period £100,000 or more to each of the following executive 13 May 2010 to 30 June 2011 can be accessed on agencies for the periods (a) 2010-11 and (b) 2011- departmental websites. Information for 1 July onwards 2012. will be published in due course. £ million Legal Aid Scheme: Social Security Benefits Name of the executive agency 2010-11 2011-12
Mr Slaughter: To ask the Secretary of State for National Offender 3,821.2 3,621.6 Justice what discussions he has had with (a) the Management Department for Work and Pensions and (b) other Her Majesty’s Courts 1,109.0 1,193.7 and Tribunals Service Departments on the effect on welfare reform of Office of the Public (1.6) (0.5) removing welfare benefits from the scope of legal aid. Guardian [87913] The figures given above are total resource budget. Mr Djanogly: Extensive discussions were held with Figures for 2010-11 are based on the final outturn. The other Government Departments as part of both the 2011-12 figures are based on the resource budget policy development and clearance processes, and these allocation as at 31 October 2011, so may vary discussions considered potential effects. Ultimately the depending on actual expenditure and the Ministry’s effects of the changes will be determined by priorities. behavioural responses to them. MOJ is currently The Office of the Public Guardian receives more considering a number of options that could contribute income than its expenditure. This is reflected in the to monitoring the impact of the reforms on clients. organisation’s budget. 279W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 280W
Offenders: Compensation prison, (b) a young offender institution and (c) a secure training centre by main budget heading for the Sadiq Khan: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice (i) public and (ii) contracted sector. [86287] what the average compensation paid by offenders was in (a) magistrates’ courts and (b) Crown courts from Mr Blunt: The information is as follows. 1997 to 2010. [87931] Adult prison and Youth Offender Institution The following table provides average annual cost per Mr Djanogly: Her Majesty’s Courts Service does not prisoner in England and Wales for adult prisons and hold centrally the average compensation paid by Young Offender Institutions (YOI), split by ages 15-21 offenders. This data could be provided only at and 15-17, for the financial year 2010-11 at public and disproportionate cost as it would require a manual private sector prisons. search of all fine accounts. Cost per prisoner by adult/YOI and public/private, 2010-11 £ Offenders: Expenditure Prison category Public Private
John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for Adult 35,702 34,864 Justice what his most recent estimate is of the average YOI (ages 15-21) 46,887 n/a cost per year of keeping an offender in (a) an adult YOI (ages 15-17) 73,885 86,961
Breakdown by main budget headings £ Adult YOI Public Private Public (15-21) Public (15-17) Private (15-17)
Direct costs Payroll 19,398 35 26,638 43,485 483 Non pay 7,349 32,607 8,601 13,965 84,402 Income -1,957 0 -1,451 -1,440 0 24,790 32,642 33,788 56,010 84,885
Allocated and apportioned costs Accommodation related 3,380 147 4,500 5,042 0 Central costs1 5,578 122 6,645 10,879 122 Prisoner Escort and 1,954 1,954 1,954 1,954 1,954 Custody Service 10,912 2,223 13,099 17,874 2,075
Total 35,702 34,864 46,887 73,885 88,961 1 Includes Shared Services Centre, IT, head quarters, restructure costs, etc. Notes: 1. The overall average costs comprise the direct local establishment costs of public and private prisons, increased by an apportionment of relevant costs borne centrally and in the regions by NOMS (as recorded in the addendum to the National Offender Management Service Agency 2010-11 annual report and accounts). This involves some estimation. Expenditure which is met by other Government Departments or directly by the Youth Justice Board, such as expenditure on health and education, is not included. Expenditure recharged to the Youth Justice Board in respect of young people is included. 2. The costs represent the total cost per prisoner at each prison where the majority use at the end of the year was as adult prison, YOI (aged 15-17) or YOI (aged 15-21). There is no adjustment for prisons holding prisoners of more than one category. 3. A split of the YOI (aged 15-21) category to show unit cost information for under-18 juveniles only within those establishments is not available. Furthermore, there are no private YOI establishments that house prisoners in the aged 15-21 category. 4. The public sector and private sector costs are not directly comparable because of differences in accounting treatment and scope of services.
Secure Training Centre Mr Blunt: The Ministry of Justice is working with The cost of a place in a secure training centre for other Government Departments to co-design payment 2011-12 is £170,000. This is the price as at 1 April 2011 by results approaches aimed at achieving shared and does not include VAT. The Youth Justice Board priorities. calculates these costs based upon full occupancy and Two pilots testing the addition of a re-offending does not calculate the costs per prisoner. The cost is outcome into the Department for Work and Pensions’ not broken down by budget heading as the financial Work Programme are due to begin in summer 2012. mechanism aggregates the full cost of the provision into the price charged to the Youth Justice Board. The Ministry of Justice is also working with the Offenders: Rehabilitation Department for Health and the Home Office to implement a further eight projects, aimed at Robert Flello: To ask the Secretary of State for incentivising drug and alcohol recovery, and including Justice when he expects to complete his work on a reducing re-offending outcome. These projects will co-design of the payment by results model. [87362] begin in April 2012. 281W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 282W
Police: Crimes of Violence with a learning disability, both to carry out work and to understand the terms of employment in prison; and Philip Davies: To ask the Secretary of State for if he will make a statement; [88752] Justice what the highest number was of previous (2) what representations he has received on (a) the convictions for assault on a police constable for an availability of support to offenders to carry out work individual convicted of an offence of assault on a and (b) to understand the terms of employment in police constable without being sent to prison in each of prison; and if he will make a statement. [88753] the last three years; and how many offences that individual had committed in total at the point of Mr Blunt: Ministers regularly receive representations sentence for this offence. [84545] from interested parties on matters pertaining to support for work for offenders in prison. For example, Mr Blunt: The table shows the highest number of several peers and representatives of Mencap met Lord previous convictions for assault on a police constable, McNally in December and discussed such issues. for individuals convicted of this offence in the years Information, advice and guidance is offered to 2008 to 2010 who received a sentence other than prisoners in England and Wales to support them in immediate custody. It also shows their total number of making effective choices regarding employment and previous cautions and convictions. Although these work based learning both in prison and upon release. individuals did not go to prison for their index offence, Prisoners receive induction and on-going training, they have all previously been to prison for the same supervision and support in the work place undertaken offence. Assault on a police constable is a summary by prison officers and/or workshop instructors and in only offence and the sentencing guidelines indicate that some cases, peer mentors. In many prison work places a non-custodial sentence, including a fine, would be industry recognised qualifications are delivered. Work appropriate where no injury is caused. place induction will cover the terms and conditions of The figure for 2008 is for a male whose first caution employment. Any on-going queries or concerns or conviction was in 1949. When looking at their regarding terms and conditions can be addressed previous offences by offence category 45% were for through local complaints and applications procedures. summary offences excluding motoring which includes In addition, as regards prisoners with, learning the offence of assault on a constable. difficulties and disabilities (LDD), NOMS has strong The figure for 2009 is for a male whose first caution policies based around equal opportunities and treating or conviction was in 1979. When looking at their all prisoners equally and with respect, and works in previous offences by offence category 55% of the partnership with other, specialist organisations to previous offences were for summary offences excluding continually seek to improve the services provided to motoring which includes the offence of assault on a prisoners. For example working jointly with the constable. In addition, 63% of the offences within the Department of Health NOMS are looking to introduce summary offences excluding motoring category were a learning disability screening questionnaire (LDSQ) for drunk and disorderly offences. for use by all prison staff to identify those with a The figure for 2010 is for a female whose first learning difficulty or disability and refer them to caution or conviction was in 1997. When looking at specialist support and services. Prison education their previous offences by offence category 83% were providers will provide additional learning support, as for summary offences excluding motoring which and when it is required, for prisoners with an identified includes the offence of assault on a constable. need through personalised programmes, specialist staff, adaptations and resources, where appropriate. These figures have been drawn from the police’s administrative IT system, the police national computer, In March 2011, the Department of Health which, as with any large scale recording system, is published “Positive Practice, Positive Outcomes: A subject to possible errors with data entry and handbook for professionals in the criminal justice processing. The figures are provisional and subject to system working with offenders with a learning change as more information is recorded by the police. disability.” This guidance is in the public domain and is available online at: Highest number of previous convictions for assault on a constable, when convicted of this offence in England and Wales in the years 2008 to 2010, and http://www.dh.gov.uk/en/Publicationsandstatistics/ not going to prison Publications/PublicationsPolicyAndGuidance/DH_124743 Number of previous offences In October and November 2011 NOMS worked with 2008 2009 2010 MENCAP to prepare and run four workshops for Previous convictions for assault on 36 31 31 prison staff, using group activities to cover basic a constable awareness of learning disabilities/difficulties (LDD) Previous cautions and convictions 241 462 78 and how such conditions can effect the day to day for any offence at time of conviction management of prisoners. Discussions with MENCAP Previous immediate custodial 115 115 23 about future LDD awareness for staff and prisoners sentences for any offence at time of are ongoing. conviction Prisoners’ Transfers: Scotland Prisoners Employment Cathy Jamieson: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Tom Clarke: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice how many requests by prisoners in England to Justice (1) what steps he is taking to ensure the transfer to Scottish prisons are under consideration. availability of support to offenders, including those [88163] 283W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 284W
Mr Blunt: 13 applications for transfer from prisoners Prisoners: Learning Disability in England and Wales to prisons in Scotland are under consideration. Mr Tom Clarke: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice what steps he is taking to ensure that when an Cathy Jamieson: To ask the Secretary of State for authorised person explains the effect of a conditional Justice when he last met the Cabinet Secretary for caution to offenders, including those with a learning Justice in the Scottish Government to discuss disability, it is done in a way which is easily understood arrangements for the transfer of prisoners between by the offender; and if he will make a statement. Scotland and England. [88164] [88754] Mr Blunt: The Lord Chancellor and Secretary of Mr Blunt: The police and Crown Prosecution Service State for Justice, my right hon. and learned Friend the have guidance in the form of the Revised Code of Member for Rushcliffe (Mr Clarke), has not met the Practice on Adult Conditional Cautions and the Cabinet Secretary for Justice in the Scottish Directors Guidance on Adult Conditional Cautions to Government to discuss arrangements for the transfer help them decide whether an offence is suitable for a of prisoners between Scotland and England. conditional caution. This guidance contains a number The process for prisoners transferring between of safeguards to ensure conditional cautions are used England and Wales and Scotland has been operating appropriately. successfully since 1997 and there are no plans at this The Code of Practice for Conditional Cautions is time to review the transfer arrangements. Officials are clear that before a conditional caution can be in regular contact about individual transfer requests. administered the authorised person (usually a police officer) must ensure the offender understands the Cathy Jamieson: To ask the Secretary of State for implications of accepting a conditional caution, Justice how many (a) male and (b) female prisoners including what is required from them to complete the serving custodial sentences in England were transferred conditions, and that it will form part of their criminal to Scottish prisons in each of the last five years. [88165] record. The authorised person should also ensure that the offender has had the opportunity to receive free Mr Blunt: From 1 January 2007 to the 31 December and independent legal advice before accepting a 2011 a total of 113 prisoners transferred from prisons condition caution. in England and Wales to prisons in Scotland to Conditions must always be appropriate, continue serving sentences of imprisonment or to proportionate and achievable and an offender must facilitate a period of temporary visits with close family. agree to accept them. It is a requirement of the Police The following table gives the number of prisoners and Criminal Evidence (PACE) Codes of Practice that transferred in each of the last five years: individuals who are detained by the police and are identified as having mental health issues including Male Female learning disabilities should be provided with an appropriate adult. It is the appropriate adult’s role to 2007 26 0 give advice and assistance to the detainee and to assist 2008 17 0 them in understanding the procedures being followed, 2009 17 0 including any interview or any proposals to give a 2010 25 2 caution. The police have guidance on recognising and 2011 24 2 responding to people with mental ill health or learning disabilities. Cathy Jamieson: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice how many (a) male and (b) female prisoners Prisons: Energy serving custodial sentences in England made requests to transfer to prisons in Scotland in each of the last five Luciana Berger: To ask the Secretary of State for years. [88166] Justice (1) further to the answer of 12 December 2011, Official Report, columns 505-6W, on prisons’ energy, Mr Blunt: From 1 January 2007 to the 31 December what proportion of the prison estate the sample sites 2011 a total of 149 prisoners submitted requests for represented; [87898] transfer from prisons in England and Wales to prisons in Scotland to continue serving sentences of (2) what estimate he has made of how much energy imprisonment or to facilitate a period of temporary has been saved at each prison where energy saving visits with close family. technology has been installed since May 2010; and what the monetary value of the saving was; [87900] The following table gives the number of applications received in each of the last five years: (3) how much was invested at each prison where energy saving technology has been introduced since Male Female May 2010; [87901] (4) how many prison sites have not installed any 2007 39 1 energy saving technology since May 2010. [87902] 2008 34 0 2009 35 2 2010 18 1 Mr Blunt: Further to the answer of 12 December 2011 17 2 2011, Official Report, column 505-6W, all public sector prisons were sampled. 285W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 286W
The Ministry of Justice is unable to provide an disproportionate cost. However, the following table estimate of how much energy has been saved and the shows the amounts invested through the Department monetary value of the saving at each prison where for Energy and Climate Change funded Salix scheme at energy saving technology has been installed since May each prison. 2010 as the information is not held centrally and could be obtained only at disproportionate cost. The Ministry of Justice is unable to say how many prison sites have not installed any energy saving The Ministry of Justice is unable to say how much technology since May 2010 as the information is not has been invested in energy saving technology at each held centrally and could be obtained only at prison since May 2010 as this information is not held disproportionate cost. centrally and could be obtained only at
Amounts invested through the Department for Energy and Climate, change funded Salix scheme at prisons in England and Wales since May 2010 Date Prison Project Cost (£)
13 September 2010 Woodhill Water Controls 29,707.00 13 September 2010 Woodhill Lighting 47,588.00 22 July 2010 Long Lartin Boiler Controls 38,704.00 28 July 2010 Whitemoor Boiler Controls 40,138.00 28 July 2010 Whitemoor Boiler Controls 1,250.40 23 October 2010 Whitemoor Lighting 54,781.56 20 November 2010 Whitemoor Lighting 17,279.17 9 December 2010 Whitemoor Voltage Optimisation 98,799.88 16 December 2010 Full Sutton Voltage Optimisation 80,201.98 17 December 2010 Manchester Voltage Optimisation 127,040.25 20 December 2010 Wakefield Voltage Optimisation 49,782.40 14 March 2011 Belmarsh Voltage Optimisation 55,696.00 14 March 2011 Belmarsh Voltage Optimisation 55,696.00 14 March 2011 Belmarsh Voltage Optimisation 22,278.40 28 March 2011 Frankland Voltage Optimisation 163,238.02 10 May 2011 Frankland Lighting 30,377.40 27 June 2011 Manchester Lighting 37,804.77 30 June 2011 Frankland Core Plant 19,800.00 29 November 2010 Bristol Lighting 4,257.35 29 November 2010 Bristol Insulation 4,614.30 29 November 2010 Bristol Core Plant 27,691.23 29 November 2010 Bristol Lighting 1,308.00 2 March 2011 Bristol Building Management System 33,046.00 16 December 2010 Dorchester Lighting 10,537.91 30 January 2011 Dorchester Lighting 15,315.00 14 March 2011 Leyhill Insulation 33,720.60 14 March 2011 Leyhill Core Plant 33,235.60 30 November 2010 Ranby Lighting 59,551.00 31 December 2010 Ranby Lighting 135,936.07 31 December 2010 Gartree Lighting 40,079.67 31 December 2010 Glen Parva Lighting 12,217.43 31 December 2010 Onley Voltage Optimisation 60,186.00 31 December 2010 Whatton Heating Controls 27,788.99 31 December 2010 Glen Parva Voltage Optimisation 61,661.65 31 December 2010 Gartree Insulation 25,076.69 1 November 2010 Bedford Voltage Optimisation 35,174.80 30 June 2010 Highpoint1 Lighting 17,557.32 7 May 2010 Highpoint1 Insulation 10,887.08 15 June 2010 Hollesley Bay Insulation 60,485.47 15 June 2010 Hollesley Bay Insulation 2,937.50 1 July 2010 Hollesley Bay Insulation 14,896.46 18 June 2010 Norwich Insulation 43,780.03 18 June 2010 Norwich Insulation 2,937.50 17 December 2010 Feltham Lighting 34,993.00 17 December 2010 Hewell Lighting 27,070.26 17 December 2010 Hewell Lighting 23,571.50 17 December 2010 Swinfen Hall Lighting 9,409.47 31 October 2010 Deerbolt Lighting 3,959.21 31 October 2010 Durham Air Conditioning Controls 6,943.08 31 October 2010 Holme House Lighting 3,870.45 31 October 2010 Holme House Lighting 16,473.76 31 October 2010 Holme House Lighting 8,166.25 31 October 2010 Low Newton Lighting 65,800.00 287W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 288W
Amounts invested through the Department for Energy and Climate, change funded Salix scheme at prisons in England and Wales since May 2010 Date Prison Project Cost (£)
31 October 2010 Low Newton Core Plant 3,963.25 17 December 2010 Feltham Lighting 34,993.00 17 December 2010 Hewell Lighting 27,070.26 17 December 2010 Hewell Lighting 23,571.50 17 December 2010 Swinfen Hall Lighting 9,409.47 31 October 2010 Deerbolt Lighting 3,959.21 31 October 2010 Durham Air Conditioning Controls 6,943.08 31 October 2010 Holme House Lighting 3,870.45 31 October 2010 Holme House Lighting 16,743.76 31 October 2010 Holme House Lighting 8,166.25 31 October 2010 Low Newton Lighting 6,580.00 31 October 2010 Low Newton Core Punt 3,936.25 17 December 2010 Feltham Lighting 34,993.00 17 December 2010 Hewell Lighting 27,070.26 17 December 2010 Hewell Lighting 23,571.50 17 December 2010 Swinfen Hall Lighting 9,409.47 31 October 2010 Deerbolt Lighting 3,959.21 31 October 2010 Durham Air Conditioning Controls 6,943.08 31 October 2010 Holme House Lighting 3,870.45 31 October 2010 Holme House Lighting 16,473.76 31 October 2010 Holme House Lighting 8,166.25 31 October 2010 Low Newton Lighting 6,580.00 31 October 2010 Low Newton Core Punt 3,996.25 2,239,539.57 1 Training centre at Highpoint prison.
Prisons: Foreign Nationals Mr Blunt: The courts already have powers to impose both community sentences and suspended sentence Cathy Jamieson: To ask the Secretary of State for orders for offences under the Protection from Justice (1) what discussions he has had with (a) the Harassment Act and can therefore impose alcohol, UK Borders Agency and (b) the Prison Officers’ drug and mental health treatment requirements as part Association on the building of prisons to of these sentences, where appropriate. In addition, accommodate foreign nationals only; [88696] accredited offending behaviour programmes and other interventions can be included as a requirement of a (2) further to the statement of 19 December 2011, community order, a suspended sentence order or as Official Report, column 1061, on foreign national licence condition, in appropriate cases. offenders, how many prisons will be built to accommodate only foreign nationals; and where such John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for prisons will be located; [88697] Justice what funding is available for existing treatment (3) pursuant to his oral statement of 19 December programmes or clinics for persons convicted of stalking 2011, Official Report, column 1061, how many prisoner offences under the Protection from Harassment Act places will be provided in the proposed new build 1997. [87528] prisons for foreign nationals; [88698] Mr Blunt: There is no funding that is specifically Mr Blunt: No prisons are being built to allocated for the treatment of offenders convicted of accommodate foreign nationals only. The prison stalking offences. Offenders are directed to appropriate capacity programme is ongoing and will deliver two programmes or services to address relevant aspects of new prisons in 2012, HMP Thameside and HMP their criminal behaviour following assessment of their Oakwood, neither of which is intended to hold foreign underlying risk factors. nationals only. As stated on 19 December 2011, it is our intention to Rights of Accused: EU Action open more foreign national only prisons. This will be achieved by the conversion of existing prisons to this function. Joint work is under way between UKBA and Naomi Long: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice NOMS to identify appropriate establishments for this what recent progress has been made in the negotiations purpose. on the Draft Directive of the European Parliament and of the Council on the right of access to a lawyer in criminal proceedings; and if he will make a statement. Protection from Harassment Act 1997 [87358]
John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Kenneth Clarke: The UK did not opt in to this Justice whether he has plans to give courts powers to proposed directive although we support the principle impose community treatment orders in respect of behind it because the Government considered that persons convicted under the provisions of the some of the provisions in the Commission’s proposals Protection from Harassment Act 1997. [87527] would have an adverse impact on our ability to 289W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 290W investigate and prosecute offences effectively. Good they will be required to notify their personal details progress has been made in negotiations, but the with the police, including: name, address; date of birth Government still have some concerns about the content and national insurance number. Offenders are required of the draft directive. The relevant Committee of the to notify within three days of becoming subject to European Parliament is yet to publish a draft report in notification and must notify annually or whenever their response to the Commission’s proposal. On details change for the duration of their notification 13 December, the right hon. the Lord McNally wrote requirements. to the European Scrutiny Committees to update them The Home Office has recently consulted on four about the progress of the negotiations. proposals to further strengthen existing notification The Government will continue to engage in the requirements, including the requirement to notify negotiations. In the event our concerns about the initial weekly where an offender is registered as ‘no fixed draft of the directive are satisfactorily dealt with, we abode’. We will publish our conclusions in due course. will consider whether we should apply to opt in to it once it has been adopted, as our protocol to the Treaty Witnesses: Finance on the Functioning of the European Union allows. A well-drafted directive could be of considerable benefit Sadiq Khan: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice to British subjects arrested in other member states. We how much funding his Department allocated to the will consult Parliament about any decision to apply to Witness Service in each year from 1997 to 2011. [87930] opt in. Sentencing: Drugs Mr Blunt: The Witness Service, which provides support to witnesses appearing in magistrates and Crown courts in England and Wales, is part of the core Diana Johnson: To ask the Secretary of State for service provided by Victim Support, the national Justice how many people are serving a custodial charity for victims and witnesses of crime which is sentence for the possession of a (a) class A and (b) principally funded by the Ministry of Justice. class B drug. [88420] The table details the total amount of central Mr Blunt: As at 30 September 2011, there were Government grant funding provided to Victim Support 10,604 prisoners in England and Wales serving between 2000-01 and 2010-11 and the amount of this sentences for drug offences. This total included 561 grant allocated each year by Victim Support to the who were serving sentences for drug possession, and a Witness Service. Between 2000-01 and 2007-08 separate further 3,461 for possession with intent to supply. From Witness Service arrangements existed for magistrates the data held centrally it is not possible to separately and Crown courts; figures are provided for both. Since identify the numbers serving sentences for possession 2008-09 there has been a single Witness Service by class of drug. covering all of those courts. Records of the amount of funding allocated to the Sexual Offences Witness Service prior to 2000-01 are not available. The total amount of funding to be allocated to the Witness Fiona Mactaggart: To ask the Secretary of State for Service in the current financial year (2011-12) has yet Justice what steps he is taking to ensure sex offenders to be finalised. leaving prison on completion of their sentence move into settled accommodation that conforms to the £ requirements of registration; and if he will make a Total MOJ Magistrates Crown court Total witness grant to statement. [85918] Financial court witness witness service victim year service service funding support Lynne Featherstone [holding answer 19 December 2000-01 1,811,111 2,048,003 3,859,114 18,550,000 2011]: I have been asked to reply on behalf of the 2001-02 2,700,000 1,683,801 4,383,801 25,000,000 Department for Justice. 2002-03 4,956,671 2,058,518 7,015,189 28,000,000 If an offender is released from a sentence of 2003-04 5,986,147 2,103,379 8,089,526 28,450,000 12 months or more, he or she will be subject to 2004-05 5,900,000 1,968,506 7,868,506 30,000,000 supervision on licence for a specified period. 2005-06 5,826,198 1,855,606 7,681,804 30,000,000 During this time, they must only reside at an address 2006-07 6,184,839 2,137,470 8,322,309 30,880,000 approved by their supervising probation officer. During 2007-08 5,815,725 2,103,000 7,918,725 35,784,263 the custodial part of the sentence, there will be 2008-09 n/a n/a 7,918,725 37,000,000 discussion between the probation officer and the 2009-10 n/a n/a 7,912,696 37,000,000 offender about what is a suitable release address. 2010-11 n/a n/a 7,912,696 45,000,000 Failure to reside at an address approved by the probation officer can result in the offender being Young Offenders: Learning Difficulty recalled to custody. Sex offender registration requirements usually last Mr Tom Clarke: To ask the Secretary of State for much longer than the post-supervision licence and can Justice what steps he is taking to ensure that, if a be indefinite. police officer gives a youth caution to a person, Offenders sentenced to less than 12 months including someone with a learning disability, the imprisonment will not be released on a licence, but if processes associated with the caution are they have been convicted of a sexual offence they will communicated in an accessible way and where the be subject to notification requirements. This means offender requires support to communicate or 291W Written Answers10 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 292W understand the process, communicated in the presence Official Report, columns 794-97, on young adult of the appropriate adult; and if he will make a offenders, what specific measures he has introduced to statement. [88756] create flexibility to enable people within the criminal justice system to begin to address this age group as a Mr Blunt: Provisions in the Legal Aid, Sentencing priority. [85481] and Punishment of Offenders Bill introduce youth cautions for young offenders aged under 18 years Mr Blunt: The Government’s reform agenda is to which will, when implemented, replace the current final drive improved results for all offenders, including warning scheme. The provisions require the police to young adults. explain the effect of the youth caution to the young person in ordinary language. Guidance will set out that Measures are also being undertaken to improve this information must be given orally and outcomes for young adult offenders through the supplemented with written information clearly process of transition from the youth justice system to explaining the effect of the youth caution. All youth the criminal justice system at the age of 18. The Youth cautions must be given in the presence of an to Adult Portal, that is now being piloted, has been appropriate adult if the young person is under 17 or constructed to enable timely sharing of offender otherwise deemed vulnerable. This could include assessments and other information about offenders. having a learning disability. The Youth Justice Board with the National Offender Management Service have recently begun the process Mr Tom Clarke: To ask the Secretary of State for of reviewing the operation of the national joint Youth Justice what representations he has received on whether Justice Board/National Offender Management Service when a police officer gives a youth caution to a person, protocol. The YJB and NOMS are working including someone with a learning disability, the collaboratively to replace the current community processes associated with the caution are focused protocol, introduce new guidance for communicated in an accessible way and where the transitions within custody and provide examples of offender requires support to communicate or effective practice. This will assist in establishing an understand the process, communicated in the presence agreed transitions process which promotes of the appropriate adult; and if he will make a understanding between youth offending teams, statement. [88757] probation trusts and young offender institutions and more effective use of the information available at Mr Blunt: The Ministry of Justice has received critical stages in the transition process. written representations on this subject from Mencap. The Ministry of Justice is also running a programme Lord McNally, the Minister of State for Justice, met of Payment by Results pilots. Providers will be paid for Lord Rix, Lord Wigley, Lord Ramsbotham and their success at rehabilitating offenders and reducing Mencap representatives on 14 December 2011 to reoffending, and will be given increased freedoms to discuss Mencap’s suggested amendments to the Legal work with offenders in new and innovative ways. Young Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of Offenders Bill adult offenders are included within the scope of the including those related to youth cautions. pilots at Peterborough and Doncaster prisons. They Youth Justice are also included within the scope available to the local justice reinvestment pilots in Greater Manchester and London though it will be for local areas themselves to Mrs Chapman: To ask the Secretary of State for decide how they prioritise their work with regard to the Justice pursuant to the contribution of the risk of reoffending rather than the age of particular Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State to the Public offenders. We will keep the position of young adult Bill Committee on the Legal Aid, Sentencing and offenders under review as we develop further Payment Punishment of Offenders Bill of 13 October 2011, by Results proposals. 293W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 294W
Damian Green: The information requested, to November Written Answers to 2011, is provided in the following table. Named day questions receiving a substantive answer within five working days Questions Percentage answered within Number received five working days Wednesday 11 January 2012 June 2011 99 82.3 July 2011 96 68.8 August 2011 0 — September 75 72 HOME DEPARTMENT 2011 Departmental Written Questions October 2011 54 92.6 November 143 72 Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for the 2011 Home Department how many parliamentary questions The Government have committed to providing the for (a) ordinary written answer and (b) written answer Procedure Committee with information relating to written on a named day by her Department have remained parliamentary question performance on a sessional basis unanswered for a period of two months since May and will provide full information to the Committee at 2010. [79542] the end of the Session. Statistics relating to Government Damian Green: From May 2010 to 30 November Department’s performance for the 2009-10 parliamentary 2011, 39 ordinary written questions and 21 named day Session were previously provided to the committee and written question remained unanswered for a period of are available on the Parliament website. two calendar months. This includes periods that cover Driving Offences non-sitting Fridays, weekends, public holidays and periods of recess, when questions cannot be answered. Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department if she will take steps to permit The Government have committed to providing the persons found guilty of an offence under section 14(3) Procedure Committee with information relating to written of the Road Traffic Act 1988 to attend a driving safety parliamentary question performance on a sessional basis course paid for by the offender that includes and will provide full information to the Committee at instruction on the benefits of wearing seat belts in lieu the end of the Session. Statistics relating to Government of a fine; and if she will make a statement. [R] [78680] Departments’ performance for the 2009-10 parliamentary session were previously provided to the Committee and Nick Herbert: The police can offer such courses at are available on the Parliament website. their discretion. They do not require Government permission. Mr Mike Hancock: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department how many questions for written Members: Correspondence answer received by her Department have not received an answer within (a) one month, (b) two months and Sir Gerald Kaufman: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department when she plans to reply to the (c) three months or more since May 2010. [81146] letter from the right hon. Member for Manchester, Damian Green: The information requested is provided Gorton of 9 November 2011 concerning Mrs Sabba in the following table. These data include periods that Ali. [87652] cover non-sitting Fridays, weekends, public holidays and periods of recess, when questions cannot be answered. Mr Kenneth Clarke: I have been asked to reply on behalf of the Ministry of Justice. Number A reply has now been sent. Police: Rural Areas Number of written questions for 5,902 answer from May 2010-30 November 2011 Stephen Phillips: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what steps she is taking to ensure Written answers overdue by 1-2 months 165 the provision of funding for rural police forces. [89078] Written answers overdue by 2-3 months 41 Written answers overdue by three or 19 Nick Herbert: The vast majority of Government more months funding is allocated using the police allocation formula The Government have committed to providing the (PAF). PAF distributes funding based on relative police Procedure Committee with information relating to written workload, taking into account population sparsity to parliamentary question performance on a sessional basis address the specific needs of rural forces. and will provide full information to the Committee at the end of the Session. Statistics relating to Government Departments’ performance for the 2009-10 parliamentary HOUSE OF COMMONS COMMISSION Session were previously provided to the Committee and Computers are available on the Parliament website. Chris Ruane: To ask the hon. Member for Caithness, Chris Ruane: To ask the Secretary of State for the Sutherland and Easter Ross, representing the House of Home Department what proportion of written Commons Commission pursuant to the answer of questions for answer on a named day received a 12 December 2011, Official Report, column 460W, on substantive answer within five working days in each of computers, if the House of Commons Commission will the last six months. [85063] consider alternative ways of disposing of obsolete 295W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 296W laptop and desktop computers that would raise greater The Government are proposing that where a child maintenance revenue per computer than was raised by the last calculation is varied under the new scheme, the actual income that disposal process. [88099] is produced from any assets will be taken into account and the statutory rate of interest will not be applied to the asset. This is John Thurso: The parliamentary ICT department has because in the new scheme child maintenance calculations will be based upon actual income data obtained from HMRC, rather not identified any disposal options likely to raise more than applying notional amounts based on a non-resident parent’s revenue per computer, but the Commission would be assets. pleased to consider any option which could do so. The proposed Regulations, detailed consultation document and other related items can be found here: http://www.childmaintenance.org/en/publications/ WORK AND PENSIONS consultations.html Children: Maintenance Employment Schemes
Christopher Pincher: To ask the Secretary of State for Stephen Timms: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions whether he has any plans to vary Work and Pensions what the funding arrangements are the statutory interest rate absent parents with assets for Work programme providers which provide valued over £65,000 are charged by the Child Support Mandatory Work Activity. [88558] Agency. [87786] Chris Grayling: Each Mandatory Work Activity provider Maria Miller: The Child Maintenance and Enforcement receives a single payment at the point a person starts on Commission is responsible for the child maintenance a work placement arranged by the provider, the amount system. I have asked the Child Maintenance Commissioner depending on the individual contract. Mandatory Work to write to my hon. Friend with the information requested Activity and the Work programme are entirely separate and I have seen the response. programmes and separately contracted, and the fact Letter from Noel Shanahan: that a provider might deliver both has no bearing on In reply to your recent Parliamentary Question about the funding arrangements. Child Support Agency, the Secretary of State promised a substantive reply from the Child Maintenance Commissioner as the Child Housing Benefit: Fraud Support Agency is now the responsibility of the Child Maintenance and Enforcement Commission. Henry Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for Work You asked the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions, and Pensions if he will support local authorities with whether he has any plans to vary the statutory interest rate absent funding to ensure that they continue to employ housing parents with assets valued over £65,000 are charged by the Child benefit fraud investigators until the commencement of Support Agency. [87786] universal credit in 2013. [87653] Child Support law prescribes that in specific circumstances the calculation used to determine child maintenance liability can be varied if it is ‘just and equitable’ to do so via the child support Steve Webb: From 2013, the new Single Fraud variations rules. One of these circumstances is when it is appropriate Investigation Service (SFIS) will be formed by consolidating to allow the interest on any income produced by capital to be the benefit and tax credit fraud investigation teams taken into account as income for child maintenance purposes. across DWP, local authorities and HMRC, which will Child Support legislation provides that in instances where a enable them to undertake a single investigation for the variation on these grounds is agreed, in order to calculate what first time. This will be a more efficient way of using income is derived from any capital held, the statutory rate of investigative resources, and it will ensure the expertise interest should be applied. As this is presently set at 8% we are that currently exists across all these areas is not lost. obliged by law to adhere to this figure. This rate, which is used across government for a variety of purposes, is set by the Ministry Local authority staff will remain employed by local of Justice and therefore the Commission is not in a position to authorities, but they operate under SFIS powers, policies, alter the level. I should also add that the rate to be used is processes and priorities. We will continue to work dependant on the jurisdiction within the UK within which the collaboratively with them to co-design an operational non-resident parent habitually resides. A parent living in England structure for SFIS from 2013. or Wales may pay a different rate to a parent living in Scotland. The rate is not intended to represent an amount which reflects the Pensions income a parent can guarantee to achieve from their asset. It is intended to reflect longer-term trends in interest rate levels, and therefore is not subject to fluctuation on a day-to-day basis. Brandon Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions what steps his Department is Using this statutory rate provides Child Support Agency staff with a simple means to obtain an income figure where grounds taking to improve transparency in pension charges and for a departure or variation may exist. It means that they do not transfers before the introduction of auto-enrolment. have to contend with complexities arising from the fact that the [87667] actual achievable return may vary considerably from case to case or over time, for example, due to market trends or the nature of Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Work the asset itself. There are currently no plans to amend the legislation and Pensions what steps he plans to take to increase in this area for the existing child maintenance schemes. transparency in the charges, fees and commissions paid However, you may be interested to know that on 1 December by consumers on private pensions; and if he will make 2011 the Government launched a public consultation on the a statement. [88762] Child Support Maintenance Calculations Regulations 2012 which will run until 23 February 2012. These Regulations will provide most of the detailed rules for calculating statutory child maintenance Steve Webb: On 15 December 2011, we published a under the new scheme of child maintenance to be introduced in consultation paper, ‘Meeting future workplace the course of 2012. pensions challenges: improving transfers and dealing 297W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 298W with small pots’, which seeks views and evidence on each (i) parliamentary constituency and (ii) local possible options to reduce the number of small pension authority area in Scotland. [88171] pots and facilitate transfers to enable individuals to consolidate their pension saving. Maria Miller: Estimates of the number and proportion of children living in poverty are published in the Households The Government welcome recent initiatives, involving Below Average Income (HBAI) series. HBAI uses the National Association of Pension Funds and other household income adjusted (or ‘equivalised’) for household stakeholders with an interest in pension provision, to size and composition, to provide a proxy for standard develop an industry code of practice to support greater of living. transparency in the charges made on workplace pensions. The sample size of this survey is not sufficient to provide estimates for small areas such as those requested. Poverty: Children However, figures for Scotland are available. Information about children with learning difficulties Cathy Jamieson: To ask the Secretary of State for and with autistic spectrum disorders is not included in Work and Pensions (1) how many children (a) in total, the HBAI datasets, therefore we are unable to provide (b) with learning difficulties, (c) with autistic the number and proportion of children in these groups spectrum disorders, (d) with disabilities and (e) under in poverty. the age of five are living in poverty in each (i) Three survey years have been combined because single parliamentary constituency and (ii) local authority year estimates are not considered to be sufficiently area in Scotland; [88156] reliable. (2) how many households with children (a) aged Statistics covering 2007-08 to 2009-10 are the most under five and (b) of any age are living in poverty in recent available.
Table 1: Number and proportion of children (a) in total, (b) with disabilities and (c) under the age of five who are living in relative poverty before housing costs (BHC) in Scotland, 2007-08 to 2009-10 Number in relative poverty (Million) Proportion in relative poverty (Percentage)
All children 0.2 20 Children with disabilities 10.0 24 Children aged under five 0.1 22 1 The number of children with disabilities in relative poverty is under 50,000.
Table 2: Number and proportion of households with children (a) aged under five and (b) of any age, who are living in relative poverty BHC in Scotland, 2007-08 to 2009-10 Number in relative poverty (Million) Proportion in relative poverty (Percentage)
Households with children aged under five 0.1 22 All households with children (any age) 0.1 20 Notes 1. These statistics are based on Households Below Average Income (HBAI) data sourced from the Family Resources Survey (FRS) available at: http://research.dwp.gov.uk/asd/index.php?page=hbai_arc This uses disposable household income, adjusted using modified OECD equivalisation factors for household size and composition, as an income measureasa proxy for standard of living. 2. Net disposable incomes have been used to answer the question. This includes earnings from employment and self-employment, state support, income from occupational and private pensions, investment income and other sources. Income tax, payments, national insurance contributions, council tax/domestic rates and some other payments are deducted from incomes. 3. Figures have been presented on a before housing cost rather than an after housing cost basis. For before housing costs, housing costs are not deductedfrom income, while for after housing costs they are. 4. All estimates are based on survey data and are therefore subject to a degree of uncertainty. Small differences should be treated with caution as these will be affected by sampling error and variability in non-response. 5. The reference period for these HBAI figures is three financial years. 6. Number of children has been rounded to the nearest 100,000 children. In table 1, the number of children with disabilities is under 50,000. 7. Proportion of children in low-income households has been rounded to the nearest percentage point. 8. For this analysis, disability is defined as having any long-standing illness, disability or infirmity that leads to a significant difficulty with one or more areas of the individual’s life. This is consistent with the definition of disability used in the HBAI publication. Everyone classified as disabled under this definition would also be classified as disabled under the Disability Discrimination Act (DDA), but these estimates do not reflect the total number of children covered by the DDA as the Family Resources Survey, the source of the Households Below Average Income series, does not fully collect this information. 9. This measure is defined as: Relative poverty: children living in households with equivalised incomes below 60% of contemporary median household income before housing costs (BHC). 10. The Child Poverty Act 2010 sets three further income-based UK-wide targets to be met by 2020. The targets are based on the proportion of children living in households with combined low income and material deprivation, absolute low income and persistent poverty. Source: Households Below Average Income 1994-95 to 2009-10, DWP.
HEALTH relating to dementia. The advertising formed part of Dementia: the national dementia: early signs and symptoms campaign, which was commissioned to help more people receive Mr Knight: To ask the Secretary of State for Health an early diagnosis. what spending his Department has recently incurred on Hearing Impaired: Children radio advertisements relating to dementia; and for what reason it has commissioned such advertisements. [87700] Tessa Munt: To ask the Secretary of State for Health how many children in Somerset were identified as deaf Mr Simon Burns: In the 2011-12 financial year, the through the newborn hearing screening programme in Department has spent £276,573 on radio advertising each of the last five years. [88435] 299W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 300W
Anne Milton: The information requested is not held European Regional Development Fund centrally. Information is available from the NHS Newborn Mr Anderson: To ask the Secretary of State for Hearing Screening Programme website at: Communities and Local Government if he will meet http://hearing.screening.nhs.uk/statistics representatives of the Industrial Communities Alliance to discuss take-up of European regional development Meningitis: Vaccination fund resources. [88538] Mr Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Grant Shapps: The Under-Secretary of State for what his policy is on making pneumococcal conjugate Communities and Local Government, my noble Friend vaccine available to adults in clinical risk groups; and if Baroness Hanham, who is responsible for European he will make a statement. [87954] regional development fund programmes in England, is arranging to meet the Industrial Communities Alliance Anne Milton: There are two types of pneumococcal to discuss take up of fund resources. vaccine: Pneumococcal conjugate vaccine (PCV); and Pneumococcal polysaccharide vaccine (PPV). TREASURY At present, the pneumococcal conjugate vaccine (Prevenar 13) is recommended for use in the national Bristol and West Building Society childhood immunisation programme for children up to the age of five. Ian Lucas: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer The Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation what steps he is taking to protect the interests of (JCVI) is awaiting the results of a major research study holders of perpetual subordinated bonds originally that is looking at how effective the Pneumococcal conjugate issued by the Bristol and West Building Society. [78610] vaccine (Prevenar 13 ) is in preventing pneumococcal Mr Hoban [holding answer 7 November 2011]: Bristol disease in older people. The JCVI will consider the and West permanent interest bearing securities were research findings as soon as they become available. transferred to Bank of Ireland by court order in 2007 as The pneumococcal polysaccharide vaccine (Pneumovax) part of a transfer of business. The Irish Minister of should continue to be used for the national pneumococcal Finance announced on 2 December 2011, following programme for those aged 65 and over and at-risk Bank of Ireland’s successful capital-raising exercise, groups aged two years and over. that he is no longer considering applying for a subordinated liability order, which could have been used to write Mental Health Services down the value of bonds including these securities. Tony Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State for As a matter of course the Government do not comment Health on what basis a person diagnosed with a on or intervene in disputes between a bank and their degenerative and progressive neurological condition bondholders. who has been awarded NHS continuing health care Britain Building Investment Fund may have it withdrawn; and if he will make a statement. [88803] Ed Balls: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer Paul Burstow: Those in receipt of NHS funded continuing with reference to table 2.3 of his autumn statement (1) health care will have their needs reviewed at least annually. what (a) assumptions and (b) methodologies underlie If their needs no longer meet the eligibility requirements, the £50 million saving shown for the Get Britain funding for continuing health care will be withdrawn. Building investment fund in 2014-15; [87774] (2) what (a) assumptions and (b) methodologies underlie the profile of the costings shown for the Get Britain Building investment fund in (i) 2012-13, (ii) COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT 2013-14 and (iii) 2014-15. [87773] Departmental Equality Danny Alexander [holding answer 20 December 2011]: The Get Britain Building investment fund will support Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for building firms in unlocking the finance needed to get Communities and Local Government what equality builders back to work. The programme will operate by impact assessments his Department has carried out making direct investments in specific projects through since May 2010; and for what purpose in each case. loans or taking equity stakes. [88576] It is anticipated that the fund will invest £260 million Andrew Stunell: The Department for Communities and £160 million in England in 2012-13 and 2013-14 and Local Government considers equality issues in respectively. Taking funding for the devolved exercising its functions, to comply with equality legislation Administrations into account, the investments in 2012-13 and to ensure it understands how its activities will affect and 2013-14 will be £310 million and £190 million different people. The conclusions are used to inform respectively. The time profile reflects the anticipated policies and programmes in various ways. Sometimes build programmes of supported projects. this information is published in the form of an equality Funding has been made available by the Government impact assessment, although there has never been a for this programme on the basis that it yields a return. It legal requirement to produce such documents. is forecast that £5 million and £50 million of receipts During the period in question DCLG carried out 35 will be generated by these investments in 2013-14 and equality impact assessments. 2014-15 respectively. 301W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 302W
Corporation Tax: Scotland (2) what funding was allocated to the Money Advice Service in Northern Ireland in (a) 2010-11 and (b) John Robertson: To ask the Chancellor of the 2011-12; and how much will be allocated in 2012-13; Exchequer what the monetary value was of receipts to [89169] the Exchequer from corporation tax from the transport (3) how many staff are employed by the Money sector in Scotland in each year since 2001. [88769] Advice Service in Northern Ireland; [89170] Mr Gauke: The information is available only at (4) whether there are any plans to reduce staff levels disproportionate cost as HMRC does not hold details in the Money Advice Service in Northern Ireland; of corporation tax receipts data relating to specific [89171] sectors of economic activity at a country or regional (5) how many cases the Money Advice Service in level. Northern Ireland has taken on in each year since it was established. [89172] Debts: Business Mr Hoban: The Money Advice Service is an independent Cathy Jamieson: To ask the Chancellor of the body, funded by a levy on the financial services industry. Exchequer what discussions (a) he and (b) officials in The Financial Services Authority (FSA) is responsible his Department have had with (i) the Bank of England for approving its Business Plan and Budget. and (ii) other banks on the operation of the market for corporate bonds. [77427] I have asked the Money Advice Service to respond to the detailed points you have raised in writing. A copy of Mr Hoban: The Treasury has regular discussions with the letter will be placed in the Libraries of the House. the Bank of England and market participants, including banks, on overall financial market conditions and the market for corporate bonds. The Bank of England National Insurance Contributions continues to operate its Asset Purchase Facility Corporate Bond Scheme to help facilitate the operation of the Robert Halfon: To ask the Chancellor of the secondary market for corporate bonds. The latest Exchequer what estimate he has made of receipts to the information on this scheme can be found on the Bank Exchequer from the employer element of national of England’s website at: insurance contributions; and what proportion of the http://www.bankofengland.co.uk/markets/apf/corporatebond/ overall tax-take this represents in each financial year index.htm from 2000 to 2010. [87899] More information on the Bank of England’s Asset Purchase Facility can be found on its website, including Mr Gauke: Employer’s national insurance receipts the latest quarterly report here: are provided in the following table. The proportion of http://www.bankofengland.co.uk/publications/other/markets/ total tax and NICs receipts this represents is also given apf/quarterlyreport.htm in the table.
Cathy Jamieson: To ask the Chancellor of the Employer Exchequer whether (a) he and (b) officials in his national Proportion of Department have had discussions with the Bank of insurance Total tax and total tax and England on the (i) underwriting and (ii) guaranteeing contributions NICs receipts1 NICs receipts of business debt. [77428] (£ billion) (£ billion) (percentage) 2000-01 35.7 360.4 10 Mr Hoban: Both the Chancellor of the Exchequer 2001-02 36.9 369.7 10 and HM Treasury officials meet with officials from the Bank of England on a regular basis to discuss a range 2002-03 37.1 375.6 10 of issues. 2003-04 41.0 396.8 10 2004-05 44.5 426.5 10 EU Budget: Contributions 2005-06 49.4 456.8 11 2006-07 50.7 485.8 10 Mr Dodds: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer 2007-08 58.5 515.9 11 what the percentage change has been in the size of (a) 2008-09 55.7 508.0 11 the overall EU budget and (b) the UK’s contribution 2009-10 54.7 477.8 11 to the EU budget in each of the last 10 years. [88759] 2010-11 55.5 520.1 11 1 Consistent with supplementary table 2.8 from the Office of Budget Mr Hoban: Details of EU budgets, including their Responsibility (OBR)’s Autumn 2011 Economic Fiscal Outlook. overall sizes and the UK contributions to them, are Historic figures are consistent with the equivalent table in previous published in the annual European Union Finances Budget publications produced by the OBR and HMT. documents available on HM Treasury’s public website http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/int_eu_statefraud.htm Northern Rock plc Money Advice Service: Northern Ireland Chris Leslie: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer Ms Ritchie: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer when the first coupon payment on the new convertible (1) how much the Money Advice Service in Northern debt in the sale of Northern Rock is due to be paid; Ireland spent on advertising in (a) 2010-11 and (b) and what further receipts he expects in each of the next 2011-12 to date; [89168] three years. [83460] 303W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 304W
Mr Hoban: Virgin Money issued to HM Treasury, on DEFENCE completion of the sale on 1 January 2012, Tier 1 Capital Notes with a par value of £150 million and a coupon of Armed Forces: Education 10.5%. The Capital Notes are designed to be CRD IV compliant. Hazel Blears: To ask the Secretary of State for In order to be compliant, the coupon will have to be Defence (1) what the cost of the Enhanced Learning conditional. The coupon on the Capital Notes will be Credits scheme was in (a) 2007-08, (b) 2008-09, (c) conditional in several ways; for example Virgin Money 2009-10 and (d) 2010-11; [88385] would be unable to pay interest if it had insufficient (2) how many service personnel used the Enhanced distributable reserves or if, after payment of such interest, Learning Credits scheme in (a) 2007-08, (b) 2008-09, it would not meet its capital resources requirement. (c) 2009-10 and (d) 2010-11; [88389] Interest accrues from the first anniversary of the (3) what proportion of course fees has been claimed issue of this debt, and the first interest payment is by service personnel on average through the Enhanced expected to be made in 2013. Learning Credits scheme; [88437] (4) what the average level has been of the contribution made by the Government towards the Regional Growth Fund: Taxation cost of course fees undertaken by service personnel through the Enhanced Learning Credits scheme. Mr Watts: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer [88438] what his policy is on taxation of Regional Growth Fund grants. [83398] Mr Robathan: The Ministry of Defence promotes lifelong learning among members of the armed forces and this is encouraged through the Learning Credits Mr Gauke: There are no special tax exemptions for schemes. The Enhanced Learning Credit (ELC) scheme grants. A private sector beneficiary must record a grant is designed to complement the Standard Learning Credits as income in their accounts which wilt affect their scheme by providing larger scale help to personnel who overall tax position. qualify, with a single payment of £1,000 or £2,000 (dependent upon length of service) in each of a maximum of three separate financial years, to help pay towards Tax Credit the cost of higher-level learning. It remains available for up to 10 years after discharge. Cathy Jamieson: To ask the Chancellor of the ELC is not a refund scheme and operates by payment Exchequer what recent estimate he has made of the being made direct to a registered training provider. number of tax credit claims which are awaiting Training by this funding stream is subject to a minimum processing. [85896] 20% personal contribution. The following table lists the amount paid to registered Mr Gauke [holding answer 12 December 2011]: At training providers and the number of service personnel the close of business on 6 December 2011 there were and leavers who have accessed the scheme: around 50,000 new tax credit claims to be processed. Amount paid to Total number of registered training Financial year claimants providers (£ million) Taxation 2007-08 6,500 5.7 2008-09 7,900 10.1 Mr Frank Field: To ask the Chancellor of the 2009-10 7,600 9.8 Exchequer (1) what estimate HM Revenue and 2010-11 10,400 14.9 Customs has made of the amount of underpaid tax in the years up to financial year 2007-08; [84307] The ELC Scheme is administered under contract by (2) what his estimate is of the amount which will be G4S who hold all records relating to claims for this type repaid to people who were over-taxed in the tax years of funding. However, no management information is up to 2007-08. [84308] compiled on the proportion of course fees claimed on average or on the Government’s contribution. This could be provided only at disproportionate cost. Mr Gauke [holding answer 1 December 2011]: Most people within PAYE pay the right amount of tax during Armed Forces: Post Traumatic Stress Disorder the year, but some customers pay either too much or too little. Julian Sturdy: To ask the Secretary of State for HMRC set up the Open Case Programme to tackle Defence how many service personnel suffering from the cases relating to 2007-08 and earlier years which post traumatic stress disorder received specialist were still to be cleared when their new computer system treatment from the NHS in the last 12 months. [88322] came in. The Programme is on track to complete this work by the end of 2012. Mr Robathan: During the period 1 December 2010 to HMRC estimates that when the Programme is complete 30 November 2011, 229 service personnel were admitted repayments worth around £2.8 billion for 2003-04 through to NHS in-patient facilities under the co-ordination of to 2007-08 will have been issued and a further £236 million the South Staffordshire and Shropshire NHS Foundation will have been collected. Trust, which has the lead for the provision of mental 305W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 306W health in-patient services to service personnel. Of that While there have been numerous allegations of human number, some 20 were diagnosed on admission with rights abuses being committed by elements of the Yemen post traumatic stress disorder. Security Forces, on both sides of the political divide, we have seen no evidence confirming the involvement of Armed Forces: Training units that have received UK training.
Simon Hart: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence what assessment his Department has made of SCOTLAND the relative benefits of live firing training for the armed Employment forces and the use of simulators. [88665] 13. Sheila Gilmore: To ask the Secretary of State for Nick Harvey: The Ministry of Defence continuously Scotland what assessment he has made of the effect of and objectively assesses the relative benefits of live fire the autumn statement on levels of employment in training and the use of simulation, some areas of assessment Scotland. [88264] being more mature than others. David Mundell: As a result of the Autumn Statement, Simulation is increasingly used for training purposes more than £500 million has been added to the existing by all three armed services. However, they all acknowledge Scottish budget by the UK Government which provides that simulation cannot fully replicate the operational the Scottish Government with significant resources in environment and that a balance must be struck between these uncertain times. simulation and live fire training. Additional action, such as credit easing, will support Marines: Rescue Services small and medium-sized businesses in Scotland to create jobs, and help to build a stronger, more balanced economy. Mrs Moon: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence Green Investment Bank how many callouts RMB Chivenor received from each local authority in (a) England and (b) Wales in the 14. Mike Crockart: To ask the Secretary of State for last five years; and if he will make a statement. [87941] Scotland what discussions he has had with ministerial colleagues on the likely benefits to Scotland of the Nick Harvey: The information is not held in the green investment bank. [88265] format requested. All requests for assistance from the Michael Moore: I have had regular discussions with emergency services throughout the United Kingdom ministerial colleagues on the potential benefits to Scotland (police, fire, ambulance and coastguard) are handled by and the rest of the UK of the Green Investment Bank. the Aeronautical Rescue Coordination Centre based at RAF Kinloss. The centre is responsible for tasking and Once the bank is established it will play a vital role in co-ordinating all of the UK’s search and rescue helicopter the Government’s efforts to develop the low carbon teams. economy in the whole of the UK, including Scotland, and I have no doubt it will act as a significant spur to The number of callouts tasked to Royal Marine Base investment. Chivenor in each of the last five years is provided in the following table: Co-operatives Number of callouts Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for England Wales Maritime1 Scotland what steps (a) his Department and (b) those 2006 168 101 24 bodies for which his Department is responsible are 2007 135 94 27 taking to mark UN Year of the Co-operative 2012; and 2008 150 84 27 if he will make a statement. [88609] 2009 192 129 18 David Mundell: The Scotland Office will work closely 2010 189 133 17 with Cabinet Office, the Mutuals Taskforce and with 20112 128 107 10 Co-operatives UK to develop and take full advantage 1 Maritime incidents are those that occur more than three miles out of opportunities to celebrate the achievements of 2 from the coastline. Up to 31 October 2011. co-operative organisations during the United Nations International Year of Co-operatives where those steps Yemen are compatible with the purposes for which Parliament has voted it supply. Mike Gapes: To ask the Secretary of State for Sovereignty Defence pursuant to the answer of 2 November 2011, Official Report, columns 665-6W, on Yemen, what Mr Hollobone: To ask the Secretary of State for discussions he has had with the Secretary of State for Scotland what his policy is on whether an in or out Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs on whether units referendum on the future of the Union between of the Yemeni security forces trained by the UK have England and Scotland is held as soon as possible. been involved in human rights violations against [88692] protesters. [87947] David Mundell: It is the Government’s clear view that Mr Philip Hammond: I have not had any discussions the Scottish Parliament does not have the legal power to with the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth legislate for any referendum on independence. That is Affairs, my right hon. Friend the Member for Richmond why the Secretary of State for Scotland, the right hon. (Yorks) (Mr Hague), on this matter. Member for Berwickshire, Roxburgh and Selkirk (Michael 307W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 308W
Moore), published a consultation to seek views on how Mike Penning [holding answer 10 January 2012]: The to deliver a legal, fair and decisive referendum. I refer Maritime and Coastguard Agency (MCA) will provide my hon. Friend to the statement made by the Secretary for the running costs of its estate (including the Maritime of State for Scotland of 10 January 2012, Official Operations Centre) within the departmental expenditure Report, columns 51-72. limits set out in Department for Transport’s comprehensive spending review. The detail of this is published in the MCA’s Business Plan (Section E) which is available on the MCA’s website TRANSPORT www.dft.gov.uk/mca A31 and in the Libraries of both Houses. In respect of the new Maritime Operations Centre in Mr Chope: To ask the Secretary of State for Fareham the MCA has signed a memorandum of Transport what estimate her Department has made of understanding (MOU) with the Department for the cost of the (a) delay to and (b) diversion of traffic Communities and Local Government (DCLG); this is a arising from the closure of local roads leading to the statement of intent for both sides regarding the transfer Canford Bottom roundabout on the A31 in spring of the Fareham site to the MCA. 2012. [88110] This MOU does not stipulate any financial commitments; this is currently subject to ongoing negotiation between Mike Penning [holding answer 10 January 2012]: The the MCA and the DCLG and has yet to be agreed. The cost of the delay to traffic arising from the closure of Fareham site is an existing government property and local roads is estimated at £343,000 per week. This is therefore the MCA’s use of it will be of net benefit to based on the DFT market value of £11.28 for an the UK taxpayer. average vehicle being delayed per hour. Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency: Databases The cost arising from the diversion of traffic due to local road closures has been estimated at £245,700 per week. This is based on an average distance per vehicle of Bill Esterson: To ask the Secretary of State for six miles at 45p a mile (a figure suggested by HM Revenue Transport what is the (a) minimum, (b) maximum and and Customs (HMRC), which includes fuel costs, wear (c) average time taken by the Driver and Vehicle and tear, insurance etc). Licensing Agency to enter registered keeper details for new vehicles. [88546] Mr Chope: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport what her estimate is of the additional cost to Mike Penning: The specific information requested is the public purse of reducing by one week the period of not recorded. The vast majority of new vehicles are total closure of access from local roads to the Canford registered through the Automated First Registration Bottom roundabout on the A31; and if she will make a and Licensing system (88%), whereby all the information statement. [88113] is transferred automatically from the manufacturers system to the Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency’s Mike Penning [holding answer 10 January 2012]: The database. This update is instantaneous. estimate of the additional cost to the public purse of For those new vehicles that are registered manually reducing by one week the period of total closure of via the Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency’s local access from local roads to the Canford Bottom roundabout office network the entire transaction has to be keyed on the A31 is £360,000. into the system. Although the average time taken to key just the keeper’s name and address is 30 seconds, the Mr Chope: To ask the Secretary of State for complete transaction can take just over 17 minutes to Transport what the (a) earliest and (b) latest time is (i) complete. on each weekday and (ii) at weekends contractors will be working on the Canford Bottom junction Fuels: Sulphur improvement during the period when all other local roads are to be closed. [88129] Dr Thérèse Coffey: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport whether she plans to review the adoption of Mike Penning [holding answer 10 January 2012]: the International Maritime Organisations limit on During the proposed programme of side road closures, sulphur content of marine fuels so that the UK is in our contractor will be working continuously from 7.30 am line with other EU member states. [88542] on Mondays day and night until 5.30 pm on Saturdays. On Sundays they will be working from 7.30 am to Mike Penning: The new sulphur limits for marine fuel 5.30 pm. that were agreed at the International Maritime Organization (IMO) as part of the revision of Annex VI of the Coastguard Agency: Finance MARPOL convention also need to be incorporated into European legislation. Bill Esterson: To ask the Secretary of State for The UK, along with other European member states, Transport how much her Department plans to provide is considering a draft proposal to align EU legislation for the annual running costs of (a) the new Maritime to the MARPOL standard. Once EU legislation to this Coastguard Agency (MCA) operations centre in effect has been adopted, the Government will take the Fareham and (b) existing MCA centres in the necessary steps to transpose it into domestic legislation, remainder of the comprehensive spending review thereby also implementing the sulphur provisions of the period. [87961] revised MARPOL Annex VI in UK law. 309W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 310W
M54: M6 Roads
Mark Pritchard: To ask the Secretary of State for Miss McIntosh: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport what assessment she has made of the case Transport what assessment she has made of the for connecting the M54 with the M6 toll road; and if importance of roads to (a) reducing congestion, (b) she will make a statement. [88952] increasing road safety and (c) economic growth; and if she will make a statement. [88707] Mike Penning: The statement of 26 October 2010, Official Report, column 177, by the then Secretary of Mike Penning [holding answer 10 January 2012]: The State for Transport, my right hon. Friend the Member Department collects and publishes a range of official for Runnymede and Weybridge (Mr Hammond), statistics related to traffic and the road network. Most “Investment in Highways and Local Transport Schemes” of these statistics are summarised in “Transport Statistics identified the M54/M6/M6 Toll Link road scheme as a Great Britain”, the Department’s main annual statistical ‘future scheme’ for potential construction in future compendium publication, the 37th edition of which was spending review periods and as one of four schemes to published on 15 December 2011. Congestion related be reviewed by the Highways Agency. information includes changes to average speeds on local In conducting the review the Agency has looked authority A roads and percentage of journeys deemed again at the scheme options currently under consideration to be on time on the strategic road network. to ensure these remain the most appropriate. The business The Government published a strategic road safety case for the scheme has also been revisited to ensure framework in May 2011, with a focus on high-risk that it is as up to date as possible. groups in the short term and longer term benefits from The Department for Transport is currently considering technology and safer driving. the allocation of development funding for the ‘future The Government’s Growth Review and National schemes’. This would see investment in a small number Infrastructure Plan, published in November 2011, identifies of schemes to progress pre-construction work and thereby transport as a key economic infrastructure sector and, maintain a pipeline of major investment in the strategic through the Autumn Statement, an additional £1 billion road network. Any announcements will be made in due of new investment will be used to tackle areas of congestion course. and improve the national road network. M6: West Midlands
Mark Pritchard: To ask the Secretary of State for NORTHERN IRELAND Transport if she will hold discussions with local authorities in the West Midlands on the possibility of Co-operatives extending the M6 toll road. [88951]
Mike Penning: My officials regularly engage with Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for authorities in the West Midlands, and would be willing Northern Ireland what steps (a) his Department and to discuss the possibility of extending the M6 Toll. (b) those bodies for which his Department is responsible are taking to mark UN Year of the Road Signs and Markings Co-operative 2012; and if he will make a statement. [88608] Mr Knight: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport what plans her Department has to make Mr Paterson: As my Department has no policy greater use of vehicle information signs on motorways responsibility for co-operatives in Northern Ireland—these and A roads to inform motorists of congestion, are devolved matters for the Northern Ireland accidents and road closures; and if she will make a Executive—we have no opportunity to mark the United statement. [87695] Nation International Year of Co-operatives in 2012.
Mike Penning: Following the recent Traffic Signs Debt Collection Regulations review, undertaken by the Department for Transport, the Highways Agency now have greater ability Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for to inform drivers about traffic conditions. For example, Northern Ireland how many times his Department has signs can now be set to; used the services of debt recovery companies since May Give advance warning of severe weather (up to 24-hours in 2010; which companies were used; and if he will make a advance of a forecast event), statement. [88372] Give multi-modal messages warning of delays to other forms of transport (for example a closure of an airport or major train Mr Paterson: The Northern Ireland Office has not station). used the services of debt recovery companies since Furthermore, the Agency are continually improving May 2010. their information provision to customers with initiatives such as: Departmental Equality Improved travel time legends to show the time it takes to travel between two points affected by congestion or delays. Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Legends that can be set to inform drivers when a closed road Northern Ireland what equality impact assessments his will re-open. Department has carried out since May 2010; and for Legends to inform drivers that a road has now re-opened. what purpose in each case. [88588] 311W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 312W
Mr Paterson: The Northern Ireland Office considers £ equality issues in exercising its functions, to comply with equality legislation and to ensure it understands September 2011 154,580 how its activities will affect different people. In the October 2011 52,516 specified period, the Northern Ireland Office has not November 2011 138,452 undertaken any equality impact assessments. Developing Countries: Agriculture JUSTICE Young Offenders: Health Education Laura Sandys: To ask the Secretary of State for International Development how much his Department Sadiq Khan: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice has spent on supporting agricultural production in what information is collected from prisoners on their developing countries in each year since 1997. [88517] (a) health and (b) education on entry to the secure estate; and whether any other information is collected Mr O’Brien: The Department for International on entry. [87920] Development (DFID) does not measure aggregate spend on support for agricultural production, as a wide range Mr Blunt: All newly arriving prisoners into prison are of activities supported by DFID contribute directly and screened by a trained nurse or trained officer to assess indirectly to agricultural production. However, support their health needs and to ensure appropriate treatment. for increasing agriculture productivity has been a major People with a mental health problem, or vulnerable to focus of DFID’s agricultural research budget which has suicide, are referred for a mental health assessment. increased from £35.6 million in 2005-06 to £70 million Prisoners are also screened or assessed for literacy, in 2010-11, DFID’s agricultural research budget has language and numeracy skills and where a need is funded a wide range of research projects, including crop identified a referral is made to the establishment’s education research by the Consultative Group on International provider. Agricultural Research (CGIAR), a consortium of Other recorded details of newly arriving prisoners international agricultural research centres. CGIAR rice include the name and contact details of their next of and maize breeding is attributed with lifting two million kin or nominated contact, the prisoner’s ethnic group, people out of poverty per year in India and 740,000 per and their religion (including nil religion). Newly arrived year in Africa. DFID has also co-funded GALVmed prisoners also undergo a cell sharing risk assessment for (Global Alliance for Livestock Veterinary Medicines) potential harm from and to others and screening is also to make the vaccine for east coast fever (ECF) more carried out to identify any risks of self-harm. accessible and affordable to livestock keepers. ECF is a All prisoners must also be photographed in accordance tick-transmitted disease that threatens more than 25 million with the National Security Framework. Features that cattle across eastern and southern Africa each year. will aid identification including tattoos, scars, and biometric data must also be recorded. Developing Countries: Biofuels
INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT Laura Sandys: To ask the Secretary of State for International Development what steps his Department Departmental Apprentices is taking to address the loss of agricultural land due to biofuel production in developing countries. [88326] Mr Umunna: To ask the Secretary of State for International Development how much funding from the public purse has been allocated to sponsor Mr O’Brien: The Department for International apprenticeships in each of the public bodies for which Development (DFID) is committed to ensuring biofuel his Department is responsible between (a) April 2010 production does not jeopardise food security of poor and March 2011, (b) April 2011 and March 2012 and people in developing countries. We also recognise that (c) April 2012 and March 2013. [88722] biofuel production can play a positive role in promoting access to energy and agricultural development, providing Mr Duncan: The Department for International the production systems benefit smallholder farmers and Development allocated funding to sponsor apprenticeships appropriate safeguards on land acquisition are in place. as follows: Together with other Government Departments, DFID April 2010 to March 2011: £20,000 has been successful in ensuring that UK and EC policy April 2011 to March 2012: £10,000 takes into account the impact (positive and negative) of April 2012 to March 2013: Not yet allocated. biofuels on developing countries. We are currently Departmental Redundancy Pay contributing to the Department for Energy and Climate Change’s new bioenergy strategy (to be published later Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for in 2012) to ensure biofuel feedstocks sourced from International Development how much redundancy pay developing countries do not adversely affect food security, was paid to civil servants in his Department in each for example by converting land used for food production month between September and November 2011. [88000] to biofuel production. It is worth noting that under the Government’s renewable transport fuels obligation, which Mr Duncan: DFID spent the following amounts on is the principal mechanism for increasing biofuel use, voluntary redundancies between September and November less than 0.1% of UK biofuel has been reported as 2011 in line with the terms of the Civil Service coming from Africa since the obligation came into force Compensation scheme. in 2008. 313W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 314W
Developing Countries: Business Apprenticeships deliver strong value for money, with good progression in employment and continued learning. Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for Small employers, who often do not have human resource International Development what steps his Department departments, or dedicated training budgets, can find it is taking to assist the UK’s bilateral partner countries more challenging to take on their first apprentice, providing to improve the conditions for doing business in their an incentive payment to support them in doing so will countries; if he will place in the Library examples of enable them to offer new opportunities to young people. UK-funded development programmes that have improved business conditions in developing countries; Children: Disadvantaged if he will respond to the recommendations in the 2012 Doing Business Report; and if he will make a Charlotte Leslie: To ask the Secretary of State for statement. [88766] Education with reference to the Autumn Statement, how many disadvantaged two-year-olds in each (a) Mr O’Brien: The Department for International region, (b) local authority and (c) parliamentary Development (DFID) is committed to making British constituency will receive 15 hours a week free early international development policy more focused on boosting education and childcare. [87399] economic growth and wealth creation in developing countries. As part of this effort, 25 DFID country Sarah Teather: The Autumn Statement provides that, offices are implementing a wide range of business by 2014, some 260,000 two-year-olds in England will be environment reform programmes that will improve the entitled to free early education. conditions for doing business in those countries. Moreover, DFID is supporting the Investment Climate Facility The Government have announced that they plan to (ICF) for Africa to work with governments, private take a phased approach to the implementation of the sector and other stakeholders in 29 countries across the new entitlement. The 20% most disadvantaged two-year- continent to reduce the time, costs and risks of doing olds—around 130,000 children—will become eligible business in those countries; information on these for free places from September 2013. The entitlement programmes and their results can be found on the ICF will then be extended to around 40% of two-year-olds— website: some 260,000 children—from September 2014. www.icfafrica.org The Government are currently consulting, until The UK Government through DFID, together with 3 February 2012, on the proposal that the first phase several other donors, also provides funding to the World will include two-year-olds from families meeting the Bank Group’s Investment Climate Advisory Services benefits criteria also used for free school meals, and (FIAS), which provides advice and assistance to developing looked-after children. The following table sets out the country governments in support of their follow-up reforms number of two-year-olds who would be likely to be to the annual Doing Business reports. eligible by local authority and region in this first phase. Numbers are not available by parliamentary constituency. I will place in the Library a document which gives examples of other UK-funded bilateral and multilateral We will make a further announcement in due course development programmes which are improving business about how we plan to determine eligibility for 40% of conditions in developing countries: ‘The Engine of two-year-olds when the entitlement is extended from Development, The Private Sector and Prosperity for September 2014. Poor People’ (DFID, 2011). This report is also available Number of families with a child aged two, with an income of £16,190 or less and on our website: receiving child tax credit, April 2011 Number (to the nearest 100) http://www.dfid.gov.uk/Documents/publications1/Private- sector-approach-paper-May2011.pdf England 136,400 Although the 2012 Doing Business report does not contain recommendations, DFID welcomes the report North East 7,900 and its main findings. In particular, the global country Darlington 200 ranking of the ‘ease of doing business’ is an influential Durham 1,700 way to stimulate reform in the countries where we work. Gateshead 600 Hartlepool 400 Middlesbrough 600 Newcastle upon Tyne 900 EDUCATION North Tyneside 500 Northumberland 600 Apprentices Redcar and Cleveland 400 South Tyneside 500 Mr Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for Stockton-on-Tees 700 Education if he will assess the merits of subsidising Sunderland 1,000 wage costs from the public purse for apprentices aged 16 to 18 years. [82556] North West 20,100 Blackburn with Darwen 600 Mr Hayes: The Government have announced that we Blackpool 500 will incentivise small employers who have not been Bolton 1,000 previously engaged in the apprenticeships programme Bury 500 to take on their first young apprentices aged 16-24. Up Cheshire East 600 to 40,000 places will be available. Cheshire West and Chester 700 315W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 316W
Number of families with a child aged two, with an income of £16,190 or less and Number of families with a child aged two, with an income of £16,190 or less and receiving child tax credit, April 2011 receiving child tax credit, April 2011 Number (to the nearest 100) Number (to the nearest 100)
Cumbria 900 Bedford borough 500 Halton 500 Cambridgeshire 1,100 Knowsley 600 Central Bedfordshire 500 Lancashire 2,700 Essex 2,700 Liverpool 1,800 Hertfordshire 2,200 Manchester 2,300 Luton 700 Oldham 800 Norfolk 2,000 Rochdale 900 Peterborough 700 Salford 900 Southend-on-Sea 600 Sefton 500 Suffolk 1,600 St. Helens 600 Thurrock 600 Stockport 600 Tameside 700 London 26,300 Trafford 300 Barking and Dagenham 1,200 Warrington 400 Barnet 800 Wigan 800 Bexley 700 Wirral 1,000 Brent 1,000 Bromley. 700 Yorkshire and the Humber 14,700 Camden 600 Barnsley 800 City of London — Bradford 1,900 Croydon 1,400 Calderdale 600 Ealing 1,100 Doncaster 1,000 Enfield 1,400 East Riding of Yorkshire 400 Greenwich 1,100 Kingston Upon Hull, City of 1,100 Hackney 1,000 Kirklees 1,000 Hammersmith and Fulham 500 Leeds 2,300 Haringey 1,000 North East Lincolnshire 600 Harrow 400 North Lincolnshire 400 Havering 500 North Yorkshire 700 Hillingdon 900 Rotherham 800 Hounslow 900 Sheffield 1,600 Islington 800 Wakefield 1,000 Kensington and Chelsea 300 York 300 Kingston upon Thames 300 Lambeth 1,300 East Midlands 10,800 Lewisham 1,100 Derby 700 Merton 500 Derbyshire 1,600 Newham 1,100 Leicester 1,400 Redbridge 600 Leicestershire 900 Richmond upon Thames 200 Lincolnshire 1,800 Southwark 900 Northamptonshire 1,700 Sutton 500 Nottingham 1,200 Tower Hamlets 1,200 Nottinghamshire 1,500 Waltham Forest 1,000 Rutland — Wandsworth 700 Westminster 600
West Midlands 16,800 Birmingham 4,700 South East 16,800 Coventry 900 Bracknell Forest 300 Dudley 900 Brighton and Hove 600 Herefordshire 300 Buckinghamshire 700 Sandwell 1,400 East Sussex 1,100 Shropshire 400 Hampshire 2,100 Isle of Wight 300 Solihull 400 Kent 3,300 Staffordshire 1,600 Medway 700 Stoke-on-Trent 1,100 Milton Keynes 800 Telford and Wrekin 600 Oxfordshire 1,000 Walsall 1,200 Portsmouth 600 Warwickshire 1,000 Reading 400 Wolverhampton 1,100 Slough 500 Worcestershire 1,100 Southampton 900 Surrey 1,600 East of England 13,100 West Berkshire 300 317W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 318W
Number of families with a child aged two, with an income of £16,190 or less and (2) have used private email accounts to discuss the receiving child tax credit, April 2011 possible dismissal of officials in his Department; Number (to the nearest 100) [88074] West Sussex 1,300 (3) used private email accounts to discuss (i) the free Windsor and Maidenhead — school application by Katherine Birbalsingh and (ii) Wokingham 200 any other free school application; [88075] (4) used private email accounts to discuss the South West 10,000 cancellation of the Building Schools for the Future Bath and North East Somerset 200 programme. [88076] Bournemouth 400 Bristol, City of 1,200 Tim Loughton [holding answer 10 January 2012]: Cornwall 900 The Department seeks legal advice on a wide variety of Devon 1,200 matters related to its functions, and Ministers and Special Dorset 700 Advisers discuss a range of issues using different media. Gloucestershire 800 Legal advice is subject to legal professional privilege Isles of Scilly— and the Department does not routinely disclose whether or not it has taken such advice on particular matters. North Somerset 400 The Information Commissioner published guidance on Plymouth 700 15 December 2011 concerning information held in private Poole 300 email accounts. The Cabinet Office is considering this Somerset 900 and will issue further guidance to Departments. South Gloucestershire 500 Swindon 600 GCSE Torbay 400 Wiltshire 700 Damian Hinds: To ask the Secretary of State for Notes: Education what proportion of pupils in (a) 1. These indicative figures are derived from a sample. Numbers at local comprehensive and (b) independent schools achieved authority level are relatively small, so are subject to statistical error. In forecasting eligibility for the two-year-old offer, local authorities may also want to draw on five A* to C grades at GCSE (i) in total and (ii) other available information, such as numbers and proportions of school age including English and mathematics in (A) 1997 and (B) children known to be eligible for free school meals, and demographic projections. 2010. [73233] Please note that the table will have no figure where the number of children eligible within a local authority is less than 100. 2. Figures are estimates, subject to statistical error. 95% Confidence intervals for Mr Gibb: The available information is given in the an estimate of 500 children are plus or minus 88 children; for an estimate of following table. 1,000 are plus or minus 124; and for an estimate of 2,000 are plus or minus 175 (for couples with children, lone parents imply a larger confidence interval) Percentage of pupils in comprehensive and independent mainstream schools who achieved five or more A* to C grades at GCSE or equivalent in total and 2. No adjustment is made to reflect that some families will have more than one 1 1, 2 child aged two. including English and Mathematics, 1997 (final) and 2010 (revised) 3. Individual LA totals may not sum to regional or England total due to Comprehensive schools3,4 Independent mainstream rounding. schools4 Source: 5+ A*-C inc. 5+ A*-C inc. HMRC 5+ A*-C English and 5+ A*-C English and http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/stats/personal-tax-credits/cwtc-geog-stats.htm grades mathematics grades mathematics
Early Intervention Grant 19975 41.8 31.3 82.5 77.9 20106 76.7 54.7 87.1 48.0 1 Including attempts and achievements by these pupils in previous academic Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for years. Education how much each recipient organisation 2 iGCSEs, accredited as at January 2011, have been counted in 2010 figures as received from the Early Intervention Grant in (a) GCSE equivalents and also as English and maths GCSEs. 3 Including City Technology Colleges and Academies. 2010-11 and (b) 2011-12. [87729] 4 School type as recorded in the Secondary School Performance Tables. 5 Figures for 1997 are based on pupils on roll aged 15 at the beginning of the Sarah Teather [holding answer 20 December 2012]: academic year. 6 Figures for 2010 are based on pupils at the end of Key Stage 4. The Early Intervention Grant (EIG) is an un-ring-fenced Source: and un-hypothecated grant to local authorities in England Secondary School Performance Tables. which came into effect in April 2011. The grant replaced Only accredited iGCSEs are included in these measures a number of funding streams to local authorities which for 2010. A large number of pupils in independent ended in March 2011. The allocations for both 2010-11 schools took unaccredited iGCSEs in mathematics in and 2011-12 are available at: 2010. http://www.education.gov.uk/childrenandyoungpeople/ The 2010 figures given here were published in the earlylearningandchildcare/a0070357/early-intervention-grant- Statistical First Release “GCSE and Equivalent Results frequently-asked-questions/ in England, 2009/10 (Revised)” at the following link http://www.education.gov.uk/rsgateway/DB/SFR/s000985/ Email index.shtml The equivalent information for 2011 was published Stephen Twigg: To ask the Secretary of State for on 20 October 2011 in the Statistical First Release Education whether (a) he and (b) his special advisers “GCSE and Equivalent Results in England, 2010/11 (1) sought legal advice as to whether the deletion of (Provisional)”. This information can be found in tables private emails concerning Government business sent or 5 and 6 of this publication which is available at the received by him or his special advisers constitutes a following link breach of section 77 of the Freedom of Information http://www.education.gov.uk/rsgateway/DB/SFR/s001034/ Act 2000; [88073] index.shtml 319W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 320W
Pupil Premium: Pendle The Government have a wide ranging set of measures in place to protect businesses and individuals from Andrew Stephenson: To ask the Secretary of State for cyber attacks and our new national Cyber Security-Strategy Education how many students have benefited from published in November: pupil premium funding in Pendle constituency since http://www.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/resource-library/cyber- April 2011. [84731] security-strategy sets out our plans for how we will improve the UK’s Sarah Teather: Pupil premium funding is provided in cyber security and build confidence by creating a more respect of pupils known to be eligible for free school secure and resilient cyberspace. meals, children in care who have been continuously The Government also supports Get Safe Online, a looked after for at least six months and children whose joint government/industry initiative to raise awareness parents are serving in the armed forces. In the Pendle of internet security and educate and empower people constituency in January 2011 there were 2,241 pupils and firms to protect themselves online. known to be eligible for FSM and 13 service children. The total number of pupils eligible for the pupil premium EU Law in the Pendle constituency may be higher, but it is not possible to identify the number of pupils in each John Mann: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet parliamentary constituency recorded as being in care or Office how many of the regulations his Department recorded in the alternative provision census as, in both brought into force through (a) primary legislation, (b) cases, the returns are provided at local authority level secondary legislation and (c) other means originated rather than at establishment level. from proposals by the European Commission in (i) 2010 and (ii) 2011. [88961]
CABINET OFFICE Mr Maude: In 2010 and 2011, the Cabinet Office did not bring into force any regulations, by any means, Charities: VAT originating from proposals by the European Commission.
Jon Trickett: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Third Sector Office if he will extend eligibility for the VAT refund scheme to charities who deliver public services under a Mr Thomas: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet contract with a public sector organisation. [88783] Office on how many occasions the ministerial group on the Big Society has met; what subjects were on its Mr Gauke: I have been asked to reply on behalf of agenda at each meeting; and on what dates these the Treasury. meetings took place. [87537] There are no plans to provide VAT refunds to charities delivering public services under a contract with a public Mr Hurd: The informal ministerial group on Big sector organisation. Society and Localism has met three times on the following In many cases, EU VAT rules mean that it would not dates, considering the following agenda items: be necessary or possible to provide a refund scheme to 21 July 2010: any contracted provider of public services. The provision The Big Society vision of any services under a contract, by a charity or a Role of the adviser on Big Society business, will normally be regarded as a business activity The compact and thus within the scope of VAT. Therefore, if the services provided are taxable (in other words, they are 28 October 2010: not specifically exempted from VAT) the provider will Locally integrated services be able to recover their VAT costs through the normal Spending review and voluntary, community and social enterprise VAT system. organisations However, if the services provided are VAT exempt, Big Society vanguard areas any form of VAT refund is prohibited under EU VAT 16 March 2011: law. Where a provider does incur irrecoverable VAT in Community budgets and locally integrated services the provision of public services, these costs should be Community capability taken into account by the contracting public sector organisation when agreeing funding. Strategic communications Cybercrime: Crime Prevention
Mike Weatherley: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE Office what (a) cyber and (b) physical steps he is taking to protect UK businesses and individual Co-operatives internet users from cyber infrastructure attacks. [88405] Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy Mr Maude: The Government takes the threat of and Climate Change what steps (a) his Department cyber attacks very seriously which is why we have allocated and (b) those bodies for which his Department is additional funding of £650 million over four years to responsible are taking to mark UN Year of the respond effectively to threats from cyberspace through Co-operative 2012; and if he will make a statement. the National Cyber Security programme. [88603] 321W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 322W
Gregory Barker: Departments will work closely with All future apprenticeships will be based on suitable Cabinet Office, the Mutuals Taskforce and with vacancies arising within the Department. Cooperatives UK to develop and take full advantage of opportunities to celebrate the achievements of co-operative Energy Efficiency Deployment Office: Public organisations during the United Nations International Appointments Year of Co-operatives. Specifically, DECC is working to support local Dr Whitehead: To ask the Secretary of State for communities to develop co-op structures for ownership Energy and Climate Change when he plans to appoint of renewable energy infrastructure locally through our a (a) chair and (b) director to administer the Energy “Community Energy On-Line” website. Efficiency Deployment Office. [88522] We have also just launched a programme for community energy called LEAF (Local Energy Assessment Fund) Gregory Barker: As soon as possible. which is open to cooperatives and encourages communities to look at renewable energy options. Energy: Prices The Mutuals Taskforce has recently indicated it will play a co-ordinating role for Departments to support David Mowat: To ask the Secretary of State for the International Yearof Co-operatives, with Cooperatives Energy and Climate Change what assessment he has UK leading the Taskforce’s work in this area. made of the effect on energy bills of (a) the Green Deal, (b) feed-in tariffs, (c) Contract for Difference Departmental Apprentices and (d) other subsidies offered by his Department. [88877] Mr Umunna: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change how many apprentices Charles Hendry: On 23 November 2011, alongside were employed by his Department between (a) April the annual energy statement, DECC published an 2010 and March 2011 and (b) April and December assessment of the impact of climate change and energy 2011; and how many apprenticeships he plans that his polices on energy prices and bills for an average household, Department will sponsor between (i) January and medium-sized business user and large energy intensive March 2012 and (ii) April and March 2013. [89216] user in 2011, 2020 and 2030, available online at: http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cms/meeting_energy/aes/ Gregory Barker: Between April 2010 to March 2011 impacts/impacts.aspx DECC had 14 staff undertaking an apprenticeship The headline results are presented in table 1. A programme. breakdown of the separate gas and electricity bill impacts Between April and December 2011 DECC had one by individual policies is presented in the set of tables in new apprenticeship start (with the above continuing). annex F (from page 67) of the aforementioned document.
Table 1: Estimated impact of energy and climate change policies on average energy (gas plus electricity) bills compared with bills in the absence of policies Real 2010 prices 2011 2020 2030
Household Bill without policies £1,229 £1,379 £1,474 Bill with policies £1,249 £1,285 £1,427 Impact of policies £19 (2%) -£94 (-7%) -£46 (-3%) Of which: Green Deal and ECO1, 2 n/a £42 -£20 Small-scale feed-in tariffs £1 £6 £6 EMR (CfDs and capacity payments) n/a £41 £50 Other policies £18 -£183 -£82
Medium-sized business user Bill without policies £1,550,000 £1,738,000 £1,829,000 Bill with policies £1,821,000 £2,073,000 £2,337,000 Impact of policies £271,000 (18%) £335,000 (19%) £508,000 (28%) Of which: Green Deal2 n/a -£16,000 -£16,000 Small-scale feed-in tariffs £3,000 £15,000 £14,000 EMR (CfDs and capacity payments) n/a £96,000 £117,000 Other policies £268,000 £240,000 £394,000
Large energy intensive industrial user Bill without policies £8.2 to £15.6 million £9.3 to £17.4 million £9.7 to £18.0 million Bill with policies £8.4 to £17.5 million £9.4 to £20.9 million £10.8 to £24.1 million Impact of policies £0.3 to £1.9 million (3% to 12%) £0.2 to £3.5 million (2% to 20%) £1.1 to £6.1 million (11% to 34%) Of which: Green Deal2 n/a n/a n/a Small-scale feed-in tariffs £0 to £30,000 £0 to £138,000 £0 to £124,000 323W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 324W
Table 1: Estimated impact of energy and climate change policies on average energy (gas plus electricity) bills compared with bills in the absence of policies Real 2010 prices 2011 2020 2030
EMR (CfDs and capacity payments) n/a £0 to £870,000 £0 to £1.1 million Other policies £0.3 to £1.9 million £0.2 to £2.5 million £1.1 to £4.9 million 1 Due to the overlap between the Green Deal and Energy Company Obligation (ECO) in the household sector, the impact of each of the two policies individually cannot be isolated. 2 Estimates of the Green Deal impact are net of the average annual loan repayment. Note: Figures may not add due to rounding. Source: DECC 2012.
Horizon Nuclear Power Gregory Barker: The latest monthly published statistics show that between April 2010 and October 2011, the Tom Greatrex: To ask the Secretary of State for number of solar PV installations (of sub 50 kW capacity) Energy and Climate Change what assessment he has on the Microgeneration Certificate Scheme database made of the implications for (a) security of supply and (MCS) was 127,474. Of these, 70% (89,297) have been (b) competition in the energy marketplace of the sale confirmed on Ofgem’s Central FiT Register (CFR). of equity shares by the Horizon Nuclear Power joint In addition, there were 3,534 solar PV confirmed venture. [88181] installations on the CFR but not registered on the MCS database at the end of December 2011. Of these, 316 Charles Hendry: Horizon Nuclear Power remains a installations were confirmed after 31 October 2011. 50:50 joint venture between E.ON UK and RWE npower. These installations are not registered on the MCS database Horizon and its shareholders have been clear that because the installation capacity is greater than 50 kW, they remain committed to the UK, and are continuing so are additional to the MCS numbers. to develop their plans for around 6 GW of new nuclear The number of solar PV installations registered on capacity, starting with around 3 GW on their lead-site the MCS database between 31 October 2011 and at Wylfa, Anglesey. 12 December 2011 was 102,183. It is the Government’s policy to make the UK energy Warm Front Scheme sector more attractive to new investors and any issues of market competition would be dealt with by the competition Caroline Flint: To ask the Secretary of State for authorities. Energy and Climate Change pursuant to the answer of 15 November 2011, Official Report, column 798W, on Power Failures Warm Front Scheme: St Helens, for how many parliamentary constituencies his Department holds Caroline Flint: To ask the Secretary of State for data on the number of households that have received Energy and Climate Change how many households assistance under the Warm Front Scheme in each of have power supply voltage optimisation devices. [88891] the last five years. [89204] Gregory Barker: We do not have records for how Gregory Barker: Carillion Energy Services hold, on many households have voltage optimisation devices. DECC’s behalf, data on the number of households that These devices are eligible measures for suppliers to have received Warm Front assistance in each parliamentary promote in meeting their household Carbon Emissions constituency. Reduction Target to December 2012, though no schemes Wind Power have been delivered as yet. Jonathan Edwards: To ask the Secretary of State for Solar Power Energy and Climate Change when he plans to visit the proposed site of the Brechfa Forest West wind farm. Caroline Flint: To ask the Secretary of State for [89093] Energy and Climate Change pursuant to the answer of 6 December 2011, Official Report, column 216W, on Charles Hendry: I have no current plans to visit the solar power, whether his Department has any plans to proposed site for this wind farm. This application is (a) undertake or (b) commission research on the currently under examination by the Infrastructure Planning effects of installing solar PV on household energy use. Commission (IPC). I will be making a decision on this [89063] application once the IPC has made its recommendation and therefore it would not be appropriate for me to Gregory Barker: DECC is currently considering what comment further on this application. further evidence may be needed in relation to the effects of installing microgeneration technologies on household energy use. BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS Arms Trade Solar Power: Feed-in Tariffs Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for Caroline Flint: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills what (a) bi-lateral and Energy and Climate Change if he will estimate the (b) multi-lateral meetings (i) he and (ii) his officials average number of feed-in tariff solar PV installations have had with their international counterparts to that were completed between (a) April 2010 and discuss the agreement of a robust arms trade treaty in October 2011 and (b) 31 October and 12 December preparation for the final Preparatory Committee in 2011. [89064] February 2012. [88047] 325W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 326W
Mr Prisk: Officials from this Department have regularly Santander have announced a “breakthrough” programme with formed part of cross-Whitehall teams in support of a £200 million fund aimed at high growth potential firms. Foreign and Commonwealth Office outreach with a The Government are also working with the banks range of international counterparts on the arms trade and other stakeholders to increase SMEs confidence treaty (ATT). These discussions have covered a broad and capability in accessing finance through a Finance range of issues and have been used to gain support for Fitness campaign, which will be putting more and HMG policy objectives on the ATT and to gain an better advice and resources in the hands of small businesses understanding of the concerns of other countries. next year. We have also announced the launch of a National Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for Loan Guarantee Scheme which will aim to support Business, Innovation and Skills what contribution his £20 billion worth of lending to small businesses over the Department is making to developing policy on the next two years. inclusion of import, export, re-export, transit, transhipment, brokering activities and the gifting, loan or lease of arms within the terms of the arms trade Business: Loans treaty. [88055] Mr Umunna: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Prisk: Officials from this Department have been, Business, Innovation and Skills what recent and continue to be, actively engaged in supporting the representations he has received on the steps taken by Foreign and Commonwealth Office on all aspects of the banks that signed up to the Merlin Agreement to arms trade treaty policy development and strategy that initiate pre re-financing dialogues with customers are within the responsibilities of this Department. 12 months before term loans end. [87820]
Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Prisk: The Merlin banks committed to initiating Business, Innovation and Skills how many of his a pre-refinancing dialogue 12 months’ ahead of any Department’s officials at each grade are working on the term loan coming to an end as part of the British arms trade treaty negotiations; whether there has been Bankers’ Association Taskforce in October 2010. These any change in the personnel leading on this matter; and dialogues would include a timely review of business and whether he expects any further changes to be made refinancing needs and an assessment of what needs to before July 2012. [88059] be in place ahead of loan expiry to maximise the prospect of successful refinancing. Mr Prisk: A number of the senior staff of the Export Control Organisation in this Department (SCS Band 1, BIS Ministers are in regular discussion with the banks Grade 7) spend a proportion of their time contributing on this and the other commitments of the British Bankers’ to the UK team negotiating the arms trade treaty. I Association Taskforce. General banking issues are regularly expect that the total level of resource dedicated to this discussed in the quarterly Small Business Economic activity will increase between now and July 2012. Forum, which I chair, and features representatives from a wide range of business groups and the Merlin banks. Business Mr Umunna: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Umunna: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills what recent Business, Innovation and Skills what assessment he has representations he has received on the steps taken by made of the steps the banks that signed up to the the banks that signed up to the Merlin Agreement to Merlin Agreement have taken to encourage increased give more weight to the expectations, capacity and demand for finance from small and medium-sized willingness to lend to small and medium-sized enterprises. [87819] enterprises in the performance metrics of the chief executives and business area leaders. [87821] Mr Prisk: It is absolutely vital that small and medium- sized enterprises (SMEs) have the confidence to seek Mr Prisk: The main representations received on the the finance they need to thrive and grow. Through the Merlin Agreement concern the need for banks to provide British Bankers’ Association, the Merlin banks have set finance on appropriate terms to the viable businesses up the Better Business Finance Taskforce, which in that need it. The Secretary of State for Business, Innovation October 2010 made a number of commitments to repair and Skills, the right hon. Member for Twickenham their relationships with small business customers and (Vince Cable), has made clear his view that the remuneration encourage demand, including a regional outreach of the Merlin banks’ chief executives and relevant programme. senior managers should reflect the bank’s performance The Merlin banks have taken a range of steps to in lending to small and medium enterprises, and the increase take-up of finance by small and medium-sized Merlin banks have publicly committed to this. businesses, for example: Lloyds TSB made new commitments for 2012 in their SME Mr Umunna: To ask the Secretary of State for Charter in November 2011; Business, Innovation and Skills what assessment he has Barclays organised free lending clinics for SMEs throughout made of the progress of delivery using the October and November 2011; 17 commitments made by the British Bankers’ RBS launched a fixed rate product with no fees for SME Association Business Finance Taskforce based on the customers; results of the continuous monitoring his Department HSBC have launched products with discounted interest rates has committed to undertake; and if he will make a for businesses which export or employ; and statement. [87945] 327W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 328W
Mr Prisk: As the Chancellor of the Exchequer said in Copies of the statement have been deposited in both the 29 November 2011 Autumn Statement, Official Libraries of the House, Report, columns 799-810, the Government welcome the The statement shows that the Government’s ‘One-in, progress the banks have made in delivering their One-out’ rule has resulted in an overall reduction in the commitments, as well as their intention to continue to net cost to business and civil society organisations. take these initiatives forward in future. In particular, the Information on costs is provided both by Department Government welcome the British Bankers’ Association’s and as a total for Government. intention to work with community development finance institutions (CDFIs) to put in place a system to refer Mr Umunna: To ask the Secretary of State for unsuccessful loan applicants to CDFIs. Business, Innovation and Skills with reference to the Second Statement of New Regulation which Business: Regulation departments did not (a) pass any deregulatory measures and (b) achieve a net fall in the cost to Mr Umunna: To ask the Secretary of State for businesses in 2011. [87825] Business, Innovation and Skills with reference to the press release issued by the Regulatory Policy Mr Prisk: The second Statement of New Regulation: Committee on 25 July 2011, whether the net cost http://www.bis.gov.uk/policies/bre/better-regulation- figures published in the Second Statement of New framework/one-in-one-out/statement Regulation were independently assessed. [87824] published in September 2011, provides a forecast of deregulatory measures (or ’OUTs’) for 2011. The statement Mr Prisk: I can confirm that the net cost figures in shows the volume (i.e. number of measures) and net the Second Statement of New Regulation were annual regulatory cost to business for each department. independently assessed by the Regulatory Policy Committee. Copies of the statement have been deposited in both Any exceptions are highlighted in the statement published Libraries of the House. by the relevant Department. An update on the final position will be provided in the new statement. Sammy Wilson: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills what assessment he has Mr Umunna: To ask the Secretary of State for made of progress by his Department in implementing Business, Innovation and Skills on which date a final the objective in the coalition agreement to reduce the impact assessment was (a) received and (b) validated burden of administration by introducing a ‘One-in, by the Regulatory Policy Committee for each One-out’ rule for regulation. [87881] regulatory change announced in the Second Statement of New Regulation. [87826] Mr Prisk: The second Statement of New Regulation, published in September 2011, reports on the first year Mr Prisk: The following table shows the regulatory of application of the ‘One-in, One-out’ rule to new changes announced in the Second Statement of New domestic regulation: Regulation and, for each measure, the dates the final http://www.bis.gov.uk/policies/bre/better-regulation- impact assessment was received and the Regulatory framework/one-in-one-out/statement Policy Committee’s Opinion was issued.
IA No. Title Date final IA received Date opinion issued
BIS0172 The Insolvency (Amendment) Regulations 2011 25 March 2011 9 May 2011 BIS0083 Weights and Measures (Specified Quantities) (Unwrapped 5 January 2011 1 February 2011 Bread and Intoxicating Liquor) Order 2011 BIS0283 Public Policy Exclusion Order (Complex Weapons) 27 June 2011 5 July 2011 (Revocation) 2011 BIS0027 Special Administration Regime of the Postal Services Act 5 August 2011 19 August 2011 2011 BIS0135 The Patents County Court (Financial Limits) (No.2) Order 10 January 2011 1 February 2011 2011 BIS0303 The Overseas Companies (Execution of Documents and 18 May 2011 8 June 2011 Registration of Charges) Regulations 2011 BIS0146, BIS0093, BIS0288 The Scheme for Construction Contracts (England and 16 May 2011 10 June 2011 Wales) Regulations 1998 (Amendment)(England) Regulations 2011, The Construction Contracts (England) Exclusion Order 2011, The Local Democracy, Economic Development and Construction Act 2009 (Commencement No.2)(England) Order 2011 BIS0073 Amendment to the Patents Act to provide for Online Patent 21 June 2011 5 July 2011 File Inspection Order 2011 BIS0181 Companies Act 2006 (Annual Returns) Regulations 2011 12 March2011 12 April 2011 BIS0292 The Companies (Disclosure of Auditor Remuneration and 26 July 2011 1 August 2011 Liability Limitation Agreements) (Amendment) Regulations 2011 DCLG0032 The Town and Country Planning (Environmental Impact 4 May 2011 16 May 2011 Assessment) Regulations 2011 DCLG5004 The Town and Country Planning (General Permitted 3 March 2011 13 April 2011 Development) (Amendment) (England) Order 2011 DCLG5001 The Town and Country Planning (Control of 10 March 2011 12 April 2011 Advertisements) (Amendment) (England) Order 2011 329W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 330W
IA No. Title Date final IA received Date opinion issued
DCLG0024 The Infrastructure Planning (Changes to, and Revocation of, 29 July 2011 8 August 2011 Development, Consent Orders) Regulations 2011 DCLG0036 Building (Amendment) Regulations 2011 15 April 2011 5 May 2011 CO1006,7,8 The Charities Act 2006 (Changes in Exempt Charities) Order 26 July 2011 4 August 2011 2011 DCMS10 The Media Ownership (Radio and Cross media) order 2010 22 October 2010 9 November 2010 DCMS007 Gambling Act 2005: Category B3 Gaming Machine 9 May 2011 17 May 2011 DECC0030 EU Third package - licence modification appeals 22 June 2011 13 July 2011 DECC0056 Extending Compulsory Purchase Powers to change of use of 4 March2011 22 March2011 pipelines to C02 transport DECC0019 Third Party access to upstream petroleum infrastructure 5 July 2011 5 August 2011 DECC0011 Repeal of 18 Exemption Orders for low risk use of 1 April 2011 19 April 2011 radioactive substances DECC0048 Raising the threshold for energy supplier participation in 28 March 2011 18 April 2011 social and environmental programmes DECC0020 Introduction of a Special Administration Regime 24 June 2011 2 August 2011 DEFRA1145 Flood and Water Management Act (2010) Implementation 28 July 2011 10 August 2011 of sections 38 and 39 Incidental Flooding. DEFRA1261 Flood and Water Management Act (2010) Implementation 24 February 2011 21 March 2011 of Section 7 (6) on cooperation and sharing information. DEFRA1147 The Water Industry (Schemes for Adoption of Private 7 March 2011 21 March 2011 Sewers) Regulations 2011. DEFRA1082 Amendments to Schedules 5 and 8 of the Wildlife and 8 August 2011 17 August 2011 Countryside Act 1981 DEFRA1199 Flood and Water Management Act (2010) Implementation 11 May 2011 3 June 2011 of Section 27(2) guidance on sustainable development duty. DEFRA1133 Simplification of the contaminated land regime. 13 September 2011 20 September 2011 DEFRA1055 Amendment of Pigs (Records, Identification and Movement) 14 July 2011 3 August 2011 Order 2007 DEFRA1071 The Water Supply (Amendment to the Threshold 17 June 2011 28 June 2011 Requirement) Regulations 2011 DEFRA1306 The Welfare of Animals (Slaughter or Killing) (Amendment) n/a 1— (England) Regulations 2011. DEFRA0185 The Environmental Protection (Controls on Ozone- 10 May 2011 20 May 2011 Depleting Substances) Regulations 2011 DEFRA0168 Cattle Identification (Amendment) Regulation. n/a 1— DfT00084 The Equality Act 2010 - Application of Part 5 to Seafarers 15 March 2011 28 March 2011 DfT00004 M25 Motorway Junctions 2 to 3 (Variable Speed Limits) 13 July 2011 12 August 2011 Regulations 2011 DfT00046 The Vehicle Drivers (Certificates of Professional 13 July 2011 2 August 2011 Competence) (Amendment) Regulations 2011 DfT00107 Revocations of the explosive provision in Classification and 8 June 2011 21 June 2011 Labelling of Explosive Regulations 1983 DH0662 Prohibition on the sale of tobacco from vending machines 10 August 2011 20 September 2011 DH3007 To include the medical exposure of self-referred 7 March 2011 30 March 2011 asymptomatic individuals within the Ionising Radiation (Medical Exposure) Regulations 2000 (IRMER) DH5059 Recognition of pharmacist qualifications awarded in the 9 May 2011 27 May 2011 European Economic Area and Switzerland: removing the “Three-year rule” from new pharmacies DWP0011 Occupational Pensions Schemes (Employer Debt and 5 September 2011 15 September 2011 Miscellaneous Amendment) Regulations 2011 FOOD0092 Earned Recognition in the Dairy Sector (England and 10 August 2011 23 August 2011 Wales) HMT1102C The Financial Services and Markets Act (FSMA) 2000 11 July 2011 20 July 2011 (Carrying on Regulated Activities by Way of Business)(Amendment) Order-regulation of sale and rent back agreements HMT0021 Introducing a protected cell regime for UK open ended 2 August 2011 25 August 2011 investment companies HMT1137 Early implementation measures of Amending Directive 17 June 2011 5 July 2011 2003/71/EC on the prospectus to be published when securities are offered to the public or admitted to trading HMT1106 Legislative Reform Order on mutuals 10 February 2011 4 March 2011 HMT1102D The Financial Services and Markets Act 2000 11 July 2011 20 July 2011 (Exemption)(Amendment) Order- Northern Ireland housing associations N/A Civil Partnerships on Religious Premises 9 August 2011 15 August 2011 N/A Specification for Firearms n/a 2— MoJ 0008 Implementation of the Legal Services Act 2007 23 July 2011 3 August 2011 1 These measures were included in SNR2 but were departmental estimates based on consultation stage impact assessment. Final figure subject to approvalby Regulatory Policy Committee in due course, on basis of final stage impact assessments. 2 Due to the negligible cost of this measure, an impact assessment was not been deemed necessary. The measure was included in Home Office SNR2 for consistency with the previous Statement of New Regulation. 331W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 332W
Mr Umunna: To ask the Secretary of State for Departmental Equality Business, Innovation and Skills whether the moratorium on new domestic regulation for micro- Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for businesses and start-ups was applied to all (a) Business, Innovation and Skills what equality impact regulatory measures and (b) deregulatory measures assessments his Department has carried out since May announced in the Second Statement of New 2010; and for what purpose in each case. [88572] Regulation. [87827] Mr Davey: The Department for Business, Innovation Mr Prisk: The guidance on the micro-business and Skills considers equality issues in exercising its moratorium, functions, to comply with equality legislation and to http://www.bis.gov.uk/assets/biscore/better-regulation/docs/g/ ensure it understands how its activities will affect different 11-1198-guidance-moratorium-on-new-domestic- people. It provides information about this consideration regulation.pdf in various ways. In the specified period, this information was applied to each measure in the Statement of New was sometimes published in the form of an equality Regulation impact assessment, although there has never been a http://www.bis.gov.uk/assets/biscore/better-regulation/docs/o/ legal requirement to produce such a document. 11-p96b-one-in-one-out-second-statement-new-regulation.pdf We have published seven such documents during the period. These are available on the Department’s website. Mr Umunna: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills whether his Departmental Manpower Department plans to conduct a review of the moratorium on new domestic regulation for micro- Luciana Berger: To ask the Secretary of State for businesses and start-ups in order to ensure that the Business, Innovation and Skills how many people were moratorium is being applied correctly in accordance working in his Department on (a) 11 May 2010 and with the relevant guidance; and if so when he plans to (b) 8 December 2011. [87344] publish such a review. [87828] Mr Davey: The following table shows number of staff Mr Prisk: The Government have no plans to conduct employed by BIS on 11 May 2010 and 8 December a review of the moratorium on new domestic regulation 2011. To note these figures are based on staff on payroll. for micro-businesses and start-ups at the present time. Headcount total Headcount total Cluster Munitions Date Including UKTI excluding UKTI 11 May 2010 3,607 3,054 Mr Kennedy: To ask the Secretary of State for 8 December 2011 2,996 2,448 Business, Innovation and Skills when he last met representatives of (a) banks and (b) other financial Departmental Recruitment institutions to discuss direct or indirect investment in the manufacture of cluster bombs; and if he will make a statement. [87938] Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills how much his Department spent on recruitment agencies in each Mr Prisk: The Secretary of State for Business, month since September 2011. [88014] Innovation and Skills, the right hon. Member for Twickenham (Vince Cable), has had no discussions with Mr Davey: In each month since September 2011, the representative of banks or other financial institutions Department has paid (on a cash basis rather than a about direct or indirect investment in the manufacture resource accounting basis) the following amounts to of cluster bombs. recruitment agencies:
Council for Science and Technology 2011 £
September 253,555 Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for October 242,178 Business, Innovation and Skills how much funding the November 420,292 Council for Science and Technology (CST) (a) received in 2010-11 and (b) will receive in 2011-12; what estimate he has made of the number of full-time Departmental Redundancy Pay equivalent staff working for the CST in each year; and if he will make a statement. [88023] Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills how much redundancy Mr Willetts: £47,000 was spent on the activities of pay was paid to civil servants in his Department in each the Council for Science and Technology (CST) in 2010-11. month between September and November 2011. The budget for 2011-12 is £50,000. No staff work [88012] directly for the CST which is an advisory non-departmental public body. The staff in the CST Secretariat are employed Mr Davey: The Department paid in total £4,413,545.51 by the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills. in respect of redundancy costs between September and Three full-time equivalent staff worked in the CST November 2011. The monthly costs are shown in the Secretariat in both 2010-11 and 2011-12. following table. 333W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 334W
It is now possible to form a UK company online with no 2011 £ reduction in creditor or investor protection. September 1,630,077.45 Over 95% of companies now file at least one document October 867,911.45 electronically and over 92% of companies file their accounts on time. The public register is updated with this information within November 1,915,556.61 24 hours. This information is then available via the web in real time. Departmental Temporary Employment UK company law has been substantially overhauled. The Corporate Governance Code for listed companies and Stewardship Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Code for investors are developed and maintained by the Financial Business, Innovation and Skills how many temporary Reporting Council. staff were recruited to his Department between The UK has a robust independent court system. Key judgments September and November 2011. [88013] are widely reported and available on the internet. The insolvency regime is subject to ongoing monitoring and Mr Davey: The Department for Business, Innovation review. We have recently consulted on plans to increase transparency and Skills recruited seven temporary staff in the period in ’pre-pack’ administrations, the regulation of Insolvency Practitioners between September and November 2011. and the application process for bankruptcy and winding-up of companies. More generally the insolvency regime has been recently Foreign Investment in UK tested in the deepest recession for generations and most commentators have agreed that it did its job very effectively in extremely difficult circumstances. Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for We will shortly be bringing forward for parliamentary approval Business, Innovation and Skills what steps his proposals to make it easier for companies to use their assets to Department has taken to (1) improve the UK’s ranking raise finance. in the World Bank’s 2012 Doing Business Report; and We are ensuring that businesses can access the finance they what steps his Department has taken to address the need to grow their business through measures such as the Enterprise findings of previous Doing Business reports; [88763] Finance Guarantee and the new National Loan Guarantee Scheme, (2) (a) strengthen courts, the insolvency regime and which will provide up to £200 billion of guarantees for bank funding over the next two years allowing banks to offer lower cost other legal institutions and (b) increase the legal lending to small and medium-sized enterprises (SMEs.) We have protection of investors and property rights in order to also transformed the way we enable people to receive the advice make it easier to do business in the UK; and what steps and information they need to grow their business; including a new his Department plans to take on such matters; [88764] Growth and Improvement Service on (3) facilitate access for businesses to fee schedules, www.businesslink.gov.uk documentation requirements, information relating to and a mentoring portal commercial cases and insolvency proceedings and www.mentorsme.co.uk other such regulatory information; [88765] bringing together existing networks of mentors in the voluntary (4) (a) strengthen governance, (b) encourage and private sectors. We will also shortly be launching a new business development and (c) improve operations to Business Coaching for Growth service, providing high quality enhance the overall investment climate in the UK. business coaching support for SMEs with high growth potential. [88767] Foresight Mr Prisk: The Government are committed to creating the right conditions for businesses to succeed, removing Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for barriers that are preventing them from performing to Business, Innovation and Skills how much funding their full potential. It is welcome that the World Bank from his Department Foresight (a) received in 2010-11 puts the UK in the top 10 places to do business in the and (b) will receive in 2011-12; what estimate he has world. made of the number of full-time equivalent staff The Government’s growth review is bringing an working for Foresight in each year; and if he will make ambitious and relentless focus, across the lifetime of the a statement. [88025] Parliament, to the role Government can play to enable the right conditions for businesses to thrive and achieve Mr Willetts: Foresight is part of the Government strong, sustainable and balanced growth. The plan for Office for Science, which is a semi-autonomous unit growth and the autumn statement set out a wide-ranging housed within BIS and funded from the BIS vote. The package of more than 280 measures to build a stronger Foresight Programme helps Government make decisions and more balanced economy.The growth review’s packages today which are robust to future uncertainties. The of more than 280 measures include, among others, estimated number of staff working for Foresight in specific activity on corporate governance, regulation, 2010/11 was 31 and for 2011/12, it is 28. The total access to finance, competition and trade and investment. funding for staff and to fund the programme of activity These measures are currently being implemented—by in 2010/11 was £3.66 million, and is expected to be the autumn statement significant milestones had been £3.74 million in 2011/12. reached on more than 90% of the actions announced at the Budget. Green Investment Bank More specifically: In its report, the World Bank specifically highlights our wide- ranging work on deregulation as a good example to follow Luciana Berger: To ask the Secretary of State for (particularly the One In, One Out programme controlling the Business, Innovation and Skills when he expects the flow of new regulations and the Red Tape Challenge thematically Green Investment Bank to receive state aid clearance. reviewing the stock of existing regulations sector by sector). [87904] 335W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 336W
Mr Prisk: It is difficult to be precise about the timetable The Government also provide direct support to disabled for the European Commission to reach a decision on students through Disabled Students’ Allowances (DSAs). the UK state aid notification relating to the Green DSAs can help pay the extra costs a student may incur, Investment Bank. If the Commission opens a full because of a disability, when undertaking a course of investigation, a decision could take up to 18 months. We higher education. DSAs are provided in addition to the are, however, optimistic about the prospects for a relatively standard student support package, are not income-assessed early decision and for planning purposes are preparing and do not have to be repaid. on the basis that this could be obtained during 2012. High Street Review Hearing Impairment Oliver Heald: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills with reference to the Andrew Stephenson: To ask the Secretary of State for Portas review, if he will meet the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills what steps his Communities and Local Government to discuss the Department is taking to improve access to its parking strategies of local authorities. [87870] programmes and services for people with hearing impairment. [86933] Mr Davey: Ministers meet regularly to discuss a range of issues. In respect of the Mary Portas review the Mr Davey: The Department is not itself undertaking Prime Minister has asked the Minister for Housing and specific activity to improve access to its programmes Local Government, the right hon. Member for Welwyn and services for people with hearing impairment. However, Hatfield (Grant Shapps), to lead on responding to the we fund the further education and skills, and higher report and the town centres agenda. education sectors to support disabled students. We provide funding to both Disability Rights UK Higher Education: Admissions and the Equality Challenge Unit, independent organisations which alongside providing advice and guidance to higher Paul Blomfield: To ask the Secretary of State for education institutions and further education providers Business, Innovation and Skills how much his also help raise awareness about a range of equality Department plans to allocate to the Widening issues in the sector. Participation Premium in (a) 2012-13, (b) 2013-14 Higher education institutions and further education and (c) 2014-15. [88115] colleges have duties under the Equality Act 2010 to support disabled students, including students with hearing Mr Willetts [holding answer 10 January 2012]: The impairment, when applying to higher and further education Higher Education Funding Council for England (HEFCE) and when studying. The law establishes a framework of is responsible for determining the level of funding made responsibility which higher education institutions and available through the Widening Participation Allocation. further education colleges must comply with and also Ministers wrote to HEFCE in June 2011 outlining our promotes an anticipatory and proactive approach to initial priorities for teaching funding for 2012/13 which supporting disabled students. Institutions are required included the funding the Council provides to support to make reasonable adjustments for disabled students widening participation and retention. HEFCE consulted, to ensure that they can fully participate in their education over the summer, on how this and our other funding and enjoy the other benefits, facilities and services which priorities might best be delivered. We will confirm our are provided for students. priorities for teaching funding for 2012/13 in our grant letter to the Council, to be published shortly. “Investing in Skills for Sustainable Growth” (published November 2010) recognises the importance of access to In June, we also asked HEFCE to consult on the further education and skills training for people with operation of the teaching grant for 2013/14 and beyond. learning difficulties and/or disabilities. We have HEFCE will launch this consultation, early next year. introduced a single adult skills budget from the 2011/12 We will confirm our priorities for teaching funding in academic year. This provides further education future years, in the usual way, in the grant letter for the colleges and other training organisations with the year in question. flexibility to offer a range and balance of programmes and support in the mode of delivery that will best meet Steve Brine: To ask the Secretary of State for the needs of disabled students and students with learning Business, Innovation and Skills whether his difficulties. Funding for additional learning support is Department plans to consult on any proposed changes also provided to colleges and other training organisations to the widening participation premium. [88652] to help support the additional needs of disadvantaged learners to enable them to participate fully in learning. Mr Willetts: The Higher Education Funding Council The funding is intended to be flexible and support for England (HEFCE) is responsible for determining learners who have a range of learning difficulties and/or the level of funding made available through the widening disabilities. participation premium. In June, we asked HEFCE to The Government also provide support to disabled consult on the operation of the teaching grant for students in higher education. We provide funding to HE 2013/14 and beyond. HEFCE will launch this consultation, institutions, through the Higher Education Funding early next year. Council for England, to help them recruit and support We will confirm our priorities for teaching funding disabled students; £13m will be provided in academic for 2012/13 in our grant letter to HEFCE, to be published year 2011/12. shortly. 337W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 338W
Higher Education: Applications Michael Dugher: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills how many people Michael Dugher: To ask the Secretary of State for applied for courses through UCAS in (a) 2008-09, (b) Business, Innovation and Skills what assessment his 2009-10, (c) 2010-11 and (d) 2011 to date by (i) region Department has made of the effects of recent trends in and (ii) socio-economic group. [85297] UCAS applications for 2012 admission on implementation of the Government’s social mobility strategy. [85287] Mr Willetts: The latest information is in the following table and has been provided by the Universities and Mr Willetts: UCAS have not yet published any Colleges Admission Service (UCAS). information on the social background of applicants for 2012 entry. They have stated that year-on-year changes Figures for 2009, 2010 and 2011 are final end of cycle for all courses at this early stage in the application cycle figures. Figures for 2012 are the latest published figures are often different from the position later in the cycle, which show the position as at 19 December 2011. UCAS and that it is too early in the cycle to extrapolate have not yet released any figures for 2012 showing volumes forward. applicants by social background.
UK domiciled applicants to UCAS by region of domicile and social background 2009 2010 2011 2012
Region of domicile East Midlands 35,088 38,123 37,925 18,730 Eastern 46,222 50,007 50,392 25,821 Greater London 88,721 96,693 99,668 44,066 North East 19,891 21,658 22,030 10,103 North West 64,644 68,965 68,767 34,976 Northern Ireland 17,864 19,682 20,242 10,480 Scotland 40,053 46,347 46,015 14,617 South East 71,964 78,255 77,684 41,700 South West 43,710 46,142 46,069 22,880 Wales 24,947 24,908 24,974 12,701 West Midlands 48,443 51,171 50,514 26,027 Yorkshire and the Humber 42,476 44,848 45,069 21,579 UK unspecified 262 22 1 0 Total 544,285 586,821 589,350 283,680
Social background Disadvantaged1 169,183 185,933 187,427 n/a Other 366,531 393,616 393,105 n/a Not known 8,571 7,272 8,818 n/a Total 544,285 586,821 589,350 n/a n/a = not available 1 Derived from the Higher Education Funding Council for England (HEFCE)’s POLAR2 measure: http://www.hefce.ac.uk/widen/fund/ HEFCE uses two different groupings of areas to define disadvantage: one based on the participation rates of young (19 and under) people in HE (which is used by HEFCE when looking at young full-time entrants); and one based on the proportion of adults who hold HE qualifications (which is used by HEFCE when looking at part-time and mature full-time entrants). Because this table includes applicants of all ages, the HE qualified adults measure has been used. For the purposes of their funding allocations HEFCE treat entrants from the most disadvantaged 40% of neighbourhoods as ‘disadvantaged’, using quintiles 1 and 2 of the POLAR2 measure.
Higher Education: Standards Insolvency
Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills what steps he plans to Toby Perkins: To ask the Secretary of State for take to ensure and maintain the quality of institutions Business, Innovation and Skills how many (a) with degree-awarding powers under his proposals to businesses and (b) retailers (i) were liquidated and (ii) increase flexibility in the higher education sector. went into administration in each month in each of the [86547] last five years. [87935]
Mr Willetts: As part of the proposals set out in the Higher Education White Paper published in June and Mr Davey: Official statistics on corporate insolvencies the subsequent technical consultation, all institutions by industry sector are not compiled monthly. The latest with English degree awarding powers will be required, headline quarterly statistics, including an industry as now, to satisfy a quality threshold administered by breakdown for liquidations and administrations may be the Quality Assurance Agency for Higher Education. found here: This assures and will continue to assure the quality of http://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/otherinformation/ an English degree. statistics/201111/index.htm#tables 339W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 340W
While the total figures in these tables cover the last Total paid in non-consolidated, 10 years, the industry breakdowns only run from Q3 performance related awards 2007; the available industry breakdowns up to Q3 2006 (£000) (which were on a different basis) are available here: 2006-07 2,491 http://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/otherinformation/ statistics/historicdata/HDmenu.htm The average award paid to staff in 2010-11 was Japan Tobacco International: Ministerial Policy £1,809. Advisers Nuclear Power Stations Mr Hain: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills whether any (a) Ministers and Mr Iain Wright: To ask the Secretary of State for (b) special advisers in his Department have received Business, Innovation and Skills what steps his hospitality from Japan Tobacco International since Department is taking to (a) encourage increased May 2010. [87609] competition in the nuclear industry supply chain and (b) ensure that British firms are well-placed to win Mr Davey: Information about hospitality received by work in the awarding of contracts to build new nuclear Ministers and special advisers is published quarterly by power stations; and if he will make a statement. [88656] Departments. Information for the period 13 May 2010-30 June 2011 can be accessed on departmental websites. Mr Prisk: The Government believes that there is Information for 1 July onwards will be published in due considerable potential for the UK civil nuclear industry course. from the domestic and global market and is working with companies to enable the right environment for Members: Correspondence these opportunities to be realised. At the heart of the Government’s strategy is the development of a healthy Graham Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for and vibrant supply chain in the UK able to compete Business, Innovation and Skills when the Minister for and win business in a highly competitive global environment. Business and Enterprise plans to respond to the letters The Government provides support through a number from the hon. Member for Weaver Vale of of routes, including: 20 September and 15 November 2011, on behalf of The Nuclear Advanced Manufacturing Research Centre (Nuclear- Mr Stevan Cross. [88433] AMRC) which, with the National Nuclear Laboratory, helps manufacturers get to market, develop their capability and Mr Davey: The Department for Business, Innovation competitiveness and thereby enable a globally competitive advantage to be gained. and Skills has no record of the letter of 20 September 2011, however the Secretary of State for Business, A new Advanced Manufacturing Supply Chain Initiative, announced in December 2011 with flexible support to improve Innovation and Skills, my right hon. Friend the Member the global competitiveness of existing supply chains and encourage for Twickenham (Vince Cable) responded to the letter development of new suppliers in the UK. This will be a competitive of 15 November 2011 on 21 December 2011. fund and the nuclear industry can apply for support through this initiative. Met Office: Pay Support for the Nuclear Industry Association’s supply chain initiative, SC@Nuclear, in order to assist the provision of market Sammy Wilson: To ask the Secretary of State for information to firms to help them make investment decisions. Business, Innovation and Skills how much has been Establishment of the Nuclear Energy Skills Alliance which paid in bonuses to staff employed at the Met Office in brings together the relevant skills academies, sector skills councils, each of the last five years. [87908] industrial training boards and others to ensure the right delivery of skills provision overall. Mr Davey: In line with civil service reward principles, Met Office staff are eligible to receive performance Nuclear Power: Skilled Workers related pay based on achievements against specific targets agreed and monitored by the Met Office Board, which Mr Arbuthnot: To ask the Secretary of State for are linked to the success of the Met Office at either Business, Innovation and Skills what steps his individual, team or organisational level. Payments are Department is taking to support small and medium- non-consolidated and represent part of Met Office staff sized enterprises that wish to invest in the nuclear remuneration which is at risk and needs to be re-earned power supply chain to acquire the necessary skills and each year. equipment; and if he will make a statement. [87866] The following table details the amount paid in performance related pay to staff employed at the Met Mr Prisk: The Government believe that there is Office in each of the last five years. considerable potential for the UK civil nuclear industry from the domestic and global market and is working Total paid in non-consolidated, with them to enable the right environment for these performance related awards opportunities to be realised. (£000) At the heart of the Government’s support is the 2010-11 3,368 Nuclear Advanced Manufacturing Research Centre 2009-10 2,593 (Nuclear-AMRC) which, with the National Nuclear 2008-09 2,720 Laboratory and the National Skills Academy for Nuclear, 2007-08 2,734 helps manufacturers get to market, develop their capability and competitiveness and thereby enable British companies 341W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 342W to gain a globally competitive advantage. In addition from the small, medium and micro business community, the new Advanced Manufacturing Supply Chain Initiative recruited and trained via the Small Firms Enterprise announced in December 2011 will provide flexible support Development Initiative (SFEDI) by September 2012. to improve the global competitiveness of existing supply Our evidence tells us that one of the top sources of chains and encourage the development of new suppliers, information and advice for small business owners is in the UK. This will be a competitive fund and the their customers and suppliers. Skillsmart Retail (the nuclear industry can apply for support through this sector skills council) have been developing a small and initiative. This initiative is supported by additional funding medium-sized enterprise mentoring scheme which is routes that businesses can use to apply for specific being rolled out across the National Skills Academy for investments such as the Regional Growth Fund. retail’s network of skills shops. Also, the Association of The Government also support the Nuclear Industry Conveience Stores have set up a mentoring scheme Association’s supply chain initiative, SC@ Nuclear, in aimed at independent convenience retailers. order to assist the provision of market information to We are working with corporate business to explore firms to help them make investment decisions, and how we can mobilise the enthusiasm and expertise of UKTI in partnership with the Nuclear Industry Association leaders and experienced senior staff in corporate is working with industry to help promotion of UK organisations in order to support local business through goods and services. corporate mentoring programmes. Near-market Research and Development projects are I strongly believe that this process should be demand-led supported through the Technology Strategy Board and and led by business. Ultimately it is for the small firm to the Research Councils provide support for longer-term decide what sort of expertise will benefit them most. nuclear research. Large retailers supporting and mentoring local businesses Delivery of skills for the industry is coordinated and independent retailers was one of Mary Portas’ through the Nuclear Energy Skills Alliance (NESA) recommendations in her Government commissioned and, for manufacturers, the National Skills Academy “Review of the High Street” which was published on for Nuclear (NSA-Nuclear) has been expanded to 13 December 2011. Government Departments are working incorporate the Sector Skills Council for Science, closely together to consider the recommendations made Engineering, and Manufacturing technologies (SEMTA) by Mary Portas and will respond in detail in the spring and the Nuclear-AMRC. NSA-Nuclear takes the overall on how we can take forward measures to support our lead in working with industry to help them acquire the local high streets. skills they need to maintain and grow their operations. Royal Bank of Scotland Public Houses Caroline Lucas: To ask the Secretary of State for Toby Perkins: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills what recent discussions Business, Innovation and Skills whether he has visited he has had with representatives of the Financial any (a) pubs and (b) breweries in an official capacity Service Authority on whether RBS was in compliance as a guest of (i) the British Beer and Pub Association with Section 386 of the Companies Act 2006 between and (ii) any other group acting on behalf of the 2001 and 2008; and if he will make a statement. [88446] licensed trade, pub companies or brewing industry Mr Davey: BIS officials are considering the Financial since May 2010. [88193] Service Authority’s report into the Royal Bank of Scotland Mr Davey: I have not visited any pubs or brewers in (RBS) and taking advice on what, if any, enforcement an official capacity as a guest of either the British Beer action or further investigation is appropriate. and Pub Association or any other group acting on Royal Mail: Pay behalf of the licensed trade, pub companies or brewing industry since May 2010. Bob Russell: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills what recent discussions Retail Trade his Department has had with the Royal Mail on its chair’s remuneration, bonuses, benefits and pension Chris Ruane: To ask the Secretary of State for payments; and if he will make a statement. [88451] Business, Innovation and Skills what steps his Department has taken to encourage large retailers to Mr Davey: The remuneration of the Royal Mail chair support and mentor local businesses and independent was set at the time of his appointment in March 2009 retailers. [88035] and has remained unchanged. There have therefore, been no recent discussions with Royal Mail’s Remuneration Mr Prisk: Businesses tell us that they prefer to receive Committee about his remuneration. advice and support from other experienced business The chair receives a base salary but does not receive people. That is why we are working alongside the private benefits, bonuses or pension payments. sector to strengthen and expand the mentoring network and stimulate the demand for mentoring in all sectors. Students: Fees and Charges In July, we joined forces with the British Bankers Association (BBA) to launch the new mentoring portal, Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for mentorsme.co.uk, which makes it easier for businesses Business, Innovation and Skills what consideration he to find the right mentoring organisation for their needs. has given to changing the tuition fee threshold which Then in November, we launched “Get Mentoring”, allows institutions to bid for additional places under which will see 15,000 new volunteer business mentors the core and margin model. [85772] 343W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 344W
Mr Willetts: The higher education White Paper ‘Students Direct grant support over £100,000 at the Heart of the System’, published in June, outlined 2011/12 £000 proposals to bring flexibility to the current system of UK Resource Centre for 500 student number controls in higher education institutions Women in SET (UKRC) (HEIs) in England. The Higher Education Funding 8,680 Council for England (HEFCE) included these new proposals in their summer consultation on the operation of teaching funding and student number controls in Other 2012-13. The consultation outcomes informed a bidding Design Council 5,312 process that was announced by HEFCE on 17 October Natural England 365 2011. This invited higher education and further education UK Council for International 300 institutions whose average fees, net of fee waivers, is less Students than £7,500, to bid for student places from a contestable Tate Britain 291 ‘margin’ of up to 20,000 places for 2012/13. HEFCE The British Council 285 have received bids from 203 hundred institutions for European University Institute 229 places. College of Europe 213 HEFCE will closely monitor the impact of these Royal Anniversary Trust 167 changes and offer formal advice to Ministers as soon as Raleigh International Trust 167 is practicable. HEFCE will also consult on how this Association of Commonwealth 117 approach might be extended, in their forthcoming Universities consultation on teaching funding for 2013/14 and beyond. National Foundation for 115 Education Third Sector: Russia Royal Botanic Kew Gardens 111 7,555 Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills pursuant to the answer The Russian Federation has not received nor is scheduled of 1 December 2011, Official Report, column 1122W, to receive any funding from Knowledge and Innovation on third sector, how much assistance to the Russian Group other than indirectly through the ESA programme. Federation cost in (a) 2010-11 and (b) 2011-12; for I am sorry for any confusion the previous answer may what purpose it was provided; and if he will make a have caused. statement. [85684] UK Space Agency Mr Willetts: The UK Space Agency, whose funding is included as part of the Knowledge and Innovation Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Group within the Department, contributes around Business, Innovation and Skills how much funding the £220 million annually to the European Space Agency UK Space Agency (a) received in 2010-11 and (b) will (ESA). It is not possible to calculate the level of assistance receive in 2011-12; what estimate he has made of the received by or from individual countries under ESA number of full-time equivalent staff working for the programmes. UK Space Agency in each year; and if he will make a The answer to the previous question from the hon. statement. [88024] Member on funding for charities and third sector bodies should have read: Mr Willetts: The UK Space Agency was established Knowledge and Innovation Group was formed at the end of as an Executive agency on 1 April 2011. Before this, 2010 after allocations for 2010-11 had been made. Most of the space spend was spread across a number of Government group’s total budget reaches charities which are higher education organisations, and hence no agency budget existed. institutions or students who attend them. We generally allocate Funding for the year 2011-12 is £229 million, further funding to partner organisations which take independent decisions details are shown in the published ″Department of on funding for individual bodies. The following table sets out the available information requested for bodies which are directly Business Innovation and Skills, Allocation of Science funded by the group rather than those whose funding depends on and Research Funding″ brochure the decisions of independent partner organisations. http://www.bis.gov.uk/assets/biscore/science/docs/a/10-1356- Direct grant support over £100,000 allocation-of-science-and-research-funding-2011-2015.pdf 2011/12 £000 which is available from the Libraries of the House. The current number of full-time equivalent staff for the Total national academies 87,465 agency is 37. Royal Society 47,830 British Academy 27,001 Work Experience Royal Academy of Engineering 12,634 Hazel Blears: To ask the Secretary of State for Other support for science Business, Innovation and Skills what estimate he has Science, Technology, 6,300 made of the proportion of people undertaking (a) Engineering and Mathematics paid and (b) unpaid internships that (i) are and (ii) are Network (STEMNET) not graduates. [84593] British Science Association 1,530 Engineering UK/Big Bang 350 Mr Willetts: I refer the right hon. Member for Salford Education CIC (The Big Bang Fair) and Eccles to the answer I gave on 5 December 2011, Official Report, column 174W. 345W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 346W
ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL AFFAIRS Mr Paice: The licensing scheme will be implemented by regulations under the Animal Welfare Act 2006. We Adders: Conservation will consult publicly on our proposals early in 2012. Mr Mike Hancock: To ask the Secretary of State for Fiona O’Donnell: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs whether she Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what assessment plans to bring forward proposals under Section 12 of she has made of trends in the number of adders in the Animal Welfare Act 2006 to ban the use of wild the UK. [83331] animals in circuses. [85233]
Richard Benyon: Natural England, Scottish Natural Mr Paice: We will be bringing forward regulations to Heritage and the Countryside Council for Wales are license the use of performing wild animals in travelling supporting the work of Amphibian and Reptile circuses. We will consult on our proposals early in 2012. Conservation and local amphibian and reptile groups to assess adder populations. Early results of a national Caroline Lucas: To ask the Secretary of State for reptile survey show that adders were recorded in only Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what recent 7% of the sample plots studied. If the final report estimate she has made of the number of wild animals confirms a worrying decline in this species the three bred in UK circuses; and what her policy is on whether agencies will build on existing work with partner a licensing system will prevent circuses from (a) adding organisations and volunteers to enhance strategies to new animals to their collection and (b) breeding from address it. existing animals. [85265]
Animal Health and Veterinary Laboratories Agency: Mr Paice: No new estimate has been made since the West Midlands one published in the impact assessment in December 2009, but we believe the figure to be in the same region, Chris White: To ask the Secretary of State for i.e. below 40. The licensing system will focus on assuring Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what steps her the welfare of all wild animals in circuses. We think it Department is taking to improve (a) communication unlikely that the introduction of the demanding new and (b) response times between the Animal Health licensing regime we envisage will encourage any significant and Veterinary Laboratories Agency and farmers in the increase to the numbers of wild animals in circuses, West Midlands. [88533] either by being bought in or bred.
Mr Paice: In late 2011, the West Midlands Animal Fiona O’Donnell: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Office experienced some problems with a new Environment, Food and Rural Affairs when (a) she national computer system which affected the efficiency and (b) officials from her Department have met with of their communications with farmers. animal welfare organisations to discuss the planned consultation on the licensing of wild animals in Many of these problems have now been resolved, circuses. [85312] more staff have been moved into the TB and communications teams and additional training and support Mr Paice: DEFRA Ministers have not met with has been provided. As a result of this, farmers should animal welfare organisations to discuss circuses since already be seeing an improvement in communications announcing on 13 May 2011 our intention to develop a from the West Midlands office. new licensing system. However, since that date, officials During February and March 2012, field, laboratory have met with a number of animal welfare organisations, and administration staff from the East Midlands and including RSPCA, Born Free, Animal Defenders West Midlands offices and the regional laboratories will International, Performing Animals Welfare Standards be brought together under a single management team International, Captive Animals Protection Society, and to make full use of all available resources across the the British and Irish Association of Zoos and Aquariums. Midlands region to focus on improving service to customers. Regular meetings are being held with the Regional Angela Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for National Farmers Union and other industry bodies to Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what steps she explore how they and the Animal Health and Veterinary plans to take to ensure that the introduction of a Laboratories Agency can work better together to improve licensing system does not increase the number of wild communications and working relationships even more. animals used in circuses. [87548] If farmers have any concerns about the time taken to respond to them individually, they are encouraged to Mr Paice: We think it unlikely that the introduction contact the Regional Operations Director through their of a demanding licensing regime will encourage any local office. significant increase to the numbers of wild animals in circuses.
Animal Welfare: Circuses Mr Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs pursuant to the Mr Mike Hancock: To ask the Secretary of State for answer to the hon. Member for Brighton, Pavilion, of Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how she plans to 8 November 2011, Official Report, column 221W, on implement the proposed licensing scheme to prevent animal welfare: circuses, what arrangements she plans circuses from using wild animals if they do not provide to make for (a) parliamentarians and (b) members of appropriate welfare standards. [85231] the public to evaluate the potential of a licensing 347W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 348W system for wild animals in circuses in circumstances The following list gives the main locations from which where the details of confidential circus inspections are non-UK residents import cats and dogs into the UK: not released. [88090] France Spain Mr Paice: DEFRA will carry out a public consultation Germany early in 2012 to allow any interested parties to evaluate our proposed licensing scheme for wild animals in travelling Netherlands circuses. The regulations will also be subject to the Belgium usual parliamentary scrutiny procedure for statutory Poland instruments. Italy Cyprus Caroline Lucas: To ask the Secretary of State for USA Environment, Food and Rural Affairs pursuant to the Australia answer of 12 December 2011, Official Report, column 464W, on animal welfare: circuses, if she will South Africa provide details of the circumstances which the Turkey Government considered in reaching its view that Canada confidentiality should be respected. [88447] United Arab Emirates.
Mr Paice: The Government considered: (i) the public Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State interest in disclosing the information; (ii) the fact that for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what the information was obtained by DEFRA from the estimate she has made of the number of live (a) cats circuses on the understanding that it would be treated and (b) dogs which have been illegally imported into confidentially and disclosure to the public would therefore the UK in each of the last five years; and if she will constitute a breach of confidence; (iii) the fact that make a statement. [87167] disclosure of the information could endanger the physical or mental health, or the safety, of any individual in the Mr Paice: All live dogs and cats are checked before context of reports of threats received; (iv) DEFRA’s entry into the UK to ensure they meet the requirements plans to consult early in 2012 on the detail of regulations of the Pet Travel scheme. There is always the potential that do not depend on informal inspections that went for illegal entry of pets through smuggling and other into an initial feasibility study, the findings of which are methods and strict action is taken in those cases, but in any case in the public domain. these are considered to be minimal due to our robust checking procedures. Caroline Lucas: To ask the Secretary of State for Information on prosecutions taken under the Rabies Environment, Food and Rural Affairs pursuant to the Order 1974 between 2007 and 2010 is listed in the answer of 12 December 2011, Official Report, column following table. Information is not yet available for 465W, on animal welfare: circuses, which animal 2011. welfare organisations have (a) agreed and (b) refused to advise her Department on the proposed licensing Prosecutions system; what reasons were given for such acceptances or refusals; and if she will make a statement. [88448] 2010 1 2009 14 Mr Paice: As part of a recent round of meetings with 2008 4 stakeholders, ADI, Born Free, BVA, CAPS, HSI and 2007 6 the RSPCA were invited to discuss our licensing proposals but all declined the invitation. Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State My noble Friend, Lord Taylor of Holbeach plans to for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many discuss the welfare of wild animals in circuses with live (a) cats and (b) dogs have been (i) imported into animal welfare groups at their request. and (ii) exported from the UK in each of the last five years; and if she will make a statement. [87165] Animals: Imports Mr Paice: The following tables provide information Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State on the number of live cats and dogs imported into and for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs from which exported from the UK in the past five years. countries live (a) cats and (b) dogs are imported into Export figures are only available for cats and dogs the UK; and if she will make a statement. [87166] travelling outside of the EU as they must do so under a third country certificate which is issued in the UK. Cats Mr Paice: Live cats and dogs can be imported from and dogs travelling to other EU countries may do so any country as long as the movement conditions meet freely under a pet passport and these movements are the required entry rules under the Pet Travel Scheme or not monitored within the UK. Rabies Importation Order. Live cats imported into the UK The vast majority of pets entering the UK under the Number Pet Travel Scheme belong to UK residents returning from trips abroad with their animals. Information on 2007 11,550 the locations these animals return to the UK from is not 2008 13,423 recorded. 2009 8,251 349W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 350W
Live cats imported into the UK crops are used for generating heat and electricity and Number are not currently used to produce liquid biofuels on a commercial scale. The Energy Crops scheme is a scheme 2010 9,502 administered by Natural England that offers grants to 20111 8,544 1 farmers in England for establishing miscanthus and 1 January to 30 November 2011 short rotation coppice for their own energy use or to Live dogs imported into the UK supply power stations. The scheme is split between the Number Energy Crops scheme (ECS) 1 (2000-06) and ECS 2 (2007-13). Payments made under ECS 1 amounted to 2007 9,4444 £7,672,454. Payments under ECS 2 amounted to £838,755 2008 10,7042 as of 8 April 2011, but this figure may be subject to 2009 9,1862 change. These figures and further information can be 2010 8,7008 found on the Natural England website at: 20111 8,1142 http://www.naturalengland.org.uk/ourwork/farming/funding/ 1 1 January to 30 November 2011 ecs/ We have limited data on the end-use of UK-grown Live cats and dogs exported from the UK under third country certificate crops. Figures reported under the renewable transport Number fuels obligation (RTFO) show that in 2008-09, 753 thousand tonnes of UK-grown oilseed rape, sugar beet 2007 9,491 and wheat were used to produce UK liquid biofuels. We 2008 8,102 do not hold data on the amount of UK-grown crops 2009 7,951 that were converted to other forms of energy (such as 2010 7,918 biogas), exported and used for biofuels production abroad. 2011 8,542 Data from the RTFO is available on the DFT website at: Biodiversity: Finance http://www.dft.gov.uk/topics/sustainable/biofuels/rtfo/ DEFRA is aware that there are limited data available Caroline Lucas: To ask the Secretary of State for on biofuels and are considering ways of improving our Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what percentage biofuels statistics in the near future. the change in the funding of the Species Recovery Programme is in 2011-12; if she will make it her policy Butterfly Conservation: Finance to work with Natural England to restore its funding; and if she will make a statement. [88450] Caroline Lucas: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs whether she has Richard Benyon: It is for Natural England to decide had any discussions with Natural England on the effect how to deploy its available grant in aid to best support on species recovery work of funding reductions to the its objectives. Natural England reduced the funding of charity Butterfly Conservation; and if she will make a its Species Recovery Programme by 54% in 2011-12 but statement. [88449] is working with its partner organisations to reprioritise, in order to maintain, and in some cases increase, funding Richard Benyon: Ministers have had no specific for specific high priority species recovery projects. discussions with Natural England on the effects on species recovery work of reducing grant support to Biofuels Butterfly Conservation. It is for Natural England to decide how it deploys its available grant in aid to best Maria Eagle: To ask the Secretary of State for support its objectives. Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (a) how much Natural England, however, continues to have discussions was spent on subsidy to UK producers of crops used with Butterfly Conservation over the work needed to for biofuel production and (b) how many tonnes of achieve the outcomes in the Government’s new Biodiversity UK-grown crops have been used for biofuel production 2020 Strategy and has increased funding to it in 2011-12 in each of the last 10 years. [87038] by £100,000 for high priority projects.
Mr Paice: The EU’s aid for energy crops, which ran Circuses for the period 2004-09, made payments to farmers Gavin Shuker: To ask the Secretary of State for growing crops for energy purposes. The scheme was a Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what plans she Pillar 1 measure and paid a flat rate of ¤45/ha for both has to allow public access to circus inspection reports. annual and perennial energy crops. A total of over ¤20 million was paid out under this scheme in the UK. [71172] Further information is available at: Mr Paice: A number of inspections of animals in http://www.defra.gov.uk/statistics/files/defra-stats-foodfarm- travelling circuses have been conducted by DEFRA- landuselivestock-nonfoodcrops-latestrelease.pdf appointed inspectors or vets in the past decade. However, Currently, land under which UK crops are grown for no central record is kept of such inspections, nor of any biofuels may be eligible for Single Payment scheme and reports which might have been written as a result of an other CAP payment schemes, but these payments are inspection. The three inspections carried out for DEFRA not specific to whether the end use is fuel, food or other in 2008 as part of a feasibility study to evaluate the purposes. The only payments currently offered specifically potential of an inspection system for such circuses were for energy crops are those for miscanthus and short conducted on a confidential basis, and as a consequence rotation coppice under the Energy Crops scheme. These we will not release these reports. 351W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 352W
The proposed new circus animal licensing scheme industry standards body for the industry itself to comply will put inspections of travelling circuses with wild with. DEFRA did not respond to the British Standards animal acts on a formal, statutory, footing. The new Institution’s consultation as we believe it was for industry, scheme will ensure that we have a record of all the producer countries and civil society to respond to. licensing inspections carried out at these circuses. We Common Agricultural Policy will also want to consider what information about, and from, the inspections should be made available publicly to ensure that the scheme is as transparent as possible. Mr Raab: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what proportion Cocoa: EU External Trade of the UK’s contribution to the EU budget was accounted for by the common agricultural policy in Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for each year since 2005 in (a) cash and (b) percentage Environment, Food and Rural Affairs if she will place terms. [87445] in the Library a copy of her Department’s response to the British Standards Institution’s recent consultation Mr Paice: The UK contributes to the EU budget as a on its position for the European Committee for whole and not to individual spending programmes within Standardisation vote on establishing a new European it and there is not, therefore, a specific UK contribution traceable and sustainable cocoa standard. [86722] to common agricultural policy expenditure. Details of the UK’s contributions to the EU budget for the period Mr Paice: The new European standard for sustainable 2005-06 to 2010-11 are set out in Table 3B, page 16, of and traceable cocoa is being developed by the independent European Union Finances 2011 (Cm 8232).
£ million 2011 Estimated 2005 Outturn 2006 Outturn 2007 Outturn 2008 Outturn 2009 Outturn 2010 Outturn Outturn1
Gross Payments2 12,483 12,426 12,456 12,653 14,129 15,197 15,289 Less: UK Abatement -3,572 -3,569 -3,523 -4,862 -5,392 -3,047 -3,141 Less: Public sector -5,329 -4,948 -4,332 -4,497 -4,401 -4,769 -4,776 receipts Net contributions to 3,581 3,909 4,601 3,294 4,336 7,381 7,372 EU budget3 1 The figures for 2011 are forecasts; those for earlier years are outturn. 2 Gross payment figures include TOR payments at 75%. The remaining 25% is retained by the UK to cover the costs of administering collection on behalf of the EU. 3 Due to rounding, totals may not exactly correspond to the sum of individual items. Source: HM Treasury
In 2005 expenditure on the CAP represented 46.2% oh the activity of these vessels. This can be found in the of the EU budget. By 2011 this had declined to 43.7%. following table, split between number of registered vessels, Sources: and those considered to be active. 1. European Union Finances 2011 Number of vessels Of which active http://www.official-documents.gov.uk/document/cm82/8232/ registered as at 1 during preceding 8232.pdf January year 2. Financial Management in the European Union (2007) http://www.official-documents.gov.uk/document/hc0607/hc04/ UK Fleet at 1 January 7790 3152 0401/0401.asp 2001, active in 2000 UK Fleet at 1 January 7623 3165 2002, active in 2001 Common Fisheries Policy UK Fleet at 1 January 7362 3069 2003, active in 2002 Mr Dodds: To ask the Secretary of State for UK Fleet at 1 January 7289 2912 Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many active 2004, active in 2003 fishing fleets were registered in the UK in each year UK Fleet at 1 January 7075 3007 since 2001. [87833] 2005, active in 2004 UK Fleet at 1 January 6994 3002 Richard Benyon: The UK fishing fleet plays an important 2006, active in 2005 role in providing food, jobs, wealth and social benefits, UK Fleet at 1 January 6724 4442 particularly in some coastal communities. Prior to 2006 2007, active in 2006 the details of activity by vessels of 10 metres and under UK Fleet at 1 January 6742 4735 in England and Wales were often recorded as part of 2008, active in 2007 grouped data for landings and effort. As such the activity UK Fleet at 1 January 6749 4797 of individual vessels is not available for this time frame 2009, active in 2008 and has lead to the apparent low levels of active vessel UK Fleet at 1 January 6568 4573 data before 2006. With the introduction of the requirement 2010, active in 2009 for buyers and sellers of first sale fish to be registered, more accurate data started to be captured against the UK Fleet at 1 January 6472 4634 2011, active in 2010 individual vessels involved, therefore providing details 353W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 354W
Convention on International Trade in Endangered Dangerous Dogs Species Glyn Davies: To ask the Secretary of State for Chris Williamson: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs whether she Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many plans to bring forward legislative proposals to (1) people were convicted of offences governed by the repeal breed specific legislation in relation to dangerous convention on international trade in endangered dogs; [87936] species of wild fauna and flora in the UK in each of (2) extend the provisions of the Dangerous Dogs Act the last five years for which figures are available. 1991 to cover private property. [87937] [88333] Mr Paice: Having consulted the police service and carefully considered all the other available evidence, I Richard Benyon: The number of persons found guilty do not consider that there is a strong case for repealing at all courts of offences under the Control of Trade in the existing ban on the ownership of certain types of Endangered Species (Enforcement) Regulations 1997 in dogs. England and Wales from 2006-10 (latest available) is shown in the following table. However, my noble Friend Lord Taylor, who leads on the subject of dangerous dogs in DEFRA, has been Annual court proceedings data for 2011 is planned working alongside Lord Henley to see how the proposed for publication in spring 2012. antisocial measures, currently being developed in the Number of persons found guilty at all courts for offences related to endangered Home Office, can be best applied to such behaviour species trafficking, England and Wales, 2006-101, 2 relating to dogs. DEFRA has also been developing Statute 2006 2007 20083 2009 2010 proposals on reducing dog attacks and promoting more Offences under 93334responsible dog ownership. This is now at an advanced the Control of stage and we expect to be able to make an announcement Trade in early in the new year. Endangered Species (Enforcement) Departmental Assets Regulations 1997 1 The statistics relate to persons for whom these offences were the principal Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for offences for which they were dealt with. When a defendant has been found Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what assets with guilty of two or more offences, the principal offence is the offence for which the heaviest penalty is imposed. Where the same disposal is imposed for two or a value of £250,000 or more her Department has more offences, the offence selected is the offence for which the statutory bought since May 2010; for what purpose; and if she maximum penalty is the most severe. will make a statement. [77371] 2 Every effort is made to ensure that the figures presented are accurate and complete. However, it is important to note that these data have been extracted from large administrative data systems generated by the courts and police Richard Benyon: Detailed as follows are assets purchased forces. As a consequence, care should be taken to ensure data collection and added to the Fixed Asset Register from May 2010 processes and their inevitable limitations are taken into account when those data are used. onwards—please note construction in progress has not 3 Excludes data for Cardiff magistrates court for April, July and August 2008. been included.
Assets Value (£) Purpose Dairy Farming Fit out costs Ergon House 613,682 Furniture and fittings Robert Flello: To ask the Secretary of State for Fit out costs—Ty Merlin 471,477 Furniture and Environment, Food and Rural Affairs with reference to Carmarthen fittings the conclusions of the Committee on Climate Change’s Biomass Boiler 285,956 Plant and Fourth Carbon Budget report and the Government machinery Office for Science’s Foresight report on Global Sharepoint Remediation 398,897 Internally Farming Futures on the effects of reduced Project (Phase 1) generated software consumption of meat and dairy products, what steps Whole Farm Approach 663,281 Internally the Government is taking to (a) define and (b) Software system—R7/8 generated software Oracle Business Suite 311,014 Purchased [87830] promote a sustainable diet. Licences software Total—Core Department 2,744,307 Mr Paice: I do not believe that Government should tell people what to eat. Our role is two-fold in providing Flow Cytometer Cell Sorter 351,239 Scientific a solid evidence base firstly to give consumers consistent equipment messages on the information they need to be able to Electron Microscope 339,689 Scientific make informed choices for themselves; and secondly to equipment support industry and NGOs in their work towards Total—The Animal Health 690,928 encouraging sustainable consumption and avoiding food and Veterinary Laboratories waste. Agency DEFRA is working with industry to reduce the impact of the meat and dairy sectors throughout the lifecycle Rural Land Register Strategic 3,478,000 Internally of its products, to ensure the environmental footprint of Systems Upgrade generated software Total—The Rural Payments 3,478,000 the meat and milk we consume is as low as possible, Agency while continuing to maintain its nutritional quality. 355W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 356W
Departmental Communication Assets Value (£) Purpose
Total for the Department 6,913,235 Pete Wishart: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many (a) DEFRA’s other Executive Agencies reported no assets press officers, (b) internal communications officers, meeting this criterion. (c) external communications officers, (d) Departmental Catering communications strategy officers and (e) other positions with a communications remit were employed Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State by (i) her Department, (ii) its agencies and (iii) each for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how much non-departmental public body sponsored by her her Department spent on food purchased through its Department on the most recent date for which figures food and catering services in the last 12 month period are available. [84205] for which figures are available. [86987] Richard Benyon: Communication functions in DEFRA, Mr Paice: Food purchased through DEFRA’s food its executive agencies and non-departmental public bodies and catering services is incorporated within a hospitality have been reviewed. The following figures reflect the account code and is not recorded separately. DEFRA situation at 25 November 2011. Job descriptions will does not receive any separate invoicing from our caterers vary from organisation to organisation. which identifies ‘food’ specifically. To extract this Detailed figures relating to smaller arm lengths bodies information would incur disproportionate cost. are not held centrally and could be obtained only at disproportionate cost. The Environment Agency figures Departmental Chief Scientific Advisers cover England only. Press officers Chi Onwurah: To ask the Secretary of State for Number Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (1) what the resource budget allocation was for the office of her DEFRA 17 Department’s chief scientific adviser in each of the last AHVLA 0.6 five years for which figures are available; [72467] British Waterways 6 (2) what the salary, including benefits, was of her CEFAS 0.3 Department’s chief scientific adviser in each of the last Environment Agency 14 five years for which figures are available; and how FERA 1 many individuals have held the post in the last five Kew 3.5 years; [72468] Natural England 11.7 (3) how many full-time equivalent staff were Rural Payments Agency 1 employed in the office of her Department’s chief VMD 0 scientific adviser in each of the last five years for which MMO 0.68 figures are available; and on what date the office was Total 51.78 established. [72469] Internal communications officers Richard Benyon: Resource budget allocation figures Number for the office of the chief scientific adviser are only DEFRA 7.8 available for the last three years, and these are given in AHVLA 2 the following table. Earlier figures are unavailable as a British Waterways 2 result of internal restructuring. CEFAS 0.2 Environment Agency 6 £ FERA 2 2009-10 282,000 Kew 0 2010-11 274,000 Natural England 4.5 2011-12 209,000 Rural Payments Agency 5 VMD 0 These figures cover pay costs and standard non-pay MMO 0 allocation. Total 29.5 Details of the salary, including benefits, payable to the Department’s chief scientific adviser as set out in External communication officers DEFRA’s annual reports and accounts each year. These Number are available on the DEFRA website. DEFRA 8.6 Two individuals have held the post of chief scientific AHVLA 1.4 adviser in the last five years. British Waterways 5 DEFRA’s first chief scientific adviser (CSA) was CEFAS 0.4 appointed on 27 February 2002. In each of the last five Environment Agency 146 years the CSA’s office has consisted of one full time FERA 0 HEO or HEO(D) Private Secretary, and one full time Kew 0 EO Assistant Private Secretary. Since June 2011 the EO Natural England 0 post has been filled on a part-time basis (20 hours per Rural Payments Agency 2 week). VMD 0 357W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 358W
External communication officers contract covers the whole of DEFRA’s estate including Number Fera, the Rural Payments Agency, Natural England, AHVLA and DECC and we are working with the MMO 1 caterer to ensure that Government Buying Standards Total 64.4 are met in full. 1 Communication and engagement roles within the Environment Agency are integral to work with external partners to ensure that The percentage of food under the contract between environmental outcomes are met, including working with businesses May and September 2011 that was sourced specifically to help them comply with environmental regulations and increasing from the UK was: public awareness of flood risk. Meat: 43.5% Communication strategy officers—central and corporate planning Number Poultry: 67.1% Fruit and Veg: 23.3% of total, 38.5% of indigenous. DEFRA 8.8 AHVLA 0 Departmental Manpower British Waterways 1 CEFAS 0.1 Environment Agency 20 Luciana Berger: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many FERA 0 people were working in her Department on (a) 11 May Kew 0 2010 and (b) 8 December 2011. [87349] Natural England 0 Rural Payments Agency 0 Richard Benyon: Staff in-post statistics are compiled VMD 0 at the end of each month. The number of full-time MMO 0 equivalent staff who were employed in DEFRA, at the Total 29.9 dates nearest to those requested, are as follows: Other communication positions includes managerial and support staff 30 April 2010: 2,558 and online communications staff 30 November 2011: 2,091. Number
DEFRA 9.4 Departmental Official Hospitality AHVLA 2.4 British Waterways 0 Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for CEFAS 0 Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how much her Environment Agency 18 Department spent on hospitality for events hosted by FERA 3 each Minister in her Department in each of the last 12 Kew 1 months. [73663] Natural England 13.7 Rural Payments Agency 0 Richard Benyon: DEFRA’s spend on hospitality VMD 0.5 organised through ministerial offices for the months MMO 1 requested is given in the following table. Spend is not Total 52 recorded according to which Minister hosted a particular event. It is also possible that some spend on events Departmental Food hosted by Ministers was incurred by other areas of the Department, but this information is not recorded centrally.
Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State Month Ministerial expenditure (£) for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what proportion of food sourced by (a) her Department November 2010 646.80 and (b) public bodies for which she is responsible was December 2010 218.12 procured from UK food producers in the latest period January 2011 205.90 for which figures are available. [83723] February 2011 0 March 2011 767.32 Mr Paice: EU treaty principles of non-discrimination April 2011 699.95 and the free movement of goods and services between May 2011 0 member states prevent public bodies from discriminating June 2011 446.30 in favour of domestic food suppliers. This is reflected in July 2011 411.80 UK and EU procurement legislation. August 2011 0 In June 2011 the Government introduced Government September 2011 205.90 Buying Standards for Food and Catering Services which Total 3,602.09 specify that food procured should be produced to UK or equivalent standards, except where that would incur All expenditure incurred was in accordance with the an increase in overall cost. We want to drive up standards principles of Managing Public Money and the Treasury and encourage people to buy food with the highest handbook on Regularity and Propriety. production and animal welfare standards. Officials are taking action to encourage these standards Mr Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State to be adopted as a minimum across the public sector for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how much and this will include all agencies and arms length bodies has been spent on hospitality by her Department since with which DEFRA is engaged. DEFRA’s current catering May 2010. [80268] 359W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 360W
Richard Benyon: The total amount spent on hospitality the Efficiency and Reform Group’s tough new efficiency regime by the Department since May 2010 through to November which will drive savings in procurement, major projects and estate 2011 is £155,362. management. For information the following table includes the statistics In August 2011, the Minister for the Cabinet Office for the preceding three years. and Paymaster General, my right hon. Friend the Member for Horsham (Mr Maude), announced that the Efficiency £ and Reform Group’s new measures had saved £3.75 billion over 2010-11. April 2007 to March 2008 320,850 April 2008 to March 2009 216,086 This impact was assessed using methodologies attached at Annex A which describes the results across Government. April 2009 to March 2010 400,271 The assessment has been independently verified by April 2010 40,274 Government auditors who found the benefits assertions May 2010 to November 2011 155,362 to be fairly calculated and presented. Departmental Procurement The Department, its Executive agencies and NDPBs also generate other procurement savings on other categories Owen Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for of expenditure through the four areas of: Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what Renegotiation of existing contracts methodology (a) her Department and (b) the non-departmental public bodies for which she is Efficiencies made in the actual buying process responsible used to estimate savings to the public purse Demand Management made in respect of its procurement and purchasing Reconfiguration of service delivery on items such as telephony, since May 2010. [69279] interims etc. These savings are borne out in Department accounts. Richard Benyon: On 15 November 2010, Official Report, Note 10 (page 92) of the DEFRA Report and Accounts columns 615-16W, the Chief Secretary to the Treasury, 2010-11 (HC1003) reports that non-pay Gross Admin the right hon. Member for Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch Costs (excluding non-cash items) for DEFRA reduced and Strathspey (Danny Alexander), said in response to from £253 million in 2009-10 to £222 million in 2010-11. PQ16752 that the Government had announced a more Figures in this report are prepared in accordance with specific and innovative approach to efficiency and reform HM Treasury’s Financial Reporting Manual for central across the public sector, including: Government Departments and associated Treasury resource a reduction in administration budgets of 34% across the whole accounting and budgeting guidance. of Whitehall and its arm’s length bodies saving £5.9 billion a year by 2014-15; In addition to using the methodologies described as radically reducing the number of arm’s length bodies across follows for other categories, DEFRA uses the National Government; and Audit Office’s definition of VFM to demonstrate savings.
Annex A—Activity and calculation method Activity Calculation
Consulting Government put in place a moratorium on new consulting Savings are calculated by subtracting total departmental spend, and extensions to existing contracts. Where spend reported spend on consultancy for 2010-11 from total was considered operationally critical (for example, where it departmental reported spend on consultancy for 2009-10. might put at risk critical services) an exception process To reduce the risk of costs shifting between categories, we existed for department ministers to sign off expenditure also monitored expenditure on other Professional Services over £20,000. categories, including contingent labour.
Crown Commercial Government have renegotiated deals with some of the The method of calculation varies according to the initiative largest suppliers to Government. that yields the saving, but was based on cash releasing savings against a baseline of what would have otherwise been spent. This was often price savings against the previous price paid. Savings agreed with suppliers are recorded in Memoranda of Understanding as guaranteed-in-year or conditional-in-year savings. Realised savings were subsequently tracked back to departmental verification of supplier progress reports.
Contingent Labour Government have significantly cut the number of Savings are calculated by subtracting total departmental temporary staff. reported spend on contingent labour for 2010-11 from total departmental reported spend on contingent labour for 2009-10.
Communications Government froze all new marketing spend unless it is an Calculations compare departmental spend on marketing operational necessity. Where spend was proposed, and advertising through COI for 2010-11 with that for ministerial sign-off was required for £20,000 or above. 2009-10.
Centralising Procurement Government have started to centralise spend on common For each initiative, calculations are performed using goods and services to drive down prices. These savings individual benefit methodologies that set out how savings derive from the 10 categories of expenditure targeted for will be calculated against an 2009-10 price baseline. centralisation, and relate to price savings through Evidence is management information provided by suppliers. increased aggregation. 361W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 362W
Annex A—Activity and calculation method Activity Calculation
ICT Government implemented: a moratorium on all new ICT Calculations are based on departmental reports of spend spend above £1 million; and a review of all on-going ICT that has not proceeded. Spend that has not gone ahead in commitments. Departments reported those projects that 2010-11 is recorded, as a result of stopping or reducing were closed before undergoing the review. spend. Further, sustainable savings are targeted through the Government ICT strategy.
Major Projects The Government’s biggest projects were reviewed to see HMT have provided assurance that the relevant amounts where 2010-11 costs could practically be reduced within were removed from departmental budgets following the contractual constraints, or wasteful projects stopped Major Projects related negotiations. altogether. Government halted or curtailed spend on four projects: 14-19 Reform—£60 million Identity Cards—£50 million Highways Agency Projects—£54 million Whole Farm—£6.7 million Government have redacted £22 million of potential double counting from these figures, that arises between this work and our supplier renegotiation work stream. £14.9 million arises from the Home Office National Identity Cards and £6.7 million from DEFRA Whole Farm.
Property Government put in place national property controls such Calculations are property by property based on the amount that signature of new property leases or lease extensions Departments have reported saved through the were approved centrally. It has not always been possible to Government’s property database by non-renewal of net off all costs associated with vacating buildings. property leases at lease breaks or upon lease expiry. However, Government have also not claimed savings in respect of revenue from property disposals.
Departmental Public Expenditure Table A £ David Simpson: To ask the Secretary of State for Design costs Print costs Total Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how much her September 0 37,961 37,961 Department spent on new furnishings in the last year. 2010 [73123] October 2010 7,349 60,736 67,736 November 19,070 59,625 78,695 Richard Benyon: Core DEFRA’s total spend for the 2010 last financial year (2010-11) on furnishings (including December 2010 11,250 34,059 45,309 office furniture) is estimated at £227,124. This includes January 2011 920 32,315 33,235 furnishing needs arising from office refurbishments and February 2011 3,145 25,745 28,890 relocations. March 2011 7,500 33,917 41,417 Total 83,739 462,172 545,562 Departmental Publications In total, 393 jobs were invoiced. Dan Jarvis: To ask the Secretary of State for Since March 2011, a contract with Publishing Delivery Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many (a) Service (PDS) was used, also appointed on a fair and leaflets, (b) posters and (c) reports her Department open competitive basis. has published since May 2010; how much each cost; In addition the Central Office of Information (COI), and which company (i) published and (ii) designed and various agents who work with them, have undertaken each. [83005] some publishing and design work for the Department. Due to the way costs are categorised it is not possible to Richard Benyon: Since May 2010 DEFRA has used separate out design and publishing costs separately, two separate publishing contracts. For the financial although it is possible to provide a composite figure. year 2010-11 information is available on publishing and Please see Table B for 2010-11. design costs for leaflets, posters and reports on a monthly basis as set out in Table A. However, exact numbers of It is not currently possible to provide information on individual publications are not available and could not the 2011-12 financial year as figures have not yet been be obtained without incurring disproportionate cost. confirmed by final audit. This contract was handled by Communisis, who were Table B: COI and linked agencies—financial year 2010-11 appointed via fair and open competition, and who have Design and print costs (£) handled the majority of such work for DEFRA in this period. May 2010 6,635 June 2010 4,471 Table A July 2010 3,391 £ August 2010 38,341 Design costs Print costs Total September 2010 608 May 2010 7,320 39,287 46,607 October 2010 2,886 June 2010 20,475 87,881 108,356 November 2010 1,520 July 2010 5,240 36,885 42,125 December 2010 23,717 August 2010 1,470 13,761 15,231 January 2011 4,475 363W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 364W
Table B: COI and linked agencies—financial year 2010-11 Mr Ellwood: To ask the Secretary of State for Design and print costs (£) Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what her policy is on the mandatory electronic chipping of dogs; and if February 2011 37,647 she will make a statement. [87404] March 2011 21,666 Total 145,356 Mr Paice: The Government support voluntary In total, 163 jobs were invoiced. identification of pets—by microchipping, permanent identification and the registering of pets on nationwide Departmental Secondment databases. DEFRA Ministers and officials are currently engaged with key stakeholders from wider government, Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State the police and animal welfare organisations concerning for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what the content of possible legislation, including the secondments there have been to her Department from microchipping of dogs. (a) industry and (b) the third sector since May 2010; We intend to make an announcement on tackling what the (i) purpose and (ii) duration is of each irresponsible dog ownership early in the new year. secondment; and whether each secondment was to a policy development role. [86141] Elephants: Africa
Richard Benyon: Since May 2010 there has been one Caroline Dinenage: To ask the Secretary of State for secondment into DEFRA from industry and there have Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what support the not been any from the third sector. Government is providing through international The secondee is a technical analyst working on organisations to tackle the poaching of elephants in requirements, design and testing on the UK Location Central and West Africa. [87154] programme. The duration of the secondment is two years. The secondment is not to a policy development Richard Benyon: The UK as a party to the convention role. on international trade in endangered species (CITES) supports its efforts to maintain or enhance countries’ Departmental Temporary Employment enforcement capabilities. In May this year, the UK participated in a CITES-organised rhino and elephant Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for enforcement task force meeting at which intelligence Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many reports and methodologies were exchanged and strategies temporary staff have been recruited to her Department were developed to tackle the illegal trade in both animals between September and November 2011. [88007] across their ranges. The UK provides funds for two CITES monitoring Richard Benyon: Temporary staff are people directly programmes: Monitoring the Illegal Killing of Elephants employed by core DEFRA under employment contracts (MIKE) and the Elephant Trade Information System of less than 12 months and paid via the DEFRA (ETIS), which were set up to monitor and assess the payroll. Between September and November 2011, no levels of poaching and trafficking to inform subsequent temporary staff were recruited to core DEFRA. decisions in CITES. Detergents We will continue to look to engage constructively in international discussions on his issue and assist elephant Ben Gummer: To ask the Secretary of State for range states where needed. For example, African elephant Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what recent range states have recently agreed an action plan covering representations she has received on the adequacy of a wide range of conservation measures. The UK is regulation of the use of environmentally harmful contributing funds to this work. chemicals in household detergents. [87392] Neil Parish: To ask the Secretary of State for Richard Benyon: DEFRA has not received any Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what financial representations on the adequacy of regulation of the support her Department is providing to the African use of environmentally harmful chemicals in household Elephant Action Plan through the African Elephant detergents. Fund. [87663] Dogs: Tagging Richard Benyon: The Department has recently agreed funding of £32,000 for the African Elephant Fund in Mr Mike Hancock: To ask the Secretary of State for support of the African Elephant Action Plan. Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (1) what estimate she has made of the likely cost to the public EU Landfill Directive purse of the compulsory microchipping of dogs; [86637] Mr Dodds: To ask the Secretary of State for (2) what assessment she has made of the operation of Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what estimate the voluntary microchipping system for dogs. [86639] she has made of the cost to the public purse of the EU Landfill Directive since its introduction. [87829] Mr Paice: Officials have prepared an assessment of all aspects of microchipping, including the voluntary Richard Benyon: The EU Landfill Directive, first system and the cost of compulsory microchipping, and implemented in 2002, has helped bring about consistently this assessment will inform DEFRA policy. high standards in the design, operation, closure and 365W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 366W aftercare of landfill sites, the costs of which fall to Number of fishermen employed through the fishing industry (full time and part landfill site operators. DEFRA has not undertaken any time) by constituent part of UK specific assessment of the estimated cost to the public Regular purse of the Directive. 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 In line with the waste hierarchy, landfill is the least North 61 56 61 99 58 144 144 preferred option for the disposal of biodegradable and Western recyclable waste. This is on the grounds that it is a waste Total 5,558 5,230 4,897 4,692 4,570 4,768 4,768 of resources, and because landfill gas is a significant contributor to greenhouse gas emissions. Wales The additional costs of the Directive requirements to All Areas 806 796 805 376 341 417 563 divert biodegradable municipal waste from landfill above Total 806 796 805 376 341 417 563 and beyond the baseline trend have largely fallen to local authorities. The Landfill Allowance Trading scheme Scotland (LATS) was introduced in 2005 to meet these diversion Eyemouth 161 152 157 148 133 140 148 targets. DEFRA has allocated waste infrastructure credits Pittenweem 112 107 101 95 117 140 120 (formerly PFI credits) to part-finance 32 local authority Aberdeen 105 91 118 103 102 94 94 infrastructure projects which will divert biodegradable Peterhead 374 273 412 469 434 408 400 municipal waste from landfill. The payments to local Fraserburgh 603 614 614 693 901 712 671 authorities will total £4 billion. Buckie 266 227 230 228 220 226 192 Subsequent to the introduction of the LATS, landfill Scrabster 214 157 165 197 191 170 168 tax has been raised significantly. This is in order to and Wick reduce the environmental impact of landfilling, and Orkney 305 284 288 317 287 275 277 promote more sustainable treatment of waste both covered Shetland 260 304 315 352 257 246 231 by the Landfill directive targets and that which is not. Stornoway 225 238 299 343 414 370 350 As a result, it was agreed as part of the 2011 Review of Kinlochbervie 38 41 36 40 40 43 44 Waste Policy in England to end LATS in 2013. Both the Lochinver 41 35 28 22 22 22 21 proposals to set up the scheme and to end it were Ullapool 70 74 75 86 88 298 274 accompanied by impact assessments on the costs and Mallaig 254 268 297 290 296 290 277 benefits. and Portree Copies of these impact assessments are available on Oban 198 163 175 168 239 250 242 DEFRA’s website. Campbeltown 259 256 292 248 239 226 231 Ayr 639 529 507 609 605 493 517 Fisheries Total 4,124 3,813 4,109 4,408 4,585 4,403 4,257
Mr Dodds: To ask the Secretary of State for Northern Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what estimate Ireland she has made of the number of active fishermen in North 20 20 20 20 20 26 24 each (a) constituent part of the UK and (b) region in Coast Kilkeel 250 255 255 242 235 230 225 each year since 2001. [87836] Portavogie 176 154 185 195 186 187 176 Richard Benyon: The UK fishing industry provides Ard glass 89 85 87 100 91 98 110 many jobs in coastal communities, and brings both Total 535 514 547 557 532 541 535 social and economic benefits to communities where other opportunities to find employment are often scarce. United 11,023 10,353 10,358 10,033 10,028 10,129 10,172 The following tables contains data relating to the number Kingdom of full-time and part-time fishermen. The data has been broken down into regions within each constituent part Part Time of the UK. Prior to 2004, the data collected regarding 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 the number of fishermen employed in the fishing industry England was only broken down into constituent parts, rather North 16 32 33 80 99 107 14 than the major port areas. Eastern Number of fishermen employed through the fishing industry (full time and part Humberside 68 129 125 79 107 70 0 time) by constituent part of UK Eastern 60 65 94 135 49 33 51 Regular South 238 47 397 15 311 102 364 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 Eastern South 37 71 73 202 166 166 232 England Western North 705 666 623 465 497 468 468 Western 257 261 272 327 335 99 227 Eastern North 149 141 66 59 85 13 68 Humberside 925 801 946 952 900 802 802 Western Eastern 617 473 404 196 505 631 631 Total 825 746 1,060 897 1,152 590 956 South 1,042 1,235 895 1,272 1,230 1,191 1,191 Eastern Wales South 1,087 949 1,017 868 908 920 920 Western All Areas 370 335 354 597 534 434 553 Western 1,121 1,050 951 840 472 612 612 Total 370 335 354 597 534 434 553 367W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 368W
Part Time Total 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010
South 1,124 1,020 1,090 1,070 1,074 1,086 1,223 Western Scotland Western 1,378 1,311 1,223 1,167 807 711 898 Eyemouth 12 16 19 20 13 11 45 North 210 197 127 158 143 157 135 Pittenweem 30 35 35 30 47 34 43 Western Aberdeen 52 72 44 54 49 58 58 Total 6,383 5,976 5,957 5,589 5,722 5,358 5,773 Peterhead 43 0 45 0 31 53 24 Fraserburgh 122 150 149 153 0 114 118 Wales Buckie 27 21 25 27 50 47 51 All Areas 1,176 1,131 1,159 973 875 851 1,116 Scrabster 00 00 000 and Wick Total 1,176 1,131 1,159 973 875 851 1,116 Orkney 38 51 54 73 43 146 132 Shetland 187 147 156 174 216 184 217 Scotland Stornoway 258 249 187 137 105 89 73 Eyemouth 173 168 176 168 146 151 193 Kinlochbervie 2 2 5 1 1 0 0 Pittenweem 142 142 136 125 164 174 163 Lochinver 5 10 8 3 3 3 1 Aberdeen 157 163 162 157 151 152 152 Ullapool 4 6 9 13 13 15 11 Peterhead 417 273 457 469 465 461 424 Mallaig 98 113 115 82 79 45 43 Fraserburgh 725 764 763 846 901 826 789 and Portree Buckie 293 248 255 255 270 273 243 Oban 78 81 74 55 29 29 23 Scrabster 214 157 165 197 191 170 168 and Wick Campbeltown 70 69 35 34 32 28 28 Orkney 343 335 342 390 330 421 409 Ayr 125 136 136 245 96 90 42 Shetland 447 451 471 526 473 430 448 Total 1,151 1,158 1,096 1,101 807 946 909 Stornoway 483 487 486 480 519 459 423 Kinlochbervie 40 43 41 41 41 43 44 Northern Lochinver 46 45 36 25 25 25 22 Ireland Ullapool 74 80 84 99 101 313 285 North 5 5 12 12 12 30 30 Coast Mallaig 352 381 412 372 375 335 320 and Kilkeel 50 25 25 60 60 60 62 Portree Portavogie24202222151715Oban 276 244 249 223 268 279 265 Ardglass55 77 666Campbeltown 329 325 327 282 271 254 259 Total 84 55 66 101 93 113 113 Ayr 764 665 643 854 701 583 559 Total 5,275 4,971 5,205 5,509 5,392 5,349 5,166 United 2,430 2,294 25,76 2,696 2,586 2,083 2,531 Kingdom Northern Ireland Total North 25 25 32 32 32 56 54 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 Coast Kilkeel 300 280 280 302 295 290 287 England Portavogie 200 174 207 217 201 204 191 North 721 698 656 545 596 575 531 Ard glass 94 90 94 107 97 104 116 Eastern Humberside 993 930 1,071 1,031 1,007 872 820 Total 619 569 613 658 625 654 648 Eastern 677 538 498 331 554 664 581 South 1,280 1,282 1,292 1,287 1,541 1,293 1,585 United 13,453 12,647 12,934 12,729 12,614 12,212 12,703 Eastern Kingdom
England and Wales Scotland Northern Ireland UK Regular PT Total Regular PT Total Regular PT Total Regular PT Total
2001 6.057 1,392 7,449 5,353 1,284 6,637 513 46 559 11,923 2,722 14,645 2002 5,587 841 6,428 4,369 1,338 5,707 568 43 611 10,524 2,222 12,746 2003 4,866 1,404 6,270 3,918 1,088 5,006 458 40 498 9,242 2.532 11,774
Fisheries: North West the Marine and Coastal Access Act (2009) and they are responsible for completing a review of all byelaws by Mr Hanson: To ask the Secretary of State for April 2015. I understand that the North Western IFCA Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what plans she is urgently reviewing Byelaw 5 and will be discussing has to review Bylaw 5 as it relates to the North Western possible revisions in due course. Inshore Fisheries and Conservation Authority. [87373] Richard Benyon: The management of inshore fisheries, Mr Hanson: To ask the Secretary of State for including cockling, has been devolved to the inshore Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what recent fisheries and conservation authorities (IFCAs) through discussions she has had with the North Western 369W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 370W
Inshore Fisheries and Conservation Authority on The UK is running a number of initiatives to reduce enforcement of approved licences. [87374] discards. These include trials of catch quota management (a quota for what is caught at sea rather than landed at Richard Benyon: The North Western Inshore Fisheries port) for North sea cod and area 7e sole. Results have and Conservation Authority (IFCA) is responsible for been very positive. For example, the English catch quota the management of inshore fisheries in the north west, scheme has reduced discards of species subject to catch including the enforcement of licences. This is a matter quotas to 0.25%. Through trialling catch quota and for North Western IFCA, having been delegated these other standalone projects, the UK continues to encourage powers under the Marine and Coastal Access Act (2009). fishermen to take up and develop more selective fishing gears to avoid unwanted catches in the first place. Mr Hanson: To ask the Secretary of State for DEFRA has also commissioned the Fishing for the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what steps she is Markets research to look at the market side of the taking to ensure that those who hold licences issued by problem. The research made recommendations on how the North Western Inshore Fisheries and Conservation to increase the consumption and use of under-utilised, Authority (NWIFCA) are able to exercise their sustainable species that are often discarded. The work is employment; and what assessment she has made of the continuing in partnership with the Seafood Industry. loss of earnings of NWIFCA-licensed cockle fisherman. [87376] Flood Control: Finance Richard Benyon: The North Western Inshore Fisheries Bill Esterson: To ask the Secretary of State for and Conservation Authority (IFCA) issues licences for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (1) what various activities as part of their management of inshore assessment she has made of the effect of changes in fisheries on the north west coast of England. Should spending on flood defences on the budgets for clearing the need arise, the IFCA can close a fishery, as recently up after flooding of (a) her Department, (b) local happened with the cockle beds on the Ribble Estuary authorities, (c) insurance companies and (d) local and the Wirral. The closure of a fishery and any decision land owners; [81469] to re-open it is a matter for the IFCA. Consequently, no assessment has been made by DEFRA of the loss of (2) what assessment she has made of the effect of earning to licensed cockle fishermen in the north west changes on spending on flood defences on the cost of as a result of the recent fishery closures. clearing up after flooding in Sefton, West Lancashire and Ribble. [81470] Fishing Catches Richard Benyon: Central Government responsibility for recovery after a flood, including clearing-up, rests Mr Dodds: To ask the Secretary of State for with the Department for Communities and Local Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what estimate Government. Therefore there has been no impact on she has made of the total tonnage of fish discards in budgets for clearing up after flooding as a result of UK waters in each year of the Common Fisheries changes in spending on flood defences. Policy’s operation. [87831] Food: Exports Richard Benyon: UK fisheries laboratories have been sending scientific observers to sea to record the quantity of fish discarded by the UK since 1975. The data Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for collected on these trips is used to estimate the quantities Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what steps she is offish discarded by UK vessels in European waters. taking to promote exports of British food to other EU Figures are estimates only, with the accuracy of the member states. [87752] figures depending on the level of sampling coverage. Mr Paice: DEFRA has a key role to play in supporting A breakdown of discards by fishery is available for the food and farming sector become more competitive 2008 to 2010 and summarised in the following table. and sustainable. Taking advantage of new opportunities Figures for 2011 have yet to be analysed. in overseas markets is important to the UK’s long-term While data have been collected by Government growth prospects for the sector, and DEFRA works laboratories since 1975, estimates made prior to 2008 closely with UK Trade and Investment to help realise are not available in the same format. For this reason opportunities in international markets. they are not included. We are progressing work on the DEFRA Business Discard estimates (kilotonnes per year) plan commitment to work with the food and drink Scottish industry, and other Government Departments, to take (cod, English and haddock, full advantage of the potential for growth through Welsh1 whiting, UK pelagic overseas trade (including by identifying global market (demersal) saithe only) species Total opportunities and barriers to exports). As part of this, 2008 9.4 35.1 4.9 49.9 the Government announced in the Chancellor of the 2009 224.406 24.401 8.27 59.085 Exchequer, my right hon. Friend the Member for Tatton 2010 226.626 25.071 3— 51.697 (Mr Osborne), autumn statement of 29 November 2011, 1 Northern Irish estimates are unavailable across all years. Official Report, columns 799-810, a commitment to 2 Sampling coverage has generally improved in some areas and fleets since 2009. publish a joint government/industry Agri-food and Drink Since 2009 English and Welsh estimates include discards of all species, not just Exports Action plan in January 2012, which will set a quota species. Furthermore, the under 10m sector estimates have also been included. shared vision to drive export growth in the sector as 3 Unavailable. well as setting out areas for immediate action. 371W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 372W
The Action plan will focus on opening international Government Procurement Card markets for the food and farming sector, ensuring the right information and support is available to help companies Chris Kelly: To ask the Secretary of State for succeed overseas, simplifying the process for food specific Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many export paperwork, and promoting the best of British Government Procurement Card transactions were food and drink overseas. To support this, last year I made by her Department’s officials withdrawing cash personally attended Anuga in Germany, one of the from automated teller machines from 2006-07 to world’s largest food and drink tradeshows, to support 2009-10; at what cost; and on which dates. [73724] UK companies working to access overseas markets both in the EU and beyond. Richard Benyon: Information prior to 1 June 2009 Food: Waste could be provided only at disproportionate cost. The following table provides detail of cash withdrawals Laura Sandys: To ask the Secretary of State for by officials working in support of Ministers in core Environment, Food and Rural Affairs if she will DEFRA for the period 1 June 2009 to 31 March 2010. consider reviewing the best before dates for low-risk The cost of these withdrawals was £124.54. food products for the purposes of reducing food waste. [88788] Cash is withdrawn to cover the reasonable costs of providing modest refreshments for ministerial meetings, Mr Paice: DEFRA issued guidance on the application including with external stakeholders, and a full log of of date marking to food businesses in September 2011 receipts is kept to account for this. to help them improve the consistency of the use of the 1 June 2009 to 31 March 2010 ‘best before’ and ‘use by’ date marks to prevent food Expense line being needlessly thrown away. date Justification £ The guidance will help businesses to decide whether 24 September Cash taken out for Petty Cash—24 September 100.00 to label their food products with either a ‘best before’ or 2009 2009 a ‘use by’ date. Either one or the other of these dates is 4 November Petty Cash for Secretariat Messengers (Exemption 200.00 required by law but the choice is a technical decision by 2009 agreed) 23 November Petty Cash for Secretariat Messengers (Exemption 200.00 the food manufacturer. The guidance is principally a 2009 agreed) decision tree asking a series of important questions 1 February Petty Cash for Secretariat Messengers (Exemption 200.00 around the production of a food product from a 2010 agreed) microbiological perspective. 1 March 2010 Petty Cash for Secretariat Messengers (Exemption 200.00 The guidance also includes a short guide especially agreed) 25 October Taxi, food, subsistence 80.00 prepared to assist small and medium-sized business. It 2009 will aid compliance with the law and assist food businesses 13 December Taxi £70, subsistence 80.00 which do not have in-house knowledge or expertise to 2009 decide which date marks should apply to which foods 22 November Taxi, food, subsistence 40.00 and if they need to seek further advice, e.g. from their 2009 local authority or a specialist food consultant. 25 February Cash to cover taxi/tube/fares 30.00 2010 Laura Sandys: To ask the Secretary of State for 14 January Cash to cover future bus/tube/taxis for meetings 30.00 Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what steps her 2010 Department is taking to reduce waste across the food 23 July 2009 Cash for travel with Minister 50.06 7 October Cash for taxi to Department to pick up papers 40.00 supply chain. [88791] 2009 then on to train station for ministerial visit 7 October Cash for Minster’s taxi from station 40.00 Mr Paice: The Government’s “Review of Waste Policy 2009 in England”, published in June 2011, sets out our aim to 2 December Cash in USD to cover expenses during Ghana 100.87 move towards a zero waste economy. It outlines our 2009 trip long-term vision for food waste, which includes substantially 24 November Cash to pay for Minister and PS visas to 60.00 reducing the amount arising. 2009 Ghana 25 February Cash to cover taxis and other small expenses 40.00 DEFRA is working with food retailers and 2010 manufacturers via the Courtauld Commitment, a 16 November Cash to cover taxi during Ross on Wye trip 30.00 responsibility deal aimed at improving resource efficiency 2009 and reducing the carbon and wider environmental impact 20 November Cash handling fee 20.00 of the grocery retail sector. We are also working with 2009 industry, the Devolved Administrations and the Waste 6 October Petty Cash for Secretariat Messengers (Exemption 200.00 2009 agreed) and Resources Action programme to develop a new 5 August 2009 Petty Cash for Secretariat Messengers (Exemption 200.00 responsibility deal with the hospitality and food service agreed) sectors to reduce food and packaging waste and ensure 11 May 2009 Petty Cash for Secretariat Messengers (Exemption 200.00 that unavoidable waste is managed sustainably. agreed) We will continue to work with businesses and consumers 16 September Reimburse Minister and pay for incidentals on 220.00 2009 trip: £89 for Minister’s hotel on 9 September to ensure less food is wasted by sharing insight, evidence 2009 £8.50 for incidental costs on 9 September and best practice, improving product design and retail 2009 £98 train tickets on 6 September 2009 £32 and supply chain practice, engaging consumers, and taxi fares on 15-17 September 2009 encouraging local partnership approaches. 31 July 2009 Cash withdrawal to reimburse Minister’s 130.00 incidental expenses We will also lead by example by tackling food waste 22 June 2009 Cash withdraw to exchange to Euros 100.47 across the public sector estate. 373W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 374W
1 June 2009 to 31 March 2010 proposals to legislate against the prophylactic use of Expense line antibiotics in livestock farming. [87807] date Justification £
21 October Cash withdrawal to pay for:£30 taxi from Bristol 100.00 Mr Paice: The European Parliament’s resolution of 2009 Airport to Communicate Conference Venue 27 October 2011 called for the phasing out of the on 21 October 2009 £75 taxi from Conference Venue to Swindon to catch train for debate in prophylactic use of antibiotics in livestock farming. house 21 October 2009 £10.54 lunch at Swindon The European Commission’s communication on its train station “Action plan against the rising threats from antimicrobial 4 November Cash withdrawal to pay for: £18—taxi from 100.00 resistance”, published on 17 November 2011, did not 2009 Edinburgh airport to conference venue on 4 November 2009 £7.10—drinks at venue 4 specifically mention prophylaxis when referring to the November 20090 £5.60—taxi from venue to veterinary use of antibiotics. The European Commission hotel on 4 November 2009 £16.50—taxi from has not yet published any proposals to change EU hotel to airport on 5 November 2009 legislation on the regulation of veterinary medicines. 10 August Cash withdrawal to reimburse the Minister 100.00 2009 and pay for incidentals on the trip to Scotland: £13 lunch at Fort William £14 coffees/minor Marine Conservation Zones refreshments for two in Mallaig £20 taxi from train station to hotel £20 and £18 taxi fares from Bridgend to Maesteg Fiona O’Donnell: To ask the Secretary of State for 7 August 2009 To reimburse the Minister: £75 for Hotel in 100.00 Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many sites Crewe on 27 July 2009 £22 for taxi from Bridgend to Maesteg on 22 July 2009 have been assessed as having adequate supporting 20 October Cash Withdrawal in Luxembourg to pay for 93.98 scientific evidence for designation as a marine 2009 lunch and miscellaneous expenses while at conservation zone. [83080] Fisheries Council 24 June 2009 Cash withdrawal to reimburse Minister 90.00 Richard Benyon: The independent Science Advisory 7 October Cash withdrawal of 500DKK to pay for:225DKK 64.02 Panel (SAP) recently carried out an initial assessment 2009 for taxi from venue to airport on 8 October 2009 103DKK for taxi from hotel to conference of the evidence base for the proposed marine conservation venue on 8 October 2009 170DKK miscellaneous zone (MCZ) sites. This assessment was based on the (coffee etc.) information presented by the four regional MCZ projects. 7 October Currency exchange from £ to 400DKK to pay 56.55 The SAP concluded that around 25% of the 2009 for:80DKK for drinks at airport on 7 October 2009 209DKK for taxi from airport to hotel recommendations appeared to be well supported by the on 7 October 2009 206DKK for dinner at evidence presented and recommended an in-depth review airport on 8 October 2009 of the evidence base for all proposed sites. The SAP’s 21 October Cash withdrawal to pay for taxi from Paris 55.95 report can be found within the MCZ pages on the 2009 hotel to CDG Airport 60EUR DEFRA website: 26 July 2009 Cash withdrawal from Grantham Station to 50.00 pay for taxis to and from CLA Game Fair http://www.defra.gov.uk/environment/marine/protect/mpa/ (return taxi receipt missing) mcz/sap/ 15 December Cash withdrawal in Brussels to purchase coffees 46.14 In line with the SAP’s recommendations, DEFRA is 2009 and lunches throughout Council proceedings on 14-16 December currently commissioning the in-depth review into site 7 December Cash withdrawal to pay for taxis, coffee and 40.00 proposals. 2009 lunch for the Minister’s trip while in Scotland on 7 December Fiona O’Donnell: To ask the Secretary of State for 1 February Cash withdrawal to fund £30 taxi following 40.00 2010 cancelled train and £10.04 for food at the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs whether funding station for improving the scientific evidence base for marine 8 December To reimburse Minister for taxis from Scotland 20.00 conservation zones will be distributed across all such 2009 Office in Edinburgh to Airport on 7 December zones where further evidence is required. [83094]
Japan Tobacco Richard Benyon: The review of the evidence base underpinning the recommendations of the four regional Mr Hain: To ask the Secretary of State for projects is expected to consider all site recommendations. Environment, Food and Rural Affairs whether any (a) Ministers and (b) special advisers in her Department Discussions are underway between DEFRA and its have received hospitality from Japan Tobacco delivery partners on the best approach to commissioning International since May 2010. [87612] additional sea bed and habitat monitoring in English waters. This is to ensure we make the best use of Richard Benyon: Information about hospitality received additional funding to support marine conservation zone by Ministers and special advisers is published quarterly designation. by Departments. Information for the period 13 May 2010 to 30 June 2011 can be accessed on DEFRA’s National Parks: Public Consultation website. Information for 1 July 2011 onwards will be published in due course. Fiona O’Donnell: To ask the Secretary of State for DEFRA Ministers and special advisers have not received Environment, Food and Rural Affairs when she expects hospitality from Japan Tobacco International since May the review by National Park Authorities on 2010. arrangements for local governance to be completed. Livestock Industry [84432]
Glyn Davies: To ask the Secretary of State for Richard Benyon: I announced the Government’s decisions Environment, Food and Rural Affairs if she will make on the review in a parliamentary written statement on it her policy to oppose the European Commission’s 13 September 2011, Official Report, column 43WS. 375W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 376W
Rural Areas: Finance million, including an element of its recent RGF award, will be used to support rural tourism) are contributing resources to the package. Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs whether the Third Sector £165 million funding for the rural economy that her Department announced on 29 November 2011 was Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for additional to funding previously allocated to her Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how much direct Department by HM Treasury. [85895] funding her Department provided to each civil society organisation it funded in (a) 2010-11, (b) 2011-12, (c) Richard Benyon: No additional funding has been 2012-13, (d) 2013-14 and (e) 2014-15; and if she will allocated to DEFRA to finance the package of measures make a statement. [74828] announced on 29 November 2011 by the Chancellor of the Exchequer. However, DEFRA is using its Richard Benyon: The information requested could be existing resources efficiently in order to deliver a valuable provided only at disproportionate cost. boost to the rural economy. This includes redirecting £20 million of DEFRA’s planned contributions to the Veterinary Laboratories Agency Regional Growth Fund (RGF) to support Rural Growth Networks and the Rural Community Renewable Tom Blenkinsop: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy Fund; and the targeting of £100 million (previously Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what the site unallocated) from the Rural Development Programme property valuations are of the regional veterinary for England 2007-13 on supporting rural businesses. laboratory centres in England and Wales. [87818] In addition, other Government Departments and public bodies, such as the Home Office (up to £2.3 Mr Paice: The existing use values as at 1 April 2010 million will support women-led businesses particularly of the regional veterinary laboratory centres in England in Rural Growth Networks) and Visit England (£12 and Wales are:
Location Existing use value (£)
Shrewsbury 3,085,000 Preston 5,020,000 Langford, Bristol 905,000 Exeter 5,105,000 Truro 690,000 Thirsk 3,580,000 Winchester 3,350,000 Newcastle 2,195,000 Bury St Edmunds 3,510,000 Luddington 4,110,000 Carmarthen 2,060,000 Aberystwyth 820,000 Notes: 1. These figures are asset valuations prepared for resource accounting purposes. The majority of the properties are assessed on a depreciated replacement cost basis due to their specialist nature. 2. DEFRA does not currently hold open market valuations for these properties. 3. Where sites are shared, the value shown is for the entire site. 4, These figures exclude Sutton Bonington and Penrith which are both leasehold properties. The main central veterinary laboratory at Weybridge is also excluded as it is not classified as a regional laboratory.
Water Charges Jarrow constituency, (b) South Tyneside and (c) the north-east in each of the last five years; and how many Jim Dowd: To ask the Secretary of State for were (i) successful and (ii) unsuccessful. [87721] Environment, Food and Rural Affairs whether she plans to replace the use of rateable values in the calculation of bills for unmetered domestic water Mr Hurd: I have been asked to reply on behalf of the supply. [87871] Cabinet Office. Richard Benyon: There are no plans to replace the use of rateable values in the calculation of bills for unmetered The figures requested are in the following tables: domestic water supply. Jarrow constituency: Projects with a correspondence address within the constituency (figures exclude projects based elsewhere and serving this constituency) 2007 2008 2009 2010 20111 CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT Awarded 25 28 15 21 14 Big Lottery Fund Rejected 32 38 33 28 15 Mr Hepburn: To ask the Secretary of State for All5766484929 Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport how many 1 Figures for 2011 exclude the two applications received in the year applications for Big Lottery funding were made in (a) that are still in assessment. 377W Written Answers11 JANUARY 2012 Written Answers 378W
South Tyneside: Projects with a correspondence address within the A copy of the data requested will be placed in the unitary authority (figures exclude projects based elsewhere and serving Library of the House. this unitary authority) 2007 2008 2009 2010 20111 Works of Art Awarded 50 48 34 38 23 Rejected 60 65 62 53 35 Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for All 110 113 96 91 58 Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport (1) what estimate 1 Figures for 2011 exclude the seven applications received in the year he has made of the number and proportion of unlisted that are still in assessment. and unprotected outdoor public works of art in North-east region: Projects with a correspondence address within the unitary authority (figures exclude projects based elsewhere and serving England; and if he will make a statement; [88526] this region) (2) what estimate he has made of the number of local 2007 2008 2009 2010 20111 authorities that have undertaken an audit of the public art outdoors in their area; and if he will make a Awarded 708 695 567 426 469 statement. [88527] Rejected 1031 966 926 891 798 All 1,739 1,661 1,493 1,317 1,267 Mr Vaizey: The Public Monuments and Sculpture 1 Figures for 2011 exclude the 109 applications received in the year Association, the lead body for our outdoor sculptural that are still in assessment. heritage, has received funding from the Heritage Lottery Mr Hepburn: To ask the Secretary of State for Fund and other organisations for their National Recording Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport how many Project, which aims to make a survey of public monuments applications for Big Lottery funding were made in each and sculpture across Britain. The database already includes parliamentary constituency in each of the last five more than 9,300 entries. years; and how many were unsuccessful. [87722] Many local authorities own and maintain public art outdoor works and organise their own records. This Mr Hurd: I have been asked to reply on behalf of the Department does not hold an estimate of the number of Cabinet Office. local authorities which have undertaken an audit.
ORAL ANSWERS
Wednesday 11 January 2012
Col. No. Col. No. PRIME MINISTER ...... 169 SCOTLAND—continued Engagements...... 169 Ministry of Defence Police...... 159 NEETs ...... 162 SCOTLAND...... 159 Poverty...... 163 Child Tax Credits...... 160 Public Subsidies ...... 168 Independence Referendum...... 165 Work Capability Assessment...... 164 Inward Investment ...... 161 Youth Unemployment...... 167 WRITTEN MINISTERIAL STATEMENTS
Wednesday 11 January 2012
Col. No. Col. No. COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT.. 13WS ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL Social Housing...... 13WS AFFAIRS...... 16WS Single Payment Scheme...... 16WS EDUCATION...... 14WS National Curriculum in England (Information TREASURY ...... 13WS and Communication Technology)...... 14WS Equitable Life Payment Scheme...... 13WS WRITTEN ANSWERS
Tuesday 10 January 2012—[Continued.]
Col. No. Col. No. CABINET OFFICE...... 249W JUSTICE—continued Charity Commission: Public Appointments ...... 249W Departmental Equality ...... 266W Civil Servants: Redundancy...... 249W Departmental Manpower ...... 266W Deloitte: Government Departments ...... 250W Departmental Recruitment ...... 266W Departmental Civil Proceedings ...... 251W Departmental Redundancy Pay ...... 267W Departmental Judicial Review ...... 251W Departmental Secondment ...... 267W Departmental Manpower ...... 252W Departmental Temporary Employment...... 268W Departmental Temporary Employment...... 252W Domestic Violence, Crime and Victims Act 2004 .. 268W Disadvantaged ...... 253W Email ...... 271W Electoral Register...... 253W European Court of Human Rights ...... 271W Employment: Private Sector ...... 254W Fisheries: North West ...... 272W Food: Prices...... 255W Harassment...... 272W Job Creation: Private Sector ...... 255W Homicide: Life Imprisonment ...... 272W Public Sector: Females...... 256W Human Trafficking ...... 272W Public Sector: Morale ...... 256W Information Commissioner...... 277W Public Sector: Pensions...... 256W Japan Tobacco ...... 277W Public Sector: Procurement...... 257W Legal Aid Scheme: Social Security Benefits...... 277W Public Sector: Stress...... 257W Non-Governmental Organisations...... 278W Public Sector: Trade Unions...... 258W Offenders: Compensation ...... 279W Third Sector...... 258W Offenders: Expenditure...... 279W Trade Unions...... 258W Offenders: Rehabilitation...... 279W Voluntary Work: Young People ...... 258W Police: Crimes of Violence...... 281W Wales ...... 260W Prisoners Employment...... 281W Prisoners: Learning Disability ...... 284W JUSTICE...... 260W Prisoners’ Transfers: Scotland...... 282W Bail and Accommodation Support Service: Prisons: Energy...... 284W Thanet ...... 260W Prisons: Foreign Nationals ...... 287W Chief Coroner...... 260W Protection from Harassment Act 1997 ...... 287W Contempt of Court: Non-Molestation Orders ...... 261W Rights of Accused: EU Action...... 288W Co-operatives...... 261W Sentencing: Drugs...... 289W Courts...... 262W Sexual Offences...... 289W Debt Collection ...... 265W Witnesses: Finance...... 290W Defamation Bill: Draft ...... 265W Young Offenders: Learning Difficulty ...... 290W Departmental Apprentices...... 265W Youth Justice ...... 291W WRITTEN ANSWERS
Wednesday 11 January 2012
Col. No. Col. No. BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS ...... 324W ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE ...... 320W Arms Trade...... 324W Co-operatives...... 320W Business ...... 325W Departmental Apprentices ...... 321W Business: Loans...... 326W Energy Efficiency Deployment Office: Public Business: Regulation ...... 327W Appointments ...... 322W Cluster Munitions...... 331W Energy: Prices ...... 322W Council for Science and Technology ...... 331W Horizon Nuclear Power ...... 323W Departmental Equality ...... 332W Power Failures...... 323W Departmental Manpower...... 332W Solar Power...... 323W Departmental Recruitment ...... 332W Solar Power: Feed-in Tariffs...... 323W Departmental Redundancy Pay ...... 332W Warm Front Scheme ...... 324W Departmental Temporary Employment ...... 333W Wind Power ...... 324W Foreign Investment in UK ...... 333W Foresight...... 334W ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL Green Investment Bank ...... 334W AFFAIRS...... 345W Hearing Impairment ...... 335W Adders: Conservation ...... 345W High Street Review...... 336W Animal Health and Veterinary Laboratories Higher Education: Admissions ...... 336W Agency: West Midlands ...... 345W Higher Education: Applications...... 337W Animal Welfare: Circuses...... 345W Higher Education: Standards...... 337W Animals: Imports...... 347W Insolvency...... 338W Biodiversity: Finance ...... 349W Japan Tobacco International: Ministerial Policy Biofuels...... 349W Advisers ...... 339W Butterfly Conservation: Finance ...... 350W Members: Correspondence ...... 339W Circuses...... 350W Met Office: Pay ...... 339W Cocoa: EU External Trade...... 351W Nuclear Power: Skilled Workers...... 340W Common Agricultural Policy ...... 352W Nuclear Power Stations...... 340W Common Fisheries Policy ...... 351W Public Houses ...... 341W Convention on International Trade in Endangered Retail Trade ...... 341W Species ...... 353W Royal Bank of Scotland ...... 342W Dairy Farming ...... 353W Royal Mail: Pay...... 342W Dangerous Dogs ...... 354W Students: Fees and Charges...... 342W Departmental Assets...... 354W Third Sector: Russia...... 343W Departmental Catering ...... 355W UK Space Agency...... 344W Departmental Chief Scientific Advisers ...... 355W Work Experience...... 344W Departmental Communication ...... 356W Departmental Food...... 357W CABINET OFFICE...... 319W Departmental Manpower...... 358W Charities: VAT ...... 319W Departmental Official Hospitality...... 358W Cybercrime: Crime Prevention...... 319W Departmental Procurement...... 359W EU Law...... 320W Departmental Public Expenditure...... 361W Third Sector...... 320W Departmental Publications ...... 361W Departmental Secondment ...... 363W Departmental Temporary Employment ...... 363W COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT.. 299W Detergents...... 363W Departmental Equality ...... 299W Dogs: Tagging...... 363W European Regional Development Fund...... 300W Elephants: Africa ...... 364W EU Landfill Directive ...... 364W CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT ...... 375W Fisheries...... 365W Big Lottery Fund ...... 375W Fisheries: North West ...... 367W Works of Art...... 378W Fishing Catches...... 369W Flood Control: Finance ...... 370W Food: Exports ...... 370W DEFENCE...... 304W Food: Waste...... 371W Armed Forces: Education ...... 304W Government Procurement Card ...... 372W Armed Forces: Post Traumatic Stress Disorder...... 304W Japan Tobacco ...... 373W Armed Forces: Training ...... 305W Livestock Industry ...... 373W Marines: Rescue Services ...... 305W Marine Conservation Zones...... 374W Yemen ...... 305W National Parks: Public Consultation...... 374W Rural Areas: Finance ...... 375W EDUCATION...... 313W Third Sector...... 376W Apprentices...... 313W Veterinary Laboratories Agency...... 376W Children: Disadvantaged...... 314W Water Charges...... 375W Early Intervention Grant ...... 317W Email ...... 317W HEALTH...... 297W GCSE ...... 318W Dementia: ...... 297W Pupil Premium: Pendle...... 319W Hearing Impaired: Children...... 298W Col. No. Col. No. HEALTH—continued SCOTLAND—continued Meningitis: Vaccination ...... 299W Sovereignty ...... 306W Mental Health Services ...... 299W TRANSPORT ...... 307W HOME DEPARTMENT ...... 293W A31 ...... 307W Departmental Written Questions...... 293W Coastguard Agency: Finance ...... 307W Driving Offences ...... 294W Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency: Databases... 308W Members: Correspondence ...... 294W Fuels: Sulphur...... 308W Police: Rural Areas...... 294W M6: West Midlands...... 309W M54: M6...... 309W HOUSE OF COMMONS COMMISSION...... 294W Road Signs and Markings...... 309W Computers ...... 294W Roads...... 310W
INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT...... 311W TREASURY ...... 300W Departmental Apprentices ...... 311W Bristol and West Building Society ...... 300W Departmental Redundancy Pay ...... 311W Britain Building Investment Fund...... 300W Developing Countries: Agriculture ...... 312W Corporation Tax: Scotland ...... 301W Developing Countries: Biofuels...... 312W Debts: Business ...... 301W Developing Countries: Business...... 313W EU Budget: Contributions ...... 301W Money Advice Service: Northern Ireland...... 301W JUSTICE...... 311W National Insurance Contributions ...... 302W Young Offenders: Health Education ...... 311W Northern Rock plc ...... 302W Regional Growth Fund: Taxation ...... 303W NORTHERN IRELAND ...... 310W Tax Credit...... 303W Co-operatives...... 310W Taxation...... 303W Debt Collection...... 310W Departmental Equality ...... 310W WORK AND PENSIONS ...... 295W Children: Maintenance ...... 295W SCOTLAND...... 306W Employment Schemes ...... 296W Co-operatives...... 306W Housing Benefit: Fraud...... 296W Employment ...... 306W Pensions...... 296W Green Investment Bank ...... 306W Poverty: Children ...... 297W Members who wish to have the Daily Report of the Debates forwarded to them should give notice at the Vote Office. The Bound Volumes will also be sent to Members who similarly express their desire to have them. No proofs of the Daily Reports can be supplied, nor can corrections be made in the Weekly Edition. Corrections which Members suggest for the Bound Volume should be clearly marked in the Daily Report, but not telephoned, and the copy containing the Corrections must be received at the Editor’s Room, House of Commons,
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CONTENTS
Wednesday 11 January 2012
Oral Answers to Questions [Col. 159] [see index inside back page] Secretary of State for Scotland Prime Minister
Breast Implants [Col. 181] Statement—(Mr Lansley)
Trade Union Officials (Refund of Pay to Employers) [Col. 199] Motion for leave to bring in Bill—(Jesse Norman)—on a Division, negatived
Opposition Day [Un-allotted day] Rail Fares [Col. 206] Motion—(Maria Eagle)—on a Division, negatived Energy Prices [Col. 251] Motion—(Caroline Flint)—on a Division, negatived
Khat [Col. 294] Debate on motion for Adjournment
Local Government Finance Bill (Carry- over) [Col. 303] Motion, on a deferred Division, agreed to
Westminster Hall North Korea [Col. 77WH] Empty Property Rates (SMEs) [Col. 101WH] Iran (Human Rights) [Col. 109WH] Sergei Magnitsky [Col. 132WH] Technology (Primary Schools) [Col. 142WH] Debates on motion for Adjournment
Written Ministerial Statements [Col. 13WS]
Written Answers to Questions [Col. 249W] [see index inside back page]