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Constitution Constitution of Canada Du Canada SENATE SÉNAT HOUSE OF COMMONS CHAMBRE DES COMMUNES Issue No.9 Fascicule n.9 Thursday, November 20, 1980 Le jeudi 20 novembre 1980 Joint Chairmen: Coprésidents: Sen¡tor Harry Hays Sénateur Harry Hays Serge Joyal, M.P. Serge Joyal, député Minutes of Proceedings and Evidence P rocès - ve rbaux et t émoi gnages of the Special Joint Committee of du Comité mixte spécial the Senate and of du Sénat et de the House of Commons on the la Chambre des communes sur la Constitution Constitution of Canada du Canada RESPECTING: CONCERNANT: The document entitled "Proposed Resolution for a Le document intitulé <Projet de résolution portant Joint Address to Her Majesty the eueen adresse commune à Sa Majesté la Reine respecting the Constitution of Canada" published concernant la Constitution du Canadar, publié par by the Government on October 2,1980 le gouvernement le 2 octobre 1980 iforme edela WITNESSES: TEMOINS: (See back cover) (Voir à l'endos) First Session of the Première session de la Thirty-second Parliament, 1 980 trente-deuxième législature, I 980 I 0s9 SPECIAL JOINT COMMITTEE OF COMITÉ MIXTE SPÉCIAL DU SÉNAT THE SENATE AND OF THE HOUSE ET DE LA CHAMBRE DES COMMUNES OF COMMONS ON THE CONSTITUTION SUR LA CONSTITUTION DU CANADA OF CANADA Joint Chairmen; Coprésidents: Senator'Harry Hays Sénateur Harry Hays Serge Joyal, M.P. Serge Joyal, député Re pres e nt i ng t he S e nat e: Représentant le Sénat: Senators: Les sénateurs: Austin Haidasz Muir Rousseau Bielish Lapointe Nieman Tremblay-( l0) Bird Representing the House of Commons: Représentant la Chambre des communes: Messrs. Messieurs Bockstael Crombie Irwin Mackasey Campbell (Miss) Dion Jewett (Miss) McGrath (South West Nova) Epp Lapierre Nystrom-( l5) Corbin Hawkes MacDonald (Miss) (Quorum 12) Les cogrefJ'iers du Comité Richard Prégent Paul Bélisle Joint Clerks of the Committee Pursuant to S.O. 65(4)(b) of the House of Commons: Conformément à I'article 65(4)b) du Règlement de la Cham- bre des communes: On Thursday, November 20, 1980: Lejeudi 20 novembre 1980: Mr. Epp replaced Mr. La Salle; M. Epp remplace M. La Salle; Mr. Keeper replaced Mr. de Jong; M. Keeper remplace M. de Jong; Miss Jewett replaced Mr. Keeper; ¡1tte Jewstt remplace M. Keeper; Mr. Robinson (Burnaby) replaced Miss Jewett; M. Robinson (Burnaby\ remplace Mrr" Jewett; Mr. Tobin replaced Mr. Lapierre; M. Tobin remplace M. Lapierre; Mr. Dion (PortneuJ) replaced Mr. Henderson; M. Dion (PortneuJ) remplace M. Henderson; Miss Jewett replaced Mr. Robinson (Burnaby); Mrrc Jewett remplacê M, Robinson (Burnaby); Miss MacDonald replaced Mr. Epp; Mrrc MacDonald remplace M. Epp; Mr. Lapierre replaced Mr. Tobin; M. Lapierre remplace M. Tobin; Mr. Epp replaced Mr. Fraser; M. Epp remplace M. Fraser; Mr. Tobin replaced Mr. Lapierre; M. Tobin remplace M. Lapierre; jewett; Mr. Robinson (Burnaby) replaced Miss Jewett; M. Robinson (Burnaby) remplace Mrr" Pu Mr. Lapierre replaced Mr. Irwin; M. Lapierre remplace M. Irwin; of Mr. Hawkes replaced Mr. Beatty; M. Hawkes remplace M. Beatty; Mr. Irwin replaced Mr. Tobin; M. Irwin remplace M. Tobin; Ser Miss Jewett replaced Mr. Robinson (Burnaby); Mr¡e Jewett remplace M. Robinson (Burnaby); 20-r r-t980 Constitution du Canada 9:3 Mr. Gimaïel replaced Mr. Irwin. M. Gimaiel remplace M. lrwin, Pursuant to an order of the Senate adopted November 5, I 980: Conformément à un ordre du Sénat adopté le 5 novembre I 980: Senator Joan Neiman replaced Senator Gildas Molgat; Le sénateur Joan Neiman remplace le sénateur Gildas Molgat; Senator Florence Bird replaced Senator Wjlliam petten; Le sénateur Florence Bird remplace le sénateur William Petten; Senator William Petten replaced Senator Florence Bird; Le sénateur William Petten remplace le sénateur Florence Bird; Senator Florence Bird replaced Senator William petten; Le sénateur Florence Bird remplace le sénateur William Petten; Senator Yvette B. Rousseau replaced Senator John J. Le sénateur Yvette B. Rousseau remplace le sénateur John Connolly; J. Cortnolly; Senator Martha Bielish replaced Senator Duff Roblin; Le sénateur Martha Bielish remplace Ie sénateur Duff Roblin; Senator Robert Muir replaced Senator Martial Asselin; Le sénateur Robert Muir remplace le sénateur Martial Asselin; Senator Stanley Haidasz replaced Senator Carl Goldenberg. Le sénateur Stanley Haidasz remplace le sénateur Carl Goldenberg. P-ubljshed under aurhority of the Senate and the Speaker Publié en conformité de I'autorité du Sénat et de I'Orateur de la of the House of Commons by the Queen's Printer for Cãnada Chambre des communes par I'lmprimeur de Ia Reine pour le Canada Available from the Canadian Government Publishing - Centre, Supply and En vente: Centre d'édition du gouvernement du Canada Services Canada, Hull, Québec. Canada KIA 0S9 Approvisíonnements et Services Canada, Hull, Québec, Canada K I A 0S9 9:4 Constitution of Canada 20-l l-1980 2j MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS PROCÈS-VERBAL Br 20, I98O LE JEUDI 20 NOVEMBRE I98O THURSDAY, NOVEMBER Cr (17) (t7) E¡ Fr [Textl ITraductionl The Special Joint Committee on the Constitution of Canada Le Comité mixte spécial sur la Constitution du Canada se met this day at 9:43 o'clock a.m., the Joint Chairman, Senator réunit aujourd'hui à t h 43 sous la présidence du sénateur Hays, presiding. Hays (coprésident). Members of the Committee presenl: Membres du Comitê prêsents: Ar Bi Represenling the Senate: The Honourable Senators Asselin, Reprêsentanl le Sénat: Les honorables sénateurs Asselin, Cr Austin, Bird, Connolly, Goldenberg, Hays, Lapointe, Neiman, Austin, Bird, Connolly, Goldenberg, Hays, Lapointe, Neiman, Gt Roblin and Tremblay, Roblin et Tremblay. Other Senator present: The Honourable Senator Rousseau. Autre sênateur présent: L'honorable sénateur Rousseau' Representing lhe House of Commons.' Messrs. Beatty, Reprêsentanl la Chambre des communesr MM. Beatty' Bockstael, Miss Campbell (South Vl/'est Nova), Messrs. Bockstael, Mrt" Campbell (South lltest Nova), MM' Corbin, Bc Corbin, Crombie, Epp, Fraser, Henderson, Irwin, Miss Jewett, Crombie, Epp, Fraser, Henderson, Irwin, Mrr" Jewett, MM. C¿ Messrs. Joyal, Lapieme, Mackasey, McGrath, Nystrom, Rob- Joyal, Lapierre, Mackasey, McGrath, Nystrom, Robinson inson (Burnaby) and Tobin. (Burnaby) et Tobin. C( Other Members present: Messrs. Allmand, Demers and Autres dêputés présents: lvfM. Allmand, Demers et Mrrc Miss MacDonald (Kingston and the Islands). MacDonald (K¡ngston et les Îles). o( In attendance: From the Parliamentary Centre: Mr. Peter Egalement prêsents: Du Centre parlementaire.' M, Peter AI Dobell, Director. From the Research Branch of the Library of Dobell, directeur. Du Service de recherches de la Bibliolhèque (r; Parliament: Mr. John McDonough, Researcher, du Parlement' M. John McDonough, recherchiste' Witnesses: From the Federation of Canadian Municipali- Témoins: De Ia Fédération canadienne des municipalités: m( ties: Mr. Dennis Flynn, President and Mr. Glennis Perry. M. Dennis Flynn, président et M. Glennis Perry. H¿ The Committee resumed consideration of its Order of Ref- Le Comité reprend l'étude de son ordre de renvoi du Sénat erence from the Senate dated November 3, 1980 and its Order du 3 novembre 1980 et de son ordre de renvoi de la Chambre of Reference from the House of Commons dated October 23, des communes du 23 octobre 1980, tous deux portant sur le G( 1980, both relating to the document entitled "Proposed Reso- document intitulé rProjet de résolution portant adresse com' Rc lution for a Joint Address to Her Majesty the Queen respect- mune à Sa Majesté la Reine concernant la Constitution du ing the Constitution of Canada" published by the Government Canada' publié par le gouvernement le 2 octobre 1980. (Voír October 2, 1980. (See Minutes of Proceedings, Thursday, procès-verbal du jeudi 6 novembre 1980, Fascicule n' l.) on Ca November 6, 1980, Issue No. I.) Ht Mr, Flynn made a statement and answered questions. M. Flynn fait une déclaration et répond aux questions. M; Mr. Joyal assumed the Chair. M. Joyal assume la présidence. M' Mr. Epp moved,-That the Committee report immediately M. Epp propose,-Que Ie Comité fasse rapport immédiate- to the House of Commons and the Senate requesting that the ment à la Chambre des communes et au Sénat lui demandant Sa deadline for the report of the Special Joint Committee on the que la date limite pour remettre le rapport du Comité mixte Constitution be extended from December 9, 1980, to February spécial sur la Constitution soit reportée du 9 décembre 1980 Dc 6, 1981, and that, upon a favourable decision by both Houses, au 6 février l98l et que, sur décision favorable des deux Pa the Committee shall advertise that the deadline for receiving Chambres, le Comité fasse savoir que la date limite pour written briefs or requests to appear before the Committee is recevoir des mémoires écrits et des demandes de comparution ,S/, extended to December 31, 1980. devant le Comité est reportée au 3l décembre 1980. Po On motion of Mr. Nystrom, it was agreed,-That the Sur motion de M. Nystrom, il est convenu,-Que la motion tiv motion be amended by deleting the words "February 6, 1981" soit modifiée en remplaçant les mots rle 6 février l98lr par ce an{ lio and substituting the following therefor: "February 10, 1981". qui suit: .le l0 février l98lr. *: After debate, the question being put on the motion, as Après débat, la motion modifiée, mise aux voix, est rejetée amended, it was negatived on the following division: sur division: er€ of YEAS: POUR: l9i The Honourable Senators Les honorables sénateurs lut ine Asselin Tremblay Asselin Tremblay on Roblin Roblin Nc t80 20-l r-1980 Constitution du Canada 9:5 Messrs. MM. Beatty McGrath Beatty McGrath Crombie Nystrom Crombie Nystrom Epp Robinson (Burnaby)-(l 0) Epp Robinson (Bu rnaby)-(|}) Fraser Fraser se NAYS: CONTRE: euf The Honourable Senators Les honorables sénateurs Austin Hays Austin Hays lin, Bird Lapointe Bird Lapointe an, Connolly Neiman Connolly Neiman Goldenberg Goldenberg Messrs.
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