Dáil Éireann

Vol. 732 Wednesday, No. 4 18 May 2011 DÍOSPÓIREACHTAÍ PARLAIMINTE PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES DÁIL ÉIREANN TUAIRISC OIFIGIÚIL—Neamhcheartaithe (OFFICIAL REPORT—Unrevised) Dé Céadaoin, 18 Bealtaine 2011. Leaders’ Questions ……………………………… 637 Order of Business ……………………………… 644 Ceisteanna—Questions Taoiseach ………………………………… 647 Minister for Justice and Equality Priority Questions …………………………… 660 Other Questions …………………………… 667 Adjournment Debate Matters …………………………… 679 Criminal Justice Bill 2011: Order for Second Stage …………………………… 680 Second Stage ……………………………… 680 Private Members’ Business Dublin and Monaghan Bombings: Motion (resumed)…………………712 Adjournment Debate Local Authority Boundaries ………………………… 730 Departmental Programmes ………………………… 732 RoadNetwork………………………………734 Questions: Written Answers …………………………… 735 DÁIL ÉIREANN ———— Dé Céadaoin, 18 Bealtaine 2011. Wednesday, 18 May 2011. ———— Chuaigh an Ceann Comhairle i gceannas ar 1.30 p.m. ———— Paidir. Prayer. ———— Leaders’ Questions Deputy Micheál Martin: Yesterday the Dáil unanimously passed a resolution asserting our belief that the European Commission’s proposals on the common consolidated corporate tax base infringes the core principle of subsidiarity. It did this on the basis of an all-party committee report, which is a credit to the various Deputies who participated on it. One of the serious points that arose during the debate was the manner in which the position of the Minister for Finance changed because of the committee’s work. His opening position was that the CCCTB did not infringe subsidiarity and he changed this only in the light of the work and the unanimous findings of the committee members. However, many people are confused as to what the Government’s position is on CCCTB. It has gone from the clear outright opposition of last year to something described by Ministers and the Taoiseach as sceptical negotiation to constructive engagement. We would all agree that this is essentially having no impact on the negotiating position and has given the impression to others, including France and Germany, that we are open to trading on a fundamental issue such as the harmonised consolidated tax base. Because it threatens to destroy more than €4 billion in national income, the corporate tax base is as much a threat as a higher rate. We know the Government’s policy on one but we do not know its policy on the other. Every other government is clearly tabling its position on the tax base across Europe. The Dáil has taken a clear position on the tax base. Will the Taoiseach now go beyond the general ambivalent stance and the ambivalent generalities in which he has engaged up to now on the issue and tell us exactly the Government’s position, what it is prepared to put on the table and what it offers to accept? The Taoiseach: I will. The position as far as the Government is concerned about CCCTB is very clear; there is no ambiguity here. The CCCTB is a method of tax harmonisation by the back door. It is bad for Ireland and bad for Europe. I will not sit at the table of leadership at European Council meetings and not say anything when a paper tabled by the Commission on CCCTB is being discussed. It is its right, legal duty and responsibility to publish papers or legislation, but I will not sit at the table and say nothing about this. What I will say is what I have just said to the Deputy. I do not believe in CCCTB and I do not support it. I have a very healthy scepticism about it. I hope I make myself clear in that regard. Deputy Micheál Martin: Does that mean in essence that the Government will veto any attempt to introduce CCCTB across Europe? The Government has ranged from scepticism to engagement to constructive engagement and so on. 637 Leaders’ 18 May 2011. Questions An Ceann Comhairle: Can we have a supplementary question please? Deputy Brendan Howlin: Was it not clear enough for the Deputy? Deputy Micheál Martin: We all know the financial support programme is important to the country. It is agreed across Europe that these financial frameworks and support programmes should be sustainable. The communiqué on 11 March was very clear on the matter, but nothing has happened on the Irish programme. Nothing has moved towards a conclusion on the Irish programme. The evidence coming back every day is that either Germany or France in particular have been encouraged to keep pushing Ireland for unreasonable concessions on the issue of not just the tax rate but the base because of what appears to be a changed negotiating stance on the part of the Government. The bottom line from Europe seems to be that either it wants Ireland to recover in a way which helps everyone or it does not. An Ceann Comhairle: Can we have a question please? Deputy Micheál Martin: We must put that very strongly to Europe. We have now had five or six weeks—— An Ceann Comhairle: The Deputy is over his time. Deputy Micheál Martin: ——of briefings on this. When will the issue relating to the change in the Irish programme, particularly the reduction in the interest rate, reach finality? The Taoiseach: The Deputy and I campaigned on the Lisbon treaty. We gave the people specific assurances about tax competency being a national issue. The Government does not support the introduction of CCCTB on the basis that the Government believes it is tax harmonisation by the back door. The Government believes that CCCTB is bad for Ireland and bad for Europe. I will articulate that very clearly when it comes before the Heads of Government meeting at Council level. The governments of other countries share this view very strongly. The Deputy is aware that under the euro-plus pact it is possible for other countries to move to an enhanced co-operation position. I will not say here in the Dáil that I do not support CCCTB and then go and articulate a different position at the Heads of Government meeting. Deputy Timmy Dooley: Will the Taoiseach veto it? The Taoiseach: In so far as the conclusion to the question of a reduction of interest rate is concerned, there has been quite a deal of speculation about every meeting that this will bring it to a conclusion — I have never said that. The point is that the authority was given to the ministers for finance to continue negotiations on this. I would like to see it brought to a conclusion and I would like to see an interest rate reduction applied to Ireland, but I cannot give the Deputy a date as to when that will finally be concluded. As the Deputy is aware, the Heads of Government agreed in principle that countries within the EFSF bailout system should have and could have an interest rate reduction applied to them. Ireland is in that position and authority has been devolved to the Ministers for Finance to continue negotiations in that regard. I recognise the Deputy has been supportive of this process. However, I am not in a position to give the House a definitive date as to when the matter will be finally concluded. The conditions for the bailout scheme were put together by the Troika, namely, the IMF, the European Union and the European Central Bank, and also by the Government. Elements of it have been changed in respect of the minimum rate and also by the Government by way of the jobs initiative. Other countries may wish to impose conditions on Ireland that are not being imposed on any other country, which is not helpful. 638 Leaders’ 18 May 2011. Questions Deputy Gerry Adams: It is interesting that while Greece and Portugal are having issues associated with their economic distress dealt with at European level, the Government has not even managed to get Irish issues on the agenda. Tá ceist agam faoi ard-bhaincéirí. An bhliain seo caite, dúirt urlabhraí Fhine Gael, an Teachta Richard Bruton, nárchóir dos na hard-bhaincéirí an méid airgid a mhol Rialtas Fhi- anna Fáil mar uas-theorainn, a fháil. Dúirt Páirtí an Lucht Oibre an rud céanna. I understand that in recent days AIB has made a request to the Department of Finance, contending that the cap on chief executives’ salaries, at €500,000, should be breached and salaries increased as the bank is experiencing difficulties in recruiting to fill the top jobs. As I said as Gaeilge, Fine Gael poured cold water on Fianna Fáil when it introduced the cap initially, as did the Labour Party. It is inconceivable that the Taoiseach would countenance such an increase at a time of consider- able distress and when people are scandalised by the pensions paid to some bankers. Will he rule out firmly any increase in the salaries of chief executives? The Taoiseach: Tá a fhios ag an Teachta go bhfuil caighdeán leagtha síos ag an Rialtas faoi seo, is é sin gur cheart nach n-íoctar níos mó ná€500,000 do bhaincéir, cibé cé chomh sinsearach is atá sé nó sí. There is no formal request before the Government from AIB for any particular level of remuneration. I have rarely seen people so frustrated as they are at the carry-on of some bankers during the years. Deputies: Hear, hear. The Taoiseach: It is fair to say those who work in banks at the lower level have taken the brunt of the stick for those who exemplified greed and rank bad behaviour in their reckless lending practices, which practices brought the banks and, as a consequence, the country to their current position. The Government would need to see an exceptionally compelling case made by any bank to breach the ceiling. The Minister for Finance has requested an overall survey of the remuneration packages of bankers.

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