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Tuesday, April 18, 1978 Chaitra 28, 1900 (Saka) DEBATES

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LOE SABHA SECRETARIAT

N E W D E L H I CONTENTS

N o. 39, Tuesday, A pril 18, 1978fChcdtra 28, 1900 {SAKA)

Oral Answers to Question.’ . C o l u m n s •Starred Questions Nos. 760 to 765,768 and 769* 1—32

'Written Answersto Questions: Starred Questions Nos. 766, 767, 770 to 774 and 776 to 779- 32— 44

Unstarred Questions Nos. 7131 to 7266 and 7268 to 7319 * 44— 240

Papers laid on the Table . 240—41 Re. Calling Attention 241— 42

Public Accounts Committee— Seventy-third Report presented 242

Committee on Public Undertakings — Fourth Report and Minutes presented 242— 43

Committee on Private Members’ Bills and Resolutions— Sventecnth Report presented 243

Committee on Petitions— Third Report presented...... 243

Matters under Rule 377— (i) Reported Withdrawal o f Consent by Chief Minister o f Karnataka to the exercise o f powers by C.B.I. in the State Shri Kanwar Lai G u p t a ...... 243—45 **(ii) Reported Delay in Supply of Enriched Uranium by U.S.A. for Atomic Power Plant at Tarapur Shri Hari Vishnu K a m a t h ...... 245— 46 (iii) Reported Drought Conditions ir. Manipur Shri N. Tombi Singh 246 (iv) Reported Threat to resort to strike by officers of nationalised banks Shri Vinodbhai B. S h e t h ...... 247 (v) Reported Fire in Indian Embassy at Manila Shri S. S. L a i ...... 247— 48

•The sign -f marked above the name of a Member indicates that the question was actually asked on the floor of the House by that Member. (ii) Demands for Grants, 1978^79— Columns Ministry of External Affairs , 251— 68, 288—416 Shri Somnath C h a t t e r je e...... 251— 56, 406—407 Shri Hari Vishnu K a m a t h ...... 256— 64, 403— 404 ^ Shri Ram Prakash T r ip a th i...... 264—68 Shri K. Mayathevar ...... 288— 94 Dr. Subramaniam S w a m y ...... 295—304,' 410 Shri C.K. Chandrappan ...... 304— 10, 405— 406 Shri C.M. Stephen ...... 310—21 Shri Krishan Kant ...... 321— 29 Shri K.P. Unnikrishnan ... 331— 40, 397—98 Shri U.S. Patil ...... 340— 43 Shri Ratansinh Rajda ...... 343— 48 Shri Nirmal Chandra J a i n ...... 348— 53, 412— 13 Shri Ram Jethm alani...... 353—61, 409— 10 Shri Balwant Singh R a m oow a lia...... 361—64 Chowdhry Balbir Singh ...... 364— 67 Shri Shriknshna Singh .... 367— 72 Prof. P.G. Mavalankar ...... 372— 75, 401— 4 J2 Shri Chitta Basu...... 376— 77 Shri . . 377—97, 4 i4 ~ i5 Calling Attention to Matter o f Urgent Public Importance— Cyclone in Orissa— Shri Somnath C h a t t e r je e ...... 269, 271— 74 Shri Surjit Singh B a ra n a la...... 269— 71, 274— 75, 278— 80, 284— 85, 287— 89 Shri Jyotirmoy Bosu . . . 275— 78 Shri Laxmi Narayan N a y a k ...... 281— 84 Shri Govinda M u n d a ...... 285— 87 Business Adivosry Committee*--

Fifteenth Report presented 4 17— 18 LOK SABHA DEBATES

i 2 LOK SABHA number of Commissions but it is un­ decided about the composition of the Law Commission It is rather an unfortunate factor that it is a prison­ Tuesday, April 18, 1978/Cha»tra 28, er of indecision here in this matter 1900 ( Saka) May I know, therefore, from the government when the Chairman and the Secretary were appointed and The Lok Sabha met at Eleven of the what are the formidable reasons for Clock the delay in the appointment of the IMr Speaker tn the Chair] other Members of the Commission? SHRi SHANTl BHUSHAN So far ORAL ANSWERS TO QUESTIONS as the Char man and the Member- Secretary were concerned, they were Appointment of Chairman and Mem. appointed a few months ago I* ' berg of Law Commission intended that the Law Commission + should consist of four members in­ *760 SHRI G M BANATWALLA cluding the Chairman The Chair­ man and the Member-Secretary have SHRI MUKHTIAR SINGH already been appointed The appoint­ MALIK ment of another Member ha& already Will the Minister of LAW JUSTICE been processed and approved by the AND COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleas­ Appointments Committee so that it ed to state will be announced within a few days So far as the fourth Member u» (a) whether Government have since concerned what I wish t0 say is that appointed the new Chairman and it is extremely important that a per­ other numbers of the reconstituted son who would really fill the role with Law Commission, and distinction has to be appointed There­ (b) if so the details ttereof? fore consultation with the Chair­ man of the Law Commission is going THE MINISTER OF LAW JUS­ on The Chairman of the Law Com­ TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS mission is trying to find out who (SHRI SHANTl BHUSHAN) (a) would be the most suitable person and (b) Shri Hans Raj Khanna, a for the fourth membership of the former Judge of the Supreme Court Commission As soon as that is com­ has been appointed as Chairman and pleted the appointment would be Shn P M Bakshi a member of the announced Central Legal Service has been ap­ pointed as Member-Secretary of the SHRI G M BANATWALLA It is very obvious that there is no satis­ reconstituted Law Commission factory reply to this particular point The question of appoiting the other Since a few months the consultations two Members of the Commission is are going on and this government is under consideration not in a position to appoint even four members of the Law Commission SHRI G M BANATWALLA This This is a very unsatisfactory state of government has appointed a record affairs We can understand that very 512 3 Oral Answers APRIL 18. 1978 Oral Answers 4 outstanding persons are to he appoint­ by my learned colleague. But this ed. That does not, however, mean long reply by the hon. Minister to tfcat the constitution of the commis­ the question does not satisfy the sion should go on in an unsatisfactory House. However, I would like to and piecemeal manner. May I know know from the hon. Minister whe­ in what time would this entire Com­ ther for constituting'such an impor­ mission be reconstituted? May I tant body, the Bar Council of India know what was the occasion for the has been consulted in the matter or re-constitution of the Law Commis- not. *on?

SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: The SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: No, occasion for the re-constitution of Sir. the Law Commission was that a Law Commission is appointed for a term SHRI K. MAYATHEVAR: Law of three years. When the term of Commission may be dealing with the the three years of the previous Law law questions including the amend­ Commission expired, then the Law ment to the Indian Constitution. Commission was re-constituted. We, Therefore, what is the special quali­ at that time, decided that the Law fication for the appointment as a Commission should not be too large Member or the Chairman of thi3 Com­ a body. We, therefore, reduced the mission? Is it the High Court Judge membership to four including the or the working judge or the Supreme Chairman and the Member Secretary. Court judge or retired judge of the As I informed the hon. member just High Court or the Supreme Court. now one more Member’s name has been finalised. It has been processed. Because the person was over 60 years SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: The of age, therefore, some formalities Chairman and the Members could either be serving judges or retired had to be complied with. The ap­ pointment has been approved by the judges of the Supreme Court or the High Court or he could be a l«'gal Appointment Committee. Therefore, expert, a jurist, a professor of Law very soon, it will be announced. in a University of India. This is the So far as fourth Member is con­ field from which a person can be taken. cerned, the Chairman of the Law Commission had, after some enquiries, suggested a distinguished name. Shortly, thereafter, he informed the Case regarding Swadeshi Cotton Mills Government that that distinguished Ltd. person for some reasons, individual and personal reasons, was not willing *761. SHRI MOHAN LAL PTPIL: to come for the Law Commission. Will the Minister of LAW, JUSTICE Therefore, the Chairman is looking AND COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleas­ out for another person because the ed to refer to reply to Unstarred Chairman is anxious that a really Question No. 2853 on 14th March 1978 distinguished person who can really regarding High Court orders perform an important function in the on Appointment of New Directors of Law Commission should be selected. Swadeshi Cotton Mills and state: Therefore, he is in the process, he has not yet been able to select that (a) the outcome of the Petition for fourth person, after he selects, and Special Leave to Appeal under Article suggest to us, then we will process the matter. 136 of Constitution along with Applica­ tion for stay of operation of the order SHRI MUKHTTAR SINGH MALIK: of High Court filed in the Swadeshi I fully support the observations made Cotton Mills Co. Limited case; and 5 Oral Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Oral Answers 6

(b) what interim measure* Govern* arra^TT MTf?rr j fa? * «par % ment propose to take to ensure stop­ page of further deterioration of the ftrcr 3TT^if I 6 f?r^ R , 19 77 working of the company under the «r$r qr arfarjft f f i continued rms-management of the present Managing Director? rHT ^ f W 'TST £ I

THE MINISTER OF LAW, JUS­ ^T^cTT 5? f f SR Wft 5PF ^ TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS ft srrspfr 1 (SHRI SHANTl BHUSHAN) (a) Petition for Special Leave of Appeal came up for hearing before the flrfwpr 1JJ«T : irm nr w&z Hon’ble Supreme Court on Monday, the 10th April, 1978 After hearing % ^ fr spr# Tar the parties for sometime the Court cr? ha w? frnn arrnT 1 ft adjourned the matter to 24th April, 1978 Mr it s n m f 1

(b) The matter is sub-iudice and cp^ ?R^TT 5»T arrt *T f’TnFr 5T ^ tio further action can be taken under fTSTfTTftfaRT TQ ^cTT ^frTT ^ fw # the Companies Act 1956 However, as per the Notification No SO 265/(E )/ T3r ?fT % f'Ttr ^rrq-n- 1 jttwht 18AA/IDRA/78 dated tne 13th April, 1978 the Ministry of Industry Depart­ n q?r tfY | fw «rm y ment of Industrial Development have eft ftFr ?rr ?t»fr 1 in exercise of powers conferred by clause (a) of sub-section (1) of Sec­ $ Jr yrrfrgre tion 18AA of the Industries (Deve­ lopment and Regulation) Act 1951 WT tr«rpT^5^ f¥*TT (65 of 1951) authorised the National *r*rr t 1 srsr tt sttot wr Textile Corporation Limited to take over the management of whole of the fam & 1 z ^ arr^ *r said Industrial undertakings namely (l) M/s Swadeshi Cotton Mills Kan­

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Ltd. Swadeshi Polytex is run by SHRI SHANTl BHUSHAN: In view Jaipuria Brothers. I say the money of this ruling, I cannot answer that. from Swadeshi Cotton Mills Ltd. has But, if you give me the option, I can been diverted by Shri Sitaram Jai­ answer. puria. MR- SPEAKER: You may answer MR. SPEAKER: Please come to that. the question. SHRI SHANTl BHUSHAN: So far SHRI K. LAKKAPPA: Sir, this is as the taking over of the manage­ a very important question. There ment under the Industries Develop­ has been allegation against Shri Sita­ ment and Regulation Act is concern­ ram Jaipuria. ed, it is just like the taking over of the Swadeshi Cotton Mills and that is MR. SPEAKER: We had a discus­ within the purview of the Industries Ministry. That does not concern the sion on this even earlier. Law Ministry. SHRI K. LAKKAPPA: I want to know from him what prevented the So far as the appointment of Gov­ Government from taking over the ernment directors under Sec. 408 of Swadeshi Polytex Ltd. run by Shri the Indian Companies Act is con­ Sitaram Jaipuria. What are the rea­ cerned, for instance, in Swadeshi sons for that? Cotton Mills Ltd., Government direc­ tors had been appointed under Sec. 408. But, the operation of that order I would like to put a straight ques- was stayed by the . tion. The Law Ministry specially, I hud had an occasion to inform this the Law Minister, was engaged by House earlier that so far a5 Swadeshi Shri Sitaram Jaipuria in two cases Polytex Ltd. is concerned, there were namely under company petition No. certain allegations which were being 20 of 1977—-Swadeshi Polytex Ltd. as enquired into. Inspection of the also under company Petition No. 21 accounts had been ordered. As a of 1977.** result of the inspection of the ac­ (Interruptions) counts, that question would be exa­ mined as to whether there is a case MR. SPEAKER: I am not allowing for appointment of Government dir­ that unless you give prima facie ectors under Sec. 408. proof.

SHRI K. LAKKAPPA: I would ^ 8^ TO : srnpTT ^ now put a categorical question. (In­ tPTZ7T f*r??r % ajfaro tpr terruptions). In view of that, will the Minister kindly consider the tak­ fazrr l t o spr wnvn ing over of the Swadeshi Polytex * 5 1 fajartw jh s w t t s m m rm x Ltd. run by Shri Sitaram Jaipuria as

••Not recorded. 9 Oral Answer* CHAITRA 26, 1900 (SAKA) Oral Answers xo

W f a r m m $ o t «pt t m tfo : stated up till now has been a sort of eye-wash What will be the posi­ wr fo r jpfrrr %■ f*i% ? tion vis-a-vis the Company Law Board ^ «wwt *r$tor

SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN So far ^rar €to ?fro ^ Tt as the first part of the question is concerned in regard to proceedings wtc< f%m f ?ft ottt relating to the investigation under ^ T*far ^ t t f r *rt ?r^ct tt Section 408 of the Companies Act against Swadeshi Cotton Mills Limited, %frrrq- wraw as I have stated earlier, as a result «TT «rVr fa * % T O ^ 3T3T ipftT of the investigation, the Government *rnrrr ^ T fw «rr 3 w r «f w u b had decided, in fact appointed Gov­ ernment Directors under Section 408 fw w wVr ot TT ^3TT ^ TT 3RTT«PFT But m respect of (Interrup­ i ar^r 'TT «tVt m»rt ^ Ttf w it tions) Now, even before the Gov­ 4*iHtTT fsrar £ ernment made that order, a writ pe­ tition had been filed m the Delhi High Court The Delhi High Court «ft yiw i w w fan|t^ had made an order saying that the »r^rrf f¥srr 11 proceedings may go on and the Gov­ ernment could proceed with the con­ sideration of the matters under Sec­ «ft tfftr ijr»i 3ft f& tion 408 and may also make an order ?ft sffTfqr fc*rf?r m wvrft Tt ^nfr if necessary But the order shall not be given effect to till the High Court n^TTt fn- Ttf * TTf ifaft permitted the same to be done There­ «i*Tnfy ^rnrift f f fT*r ?rrf ?r o t t t fore an order under Section 408 was »M*n f%rqr srr stt?tt f i “ “f , app“ nt“ 8 the Government Directors but which had not been Riven effect to Thereafter the wnt SHRI SAUGATA ROY Sir, m May 1977, the Company Law Board had CourtCourt°n ItZ‘S was admitted1 “ the Dellu and a » Btay2h to undertake inspection under Sec­ o f Z T L T * '*°ymg the °Peration tion 209(a) of the Companies Act Department of Company ttrec- and a notice was issued to this com­ tors under Section 408 sinC(v the pany under Section 408 of the Com­ matter is still sub judice, because the panies Act I do not know why Dir­ C * ■ f n Pending ^Thetrc- ectors could not be appointed in the this maH be Possible to go into company to prevent the affairs of this matter namely as to what the company from being conducted ceodings had been done because the m a manner detrimental to public S 5 ' - * n Pending < Z r £ interest My question is m regard to the backlog of the wages Let the U P Government appoint a receiver whpfl ®P®AKER He wanta t kno who in the exercise of his rights attach shares worth Rs 10 crore of css.’ss’i s — — the Swadeshi Polytex invested m the Swadeshi Cotton Mills I would like to know from the hon Minister whe­ ther he would place a report of the i s r s y r i f investigation carried out by the Com­ ?hf matter “ Pending in pany Law Board on the Table of the o LSW 1 co»^er « House because whatever has been to whether it would be oroper to lay any such document 7 XI Oral Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Oral Answers , J.2

SHRI SAUGATA ROY: What about THE PRIME MINISTER (SHRI my second part of the question re- MORARJ1 DESAI): May I ask my garding Swadeshi Polytex...? hon. friends, why can they not speak more politely? Why do they always want to have a quarrel, I cannot un­ SHRI SHANTl BHUSHAN: So f « derstand it. ( Interruptions) It is not as the other part of the question is the way to do it. (Interruptions) concerned, perhaps the hon. Member has got a little mixed up because it * MR. SPEAKER: What is most dis­ not that Swadeshi Polytex has got turbing is, when one man gets up shares in Swadeshi Cotton Mills Ltd. and speaks, I can understand it, but On the other hand, Swadeshi Cotton does he require the support of another Mills Limited has got certain shares in half a dozen people to shout together? Swadushi Polytex. So far as those I think the voice of Mr. Saugata Roy shares are concerned, as I had said is loud enough to be heard by every­ on an earlier occasion, the receiver body. Is Mr. Lakkappa's assistance appointed bv the State Government necessary? Mr. Saugata Roy is on for the pu»po&e of collection of elec­ his legs—I can understand that. If tricity dues which was due to the there is any error that can be cor­ U.P. State Electricity Board had rected. But I cannot understand half been appointed and then these shares a dozen people getting up and saying were attached The delivery of these “No, No”. What th<> Minister said shares, according to my information, was that there was a mixing of thought has not been procured by the recei­ and it is a polite expression. ver but the icceiver had advertised (Interruptions) and invited offers for the purchase of SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: May 1 these. There have been certain oilers clarify? Perhaps, the hon. Member and one of them had been accepted, would appreciate that the Swadeshi namely, a large industrial house. Cotton Mills Limited, which is ope I had occasion to inform the House company, owned shares in the other that no application for approval of company viz, Swadeshi Polytex the Law Ministry, namely, Company Limited. Now the sentence to which Affairs department under section 372 my attention has been drawn by the of the Companies Act or under the hon. Member, the relevant portion MRTP Act had been received so reads like this “Let UP Government far. . (Interruptions) appoint a receiver who in exercise of his rights attach shares worth Rs. 1 SHRI SAUGATA ROY: I am read­ crore of the Swadeshi Polytex”—of ing from the statement of the Indus­ course, it can refer to the shares of tries Minister and what I said was Swadeshi Polytex Limited—"invest- correct. The hon. Law Minister says ed in the Swadeshi Cotton Mills." that what I said was the wrong thing. Perhaps, the happier expression should have been “invested by the Swadeshi (Interruptions) •• Cotton Mills”. ‘In’ or ‘by’, in a com- plex sentence many people use a particular word. Invested in the MR. SPEAKER: Don't record. All that the hon. Minister said was that ? w2 S 1,0ottan MUk-that is money there was a little confusion because invested in the Swadeshi Cotton mid. i i? 6 “t080 that Swadeshl Cotton the shares were not taken by Poly­ *01* thow shares to Mother ™ tex---- (Interruptions) For every small mater should people get up . S i ! ! ? 1” “ * Mnae ^ "■ like this? garded as investment in the Swadeshi Cotton Mills. This is also one of the ••Not recorded. Oral Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Oral Answers 24

investments. But this is merely a ft * x matter of language Language is a vehicle of thought Many people vflTTcT | 1 ft *1$ $ERT ’STTqcTr £— fsnff speak in different ways But both ar? % w w fosnt: ft* * mean the same * 5 ?rercn m zv t v t §f*nn Relaxation of Restrictions on Seasw JfTR q % f5T^ «TT5 ’Sn*TT Ticket Holders on Paschim Express t t 7 ■USmk *762 SHRI SOMJIBHAI DAMOR sfto TO Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be *J^T SPFT »wr I, SPFT pleased to state f^RtcTr I far ftJTT!T5ft?r«Pt (a) whether the additional restric­ tion was relaxed for season ticket hol- ^•T^T^T ^T??TT f ---- 5IT5T »PTT TT ^ uers for travel by Air Conditioned ex­ ZZ 3TT% T oTTS 3T3T ^ *PT fT^STT *PT press (Deluxe) Paschim Express dur­ TT*T fHTCT fTPft ^ t flfanT- ing August 1J75 till further notice, and wt gfasu w fa* % 53TT3KT 3ft «ft I 3 ^ 1* 5TTJT * 5* ft (b) if so the reasons for not relax, ini t prrs< nt between Vadodara and art ft I , *r & 1 ^ 1% Dobad7 1975 wr f3r?rfr«r f $ r r »n?rfr®|i srw j *r f ^ s r r 1HF MINISTER OF RAILWAYS 976 (PROF MADHU DANDAVATE) 1976 % sffa tftsnr fere vt (i) and (b) A statement is laid on q? 5f*wnft*nf 1 ^ s r w r ^ T the Table of the House q f ^ i$wsrcr— 5T*nfe*rr Statement ^ ft «ft 1 $*r(t *rrfon ?% w ? f t (al Season ticket holders are not *rf «ft, wzrwr rt **rw ?r permitted to travel by 25 Dn/26 UP vrttz rr fcm *m m 1 fa? AC Express (Deluxe)/Paschim Ex­ fzwz *rt ?;jt »rrfwt press trains Due to extensive brea­ ches tram services were drastically ft m n ¥ t ?ft *Tf aft 1 £f«nr curtailed during August/September, ^ftftt f s r 3 ix t v ^ ^ ^ T W ir^?Tf?nT- 1976 Season ticket holders were temporarily permitted to travel by * t gfaSTT rjr t t f t v i v f t t JTPft these trains between Godhra and Va­ faqfrr TT WT f?qr P T I dodara upto 30-9-1976 This was done J ?r *T f k w t JTTnft gfatfT ^ t X% only as a temporary measure to alle­ viate the difficulties of daily passen­ gers till normalcy was restored. «ft ^ T m tr ft% ^ (b) These trains cater for long dis­ tance passengers and the occupation «TT «n«T ?ftlR f z w z «mft T t being heavy, season ticket holders ZX *T jf^t | I snr cannot be permitted between Dohad wim ft q-^srr fer ^ «ft »nf3nft and Vadodara ?t f VT ?Tfi?TT ^ ?ft HT’T ?fWt T t sfhnft nr# n*ftr : irRrfhr «ft *r*rra;1 STSarSfT 3ft, ^*ft 3 WZrHYK ^TRTT lS^T 20Wn^T73r^fa^3TTcfr «it, to tsrt * wtM tt srfarsr ^ 1 » p r sjrr«r ir?r^ ** ?ft sft fo n w $ 1 *rnft 7 ^ qRcsrvr 1 $ w T^t t , f t «nsr *jjsnw «n*nft 1 w r ^?ft gfror t»r 7 Oral Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Oral Answers 16

sft© *wj w wfc : «rnr % (2) retirement age; and (3) grant of other benefits to f«Pr> i *rfe *rnr to *rrfeft vt in Library. See No. LT-2127/78]. ?TT^9R tft f w *T eft OTWT SHRI MANORANJAN BHAKTA: ^rrgw $m fa t o # vnqfoH 139 The Law Commission suggested that ?flF5ft?> sideration. ?fr»ft sflrc 5*r »t «ft *r^ wr^r srmr T$f I fo STM faf&T ^ *t «rT ^ long as the matter is still under con­ ?pt *3t r

Recommendations of Law Commission SHRI MANORANJAN BHAKTA: t The High Court Judges (Conditions of Service) Act, 1954 and the Supreme *763. SHRI MANORANJAN BHAK- Court Judges (Conditions of Service) TA: Act, 1958 were amended in 1976. Con­ SHRI PRADYUMNA BAL: sidering the suggestions made by the Law Commission, sometimes it appears Will the Minister of LAW, JUSTICE much more benefits have been provided AND COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleased by the amendments of 1976. That to state the action taken by Govern­ was the time of and ment on the recommendations contain­ there was very often criticism in this ed in the 58th Report of the Law Com­ House and outside regarding commit­ mission on structure and jurisdiction ted judges, etc. In view of the chang­ of the higher judiciary in respect of ed political situation, I want to know the following matters; whetther the government is thinking of re-examining the whole amend­ (1) appeals in criminal cases; ment made during that period? * 7 Oral Answers CHAITRA 28, 1000 (SAKA) Oral Answers 18

SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: What- About the other part of the question ever improvements were made In the relating to facilities * for providing conditions of service of the judges of better criminal justice, it is true that the High Courts and Supreme Court I had wntten a letter some time back by the amending Act of 1976, there is to the Chief Ministers of all the States no proposal under the consideration of in the country drawing their attention the government to withdraw any of to the fact that even criminal justice them. was too much delayed and pointed out the various serious consequences SHRI SOMNATH CHATTERJEE* which arose on account of delays not May 1 know whether the government only in the administration of criminal is considering raising the retirement justice, but also m the administration age of Supreme Court Judges and con­ of justice by itself and I had suggested sequently the retirement age of High that perhaps they might consider the Court Judges because they want to question of constituting more courts keep a distinction between the Sup­ and taking other step® also, whatever reme Court Judges and High Court might be feasible, to rectify the situa­ Judges9 May I know whether the tion In that connection, many of the the State Governments m regard to State Governments have already in­ providing proper facilities with regard creased the number of courts and to dispensation of criminal justice? So various other things are being done far as I know, a representation has and the Chief Minister of West Bengal also wrote to me saying “Yes, we are been made by the West Bengal Gov­ trying to increase the number of ernment for financial assistance May I know whether the Government is courts, providing more court rooms, buildings and so on but then there considering it? are financial implications". He wrote that special assistance to the West SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN So far Bengal Government might be provid­ as the age of retirement is concerned, ed by from the Central financial assis­ the suggestion made in the report of tance in that connection Now, it is the Law Commission was that the age obvious that this is not a problem of retirement of High Court Judges special to the West Bengal Govern­ should be raised from 62 to 65 At ment, this is a problem which occurs that stage it was decided by the gov­ in almost all the States of the country ernment not to accept that recom­ so that the question of providing any mendation of the Law Commission special assistance only to the West because the government felt that there Bengal Government and not to other should be a difference in the retire­ Governments obviously does not arise ment ages of High Court Judges and But so far as general assistance to Supreme Court Judges, one of the State Governments etc, is concerned, reasons being obvious, i.e., some at­ that is a general question and obvious­ traction for going to the Supreme ly everything, allocation of funds etc., Court is provided even by the differ­ is taken into consideration ence in the two ages.

Now, so far the Government has not applied its mind to the question New Direct Train from Ahmedabad to of making a general raise in the age Madras of retirement of the Supreme Court Judges also except the fact that the *764 PROF P. G. MAVALANKAR: former had sent Will the Minister of RAILWAYS bu a suggestion some time back that the pleased to state. age of retirement of the Supreme Court Judges should also increase, but no (a) whether Government have consideration has been given to that started a new direct train between proposal. Ahmedabad and Madras; 1 9 ...... Oral Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Oral Answers

(b) if so, when and with what ed in such a way so as to enable him- periodicity; dreds of thousands of people at (c) is it an all second-class train; Andhra Pradesh who live in Ahmeda- amd bad, Baroda and other placeg in Guja­ rat to catch this train and get down (d) if so, what are the special and at a particular station to go on their additional passenger amenities provid­ onward journey to Hyderabad and ed on the said train? other places.

THE MINISTER OF RAILWAYS PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: He (PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE): (a) has congratulated me, but during the to (c). Yes Sir, 145/146 Madras Beach- Question Hour he must only say Ahmedabad weekly Navajivan Express “Whether I can congratulate.” Anywar* has been introduced with effect from he has congratulated me. I am thank­ 6th April, 1978. It is a classless tram ful to him. As for the suggestions having only Ilnd class accommodation. which he has made, we have already (d) It is a fully reserved fast train made the announcement. Firstly, as far as the frequency of the train is with Second Class cushioned sleepers. concerned, the occupation of train Janata Bed rolls are supplied on de- goes on increasing as the frequency mand on payment of prescribed char­ increases. It is directly proportionate ges. Water containers have also been provided in the coaches to provide to the occupation and therefore, we are watching the occupation o£ the cold water. A pantry car has been train. Secondly, we quite see the provided on this train to supply hot food. A lending library has also been difficulties of people coming from other regions of South like Andhra, Manga­ introduced on the train. lore. and Kerala. I have already an­ PROF. P. G. MAVALANKAR: Sir, 1 nounced while introducing the tram d0 wish to congratulate my friend, the that within a few days we are going Railway Minister for starting this new to have some additional bogies for peo­ tram which has been a great help and ple travelling to Kerala and other it was welcomed by many people. parts so that they should be able to ‘Classless society’ is all right. But I get full advantage. In addition to do not know why he calls it a ‘class­ that ... less train’. What he means is a single class train—only the second class. I SHRIMATI PARVATHI KRISH- would like to ask him, apart from con­ NAN: At least you give South Indian gratulating him on this and also con­ names to the additional bog

facilities, and you will be happy to that it starts from Ahmedbad, goes to know that our idea is to give more Baroda, then to Surat, Nandurbar, connections between Ahmedabad and Jalgaon, Manmad, Dhond, Sholapur, Madras, not only in terms of carrying Guntakkal, Gooty, Renigunta and then passengers, we have also tried to de­ to Madras. The tickets for all the pict, in this very train, the saga of In­ stations are available. Reservations dian freedom movement, in which the for the intermediate stations are avail* important events in the life of Gan- able. And since the train does not dhiji when he led the struggle, have stop in between these stations, the been pictorially inscribed, and Impor­ question of reservation does not arise, tant quotations have also been ins­ for others. cribed. We have received very good response to it. Secondly as regards the janata bed rolls, if the hon. Member travels by PROF. P. G. MAVALANKAR: this train, he will And that we have Music is also very important. Music taken proper precaution to provide is soothing. clean janata bed rolls, so that passen­ gers should have sound sleep and not PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: If be disturbed by the bad smell of the he travels by this train, he will find janata bed roll. That precaution has that tho entire music of the wheels is been taken. also vi:ry pleasant. As regards the extension of the Ira:’:, PROF. P. G. MAVALANKAR: He Members will be very happy to know said in his answer that it was a fully that we want such facilities oe reserved train. I want to know extended to different regions. An*, whether reservations are also possible therefore, we are already examining for the passengers to Madras or trice- the starting of such classless trains, uersa at the intermediate stations, and with all these facilities. We are whether the janata bed rolls which examining the problem of starting are provided are really of good quality them between Bhubaneswar-Secun- or they are only of janata quality. derabad; Secunderabad-Bombay and (Interruptions) When we give things similarly between Ahmedabad-Bhev- free or at low cost, we don’t look at nagar-Porbandar and also between the quality. I want that quality Bhubaneswar and Delhi via Asansol. things should also be given. We should not look merely at the price. I did not MR. SPEAKER: Mr. Minister, you mean quality! I said are extending the scope of the question. janata quality. I want to know whether the quality of the thing will PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: He be looked after, and what is the fee has asked the question. charged for the bed roll? Finally, the Railway Miniser has already started MR. SPEAKER: That is why I said this train. There is also a train from that the last question need not be ans­ Ahmedabad to Calcutta. Will he also wered. Once you extend the scope of think of having a train by name the question, the supplementaries will 'Young India’—a name also given by also be extended. Gandhiji—between Ahmedabad and PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: Now Delhi via Jaipur, so that these States about the last train. I have mention­ can also be connected? ed these trains. There is also one MR. SPEAKER: The last question train in the northern region, I tiust does not arise. mention it. Otherwise I will be guilty of regionalism. There is the Howrah- PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE As Jammu train which will pass through far as part A of the question is con­ Patna, Lucknow and Ludhiana. We cerned, the entire train is so devised are also trying to examine it. 23 Oral Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Oral Answer»

SHRI VIJAYKUMAR N. PATIL: THE MINISTER OF RAILWAYS Will the Minister consider the possi­ (PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE): (a) bility of linking Nardana and Dhule to (d). A statement is laid on the .line, a distance of 20 miles with this Table of the Sabha. train? It is lying in the region bet­ ween Ahmedabad and Madras. This Statement Nardana-Dhule-Chalisgaon line will re­ duce the distance between Ahmedbad The number of train accidents in the and Madras by this train by 60 miles. categories of collisions, derailments, There is already a demand placed on level crossing accidents and ares in the Government by the people of Dhule trains which occurred on the different district, for the provision of this 20- Railways during the penod 1-10-1977 mile link between Nardana and Dhule. to 31-3-78 and the number of persons killed therein is given below:— PROF MADHU DANDAVATE; That is altogether a different question. Railway No of No. or MR SPEAKER. Mr. Minister, You train persons have opened the topic. That is the accidents killed difficulty. Anyway, the Mimser will consider that. I. Central 67 8

SHRI VIJAYKUMAR N. PATIL: 2. Eastern 36 8 Will the Government agree to this at least? 3* Northern . 6a 77 North Eastern PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: 1 am 4- 35 4 saying that already we have received 5- Northeast Frontier 29 .. a memorandum on those lines We will take it into account. I am not 6. Southern . 43 8 going to give a firm commitment. Un­ 7- South Central 39 12 less we examine the problem, it is not proper to give a reply. 8. South Eastern 59 .. Western MR. SPEAKER- May I suggest that 9- 59 29 the Minister may kindly reply to the T otal 41a <39 question1' Do not enlarge the scope. Then it will enlarge the scope of the (d) A sum of Rs. 2 51 lakhs approxi­ supplementaries. That is my request mately has been paid as compensation to all of you. under the Indian Railways Act, 1890 to the victims or their dependents in­ volved in train accidents during the Train Accidents period from 1st October, 1977 to 31st *765. SHRIMATI BIBHA GHOSH March, 1978. The other claims are GOSWAMI: Will the Minister of pending in the courts of the Ad-hoc Claims Commissioners/Ex-offlcio RAILWAYS be pleased to lay a state­ Claims Commissioners and the pay­ ment showing ment will be made to the claimants (a) total number of train accidents on the basis of the verdicts of the during the last six months; courts. (b) total number of people died in Out of 16 Railway employees who these accidents; were killed on duty in these accidents, a sum of Rs. 3,32,100 has been paid at (c) details zone-wise; and compensation due under the Work­ (d) total amount paid as compensa­ men’s Compensation Act 1923 in the tion? case of 14 deceased employees. »5 Oral Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Oral Answers 26

SHRIMATI BIBHA GHOSH GO- not be shifted. As regards the ini­ SWAMI; The Minister must be aware tial complaint that she has mention­ that there is a widespread feeling ed, we will see to it that when vacan­ that the maintenance ot the railways cies of gangmen occur, we will not is not up to the mark, especially, allow those vacancies to go uncover­ in regard to gangmen etc the accept­ ed or unfilled Injustice to gangmen ed formula for appointment or will always be avoided maintenance of manpower, what is called the Mufflrn formula, that for­ SHRIMATI BIBHA GHOSH GO- mula has been given up in many of SWAMI There have been 412 train the sections The result is that accidents causing 129 deaths 1 want vacancies caused by death or retire­ to know m how many cases sabotage ment are never filled up Consider­ was the cause of the accident ing also the fact that the volurre of traffic has gone up several times, this is a real danger for the safe PROF MADHU DANDAVATE I running of trains I want to know have already informed the House a whether the Minister has gone number of times that from 1st April through all these questions and 1977 to 31st March 1978 we detected whether he is considering the re­ 127 obstructions m the path Some placement of those vacancies caused of them were by way of removal of by death and retirement by appoint­ fish-plates, m some places the rails ing more gangmen and other man­ were cut Even though 127 attempts power necessary for fulfilling the were made, 8 of them resulted m Mufflin formula at least, if not more accidents due to sabotage In addi­ staff tion to other steps, m November we »et up a patrolling agency of 25,000 PROFF MADHU DANDAVATE men—14,000 gangmen and 11,000 There are two aspects of the pro­ RPF men—and I am very happy to blem One is mantenance The say that after starting the practice second is the question of allotment of patrolling froir 23rd December of work to gangmen and judicious 1977 not a single accident due to implementation of the formula that sabotage has taken place, and has been observed so far I am very that is a tribute to our gangmen and happy to inforir the House that re­ RPF men cently we had tried to strengthen and to reinforce all our maintenance SHRI T A PAI May we know arrangements and a number of whether the Minister hat, raised the mechanical devices are also being quantum of compensation m the case introduced As far as the problem of deaths from Rs 50 000 to Rs 1 of gangmen is concerned, I have said lakh because the cess collected is it in this very House, that for a leaving an insufficient balance every variety of reasons we would perfer year and it would be fair that the to introduce the concrete sleepers, travellers by trains are treated on instead of the wooden sleepers, be­ a par with travellers by planes? cause the durability of the concrete sleepers m the long run will be very PROF MADHU DANDAVATE: high, about 50 years mstead of the The hon Member, who is also an ex- usual 12 to 15 years for wooden Railway Minister, is aware of the sleepers When we are introducing fact that even this particular quan­ the concrete sleepers, in that new tum of compensation of Rs 50,000 arrangement, gangmen are not able was introduced after considerable dis­ to do it manually and, therefore the cussion Normally, there is some job has to be done mechanically sort of link between the compensa­ But even with this mechanisation, tion paid to the victims by the air­ we will see that the gangmen will ways and the compensation paid by .27 Oral Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Oral Answer* 28

the railways. In air. the risk is sup­ main in theory, I would have been posed to be enormously large and, extremely happy. Then there would therefore, to that extent the compen­ have been no danger at all. But it sation quantum has always been more has been put into practice. there. There is a certain interna­ tional concept that has been accepted, There were 127 obstructions to the railway track in the form of re­ and it has always been accepted that moval of fish plates, tampering with whenever there is an upward revi­ the track cutting of the rails etc. sion of the one, there is an upward They resulted ultimately in eight revision of the other. In fact, I my­ accidents. Even after introducing self had suggested that this should patrol, we find that 27 attempts at be examined. We have examined this and come to the conclusion that sabotage were there, but they were detected by our patrolmen w p II in the maximum compensation should time before the trains could pass. be Rs- 50,000 and that if we revise it upwards, the compensation to the In the case of these eight accidents which were due to sabotage, there air victims will have also to be rais­ is no clear-cut indication. The final ed. At present we are confining ourselves to Rs. 50,000. Let there report has yet to come. be no incentive for accidents. In one case, 13 men at Murtajapur SHRI SHAMBU NATH CHATUR- have been arrested .but I wish to make it clear that they do not happen VEDI: May I know how the accident figures of the current year compare to be railway employees, becau.se a theory is sought to be built that be­ with the figures of the previous cause bonus has not been given there years? is discontent and the workers arc; PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE; In indulging in it. In 1974, there was 1974-75 for this period the number the maximum discontent and a 20 of accidents was 479. They are 412 days strike, but not a suagle act of for this year. In 1975-76 it was 428, sabotage took place even during that in 1976-77 it was 368 and m 1977-78 struggle. Therefore, I do not want it is 412. to allege that the railway workers arc indulging in this. No railway SHRI BEDABRATA BARUA: May worker has committed any act of I know from the hon. Minister what sabotage. has happened to the theory of sabot­ SHRI BEDABRATA BARUA; Are age? Has it remained only a theory political elements involved in it? or has there been any finding also that many of these accidents took PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: place due to sabotage resulting in The enquiry is going on. No politi­ loss of life and property? I would cal identity has, been established, like to know whether, after six but it has been established that they months or one year of propounding are not railway workers. That much this theory, Government has comp to I can say. any conclusion as to who indulged in this sabotage. It is no use saying sftr if tor wftr for wtar there is sabotage, but we do not know who did it. We should be told * 7 6 8 . TTWTft irrN* : fJTr if they suspected certain elements tror T*n*rc ^ and have made certain findings about qfr f

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trips run during January to March, Iff#, New Delhi—Howrah and New Route Frequency Delhi—Bombay Central Rajdhani Express trains ran to time on 43 and (6) Bombav VT-Trivandrum Weekly 44 occasions respectively The com­ (7) Bombay VT Madras Weekly parative earnings of Rajdhani Ex­ (8) Bombay VI-Vasco da- press with other trains running on these routes show that it is economi­ gama Biweekl) cal In order to avoid dust nuisance (9I Bombay-Sf < uik!< rabatl Weekly at the high speeds of these trains, air-conditioiung is essential This (10) Bombay-Pun c- , Daily tram is highly appreciated especially (11) Bombay V T-Varanasi Biweekly by tourists coming from foreign (12) Bombay Coniral countries Ordinary coaches cannot be attached to these high speed Gandhidhatn Biweekly trains (13) Bombay Central Ahmadabad 5 days in a week Arrangements to clear summer Traffic Rash (14) Ahmadabad-Marwar Daily ( 1 Viramgam-Jamnagar BiweekU 767 SHRI K MALLANNA Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be (16) Howrah-Nru Jalpaiguu Biweekly pleased to state (17) Howrah-Jammu Tawi . Weekly (a) whether any special arrange (18) Howrah-Barium Weekly ments have been made by the Railwav (19) Dhanbad Varanasi Alternate days authorities for clearance of rush of traffic duung summer months this (20) Delhi Sarai Rohilla- year, and Jodhpur Biweekly (b) if so the details thereof* Phan bad Railway Loco Worfcem THE MINISTER OF RAILWAYS (PROP MADHU DANDAVATE) *770 SHRI YADVENDRA DUTT (a) and (b) Yes, Sir In order to Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be clear the exodus of sumirer rush pleased to state traffic during the coming summer (a) whether on 1st February, 1978, season. Railways propose to run Dhanbad Railway Loco Workers had about 1200 special trams on various gone on strike which has led to total routes, subject to traffic offering A stoppage of railway traffic, and statement showing important routes and the frequency of trains is laid (b) if so the demands of the wor- on the table of the Sabha keis and steps taken by Govern­ Statement ment thereon’ * Anwgmunts to eltar Summer Traffic Rush’ THE MINISTER OF RAILWAYS Sptcial Trams (PROF MADHU DANDAVATE): (a) There was a stoppage of work Route Frequency from 31-1-78 to 1-2-78, passenger services were maintained by-passing Chopan (1) New Delhi-Madras Biweekly (a) Howrah'Delhi Kalka Weekly (3) Ddfai-JammuTawi Triweekly (b) There was a demand for in­ creasing the earnings out of the (4) Niaamuddm-Bomb*) Central Biweekly crew links of the Loco Running Staff (5) Bombay Central-Jamm of Chopan The question erf read­ Tawi Weekly justment of the links o* running staff 35 W ritten Answers APRIL 18, 1978 W ritten A n sw er 36

of Chopan Shed and other contigu­ ( 1 ) 5rprar Srtrfa* 'irftrtnt % ous sheds in under consideration of the Railway Administration. «WT«r smT^t ?wt srriRr jprnft if srjpf^TT 1

wtna-Srarr Tctan ( 2) f® *PT5Tf it SHmT ’FT fTJT 'dMUt^r, TTT»r ^TT^Tcff % 'ufawg*r I *771. fa g : w W w ,

»rwr iftx ^ctt% ^ ( 3 ) j® *rnraf *r StTTot $fa- yrr fa ; «TWff * ^f|>RTT 1 (*r) wr ?rfr snsr cm «Rr3HT f^rfrcr frerfcT ?T«rT §Tf^rt : faftr, »rrsrvsqsft uwf in ft («it infar ijto ) .- ( * ) ( 1) ( 6 ) 7§^S HNWT if fTHfiT ^TPTcT %% arr^ «rrfr f?refk *pf ft ?rm (a) has the Government received $rwT-*rO'e»T % sF?r«f?T“trch3T Jr ?FRfHr?T ^ r ^ 6T, wr*r?ft (*T9r m ) *rfsrf?r£nr, (c) if go, what steps the Government propose to take against the officers 1965 ( 1965 s*rr 31) ?RI : responsible for causing a loss to rail­ M ^ $, 3ft 1 5- 10-1965 way revenues in the process?

^ ^*L I s'T T O l % fFcPTcT THE MINISTER OF RAILWAYS 1 -1 -1 9 6 9 % TiT^TcT, faftn ?HPTf (PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE): (a) *R, 23 $T ^PTfa’sff cTRrT ^tpft Yes, Sir. Representation from the Working President and Secretary on ^narr-rOsTT * 7 % % sfafr fo*r behalf of Heavy Repair Shop, Elec­ ^ 3 t i r w ; fvrtel % ’sr^rr’ -, trical Staff Council, Kharagpur, ad­ STPRT ^TT-TThn v f ^Trffr^f, dressed to the Hon*ble Railway Minis­ ter has been received. Repair work has been entrusted to private parties 37 Written Answers CHAITRA. 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 38

only to the extent that Railway ing Supervisors at Howrah during Workshop was not able to find capa­ Emergency; city. The works contracts to private (b) if ao, the facts given out in the parties have been awarded by fol­ representation; lowing all rules of tendering. (c) whether any enquiry has been (b) The matter has been investiga­ conducted in the matter and if so, ted and the complaints are not found with what results; and to be correct (d) what the Government propose (c) Does not arise. to do to stop such practices and to punish the delinquent officers? A.C.C. Travel by Railway Officer! THE MINISTER OF STATE IN *773. SHRI SHYAMAPRASANNA THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS BHATTACHARYYA: Will the Minis­ (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) Yes, ter of RAILWAYS be pleased to Sir. state whv the pay limit for A.C.C. Travel by railway officers on duty has (b) Eight representations and been reduced from Rs. 2,250/- to Rs complaints containing allegations of 1,800 - violating recommendation of illegal charging, realisation of money Third Central Pay Commission con­ without issue of receipts and use of tained in para 7 of Chapter 57 of the abusive language towards passenger Report’ (<0 were received.

THE MINISTER OF RAILWAYS (c) Yes, Sir: Enquiries have been (PROF MADHU DANDAVATE): completed in the case of seven of the With a view to broadly maintaining, representations and the allegations m the revised set-up, the same set of could not be substantiated in Depart­ 1 elativities that existed between the mental and confronted enquires. In railway employees on the one hand one case, the enquiry is still in pro­ and other Central Government emp gress. loyees on the other, in the matter of (d) Secret watch is being kept by entitlement to the class of travel, the Vigilance Organisation and anti-fraud recommendations of the Third Pay squad. If any staff is detected indulg­ Commission in this regard were modi­ ing in any malpractice, suitable dis­ fied to the extent necessary. The ciplinary action is taken. entitlement of Railway officers in the J.A. grade for travel on duty in ACC was fixed at the pay limit of Rs 1800/- TnnjTBn wfafw w>t and above, with the approval of the Cabinet, to maintain the broad rela­ n w tivities that prevailed in the pre­ revised set-up between the officers on the Ralways and those on the Civil *776. T O fa f : VTT and Defence sides *Tf

(»r) fotor 4 ( 8) t r a w trftsrfFnr, i9 6 3 fftr rnnrm fw r, i ®76 % w m f f

Ir *r«*fHr?r ^ r t *nfarfr*flr («r) *hr Opjfcrt ?rr*j; *r *r st^tr w vm r jftjtt ; fa?r«r % wr *?re«rf[? ( 9) *r>rfa*fr % «hra:T % ^IfflPW ?WT TWWfT TT-^tf%^ cPTT T3TOT srVr ( 10 ) 7-sr? apt xfr^- fs«rrfipr * t ■jfiar faiTPft ir T n w m wrprf^nH »t swtar * r w *Ffarf

Tnmrcnr ^ T*rfam *rfVrfrrJTf?r*n #5^fr it Orqr *mnft ^ ^anfhr; ^rmT £ 1 (4) ff*ft *r srr^r tot t t f^fV ir ^TT ; Expert Committee for Modifying existing Plant of Cochin Refinery ( 5 ) STTtft TFaft % ft*TcT •777 SHRI K A RAJAN Will the ^irfvPTT % ^ Minister of PETROLEUM, CHEMI­ * TO SJISTfR *TfTT ; CALS AND FERTILIZERS be pleas­ ed to state (6 ) *rwt shtpt fennfa^ (a) whether a Central Expert Com* ^ W STTCt ^TT ; mittee is examining a plan to modify the existing plant of the Cochin Re. (7 ) it smr: srafa 3r m^r finery; and *T?ft vreKsft #*TTT ?TT?Tr ; (b) if so, the details thereof? 4 i Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers

THE MINISTER OF STATE IN vnrvT xrffo vrftrwr ttww t «rfa- THE MINISTRY OF PETROLEUM, AND CHEMICALS AND FERTILI­ f * m , 1963 % % snrnft ZERS (SHRI JANESHWAR MISH- RA) (a) and (b) In December 1977 t c ^rr€V jjtr vtftmfvn&fT Government appointed a Study Group under the chairmanship of Shri R N 'r f v iw t ?nf^ ’SF'r +T*rff^rai *FT 3T T£T 1 1 Bhatnagar, Chairman and Managing srfff!FT«r % irfsrcnfofT Director, Bharat Petroleum Corpora «pf*rrfcp* t tion to examine the additional re­ fining/secondary processing capacity wfta f^ fr ir sfyifoa f a m *tt t$ t $ to be set up/initiated during the Sixth wfwnrr % ^ Plan (1978—83) and for two subse­ quent years The functions and duties f w r , 1963 % fjpnr 5«F % of this Study Group were to recom­ sreto srfswf^or farr*TT £ f a *rfa mend the priority and location for ^ t| ?ft t ^ rfgr^ T *pV |* rr * re / 3t w the establishment of such additional capacity based on an evaluation of HT«i^

sn%sr ftranrr stttj^t fcprr % i *778 TTWft * ^TT fofo, Railway Crosrings in Delhi vtppt WTrft vra srarW =rrr f¥ *779 SHRI KANWAR LAL GUP TA Will the Minister of RAILWAYS (*r) frfafta ?qwrfsr- be pleased to state ^frroft % % ?T*n*T ^ 3IT^ % tfTTTT (a) the details of main Railway crossings m Delhi where over-bndge sht sfrfrr % should be constructed, ( * ) ^qrofsrsfTTofT n SrTTTrTT (b) the details of the Railway crossings where over-bridges are pro­ 5spr srorpr ^ r f r ^ r posed to be constructed in 1978, 1979 w r wfwnft *rf t irk and 1980, (c) in, how many cases Government (*r) has received representation to con struct over-bridge on the Railway arrarfsRTToft % * crossing, and fw r# ^ r r httwt fap^nr ’ (d) why no action was taken over those representations? THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS firfa, wrm iftr i w f t frri ifcft (3HRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) Re («ft ) :(v) iftr («r) placement of following level crossings 43 ■ W ritten Answers APRIL 18 , 1978 Written Answers 44

by road over/under-bridgea is consi­ their share 01 cost as per extant rules, dered desirable: is awaited. (1) Jail road level croning No. ia-B at km 14/4-3 near Delhi Cantt. Board of Directors of Kanol Industrie* (2) Level croning gate No. 2 at km Limited 4/4*5 near Shakti Nagar, Delhi. 7131. SHRI K. LAKKAPPA: Wi’l (3) Level crossing No. 5 at km 7/1*2 near Rampura. the Minister of LAW, JUSTICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleased to (4) Level crossing No. 7 at km 9/2*3 near state: Ranibagh. (5) Level crossing No. 9 at km 13/7-8 near (a) the composition of Board ot Mangolpuri. Directors of the Kanoi Industries Pri­ vate Limited, Calcutta as at present; (6) Level crossing No. 12 at km 39/2-4 near Britan ia Factory. (b) full particulars of its principal (7) Level crossing No. 13 at km 26/3-3 shareholders and value and percent, near Ashok Vmar. age of shares held by each of them; (8) Level crossing No. 580 at km 1519/6-7 near Tughlakabad. (c) whether it is a fact that the company does not maintain its books (9) Level crossing No. 580-A at km of accounts and the statutory books in 51523/1*2 near Okhla Industrial Estate. accordance with the provisions of the Companies Act; (to) Level crossing No. 581 at km 1526/4-5 near Okhla Industrial Estate. (d) whether the Company has (11) Level crossing No. 4-C & 4-B at kmaccepted loans and deposits and has 5/8-9 at New Rohtak Road. also transferred loans to various other companies contravening the Compa* (b) No road over-bridges are pro­ posed to be constructed during 1978- nies Act; and 79. Proposals for 1979*80 can be con­ (e) if so, the facts thereof and sidered if Delhi Administration | Road action taken against the principal Authorities complete the necessary officers? > ft) preliminaries/formalities in respect thereof before-hand. THE MINISTER OF LAW, JUS­ TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS (c) Representations have been re­ (SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN): (a) ceived in two cases viz., for the cons­ Board of Directors consists of the fol­ truction of road over-bridges in r»- lowing persons: placement of level crossings mention­ ed against item (1) & (2) (Le., on 1. Shri Murlidhar Kanoi Jail Road and in Shakti Nagar res­ pectively) of the reply to part (a) of 2. Shri Om Prakash Kanoi the question. 3. Shri Hari Krishna Kanoi. 4. Smt. Karuna Kanoi. (d) For the road over-bridge on Jail Road, acceptance of the Munici­ (b) A statement I is attached. pal Corporation of Delhi for the pro­ posed apportionment of cost and gene­ (c) The Department of Company ral arrangement drawings is awaited Affairs has no information in the mat­ ter an<* no complaint on the subject .For the road over-bridge at Shakti has been received. Nagar, a firm proposal from the Delhi Administration/Road Authority to­ (d) and («). A statement-11 is at gether with their undertaking to bear tached. 45 Written Answer* CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 46

j Statement-I of Deposits) ftules, 1975 with regard to deposits accepted. Action on this Name* of principal shareholders, remark is under examination. De­ value and percentage of shares held partment of Company Affairs have no by each of them as per the annual information on about the alleged return *»de upto 30th September transfer of loans to various other com­ 1977 are as under: panies.

Value of Percen­ Cell lor Reservation of Posts tor 8.C. Share Held tage and S.T. Name 7132. SHRI P. RAJAGOPAL NAI- 1. Shri Murlidhar DU: Will the Minister of LAW, JUS­ Kanoi 45.000 9% TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS be «. Sat. Kanina Kanoi 45,000 9% pleased to state: 3. Shri Om Prakash (a) whether special cell have been Kanoi 35.000 7% functioning in the Department of Legal Affairs to ensure strict enforce­ 4. Shri O-P. Kanoi 53.ooo io-6% ment of reserving posts for Scheduled 3. Mr*. Sabba Kanoi 140,000 8% Castes and Scheduled Tribes; and 6. Kum. Shrikanta | (b) whether any complaint was sent Kanoi €0,000 12% to the cell during 1977 -78 ?.

7. Kum. Umakanta THE MINISTER OF LAW, JUS­ Kanoi 60,000 iaDo TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS (SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN): (a) Yes, Sir. Statement-!! (b) One complaint was received in Particulars regarding loans and de­ the Cell during 1977-78 which was posits accepted by the company as duly considered and finally disposed disclosed in its Balance Sheet as at of. 31st March 1977 are as under: Monthly Season Tickets for Passengers Unsecured Loans Rs. between Dina Nagar and 7133. SHRI DURGA CHAND: Will Shtrl Umu loans the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to state: From Director* . - 7,16,500 J (a) whether it is a fact that there From Other* • 38.95.31*! is a great demand for issue of monthly 0 Hut Loans season tickets for passenger8 travelling between Dina Nagar and Amritsar; From Directors . . 7.75, »54l (b) whether it is fact that Station From Others • 5.34.03* Master, Dina Nagar is reported to have observed that the monthly season tickets can be issued only with the Auditors in their report of the Ba­ sanction of the Chief Commercial lance Sheet as at 31st March 1977 re­ Superintendent, Northern Railways; marked that the Company i8 taking steps to comply with the provisions (c) whether the Pathankot-Amritoar of Section 58 A of Companies Act, Railways Section train traveller Asso­ lMKt and the Companies (Acceptance ciation, Gurdaspur have sent any re* 4 7 Written Answers APRIL 18, 1678 Written A nsw sti 4ft

presentation to the Chief Commercial the house rent allowance admis­ Superintendent, Northern Railway in sible in lieu thereof to the Judges this regard; and of the High Oourts. (d) if so, what action Government (ii) a proposal to amend the High have or propose to take in the matter? Court Judges (Conditions of Ser­ vice) Act, 1954 and the Supreme THE MINISTER OF STATE IN Court Judges (Conditions of Ser­ THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS vice) Act, 1958 so as to allow Jud­ (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) Yes. ges of the High Courts and the Sup­ reme Court to avail of leave on full

Proposal to improve Service Condi- Task Force Officers UnclasaUed tions of Judges 7135. DR LAXMINARAYAN PAN* 7134. SHRI SHY AM SUNDER DEYA: Will the Minister of RAIL­ GUPTA: Will the Minister of LAW, WAYS be pleased to state: JUSTICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleased to state- (a) whether there is a strong task force of thousand officers on the (a) whether Governlment propose Indian Railway unclassified because to raise the pay scales and to further they were recruited as temporary offi­ improve the conditions of service ol cers; the Judges of the Supreme Court and the High Courts; and (b) whether AUahabad High Court has pronounced verdict with 5 judges 1(b) if so, what are the details there­ in 3 stages that these officers are assis­ of? tant officers and they should be en. titled to seniority from their respective THE MINISTER OF LAW, JUS­ dates °f recruitments; and TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS (SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN): (a) ard (c) on what grounds his Miaistry (b). There is no proposal under disregards the judicial decrees and Government's consideration to raise does not implement the above decisions the pay scales of Judges of the Sup­ unlike other Ministries, as this has a reme Court and the High Court. How­ strong repercussion and demoralising ever, the Government arc at present effect on the career growth of these oonsidering:— temporary officers?

(1) a proposal to exempt the THE MINISTER OF STATE IN Judges of the Supreme Court d'd THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS the High Courts from payment o£ (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) 1M9 income-tax in respect of rent-free temporary officers recruited through accommodation allotted to their, w Union Public Service Commission Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 50

with certain relaxed conditions were m m x «ft ^ j m r ^ t t fa* v s f* m “unclassified” ie , neither in Clasa I * t w fasrm mrr % *ro% nor in Class II as they were recruit­ ed against the temporary posts farfanft *r T WTTT % 3TTT TT 28 1978 % IkdK ifrn sn^T *To 1056 ^ TrT?" Sfr (*r) ^?r wnrT/fi?rvRwi %- an^- ^ W f * *?TT^ r t FTT T^r f¥ w r TTq’^ t £ *ft* «rfgr « r ?np *ni rr^r^ fr^ ^ ?rt | ctt ^ *tt (v ) JTHTfTT flfaFrT, ^ 3P5T w k WT TPfanft TT fsRTT ftffwr ?m sn^ srm % *rr»fV t t swftrr f «TSTO1T ^ TTW *nft ( t f (w ) wot p p t t % ^ itrt

( 1 ) STT'T'T % wt ijf | wrm- (a) total number of representations WtWT VT ^r?T qr received by the P T A /Administration, Western Railway during the year 1872 ?r»nr ?pf*rr i to 1977, Written Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Written Answers 52

(b) total number of representation® Violation of Companies Act by Hta- finalised and still pending; dostan Laver limited

(c) the reasons for thi8 long delay; 7140. SHRI SUKHDEO PRASAD and VERMA: Will the Minister of LAW, JUSTICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS (d) steps taken by Government lor be pleased to state; the quick disposal of staff representa­ (a) whether Government’s attention tions? has been drawn to the various irregu­ larities committed contravening the THE MINISTER OF STATE IN provisions of the Companies Act 196C THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS by the Hindustan Lever Limited Bom* (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) 67. bay;

tb) Finalised 59; Pending 8. (b) the facts thereof; (c) the composition of Board of (c) Pending representations are not Directors of the Company including very old and there is no undue delay. the principal shareholders and value They are being finalised. and percentage of shares held by each (d) Instructions exist for prompt of them; disposal of staff representations ai d (d) whether it is alleged that tlie al] efforts are being made to ensure Company has secured deposits from this. various sources without appropriately securing any permission of authorities; and (e) if go, the details thereof and Complaints made to MLR.T.F. C w aw - action taken thereon? sloa

7139. SHRI D. B CHANDRE GOW­ THE MINISTER OF LAW, JUS­ DA: Will the Minister of LAW. JUS­ TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS be (SHRi SHANTl BHUSHAN); (a) and pleased to state: (b). Government’s attention w drawn to *n article published in *New (a) whether some cases have been Age’ dated the 26th of September, brought to the notice of Government 1976 containing allegations of irregu­ frem the dealers who made complaints larities committed by the company* to M.R.T.P. Commission against manu­ The following are the main allega­ facturers in respect of unfair and res. tions:— trictive trade practice during the last (a) There wa8 discrepancy In two years; and the figures reported in the Profit and Loss Accounts of the company (b) if so, the details thereof and for the years ended 81st December the decision taken by the Commission 1974 and 31st December 1979. in each case? , (b) There was discrepancy in the THE MINISTER OF LAW. JUS­ provision for bad end doubtful TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS debts. (SHRI SHANTl BHUSHAN): ( 0 (c) Discrepancy in the closing Yes, Sir. stock. (b) A statement i8 laid on the (d) Production in excess of Uctts- Table of the House. [Placed in Libra­ ced capacity plus permitted liberali­ ry. See No. LT-2129/78], sation. 5 3 W ritten Answers CHATTRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 54.

(e) Collection of security advan- 7 of the Companies (Issue of Share ces from distributors without pay- Certificates) Rules, 1960. ment of interest, and utilising the said money without disclosing in the (ii) Non-compliance of the provi- Balance Sheet. sions of section 297, 299/301 of the (J) Running trade load scheme. Companies Act, 1956 (Director-, to- and making hidden earnings. ‘ " est ln “ f “ ** entered mt® ^ the company). (g) Running Guest Houses as Hotels without any licence. (Ui) NoBHMa|fltaBce ^ the provi. (h) Company has not diluted its sions of section 193, of the Compa- foreign equity holding which stands ndes Act, 1956, relating to main- at 85 per cent. tenance of Minute Books. These points were taken up with the company who has satisfactorily (iV) Non-compliance of section explained the position. 211 read with Schedule VI on at- II. Additionally, during the course S E L 2 L “ tE f*""”* 01 of inspection of the books of accounts, authorised capital. etc., of this company under section 209A of the Companies Act, 1956, m . Item (ii) is under examination following irregularities were lound by to cooptation with the Department the Inspecting Officer in 1974:— Legal Affairs. The remaining items (i) Non-compliance of the provi- have been ^ P P ed after rectification sions of section 150 read with ru)« of the defects by the company. ____(c)

Name of the Directors j Value o f( Percentage Shares held'

Rs. i. Shri T. Thomas ( C h a ir m a n ) ......

3. Shri E. H. Shimmin (Vice-Chairman) .... 3. Shri R. B a n e r j e e ...... 3,000 O’ 0015

4. Shri H. C. B ija w a t ...... 5,000 0*0095 5. ShriJ. C. C h o p t m ...... 5,000 0*00*5

6. Shri S. M. D a t t a ...... 6,000 0*0029

7. Shri A. S. G a n g u ly ...... 7»5«> 0*0037 8. Shri S. H. G u r s a h a n i ...... 2,000 0*00098

9. Shri J. P. L u s t y ......

10. Shri J. S. R a j ...... ••

Principal Shareholders (having shares valued at more than Rs. 1 lakh)

1. Unilever Limited, U. K . ^ ...... 14*33,48,500* 00 70*39 8. Life Insurance Corporation...... *6,67,530*00 0*82

3. Unit Trust of India...... 40,88,640*00 2*00 4. General Insurance Corporation of India . 2,25,930*00 0*11 W ritten Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Written Answers 56

Value of Percentage Shares held

Rs. 5. Bank of I n d i a ...... i,8o,aio*oo o '09

6. The Calcutta Hos. & Nur. Home Benefits Asson. Ltd. 1,69,510-00 <>•083

7. Industrial Investment Trust Limited . 3,61,180-00 o* 18

8. Oriental Fire & General Insurance Company Limilrd 10,35,660* 00 0-51

9. United India Fire & General Insurance Company Ltd. 7.95 .590 - 00 o-39

10. New India Assurance Co. Ltd...... 8,04,890- OO 0-44

11. National Insurancr Co. Ltd...... 1.26,550* 00 o' 16

ia. Ruby General Insurance Company Limited . 1.59,270* 00 11' 078

13. National Assurance Co. Ltd. .... 1,23.460' 00 {>• of* I

(d) and (e). It was alleged that to the distribution stockists in which the company had collected huge the company had already transferred amounts interest-free as security ad­ ownership to them was far more than vances from distributors and these the security advance standing to their were not disclosed in the Balance credit The company also adder1 that Sheets. The matter was taken Ujj it was not correct that these advan­ with the company. The company ex­ ces were not disclosed in the Bdhnce plained "that due to continuous flow Sheets. of company’s goods to the redistribu­ tion stockists and the advprsp expe­ rience the company had in the mattei In this connection, it is seon that of bouncing of cheques, it was decid­ the following amounts have been sta­ ed to cover a part of its risk of bad- ted in the company's balance sheets debts by taking from the distribution under the head ‘Security Advances.’ stockists an advance to cover partl> the price of goods continuously being sold and supplied to them. The com­ Amount pany explained that taking such of Financial yrar Security advances to cover the risk of bad- Advance debts was prudent business practice (Rs. in and any supplier of goods cannot be lakh<0 compelled to extend credits or to sup­ ply the goods otherwise than on cash 31-12-1974 234- 37 payment, simultaneously, with the delivery of goods to the purchaser. 31-13-1975 >88* <54 It was also explained that since these 31-12-1976 270' 73 were in the nature of security advan­ ces for price of goods continuously 31-12-1977 300* 39 supplied to the distribution stockists, the question of paynvent of interest did not arise. The company contend­ Under the Companies Act, no per­ ed that at any given time thp value of mission is required to be taken from goods sold including those in transit Government to accept such Deposits. 57 Written Annuers CHAJTRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answer* 5g Proposal to Start Exprea Train tto m iwsnf wmr *jt fiwrw Bbnbanealtwar to Bombay

7141. : *TT * * 7142. SHRI PABITRA MOHAN PRADHAN: Will the Minister of m *?TT^ *Bt fTT fa : RAILWAYS be pleased to state whe­ ther there is any proposal for starting any express train from Bhubaneshwar (v) *mr

(*r) ^r, ?ft ftrnRRT ?rt%, Conversion of Gauge in Karnataka ^r§*T spft % jft ^rnpr ?i%, t *t nrfWlf % f^rr ^prf%nr gframT 7143. SHRI C. K. JAFFER SHA- RIEF: Will the Minister of RAIL­ a flW *ftr ^Wfff ^t g*: WAYS be pleased to state: V spft * aresTsr fo r * * iTV sr^g- (a) the details of proposals sent by far* ramriT 1 the Karnataka Government to the Central Government for construction of new railway lines into broad gauge T?f ijllW ^ tlW >ilft («ft fiW lines during the Fifth Five Year Plan; HTTRTO) : (*) fr (*r). OTVTlfa (b) whether some incomplete pro­ jlpfcTjr fffaRT ^S" ^TTRT’T

Rs. 2.06 crores has been made for the project in the Budget for the current Year Amount year. The project is exnected to be (R».)l completed by 1983, subject to avail­ ability of adequate funds in the next 1969-70 3383*3 and subsequent years. 1970 *7* 459631 Representation from Ex-Combatants of 1971-72 343483 Defence >972-73 4795 **

7144. SHRI R. K. MHALGI:Will 1973-74 607354 the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleas­ ed to state: *974-75 47375 * *975*7® 1285492 (a) whether it is a fact that the Government have received a represen­ 1976-77 1588158 tation dated the 12th January, 1978 *977-78 *«37567 from the ex-combatants of Defence Services, South Central Railways, Secunderabad; and Information for the ycars 1967-68 and 1968-69 is not available. (b) if so, what action have Gov­ ernment taken or propose to take In the matter soon? Fertilizer Unit at Uran, Bombay 7146. SHRIMATI PARVATHI KRI- THE MINISTER OF STATE IN SHNAN; Will thP Minister of PET­ THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS ROLEUM, CHEMICALS AND FER­ (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) and (b). TILIZERS be pleased to state- A representation dated 2

Goods earning Revenue at Achalda THE MINISTER OF STATE IN Station THE MINISTRY OF PETROLEUM AND CHEMICALS AND FERTILI­ 7145. SHRI R- L. P. VERMA: ZERS (SHRI JANESHWAR MISHRA): Will the Minister of RAILWAYS (a) and (b). A proposal received from be pleased to state the revenue earn­ M/s. Deepak Nitrite Ltd., to set ed from goods at Achalda Railway up a small size gas based plant for the station of the Allahabad Division of manufacture of 235 tonnes per day of the Northern Railway from 1967-68 to ammonia near Uran in Maharashtra 1977-78 year-wise? was earlier rejected for the following reasons: THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (i) The capacity of the plant, viz., (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): The revenue 235 tonnes per day is uneconomical as earned from goods at Achalda rail­ against * capacity of 1350 tonnes way station year-wise from 1969-70 per day being planned for the gaa "to 1977-78 is as under: based plant* in the Bombay region. 6 i Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 62

(ii) Government have already tration, a search for suitable houses finalised their plans for the utilisa­ is being made by the Administration tion of associated gas that would and both the remaining Judges are be available from the Bombay High expected to be provided with rent free and it ]s not necessary to sanction residences shortly. this proposal as a means of utilis­ ing the associated ftas. Monetary Limits of Divisional Superia. tendents to enter into Agreements for (iii) The applicant did not have a entrusting Goods and Parcel Handling clear marketing plan for ammonia. contracts

The company has represented 7148. SHRI BATESHW^R HEM- against the rejection. This represen­ RAM: Will the Miristt* of RAIL­ tation is under consideration. WAYS be pleased to state

(a) what are the monetary limits up Judges of High Court of Punjab and to which the Divisional Superinten­ Haryana provided with official Resi. dents working on Northern. Eastern denceg and North Eastern Railways are com­ petent to negotiate and enter into 7147. SHRI OM PRAKASH TYAGI: agreements with Labour Cooperative Will the Minister of LAW, JUSTICE Societies/Contractors for entrusting AND COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleas- Goods and Parcels handling contracts; ed to state: (b) what is the present annual valu­ ation of parcels handling work at (a) how many Judges are working Allahabad; in the High Court of Punjab and Har­ yana; (c) whether the Parcels handling contract at Allahabad falls within the (b) how many out of them have competence of the Divisional Superin­ been provided with rent free official tendent concerned or the final authori­ residence as required under the pro­ ty is vested in the Chief Commercial visions of the High Court Judges (Con­ Superintendent; and ditions of Service) Amendment Act, 1976; and (d) what is the hitch in deciding fresh award of contract at Allahabad (c) what steps have been taken by as the old contract had already ex­ the Chandigarh Administration to pired on the 31st July, 1977? provide rent free residence to the other Judge* who are not having official residence? THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS THE MINISTER OF LAW, JUS­ (SHRI SHEO NARAINV (a> The TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS monetary limits up to which Divi­ (SHRI SHANTI BHUSHANV (a) sional Superintendents on Northern, Nineteen Judges including the Chief Eastern and North Eastern Railways Justice are working in the High Court are competent to negotiate and enter of Punjab and Haryana; into agreements with Labour Co­ operative Societies/Contractors for (b) Seventeen Judges including the entrusting Goods and Parcels handling Chief Justice have been provided with contracts are as under: rent tree residences; Northe rn Railway — up to Rs 10 hkhi per annum. (c) Rent free residences remain to Eaitrm Railway — up to Rs 5 lakhs foi be provided to two Judges, who have 3 years. recently been appointed/transferred. North Eastern Railway — up to Rs. 10 According to the Chandigarh Adminis­ lakhs in earli casr. Written An«toer« APRIL 18, 197ft Written Answers 64

(b) Ks. 2,54,100 per annum. faifir, «rw iftr ^ r t t (c) The Parcel handling contract at («ft mfar ^jro) : (m )w & $ « r fa r Allahabad falls within the competence ?n?r»u*ff*r^ {t^Tr^ftvfyfarw, of Divisional Superintendent, Allaha­ bad. 1956% *F£BTT (RPTcT, Taftf'tf *PWPlt 1 ’ffcr:^5rr*raTf<«fl siRf^w (d) This is under examination In <£3ft, ®PT 197 7*^sft?PTTt*pW «J?ft the meantime, the existing Society is being allowed to continue. k yTerfwr ^ r t ^crsst ^ f>1

(»*) trt»t ( * ) * ^rfar?r ^pff 5® ffTTT PWlf fT H *t *rrt «ft wnxpft *rfafaqr*r % n?F wnxfift % 1ETT jj- Cfgf^rT H|fV t, JTT. 7149 ** JTTTm W f* : *r wr ttfafim ifhrr^rt w fwfcr, arm ww f ^ - STFTt i f^rfenr stt’ptt faap'ui WffftjT finftlR if j f W -T T ? Tr rjg-% *?V $*TT % : vrftarr (*f) fTRrfsrferT yprPf^T % srr^ t srpfwrr jwt, *7 1977*Tsfr isrV 7150. : *TTW t^rriT'nft *raft q^sRTr^r f m f a .

4frr Trs* fif^r, srTtrirr {w) «r*n *r* | fa ^ t t ^r% (faryn-) % HKf?T>5T fafarc % W?f ^ 14 % 18 (*T) SfffRlTTTTJr, HTTTt qir^d, 1978 % f? | i (fkzrr)

(iv r) f^FPT f^ r snPTFT rn-? (w ) ^r,

(fm ) miTfw vsrfanfr (^r) spr ^ ^35?n 1 wrrrr^r, snprr (fc&rr);tfhc Booking at wayside Railway Stations (»f) wr&r wrwrfjRfjm ^ R t 7151. SHRI SURAJ BHAN: Will TW fT % OT«nr the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleas­ fir? gt *r*r t srV «pit ?pr fk^rr ed to state: *nznv t ^rrsr t o ft *rV vfe (a) are the Goveraxnent aware o f' rff,tTwsprr«rf ? the ftwt that on wayside Beilwajr Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 66

Stations the booking window# are not % f ^ r , STfTT ^TTT opened quite in time to enable the passengers to purchase tickets without Pww-*w Bxvnc v t *N fit | t i inconvenience, they are some times opened after the train; leaves the last Proposal to amend Constitution to proscribe detention Law station and thereby much confusion is caused; and ,7153. SHRI S. R. DAMANI: Will (b) what steps are proposed to be the Minister of LAW. JUSTICE AND taken to remove this difficulty of the COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleased to railway passengers who generally state: come from the rural areas? (a) whether the Bar Council of THE MINISTER OF STATE IN India has urged the Government to THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS amend the Constitution tp proscribe (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) and detention without trial; and (b). A few complaints about non­ opening of Booking windows in time (b) if go, Government’s reaction have been received by the Railway thereof? Administrations. Instructor already exist that Booking windows are kept THE MINISTER OF LAW. JUS­ open at least one hour before the TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS train is due to arrive and longer (SHRI SHANTl BHUSHAN): (a) The where the offering requires so. Bar Council 0f India has in’ted that the Constitution be suitably amended Frequent checks are cu:duct

fttH fi 4i (b) Government will give due con­ sideration to the said suggestion wnue finalising the proposals for amend­ 7152. gtnr fro : wr ment of the Constitution. fafa,STFTIfft*SvPqrftfTO Recommendations of Tarkunde *rr fqrr *pr»i f% : Committee 7154. SHRI C. K. CHANDRAPPAN: (sr) fofrr- Will the Minister of LAW, JUSTICE ct % $ srR srfcrfaftr fwfarr AND COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleased to state: srfgrf^rftr v i tfsTTOTT

v t I I I % vihrrct vfyf^nr, 1955 .^ f *T 3rr?T TT fa farT$t*fr*PT ^ f iw t f a i w r w it r t 7155 *ft WT *ST *T$ft *T{ft Sft SrTflT t, faam-faeBT % ^T «RTT% f t *

(*i) ^rqr^tffaohTJT^%WT (*r) w - r Tt «f * pt m m far tp c ^t t , tft* qftfiwfa«ft *t, qfyrsrtT qc*jft % fafft fafafsfEff inftr % sfpmft^t (»r) ^T^TS^TfofafaftafTfr ^raTT fwwr^-fa^7 % n-q- xd^rr % * t Tt ^sttctct | 7 fr ^ m r l i t fa r r irr 11 ^ar *hrm*r if Trwrtfsft («rtfrw firoriiffvt^v ^<0 1S T faur mrnmr) (v ) fr (»r). ^ ^ ^ s t 3TPTT Tt *rr r t sftr ?tjtt *K*t TKWft STT^ft I 7157 »T tT : (»I) WT ?TTTTT TT m Tr 5TRTRt I fa rr#*ft ry fa^ jTR Tf TT| ( t ) tit ?rrrr tt gfaar^TT «ftf^Fr^r $ «rtr ?T^rfacr «ft ’ *fi t t ^ srwrrar v z f w % fa^PTefrr f , W?TPW if TT3CT («ft flW $TR m ) (t ) «f|T (^)_ 21-2-78 TT ( g ) t*( q-fr iffT-7-ffr ^fn-^rr^TT fajTT»fnr q f^ % Tt Jjfa* f f ‘T ftwr qr^r ett ?tt T47- TTST T ^ R TT ffm »RT "r-f^ fr qrJ-swTTJT t \ «TT I *T^r 3TT9PT Tr ’TTTTT f?rdeTTT ssftr rHiwm q ^Tq--qT7trr ^ % fan 5FT 2 1 -8 -7 7 TT 3TFT % s t ^ h •r t \ n i p i t * a ?t i t *rm ^Vr?T ITT »^BR «F ^5T, TTT «Ttfa Tt w n faw WTTT ft , ifrr faspt TT?T TPT *T4 ^ i aw firdsTT w?x\ n (IT) qfc rf/t, fr **TT W l ^FT'JT ?r^ t % ^T*ft9Frtrd^ faarr ®ftT ^PTT^T ffrfterrt Tt fafa, wn*r tnfa T*q*ft tp t *r>ft STHTt it «^T g^PTT^ TTfr ^ 3mTT («ftinfc?nj*«r) (t ) ^ ttt ^tsp?t TT?fl I JSrFPTPT f*TMT % THT Tt ^THT

$ 1 % frn* f^fwer way electrification during the year 1972 and up to 31st December, 1977; fararr «r*rr «rc 1 (b) what is the total number of leiU a tlv e Constituencies on Nagaland employees m different categories in and certain other States all divisions over Northern Railway who were recruited or promoted dur­ 7158 SHRI K B CHETTRI Will ing each year and what is the total the Minister of LAW, JUSTICE AND number arrongst them who belong to COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleased to Scheduled Castes, Scheduled Tribe* state and others (list of SC and ST employees be furnished), and (a) the total number of Legislative Constituencies m the States of Naga­ (c) what steps have been taken to land, Meghalaya, Arunachal Pradesh make good the shortfall m all cate­ and Sikkim, gories m the divisions of Northern Railway mentioned in (a) above for (b) the names of the constituencies the reserved vacancies earmarked for State-wise with the total number of SC and ST through direct recruit­ electorates in each constituency, and ment and promotions7 (c) the criteria laid down for THE MINISTER OF STATE IN demarcating the various constituencies THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS in the States’ (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) to (c) Information is being collected and THE MINISTER OF LAW JUS­ will be laid on the table of the TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS Sabha (SHRI SHANTl BHUSHAN) (a) and (b) Two Statements containing Appointments and Promotions against the lequisite information are laid on Reserved Posts the Table of the House [Placed in Library See No LT-2130/78] 7160 SHRI R N RAKESH Will (1) The cntcria laid down for de­ the Minister of LAW, JUSTICE AND marcating the Assembly constituen COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleased to cies m the States and Union Terri­ state tories are contained m Article 170 of the Constitution ind relevant provi­ (a) the total number of posts in sion*! of the Government of Union the Ministiy, its attached and sub­ Tern tones Act 1963, the Delimita­ ordinate offices including Public Sec- tion Act 1972 and 1he Rpresentation toi Undertakings, if any, filled of Sikkim Subjects, Act, 1974 m each category of posts with specific share of Scheduled Castes and Sche­ duled Tribes in such employment and Strength of Railway Employees In also the number of posts de-reserved Allahabad etc. Divisions in each category and reasons thereof • during the last one year, and 7159 SHRI SHIV SAMPATI RAM Will the Minister of RATLWAYS be (b) the total number of depart­ pleased to state mental promotions/upgradation of posts m each category of posts and (a) what was the total strength of how many posts have gone to S/C Railway employees in different cate­ and S/T7 gories over Allahabad, Bikaner, Delhi, Ferozepore, Jodhpur and Moradabad THE MINISTER OF STATE IN Divisions of Northern Railway includ­ THE MINISTRY OF LAW, JUSTICE ing workshops, constructions and rail­ AND COMPANY AFFAIRS (SHRI 71 Written Answers APRIL 18. 1978 Written Answers

KAR SINGH YADAV): (a) (i) '«) Total number qfupgradatmtf Posts Number of Posts Filled Group Total S.C. S.T. Group Total S.C. S.T. No. of Post* A filled B a A 38 7 3 C B 73 8 4 D C >75 32 13 D 12 6 , , Cooking Ga« connections lamed Company-wise (ii) Number of Posts Deresetved

Group S.C. S.T. Reason 7161. SHRI VASA NT SATHE: Will the Minister of PETROLEUM, A i i Non-availability CHEMICALS AND FERTILIZERS be of suitable candi* pleased to state what is the total B 3 3 dates from reserv- number of gas cylinders (cooking C i a ed communities. gas) company-wise issued by 31st March, 1978 and the total amount D collected as security deposit?

(b) (i) Total number o f departmental promotion THE MINISTER OF STATE IN Group Total S.C. ‘ S.T. THE MINISTRY OF PETRO­ LEUM. CHEMICALS AND FERTILI­ A *4 ZERS (SHRI JANESHWAR MISH- RA): B 43 5 3 C 92 14 9 The requisite information, as avail­ D 13 5 .. able, is given below:

Name of the Oil Company Total number of gas Total amount collect- cylinders issued to ed as security consumers deposit

i . Indian Oil Corporation Limited About 15 lakhs About Rs. 33 crores (as on 3i-ia-77)

3. Hindustan Petroleum Corporation limited About 6 lakhs About Rs. 5*3 cror't (as on si-ia-77)

S. Bharat Petroleum Corporation Limited About 5* 4 lakhs About Rs. 5* 8 crores (as on 1-3-78)

4. Caltex Oil Refining (India) Limited About 7 thousand About Rs. 90 lakhs (as on 31-3-78) "Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 74

The cylinders issued to Calgas cus- (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) At iomers before take over of the Caltex important stations where separate Oil Refining (India) Limited m 1976 parking space has been provided, are owned by the distributors/con­ parking fee is levied on private cars cessionaries of the company and are parked m the station premises not included m the figures shown above against that company (b) and (c) The amount of levy varies from 50 Paise to Re 1/- per car depending on the importance of Exploration abandoned ia Tanzania the station At Ptttna Jn the park­ by ONGC ing fee for private cars has been fixed at Re 1/- per car 7162 SHRI JANARDHANA POO- JARY Will the Minister 'of PET­ ROLEUM CHEMICALS AND FER­ Shifting of Workshop from Jamnagar TILIZERS be pleased to state to Hapa 7164 SHRI VINODBHAIB SHETH (a) whether ONGC has abandoned Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be its exploration ventures in Tanzania, pleased to state and (a) whether Government have taken (b) if so, the reasons therefor’ a decision to shift the workshop at Jamnagar to Hapa on the Western THE MINISTER OF STATE IN Railway, and THE MINISTRY OF PETROLEUM, CHEMICALS AND FERTILIZERS (b) if so, what amenities would be (SHRI JANESHWAR MISHRA) (a) provided to the staff in the matter of and (b) The ONGC has not taken housing, water and transport etc’ up any exploration venture m Tan zania It has only e drilling cont­ THE MINISTER OF STATE IN ract with the Tanzania Petroleum THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS Development Coiporation which is (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) With still in force the conversion of Viramgam-Okha- Porbundar Metre Gauge Section into Levy on entry of Cars at Railway Broad Gauge Jamnagar will no lon­ Junction ger remain on the M G route and at that time the structures and equip­ 7163 SHRI D N TIWARY Will ment of Jamnagar workshop will be the Minister of RAILWAYS be shifted to Hapa and utilised for re­ pleased to state pairs to Broad Gauge Wagons (a) whether any levy on the entry (b) Hapa is about 5 Kms from of cars made at railway junctions, Jamnagar The Railway staff work­ (b) if so, the amount of the levy, ing in Hapa Metre Gauge Yard re­ side at Jamnagar and come to work and at Hapa by utilising their own or the available public transport facilities (c) if not, why at Patna Junction The staff of Jamnagar workshop will Re 1/- per car is taken as levy when not be required to change their resi­ a car enters the station yard at Patna dence with the shifting of their work­ Junction? place from Jamnagar to Hapa As such there would be no need to pro­ THE MINISTER OF STATE IN vide any special amenities like Hous­ THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS ing, Water and Transport etc 75 Written Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Written Answers 76

Import of Paraffin Wax and Criteria source for the production of paraffin to distribute to States wax m the Country. The production of paraffin wax at this refinery during 7165 SHRI AHMED M PATEL: the calendar years 1976 and 1977 was Will the Minister of PETROLEUM, as under: CHEMICALS AND FERTILIZERS be pleased to state. 1976 . 43,000 tonnes 1977 . 41,780 tonnes (a) the quantity of Paraffin Wax imported during the last two years; (d) The yearly allocations of indi­ genous paraffin wax to the States/ (b) the name of the agency through Union Territories are made on the whom imported, basis of total expected availability in a particular year and the wax uplift- (c) the quantity of Paraffin wax ment perfoimancc of each State manufactured m India during that period; Under the provisions of the Paraffin Wax (Supply, Distribution and Price (d) the criteria adopted to dis­ Fixation) Order, 1972 the ‘Compe­ tribute it to States for the use of tent Authority’ (usually the Director small scale industries; and of Industries) of the State/Union Territory conccrncd is only compe­ tent to make allotment of paraffin (e) the quantity supplied to Gujarat wax to the actual users under his State during that period against their jurisdiction whether falling under requirements’ large, medium or small scale indus­ tries sctors, from withm the wax THE MINISTER OF STATE IN allocations made by this Ministry THE MINISTRY OF PETROLEUM, CHEMICALS AND FERTILIZERS To protect the interests of the (SHRI JANESHWAR MISHRA) * (a) existing small scale units m the mat­ and (b) With a view to supplement­ ters of allotment of indigenous paraf­ ing indigenous availability of paraffin, fin wax, the Development Commis­ wax the Import Policy for 1977*78 sioner (Small Scale Industues), Minis­ was amended to provide for the first try of Industry, has in a circular time, for canalised imports of para­ dated the 5th November, 1977, asked ffin wax by the actual users through the Directors of Industries of all the M/s Balmer Lawne and Co Ltd, States/Union Territories to give pri­ Calcutta, a public Sector undertaking ority to small scale units in the dis­ of this Ministry Firm orders for the tribution of indigenous paraffin wax import of paraffin wax aggregating to and direct the large scale units to about 2,600 tonnes were registered by procure their requirements from im­ the actual users with the Company ported source. durng the year 1977-78 Out of this a quantity of 1718 5 tonnes was actually imported upto the end of March 1978, (e) The upliftment of indigenous M/s Balmer Lawne and Company paraffin wax by wax allottees in have also placed orders for a further Gujarat State during the last two quantity of 1050 tonnes of paraffin years has been as under: Wax based on firm registrations. 1976 ... 796 tonnes (c) The Digboi Refinery of the Assam Oil Company is the main 1977 ... 118 tS tonnes 77 Written Ar sw ert CHA1TRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) W ntten Answers 78

^0 tjwo qwt 5f THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS O T I m (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) No

71 (16 «ft wsfa ftc$ ^rctfnrr (b) Does not arise SPTTTW»T9fV JT?r STTPt aft rTT TT*T f f Bhagalpur Mahadevpur-Bhipnr ( T ) n-o TT^o Steamer Rail Service

M«T5rr T»" 5 ^ ^ ?TTSirr TK 7168 DR RAMJI SINGH Will firw «rm vprvrTfcfr %ftr the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleas­ ed to state ( * ) *tstt fV ? rf ®wt f vfrr & rft *r^r t jtt# *rwrerr *fr *p-«T (d) is it a fact that the private com­ *rrfc H n t trfa rp - it ^ «rnft 1 pany plays also during night and stations its steamer very near the f a r »ft H r r ?n«r t o t t t t $ *n? railway steamer and draw the passen­ sqRWT ^ ipfr £ fir ito rr^o gers to its own site violating rules, ?PT^ TTfRTTT WTT ’Ef^t and in rrt ?rrr t n-o it^-o rnry (e) if so what action Governmert ^ SFTRr & f r *5 ^ ^FTt ^PT falJ^T has taken or proposed to take in the wr* tfr spf st^t *?sr tt irt? sflv matter’ «tftt r fl^r f t $ frar?- THE MINISTER OF STATE IN fw W'ft £ *?1T 5TI5T ^ T 5TW THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS u p w ’Tsnr t jmrsfr * *?V kt r 3rr?r 5 1 (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) Yes (b) Yes Proposal to start Super Fast Trains between Bombay and Surat (c) The ferry Qharges fixed by the Railway Administration include an 7167 SHRI HITENDRA DESAI element of over head expenses such Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be as maintenance of the ghat, keeping pleased to state the channel of the river navigable, costly stand-by equipment etc Hence (a) is there any proposal with Gov­ it is not possible to reduce the char­ ernment for super fast train between ges which will increase the huge loss Bombay and Surat, and already sustained by the Railway Administration in running this ferry. (b> if so, when is it likely to com* into operation? (d) Yes. 79 Written Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Written Answers 80

(e) The Railway Administration that the D.B.K. Railway line of South has taken up the matter with the Eastern Railway is running late daily State Government to shift the private since long; ferry operators to a distance of 3 kilometres from the railway ferry (b) whether passenger trains operat­ ghats. ed diesel engines are scheduled for run with lengthy time schedule;

tw w w 5$ srtrv vritrt (c) whether Railway authorities have taken any step to improve the 7169. arrftar s*mr : link roads from the important Railway Stations like Jey Pore Koro- put etc. to the National High Way 43 frqT f % : for the convenience of the train passengers; and

(sp) WT TT3TWR TT^T t (d) what action has been taken for W 'ficlJ q r w ? ^ "TT ITTSTf^T catering the passengers on those 3*rsp fTTT^T^T WTTfm Wrrif Ttf lengthy line isolated from the towns? ^ft^T 5RT% WT TT f?RT7 f ; THE MINISTER OF STATE IN «ftr THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) The (sr) ,'s(mT ?TTT also not feasible as the section capa­ f w ^TT ■’^T I I W 'W l % fsTRfwr % city is fully committed for moving iron ore traffic for export. f*P* qfrTflyq % whether Government is aware Jaypur and Kirandul stations. At 8* Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 82

present meals are served at Jagdal- (q>) pur. Arrangements for service of meals at Shunvarapukot and Koraput is in band. *>T 5TF5TT?r $ J

(sr) *rfc Proposal to run Trains from Utkal and v n t f f k 3*r*r*rfnrfa?r «rr%*sff Port to Nisamnddln % smr tot |

7171. SHRI SARAT KAR: Will the (tt) ^ st ’tt Pmwt <5zr*r ^nrr ? Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to state: fa fa , arm ctt vwpft vnf (a) whether there is any proposal («ft *nfar *j»ro) : (v) fafa under the consideration of Govern­ ?TTER TX *fH IPrrdisfhT ment for running National trains from Utkal and Puri to Nizamuddin daily; foHrPTBffr ^ 11 f*F5, ’Terr w | (b) whether Government is aware far sr*r vpr f^rr ;3W that a number of pilgrims are facing difficulties without daily service of this train; and *RT|T | I

(^ ) w k (*r) sr*T^t*#r i (c) if so, the steps Government has taken in this regard? » - A _____ -T - WWRT W W Pfm THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE- MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS 7173. Tm 5T^T fW ^t :**r (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) Yes. T*r*Tsft SKTT% $

Introduction of Railway Lin« 1 5 % fw «r st^ tr qft 7174 SHRI GANGADHAR APPA ^TTfw * % 95

(c) whether the Government is aw*re that due to want of railway lines there is no industiidl development m this (I) 1333 TWTT wnm ^ district and ^HFTf . . 20 00 (d) if so steps taken to introduce (II) 1649 t W railway lines m vast Bhir Distuct’ ¥ 'jf'f-TT "ft s^WTT 5 oo THE MINISTER OF STATE TN THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS ( III) 1251 snrw V ^n^T (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) No iffwsnri"srrnf , 1 1> oo lailwav line has been construct pd since independence in Blur district (iv) ^w wfarT ^ar^frv (b) to (d) Government are awa p tffsrr ^rarmT * of the need for construction of new fat* *r*jfsnr w fa fr w v m lines in thp ureas where transport facilities, are lacking or are made sq^ppgr 5 8 5 quate to meet demands of the area, (v ) *TC«TFTT TfSTTW *T> but have not been able to take up the construction of more such lines WRT ^STI T ^ 3T fTT- on account of the constraint of •"Up'qT T farr TTTTr^PT resources *T^ftgfarsrrn- . 18 25 Steps to curb Wagon-Breaking (vi) Jjfaynr 5 30 Activities

(vii) ’Rr^RTvr*pr 8 00 7175 SHRI R P DAS Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased (vm) ^nNrfrzfT^ ^r=r ^h to state what steps the Government ? t r 5rB=Ert * fatT have so far taken to curb the grow­ ing activities of wagon-breaking tn ’rtw p r * fsppqr MY the Ranaghat-Lalgola Section under * F m r i f t * tF^TFrr w Eastern Railway and m other parte ^fhfreFT ^qrsFT p b g 0 of the country7 THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS . 95 00 (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) The steps taken ere — 1 Escorting Goods train* running between Ranaghat and Lalgola by ( * ) *?(T (*r) STVT^^TT I Railway Protection Force; ^5 Wntten Answers CHA2TRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 86

2 Escorting trains carrying valu­ (b) if so, facts thereabout, able consignments/foodgrains by Railway Protection Force, (c) the reaction of the Indian Oxy­ gen Limited regarding such com­ 3 Patrolling yaids vulnerable for plaints and high incidents of thefts by RPF Dog Squads also, (d) the steps taken or proposed to be taken by the Government m this re­ 4 Patrolling important and vul­ gard? nerable yards round-the-clock and guarding by armed Railway Pro­ THE MINISTER OF LAW JUSTICE tection Force personnel, AND COMPANY AFFAIRS (SHRI 5 Staff of Crime Intelligence SHANTI BHUSHAN) (a) The Branches of the Zonal Railways and Monopolies And Restrictive Trade the Cential Crime Bureau of Rail- Practices Commission instituted two v,a's Boajd me deployed to collect restrictive trade piactices inquiries crime intelligent? with a view to against M/s Indian Oxygen Ltd tracking doun cuminals. receivers duung 1976 of stolen property and also to or­ ganise mid (b) The Restrictive Trade Practices inquuies instituted by the MRTP 6 Impo tant Goods-sheds and Commission against Indian Oxygen platforms aie &uarded by Railway Ltd pertain to the following allega Protection Force tions — 7 Close coordination between RTP No 2 of 1976 Railway Protection Force and Go\- einment Railway Police is main­ (a) discriminating m the matter tained to exchange criminal in­ of charging prices for the sale of telligence the said gases manufectuied by it m-as-much as at places where there 8 Escorting of Goods trains is either no competition or less carrying non and steel foodgrains competition higher prices are sugar, oil seeds etc by Railway charged and at places where there Protection Foice aimed personnel is competition lower prices are in vulnerable sections charged and 9 Piopei rivetting and locking 19 (b) charging prices on slab basis, is provided on wagons carrying in such manner as to chaige highet valuable goods, pneet. foi the consumers, whoso off­ take is lesser and charging lesser 10 Seals on vtagons are checked at impoitant yards to localise prices to the consumers whose off­ crime 4 ^ 4 ^ take is comparatively more, and (c) prescribing different number of slabs at different places for Complaints made by MR.TP.C. charging prices and thus further against Indian Oxygen discriminating between consumers of different places 7176 SHRI SAMAR GTJHA* Will the Minister of LAW, JUSTICE AND R T P No 44 of 1976 COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleased to state (a) Insistence on selling a set of accessories with each gas cylinder (a) whether M R TPC . made com­ irrespective of customers’ require­ ments, and plaint against Indian Oxygen limited °n various accounts and on several (b) Inordinate delay m extend­ occasion during last lew yearr, ing repair facilities to the gas 87 W ritten Answers APRIL 18. 1978 Written Answers 88

equi pment thus indirectly com­ pelling the customers to go in for new equipment accompanied with the accessories, etc. 7178. wftw srrni •• w r f t fTCT f t (c) M/s. Endian Oxygen Limited atf 1977-78 % has entered appearance before the Monopolies And Restrictive Trade xftx «rr*r ? Practices Commission and wanted to be heard m both the cases. fc* 3 T m inft («ft ftr*

(d) Necessary steps to support *TCWl): TO 1977-78 % and pursue the complaint before Sran % w 1978 the commission has been taken by the Director of Investigation of the MRTP Commission. 1976-77 % 3T>TR fftr TOFT STrfr f t TTfa 48. 45 Recruitment through U.P.S.C. 9 Rcft «fr f r o % 7177. SHRI MANOHAR LAL: Will *rn> f t rrftr tosi t 2 8 .5 3 irtvs the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleas­ xfrt 15. 85 «ft . ed to state: Creation of a *°st of Member (a) whether about 1068 officers were recruited through the Union Public 7179. SHRI HARI VISHNU KA­ Service Commission by regular modes MATH: Will the Minister of RAIL­ of recruitment to Class I Service as WAYS b»s pleased to state: Assistant Officer 10-15 years back and still their services are not confirmed, (a) whether it is a fact that the and Administrative Reforms Commission had recommended the creation of the (b) if so, what is the reasons for not post of a Member (Electrical Electro­ confirming them in spite of Cabinet nics) on a restructured Railway Board; Secretariat Principles under their C.M. dated 22nd July, 1972 to all the Minis­ (b) whether the Commission had tries? made the recommendation with a view to taking advantage of and fully utiliz­ ing the modern technological activities THE MINISTER OF STATE IN in the field of electrical an1 electronic THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS engineering; (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) and (b). 1089 Temporary Officers (Un­ tc) whether Government have creat­ classified) were recruited through ed only the post of an Adviser Union Public Service Commission i.e. (Electrical) in the Railway Board; neither in Class I nor in Class II against temporary posts with certain- the reasons therefor and for not relaxed conditions during the years fully implementing the recommenda­ 1955 to 1967. 300 officers still remain tion of the Administrative Reforos as Temporary; but 109 will be per­ Commission; manently absorbed in Class I in the very near future leaving a balance (e) whether it i» not a fact that the of only 191 officers as temporary. absence of the Member (Electrical) in These officers are not covered by the the Railway Board has contributed to Cabinet Secretariat O.M. dated 22nd the neglect of Railway electrification July, 1972. during the last few years; 89 Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers go

(f) whether Government do not con. Member (Staff) Personnel mat­ aider it necessary in this electrical elec­ ters, Manpower and Personnel tronic Age to create the post of a Hem. Planning, Organisation and Met­ ber (Electrical Electronic) with lull hods recruitment and training of responsibility for electric traction and Gazetted Officers, Stores allied activities, and (b) The Administrative Reforms (g) if so the reasons therefor? Commission had observed vide para 17, Chapter II of their Report THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS “In recent years certam depart­ (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) The ments have acquired increased im­ Administrative Reforms Commission portance and fiom the point of view had not specifically recommended the of operational efficiency moderni­ creation of the post of a Member sation and sophistication they will (Electrical and Electronics) on the continue to do so We would spe- Railway Board In Recommendation bifically mention Electrical En­ No 6 of the Report on Railways, gineering Signalling and Telecom­ Administrative Reforms Commission munication ” had recommended that “for efficient (c) Yes functioning the Railway Board should be compact in size The number of (d) jt was decided not to make any Membets of the Board excluding the addition to the existing strength of Chairman and the Member Finance the Board in the interest of economy (Financial Commissioner) should not and efficient woikmg noimally exceed six Vide para 17 of Chapter II of their repoit Ad (e) No There is no giound for minzstrative Reforms Commission had such an apprehension m their observations leading to Re­ (f) and (g) The existing organi­ commendation No 6 suggested a dis­ sational set up and anangements aie tribution of work among the Mem­ consideied adequate for effectively bers of an enlarged Board (a Board meeting the Railways' present needs of 7 Members) as under — and responsibilities in the matter of Chaaman General administration electric ti action and allied activities (including Management Develop­ ment) Planning Public Relations Vigilance Organisation Security Vigilance and Research Designs and Standards Organisa­ 7180 SHRI DAYA RAM SHA- tion KYA Will the Minister of RAIL­ WAYS be pleased to state Member (Finance) Finance Bud­ get Efficiency Bureau, Statistical (a) is it a fact that the Vig lance Or­ and Economic Cell ganisations are manned by Railway Officers who are subordinate to the Member (Engineering) Civil G M of that Railway, Engineering Member (Mechanical) Mechani­ (b) is it also a fact that these officers cal ol the vigilance organisation do not work freely and fearlessly due to their Member (Transportation and future being in the hands of the Rail- Commercial) Transportation Tra­ way Officers above them, ffic and Commercial Branches, Rail­ way Safety Cc) the number of cases the v ’gilancp organisation has successfully investi­ Member (Electrical and Elec­ gated and the number of persons tronic) Electrical, Signalling and jfcinished, category-wise including Telecommunications officers, and 91 W ritten Answers APRIL 18, 1878 Written Answers 92

(d) why this organisation is not plac­ (b) No. Ail the officers in the ed directly under the Chief Vigilance Railway, Vigilance Organisations are Commissioner with full protection of independent of other Heads of De­ their Confidential Reports, promotion, partment in regard to Vigilance work. etc. controlled by him, to make it an They have been and are also working effective and purposeful organisation? freely and fearlessly in this regard.

THE MINISTER OP STATE IN THE MINISTRY OP RAILWAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) Vigi­ (c) The number of cases in which lance Organisation, on the Zonal departmental inquiries were held and Railways as part of the Manage­ the number of employees punished ment, functions under the overall in such Vigilance/SPE cases during supervision of the General Manager. the last three years, is as under:

1974*75 >975-76 >976-77

Cases m Employees Cases in Employee* Case* in Employees which depart- punished in which depart* punished in which depart* punished in mental each cases mental such cases mental >uch rases enquiries enquiries enquiries were held were held were held

Gaz. ir,l 36 172 68 209 76 Non. Gaz. 235* 3249 1958 33°) 2 409

(d) Vigilance Organisation, being fT'Tr q-fa ?ft tftT part of the management has to re­ main under the overall supervision (m) of the General Manager of the Zonal *rt srrefaycTT * n fr if *r^r Railways. srfsnp f«TOf *r 1

(sp) far^nrT f a s t ^ n w 1 % f«r®i weft ^ srifV srr^jfT % fasrfar % frpT % ifa p ft fTT *rV pttfrr kjj&jt srrs*r'H r tfwrTsrw *pt sfft f q f^ntrr ftnrr srnfar % faqH % farr m i ferr w r 1 «tt w r f^Ercr 'JWWgT % W§ IW 5 5 W % wft jtow't % ftwtw % srsftfim WW VT SFFTTV % 12 1977 *rt t o * % ut *jrr vrfwn srPrl^r zwH 7182 . «ft ’I’Nt STOW TTO : WT ft, ?ft iw rtw rm fn# vt $ *fSfr ^P^TT *F^T f«f> : 93 Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1800 (SAKA) Written Answers

(qr ) f*TT fRJ the workshop complex Modernisa­ tion Project will extend over a period of 10 years and involve provision «p fiwrrata |,J of— (i) Modem Machinery & Plant (sr) * r r m t f a v * to replace old and antiquat­ *TPT r »tt t fsi^r fTir fim r *nn | ? (m) Better material handling material; T 5rrq»fy t 7184. frw *rnw : wr Modernisation of Railway Workshops «icn% aft r n Or

718 i SHRI M RAM GOPAL RED­ (;p) *rur ^ r t ir *n?r w DY Will the Minister of RAIL­ % *r fw z r ti ‘srrefinr' % i WAYS be pleased to state

( 5sr) % *TT*r to t f (ci) whether there is a proposal with the Government to modernise railway snrre f , w oik shops., and (*r) s r t $ r 4 r w ft ?r T*rt (b) if so, the details thereof m t f m «tt ^ rr sr frrn | m r THE MINISTER 01 STATE IN fT, fTT w n % 7 THE MINISTRY OP RAILWAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) Yes tw tfarmir $ r m («ft fcr* (b) The objective of Workshop sm ra«r ) : Modernisation Project is to improve performance and availability of roll­ («f ) ?rhr, ing stock and reduce cost of its ma­ JfllfW 1 1 nufacture and maintenance. In the past it has not been possible to (sr) w s z m tn: undertake timely replacement of Ma­ chinery and Plant within the limited OTSftpr *Tpp*T % resources at the disposal of Railway* fa q spptt qft fsrefrnrcffcr This has resulted in 70 per cent of 1 1 v zx srrpr wrft ferfrgg I Machinery & Plant in Workshops end repair depots becoming overaged and rundown thus impairing manu­ facturing and maintenance ability of («r) aft ?^n 95 Written Answers APRIL 18 . 1978 Written Answers 96

M on Trains from Jamnui to Fathankot (v ) srcir Sr fkzft vt

7185 . DR. BALDEV PRAKASH: wvipf * gnr t Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to state: (»r) srrt t wr | ? (a) whether Government has receiv­ ed representation to start more trains t w («ft from Jammu to Pathankot; and snrwn) : (*) *r (»r). (b) if so, the actions taken? 3IT T|t % jf a m i TK VS i t I THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS Direct Fast Express Train from Delhi (SHRI SHEO NARAIN); (a) and

(9) if so, the reasons lor the same *rrfinft w & n ftn n ft «fhc 30 nod what steps are being taken to check them? *thtt («r) w r w arm ^R*nrflr THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OP RAILWAYS $ x x ?rnpT irrfinrt % m m (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) In this *rriwT trrft wgOon tt m vrr accident 1 i wagons had derailed *F^Tr ^nFcfT | ? (t<) At about 13 25 hours on 22nd March, 1978 while 14 Up Diesel Goods * x m («ft ftro train was running between Supedi *»TTW ) • ( f ) I 948 WFR- and Dhoraji stations on Forbandar- ^TToft Jetalsar Metre Gauge section of »rrfwwTT *rhr grgrrey % *Nr * Bhavnagar Division of Western Rail­ way, it derailed at Km 145/14-11 No «nf»«rr k r z qffararanr one was killed or injured in this ac­ ^ afta 2 ^TTst *nfyqT *rre sj$t cident % sfhr sntfr *tt^ The inquiry into this accident has «ft, wrfir vtiw, 1978 not yet been completed % vrim r * * *r»re (c) and (d> Yes Out of It derail­ »nftraT*r* % ftror * 9 nrffcrr ments which took place in March 1978, on the Western Railways, 9 *rtr 3^ fairr *r 8 *nfwi, qnfiran re occurred m Gujarat State There was frts *ftr also an accident at an unmanned level % arm crossing m Gujarat State Of the 9 derailments which occurred in Guja­ ^W E T t 1 rat State 4 were due to failure of (*J) *r^«rfa*rfafTf5r »nfgq| vfr *rnr railway staff 3 due to failure of me­ chanical equipment and 2 were acci dental in nature The accident at w *prar te fty ?r*ft unmanned level crossing was due to 3pR9r gfarmvt % T O the failure of road users ?% wrr^rfrr ^ qmrr *r*rr 1 1 Besides counselling the staff to en­ sure that they do not violate the rules Violation of Companies Act by Foreign rind indulge in short cut methods Companies examination of trains and spot checks 7191 SHRI JYOTIRMOY BOSU at Carnage and Wagon depots have Will the Minister of LAW, JUSTICE been intensified Surprise checks are AND COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleas­ also being conducted in coordination ed to state with police authorities to ensure strict compliance with the Motor Vehicle (a) names and particulars of the Rules by the road users foreign companies, branches as well as subsidiaries, who were charged with violation of the provisions of the Com­ mftwrwni tfttn grcqT % wtawsft panies Act during 1977, (b) specific charge against each of the firms; and 7190 *WTfT w m • w (c) action taken against the firms concerned tor this violation*

( v ) 1947 % irifinromr- THE MINISTER OF LAW, JUS­ TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS mtft fatfaa (SHRI SHANTl BHUSHAN)* g ») 512 L S -4 99 Wntten Answers APRIL 18. 1978 Wntten Answers 100

to (c) The information is being col­ Northern Railway especially in Morada* lected and will be laid on the Table bad Division, and of the House (b) the action taken against them? Corruption Cases THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS 7192 SHRI RAJENDRA KUMAR SHARMA Will the Minister of (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) The number of vigilance cases pending on RAILWAYS be pleaded to state the Northern Railway and in parti­ (a) the number and nature of corrup. cular on the Moradabad Division as lion cases pending at present on the on Jlst March, 1978 is given below

Northern Railway Moradabad (all divisions includ Ih vision mg Moradabad\ Dr[vision) Gazetted Non Gazettrd Non Gaz Gaz

M ijor Penalty Proceedings 18 >44 i 1 8

Minor Prndll> Proceedings lO >45 ai

Pros t ltioa m Courts 3 3

3‘ 315 * ♦»

(b) Disciplinary proceedings are recruited in 1966 have not been given in progress in all these cases and ac­ any percentage of higher Grade Posts tion as called for will be taken on so far, ftnalisation of the proceedings Cons* tant efforts are being made for their (c) is it because that it is a tempos quick flnalisation ary organisation, or

(d) is it because this organisation is financed by Ministry of Health and Higher Grade Posts to Port Graduate Family Welfare, Extension Health Educators (e) if the answer to (cj ind \d) be in the affirmative, is there any embargo 719 i DR BIJOY MONDAL Will to give further grades to the staff of the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleas* temporary status and «d to state (f) whether the Ministry ever made (a) whether Doctors with Diploma proposals to the Ministry of Health have been promoted from clas3 III and Family Welfare for additional st rvice to class I between 1966—73 and funds and got refusal? Health Inspectors given two higher grade scales of Rs 550—750 and THE MINISTER OF STATE IN Rs. 700—900 with enhanced ferceniage THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS just two years before, (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) to (f) Information is being collected and (b) if so, the reason for which Post will be laid on the Table of the Graduate extension/Health Educators Sabha 100 102 101 Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answe?'s especially in M01'ada- Unlicenced Producers of Lubricants been conducting surprise checks on and Greases their retail outlets/ agents with a view to ensuring that there are no taken against them? 7194. SHRI F AQUIR ALl ANSARI: malpractices in distribution of lubri- Will the Minister of PETROLEUM, cants through their outlets. The oil :R OF STATE IN CHEMICALS AND FERTILIZERS companies have also been asked to OF RAILWAYS be pleased to state: increasingly take up direct sales to ARAIN): (a) The all the major consumers. Some of ice cases pending on (a) the number of unlicenced pro. the further steps being contemplated ailway and in part i- ducers of lubricants and greases in the with the objective of minimising the radabad Division as country; circulation of spurious lubricants are 978, is given below: (b) whether it has been established set out below. that the sub-standard and spurious pro. (i) Government propose to make ~y Moradabad •• ducts marketed by these producers are Division ....•• use of the ISI mark manda- :1- playing havoc with the sophisticated tory for all manufacturers of o' machinery and equipment; and .~ automotive oils, industrial (C) the firm step taken by Govern- oils and greases. The details 1- Gazetted Non- z. Gaz. ment to curb the activities of these un- in this regard are being licensed producers of lubricants and worked out in consultation 18 with the ISI and other con- 4: 2 greases? cerned organisations. 21 ~5 THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF PETROLEUM (ii) stricter control has been 2 :6 AND CHEMICALS AND FERTILI- prescribed over allocation of .p ZERS (SHRI JANESHWAR ;M1SH- feedstocks for the purpose of IS 2 RA): (a) The information is not ilube manufacture. The idea available with the Government. is to ensure proper accountal ; have not been given of feedstock releases as re- )1 higher Grade Posts (b) and (c). Substandard and spuri- lated to the output of the ous lubricants if used in sophisticated end-product. machinery and equipment will cause (iii) The oil companies have been se that it is a tempor. damage but the extent to Which this is taking place is not known. How- asked to eliminate intennedi· . or , ..• ' ever, to prevent this and ensure pro- aries and prevent multi plica- per quality of the lubricants the cation of agencies engaged in ise this organisation is following steps are taken/ contem- lube distribution so as not to .nistry of Health and plated. weaken effective control by the oil companies over their 2. The State Governments/U.T. operations. wer to (c) and (d) be Administrations have been advised ~,is there any embargo (iv) The oil companies have heen to invoke the powers available witli grades to the staff 01 asked to launch a major them under the Indian Penal Code publicity drive to bring ab- s; and and deal severely with adulterators out greater consumer aware- of petroleum products. he Ministry ever made ness and involvement. e Ministry of Health 3. Apart from initiating ronow-uc elfare fOT additional (v) SpecificalJ.y in regard to the action on the measures suggested by activity of re-refining of used :efusal? an expert panel set up by the Gov- lubricants which is potential- ernment to look into the problem of ly a major source for adulte- rER OF STATE IN adulteration/misuSie of lubricants ration of lubricants decislOns RoY OF RAILWAYS Government have prescribed a scheme have recently been taken to ~ARAIN): (a) to (f). of discipline in regard to distribution introduce a scheme for volun- being collected and of lubricants which is required to be tary registration of re-refiners on the 'I'able '01 the implemented:,y all the major oil who fulfil the basic quality companies. The oil companies have 103 W ritten Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Written Answers

criteria and possess the re* utilised for industrial purposes and quisdte facilities including in- the remaining 30 per cent is used for process quality controls. manufacturing potable liquors.

4. An Industry Group is presently (b) Government are encouraging engaged in the task of evaluating in the setting up of further alcohol based depth the problems in this field in­ industries. cluding the specific aspects of the ade­ (c) The distillery capacily should quacy of the existing laws for curbing match the availability of molasses. the activities of manufacturers of spu­ The distilleries are established within rious lubricants. They have been ask­ an economic distance from the sugar ed to come up to the Ministry with factoring. definite and concrete suggestions for implementation. Demand for New Division with H Q. at Ronrkela Availability of Molasses and its 7196 SHRI GANANATH PRA- Utilisation DHAN Will the Minister oI RAIL­ 7195. DR. VASANT KUMAR PAN­ WAYS be pleased to stale DIT: Will the Minister of PETRO­ (a) whether the Gov^ri'ment have LEUM, CHEMICALS AND FERTILI­ received any demand to establish a ZERS be pleased to state* new Division with Head Quarters at (a) what is the current availability Rourkela by reorganising the existing Bilaspur, Chakradharpur, Waltoir, and of molasses in the country and how Khurda Road Division in a rational much of it is utilised by ( 1) Industries manner to achieve optimum operation­ manufacturing wines and liquors ( 2) Industrial alcohol and (3) by paints, al efficiency; and spirit varnish and other companies; (b) if so, the action taken thereon and the probable period of its imple­ (b) what are the plans of utilising molasses production with the progres­ mentation? sive implementation of Prohibition THE MINISTER OF STATE IN policy by the Government; and THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (c) how many new licences would (SHRI SHEO NARAIN)- (a) Yes. be given for producing Industrial Al­ (b) The demand was carefully con­ cohol and whether such industries sidered but was not found acceptable would be set up in rural areas near on administrative, operational and sugarcane producing zones? economic grounds THE MINISTER OF STATE IN Representation for Howrah Coach upto THE MINISTRY OF PETROLEUM Gandhidham AND CHEMICALS AND FERTILI­ ZERS (SHRI JANESHWAR MISH­ 7197 SHRI ANANT DAVE: Will RA); (a) The current availability of the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleas­ molasses in the country is of the ed to state; order of approximately 22 lakh tonnes (a) whether the people of Kutch and per annum. About one lakh tonnes rfl«tf»ftger association are writing to of molasses is utilised for cattle feed Railway authority for the extension of and fodder and other miscellaneous Howrah Coach upto Gandhidham uses like tobacco curing. The remain­ which at present comes up to Viram- ing quantity of molasses is used In gam. the distilleries for the production of ethyl alcohol (rectified spirit). About (b) why this Howrah Bogle is not 70 per

(c) if not, the reasons thereof? entrance of D.S’a. Office, Madras as a protect against THE MINISTER OP STATE IN delay in clearance of over­ THE MINISTRY OP RAILWAYS time bills in the Divisional (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) Yes. Accounts Office. (b) and (c) At present two through een allotted for different stations m- wages tluding a quota of 4 and 2 sleeper berths for Gandhidham and Bhuj (t) The payments as admissible m irea respectively As the quota for Ihe above cases have been arranged stations upto Viramgam and stations ? ia Viramgam is fairly high the ex­ Instructions to the Railways al­ tension of the through coaches upto ready exist to ensure that the work Gandhidham will inconvenience the m regard to timely payment of an­ present users of Saurashtra region nual increments, payment of overtime ind running allowances to staf* fixa­ Stoppage of Work tion of pay and payment of ariears 7198 SHRI SAMAR MUKHER- in regard to the recommendation of the Third Pay Commission etc etc JEE Will the Minister of RAIL­ is kept current without any arrears WAYS be pleased to state being accumulated (a) whether there have been any stoppages ot work by railway woikers Railway Administrations have fur­

(d) the steps Government propose to Concentration of Economic Power take in this regard? 7200. SHRI CHITTA BASU: Will THE MINISTER OF LAW JUS­ the Minister of LAW, JUSTICE AND TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleased to (SHRI SHANTl BHUSHAN). (a) refer to the reply given to Starred and (b). As was stated in reply to Question No. 388 on 21st March, 1978 Lok Sabha Unstarred Question No. regarding turn over and profits of In­ 3791 answered on 13 th December, dustrial Houses and state; 1977, under scheme cf arrangement (a) whether there has been further sanctioned by the Delhi High Court, concentration of economic power in the which was effective from 22nd Feb­ hands of lew during these years; and ruary 1970, M/s. Globe Motors Limi­ ted was required to repay its credi­ (b) if so, the particular steps taken tors (including depositors) in six ins­ to assess and reverse this trend? talments. the last instalment being due by 22nd March, 1974. Payments THE MINISTER OF LAW, JUS­ were made up to fourth instalment TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS and, as was stated in reply to Lok (SHRI SHANTl BHUSHAN); (a) Sabha Unstarred Question No. 7909 The reply to Star;ed Question No answered on 29th April, 1975 the 388 of 21st March, 1978 gives infor­ Court had granted extension up lo mation about the turn-over and pro­ 31st July, 1975 for payment of the fits of 45 Industrial Houses. The data fifth instalment and the sixth instal­ reveals that there has been an in­ ment was payable up to a period of crease in turn-over and jrofits in two years from the completion of most of these cases and to that ex­ payment of the fifth instalment. tent there has been an increase in the economic powu- of these Houses As was indicated in reply to Lok (b) Paragraphs 18 and 19 of Gov­ Sabha Unstarred Question No. 3791 ernment’s Statement on Industrial answerd on 13th December, 1977, the Policy of 23rd December, 1977 detail company has not filed with the Re­ the new restrictions to be placed in gistrar of Companies, Delhi any re­ the future expansion of Large Houses turn of deposits for the periods ended Relevant extracts [Placed in Library. on 31st March. 1975, 31it March 1976 See No. LT-2131/78]. and 31st March, 1977. The winding up of the company was ordered by the Delhi High Court on 15th April Fees paid by Porter 1977. The company did not file with the Official Liquidator, Delhi the 7201. SHRI B. C. KAMBLE: Will statement of affairs. The Government the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleas­ is, therefore, not aware of the latest ed to state; position regarding payment of depo­ sits by the company. A criminal case (a) the different fees including has been filed by the Official Liqui­ licence fee, each railway porter, and dator, Delhi against the ex-directors head of the porters (Mukadam) is for non-filing of statement of affairs. required to pay to the (i) railwa\ authority, (ii) railway union either (c) and (d). Winding up proceed monthly or annually in Central, ing-s of the company are conducted Western, Southern and Eastern Rail­ under the directions of the High ways; and Court and hence further action will he taken by the Official Liquidator in (b) whether in view of the condi­ this regard in accordance with the tions under which the railway porters directions issued by the High Court labour, Government propose to reduce XQ9 Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers no the fees; and grant the facility of vnprfinfhr «? % frtfto- ^ providing more pieces of red-uniforms to the railway porters? t o tot«tt i vifaKtfxftm *£irct % #*T f d 14 20ft»olfto 11 ir? THE MINISTER OF STATE q fn ^ r SRT ifsft tnftr lrfa?r IN THE MINISTRY OF RAIL­ WAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) 1 1 grrrr fr w ra n : q v o t t The licence fee paid by the licensed m * irhre | %ftx ^ rtt ?wt

For ash handling lumpsum payments ing, payments axe being made for the are being made on Lucknow Division quantity picked and delivered. while in Allahabad Division, lump­ sum payments are being made in some (b) The lumpsum payments being sheds and in others payments are be­ made monthly for handling of ashes in ing made on the basis of actual quan­ the sheds of Allahabad and Lucknow tity of ash handled. For cinder pick­ Divisions are as follow#:—

Allahabad Division Lucknow Division

Shed Amount Shed A mount Rs. R». Allahabad Departmental Lucknow 5975 *00 1825-00 Tundla 7001•oo Faizabac! 1000*00 Stiikohabad . 1871*00 Pratapgarh 950*00 Aligarh Jn. . 1i o o - o o Varanasi 600*00 Etawah NIL Rai Barrily

Kanpur 2191*00 Sultanpur >130*00 850*00 Kanpur NIL Jaunpur 600*00 (GMCtfuhi) Prayag Chunar 701*00 (c) The Senior Divisional Mechani­ broad gauge line beyond Gauhati cal Engineer is empowered to award upto Tinsukia can be considered after contracts on the recommendation of the broad gauge link is establishd up­ the Tender Committee. to Gauhati. The approximate cost of the proposed gauge conversion o#

7204. SHRI AHMED HUSSAIN: 7205. SHRI G. BHUVARAHAN: Will Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be the Minister of PETROLEUM AND pleased to state: CHEMICALS AND FERTILIZERS be (a) the Government’s plans on pleased to state: providing/extending Broad Gauge (b) whether it is a fact that Gov­ line from Gauhati to Teensukia in the ernment of India have given licence near future; and to start caustic soda factory at Madras; (b) what is the financial aspect in­ (b) when was the licence given; volved, and whether any survey etc. and have been finalised/required to be finalised; and (c) the reasons for not starting the factory so far?

Industrial Licence No. C. IL. 486(75) (b) As mentioned in the Statement dated 24-12-75 was issued to M/s. Ko- Shri R. R. Jaipuria the Managing Di­ thari (Madras) Ltd., for setting up a rector of Swadeshi Cotton Mills has new unit in the State of Tamil Nadu made certain complaints. It is not for the manufacture of caustic soda, known whether he has instigated others liquid chlorine and hydrochloric acid to make complaints against Swadeshi with the following capacities:— Polytex Limited.

(i) Caustic Soda . jj.oou tonnn* j>er yeai (c) The complaints are being look­ ed into, as mentioned in reply to (ii) Liquid Chlorine 20,000 tonnes per vcar unstarred question No 2688 of 14th (lii) Hydrochloru At id 24,750 tonnes per veat March, 1978. Statement (c) Caustic Soda is a long gestation industry. A capital goods import li­ 1 Shn V N Ahuja cence for Import of equipment and machinery was granted to the firm on 2 Shri Balknshna Tandon 31-3-76 to CCI&E. The firm is m the 3. Shri Shashi Kumar Malhotra final stages of construction of civil works and erection of machinery etc 4 Shri Ved Prakash Agarwal It is estimated that this unit will go 5 Shn Murhdhar Gupta into production during 1979. 6 Shri Raja Ram Jaipuria Complaints regarding Swadeshi Poly, 7 Shri Rajendna Kumar Mahesh- tex Limited wari 7206. SHRI MOHAN LAL PIPIL- 8 Shri B B Narula Will the Minister of LAW, JUSTICE 9 Shri Gopal Chand Mittal AND COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleas­ 10 Shn Kunj Behari Lai ed to refer to the reply given to Un- 11 Shri Swadeshi Cotton Mill; starred Question No. 2688 on 14th March, 1978 regarding coplaints of Company Limited. mismanagement in Swadeshi Polvttv 12 Shri G. P. Khaitan Limited and state: 13. Shn S. D Vengurleskar (a) the name or names of persons/ 14 Staff of Swadeshi Polytex (un­ parties said to have made the com­ signed). plaints against Swadeshi Polytex Railway Strike hi 1974 limited referred in part (a) and (b) thereof; 7207. SHRI DAYA RAM SHAKY A: Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be (b) whether he is aware that the pleased to state: complaints are being made at the instance of the present Managing (a) whether it is a fact that All Director of Swadeshi Cotton Mills India Railway employees confedeia- Company Limited who is out to dis­ tion fought shoulder to shoulder in turb efficient working of Swadeshi strike 1974 as constituent of NCC.RS. Polytex Limited; and (b) the present Government are also (c) if so, action Government pro­ holding consultation with all Union* pose to take in the matter? but ignoring confederation at the ad­ vice of A I.R.F; THE MINISTER OF LAW, JUS­ (c) what steps the present Govern­ TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS ment are taking to give proper repre­ (SHRI SHANTl BHUSHAN): (a) sentation to all categories as both Fed­ A statement is attached. erations have totally failed to do so; 115 W ritten Answers APRIL 18. 1978 Written Answers

Id) whether Government are aware (a) whether it is a fact that the of the fact that a few office bearers are Federation of Indian Chambers ti holding posts of A.I.R.F. and N.F.I.R. Commerce and Industry has urged for the last 25 years and their elec­ Government to modify the concept of tions are not held democratically; and 'Monopoly Commission’; and (e) if so, the Government’s action (b) if so, what are the details there. to make the Unions democratic? of and Government’s reaction there­ to? TIIE MINISTER OF STATE m THE MINISTRY OF RAII- THE MINISTER OF LAW, JUS­ UTAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN)- (a) TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS The Confederation or its constituents (SHRI SHANTl BHUSHAN): (a) had seived notice of strike on the and (b). The Federation of Indian Railways. Chambers of Commerce and Indus­ try, New Delhi, in its Memorandum (b) In pursuance of the statement made by the Minister tor Railways ui to the Committee appointed by the Government under the Chairmanship the Parliament that he would be hav­ of Mr. Justice Rajinder Sachar, has ing discussions with Labour Organi­ submitted that Chapter III of the sations on the problem of Railway Monopolies and Restrictive Trade Pra­ employees, informal discussions were ctices Act, 1969, should be deleted. It held with the two ipcogmscd Federa­ has further suggested that the Mono­ tion';. i'tz . the All India Railwaymens poly Commission should deal only F- deration and the National Federa­ with matters relating to restrictive tion of Indian Railwaymen and also trade practices. The Government is wrth certain Members of Parliament awaiting the report of the said Com­ connected with Railway Labour along mittee which is expected to be sub­ with trade Unionists who accompani­ mitted to the Government by the 30th ed them, in order to explore what June, 1978 and would thereafter for­ concrete measures could be taken to­ mulate Its views after studying the re­ wards fostering a proper industrial commendations made therein. relations climate on the Railways «c) Both the recognised Federations Twgfrtnmifl *Ni t o * vt have been found to sponsor the cases * f t tot if towt of many categories of staff Further, the policy of the Government is to 7209. g** vf : *rr take due note of all grievances and demands of railway employees whe­ mar sr%Jr ir m rnnw ther they are represented by recognis­ % 1078% VcTTTifafr ed or unrecognised Unions/Federa­ sro* won io5 7 % wft % tion*: # ftt far • (d) and (e) These relate to inter­ nal affairs of the bodies. No dispute ( * ) TT*rfT-snrar#t t o t regarding the office bearers of these two organisations ha«* come to no­ tice. m rp R ftwr srrfcrr wffar vr ^ V* $ y n 11 Views of F1CCI on the Concept of («sr) f t i ihr t o t Monopoly Commission wft t o t % st«t art?* Ir tfffinr 7208. SHRI SHYAM SUNDER *7TJf % ^ to $tt «nr% GUPTA- Will the Minister of LAW, JUSTICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS wrcnr t w t t o t faw% be pleased to state: * t «pt* v * t o * f w arr^rr i 117 Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers n 8

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fcr *frrt*w if tww *W («ft fir* (w) ^ qtiff *FT 5PP mxron) : (w:) 7:rzn^-gwft ®tfV W>r f-JTTT ^TT^5TT ? vfnpr «Pt «n?t ctt^t it «pt ®Fnr ?fare?fT tft ^3Hcrr qr M t wrwr | fcr»fcTO*r* TTwriWy vftx f ?r ^rnr ^ 9^ forcr Hum*..) • (^>) ?r (?rj. ir «T*fV 5T^t qFfrr «TT yaRIT I ^r T ft | *ftr ?hrt q^?r q r tst it (^r) ^^T-*ftforr ®t£T ^rnpr srnpfV 1 *p> gfr ?rr^r ir s r ^ % ^ ir srrefarr

«?*r v rtrrt ?rafer«r ®ft ?nr v|*nnvn fr v i f ?r t $rr ?ft% anr?rr 11 *T*$r«r ^ ^rr *hf flwpsft ftwn ntart tft*t srfa- faff £ vt srhr-qsrmr ft 5rr%

TT ^ STHTR ’ifoRPT % *T 7211. «ft OT fa f *nf q?*r : w faofa fm r * n w 1 * w w iftr sswtv trPt *rf *“ (it) srk («r) . -ranfsraR-ftnwfr vt ftt ^ <% : ^ TOT? it nrft | I wnrfiwT ^T («F) m 23 ^5Trf, 1977 Vt sret mvt sitt *p=rr arreft % ftit JT^rrar eriPoi^ 5t*tt g^fhr *ri3^r ^TW^TTT SrTt?T ft* ^ I JlWlfad 5fTf»T w < w »y w k »j3,7:rcr fsm ?r q>tr*r, 225 fwtjffcT Hsfr i n t ST>T S*T TT 5T^r?WRr % # «n^rf ^ fT t 32 ZtXTS *q$ 5THRT « I ^T5nrr^?rk ^r% ^nf^T qr f«RR ^msrrr farf?r ir ggrR ft% qr TTTsst | f «ft «rV7 ^ % Prat ??rr?Ff ir *r*ft srrFff % ?rnff % ^ r^sr v[r& s r m t o t t f?nrf®r % shpt *tt f^errT f*RT 3rr*r*rr 1 sr^?r fw w «rr; q frw % *T^T$nFyv *f>T efhlFVT (sr) *rfc$r,rft ?n^n:^t frt t i n srm srrR ¥t (v) wr qfVw csr', *wr£ % *sf |

counts) is a slection post. Their seni­ (* ) var irhff Vt ^ftVTT ority is maintained on whole-Rail- JTft fa«r tfr wmrsmft «ftr WAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a; srmt «ftr vtosfht tw t* *rr to (c) Information is being collected ®FT% % f*T«t f*T^PT ff^TT 3TPT I and will be laid on the Table of the House. trsyrrr, ^^rrnr flRfsrwr ^ t smpi rm*r % *rs*rw qft vm wtt w tTT trforfa »rf5* W\ iff faTff^ fV-f^ fTTfTTT spt Board of Directors of Darjeeling Plantation Industries Limited 4*rfcr i978«prsrFT?mrf % 1 qft fafa*r f*T

(d ) who are the principal share- Statement holders and percentage and value of shares held by each of them; and (i) Following is the composition of the Board of Directors of M/s Dar­ (e) whether it is alleged that the jeeling Plantation Industries Limited: Company has committed large nura- bei of irregularities in contravention Name of the Companies Act, 1956 if so, the (1) Shri Frank Arthur Ferrow. facts thereof and action taken there­ on? (2) Shri Sriram Kapur. THE MINISTER OF LAW, JUS­ (3) Shri Golam Momen. TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS (SHRI SHANTl BHUSHAN): (a) (ii) The main objects of the com­ A statement is attached pany, inter alia include acquisi­ tion, take over and development of (b) and (c) Hie company was pro­ the business and undertaking in India moted and formed to acquire the of the Darjeeling Company Limited, a bus’ness and undertaking in India, of company incorporated under the Eng­ “The Darjeeling Company Limited” , lish Companies Act, having its regis­ U K The company was registered tered office at London and its Head with the Registrar of Companies. Office for India at 81, Chownnghee Calcutta, on 24-12-1976 No informa­ Road, Calcutta and all the property tion about investments m the com­ and assets and all the debts and lia­ pany is available as the company has bilities, contracts and engagements of net filed any Balance Sheet so far. The the said business, and undertaking in fir't Balance Sheet of the company is India. The mam objects which will due to be filed with the Registrar of be pursued by the company as given Companies, Calcutta by June, 1978 in its Memorandum of Association further include the business of*— (d) The company has not filed anv Return of Allotment since its incor­ “Planters, farmers, growers and poration It has also not filed any dealers of tea. coffee and other pro­ Annual Return Its first annual re­ duce and to manufacture and deal turn is not yet due for filing Hence all kinds of machinery, implements no information is available about requisites, etc. of planters and farm­ shareholders and shares held How­ ers.” ever the following persons subscribed to the Memorandum of Association of the company and have each taken one equity share of the value of Rs 10/- Composition of Board of Directors of A SC Engineers and Consultants (1) Shri Siram Kapur Limited (2) Shn N. A Raj an 7215 SHRI SUKHDEO PRASAD (3) Shri J Kapur. VERMA: Will the Minister of LAW. JUSTICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS (4) Shri P. Subramaniam. be pleased to state:

(5) Shri S. N. Dhawan. (a) the composition of the Board of Directors of the ASC Engineers and (6) Shri P. K. Pandey. Consultants Limited, Calcutta;

(7) Shri R. Menon. (b) full particulars of the principal shareholders and the value of each (e ) No Buch allegations have been individuals or firms shares and. per­ received. centage thereof; Written Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Written Answers 124

(c) whether it has been alleged made upto 2nd May, 1977 is as under: that the Company management have 1 SHRI B. C. MITTAL committed large number of irregula­ rities contravening the provisions of 2 SHRI M. L MITTAL the Companies Act, 1956, and 3 SHlU R K. CHOUDHURY 4 SHRI M SUDARSANAM (d) if so, the facts thereof and 5 SHRI L N. MITTAL action taken thereon? 6 SHRI M GOENKA

THE MINISTER OF LAW, JUS­ SHRI K. K DAMANI was appointed TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS subsequently as per Form 32 filed on (SHRI SHANTl BHUSHAN) (a) 17-5-1977 as additional Ducctor The composition of Board of Directors of M/s A S C Engineers and Consul­

Number of equity Name of the Shareholder shares Puct ntage ofR * io 1. earh hf Id

1. M/s Giovanola Bmny Ltd. A i5»»50 49 30% 2. M/s. Kanoria Plasto-Ghera Private Limited . 1 ,ao,ooo 21 50% 3 Shn S K. R ateria ...... 40,000 9 ' 17% 4. Shn P K Mittal . . 21,000 4 8* 0 5. Sh nV .K Mittal . . 20 050 4 59 % 6 Shn S.K Kanoria . 20,000 4 58 % 4,36,900

(c) No, Sir, No complaint has been (sr) w *r urcrm tftr received in this Department ft wV nftiPFryc (d) Does not arise *rr *rr% erRt ^T*rrfw f ,

ffarr ^r«r r »r % f?r«w twr (*r) w r mwrr m I w r sfrtt vrsv ^ yfeqryfr %% stst it*? qj nr*? w^tr ?rr | «sftr 7216. irrnsr : w r ^ fn-, ?rr 3r

tftoPrT # *rtar % firm ^ fcftffro* * r m ib ft («ftfiw * m rm < rr$ ; m rm ) : (*f) «rt w ttc t i t 125 Written Answers CHATTRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 126

u re w w r f t y f i f y ifarr*£»PT THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF RAIL­ Ir fora fro 597/ 11-12 qr WAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) vdwnr m r z 'r^r % $■ w fet fc, and (b). The Government of Orissa have suggested opening of a branch % wnlt^r 'nr jpt *pf?f ^ i officc of the Railway Service Commis­ sion Calcutta at Bhubaneshwar or («■) 3ft fT 1 Cuttack The matter is being examin­ ed. (*r) *flr (*r). 1

Proposal to run a Passenger train Coach Repairing Factory at Manche- shwar between Palasa and Balasore

7217. SHRI PABITRA MOHAN 7219 SHRI PABITRA MOHAN PRADHAN: Will the Minister of PRADHAN- Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to state’ RAILWAYS be pleased to state whe­ ther the Railway Department have re­ (•) whether the Department have ceived any proposal from the people any scheme to establish a coach re­ for running any passenger train in pairing factory at Mancheshwar near between Palasa and Balasore in view Bhubaneshwar; and of the fact that the travelling people (b) if so, the progress made so far are put to difficulty in travelling m for the purpose? this area because of absence of any through passenger train in this portion THE MINISTER OF STATE of the line? IN THE MINISTRY OF RAIL­ WAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN)- (a) THE MINISTER OF STATE Ye* IN THE MINISTRY OF RAIL­ WAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (b) The work for construction of Introduction of a passenger train this Coach Repair Workshop at Mati- between Balasore and Palasa is at pre­ chesbwar is expected to commence sent, not operationally feassible for shortly. A provision of Rs. 42.91 lakhs want of spare line capacity on certain ha9 been made in the Budget for 1978- sections enroute and lack of requisite 79 for this work. The Project Report terminal facilities at Balasore and and Estimate received from the South- Palasa. Apart from 3 pairs of Mail/ Eastern Railway for this work are at Express trains stopping both at Bala­ present under examination sore and Palasa, connected services are also available between these points Railway Service Commission at with a change at Khurda Road. Cuttack Railway concession to Physically 7218. SHRI PABITRA MOHAN handicapped PRADHAN: Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to state: 7220. SHRI R. K MHALGI Will (a) whether the Department is the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleas­ proposing to open a branch of the ed to state: Railway Service Commission, Eastern Zone either at Cuttack or Bhubanesh~ (a) whether it is a fact that the war or Khurdha Road just as branch Government have received a repre­ offices have been opened at Ranchi sentation dated 30th October, 1977 and Dhanbad; and from ladies of Thana (Maharashtra) in regard to railway concessions to fb) if not, why? physically handicapped students; and 12? written Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Written Answers

(b ) if ao, what action Government have taken or propose to take In near future? 7222. WTW ! WT

THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF RAIL­ WAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) and (b). No representation as such (ap) m i was received from ladies of Thana. XRT^TR: *PT TO* fsRT *TOT | J However, representations were receiv­ ed fiom the Guardian Association and (g -) srr, eft 3*8% % the Principal, Vikas High School for Beaf Students, Dadar. Bombay. On consideration, it was decided that in tfr tfw r jtht wr £sft rnr*mr the case of physically handicapped stu­ wrcfor fa^rfVgff tt fa* dents. one escort should be allowed for every 5 such students instead of 15 a«. ? provided in the extant rules. The other two demands of the Association qftfffCW WT T P R 4 ft that deaf students under 12 years of x to m S x m H i age should be allowed to travel free on the authority of the attendant’s con­ fw ) : (*)«rtr (*). 3fy, *r£l V f cessional ticket and the limit of es­ q%rm m r& rr F fW % corts in the case of deaf students bet­ it5»t *Fr jpft f«r^r

7223. SHRI BATESHWAR HEM- Grievances of Car Attendants RAM: Will the Minister of RAIL­ WAYS be pleased to state: 7221 SHRI R K MHALGI: Will the (a) names of genuine and registered Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to Labour Co-operative Societies of state: actual workers holding Coal Handling, Cinder Picking and Ash Handling, (a) whether it is a fact that Divi­ etc. contracts on Allahabad and Luck­ sional Superintendent of Central now Divisions of Northern Railway Railway, Bombay has received a together with details of contracts held representation dated the 4th October, by them during the last three years; J076 regarding the grievances of Car (b) details of piece-rates fixed E? Attendants of the Bombay Division; the Railway Administration and paid and to Labour Co-operative Societies for different items of schedule together (b) if so. what action has been with average quantum of traffic dealt *c,ken and when? with monthly at each individual shed on Allahabad and Lucknow Divisions THE MINISTER OF STATE separately; IN THE MINISTRY OF RAIL­ (c) whether higher rates have been WAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) fixed on Allahabad Division for doing NO. coal handling work during atf” (b) Does not arise. hours together with details tmerew; 129 Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 130

(d) whether it is a fact that rates snr s«t 5ppTf?nft ^ trtefrfw paid to the Labour Co-operatives on Allahabad Division are lower than srf?TG5HT*r , the rates paid on Lucknow Division; and (w ) m v t ^ amnT (e) if so steps proposed to remedy ^ % * r q w r the situation to avoid dissatisfaction *ft f«nrr f iftr # sw t *n3r *wr^ amongst the labour force? fr, ?fr 5prrftwt % fk^s w t vphrrfi ^ »r# t ? THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF RAIL­ fafa, 5*rw *ftr WAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) A statement as Annexure ‘A* is laid («ft Aifar tyro) : (*») w m ^rrr on the Table of the House sr^sr ff^ r % o «r?n% qft irr fo w tstt vvnvFrsRTrr ^fft ?r W»n% % ^TSSTT'T^RT VPT’TT^f / (*r)

fare*

m |ft»r w f t fa frc? *tw1ct w ft fafasi vt 31 -3 -7 7 ?TV JT^ ?T?R

Vf «m fN t jttt fsnrr w r w t w %rh ifartftar ^ rm m t ir ^ 1% fafcfr % stfkt s f p st^t «nft «f> w^fvRr wcsi f m t o —

^ q [ 5f r ^ T

W o * r n r ^ J 1- 3 - 5 2 3 1 - 3 - 7 7 TTfVT fw fi %afft ^0

m r t e r ^0 t o 3 1 - 3 - 7 7 v v r f o t f t %

* (sr«r*r vt^^t t t ■rnr frn rir f*Tt*T

3 *nrm) (^w a ) s T f r s r f % 5n

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8

1. 3WT sr^fr 23-2-51 80,000 16,00,000 f® ^ W(WI SfofT ff%*r fsrftr^s i. ^fhrerr ^hrRnr f a f a s s - 10, 51,198

2 cfv *jfo TO f*TW 1,12,787 fafiTJS

3 farar 11,263

4. TvTPF*- f*!lfM*T ^q?f|-W^5r 7,71,840

5 1$f ^ R itM^RTT §f*rsn[*r stt?* 2 ,9 4 ,1 8 1 farfires 4,00,000

e. iirwfftfvnr FrtvT

faro ^ 50,000

8. fapwftar

8. q w rti r fs r fa t* 60,150

9 cmferr fafaT* 40,105

10. $fWP>IT HTVifrsnT 50,000

rfwrw shrc 5FR f r o fa fa g g (1 2 21% ) 2,506

5^ ffasPTT VHTT favff ( 5 5% ) 34,471

3Hfl3TgTT

fa o 2, 50,000

fc %|S?TR m * * f«lf«l'dV 1, 75,438

tfaT 36, 15,667

( 5*r^ s r t fa??r f?rfa£* % srfte $ fsn* wvrit a m f t H 1,0 7 ,9 4 4 n o v t vrqr fMNr TTftr flfwrfara ^ I 1)

2 TO»n *TFF- 23-2-51' 78,910’ 8,68,010 $ 3 ^ 5T** fi^T ^ R t % o ^f^sirr vfhrfsrr Tt^R UTE

tfntfTT fa fa S * 7,500

■c t tv < ftrf^nr ‘FPreft 8 9 ,0 2 4 w »» N.

f*$K VTVftXVM ftrfkSt 12,032 135 Written Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Written Answers 136

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8

fir?wr favvwr 12,031 fa® (lO O So ST?iN?%$faT) 2 ,4 0 7

( 1 0 s o v r H v WIT) urefa farfass 3,00,000

firo* Tt?n: «Ffrrf^»T 1,0 0,000 far®

^ j?7 3PTT?*T 20,852

«ft fao 60,150

2,760

crrcfsqT 40,10s

^rPTsflr fa* 10,473

' *E*r-q*

^rar^srnTT W^hfWTir JPVR> fao 2 50,000

*ft»T 21,82,963

3 grrrr 1 07 91 4 So s ftjfa T f*rtWTTfir flforfcRT *># | I

Unlicensed Hawkers and Beggars (b) if so, what steps are proposed Frequenting Railway Carriage to be taken to remove this nuisance and source of inconvenience to the 7225 SHRI SURAJ BHAN: Will the travelling public which m a way Minister lor RAILWAYS be pleased erodes the confidence of the public in to state the management of the Railways? (a) are the Government aware of the fact that a large number of haw­ kers who are not licensed by the THE MINISTER OP STATE IN THE Railways and the beggars frequent the MINISTRY OP RAILWAYS (SHRI railway carriages and are a source of SHEO NARAIN): (a) and (b). Yes. nuisance to the travelling public; and Every effort is made by the Railway 137 Written Answers CHAITRA 2®, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers I3g

Administration to check the bflfgaaf and uanuthorised hawkers' nuisance in m 31- 3-78 Ir 2-4-78 ?rt trains and at stations. TOfar «rr «rk 53% qww w r V( Special drives are launched with the W¥ for sq^fir srafsr % sftrnr «%?- assistance of Railway Police, Railway «rr 1

Public cooperation is sought through tit *m fcr t m r f % ?r*sr ifr exhibition of posters, announcements fiTFrm 4 fvrvm strt ^ hrr# over the Public Address System etc., requesting the public to refrain from % R* 3 1 -3 -7 8 *tt* 2 -4 -7 8 giving alms to beggars and purchasing STFrT f f I *RT ftpffW if edibles from unauthorised persons. 3TPTV, fa?IT rfTThST fkm f ftflm The unauthorised hawkers found | I selling food stuffs and other articles in running trains as well as at stations are dealt with in accordance with the ifiWW ^IW if vV *|?ff provisions of the Indian Railways Act, 1890. 7227. ITo ?TWt *RW«T «TTW : tot tw *r?r ?ctr tit ftrr ?Rtr fa:

(*) wr qrf^r*r % Trnrnr 7226. «T> g f c l fWWW . WT fa : fWhR f ^ wf % ?f?sr t Sfrcfrpr

t i t irrft vfe?rrf t ; ] (»r) #f»r%3F «rtr ^w rfvff *rt ?rt fazrr (^ ) *rfa §t. «rtt Sr anir^rn *5?r fsTOT?r *ft ftifw i

^ r ^ n w i («ft f

ihmnr if tw («ft fiwr (»T) *Tf fTfET f«TRf «rtr g?T *nrm) : («r) irtr (w) sm innrfWf ^ rtt tk f?r^T v rm t reypr % qrpft ^ f r m w n f t «hr#5rf % fvm 24W ? *T«T^T WFff qr ipff % ^PR fajrr 3TRT ftcTT | I W ritten Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Written Answers 140

Companies owned by Evangelical (d) profit earned by each company Bodies of Foreign Origin during the last three years, year* wise? 7228. SHRI G. M. BAN AT WALLA: THE MINISTER OF LAW, JUSTICE (SHRI MUKHTIAR SINGH MALIK): AND COMPANY AFFAIRS (SHRI Will the Minister of LAW, JUSTICE SHANTI BHUSHAN): (a) As AND COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleased per the latest available information as to state: on 31-3-1978, there were 15 evangelical bodies corporate of foreign origin with (a) the number of companies owned places of business in India and regis­ by evangelical bodies of foreign origin tered under Section 592 of the Com­ at present registered in India under panies Act, 1956 the Indian Companies Act; (b) to (d) Statement annexed gives the latest available information aoout (b) the upto date investment made the investment (i.e. value of assets) in by each one of them in India; India of these evangelical bodies the nature of their activities, and about (c) the nature of their business their proftts/losses during the last activities as companies; and three years. I4X

E v a n o e U c \l B odies of foreign origin ope r a tin g in I ndia t h r o X-’ qh thsir b Writ ten ten Answers HTR 2, 1900 28, CHATTRA (SAKA) rte Answers Written

Do-* Religious activities. Exempted from filing balance Charitable activities. 143 W ritten Answers APRIL 18. 1978 Written Answers 145 Written Answers CHAITRA 2B, 1800 (SAKA) Written Answers 146

Violation of Companies Act by Com­ by foreign-collaborated companies in panies the pharmaceutical industry during the three years 1975, 1976 and 1977, 7229 SHRI G M BANATWALLA SHRI MUKHTIAR SINGH (b) foreign exchange earned by the MALIK said companies during the said penod, SHRI HUKMDEO NARAIN and YADAV Will the Minister of LAW JUSTICE (c) Government reactions thereto, AND COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleased and whether Government propose to to state curb or restrict the remittances, if any, abroad and if so, broad details (a) the number of companies against thereto? whom prosecution cases have been initiated for violation of various pro- visions of the Companies Act during THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE the last three years, and MINISTRY OF PETROLEUM AND (b) the broad features of charges CHEMICALS AND FERTILIZERS igamst them and the action Govern­ (SHRI JANESHWAR MISHRA) (D ment contemplate taking against and (b) A statement furnishing the them’ requisite information for the years 197» and 1976 in respect of foreign THE MINISTER OF LAW JUSTICF collaborated companies in the Organis­ AND COMPANY AFFAIRS (SHRI ed Sector having direct foreign equity SHANTl BHUSHAN) (a) and (b) exceeding 40 per cent and engaged m The information is being collected and the manufacture of drugs and phar­ will be laid on the Table of the House maceuticals is enclosed Remittances abroad by Foreign Drug Industry Information for the year 1977 is not yet available 7230 PROF P G MAVALANKAR Will the Minister of PETROLEUM (c) Repatriation of profits etc is CHEMICALS AND FERTILIZERS be permitted m terms of the relevant pleased to state statutory/regulatory provisions applic­ (a) remittances abroad by way of able to all such foreign companies in dividend royalty and technical fees all Sectors of the Industry Statement

Amount remitted abroad Foreign as Dividend Royalty Exchange SI No Name of firm and Technical Fee earned by to f

Year Amount Amount (Rs in (Value m lakhs) Rs lakhs)

1 M/» Abbott Labs Nil 7* 73 1970 16 76 53 23

9 M/s Beecham 1975-76 s 66 1 30 1976.77 Nil o 73 3 M/s Burroughs Wellcome *97* Nil 18 40 *97® 3 9i as 80 147 W ritten Answers APRIL 18. 1978 Written Answers 148

I 3 3 4 5

4* M/s Warner Hindustan . 1975 6*55 26* 17 1976 13*00 28*60

5* M/s Cartar Wallace • *973 Nil N.A. 1976 0*83 N.A.

6. M/s Whiffcns .... • *875 Nil N.A. 1976 O’ 20 N.A.

7* Nil 50* *4 1976 3’ 9i 39 7 b

8. M/s S.K.F. .... • *975 20*55 0*90 1976 2 60

9- M/s Roche ...... • *97 5 8*59 29 98 1976 3<>' 77 5r>‘4i

10. 0*47 N.A. *97b Nil N.A

11. M/s Parke Davis .... • 1975 Nil 9 * P »97 b 10*01 30 9 »

12. M/s Anglo French .... • *975 o* 60 <5 6 2 1976 0-90 12*53

13- . 1975 . 33*43 166* 52 1976 45*46 94 14. M/sJohmon & Johnson • 1975 i*8 o 49 * *3 1976 16*28 38 01

15. 1975 15*60 84*29 1976 N.A. 86 21 16. M/s Wyeth Labs. Ltd...... • *975_ 4 45 Nil »976 ii* 13 Nil

17* M/s Ciba Geigy .... • *975 21*33 37*oo 1976 34* 18 8 *oo 18. M/s Cyanamid .... **35 18-23 1976 59-70 14 37

,9* M/i Alkali & Chem. Corpn. of India Ltd. . • *975 Nil 22-00 1976 Nil 27*00 20. M/s E. Merck • *975 7*69 1978 rJi83 8 90

21. M/s Merck Sharp & Dhome . • j975 0*02 i6*on 1976 *3*45l 10*05 22. M/s Sandor .... 1973 Nil 168-00 1976 26*84 264*00

23. M/s Boot* .... 4 7 9 33 ar> 1976 10*17 <17-09

24. M/s Richardson Hindustan Ltd. • 1975-76 4*60 33 00 1976-77 12*00 40*00

*5* M/» Bayer (I) Ltd...... ■ *975 59* *4 *0*47 1976 «3*«7 13*00 149 Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SA KA ) Written Answers 150

2 3 4 5

86. M/s Geoffrey Manners • *975 6-03 9-58 1976 20* 33 5-58 87- M/s Hocchst Pharm. Ltd. • >975 9-48 t00-60 1976 20-36 *33‘ 7r 98. M/s Organon • *975 4*30 129*25 1976 4-06 220*43

99 M/s Suhml Oi'g} • 1975-76 2*00 Nil 1976-77 Nil NA.

3°« M/s Synbiotics Limited • 1975-76 3’ 28 1976-77 W NA. 3i M/s Uni-Sankyo • >975 0-40 3-61 1976 1-07 8- 32

Ticketless Travel of sample checks conducted on all Indian Railways during the year 7231 PROF. P G. MAVALANKAR- 1976 77, the loss on account of ticket­ Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be less travel was estimated at about pleased to state Rs 18 crores per annum.

(a) whether ticketless travel |s still There has been no let-up in the largely prevalent in the country; drive against ticketless travel The (b) if so, its magnitude, usual re­ ticket checking activities have been gions wherem it is noticed more and further intensified. the overall loss of revenues to the Railways on this count; and Posts of Judges lying vacant (c) steps being taken t0 effectively 7232 PROF. P. G. MAVALANKAR. check the said evil and with what Will the Minister of LAW, JUSTICE concrete results? AND COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleased to state THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI (a) whether there are any posts of SHEO NARAIN): (a) to (c). To combat Judges including Chief Justice vacant the evil of ticketless travel on the in cfoe or more of the High Courts; Indian Railways, apart from normal (b) if so, full facts thereof; and ticket checking arrangements, vigor ous ticket checking drives are under- (c) when will the said vacancies be taken. During the period 1-4-1977 to filled and how? 28-2-1978, 99,442 special checks were conducted as against 88.737 during the THE MINISTER OF LAW, JUSTICE corresponding period of last year. As AND COMPANY AFFAIRS (SHRI a result of these concentrated drives, SHANTl BHUSHAN): (a) Yes, Sir. the sale of tickets and earnings realis­ (b) A statement indicating the va­ ed therefrom during the period 1-4-1977 cancy position in the various High to 28-2-1978 have shown considerable Courts as on 13-4-1978 is attached increase over the figures for the cor­ responding period of last year. The (c) Steps are being taken to fill up extent of ticketless travel tends to the vacancies expeditiously. The State vary from area to area and in each authorities and the Chief Justices con­ area from train to train. On the basic cerned have been reminded to expedite J 5 I W ritten Answers APRIL 18. 1978 Written Answers

their recommendations. They have also fled time schedules in sending pro- been asked to adhere to certain sped- posals. Statement

Vacancies SI. No. Name of the High Court Pint. Add!.

Allahabad . Andhra Pradesh

3- Bombay 4- Calcutta 5- Delhi

6.Gauhati 4iC £One of the vacancies is thai of Chief Jus­ tice. 7- Gujarat 8 . Himachal Pradesh •The vacancy is that of Chief Justue. 9 * Jammu & Kashmir

20 . Karnataka 11. Kerala 12. Madhya Pradesh

*3- Madras II. Orissa T5* Patna 16. Punjab & Haryana *7- Rsyasthan ®One of these vacan­ cies is that of Chief Justice. The appoint­ ment has been noti­ fied but thr Chief Justice designate has not yet assumed office. 18. Sikkim 16 25 4*

N.B.— In addition, there are 14 newly created posts in the following High Courts which are sanctioned with effect from the date they are filled and which are yet to be filled Pmt. Addl.

Allahabad 3 Himachal Pradesh 1 Madhya Pradesh 6 Karnataka Patna >3 ,53 D H M i J M C H A im 28. 1M« (SAKA) Written * « « , 54

• I W l t r “ * ■ to of this new system in open line of Gujarat Dhanbad Division? THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE 7233. PROF. P. G‘ Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) and (b). On pleased to state: the open line Casual labourers are on (a> whether Government are aware daily wages for the first 120 days. On that the movement of sponsoredi quota completion of 120 days continuous „n„l !„ South Gujarat is seriously service they are granted temporary affected because o* the recerrt abrupt status with monthly rates of pay and 35 per cent cut imposed by the Rail are eligible for almost all the benefits way Board; given to temporary Railway servants. On projects, on completion of 6 months (b) if so, reasons lor effecting such they are given the scale rate of pay. a cut; and These are in accordance with the re­ (c) what 9teps GovernmentJ*e tak­ commendations made by the Miabhoy ing to improve and augmen Tribunal. Project casual labourers- movement of coal by the railway effi­ cannot be allowed to abstain from ciently and speedily? work for long periods. Hence they have been given 20 days authorised t h e m in is t e r o f s t a t e w t h e absence lor contingencies like illness, h/t t m t sst r Y OF RAILW AYS (Sn.rU etc. Any absence beyond this limit is S o N A R A ? N > : treated as a break in the continuity been imposed by the Railway of employment and they have to com­ plete another six months of continu­ (b) Does not arise. ous service before being entitled to (c) AU efforts are being m ad eb ylh e scale rate of pay. Railways to maintain the loading of S S T u * maximum extent po»^ie. (c) and (d). Information is being collected and will be laid on the Table Project Rates to Casual Gangmen of the House. Strike by Technical Supervisors of M™ « r r f RRWLWKAVS°te pleased w Slndri Unit o t F.CJ. state; 7235. SHRI A. K. ROY: (a) the policy and principle adopted Minister of PETROLEUM, CHEMI­ SES AND FERTILIZERS be pleased to state: (a) whether it is a fact that the m M i Technical Supervisors ofSindri Unit « vertilizers Corporation of inw® t t C . -trike Since JOB. March S i S i S S s - " S l»a * . «t*n» o*

iect Rates and C.r.v» v to casual Gangmen line; , Ministry A oe a»d specification ol work in open long and the matter is still under con- sideration; and (c) it SO, how long the matter Sates in Dhanbad Division since 1970 ; and

.ssrtt’aw sss: 155 Written Armoer* APRIL 18, 1978 Written Answers

THE MINISTER OP STATE IN THE MINISTRY OP PETROLEUM AND Sf itar m w m w CHEMICALS AND FERTILIZERS (SHRI JANESHWAR MISHRA): (a> 7237. gfcr faf : *rr and (b). The Technical Supervisors of the Sindri Unit resorted to hunger strike to press their demand for intro­ *5 qft ftrr ^ f t . duction of single channel of promotion for degree and non-degree holder en­ gineers in the F.C.I. The agitation was ( * ) wwr vrsrf srfir withdrawn consequent on the decision ere *rraT vr fawrrerr of the F.C.I. to introduce single channel of promotion. ( * ) VW t o f t *TPTT j (c) Does not arise. **r sjffcrr | Of Of srfimw >wt Award of Miabhoy Tribunal i ,

(*r) w f f r t ^ srf?T 7236. SIIRI A. K. ROY- Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to f?m^r 3rr% spt *r*rmT state: t ?TTT ^ m STM f^ETT «TT^TT ? (a) whether it is a fact that 160 gang men of Barakar and Kalvobathen PWI of Asansol division have been wr T*rm iftr gthw stopped from duty since 16th March, »wrtw $ ttwt fiw ) 1978 as they refused to accept artificial («T) 1 8 -1 -1 9 7 8 * i $Ti % break in service to remain deprived of the CPC for ever; 3cMTiTx»r ^c*TT- (c) if so, whether the Government tw? fan »i«rr 11 Viv would give instructions to stop such ^ TfaTRT 57| practice? 100,000 srfofcH THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE 5 fao *fto z* srfo * * % 5pcm MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI ^ n rr srr *rt?err | 1 SHEO NARAIN): (a) No. They, m fact, refused to accept appointment on 16-3 1978 against a new sanction after (% qr %jf (b) and (c). The existing rules pro­ vide that casual labour should not de­ % awrnw srf?wr e fao jfto liberately be discharged with a view to zh pt *rmr $ u ft 1981-82 causing an artificial break in their service. These instructions have been reiterated from time to time. 10 fir* ifto stt sj% 1 157 W ritten Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 158

Heavy Repair Shop Electrical, (u) Entrusting of the work to the Kharagpur private firms at higher costs 7238 SHRI DINEN BHATTA- The repair work has been off loaded CHARYA Will the Minister of RAIL­ to the trade only after utilising the WAYS be pleased to state full capacity of Kharagpur and Tata­ (a) is it correct that the Heavy Re­ nagar Shops and only to the extent pair Shop, Electrical at Kharagpur u these shops were not able to under­ not being put to lull use and there is take repairs of defective equipment idle capacity while the work is being thereby leading to heavy loss Works transferred elsewhere, Contracts were placed after due pro­ (b) is it correct that after Buch cess of tendering and observance of transfer of work the same is being all laid down procedures with iue entiusted to private firms which costs finance concurrence The cost of the nearly double than Kharagpur esti­ work by trade for such works for mated cost, which facilities exist at Kharagpur (c) whether the Government haa Shop is not higher than the estimated received any representation on the cost of the same at Kharagpur shop subject, (111) Surrendering of the staff (d) if 50, what are the facts and sanctioned ifor repair of traction demands, and motor armatures at Kharagpur (e) what steps the Government propose to take to do away with the The total workload at Kharagpur has idle capacity* not come down No staff at Kharag­ pur Workshop has been rendered sur­ THE MINISTER OF STATE IN TIIE plus There is no idle capacity MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) and (b) No Micro-wave section of S & T Depart, (c) to (e) Yes Representation from ment in S.E Railway the Woiking President and Secretary 7239 SHRI DINEN BHATTA on behalf of IIea\ y Repair Shop Elec­ CHARYA Will the Minister of RAIL­ trical Staff Council Kharagpur ad­ dressed to the Hon ble Railway Minister WAYS be pleased to state has been received The issues raised (a) whether the Government have md the actual facts arc indicated be­ received any representation against low curtailment of posts and reversion of staff m the Micro-wave, section of (1) Shifting of the work Irom Signal and Telecommunication Depart­ Heavy Repair Shop at Kharagpur to ment in S E Railway, Tatanagar (b) if so, the details thereof, and Repair facilities were bet up t Tatanagar as approved by the Board to (c) the decision of the Government take care of the additional workload on the same? on account of increase m electrical assets The work between the two THE MINIS1ER OF STATE IN THE repair shops has been rationalised MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI Kharagpur shops repair machines of SHEO NARAIN) (a) to (c) Norms General Services and Train Lighting for providing maintenance staff for while Traction Repair shop Tatanagar, multi-channel radio relay systems repairs traction motors, transformers (Micro-wave, UHF and VHF) have etc of Electric locomotives The been evolved by the Ministry after a rationalisation has been done to avoid detailed investigation of the mainten­ mfructuous expenditure due to haulage ance workload a t different types of re­ of defective and repaired equipment peater stations and having due regard 159 W ritten Answers APRIL 18. 1978 Written Answers 160 to the pattern of staffing followed by (c) No. the Zonal Railways and the Posts & Telegraphs. With the implementation (d) The policy of the Government of the new norms the maintenance is now to follow the norms as referred stall strength is to be augmented on to in answer to question (b) above. some of the Railways, while on South Eastern Railway it is to be somewhat Traction Distribution Workers* A s m - scaled down. Staff rendered surplus elation on the South Eastern Railway will 1-e utilised for the maintenance of new 7241. SHRI DINEN BHATTA- Micro-wave installations on that Rail­ CHARYA: Will the Minister of RAIL­ way itself and there will be no re­ WAYS be pleased to state: trenchment, whatsoever, on this account. (a) whether Government has re* ceived any representation from the Higher skill for Micro-wave work Traction Distribution Workers’ Asso­ ciation about their grievances; 7240. SHRI DINEN BHATTA- CHARYA. Will the Minister of RAIL­ (b) if so, the details thereof; and WAYS be pleased to state: (c) the steps taken by Government (a) whether it is a fact that the regarding solution of these grievances? work in Micro.wave section is of higher skill and the staff had to be THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE specially trained t0 tackle the work; MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) Yes. (b) whether initially certain rules were laid down not to entrust cer­ (b) A statement is attached. tain work to staff of lower category; (c) In accordance with Government’s (c) whether an attempt is now be­ policy, stafl representations received ing made to lower down the highly from any source are given due con­ technical posts and increase work sideration and action is taken. The load on staff; and demands of all categories of slafl are considered and solved through the (d) what is the policy of the Gov­ various tiers of the Permanent Nego ernment in this regard? tiatmg Machinery and the Joint Con­ sultative Machinery. THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI Statement SHEO NARAIN). (a) It is a fact tha» 1. High tension hazardous allowance. the work in micro-wave maintenance is of higher skill and the stafl are gneu 2. Running Allowance special training both on job and in the 3. Workshop facilities Railway Training Institutions. 4. Risk Insurance. (b) When initially Railways pro­ 5. Free diet. vided rmcro-wave networks they had 6. Free Railway quarters. no experience of the requirement of maintenance set up. Each Railway 7. Job and workload analysis. was, therefore, following its own stand­ 8. Acting in higher grade. ards. In 1973 the Efficiency Bureau 9 . Payslip. of the Ministry of Railways conducted a study and, after taking into account 10. Promotion. the practices obtaining in some other 11. Safety. organisations and the special require­ 12. Confirmation ments of the Railways, formulated 13. 40 per cent B.T.M. Post. norms to be followed for the mainten­ ance of the micro.wave equipment. 14. Supply of duty dress. x6x Written Answers CHAITRA 26, 1W0 (SAKA) Written Answers 162

Etftattton of Civil Engineering De- Strength o i Railway Employees is IftrtaMit of South Saltern Railway Nagpur, etc. Divisions

n 42 SHRI SHYAMA PRASANNA 7243 SHRI SHIV SAMPATI RAM BHATTACHARYA Will the Minister Will the Minister of RAILWAYS of RAILWAYS be pleased to state be pleased to state

(a) why the Estimators of Civil (a) what was the total strength of Engineering Department of South Railway employees in different cate­ Eastern Railway are not yet con­ gories over Bhuaawal, Bombay, Jabal­ firmed even after rendering twelve to pur, Jhansi and Nagpur Divisions fourteen years service and availabi of Central Railway including lity of permanent posts Workshops, Constructions and Railway electrification during the year 1972 (b) why the posts of estimatory and up to 31st December, 1977, draftsmen and tracers m civil engineering department of South (b) what is the total number of Eastern Railway are lying vacant employees in different categories in since long thereby increasing work­ all divisions over Central Railway load on the existing staff, and who were recruited or promoted during each year and what is the total number amongst them who be­

THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE (c) what steps have been taken to MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI make good the shortfall in all cate, SHBO NARAIN) (a) Confirmation of gones in the divisions of Central staff depends on a number of factors Railway mentioned in (a) above for Confirmation against available vacan­ the reserved vacancies earmarked for cies was last made in March 1977 Due SC and ST through direct recruitment to non-availability of lien-free poets and promotions7 all the staff at present working a? Lstimators could not be confirmed as THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE vet even though they have rendered a long period ot service MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) to (c) Informa­ tion is being collected and will I e laid on the lable of the Sabha (b) and (t) No posts of Jumoi Draftsmen Junior Estimators and Tracers of Cicil Engg Department of the South Eastern Railway are lying Strength of Railway Employees in vacant As regards the higher grade Asansol etc Divisions posts, the same could not be filled as the Drawing Offices of the Civil En­ 7244 SHRI SHIV SAMPATI RAM gineering Department on the Railway Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be are already overstaffed An overall pleased to state review of the cadre has since been conducted and the matter is now undei (a) what was the total strength of review by the Railway Meanwhile Railway employees in different cate­ selections and suitability tests for filling gories over Asansol, Sealdah, Cal­ up the posts earmarked for promo­ cutta Coal Tpt Dhanbad, Danapur, tion are under process and the same Howrah and Mughal Sarai Di­ are expected to be finalised shorty visions, of Eastern Railway mdud- 512 LS— 5 163 W ritten Answers APRIL 18, 1676 Written Answers 164

lag Workshops, Construction and Pay of Primary School Teacher* Railway electrification during the year 1972 and up to 31st December, 1977; 7246. SHRI SOMNATH CHATTER- JEE: WU1 the Minister of RAILWAYS (b) what is the total number of be pleased to state: employees in different categories in all divisions over Eastern Railway (a) whether the Government have received any representation regarding who were recruited or promoted during each year and what ia the anomaly in the pay of Primary total number amongst them who be­ School Teachers of S. E. Railway, Adra arising out of orders issued by long to Scheduled Castes, Scheduled Railway Board; Tribes and others (list of SC and ST employees be furnished): and (b) if so, the details thereof; and (c) what steps have been taken to (c) the steps taken by the Govern­ make good the shortfall in all cate­ ment in the matter? gories in the divisions of Eastern Railway mentioned in (a) above for THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE the reserved vacancies earmarked for MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI SC and ST through direct recruitment SHEO NARAIN): (a) Yes and promotions? (b) Some junior teachers of Adra Primary School, S.E. Railway **re THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE getting higher rate of pay than their MINISTRY OF RA ILWAYS (SHRI seniors on account of fixation of their SHEO NARAIN): (a) to (c). Informa­ pay in the authorised scale, with effect tion is being collected and will be laid from 27-5-1970, at the next higher on the Table of the Sabha stage with date of increment remain­ ing unchanged. Contracts/Licences Granted (c) The matter is under considera­ tion in consultation with the Ministry 7245. SHRI R. N. RAKESH. Will the of Education, following whose deci­ Minister of LAW, JUSTICE AND sion to revise the scales of pay of COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleased to teachers, revision of scales of pay was state the total number of contracts/ ordered in respect of Railway School licences granted by his Ministry and teachers. the share thereof, if any, to S/C and S/T in each category of such con­ Garhaira Transhipment Sheds N. E. tracts/licences during the period of Railway Janata Government regime and if not, 7247. SHRI SOMNATH CHATTER- why? JEE: Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to state: THE MINISTER OF STATE IN TJiE MINISTRY OF LAW, JUSTICE AND (a) whether it is a fact that the COMPANY AFFAIRS (SHRI NAR work of Garhara Transhipment Shed, SINGH YADAV): Apart from petty job NoPth-Eastern Railway regarding contracts like contracts for repair of loading and unloading is being done room coolers, air-conditioners, heaters, with departmental labour; livery items for class IV staff etc., no (b) whether similar steps were contract or licence has been granted by taken for Manduadih Transhipment this Ministry since March, 1977. How­ Shed: ever, the Department of Company Aff­ (c) if so, what pay-scale is granted airs has granted one licence for a fruitcum-pan shop an dthis licence has to the workers at Garhara and at been granted to a person belonging to Manduadih; and a Scheduled Caste. (d) if not, the reasons thereof? Written Answers Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 166 Of Primary School Teachers '; THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE ~ \3"qor;:!:TT~R:\3"rr~ ~ra~d qiT f.fll1:fT . SHRI SOMNATH CHA TTER- MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRl ~ 'fifl::rT"'Cflfrr~ f~i't" tfifc:~~;;:r~ ~~~r Will the Minister of RAILWAYS SHEO NARAIN): (a) Loading and 'fimTf~iT!1Trr 'fim:r;;rT fCfi f~Wq~, ased to state: unloading at Garahara Transhipment Shed is done by casual labourers who 1 977 ~ f~Tfqd 'fir :rr~ ~r ~ rrTfc:~ ~ whether the Government have have attained temporary status. ed any representation regarding ~rlfr ;;rr ~\?:r ~ I ~tT +iz;rT~ ~ ~;:q ly in the pay of Primary (b) No. wor;a 3;f~cn 3;forrrrf'lf CfiTlfT~lf ~f r Teachers of S. E. Railway, arising OUt of orders issued by (c) and (d). Scales of pay at Gar- ~I ay Board; 'hara are as under: if so, the details thereof; and Rs. the steps taken by the Govern- Transhipment labour .. 196-232 fiflfll ~t~1 ~T<: ~T ~T m the matter? Tindals .. 200-250 fli\lTflSl'fi ~q if SI'~~if MINISTER OF STATE IN THE Supervisors .. 225-308 ['RY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI "The loading and unloading at Mandua- 7249. P.o1T ~ f~ NARAIN): (a) Yes. -1Td f~i't" ;;rT~ ~; s, revision of scales of pay was ~R: \3"~ 3;forrrr ~rr, 1 9 7 6 -q.' qrrrlt in respect of Railway School iTlr frr

NtaiMMwn jiwi w* the other companies are highly quali­ fied. W WPf w ^bw (e) what fe the criteria in the mat­ 7250*

(1) With a view to saving money, (c) if so, what steps are being taken aome employees might sell the cloth to test it properly before use and to and continue to use the old uni­ make it lit with Indian conditions? form thus appearing on duty in shabby dress; THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE (2) Some staff may not be able MINISTRY OF PETROLEUM AND to arrange stitching of uniforms CHEMICALS AND FERTILIZERS themselves by paying higher tailor­ (SHRI JANESHWAR MISHRA): (a) ing charges prevailing in the mar­ to (c). The specification for high ket; speed diesel oil prescribed by the Indian Standards Institution stipulates (3) Staff at road side stations tjiat the sulphur content should be might not be able to have their uni­ 1 (one) per cent maximum by weight. forms stitched for want of tailoring As per the contract entered into by facilities at or near their places of the Indian Oil Corporation with the work; Soviet suppliers, the sulphur content of high speed diesel oil is required to (4) At present uniforms are cut by be between 0.2 per cent and 1.0 per the Railways in their centres/facto­ cent. The parcels of diesel oil recent­ ries and are got stitched through ly imported from the USSR had a Mahila Samitis, Handicraft Centres, sulphur content ranging between 0.09 Ordnance Factories, etc. In the pro­ per cent and 0.26 per cent which is cess, considerable saving of cloth is within the limits prescribed by the effected because of bulk manufac­ I.S.I. No complaints from any of the ture and low stitching charges Railways or other quarters about This procedure is also considered the high sulphur content of diesel oil advantageous as it ensures additio­ imported from the USSR or any ad­ nal income t0 dependents of Rail­ verse effect of this oil on their em­ way employees working in Handi­ ployees handling it have been receiv­ craft Centres, etc. ed

However, the procedure for manu­ facture and supply of uniforms has Judges in various High Courts since been streamlined with a view to avoiding any complaints from the 7255. SHRI VASANT SATHE: Will staff and ensuring individual measure­ the Minister of LAW, JUSTICE AND ments being taken. COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleased to state: (a) what is the approved strength Import of Diesel oil from USSR of Judges for the various High Courts in the country and the number of 7254. SHRI MANORANJAN BHAK- judges actually in position; TA: Will the Minister of PETRO­ LEUM, CHEMICALS AND FERTILI­ (b) the number of vacancies as on ZERS be pleased to state; 31st March, 1978 and steps taken to have them filled; (a) whether the diesel oil import­ ed recently from USSR contains high (c) details of proposals approved sulphur content and is unfit for use in under consideration High Court-wise, railway and other machinery work­ for increasing the strength of judges shops, if so, details; and other supporting staff for 1978-79; and Ob) whether a large number of workmen have been physically affec­ (d) the decision taken in this re­ ted for using this diesel oil; and gard? 173 Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 ( SAKA) Written Answers 174

THE MINISTER OP LAW, JUS- the creation of 4 posts of Additional TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS Judges in that High Court has been (SHRI SHANTX BHUSHAN): (a) and received and is being processed An­ (b). A statement indicating the sanc­ other reference for conversion of the tioned strength, the number of jud­ existing 6 posts of Additional Judges ges In position and vacancies as

Statem ent

SNo. Name of the Hugh Sanctioned Actual Vacancies Court strength strength ______Pmt Addl Pmt Addl Pint Addl.

h I 2 3 4 j 7 8

i Allahabad 40 10 39 IO 1 — 2 Andhra Pradesh 18 3 18 2 — 1 3 Bombay «7 8 *4 7 3 1 4 Calcutta 33 7 33 7 — — 5 Delhi - 18 17 — 1 3 6 Gauhali. 8 — 5 — 3 — 7 Gujarat *4 4 *3 — s 4 8 Himachal Pradesh 3 — 2 — 1 — 9 Jammu f t Kashmir *4 2 2 2 t — 10 Karnataka >4 4 «3 4 1 — 11 Kerala . *3 3 >3 3 — — 1 a Madhya Pradesh so 3 *9 T 1 *— 13 Madras 16 6 16 T — • 14 Orxssa 7 1 7 —— I 15 Patna . 18 *) 18 8 — I 16 Punjab Is Haryana 17 6 16 1 3 17 Rajasthan 10 4 6 1 4 3 18 Sikkim . 2 2 “

•983 ?3 263 53 18 20 •355 3*6 <*8

N B In addiuoa to the above vacancies, 14 posts sanctioned recently with rffcct fiom the dates *75 Written Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Written Answers 17 6

the/ are tilled up have yet to be filled up. lh e break-up of there newly created pasta is as follows •— Pmt. Add]. .Ulahabad 3 Hunachal Prades.li i Madhya Pradesh 6 Km nataka Patna

'* Ja< 1>M kr-pt ill a ix-vanct and a post o f Vdditioiul Judge was created m In u thereof.

Passes issued during 1977-78 (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) and (b). Government have laid down the fol­ 7256. SHRI VASANT SATHE,: Will lowing broad guidelines for the issue the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleas­ of complimentary passes:— ed to state: (l) Institutions and organisations (a) whether the guidelines for issue devoted to social, cultural, scienti­ of passes have been revised and details fic, literary, sports and educational thereof; activities and whose work is of an all-India character. (b) what are the important consi­ (ii) Organisations devoted to the derations and the procedure adopted for i3sue of such passes, and welfare of Scheduled Castes, Sche­ duled Tribes, backward and neglect­ (c) the number and names of per­ ed sections, women, blind and han­ sons from Maharashtra who have been dicapped persons, etc. issued passes during 1977-78 and the number and names of person/or­ (iii) Eminent persons engaged in ganisations to whom complimentary work of national importance for passes have been discontinued? which they are required to under­ take frequent journeys. THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (c) Two statements are attached.

Statement No. i

Vames o f ptrums from Xtaharashira who have been ismdjrenewed passes' during 1977-78

Class of No of Fan Pan

1(a) New passes issued during 1977-78

1. President, Dr. Ambedkar Memorial Society, Chandrapui 1st 9 One office bearer of Mahatama Gandhi Institute of Medical Sciences, Sevagram with one Attendant in Ilnd class . . . 1st one 3, One office bearer of National Leprosy Organisation, Wardha Ilnd one 177 Written A i d e r s CHAITRA 28, 1900 ( SAKA) Written Answer* X78

clan or No. of Pus Pass

1(b) Puses renewed during i977*78 I. Sb. P. N. Rajbhoj, President, Bharat Dalit Sangh, Pune with one attendant in Ilnd clan ...... 1st one а. Shri N. V. Tungar, Pune, a worker of Gandhian philosophy and U n to u c h a b ility ...... „ one 3. One office bearer of the Tata Agricultural & Rural Trg. Centre of the Mind, B o m b a y ...... one 4. Sanrhalifeft and/or Assistant, Matru Seva Sangh Nagpur, with one male/female worker in Ilnd c l a s s ...... „ one 5. Any two workers of the Gandhi Memorial Leprosy Foundation, Wardha ...... „ one б. One office bearer ofKasturba Health Society, Wardha, with one atten- , dant in Ilnd clas*...... „ one 7. Smt. Nirmala Gandhi of Sevagram Ashram, Wardha . . . „ one ft. One office bearer of Indian Secular Society, Bombay . „ one 9. One blind worker of the Poona Blind Men’s Association, Pune, with one guide ...... „ one 10. One office bearer/worker of the National Association for the Blind, Bombay, with permission to take one Personal \ssistant when the official is blind ...... „ one 11. Specified office bearer of Antar Bharati, Pune . . . „ o n e 12. Shri Mahadeojoshi, Member of the Bharatiya Sanskriti Kosh Mandal, ...... one 13. Director or one more office bearer (to be used by one at a time), Rang- manch Research Institute, B o m b a y ...... „ one 14. Shri D. G. Kclkar of Raja Kelkar Museum, Pune, with one companion ...... one 15. Shri Ram Singh Bhanavat, General Secretary, All India Banjara Seva Sangh, B o m b a y ...... one 16. One office bearer of Indian Council of Social Welfare, Bombay Ilnd one > 17. Any worker of the Gandhi Memorial Leprosy Foundation, Wardha Do. one

Statement S o . II

List o f Complementary Card Pastes cancelled

No.

First Cta ft 1 Shri Lalhan Prasad Vyas, Assistant Secretary, World Hindi Convention, Nagpur. 9 One worker of Sant Sahitya Sadan, Bombay. 3 One worker of Sant Sahitya Sadan, Bombay. Second Clast NIL 179 Written Answers APRIL 18, 1978 W ritten Answers 180

Stoning problem for Held Stall of ( v ) p « r grcwj* afhwfa: ONGC % afhr as/96 w r m s irk 231 / 7257 SHRI VASANT SATHE ,Will 222 *nfWt % Tjpr the Minister of PETROLEUM AND CHEMICALS AND FERTILIZERS be 5*

( f ) w t 35^ w k % In Iraq oil was discovered in the well drilled by the ONGC but the wfar ®rrf?pft stcpt ^ % rate of flow of oil was not sufficient % 3TTR SFT f^TT W 'TT to declare it a commercial discovery m w iTT fftr arrayc jftrr in terms of the provisions of the con­ tract The total expenditure incurred ^Frr% t t | t fr on this venture till March 1977 was approximately Rs 988 crores includ­ ( s ) irfe ?ft w XTWTT TT ing Rs 129 crores as depreciation. ftnnx irrfeift %

(a) the original scheduled tune of (c) the criteria for levying the sur­ completing the gauge conversion bet­ charge on Halt Stations; and ween Sonpur and Barabanki; (d) the circumstances under which surcharge is levied on certain Halt (b) whether more than 75 per cent Stations while no surcharge is levied work between Sonpur and Chapra on other Halt Stations? Railway Stations has been completed; THE MINISTER OF STATE IN (c) when the remaining work is THE MINISTRY OP RAILWAYS likely to be completed; and (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) 273.

(d) the new schedule for complet­ (b) 798. e s the gauge conversion between Son­ pur and Barabanki and the amount re­ (c) and (d). When the working of quired for the same9 a halt station is not found financially justified surcharge is levied to reduce THE MINISTER OP STATE IN THE the recurring loss. MINISTRY OP RAILWAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) The project was Railway Bridge at Jamnagar originally targeted for completion by December 1977 but it had not been 7262. SHRI VINODBHAI B. SHETH* possible to do so on account of limi­ Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be ted availability of funds. pleased to state:

(b) to (d). 55 per cent of the total (a) whether Government are aware conversion work has been completed that the Railway Bridge at Jamnagar and the entire remaining project is is in a dilapidated condition and i9 a planned to be completed and commis­ hazard m view of the same being sioned by 1980. more than 70 years old; and

According to the latest assessment, (b) what steps government propose the cost of the project is about Rs. 69 to take for either repairing it or re­ crores and the expenditure on the placing it with a new construction? project upto March 1978 was Rs. 39.57 crores. A sum of Rs. 12.97 crores has THE MINISTER OF STATE IN been allotted for the project in the THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS current year. A further sum of Bs. (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) The 16.46 crores will be needed to com­ Railway is aware of some cracks that plete this gauge conversion project. have developed in the arches of Vic­ toria Metre Gauge rail-cum-road bridge (No. 376) at Km 324/9-12 near Surcharge on Halt Stations Jamnagar on Rajkot-Jamnagar Sec­ tion. There is however no danger to 7261. SHRI D N. TIWARY; Will the Railway traffic on account of these Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to cracks in the Bridge Structure. refer to reply given to Unstarred (b) Strengthening of the arches by Question No. 50 replied on 21-2-1978 cement grouting is already in pro­ regarding surcharge on Tickets to and gress and this has given good results. from Sher Halt and be pleased to state: After the completion of Viramgam- (a) the number of Halt Stations on Okha Broad Gauge Conversion Pro­ which such surcharge has been ject; the existing Victoria—M.G. levied; bridge will be closed to rail traffic 183 Written Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Written Answers 184 which will then be earned over the (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) The ex­ new railway bridge constructed up­ isting facilities at Cuttack Station are stream considered fairly adequate for the present level of passenger and parcel Railway Overbndge at Cuttack traffic However, some additional fa­ cilities such as a dormitory type re­ 7263 SHRI SARAT KAR Will the tiring room, water cooler on plat­ Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to form a fruit stall and a Cycle Shed state are programmed for construction dur­ ing the current yeai No othei ma­ (a) whether any representation has jor remodelling of the station is con­ been received by the railway authori­ templated for the present ties for Railway Overbridge at Cuttack, and (b) Government of Orissa (Tiam- (b) if so, the reaction of Govern­ port Department) m their Memoian ment thereon’ dum presented to the Union Minister for Railways at Bhubaneswar on 10-9 THE MINISTER OF STATE IN 1977 had asked for increased terminal THF MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS facilities at Cuttack Railway Station (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) Yes m view of the increased importance of this Station and increase in pa* (b) Proposals for the construction senger tiaffic of road over-bndges m replacement of existing level crossings have to be sponsored by the State Government Work done by Department of Legal together with an undertaking to share Affairs broadly 50 per cent of the cost as per extant rules Even though a propo­ 7265 SHRI P RAJAGOPAL NAI sal for the construction of a road DU Will the Mimstei of LAW JUS over-bridge at Cuttack was under the TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS la consideration of the State Govern pleased to state ment for the last 10 years they have recently decided not to go ahead with (a) the work done in rendering legal advice to the Government bv the same Hence, the proposal has the Department of Legal Affatrs been dropped Further action in the during 1977-78 and matter can be taken by the Railway only when the proposal is revived by (b) the legislative measures dealt the State Government with bv the Department during that period’ Overhauling Cuttack Junction THE MINISTER OF STATE IN 7264 SHRI SARAT KAR Will the THE MINISTRY OF LAW, JUSTICE Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to AND COMPANY AFFAIRS (SHRI state NARSINGH YADAV) (a) During the period of 14 months from 1-1-1977 to (a) whether there is any proposal 28-2-1978, the Department of Legal under the consideration of Govern* Affairs attended to about 61906 ad ment for the overhauling of the Rail­ vice cases way Cuttack Junction, and (b) Although no separate record ie (b) whether any representation has maintained with regard to the advice* also been received by Government in matters relating to legislative mea this regard and if so the details sures as such, yet according to the thereof’ available Information, during the re levant period, the Department consi­ THE MINISTER OF STATE IN dered about thirty-five important le­ •THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS gislative measures H fj Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers i 8fi

Depreciation Reserve Fund consultation with the Planning Com­ mission and the Finance Ministry. 7266. SHRI P. RAJAGOPAL NAI- DU: WiU the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to state: yffwT fcw if wfircrnft (a) the Depreciation Reserve fund in the Railways now available with 7268. TT* the Government; tot ^ sraT% : (b) whether Government are con­ templating to utilise this fund; and (*r) *RT 10 ff S/tfrTT ^ra­ ff flrftpprfw Tt ffwr ff (c) if so, in what way?

THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (ST) TOT vWTfcRT (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) The De­ preciation Reserve Fund had a bal­ fspOT fr f t stft « r rRr ff f t t ance of Rs. 218.67 crores as on 31-3- dfc sifr, «T f* * tot spnew 1977. The balance at the end of March, 1978 is estimated to be Rs. (ff) TOT ff f f e % 226.51 crores. tftarct t f r *frft £«ft % (b) and . The Depreciation Re­ ff *ft ^ *pft | fftr snff, eft serve Fund was started from 1st April, 1924 to provide for renewal of tot ail wasting assets excepting forma­ tion, fencing and ballast. Every year (f f) to t vni ff f t »rft ^ ffe a specified amount, as fixed on the basis of the recommendations of the ^ v n m ff> fe % *n j^ | Railway Convention Committee, is ?T$f, *ft TOT *?TTW I ? appropriated to the Depreciation Re­ serve Fund from the Revenue and the entire expenditure on replace­ tw if TTW wft ( f t fire ment and renewal of assets is charg­ ffnrm ) : (v ) sftpprfoff % i ed to this fund. The amounts appro­ f t VS8TT 466 597 ft priated to the Fund from Revenue in 1976-77, 1977-78 and provided in the t * Budget for 1978-79 are Rs. 135 crores. Rs. 140 crores and Rs. 145 crores res­ (W ) ?WT % Vff f t pectively. The expenditure from the Fund during 1976-77 was Rs. 125.22 ffTOT 24 fr 5ra*R 41 ft ^nfV I I crores and estimated to be Rs. 147 crores during 1977-78 and Rs. 151.42 (*r) nti- III wfalV crores during 1978-79. The expendi­ ture is incurred under various plan, % qti tf®TT 94,674 % heads such as rolling stock, machi­ 1,00,929 ft ^ 1 trffrfiW 'ft nery and plant, track renewals, fctff TR ^rff^fe fr FT bridge works, traffic facilities, signal­ ling and interlocking etc. The bal­ fr ^ I , w ftv f t -m \ ance available at the end of 1978-79 *rkff$?«r?r*rT w w ifw r t c w m fia is estimated to be Rs. 235.69 crores. The amount available in the Depre­ 1 1 f a r f t , t&r swftr ff' fr ciation Reserve Fund is taken into ac­ f f f srrfer 37 .67 wtt* fr count while fixing the overall ceiling 88. 54 «PTt? ft »Pft I tor the Annual Plan expenditure in 1 8 7 Written Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Written Answers

v f a w afow (imtfhr ^5T^r sr«r) % *r*rt crtt *rt *rr^r?rr gffrftftrft ^ ?rnr 28 spj?pt, 1977 st^r apTPrr 1 z * jtrt % ^pet ^ iftwnnfcr&wtffctfkzr, fft Hrrarcfrr f«rffr ^ fft ? w ^ »nfr «ft 1 % Tknr «r? f*nr wrm % t sqfar wot % 1 fw vnfr wk srf^PT % fw r^ r+41 '5TTT^T t srflrfr *rar »rr»f r tt, fsnr^r (*§r) w r^finpT^w ’far f o frgM ^sp-fr, tTJT^t % Tr?m % 5T9PT 5T*TT ST^T T^Tftr^Tfr^t % *r»r-T$r tor *rr tffc *rfc *tt, ?tt t , ftr^p- T^ft f w t o t t ^rar% s w wflrr m | «flr m «rr w r ’Tf’r f »t v o w r t t fspn ^rnr*iT 1 wt ®frht ft ? ^TR-T^ ^ ISFft w r ^r^rncfT, «Nrvm If tfw *nrt («ft ffw ^?r ^nrr jfrsnrr % «jnR?r ^r*rr ■nfar wt ^*rrf ^tt t?R $ «rnnra®T) (*r) «r> (w ) »rert jrrr *nw * fir* *rr sir w p t % *pj*tp- OrcTRT, ?nftr w* ?i%% ^ ft i p t f ^ r r ft? ®rs ^ r ^q-^rfrift *ft *nrc*rwt «r* ^ t t o ^rr swrtf% ir ?m^FTTtr f fiPT T ^T m*X «nr ?r*rsTt % *tpt *P^r, 7 4*T

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«t t i < rrfa y ( 1) *ftTT*r srr^rffTp WT 3WT ST?T ^ fonrft *Pt3Rg!TV^ (^ ) w r ^ ^ o tfnr* e *t( v & qfofim qft itkt i ss e 192

(*r) «ft srfasrtfto tfyrrsr 'eTovT'Spf fw i ^ I W <&

(w ) vft ^ T ^ ft ’Brarr^nf *rtsfT

(^ ) «ft fsmrwrr ?t r sm (»r) ( l ) SPWIT ^T t& STRVTfV WT

(*T) «ft 3T*T5tT *TR 3T5T tTW s w w ?tt% ^fr# f *« m STTWTRT f^qr 3TT TfT f I

(e) ftr^rfTtJr^n^T

(sr) ( l) ^Jft s f r fan rn r f r ( 2) ?f)mr?RT srn^hr far© %• sr*ft?r?? sr?rr% *rnT?r*r, M w > s r r *rf»r*

V R W f f t WTH TT ST^T ^ f= W q fft fTrTT t 3* w «?ncq?fr *rr snm T f s t % m ® §?rc

TO JRT/T ? T ^ r rPTT ^ f«r%r ewftr % vfst ^q?ft r%^p- % ' ( 3 ) if*T9CT WFfhrerfWY

’TRT sr^r * 15R%, T m t«rfefare % o ^)r bttwct, fMfwfr s r o wrfar 1956 HRT 210 W 220 f ^ f t PnftftRT ^nrH H ^TT

*FT S’F fo r fa*TT % I f^T^PFT T* 1 1 193 Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 194

100 *0 sift ST % 1,000 *0 t f * T % nfsPfTR %

*0 1. sft 3r© grqcT 1,2 5,0*00 1,00,000 2 f>® or® 1.09.000 8,000 3 «rV afto r>o 5r?n?r 1.25.000 30,000 4 ?r>o 2.21.000 irer^ftiTSTf ** sr«^rfv^ % srr^r W ^

srfin r spt

1974 19 75 197b

*0

1 sffir srrsrvfr % fVss srr=gr srfire m 22,49,578 33,55,724 8,64,274 2 st^ t *t sprr src 1,15,750 1,99,000 1,99,000

T.T E.’s ana Conductors as Running specific recommendation in this re­ Staff gard. However, only such staff as are directly in charge of ,and respon­ 7272 SHRI R P DAS Will the sible for the movement of trains are Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased classified as Running Staff Since the to btatQ T T E’s and Conductors are in no way directly connected with the move­ (a) whethei it is not a fact that the ment of trains, they have not been T T E ’s and conductors were classified classified as Running Staff They draw as tunning staff in most of the zones Travelling Allowance like other non­ of the Indian Railways till 1931, running staff while on tour Further, the issue went before the Board of (b) despite the recommendations Arbitration under the Joint Consulta­ of the Corruption Enquiry Committee tive Machinery and the Board gave headed by Shri J B Knpalam, these its award on 30th June 1972 rejecting T T E ’s and conductors have so far the demand for treating the T TE ’s been debarred from being classified as as running staff. running staff, and Appointment o f Chairman and Mem­ (c) the reasons thereof? bers o f O.N.G.C

THE MINISTER OF STATE IN ,7273 SHRI SUKHDEO PRASAD THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS VERMA- (SHRI SHEO NARAIN). (a) No* only SHRI C K CHANDRAPPAN- on a lew ex-State and ex-Company Will the Minister of PETROLEUM, Railways Ticket Checking staff were CHEMICALS AND FERTILIZERS be treated as running staff. pleased to state: (b) and (c) The Corruption En­ (a) whether Government’s attention quiry Committee did not make any has been drawn to the news-item 195 Written Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Written Answers 196 appearing in the Times of India, seas Operations, may go to some in­ Delhi dated the 27th March, 1978 fluential outsiders instead of to senior under the caption ‘ONGC officials officials in the organisation itself. against Bahuguna scheme’; (v) Likelihood of tne successor to (b) if so, the facts thereof and re­ Shri N. B. Prasad, Chairman, ONGC action thereto; not being from the organisation.

(c) whether the selection for the The various reasons based on which post of Chairman of the Commission the final decisions of Government on has since been done from outside the the future organisational set-up of the ONGC; ONGC were announced, have already been enumerated in tne statement (d) if so, the details thereof and made by Shri H. N. Bahuguna, Minis­ how Government propose to minimise ter for Petroleum, Chemicals and Fer­ dissatisfaction arising out of such tilizers, in the Lok Sabha on 6-12- outsiders selection amongst the senior 1977. officials and members of the Commis­ sion m its larger interest; and It is not correct to say that by no­ minating Additional Secretary/Joint (e) why outsiders are being brought Secretary as Members of the Com­ in when capable people are available mission, instead of the Secretary, the within the ONGC? status of the ONGC has been down­ graded. THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF PETROLEUM All top level and second level ap­ AND CHEMICALS AND FERTILI­ pointments in the public sector enter­ ZERS (SHRI JANESHWAR MISH- prises of the Central Government are RA): (a) to (e). Yes, Sir. The follow­ made in accordance with the ins­ ing are briefly the main points men­ tructions contained in the Ministry of tioned in the said news item: Finance (Bureau of Public Enterpri­ ses) Resolution No. 5 (l)/74/BPE (i) A large section of officials of (PESB) dated the 30th August, 1974 the ONGC is m favour of scrapping Action for the apopintment of Chair­ the ‘restructuring’ scheme announced man and Executive Directors for On­ in Parliament last year. shore, Offshore and Oversea* Opera­ tions, is being taken as per these in­ (u) The implementation of the structions. scheme will lead to dominance of “ge­ neralists” in what is basically a tech­ nological organisation.

(iii) The status of the ONGC has viHunn been downgraded by proposing to in­ duct as part-time members relatively 7274. : less senior officials of the concerned Ministries of the Central Government firfcr, am* As a result the Secretaries of the vft f*rr Ministries of Finance and Petroleum will have the power to ‘veto’ decisions of the Commission when these are finally referred to the respective Min­ istries for their approval f a # % frtr ; (iv) Apprehension that the three newly created posts of Executive Di­ (*f) aTfegt.rftT O TTW snrw rectors, Onshore, Offshore and Over­ * ret

Oe) Overall functioning of the programme of research work and institutions is watched from the programme of other activities of the achievement - cum - performance re- institutes, ports, audited statements of accounts, Statement No. I

Statement containing the names o fthe mstit>Uions receiving annual grant-in-aid together unth the amount o f grant sanctioned.

(A) N on-O fficial Institution

Year Institute of Consti- Indian Law Institute International Law tutional and Parliamentary Association Regional Studies Branch (India)

Rs. Rs. Rb

*973-74 2,00,000' OO 5,49,500-00 75,00000

1974-75 2 ,0 0 ,0 0 0 ' OO 4,50,000’ 00 a,75,ooo-oo

>975-76 2,00,000- OO 6,oo,ooo‘ 00 25,000- 00

1976-77 4,00,000 OO 5,66,972-00 24,905-00

»977-78 4,00,000*00 6,oo,ooo- 00 6,992-09

(B) Statutory Organisations

Central Wakf Council (set up under the* provisions of Section 8A of the W AkF ACTI, 1954).

Rs.

*973-74 NIL *974-75 fa,00, ooo-oo 1975.76 10.00.000-00

1976.77 15.00.000-00 *977-78 20.00.000- 00

Statement 11

Statement showing the institutions to whom annual grants-in-aid are given and the purpose fnr which grants are given.

Name of the Institute Purpose

( 1) Institute of Constitutional and Parliamentary To meet the expenditure on publication of Studio. Journals relating to Parliamentary Studio and partly on payment of salary and miscellaneous expenses of the Institute. 201 Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 2C2

Name of the Institute Purpose

(a) Indian Law Institute . (i) To meet the cost of research teaching and training staff of the Institute; (ii) To meet the cost of establishment of the Institute; (iii) To meet the cost of Journals published by the Institute; and (iv) To meet the expenditure incurred on holding the Seminars and Conferences by the Institute.

(3) International Law Association, For meeting expenses on— Regional Branch (India). (*) Cost of research project undertaken by the Association;

|(iii) lectures by thejvisidng Professors, etc., and (iv) publication of Journals of the Associa* lion.

(4) Central Wakf Council . For advancing loans to the State W akf Boards and Dargah Khwaja Sahib Ajm -r for the development of their urban wa kf properties.

firajf hhs* «nrm Sf w («ft fira 72 77. *TWT srcrra TW : jrrcm) (^) SwfcfTOTsswrtq i| : ? n v n % f*nrt«r jtstt (*P) WT *rT5PTT % ^ W'fTT ^ *r> fiRTmaW f t w n : ^r*rfa«hT «ft f% f ; 5frr tfarraifh (*j) 5HTT ST^r % HPF «tVt fWfapfr ft *r<[t3rr *r v N t ^ (^ ) 3r ( » ) . $r sp^ftcRr

*st ^rrsT’T f*OT?r srprra I , % fa»rfar TT sTftf srerrsr (* ) *rfe firffcpft% sflr wtttit % f^rfH-ir sfrr^sm: 5ft fa st I ? **r w fa®r$ *r snjsff % % arwft cpsrt wt * *rafer>r srurqT far^rrTftnrTsrr^rr 1

f w *m | , Amount sp«nt by ONGC on Explore, ( ? ) *PTT?*T PWSnfiRT% ?rr^T *r tlon in Iraq, »rgnrr,^qrw y , w f . 7278 SHRI M. RAM GOPAL ffTTTT^T, *mrrr srr^r?, *rm REDDY; WiU the Minister of tpRWrf, irt— grsft, PETROLEUM, CHEMICALS AND ftTwmr,^^, ftertt ^nr, afoft, FERTILIZERS be pleased to state: ■#ir| t o r vftx vt sfarfagr (a) whether it is a fact that huge faro tot «frc amount has been spent by O.NG.C. on exploration in Iraq without any C K * ) ‘ptt w ^ «mpr *t success; and fararr^r ^ o t t fstffrnr if siftff (b) if so, lose incurred on thU ^r*r ^t»tt ? account? 203 W ritten Answers APRIL 18. 1978 Written Answers

THE MINISTER OF STATE IN 24,000 tonnes/annum to 30,000 THE MINISTRY OF PETROLEUM tonnes/annum. AND CHEMICALS AND FERTILI­ ZERS (SHRI JANESHWAR MISH­ No decision has been taken to set KA); (a) and (b). The ONGC had up any other petrochemical project signed a contract in August 1973 in the public sector during 1978-79. with the Iraq National Oil Company for exploration and exploitation of Railway lines in Punjab oil. On the basis of the results of the geophysical surveys, the ONGC 7280. DR. BALDEV PRAKASH: drilled one well where oil was dis­ Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be covered but the rate of flow of oil pleased to state: was not sufficient to declare it a commercial discovery in terms of the (a) whether any new Railway Tines provisions of the contract The total are to be spread in Punjab in 1978-79; expenditure incurred on this venture and till March 1977 was approximately Rs. 9.68 crores including Rs. 1.29 (b) if so, the details thereof? crores as depreciation. THE MINISTER OF STATE IN Proposal to set up Petro-Chemical THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS Plants during 1978-79 (SHRI SHEO NARAIN); (a) and (b). No new railway line will be under 7279. SHRI M. RAM GOPAL construction in the Punjab during REDDY: 1978-79. Survey for a new railway SHRI AHMED M. PATEL: line from Rajpura to Chandigarh is, however, In hand Gauge conver­ Will the Minister of PETROLEUM, sion of Suratgarh-Bhatinda metre CHEMICALS AND FERTILIZERS gauge line into BG, a portion of be pleased to state: which falls in the State of Punjab, is (a) whether there is a proposal to also in progress and is expected to set up Petro-chemical plants during be completed shortly. 1978-79; and (b) if so, location of these plants? Speed of Kalinga Express

THE MINISTER OF STATE IN 7281. SHRI BAIRAGI JENA: Will THE MINISTRY OF PETROLEUM the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleas­ AND CHEMICALS AND FERTILI­ ed to state: ZERS (SHRI JANESHWAR MISH- RA): (a) and (b). In addition to the (a) what is the average speed of continuing programmes of Ihp Indian superfast express train; Petrochemicals Corporation Ltd (IPCL) and the Bongaigaon Refinery (b) whether Kalmga Super fast & Petrochemicals Ltd. (BRPL), express is maintaining its speed; and investment approval has recently (c) if not, why? been issued for setting u d of the following new plants bv the IPCL, THE MINISTER OF STATE IN work on which is expected to com­ THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS mence in 1978-79: (SHRI SHEO NARAIN); (a) to (c). The average speed of some of the (1) A plant for the manufacture fast express trains ranges between of 55,000 tonnes/annum of PVC 49 KMPH. and 75 KMPH. The (2) A plant for the manufacture average speed of 143/144 Kalinga of 10,000 tonnes/ annum of Express is 51/49 KMPH. Speeding Acrylates up of 143/144 Kalinga Express will (3) Expansion of the capacity of be reviewed at the time of next the existing DMT plant from revision of time table. 205 Written Answer* CHATTRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 206

(c) the total number of wagons provided b y the Government for 7282 . wh ^TJT : Wr ^ transporting the coal to the steel plants during 1977 and up to March, "R'Sff *Tf W?TT% f^TT SfT^T f*F : 1978; ( * ) *PTT VfegTTWhTTWT tftT (d) whether in view of the serious %TRo afto it^-o ^Tfo % wNr crisis to the steel plants the Railways have decided to provide more wagons % ^5T TffiTT TT STTSt «FT w f f £ l to these plants for transporting coal w % tr o t 9r*r*Fr 5 p n r ®dvnft to them; and Tt if I *T ^foni^'l ?fHt %, (e) if so, to what extent the wagons («r) ?qT STltffar STEfteTT «ft will be provided? STTTT m « rfittWd WT ^ TT THE MINISTER OP STATE IN »TO f, i t s fr^T t o t t iftr irftr (b) Does n°t arise. v m g?r% w? tt^ t f, ’ (c) During 1977t 1594 wagons daily were loaded with coal from Bengal- ^sr «hmw If ttsu tfsft («ft fmr Bihar fields for Steel Plants. During *ttpt«t ) (t) ip 1978, 1636 wagons (Provisional fT?rT VTT % fTW F«TR % WTTT «pr Figures) of coal were loaded daily upto end of March 1978. sRcrr ^r*rPT t t srr*ii t^cit f ft3r?r% «KT7T,r 'Tryt high priority in allotment of wagons «Tgf®r6TT fftfr t I for coal loading. The coal stocks held by the Steel Plants at the end (sr) ^ st, 1978 n 1 of March, 1978 was approximately 4.5 lakh metric tonnes representing (it) ^

(e) if so, whether some of the tion adopted by the Legislative States have referred the matter to the Assembly of a State for the abolition Law Ministry for clarification; and of the Legislative Council of that State pending consideration. (f) if so, the reaction of Govern­ ment thereto? (e) No, Sir. (f) Does not arise. THE MINISTER OF LAW. JUS­ TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS Decision to set up a new Fertiliser (SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN); (a) Plant at Sindri Yes, Sir. 7285. SHRI PRASANNBHAI (b) and (c). The Legislative MEHTA: Council of the State of Punjab was SHRI R. V. SWAMINATHAN; abolished by the Punjab Legislative Will the Minister of PETROLEUM, Council (Abolition) Act, 1969, m CHEMICALS AND FERTILIZERS pursuance of a resolution passed by be pleased to state- the Legislative Assembly of the (a) whether it is a fact tat Union State of Punjab. The West Bengal Legislative Council was abolished Government have taken the decision by the West Bengal Legislative for setting up of a new fertilizer plant at Sindri, in place of the existing one; Council (Abolition) Act, 1969. in pursuance of a resolution passed by (b) if so, the main reasons for the the West Bengal Legislative Assemb­ same; ly. (c) whether the new fertiliser plant At its sitting held on 3rd April, will be equipped fully with modren 1970, the Legislative Assembly of techniques and know how; Bihar adopted a resolution that the (d) the cost of expenditure involv­ Legislative Council of the State be ed and time the plant to start pro­ abolished. On December 4. 1970, duction; and that Assembly passed another resolu­ (e) the details of the same? tion that the resolution for the aboli­ tion of the Bihar Legislative Council THE MINISTER OF STATE IN passed on 3rd April, 1970, may not THE MINISTRY OF PETROLEUM be implemented before 7th May, AND CHEMICALS AND FERTILI­ 1974. In view thereof, no action was ZERS (SHRI JANESHWAR MISH- taken on the resolution. RA): (a) to (e). Yes, Sir. The exist­ ing plant at Sindri which is based on There were newspaper reports and coke and coke oven gas as feedstock some communications m May, 1970, and on technology which is now to the effect that a resolution had obsolete, has outlived its useful been adopted by the Legislative economic life. To improve ammonia Assembly of Uttar Pradesh recom­ availability and thereby overcome mending the abolition of the Legisla­ the principal limitation to produc> tive Council of that State. No inti­ tion at the existing plant a scheme mation was, however, received in of modernisation is being implemented this Ministry either from the Secreta­ there. This project envisages the riat of the Uttar Pradesh Legislative setting up of a 900 tonnes per day Assembly or from the Government ammonia plant based on partial of Uttar Pradesh about such a resolu­ oxidation of fuel oil. Six hundred tion having been passed by the State tonnes per day of ammonia from Legislative Assembly, ^n the circum­ this plant will be used in the manu­ stances, no action was taken by this facture of 1000 tonnes per day of Ministry in the matter. urea in a new plant and the balance (d) Subject to what is stated of ammonia will be used in the exist­ about Bihar and Uttar Pradesh ing facilities for the production of against part (e), there is no resolu­ ammonium sulphate. 209 Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 210

The present estimated cost of the (*§r) sfr $r 1 t o t t ?r Sindri Modernisation project is Ks. 152.04 crores. The project which vz sr^ra fw w | fa ?rf w faw was originally expected to be *r ^rfTan? ?roTW«r % jjm mechanically completed by Novem­ ^TOTftnfiT % fk^nx t o wx ber 1977 is now expected to be com­ pleted in May 1978. The Modernisa­ 1 tion scheme will not only maintain the supply of ammonia for the Issue of Licences to Foreign Drug manufacture of ammonium sulphate Firms in the existing facilities but will result in an additional fertilizer 7287. SHRI JYOTIRMOY BOSU: capacity of 129,000 tonnes per annum Will the Minister of PETROLEUM, of nitrogen in the form of urea CHEMICALS AND FERTILIZERS be pleased to refer to the reply given to Unstarred Question No. 2832 dated 14th March, 1978 regard­ ing nationalisation of foreign drug W\ STRTPST firms and state: 72 86. tom wm : *TT (a) whether many foreign drug firms have been given licences and faftr, wrwr wnr *nr letters of intent to produce various fcu^r fqr fa . type? of drugs since the submission of the Hathi Committee Report; (*) wr 7 rr sr^$r ^ (b) if so, names of the firms who ^rnTFrq'^- t^r have been given licences/letters of »afFr% wt fw fnfr^|, wh-nfe st, intent to-date since the submission of the Hathi Committee Report; ?fr *r?rf?rc^3Hra 5rrar|f, ur'p- (c) tvpes of licences given to each (’I ) WT SffT TTT5 it firm, and sPrf |?tt t fa-fnr (d) the reasons why so much time is being taken to finalise Govern­ %T5 it W| | i| Hq- f ^ qT 5T% 3ft ment’s decisions? *TPT*r|-*if t sflrq-fir^r,?tt THE MINISTER OF STATE IN w> nNrnf)- ? THE MINISTRY OF PETROLEUM AND CHEMICALS AND FERTILI­ f«rftr, «rm t o ) t o ihft ZERS (SHRI JANESHWAR MISH- («fl ^jht) ( t ) *tpt, RA): (a) to (c). Thirteen foreign drug manufacturing companies 1978 % XrTX JT^T ?PTTT * VTFfT (having direct foreign equity ex­ fn^rr ^rt «rr f% ceeding 40 per cent) have been granted 23 Industrial Licences/COB sr^r% i Am 'hY fapft % ft-rr -?=?gr Licences/Letters of Intent for the manufacture of drugs and phar­ 1 1 maceuticals since the submission of thr Hathi Committee Report to date. ftreTfar A statement furnishing the requi­ «p> ^rnr tft ferr | f«p 1 site information is attached. **r fomr * ^ f®

Use of Saloon Refund of Fare for Unused Tickets

7288 SHRI RAJENDRA KUMAR 7289 SHRI RAJENDRA KUMAR SHARMA Will the Minister of SHARMA Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to state RAILWAYS be pleased to state (a) whether any refund of fare is (a) whether Government propose to allowed to passengers and students abolish the use of Saloons, luxury with escorts who miss the train for cars and A C C by high railway any reason on return of unused tickets officials and VIPs to effect economy after the departure of the train, and austerity in the country, and (b) if so, to what extent, and (c) if not, the reasons thereof’ (b) if not the reasons thereof’ THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS THE MINISTER OP STATE IN (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) and THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (b) Yes the Station Masters are (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) and (b) authorised to grant refund on un­ Instructions have been issued only used tickets surrendered for cancel­ to use the Inspection Carnages which lation within 3 hours after the de­ are generally referred to as saloons, parture of the train in the case of for functional purposes and to places unreserved/wait-listed passengers where suitable accommodation is not and 12 hours after the departure of available It has been decided not the tram m the case of reserved to manufacture inspection carnages passengers A clerkage charge of 50 on additional account Therefore, paise per ticket is levied on un­ the existing numbers will not increase reserved tickets In the case of any further but may gradually come reserved passengers, a cancellation down when some old unserviceable fee of 30 per cent of the fare subject stock are condemned without replace­ to the following mmirrum and maxi­ ment mum as levied —

Minimum cancellation fee per Maximum cancellation fee per person person

A C Class 1st Class/ and Class A C Class 1st Class/ 2nd Class a tier A C / a tier A C / A C Chair Car A C Chair Car

Rs Rs Rs Rs. Rs R s

36 18 6 72 36 18

(c) Does not arise Foots of Extension/Health Educators tors ignoring qualified and experience ed Field workers of the same branch, 7290 DR BIJOY MONDAL Will and the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to state (b) if so, the reasons therefor?

(a) is it a fact that the vacant posts THE MINISTER OF STATE IN of Extension/Health educators are THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS filled by Matriculate Health Inspec* (SHRI SHEO NARAIN) (a) and 215 Written Answers APRIL 18. 1978 Writtcwi Answers

(b). 50 per cent of the vacancies of of State were appointed as Judges of Extension Educators are filled by the High Court of another State after promotion of Health Inspectors with the (Fifteenth) Amendment to the 10 years service and from among ; other serving employees between 30 to 48 years who are graduates and (b) whether the Law Commission In who have direct association with the its Fourteenth report has made any railway's family planning pro­ recommendations about such appoint­ gramme for a period of 5 years ments; and continuously. The posts are filled (c) what is the number of persons by selection. The remaining vacan­ so appointed, the service to which they cies are filled by direct recruitment belonged and the High Courts to which through the Railway Service Com­ the appointments were made? mission THE MINISTER OF LAW, JUS­ Facilities provided to Members of TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS Board of Directors and Offlceru of (SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN): (a) F.CJ. and (c) The information regarding the number of Members of Superior 7291. SHRI C K. JAFFER Judicial Service of one State ap­ SHARIEF; Will the Minister of pointed as Judges of the High Court PETROLEUM AND CHEMICALS of another State after the Fifteenth AND FERTILIZERS be pleased to Amendment to the Constitution of state: India, the service to which they be­ longed and the High Courts to which (a) the item-wise details of facilities the appointments were made, is being provided by the Fertilizer Corporation collected and be laid on the of India to the members of its Board Table of the House. of Directors and its top officers during each of the last 3 years and the expen­ diture incurred on each of the items; (b) In its 14th Report, the Law and Commission observed as follows: —

(b) the steps have been taken to “59 Further the whole country economise on their perquisites and the must be treated as a single unit for date from which such steps have been the purpose of selection as it is taken? vitally important that the best available talent which the country THE MINISTER OF STATE IN is capable of providing be mobi- THE MINISTRY OF PETROLEUM li7ed for the task of meeting a situ­ AND CHEMICALS AND FERTILI­ ation which has undoubtedly assum­ ZERS (SHRI JANESHWAR MISH­ ed the proportions of an emergency. KA): (a) and (b) The information If suitable persons of the necessary is being collected and will bP laid merit and character are, in the opin­ on the Table of the House. ion of the appointing authority, not available in the State, the authority should not hesitate to draw upon per­ Members of Superior Judicial Service sons available in other states. Selec­ of States Appointed as Judges tions from the Bar must necessarily be of persons of outstanding merit 7292. SHRI D. B CHANDRE GOW­ commanding a large practice who DA: Will the Minister of LAW, JUS­ may well be willing to make a TICE AND COMPANY AFFAIRS be pecuniary sacrifice and render pleased t0 state: public service by accepting these judgeships. An effort should be (a) how many persons who were made to persuade suitable senior members of Superior Judicial Service practitioners to accept these judge* 217 Written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 218

ships at least for a short period as W W cf ip * m lncl, a public duty. Their position at the Bar must be of such eminence that it could not be suggested that 7293. «rt finwr : wr acceptance by them of judgeships was likely to increase their earn­ re? ?r«rr ings on their reverting to the Bar SHT-T Tt fir TO fT (t ) fafass, TT -3TCT sraTSPT 3TTT 60 We envisage that in some srfo *TT7 *TT3T *r SFTtfR ffcTT States persons, of the required standing and competence may not 'SfPTT f , be available and the State Chief (»?) fawffdT rrTT? Justice may not have information as to the talent available elsewhere in «i ??Tr gTTT 5rnii fw^HiT the country Our further proposal, Tq ^t^tt t t f-wfaci *r tt% cT®rr therefore, is for the crcation of an T5n t t *&&& wnfr t c Tt ad hoc body presided over by the Chief Justice of India to draw up a I t T TTT T q # I panel of names of suitable persons ?TOT TflTOW 3WTT both from the Bar and the Service *rsrrm 3 tto *nrt («ft m3wr^To ^to SRTT-o % •'cfcMfKH Bar In such cases, suitable talent f?r *rr»PT t t pnr^rr 1 *> *r 2 0 srfdvid will have to be looked for in the «TT, SffiT *T ^ ^ fa^feT (^0 services In short, both these sour­ ces of recruitment should be treat­ sfto m To) qr *r ^ ed as one field of selection with an t t fa r o fr*rr mr «it 1 wtftfr eye solely to appointing the fittest tnrf^TT W «rk tT^ro «fto ?TTT0 % men available from the entire field During our tour of the country we % sffa- srjcr feqw r *ft wr tjm have observed that the judicial ser­ fW rc Ptstt w rtriM w ywr sr qr vices in certain States do not yet ^ tT m i t srnsrrc m f t possess men of the calibre needed to make competent High Court 'rsrfer ft*rr i Judges In some States, even the Bar suffers from want of the neces­ n^r fcftrrssr ffirr sary talent It is in view of these f^rf^rsr nrr % deficiencies that we recommend that fr*rr »nrr ^frr wnmr arm *pj- the country as a whole be treated as one single field of selection.* 1975 % W&T ^ t*t ^ 1 219 Written Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Written Answers 220

if a fT IlfPHIIIV WWlfjlT 1 1 %*r t m *f % % rr «r £Tr ?raT yr?Tf qr »rr#V % f® f¥ (rfe^

(«r) tt ?tt^ f st*t wr sfrnf- *r$ftit t v w t f%V 3rr% *r f^r^rr f , tfhmrt % » fm> W#T (*r) ** iTTfirTt % sfH tr^ vr «r tt % faw $m?rc %*m 7295. qj?| : tit $ mfa fcr ?r wr t ^ft % ^ tp4- srfarftpr «rrpfr *rr#t ^TfT«ft%f*P5 ^qTtTt«ftTg^r Trf5Tflrf*r «RTT 45TTWT ft , sftaTPT Sfar nTyl1 % STf^ft Tt ^ftrgr (*r) fm ^-r w r n ir fai^fV fa* ’ «ft xftx irfe fr, ?fr f^?r «rar% % facr ^T#!TT?TO % TTJH w ft («ft ftra «ft S^rqTftriffift^Tt *!&$, w n w ) : (*f) vtwr i *rg»wF«ng xftx n 23 wt *r«rir % t«ffhW*TTCTCq-I^ 20 irVT 2TTPT— «r«j?TR srw 23 *rr *rr*rarr«r ifa I1 % m i x ff rr ^ wrNf 6 25 w* fTfWWn? - t 11 1 t finiwy s»ft f t 1 1 ftwsfV % firm 13 3 v t *cf»WT*rs— ?r w ipRrfa *tr- ^ farrtx ^ | 1 *rsnrn*%6 4 0 s * TarnrT ^tcft & *vrr: ifrr # f % faq 15 f w vj *wt ( v ) tftT (»r) srv^r ?r^ ^ r r « 221 Written Answer* CHAITEA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Written Answers 222

Thef t of Crude Oil from the Pipelines Recognition of Trade Union In CJL.W of ONGC 7297. SHRI ROBIN SEN: Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to 7296. SHRI FAQUIR ALI ANSARI: state: Will the Minister of PETROLEUM, (a) whether it is a policy decision of CHEMICALS AND FERTILIZERS be the Railway authorities not to recog­ pleased to state: nise Trade Union in C.L.W.;

(a) whether it is a fact that some (b) whether it is a fact that C.L.W. persons had been cbargesheeted in Employees have been pressing for Ahmedabad for Involvement in the recognition of Union for the last twenty theft of crude oil from the pipelines of years; Oil and Natural Gas Commission; (c) whether the present Government are thinking to recognise the Union (b) whether it is also a fact that this at C.LW.; stolen oil was being sold to some mills; (d) if so, when; and (e) if not, the reasons thereof? (c) steps taken to ensure safeguards against future thefts from the pipe­ THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE lines of OSSCC; and MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a) to (e). Govern­ (d) the names of those mills who ment did not consider it necessary to used to purchase this stolen oil have any unions recognised in the and the action taken against them’ Production Units on Indian Railways including C.L.W., as the grievances of staff of these organizations are taken up by the elected Staff Councils func­ THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE tioning in these Administrations, un­ MINISTRY OF PETROLEUM AND like the Zonal Railways, where there CHEMICALS AND FERTILIZERS are no staff councils. (SHRI JANESHWAR MISHRA): (a) to (d). There had been a case of theft Following a Tripartite Labour Con­ of crude oil from a Well of Mehsana ference held in May 1977, a Tripartite Project which was detected by police Committee was set up by the Labour authorities. Six persons were arrest­ Ministry to make recommendations ed including one driver of ONGC inter alia regarding norms for recogni­ Mehsana presently under suspension tion of Unions. Government is consi­ and chargesheeted in the court of dering their report and the question of Judicial Magistrate First Class, Kadi. recognition of unions in the Produc­ tion Units including C.L.W. would be examined on merits in the light of the It was alleged that stolen crude was decision that may be taken by the sold to two rice mills, namely, Patel Government on the report of the Com. Rice Mill and Bhavani Rice Mill of mittee. Bawala. The case against the six ac­ Drilling in Kutch District cused persons for the theft of crude oil is presently pending in the court 7298. SHRI ANANT DAVE: Will the The question of taking action against Minister of PETROLEUM, CHEMI­ the two mills who are alleged to have CALS AND FERTILIZERS be pleased purchased this stolen crude oil would to state: depend upon the outcome of the cases pending in the court. Intensive pat­ (a) whether it was decided to start rolling is being done to guard against drilling work for oil after August, such thefts In future. 1977 in Kutch district; 223 Written Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Written Answers

(b) if so, whether any work of Bhuj into broad gauge line is under drilling has been started; and consideration as Kutch District is quite backward district and Government (c) if so, the result thereof? have accepted in principle that back­ THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE ward District would get priority; and MINISTRY OF PETROLEUM AND (b) if so, the present progress of CHEMICALS AND FERTILIZERS work and time by which it was to be (SHRI JANESHWAR MISHRA): (a) completed in accordance with the No, Sir plan?

(b) and (c). Do not arise. THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI Gandhidham-Lakhpat Railway SHEO NARAIN): (a) and (b). A sur­ Line vey was carried out for the conversion of Gandhidham-Bhuj metre gauge line 7299. JJHRI ANANT DAVE: Will the into broad gauge in 1971-72. The pro­ Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to ject was not found *o be viable on ac~ state: count of very limited prospects of (a) whether the new Railway line traffic and was not, therefore, taken from Gandhidham to Lakhpat is under up It will be possible to consider consideration; and this project afresh when there is sub­ stantial improvement in the avail­ (b) whether Government propose to ability of resources. give priority to this new Railway line as this line is in backward district and crores of rupees of minerals have been found out after commercial sur­ wfofarara hi»ii vey and it is in border area? THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE 7:ioi. jt® HvfhrTTrevT qt**r: MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI tot farfa, iftr ^

SHEO NARAIN): (a) and (b). The _ «TcTT% apt f > : question of gauge conversion of the existing metre gauge line between ( 4.) tot | ft Gandhidham and BhuJ and construc­ tion of a broad gauge line from Gan­ w t* *rftrfor*r ^ ^ sr> 50 dhidham to Lakhpat via Mandvi were so examined during the course of surveys $ *TWlfa?l T ^ ^ t ^ T c T carried out in 1971-72 The projects were not found to be viable on account |

7300. SfHRI ANANT DAVE: Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to farfisr, wrm wwnft v i* «Wt state: (sft Wrfaf ) : ( * ) (a) whether the work of converting $r (it) . ^ irfsfswwf ^ so metre gauge line from Gandhidfeim to 2»5 written Answers CHAITRA 28, 1W0L (SAKA) Written Answers 226

% 8 0 ^ f ( « ) srftraj nfirfron % wfar iftr »mreff 5f 3*% to ft sfrontf vt sfirenr ^ frsrar $ wftrfwH vrr% «ffY j-s- Brorortf 7r**i *fe«rsrfira*r fanr^T «* tow ^ ftm tot $ ^ *T% ?PT5«f *T «TOWT f«F j irspM m wfafarot

w t - w f i vr ^ ?TftRar ^ 1 1 ^rf gr^r snsrn 5PRTT |( TK tftftfacT farm ITT T|JT t m ^ jftftft WW IT srqr \rfkfaiW aprrtT 5TT f I ins ^ % ^nrf tt ift Pnrr ^rTcft f 1 vrtf snrrerfro* iferrw & sira *prnrf % wtutt

(«P) TOT ^ T % 20 . «To wuft mrmr nrfiar: 7302 -^T?r im i % snpff ^ «rr* ^ a«n tot *tk «rtt% vt i w *k^»t ftw w i t f>T jrpw ^>rr ^ t r f t : f^^nfrvi % jfetr ^ ts- (*) TOr«n$s*$ft faforar^i* vtvr% <^r! ^rfro «ft tht fw»hn frfa vffif srf?i«5ift%^^f*ryRrf«p3r ^ WaRRTT jf tnp ffftff, ^ ^ «rfro*ff vt W v * *tt stfraro » r f ^ ; f fojfro % irnq% j5) w

fa o'% d lM ffipp wrwrr *if $ i nr sfafown % «t%^rr v * m % faq qfr marcra ffs w k **wt «nr «w frm tot «rr, tftr ^=rw *tt M r i XHTW WTHV % ?Tc*T5ffa fifw Recruitment of 10,00* Additional Staff «rt TT*rnF»hTT sw *** % «WVw $ i w m x arrcff % ?mr- 7305. SHRI SAMAR MUKHERJEE: w*r flU *ft 'prr? f?*rr «rr fa x ? m fi Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to state: aterir f f rtv t fw r ftar *t%t i *rr war tit *pt- December, 1977 has been completed; % % r *r ^ 1r i (b) if so, has the Award been im­ plemented; and

(c) if not, the reasons therefor? s w j^ 't n H n wi*r *ft hw t w it THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE 7304. *ft nr g*pr s wt MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN)- (a) tQ (c). Recruit­ fcl ifcft ^ *5T^ fl’TT fa : ment of these 10.000 posts belonging to various class III and class IV catego­ (sp) ?7T m=r^ft^4rnm tffcr ries will take some time as the process ihr m^r sr^ ?=rr^T *r ***& % involves recruitment and training of Km'^g 3r h f?M tot staff Railways are making all efforts to complete the work as early as possi­ I; ble The accepted recommendations of the Railway Labour Tribunal, 1969 ( * ) fa * »fr irffew TR % ^«T on Hours of Employment Regulations w ^ are in the process of implementation Since these recommendations take (»r) w r t effect from 1-8-74, the time taken in implementing them will not eo against ^ct $ *vt*n ? the existing staff who are getting overtime wherever due. t a «nrr*nr * ttw («ft far wrenm) : ( * ) (»r) . Violation of Rules in regard to y^Rhfc « ^ T O i n % l i f t e r ?tt^t Employment VtaNt t 5TTT% % faq; SfaT* 7306. SHRI SAMAR MUKHERJEE: jth fafffar w fm *& Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be flWTRT *PT fW fTT $t pleased to state; ’ff?T | I 5#fWhFT ^ XnpTTT Sff (a) whether Government have re­ i,fT?n

(c) whart st«p$ the Government sentation from Blind people of Pune propose to take for disposal of these (Maharashtra) dated 3rd December* complaints? 1977 suggesting a change of procedure in utilizing effectively and convenient­ THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE ly the concession offered by Railways MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI to Blind men; SHEO NARAIN): (a) Some com-* plaints in this regard have been (b) if so, what action have Govern­ received from time to time. ment taken or propose to take; and (b) Statistical Information in this (c) the reasons for delay? regard ig not being maintained. (c) These are looked into and re­ THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE medial action taken wherever warrant­ MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI ed. Instructions have been issued to SHEO NARAIN): (a) t0 (c). A re­ the Railway Administrations to avoid presentation was received from the artificial breaks and to gear up the Poona Blind Men’s Association in May, personnel department to ensure pro­ 1977, and not in December, 1977, sug­ per redressal of grievances. gesting the issue of concession tickets to Blind persons on production of identity cards instead of the requisite 1974 Strike medical certificate as prescribed under the extant rules. The request could 7307. SHRI SAMAR MUKHERJEE: not be agreed to and the Association Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be was replied accordingly in May, 1977 pleased to state: itself. (a) whether the Government are aware that some employees of South Under the existing procedure for Eastern Railway who were removed availing of the concession, Blind per­ from service for participation in May, sons can have the concession tickets 1974 strike have not been taken back direct from the station concerned on to duty as yet; production of a requisite medical cer­ tificate, which is maintained as a re­ (b) if so, their number; cord by the station staff for internal check and also forms an authority for (c) whether Government had re­ the issue of a concession ticket. In ceived any representation for their view of this, it has not been considered reinstatement; and possible to have the concession ticket (d) what is the decision of the issued on production of identity cards. Government?

THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE Proposals from MRTP Commission to MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI amend MRTP Act, 1969 SHEO NARAIN): (a) t0 (d). Only two such persons remain out of service. 7309. SHRI CHITTA BASU: Will They are undergoing life imprison­ the Minister of LAW, JUSTICE AND ment and the question of their reins­ COMPANY AFFAIRS be pleased to tatement does not arise. refer to reply given to Starred Ques­ tion No. 388 on 21st March, 1978 re­ Railway Concession to BHofl 9fan garding turn over and profits of Industrial Houses and state: 7308. SHRI R. K. MHALGI: Will the (a) whether the MRTP Commission Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased to submitted some proposals for suitable state: amendments of the MRTP Act, 1969 (a) whether it it a fact that the further expansion of the authority of Government have received a repre­ the commission; and a3i Written Answers APRIL 18, 107* Written Antwerk 392

(b) if so, the nature of the propo­ sals and the reaction of the Govern­ i m * * ment thereto?

THE MINISTER OF LAW, JUSTICE 7310. jvw tw w rtm w i n : AND COMPANY AFFAIRS (SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN) (a) and (b) srertf fTT : Certain proposals have been made by the M R T P Commission They inter- (v ) rt 1970%■ 1977?rrfiFr aha include proposals for amendment of the M RTP Act to enable the % fn r tiMfirv wsft ?wt Commission to exercise its powers of 'jwr-'pnp fr*FTT-fwTT w enquiry and investigation more forr , 1fa: effectively and in particular,— (v) w fcrc rpjjft ffe (1) to enable the Commission to function when there is a vacancy/ frsftpr wt’ absence of the Chairman, (u) appointment o* Director of Investigation and other members of fwftr, wrm iftr tw staff, wTfm ) • (t) ?wt (tr).

Oil) to enable the Commission to I T T T w fom 1* 1* * W R T have the same powers as a Civil xnr^PF vsft trrr t r ^ t v vt Court und**r the Civil Procedure Code and the proceedings before the fa* wwer Twtft tt* Commission be deemed to be judi­ cial proceedings, 1956 qft WTTT 293 T 'tft

( i v ) reference to the Commission WtfTTT (l), 28 *rf, 1969 fr of monopolistic trade practices in **T W Fft % fwr, dulged m by one or more under* takings. first TTTtfffT UWWT f t # ^ TT ftfiu $ I (v) the power to the Commission xm Ttf ww srrrr to enquire into rejection of applica­ tions for industrial licence, and e t t t t ( 2) % v w \ < r w n r

tjtott ewrit 9 fT % T T ZRPZfim (vi) to empower the Commission to pass interim orders fa* fiRT, SfIT % r ft % 1 These proposals are presently under consideration of the Export Committee 1-1-74 fr 31-3-77 ?tt headed by Justice Rajindar Sachar which is reviewing the provisions of war, w ft aroft the Companies Act, 1976 and the s to , qurflfrr rrrr srrrftrar/ Monopolies and Restrictive Trade snpiftw ^ 3ri% WTsft F n fw w t ^ Practices Act, 1969 50 as to am plify them and to make them more effec fciirpfffrfaq loisTPrfWftfio. 13 tive The Report of the said Com­ % *r*nnr w Tifwr ^ 1 mittee is expected to be submitted to the Government bv the 30th June, 1978 jnj t o t ft?*RTFT and thereafter, the Government would tt sfirfwr 1956 s r o consider it and formulate its views on 293 V % the recommendations made by the Committee t «rte/

*Tnwft3V*i«f»n mm *» ernment decisions on the (Hathi) Committee on Drugs and Pharmaceu­ fcWTT ticals Industry, a copy of which has been laid on the Table of the House on 29-3-1978, provide for acquiring of 7 3 1 1 . «ft r n n : m disinvested shares of foreign com­ *W*TCft PTT f t : panies by Government financial and public sector institutions. Represen­ ( w ) tot «fawriftr< *rft tation on the Boards of such com­ *pt ftr^rr ir tot w fa w n . *pt^ % panies would be decided in each case depending on such equity holding by farj wfenr •tfnfr «jrn(t tot $; *ftr Government financial and public (m) *rf* , eft **r % far^TTT sector institutions as may result. win***? Representation from Senior ftwr «n^rr ? Stenographers

if «Wy («ft 7313. SHRI ISHWAR CHAUDMRY: Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be ftnr « r c m ) : (v ) (w ). pleased to state: wAwr^-TiarfiR ftft 5m pl TOT (a) whether any representation tf«P JTfT% % f a * STOPT TT

Category Authorised acale Retted Scale

Rs. Rs. (i) Stenographers (1) a 10—495 425-700 (ii) 210—425 plus Spl. PayRs. 550—75° 30/50. (u) Chief Clerks 335-4*5 (>) 435—700 (i/grd of posts) («») 550—750J (a/grd of po«*

It has not been found feasible to THE MINISTER OF STATE IN make any deviation from the recom­ THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS mendation of the Third Pay Commis­ (SHRI SHEO NARAIN), (a) From sion. Since the scales of pay recom­ August, 1975 to June, 1976 mended by the Pay Commission have been implemented, it is not considered (b) Information is not available as that this constitutes an anomaly. the account books of ihe Society are stated to be under the Government Audit Payment of Wages to Parcel Porters at Allahabad (c) and (d). Payments have been witnessed by the Railway representa­ 7314. SHRI BATESHWAR HEM- tive with effect from September, 1977 RAM: Will the Minister of RAILWAYS only. Pnor to this, a certificate that be pleased to refer to the reply given “fair wage is being paid to the work­ to Unstarred Question No. 5709 on the ers” furnished by the Society along- 2nd August, 1977 regarding Payment with the monthly bills was accepted of Wages to Parcel Porters at Allaha­ bad and state: Licensed Porters at Allahabad (a) the specific month and year from which the Society started paying Par­ 7315. SHRI GYANESHWAR cel Porters @ Rs. 3.50 per day; PRASAD YADAV: SHRI N. K. SHEJWALKAR (b) the total payments made to the Parcel Porters and Supervisory staff employed for performing Parcels Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be handling work at Allahabad Railway pleased to refer to the reply given to Station dux mg the period July, 1975 to Unstarred Question No. 3625 on the July, 1977 month-wise separately; 13th December, 1977 regarding Licensed Porters at Allahabad and (c) whether these payments were state whether entire question of made to the Parcel Porters in presen­ introducing the ‘decasuallsauon ce of the representative of the “Princi­ scheme’ at Allahabad Railway station, pal Employer” as per provisions made after taking all pros and cons of both under the Contract Labour (Regu­ the systems into consideration, has lation and Abolition) Act, 1970; and been examined in the Ministry and what is the final outcome of their (d) if not, the reasons therefor? examination? a 37 W ritten Am txrt CflATfRA 38, i960 ($AkA) Written Answer* 23* THE MINISTER OP STATE IN in the near future particularly in view THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS of the backwardness of the tract; and (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): The matter hi still under consideration. (d) if not, the reasons therefor? THE MINISTER OF STATE IN Workmen Engaged for Parcel Hand* THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS lint at Mughalsaral (SHRI SHEO NARAIN): (a). No, Sir. 7316. SHRI ISHWAR CHAUDHRY: Will the Minister of RAILWAYS be (b) and (c). Do not aril®. pleased to refer to the reply given to (d). There is extreme shortage of Unstaired Question No. 3610 on the funds and the limited funds which are 13th December, 1977 regarding work­ available are not sufficient even to men engaged for parcel handling at meet the requirements of the projects Mughalsarai and state: already in hand. (a) the total amount paid to the workmen during the period Novem­ Idling of Wagons ber, 1975 to March, 1978 month-wise separately and whether the entire pay­ 7318. SIIRI VASANT SATHE: Will ment was made in presence of the the Minister of RAILWAYS be pleased authorised representative of the prin­ to state; cipal employer; (b) the total amount paid to the (a) whether it is a fact that large scale idling of wagons is in evidence in Supervisory Staff during the above- mentioned period month-wise separate­ the delay caused in the carrying of whole cement, fertilisers and other ly; and goods both for public and private (c) the details of payments made by sectors and the situation has become the Eastern Railway against work done critical enough to call for immediate bills for the period November, 1975 to action to normalise the position; February, 1978 month-wise separately? (b) if so, furnish details regarding THE MINISTER OP STATE IN the reported idling of wagons; and THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (c) details of action laken/proposed (SHRI SHEO NARAIN); (a) to (c). in the matter? The information is being collected and will be laid on the Table of the THE MINISTER OF STATE IN Sabha. THE MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS (SHRI SHEO NARAIN); (a) to (c). There have been cases of delay in Bareli to Sagar Railway Line loading and releases of wagons at 7317. SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMA­ loading and unloading points res­ TH: Will the Minister of RAILWAYS pectively, resulting in blocking of a pleased to state: -number of wagons mainly in the Collieries, Steel Plants, Thermal (a) Whether it is a fact that a Power stations, Fertilizer unloading survey was undertaken some years points etc. The following steps have ago for the construction of a railway been initiated by the Ministry of line from Bareli (district Reiren, Railways in coordination with the Madhya Pradesh) to Saga* (Madhya other concerned Ministries, to Im­ Pradesh); prove the situation:— if so. the outcome thereof; (j) Prequent meetings by the (c) whether Government propose to Director, Rail Movement, Calcutta, include that project for implementation who controls the allotments of coal Written Answers APRIL 18, 1978 Laid 240

In Calcutta, with the representatives ( 1) *r*m % tt# ^kiwi Ir of the Coal India Limited and the Steel Authority of India 1itx. ( 2) w fa % w titfi « r t ^ r (ii) Setting up of a Task Foroe consisting of senior officers of f^tT g n fN v rsftfauft Ministry of Railways, Energy and t *rrfr w w w rr (111) Constitution of Working Group with representatives of the % f w K v r WR ^ V 71TT Department of Agriculture and Rail­ ways to review the loading of fei $ • tilizers and the release of wagons at unloading points and to rationa­ lise movements to the maximum 12 00 h r s extent possible PAPERS LAID ON THE TABLE (iv) Periodical meetings with the

representatives of the Department Ruvifw on the W orking and Annual of Food for streamlining the move­ Report op Pyrites, Phosphates and ment of foodgrams Chem icals Lim ited for 1976-77

w i tow * tftx if » N r w m 3 TTwr*foft (*rt ): 7319. wren? mw : wr nwrcr ft ?*n 1956 a f t H P T 619 *R H ?t 3ft ? TTfftWT I

fcrifaww* (vftftm ( 2 ) trP5TT?7tf, «£«¥ *n rm ) : ( * ) . ifk ( ). 9 faftr?*, y d irr*T star, fawr Tt^rm (ftr^rr) «pt ^ 1976- iftsfaSrir Tycrr$, ymfcfor 77 vi srf^ r, #wt- ?r^5WT ^ *rc Hw*w 22 53 wrds ^ an* w* gy rra * i ^ h « i ,i 4’0w ^ » f % ° r f » n r t 1 $ I ^ « P P T TJQ | %ftx m ?IT | f*p [Placed i n Library See N o . L T - i9 8 o fPP^TT^tsn^n 1 2108/78 ] 41 Re* Calling CHAITRA 28* 1900 (SAKA) Committee on 342 Attention Public Undertakings Report NonncATioNs under Representation THE MINISTER Off AGRICUL­ OF THE PEOPLE ACT, 1950 AND COM­ TURE AND IRRIGATION (SHRI PANIES Act, 1956 SURJIT SINGH BARNALA): I was collecting all the facts; I have collec­ fcftr,nw iftrirwuft it r fifw w ted the facts.... $ x m («ft wrftqr *nw ) : MR. SPEAKER. I will take it up «r«w qtfwr, * faRfafwer «rar *rm at 1 O’Clock. Will that be all right? T??T TT T^rr g : SHRI SURJIT SINGH BARNALA: ( 1) srffrfafac? «rfafirc*i, I have got the statement ready. 1950 tffinreretf s t o r t ( 2) MR SPEAKER: Is it a long one? %

(2 ) -PTOft >Rf«rf5W»r, 1956 tft 12.01 hrs. 3FTTT 620V «Ft ^‘TSTTT ( 3) ^ PUBLIC ACCOUNTS COMMITTEE «r^ifa 4«fe$9!TT *twt xt° m ° S e v e n t y - t h i r d R e p o r t fao 426 (f^tft ?m SHRI C M STEPHEN (Idukki); I tft srf%, ft fcsrrsr 5 beg to piesent the Seventy-third Re- 1 wfa, 1978 % % m t- poit of the Public Accounts Commit­ W TT SWftTCT «ft cm fa* tee on paragraph 48 of the Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General %*TTTfatf v y m x Treranft of India for the year 1975-76, Union Ttq^ft (m vU ) fir- Government (Civil) on University r f *>, fsw «ft

RE. CALLING ATTENTION COMMITTEE ON PUBLIC UNDER­ MR. SPEAKER: Calling Attention, TAKINGS Shri Somnath Chatterjee. F o u r t h R e p o r t a n d M i n u t e s SHRI SOMNATH CHATTERJEE (Jadavpur): Up till now, we have not SHRI JYOTIRMOY BOSU (Dia­ r*ceiv«d any statement mond Harbour): I beg to present the 243 Matters under APRIL 16, 107* Ik*»le 3W *44 following Report and Minutes of the State Governments consent to the Committee on Public Undertakings:— exercise of powers by the Central Bureau of Investigation for criminal (1) Fourth Report on Extraordi­ offences in that State. The consent narily High Expenditure on Publi­ was given many years back b y the city by Public Undertakings. State Government. Thus, the Chief (2) Minutes of the sitting of the Minister has opened up possibility of Committee relating to the above Re­ a potentially explosive conflict with port. t h e Centre in another sensitive areas. There are reports that some other State Governments will follow in his foot steps. The Andhra Government 12.42 tea. has also withdrawn its consent. Thus, t h e CBI will not be able to operate in COMMITTEE ON PRIVATE MEM­ many parts of the country and thus BERS' BILLS AND RESOLUTIONS tt may pose a serious problem for the Centre. Seventeenth Report The background for the withdrawal SHRI NIRMAL CHANDRA JAIN ot the consent by the Chief Minister (Seoni): I beg to present the Seven­ is that the Central Government in teenth Report of the Committee on exercise of its powers appointed the Private Members’ Bills and Resolu­ Grover Commission last year to look tions. , into the charges of corruption and nepotism against Mr. Devraj Urs. The Commission found him guilty on four 12.2£ hrs. counts. It is stated that another list of charges of corruption etc. was sub­ COMMITTEE ON PETITIONS mitted to the Grover Commission after the dismissal of the Karnataka Minis- T h i r d R e p o r t try headed by Mr Urs The Commis­ sion is supposed to look into all these chargcs. By withdrawing the consent, *Ti**nrr the Chief Minister wanted the Centre to drop further proceedings against him on the plea that the people o f «FGrr 1 1 Karnataka had given him a fresh mandate. But the Central Govern­ ment has refused tp agree with him The Central Government rightly feels 12.03 hrs. that any person, whosoever he may bo small or big, must be punished if he MATTERS UNDER RULE 377 has indulged in corrupt practices as everybody is equal in the eye of the (i) R e p o r t e d W i t h d r a w a l o f C o n s e n t law. b y c h i e f M i n i s t e r o f K a r n a t a k a t o

THE EXERCISE OF POWERS BV C.B.I. IN

t h e S t a t e The Karnataka Chief Minister has refused to accept this principle and he SHRI KANWAR LAL GUPTA has now retaliated by striking at the {Delhi Sadar): With your permission, C.B.I. operation at Karnataka. The Sir, I want to make a statement under news that the Commission has been rule 377. A *11 facing hostile demonstrations have also appeared in the press. This ac­ tion of the Chief Minister is a crude The Chief Minister of Karnataka, attempt t0 save himself from the Mr. Devraj Urs, has withdrawn the clutches of the Commission, If he is 345 H auers under CHAITRA 28, 1900 ( SAKA) Rule 877 246

innocent, he should be ready to lace the 2nd oi March, 1078 that •‘Govern­ the Commission boldly. It happened ment are at present studying the many times in the past that many legislation, meaning, Nuclear Non- State Governments had requested the Proliferation Bill passed by the U. S. Central Government to give the help Senate, the legislation in the context Of the C.B.I. to investigate senous of its implications of Indo-US Nuc­ cases of corruption, bribery, atrocities lear cooperation." etc. The withdrawal of the consent will amount to the destruction of a The Government would do well to useful instrument like C.B.I, It will take the House into confidence with also disturb the Centre-State relations. regard to the exact position today on It will create many complicated pro­ thi# matter. blems because there are many enemy (iii) Reported D rought conditions ur agents, saboteurs and anti-social ele­ M anipur ments in all parts of the country and SHRI N. TOMBI SINGH (Inner the Central Government is supposed Manipur); Mr. Speaker, under rule to keep a watch on them. If the Cen­ 377, I would like to raise a matter of tral agencies like C.B.I. are checked public importance. Severe draught by the State Government in this way, condition all over the State of Mani­ a peculiar situation can develop, which pur has caused indescribable hard­ may pose a threat to the security of ship to the people of Manipur. Rains the country. It should also be presum­ are late this year. Usually the mon­ ed that the Central agencies like soon starts in March. This year upto C.B.I. should work m the States, in­ this time of April, there is no rain. dependent of any political influence In that region, there is no big river. The withdrawl of the consent has Al] the small rivers originate \n the made the conditions from bad to hills surrounding the Manipur Valley. worse. They are all rainfed. Dry season I demand that the Home Minister started from the month of December. should make a statement on this issue. Owing to the unique topographic con­ If the Home Minister wants to say dition of the region flood and drought something on this, let him say. follow each other quickly. Every day

( u ) R e p o r t e d D e l a y i n S u p p l y o f is precious. All the sources of water

E n r i c h e d U r a n i u m b y U . S . A . f o r in the hill areas well as in the Valley

A t o m i c P o w e r P l a n t a t T a r a p u h have dried up. The State Govern­ ment, the Municipal Board and all SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH such bodies are addressing themselves (Hoshangabad): By your leave, I to the task o f emergency water supply proceed under rule 377 to make the spending huge amounts of money following statement: There has ap­ every day. May I request the Gov­ parently been inordinate delay on the ernment of India and Agriculture part of the Government of the United Minister to rush to the rescue of the States in arranging for the shipment people in this plight? It is time that of enriched uranium needed for our permanent measures be taken to Atomic Power Plant at Tarapur. There avoid such situations in the future by are also two statements made by the digging sufficient number of tanks in Minister of External Affairs in Lok the Valley and by creating more Sabha, one on 23rd of February, 1978 catchment areas near foothills in the that “President Carter in one of his northern portion of the Valiey from communications to our Prime Minister, which the Valley acutely slops down has reiterated his hope that India towards the south. The forest depart­ would see its way to accepting the ment also should see that indiscrimi­ comprehensive international safe­ nate destruction of forests for fire­ guards on all of its nuclear activities," wood or shifting cultivation be stopp­ and secondly by the Minister of State ed to ensure rainfall throughout the in the Ministry of External Affairs on year. Rule *7? H i Matter* under APRIL 18, 1978

( i v ) R e p o b t k d T h r e a t t o r b s o r t t o I do not mind But the rule is that

s t r i k e b y O f f i c e r s o f N ationalised you have to stick to your written

B a n k * statement

SHRI VXNODBHAI B SHETH «ft w w y r c mm : ft warn (Jamnagar) Mr Speaker, Sir, with *n£ta*r, g i wnr your permission, I would like to raise the following matter under Rule 377 — jforT ft «r*r wt i> r «i«r & t * ^ rnrt The reported threat to resort to strike by 38,000 officers of 14 nationa­ «r**i lised banks, the State Bank of India 5 i ftft ^ ^ftf* f w «rr fp and it* subsidiaries throughout the *rtf f*sr% xttt country, against the unilateral decision of Government to implement the Pillai «Ft 5 TWT % falj 5 ® ^ x% May 1, 1978, has created widespread discontent m business circles *rrFrt % ft oft %r$mr iff *rmr a w t % fw? The Finance Ministry is requested $ ft t ftw i to discuss this matter with the All India Confederation of Bank Officers’ ^ *T vr r f t TfrH W,T fft Organization immediately to avert ftft *ft w «TT - irRY ift thi8 impending strike, which will otherwise paralyse the entire economy q-fit «rtT « ? t * 1 3 $ t # & * * * of the nation *rar fa s to wprr ir ^ P?

( v ) R e p o r t e d F i r e i n I n d i a n E m b a s s \ f , ^ r v 'iT ^fte iftr *n|

a t M a n i l a frrearmr ^ w ^r ^ «ft x m (jwtrt ) ft in srm11 sft, 4 srpT % ft qjfT SHRI KANWAR aLAL GUPTA The Home Minister may like t say ax* 0 something on the matter that I have win fo?iT ^aprr g t fro # 25 qrrt vt raised anr 29*rtf vt MR SPEAKER It is upto the n * TOrarfc*n far** Minister, if he wants to make a state­ srnnrrd sn«?i w x 1 1 % ment, I do not object it fUTft * wnr gift, SHRI K LAKKAPPA (Tumkur) ftfc^T t o *ri, *nrnr w w f, When matters are raised under Rule m r d , 377, statements should come from Ministers «ft vnr hjtst 9 , «ptt Sraar fY, 5*r ^ «ft x fvfit m\ MR SPEAKER I have requested sraft f i ft wt wft-for f t them to do it

w£vrw*nr Ttftf,Sr*$?r f ^ T *pt ftranr Mr Stephen has given a notice i I $ STVrT % »rhT ’RcH £ ......

MR SPEAKER Mr Lai, I would SHRI C M STEPHEN (Idukki) like to point out one thing The rule There is a small matter which I want is that you have to give a written to raise on which, I am sure, all Mem­ statement and stick to that You have bers of this House will be united to given something, but are making supporting me The point la what was another point If you depart a little, raised here yesterday, though <& 249 Matter* under CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Rule 377 250 record, about the law and order situa­ MR. SPEAKER: Not mine, it is tion in the country. Enough has been that of the House. said—and enough has happened—in the House and outside, by high and SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH: low, to give the impression, the feel­ Yes, ours, but you wield it. There­ ing, that the situation in the country fore, I am anxious that it would not is grave. You were pleased enough descend on the Home Ministry by any to announce yesterday that there will means. (If the Steel Ministry goes be a discussion. I expected it would scot-free and if the Energy Ministry be scheduled for today at least and I goes gcot-free, I don’t mind.) There­ was disappointed when I found it was fore, the only way out is for the House not there. I am not making any ac­ to sit till 7 o’clock today, tomorrow, cusation or any such thing, but the next Monday and Tuesday, Yesterday matter is very, very urgent. I do not the Minister of External Affairs took want to use the name of the Presi­ about 40 minutes. He is a young dent—it should not be used—but when bachelor Minister who was making a certain announcement has come, it his maiden speech, and we didn’t want behoves us that the Parliament does to upset him — take note of it with a sense of urgency, MR SPEAKER: All bachelors with the highest priority; and I urge should not speak about maidens. upon you to allow a discussion in this matter, with sufficient time, on a very AN HON. MEMBER; All—young early

MR. SPEAKER; That is why I have world the faith that ours was a de­ said that the House will consider it. mocratic country and that our We will consider it at the appropriate people believed in democratic prin­ stage. I ciples and civil liberties and were against authoritarianism and that SHRI KANWAR LAL GUPTA: May this country meant what it said X m#ke a submission with your kind in severe contrast to what the permission? Today we received List people had experienced during the II ol ‘No-Day-Yet Named Motions.’ last regime. There are still various This List has been approved by distortions in the world politics and you . The last is 252 which is regard­ our foreign policy should be based ing the law and order situation. You upon the realization that the days of mentioned it yesterday also, that Mr. colonialism and imperialism have not Stephen has sent a motion. In this yet come to an end and the stronghold connection 1 want to make a submis­ ot the colonial and imperialist pow­ sion. This very motion is already ers has not been loosened. We realise there in the first List which you ac­ that the direct colonial political rule cepted and circulated, and that is in has ended in majority of the coun­ my name. So, I think, those who have tries. but still the people of Zimbabwe, given the notice first should be given Namibia and South Africa are groan- the first priority and those who have \ng under the worst types of repres­ given the notice later should be given sion, misrule and colonial hegemony. the second priority. If my namo is Still, in South Africa a large number first, I should be given the first of people are victims of the vicious chance; if some other hon. Member’s policy of apartheid which is the very name is first, he should be given the negation of a civilised system of Gov­ first priority. That is my submission. ernment Still millions of people have MR. SPEAKER: Business Advisory been, denied their right of self-deter­ Committee will consider that. mination and are held as hostages of a repressive white minority rule.

12121 hrs. Sir, as I was saying, although direct and over political rule in many coun­ DEMANDS FOR GRANTS, 1978-79— tries by colonial powers has ended, Contd yet the imperialist forces are still ope­ rating in multitudinal forms. We have M i n i s t r y or E x t e r n a l A f f a i r s — seen the neo-colonial exploitation of Contd. the under-developed and developing countries by the developed and im­ MR. SPEAKER: The House will perialist countries. We find that in now take up further discussion on the the fields of monetary reforms and Demands for Grant under the control economic fields like procurement and of the Ministry of External Affairs. supply of raw materials, adequate pri­ ces of finished goods and in sharing of Shri Somnath Chatterjee. oroflts by multi-pronged activities of SHRI SOMNATH CHATTERJEE the imperialist countries through their (Jadavpur): Mr. Speaker, Sir, in the agencies including multi-national cor­ field of external affairs I feel that the porations. These are the various fa­ present Government can claim to cets of colonial and imperialist strategy have mad© some achievements and that has been taken by the developed Shri Atal Bihari Vaipayee has, to countries in the world to exploit the some extent, redeemed himself. The poor and developing countries. In greatest task of this Government was South Africa, where Mahatma Gandhi to restore, amongst the nations of the had started his struggle against colo- 253 DG ; 1078-79 CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) D.G., 1978-79 254

nicrUsm and imperialism, the people We must thank our Foreign Minis­ arc still fighting for their emancipa­ ter for the policy which he has taken tion, political and economic. They are in forging good neighbourly relations fighting against the inhuman policy with the countries surrounding us and of apartheid and it is our solemn res­ we particularly welcome the steps ponsibility that we should pledge our taken in that regard and the visits total support by all means political, which the hon. Foreign Minister had diplomatic and economic to those peo­ undertaken to different countries like ple in Africa who are fighting for Pakistan, Bhutan, Burma, etc. It is their political liberation and against essential that we should have the best exploitation of all types and forms. of relations with them. The relations We should see that the imperialist and have improved. We should have bet­ the colonial powers do not get any ter trade relations. We should have foothold and do not get any opDOrtu- better travel facilities. We should nity to create divisions amongst the have more and more cultural exchan­ people who are fighting for their libe­ ges and this is a welcome change we ration. One of the methods of entren­ find from the policies that had been ching the minority ruled in these coun­ followed by the last regime. tries like Namibia and Zimbabwe is to tiy to creatc divisions among the peo­ Many apprehensions had been ex­ ple of the country. As we have seen pressed by some of the Members on the recent Anglo-US proposal with the Congress side of both houses but regard to Zimbabwe is ducclcd to­ it appears that Mr. Atal Bihari Vaj­ wards creating a division among the payee has taken to this Department as blark majority there and I flnrl ihere a Ash takes to water and we very ib some anomaly in our foreign policy much welcome and I must thank him with regard to Zimbabwe because in for the way he has tried to cement the annual report of this Ministry we better and better relations with our find that our government has welcom­ neighbours. ed the so-caUed positive elements in the Anglo-US proposals which are supposed to be directed towards With regard to China we also wel­ achieving independence for them, but come the Government’s decision to im­ we find these Anglo-US proposals arc prove the relationship with China. One nothing but an attempt to create divi­ aspect I want to make it clear. The sions amongst the majority people. We Communist Party of India (Marxist) have expressed our strong support for was the subject matter of various types democratic rights of the people of of a slander campaign. What Zimbabwe and in their struggle against was advocated by them? They the white-dominated minority regime. had advocated that all outstand­ At the same time, when we are sup­ ing problems should be solved porting their fight for liberation and by mutual negotiations and that is pre­ freedom from the white-dominated mi­ cisely what the Foreign Minister has nority regime, and I request this ano­ said in respect of our relations witft maly to be removed, we also welcome China. We find after a long time posi­ the Anglo-US proposals and there are tive steps are being taken to improve supposed to be some positive elements the relationship with China and I must m these proposals which are no­ welcome this npproach of the present thing but an attempt to create divi­ government. It is essential that we sions as we have seen, amongst the really reciprocate all attempts to maiorltv people and which will seri­ improve the relationship with China ously affect their united struggle for and we hope that greater and grater emancipation and for political and co-operation will be there and with economic freedom. greater and greater understanding bet- D.G., 1978-79 APRIL 18, 1978 D.G., 1978-79 256

TShri Somnath Chatterjee] With regard to the Indian ocean we •ween these two countries we shall have want that this should be a zone of the best of relations between us. peace and there should be abolition of bases. I find there is no mention ab­ So far as West Asm is concerned we out Diego Garcia and our attitude to­ must protest against the attempt of ihe wards that and it has been referred to U.S Government to divide the Arab as if thero is a major power rivalry world. We have accepted as the basis and that is creating difficulties in the of our policy that the occupied terri­ situation. tories must be relumed to Egypt and that the representative character of 11 seems that the U.S. imperialist P.L.O. has to be acknowledged Bui forces have been equated with the so- the recent attempt by President Sadat tialist forces and as if we are trying who has really played the role of the to minimise the danger which Diego U.S. imperialists has been directed to­ G

Sc far as the policy of non-align­ SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH ment is concerned, we feel that wc (Hoshangabad) Mr Speaker. Sir. when should continue with this policy of we lift our anxious minds from the non-alignment We should follow the somewhat disconcerting, if not dismal Colombo Resolution of the non-align­ domestic scene to the global scene our ed countries and we want that India hearts do warm up somewhat. But. should be in the fore-front in the fight Sir, that scene, that landscape is also against imperialism and neo-colonial- over-shadowed by some misgivings, ism and we should vigorously pursue some doubts. There are trouble spots; this policy of non-alignment. there are difficult spots and there are many areas of conflict where we can With regard to South Korea, I have pla> a useful role. something to say This is a country •with which our relations should have I will come to that presently. Rac­ been on the basis of our own experi­ ing against time, I will not indulge in ence We should have remembered a long speech. I think you will per­ our own experience in our country mit m(> to make my few points. This is the regime which has been propped up by US. Armed Forces and MR. SPEAKER: That is true. You specially after the defeat of the U S. are right. imperialist forces in Vietnam, the U.S. and Japan are holding military exer­ cises in this area and, unfortunately, SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH: I find there is no mention in the Annu­ But. Sir, I should have been given al Report of this Ministry to the pro­ more time The two Ministers will posal for unification of the two Koreas take one and half hours between and what this Government is going to themselves and out of what is left, at do and what is its policy with regard least twenty minutes should have been to unification given to me. 257 *>•

SHRI ATAL* BIHARI VAJPAYEE: SHRI JYOTIRMOY BOSU; Prohi­ I am prepared to forego my speech. bition could not make such a puny re­ duction. SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH: Give me twenty minutes. SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH: Now I will come to the other issues MR. SPEAKER; Only ten minutes which are very important from the for you point of view of our policy. It is a SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH: truism to say that a nation’s foreign I would rather not speak. policy should conduce to and promote its national interests in conformity with MR SPEAKER: I hope you will its basic domestic policy. make a very useful contribution and, in ten minutes, you know how to sum­ MR. SPEAKER: It is an extension marise. I know he can compress that. of the domestic policy.

SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH: SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH: Before I come to the main issues. I Thank you very much, Sir. It is in will ha' q just Cor a few seconds a conformity with the basic principles of glance at the Demands of the Ministry peace, friendship and cooperation with of External Affairs. On pages 5 and all nations and here we have to see 15. in the printed booklet I find there and show that our national interests arc two furious items—first is the en­ are promoted. All the whole, while we tertainment charge Under that, there are promoted. All the while, while we iv an item —entertainment of the digni­ to the basic principles. taries. The mam trouble spots are in Asia SHRI ATM. BIHARI VAJPAYEE: and Africa. As a matter of fact, the Including those of the United Nations. entire world, all the countries of the SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH: world, are now free except, as far as I I am gldd that you have raised this can see—or as far as I am aware, some point. But, Sir, this is blank. Nothing countries of Southern Africa and is shown against it. Under Entertain­ certain Islands in the Pacific, and the ment chirges and Entertainment of Atlantic. The other countries are na­ dignitaries that is blank. Nothing is tionally liberated. Whatever their in­ shown. ternal systems are, we do not bother about. SHRI JYOTIRMOY BOSU (Dia­ mond Harbour): They do riot want to Now. we are mending our fences very tell us about others. well with many countries, with our neighbours, particularly due to the SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH: personal relations, personal contacts of Fortunately, the expenditure is shown the External Affairs Minister who in on page 15: there is an item called— his amiable flexible style has managed ‘entertainment of foreign dignitaries!’ to shed many of his former Jan Sangh That means to say, does it include predilections and adopted himself very Indian dignitaries as well? I do not well to the Janata Party and Janata know. That should be made clear. I Government’s foreign policy. That am glad to find that the budget esti­ shows his resilience and flexibility and mate is now reduced from the last adaptability and thereby it has promo­ year’s estimate of Rs. 104 lakhs. This ted the country's interestsi very well year’s estimate will be only Rs. 63 indeed. But Sir, even then with regard lakhs. That, I suppose i$ due to the to China, with regard to Pakistan, ooUcy of prohibition. I think it is a with regard to Kashmir—I mean—in welcome reduction in our budget for answering a question of mine in the entertainment Lok Sabha recently—he said that so 512 LS—?. 259 D.G., 1978-79 APRIL 18, 1978 D.G., 1978-70 260

[Shri Hari Vishnu Kamath] one of the Generals was reported to far as Kashmir is concerned he has have said. At that time, Six Colombo had so many talks with the Pakistan Powers, Six non-aligned Nations, met representatives here recently; he has at Colombo and decided on a plan. been to Pakistan also and I do not Pandit Jawaharlal Nehru, the then know what detailed talks he had there. Prime Minister, accepted the plan with It has been a sort of top secret. I do alacrity though it fell far short of the not think he has told us all about it original proposal made by him for the so far. The latest statement made by vacation of aggression by China of him in regard to a question of mine on Indian territory. The Prime Minister the 6th of April, with regard to Kash­ Shri , wants a change; mir, was that the Government of In­ the only change in the resolution dia's position on Kashmir is well- which Parliament passed in 1962, the known. The whole of Jammu and historic resolution passed by the Lok Kashmir is constitutionally and legally Sabha in 1962, the only change that the an integral part of India, that is to say, Prime Minister made was that the it is only a de jure part of India not words ‘drive the aggressor from the yet de facto, because a part of Kash­ sacred soil of India’ should be changed mir is still in Pakistan’s possession and to ‘vacation of aggression'. Even in perhaps a little part is also in Chinese the time of Pandit Nehru a special possession via Pakistan___(Interrup­ session was called in January 1963, tions) one-week-session, in the history of free MR. SPEAKER: He will be disturb­ India there was no other special ses­ ed. sion in January for a special purpose; SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH: it was called to endorse the proposals I think the Minister should make the made by the 6 Powers which had met Government’s position clear on this in Colombo, and Parliament also en­ subject as to what exactly the Govern­ dorsed the proposals made by the Co­ ment pioposes to do with regard to the lombo Powers and accepted by the Kashmir issue whether it is by peace­ Prime Minister at that time. I should ful negotiations, whether there is any like to know whethei any communica­ prospect of a successful outcome of tion has been received by the govern­ peaceful negotiations. So also with re­ ment from the Chinese government gard t,> China, the Prime Minister from any Chinese authority, the Chi­ made a statement recently in regard nese President or the Chinese Prime to a Call Attention by me last month, Minister with regard to this subject I believe saving that we would certain­ after the Prime Minister made the ly settle border disputes by peaceful statement*in the House, whether they are ‘willing to enter into negotiations negotiations and he suggested that it would be clone on the basis of the five and if so on what basis. pnnciples of Pan oh Sheel. Now, un­ Then there is the question of ge­ fortunately. Pandit Jawaharlal Nehru, n u i n e non-alignment. Non-alignm ent ac Prime Minister, who was shocked is a much bandied word, sometimes and dismayed and who finally inter­ misused a’so. Genuine non-alignm ent nally follapseri after the Chinese ag­ r e a l non-aLgnment. Can we at a l l say, gression at the beginning was insis­ so far as West Asia is concerned, can tent that China should withdraw from we place our hand on our hearts and ihc occupied territories. But then Chi­ say that India is genuinely n o n - a l i g n ­ na unilaterally withdrew not from ed so far as West Asia is concerned? those territories, withdrew from India, and then threatened to come again. MR. SPEAKER : It depends upon That was the statement which was the nature of the heart. made by one of the Chinese Generals; “we have come to India once, if need SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH: be we will come again.” That is what While in the Opposition, he was as 2 ( 1 DG ., 1978-70 CHAWRA 28, i960 (SAKA) D G ., 1978-79 262

vehement also or even more vehement Government should look into this and than some of us used to be with regard rectify the position Then two more to government's West Asia policy, at points that tune Congress Government’s West Asian policy and now of course the MR SPEAKER You have already Janata governments policy which he taken fifteen minutes has to follow Look at the prepoit- SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH I rousness of this policy It is only a will take another five minutes Thu is hangover of the moronic policy ini­ what the first Speaker used to say: tiated by Jawaharlal Nehru and ear­ fifteen minutes and if the Member is ned on for 25 years and pursued with making substantial points, five minutes even greater vigour by his daughter more Shrimati The hangover is still there, it is difficult to shake off MR SPEAKER At that time you JO years policy hangover But some were lucky because there were very beginning should be made I should few speakers like to suggest that m the world there are countries even small countries like SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH Nepal and Burma who aie our neigh­ Time can be extended by one hour bours who ha\e got full diplomatic relations with Israel as well as Arab There is a conflict going on between States I have got a list here I do not Vietnam and Cambodia in Asia, both have the time to read the whole list are communist countries But the Minister for External Affairs was re­ MR SPEAKER Your time is up ported by the Samachar Correspondent SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH on the 3rd of January to have observ­ 1 have got two or three points to make ed that the conflict was unfortunate, and I hope they arc not unimportant especially as both Vietnam and Cam­ cnes you will appreciate There are bodia were non-aligned countries ” I European countnes, African countries, do not know where he got this con Asian countries—there are about 48 ception from that both Vietnam and <<>untucs that have got full diplomatic Cambodia were non-aligned countries relations with Arab States a«t well as This was Samachar report I do not Isinc.1 Among them are States like know whether it is wrong report or Nepal Burma Turkey among the misreporting riuslim States Iian also But we are SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE: not h ivmg even bilateral consular re- Are > ou objecting to the word were’ litions I do not ask for more at pre­ or to the substance of the matter’ Both sent What is this if not pusillani­ are non-aligned mity? SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH STS rzj TWZ I Both are non-aligned’ One is pro- Moscow and the other is pro-China 1 h(y have got a consul here, but we They are non-aligned’ (Interrup­ have no consul in Israel tions. )• SHRI JYOTIRMOY BOSU We can Now one last word Mrs Indira ask this consul to go away Gandhi, who is taking every oppor* SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH tumty to condemn this Government, m That is alright If we can do that, it is season and out of season, has now alright But look at the absurdity come out with a statement preposter­ The British Embassy m Israel is sup­ ous statement, that too many pacts is posed to look after our interests in a sign of weakness That she herself Israel, used to, I do not know what indulged in too many pacts it does the position is today That is the not matter ! But our Government absurdity of the whole position. The should not Look at this 263 D G > 1978-70 APRIL 18, 1978 D.G., 1978-70

DR. SUBRAMANIAM SWAMY unless the question of Japanese and (Bombay North-East): She is jealous. Swahili is decided, Hindi cannot be taken up at all in the United Na­ SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH: Of tions. course. Lastly, she says: “who was it that brought Kashmir within the folds of India?’* I hope all these questions which I have raised will be looked into by the Look at this. Minister, and next year we will have a few brighter things to say about the " ---- those verv Janata people were performance of the Ministry in foreign opposed to it because Nehru was a affairs. Kashmiri”. What is this? If people go about saying this kind of thing, I think, the sooner they shut up the better. tjw swTir firnst (W te ) : roarer w$zw, t qft SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE: JTHTifatf tit *ri*ff *fT There is freedom of speech. % ’snrT fj i ?ir eft $ SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH It JTPFfar fairSFr ifeft 3ft 3PTST TT«ff is a licence. One last word about tit 3TSTT Tt fSTf ^iT STTfrTr j - - external publicity, External publicity is so badly arranged, particularly sreafaf irfa: aswrr public relations in our ' Embassies tit tit f w i i 1^ abroad, that the speech made by the External Affairs Minister in United «Frfar % qrir fasr # w «tt f

fa* «fin> w r t # r r fin? \m ?ft»ff v t »ft f w wn? 1 5fta ^«rr *t^yt $ f r F=rwmr *rc wvk STFTTOT 639 ^ 3TTT *TT ^ ft | f«P «tft m * n tf’jw ttt^ Sr ft **nH^ 1 % 3?tt «ftr ^?r w H r % fire? srcrrr iftr ftr^r *feft tft anft fr*%jrfv*rr rr 5^n%r TfT«rr fT^r%wr^^'TT^TfT% frs f IH% THTTT MHl«llWT*ITTTftl 267 D .G , 1978-79 APRIL IB, 1978 D G , 1978-79 268

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CALLING ATTENTION TO MATTER Relief operations have been started by OF URGENT PUBLIC IMPORTANCE the State Government Special Medi­ cal Team has reached the affected C y c l o n e i n O r i s s a areas and the tempoiary hospital has been opened Injured peisons have SHRI SOMNAIH CHATTERJEE been hospitalised and serious cases are (Jadavpur) I beg to call the attention being removed to Cuttack Medical Col­ of the Munster of Agriculture and lege Hospital Besides normal diet, Irugation to the following matter ol special nutritive diet like fruits and uigent public importance and request Horlicks for affected patients have that he m

fShn Surjit Singh Bamala] of seven villages under Rama- lagers are to be shifted to safer sites chandrapura police station were be­ for rehabilitation and Central assistance lieved to be alive. Those who have for construction of new houses, pur­ survived are still dazed and unable chase of bullocks and assistance for to give a graphic description of what agricultural operations is necessary. had happened” The requirements of Central assist­ ance are being worked out by the The Times of India has given the grim State Government. We are in con­ details of the tragedy It sajs stant touch with the State Government and I may assure the House that all “That impact of the cyclone was so great that m one case the head necessary action is being and will be taken to assist the State Government, was severed from the body. Some in mitigating the distress of the people lost their ears or eyes A ten >ear old child was seen crying affected population. for his parents who were believed The has decid­ dead ” ed to provide an intenm Advance Plan assistance of Rs 2 crores to assist the This is the magnitude or seventy of State Government to meet their im­ the problem According to unoflicnl mediate commitments This will be in reports the death toll has almost addition to the margin money of reached 500 Though the statement Rs 3 58 crores already available with sayb 9 persons in Cuttack district and the State Government for relief 151 in the Keonjhar district”, accord­ ing to other reports, the figures are operations much more This magnitude of the An amount of Rs 3 lakhs has been devastation should be fully appreci­ provided to the State Government from ated A large number of persons h0/* the Prime Minister’s Relief Fund also been injured So far as Pumabandha- I may also add that the Government guda village is concerned, it appears of Orissa is doing commendable work that all the houses have been destroyed and it has taken up relief operations and the entire village has been razed m very quick time to the ground The difficulty is that SHRI SOMNATH CHATTERJEE: most of the houses are mud houses Mr Deputy-Speaker, because of this or huts and they could not possloly natural calamity a large number of withstand the violent tornado whicd poor people of our country in the hit them It has very seriously affected State of Onssa have been affected We the cattle population also of that area find that what has happened in that State is devastating. It appears from I am happy to note that the State the newspaper reports that hundreds of Orissa, with its limited economic of dwellings, mostly mud huts, col resources, is trying its best, and the lapsed like a house of cards The report Minister has been good enough to ap­ preciate the commendable effort that •ays has been made. But we want that the "According to an eye-witness, Central Government should also play Hundreds of trees were uprooted and its role. We notice that the assistance many cattle lost. Corrugated tin which has been given is the very sheets, bamboo poles, doors and minimum. Only gratuitous relief for windows were seen flying in the air. seven days has been started. When The impact of the whirlwind was faced with a calamity of this magni­ so severe that cattle were lifted high tude, relief for seven days will be in the air and a building in which hardly adequate. Apart from provid­ 100 people had taken shelter col­ ing free medical treatment, we think lapsed, trapping almost all of them. that immediate arrangements should be made for gratuitous relief and sup­ Another eye-witness said that ply of food for at least a month, in hardly 25 per cent of the Inhabitants 273 Cyclone in CHAITRA 28 1900 ( SAKA) Orissa (C A ) 274 view of the situation that has been relief body. We find that whenever created. these calamities take place, non-offi- cial bodies go there to help, but their It is also essential that these ooor resourcs are inadequate. To kneet people in the villages who had only calamities like this where the State mud huts should be given full reha­ Government’s resources are limited, bilitation grants. Otherwise it is im­ where the resources of the non-ofift- possible for them to rebuild their cial bodies are limited, there should houses. It may be necessary to see if be, apart from the Prime Minister’s they can be shifted to other sites, in Belief Fund, a permanent machinery which case the land necessary should for giving relief to the people as soon be provided to them. Otherwise they as possible. May I know whether cannot rehabilitate themselves. For such a proposal is being mooted? rebuilding their houses and dwellings, lull financial assistance should be given Lastly, as the Plan resources of the What is indicated in the statement State Government are going to be is that the Orissa Government is affected by reason of the advance that being given interim advance Plan as­ is being made by the Central Gov­ sistance of Bs. 2 crores. I do not know ernment, we would like to know whether the Central Government should whether there would be an outright give outright relief or not because it grant. will affect the State of Orissa which is a backward State if Plan expendi­ SHRI SURJIT SINGH BARNALA: ture is to be diverted. In the circum­ The hon. Member has mentioned stances, we request the hon. Minister that gratuitous relief is initially pro­ to tell us whether the Central Govern­ vided for only seven days and that it ment will undertake to bear—and we is not sufficient. This is just the demand that it should bear—all ex­ beginning. Gratuitous relief is being penses that have to be incurred not provided for the time being for seven only for giving them temporary relief, days. It will probably be extended but also for the relief of the affected according to the needs of the people people in full. For no fault of theirs, there and if any assistance is required they are victims of this calamity, s»nd from the Central Government in the it is not fair to require that the State form of food, we will be very glad to Government, which is under financial provide it as we have done in the constraint like all other States, should case of other calamities also. bear all the expenses or the major oart of the expenses for this. Therefore, So far as the advance Plan assis­ we want an assurance, and I requsst tance is concerned, as my hon. friend the hon. Minister to tell us what the already knows, after the Sixth policy of the Central Government is ’s recommenda­ with regard to providing assistance. tions, the earlier method of providing ad hoc Central assistance has been Secondly, for the purpose of proper stopped. Since 1st April, 1974, the co-ordination, a team should go from method of providing relief has been the Centre and be there to see that through advance plan assistance and proper co-ordinated relief operation some marginal money is provided to as well as rehabilitation operation is various States. As I had mentioned, carried on and all necessary facilities Rs. 8.58 crores had been provided as are glVen by the Central Government marginal money to Orissa Govern­ to the State Government in this ment also. So, that money is avail­ connection. able for purposes of relief in these oases. Whenever a calamity like this Thirdly, we would like to know is faced by a State, the State Govern­ whether the Central Government ment normally asks for relief and the will set up some sort of a permanent relief is advanced from the advance 275 Cyclone in APRIL 18, 1978 Oriwa (C A ) 276

[Shri Surjit Singh Barnala] this is a matter where I would like a plan assistance. Previously, during clarification from the hen. Agricul­ 1977-78 floods also, the Orissa Gov­ ture Minister, ernment had asked for some relief and Rs. 8.52 crores were advanced as This is qne of the worst tragedies advance plan assistance to Orissa that Orissa has faced. Besides this Government. severe loss of human lives, I am told, SHRI JYOT1RMOY BOSU (Dia­ property worth about Rs. 2 crores »£> mond Harbour): Science today has totally written off. It cannot be used; enabled many countries to tackle the it cannot be salvaged. Nothing will fury of the nature. In India although happen. But the only trouble is—I we are independent for 30 good years, do not understand—as seen in this we become victims of nature's fury case, most of the deaths are due to so frequently. We have cyclone, house collapse. Most of the dead bodies are being pulled out of the tornado, we have flood, we have drought and we ere helpless victims debris. This is what the Chief Secre­ of these furies. I have said it more tary told me on telephone. The only than once on the floor of this House remedy one can do in that sort of that certain super powers are ex­ situation js go to the open field, if perimenting with weather warfare. I you had the earlier warning, and lie am again requesting the Government flat on the ground. That is the only to enquire into the matter because remedy that you can possibly think this is happening much too frequently. of. But what is happening to the warning system. Mr. Barnala on 8th In China, recently they had repeat­ December had said about Andhra ed earthquakes but the suffering Pradesh cyclone: compared to the fury of the nature that came on China was negligible. "So, a definite information, a The Government tackled the situation positive information was received m such a manner that people’s suffer­ by about the mid-night on the 18th ing was reduced to nothing practi­ and the warnings had been given cally and they refused help from out­ But, unfortunately, it appears spe­ side countries also. cific warning regarding evacuation was not given. I do not know why Here I read a telex from the Chief the authorities did not think it pro­ Secretary of Orissa Government. I per to give that waring also be­ talked to him because the Chief cause that was one of the essential Minister was out of Bhubaneswar; he warnings that should have been had gone to the affected areas. Here given at that time. I do not blame he says: “All houses in these two anybody for that. There might be villages with 900 population have a lapse on the part of somebody collapsed.” This is a very important But the only thing is that it was point. The point is that 900 houses not done. Otherwise, possibly some had collapsed at 430 p.m. If we take more number of people could have half a person per house as dead be­ been evacuated from that place and cause it was total collapse, uprooting, could have been saved. Without it comes to 450. The news item of entering into any political contro­ the Times of India of this morning versy—etc. etc.” cannot he scoffed of. Although the Government have said in telexes that The question, here, that I woulft like the death comes to about 158 or 159, to ask is as to whether any kind of I am afraid, I am not quite able to prior warning was given to the peo­ accept that because, as they say, all ple of the affected area. the houses in these two villages of 900 population collapsed. This is the Only the other day, we had in most important point. Therefore, Delhi a tornado, exactly of this type 277 .Cyclone in CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) Orissa (CA)

and almost of the same duration. Sobha. We cannot do that. I want How severe was the tornado in to know from the hon. Minister Delhi can be gauged tram the fact whether, as it was indicated earlier, that a double-decker bus, full of a National Calamity Insurance Fund passengers, was lifted up and dropped has been created and, if not, what is in a ditch. I am again asking, in the the reason for the same. We have context of weather warfare, or wea­ repeatedly said, let there be a Na­ ther modification techniques, whether tional Calamity Insurance Fund. anybody is experimenting on that. Is Whenever something happens, let the it an outcome of our own human, money be taken out from that fund. economic and scientific activities? Is it due to climatic instability owing No need to beg. I know, my hon. to our expelling every day huge quan­ friend from Orissa will say that he tities of fossil fuel burning and needs Rs. 10 crores, and rightly so. synethetic chemicals into the bros- You must give a minimum of Rs. 5 phere? This is what wr have to find crores grant, not less than that. I owt. Thi? is not a matter which can would like to have a clear and cate­ be jrnt ruled out like that. The gorical assurance about having a pro­ setellitos can predict cyclones, etc. It per "previous warning system” which is an expensive method. We may not science has already provided. be able to afford it. But there is the modern Doppler Radar which the Secondly, adequate grant should be Bharat Electronics, a public sector given, no loan, no assistance. The undertaking, can easily undertake to whole nation shares the sorrow of manufacture. That should be tried. Orissa, the poorest State in the coun­ The modern Doppler Radar with a try with the richest natural resour­ real time processor and colour display ces exploited by other States which will do. have become richer at the cost of Bihar and Orissa. We know all these things. Therefore, I want to have a I would like to know from the hon. clear and categorical assurance from Minister as to what this Government the hon. Minister that at least Rs. 5 is doing? Are they all the time be­ crores grant will be rushed to Orissa, hind the quacks and generalists of You leave it to the State Government the Indian Administrative Service or to do what they think best. We do do they consider these people as not want subedars going from the scientists adopting scientific methods? Centre. I would like to know in con­ The world is moving ahead fast with crete terms how much do they pro­ weather warfare techniques, change pose to give and in what shape and in weather technology and all that. form. This is a very serious question. I have been saying it repeatedly—it is SHRI SURJIT SINGH BARNALA: throwing pearls before swine. This My hon. friend has correctly said Doppler Radar is an outcome of the that in some villages, there has been study done by Dr. Harold W Bayton a colossal loss. I had also mentioned of National Centre for Atmospheric in my statement that about 500 Reaarch Boulder. houses have been wiped off, that they have lost their existence as such and, about 1000 houses have collapsed. I I am making a concrete suggestion. also stated that by this evening, pro­ I would like tp have a categorical bably, after salvaging from the reply and an assurance from the hon. debris, we will be able to know the Minister that they are going to look exact number of the casualties that into the matter. Every time, we can­ have taken place. And we are in not sacrifice hundreds of people and constant touch with Orissa Govern­ end up with a debate In the Lok ment to know the latest figures, so 279 Cyclone in APRIL 18, 1878 Orissa (C A ) . 280

[Shri Surjit Singh Barnala] the news after a long time. My State far as this is concerned. So far as Minister was also there. He said: I warning is concerned, in case of tor­ was about to board a State plane. He nado, the warning is* not possible. It said: the pilot told me that Sir the is not of cyclone that it can be seen or wind velocity is increasing. Pro­ some advance information can be bably there might be a thunder storm gathered about that. or something like a cloud burst, so, we must start. So, they immediate­ SHRI JYOTIRMOY BOSU: Tim­ ly started towards Calcutta and ing may not be possible, but the fore­ reached there safe in time. But on cast is possible. the way also, they found out that there was a formation of thunder SHRI SURJIT SINGH BARNALA: storm. Probably there might be a As regards tornado, it is not possible, squall, etc. This was what they but we did have a warning in this could get. So, I was submitting that case also. For example, the India whatever possible could be done was Meteorological Department, issued a done and information was given. general bulletin also and issued a warning also on the 16th April, 1978, So far as assistance of Rs. 5 crores at 12.30 P.M. The station at Bhu­ as suggested by my hon. friend is con­ baneshwar issued a general bulletin cerned, I have already submitted that as well as a special weather warning now the Seventh Finance Commission and a bulletin for fishermen. This is sitting. Probably, they may re­ special weather warning was as commend such things. But, so far, we follows: have to go, according to the recom­ mendations of the Sixth Finance Com­ “Isolated thunder squall wind mission and according to that, we have speed reaching 70 km. per hour in provided assistance that was required individual gusts likely in north for the time being. Orissa during the next 48 hours.” This is the maximum they could do SHRI JYOTIRMOY BOSU: Seventh because it is under that thunder Finance Commission is not a tornado squall that the tornado forms and we commission. do not know until we see actually that it has been formed; we cannot MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: Dont try give any warning. In other coun­ to create a tornado in the House. tries, this is the only system. They keep a watch; they can only see; SHRI JYOTIRMOY BOSU: I want­ they can find out that in an area of ed an assurance that money will be 100 kms by 200 kms. there will be rushed as grant and there will be no thunder squalls, etc. So, they give a reference of this matter to the Finance warning and they keep a watch. Commission and all that. Let the Whenever a tornado is seen, a warn­ Minister give an assurance. Other ing is issued that it has occurred at wise, it i& very unfair on their part if such and such place and now if is they do not do it. travelling in this direction, etc. That warning is issued. That is the only SHRI SURJIT SINGH BARNALA: method. There Is no other method. Direct grant cannot be given, accord­ That is why in Delhi also, within ing to the recommendations of the three minutes, go much damage was Finance Commission. We only advance caused and nobody knew what was from the plan assistance whatever -happening. amount is required. In Orissa also, Mr. was there. He did not know what SHRI JYOTIRMOY BOSU: On a Actually had happened unless he got point of order. 281 Cyclone in CHAITRA 28. 1900 (SAKA) Orissa (CA) 282

ME. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: There Is *1$ fapfrqvft t ft? aw?rar *r$r St no point of order. Mr. Nalk. gftrfirfe sot ^ *rf& st ifk SHRI JYOTIRMOY BOSU: On a 3S% msre re awrcr sfnrcrr *t STffr point of order. * n f^ «ft 1 MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: There is no point of order. 1 have called Mr. «nft *r?$r tot fa? $s m r far Naik. £ fair? ^^?> 58TT5TT fc^f | I Sfa?S tgk f t ^arTT fs?ft |— *tsf farsf SHRI JYOTIRMOY BOSU: On a point of outer. In cfise of Andhra % 3ft »rrar srsrfas f — t s s $ fc * s Pradesh, the State Government had s fk w fin wft *rra|, f w t s fa s fls been good enough to pay money as wrfas wstjrs f , W grant. I am a party to that. ?rfnrarr f w f t ^Tf^tr MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER- I know %^grt®r x u m % «mj sft sptr tstt the facta, as far as Andhra is concerned f«TT %fRT«»?f »^t?R ?T T ^ ^ i w v t 3|-nft % *r^?R

«ft W f t *ITTU«I ): «p^r aft ? f t, fans c t t o t 3ft, TTRjftiT ffa JTsfr f^q- »rvw ann% ^rrfav 1 *r^ s-ftar f t * ft*r * T f ^ fa? 5rr*T *?> faFft W f t «TT«rT?T ^1% iTTf^rT#T^^%, qffc- jprrnj 3fT srhpi fee ? TRf % fcTTT UTO W 5 ftsr *TPT5rr 5 f% ^ r r q-nrf *pV 1 ft n%t irrvf $ 1 f a ^R- STPW *T g^RPT W5TT «TT, fa? ma arret ir ®rr %m *nft % W T srsrpr^ 3ft % ^ % ?rftw fft^TT, ttst % snmir w>r ^ | ^?t«ft farar^f

«ppft ssrt 3ft % *p?t far tm «nfV *p^t «rt fV 250 srfftrr ^t m?rT s 3# art ^ r t srrar g f t, $ ^5^|fa?fa?s?r^lt^ft **ft * r ^rff srrtfta t o t t ^t *?r*r * t ^ ft* »Tr ^ t ifcrrsiifqrprcrn fafrr t o r vPu'^Tfo ff % ttt fa? 283 Cyclone in APRIL 18, 1978 Orissa (CA) 284

[*ft m f t JTrrm jttcv] It 5?t?t iifM M a n m ^ t arm s?Tff# ffM t JT^f^TfT | 1 * %r w t tt tt*t vt 1 ftnr «rn % *ft *r ?TTfiT^ f1% s*i% $ *ftr s r fe fa fe r »t« h % »it( *nr ^ nr ?r^t ^ tt, «p^tt ^t%tt «rr ft? ^ smnft ^^^S FT^R T ^T ff^fa«ft ?TgTET?!T f ^ r | 1 *rnn? ?ftir s# $f«r^ wit «f* ^arrarm»nn 1 t**rr£*r£i!TT? 5TRTT «PT fiFTT t W WTT fa W* % f v% 1TFT5TT f fa *fhT*T fa*TFT % ?ffa- ^ w t f t et^t % ir^r sto w ^ v f t *FRt ?ftfr T*?tf ^ ^ ?P? ft ftp* wh- -rrar ^r f t fa ?w %• sn^r-^fV tft n f t 1 Twft ^ttt % 5TRP1 3$?T jf^t flST^TfZn W*. ft* wrerrr t c ?fa f t % v%t *% ?TPft *TT «ftr «TTTT £ t ^TRT % I 1W 'Sft ferr f¥ 12 si* ^ R t sYnf, ^ T? srn?ft?r *nrn- * m w r r f t t, 3TFT * (ft 3fV ?fr grfr ^ ^rr ^T ^rr % s m tft frrar fa 1 wnr^ fT VTTfwr 1 arsr m ftfa* f*rp-^rr faflr»r % srfroft, wt*t fa«n=r 5T(tn w V # # s r «rr ^ n r f3R *Ft **nft t fa 1T7T cTT£ ^TT j n ft a r ^ r

*yr«flr i,ooo«r?rr people who have lost so many lives, along with their cattle and other ?rf*R things. f»T Vt «T$- ar-TFTT TOST %, 3TT fife fr $ fa w r 1 1 *i§*s «FitnJ Any way I am very much grateful to our Hon. Prime Minister. 1 thank Ir «rnr ^ % ?tt fRT^ TTST w tn1 ’ft ^ % for the relief operations from the Prime Minister’s Relief Fund. But, so *T* |*r 3WT ^ I far as the loss caused to the area is concerned, the amount sanctioned is 4t, w f t ^ m', q* ^ graciously, so that these distressed families could find a shelter again. $ t o ?MT r^r «rr ftr *rt tfqrr | 1 financial help for the relief of those distressed people who have been SHRI GOVINDA MUNDA: Mr. affected by the tornado. Indian Red Cross may be a«ked to send the re­ Deputy Speaker, Sir, it is very un- lief supplies immediately. I would ioitunate that, on seeing the state­ request that the Central Government ment of the Minister for Agriculture may send a Central team to assess and Irrigation we find that it is a the loss. The Mctereologieal De­ totally incomplete report. Of course, partment has failed to warn the peo­ the Government’s intention is very ple of this impending tornado. It came good but in the figure mentioned in upon them all of a sudden. I would the report there is a difference of Hell request that the Central Government and Heaven, I find from the paper should strengthen the Metereolo­ Hindustan Times that the Chief Minis­ gical Department to be an effective ter of Orissa has stated to the Press instrument for the good of the peo­ that 400 to 500 people have already ple. Since the area is very fertile died. 1 believe they are poor class and paddy grows in abundance, the people—Harijans and Adivasis. You Ministry of Agriculture may be ask­ know that Keonjhar is a District (this ed to give financial help from their is my Constituency also) where there funds to the affected farmers in the are veryj very poor people—Harijans shape of sheds, fertilizers and other and Adivasis. They an» very poor instruments. 287 Cyclone in APRIL 18, 1978 Oritta (C A ) 288

[Shri Govinda Munda] pucca also in that area. If one vil­ The House may be well aware that lage is made up of pucca houses, it all the houses in the villages of Keon­ will cause a great heart-burning to jhar district are thatched ones. For the other villages, the neighbouring the last thirty years after indepen­ villages, and it would create difficul­ dence not even a single house in ties for the hon. Member himself. any of the villages has been made pucca. May I earnestly request the Government to kindly set apart cer­ 13.49 hrs. tain funds from their Rural Uplift- DEMANDS FOR GRANTS, 1978-79— ment Fund and create an organiza­ Contd. tion which may select certain villa­ ges year after year and make them M i n i s t r y o f E x t e r n a l A f f a i r s — contd. pucca? This will create a sense of confidence amongst the tribal people MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: We will and Harijans. now resume further discussion on the May I know whether the Minister Demands for Grants of the Ministry oC External Affairs. for Agriculture will agree to send a team of Members of Parliament to Shri Mayathevar. this area to assess the actual position there? Secondly, will he himself kind, SHRi K. MAYATHEVAR (Dindi- ly agree to visit the area and have gul): Mr. Deputy-Speaker, Sir, I a complete picture of the situation rise to support the Demands for there? Grants of the Ministry of External Affairs on behalf of All India Anna SHRI SURJIT SINGH BARNALA: DMK. It was the late Pandit Jawa­ Sir, I have all the sympathies with the harlal Nehru, who, in 1954, propoun­ hon. Member in whose constituency ded the foreign policy of India, which the tornado has caused such a big was also styled as non-alignment loss In fact, he should have been policy. He taught this country and ther^ by now and should have sup­ other countries of the world much plied more information to the House. about the policy of co-existence and That would have been very good. panch sheel. We were able to pro­ Whatever information he hag got, has pound so many non-violent policies been collected by him from news­ and very good policies which are non­ paper reports. As submitted earlier, violent according to Mahatma Gan­ we cannot take all these reports as dhi’s principles and policies. In spite correct. We are submitting only those of our preachings of non-violence and reports which we are getting from peaceful co-existence and the Panch the Government there. Sheel and in spite of the fact that in 1954 we stood shoulder to shoulder with So far as the relief and rehabili­ China and declared to the world tation work is concerned, necessary ‘Hindi-Chini Bhai Bhai\ the Chinese measures are being taken and as I stabbed us on our back in spite of stated earlier, probably pome of the our sincerity, honesty and straight­ villages will have to be shifted to forwardness in our foreign policy to­ some other safer places and then the wards the Chinese. Therefore, we construction of houses will also come must be very careful, very cautious in If they are keen to have pucca and alert towards China. houses, they can ask the Government that thcv want pucca houses. This We had great respect for Britain is a good suggestion that has been The British Government was respon­ made by the hon. Member. However, sible for dividing our motherland. as the entire villages, a, 1978-79 * 9 o

QOtL Gandhiji mid 'Cutting India in­ SHRI K. MAYATHEVAR: Regard­ to twb amounts to cutting a cow into ing USA even before 1947 they were two*. But the former President of not in favour of our Independence Pakistan said, ‘No. I do not want to but Russia was in favour of our inde­ hear your words. I want India should pendence—subject to correction. In be divided.’ And accordingly it was the course of our fighting and the in­ partitioned and it has created so many ternational clash with Pakistan the troubles. Who is responsible for American Government was pouring dividing the country? Is it not the arms and ammunitions and extending cunning Britishers who are responsi­ all kinds of military aid to Pakistan ble for dividing our motherland into but they withdrew their aid to our two? Therefore, we must be very government. Even the little aid they careful with the British fox also bo were giving us was withdrawn by the iar as the foreign policy is concerned Americans but they gave double the quantum to Pakistan. At the time of Then wo come to the Commonwealth Indo-Pakistan war, it is shameful on of Nations. We are not ashamed to the part of the American Government say that we are still a member of the that they sent Seventh Fleet in sup­ Commonwealth of Nations. When port of Pakistan. Although I wel­ there was a tussle between Pakistan come the genuine non-alignment policy and India, the British Government, of this Government, although I ap­ our old master—I am ashamed to say preciate the genuine foreign affairs and we do not admit but some people policy of non-alignment, I request say they were our masters, the Bri­ the hon. Minister of Foreign Affairs tish Dorais—in Tamil we call Dorais of the Governmet of India to be very but we never accepted them as our careful about the USA Government. masters an actually we are the mas­ ters of the Britishers—created another Yesterday, we were discussing trouble. They not only divided the about the nuclear powerpack. Hon. country but they created K ashm ir Prime Minister made a lengthey also with the object and intention that statement in this House. I quote: we must have an international trouble throughout our life. That trouble is “The remote sensing device with even now continuing but our hon. a nuclear powerpack was installed External Affairs Minister who is one at the highest point of mountain of the very responsible and senior- under an agreement between the most leaders of the country and even Government of India and the United at the time of Jawaharlal Nehru he States.” had vast experience so far as Indian politics ana foreign affairs are con­ If so, why was it not announced to cerned, is making his best efforts to the people, m thia House if this was solve our problems. m the interest of the country to instal such a device at the height at 20,000 Then, Sir, we must be very careful feet. If it was in the interest and about America also, not alone with security of our motherland, why after China and Britain---- (Interruptions). the Chinese clash, it was not disman­ Anna DMK is very non-violent. It tled. Why were the people of India believes in Mahatma Gandhi’s poli­ not informed about it? We are high­ cies of nonviolence. Therefore, you ly disappointed about the secrecy. I need not be careful about us. If you accuse the former Congress Govern­ are careful, wg will be careful about ment also which allowed impliedly, you... directly or indirectly, this kind of spy system in our mountain. This should MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER; Anyway, not be allowed to continued hereafter, it does not come under External Affairs. This Government should be very careful towards such kind of spying «12 LS—10. 2 9 1 D.G., 1978-79 APRIL 18, 1978 t>.G., 1978-79 292

[Shri K. Mayathevar] ful about these things because at the activities by the American Govern­ time when the Israel Arab war was ment. CIA is working, for what? on, the Americans were supporting CIA is working to depose certain Israel. We were supporting the Arab Government elected by the people countries. At the time when North The democratic Government arc de­ Korea and South Korea were fighting posed by the CIA. Therefore, we we were supporting North Korea and must be very careful about the CIA they were supporting South Korea. and its activities in India Finally Americans beaten tj ml in the battlefield of Vietnam. When Vit- SHRI K P. UNNIKRISHNAN nam war broke out Americans were (Badagara): Shri Subrarr.aniam supporting South Vietnam and we sup­ Swamy gets excited when the word ported North Vietnam. Therefore I ‘CIA’ is uttered. request the hon Minister to be verv SHRI K. MAYATHEVAR; I wel­ careful in regard to our foreign policy come genuine non-alignment on be­ towards America and Ameucan CIA half of my party. Do you think that and American foreign pohcv. the former Government was follow­ Then, Sir. we had the highest re­ ing non-genuine or in-genuine non- gard, honour and respect to the pre­ alignment policy? I do not acccpt sent President of the U S A. Mr Car­ that. You should not, once for all, ter. We accorded him the biggest shift the burden on the Indira Gov­ welcome and reception in oui Central ernment—that Indira Government was Hall when he came and visited out not sincere I am not going to accept country. But he did nothing. It is that. That Government was also as love’s labour lost! We lovpd him, w<' sincere as this Government is. laboured for him, we lost everything 14 hrs. finally here m the Central Hall’ He So far as India is concerned, we die did not help our country He did not genuine to everybody, oven to Ame­ support our hon. Primp Minister's rica or China. But I doubt whether policy regarding uranium, m spite of anybody is genuine to our policy, that our sincerity and honesty towards is my doubt. Is any country genuine America Therefor? even Carter, I to our country? No. Yesterday, the am sorry to say, is not sincere. I am hon. Prime Minister said, we are res­ told his mother was working here in pecting China and we are going to re­ India as a nurse. We thought that vive our relations with China, Pak­ the American President would have istan, Burma and all the countries in­ greatest respect and sincerity from cluding America and British Govern­ the bottom of his heart towards India, ment. But I doubt very much, verv not from thp lips, just like the othei reasonably I am doubting that no former Presidents of USA like Mi Government is following our non- Eisenhover and others. But this man alignment policy which was being fol­ has unfortunately, accidentally and lowed at the time of Pandit Jawahar- unexpectedly proved that he is also a Jal Nehru when we were stabbed by legal heir of those former President? China and Pakistan twice. We must of America. He is only following the be very careful. Other countries are old American foreign policy and he behaving as if they are following that is not an exception. Therefore we non-violent policy taught by us. But must be careful about Carter also. nobody is following. They are talk­ I am coming to the last point. This ing from their lips only. They are is regarding your Report for 1977-78, stabbing and sbooting on our back, on issued by the Ministry of External our shoulders, if not on our chest. I Affairs Please see page 56< Para 2* request the hon. Minister to be It says: very careful about the policy of gen­ uine non-alignment. Although we ‘This Ministry has two specialis­ appreciate it, we must be very care­ ed fields of work, i.e., protocol *n*t- Cyclone in CHAITRA 28. 1000 (SAKA) Orissa (CA) 494

ters and international relations. In speech. On the first day we were un­ .these two fields, Hindi was regularly happy. The next day we were ex­ used during the year under review. tremely happy to hear his speech Documents like ‘Letters of Recall, here. You should npt take away the 'Letters of Credence* and ‘Commis­ opportunity of the non-Hindi speak­ sions of Appointment’ as well ing educated people in the matter of as other protocol documents, were selection oi officials in your ministry prepared in Hindi. The Ministry for these higher posts on the basis of also advised Ambassadors and the language. Heads of Missions that while pre­ I would now quote one sentence senting credentials, they may as far from page 58 of this report. See the as possible, make their introductory last sentence of the last paragraph. I speeches in Hindi.’ quote: “The Council regularly sent Hindi books for presentation t0 the cultu­ My submission on this point is this. ral institutions and also arranged 1 want to know whether the Foreign to project Hindi films in foreign \ffairs Department is a Hindi propa­ countries”. gating Department or propagating Why Hindi films alone? It means that Indian foreign policy? This is a sim- it includes, indicates and reveals also olc* question. On behalf of the non- that the Hindi pictures alsone are des­ Hindi speaking people, on befhalf of patched to the foreign countries for i ho South Indians, I am asking this question Thev are giving special res­ screening. pect to Hindi and Hindi alone in Equal opportunity should be given foreign affairs to make the world to the Tamil, Bengali. Walayalam, understand that Hindi alone and Hindi Kannada, Telgu and Marathi pic­ only is the onlv language available tures also and not only to Hindi pic­ in India in the language market. tures. (Interruptions). Under! Art. Are no other languages available 14 of our Constitution there should here? be equality for all before the law. Under Art. 14 we say we allow equa­ lity of opportunity before law. Simi­ Theiefore, Sir, I do not oppose this. larly, there should be equality lor ’Jut, my submission is this. The non- every language picture. Equal oppor­ Hindi speaking officials will lose the tunities should be given to all the opportunity in the matter of appoint­ language pictures that are produced ment or selection in different services. here. With these few works. I con­ Therefore, this discrimination should clude. lot be made against the non-Hindi MR DEPUT Y-SPE AKER: Dr. .vpeaking people. You must encourage Subramaniam Swamy, all the languages of our Indian peo­ ple. The people who do not know SHR1 HARI VISHNU KAMATH Hindi will not be selected in the I A.s fHoshangabad): I want to know i F S. 0tc.. services. when the Minister will reply. MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: Well, some time in the evening We had The hon. External Affairs Minister tliree hours twenty minutes when we ^ade a speech somewhere in Bhopai .started. So, I have to calculate the :>ut he subsequently denied that. That time because We have been doing it in was on the question of the Hindi blocks. "anguage being the official language SHRI HARI VISHNTJ KAMATH- I in the Public Service Commissions. think the time may be extended by The hon. Minister later said that he one hour. The Speaker said that he did not make a mention of it in his will consider the matter. .... 295 Matters under APRIL 18. 1978 Rule 377 *9®

MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKEE: We shall v r m % *ptf aim $ see at tbe end of the day. ^it( ?rt w m f«rd?r ?r^f wn Now Dr. Subramaniana Sway. «rf5V 3F& !3WT W*Tfl ¥To w ? tPRi wr®r xsnr wr^rr jjt i ^?r vr q^qTcT «pr^r t , «^T «fV fa'PFr ^rrTT% % I fw»T ft TOTT t m ^fcT^Tfw *?w®r f^ ft m^T-

% f o r r «tt i w %, ? ¥ m v n *r $ smT * rm % *rrqr g- ^ arr?r ^tpO t ?ft ^»mrr w f t «n^ ^rh-fw ^^nr^^gfrf^sr *T5fr r % *prrtarr q*rer ^ ?ntr ?tt ^ ^ ?r*w fr iftr ictt 1 v tf «Fff?t «f f«r «nr€m % fesft «rm «jir *rr *r^ft ?rqr % ?i?fr m«r ^FT ^ «t fo ** *mfr, ^ apTT^ir ifcft «rr?r ^ I 1 % »mr srtf «rr^ 5pr «nr fwf*? t q?% jrf ^rfRT ^ r r ^ r r far srrr ^ ^ 1 ^ «T*rfhn st ?t ftforr jftfr w m t%\ £ i |( iw *^i*>rr wzi Trim- ^t?tt t 4j*iT ^ W «T|t ^ #5?t ir •frf^ #■ T| | Honest trade « *w t w srrar «tt irtr 5*nft «*nr policy is the best foreign policy 33- 3 w ro wrm «rr i («nwwr) t *r? 297 DX}> I078-?9 CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) D .G , 1978-79 29s

ffsnr MTjpTT j ft? v t srw ^ aft fffT «JT, ^ W VT f T O ■RTBT v * $ f*r ^ ff i aw fsr fptofapr ^ i v fp >tt- ^ ^?r w f v?r ff ff ^ W T, Tf*5^pf “W t «n, ^ ijt^ ?m *rr, w ftftf *nam % wps W'ptt &s f^rr «rr TfT *TT, inr 5^pt 3RT5T% VT Vtf W W sftr gas iw* imk faffw *reft tft stft ^ t» i ^rt ^TFft »ft% aft vrerre «rc ff i «rar t T f fa w ft iff m u ?nr ^»t ’•rf «ft, *rf *ftftr TT^f sr^t t> **ft ^ftfiy |, %rr ®r|, ?w fir wt^ft vt ^Rftir ^Ittt srwfcr |, * t *m w Tarff ?hr ^ ^rr fvmw | ff ^wr *f?ft ff irff ff f fa % ff Ttarro ^ft «n% fa*T ¥RT ’fJf’T I 3»f *it sn$ *rrff *rr srarrcr *pf eft ?tr> t ^mrr arr t^t ^ fr # anw^ ^mrr wrrfa ^ ^ f i *r M * & < f^TT ^ ^ 5fTPT ^fTpfV ?w 3 rrt «rr€f ^ 4fr^ R t *5t fc ?t anwft i fm «P ar?Rr«r % ^nw*r im »rtcfV *ft€V anaf f *fk ^rff f ® ^■, ^ r ?r*nsr ’ ft fnsrn: tn: % zitiwrtt *ft fa j firePTT aff 9TiTT $ i ^fV f% ftrfrft *TR^*ft art vsintn: ff fat^T fa WW tWT-QWnxfci t, ^rt ft ^r€f % war ?r>r ^sr% ?r*nr«p- *TFT ^ZT ^tfatT I *Tf ^ f, %f^r t wf ?r ?mnm | i ^ ^rrer % ?mr ff sttt t *rk srt *ft ?ft ^ r m v «ft ^ftf im rn ^|t «fr W ft 9TM % jtw ff ^ t jut ft, * ? wk t o »ft vtt «nwr ^ | i W t o t qrsT ff w f s*w t % fax' ?pt eft ^?rr ^TRidt 2r—*rfe ar* f ^ r i^fr

sftr irw 3r « t % f^iTT ftnr ^ ft yvgrr 5R arw *r> ?t ^RrsiT t . 11 **r farj **r Tt M »r jftftr vt •inwnwfwir mto ttvtvt (ar*q» fa S*T % fW *WT JTPT i t 1 ff tnp TrTT ^ ctt) «rrr ?ft ftrtrft ^ ^-rr xfk «rror % far* ift mv $m i wnr ^tqT^f »ft ^rr ^t wr^ft 11 %fipr ^ ^ *t$ ?(f ^ ft> ft^ r m?0 # FT®avnft f w ftrct ff ?rrr lift ^?rr ^ § r M

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f^vr *Rft % mf*h"wn % vfr *?t ], f, ^ >pt -wTf^r i ffn t *ftfir ff aft q fcv N «mrr | ff ^ar vr % fve^r fWtfisrfwr % Frnrer *pt?it g i 299 D .G, 1078-79 APRIL tt, t m D.O., 1078-79 & o

(ito tgw^nnpr mt*TI) f%tT tr^rT qrf^RfV STRIWRTr t I trsft % tmic w i r — srrfT ♦ *r? f « t r ^ TTf^prr!? t f , m m fa ^ wrcr-«mr % **ff % sro #*r ^ wnfhn f5p*rr, w % ftrrr %m steft Kt »rf— ^ r *r*sft strt ft , ararf % qr?r ft i aft wnprr ^rr wanpr ^ t t «rr, i f*Ffr *fr ia% tn ftw % ap* wfi- % ?n«r 5?*rft <^wi ;r#r ft, ^ cl?fr TT^-^rsft wrr% ^ WT5T rr >sV «nf^rpr ?t*tt* q r wffcrr, m f e r r ^ fax? ^ ipr-pr ?>rr I f?*J 3r%*TT-—2f ®ft?> 5FTT ir tfft 'TT^?fR w irwr fjfr ^tt ’ firfesr ^T *FT ^T*T?r fWT I TT»3 *T ft, ?f^T errors % ^>r «PT e> fawrft *r ttst 7^HTrarniir^T^T??rT p i «rr i w firn; ^ tt i «rraw ^ t ^ i m * z m r?r W«RTRT % *nft 'BPTcft ft i in ft «nft %1vh ^ar wfV ^T5T*r «r»w f^wft ^ arrar ^ t t 5r ftw *t m%*r f^rr »prr, ^ r % ^ jrV q?r ¥> >rf-~ v fffarcr ^ r % t m f w r *rqr ft, ^ 3ft 3T37; 'WTRT q * e ) f w i BTT «JT, f m % UTRfT «Pt w «rr, i crrf!F^Tr?r

% ^ % firm ^ *n?fr ^fT^r t ^ *tt f* n «tt, sw smr *?t fv ffgf w w % ?r>r ti& t, |, ^ ftrsr ^ w t «tt ^arr*?*r % ^ f r v T f m t ’ D.G., 1978-79 CHATttU 28, 1900 (SAKA) D.G., 1978-79 302

^^rnTrftftwrstw% % »** vt wwtr Sr «rmT *n$t |

SHEI K P UNNIKRISHNAN (Ba- % OTETTT cfT T^V t «*? dagara). How dare you talk’ ** arc*. ’an^rr ff fa v * *nr w w

p r f t * «wt JTft *n*fi i w ? r w r ire gmgwmr : t $ s r m ? r *pt jptf »«{Pffg fro m | fa % w r f«rsrr | vftx ^ g fa %(m ?np, ir*nft Vajpayee is a reactionary «wrr sft TTvmr feq 1 iw, *r^ ftir *r*r ?ft<> w f o jto ^ spr ^rr frwr fi?*rr Morarjibhai is an imperialist «m 1969 »r ??fapT?T>n^r fasrr »r*rr i ^smT^3ft3ffir3fra% f. ^ ?ft *13 5TT TOWP- *T *T 3TRTT 3tfa?T *fto «nfo rro »pr ^ct *r^r 11 ^ ^ft «f|»tt fa&r TRn^nr srm w *it fa fft® *nfo tTo sft ♦wt »tr ^jrftar *rfr % tft ^ firarr ^pit i sti: Sa*fljt*n5rinniOTVTwl^WT ? w *ntft t t fifpRf«rT «n^rT **\r *prit f ? itrr vjr^r *^r | fa ^>ft ^rfar I vr *roiw w«r *rt stfair i gppppr vt *ft ®t* tftftrcr fftT !ro r t v ‘‘Because San jay Gandhi is emi­ % 3ft I f£, Vt ^t 9l8 nently purchasable we have got a lot of monev and he is foolish ^ t fs n j i a fR t wrr x??r % fa ? r enough to take money*’ fPWPI % *PT WWIT ^TT & eft 5^ tar f r *ft feftsf *FtftiTT i jftftffT V ’ETUT cfk n ntfiqrr %«ft *rar £t w r | f a :snvrT% *n*r $*rft tost 3fa $t ^ vt^Ptnjt^iT i cftt^ ^^n ’^T^rr g fa ^ SfcPTT ^rT% ^ gft fi *trf % $■ «fi£lr sfN? aft i^tt^ swft ^T^% ^ftarRT|,w«n:^t 3* % *n*r «sWfcr f , tftT$$i ?ft^TT i («w rm ) itftanft imwrff S WV *ft *F$nft f*WSft 11 IS tt flTTfa SfofTT fa Wt«( 1966 % *ggfr« f «ft qft VtTTo W|WW ^ vt ^sr ?ftfatr, anr sfarr m vt ^ft %&- ^rvHte

♦♦Ek^unged as ordered by the Chai* D.Q, 1978-79 APRIL 18, 1970 B.G „ 197B-7B 9 H

(«To nprr i r % ( t n w ) iflr <8r v n «m r * t fa to rcwftwjfcf 1 i f t t m 3ft tftomnr t ^ WCT $ I ^ sHVt WWW ^FGTT WnpiT jj fir? ^ fnft v r •*& 1 1 ft» V*T ^ I W f W wfrft %— ( « w m ) “We have sympathy with America about Vietnam ”

*fi£ 'ajVPF HT^*T *t **>*£ «TT vpRrlvp?TT v n A wn?^ tw *ft w «TTI 1 1 $■ ^snrr ft i r t 5t fMtar wttstt f fa ^ nf« f w ^ % «mr It «ft Wfi*fr W5 (*Rfarr) sm tfto ^rrft ftf^r jftftr «pt v w ?t 1 wrfo ir© «i»t ’PFTwdvrr %*pt inlxtvr Jawaharlal Nehru was a faihire alt «nT**rr?i$? through % tBTOir qr « 1 T VT^rr 1 1 qo iprr *.?* t • («w w w )

nTvftn w w : «nft 3r

«w »r *r ^trrtt w r «n% *ft SHRI L K DOLEY (Lakhmipur) We take objection to the allegations v zz t fa^rct ? rafrft ^ r % f ^ r made by Dr Subramamam Swamy *r?ft | (« w r w ) 7 tfnr ^rrft arrcr % against Jawaharlal Nehru and his foreign policy Let it go on record that we take objection to this %fa*r f ar*r «f^tt ^?rr % fa ^ w v fafcr *rafV 5m * b it if r«ft *ft ^ MR DEPUTY-SPEAKER No qties tion of objection It is his view and 1 «r^r % Terr «tt f a dvr that is your view Mr Chandrappan ^&«Sff«rrc$r5»r

[Shn C K, Chandrappan] pers, Indian peasants of Rajasthan will in our interest, it is not good to say become share-croppers of the Shah of Iran That is the poltey that there are two super powers in rivalry and we are non-aligned »n AN HON MEMBER How* between That is not the fact Take India s own mteiest As Mr Subra SHRI C K CHANDRAPPAN Yes roaniam Swamy said I agree with him you will understand if you lead it we hive to take our own national Then the policy of Iran is presented ii ^crests and we have to see which in this Report The new traditional fo’xes are tor us and which aie against historic relation is being revived They u-, Our policy towards the United subvert they butcher people and kill States Mr Foreign Minister is not an them We have a responsibility to a ideni >ou will agree with me Dur- fight these people also irfi the last 30 years whenever the DR SUBRAMANIAM SWAMY interest of India was aftected we have What about Mr Sakharov’ seen the US imperialism standing i&iinst India in the other camp On SHRI C K CHANDRAPPAN 1 the question ot Kashmir on the quev- dont know who he is ticn of Goa & liberation on the question Sir the point is that the Shah of of Bangladesh and on ever so many Iran is playing a sub-imperialist role qi estions on all the wars th it India h d to light against her aggressors we in this part of the world (Interrup­ h^e seen the US imperialism stand tions) It is again he who played a n , on the other side In th< early destructive role in the heart of Africa ibout which the Government says that diys of India s Independence there, we are not concerned No You should wtre even attempts made to be friend USA but they did not succeed because have take to a policy which would hue been appreciated b> the African the imperialist nation as the USA is r ? (he OAU The OAU adopted jt is always against the interests of ihc polcy of supporting Ethiopia Ihe developing countries So they will be Soviet Union was on the side of llways against us and todav also So if jou tike the national interests Mr Ethiopia just as it was on the side ot India and Bangladesh at the time of Subramaniam Swam> you cannot gam anything bv making friendship with the Bangladesh liberation struggle The Cubans are on the side of the national the United States and this Report is liberation movements Strangely, wt trying to make a white-wash Our tound that the Shah of Iran gom*, relation with the Shah ot Iran your with his arms and evei> thing And t new friend*—not vours but his \ou lake the South-East Asian policy vour Report is trying to depict—my (stftor

CShri C. M. Stephen] AN HON. MEMBER: Indira. ing the foreign policy of the former Government The foreign policy was SHRI C. M. STEPHEN: Forget about the one thing on which the present that. Government asserted that the policy AN IION. MEMBER. Why? will be one of continuation and con­ tinuity, and that there was not going to be any deviation. At that time, SHRI C. M. STEPHEN: But then this policy statement by the External there is a change. I have got before Affairs Minister of the Government, me documents which spell out certain it was more or less clear, was not new propositions. Last year, when the unanimous voice of the Janata the 1976-77 report was presented, Party. We had, for Instance, persons they said: like my very beloved friend, Mr. Subramaniam Swamy, coming out “ .. .the substance of the coun­ openly and strongly against try's foreign policy was not an issue during the elections— the new Government reaffirms its commit­ SHRI ATAL BIHAR1 VAJPAYEE: ment to the policy of non-alignment Beloved? and affirms that is continuing that policy." SHRI C. M. STEPHEN I said "be­ loved”; and lovable Today also thtey have said something like that. They have said. SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE- “ ___during tthe years immedia­ Is he lovable? tely before independence and subs- quently when India played a domi­ SHRI C. M. STEPHEN: He came out nant role in the political process of strongly against the basic tenetg o f the decolonisation, a consensus on foreign policy. He had gone to the foreign policy had developed with­ extent of demanding the scrapping of in the country cutting across party the Indo-Soviet Treaty. On the basis lines. Against this background, it was of that, news was floating about that, only natural---- ” in spite of the identity of their party affiliations within the party, there was Then they went on to say much of confrontation between them and there was not much love lost bet­ “This did not. however, mcai. ween them. Today we JfouUd Mr. that this major political transforma­ Subramaniam Swamy giving very tion did not have any influence on handsome compliments to Shri Atal the content and style of foreign Bihari Vajpayee. It is a fact that he policy^ gave very high compliments to him and there was an appearance of com­ Here we get the first indication plete friendliness. openly stated, that the foreign policy is not going to be the same as it was. Now I am wondering whether there They now say that there is a change Is something which could be read bet­ in the “content and style” of the ween the lines, whether some change foreign policy, new phases are coming is taking place or not. I do not think in. I am putting these two together— that Shri Swami is the type of person the present attitude of Mr. Subra- who can change that easy, because manian Swamy on the one side, and with respect to these matters what the statement in this document of he speaks is not what really is his. the Government on the other side, He is bound to speak by certain com­ where the Government says that the mitments. content and style would remain chang* 313 D.G., 1978-79 CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) D.G., 1978-79 314 ed. If the content and style, ii these goodwill and understanding. Ini­ two things ace removed, what remains tiative was taken to normalise in the foreign policy, I do not know. relations with China end diplo­ As far as the content and style of the matic ties were re-established with foreign policy are concerned, they are that country at the level ot not going t0 be the same, they are Ambassador.” going to be changed, the change is Tlie whole chronicle, as far as the taking place. What exactly the neighbouring countries are concern­ change is what the Minister of Exter­ ed, is that normalisation took place, nal Affairs in truthfulness must ex­ that agreements were arrived at, that plain to the people and explain to we were on the path of normalisation the world and good neighbourliness. It was at­ Now you have high-lighted certain tempted in 1976-77 itself, and that is new points, certain new philosophy acknowledged. Therefore, the question and certain new phrases have started I am now asking is this. Apart from coming. In this Report you have this, what is the new element in the s t a t e d about “neighbourhood diplo­ neighbourhood diplomacy that you macy" Yesterday, Shri Kundu coin­ are evolving, what is the new Asian ed a new phrase "Asian image of Personality that you are projecting, India” or something like that that you want to project? I am not AN HON MEMBER: Asian perso­ saying that you are doing something nality. wrong or anything like that, but tell us, when you use the phrases of SHRI C. M. STEPHEN: Yes, Asiar^ “neighbourhood diplomacy” and peisonality of India, as if it was ever “Asian Personality”, against the in doubt that we are an Asian country background of what was being at­ that we have got an Asian image or tempted earlier, what is the new Asian standing. They are going to thting that you are attempting? This And a new Asian personality. The is a matter which has t0 be explain­ question is whether this endeavour to ed. discover a new Asian personality is the same as the personality that we Somebody said that India must wanted to project. lead the other countries^ somebody else said that India must go to the As far as good neighbourliness is assistance of the other countries. concerned, this is what the docu­ ment of 1976-77 says: Another Member said that India must give confidence to the neigh­ “India worked for the extension bouring countries. One Member went of detente in its own region by to the extent of saying that Morarji trying to normalise and improve Desai’s statement on Sikkim sent relations with all the neighbours. A terror into our neighbouring count­ number of issues were settled ries. So, what is the role that through bilateral negotiations. The we are playing’ Are we playing entire maritime boundary with Sri the role of only an Asian Lanka was deliminated on the basis country, are we playing the role of of agreement signed with that leading somebody, are we playing country. An agreement was con­ the role of a big brother, giving mo­ cluded with the Maldivis for deli­ ney and everything to everybody? mitation of the maritime boundary That was not the role that we were between for two countries. Friend­ playing We had been playing the ly ties were maintained with Af­ plain role of a country which knows ghanistan and Nepal. Excange of its mind, which knows its inherent visits with Afghanistan and Nepal, strength, which has got an economic at the ministerial and official levels, sub-structure to rely upon with a and the discussions held during personality of its own, not limited to these visits redacted a spirit of Asia or the Southeast Aslan area .'D.G., 19'78 315 D.G., 1978-79 APRIL 18, 1978 D.G., 1978-79 316 317

[Shri C. M. Stephen] foreig ..! policy. On issues, we' take a A new discovern only. but covering the entire world, particular stand. We refuse to be "They say because the non-aligned world, not linked tied down to any country at all. Or. democracy in: Indil with any particular bloc, not being the international field, we have get America has changl under the umbrella of any particular our preferences. Let us not forget the different countries bloc, but having its own personality fact that .two forces are operating in 'wards us. I ask ~ and projecting its domestic policies on the international field. The force of fore emergency is the international field. Therefore the imperiahsm, colonialism, suppression, there was. no sort of thing that we are now finding exploitation is functioning openly or "Pandit Jawaharlal is rather. disturbing. unopenly. On the other hand, there there no tlemocraci are forces which are supporting the hadur Shastri's ti Mr. Atal Behari Vajpayee does developing countries and the imperi- democracy? Before alism and the colonialism. These say that there wa make occasional visits to India, I l know! when those occasional visits forces are" there. We have got to take There was democ to India are made,' he 'should make OUr sides with one of these forces. It try. an attempt to understand what ex- is natural, therefore, that certain countries which. take up our own po- actly the economic policy of this THE MINISTE~ sition come nearer to us. You call it country is, or must be. 'This attempt AFFAIRS (SHE a tilt. Whether we tilt to. somebody has got to be made., . VAJPA YEE): WI or somebody else tilts to. us is a ques- -ey? There are new phrases coming up tion. It has been acknowledged in like "genuine non-alignment". Is it this Report itself that the Soviet different from the non-alignment that Union has felt that non-alignment SHRI C. M. STI We had been following ~o far? Oris it which was being followed by India, is ing of the perior suggested that the non-alignment that a ~bulwark for international peace Pandit Nehru followed was not gen- and international harmony and pro- Now the questil uine non-alignment? If that was 'not gress. They acknowledge Us as an Pakistan and Indi non-alignment and non-alignment independent country which takes its Pakistan a demot characterised by genuineness ·is now Own stand. As we think on many democratic? And forth coming, then yOU candidly con- lines similarly whether the socialist tude of this gre< cede that you are changing the foreign transformation or economic policy, ry. the United policy. You have got the sanction of not everything but many things, they If they were in the people, you can do it, but do not get tilted to' us. Nobody need be they should have II come out with the statement that ashamed of it. Nobody need to take Pakistan. Pakist: this is noon-alignment. it as a sort of deviation from non- o ing Lal Bahadur alignment. But you need genuine tl India has its own concept of non- der Shastri, ther ta non-alignment. You say that we alignment from the Power blocs. We mocracy in the would be equi-distant from both. d: are not part of any Power bloc. we Khan's Pakistan Now, you are going to say that we t~ are not subject to anybody. Non-- democratic. Whs e wilJ be equi-distant between the op- alignment means, as far as we are democratic COUll ti pressor and the oppressed. You would concerned, not neutrality, not inacti- time? Whom dil say that We would be equi-distant vity, not just blindness, but a posi- point I am rnakt between Israel and the Arabs. You tive policy in the interests of the postulates its at n~ are going to be equi-distant between country, in our self-interest. country on the re: i;he African countries and the oppres- system.~ It -postu ~ sing nations. You just cannot be. We the basis, of the ti Every foreign policy of any country have to take a position. That is not they have. If it projects its foreign policy from its a deviation from the policy of non- country with a • OWn interest, its own self-interest. alignment. A new concept is being Vi. the other is also Our internal democracy or OUr inter- evolved. I would" appeal to the hon. then they will nal economy has got to be develop- Minister to snell out what exactly he That was, why t ed. POl' that, we want peace in the means by the new concept of genu- 7 to Pakistan. Th world. We want reJationship with ine non-alirmment. Whether it is any GD: conniving with Jm. other developing countries. We want way different from the non-alignment that are taking freedO:!11 from attack from foreign that we have been pursuing. You "They were very be areas.. With this, we project our kindly explain this matter. CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) D.C., 1978-79 '., 1978-79 316 .'D.G., 1'978-79 Emergency here. But they had ln issues, we take a A new discovery has been made. noth- ing to say about the butchering We refuse to be: "They say because of restoration of of Banga Bandhu; they had nothing to 1 country at all. On democracy in India, the attitude of say about him; the whola lot of t he.n field, we have got .•• America has changed, the attitude of was murdered, but not a whisper; .et us not forget the differ.ent countries has changed to- they were not bothered about that. ces are operating in wards us. I ask in all humility, be- But about this they were gathered. field. The force (jf fore emergency is it your case that nialism, suppression there was no democracy? During 15.00.hrs. nctioning openly OL: Pandit Jawaharlal Nehru's time, was ~ other hand, there there no democracy? During Lal Ba- The point that I am emphasizii1.g are supporting the hadur Shastri's time, was there no is that, when they project a particu- ies and the impar]; democracy? Before emergency, you lar attitude, they know where the :oloniaIism. These say that there was no democracy. br-ead is but tiered, tpey understand 'e have got to take There was democracy in the coun- that they have got their own econo- , of these forces. It try. mic philosophy. They want a colonial ore, that certain economy in this .country. ;:e up our own po- THE MINISTER OF EXTERNAL to us. You call it You now say, 'Come back to the AFFAIRS (SHRI ATAL BIHARI ~ tilt to somebodv rural economy'. They are hap y VAJPAYEE): What about emergen- Its to, us is a ques- about it. They wanted us to suspend acknowledged in cy? the nuclear explosion, and you, have that the Soviet agreed to suspend it. They are .happy at non-alignment SHRI C. M. SlliPHEN: I am speak- about it. About every step you are [lowed by India, is ing of the period before emergency. taking, they are absolutely happy. ternational peace Therefore, Mr. Carter comes here, armony and pro- not as a friend but as a victor who Now the question I am putting is: ledge Us as an has conquered this country, and he Pakistan and India came to war. Was . which takes its addresses us in that particular tone. Pakistan a democrat? W9-S not India think on many I do not want t·o put it in this parti- democratic? And what was the atti- her the socialist cular fashion, but this is the picture iude of this great democratic count- !conomic policy, which -you cannot avoid. One after ry. the United States of America? 1any things, they another, a long galaxy of Western )body need be If they were in love with democracy bosses are coming to us, the Red Car- y need to take they should have supported Us against pet is being thrown out, and we ltion from non- Pakistan. Pakistan attacked us dur- Members of Parliament are being ing Lal Bahadur Shastri's time. Un- need genuine drawn out every alternate day to the der Shastri, there Was certainly de- 1 say that we Central Hall to hear the speeches tant from both. mocracy in the country and Ayub that they are deliv·ering. With one or to say that we Khan's Pakistan was certainly not two persons, it was allright; but then ietween the op- democratic. What did this great the benches were empty; the officers ssed. You would democratic country do during that were put in and the whole thing was e equi-distant time? Whom did they support? The filled up in order that we might hear he Arabs. You point I am making is that no country those speeches. postulates its attitud~ to any other distant between country on the basis of its political Let Us not forget that India is a and the oppres- system. It postulates its attitude on great country, it is self-reliant and cannot be. \Ve completely self-supporting. It did not on. That is not the basis of the basic interests that they have. If they are a capitalist bend itself to anybody. Let us not policy of non- be petty-minded in our behaviour, cept is being country with a capitalist interest and be it with a small country or a b'g al to the hon. the other is also a capitalist country, country. Let there be a sense of pro- 'hat exactly he then they will be nearer to them. portion in our dealings with other ncept of genu- That was why the USA were nearer countries. Agreements can be evolv- ether it is any to Pakistan. That is why, they. are ed. Talks can take place. But forget non-alignment conniving with all sorts of sabotages not that India is India with 60 crores pursuing. You that are taking place everywhere. of people that balance be main- rtter, 'They were very much against the Let 3I9 D.G., 1978-79 APRIL 18, 1978 D.G., 1978-79 320

[Shri C. M. Stephen] and prove. Otherwise, you will have tamed, and without maintaining the to apologise to the nation—if what balance, let us not give an impression was said was incorrect that we are so anxious to get on with anybody; they get away with what He said about 'bombshell'. What they want and we give away one exactly is the ‘bombshell’? ___ after another, kindling hopes which crnnot be satisfied, ultimately creat­ MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: There is ing hostility all around, promising all something like tim e...... sorts of financial support which we will not be able to satisfy, ultimately SHRI C. M. STEPHEN: One minute creating hostility all around. This more. sort of an attitude is certainly not the one we have got to foster. SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE Here is a time bomb. What has been stated by the Gov­ ernment when they assumed the ad­ SHRI C. M. STEPHEN: Yes; it can ministration and the government in be a time bomb. He came out with a this country in the line of the foreign ‘bomb-shell’. I thought something policy? Here is something which was big was coming and wondered evolved during the years, by a con­ what was that bomb-shell. The sensus, cutting across party lines, bomb-shell was that when in which stood the test of time, which 1960 this plutonium device was has elevated the position of India in planted. Mrs. Indira Gandhi was the international arena. If you want responsible for that—that she was to deviate from that, come out with responsible for that and that she a clear statement giving the points of was in leageu withe America deviation that you want to inculcate Are you saying that this is something and say where the foreign policy has which you are against? What exactly been drawn, what it is going to be. is your attitude? We on these Ben­ Tell us clearly rather than play this ches were never against any Govern­ sort of hide-and-seek game. ment at all: we never wanted to get away from anybody. We made our Again, political controversies, there best efforts to be friendly. But. on can be. When Mr. Atal Bihari Vaj­ the basis of the self-respect of thi** payee was on the Opposition Benches, country, on the basis of the save —I hope, he will acknowledge this— reignty of this country, on the basis we had the highest of respect for of the economic interests o f this him—even when he was in the Op­ country, on the basis of the personali­ position attacking us. There is a ty proiected not on the Asian field level below which we do not expect but on the international field, on him to go. One or two of his recent the basis of prolection of the inter­ utterances gave a real shock to me. national personality of this country, He told about Mrs. Indira Gandhi its 60 crores of people w ill be a stand­ that there was a secret deal with ing source of strength for the pur­ Kashmir Come out with the terms pose of evolving peace, lasting peace of that deal, if it is there. That has and progress. Let us not ridicule it been denied by her. That has been International questions are not ques­ denied by Mr. Aga Shahi. That has tions for political parleys on the ba­ been denied by everybody. If there sis of ridicule. That manner should is a secret document that you have, not be adopted. I would only submit then you tell the Parliament—rather to my friend that he could perform than go to the platform and say— what his task fairly well without stooping is that secret arrangement. This is a t0 this sort of low -level rhetorical thing which you have to tell us performances. 32I D.G.. 1978-79 CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) D.G., 1978-79 332

While concluding, I would like him the Janata Party, definitely and deli­ to spell out the deviation that he berately the words ‘genuine-non- U attempting. It is clear that devia­ alignment’ were put in the Election tion is being attempted. Spell out Manifesto knowing fully well the where and to what extent you want background of the various constituents of the Janata Party and I feel and to deviate in the different areas. Be honest with us: be honest with Par­ consider that Mr. Vajpayee represent* the majority view of the erstwhile liament: be honest with the nation, Jana Sangh which has merged with rather than attempt deviation by a revolutionary back-door method. the Janata Party and has the right to say that we believe in ‘genuine non- alignment* and to spell out the histori­ With these words 1 conclude. cal growth of the non-alignment movement. SHRI KRISHAN KANT (Ghandi' garh): Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, 1 Mr. Subramaniam Swamy has hit am happy to speak in support of the own views. He may be representing Demand of the Ministry of External certain forces which are in a minority, Affairs. Whatever people may say which we had been fighting earlier about the performance of Govern­ and which we continue to fight even ment in various other fields, this « now. (Interruptions). I do not want one field where there is unanimity to enter into a controversy; but these that it has been successful. The forces, I can assure the House and credit goes, by and large, to the the country were never in a majority Minister of Foreign Affairs Mr. Atal when Gandhi was leading the freedom Bihari Vajpayee. I would like to struggle. This force was never in offer my personal congratulations *o majority even for the last thirty years him for his dynamic stewardship of after independence. We thought, the External Affairs Ministry. But I these forces have taken new know­ would like to say that my compli­ ledge, new experience and have ments arc not left-handed or right- suffered and changed. Well and handed or many-sided, like my friend good, if they have not changed, then Shri Subramaniam Swamy’s. My we have to fight those forces again, compliments are genuine, because I because they do not represent the in­ feel that he has taken the national tegrating forces, they are not the policy which has been evolved over uniting forces. the last 30 years. And when Mr. Vajpayee says: He says that he does not want to hear the name of Nehru; he wants to completely cut himself off from the SR^cIT * ^ foreign policy of thirty years and the he is correct. Subramaniam Swamy foreign policy of Janata Government has criticised him for that. He may now. He is making the same mistake have been saying other things too. which, his erstwhile party and the so- Generally, I Ignore what my friend called voluntary organization was Subramaniam Swamy says, but he has making. You cannot cut out history; said today in Parliament House, in history is a continuity; you cannot the Lok Sabha, while speaking on cut out the Mughal period; you cannot the Demand of the Ministry of Ex­ cut out the Muslim period. They are ternal Affairs, and people might take a part of history, they are our life it that he speaks the voice of the party and blood. We have to learn fron and the Election Manifesto of the them and we have to learn from the Party. Our Manifesto has the words experience. If you want to cut off ‘genuine non-alignment’ but he is that history, you will not be the India against the word ‘non-alignment’. which you are today. I am glad that According to me, as I understand the Mr. Malkani who has written that policy and the Election Manifesto of book about the jail experiences, har 512 LS—11 D.G., 197 8-79 APRIL 18, 1978 D.G., 1978-79 324

' [Shri Krishan Kant] is a valuable heritage that Nehru has left I must say that he talked changed his interpretation of history. dangerously, he said, he would like to He says, now we can say that Muslims have a situation where there is no and Hindus can live and should live border between India and Pakistan «s brothers. Later on In other chap­ When the Prime Minister and the ters because of his experience at the Minister for External Affairs are build, feet o< RSS, he has not changed that ing up bridges of trust, such a speech much. at this time can be harmful to the foreign relations of India. Mr. Chaii- Dr. Subramaniam Swamy wants the man, I would like to dissociate myself Janata Party to cut off from the from that He has tried to lefend the foreign policy developed by Nehru In Prime Minister and criticised the Minu­ the background of freedom struggle ter of External Affairs. 1 think the of Mahatma Gandhi and others, policy of the Janata Parly and the wtiuch is a very valuable aset for us policy of the government are (he same and on the basis of which the Janata Whether at is Prime Minister or the Party has built up its foreign policy. Minister of External Affairs, it is the Janata Party policy as a whole and there is no division between the two. He mentioned about our relations Assuming division in the basic with Pakistan. When Mr. Agha Shahi approach of the Janata Party by those came here, he said that he has built who are representing the minority up more trust not only in the Janata forces of my friend—I can tell you Government, but in the Prime Minister it will not help them. and in the Minister of External Affairs in spite of the background of Shri He then referred to China Perhaps Atal Bihari Vajpayee. Shri Vajpayee, he is talking of the new friendship while speaking at the press con­ with China as if we were not friend1: ference in Islamabad, when he was earlier I think wc ore more than asked about his backgraund of friends of China. We want that Jansangh, said, “I have shed off that”. friendship to grow, not at the cost of He said, he has become part of the our self-respect We want friendship Janata Party which adopted the elec­ with Soviet Union We want friend­ tion manifesto, where we mer.t'oned ship with America, but with our about genuine non-alignment. If the dignity remaining intact. He sav^ forces represented by Dr. Subramaniam that because we are afraid of Russia Swamy want to continue the same so we do not want to become friend* approach towards Pakistan, the same with China. Then tKere are fears in approach to non-alignment, I feel, Russia about this country. This is they are heading towards a dismal wrong And we are not guided by failure. This country is not going these considerations. I can say to accept that. He still talks of whether of the previous government Akhand Bharat History has changed or this government, as far as our He feels liEe the RSS that the Muslim foreign policy goes there is no diffe­ period, the Mughal period be cut off rence What Russia likes or does not from history and can be linked to two like is immaterial to us. What ^ thousand years back. He feels that India’s interest, it is on that wP We can start from where we started decide. He criticised the Nanda Devi in the beginning ancl Nehru is no expedition and the plutonium device more in history. No history of a and everybody connected wffh this nation, no history of a people can be I am sure, in' those circumstances, cut off from the people. Whatever anybody might have reacted in the mistakes Nehru might have made, it same way as the three Prime Minis­ i$ the duly of the future generations ters, Nehru, Lai Bahadur Shastri and ttf learn from those mistakes and go Indira Gandhi did. Perhaps as the forward, but not to decry them. That Prime Minister said he would have 325 D G > 1978-79 CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) D.G., 1978-79 326

agreed to that. II the forces repre­ What I mean genuine non-alignment sented by Dr. Subramaniam Swamy is non-alignment on the basis of the were in power at that time, they five priciples and non-interference in would hBVe not merely allowed the each other’s affairs. I think Mr. Atal expedition but they would have even Bihari Vajpayee will make it more called the American forces here. clear. We know the Soviet Union has come to our help in every difficult Some of his criticism, I think, was time, whether it was conflict with because he does not like the word Pakistan or the question of b steel nonriali'gninent. Other friends also mill. We know all that. In spite of said it. But I would like to say some­ that, we would not like them to in­ thing about that. I have held the terfere m our internal Affairs. Pro­ view that friendship with the Soviet bably they were misled by our friends Union is a geo-political necessity in the Cpj and they have also now whatever government comes into changed and they have said that their power, rightist, centrist or leftist. We support to emergency was wrong. may not like their method of working When we say genuine non-alignment, in their own country. That is their it is non-alignment—clear and honest. look-out. When we talk of genuine No friend can interfere in 0ur internal non-alignment, I would like to clear affairs. That is what I would like it very much as to why we call it to say. genuine non-alignment. Genuine non-alignment means that we did not I would like to deal with another want to become a part of the cold point. Nobody has dealt with that war. Because of our genuine non- point and that point is...... alignment we steered through and we became successful. Non-alignment I am glad Mr. Stephen said we has an element of reciprocity. It have always cared for neighbours. It is dors not mean that somebody attacks true and I think when Mrs. Gandhi you and you will be still friendly with was the Prime Minister, I also prais­ him. So we did take side on issues ed that we were giving more attention and we will continue to take side on to our neighbours. Though Nehru was issues. When the United States acted trying to build up non-alignment, against our national interests in 1971, somehow our people bureaucracy in we went in for the Indo-Soviet the foreign office in the earlier years Treaty of friendship, but not at the were trying to be friendly with the cost of our policy of non-alignment. richer people than others. Slowly, the Even there is an article in that treaty policy was developed and 1 think that Russia respects our policy of non. what Mr. Vajpayee has done after alignment. We said while signing taking over the Foreign Ministry, that treaty that we will not participate is that he has tried to mend fences in the rivalry.of the super powers. with the neighbouring countries. Why When we talk of genuine non-align­ should we not praise him for that? ment, I want to make it very clear He has done that. He has done a what we mean. During the emer­ good thing. To-day in the sub-con­ gency and earlier when certain tinent there is greater relaxation than forces in the Soviet Union tried to there was at any time in the last 30 criticise JP, Morarji in 1974-75 and years. Because of many historical also suported the emergency, it was events Vietnam has changed. So interference in our internal affairs. many other things have changed. We When Mr. Brezhnev made his speech are trying to have more moves of at a public meeting near the Red friendship with China, but not at the Fort supporting the programme of the cost of Soviet Union or anybody else. Congress Party, I objected to it as a Another important thing that has been member of the Congresg Party that done is that the foreign economic he had no business to do that. policy is slowly becoming an impera- D.G., 1978-79 APRIL 18, 1978 D.G., 1978-79 328

[Shri Krishan Kant] be given up. It must be given the tive and important component of our shape of global free zone because any other thing below that is to legitimise foreign policy. As the Report shows nuclear weapons of the big super-po­ our technical help to Asian African wers whether it is NPT, whether it is countries, our economic agreement nuclear power free zone whether it is with Vietnam breaks fresh grounds. in South America or Asia or it is the SHRI K. LAKKAPPA (Tumkur): question of taking nucloar protection from big powers. I would like to What about economic policy? warn him, the bureaucracies all over SHRI KRISHAN KANT: We are the world are the same. They have not discussing on economic policy. Do been influenced by money and pro­ you want economic agreement with paganda and the media which was to Vietnam or not? Then why do you legitimise the super-power hegemony speak like that. in the nuclear stock piles. Many of you must have read a book by Ashok Kapur on 'India’s nuclear option1. He I would like our food and foreign has mentioned the names of two im­ exchange reserves to be utilised in a portant officials—Shri C. S. Jha and way that the new concept of align­ Shri Jagat Mehta, who (have been ment grows, having self reliance, not propagating in favour of the N.P.T. based on the support of the big po­ and other things. I would like that wers or industrialised nations, but such things should not be allowed to mutual help of the non-aligned coun­ happen again against our national tries. That should be given impetus. policy. 1 think, in that direction Mr. Vajpayee has gone ahead. I think now initia­ tives have been taken during the last I wanted to give lot of points on one year of his stewardship of the this. But I would like only in the Ministry of External Affairs. I think end to say that this is the time when now oppr rtunity has come when a we should take the initiative. We special session of the General As­ have lost that initiative after the sembly is being called to discuss dis­ Chinese aggression. We have lost armament. I would like him to take this for the last 15 years because many initiatives in that. other things developed in the world and in the country. I request you to One factor—awful and terrible tothe take that initiative which may lead whole world—is nuclear power growth us to a situation wlhere production of all over the world. The nuclear stork nuclear weapons becomes a crime piles are growing with two super po­ against humanity, against the con­ wers. This has led to rivalry This science of the people. And, in the has led to intervention in the develop­ next General Assembly of the UNO, ing countries. I would like Mr. you please try to get a Resolution Vajpayee and the Prime Minister-- passed to that effect, so that later on Mr. Desai—when thtey go there, take you can go ahead with the idea, so more senous action m this respect. I that in the shortest possible time, our know he has written latters to his real dream when we took to non- alignment is realised. Before conven­ counter-parts in non-aligned countries. But writing letters would not suffice. tional disarmanet takes place, nuclear Just as we did earlier, I think, a re­ weapons disarmament has to be realised. With these words, I would solution must be brought in Parlia­ ment and later on in the United once again request the hon. Minister that he should not lose this oppor­ Nations saying that these nuclear weapons are a crime against humanitj. tunity, because, genuine non-align­ ment policy is the only correct policy As we did in Nehru’s time in 1981, we and India must play its historic role must bring in a Resolution. Regional and we are confident. Because we nuclear weapons-free zone idea must are powerful in nuclear technology, 1900 (SAKA) D.O., 1978-79 33© 329 D .G., 1078-79 CHATTRA 28, SHRI VASANT SATHE: Let him we have the credibility and we take our stand on right lines. With these write to the Speaker. words I conclude my speech. MR. CHAIRMAN: Mr. Subrama­ MR. CHAIRMAN: Now, Mr. Un- niam Swamy, you also made so many nikrishnan. allegations against others. They have not made any allegations against you. DR. SUBRAMANIAM SWAMY As a matter of fact, I have not given (Bombay North-East); I have a point you permission, there is nothing now. of order, Sir. I have to draw your I am not giving you permission... attention to Rule 357. (Interruptions) How can he say that there is no point DR. SUBRAMANIAM SWAMY; I of order? I draw your attention to don’t understand wby you should not Rule 357. It says: allow me to speak. (Interruptions). “A member may, with the permis­ MR. CHAIRMAN: Mr. Subrama­ sion of the Speaker---- ” niam Swamy, will you please resume your seat? You please refer to Direc­ I am asking for your permission, Sir. tion 115 C. It reads as follows:— MR. CHAIRMAN: Nr. Subrama­ “No member shall be permitted to niam Swamy, you are referring to make a statement by way of per­ Rule 357. It is very clear that a Mem­ sonal explanation under rule 357 ber may, with the permission of the unless a copy thereof has been sub­ Speaker, do so. But, I am sorry, I mitted in writing by the member am not giving you the permission... to the Speaker sufficiently in ad­ vance and the Speaker has approv­ DR. SUBRAMANIAM SWAMY: ed it.” My point is a small point only. I don't want to take the time of the House, So, that is the Direction of the Spea­ Sir. ker. You have not given me in writ­ ing and I have not given you the per­ Sir, an allegation has been made mission. against me. Have I not got the right to defend myself? DR. SUBRAMANIAM SWAMY: I will give it, Sir. Let me quote again. MR. CHAIRMAN: But he has not This is not a long speech or anything made any allegation. like that. If a member is present he can interrupt. I do not want to 80 DR. SUBRAMANIAM SWAMY: I out of the way. If a Member is pre­ would like to make one point clear. sent, he can interrupt. After all. I I would request you to give me per­ have a right to defend myself in this mission to make a brief personal Ex­ House. If an absurd allegation is planation. made against me, have I not got the right to defend myself? I have got SHRI VASANT SATHE (Akola): that right here. You just allow me a What is the use of his Personal Ex­ minute. planation? He uses every kind of word for others. If he is given an MR. CHAIRMAN; You gee only opportunity to offer a Persona] Ex­ wasting the time of the House. planation, then, we should also be given an opportunity to give a Per­ SHRI VASANT SATHE: It should sonal Explanation. not go on record. He is speaking with­ out your permission. MR. CHAIRMAN: Mr. Subrama­ niam Swamy, you please resume your MR. CHAIRMAN; Now, Mr. Unni- fceat, Your point is not relevant. krishnan, D.G., 1978-79 APRIL 18, 1978 D.G., 1978-79 332

SHRI K. P. UNNIKRISHNAN MR. CHAIRMAN: I will examine (Badagara): Mr. Chairman, Sir,— it whether it is unparliamentary or not. Now, Mr. Unnikrishnan. SHRI K. LAKKAPPA; He is weep­ ing. SHRI K. P. UNNIKRISHNAN: Mr. Chairman, Sir, I do not want to take SHRI B. P. MANDAL (Madhe- away Mr. Krishan Kant ... pura): Sir, I rise on a point of order. «ft q * o q

The foreign policy, goals and objec­ the neighbourhood? These are the tives are sought not in a vacuum but in crucial questions which would come d broad international environment. upl when we talkf about ‘Neighbour* This will change obviously when the hood diplomacy’. forces that operate change and when there is any deviation from certain Also, there is yet another related things—I do not take it that there question. That question has been should be no deviation—there can be raised here earlier in the House, and there might be deviations. But, namely, the question of authoritarian­ we have been hearing for quite some ism and human rights, an issue over time over the months the Prime which your party came to power, an Minister and the Minister for Exter­ issue over which you sent people all nal Affairs have been talking about a around the world, including My friend national consensus around the foreign Mr. Subramaniam Swamy, you tried policy goals. But, how can there be to show that there was an authorita­ a national consensus is a basic ques­ rian regime here- It is as though tion. Is there one? That is my basic Indian History was to be divided bet­ policy question. The question of ween pre-emergency and post-emer- continuity and national consensus is gency periods, as if this is the great more important because, over the dividing line. years, we have changed from a bin- polar world into a multi-polar world Sir, it would be a great historical uhere the position of India has also fallacy to suggest such a thing. But (hanged. that does not mean that you defend or condone everything that went on Now, the Report of the Ministry of during those 19 unfortunate months. External Affairs talks about 'Neigh­ bourhood diplomacy’ and about But the other point is this: What ‘Genuine non-alignment’. Sir, these is our attitude towards the aspirations years, we have changed from a bi­ of freedom-flghters in Bangladesh? polar world into a multi-oolar world What is our attitude to the great Office, after Mr. Vajpayee has taken freedom-fighters like Mr. B. P. Koirala over. in Nepal? What is again our attitude on the question of human rights and Now, I would like to know, what the democratic right of people like is the content of this term ‘Neighbour, Mr. Bhutto with whom we may have hood diplomacy’? Sir, neighbourhood disagreed? These are the questions issues and our relations with our which assume importance when they neighbours are something which is talk in season and out of season about very crucial and which is very impor­ human rights. And when you want to tant for us and our bilateral relations raise many issues relating to human should undoubtedly improve. But rights in the United Nations and other the other point is this: Is it right on forums, the international community °ur part to prop up unstable regimes can legitimately pose this question: with no social base? This is an im­ What is your attitude to the question portant question. This question is of human rights in yaur own neigh­ very relevant when We discuss the bourhood, with whom you want to Question of our relationship with cer­ improve your relations? tain neighbours. Sir, I am not arguing for any kind Then the next question is this: Is of paternalistic approach or that we our objective to enhance the ex­ should dictate to them, nor am I argu­ pectations of our neighbours to a level ing for a policy of benign neglect! which we can never fulfil? What' But it is very important that we shall be the consequences of such a should have a clear conception of what policy for our future relations with we want to do in the entire South D.G., 1978-79 APRIL 18, 1978 D.G., 1978-79 336

[Shri K. P. Unnikrishnan] tant that we have an involvement with Aslan region. The whole attitude of what goes in Asia or in South East what U.S. and the West pursued, of Asia. It is good that Mr. Kundu had building up Pakistan as a countervail, gone to Vietnam and, I hope, it will ing force in South Asia against us has further strengthen our relations. But failed since 1971 and this cannot be if you are going all round the world revived. to every country and say that we want to be friendly with you, that means I would like to Bay that in this you have no conceptual framework country we have a stake in human of foreign policy! You have a policy rights. We have a stake in democracy of no thrust by putting your eggs in and more so in our neighbourhood, hundred baskets! While it is impor­ we do not want the dismemberment of tant not to put all your eggs in one Pakistan and we do not contribute to basket, it is equally important that the idea as a nation to ‘Akhand Bharat' you do not put your eggs in a hun­ whatever might have been the views dred different baskets! of Mr. Vajpayee ji and many other Sir, Vietnam is going to be a bul­ friends on the other side on this ques­ wark of non-alignment. It is going to tion. People who talked about Akhand be a power Centre in Asia and the Bharat like Shri Aurobindo, who very earlier we realise it the better it much disagreed with the partition of will be. India said that the unity that will come in future will be different m Another related question is the texture.’ And therefore, what we question of the Indian Ocean. The should undoubtedly pursue is a policy very concept of super-power has to be of friendship and concern for the de­ re-examined in depth. The Uni­ mocratic rights and help for evolution ted States wants stabilisa­ of emocratic reglms. We cannnt tion of existing military situa­ have anything to do with unstable and tion in the Indian Ocean area authoritarian forces operating in our That is very different from what we neighbourhood. demand that it should be a zone of peace and that there should be total MR. CHAIRMAN: Mr Unnikrishnan, de-militarisation in the area. There may I kno^y this? Prom your partv is a distinct difference also in are you the only last person to speak the approach in building up of the or you are also given a chance? Diego Garcia base it is a military base and you say there is military presence' SHRI VAYALAR RAVI: He may This subtle distinction can impart a take as much time as he wants we new element to your approach on don’t mind. Diego Garcia and the question of peace in Indian Ocean zone. MR. CHAIRMAN: I am saying this Similarly, on the question of West because your party has 84 minutes and Asia There were murmurs when 17 minutes are over. Please continue certain initiative were taken by Sadat —some officials of Foreign Office start­ SHRI K. P. UNNIKRISHNAN; So. ed saying that there la a great achieve­ Sir, India is a major power between ment as though he has already achiev­ Suez and Singapore. It i8 not only a ed a great deal! I would like to re­ regional power but a major power. iterate that the policy that we had India’s voice counts not in terms of the even during the Freedom Struggle arsenal it has; but India always had has been a commitment to the cause a certain moral authority. I would of Palestine and Arab nationalism not like this authority to be diluted and also we have made it clear; I am by considerations that we are only glad that the External Affairs Minis­ concerned with our own neighbour­ ter did say that the basic question is hood. That is why it is very impor­ one of vacation of aggression. 337 D G., 1978-79 CHAITRA 28, 1900 < SAKA) D.G., 1978-79 338

Our concern with problem* of sabotage Indo-Soviet relations though Africa is vital. You cannot contribute there are public declaration to the anything in Africa unless you accept contrary. the role of imperialism in Africa and also understand the role of neo­ I would like to say a few words colonialism. If you reject these con­ about the bilateral relations between cepts, you cannot play a positive role India and United States. Undoubted­ in the African developments in Zim- ly, we on this side went to improve babve, South Africa and Namibia or the relations but not at the level that help front line states and above all Vajpayee ji would like to have. Once meet the aspirations of African people. he took a letter of Guru Golwalkar to the President Jhonson which said “you Now, I find that in this Report even are the leader of the Camp of Dhar- the typographic letters have under­ ma.'* gone a change when it came to the Soviet Union. When it comes to SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE: Western Europe there are bold letters Took to whom? but in the case of USSR and Eastern SHRI K. P. UNNIKRISHNAN: Took Europe there are smaller letters which to the President Johnson. means they have been relegated to background! SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE: No. You are wrong. THE MINISTER OP EXTERNAL AFFAIRS (SHRI ATAL BIHARI SHRI K. P. UNNIKRISHNAN: You VAJPAYEE): It is not deliberate. can correct me. I said you took a letter of Guru Golwalkar. SHRI K. P. UNNIKRISHNAN: I know the Minister of External Affairs The most important question is to has a correct understanding and pers­ understand the case that United States has certain global interests These pective. Simultaneously efforts are global interests are dictated by the going on to subvert the Indo-Soviet relations. I will give a small example. Military Industrial Complex of the There is an Indo-Soviet Coriimission United States and they cannot be on Social Sciences. Now, an attempt changed. It is my friend, Mr. Chan- drappan who quoted Brezenski an­ is being made to propose a man—who is an intellectual undoubtedly and a other exponent of the new trilateral professor but who is totally anti- view. That is the view which holds Soviet—a8 Chairman of this Indo- good with President Carter—the views of trilateral commission. Harold Soviet Commission on Social Sciences. Brown, the U.S. Defence Secretary, He is totally —unwelcome. He has taken a distinet position of certain has said recently that the situation in things. He is a person whose institute Asia, India and particularly South Asia is better for us How do they —Centre for Development Studies or look at the situation! I quote: so—was financed for year* by the Asia Foundation, which was exposed by the “We want to ensure that :his en­ New York Times in American Mass vironment continues. In the next Media to be a conduit for CIA funds. five years, we will be strengthening Hp is sought to be imposed by the our forces in the region by the in­ Ministry of External Affairs and the troduction of several advanced wea­ Ministry of Education as a new Chair­ pon systems, trident nuclear missiles man of the Indo-Soviet Commission for our submarine fleet, cruiser mis­ °n Social Sciences, This Is how you siles for B-528, F-14 fighters for our want to promote cooperation with carriers, F-158 for Air Force squa­ Soviet Union I Attempts are afoot to drons, etc. etc.” D.G., 1978-79 APRIL 18, 1978 D.G., 1978-79 340

[S h n K . P. Unnikrishnan] sions because there have been dis­ This is how Mr. Harold Brown hopes quieting trends during the last year. I hope he will not allow himself to be to improve the situation in Asia. So, a prisoner of this disquieting trends what the United S t a t e * want us is t o be an honest broker between these and of the non-official advisers who crowd around him. I hope he will people who have these neo-clomal himself clarify the issues to the satis­ projections and the rest of the third faction of this House so that a genuine world. Are you prepared to play this consensus can be built up which is role? That is the basic question whe­ vitally important But on the basis of ther you raise it in connection with what you have shown, there can be no Brown's remarks or Brezenski’s or the consensus, there can only be disquiet­ views of the Business International ing apprehensions and doubts. I hope Team which came here and which was he will be able to clear it up. given a red carpet treatment. MR CHAIRMAN: Mr. Patil, you Now, again you have a threat to cut have got only three minutes. But I off uranium supplies by Joseph Nye. will give you five minutes. Before I conclude I would say we had %h *?o inftw ) : a disarmament workshop here at a considerable expense—Rs. 30 lakhs or *TTB3T, so—10 the exchequer Afterall the Papers had been prepared and accept­ snmr ed for the U N Special Session on Dis­ armament! I did not know what was %, xftx *rr*r the need for this kind of lavish get- srar fo n | 1 »rwfor sft fwr together. Undoubtedly, disarmament is a question with which we should be ®HRT ^ OT *T7Fnr concerned and we should have taken initiatives m the matter as we had in ^ Tsrarr fj the earlier past in 1950s. I would like you to revive this interest but the qrnr % i whole question is how you do it I hope this kind of workshops—expen­ ^ titfa tit* sive workshops—may be good enough «r? tftr *n?nn*TTt % fa r for some people who claim to advise $ 1 CT the Foreign Office in their non-official capacities; but I do not know whether from TOroul xfrr flfrgfirceq *pt they can really contribute anything ftwiv ^ i ^rf^riT more than that On disarmament, tost* what is more important is that you sefre your opportunities and initiati­ t fa & # f f ves and take a more active role in T9IT % f t — international forums—a decisive role «R it*, f»TST3fT^ —which you can take only if you are clear in your minds as to what you * % f o w want. I I n r wm % Before I conclude I would only say 3fi vp’RTT | f«p wmrr w f one thing When he assumed office a f^Rrr 1 1 m $ fa year ago, we welcomed his assertions fcff % «rtfr iflr of continuity and course of Indian foreign policy We will continue to do W ^ fTT 5TRTT % VTT*T so, despite Dr Subramaniam Swamy, q y fTTTTf qrfwff but we would have much to say, as fa s f ? to wt* we have pointed out, on these ques­ tions, we have quite a ftew apprehen­ . tit tffit vpwptt&f ^ifwrr g i D.G., 1078-79 CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) DXS., 1978-79 343

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[*rt $© iwt© qrfe?r— arrd] rapt attention various speeches by my hon friends with regard to foreign policy If there is any domain about t» f * wrht f , f * wr^r ot & *re*ft which 99 or 100 per cent unanimity «pt 11s**n*r?r could be obtained, it is in the domain fa? t*fhc^*nar*fr*n|?wtfifr of the foreign policy of this country It has been evolved for historical rea­ 'srar ?w f*rrft w w w rit sons, all these years and there is un­ ^rrf?FT «rfr ^ ftaft W w animity, by and large as far a$ this fftr j*r$ f e r v^lw % «rr *r%r policy is concerned I am very much distressed that some voices had been f?w!an *R?r ^ wr !hf rr raised not only denouncing this policy «f>rfcr qrfsrcflr «w w ft s*Rft i of non-alignment but also sugges1m | * f am very much distressed because this w r | ? *r? fees 5 tftrcrr *jt fe w statement has come from my friend Dr Subramaniam Swamy The Janata z qttfw r 3FTT ft fm | 1 v t *t party manifesto is clear z*£t % f*rft w fofferc t | I ZWS *pt WVH ft afTT “The Janata Party is committeJ f> ^ t 5TT ^Tt ?r ^ | vt^ wrw »ft ?ifi have difference of opinion with Jawa­ 4t» f> Tft I 1 s * * v tf harlal Nehru or Atalji 0r Shri Morarji Desai, but to question the bonafides ff^t % m 1 1 sg tPTfr aft *mr vr *rcr and to describes Jawaharlal Nehru as Tfr $Jr$$®«itsnm?ftTT?rafcftvi rnr the traitor of the country, I gay, the man who speaks this, either he mi’st | *fh «rt«T w f® *rfa frrsT 1 1 *«r be suffering from bouts of insanity or n?t jftftr wrsrr? *rr% % rri spokesman of the Janata Party an^ Janata Party’s policies are wot clearly SHRI RATANSINGH RAJDA enunciated by him I fully endorse (Bombay South)* I have heard with the views expressed by my colleag,,p D.G., 1978-79 CHAITKA 28, 1900 (SAKH) D.G., # )/d -79 346

Shri Krishnan Kant on this. What is Jawaharlal Nehru. But at the same the foreign policy of a country? It is time, we believe that there were alter all an extension ot the national certain deviations. Some element*, interest and extension of the domestic were there and they triea policy on the international plane to tilt the balance. We wanteu Looking from this view point, any to rectify that imbalance which Indian and in fact every Indian would was introduced and if that is so, the be proud of the record that Jawaharlal entire country would be indebted to lias created in the international field. our present Prime Minister and Exter­ Panditji is not only a deyen of t>ur nal Affairs Minister. Whatever tilt foreign policy and an architect of our was there, tnat is, being removed and loreign policy, but he has also given a we are not tilting towards Russia or new direction and new thrust to our USA. We say that hitherto there was internationalism in this country. Even a phenomenon m the name of pro- the common man in the street became gressivism and leftism; some people very conscious of the internationalism were pro-Russia, some were pro-USA, and he knew what was the foreign but there was nobody who was P?o- policy that was being pursued in the india. This is a real patriotic policy interest of the country. The entiiu that is being pursued in this country. country would be indebted to Jawa- Now the tilt has been removed and hailal Nehru for centuries to come. I we genuinely say that this is the am shocked to hear Jawaharlal being genuine policy of non-alignment. described as a traitor and I am asham­ From this point of view, I would ed that this was spoken on the floor of beseech and appeale to all my friends this House; this should not have been in the Congress Benches to under­ uttered. stand the implication of proper and genuine non-alignment. If they un­ derstand it in the proper perspective, Having said this, as far as this policy 1 think, they would also agree with is concerned, after the change in the Government, a new wind of change us and by and large support this has come in this country and I would foreign policy. Since the time at my disposal is short—I am told that you like to pay full compliments and con> uratulation to Vajpayee, who has been have warned the Members that the time at our disposal is very short—I pursuing the right foreign policy en­ would like to make some suggestions unciated in the manifesto of the Janata to our Foreign Minister. Party. Yesterday, one of my collea­ gues in the Congress Bench was tell­ So far only rhetories and cliches and ing that Atalji being an erstwhile lobbying was going on in favour of Jansangh Member would behave like particular interests, but now it is very a bull in a China shop. But now they essential that we must create a non- would have known that he is In 110 bureaucratic cadre. 1 do not criticise mood to oblige them. He is working or condemn the bureaucratic cadre. throughout in the interest of the na­ We have got fine patriotic youngmen tion. He is a patriot and if anybody in our External Affairs Ministry. At criticises Atalji and finds fault with the same time, it is necessary that we him, I would say that he is doing great must create a non-bureaucratic cadre injustice not only to Atalji, but to him­ comprising of academicians and many self also and to his party and his other people who seriously study the colleagues. That should not have foreign policy in depth. They must been uttered on the floor of the be constantly invited by our Foreign House. After all, there were Office and a constant dialogue should certain deviations. I would say be carried on with them so that con­ that genuine and proper foreign policy structive and refreshing suggestions Js being pursued by this Government can come from all these friends. That what does it mean? We definitely would go a long way in helping us in supported the non-alignment policy of our decision-making. 347 JXGL, 1978-79 APRIL 18, 1978 DC, 1978-79 348

[Shn Ratan Singh Raj da] like to congratulate our Foreign Min­ We have got our Policy Planning ister who has been pursuing a correct Division It requires revamping I genuine and proper non-alignment am told that dynamic Atalji has al­ policy and the entire country of 650 ready introduced new changes in the million people are with him department It must be under a cons­ tant revamping process If that is done, our policy would always be dynamic We are suffering from poor publicity tto ^rnft qr ^rr If our publicity is earned on syste­ t t %f*2cT art £ 1 ira ^ t tit matic and scientific lines, that would go a long way in creating a good srTif | It ^ farto to % v s srtan image for our country It must be our n f t * f r 3R?rr fr ?rr gwrcV jftfsr the direction of gaining that leader­ f ^ T fr fWl?TT TT ship in the third world scrtfft cTT Tf T77TT «TT fT Other members have spoken about firam «ft?% ^ fT s*r finftsr normalisation of relations with China and I do not want to go into it in de­ fr sftr t *?^ ^ f r w ^ tail We want to be friendly with t 1 wrterr ?t*t * s m «tt s*ttt stpt China but not at the cost of the self- «mr % «m«ft &rr % ndr respect of this country If we can normalise our relations with China f*r % sn^ir ^ nfvrtrr % that will go a long way and it would fir ft ^ % 1 wft Ttforr tfV help stabilise u8 m our foreign policy arrrpr 3n% t t x&w firrr «tt 1 if nr and &tablise the position of nations m thig region After normalisation of i f * ir r w «rr 1 w « t t t t relations with China, we shall have a % arre m y T ir m ^ r r r f r arf?rfM%r zone of peace from Australia to Iran *rs*r arrrrtT sraw T tfw w and beyond, and m Africa, South of Sahara, we shall have to pursue a «tt 1 tnfinfrifed policy of graduated response, develop, ^ m r r «rr 1 % ^ r f % mg closer ties with enlightened gov­ w z r*r it «ry firfft' f*P ernments of Kenya, Tanzania, Zambia and Nigeria t ?»? ?r s«psr *f?ps£ Tsr t vfifip # r m # ft? *F Sir, as the time is short I would conclude with this words* I would f i v ft ^ ^ r r 349 D.G., 1078-79 CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) D.G., 1978-79 350

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St s r fe : site* f% f i SHRI NIRMAL CHANDRA JAIN* You know it I have just referred to ?r*ft wnf'T^'TR' ^ j s *l5^rr fa^fr it $ ¥t, &T Wf % WIcT s>tt t fa f*rrt SHRI VAYALAR RAVI: I believe > *rF?ffpff yRSQf *r^r ^ ■gfnrt «fh: it is only m India Then it is all amm ^rrffv 5nfa f*rr(t f*racn ^ right I know whom the hon. Mem­ wsfv %f\j w t v*® f t I ber means.

5HRT «Ft «fk fww *rk ^TFgrorT «ft ftitw w* «hf: ftf7 »r*ft fa^r TRrmv »t w it o ^ 0^ ® f > n v t r H tm prre ^ sft f a f w w n m t *«n?r f JTFFfta TT3f^ ft 5ft ^ 353 DG > 1978-79 CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SA KA ) D.G., 197B-79 354

fit* ff wr t t f?Rft ff i t r t unwr forr in glorious contradictions and notor­ ious embarrassments, he ha8 succeeded v 1 ^srftrt ff ^Rff fk^nr w rr in creating a two-fold image of India ^ t t j ftr wi$c vr STOTT t$ i on the world stage: internally com­ ®fVr v^Tff t*T fW>« ITRft ^ mitted to freedom, democracy and the rule of law and externally committed T cracies. Ttatar^tff fff*TCftf[*flT *TfTcrr fa- The democracies of the world, I Tfatf 5»pfr t «ftr fsffir ffsft the advice or criticism of those people v m w m ?»r 1 who continue to use a dictionary, the first and last edition of which ap­ SHRI RAM JETHMALANI (Bom­ peared in 1844, in which "democracy” bay North-West) • Mr. Chairman, is “imperialism” and “imperialism** Sir, 1 rise generally to endorse is “democracy*'. Let us not forget the foreign policy of my Government that this is a country of Gandhiji, and to compliment my distinguished and Gandhism is not inconsistent with Foreign Minister on the substantially gratitude. Let us not forget that successful conduct of big Ministry. when the Combrades across the Hima. Sir, I must say that in the traditional layas attacked us, it was the Ameri­ style of secret and. silent diplomacy, cans who brought arms and other without resorting to spectacular pub­ supplies and helped us to repel that lic statements, which often land us attack---- (Interruptions). 512 LS— 355 D.G., 1978-79 APRIL 18, 1978 D.G., 1978-79 356 I6I

]Shri Ram Jethmalani[ Our record of commendable com- .Rules 1 I must congratulate not only the mitment to the principle of universal :to the Foreign. Minister but also the dis- friendship for all and genuine non- .also ani tinguished Prime Minister of our alignment carries an avoidable black ../' country, who havte refused to blow spot, a black spot which has been their own t·rumpets, and who have very ably pinpointed by the distin- ,(c) y not taken credit for something fer guished Mr. Kamath and by my young which tlhey should be taking credit, friend, the distinguished Mr. Jain namely, a revolutionary break- here who spoke a few minutes before. through in the foreign policy which Shifting had been practised before. Our pOlicy in the Middle East pre- ,t sents a look of unforgivable crooked- The previous regime talked of non- ness, which must immediately put an 7331. alignment and We also talk of non- end to. We must polish up and ::Minister ailignment but the glaring difference, round off the angularities of that .state: (of which 'we ought to be·· proud, is policy. .•.....• that though Pandit Nehru did start a (a) w very sensible policy of non-align- I value OUr friendship with the received ment, and to· that extent my hon. Arab countries. I am next to none -ernment friend Shri Rajda was night, equally in believing that we must sympa- Ranigan let Us recognise what in his own way thise with Arab objectives, at least Ministry the great Subramaniam Swamy told some of them, but the manner in , (b) w us, namely that in course of time, which we have irrationally identified '" 'been acc ultimately, that sensible policy which ourselves with some obscurantist ele- and agr the great Pandit Nehru started de- ments in .tha Middle East has robbed generated into an undig;ufi~d posture our voice, robbed our advice, robbed (c) if of spurious neutrality. But the our counsel, of that moral authority iormalis neutrality of our Prime Minister and 'and political effectiveness which are ry in th, Foreign Minister and of the Janata due to the voice of this great country. Party Government in general is pre- It is in the interests of our Arab THEl gnant with robust manliness and friends that We should have some MINIST transparent genuineness. Don't be effectivj, channel of communication MATI A dismayed by the Congressmen think- with the small but gallant country of ing of you as a bull in a china shop. Israel. We should be more r-eason- (b) ar -consider, Whether you are a bull is a matter of able in Our denunciation of that coun- concern only to the Congress cows. !try .... (Interruptions) -cision w It is not that they are happy that MR. CHAIRMAN: He has got his you are not acting like a bun. They own views. are disappointed that you are not. My suggestion is tlhat you do occasionally Appoint. SHRI VAYALAR RAVI: Her~ is a oblige them. lobby speaking On behalf of Israel. da While I Ihave said all this, I do not Is it in the interests of our country, wish to create an impression on this of the Janata Party? They are the f 7332. ~ House or on anybody ehe nor on ruling party. (InterrUPtions) ·the Mini your Ministry that everything is per- BROAD ( fect and, therefore, incapable of im- SHRI RAM JETHMALANI: I (a) wl provement in many spheres. It is in suggest that We should be more Carneran this spirit of constructive suggestion Te~.l;onaQle in our denunciation of Doordars that I have taken upon myself the that country. We should be more April, 19 somewhat irksome task Of moving conscious of tlhe imperatives of its four cut motions, but believe it or not survival, And above all, we should candidat I would not have moved them if our be more even-:han:ded in tl1e judg- 'vacancie: consultative meetings had not been ments which we pass upon issues "is given very rare and if our own party meet- Wlhich arise in that region. Let me (b) wl: lngs in which loreign policy could l;>e s.ay for the benefit of my learned :men are discussed continuously were not friends on 'the other side that Israel vacancis, themselves very rare. is not a western country, it is an estill wai1 357 D&- 1*78-79 CHAJTRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) D.G., 1978-79 358

Asian country and when all our com­ MR. CHAIRMAN: X know that you rade# and all our Arab friends had can contribute something. You are deserted ua during the Bangladesh a good speaker. But what can 1 do? war, It wa8 the Foreign Minister of It is left to your whip. If your name Israel who made a speech which was first, you could have got some should have been made by the time. But always, your name is in Foreign Minister of India. Let us not the last. forget that and let us not be carried away by our spurious secularism SHRI RAM JETHMALANI: While which we have been practising in this it is true that all violence breeds country for so long. counter-violence and it did produce massive counter violence from Israel, I wish to remind this House that but I want to ask why you kept your our Government welcomes all kinds mouth shut when the first act of vio­ of people from ell countries but it is lence took place and you opened your a matter of some shame that we did mouth wide only when retaliation not allow the great , a took place. I plead that hereafter at world genius in the field of music, least let this country rise to its full and his orchestra to come to this Gandhian statute and let our moral country. Does music become bad be­ authority be found effective in the cause it is produodt or played by a world. If we are prepared to throw Jewish musician? This is not secu­ away crores of rupees for the purpose larism, this is not Gandhism end this of prohibition, we can spurn a few is not Xndianism. It is something petro-dollars if speaking truth in in­ which is destructive and frustrative ternational councils costs us a few of the very objectives of helping the petro-dollars. Arab cause. We welcome all peoples from Arab countries but why cannot In our manifesto, we have taken we welcome philosophers, scientists upon ourselves a great obligation— and musicians from that democratic the obligation to denounce the vio­ and bsave> coumtry?< The people of lation of human rights whenever and this country shall not tolerate it for wherever it occurs. In 1966 when Jong. I wish to declare that I deeply Mrs. Gandhi came into political owcr, deplore the Palestinian raid on the it is precisely at that time that the 12th March upon the legitimate terri­ United Nations brought into exis­ tory of Israel, not on disputed terri­ tence two of those monumental docu­ tory but on legitimate and lawful ments relating to the preservation and soil. The commandoes went on that support of human rights, the two soil, got hold of a bus, moved down United Nations Covenants with the with Are arms innocent men, old Optional Protocol. I have been ask­ men, pregnant women end children ing that these should be ratified by in arms.

SIffil RAM JETHMALANI: I will SHRI SY®D KAZIM ALI MEERZA take five minutes lor my cut motions. (Murshidabad): May 1 put a question D.G., 1978-79 APRIL 18, 1978 D.G., 1978-79 360

[Shri Syed Kazim All Meerza] goes and gets Rs. 2,000 there, your to my friend Mr. Jethmalani? Whom Ambassador tells him that unless he is he supporting? Is he supporting gets Rs. 2,500, his passoprt will be the aggressor Israel which has been impounded. By this, he is not serv­ committinig brutalities and atrocities ing the national interests. He ought against all human rights condemned by to go— all nations of the world---- (Inter­ ruptions) MR. CHAIRMAN: Please conclude. MR. CHAIRMAN: Mr. Jethmalani, SHRI RAM JETHMALANI: One please conclude. more minute Sir.

SHRI RAM JETHMALANI: A I admire the efforts of my Govern­ word about the third point which ment in developing friendly relations I wanted to mention, which is the with our neighbours, particularly subject-matter of the third Cut with Pakistan and with Bangladesh. Motion—the manner in which the But let me remind the Minister that, provisions of this outdated Emigra­ in developing this friendship, we tion Act of 1922 are being enforced should not forget the obligation of in this country---- our manifesto. The obligation of our manifesto is to denounce violation of SHRI VAYALAR RAVI: I support human rights wherever and whenever you here that occurs. That Is our Bible. I do not accept the suggestion of Mrs. SHRI RAM JETHMALANI: I am Gandhi because she never talks on glad, sometimes you see light. principle, she talks on the basis of personalities. She has said that wc That Act embodies the text of I860. must talk about Mr. Bhutto. Mr. Tt incorporates the colonial ideas of Bhutto is not a person who should the last Century when the British be very loved in this country because wanted to have the monopoly of the he has been the cause of discord bet­ use of Indian manpower for the pur­ ween India and Pakistan and he is pose of their being exploited in the the man who, like a common urchin, British colonies and not in other had presided over the burning of the colonies That Act today has become hijacked Indian plane in Lahore. the instrument no longer of exploi­ Therefore, we have no sympathy with tation by the colonial powers because him. But we have sympathy with we are free, but it has become an principle, we have sympathy with instrument of corruption and bribery conscience, we have attachment to in the hands of a large number of human rights. Mr. Bhutto, considered officers who collectively call them­ from the point of view of a lawyer selves the Protector of Emigrants. has not had a fair trial in Pakistan; But they are not the protectors of he has been denied that human right. Emigrants they are out to destroy We should denounce the verdict on and exploit them for their own profit. the ground that he has not had a fair trial, a basic right. Even the worst There is an Ambassador of ours criminal is entitled to a fair trial and living in one of those countries—I that is what he should have. Our do not wish to name him here—who stock will rise in the international has issued a circular in which he has world if we supported Mr. Bhutto said that the passport of any Indian not because he is Mr. Bhutto but be­ who accepts employment for less than cause he is the victim of an unfair the particular figure which he has trial, his conviction is the result of prescribed shall be impounded. The that. position in this country is that we cannot give a man Rs. 100 or give him We are today playing host to a an employment. And if that man Russian Parliamentary Delegation. 36l D.G., 1978-79 CHAITRA 28, 1900 ( SAKA) D.G., 1978-79 362

While I say, ana I have said, that I Vajpayee to do something for non- am next to none in my advocacy of alignment—the non-alignment policy Indo-Soviet friendship, let us din which got eclipsed during Mrs. very politely and gently into the ears Gandhi's regime. of our Russian friends that we admire them for the Helsinki Accord which There were some friends from the was arrived at in 1975. But the proof CPI and others who, with the help of the pudding is in the eating. Today of the Russian people, said in this are imprisoned almost without a trial country that if Mr. Vajpayee, Mr. eleven persons who have been tell­ Desai and Mr. come to ing their Government ‘why are you power, Delhi will be converted into not following the Helsinki Accord’. ‘Chile’. (Interruptions) They said Read the latest bulletin of the Inter­ it. Even the CPM said it. But the national League for human Right3— whole world can see that Delhi has a document which my friends across not become ‘chile’. (Interruption). will not touch because for them it is poison; they do not like it. But let Sir, after appreciating the non- us tell our Soviet friends that we do alignment policy and foreign affairs not approve of this. policy, I want to bring to your kind notice two or three things which are SHRIMATI AHILYA P RANGNE- of utmost importance to the Sikh KAR (Bombay North-Centrall: You community. An Arab country—Saudi were the Chief Guest when the Soviet Arabia—has banned the entry of Sikh delegation came. people into that country Shiromani SHRI RAM JETHMALANI: I told Gurudwara Prabandhak Committee them. I had the courage to tell them, the biggest representative organisa­ which you did not have. tion of the Sikhs of the world and the Akali Dal leader and the Punjab Let us rise to our full stature and Chief Minister had written to Hon talk of human rights. It does not Mr Vajpayee to take up the matter. matter if it costs us some inconveni­ Now two and a half years have elaps­ ence and loss of fair weather friend­ ed and yet nobody has talked about ships. the Sikjhs’ entry into Saudi Arabia. Sir, a third nation is creating a wedge between citizens of the same country. MR. CHAIRMAN: If Members do A third nation is creating a wec^e not cooperate with me, it will be very and it is a challenge to the capab'hly difficult; I cannot accommodate the of the Hon. External Affairs Minister. Members. After all, I am trying my (Interruptions). Even I had applied best to accommodate everybody, but for a visa to Saudi Arabia as a Mem­ vou don’t listen. That is the situa­ ber of Parliament but, because I am tion. a Sikh, I was denied the visa to Saudi Arabia. I hope the Minister Only five minutes please. will take it up.

SHRI BALWANT SINGH RAMO- Further, 1 want to say that the Sikh OWALIA (Faridkot): First of all, I Community lost property, houses etc appreciate the external affairs policy during Partition and we lost our of my Government. But before ap­ Gurudwaras also. At that time there preciating the External Affairs Minis­ was a provision that 25 Sevadars of ter Sahib I want to appreciate some­ Sikh community can go to Pakistan «nd one else also. Who is that? Before live there to see to the organisation appreciating the Hon. External Aff­ of Gurudwaras. That also has been airs Minister I want to give my thanks denied. Now, the Salal Dam has been and appreciate the great people of discussed and other things have been this great country who provided discussed, but I am sorry that the enough opportunity to the Hon. Mir. Hon. External Affairs Minister has not 363 DG., 1978*70 APRIL 18, 1 978 D G , 1978-79 364 [Shri Balwant Singh Ramoowalia] Mr Chairman, Sir, I have taken the taken up this issue which is a burn­ minimum time of the House and 1 hope ing issue for the Sikh Community. the Minister will consider my requests I hope he will do justice to that also. with maximum of a attention, The Foreign Exchange Regulations Act was enacted in the year 1973 MR CHAIRMAN The whole House There ate many Indian who went to is grateful to you. some foreign countries ten years back or twenty years back The Govern- ment enacted a law in 1973 which is causing great harassment to such peo­ *tarft (ftftpmgr) * ple A person, some members of whose sirrofir u p m , * tot* xtinri f W z r family went to England, Malaysia or some other country about twenty wn g fa 355ft aft years back, is now being harassed by vt o t % *r*T*n fa the Enforcement authorities and they tft t i 3 * ^ v* ask such a person “Where from did you get this property or this house arrcr trw ifnfar *r farr $ fa aft etc,> I would request the Minister of ?ftor ?T*ffTT if f a tit External Affairs to see that at least aft $ *1$ W afr ^ sftaft fa such people are not harassed under this Act Such people who went f*r *t$t vr ijpp tg&rr m * abroad before 1973 should not be % ^*vt *r ?*rrft 1 * harassed x * trnrnr ?t $ i Then Sir, Uganda expelled Indians and Burma also expelled Indians. When they came to this country, they became a burden for us Such a situa *»t wnsr tit isott ttct aft tit 5 3 tion can be created in certain other arm 3 * artt $TFft f f i ^ft countries and thousands of Indians who are there can face the same pro­ v f it it t im , «ft tit w r blem and have the same ill-luck *rrs* *rr tot * t ^ r r CHAITRA 28, 1800 (SAKA) D.G., 1978-79 366 ft anr p f *f I «TTOT 8$ vttir ?pt ^nxrif i unnfr *wfff ^ rr itrafcnff * t tar f t 1 eft mf^r«fY ?ftr %m ?*t ftrot «rM t ^ S»r f»rrtV $ m w ft ifhc n $ «Ffr *tm t$t »nr r ft t$ mrrtff i jfror m r t f v f c ft far <** *rrs*ft % fr«r *m?r i St vteT tfV ^ $*TT f«w% ^r% * * * $ u;* «nrar*fV ?ft ftrwr ?r 5> i ^ ?pf *TT *P*r f t TOT ? «T ^ tnp m s*ft #r =ar# i ^rrd f«^ r jftf?r ^ r «tt * fa s*rtr *r * % 5m *rJRp srrmfm «fV, M t «ft fr ^rrt ap^r aft *TT *F^V »ff I *5 »fr 3W rnTwwf ?*n^ Tirr ft i ^ ^rt wt«r ft 'H t «ft n i t $£ «ft, snr *?tf *i? t g#t awm' if vt^Rt ft f^ r t «r^r sf^r ?r^Krr ft f r ?”r *wftaT ? th itm ^ i ?rf »«1^ft It if* Tft f *rrft qTfmft | 1 5 1 8f frnr^ararrr^>tt i q ^r ^ y »r ^r 3r> *ft srrt ffy^RTr^r % fft?r *rr?ff apt ^rrfw «rr ^ ^ » f t ?ftnT *$t rr ^t f * % ^rrfr^rnr *t w Sjtw 1 f^fjRTR % srrt ^ ^?rf ^r ^ arm n lr 1 *£5sjrf «r> *?r£ srrcr ^nft *f^r arfrr a% ft i «nf^FaT*T «ff I 3R <^r * ^ 5TVFfH ff ?ft 5 1 rwsKcwifr «mr ^r «^t i*r fW T ^ %■ *Tt*T*ft *PT *ft ^ ?r Ir frr ^ ft ^ f% *?w?t *»r& *jt st i ^rr^r ft i ^ ?nr ?r anft *for ft i itf faaft ^ afJTrft I «rr*T% v t *rr^r^

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17 00 h r g . fffranff ^rt^Tift vt s r t ftwrr ^rrfr, ^ arnrfr | 1 wftsr «Ft atfRfa % arn? Trf¥Nmnt JW ^ fiW f* .**rK _ f\.ctmtr r\ WnRT _ s ^ r» faRFT r W , ^ iftfW w r *TCrf aRRTT ^fY I fr w * t 3ft jfinrr fr ?sr*T!rr % * * P*ftfr*rfw5*r w w y> anrr, t o it w r tk ?rfr arnar m & *t ™ ^ ^ **T =PT 1 *pt yaRft t 1 vrorPn? vtPrt % ^rj- 3rfirfr?ranar,TO, swh af?ft gft fr «ft t o c % srnr ^ft f fv ^ toff *t t artffrff *r ^fevtw iwstwt, ^ifr fimarhr «*k *ftr w fN ft w w Ypflvr srcnrt in fr firm wfw w irfrar ^ amrfisff iftr w r fr wtf, vfrfrfftft snprr v t % npw »i *Pt ftfr ararr | 1

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[S>.ft S>.ft ;p:iJT f~1"~ (I~l~I~ifi'fc: dhinagar): Because so much time has 'flfT ~ ? ~. f'+i;;;rlITfcfcr¥T 9;'T "fTCfi<:T already been extended, I request ,.•.•...... ctT ~, <:fllTlfTCfiT~~T ~r CfiT, ~Tcnr that we may be given some time. " ctT ifm+rf ::rgr CfiT-~ I ~T ~<: Q - . CfiT ~ I 'f<1"T

CfiW mCfT ~ f91 ;:rr;:r-~;:r+i'~ I ~ [SirnI N. K. SHEJWALKAR in the- ~ ~T ~o~ ~ if ~ FiJi Chair] fGJ"i1~mTif q'ffi ;:rrrr-1:1;~ ctT ..,'Tfcr I shall begin with a suggestion. It

be presented on annual basis for dis- In fact, Sir, there has been some, cussion for at least a day or two as kind of a fortunate imbalance; I. we have in the case of the Economic want to suggest in all humility that. Survey. Going abroad I find that in the country's foreign policy, how- several foreign countries, such oppor- ever good it may be, cannot remain, tunities are increasingly available' to good unless the country's domestic Members of Parliament to take legi- policy is taken care of. If the domes- timate interest in the foreign affairs, tic policy of the country goes to dogs" and if such an annual survey comes if there is no law and order, if there to our House also, I think it will give is no sense of justic and if there is- Us a chance to discuss foreign po- no fair play, if there is no discipline licy issues, and if -the House 'extends and a commitment to Rule of Law- the facility of discussing the annual by all, then no matter how good our' report on foreign affairs in such a foreign policy may be, it is only go-· manner, it would be helpful to us. I ing to upset the entire balance and. have gone through the 96-page annual it is bound to have its disturbing report of the External Affairs Minis- effect. The Janata Government, in, try for 1977-78 and as far as reports the last one year, has made a good. of any department or any association start in the field of foreign affairs. go, they are good, but they do not In fact, it has taken many welcome- tell us in succinct manner what the initiatives. I am happy to say that. Government's emphasis is going to it has taken positive steps on its own be on various important aspects of in various fields. But, what is more- foreign policy. Therefore it is of important is this. Since 1977 we utmost importance that' an annual seem to have grown in maturity in. survey is presented to the House as the conduct of our foreign policy. it would be very useful to us. After all, if you believe in an open, society, -then let us remember that Foreign policy as a matter of fact other countries also believe in an is largely and broadly the result of open sQcjety. We must be prepared a national consensus. I agree with to take the risks involved in the open Mr~ Vajpayea when he said that. society. After all, foreign policy does But this debate has clearly shown not depend on our own wisdom only. that even within the ruling party and It depends also on factors which are other sections here arid elsewhere out- unforese'en/ factors which are of at side this House, there are bound to contingent nature, factors which are- be differences in emphasis or shifts unstab1e,factorswhich are riot per- 01'1 priorities. Therefore, we may manent, and, moreover, it is also ,not harp too much on national con- something like this that you may- sensus. At the same time I wish to driv~ very carefully and eautiously- say t~at foreign policy of a country, but if you get involved in an acci.. especially, our country has been go- dent because other vehicles may make ing on for -many years on the basis mistakes, then obviously you get i.nto-- of a consensus, and there have been difficulty. So the foreign policy of' basic and fundamental agreements. our country should be viewed from So, on our side, I do not think we _a larger point of view. Now, I will should do anything which will dis- say three things. turb that particular situation .

. Now, Sir, OUr foreign policy is also One is of course about the exter- dependent on our home policy. It is nal publicity. Although Shri Vajpayee: ~nfortunate that our domestic 'policy has been telling us again and again In ~he, l~st o?e year is n~.t as happy ~n terms .of assurances, itls far from as It' should have been. But, fc):rtu_ ~a~isfactory. I want him to go into nately, for tis, the 'foreign policy this matter since "our "image abroad is has Chad marly gains and ,advantages. not commensurate With _ tme image, 375 D-G-, 1978-79 APRIL 18, 1978 D.G., 1978-79 376

[Prof, P. G. Mavalankar] SHRI CHITTA BASU (Barasat): that is actually in the minds of the Sir, I want just to make certain points. peoples of the various countries. Se­ I think the foreign policy of the coun­ condly, we have about 127 Embassies try must depend on certain funda­ and Missions abroad, but many of mental premises and to me, funda­ them are not functioning satisfactorily mental premises must be formulated. and they are not serving the Indians They are who go abroad. That is the complaint in which you will have to go in de­ (1) Projection of the enlightened tail interests of the nation at the given time,

Finally, I find that IFS(A) and (2) The assessment of the chang­ IFS 3«rr?T m nf i ^ friendship is being pursued in ail fatar jftfa % these cases but equi-friendship is not to be the criterion as we have got 4MTCR *>t VtVT^iTT $ Ssfr certain values and aims to be achie­ sRrarc tan “arri^i ff %Ppfr *ft ved. Imperialism is not there for f ^ E F W * taTT =5|TpT | peace, stability, social progress and new social order. I will only say that VTWhRT Vt | I *TTTST Jf *Fft it will be wrong on our part to equate »nrr f *rz wrrt %*nft— non-alignment with equi-friendship. I f*RT TTWf ffT WK if T^STT am afraid and I must say that under the garb of non-alignment the prac­ ■srri^r 1 jpTT 9ftv?fgr If ^ *f tice of equi-friendship is being prac­ q?t 5TFRT *fi£t |— *TC % f^RTT % 5*1% tised I think the Foreign Affairs src % *rr*A lrfv«T ^ v h v s v Munster should take note of it and 1 exercise genuine non-alignment for | fa w t t w-jmr Tf^r srtr strt^ tt the purpose of international peace and i*t ?r ^ r t sW t ^rrf^r 1 ?TTsr *ft bringing about a new social order and that must have a thrust against impe­ i *TTT? «rHr— rialism. The more and more the thrust i*ft TUT ■3^% fm % 1 w % ag-unst imperialism is blunted, the JJf 3TRT WZ f t »r£ | fa ?ftT PTT fSfasft «Ft «TOT «r*NrT ? ^ 1 q ? ^ t ^:yfT«TT— w w rfln ^ mtwnc «Pt§^r ^ t ^ TTwftwqft (foarwnrre): wtr qi€f vrnnr *mft «fhc i t *ff)r ilHTf w?t$ %frz sw w i??ft ftm , s t wt 379 DJG., 1878-79 a r b i l is , m e D.G., 1878-78

[«rt m w firf rft wTOf^yj ywrmr *rtr f « tot % fwtor #jft % m?T «Tf5TT T O ’Tftm , ?ft W flfT ^g-fir vt ro rf ^r*r % n% ff rsprro «TT I W T ^PT^T fft % T O *TTOT «rPw fw ^ i vwft ^t fmft ftwft ip *r *rrfa?T f t anm ’ w r t t *tf ?nr *rf f*nt ffiifw f*r w f t

FfEf^RTT t t *R rd ^ t*r ^ 5t f ^ r r r m - i *Ft f^tTtfhTBTT % ftW[ «H¥- fW t t i v w «rr, t o ^ inftnF ftnfpr % ftr^ v n m v «tt, f t w n f a % ftn? tft f * n t f^rer ^arnft aft *rgr | % rm m vr i ft; f*r *p-ftnftfrm * t| *nw- ftrfasrT ^t t| i *f am w r u f sn?r 535WT wrm ^ ftp »w T t— *p -ftn^sraT ^t fftf^r tt ywrx *r vn wiftOTT ff % i ?wrrftr $ — srrer M vm i mrrf*rftrcft*p ’ Tftor, w*^t ^ ftnrt-ftrss a r m «ftr» tt mfaw f t *pf, ftRft anrt ?rTT?r t t *fift f , ^rftR gfhRRr$r «ftrr H n n ? r- fttfr ft irt ?rt far mcr-fa^ ftrarnrr wwr ftaT t i *rt ^ f t im | » ^gftrrfrgftrr T t ?ftfa «pt «ns?n-^i t t aw ^ ^ftdrnr t>

% fnw hwpbt wftrwr f r fi r o r i * 5 *i vtvr m

a i t t o r * f , *nrr ^ 1 1 \j*f[ ift fw ff ?n% jpr mt&R f*r*ft ^mw wt ftowtw «rf%ar ^ VPRfT t 1 ^mft|i f?r Jr f%^t M r vt «TT»?fa ^ ft?ft 1 w*fnTct aft, arrcr ^ % f&m jfi# m tft | *rr ss?ft | 1 # ^brt ^ r g ftp iptt crftferf?rar SHRI VAYALAR RAVI: Are you arc* ?rt mt ftta r *rt wt Tf*w accepting the suggestion for a corri­ dor?

tm ^rit % ot*t « f f r g^, qft- «ft wawr ftr^nft wwwrft ‘ No corridor, farfinft it sfWflr % irjhtt, my dear friend, Mr. Vayalar Ravi. That is why I said I would like to 'TfW’T unpsv {£, flifftfcM WFTWV say something in English. vfkssiw WTOWfr, f w ?T*Tfrf?T aft, W *T?r ^ spto ^cpiT iFC t «flr ar^r ^qftaret, ftr^grerT *t VWT I f*F fTWt ^R.VTT % »ft MlfihWW ifnrw^i ft, «Bt %?n«r y ^ p stv t’TTRT*r vn^f^tvrfirar * f iff m*Mt % ffw ^ r ft T O ^ s w c iT # , wcf^rej^ 12 m f % «TR5T »FT «mft t 1 m\ qiPh^rrr ?fft w r «ftr t o t M) ^ctNh w *r*R «r ^ 11 WrttX % *T?% 3r 1? Tf?ft WTX * ^ ^ yp Tfc $ fa " v ^ r ” *ffr TTf^wnr w r 1 q? t t i r k 1 1 ''^^TFr” % W qfaRIST JWT | ? WT (s!TTOpt) ^ %f^r ^ firs^r 'TfVsRR |*TT t , «irw fri flfR q-, if 12 ^ft arrer ^ t$t f 1 TT^ ^ t 'cf'JffifW %Wt I %TTW SHRI VAYALAR RAVI: Simla is f ’TTTT T fW t tot t I % 9MTrsr fW^rar v ^ f $t WfTm1 % fin? ?rtff ^ff vt srm t o t *rrf t «rk Art m m fm ?wr t*n 1 « t o t *?t wf srcsr ?nfj?ft f , v^itpt % ipr m t t t z&fot ^tfV’ T %TT^T V t ^ iF^d ^fVEfT f w f t *Fnnnvy;fi f® «n rW t%?rr«r w f f ir "^ n r ?d*nr f ^ t " Vt£t ®t€t 3TT^ f»TT^ «W 8ff it ?R R 1 1 w k ff r ift % w w f t |t?t crt «rt 1$ f t 1 ^ «r ’wt ^ | f**t ^ ^rftwt wr # fnwffr «rrf t «rtr s»rrt wrrrft tn va- ^ ^ f t v ttM ’ % Ai^ tfr «mnf)vr 5 ^ | 1 383 D.GL, 1976-79 APRIL 18, 1878 D.G., 1878-79 384

[*ft f*frrt ^rsrfcft] fsn^r f^rr fft *n£t | j jfSwrr vrrar fifo r »ftf?r * ft *nrar f r * * - Vt *Tf ftWTf tft ^TT ^Tff^ fv f*T Y *nfor, w rf^ r m r w r t o f N ?rf*rt»r f^nc^w t 1 *Ft 3R5TTT ^*TT ^ I f*?f^ TTfffaT ff?ft trrsr fftrm ^ fcr | fapr vt vtnflwiwr %f*nr,*Tf *n^*np ^ftr«nc fafcfr ^ t «ftr aft «p $ *T ^T5T WRT % WTfxT f t fHTffW qtr y ^a f ^r?RT WTf^- *r *ft m fcr arr qrrcrm®r 1 1 vrTf»r^m#^? t| 1 ?rrff5T^«f *rar*POT ir f t fa*rf®r %?T t ^ t f«Rft ^Jf?PF »T5ff9*T *t 1 1 T p p ftfw ?rft 1 1 %Pb^ fynr^ft cftr q x f y # ^ rn^Kt w tf | 1 m ^riffr t % % « w ^ ^ 1 ^ *r rTTPr wf*FT «ft 3ft srf^PTT *TTta *T ST* 1 %ft fq' viptt to t frfvg^vpfaftnr I * ? 5,f*wT % wtff *rm ir i irNtVFT ^ t trJFcTT Vt, T«!IT v t if r v& *rt t ft: f*r gra ftrmr % ftnypeft w srftr srfh^TT «pm % ft% *rtft ir Nt inrfpr W IT | I f t faFKt fav*r % ’ffrf^TT * r m f* r cm ff*rcret*r *ra f f t % snsrrc v^ar, sforrtt 3T®r tnTrT % *Tf fsp^Fr f1% *FflT f t »r? fjR^w ^f#%ftff[?nf?r^t5?^T«r ?m*rt % %f*nr *if jrnT-q*rrcr- «ft w tw rw r ?nrw ir art ^hrr^ft ife *rr *>rTfh % snf»-m *rf arfVi'gT?T irtr ?qnr v t srfrr ^ f& r ** *rt ^ f T 3n ^ r | f % ^ 5ftJTPT- t»snrr- wx ^ 1 ^rft f ^ w r •TTrT f t Jift % 1 $ ^?rr !?rgcTT g fa 1 f*r% * r iw r frTTT ?rr?r ?rft & 1 ?*r sffar- apt ?frf=r apt im r a r 1 1 # f j F d« *T**r * m t %rm ?t Ssr ^=rt t fa ?tb^t •rc «ft»r «ftr *rfrr# It f*nrr Htuww *ptt irk sjot ^5T?r w t f m aiT^t | 1 1 1 % *n*r t z w*r vftnrr^T- t r 3PTRT 3rr ?wm ^ ?fr«p fr^^TT A VfJlT ^Tf^TT ^ fr ^ W 'fT % JfPT 'R *JZt ^ fl& ft VT «ft ^rrtt fe% ^5t «ftfir *>f «w ra w ^tfir «ff t» ** «n?R f^arr vr v m r t 1 » p wwrwv, QvmTFv «frc ^ 385 £>.G, 1978-79 CHA1TRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) D.G., 1978-79 ^ 8$ .

I «ftr * w ^ T te 'ta efcr it fp T d OTT^T^TsrnrfT fa^T^Vfir ^w n r tt fr o r r £ «rf?r jt? t*T ;nr «rr Fiw nrrnr ^ «rrt ^ ff fsrv t t t^t fa*T T t T=3RT TT fftarrr «fV I, ^ ff *5 ^ r iftar «ftr «rryr ^rnr^r fanr Tt ^prr tt fm *r w flfim TT qT WJT^rTTT^^TtfWTTT^ »wpft ?>ft, snfirr ^ ?ft WcT 5>TT I f> n ^wi\ % <*r*T3Fnr^ «tott 3TTrf fT grflft q r t> *rr sr?T * f f s w ^ % c^TffV qrgrnr r^r ?n?r t g t f r ^ f r srii^ii I ar^sr »r| ? 3ft sfnfr ?tttt¥ ?t ^ r t

i p f ^ k i T i ttt I . w nrr TSF3T T ^ r « f, lr^rr t t h t f ^ f l W T t «r?fPTT «*r *rr*r * sn w sT star f PnfrPfr * tr% t ark zw w ^rfgrr fr ^-fjp^awr $*3T?r Tg%gTsfr Tt |q T T ^ T t ^T5R ^ JTW**T * g t | I $ smr ^ fT*r tt?: ^ sfb-

Non-aiif. nment »s not neutrality ?TTT JT^rr I I -35%, 1st wt%, *5R 5SpTT *ftr ^sfnft T ffar *T, J*TPT *ftr ^rr% ?ft%, 3rnr%, gT?r, tnggei war in the Indian Ocean STf^T TTcft I i Non-alignment diluted to suit U SA India s stock ebbing among non- *nTFTfa 3ft, fJT f a ^ S - TT fTT*RT aligned Some powers plotted to ft, *n*T>5rcT b f^rtT srmift I i oust me ” f r s j *t farrtsr T t farr srarrsr t t ^tt?tt SHRI VAYALAR RAVI- Whose quo­ kr%t f «rr?r>5RT t» t *rtr 5rnpt?r tation it is’ ^ ttst wT'Bni’ «nr «t\t WFf^nr «rftjT 17.40 hrs. t , T to fr T*T, ^*rt vftt 3RT

mm irwfcft: xnrvnr controvertible logic of the geographi. cal compulsions of good neighbourly ?spw 1 cooperation and the vision of regional stability. Having visited or met the %tt fa ts* | fa facttfV *T leaders of all our neighbouring coun­ 5^ ?nfV if w r *nft tries, I can assert that the confidence of a new era in relationships with *fV, Srfa^arft to 's t *tw xrd, India is shared by their leaders. These sm'm %ft *fiT fa aft new perspectives are, of course, as much due to their leadership as our *f ^STRT *T fTTT t * * 1? I own. We can all feel more confident that if we can sustain these efforts t SrnTT«T ?r JT?T WT9TT ^ T7STT fa towards mutual understanding, the ^ ^ ^TR'Tr *rr qf?^nr^f, sub-continent will remain free from the play of malevolent politics as it JHTT 5 m fa^PTT | f a fafcnr ftffr % affects many other parts of the world. ^r®tT?TTt%9r^t ^rrff^ i fcrwrz v fwt?., tnri $ fsnj, The House is aware that the year under review has been an unusually 'jM'dl I: fax* Tpg% %, exacting and intense period for our WIT ST5T eft fftm ^T%r fo diplomacy; and concrete improvement has been made in the wide circles of fas*r sptt

D.G., 19'78-79 CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) D.G., 1978-79 J understanding and identified new po- nomic links in Libya, Iraq and tlhe tential of bilateral economic comple- Gulf States. We are hopeful of high- mentarity with our own developmental er technological and scientific and dynamism. Such occasional criticisms trade co-operation with the Federal that the Government's policies were Republic of Germany and France, es tilting in one direction or tilting awav with Western and Northern Europe. in other directions, are often based on Our strong ties Of technical co-opera- an antiquated understanding of the tion with many 'countries, notably world situation. Afghanistan, Mauritius and East Africa, continue to grow in diversity Consistent with non-alignment, our and scope. The thrust of our foreign purpose has been chartered within a policy has moved on a broad front, conceptual .framework of promoting and everywhere our diplomatic effort .and enriching relationships based on has gone hand in hand with an inte- beneficial bilateralism. We have, with grated effort to strengthen our eco- full confidence, carried Indo-Soviet nomic links: friendship and economic cooperation to levels well beyond what existed be- May I, at this point, say a word fore. At the same time, we have on the national problem of interna- restored mutual confidence in our re- tional co-operation in the field of peace- lations with the United States. Prob- ful use of nuclear energy? Our policy lems, no doubt, exist or may arise, on this has been made clear by the but Indo-US relations are no longer Prime Minister. Our entire foreign clouded with unwarranted and acrimo- policy is one which has always recog- nious mistrust. Without pretending nised the need for discipline on all 'to overlook the existence of difficult matters which may be a threat to in- problems and the ups and downs of ternational peace. As such, we strong- our past relations, we have created ly believe hat the world should not the basis for improved bilateral ex- make use of nuclear energy for des- changes in the economic, commercial tructive purposes and should aim not and cultural fields with China. only at non-proliferation but the eli- mination of existing weapons, We have truly broken new grounds • .J in responding with sincerity and ala- crity to co-operate with Vietnam in Our problem arises out of a contrac- the immense task which that brave tual obligation by which the Tarapur country faces in its national recons- reactor was planned on the presump- truction, We feel proud that India tion of a" pledged supply of enriched may be the first country outside • 'he fuel for its functioning. We have ad- socialist bloc with which such links hered to our side of the contract. We are being forged with the Democratic have noted the recent American do- Republic of Vietnam. We are poised mestic legislation on non-prolifera- for improved relations bilaterally and tion, which seems to imply that even regionally in Our sub-continent. We past contracts may be sought to be have prepared the ground for closer re-negotiated with new conditions. rapport and greater economic and col- While willing to adhere to our side of laborative relations with Japan. the obligations and while continuing the dialogue with the US Government, There is a new warmth of under- we certainly hope that such long-stand- standing in our relations with Aus- ing co-operation will not come to an tralia on the one hand and, at the end. But we will have to face the other end, with the United Kingdom. contingency, if this should arise. We have concluded far-reaching ,agree- ments for new fields of economic co- MR. SPEAKER: Just one minute, operation- with Iran. Our public sec- L will ask the House to extend the tor undertakings have, during the time of the' House till the Demands year under review, forged new eco- are voted. Because, under the 391 DG, 1978-79 APRIL 18, 1978 DG, 1978-79 393

[Mr Speaker] mendations on equipment, formulation rules, I have to do it 15 minutes be­ of publicity literature, training, liai­ fore the scheduled time of adjourn­ son with Indian organisations and a ment Is it the pleasure of the House number of other related matters I to extend the time’ would like to assure the House that we are carefully evaluating the re­ SEVERAL HON MEMBERS Yes commendations made by the Com­ SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE, mittee and Government will take ex­ Thank you peditious decisions to streamline and SHRI K GOPAL (Karur) You impiove our publicity effort abroad should thank us It has long been recognised that evokes considerable interest and MR SPEAKER All of us not ex eluding me fascinating among the scholars and intellectuals and indeed the public SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE at large abroad who see in our cul­ May I say that we do not believe in tural heritage the panacea for many the use of the option of nuclear wea­ of the ills which affect present-day pons * We cannot but maintain that civilisation It is recognised that our it is unrealistic that these chances of national ethos whith stems fiom this nucieai war can be averted and sen­ cultural heritage has an abiding ra sitive technology can be exclusively tionale in a world which is beset preserved for peaceful uses unless with increasing materialism end there is a univeisalised discipline neglect 0f the values of yore It 1 against nuclear weapons for thi«* reason that we have long recognised the importance of oui cul Some of the bon Members referred tural diplomacy as a vital aim of to our poor performance m the tield our foreign diplomacy of external publicity I have been all loo aware of the need to re-orient Apart from the bilateral relations and give a more purposive content to we have continued and indeed inten the efforts made by our Miss ons sified our participation m the Unit d abroad and the organisational struc­ Nations and other international 01 ture in India to project the correct ganisations and m the gamut of mul image of contemporary India the tilateral diplomacy It would be pei policies and programmes of the Gov­ tinent to recall the success of the ernments and the hopes and aspira­ meeting of the Non aligned Buie tions and traditions of our people which took place m Delhi soon after The Report of the Ministry of Ex­ we’assumed office We are at p r e s e n t ternal Affair*; alludes to some of the engaged m consultation with friendlv efforts which have been made in the Afghanistan for the preparation of past ear to give meaningful content the Kabul Bureau meeting This "ill b e followed by a meeting of the to our publicity efforts abroad I must say that whereas I am gratified Foreign Ministers and the entire movement which will take place m at some of the progress which has Belgrade where it will be r e c a l l e d been made I fully recognise that the first major meeting of the move­ there is scope for improvement A ment look place in 1961 These m e e t ­ committee headed by Shn Chanchal Sarkar was recently set up to go into ings are coming at a time when the non-aligned movement faces many the various aspects of our publicity efforts The Chanchal Sarkar Com­ challenges They will demand sober judgment and careful adherence to mittee has made far-ranging recom­ mendations on not only strengthening the spirit of the movement and reorganising the institutional It was I believe, well recognised framework of the external publicity that our Prune Minister’s contribu­ organisation but has made recom­ tion played a significant role in the 393 D-C?.. 1978-79 CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) D.G., 1978-79 394

success of the Commonwealth Heads Indian Ocean. All foreign bases in­ of Government meeting in London cluding Diego Garcia must be elimi­ last year and the first ever Regional nated from the Indian Ocean. There Commonwealth Conference in Sydney is no change in our stand. But we are two months ago. In all these and living in a strange world. The pro­ other international meetings, our blem of Indian Ocean is being dis­ approach is one not of trying to seek cussed by two big powers without the leadership—and here 1 would like participation of any of the littoral to draw the attention of my dear countries. But we have been exerting friend, Shri Subramaniam Swamy— our influence in the United Nations but responding with whatever ex­ and outside that the pace of the talks pertise and capability we possess to should be accelerated and there should fulfil the ideals of constructive inter­ be an agreement between all big dependence and beneficial solutions to powers to make Indian Ocean a zone international problems. We have of peace. We do not believe that if consistently sought to play an active the big power rivalry is eliminated, and responsible role to help fashion there will be a vacuum. The littoral a new economic order and joined the and hinterland countries are in a posi­ developing countries in their quest tion to guarantee freedom of naviga­ for development and correcting eco­ tion. The Indian Ocean will be free nomic imbalances through interna­ for all countries provided they do not tional co-operative effort and the indulge in military rivalry and we pro­ promotion of economic collaboration pose to accelerate the efforts in this within our fraternity. direction in the United Nations at the forthcoming session. Notwithstanding the consensus in favour of peaceful solutions, the in­ ternational scene today is beset with While 1 do not pretend to catalogue gTave problems. We still have to all the world’s problems, j can assure see the vacation of aggression and you that on the basis of our well- the fulfilment of the rights of the established policies of independent Palestinian people, so that the seri­ judgment, non-alignment and inter­ ous efforts and hopes to see peace national cooperation, we shall strive and stability established among the vigorously and play a constructive role States of Asia are fulfilled. wherever possible as a responsible member of the international com­ We have been active directly and munity. in international formus, striving to underline the urgency of bringing Now I come to the question, a deli­ about majority rule and democrati­ cate question whether there was some cally granted independence for Zim­ secret understanding between Mrs. babwe and Namibia. We are alarm­ Gandhi and Mr. Bhutto in Simla or ed at the diverse conflicts between not. When I was in the opposition, I fellow non-aligned countries such as had made an open charge. But now in the Horn of Africa where we have when I speak, I speak as the Foreign counselled the end of conflict and Minister of India and I am in posses­ respect for established frontiers. sion of all the records. Though the U.S. and the U.S.S.R. have made a beginning, we have yet SHRI K. P. UNNIKRISHNAN: You to see a genuine break-through to­ must lay it on the Table. wards making the Indian Ocean a *one of peace. Here I would like to SHRi ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE: correct the impression— 1 do not know Not necessarily. All the records can­ *«»n where he got that impression— not be placed on the Table of the « my friend, Shri Unnikrishnan. India House. I would like to take the House » opposed to all foreign bases in the into conifidence. 395 D.G., 1978-78 APRIL 18, 1978 D.G., 1978-79 SHRI K. P. UNNIKRISHNAN: This SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE: is an important issue. I have not yet completed. SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE: Let me add straightaway that, in I do not speak on unimportant issues. drawing attention to this, I am look­ Let us have the discussion in a cool ing at it as an internal matter---- and calm atmosphere. SHRI VASANT SATHE: That does Ever since I took charge of the not make any difference. Ministry of External Affairs, I have been trying to know the circumstances SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJPYEE: in which the talks between Shrimati So far as external policies are con­ Gnndhi and Mr. Bhutto in Simla in cerned, contrary to what has been 1972, which had run into serious diffi­ suggested by certain interested quar­ culties, suddenly culminated in the ters. we have maintained continuity Simla Agreement. and adherence to the broad parametres I myself was present in Simla when of our non-aligned foreign policy. the talks were going on between the Perhaps, it was being hoped that two sides and it was common know­ India’s image will have a setback ledge there that the negotiations had after the Janata Party camc into office. run into rough weather. Therefore, it This may be the reason fom annoyance puzzled one and I am sure it must and disappointment in some quarter. have puzzled many other observers of Indo-Pak relations at that time, how As tar as Pakistan is concerned, what­ all of a sudden an agreement had ever may have been my differences emerged. Several journalists, some of with our Government in power at the whom had interviewed Mr. Bhutto, time of the Simla Agreement, we have have given stories of a sudden change accepted in letter and spirit the obli­ in the course of events after a post­ gations undertaken by India in that dinner meeting between the two accord. We have indeed managed leaders. In fact, the country at large ana improved the climate of relations was surprised that a reference to “final with Pakistan. We have assured settlement of Jammu and Kashmir” Pakistan that we would continue to had been included in the Simla Agree­ follow a policy of strict non-inter­ ment. ference in Pakistan’s internal affairs. In fact, the House knows, even with Since assuming the charge of the regard to the legal processes affecting Ministry of External Affairs, I have Mr. Bhutto, we have observed scrupu­ made an effort to acquaint myself lous detachment. with not only various documents re­ Keeping in view the fact that our lating to the discussions but also have foreign policy which is strictly and held personal discussions with a num­ transparently in tune with our ber of knowledgeable individuals. national interests and has been based Piecing together all the evidence from on a broad national conensus, I would different sources, I cannot but reaffirm urge that any discussion we may have that some sort of secret understand­ on this subject should not weaken ing was reached by Shrimati Gandhi our efforts for peace In this sub­ in her confidential conversation with continent. Mr. Bhutto.... Mr. Speaker, our foreign policy, I 18.00 hrs. believe, has a conceptual coherence and transparent logic from the point SHRI K. P. UNNIKRISHNAN: Is of view of both national interest and he telling us from the minutes? Were international stability. Indeed I would any minutes kept, I would like to hope that India, along with its neigh­ know. He is saying this on the basis bours, can continue to be both an o f— (Interruptions) example of stability and a force which 397 D G -> 1978-79 CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) D.G., 1978-79 398

stands lor a cooperative world order. The charge in substance was that Mrs. 1 would beg of the House not only Gandhi, acting as the Prime Minister to approve the modest demands put of India entered into a secret deal forward on behalf of my Ministry but over Kashmir.... also give its blessings and support so that the standing of India continues SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE: to rise and commands respect amongst Understanding. the comity of nations. SHRI K. P. UNNIKRISHNAN: SHRI VAYALAR RAVI: On a point ‘Deal’ or ‘understanding’, whatever it of order. Rule 370 reads as follows. was—if you want to put it that way. Now you know that we have been “If, in answer to a quetion or trying to raise this issue also through during debate, a Minister discloses various Motions but, since you felt the advice or opinion given to him that the Demand of the Ministry was by any officer of the Government coming up you probably did not al­ or bv any other person or authority, low us. Now he has repeated this, but he shall ordinarily lay the relevant left it very vague—delightfully vague document or parts of document con. —so that anybody can say anything taining that opinion or advice, or a and got away with it. He said he was summary thereof on the Table.” present in Simla—of course not in the capacity of Minister but as a Mem­ Here, the hon. Minister made some ber of Parliament,—and he heard cer­ observations. He has referred to a tain things. And, again, he has said certain document which, he says, is that Mrs. Gandhi had a meeting with in his possession and on the basis of Mr. Bhutto because there was a dead­ that he comes to the conclusion that lock. And now, he says, after he there was a secret agreement between became Minister he has gone through the former the relevant records and also had dis­ and the former Prime Minister of cussions with what he calls ‘know­ Pakistan. Mr. Bhutto. Naturally this ledgeable people1. Now, I would like House is competent enough to demand, to know whether any minutes of these under this rule itself, that we must discussions have been kept and whe­ know what is that document, and we ther he has gone through those mi­ havc every right to demand that it nutes. Or is he basing it on mere as­ should be placed on the Table of the sumptions? Is he basing it on the ad­ House, because rule 370 clearly pres­ vice given to him by the Ministry? Or cribes that it must be laid on the are these just deductions? This is very Table. It is a very serious matter, important for the House and the coun­ and this House must know what hap­ try to know. If Mrs. Gandhi is guilty, pened and what conspired between she shall be punished. If Mr. Vajpayee the two Prime Ministers, whether it is bluffing, he shall be exposed, but was in the interest of the nation or not. the House is entitled to know. SHRI VASANT SATHE: We ere SHRi ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE: really surprised that the Hon. Exter­ Mr. Speaker, Sir, before you give your nal Affairs Minister, having made an ruling, please hear me. innuendo or an indirect hint or sug­ gestion that there was some secret ME. SPEAKER: I will certainly hear you. agreement or understanding on the question of Kashmir, has not, even to day placed before us what was that SHRI K. P. UNNIKRISHNAN: A understanding, what was the nature few days ago, the Minister for Exter­ of that understanding, what was the nal Affairs made a charge outside the purport of that understanding relat­ House which has been contradicted ing to Kashmir. The Simla Agreement by the former Prime Minister. is a recorded document. Therefore, we 399 D G » 1078-7& APRIL 18, 1978 D.G., 1978-79 40 0

[Shri Vasant Sathe] though he asserts and reaffirms that there has been such a secret under­ standing, yet he is not willing to do not iind any such understanding, disclose what that secret understand­ coventy or overtly. Now, if the Hon. ing is. In the interest of the country, External Affairs Minister has come to know, whether from documents or Shri Vajpayee owes it to this Hcusc to disclose what that under­ frcn knowledgeable sources wnom standing is and what evidence he has he has contacted or fiom his petsoi.al to justify that. knowledge, having been present thtre • —I do not know whether he met Mr. MR. SPEAKER: Before I call upon Bhutto himself or Mr. Bhutto cottvey- other Members, I would say that if M something to him the other day you have anything new to mention, when he went there: I do not know kindly add, otherwise leave it. whether Mr. Zia had some document which he showed to him. but the Advi­ Shri Desai. ser to the Pakistan Government on External Affairs. Mr. Aga Shahi who SHRI D. D. DESAI (Kariar)- Mr. was here the other day, denied having Speaker, Sir, under the garb of sec­ any knowledge of any such understan­ recy, the Minister should not dep­ ding and the previous Prime Minister rive . . (Interruptions). also, has categorically denied it. Therefore, the country must not be SHRI RAM JETHMALANI: Sir, left m the lurch or with any sense on a point of order. The House just of suspicion, particularly by a respon- resolved to continue these proceed­ •sible Minister like Mr. Vajpayee. ings only until Shri Vajpayee Therefore, he owes it to the House— finishes... whatever the consequences, it does not matter, but he owes it to the House— MR. SPEAKER- Until the de­ mand is voted. if the consequences are of a personal nature and if the consequences are SHRI RAM JETHMALANI: Until going to fall on the previous Prime Vajpayee finishes, this is what you Minister, let her face the consequen­ said. ces; but I do not understand why he is trying to keep the House—to­ MR. SPEAKER: No, until this day if he does not, having said to demand is voted. much, take the House and the country into connected about the nature SHRI RAM JETHMALANI: We of the understandig. can have it tomorrow, this is a matter of importance— (Interruption#). The two concerned persons are the ex-Prime Minister of India and on MR. SPEAKER: No; Mr. Desai. the other side is Mr. Bhutta and both are fortunately alive. Unless SHRI D. D. DESAI: The principle the Minister corroborates it or con­ is whether the Government or the tradicts it; we cannot allow it—to go Cabinet operates under the supervi­ as one man's word against another sion of Parliament or whether they man's word. This would be very are entitled to have some secret nego­ unfair to the country if this is not tiations and treat the country or a made clear in the garb of the matter part thereof as a private property of being in national interest. How is it individuals. This is the principle. an internal matter any longer? When Therefore, we must decide once for all it is an understanding between two that whether the Parliament should Prime Ministers of two different be taken Into confidence and within countries, it is no longer an internal the parameters laid own by Parlia­ matter. I do not think, Shri Vajpayee ment, the Government would operate can get away by saying that. Al­ and not that they would have some 401 D.O., 1978-79 CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) D.G., 1978-79 402 private negotiations and private set­ which he thinks are not to be disclosed tlement for the country, which would in public interest. (Interruptions). be binding on the country. That is one aspect of the matter. I am not discussing merely the question PROF. P. G. MAVALANKAR: Mr. of any secret agreement between Mrs. Speaker, Sir. I do not want to repeat Gandhi and Mr. Bhutto. This may what has been said, but I must say again happen on some other matters. that my esteemed friend, the hon. Mi­ I am discussing a fundamental ques­ nister has been treading on a very se­ tion. Therefore, if any Minister takes rious and delicate ground. He did say, the view that there are certain things if you recall his words that not only which he will talk publicly, but will did he believe that this kind of a pact not give all details because it should existed when he was not a Minister not be disclosed in public interest, let but he said and 1 am quoting his him say so, let him go on record say­ words, ing that there are certain things which should not be disclosed in public in­ terest. That' is right. Certainly the “I take full responsibility as practice has been that if the Minister Foreign Minister to repeat what I thinks that there are certain things.. said.” Therefore, this is no longer (Interruptions). As a matter of fact a matter which can be taken lightly. we pass so many things an dwe give Here is a Minister of the Cabinet so many powers to the Government and that too, a senior Minister like and if the Government says that it Shri Vajpayee, coming out with a would not be in public interest to statement on the floor of the House disclose certain things, we accept it and not substantiating that state­ in bonafide. That I have said. ment with any convincing details. All 1 would suggest is that you may My second and last point is, if the kindly consider this aspect of the Minister has certain documents and he matter. If the Minister stands on said, “I would like to take the House the point that there are certain do into confidence”-—that is the phrase cuments or understanding or discus­ which he used—if he feels that he has sions, with knowledgeable persons certain things in his possession which that he had and these are of such he would like to share with us all, his nature that it would not be in the hon. colleagues in this House, without public interest to disclose any of detriment to national interest at those things, I can understand that publicity, etc., there is the other possi poature that he may take. bility of converting this House into a ---- (Interruptions). secret session, let the press and the strangers be called of! and let the Minister tell this House in full con SHRI VASANT SATHE: That stage fldence what he has got to say in this has gone. That is also the second course left to him. But il he does not take either of PROF. P. G. MAVALANKAR: My the two courses, then we are left in contention is that a Minister in any the lurch and darkness and in a situa­ Government has a right to even come tion which we cannot accept as Mem­ to the conclusions without telling this bers of Parliament. House as to how he came to the con­ clusions If he thinks that the process SEVERAL MEMBERS, rose— of coming to the conclusion is some­ thing which is a matter o f secrecy and MR. SPEAKER: I am calling different which is not to be disclosed in public party members. interest. Then, my submission is, let him say so that there are certain docu­ This is not going to be another ments and papers in his possession, debate. Mr. Chandrappan. 403 D.G, 1978-79 APRIL 18, 1978 DG, 1978-79 404

SHRI SAUGATA ROY* I am on a and attention, I do not think he dis» point of order closed the opinion o>f any officer or authority on the subject at all He MR SPEAKER I have called Mr said he had access to all papers in the Chandrappan Ministry but he did not name any officer, by name or designation This SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH rule, therefore, says rose— SHRI VASANT SATHE Any other MR SPEAKER Are you on a point person of order’ SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH No SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH he has not disclosed any name I Yes Sir I am afraid, the rules regard­ listened to him with all my heart and ing la>mg of the documents on the with ail my mind This rule sa>s Table of the House have not been fully and in their totality, brought to your If m answer to a question or notice \iz Rules 368 369 and 370 during debate a Minister discloses the advice or opinion ” Now Rule 568 says He has neither d sclosed the advire nor “That if a Minister quotes m the the opinion given to him by any officf House a despatch or other State or any other person paper SHRI VASANT SATHE Knowledg- The Minister has not done so at all able person

‘ which has not been presented SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH No to the House, he shall lay the rele­ he has not disclosed vant paper on the Table’ ( Interruptions) The Minister has not done anything SHRI K P UNNIKRISHNAN of that sort He has not quoted any Knowledgable persons Hundred times despatch nor any other State paper he has said The provisos do not apply because he has not quoted any despatch nor any SHRI VASANT SATHE He is not other State paper The provisos, of on the Point of Order He ib defend­ public interest does not arise at all ing the Minister So, they are misleading the House, the other side is completely, totally and SHRI HARI VISHNU KLAMA1H deliberately misleading the House The Rule says— he shall ordinal ily (Interruption*). SHRI VASANT SATHE Give the MR SPEAKER Let there be orderly reasons now debate SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH MR SPEAKER Rule 377 orderlv Now please see Rule 370 also debate

It reads' SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH Neither of the Rules 168, 370 has been “If m answer to a question or broken He has not quoted any des during a debate, a Minister discloses patch, nor he has given the opini°n the advice or opinion given to him by any officer or any other person, or by any officer of the Government or authority, nor he has quoted any advice by any other person or authority " in the House So he 1* not bound A* far as I am aware, 1 listened to h's under rules to lay any document or speech wry closely with all respect any paper. 405 D.G., 1978-79 CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) D.G., 1978-79 406

MR. SPEAKER: I have understood to keep that a secret. My suggestion, the point. therefore, is that the Speaker as the custodian of the House should be taken SHRI C. K. CHANDRAPPAN (Can- into confidence and the Speaker should nanore): My point is there are no two constitute a Committee as was the opinions in the House that the charge tradition of the House and the docu­ made by the hon. Minister is so seri­ ment should be gone through because ous. The Minister himself said that you owe an answer to the country. No he took the entire responsibility for doubt, there is no escape. levelling that charge. The only ques­ tion is that the Minister said that in Some time back another thing was the public interest he cannot place also said. I think Mr. Vajpayee may those documents on the table. But be you and your friends said that afterwards whatever explanation he there is a secret provision in the Indo- had given was not convincing to the Soviet friendship treaty. IIousc though he tried to take the House into confidence. SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE: 1 did not say that. There are certain practices in this House. Perhaps, Mr. Vajpayee, when SHRI C. K. CHANDRAPPAN: he was sitting on this side as one of Somebody at that time had said in­ the leaders of the Opposition, would cluding people from the party. But remember that this House discussed then after coming into power the the Pondicherry Scandal case and at Prime Minister came and said there is that time the argument advanced no secret provision. Here again comes from the treasury benches was that another secret deal. The House has a the files were confidential and in the right to know and the country too. My public fnterest it could not be re­ concrete suggestion is that the Speaker vealed. Then the House found out the should take the consensus of the solution because the whole country House and you may constitute a Com­ wanted an answer and the House also mittee and the records should be placed wanted an answer and then the House before you and the Committee to see took the Speaker into confidence and that. a Committee of the House was con­ stituted. The whole files were placed That is the tradition and so I am at the disposal of the Speaker and the pointing it out. Speaker constituted the Committee re­ presenting various members from DR. SUBRAMANIAM SWAMY: One various parties. I think including point was missed,—a short point.. Shri Morarji Desai. I do not know whether Shri Vajpayee himself was a MR. SPEAKER: Mr. Somnath member seeing those files. If he was Chatterjee. I have called Mr. Somnath not, then somebody from Jan Sangh Chatterjee. was there. My Point is---- SHRI SOMNATH CHATTERJEE SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE: (Jadavpur): Mr. Speaker, Sir, refer­ This is not a scandal. ence has been made to Rule 388 by my friend here. SHRI C. K. CHANDRAPPAN: This is the biggest scandaL If the Prime SHRI HARI VISHNU KAMATH: I Minister of that time had entered into cited it. an agreement over the head of the Parliament, over the head of the coun­ SHRI SOMNATH CHATTERJEE: It try, it is a crime. Shri Vajpayee by has been pointed -out that on the basis making it public, he wanted the coun­ of that rule it is incumbent on the try to know that such a crime had Minister to lay the paper on the been committed. There is no reason Table. 407 D G , 1978-79 APRIL 18, 1978 DG, 1978-79 408

MR SPEAKER Rule 370 MR SPEAKER I have not called you Mr Kachwai Mr Shankaranand, SHRI SOMNATH CHATTERJEE you may say, if you have to add any­ Rule 368 is obviously not applicable thing because there has been no quotation from any document So far as Rule SHRI B SHANKARANAND (Chik- 370 is concerned, what is stated here kodi) I am not repeating anything is this — Sir, an attempt is being made by a If in answer to a question or few members to defend the Foreign during debate a Minister discloses Minister under the technicalities of the advice or opinion given to him some rules I do not think he can be by any officer of the Government or defended m this way By making b\ any other person or authority he reference to a secret understanding he shall ordinarily lay the relevant has really damaged the prospects of document or parts of document con­ smoothemng the reliticms with our taining that opinion or advice or a neighbouring countries summary thereof on the Table THE MINISTER OF EXTERNAL As such I am not holding any brief AFFAIRS (SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJ for him But it is obvious that he PAYEE) I have not was not refernng to any advice or opinion given by somebody which is SHRI B SHANKARANAND Now contained in a document He has not the main point for us to consider is, referred to it Therefore there is no whether the Foreign Minister is re­ question of applicability of Rule 370 cognising respecting and following the in a matter like this There is no Simla Agreement He is not applicability of Rule 170 Therefore he cannot be compelled to do it Further MR SPEAKER Mr Shankaranand Sir m a matter like this we have to we are not on that issue We are on rely on the judgment of the Foreign another point Let us have a limited Minister that m the public in­ debate (interruptions) We are not terest it is not to be dis­ on that point eW are on the scope of closed Sir we are not surprised that Rule 370 there was such a secret understanding because the person who was a party to it was quite capable of doing it SIIRI B SHANKARANAND Hav­ She played with the lives of millions ing referred to the secret agreement of people of this country The people or understanding of this country had been denied their freedom They lost their civil liberties MR SPEAKER The debate is not They lost everything Therefore she whether it is right or not What shall is quite capable of it (Interruptions) I do7 What is my power under Rule 370’ SHRI SAUGATA HOY I nse on a point of order SHRI B SHANKARANAND I am coming to that, Sir He has referred w * WWW to certain knowledgeable persons The House is entitled to know the names STPT trip 9 * $ *»> of those persons as to who they are I (Interruptions) If he refers to certain documents, we are entitled to look into MR. SPEAKER I am going to give those documents He cannot get away you adequate hearing by saying that there was secret under­ standing because he wanted to justify himself or defend himself by saying all this outside What has the Foreign Affairs Minister got to say? 409 DG ; 1978-79 CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) D.G., 1978-79 410

SHRI SAUGATA ROY: Let me be SHRI RAM JETHAMALANI: For heard. example, the Minister said that there were lofs of difficulties. The difficul MR- SPEAKER: I shall hear you ties appeared to be insoluble. Then also. there was a dinner. Then, after the dinner, there was a meeting. After SHRI B. SHANKARANAND: Sir, he that meeting, the difficulties dis­ has referred lo the persons saying that appeared.' they are knowledgeable persons. Who are those persons—whether they are Now it is possible for somebody from in his ministry or outside. How did the circumstantial evidence to form he come to know? All the relevant an opinion that there was some secret materials we should have. agreement; he is giving an opinion on it but he is not relying upon the opinion of others. Therefore, some MR. SPEAKER: Mr. Ram Jetha- malani. other witnesses, some other gentlemen have come and given some materials and on the basis of those materials, SHRI RAM JETHAMALANI: Mr. he has formed his own opinion which Speaker, Sir, the question of legal he has given to the House. obligation of the minister to comply with Rule 370 must be distinguished May I say one word? I want to from the question of propriety of tak­ appeal to my learned friends not to ing this House into confidence. embarrass the Minister by insisting on disclosure of a thing so delicate. Purely on tlie construction of rule 370, it appears that on the face of it, MR. SPEAKER; That aspect is for that Rule 370 comes into play only the Minister to say. Dr. Subramaniam when the Minister has voluntarily dis­ Swamy. closed to the House the advice or DR. SUBRAMANIAM SWAMY: I opinion given to him either by an support the points made by Shri officer or by somebody else. Kamath and Shri Jethamalani. Listen­ ing to the Minister it was quite clear What the Minister has actually done that he was summarising in his own is to give his own opinion, conclusion, words and he had put that in his own judgement, formed. (Interruptions) words. The hon. Member will not understand the law unless he hears something I now come to the second provision from me. He has purported to give his namely: own opinion which is based upon cir­ cumstantial evidence which he has “provided further that where a ascertained from others but not upon Minister gives in his own words a the opinion of others. You know as a summary or gist of such despatch judge, that when you record an evi­ or Stat » paper it shall not be neces­ dence of an expert, then you are act­ sary to lay the relevant papers on ing on opinion evidence. Based on 'he the Tal le.” circumstantial evidence, he draws upon his own conclusion from that cir­ Sir, even assuming that he had used cumstantial evidence. He Is not rely­ the words ‘state paper’, where it is ing upon the opinion of somebody done by his own words or where he else. Let us not take what the Minis­ is using a gist, it is not necessary for ter said. I am not going into it. him to lay it on the table. Therefore, they have no case on either ground. (Interruptions). SHRI SAUGATA ROY: Mr. Speaker, SHRI C. K. CHANDRAPPAN: Is it Sir, while rising on a point of order a criminal evidence? under Rules 368 and 370 I shall point 411 D G, 1978-7® APRIL 18, 1978 DG, 1978-79 41a [Shri Saugata Roy] session all these documents but it is inconsistent with public interest and, out two precedents from Sixth Lok therefore, I take protection under Rule Sabha One was about the Farrakka 368 Or the Minister can say what agreement which was signed There I have said is from my personal in­ was lot of turmoil in Lengal You ference I take protection under allowed a debate I made a charge Clause 3, viz, that the Prime Minister of India Shri Morarji Desai made a secret deal with Provided further that where a General Zia Rehman The Foreign Minister gives in his own words a Minister denied it Since the Foreign summary or gist of such despatch Minister denied it we did not press or State paper it shall not be neces­ the charge because it was on a delicate sary to lay the relevant papers on matter of foreign relations the Table’

There was another precedent in He can say from the gist of summary which the Home Minister Shri Charan of State papers I have come to this Singh had made the charge that the conclusion and I do not want to lay former Prime Minister had thought of it on the Table of the House Let him shooting oil of people in the jails We state that clearly What I want to asked him to substantiate the point He stress is that you instruct the Minis­ could not We brought a censure ters to be very responsible m thei’* motion against him He could not utterances on the Floor of the House prove the point at the time of the cen­ in future If they are not they can sure motion take protection under Rule 368

Now Sir this case is still a more SHRI NIRMAL CHANDRA JAIN serious case The Minister has made Sir there are two most important the statement in the House If he points in this matter In Rule 370 makes it on some platform outside in first it is said discloses the advice or a public meeting to whomsoever he had opinion given Kindly see the latter spoken could go to the court and sue portion where it is said ordinarily him lor libel But here in the House lay the relevant document or parts of when the Minister speaks he speaks document containing that opinion or with all responsibility The Minister advice or summary thereof on the could have entirely avoided making a Table The first thing is that opinion reference to it Here he says that now or advice must have been token from I am the Foreign M mster of the coun somewhere This forms part of a try and I have m my possession full document If there is some evidence documents and I have talked to somewhere then it would stand m knowledgable people who have told contravention of advice or opinion far me about it which there is relevant document SHRI H L PATWARY What is the Secondly you will kindly see that there new point9 What is the new point is one important word ordinarily’ that you want to make9 Here the responsibility has been given to the Minister to use his own dis­ SHRI SAUGATA ROY Now Sir, cretion Here it says like this there are two alternatives open to the Minister As Dr Subramaniam Swamy ‘ 370 If m answer to a question or has correctly pointed out if the Minis­ during debate a Minister discloses ter cannot prove the point then the the advice or opinion given to him Opposition will have to bring a cen­ by any officer of the Government or sure motion against him If the by any other person or authority, Minister wants to take protection he shall ordinarily lay the relevant under Rule 368 then the Minister has document or parts of document con­ to make a statement on the Floor of taining that opinion or advice, or a the House that I have got m my pos­ summary thereof on the Table’ 4X3 D.G., 1076-78 CHAITRA 28, 1900 (SA KA ) D.G., 1978-79 4x 4

So, he can take shelter under this and under 358 and so on. No further point •ay "ordinarily I would not lay it” of order. and he has got certain reasons for that. The discretion would be his and not SHRI VASANT SATHE: But you of the House. will refer it Sir. MR. SPEAKER: I will refer it. SHRI D. N. TIWARY: Mr. Speaker, Sir, the Minister has made certain statement which has been doubted by SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE: the Opposition Members. They think Sir, 1 did not quote a despatch or any that he has not made the correct state­ other State paper. So, the question of ment. Whether it is a bluff or a stunt laying the relevant paper on the Table whether it is true or not, Mr. Mava- does not arise. Nor did 1 disclose the lankar has suggested formation of a advice or the opinion given to me by Committee under you...... any officer of the Government or lor ' (Interruptions). any other person or authority...... (Interruptions) If I am not allowed to SEVERAL HON. MEMBERS: No, complete how can I make my point? No. Please hear me. SHRI SAUGATA ROY: What about SHRI D. N. TIWARY: My submis­ sion is when the Minister says that the Simla Agreement? it is not in the public interest...... SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE: (Interruptions). Whalever I have said on the subject MR SPEAKER: He has not said is the conclusion which has been de­ that. 1 will hear the Minister. rived from circumstantial evidence after talking to so many people, after SHRI D. N. TIWARY: My sugges­ examining so many documents. As the tion is that he should show the pa­ question relates to national interest, pers or the statements to you...... let it not be compared with the Pondi­ (Interruptions) cherry scandal. (Interruptions) ** SOME HON. MEMBERS: No, No. MR. SPEAKER: Ruling is reserved. (Interruptions) I shall examine the matter carefully SHRI D. N. TIWARY: And you may, and I will give the ruling---- (Interrup­ after you are satisfied tell the House tions) and the matter will rest there. AN HON. MEMBER: The Minister MR. SPEAKER; Now, the External cannot make a statement. Affairs Minister. MR. SPEAKER: I have heard all of SHRI VASANT SATHE: Sir, on a you. I am not hearing any more on point of order under Rule 353. this. I am going to examine the matter carefully and I will give the MR. SPEAKER; I have heard your decision. point of order. (Interruptions) ** 8HRI VASANT SATHE: That you MR. SPEAKER: Don’t record...... have heard under Rule 370. This is (Interruptions) If necessary I shall under Rule 353. hear the tape also. No further debate on this. MR. SPEAKER: A Member cannot SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE: raise point of order on the same sub­ ject, one time under 374, another time Will you allow me? ••Not recorded. 415 D G , 1978-79 APRIL 18, 1978 DG, 19 78-79 416

MR SPEAKER I am hearing you MR SPEAKER I shall now put the completely Do you want to say any­ cut motions to the vote of the House thing more’ I said that after hearing the Foreign Minister I will give the The question is ruling That the Demand under the Head ‘Ministry of External Affairs be re­ SHRI ATAL BIHARI VAJPAYEE duced to Re I 1” The House is not discussing the Pon­ dicherry scandal nor the opinion of any [Increasing number of restric­ particular Minister This is a delicate tions being imposed upon persons question where Pakistan is involved going abroad especially to Middle We are having (Interruptions) You Eist countries for employment must allow me to conclude Here are and the consequent hardships fac­ the statements made by the former ed by them (1)] Prime Minister and I will hit back (Interruptions) It will not be in public The motion was negatived interest to disclose the details about the secret understanding between Mrs MR SPFAKER Mr Jethmalam are Gandhi and Mr Bhutto (Interrup you withdrawing your cut motions’ tions) SHRI RAM JETHMALANI Yes "SHRI V\SANT SATHE This will Sir not do This is net t question of Mrs Gandhi MR SPEAKER Has the hon Mem­ (Interruptions)•• ber the leave of the House to with­ draw his cut motions Nos 2 to 5 MR SPL AKER Don t record I am going to examine the matter (In­ SEVERAL HON MEMBFRS Yes terruptions) I am net concerned with other matters I am only considering Cut motions Not 2 to 5 v}fre by leai p the legal aspect I am going to gi\e withdrav n my derision after carefully considering MR SPEAKER Now I will put the it Now there are some cut motions cut motion No 7 moved by Shri Banat- Before I put the cut motions to the walli vote of the House I should like to know whether Mr B'matwalla and Cut motion No 7 was put and Mr Ram Jethamalmi are withdrawing negatived their cut motions MR SPEAKER The question is SHRI G M BANATWALIA (Pon- nini) Ctilunly not In the face of ‘ That the respective sums not ex­ such art itnry attitude of the Foreign ceeding the amounts on Revenue Ac­ Minister I am not withdrawing In­ count and Capital Account shown in stead of hitting the person outside he the foui th column of the Order paper is f busing the floor cf this House to be granted to the President out hit back it is polihca’lv motivated of the Consolidated Fund of India Therefore in the face of such attitude to complete the sums necessary to defray the chargeb that will come I will in protest certainly not withdraw any of my cut motions It is political­ in course of payment during the year ending the 31st day of March, 1979 ly motivated Speak outside (Inter­ ruptions) in respect of the heads of demand* entered m the second column thereof SHRI ATAI BIHARI VAJPAYEE against Demand No 31 relating to I know what to speak and where to the Ministry of External Affairs” speak I am not to learn from you The motion was adopted ••Not recorded 417 B.A.C. Report CHATTRA 28, 1900 (SAKA) B.A.C. Report 418

D tm a n d fo r G rm t 1978*79 w rtsptct o f t/u Ministry e f External Affairs voted by Lok Sabk*.

No. of Name of Demand Amount of Demand for Grant Amount of Demand for Grant Demand on account voted by the House voted by the Houae on 16-3*1978

1 a 3 4

Revenue Capital Revenue Capital

Ra. Rs. Rs. Rs.

MINISTRY OF EXTERNAL AFFAIRS 31 Ministry of External Affairs 18,92,88,000 3,46.38,000 94,64,40,000 19,31,89,000

18 .54$ hrs.

BUSINESS ADVISORY COMMITTEE to present the Fifteenth Report of the Business Advisory Committee. Fifteenth R eport 1&55 hrs. THE MINITER OF PARLIAMEN­ TARY AFFAIRS AND LABOUR The Lok Sabha then adjourned till (SHRI RAVINDRA VARMA): I beg Eleven of the Clock on Wednesday April 19 , im/Chaitra 29 , 1900 (Saka).

GMGIPND—S 1-512 LS-15-6-78— 880.