Regional Oral History Office University of California the Bancroft Library Berkeley, California

Regional Oral History Office University of California The Bancroft Library Berkeley, California Margaret Liu Collins: An Oral History including supplemental interviews with Ted Collins and Blair Maus Interviews conducted by Richard Cándida Smith and Robin Li in 2011 Copyright © 2012 by The Regents of the University of California Since 1954 the Regional Oral History Office has been interviewing leading participants in or well-placed witnesses to major events in the development of Northern California, the West, and the nation. Oral History is a method of collecting historical information through tape-recorded interviews between a narrator with firsthand knowledge of historically significant events and a well-informed interviewer, with the goal of preserving substantive additions to the historical record. The tape recording is transcribed, lightly edited for continuity and clarity, and reviewed by the interviewee. The corrected manuscript is bound with photographs and illustrative materials and placed in The Bancroft Library at the University of California, Berkeley, and in other research collections for scholarly use. Because it is primary material, oral history is not intended to present the final, verified, or complete narrative of events. It is a spoken account, offered by the interviewee in response to questioning, and as such it is reflective, partisan, deeply involved, and irreplaceable. ********************************* All uses of this manuscript are covered by a legal agreement between The Regents of the University of California and Margaret Liu Collins, dated February 16, 2011; Ted Collins, dated September 21, 2012; and Blair Maus, dated October 24, 2012. The manuscript is thereby made available for research purposes. All literary rights in the manuscript, including the right to publish, are reserved to The Bancroft Library of the University of California, Berkeley. Excerpts up to 1000 words from this interview may be quoted for publication without seeking permission as long as the use is non-commercial and properly cited. Requests for permission to quote for publication should be addressed to The Bancroft Library, Head of Public Services, Mail Code 6000, University of California, Berkeley, 94720-6000, and should follow instructions available online at http://bancroft.berkeley.edu/ROHO/collections/cite.html It is recommended that this oral history be cited as follows: Margaret Liu Collins, “An Oral History” conducted by Robin Li and Richard Candida Smith in 2011, Regional Oral History Office, The Bancroft Library, University of California, Berkeley, 2012. Margaret Liu Collins v Table of Contents—Margaret Liu Collins Interview 1: February 16, 2011 [Audiofile 1] 1 Birth in 1941 in Chongqing, China, origin of name—pharmacist mother and banker father meet and marry—family roots in Shanghai, displacement during Japanese invasion—father’s NYU scholarship, travel to US by cargo ship, time en route in Delhi—mother’s background, parents’ death at age 14, raised by oldest brother—giving birth to Margaret during Japanese bombing—father’s family background and Shanghai roots—early childhood in Chongqing during wartime— learning dialects—journey to New York in 1945, V-Day celebrations—post-war return to China for father’s new job with China Steel—more on happy time in New York, mother’s love of fashion—return to Shanghai, schooling, move to Hong Kong in 1948—father’s entrepreneurial efforts—enrolling at Kowloon Tong Elementary School, later Saint Stephen’s Girls’ College—real estate success and navigating traditional gender expectations—admiration for Marie Curie— becoming a Christian at age 13. [Audiofile 2] 15 Conversion to Christianity at age 13—attending an evangelical revival with neighbor Mrs. Kung—regular church attendance, involvement in youth groups— comfort from Christian faith—stern but loving parents, changes in parenting philosophy—early church learning—attending Hip Yun Christian School, then Saint Stephen’s Girls’ College—summer lessons in art, swimming, music— family’s reception of Christianity, mother’s and brother’s eventual conversion— traveling to San Francisco for college, transferring to UC Berkeley after one year at City College—studying architecture then chemistry—making friends, missing family, involvement in local church—family pressure to marry early, choosing a bad match—married life, immediate birth of Magdalene in 1964, taking education classes—early sense that the marriage was not sound—son Samuel’s birth and family’s six months in California in 1968—move to Long Island for husband’s work at Brookhaven National Lab—hard early years in New York, teaching credential from Stony Brook and teaching high school science—love of teaching, sharing childcare, welcoming community of European immigrants in Shoreham— travel to New York to attend church—move to New Jersey in 1972, then 1974 move back to California—giving up teaching for real estate in order to support family as divorce became inevitable—parents’ and church’s opposition, personal struggle with necessity of divorce—struggling to hire a lawyer—eventual departure from church. Interview 2: May 9, 2011 [Audiofile 3] 37 Mother’s and father’s relative family backgrounds—maternal uncle’s trading and import business—mother’s siblings and their families—father’s family’s struggles after grandfather’s early death—family relationship with the Guomingdang, escape to Hong Kong in 1948, hardships of family members that remained in China—parental love and discipline in traditional Chinese childrearing—sense of security despite childhood hardships, moves, and poverty—mother’s traditional role in marriage despite pharmacist career training—father’s criticism and affection—family’s Confucian traditions: Chinese New Year, ancestor worship— father’s traditional attitudes about gender, pride in daughter’s accomplishments— limited financial support from family: “did not enable me to be disabled”— working while a student at Cal—father’s work as a Chinese government bank employee, import/export, textiles, then housing developments—father’s capitalist leanings—father’s immigration to Canada in 1993, death from prostate cancer in 1995—obedience to father and pressure to marry young—parents’ reaction to Christian conversion at age 13—refusal to kowtow to ancestors at Chinese New Year creates friction—attending a Chinese Southern Baptist church— understanding of original sin as a 13-year-old—birth of brother at age eight or nine, ingrained sense of being a second-class citizen as a girl—learning to work by building consensus—similarities between traditional Chinese and American gender roles—short stint in a Confucian school—more on elementary schooling—father’s inability to find banking work in Taiwan due to his age (40)—father’s opposition to communism—staying in touch with Saint Stephen’s classmates. [Audiofile 4] 55 Arranging to attend college in Utah, then mid-voyage change of plans to stay in California—year at San Francisco City College and applying to UC Berkeley— studying architecture then chemistry at UCB 1959-1963—making friends with Christians from Taipei University, struggles adjusting to American academics— comfort and inspiration from religious inner life—beginnings in real estate, first Houston then Dallas—evaluating Atlanta, Raleigh-Durham, deciding on Dallas for Hong Kong land investor clients—first success with Hong Kong clients and developing a good reputation—difficulties and loneliness adjusting to life in the US, joining a Chinese Christian group—living first with a Chinese family then moving into the dorms: Durant Hall and Davidson Hall—racial attitudes— difficulties adjusting to US educational system: “I was lost”—dorm life and cultural differences regarding rules and morals—sense of gratitude and obligation to family for sending her to the US: “It would have been totally unconscionable for you to be partying.”—limited awareness of the Free Speech Movement— shock over changing sexual mores at Cal, not dating, surprise marriage proposals from church peers during senior year—pressure to marry to prevents father’s loss of face in Hong Kong—meeting future husband David, brother of roommate and physics PhD student—traditional views on marriage, deferring to husband and his career—ultra-conservative church group: “I remained more Chinese than when I was in Hong Kong.”—husband’s illegitimate birth and resentment, father’s disapproval—early married life in Albany, taking education classes, husband’s cyclotron work—birth of first child, Magdalene. Interview 3: July 7, 2011 [Audiofile 5] 75 Studying architecture for one year then changing to chemistry—facing discrimination—shock of moving to Long Island and away from church community—isolation and struggles in Shirley, Long Island, taking teacher certification classes—teaching sciences to underachieving junior high students— move to New Jersey then back to California in 1975—realization that marriage was ending, urgency in finding well-paid work, decision to go into real estate— comfort in religion during difficult divorce and career transition—learning real estate, “farming”—excitement over first residential negotiation and success— transition to more reliable commercial real estate—fortunate timing regarding California’s real estate boom—visiting Atlanta, Raleigh-Durham, and Houston to research investment properties—parents’ concern over “playboy” Hong Kong clients—meeting future husband Ted Collins, lawyer hired to write real estate contract in September 1978—gaining a good reputation in Hong Kong and

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