Queensland

Parliamentary Debates [Hansard]

Legislative Assembly

TUESDAY, 14 OCTOBER 1958

Electronic reproduction of original hardcopy

586 Assent to Bills. [ASSEMBLY.] Questions.

AUDITOR-GENERAL'S REPORT.

PUBLIC ACCOUNTS. Mr. SPEAKER announced the receipt from the Auditor-General of his report on the public accounts for the year 1957-1958. Ordered to be printed.

QUESTIONS.

KIANGA OPEN-CUT COAL MINE. lUr. HOOPER (Buranda) asked the Minister for Development, Mines, and Main Roads- " Will he confirm that the projected development of Kianga Open Cut by Thiess Brothers will be for export trade only and that no local trade will be granted by the transfer of quota from an existing mine or mines or otherwise~" Hon. E. EV ANS (Mirani) replied- " The grant of Coal Mining Lease No. 105, Mount Morgan, on which the Kianga Open Cut is situated as well as the Coal Prospecting permission and the authority of the Queensland Coal Board to comrp.ence operations were all given subject to the condition that no coal from the area should be sold or offered for sale for use within Queensland without the prior written approval of the Coal Board. Existing Queensland Collieries are meeting all local present requirements and policy is not to permit a new mine to be opened for the purpose of sale of coal to Queensland con­ sumers except where the new mine replaces another mine in the same ownership and in the same district and supplying coal to the same consumer or consumers. Policy also has precluded transfer of allocation of out­ put for local trade from one ownership to another and from underground mines to open cuts where the original owners and mines are meeting or are capable of meet­ ing local demands with coal of required TUESDAY, 14 OCTOBER, 1958. specifications and qualities.''

Mr. SPEAKER (Hon. A. R. _Fletcher, EXPENDITURE ON SCHOOL BUILDINGS AND Cunningham) took the chair at 11 a.m. GROUNDS. Mr. HOUSTON (Bulimba) asked the ASSENT TO BILLS. Minister for Education- Assent to the following Bills reported by '' What amount of money was expended Mr. Speaker- in the year ended June 30, 1958, showing separately the cost of buildings and ground Brisbane Gas Company Limited Acts improvements, on (a) Primary education Amendment Bill. both Oral and Correspondence; (b) Second­ South Brisbane Gas and Light Company ary Education both Oral and Corresp·ond­ (Limited) Act Amendment Bill. ence; (c) Technical (Apprenticeship) Oral Colonial Gas Association Limited Act and Correspondence; (d) Technical other Amendment Bill. than Apprenticeship, Oral and Corres­ pondence; (e) Adult Education; and Wynnum and Manly Gas and Lighting (f) Other Educational Branches~" Company, Limited, Act Amendment Bill. Mines Regulations Acts Amendment Bill Hon. J. C. A. PIZZEY (Isis) replied­ (No. 2). '' The expenditure on Education for the year 1957-58 is as follows :-Primary Edu­ Petroleum Acts Amendment Bill. cation-£7,226,993, which is approximately Questions. [14 OcTOBER.] Death of Hon. H. A. Bruce. 587

£500,000 more than the previous year and facts of an alleged or suspected offence or approximately £1,000,000 less than the the facts associated with a road incident appropriation for the present year. Second­ such as a collision. Such records are con­ ary Education-£1,314,274, which is fidential documents accessible only to mem­ approximately £150,000 more than the pre­ bers of the Police Force. The information vious year and £250,000 less than the is available to Police Prosecuting Officers appropriation for the present year. Techni­ when traffic offences are being dealt with cal Education-£1,061,016, which is approxi­ in a Court, and will be available for mately £69,000 more than the previous reference by Police Officers who have the year and £146,000 less than the appropria­ responsibility of determining the :fitness of tion for the current year. Adult Educa­ persons to hold licenses under the Traffic tion-£50,900. Other Educational Branches, Acts.'' including University Endowment, T€achers' College, Queensland Agricultural High PAPERS. School and College-£2,674,722. Total expenditure from consolidated revenue­ The following papers were laid on the table, £12,327,905, which is approximately and ordered to be printed:- £1,000,000 more than the previous year and Report of the Public Service Superannua­ £1,500,000 less than the appropnatior, for the current year. Expenditure on buildings tion Board for the year 1957-1958. from revenue and Loan funds-£2,442,762, Report of the Queensland Government which is approximately just over £500,000 Tourist Bureau for the year 1957-1958. less than the appropriation for the present Report of the Commissioner of Land Tax year." for the year 1957-1958.

DOSSIERS ON HOLDERS OF DRIVERS' LICENCES. The following papers were laid on the table:- 1\'Ir. DUGGAN (North Toowoomba­ Leader of the Opposition) asked the Minister Report of the State Stores Board for the for Labour and IRdustry- year 1957-1958. ' 'In view of a Press statement attributed Financial Statements in connection with the to the District Superintendent of Traffic, Parliamentary Contributory Superannua­ Inspector C. E. Risch, that the aim of tion Fund for the year ended June 30, police headquarters is to have a dossier on 19EL. every holder of a driving licence, will he Order in Council under the Bureau of inform the House of the nature of such Industry Acts, 1932 to 1943. dossiers, giving precise details of the items of information to be sought, by what Proclamation under the Public Works Land procedure the information is to be obtained, Resumption Acts, 1906 to 1955 and the to whom such dossiers will be accessible, State Development and Public Works and to what purposes they will be Organisation Acts, 1938 to 1954. applied~'' Orders in Council under the Southern Elec­ tric Authority of Queensland Acts, 1952 Hon. J. C. A. PIZZEY (Isis-Minister to 1954. for Education), for Hon. K. J. lU:ORRIS Report of the All-Party Committee (Mt. Coot-tha), replied- appointed for the purpose of conducting '' I can assure the Honourable Member an investigation into the social, economic that the Government has no intention of and cultural conditions of Torres Strait permitting a dossier to be kept on every Islanders. licensed driver in the State. The reference Orders in Council under the Medical Acts, to dossiers of traffic offenders was an 1939 to 1955. unfortunate choice of a word to describe Poisons Regulations of 1958 under the the ordinary :file of records kept by all Health Acts, 1937 to 1955. Police Departments of persons reported for a traffic offence or involved in a road inci­ dent which had been reported to the Police. DEATH or HON. H. A. BRUCE. The Police records which have been MOTION OF CONDOLENCE. described as 'dossiers' are the ordinary records containing the information set out Hon. J. C. A. PIZZEY (Isis-Minister in reports furnished by members of the for Education) (11.19 a.m.), by leave, with­ Police Force of the evidence available to out notice: I move- sustain proceedings in cases where traffic offences have been detected, the decisions '' 1. 'l'hat this House desires to place on made upon such cases and the reports record its appreciation of the services ordinarily made by members of the Police rendered to this State by the late Hon. Force as to the facts of a road incident Henry Adam Bruce, a former member of such as a collision which has been reported the Parliament of Queensland and Minister to a member of the Police Force. The in­ of the Crown. formation is obtained by members of the '' 2. That Mr. Speaker be requested to Police Force in -the ordinary course of their convey to the widow and family of the duties when endeavouring to ascertain the deceased gentleman the above resolution, 588 Death of Hon. H. A. Bruce. [ASSEMBLY.] Death of Hon. H. A. Bruce.

together with an expression of the sympathy He was a ''Prince of Good Fellows'' who and sorrow of the members of the Parlia­ by his cheerful disposition endeared himself ment of Queensland, in the loss they have to all. Few men in public life have for so sustained. ' ' long held the affection of political friends It is my sad duty to pay a tribute to a and political foes alike. His deep humility man who rendered long and sterling service and his unfailing humour endeared him to all to the people of Queensland in both the Com­ who came into contact with him. Every monwealth and State Parliaments, the late member of Parliament, irrespective of the Hon. Henry Adam Bruce, who died after a party to which he belonged, regarded him short illness last Saturday. as a real friend; that, perhaps, was one of his greatest attributes-his immense capacity The late Mr. Bruce, better known to his for making friends. He was also a great colleagues and his constituents as Harry friend of children and it was fitting indeed Bruce, represented North Queensland elec­ that he should have occupied the position of torates in this House for 27 years. He retired Minister for Public Instruction for such a in 1950 because of ill-health, but recovered long period. Wherever a school cricket or and the following year entered the Federal football match of any importance was being Parliament as member for Leichhardt. played, there you were sure to find Harry Mr. Bruce had announced his intention to Bruce. He will long be remembered by retire from active politics at the end of the thousands of school boys for t~e encomage­ current session of the Federal Parliament. ment and support he gave them m the field of He was to have made his farewell speech in sport. The 'Gabba, during the playing of that Assembly a fortnight ago, but collapsed test matches in the coming season, will greatly just a few hours before he intended miss his familiar face. No longer will his to speak. Mr. Bruce not only served North anecdotes and reminiscences enliven the dull Queensland in two parliamentary spheres, but spots invariably associated with such he also held Cabinet positions in this State. matters. He became Minister for Public Works m The late Harry Bruce was also a great 1932 and held that portfolio until 1938, when northerner, who had great faith in the future he had that of Public Instruction added to of the North. There his name is a household his duties. He held the latter for nearly word. ten years, before reverting to the \Vorks Although he had intended to retire from portfolio, then back to Public Instruction active politics, Mr. Bruce died in harness. He which he held in 1950, the year of his retire­ died full of years and honour, having tasted ment from State politics. the sweets of office, but never the bitterness There is a lasting monument to his memory of personal defeat. His memory will com­ in the road that runs from Brisbane to Cairns mand respect, and his epitaph will be that he along this State's coast. That road has been served North Queensland and his State well named the Bruce Highway, in memory of his and truly for most of a busy lifetime. And so activity as Minister for Public Works, and toclay we join with his bereaved widow and thousands of motorists know that scenic fami~y in mo~rnin~ a man of great humility, route by that name. Long after all those manlmess, fnendlmess and humanity. who knew him have passed on, his name will long remain familiar to Queenslanders. His ~Ir. DUGGAN (North Toowoomba­ name is thus indelibly written in the history Leader of the Opposition) (11.26 a.m.): On of this State. behalf of the Opposition I join with the Acting Premier in the most generous tribute Mr. Bruce, ljke many of his parliamentary he has paid to the memory of an esteemed colleagues, was ait organiser for the Austra­ member of this Parliament. Looking round lian Workers' Union before he stood for Par­ the House this morning-although I am per­ liament. It was a true testing ground, mani­ haps a young man so far as politics are fested by his electoral success at his initial concerned-! see about only 10 faces of men attempt. He was first returned for the State who were in Parliament when I came here seat of Kennedy, but later represented The some years ago. Public life has taken it& Tableland until he retired from State toll of many of the men privileged to politics. represent the people in this State and in other Mr. Bruce soon made his mark in Parlia­ Parliaments. My only regret is that con­ ment, even though he was a young man, in vention seems to decree that it is only when an era when politicians were not ncited for a man passes on, that high tributes are paid their youth. to his memory particularly in the political He was a convincing speaker and competent field. I often feel that if during their life­ debater. He could sally out to attack the time they were paid half the meed of critics of his administration with warmth and praise they receive on their death they would cogency, and was a strong defender of his feel that their contributions were appre­ party's · politics when the pressure was ciated and were regarded as worthwhile in applied. the community. I did not have the privilege of being in Yesterday I had the privilege of being a Parliament with the late Harry Bruce, but pall bearer at the funeral of the late Henry I knew him well in sporting circles and as a Adam Bruce. I hacl the opportunity of Minister in his administrative work. serving with him in a number of Cabinets. Death of Hon. H. A. Brwe. [14 OCTOBER.] Death of Hon. H. A. Bruce. 589

I also know the work he did for the merited tribute that he has paid to the Parliamentary Labour Party. Indeed his memory of a man who served this State wise counSBl was of great value on many faithfully and well. occasions. He was not a man who could be easily ruffled unless one did the wrong l\Ir. WATSON (Mulgrave) (11.31 a.m.): thing in a game of cards. Such occasions It is fitting that I should join with the were the only ones when he was given to Acting Premier and the Leader of the Opposi­ quick anger, but it quickly subsided after the tion in their expressions of sympathy follow­ situation had been retrieved by his own expert ing the death of such a fine man as the late play or by the quality of the cards put down Harry Bruce. As most hon. members know, for him. the electorate that I am honoured to represent The late Mr. Bruce, as the Acting Premier was pa1·t of the former electorate known as The Tableland, and irrespective of our differ­ s~id, was a most friendly man. I do not think that during his lifetime he ever did a ent political colours, Harry Bruce and I were mean thing to anybody. I know of no very close friends. ·when the news of his occasion when he was guilty of snide methods death reached the Tableland last Saturday, or attacks nor at any time did he seek to all of us, irrespective of politics, paid a high undermine or destroy a person's character or tribute to our dear old friend. do any of those things often regarded as the North Queensland has many monuments to stock-in-trade of a practising politician. the late Mr. Bruce. As Minister controlling Because of his friendliness and great desire both education and main roads, he took a to serve the people generally he had a wide very active interest in the welfare of the vell. iinest physical specimens we could see. He The sporting world, too, owes much to and his wife were a most striking and hand­ Harry Bruce because of the help he gave it some couple who enjoyed a devoted family on many occasions. During the period that life. \Ve deeply mourn his passing. On he was a member of the Queensland Parlia­ behalf of the Opposition, I join with the ment, he missed very few contests at the Acting Premier in the very generous but Brisbane Stadium. The sporting worlcl will 590 Death of Hon. H. A. Bruce. [ASSEMBLY.] Gift Duty Acts, &c., Bill.

miss the advice and support he so often gave. a building in Canberra just before he died, Queensland generally will be the poorer for he would have just as unhesitatingly said to his passing and will mourn the loss of one some young man, ''Sit down here alongside who served both State and Federal Parlia­ me on the step, young fellow. I have some­ ments so well. thing to say to you.'' That was the Harry Bruce that . I knew through the years. He lUr. AIKENS (Mundingburra) (11.35 dearly loved to sit down and reminisce a.m.) : I suppose I knew Harry Bruce longer about old times, to talk about the days gone than most hon. members in this Chamber. I by. Only a few months before he died I met first met him during the first conscription him in a street in Townsville and he asked me campaign in Cloncurry in 1916. There is no to do a little job for him. I gladly consented: need for me to tell hon. members on which to do it and, in the meantime, we went down side he was a fervent advocate. Later, in to a shop occupied by an old Western mate of 1917, when I went to Selwyn as a cleaner in his and mine. I introduced him to· our mutual the Railway Department, Harry Bruce was friend and Harry sat there so long talking there, as he was in most other Western places, about old times that it was hard for me to as an organiser of the A.\V.U. when the remind him that we had to go and do this A.W.U. was a union of which its members little bit of business that he had asked me to were really proud and a union in which its do for him. That was Harry Bruce. He was members could take some active part. When completely unspoiled by his success in the the hon. member for Belyando spoke of miners political field. He was completely unspoiled on the day shifts and miners on the afternoon by the fact that with the passing of the years and night shifts sleeping in the same bed at he became more comfortably off. It was this the boarding houses and the hotels, of course characteristic of Harry Bruce that endeared he was referring to those who could get him to all who knew him. Far too often do accommodation at boarding houses and we see men come into this Parliament from hotels in the 'smelter' towns. When the ranks of the wo·rking class only very I :first knew Harry Bruce he, with many quickly to suffer from what might be termed other miners in the Selwyn district, was an inflated ego. It is not long before we see sleeping in a cave in the hillside-a cave that them wearing the livery of the capitalistic had been hollowed out through the centuries class. It is not long before we see th~m by the kangaroos. Those who could not find parading themselves in the white tie and tails caves in which to slBep occupied huts and or walking down the street with a hombur.g shacks on the hillside, and conditions were so hat, striped pants and cut-away coat. It .1s bad that very frequently the miners in the not only regrettable to see them dressed 1n area went on strike. I think at Mt. Cuthbert the livery of the exploiting class but also far they had a strike every month or six weeks too often what they wear seems to affect their or so and when they had a strike they used minds and mental outlook. That could not be to commandeer the trains and go into Cion­ said of Harry Bruce. He died as he lived, curry to hold their strike there. Most of them the same simple, lovable, affable Harry Bruce used to sleep on the concrete platform of the that we all knew 40 and 50 years ago. railway station. They were the days when an I was shocked when I heard of his passing A.W.U. organiser had to be a real man in although I knew he had not enjoyed really every sense of the term, and Harry Bruce good health for quite a long time. I felt was indeed a real man. If, as has been alleged his death very keenly. I felt that I had lost by some, he mellowed with the passing of the an old friend because even when I considered years, that was not his fault; it was the fault it was necessary for me to break away from of the change in outlook of the party to the Party to which we had both belonged for which he belonged. so long Harry Bruce never lost his friendship I clearly remember meeting Harry Bruce for m; and I never lost my friendship for when I was a young lad. He was sitting on him. He was a good man, an honest man, and the steps outside Aunty Cowling's Hall in above all things a simple man. Selwyn. At that time I was young and eager I should like to pay my tribute to his and I thought I knew the solution of all the memory and publicly express my condolene~s problems that confronted the world, as most to his widow, to his daughter, to all h1s young boys of that age do. I had been making relatives and to all those who like myself a bit of a speech up near the railway station felt a pang at the passing of Harry Bruce. about something or other and I am sure now that I had very little knowledge of the sub­ Motion (Mr. Pizzey) agreed to, hon. mem­ ject. Harry Bruce said to me, ''Sit down bers standing in silence. alongside me here, young fellow. I have something to say to you.'' And he gave me GIFT DUTY ACTS AMENDMENT BILL. the benefit of his wisdom and his personal experience. What endeared Harry Bruce to INITIATION. all who knew him was the fact that his climb up the political and-if we may say so-the Hon. T. A. HILEY (CoDrparoo- social ladder with the passing of the years Treasurer and Minister for Housing): I never altered his outlook on life. He was still move- the same Harry Bruce, and I suppose even if ''That the House will, at its next sitting, someone haclmet him sitting on a step outside resolve itself into a Committee of the TreaBUry F'IIIYtda, &:c., Bill. (14 OCTOBER.] Supply. 591

Whole to consider of the desirableness of SUPPLY. introducing a Bill to amend the Gift Duty Acts, 1926 to 1952, in certain particulars.'' COMMITTEE-FINANCIAL STATEMENT-­ RESUMPTION OF DEBATE. Motion agreed to. (The Chairman of Committees, Mr. Taylor, Clayfield, in the chair.) STAMP ACTS AMENDMENT BILL. Debate resumed from 2 October (see p. 586) on Mr. Hiley 's motion- INITIATION. " That there be granted to Her Majesty, Hon. T. A. HILEY (Coorparoo­ for the service of the year 1958-1959, a Treasurer and Minister for Housing): I sum not exceeding £1,166 to defray the move-- salary of Aide-de-Camp to His Excellency the Governor.'' ''That the House will, at its next sitting, resolve itself into a Committee of the llr. DUGGAN (North Toowoomba­ Whole to consider of the desirableness of Leader of the Opposition) (11.46 a.m.): Mr. introducing a Bill to amend the Stamp Taylor- Acts, 1894 to 1956, in certain particulars.'' '' It is almost two thousand years since the parable was written, 'Let us eat and be Motion agreed to. merry, for tomorrow we shall die.' It is an unhappy and unfortunate Budget, easily the most unhappy and most unfor­ SUCCESSION AND PROBATE DUTIES tunate presented. Anyone who studies the ACTS AMENDMENT BILL. Australian economy must agree that never was there such a need for a sound financial INITIATION. policy and n-ever was there less evidence of Hon. T. A. HILEY (Coorparoo­ it in any State Budget in my recollection. Treasurer and Minister for Housing): I There was a fall in overseas income due to move-- a lower price for primary products un­ recouped by increased quantum. That is ''That the House will, at its next sitting, a picture that everybody must accept. The resolve itself into a Committee of the Government are spending more money Whole to consider of the desirableness of against a depleted national income, with introducing a Bill to amend the Succession the abandon that is only characterised by and Probate Duties Acts, 1892 to 1955, in drunken sailors and a few other people. Yet certain particulars.' ' with all the evidence that the production of wealth in Australia is dwindling all the Motion agreed to. Governments throughout Australia have consented to perpetuate the situation where all other sections have expended their LAND TAX ACTS AMENDMENT BILL. spending power while the spending capa­ city left in the farm sector is dwindling. INITIATION. Anyone who is not blind must realise that Hon. T. A. HILEY (Coorparoo­ if somebody does not stop it we will tor­ Treasurer and Minister for Housing) : I pedo the vital backbone of Australia's move-- economy.'' That· statement is very interesting, and is ''That the House will, 'at its next sitting, contained in "Hansard" for 1956, pages 732 resolve itself into a Committee of the and 733, and was uttered by the present Whole to consider of the desirableness of Treasurer. It is extraordinary how a phase introducing a Bill to amend the Land Tax of political events will cause a man to declaim Acts, 1915 to 1954, in certain particulars.'' in that fashion, and when he has the oppo~­ Motion agreed to. tunity of introducing an important document of State such as the Budget, the hon. gentle­ man is doing precisely the same 'things which he condemned so strongly two years ago. TREASURY FUNDS INVESTMENT BILL. Any observations I might m'ake regarding INITIATION. the conduct of affairs by the Government are not to be construed as a personal attack Hon. T. A. HILEY (Coorparoo­ on the Treasurer. It is not going to be Treasurer and Minister for Housing): I fashionable for me to exempt the Treasurer move- from any attacks because he as a leading '' That the House will, at its next sitting, and prominent member of the Government, resolve itself into a Committee of the and one of their best minds, and must be Whole to consider of the desirableness of prepared to accept his· share of responsibility introducing a Bill to authorise the invest­ for what we consider to be acts of mal­ ment of certain funds in the Treasury, and administration. for other purposes.'' The Treasurer has at least attempted to be co-operative in his presentation of the Motion agreed to. Budget and in regard to all information that 592 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply. we may seek from him. He has the gift of Treasurer has deliberately chosen as an clarity and is lucid and invariably reasonable; instrument of policy a series of financia] and for these things the Opposition are events, transfers and transactions to con­ grateful. And the Government should also be dition the public mind in the first instance, grateful. Having said that I want the the Federal Government in the second Treasurer to know that as a person who has instance and the Federal Grants Commission fashioned Government policy more than any in the third instance that Queensland must Cabinet Minister he must take his share of be given a better deal. responsibility for what we consider to be From the beginning I make it clear that things which are wrong politically in Queens­ I am 1Yith the Treasurer if at any time he land. When I was on the other side of this can produce ways and means of augmenting r'hamber, I can remember clearly the present the income for development. The Treasurer Premier and the Treasurer, and other leading will find in me and all Opposition members members of the Government declaiming from a ready co-operation and desire to help con­ the Opposition side about the shabby treat­ structively in the preparation of a case for ment of the Oppositfon in not having the submission to the Commonwealth authoritieR Auditor-General's report in time so that the to rectify the uneven financial balance that public accounts could be scrutinised. A exists between the Commonwealth and the week after the delivery of the Budget, we States, but it seems to me to be a political have the Auditor-General's report. contradiction from a Government that went lUr. Hiley: The earliest time. before the people with a long list of glowing promises as to what would happen in Queens­ lir. DUGGAN: It may be that the land if they were returned to power, that Treasurer would start quoting statistics about millions of pounds would flow into Queensland when the previous reports were submitted. as a result of the confidenc.e and trust of That does not alter the gravamen of my overseas investors in this country. Even the charge. It is easy for a person who has no Premier who is not given to extravagant responsibility to condemn the other fellow, language, being a man who has spent all but when he has a chance to rectify the posi­ his life on the land and is m.ore of a realist tion he follows the same pattern as his pre­ and down to earth, could not resist the deces.sors. That seems to me to go through wonderful opportunity presented to him at the whole of the Budget speech. the last election, with a desperate bid for First, '"e see perpetuated the policy office, to make promises to bank officers, laid down by the Premier with his highly­ public servants, farmers, trade unions, rail­ paid and growing number of public relations way men and business men. Never have I officers, and with the active assistance of seen a more glittering presentation of a a galaxy of Ministers who feel that the prospectus as that presented by the Premier State is best served by a continuous pouring­ 12 months ago. out of pamphlets depicting the good deeds lUr. Windsor: Optimism. of the Government. The Budget contains a recital of a number of things, many of which lUr. DUGGAN: It may have been were started by the previous Government, optimism, but it was a false document. but which, according to the propaganda speeches of Government members and Press I came back from Rockhampton only a reports, were fathered by the Government. few days ago. If I was a political strategist probably I would not mention this matter, A close examination of the Budget reveals, because it can only add to the material being except in the field of education, that it con­ heaped before Cabinet at the present time of tains very little that is new, and even in the seething discontent in Central Queensland the education field the Budget details merely about the treatment of that area by the an extension or acceleration perhaps of a Government, particularly after their talk of programme which is very necessary in this decentralisation and their holding a Cabinet modern technological age when an increasing meeting there ancl the propaganda about what number of trained minds is needed to serve they proposed to do for Central Queensland. the economy of the country. They then repudiated promise after promise. It is largely a propaganda Budget, con­ A leading citizen who is a Liberal sup­ taining 1Yhat the Government believes to be porter told me, ''I will not give any money good window-drPssing material. They keep to the Liberal Party. I will not help it in on using the Public Relations Department any way. I have been here for about 6(} and the most co-operative Press, and since years and I have never known a time when the granting of a T.V. licence, in which a the people were so disgusted with the Govern­ very substantial interest is held by the ment of the day as they are at the moment.'' Queensland Press, no doubt that will be a further agency to be nsed by the Government I came back from a trip to Roma only a for the purpose of sowing in the public mind week ago, a trip that the Premier \Yas mean a feeling that all is well in this Rtate. enough, through the Public Relations staff, to refer to as a little jaunt by me to appeal The second part of the Budget which plaintively to people to come back to the arrests my attention is the fact that for the A.L.P. He should visit the area. The very first time" there is a public disclosure that presence of Mr. Russell, the Independent we are becoming a mendicant State, that the Country Party man is proof of the fact that Supply. [14 OcTOBER.] Supply. 593 many of his supporters are so fed up with million in imports. In regard to wool six the repudiation by this Government in regard weeks' trading in wool suggests that 'com­ to their land policy that there is much dis­ J?ared with last year's wool price of above content in that area. The people in these 62d. we shall be lucky this financial year to areas of discontent to which I have referred end up with a seasonal average of much above are traditional supporters of the Government. 48d .. In B_ritain and Western Europe, to say I say nothing of the seething discontent nothmg of Japan, the predominant trend is widespread throughout Queensland in the that of a levelling off of economic activitv homes of the working people who predominate by_ act.ual d_ecline. lt is unlikely that exports in this country. this financial year will furnish a total of £7~0 million compared with the 1957-1958 Jir. Ramsden: Do you see the letters to estimate of £815 million. Exports are esti­ the editor every day~ mated therefore to fall by £85 million whilst llir. DUGGAN: If the hon. member on estim~t.es for 1958-1959, imports will rise thinks that the only people who are discon­ above ceilmg rate of £800 million which is tented with the actions of the Government are £10 million more than the 1957-1958 imports. those who send letters to the editor he is So we see the serious decline in trade which very wrong in his assumption. If he had must have an adverse effect on our economy, sufficient political training he would know but at the same time the Treasurer with gay that a great number of the letters of discon­ ~bando~ is _spending more and more money tent sent to the editor never appear in the m all d.uec~wns. He has used many devices Press because the Press do not want to some of ·n-lnch I nnght approve of but some embarrass the Government of the day very of which I do not. ' much. I am not referring to myself at all S_ome of them are merely accountancy because I use the medium of this Parliament d~viCEd, others are designed to give effe"t to to voice my opinion. Leader writers cannot his promise to simplify the presentation of the tell me what to say because I am prepared to say what I have to say on the public platform accounts. \Yllcrever that has been done the and on the fioor of this Chamber. It is here TTeasurer is deserving of thanks and 'con­ that I can state the case for Labour and say gratulations, although personally I cannot see what I want to say. that the way in which he has presented the accounts makes it very much easier to discern This Budget is indeed an illustration of the truf p_osition than the previous method. the Treasmer 's dilemma in trying to give However, If from an accountancy point of effect to extravagant promises and pressing view he has managed to present the accounts demands of those in Cabinet and at the same in a more readily accessible form than previ­ time finding the wherewithal to finance certain ously, we offer him our congratulations. proposals. The Treasurer is a man who has read widely. He can assimilate information The. Government !Iave failed to face up to and his professional contracts before he the widespread declme in wool values with a resultant fall in graziers' incomes, the· assumed ministerial office enabled him to get ~nd the opinions of the business community to catastrophic increase in living costs generally. an extent far greater than most, and if he Instead, they have said that they intend to felt constrained two years ago to direct make Queensland a claimant State and in attention to the serious position threatening order to justify themselves they say they must Australia and the need to exercise restraint bring certain conditions here up to the aver­ one would have thought that being a member age standard that prevails in the other States. of a private enterprise Government and a It might be good political propaganda to say Country-Liberal Party Government he would that in some directions Queensland's stand­ have set an example. ards are lmver than those of the other States but I should like to have them enumerated: Let us also go back two years to the speeches made by the present Premier. We The Treasurer in his Financial Statement has find him speaking then about how inflation set out a table of these alleged comparative was gradually increasing, lowering the general standards. I do not intend to challenge them standards of the people and how necessary it at this stage, but I should like to know was that a halt should be called to expendi­ whether they are on an entirely comparable ture. He spoke of quarterly adjustments to basis. They are certainly not in complete the basic wage and the need for the pegging conformity with the standard that has been of wages. Such statements were made when presented by the Commonwealth Grants Com­ the Premier was Leader of the Opposition mission. A good deal of discrepancy exists only two years ago. If the remarks of the between the headings specified by the Treas­ '.rreasurer and the Premier were relevant on urer and those that appear in the Common­ that occasion and if there was any political wealth Grants Commission tables. In addi­ point in dealing with the matter then how tion, we know that some States, in assessing much worse is the position today. Th~ Sep­ the per capita costs of public works and' tember quarter brought an unf,avourable education, for example, charge them all balance for the first quarter of the financial against Consolidated Revenue, while others do year to £37.8 million against a favourable not. Instead, they charge them against Loan ?alance of £14.1 million for the first quarter Funds and Trust Funds, as well as Consoli­ m 1957-1958. The turn-round in trade has dated Revenue, with the result that it is not thus been £51.9 million made up of a fall of always possible to get a clear picture. Again, £45.2 million in exports and a rise of £6.7 in the administration of health matters some· 594 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

States have money made available from the smug. No-one knows better than I his general Motherhood Endowment Fund, money that knowledge of the subject, but neither he nor ·does not go into Consolidated Revenue. Conse­ anyone else has all the answers. Whether quently, in the presentation of the tables that someone thinks he has scored a debating money "-ould not be credited on a per capita point or not, the :figures show what is being basis. clone by the transfer of funds frop1 time to Can anyone say that the standard of living time. We are adding tremendously to the in Queensland has been lower than that in deficit. The Treasurer has revealed the Gov­ ernment's tremendous cle:ficit, as he did last any other State~ I say it has not. Rents in Queensland were lower than those in the year, in contrast with a surplus of £15,000 the previous _]'ear. At one time, the ability ·Other States, and so were meat prices. Trans­ to balance the Budget was regarded as a test port costs, too, particularly for suburban of good Government. With the transfer of traffic, were at least no higher than those in funds from the suspense account and other the other States. Therefore, the standard of accounts for use, the Treasurer has been living of Queensland people has certainly not able to bolster the Consolidated Revenue been lower than that of people in the other Fund considerably. He cannot have it every States. Again, can anybody say with truth way. Is he deliberately inviting the Grants that hospitalisation in Queensland has been of Commission to help Queensland? Let us con­ a. lower standard than that in the other States~ sider whether they are likely to give us that I think it is freely conceded by people of all assistance. The claimant 'States at present political parties that the general standard of are West Australia, South Australia and hospitalisation in this State is superior to that Tasmania. So far Queensland has remained in any other State in Australia, yet the aloof. Treasurer will try to show that there has been less expenditure per capita on hospitalisation Dr. Noble: They do much better than we do in the way of Federal grants. in Qu~ensland than in any other State. Dr. Noble: There is better administra­ lllr. DUGGAN: Unquestionably they do. tion here. Probably one-sixth of the total revenue of Tasmania comes from Federal grants. lUr. DUGGAN: There is no room for Dr. Noble: That's right. .complacency in this matter. Mention was made by an hon. member on the Government lllr. DUGGAN: Sooner or later some­ back bench a tew minutes ago about letters body in the Federal Treasury is going to .coming in. I personally am receiving numer­ put his foot" down. The last Budget speech ous letters from people in various parts of by the Tasmanian Treasurer disclosed an Queensland directing attention to the decline increase from 6 per cent. to 12 per cent. in in the standard of some hospitals. I shall th'l margin allowed because of the higher not go so far as to say that there has been a costs per capita of serving a small popu­ professional decline, but there has certainly lation. That increase followed persistent been a decline in the supply of such things agitation by the Tasmanian people to make as dressings, bandages and medicines. There their conditions comparable with those of the has certainly been a very strict instruction other States. The Tasmanian Treasurer said on the quality of the meat to be purchased by he would press very strongly for the margin hospitals. For example, in one hospital where to be increased to 15 per cent. If we move sirloin roast has been purchased for years, a in and show that we are enjoying, or forcing direction has been issued that only rib roast on our people, a higher standard of living may now be bought. than the other States, what will Victoria and New South Wales do~ An examination of Dr. NOBLE: I rise to a point of order. their :finances shows they have recurring I point out that no instructions have gone deficits. Surely they will object very strongly ·OUt from my department on the quality of if more money is to be pumped from the food to be used in any institution. The best available pool into another IC!aimant State quality must always be ordered. when they think the time has come for them to be claimant States too. We know very well ~Ir. DUGGAN: I must of necessity how much is collected in income tax in New accept the denial of the Minister for Health South Wales and Victoria and how much they and Home Affairs, but will he deny that he get back by way of tax reimbursement. has set out a budget for these institutions Queensland's tax reimbursement per capita that leaves them with no alternative but to is £19.74 against £18.19 for New South give a lower standard of service~ Because of Wales, and £17.44 for Victoria. Both those the department's refusal to accept their States can be expected vigorously to oppose budgets, they are compelled to provide a less any application Queensland might make. efficient service ancl food of a poorer Indications are that the Victorian Premier, standard. a Country Party man, of the same political kidney as the Queensland Government of the ilir. Hiley: Is the purpose of this argu­ clay, is trying to pave the way for an altered ment to suggest that we should have spent approach to the provision of Victorian more or allowed more money for this~ :finances. 5Ir. DUGGAN: I will come to that later The Treasurer very definitely reveals that .Qn. It is all right for the Treasurer to be the Queensland Government have no internal Supply. [14 OcTOBER.] Supply. 595 plan to control inflation, or to arrest the drift will be somewhere in the vicinity of 8 per in wool prices, or to improve conditions in cent. Am I right in that~ I think that the dairying industry, or to propound a land the interest rate plus other charges, includ­ scheme. that will be acceptable to the people. ing sinking fund charges, will amount to Indeed the Government are abandoning QI approximately 8 per cent. The Treasu~er relinquishing their responsibility in many proposes to fund some of these vast deficrts directions. They lean towards Government by the transfers of funds from certain trust by committee. They are not themselves accounts, action which will be validated by accepting the responsibilities of their office. subsequent legislation. He has budgeted for They have a Delinquency Commission, a an additional deficit. It seems to be fashion­ re-distribution committee, someone else to able for every Government to do the same examine the land question, a trade delegation thing. committee, a committee to make inquiries into We could be on common ground with the hire-purchase business. The Government Treasurer if a concerted attempt were made· channel all these knotty questions into vari­ to approach the Commonwealth authorities ous sub-departments and then endeavour to on the matter of interest. The Treasurer has hide behind the various committees once they repudiated some of the financial practices of make their recommendations in that they are his counterparts in the Federal Parliament the recommendations and advice of people by providing that capital works are now to who are not necessarily answerable to Parlia­ be fully borne by loan funds and not charged ment at all and we have no means of redress. to Consolidated Revenue. This pr-actice is in Dr. Noble: We have not got a Gerry contradiction to Federal policy. I am not Dawson committee. arguing the merits of it at the moment other than to say that much of the public works lUr. DUGGAN: We have not, either. The undertaken by the Commonwealth Govern­ hon. gentleman likes to join with the hon. ment has been financed from revenue and on member for South Brisbane in his little quip many occasions their surpluses have been used about "wise or unwise, rightly or wrongly", for the purpose of lending money obtained in and things of that kind. On page 17 of the taxation back to the States at rates of interest Treasurer's Financial Statement the best varying between 4 and 5 per cent. It is brains of the Government use the words morally wrong that a Government that take "Rightly or wrongly, the Government took money from taxpayers throughout the whole the view--'' I am in good company with of Australia, although they get the money the Treasurer. If the Minister for Health and for nothing, should want to sell it back to Home Affairs were not so vociferous he would the States at interest rates as high as 4 and realise that the Treasurer used those words 5 per cent. in the same sense as I used them at the time They propose to assist by having the use I used them. I am sure the hon. gentleman of Treasury bills for over £100,000,000 for would not want to rebuke the Treasurer as he which the States aTe obliged to pay 4::! to 5 attempts to rebuke me for the use of the per cent. The Treasurer should lodge the term. The Treasurer is in good company with strongest protest against this discrimination me and I am in good company with him. and the tendency to make money clearer for I am glad that the Minister for Health and the States. Every State will be eventually Home Aftairs has joined with the hon. mem­ putting up a case to the Commonwealth ber for South Brisbane in this regard. It does Grants Commission. I am certain that the nbt worry or embarrass me in the slightest. Grants Commission will not tolerate a situa­ Dr. Noble: I would rather join the hon. tion where the States will ask for the member for South Brisbane than you, I think. increased rates. The proposed international tradings may dictate a policy of restriction Mr. DUGGAN: I think the hon. gentle­ and deflation. I am not subscribing to that. man would because he is of the same political The principal Governments, America, Britain, kidney. The Minister for Health and Home Western Germany and Japan are stating a Affairs is well Jfnown, of course, for the policy of restriction and deflation and they way he shifts his ground very quickly. When are getting the benefit through reducing their l was a member of the Government there was costs. They are paying less for our sugar, our no person who would come along more fre­ wool and our primary products. Britain has quently and more consistently to poison you beaten us to the punch all along the line when against the hon. member for South Brisbane it comes to trading. They have given us a than the hon. member for Yeronga. Not only money preference and in Australia we have did he do it frequently and consistently but given them a percentage pl'eference. The he did it very well. If they think that they measure of preference given to some British might get anywhere by coalescing at the products is higher than the preference present time I suggest that when they have granted to our products. It may be 20 per their conferences they both have their backs cent. preference on a machine, and if the cost to the wall. is £2,000 there is a £400 protection. I shall proceed now with the matter of the popularity of government's budgeting for Mr. Richter: Has not that been adjusted in the last agreement~ deficits. Five States this year have an antici­ pated deficit of £7,597,000. I think the Mr. DUGGAN: I have not seen the final Treasurer will admit that the growing interest statement. It seems unfair that Britain burden, including the sinking fund charges should be enjoying all that. She reserveS- 596 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

the right to pay a certain price and then losing a couple of millions here and a couple become a trader and sell on the best market of millions there, in sugar and wool,'' but if in the world. We should try to seek an the hon. member was a victim of the policy adjustment. vV,e find that the farmers are and had been thrown out of work, and was forced to feed surplus production to the faced with the impossibility of meeting pigs at a time when perhaps two-thirds of increased rent and increased food charges the people in the world are starving. Accord­ and not having the means to buy butter, a~ ing to reports, one-half to two-thirds of the many thousands of people have been he p~ople go to bed hungry, and in the colcler would not think it was funny to talk in t~rms chmates they go to bed shivering night after of millions of pounds. The average person night; yet in this country with 10,000,000 in the community is more concerned about people we are sending commodities overseas making ends meet on a basic wage of £12 and selling them at less than the cost of or £13 a week. production. The de-control of prices led to The Government have engaged in window­ an increase in the basic wage and now the price increases have outraced the miserable dressing. They have made a bid for the increases in the basic wage. The Treasurer Public Service vote. I do not mind an has made no provision to assist those people. improvement in the conditions of public servants. I agree that their superannuation What has the Treasurer done about sugar~ Perhaps that is outside his full control. The scheme lags behind that in other States Government have not been vigorous in exploit­ _and that it is a welcome move to improve ing ways and means of selling our surplus It, but I notice a curious disinclination on sugar production. Many hundreds of thous­ the part of the Government to barter with ands of tons of sugar-cane are being left in other than the white-collar workers. Trade the fields because of inability to find markets. unions outside the Government have been Eggs are increasing in price, yet they are agitating for increased margins for many being sold after being transported 13,000 months, but the Government have not miles, at exactly half cost, and the same brought those trade union officials to the thing could be said of butter, cheese and other conference room and have not had confer­ ence after conference with them on the ·commodities. subject, as they have with the unions repre­ Jl[r. Pizzey: Would you advocate scrap­ senting the white-collar workers. ping the International sugar agreement. Is I am not against improvements for white­ that what you are suggesting~ collar workers. I have never been a party Jl[r. DUGGAN: What I am suggesting to refusing something for one section merely is that a Government that claims to be the because it will prevent the same thing being friend of the primary producer hnve shown sought by another section, but there is a a singular lack of imagination in dealing curious reluctance on the part of the Govern­ with the problem. It is their responsibility ment who pose as a good employer to deal to negotiate trade agreements. Opposition with outside unions. There see~s 'to be a members make suggestions in which the Gov­ disinclination on the part of the Government ernment say they are not going to interest to extend the same benefits to others who themselves. The Premier has told us that perhaps need them most. The determina­ 118 is not going to put to the Federal Govern­ tion of Public Service salaries invariably ment our ideas about trade matters, that means that public servants receive consider­ if we have some desire and interest, we ably ~ore than the basic wage. Admittedly can communicate direct with the Prime a pubhc servant's responsibility entitles him Minister and the Commonwealth Government. !o som~t?ing more than the basic wage, but That has been the attitude of the Govern­ m additiOn to that he has continuity of ment to a series of Opposition suggestions employment, unlike the seasonal worker or about the promotion of trade. The Govern­ the person who is always the first victim of ment have tried to score off Opposition mem­ an economic recession, the chap at the bottom bers in a cheap political way by talking of the economic scale. about Communism, but the Federal Minister, lUr. Tooth: The Government should set Mr. McEwen, the white hope in the Federal an example. Rouse, has returned from overseas and has publicly advocated trading with Red China. Jlir. DUGGAN: I know from my limited time in the Chamber since the hon. member Jlir. Tooth: Is that your solution or was elected that he will not apply himself part-solution of these difficulties~ to this problem. He will snort and rant Jir. DUGGAN: No, I do not think it is. about Red China and the Communists and There is very little we can sell to Reel China, the Q.C.E., which is no solution at all of because the capacity of Red China to trade the problem. Instead of the hon. member is very limited. telling me what to say, I ask him to apply himself constructively to the main problem. Jlir. Tooth: Then your suggestions are of straw; they are not of any value. That is his obligation as a member of the Government. Instead of speaking with 1\Ir. DUGGAN: It is all very well for hatred and bitterness of dreadful menaces the hon. member to adopt the attitude, we have to face, let him, if he is as able as ·"Look, old boy, it doesn't matter very much he feels he is-and I do not say that with Supply. [14 OcTOBER.] Supply. 597

any disrespect-make his presence felt on asked the people to return them as the Gov­ these various committees. Let him apply ernment and promised that there would be himself with the same zeal to the economic a transformation in the economy of the State, problems as he has to the problems of that more jobs would be provided. That was redistribution. stated only two years ago in the policy speech. ~Ir. Tooth: Is not the Government's primary responsibility to its own employees~ 3Ir. Low: Since then we have had a drought. ~Ir. DUGGAN: It certainly has that responsibility, but many of them are not JUr. DUGGAN: The hon. member for white collar workers. If similar treatment Cooroora is a sincere and honest type of is extended to them, there will be no person. If I had the opportunity of listening criticism of the Government from this side to his caucus contributions from time to time <>f the Chamber. I am sure that there would be something more The Treasurer used the term, ''a good than drought to cause him to complain of employer's budget.'' His argument for that the Government's acts of omission. assumption was that the Government were ~Ir. Pizzey interjected. providing for reclassification of the Public Service and an improved superannuation JUr. DUGGAN: No. These men have not scheme. been absorbed as they previously were. Prev­ I have already indicated that we have no iously numbers of men came from Southern quarrel with those features, but surely the Queensland and the Southern States to take Government will not rate themselves as a part in cane cutting, whereas today there is good employer on those aspects alone. It a greater resident population because of is the overall picture of the State's economy migrants in the northern part of the State. in which people are vitally interested, and Only on Wednesday last when at Rockhampton there have been adverse developments since and at the A.M.I.E.U. office I met a number the accession to office of the Government of people, women particularly, who were look­ which are of growing concern. In the first ing for work at Lakes Creek meatworks. The month of the Governments' term of office number at present looking for work has never in August of last year there were 7,394 per­ been greater over the last 20 years. Anybody sons registered as unemployed in Queensland, who says that the incidence of unemployment but the figure quickly rose to approximately is not gro,ving is not prepared to face up 20,000 in March of this year when more than to the situation, because every week more 10,000 persons were receiving unemployment people are complaining of the difficulty of relief. As late as the end of August there getting work. It is all very well for people were 9,600 persons registered as unemployed to say that I am a ''knocker'', but you can­ in this State. Those who take particular note not have your cake and eat it too. The Gov­ of the reviews of the unemployment situation ernment say that there is no reason for un­ issued by the Federal Minister for Labour, employment but they have not yet succeeded Mr. Holt, will have noticed that he finds it in attracting the millions of pounds they said very expedient to deal in percentages rather they would get to this country to provide than the number of persons unemployed. In more jobs for the people. We are concerned his last release of 15 September he put this very much with this great incidence of un­ State's unemployed at 1.5 per cent, which, as employment and we feel that some strong we have previously contended, is completely .action should be taken to deal with it. unreal in view of the method adopted in The Treasurer has had something to say on assessing the figures. this matter. He cleverly left himself with a 1Ur. Richter: Are you suggesting he does way out if things do not go so well this not quote the actual figures~ financial year. While saying that a record level of spending in the public sector of lUr. DUGGAN: I am saying that there finance will help greatly in providing accelera­ is an increasing tendency on the part of the tion in economic activity and employment he J!'ederal Minister to deal in percentages rather adds the proviso that everything should' be than the number of unemployed. satisfactory so long as the private sector does not weaken. In an era of inflation when ~Ir. Richter: He does quote the number of unemployed. world commodity prices are coming down is it reasonable and proper for the Govern~ 3Ir, DUGGAN: I said that. Surely what ment to say, ''We intend to spend more I have said is clear. I repeat that there is money, particularly on increased salaries for an increasing tendency to quote percentages. people who will not increase the country's production.''~ The pages of '' Hansard'' 1Ur. Richter: What are you trying to are full of comments from them on that say~ matter when they were in Opposition. It is what the money will buy that counts, not ~Ir. DUGGAN: An unreal picture is being presented. The hon. member will not the figure that should be in the pay lead me off the track. I am saying to the envelope. Government that there has been a growing With increasing costs and the inability to incidence of unemployment in this State. The market our goods overseas, it is rather a Premier and his Deputy before the elections contradiction for the Government to say that 598 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

the private sector of spending in the com­ malicious propaganda that is being spread in munity should be left to its own devices. It an effort to make them fear that something is completely unreal, and I do not think that unspecified and uncertain will occur. Hon. the Government's supporters will welcome it. members opposite know in their own hearts Of course, many of these things are merely that it is completely untrue, yet we have it political devices. The hon. member for over and over again. That sort of thing will Somerset, who is a leading member of his not cure our economic ills. party-- Mr. Pizzey: You should take Eddie ~Ir. Aikens: He is the Joe Bukowski of Ward out to Goondiwindi to speak on the land the Country Party. policy. Mr. DUGGAN: He is a big man in the }Ir. DUGGAN: I have no doubt he will party, and I am sure that he does not view go out there and if he does the Country with equanimity the Federal Government's Party's seat will tumble very quickly. I decision on the dairying industry on the eve had more graziers come along to see me of an election. I think he will know from when I was out there the other clay than I protests that have been voiced in his area have had for 20 years. what the impact of the Federal Government's Dr. Noble: Did you have time to talk decision will be. There has been no con­ to members of your own party~ certed action at all. The Federal Govern­ ment have become complacent and they think lUr. I)UGGAN: Yes, I did. Not only did that as long as they put out a spate of pub­ they talk to me but they also paid my hotel licity and propaganda, it will get them bill, if the hon. gentleman wants to know. through. It was the only place they did. That is I suppose that people who have subscribed how friendly they were. There is nothing to these principles for 25 or 30 years :find it to fear there. The Labour organisation out difficult to get away from them. However, there is very sound. The hon. gentleman I can say very definitely that the interest of should concern himself with the mounting the people in these matters has been support the petition for Mr. Russell is getting awakened. Only last night I was at a meet­ instead of talking about what Dr. Evatt will ing in one of the subur];)s to which no fewer do in Gooncliwincli. Hon. members opposite than 115 people came to hear speeches by me should see what they can do out there to and one or two other representatives. retrieve the position. They are in for a very Previously we would have been lucky to get big shock, and they will get a bigger shock 15 or 20 people there. The same remarks still, despite redistribution of electorates, apply to the meetings that I attended at when the next elections are held. Goondiwindi and Roma. They were full of enthusiasm and we received many expressions ~Ir. Hilton interjected. of encouragement. JUr. DUGGAN: The hon. member cannot It does not reflect very well on the Prime resist getting on the band wagon. There Minister when he makes a public declaration is a rumour going around now that an invi­ that the only way to retain the Liberal tation has been extended by the Country Party Government in office is to engage in a series for him to join it and I suppose it 1>ould of attacks on the integrity of the Federal be one way of making his path a bit easier. Leader of the Australian Labour Party. I am quite sure that Dr. Evatt will have in his lUr. IIilton: Who is doing the smearing policy speech something that will be both now~ acceptable and beneficial to the Australian lUr. DUGGAN: I am not smearing at people. The history of this country shows all. I am certainly not smearing the hon. that every time it has been in trouble member. I am talking about hon. members :financially, and in times of war, the people opposite. They extended the invitation. have turned to the Labour Party. In two Ask them. All I am saying is that the hon. wars and two depressions they have asked member will need to hang on. the Australian La.bour Party to take control of the Federal Treasury benches. lUr. IIilton: You said that last time. Can anyone say that the present position 1\Ir. DUGGAN: That is true. in the Commonwealth Parliament is satis­ factory~ In the 1956 Federal election 1\Ir. IIilton: Didn't you tell them to vote campaign, Mr. Menzies said that there would for the Country Party in preference to us"f be no increase in taxes. Within two months of the election, however, there was a tremen­ 1\Ir. DUGGAN: Your party went down dous increase in the duties on beer, tobacco, something like 49 to 11. That was not a petrol and other commodities, and that could bad retrogression! happen again on this occasion. Consequently, 1\Ir. Davies: They haven't paid their any person with the interests of Australia at debts in Toowoomba. heart will see to it that the Labour Party is given the opportunity of putting into effect }Ir. DUGGAN: They have not even paid a policy tl-tllt wm be of great benefit to the their accounts in Toowoomba yet. There is country and its people. The people are £600-odd 01Ying. Those are the people who getting sick and tired of the false and talk about honour and integrity and so on. Supply. (14 OCTOBER.] Supply. 599

One would think they would pay an account motorist because he has been singled out by that is becoming old. I do not want to succ9ssive Governments for charges that I int:"oduce these matters, but apparently they believe are getting beyond the ordinary person want to mix in with this sort of thing. in the community. Mr. Gair interjected. Mr. Hiley: Are you taking a look at yourself now~ Mr. DUGGAN: The less said about that the better. I suppose the most pleased hon. Mr. DUGGAN: The Treasurer has raised member in the Chamber would have been the the matter of registration fees. I am not hon. member for South Brisbane if the Gov· making a great deal of political capital out ernment had not elected to table the report of this. When registration fees were increased on National Petroleum Ltd. If ever a man I did so with considerable reluctance, as the was sold a pup it was he. Treasurer may have done on this occasion. The chief reason I am raising the point is that Mr. Pizzey: What has that got to do I think he will find that charges on corn· with the Budget~ mercial heavy vehicles in Queensland bear favourable comparison with the charges in ~Ir. DUGGAN: Charges are made from time to time that the A.L.P. want to get other States; charges on the private motorist away from all sorts of things. I am not perhaps are not so favourable. Of course, getting away from anything. We are not the reason is quite obvious. With 1,000,000 the type of people who want to get away. people in an area so vast as Queensland the We have made mistakes in the past, and no amount of money available for many years doubt we will make more, but we will never will be insufficient to provide even all-weather say that we are ashamed of the Australian communication between principal cities and provincial towns. The 'l'reasurer will be fair Labour Party or of its policy or of its enough to admit that it would not matter how spokesmen. I want to throw that back in much additional money was poured into the the teeth of hon. members opposite very Main Roads Fund there would always be a definitely. vVe are well able to defend our· clamour for more. My quarrel is not so much selves. We are on the up and up. We are that the Treasurer has been obliged to seek on the march. Make no mistake about that. additional means of adding to the revenue lUr. Richter: You have a long way to but that in most cases he has made exemptions climb back. from an existing charge such as tobacco licences where the costs of collection seem to ~Ir. DUGGAN: And it will be worth outweigh the revenue received, whereas he while. Nothing is worth while unless it might well have considered other ways and involves some effort. If hon. members oppo· means of getting £100,000. site did not have the guiding hand of one or two of their number they would not be able lUr. Hiley: You realise that the costs of to extricate themselves from some of the collection on that are nil~ messes they get in. They were only too ~Ir. DUGGAN: I agree, but why put it glad to get away from here for a while. Most on the motoristf He might say, "What about of them would have liked to extend the the pedestrians who are using the zebra period from a week or two to two or three crossings~ What about the school-teaching months. section where the Minister is spending larger The main point on which we find ourselves sums of money~ The ordinary person gets at variance with the Government is that their some benefit from that. What about award election promises have not been kept in any increases and so on~'' I am not making a way. Perhaps I should not say ''in any strong point about this matter but I do regret way'' because that would be untrue. In that generally speaking Governments through· some directions efforts have been made to out Australia, indeed all kinCls of political honour their election promises-one must be affiliations, have imposed unnecessary heavy fair enough to admit that-but the very burdens on motorists in sales tax, excise and glowing and rosy picture painted by leading other charges. Government spokesmen 12 months ago has All in all I agree that the Treasurer has not been realised. made a valiant attempt to present a document Secondly, I did not think I would fin~ a which seems to have all the trimmings, but Country-Liberal Party Government gomg in reality we find that it is really a document cap·in·hand, like the poor little beggar boy, containing a confession of inability under the asking the Federal Government to help them existing methods of finance to carry on the out in any matter. I know that the Treasurer work of Government without some consider· is earnest in his desire to do a good job for able measure of Federal assistance. In my the State. I know he is strong enough and view the Government have not done anything able enough to present a case to the Federal at all to lessen the plight of the unemployed. Government for the rectification of some of Despite the Government's attempt to allow these anomalies. I regret that the Treasurer more and more people to become owners of has seen fit to impose a further charge on the homes, I find that an increasing number of motorists of the State. Certainly it is not people are expressing dissatisfaction and re· a very heavy one-perhaps in justification gret at their inability to get homes for rental he could point out that costs of traffic control because they cannot raise the necessary de· are increasing. But I make a plea for the posit. 600 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

On the other hand the 'l'reasurer has allowed with the hon. gentleman in his problems. We a few tax concessions, for example land tax are anxious to co-operate with him. These to the extent of £145,000. He probably will matters should be ventilated at Canberra argue that because of recession in land in­ for rectification. We disagree strongly on dustries it is desirable. I am not cavilling the propaganda note which we think is based very much at that but it seems to me that on false premises. if he is levying additional taxes at least this It is regrettable that Queensland finds is not the time to reduce taxes to the extent itself in the position of becoming a claimant he has in that direction. State. The Commonwealth authorities­ No doubt the hon. gentleman will amplify whatever their complexion after 22 N ovem­ his re~sons for the reduction of £145,000. ber-will find difficulty in meeting the The Budget represents a considerable demands of the States who are fighting with increase in the funds avail~ble to the Govern­ each other for greater reimbursements, ment and they should be in a position to social services, and increased emoluments create ~ddition~l school buildings. Mention for the public services. If that is to be was made of the small relative increase in carried out at the expense of the Common­ railways costs, but there are 1,000 fewer on wealth authorities, and if they are to be the the payroll. There is evidence of neglected butt of the criticism by State Governments m~intenance in some sections following the because of their niggardly treatment of the economy campaign that is being practised. demands of State Governments, there will There are some sections in which it may be have to be a showdown between the Common­ possible to effect some economies. The wealth and the States regarding financial Government are retaining permanent relationships. No self-respecting Prime employees bnt are not replacing those who Minister would want to be confronted at retire or resign, and they have reduced the every election period with the insatiable temporary staff. That is how they achieved demands of State Governments, in the know­ the result of 1,000 fewer on the payroll. ledge that everything granted will be avidly accepted and everything rejected will be We support the increase in the school hotly contested and made the subject of building programme. I should like to ask political propaganda. the Treasurer for his reasons for suggesting that the State Government Insurance Office I assure the Treasurer that we will be should erect a many-storied building for happy to hear his explanation and elabora­ the provision of many offices which it is tion of some of the points he has made. At intended to let for private office accommoda­ a later stage, when the departmental esti­ tion, when there is need for accommodation mates are being considered, the Opposition: for so many other Government departments. will examine very critically some matters Should a Government instrumentality spend iYhich we think are of great importance. £1,000,000 if it is intended to let portion I thank the Treasurer for setting out some of the building for private office accom­ information in regard to the financial rela­ modation W tionships with the Commonwealth authorities. lUr. Hiley: You do not think it is right After they have the opportunity of examin­ to look ahead, and not to plan merely for ing this information very closely, succeeding today~ Opposition members will have more to say about it. IUr. DUGGAN: I am generally in accord Overall, we have a sense of disappointment with that. When the transfer of the Depart­ about the Government's achievements, their ment of Main Roads was mentioned I was abandonment of price control, their carefree anxious to have that department anE! the attitude to unemployment and their failure Transport Departments housed in the same building in order that everything could be to attract to Queensland all those investors they promised would be coming here. I think done with convenience. I am not against that spirai!ing costs will act as a dElterrent the general position of an insurance office erecting buildings in provincial cities, but to investment in Queensland. There was a does the need to provide private office time when we could say that our standard of accommodation justify the expenditure when living was comparable with that in other there are so many public servants who are States, that we had a lower basic wage and inadequately accommodated nowW lower rent and commodity prices. As Queensland in her geographical position is In the immediate post-war years the far removed from the main centres or mar­ pr0blem of housing was accentuated and kets in the South, I find it difficult to there was a big Jag. I invite the Treasurer's imagine what arguments can be used to get comment on those minor matters. investors to establish industries here to In regard to Commonwealth financial serve southern demand, when our cost struc­ relationships, I spoke about the additional ture is as high or higher than Victoria and money made available this year. Perhaps New South Wales. as a result of the Treasurer's actions some I do not want to be regarded as a knocker. beneficial result may accrue. I want to see many new industries in Queens­ We commend the Treasurer for his desire land, but all the specious statements about to be of assistance in the method of the conditions being made suitable to attract presentation of the budget. We sympathise industry here seem to be destroyed on the Supply. [14 OcTOBER.] Supply. 601

'Treasurer's own admissions of rising costs For some years I have been associated with which the Government have not attempted to local authority work and as many hon. mem­ control. The great increases in wages, bers are aware I am still an alderman of the prices and unemployment are a severe indict­ Toowoomba City Council. From my personal ment of the Government, for which they will experience in this field I cannot speak too have to accept responsibility when they face highly of the consideration extended to local the electors in due course. authorities by the Government. One of the major problems confronting all local lUr. ANDERSON (Toowoomba) (12.53 authorities is that of loan approvals and loan p.m.): I have listened with a good mea­ raisings, and in this respect the Government sure of surprise to the hon. member for North have been most co-operative. This year a Toowoomba and, although I share a distinct record amount of £19,370,000 has been honour with him in representing one of the approved for semi-government and local most progressive cities of our State, I can­ government bodies. There are inclica tions not share his views on what must be regarded that the Government are most sympathetic in as one of the most practical and common­ their response to the appeals of these sense budgets presented to this House for authorities. I desire to place on record the many years. appreciation of the Toowoomba City Council I have formed an opinion which must be in respect of a special grant we received and supported by many hon. members that, acting which contributed in no small way to alleviat­ in his official capacity as Leader of the ing the unemployment situation in Opposition, he has expressed certain views Toowoomba. Not only was the loan approved, merely for the sake of opposing. I can but the Government also raised the amount :appreciate his hostility to it, in the for us. Last March we received £59,000. In sense that the Treasurer has dared to depart view of this policy which is undoubtedly most from a practice adopted for many years in welcome to local authority circles, might I the manner of its presentation. On this occa­ suggest that the Treasury Department investi­ sion we have a Budget bearing proof that gate the possible advantages of establishing the Government of the day, of which I am a loan-raising section within the department very proud to be a member, are making good for the purpose of raising the total amount of their promise to take the people of Queens­ loan approvals and disbursing it to the various land into their confidence. It has been pre­ local authorities. It is possible that some sented in a very clear and concise manner scheme basically similar to that adopted by with no attempt to persuade anyone that we the Commonwealth Grants Commission might are really better off financially than we be employed to advantage. I believe that such thought we were. The traditiona.l cam?ufiage a plan would eliminate quite a lot of duplica­ associated with former budgets 1s noticeably tion, not to mention the reel tape that has absent on this occasion and it is very inter­ prevailed. When we consider how much our €stinu indeed to observe how former errors planned works programmes and the con­ of financial mismanagement were hidden tinuity of unemployment depend upon the within the maze of figures which represented Government's sympathetic reaction to our a budget but which in fact could be more applications, we realise the immense value of correctly termed, ''An Annual Apology.'' the Government's assistance. If funds could be pooled in the larger cities and allocated to I feel confident that I am voicing the the various council undertakings we would not sentiments of the majority of hon. members have unemployment in any section as there when I congratulate the Treasurer on his could be a transfer of money from say excellent and down-to-earth presentation of sewerage works to road works. This would this State's financial position. It is true, as result in less unemployment at certain times we all admit, that the financial year just ended of the year. was fraught with problems over which the We appreciate the Treasurer's explanation Government had little or no control. It is ~bout t~e ;eduction in the amount of subsidy not my intention to repeat those set-backs m certam mstances. Naturally with a marked but I should say that the Government make no ~ncrease in loan approvals a proportionate excuses for their approach to th<: situation, mcrease would have to be borne by the and in fact we do not feel there is any need Government if previous levels of subsidies were for excuses. I suggest that no Government maintained. However, it is quite obvious that regardless of political creed, could have a revision of the scale was warranted. adopted a more practical approach than that adopted by the Country-Liberal Party Govern­ I believe that I would be in order Mr. ment on this occasion. \V e commend the Taylor, if at this juncture I referred' to a Treasurer on his timely decision to correct situation which exists in Toowoomba and the false impression that Queensland was which comes within the scope of considera­ financially well off. Certainly certain reserve tion of the present scale of subsidies. As funds accumulated during and immediately hon. members are aware Toowoomba is so after World War II. but as I will indicate situated on the crest of the Great Dividing later the possession of these funds acted to range that water reticulation presents a some­ our detriment, and particularly was this what important financial problem at all times. noticeable at the Loan Council meeting and Linked with an energetic programme designed the Premiers' Conference. However, in spite to supply Toowoomba with an abundance of of the unexpected set-backs many achievements water for years to come is an urgent desire to emerge from a perusal of the Budget. sewer the city completely within a minimum 602 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

time. Naturally, to carry out our second the Treasurer referred in his speech, the big project-the sewerage programme--we people of Queensland were given a false must tirst provide an adequate water reticu­ sense of security and thus held the belief lation system to meet the added demands that that we still possessed great wealth. Contrary would be made upon it. Such a provision is to that belief-both on the exact tinancial normal and is a basic necessity in all position of the State and the absurd claim sewerage programmes. that Queensland would surrender its sovereign powers by becoming a claimant State-I hold Under the present table of subsidies, Too­ the view that such an application will be woomba and other local authority areas in regarded as a milestone in the future develop­ the past have attracted a 50 per cent. sub­ ment of Queensland. No-one can fail to regard sidy on sewerage but only 20 per cent. on it as the first practical step towards bringing water reticulation, so that what actually this State into line with the other States of appears on paper to be a generous grant the Commonwealth. towards the cost of sewerage is in fact some­ thing that cannot be used to its fullest Let me now return to the questions that extent till the water supply programme is I have just posed. Firstly, why has the need completed. for such an application arisen~ I undeTstand that for many years there has been talk of I do not wish to sound parochial on this approaching the Commonwealth Grants Com­ matter, but I suggest to the Treasurer that mission. However, any potential ability to perhaps the system could provide enough qualify as a claimant State was negatived fiexibility in these unusual cases to enable during the war following the building up further aid to be rendered to local authorities of funds in various reserves. One cardinal whose water reticulation programme is only rule that is fundamental to the work of the the tirst step in a long-range plan for sewer­ Commonwealth Grants Commission is that age. financial need must be demonstrated. In the light of what has happened in Too­ Obviously that cannot be done where there woomba, I ask the Treasurer to give due are reserves of a revenue natuTe, reserves consideration to the Perseverance Creek pro­ that could be transferred to help the Con­ ject with a view to increasing the present solidated Revenue Fund. It is onlv now that subsidy of 20 per cent. I should also like these reserves have necessarily been absorbed the Treasurer to indicate whether that scheme and the conditions exist under which an would be considered in the category of head­ application might succeed. works, which can attract a maximum subsidy The Treasurer has shown in his Budget of 100 per cent., or whether it would be regarded as a local weir and thus qualify for speech that the accumulated deticit of the a maximum subsidy of 50 per cent. Consolidated Revenue Fund, after adding the 1957-1958 deficit, amounts to £5,211,595, To my mind, one of the most important which has been financed by the credit balances aspects of the Treasurer's speech was the in various trust and special funds amounting statement of his intention to apply for a to £6,003,428. Details of these trust and special grant from the Commonwealth Gov­ special funds and the balance in each are ernment under Section 96 of the Common­ shown in Table ''A'' of the Tables relating wealth Constitution which provides- to the Treasurer's Financial Statement and '' During a period of 10 years after the are listed under the heading of "Reserves". establishment of the Commonwealth and The Treasurer has also stated that it is thereafter until the Parliament otherwise proposed to offset the accumulated deficit provides, the Parliament may grant tinancial against these reserves, reducing their level assistance to any State on such terms and to £791,833 at June last, most of which conditions as the Parliament thinks tit.'' is held in the Hospital, Motherhood and On receipt of an application from a State for Child Welfare Fund. The anticipated deficit assistance under this section, the Common­ for 1958-1959 is £1,828,299, after using what wealth Government may either decide itself is available from the remaining reserves, and whether to make a grant, or refer the appli­ it is obvious that Queensland is now in the cation to the Commonwealth Grants Commis­ same position as other outlying States who sion for examination and recommendation. must rely on grants recommended by the Commonwealth Grants Commission to tinance \Ve in Queensland may ask two questions the bulk of the deficits they would otherwise on the decision to apply for aid- be forced to budget for. 1. Why has the need for the application arisen~ Considering their financial position, the 2: What advantages could be expected to only courses open to the Government in fram­ flow from such a step~ ing the Budget were-- Hon. members opposite will be quick to tell (a) to increase revenue us that by so doing we shall automatically (b) to reduce expenditure surrender many of Queensland's sovereign (c) to carry a deticit or fund it powers. Let me remind them, however, that under the former administration Queensland (d) to apply to the Commonwealth for lagged sadly behind her sister States in de­ financial assistance. velopment and general prosperity. By various These various courses were examined. On ways and means, principally the one to which the revenue side this State is in most respects Supply. [14 OCTOBER.) Supply. 603

not below other States in its level of charges sources. It is clear that there is little flexi­ and taxes. There is no good reason why we bility left in State revenue. Let us examine should tax at higher than average rates and the following percentages- there is every good reason why we should not. Per cent. ·Obviously, high rates have a tendency to Railways frighten potential industries away from the 38.6 State and that is what we wish to prevent. Income Tax Grant 35.0 Other Taxation 12.3 Actual figures of receipts per head of popu­ Land and Mining Revenue 5.3 lation do not always reflect the effort made Other Receipts 8.8 to raise revenue and for this reason the Grants Commission works on rates of tax, etc., rather \Ve now come to the second alternative, than on the average level of revenue collected namely to reduce expenditure. This is not for its assessment of a State's revenue-raising a satisfactory solution either, as already effort. In this way allowance is made for many departments are bitterly disappointed difference in taxable capacity, which is by the drastic reduction in their allocations. admittedly lower in Queensland, owing to The Government are determined to remedy various factors, for example, the lower level the adverse position of salary scales and of prices and wages and also the greater superannuation rights of the Public Service proportion of rural industry. Furthermore, a which, if allowed to continue, would seri­ State is not penalised by this method for ously undermine ancl weaken the standard O·f factors outside its control. These factors our service owing to the inability to recruit would include the reduction in the incomes suitable staff, and to hold existing trained of primary producers by reason of the fall staff against the competition offered by other in overseas prices and, of course, the recent Governments and large institutions such as drought in this State. bankJ and insurance companies. In some cases where we were ohdously Increased expenditure on education and below other ::ltates, action has been taken to health services was considered to be war­ increase rates as in the case of the tax on ranted, while other increases were unavoid­ betting tickets and drivers' licenses. Some able, for example, the higher cost of ser­ will question this move. 'l'oowoomba is vicing the Public Debt. In many direc­ affected in much the same way as the metro­ tions, however, expenditure is still relatively politan area. Here, when we consider the lower in Queensland than in other claimant smaller bookmaker and bettor, we find that States. Development is not entirely a matter where the tax was formerly 3d. a ticket, it of loan expenditure, but it also calls for has now been increased to 6c1., but in other expenditure from the Consolidated Revenue cities such as Townsville and Rockhampton, Fund on research, drilling, pest control, etc. I believe, the tax, formerly 1d. is to be In these fields it would be tragic to reduce increased to 2d. This situation does appear effective expenditure. In fact, every effort to me to need further consideration so as to must be made to increase it to ensure that bring Toowoomba into line with the other our in cl us tries can go on expanding their out­ places mentioned. put at a satisfactory rate. Should we carry a deficit or fund it~ In the first place, it Again, on the subject of drivers' licenses, has already been shown that we do not have regardless of other views it is my considered sufficient reserves to allow a further deficit opinion that the Government have been very to bt: carried. It is possible, of course, to lenient. We hear the old cry, "The poor fund a deficit from the Loan Fund, but this motorist again'' but let us examine the is most undesirable for several reasons. Our motorist's position, particularly the non-owner loan allocation as determined by the Loan motorist whose numbers in this State are Council is already low compared with other States and every penny is required for vital very considerable. He is not called upon to capital works. Funding the deficit would not pay anything towards registration fees and only reduce the loan funds available for in the main he enjoys a very fortunate pos­ other purposes but would reduce our future ition. His only inconvenience is the require­ rights to loan money. I say this because ment to pass a driving test, which incidentally funding of deficits is not counted as expen­ must cost the Government something for diture for the purpose of determining the officers' time and administration. If he formula under the financial agreement. The passes his test, as most do, he is issued with agreement provides that when the distribu­ a licence which in some cases is valid for a tion of the total approved borrowing cannot period of 10 years, and for that he pays be unanimously agreed upon, a formula shall nothing! So 1 don't think as a whole the be applied, based upon the net loan expen­ motorist is very badly clone by. Queens­ diture of each State over the previous five land's registration fees are much lower years. Deficits are not included :itS loan than those of other States. However, when we expenditure. examine the overall sources of the State's ~Ir. JESSON: I rise to a point of order. income the limitations upon State action can I do not want to object to an hon. member quickly be realised. On a percentage basis, making a speech but do you not think it is the total receipts of the Consolidated Revenue rather tedious when the hon. member is Fund are derived from the undermentioned reading every word of his. 604 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

The CHAIRiliAN: Order! I point out to 1933 they were granted varying amounts to the hon. member for Toowoomba that he by the Commonwealth Government, but in is not allowed to read his speech but he is 1933 the Government appointed the Common­ allowed to refer to copious notes. wealth Grants Commission of three members who were to inquire into and report upon 3Ir. ANDERSON: Thank you, Mr. Taylor. claims made for a grant of financial assistance and other relevant matters. l\Ir. Lloyd: Who wrote the brief for These three States have received annual you~ grants as recommended by the Grants Com­ ~Ir, ANDERSON: The hon. member mission since 1933. An examination of the should be thankful that I can read. :finances of Queensland and the claimant In addition, funding deficits is a costly States reveals the extent to which the latter business for a State because the Common­ have gained in assistance from the Common­ wealth Goyernment makes no contribution to wealth. In 1942-43, the first year of uniform the Sinking Fund which the State must pro­ taxation, the amount paid to the States was vide at the rate of 4 pe1· cent. per annum. £24,063,341. This year the CommomYealth Therefore, it must be obvious to all that the will pay the sum of £205,000,000 to the only practical course open in the circum­ States, which represents an increase of 502 stances is to apply to the Commonwealth per cent. over the amount disbursed in Government for special financial assistance. J 942-4?. Over the same period, the grants to the three claimant States have increased from I believe if we were to continue without £2,175,000 to £20,750,000, an increase of 854 grants that we would be sentencing the State per cent. To illustrate further the extent to of Queensland to a sub-standard level of which the claimant States have benefited in expenditure for a long period. contrast to Queensland, it is interesting to Let us deal now with the advantages which compare on a per capita basis the income might be expected to flow from a proposal of tax grant to Queensland and the tax grants, this nature. The States of South Australia, plus the commission grants, to the other \Vestern Australia and Tasmania have States concerned. The following table sets received grm1ts since 1910. From that year out the position:-

·- _ ___Australia.s_o_u_tl-1---I·----VV--e-st----·I--T_a_s_m_a_m_·a_. Australia. __ -. ------~~------I·-Q-u_ee_n_s_la_n_d_._, £ 8. ~ £ ~ ~ £ ~ ~ £ ~ ~ 1942-43 income tax grants .. 5 11 11 3 19 8 5 9 10 3 15 9 Grants Commission grants .. . . Nil 1 6 2 1 13 7 2 7 7 1------1------1------1------Total 5 11 11 5 5 10 7 3 5 6 3 4 1956-59 Income- Tax grants . . . . 22 6 7 I 20 17 8 22 12 10 21 3 11 Grants Commission grants Nil 5 15 11 15 11 0 12 17 8 1 Total .. 1---2_2__ 6__ 7_1 ====26==1=3==7~+--3_8 __3_1_0 __ 1---3_4__ 1_7 __ Amount of increase .. .. ~M 8 ~ 7 9 n 0 5 H 18 3 1---- Percentage .. 299% 404% 433% 453%

That table shows how the increases in annual gTant of about £5,000,000. If our these grants to revenue in the claimant States State's application is referred to the GTants have vastly exceeded the increase in Queens­ Commission it will be dealt with in accord­ land's tax grant, both in amount and in per­ ance with procedures which the Commission centage. These figures would serve to con­ has built up over a period of 25 years. The vince the most sceptical that claimant States basic pTinciple adopted by the Grants Com­ have benefited considerably through the mission was set out in its third report as Grants Commission. It is a well-recognised follows:-- fact that although the three smaller States '' Special grants are justifiecl when a are claimant States, nevertheless, their rate of State through financial stress from any development has been at least equal to and, cause is unable efficiently to discharge its in some respects, faster than the rate of functions as a member of the Federation expansion of the non-claimant States such as and should be determined by the amount Queensland, New South Wales, and Victoria. of help found necessary to make it pos­ Undoubtedly the special assistance has sible for that State by reasonable effort accounted for this. \Vhen a State has a high to function at a standard not appreciably loan allocation, plus a high per capita grant below that of the other States.'' towards revenue, then it must be in a more I would draw the attention of hon. members favourable position to promote development. to two points in that quotation. First, a We have only to look at South Australia State is required to make reasonable effort. for proof. \Vhatever measure one chooses, it T·his disposes of any suggestion that grants will not be denied that South Australia is discourage financial responsibility. The advancing at a rate possibly unequalled in Grants Commission will not shoulder the any other State; yet they still receive an whole burden of the State's difficulties but, Supply. [14 OCTOBER.] Supply. 605

provided that the State makes reasonable Hon. members will realise that although efforts to help itself, the Commission will this State is now in a period of financial assist. This assistance, however, is on a stress, for which the Grants Commission limited scale because the Commission will not machinery is designed to cater, we do not allow a claimant State's services to be raised expect assistance on the scale received by the to a level above those of the other States. In above States. We need assistance, but as the Commission's words, which I read, the the anticipated deficit is under two million,. standard is set "Not appreciably below" that the requirements this year are not large, and of the other States. The Commission makes it is possible they could be met by the Com­ a thorough examination of a State's accounts monwealth without recourse to the Grants to ensure that revenues are all used for Commission. The Government is convinced: revenue purposes and are not diverted to that the step it has taken is the only practical capital works or to bodies outside the Budget. course open to save this State from sub­ It also examines the impact of business standard conditions. In the Treasurer's undertakings on the Budget, the level of social speech, our attention was drawn to the fact service expenditure, etc. Far from encour­ that the greatest contributing factor to our aging irresponsibility, the Commission actu­ overall deficit for the year can be attributed ally forces a State to improve its budgetary to the decline in railway receipts. It must control. · be apparent to all that circumstances again played their part in this result. There is no In comparing services in the various States need for me to refer to those conditions again, and the cost of providing them, the Commis­ but I believe in all matters relating to rail­ sion allows for special difficulties encountered way finance we are inclined to place too much by the outlying States by reason of sparsity emphasis on the word ''deficit.'' of population and so on, and makes a per­ centage addition to the cost of social ser­ When analysing the receipts and expendi­ vices to cover this additional expense. The ture of that department, I believe we should percentages adopted are 6 per cent. for South regard the Queensland Railways in a similnr Australia and 12 per cent. for Western light to that of our hospitals. They both Australia and Tasmania. exist primarily as a public utility, and as It is to be hoped that Queensland will also such, we must provide them for the people of qualify for a percentage allowance on account Queensland regardless of whether they are a. financial asset or liability. Certainly it is the of these difficulties because we suffer from bounden duty of any Government to ensure the factors which the Commission takes into that these public utilities are operated effic­ account. iently and as economically as possible, but let Large areas of Queensland are only sparsely us not forget that the present state of the settled and costs are high. For example, edu­ railways is a legacy of a former Government. cation is costly in these circumstances because of a high proportion of small schools with I hasten to assure hon. members of the few pupils. These are the factors which the Opposition that our Government is fully con­ Commission refers to as ''natural'' factors, scious of the need to streamline and even and the Commission itself recognises that eliminate certain contributing factors sur­ Queensland is affected by them. In its rounding the present unsatisfactory position t1venty-first report in 1954, the Commission of this department, and I have reason to stated, believe that we will see a m,arked improve­ ''The task before the Commission is to ment in the near future. form a judgment on the basis of all the To illustrate our desire to eliminate unnec­ statistical evidence which is available as essary expenditure, I have only to draw atten­ to the extent to which claimant States are tion to a previous practice adopted in the faced with greater difficulties or have issuing of tobacco resellers licenses. With greater advantages than are experienced the repeal of the Tobacco Act, the payment in the non-claimant States. In this con­ of a fee has been abolished. In this instance nection- it is of course evident that one of it was costing the State more for administra­ the non-claimant States, namely Queens­ tion than was being attracted by the licence land, suffers from 'natural' factors in fees, and commonsense alone directed that much the same way as the claimant States.'' such trifling forms of taxation were both The grants already recommended for 1958- unnecessary and undesirable. Other similar 1959 to the three existing claimant States of eliminations have taken place in various South Australia, Western Australia and departments and I understand that very Tasmania are as follows:- energetic efforts are being made within the Special Railway Department to reduce expediture to Grants a minimum. However, I cannot urge too 1958-1959. strongly the elimination of the word ''deficit'' £ in our references to the financial position of· South Australia 5,250,000 the railways. It is interesting to recall that we do not hear the same reference to hos­ Western Australia 11,100,000 pitals. Before departing from the subject of Tasmania 4,400,000 railways, I believe we can expect more than the average seasonal patronage from the Making a total of £20,750,000 Darling Downs areas where an excellent wheat crop is about to be harvested. It will be a 606 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

record, I feel sure. We want to make sure While speaking about Thursday Island, I that the railways get their share of carting should like the Treasurer to give considera­ the grain to Brisbane. Recently I went to tion to the building of Housing Commission Melfiourne and travelled on the Spirit of homes there as many of the Islanders are Progress from Albury to Melbourne and was very keen on owning their own homes. They given a brochure concerning railway travel in approached us on that subject, and I am Victoria. I know that hon. members opposite sure that they would be very appreciative of think the Government are indulging in too any help that could be given to them. If much publicity and would not be warranted homes were built over a period of two or in printing such a brochure as I have in my three years, the favourable reaction of the hand, but I think that one such as this sup­ natives could be gauged. plied to passengers on the various train ser­ vices throughout Queensland would go a long Vast changes have taken place in the field way to encouraging passengers to use our of education, and the present healthy railways. I think it inadvisable to take the approach to a subject that threatened to .dining car off the train to Cairns at Towns­ present a problem in this State is highly ville. It should remain until the train reaches commendable. I congratulate the Government Cairns, so that it can provide a first-class on their approach. I should like also to facility for passengers. I urge the Minister advocate improved education facilities for for Transport to recognise the importance of Torres Strait Islanders. I am sure that printing a brochure similar to the one I have every member of the all-party committee just mentioned. realises the value of the work that has been done by the Department of Native Affairs, Housing calls for particular comment. The but it is time that the Education Department Treasurer's statement reveals a very accept­ administered teaching in all schools in the able and encouraging situation, one which I Torres Strait area. The main need there is think will be gladly welcomed by the people for improved education facilities, and it is of Queensland generally. An examination of up to the Government to provide them. The iigures reveals that apparently the former members of the all-party committee attended Government overlooked the simple rules of a meeting of 500 natives and heard them good housekeeping to such an extent that express their views. The meeting was State landlordism predominated all schemes started with a prayer and a hymn and was to overcome the housing shortage in this closed in the same way, followed by the State, with the result that finances were singing of the National Anthem. More strained to the very limit. Not only has decorum and dignity were shown at that this undesirable trend been checked with a meeting than is seen in this Chamber. consequent increase in the number of home owners instead of State tenants, but a feeling I should like to commend the Government and the Minister for Education for provid­ ·Of security has been given to many Queens­ ing so much additional school accommodation landers who probably, for the first time in their lives, can now proudly claim, ''This is throughout the State. It is gratifying to our home.'' This very welcome change has record that no fewer than seven new high been brought about mainly by the introduc­ schools have been provided for, one of which tion of co-operative housing societies which I am pleased to say will be at Toowoomba. have been pleased to share the burden of this I commend the department for anticipating the State's education requirements in that responsibility with the Government. I feel way. confident that next year's Financial State­ ment will prove the unquestionable merit of lUr. Davies: Are you trying to say that this significant change. that is something new~

During my recent investigations into the ~Ir. ANDERSON: It is something new living conditions of the natives of the Thurs­ for education in Queensland. The present day Island group, I learnt that there was an Government are providing more Bchools than urgent need for the Treasurer to give con­ any previous Government did. sidemtion to the building of some Housing Commission homes up there. I congratulate I should like now to refer to the tourist industry in this State. is obvious that the Government on t4e appointment of the It all-Party committee consisting of the hon. we must encourage tourists to come to Queens­ member for Cairns, Mr. Wallace, the hon. land, and the Government are doing every­ thing possible in that direction. member for Cook, Mr. Adair, the hon. member for Tablelands, Mr. Gilmore, and myself. It lUr. Davies: How is the Minister's tour was something that I advocated during my getting on? Address in Reply speech last year and I encourage the Government to appoint more l\Ir. ANDERSON: It is a pity that more of these all-Party committees to investigate hon.. members would not go on tours, other matters. particularly of the North. They would then be able to realise the difficulties of the people Jir. Davies: Give us one on transport. in that part of the State. We commend the Government on their extra Jir. ANDERSON: Transport matters allocation for main roads because they are are in the capable hands of the Minister vital to the tourist industry. They have ·for Transport. granted an extra £2,500,000 for the coming Supply. [14 OCTOBER.] Supply. 607 year and we know it will be spent very of the railway deficit. They point to the wisely throughout Queensland and not just in fact that over a period of years we have one section. accumulated a huge railways deficit and they say that that would not have occurred if all We commend the Budget. We are very the traffic, passenger and goods, in the State, pleased to be associated with it. I shall had been handled by road transport. They conclude my remarks, if hon. members do not tell the people the whole story. Unfor­ opposite do not mind, by congratulating the tunately many people are gullible enough Treasurer on the presentation of the and credulous enough to fall for this blarney Financial Statement. I congratulate, too, and blither of the oil companies, the motor the Ministers who administer the various companies, and the rubber companies about departments. They are all keenly aware scrapping the railways. But the companies of the problems that confront them. We do not tell the people how much it would are gratified to have men of their calibre cost to build and maintain the highways holding office. They are doing a wonderful if road transport were to handle all the job for the Government and for the people passenger and goods traffic in Queensland of Queensland as a whole. today. They do not tell the gullible and Mr. AIKENS (Mundingburra) (2.51 credulous people who listen to this story that p.m.) : I should like to deal with two matters the biggest howl from the large transport if time permits. The first is transport, which companies in the United States of America poses perhaps the most pressing problem where there is no restriction on road trans­ facing the Government today. In the last port is about the toll system of highway years of the previous Govermnent the construction. In America the Governments, position of road transport became absolutely the local authorities, and those responsible chaotic. Several suggestions were offered for the construction and maintenance of roads some of them quite unsavourly, as to th~ a long while ago gave up the struggle to reason for that state of affairs. I investi­ supply and maintain roads for road transport. gated some of the statements that considera­ They handed over the construction of roads tions had been given for the running of State to various companies and instrumentalities transport companies, either legally or ille­ who built sections of roads on the toll-bar gally, and I could find no factual evidence system. Before a motor transport can enter to support the allegations. Rather, I came any section of such a road anywhere in the to the conclusion that the former Minister United States the driver must stop and pay for Transport, who is now the hon. member the toll, just as they stop and pay the toll, for North 'l'oowoomba, threw up his hands I understand, before they cross the Horni­ in the last years of his Ministership a11d said brook Highway or the Sydney Harbour "Well, it appears that nothing can be don~ Bridge. about it, so let the mad rat race continue.'' Mr. Windsor: Have you been to JUr. Davies: Oh, no! America~ llir. AIKENS: You do not have to go llir. AIKENS: If the hon. member for anywhere to know things. You do not have· Maryborough can tell me of anything tang­ actually to go to America to know these ible that the former Minister for Transport things. I went to school long enough to be did really to cure or attempt to cure the able to read words of more than one syllable, chaotic conditions of road transport I should something which apparently the hon. member be very happy to hear it because I do not for Fortitude Valley failed to do. If he Yvant to say anything that might not be justi­ goes into the Parliamentary Library he can fied. However, I can come to no other con­ read all the things I have read about the clusion. I do not believe many of the state­ transport position in the United States of ments made outside about the hon. member America. for North Toowoomba. Rather am I pre­ pared to believe that he just-if I may use While the oil companies and rubber com­ the term-gave up the ghost. panies are telling people that neither this State nor the other States of Australia ean The present Minister for Transpo.rt is afford any longer to finance constantly recur­ faced with the same problem and apparently ring railway deficits, saying that it is an he is having some difficulty, even in his own imposition on the taxpayers of Queensland party, in reaching a solution. \Ve know very and Australia, they have not got the ordin­ well that the oil companies, the motor com­ ary decency and honesty to tell the people that panies, the rubber companies, and all those this year alone the Federal Government will IYho are interested in the promotion of road make available out of the taxpayers' pockets t~ansport and in its expansion are crying to not less than £10,000,000 to keep A.N.A., h1gh heaven that the time has arrived in T.A.A., and the other commercial airline com­ Queensland to scrap the railways. They say, panies operating. It is costing the taxpayers ''Let road transport handle all the traffic, of Australia £10,000,000 a year to keep the whether passenger traffic or freight traffic. commercial airlines flying. I would say that We will handle it much more cheaply and £10,000,000 a year is more than the aggregate m~ch more efficiently than the railways are railway deficit over the whole of Australia. domg today." They add that scrapping the railways and handing all transport over to Mr. DaYies: They are giving a very big the road transport people will mean the end subsidy to private enterprise. ti08 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

lUr. AIKENS: Of course they are. They not noticed this in regard to Mt. Isa-after are making a very big subsidy to a particu­ they have been well established after the lar type of transport. These people who do profits have rolled in, they say, "We do not cavil at over £1,0,000,000 a year to keep not want the railways any more; we will commercial airlines in the air are the very bring the stuff up by road.'' The Mary people who are squealing like brumby Kathleen Company was talked into bringing stallions because the Queensland railway north by road all its plant and material, all system is losing £1,000,000 or £2,000,000 a the way through South Australia to the year. They are losing it not because of Northern Territory and out to the mine. bad business, but because the raihvay system Some of it should have gone by boat or rail in Queensland is em.ployed in the main in from here to Townsville and then by rail the clevelopment of Queensland and in keep­ from T6wnsville. The hon. member for Roma ing people and industry in the outback. J1as just rushed out of the Chamber with his tail between his legs because he knows that lir. Ewan: That may be true. 1 am about to deal with this point. As a member representing a western electorate he }Ir. AIKENS: The hen. member for makes representations for free passes for Roma walks in as usual. It seems a remark­ this type and that. I have no doubt he gets able coincidence that the note I made on the political propaganda out of pleading for particular point impinges directly on men passes on the railways-not on road transport like the hon. member for Roma, big wealthy -for pensioners, school children, western graziers who want road transport only in good women, workers on holidays, delegates to times. I can notice the Minister for Trans­ conventions, sporting and musical bodies, and port nodding his head in agreement with me. the hosts of people who say to the railway They ·want road transport in good. times but department, "We want to get to the coast; they want rail t:tansport in bad times. When we cannot afford to pay our full fare or go wool is bringing £1 a 1 lb., when they are by road; will you give us a concession living in the lap of idleness and luxury they ticket q" Over the years the department has say, "To hell with the railways! We are said-and the present Minister has also said going to do all our own travelling by road. -' 'Of course I shall give you this conces­ We are going to get all our supplies and send sion.'' all our wool away by road transport.'' But JUr. Beardmore: What is wrong with when the grim spectre of drought hovers over thaH :the land how do we hear the hon. member for Roma ancl his like squealing? They immedi­ lUr. AIKENS: There is nothing wrong ately run off to the Minister for Transport with it, if you fellows were only consistent. and say, ''We want freight concessions on the I repeat, some hon. members only want the railways for starving stock. We want freight railways for the concessions they may give . .concessions on the railways for fodder to feed .our stock. vVe want freight concessions on The CHAIRJJIAN: Order! I ask the hon . the railways to bring stud stock onto our member to address the Chair. property. We want freight concessions on the railways to bring stock onto our proper­ JJir. AIKENS: When they have money ties in order to restock them after the they say, ''To hell with the railways; let us ravages of drought.'' In other words they use the road transport companies.'' want the railways only in bad times. They .only want the railways when they have lUr. Hanlon: They believe in capitalisa­ not any money to spend on road transport. tion of their profits and the socia!isation of In other words, if I may use a vulgar word, their losses. they want to bludge on the railways when 1Ur. AIKENS: That is the point. All they have not money to use on road transport. I ask of them is to be consistent, and next Let us deal with the various other industries time they get up on the band-waggon of who use road transport when times are good the oil companies and the motor companies and the profit bags are full of money, and who are squealing to scrap the railways, let who want the department to give them con­ them be honest and tell the people what the cession rates when times are bad. How many railways have clone for our outback areas and industries have been established purely and the development of this country, and the simply as a result of the concessions given keeping of people in the outback. If l were by the railway department. I know how Mt. to list in this debate all the concessions given Isa was established. I was deputy chairman by the department I would want more than of the Cloncurry shire council when Mt. Isa an hour to speak. It would take me more than was opened. I was there when the railway an hour to deal with railway concessions and line was opened. I know the way that the the manner in which the department has then-Labour Government turned themselves assisted industry and the people in the out­ backwards to establish Mt. Isa. I know how back and how it is assisting to keep the millions poured into Mt. Isa in the form of people in the outback contented and happy. freight concessions. Not only does the rail­ I do not want any hon. member to think way department establish industries in the that I do not believe there is a place for road "far-flung corners of the State but the railway transport in our economy. There is a place department keeps them there once they are for it, but it must be orderly and established. Strangely enough-and I have lawful. I do not think any hon. member Supply. [14 OcTOBER.] Supply. 609

would have the hide to suggest that road moving mail train like a dead weight. Be· transport in this State at the present time, tween Cairns and Ingham particularly there as inherited by the Minister from his pre· are many sharp dips in and out of creeks decessor, is either orderly or lawful. Frankly, and rivers, with low-level bridges, and danger­ the present road transport systems, if I may ous curves, particularly approaching the Tarn refer to them as sueh, are being conducted o' Shanter Range. I ask the hon. member under the rules laid down by the late Mr. for Keppel to say how he would feel if he Rafferty, and no-one appears to be able to do was driving the Sun.lander and was told anything about it, although I understand "You have a milk tanker on your tail." ' the Minister is making a valiant attempt against very strong, venomous and vicious lUr. Thackeray: It would be like riding opposition in his own. party. in the last carriage of the Big Dipper at Luna Park. lUr. Windsor: Don't you believe it. Mr. AIKENS: It would. If I was still Mr. AIKENS: I will prove it. an engineman based on Townsville, as I was Let us look at some of the things going for many years, and I was driving the Sun­ on in road transport. I shall give a few lander and was told that a milk tanker was definite, concrete examples of the Ra:fferty to be attached to the back, I would refuse to rules being followed by the various firms, haul the Sunlander until the milk tanker companies and organisations in this State was detached. I am sure the hon. members that claim to be reputable. I speak with for Keppel and Mackay and other enginemen regard only to the North Queensland area would do the same. Sooner or later that based on Townsville, an area with which I dangerous and murderous practice is gomg am particularly conversant because I live to bring disaster to the Sunlander train. Yet there and know what is going on. What goes this company, when the roads are good, would on in that area, for all I know, may be going not touch the railways with a 40-ft. pole. on in other areas too. Take the Malanda Co· They say, "We do not want the railways; operative Dairying Co. based on the Atherton to hell with the railways; let them do with Tableland, which has a big milk distributing their trains what the monkey did with his depot in Townsville. From that depot it nuts. We will cart our milk by road." But sens milk to Townsville and neighbouring when the roads are not traffickable they hitch towns and sends it even as far as Mt. Isa. this milk wagon to the tail-end of the Sun­ The company is in the same group as the lander. hon. member for Balonne and Roma and other hon. members of the Country-Liberal Let me deal with another instrumentality Government. It only wants the railways when that functions only because of the legislative it cannot use the roads to its own advantage. protection given to it by this Parliament. Every day that the roads are traffickable big I will not touch on its various ramifications milk tankers tear down from Malanda to but only those that deal with this argument. Townsville cutting the roads to pieces, and I refer to the Committee of Direction of go back empty, again tearing the roads to Fruit Marketing. The C.O.D. at the present pieces. time is doing something regularly that is not only unlawful but dishonest. The C.O.D. I am glad the hon. member for Keppel at Townsville-and the Minister will bear has just walked into the Chamber. I am me out-has an agreement with the Railway sure that what I am about to say will stun Department for a concession rate and as a the hon. member just as it stunned me when result it has contracted with the department I heard it. When the road between the to bring all its goods from ;Brisbane to Tableland and Townsville is not trafficable Townsville by rail and send all its goods believe it or not, in order to prop up the from Townsville back to Brisbane by rail. dairying industry on the Atherton Tableland, That is the fact, but we now find that the a milk tanker is coupled behind the Sun­ lander mail train from Cairns to Townsville, C.O.D. is employing a firm- a dangerous and murderous practice that lUr. Davies: Are you sure of this before sooner or later is going to bring the Sun­ you tell iU lander to disaster, occasioning thousands of pounds of damage and unfortunately the loss lUr. AIKENS: I am sure of everything of many valuable lives. I say in this Chamber. I am not in the habit of making extravagant and unfounded Mr. ~Iann: How long has that been going onT statements and I commend the hon. member for Maryborough to follow my lead in that Mr. AIKENS: For the last two or three regard. The C.O.D. has entered into an months, whenever required, because of pressure agreement with the Boland Trading Company on the Minister or the General Manager of the of 66 Gypp Street, Dubbo, and Gypp Street Northern Division. Anyone who has driven a is an appropriate name for the street in which locomotive on a fast mail train, as I have, and this comnpany is registed to carry on busi­ as have the hon. members for Mackay and ness. It sends goods by road between Bris­ Keppel, would know the danger. They would bane and Townsville and return. Almost know how a big, semi-rigid vehicle with very weekly we see the big transports of the Boland little oscillation, will hang behind a fast Trading Company running from Brisbane to 1958-W 610 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

Townsville with a load of fruit and every­ want to use the railways and who is working thing for the C.O.D., unloading at Towns­ in ''cahoots'' with a road transport operator ville, loading at the C.O.D. premises in Towns­ legal or illegal, goes to the local police ser: ville and bringing a load back to Brisbane. geant and says, ''There are some goods that Remember that the C.O.D. operates only under I urgently need here from Townsville. I want legislative protection. them inside 12 hours.'' It could be a few bags of cement, or anything at all. He says, ~Ir. Davies: Is it an interstate truck? ''The Railway Department cannot get them Jir. AIKENS: I shall deal with that. here inside 12 hours, so I should like a special They work in a dirtier little way than that. permit to go down and get them.'' The The company loads at. Dubbo with a couple local police officer, not through any sense of cases of fruit and runs a couple of cases of dishonesty, but because he does not like to of fruit from Dubbo or somewhere on the fall out with the local populace, writes out other side of the border into the C.O.D. depot, a special permit, and the man drives his Brisbane, unloads them and loads to the vehicle to Townsville and returns with the plimsol with goods from Brisbane to Towns­ goods. The old standby is that thf' goods ville. This information has been checked and are urgently required. The Railway Depart­ rechecked. Of course when the truck leaves ment is never given an opportunity to say Townsville there are a couple of cases of whether it can handle the job. However, I fruit going to Dubbo but the great bulk of will say that in Townsville today, due to the the cargo is unloaded in Brisbane. Of activities of some of the smartest officers in course the trucks might continue the journey the administration of the Railway Depart­ over the border to keep up the pretence and ment, the net is slowly but surely being maintain the farce. I repeat that it should closed on the snide special permit operators. be remembered that the C.O.D. operates under the legislative protection of this Parliament. lUr. Thackeray: Would that be Val Hall? When we talk a bout rackets and '' rorts'' :ilir. AIKENS: No, but it would be better we can refer to the great pantechnicons used not to mention names. There are so many of by firms such as Grace Brothers and others them that I could not mention them ail in that run on a monthly manifest. There is no the hour that I have to speak. check by the State Transport Department The oil companies, too, work the same where they run, what load they carry or the '' rort'' as do the pantechnicon operators. milage they run. At the end of every month The oil tankers leave the depots at Towns­ they put in what the journalists call a ville laden with oil and the companies pay swindle sheet showing that say pantechnicon 3d. a ton mile only on the petrol carried. No. 6 ran from Brisbane to Gym pie and They pay nothing on the empty vehicle, Gympie back to Brisbane carrying 3 cwt. although it chops up the roads just as much it ran from Brisbane to Childers and Childer~ as it does when loaded. T'he Transport back to Brisbane carrying 5 cwt. It may be Department takes the company's word on how that the pantechnicon covered thousands of much petrol is carried and how far it is miles during the month and it probably carried. At the end of each month the oil carried hundreds of tons of goods in the companies say, ''We carried so much petrol month, but on that carriage the Transport last month to such-and-such a place at 3d. Department has no check at all. At the end a ton mile, and hel'e is our cheque for the of the month the owner of the pantechnicon submits his swindle sheet, and sends along his amount.'' cheque on his assessment of the work done. All over North Queensland-and I have no doubt in many other country areas-the oil lUr. Davies: You would not say that companies hold leases from the Railway every firm does that~ You have charged every firm. Department over large areas of land in rail­ way station yards. As a matter of fact, some lUr. AIKENS: I will tell the hon. of them have their installations in the rail­ member what Lord Chief Justice Goddard way yards and they lease the land from the said in the High Court of England. No doubt Railway Department at a peppercorn rental. the hon. member has heard of Lord Chief They are working the road tanker racket at Justice Goddard. He said, "If a law will 3d. a ton mile on petrol actually carried­ admit of dishonesty, it is only reasonable to their own weight and their own mileage-and assume that some people will practise dis­ at the same time hold leases of large areas of honesty under that law." Queensland's Railway Department land at the various rail­ transport sys_tem is wide open to abuse, dis­ way stations that they use now only to bring ~on.est practices, '' rorts'' and rackets, and in a few odds and ends that are not worth a 1t 1s only reasonable to assume that there ' 'cracker'' to railway revenue. are companies in Queensland who are prac­ There is also the racket that is being tising them. worked by private cars and trucks. On every Let me deal also with the special permit occasion when a sporting function is to be racket that operates in small towns such as held in Townsville, nearly everyone within a Ingham, Innisfail, Cardwell, Home Hill, Ayr, radius of 200 miles who owns a car or a truck Charters To1vers and Hughenden. The Rail­ says to the people in his town, ''I am going way Department can handle all the goods to Townsville next week. Can I get a load offered to it, but some fellow who does not at £1 a head~'' If he has a truck he will Supply. (14 OCTOBER.] Supply. 611

say to the various firms in town ''I am Constitution. I have long been of that going to Townsville next week. Have you opinion and I have waited a long time for anything that I can take down for 15s. or him to admit it. £1 a ton?'' He loads to the plimsoll line. The same thing happens on the return jour­ Something has to be done. There is a vital ney. He goes round the various firms in need to preserve the railway system of Townsville and says, ''I am going back to Queensland in the interests of the State and Ingham, Bowen, Ayr, or Charters Towers in the interests of its economy. There is tomorrow. Have you anything for me to take room, too, in the State's economy for an back~'' In other words, those people are ordered and lawful and honest road trans­ engaging in illegal road transport to cover port system. I suggest that a Royal Commis­ the cost of their private expenses to and from sion be set up, or if not a commission then Townsville. And for all I know that sort of perhaps a committee of investigation or a thing might be going on in other centres of committee to make suggestions, with an inde­ the State a~ ~-ell. Let us get back to the fight pendent chairman, with the Commissioner for that the Mmrster for Transport is having in Railways as one member, the Commissioner his own party in trying to get order out of for Transport as another, a representative of chaos. I commend him for the fight he the road transport operators as another, and appears to be putting up. We all know that a representative of the railway unions as the as a Minister he will be limited, first of all fourth member, irrespective of who is the by the opinions of his Cabinet colleagues, chairman of the board or the fifth member, and secondly by the opinions of his col­ because the railway men are eager to help leagues as expressed in ''Cactus'' from time bring order out of the chaos. They were pro­ to time. On page 9 of ''The Sunday Mail'' mised, during the last election campaign, that of 5 October there was, I thought, an illum­ a consultative committee would be set up, inating article which said that the hon. mem­ on which the railway unions would be repre­ ber for Mt. Gravatt and the hon. Thomas sented so that they could join in the fight A 'Beckett of the party from Kurilpa and help the Minister find a solution to attacked the Minister in the party meeting cut the Gordian knot of the road transport for trying to stop the '' rorts'' and rackets chaos of the State. The sooner the Minister of road transport and were parading-- for Transport gets around to that and appoints the consultative committee and calls JUr. IIART: I rise to a point of order. the representatives of the trades unions in to I did not attack the Minister for trying to help him, with the assistance of the Commis­ stop rackets. There is no truth in that state­ sioner for Railways, the Commissioner for ment whatsoever. Transport. and the representative of the road transport operators, sitting under an inde­ !Ur. AIKENS: What did you attack him pendent chairman, the sooner we will get road for~ transport back on to an orderly and lawful basis. ~Ir. IIART: There is no evidence that I attacked him. ltir. Davies: You really believe the Minister is being handicapped by his caucus~ The CIIAIR~IAN: Order! I ask the hon. member to accept the denial of the hon. Mr. AIKENS: I believe the present member for Mt. Gravatt. Minister for Transport is under exactly the same handicap as his predecessor-that is he lUr. AIKENS: I will accept his denial, is at times browbeaten, bullied and coerced Mr. Taylor, because you are a fine old by his party colleagues into doing something gentleman and you would not want me to do that he himself knows to be wrong. something I should not do. But if that state­ ment is not true-and it appeared in ''The ~Ir. Thackeray: Which Minister was Sunday Mail'' only a fortnight ago-why thaH Was it Mr. Moores, the Q.L.P. man~ did the hon. member for Mt. Gravatt and the hon. member for Kurilpa not ask the ~Ir. AIKENS: The hon. member knows paper to publish a retraction~ As a matter I am talking about Mr. Duggan. Mr. of fact, they were both up on their favourite Moores was not there long enough to clean his hobby horse of Section 92 of the Common­ boots. I am talking about Mr. Duggan and wealth Constitution and they were trying to Mr. Chalk. Mr. Duggan, as I said, threw up emasculate the Minister. his hands. I hope the present Minister for Transport does not do the same. If he does, ~Ir. IIART: I again rise to a point of order. I was on no hobby horse of Section 92. my strictures on him will he just as pointed ana, I would say, just as near the mark, as lUr. AIKENS: I accept the assurance of my strictures on his predecessor. I have the hon. member for Mt. Gravatt. something to say that might interest the hon. member for Kurilpa who, since he entered Mr. IIART: You know nothing about Parliament, has more or less let it be known what you are talking about. that he was the turbulent priest, the Thomas a 'Beckett, of the Liberal Party-much to ~Ir. AIKENS: I accept the hon. the discomfort at times of his own party but member's assurance that he is completely much to the gratification of other hon. mem­ ignorant of Section 92 of the Commonwealth bers who, I am sure, have been very interested 612 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply. in his remarks and particularly pleased to but not the new switch.'' She got the usual hear him espouse the cause of the ordinary notice, ''Pay up in 21 days or we cut the person. light and power off your home.'' That putrid blackmailing tactic was well known to Let me deal with the Townsville Regional the hon. member for Baroona, the hon. mem­ Electricity Board. We have heard a great ber for Haughton and other hon. members of deal about the need to amend legislation the Government who were here at the time I affecting hire-purchase agreements. Let me exposed the rotten thing. They not only tell the Com~ittee what was happening in the condoned it, but they actually urged the Townsville Regional Electricity Board for T.R.E.B. to keep it up. These are the men some years until it was stopped who claim to represent the working class. recently to the eternal credit of the present Minister in charge of electricity ~lr. POWER: I rise to a point (i)f order. supply. When I say, ''To the eternal credit The statement made by the hon. member is of the present Minister in charge of elec­ entirely untrue. tricity supply'' I, of course, imply that it is to the eternal disgrace of the hon. member for The CHAIIDIAN: I ask the hon. Baroona and the hon. member for Haughton member for Mundingburra to accept the who, in their turn, were Ministers in charge denial of the hon. member for Baroona. of electricity supply, hon. gentlemen who not only knew of the existence of this putrid, ~Ir. AIKENS: Mr. Taylor, I have to blackmailing tactic but who actually condoned accept his denial because you have asked me it. When a person went to buy an electrical to, but you were a member at the time and appliance on time payment from the Towns­ you know how true it is. ville Regional Electricity Board in the years The CHAIR]'IAN: Order! The hon. before the hon. member for Mirani took over member for Mundingburra is casting a the portfolio and stopped the putrid practice, reflection on the chair. I ask the hon. mem­ he would pay his deposit and enter the usual hire-purchase agreement to pay so much ber to proceed with his speech without fur­ a month. If that person was not satisfied ther reflection on the chair. with the electrical appliance or if it were Mr. AIKENS: I ask the hon. member faulty and not running as he thought it for Baroona is it a fact that last Christmas should, he would get in touch with the he gave J oe Bukowski 's boy a present of T.R.E.B. and ask them to do something about a bike or am I a liar in saying that~ it. They might or might not do it. If he said to them, "I do not want this electrical Mr. POWER: I rise to a point of order. appliance at all; as far as I am concerned 1t That statement is a deliberate lie and I ask is on the nose. Keep the deposit I paid on it, for a withdrawal of it. keep the monthly instalments I have paid on it up to date, take it out of my sight, I never The CHAIR~IAN: Order! I ask the want to see it again,'' or if he failed to keep hon. member to withdraw the words '' deliber­ up the instalments because of some argumem ate lie." he had with the T.R.E.B. and he said, "I am not going to keep paying my monthly instal­ Mr. POWER: I withdraw them. I say ments until you do something about the faulty that the statement made is untrue and offen­ electrical appliance I bought from you,'' the sive to me; and I ask that it be withdrawn. average decent person would expect that act­ The CHAIRMAN: I ask the hon. ing under the law the T.R.E.B. would take member for Mundingburra to withdraw that any action it was permitted to take under the remark. terms of the hire-purchase agreement. But they did not do that. The moment the buyer Mr. AIKENS: Very well, I withdraw the of an ·electrical appliance on time payment remark. I assure the hon. member for failed to meet his obligations at the moment Baroona that I shall not take his bike off they were due, they merely sent him a printed Joe Bukowski's son. note--incidentally it was very appropriately printed in red-saying, "If this account is I brought this matter up some time ago. not paid within 21 days the electric light and The last time I brought it up hon. members power will be cut off your home.'' Believe it will remember that the hon. member for Forti­ or not, they did it. I have already mentioned tude Valley tried to break down my argu­ in the Chamber the case of an old widow who ment. They admitted it was going on, but asked the T.R.E.B. to mend her stove. This the then hon. member for Fortitude Valley, old lady was a pensioner. They mended her to prove it to his own satisfaction and the stove all right but in the process they broke satisfaction of those who grace the Opposi­ the switch on the stove. When she got the tion benches-the Q.L.P. and the A.L.P.­ bill for the repairs she found that she was said that my statement must have been untrue asked to pay for a new switch. She said because many years ago I lay drunk in the "Your men broke the switch." The T.R.E.B: gutter in front of a hotel in Townsville. said, ''Yes, our men broke the switch but we That is the sort of thing that has been put a new switch on your stove out of stock. going on. I would like it to be known that Someone has got to pay for it and it is not the blackmailing practice by T.R.E.B. in going to be us.'' She said, ''I am not going regard to articles sold on hire purchase is to pay for it. I will pay for everything else now no more. The eternal thanks of the Supply. [14 OcTOBER.] Supply. 613

people who live in the area go to Ernie me because I think it was written by Words­ Evans w.ho stopped the practice. I want to wo~th, the most gentle of the English bards. say this: no other regional electricity board It went something like this- in Queensland did the same thing as the ''Holy Moses, what a caper, Townsville Regional Electricity Board did. Came in here and found no paper, It is to its eternal discredit that it was the Bus is going I cannot linger. . . " only board in Queensland who adopted this And then there were some indecipherable blackmailing practice. words and something about a finger. We are I agree where a man will not pay for his getting all those extracts cleaned off the electric light and power that the Townsville walls, so that, if the Royal visitor on this Regional Electricity Board has a right not to occasion thinks it worth her while to come supply it; just the same as any other trader down to the broom cupboard, at least it will has the right not to continue to supply goods be reasonably clean and will not resemble to a customer who will not pay for them. the room that I am sure it was before it was To cut off the light and power and leave a roughly knocked into shape for the hon. man in Stygian darkness and perhaps with­ member for Burdekin and me. out cooking facilities, not because he did not Because we have a post office in Parlia­ pay for the power supplied but because of ment House, and it is only right that we some argument over the purchase of an should, members of the public can use the article on time payment is a different matter. post office. That is not generally known, but I repeat on behalf of the people of the Towns­ the post office of Parliament House belongs ville area, ''Thank you, Ernie Evans, for to the Postmaster-General who is a Minis­ doing something that Labour Ministers of ter of the Federal Government, and it would the Crown did not have the guts to do in be against the laws of the Commonwealth the interests of the little people." Government to put a post office in Parlia­ ment House purely and simply for the use and A Government Member interjected. benefit of hon. members. In order to get a post office here in the early days, I am Mr. AIKENS: I believe in giving credit informed that the condition that it would be where credit is due, just as members of the a public post office for the benefit and use of .A:.L.P. congratulated Ernie Evans on the all had to be agreed to. Hon. members introduction of the Miners' Pensions Bill. I know that quite a number of outsiders use would have done the same had I been here, this post office. I think they are rightly and I now congratulate him on behalf of entitled to do so, but many young people come the people in my area. I know that the in and, young people being as they are, legal eagles of the Liberal Party would not although perhaps not as bad as we were in support the putrid act of blackmail perpe­ our young days, they scratch the walls and trated by Townsville Regional Electricity scrawl notes on them. These scratches and Board. scrawls could be covered with a coat of paint. Next year we are to have a Royal visitor. We have had Her Majesty the Queen and the Mr. Mann: You are talking a lot of Queen Mother, and next year we are to have nonsense. Princess Alexandria or Marina or some other Mr. AIKENS: I may be talking a lot member of the Royal Family. While I do of nonsense, but the hon. member for Bris­ not want to appear to be snobbish, I draw bane was the Speaker who put the hon. mem­ thP. attention of Mr. Speaker and hon. mem­ ber for Burdekin and me in the broom cup­ bers on the House Committee to the dilapi­ board. I have learned since that was an dated condition of the corridors of the House. error on the part of the messenger. The They are becoming badly scratched and hon. member for Brisbane told the messenger dirty. While I am not in favour of spending to put the hon. member for Burdekin and me too much money in order to maintain pomp in the room at the end of the Alice Street and ceremony, I think a coat of paint in corridor, but the messenger put us in the room at the end of George Street corridor. If the corridors and in some of the rooms would we .had gone to the room at the end of the not go astray. Alice Street corridor, the surroundings would Prior to the visit of Her Majesty the have been exactly the same, but they would Queen, the hon. member for Burdekin and I have been more modern, we would have had more room, and incidentally would have had took steps to clean the room we occupy, which facilities there to polish our shoes. we were informed was originally a broom cup­ board. Prior to the visit of Her Majesty, I hope the Minister for Transport, if he WP. took out the box of sawdust and also can or is allowed by those who subscribe to Section 92 of the Commonwealth Constitu­ removed from behind the door a big printed tion and its omnipotent powers, will favour ~ign, ''Please adjust dress before leaving.'' the House during this Session with a clear We are now busy cleaning from the walls the and detailed statement as to what he pro­ pencilled extracts from the works of various poses to do to get order out of chaos in the poets that have been pencilled there over the present road transport set-up, and also what years. One I cleaned off this morning touched he proposes to do to see that the railways 614 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

are not scrapped, as the oil companies, the Commonwealth. No-one from Victoria or motor companies, and other companies desire. New South Wales registered a word of dis­ sent. lt took somebody from a small State Mr. CONNOLLY (Kurilpa) (3.40 p.m.): to express opposition. All the others seemed I congratulate the Ministry and particularly to think that State Parliaments are similar the Treasurer on the presentation of a bold to local authorities whose function it is to and imaginative Budget. In particular I carry out the policy of the Federal Govern­ should like to say how heartened I am per­ ment. sonally to see that provision is made in the Budget for the re-institution of an inter­ ln terms of some encomium, the report re­ mediate jurisdiction in this State and that cites a statement by a former Attorney­ district courts at long last will be brought General, Senator Spicer, who is now Chief back. Queensland is no long a hill-billy Judge of the Commonwealth Arbitration State; we have become one of the major Court, in answer to a question in the Senate. States of the Commonwealth. We cannot hope ln answer to a question suggesting that there to take our proper place in the Federal should be a new constitutional convention, he system if our courts are not up to doing the made this remarkable statement- job the people of the State require of them. '' What is overlooked these days is the We cannot function with archaic or hill-billy fact that this Parliament is in truth a lower courts. Despite the fact that the Gov­ continuing convention of the people of ernment are finding it difficult to provide all Australia to consider amendments to the the funds needed for present requirements of Constitution.'' the State they still recognise the obligation 'l'hat is the first time I have heard that said. to provide the people with the satisfactory The Parliament of the Commonwealth has system of courts which is most heartening. certain functions under the Australian Con­ stitution, and the notion that the primary Since we last met a very important docu­ responsibility for reviewing that Constitution ment has been presented to the two Houses is reposed in the l<'ederal Parliament is one of the Parliament of the Commonwealth. It that we should do well to eradicate from the is the report of the Joint Committee on. minds of our colleagues in Canberra. Constitutional Review, an all-party committee that was appointed from both Houses of the Senator Spicer went on to say- Federal Parliament to consider proposals '' If, as a result of our deliberations, we for the amending of the Federal Constitution. reach agreement on matters, upon which no I commend the report most earnestly to the doubt it will be necessary to be in agree­ attention of all hon. members. I think that ment, then we shall have gone a long way every hon. member should read it carefully. indeed along the road to getting a desirable It reveals the alarming extent to which the constitutional reform.'' hon. members of the Federal Houses of Par­ Over my dead body! liament are able to reach substantial agree­ :nent when it comes to a question of enlarg­ Brisbane's most responsible daily news­ mg the powers of the Federal Parliament. paper said in an editorial that the Federal Attorney-General was to be complimented on lllr. Aikens: At the expense of the having achieved such a large measure of States. agreement among parliamentary colleagues of all shades of political opinion. His success lUr. CONNOLLY: Of course, at the was no more remarkable than it would be to expense of the States. I propose to examine succeed in persuading all the small boys at this report in detail because I think it is a Christmas party that there should be an­ a matter which everyone should take a good other cake on the table. They all want to deal of notice of. Before coming to the have their fingers in the pie, and naturally substance of the recommendations let me all members of the Federal Parliament be­ say that the committee sat in camera. I lieve that the powers of that Parliament call attention to the reason for it. It was cannot be too wide. said it was not possible to gain agreement on the question of whether or not there should l\Ir. Hanlon: Do you believe that the Federal Parliament is duplicating much of be full legislative power in the Federal Par­ the work that can be done better by the liament. As hon. members opposite know their party in the Federal sphere believe~ States~ that there should be only one Parliament in ~Ir. CONNOLLY: The whole basis of this country and that it should be at Can­ the Federal system is that some things are berra. We who believe in the Federal system done better by the States while others are think that that is a hopeless attitude to done better by the Commonwealth. take up. We think that many hon. members opposite do not really believe in that policy If the report to which I refer meets with of their Federal party. The committee con­ general approval, we might just as well close sidered that its work would be better advanced down. Indeed, it may well be that the if proceedings were not conducted in public. death knell of the Federal system has already So far as one can see the gentlemen who been sounded. comprised the committee agreed, with the I wish now to refer to a recent decision sole exception of Senator Wright of Tasmania, of the High Uourt on the second occasion on and I want hon. members to note that Tas­ which the question of the validity of the mania is one of the peripheral States of the system of uniform taxation was before it. Supply. [14 OCTOBER.] Supply. 615

The point of principle is of fundamental im­ the other to have a Senate in existence as portance here. Hon. members know that the a means of harassing or delaying the activities present system in point of law is that the of its political opponents in the House of :E'ederal Parliament levies all income taxation Representatives. Whether that is a sufficient and gives back to the State by reimbursement justification for burdening the people with grants what it thinks they need. That is the cost of retaining the Senate is debatable. done under Section 96 of the Commonwealth The point I want to make is that the members Constitution, which empowers the Federal of the Federal Parliament so far recognise Parliament to make grants to the States. that state of affairs that, without a qualm, I should like hon. members to listen to this Committee of Constitutional Review this brief statement of the reasons of the makes recommendations the effect of which High Court for saying that uniform taxation would be to force the Senate into a joint is valid. This is the opinion of the Chief sitting with the House of Representatives in Justice, Sir Owen Dixon, and Mr. Justice case of disagreement and so whittle down Kitto, and also of Mr. Justice Taylor, almost to nothing the delaying power of the although in different language- Senate. I am not saying that I do not think that in the circumstance~, in the political '' Section 96 is susceptible of very wide atmosphere of 1958, it would do any particular construction and it would empower the Com­ harm, but let us remember, as point No. 1, monwealth to impose as a condition of the that the salient safeguard that the founders grant of financial assistance to a State of the Constitution gave to the States as a requirement that in the exercise of the State's governmental powers it shall con­ against the Central Government-the indepen­ form with the desires of the Commonwealth dent Senate, the States' rights house-has in relation thereto." ceased to function to such an extent that one can barely get a Federal Member of Parlia­ That means that as long as the uniform taxa­ ment to worry himself about any cutting tion system applies-and it looks as if it will down of the functions of the Senate. apply forever-any grant of money by the Commonwealth to the States can be made Indeed, they make a subsidiary recommen­ on the condition that the sovereign legis­ dation. As hon. members know, from time to lative, and indeed, executive powers of the time for one unfortunate reason or another a States are exercised in conformity with the vacancy may occur in the Senate. An hon. wishes of the Parliament and Executive Gov­ member may die. The State Parliament ernment in Canberra. Hon. members would or the Executive Council-! think 1 am right do well to ask themselves what real purpose about that; anyway, it is the State-replaces they will serve by sitting and deliberating here if the Federal Government and the that Senator for the time being. The practice Federal Parliament really take it into their has grown up that, if, for example, a Labour heads to give effect to their legal powers. Senator from Queensland died, this Govern­ ment would in proper constitutional practice The gentlemen who comprised this com­ no doubt appoint a member of the Australian mittee-who were of course senators and Labor Party to take his place. If the Senate members of the House of Representatives­ is supposed to be a House which represents addressed themselves initially to matters the views of this State and the attitude of affecting the Commonwealth legislative this State Government at Canberra, that machinery and one of them was disagreement practice is entirely wrong. I suggest for the between the Senate and the House of consideration of hon. members that the report Representatives. Hon. members will not be of the joint committee concedes that the surprised to hear that recommendations that Senate is virtually a dead letter, that it is in involved serious whittling down of the powers effect a luxury. As to whether or not we can of the Senate were unanimously agreed to. afford it as a Commonwealth I do not intend When I say unanimously, I again except to comment_ Certainly the Commonwealth Senator Wright. The States-we in this Government seems to be able to afford many Parliament-have, or should have, if the rather expensive things. Constitution is functioning properly, an inter­ est in the Senate because the whole notion of Now we come to the crux of the report, the Senate when it was instituted was that it that is, whether additional legislative power was a chamber to protect the State, a cham­ should be given to the Commonwealth ber in which each State had equal numbers Parliament. I venture to describe the pages irrespective of its population. Tasmania, as of this repOTt as disingenuous, as deliber­ we all know, has as many senators as New ately creating an atmosphere favourable to South Wales. All political parties have made the extension of the power of the Common­ a mockery of that constitutional safeguard wealth Pariiament. The committee com­ because the Senate has divided along party mences this section of their report in these lines. I suppose it is too late now in the words- history of Australia to say that that should " It seems to be a widespread miscon­ not have happened. For that reason it ception that the grant of an additional is very questionable whether the Senate legislative power to the Commonwealth really fulfils a useful constitutional Parliament necessarily involves a with­ function in Canberra. From time to drawal of power from the States. Most time, because of the accidents of current of the legislative powers vested in the party politics it may suit one party or Commonwealth Parliament are known as 616 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

concurrent powers, that is to say, they do rather than in favour of centralisation. The not belong exclusively to that Parliament larger the States grow the more is the but are also retained by the States." pressure on the time of Ministers and That is perfectly true in point of law. It Parliaments to give proper care and atten­ is also perfectly true in point of law that by tion to the requirements of the communities virtue of Section 109 of the Commonwealth which make up the States. When the popula­ Constitution when the Commonwealth Parlia­ tion is 20,000,000 it will be even less com­ ment legislates upon a subject so as to show petent for the Parliament at Canberra that it intends by its legislation to cover adequately to administer the country than it the field, that excludes the States from is now. legislating in that field. While it is true to lUr. Walsh: The States and the local say that many of the powers given to the authorities really shouldered the respon­ Federal Parliament are concurrent powers, sibility for the development of this country. it is also equa:lly true to say that as soon as the Commonwealth Parliament likes to do JUr. CONNOLLY: That is so. If the it, it can legislate us right out of the field. Federal Parliament or the members who sub­ The power to levy taxation is not a power scribe to this document have their way we whieh is exclusive to the Commonwealth will be reduced to the position of local Parliament at all. It is a power which, authorities. According to the view they take, in point of law, is possessed by both the wherever the concurrence of a State Parlia­ Parliament in Canberra and the Parliaments ment is required it should be siaetracked by of the States. We know the history of the taking a referendum of the people. The Commonwealth Parliament wherein they have matter of new States is one. They say that adopted a device by a set of Acts of it is undemocratic for the Parliament of the Parliament to obtain exclusive control State to be consulted. They do not think over income tax. Having legislated in that it is undemocratic to have a discretion as to field the Commonwealth Parliament has whether they accept the wishes of the people forced us right out of the field. For the at the referendum. They say they should not Committee of Constitutional Reform to say, need to consult the Parliament of the States. gently, as it were, "Nobody need be afraid Hon. members may wonder in all innocence of giving extra power to us here in Canberra how this was thrown together. Under the because after all we exercise it only con­ heading of "National Development" the com­ currently witli the States'' is something less mittee discusses briefly the provision of than frank. Once these gentlemen get their capital works in this country. One gets the hands on another power it is only a matter impression that they completely accept the of time before, if they choose to do so, they idea that they are the main Government of can occupy that legislative field to the exclu­ this country and the rest of us are here to sion of this Chamber and of the Parliaments administer the grants made by the Federal of the other five States of Australia. There Government. are people who believe that we should not have a Federal system but that we should have Mr. Gair: The States are regarded as one Parliament of the Commonwealth, one kindergartens. legislative authority for the whole of Mr. CONNOLLY: I endorse the hon. Australia. These views are all arguable. member's remark. They do not even seek Personally I am strongly in favour of the to justify some of these things. They say Federal system but we should not be deluded that most of the capital works and services by this sort of statement into thinking that undertaken by the States is financed by loan it does not matter a jot if we do give these funds and for the five financial years ending powers to Canberra. It matters a great 1956-57 the total loan expenditure on State deal. To justify the notion that a good deal capital works and services was £803,000,000. more power is required down there, there is Paragraph 84 says- a set of short essays on the development of this country since Federation, material which '' The Commonwealth has also been com­ I propose to describe as specious, with all mitted over recent years to a heavy respect to the gentlemen of all parties whose programme of a capital nature.'' signatures are appended to the report. First It gives the Commonwealth expenditure. The of all they refer to the growth of population. total expenditure over the past five financial It is perfectly true that there has been a years was £693,000,000, all of which has growth of population. They say that since come from the Consolidated Revenue Fund. the last war about 1,000,000 persons have Is it any wonder that one stands here and entered Australia as migrants, making them complains of the attitude of members of the about one-tenth the total population. They Federal Par1iamenU It is clearly the inten­ say, ''These people have no traditional ties tion that we should be put on a ration of with any of the States.'' It is obviously money, of resources, and in terms of Section designed to create the atmosphere that at 96 of the Constitution, as interpreted by the the time of Federation people had traditional High Court, the Commonwealth may impose ties but now our primary loyalty goes to as a condition of the grant or financial Canberra. That is not so. The fact that assistance, a requirement that in the exercise there is a larger population now is probably a of the State's governmental powers it shall strong argument in favour of the decentralisa­ conform to the desires of the Commonwealth ation of legislative power and administration in relation thereto. Supply. [14 OcTOBER.] Supply. 617

They want power in respect of scientific want unlimited power over industrial con­ progress, transport and communications. It ditions, so far as I am able to understand may well be that some of these things are it. It reads- justified. '' The Commonwealth Parliament should, We next get a statement or an essay on subject to the Constitution, have power to the emergence of the national economy. make laws for the peaoo, order and good There could not be anything else since 1942. government of the Commonwealth with In the case Sou.th Australia v. The Common­ respect to terms and conditions of indus­ wealth in 1942 the High Court held that the trial employment.'' Commonwealth's set of Acts of Parliament, I realise that there may be an argument in their statutory devices, four interlocking Acts favour of saying that this power or that to squeeze the States out of the income tax power should be transferred to Canberra from field, was not invalid as being an attack on the States, as no doubt there could be argu­ the sovereign functioning of the States. ments in favour of certain powers being transferred back from Canberra to the Mr. Lloyd: The decision of the High States, but I want hon. members to know the Court seems to depend on the composition of extent of the recommendations made by these the bench of the High Court. gentlemen, and all parties are involved. Their recommendations continue- Mr. CONNOLLY: That is the law as laid down by the High Court, and has been '' Corporations. the law since 1942. It was tested again, in The Commonwealth Parliament should 1957, in the case Victoria v. The Common­ have power to make laws with respect to wealth, the headnote of which I have read corporations.'' twice. In those circumstances what other sort of economy could we have except a national That may or may not be a reasonable proposi­ tion, standing alone, but it is linked with economy~ unlimited power oYer conditions of employ· lUr. Walsh: The High Court latterlY ment. did say that the Commonwealth Government In regard to marketing of primary pro­ did not have a prior right to the collection ducts, they have to get round Section 92 of of tax. the Commonwealth Constitution. }lr. CONNOLLY: The hon. member is Jlir. Power interjected. quite right, but it is a cold comfort. lUr. CONNOLLY: I am not saying that Mr. Walsh: I realise that. I made last an argument cannot be advanced piecemeal year the point you are now making, in my for some of these things. By the time we speech about Section 96 of the Common­ add up all the recommendations it would be wealth Constitution. time for us to pack up our traps and go illr. CONNOLLY: The hon. member for home. I refer now to economic power-the Bundaberg is quite right. recommendation is that the Common­ wealth Parliament should have power There are two devices in that set of Acts. to make laws with respect to the issue, There may be more but, as I recall the Acts, allotment or subscription of capital and the there are two devices. There was one pro­ borrowing of money whether upon security or vision that it was unlawful for a citizen to without security, by corporations which pay State tax before his Federal tax. That engage, or may engage in production, trade, provision has been held not to be valid, but commerce or other economic activities. it is cold comfort, because the main structure of the uniform taxation setup is this: the I remind hon. members of the views of some Commonwealth Government levy the tax, they of us about the activities of hire-purchase make grants back to a State on condition that corporations, the way they conduct their the State does not levy income tax. From the businesses and the rates of interest charged viewpoint of practical politics no State and the terms and conditions under which Treasurer could say, "I know that Federal they lend money. Many of us do not like income tax stands at such-and-such a figure, the way they conduct their businesses, but we but we will levy ours and see who gets to have seen no strong signs of disapproval from the citizen :first. " Canberra. The Commonwealth want to occupy the legislative :field with respect to hire­ Mr. Gair: There is no :field left to him. purchase legislation. Mr. CONNOLLY: Quite so. In the matter of interstate road transport there is a sop to the States. The suggestion That is the position as a matter of law. is made that the Constitution shouid be A citizen cannot be forbidden to pay his State altered to authorise the States, notwithstand­ tax before his Federal tax, but the system is ing Sectio...IJ. ~2 of the Constitution, to so completely tied up and quite legally under impose charges in respect of the carr-iage the Commonwealth Constitution that the interstate by road of persons and goods. Let States cannot levy income tax. it be noted, incidentally, that this function That being the position into which the is to be given to the States. Why' Why Federal Government have legislated them· should this come to the States instead of selves let us see what more they want. They being dealt with at Canberraf The answer 618 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply. is that it is a hard matter to deal with; it authority. But how can you, when the Com­ involves a lot of fuss and bother and is a monwealth Government have the whip hand nuisance. The Commonwealth want us to do and have to be persuaded to relinquish it~ all the work. is suggested that the It The report proceeds- charges to be imposed in respect of the carriage of interstate trade by road should '' The Committee felt, however, that it be approved by the Interstate Commission. should consider whether constitutional The suggestion has some merit. At present, changes could be made to give the States as hon. members know we can impose road greater financial responsibilities, but it maintenance charges, but we take the risk found itself unable to ascertain whether whether the charges we impose are reasonable, any particular course of action proposed and that the Court may hold, if the charges would assist in solving more important Commonwealth-State financial problems and are challenged, 1tha:t the charges are not reasonable. We have to take the risk of at the same time be acceptable to all or collecting the money and being told some five most of the States and the Commonwealth.'' or six years later that the charges we imposed In most of the recommendations, there has were not reasonable charges and being ordered been no attempt to ascertain whether they to give the money back. The proposal is a would be acceptable to all or any of the sensible one. The granting of such States. power notwithstanding Section 92 of The Committee very tearfully concludes- the Commonwealth Constitution is not an '' Thus, although the Committee was pre­ unreasonable one at all. We sadly need pared to deal fully with any constitutional stronger powers to control the people using aspects of the inter-governmental financial our highways and in particular, the inter­ problem, it was unable to do so and it state haulier and the man who puts up a regretfully reports accordingly.'' placard over his van stating, ''I am an inter­ That is the whole crux of the present crisis state haulier'' and continues to conduct his that exists in the Federal system. The power affairs as before. He knows full well that of the purse resides in Canberra to such an we have not the machinery or the police to extent that unless some solution of the Com­ catch him. We have not the machinery to monwealth-States - financial relationship is catch those who commit these offences, and achieved, the Federal system is a Federal so that is one recommendation with which system in name alone. That that is the view I personally agree. of members of the Federal Parliament is I come now to Section IX of the report borne out by the Committee's recommenda­ dealing with the financial relations between tions on the formation of new States. Hon. the Commonwealth and the States. I might members know that broadly the Common­ suspect, if I were not cynical, that a serious wealth Constitution provides for the creation examination of this problem might have led of new States and that it is a pre-requisite to to some useful recommendations. It was said the formation of a new State by separation that there were many indications to the from an existing State that the consent of Committee in the course of its inquiries of the Parliament of that State be obtained. dissatisfaction with the present state of Clause 166 of the report says that in the financial arrangements between the Common­ opinion of the Committee- wealth and the States. "The view was '' ... the Constitution should provide an repeatedly expressed that it was necessary opportunity for the people to determine the for the States to have a greater measure of question whether a new State should be financial independence and increased responsi­ formed. If a majority of electors both in bilities in the raising of revenue for State the area of a proposed new State and in purposes. The Committee concluded that the State as a whole support the formation some action was needed to improve the posi­ of a new State, it should not require the tion and that it should be prepared to recom­ approval of the Parliament of the State mend Constitutional changes if any should before the new State can be established as be found necessary.'' That is all very a member of the Commonwealth.'' illuminating. The Committee recommended that the Com­ The report continues- monwealth Parliament should have power to '' Searching inquiries indicated, in the form a new State by separation of territory opinion of the Committe, that current dis­ from a State or by the union of two or more content largely stemmed from arrangements States. In effect, the Committee's recom­ made within the constitutional framework, mendation is that a union of this State wlth as for example, in relation to the imposi­ New South Wales could be effected following tion of income taxation, which, if the Com­ a referendum of the people of both States, monwealth and the States were to agree, thus by-passing the Parliaments of those could probably be adjusted without the States. need for constitutional amendment.'' Mr. Cob urn: Could that be done now Of course it could be. If I may continue my with a referendum~ analogy, if two small boys both had their hands on a cake and you could get them to Mr. CONNOLLY: Under the existing agree who was to have how much of it, of Commonwealth Constitution there must be course it would be possible to reach agree­ concurrence of the Parliament of the State ment without the imposition of any outside and the people of the State. Supply. [14 OcTOBER.] Supply. 619

All those fine words about democratic prin­ Victoria were combined, I should say that ciple being sufficiently satisfied if the people the odds of getting certain types of constitu­ vote on the matter are used only as a means tional amendment through half the States of by-passing the Parliaments of the States. should be fairly good. The report further In the proposals that have been recommended, says- however, there is no obligation on the Com­ '' The Committee recommends that Sec­ monwealth Parliament to accept a new State tion 128 of the Constitution shauld be if it does not choose to do so. The people altered to provide that a proposed law to­ can vote unanimously in support of it until alter the Constitution which has at present they are black in the face, but those who to be approved in a majority of the States support the Committee's report will not Le by a majority of the electors voting and obliged to be bound thereby. In other words, by a majority of all the electors voting we as a Parliament-" we" in the widest before it can be submitted for the Royal sense as the State Parliaments of the Com­ assent, should be submitted for the Royal monwealth-are treated by Canberra, by the assent if it has been approved by a representatives of the people, the Federal majority of all the electors voting and by representatives of all parties down there, as a majority of the electors voting in at far as one can see, as Parliaments whose day least one half of the number of States.'' is done, whose views on these matters are In other words, if the amendment were passed superfluous in the year 1958. in three States that would probably get it Last but not least we have a section on through. When you think of the weight of alteration of the Constitution. This Commit­ population of Victoria and New South Wales, tee, which has been sitting for some years Mr. Chairman, if ;vou could swing the referen­ but which reported sadly somewhere else dum in those States and in Queensland, or that it had not had time to finish its report, in, say, South Australia, you would probably has not shrunk from making recommenda­ have the majority of all electors in the tions on a change in the method of altering Commonwealth. the Commonwealth Constitution, the organic Personally, I find this a disquieting docu­ document under which the Federal Parlia­ ment, not because such views are advanced­ ment itself exists and which governs the after all, it is a free country and people are relations between that Parliament and this entitled to have what views they like and to Parliament, which governs the relations of advance them-but that they should be the Federal Parliament, the Federal Execu­ advanced with such unanimity by members of tive and the Federal courts with the people all parties, that they should be advanced by of Australia. The report states- members of the Federal Houses without, as it " The Committee acknowledges the vital were, any feeling that they are proposing interest of the people in proposed constitu­ virtually to abolish the Parliaments of the tional alterations, and considers that if a State, the sovereign Parliaments, even in law. clear majority of electors who vote at a Many of us have spoken for some years now referendum are in favour of a proposed about the serious implications of the 1942 law, their will should not be frustrated decision of the High Court and the transfer because separate majorities of electors have of the power to raise revenue to the Parlia­ not been obtained in a majority of the ment at Canberra. Such is the shortness of States.'' memory that many of the people who went Let me refresh the memory of hon. members. into the Federal Parliament since 1942 have Before an alteration can be made to the become so accustomed to the pre-eminence Constitution it must be passed by a majority in all fields of the Federal Parliament and of electors in a majority of the States. the Federal Executive that they can advance Plainly the object of the founding fathers in this sort of document without realising that inserting that sort of provision into the Corn· they are taking an axe to the Constitution monwealth Constitution was to ensure that of this country. As I say, I commend this the smaller States should not be swamped by report to the earnest study of hon. members the opinions and policies and pressures in the on both sides of the Chamber, not for its great centres of population in the South. contents and recommendations, as I cannot endorse a word of it except Senator Mr. Hanlon: That is a more funda­ Wright's contribution which appears in mental safeguard than the Senate, isn't it, Annexure "B"-Senator Wright comes from for the State~ a small State and he is frightened of what might happen-but because all hon. mem­ Mr. CONNOLLY: The Senate has bers should know how unblushingly members ceased to be a useful safeguard. At least of the Federal Houses of Parliament are we still have our relatively inflexible Con­ able to set their signatures to a document the stitution, a Constitution which can be altered recommendations of which, if accepted at a only if there is a clear desire on the part of general referendum, would write the epitaph the people of this country and of the States of the Federal system. of this country to alter it. In a bare ten lines these gentlemen propose to do away Mr. LLOYD (Kedron) ( 4.27 p.m.) : The with that and to substitute a requirement hon. member for Kurilpa has given us the that the passing of the proposed amendment usual dissertation of the legal brain in disa­ by a majority of electors in half the States greement with any extension or expansion of shall be sufficient, If New South Wales and the powers of the Commonwealth Government 620 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply. over and above the States. I do not know Mr. Walsh: I think a convention was why, but it always appears that legal men held in 1943. are of the same opinion about Section 92 of the Commonwealth Constitution. I do not Mr. LLOYD: It was in 1943 that John know whether it is because of their own Curtin called a convention of all State profits which naturally accrue :from the legal Premiers and Leaders of the Opposition. I battles between the States and the Common­ point out, :for the information of the hon. wealth, individuals, manu:facturers-- member :for Kurilpa, that that convention made a number of recommendations for the Mr. Connolly: Because it prevented the transfer of more power to the Commonwealth. socialisation of the banks, that is why. Unfortunately, the Liberal Party refused to lUr. LLOYD: I think the statement made support those decisions at the referendum by the hon. member :for Kurilpa would not which followed. If it had been carried many be completely in line with the thought of of our present difficulties would not have many people in business in Australia at the arisen. present time. We see at the moment the dis­ The Treasurer has applied a number of membering of the Commonwealth Bank as a names to the Budget, one of which was result of the attitude of other Governments "simplified Budget". In my opinion it is which are at all times attempting to sell out a dangerous Budget, not for the reason that the assets of the people against the better we are spending so much money, but :for the living standards of the general population reason that we are taking from our reserves by allowing the finances of the country to be and offsetting the balance in the Consolidated controlled. Many people, particularly prim­ Revenue Account. ary producers, are thinking that without Section 92 even the nationalisation of banks JUr. Walsh: That will not make a scrap might have been preferable to the system of difference. operating in Australia at the present time. In any case the report quoted by the hon. Itir. LLOYD: It will not. I was about member for Kurilpa is based on very sound to make the point. The Treasurer, by the investigations. As a matter of :fact the all­ use of a double-entry bookkeeping system, party members of that committee were has attempted to mislead the public and this praised by people who were witnesses before Committee by implying that the Common­ the committee. The considerable amount of wealth Grants Commission will consider that legal and other knowledge demonstrated by the affairs of Queensland are in a much the members of the committee shows that worse position than they are at present. their considerations must be of some great It has taken 99 years of parliamentary benefit to the people. The matter of the government in this State to accumulate a powers between the States and the Common­ deficit or an overdraft balance in the Con­ wealth is a very important one. Hon. mem­ soliilated Revenue Account of £5,200,000. bers should realise the great good that could Some of the previous deficits, of course, have result :from the transference of some powers been funded. I think about £7,000,000 or from the States to the Commonwealth in £8,000,000 has been funded. order to bring about uniformity and ensure that every person paid for the service which Mr. Walsh: Most of that because of the he used. Moore Government. JUr. Gair: We have so few powers Mr. LLOYD: Yes, and that is occurring today. in other States, the claimant States. Tas­ mania has had to fund £2,000,000 of deficits Mr. LLOYD: We have not many powers in the last 10 years, and when the size of left. It looks as though we shall never get our Tasmania's Budget is taken into considera­ taxation powers back, therefore it is all the tion, that is a considerable amount. Tas­ more important that we should re-examine mania this year funded a deficit of £811,000, the powers we have to find out exactly what as against £818,000 last year. Queensland our administrative powers are. We have what will be in an identical position. By one is generally recognised as a racket in trans­ stroke of the pen the reserve balances avail­ port. Motor vehicle registration is now higher able at the moment, will be destroyed, reserves here than in any other State. which were there for spending gradually Itlr. Walsh: Do you not think that a throughout the years in the alleviation of convention of representatives of all the States unemployment and the creation of services would be a better approach to this matter~ :for the people. That policy can only be described as dangerous. Mr. LLOYD: I do believe that. The hon. member will probably remember the The explanation given by the Treasurer is occasion on which I had the privilege of that we will be able to approach the Common­ moving a Private Member's Motion, and dur­ wealth Grants Commission as a claimant ing the debate we criticised the appointment State. Let us examine the case put forward of an all-party committee :from the Federal by the Treasurer. He has deliberately misled Parliament. I then said that it would be the Committee on the cost of social services. much better if we had a committee com­ With his background and experience hon. posed of representatives of State Parliaments members expect from him :fulfilment of his and the Commonwealth. The Constitution promise of accuracy and a genuine state­ was framed by an interstate convention. ment of the State's accounts, but he has Supply. [14 OcTOBER.] Supply. 621 attempted to mislead the Committee. The make a very close analysis of our claim as Budget contains figures which indicate a it has done with every other claim put before certain state of affairs in the provision of it. social services. When those figures are com­ This year the claim by the claimant States pared with the figures in the 25th report was approximately £23,000,000, and in all of the Commonwealth Grants Com- cases, except one, the final allocation by the mission considerable discrepancies are Commonwealth Grants Commission was revealed. We must pay regard to the Com­ changed. The amounts stated as being mission's statement on this sUibject. It required to balance the Budgets were- realises that it is virtually impossible pre­ South Australia £5,342,000 cisely to compare expenditure on social services in each State. On page 120 of the 25th Western Australia . . £12,544,000 report the Commonwealth Grants Commission Tasmania £5,546,000 sets out net figures not only for expendi­ In actual fact, the Commonwealth Grants ture from consolidated revenue but also Commission, on a comparison of the budget­ from reserve funds. At page 120 in Appendix ary of the non-claimant States made the No. 16 certain figures are given. There is recommendation that those States should a discrepancy between those figures and the receive the following amounts:- figures given by the Treasurer. For instance, South Australia £5,250,000 the figure used by the Treasurer for expendi­ Western Australia . . £11,100,000 ture per capita in 1956-1957 on social services Tasmania £4,400,000 in Queensland was £19 13s. 4d. While the Commonwealth Grants Commission admits The basis upon which it was made was on the t.hat it is difficult to get a precise comparison 1956-1957 butgetting of the States, with an or complete accuracy, the figure used by adjustment to bring the accounting prac­ that Commission is £18 12s. tices to a common basis. That brought Queensland's £15,000 surplus up to £467,000. There is considerable discrepancy between Queensland was one of the more financial the 'I'reasurer 's figure and the Commonwealth States of the Commonwealth at that time. Grants Commission figure for South Australia. Victoria, at the time, had a very different An entirely different picture is revealed. The budgetary result because it showed a deficit Treasurer gave the figure as £20 17s. 4d., of between £3,000,000 and £4,000,000. The whereas the Commonwealth Grants Commis­ corrected budgetting upon which the Commis­ sion figure in the last report was £17 17 s. 8d. sion made its recommendation was on the As against an all-States average of deficit between the three non-claimant States £21 16s. lld., as set out in the Budget, the of 3s. per capita. Take Queensland out and Commonwealth Grants Commission figure is we have a deficit of approximately 7s. per £19 4s. 4d. That represents a discrepancy capita. of approximately £2 in the per capita figure. Mr. Hiley: If we had claimed, we would These matters are of very great impor­ have got more and South Australia, Western tance to the public and to Parliament. We Australia and Tasmania would have got less~ should be given a detailed survey so that we can either oppose the attitude adopted Mr. L.LOYD: No. The clalmant States bv the Treasurer or take some other action would receive enough in grants to enable about it. them to budget for a larger deficit. There are more complications to it I have already stated that the system to than that. Motor vehicle taxation is be adopted will not convince the Comm.on­ not taken into consideration in Queens· wealth Grants Commission that Queensland's land, and without motor taxation Queensland position is in any way different. By one is one of the lowest taxed States in the stroke of the pen reserves of £6,000,000 are to Commonwealth. Prior to uniform taxation be destroyed, more or less in five minute, and Queensland was the highest taxed State in it is retrospective to 30 June, 1958. It is the Commonwealth, but now it has become not going to convince the Commonwealth one of the lowest. Grants Commission that we in actual fact are The reduction in land tax could also affect a mendicant State. We have to consider the figures given by the Leader of the Opposi­ Queensland's case before the Commonwealth Grants Commission. The same remarks apply tion when he indicated that Queensland's finan­ to the increase in motor vehicle taxation. cial position was not as bad, perhaps, as the Many factors have to be taken into considera­ financial position of the other States. Are tion. we to take it for granted that the claimant States will be given each year an amount of I do not think we shall achieve a great deal money from the Commonwealth, in addition from our application to become a claimant to the tax reimbursement grant, and other State. Since uniform taxation, Victoria has revenue, on the basis of a comparison of the had an accumulated deficit of £13,000,000. budgetary position of the non-claimant That is very different from the budget result States and the standard of social service in Queensland and some of the other States, expenditure in the non-claimant States, and There is sure to be violent opposition from the standard which the Treasurer has not Victoria. mentioned--our own non-income taxation~ What might be achieved, however, The Commonwealth Grants Commission will could be a complete revision of the 622 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply. allocation of revenue payments by the Com­ was examined to see whether it would be monwealth Government to the States. I should possible for extra homes to be built with the like to hear from the Treasurer whether any sum appropriated each year. revision of the present formula upon which is based the tax reimbursement grants to the The extraordinary fact is that there is not States would affect Queensland detrimentally. a great deal of simplification in the Budget. The payments to Queensland by the Common­ I believe it to be a dangerous Budget. wealth Government are much higher than I suggest, too, that the Treasurer should those to either of the other two non-claimant give the Committ~e a clearer, a more concise, States. As a matter of fact, I think they are and a more accurate analysis of the case he exceeded only by the payments to Tasmania. intends to present to the Commonwealth I should like to hear a much more convincing Grants Commission in support of his applica­ case from the Treasurer than one of com­ tion. Costs have always been lower in Queens­ pletely destroying the State's cash balance", land, especially in the post-war years. The by transferring £5,200,000 to Consolidated Commonwealth Statistician's figures on the Revenue to offset accumulated deficits. We average wage indicate that the costs of pro­ have been very fortunate in the past in not viding services in Queensland would be con­ having to fund any of our deficits, which siderably lower than in the other States, tak­ would attract an interest charge of 8-?! per ing into account area and population. Natur­ cent. ally sparsity of population in a large area The Treasurer has said that this is a sim­ would add to costs but in actual costs Queens­ plified form of budget. One would expect land would have_ an advantage over other a simple budget to show things in a simple States. The Commonwealth Statistician sets way. For example, if there was a deficit for out the average wage level as £16.24 for the year of £1,500,000, one would expect that Queensland, £19.20 for New South Wales and it would be shown clearly and that there £19.13 for Victoria. As an indication that would be no complications. I think the the cost of living is much lower in Queens­ Treasurer will admit that there are still com­ land than in the rest of the Commonwealth, plications in the Budget. He has frequently the Commonwealth Arbitration Court's fig­ quoted figures from Trust and Special funds ures show that the basic wage in Queensland to show that moneys have been transferred is £12 3s. as against £13 14s. for New South there from Consolidated Revenue. That could Wales, £13 for Victoria, £13 7s. for Tasmania, have the effect of increasing the surplus or £12 16s. for South Australia and £13 1s. for reducing the deficit. Western Australia. An Op})OSitiou J'IIember: He himself has All these factors are taken into consiilera­ done the same thing. tion when analysing the accounts of an indi­ vidual State. The Commonwealth GrantR J'IIr. LLOYD: That is borne out by Commission has already made it clear that Table '' G'' on page 46 of the Tables relat­ wages, the level of income, does not affect ing to the Treasurer's Financial Statement. to a great extent the amount of State It shows the receipts and payments and cash revenues from non-income taxation within balances of all funds for the financial years the State. It is not a tax on income so it iR ended 30 June, 1957, and 30 June, 1958. We not affected by the lower cost of living, but find that there was an increase in the cash it has an effect on the cost of providing social balances at the end of the year of a little services for the State. more than £1,000,000, while a study of the Labour Governments of the past in Queens­ Trust and Special Funds shows that the sur­ land have been sympathetic to the problems plus of receipts over expenditure was of the people ana have attempted in their £2,500,000, and in the Loan Fund Account own way to play their part in stabilising at there was also a credit balance, whilst a least a part of the Australian economy_ wh_en deficit of £1,500,000 was shown in Consoli­ other States and the Commonwealth Govern­ dated Revenue. ment have allowed costs to spiral. Mr. Aikens: It is impossible to bring I have already given figures of the sur­ down one balance sheet for the State's pluses and deficits of the individual States. finances as is done by a trading firm. Since 1942-1943 the Commonwealth has shown a gross surplus of £314,458,000; New South J'IIr. LLOYD: I realise that, but I am Wales has shown a deficit of £7,818,000, Vic­ pointing out that the Budget is apparently toria a deficit of £10,000,000 and Queensland not as simple as we were led to believe. In a deficit of only £14,000. That is since uniform the Commonwealth Housing Fund and the taxation came into operation. Certainly we Housing Commission Fund we find an excess have been fortunate over the years in having of receipts over expenditure. The Treasurer reserves of cash balances with which we have has already told us about the £100,000 that been able to subsidise expenditure within the was transferred to co-operative building State. When we see that the average in New societies because it was impossible for the South Wales over the past 10 years has been Housing Commission to handle it. Apparently a per capita deficit of 5s. 6d., Ss. 11d. in the Housing Commission was also unable to Victoria and 1s. 2d. in Queensland we can handle the amount appropriated for it during realise the difficulties with which we will be the 12 months. So I suggest it is high time confronted in being accepted as a mendicant that the administration of the Commission State. In fact it appears very definite Supply. [14 OCTOBER.] Supply. 623 that the transfer of this money from our bal­ accumulated deficiH Would we not be able ances will not have any great effect on the to put up a more convincing ca.se to the Commonwealth Grants Commission. We must Commonwealth Grants Commission if we said remember that we will be faced with a deficit that in order to provide people with full of £1,500,000 at the end of this financial year. employment we had taken action along the lines I am suggesting~ lUr. Aikens: Only chicken feed. Mr. Hiley: If you have £500 credit with ~fr. LLOYD: It is only chicken feed, a bank and £4,000 debit with the same bank, certainly. It may be chicken feed if an what are you worth~ attempt is made to alleviate unemployment. While men are unemployed we must do our Mr. LLOYD: Are we any better off by best to spend as much money as we can­ having a nil deficit in the Consolidated even more than we can afford on some Revenue Account and having only £791,000 in occasions. Reserves, instead of having a cash balance of £6,000,000 which can be used at any time~ ~Ir. Hiley: You disagree with the argument presented by your Leader. ~Ir. Walsh: It is the actual cash value. ~Ir. LLOYD: No. The Leader of the lUr. LLOYD: That is correct. In many Opposition quoted the Treasurer's own state­ cases the Treasurer has not said from what ments made several years ago when he was funds the money is to be obtained. There replying to the Budget introduced by his was an expenditure last year of £1,600 from predecessor. He was quoting speeches made the Unemployment Insurance Fund. That by the present Treasurer, he was not in any is transferred to the Industries Assist­ wa:v criticising the fact that we are sus­ ance Board, for what purpose we do not taining a deficit this year. know. In the account this year we find Mr. Aikens: Those were the days of that the balance of the Unemployment full employment. Insurance Fund is to be utilised. According to the Act any portion of the fund can be ~Ir, LLOYD: Certainly. I am sure that transferred with the approval of Parliament there was one occasion when the Treasurer to the Post-war Reconstruction and Develop­ said that when there is prosperity within a ment Fund. We must examine it very care­ country a surplus should be budgeted for. fully. The money was contributed by the He was congratulating the Commonwealth employers, the employees, and the Government Government on having a surplus of during the depression years under emergency £110,000,000. He said that during times legislation. I understand that the money has of full employment we should certainly to be transferred to the Post-war Reconstruc­ budget for a surplus. tion and Development Fund. It was never Mr. Hiley: And in times of unemploy­ anticipated that the Post-war Reconstruction ment budget for a deficit. That is exactly and Development Fund would not be in what thA Commonwealth Government have existence. It is to be transferred to one done and that is exactly what we have done. fund so that it can become a book entry. JUr. Aikens: What does it matter where ~Ir, LLOYD: It was done before. The he gets the money as long as we keep the Leader of the Opposition referred to the men in employment~ spending of this money. In actual fact the Government's expenditure will be £101,000,000 lUr. LLOYD: It does not matter a damn. from Consolidated Revenue this year, with a There is more unemployment here now on a deficit of £1,500,000. The receipts thrown population basis than there is in any other in from the Post-War Reconstruction and State. When the seasonal industries finish Development Fund will increase the total the position may be worse. It is necessary receipts. that we plan ahead and give urgent con­ ~Ir. Aikens: What does it matter if we sideration to this problem. A completely go into the red for £3,000,000 as long as we callous attitude has been adopted towards keep people employed~ housing, which is one of the greatest needs of our people. An examination of the tables ~Ir. LLOYD: Instead of transferring shows that there was an under-spending last this money in one period of 12 months year in both housing funds. Members of the money which it has taken 99 years t; Opposition have asked many questions on accumulate, would it not be better to transfer this matter, some of which have been termed it to Consolidated Revenue over several years ''mischievous,'' but we did so because we to provide employment by its expenditure~ believe there is still a necessity for the If we were to go to the Commonwealth Grants building of State rental homes. There are Committee at the end of the year and say, many people who are unable to pay a deposit ''There is our expenditure. There is a deficit on a home. Two or three families are some­ this year of £1,500,000. We have an accumu­ times sharing one home. I think every hon. lated deficit of over £7,000,000 and cash member knows of cases where 10 or 12 balances only to the extent of £2,000,000 or people are living in a two- or three-room £3,000,000," is not that a better case to house. They cannot afford to pay a deposit, put up than to take this money away from but their requirements must be met. The any reserves we might have and just offset the basis of the Commonwealth-States Housing 624 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

Agreement was the provision of homes. I Mr. LLOYD: Many families cannot even cannot see why the Treasurer should be afford the rental of State homes. T11eir prob· proud to say that he has destroyed State !em is acute. In other States, I think Tas· landlordism. Some weeks ago I directed a mania and Western Australia, the system of qustion to the Treasurer regarding the rental rebates for people on low wages has number of State rental homes built in been continued. Queensland during the last three years. I accepted the figures that were given at the An A.L.P, :Member: How could a work­ ing man save £250 on the present basic time, but I now :find that there is a dis· crepancy. The number of State rental wage~ homes built by the Housing Commission for Mr. LLOYD: That is so, and how could the year 1957·1958 was given as 287. he save it when he is paying the present According to the :financial statement the rental of a State home. number of homes built for rental purposes I have always been puzzled by housing was not 287 but 134. What is the somce society advertisements suggesting three-bed· of those :figures W Who is making the room homes can be built for £2,500. Housing mistake~ It is important that the people Commission homes whether built by contract who want rental homes should know that or day labour are much dearer than that. rental homes represented less than 50 per Whether the type of structure is cheaper or cent. of the figure supplied by the Treasurer. different, I do not know, but some of the It is all very well to be proud of the fact contemporary-type dwellin,gs, sheeted with that all homes being constructed are being fibro-cement, are quite attractive. I ask the sold, if times were such that there was not Treasurer to examine the designs of Housing a demand for rental homes, but applicants Commission home to see if, without reducing are being knocked back every day of the the standard or the safety factor of those week by the Housing Commission. Many homes, they can be built at a lower cost than have been told that it is useless to submit at present. The cost factor together with the an application. Some who have been given increasing interest rate is causing great two or three extensions of time in which to concern to many people desiring to build. vacate a house and who do not know whether 'rhere is another point I should mention in they will be out in the street by the end relation to the apparent increase in Con· of the week are told by the Housing Cam· solidated Revenue expenditure on hospitals, mission that no homes can be provided. It because it is obvious this year there has been is all very well to be proud of the fact that an actual reduction in the value of expendi· State landlordism has been destroyed, but ture on hospitals and health services in this State according to the appropriation. In many homes are required by people who past years the Commonwealth advances to cannot afford to purchase them. the States to meet hospital benefits and tuber· In thP aspect of accuracy of information, culosis were credited to the Department of the figures in the Governor's opening Health and Home Affairs but this year the practice has been changed and the money is address-and I am not sure that they do not credited to Consolidated Revenue so that appear again in the Financial Statement­ there is in actual fact the same net expendi· include homes built in previous years. As ture this year as there was last year. With they have been sold this year, those homes the anticipated increase of almost £200,000 are included in the homes built for sale this in hospital patients' fees, and this is a sur· year. The figure given is not accurate, as it prisingly large amount to estimate in the includes three hundred homes built in pre­ light of previous experience, there is going vious years, although sold this year. to be a reduction in the value of the services given to hospitals this year as compared with There is a further reduction this year in former years. the housing allocation. The :first indication Dr. Noble: A lot of rot. of this policy came in the last financial year when there was an under spending of the Mr. LLOYD: I am sure the Minister is appropriation. There is a further reduction not happy with the allocation made to him this year. No doubt we could expect a slight this year. The figures are there. reduction, because 30 per cent. of the net lir. Hiley: It is the second biggest amount under the Commonwealth-States increase in the State. Housing Agreement will go to building soei· eties but I should not have expected that Mr. LLOYD: The figure is purely a there would be a reduction of approximately gross figure equivalent to the usual annual £1,000,000. Last year only 134 homes were increases in regard to administration, cost built for rental. The figure will be less this of materials, and so on. The Commonwealth contributions of £2,350,000 have not been year. I emphasise to the Treasurer that there erediteol to the de13artment. are still many people w.h.o cannot afford to purchase homes. The Treasurer has made a statement show· ing that expenditure on social services is :Mr. Aikens: They cannot even afford lower in Queensland than in the other States, the £250 deposit. and I should like him to inform us as to Supply. [14 OcTOBER.] Supply. 625

whether the impact of the subsidising of local Another part of the agreement says- authorities would have any great effect upon ''Such established discounts would be the expenditure on social services in Queens­ maximum discounts and need not neces­ land. That is a point to be considered. sarily be adopted in full by individual Queensland is the only State which to any manufacturers.'' extent subsidises local authorities, and I be­ Agreements such as that seem to be growing. lieve that portion of it would be applied to On page 29 of today's "Brisbane Tele­ improving the services to the people. graph'' we find an article headed, ''Secret Discounts on Large Orders is Claimed". There are many factors which do not make this Budget a simple one. The Treasurer I quote again from the paint manufacturers' appreciated this point and although he said agreement- it was a layman's budget and could be '' Discount 15 per cent. understood by layman he gave members of ''Storekeeper '2 ': Shall carry not less Parliament 14 days in which to study it. than 50 gallons stock in one-quarter gallon That was very kind of him. The cost struc­ size ••. ture of Queensland has caused the Treasurer ''Discount 20 per cent. some concern. lie has stated that increased ''Storekeeper '3 ': Shall have aggregate rentals and prices have caused increases in annual purchase of all recognised brands costs to the Treasury this year to the extent of paint of £5,000 with a minimum stock­ of £2,035,000. The Commonwealth Statistic­ holding of 400 gallons. ian's estimate of the rental increase on the ''Discount 22! per cent. formula used for the '' C'' Series Index is ''Storekeeper '4': Shall have aggregate 6s. a week, but the actual increase has been annual purchases of all recognised brands much more than that. The Government appear of paint of £12,000 with a minimum stock­ to be doing nothing about increased costs. holding of 750 gallons. They are merely allowing matters to drift "Discount 25 per cent. along. ''Distributor: Shall have aggregate According to this morning's newspaper, the annual purchases of all recognised brands price of eggs is to be increased by Sd. a of paint of £20,000 with a minimum stock­ dozen because of a shortage of production. holding of 1,250 gallons.'' Why is it that at the beginning of the quarter That shows the present trend towards forcing there were two reductions in the price of the small man out of business. It will not eggs, yet at the end of the quarter there is make paint any cheaper, but it could quite an increase of Sd. a dozen~ I point out, easily introduce into the retailing of paint too, that in urban areas close to Brisbane all sorts of unfortunate and unethical prac­ the market is over-supplied with eggs. The tices. A large retailer-for example, Allan same remarks apply to many other commodi­ & Stark-will receive a discount of 25 per ties, and some action will have to be taken cent., while a small distributor in a country by the Minister who controls that branch of area will get only 15 per cent. Besides the Government's administration. having a tendency to force the small man out of business the agreements are against the Only the other day I asked the Premier to best interests of the public. The excuse for give consideration to the establishment of a them is that they will cheapen commodities Restrictive Trade Practices Court in Queens­ but they will not. They may have a temporary land. lie side-stepped the question and re­ effect until only the big men are left and then ferred me to a previous reply that had been prices will be maintained by the cartel. given by the Minister for Justice. My question referred to the ring of paint manu­ Today's "Telegraph" publishes a state­ facturers. To give hon. members some idea ment made at Broadbeach by Mr. C. C. Carey, of the seriousness of the matter I should President of the Retail Grocers and Store­ like to quote from the circular that was dis­ keepers' Association. tributed by the Paint Manufacturers' Associa­ lUr. Power: A member of the Liberal tion of Queensland. Ten paint manufacturers Party. acting in concert have formed an association, and Clause 2 of the agreement between the Mr. LLOYD: I would not be surprised, association and the distributors provides that but he must be coming round to our way the distributors will purchase at least 90 per of thinking. The report says- cent. of their paint, varnish and enamel " Many manufacturers today were giv­ products from the members of the association. ing secret discounts for large merchandise The Government are continually talking orders, Mr. C. C. Carey, Retail Grocers and about encouraging the expansion of secondary Storekeepers' Association president, said industries in Queensland, yet they are allow· yesterday. ing practices such as these to be brought ''He was speaking at the annual con­ into the State's economy. There are many vention of the Australian Association of small paint manufacturers in Queensland who Advertising Agencies at Lennons Broad­ are not members of the paint ring, and under beach.'' the agreement to which I have referred only The agreements are most unfortunate but 10 per cent. of the market is left for dis­ they are not the only restrictive agreements tribution of their product. operating in industry. Other es-:amples have ·626 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

been given in the Chamber in the past. The eventual further development of the areas .sawmillers operated under an agreement concerned, and to provide services needed amongst themselves in an attempt to stifle before industry will expand in the country or .competition and to make it hard for a new new industries will develop . man to commence operations. This could It is my opinion that the Budget could be greatly affect the Government's encourage­ dangerous. If additional expenditure had ment of new industries in the State. If they been made from the various funds on a intend to continue the practice of appointing works programme, the position would not committees of inquiry into juvenile delin­ have deteriorated to the extent that Queens­ ·quency and other matters, let them have an land had to become a claimant State. In inquiry into this matter. addition, more employment would have bee_n It has been found necessary in some States provided than will be the case under this since the war to introduce restrictive trade Budget. practices. An Act was introduced in West .Australia and it has been effective. In the ltir. ADAIR (Cook) (5.26 p.m.): I really thought that the debate would have lasted United Kingdom the Conservative Govern­ two or three weeks. Sooner than allow the ment found it necessary to introduce legis­ lation setting up a court for the registration debate to collapse I rise to say a few words about my electorate. When the Treasurer ·of trade agreements. They could be outlawed by the court if they were seen to be detri­ introduced his Budget he gave the Com­ mittee a clear outline of what it contained. mental to the interests of industry or of the general public. All these matters deserve We have been given considerable time . to .careful study. peruse it and there is now an opportumty for hon. members to speak on it. We have already complimented the Govern­ I congratulate the Minister for considering ment on the increased allocation for educa­ requests on hospitalisation. Patients come tion. It is a natural expenditure, necessary to the Cairns Hospital from Thursday because of the rapid increase in the numbers Island, Cooktown and the Cape York of high school children in Queensland. Many Peninsula but unfortunately we have not got .States of the Commonwealth have had the the same facilities for Hospitalisation as same experience with the differences in ~he people who live in th~ metropolitll;n area. ages of children and the numbers att.endmg For instance, the patients attendmg the schools. That has been taken into considera­ Cairns General Hospital have not got a choice tion by the Commonwealth Grant~ · Com­ of specialists. There is one bone specialist mission. In Queensland the sudden mcrease in Cairns. I am not blaming the present in allocations for expenditure on high schools Government for this position. is very necessary and has been for some yea~s. It is unfortunate that the Government did Dr. Noble: They have visiting specialists not see fit to spend as much money as pos· from Townsvil1e. sible on the construction of high schools last ltir. ADAIR: Yes, but there is only one year when very few were built. This year bone specialist. Although a patie~t m_ay ~ot will show an improvement and it is hoped like a doctor or may not have faith m him that the administration of the department he still has to be treated by him, whereas will be geared to cope with the children at the Brisbane General Hospital there are requiring secondary education in the peak several bone specialists to choose from. year of 1961. The allocation for State school buildings will not be increased so apparently Dr. Noble: Dr. Ley of Townsville is a there will be an offsetting of the expen

.Japanese divers. The Labour Government Darnley, Saibai, Murray Island-and there believed that the industry should be kept are hundreds of them-the Government will for the Torres Strait Islanders and refused have to take over the schooling of the to introduce Japanese divers. As soon as the natives. They must either bring the students present Government came into power, how­ down to Brisbane to train or put better ever, they permitted the Commonwealth teachers up there. It would probably be Government to allow 162 Okinawans into better to bring them down here, train them Thursday Island. Two pearlers-Dunwoodie to the teaching standard required in our own and Hocking-went to Okinawa and them­ schools and then send them back to teach the selves chose the divers and brought them other islanders. It is very important to cater back to Thursday Island. Contrary to reports for their education to a better standard. in the Press that the Okinawans had had no experience in diving, they were expert salvage The Department of Native Affairs is doing divers. However, salvage diving is very an excellent job of home building for the different from diving for shell. Many islanders. On Bamaga they have some of the obstacles are encountered in the Darnley best timbers in Australia-large scrubs of Waters. The currents run at from 10 to 12 hardwoods and softwoods. The islanders work knots 30 and 40 fathoms down, and anybody in the sawmills and many are employed who dives there must have a very good as carpenters under white foremen. knowledge of the area. They are building homes, several of them, at Thursday Island. The timber is free. The Okinawans had never dived for pearl­ It is brought over to the island and two­ shell before they came to Thursday Island. room homes are built that would be quite I have been told that when they went below suitable for any worker or any person to live they threw stones and anything else in their in. The cost of each is about £900. They baskets. Each man wore a helmet and a are building three or four homes on each .corselet, and a flannel shirt and pants with island throughout the area. If the Govern­ white calico patches on the knees. When they ment allow the department to carry on with descend to collect the shell they have to go the building programme the islanders will down on their knees because they cannot have good housing and will also be kept in bend their heads to look down. If they did, employment. There is a great deal of the helmet would let the water in and they unemployment at Thursday Island and the would drown. When they are collecting shell men could well be engaged by the Government they are looking straight ahead. They have in the construction of homes and in the to grope round for the shell and cannot see sawmill at Bamaga. Homes are sadly needed what they are putting in their baskets. in the Thursday Island area. Dozens of The Torres Strait Islanders have been homes in the township itself should be con· gathering shell for years. It is incorrect to demned but they are being used because they say that they cannot dive. I know at least are the only places to live in. The Government 30 of them who can dive as well as anyone should step up the building programme on the €lse. At the present time they are diving islands as soon as possible. Most of the up to 40 fathoms deep in Darnley Waters islanders who work receive only a small wage and are producing large quantities of shell. of about £19 a month to keep a wife and Sabatino and several others are bringing in family. It would be impossible for them to large loads of shell every time they go out. build their own homes. The Government will have to help them. Their education is most The Okinawans were a failure because they important and their living conditions are had no knowledge of the pearling industry. important, too. With decent housing there They did not know how to collect the shell would be no trouble in assimilating them into when they went below. With the introduc­ the white population. tion of the grading of pearlshell by Gerdau, who has control of the pearling industry­ The Committee also looked into the pos­ ! have been told that he also has a big sibility of developing other industries in the interest in the plastics industry-much of area. The abundant supply of crayfish the shell that was formerly graded as first­ warrants the establishment of a crayfishing elass is now being discarded. industry. The waters around Murray Island are matted with sardines. I have never seen The pearlshell industry will carry on as schools so thick. A sardine-canning industry there is still a sale for good shell, but it could be started. I am concerned about the should be reserved wholly and solely for the Torres Strait Islanders. There are 6,000 future of Thursday Island. I know that with natives on Thursday Island and the pearl­ industry as it is on Thursday Island many shell industry will have to be kept exclusively of the islanders will be out of work. A lot for them. of them are out of work now. The Govern­ ment will have to see that these men are The most important matter that was raised given some sort of employment to enable before the All-party Committee was educa­ them to carry on. If work cannot be found tion. At present, the Islanders are being for them round Thursday Island they will educated only to the fourth or fifth grade have to be assimilated on the mainland. standard. That is as far as he seems to get. Homes and schools are very necessary. I have It is not because he has not the intellect or no doubt at all that half the population of the brain to go further but because he lacks Thursday Island could be assimilated with the tuition. On all those islands, like the white population on the mainland. There Supply. [14 OCTOBER.] Supply. 629 has been some talk of amalgamating the two Mr. ADAIR: It is a record for them. schools, the State school for white children They planted this cane and many of them will and what is known as the Waiben school for go broke. eoloured children. I ask the Government to JUr. Watson: Do you suggest that they look at the matter carefully before they should be allowed to go on planting as they decide. Personally I can see no harm in it. like I I understand that about two-thirds of the children attending the State school are Mr. ADAIR: They have not done that; coloured children. They seem to mix well. that is wrong. As I proceed I shall prove It should not be a very difficult matter for that they have not done that at all. the Government to decide. Mr. Aikens: Did they know that they Mr. Gair: We will not have another were planting over their farm peaks~ Little Rock. Mr. ADAIR: They have not planted lUr. ADAIR: I hope not. The pearlers over their farm peaks., This addition,al are satisfied that the Japanese divers are a amount of 4,425 tons of sugar represents failure. They are being sent back to their 32,000 tons of cane that will have to be homeland. The only thing I am sorry about ploughed back into the soil, because the cane is that the pearlers have lost very heavily. in this area will not stand over till the follow­ They spent thousands of pounds on accom­ ing season. In addition to the loss of the modation for the Okinawans. They spent cane, there is the expense of ploughing it in. considerable sums of money in bringing them 'l'his will probably be the first mill to finish over from Okinawa only to have to send them crushing, whieh date is expected to be the back again at about £80 a head. It will mean first week in November. Any decision to a considerable loss to the pearlers. I wish to permit of the taking of further sugar should make it clear that the island diver has proved be made two weeks before that date. The himself far superior to the Japanese diver. Central Sugar Cane Prices Board allows the They have proved that on the tonnage of catch grower to harvest up to 75 per cent. of the since the season started. I am sure that gross assigned area, and this provision has pearlers themselves are satisfied that the been strictly polieed in the area since 1938, island diver is better than the Japanese at which time all assigned land was surveyed diver. by an authorised surveyor. The position this year is that this big crop has been grown ]lr. Lloyd: It is a shame to see them go down in those dangerous waters. on only 64 per cent. of the gross assigned area, and the growers have been notified that JUr. ADAIR: Yes, it is a shame to see for the present they will be able to harvest them go clown because it is suicidal when from only 55.3 7 per cent. of their effective they do not know enough about the currents. gross assignment. Mr. Lloyd: More precautions should be ]}fr. Evans: You know that at confer­ taken. ence after conference for the last 20 years there has been agreement as to control. 1\Ir. ADAIR: I think there should be more precautions and the divers should be ]}fr. ADAIR: It can readily be realised better equipped. The under-currents are so that individual farmers with 75 per cent. of treacherous that it is suicidal to go down in the assigned area under cane can lose 26 per some those waters. cent. of the total growing erop. The loss of During the dinner adjournment I collected such a large percentage would spell ruin some information about the sugar industry to some farmers. in the Mossman area. If the mill is only New and increased assigments were granted allowed to crush the present tonnage allotted by the Central Sugar Cane Prices Board, and to it it will mean the ruin of many farmers, in recent years growers have been advised especially the small ones. It will mean the that unless these new or increased assignments mill will cease crushing within a couple of were put under eane they would be cancelled, weeks, the mill hands will lose their jobs, so that farmers were forced to put the land and the cutters will be out of work. under cane. It has been put under cane at the direction of the Board, at heavy expense Mr. Aikens: Will not the farmers be to growers. They have done that with assist­ compensated to some extent for the loss of ance from the banks on their undertaking tonnage by the higher c.c.s.' that the return from the crop would repay Mr. ADAIR: No. There has always the advances. been a high c.c.s. in the Mossman area. The While there is complete agreement that sugar peak of this mill is 31,000 tuns of export restrictions are in force, I point out bagged sugar. The announced acquisition of that, even if all available cane was .harvested a further 12~ per cent. will enable the mill throughout Australia in the 1958 season, the to produce 34,875 tons of bagged sugar. The total stocks for export at the relevant date estimate of this year's crop is 287,000 tons would not exceed the stocks allowed under the of cane. Agreement. Mr. Evans: That will be a record, This additional cane would produce 4,425 won't iH tons of bagged sugar for the additional cost 630 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply. of cutting and crushing. The Mossman mill These little farmers should be allowed to and the Mossman District Cane Growers' harvest their crops rather than be compelled Executive have agreed, if they are permitted to go broke. to crush this cane, to take the risk, to store ~Ir. 1Yatson: Notwithstanding the fact it, and nuance it at no cost to the industry, that they are not going to harvest this cane, and on the distinct understanding that it will more money will be recovered from the not interfere with the upward peak or third Mossman crop this year than last year. quota sugar of any other mill in Australia in future years. It'Ir. AD AIR: That will not make any Mr. Aikens: What will they do with it difference. Some might get more money, but when they mill iU the small :farmers will go broke. There will be no money for them at all.

ltir. ADAIR: They are prepared to take ~Ir, Watson: I wish the solution was the risk. There may be a bad season or a as easy as that. cyclone next year. They may have a bad crop. They are prepared to do these things li'Ir. Aikens: How can a farmer go at no expense to the industry. They have broke if he is to be allowed to harvest facilities for storing it, and they want the 12~ per cent. over his peak~ permission of the Board and the Government to do t.his rather than have the cane ploughed It'Ir. AD AIR: I have pointed out that in. In the Mackay area cane will stand over this year's crop in the Mossman area will until the next season. be the best it has ever had. Some farmers planted 14, 15 and 20 acres because they 1Ur. Watson: No. were told that if they did not plant the new assignment would be taken from them. JU:r. A DAIR: I have cut standover cane Hon. members know the expense involved in in seveml successive years. Cane in the grubbing. It costs £40 an acre to grub Freshwater area or a heavy soil area will fall land and then there is the added expense of down by reason of its weight and >Yill root ploughing and putting it under crop. in the ground. Mr. Evans: These new canes will not Mr. Watson: They have not done any stand up. grubbing of land. Itir. ADAIR: In other areas cane will lir. ADAIR: They had to put the cane stand as straight as a die, and it can be cut in, otherwise they would have lost their the next season. I know what it will mean to land. the people in the Mossman area. I appeal to ~Ir. Aikens: If Mackay, Burdekin and the Government to allow these people to take other areas were allowed to do this the whole the risk by harvesting and milling the cane fabric o:f sugar production would break down. and storing the sugar. I ask the Government to allow them to take the risk, whether the JUr. AD AIR: They were given permis­ gamble succeeds or not. sion to do it. li'Ir. Aikens: What objection has the I again work the parish pump by speaking Board to the proposal you have just made~ about a cannery for Cairns. !Ir. Aikens: After we get one at 1\Ir. ADAIR: The Board believes that To wnsvill e. this sugar will go onto the market. Mr. Watson: It will not go onto the Mr. ADAIR: I am not concerned about market; there is no market. Townsville; I want a cannery at Cairns. The committee of inquiry that is in the district Jlir. ADAIR: I do not understand what investigating the project now is simply_ wast· objection they could have to the proposal, as ing time and money. I know what its these people are willing to take the risk. decision will be. The committee knew its They are willing to cut it and crush it and decision before it left Brisbane. There will store the sugar at no cost to the industry. not be a cannery built at Cairns. Since I think they should be allowed to do that. the Premier gave his answer to my questions of last year and said that there would not Mr. Evans: This position applies to be a cannery built at Cairns over 50 farmers other places as well as Mossman. have gone out of production. The committee is discouraging the farmers from planting. Mr. AD AIR: I understand that, but I We were told that if the area grew a certain think the sugar industry is strong enough to quantity there would be a cannery at Cairns. take all the surplus sugar. Even if the farmers receive a lower return, what would be Mr. Hanlon: Did he not have incorrect the difference~ information on the capacity of the area~ Mr. Aikens: Next year you will have Jlir. ADAIR: Yes. I am confident that more complaining. the cannery in the South is being protected. There is no doubt about that. ~Ir. AD AIR: They will wake up to themselves and that will be the end of it. Mr. Aikens: Hear, hear! Supply. [14 OCTOBER.] Suppty. 631

Mr. ADAIR: There is no doubt that plans and specifications than in doing the the protection is to swell the pockets of the actual job. I give the Minister full credit farmers in the South. for the construction work on the Cook High­ lUr. Hodges: Tommyrot! way. I do not think it would be possible to find better drivers than the men who are Mr. AD AIR: The hon. member would operating the big trailers. It is a pity that not know. the Pioneer Tour drivers are not half as good as them. Mr. Davies: You claim that the promise was a political one and there was no intention ~lr. Aikens: You were sour on them of keeping it~ last year. Mr. Aikens: The Northgate cannery is the Premier's pet baby. Mr. ADAIR: I was sour because the Government started the job so soon. They ~lr. ADAIR: He must protect it. should have given the Port Douglas men time to get jobs somewhere else. Even at this lUr. Evans: You had a cannery at late stage the Government should help them Cairns~ Whathappened~ to shift their homes from Port Douglas to Cairns. They have to travel to and from illr. ADAIR: It was run by the farmers Cairns, a distance of 43 miles, every day to themselves with help from the Government. work on the wharves. When I previously From the start there was bad management. brought the matter before the notice of the il'Ir. illuller: You can't blame the South Minister, I said that the road was not suit­ because you failed. able for heavy traffic. He said it was. I must have been right, because the Government il'Ir. ADAIR: The previous Government are spending £150,000 on widening the road. promised to build a cannery when the district produced the goods. Mr. Evans: I told you it would be widened, and you said it could not be done. Honourable ~!embers interjected. ~Ir. ADAIR: It must have been the The CHAIRj}fAN: Order! This is not Minister for Agriculture and Stock who said a questionnaire. I should be very pleased if the road was suitable for heavy traffic. the hon. member for Cook would proceed with his speech. On two or three occasions the Main Roads Department has tried to widen a bend in the ~Ir. ADAIR: No-one tried harder than Stratford area known as Suicide Bend because I to haYe a cannery established in Cairns, but of the numerous accidents there. Previous I am now fully convinced that it is a "blue efforts have been unsuccessful but the man duck.'' Only a change of Government will now in charge of the job of drilling and bring a cannery to Cairns. firing knows his work and I congratulate him on the excellent job he has done in such a Mr. Evans: You had a cannery there short time. for years and it went broke. Mr. EYans: I must be doing too much Mr. ADAIR: I said before that the work in the North. I am widening the Gillies farmers knew nothing about running a can­ Highway. too. nery. It was badly managed. They could produce the pineapples and the cannery would ~lr, ADAIR: That is not in my have been a success if the C.O.D. had only electorate. given the farmers some sound advice. How­ ever, the C.O.D. did not want it to be a suc­ On my recent visit to Cairns I inspected cessful venture. They knew that if a cannery progress on the road constructon at Barron was successfully established in Cairns, their Waters and from Kuranda to Robb 's Monu­ cannery in Brisbane would go out of exist­ ment. Before long, tourists will be able to ence. All the pineapples j;hat are now grown drive right through to Robb 's Monument and in the North are sent to the Sydney market. to the Barron Falls, something they have Those grown in South Queensland would not never been able to do before. It will mean sell in Sydney. They are too sour. competition for the railways but it is still very worth while. When the road is built Mr. Aikens: They would not feed them behind Barron Waters and up the Barron to the pigs down there. gorge a bridge will have to be built over the Barron River at a cost of over £100,000 and ~lr. ADAIR: That is so. a tunnel will have to be put through from I think this is about the first occasion on Robb 's Monument to the weir. That will which I have congratulated the Minister for keep many men employed and nobody could Development, Mines, and Main Roads. I be happier than I to see it going ahead. have never seen road construction work done as quickly as that on the Cook Highway. Red ~lr. Aikens: All done because of your tape was brushed aside and specifications representations. were dispensed with. The men simply went lUr. ADAIR: Yes, all done through my in with jack-hammers and widened the road. representations. Normally, if a local authority wants a £1,000 job done, more time is wasted in preparing Mr. Evans: In 12 months. 632 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

li'Ir. ADAIR: I should like to touch }Jr. Evans: The miners have to play briefly on the mining industry again. It the game too. is an industry I know and one in which I have taken an active part. I ask the Minister 1\'Jr. ADAIR: They are producing but to give the mining industry of the Far North they have to get assistance from the Govern­ all possible help because no section of the ment. The Government have to help them people needs it more. I can assure him that build roads to their mines. They build roads all the old mines lying dormant today, full to farms and everything else. of water and with timber rotting in them, Mr. Evans: They are doing that. can produce again. They were abandoned only because of the fall in the prices of tin, }Jr. ADAIR: I know that I had to build copper, lead, wolfram, bismuth, molybdenite any road I wanted. or whatever it might have been. Once mines were abandoned it was too costly to bail }Jr. Evans: That was under your them out, retimber them and resume working. Government. The only way to open them is to use diamond }Jr. ADAIR: I hope that this Govern­ drills in the area. So far I do not know of ment will show us the way and build the one there. roads. As I have pointed out to the Minister, Mr. Windsor: You are not talking these mines will produce if they are deve­ about the mine that is worked for only 10 loped. It is up to the Government to keep weeks in the year and pays them £3,000. the Irvinebank mill going. To do so it is necessary that assistance be given to the lUr. ADAIR: The hon. member himself miners in the construction of roads and by will dodge tax if he can; every hon. member the provision of diamond drills to :find the in the Chamber will. I know the two miners lost lodes that I am sure are there Miners concerned. They worked in the Dargo moun­ recently went back into the old Gilmour mine tains and lived a very hard life. 'l'hey were and struck the old lode. That mine is now lucky; they made a find and it has become producing large quantities of tin. The Wild their bank. In eight to 10 weeks they can Irishman mine was left dormant for 20 to cut out £2,000 to £3,000 worth of tin. If 30 years. My father went into it. put three they produced more, most of the profit would or four men down in different levels and go into taxation, an(l their production would struck the old bodies again. In one crush­ not keep the mill going much longer because ing he got 50 tons of black tin. I am the tin is so rich. It is 20, 30 and 40 per confident that these old mines will produce cent. again if the Government will spend a little Mr. Evans: What about the Irvinebank money to help the miners to work them. treatment plant"{ It is short of raw material and yet those people sit down for half the Hon. P. J. R. HILTON (Carnarvon) year and do nothing. (7.42 p.m.): In my opinion the Budget debate is very important, consequently I :find 1Ur. AD AIR: As I pointed out, theirs it difficult to understand the lack of is a very rich seam of tin and even if they enthusiasm associated with the present worked to full capacity the battery would not debate. It is true that many people are apt be kept going much longer. to accept a difficult position, merely saying JUr. Aikens: They would work the that there is no way out of it. It is true second six months of the year for Artie that we are living in times of many com­ Fad den. plex problems but a State Parliament should display the maximum interest in the financial lUr. ADAIR: Of course they would and matters under its control. I would not work for him. Would the hon. There are some aspects of this Budget member work for him W which to my mind are very important indeed. Mr. Hiley: The miner gets 20 per cent. Obviously the first things to be looked for of his profit from tin tax free, you know. in a Budget are accuracy and honesty. To that extent I think that the Budget measures 1\Ir. ADAIR: I know he does, but he up to a high standard, despite the fact that has his other commitments too. I do not in my opinion, as facts will bear out, there blame him in the least. I was told during has been some skilful juggling of figures and the week-end that I went home that both funds, nothing dishonest in ~tself, but some­ these men have contracted miners' phthisis. thing th.at has been done wh1ch supports the Mr. Evans: What wvuld he say if we actions taken by the late Hon. W. Forgan shut down the treatment planU It is run­ Smith when he was Treasurer. I refer to ning at a loss now. What would you say~ the Main Roads Fund. You cannot have it both ways. ItJr. Evans: What is wrong with the Mr. ADAIR: It would be the end of Main Roads Fund~ the Irvinebank district if the treatment plant }Jr. HILTON: Nothing at all. I am closed down. The Government must make pleased to see the amount going up. I sure that they keep the treatment plant merely make the observation. going because it is only the treatment plant that keeps the area going. It would mean Mr. Evans: You have had more work the end of tin-mining up there. done than you have ever had before. Supply. [14 OcTOBER.] Supply. 633

Mr. HILT ON: I appreciate everything problems arising from economic upsets caused that has been done. I have always taken by the erratic course of the law of supply and the view that priority should be given to demand. main roads construction throughout Australia. I am sorry that the Main Roads Fund has Mr. Davies interjected. not increased by £3,000.000. Mr. HILTON: In a plan such as I have mentioned the haves should give to the have­ Mr. Evans: So am I. nota. They cannot trade with us unless we lllr, HILT ON: If contributions under trade with them. Countries producing goods the State Transport Facilities Act were under slave labour conditions could flood this credited to the Main Roads Fund there would country and undermine our standard of liv­ be an increase of over £3,000,000 but there is ing. I recall the heated protests when a perhaps still time for the Premier and trade agreement was reached with Japan. Treasurer to honour the promise which was We have to trade with Japan if we want so enthusiastically and earnestly made in the her to buy our wool. There was a stream of eourse of the 1956 election campaign. How­ protests about Japanese goods coming in and ewr, in this State, in common with other undermining the conditions of the workers States in Australia, many serious problems here. You cannot have it both ways. have arisen, particularly in the sphere of llir. Davies: Would you be willing to primary production. There is no gainsaying trade with Red China 1 the fact that the fall in wool prices is already having a serious effect on the lllr. HILT ON: Recent Press statements economy of this State and Australia. were to the effect that Red China and Russia, where they had the opportunity, were under­ lllr. Power: There has been no corre­ mining countries with a high living standard sponding drop in woollen clothing. by flooding them with goods produced by slave labour. If it meant that we were to Mr. HILT ON: There has been no trade with Red China-- corresponding drop in woollen clothing; I hope that will come. Many other primary llir. Davies: Japan. products are being depressed. We read of the great surplus in certain lines of agri­ lllr. HILTON: I made an observation cultural production. That is not peculiar to about Japan. Australia. It has occurred in America where lUr. Davies: About £9,000,000 worth of the Government subsidised those primary wool was sold to China. industries in order to keep the standard of living at a reasonable level; and they were Mr. HILTON: If you have to accept forced to unload a lot of their processed goods purchased at a cost much lower than primary products on the open market, to the here, if you have to sacrifice the conditions detriment of Australia. of workers here, I do not think that would be a wise policy. I believe in effective, Some comment was made by the Leader of reasonable trade. the Opposition on what can be done to keep prices up. If we did what they did in lllr. Thackeray: Would it not be of America we would have to unload the goods benefit to the primary producers of this on the open market or give them away, which State' would be to the detriment of the primary producers. Mr. HILT ON: Certainly not. How could they pay for iU We would have to Mr. Aikens: We are practically giving buy their goods in order to give them suffi­ our butter and cheese away at present to cient to pay for our goods. England. A Government Member: How do the Japanese pay' lllr. HILTON: I agree. The problem is a very complex one. There would have to be lllr. HILTON: We have to take a certain a worldwide approach to this problem of amount of their goods, and the balance is gluts and the regulation of the law of sup­ very much in our favour. Although Japan ply and demand in order to keep a reasonable buys a great deal of our wool, there have economic level in all countries and so raise been protests about the import of Japanese the standard of living. It would be a good goods and the undermining of conditions in thing if the World Bank was given power to this country. The same could be said of Red give effect to such a policy. It could embody China or any other country where the stand­ the best aspects of the Marshall plan inaugur­ ard of living was lower than in Australia. ated by the American Government. It could bring about a properly-supervised and Mr. Davies: Would you object to selling enlarged Colombo Plan so that the nations our wool to Red China W with surplus food supplies could give some to the have-nots. This should be approached lUr. HILTON: That would depend on on an international basis. We look to the the terms of trade, and whether it was on free countries to do this. Unless something the lines I have mentioned. I certainly should is done we will be faced with serious if it meant undermining our conditions, which 634 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply. in the present circumstances would be in­ on the point. I submit that any interest from evitable. I certainly would object if it meant the investment of those funds should be the uplifting of Red China, to which Mr. devoted to the specific purpose for which the Chamberlain, the Federal President of the trust fund was created. Australian Labour Party, has referred in lUr. Hiley: Was that always your such fulsome and glowing, although, of course, incorrect terms. view~ Mr. HILTON: Yes. I repeat that until there is a sensible international attempt by the free countries lUr. Hiley: Then how do you account of the world to grapple with these complex for the fact that the Cabinet of which you problems we shall not have stability in our were a member transferred moneys from the standard of living. Post-war Reconstruction and Development Fund~ lUr. Aikens: Let us face the fact that one of our chief economic ills is the adverse I\Ir. HILT ON: I should like to see trade balance with America who sells us details of that. The Post-war Reconstruction everything and will not buy anything from and Development Fund did a mighty lot us. towards stepping up main roads employment in this State and it has been of great help l\Ir. HILTON: America does buy from to the primary producers. It is an unsound us. No country in the world is self­ practice to put interest from these funds sufficient. There ivould have to be some that have been contributed by primary pro­ levelting up between the haves and have­ ducers for specific purposes into Consolidated nets on an international plane, through a Revenue. reorganised and enlarged International Bank, There is another matter upon which the to try to correct the serious complications Treasurer might give us some elucidation. that have arisen and are arising in world On page 10 of the Financial Statement the trade and commerce. Treasurer referred to special assistance JUr. Aikens: You want us to give our received from the Commonwealth. The butter and cheese to the Japanese, when our Statement says- own people cannot aftord to buy those com­ '' As against these increases, must be off­ modities. set the special grant to relieve unemploy­ ment and drought. The sum of ltir. HILTON: I want to give those £1,125,154 was received from the Common­ commodities to the Japanese! No. I am wealth last year for these purposes.'' talking about a sane approach. I referred briefly to what had happened in America. Is that only a revenue loan in advance which The hon. member should be aware of that. has to be paid back~ I emphasise that we have to maintain the I\Ir. Hiley: We got it last year and will standard of living of our own people, includ­ not get it this year. ing primary producers and farm workers. Those things are outside the ambit of State Itlr. HILT ON: The statement is a little Parliaments, but it is important that we misleading. I thought there was a handle should keep them in mind when we are to it because of the reference on page 10. considering deficits and the other problems It is quite legitimate that I should raise the of the moment. query. I am pleased to see that the Commonwealth lUr. Aikens: You do not believe in the Government have at last recognised their axiom that charity begins at home~ liability in regard to borer eradication in homes. That Government were primarily 1Ur. HILT ON: I most certainly do. I think I have made that abundantly clear. responsible for the trouble that occurred, and I see from the Financial Statement that the There are some new aspects in the Budget. total cost incurred by the State will The estimated deficit would be much greater approximate £341,252 of which £50,000 has but for certain innovations introduced by been charged to the Commonwealth-State the Treasurer. Interest on various Trust Housing Fund. The assistance from the Fund balances amounting to £450,000 is to Commonwealth is expected to total £145,625. be credited to the Consolidated Revenue I repeat that I am glad to see that the Fund. Parliament has not given legislative Commonwealth Government are facing up to warrant for that transfer. Although the what was primarily their responsibility. I Treasurer has given notice of a certain Bill, mention that because of the untruthful and I think in fairness to hon. members he should wrongful statements levelled at the Labour have mentioned the particular Trust Fund Government in the past about this problem. balances that are to be invested, because as The fact that the Commonwealth have hon. members know only too well, many funds accepted their responsibilities shows that created by special Acts are subscribed to by what I said in the past was correct. primary producers. Those subscriptions are I\Ir. Aikens: You are referring to the made for a particular purpose, for the Zillmere homes~ benefit of a particular industry, and I strongly object to the payment into Consolidated I\Ir. HILT ON: In my last Budget speech Revenue of interest on the investment of that I made pointed reference to the part the money. The Treasurer has not enlightened us Commonwealth played. Supply. [14 OCTOBER.] Supply. 635

I am pleased in one way but sorry in institutions, and the interest they pay is the another that the Treasurer has been gravely same as if the loans were made to them by disappointed with the Commonwealth's the Treasury. attitude in regard to flood relief. When the floods occurred in 1956 the Labour Govern­ lUr. Hiley: No. ment of the day were criticised by the then I think so. Leader of the Opposition and members of lllr. HILT ON: his Party regarding the Government's JUr. Hiley: The rate that the Treasury approach to the Commonwealth Government. ha" to pay is at least three-eights per cent. I was flayed by Country Party members in less. If the Treasury got that money on the my electorate and I was told that if the State loan programme we could help local author­ Government had made the correct approach ities and other public bodies by allowing them they would have received a £ for £ subsidy. a cheaper rate of interest. Mr. Adermann, M.P. for Fisher, added fuel to the fire by saying that the money was there lUr. HILT ON: Is it not virtually the had the State Government asked for it. The same rate of interest~ chickens have now come home to roost. The promises of the Commonwealth Government JUr. Hiley: But all that we could lend made th!ough the Press in 1956 regarding them would be mere chicken-feed. flood rehef are now being disclosed in their true meaning. lUr. HILT ON: My point is that the local authorities "·ould still pay the same rate llir. Bjelke-Petersen: The Common­ of interest. The Treasurer has made much wealth Government gave £ for £ on the basis of the point that all local authorities were on which the Government here applied. able to get debenture loans. I do not think it is a form of assistance that should be ~Ir. HILTON: No. The hon. member decried. for Barambah supported Mr. Adermann in the false statements that he made, and he said llir. Walsh: They won't get it this year. that if the right approach had been made we would have got it. I refer the hon. member lllr. HILT ON: They may not. to the Treasurer's Financial Statement. There is no need for me to go further. When lllr. Hiley: If £10,000,000 was taken off a man is proved wrong he should have the the debenture programme and added to the moral courage to admit that he had made loan programme. Queensland as a whole would unfair imputations against the previous Gov­ collect £5,000,000 in sinking funds. Today ernment. she gets nothing. llir. Bjelke-Petersen: You are the one 3Ir. HILTON: And conversely, she "·ho is wrong. would have to make her contribution to the sinking funds; the Treasury would have to ~[r. HILT ON: The hon. member can make its contribution. But when the local argue it out with the Treasurer. authorities get that money and spend it, they Those are just a few small matters per­ merely repay the interest and redemption and haps, but they are worth while mentioning the State Government are not called upon to and putting on record. pay their quota to the sinking funds. I wish to say something now about the JUr. Hiley: You cannot detect my point. Government's intention to approach the Com­ monwealth Government on the basis of accu­ i\Ir. HILT ON: I realise fully the sub­ mulated deficits for assistance from the Com­ stance of the Treasurer's argument. It is monwealth Grants Commission. I cannot all sound developmental work, and it grieves follow the Treasurer's argument. In tax me to know that the Government have reduced reimbursement grants he shows Queensland in the second-best position in the Commonwealth. the subsidy in some directions. I am wonder­ Western Australia is in a better position by ing what the Country Party members have only 6s. 3d. per head. In the Governmental been doing to allow that to take place. Per­ loan programme various factors have to be haps we shall hear more about that later on. taken into consideration. Queensland has not The Treasurer hammered the loan side of the been as big a borrower as any of the other matter. He quoted tables of the cost of ser­ States. Under debenture approvals, Queens­ vices in other States and quoted the Common­ land stands in a very favourable position. I wealth Statistician's figures, but it is not should like to know why the Treasurer con­ clearly stated whether those services are shown siders debenture loans as the least desirable. at the net cost or the gross cost. How many llir. Hiley: Because they cost us a of those services are financed from loan higher rate of interest ana we get no sinking funds~ Most of them are from revenue funds. fund contribution. lUr. Hiley: That is so. Mr. HILT ON: Most of it is devoted to local authorities, who pay the same rate of lllr. HILTON: And I do not see the interest on it as on Government loans. Deben­ force or the validity of using those tables to ture loan raisings in the main are accepted support an argument to obtain further loan by local government and semi-government money. 636 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

Mr. Hiley: They are not used for that it is corrected. By and large Queensland has purpose. They are used in support of appli­ not done very liladly. It is inevitable that cation to the Commonwealth Grants Com­ a deficit should be budgeted for this year. mission for more revenue. Perhaps the time will come when the whole financial relationship of the Commonwealth ltir. HILTON: If the Treasurer argues and the States will have to be reviewed and that way, he has set out in the Financial put on a more satisfactory basis. Statement what the Commonwealth Grants Commission takes into consideration in deter­ Mr. Aikens: If it would have meant mining the eligibility of a State. Very early more employment I think we should have in the piece he says- budgeted for a bigger deficit. " In measuring disability, the standard Mr. HILT ON: I agree that it is much set by the non-claimant States for revenue better to have a deficit than to have unem­ and services is the usual basis.'' ployment, but, under the present system, if It is not a matter of loan expenditure at all. you have deficit after deficit the economic Queensland's sound economic position in com­ ~tability of the country becomes undermined. parison with that of every other State comes We do not want a repetition of the days when substantially from the sound borrowing policy Sir Otto Neimeyer came out and mapped out of past governments and the lower debt per a plan to be followed, which made a bad head of the population because of it. The depression even worse still. Treasurer is not justified in saying that what he calls the State's unfair position was JUr. Walsh: To say nothing of the mess inherited from the Government's predeces­ of the Bruce-Page Government. sors. I recall reading in the Press some years J\Ir. IIILTON: I have more important ago about a great fight at the Loan Council things to discuss than that, but we know meeting in which Queensland participated. I of the endeavours of the Scullin Govern­ forget exactly who were the Premier and ment at that time to try to rectify the posi­ Treasurer in office at the time but a threat tion. We know how the Scullin Government was made to apply the formula. The Treas­ was overthrown in the House of Represen­ urer may recall the incident. Queensland's tatives by the actions of certain people, position is not the making of his Government including a man who at the present time and he knows it full well. It doesn't matter poses as the great Labour man, Mr. Eddie if he budgets for a deficit for one, two, three Ward. When the Scullin Government were or four years; before the Commonwealth give any assistance along the lines suggested, battling against the men who wielded the Queensland would be subjected to the delibera­ financial power, in an effort to do something tions of a Royal Commission as Western for the workers of this country, it was Eddie Australia was before it was granted assist­ Ward and company who crossed the floor of ance. the House and defeated Scullin. Mr. Aikens: Western Australia A Government Member: He was on threatened to secede from the Commonwealth. your platform once. Government ltiembers interjected. ltir. HILT ON: That is true. A Royal Commission was appointed and it was only The CHAIRMAN: Order! after it made its report that Western Aus­ tralia received assistance. If Queensland were iJ'Ir. HILTON: Mr. Ward was never in given similar assistance, Victoria and New my electorate. I never want him there. South Wales would demand very close investi­ Mr. Walsh interjected. gation. They would say, ''One in, all in.'' Mr. HILT ON: That is quite true. ltir. Hiley: Is the purpose of your argument to suggest that we should remain The CHAIRiJ'IAN: Order! I ask the eontent and watch South Australia, Western hon. member to address his remarks to the Australia and Tasmania collect £20,000,000 chair. a year as special grant while we get none f Mr. HILTON: I shall endeavour to do Mr. HILT ON: No, certainly not. so but with all these relevant interjections with so much meat in them you will perhaps ~fr. Hiley: What is your argument, pardon me if I take the opportunity to then~ reply. ltfr. HILT ON: I think a better approach ltir. Aikens: What chance do you give could be made. What is the object of stress­ Evatt in the coming Federal elections~ ing the loan aspect when the money we really '"ant to provide for services and the ordinary ltir. HILTON: I could make a few yardstick for the Commonwealth Grants Com­ relevant observations on that. I repeat that mission is a question of revenue~ It has been we are living in a time of complex economic a question of revenue right from the incep­ problems. tion of Federation, not of the disbursement of Let me make a brief summary of the poli­ loan moneys. I agree that it is somewhat tical parties that graee the Australian poli­ lopsided in that respect but an entirely dif­ tical seene at the present time. First of all ferent approach will have to be made before I take the Country Party and the Liberal Supply. [14 OCTOBER.] Supply. 637

Party. Theirs is not a really happy com­ A Government 1\lember: You remained bination, indeed a most illogical one because for years after the conference. it has been stated time and time again that the Country Party was formed as a separate 1\Ir. HILT ON: It was not years. It is political entity because it wanted to cut itself a wise man who chooses his time and place adrift from the control that the Liberal of battle. Party exercised over it. It was freely stated by the late John Leahy-may the soil rest We have heard much talk about pledges. lightly on him-that another of the reasons I recently browsed through a book written for getting a separate political Country by an eminent jurist regarding the pledge Party in Queensland was that the Liberal system in party politics. It is a most interest­ Party held the political money bag. The ing book and one of the greatest expositions Country Party could not get anything. It of Liberalism I have ever read. I shall was a rebellion against the Liberal Party quote extracts from it. At page 59 of the that caused the birth of the Country Party. book reference is made to the policy of the Yet we find them now working in an unhappy Labour Party as adopted in the year 1905. and sometimes unholy alliance. It goes on to say- '' In its revised form the newer Lib era· Jlir. Richter interjected. lism could :find little to condemn in the objective, and the various Australian Jlir. HILT ON: I do not think that is Liberal Parties have entered into cam· true. I am the first Labour man to repre· petition with the Labour Parties in their sent the electorate of Carnarvon and I can common efforts to extend the powers of claim that many of my recruits have been the community as a whole. One point on drawn from Country Party ranks. They agree which they have joined issue is the question with me that at the present time the Country of immigration. Chiefly as a result of Party representatives in the Federal sphere union agitation, assisted immigration was have fallen down on the job over the butter abandoned by Victoria in 1873, South Aus· subsidy. Anyone who is worth his salt knows tralia in 1886, New South Wales in 1887, that. and Tasmania in 1891, and although more recent legislation has endeavoured to cope Jlir. Aikens: The Country Party with the problem there is no steady stream represents the farmers and the Liberal Party of new settlers and workers. represents those who exploit the farmers. But there are two equally important phases of the development of the Labour Jlir. HILT ON: That is a very old one but it is true. Now let me deal with the Party which must be considered. In the other great alliance that unfortunately has :first case there is the question of the crept into being, the alliance of the once pledge and caucus, and in the second there great Australian Labour Party with the is that of preference to unionists. Communist Party. A few months ago Mr. As to the pledge, the form runs: 'I here· Chamberlain, the top boss of the A.L.P., by pledge myself not to appose the can· returned from a visit to Red China. He could didate selected by the recognised political not say one word against Red .China. Accord­ Labour organisation, and, if elected, to ing to him the millenium had been reached, do my utmost to carry out the principles there was not one unhappy man, woman or emoodied in the Australian Labour Party's child in the whole of Red China. The whole platform, and on all questions affecting the purport of his words was to show that under platform to vote as a majority of the Par· Communism in a country like Red China liamentary party may decide at a duly con· miracles had been accomplished, that all was stituted caucus meeting.' well, and there was an invitation to the people The justification of the pledge is made of Australia to follow suit. Would not any on three main grounds:-(!) It is sanc­ thinking person realise that when the Federal tioned by precedent. In his 'The Case for boss follows that line, under the present setup Labour' Mr. W. M. Hughes makes a good the others follow behind him~ Has anyone deal out of this point, and he indicates stood up to repudiate Chamberlain's fulsome that no lodge or religious sect could carry eulogy of one of the most ruthless dictator· on unless some such system as the pledge ships ever enforced on any people~ is adopted. A Government }!ember: How long did It is amusing to find that the Labour you take to fall into linef party, with its notorious hatred of pre· cedents in legislation, should have to faH back on such an argument to justify a Jllr. JIILTON: I always made it clear where I stood. I was a member of the A.L.P. vital feature of its own internal organisa­ when the spirit of justice and decency per­ tion. Except in Parliamentary and legal meated the party and I was proud to belong practice, the sanction of precedents is to it. My sense of justice is so great and unjustified. The appeal is not to origins my abhorrence of Communism is so strong but to right and validity when political that I could never remain with a party that principles have to be settled, and we must perpetrated shocking injustices and was pre· dismiss the argument.'' pared to collaborate with Communism in this He then argued strongly under two headings country. against the pledge. 638 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

Jlir. Aikens: What is the name of the an Independent Labour candidate and opposed book? the endorsed Labour candidate. Later he went back to the A.L.P., and now .he is a very Jlir. HILT ON: "Liberalism in Australia." ardent Marxist. JUr. Aikens: Written by whom? Mr. Evans: You followed him for years.

lUr. HILT ON: H. V. Evatt, M.A. LL.B. Jlir. HILTON: I never followed him 1 do not know what the Liberals will think once it was evident that a policy of collab­ of this. He continues- oration with the Communists was to be the '' A part from this, it is not consoling to order of the day. When it was given out find that Liberal parties in England, as that those wrongly termed Rightists had to well as in Australia, are tending towards be liquidated and expelled from the Labour an adoption of the caucus system. It is Party, how could any man with a sense of on this question that Liberalism should be justice and decency accept such a policy~ prepared to fight once again for freedom and liberty, and it is wrong that those ideals JUr. Aikens: The letter you wrote him of political and social philosophy should be was headed, ''Dear Doe.'' sacrificed on the altar of utility and party discipline. Australian Liberalism will do 1\'Ir. HILT ON: The hon. member is well to pause in this matter and consider being facetious. I never wrote to him in my in what direction it is going. Certain sug­ life. The people in my electorate know me gestions for the betterment of the present and know what I stand for. party system we shall consider below. lUr. Hanlon: Do you agree with the Meanwhile we must express the hope that hon. member for Baroona that your prefer­ the vital principle of representative govern­ ences should go to the Australian Labour ment will not be sacrificed.'' Party in the ];'ederal election or not~ 1\'Ir. Jesson: Hallelujah! lUr. HILT ON: I will cast my preference and will advise my friends how to vote in that lUr. HILTON: I am glad of that inter­ election. I make the point that never as long jection by the hon. member for Hinchin­ as I live will I vote for a policy of collabora­ brook, although I know he cannot appreciate tion with the Communist Party. I make that the argument used. statement. I took that stand, whether it l\Ir. Davies: For how many years did meant my political extinction at the last elec­ you sign the pledge~ tion or in the future. I took it after full deliberation and I hope I never depart from lUr. HILT ON: Quite so. I freely admit it. that. I am merely making the point that democratic parliamentary representation was Mr. Hanlon: You disagree with the being sacrificed at the altar. The argument hon. member for Baroona ~ that the pledge should be paramount and Mr. Power: Never mind about the hon. should supersede democracy was used to member for Baroona. wreck the Labour Party, and I am quoting the arguments put forward by no less a person The CHAIRlliAN: Order! I ask hon. than Dr. Evatt, who stated- members to allow the hon. member for '' The appeal is not to origins, but to Carnarvon to proceed with his speech. right and validity when political principles have to be settled, and we must dismiss Mr. HILTON: I am afraid they do not the argument.''- know what they are doing. I should like to of the pledge. quote the concluding chapter in this book­ let which shows how Dr. Evatt went from An A.L.P. Jllember interjected. camp to camp. It says- liir. HILTON: Of course I have inter­ "We have attempted to justify the preted it correctly. My interpretation is in principles of Australian Liberalism and to conformity with the essay of this eminent show how 'the spirit of man may find jurist. itself in the social order; man may be obedient and yet free, and the more Jllr. Jesson: What year was that? obedient because he is free. The social authority may be still steadfast and the Mr. HILTON: It does not matter what more steadfast and imperative because it is year it was. It was at a time when he was rooted in the hearts of its subject.' In a lecturer in law. these words of Henry .Tones, the newer liir. Walsh: He wrote many good books. political philosophy finds its justification and its ideals and principles, its con­ Jlir. HILTON: Of course he did, but at ceptions of equality of opportunity, and the same time he has been something of a of the equation of social service to social political adventurer because in this book he reward have found embodiment in the espouses as no other man has or could espouse legislation of our young Commonwealth. the cause of Liberalism in Australia. He Liberalism in Australia has had a then went from Liberalism to the ranks of remarkable development, when one considers the Australian Labour Party and then became that, when the great Reform Bill was Supply. [14 OCTOBER.] Supply. 63~

passed in England, its own seeds were Party would realise that the stand that WEl' being sown in Sydney by Wentworth. have taken is the correct one. At the forth­ Liberalism in Australia is the spirit of coming elections, the people of Australia Liberalism taking its time to reveal itself, should make a determined effort to ensure and teaching its adherents in the rest of that no party that will collaborate with Com­ the world its new possibilities in practice, munists holds the reins of government. Ho11 and even its new implications in theory. members have only to go into the Parliament­ Liberalism in Australia is not to be identi­ ary Library and read the history of Czecho­ fied with any closed system of political slovakia, which was the shining jewel of maxims nor with any one political party. democratic Europe during the post-World War But that it is as much a living force to­ I era, to realise the truth of what I am say­ day as when it entered its first protests jug. Following the first free election after against privilege and tyranny, no one who World War II. there were only a handful of knows the ideals of Australia can reason­ Communists in the Czechoslovakian Govern­ ably doubt." ment but the Socialists collaborated with them and within two years a Communist GoYern­ ~Ir. Davies: What did the hon. member ment was in control. We have all read about for Bundaberg say about discipline in the the alleged suicides that took place. The Labour Party~ undercover Communists are to be feared more ~Ir. HILTON: If the hon. member wants than those who come out in the open. As to read anything let him read it. My time is soon as the Communists gain power, the limited. I have tried to make an objective undercover men manifest their presence very speech by throwing a few views onto the quickly. And it can happen here. I say political screen so that those who think can that with all sincerity after a close study of form their own opinions. the matter. I give that message to the people of the State, and I hope that I have ~Ir. Evans interjected. the opportunity of giving it in greater detail before the forthcoming Federal election. 1\Ir. HILT ON: The Minister for Mines cannot say that. As to my association with I resent the slurs cast on me today by the the Labour Party I have always made it clear Leader of the Opposition. I have been associ­ where I stood on vital principles. ated with the Labour movement since my early days, and everybody who knows me 1\Ir. J\'Iann: Would you support trade realises ·where I stand. I shall always stand with Red China~ firm on my political convictions. If it comes to collaborating with any party, I would 1\Ir. HILT ON: The hon. member for sooner collaborate with a Country Party Gov­ Brisbane should have been present earlier ernment than with a Communist Party Gov­ when I gave a few worth while ideas on the ernment. matter. For the information of the hon. member I repeat I would not like to see him Let there be no misunderstanding. If I and the hon. member for Kedron act as they were faced with the alternative of collabora­ did 12 months ago when they screamed about tion with the Communists and collaboration selling wool to Japan and bringing Japanese with some other party, I would do my utmost goods here to undermine the standards of to oppose a Communist Party Government or living of Australian workers and so bring anybody who was prepared to help the Com­ about unemployment in this country. munists to gain power. Mr. Aikens: You opposed a referendum ~1r. W ALSH (Bundaberg) (8.34 p.m.): to ban Communism~ I thought that the interesting speech by the hon. member for Carnarvon would have given Mr. HILTON: Yes. I based my view on some encouragement to members of the the attitude adopted by all those associated official Opposition to deal not only with with the mother of democratic Parliaments. matters relating to the Budget but also with You cannot cure the soul of a man by legis­ the criticism that he levelled at them on a lation. Communism is a mental disease and documentary basis. no matter what legislation is passed you can­ not cure it spiritually by that method. You 1\Ir. Davies: You would not call that can do much by constructive and uplifting criticism, would you~ legislation to ensure that the rights embodied ~Ir. W ALSH: I hope I never criticise in in the United Nations charter are carried the same way as the hon. member for Mary­ out. Many who have a blind loyalty to the borough does. A.L.P. think that nothing out of the ordinary has happened. That is understandable Despite what the hon. member for Carnar­ because they have not followed the political von has said, and despite the attempts of scene closely but have been misled by members of the official Opposition to belittle spurious propaganda circulated by those in Dr. Evatt, I have always been big enough the A.L.P. and by the Metropolitan Press. to recognise him as a great jurist and as a They do not realise the true position, and man who has taken his place in the inter­ up to a point I admire their loyalty to a national sphere in trying to overcome the cause. But if we could g.et the message over difficult problems that face the world. But to them and give them all the facts, many dealing with him on a political basis is an of the decent men in the Australian Labour entirely different matter. Simply because 640 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

the hon. member for Carnarvon reads from walked over and destroyed the Labour Gov­ a book written by Dr. Evatt is no justifica­ ernment that had been given a mandate by tion for them to attempt to belittle him. the people of Australia, exactly in the same In his sphere, in his right place, Dr. Evatt way as they did in this Chamber with the has made great contributions; but in the Labour Government that was elected in 1956. politics of Australia he certainly has done a great deal of damage. Mr. Davies: The same as the Q.L.P. did. You walked over. Jtir. Aikens: One of the best lawyers and one of the worst politicians we have ever ])fr. W ALSH: It will never be on the known. conscience of any of the members of the Q.L.P. that they failed to honour the obli­ Jtir. W ALSH: I have said that. Horses gations that were entrusted to them by the for courses, as it were. Every man in his people of Queensland, as their representa­ right place. tives in the Parliament-to give effect to their wishes, not the wishes of a small Jtir. DA VIES: I rise to a point of order. section who sought to dictate to the Parlia­ The hon. member for Bundaberg is incorrect ment of the State. when he says the official Opposition belittled our Federal leader, Dr. Evatt. The state­ Mr. Hanlon: When you went in the ment is incorrect; it is offensive to the country only 28 per cent. of your supporters members of the Opposition and I ask that backed you. it be withdrawn. Mr. W ALSJI: Irrespective of what hon. The CHAIRltiAN: Order! I ask the members say I am going to get on to the hon member for Bundaberg to withdraw the Budget; but let me remind the novice from remark that is offensive to the hon. member Ithaca that in the birthplace of the Austra­ for Maryborough. lian Labour Party, in the territory where the first 16 Labour members were returned to ])[r. W ALSH: If it is offensive to the this Assembly, the Q.L.P. got 50 per cent. hon. member for Maryborough I have no of the votes. alternative to withdrawing it out of respect to your position, Mr. Taylor. But it has come lUr. Hanlon: How many did they get in North Toowoomba~ to a sorry pass if an hon. member in this Chamber cannot form an impression from the lUr. W ALSH: It does not matter what attitude and the spoken words of another they got in North Toowoomba. When they hon. member. Surely to goodness there is allied themselves with the Liberals, yes! The nothing in the Standing Orders that takes Leader of the Opposition will not deny that away my right to form an impression from he got a greater vote than the previous Leader the statement of another hon. member! I of the Opposition, the late Les Wood, but resented it at the time and I interjected and only because he got the support of the gave credit to Dr. Evatt only because the Liberals. I will never be found in a coali­ hon. member for Maryborough sought to tion with the enemies of Labour. ridicule him in the way he was interjecting during the speech of the hon. member for ])fr. ])fann interjected. Carnarvon. Mr. W ALSH: The hon. member for lUr. Hanlon: It is your warped mind. Brisbane is likely to go over there. He would be likely to be one to destroy the llir. W ALSJI: The hon. member may Labour Party. It would suit his outlook. think that. Irrespective of what might be said about the elements in the Q.L.P., the Q.L.P. will ltir. Davies: You walked out on him in be the challenge in the forthcoming Federal Hobart. elections both to the Menzies Government and ])Ir. WALSH: If the hon. member wants the Australian Labour Party if they do not to enter into controversy on these matters put forward a policy consistent with the I can assure him I will not let him down. welfare of the people. Apart from what they I have a few other matters to talk about. If tried to do to any other hon. member I the hon. member for Maryborough has no know all the force they brought into regrets I for one have some that he and Bundaberg, including Dr. Evatt, who never others walked across the floor of the Chamber said one word against me that would be and allied themselves with the enemy of the understood. Despite all their efforts I still true Labour Party to destroy the Labour ended up with the greatest percentage of Government. He is in the same category as Labour votes in history while the Labour the man the hon member for Carnarvon candidate got the smallest percentage of votes referred to, Mr. Eddie Ward. The records ever recorded for a Labour candidate in of the Federal Parliament show that Eddie Bundaberg. Ward in his day was one of the five who Let me leave that now because I want to walked over after a pact with Mr. Latham, say a few words about the Treasurer. now Sir John Latham, at that time the Thrusting all this petty political intrigue Leader of the Opposition. When the ques­ aside, it will be agreed that irrespective of tion that forced the issue in the House was disagreement on political policy the Budget put, Eddie Ward was one of the five who presented to the Committee, irrespective of Supply. [14 OcTOBER.] Supply. 641

who presents it or the Government in power, them they admitted to me that the thing .could be regarded generally as a very Impor­ was all double-Dutch to them. I do not know tant document. It could be accepted as a how the Treasurer thought he was going to {iocument presenting the financial and put it over that the average worker or layman economic picture of the State. I think that would be able to understand the document. is how the community outside would expect I never expected that every hon. member it to be presented. It also shows the record would be able completely to understand all of the Government and their capacity to the statements in such a document as the handle the State's finances. Financial Statement or the Financial Tables. I recall that the Treasurer himself got into If we eliminate from the Financial State­ great difficulty one year when the then Leader ment the usual statistical data, or the of the Opposition, the hon. member for J:a~~s­ statistical data that has been presented by borough, entrusted to him the responsibility the Treasurer-which, of course, would of leading the debate on the Budget pre­ eliminate much data that has been presented sented by myself. No doubt t~e Treasu_rer previously about the Commonwealth-State will recall the difficulty he had m followmg relationship-what remains presents a picture some of the statements which were no dif­ of failure and despair. I am wondering ferent, so far as statistical data and :financial whether the Treasurer has taken his cue from tables were concerned, from what they were the attitude adopted by his co-partner in the in previous years. If the Treasurer got his civic arena, the Lord Mayor. The Lord Trust Funds and Consolidated Revenue mixed Mayor wants to get rid of everything that up, that was just too bad .. I. know that is causing embarrassment to the City Council. .accountants might have certam Ideas about He wants to get rid of the buses and the the presentation of a balance sheet to share­ trams, everything that he can throw off his holders. Frequently I got up at the annual shoulders, rather than face up to the position meeting of shareholders at the Pla~e Cr~ek and bring down a policy that will inspire the Mill in orC!er to pinpoint the mampulatwn people and give them some hope in the future that was being indulged in by the manage­ Df the city. After we eliminate some of the ment of the mill in order to hide from the 'Treasurer's subtle jibes and criticism" we find growers the actual financial position. All I that he appears to be grasping in all direc­ can say in this case is that the Treasurer tions in the hope that somebody will come may or may not have. I am not going to along to help him to get out of the :financial say that the hon. gentleman is quite bona predicament the State is in. The Treasurer :fide in the matter. He may have other will blame everybody but himself or his ideas. I am not here to criticise unduly. 'Government. In this respect I am not going Where there is something of advantage I to the lengths of the Leader of the Opposition and make all sorts of apologies. My criticism think credit should be given. In the Federal is directed in the same way in an official sphere they have a Public Accom;tants Com­ mittee. Professor Bland who IS accepted, capacity. Other than that I do not want to I think, as an authority on ~hese say anything about the Treasurer. I have matters is chairman of that committee. made statements before regarding the hon. Senator Condon Byrne, the Q.L.P. Senator gentleman's capacity to do certain things as and candidate in the forthcoming Federal far as private interests are concerned. I made elections, was accepted in that committee as the same reference to the hon. member for a member who thoroughly understood the Toowong, for whom I have a high regard, accountancy procedure and the different about his capacity to handle things from an accountancy point of view, but when it came phases of presentation of public :finance .. I to political things and the welfare of the remember that some few years ago a promm­ ent witness before that committee in evidence workers the hon. gentleman was no different made a statement that the budgetary system from the Treasurer. The hon. gentleman's first consideration would be to those who keep in Queensland was the best syst~m to come them where they expect to remain as a under notice of the Federal Pubhc Accounts 'Government. Committee. I am not throwing out my chest or saying that that was to the credit ?f the Much was said about the presentation of previous Government. Not at all, but It was the Budget. People were led to believe that a system developed by successive Labour it would be a document that the average man Governments since 1915. As that was the in the street would be able to understand. opinion of an independent aut~or~ty who Strangely enough, the afternoon the Treasurer examined the Queensland system, It IS to the presented his Budget, for the :first time in credit in the :first instance, of the Treasury history someone was in the gallery distribut­ department, which was res~onsible for the ing the Treasurer's Financial Statement to preparation of all :financial data. . T~e the audience. I never knew that to happen Treasurer knows that. He knows that It ~s before. I probably held that single portfolio not for him or for that matter any of his longer than any other person, with the excep­ predecessors; to determine the :final result. tion of Mr. Theodore, and I never resorted to He must depend on the officers who are experts the practice of having a copy distributed to in these particular matters. The statement people in the gallery. It has come to my know­ of that expert witness before the Federal ledge that amongst those in the gallery were Public Accounts Committee would indicate, several persons who had been educated at at least in regard to the presentation of the University and who are still employed accounts, that there was no dishonesty on the there. When discussing the matter with part of the Government. I go further, and 1958-x 642 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

the Treasurer can check my statement. In reported correctly. The Treasurer was exag­ this State there are more trust funds than gerating when he said that a certain amount in any other State of the Commonwealth. was paid back less £329,000. What does that mean~ It means that the average person interested in the financial JUr. Hiley: Tt was years before you position of the State has a better chance of paid it back. tracing money placed to the credit of a fund and money taken out of a fund. It is all l\Ir. W AJ,SH: It does not matter when we paid it back. The fact remains that it accounted for, as detailed in the Auditor­ was paid back. It 1vas purely a budgetary General's report. This so-called simplicity may lead to such a position that the Govern­ position. The Treasurer does not wa~t any­ one to believe that because he has debited to ment can cover their financial misdeeds. Consolidated Revenue losses on the various Whether that happens in the future remains trading concerns such as the Collinsville and to be seen, but I should say in this particular case, if I may say it in a political sense, Ogmore mines it is going to present. any that this can be accepted as one of the great­ different picture. Losses on these parhcul~r est political confidence tricks ever put over. undertakings were financed from Consoli­ dated Revenue and every member of the lUr. Aikens: Are you referring to this Chamber got a picture showing what the Budget~ operations were in the coal mines and what the losses were. JUr. WALSH: Yes. I should say that lUr. Hiley: You stole i~ from the poc~et nobody who understands the real position of Consolidated Revenue mstead of stealmg will be deluded into believing that because it from the Public Service Superannuation of an adjustment in the presentation of the Fund and the State Insurance Fund. Financial Statement or accounts of the State an extra penny will be received by way of lUr. W ALSH: That is where accountancy revenue. comes into these things. It came out of I can remember in years gone by criticism Consolidated Revenue but we paid no interest. of the previous Government, and that criticism If the Treasurer is going to show that it continued for some time, over the transfer of should have come out of the State Insurance £250,000 from the Main Roads fund to Con­ Office-- solidated Revenue. It was frequently used lUr. Hiley: That is where you took it by Labour opponents on the hustings to from. demonstrate that funds collected from motor­ ists were going to Consolidated Revenue for lUr. WALSH: No. The hon. gentleman purposes other than road construction. Of cannot say that that is so. course, those persons never pointed out that Mr. Hiley: You took it out of trust. there was a balancing of the position, under which the Main Roads fund benefited in an­ Mr. W ALSH: Do not try to delude the other direction, in that loan moneys balanced Committee in that respect. If you take money those amounts. out of trust, irrespective of what .t~ust. fund your cash reserves are in, you utilise It for liir. Hiley: Not quite. Government purposes. Jir. W ALSH: The Treasurer says l\Ir. Aikens: You are a pair of financial "Not quite," but that depends on the manne~ Blondins. in which you approach it. J\Ir. W ALSH: The fact that you have lUr. Hiley: The Auditor-General says reserves in the Unemployment Insurance Fund that you failed to pay back £329,000. and other trust funds, they still show a credit, and that is nothing more or less _than what. I ltir. W ALSH: We failed to pay it back? have told the Committee. I pomted out m March, 1957, when there was an overall cred~t ltir. Hiley: You had £2,500,000 and you so far as reserves were concerned of approXI­ put it all back excepting £329,000. mately £20 000 000 that there was little over £12 000 ooo' actually available in cash and lUr. 1YALSH: It could be quite true. inv~stm~nts to meet a particular indebtedness l\Ir. Hiley: It is true. when certain industrial reforms and condi­ tions were being sought. No matter how you l\Ir. W ALSH: I am not denying that can juggle figures you cannot giv~ the. funds statement. Far be it from me to contradict any more. I hope the Treasurer Is go:ng to a statement made by the Auditor-General. enlarge on his system, and I should hke to Do not let us overlook the fact that Consoli­ see the ·Jorm of legislation he brings down dated Revenue is being charged with quite a to justify investments, and so on. It could lot of expenditure which could justiably be become more difficult for hon. members to charged to these particular funds. follow the actual financial position if the Treasurer is going to juggle everything into l\Ir, Aikens: Why wasn't it? Consolidated Revenue. He knows that as well as I do. One good cover-up for any Govern­ l\Ir. W ALSH: It was charged adminis­ ment is to place as much money as they can tratively, yes. So far as that act is con­ into Consolidated Revenue from their financial cerned, the Auditor-General has probably resources. Supply. [14 OcTOBER.] Supply. 643

lUr. Hiley: You tried to hide it. Further down on page 6 the Treasurer says- lUr. WALSH: That is what the '' On 15th May last £6,555,000 of 4 per Treasurer is doing. At least we put the Trust cent short term Commonwealth Govern­ l<'und there. An account must be kept of what ment Securities held as a Trust and goes into the Trust Fund and what comes out Special Fund investment matured. This of it. If a new policy of bolstering the presented a good opportunity to review Consolidated Revenue Fund is put into effect, the form of our investment and to deter­ it will be interesting to see how it works mine future policy.'' out. The Treasurer may parade his new This is where a Treasurer has to depend very system of presenting the Budget, but I have largely on his departmental officers, and pointed out previously that the Federal Public it is to the credit of his Assistant Under Accounts Committee regarded the previous Secretary for finance that he at least drew Queensland system as the best in Australia. my attention to the fact that the Government were holding too much cash, which was quite The Treasurer knows as well as I do that true. From there on, after discussion, as .his counterparts in the Federal sphere have with some of the parliamentary funds that rmmerous 'l'rust J<'unds. In 1956, when the could not be used, moneys were invested in present Government were in Opposition they Commonwealth stocks to give a good return criticised my Government on having to the funds by way of interest rather than £26,000,000 in reserves, and in a dishonest leave them on fixed deposit in a savings bank political approach to the subject, Sir Arthur or trading bank earning a low rate of Fadden upheld their line of argument. The interest. In reviewing the policy, it was obvious that the previous Government's 'freasurer may wish to dissociate himself from method of investing was to see that the such statements and say that he did not money would be on call at reasonable periods. make them, but they were peddled through That was carefully worked out, as the Trea­ sources associated with the then Opposition surer will know. All he has to do is to and were widely circulated. At that time, look at the dates and he will see that there ho>vever, the Federal Government had reserves was a reason for it, especially as we were of £733,000,000 in various funds. Does any­ getting a rougher and rougher spin from body believe that they actually had that sum the Federal Government. in liquid resources~ Of course not. The The Treasurer then refers to the new policy National 'IV elf are Fund showed a balance of on investments and sets out a table, which well over £50,000,000, and various other funds should be informative to hon. members, showed that in the aggregate almost showing that for the financial year 1958-59 £733,000,000 was available to the Federal the investment face value is £1,263,500 and giving the figures right through to 1972-73. Government. If that were so, why did they In other words, he has gone a long way budget this year for a deficit of £110,000,0001 ahead and tied up the money without any It was only because there is a substantial knowledge of what the picture will be even deficit in the Sinking Fund for a start. next year. I do not want to be a pessimist The Treasurer knows that there are two but rather a realist. I make the frank types of Trust and Special Funds, namely, admission that if I were in in the position those that are actually determined in the of the State Treasurer or the Federal House and provided for in an Act of Parlia­ Treasurer I should probably do the same as ment, and the Special Funds that are created they will have to do next year. With the by Executive ni1nute. No doubt in arriving fall in the values of wool, metal and farm at his deficit the Treasurer has had a look products, is it not obvious that the same at the Hospital, Motherhood and Child Wel­ revenue will not come into the Federal cof­ fare Fund and the Grafton-Kyogle-Soutli fers as in previous years~ That is the big Brisbane Railway Fund, and various other problem that will face the national Govern­ funds, to bring his deficit to the figure that ment, whoever they may be after the elec­ he has presented. But it does not neces­ tions, and the State Governments, who have sarily follow that that is the true position. to depend on the Commonwealth Gover11111ent to finance much of their works programme. The Treasurer had a good deal to say It is true that something can be done with about cash balances and investments. On Treasury bills and finance, but there is a page 6 of the Financial Statement he sub­ limit to that. The Treasurer will remember mits a table showing Trust and Special Funds that I made the observation last year that with a credit of £9,747,565 and Loan Fund the Commonwealth Government would make with a credit of £310,825, making a total of substantial bank credit available some time £10,058,390. He shows also a debit in the before the Federal elections to bolster up Consolidated Revenue Fund of £5,211,595. their case for support at those elections It He i~ not honestly conveying his opinion is perfectly obvious to me, and it should be when he tries to convince the Committee that to the Treasurer, that, the Federal Govern­ the State's cash resources and investments ment not having thrown out any baits or have dwindled from the figure he mentions in carrots for the electors as a whole in the the first instance to £4,846,795. He must Budget brought down by Sir Arthur Fadden, have at his disposal the same amount of cash the next Budget to be brought down by reserves and investments as previously. them, if I may make the observation at this 644 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply. stage and put it on record, will be a real some reference to drought. All I ask is that shocker, far from comparable with the hon. members of the Country Party take out Budgets of 1951, 1952 and 1953 and far statistics for 1951, 1952 and 1953; let them from comparable with the Little Horror put on record the production in the various Budget of 1956. Believe me, the taxpayers primary industries, whether it is sugar, wheat, and workers generally are in for a rude shock wool or cattle, remembering that on that when they are faced with the next Budget occasion_ there was a State-wide drought. to be brought down by the Federal Treasurer. It was nof confined to the south-eastern area As to investments, ther@ was a time when as was the case up till the end of last year or the Government had considerable cash the beginning of this year. It applied reserves. My attention was wisely drawn to throughout the north. Mills that normally the matter by the Assistant Under Secretary started in May or June did not start till July for Finance. I have already given him the or August and mills that normally finished in credit for what was done. Instructions went January finished in November. The main effect out to make the necessary arrangements for of the drought last year was felt in Bunda­ investments. I do not know that there is berg, Maryborough and Isis. The:v still had anything wrong with investing the State's record crops in the North. The railway tables resources on a proper and sensible basis. The are some guide, although not a complete one. Treasurer might try to ridicule the policy of I think the Treasurer will agree with me even the previous Government, but at least it though the railways may be a bugbear to him can be said that the policy pursued by the as they were to me. They have their good previous Government did result in continuous years and bad years. I fully appreciate the full-time employment in Queensland. hon. gentleman's difficulty. I realise that the Hon. members can talk about the drought. Treasury people may get the blame for many I will give them something to look into as time things when the blame should lie on the goes on. Droughts are very nasty occur­ shoulders of other people. On page 16, Table rences. They are nasty for Governments but 05 it shows that in 1951-1952 the revenue they are even worse for the individual. But from the railways was £18 1s. 5d. per head of do not let us be crying on one another's population, and in 1952-1953 it was £19 10s. 5d., and in 1957-1958 it was £24 3s. 7d. That shoulders about the Government's finances, saying that drought is the sole cause of their could be classed as a drought year and the financial difficulties. revenue was £5 per head of population higher than it was for the year 19o2-1953 and £6 per Mr. Rae: The drop in wool prices. head higher than it was for the year 1951- 1952. 1\'Ir. WALSH: I have already said that there has been a substantial decline. Every­ lUr. Hiley: How often have you body has to take notice of that, not only the increased the rail charges in between? wool-grower. Irrespective of what field they are employed in, all who are dependent upon ~Ir. W ALSH: I am coming to those. income from prod,_uction have to take serious Of course we increased them; once or twice notice of the decline in values of primarv at the most. The fact remains that in the production. I do not have to claim what I year prior to the year in which the present am about to say because the Treasurer has Government took office there was no increase. already claimed it. I refer to the State's ~Ir. Yes, there was-1 August. improved financial position. The Treasurer Hiley: will agree that in examining the overall ~Ir. W ALSH: It was a special classi­ financial position of a State it is not only fication of certain goods. In 1951-1952 the the Government's programme that has to be expenditure was £19 Ss. per head and in 1952- taken into consideration, but also the semi­ 1953 it was £21 9s. 7d., and in 1957-1958 it governmental programme. The Treasurer will was £25 13s. 2d. per head. The point I make admit that there is over £3,000,000 more is that despite the great margin in revenue being made available by way of approvals for it varied from £6 per head higher than under local authorities compared with the last year a Labour Government and in this case the of office of the Labour Government­ expenditure is frCJm £4 to £6 in round figures, £16,400,000 as against £19,000,000 odd. That higher per 1iead. The test is there. While appears in the Treasurer's Financial State­ the drought may have had some effect it was ment. They are not my words. The Treas­ not the sole reason for the State 's financial urer will also agree that in his Statement he difficulties. has made reference to the numerous grants Regarding the claim for a special grant, I the Government have received from the do not think that the Treasurer believes that Federal Government, a special grant of the Commonwealth will give this State the £500,000, and other assistance amounting to consideration to which it is entitled having £1,125,000. Yet with all that and the increase regard to pr

they wanted to cultivate South Australia, take the attitude, "Why should we pay a Western Australia or Tasmania there was a levy on production to assist in the. recon­ medium by which they could give financial ditioning of the line between Townsv1lle and assistance to those States. I quoted from Mt. Isa for the benefit of one of our Sir Thomas Playford 's Budget speech some competitors~" If it is a matter of taking three or four years ago in which he said that sides on issues that concern the other States that State would no longer require financial and Queensland, I could bet my life that the assistance but it is still being given to that Menzies-Fadden Government will take the State. side of Broken Hill and put this impost on Although the Government whe~ in opposi­ th@ State. tion threw in the teeth of the previous Govern­ }Ir. Hiley: You should know that there ment that South Australia under a Liberal was a unanimous vote by the Commonwealth Government had the highest taxable capacity and every State that an application should be of any State-a misleading ~pproach, made to the World Bank by Queensland for obviously-that is the State that st1ll gets a that advance. considerable hand-out from Canberra, and that is the State that will continue to get a Mr. W ALSH: I know that, but I know considerable handout. also that would not be any different from the position in regard to South Australia and the The value of the financial policy of the uranium treatment works in that State. I Treasurer will be revealed in the current am not going to discuss that. The conditions financial year. I do not think any hon. me~­ have not been published. Do not let it be ber would not wish the Government well m said that I do not know of some of the their financial policy if it will give employ­ intricacies of the Loan Council. It would ment or keep people in employment. I~ is have to get permission. I hate to think that sufficient to say that under the prevwus any State would take up the attitude that Government's financial policy there was no Queensland has no right to go to the World question of unemployment. As and. when there Bank to develop resources so important to were signs of unemployment, as there were Australia, not so much to Queensland. There in 1952-1953, the Government took steps to is silence on the part of the Premier and the remedy the position. At that time they Treasurer. The Press have buttoned-up so made available an additional £1,000,000 for far as the particular mission is concerned. Main Roads work and dispensed with the It is pretty hard to break down barriers and procedure of waiting for Orders in Council, it is to the credit of the local provincial Press plans, and so on. That was done to h.elp that it published my comments on the matter. workers who because of the short crushmg Far be it from me to damn the scheme. In season, were' on the roads without a job. the previous Cabinet we kept our confidences and if any member of the Cabinet could be The Premier and the Treasurer have made challenged for talking out of place that could a mouthful of what they expect from the not be said of the previous Premier or myself. Commonwealth Government by way of grant. If the Federal Treasurer took somebody to I shall say now what I said in Bundaberg task for blowing too loudly, that is too bad. recently about the Mt. Isa proposal. I The Premier can rest assured that so far as should say that the Premier is in a positio.n the Queensland Labour Party is concerned, to tell this Chamber and the people of th1s irrespective of politics, we wish the Govern­ State that that project has been turned. down ment success in the negotiations. I think because the Commonwealth Government are that can be said for every hon. member. The not prepared to accept the conditions that people are entitled to know if Queensland is the ·world Bank will impose for the advance going to be left in the lurch once again. of £30,000,000. The Financial Statement deals Very definitely I say that it would be to their with the £7,000,000 to be found by Queens­ ever-lasting disgrace if the Commonwealth land. The Treasurer in the Financial State­ Government were not prepared to make some ment qualified the provision of that money by sacrifice for the the development of a project saying that the Government would take steps, which must assist their finances and the if the money was not wanted, to put it to finances of every State of Australia more other uRe. That is quite sound and I agree so than Queensland. When there is talk about with it, but I should think that the Treasurer the depressed state of finance overseas, what would have good reason to believe with the would it mean if this project ~ould be Premier that there is no chance of the Govern­ speeded up and more and more of its output ment's being called on to expend that money exported overseas~ as part of the total project. I have discussed one phase in relation to JUr. Hiley: You are quite wrong. Mt. Isa but I want to now deal with the recent inquest at Mt. Isa. I hope that the }fr. WALSH: I hope I am wrong, but Government will not stay put so far as that there is evidence that £23,000,000 must be question is concerned. If ever there was a found by somebody else, and the terms and disgusting exhibition and waste of public conditions under which repayment of that money in the manner in which the case was sum is to be made are vital factors in discus­ presented to the coroner I do not know where sions between the Commonwealth Government, anyone could find it. Whatever the motives Mt. Isa, and Broken Hill. That is true, might have been in the first place for and the Broken Hill people would probably re-opening the inquiry-and I am not sure 646 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Questions. that the motives were bona fide-we have appointment of a royal commission. That witnessed the sorry spectacle of having should be done, irrespective of whether the engaged two men to investigate. That investi­ people in the Police l''orce concerned are gation would have cost some thousands of supernumeraries or top-ranking officers. pounds in covering all the areas in which they (Time expired.) had to travel by plane and car, and if the Progress reported. expense was justified one could not cavill at it-if it proved who bashed J orgensen in The House adjourned at 9.36 p.m. the cells. Has the expense been justified~ Members of the Police Force went in to the witness box and in effect called one another liars. The great body of men in the Force are respected but so long as this particular suspicion is hanging over the heads of innocent parties it gives the impression to the public mind that there is something wrong with the administration of the Police Force. I hope that the Premier will not let the matter rest. It is not a good thing for the community. Do not let us have all the propaganda which has developed against the Government of New South Wales prompted probably in some cases by Communist agitators. That is not the point here. I give the Premier credit for acting in a bona fide way, but I hold the view that the inquest was reopened for the purpose of whitewashing somebody and to try to expose inefficiency on the part of somebody else. However, the attempt failed miserably. This is a very serious matter. I do not see why any relative of the deceased man should be put to the continued expense of trying to solve the mystery. So far the workers in Mt. Isa have stuck to Jorgensen's brother and have contributed very largely to the expenditure incurred by him. However, there is a justifiable demand that the Govern­ ment should appoint a royal commission and that people who were initially accused of entering into a conspiracy to defeat the ends of justice should be called as witnesses. We cannot ignore the fact that following the original inquest the coroner suggested in his findings that the secretary of the Queensland Police Union may have committed an offence under the Criminal Code. He went to Mt. Isa and told members of the union, in effect, to "button up" and not impart any informa­ tion that they had on the incident. At the recent inquest, too, Mr. McGill, who appeared to assist the coroner, asked questions about whether there was a conspiracy among mem­ bers of the Police Force-one passing the buck to the other. What a terrible thing to happen! After studying the published re­ ports and comparing them with the depositions in the appeals following the suspension of the two police officers, how could anyone be satisfied 1vith the administration of the Police Forcer lUr. Power: Somebody should be charged with perjury. Mr. WALSH: That is a matter for the Government's legal advisers. Howm·er, having regard to the submissions made to the Police Appeal Board and the evidence that was obtained following the reopening of the investigation, the Premier would be justified in giving serious consideration to the