Max mosley The charmingly ruthless ex-FIA president is in a mischievous mood. On the agenda: the closure of McLaren, ‘nonsense’ bloggers and his problem with F1’s new tracks. But he’d happily buy Ron a beer and reckons Bernie should be knighted…

Words hANS SEEBERG Portraits ANDY TIPPINg

ome on, let’s go for lunch gentlemanly manners straight from A couple of hours in Max Mosley’s – then we can have a good a 1960s Bond film. Even his fiercest company make it almost impossible to old gossip about all the detractors would concede that he has a believe that he could be capable of the “C things I couldn’t say into that very specific charisma about him, and sort of ruthless leadership that’s been Dictaphone!” Max Mosley has spent an it’s a trait that makes it rather disarming associated with him since he became hour answering all your questions in his when the clinical precision of his legal president of the FIA back in 1993, but FIA office overlooking ’s Casino mind launches into a dissection of Luca don’t be fooled: everything he says is Square; every query has been dispatched di Montezemolo, or the woes of meticulously considered. This is a man with his trademark charming brutality. ‘Spygate’. It’s like Tony Hart suddenly who is not afraid of upsetting people, Mosley is quite a contradiction. He speaking with the bludgeoning clarity as you’re about to witness over the is softly spoken, with classic British of Gene Hunt from Ashes to Ashes. following pages… Ü

042 F 1 R a c i n g m a y 2 0 1 0 F1 Racing m a y 2 0 1 0 043 should succeed. But, unfortunately, in charge, it would never have got to that was already saying then that we needed the FIA is not in a position to insist stage. The classic case of people saying we to do something about safety. But the that this should be the case. favoured Ferrari was the barge boards, conventional wisdom was that it was which were legal if they were at a slight perfectly safe and we hadn’t killed anyone Why did you always tend to angle to the chassis and illegal if they for 12 years. You think, ‘Maybe if I’d favour Ferrari so much? were vertical. Now I think that they were pushed a bit harder…’ because they were Martin Wellbelove, UK probably vertical, but we took them off to completely unnecessary deaths. I liked Why have you got it in for something else to do. So, in the end, it What we want is innovation.” Well yes, We never did favour Ferrari, although look at them, and then it was possible for Ayrton too. I had this strange meeting so much? was just better to stop. of course we all want innovation, but there was this perception that we did. Ferrari to say, ‘No, they were at a slight with him once in Japan – it was very soon Paul Cullen, UK if it’s allowed to go unchecked it puts After I’d been in the job for a few years, angle’, and they got off on that basis. We after I’d been elected and he’d been very I really haven’t. There’s this theory that I Was there ever anyone in Formula 1 Formula 1 out of business. It’s all very I developed a very good relationship should have impounded the entire car, rude about my predecessor Jean-Marie don’t like Ron and it’s simply not true. that you totally trusted, and did well to say people can do what they like with : I knew he didn’t tell me but you live and learn and we would never Balestre. Ron wanted him to apologise On a personal level, he and I get on they trust you? technically, but if they’re going to go lies, and I think he knew the same. You make that mistake again. but there was no way he was going to do perfectly well, but clearly ‘Spygate’ has Barry Coldbreath, UK bankrupt in the process and you end up could go to Ferrari and they would be that. So Ayrton came to see me and I said, something to do with the perception. Yes… I totally trusted Jean Todt, Gerhard with just three teams competing, then it’s completely honest and open with you; How hard did you take Ayrton “Ayrton, there are two kinds of people in It’s nothing to do with liking or disliking Berger, Franz Tost, Frank Williams… and no good. Formula 1 is all about out-and- most of the other teams wouldn’t do Senna’s death personally? this world: amateurs and professionals. Ron, but I think he made a mistake. I’ve probably forgotten somebody I wish out competition, but you can only really that, so that created a certain perception Gavin Malewski, UK An amateur does something because he He should have come to us at the very I hadn’t. Bernie? Um… you could trust have that if you have a cost-cut… yet but it didn’t mean we favoured Ferrari. Strangely enough, I would say that I feels like it; a professional does something beginning and said, “Look I’m really there’s one team that’s been adamantly But you see, lately, Ferrari is not run probably took ’s because it aids whatever it is that he’s sorry, we’ve got this information. We opposed to that, and that’s Ferrari. by Todt but, essentially, by Luca di death on the same weekend even more trying to do. What you did about Balestre shouldn’t have it and I’m going to take And, in my view, the reason they have Montezemolo. Luca is very, very good personally because I thought he’d never was amateurish.” He thought for quite a whatever steps to correct it,” instead been adamantly opposed to a cost-cut with people and he’s certainly a very had a chance and never made it. I went long time and he said, “You’re right.” Then of coming to the World Council and is because they’re not prepared to take personable, pleasant person but, in my to his funeral while all the celebrities his eyes welled up and he said, “What you saying, “Nobody knew except Coughlan,” on the other teams on an equal basis. opinion, he’s also a very weak character went to Ayrton’s, because I thought that don’t understand is that I’ve been doing which later turned out not to be true. Back between January and May in 2008, so he’s easily led. He allowed himself to somebody should. But I was really sad this since I was six years old, and that man So that was very unfortunate. But there we had a series of meetings with all the get into a situation of conflict between because, in the end, you know that you took a race and probably a championship was nothing personal about it – it’s just chief financial officers of the teams, and Ferrari and the FIA whereas if Todt were have a degree of responsibility, and I away from me.” In the end, we cobbled Ü the way things were. I hope and think everyone was agreed on the cost-cap and that if I bumped into Ron in the street on the methodology – but Ferrari were we’d go off and have a coffee together. Current FIA president Jean Todt has Mosley’s “total trust” always against it. I think it’s because they Or a beer maybe. know that if they had the same amount Bernie… [pauses for 17 seconds] Bernie of money to spend as the other teams, What took you so long to step down can be trusted, with the proviso that in they would fail. as FIA president? the final analysis he will always look after Thomas Guilfoyle, USA his own interests, whereas that would If you had to share a taxi with Ron Well, I did step down in 2004, but the not necessarily be the case with the other Dennis, Flavio Briatore or Luca di FIA membership told me there had to be people I mentioned. Did they trust me? Montezemolo, who would it be and a succession. I told them I wanted Jean You’d have to ask them. why? Or would you rather walk? Todt to be my successor and, obviously, Richard Ginn, UK it’s a matter for the FIA to elect him or Were you aware that there was a Well firstly I’d have no problem getting not. Originally, in 2005, he was going campaign on Twitter last year to in a taxi with any of them, but if I did to stand and I wasn’t, but then he got get you out of office called ‘Max have to choose – and this may sound offered the big job at Ferrari and I had Out’? How does it feel to know that strange – I’d say Flavio. If it was a long no choice but to continue. But I did so many F1 fans were against you? taxi ride he would probably be the most actually do it for five years longer than Sarah Green, UK entertaining companion. I wanted to. I was always going to stand If the fans really understood the issues, down in 2009, and the only thing that I don’t think they would be against Who was responsible for your put that slightly into question was when me, because everything I’ve ever done personal life ending up in the Luca [di Montezemolo] started saying, has always been done with a view to newspapers? “We’ve got rid of him.” Of course, at keeping Formula 1 going and stopping Richard Walsh, Ireland that point, it was tempting to go on for it collapsing. It’s a much more fragile I’m still working on that question. We’ve a year, because it would have been quite structure than people realise. It doesn’t got suspicions, but there’s a huge gap easy to destroy FOTA and the breakaway bother me that a lot of fans were hostile, between suspicion and proof and I’m series would never have happened because I believe their hostility was not prepared to even move until I’ve got – they would never have been able to based on misinformation. I mean, a lot proof – which sooner or later I will get. get the commercial deals together and it of it is just assumption – you read things I’ve got some people looking…

would’ve folded. But it would have meant on blogs that are complete nonsense. You t going on for another year and Jean would get people saying things like, “Why don’t Do you regret that the new tracks probably have got fed up and found you just leave the regulations alone? in F1 are characterless seas of Tarmac, designed to test safety

standards rather than driver skill? e th ri ng to n /l a Gianni Fasulo, UK “If the fans understood I certainly don’t like the modern circuits. I think the fundamental problem is that they’re all done by the commercial rights the issues, I don’t think holder, using only one company to design Mosley in his unsuccessful them. Each new circuit should be put out F2 days: “If you don’t have the

to tender just as you would with a new talent, you need to recognise it” st e v ge tt y im age s. i n s e t: they’d be against me” building, and the best overall proposal m a i n :

044 F 1 R a c i n g m a y 2 0 1 0 F1 Racing m a y 2 0 1 0 045 together a statement, but it made me feel a great sympathy towards him. To me it’s the most awful thing in the world when somebody dies because it’s so final… and in the end you knew those two deaths could have been avoided.

Just who do you think you are? rather spend £10million a year refining boy in there?’ When I got into Formula 2, I once heard that won the Shambus McClure, USA their gearboxes than spend it on KERS, I had exactly the same car as Jochen 1983 title with illegal fuel. What’s That’s one of the less intelligent questions, because KERS is difficult. Every year Rindt, and those kind the most successful ‘cheat’ that you isn’t it? they shave a few microns off the gears of people, but I was just slower. And discovered too late? and it’s slightly more efficient, but that’s if you don’t have the talent, you need Peter Goodchild, UK Given the seriousness of ’s not what’s going to keep F1 going for to recognise it. I think it was the BMW fuel in 1983, intentional crash to fix the race the next 15 years. But, ultimately, I was but it wasn’t actually illegal because result at Singapore in 2008, their trying to get the money down, and those Who would be the best person to the rules were quite wide at that time. attempts to cover that up and their that have money didn’t want that because take over F1 after Bernie? The interesting thing about that fuel was possession of McLaren technical the further you bring costs down, the Antti Martikainen, Finland that it was something they found in the data, how can you justify their mild more rivals you’ve got. If there are ten Gerhard Berger. He’s very clever: he fuel company’s cellar in the old files – it punishment in comparison with teams with the same money and it’s fundamentally understands the business was the fuel that was used in the war for McLaren’s $100m fine? just a question of who’s got the biggest and always did his own deals. But there’s supercharged planes but with no lead in Mark S Everett, USA brain, then your chances of being in the only a small chance it would happen – it, because Germany was short of lead In Renault’s case the technical top three are much smaller – and that’s during the war. So they decided to try it. information was minimal compared really what it was about. I remember being told that it added an with that in McLaren’s case and, as far instant 100bhp. as Singapore goes, they held an internal Describe your character to us investigation and without any prompting in three words… Do you think that Ron Dennis from us got rid of the people concerned. Ben Clarke, Australia should get a knighthood for his Had McLaren done the same, I don’t [Pauses for 42 seconds] Lazy, achievements in motorsport? think there would’ve been any question well-intentioned… and enthusiastic. Rocky Tampin, UK of fining them $100m. The problem with But those things are constantly in conflict He should… and Bernie should, too. McLaren was that they first of all came to with each other. the World Council and told us something How would you have felt if that turned out not to be true and, when Was there ever a time as FIA Max reckons Berger is the man to take over from Bernie had won the FIA they came back, we still weren’t being told president that you didn’t enjoy it? presidency instead of Jean Todt? everything. I think they got away lightly, Adam Martin-Lawrence, UK I’m not sure he’d want to do it. Gerhard Kevin Joyce, Ireland because what I was putting forward Absolutely. In a job like that you’re under is an entrepreneur, and if he does I’d have been very worried, because was that they should be suspended for constant pressure and you’re solving business, he does it for himself to make I think Jean, with all his ability, is finding the rest of that season and the whole of other people’s problems; sometimes I money. I can’t really see him working it quite a struggle. It’s so much more the following one. If a team has stolen used to go round in a haze of irritation for CVC. I think a more likely figure complex than when I took over, and technical information from another team because there was always something would be some sort of outside, very able I think it would’ve been completely then the only fair thing to do is to kick really annoying happening. On the other manager and deal maker – somebody beyond Ari. There is endless scope for them out of the championship until that hand, there were moments that were who runs a big enterprise successfully. making mistakes, and I don’t think Ari information is no longer current. The enormously satisfying. There’s always Bernie’s great talent is in making deals, would have known where to start. difficulty is that I think it would’ve been this perception that I like trouble and an but he’s got his weaknesses like we all the end of McLaren. Would I have felt argument, but it’s not true. I like things have: his one blind-spot is the internet. Was the lifetime ban given to responsible if they’d gone under? No – I’d to run smoothly, but I hate being pushed I think that’s a great pity, because so Flavio Briatore too severe? think that they were responsible. If you around. So when I feel challenged I just much could be done with it. Denise Harvey, UK don’t come clean straight away and you feel an overwhelming urge to respond. Possibly, but we offered him the chance get caught, you’ve got nowhere to hide. But, you know, there would be times What do you think of Michael to go to the FIA Court of Appeal, which, when I’d go home and complain to my Schumacher’s return to F1? for reasons best known to himself, he Will you be remembered more for wife about certain aspects of the job and Michael Bielicki, Poland never accepted. Clearly the offence was your sex scandal than your safety she’d say, quite rightly, “Well no one I think he’s an absolute racer; you saw about as serious as it gets. I’ve spoken campaigns? forces you to do it.” it when he was being completely crazy to him once or twice since it happened, David Smith, Wales racing those motorbikes, one class up although it has been a bit quiet for I hope not… I hope not. If you went on Top Gear, could you from club level. I saw him just after he the past two or three months. It’s not beat Jay Kay’s record in the ‘Star started doing it and I said to him, “I have awkward talking to him now – he’s quite Bernie recently told F1 Racing that in a Reasonably Priced Car’? to say, Michael, I don’t think you should grown up. The only thing that annoyed F1 shouldn’t be run as a democracy. Dewe Gede Putra Angga Pradnyana, do it but it looks such fun.” He said, “It’s me was when he said to the Italian press Why did the teams have problems Indonesia brilliant – you have to come and try it.” that I enjoyed punishing people, which with your style of leadership? I’d try, but I doubt I’d be successful. I said, “Hang on, I’m nearly 70!” But was a reference to my problem with Jon JB Willis, UK I once went for a ride in a rally car with that’s how he thinks. The reason people the . I thought, ‘You Teams hate change and, technically, Colin McRae and after a few laps of leave Formula 1 is because they lose the shouldn’t have said that, it’s nothing to most of them are only comfortable with this test track he said, “Right, let’s swap urge. But he hasn’t. do with it.’ I would never refer to any of

refinement rather than innovation. I places.” So we did, and as far as the interesting rumours about him… t believed that we needed to innovate I was concerned I was going really fast, To whom, or in what situation, radically in technical areas and also get but when I watched the video of my do you not mind losing? Join our Reader Panel

the costs down. Because both of these laps and his, the difference was just so Eric Harkink, Holland Want to put a question to an F1 star? Visit be ll an c a /l things involved making significant depressing… actually it was funny. You I always mind losing, but sometimes www.f1racing.co.uk and join the Reader Panel. changes, the teams hated it. They would watched it thinking, ‘Who’s that poor old one has to accept it. We’ll let you know which interviews are coming up lor en zo

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