Tuesday Volume 501 24 November 2009 No. 4

HOUSE OF COMMONS OFFICIAL REPORT

PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES (HANSARD)

Tuesday 24 November 2009

£5·00 © Parliamentary Copyright House of Commons 2009 This publication may be reproduced under the terms of the Parliamentary Click-Use Licence, available online through the Office of Public Sector Information website at www.opsi.gov.uk/click-use/ Enquiries to the Office of Public Sector Information, Kew, Richmond, Surrey TW9 4DU; e-mail: [email protected] 381 24 NOVEMBER 2009 382

Andy Burnham: My right hon. Friend the Chairman House of Commons of the Select Committee is right to say that the outstanding progress the NHS has made on waiting times in the past decade should never be lost. We should lock in that Tuesday 24 November 2009 progress and the NHS should not slip back below those standards. The patients charter published on 3 March The House met at half-past Two o’clock 1995 gave an 18-month guaranteed waiting time for in-patient treatment. That is the measure of how far the national health service has come in recent times. I PRAYERS expect patients to endorse the proposal on that new right, but the NHS constitution will need to be updated in line with public expectations about the national [MR.SPEAKER in the Chair] health service. Norman Lamb (North Norfolk) (LD): The draft NHS constitution includes a right to drugs approved by the Oral Answers to Questions National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence, yet we are witnessing a growing crisis with patients unable to get hold of vital drugs for breast cancer, epilepsy and many other conditions. There is a long list HEALTH of drugs that are currently unavailable because people are exporting them and profiting from the exchange rate. Is this not a despicable trade? What are the Government The Secretary of State was asked— doing to stop it? Andy Burnham: I understand the concerns that the NHS Constitution hon. Gentleman expresses about parallel exports. The medicine supply chain is crucial and we are taking steps 1. Mr. Mark Lancaster (North-East Milton Keynes) in the Department to guarantee the security of crucial (Con): What recent assessment he has made of the medicines. He mentions the right in the constitution to effectiveness of the NHS constitution; and if he will “treatments...recommended by NICE...ifyourdoctor says make a statement. [300139] they are clinically appropriate for you.” We believe that that is an important right for patients. The Secretary of State for Health (Andy Burnham): Obviously NICE has a difficult job to do in judging the The NHS constitution was based on extensive consultation cost-effectiveness of treatments, but we think it is the and has widespread support. It gives real power to right guarantee to make so that, just as we will not see patients by describing their rights. The Health Act 2009 waiting times slip back, there will never be a return, gives the constitution its legal underpinning and requires under this Government at least, to the postcode prescribing a report on its effectiveness to be published every three that we saw in the 1990s. years. Norman Lamb: The right hon. Gentleman is right Mr. Lancaster: Last month Milton Keynes hospital that there should be an entitlement, yet every day drug acquiesced to the demands of a pregnant woman by companies are reporting 300 to 500 calls from people providing an all-white staff for the delivery of her baby. who cannot get hold of vital medicines. I have a letter Does the Secretary of State think that this was the that has been circulating to community pharmacists; it correct decision by the hospital, or can we sometimes includes a price list, with very attractive offers to pharmacists put patients’ wishes too much to the fore in thinking of to buy their drugs for export, thereby denying patients hospitals’ actions? in this country vital drugs. What are the Government doing to stop this unethical practice? Andy Burnham: I cannot be alone in finding uncomfortable the situation that the hon. Gentleman Andy Burnham: On Friday, the Minister of State, my describes. I should have thought that it was so for the right hon. and learned Friend the Member for North NHS staff who were on the receiving end of such a Warwickshire (Mr. O’Brien), published clear guidance request. I know that the trust concerned is conducting to primary care trusts. The issues that the hon. Gentleman an investigation into the request and its handling. I raises are crucial. It is vital that patients have access to shall be happy to update him when further information the medicines that they need. We are taking a range of is available. steps to secure the medicines supply chain, but I understand the points that he is raising. We have taken action and I Mr. Kevin Barron (Rother Valley) (Lab): Does my will continue to work with him to ensure that there is no right hon. Friend expect that when the patient consultation problem in the supply of medicines. on the new constitution has been completed, the wait of 18 weeks or less for a referral from a GP to a consultant Keith Vaz (Leicester, East) (Lab): I declare an interest or the two-week wait for GP referral for somebody as someone who suffers from type-2 diabetes. Will suspected of having cancer will be one of the most my right hon. Friend assure the House that the NHS popular things that has happened in the national health constitution will properly protect those who have diabetes service in our lifetime? Will he make sure that that is by giving them an assessment to determine whether reinforced so that people will expect it for many years they have the illness? It is better to prevent than to treat to come? once somebody has an illness. 383 Oral Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Oral Answers 384

Andy Burnham: I agree entirely that the challenge for Derek Twigg (Halton) (Lab): About 10 or 12 years the national health service is to become truly preventive—to ago, I regularly had complaints from constituents who become a national health service, with the word “health” were waiting 18 months, two years and, in some cases, underlined. My right hon. Friend will know that as well three years for an operation. On the patient guarantee, as consulting on the proposed maximum waiting times, it is absolutely right that we reaffirm our commitment we are asking the public whether people aged between to waiting list times, and we should laud what we have 40 and 74 should have a right to an NHS health check done to reduce them, but will my right hon. Friend every five years. That would take the NHS into new similarly guarantee that we will continue to press as territory. It would take it squarely into preventive territory, hard as we can to get waiting lists down? and I look forward to hearing whether he and his constituents think that is the right step to take. Andy Burnham: I agree entirely with my hon. Friend, and the whole thrust of the constitution is to translate Mr. Andrew Lansley (South Cambridgeshire) (Con): those targets into permanent rights so that there is no The NHS constitution says that patients should have slipping back. My father has just had a heart bypass access to NICE-approved drugs. What does it offer a operation, and he was treated within a matter of weeks. patient with primary liver cancer, for example, who has I looked at the patients charter that the Conservative only one drug as an option for treatment and is told party introduced in 1995, and there was a 12-month that the NHS will not provide it? standard for an artery bypass graft. How many unlucky people died on those waiting lists for heart bypass Andy Burnham: I described the right very clearly in operations? That is a world away, and I assure my hon. my answer to the hon. Member for North Norfolk Friend that under this Labour Government we will (Norman Lamb): it is a right to drugs as approved by never go back to such a situation in the national health NICE. The hon. Member for South Cambridgeshire service, with people dying waiting for hospital treatment. (Mr. Lansley) should accept—indeed, I think I have heard him say before—that NICE has a very difficult job to do in judging the cost-effectiveness of new treatments. NHS Dentistry I do not want to return to a situation in which people have different access to drugs and treatments according 2. Michael Fabricant (Lichfield) (Con): What recent to where they live. NICE brought order to the system, assessment he has made of the adequacy of NHS and has an international reputation for rigour in the dental provision; and if he will make a statement. assessment of new medicines. I am proud of the difficult [300140] job that it does, and when it has made its deliberations, that right carries its recommendations to patients 6. Mr. Edward Vaizey (Wantage) (Con): What recent throughout the country. assessment he has made of the adequacy of NHS dental provision. [300144] Mr. Lansley: The Secretary of State did not answer my question, but the answer that he should have given, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Health according to his view, is that the constitution offers (Ann Keen): More than 27.6 million people saw an NHS patients in those circumstances nothing—they will not dentist in the 24 months ending June 2009. That is have access to that drug. Why will he not follow the almost 750,000 more than in the same period ending policy, which we pressed on him and his predecessors, June 2008. of a value-based pricing system for new medicines, so that patients are provided with treatments that are Michael Fabricant: I thank the Minister for her answer. clinically best for them, so that the reimbursement price Paul Bason, a constituent of mine and a dentist, came through the NHS then reflects the value of the drug, to see me and told me that he has a major problem, and so that the Government, the national health service because when someone needs a root canal operation on and the drug companies get together to ensure that their teeth the current dental contract incentivises him patients have access to treatments that are clinically to remove the tooth rather than to perform an operation. effective and best for them? Why will the Government Does the Minister think that the contract is conducive not accept that they should have a policy that puts to good dental practice? patients first?

Andy Burnham: Let me answer the direct point about Ann Keen: No, I do not. We have discussed that issue NICE’s provisional decision on treatments for liver and root canal work many times in the House, and I cancer and Nexavar. It is a provisional decision, so suggest that the primary care trust in the hon. Gentleman’s every patient in the country has the opportunity to constituency speaks to the dentist concerned. Some comment on it and the breadth and range of views can root canal work is extremely complicated, so if the be heard. That is everybody’s right—to make their dentist cannot carry out the required clinical procedure, views known. I do not think that the hon. Gentleman he can refer the patient to an NHS hospital, where a could sit in my position and basically say that every new consultant will see them. treatment that comes along can be afforded. We have to have some rigour in the system, and in the way that Mr. Vaizey: May I wish the Secretary of State’s father decisions are made. Experts—I stress that word—should a speedy recovery? advise Ministers on how best to take forward those In 1999, Tony Blair promised access for all to an decisions, and that is what we have in NICE. It does an NHS dentist by 2001. Since the contract was rejigged, extremely important job for the Government and, I more than 1 million people now do not have access to might add, for the taxpayer, and I should expect the an NHS dentist—an increase of half a million. When hon. Gentleman to show it a little more support. will Tony Blair’s promise be fulfilled? 385 Oral Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Oral Answers 386

Ann Keen: I believe that the hon. Gentleman will be the lives of those who have suffered the worst of violations. aware of the increase in dentistry and dental practice Provision of services is of course a matter for local over the past two to three years, particularly in his own health services. However, I will gladly draw the hon. area. Oxfordshire has a contract with an existing practice Gentleman’s comments to the attention of the taskforce to provide short-term provision, initially for 500 additional that the Government have set up, whose work includes patients. In Oxfordshire, the number of dentists increased looking at the role and the response of health services in from 262 in March 2007 to 309 in March 2009. I hope respect of trafficked people. that I am known in the House for my caring attitude to staff and to Members. Later this afternoon, I am opening Fiona Mactaggart (Slough) (Lab): Talking therapies a dental practice in Horseferry road in Westminster, are very important for people who have been through which I am sure that residents and people who work in the trauma and post-traumatic stress disorder that are this area will be able to use. too commonly the fate of those who have been trafficked. In our constituencies, many of us find that there is Natascha Engel (North-East Derbyshire) (Lab): Will insufficient access to talking therapies for anyone. Will my hon. Friend agree to meet me to discuss the plight of my hon. Friend talk to PCTs and mental health trusts lab technicians who make crowns and dentures for around the country about ensuring that there is better dentists? With dentists using cheaper foreign options, access to counselling and talking therapies for people our domestic industry is dying on its feet. with such conditions?

Ann Keen: My hon. Friend raises with me an issue Gillian Merron: I certainly share the views of my hon. that I am happy to discuss with her at a later date. Friend, who makes an absolutely valid point. That is exactly why we have set up the taskforce. It is chaired by Mike Penning (Hemel Hempstead) (Con): I am sure Sir George Alberti, who will look specifically at where that the whole House would agree that when our armed there are gaps and what role the NHS and health service forces come home on leave they need the best possible workers can play in supporting those who have been treatment from the NHS. Does the Minister therefore traumatised in the way that has been described. I hope agree that it is abhorrent that when a serviceman comes that will do a lot to plug any gaps such as those that my home on leave and needs dental treatment he is turned hon. Friend mentions. away by the PCT because there is no funding stream for that treatment and sent back to barracks for treatment? Jim Sheridan (Paisley and Renfrewshire, North) (Lab): Is that not wrong in the NHS in the 21st century? Most of the people who are trafficked into this country are young men and women who are exposed to terrible Ann Keen: If the hon. Gentleman would like to give abuses. Will my hon. Friend have discussions with her me evidence of that, I would be very interested to look counterpart in the Home Office to ensure that any at it. criminal money that is recovered from the people responsible for this trafficking is confiscated and, better still, redirected Human Trafficking to the NHS to pay for the health care of these young people? 3. Mr. Anthony Steen (Totnes) (Con): If he will issue guidance to health care practitioners on the likely Gillian Merron: Again, my hon. Friend makes a very health care problems experienced by trafficked persons important point. Indeed, the taskforce that I referred to which might not present immediately. [300141] was set up by the Home Secretary and the Health Secretary, and we want particularly to consider how we The Minister of State, Department of Health (Gillian can support victims of trafficking, work better together Merron): Multi-agency guidance for all front-line across Government and help to bring to justice those practitioners on meeting the needs of trafficked people who perpetrate this crime. We want to make the advances was issued last month. It includes a specific section on that my hon. Friend refers to. how front-line health practitioners should respond to the needs of trafficking victims, including those who Parking Charges (Offsetting) might not present themselves immediately. 4. Mr. Simon Burns (West Chelmsford) (Con): What Mr. Steen: As many trafficked people have suffered guidance he has given to NHS trusts on the offsetting from the most appalling mental and physical abuse of receipts from parking charges against their deficits; requiring ongoing medical support and counselling, and if he will make a statement. [300142] could I mention to the Minister the in-depth counselling service of the Helen Bamber Foundation in London, The Minister of State, Department of Health (Mr. Mike which gives wonderful ongoing counselling support to O’Brien): NHS trusts manage finances locally, including trafficked victims as well as to those who are found to how they eliminate deficits. Parking subsidies need to have suffered torture? Will she consider extending that be approached with care, especially where the trust has kind of in-depth counselling service to other parts of a deficit. the country where more and more trafficked people are coming forward? Mr. Burns: The Minister will remember that at the last Health questions, he told me that he did not expect Gillian Merron: May I pay tribute to the hon. Gentleman, trusts to make a profit out of car parking to pay off who is a passionate advocate for people who rarely have deficits. What is he going to do with the letter from the a voice themselves? I, too, congratulate the Helen Bamber chief executive of Mid Essex Hospital Services NHS Foundation, whose work does indeed help to rebuild Trust that I sent him a month ago, which states that the 387 Oral Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Oral Answers 388 trust increased car park charges from 1 February 2007 effects of smokeless tobacco products and concluded for staff at Broomfield hospital from £40 a year to that such products were addictive. I have myself looked £200 a year as part of the turnaround scheme to reduce at the packaging of such items and seen that even the the deficit? That seems directly contrary to what the tobacco industry acknowledges that they are not a safe Minister said last month that trusts should do. alternative to cigarettes.

Mr. O’Brien: The hon. Gentleman did raise that with Mr. Adrian Bailey (West Bromwich, West) (Lab/Co-op): me, so I have looked into it. The increase in 2007 for May I associate myself with my hon. Friend the Minister’s staff was from 77p a week to £3.85 a week. At the remarks? Does she agree that the most effective way to moment, the trust apparently charges staff half the reduce the incidence of smoking is to reduce peer group annual cost of operating the space. In other words, I am pressure on young people to take up smoking? What told that the trust subsidises those car parking spaces. assessment has she made of the role of the ban on Today the shadow Chancellor has said how tough he smoking in public bars and restaurants in achieving wants to be on climate change and how he wants to that? discourage people from unnecessarily using vehicles and so on. Now, the hon. Member for West Chelmsford Gillian Merron: My hon. Friend will know that just (Mr. Burns) wants to ensure that instead of money this year we celebrated the 10th anniversary of the NHS being put into patient care, it is put into greater subsidies stop smoking services, which have saved more than for car parking— 70,000 lives. We know that people are four times as likely to quit with support as without it. The important Mr. Speaker: Order. I think we have got the gist of it. point that he makes is that two thirds of smokers start I am grateful. before they are 18, and that is why smoke-free legislation and other measures in recent health legislation will Mr. Tom Watson (West Bromwich, East) (Lab): I contribute to reducing the numbers of new recruits to believe my right hon. and learned Friend’s guidelines the tobacco industry. suggest to acute trusts that they should provide some free parking to disabled badge holders. In cases where Social Care Reform they do not do that, such as at my hospital at Sandwell, what recourse do we have to press them to change? 7. Mr. Mark Harper (Forest of Dean) (Con): When Mr. O’Brien: We have said that we want people with he plans to publish the Government’s response to their disabilities who are regular visitors to hospital to have consultation on the reform of social care. [300145] access to permits that will enable them to have car parking spaces at a reduced charge. On what can be The Secretary of State for Health (Andy Burnham): done, my hon. Friend must of course first approach the The consultation closed on 13 November. More than hospital, and if that is unsuccessful he should approach 28,000 responses have been received and 37 events held the primary care trust. in all parts of the country. The Government’s response to the consultation will be published in the new year. Smoking Cessation Mr. Harper: I am grateful for that reply. The Secretary 5. Mr. Christopher Chope (Christchurch) (Con): If of State will know that all the options being consulted his Department will take steps to promote the health on, except for the one whereby everyone would pay for benefits of low-toxicant smokeless tobacco products as themselves, assume that the Government would take aids for smoking cessation. [300143] attendance allowance and disability living allowance from the over-65s and put them into a social care The Minister of State, Department of Health (Gillian system, which would take away individual control. That Merron): There is no evidence that smokeless tobacco move is opposed by every single organisation representing can help people to quit smoking. Such products are disabled people. When he publishes those consultation tobacco, and they release harmful toxins when used. responses, will he listen to them and cancel that aspect The Department therefore has no plans to promote that of his social care plan? form of tobacco, but we will continue to support smokers in quitting using safer means, including licensed nicotine replacement medicines. Andy Burnham: The hon. Gentleman either has not read the Green Paper or has misunderstood it. The Mr. Chope: What an arrogant and irresponsible reply Minister of State, Department of Health, my hon. that is. Does the Minister not realise that based on the Friend the Member for Corby (Phil Hope), who has Swedish experience, if snus were legalised in the United responsibility for care services, has said that the principle Kingdom it would save up to 30,000 lives a year? Does of individual budgets, introduced by this Government, she not realise that even the World Health Organisation would be the cornerstone of any national care service. recognises snus as a useful harm reduction product? That control over purchasing care would be replicated in and be at the heart of any new system. Gillian Merron: I am sorry to disappoint the hon. This is an important debate which is at the forefront Gentleman, but there are very good reasons for my of many older and disabled people’s minds. The unpleasant comments. The Scientific Committee on Emerging and campaign that the Conservative party launched last Newly Identified Health Risks, which is both official week will frighten vulnerable people about their benefits and independent and provides the European Commission with misleading claims about what will happen to them. with scientific advice, considered in detail the health I find it despicable. 389 Oral Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Oral Answers 390

Tony Lloyd (Manchester, Central) (Lab): Does my pay grade? Can we not have people who are directly right hon. Friend agree that when we are talking about elected and capable at the local council and regional people who are disadvantaged and vulnerable, and who levels? have great fears about their future, playing party politics is disgraceful? Phil Hope: I know that my hon. Friend plays a huge role in chairing his local strategic partnership, where he Andy Burnham: I entirely agree with my hon. Friend. has locally elected representatives and members of the It is utterly disgraceful. There were claims made last primary care trust sitting round the table talking about week that benefits would be taken away from elderly local needs and issues. However, I might also draw his and disabled people and that some could lose “up to attention to the new Regional Select Committees, which £60” a week. I do not know how the shadow Health can hold regional health authorities to account for Secretary can justify those claims when he knows them specific aspects of their performance. [Interruption.] to be untrue. We have said clearly that in any new And as you can hear from the noise, Mr. Speaker, the system people would be offered an equivalent level of Opposition voted against those regional forms of support. The whole aim of this reform is to provide accountability. more support to vulnerable people, not less. It is because the Conservatives have such a threadbare response to Lembit Öpik (Montgomeryshire) (LD): The hon. these serious issues that they resort to scaremongering Member for Shrewsbury and Atcham (Daniel Kawczynski) and frankly despicable tactics. and I have worked as locally elected representatives on his energetic campaign to prevent the movement of the Mr. Andrew Lansley (South Cambridgeshire) (Con): accident and emergency unit from Shrewsbury hospital. Responding to the Green Paper, Age Concern said: We have now received assurances from the authorities “We oppose funding the National Care Service from Attendance at the hospital that the service will not be moved, but I Allowance”. do not understand what formal mechanism we would I agree with Age Concern. The Secretary of State seems have under the current arrangements to object, especially to have been thrown into a panic by this subject. Why bearing in mind that this is a cross-party issue. How does he not simply get up now and say that the Government would the Minister advise us to ensure that our constituents’ will reject any of the options in the Green Paper that concerns about any such move are formally registered, depend on scrapping attendance allowance or disability given the system that he has been outlining? living allowance for the over-65s? Phil Hope: I am not familiar with the hon. Gentleman’s Andy Burnham: I will get up and say what I have just specific concern, but in general terms, decisions about said—that every person will get an equivalent level of reconfiguration, which is what I suspect he is talking support, and I have made that clear. The hon. Gentleman about, are clinically led decisions, made by leading local went to a press conference last week at which he suggested clinicians determining what is in the best interests of that money would be taken from those people. That patients and services in his constituency and those of destabilises, upsets and causes anxiety in some of the his neighbours. I would hope that he, his constituents most vulnerable people in society, and for whose purposes? and other local bodies would make their representations It is for the purposes of the Conservative party’s election in the normal way, but be guided by the clinicians, who I campaign. I find it beneath contempt, and we would do think probably know what is best for patients in their those people more service by having a proper debate on area. the issues. NHS Governance Mr. Gordon Prentice (Pendle) (Lab): But are patients’ voices being heard in the NHS, and what about these 8. Mr. Graham Allen (Nottingham, North) (Lab): If local involvement networks? What assessment has the he will bring forward proposals to involve more elected Minister made of their effectiveness? representatives in NHS governance structures at local and regional level. [300146] Phil Hope: The creation of LINks is an important additional form of accountability in the NHS locally, The Minister of State, Department of Health (Phil not only to local Members of Parliament and locally Hope): There are many ways in which elected representatives elected councillors but directly to service users and can be involved in the NHS locally. These include patients, who will have an opportunity through LINks opportunities for elected representatives to seek membership to influence the pattern of service, including procurement, of primary care trusts and strategic health authority provision and quality. boards as non-voting members or non-executive directors. There is joint working by elected representatives, local Capital Funding (Hospital Trusts) authorities and primary care trusts in local strategic partnerships and, of course, there is the use of overview and scrutiny powers by local government. 9. Mr. Peter Bone (Wellingborough) (Con): What mechanism is used to determine the allocation of capital Mr. Allen: When I want to discuss health matters funding to hospital trusts. [300147] with a directly elected person in this country, I cannot do it at either the local or regional level. The first person The Minister of State, Department of Health (Mr. Mike I come across who is directly elected is my hon. Friend, O’Brien): Capital allocations to hospital trusts are along with his capable colleagues on the Front Bench. determined by local need and subject to local and Does he not think that that is going a bit too high up the national affordability. 391 Oral Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Oral Answers 392

Mr. Bone: Wellingborough is a fast-expanding Mental Health Services constituency, with thousands of new homes being built. It has no hospital, and now this discredited Government 11. Paul Holmes (Chesterfield) (LD): What steps his are closing the hospital out-patient facility. In the Department is taking to improve the level of access to neighbouring, highly marginal Labour constituency of mental health services. [300149] Corby, a new hospital and a new out-patient facility are being built. Are this Labour Government buying votes? The Minister of State, Department of Health (Phil Mr. O’Brien: I thought the hon. Gentleman’s party Hope): As a result of nine consecutive years of increased was fully in favour of foundation trusts. Kettering general spending, access to mental health services has never hospital foundation trust wants to build a new unit at been higher. Many more staff, more community mental Irthlingborough, which is 2.7 miles from the current health services and increased access to psychological Rushden clinic that he is talking about. Through its therapies have transformed services since 1997. Our overview and scrutiny committee, Conservative-controlled vision for the future of mental health services and wider Northamptonshire county council decided that the move public mental well-being, which we are calling New did not need consultation, because it was not a substantial Horizons, will be published shortly and will build on change. these remarkable achievements.

Mr. Geoffrey Robinson (Coventry, North-West) (Lab): Paul Holmes: Lord Layard’s report recently revealed Given the terrific importance of abolishing car parking that there are more mentally ill people on incapacity charges, about which the Secretary of State made such benefit than there are unemployed people on all benefits important announcements a couple of years ago, will put together. One in four people will have a mental my right hon. and learned Friend look into the possibility illness at some stage during their life. However, the of appropriating those car parks into the capital structure 18-week waiting time target applies only to physical and capital allowances of hospitals, thereby not imposing ailments, not to mental illness. Why do the Government that revenue drain on them? treat mental health problems as a Cinderella subject, especially when the new NHS constitution states: Mr. O’Brien: I shall of course look into the point that “You have the right not to be unlawfully discriminated against my hon. Friend makes, but I have to say this. We want in the provision of NHS services including on grounds of…mental to ensure, as far as finances allow, that patients and health”? those who visit them can get a permit for free car parking in due course. I will look into the point he Phil Hope: I am pleased to be able to tell the hon. makes, but our policy is to move towards patients Gentleman that Cinderella has come to the ball. We getting that free car parking in due course. have increased investment in mental health services by 50 per cent.—£2 billion—since 2001. We have more Alternative Medicine (Regulation) consultant psychiatrists, more clinical psychologists and more mental health nurses. That investment in the extra services means that individuals will be able to access the 10. David Tredinnick (Bosworth) (Con): What progress mental health services that they need, not least the has been made on the regulation of herbal medicine, psychological therapies that we are rolling out across acupuncture and traditional Chinese medicine; and if the country, investment in which will rise to a total of he will make a statement. [300148] £173 million by 2010-11. The Minister of State, Department of Health (Gillian Merron): The consultation on whether—and if so, how—to Dr. Brian Iddon (Bolton, South-East) (Lab): During regulate practitioners of acupuncture, herbal medicine the passage of the Mental Health Act 2007, there were and traditional Chinese medicine closed on 16 November many discussions about providing places of safety, other 2009. We are considering our response to the consultation, than police stations, to which seriously mentally ill and it will be published next year. people could be taken. Has any progress been made on that, please? David Tredinnick: Is the Minister aware that the qualified practitioners at the Hydes Herbal Clinic on Phil Hope: Providing such places of safety for people London road in Leicester—the oldest and largest such outside police custody has been an important part of clinic operating in this country—want statutory regulation developing mental health services for the future, and we to interface with European legislation as quickly as continue to drive forward progress in that area. If my possible? Will she guarantee that the clinic will still be hon. Friend has a particular issue in his constituency, I able to treat, and to prescribe and prepare its own ask him please to write to me and I will be happy to take herbs? the matter forward with him.

Gillian Merron: I thank the hon. Gentleman for Anne Milton (Guildford) (Con): The Government making that point. We have had some 5,000 responses predicted that the number of community treatment to the consultation, which I welcome. We will move as orders needed in the first year of the Mental Health quickly as possible, and, when taking our decision, we Act 2007 would be 600 to 800, yet in the past year there will balance public safety with the risks involved, and have been 4,000. That was therefore a gross under- look at the principles of better regulation in deciding prediction. Will the Minister investigate the impact of whether any action would be transparent, accountable, this massive under-prediction on the thousands of proportionate, consistent and targeted only where action vulnerable people without sufficient safeguards in place was needed. and without sufficient support in the community? 393 Oral Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Oral Answers 394

Phil Hope: I do not recognise the hon. Lady’s description of those who wish to become surgeons by her Department’s of those services. It is true to say that there has been use lack of proper planning for the implementation of the of community treatment orders, but those orders can be working time directive? made only when a clinician has made a decision that that is the safe and right thing to do, that there is Ann Keen: I am sorry to disagree with the hon. Lady. support in the community, and that the individual can The working time directive is health and safety legislation, be recalled if necessary. That has happened on a number and there is strong evidence that tired doctors make of occasions. I believe that the Mental Health Act has mistakes, so reducing working hours to 48 will of course been a success, and that these new orders have provided improve patient safety. I know that the Norfolk and new opportunities to treat people safely in the community Norwich university hospital is looking at its anaesthetic and to keep the community safe. rota and coming to an agreement on it. There has always been a tradition in surgical training that needed Independent Sector Treatment to be addressed. The most recent survey of medical education for those in training has shown that this 12. Greg Mulholland (Leeds, North-West) (LD): training is now better and safer. What assessment he has made of the use made by the NHS of services commissioned from independent Mr. Stephen O’Brien (Eddisbury) (Con): Given that sector treatment centres. [300150] at the last count, only two thirds of junior doctors were compliant with the European working time directive The Minister of State, Department of Health (Mr. Mike and 77 trusts have had to request a derogation from the O’Brien): Independent sector treatment centres have directive, and in light of the fact that the Secretary of treated more than 2 million NHS patients and helped to State himself does not have to comply with the directive reduce waiting times and improve patient choice. that his own party has forced on our doctors, what action are the Minister and the Secretary of State taking to bring forward the long-delayed review of Greg Mulholland: The Care Quality Commission carried junior doctors’ training to ensure that doctors’ skills out a report on the Eccleshill treatment centre in Bradford and training—and, ultimately, patient care—do not at the request of the coroner after the death of my suffer as a result of the Government’s failure to negotiate constituent, John Hubley, in 2007. A freedom of an opt-out? information request has shown that in January this year, the centre still did not have adequate risk-management procedures or responses to emergency surgical situations. Ann Keen: I can certainly tell the hon. Gentleman one When can we finally have a debate about NHS use of thing—this Labour Government and this Minister have such facilities? Is it right to send patients there when no intention ever of returning to the long and dangerous safety procedures are not adequate? hours that all our doctors and surgeons used to have to work, because I actually worked with those doctors at Mr. O’Brien: Debates are a matter for the usual the time. Any one of them would tell the hon. Gentleman channels. We of course extend our condolences to the how serious that practice was, as mistakes were made. family of Dr. John Hubley. The coroner stated that he Along with the medical education authorities, the British was satisfied that there was no ongoing system failure at Medical Association and all the Royal Colleges, we take the Eccleshill treatment centre. The Care Quality patient safety very seriously. The report that the hon. Commission has looked into this and will continue to Gentleman mentioned will be looked at and we will monitor it to ensure that quality standards are met, but report back on it, I believe, early next year. 96 per cent. of patients who use ISTCs have recorded either excellent or very good quality services. Health Visitors (Greater London)

Working Time Directive 14. Simon Hughes (North Southwark and Bermondsey) (LD): How many health visitors were employed in 13. Chloe Smith (Norwich, North) (Con): What recent Greater London in (a) 1997 and (b) 2009; and if he will assessment he has made of the effect of the European make a statement. [300152] working time directive on NHS staff. [300151] The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Health The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Health (Ann Keen): In the last decade, child health services have (Ann Keen): All NHS staff, with the exception of doctors developed based on research and the healthy child in training, have been compliant since 1998. In 2004, programme. In the London strategic health authority working time provisions were extended to doctors in region, 1,876 health visitors were employed in 1997. training whose maximum hours were reduced to 56 hours Following the change and the extensive child health by August 2007 and 48 hours by August 2009. programmes, we now deliver child health by a range of practitioners. The latest figures show that at 30 September Chloe Smith: The Royal College of Surgeons said in 2008 there were 1,577 health visitors. January this year that we simply do not have the surgeons in the UK to fill the gaps created by the working time Simon Hughes: Does the Minister accept that after directive. Does the Minister agree that it is wrong to put 12 and a half years in office, we are losing nationally at risk the work of local trusts, including the Norfolk one health visitor on average every 30 hours, that the and Norwich University Hospitals NHS Foundation professions reckon that we need another 8,000 to plug Trust, the safety of patients and the career aspirations the gaps and that there are some places where there are 395 Oral Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Oral Answers 396 two and a half as many people on a health visitor’s case health professionals who have done so much to help load as was recommended as safe by the inquiry into local people to pull through during some very dark baby Peter’s death? hours. I am assured that emergency measures are in operation, Ann Keen: We recognise that there is a shortage of including the use of Cockermouth community hospital health visitors, but, as I said in my earlier answer, we are as a general practice. In Workington, emergency measures delivering the child health strategy in a different way. are providing the full range of primary care services for Health visitors now lead teams. The 21 Sure Start people in the north of the town. My hon. Friend the centres in Southwark, part of the hon. Gentleman’s Under-Secretary will visit the affected areas on Friday, constituency, serve as a focal point for local families, and any further steps that are necessary will be taken. and have excellent links with health visitors, nurseries and infant schools. James Duddridge: Following concerns raised about Unite/CPHVA and the national health service have the generic substitution of epilepsy medicine, what decisions launched an action on health visiting programme. They has the Secretary of State made on whether such medicines are working closely together, especially in London, should be excluded from the pharmaceutical price regulation evaluating return to practice schemes. We value our scheme? health visitors greatly. As for their case load, the Secretary of State recently announced that such issues were to be reviewed. The Minister of State, Department of Health (Mr. Mike O’Brien): We intend to launch a 12-week consultation, Working Time Directive which I hope will begin before Christmas. We therefore do not expect to be in a position to implement generic 15. Tony Baldry (Banbury) (Con): What recent assessment substitution until next year. However, we will wish to he has made of the effect on hospital trust budgets of examine those issues as part of our wider consultation. the implementation of the European working time directive. [300153] T5. [300168] Martin Linton (Battersea) (Lab): Cans of super-strength lager carry the message “Enjoy responsibly” The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Health or “Please drink responsibly”, yet they contain four (Ann Keen): This is a matter for local organisations. and a half units, which is more than the maximum They make budgetary decisions based on the needs and recommended daily intake. Given that super-strength priorities of the local populations to deliver effective drinks are a major killer of vulnerable homeless people, local services. would it not be more responsible for the Department to ban half-litre cans and to introduce a super-strength tax Tony Baldry: Three consultants used to provide 24/7 on beers and ciders containing more than, say, 6 per consultant-led paediatrics at Horton general hospital, cent. of alcohol per volume, as recommended by the but it is estimated that it will take between nine and 13 Thames Reach charity in my constituency? to deliver the service in future. That has implications not only for the trust’s budget, but for the future recruitment The Minister of State, Department of Health (Gillian of consultants. What plans are the Government making Merron): I note the clear recommendation from that in relation to recruitment as a consequence of the organisation in my hon. Friend’s constituency. Whatever working time directive? the strength of the lager or other alcohol that people drink, they should understand how strong the drink is, Ann Keen: We are in constant discussion with Medical how much they are drinking and the health risks involved. Education England, along with the strategic health As my hon. Friend knows, tax is a matter for the authorities, which have strategic responsibility for the Chancellor, but I will ensure that his comments are planning of their consultants. Money has been made drawn to the Chancellor’s attention. available to assist them in that process.

Topical Questions T2. [300165] Mr. Philip Hollobone (Kettering) (Con): According to the Jeanette Crizzle trust, of which I have T1. [300164] James Duddridge (Rochford and Southend, the honour to be a trustee, fewer than 7 per cent. of East) (Con): If he will make a statement on his secondary schools have taken part in the Department’s departmental responsibilities. Give and Let Live organ donor education programme. What is the Secretary of State going to do to improve The Secretary of State for Health (Andy Burnham): participation rates? Tomorrow the Government will publish the personal care at home Bill, which will benefit about 400,000 of Andy Burnham: This is obviously a very important the most vulnerable people in our society. On the same issue. There were reports in the news again today that day, I will address a conference at the London School of not enough good organs were available for donation. I Hygiene and Tropical Medicine to raise awareness of think that we can reach across the House and agree that the human health costs of inaction on climate change in the matter is crucially important. There is more that we the lead-up to the Copenhagen summit. can do to encourage people voluntarily to join the The people of Cumbria have been in all our thoughts organ donation register. Progress has been made recently, over recent days. Today my hon. Friend the Under-Secretary but there can be no let-up. I hope that the hon. Gentleman of State for Health spoke to Sue Page, chief executive of will work with us, and will support all our efforts to NHS Cumbria, and passed our thanks—the thanks of boost awareness and the number of people joining the the whole House, I am sure—to the NHS staff and register. 397 Oral Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Oral Answers 398

Jane Kennedy (Liverpool, Wavertree) (Lab): Will my Dr. Phyllis Starkey (Milton Keynes, South-West) (Lab): right hon. Friend take a personal interest in the two Further to the incident at Milton Keynes general hospital capital building projects, part of the £1.2 billion committed when a maternity patient demanded all-white staff, may to Liverpool hospitals by the Government, the Liverpool I clarify to the Minister that I spoke directly to the chair university hospital and the Royal Liverpool children’s of the hospital trust, who assured me that the patient’s hospital, both of which are critical to the future delivery request had not been acceded to and that she was of hospital services to Liverpool? treated by the duty team—a mixed team—for her caesarean? It would appear that the hospital did follow the NHS Andy Burnham: I visited Liverpool yesterday and code in dealing with what was clearly a difficult and spoke to the chief executive and chair of the Royal sensitive incident. I would be grateful if the Minister Liverpool and Broadgreen University Hospitals NHS made sure that the accurate account of what happened Trust. The scheme has important health benefits for the is accentuated and that the hospital is congratulated. city and region, but also has wider economic benefits. I Andy Burnham: I am grateful to my hon. Friend for can assure my right hon. Friend that I am paying close that important clarification. We would want to ensure attention to both of the schemes that she mentions. that no unfair suggestion is made about NHS staff who Obviously there is pressure on capital budgets in the do their best for all of her constituents at all times. current climate but I recognise that these are important There is of course no place for racism in the NHS, nor schemes. for any discriminatory behaviour towards NHS staff. On that there can never be a compromise, but we have T3. [300166] Bob Russell (Colchester) (LD): Is the heard the clarification given by my hon. Friend today. Secretary of State aware that the future of the nation’s community dental practices has been put at serious risk T6. [300169] Mr. Andrew Pelling (Croydon, Central) because of guidance HTM 01-05? Will he agree to meet (Ind): A Bethlem Royal hospital in-patient who had me and some dentists from my constituency so that previously been convicted of murder absconded while they can explain what are clearly the unintended on a shopping trip to West Wickham. As we would consequences of this guidance note? expect of one of the best trusts in the country, Bethlem reacted very professionally in giving reassurance to the The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Health public about its procedures for such circumstances, but (Ann Keen): I would be happy to meet the hon. Gentleman would it be worth while to see whether there are on that detailed guidance, but I cannot answer at present. sufficient resources to support such activities for in-patients outside hospital?

Mr. Lindsay Hoyle (Chorley) (Lab): There is a new Phil Hope: I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for village near Chorley called Buckshaw, and thousands of bringing this case to my attention. Whether a patient new homes are being developed in Chorley. My concern who has been detained under the Mental Health Acts is that there is a drag factor between the population and can leave a hospital or unit under escort on a visit is the funding given to primary care trusts. What can we always a clinical decision. The hon. Gentleman described do to ensure that Chorley gets the right amount of the mental health trust involved in this case as one of funding for its primary care trust? the best in the country, and it is the responsibility of individual trusts to ensure that patients in their care do Mr. Mike O’Brien: The NHS is constantly looking to not abscond from secure services. The hon. Gentleman ensure that we keep up to date with the way in which referred to resources. As I said earlier, investment in populations change in particular areas. PCTs must ensure mental health services has increased for nine consecutive that that data goes to the Department so that the years, and by some 50 per cent. or £2 billion in real appropriate decisions on finances can be made. terms. I understand that the South London and Maudsley NHS Foundation Trust will be carefully reviewing the incident the hon. Gentleman raised and that it will T4. [300167] Greg Mulholland (Leeds, North-West) (LD): At a recent surgery, a constituent raised the change policies and procedures for escorting patients if problem of having an above-inflation increase at a that is found to be necessary. private care home for his mother. It can be difficult to Joan Walley (Stoke-on-Trent, North) (Lab): May I move people from those homes, so there is no competition mention how proud my constituents are of the new with other businesses. What tools are at the Government’s Haywood hospital alongside the University Hospital of disposal to deal with this and to regulate private care North Staffordshire NHS Trust’s new hospital? Will my homes so that they cannot simply charge anything hon. Friend the Minister take a very close look at willy-nilly, knowing that people cannot access another investment and capital funding, however, and will he in care home? particular look at the pace of change, as our area is still distant from the target, and at the importance of the The Minister of State, Department of Health (Phil market forces factor, so that we can make sure we get Hope): The quality of care provided by private care our full allocation of capital funding across north homes is subject to regulatory control by the Care Staffordshire? Quality Commission. They are independent and fee levels negotiated with local authorities are a matter for Mr. Mike O’Brien: My hon. Friend is a doughty local authorities. If the hon. Gentleman has a particular fighter for Staffordshire and for ensuring that funding issue on that, he should first discuss it with the local goes in the direction of her constituents. I will, of authority, but recent legislation means that an individual course, look at the issues she raises and see if I can be may be able to complain to the local authority ombudsman. helpful. 399 Oral Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Oral Answers 400

T7. [300170] Michael Fabricant (Lichfield) (Con): Paul T9. [300172] Simon Hughes (North Southwark and Bason, a Lichfield-Staffordshire dentist who came to Bermondsey) (LD): Who takes responsibility in government see me, raised, among other issues, the question of for the fact that figures released today show that there training. He says that after graduating in dentistry were nearly 40,000 extra deaths last winter in this country people have to have a year in vocational training, which because of cold? That is the highest figure for nearly is a good thing, but he asks whether there will be 10 years. What will the Department of Health and enough vocational trainers for the next batch of graduate other Departments do to have a proper insulation strategy dentists, and he thinks that perhaps there will not be. for homes in Britain, rather than a piecemeal system that leaves many people dying when they would survive Ann Keen: We have to accept that there is competition in other countries? for training places in some areas and that it is necessary for some new graduates to move out of their home area. Gillian Merron: Obviously, the causes of winter deaths Over the country as a whole, however, we make sufficient in excess are complex. The fact that last year’s winter training places available for training new graduates. was colder than average will explain some of the extra Andrew Mackinlay (Thurrock) (Lab): The roll-out deaths, but I assure the House that the Government are programme for ultrasound screening against aneurysms working hard, and will continue to do so, to improve of the aortic artery is inadequate. How and when will the uptake of grants, benefits and sources of advice, so this treatment, which will save up to 6,000 lives a year that homes are more energy efficient and people have among men aged over 60, be available? It is desperately the help they need with heating and bills. needed, especially in working-class areas where the greatest indices of health poverty exist, such as my area. Dr. Brian Iddon (Bolton, South-East) (Lab): A few days ago, work began on Bolton One, which is a Ann Keen: When rolling out any new technique within £30 million project delivering a new swimming pool, a the national health service, we have to prepare the work walk-in health centre and teaching facilities for the force. This screening has been in progress. It has taken off university of Bolton. Will the Minister congratulate better in some areas than in others, but we are looking that university, Bolton council and Bolton primary care at this and we are particularly concerned that we get it trust on this innovate new partnership? right because of the number of lives that will be saved. Mr. Mike O’Brien: Yes, and I also congratulate my T8. [300171] Sandra Gidley (Romsey) (LD): Constituents hon. Friend on fighting for it. are being told that GP surgeries have to use up their initial allocation of 500 flu vaccines before they can order further supplies, even if the surgery knows there T10. [300173] Mr. Andrew Robathan (Blaby) (Con): are a further 1,500 or so patients still to be vaccinated. There are concerns about the future of the Feilding What is the Secretary of State doing to ensure that Palmer cottage hospital in Lutterworth, in my surgeries have adequate and timely supplies of vaccines constituency. It is much valued by local people and so that all vulnerable people can be vaccinated as soon there has been talk of it closing. People like to be as possible? treated close to their home, and I believe that such an approach is public policy for all parties. Therefore, will Andy Burnham: It is very important that surgeries the Minister inform PCTs that they should make every have a ready supply of vaccines so they continue with effort to allow local people to decide where they are the programme of vaccinating priority groups. We were treated and that where people have a facility such as the aware that some surgeries may be coming to the end of Feilding Palmer cottage hospital they may be treated the vaccination of priority groups at around this time, close to home, rather than 20 miles away in the city of which is why we took the decision to extend the vaccination Leicester? campaign to children aged between six months and five years. I take the point the hon. Lady raises very seriously. Mr. O’Brien: What is also shared by the Front-Bench We want to ensure continuity of supply of vaccines to team of the hon. Gentleman’s party and our Front-Bench all surgeries around the country. We are confident that team is the view that reconfigurations—changes that all GP surgeries have had a supply of vaccine, but we are being made—should be clinically led and locally will continue to take a close look around the country to decided. ensure that all surgeries have enough vaccine to be able to continue vaccinating in the priority groups. Julia Goldsworthy (Falmouth and Camborne) (LD): David Taylor (North-West Leicestershire) (Lab/Co-op): Today’s Western Morning News reported that Cornwall Having five years ago been given exclusive rights to dip council is holding an urgent meeting to discuss the its corporate snout into the private finance initiative relocation of upper gastro-intestinal cancer services to hospital trough, Laing O’Rourke must have industrial- Derriford. Devon county council has also requested strength chutzpah now to sue the Secretary of State for that the Secretary of State re-examine the issue. Will he Health for abortive costs on that collapsed project. agree to a meeting to discuss the impact of this central Does that not lay to rest, once and for all, the illusion policy on local access to services? that PFI transfers risk to the private sector? Mr. O’Brien: I am happy to agree to meet the hon. Mr. Mike O’Brien: PFI has produced a large number Lady and some of her parliamentary colleagues, but of hospitals and clinical facilities for the NHS; it has, in may I just say that we also need to accept that decisions many areas, been an enormous success. What I would have to be made in the health service about where say is that sometimes difficulties arise and we must deal facilities are placed? Such decisions are difficult and with them. they are best arrived at locally. 401 Oral Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Oral Answers 402

Ann Winterton (Congleton) (Con): What advice can Phil Hope: Decisions on the care of children with the Minister give to a constituent whose eight-year-old autism will come under the remit of the children and son is suspected of having Asperger’s syndrome and young people’s plan, the legislation for which was recently who is having to wait three years before a test might passed. It will make sure that disabled children and confirm that? He could pay £1,000 for a test to be children with autism in an area are covered by a plan carried out privately, but that would not necessarily be that will determine the level of need locally and the accepted by the local education authority. Is this not a services to meet that need. disgrace? 403 24 NOVEMBER 2009 404

Points of Order House at heart. I will ask officials to be in contact with her with a view to seeing whether her request, which I 3.34 pm suspect will be reflected elsewhere in the House, can be accommodated. Mr. Bernard Jenkin (North Essex) (Con): On a point of order, Mr. Speaker. This morning, the Select Committee on Reform of the House of Commons produced an Dr. Evan Harris (Oxford, West and Abingdon) (LD): extremely important report. Unfortunately, at last In business questions last week, I raised with the Leader Thursday’s business questions the Leader of the House of the House the question of the House’s ability to declined to say when the report might be debated and scrutinise Government Bills, particularly on Report and declined to come to give a statement to the House today particularly in relation to the Equality Bill, which is her on how the Government might respond to it. Could you Bill. She accepted that she had given undertakings to use your good offices to advance the case made by this consult Opposition parties about how that would be excellent report and, indeed, to give the House an dealt with, given that it is a huge Bill with many opportunity to debate it, so that we may add to or amendments and that there will be multiple groups of subtract from it as we see fit? amendments. However, without any consultation, only one day has been allocated and that will not be sufficient Mr. Speaker: The hon. Gentleman is anticipating to even touch proper scrutiny. Have you heard from the business questions and asking a business question on Leader of the House whether there will be reconsideration Tuesday that would be suitable subject matter for a of that provisional business? An announcement on question on Thursday. I am, very properly, conscious of Thursday might be very late for business scheduled for and focused on this subject. I am watching events with next Wednesday and it is very difficult for the House to close interest, as he would expect. He might want to provide scrutiny if we do not get good notice as well as raise the matter on Thursday.There will be opportunities— sufficient time. and soon, I am sure—for these matters further to be considered and it is right that they should be, with a Mr. Speaker: I think that the hon. Gentleman has a clear indication of how events should proceed. lot in common today with the hon. Member for North Essex (Mr. Jenkin), at least in the sense that he is asking Ann Clwyd (Cynon Valley) (Lab): On a point of a business question on Tuesday that could reasonably order, Mr. Speaker. Can you use your good offices to be asked on Thursday. I also remember very distinctly see whether we can have a feed of the Chilcot inquiry the list of dates recited by the hon. Member for Oxford, into Iraq on our parliamentary channels? There is West and Abingdon (Dr. Harris) in the House last week considerable interest in the inquiry. I am aware that if on which he had previously made the request for due one has a BBC red button, one can push that, but we consideration on Report over two days of the matters in have no such buttons on our sets. question. I feel sure that the concerns that he has again articulated will have been heard by those on the Front Mr. Speaker: I understand that in technical terms the Bench and by the Leader of the House. I have no power matter is relatively straightforward. I have noted what to influence the matter further, but he has raised an the right hon. Lady says, although I am not quite sure extremely important concern. He might be tempted to that it constitutes a point of order. As always, I want to raise it again, and I feel sure that if it is raised again it be helpful and I know that she has the interests of the will be heard. 405 24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 406

Debate on the Address Lembit Öpik (Montgomeryshire) (LD): Does the Secretary of State get very frustrated, as I do, by the small number of deniers who still think that climate [4TH DAY] change is not happening? Anyone who comes to Montgomeryshire today will see a large swathe of my Debate resumed (Order, 18 November). constituency under water, something that is happening Question again proposed, more and more frequently. The reality is that climate That an humble Address be presented to Her Majesty, as change is happening, we have caused it and, as he follows: rightly points out, we have to fix it. Most Gracious Sovereign, Edward Miliband: I agree. In the year or so that I have We, YourMajesty’s most dutiful and loyal subjects, the Commons of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, been doing this job, I have learned that we have to in Parliament assembled, beg leave to offer our humble thanks to remake the case for the science each time we talk about Your Majesty for the Gracious Speech which Your Majesty has these issues. There are too many noises off from people addressed to both Houses of Parliament. who say that the science is somehow not proven, or that experts differ. Let us be clear: the overwhelming consensus of scientific evidence says that climate change is happening Energy and Climate Change and and that it is man-made. Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Mr. Lindsay Hoyle (Chorley) (Lab) Will my right hon. Friend give way? 3.38 pm The Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change Joan Walley (Stoke-on-Trent, North) (Lab) rose— (Edward Miliband): It is a great privilege to open this debate on the Gracious Speech and its plans on energy Daniel Kawczynski (Shrewsbury and Atcham) (Con) and the environment. rose— The debate comes as people in Cumbria are battling the worst flooding in memory and I want to start by Edward Miliband: My goodness, what a range of paying tribute to PC Bill Barker, who tragically lost his choices. I give way first to my hon. Friend the Member life, and to others who have lost their lives around the for Stoke-on-Trent, North (Joan Walley). country. I am sure the thoughts of the whole House are with their families. Joan Walley: I am so grateful to my right hon. We thank the emergency services for the work that Friend. On that point, does he agree that the 10:10 they are doing and hope that the people who have been campaign is doing a great deal to promote awareness of forced out of their homes can return to them as soon as the seriousness of the situation that we face, which is possible. Such flooding will become more frequent because backed up by the scientific evidence? Do we not need of climate change, which makes the Flood and Water more local initiatives so that everyone can understand Management Bill, overseen by my right hon. Friend the the big picture and take action locally as well? Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs, so important. The Bill is a crucial part of Edward Miliband: I agree absolutely with my hon. implementing Sir Michael Pitt’s recommendations. Friend. We must act not just to adapt to climate change but Mr. Hoyle: My right hon. Friend has touched on part to prevent it. That is the focus of my Department’s of the problem, which is that some people are in denial. work and the Energy Bill, announced in the Queen’s However, the majority of the world recognises that the Speech. The context of that Bill is the crucial starting problem has an impact for everybody. What can he do point for this debate on the Gracious Speech, because I to ensure that there is international collaboration on believe that we need candour above all on the reasons good, positive schemes, such as carbon capture and the why we must act on climate change, the scale of the other initiatives that are emerging? Does he agree that challenge that we face and what we need to do about we must ensure that developing countries such as China, that challenge. Brazil and India also get that technology? There is a real danger to this argument, which is that somehow it is suggested that the science of climate Edward Miliband: My hon. Friend makes an extremely change is in doubt. It is very important that we show eloquent point, and one of the most important purposes that it is not. Today, the Met Office, the National of the upcoming Copenhagen summit is precisely to Environment Research Council and the Royal Society encourage the sort of co-operation that he mentions. issued a joint statement, and it is worth mentioning We must also ensure that all countries take action, and some of the key points. They say that global carbon that is a central part of tackling the problem. dioxide concentrations continue to rise and that the decade 2000-09 has been warmer on average than any Daniel Kawczynski: The right hon. Gentleman started other decade in the previous 150 years. They add that by talking about flooding, and many of us who represent Arctic summer sea ice cover declined suddenly in 2007 constituencies that flood have been raising these and 2008, and that there is issues for many years. The river in Shrewsbury has been “increasing evidence of continued and accelerating sea level rises rising again, threatening the town. When he makes around the world.” announcements about future plans for flood defences, Those organisations also say that the science has become will the Government ensure that there is considerable clearer and that, if anything, the dangers are becoming debate about wet washland schemes and about managing more pronounced. rivers across large areas, rather than piecemeal defences? 407 24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 408

Edward Miliband: My right hon. Friend the Secretary language? It might be accurate to say those sorts of of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs things when looking backwards, but looking forward, assures me that that is an important part of the debate. such events will become much more regular because of It is worth saying that we have increased flood defence the climate change to which he refers. spending, but the point that the hon. Gentleman makes is absolutely correct. Edward Miliband: Indeed. The hon. Gentleman is I believe that the science is clear. I also believe that right: the standard will change over time. There was the case for action does not rest simply on the environmental severe flooding in my constituency in 2007. That had catastrophe that awaits if we do not act: there is also a last happened in the 1950s, but the flooding was described positive argument, to which the Energy Bill in the as a once-in-100-years or once-in-1,000-years event. Queen’s Speech speaks. The way that we talk about such matters needs to change. Mr. Peter Lilley (Hitchin and Harpenden) (Con): I could not agree more with the Secretary of State when Mr. John Baron (Billericay) (Con): Will the right hon. he says that we need to have confidence in the science. Gentleman give way? Does he therefore agree with the remarks of George Monbiot in The Guardian today? He says: Edward Miliband: I will, and then I will make a bit of “The emails extracted…from the climatic research unit at the progress. University of East Anglia could scarcely be more damaging…There appears to be evidence here of attempts to prevent scientific data Mr. Baron: The Secretary of State is being very from being released, and even to destroy material that was subject generous in giving way. I am sure that he will agree that to a freedom of information request. if we are to reduce our carbon footprint, it is important Worse still, some of the emails suggest efforts to prevent the to lower domestic fuel consumption, including fuel publication of work by climate sceptics, or to keep it out of a bills, wherever possible. Some months ago, I raised with report by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change.” him the idea that we should oblige energy companies to He concludes: print on all domestic bills whether customers are on the “I believe that the head of the unit, Phil Jones, should now company’s cheapest tariff, and if they are not, the resign. Some of the data discussed in the emails should be company should put how much the customer would re-analysed.” save by changing or switching. He kindly said that it Will the right hon. Gentleman comment on that? was an ingenious idea, yet recently I received a letter from his Department saying that the Government could Edward Miliband: That is certainly an unusual alliance— no longer support it. What has changed his mind? George Monbiot and the right hon. Gentleman. In all seriousness, my view is that there should be maximum Edward Miliband: We absolutely support the idea; transparency about the data that exist. I know that in indeed, Ofgem is bringing in regulations to ensure that debate on related questions, one of my ministerial colleagues people get an annual statement about where they can talked to the right hon. Gentleman about the way in get a better tariff from the company concerned. I hope which the Met Office was seeking permission for the that that will reassure the hon. Gentleman. release of the raw data; the right hon. Gentleman has I briefly want to mention the positive case. There are been campaigning for that. Maximum transparency can real gains for our economy if we make the low-carbon only help the case of those who believe that climate transition and if, at Copenhagen, the world signals that change is real and man-made; that is important. I will it will make the low-carbon transition. There would be not comment on the e-mails, because I have not seen the jobs in new industries, including the wind industry. The detail, but I clearly say to him that transparency is money allocated in the Budget by my right hon. Friend important. the Chancellor is already being used to help wind The only other point that I would make to the right companies such as Clipper in north-east England, which hon. Gentleman is that we should be cautious about is developing the largest offshore wind blade in the using leaked partial e-mails to cast doubt on the scientific world; it is larger than a jumbo jet. There is money for consensus, because that is dangerous and irresponsible. wave and tidal power, and money for venture capital The scientific consensus is clear. Although there must investment in green industry. be transparency of data, we should be responsible in The point is both to avoid environmental calamity how we talk about the issues. Let us be clear: the more down the road and to talk about the positive benefits we cast doubt on such questions, the more we question for our economy, energy security and quality of life. the case for action. The case for action involves making However, the scale of the challenge is enormous. Nowhere difficult decisions—a point that I shall come on to. will that be more clear than at Copenhagen, and my hon. Friend the Member for Chorley (Mr. Hoyle) referred Tim Farron (Westmorland and Lonsdale) (LD): May to the issues. The UK is determined to play its part in I assure the right hon. Gentleman that my constituents getting an ambitious agreement at Copenhagen. That is need no convincing that climate change is real? The why we have committed to 34 per cent. reductions in evidence is before our eyes in Cumbria today. Does he our carbon emissions by 2020, to more as part of an agree that denial and scepticism are basically an excuse ambitious agreement at Copenhagen, and to 80 per for copping out and not taking the action that we need cent. cuts by 2050. to take? As for the events that we are witnessing this It is worth asking, “What do 80 per cent. cuts by 2050 week in Cumbria, we sometimes refer to such events as mean?” because that is very much the context of this incidents that take place once in 100 or 1,000 years. debate. They mean huge ambition—near zero-carbon Does he agree that that is unfortunate and inaccurate homes, substantial cuts in transport, and near zero-carbon 409 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 410 energy. That shows the scale of the challenge. At the made national policy statements on that two weeks ago. same time, because of electric cars and the electrification That requires hard decisions, and we should be honest of rail and heating, it will in all likelihood—in a sense, about that. It requires giving people a voice—that is this is the biggest challenge—mean more use of electricity, important in the new planning process—but it also which must be low carbon. That is what makes the means, in my view, facing down those who would say no decarbonisation of our energy supply the most important to wind, or to nuclear, or to clean coal. The scale of the and urgent task that we face, and that is what the challenge that we face is enormous, and it requires a Energy Bill in the Gracious Speech addresses. culture change, as our countryside is going to change, because we need a low-carbon energy infrastructure. It Mr. Hugo Swire (East Devon) (Con): One of the also means driving forward on clean coal and saying no greatest polluters is the marine industry, which deploys to those who oppose it. large supertankers. As the Secretary of State will be One clean-coal power station in the UK has already aware, at the moment a considerable number of received a provisional allocation of ¤160 million in supertankers are carrying oil in very sensitive areas off funding. In the new year, we will announce how we will the shore of the UK, waiting for the price of fuel to spend the £90 million to be allocated for engineering increase. Is that a matter of concern to him, and is there and design as part the next stage of our carbon capture anything that he proposes to—or, indeed, can—do about and storage competition. The crucial thing about the it? Energy Bill is that it legislates for a clean-coal levy to provide funding for up to four demonstration projects. Edward Miliband: Controlling the movement of That will provide funding of up to £9.5 billion over the supertankers is tough, but maritime shipping and aviation coming two decades—the largest single investment in are important, and must be part of the Copenhagen CCS of any country in the world, including the United deal in my view. Unless we can get action across the States. board, including in the sector to which the hon. Gentleman referred, we will find it much harder to tackle the Mr. Brian Binley (Northampton, South) (Con) rose— problem. Edward Miliband: I give way to the hon. Gentleman, Simon Hughes (North Southwark and Bermondsey) who is a doughty fighter for clean coal. (LD): The Secretary of State has repeated that shipping, like aviation, is hugely important if we are to get the Mr. Binley: I am always pleased to hear the Minister’s right climate in future. Why, then, does the parliamentary words on clean coal, as he knows. However, we talk answer that I have just received say that of the 38 people glibly about “up to four” demonstrations, and we talk his Department is sending to Copenhagen at least 19 are about ensuring that those things happen without providing flying there, given that perfectly adequate, and probably the finance to do so properly. When will we know cheaper, rail journeys are available? exactly how many demonstrations there will be, and when will we know when the money will be available to Edward Miliband: I hate to tell the hon. Gentleman get them moving? this, but I think we might be taking more than 38 people to Copenhagen. However, I am sure that as many of Edward Miliband: The plan is that the money starts to them as possible will travel by train, and I am sure that flow from 2011, subject to the House passing the Energy we will investigate all the possibilities for getting there. Bill. The levy is precisely designed to give the certain stream of funding that the hon. Gentleman mentions. Dr. Andrew Murrison (Westbury) (Con): The Minister Our view was that in difficult fiscal times it was right to briefly mentioned electric cars—indeed, the Prime Minister make this investment and to provide a clear and certain mentioned them at the G8 in 2008, when he said that stream of funding. That is the plan. the UK should be at the forefront of the electric car revolution. However, with the exception of the efforts David Taylor (North-West Leicestershire) (Lab/Co-op): by the Mayor of London in the capital, very little With 800 million tonnes of coal in north-east Leicestershire appears to have been done, while our competitors are ready to be extracted, I would be the first to support the streets ahead, even gas-guzzling America, which has advance of clean coal technology, but does the Secretary increased its total of electric cars by 27 per cent. on of State recognise that in the interim, there is a risk of average since 1992. What is the Minister going to do an expansion of open-cast coal, which is one of the about it? most environmentally damaging activities that we can see in the midlands of England? That should be headed Edward Miliband: The hon. Gentleman obviously did off, should it not? not notice the incentive that we have unveiled for electric cars, precisely to encourage electric cars in this country, Edward Miliband: It is important to say that the as well as the charging points that my right hon. Friend position on open-cast mining has not changed and the the Secretary of State for Communities and Local planning guidance has not changed. The Government’s Government discussed last week. position is as it has been. It is for that planning guidance That takes me to the issue of energy, and I repeat that to be properly interpreted. we face big challenges in that area. No one should pretend the scale of the challenge is not huge. Our plans Mr. Stephen Crabb (Preseli Pembrokeshire) (Con): I will mean that approximately 10,000 wind turbines will am grateful to the Secretary of State, who is being be built between now and 2020, as part of the strategy extremely generous with his time. On clean coal, he says for achieving 30 per cent. renewable electricity by 2020. that already one plant has received a funding allocation It means having nuclear power stations, which is why we for a carbon capture and storage project, but the 2003 411 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 412

[Mr. Stephen Crabb] higher energy costs of winter through the winter fuel payment, and, as a result of the action that has been energy White Paper referred to CCS technologies and taken, in the past year we have eliminated the differential the need for projects. We have lost five or six years. The between pre-payment and standard credit customers. In Secretary of State is in no position to brag about speedy 2008, the average dual-fuel pre-payment customer paid progress on carbon capture. £41 more than the average standard credit dual-fuel customer; now they pay £4 less. But we know that we Edward Miliband: I am in a position not to brag but need to do more, and that is what the Energy Bill tries to to say that it is important that we are doing what many do through a series of changes. hon. Members called for—providing certainty about the stream of funding. Provided that the Bill gets through Mr. Baron: On that point, will the Secretary of State the House, it will provide the certain stream of funding give way? that I know the hon. Gentleman wants. Edward Miliband: I am going to be very generous to Willie Rennie (Dunfermline and West Fife) (LD): I the hon. Gentleman. welcome the Secretary of State’s support for carbon capture. In West Fife there is certainly support for Mr. Baron: The answer that the Secretary of State Longannet being one of those carbon capture gave me about the Ofgem annual statement was, I demonstration projects, but I fear that the timetable is respectfully point out, incorrect. The annual statement slipping; 2014 is a date that is not mentioned any more. will not explain to customers whether they are on the Can the Secretary of State give an assurance that the cheapest tariff or what they should do to switch. Will he pilots and the roll-out of carbon capture are not being answer my original question? When he first described subtly delayed? the idea, he called it ingenious, but his Department no longer supports it. Why the change? Edward Miliband: No, they are not, and 2014 has always been part of our criteria for the competition. Edward Miliband: I do not think that the hon. Gentleman That remains the case. The hon. Gentleman will know is correct, but if he is I shall be happy to make that, as with any procurement, the rules cannot be representations to Ofgem, because we need the fullest changed half way through the process, so the rules are information possible for consumers. That is what Ofgem’s as they have always been. planned annual statement is designed to do, and, as it is I was saying what the case is. There is a UK case, coming in next year, I am sure that there will be time to which all hon. Members are aware of, and there is a influence it. global case. On its own, coal accounts for around a Let me list three things that the Energy Bill will do. third of all global CO2 emissions. That is why it is so First, it will make social price support mandatory. At necessary to make progress on CCS, and why we should the moment, vulnerable customers rely on a voluntary make our contribution in the UK. It is also—this goes system to receive a reduced rate on energy. The voluntary to my point about the economic opportunity for Britain systems mean that more than 1 million customer accounts in tackling climate change—a huge economic opportunity. have benefited from lower prices, but I fully acknowledge I pay tribute to regional development agencies and that we need to do more, and that is why we will make others who are working on potential clusters in their compulsory that support and increase the available own areas. That is true in Yorkshire and in other parts amount of social price support. of the country. All these can be eligible for the levy and the funding that that will provide. The possibilities are Secondly, the regulator needs stronger powers to deal significant. Independent estimates say that we could with abuse, and the Bill will specifically act to prevent have up to 60,000 jobs in the UK as a result of moving the exploitation of market power by energy generators. towards CCS, with the demonstration projects that I Thirdly, not only do we need stronger powers for the have talked about as the hub. regulator but we need the regulator to use them, so the Bill will change Ofgem’s remit to reflect the fact—this is In respect of our low carbon and energy infrastructure, very important—that relying on competition alone is there are difficult decisions to be made on renewables, insufficient if we are to provide the consumer protection nuclear and clean coal, but the other half of the equation that we need. My message is very clear—the regulator is the cost that we face. It is important that we face up to must step in proactively where competition is not sufficient those costs. The low carbon transition plan was clear to protect the interests of consumers. We will make that about the costs and the impacts on bills. The CCS levy very clear. will add 2 or 3 per cent. to electricity bills by 2020, as we have set out. The only way we take people with us in this John Mann (Bassetlaw) (Lab): A number of people in process is by showing that the price impacts can be fair. my constituency would like to use less electricity, but unfortunately the communal heating systems that the Mr. Baron: Will the Secretary of State give way? local authority refuses to change prohibits them from doing so. Will the Secretary of State look at whether an Edward Miliband: I have already given way to the amendment could be added to the Bill to compel local hon. Gentleman. I want to make progress. authorities to get rid of those inefficient and environmentally We are acting in the Bill and elsewhere to make the unfriendly communal heating systems? transition as fair as it can be. We are acting to help people reduce the energy that they use, and in the past Edward Miliband: I thought that we were rather in year 1.5 million households received support to improve favour of community heating, but perhaps not in the their insulation. We are acting to help people meet the case that my hon. Friend talks about. I fear an increase 413 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 414 in this trend whereby I receive lots of invitations to add investment bank. That policy was announced today. to our Bill, which I am told has to be short and concise. The green investment bank is the first bank in world Indeed, I think that it is. However, I shall definitely look history to be announced with no money attached to at what my hon. Friend has to say on that question. it—it will not be much of a bank, in my view. This is an opportunity for the Conservative party to Mr. Mike Weir (Angus) (SNP): I support what the join the all-party consensus in this debate. There are five Secretary of State said about mandatory social tariffs, questions that I hope that the hon. Member for Tunbridge but we need to introduce the data-sharing provisions Wells will be able to answer—the five tests, one might that were passed in a previous Bill. I understand, however, call them. The Conservatives need to face up to the hard that an ongoing Department for Work and Pensions choices that are necessary. First, I say that the CCS levy pilot must end before data sharing can be introduced, is necessary: does he agree? I will be interested to hear so what is the time scale for making it available to his reply. Secondly, they need to face up to the hard energy companies? choices necessary on low-carbon infrastructure in general. We say that it is right to go ahead with the Infrastructure Edward Miliband: I am reassured by the Under-Secretary Planning Commission, but the local government spokesman of State for Energy and Climate Change, my hon. for the Conservatives says that they would abolish the Friend the Member for Stafford (Mr. Kidney), that the IPC. Business says that it is very worried about that regulations will be out this week, so that is a clear sign plan because it would set back the process of building of delivery by the Department for Energy and Climate our low-carbon infrastructure. Change. Thirdly, we say that it is wrong that 60 per cent. of wind turbine applications are turned down by Conservative David Taylor: I thank my right hon. Friend for giving councils, because that will not get us the low-carbon way for a second time. Social tariffs drive down electricity energy infrastructure that we need. [Interruption.] Just bills, but so does energy efficiency. Will he comment on to be clear about this, 60 per cent. of such applications the plans that have been floated to make available to all made to Conservative councils are turned down. That is 25 million households in Britain energy efficiency loans not surprising, given that the shadow Business Secretary of £6,500? Is he aware that the cost would be about says: £160 billion, a sum not unadjacent to 10 per cent. of “My view is that those few wild and open spaces that we have GDP? Is that a cost-effective way of using taxpayers’ left in Britain should not be used for wind turbines”. money? There would be no onshore wind at all under the Conservatives. The hon. Member for Tunbridge Wells Edward Miliband: My hon. Friend makes his point will have to tell us whether he agrees with me that we eloquently. My hon. Friend the Minister of State and need onshore wind to contribute towards a renewable the hon. Member for Tunbridge Wells (Greg Clark) energy target of 15 per cent. or agrees with his right have become pen pals on that issue, but I have to say hon. and learned Friend the shadow Business Secretary. that her letters have been better than his. I shall turn to that subject in a moment. Fourthly, there is the issue of costs, which was mentioned My message is very clear: the regulator must step in by my hon. Friend the Member for North-West proactively where competition is not sufficient to protect Leicestershire (David Taylor). The Conservatives cannot the interests of consumers. Let me also make it clear simply keep going round promising things that they do that the new system of quarterly reporting on wholesale not have a clue how they are going to pay for. The latest and retail prices that we introduced is designed to bring example is the promise of £6,500 for every household, transparency and fairness for consumers. We look forward which would cost £150 billion or more, as my hon. to the next quarterly report, because when there is a Friend the Minister of State has made clear. They have case for price reductions they need to be passed on to absolutely no idea how they are going to pay for that consumers. Taken together, the measures that we have policy, and I will be interested to hear what the hon. announced in the Queen’s Speech confront the hard Member for Tunbridge Wells has to say about it. choices that we have to make in relation to climate Finally, there is the international dimension of climate change: hard choices about our energy infrastructure, change. That is not about the huskies—it is about about energy bills, and about protection for vulnerable Europe. What are the Conservatives doing in Europe? consumers. They are hanging around with climate change deniers in I search in this debate for that elusive thing, all-party their new grouping. What did Roger Helmer, the consensus, but on domestic policy I am not optimistic. Conservative MEP, choose to do this week, of all It has to be said that the Conservatives are outstanding weeks? He organised a conference of climate change at green image-making. Let us be honest, the image that deniers. What kind of signal does that send? I think it we all remember—perhaps their finest moment; I think sends a ridiculous signal, and I will be interested to hear it was the brainchild of the hon. Member for Bexhill the views of the hon. Member for Tunbridge Wells. The and Battle (Gregory Barker)—is the huskies. [Interruption.] truth is that on the CCS levy, on energy infrastructure, There was not a car driving behind the huskies—that on costing their policies, and on Europe, the Conservatives was in the case of the bicycle. The test for the Opposition are not willing to face up to the hard choices necessary in this debate on the Gracious Address is whether they to make the green energy revolution happen. can match the huskies with clear and concrete policy By contrast, we are willing to face up to the hard making. So far, they have not done very well, but the choices. We have a clear plan with clear policy. It is Queen’s Speech represents a chance for them to support guided by the science, it makes the case for action us in five particular areas. [Interruption.] The hon. economically as well as environmentally, and it is about Member for Bexhill and Battle refers to the green taking the carbon out of our economy. The Queen’s 415 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 416

[Edward Miliband] Dr. Roberta Blackman-Woods (City of Durham) (Lab): The hon. Gentleman makes a valid point about the Speech makes an essential contribution to that task and need for more energy in the future, and particularly for to combating dangerous climate change, adapting to it more renewable energy, so will he tell the House what he and ensuring that the low-carbon transition is fair. I is going to do to persuade his party’s council leaders to commend the Gracious Speech to the House. approve more wind farm applications rather than reject them in the numbers that they are currently rejecting them? 4.10 pm Greg Clark (Tunbridge Wells) (Con): I begin by Greg Clark: If the hon. Lady will be patient, I will expressing my solidarity with what the Secretary of answer the Secretary of State’s question about that in State said about our concerns for the people of Cumbria great detail; I have no problem with doing that. However, and other parts of the country given the devastating we should be aware of the chasm that faces us: power floods that they have suffered during recent days. I cuts that will affect British industry and consumers and believe that that part of the country is braced for be equivalent to an hour’s black-out for a quarter of the further inclement weather, so perhaps the Secretary of British population. What a humiliation it is that we are State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs might in that position. take the trouble in his remarks at the end of the debate to update us on what is going on there. We all know that Mr. Swire: My hon. Friend is talking about the the family of PC Barker will never be consoled over his future, but an immediate problem is storage capacity, loss, but they should know that we are united in admiration particularly for gas. Other countries, such as France, for the heroic father of the children in that family. have far greater capacity. Does he agree that our current It is always a pleasure to debate matters with the capacity is woefully inadequate, and that the Government Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change. We have not had their eye on the ball? have seen something of a starfest in these Queen’s Speech debates in recent days. We started with the Greg Clark: My hon. Friend is right and it is completely Secretary of State for Children, Schools and Families, inadequate. The Energy Bill was an opportunity to take moved on to the Energy Secretary’s brother, the Foreign urgent action on this point. Other countries protect Secretary, and now we have the right hon. Gentleman themselves against the possibility of interrupted gas himself. One could be forgiven for thinking that this was supplies, and nothing in the Bill would address that an early hustings meeting for the future leadership of problem. the Labour party. I suspect that that accounts for the thinness of the attendance on the Labour Benches. Nia Griffith (Llanelli) (Lab): How did the Conservatives’ There is a degree of consensus, despite the Secretary policies in the 1980s help to secure energy supplies—they of State’s attempts towards the end of his speech to sow wrecked the coal industry—and will he tell us about the the seeds of division, which were not particularly necessary. power stations that his party constructed in the 1980s He mentioned the Energy Bill, but he must realise that and 1990s that would have prevented the crisis that we at this stage of a Parliament, faced with the current are now facing? crisis in our energy security, it is so weak and feeble in its contribution to solving the problem as to defy belief. Greg Clark: I do not know whether the hon. Lady is As has been mentioned, we have had news today that with us on the need to decarbonise our production of last winter, there was a 40 per cent. increase in the electricity, but one of the problems that we face at the number of excess winter deaths—people who sadly died moment is the fact that our coal-fired power stations in advance of what was expected. If that is not a clarion cause nitrogen and sulphur dioxide pollution and contribute call for an urgent increase in the energy efficiency of disastrously to our climate change objectives. So the properties in this country, especially for people who are unabated reliance on coal that she implies is not the vulnerable and in need, particularly pensioners, I do not answer. know what is. Yet that fails to appear in any part of the Bill, which is a great disappointment to Conservative Miss Julie Kirkbride (Bromsgrove) (Con): If Labour Members and, I suspect, to those of all parties. Members want a lesson in history, they need only look Unbelievably, the Bill is not purposeful in its intentions. back some five years, when the Government published It is timid and provides powers that will need to be an energy White Paper on future energy needs and enacted in a future Session. It does not get to grips with completely dismissed the idea that nuclear power stations the urgency of the problem. It fails to take into account should be recommissioned. That was absolutely ridiculous. the urgency of the opportunity that we have been pointing out, which is a shame, because there is cross-party Greg Clark: My hon. Friend is right. Indeed, the consensus on addressing our need to close the energy Government have failed to take the right decisions on gap that has opened up. all of these different technologies. They have got us into That is the context in which we debate these matters. this position because they have failed, over a 12-year For the first time since the 1970s this country faces a period, to take the necessary decisions for our national shortfall in its energy generation capacity and the energy security. That should not be a surprise, because Government have had to admit that we face power cuts it is the same approach as they took on the economy, in the decade ahead. It is back to the 1970s—that was where they failed to address the problems that were disclosed in the Government’s own paper, which was evidently mounting, instead hoping to be able to look published and announced to the House in July. the other way and ignore them. 417 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 418

Mr. Laurence Robertson (Tewkesbury) (Con): My think, Mr. Speaker? Of course we have not. There is a hon. Friend talks about the weakness of the Energy gap there, just as there is a gap in all the other technologies. Bill, but he will recall that the Government passed the The Secretary of State trumpeted his proposals in the Energy Act 2004. I had the honour of leading for the Energy Bill that will come before us to introduce a levy Opposition on that Bill, and while it did a few useful to pay for that process—or, I should say, to introduce things, it entirely disregarded the problem that we are the powers later that would give him the opportunity to facing. introduce a levy to pay for it. However, given that we have known for so long that Greg Clark: It has been a consistent tendency of the coal without CCS is not viable, why has it taken a Government’s over the past 12 years to behave like an proposal in the Energy Bill in this Queen’s Speech, so ostrich, put their head in the sand and duck these late in the day, for us even to think about how it will be issues—[Interruption.] Labour Members moan, but let paid for? As my hon. Friend the Member for Preseli us go through each option in turn. For example, the Pembrokeshire (Mr. Crabb) said, going down the CCS whole House has known for the past 12 years that route was first mooted in 2003, so why were those North sea oil and gas production would peak and go proposals not in the Queen’s Speech in 2004, 2005, into decline during the years ahead. There was nothing 2006, 2007 or 2008? Only now, in 2009, do we finally get much to be done about that, but we should have prepared the first inkling that it might be necessary to pass a for the inevitability of needing to import greater supplies piece of legislation to turn what I might uncharitably of gas. What happens in other countries that rely on gas call the right hon. Gentleman’s predecessor’s hot air on to heat and power their homes? They ensure that they the subject into something approaching an idea that have enough storage capacity to get them through the could help with our energy security. winter— When it comes to renewables, again we have an abysmal record in this country. In the first decade of the Mr. Swire: By law. 12 and a half years in which the Government have been in office, we increased the share of energy that we Greg Clark: As my hon. Friend says, that is a legal generated from renewables from 1 to 1.3 per cent. What requirement in many cases. Have we seen such an approach a completely pathetic increase, especially when we consider in the past 12 years from the Government? Of course that we have some of the best renewable resources in the we have not, and the result is that we have—at the world, including a coastline that is the envy of Europe present rate of consumption in the winter—fewer than in the opportunities that it provides for wind, wave and 15 days’ storage capacity for gas supplies. Germany has tidal energy—none of which has been exploited to its 99 days and France has 125 days of storage capacity. As full potential, beyond a bare scratching of the surface. the Secretary of State knows, in February when we At a time when other countries have substantially increased faced a combination of a severe winter and the dispute their contributions from renewables, it is shameful that between Russia and Ukraine, which disrupted gas supplies we have failed to take the opportunities that we have across Europe, we had left in storage just four days had, and in so doing seen the supply chain for many worth of gas. If that were this week, that would not be such technologies move to other countries. enough to get us to the weekend. That is an abysmal record for this Government. Nor did the problem emerge Linda Gilroy (Plymouth, Sutton) (Lab/Co-op): Could from a clear, blue sky: it was predictable and foreseeable. the hon. Gentleman therefore explain why his party Another example is nuclear energy. We have known voted against the financial stimulus, which included a for the whole of the past decade that our nuclear fleet £1.4 billion package for sustainable investment, including would come to the end of its planned life by the end of in the low-carbon economy in my region? the decade ahead, but where was the realisation that that would lead to a shortfall in our energy-generating Greg Clark: I have just been talking about how the capacity? It was not there. We are now in the ridiculous Government’s approach to the economy very much situation where it is too late for us to renew the contribution mirrors their approach to energy. Where they have from our existing nuclear fleet before it is closed down. acted, they have acted unsustainably, but more often We cannot have new nuclear power stations up and they have failed to act. We are in the sad position of not running by 2017. Yet again, that is an abdication of being able to afford the profligacy that the hon. Lady responsibility by this Government over 12 years. mentions. When the Government finally publish the long-awaited Edward Miliband: The hon. Gentleman has just said planning statement on nuclear—indeed, it is six months something significant. He said that we cannot afford overdue—they leave it open to further delay through the £400 million to which my hon. Friend the Member the possibility of judicial review. However, that could for Plymouth, Sutton (Linda Gilroy) referred, which is have been proofed against if only they had followed the investment in green technology. That is what he said. right democratic course and allowed this House to vote on the statement and ratify it, thereby clearly expressing Greg Clark: No, I am talking about a fiscal stimulus the view of the people through the House, so that when more generally. The right hon. Gentleman knows that it comes to judicial review, investors can have a greater we have been talking all week about the proposals that reliance on it. we will make. I will come on to say more about them, The hon. Member for Llanelli (Nia Griffith) mentioned but whatever we are talking about—whether gas storage, coal. We have known for many years that our most nuclear, coal or renewables—the Government’s record polluting coal-fired power stations would need to be over 12 years, across the board and on all those technologies, turned off in the years ahead, but have we had a plan to has been to create the problem that is now a national replace them with clean coal capacity? What do you emergency for us to solve. 419 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 420

Mr. Peter Ainsworth (East Surrey) (Con): I assure my policy for the times, and it is a source of sadness to me hon. Friend that this litany of woe is all too familiar to and others outside the House that the Secretary of State me. Will he comment on the lamentable record on has not had the imagination to put such a proposal into energy efficiency? The energy that we do not use is the the Queen’s Speech. greenest, cheapest and most secure of all. John Mann: One group of people who cannot benefit Greg Clark: My hon. Friend is completely right. It is are local authority tenants living in accommodation a real disappointment that the Energy Bill does not with communal heating systems. The only way they can contain a serious proposal to improve the energy efficiency reduce the heat is to open their windows, and they are of our properties. I was asked earlier about our green still billed for the total cost of the heating by the local deal, which has been widely welcomed as offering the authority. Does the hon. Gentleman agree that local opportunity for people to save money on their energy authorities that refuse to deal with such inefficiency and bills. That is much needed—[Interruption.] The Secretary continue to bill their tenants, who have no choice, need of State might not think that that is the case, but his to be tackled robustly and immediately by the Government? constituents might advise him that they are struggling to pay their bills at the moment. It is important that we find ways to cut the energy consumption in people’s Greg Clark: I agree with the hon. Gentleman to the homes, especially at this time. In so doing, we should extent that, if people are having to open their windows to maintain the right temperature in their homes, that is also be helping to reduce our CO2 emissions. I cannot for the life of me understand why, when everyone recognises a problem that should be addressed. I am sure that the that the best way to save energy and money is to stop modern controls on boilers should be able to address it. wasting energy, the Government have wasted the In general, I share the Secretary of State’s enthusiasm opportunity provided by the Queen’s Speech and the for district heating systems that can provide a more Energy Bill finally to do something about that. efficient alternative to individual boilers. However, the energy efficiency improvements that we have been talking Mr. Swire: Does my hon. Friend agree that one of the about apply just as much to the tenants that the hon. Government’s biggest omissions has been in not considering Gentleman has just mentioned as to the occupiers of rural areas, especially areas such as Devon, which have any other kind of house. very old houses that are much more difficult to insulate? They have provided no significant extra funds for such Edward Miliband: The hon. Gentleman knows that insulation. we have published our own home energy efficiency plan for 700 million households to be insulated by 2020 and Greg Clark: My hon. Friend is right. When we were we have said that we will pilot it in the low-carbon designing our green deal, we were determined that the transition plan, which we will be announcing shortly. limit of £6,500 should be high enough to ensure not The problem with the hon. Gentleman’s position is that only that it covered the basic cavity walls and loft he says that we can give £6,500 to everybody on day insulation available for modern houses, but that houses one. I do not know how he will pay for every household that are harder to treat—I hesitate to say “hard to to have that. I asked him in my speech to clarify—perhaps treat”, because it is important to get the message out he can advise us now—how he will pay for that £6,500 that they can be treated—can be treated in such a way on day one. that actually saves money. We need to unlock the savings that people can make, and use them to release to people Greg Clark: I cannot understand why the Secretary up front the cost of making those investments. of State does not listen if not to me, then to his own It is characteristic of the Government to assume that speeches. Perhaps he has been too long in the Treasury. any proposal that they hear about must involve the Let me remind him of what he said to the Environmental expenditure of vast amounts of public funds. That is Audit Committee, and I shall comment on it after I have what they assume all the time—[Interruption.] I will read it: enlighten the Secretary of State. When people save “The truth about energy efficiency is that it pays to do it, but money on their energy bills through being more energy the problem is the upfront costs. And the task is to spread those efficient, that is costing them less than it otherwise costs over time, not over the time that someone lives in a house, would. That stream of savings continues into the future. because that might be eight or nine years and that’s probably not Our discussions with the banks have elicited a certain enough time, to spread it over a longer period so the repayment, if enthusiasm for the proposal that, by taking those savings you like, is connected to the house not the person and to find and capitalising on them, people can get the money up ways”— front that is needed to make those investments. [Interruption.] The right hon. Gentleman should listen That proposal would benefit everyone in the economy. to this, as I am quoting his own words back to him and From day one, it would reduce energy consumption and this is a particularly important point: bills, even after repayment, for the people who engage in “in which I think the private sector and others, local councils such improvements. It would reduce our CO2 emissions maybe… can come in and provide that upfront finance”. and provide work for energy efficiency installers at a That is what the Secretary of State said on 27 October time when the construction industry is suffering. It to the Environmental Audit Committee, so I suggest would also provide apprenticeships. It would provide a that he listens to the evidence that he gives to Committees stimulus to the economy that would not have the effect and puts it in the Bills that he brings before the House. that the Government’s stimulus is having—namely, to saddle future generations with debts without the means of repaying them. There could not be a better designed John Battle (Leeds, West) (Lab) rose— 421 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 422

Greg Clark: I want to make some progress. Many This time last week, I was in Bangladesh with the hon. Members want to speak and I have already taken charity Christian Aid, looking at the experience of several interventions. If I have time, I will come back to people living in that part of the world, particularly the right hon. Gentleman. those living on a delta near the coastline. What struck It is not surprising that we have been in this mess over me about all the villages that I visited was not that such a long period when over the past 12 years of this flooding, erosion and cyclones were out of their historical Government we have had 15 different Energy Ministers. experience—life in the delta is clearly dangerous and If Ministers are moved every nine months, it is not prone to such events—but that people recalling their surprising that they cannot get their heads around this childhoods were unanimous in the view that events relatively technical subject and do not get enough time taking place there now were occurring with much greater to act. It is not as though the creation of the new severity and frequency than was the case even a generation Department has solved all these problems, although it is ago. We cannot say that any individual event is categorically a step in the right direction. I discovered the other day indicative of climate change. However, I think there is that a shadow Department of Energy and Climate consensus between us that such events are happening Change, if we can believe it, has been set up in Lord across the world, and are happening more frequently Mandelson’s empire. Not only is there a shadow and more severely. Department in the Opposition, but there is a shadow The meeting in Copenhagen that the Secretary of Department—shadowing everything that the Secretary State is about to attend represents an important opportunity. of State does and presumably picking holes in it—in As we have said before during exchanges on this subject, the Government. Not only that: I have discovered that if a deal is to be done at Copenhagen it must be 15 civil servants are employed to do that work. The rigorous and consistent with what the science considers problem has not been solved; the Government are eating necessary to contain catastrophic climate change. A themselves. We are in such a state of tailspin that the serious attempt must be made to find a new mechanism Government are setting up Departments to shadow enabling us to generate funds covering the additional themselves, which is a pretty poor state of affairs. costs of climate change—additional, that is, to the costs We are where we are and this opportunity to achieve that we have already accepted are needed to help people a degree of cross-party consensus on some of the necessary across the world to deal with their poverty in other measures has arisen; in many cases, we agree on what respects. It is particularly urgent for the rain forests to needs to be done, but a lack of urgency has prevailed be protected by a tangible deal. If there is one thing we during the past 12 years and, sadly, it prevails to this day. can do immediately, it is to stop the destruction of rain forests that can not only reduce the stock of carbon John Battle: I want to be absolutely clear about what dioxide in the atmosphere, but help the countries in the hon. Gentleman is offering the people. If he is which they are located. offering £6,500 to every family, to be paid for by the I am optimistic that a positive deal can be struck at energy companies and backed up by either the Government Copenhagen. I am sure that there will be tense moments or local authorities, how much does he expect the public during the weeks ahead when it will seem likely that a coffers to put forward? I understand that he is offering deal is slipping away, but I think that it can be done. it immediately to every family in Britain. One by one, countries that were opposed to international agreements—such as the United States, Australia and Greg Clark: I am grateful for that intervention because Japan—are coming aboard. I think that the intervention it allows me to tell the right hon. Gentleman that it will of China in recent weeks is highly significant. Many of cost the public sector precisely nothing. The savings its efforts have been overlooked by the west, but it has made on energy bills will be brought forward to pay for made considerable progress. the costs. [Interruption.] Let me commend something I also think that the Chinese sense an industrial called the McKinsey cost curve to the Secretary of opportunity. In my view, one of the reasons why the State; I am surprised that he is not familiar with it. The Chinese Government have reversed their position, or at McKinsey cost curve is well known to those of us least advanced it towards greater urgency of action on familiar with the literature. What it shows is that some climate change, is that they see that a global economy ways of improving energy efficiency and saving carbon based on low-carbon sources can offer jobs and prosperity actually save money at the same time—and that is to their people as it can to ours. For instance, 4,000 miles where we should start. It seems to me that if the of high-speed electric railway have been installed in Secretary of State is aware of that, he is not able to China in the past few years, and it has a new and translate it into policy. ambitious nuclear power programme. It is clear that the Chinese Government are booking their place for Linda Gilroy rose— the future. I share the fear of some of my hon. Friends that we Greg Clark: I must make some progress now, if the may be falling behind the pace somewhat. Carbon hon. Lady will forgive me. capture and storage is an example. It would be a tragedy I want to talk about an area where there is greater for this country if that were indeed the case. We have agreement—on the international dimension. The some of the best resources for the new energy economy. Copenhagen summit, meeting in less than two weeks’ We could not be better placed in terms of our marine time, is a crucial opportunity not just for Britain but for engineering skills, some of our research institutions and the world. We cannot say for sure that the floods in some of our process engineering skills—not least in Cumbria were a result of climate change, but what we Teesside, where I grew up. It is important that we can say is that events like it are going to be more likely, harness those skills to provide jobs for the future, and to more severe and more frequent in the future. serve as a new source of buoyancy in our economy. It 423 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 424

[Greg Clark] use of our fantastic coastal resources. We will provide those parks so that we can have that head start. Rather makes me angry to observe the dithering on carbon than hectoring communities that host wind farms, telling capture and storage which has resulted in countries them that they are somehow immoral if they entertain around the world such as China, Canada and Germany any objection at all, we will engage them in dialogue stealing the lead that we could have had if we had been and allow them to share in the benefits of renewable true to what the Labour party said that it wanted to do energy. We would allow every community that hosts a a while ago. wind farm to keep six years’ worth of business rates that arise from that investment. Why is that not in the Tim Farron: Will the hon. Gentleman give way? Queen’s Speech? It will be in the Queen’s Speech if we are elected to government next year. Greg Clark: I will give way one more time. We will upgrade our 50-year-old national grid to be a smart grid so that it can better balance the supply of Tim Farron: Does the hon. Gentleman accept that electricity, especially from renewables, and the demands. hydropower, particularly in counties such as Cumbria, We will speed up the deployment of smart meters. For provides an opportunity that we have missed massively some reason the Government have been bludgeoned in recent years? We had a thriving localised hydroelectricity into thinking that smart meters cannot be introduced system until the 1950s, but successive Governments until the end of 2020, 11 years away. Across the world have let it go. We know—obviously—about the power now, communities are benefiting from the interactivity of the water in the county of Cumbria, but there are and the cost savings that come from smart meters. We only four working hydro schemes there today. Is that need to get on with that. Why do not we have this urgent not an outrage, and should we not be building on what action? is available? We need charging points for electric vehicles all around the country. We need the kind of consumer revolution Greg Clark: I completely agree. We have failed across that my hon. Friend the Member for Billericay the board to capitalise on our technology. The first (Mr. Baron)—he has momentarily left his place—talked industrial revolution started with a reliance on water, about. We need information on bills that says not just not least in the north-west of England. The part of the how much the consumer has consumed—often an estimate country that the hon. Member for Westmorland and at the moment—but how one could go to the cheapest Lonsdale (Tim Farron) represents is teeming with energy possible tariff, with the number and the link to be able possibilities. It has been described as the energy coast, to do that immediately. and that applies a bit inland as well. We should be We need transparency on wholesale prices. When the leading the world in this and it is frustrating that we wholesale prices of gas are falling, consumers rightly are not. expect that their bills will fall, too. I am not at all The Queen’s Speech should have contained a set of satisfied that the present system is clear enough as to urgent actions: an emergency plan to keep the lights on whether the right reductions in domestic fuel bills are in this country and to reduce CO2 emissions as we need happening at the right pace. That needs to be investigated to and to keep fuel bills down for those in greatest need, and acted on immediately. not least through energy efficiency. If the Conservative We will give every household in the country a green party is elected to government, that is what one will find deal that would allow them to have the energy efficiency in the Energy Bill that will be included in the first improvements that would cut our CO2 emissions, save Queen’s Speech of a new Government. We would them money and get people back to work in this country. immediately deploy clean coal technology and would Immediate action to keep the lights on, to create jobs, to not dither as the Government have done through the make the UK the industrial leader that it should be in competition. We would publish and, subject to a vote in all these technologies and to safeguard our planet—that Parliament, immediately ratify the planning guidance is what is needed from a Queen’s Speech from a Government that is needed on nuclear— of this country. The only power cut that we want is an end to the power of this Government and the election Edward Miliband: We have done that. of a Government who take these matters seriously. Britain will be better for it. Greg Clark: The right hon. Gentleman says that he has done it, but he has not brought it to this House to be ratified. We would do that so there is proof against 4.44 pm judicial review. Mr. John Prescott (Kingston upon Hull, East) (Lab): We need to have diversity. Churchill said that diversity I want to address my remarks to the climate change and diversity alone guaranteed energy security. We should negotiations. They are critical and I think that all speakers abide by that principle. We will mandate the national recognise that. I also want to set my speech against the grid to extend its network offshore as well as onshore, background of my experience at Kyoto, because many so that we can better harness the power of the waves, aspects of that seem to be being repeated as we approach tides and offshore wind. We need to be able to get the negotiations at Copenhagen, which I call “Kyoto 2” the benefits to consumers onshore and we need that as we are not developing a new convention, but merely offshore grid. an extension of Kyoto. We will build marine energy parks—perhaps there The current developments are important. I agree might be one in Cumbria—to provide the grid connections with what the Secretary of State said. The Opposition and the planning requirements necessary to allow spokesman, the hon. Member for Tunbridge Wells entrepreneurs to promote new energy projects, making (Greg Clark), said some things about climate change 425 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 426 towards the end of his speech that I agree with, particularly that the earth was flat, but the rest of us did not generally about how China and other countries have begun to agree with them. At Kyoto, one or two research bodies develop in respect of these issues. Momentum is now were found who came up and said that the science is beginning to develop. People had, however, been suggesting now doubted. The overwhelming opinion now in almost that Copenhagen was going to end in breakdown, and I every country is that the science is accurate, however. want to say something about that. That is not the same situation as at Kyoto. Let me explain something that we learned from Kyoto, The right hon. Member for Hitchin and Harpenden as it is important. There seems to have been the view (Mr. Lilley) quoted an article in The Guardian.Iread that the Copenhagen negotiations must result in a legally the article, and it also made a statement about not binding agreement. There was not a chance in hell of detracting from the central argument about the accuracy getting a legally binding agreement, however, as anybody of the science. Why did he not quote that? Why did he who has looked into the matter will know. I have been quote only the bits about the university in question, and saying that for almost 12 months, and I have been so forth? [Interruption.] Well, it would be very good if criticised for undermining negotiations, but I am pleased he actually gave us a proper and objective opinion, to see that we have moved away from plan A, and we are instead of just selectively quoting from the article, as now looking at plan B. What is important is to get an he did. agreement, not a breakdown—everybody agrees that I shall now return my attention to Lord Lawson. In that is critical. I have to note, however, that we did not an article in The Times, he casts doubt on the science, do a deal in December 1997; we established the principles, but he also says that he has no idea whether the science and it then took us three years to negotiate the processes is true. He is quite sceptical about it; he produced a by which we would achieve those, and it took us another book a few years ago making it clear he is sceptical three or four years before the deal was ratified by the about it. I am bound to say, however, that the fact that 55 countries that had to ratify it. The time taken was, he announces this now has the same ring as what therefore, up to seven or eight years. In my view, the happened at Kyoto. Just before people come to the current situation will not be different. I recognise the negotiations, they start throwing in all the doubt about 2015 and 2020 timetable and the argument that if we do the science. not meet that, we might fail; however, the real point is to get an agreement. Apparently, Lord Lawson is setting up a As we approach the Copenhagen conference, similar “high-powered all-party (and non-party) think-tank, the Global lines of opposition are beginning to develop. At the Warming Policy Foundation”. time of Kyoto, a combination of people from the coal, Obviously that is designed to feed into the current steel and iron industries—all great carbon emitters—got atmosphere that the science is faulty. It is true, as he together in America and went to Kyoto and said, “We suggests, that we are making judgments on the science—all can’t accept this agreement.” Fortunately, they were Governments are. He desires “open and reasoned debate” ignored at Kyoto and an agreement was reached. We and was very upset about the word “trick” in the e-mail are, however, already seeing the first signs of a similar from the university—we would all be concerned about line of opposition developing now. I was in America a that if the imputation is right, but an inquiry is going on few months ago, where the same people were again into that. I should say to him that this approach is putting in hundreds of millions of dollars to combat exactly what we found at Kyoto: people come up with the idea of climate change. They were employing a some scientific body that they say has done the research technique that is also now emerging here. I am sure that and suggested that the science is not acceptable. Members will be well aware that we are suddenly seeing I just wondered who is financing this body that Lord attacks on the science. It has, for instance, been said that Lawson is setting up. We tend to find that such bodies some event was merely an exceptional incident, and are funded by the oil and coal industry and people like questions have been raised as to whether someone used that. So I had a look and found that the Central Europe the word “trick” in an e-mail, all in order to attempt to Trust Ltd is the body that he has set up and his clients undermine the science. are Elf, Total, Shell, BP, Amoco, Texaco—that is a lot A thousand scientists have said they believe in the of oil companies. From what I can see of it, it is not so science, however. Not so many of those involved at much a think-tank as a petrol tank. Kyoto said that, but now there is no doubt. Everybody We must take that point into account, because Lord everywhere agrees about this—except Lord Lawson, as Lawson used to say a great deal about money from the I see from the statements he has been making. trade unions influencing the position of the Labour Mr. Lilley: Is the right hon. Gentleman aware of the party and about the people paying the piper calling the study of all registered climate scientists carried out by tune. It is fair to say that as this operation is being Dr. von Storch of the Planck Institute in Germany? It financed by the oil companies, we should perhaps look showed that two thirds of scientists agree with the a little suspiciously at it. The right hon. Member for scientific conclusion that the majority of recent warming Hitchin and Harpenden may have a future in this, is produced by anthropological means, but that means because he knows the oil companies involved. There that a third of them disagree. Moreover, only 8 per cent. seems to be a correlation whereby if someone works for of all scientists thought it was the most important oil companies, they happen to be against the science. threat to the world’s future. Saying that is perhaps a bit naughty, but people get suspicious about the conclusions that are being reached. Mr. Prescott: I am sure that studies come up with The point I wish to make is that the science is right, such results, but I do not think that the people who and we must act on it. The Secretary of State for Energy disagree with the science are in the majority; they are a and Climate Change made it clear in his speech what he very small minority. There were people who still believed has to do about that. The important thing is to ensure 427 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 428

[Mr. Prescott] we have, so any Copenhagen agreement had better find a way of introducing better social equity. That is what that there is momentum. To be fair, I should say that the we have been doing in the Council of Europe, where I Opposition spokesman mentioned the kind of changes am the rapporteur, and I shall be at Copenhagen. that are under way. The view has always been that there It is important that we get greater transparency. In is not going to be any change in Copenhagen, that my last speech, I said that we should be measuring the things will break down and the issue causing the breakdown problem by gigatonnes instead of by emissions. Measuring tends to be emissions. emissions is fancy dancing by Europe, basically—people Let us consider what is happening, even in the countries do not know what they are doing, but it looks as if they that have been mentioned. South Korea, Japan—it promised are doing something. The real point is whether the things at Kyoto and did not deliver on them, but there is southern world will get a better chance of growth. a different party in power there now and its Tories have When we measure by gigatonnes, we find that the figure gone—Brazil, Russia and Australia have all decided per head in America is 20 gigatonnes, in Africa it is that they are going to do something about cutting 1 gigatonne and in Europe it is 12 gigatonnes. If we emissions. That is at the heart of this argument. begin to set a good example and consider how we can I was in China last week having discussions with get fairness and equity into the system, that is how we Premier Wen and appealing to him to ensure that the will achieve results in Copenhagen. We have to be very Chinese leadership go to Copenhagen. It was clear from clear about trying to create social justice. the communiqué that both America and China are I believe that we are on the way to some agreement. It considering what further offers they can make on emissions. will not be a matter of the dotting the i’s and crossing Of course America faces a difficulty, because it has a the t’s, but of finding a political framework that we can constitutional requirement to put things before Congress, offer. There must be a timetable to it, and Mr. de Boer but it is nevertheless showing that it might make some of the UN made that absolutely clear. He said that the judgments about that. China and America are the major political agreement at Copenhagen has to set out essential emitters, and if they can come to some agreement about principles: first, it must focus on what is realistic and emissions, that would represent a major change in the concentrate on the politics of achieving that; and it argument. should get climate change and emissions targets that While I was in China addressing a group and a countries should agree with. I think that is crucial. conference—this was paid by me; nobody else pays the There is another factor to consider if we are to get the money when I go to these countries—people were discussing framework right, which I believe that we can do—we how they might now move on this. Where do the difficulties are moving in that direction. On this point, the Government lie? The difficulties are whether we recognise the common are showing the leadership that they have always shown but differentiated responsibilities and that the bigger and as they showed on achieving the Kyoto targets. burden should fall on the developed countries—clearly Leaders must go to Copenhagen. When our Prime it should—whether we believe there should be an audit Minister said that he was going, he gave a lead. We now if a policy is carried out and whether there will be a have 60 countries going. I appealed to Premier Wen timetable on such an audit. Those are very real questions only last week that China must be represented. We and the Chinese are now discussing how we can achieve decided at the Council of Europe meeting in Paris this progress on them. To that extent, we are getting considerably week that we will write to India, China and America. more movement than we could have expected normally. The leaders of those three countries must go to Copenhagen, because at the end of the day, as was the Mr. Swire: I understand the right hon. Gentleman is case with Kyoto, it is the leaders who decide. It will be a spending an increasing amount of time in China and is political fix—whether we like it or not. Their involvement getting to know the Chinese. Is he concerned about is useful because nobody wants to be accused of breaking China’s need to extract vast amount of minerals and its the agreement. We need to shove them all in the same raid on mineral resources in Africa? Does he regard that room and tell them, “If you really mean it about change, as a wholly benign or malign thing? if you are talking about our children and their children, and if you are going to make effective change, you can Mr. Prescott: That is an interesting point because sit in that damn room and come to an agreement. We each industrial country, as it begins to grow, has to get won’t let you out before that.” That happened at Kyoto. its resources. Every European country—Britain, France Many things are being repeated from Kyoto, but we and Germany—went through its industrial development have a moral obligation to achieve an agreement. but we sent in troops and got the resources by conquest. Let me make one point that we can learn from. In the It was called colonialism. The Chinese are going in and 19th century, we spent all our time in mass production. negotiating contracts. I happen to think that that sounds In the 20th century, that became mass consumption. We a more harmonious way to do it than the murder that must learn to have mass sustainability in this century. we were involved in when we raped these countries of That is the only key. The decisions are difficult; we must their resources. We should take a balanced view and not carry the great burden and we should recognise the need forget our own history, and we should not lecture them for social justice. Countries want to lift their people out too much. of poverty, like we have done, and we should play our We do not have sufficient resources for the massive part in producing the low-carbon economy to achieve amount of growth that will take place in this world. that. Copenhagen will be judged on the social justice Inequality between the north and the south—it is the embodied in it, and within a financial framework. I am rich countries that did the pollution—is growing and looking forward to that debate, but I hope that I will Copenhagen must recognise social injustice. Two thirds have the key to the door so that I do not let the buggers of the world are poor and do not have the growth that out until they have done a deal. 429 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 430

4.58 pm believe that, if we are really determined, a 40 per cent. cut from 1990 levels is achievable. Yes, that will be tough Simon Hughes (North Southwark and Bermondsey) and difficult but, because we are one of the countries (LD): It is a pleasure and a privilege to follow the right that have been the greatest contributors, it is our obligation. hon. Member for Kingston upon Hull, East (Mr. Prescott), who was characteristically ebullient and forceful. He The other issue on which Mr. de Boer was very clear has shown fantastic commitment to this issue and I pay was the amount of money that rich countries must put tribute to him. Copenhagen needs people like him. I in to help the poor ones. For example, I have visited had not heard that the Council of Europe had taken the Bangladesh in the past and I appreciate the difficulties view that it should specifically request the leaders of that it faces. The Secretary of State for Energy and China and India to go there. I share absolutely the view Climate Change knows that I respect him, but I was that if the leaders of the most powerful nations on the disappointed that his remarks contained not one word planet are in the same place, the pressure will be on about finance. I appreciate that legislation is not finance, them to ensure that they deliver. All sorts of good but we are talking about Copenhagen and no mention things should flow from that, and I shall come back to has been made today of how any deal on adaptation that point in a second. and mitigation that might be reached there will be I join the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate financed. I want to be tough on the right hon. Gentleman Change and the hon. Member for Tunbridge Wells about financing and its source, so that we get some (Greg Clark) in recognising the suffering of the people answers. of Cumbria in recent days. I pay tribute to PC Barker We got no answers when we last debated these matters and to the police service and public services there. My on 5 November, when Ministers repeated what the hon. Friend the Member for Westmorland and Lonsdale Prime Minister had said about the need for a universal (Tim Farron) has been hugely involved, as we would pot worth ¤100 billion. In that regard, Mr. de Boer said expect from a county Member of Parliament. The that rich countries need to declare clear emission targets, Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural and must also commit “very large” sums to the global Affairs has been to see the situation for himself. The south for mitigation and adaptation efforts. These sums whole country will want those people to be supported. must be “stable and predictable” so that the third world The lesson learned from Hull, Gloucestershire and other can move ahead places affected by flooding is that this will be a long haul. The rest of us must ensure that, especially at this “without having to constantly re-negotiate the burden sharing every year.” time of year, we give every support at a local and national level to the people in those communities who He reckoned that that amounted initially to at least have to rebuild their lives. $10 billion a year in immediate financing for the period This debate is about two substantive issues. The first of 2010-12, but that the global south ultimately would is what we can achieve at Copenhagen, a subject that need around $200 billion to mitigate carbon emissions was rightly flagged up in the Queen’s Speech as being of and another $100 billion for adapting to the effects of huge significance. The second is the legislative opportunity climate change. Mr. de Boer added that the north must represented by the one Bill that the Government have also list what each country will provide and how funds put on the table—although I agree with the hon. Member will be raised. for Tunbridge Wells that it is a mouse of a Bill when we We have not yet heard a word about how the funds could have done with a much more significant mountain will be raised. I believe that the easiest way would be to of a Bill. apply a levy or charge on bunker fuels used by the I begin with Copenhagen. The right hon. Member for airline and shipping and industries. They have remained Kingston upon Hull, East mentioned Yvo de Boer, the relatively untaxed globally but we know them to be a lead UN climate change facilitator, and from my reading key cause of the trouble. There may be other sources of I know that he and all the people who have followed the funds; it is not for me to say that my suggestions are the negotiations are very clear about two things. The first is only show in town. I hope that when the Secretary of that the EU is one of the keyholders in this matter, and State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs winds the right hon. Gentleman will have seen the comments up the debate, he will indicate that the Government’s that Mr. de Boer made yesterday in which he said: thinking has moved on, and that the Treasury are “The EU must be clearer now about what it has in its final moving. Bluntly, the issue needs Treasury sign-up, but hand and put that final hand on the table.” not just sign-up from the Department of Energy and Climate Change and the Department for Environment, Mr. de Boer spoke about the targets and about the Food and Rural Affairs. Unless the Treasury is willing money for mitigation and adaptation. The EU has said to write the cheques on behalf of UK plc, no cheques that, if there is a deal, there will be a commitment to a will be written. reduction in emissions of 30 per cent. from 1990 levels across the EU, but I think that we should say that now. I Mr. de Boer made a point about the time frame; I do urge the Secretary of State to speak for the UK, to not think that there is a difference between the right make it clear that this is our view and to try and get the hon. Member for Kingston upon Hull, East and me on EU to set the same target. If we could go into the talks the issue. I have often said from the Liberal Democrat with that as our commitment across the EU—and not Benches that I did not think that there would be a final something that is conditional, possible or dependent on deal in December. We should not be frightened by that, an eventual deal—that would be really helpful. but there should not be a deferral indefinitely. Mr. de By definition, the UK has to have a higher commitment Boer was very tough: to make up for other countries not doing as well. The “As for a timeframe, he felt that a strong agreement was still Secretary of State knows that we on these Benches achievable in Copenhagen, even if not a legally-binding one.” 431 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 432

[Simon Hughes] In some ways, the second issue dealt with in the Bill is the more important issue—the one that people in the I think that we share that view. Mr. de Boer country are concerned about. It is the question of “felt this was acceptable so long as the world’s nations only took whether there will be fair fuel prices in this country, another two months to ‘turn that into treaty language.’ something that we have not had in our lifetime. As for The EU has said this could take up to another year.” the call for social justice across the world that the right There is talk of Mexico in that regard. hon. Member for Kingston upon Hull, East made, there is still a long way to go in this country, for his constituents, There are colleagues who have been in British politics mine and others. The poor and people who use less fuel for as long as I have. The politics of the issue is that if still have to pay relatively more. there is momentum now, we have to see the matter through to a conclusion before long. I think that the I want to give Ministers some direct questions to Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change answer when the Secretary of State for Environment, understands that the politics in the United States, the Food and Rural Affairs winds up. I have looked carefully election cycle and other factors mean that we might lose at the Bill, and understand that it will provide a statutory the momentum. I am clear that the Government will basis for subsidy for poorer households, once the voluntary serve Britain well if Ministers make it clear in Copenhagen deal finishes in a year’s time. I also understand that it that if we get the outline deal agreed in December, there will change the wording of the obligations on the regulator should be a resumption early in the new year, so that we for gas and electricity supplies. It is not clear to me can get that deal into a legally binding agreement. whether that will guarantee that, in future, every utility company has to have a tariff that does not discriminate Of course, the United States has to come in on the at all on the basis of method of payment, and whether issue—it has indicated that it might—and so must China, it will guarantee that poorer households and low users India, Brazil, Russia and Japan, all of which are now will always pay at a lower rate than the people who being helpful and are giving signs of movement. They consume more. That is the iniquity. As Ministers know, have to be part of the process from the beginning. That the unit cost for the low user is higher than the unit cost is not what happened with Kyoto, to which they were thereafter. All sorts of fiddles, to put it bluntly, mean not all signed up from the beginning. that no one can work out the system, because there are 4,000 different tariffs. I should be grateful to know Mr. Weir: I am listening carefully to the hon. Gentleman, whether Ministers are happy to accept amendments to and I very much agree with him on the need for speed. the Bill that will make that absolutely clear in the My concern about not getting an agreement at Copenhagen measure itself—not in regulations that may, or may is that we have spent the past two years going on about not, deliver—so that we can ensure that those things the importance of getting a deal that seals in action on happen. climate change. I am deeply concerned about the impact on public opinion if we fail to get a deal. If politicians are seen not to grasp the nettle at this stage, we are in Mr. Mark Oaten (Winchester) (LD): Does my hon. danger of losing momentum with the public, whom we Friend share my concern that oil and liquefied petroleum need to take with us on the issue. gas should be covered by those measures, because many people in rural communities face severe oil bills? A lot Simon Hughes: The hon. Gentleman is absolutely of rural poverty arises from the fact that individuals right. His point applies particularly to young people, cannot get mainstream gas or electricity. but huge numbers of people in this country will be interested. My postbag, like that of other hon. Members, Simon Hughes: My hon. Friend and many other shows that there is huge interest in the issue. Climate colleagues have consistently made that point to change is important here, for reasons that people in Government. Not only is the situation unfair for people Cumbria may think are obvious, but it is far more who are not on the gas supply or whatever but there are important for countries such as Bangladesh and the other iniquities which mean that they have to buy a Maldives. There are other places for which it is a life or tank, pay extra charges and so on. It is absolutely right death issue, too, so momentum is vital. that provisions to deal with that should be included We wish Ministers well, but we hope that we will hear in the Bill. higher targets announced before Copenhagen, as an There was a blinding omission from the Queen’s indicator from the UK. The UK could then lead; that Speech and the proposed legislation, which was touched would be to the credit of the Government. It would on by the hon. Member for Tunbridge Wells. My hon. unite us across Parliament and politics if the Government Friend the Member for Chesterfield (Paul Holmes) is in were bolder. The Treasury has to come along, too, but the Chamber, and he spoke about this the other day. In the obligation to ensure that that happens rests with 1983, the Social Democratic party was created, and it Ministers. fought the election in alliance with the Liberals. I fought The Energy Bill effectively does two things. First, it that election, and one of our commitments was for provides for the authorisation of the development of warm homes for everyone throughout the country. It carbon capture and storage. I shall not speak at length was obvious then that most British homes were badly about that. That is, inevitably, the way that we must go. insulated, and that was bad for the poor, because they We will need coal, but it has to be clean coal. However, were paying a lot of money, which was literally going we need to move far more quickly. One of my frustrations out of the window and the roof. As a result, their bills is that so many of the issues have been on the agenda for increased, their homes were not heated properly, and as long as I have been in this place—a quarter of a harm was done to the planet. Twenty-five years later, we century. The issues are not new, and the Government have barely made progress. According to the latest are really slow to give them any urgency. figures, only one in 100 homes is energy efficient. 433 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 434

The Government could have announced a serious and above all protecting the vulnerable from dying in programme in the Queen’s Speech to make every home one of the richest countries in the world, where that a warm home, instead of introducing piecemeal schemes: should not happen. a bit here and a bit more there; a top up for this scheme; a bit of the community energy saving programme, a bit Mr. Oaten: Many of the vulnerable people to whom of the carbon emissions reduction target, a bit of Warm my hon. Friend refers live in park and mobile homes. Is Front. There is no reason why the UK should not have a he aware that they are unable to take part in the Warm programme, driven by Government and managed locally Front schemes? Would it not make sense to include by local government, street by street, village by village them in the Government schemes? and community by community. That is what we need, but the question of financing then arises. With respect, Simon Hughes: The honest answer to my hon. Friend hon. Member for Tunbridge Wells ducked that question, is that I learned that fact yesterday. Those people should because the money must be made available up front. If be included. the work is going to be done, even if it is done by loan, It is frustrating for my hon. Friend, other colleagues apart from work for the very poorest, the loan has to and myself that our hon. Friend the Member for Hazel come from somewhere. He made it clear that not a Grove (Andrew Stunell) got a Bill on the statute book single penny would come from the Government, and he in 2004 for sustainable homes, and our hon. Friend the appeared to imply that there would not even be any Member for Somerton and Frome (Mr. Heath) had a Government underwriting or support. I do not think private Member’s Bill earlier this year to deal with fuel that that is possible, and my right hon. and hon. Friends poverty, which would have got through had the Government have said so. We believe that such a scheme has to be not blocked it. There have been opportunities, but time underwritten by someone, and we believe that it should and again they have not been taken. I know that work is be the Government, so that people can take out a loan going on in the Department of Energy and Climate and pay it back. Change. I hope Ministers will realise that we should be I understand the economics of the system: if someone seeing the results now. Unless we do, another winter, invests in loft or cavity wall insulation, their bills will go which is likely to bring problems, will see other people down and they can afford the repayment or top-up, suffering. but their bills will still be less than they were before. I shall make three other points; I am conscious that However, we cannot pretend that this is a cost-free others want to speak. I want to pick up the point made exercise. At £6,500 a time, the total cost would be more by the hon. Member for East Devon (Mr. Swire). The than £100 billion. At a more realistic £11,500, it may be Minister was uncharacteristically—flippant is, perhaps, more like £200 billion. The Tory party is often wonderful the wrong word—dismissive of the issue. It is scandalous at ideas—talking the talk—but as I could prove on lots that off the coasts of Britain there are tankers full of oil of other things, it is slightly less convincing when it which are not unloading. They are waiting until the comes to walking the walk. price goes up because they are being managed by the speculators. I know that there is nothing new about that. The global regime means that we have enough of Greg Clark: The hon. Gentleman asked a fair question. the fuel. The oil is taken out of the ground, put on to Clearly, if we are recovering costs through savings on tankers, and sits off the shore of the UK, not just people’s energy bills and meter charges, there is a risk of anywhere, but in vulnerable marine environments such default. That risk also applies to people paying their as off the coast of Dorset and the south-west. Some of energy bills through the gas or electricity meter, and it is us well remember the Torrey Canyon. about 2 per cent. If we include that 2 per cent. default rate in the cost of the scheme, and spread it out for I ask Ministers in the Department for Transport as everyone, it is perfectly manageable and financeable. It well as Ministers in the Chamber—the Secretary of can be managed without requiring a huge injection of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs has a public funds. responsibility too, as does the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change—to engage with the companies that own the oil and the tankers to ensure that the Simon Hughes: I do not want the whole debate to be regime does not allow people to exploit the prices. We dominated by this topic, but I have read the trailer for know what the effect is. The price of oil has increased— and the speech of the Conservative shadow Chancellor. doubled in some cases—over the past year. Petrol at the I do not see in it anything that ensures the funding pumps will probably be a quarter as much again at the necessary. I am happy to have the debate in private end of the year as it was at the beginning. and in public, but whereas we as a party have said for Prices are going up all the time. People are suffering 25 years that we need warm homes for all, there must be because of those who are fiddling or abusing the system. something that triggers the funding, otherwise many I would like to hear from the Government what they people will not participate in such a scheme, which intend to do. If they say that they and the global makes the proposal unconvincing. community can do nothing, that is an unacceptable The reason why that is as important now as ever is answer. The public would think so, too. The energy evidenced by the figures that I cited today—not my companies—I did not hear Ministers say this—have an figures, but figures from the Office for National Statistics, obligation to respond to the fact that when prices go which showed almost 40,000 extra deaths, above the down, the price to the consumer does not follow, but average, for the winter quarter last year, higher than at when prices go up, it seems to follow mighty quickly. any time since the beginning of the decade. That is not The regulatory system has been inadequate since it was happening in other countries with much colder climates set up. I had hoped to hear a much tougher response than ours, so this is not theory or some wild idea that from Ministers. I hope that we might do so before the does not matter. This is about making a fairer Britain end of the debate. 435 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 436

[Simon Hughes] deal that averts climate crisis, and that they want to do the right thing for a sustainable future, but when the In relation to other supplies, all parties are concerned Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural that we should have energy security. There is a difference Affairs winds up the debate, he must acknowledge that between us: the Labour and Tory parties believe that they have to lead by action, not words. nuclear is a necessary component; we do not. We can The Queen’s Speech contained half as much as the have that argument separately, but the Liberal Democrats public and the crisis needed. That was not enough, and believe that nuclear makes a small contribution to dealing this is the Government’s last chance. These may be the with emissions and a small contribution to our need, last few months that they are in office, and I am afraid and that we could do much better and in a more that, if they are trying to make up for lost time, they accountable way by renewables. have not done so with the Queen’s Speech.

Paul Holmes (Chesterfield) (LD): Does my hon. Friend not agree that, in costing nuclear power, the Government 5.23 pm must include the huge cost—£18 billion was recently Malcolm Wicks (Croydon, North) (Lab): This has suggested—of providing the underground long-term been a very useful debate, with good speeches from all waste storage facility? The industry will never pay for parts of the House, although the speech from the hon. that; it just assumes that the taxpayer will pick up the Member for Tunbridge Wells (Greg Clark) reminded bill. If that was included in the costs, it would become me, if I may say so humbly, that Opposition wish lists quite clear not only that not a penny should go to are so much easier than government. However, I hope nuclear power, but that the money should go into real he never finds that out. clean and renewable energy, which is not nuclear. I am convinced that when the historian looks back on this century, energy questions will assume great importance Simon Hughes: I absolutely agree. The Government’s in terms of global affairs. I shall not cover the whole official advisory body on these matters is absolutely field, but as a framework I suggest that there are about clear: we should not opt for another generation of four major questions. The first of those relates to the nuclear power until somebody has come up with something economics and affordability of energy. Not so long ago, that it and others, who are independent and not politicians, when energy prices were sky-rocketing and the price of consider to be a safe method not just of storage, but of a barrel of oil hit $147, the business and economic disposal. That has not been found. That is not my view; consequences were extremely serious; that must not be it is the view of those charged with advising the forgotten. Secondly, there are key themes about energy Government. My hon. Friend is completely right. supply and security. The other day the Government defeated the Liberal Thirdly, and most important, there is climate science Democrat motion on a 10 per cent. reduction in emissions and the importance of making progress at Copenhagen: next year. The Conservatives support that reduction issues that the former Deputy Prime Minister, my right today, and they supported it the other day, although I hon. Friend the Member for Kingston upon Hull, East noticed that the Conservative shadow Chancellor and (Mr. Prescott), spoke about so eloquently and, as usual, leader were not present to vote for it in the Commons. with such great passion. However, we are pleased to hear that the shadow Chancellor The fourth issue, as my right hon. Friend noted, has now bought into it. I think that it is achievable, and again with some passion, is social justice, internationally if it is not, it should be an aspiration. and domestically. The other day, I saw an estimate The Minister of State, Department of Energy and suggesting that some 1.5 billion people—more than one Climate Change, is on the Front Bench today, and in fifth of the world’s population—do not have electricity. October her only real argument was, “We cannot do it, Here we are talking about global warming and, in a because we have already set targets which go to dates sense, the over-demand for energy, yet, in terms of beyond that, and this would get in the way of those.” I inequality and injustice, so many of the people who just say to her very simply—[Interruption.] I heard her share this planet with us are nowhere near to getting argument and followed it carefully, but the Government electricity. Of course, that has a domestic resonance. set their policy before the 10:10 campaign was launched, The Liberal Democrat spokesman reported that the and they believe—I could turn to what she said in reply ONS has produced its annual statistics on excess winter to the debate—that to introduce a 10 per cent. reduction mortality. One must be careful about interpreting those target for the next 12 months would confuse, complicate figures: for example, flu has an impact, and that varies and undermine the longer-term strategy. I understand from year to year. Nevertheless, it is a scandal that in the argument, but I do not accept or believe it, and I do modern western affluent societies we talk in comfort not think that the public believe it either. They still see a about global warming while many of our constituents huge amount of waste from the public sector and the might say to us, “Chance would be a fine thing—I’d Government. love some of this global warming in my bedroom or The public expect the Government to lead, and that living room.” I do not want to get sidetracked on to that is why I intervened on the Secretary of State to say that subject, which I feel very strongly about. It is a matter I was saddened, although not entirely amazed, by his of immense importance. I could write a book about it; written answer to me explaining that at least half the indeed, more than 30 years ago I did so. Ministers and officials going to Copenhagen will fly there. Of all the places—[Interruption.] But it is a Linda Gilroy: Will my right hon. Friend give way? serious point. People are meant to set an example, so the Government must set an example. They have often Malcolm Wicks: If it is to publicise my out-of-print made it clear that they are committed to a Copenhagen book, yes. 437 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 438

Linda Gilroy: It certainly is; I was at the Age Concern Although there is much excitement, controversy and conference where my right hon. Friend published his debate, not least in the House, about the contribution of book on hypothermia. Does he agree, however, that new renewable technologies and the fairly new technology some of what has been said about the progress that we of nuclear, that global demand will be met in the main have made on warm homes plays things down a little not by wind turbines and nuclear power stations, although bit? I do not know about his constituency, but in mine they will start to make a greater contribution, but by 2,000 homes have been fitted with insulation. fossil fuels—coal, gas and oil. They account for three quarters of the increase in demand in the reference Malcolm Wicks: I think that both things are true. We scenario, and in the 450 scenario they still account for have made immense progress, not least under this two thirds of the increase, even though coal is less Government, but there is still so much more that needs important. to be done. As we know—this is part of the politics of I want to focus on energy supply and security, putting Copenhagen—most of the extra demand will come the issues in a global context but focusing to some from emerging and developing countries. We should be extent on Europe and particularly on our own country, pleased that demand is fairly flat in OECD countries the United Kingdom. There are serious matters to such as our own, even though it goes up and down in consider. When I stopped being energy Minister a year different countries. We are beginning to find out how to ago, the Prime Minister asked me to be his representative have economic growth without a correlation with energy on energy security. I delivered my report to him in demand. The challenge for our country is surely to August; it was published by DECC and entitled “Energy reduce our demand for energy but move back to economic Security: A national challenge in a changing world”. If growth after the recession. According to the latest edition my words are of any interest and people want to know of the IEA’s “World Energy Outlook”, published just a more, they will find it in that report. couple of weeks ago, 93 per cent. of the increase in The key issue is that, post recession, the global grab—the global demand to 2030 will come from non-OECD global demand—for energy will surely be maintained. countries, driven largely by China and India. We all We speak at a peculiar time. According to the International know the data that can be related to that situation, but Energy Agency’s new report, “World Energy Outlook just to give an illustration, the number of vehicles in 2009”, this is an almost—I think I use the word properly— China was some 23 million in 2005. By 2030, it will unique year, because global demand for energy will go grow tenfold to 230 million. down, as will carbon emissions. When we come out of Why do I talk about the national security energy recession—I hope that we are doing so—this huge challenge? First, let us look at Europe. The EU already increase in demand for energy will be maintained. That depends largely on imports, and that dependency will is happening at a time when, historically, we are moving only grow in magnitude. By 2030, it will be getting some away from relative self-sufficiency in terms of indigenous 90 per cent. of its oil, more than 80 per cent. of its gas energy in the UK towards a significant amount of and 50 per cent. of its coal from outside the Union. import dependency, obviously for oil but also for gas. Parts of Europe, of course, already depend heavily on That involves serious issues as regards energy supply Russia, and we know some of the difficulties that that and security. I use the word “security” because this can bring about. Sadly, I would guess that the geopolitics takes on a further resonance of national security. I of energy and security will become more important for remember the former Prime Minister Tony Blair, when Europe as the years, and possibly the next few decades, the Langeled pipeline from Norway was opened—thank roll by. goodness we have it—saying that in this century, energy security could become as important to a nation’s security Let us look at Great Britain. To generalise, we have as the conventional defence forces. That is at least an been blessed with self-sufficiency. In the pre-industrial interesting point to consider. era, people used wood and twigs—what would now be We have the benefit of the International Energy called biomass—to cook their food and keep warm by Agency, which has painted two scenarios of how global their fires. We then had the development of coal, which demand will increase. I will not go into too much detail, fuelled our industrial revolution and our industrial and but they are closely related to Copenhagen. One is a economic development. After coal, we discovered oil reference scenario, if the energy efficiency and other and gas in our backyard, in the North sea on the wider policies that we have already agreed are implemented. UK continental shelf. The other is called the “450 scenario”, because it sets What will happen in the next 10 or 20 years? The out a world in which collective action is taken to limit North sea oil and gas resources are in decline, although long-term concentrations of greenhouse gases in the there are still plenty of resources out there, and it is still atmosphere to 450 parts per million of CO2 equivalent. a major British industry. Many younger, smaller Many of today’s useful contributions have been about entrepreneurial companies are coming into the North the importance of securing that agreement. sea, as some of the big boys move on to Brazil and In the reference scenario, into which are built a lot of elsewhere. The licensing round is always very active and actions that Governments in Europe have promised and resources remain to be exploited—for example, West of need to take, the assumption is that between 2007 and Shetland—and that augurs well. However, oil and gas 2030, global energy demand will increase by 40 per cent. production is in decline by 6 to 8 per cent. a year. In the far more ambitious 450 scenario—maybe I could call it the Copenhagen scenario—that goes down to Mr. Swire: When the right hon. Gentleman was the 20 per cent. That is still a huge increase, but only half Minister for Energy, we debated the issue of North sea the increase in the reference scenario. People can make oil and how economically sustainable it was. At the their own judgments about what percentage increase is time, we discussed the incentives to Scottish drilling likely to take place in practice. companies, as opposed to English drilling companies. Is 439 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 440

[Mr. Swire] There is huge potential in renewables, which I think we all support, although we need to support it in he convinced that we are providing enough incentive to actuality, through onshore wind, and not just in rhetoric. companies that may wish to explore in the North sea to However, as a percentage of all energy, renewables reach oil that otherwise might be uneconomic? account for perhaps only 2 per cent. or so. The 15 per cent. target is the right target, but hitting it will be Malcolm Wicks: I am pleased that, in the last year or tremendously challenging. so, the fiscal regime has become more sensitive to the In the meanwhile, in the period before we can build current position of the UK continental shelf. The Prime up new nuclear—that will be largely after 2020, with the Minister asked me to make recommendations, and I first one perhaps in 2017—and in which we can bite recommended that fiscal sensitivity to the North sea—the down on energy demand and develop our renewables, in sheer cost of certain explorations—should be borne in my judgment we will see significant imports of energy. mind by the Government. I think that I am on the same Let me take the example of gas. I know that some of the page as the hon. Gentleman. estimates about the future—they are only estimates—are contentious. I know, too, that there are different official Mr. Weir: Has the hon. Gentleman read the report estimates. There is a perfectly reasonable debate to be from the Select Committee on the oil and gas industry? had, but the trend is essentially as follows. We made the point that small companies working in the Only a few years ago we had a sufficiency of gas and North sea are having difficulties obtaining finance from we were exporting. Very recently we were self-sufficient, the banks. Only Lloyds-HBOS is prepared to lend, and but we are now importing 20 to 25 per cent. of our gas. only to its existing customers. That is a serious problem Some estimates—they are perfectly sensible estimates— for those companies. suggest that by 2020 some 70 per cent. of our gas could be imported. Indeed, I have even seen the figure of Malcolm Wicks: I do understand that point, and I am 80 per cent. The more successful we are in reducing sure that the Government are aware of it. One of the demand and bringing forward renewables, the more great dilemmas of economic recession in all fields, and likely it is that 70 or 80 per cent. might seem an certainly in the energy fields, is that while we can be sure exaggeration. However, for contingency planning it is that global demand will increase soon, there has been a sensible to look at that issue. significant decline—collapse would be too strong a Where will the imports come from? I have mentioned word—in investment, and that is affecting not only the the Langeled pipeline from Norway, and there is more North sea but the renewable sector. potential to build up our relationship with Norway, as I argue in my energy security report. That is important, Mr. Binley: May I ask the right hon. Gentleman because the gas from Norway is good democratic, human- about the possibility of using North sea wells as carbon rights gas, and that cannot always be said of other gas! storage sites? Does he think that that would provide a What is the agenda for action? Much of it has been real opportunity to extend the life of the North sea touched on. Any sensible agenda, whether for energy by—in some estimates—an additional 15 per cent. of security or climate change, starts with reducing energy the available oil? Is that a real prospect or should we demand and increasing energy efficiency. I subscribe to discount it? that position, but we need to recognise the sophistication and the broad nature of the approach that we need to Malcolm Wicks: I intended to mention the importance adopt. Housing is of course important, and we can of CCS a little later, but the hon. Gentleman is right to argue about the pace of change there. The development suggest that the injection of CO will help with enhanced of zero-carbon housing by 2016 is important. We will 2 see a great revolution in design and materials as we oil recovery. Elsewhere in the world, CO2 is being used for that purpose. Given current technologies, a lot of oil move towards higher standards of thermal efficiency in and gas is left behind during extraction from the North new build. How we integrate renewables into that will sea, and recently the industry and the Government have be crucial. been discussing that matter. Solving it would not be Obviously, there is also transport, appliances and without costs or difficulties, but it is an important item other things that we are familiar with. However, there on the agenda. are also things that I do not feel so tutored about, in the To get back to my story, the North sea is in decline, as range of various industrial and business processes, such is nuclear, with perhaps only 15 per cent. of our electricity as pumps, valves and advanced control engineering, coming from nuclear—some of that electricity is above which I was hearing about at a conference the other day. the Liberal Democrat Benches, so I give hon. Members All those things are important and can be developed by a health warning about that one. At its height, some industry to reduce demand. Indeed, there is so much 30 per cent. of our electricity came from nuclear. The that can be said about that. reactors are of varying ages, but they are old and need Smart meters are important, but only if we link them to be decommissioned, and then we will see the development to a public education programme, so that when people of new nuclear reactors. get their smart meters, they are told about a wider We know the story of coal, too. I do not want to get package of things that they can adopt, so that the whole too much into the politics of it, but coal was devastated community down that road, in that village or in that by a previous regime, albeit not for industrial purposes town gets behind the project. or because the then Government were early converts to Energy efficiency is item number one. The second climate change—although the new Tories might rewrite item is cleaning up fossil fuels. Some of the environmental the history on that—but largely for political reasons. groups might not like it, but we will be using fossil fuels 441 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 442 for the foreseeable future. Indeed, the environmental historical perspective, I would say that our gas storage groups will not stop the Chinese using them in future. area was the North sea. We had plentiful supplies and So we have to become one of the world leaders in clean we were self-sufficient, but that is now in decline. We coal technology and carbon capture and storage. I am therefore now need to develop gas storage, and that is very pleased by the Government’s position on this. As not quite so easy as some people make it sound. Are we an energy Minister, I was frustrated by the pace of talking about commercial gas storage, or about strategic change, but no one has ever done this around a coal gas storage? If we are talking purely about the former, power station. We are moving pretty rapidly in the right the gas will be sold to the highest bidder. direction, but let us become a world leader and help The reality at the moment is that our main store of China and others to develop this technology. gas—the Rough storage, which is administered by It is difficult to overstress the importance of CCS. It Centrica—is a store for gas that is owned by the different is not just another thing. Unless we get to grips with the supply companies in Britain, including the French and challenge of CCS globally, all will be lost in terms of German companies. Last winter, things were all right-ish, global warming, given that most of the energy that we but if I had still been Minister, I would have been use in the years to come is going to be obtained by looking at the situation day by day, as I did in earlier burning fossil fuels. There will be huge technological winters. I am almost sure I am right in saying that, at challenges, including where to store, the fact that storage that time, German supply companies were taking gas is very expensive, and the importance of the carbon out of Rough storage and returning it to continental price. There are all sorts of issues around financing, and Europe. They had contracts to supply gas there, so we the emissions trading scheme is very important. cannot blame them, and as I understand it there is My next heading is gas. I make various recommendations nothing to stop that gas—we did not stop it—going to about gas in the United Kingdom in my report, to continental Europe at quite a difficult time. I put it to which I know that the Government will respond before the House that this is quite a difficult issue. long. I am not trying to get the Minister to respond to it I believe either that we need strategic gas storage—gas this evening. I worry about a new dash for gas. It is that will be in the control of a democratic Government, easier to build gas power stations than nuclear power subject to parliamentary accountability—or, if the gas stations, and it is probably easier to get planning permission storage is commercial, that we will need to explore the for them than for large-scale wind farms. There is a fact that the British Government under European law danger of becoming over-dependent on gas, with all the have a right to say that in extremis or in emergencies, implications that that has for imports. some of that gas has to stay here in the UK. If it can I raise three points about gas for the Government in simply go hither and thither in a crisis, it is not the kind my report. One is that Britain, compared with many of gas storage that many are calling for. other European countries, does not have in place significant Bob Spink (Castle Point) (Ind): Will the right hon. numbers of long-term contracts for gas. We tend to Gentleman give way? contract with the suppliers and countries involved on a far shorter-term basis, and we often buy gas on the spot Malcolm Wicks: I have only one more point before market. I can see advantages in that, but I can also see coming to my conclusion, and others want to contribute, the disadvantages for our security of supply, and the but I will give way to the hon. Gentleman. Government need to address that. The second issue relates to the supply obligation. We Bob Spink: Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that place on our supply companies a supply obligation: the some of the imported gas will come in the form of Centricas, EDFs and Scottish and Southerns of this liquefied petroleum gas and liquefied natural gas, and world have to supply gas to us. What does this mean in that some of it comes to Canvey island where it is stored practice? When I produced my report—with the help of very close to residential houses? He may be aware that a very able team from the Department for Energy and there was a leak there, when 140 or so tonnes of LNG Climate Change—I found the gas supply obligation to escaped and partly became an unconfined vapour cloud. be a bit like jelly: I could not get to grips with it. The Health and Safety Executive is currently pursuing a When I questioned key institutions on this matter, possible criminal investigation following this incident, they recognised that all was not well. Let me spell it out. which put my residents at great risk. Does he accept There is no way in the present regulatory system for that the safety of residents and communities must always National Grid or the regulator to establish whether be put first by the Government? there is likely to be sufficient availability of gas, in Malcolm Wicks: Of course. We recently had the aggregate, in any coming period. That is not to say that report on Buncefield, so it is not just a problem of the gas will not be there; it will be bought on the spot LNG. The point applies to virtually every kind of market or short term, but what would happen if we energy source that we are talking about. I agree that were to have another situation like Russia versus Ukraine? LNG is important. The Milford Haven terminals have We had such a situation once, or possibly twice, during been opened and we will get quite a substantial supply my tenure in office. Combined with a very cold winter in of LNG from Qatar in the future. I do not think that Europe, that created real difficulties for European energy the hon. Gentleman is arguing that we should say no to supply and for us in the UK. I would therefore like to it; the issue is about being properly strict—I believe that see greater clarity in the gas supply obligation, and I we are being properly strict—about the health and make that recommendation in my report. safety considerations. The third subject related to this is gas storage. It is quite easy for us to say that we need greater gas storage Mr. Swire: I am grateful to the right hon. Gentleman capacity. It is like motherhood and apple pie: we all for giving way a second time. To answer his question want more gas storage. To defend where we are from an about the reserve storage of gas, it may well be motherhood 443 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 444

[Mr. Swire] one region—or any one fuel, which is why I support clean coal. The other side of the coin is that we need to and apple pie, but given the security issues involved, build up our own indigenous sources of energy—energy would it not be prudent and good sense to enshrine in that we can produce for ourselves, hence my commitment law a statutory requirement to have a certain amount of to both nuclear and renewables. I go rather further in days of reserve, as we have learned happens in France my report than perhaps this Government and this and Germany? This is not impossible; it is something Parliament are prepared to go by saying that if by that could be done very simply, and we should remember around 2030 we could have 35 to 40 per cent. of our that we went down to about four days’ worth of gas electricity coming from nuclear, that would be a sensible last year. place for Britain to be.

Malcolm Wicks: The short answer is yes. We need to Mrs. Maria Miller (Basingstoke) (Con): The right have that requirement for commercial storage—my guess hon. Gentleman talked about public opinion having is that the Government would want to explore the moved on the nuclear debate, but does he believe that legalities around that, given the single market and so we can learn lessons from countries such as France and forth—which would be perfectly acceptable in my judgment; Canada, which have far higher levels of public acceptance but if that is not possible for legal or other reasons, we for nuclear power? Does he think that there is still need strategic gas storage, which is very expensive—much further work to be done there, as this could be one of more expensive, I am advised, than strategic oil storage. the continuing sticking-points? I welcome the hon. Gentleman’s strong interest in this subject. Some may think it a grey area of debate, but Malcolm Wicks: There are lessons to be learned: we given our current dependency on gas, it is a very important mentioned health and safety in respect of LNG, so it one. In my judgment, import dependency is going to needs to be health and safety times 100 for nuclear. The grow in significance. safe disposal of nuclear waste is another huge issue—also I want to mention two other areas. I do not need to a huge industrial and jobs opportunity—that needs to say much about renewables, as we have already discussed be tackled. We need speed, but we need to take the the importance and huge potential of renewable energy public through the issues with great care. As I say, I am from the sun—even in Britain now—the seas, the wind convinced that in terms of national security, the answer and from biomass. We also know about the importance on nuclear has to be yes. of hydro. It may not be as important here as in Sweden The Secretary of State made an important speech or Norway, but we are able to explore it on a smaller focusing mainly on climate change. I understand the scale in imaginative ways. I, too, am excited about the reasons for that at this time, given the science and given potential of marine, wave and tidal energy, but I need to Copenhagen, but my report, at the request of the Prime caution that this is very new technology. Yes, British Minister, is also telling the Government that energy companies are very good at it, and we could truly security as an aspect of national security needs to be become a world leader as a result of our technological, taken very seriously. Albeit in due course rather than engineering and entrepreneurial flair and the natural tonight, I look forward to the Government’s response habitat in which we live as an island people. As I say, to my report. however, this is new technology and we should not exaggerate its contribution over the next 10 years. The 15 per cent. target for renewables is absolutely crucial. When I say that it is demanding, this is not a code for 5.58 pm saying that we will not do it, but I put it to the House Mrs. Jacqui Lait (Beckenham) (Con): I hope that it that this is a tough one and we will need to stretch every will not embarrass my next-door constituency neighbour, sinew to move there. the right hon. Member for Croydon, North (Malcolm Finally—I am sorry for having spoken so long, but Wicks), if I say that that was one of the most interesting there were interventions; I will blame them, anyway!—I speeches I have ever heard on the security of energy come on to nuclear, which I know is controversial. I supply, which is a crucial issue that needs to be resolved respect the position of the Liberal Democrats—they are and should have been addressed much earlier than wrong, but I respect their position. I believe public when the Government asked the right hon. Gentleman opinion has moved more in the direction of nuclear. I to prepare his report. was privileged to lead the review on energy policy—Tony I recall during my young adulthood in Scotland how Blair asked me to do it some years ago now—which said we had to deal with the discovery of North sea oil and yes, the Government would support and, where possible, gas, yet now as I prepare to retire we are looking at how facilitate the development of new nuclear. I believe it is to reduce quantities of oil and gas. It is an issue of important for climate reasons—some environmentalists which I have been conscious for a long time. Given that still cannot quite make up their minds whether they I live close to Dungeness power station, I am also hate nuclear more than they hate global warming, although conscious of the ageing of our nuclear power stations—I some are changing their position, which I welcome. nearly said our nuclear fleet. It is a great sadness to me In my judgment, as well as being crucial for climate and to many on the Romney marsh that the Government change reasons, nuclear is also crucial—I am almost have so far ruled out the building of a third power saying equally crucial, but I am not sure that that is station at Dungeness on the grounds of what Natural scientifically valid—in terms of energy security. In future, England said rather than on what I would have thought faced with import dependency, we need to do two was the more logical ground of the potential for movement things. We need to be as smart as possible in our foreign of the shingle. I believe that, engineering-wise, that policy on import dependency so that we are not over- problem could be solved. It was fascinating to listen to dependent on any one country, any one company, any the right hon. Member for Croydon, North. 445 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 446

I do not intend to concentrate too much on the Bill I think that microgeneration is the easiest and quickest that the Government propose to present in the few way for every one of us, in our domestic lives, to weeks left to them. Nor do I intend to spend too much contribute to the reduction of our carbon footprint. time discussing Copenhagen, because we have already Another issue that seems to have been omitted from discussed it at great length. I will say, however, that the debate so far, and does not appear to have been whether or not one is a supporter of the science of included in the Bill—although I hope that I can encourage climate change it is surely common sense for consumers the Government to include it—is the production of to reduce the amount that they spend on energy, and for energy from waste. Local authorities currently spend that practical reason I am sad that so far there has been huge amounts on trying to avoid sending waste to little effective action to develop new technologies in the landfill, and we know of the difficulties that that is new industries. causing our local communities. There will be one collection It is true that we have wind farms. We have a wind in one week and another in a different week; people farm on the Romney Marsh, although I am afraid that wonder whether there is a chip in the bin to establish it is not taken terribly seriously because for most of the how much waste they have put out, and whether they time its turbines are not turning. There is endless anecdotal are allowed to put out six bottles a week instead of five. evidence that wind farms have not been built quite All those rather claustrophobia-inducing management correctly. There is also a great deal of evidence that demands drive many householders demented. But if—or carbon capture has been delayed by the Government’s rather when; there is no “if”—we develop the new dithering. In Kingsnorth, E.ON was prepared to build a generation of incineration with scrubbed emissions, we new coal-fired power station as part of the original can feed electricity into the local community and into competition for carbon capture and storage, but— the grid, and when we develop anaerobic digestion we fundamentally because of Government dither and delay—it can do exactly the same. Why are we not creating an decided that the game was not worth the candle. As we economy that favours that form of waste disposal? It all know, environmental protesters collected at the power would mean that waste would not go to landfill but station and had a rather unpleasant confrontation with, could produce useful heat and energy—and we could primarily, the police. If the Government had not dithered stop irritating our fellow residents at the same time. over the scheme and the competition, we might have There has been a fair amount of comment about moved much further down the route of developing our nuclear power. I believe—and the right hon. Member own carbon capture technology. for Croydon, North seemed to agree—that it is the best Along with the hon. Member for Calder Valley (Chris way in which to generate relatively low-carbon-emission McCafferty), who is present and whose constituency electricity and energy. When the Secretary of State includes the lovely and literary Hebden Bridge area, I published the draft national policy statement on energy was on the Commonwealth Parliamentary Association’s recently, he told me that the public consultation on it delegation to Australia this year. People there told us would continue until February. He expects it to come to proudly that they had created an international centre the House in March for consideration by the Select for carbon capture technology. The bulk of Australia’s Committees. It does not take a great brain to work out energy comes from brown coal. The Australians are that the consultation will not end before the general committed to reducing their emissions under Copenhagen, election. There is an immediate and built-in delay in the and they realise that if they are to do that it is essential progress of national policy statements. for them to develop carbon capture. I wonder about the Furthermore, as my hon. Friend the Member for degree to which we in the United Kingdom are trying to Tunbridge Wells (Greg Clark) pointed out, the system reinvent the wheel with our carbon capture schemes. I provided by the Planning Act 2008 is completely open to wonder to what extent there is an international exchange judicial review. According to the 13 November issue of of information about the technologies being developed, “Planning”, the Town and Country Planning Association about what works and what does not work, and about has said that how we can move from demonstration to production. It “the NPSs make the ″very profound mistake″ of not including would be such a waste of entrepreneurial abilities if we carbon assessment for energy projects.” developed in parallel rather than together. If it is not included in the NPS, there will be an application for a judicial review and we shall see more of the delays I find it fascinating that, apart from passing references, resulting from the debate about Sizewell. We shall ensure there has been no mention of how solar energy could that there are delays in the building of nuclear power help to meet our energy requirements. There are stations. We cannot assume, merely because we have Government grants to help people to install solar panels, passed the Planning Act, that we will magically secure but they are difficult to obtain. Four or five years ago the nuclear power stations that we need unless we China set out to develop production systems for solar ensure that national policy statements are voted on panels so that they could reduce production costs to a democratically in the House. That would make it possible level enabling them to capture the world market. for Secretaries of State who no longer wish to make Another thing that I learnt in Australia was that there such decisions to make them, and to make them much was considerable resentment because the Chinese were more quickly than the Infrastructure Planning Commission exporting cheap solar panels to Australia which were need do. That is the basis for getting rid of the Infrastructure challenging those being produced indigenously, but we Planning Commission. We must get democratic legitimacy have to live with that. It is not dumping; it is driving the within the planning system if we are to get the infrastructure market so that more and more people can use solar built. If we do not, we are unlikely to be able to move panels. I do not understand why we are not doing more forward. in this country to encourage people to use them. I do The right hon. Member for Croydon, North talked not think that the Government’s proposed Bill will about the target for zero-carbon houses by 2016. I do address that question in any way. In household terms, not whether the right hon. Gentleman noticed—Hansard 447 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 448

[Mrs. Jacqui Lait] and almost stigmatised with failure. Such legislation would help us to move this country towards becoming a will tell us whether I am correct—but I thought that the positive, forward-looking community. Secretary of State said “near-zero-carbon houses”. I The saddest thing of all—there is nothing in the notice that there is a written statement from the Department Queen’s Speech to address it—is the statement by Lord for Communities and Local Government on that subject—I Strathclyde that the House of Lords will ensure that have not seen it yet. Whether the Government are most of the legislation does not get through. The House resiling from that commitment—I would not blame of Lords is a revising Chamber. It is this Chamber that them, as it will be next to impossible to achieve it should ensure whether or not legislation gets through. anyway—and are breaking the news gently, or whether For the House of Lords to be able to claim that it has it was a slip of the tongue, I do not know. If we are the ability to stop legislation shows how this House of getting a more realistic target for reducing emissions Commons has been demeaned by the Government, who from domestic houses and are moving away from the have taken from it the ability to look properly and lifestyle constraints implied by zero-carbon houses, thoroughly at legislation and to decide whether or not I am glad to see common sense dawn. With a bit of that legislation is of quality. That is not the job of the luck we will be able to get more buy-in for reducing House of Lords; it is the job of the Commons. If there carbon emissions from houses rather than banning is one thing that I sincerely hope my party addresses them altogether. after the election, it is that the House of Commons I feel desperately sorry for DEFRA, because nobody regains its primacy and democratic legitimacy. has mentioned that Department so far. It is lovely to see the Secretary of State here; he has sat patiently wondering 6.17 pm if anyone will mention anything to do with the countryside. I join completely all the messages of sympathy and Linda Gilroy (Plymouth, Sutton) (Lab/Co-op): I thought support sent to everybody who has been affected by the for a moment that I was at least going to be able to flooding in Cumbria. It is a ghastly thing to happen to agree with the last point made by the hon. Member for so many people in an area where it is difficult to get the Beckenham (Mrs. Lait); she would get agreement from help that is needed. I feel very sad and send them all all of us that the primacy of this House is crucial and best wishes. There is a reference in the Queen’s Speech that statements made about opposing the legislative to a flooding Bill. Its proposals could be implemented programme set out in the Queen’s Speech are out of by changing who is responsible for what and making it order. However, she then went on to say something with clear which local authority has what powers. The only which I could not agree—that there should be a change other thing in the Queen’s Speech that might affect the of Government. rural community is the broadband Bill, which could I invite the hon. Lady to look at what legislation can bring some economic strength to deprived rural areas. do. Of course legislation does not do everything but it For farmers, fruit farmers, fishermen or environmentalists, can provide a framework in which active government however, there is nothing that will in any way, shape can be delivered alongside the third sector and the or form help them to live a more productive and community sector. I invite her to look at my Adjournment helpful life. debate last week on the work of the Department for I want to talk briefly about the other Bills proposed Work and Pensions in my constituency. We have a much in the Queen’s Speech. I could not believe that there is deeper recession this time than we have had at any time to be legislation to halve the deficit. Legislation will not for 50 years. My constituency has the legacy from my halve the deficit; action will. There is a Bill to ensure Tory predecessor of the poorest ward in England. But good schooling. Legislation will not ensure good schooling; 1,500 more people are in employment now than in good teachers, good head teachers and good parents 1997—which was not at the very depths of a recession— will. There is yet another promise to halve child poverty. when I became the Member of Parliament. I also disagree Legislation does not halve child poverty; the economy with the hon. Lady about the legislation that has been and social structure will ensure that children no longer passed over the past 12 years and about that proposed live in poverty. in the Queen’s Speech. For 12 years we have had a Government who believe Bob Spink: Did the hon. Lady share my slight that legislation is the answer. For 12 years we have been disappointment that the hon. Member for Beckenham telling them that legislation is the problem. It is not (Mrs. Lait)—unintentionally, I am sure—was rather delivering because the Government believe so often that dismissive about the Flood and Water Management if they pass an Act, nothing more needs to be done. We Bill, which I hope will get a clear run through Parliament. must create the circumstances in which we get the It is an extremely good Bill that will give a much more outcomes that we want, That is the key to decent thorough and integrated management of coastal risk. I legislation. Sadly, this Queen’s Speech is probably more know that the hon. Member for Plymouth, Sutton an electoral statement than anything to do with achieving (Linda Gilroy) is very interested in coastal flood risk the laudable objectives set out in it. management because, like me, she has a coastal constituency. There are things that I would have liked to have seen in the Queen’s Speech. The scandal of the exploitation Linda Gilroy: Indeed, and I shall come to that. I shall of public sector leaseholders needs to be addressed by also wish to touch on the Bill in my capacity as chair of legislation. The emerging scandal of leaseholders who the all-party group on water. I will explain why the Bill live in retirement homes needs to be addressed by is so important, although that is clear from the events legislation. Why is there no legislation to get rid of the we have witnessed this week. I cannot understand how stigma of the housing estate? People say that they live anybody could possibly say it is not prescient for such a on a certain housing estate and are immediately pigeonholed measure to be in the Queen’s Speech. 449 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 450

I wish to cover five issues. The first of them is about a successful conclusion. If unchecked, carbon emissions specific aspect of climate change that is little spoken could progressively affect whole ecosystems and trigger about, perhaps because it emerged on the agenda only a chain reaction through the food chain. Apparently, at the 2005 conference at the Met Office in Exeter while there remains a degree of uncertainty in some people’s we were holding the chairmanship of the G8: ocean minds about the impacts of climate change. The chemical acidification, or the other CO2 problem as it sometimes changes in the ocean are much more certain and predictable, referred to. Secondly, I will welcome some of the measures however. Although they are relatively minor at present, in the Energy Bill. Thirdly, I will anticipate the long-awaited the impact of unchecked carbon emissions will be final report of the Walker review on water metering and incremental, and the acidification process adds considerable charging. Fourthly, and alongside that, I will welcome weight to the arguments for immediate and significant measures in the Flood and Water Management Bill. cuts in CO2. Fifthly, I shall raise one small, but very important, issue If my city is one of the most climate-change and that brings both water and energy together in a way that carbon-emission literate, I believe the south-west region could lead to a reduction in water bills, fuel bills and the and the United Kingdom will be among the most carbon footprint. literate at Copenhagen. We have big responsibilities to First, let me turn to ocean acidification—the other lead, and to persuade not only that we have a problem, CO2 problem. The Secretary of State for Energy and but that it must be tackled as a matter of urgency. It is Climate Change recently visited Plymouth. When we characteristic of what happens in any period of change were walking from the railway station to the university—yes, that there are leaders, early and late followers and we walked there—to attend a question-and-answer session, laggards. If there are any late followers and laggards I said to him that I must represent one of the most during the Copenhagen discussions, I hope our hon. environmentally literate constituencies in the country, and right hon. Friends who will be representing us there as there are 450 marine scientists working in it and will tell them of the other CO2 problem, which is about some 1,400 to 1,500 environmental students at the not the sometimes too benign sounding “global warming”, university. Some of these people serve on international but the acidification of the oceans, which cover 70 per forums and work with scientists across the globe, including, cent. of the globe. I hope they will tell them about the particularly, Dr. Carol Turley of the Plymouth Marine 80 years of long-term plankton data recording science Laboratory, who has served on the United Nations at the second oldest marine laboratory in the world on intergovernmental panel on climate change and who Plymouth Hoe, which is the basis of the work of the plays a leading role in the ocean acidification reference current scientists who are leading globally in their field user group. and of some of the eight Nobel scientists who have been Even before the Secretary of State arrived, I was based at that laboratory. receiving e-mails from disappointed people who could Of course, we have to walk the talk. The Energy Bill not attend the question-and-answer session asking me does further work in that regard in implementing elements to make sure the Secretary of State was fully seized of of the UK low-carbon transition plan in important the importance to climate change of the other CO2 ways, and by changing the remit of Ofgem in a way that problem of ocean acidification. He went away with a is essential to the implementation of that plan by making heavy load of papers. I promised to let him have a CD sure that not only competition, but climate change and of an animation that the Ridgeway school at Plympton the transition plan, feature in the important decisions made, and which has been shown at Copenhagen Ofgem makes in regulating the market. There are important international conferences. It outlines this problem, measures at the other end of the spectrum as well, such graphically setting out the consequences and the way in as putting in place statutory protection for vulnerable which the sea has acted as a buffer for 25 per cent. of customers. I would like that to extend—I am not sure it the CO2 produced since the industrial revolution. A key does this in its current form—to making sure some of consequence is that the seas have become more acidic as the poorest customers do not have to pay higher tariffs. carbon dioxide absorbed in the ocean becomes carbonic A number of Members from both sides of the House acid, and the sea water acidity has increased by 30 per attended a National Housing Federation reception cent. over that period. Without the steps proposed to yesterday, at which we were reminded of the continuing limit our carbon emissions, this will accelerate and by prepayment rip-off of the difference in respect of dual 2060 sea water acidity could have increased by 120 per tariff from many of the big providers. The difference cent., greater than any increase in the past 21 million between prepayment and the average direct debit cost is years. £106 for British Gas, £77 for EDF, £105 for npower, This matters because at the bottom of the food chain £99 for E.ON UK, £108 for Scottish Power and £102 for in the oceans are many tiny creatures: zoo plankton, Scottish and Southern Energy. These still amount to which have tiny shells and skeletons; shellfish, which are very significant sums of money for some of the poorest slightly larger; and molluscs, which play a very important households in the country, and I wish the Bill had role in daily diets across the world, and particularly of touched on that. No doubt a measure to deal with that those of some poorer communities. The very existence problem is one that a Member who is fortunate enough of these creatures is threatened, as ocean acidification to be drawn in the private Member’s Bill ballot might dissolves their small shells and skeletons. wish to try to take forward, if that is not achieved The air we breathe depends on a healthy ocean for through this particular Bill. the production of oxygen, and the productive layers of At that reception, the Under-Secretary of State for seas stimulate clouds that help to shade the planet. Energy and Climate Change, my hon. Friend the Member These are just a couple of a cocktail of essential processes for Stafford (Mr. Kidney), heard about how more is in the ocean that will be impacted upon by carbon being done in his constituency to encourage low-income emissions if the climate change talks do not come to a families to switch to the best tariff. I was particularly 451 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 452

[Linda Gilroy] matters. I shall return to those in just a moment. I hope that the other important work, which has been running struck by the work the Stafford and Rural Homes in parallel, can also be developed where appropriate. housing association is doing to ensure that any incoming The interim report was promising, but I know that tenant to a new home is encouraged to look at the best there has been substantial engagement with the consultation tariff for them. Among lower income households, not on it. Much water has flowed under the bridge, and I nearly enough benefit is taken from the ability to switch hope that proposals that are even more radical than from one provider to another who will often offer them some of the very good ones that were in Anna Walker’s significantly better tariffs. interim report may result. The Flood and Water I took the opportunity to ask my hon. Friend the Management Bill addresses some important lessons Minister to look at one way in which fuel poverty, water arising from the problems encountered during previous poverty and water use generally overlap. I know that floods that were similar to those causing such devastation our colleague, my hon. Friend the Member for Oldham, in parts of the country, in particular, in Cumbria. East and Saddleworth (Mr. Woolas), was well seized of Prevention is better than cure, and as chair of the the links when he was water Minister. I believe that his all-party group, I welcome the work done in the run-up successor, the Under-Secretary of State for Environment, to producing the Bill. The 2007 floods caused major Food and Rural Affairs, my hon. Friend the Member disruption, particularly in Hull, Doncaster, Leeds and for Ogmore (Huw Irranca-Davies), is also taking these the Severn valley, caused £3 billion of damage, affected issues on board. Our all-party group report “The Future 55,000 properties and resulted in the loss of 13 lives. of the UK Water Sector”, which was published last Sir Michael Pitt’s report in the wake of those floods year, points out that made it clear that we needed to change the legislation “around 40 per cent. of energy used in households is to heat governing how we manage floods and our water systems. water”. The Bill contains important measures to implement There is, thus, an enormous potential for saving both some of what he and the Cave report said needed to energy and water. Pipe runs between the point of heating happen. and the point of use are often long, which means that The Bill is also important to the insurance industry, water is drawn off and hot water left in the pipes. There because without it, the industry will be less and less is a big job to be done both on retrofitting and on willing to insure—we all know that that is already a ensuring that the new building standards deal with that problem—and there will be increasing reliance on, and effectively. I am pleased to see that the potential for costs for, the Government. Many more people are finding such savings is acknowledged in the interim report of that they cannot get insurance and, thus, the Bill is the Walker review on metering and charging. I hope important. It will also ensure that all involved in the that when its final report is published—I hope that will water, flooding and coastal erosion systems have clear be before Christmas—it will hold out real help for the roles and responsibilities. I do not imagine that I am the too long hard-pressed water users on low incomes all only MP who has faced small flooding issues in my over the country. constituency involving many stakeholders. One such situation has been going on for many years in Laira Martin Horwood (Cheltenham) (LD): Does the hon. avenue, in my constituency, and I frequently have to Lady regret that the Flood and Water Management bring together the council, Network Rail, a housing Bill, which has just been published, does not incorporate developer and the water company, because nobody anything from the Walker review’s interim findings or plays that role well at the moment. From this Bill anything that addresses the issue of social tariffs and onwards, local authorities will have a strategic role to tariffs for the least well-off water customers? play, which should make dealing with such circumstances much more straightforward. Linda Gilroy: In common with a number of Liberal Martin Horwood: Does the hon. Lady also regret that Democrats, I have been involved in several Adjournment nothing in the Bill addresses the crucial problem that debates over the many years leading up to the Walker people’s insurance premiums can go sky high and their review, and I have pressed the relevant Minister on that excess charges can go stratospherically high even though issue. We should be able to examine any pressing matters flood defence work has been done in their locality or that arise from the review to see whether they can be even, in some cases, on their own property? Does not incorporated. However, I must acknowledge that some something need to be done of the order that was done of the measures in the Bill are of immediate and pressing in respect of serious medical conditions to legislate, importance, especially in the context of what has happened level the playing field and return to the principle of this week. These things were recognised in the all-party pooled risk? I hope that hon. Members pardon the pun. group’s report. As the hon. Gentleman can well imagine, I shall be Linda Gilroy: I recognise the issue that the hon. pressing Ministers to find ways to proceed where legislation Gentleman is talking about. It might well sit more easily may be necessary, but legislation will not be needed to with some of the issues that will emerge from the implement much of what was in the interim report of Walker review report, which will undoubtedly need Anna Walker’s review—confusingly, two Walker reviews some form of legislation. The issue that he raises will be are taking place at the moment. Our Department for debated at various points of our consideration of the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs team has a big Bill, and it is important that something is introduced at strategic role to play in supporting the climate change an early stage to deal with it. discussions that the Department of Energy and Climate Importantly, the Bill will ensure the delivery of large Change will lead on, and I am pleased that, as part of and unusual infrastructure projects. I often think that that, we have a water Bill that deals with some important the water Minister has the most difficult job, because 453 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 454 although many Ministers have difficult jobs, standing on doing the work that he needs to do. I pay tribute to up to one’s knees or neck in water one day and then a him and to all the other people who are working so month or two later being in the same part of the hard. I also send my deepest sympathies to the friends country trying to explain away drought is a very difficult and families of those who have lost their lives. We lost ask. The work that has gone into preparing what is in three people in Tewkesbury because of the floods and it this Bill to deal with some of the risks associated with has a devastating effect. major projects that can help to address some of that is I say this respectfully, but anybody who has not been important. involved in any way or who has not been to visit people The Bill also changes the powers to amend the non- who have been flooded can fully understand the devastation essential uses of water that can be subject to hosepipe that it causes. In Tewkesbury, people were living in bans. As increasing pressure comes on parts of the caravans for more than a year because of the floods. country in times of drought, that, too, is important. I That was remarkable in itself, but what was in some am also pleased that the Bill will, crucially, give water ways even more remarkable was the spirit and resilience companies the power to introduce concessionary schemes of those people. Everybody whom I went to see just for surface water drainage charges to amateur sports before Christmas of that year said, “Oh, don’t worry clubs, scout groups, Churches and other community about us. We’re okay. We’re not as badly off as some groups, thus putting an end to the so-called rain tax. I people.” They were living in caravans—young people, understand the principle behind why it is so important old people, children and people who were seriously to try to make transparent the costs involved in dealing ill—and the flooding had a devastating effect, but their with water run-off from roofs and concrete partly in spirit and resilience were not broken. I am sure that that order to avoid some of these floods that cause our will be the case in Cumbria. constituents such distress. Let me speak briefly about flooding and flood prevention. This Queen’s Speech sets out, at a critical juncture, I agree with my hon. Friend that legislation often does the strategic and the tactical approach on a range of not put things right. It is important to recognise that it important issues, most particularly dealing with climate is not the end but the beginning of the process. I think change. This country played an important role, through that that was the point that she was striving to make the leadership of my right hon. Friend the Member for when she spoke so excellently a few minutes ago. That Hull, East— said, I want the Government to introduce the Flood and Water Management Bill early in this Session. It has Mr. Prescott: Yes, not the Kingstown. been trailed for a long time and I hope that it is introduced fairly quickly, because of course a general Linda Gilroy: Not the Kingstown. I am glad that it is election is coming up in not too many months. Even if our Front-Bench team who are charged with, once we run to the latest time, that does not give us an awful again, playing a key role in these so very important lot of time to carry out the legislative programme that discussions. I am sure that whatever bones of contention the Government want to introduce. I hope that the Bill we may have, we all wish them well in that work and in comes forward quickly. One slightly good thing to come the work on the Bills set out in the Queen’s Speech. out of the tragic events in Cumbria might be that the They complement that very important work. Bill will be given parliamentary time very soon. It is also important that the Bill is given sufficient time to be considered. Far too often, we rush legislation 6.40 pm through when we really do not need to. An awful lot of Mr. Laurence Robertson (Tewkesbury) (Con): My time is wasted in this House and we should give more hon. Friend the Member for Beckenham (Mrs. Lait), time to considering the legislation in detail, particularly who spoke so excellently, said that she sympathised with in Committee and on Report. the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs because nobody had touched on those issues Linda Gilroy: I simply want to agree with the hon. that are his responsibility, but when he sees me in the Gentleman that we need to have more time, particularly Chamber, he is well aware that I will talk about flooding, on that Bill. It would also be good to have an early which is very much his issue. Second Reading debate in light of the circumstances The debate is wide ranging. One can talk about that prevail this week. energy, as many hon. Members have, and about climate change, farming and many other issues. I would have an Mr. Robertson: I am grateful to the hon. Lady for that interest in speaking on all those things, but because of intervention. To be honest, introducing the Bill in the shortness of time and the number of other hon. recognition of what is taking place in Cumbria is the Members who want to speak, I shall contain my remarks least that we can do for the people who are suffering to flooding. there. I represent Tewkesbury, which I am proud to do, and Another reason I want to introduce the Bill early is obviously two and half years ago we had the most that I fear that it is somewhat lacking. I am afraid that I horrendous floods, as did other parts of the country, am not as enthusiastic about it as the hon. Lady is. It and because of that, and because the problem is obviously seems very strong on requiring people to produce reports, very difficult, I deeply sympathise with the people of assessments and all these other buzz words. I am not Cumbria. I spoke to the hon. Member for Workington sure that there is the detailed requirement for action (Tony Cunningham) for just a few minutes yesterday that we need. and he is obviously working extremely hard. He sounded—I One of the actions that we need was briefly mentioned say this in the nicest possible way—absolutely exhausted by my hon. Friend. When we had the floods in Tewkesbury by his efforts. However, he is unstinting and is carrying and Gloucestershire, one of the great difficulties that we 455 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 456

[Mr. Laurence Robertson] who produced the maps that say that those areas do not flood, and planning permission has been granted on had in trying to help people and to get things fixed was appeal for that very land, but the floods in that area will determining who was responsible for which waterway. It be even worse in the future. We cannot work from some was very difficult, if not impossible, to determine who of the maps that have been drawn. was responsible. There were two reasons for that: partly, those involved genuinely did not know; and, once they David Taylor: I was on the Select Committee on had accepted responsibility, they had to pay to put it Environment, Food and Rural Affairs when it reported right and they claimed to be short of money. For those on the flooding in Gloucestershire and elsewhere a two reasons, defining responsibility was very difficult. number of years ago. We visited Tewkesbury and I However, it was crucial and we must address that. I am remember well that, as we drove out of the town in our not sure that the Bill does so fully. I hope that it does, hired minibus, I saw lots of yellow signs saying, “Come and perhaps if there is sufficient time in Committee we and have a look at the river view development.” That can explore that and the Bill can be strengthened at that was ironic in the light of what happened. Does the hon. stage for that reason. Gentleman believe that his local authority and others It is also important to ensure that whoever is responsible are too quick to lie down in front of powerful developers for which waterway does not just repair things when and to ignore advice from the Environment Agency and something has gone wrong; it is important to maintain others? Should not greater powers be given? Looking the waterways on an ongoing basis each and every year. back over the past 100 years, it seems that in some cases That simply is not happening. I was not flooded in flooding occurs not once in 100 years, but once in Tewkesbury, but my house was full of people who were. 10 years. We need urgently to update that figure. They lived further up the hill than I do, so they should not have been flooded. However, a drain was broken. Mr. Robertson: The hon. Gentleman is absolutely The problem did not show up when there was ordinary right, and I know the estate that he is talking about. It rainfall, but it did when there was heavy rainfall. The flooded as it was being built, and then an application drain had not been maintained and we then went into was put in to build 100 more houses on that very site. the process of working out who was responsible for it. The second bit of the building application has not gone The county council denied responsibility, but it was through, but the first did. then proved that it was its responsibility and it had to I am not willing at this stage to lay too much blame at fix it, but it was too late—the family had already been the door of the local authorities. They know what flooded. happens. The hon. Member for Bassetlaw (John Mann) We must have maintenance as well as repair work. Of is smiling, but I remind him that no party has overall course, repair work is involved in maintenance. Nobody control of the Tewkesbury authority—I think that that would have a car that they never serviced and expect it is what he is getting at. to run for ever until it got to the point where it absolutely Planning policy statement 25 is insufficient. It says broke down. The job is far more expensive then than if that authorities should not build in flood-risk areas services are carried out every 15,000 miles or so. We unless this or that is the case, but it is far too weak a would not do that and we should not do it in this document to provide the protection that we need. respect, either. Another issue that I want to mention is one that I Mr. Swire: In his recent statement on the flooding in have brought up many times, which is building houses Cumbria, the Secretary of State for Environment, Food in flood-risk areas. Whenever we raise the issue, locally and Rural Affairs said—I paraphrase him—that one or nationally, we hear the old theories, such as whether problem was the concreting-over of Britain, not least of it is a flood-risk area or whether it has flooded in the people’s front drives and gardens. Does my hon. Friend past 100 years. On the one hand, we are told that we are agree with me, and by extension, presumably, the Secretary experiencing climate change, and I am not denying that, of State, that local authorities must be given much but if we are experiencing climate change, we cannot stricter guidance about when to allow front gardens to use the old figures of once in 100 years, once in 500 years be concreted over, as very often that just exacerbates the and once in 1,000 years. We cannot have it both ways. problem? We do not know when the rain will fall in the way that it did in 2007 or the way that it did in the past few weeks. Mr. Robertson: My hon. Friend makes a good point. However, I think—I will have to look it up—that local Mr. Binley: Northampton has also suffered floods authorities have been given that power only very recently. and we lost two people, so I understand my hon. Friend’s comments about that. However, one lesson John Mann: I hope that the hon. Gentleman is not that we learned is that floodplain maps simply are not going to ruin a cracking speech by letting off local good enough and houses are being built on floodplains. authorities of all parties. Does he agree that they see all Does my hon. Friend agree that the Ministers need to those pounds from council tax and think, “Let’s build a take that seriously into account because the problem is few more houses and we can get a bit more in our continuing and is not being stopped? We are making the empire. Let ’em build anywhere.” That is what all local problem worse for the future. authorities think, regardless of colour—and even those that are colourless, like his own. Mr. Robertson: I am grateful to my hon. Friend for that intervention. He is absolutely right: we can all draw Mr. Robertson: I certainly would not describe Tewkesbury maps, and I have seen maps that are manifestly wrong. local authority as colourless. It might have no overall We have given photos of flooded areas to the people control, but it is certainly not colourless. However, the 457 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 458 hon. Gentleman makes a point that, although slightly I was never big on science at school, but the theory is different from mine, is important. What he describes is a pretty obvious—the water is going to go somewhere consideration, albeit a very short-term one. else. It is profoundly wrong, and dangerous, for the RSS to propose that 14,000 houses be built in my area. The Bob Spink: Does the hon. Gentleman believe that the people who put the strategy together do not live there Government should give very firm instructions to their and obviously have not studied it, because they do not inspectors to be much more robust about planning know what they are talking about. policy statement 25? My Castle Point borough council, It is not just in my area that there have been objections which happens to be Tory controlled, wants to build to the RSS. The Secretary of State will know that in the several hundred houses on the Canvey Island floodplain, south-west region there have been 35,000 representations where 58 people died in the 1953 floods. Does he agree about that document, for very many different reasons. that it should be stopped from doing that? The document is fairly technical, and is not necessarily something that people wake up with in the morning. Mr. Robertson: As I said, I think that PPS25 is People do not normally get involved in responding to inadequate because it does not provide the protection the RSS, but 35,000 have. that we need. The hon. Gentleman is therefore absolutely right. David Taylor: Is it not being disingenuous to the point of dishonesty for the hon. Gentleman’s party to Mrs. Maria Miller: Does my hon. Friend share my suggest that abandoning the RSS will somehow lead to concern that local authorities’ priorities in assessing a nirvana in which people will decide how many properties where houses should go are being distorted by the are needed and where they should be built? He suggests house building targets set by the Government? They are that there would never be a problem again if that were causing a great many problems when it comes to finding to happen, but that was never the case in all the years of the space on which houses can be sited. county structure plans that lie behind us. At some point, and if necessary, Governments will always impose Mr. Robertson: My hon. Friend is absolutely right, their will on counties preparing structure plans to ensure and she very conveniently takes me on to the next point, that the number of houses needed are built in particular which concerns the pressure placed on local authorities locations. To suggest that those days are going to return by the regional spatial strategy. and that all will be well is barmy. The hon. Gentleman When this Government came to power, they said that has not said that, but his party has. they wanted to end the “predict and provide” approach to housing. Like me, many hon. Members will remember Mr. Robertson: I am not sure that my party has said that statement. I thought, “There we go. I’m not going that. As I understand the policy, it is to scrap the to be able to disagree with everything that this Government regional assemblies and the RSS process. I agree with say.”However, they have not only reinforced that approach, the hon. Gentleman that that will not necessarily be they have regionalised it. They have reinforced it by absolutely perfect or a utopia, and I am sure that I will making it a requirement to build 3 million extra houses still have disputes and arguments with my Front-Bench over the next 20 years or so, but how did they know that team or local councils, but at least I will know who I am we would need that many houses in that period? Why arguing with and what the process is. To me, that is far has the power to decide how many houses are needed, more honest than the system that we have now. and where they should go, been handed to the regions? The people of the north-east were asked whether they The decisions are almost site-specific, but I do not wanted elected regional assemblies, and they said no. know who is making them. It is not local councillors, What have the Government done? They have carried on because if it were we could go to them and say, “We devolving powers to regional assemblies that are unelected. disagree with you and we’re going to boot you out next That cannot be the right way to go. time because we don’t like what you’re doing.” We Because of all the interventions, which I have been cannot do that with the RSS. very glad to take, I have spoken for far longer than I In my constituency, the proposal in the RSS is to intended. I shall end with two very quick points, the build more than 14,000 houses. How on earth can we first of which has been mentioned. Since the floods in find space for all those houses when the area concerned my area, some people have not been able to get insurance is a flood risk? I do not care whether we are just on one and others have had to pay vastly increased premiums. side or the other of a line on a map, because that is not As the hon. Member for Cheltenham (Martin Horwood) what is important. As the hon. Member for North-West said, some have had to cover extraordinarily high excess Leicestershire (David Taylor) mentioned, the planning payments. I had a telephone call today about someone process does not take account of the theory of water with an excess of £20,000 on his house. In effect, that displacement. means that that person is not insured against flooding, It is not only a matter of whether the new houses because it would probably not cost more than that to fix flood. When the hon. Gentleman visited Tewkesbury, the damage. the new houses flooded as they were being built, but the The insurance industry, of course, is a business that other problem is that they also displace water and send has to fund itself and make itself pay, but I wish it somewhere else. The water in Tewkesbury is, as we insurance companies could be a bit more flexible and speak, resting on green fields. It does that quite frequently, understanding. I do not know whether the Government as certain parts of the fields in the town flood several can help in that regard, or whether they have had times a year. That is not a problem, but concreting over discussions with the industry. I presume that they have, those green fields causes that water to go somewhere but a bit more flexibility and understanding would not else. go amiss. 459 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 460

[Mr. Laurence Robertson] That is what people face, and they are absolutely frustrated. They may have to phone around on a Sunday My final point has to do with water supplies. I do not afternoon, without having a clue where they will get know what the situation is in Cumbria, but we in their help from. It is worse than that; even when the Tewkesbury lost our water supplies as a result of the emergency state—the actual flooding moment—is over, floods. Some people were without water for up to three they have the frustration of spending months trying to weeks, and the entire county came very close losing its find out who is supposed to repair the flood defences, electricity supply. I understand that the problems in dredge the river, and check whether the pumping station Gloucestershire amounted to the largest peacetime works. That is extremely complex, which is why many emergency that this country has ever had, but can the people come to me. We have had to go around trying to House imagine how much worse it would have been if sort out who is supposed to do what. Clarity is essential, we had lost our entire electricity supply? If it is possible and the sooner we have it, the better. The sooner we all to provide alternative water and power supplies, such know exactly who does what, and where their responsibilities systems certainly should be in place, as well as the extend to, the better. That has to be sorted out as soon protective barriers that can be built around those utilities. as possible. I send my deepest sympathies to the people of Looking to the future, we need to be very cautious in Workington. I can put my hand on my heart and say our approach. We have to think of the worst. We cannot that I know what people there are going through. I have our grandchildren, or great-grandchildren, looking sincerely hope that they come through the experience back and saying, “Why on earth did they build here? with the same spirit and resilience as my constituents What possessed them to do so?” When I look at the did. addresses of many people in my constituency, I see Welsh words that mean willows and marsh. The minute 7pm I see such words, I think to myself, “How absolutely Nia Griffith (Llanelli) (Lab): My hon. Friend the lunatic we were to put buildings in those places!” We Member for Plymouth, Sutton (Linda Gilroy) and the really have to stop. hon. Member for Tewkesbury (Mr. Robertson) have In my constituency, a further danger is posed by the covered much of the ground that I wanted to cover. I coast. We have a magnificent view; we look out over the shall focus on the Flood and Water Management Bill Gower peninsula. A person could not want a nicer listed in the Queen’s Speech, because I think that it is place to put their house than looking out over the excellent. I urge Ministers to give it utmost priority, so magnificent scenery, across the Burry inlet. However, that we can get started on it straight away. we have to look at the maps and think about coastal Even before the dreadful events of last weekend, erosion. What is the point in putting a house in a place many of us have experienced the constant threat of where coastal erosion may well be an additional problem, flooding. We had flooding in my constituency in July, or where there is a tidal lock because the house is so and we know that flooding is no longer confined to the near the sea, meaning that nothing can flow away? We dreaded November winter onslaught; it can happen all have to look at what is underneath; we cannot just look year round. There has been an enormous amount of at the surface and think, “Let’s build here because flooding across the country; it may not have received there’s a fabulous view.” the same publicity as the flooding of the past few days, but it nevertheless left people out of their homes for We have to be brave. Obviously, we cannot move months and months, with all the cost and distress that every single bit of infrastructure straight away. We that brings. cannot move every single water supply source or electricity substation immediately, but we have to plan to move Some of the main issues that we are tackling in the them. We have to plan to get those vital bits of equipment Bill were highlighted by Sir Michael Pitt in his report, out of floodplains. We also have to stop putting buildings following the 2007 flood problems. Many of those on floodplains. Sometimes, it is tempting to put them problems do not happen once every few years, or once there. We all would like a particular new facility—a every 100 or 1,000 years, or whatever figure people school or a hospital—in a particular location, but we would like to quote; we have to face up to the fact that have to think twice. We have to say, “Perhaps we need to they will happen much more frequently. We have to think of the future, and think whether this will be a safe rethink our whole way of planning. Many of the points place in 30 years’ time.” Otherwise, we are creating made about planning are exceptionally important. problems for ourselves, and for the people who will One of the main provisions of the Bill—a provision move in. We have to think about that in advance, rather of immediate importance—relates to finding out who is than waiting for those buildings to be flooded. responsible for what. The idea that we are to clarify that must be very welcome to many people. I have constituents who, when faced with rising water, have panicked and Mr. Roger Williams (Brecon and Radnorshire) (LD): wondered who on earth they were supposed to contact. The hon. Lady makes important points that apply to Do they contact the water company, because a pumping both England and Wales. Sometimes, part of the problem station is involved? Do they contact the Environment is that the plans produced by the Environment Agency Agency, because the water is from a river? Do they are not extraordinarily accurate. A hospital extension in contact the local authority, because the problem is my constituency was ruled out at one time because the surface water coming off the highways? If they are site was on a floodplain, but further examination showed extremely well informed, they might even know that the that it was completely safe. We have to give the public local authority has responsibility for that wonderfully confidence that the maps are accurate and really reflect named creature, the non-main river, whatever one of the situation; otherwise, planning decisions will be arbitrary those is. and people will not be able to trust them. 461 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 462

Nia Griffith: One of the difficulties is that people’s have paid for years. The Bill will end that practice and faith in the maps has been undermined, because they make sure that, after the 2003 survey, which included a have seen inconsistencies. I have to say that those mapping exercise of all the private sewers across the inconsistencies are sometimes driven by motivations country, water companies will be forced by legislation in much more along the lines of those mentioned earlier, 2011 to adopt all the systems on estates that have not when reference was made to some local authorities and been properly adopted in the past. That will be of greed, and authorities looking to develop much more tremendous importance to those people. than they need to. There has been a problem, but I In Wales, powers can be drawn down by the Welsh understand that a lot of the maps have been redrawn. Assembly Government, and we very much look forward We have very sophisticated systems, but we need to ask to that. The Under-Secretary of State for Environment, people with local knowledge for advice, too. People may Food and Rural Affairs, my hon. Friend the Member have seen fields flooded, and may know that there are for Ogmore (Huw Irranca-Davies), has been closely regular occurrences of flooding in an area. involved in work with the relevant Minister from the We should also look at the effect that building in one Welsh Assembly Government to make sure that that area immediately has on another. In urban areas, we happens. It should be simpler for Wales, as it has only might be talking about concreting over a garden. However, two main companies—Welsh Water and Severn Trent when vast new housing estates are built, we have to Water—with which to negotiate, so that should happen think about where the water will go. That is yet another very soon. I was somewhat shocked at a public meeting problem that we have to think about in advance, so that that I called not very long ago to hear how proud Welsh we are not paying for repairs when we could have Water was of paying a dividend of £21 per water-charged avoided the situation in the first place. household throughout Wales. That was a very nice dividend, but those of us who are comfortably off could Mr. Binley: This whole business has been going on for probably have done without that £21, because we would years. One need only go to the Nene valley and notice not have noticed if it had not been returned. However, where the churches were built to see that people in Welsh Water balks at the thought that it might cost mediaeval times knew exactly what ground to build on, £5 to £30 per household to absorb the costs of sewer and not build on. We have become too arrogant; we adoption. Everyone at the meeting thought that that have forgotten most of that, and build on floodplains was quite absurd: one minute, the company was giving time and again. I support what the hon. Lady says. We back money, but the next it was saying, “Well, we don’t have to find some way of stopping that. know how the negotiations will go with the Welsh Assembly Government. We don’t know whether we can adopt those sewers, as a certain amount of money Nia Griffith: Absolutely. My constituency happens to might be added to the bill—perhaps £5 to £30. have that tricky combination: short, steep hills next to a coastal plain. Any geologist, geographer or hydrologist Mr. Roger Williams: The hon. Lady has been very will say that that is classic flood country. The rain generous in giving way. I very much agree with her. comes down the slope very quickly, so we have to look Some houses in my constituency have been subject to at all sorts of areas that are close to the river banks sewer flooding, and I have always said that it would be or that are likely to flood with water from those slopes. far better not to pay a dividend of £21 or £22 a year, We need to do a lot of work, and should be much and instead to ensure that the affected houses are more cautious about what we build where; we should safeguarded from that occurrence, and to take up the think first. sewerage systems that the hon. Lady has mentioned. I move on to a problem that, though small, is of enormous significance to those affected, and that will Nia Griffith: Indeed. I very much agree. It is extremely be addressed by the Bill, namely the adoption of private important that we keep up the pressure, and I urge sewers. The problem is terrible for those whom it affects. Ministers to do so, to make sure that legislation is It has certainly affected people in my constituency, in imposed on those water companies and they do not try places such as Cleviston park, Derlyn park and Dolau to wriggle out of their obligations or postpone them—action Fan road. When something has gone wrong, residents must take place in 2011, and we must not let it drift there have found, to their absolute horror, that they are around the place. That is a completely different issue, on what is called a private sewerage system. They did however, from tackling water poverty, where we seek to not know that because they have paid—some of them operate a sliding scale or provide help where it is needed for as long as 40 years—what were water rates and are instead of paying a blanket dividend. now water charges in the same way as everybody else. The Bill will therefore be extremely important in They have paid and paid, like everybody else; of course, dealing with something that we said was extremely the sewers for which they are paying are taking some of important in the Climate Change Bill—the issue of the local authority’s water off the local authority’s adaptation. We always thought that it would be something highways. right at the end of the Bill, but when we are rushed for Suddenly, when something goes wrong—it may be a time it can be difficult to give something full consideration. blockage, because the pipes may not have been of the However, the Flood and Water Management Bill makes best quality—the system is discovered to be completely a commitment to try and put something in place and to weird, but certainly not wonderful, with pipes doubling begin the process of dealing with adaptation. We need back on themselves in people’s back gardens, and crossing to take that more seriously, and make sure that we from one garden to another in an absurd way. That has design a country so that, in 200 or 300 years’ time, left people such as my constituents with bills of around residents say, “Yes, this was the right place to build,” £2,500 for one simple break to be repaired. They have to and not, “How stupid or foolish they were to do that all pay that in addition to paying the water rates that they those years ago.” 463 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 464

7.13 pm operate in future. I challenge the Under-Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs, the Mrs. Maria Miller (Basingstoke) (Con): It is a pleasure hon. Member for Ogmore (Huw Irranca-Davies), who to follow the hon. Member for Llanelli (Nia Griffith), is sitting on the Front Bench, on whether all his colleagues who raised a number of important issues, particularly are convinced about issues of sustainability and the need for clarity on different responsibilities, which I environmental sustainability. encountered in my constituency when it was difficult to assess who was responsible for the clean-up after flooding When we begin to look at work that has been done, that occurred as a result of building works. Even more particularly on planning and development, we can see importantly, we should make sure that we do not build that there is a great deal of paperwork on environmental in inappropriate places. There are great examples in sustainability. Indeed, the new Bill specifically establishes history of houses and palaces built next to water courses. the need for a Indeed, I live in a 400-year-old barn, which was built in “local flood risk management strategy”, Huish—an Old English word for “damp”—next to a which will be developed by a county council or a local spring, and it is still standing somehow. There are district council in the regional spatial plans that we examples of how that can work, but all too often the discussed earlier. Specific attention is paid to the reverse happens, and those houses are devastated by environmental impact of house building, particularly in flooding. The hon. Lady therefore made some important local communities. In my constituency in Basingstoke, points, as indeed did my hon. Friend the Member for as a result of the south-east development plan, we have Tewkesbury (Mr. Robertson), who spoke about the undertaken an extensive four-year water cycle study, to need to ensure that development is appropriate. consider pollution levels in our local river. Various I welcome the opportunity to contribute to today’s consultations have been undertaken by water companies debate. I shall probably redress the balance in favour of and the Environment Agency to make sure that we are environmental issues, as opposed to the energy issues aware of environmental issues as they pertain to house that dominated our initial proceedings. The Flood and building and planning. Water Management Bill in the Gracious Speech gives us However, when I look at the actions of Government an opportunity to deal with important issues relating to Departments other than DEFRA, I question whether development, and I shall develop that theme. This is a there is complete buy-in to the goal of environmental timely debate, and I echo the comments made about sustainability, and whether the Bill offers Ministers the problems experienced in Cumbria, Wales and many opportunity to make sure that their colleagues in other parts of the country, and the devastation that the floods Departments have got the message. In relation to house have brought to local communities. My hon. Friend the building particularly, environmental sustainability cannot Member for Tewkesbury said that it is probably difficult be ignored. As the hon. Lady said, we cannot set it to for someone to appreciate the true impact of flooding one side. It is a matter on which we will be judged by until they have experienced for themselves losing all our children and our children’s children. their belongings or their home. I hope that the people who have been affected receive all the support that they Perhaps in the Department for Communities and need, and I pay tribute to the heroic work of the Local Government there is not complete buy-in to the emergency services in the past week. concept of sustainability. Having examined the problems in my constituency, I cannot understand why the Recent events have heightened our awareness of the Department would endorse a building target of 19,000 natural limits that the environment imposes on every houses by 2026 if it truly bought into the vision of single community, so we must keep a careful eye on the environmental sustainability. Along with many areas of implications of climate change. Water has always played the south-east, Basingstoke is an area of serious water a fundamental role in all communities, which were set stress. The Government acknowledge that the effects up because there was a water source close at hand. That of climate change will lead to a reduction in the supply water source has nurtured our communities, enabled of water in my constituency and an increase in demand. them to grow and has shaped them in many respects, too. Moving water about and storing it is expensive. In terms of water supply, the situation in north Cleaning it is costly and subject to technical limitations. Hampshire is worse than in some Mediterranean countries. When I began to read the Bill, I felt that it was just My local river, the River Loddon, is in extreme breach scratching the surface of the issues that arise when we of the European water framework directive. The phosphorus look at water management and flooding. I echo the levels—which, as the Minister is aware, are directly comments made by the Select Committee on Environment, linked to levels of population—are six times higher Food and Rural Affairs that the Bill is a slimmed-down than the water framework directive standards because version of what is needed. of the effluent discharges from my local sewage works. I If we are looking for consensus, however, we can find am told by those who are expert in these matters that it on the need for sustainable development. Environmental there is no sewage treatment works in the country and concerns should play a considerable role in helping to no technology in the world that could reduce the pollution determine the way in which our communities develop in in that river to levels consistent with the water framework future. The Bill in the Gracious Speech should not be a directive. Building one more house, let alone 19,000 missed opportunity to reinforce that even further. There more, is problematic if we are to be truly sustainable in has been much talk today about making tough decisions— our approach to developing our communities. the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change I mentioned earlier that there has been an expensive used that phrase on several occasions. He also urged us and extensive water cycle report, which has been going to believe the science, and to make sure that we are on for about four years. That has confirmed that house convinced, as issues arising from climate change will building levels set by Ministers through their regional affect the way in which our communities will have to assemblies will perpetuate the situation. There will be 465 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 466 no improvement in the water quality and the pollution among constituents who might be affected by these levels in my local river if house building continues in the issues, and that there is a clear demarcation of role in way that the Government foresee. In case hon. Members practice. are not aware, the river is a north-flowing salmonoid A further question that I would throw to those on the river, one of very few in the country, and a prize Government Front Bench is how local authorities can possession in our local area. balance the conflicting priorities of hitting the Government’s In my constituency, 75 per cent. of the water comes house building targets and being responsible for managing from chalk aquifers, so abstraction of water from flood risk. As we have heard in the debate, those could underground is key. Even before the proposed increase be conflicting priorities. Where are they to put the in house building, the way we get our water is resulting houses if the housing number is set so solidly, if they are in a lowering of the water table because of the increased restricted by the risk of flooding or unsuitability for abstractions that we have had to undertake in recent other environmental reasons? We must make sure that years. As a result of excessive abstraction in the we address that conflict. I urge the Minister, if he has neighbouring Whitewater valley area, there is already not already done so, to look at the proposals put possible environmental damage, which is being closely forward by my hon. Friend the Member for Welwyn monitored. On behalf of my constituents, I pay tribute Hatfield (Grant Shapps), which would help enormously to the work of the Hampshire and Isle of Wight wildlife to overcome some of the conflicts by putting the scheduling trust for all the work that it does in identifying and of house building and the determination of house building protecting fragile and important areas such as the levels into the hands of local elected representatives. Mapledurwell fen, where there is a risk to the environment from a lowering of the water table as a result of high Martin Horwood: Some of the conflicts that the hon. abstraction levels. Lady rightly describes could be resolved by more careful examination of the numbers behind regional spatial Too many of the tools that the Government are strategies. The RSS for the south-west is still based on a foisting on local authorities do not seem to take account 3 per cent. per annum growth rate maintained consistently of the importance of environmental sustainability. I over 20 years, which is clearly not being achieved at refer to the strategic housing land availability assessments, present. with which many other hon. Members may be grappling— those nicely termed SHLAAs, as our local councillors are starting to call them. They are being used to determine Mrs. Miller: The hon. Gentleman is right to question where houses might end up, without even considering the numbers. Rather than questioning the numbers issues of biodiversity or the quality of the landscape myself, I should like my local elected representatives to and its importance in the local community. Despite all be in charge of house building and the scale of house these troubling environmental indicators, my constituency, building that might be undertaken in that locality. They along with the south-east, is being earmarked as the are best placed to know how a community should centre of house building in the country. develop, and how they want their community to develop. That is where the power should lie, rather than in We cannot allow the debate to go by without Ministers Whitehall, as it has in recent years. responding to that. There seems to be a disconnect The hon. Member for Llanelli spoke about private between house building and environmental sustainability, sewers. I thought I might be the only person to pick that and the consequent overloading of the south-east with topic out of the Bill. It seems that many of the 200,000 house building. What assurances can the Secretary of km of private sewers reside in my constituency. For State give when he winds up the debate to me, my hon. Members who have not encountered it, the issue is constituents and other Members who represent areas in that housing estates are developed and because of their the south-east about the priority that should be given to set-up the sewerage systems, which we would naturally environmental sustainability in the context of house presume would be handed over to the relevant authority building in the future? The Secretary of State for Energy to be maintained, remain the responsibility of local and Climate Change spoke about making hard choices. residents. That can come as something of a shock to I do not see those hard choices being made when it some residents, but even more of a shock are the bills comes to saying no to development that might that are sometimes associated with such private sewers. fundamentally affect the environmental quality and sustainability of our communities in the future. I see the Under-Secretary nodding in agreement that that provision is quite firmly in the Bill, but I ask for I know that many hon. Members are keen to participate clarification about how it will be rolled out, because it is in the debate because it is such an important subject for a potentially significant financial issue for local water us and our constituents. The second area that I shall companies—the organisations that will take over touch on is the involvement of local communities, which responsibility for private sewerage systems. Many sewers is picked up in the Flood and Water Management Bill. in my constituency have deteriorated significantly because I welcome the apparent increase in the role of local of a lack of maintenance, mostly due to tree roots having authorities in strategy and planning for flood management. gone through the sides of pipes and caused blockages The hon. Member for Llanelli stressed the importance and as a result of the sort of flooding referred to. of clarity of roles. Reading through the Bill, I can Will the Secretary of State offer some assurance that understand that the intention is to clarify the roles simply handing over ownership to a third party—to a undertaken by county councils and district councils, water company—will not be a paper exercise, and that and that the Government are rightly introducing some those companies will be able to undertake the maintenance flexibility so that local authorities can work matters out that has not been what it should have been in recent for themselves. Let us make sure that that flexibility years? I am aware of the water bill levy that is intended does not turn into a lack of understanding, particularly to pay for some of that, but will there be an imperative 467 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 468

[Mrs. Maria Miller] sneering, by a Member who drives around one of the nearest constituencies to Westminster in a car, when for maintenance, and how will it be dealt with? Will he most of his constituents are happy to go on the bus and confirm that he intends the legislation to come into on the underground. That syndrome, which involves force as soon as possible? Why do we have to wait until sneering about action on the environment, undermines 2011? If it is going to happen, it should happen sooner the case for the environment. rather than later, so that residents in areas such as Popley in my constituency can rest easier in their beds, Madam Deputy Speaker (Sylvia Heal): Order. The without the threat of sewage flooding, which has become hon. Member is making a quite considerable attack on an all too common incident for too many of them. a Member who is not present. I suggest that he returns In conclusion, I shall pick up on something that the to his speech and to a contribution to the debate. right hon. Member for Kingston upon Hull, East John Mann: Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. I (Mr. Prescott), who is not in his place, said in his will continue with my speech. concluding remarks. He said that the 21st century is the period of mass sustainability, and I could not agree “We all know,” said a Conservative Front Bencher, more. That should be our watchword, and I say amen to “that coal-fired power stations are to close.”Well, actually, that comment. The right hon. Gentleman was the architect we do not all know that. When will that happen? What of the problems of overdevelopment and excessive house is the time scale? It shows the vagueness that has slipped building and with planning for the future that I am in and become major statements. I happen to have two dealing with in my constituency. My local council in coal-fired power stations in my constituency, and nobody Basingstoke is grappling with many issues that were has told the company that runs them that the power formed under his stewardship of that part of the stations will be closing. Indeed, it has just invested Government, so perhaps his successor, who is now many tens of millions of pounds in technology to green responsible for that area of Government policy, will the stations, and it has done so with Government support. hear the words that the right hon. Gentleman sagely Therefore, it is not accurate to say that we all know that uttered today and act now to ensure that future house coal-fired power stations will be closing—not in my building is environmentally sustainable not just in my constituency. They will not be closing, those jobs will constituency and the south-east, but in all our constituencies. not be going and that energy will be required. Such The Government should use the Bill in the Queen’s statements show the shoddiness of the debate. Speech to underline to people not just on the outside If we were to ask, “In 30, 40, 50 years’ time, what but on their own side that environmental sustainability power stations should there be, and what do we want to has to be the name of the game. see there?”, we would rightly recognise that the new gas-fired power stations being built alongside existing stations are an interim stage. There will be stages beyond 7.33 pm that. However, a party, presuming that it will be in John Mann (Bassetlaw) (Lab): I have been listening to power, suggests that it is going to close down coal-fired these speeches about how this is the important issue, power stations. No, it is not, and if it is, it should give us and 23 Members of the House of Commons have the time scale, because my constituents, as producers managed to stay this long, or were here in the first place, and consumers of that energy, will want to know when out of 646, so it has clearly captured the imagination of they are going to close. The Government encouraged this country’s elected representatives. In a similar way, new and wise investments in flue gas desulphurisation everyone’s propaganda will say that this is their top units, and EDF and the power stations put up the priority, or one of their top priorities, in the months money. Those units green the use of coal in order to to come. create power, and they have a long life span, which is I listened with interest to my right hon. Friend the precisely why I and my local community welcome that Member for Kingston upon Hull, East (Mr. Prescott), investment. who is not now present. He made a good speech, and I However, that does not mean that I agree with the am glad that he is going to Kyoto, because he has done consensus, but I have heard a little bit of consensus. The a lot of the ground work. [HON.MEMBERS: “Copenhagen.”] Government are in favour of wind farms and the He was in Kyoto and he is going to Copenhagen. Opposition are in favour of wind farms, so there will be However, I heard the sneering remark from the Liberal wind farms everywhere. Well, I am no nimby: there is a hon. Member for North Southwark and Bermondsey power station, literally, in my backyard. I look out my (Simon Hughes), who is also not present, about how window and see and admire it every time that I am at people should not fly to Copenhagen. I call that the home. There is a second one just down the road, a “Monbiot syndrome”, after The Guardian writer. What gas-fired power station is being built alongside a massive such people do, from their intellectually high position, one and doubtless there will be more in the future. We is sneer on the masses when it comes to everything to do are not nimbys, but we are not going to be surrounded with the environment, and they believe that, in some by windmills on one side and power stations on the way, such tokenistic little gestures move things on. Well, other, so those windmills can go where the wind don’t they do not. They polarise the population and people blow, as far as I and most of my constituents are dismiss the idea that what we say is important. concerned. We are not having anything anywhere, and that Martin Horwood: Will the hon. Gentleman give way? consideration must be part of the process. Those of us who have power stations in our backyards have a right John Mann: No. The hon. Member for North Southwark to say that we are not having more in front of us than and Bermondsey is not here, but if he wants to come we have behind us, or, in some householders’ cases, back, I may take an intervention from him. I noted that more behind them than they have in front of them. It 469 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 470 depends which way we look at these things. That is a I was perplexed by the consensus between those on critical factor. When we scrutinise the legislation, I want the Front Benches on communal heating. The Secretary to ensure that there is no sneaky way something can be of State was a little equivocal, but the Conservative imposed on us. I will not vote for anything that can spokesman was absolutely certain. The Conservatives impose windmills on us when we have the power stations back district heating systems, just as the Soviets did already. Far more windmills should be put out where when they pioneered communal heating systems and the wind does blow—out at sea—as the Danes and built them across the Soviet empire. That was how others have learned. That is where the majority of wind people had to live. They were told, “Here’s your heating— farms should go. I think that we will see more resistance you will have it. If it’s too hot, you’ll open the window, to the indiscriminate location of something that makes and if it’s too cold you’ll put a coat on.” We now find, in a tiny contribution to the energy supply, but undermines local authority areas such as mine, these cranky old the concept of environmentalism for my constituents boilers that are years out of date and pump out the and others. That is an important consideration. heating, not very efficiently. I know a little bit of physics. I heard the Secretary of State dismiss, perhaps unwisely, Some people like the extra heat, but others do not, and the notion that there should be amendments to his Bill. with a centralised system, there is nothing they can do It behoves Secretaries of State, particularly young ones other than open the windows. The heat pours out, and with ambitions for the future, to listen not only to the they get the bill. They come to me and say, “This is Opposition but to the country and to their own Back stupid. Look at our bill—it’s far more than anybody Benchers. I am pleased to see that three Ministers—there else’s. It’s bad for the environment and bad for my were five a moment ago—are in their place taking notes pocket—I’m paying for something I don’t want.” There of the points that I am making. There is a series of is an opportunity to move away from the Soviet structures potential amendments that would improve the so beloved by the new Conservative party, as articulated Government’s performance on the environment. Let us this afternoon—much to the horror of one or two of its not have too much rigidity on wind farms. In Germany—I Back Benchers, as I can see from their facial expressions. think the figures are two-years-old—14 per cent. of I encourage them to sort out their Front Benchers on households have solar energy. That is extraordinary. this issue. These Soviet systems are not efficient for Based on my occasional visits there, Germany is no the environment or for the consumer, so let us change warmer than my constituency or the rest of Britain—it them. That could be done easily and immediately, with is about the same. If the Germans can have 14 per cent., a few extra bits of pump-priming of the economy as we can have more. We can manufacture that sort of new boilers and systems had to be installed by local technology in this country, thereby creating manufacturing suppliers. jobs. I am bewildered as to why we allow new house I am surprised that that the issue of mushroom farm building without insisting that it should get preferential composting is missing from the Queen’s Speech. In the planning consent—not in any area, but in appropriate villages of Misson, Harwell and Everton, the biggest areas—if such technologies were built into it. We are single emissions are those from the Tunnel Tech mushroom making a major error by failing to encourage solar composting factory. No one else would know about panels and other such technologies in all new buildings—we that—apart from my right hon. Friend the Member for should be incentivising that in a big way. Don Valley (Caroline Flint), who has Bawtry, which is I would go a stage further. How do we sell to retired also affected, in her constituency. There is only one such miners who are only just giving up their solid fuel area in Britain. Following my interventions, we have fires—some have still not done so—the concept of managed to get some regulations on this, and I believe alternative green technologies? I could do that in any of that the Secretary of State has indicated that there will the homes in my constituency; they are often little be more over the winter. bungalows. The way to do it is to stick in a solar panel for free and give those people free hot water. The retired Action is needed to end this scandal. It is a classic miners who dug the coal in my constituency would be example of what happens when we devolve power to the rather pleased to have free hot water. It might not be on lowest level. This place is full of former councillors who every day of the year—the experts can tell me that—but love everything being devolved to the local level. The for most of the year they would get free hot water, and problem is that we have these tiny district councils as the technology developed they would get more because no one has bitten the bullet and brought in than that. good-sized unitary authorities, which we should have To me, that is common sense, so why are we not doing across the country, including in my area, saving the it? We could be giving young people apprenticeships in taxpayer at least £200 a year on a band D property. If these new manufacturing technologies so that we are we had that system, my authority would have the ability the leader, pump-priming in the way that the Americans and money happily to take on Tunnel Tech in court but, long ago learned to use contract compliance, not least having lost £8 million in the Icelandic banks debacle with the armed services, to pump-prime manufacturing through its bad financial management, it is too terrified and new technologies. We should be doing the same. to take anybody to court about anything, so Tunnel That would be a more complex amendment, but the Tech gets away with it. This little authority is up against principle is simple—to get our manufacturing industry the big multinational, and it is terrified. The problem going with products that the public will see as common needs to be resolved, whether through regulation or the sense and as things that matter in everyday life. None of wise counsel of the Secretary of State or one of his my constituents would turn down free hot water—not Ministers. I do not suggest an entire Bill on mushroom one. That is where we should be taking these policies. If composting because, important though it is, it is perhaps we cannot manage to do that by amending the Bill, not the highest priority for the country at the current perhaps the opportunity will come with next year’s time—although it certainly is for those 1,000 residents. I Budget, if not the pre-Budget report. am looking for even more support from the Secretary of 471 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 472

[John Mann] Treasury moneys—but there is nothing more frustrating for someone when their house and their neighbours’ State. I congratulate him on his diligence in working on houses are flooded than to be told that it is a once-in- this over the past year, but we will need a final push to 100-year event when they can plot exactly when it last sort out the problem once and for all. happened. The change will be a major step forward, The House will be pleased to know that for the sake and I hope that the ministerial team will expand on it. of brevity I will not say too much about the issue of I have one more little suggestion for Ministers. A Warm Front, which I have raised over the past five years small number of schools have been flooded—I believe with the Secretary of State, his team, and his predecessors. that one in Tewkesbury may have been, and two in my Suffice it to say that the scandal of Warm Front contracts constituency were. There needs to be a better system for undermines, once again, the confidence of constituents ensuring that when a school floods, decisions on rebuilding such as mine in the whole concept of environmentalism. it are not just insurance fund-led. If they are, we get In theory, it is a brilliant scheme; in practice, half of it is cheap and cheerful patch-up jobs on the assumption a brilliant scheme, but the other half is racked with that the school could flood again. If it is in a floodplain, labour costs. I had a case this week, with constituents it either needs to be rebuilt higher up or moved slightly—not being charged £4,500 to put in one boiler and two to another village or another area, but in most cases it radiators. I can get tradesmen and tradeswomen to do will be possible to move it slightly. It may be difficult that for £900 or £1,000. My constituents expected to and expensive, but the power ought to exist for schools pay £1,000 of that £4,500. We will ensure that they do in particular, as they are the key public buildings most not, but the taxpayer is still paying £3,500 for that likely to be affected by flooding. A little amendment to simple little job. The scheme needs to be properly tightened the Flood and Water Management Bill would give up. I suspect that a Warm Front Bill will not emerge Ministers the power to intervene to override the natural from amendments that I attempt to introduce, but it tendency of those in officialdom to chase insurers remains a very important issue. immediately and replace like with like. That can be a weakness, and the power to intervene directly in such Bob Spink: While the hon. Gentleman is talking cases would be a wise addition to the Bill. about fuel poverty, will he address the problem of The huge omission from this debate, as it will be in prepayment meters? The electricity supply companies Copenhagen, is population. To my mind, there is no have done well so far, but they need to go a lot further. question but that the world cannot continue to expand Will he look to the Government to make further progress and expand its population. The notion that Britain can so that we remove the obscenity of the poorest people manage with an extra 10 million people living here is paying more for their electricity? nonsense. That has something to do with the immigration debate, but it is far more widespread than that. It is not John Mann: As ever, the hon. Gentleman makes an about the composition of the people here—I have no excellent point on behalf of his constituents, mine and problem with that, and the more diverse the better, in others. Those in private rented accommodation are many ways. However, the increasing number of people often ripped off the most, and I know that, as ever, and the requirements for housing and other services Ministers will be listening to his wise counsel. that go with it, if not irreversible over the centuries, is I echo most of the comments that the hon. Member irreversible within our lifetime and that of the next for Tewkesbury (Mr. Robertson) made on flooding. I generation. will not repeat them, but it was a superb contribution. I I do not want my constituency, rural Bassetlaw, to be recall sharing flood telephone conferences with him, a suburb of Doncaster or Sheffield, with ever more during which we pushed for and got a responsiveness housing stuck in for the so-called needed increase in from Government that we found admirable and a good population. I am an economist, and when I question example to Departments on how to respond in times of other economists such as those at the Monetary Policy crisis. Ministers should be congratulated on that. Committee and the Bank of England, they do not want I was delighted to hear the Secretary of State announce to discuss population. However, it is fundamental, and that the concept of speaking of floods as one-in-100-year we must consider where those people who move across or one-in-30-year happenings is to be changed. That the world are coming from. Our immigration is a trickle was a profound announcement, and I attempted to say compared with most countries in the world. There are something on it but my intervention was unfortunately huge population moves, sometimes led by war but more not taken. Perhaps we can tease out more of what it endemically led by food and water shortages. Those are means. Those numbers determine where flood defences the key factors that will determine where the wars of the and money go and what local authorities feel obliged to next 30 or 40 years will be. do, and they have a significant impact on the planning The British Mountaineering Council, of which I am process and decisions on where new houses and other an active member, is meeting today in this building, and buildings are unwisely built. one can examine the big mountains and glacier shrinkage My house was a little flooded on one occasion, but to see the impact on the environment. It is not just nowhere near as badly as my neighbours’ and other about the damage that has been done. One can map out people’s. Things change over time, and I have shipwreck where the water supply will not go when it is reduced, timbers from when the river came all the way up into and therefore where the next major wars will be. The Bassetlaw. The Pilgrim Fathers went to America on a Himalayas are the biggest area for the provision of boat from Bawtry. Planning for flooding clearly needs drinking water, so that is a frightening prospect. to be overhauled, and the change in the language used Population needs to be part of our equation. It is the will simply and easily create a new understanding. Of great unspoken, and not just in this country. It has an course it will not provide resources—that will require effect on consumables. One of my political opponents, a 473 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 474

Conservative, bemoaned the fact that I had raised locally have seen them for themselves. That is a strong point, the point that the situation could lead to the extinction because I saw both sides of the issue last week. On of animals that the world needs for the quality of our Thursday morning I was in Kendal as the River Kent life. A good example is that there are virtually no tigers was bursting its banks. On the Aynam road side of the left in the wild. That is a direct consequence of population river, one of the warehouses had been lent by its owners growth. What kind of world will it be if the animals that to Operation Christmas Child, which—as other hon. we see only on occasion, or through the BBC, disappear Members will be aware—is a project in which the because population has crowded them out? That is what community, especially local schools, works to put together is happening, at such a fast rate that there will be shoeboxes of Christmas presents for orphans in eastern nothing left for future generations. That is irreversible, Europe. That warehouse was right next to the river and and it should be at the heart of our thinking. was likely to flood within half an hour. I joined some My final point is about the new nuclear power stations. 25 to 30 people who were busily emptying about 10,000 Already, we are hearing that those responsible for one of those boxes into the back of a lorry so that they of them want to bring in foreign companies to do the could be driven to safety. We succeeded, which was build. In this country’s economy, far too much investment wonderful. I then walked down the road with a family has gone to the south and south-east, particularly London. who had been helping, and we were full of the spirit of I say to the ministerial team that with new nuclear camaraderie that difficult times engender. We reached build, British companies must get the vast majority of their house, which had just flooded, and the mood the contracts, so as to build skills in this country by changed instantly. They went from feeling that community using large numbers of apprentices and by upskilling spirit—which undoubtedly exists at such times, so much the existing work force. There should not be, as with so that it could almost be bottled, no pun intended—to Crossrail, American competition coming in, cherry-picking abject misery through being affected personally. the labour, leaving no skills benefit and damaging our It is important to pay tribute to that community economy because of it. We got it right on the Olympics spirit. When I was on the other side of the river, earlier and wrong on Crossrail, and for nuclear power stations in the day, at Edgecombe court—a block of sheltered it is vital that in the subcontracting we buy British. If flats—I was helping to move some of the residents to we do not, our manufacturing industry and much more higher floors. I expressed sympathy to them as we will rue the day. helped to move their stuff upstairs, but I was mostly slapped down, because as they said, they had lived 7.59 pm through a war and this was nothing. That spirit is prevalent throughout the county and we need to pay Tim Farron (Westmorland and Lonsdale) (LD): It is tribute to it. an honour to follow the hon. Member for Bassetlaw The Flood and Water Management Bill is late. We (John Mann) in what may be quite an important could have had it a year or two ago, but it will be moment—his castigation and denunciation of the Soviet welcomed throughout my constituency. After I had Union probably means that old Labour is now dead, been in Kendal on Thursday morning, I went up to and we should probably take a moment to think about Burneside. Many people will have seen the torrent there that. However, he made some good points. when the Kent burst its banks and rushed through As the remaining months of this Parliament go by, I people’s living rooms. Further up the road in Staveley, am sure that with my Front-Bench hat on I will have where the Gowan burst its banks and rising water levels time to engage with Ministers and other Front Benchers affected people living on Main street, the problems on issues in the Queen’s Speech, but today I shall could have been dealt with by some of the measures in restrict my remarks to my constituency, particularly at the Bill. this time when it has suffered from unprecedented flooding, like much of the rest of Cumbria. Many parts of my constituency remain under water and they are what we might call the tourist honeypots— When I listened to the Gracious Speech last week, I Bowness, Ambleside and other areas in central and paid particular attention—because of my brief and southern Lake district. As I left home yesterday morning, other interests—to the reference to the Flood and Water Lake Windermere was significantly bigger than usual. Management Bill, but I did not realise, whatever the It is the biggest lake in England, but it has a tiny drain forecast might have said, how personally involved I into the Leven to the south and it is taking longer to would become with that issue within 24 hours. Less empty. Many of the businesses in Bowness and Ambleside than 24 hours after Her Majesty had spoken, I was are still under water and they will need specific support waist deep in water in Kendal with my constituents. as they seek to recover. As I said in my question to the Secretary of State The impact is also high in places such as Backbarrow, during the statement yesterday—it is important to repeat where a bridge was lost, causing great inconvenience. it—PC Barker lost his life protecting the lives and safety The loss of so many bridges has not only been tragic, in of civilians. At times of difficulty like this, we always the case of PC Barker, and inconvenient, causing praise the emergency services, and we are right to do so. communication difficulties, but has meant the loss of We should not forget what risks they run at such times, important parts of our heritage, which have been literally and PC Barker’s tragic death underlines that. On behalf washed away. Earlier in the debate, we heard about of the whole House, I wish to express my immense people who expressed scepticism about climate change. sympathy and gratitude to his family, and indeed to the I just ask them to look around. Very few people in whole constabulary. Cumbria this evening will need much convincing that The hon. Member for Tewkesbury (Mr. Robertson), climate change is both real and the result of human who is no longer in his place, remarked that people do activity. The good news is that if we caused it, we can not really understand the issues of flooding until they solve it. As we look to mitigate and deal with climate 475 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 476

[Tim Farron] of the floods there. We were trying to deal with flooding that happens just about every fortnight, never mind change, we must keep in mind that common endeavour— once in a thousand years—flooding at a lower level in that wartime spirit evoked by the residents of Edgecombe Burneside, but nevertheless at an appalling level, because court—but we must also adapt. The Flood and Water it involves foul sewage as well as everything else. The Management Bill is part of that. response of United Utilities was, “We know what the While we have suffered immensely in south Lakeland, problem is. The problem is that the Kendal and Burneside we feel tremendous solidarity with our fellow Cumbrians drainage system is inadequate, but it is a low priority to in Cockermouth, Keswick, Workington and other parts us.” The Environment Agency representatives stood of the north and west of the county who have suffered there and sort of nodded. However, I do not want the even more in many cases. Like us, they refuse to be Environment Agency to stand next to United Utilities; I cowed by this devastation and are determined to rebuild want it to apply shoe leather up backsides to ensure that their communities, including residential properties, the those things get sorted out. The complacency of the communications network and businesses. water companies was shown up for what it was just six days later, when the residents in that area had to deal Christopher Fraser (South-West Norfolk) (Con): We with the devastation. all have sympathy for the hon. Gentleman’s story, but I also welcome the elevated role of local authorities, can he clarify his view of the Flood and Water Management as a potential consequence of the Flood and Water Bill? Does he agree with the Environment, Food and Management Bill. It is right that they should have single Rural Affairs Committee, which has been critical of the responsibility for the local flood risk strategy, but they Bill? It said: must also have the resources to do that job. One of the “The current draft is a confusing mix of measures, many of other success stories, as it were, in our area that we them poorly drafted; a patchwork that seeks to address individual would like to talk about is that in Kendal, even with a identified problems, rather than deriving from a coherent and deluge, say, a quarter of the size of the one that we have comprehensive strategy to implement the vision set out in ‘Future experienced in the past few days, the Sedbergh road Water’.” area would have been flooded and about 250 homes would have been under water. Indeed, with that particular Tim Farron: That is a fair intervention, and I agree deluge, I suspect that we would have had 500 to 700 that there is a lot wrong with the Bill. It is inadequate in properties under water. However, that area of Kendal many respects, but it is on the table and it is significantly did not flood because two years ago the local district better than nothing. We will scrutinise it throughout its council built the Stock beck flood relief system, which progress through this House, but we believe that it will has worked, even in this most dramatic of situations. be better for my constituents, for his and for the whole That came about after I chaired a meeting of about country if we end this Parliament with a Flood and 11 different agencies, sitting them round a table at the Water Management Bill on the statute book. I hope Castle Park primary school. It is wonderful what getting that it will be better than the one in front of us at the people sitting round a primary school table on those moment. low chairs with their knees underneath their chins can I shall give some reasons why the Bill would be a do to, let us say, interfere with their dignity and ensure positive step. The presence of a single co-ordinating that they address the issues. We banged heads together body across the country—it makes sense for that to be and ensured that a successful flood relief scheme the Environment Agency—will be a huge improvement. was built. There is far too much confusion and buck passing, and However, I do not want to go through the same not enough backside kicking, when it comes to preventing process every time. I want local authorities to have the flooding from happening and dealing with it when it power to make things happen, but money is power, and happens. One area of my constituency that thankfully they have to have the necessary resources. If the resources did not flood this time round is Grange-over-Sands, do not follow those powers, they will be absolutely although it often does flood in the Windermere road pointless. area. Fixing that problem is a nightmare, when the Environment Agency, local authorities, United Utilities, I look back on the experience of my constituents last Network Rail and others all pass the buck to each other, week. I talked to the Environment Agency earlier today no doubt because solving it would cost money. I want to about early warning. I appreciate that it has done a see a single entity that has the power, the authority and tremendous job these past few days and deserves praise the resources to knock heads together and ensure that for its work. Indeed, it has improved the standard of the we solve such problems. That single co-ordinating body warnings going out to people, but many of my constituents should have the muscle and the inclination to tackle either did not receive text message warnings at all, if such problems. I observed this morning that Severn they were on Aynam road, Lound road or any of the Trent Water was celebrating—or perhaps apologising streets off those roads in Kendal, or, in the case of for—record profits. I think of the record profits that Burneside, they received a text message six hours after United Utilities and other water companies have been, their homes had flooded. I understand that that is all shall we say, fortunate to amass, thanks to an infrastructure down to mobile communications and so on, but frankly paid for by the taxpayer—an infrastructure that is also we have to look at the issue in future, because that is not elderly, but which they have been far too complacent a good enough excuse. about. Also, although the generalised flood warnings put Again, it was an irony—or a coincidence; I do not out by the Environment Agency were excellent, timely know—but six days before the catastrophic floods last and accurate, we now have the know-how, particularly week, I was in Burneside with representatives of United in the national flood forecast centre, to give specific Utilities and the Environment Agency, at the epicentre targeted warnings to homes and businesses well in 477 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 478 advance to allow them to take the necessary precautions, I mentioned earlier that those areas in my constituency move furniture upstairs, evacuate if need be or sandbag that have been under most pressure, at least in the past themselves in to ensure that they do not get flooded couple of days, are, as it were, the business centres of at all. the south lakes area, particularly in Bowness, Windermere I am also concerned that the warnings are given only and Ambleside. It is worth pointing out that the tourism when homes or businesses are at risk of flooding because economy in Cumbria is worth £1.5 billion a year. To the of rivers bursting their banks, because the majority of Exchequer, therefore, it is worth some £500 million a the homes flooded in my constituency were flooded year. I spoke to a businessman friend of mine in Grange- because of surface water and ground water. All those over-Sands last night who told me that his takings in the things are just as predictable—or potentially predictable, past week had gone down by 90 per cent.—and that is using different models—but at the moment they are not in a town that has not flooded—because the general in the Environment Agency’s remit. That is wrong. I message being put about out there was that the Lake want to ensure that the Bill makes provision to put that district and Cumbria are closed for business. I want to in law, although they are things that can also be fixed take this opportunity to say that we are not. without legislation. I would like the Secretary of State If the Government are coming up with money—I to take steps towards addressing that right away, because would encourage them to come up with yet more funds we have the know-how to sort it out. to support us in this endeavour—they could spend that As other right hon. and hon. Members have mentioned money successfully and profitably by investing it in the this evening, we also need to be able to strengthen the marketing and development of the Lake district and hand of local authorities to say no to development on Cumbria brand over the next few weeks. Cumbria Tourism flood plains and in other flood-risk areas. I am absolutely has an annual budget of just £1 million per year—annual committed to developing new, affordable homes for budgets tend to be per year. That is clearly inadequate, local families, particularly in my area. It is a tragedy full stop, but it is absolutely inadequate for trying to that we have a waiting list of 5,000 people for council rebuild the reputation of a part of our country whose homes in social rented properties, but only 4,000 social economy has been enormously damaged by the devastation rented homes available. I will not go into why that might of the past few days. We need to be able to sell our be, but we all know the reasons why—the failed policies communities and our tourism product, especially in the of the past, shall we say? That is a tragedy, so I want run-up to Christmas, and we would appreciate some more social rented and other affordable homes built as financial support in order to do that. The Exchequer an urgent priority. However, I do not want the families would get more than its money’s worth if it were to who get those homes to be subject to almost instant invest £10 million or £20 million in marketing for Cumbria, misery because the houses have been built in areas because of the benefit to the Exchequer of tourism. where we will be dealing with flood risk year after year. I also want to emphasise the importance of the We surely have the capacity to deal with that in this day uplands. One of the reasons that Kendal did not flood and age. more seriously than it did was the work of the upland The hon. Member for Llanelli (Nia Griffith) talked farmers in the Kentmere valley. We need to look at the about the names of places where such developments role of the uplands in the retention and storage of flood have been built, perhaps giving away the fact that they waters. We have the fastest falling water in the country. should not have been built. My previous home in The source of the river Kent is only about 15 miles away Milnthorpe, before we moved to our current house, was from the sea, and it can fall extremely rapidly, as we built in a place called Grisleymire lane, which once won have seen in the past few days. It falls rapidly at the best a prize on “Nationwide” in the ’70s for having the of times. quirkiest name in the north-west. We were never flooded, but perhaps that is another story—it was probably We need to invest in the work that upland farmers do because the Kent silted up. to disperse and contain the waters in the uplands. They I have two more quick points to make arising from have done more than almost anyone else to protect our my experience these past few days. My great concern is towns and villages in Cumbria from flooding, yet they that residents and businesses will have their insurance are an endangered species. Only two weeks ago, Natural premiums hiked up or their excesses increased to the England released a report entitled “Vital uplands: Natural extent that, in reality, they will become uninsurable. We England’s vision for the upland environment in 2060”. need to put pressure on the insurance companies, now The reality is, however, that hill farming could be dead and in future, to ensure that that does not happen and by 2020 if we do not act soon. The average income for a we do not allow people to become effectively uninsurable. hill farm is £5,000 a year, and the average age of a hill My hon. Friend the Member for Cheltenham (Martin farmer is 59. You do not need to be a genius to work out Horwood) rightly pointed out earlier that there is a that that income base makes it unlikely that the profession principle of shared risk, and that must continue. If it will continue for much longer, yet the economic, does not, the whole principle of insurance is blown environmental and social value of those people in Cumbria away. is immense, and we need to support them and pay them I am also experiencing problems with residents, for the work that they do. particularly in Burneside, where private landlords are I pay tribute to the emergency services—the police, refusing to take the action that they need to take, on the the fire and ambulance services, the bay search and electrics and so on, to make homes habitable. Where rescue and mountain rescue teams, the coastguards, the homes belong to local social landlords, for example, it is Royal National Lifeboat Institution and all the others much easier to take action. I want there to be provision who have made such immense efforts over the past few for private landlords to be forced to take action to make days. It is important to point out that many of those homes habitable and to take reasonable steps to prevent agencies are voluntary in nature. In particular, the equipment future flooding. and vehicles that the mountain rescue service has been 479 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 480

[Tim Farron] 74 per cent. of people would take immediate action to change their lifestyles if they knew that that action using to save lives and protect and rescue people over would affect their children’s or grandchildren’s lives. We the past few days will have been paid for by voluntary have not always made the case for bringing climate donations. The service also has to pay VAT on those change down to the individual level or for making it donations, and pays vehicle excise duty. Across England absolutely clear to individuals and communities what and Wales, however, the cost to those volunteer mountain action can be taken in the home to help the Government rescue teams is less than £200,000 a year. If I could ask and others to tackle climate change. I also want to pay the Secretary of State for one additional thing—it would tribute to Climate Durham, an umbrella organisation not require any legislation—it would be to reimburse in my constituency that seeks to raise public awareness the mountain rescue teams that relative pittance of about climate change, and to make the link between the £200,000. So far, the Treasury has refused to do that, global issue and local and individual actions. but it would represent an immense vote of confidence I am also pleased that Government projects are and be seen as a thank you to the communities of supporting technological development, and we need to Cumbria that are struggling so manfully at this time. do much more of that. If we are to have the necessary energy and renewable energy sources for the future, we Several hon. Members rose— must keep investing in the technology. I am pleased that the north-east has recently received public investment Mr. Deputy Speaker (Sir Michael Lord): Order. Before not only to develop wind turbines and, critically, wind I call the next hon. Member to speak, may I inform the turbine manufacturing, but to extend the use of solar House that six other hon. Members are seeking to catch energy and further to develop photovoltaic cells. my eye. We have just over an hour left, so if everyone is The Government, as well as other bodies, have also going to get in, hon. Members will have to think about supported an interesting project in Teesside involving a the timing of their speeches. feasibility study to see whether household waste could be converted into an energy source. Just now, we are 8.23 pm awaiting news about whether the expansion of carbon Dr. Roberta Blackman-Woods (City of Durham) (Lab): capture and storage will be extended to the north-east. I am pleased to be able to speak in this debate on energy Of course, I make a special plea for that to happen. and climate change. These subjects are particularly Several Members have spoken today of the need for important as we approach the Copenhagen summit. If CCS. We know that we are going to continue to use coal we needed any reminder that Governments must act to as an energy source in this country and elsewhere for tackle climate change, surely witnessing the events of some time into the future, and it is therefore important the past week in Cumbria will confirm that. I want to that we have carbon capture and storage measures in join other hon. Members in expressing my sympathy for place to make coal a much greener energy source. the constituents of the hon. Member for Westmorland I particularly welcome the Energy Bill in the Gracious and Lonsdale (Tim Farron) and the other people of Speech and it is important for it to get through the Cumbria for what they have suffered in the past week. I parliamentary process in time. I am also pleased that also want to pay tribute to them for the fortitude with there are measures in the Energy Bill further to tackle which they are tackling the clean-up operation. fuel poverty. The Government have done much—they I am fortunate in having a number of projects in have gained little credit for it today—to reduce energy Durham that are seeking to remind people not only use through better insulation, which has been achieved about climate change but about the ways in which all through a number of measures. The obligation on energy communities can begin to take action to tackle it. Last suppliers, CERT—the carbon emissions reduction target— Friday, I attended an event in Durham organised by has helped insulate about 6 million homes already, and Professors Lena Dominelli and Phil Gilmartin and the scheme is being extended until 2012. other staff from the energy institute at Durham university. Warm Front, which has received some criticism in the That is an important institute, which receives funding Chamber today, has carried out extensive work in my from the Government and other bodies to develop new constituency. The number of households that have already green technology and to seek ways in which that technology been assisted is 4,691, with a further 991 households can be applied in the energy sector. The institute is receiving help with heating. The total value of that therefore very important for the future development of work is almost £4 million, which in the main has been green jobs in the north-east region and in the country as money well spent. A number of my constituents have a whole. It also does significant work to transfer technology been very pleased to receive extra insulation as well as, overseas. in some cases, a replacement boiler. We are extremely lucky to have the institute in Durham. Warm Front is also carrying out a project on income I am particularly pleased that its academic staff are maximisation, ensuring that people on low incomes get taking time out of their busy schedules to work with all the benefits to which they are entitled. I am pleased local businesses and community groups to make them that the scheme operates in my constituency. Nationally, aware of the measures that are readily available to be 2 million homes have been helped through Warm Front. used in homes to reduce energy use and to save money. A number of homes have also been updated with insulation The response from members of the local community to and new boilers through the implementation of the the measures described and made available to them was Government’s decent homes standard—again, not really positive. much mentioned today. In total, a very large number of That backs up the recent poll that was carried out for homes have already been helped to reduce their energy the Department for Energy and Climate Change, which costs through better insulation. I accept, however, that a found that, once the issues had been explained carefully, lot more needs to be done. 481 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 482

I hope that the Government will achieve the goal of I could go on, but what I am trying to make clear is carbon-neutral buildings very much in advance of their that the Gracious Speech contains a number of measures 2016 target for homes and their 2019 target for commercial that are genuinely necessary. I find it very disappointing premises. What we know about global warming and that Opposition Members have described a number of climate change presses us to take action to bring about those measures as a waste of time. I cannot see how carbon-neutral or carbon-zero homes and premises much legislation to fund care for the elderly, tackle fuel poverty, in advance of those dates. deal with child poverty and ban cluster munitions—let I am pleased that £10 million has been set aside for alone further measures to regulate the banks—can be a the low-carbon communities programme and the low- waste of time, and it is truly astonishing that it should carbon communities challenge. I am certainly pressing be described as such. my local authority to put in a bid in partnership with I am also dismayed by the fact that some Opposition our local communities for a slice of that fund. It is Members could do anything but accept that the Flood important to seek ways whereby local communities can and Water Management Bill is absolutely necessary. really look at what works best in the local area in Last Wednesday my Durham constituency was almost producing more sustainable communities. Although he flooded following a very serious series of floods in July. is not in his place at the moment, I pay tribute to my I believe that my constituents would be astonished that right hon. Friend the Member for Kingston upon Hull, so many Members have said—possibly outside the East (Mr. Prescott) for saying that sustainability is the Chamber—that the Bill is not necessary. I know that key issue for this century. I hope that the Government Northumbrian Water has done a huge amount to reduce will continue to press forward on all issues relating to the incidence of flooding in my constituency, but more sustainable communities. needs to be done, particularly in co-ordinating measures It is really important that the public sector takes the to prevent and deal with floods. I am therefore very lead in promoting and adopting measures to reduce pleased that the Bill was included in the Gracious climate change, but in fairness, the private sector has a Speech. huge role to play, too. I would like the private sector to I was—again—astonished to hear some Opposition do much more to bring about a reduction in energy Members say that they hoped that some of the Bills costs for my constituents and to produce exemplars of would be blocked in the House of Lords. I think that carbon-neutral buildings. We just have not seen enough that is absolutely dreadful: apart from anything else, it of them. In that regard, we should press the private undermines our democratic mandate. I hope that all sector as well as the public sector. Members will back the important measures in the Gracious I want to say a few brief words about Copenhagen. Speech. The press reports about it have been quite pessimistic, but I hope that other countries will follow the Prime 8.38 pm Minister’s lead not only in attending Copenhagen, but in actively pursuing a new global deal on reducing Mr. Hugo Swire (East Devon) (Con): I shall be astonished carbon emissions. This really is the key issue of our if some of these rehashed announcements and Bills go time. anywhere in the time left to the Government. In fact, I While I am on my feet, let me briefly speak about a share the astonishment expressed by the hon. Member few other measures in the Gracious Speech that I believe for City of Durham (Dr. Blackman-Woods), but it is are worthy of mention. I am very pleased that the not astonishment about the cynicism of the Opposition; Government are at last considering the difficult issue of it is astonishment about what was not in the Queen’s social care and are seeking to bring forward the personal Speech. care at home Bill. That will mean that, from October, I find myself—unusually—slightly agreeing with the more than 275,000 of those with the greatest needs will leader of the Liberal Democrats, the right hon. Member be protected from charges and top-up fees for care in for Sheffield, Hallam (Mr. Clegg). I am not at all sure their own homes. I hope that everyone will get behind that there was need for a Queen’s Speech at this stage. that measure. From where I am standing, and from the viewpoint of I am also pleased that we are getting to the final the part of south-west England that I represent, there stages of the Equality Bill and it looks as though it seems to be little in the speech that relates to us. It is not might manage to get through the parliamentary process. surprising that, in responding to a recent ICM poll, a It will introduce a new public sector duty to narrow the sizeable majority—66 per cent.—said that the Government gap between rich and poor. It is a radical measure, and I cared more about issues affecting urban people than find it disappointing that the policy that it represents about those affecting people in the countryside. Everything has received so little attention from the media. It is that I have seen in the Queen’s Speech only goes to critically important, because it makes clear that we will support that. Given the number of vegans on the be serious about reducing inequality. It will also ban age Government Front Bench, I suppose I should be grateful discrimination outside the work force, and will introduce that Devon’s cow population did not come in for an reporting on gender pay in the case of large employers. attack on carbon emissions. The agency workers regulations will ensure that agency I should say in all fairness that, in the run-up to workers are given treatment equal to that given to Copenhagen and following the recent tragic events in permanent staff when they have been employed for Cumbria, it is right in a sense that we have concentrated 12 weeks. The Cluster Munitions (Prohibitions) Bill will on flooding and flood prevention. However, the debate implement in United Kingdom law the convention on has been interesting in other respects. In my view, the cluster munitions, which bans the use, development, best contribution so far—I say this in a non-partisan production, stockpiling, retention and transfer of cluster way—has come from a former Minister, the right hon. munitions. Member for Croydon, North (Malcolm Wicks). He 483 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 484

[Mr. Hugo Swire] has very few designated areas that are in rural England because fuel poverty is so dispersed in rural areas. It talked of energy security, which is or should be of real is dispersed and disguised and we need to do more concern to us all. I wonder whether the Secretary of about that. State could let us know when the right hon. Gentleman’s On flooding, it is heart-wrenching to hear the reports report to the Prime Minister will be available to us and from Cumbria. I can empathise somewhat; we have had whether there will be a copy in the Library; indeed, similar problems in my part of the world. Indeed, on whether there will be an opportunity to debate what I the river Dart we had the tragic death recently of the believe to be an extremely serious issue. canoeist Chris Wheeler, to whose family I send my The Government have had 12 years—it is difficult to condolences. I welcome the Flood and Water Management believe some times—to deal with energy security. We Bill. The draft Bill needs some attention and there are have heard that France, by law, must have 125 days’ some things in it that we need to debate and change but worth of gas holdings. We have less than 15 days. it is timely; indeed it is overdue. I was with the Environment Germany has 99 days; last year we were down to as little Agency a few days ago in Devon where we were looking as four days. That is irresponsible and clearly unacceptable. at maintaining banks. Its representatives were telling me We have heard about the energy deficit. Even if we about how it was encouraging farmers and landowners pressed the start button tomorrow, no nuclear power to undertake deeper ploughing—another practice that station could be built until 2017. Yet I believe that the has gone by the wayside in recent years—in order to try Government are not doing enough to explore the finite and hold deeper water. Whatever happens, there will be resources—they are still there but are more difficult to a trade-off between the farmers, the landowners and get at now—in the North sea. I would welcome the the EA, because we cannot just flood huge areas without Secretary of State’s comments about whether the compensation and discussion; that needs to take place if encouragement given to drilling companies to explore things are to work at all. in the North sea is going as it should be. The south-west has the second highest number of We heard about alternative energy and tidal wave properties at significant risk of flooding, with 86,000 power. There is a very good project in Plymouth financed under threat. I agree with the chairman of the EA, Lord by the South West of England Regional Development Smith, who said: Agency to have a tidal wave power machine put off “More people have lost their lives from flooding than have Hayle in Cornwall. It has not happened yet and it is a from terrorism in England.” wonderful and exciting piece of technology, but we We therefore must take flooding extremely seriously. should not be relying on a piece of technology that remains unproven. The emergency services have done excellent work in the last few days, and I pay tribute to them; they do a We have heard about offshore wind farms. I am very magnificent job time and again. I am, however, concerned keen on offshore wind farms but I remind the Secretary about preventive aspects in relation to flooding, the of State that we have just had the Marine Bill. In co-ordination of different Departments, and the amount Committee I asked how we brought onshore the energy of money that is spent in different areas. We have heard generated by tidal wave power. My hon. Friend the today, in a completely non-political way from Members Member for Beckenham (Mrs. Lait) mentioned judicial on both sides of the House, of the continuing concern review in terms of the new generation of nuclear power about England being concreted over. In my part of the stations. I think there will be judicial review every single world, there is concern about the proposed new development time we try to extend the national grid and bring in of Cranbrook near Rockbeare, as that will arguably be these wires to highly sensitive areas. built near, or adjacent to, a floodplain. It may not have It is clear that the UK is still lagging behind in the use flooded for many years, but given the way the climate is of alternative technologies. We do not have enough changing and its unpredictability, is it wise, as part of a electric charging points, particularly in the capital city. regional spatial strategy—something we are committed We are lagging well behind Japan and the US in investing to getting rid of—to build a brand-new town if there in new green technologies. We should be doing more to is any question of it being subjected to flooding at deal with battery disposal. any time? I urge the Secretary of State to go the United Arab We are miles behind other countries in terms of the Emirates, if he has not done so; I declare an interest as housing we build. In the low countries, such as the the chairman of the all-party group. In Masdar, they Netherlands, houses on stilts and houses that can float are seeking to create the first carbon-neutral city and to are being built. It is difficult to believe that we might attract other high technology industries there. They are need to look at what other countries are doing, but we doing some incredibly good work from which we could clearly do. I would welcome hearing the Secretary of learn. State’s views on how far we will need to go down that I do not want to detain the House as others want to road to address not the problems of today, but the get in, but I want to talk about fuel poverty and flooding. unpredictable problems of tomorrow. On the Energy Bill, the Government have said that they I shall end by making a plea on behalf of my part of will give a greater amount of help to the poorest and the world. This ties in with climate change, and trying most vulnerable. But they said already that they would to get people around the place in an environmentally end fuel poverty by 2016. How will they reach that sustainable way, and trying to get the local economy target given that nearly one in four households—16,000 going. If I had sufficient time, I would like to address households—in East Devon is currently in fuel poverty? many of the myriad other issues that plague those of us The Government’s current schemes give very little help who live in rural areas, but I shall, for now, make a plea to rural areas. The community energy saving programme about Devon’s roads. We have a lot of them: we in 485 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 486

Devon have 8,000 miles of roads to maintain—3,000 Population and the environment are closely related, more miles than any other authority. It is a huge road but the links between them are complex and varied, and network. We beat the Liberal Democrats to win Devon they depend on specific circumstances. The key policy county council in the local elections in May. In the questions must be how to use available resources of run-up to the election, the Liberal Democrats pledged land, energy and water to produce food and shelter for £2 million to fill potholes, but nobody will be surprised all, how to promote economic development and end to learn that when the Tories won and looked at the poverty so that everyone can afford to eat and, in doing books, we found that there was absolutely no provision so, how to address the human and environmental at all for spending money on filling in the potholes. This consequences of industrialisation, energy consumption is a huge issue for Devon’s economy. Almost 8,000 miles and the loss of biodiversity. of roads are enormously vulnerable to environmental Understanding the ways in which population and the change. They are vulnerable to flooding, for example, as environment are linked means examining not only how they get washed away on a regular basis. I ask the affluence, consumption, technology and population growth Secretary of State to bear in mind Devon’s special interrelate, but previously ignored social concerns such situation when it comes to the maintenance and repair as gender roles and relations, political structures and of our vital infrastructure. governance at all levels. The relationship between the I welcome certain measures in the Queen’s Speech, environment, population and social development is now although some of them have been announced before. much better understood and there is broad agreement However, if we take out flooding, there is very little for on the means and the ends. The Copenhagen summit is the rural communities, who have felt abandoned for so our opportunity to implement those means and to long by this Government. That is the case even in achieve the ends. Achieving equal status between men respect of the Bill on communications. At first sight, it and women, guaranteeing the right to reproductive looks as though it is legislation health, and ensuring that individuals and couples can “to ensure communications infrastructure that is fit for the make their own choices about family size will also help digital age”. to slow population growth rates and reduce the future Some of us thought that might mean that we would size of the world population through choice. When finally get broadband access in remote and rural areas, given choice, women tend to have fewer children than but it transpires that this is in fact a new enthusiasm of their mothers did; they want more for their children, Lord Mandelson that is more to do with copyright but not necessarily more children. protection than extending and rolling out the broadband Among other things, slower population growth in network, which was promised years ago by Tony Blair, developing countries will contribute measurably towards but which has not materialised in many areas. relieving environmental stress and promote sustainable Tonightshould be about Copenhagen and about flooding, development. I do not believe that there can be sustainable however. Again, I express my sympathies to the people development unless women are in charge of their own of Cumbria, but please let us not forget that we in fertility.The programme of action of the 1994 international Devon have tremendous problems ahead of us, and we conference on population and development was agreed need a Government who are prepared to support us. by 179 countries and there was a consensus that there should be universal access to reproductive health by 2015. Last year, the United Nations finally agreed that 8.50 pm that should be a new millennium development goal Chris McCafferty (Calder Valley) (Lab): I apologise target under MDG 5, which relates to maternal health. for not being in my place at the beginning of the debate, We are so far adrift on that MDG that the Prime Mr. Deputy Speaker. I did apprise the Speaker of my Minister has said that we are not likely to achieve it being unavoidably detained by a Minister of the Crown. until 2165 at the present rate. My right hon. Friend the Member for Kingston upon Changes in the size, rate of growth and distribution Hull, East (Mr. Prescott), who, unfortunately, is not in of human populations have an enormous impact on the his place, talked about the centrality of social justice environment and on development prospects. We know and sustainability to the debate in Copenhagen. He was that people and human activity are altering the planet right to do so, and I intend to talk a little more about on an unprecedented scale. More people are using more those issues. It has taken a long time for us to recognise resources with more intensity and leaving bigger footprints that local decisions have a global impact, but it has on the earth than ever before. That is borne out by become impossible to ignore the reality. Humans have statistics that 10 years ago were just a matter for conjecture. always changed and been changed by the natural world, We have increasingly seen hurricanes, landslides and but the prospects for human development now depend floodwaters. I want to add my expressions of sympathy on our wisdom in managing that relationship. to the people of Cumbria. The hon. Member for As my hon. Friend the Member for Bassetlaw (John Tewkesbury (Mr. Robertson) talked about how difficult Mann) said—unfortunately, he is not in his place either— it is to imagine the devastation that floodwaters bring. one of the key factors will be population. I think he Unless one has seen it, it is inconceivable. I know that might have said that that is the elephant in the room—well, because we have suffered immense flood trauma over I like elephants! The global human population has many years in my constituency. I want to thank our more than doubled since 1960, with the growth mostly Government for investing £40 million in five phases of taking place in the poorer countries, but consumption the flood defence work in the upper Calder valley that expenditure has more than doubled since 1970, with the has made an immeasurable difference to the people who increases mostly occurring in the richer countries. During live there. It is not just about homes, but about jobs. In a this time, we have created unimaginable wealth, yet half semi-rural area such as mine, we cannot afford to lose the world still exists on less than $2 a day. one job. When companies are constantly flooded, they 487 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 488

[Chris McCafferty] to my question on 5 November. Therefore, I ask the Government to take a lead at the Copenhagen conference, think twice about whether they want to remain and to as international agreements and national policies on keep investing in the local area. I am very grateful for climate change are much more likely to succeed in the that investment and I have to say that every time there long run if they take into account population dynamics, are flood warnings, we hold our breath. This time, we the relationships between the sexes and women’s well-being held our breath and the flood defence system worked. and access to reproductive health services and opportunities. Not one single home has been flooded. I hope that the Government will take advantage of their I also want to congratulate the Government on making lead position in the world on these issues to do just that. it possible for the Environment Agency to do riparian work on the banks of rivers where it was unable to do so 9pm in the past. Of course, absentee or unknown owners meant that riverbanks were not reconstructed, and that Mr. Brian Binley (Northampton, South) (Con): I just added to the dilemma. That was certainly the case want to raise the issue of the strategic balance of our in my constituency, where there is a confluence of two future energy policy, which I feel that we have got rivers and a canal to boot, as well as some very steep-sided wrong, but I shall first pose three questions. First, does hills. Now that the Environment Agency can search out our strategy for a low-carbon economy, which places those landlords and retro-charge them, that is making a such a heavy burden on the nation, put too much big and important difference in my area. emphasis on alternative energy sources to the detriment of a robust and sensible approach to fossil fuels? Secondly, We know that wet areas are becoming much wetter has politically correct thinking forced both the EU and and dry areas are becoming dryer. El Niño and the the Government to create a strategy incapable of achieving Asian monsoon are becoming more extreme and its built-in targets? Thirdly, will we be able to produce unpredictable. Inevitably, areas that are already affected the energy that we need to keep the lights on and the by famine will be growing less food while many of the country working? richer lands will grow more. Many continental coastlines are also at risk and contain much larger populations. Those are the questions that we should ask of our These regions are already home to half of the world’s future energy mix and the strategy that we are using to population and they have population growth rates that achieve it, so let us look at the facts. On 26 June, the are double the global average. Prime Minister unveiled the Government’s strategy for building a low-carbon economy. It involves building It is very clear that the activities of the 20th century 7,000 wind turbines, 4,000 on land and 3,000 offshore, have set us on a collision course with the environment. by 2020. In addition, there is to be a mix of microgeneration, We now have to decide what we can and what we must tidal and wave power and other forms of alternative do about it. The British are well known for our ingenuity, energy. which has got us a long way in the past. I welcome the Government’s thinking out of the box on climate change, The strategy will be expensive. The Climate Change especially with the low-carbon transition plan. We need Act 2008 will cost Britain £18 billion a year, or £720 for to concentrate on how we can apply that ingenuity in every household in the country from now until 2050. the future so as to ensure the well-being of human That is quite a price, and it must produce a viable populations while still protecting the natural world. return. I am delighted to say that nuclear power will How can we protect and promote fundamental values figure prominently in Britain’s future energy mix. I such as the right to health and human dignity while welcome that, but I am deeply concerned about the role providing for sustainable development at the same time? that wind power will play. We know that sustainable development is based on a We all know that onshore wind power is pretty universally balance between the three pillars of economic development, disliked. I do not know whether that is true in the social development and environmental protection. As Secretary of State’s constituency, but it is pretty true in my right hon. Friend the Member for Kingston upon most of the constituencies that I go to. More importantly, Hull, East said earlier, development cannot be sustainable onshore wind power is the section of the strategy that without social justice. many people think is unworkable. It is certainly massively While the rich 20 per cent. of the world’s population expensive, and some say that it simply panders to the consume 80 per cent. of the world’s resources at a fashionable end of the green lobby. completely unsustainable rate, some 3 billion people The strategy is, at heart, a built-in conflict between struggle to survive on less than $2 dollars a day without renewable and non-renewable energy.The balance between adequate access to education, health care, food, water, the two is out of kilter and needs to be reassessed sanitation, shelter, decent employment or, as we heard quickly. Many experts have stated that we will never be earlier, clean energy sources—or, ultimately, to a liveable able to build the 7,000 turbines by the target date. environment. Poverty must be acknowledged as a serious Whether we have the available construction capacity is threat to humanity and our planet and the fact that doubtful, as is whether there is the political will to allow many children and their children will be condemned to the challenge to be met. Even if we did manage to build a life of abject poverty, starvation, illiteracy and ill the turbines—and, given the time frame, offshore turbines health is inhuman, unjust and unacceptable in the will be a particular problem—they will not produce the 21st century. energy that we will need when we need it and at a cost Finally, it is widely acknowledged that this country is that we will want to pay. We must face up to that a world leader in family planning and sexual and problem. reproductive health rights. Population is definitely an The second problem with regard to wind is that issue in relation to climate change, as my right hon. Britain will still require considerable conventional electricity Friend the Secretary of State acknowledged in his reply generating back-up, as wind fluctuations mean that 489 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 490 turbines often have spells when they produce little electricity. gets worse: Britain is likely to carry a disproportionate “Peak demand” means exactly what it says. It is no cost of meeting the EU’s 2020 renewables target. Indeed, good telling industry to wait until the wind picks up. Pöyry Energy Consulting has estimated that the UK International business waits for no man and will soon will carry between 20 and 25 per cent. of the total EU go elsewhere if we fail to deliver on time. cost of meeting a Europe-wide renewables target. That Is back-up a real problem? Mr. Paul Golby, chief works out at between £150 and £200 per household executive of E.ON UK, has stated that we should per year. require conventional back-up capable of producing To sum up, we probably will not be able to build the 90 per cent. of wind turbine capacity. What is the point target number of wind turbines; in any case, they would of that? It is like having 10 subs on the subs’ bench, all not produce the energy required, and even without the of equal ability to the players on the pitch. Very few much-needed back-up capacity, they would cost us all a football teams can afford to do that— great deal of money. No wonder industry and commerce are concerned. The lights could go out, and Britain’s Edward Miliband: Chelsea. energy prices will be higher and less competitive. Industry and commerce will find it harder to sell their goods and Mr. Binley Except Chelsea; the Secretary of State is services abroad. absolutely right. It can afford to do so because it is so What should we do? First, we must not shy away flush with Russian oil money that it is untrue. A good from fossil fuels, but should concentrate on making example! them carbon-free. Secondly, we must invest in the long-term We face another problem: the closure of much of the development of nuclear fusion. I am delighted that the current electricity generating capacity over the next Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change has 10 to 15 years. Most of our nuclear power stations, and found such enthusiasm for clean coal, because I genuinely half our coal-fired power stations, are due to be think that it is a real alternative. My concern, however, decommissioned, thanks to the EU’s large combustion is that we are not moving quickly enough. That is the power directive, which is about controlling emissions. general thrust of my argument. I plead with him to find Consequently, we will not have the resources to provide ways of moving on the whole clean coal agenda more adequate, conventional back-up capacity, despite the quickly. He has a problem with wind turbines—there is Government’s welcome acceptance of the need for nuclear no doubt about that—and we need to find a sensible power and the onset of new gas-fired capacity. The replacement, which is sitting underneath our feet, and required back-up just will not be there, and that makes will fulfil 300 years of energy need, provided that we nonsense of the Government’s reliance on wind turbines can create the technology in time to make it viable. for such a sizeable proportion of the nation’s energy That is where I want to end. I have a great deal of requirement. respect for the way in which the Secretary of State has Why not allocate more resources to nuclear power? changed the whole focus of our energy policy, and I The simple but disturbing answer is that that would not believe that he is committed, as I said earlier, to the be permitted under the EU’s 2008 renewable energy concept of clean coal. I simply urge him to put more directive, wherein Britain has agreed to meet 15 per effort, energy and resources—perhaps by shifting some cent. of its energy consumption from renewable sources of the resource that has gone into fashionable wind by 2020. We could have fought our corner, and battled turbines—into developing clean coal more quickly. The against the nonsense, but perhaps the Government hoped payback for Britain will be considerably greater, and it that the previous Prime Minister would become President is one way—just one way—in which we might escape of the EU, and so did not want to rock the boat. Who the lights going out. knows what the reason is? The Government certainly did not fight the issue. In fact, many experts now tell them that on the question of wind power, they have got 9.11 pm it wrong. Mr. Mike Weir (Angus) (SNP): Many hon. Members have expressed sympathy for the people of Cumbria in Martin Horwood: Will the hon. Gentleman join the the recent floods, and I associate myself with that. Liberal Democrats in supporting a European super-grid, However, may I also point out that other areas have which could connect this country to Scandinavian hydro been affected, not least the south-west of Scotland, power, for instance? That would be an extremely flexible which just shows that the effects of climate change do back-up in the case of any intermittency that he might not respect boundaries? Indeed, I saw on “Reporting find in wind power, and it is entirely clean and renewable. Scotland” the other night that the constituency office of Of course, it would require a certain amount of European the hon. Member for Dumfries and Galloway (Mr. Brown) co-ordination, with which he might not be entirely was flooded. comfortable . The most important issue facing the Department of Energy and Climate Change is the Copenhagen summit Mr. Binley: The Front-Bench spokesman for the Liberals and the need to reach agreement. I have to confess that I consistently tries to take every opportunity to thrust his have become increasingly concerned about the outcome, party’s policy down our throat, but I have a better especially if a deal is not made or if the issue is fudged alternative, and I will tell him what it is in a minute. at a future summit. That may well be the political We have made a commitment to increase our renewables reality, but I fear that there is a serious risk of a sense of share massively, with the consequence that, with the hopelessness taking root in the face of climate change. I exception of Malta and Luxembourg, we are faced with was interested to note that the recent HSBC climate the toughest target in the whole EU. One wonders what confidence monitor reported not that people did not Malta and Luxembourg have done to deserve that. It believe in climate change but that a significant percentage 491 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 492

[Mr. Mike Weir] it also presents us with a huge challenge. So many people are employed in the oil and gas sector that we did not believe that there was anything that we could do need to manage that transition carefully and ensure that about it. If that attitude becomes more prevalent, it the skills developed in the North sea are retained and points to serious difficulties ahead. transferred to new jobs in the new economy. We are We have spent many years, however, telling people presented with the challenge of turning carbon jobs that we need to make a deal at Copenhagen. If world into green jobs. leaders suddenly decide that it is not urgent and that it For the foreseeable future, as has been said by others, can wait for another year, what sort of message does fossil fuels will still play a considerable part in our that send out to the peoples of the world? However it is economy. We note in our report that more than dressed up, it will be a serious setback for acceptance of 30 billion barrels of oil equivalent have been produced the need for strong action to tackle climate change. The over the past 40 years and a considerable amount Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change remains in the North sea. Witnesses said that between rightly pointed out that we need to discuss the costs of 11 billion and 37 billion barrels remain, which is a climate change—and, I would add, we must take the significant amount of oil, whichever figure one takes. opportunity to do so. Out in the country, there is very little appreciation of what an 80 per cent. reduction in Mr. Angus MacNeil (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (SNP): emissions means, so there is a huge need for education, Cash transferred to London— because it will have a serious impact on our economy and way of life. I am convinced that most people do not Mr. Weir: Indeed. Exactly how much oil is recoverable understand the full impact. will depend on a number of factors, not least the world On other aspects of the Energy Bill and how they price of oil. relate to the low-carbon economy, I fully support the Bill’s aims of tackling fuel poverty and creating funding Mr. MacNeil: Will my hon. Friend give way? for carbon capture and storage. It makes positive moves towards helping people in fuel poverty, including the Mr. Weir: I am sorry. Time is short. mandatory introduction of social tariffs, which have Setting the fiscal regime will be extremely important. long been argued for. Yet again, one group of fuel-poor The oil industry is very concerned about what may have been omitted—those who are not on the gas mains come out in the pre-Budget report. It urged Ministers to and who rely for heating either on liquefied petroleum argue with their colleagues in the Treasury that we need gas or on heating oil. I, and many other hon. Members a proper regime to ensure that we get the development who represent rural constituencies, have long argued for of the area west of Shetland, where new thinking may action on that. An inquiry by the Office of Fair Trading well be necessary if development is to go ahead on a unfortunately did not produce a positive outcome, but major scale. it is a serious issue. There is a great deal of fuel poverty It became clear in the course of our report that there in rural areas, and we need to find a solution. I urge are serious concerns also about finance for the North Ministers to look at it again, to see whether we can sea, a point that I made in an intervention. The big come up with something to help that group. companies will always get finance—it is not a problem As I pointed out in an intervention, although there is for the likes of Shell or BP—but many of those working provision for information to be passed on, a data-sharing in the North sea are much smaller companies operating project is still in its early stages. I was interested in what in smaller fields. Many of them are experiencing difficulty the Secretary of State said about introducing regulations with finance, even from our state-run banks. in the next week, and I look forward to seeing them. We were told in the course of our investigation that I welcome the provisions in the Bill to amend the of the major UK banks, only Lloyds HBOS, or whatever powers of Ofgem. I have had many vigorous discussions it now calls itself, operates in the North sea. It became with it in my years in the House on many aspects of its clear that the bank was lending only to existing customers work. I am particularly pleased to see that at long last and was not prepared to lend to new entrants into the competition will not be its sole guiding light. In reaching market. That is a serious barrier to exploiting the riches its decisions, Ofgem must take into account both security of the North sea. of supply and climate change. From my experience, I A further important point concerns the infrastructure. suspect that to put this into practice will require a Much of it is ageing—it has been there a long time—and significant change of culture at Ofgem. I hope Ministers decommissioning is an issue. That may create a great will push for that at the earliest opportunity. The current deal of work, but there is also the problem of the use of culture is amply illustrated by reported attempts by that infrastructure if we are to make carbon capture Ofgem in effect to undermine proposals for a feed-in and storage work. As well as getting it working in the tariff. I look forward to debating those issues in Committee. coal stations onshore, we have to find a way of storing As an MP for the north-east of Scotland, I want to captured gas. The obvious place for storage is the depleted say something about the oil and gas industry, which is oil and gas fields and the aquifers under the North sea. very important to my area. Ministers will be aware that To do that, we have to retain the existing structure to the Select Committee on Energy and Climate Change enable us to pump the gas out to the North sea. We recently produced a report which brought out some must have a fiscal regime that allows the companies that interesting issues on the future of that industry. We are are no longer using much of that structure for its clearly in a state of transition as we work towards a original purpose to maintain it to ensure that it is low-carbon economy. The existence of oil and gas off available for carbon capture and storage. Again, I urge our shores puts us in an enviable position in some Ministers to make that important point to their Treasury respects as we have a cushion during that transition, but colleagues. 493 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 494

The Energy Bill includes much about carbon capture and the stability of fuel supplies from the Gulf region. and storage, and Ministers have told us today that we However, I urge caution on that paradigm. The former are world leaders in it. I have talked many times in this Minister described imported gas from Norway as good, House about the Peterhead project. It would have given democratic, human rights gas. He did not describe what us world leadership in CCS, but, because of this imports from Russia or Qatar would be, but the House Government’s typical dithering, we lost it, and it is no understood the implication. I urge caution on automatically longer true to say that we are world leaders in CCS. regarding as inherently unstable imported energy from Ministers talked about the potential to export it to any country other than a stable western European developing countries, and that may well be true, but the democracy. Library has produced an interesting note on CCS. It The House should not forget that during the deepest, considers what is happening in other countries and darkest days of the cold war, when millions of troops states that China has one of the world’s few commercial and missiles faced each other across central Europe, the CCS operations, at Huaneng Beijing co-generation power USSR still supplied gas for central and western Europe. plant. China is, in fact, ahead of us in many ways, and, In fact, Russia, formerly as the Soviet Union, has unless we move quickly and get CCS working, rather proved itself to be an extremely stable supplier of gas, than exporting technology to developing countries, we notwithstanding the recent dispute with Ukraine, which may have to buy it in. has more to do with internal politics going back to We have heard a lot about people who complain pre-Soviet Union days than with Russia’s wider approach about wind farms. My good friend, the hon. Member to using its domestic energy resources for geopolitical for Northampton, South (Mr. Binley), talked about gain. that, and there are difficulties with many such sources, Much more immediately, energy security is about the so we cannot assume that there will not be difficulties resilience of the UK’s downstream infrastructure. It is with CCS. A few months ago, I, along with other about the vulnerability that was highlighted in 2000, members of the all-party offshore oil and gas industry and at intervals since then, in supplies of refined products group, visited a CCS project run by Total in Pau, as a result of blockades or industrial action at oil southern France. All over the surrounding countryside, refineries, leading to panic buying and shortages of there were large signs protesting against the development petrol and diesel on forecourts. It is about the resilience of CCS in that area, so that is something else to worry of the supply network in the face of events such as the about and another reason to move fast, to get the work explosion at the Buncefield depot, although the supply under way and to ensure that we have CCS. Only with network coped very well with that disastrous event. that will we be able to develop our coal resources, create More fundamentally, it is about human error and technical jobs by linking coal with existing North sea infrastructure failure. Keeping the lights on is as much about bringing and ensure that we have clean energy and do not need to new capacity on stream in a timely way as it is about rely on the disaster that is nuclear power. geopolitical developments. Of course, energy security is also about how well the internal EU gas market functions. 9.22 pm Recent cold winters have demonstrated that it does not Mr. Stephen Crabb (Preseli Pembrokeshire) (Con): It currently function in a way that is particularly helpful is a privilege to participate in what has been a popular for the UK. The Government should be disappointed and very interesting debate. I begin by trying to strike a that they have not achieved more in encouraging European note of empathy and understanding with the Government counterparts to move forward faster with liberalising Front Benchers, because the past 12 years have, indeed, the gas markets. thrown up a complex, dynamic and changing energy The most profound shift that has occurred during the scenario to which Ministers, policy makers and regulators past 12 years in the lifetime of these recent Labour have had to respond. At times, the challenges have Governments has been the emergence of the climate appeared extremely difficult, and the UK faces a number change agenda—a game-changing issue—and the rise of specific and profound tests. of the imperative to reduce the growth of, and if possible In an excellent speech, the former Minister, the right reverse, the amount of carbon emissions into the hon. Member for Croydon, North (Malcolm Wicks), atmosphere. That has been a major shift in the backdrop described very well one of the biggest shifts in the past against which Ministers have had to frame policy. I 12 years. He explained how the UK has moved from empathise with and understand the challenges that Ministers being largely self-sufficient in energy to being increasingly have been up against, which include dealing with the reliant on imports. I shall not rehearse all the data to drivers of energy policy, market efficiency, security of which he referred, but he described them very well. I supply, climate change, and fuel poverty. Those elements shall, instead, draw the House’s attention to the change do not always hang easily together, and sometimes they in the gas situation, because the move to import reliance conflict, so coherent policy making in this environment has been very pronounced, and this year the UK will is no easy task. However, there my sympathy with probably rely on imported sources for about 30 per Ministers ends. As my hon. Friend the Member for cent. of its gas requirements. The UK relies on imported Tunbridge Wells (Greg Clark) said, some of the changes sources for about two thirds of its domestic coal that we have been discussing were entirely predictable; requirement. indeed, they were predicted many years ago. Linked to increased import reliance is, of course, A more purposeful and courageous Government could energy security, and in this country that issue has received have made much more progress on these issues during more attention in recent years than at any time since the the past 12 years. During that period, what was required pre-North sea oil days. The right hon. Gentleman’s was stable, coherent policy making, strong departmental speech typified how, for some, energy security has a leadership, and clear and predictable signals going to strong geopolitical dimension: it is about Russian pipelines the marketplace and to industry. What have we had 495 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 496

[Mr. Stephen Crabb] are frankly delusional. We can look around the world and see what other countries have been doing on CCS instead? We have had 15 Energy Ministers averaging a technology. The hon. Member for Angus (Mr. Weir) span of nine months each in office. We have had two mentioned Total’s work in Pau in France and the work White Papers and a huge number of consultations and in China, and we could mention what Exxon is doing in reviews. We have had departmental changes, with the Wyoming in the USA. The Government should be far alphabet soup of DTI, DBERR and DECC. We have more modest and say that we need to work in partnership had spectacular policy U-turns, most fundamentally on with other countries to bring forward CCS technology new nuclear build and on whether new coal-fired power and make it commercially viable. We are in no position stations should be given the go-ahead without being to say that we will be leading the way, because we will carbon capture ready. The past 12 years have been need to work in close co-operation with other countries. wasted, characterised by delays, policy confusion, and The very first parliamentary briefing note that I read the lack of courage of a Government who have at times after being elected in 2005 was one produced by the talked the talk, with good language about the need for Parliamentary Office of Science and Technology on diversity of energy supplies and the need for a strong CCS. It had been published in March that year, before I domestic production component. was elected. It stated that it had been the subject of The fruit of those 12 years of dithering and confusion many Government reports and would be included in the is that we are becoming more reliant than ever on forthcoming DTI carbon abatement technology strategy. imported natural gas. In his excellent speech, the former That was five years ago—it has taken that long to get energy Minister, the right hon. Member for Croydon, the first piece of legislation on the matter. We should be North, warned about over-reliance on gas. Can he not much further forward. see, however, that everything that has happened in the I would have liked to speak about the future of the past 12 years—the delays, U-turns and policy confusion— UK oil refining industry, but I have already written to has helped to bring about and exacerbate that situation? your office, Mr. Speaker, to request time for a debate I remember a debate that we had last year on a similar about that. I have severe concerns about some of the set of issues in which he described energy security as pressures on the nine remaining oil refineries in the UK, “an increasingly important aspect of national security.” but we will leave that matter for another time. He said that he was not “relaxed about the national security implications” 9.32 pm of growing reliance on imports and that Nick Herbert (Arundel and South Downs) (Con): “the geopolitics of energy are not reassuring…That is why we This has been a wide-ranging debate. We have heard need to be bold.”—[Official Report, 22 January 2008; Vol. 470, from a number of hon. Members about the need for c. 1461.] energy security, and we have heard differing views about But where is the boldness? If there had been boldness, how to drive towards the renewable generation of power. we would be much further ahead on the new nuclear From the hon. Member for Bassetlaw (John Mann), we programme, we would see a much more balanced portfolio heard memorably about the dangers of growing mushrooms of renewables in the UK energy mix, with more wave and the loss of the world’s tigers. I am still unclear and tidal power, and we would be much further ahead about the link between those issues. as regards gas storage. We heard the Energy and Climate Change Secretary For the past four years I have tabled written and oral throw down a considerable gauntlet to the Secretary of questions, and I have had a Westminster Hall debate on State for Children, Schools and Families by setting out gas storage to try to tease out where the Government’s his own five tests, none of which I can remember, but thinking was going and what a sufficient level of gas which I feel sure he will repeat. In spite of his attempt to storage would be for any given level of import reliance. divide our respective parties, we heard from Members If we are to be 50 per cent. reliant on imported gas, in all parts of the House about the importance of what is a prudent level of gas storage? I have not been securing an agreement at Copenhagen, the considerable able to get clear answers. I have been trying to find out challenge of climate change and the urgency of reducing whether the Government believe that the extra storage greenhouse gas emissions in the years ahead. that we need can be delivered through the marketplace and through normal price signals, or whether we need Mitigating climate change is a colossal challenge for non-market intervention through a supply stocking all nations, but as well as seeking to avert dangerous obligation. We are no further forward on that. climate change we need to prepare for the changes in our climate that are already under way.Alongside reductions If there had been boldness in the Government’s approach in emissions, one of the key issues at Copenhagen will to energy policy, we would be much further ahead on be how to help developing countries adapt to climate carbon capture and storage. I read the press release that change. I wish to focus on the three critical challenges the Department for Energy and Climate Change put that the reality of climate change brings, which the out on the day of the Queen’s Speech, stating that the modest legislative programme set out in the Gracious Energy Bill would put the UK “at the forefront” of Speech does not meet. The first is the need to adapt to a CCS development and that the UK would “lead the changing climate in the UK. The second is the impact way”. The Secretary of State said today that “already” that a changing climate is having and will continue to funding had been allocated to the first project. It is have on our natural environmental, and the role of actually European, not Westminster, funding. natural systems in helping us to adapt; and the third is Frankly, I rank those statements alongside those that the global resources challenge that arises from population we have had from the Chancellor of the Exchequer growth and industrialisation combining with climate about Britain leading the world out of recession. They change. 497 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 498

First, we must face up to the need to adapt to climate limits for the next five years, and we will be presented change, because there is no choice between mitigation with an opportunity—a break in the regulatory cycle and adaptation—we have to do both. The climate change —to tackle some of the challenges that the industry projections that the Government published last June is facing. warn of the future dangers. By the 2080s, summer Climate change and population growth will put pressure temperatures in the UK could be between 3° to 4° on our water supplies and will increase concerns about hotter and total rainfall is expected to decrease by up to affordability and environmental protection. The industry 27 per cent. Extreme weather events such as storms and must do more to conserve water itself and help incentivise droughts will be more common. Higher sea levels will water efficiency. Changes need to be made now in order bring increased coastal erosion and flooding. Some to ensure a strong industry and a sustainable supply of 5 million properties in England—one in six—are at risk water in the future. of flooding. Torrential downpours on the scale that we saw last week in Cumbria may be exceptional, but we Only seven months ago, Ministers committed to bringing will see more flash floods as a result of climate change forward legislation to implement key measures from the in the decades ahead. That is why it is vital that people Cave review of innovation in the water industry and we are given the tools that they need to defend their were also promised legislation to implement measures communities, and that the Government do all they can from the Walker review of charging and metering. The to ensure that effective measures are in place to prevent final report by the Walker review has not yet arrived, future incidents where possible. and those measures will not now happen. Effective measures also mean passing the right legislation Instead of tinkering around the edges, we need innovative so that the law is clear and responsibilities for flood reform in the water industry and water policy. Such defence are properly demarcated. We therefore welcome reforms do not form part of this Bill, so it will fall to the the Flood and Water Management Bill, announced in next Government to draw together all the work that has the Gracious Speech. As I made clear yesterday, my been done on industry and regulatory change to promote party will back the necessary measures to implement the conservation of water and set out real proposals the Pitt Review recommendations for flood prevention for change. so that they become law at the earliest opportunity. I Climate change is already affecting the health and join with those hon. Members who have called for a biodiversity of our natural environment, yet very little Second Reading for that Bill as soon as possible. We has been said about that part of the challenge today. would welcome that. Our biodiversity is in decline. Numbers of birds such as The legislation must end the institutional confusion the cuckoo and swift have fallen significantly in recent over responsibility for flood risk management and the years, while other species have been lost altogether. As Environment Agency needs strategic overview of all the Royal Society for the Protection of Birds has argued types of flooding. We are keen to ensure that this does in its excellent “Nature Needs a Voice” report: not mean that power is taken away from local communities, “Whilst the loss of species represents the loss of irreplaceable or that key decisions over coastal protection are taken natural assets, declines in wildlife populations impoverish our away from Ministers accountable to Parliament. We lives well before species become biologically extinct.” must ensure that the current Bill truly reflects the importance Internationally, climate change is driving biodiversity of local decision-making to effective flood prevention. loss on a massive scale. This year’s assessment of the red We must also make sure that local communities have a list of threatened species shows that more than a third strong voice in decisions over priorities for flood risk of the species on the list are at serious risk. As climate management and avoid top-down imposition. change takes hold, rising temperatures will lead to However, it is also vital that we address water fragmented habitats that will affect species population management issues as well as flooding, because in the and migration. decades ahead, resource efficiency, and in particular, The Government’s 2010 biodiversity targets are set to the supply and availability of water will be a key concern. be missed, yet there is no plan for how to do better next By 2050, climate change could reduce the amount of time. Next year is a key year for international co-operation water available by 10 to 15 per cent., when 20 million on biodiversity, with a major UN conference in Japan in more people could be living in England alone. Average October, but just setting targets will not be enough. summer river flows could be reduced by 50 to 80 per We will need new leadership and new thinking. That cent. by that time. With climate change having a significant means both promoting new mechanisms to value our impact on supply, we will need to prepare for long dry environmental assets, if we are going to protect nature’s periods, such as those in the summers of 2005 and 2006, capital, and starting to think in terms of habitat protection and for potential problems with abstraction as rising on a landscape scale—an approach that the National temperatures reduce river flows, possibly by as much as Trust is exploring. 80 per cent. in the summer. The World Wildlife Fund We must start to identify and then develop wildlife has warned of the impact that this will have, for example, corridors to aid migration, as the wildlife trusts have on our chalk streams such as the River Itchen in Hampshire, advocated, instead of relying on isolated reserves. We which I visited recently and which is one of WWF’s must also start investing in protecting our ecosystem “rivers on the edge”—those that are already under services that sustain life. That means new incentives serious threat from over-abstraction. both to encourage people and businesses to support On those significant questions, the Bill is notable as conservation and to help local communities to invest in much for what is not in it as for what is. The title, biodiversity through mechanisms such as conservation “Flood and Water Management” implies a greater focus credits, so that new habitats can be created on the back on the water industry than we have in the final Bill. of development. We need that new thinking because of Later this week, Ofwat will announce the final price the scale of the challenge that we face and how precious 499 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 500

[Nick Herbert] Although we must pursue sustainable growth in the years ahead, we must not, however, reject the idea of our natural environment is. As the Green Alliance rightly growth itself. Government policies, business practices says, Britain’s natural environment and countryside, and, yes, individual lifestyles will have to change, but perhaps more than those of many other nations, are an the planet that we want to save is surely a world of “integral part of Britain’s heritage and identity”, prosperous, free people where wealth can be shared and yet none of that new thinking forms part of the Gracious opportunity is available to all. So we must be ready to Speech or the proposals for legislation. promote the good that will come from making these changes, and talk less about the cost of environmental On top of the need to adapt to climate change and compliance and more about the opportunities of green protect our natural environment, we have the extra jobs and growth. This is what my right hon. Friend the pressure of a global resources crunch caused by population Leader of the Opposition has called the “good future”, growth and climate change. Professor John Beddington, in which we will all enjoy and truly value the fruits of a the Government’s chief scientific adviser, has warned of cleaner, quieter and more beautiful environment. a “perfect storm” in just two decades of food shortages, scarce water and insufficient energy resources, threatening The changes that we will need to make in order to to unleash public unrest, cross-border conflicts and ensure our environmental security and that good future mass migration, as people flee from the worst affected are far more profound than the few measures set out in regions. The world’s population is projected to rise from the Gracious Speech. We have an important but limited 6 billion to 9 billion by 2050, and the UN estimates that Flood and Water Management Bill, limited energy measures global food production will need to rise by 70 per cent. and limited time. As this Government’s life ebbs away, it from today’s levels. is clear that only an election and a change of Government will bring the ambition to drive a new green agenda and For us to have a chance to meet that huge demand, secure the environmental security that is necessary. the UK must play its part. That means that it should be a strategic priority of the Government to increase domestic food production and maintain our food security, just as 9.46 pm we need to maintain our energy security, which hon. Members in all parts of the House have spoken about The Secretary of State for Environment, Food and today. Until recently, however, the Government’s formal Rural Affairs (Hilary Benn): We have had a very interesting position was that it did not matter where our food came and, at times, lively debate. It was opened by my right from. Not surprisingly therefore, the UK’s self-sufficiency hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Energy and in indigenous food has fallen significantly in the past Climate Change, whom the whole House will wish to 10 years. We need to reverse that trend and produce thank for his outstanding leadership, together with the more of the food that we could and should be growing Prime Minister, in trying to get that deal in Copenhagen. ourselves. He was followed by the hon. Member for Tunbridge However, we need to do that in a sustainable way. Wells (Greg Clark), who was not so much disgusted as Meeting the resources challenge in the decades ahead implausible in what he had to say. On renewables, he will mean relying on modern, productive agriculture to said that we had barely scratched the surface. Listening provide global food security. However, we cannot permit to him, one would never know that this country produced more agricultural emissions in future just because we more electricity from offshore wind than any other need to grow more food. That means that we have to nation on the planet. Listening to what he said about prioritise research and development now, in order to nuclear, one would have thought that that was the improve our management of soil, increase yields and Conservatives’ first resort, whereas we know that it was, cut emissions without cutting production. We should be in the words of the Leader of the Opposition, their last sharing best practice and pooling expertise with other resort, until we led and they had to follow. countries so that we can find solutions quickly. That is On carbon capture and storage, the hon. Member for why I said last week that Britain should join the global Tunbridge Wells was unable to say whether he supported alliance pioneered by New Zealand to focus on reducing the levy to fund the programme that my right hon. emissions from agriculture. Friend the Secretary of State has set out. We now have a The challenges arising from climate change are serious, policy for no new coal without CCS. On smart meters, and none of the solutions is easy. However, if we have 48 million will be a lot to roll out by 2020; that is a huge learned one thing from the past few years, it is that no programme. Despite prompting from many quarters, one can live beyond their means. We cannot live beyond however, including from the hon. Member for North our economic means, but neither can we live beyond Southwark and Bermondsey (Simon Hughes), the hon. our environmental means. The resources of this planet Member for Tunbridge Wells was unable to tell the are no more infinite than the Treasury’s reserves. We House where people would get their £6,500, given that must learn to use them sustainably. It is often said that there will apparently be no public support available for the first duty of Government is to ensure the security of that proposal. the people. Adapting to climate change and protecting My right hon. Friend the Member for Kingston upon our natural systems are the prerequisites of ensuring Hull, East (Mr. Prescott) gave us a tour de force, drawing our environmental security.That will mean climate-proofing on all his experience in climate negotiations. There is a our policies, creating communities that are resilient to lot to recommend his suggestion that the world’s leaders extreme weather, respecting nature’s capital and investing be locked in a room until they agree on a deal. I agree in conservation to help wildlife to adapt. It will also with what the hon. Member for North Southwark and mean living more sustainably by reducing waste, sourcing Bermondsey said about Copenhagen, and he is right more food locally, generating more renewable energy that we will need a legal treaty as soon as possible after and using resources efficiently. a comprehensive agreement has been reached. 501 Debate on the Address24 NOVEMBER 2009 Debate on the Address 502

My right hon. Friend the Member for Croydon, other responsibilities put on them in the Flood and North (Malcolm Wicks) gave a very thoughtful speech Water Management Bill—to the water companies that that was much enjoyed across the House. I thank him will pick it up. for the work that he has done on energy security and for My hon. Friend the Member for Bassetlaw (John his report. I am advised that a copy of it is now Mann) made a stirring speech and I probably owe him available on the Department of Energy and Climate another letter on the subject of Tunnel Tech, but I think Change website. he will find that feed-in tariffs will in part answer the The hon. Member for Beckenham (Mrs. Lait) and point he raised about the incentive to put small-scale my hon. Friend the Member for City of Durham renewable energy into people’s houses. (Dr. Blackman-Woods) both raised the question of I am grateful to the hon. Member for East Devon carbon capture and storage. I can tell them that we are (Mr. Swire) for his support for the Flood and Water working with other countries and trying very hard to Management Bill, although I have to correct him in one take that forward. My hon. Friend the Member for respect, as there are no vegans on the Front Bench. Plymouth, Sutton (Linda Gilroy) talked about marine There will be a new 26th offshore round next year in the science, on which she is of course an expert. North sea. Linda Gilroy: Will my right hon. Friend give us an My hon. Friend the Member for Calder Valley (Chris assurance that the Walker report on metering and charging McCafferty) talked about sustainable population and I will materialise soon, preferably before Christmas? thought she made a very important contribution on a subject for which she has been a passionate advocate for Hilary Benn: The plan is indeed that it should be many years indeed. available before Christmas. We have already had the I agreed with half of what the hon. Member for interim report, but we await with interest Anna Walker’s Northampton, South (Mr. Binley) had to say, if I may final report. be generous. He praised my right hon. Friend the Secretary The hon. Member for Westmorland and Lonsdale of State for Energy and Climate Change in relation to (Tim Farron) spoke movingly about the impact of the clean coal, but when he got round to attacking renewables flooding in his constituency. His expression of sympathy his remarks were very much out of sync with those of for PC Barker’s family will be widely supported. He his hon. Friend the Member for Tunbridge Wells, who knows only too well that predicting river flooding is one speaks from the Front Bench for the Conservative thing but that surface water flooding is much more party. It would be nice to know what the Conservative difficult to predict, because we need to know the precise policy is. topography, exactly how much rain is going to fall on it, The hon. Member for Angus (Mr. Weir) spoke eloquently and the drainage capacity of the area. That is precisely and knowledgeably about North sea oil and gas. I why—I shall come back to this—the Flood and Water agreed with a little of the speech made by the hon. Management Bill will give local authorities the lead Member for Preseli Pembrokeshire (Mr. Crabb), particularly responsibility. when he talked about the need for a balanced energy supply. Martin Horwood rose— One phrase used in the debate was seized upon by a number of Members and it sums up the challenges that Hilary Benn: If the hon. Gentleman will forgive me, we face. It came from the words of my right hon. Friend time is very short and I want to respond to the debate. the Member for Kingston upon Hull, East in talking The hon. Members for Westmorland and Lonsdale about mass sustainability. In truth, to address the points and for Tewkesbury (Mr. Robertson) have, sadly, both raised by the hon. Member for Arundel and South had direct experience of flooding and they spoke movingly Downs (Nick Herbert), he is right about the changing about the spirit and resilience of the constituencies and climate and the more extreme weather in the UK. the constituents whom they represent. I know that that Let me take this opportunity to give the House an is the best quality their communities have to carry them update on the latest information about Cumbria. Rain through these difficult times. Let me assure the hon. has fallen during the day and 52 mm has been recorded Member for Tewkesbury that we will, of course, continue in Honister. The heaviest rain is expected somewhere to talk to the insurance industry about how it can help. between about 54 minutes ago and midnight. The campsite My hon. Friend the Member for Llanelli (Nia Griffith), in Keswick now has a flood warning, while Cockermouth in common with other Members, raised the question of and Keswick may need to have further warnings and building on floodplains. The latest information we have, there could be further property flooding—although as a result of PPS25, is that 98 per cent. of planning not, on current indications, on anything like the previous decisions are going in line with the advice of the scale. All are currently warnings as opposed to severe Environment Agency, which is exactly why we changed warnings. I can also announce that in the past few days PPS25 to make sure that flood risk was taken into 63,500 automated warnings have gone out as a result of account. people having registered on the floodline and the warning The hon. Member for Basingstoke (Mrs. Miller) asked system. We will, of course, look into particular cases. about private sewers, but primary legislation is not People will not get a warning of surface water flooding, required in order to effect the transfer. We will consult for the reasons that I set out a few moments ago, but we on draft regulations as soon as possible. In effect, what are trying to develop our understanding. we are doing is creating a national insurance scheme by passing that responsibility from local authorities—thus Martin Horwood: May I pursue the point about warnings relieving them of a cost, so that the money can then be of surface water flooding? It was clear even two and applied to deal with surface water flooding and the half years ago in Gloucester that predictive abilities 503 Debate on the Address 24 NOVEMBER 2009 504

[Martin Horwood] consider. Having completed the original list of national parks—I shall return to that in a moment—and having provided by Met Office technology would have allowed passed the Marine and Coastal Access Act 2009, which more precise predictions of intense rainfall—if only a is hugely significant for the coherence of the protection few hours beforehand—and it is clear now that that of our biodiversity, we do indeed need to look at ways predictive capacity has become even more precise in the in which we can connect those developments more intervening years. Even a few hours’ warning for effectively. householders of that level of flooding and heavy rainfall As the hon. Gentleman spoke, I felt that what he was would have allowed an awful lot of property to be saying reflected the work that my colleagues and I have saved. already done. As he will know, one of our latest actions has been to designate the South Downs the last of the Hilary Benn: I accept what the hon. Gentleman says national parks. I was sorry that he described that as the about our improved capacity to warn. One of the wrong decision, and said that it had been rushed for benefits of the flood forecasting centre that was established political reasons. I would simply point out as a matter following Michael Pitt’s excellent report is the provision of historical accuracy that the South Downs national of a unified forecast, including an extreme rainfall alert. park was first proposed 62 years ago. That hardly Let me stress that when we watch the weather forecast constitutes a rush. What it shows is that this party—for on television at night and it says “Severe weather warning— it was Attlee’s Government who did it—has been on the heavy rain”, all of us who live in an area for which that case for 60 years in protecting our biodiversity. We is forecast need to pay attention. I know that people celebrate the park’s 60th anniversary this year. would like to be told whether the flooding will happen The Gracious Speech shows that we are still on the exactly where they live, as opposed to a mile down the case, and I commend it to the House. road. The Environment Agency and others are trying to improve the level of warning, but that warning means 10 pm something, and we should all pay attention to it. The debate stood adjourned (Standing Order No. 9(3)). The hon. Member for Arundel and South Downs was, of course, right about the more extreme weather Ordered, That the debate be resumed tomorrow. and the changes that we shall have to learn to live with. The Flood and Water Management Bill seeks to deal Business without Debate with that. It is a timely and important Bill, which builds on a great deal of what we have done since the 2007 floods. I am talking about increased defences, the protection DELEGATED LEGISLATION of Carlisle, better warnings, funding for local authorities Ordered, to start work on surface water flooding—the Bill will That the Business Rate Supplements (Rateable Value Condition) provide a statutory responsibility for them to take the (England) Regulations 2009 (S.I., 2009, No. 2542), dated 18 September lead on that—a grant scheme for household protection, 2009, be referred to a Delegated Legislation Committee.— and better water rescue capability. (Mr. Mudie.) I believe that the Bill, which we will no doubt scrutinise carefully, gives clear responsibility in the way that Sir SITTINGS OF THE HOUSE Michael Pitt recommended. It will also—this picks up Motion made, the point made by the hon. Gentleman—help us to That— better conserve supplies in drought. It may seem strange (1) Standing Order No. 14 (Arrangement of public business) to talk about drought in the wake of the last three shall have effect for this Session with the following modifications, summers, but the hon. Gentleman was right to draw namely: attention to the two drought summers that we had In paragraph (4) the word ‘eight’ shall be substituted for the before those. word ‘thirteen’ in line 42 and in paragraph (5) the word ‘fifth’ shall be substituted for the word ‘eighth’ in line 44; (2) Standing Order No. 90 (Second reading committees) shall Mr. Lilley: Does the Secretary of State share the have effect for this Session with the following modification, extraordinary complacency of his right hon. Friend the namely: Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change In paragraph (2) the word ‘fifth’ shall be substituted for the about leaked documents from the Climate Research word ‘eighth’ in line 21; and Unit which show that civil servants have been trying to (3) Private Members’ Bills shall have precedence over Government avoid the Freedom of Information Act—which is potentially business on 29 January; 5 and 26 February; 5 and 12 March; a criminal offence—have been conspiring to prevent 23 and 30 April; and 7 May.—(Mr. Mudie.) publication of dissenting views, and have been modifying their own data? Would he allow such behaviour by Hon. Members: Object. officials on his Department’s payroll? PETITION Hilary Benn: I fundamentally disagree with the right hon. Gentleman’s accusation of complacency, because Equitable Life (Bexhill and Battle) that is not what my right hon. Friend said. He said that he was in favour of maximum openness, and that is a 10 pm view that I entirely share. Gregory Barker (Bexhill and Battle) (Con): I rise to The hon. Member for Arundel and South Downs present a petition on behalf of my constituents in raised the subject of wildlife corridors. That is what the Bexhill and Battle who are continuing to suffer from the Lawton commission, which I have just established, will injustice of the situation regarding Equitable Life. 505 Business without Debate 24 NOVEMBER 2009 506

The petition states: King George Hospital (Ilford) The Petition of residents of the constituency of Bexhill & Motion made, and Question proposed, That this House Battle in the East Sussex region of the U.K. regarding the Government’s response to the Parliamentary Ombudsman’s reports do now adjourn.—(Mr. Mudie.) on Equitable Life, Declares that the petitioners either are or they represent or 10.1 pm support members, former members or personal representatives of deceased members of the Equitable Life Assurance Society who Mike Gapes (Ilford, South) (Lab/Co-op): I am raising have suffered maladministration leading to injustice, as found by the very important question of the future of King the Parliamentary Ombudsman in her report upon Equitable George hospital, Ilford. Ilford has had a maternity Life, ordered by the House of Commons to be printed on 16 July hospital since 1926 and has had a district general hospital 2008 and bearing reference number HC 815; and further declares since King George V opened it in 1931. I want to place that the petitioners or those whom they represent or support have on record my strong support for the record investment suffered regulatory failure on the part of the public bodies responsible from the year 1992 onwards, but have not received in the national health service under this Labour Government compensation for the resulting losses and outrage. and for the modernisation that they have carried out, The Petitioners therefore request that the House of Commons including the new polyclinic in Loxford in my constituency. urges the Government to uphold the constitutional standing of I was pleased to meet the first patient of that polyclinic the Parliamentary Ombudsman by complying in full with the in June. findings and recommendations of her Report upon Equitable I also believe that as technology changes, it is important Life. that we have more community-based facilities and services. And the Petitioners remain, etc. Unfortunately we should not allow those people who [P000415] run the bureaucracy of the NHS, and even those who believe they know what is best for our communities, to make decisions that have an intense impact on many poor people in the poorest communities of our country. Three years ago, the NHS bureaucracy came up with the misnamed “Fit for the Future” proposals, which would have led to the closure of the accident and emergency and the elective facilities at King George hospital, Ilford. A vigorous local campaign was mounted. I myself organised a petition and we presented 28,000 signatures. The local paper, the Ilford Recorder, organised its own petition. Other local MPs supported us in that campaign. In 2007, Professor George Alberti produced a report in which he said that the proposals were “clinically unsound” and that those concerned had to go back to the drawing board. He also said that King George hospital should be developed as a first-class local hospital. It took them a long time; there was then a review of health services in London. Eventually, the NHS bureaucracy decided to go ahead with another attempt. I am afraid that because of arrogance and the “we know best”approach the people behind this—whether they are on the clinical bodies or are the “joint responsible owners”, to use the jargon—have come up with proposals that do not take account of community needs. At the time, I asked the chief executive of Redbridge primary care trust, Heather O’Meara, to give me an assurance that the “Fit for the Future” proposals were dead—that they were not going to be revived in some other form. I was simply told that they had been stood down. It seems that they have now been reactivated under another guise. It is true that this time we are to keep elective operations at the King George site, but at the price of losing all our maternity services as well as our accident and emergency functions. At Upton Park this afternoon—as a West Ham United season-ticket holder I am very disappointed that this venue was chosen—a joint committee of inner north-east London and outer north-east London primary care trusts has been meeting to rubber-stamp proposals to go ahead with a public consultation starting on 30 November and running for 14 weeks until 8 March 2010. I understand, however, that for some reason no decision will be taken until after the general election. If this is so urgent, we might wonder why they do not make the decision straight away, or why they do not defer the whole thing until 507 King George Hospital (Ilford)24 NOVEMBER 2009 King George Hospital (Ilford) 508

[Mike Gapes] down, people can sell off a lot of land. There is a lot of land on the King George hospital site that would, after the general election, but this is how NHS bureaucracy undoubtedly be prime for housing development, thus seems to work. It is planning to have a consultation, adding to the population of Ilford and to the number of which in my opinion will be about as free and fair as a young mothers who would have to go to Romford to rigged Afghan election. It is clear that they have not give birth to their children. listened to what the community said three years ago. It We face a serious problem as a result of these proposals. is now again going ahead with proposals that will Members of Parliament have been kept out of the loop significantly downgrade services for people living in on this discussion. The first time I saw any documentation Ilford, and that will mean that each year several thousand given to me by the primary care trust was when I women who are due to give birth will have to go to received an e-mail about 10 days ago supplying me with Romford. Children will not be born in Ilford any longer, a document dated February 2009. I saw the documentation unless they are born at home or in the back of taxis or that was going to today’s meeting only on Friday by cars driving them to other hospitals; they will be born in e-mail and yesterday in hard copy. It seems that because Romford and elsewhere in London. the elected representatives played such an effective role It is said that this proposal is clinically led, but it is in stopping the proposals three years ago, we have been admitted in the small print of the documents that the deliberately kept out of the process so that we cannot engagement exercise builds on previous exercises including stop the consultation before it starts this time. “Fit for the Future”. It is therefore clear that “Fit for I wish to say something about the consultation, because the Future”, which was rejected because it was financially it is based on a certain amount of information being driven and not clinically sound, is part of the basis of put forward about issues such as travel patterns, how the decisions that are going forward. many miles people will have to travel and so on. Interestingly, This is a hidden agenda to save money, dressed up as the bureaucrats are supposed to have produced something a clinical exercise. We have big financial deficits in called an “integrated impact assessment”, which should north-east London. The Barking, Havering and Redbridge take account of the impact on ethnic minorities and University Hospitals NHS Trust has serious management women, on the carbon footprint and on other matters. and financial problems. I would argue that most of Page 23 of their documents admits: those problems relate to the expensive private finance “The scope of work of the Integrated Impact Assessment (IIA) initiative Queen’s hospital, which has been open for includes further work on the impact of any changes to distances three years. My constituents in Ilford are therefore and travel times. This work will take place during consultation being made to suffer as a result of problems from the and will be made available via the Health for North East London other hospital in the trust. website”. The documents also says that the proposals are based So they are starting a consultation at the end of November on “Healthcare for London”, which Professor Lord and then halfway through the process they start producing Ara Darzi produced. He talked about a local hospital more information for the consultation. Surely, the serving a population of between 200,000 and 250,000 consultation cannot be started until all the information people. Under these proposals, neither Barking and necessary to make it accurate has been provided. This is Dagenham, with a population of 182,000, nor Redbridge, a bit like changing the party affiliation or the candidates with a population of 264,000, will have a local hospital. halfway through an election campaign, once the nomination All other boroughs in east and north-east London have papers are in. This is absurd, but it is typical of the a hospital, but we will no longer have a hospital serving determination of certain people in the London region our populations. This is a disgrace. We could lose up to NHS to go ahead regardless. They want to push this 488 beds at King George hospital, and the consequences through and to present a fait accompli before the general would be very serious in terms of added pressure on election but not make the decision until after it. other hospitals in the region. I believe that this is financially driven, but interestingly Harry Cohen (Leyton and Wanstead) (Lab): Will my the small print of these documents talks about the hon. Friend give way? proposals saving £19 million a year and a modelling exercise showing that if the accident and emergency Mike Gapes: I will do so briefly, with your permission, facilities at Newham general hospital were closed instead Mr. Speaker. of those at the King George hospital, £27 million a year would be saved. For some reason, the bureaucrats have Harry Cohen: This will be a very brief intervention. I chosen not to go down that route and that confirms the congratulate my hon. Friend on being a doughty fighter preconception of the “Fit for the Future” option 4, for the NHS and his local hospital in his constituency, which was to downgrade King George hospital; even and I express my solidarity with him. Should not the though the financial figures give a different result, they urgent care centre that the PCT says will be at the King are still going ahead on that basis. George hospital 24/7 be of high hospital standard? Serious financial deficits are predicted. The deficit for Should there not be hospital-standard cancer care, outer north-east London is predicted to be £140 million chemotherapy, renal dialysis and other such services by 2016-17, whereas the one for inner north-east London there? is predicted to be £150 million. It is estimated that even with what are described as “aggressive savings”, the Mike Gapes: I am sure that my hon. Friend would total deficit for all the trusts and all the health economy not be happy if I suggested that they closed the accident will be £140 million, as opposed to £290 million. That is and emergency at Whipps Cross and turned Whipps a serious amount of money, but of course there will be Cross into a 24/7 urgent care centre. We need urgent some income. If a major acute hospital can be run care centres, state-of-the- art polyclinics and all kinds of 509 King George Hospital (Ilford)24 NOVEMBER 2009 King George Hospital (Ilford) 510 other facilities, but we also need people in Ilford to have He went on: access to accident and emergency and maternity services “Had KGH not been there I hate to think of the consequences. in Ilford, rather than their having to go to other parts of Needless to say the attention, care and organisation at KGH was north-east London. outstanding.” There are clear grounds for throwing out the consultation That is the question—will my constituents get outstanding process before it is launched and I hope that the Minister care in future if our local maternity facilities are closed is listening carefully to what I am saying. The clinical and our local accident and emergency department is reference group behind the proposals said that there taken away? I do not think so. was a “preferred” location of having obstetric maternity I have one final point to make. All the data treat on the same site as accident and emergency. When I met Barking, Havering and Redbridge NHS trust as though the officials behind the plan last Friday, I asked medical it were one place, but the trust has two hospitals and it director Mike Gill whether it was absolutely necessary is very difficult to get disaggregated information. The to have an A and E on the same site as an obstetric documents that are about to be published should not maternity facility. He said that it was not, and that the be published until the information in them has been closure of the maternity services was not due to the disaggregated in all respects. closure of the A and E. The midwifery director, Carol When proposals are made for changes that would Drummond, took a slightly different view. She was affect one of the hospitals in a joint trust, every part of arguing that it should all be on one site together. The the relevant documents should have a clear breakdown documents that they produced admit that of the data so that people can see what all the costs are. “obstetrics can be provided with no A&E.” The information should show where the deficits and That is in the documentation. complaints come from, and where the quality variations are. It may be claimed that the data are not available, If there is a need to have the maternity facilities but lots of money has been spent on Mott MacDonald’s consolidated in one place, perhaps the King George scoping exercise on the assessments, and on consultants. hospital could be a good site for them—or for most of If some money could be spent on getting the information them, given that about 4,000 children are born at the that I have described together, it is possible that a site each year. The maternity issue raises a serious proper consultation could be held. concern for me, because my constituency has the youngest population in Redbridge, as well as the highest number My local authority in Redbridge is a hung council of births, people from ethnic minorities, people for with a Conservative administration, but Conservative, whom English is not a first language and complicated Labour and Liberal Democrat councillors are all together births because of deprivation, poor housing or genetic in being strongly opposed to the proposals. If the local factors. health overview and scrutiny committee were to request a reference to the NHS reconfiguration panel, could I am concerned about my constituents, who also have that reference be implemented speedily, so that we can less access to cars than those in other parts of outer stop the consultation exercise? I hope that my right hon. north-east London. Barking and Dagenham is in a and learned Friend the Minister will be able to answer slightly worse position than some of the wards in my that. Apart from anything else, stopping the exercise constituency, but I have constituency wards where 38 or would mean that I would not have to spend the whole of 40 per cent. of households do not have access to a car. my Christmas collecting another 28,000 signatures to In the wards near Queen’s hospital, 10, 15 or 20 per defend my local hospital. cent. do not have access to a car. The proposal will move the facilities away from the area with the poorest 10.22 pm people in the poorest areas, with less access to transport. People will be made to rely on two buses and a train to The Minister of State, Department of Health (Mr. Mike get to the Queen’s hospital in Romford. That is unacceptable. O’Brien): First, may I congratulate my hon. Friend the A poor migrant woman from Ilford, South, without Member for Ilford, South (Mike Gapes) on securing the access to a car, does not wish to go several miles to a debate? He has been a champion of good local health strange environment elsewhere. Those responsible for services in Ilford and I have the greatest respect for the the plans say that they will encourage home births and dedication with which he serves the needs of his constituents. that they will encourage the establishment of a birthing I have listened carefully to my hon. Friend’s points, centre, but we need a maternity hospital in Ilford. and he has spoken to me on a number of occasions to I also want to say something about the quality of the express his very real concerns about how the consultation maternity care. I have a constituent, Mr. Ali Hai. He might develop. He has also spoken to my right hon. and his wife had their second child just a few weeks ago. Friend the Secretary of State, and I shall certainly look His wife was going to give birth in Queen’s hospital but, at the points that he has raised. as he stated in an e-mail: My hon. Friend asked in particular about a reference “I asked the Director responsible for Maternity Care…to be to the local health overview and scrutiny committee, switched to KGH”— and I shall consider what he has said and get back to him. As I understand it, it is normal for a reference via that is, King George hospital— the overview and scrutiny committee to take place at the “because of the state of chaos and the ridiculously long waiting end of a consultation, but I am not sure that there is any times at Queens”. obligation in that regard. I shall check on that and write They waited several hours. He stated that those waits to him shortly. were I am sure that my hon. Friend will want to recognise “totally unacceptable given that it is responsible for dealing with the contribution of NHS staff, not just at the King High Risk Maternity cases.” George hospital but across the whole of Ilford and 511 King George Hospital (Ilford)24 NOVEMBER 2009 King George Hospital (Ilford) 512

[Mr. Mike O’Brien] Such issues are rightly always matters for debate; those who seek change need to demonstrate that their north-east London. They are constantly striving to case is the right one. The NHS in London is concentrating deliver better quality health care, benefiting his and specialist services in centres of excellence across the city. other hon. Members’ constituencies. A Londoner suffering a heart attack will now be taken The Government remain absolutely committed to straight to the hospital providing the specialist care that supporting health service staff in the provision of better that person urgently needs, rather than simply to the health services, across London and in the deprived closest hospital. People will go straight to the experts areas of north-east London in particular. We have been with the equipment, experience and expertise that can consistent in emphasising the value of strong clinical save their lives. Those changes were often difficult. and local leadership so that doctors, nurses and other However, they have produced results; it has been shown clinicians, who understand best what their patients need, that people now have a better chance of surviving. are at the forefront of shaping the health service locally Those charged with driving forward the programmes of in the best interests of patients. change all over London are learning the lessons of However, I of course recognise that any programme cardiac care. of change will generate controversy. Our hospitals are As my hon. Friend has said, north-east London is a much-loved institutions, to which local people are place of marked contrasts, with a rich cultural and understandably very attached. The challenge is for the ethnic diversity and a growing population. It has particular local NHS to explain to patients, the public and their transport needs, and particular needs relating to ensuring representatives—including Members of Parliament such the highest quality health care. There are many opportunities as my hon. Friend—when change is needed and how for improvement in north-east London, and we need to proposals will deliver safer and better quality health ensure that proposals are properly, and sometimes critically, care. Of course, if it can explain that, and can work examined. We should make decisions to ensure that through the consultation and get support, that is one patients get the best possible outcome. Why should thing, but consultation needs to be genuine, and local out-patients have to travel to a hospital, when they can people need to be listened to. be treated just as easily and more conveniently in the In recent years, my predecessors have put in place a community or at home? How do people best access robust process for the Department of Health, strategic primary care? How do people best ensure that when health authorities and primary care trusts to follow to they need to use a hospital, they can get the best quality ensure that any proposed service reconfiguration is treatment? All those issues need to be addressed in the driven by clinical need, not anticipated financial savings. broader context. Such savings sometimes occur, but the primary aim We need to ensure that any consultation is done must be to ensure that clinical needs are better met. We properly. My hon. Friend indicated that the committee are moving into very difficult financial and economic that met today proposed launching a consultation on circumstances, and we have to look at all the issues 30 November, with a view to it running until 8 March facing the NHS in the context of the situation that now 2010. The purpose of consultation is to gain a better confronts it. It has to ensure that it deals with the understanding of the views of the local community, and problems that we face, rather than the problems that it to deal with the arguments put forward on both sides—both faced some years ago. for and against any change. The review in 2007 by Professor Lord Ara Darzi, We need to ensure that the debates are conducted in a together with more than 100 leading clinicians, resulted way that means that the best interests of patients overall in a series of recommendations for changing London’s are considered. Patients and the public are at the heart health services. The Healthcare for London programme of the NHS, and the Government are absolutely committed sets out a clear direction for the capital’s NHS, and was to that principle. It is important that communities are the subject of a wide and extensive consultation with listened to, which is why I expect the local NHS to Londoners. Lord Darzi was clear: change must be led demonstrate that any proposals will improve care. As by doctors, nurses and other clinicians. There is evidence well as improving clinical care for the people of Ilford, that, where necessary, specialist services should be provided the local NHS will need to ensure that it can deliver a by clinicians with specialist skills, supported by the financially sustainable platform for the NHS in north-east latest high-tech facilities. That might be done in a local London. I am sure that my hon. Friend will continue to hospital, a polyclinic hub, a general practitioner’s surgery, champion and support health services on behalf of his or even in people’s homes, where that is possible. Across constituents. London, the NHS is looking at how those arrangements Question put and agreed to. can be put into practice. That involves looking at what the NHS has to offer in a new light, and thinking about how its staff, buildings and resources can best serve 10.30 pm patients. House adjourned. 27WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 28WS

Written Ministerial Change New DEL Non- Non- Voted Voted Voted Voted Total

Statements Resource -4,037,427 21,292,300 -3,515,015 22,354,754 18,839,739 (£000) Tuesday 24 November 2009 of which: Administration* 84,524 357,473 357,473 budget Near cash in -5,337,748 21,062,238 -4,937,070 22,105,386 17,168,316 Resource DEL* BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS Capital -95,993 2,747,901 -486,854 3,476,816 2,989,962 (£000) Less -5,112 -180,116 -59,448 -201,279 -260,727 Depreciation* Chief Construction Adviser (£000) Total -4,138,532 23,860,085 -4,061,317 25,630,291 21,568,974 (£000) The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Business, *The total of the ‘Administration Budget’ and ‘Near Cash in Resource DEL’ Innovation and Skills (Ian Lucas): The Department for figures may well be greater than total Resource DEL, due to the definitions overlapping. Business Innovation and Skills, together with the Office *Capital DEL includes items treated as Resource in Estimates and Accounts, of Government Commerce, is today announcing that but treated as Capital DEL in Budgets. Paul Morrell OBE will be appointed to the new role of *Depreciation, which forms part of Resource DEL, is excluded from the total DEL since Capital DEL includes Capital spending and to include depreciation Government Chief Adviser on Construction. of those assets would lead to double counting. The Government Chief Construction Adviser is an The change in the resource element of the DEL arises independent role, but will report jointly to BIS and HM from: Treasury Ministers. The remit of the role includes: RfR1 chairing the new Construction Collaborative Category Board, i) a Machinery of Government transfer from the which will build on the existing Public Sector Construction Clients Forum, to drive the implementation and further Department for Innovation, Universities and Skills of development of best value construction procurement; £114,024,000 voted near cash and £317,335,000 of non- leading the low carbon construction innovation and growth voted near cash in respect of Knowledge Transfer and team that will assess the key barriers to growth in the UK’s low Innovation and central programmes; carbon construction sector to ensure the UK industry is well ii) a Machinery of Government transfer from the placed to serve developing needs and markets; Department for Innovation, Universities and Skills of chairing an enhanced sustainable construction strategy delivery £3,762,000 voted depreciation and £7,829,000 other board to help ensure policy regarding the industry is effectively voted non cash and £168,000 non-voted depreciation co-ordinated; and £23,000 of other non-voted non cash in respect of working with the industry, through the Strategic Forum for Knowledge Transfer and Innovation and central Construction, to deliver the industry improvement agenda programmes; including the Construction Commitments; iii) a Machinery of Government transfer from the promoting innovation in the sector, working closely with the Department for Innovation, Universities and Skills of Technology Strategy Board and other funding bodies; and £400,000 non-voted near cash and negative £400,000 co-ordinating the Whitehall response to reports featuring non-voted non cash in respect of research establishments construction. provisions; Paul Morrell was previously senior partner of iv) a Machinery of Government transfer from the construction consultants Davis Langdon and also Deputy Department for Innovation, Universities and Skills of Chair of the Commission for Architecture and the Built £40,624,000 non-voted near cash in respect of the Environment Departmental Unallocated Provision; v) transfer of £1,027,000 voted DEL and £4,732,000 non-voted DEL from the Department for Work and Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) Pensions in respect of Business Link activities to tackle long-term unemployment; vi) virement of £43,700,000 from non-voted Departmental The Minister for Business, Innovation and Skills (Mr. Pat Unallocated Provision to voted expenditure in respect McFadden): Subject to parliamentary approval of the of the Automotive Scrappage Scheme; necessary supplementary estimate, the Department for vii) virement of £7,300,000 from voted Strategic Investment Business, Innovation and Skills’ DEL will be increased Fund capital expenditure to non-voted resource expenditure by £19,906,781,000 from £1,922,920,000 to £21,829,701,000 in respect of the Technology Strategy Board. as a consequence of the merger between the Department viii) virement of £2,500,000 from voted expenditure in for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform and respect of Business to non-voted Regional Development the Department for Innovation, Universities and Skills. Agency expenditure; The administration budget will be increased by £84,524,000 ix) virement of £37,000,000 of non-voted expenditure from £272,949,000 to £357,473,000. from the Learning and Skills Council (RfR3) to Regional Within the DEL change, the impact on resources and Development Agencies (RfR1) voted expenditure in capital is as set out in the following table: respect of the Train to Gain programme; 29WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 30WS x) virement of £1,700,000 from voted expenditure in ix) increase in voted receipts for the UK Commission respect of Business Link Marketing to non-voted Regional for Employment and Skills of £6,211,000 from the Development Agency expenditure; Department for Children, Schools and Families, offset xi) transfer of £2,629,000 from the Home Office in by an increase in the UK Commission for Employment respect of Migration Impact Funding; and Skills non-voted resource DEL; xii) virement of £138,000 from voted central programmes x) increase in voted receipts for the Student Loans to the non-voted Departmental Unallocated Provision. Company of £503,000 from the Department for Children, Schools and Families, offset by an increase in the Student Also within the change to resource DEL, the changes to Loans Company non-voted resource DEL; the Administration budget are: xi) increase in voted receipts for the Higher Education (RfR1) Funding Council for England of £2,344,000 from the i) a Machinery of Government transfer from the Department for Children, Schools and Families, offset Department for Innovation, Universities and Skills of by an increase in the Higher Education Funding Council £69,299,000 voted near cash, £1,350,000 voted depreciation for England non-voted resource DEL; and £250,000 of other voted non cash; xii) increase in voted receipts for the UK Commission ii) reclassification to administration from non-voted for Employment and Skills of £1,300,000 from the programme Departmental Unallocated Provision of Department for Work and Pensions, offset by an increase £13,625,000. in the UK Commission for Employment and Skills RfR2 non-voted resource DEL; i) a Machinery of Government transfer from the xiii) Increase in voted receipts for the Higher Education Department for Innovation, Universities and Skills of Funding Council for England of £502,000 from the £116,742,000 voted near cash and £2,732,835,000 of Department of Health, offset by an increase in the non-voted near cash in respect of Science programmes; Higher Education Funding Council for England non-voted ii) a Machinery of Government transfer from the resource DEL; Department for Innovation, Universities and Skills of xiv) increase in voted receipts for Investors in People £138,960,000 non-voted depreciation and £54,600,000 (IiP) of £70,000 from the Department of Health, offset other non-voted non cash in respect of Science programmes; by an increase in the Investors in People (IiP) non-voted iii) a Machinery of Government transfer from the resource DEL; Department for Innovation, Universities and Skills of xv) increase in voted receipts for the Commission for £27,332,000 non-voted near cash and £2,511,000 non-voted Employment and Skills of £250,000 from the Cabinet depreciation in respect of the Departmental Unallocated Office, offset by an increase in the Commission for Provision; Employment and Skills non-voted resource DEL; iv) virement of £287,000 non-voted Departmental xvi) increase in voted receipts for the UK Commission Unallocated provision to voted Research-Based Initiatives. for Employment and Skills of £566,000 from the devolved RfR3 Administration for Scotland, offset by an increase in the UK Commission for Employment and Skills non-voted i) a Machinery of Government transfer from the resource DEL; Department for Innovation, Universities and Skills of a net negative £5,763,198,000 voted near cash and xvii) increase in voted receipts for the UK Commission £18,038,714,000 of non-voted near cash in respect of for Employment and Skills of £373,000 from the devolved Education programmes; Administration for Wales, offset by an increase in the UK Commission for Employment and Skills non-voted ii) a Machinery of Government transfer from the resource DEL; Department for Innovation, Universities and Skills of £1,331,730,000 other voted non cash and £16,624,000 xviii) increase in voted receipts for the UK Commission non-voted depreciation and a net negative £27,024,000 for Employment and Skills of £243,000 from the devolved of other non-voted non cash in respect of Education Administration for Northern Ireland, offset by an increase programmes; in the UK Commission for Employment and Skills non-voted resource DEL; iii) transfer of £24,073,000 from the Ministry of Justice in respect of prison education and offender learning; xix) virement of £24,943,000 from voted to non-voted expenditure relating to the Learning and Skills Council; iv) transfer of £222,000 from the Ministry of Justice in respect of Government Skills; xx) virement of £374,000 from non-voted to voted expenditure relating to the Higher Education Funding v) utilisation of £384,000 from the non-voted Departmental Council for England; Unallocated Provision for voted Government Skills; xxi) virement of £1,260,000 from non-voted to voted vi) virement of £60,000 to the non-voted Departmental expenditure relating to the Student Loans Company; Unallocated Provision from voted International programmes; xxii) virement of £2,461,000 from voted to non-voted vii) virement of £10,000,000 to non-voted capital from expenditure relating to the UK Commission for non-voted resource in respect of the Learning and Employment and Skills; Skills Council; xxiii) virement of £32,000 from voted to non-voted viii) virement of £37,000,000 of non-voted expenditure expenditure relating to the Sector Skills Development from the Learning and Skills Council to the Regional Agency; Development Agencies (RfR1) voted expenditure in xxiv) transfer of £400,000 from the Department for respect of the Train to Gain programme; Children, Schools and Families for the College Sector. 31WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 32WS

The change in the Capital element of the DEL arises DEL will be increased by £15,000,000 from £215,747,000 from: to £230,747,000. The administration budget will be RfR1 increased by £15,000,000 from £165,145,000 to £180,145,000 i) a Machinery of Government transfer from the and the capital DEL will be reduced by £625,000,000 Department for Innovation, Universities and Skills of from £781,942,000 to £156,942,000. The impact on £14,131,000 voted and £10,080,000 non-voted in respect resources, including the administration budget, and capital of Knowledge Transfer and Innovation and central is set out in the following table: programmes; ii) virement of £2,500,000 from non-voted Regional Development Agency expenditure to voted expenditure Change New DEL in respect of British Shipbuilders; Non- Non- Voted voted Voted voted Total iii) virement of £7,300,000 from voted Strategic Investment Fund expenditure to non-voted resource expenditure in Resource 18,631,000 -3,631,000 209,903,000 20,844,000 230,747,000 respect of the Technology Strategy Board; of which: iv) transfer of £25,000,000 from the Department of Administration 16,531,000 -1,531,000 180,145,000 - 180,145,000 Energy and Climate Change in respect of the Low budget* Carbon Buildings programme; Near cash in 18,631,000 -3,631,000 200,218,000 31,444,000 231,662,000 RDEL* v) transfer of £2,100,000 of non-voted expenditure Capital** -625,000,000 - 154,800,000 2,142,000 156,942,000 from the Department of Energy and Climate Change in Less: - - -7,915,000 - -7,915,000 respect of the Fuel Cells and Hydrocarbon demonstration Depreciation*** programme funded through the Technology Strategy Total -606,369,000 -3,631,000 356,788,000 22,986,000 379,774,000 Board; *The total of the ‘Administration Budget’ and ‘Near Cash in Resource DEL’ vi) £18,000,000 increase in Small Firms Loan Guarantee figures may well be greater than total Resource DEL, due to the definitions overlapping. expenditure (funded by a reduction in the non-voted **Capital DEL includes items treated as Resource in Estimates and Accounts, RfR2 Departmental Unallocated Provision in part but which are treated as Capital DEL in Budgets. repayment of a loan made from non-Science to Science ***Depreciation, which forms part of Resource DEL, is excluded from the total DEL since Capital DEL includes Capital spending and to include depreciation in 2007); of those assets would lead to double counting. RfR2 The net increase in resource DEL and the Administration i) a Machinery of Government transfer from the Budget of £15,000,000 is the net effect of the take up of Department for Innovation, Universities and Skills of Administration Budget EYF in RfR 1 Section A to £47,676,000 voted and £644,053,000 non-voted in respect fund the costs of the increased workload arising from of Science programmes; financial stability work. ii) a Machinery of Government transfer from the There is a reduction in non-voted DEL of £3,631,000 Department for Innovation, Universities and Skills of due to the draw down of Departmental Unallocated £175,840,000 non-voted in respect of the Departmental Provision (£1,531,000 Administration Budget and Unallocated Provision; £2,100,000 programme costs) to offset increased voted iii) virement of £2,000,000 non-voted Departmental spending in RfR 1 Section A. Unallocated provision to voted expenditure by the British The capital DEL is being reduced by £625,000,000 Academy; following the revision of forecast spending in 2009-10 iv) reduction of £18,000,000 in the non-voted Departmental by the Infrastructure Finance Unit Ltd. Unallocated Provision in part repayment of a loan made from non-Science to Science in 2007 (utilised to H M Revenue and Customs DEL (2009-10) fund increased RfR1 Small Firms Loan Guarantee expenditure); v) reduction of £25,000,000 in the non-voted Departmental The Financial Secretary to the Treasury (Mr. Stephen Unallocated Provision in part repayment of a loan Timms): Subject to parliamentary approval of the made from non-Science to Science in 2007 (utilised to supplementary estimate, the HM Revenue & Customs fund an RfR1 transfer to the Department for Communities total DEL will be decreased by £253,820,000 from and Local Government in respect of the “Building £4,317,670,000 to £4,063,850,000. Within the total DEL Britain’s Future” Housing Pledge). change, the impact on resources and capital are as set RfR3 out in the following table: i) a Machinery of Government transfer from the £’000 Department for Innovation, Universities and Skills of a net negative £198,000,000 voted and £1,953,328,000 Change New DEL non-voted in respect of Education programmes; Non- Non- ii) virement of £10,000,000 to non-voted capital from Voted Voted Voted voted Total non-voted resource in respect of the Learning and Resource DEL -190,581 -38,387 3,677,851 351,337 4,029,188 Skills Council. Of which: Administration -158,804 -42,585 3,957,886 - 3,957,886 TREASURY Budget* Near-cash in -179,853 -38,387 3,356,397 385,485 3,741,882 Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) RDEL* Capital** -9,522 -3,559 241,633 - 241,633 The Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury (Sarah Less -11,771 - -206,971 - -206,971 McCarthy-Fry): Subject to parliamentary approval of Depreciation*** the winter supplementary estimate, HM Treasury’s resource Total DEL -211,874 -41,946 3,712,513 351,337 4,063,850 33WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 34WS

*The total of the ‘Administration Budget’ and ‘Near Cash in Resource DEL’ Change New Del Total figures may well be greater than total Resource DEL, due to the definitions overlapping. Non- Non- **Capital DEL includes items treated as Resource in Estimates and Accounts, Voted voted Voted Voted but which are treated as Capital DEL in Budgets. ***Depreciation, which forms part of Resource DEL, is excluded from the Resource 26,492 -4,994 183,599 - 183,599 total DEL since Capital DEL includes Capital spending and to include Del: depreciation of those assets would lead to double counting. Of which: - Administration 26,492 -4,994 183,599 - 183,599 The change in the resource element of DEL arises budget: primarily from: Near cash in 26,492 -4,994 179,104 - 179,104 RDEL A reduction of £303,166,000 resource (of which £271,389,000 relates to administration costs) due to a Machinery of Government Capital - - 3,176 - 3,176 transfer from HMRC to the Home Office as part of the Depreciation* - - -3,015 - -3,015 establishment of the UK Border Agency (UKBA). Total 26,492 -4,994 183,760 - 183,760 The draw down of end year flexibility of £70,000,000 administration *Depreciation, which forms part of Resource DEL, is excluded from near cash in accordance with the Public Expenditure outturn the total DEL since Capital DEL includes Capital spending and to White paper (CM 7606). include depreciation of those assets would lead to double counting. The take up of £42,585,000 non-voted departmental unallocated The change in the resource element of DEL arises from: provision as voted administration near cash to facilitate improvements to key operational activities (this is DEL neutral). A drawdown of £ 1,498,000 from the Modernisation Fund for the development and implementation of the IS strategy. A transfer of £4,198,000 near cash non-voted programme expenditure from the Ministry of Justice for work related to A drawdown of £20,000,000 of end year flexibility for continuation National Insurance benefits. of modernisation programmes that commenced in 2008-09. These cover IS Infrastructure Programme, Strategic Platform The change in the administration budget arises from Development Programme, Dematerialisation and Authentication. the specific administration items detailed in the resource element above. A drawdown of its departmental unallocated provision of £4,994,000 to fund the simplification and modernisation The change in the capital element of DEL arises programme. from: A reduction of £13,081,000 capital due to a Machinery of Government transfer from HMRC to the Home Office as part CABINET OFFICE of the establishment of the UK Border Agency (UKBA). The take up of £3,559,000 non-voted departmental unallocated Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) provision as voted capital to facilitate improvements to key operational activities (this is DEL neutral). The Minister for the Cabinet Office and for the Olympics, and Paymaster General (Tessa Jowell): Subject to National Savings and Investments DEL (2009-10) parliamentary approval of the winter supplementary estimate 2009-10, the Cabinet Office total departmental The Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury (Sarah expenditure limit (DEL) will be increased by £17,068,000 McCarthy-Fry): Subject to parliamentary approval of from £377,081,000 to £394,149,000 and annually managed any necessary supplementary estimate, National Savings expenditure (AME) will be increased by £10,000 from and Investments DEL will be increased by £26,492 to £Nil to £10,000. £183,760,000. Within DEL change, the impact on resources The impact on resources and capital is set out in the and capital are set out in the following table: following table:

Winter Supplementary Estimate New £’000 Main Estimate DEL Changes DEL

Non Non Non Voted Voted Total Voted Voted Total Voted Voted Total

Resource DEL 324,540 36,875 361,415 +8,414 +8,140 +16,554 332,954 45,015 377,969

Of which:

Administration 207,833 - 207,833 -1,436 - -1,436 206,397 - 206,397 Budget

Near cash in 279,762 36,875 316,637 +8,414 +8,140 +16,554 288,176 45,015 333,191 RDEL

Capital DEL** 49,471 1,000 50,471 +514 - +514 49,985 1,000 50,985

Depreciation* -34,805 - -34,805 - - - -34,805 - -34,805

Total DEL 339,206 37,875 377,081 +8,928 +8,140 +17,068 348,134 46,015 394,149

Resource AME - - - - +10 +10 - 10 10

*Depreciation, which forms part of resource DEL, is excluded from the total DEL since capital DEL includes capital spending and to include depreciation of those assets would lead to double counting. **Capital DEL includes items treated as resource in estimates and accounts, but which are treated as Capital DEL in budgets. 35WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 36WS

Summary of Changes in DEL and AME Transfer from Non-Voted Resource DEL to AME The change in the resource element of DEL, an A transfer of £10,000 has been made from non-voted increase of £16.554 million, comprises a £18 million resource DEL to AME in respect of employee benefits agreed claim on the Reserve, £0.010 million transfer to for accrued holiday pay which is a cost resulting from AME as a result of the implementation of International the adoption of International Financial Reporting Financial Reporting Standards (IFRS), £0.942 million Standards (IFRS). resulting from transfers of budgetary cover to other Changes in Capital DEL (CDEL) Government Departments and £0.494 million transfer to Capital DEL. The changes which result in a net increase in Capital DEL (CDEL) of £514,000 are as follows: The change in the capital element of DEL, an increase of £0.514 million, comprises a £0.494 million transfer Transfers from Voted Resource to Capital DEL from Resource DEL and a £0.020 million budgetary Transfers from voted Resource to Capital DEL increases cover transfer from another Government Department. Capital DEL by £494,000 and consists of the following: Changes in Resource DEL (RDEL) a £30,000 contribution towards the creation of a new The changes which result in a net increase in Resource Public Appointments Website, a £14,000 contribution DEL (RDEL) of £16,554,000 are as follows: in respect of software for a secure communication network and a £450,000 transfer to cover the expenditure on Agreed Claim on the Reserve enhancing the computer system which supports Civil A drawdown on the Reserve for the Grassroots Grant Service Pensions. programme increases Resource DEL and Net Cash Requirement by £18,000,000. Budget cover transfer inwards Budget cover transfers outwards A transfer of £20,000 has been made from the A transfer to the Department for Culture Media and Government Equalities Office to contribute to the costs Sport (DCMS) to cover costs of the Office of the of a new Public Appointments Website. Parliamentary Counsel reduces Resource DEL and Net Cash Requirement by £226,000. CHILDREN, SCHOOLS AND FAMILIES A transfer to the Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) to cover costs of the Office of the Parliamentary Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) Counsel reduces Resource DEL and Net Cash Requirement by £376,000. A transfer to the Department for Communities and The Secretary of State for Children, Schools and Local Government (DCLG) to cover work on community Families (Ed Balls): Subject to parliamentary approval cohesion reduces Resource DEL and Net Cash of any necessary supplementary estimate, the Department Requirement by £340,000. for Children, Schools and Families Departmental Transfers from Voted Resource to Capital DEL Expenditure Limit (DEL) will be increased by £33,571,000 Transfers from voted Resource to Capital DEL decreases from £56,381,456,000 to £56,415,027,000; the administration Resource DEL by £494,000 and consists of the following: cost budget will remain at £182,352,000. The Office for a £30,000 contribution towards the creation of a new Standards in Education, Children’s Services and Skills Public Appointments Website, a £14,000 contribution (OFSTED) which has a separate Estimate and DEL, in respect of software for a secure communication network will remain at £192,881,000 with the administration and a £450,000 transfer to cover the expenditure on cost budget remaining at £28,020,000. enhancing the computer system which supports Civil Within the DEL change, the impact on resources and Service Pensions. capital are as set out in the following table:

DCFS Resources Capital*** Of which: Of which: Change New DEL Voted Non-voted Change New DEL Voted Non- voted £’000 £’000 £’000 £’000 £’000 £’000 £’000 £’000

RfFM 8,479 47,593,554 46,319,708 1,273,846 32,522 6,991,188 3,303,536 3,687,652 RfR2 -7,430 1,447,260 1,422,910 24,350 0 383,025 383,025 0 DCSF Total 1,049 49,040,814 47,742,618 1,298,196 32,522 7,374,213 3,686,561 3,687,652 OFSTED 0 191,900 178,385 13,515 0 981 981 0 Sub Total 1,049 49,232,714 47,921,003 1,311,711 32,522 7,375,194 3,687,542 3,687,652 **Of which 0 210,372 210,372 0 0 0 0 0 Admin Budget Near-cash in 1,049 49,270,499 47,917,883 1,352,616 0 0 0 0 RDEL Depreciation* 0 -12,385 -8,826 -3,559 0 0 0 0 Total 1,049 49,207,944 47,912,177 1,308,152 32,522 7,375,194 3,687,542 3,687,652 *Depreciation, which forms part of resource DEL, is excluded from the total DEL, in the table above, since capital DEL includes capital spending and to include depreciation of those assets would lead to double counting. ** The total of ‘Administration budget’ and ‘Near-cash in resource DEL’ figures may well be greater than total resource DEL, due to the definitions overlapping. ***Capital DEL includes items treated as resource in Estimates and accounts but which are treated as Capital DEL in budgets. 37WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 38WS

Resource DEL Non-voted Capital DEL The increase in the resource element of the DEL of The £2,675,466,000 increase in the non-voted element £1,049,000 arises from an decrease in the voted element of capital DEL arises from: of the resource DEL of £28,340,000 and an increase of A take-up of End Year Flexibility of £65,114,000 to support £29,389,000 in the non-voted element of resource DEL the Department’s Non-Departmental Public Bodies with Building mainly in the Department’s Non-Departmental Public Schools for the Future and Academy costs. Bodies. A movement of £2,610,352,000 from voted resource for Capital Grants to Local Authorities to support Schools to non-voted Voted Resource DEL resource to support the Department’s Non-Departmental Public The £28,340,000 decrease in the voted element of the Bodies. resource DEL arises from: Office for Standards in Education, Children’s Services and Skills RFR1 There has been no change in overall DEL limits A movement of £4,500,000 from RfR2 for the National Strategies within the Winter Supplementary; however a movement Early Years programmes. of £10,000,000 from Non-VotedDepartmental Unallocated A movement of £300,000 from RfR2 for Early Support e-profile. Provision to Voted Resource has been made to cover A transfer to the Department for Business, Innovation and increased expenditure on existing services. Skills of £400,000 for the transfer of Crescent Purchasing to the College Sector. A transfer to the Ministry of Justice of £291,000 for Implementation of the Children and Adoption Act. COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT A transfer to the Scottish Office of £228,000 for Child Trust Funds. Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) A movement of £24,441,000 to non-voted resource DEL to support the Department’s Non-Departmental Public Bodies. RFR2 The Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government (Mr. John Denham): Subject to Parliamentary A transfer from the Department for Work and Pensions of £572,000 for Child Poverty programmes. approval of any necessary Supplementary Estimate, the Department for Communities and Local Government’s A movement of £4,500,000 to RfRl in respect of National Departmental Expenditure Limits for 2009-10 will change Strategies Early Years programmes. as follows: A movement of £300,000 to RfRl in respect of Early Support e-profile. The Department for Communities and Local Government’s Main Programmes DEL will be increased A movement of £3,202,000 to non-voted resource DEL to by £554,164,000 from £13,118,891,000 to £13,673,055,000 support the Department’s Non-Departmental Public Bodies. and the administration budget will also be increased by A movement of £350,000 to support the Department’s Non- £161,000 from £272,903,000 to £273,064,000. Within Departmental Public Bodies. the DEL change, the impact on resources and capital Non-voted resource DEL are as set out in the following table: The £29,389,000 increase in Non-voted resource DEL arises from: Change NEW DEL Non- Non- RFR1 Voted voted Voted voted Total

A transfer of £1,396,000 from the Home Office for the Migration Resource -55,135 55,324 3,891,278 653,803 4,545,081 Impact Fund. Of which A movement of £27,643,000 from voted resource to support Administration 161 0 273,064 0 273,064 the Department’s Non-Departmental Public Bodies. budget* RFR2 Near-cash in -47,074 47,263 3,847,136 500,532 4,347,668 RDEL A movement of £350,000 from voted resource to support the Capital ** -70,097 625,097 2,143,306 7,034,464 9,177,770 Department’s Non-Departmental Public Bodies. Depreciation*** -27 -998 -36,050 -13,746 -49,796 Capital DEL Total -125,259 679,423 5,998,534 7,674,521 13,673,055 * The increase in the capital element of the DEL of £32,522,000 The total of ‘Administration budget’ and ‘Near-cash in resource DEL’ figures may be greater than total resource DEL due to the definitions overlapping. arises from a £2,642,944,000 decrease in the voted element of ** Capital DEL includes items treated as resource in Estimates and accounts capital DEL and an increase of £2,675,466,000 in the non-voted but which are treated as Capital DEL in budgets element of capital DEL. ***Depreciation, which forms part of resource DEL, is excluded from the total DEL, since capital DEL includes capital spending and to include depreciation Voted Capital DEL of those assets would lead to double counting. The £2,642,944,000 decrease in the voted element of the capital DEL arises from: The change in the resource element of the DEL arises from: A take-up of End Year Flexibility of £67,408,000 for Building Schools for the Future and Academy costs. (i) A net transfer of £1,135,000 to Request for Resources 2 ( Local Government DEL) from Request for Resources 1 A reduction of £100,000,000 from RfRl voted Capital Grants (Main DEL) comprising: to Local Authorities for Building Britain’s Future. From RfRl to RfR2 A movement of £2,610,352,000 from voted resource for Capital Grants to Local Authorities to support Schools to non-voted a) £200,000 from Implementing Planning Reforms to resource to support the Department’s Non-Departmental Public London Governance to fund the Mayor’s new planning Bodies. powers in the Greater London Authority Act 2007; 39WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 40WS b) £1,432,000 from Fire and Rescue Services Improvement (ii) Planning Performance Agreements for Renewable Programme to Best Value Inspection to pay the Audit and Low-Carbon Energy Planning Applications Commission’s bill in respect of work on ’Fire’; (£300,000); c) £76,000 from Efficient Geographic and Statistics to (iii) Rural master-planning (joint with the Department Best Value Inspection for secondment costs relating to for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs)(£250,000); the Data Inter Change Hub. (iv) Advisory Team on Large Applications (ATLAS) From RfR2 to RfRl (£2,500,000). d) £573,000 from Local Government Research and (c) £15,711,000 of uncommitted and available resources Publicity, comprising of £500,000 for Cohesion Race to the Departmental Unallocated Provision (DUP), and Equality to provide a more streamlined and effective where it is available for other uses, from various programmes. research team and £73,000 for Main DEL Research for These represent transfers from: the new strategic research budget. (i) Supporting People Administration (£3,280,000); (ii) a net transfer of £1,943,000 from other Government (ii) Regeneration Strategy (£600,000) Departments, comprising: (iii) Local Enterprise Growth Initiative (£2,359,000); To other Government Departments (iv) National Register of Social Housing (£419,000) Programme Expenditure (v) Regeneration Monitoring and Digital Inclusion (£2,000,000); (a) £233,000 to the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs for new burdens for the Environment (vi) Efficient Geographic and Statistical Data Agency implementation of the Mine Waste Directive. (£4,581,000); (vii) Planning Inspectorate (£2,472,000); From other Government Departments (d) £606,000 for West Northamptonshire Development Programme Expenditure Corporation comprising £400,000 to fund costs in respect (a) £1,396,000 from the Home Office in respect of their of unfunded legal challenges on planning (£300,000 contribution to the from New Deal for Communities and £100,000 from Migration Impact Fund; Valuation Office Agency) and £206,000 from Planning Inspectorate to cover cost of capital; Administration Costs (Government Offices) (e) £1,667,000 from Efficient Geographic and Statistical (b) £340,000 from Cabinet Office to Government Offices Data to the Tenant Services Authority (TSA) budgets for work on Community Cohesion; to cover the cost of taking over the maintenance and (c) £440,000 from the Department for Work and Pensions running of the National Register of Social Housing to Government Offices for work on Older Persons database which is to be transferred to the TSA; agenda; (f) £18,206,000 transfer to Arms length bodies comprising (iii) a decrease of £619,000 for Government Offices to £16,500,000 from Thames Gateway direct funding to reflect of technical accounting changes as a consequence Thames Gateway Development Corporations; £1,706,000 of implementing International Financial Reporting from Community Empowerment to the Community Standards; Development Foundation. (iv) a net increase in receipts of £34,556,000 offsetting Administration costs - and Other Current increases in provision of: £100,000 for the Residential (g) £12,300,000 (near cash) from voted Government Property Tribunal Service for Tribunal Hearing applications; Offices (Other Current) to non-voted Government Offices £100,000 for Supporting People Administration; £600,000 to adjust budgets for utilisation of provisions in respect for the Regeneration Strategy to help establish the of early exit costs and National Worklessness Forum; £7,954,000 for Planning (h) £1,400,000 (non-cash) from Central Administration Inspectorate to fund projected spend; £250,000 for Fire to non-voted Government Offices to correct the baseline and Rescue Services Improvement Programme to enable provision of both pay and provision release; the Department to invoice the Fire Service College to From non-voted to voted provision recover subscription expenditure; £1,800,000 for Central Administration to fund outward secondments; and Programme Costs £23,752,000 for various Government Office programmes (i) £309,000 drawn down from the Department Unallocated including £672,000 for technical changes in implementing Provision (DUP) for the National Register of Social the International Financial Reporting Standards. Housing Capital Plan; (v) a net transfer of £55,324,000 from voted to non- Administration costs voted provision comprising: (j) £1,400,000 (near cash) from non-voted Government From voted to non-voted provision Offices to voted Government Offices to correct the baseline provision of both pay and provision release; Programme Expenditure The change in the administration budget arises from a (a) £3,953,000 to the newly formed Infrastructure Planning transfer of £780,000 from other Government Departments Commission from Implementing Planning Reforms (see above section (ii) and a decrease of £619,000 for the (£3,661,000) and Planning Inspectorate (£292,000); transition to International Financial Reporting Standards (b) £3,190,000 to the Homes and Communities Agency (see section (iii)). (HCA) in respect of: The change in the capital element of the DEL arises from (i) Commitment in the ″Lifetime Homes, Lifetime (vi) a transfer of £420,000,000 from other Government Neighbourhoods: a National Strategy for Housing in Departments to the Homes and Communities Agency an Ageing Society ″(£140,000); towards the Housing Pledge. The Pledge was announced 41WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 42WS on 29 June as part of Building Britain’s Future. This Zero Carbon Standards (New Buildings) comprises £350,000,000 from Department for Transport; £25,000,000 from the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills and £45,000,000 from the Home Office. The Minister for Housing (John Healey): The Government (vii) £135,000,000 of funds brought forward from 2010-11 have recognised the serious global risks from climate for the Homes and Communities Agency in respect of change and have set in legislation a challenging target to the Housing Pledge as announced on 29 June. reduce UK carbon emissions by 80 per cent. against (viii) a net increase in receipts of £450,000 fully offset by 1990 levels by 2050. Emissions from the way we heat, increases in provision for the Fire and Rescue Services cool and power buildings are important in achieving Improvement Programme. This relates to a short term this target: 17 per cent. of UK emissions are from working capital loan to the Fire Service College. non-domestic buildings and 27 per cent. from homes. The scale of the challenge means that we need to find (ix) a net transfer of £70,097,000 from voted to non- ways of reducing emissions from all types of building as voted provision comprising part of the UK’s transition to a low carbon economy. From voted to non-voted provision I am today reaffirming the Government’s commitment (a) £70,000,000 from Thames Gateway direct expenditure to the ambition for all new non-domestic buildings to to Thames Gateway Development Corporation; be zero carbon from 2019, and publishing a consultation (b) £1,800,000 from Planning Inspectorate to the Homes document that sets out policy principles and options for and Communities Agency to cover additional meeting this ambition. I am also setting out our plans accommodation/IT costs incurred as a result of its for how new public sector buildings could lead the way, set-up; building on the work of a cross-departmental task force of government officials. We are seeking views on these (c) £1,460,000 to a new Non Departmental Public Body, options and their implications for viability for individual the Infrastructure Planning Commission from E-Planning developments and sectors. The consultation closes on (£450,000) and the Planning Inspectorate (£1,010,000). 26 February 2010. From non- voted to voted provision This follows my statement in July, when I confirmed (d) £3,163,000 from Local Authority Supported Capital the Government’s policy that all new homes will be zero Expenditure to Regional Housing Pot to assist with carbon from 2016 and announced further details on the programme delivery in East Midlandsand South-East. definition and standards we will legislate for. One in (2) The Department for Communities and Local Government’s three of Britain’s homes in 2050 will be built between Local Government DEL will be increased by £60,150,000 now and then. So today I am also providing an update from £25,700,995,000 to £25,761,145,000. Within the on the definition and measurement of zero carbon DEL change, the impact on resources and capital are as homes, following the report of a specialist task group. set out in the following table: Zero carbon non-domestic buildings In December 2008 we published a consultation on Change NEW DEL options to meet the definition of zero carbon, which Non- Non- included some initial thinking about what this could Voted voted Voted voted Total mean for non-domestic buildings. I am announcing Resource 961 174 25,479,000 118,051 25,597,051 today our more detailed proposals and the next steps Of which needed to enable new commercial buildings to be zero Administration carbon from 2019. * budget We will adopt the broad framework for zero carbon Near-cash in 961 189 25,479,000 116,961 25,595,961 RDEL that has been developed for homes, but adapted Capital ** 59,000 0 164,122 978 165,100 appropriately to reflect the differences in the non-domestic Depreciation*** 0 15 0 -1,006 -1,006 buildings market and the variation between non-domestic Total 59,961 189 25,643,122 118,023 25,761,145 buildings. This means that, as supported by responses ** Capital DEL includes items treated as resource in Estimates and accounts to the 2008 consultation, we will be using the threefold but which are treated as Capital DEL in budgets hierarchy of energy efficiency, followed by onsite or ***Depreciation, which forms part of resource DEL, is excluded from the total linked low and zero carbon technologies (“carbon DEL, since capital DEL includes capital spending and to include depreciation of those assets would lead to double counting. compliance”), followed by primarily offsite “allowable solutions”. The change in the resource element of the DEL arises The policy will also reflect the important differences from: in non-domestic buildings, including the much wider (i) a net transfer of £1,135,000 from Request for Resources variation in building types, locations, and uses, which 1 (Main DEL) comprising (see above section l(i)). can impact on both potential solutions and costs. We are therefore proposing that new non-domestic buildings (ii) an increase in receipts of £13,600,000 offsetting an should improve through an approach with differentiated increase in expenditure for Local Government Public targets to reflect the different potential different buildings Services Agreement repayment of capital grants to Local have for energy efficiency and for onsite levels of carbon Authorities abatement. The consultation seeks views on this approach. The change in the capital element of the DEL arises Non-domestic buildings often have greater potential from: for onsite renewables (for example, more roof space) (iii) a take up of End Year Flexibility of £59,000,000 and to play a central role in the viability of community to meet commitments for the Local Government heat or energy networks. We need to determine the Public Service Agreement Performance Fund. extent to which we encourage use of these opportunities, 43WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 44WS and the consultation covers these questions. Onsite heat consultation on updating the Code for Sustainable Homes and energy generation will also be eligible for financial to check that there are no unintended consequences assistance under Government incentive schemes for small- from this standard and to seek views on the energy scale renewable generation, providing future income efficiency standard to be adopted in 2013. By aligning streams. our approach to energy efficiency and zero carbon Any carbon not mitigated onsite will be dealt with within the Code, we will smooth the transition to zero through a range of good quality ‘allowable solutions’. carbon homes in 2016. We are proposing that we will bring in some allowable The task group has made a number of additional solutions from 2016, alongside the approach for homes, recommendations for further research and modelling to and thus develop a single system for delivery and assurance. support the proposed energy standard. I shall be taking This early deployment could help to increase the volume these recommendations forward, in collaboration with and therefore viability of the allowable solutions market the Zero Carbon Hub and other relevant research and in its early years, and could increase the opportunities industry bodies. One of the particular recommendations for non-domestic developments to contribute to community is that industry will need design guidance to support the energy solutions. I have said that I will make a further standard. I recognise that industry will need such guidance announcement later about the allowable solutions that and will work with industry to produce this. will be included. I can also announce that the Government-funded For non-domestic buildings, the variation in energy Technology Strategy Board is allocating £3.2 million of uses is considerably greater than for homes—reflecting funding to boost long-term research into how we design the range of different uses for individual building types and build low carbon homes. The research will use new as well as the range of energy-intensity of different technologies and materials to provide valuable evidence commercial activity. As a minimum, the zero carbon for future standards and how to drive down energy bills. standard for non-domestic buildings will include 100 per This funding is part of the Technology Strategy Board’s cent. of energy uses currently covered by the Building £50 million Low Impact Buildings Innovation Platform, Regulations (principally space heating, cooling and internal which is being allocated to projects in the period to lighting). We are considering in addition a simplified 2011. The money will be used by a consortium—including way of accounting for ongoing energy use in the building Barratt Developments, Crest Nicholson, Stewart-Milne, (such as machinery, refrigeration, or computers), through H + H Celcon, Oxford Brookes University and the requiring either 10 or 20 per cent. extra improvement on Building Research Establishment—to build demonstration top of regulated energy. The consultation seeks views homes. on this and its potential impact on market viability. These homes will be built without the use of on-site The public sector can play a significant role in supporting renewables so as to test just how far it is possible to go market development of low and zero carbon buildings. towards zero carbon through energy efficient fabric We confirm our ambition from Budget 2008 that the measures alone and the implications of doing so. Having public sector should aim to make the move to zero designed and built the homes, they will be monitored to carbon for new non-domestic buildings by 2018, one find out the energy savings that occupants realise in year ahead of commercial buildings. The consultation practice and to learn more about the occupants’ experience sets out our proposals for a work programme to deliver of living in highly energy efficient homes. The lessons this. we learn from these homes will be valuable evidence to I have placed a copy of the consultation document support the way that the zero carbon homes of the and the detailed impact assessment that accompanies it future are built. in the Library of the House. Zero carbon homes Gypsy and Traveller Caravan Count 2009 I announced in July that I would set up a specialist task group to examine the energy efficiency metrics and The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for standards that should be part of zero carbon homes, in Communities and Local Government (Mr. Shahid Malik): order to realise our ambition for the highest practical The Government have today published the “Count of energy efficiency level realisable in all dwelling types. Gypsy and Traveller Caravans on 16 July 2009”. Following an intensive period of analysis and wider Copies have been placed in the Libraries of both involvement of industry, commercial and environmental Houses and can be accessed via the Communities and bodies, the task group has now reported to me. I am Local Government website at: grateful to the task group for their excellent work and am placing a copy of their report in the Library of the http://www.communities.gov.uk/publications/ House. corporate/statistics/caravancountjul2009 The recommendations are for an energy standard that is measured as the amount of energy required to CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT provide space heating and cooling. The proposed standard is 46 kilowatt-hours per square metre per year (kWh/m2/ year) for semi-detached and detached homes and 39 Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) kWh/m2/year for all other homes. The further details of what that means are set out in the task group’s report. The Secretary of State for Culture, Media and Sport I am satisfied that the task group’s recommendations (Mr. Ben Bradshaw): Subject to Parliamentary approval, strike the right balance between a high level of ambition the Department for Culture Media and Sport’s and a standard that can be realised in practice by 2016. Departmental Expenditure Limit (DEL) will be increased I therefore intend to use this standard within the definition by £85,705,000 from £1,974,663,000 to £2,060,368,000 of zero carbon homes. I will be using our forthcoming and the administration budget will increase by £6,926,000 45WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 46WS from £48,207,000 to £55,133,000. Within the DEL change £000s the impact on resource and capital are set out in the Change New DEL following table: Non- Non- Departmental Expenditure Limits and Administration Budgets Voted Voted Voted voted Total Change New DEL £’000 Near-cash 34,792 32,980 26,371,391 424,925 26,796,316 Non- Non- in Voted voted Voted voted Total RDEL Capital -71,000 - 9,048,789 851 9,049,640 Resource DEL 9,696 -1,491 103,335 1,585,502 1,688,837 Depreciation* -81,000 - -8,354,962 -9,520 -8,364,482 of which: Total 143,792 32,980 39,381,335 214,776 39,596,111 Administration 6,926 55,133 55,133 * budget* Depreciation, which forms part of Resource DEL, is excluded from the total DEL since capital DEL includes capital spending and to include depreciation Near-cash in 9,696 -1,491 93,956 1,357,881 1,451,837 of those assets would lead to double counting. RDEL Capital** 585 76,915 -784,204 1,266,104 481,900 The changes to the resource and capital elements of the Less 1,631 -6,405 -103,964 -110,369 Depreciation*** DEL arise from: Total 10,281 77,055 -687,274 2,747,642 2,060,368 to transfer £100,000,000 capital resource to direct resource *The total of ‘Administration budget’ and ‘Near-cash in Resource DEL’ within RfRl relating to single use military equipment (SUME) figures may well be greater than total resource DEL, due to the definitions flexibility with no overall impact on DEL; overlapping. **Capital DEL includes items treated as resource in Estimates and accounts a transfer in from the Department for Transport of £500,000 in but which are treated as Capital DEL in budgets. respect of funding arrangements for the Royal Flight (RfRl); ***Depreciation, which forms part of resource DEL, is excluded from total transfers out to the Foreign and Commonwealth Office being DEL since capital DEL includes capital spending and to include depreciation the MOD’s contribution to the Afghanistan delivery group of of those assets would lead to double counting. £6,500,000 (RfRl); transfers out to the Department for International The change in the resource element of the DEL arises Development of £500,000 being the MOD’s contribution to from: the tri-department stabilisation unit (RfRl) and £6,729,000 being the MOD’s contribution to the conflict pool (enabled by Take-up of £7,179,000 End Yearflexibility comprising: a token increase of £1,000 resource DEL in RfR2); (£3,000,000) UK Film; (£879,000) Central DCMS Invest an increase in fiscal capital resource of £17,000,000 to reflect to Save Budget (ISB); and £3,300,000 Administration the abatement of the MOD 2008-09 Treasury fine, which budget. resulted from a smaller overspend than originally forecasted; Transfers from other Government Departments of: an increase in fiscal capital resource of £15,000,000 to reflect £800,000 from Department for International Development treasury relief for lower capital receipts in Northern Ireland for International Inspirations; and £226,000 from Cabinet than originally forecasted; Office to cover baseline costs of the Parliamentary an increase of £20,000,000 resource DEL (funded from our Counsel. 2008-09 end year flexibility stock) to reflect the Government decision to negate the impact of the planned MOD training The administration cost limit has increased by £6,926,000 costs 2009-10 budget reduction for the Territorial Army (RfRl); from £48,207,000 to £55,133,000. This is as a result of a transfer from Cabinet Office of £226,000 detailed above; to reflect the estimated net resource ( near cash and indirect cost) impact of the third stage of the international financial take-up of £3,300,000 Administration End YearFlexibility reporting standards for leases relating to Annington Homes and an agreed transfer of £3,400,000 from programme (IAS 17) of £222,000,000; to administration costs. to reflect the estimated net capital resource ( near cash) impact The capital element of the DEL has increased by of the third stage of the international financial reporting £77,500,000 reflecting take-up of End Year Flexibility standards for leases relating to Annington Homes (IAS 17) by the Olympic Delivery Authority. being a reduction of £3,000,000; to increase non-budget grants in aid (non-voted) for the Council of Reserve Forces and Cadets Association of £31,700,000; DEFENCE £180,000 for the National Army Museum; and £1,100,000 for the Royal Hospital, Chelsea ; by reducing resource DEL current Departmental Expenditure (2009-10) costs and increasing non-budget grants in aid with no overall impact on resource; to revise sub-head provisions to reflect resource and capital The Secretary of State for Defence (Mr. Bob Ainsworth): revisions in allocations between top level budget-holders to Subject to parliamentary approval of the necessary match required defence outputs, with no overall impact on supplementary estimate, the Ministry of Defence DEL. Departmental Expenditure Limits (DEL) will be increased The changes to resource DEL and capital DEL will by £176,772,000 (Voted and Non Voted) from lead to an increased net cash requirement of £38,501,000. £39,419,339,000 to £39,596,111,000. Within the DEL change, the impact on resources and capital are as set out in the following table: Supplementary Estimate (2009-10)

£000s Change New DEL Non- Non- The Secretary of State for Defence (Mr. Bob Ainsworth): Voted Voted Voted voted Total The Ministry of Defence votes A Supplementary Estimate 2009-10, will be laid before the House on 24 November Resource 295,792 32,980 38,687,508 223,445 38,910,953 as HC7. This outlines the change in the maximum Of which: --2,237,737 - 2,237,737 Administration numbers of personnel to be maintained for service in Budget the Naval Service during financial year 2009-10. 47WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 48WS

ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE a transfer to the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills of £25,000,000 for the UK Innovation Investment Fund Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) a transfer to the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills for the Technology Strategy Board of £2,100,000 The Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change for the fuel cells and hydrogen demonstration programme (Edward Miliband): Subject to Parliamentary approval a transfer from non-voted Capital DEL of £170,000 of any necessary Supplementary Estimate, the Department an increase of £121,599,000 in nuclear decommissioning of Energy and Climate Change Departmental Expenditure authority non-operating appropriations-in-aid. Limit (DEL) will decrease by £22,700,000 from Non-voted Capital DEL £3,125,377,000 to £3,102,677,000. The £121,429,000 increase in the non-voted element Within the DEL change, the impact on resources and of Capital DEL arises from: capital are as set out in the following table: a transfer to voted Capital DEL of £170,000

£’000 an increase of £121,599,000 in nuclear decommissioning Change New DEL authority DEL offsetting the increase in non-operating Non- Non- appropriations-in-aid. Voted Voted Voted Voted Total OFGEM DEL (2009-10)

Resource DEL 39,044 -39,044 -704,781 1,809,944 1,105,163 Subject to Parliamentary approval of the necessary Of which: Supplementary Estimate, the Office of Gas and Electricity Market’s DEL will be increased by £1,000 from £651,000 Administration - - 93,512 - 93,512 Budget * to £652,000 and the administration budget will be increased Near Cash in 39,044 -39,044 -728,313 1,854,438 1,126,125 by £1,000 from £701,000 to £702,000. * Resource DEL New DEL ** Capital DEL -144,129 121,429 682,201 1,322,404 2,004,605 £’000 Less Depreciation - - -2,987 -4,104 -7,091 *** Non- Change Voted voted Total Total DEL -105,085 82,385 -25,567 3,128,244 3,102,677 *The total of ‘Administration Budget’ and ‘Near Cash in Resource DEL’ Resource DEL 1 702 0 702 figures may well be greater than total Resource DEL, due to the definitions Of which: * 1 702 0 702 overlapping. Administration budget 1 -93 700 607 ** Capital DEL includes items treated as resource in estimates and accounts Near-cash in RDEL but which are treated as Capital DEL in budgets. Near-cash in RDEL 1 -93 700 607 *** Depreciation, which forms part of Resource DEL, is excluded from the total DEL in the table above, since Capital DEL includes capital spending and Capital DEL** 0 950 0 950 to include depreciation of those assets would lead to double counting. Depreciation 0 -1000 0 -1000 Total 1 652 0 652 Resource DEL *The total of the ‘Administration Budget’ and ‘Near-cash in Resource DEL’ The Resource element of the DEL remains unchanged figures may well be greater than total Resource DEL, due to the definitions overlapping with an increase in the voted element of Resource DEL **Capital DEL includes items treated as resource in estimates and accounts but of £39,044,000 offset by a decrease of £39,044,000 in which are treated as Capital DEL in budgets. the non-voted element of Resource DEL. Depreciation, which forms part of resource DEL, is excluded from the total DEL since capital DEL includes capital spending and to include depreciation of Voted resource DEL those assets would lead to double counting. The £39,044,000 increase in the voted element of The change in the resource element of the DEL arises Resource DEL arises from: from a token increase in administration costs. The a decrease of £34,043,000 in nuclear decommissioning token increase is necessary to bring to Parliament’s authority operating appropriations-in-aid attention an increase in administration costs of £4,001,000 offset by an increase in appropriations in aid of £4,000,000. a transfer from non-voted Resource DEL of £5,001,000. The increase in administration costs is as a result of Non-voted Resource DEL additional unplanned expenditure on administration of The £39,044,000 decrease in non-voted Resource DEL the Smart Meter project, and the offshore transmission arises from: tender process. a decrease of £34,043,000 in nuclear decommissioning There is no change in the capital element of the DEL. authority DEL offsetting the reduction in appropriations- in-aid ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL AFFAIRS a transfer to voted Resource DEL of £5,001,000. Capital DEL Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) The decrease in the Capital element of the DEL of £22,700,000 arises from a decrease in the voted element of Capital DEL of £144,129,000 and an increase of The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for £121,429,000 in the non-voted element of Capital DEL. Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Dan Norris): Subject to Parliamentary approval of any necessary Supplementary Voted Capital DEL Estimate, the Department for Environment, Food and The £144,129,000 decrease in the voted element of Rural Affairs DEL will be reduced by £4,566,000 (0.14 per Capital DEL arises from: cent.) from £3,153,699,000 to £3,149,133,000. The a transfer from the Department for the Environment, Administration Budget remains unchanged at £304,296,000. Food and Rural Affairs of £4,400,000 for Anaerobic Within the DEL change, the impact on resources and digestion capital are as set out in the following table: 49WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 50WS

Changes in Capital DEL (CDEL) £‘000s Change New DEL The change in the capital element of DEL of £80,000 Non- Non- arises in a claim on capital end of year flexibility to Voted voted Total Voted voted Total cover the cost of Phase 2 of the new telephone switch system. Resource -1,258 1,633 375 4,001,027 -1,292,020 2,709,007 of which: Administration ---304,296 - 304,296 FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE Budget Near-cash in -1,258 1,633 375 3,748,889 -1,375,314 2,373,575 Resource Sanctions Regimes DEL Capital -4,400 - -4,400 270,376 394,139 664,515 Depreciation* -541 - -541 -125,270 -99,119 -224,389 The Minister for Europe (Chris Bryant): The Government Total -6,199 1,633 -4,566 4,146,133 -997,000 3,149,133 are committed to keeping Parliament informed of the *Depreciation, which forms part of resource DEL, is excluded from the total sanctions regimes which the UK implements. Currently DEL since capital DEL includes capital spending and to include depreciation of the UK implements United Nations sanctions in relation those assets would lead to double counting. to Al Qaida and the Taliban, Côte d’Ivoire, the Democratic The change in the resource element of the DEL of £375,000 Republic of the Congo, Democratic Peoples’ Republic arises from (i) a transfer of £233,000 programme spend of Korea, Iran, Iraq, Lebanon, Liberia, Sierra Leone, from the Department for Communities and Local Somalia, Sudan and in relation to terrorism as laid out Government for an inventory of former mining waste in UN Security Council Resolution 1373. sites in England; (ii) ‘Need it/Build it’ Invest to Save The UK also implements sanctions regimes imposed Budget (ISB) of £142,000. autonomously by the EU in relation to Belarus, Burma, There has also been a transfer within the resource China, the former Federal Republic of Yugoslavia (in element of the DEL of £1,633,000 from voted to non-voted. connection with individuals indicted by the International This relates to budget transfers from the core Department Criminal Tribunal for the former Yugoslavia or responsible (voted) to the Departments Non Departmental Public for certain acts of violence at Mostar), Guinea, the Bodies (non-voted). Transnistrian region of Moldova, and Zimbabwe. The change in the capital element of the DEL of -£4,400,000 In accordance with a decision of the organisation for arises from a transfer of £4,400,000 to the Department security and co-operation in Europe, the UK implements of Energy and Climate Change for the Waste and arms embargoes on Armenia and Azerbaijan. The Resources Action Programme. Government also take full account of the economic The change in the depreciation budget of -£541,000 relates community of West African states moratorium on certain to the creation of the Food and Environment Research exports of small arms and light weapons to economic Agency. community of West African states members. A document listing the sanctions regimes and restrictive (Ofwat): Capital End of Year Flexibility Draw Down measures implemented by the UK is being laid in the Libraries of both Houses. It is also published on the Foreign and Commonwealth Office website at: www.fco. The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for gov.uk/en/about-us/what-we-do/services-we-deliver/ Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Huw Irranca-Davies): business-services/export-controls-sanctions/. This document Subject to parliamentary approval of HM Treasury outlines the restrictive measures in place and includes agreement to capital end of year flexibility draw down objectives and lift criteria for each regime. in 2009-10, the capital element of DEL (CDEL) will increase by £80,000. Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) Resource DEL (RDEL) remains at £1,000 representing the ‘token vote’; no additional cash requirement is required. The Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth The impact on resources and capital is set out in the Affairs (David Miliband): Subject to parliamentary approval following table: of any necessary supplementary estimate, the Foreign and Commonwealth Office departmental expenditure New DEL £’000 limit (DEL) will be increased by £104,995,000 from Change Voted Non-voted Total £2,141,898,000 to £2,246,893,000. The administration budget will be increased by £6,500,000 from £420,345,000 Resource DEL 0 1 0 1 to £426,845,000. Within the DEL change, the impact on of which: resources and capital are as set out in the following Administration budget* 01 0 1table: Near cash in DEL 0 -234 0 -234 Capital ** 80 480 0 480 Change £000 New DEL £000 *** Depreciation 0 -189 0 -189 Non- Non- Total 80 292 0 292 Voted voted Voted voted Total *The total of the ‘administration budget’ and ‘near cash in resource DEL’ figures may well be greater than total Resource DEL, due to the definitions Resource 121,745 -17,000 2,130,633 3,000 2,133,633 overlapping. Of which: **Capital DEL includes items treated as resource in estimates and accounts but which are treated as capital DEL in budgets. Administration 23,500 -17,000 426,845 – 426,845 * ***Depreciation., which forms part of resource DEL, is excluded from the total budget DEL since capital DEL since capital DEL includes capital spending and to Near-cash in 81,745 -17,000 1,920,579 16,000 1,936,579 include depreciation of those assets would lead to double counting. Resource DEL 51WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 52WS

responsibility for international defence and security, Change £000 New DEL £000 Baroness Taylor and I represented the UK. The agenda Non- Non- Voted voted Voted voted Total items covered were as follows: GENERAL AFFAIRS Capital** 250 – 216,310 – 216,310 Depreciation *** – – -103,050 – -103,050 The full text of Conclusions adopted, including ‘A’ Total 121,995 -17,000 2,243,893 3,000 2,246,893 points, can be found at: * The total of ‘Administration budget’ and ‘Near-cash in Resource DEL’ figures http://www.consilium.europa.eu/uedocs/cms_data/ may well be greater than total resource DEL, due to the definitions overlapping. docs/pressdata/en/gena/111231.pdf ** Capital DEL includes items treated as resource in Estimates and accounts but which are treated as Capital DEL in budgets. Preparation of the 10-11 December European Council *** Depreciation, which forms part of resource DEL, is excluded from the total DEL since capital DEL includes capital spending and to include depreciation of The European Council will focus on economic and those assets would lead to double counting. financial issues, climate change and external issues. The Government are broadly content with the Presidency’s The change in the resource element of the DEL arises draft agenda. from: On economic and financial issues, I noted the importance Request for Resources 1 of addressing the issues of most concern to citizens, Administration especially jobs and economic growth. I also said that I. An increase of £4,500,000 administration costs in respect of the UK was in favour of more and better international the impact of the adoption of international financial reporting financial supervision so long as this protected the fiscal standards (IFRS) on FCO capital charges (non-cash). autonomy of member states. II. An increase of £2,000,000 administration costs in respect of Ministers’ discussion of climate change focussed on take-up of end-year flexibility (EYF) for FCO capital charges the Copenhagen conference on 7-18 December. The (non-cash). Presidency concluded that the EU position remained as Programme agreed by Heads at the October European Council. I. An increase of £22,500,000 other current costs in respect of On external relations, the UK suggested that Iran the impact of the adoption of international financial reporting should be added to the European Council agenda. standards (IFRS) on FCO capital charges (non-cash). 19 November informal European Council II. An increase of £11,000,000 other current costs in respect of take-up of end-year flexibility (EYF) for FCO capital charges The Presidency set out their plans for the informal (non-cash). European Council on 19 November, which has since III. A claim on the Resource DEL Reserve of £8,000,000 other taken decisions on the new president of the European current in respect of modernisation of the FCO Corporate Council and high representative for Foreign Affairs and Services. Security Policy. IV. A transfer of £6,000,000 other current programme from Post-2010 Lisbon Strategy DfID in respect of the returns and reintegration fund. V.A Transfer of £500,000 other current programme to DfID in The Commission introduced a reflection paper on respect of the stabilisation unit. the future of the Lisbon strategy for jobs and growth after 2010. The paper set out four priorities: creating Capital value by basing growth on knowledge; empowering I. A transfer of £250,000 capital from DfID in respect of New people and fighting exclusion; creating a competitive Delhi shared accommodation. greener economy; and making Europe mobile and Request for Resources 2 connected. The paper proposed that the European Council Programme should steer the strategy and set objectives, and the I. A transfer of £15,465,000 grants from DflD in respect of Commission should undertake a yearly review of progress. stabilisation and conflict prevention. The Presidency sought views on these ideas. II. A transfer of £14,000,000 grants from MoD in respect of I noted the need to draw a line under the process of stabilisation and conflict prevention. treaty reform so that the Union could address the issues III. A transfer of £11,500,000 grants from DfID in respect of of most concern to citizens across Europe, namely jobs, the Helmand uplift for stabilisation and conflict prevention. competitiveness with emerging economies and individual IV.A transfer of £6,500,000 grants from MoD in respect of the economic opportunities. Member states needed to address Helmand uplift for stabilisation and conflict prevention. these issues in a united fashion, maintaining the fiscal V. A claim on the Resource DEL Reserve of £3,430,000 grants stimulus until such time as growth was established. I in respect of take-up of balance of peacekeeping funds. said that the Government supported the Commission’s VI. A transfer of £1,500,000 grants from DfID in respect of paper, except for two points: we wanted it to emphasise stabilisation and conflict prevention in Sri Lanka. more clearly the need to open markets yet further and VII. A transfer of £1,150,000 grants to the security and intelligence to avoid protectionism; and to promote and deepen the agencies in respect of expansion and capability. single market. The Presidency concluded that they would take Ministers’ comments into account in the formulation of the December General Affairs and External Relations Council European Council conclusions, and looked forward to finalisation of the strategy under the Spanish Presidency. The Minister for Europe (Chris Bryant): The General EU Sustainable Development Strategy Affairs and External Relations Council (GAERC) was The Presidency invited member states to consider held on 16/17 November in Brussels. My hon. Friend which areas should be priorities for the future of the the Parliamentary Under-Secretary for International sustainable development strategy, and how implementation Development, my noble Friend the Minister with and monitoring of the strategy could be improved. The 53WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 54WS

Commission confirmed that four priorities had emerged AOB: Belarus since their communication was published in July: the Latvia debriefed ministers on a recent visit to Minsk, move to a low carbon, low input economy; protection and concluded that the EU should continue to monitor of biodiversity, water and other natural resources; social the behaviour of the Belarusian authorities, and assess inclusion; and the international dimension. its policy on the basis of progress against agreed human The Presidency concluded that it would take Ministers’ rights benchmarks. Ministers adopted conclusions, which views into account in its preparations for the December the Government broadly welcomes, prolonging restrictive European Council. The Government welcome the measures against certain officials until October 2010 sustainable development strategy, and wants to ensure while suspending the visa ban for the same period. that it is well-coordinated with other EU strategies such JOINT SESSION OF EU FOREIGN AND DEFENCE MINISTERS as the Lisbon strategy. Bosnia and Herzegovina (BiH): Operation Althea EXTERNAL RELATIONS The Presidency updated ministers on the current The full text of all Conclusions adopted can be found EU/US ‘Butmir’ initiative to increase the pace of reform at: in BiH, and said that the political situation was likely to remain tense throughout the current talks and the elections http://www.consilium.europa.eu/uedocs/cms data/docs/ in Autumn 2010. In this context, the Presidency introduced pressdata/en/gena/111287.pdf a discussion of the future of EUFOR Operation Althea Afghanistan by setting out the options available. The Presidency The special representative of the UN Secretary General, concluded that it was too early to take a decision, but Kai Eide, briefed Ministers on the situation while that Ministers would return to the issue at the December underscoring the challenges and need for a greater sense GAERC. The Government continue to support the of shared priorities amongst the international community. ongoing presence of EUFOR in BiH. The UK has reiterated its offer to use London as a ESDP venue for a possible international conference on Foreign and Defence Ministers agreed a declaration Afghanistan. marking the tenth anniversary of ESDP and a wide-ranging Russia set of conclusions, which the Government support, including on EUFOR Operation Althea, a possible The Presidency ran through the issues for the EU-Russia Somalia training mission (see below), civilian capability Summit on 18-19 November. I stressed that it was development, and EU/NATO defence planning coherence. important to maintain a regular and respectful dialogue with Russia, but that the EU should be robust in Informal meeting with NATO Secretary General defending its interests and speaking with one voice to Foreign and Defence Ministers held an informal session send clear messages. Following a wide-ranging discussion, with NATO Secretary General Rasmussen, focusing on the Presidency concluded that the priorities for the Afghanistan. Rasmussen stressed the need to focus on a Summit were: climate change, energy, WTO/trade issues, gradual transfer of responsibility to the Afghans; to human rights and the common neighbourhood. hold the new Afghan government to account; and to increase European efforts to match those of the US. Ukraine JOINT SESSION OF EU FOREIGN AND DEVELOPMENT MINISTERS The Presidency said that at the EU-Ukraine Summit Afghanistan and democracy support in EU external relations on 4 December they would urge Ukraine: to get the IMF Programme back on track; to ensure funding The special representative of the UN Secretary General, mechanisms were in place to pay its gas bills; to conduct Kai Eide, took part in this session. Ministers highlighted free and fair Presidential elections; and as soon as Afghanistan as an example of the need for a more possible to undertake constitutional reform. I stressed coordinated and coherent EU approach to democracy the need to push Ukraine hard on compliance with the support for third countries, which the Government conditions attached to the IMF programme. strongly support, using all available EU instruments. All member states agreed on the need to respect and MEPP build Afghan ownership for development and democracy High Representative Solana briefed Ministers on the building. Eide urged the EU not to impose solutions latest state of play on the region. The Presidency said but to work towards Afghanistan’s own priorities of the EU needed to continue working on how it could agriculture and rural development, infrastructure and practically support a settlement, in case prospects improved, education. and continue to support the Fayyad Plan. The Government The UK emphasised the importance of involving broadly support the Presidency’s approach. regional players, and argued that the approach needed Somalia to be fully comprehensive so as to deliver security for the EU alongside benefits to the Afghan people. The Presidency dropped this item from the external relations agenda. However, EU Defence Ministers did Meeting of EU Defence Ministers discuss Somalia at their informal meeting, as reported Defence Ministers, meeting in their capacity as the below. European Defence Agency (EDA) steering board, agreed: the EDA budget for 2010; the launch of a European AOB: European Security and Defence Policy (ESDP) helicopter training programme; a Letter of Intent on a civilian capabilities European Air Transport Fleet (which the UK and some The Presidency emphasised that the development of other member states did not sign); and a declaration on civilian capabilities was of critical importance to ESDP a level playing field for the European defence equipment and to the EU’s ability to operate as a global actor. The market, which the Government support. High representative Government strongly support this position. Solana also gave a report on EDA activities. 55WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 56WS

Defence Ministers discussed Somalia during an informal HEALTH meeting. Operation Commander Rear Admiral Hudson (Royal Navy) briefed on Operation Atalanta’s continuing success against pirates, explaining that while there were Employment, Social Policy, Health and Consumer still some successful attacks, the majority of the vessels Affairs Council affected had failed to follow best practice for self-protection. Ministers commended the operation. My noble Friend Baroness Taylor said that the UK remained committed The Minister of State, Department of Health (Gillian to Atalanta and to providing the operation HQ for Merron): The Employment, Social Policy, Health and 2010. Consumer Affairs Council will meet on 30 November- High representative Solana stressed the urgency of 1 December. The Health and Consumer Affairs part of helping Somalia’s transitional Federal Government by the Council will be taken on 1 December. training its security forces in close coordination with the Items on the main agenda are: African Union Mission in Somalia (AMISOM) and the US. The Commission made clear its commitment to patients’ rights in cross border healthcare; supporting a possible training mission with a contribution incentives for effective antibiotics, e-health; to costs. Some member states offered to contribute personnel and lead the mission. My noble Friend Baroness the three aspects of the pharmaceutical package (proposals to reduce the threat from counterfeit medicines, strengthening of Taylor said there should be no illusions about the community pharmacovigilance and information on prescription challenges of working in the region; before making a medicines to patients); final decision on the mission, we needed the key questions to be properly answered. alcohol and health; Ministers also had a general discussion of smoke-free environments; implementation of the ESDP-related provisions of the seasonal influenza vaccination and information from the presidency Lisbon Treaty. and the Commission on pandemic H1N1 following the Council meeting on 12 October, together with a discussion on lessons MEETING OF EU DEVELOPMENT MINISTERS learnt on H1N1 preparedness and future challenges faced. The UK secured Development Ministers’ support for The presidency propose to ask Ministers to reach our proposals for the Commission to take on a strengthened political agreement on the directive on the application role in monitoring official development assistance (ODA) of patients’rights in cross-border healthcare. The presidency performance and for the European Council to monitor also proposes to adopt Council conclusions on innovative EU ODA on a regular basis. The UK strongly emphasised incentives for effective antibiotics, safe and efficient the importance of additionality of climate finance over healthcare through e-health and alcohol and health. ODA, and secured agreement that Ministers would They also propose to adopt a Council recommendation revert to this issue next year. on smoke-free environments. The UK can support the adoption of these proposals. Ministers also discussed how to achieve progress on the EU’s commitments on aid effectiveness, and agreed Although the main agenda currently proposes the an operational framework to that end in conclusions. adoption of a recommendation on seasonal influenza Other items discussed were policy coherence for vaccination, this is still at an early stage in negotiation development, on which the Spanish Presidency and and we anticipate that adoption at this forthcoming Commission briefed on the forthcoming work programme; Council will not be possible. and budget support, on which Ministers discussed the need for a future dialogue on a coordinated EU approach Under any other business, information will be provided from the presidency on a directive on standards of “A” Points quality and safety of human organs intended for The Council adopted conclusions or decisions, without transplantation. Information will also be provided on discussion, on: Commission Communications on cancer, combating HIV/AIDS in the EU and neighbouring countries and Council Conclusions on an Integrated Maritime Policy reducing health inequalities in the EU. Council Conclusions on Freedom of Religion or Belief Conclusions on Democracy Support Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) Conclusions on Policy Coherence for Development A Council Decision on conclusion of an agreement with Russia on exchange of classified information The Minister of State, Department of Health (Mr. Mike Conclusions on the use of EU Battlegroups O’Brien): Subject to the necessary Supplementary Estimates, the Department of Health’s element of the Departmental Conclusions forwarding the application by the Republic of Albania for membership of the European Union to the Expenditure Limit (DEL) will increase by £14,089,000 Commission for an avis from £105,335,865,000 to £105,349,954,000. The Administration Cost Limit remains unchanged at Conclusions on Belarus highlighting prolongation of the restrictive £213,765,000. The Food Standards Agency DEL increases measures in place against certain officials until October 2010 and suspension of the visa-ban for the same period by £1,000 from £134,986,000 to £134,987,000. The overall DEL including the Food Standards Agency will Draft Council guidelines for the European Defence Agency’s increase by £14,090,000 from £105,470,851,000 to work in 2010 £105,484,941,000. The impact on resource and capital Approval of the European Defence Agency budget are set out in the following table: 57WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 58WS

Department of Health Change New DEL

Voted Non voted Voted Non voted Total £m £m £m £m £m

Resource DEL, of which 870.364 - 101,418.953 - 99,949.100 684.275 1,469.853 Administration Budget* --213.765 - 213.765 Near-cash in Resource DEL 870.364 - 96,678.684 -180.133 96,498.551 684.275 Capital DEL - - 2,638.505 2,762.349 5,400.854 172.000 Total Department of Health DEL 870.364 856.275 104,057.458 1,292.496 105,349.954 Depreciation** ---933.003 -67.744 -1,000.747 Total Department of Health spending (after 870.364 - 103,124.455 1,224.752 104,349.207 adjustment) 856.275 Food Standards Agency Resource DEL, of which 0.001 - 134.371 - 134.371 Administration Budget* 0.001 - 49.894 - 49.894 Near-cash in Resource DEL 0.001 - 131.698 - 131.698 Capital DEL - - 616 - 616 Total Food Standards Agency DEL 0.001 - 134.987 - 134.987 Depreciation** -- -1.908 - -1.908 Total Food Standards Agency spending (after - 133.079 - 133.079 adjustment) * The total of “administration budget” and “Near cash in Resource DEL” figures may well be greater that the total resource DEL, due to definitions overlapping. **Depreciation, which forms part of resource DEL, is excluded from the total DEL since the capital DEL includes capital spending and to include depreciation of those assets would lead to double counting. i£l * The total of “administration budget” and “Near cash in Resource DEL” figures may well be greater that the total resource DEL, due to definitions overlapping. ″Depreciation, which forms part of resource DEL, is excluded from the total DEL since the capital DEL includes capital spending and to include depreciation of those assets would lead to double counting.

The Department of Health DEL has increased by The Government recognise that the complexity of £14,089,000 made up of: this issue demands not only a firm criminal justice £60,000 for additions to Invest to Save Budget awards. response, but focussed measures to stop violence from a net transfer of £12,633,000 from the Ministry of Justice happening in the first place while ensuring that appropriate mainly for prison healthcare services; help and support for women and girls is available to a transfer of £1,396,000 from the Home Office as the Department’s those who need it. To deliver these commitments we will share of a contribution to the migration impact fund; and continue to work closely with local partners to achieve a transfer of £172,000,000 from Capital DEL to Revenue DEL our goal of ending violence against women. as a result of the budgeting treatment of some pandemic flu items. Resident Labour Market Test The Department of Health’s administration cost limit remains unchanged at £213,765,000. The change to the Food Standards Agency element The Minister for Borders and Immigration (Mr. Phil of the DEL is due to a token increase in FSA resource Woolas): I am announcing today that, from 14 December administration cost of £1,000 to allow for an increase in 2009, employers wishing to recruit a migrant under Tier the net cash requirement and additional appropriations 2 of the points-based system will first need to advertise in aid. to jobseekers in the UK for four weeks. This strengthens the current requirement to advertise jobs for two weeks, or one week for jobs over £40,000. HOME DEPARTMENT Since April this year, the resident labour market test (RLMT) has included a requirement to advertise skilled jobs in Jobcentre Plus, so that resident workers have a Violence Against Women single source—their local job centre—to access all skilled vacancies. The Secretary of State for the Home Department This change was proposed by the independent Migration (Alan Johnson): I am pleased to announce that on Advisory Committee (MAC) in their Tier 2 report Wednesday 25 November, the international day for the which was published on 19 August, a copy of which can elimination of violence against women, I am launching be found in the House Library. On 7 September the a cross-Government strategy to address violence against Home Secretary announced that the Government have women and girls. accepted the recommendations put forward in the report In recent years much has been achieved to increase in full. protection for women and to prosecute their attackers. The Prime Minister announced, in his speech on However, the strategy will be the first comprehensive, immigration on 12 November, that the strengthening of co-ordinated effort to tackle this form of gender-based the resident labour market test would be introduced violence, integrating work from across government under quickly, to better support resident workers looking for the headings of prevention, provision and protection. skilled jobs. 59WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 60WS

The flexibility of the points-based system allows us The other changes to Tier 2 recommended by the to support UK workers and at the same time meet the MAC will be implemented in spring 2010. recruitment needs of businesses and to support the economy. In making this change, we are using that flexibility to support businesses in two ways: First, we will only apply this change to advertising campaigns Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) that start on or after 14 December. Businesses that have already run advertisements will not need to do so again to meet the new requirement. The Secretary of State for the Home Department Secondly, while we will require all jobs to be advertised for four (Alan Johnson): Subject to parliamentary approval of weeks before a migrant worker can be appointed, we will not require the four weeks to be continuous. This will mean that the necessary supplementary estimate, the Home Office’s businesses will not need to advertise all their vacancies for four departmental expenditure limits for 2009-10 will be weeks on the off-chance that no suitable resident workers apply increased by £265,493,000 from £9,976,727,000 to and they need to recruit a migrant worker. For example, we will £10,242,220,000 and the administration budget will be allow businesses to advertise skilled jobs for two weeks initially. If increased by £271,389,000 from £404,151,000 to a suitable resident worker applies, the business can appoint them £675,540,000. straight away. However, if no suitable resident workers apply, the resident labour market must be tested for a further two weeks Within the DEL change, the impact on resources and before they can appoint a migrant worker. capital are as set out in the following table:

Change New DEL £’000 Non- Non- Voted voted Voted voted Total

Resource DEL 20,584 233,496 8,542,585 1,065,769 9,608,354 Of which: Administration 115,556 155,833 487,410 188,130 675,540 budge* Near-cash in 9,120 234,232 8,377,062 1,023,065 9,400,127 RDEL* Capital** (10,819) 18,900 537,261 280,820 818,081 Less 2,683 649 (128,891) (55,324) (184,215) depreciation*** Total 12,448 253,045 8,950,955 1,291,265 10,242,220 *The total of the ‘Administration Budget’ and ‘Near cash in Resource DEL’ figures may well be greater than total resource DEL, due to the definitions overlapping. **Capital DEL includes items treated as resource in Estimates and accounts but which are treated as Capital DEL in budgets. ***Depreciation, which forms part of resource DEL, is excluded from total DEL since capital DEL includes capital spending and to include depreciation of those assets would lead to double counting.

o/w near o/w o/w near o/w (a) Total Cash Admin (a) Total Cash Admin

The change in the resource 254,080 243,352 271,389 Programme from the Office (40,000) (40,000) element of the DEL arises for Security and Counter from: Terrorism (section D) to the Machinery of Government 303,166 292,438 271,389 Department for changes: Communities and Local Government’s affordable The United Kingdom housing programme Border Agency (UKBA) was “Building Britain’s Future”. transferred to the Home Office on 1 April 2009. The Programme from crime (2,358) (2,358) specific changes relating to reduction and drugs (section this machinery of B) to cover the Ministry of Government transfer from Justice’s additional costs of HM Revenue and Customs implementing the provisions are: of the Violent Crime Reduction Act. UK Border Agency 302,658 291,930 270,881 (section E) Programme from the Departmental Unallocated Central Services (section G) 508 508 508 Provision to fund Migration Transfers from other 489 489 0 Impact expenditure of the Government Departments: following Departments: Programme from the 489 489 Department for Innovation, (2,629) (2,629) Ministry of Justice to Police Universities and Skills. (section A) for the British Crime Survey. Department for Children, (1,396) (1,396) Schools and Families. Transfers from other (49,575) (49,575) 0 Government Departments: Department of Health (1,396) (1,396) 61WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 62WS

remain basic but have improved since the separate visits o/w near o/w to Sri Lanka earlier this year by the Foreign Secretary, a (a) Total Cash Admin cross-party group of MPs led by Des Browne as well as Department for (1,396) (1,396) my own previous visits in April and October. The Communities and Local monsoon has now started and it is raining heavily. Government Many of the temporary shelters are deteriorating and Programme from the United (252) (252) there is a risk that flooding will occur. With freedom of Kingdom Border Agency movement then it would be much more acceptable for (section E) to the Ministry humanitarian agencies to be able to improve conditions of Justice for the European Economic Area modelling in the camps and support any moves to make them policy genuine welfare villages. Programme from crime (148) (148) I also join with the UN to welcome the recent progress reduction and drugs (section made by the Government of Sri Lanka over the last B) to fund the Crown Prosecution Service’s four weeks in returning the IDPs from the closed camps additional costs of in Vavuniya to their home areas. As of 20 November, implementing the provisions the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees of the Violent Crime (UNHCR) estimates that over 132,000 IDPs have now Reduction Act either returned to their home areas or have been released to institutions or host families elsewhere. The majority (b) Capital Total of those returning to their homes have been to Jaffna. The change in the capital 8,081 Returns are now starting to other areas in the Vanni element of the DEL arises such as Kilinochchi and Mullaitivu. from: However, I also have concerns. The pace of returns is Machinery of Government 13,081 changes: increasingly limited by the challenge of ensuring that The United Kingdom 13,081 areas are free from land mines and unexploded ordnance. Border Agency (UKBA) was I am pleased that we are helping to meet this challenge transferred to the Home by funding the work of two British demining NGOs—the Office on 1 April 2009. This HALO Trust and Mine Action Group—to help make machinery of Government areas safe again. A further concern is that not all change from HM Revenue returnees enjoy unrestricted freedom of movement outside and Customs was transferred to section E of their immediate home areas. Moreover, in some Transfers to other (5,000) areas where the IDPs have been able to return home, Government Departments: humanitarian access for agencies to assist them is still Capital from the Office for (5,000) restricted. This is making it unnecessarily hard to meet Security and Counter the basic needs of returning IDPs. I urge the Government Terrorism (section D) to the of Sri Lanka to co-operate fully with all concerned Department for humanitarian agencies so that they can undertake their Communities and Local Government’s affordable usual assistance and protection activities, including the housing programme International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC). “Building Britain’s Future” DFID continues to support the relief effort to Sri Lanka as the situation on the ground allows. Since September 2008, we have committed £12.5 million. Last INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT week I approved a further £1 million from this budget to the International Organisation for Migration (IOM) Sri Lanka to support the safe and dignified return of IDPs to their home areas. This grant will help provide transport, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for emergency shelters, temporary health clinics, immediate International Development (Mr. Michael Foster): I would access to high quality water and sanitation facilities and like to update the House on the humanitarian situation livelihoods support for the returning IDP population. It in Sri Lanka. Six months ago the end of the conflict in will also allow IOM to extend their existing IDP registration Sri Lanka created almost 280,000 internally displaced programme to all IDPs. This registration programme persons (IDPs). I visited Sri Lanka in early October and was originally supported by DFID in April and is an advocated freedom of movement for the IDP population essential part of enabling returning IDPs to access basic who continue to be held in closed camps. At the time of services. my visit, this population numbered almost 253,000 people. We have always made it clear that the IDP camps I would like to reiterate that meeting the humanitarian should not be anything other than temporary in nature. needs of the IDPs remains the most immediate priority During my recent visit, I confirmed that once the critical for the UK Government. monsoon season is over DFID will only fund-life-saving I welcome the recent announcement by the Government emergency interventions in the existing closed camps. of Sri Lanka of their intention that all IDPs will have The focus of our funding will shift further towards early total freedom of movement from 1 December in the recovery activities in the area of demining, support to camps in Sri Lanka. It will be important that humanitarian the returns process and livelihood recovery. Once again, agencies have access to fully meet the needs of the IDPs I would like to reassure the House that all DFID who choose to remain in the camps until they can funding is provided directly to neutral and impartial return to their homes or go to host families. Approximately international agencies. Some £2.87 million remains to 130,000 IDPs still remain in these camps. Conditions be committed as the situation on the ground allows. 63WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 64WS

Looking forward, we recognise the progress that the The net change in the Resource element of DEL arises Government of Sri Lanka have made towards their own from: Additions original target of returning 80 per cent. of the IDPs £500,000 transferred to DFID from the Ministry of Defence in to their areas of origin by the end of the year. After relation to Stabilisation Unit. 26 years of intermittent conflict, there remains an additional £500,000 transferred to DFID from the Foreign and 214,000 long-term displaced people to consider who Commonwealth Office in relation to Stabilisation Unit. may now also wish to return to their home areas. It is £6,729,000 transferred to DFID from the Ministry of Defence important that the Government of Sri Lanka addresses in relation to Conflict Prevention Pool. the needs of all IDPs. Reductions Our other priority since the end of the conflict has £6,000,000 transferred from DFID to the Foreign and been to urge the Government to make a concerted effort Commonwealth Office in relation to the Returns and Reintegration to secure lasting peace by working for genuine reconciliation Fund. between Sri Lanka’s communities. Our view remains £800,000 transferred from DFID to the Department for Culture, that this can only be achieved through a fully inclusive Media and Sport in relation to London 2012 International Inspiration. political settlement that addresses the legitimate grievance £11,500,000 transferred from DFID to Foreign and and aspirations of all communities. Commonwealth Office in relation to Conflict Prevention in The British Government continue to engage fully Afghanistan. with the Government of Sri Lanka as well as international £15,465,000 transferred from DFID to Foreign and and multilateral partners. The Foreign Secretary discussed Commonwealth Office in relation to Conflict Prevention Pool. these issues with the Sri Lankan Foreign Minister when £1,500,000 transferred from DFID to Foreign and Commonwealth they last spoke on 4 November. Our High Commissioner Office in relation to Conflict Prevention in Sri Lanka. to Sri Lanka regularly raises our concerns with senior The net change in the Capital element of DEL arises members of the Sri Lankan Government. The UN from: Emergency Relief Coordinator, Sir John Holmes, visited Reductions Sri Lanka on 17 and 19 November and concluded that returns must be both voluntary and informed. He also £250,000 transferred from DFID to Foreign and Commonwealth Office in relation to refurbishment of shared Delhi office. welcomed the Government of Sri Lanka’s assurance regarding their commitment to ensuring full freedom of movement for IDPs. I spoke to Sir John Holmes yesterday about the humanitarian situation going forwards and JUSTICE the international response, and reiterated the UK priority of freedom of movement for the IDP population. I also welcomed the progress that has been made to date by Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) the Government of Sri Lanka in returning the IDPs from the camps to their homes. The Secretary of State for Justice and Lord Chancellor Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) (Mr. Jack Straw): Subject to parliamentary approval of any necessary supplementary estimate, the Ministry of The Secretary of State for International Development Justice (MoJ), Northern Ireland Court Service (NICS) (Mr. Douglas Alexander): As a consequence of budgetary and The National Archives (TNA) total departmental transfers associated with the Winter Supplementary expenditure limit (DEL) will be increased as follows: Estimates, the Department for International Development’s Total DEL for MoJ (RfRl, 2 and 3) is increased by £214,550,000 total departmental expenditure limit will be reduced by from £9,614,212,000 to £9,828,762,000 and the administration £27,786,000 from £6,785,560,000 to £6,757,774,000. Within budget has increased by £200,000 from £435,720,000 to the total DEL change, the impact on Resource and £435,920,000. Capital is set out in the following table: Total DEL for the NICS has increased by £20,000,000 from £127,556,000 to £147,556,000. £’000 Change New DEL Total DEL for the TNA has remained unchanged. Non- Non- Within the Total DEL change for MoJ (RfRl, 2 Voted Voted Voted Voted Total and 3), the impact on resources and capital are as set Resource - (27,536) 4,299,064 1,112,960 5,412,024 out in the following table: DEL Of which:* Change New DEL Administration - 1,000 156,609 3,341 159,950 Non- Non- Budget Voted voted Voted voted Total £’000 £’000 £’000 £’000 £’000 Near-cash in - (27,536) 4,204,064 1,112,960 5,317,024 RDEL Capital - (250) 1,356,000 9,750 1,365,750 DEL Resource DEL: 208,766 (81,413) 5,736,008 3,647,419 9,383,427 Of which: Less - - (20,000) - (20,000) Depreciation** Administration * 200 0 435,920 0 435,920 Total DEL (27,786) 5,635,064 1,122,710 6,757,774 Near cash in 169,315 (56,962) 4,864,500 3,834,778 8,699,278 Resource DEL * The total of ‘Administration budget’ and ‘Near-cash in Resource Capital ** 258,945 (158,945) 832,864 35,670 868,534 DEL ’figures may well he greater than total resource DEL, due to the definitions overlapping. Depreciation *** (10,645) (2,158) (412,523) (10,676) (423,199) ** Depreciation, which forms part of the resource DEL, is excluded Total 457,066 (242,516) 6,156,349 3,672,413 9,828,762 from the total DEL, since capital DEL includes capital spending and *The total of ‘administration budget’ and ‘near-cash in Resource DEL’ figures to include depreciation of these assets would lead to double counting. may well be greater than total Resource DEL, due to the definitions overlapping. 65WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 66WS

A decrease in Resource DEL of £14,810,000 in relation **Capital DEL includes items treated as resource in Estimates and accounts but which are treated as Capital DEL in budgets. to healthcare services for additional prison places transferred ***Depreciation, which forms part of Resource DEL, is excluded from the total to the DoH. DEL since Capital DEL includes capital spending and to include depreciation of those assets would lead to double counting. A decrease in Resource DEL of £4,300,000 in relation to Compass Case Management Funding transferred to 1) The change in the Resource and Capital DEL for MoJ the Crown Prosecution Service (CPS). arises front: A decrease in Resource DEL of £4,198,000 in relation RfRl: To promote the development of a modern, fair, cost to National Insurance Funding transferred to HM Revenue effective and efficient system of justice for all. & Customs (HMRC). Resource Change: Admin (total increase of £200,000) Other Increases: A decrease in Resource DEL of £2,600,000 in relation to Victim Surcharges transferred to the CPS. An increase of £200,000 in Resource DEL in relation to the transfer of FHSAA administrative support costs A decrease in Resource DEL of £806,000 in relation to from the Department of Health. London Criminal Justice Board transferred to the CPS. Resource Change: Programme (total increase of A decrease in Resource DEL of £489,000 in relation to £182,939,000) the British Crime Survey transferred to the HO. Reserve Claims: A decrease in Resource DEL of £417,000 in relation to An increase in near-cash resource funding of £110,000,000 Road Safety Act transferred to the CPS. in relation to the Prison Capacity Programme. An increase in near-cash resource funding of £34,000,000 A decrease in Resource DEL of £222,000 in relation to in relation to the Workforce Modernisation Programme. Government Skills Strategy transferred to the BIS. An increase in non-cash resource funding of £15,000,000 A decrease in Resource DEL of £208,000 in relation to in relation to the Prison Capacity Programme. healthcare services for additional prison places transferred An increase in near-cash resource funding of £300,000 to the Welsh Assembly Government (WAG). in respect of Consolidated fund draw down in relation Capital Change (total increase of £100,000,000) to funding for Norwich by-elections. Other Increases: Reserve Claims: An increase in Resource DEL of £8,600,000 in relation An increase of £100,000,000 in Capital DEL in respect to the ESA (Jobcentre Plus) funding and transfer of the of the Prison Capacity Programme. Appeals Court from the Department for Work and Pensions (DWP). RfR2: Overseeing the effective operation of the devolution An increase in Resource DEL of £4,720,000 in relation settlement in Scotland and representing the interests of to Child Support Reform Funding from the DWP. Scotland in the UK Government. An increase in Resource DEL of £3,680,000 in relation Total DEL for Scotland has remained unchanged. to Mental Health Review Tribunal funding from the Department of Health (DoH). RfR3: To support the Secretary of State in discharging his role of representing Wales in the UK Government, An increase in Resource DEL of £2,830,000 in relation representing the UK Government in Wales and ensuring to offender learning, transfer of resources relating to the smooth running of the devolution settlement in Wales. skills costs of additional prison capacity from the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills (BIS). Total DEL for Wales has remained unchanged. An increase in Resource DEL of £2,358,000 in relation There is no change in the Capital DEL for RfR2 and to the Violent Crimes Reduction Act from the Home RfR3 Office. An increase in Resource DEL of £833,000 in relation to 2) The change in the Resource and Capital DEL for the Immigration Removal Centres from the BIS. Northern Ireland Court Service (NICS) arises from: An increase in Resource DEL of £291,000 in relation to Within the Total DEL change for Northern Ireland the enforcement order provisions of the Children and Court Service, the impact on resources and capital are Adoption Act 2006 in 2009/10 from the Department for as set out in the following table: Children, Schools and Families (DCSF). An increase in Resource DEL of £252,000 in relation to Change New DEL EEA Modelling from the Home Office. Non- Non- An increase in Resource DEL of £75,000 in relation to Voted voted Voted voted Total Offender Health - Ministerial Council on Deaths in £’000 £’000 £’000 £’000 £’000 Custody funding from the DoH. Resource DEL: (2,534) 22,534 58,391 94,300 152,691 Resource Change: Programme (total decrease of Of which: £55,786,000) Administration * (1,000) 1,426 1,426 Decreases: Near cash in (2,534) 22,534 40,451 93,800 134,251 A decrease in Resource DEL of £27,736,000 in relation Resource DEL ** to offender learning, transfer of resources relating to Capital 6,000 6,000 skills costs of additional prison capacity transferred to Depreciation*** (10,694) (441) (11,135) the BIS. Total (2,534) 22,534 53,697 93,859 147,556 67WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 68WS

The report’s authors argued that it sends a poor * The total of ‘administration budget’ and ‘near-cash in Resource DEL ’figures may well be greater than total Resource DEL, due to the message to the public that personal information collected definitions overlapping. for something as vital as participation in the democratic **Capital DEL includes items treated as resource in Estimates and process could be sold on to “anyone for any purpose” accounts but which are treated as Capital DEL in budgets. and that the sale of the Edited Register may deter some ***Depreciation, which forms part of Resource DEL, is excluded from people from registering to vote at all. the total DEL since Capital DEL includes capital spending and to include depreciation of those assets would lead to double counting. The Government take the issues of data protection, the privacy of citizens and democratic engagement, Resource Change: Admin (total decrease of £1,000,000) including electoral registration, very seriously. It is for The change in the administration budget arises from these reasons that the Government committed, in their a £1,000,000 increase in civil court fee income. This will response to the Data Sharing Review, to consult on the be offset against additional related costs to dispose of future of the Edited Register. However, abolition of the civil court business. The appropriations-in-aid are classified Edited Register could have an impact on those businesses, as administrative incomeand so the additional fee income charities and others that currently use it. The Government will reduce the administration cost limit by £1,000,000. therefore do not wish to make a final decision to act Resource Change: Programme (total increase of until they have considered carefully the available evidence £22,534,000) about the potential impact of abolition. Reserve Claims: It is hoped that the consultation I am publishing today will elicit detailed evidence and information from Take up of DEL Reserve claim of £20,000,000 to a wide range of sources on the potential impact of reflect the increase in the Northern Ireland Legal Services abolition, which will help to inform future policy decisions Commission baseline to cover the projected shortfall in about the Edited Register. The wide range of options legal aid expenditure. proposed in the consultation paper provides a variety of Other Increases: potential approaches to the future of the Edited Register Transfer of £2,534,000 resources from voted to non-voted and the Government invite views on all of them. to cover the shortfall in Judicial Salaries paid from the The consultation will run for a period of three months Consolidated Fund. and closes on 23 February 2010. Resource Change: Programme (total decrease of £2,534,000) A copy of the consultation paper and impact assessment Decreases: has been placed in the Library of the House. Transfer of £2,534,000 resources from voted to non-voted Political Parties and Elections Act 2009 to cover the shortfall in Judicial Salaries paid from the (Commencement) Consolidated Fund. 3) The National Archives are not submitting a Winter Supplementary Estimate. The Secretary of State for Justice and Lord Chancellor (Mr. Jack Straw): I wish to make the following statement to the House regarding the commencement of party Edited Electoral Register funding provisions of the Political Parties and Elections Act 2009. The Act received Royal Assent on 21 July 2009 and represents a significant step towards a system The Minister of State, Ministry of Justice (Mr. Michael of party funding which is more transparent, better Wills): I am today publishing the consultation paper on regulated and, most importantly, better able to win the the future of the Edited Register (CP 46/09). confidence of the public. In October 2007 the Prime Minister announced that The following provision will commence on 25 November he had asked Dr. Mark Walport, the director of the 2009: Wellcome Trust and Richard Thomas the then Information Section 21—Limitation of pre-candidacy election expenses for Commissioner, to undertake an independent review of certain general elections. This provision introduces a new spending the framework for the use of personal information in limit for candidates at certain general elections, to run from the date after 55 months of a Parliament have elapsed until the date the public and private sectors. an individual formally becomes a candidate (this is, in most cases, Their final report was published as the Data Sharing the date of dissolution of Parliament). Commencement on Review on 11 July 2008 and recommended various 25 November means that, in the case of the present Parliament, the new spending limit will apply to election expenses incurred on specific measures that the authors considered needed to or after 25 November which are used on or after 1 January 2010. be taken to increase public trust and confidence in the The following provisions will commence on 1 January handling and processing of personal data by both the 2010: public and private sectors. The Government have already Section 12—Defence to charge of failing to return donation taken on board many of the review’s recommendations, from impermissible donor. This provision seeks to add clarity to including, for example, strengthening the powers and the existing position in the 2000 Act, namely, that if a party penalties available to the Information Commissioner. treasurer is charged with an offence of accepting an impermissible Recommendation 19 of the report covered the edited donation, the party or party treasurer will not be guilty if they version of the electoral register which, since 2002, has can show that they took all reasonable steps to verify that the donor was a permissible donor, and having done so, believed that been available for sale to anyone for any purpose. People was the case. are free to opt-out of inclusion in the Edited Register if Section 13—“Reasonable excuse” in relation to certain offences they so wish. Nevertheless, the Data Sharing Review under the 2000 Act. This provision recasts certain offences in the recommended that the Government should remove the 2000 Act (mainly relating to requirements imposed by that Act to provision allowing the sale of the edited electoral register report various matters to the Electoral Commission) so that they and that it should therefore be abolished. may be committed only if something is done or not done “without 69WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 70WS reasonable excuse”. The provision also removes existing defences Section 2 (and Schedule 1)—Investigatory powers of the to the offences in question, in consequence of this new qualification Commission. These provisions give effect to new Schedule 19B to to the acts or omissions that may constitute an offence. the Political Parties, Elections and Referendums Act 2000 which Section 14—Control of donations to members associations: provides the Commission with powers to enable them to require responsible persons. These provisions require that members access to information for certain purposes and to fulfil their associations in receipt of a reportable permissible donation (a function as an effective regulator. transaction in excess of £7,500) or an impermissible recordable Section 3 (and Schedule 2)—Civil Sanctions. These provisions donation (above £500), appoint a responsible person where they insert new Schedule 19C to the Political Parties, Elections and do not have a treasurer. Referendums Act 2000. They give the Electoral Commission new powers to apply a range of civil sanctions to offences and Section 15—Control of donations to holders of elective office— contraventions under the Political Parties, Elections and Referendums compliance officers. These provisions are intended to alleviate Act 2000 (as amended by the Political Parties and Elections Act some of the burden of complying with reporting procedures by and the Electoral Administration Act 2006). The new flexible civil allowing (but not requiring) holders of elective office1 to appoint sanctions provide alternatives to referral for criminal prosecution a compliance officer to assist with the duties of reporting and under the 2000 Act, allowing the Electoral Commission to apply verifying donations and loans. The provisions do not absolve an sanctions that are appropriate to the nature of each contravention. office holder who chooses to appoint such an officer of guilt for a The Commission will also be able to use new approaches to secure failure to comply. compliance with the law where appropriate, rather than imposing 1 For the purposes of Schedule 7 (reporting of donations), the a traditional penalty such as a fine, or referring a case for criminal relevant elective offices are: Member of the House of Commons; investigation. Member of the European Parliament elected in the United Section 8—Education about systems of government and EU Kingdom; Member of the Scottish Parliament; Member of the institutions. This provision restricts the Electoral Commission’s National Assembly for Wales; Member of the Northern Ireland educational role to promoting awareness of current and pending Assembly, member of any local authority in the United Kingdom electoral systems in the UK. (including the Common Council of the City of London but excluding a parish or community council); a member of the The following provisions will be not be commenced Greater London Assembly; and the Mayor of London or other before the summer of 2010: elected mayor. For the purposes of Schedule 7A (reporting of Section 9—Declaration as to source of donation; loans) the list of relevant elective offices is the same, with the exception of independent Members of the Scottish Parliament Section 10—Non-resident donors; and independent members of Scottish local authorities. Section 11—Non-resident lenders. Section 16—Control of loans to members associations: responsible Officials have begun preliminary work on the prerequisites persons. This provision achieves the same effect as section 14, in relation to loans and related transactions. to implementation of these provisions. However, as I stated during consideration of Lords Amendments to Section 17—Control of loans to holders of elective office— the Bill, we are practically unable to commence Sections compliance officers. This provision achieves the same effect as section 15, in relation to loans and related transactions. 10 and 11 before the summer of 2010 due to their complex nature. Section 9, which requires donors to Section 18—Person may not be “responsible person” for more provide declarations as to the true origins of all donations than one recognised third party. A recognised third party is an organisation that spends more than £10,000 on campaigning at of over £7,500, will be commenced alongside Sections an election and registers with the Electoral Commission as a 10 and 11 to ensure consistency in approach, which will result. This Section provides that persons responsible for ensuring be welcomed by those who make political donations, as compliance with the reporting requirements for expenditure to well as parties and other recipients who will have to which recognised third parties are subject, as set out in the 2000 ensure that they comply with the additional declaration Act, may not discharge these responsibilities with respect to more requirement. than one recognised third party. Section 20—Increased thresholds in relation to donations etc.. This Section increases to more than £500 the threshold above Archival Services which donations received and loans entered into must be recorded under the 2000 Act. Additionally the thresholds above which donations and loans must be reported to the Electoral Commission are increased to more than £1,500 (for individuals and accounting The Minister of State, Ministry of Justice (Mr. Michael units) and to more than £7,500 (for registered parties, members Wills): On 6 May, I informed the House that the associations, recognised third parties and permitted participants). Government had published a consultation document, We are committed to implementing the Act in a “Archives for the 21st Century”, asking for views on a timely and appropriate manner, taking account of good proposed new policy for archival services. The Government regulatory practice and the desirability of early specifically sought views on five main proposals to help commencement. We have been engaging with the political the sector build the foundations for a more sustainable parties, the Electoral Commission and other Government future and respond to the challenges of the digital Departments to ensure that the commencement programme information age. for the Act is timely and effective. This consultation closed on 12 August and the Subject to approval by both Houses where necessary, Government are grateful for all the responses they the following provisions will commence on 1 July: received from a wide range of individuals and organisations. Section 1(2)—Compliance with controls imposed by the 2000 Based on the feedback received, which was largely Act etc. This provision amends Section 145 of the Political supportive, I have today laid before the House a revised Parties, Elections and Referendums Act 2000 by clarifying that and final version of the policy. the function of the Electoral Commission is to regulate, as well as The policy outlines a new framework for the sustainable monitor, compliance with that Act. In its capacity as regulator, the Commission shall take such steps as they consider appropriate development and improvement of the publicly funded to secure compliance with those requirements. The Commission archive sector, which supports the sector and maximises will publish guidance as to what conduct will satisfy the requirements opportunities to make archives accessible to an even of the 2000 Act. wider range of people. 71WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 72WS

The National Archives and the Museums, Libraries DEL provision for the Scotland Office DEL will and Archives Council now wish to encourage professional remain unchanged. bodies, individual institutions and other key stakeholders The increase in the Scotland DEL takes account of to help them shape a detailed action plan. This will take the following adjustments to the Scottish Government forward the policy’s five recommendations with the aim provision: of strengthening this key part of the nation’s historical, the take-up of End Year Flexibility (EYF) by the Scottish cultural and information infrastructure. Between today Government amounting to £400,000,000; and the end of January 2010 they will be consulting widely on a draft of the plan, and developing it in light International Financial Reporting Standard (IFRS) classification changes of £18,765,000. of comments received. The DEL increase also includes the following change: A copy of the policy has been placed in the Libraries of both Houses, along with a report on the responses a transfer of £228,000 from the Department for Children, received during the consultation. Schools and Families.

NORTHERN IRELAND SOLICITOR-GENERAL Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) The Secretary of State for Northern Ireland (Mr. Shaun Woodward): Subject to parliamentary approval the Northern The Solicitor-General (Vera Baird): My right hon. Ireland Office (NIO) will be taking a 2009-10 Winter Friend the Attorney General has made the following Supplementary Estimate. The effect this will have is to written ministerial statement: increase the NIO’s DEL by £41,255,000 from £1,164,487,000 Subject to parliamentary approval of any necessary to £1,205,742,000. Supplementary Estimate, the Attorney-General’s total DEL will be increased by £8,271,000 from £736,695,000 £’000s to £744,966,000. Within the total DEL change, the Change New DEL impact on resources and capital are set out in the Non- Non- following table: Voted Voted Voted voted Total

Resource (7,286) 10,286 292,868 896,594 1,189,462 £’000s Admin --73,926 - 73,926 Change New DEL Budget Non- Non- Near-cash (3,799) 6,799 248,936 720,179 969,115 Voted voted Voted voted Total Capital (2,773) 2,773 24,238 52,465 76,703 Resource DEL 3,226 5,045 729,855 10,898 740,753 Depreciation 18,639 19,616 (19,249) (41,174) (60,423) of which: Total 8,580 32,675 297,857 907,885 1,205,742 Administration --68,623 - 68,623 budget * The change in total DEL of £41,255,000 relates to Near-cash in 3,226 5,045 717,482 12,571 730,053 funding of £3,000,000 from DEL Reserve for the European RDEL* Elections held in May 2009 and the transfer of non-cash Capital DEL ** --12,730 - 12,730 of £38,255,000 from depreciation to cost of capital and Less --8,517 - 8,517 provisions. Depreciation *** Total DEL 3,226 5,045 734,068 10,898 744,966 SCOTLAND *The total of ‘Administration budget’ and ‘Near-cash in Resource DEL’ figures may well be greater than total Resource DEL, due to Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) the definitions overlapping. **Capital DEL includes items treated as resource in Estimates and accounts but which are treated as Capital DEL in budgets. The Secretary of State for Scotland (Mr. Jim Murphy): ***Depreciation, which forms part of resource DEL, is excluded from total DEL since capital DEL includes capital spending and to Subject to parliamentary approval of the necessary include depreciation of those assets would lead to double counting. Supplementary Estimates, the Departmental Expenditure Limit (DEL) the Scotland DEL will be increased by The Crown Prosecution Service’s (CPS) element of the £418,993,000 from £29,133,289,000 to £29,552,282,000. Attorney-General’s total DEL will be increased by Within the total DEL change, the impact on resources £44,343,000 from £643,992,000 to £688,335,000. and capital is set out in the following table: Changes in Near-cash Resource DEL arise from: A machinery of Government transfer of £36,072,000 £’000s from the Revenue and Customs Prosecutions Office as a Change New DEL result of the previously announced merger. Resource DEL 167,423 25,588,009 Budgetary transfers from the Ministry of Justice Of which: totalling £8,123,000 consisting of: Near Cash 115,658 24,537,883 £4,300,000 to help fund the Compass Case Management System Capital DEL 251,570 3,964,273 £2,600,000 from the Victim Surcharge collections Resource DEL + Capital DEL 418,993 29,552,282 £806,000 to provide support for the Local Criminal Justice Less Depreciation 42,728 507,265 Boards Total DEL 376,265 29,045,017 £417,000 to help fund the prosecution of new offences introduced in the Road Safety Act 2006 73WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 74WS

A budgetary transfer of £148,000 from the Home £’000 Office to help fund the delivery of the Violent Crime Change NEW DEL Reduction Act 2006. Non- Non- The Serious Fraud Office’s (SFO) element of the Voted voted Voted voted Total

Attorney-General’s total DEL remains unchanged at Resource +20,917 +28,583 5,795,010 652,544 6,447,554 £40,932,000. Of which The HM Procurator General and Treasury Solicitor’s Administration 0 0 274,672 500 275,172 (TSol) element of the Attorney-General’s total DEL budget remains unchanged at £15,699,000. Near-cash in +20,722 +28,778 5,423,325 681,229 6,104,554 The Revenue and Customs Prosecutions Offices (RCPO) RDEL Capital -291,447 -58,553 6,820,737 1,142,865 7,963,602 element of the Attorney-General’s total DEL will be * decreased by £36,072,000 to £0 arising from a machinery Depreciation -500 0 -241,705 -31,774 -273,479 of Government transfer to the Crown Prosecution Service Total -271,030 -29,970 12,374,042 1,763,635 14,137,677 *Depreciation, which forms part of resource DEL, is excluded from the total as a result of the previously announced merger. DEL, since capital DEL includes capital spending and to include depreciation of those assets would lead to double counting.

Resource Change: Programme (total increase of £49,500,000) TRANSPORT Voted: total net increase of £20,917,000 RfR1 Essex Thameside and InterCity East Coast Franchise (i) Net transfer of £21,417,000 from non voted provision as follows: £23,222,000 near cash for payments to Transport for London in The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Transport respect of ITSO; (Chris Mole): My noble Friend the Secretary of State £195,000 non cash for cost of capital charges; partially offset by for the Department for Transport, Lord Adonis, has £2,000,000 near cash to the Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency made the following Ministerial Statement: for Vehicle Excise Duty enforcement work; and The Essex Thameside franchise, currently operating as c2c, (ii) Transfer of £500,000 near cash from the Royal Travel budget consists of services on the London, Tilbury and Southend Railway to the Ministry of Defence in respect of continuing squadron 32 line from Fenchurch Street to Shoeburyness in Essex. The current services to the Royal Household. franchise is due to end in May 2011. The Department will be Non-Voted: total net increase of £28,583,000 consulting on the new franchise specification over the spring of (i) Take up of £50,000,000 end year flexibility to fund the disbursement 2010, with a view to issuing an invitation to tender in the summer costs associated with the restructuring of London and Continental of 2010 and an announcement of the successful bidder in early Railways; partially offset by 2011 to start the new franchise in May 2011. (ii) Net transfer of £21,417,000 to voted provision of which The InterCity East Coast franchise is currently operated by the £21,222,000 is near cash and £195,000 non-cash. East Coast Main Line Company after the previous franchise, operated by National Express East Coast, was terminated. This Capital Change: (total net decrease of £350,000,000) franchise consists of services on the East Coast Main Line from Voted: total net decrease of £291,447,000 RfR1 London to Scotland, including Leeds, Newcastle, Edinburgh and (i) Transfer of £350,000,000 to Department for Communities and Aberdeen. The Department will be consulting on the new franchise Local Government in respect of the Building Britain’s Future specification over the spring of 2010, with a view to issuing an initiative; partially offset by invitation to tender in the autumn of 2010 and an announcement of the successful bidder in the summer 2011 to start the new (ii) Net transfer of £58,553,000 from non voted provision as franchise in November 2011. follows; I have today published the joint prior information notice (PIN) £50,000,000 from departmental unallocated provision to be included for the re-franchising of both the Essex Thameside and InterCity within £350,000,000 transfer to Department for Communities East Coast rail franchises, giving potential bidders further information and Local Government in respect of Building Britain’s Future; and I have placed a copy in the Libraries of both Houses. £18,053,000 Supported Capital Expenditure (Resource) reclassified as capital grants; partially offset by £9,500,000 to the Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency for various Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) projects. Non-Voted: total net decrease of £58,553,000 (i) A net transfer of £58,553,000 to voted provision. The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Mr. Sadiq Khan): My noble Friend the Secretary of WALES State for the Department for Transport, Lord Adonis, has made the following ministerial statement: Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) Subject to parliamentary approval of any necessary supplementary estimate, the Department for Transport The Secretary of State for Wales (Mr. Peter Hain): departmental expenditure limit (DEL) for 2009-10 will The Welsh Assembly Government’s Departmental be decreased by £301,000,000 from £14,438,677,000 to Expenditure Limit (DEL) will be increased by £208,000 £14,137,677,000 and the administration budget will remain from £15,278,348,000 to £15,278,556,000. The increase at £275,172,000. is a result of: Within the DEL change, the impact on resources and Transfer of £208,000 Near-cash from National Offender capital, are as set out in the following table: Management Service; 75WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 76WS

In addition there will be changes to the annually Administration Costs Limit managed expenditure limit (AME) of: This switch reflects the fact that GEO was established £1,600,000 Near-cash AME as a separate Department at a very late stage in CSR 07, £7,830,000 Non-cash AME and its budget did not reflect the costs of its stand-alone £25,263,000 Capital AME status. Successive changes have been made since then to ensure GEO has the right breakdown of money. This There will be a variation in non-budget spending of completes that process. £10,700,000 cash increase required for a housing stock transfer for Conwy.

Framework Powers Explanatory Memorandum WORK AND PENSIONS

The Secretary of State for Wales (Mr. Peter Hain): I Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) am pleased to inform the House that an explanatory memorandum explaining the proposals for the use of framework powers in the Children, Schools and Families The Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Yvette Bill is available today, copies of which can be found in Cooper): Subject to parliamentary approval of the necessary the Vote Office, Libraries of both Houses and at: Supplementary Estimate, the Department for Work and www.walesoffice.gov.uk. Pensions Resource Departmental Expenditure Limit will decrease by £166,843,000 to £8,805,256,000 and the Capital Departmental Expenditure Limit will increase WOMEN AND EQUALITY by £207,762,000 to £284,517,000. The Administration budget will decrease by £160,512,000 to £6,204,337,000.

Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) Change £k New Departmental Expenditure Limit £k Non- Non- The Minister of State, Government Equalities Office Voted voted Total Voted voted Total (Maria Eagle): Subject to parliamentary approval of the necessary supplementary estimate, the Government Resource -838,686 671,843 -166,843 5,880,783 2,924,473 8,805,256 Equalities Office departmental expenditure limit will of which: reduce by £5,019,000 from £85,201,000 to £80,182,000 Administration -842,936 682,424 -160,512 4,800,729 1,403,608 6,204,337 and the administration budget will increase by £1,600,000 Near-cash -918,863 680,653 -238,210 5,619,053 2,957,899 8,576,952 from £8,005,000 to £9,605,000. Capital 207,828 -66 207,762 283,709 808 284,517 Within the departmental expenditure limit change, Depreciation* -68,076 329 -67,747 -234,194 -1,105 -235,299 the impact on resource and capital is as set out in the Total DEL -698,934 672,106 -26,828 5,930,298 2,924,176 8,854,474 following table: * Depreciation, which forms part of resource Departmental Expenditure Limit, is excluded from the total Departmental Expenditure Limit since the capital Departmental Expenditure Limit includes capital spending and to include Change £k New Departmental Expenditure depreciation of those assets would lead to double counting. Limit £k Non- Non- Resource Departmental Expenditure Limit Voted voted Total Voted voted Total The change in the resource element of the Departmental Resource 3,001 -3,000 1 17,806 60,960 78,766 Expenditure Limit arises from: of which: Movements in Voted Expenditure Administration 1,600 - 1 9,605 - Request for Resources 1 Near- 3,001 -3,000 - 17,806 60,651 78,455 i. Classification changes as a result of adopting International cash Financial Reporting Capital -5,020 - 1,980 1,980 Standards (IFRS). In RfR1 this has led to a reduction Depreciation* - - - -564 -564 in DEL Resource of £132,679,000. Total 3,001 -8,020 -5,019 17,806 62,376 80,182 Request for Resources 2 *Depreciation, which forms part of resource Departmental Expenditure Limit, is excluded from the total Departmental Expenditure Limit since the capital ii. Classification changes as a result of adopting Departmental Expenditure Limit includes capital spending and to include International Financial Reporting Standards (IFRS). depreciation of those assets would lead to double counting. In RfR2 this has led to a reduction in DEL Resource of Resource Departmental Expenditure Limit £768,861,000. The change in the Resource Departmental Expenditure iii. A budget transfer of £4,720,000 to the Ministry of Limit arises from a token increase to the administration Justice to fund increased activity through the courts forecast, where a Department’s expenditure within the relating to Child Maintenance, following repeal of section Estimate is wholly offset by income, so that a token 6 of the Child Support Act 1991. amount of £1,000 is voted. iv. A budget transfer of £8,600,000 to the Ministry of Capital Departmental Expenditure Limit Justice to meet the costs associated with increased The decrease in the capital DEL reflects the Government Employment and Support Allowance appeals. Equalities Office surrender of capital funds. These were v. A budget transfer of £5,759,000 to the Department of little value to either the Government Equalities for Business Innovation and Skills relating to the self- Office or the Commission for Equality and Human employment option of the Government’s six month Rights and could be better used elsewhere. offer. 77WS Written Ministerial Statements24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 78WS vi. A budget transfer of £572,000 to the Department for xvii. A decrease in non-voted expenditure of £7,796,000 Children, Schools and Families in respect of the Child offset by an increase in voted expenditure of £7,796,000 Poverty Unit. relating to decreased spend of the Personal Accounts Request for Resources 3 Delivery Authority. xviii. An increase in non-voted expenditure of £431,000 vii. Classification changes as a result of adopting offset by a decrease in voted expenditure of £431,000 International Financial Reporting Standards (IFRS). relating to increased spend of the Pensions Regulator. In RfR3 this has led to a reduction in DEL Resource of £117,497,000. xix. A decrease in non-voted expenditure of £69,000 offset by an increase in voted expenditure of £69,000 viii. A budget transfer of £440,000 to the Department relating to the alignment of internal plans. for Communities and Local Government in respect of Capital Departmental Expenditure Limit Older People’s Engagement. The change in the capital element of the Departmental Request for Resources 4 Expenditure Limit arises from: ix. Classification changes as a result of adopting Movements in Voted Expenditure International Financial Reporting Standards (IFRS). Request for Resources 2 In RfR4 this has led to a reduction in DEL Resource of xx. Classification changes as a result of adopting £53,215,000. International Financial Reporting Standards (IFRS). Request for Resources 5 In RfR2 this has led to an increase in DEL Capital of x. Classification changes as a result of adopting £52,336,000. International Financial Reporting Request for Resources 3 xxi. Classification changes as a result of adopting Standards (IFRS). In RfR5 this has led to an increase International Financial Reporting Standards (IFRS). in DEL Resource of £242,700,000. In RfR3 this has led to an increase in DEL Capital of xi. A budget transfer of £376,000 from the Cabinet £5,913,000. Office to enable the Department to meet additional Request for Resources 5 costs incurred by the Office of the Parliamentary Counsel. xxii. Classification changes as a result of adopting Movements in Non-Voted Expenditure International Financial Reporting Standards (IFRS). xii. Classification changes as a result of adopting In RfR5 this has led to an increase in DEL Capital of International Financial Reporting Standards (IFRS). £149,513,000. This has led to an increase in non-voted DEL Resource Movements in Non-Voted Expenditure of £682,424,000. xxiii. A decrease in non-voted capital expenditure of xiii. A decrease in non-voted expenditure of £806,000 £9,000 offset by an increase in voted capital expenditure offset by an increase in voted expenditure of £806,000 of £9,000 relating to decreased spend of the Pensions relating to decreased spend of Working Ventures (UK) Advisory Service. Limited. xxiv. An increase in non-voted capital expenditure of £213,000 offset by a decrease in voted capital expenditure xiv. A decrease in non-voted expenditure of £2,774,000 of £213,000 relating to decreased spend of the Personal offset by an increase in voted expenditure of £2,774,000 Accounts Delivery Authority. relating to decreased spend of the Independent Living xxv. A decrease in non-voted capital expenditure of Fund. £270,000 offset by an increase in voted capital expenditure xv. An increase in non-voted expenditure of £172,000 of £270,000 relating to decreased spend of the Pensions offset by a decrease in voted expenditure of £172,000 Regulator relating to increased spend of the Pensions Advisory Administration Costs Service. The movement in the Administration Cost limit arises xvi. An increase in non-voted expenditure of £261,000 from the changes to the Resource Departmental offset by a decrease in voted expenditure of £261,000 Expenditure Limit as noted in items i to iv, and vii to xii relating to increased spend of the Pensions Ombudsman. above. 47W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 48W Written Answers to CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT Departmental Conditions of Employment Questions Andrew Selous: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, Media and Sport how many and what proportion of staff of his Department, its executive Tuesday 24 November 2009 agencies and non-departmental public bodies work flexibly or part-time; and what his Department’s policy is on making jobs available on a job-share or flexible basis. [301336] HOUSE OF COMMONS COMMISSION Mr. Simon: Currently there are 50 (10.3 per cent.) out Members: Allowances of a total of 481 staff working part-time in DCMS. However, all staff are actively encouraged to work Mr. Allen: To ask the hon. Member for North alternative working patterns, including flexible working, Devon, representing the House of Commons compressed hours, and working from home. These are Commission whether the House authorities have mainly arranged at local line management level and the requested the return of the disc containing personal Department does not hold comprehensive data centrally financial information of hon. Members from the Daily about the percentages of staff involved. The Department’s Telegraph. [300229] policy is that all posts are considered suitable for part-time employees or job-share unless there is a clear business Nick Harvey: In the absence of a police investigation case outlining why this should not be the case. the House authorities are not in a position to confirm The Royal Parks Agency currently has seven (7 per whether or not there is such a disc, or who may have cent.) out of 100 staff working part-time. Application such a disc in their possession. I refer the hon. Member forms ask for applicants to state their preferred working to Mr. Speaker’s statement of 11 May 2009 referring to patterns including whether they wish to be considered steps the House authorities have taken to remind publishers for a job share. of the serious security implications if personal data that We do not hold information centrally about our might expose Members and others to risks to their non-departmental bodies. safety were to be published. Departmental Food Mr. Allen: To ask the hon. Member for North Devon, representing the House of Commons Mr. Roger Williams: To ask the Secretary of State for Commission if the House of Commons Commission Culture, Media and Sport what estimate he has made will advise hon. Members on changing their bank of the proportion of (a) lamb, (b) beef, (c) chicken, details following the disclosure of hon. Members’ (d) pork, (e) turkey, (f) other meats, (g) vegetables and (h) fruit procured by his Department that was personal financial information. [300238] produced in the UK in the latest period for which Nick Harvey: All Members were advised, by letter, on figures are available; and if he will make a statement. 13 May that they should consider taking action. I will [300182] send the hon. Member a copy of the letter. Mr. Simon: The proportion of food procured by the Department during 2008-09 which was produced in the UK was as follows: ELECTORAL COMMISSION COMMITTEE Percentage Elections (a) Lamb 100 (b) Beef 100 Mrs. Laing: To ask the hon. Member for South West (c) Chicken 100 Devon, representing the Speaker’s Committee on the (d) Pork 95 Electoral Commission whether the Electoral (e) Turkey 100 Commission has provided guidance to electoral (f) Other meats 0 registration officers in local authorities on the storage of electoral records. [300736] (g) Vegetables Mr. Streeter: The Electoral Commission informs me Ware potatoes—whole, unprepared 90 that it issues guidance to all electoral registration officers, Processed potatoes—whole, prepared 90 which highlights the importance of ensuring that electoral Root vegetables and onions 90 records containing personal data are stored securely. Brassicas 90 In particular the Commission’s guidance recommends Legumes 90 that electoral registration officers should seek guidance Protected vegetables—e.g. tomatoes 80 from the appointing authority’s Data Protection Officer and IT department on appropriate procedures to mitigate Other vegetables—e.g. asparagus 85 risks to the security of electoral data. The Commission further informs me that the Ministry (h) Fruit of Justice has published guidance on common standards Orchard fruit 75 for the storage of electors’ details on the electoral Soft fruit 70 register. 49W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 50W

Departmental Legal Costs Licensing

Pete Wishart: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr. Hollobone: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, Media and Sport what the (a) cost and (b) Culture, Media and Sport whether his Department purpose was of legal (i) representation and (ii) advice provides guidance on whether hon. Members and sought by his Department and its agencies in each year district councillors are included in the definition of since May 1997. [300334] ‘interested parties’ or ‘responsible authorities’ in section 13 of the Licensing Act 2003 and in the Mr. Simon: The overall legal costs incurred by the Licensing Act 2003 (Hearings) Regulations 2005. Department and its Agency, The Royal Parks, from [301073] 2005-06 to 2008-09 are set out in the table. Information relating to prior years can be obtained Mr. Sutcliffe: The Licensing Act 2003 (the 2003 Act) only at disproportionate cost. Legal advice is provided and associated guidance issued by the Secretary of by the Treasury Solicitor’s Department and, where required, State and by my Department sets out the individuals or by counsel and private sector legal firms. The purpose bodies that are interested parties and responsible authorities of the advice is to support the whole range of the under the 2003 Act. Members of Parliament and district Department’s activities, including policy making, the councillors are not responsible authorities under the drafting of statutory instruments and the preparation 2003 Act and, currently, are interested parties only if of Bills. they live, or operate a business, in the vicinity of the premises. In addition, if requested to do so, they can Financial year Legal expenditure (£) make representations on behalf of a resident or a business who themselves is an interested party under 2008-09 2,724,750 the 2003 Act. 2007-08 2,873,160 2006-07 3,190,360 In recognition of the important role that local authorities 2005-06 2,454,740 play in co-ordinating efforts to manage local alcohol related problems, the Policing and Crime Act 2009 Departmental Official Cars includes a provision which, when in force, will make local councillors interested parties under the 2003 Act Norman Baker: To ask the Secretary of State for and therefore able to make representations on licence Culture, Media and Sport what estimate he has made applications and seek licence reviews in their own right of the cost to his Department of providing official cars as councillors. for the use of (a) Ministers and (b) officials in the last 12 months. [301184] Mr. Simon: The cost of providing official cars for the WALES use of Ministers in 2008-09 was £276,668. No departmental Departmental Disclosure of Information official was provided with an official car. Departmental Rail Travel Norman Baker: To ask the Secretary of State for Wales how many allegations of victimisation for Norman Baker: To ask the Secretary of State for whistleblowing have been made to his Department by Culture, Media and Sport on what date he last travelled its staff since 6 June 2006. [301499] by train in the course of his official duties. [301195] Mr. Hain: The Wales Office has had no occurrence of Mr. Bradshaw: I travelled by train to Nottingham on whistleblowing. 20 November. Departmental Official Cars Departmental Recruitment Norman Baker: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr. Jenkin: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, Wales what estimate he has made of the cost to his Media and Sport what proportion of jobs advertised Department of providing official cars for the use of by his Department in the last 12 months were online (a) Ministers and (b) officials in the last 12 months. only applications; and what provision his Department [301179] makes for those wishing to apply for jobs in his Department who do not have access to the internet. Mr. Hain: I refer the hon. Member to the written [301547] ministerial statement made by the Under-Secretary of State for Transport, my hon. Friend the Member for Mr. Simon: 95 per cent. (or 113 out of 119) of the Gillingham (Paul Clark) on 16 July 2009, Official Report, recruitments that took place between November 2008 column 80WS. and November 2009 were advertised on the internet only. These were recruitments that were open to existing Departmental Taxis civil servants only. Posts open external to the civil service are often advertised in the press as well. As yet Ian Stewart: To ask the Secretary of State for Wales no provisions are in place to advertise internal Civil what contracts his Department has with private hire service recruitments in a non-electronic format, however, taxi companies; and what expenditure his Department paper-only applications are accepted by the Department has incurred against each such contract in each of the and information on current vacancies is available and last three years. [300836] readily given to any individual who contacts the Department inquiring about current opportunities. Mr. Hain: None. 51W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 52W

DEFENCE Under armed forces legislation, it is not always possible for the full amount of a deductions from earnings Armed Forces: Cadets request to be taken from a serviceperson’s salary. Under the Minimum Drawing Rate regulations, no individual Bill Wiggin: To ask the Secretary of State for can have more than 50 per cent. of their net pay Defence (1) how much funding is required for cadet deducted in respect of certain items, including deduction instructors to resume training; [301439] of earnings requests. Individuals will, nonetheless, remain liable for the amounts as ordered. Such arrears must (2) what remuneration cadet instructors will receive either be cleared via private arrangements, or by continued in 2009-10; and from what budget such remuneration monthly deductions from salary at the end of the period will be drawn. [301440] of liability. Mr. Kevan Jones: We fully recognise the contribution that the cadets make to the long-term future of the Armed Forces: Recruitment Army and to society in general. But tough choices have to be made. Our focus is on Afghanistan and the cadets do not contribute directly to that main effort. We have Mrs. Curtis-Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State therefore taken the very difficult decision to reduce the for Defence what recent assessment he has made of amount of money available to the Army Cadet Force progress towards his Department’s recruitment targets for the remainder of the year. This means that instructors for the armed forces in the (a) short and (b) medium will receive no further payments for weekend Cadet term; and how many personnel have been recruited into training, although we will continue to meet enabling the armed forces from non-Commonwealth countries costs such as travel where we can. We will also continue in each of the last three years. [300387] to provide training courses at the Cadet Training Centre and at Brigade level for adult instructors, as it is essential Mr. Kevan Jones: Recruiting targets are determined that we maintain that core of skill and expertise. Instructors annually based on current and forecast outflow rates are not paid for evening training activity, so this is and liability, and recruitment to all three services continuing as normal. The reduction in activity is saving continues to improve. Targeted national, regional and a total of £4 million. By the end of 2009-10 Army cadet local level recruiting campaigns coupled with the current instructors will have received some £13 million from the economic climate are factors contributing to increased Army budget. interest. We acknowledge the huge level of commitment and enthusiasm within the Army Cadet Force, and among Shortages in some key trades remain a concern. This the volunteer adult instructors in particular. is being addressed through retention incentives, increased recruiting, and by restructuring the services to improve effectiveness. Armed Forces: Pay Manning Balance is defined in the MOD’s public Steve Webb: To ask the Secretary of State for service agreement as between -2 per cent. and +1 per Defence how many deductions of earnings requests cent. of the requirement. The Army has moved into each of the armed forces received from the Child Manning Balance and the Royal Navy and Royal Air Support Agency and the Child Maintenance and Force are both forecast to move into Manning Balance Enforcement Commission in the last three years for during 2010. which figures are available; how many requests were With the exception of the citizens of the Republic of (a) complied with and (b) not complied with by each Ireland and Nepalese citizens recruited into the Royal service; and under what circumstances a service will Gurkha Rifles we do not recruit outside of the not comply with a deduction of earnings request. Commonwealth. [300694] Gurkha intake was fixed at 230 personnel over the previous three financial years 2006-07, 2007-08 and Mr. Kevan Jones: Data are not held in a format which 2008-09. would identify a breakdown of the number of deductions from earnings requests. However, the total numbers The following table provides the number of other received across the services since January 2007 to date personnel recruited into the UK Regular Forces who are provided in the following table: register a non-Commonwealth nationality. Non-Commonwealth Number Number

January to December 2007 3,577 2006-07 40 January to December 2008 5,507 2007-08 70 January 2009 to date 4,147 2008-09 60 Notes: Deductions from earnings requests are complied with 1. Figures have been rounded to 10. When rounding to the nearest 10, in all but exceptional circumstances. If an individual numbers ending in ″5″ have been rounded to the nearest multiple of was not in receipt of pay, for example because they were 20 to prevent systematic bias. absent without leave, this would prohibit compliance. In 2. Availability of data has been affected by the introduction of the instances where a non-resident parent cannot be contacted Joint Personnel Administration (JPA) system. Figures for 2006-07 exclude the RAF and Army figures for 2006-07 are for the 11-month because they are committed to operational duties, the period from 1 April 2006 to 28 February 2007. CSA would be informed accordingly, and asked to 3. All figures are provisional and subject to review due to ongoing resubmit the request in six months. validation of data from JPA. 53W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 54W

Armed Forces: Waste Disposal Defence Estates: Sales

Mrs. Curtis-Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State Willie Rennie: To ask the Secretary of State for for Defence what assessment he has made of the Defence with reference to the answer of 12 November potential effectiveness of pyrolysis waste disposal 2009, Official Report, columns 702-3W, on Defence systems generating heat and electricity whilst troops Estates: sales, how much of the total receipts accrued in are on operations; and how wet and dry waste is 2007-08 have been allocated for the purposes of disposed of during operations in Iraq and Afghanistan. improving armed forces accommodation. [301481] [300501] Mr. Kevan Jones: I refer the hon. Member to the Official Report, Mr. Quentin Davies: The use of pyrolysis waste disposal answer I gave on 10 November 2009, systems on operations to generate heat and electricity column 222W to the hon. Member for Westbury may not be viable, due to the low electrical power (Dr. Murrison). output such systems can generate and the difficulty in Departmental Assets utilising heat energy in hot desert environments. MOD is however, committed to investigating this and is conducting Dr. Cable: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence a study into the quantity and type of waste produced in what assets of his Department are planned to be sold in theatre, which will enable the Department to determine each year from 2009-10 to 2013-14; what the (a) the best energy from waste solution. description and (b) book value of each such asset is; Currently dry waste in theatre is sorted and plastics what the expected revenue from each such sale is; and if and metals are recycled by local companies. The rest is he will make a statement. [300198] incinerated in theatre. MOD is in the process of supplying Membrane Biological Reactors in order to treat sewage Mr. Kevan Jones: The Ministry of Defence (MOD) and it is investigating the re-use of grey water from keeps its estate under constant review to meet present showers. and planned future requirements, with a view to disposing of surplus assets as quickly as possible. A list of the sites comprising the present and potential future programme Armoured Fighting Vehicles is available in the Library of the House. Details of all MOD holdings over £1 million, including Willie Rennie: To ask the Secretary of State for sites in disposal, together with their latest asset valuations Defence how many armoured vehicles of each type can be found in Chapter Seven of the National Asset were classified as (a) in service, (b) fit for purpose and Register, on HM Treasury’s website: (c) not in service on the latest date for which figures www.hm-treasury.gov.uk are available. [301595] Details of all property below £1 million in value could be provided only with disproportionate cost. Mr. Quentin Davies: The numbers of armoured vehicles Receipts from individual sales depend on market of each type classified as ’in service’, ’fit for purpose’ conditions at the time of sale and other factors. Where and ’out of service’ are provided in the following pre-sale valuations have been obtained, then release table. ahead of the sale, could, in any case, influence the Significant quantities of Mastiff, Vector, Bulldog and market and are thus regarded as commercially confidential. Snatch are currently in the process of withdrawal to the UK following the cessation of operations in Iraq. Nuclear Submarines: Decommissioning

Fit for Willie Rennie: To ask the Secretary of State for Vehicle In service purpose Out of service Defence how much had been spent on the submarine dismantling project on the latest date for which figures AS90 145 132 0 are available. [301596] Challenger 2 345 261 40 CRARRV 81 70 0 Mr. Quentin Davies: Up to and including 31 March CVR(T) 1,052 928 116 2009, the latest date for which figures are available, FV 430 (Mk2 1,110 658 290 spending on the Submarine Dismantling Project had and Bulldog) been £3.15 million, excluding staff costs. Fuchs 11 11 0 Saxon 147 147 0 At this time the project was still known as the ISOLUS Titan 33 24 0 (Interim Storage of Laid-Up Submarines) project. Trojan 33 25 0 Territorial Army: Finance Warrior 793 552 0 Mastiff 271 134 0 Mr. Lancaster: To ask the Secretary of State for Panther 401 334 0 Defence when he expects to publish the Territorial Ridgeback 118 73 0 Army budget for financial year 2010-11. [300539] Snatch 2 653 358 0 (including variants) Bill Rammell [holding answer 23 November 2009]: Vector 192 87 0 The Army budget for 2010-11 will be published in the Viking 116 86 0 Defence Estimates in spring 2010 following approval in the House of Commons. However, this will not separately 55W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 56W identify individual cost areas within the total budget; Overseas Aid the ethos is of one Army—Regular and Territorial. The financial systems do not allow costs such as stock, Chris Ruane: To ask the Secretary of State for ammunition and rations to be separately identified from International Development what recent steps have been those incurred by Regular units. taken to provide information for the public on the allocation of funds from the public purse to overseas aid projects. [300663] FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE Mr. Michael Foster: The Department for International Development (DFID) has published summary information Departmental Official Cars on each of its overseas aid projects via its website since August 2009. We are working on arrangements Norman Baker: To ask the Secretary of State for and a time table for publishing further details of our Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what estimate he projects. In doing so, we need to balance our commitment has made of the cost to his Department of providing to transparency with the need to protect sensitive official cars for the use of (a) Ministers and (b) information, and the cost and practicality of publishing officials in the last 12-months. [301175] information in a usable format. Chris Bryant: I refer the hon. Member to the written In October 2009 DFID also published “Statistics on ministerial statement made by my hon. Friend the International Development” which contains summary Parliamentary Under Secretary of State for Transport, data tables on the destination and purpose of all UK the hon. Member for Gillingham (Paul Clark), on 16 July official expenditure on international development in 2009, Official Report, column 80WS. each of the last five years. A copy is available in the Library as well as at: www.dfid.gov.uk INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT Mr. Hoyle: To ask the Secretary of State for Departmental Manpower International Development what the time taken between the commitment and delivery of funds was in John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for respect of each pledge made by his Department in each International Development how many staff of each of the last five years. [301474] grade work at each location on services which his Mr. Michael Foster: This information cannot be provided Department has contracted out; what the (a) without incurring disproportionate cost. contractors and (b) services provided are in each case; what the length of each contract is; and what union recognition agreements are in place with each Sri Lanka: Internally Displaced Persons contractor. [301601] Jo Swinson: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr. Douglas Alexander: The Department for International Development what reports he has International Development (DFID) has contracts with received of sexual and gender-based violence against third party suppliers for a number of services which are Tamil women in the camps of northern Sri Lanka; and carried out on DFID premises. Information on the if he will make a statement. [301087] name of contractors and the services provided is available Mr. Michael Foster: It is very difficult to verify reports on the DFID website at: or allegations of sexual and gender based violence in http://www.dfid.gov.uk/Working-with-DFID/Procurement/ the camps in Sri Lanka. This is because access for Contracts-let/ humanitarian agencies, particularly those who work on It is not possible to provide the number of staff protection activities, has been extremely restricted. We broken down by civil service grades. Union recognition continue to press the Government of Sri Lanka to allow agreements are a matter between our suppliers and their humanitarian agencies access to the camps to assess employees. allegations of abuses such as sexual and gender-based violence. Latin America: Overseas Aid The UK Government have consistently advocated for Greg Mulholland: To ask the Secretary of State for the treatment of all internally displaced persons (IDPs) International Development how much funding his held in camps in Sri Lanka to be in accordance with Department has provided to each south and central international standards. American country in each year since 2006. [300353] The most effective way to ensure the safety of women displaced by the conflict is to restore freedom of movement Mr. Michael Foster: Information on the Department to the IDP population so vulnerable people can be for International Development’s (DFID) aid to all reunited with their families and communities. developing countries is available in the publication Statistics on International Development, which is available in the Library or online at: http://www.dfid.gov.uk/About-DFID/Finance-and- WOMEN AND EQUALITY Performance/Aid-Statistics/Statistics-on-International- Development-2009/ Climate Change Details of funding in south and central America can be found at: Simon Hughes: To ask the Minister for Women and http://www.dfid.gov.uk/Documents/publications/sid%202009/ Equality how many (a) Ministers and (b) civil Table%2014.2%20America.xls servants from the Government Equalities Office will 57W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 58W be attending the United Nations Climate Change TRANSPORT Conference in Copenhagen in an official capacity. [300915] A5: M1

Michael Jabez Foster: None, Andrew Selous: To ask the Minister of State, Department for Transport what estimate he has made Departmental Hotels of the costs (a) to date and (b) by the end of the 2009-10 financial year of preparing the A5-M1 link. Mr. Heald: To ask the Minister for Women and [300620] Equality what expenditure the Government Equalities Office incurred on hotel accommodation in 2008-09. Chris Mole [holding answer 23 November 2009]: The [301389] total cost at the end of October 2009 of preparing the Michael Jabez Foster: In 2008-09 the Government A5-M1 Link scheme is £11.8 million. The estimated Equalities Office spent £8,234 on hotel accommodation. total costs by the end of the 2009-10 financial year is £12.8 million. Departmental Official Cars Bus Services: South East Mr. Heald: To ask the Minister for Women and Equality what the cost of provision of Government Mr. Lancaster: To ask the Minister of State, cars to special advisers in the Government Equalities Department for Transport what steps his Department Office was in the last 12 months. [301392] is taking to reduce the incidence of alcohol-related violent, anti-social behaviour on buses in (a) Milton Michael Jabez Foster: The Government Equalities Keynes and (b) the South East. [300274] Office does not provide Government cars to special advisers and therefore there has been no expenditure for Mr. Khan: The Department for Transport has not this service. directly undertaken any specific initiatives in relation to Milton Keynes or to the South East. Departmental Pay Departmental Pay Dr. Cable: To ask the Minister for Women and Equality how many staff in the Government Equalities John McDonnell: To ask the Minister of State, Office received bonus payments in 2008-09; what Department for Transport what the (a) average and proportion of the total workforce they represented; (b) highest non-consolidated performance related what the total amount of bonuses paid was; what the payment was in cash terms for senior civil servants in largest single payment was; and if she will make a his Department in each of the last five years. [300509] statement. [300568] Michael Jabez Foster: In 2008-09 the Government Chris Mole [holding answer 23 November 2009]: The Equalities Office awarded 19 bonuses to its staff at a (a) average and (b) highest non-consolidated performance total cost of £28,400. The 19 staff represented 19 per related payment in cash terms for senior civil servants in cent. of the total work force. The highest individual the Department for Transport in each of the last five bonus awarded was £10,500. years is set out in the following table: Departmental Training £ Average non-consolidated Highest non-consolidated Grant Shapps: To ask the Minister for Women and performance related payment performance related payment Equality what training sessions were attended by (a) 2009 6,359 12,500 Ministers and (b) special advisers in the Government 2008 7,001 22,000 Equality Office at public expense in each of the last 2007 5,749 20,000 three years. [301368] 2006 4,975 12,500 2005 3,565 17,000 Michael Jabez Foster: Since it’s creation on the 12 October 2007 the Government Equalities Office has not funded any training sessions for its Ministers or John McDonnell: To ask the Minister of State, special advisers. Department for Transport with reference to the answer of 2 November 2009, Official Report, column 632W, on Departmental Working Hours departmental pay, when the next equal pay review for each bargaining unit will be held. [301151] Andrew Selous: To ask the Minister for Women and Equality how many and what proportion of staff of Chris Mole: The table shows when each of the the Government Equalities Office work flexibly or Department for Transport’s bargaining units will be part-time; and what her Office’s policy is on making carrying out its next equal pay review. jobs available on a job-share or flexible basis. [301342] Bargaining unit Next equal pay review Michael Jabez Foster: The Government Equalities Office (GEO) operates a flexible working policy which Department for Transport (Centre) December 2009 is available to all staff and this is offered on all job Driver Vehicle and Licensing January 2010 Agency vacancies. We currently have six staff who work part-time Highways Agency February 2010 and this equates to 5.5 per cent. of our work force. 59W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 60W

technical issues it is hoped that the draft report will be Bargaining unit Next equal pay review ready for distribution to the statutory recipients by Vehicle and Operating Services July 2011 March 2010. Publication of the final report typically Agency occurs three months after representations have been Government Car and Dispatch April 2010 received and considered but it dependent on the issues Agency raised by those consulted. Maritime and Coastguard Agency October 2012 Vehicle Certification Agency July 2012 Driver Standards Agency May 2012 Integrated Transport Smartcard Organisation: Finance

Departmental Rail Travel Stephen Hammond: To ask the Minister of State, Department for Transport with reference to the answer Norman Baker: To ask the Minister of State, of 5 November 2009, Official Report, column 1103W, Department for Transport on what date he last on the Integrated Transport Smartcard Organisation: travelled by train in the course of his official duties. finance, how much his Department and its agencies [301200] have spent on (a) pilots, (b) design studies, (c) development, (d) consultants and (e) equipment Mr. Khan: On Friday 20 November 2009. relating to the Integrated Transport Smartcard Organisation in each of the last 10 years. [301472] Electric Vehicles: Milton Keynes Mr. Khan: The table sets out payments made directly Mr. Lancaster: To ask the Minister of State, to ITSO Ltd. (and its predecessor, the Integrated Transport Department for Transport what steps his Department Smartcard Organisation) in the last 10 years, broken is taking to encourage the use of electric vehicles in down into development and consultancy. Please note Milton Keynes. [300544] the membership fees are included in the development figures: Mr. Khan: The Government have allocated over No funding for pilot schemes has been paid directly £400 million to deliver policies aiming to place the UK to ITSO Ltd. However, the Department for Transport at the global forefront of ultra-low carbon vehicle has made payments to public authorities to support development, demonstration, manufacture and use. These pilots and in some cases the transition of legacy schemes policies would all be applicable to encouraging the use to ITSO compliance. of electric vehicles in Milton Keynes. The Department has not fund design studies for Some measures are available nationally, such as ITSO. £230 million to provide consumer support worth in the The Department has not directly funded equipment region of £2,000 to £5,000 per car to be used between purchase for ITSO Ltd. However, some public authority 2011 and 2014. schemes will have used DFT funding to purchase equipment Other measures have a regional focus. For example for their schemes, for example smartcard readers. on 19 November, the Government launched the Plugged-in Places infrastructure framework, providing up to £30 million £ to support the deployment of electric vehicle charging Total spend exc. infrastructure in around three to six lead cities and Development Consultants VA T regions across the UK. The aim of this scheme is for 1999-2000 104,000 0 104,000 consortia to come forward with plans for roll outs of 2000-01 25,000 0 25,000 the electric vehicle infrastructure in their region. 2001-02 20,000 0 20,000 2002-03 1,058,000 46,647 1,104,647 Helicopters: Accidents 2003-04 2,690,180 47,704 2,732,884 2004-05 311,275 34,481 345,756 Miss Begg: To ask the Minister of State, Department 2005-06 485,256 44,691 529,947 for Transport when the draft Air Accident 2006-07 223,176 4,982 228,158 Investigation Branch report on the Etap field 2007-08 760,700 9,184 769,884 helicopter incident will be with the statutory recipients; 2008-09 130,000 650 130,650 and when he expects to publish the final version. [301114] M6: Walsall Paul Clark: The accident occurred on 18 February 2009 and is the subject of an inspector’s investigation. Mr. Winnick: To ask the Minister of State, The Civil Aviation (Investigation of Air Accidents and Department for Transport (1) whether the chief Incidents) Regulations 1996 state that a report on an executive of the Highways Agency plans to visit investigation should be made public in the shortest time residents of the parts of Walsall borough affected by possible (and if possible, within 12 months of the date works on the M6 when he visits the sites in the borough of the accident or serious incident). where work is being undertaken; [300244] The subject investigation is complex in nature and (2) with reference to the letter of 13 November 2009, requires significant consultation with Eurocopter, the from the Chief Executive of the Highways Agency to helicopter manufacturer. This has introduced some delays the hon. Member for Walsall North, on what date the to the investigation process. While it is difficult to Chief Executive plans to visit Walsall to inspect the predict the future time scale for concluding the outstanding work being undertaken on the M6. [300683] 61W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 62W

Chris Mole [holding answer 23 November 2009]: The Railways: Closures chief executive of the Highways Agency has agreed to visit the site of the Managed Motorways work on the Norman Baker: To ask the Minister of State, M6. I have asked the chief executive to notify my hon. Department for Transport what his policy is on the (a) Friend when details are finalised. promotion and (b) facilitation by his Department of the reopening of closed railway (i) lines and (ii) Motor Vehicles: Safety stations. [301246] Chris Mole: It is for local authorities and regions to Mr. Greg Knight: To ask the Minister of State, determine whether or not a re-opened railway or a new Department for Transport if he will make it his policy station is the best way to meet local or regional transport to oppose any proposals from the European needs. They can fund a scheme from the regional funding Commission which would require existing vehicles to allocation if it is a priority and demonstrates value for use daytime running lights. [300575] money. The Department for Transport is prepared to work with promoters of new lines, services and stations Paul Clark: We have argued successfully against to help and advise them on how their objectives can be mandatory European rules on the use of dipped headlamps achieved and to facilitate their implementation through during daylight hours by existing vehicles (except when changes to franchises. required by conditions, eg fog) and are not aware of any Where investment requires the provision of new or new proposals along these lines. enhanced services, the policy is that a subsidy required Special, dedicated, low-wattage daytime running lamps should be funded by the promoter for at least the first will be required by early 2011 for all new types of three years. Following that period, if the service is passenger car/light van and by summer 2012 for all successful and demonstrates value for money, subject to other new types. We are not aware of any proposal to funds being made available, the Government would retro-fit such lamps to existing vehicles. consider funding it thereafter as part of the national rail network. Public Transport: South East Railways: Finance Norman Baker: To ask the Minister of State, Mr. Lancaster: To ask the Minister of State, Department for Transport how much his Department Department for Transport whether his Department has has spent on (a) consultancy fees and (b) other made a recent assessment of the level of violence and aspects of the Intercity Express programme to date. abusive behaviour on public transport in (a) Milton [301245] Keynes and (b) the South East. [300275] Chris Mole: From 2005 to October 2009, the Department Mr. Khan: The Department for Transport (DFT) for Transport has spent £21 million on the Intercity does not routinely assess regional public transport crime Express Programme. This resource has included financial, or antisocial behaviour data. procurement, programme management, technical, legal, industry, business case and other specialist advice required The British Transport police collect crime data for to ensure the successful delivery of a project of the scale crime committed at rail stations and on trains, as well as of the Intercity Express Programme. This figure should London Underground, Docklands Light Railway, Glasgow be considered in the context of the Intercity Express Subway, Croydon Tramlink and the Midland Metro Programme contract value of £7.5 billion. tram system. Rolling Stock Crime committed at bus stations and on buses may be collected by the bus operator, local authority, Passenger Mrs. Villiers: To ask the Minister of State, Transport Executive and/or local police. These data are Department for Transport how many of the 1,300 extra not collated or assessed at a national level by DFT. carriages referred to in the Government’s Rail White Paper of July 2007 have been ordered; and on which Railway Network: Finance lines they will be operating. [300346] Chris Mole [holding answer 23 November 2009]: As I Mr. Sanders: To ask the Minister of State, set out in my answer of 14 October 2009, Official Department for Transport what account his Report, columns 895-96W,to my hon. Friend the Member Department takes of local authorities’ growth point for Heywood and Middleton (Jim Dobbin), so far there status when determining the level of funding for new have been 543 new rail carriages ordered by the following railway infrastructure. [300317] train operators:

Chris Mole: Local authorities are best placed to Number of determine the transport requirements arising from any TOC Class Type vehicles growth point in their area. They can fund railway Southern 377 EMU—DV 48 infrastructure through the Community Infrastructure London Midland 350/2 EMU 148 Fund and prioritising the use of Regional Funding London Midland 172 DMU 69 Allocation for investment in such an area. The Department Chiltern 172 DMU 8 for Transport also takes account of population and Southern 377 EMU—DV 44 employment growth when determining future capacity Virgin West Coast 390 EMU 106 requirements of the railway funded through the High NXEA 379 EMU 120 Level Output Specification. 63W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 64W

On 23 July, the Government announced a major new Official Report, column 639W, the Department for electrification programme which radically affects the Transport is currently planning to award the order requirements for train rolling stock over the next decade. around autumn 2010. In particular, there will be far less need for diesel trains and a greater requirement for electric trains. The Department for Transport will publish a new rolling COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT stock plan in the autumn, setting out a revised strategy. Homes and Communities Agency Mrs. Villiers: To ask the Minister of State, Department for Transport when he expects to issue the Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for rolling stock statement which the Secretary of State Communities and Local Government how much the indicated in July would be published in the Autumn of Homes and Communities Agency has spent on its this year; and whether this statement will cover both National Consultancy Unit since the establishment of the Intercity Express programme and the 1,300 extra that unit. [300450] carriages referred to in the Government’s Rail White Paper of July 2007. [300348] John Healey: Since the National Consultancy Unit’s establishment in 1 April 2004, staff costs (salaries) are Chris Mole [holding answer 23 November 2009]: As estimated as £10,062,940. set out in my answer to the hon. Member for Lewes (Norman Baker) of 26 October 2009, Official Report, Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for columns 12-13W,on 23 July the Government announced Communities and Local Government (1) how much the the electrification of the Great Western Main Line Homes and Communities Agency has spent on between London and Swansea, and the line between providing (a) signage and (b) security for the site at (i) Liverpool and Manchester via Newton-le-Willows. This St Clements Hospital, London and (ii) Castle College electrification programme radically affects the requirements Northside, Sheffied; [300451] for rolling stock over the next decade. We will publish (2) how much the Homes and Communities Agency an updated rolling stock plan, taking account of these spent in acquiring (a) St. Clement’s Hospital, London changes and setting out a revised strategy in the autumn. and (b) Castle College Northside, Sheffield; and if he This will happen in due course and will set out the will make a statement. [300608] Government’s strategy in relation to rolling stock provision. John Healey: St Clements Hospital, London was Rolling Stock: Procurement purchased for £7 million on 11 June 2008. Since purchasing St. Clement’s Hospital, the Homes and Stephen Hammond: To ask the Minister of State, Communities Agency has spent: Department for Transport with reference to the answer £255,323 on security up to and including 31 October 2009; to the hon. Member for Lewes of 26 October 2009, and Official Report, column 12W, on rolling stock: £504 on safety and warning signage. procurement, by what date he expects to publish the Castle College Northside, Sheffield was purchased updated rolling stock plan. [301048] for £5 million on 16 July 2008. Chris Mole: As set out in my answer to the hon. The Homes and Communities Agency has not spent Member for Lewes (Norman Baker) of 26 October anything on signage or security on Castle College as 2009, Official Report, columns 12-13W, on 23 July the the college are occupying the site until 2010. Government announced the electrification of the Great Rent to HomeBuy Scheme Western Main Line between London and Swansea, and the line between Liverpool and Manchester via Newton- Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for le-Willows. This electrification programme radically affects Communities and Local Government when he expects the requirements for rolling stock over the next decade. to make a decision on the future of the pilot Rent to We will publish an updated rolling stock plan, taking HomeBuy scheme. [300456] account of these changes and setting out a revised strategy in the autumn. John Healey: Rent to HomeBuy is proving successful This will happen in due course. in supporting first time buyers and providers of affordable housing, and will continue for the remainder Thameslink: Rolling Stock of the 2008-11 National Affordable Housing Programme. Stephen Hammond: To ask the Minister of State, Department for Transport pursuant to the answer of Christmas 12 November 2009, Official Report, column 639W, on Thameslink: Rolling Stock, when he expects to (a) Mr. Roger Williams: To ask the Secretary of State for announce the preferred bidder and (b) place the final Communities and Local Government how many order for the Thameslink rolling stock programme. Christmas parties his Department plans to host in [300312] 2009; what has been budgeted for each such reception; what estimate he has made of the proportion of (a) Chris Mole: The identification of a preferred bidder lamb, (b) beef, (c) chicken, (d) pork, (e) turkey, (f) prior to final award will depend on the progress of the other meats, (g) vegetables, (h) fruit and (i) alcohol to evaluation and negotiations with the remaining bidders. be served at each such function which is produced in As set in out in my answer of 12 November 2009, the UK; and if he will make a statement. [300879] 65W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 66W

Barbara Follett: The Department does not fund staff John Mason: To ask the Secretary of State for Christmas parties and in respect of any other functions Communities and Local Government what (a) this question could be answered only at bonuses and (b) incentives have been paid to (i) disproportionate cost. consultants and (ii) contractors engaged by executive A second report on the proportion of domestically agencies and non-departmental public bodies for which produced food used by Government Departments and his Department is responsible in each of the last three also supplied to hospitals and prisons under contracts years. [300644] negotiated by NHS Supply Chain and HM Prison Service was published in November 2008, covering the Barbara Follett: The information requested is not year from 1 April 2007 to 31 March 2008. This report held centrally and could be provided only at and the first one covering the previous year can be disproportionate cost. found at: Departmental Disclosure of Information http://www.defra.gov.uk/foodfarm/policy/publicsectorfood/ awareness.htm Norman Baker: To ask the Secretary of State for The report gives details of the proportion of individual Communities and Local Government how many meat, fruit and vegetable categories purchased. allegations of victimisation for whistleblowing have Although it is too early to show a trend, the report been made to his Department by its staff since 6 June indicates that the amount of domestically produced 2006. [301563] food consumed by Government Departments in England is increasing. The proportion of domestically Barbara Follett: There have been no allegations of produced food procured by Communities has gone up victimisation for whistleblowing made to the from 59 per cent. in 2006-07 to 65 per cent. in 2007-08. Department for Communities and Local Government We expect to publish a third report at the end of 2009. since 6 June 2006. Departmental Official Cars Climate Change: Conferences Norman Baker: To ask the Secretary of State for Simon Hughes: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government what estimate he Communities and Local Government how many (a) has made of the cost to his Department of providing Ministers and (b) civil servants from his Department official cars for the use of (a) Ministers and (b) will be attending the United Nations Climate Change officials in the last 12 months. [301181] Conference in Copenhagen in an official capacity. [300887] Barbara Follett: I refer the hon. Member to the answer given on 22 October 2009, Official Report, John Healey: None. column 1642W, to the hon. Member for Putney (Justine Greening). Departmental Conferences Figures could be broken down by (a) Ministers and (b) officials only at disproportionate cost. Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for Departmental Official Hospitality Communities and Local Government what (a) drinks receptions, (b) seminars and (c) conferences have been Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for hosted by (i) his Department, (ii) the Tenants Services Communities and Local Government how much (a) Authority, (iii) the Homes and Communities Agency his Department, (b) the Homes and Communities and (iv) the Homes and Communities Agency Agency, (c) the Homes and Communities Agency Academy in each of the last 12 months. [300444] Academy and (d) the Tenant Services Authority expects to spend on Christmas parties in 2009. [300448] Barbara Follett: The Department does not hold this information centrally and it could be provided only at Barbara Follett: In relation to Christmas parties, the disproportionate cost. Department has interpreted this to mean internal, Information in respect of the Tenant Services departmental Christmas parties. On this basis, the (a) Agency, the Homes and Communities Agency and the Department can confirm that no official funds are Homes and Communities Agency Academy has been planned to be spent on Christmas parties in 2009. deposited in the Library of the House. The Homes and Communities Agency (b), the Homes and Communities Agency Academy (c) and Departmental Consultants the Tenant Services Authority (d) can also confirm that there are no plans to spend official funds on Christmas parties. John Mason: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government what (a) Departmental Official Visits bonuses and (b) incentives have been paid to (i) consultants and (ii) contractors engaged by his Norman Baker: To ask the Secretary of State for Department in each of the last three years. [300643] Communities and Local Government on what date he last travelled by train in the course of his official duties. Barbara Follett: The Department has not paid any [301192] (a) bonuses and (b) incentives to (i) consultants and (ii) contractors in the last three years. Barbara Follett: Friday, 20 November 2009. 67W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 68W

Departmental Recycling £

Mr. Jenkins: To ask the Secretary of State for 2006-07 121,588 Communities and Local Government what weight of 2007-08 111,056 paper his Department has recycled in each of the last 2008-09 55,736 five years. [300774] Food: Procurement Barbara Follett: The weight of paper recycled by the Department for Communities and Local Government Mr. Roger Williams: To ask the Secretary of State for in the last five years is as follows: Communities and Local Government what estimate he has made of the proportion of (a) lamb, (b) beef, (c) Paper recycling1 (tonnes) chicken, (d) pork, (e) turkey, (f) other meats, (g) 2004-05 Not known vegetables and (h) fruit procured by his Department 2005-06 132 that was produced in the UK in the latest period for 2006-07 127 which figures are available; and if he will make a 2007-08 263 statement. [300188] 2008-09 254 Barbara Follett: A second report on the proportion 1 The data includes cardboard as this is often mixed with paper for recycling of domestically produced food used by Government Departmental Travel Departments and also supplied to hospitals and prisons under contracts negotiated by NHS Supply Ian Stewart: To ask the Secretary of State for Chain and HM Prison Service was published in Communities and Local Government what contracts November 2008, covering the year from 1 April 2007 to his Department has with private hire taxi companies; 31 March 2008. This report and the first one covering and what expenditure his Department has incurred the previous year can be found at: against each such contract in each of the last three http://www.defra.gov.uk/foodfarm/policy/publicsectorfood/ years. [300833] awareness.htm The report gives details of the proportion of individual Barbara Follett: The Department has spent the meat, fruit and vegetable categories purchased. following amounts through formal and informal Although it is too early to show a trend, the report contracts with taxi companies over the last three fiscal indicates that the amount of domestically produced years. food consumed by Government Departments in England is increasing. The proportion of domestically £ produced food procured by Communities has gone up 2006 A1 Taxi Safe 1,333 from 59 per cent. in 2006-07 to 65 per cent. in 2007-08. Balmoral Transport 8,516 We expect to publish a third report at the end of 2009. Services Ltd. Homes and Communities Agency Dial a Cab 15,700 Radio Taxis 5,997 Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for Taxifast 1,210 Communities and Local Government what (a) Total 32,757 shareholdings and (b) subsidiaries the Homes and Communities Agency (HCA) owns; what the purpose of ownership of each stake is; what the HCA’s 2007 A1 Taxi Safe 833 shareholding represents as a percentage of the overall Balmoral Transport 2,755 Services Ltd. shares; and what recent estimate he has made of the Dial a Cab 4,885 monetary value of each stake. [300441] Knight and Day 156 John Healey: A list of the Homes and Communities Taxis Com Agency’s associates and subsidiaries and its Radio Taxis 2,730 proportionate shareholding is disclosed in its Financial Taxifast 202 Statements for 2008-09, as laid in the House (pages 81 Total 11,560 and 82). The main reasons for holding these investments is to 2008 A1 Taxi Safe 144 further the business of the agency in pursuit of its Balmoral Transport 8,417 strategic objectives. Services Ltd. The carrying values of the agency’s investments in Crownhill Taxi 490 the Financial Statements are assessed each year. This Services Ltd. assessment is scrutinised by the National Audit Office Dial a Cab 2,793 as part of their annual audit work. Radio Taxis 59 Total 11,903 Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government how much the Staff will also pay taxi fares themselves in the course Homes and Communities Agency and its predecessor of official business and claim the costs back through spent on (a) Places of Change, (b) the Thames the T&S system, figures from this show the following Gateway and (c) growth funding in each of the last expenditure over the last three years: three years. [300442] 69W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 70W

John Healey: Information on spending on Places of households to avoid repossession and remain in their Change, the Thames Gateway and growth was home by taking a lead role in working with and published in the Homes and Communities Agency’s monitoring the performance of those RSLs delivering Annual Report and Financial Statement for 2008-09, the scheme. and in the financial statements of its predecessor In May 2008, the Government announced a plan to bodies: the Housing Corporation, English Partnerships take advantage of market opportunities to bring and the Department for Communities and Local private sector developer stock into the affordable Government for preceding years, as lodged in the housing sector by earmarking £200 million of funding House Library. through the Housing Corporation (the Homes and Communities Agency’s predecessor) National Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for Affordable Housing programme (NAHP) budget for Communities and Local Government how much the the purchase of homes from house builders. Homes and Communities Agency (HCA) has spent on To help facilitate the scheme, the Corporation set up staff costs related to the HCA Academy. [300443] the National Clearing House to streamline initial assessment of national packages of at least 250 units John Healey: I refer the hon. Member to the Homes from private sector house builders. The Housing and Communities Agency’s 2008-9 Annual Report Corporation’s Investment partners, mainly Registered which includes information about the HCA Academy’s Social Landlords, wishing to buy smaller numbers of staff costs. units from developers could bid for funding directly to A copy of the Annual report and Accounts can be the Corporation in the normal way. found in the Library of the House. They can also be found at the following web link. Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for http://www.homesandcommunities.co.uk/public/documents/ Communities and Local Government what target was annual-report-2009.pdf set for the Homes and Communities Agency in relation to private sector investment in its property and Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for regeneration programme in 2008-09; and what such Communities and Local Government with reference to target has been set for 2009-10. [300595] the answer of 5 November 2009, Official Report, column 1124W, on the Homes and Communities John Healey: I refer the hon. Member to the Agency: consultants, how much the Homes and 2009-2011 Homes and Communities Agency Communities Academy spent on (a) the National and Corporate plan, which is available at: (b) Regional Delivery Structure project, the http://www.homesandcommunities.co.uk/publications Brownfield Skills project, (c) the Endorsement (d) Framework project, the Benchmark and Toolkit Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for (e) project, the Practical Knowledge to Support Communities and Local Government how much the (f) delivery project and the programme staff costs Homes and Communities Agency has spent (a) in project; and how much of each sum was spent on total and (b) on each housing association (i) shared consultancy costs. [300515] ownership product and (ii) try before you buy home scheme in the latest year for which figures are available. John Healey: The HCA Academy’s project and [300602] consultancy spend on the projects listed above are as follows: John Healey: I refer the hon. Member to the reply given to him by my right hon. Friend the Member for £000 Derby South on 21 May 2009, Official Report, column Workstream Total spend Consultancy spend 1540-42W. National and Regional Delivery 30 30 Allocations by housing associations are published on Structure the Homes and Communities Agency website. Details Brownfield Skills 21 20 of historic allocations can be found on the Housing Endorsement Framework 46 46 Corporation website. Benchmark and Tool Kit 113 98 Practical knowledge to support 127 100 delivery Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for Programme staff costs 261 0 Communities and Local Government what the average per household entitlement to the proceeds of future The spend on programme staff costs include staff sales of properties owned by the Homes and salaries, expenses and costs for staff seconded in from Communities Agency is under each HomeBuy scheme. other organisations. [300612]

Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for John Healey: The Homes and Communities Agency Communities and Local Government what role the (HCA) does not own any of the current HomeBuy Homes and Communities Agency has had in the properties, but holds a second charge on HomeBuy delivery of (a) the Mortgage Rescue scheme and (b) Direct and First Time Buyers Initiative properties. No the National Clearing House. [300594] estimate is made as to the average entitlement per household for these as actual entitlement to proceeds John Healey: Since the Mortgage Rescue scheme’s of future sales is dependent on when the properties are inception, the HCA has worked with the Government sold and the price achieved at the point of sale. The to ensure support is available for the most vulnerable HCA and developer/provider of the properties are 71W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 72W entitled to a share of sales proceeds in proportion to the creation of the Homes and Communities Agency, the percentage of equity loan provided while the PFI credits for housing projects have continued to be household is entitled to the remainder. issued by this Department. Housing PFI credits issued in each of the last Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for financial years have been: Communities and Local Government for how much the Homes and Communities Agency’s land at the £ million Gateway site in Harlow was (a) purchased and (b) sold. [300613] 2009-10 (to date) 0 2008-09 137.9 John Healey: The Harlow Gateway housing site was 2007-08 283.4 not purchased by the Homes and Communities Agency, as the freehold was transferred to the agency from a predecessor body. The HCA secured a receipt of Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for £33.5 million for the land. Communities and Local Government how much the Homes and Communities Agency secured in private Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for sector contributions to its property and regeneration Communities and Local Government how much the programme in 2008-09. [300902] Homes and Communities Agency has spent under each budget category in exhibiting a show garden at the John Healey: I refer the hon. Member to the Homes Chelsea Flower Show. [300616] and Communities Agency’s 2008-09 Annual Report and Accounts, which are available at: John Healey: The Homes and Communities Agency http://www.homesandcommunities.co.uk/publications provided £150,000 capital funding under the Places of Change programme towards the ’Key Garden’ at the Chelsea Flower Show 2009. The garden was developed Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for by over 200 homeless people from 25 homelessness Communities and Local Government what target was services and prisons nationwide, in partnership with set for the Homes and Communities Agency in respect the Eden Project. of low cost homes ownership starts in 2008-09; and what target has been set for 2009-10. [300903] Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government what estimate he John Healey: Details of the targets for low cost home has made of the monetary value of the entitlements of ownership starts in 2008-09 are set out in the Housing the Homes and Communities Agency and its Corporation Annual Report and Accounts 2008-09, predecessor to future sale proceeds resulting from the and the target for 2009-10 is set out in the Homes and sale of homes under (a) HomeBuy Direct, (b) Communities Agency Corporate Plan 2009-10— OwnHome, (c) Open Market HomeBuy, (d) 2010-11, copies of which have been placed in the MyChoice HomeBuy, (e) New Build HomeBuy and Library of the House. (f) Social HomeBuy in each of the last three years. [300897] Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government on what dates John Healey: The Homes and Communities Agency the Homes and Communities Agency Rural Housing (HCA) is entitled to a share of sales proceeds when Group has met since 1 December 2008; and if he will homes bought through HomeBuy Direct are sold by place in the Library a copy of the minutes of each the purchaser. The scheme became operational in meeting. [300905] February 2009. No estimate has been made of the monetary value of the HCA’s entitlements to future John Healey: Since 1 December 2008, the Homes sales proceeds as it is dependent on when full or partial and Communities Agency Rural Housing Advisory redemption of the equity loans are made and what the Group have met on 30 January, 13 May and value of the loans are at the point of redemption. 11 September 2009. The minutes of the meetings are Grant invested in OwnHome, MyChoice HomeBuy available on the Homes and Communities website at: (Open Market HomeBuy products), New Build http://www.homesandcommunities.co.uk/the-rural-housing- HomeBuy and Social HomeBuy properties, through advisory-group registered social landlords (who own the properties) is credited to the Recycled Capital Grant Fund (RCGF) for provision of new social lets or other low cost homes Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for when the properties are sold whole or through shared Communities and Local Government how much the ownership terms. Homes and Communities Agency has spent on the Future Communities website; and how many (a) Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for unique visitors and (b) page impressions have been Communities and Local Government how many recorded by the site since its creation. [300907] private finance initiative credits the Homes and Communities Agency and its predecessor allocated in John Healey: The Homes and Communities Agency each of the last three years. [300899] has spent nothing on the Future Communities Website which is run by the Young Foundation. The John Healey: It is convention to record PFI credits in Department does not hold information relating to the financial year in which contracts are signed. Since parts (a) and (b) of this question. 73W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 74W

Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for service agreement targets require action from (i) the Communities and Local Government how many sites Tenant Services Authority and (ii) the Homes and listed as (a) Grade I and (b) Grade II the Homes and Communities Agency. [301471] Communities Agency and its predecessor have redeveloped in each of the last three years; and how John Healey: The work of the Tenant Services many homes have been built on such sites. [300909] Authority (TSA) contributes to the following public service agreements (PSAs): John Healey: The process of listing does not apply to sites. PSA20: Increase long term housing supply and affordability PSA21: Build more cohesive, empowered and active Homes and Communities Agency: Manpower communities PSA23: Make communities safer. Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for The TSA’s work also contributes to three of Communities and Local Government how many staff Communities and Local Government’s (CLG) six the Homes and Communities Agency has had on departmental strategic objectives (DSOs): secondment since its establishment; from which organisations the employees were seconded; and what DSO2: To improve the supply, environmental performance and quality of housing that is more responsive to the needs of [301597] the cost of each secondment has been. individuals, communities and the economy. John Healey: There are approximately 50 secondees DSO3: To build prosperous communities by improving the economic performance of cities, sub-regions and local areas, currently working in the Homes and Communities promoting regeneration and tackling deprivation. Agency (HCA), most of them from Communities and Local Government. The overall cost of HCA posts DSO4: To develop communities that are cohesive, active and filled by secondees rather than direct HCA employees resilient to extremism. since 1 December 2008 is approximately £2.3 million. The Homes and Communities Agency’s corporate Information on the cost of each secondment is not held plan for 2009-10 to 2010-11 explains how it contributes centrally and could be provided only at to the Government’s PSAs and CLG’s DSOs. The disproportionate cost. corporate plan is available via the HCA’s website: Homes and Communities Agency: Marketing http://www.homesandcommunities.co.uk/

Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government how much the (a) Homes and Communities Agency and (b) Tenant BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS Services Authority has spent on signage since each was established. [301470] Bankruptcy: Hampshire

John Healey: I refer the hon. Member to the answer Sandra Gidley: To ask the Minister of State, given to him on 2 April 2009, Official Report, column Department for Business, Innovation and Skills how 1501-02W by my right hon. Friend the Member for many bankruptcies there have been in (a) the Derby South (Margaret Beckett). Since then the ceremonial county of Hampshire, (b) Southampton Homes and Communities Agency has spent an and (c) the Test Valley of individuals in each age additional £34,000 and the TSA an additional £200 on group in (i) 2008 and (ii) 2009 to date. [301150] signage. Tenant Services Authority Ian Lucas: The available information for bankruptcies in Hampshire, Southampton and Test Valley, in 2008 by Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for age group, can be seen in Table 1. Information for 2009 Communities and Local Government which of his is not currently available, as regional insolvency statistics Department’s (a) strategic objectives and (b) public are only compiled on an annual basis.

Table 1: Bankruptcies by age - 20081 Age Group Area Under 25 25-34 35-44 45-54 55-64 65 and Over Unknown

Hampshire 58 329 455 294 148 40 81 Southampton 20 104 116 67 31 12 22 Test Valley 33 198 227 144 81 15 21 1 Where the bankrupt has provided a valid postcode (96.9 per cent. of cases in 2008).

Climate Change Climate Change Conference in Copenhagen in an official capacity. [300884]

Simon Hughes: To ask the Minister of State, Ian Lucas: At present, no Ministers and one official Department for Business, Innovation and Skills how from the Department has been confirmed as attending many (a) Ministers and (b) civil servants from his the United Nations Climate Change Conference in Department will be attending the United Nations Copenhagen in an official capacity. 75W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 76W

Furs: Imports Annette Brooke: To ask the Minister of State, Department for Business, Innovation and Skills what Mr. Breed: To ask the Minister of State, Department estimate he has made of the average time taken to for Business, Innovation and Skills what the value was process applications for finance made to Student in sterling of fur pelts imported into the UK from Finance England for the 2009-10 academic year; and if China in each year since 1999. [300360] he will make a statement. [300918]

Ian Lucas: The data in the following table show the Mr. Lammy: I am informed by the SLC that, for value of imports from China recorded in the Overseas those Student Finance England applications for both Trade Statistics for raw, tanned or dressed furskins new students and those returning to University which (Harmonized System codes 4301 and 4302): had been approved by 1 November 2009, the average number of days from the date the applications were £ million submitted to the date they were approved was 31 days. Lamb and sheep Other Total Annette Brooke: To ask the Minister of State, 1999 0.4 1.6 2.0 Department for Business, Innovation and Skills what 2000 0.7 3.2 3.9 recent representations he has received on the length of 2001 0.4 2.4 2.8 time for which Student Finance England has retained 2002 1.2 1.7 2.9 the passports of applicants for funding; and if he will 2003 1.1 1.2 2.3 make a statement. [300919] 2004 0.8 1.8 2.6 2005 0.5 2.3 2.9 Mr. Lammy: I have received two representations from 2006 1.0 2.6 3.6 applicants of Student Finance England complaining 2007 2.9 1.4 4.3 that passports had not yet been returned. Both were 2008 2.0 1.2 3.2 advised on the reasons for the delay and have now had their passports returned. Insolvency: Fees and Charges Students: Loans Mr. Weir: To ask the Minister of State, Department for Business, Innovation and Skills whether his Mr. Hoyle: To ask the Minister of State, Department Department plans to set a cap on the fees charged by for Business, Innovation and Skills what recent assessment he has made of the merits of increasing the insolvency practitioners. [300679] salary threshold at which people are required to make payments towards their student loans. [301475] Ian Lucas: I have no plans to set a cap on the fees charged by insolvency practitioners, which are properly Mr. Lammy: The repayment threshold is currently a matter for the creditors or the court. £15,000. The threshold is agreed between my Department However, the Office of Fair Trading (OFT) confirmed and the Devolved Administrations. Early this year, the on 12 November that they are to undertake a market decision to raise the threshold from April 2010 by study into the corporate insolvency market which may inflation was cancelled because the relevant RPI rate include analysis of the level of fees charged by insolvency was negative, meaning the threshold would have been practitioners as insolvency office-holders. reduced and borrowers would have had to pay more. The Government believe that it is particularly important Instead the threshold was frozen at £15,000 for a further at this point in the downturn that creditors and employees 12 months. We will be considering the threshold for who lose their jobs through insolvency have confidence April 2011 early in the new year. that the fees charged by insolvency practitioners represent good value for the very important work they do and I Telephone Services look forward with interest to the outcome of the study announced by the Office of Fair Trading. Mark Hunter: To ask the Minister of State, Department for Business, Innovation and Skills what Students: Finance recent estimate Ofcom has made of the average waiting time before speaking to a person when calling Annette Brooke: To ask the Minister of State, telephone numbers with (a) 0844, (b) 0845, (c) 0870 Department for Business, Innovation and Skills what and (d) 0871 prefixes; and if he will make a statement. his most recent estimate is of the number of [300851] applications for finance made to Student Finance England which are awaiting decision; and if he will Mr. Timms: The matter raised is the responsibility of make a statement. [300917] the independent regulator, the Office of Communications (Ofcom), which is accountable to Parliament rather Mr. Lammy: The Student Loans Company has released than Ministers. Accordingly, I have asked the chief figures to show the levels of processing and payment of executive of Ofcom to reply directly to the hon. Member. Student Support in England for the 2009/10 academic Copies of the chief executive’s letter will be placed in year. The information is available on the Student Loans the Libraries of the House. Company website and includes information, under “application status”, on “applications currently being Mark Hunter: To ask the Minister of State, processed”and “further information required from student/ Department for Business, Innovation and Skills what sponsors”. recent estimate Ofcom has made of profit made by 77W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 78W operators of lines with numbers with (a) 0844, (b) Jim Knight [holding answer 23 November 2009]: My 0845, (c) 0870 and (d) 0871 prefixes in each of the last right hon. Friend the Secretary of State visited five years; and if he will make a statement. [300852] St. Marylebone Jobcentre (part of Central London District) on 8 June, Leith Jobcentre (part of Edinburgh, Mr. Timms: The matter raised is the responsibility of Lothian and Borders District) on 1 July, Westminster the independent regulator, the Office of Communications Jobcentre (part of central London District) on 21 October (Ofcom), which is accountable to Parliament rather and Chelmsford Jobcentre (part of Essex District) on than Ministers. Accordingly, I have asked the chief 16 November. executive of Ofcom to reply directly to the hon. Member. Copies of the chief executive’s letter will be placed in the Libraries of the House. NORTHERN IRELAND Unemployment: Young People Departmental Rail Travel

Mr. Clappison: To ask the Minister of State, Norman Baker: To ask the Secretary of State for Department for Business, Innovation and Skills how Northern Ireland on what date he last travelled by train many and what proportion of people aged between 16 in the course of his official duties. [301199] and 24 years were not in education, employment and training in (a) each year since 1992 and (b) the latest Mr. Woodward: 12 November 2009. quarter for which figures are available. [300486]

Kevin Brennan: Table 1 shows the number and percentage ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE 1 of people aged 16 to 24 in England who are not in Carbon Emissions: Buildings employment, education or training in quarter four of each year since 2000. Due to incomplete data, estimates Mr. Lancaster: To ask the Secretary of State for are not available prior to 2000. Energy and Climate Change what financial assistance These estimates are from the Labour Force Survey his Department makes available to low-carbon building and will include pregnant mothers, those caring for projects to help to improve their energy efficiency in children or relatives, people with a disability or suffering (a) Milton Keynes and (b) England. [300711] from ill health, and those waiting for a course or job to start, including those on a gap year. Joan Ruddock: Through Budget 2009, Government 1 Age is based on academic age, which is defined as the age of the made available £25 million for community heating respondent at the preceding 31 August infrastructure in the UK. Of this, £20.96 million was Table 1: Number and percentage of 16 to 24 years-olds not in employment, made available for schemes in England (and is being education or training administered by the Homes and Communities Agency Percentage (of all 16 to 24 on behalf of the Department for Communities and Number years) Local Government). Through this fund we have allocated 2000 629,000 12.3 £1.5 million to provide Milton Keynes with a new 2001 664,000 12.6 biomethane plant which, along with the city’s planned 2002 659,000 12.2 anaerobic digestion plant, will power households with 2003 667,000 12.1 green energy by injecting biomethane gas into the regional 2004 744,000 13.2 gas network. 2005 837,000 14.6 Support for low carbon building projects is also 2006 808,000 13.8 provided through the work of the Research Councils 2007 782,000 13.1 and the Technology Strategy Board, funded by the 2008 857,000 14.2 Department for Business Innovation and Skills. The Technology Strategy Board has a significant programme In the latest quarter available, Q3 2009, there were of work relevant to this area under its Low Impact 1,082,000 (18 per cent.) people aged 16 to 24 not in Buildings Innovation Platform. employment, education and training compared with 973,000 in Quarter 3 of 2008. It must be noted that a In addition, my Department’s policies also provide direct comparison between consecutive quarters cannot significant funding to support the retrofit of energy be made as quarterly NEET estimates from the LFS efficiency measures in existing homes, through programmes display a strong seasonal pattern. such as the Carbon Emissions Reduction Target (£3.2 billion over 2008-11), Warm Front (£950 million over 2008-11), Estimates for quarter three are always considerably and the Community Energy Saving Programme higher than in quarter 4 because of the number of (£350 million over 2009-12). In the Low Carbon Transition young people who are either between courses or who Plan we committed to continuing the CERT programme have recently left education. for at least a further 21 months potentially driving a Estimates for every quarter since 2005 have been further £1.9 billion of investment before the end of produced by the Department for Children Schools and 2012. Families and are available here: NEET quarterly brief Christmas

WORK AND PENSIONS Mr. Roger Williams: To ask the Secretary of State for Jobcentres: Domestic Visits Energy and Climate Change how many Christmas parties his Department plans to host in 2009; what has Mr. Clappison: To ask the Secretary of State for been budgeted for each such reception; what estimate Work and Pensions what jobcentres she has visited he has made of the proportion of (a) lamb, (b) beef, since her appointment. [300300] (c) chicken, (d) pork, (e) turkey, (f) other meats, (g) 79W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 80W vegetables, (h) fruit and (i) alcohol to be served at Joan Ruddock: A second report on the proportion of each such function which is produced in the UK; and if domestically produced food used by Government he will make a statement. [300876] Departments and also supplied to hospitals and prisons under contracts negotiated by NHS Supply Chain and Joan Ruddock: The Department of Energy and Climate HM Prison Service was published in November 2008, Change is not planning to host any Christmas parties in covering the year from 1 April 2007 to 31 March 2008. 2009. This report and the first one covering the previous year Community Energy Savings Programme can be found at: http://www.defra.gov.uk/foodfarm/policy/publicsectorfood/ Martin Horwood: To ask the Secretary of State for awareness.htm Energy and Climate Change how much his The report gives details of the proportion of individual Department plans to spend on the Community Energy meat, fruit and vegetable categories purchased. Savings Programme in (a) 2009-10, (b) 2010-11, (c) DECC was established after the information in this 2011-12, (d) 2012-13 and (e) 2013-14; and what report was collated, therefore the percentage of meat, estimate he has made of the (i) proportion of such fruit and vegetables procured domestically within the expenditure to be incurred in England, (ii) the carbon estate currently occupied by DECC is included within savings to be achieved, (iii) the number of properties the information provided on the attached report under affected and (iv) the number of jobs created from such DEFRA. expenditure in each year. [300477] A third report is expected to be published shortly. Joan Ruddock [holding answer 23 November 2009]: The Community Energy Savings Programme (CESP) is Departmental Pay funded by an obligation on energy suppliers and generators. They are expected to install around £350 million worth John Mason: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy of energy efficiency measures across GB in the CESP and Climate Change what (a) bonuses and (b) obligation period, from 1 September 2009 to December incentives have been paid to (i) consultants and (ii) 2012. DECC does not fund the programme. contractors engaged by his Department in each of the There are around 4,500 eligible CESP areas across last three years. [300639] GB, 3248 are in England. Within this constraint energy companies, working with local authorities and community Joan Ruddock: The information is as follows: groups, are free to choose where they deliver CESP. The (a) Bonuses to consultants or contractors are not paid by the programme is expected to deliver up to 100 projects Department of Energy and Climate Change. Contracts are let for across GB, benefiting c90,000 households and saving a service at the market rate determined by competition. 2.9mtCO over the lifetime of the programme. (b) Incentives are not paid to consultants or contractors. 2 Suppliers can benefit from early payment and shared reduction of Given CESP’s focus on delivering energy efficiency cost. Incentives are used without a cost to the Department when measures to hundreds of households in each particular milestones are included into contracts, allowing early payment to area targeted we expect this to create business and the supplier as they are paid on completion of milestones. This is employment opportunities. For example, the energy an incentive to the supplier to finish the work on schedule. The companies are currently assessing their options for delivering Department also seeks innovative solutions from suppliers wherever CESP including in the first instance recruiting staff possible. In some contracts this may allow a reduction of costs where necessary and reviewing their supply chains to that can be shared between both the Department and the supplier. deliver the significant number of energy efficiency measures Departmental Rail Travel expected under CESP. Departmental Assets Norman Baker: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change on what date he last Dr. Cable: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy travelled by train in the course of his official duties. and Climate Change what assets of his Department are [301197] planned to be sold in each year from 2009-10 to 2013-14; what the (a) description and (b) book value Joan Ruddock: 23 November 2009. of each such asset is; what the expected revenue from each such sale is; and if he will make a statement. Energy: Mobile Homes [300199] Joan Ruddock: There are no current plans to sell any Mr. Oaten: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy of the assets of the Department of Energy and Climate and Climate Change whether his Department has Change in any of the years from 2009-10 to 2013-14. taken steps to help park home residents reduce their (a) carbon dioxide emissions and (b) heating bills. Departmental Food [301082]

Mr. Roger Williams: To ask the Secretary of State for Joan Ruddock: It is difficult to reduce the carbon Energy and Climate Change what estimate he has made emissions and heating bills of park homes due to the of the proportion of (a) lamb, (b) beef, (c) chicken, lack of scope for key energy efficiency measures, such as (d) pork, (e) turkey, (f) other meats, (g) vegetables cavity wall and loft insulation. Where scope does exist, and (h) fruit procured by his Department that was such as through draught-proofing and high-efficiency produced in the UK in the latest period for which lights and appliances, assistance is available to park figures are available; and if he will make a statement. homes residents through schemes such as the Carbon [300178] Emissions Reduction Target and Warm Front. 81W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 82W

Warm Front is currently working in partnership with Carbon Transition Plan, the Government have committed a gas distributor and a local residents association to to extend CERT to the end of 2012 with an even enable 61 residents of Elm Tree caravan park in Hartlepool stronger focus on delivering insulation. to be connected to the mains gas network. This project meant these homes, previously utilising liquid petroleum Renewable Energy gas, coal or forms of electric heating, reduced their likely energy bills and likely carbon consumption. The project considerably reduced the otherwise prohibitive Graham Stringer: To ask the Secretary of State for cost that had prevented each park home individually Energy and Climate Change if he will estimate the connecting to the gas network. amount of black carbon which would be emitted consequent upon achieving biomass targets as set out The Warm Front Scheme has also begun a piloting in his Department’s renewable energy strategy. [300406] exercise of external wall insulation for 100 park home properties. If this trial is successful, then this may be included as a main measure offered through the scheme. Joan Ruddock [holding answer 23 November 2009]: Specific estimates of black carbon emission have not Free expert advice on practical ways to save energy in been made in support of the development of the Renewable the home is also available through the ACT ON CO2 Energy Strategy. advice line. The emissions of black carbon for each unit of heat Housing: Insulation delivered are likely to decrease in future as a result of measures announced in the Government’s Renewable Mr. Jenkins: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy Energy Strategy. Efficient modern biomass appliances and Climate Change what estimate he has made of the have advanced combustion control systems. When number of homes which would benefit from insulation. maintained adequately and fuelled correctly, the particles [300588] emitted under normal operating conditions are primarily composed of the inorganic salts naturally present in the Joan Ruddock: Almost all homes can benefit from wood, not carbonaceous material. further insulation, whether this is through taking relatively simple actions such as topping up levels of loft insulation Mrs. Curtis-Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State and filling un-insulated cavity wall, or though more for Energy and Climate Change how much has been difficult or expensive steps such as insulating floors, spent on the renewable energy sector in each of the last installing high efficiency glazing or fitting solid wall five years; what the purpose is of the £18 million insulation. additional funding for the UK clean energy sector We have made good progress insulating lofts and available via the Carbon Trust; and how many green cavity walls with five million homes insulated between start-up renewable energy companies (a) have had and 2002 and 2008 and a commitment to insulate a further (b) will receive such funding from the Carbon Trust. six million homes by 2011. The Heat and Energy Saving [300499] Strategy (HESS) consultation published in February sets out our ambitions to insulate all of the remaining Joan Ruddock: According to recent research published lofts and cavities where practical by 2015. The HESS by the Carbon Trust building on research by New also explains the approaches we are considering to Energy Finance, total UK venture capital clean energy1 make it easier for households to take on more difficult investment (including renewables) between 2003 and or expensive forms of insulation and thus gain the 2008 was: benefits of reduced energy bills and a warmer home. 1 We do not hold independent data for overall renewable technology investment separate from clean energy. Mr. Jenkins: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change what estimate he has made of the ¤ million number of domestic dwellings to have been insulated in 2003 131 each year since 1997. [300589] 2004 123 Joan Ruddock: For the period between 1997 and 2001 2005 182 on average around 250,000 homes were insulated per 2006 167 year (loft and cavity wall insulation). 2007 269 From 2002, with the introduction of the Energy 2008 83 Efficiency Commitment (EEC) figures rose. For the The purpose of the up to £18 million additional first period—EEC1 which ran from April 2002 to March venture capital investment available via the Carbon 2005 around 1.9 million homes were insulated (roof, Trust is to meet the current market failure in the provision cavity and solid wall insulation). For EEC2, which run of private sector venture capital investment for early until April 2008, around 3.3 million homes were insulated. stage low carbon companies. In 2008 my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister made the commitment to insulate a further six million Since the Carbon Trust was set up, it has provided homes by 2011 and the Government are on track to funding to 17 green start-up energy companies investing deliver this target. In April 2008, the Carbon Emission over £13.5m. This funding has also helped these businesses Reduction Target (CERT) replaced EEC with a new to leverage over £117 million of private sector investment. more ambitious target. In the year following April 2008 No investments have yet been made from the £18 million around 1.5 million homes were insulated by CERT and additional funding but four companies are in due diligence other programmes. In addition, as set out in the Low and a further 10 are under active consideration. 83W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 84W

Warm Homes and Energy Conservation Act 2000 from his Department will be attending the United Nations Climate Change Conference in Copenhagen in Mr. Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy an official capacity. [300890] and Climate Change what progress the Government have made on meeting the targets stipulated in the Warm Homes and Energy Conservation Act 2000 Mr. Wills: There are no Ministers or civil servants during (a) 2008 and (b) 2009; and if he will make a from the Ministry of Justice who will be attending the statement. [300809] United Nations climate change conference in Copenhagen in an official capacity. Mr. Kidney: The Warm Homes and Energy Conservation Act 2000 required the publication of a strategy to include Drugs: Crime “a target date for achieving the objective of ensuring that as far as reasonably practicable persons in England or Wales do not live in fuel poverty.” John Penrose: To ask the Secretary of State for Annual reports on progress are published and copies Justice how many people have been found guilty of are placed in the House Library. Web links to the 2008 offences of drug (a) possession and (b) dealing in and 2009 Annual Progress reports are at: Avon and Somerset in each year since 1997. [300748] http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cms/what_we_do/ consumers/fuel_poverty/strategy/annual_report/ annual_report.aspx Claire Ward: Information showing the number of persons found guilty at all courts for drug possession and dealing in the Avon and Somerset police force area JUSTICE from 1997 to 2007 (latest available) is shown in the Climate Change following table. Simon Hughes: To ask the Secretary of State for Data for 2008 are planned for publication on 28 January Justice how many (a) Ministers and (b) civil servants 2010.

Number of persons found guilty at all courts for the possession and dealing of drugs in the Avon and Somerset police force area, 1997 to 20071, 2 Offence 1997 1998 1999 2000 2001 2002 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007

Having possession of a 381 422 541 581 523 502 504 420 375 422 574 controlled drug Having possession of a 75 99 86 89 101 110 124 115 116 120 150 controlled drug with intent to supply Supplying or offering to 83 85 9 2 83 38 45 74 64 58 36 58 supply a controlled drug 1 The statistics relate to persons for whom these offences were the principal offences for which they were dealt with. When a defendant has been found guilty of two or more offences the principal offence is the offence for which the heaviest penalty is imposed. Where the same disposal is imposed for two or more offences, the offence selected is the offence for which the statutory maximum penalty is the most severe. 2 Every effort is made to ensure that the figures presented are accurate and complete. However, it is important to note that these data have been extractedfrom large administrative data systems generated by the courts and police forces. As a consequence, care should be taken to ensure data collection processes and their inevitable limitations are taken into account when those data are used.

European Convention on Human Rights Offenders: Drugs and Mentally Ill

Mrs. Curtis-Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State Alan Duncan: To ask the Secretary of State for for Justice whether there has been a proportionate Justice (1) what recent estimate he has made of the (a) alleviation or suspension of a specific right provided number and (b) proportion of (i) offences and (ii) for in the European Convention on Human Rights reoffences which are committed each year by those since the Convention was ratified by the Government. with substance misuse problems; [300804] [300383] (2) what recent estimate he has made of the (a) number and (b) proportion of (i) offences and (ii) Mr. Wills: The majority of the rights protected by the reoffences which are committed each year by those European Convention on Human Rights are not absolute. with mental health problems. [300796] Most rights are qualified, which means that interference with a right is permitted where that is in accordance Claire Ward: The requested information is not available. with the law, proportionate to a certain specified aim, The Ministry of Justice’s extract of data from the police and/or necessary to protect the rights and freedoms of national computer can provide information on the previous others. For example, it is sometimes necessary to balance convictions and reoffences of offenders. However, the the right of the media to freedom of expression with the database does not identify offenders with substance right of individuals to respect for their private life. misuse problems or those with mental health problems. Many areas of Government policy involve making these Office for Criminal Justice Reform: Finance difficult decisions on a daily basis and it is not possible to list them exhaustively. It is also possible for states Chris Huhne: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice party to make reservations to some rights or to derogate what the budget of the Office for Criminal Justice from some articles of the convention in times of emergency. Reform was in each year since it was created; and what However, the UK currently has no derogations to the its budget is expected to be in each of the next five convention. years. [301478] 85W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 86W

Claire Ward: The annual budget for the Office for employment; access to suitable accommodation; public Criminal Justice Reform (OCJR) for the last five years and victim confidence and reducing numbers in custody. was provided in an answer to the hon. Member for The most recent YJB quarterly assessment of YOT Harborough (Mr. Garnier) on 30 March 2009, Official performance was completed in July. The results for the Report, columns 999 and 1000W. 139 English YOTs show that 79 per cent. of YOTs were OCJR’s budget for 2009-10 is £129.1 million resource classified as either good or outstanding. and £20.5 million capital. The budget for 2010-11 has Young People: Finance yet to be finalised and budgets from 2011-12 will be determined in the next spending review. Tim Loughton: To ask the Secretary of State for Prisoners Release Justice how much funding has been received by each youth offending team in each of the last three years; how much such funding each such team will receive in Mr. Burns: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice if the next three years; and what formula is used to he will publish the results of his Department’s calculate allocations to such teams. [301045] investigation into the release of a prisoner on remand by mistake from HM Prison Chelmsford on 16 October Maria Eagle: Youth offending teams (YOTs) receive 2009. [301132] funding from a number of sources. The table shows financial contributions made to YOTs via the Youth Maria Eagle: I understand that the hon. Member is Justice Board and other Government sources (including referring to the release of a prisoner on 16 November police, probation, social services and via local authorities) 2009. by financial year: It is not Ministry of Justice policy for the contents of The Youth Justice Board funding is divided between investigations to be made public however, I will write to Wales and England in the ratio 5 to 85. The YJB grant the hon. Member with a summary of the findings, when funding for England is allocated to individual YOTs they are received. according to the prescribed formula, in which 40 per Young People: Crime Prevention cent. weighting is given to the local 10-17 population, 10 per cent. to the geographical size of the area, and 50 per cent. in aggregate to ‘Deprivation Indices’—Local Tim Loughton: To ask the Secretary of State for Concentration, Extent (the proportion of a YOT’s Justice which youth offending teams were assessed as population living in the wards which rank within the requiring significant improvement at their most recent most deprived 10 per cent. of wards in the country), inspections. [301044] income deprivement, employment deprivement, average of ward ranks, average of ward scores. Maria Eagle: This year HMI Probation introduced a These indices are compiled by Communities and new core case inspection regime for youth offending Local Government and full details are available on their teams (YOTs) looking at three specific areas of practice— website at; safeguarding, risk of harm to others and risk of reoffending. To date only the inspection reports of North West http://www.communities.gov.uk/documents/communities/ pdr7131206.pdf YOTs have been published. Of the 21 YOTs in the North West 12 were assessed as requiring significant The YJB grant funding for YOTs in Wales is allocated improvement in at least one area of practice. Three on the same basis with slight variations on the main YOTs were assessed as requiring substantial improvement formula. in a single area of the inspected work: Cumbria, Manchester Additional Government funds, as reported to the and Stockport. The following were assessed as requiring YJB by YOTs, are allocated at individual local area substantial improvement in two or more of the areas level and the YJB has no information on how these inspected: Bolton, Bury, Lancashire, Liverpool, Rochdale, funds are allocated Salford, Tameside and Wirral. In addition Sefton YOT The full set of data returns from youth offending was assessed as requiring drastic improvement in two of teams are yet to be submitted for 2009-10, therefore the three areas and substantial improvement in the figures cannot be made available at this time. Final other. allocations for 2010-11 and 2011-12 will be allocated at The assessment of YOT performance does not rest the beginning of the respective financial year. Allocations soley with the HMI Probation core case inspection. It will use the current formula outlined above. has been designed to include two distinct but The data contained in this answer are supplied by the complementary processes which together give a complete YJB and comprise data supplied from youth offending picture of the performance of a YOT Partnership. The teams in England and Wales via monthly or quarterly HMIP Inspection regime looks in depth at practice returns to the YJB. As with any large scale recording whilst the YJB YOT assessment is at a strategic level system, the data are subject to possible errors with data and looks additionally at: reducing re-offending; first entry and processing and may be subject to change over time entrants; engagement in education, training and time.

£ Total YJB Additional government funding YOT 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09 2006-071 2007-081 2008-09

Barking and 1,864,512 2,034,248 2,416,377 629,995 711,731 728,377 1,234,517 1,322,517 1,688,000 Dagenham 87W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 88W

£ Total YJB Additional government funding YOT 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09 2006-071 2007-081 2008-09

Barnet 902,614 999,654 1,072,586 310,030 351,198 451,516 592,584 648,456 621,070 Barnsley 1,478,699 1,574,873 1,932,637 506,854 573,943 787,447 971,845 1,000,930 1,145,190 Bath and North 639,714 662,964 821,763 196,013 234,639 278,827 443,701 428,325 542,936 East Somerset Bedfordshire 2,058,635 2,259,193 2,293,606 531,546 566,479 607,350 1,527,089 1,692,714 1,686,256 Bexley 887,371 921,885 992,142 246,321 286,493 314,607 641,050 635,392 677,535 Birmingham 9,224,489 9,485,873 10,034,391 3,131,725 3,281,517 3,755,001 6,092,764 6,204,356 6,279,390 Blackburn with 1,859,352 1,630,567 1,976,656 610,331 634,407 835,571 1,249,021 996,160 1,141,085 Darwen Blackpool 1,427,385 1,429,786 1,565,250 484,812 543,875 623,187 942,573 885,910 942,063 Blaenau, Gwent 1,916,543 2,040,336 2,349,211 887,336 982,156 1,083,093 1,029,207 1,058,180 1,266,118 and Caerphilly Bolton 1,461,625 1,482,333 1,575,845 646,419 723,260 816,360 815,206 759,073 759,485 Bournemouth 1,251,397 1,181,506 1,244,565 470,265 361,444 410,463 781,132 820,062 834,102 and Poole Bracknell Forest 587,378 645,199 682,184 129,120 150,659 166,925 458,258 494,540 515,259 Bradford 3,442,491 3,440,127 3,991,440 1,526,268 1,659,138 1,915,964 1,916,223 1,780,989 2,075,476 Brent 1,531,258 1,920,952 1,858,132 496,174 818,674 870,683 1,035,084 1,102,278 987,449 Bridgend 781,237 824,548 906,124 205,659 215,963 220,738 575,578 608,585 685,386 Brighton and 1,092,925 1,258,661 1,372,910 238,768 291,463 412,198 854,157 967,198 960,712 Hove Bristol 2,970,490 3,110,839 3,314,888 1,029,955 1,063,683 1,228,533 1,940,535 2,047,156 2,086,355 Bromley 822,688 1,189,830 1,563,759 277,409 318,683 358,965 545,279 871,147 1,204,794 Buckinghamshire 1,854,962 1,896,197 2,107,616 672,723 668,513 728,605 1,182,239 1,227,684 1,379,011 Bury 1,784,640 1,913,738 1,381,533 784,227 835,510 409,457 1,000,413 1,078,228 972,076 Calderdale 1,794,751 1,777,023 1,879,800 808,430 699,650 858,780 986,321 1,077,373 1,021,020 Cambridgeshire 1,832,854 1,951,115 1,933,562 893,108 902,035 1,005,475 939,746 1,049,080 928,087 Camden 2,536,399 2,754,176 2,602,427 1,090,385 1,181,090 1,271,882 1,446,014 1,573,086 1,330,545 Cardiff 2,025,414 2,461,353 2,814,433 568,064 955,480 1,062,583 1,457,350 1,505,873 1,751,850 Carmarthenshire 1,151,965 1,124,717 1,382,055 450,247 385,855 395,108 701,718 738,862 986,947 Ceredigion 553,132 599,176 747,317 201,279 206,249 199,464 351,853 392,927 547,853 Cheshire 2,254,651 2,458,230 2,568,442 644,472 753,359 823,498 1,610,179 1,704,871 1,744,944 Conwy and 1,129,085 1,028,792 1,076,726 412,148 330,792 390,726 716,937 698,000 686,000 Denbighshire Cornwall 1,870,500 2,021,943 2,145,114 759,619 875,383 974,145 1,110,881 1,146,560 1,170,969 Coventry 2,658,474 2,583,743 2,847,999 866,519 925,735 1,009,415 1,791,955 1,658,008 1,838,584 Croydon 2,786,038 2,756,545 2,945,833 1,165,538 1,204,885 1,299,333 1,620,500 1,551,660 1,646,500 Cumbria 2,387,172 2,580,113 2,761,464 1,028,223 1,192,342 1,254,999 1,358,949 1,387,771 1,506,465 Darlington 937,562 974,988 1,023,681 275,075 282,170 308,948 662,487 692,818 714,733 Derby 2,089,814 2,187,210 2,248,864 763,335 818,320 910,120 1,326,479 1,368,890 1,338,744 Derbyshire 2,408,224 2,646,724 3,070,595 768,234 883,962 981,634 1,639,990 1,762,762 2,088,961 Devon 2,684,288 3,121,356 3,183,190 1,000,688 1,170,746 1,287,421 1,683,600 1,950,610 1,895,769 Doncaster 2,076,931 2,183,626 2,507,461 748,663 814,861 1,128,473 1,328,268 1,368,765 1,378,988 Dorset 1,378,137 1,570,619 1,690,021 545,802 673,087 744,280 832,335 897,532 945,741 Dudley 2,125,460 2,323,492 2,452,252 1,117,686 1,189,645 1,241,248 1,007,774 1,133,647 1,211,004 Durham 3,831,998 3,980,139 4,156,517 1,015,571 1,120,518 1,190,983 2,816,427 2,859,621 2,965,534 Ealing 2,257,307 1,981,743 1,863,359 1,339,527 685,349 762,121 917,780 1,296,394 1,101,238 East Riding of 1,090,861 1,212,664 1,297,022 488,133 562,957 613,135 602,728 649,707 683,887 Yorkshire East Sussex 1,820,513 2,099,540 2,263,041 663,772 773,899 840,160 1,156,741 1,325,641 1,422,881 Enfield 1,544,651 2,015,506 1,923,573 491,155 405,944 448,509 1,053,496 1,609,562 1,475,064 Essex 4,022,627 4,156,126 4,343,840 1,426,627 1,633,126 1,772,840 2,596,000 2,523,000 2,571,000 Flintshire 847,579 1,124,875 1,354,398 371,203 594,180 580,144 476,376 530,695 774,254 Gateshead 1,162,906 1,225,557 2,076,698 374,906 434,557 511,702 786,000 791,000 1,564,996 Gloucestershire 3,004,674 3,135,402 3,477,297 754,581 840,772 884,053 2,250,093 2,294,630 2,593,244 Greenwich 1,817,550 2,310,485 1,482,509 1,181,438 1,340,259 595,046 636,112 970,226 887,463 Gwynedd Mon 968,418 1,188,972 1,249,465 376,588 510,692 498,215 591,830 678,280 751,250 Hackney 3,298,746 3,756,702 3,352,122 872,902 788,593 864,389 2,425,844 2,968,109 2,487,733 Halton and 1,424,752 1,867,972 1,837,589 704,784 818,418 867,832 719,968 1,049,554 969,757 Warrington Hammersmith 1,636,021 1,757,262 1,671,817 769,913 814,523 846,322 866,108 942,739 825,495 and Fulham Haringey 2,566,076 3,002,639 2,457,459 1,140,816 1,165,708 1,250,079 1,425,260 1,836,931 1,207,380 89W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 90W

£ Total YJB Additional government funding YOT 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09 2006-071 2007-081 2008-09

Harrow 910,913 1,193,041 1,361,831 230,423 525,825 632,381 680,490 667,216 729,450 Hartlepool 1,292,825 1,405,210 1,474,033 450,991 496,992 543,540 841,834 908,218 930,493 Havering 1,010,340 1,009,450 1,116,003 355,841 395,808 425,904 654,499 613,642 690,099 Hertfordshire 3,792,402 3,936,853 4,158,573 1,075,804 1,149,583 1,240,253 2,716,598 2,787,270 2,918,320 Hillingdon 1,347,589 1,428,823 1,504,057 278,911 306,415 351,275 1,068,678 1,122,408 1,152,782 Hounslow 1,279,268 1,530,175 1,728,616 350,238 624,434 773,491 929,030 905,741 955,125 Islington 1,498,506 1,644,247 1,708,383 568,671 650,522 799,638 929,835 993,725 908,745 Kensington and 1,351,910 1,567,696 1,508,106 536,899 578,616 488,789 815,011 989,080 1,019,317 Chelsea Kent 6,846,151 7,679,376 7,669,959 1,798,427 1,995,435 2,136,752 5,047,724 5,683,941 5,533,207 Kingston-upon- 2,206,528 2,390,299 2,501,233 969,910 1,024,888 1,038,733 1,236,618 1,365,411 1,462,500 Hull Kingston-upon- 815,984 859,376 993,374 152,484 172,676 199,574 663,500 686,700 793,800 Thames Kirklees 2,694,618 2,977,398 3,120,354 605,647 919,443 1,139,070 2,088,971 2,057,955 1,981,284 Knowsley 2,061,081 1,765,141 1,976,253 833,232 620,267 693,427 1,227,849 1,144,874 1,282,826 Lambeth 2,943,593 2,822,857 3,207,021 776,775 932,812 1,231,779 2,166,818 1,890,045 1,975,242 Lancashire 5,172,766 5,522,706 5,675,691 1,935,266 2,212,406 2,281,082 3,237,500 3,310,300 3,394,609 Leeds 6,362,314 6,754,804 7,085,133 2,436,454 2,517,151 2,459,318 3,925,860 4,237,653 4,625,815 Leicester City 3,600,679 3,782,109 3,869,922 1,151,779 1,288,269 1,433,022 2,448,900 2,493,840 2,436,900 Leicestershire 2,229,654 2,579,780 2,705,272 633,234 676,600 730,197 1,596,420 1,903,180 1,975,075 Lewisham 1,992,119 2,293,805 3,376,436 549,536 624,011 1,660,429 1,442,583 1,669,794 1,716,007 Lincolnshire 3,010,301 3,365,813 3,289,713 1,098,043 1,215,488 1,317,254 1,912,258 2,150,325 1,972,459 Liverpool 4,742,310 5,145,453 5,404,968 1,975,590 2,133,434 2,280,400 2,766,720 3,012,019 3,124,568 Luton 1,931,358 1,969,154 1,993,004 714,267 645,489 729,971 1,217,091 1,323,665 1,263,033 Manchester 5,115,499 4,920,985 5,210,028 2,268,438 2,115,102 2,316,776 2,847,061 2,805,883 2,893,252 Medway 1,006,352 1,082,428 1,175,072 310,943 385,260 475,387 695,409 697,168 699,685 Merthyr Tydfil 685,324 679,962 638,200 259,503 241,258 225,242 425,821 438,704 412,958 Merton 720,794 792,337 818,509 196,592 230,135 251,058 524,202 562,202 567,451 Milton Keynes 1,423,692 1,361,331 1,487,737 428,637 445,193 480,960 995,055 916,138 1,006,777 Monmouthshire 1,193,948 1,261,781 1,296,695 262,025 293,522 287,326 931,923 968,259 1,009,369 and Torfaen Neath Port 2,344,121 1,568,532 1,718,232 1,623,536 798,187 819,781 720,585 770,345 898,451 Talbot Newcastle-upon- 2,414,803 2,717,704 3,079,940 1,287,378 1,390,334 1,529,091 1,127,425 1,327,370 1,550,849 Tyne Newham1 3,028,204 4,959,721 3,482,334 1,557,139 1,573,546 1,587,134 1,471,065 3,386,175 1,895,200 Newport 1,028,332 1,148,817 1,314,650 315,266 375,701 366,711 713,066 773,116 947,939 Norfolk 3,668,154 4,096,742 3,516,482 1,050,199 1,212,056 1,320,925 2,617,955 2,884,686 2,195,557 North East 1,013,614 1,341,174 1,644,874 482,748 539,108 660,299 530,866 802,066 984,575 Lincolnshire North 1,293,440 1,318,798 1,250,116 733,073 713,815 644,116 560,367 604,983 606,000 Lincolnshire North Somerset 657,176 727,793 1,082,568 233,226 276,789 332,184 423,950 451,004 750,384 North Tyneside 1,238,810 1,181,188 1,158,006 461,139 371,178 438,438 777,671 810,010 719,568 North Yorkshire 2,428,033 2,809,317 3,213,336 1,324,269 1,407,174 1,537,104 1,103,764 1,402,143 1,676,232 Northamptonshire 3,446,717 3,605,073 3,796,501 960,777 971,083 1,000,631 2,485,940 2,633,990 2,795,870 Northumberland 1,914,385 2,088,491 2,199,627 598,608 678,246 767,972 1,315,777 1,410,245 1,431,655 Nottingham 3,027,011 3,173,817 3,503,957 1,354,709 1,437,330 1,564,137 1,672,302 1,736,487 1,939,820 Nottinghamshire 3,955,855 4,179,634 4,243,213 1,522,157 1,688,264 1,791,385 2,433,698 2,491,370 2,451,828 Oldham 2,567,948 1,896,623 2,015,584 1,453,898 843,945 943,681 1,114,050 1,052,678 1,071,903 Oxfordshire 3,062,703 2,830,607 3,071,403 858,275 923,582 1,018,463 2,204,428 1,907,025 2,052,940 Pembrokeshire 718,615 769,331 1,000,973 272,194 299,551 313,137 446,421 469,780 687,836 Peterborough 1,838,465 2,013,689 2,071,305 769,595 834,014 946,236 1,068,870 1,179,675 1,125,069 Plymouth 1,290,567 1,332,249 1,406,106 556,383 555,774 608,968 734,184 776,475 797,138 Powys 978,336 918,970 1,152,847 344,380 329,325 379,367 633,956 589,645 773,480 Reading2 1,776,264 1,439,227 1,586,468 871,258 815,742 828,807 905,006 623,485 757,661 Redbridge 2,127,060 2,084,378 2,226,718 435,485 512,079 583,189 1,691,575 1,572,299 1,643,529 Rhondda Cynon 2,015,198 2,399,044 2,434,570 471,463 843,873 864,271 1,543,735 1,555,171 1,570,299 Taff Richmond- 607,680 677,156 985,079 150,680 175,656 192,439 457,000 501,500 792,640 upon-Thames Rochdale 1,556,568 2,109,371 2,363,578 603,568 883,371 986,352 953,000 1,226,000 1,377,226 91W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 92W

£ Total YJB Additional government funding YOT 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09 2006-071 2007-081 2008-09

Rotherham 2,774,829 2,921,986 2,128,479 1,771,829 1,886,986 1,025,323 1,003,000 1,035,000 1,103,156 Salford 1,284,647 1,440,538 1,564,546 634,332 702,803 804,544 650,315 737,735 760,002 Sandwell 1,872,778 2,016,566 2,241,746 620,271 692,979 809,693 1,252,507 1,323,587 1,432,053 Sefton 1,770,920 1,859,297 2,219,476 404,020 585,397 659,976 1,366,900 1,273,900 1,559,500 Sheffield 2,826,712 3,008,846 3,705,487 826,712 913,846 1,610,487 2,000,000 2,095,000 2,095,000 Shropshire, 1,737,111 1,836,798 1,960,473 607,301 665,478 768,783 1,129,810 1,171,320 1,191,690 Telford and Wrekin Slough 1,016,149 1,074,369 1,179,948 325,424 362,366 431,427 690,725 712,003 748,521 Solihull 1,066,229 1,111,457 1,269,713 325,687 369,356 474,791 740,542 742,101 794,922 Somerset 2,565,106 2,677,890 2,674,683 990,646 1,054,800 1,114,859 1,574,460 1,623,090 1,559,824 South 827,847 897,256 937,148 288,847 334,256 391,918 539,000 563,000 545,230 Gloucestershire1 South Tees 3,459,515 3,241,109 3,037,495 1,993,936 2,038,267 2,120,401 1,465,579 1,202,842 917,094 South Tyneside 1,793,238 1,626,431 1,678,341 529,197 412,259 484,075 1,264,041 1,214,172 1,194,266 Southend-on- 695,799 842,347 946,923 253,149 387,806 418,059 442,650 454,541 528,864 Sea Southwark 3,373,859 3,599,941 4,083,933 738,694 747,097 915,759 2,635,165 2,852,844 3,168,174 St. Helens 1,200,059 1,313,869 1,380,941 519,878 533,816 587,439 680,181 780,053 793,502 Staffordshire 4,592,052 4,594,322 4,822,642 2,209,322 2,114,992 2,317,942 2,382,730 2,479,330 2,504,700 Stockport 1,406,960 1,633,803 1,735,856 318,571 576,733 657,828 1,088,389 1,057,070 1,078,028 Stockton-on- 1,151,909 1,259,183 1,348,972 472,163 537,837 567,118 679,746 721,346 781,854 Tees Stoke-on-Trent 2,328,801 2,445,423 2,535,059 796,107 825,337 870,677 1,532,694 1,620,086 1,664,382 Suffolk 3,286,798 3,546,540 3,573,334 1,067,798 1,154,189 1,236,939 2,219,000 2,392,351 2,336,395 Sunderland 3,596,790 4,067,531 4,108,128 1,651,268 1,727,424 1,677,651 1,945,522 2,340,107 2,430,477 Surrey 2,743,749 2,896,715 2,983,696 1,038,927 1,073,381 1,163,820 1,704,822 1,823,334 1,819,876 Sutton 787,454 925,416 807,574 200,873 227,497 261,866 586,581 697,919 545,708 Swansea 1,760,759 2,064,050 2,327,065 472,459 686,476 701,448 1,288,300 1,377,574 1,625,617 Swindon 892,880 969,585 1,069,756 253,432 309,551 393,243 639,448 660,034 676,513 Tameside 1,346,445 1,490,302 1,635,014 742,709 836,064 930,535 603,736 654,238 704,479 Thurrock 1,061,063 1,042,422 1,131,938 445,808 391,949 424,572 615,255 650,473 707,366 Torbay 845,478 853,693 896,815 276,742 287,201 309,622 568,736 566,492 587,193 Tower Hamlets 1,741,447 1,864,442 1,983,377 656,388 746,831 863,940 1,085,059 1,117,611 1,119,437 and City of London Trafford 2,340,245 2,512,420 2,869,739 1,362,229 1,613,685 1,937,037 978,016 898,735 932,702 Vale of 1,022,278 991,459 994,364 190,195 198,429 192,508 832,083 793,030 801,856 Glamorgan Wakefield 1,796,211 1,981,690 2,159,545 797,973 868,093 1,016,503 998,238 1,113,597 1,143,042 Walsall 1,621,932 1,722,936 2,099,155 402,721 464,327 514,349 1,219,211 1,258,609 1,584,806 Waltham Forest 1,557,007 2,026,516 958,040 701,632 779,941 871,224 855,375 1,246,575 86,816 Wandsworth 2,464,030 2,217,787 2,028,546 1,087,556 907,674 789,616 1,376,474 1,310,113 1,238,930 Warwickshire 2,290,645 2,271,891 2,469,646 633,776 727,644 791,950 1,657,069 1,544,247 1,677,696 Wessex 7,606,998 7,563,178 8,381,509 2,223,941 2,419,490 2,812,339 5,383,057 5,143,688 5,569,170 West Berkshire 760,190 881,133 963,841 170,982 198,133 224,335 589,208 683,000 739,506 West Sussex 2,390,344 2,368,313 1,992,035 826,068 897,291 968,706 1,564,276 1,471,022 1,023,329 Westminster 1,746,831 1,825,591 2,306,351 414,981 493,741 631,051 1,331,850 1,331,850 1,675,300 Wigan 1,793,352 1,946,132 2,132,530 438,555 508,675 618,055 1,354,797 1,437,457 1,514,475 Wiltshire 1,505,228 1,620,205 1,691,328 623,303 712,461 784,512 881,925 907,744 906,816 Windsor and 722,164 668,857 684,847 143,787 167,292 189,892 578,377 501,565 494,955 Maidenhead Wirral 2,267,395 2,366,442 2,643,605 799,123 873,412 934,572 1,468,272 1,493,030 1,709,033 Wokingham1 — 378,822 558,287 — 141,372 165,549 — 237,450 392,738 Wolverhampton 2,433,318 2,873,856 3,028,619 605,198 731,466 871,412 1,628,120 2,142,390 2,157,207 Worcestershire 3,022,248 3,194,828 3,339,657 1,159,296 1,286,592 1,388,272 1,862,952 1,908,236 1,951,385 and Herefordshire Wrexham 1,193,755 1,126,659 1,511,879 457,357 257,190 260,920 736,398 869,469 1,250,959 York 714,175 835,777 874,664 223,208 256,624 275,134 490,967 579,153 599,530 Total 322,108,739 343,430,286 361,370,945 118,481,713 126,762,030 138,557,446 203,627,026 216,668,256 222,813,499 ’ Totals indicated differ from those published in the Youth Justice Annual Workload Data for 2006-07 and 2007-08, due to subsequent resubmissions by South Gloucestershire and Newham respectively. 2 Reading and Wokingham split into Reading YOT and Wokingham YOT from April 2007. 93W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 94W

CHILDREN, SCHOOLS AND FAMILIES The Building Schools for the Future standard contract documentation includes a requirement to create an access document, which records all actions taken to ensure access and Academies inclusion are appropriate. In addition, the Department and Partnerships for Paul Holmes: To ask the Secretary of State for Schools have regular contact with a variety of disability Children, Schools and Families how many National groups over design matters. For example, a number of Challenge schools are academy schools. [301250] organisations—including the Council for Disabled Children, the Royal National Institute for the Blind (RNIB) and Mr. Coaker: Based on the most recently available the National Deaf Children’s Society (NDCS)—advised GCSE results (2008), there are 32 academies below the the Department on its publication Building Bulletin National Challenge benchmark of at least 30 per cent. 102: ’Designing for Disabled Children and Children of KS4 pupils achieving five A*-C grade GCSEs including with Special Educational Needs’, which is the main English and maths. An updated figure will be available reference guide for designing inclusive mainstream and in January 2010 when the validated 2009 GCSE results special schools in Building Schools for the Future. are published. More recently DCSF ministers and officials have held extensive discussions with the NDCS about acoustics Building Schools for the Future Programme in Building Schools for the Future projects. The Department and Partnerships for Schools encourage Mr. Marsden: To ask the Secretary of State for local authorities and designers to involve all children— Children, Schools and Families (1) if he will assess the including those with disabilities or special educational merits of using independent disability experts to review needs—and their parents in the design briefing process. and monitor current and future Building Schools for The Design Quality Indicator (DQI) for Schools, which the Future new build proposals; [301080] helps staff children, and parents to establish what they (2) what discussions he has had with national want in their new building, is mandatory for all Building disability groups on their input to school design and Schools for the Future projects over £1 million. The access planning under the Building Schools for the resulting information has to be submitted to the Minimum Future programme; [301093] Design Standard panel to inform their decision on whether the design is suitable and passes the threshold. (3) what involvement there has been for parents of Partnerships for Schools also use the DQI information children with disabilities or special educational needs in to inform Building Schools for the Future benchmarking, reviewing the criteria for school new builds under the and in turn to improve the design brief template that Building Schools for the Future programme; [301094] forms part of the Building Schools for the Future (4) what his policy is on involving (a) parents, (b) standard documentation. For more information on the children and (c) disability groups in building design DQI for Schools process, see: criteria for schools which admit children with www.dqi.org.uk disabilities and special educational needs; and if he will In addition, Partnerships for Schools encourages all make a statement; [301095] students involved in Building Schools for the Future to (5) what discussions he has had with Partnerships for take part in the Sorrell Foundation’s ’joinedupdesign’ Schools about the effectiveness of his Department’s sessions where they create a Pupils’ Brief to be fed into guidance for adaptations for children with disabilities the schools design brief. For more information on and special educational needs in implementation of the joinedupdesign, see: Building Schools for the Future programme; [301096] www.thesorrellfoundation.com (6) how many school new build design proposals The Department and Partnerships for Schools have under the Building Schools for the Future programme estimated that around 50 per cent. of Building Schools have been subject to revision because of access for the Future projects will involve remodelling or problems for children with disabilities and special refurbishment. All design guidance issued by the educational needs. [301097] Department and Partnerships for Schools has therefore been written with this in mind. Building Bulletin 102: Mr. Coaker: The Department for Children Schools ’Designing for Disabled Children and Children with and Families and Partnerships for Schools are committed Special Educational Needs’ can be used to design new to inclusive design and there are a number of processes facilities and for assessing the suitability of existing in place to ensure that Building Schools for the Future accommodation. new build proposals meet the needs of children with The Department does not routinely collect information disabilities and special educational needs: about revisions that have been made to new build The design of a new school has to comply with Approved proposals. But we expect all school projects to be designed Document M of the Building Regulations ’Access to and use to be accessible and inclusive, following the requirements of buildings’ and this is checked through the Building Control of the Building Regulations, the DDA and the Departments system. design guidance. Under the Disability Discrimination Act, all buildings have to provide suitable access for disabled people. Paul Rowen: To ask the Secretary of State for Teams bidding for Building Schools for the Future projects Children, Schools and Families (1) how many schools cannot proceed through to procurement if their sample designs do not meet a Minimum Design Standard judged by a panel have been refurbished through the Building Schools for set up by the Commission for Architecture and the Built the Future programme; how many of them were found Environment (CABE) which includes people with experience to have asbestos; and how many had that asbestos in special school design and accessibility. removed; [301091] 95W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 96W

(2) how much has been spent on refurbishing schools ensure the standardisation of marking, including that through the Building Schools for the Future “examiners should have relevant experience in the subject programme; how much has been spent dealing with area”. asbestos during such refurbishments; and if he will make a statement. [301092] Family Courts: Guardians Mr. Coaker: Of the 129 schools where work under Annette Brooke: To ask the Secretary of State for Building Schools for the Future (BSF) is complete, Children, Schools and Families with reference to the 30 have included refurbishment. In a further 21, the answer of 3 November 2009, Official Report, column work was confined to ICT renewal. Asbestos surveys 945W, on family courts: guardians, how many cases the may or may not have been required, depending on the Children and Family Care Advisory and Support age of the buildings. The total capital funding provided Services has allocated to self employment guardians in for these schools under BSF is £429 million, including each area in each of the last six months. [300570] £66 million for ICT. Information on the number of refurbished schools that contained asbestos or the amounts Dawn Primarolo: The allocation of cases to self employed spent on asbestos removal is not held centrally. Overall guardians is a matter for CAFCASS which has supplied the BSF programme is expected to comprise approximately the following data1: 35 per cent. major refurbishment, 15 per cent. minor refurbishment and 50 per cent. new build in terms of 1 This data is from the CAFCASS national Case Management floor area. Major refurbishments carried out under the System (CMS). The unit of measurement is cases, which can involve multiple application types and multiple reports for a Building Schools for the Future programme normally family with multiple children. include removal of all asbestos in areas likely to be disturbed by the work. Asbestos-containing materials Trend of allocations to SEC guardians for the last six months (ACMs) that are likely to deteriorate are identified by Cases allocated between 1 May to 31 October 2009 May June July Aug Sept an asbestos survey for each refurbishment and normally Area Oct Total removed. N1 (North and South 0010001 Asbestos is also removed when buildings are demolished. Tyne) For minor refurbishment work, an asbestos survey is N2 (Durham and 3410008 done and ACMs are either removed or managed in Teesside) place, depending on their condition. N3 (Lancashire and 432310141 Cumbria) Departmental Air Travel N5(WestYorkshire)5201008 N6 (South Yorkshire) 7010008 N7 (Greater 100001314 Mr. Heald: To ask the Secretary of State for Manchester) Children, Schools and Families how many first-class C2 (Lincolnshire, 151223124 flights were taken by each Minister in his Department Cambridgeshire, Hertfordshire, in 2008-09; and what the (a) origin, (b) destination Bedfordshire) [301419] and (c) cost was of each such flight. C3 (Leicestershire, 5100017 Northamptonshire, Ms Diana R. Johnson: There have been no first-class Warwickshire) flights purchased for Ministers in the Department for C4 (Staffordshire, 1000001 Shropshire, Children, Schools and Families in 2008-09. Worcestershire, Ministers’ tickets have been upgraded by airlines on Herefordshire) four occasions in 2008-09 at no cost to the Department. C5 (Birmingham, 116400122 Black Country, Right hon. Ed Balls MP Solihull) New York to Heathrow C6 (Norfolk, Suffolk, 14 15 11 4 4 5 53 Essex) Right hon. Jim Knight MP C7 (Cheshire and 0131005 Heathrow to Singapore Merseyside) Dubai to Heathrow S1 (Avon, Wiltshire, 3010105 Gloucestershire) Heathrow to Beijing S2 (Thames Valley) 19 10 7 13 4 6 59 S3 (Greater London) 47 52 49 41 46 65 300 Education: Assessments S4 (Kent) 16 15 11 9 14 7 72 S5 (Sussex and 20 13 13 14 25 10 95 Mr. Lancaster: To ask the Secretary of State for Surrey) Children, Schools and Families what qualifications are S6 (Hampshire, 488148042 required to become an examiner for (a) A levels and Dorset, Isle of Wight) S7 (Cornwall, Devon, 6 10 7 2 6 13 44 (b) GCSEs. [300713] Somerset) Total 167 145 131 132 111 123 809 Mr. Coaker: Examiners for GCSEs and A levels (GCEs) are employed by the awarding bodies, which This data relates to self employed contractors employed award the qualifications and are regulated by Ofqual. in care cases (section 31 cases). C1 (Derbyshire, Ofqual does not specify the qualifications required in Nottinghamshire) and N4 (North and East Yorkshire order to become an examiner. The regulators’ ’GCSE, and Humberside) have not allocated any new care cases GCE and AEA Code of Practice’ (April 2009) sets out to self employed contractors in the period covered in the responsibilities that awarding bodies must follow to the table. 97W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 98W

Annette Brooke: To ask the Secretary of State for and exams and successfully delivered key stage 2 results Children, Schools and Families what recent to schools and pupils this year. The value of the contract representations he has received on the caseloads of for the 2010 tests is £23 million. guardians employed by the Children and Family Court Advisory and Support Service. [301006] Primary Education: Lancashire

Dawn Primarolo: The allocation and management of Mr. Hoyle: To ask the Secretary of State for guardians’ caseloads is a matter for CAFCASS. The Children, Schools and Families what recent Secretary of State has received approximately representations he has received on proposed primary 20 representations on CAFCASS performance in the school closures in West Lancashire. [301416] last six months. A minority of these refer to the caseloads of guardians employed by CAFCASS. Mr. Coaker: None. School place planning is the statutory responsibility of individual local authorities (LAs). This Family Intervention Projects includes making sure there are sufficient school places, and also removing surplus places when required. To James Brokenshire: To ask the Secretary of State for facilitate this LAs have the power to propose the closure Children, Schools and Families what recent estimate he of maintained schools. has made of the number of families who have been Where LAs propose to make any changes to local subject to support from family interventions projects; school provision, including closures, they must follow a what funding his Department has committed to statutory process, which is then decided under established provide to family intervention projects in (a) 2009-10 local decision making arrangements. Ministers have no and (b) 2010-11; and how such funding is to be direct role in the process. allocated between local authorities. [300243] Sure Start Programme Dawn Primarolo: Data published in November 2009 shows that 2,225 families have received support from a Family Intervention project as at 31 March 2009. Mr. Hoyle: To ask the Secretary of State for Children, Schools and Families (1) whether he has The Government allocated £35.5 million for the projects plans to extend the operation of the Sure Start in 2009-10 and are planning to allocate £57 million programme in (a) Chorley and (b) Lancashire; Government funding in 2010-11. In addition there is [301418] anticipated match funding of £9.5 million from Registered Social Landlords, Housing Associations and Youth (2) how much his Department has spent on the Sure Offending Teams. Funding has been allocated to local Start programme in Chorley since the introduction of authorities using a range of criteria including levels of that programme. [301476] antisocial behaviour, youth crime, deprivation, poverty and number of children. Dawn Primarolo: Lancashire currently has 73 designated Sure Start Children’s Centres offering access to services GCSE to approximately 48,800 children under five and their families. Of these centres, six are in the Chorley constituency, Mr. Laws: To ask the Secretary of State for Children, with a combined reach of approximately 4,000 children Schools and Families what assessment he has made of under five and their families. Lancashire is planning a the effect of modular GCSE courses on the level of further six centres to be delivered by 2010, with two of examination grades awarded; and if he will make a these in Chorley. statement. [300698] The Department allocates capital and revenue funding for children’s centres and their predecessor Sure Start Mr. Coaker: There is nothing in the regulatory criteria Local programmes to local authorities. It is for local governing GCSEs that requires GCSEs to be modular: authorities to decide how to allocate funding between it is for awarding bodies to decide whether to develop individual centres. The following table contains details qualifications in this way. of the Sure Start Children’s Centre expenditure (both It is for Ofqual as the independent regulator to revenue and capital) for Lancashire for the years since ensure that the standard of GCSEs is maintained year the inception of the Sure Start programme. on year. They are engaged in work with awarding Lancashire Sure Start Children’s Centre funding (Capital and bodies to make sure that this is the case where the Revenue) programme allocation table awarding body has chosen a modular approach. Children’s Centre expenditure/ Capital and revenue allocations Lancashire National Curriculum Tests: Contracts 2003-04 21,000 2004-05 100,000 Mr. Laws: To ask the Secretary of State for Children, 2005-06 7,150,000 Schools and Families what progress has been made on 2006-07 12,559,000 the Key Stage 2 test contract for 2010; and if he will estimate the cost to the public purse of this contract. 2007-08 14,323,000 2008-09 13,125,000 [300701]

Mr. Coaker: The Secretary of State has approved the Mr. Hoyle: To ask the Secretary of State for QCDA’s choice of Edexcel as the test operations contractor Children, Schools and Families what his most recent to deliver key stage 2 national curriculum tests in 2010. assessment is of the outcomes of the Sure Start Edexcel has a strong track record in delivery of tests programme; and if he will make a statement. [301477] 99W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 100W

Dawn Primarolo: I refer the hon. Member to the reply Mr. Coaker: The Department collects data at local given on 10 November 2009, Official Report, column authority level on the number of penalty notices issued 354W, to my hon. Friend the Member for Wirral, South to parents for their child’s unauthorised absence from (Ben Chapman). school. Information is not available at constituency level. These data have been collected since 1 September Teachers: Training 2004 and the latest data available relate to the period to 31 August 2008. For each of these four years, the data Mr. Crabb: To ask the Secretary of State for for Sussex and the south-east are: Children, Schools and Families what timetable has Number been set for the review by the Training and South-east Sussex Development Agency for Schools of the qualified teacher status standards. [301431] 1 September 2004 to 31 August 2005 117 19 1 September 2005 to 1 September 2006 782 150 Mr. Coaker: Beginning a review of the standards for 2 September 2006 to 31 August 2007 1,973 226 qualified teacher status has been agreed as one of the 1 September 2007 to 3 August 2008 2,429 170 operational priorities for the Training and Development Agency for Schools (TDA) for 2010-11. We are currently Full penalty notice data can be found at: discussing the TDA’s remit for next year, including the http://www.teachernet.gov.uk/_doc/13800/ detailed timetable for the standards review. DataPNsFTPOsPCs%20Cumlative%20Sep04-Aug08.pdf United Church Schools Trust Teenage Pregnancy Paul Holmes: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr. Lancaster: To ask the Secretary of State for Children, Schools and Families whether his Children, Schools and Families whether he has made Department has funded sponsorship funds operated by an assessment of the merits of collecting more detailed United Church Schools Trust. [301251] information on pregnancies involving one or more underage parents. [300273] Mr. Coaker: The Department does not provide any funding to United Church Schools Trust (UCST). United Dawn Primarolo: The conception data supplied by Learning Trust (ULT) is a subsidiary charity of UCST the Office for National Statistics (ONS) are derived by and sponsors 17 academies. The Department does not combining birth registration data and abortion notifications. provide any funding to sponsors but to the not-for-profit It includes the number of conceptions, the rate of charitable companies they establish to set up and run conceptions per 1,000 females and the proportion of the academies. Sponsors, including ULT also provide conceptions that result in an abortion. funding to these charitable companies. For the purposes of measuring progress against the Government’s Teenage Pregnancy Strategy, the under-18 conception rate is used. This is expressed as a rate per TREASURY 1,000 females aged 15-17. Using rates rather than numbers takes account of changes in the 15-17 female population EU Budget size and therefore provides a more accurate picture of the proportion of the under-18 population that became Mr. Heathcoat-Amory: To ask the Chancellor of the pregnant in a given year. Exchequer what his Department’s projections are for the level of the UK’s (a) contributions to and (b) Conception data can be disaggregated to ward level, receipts from the EU budget in each calendar year from allowing local areas to target their local strategies in 2009 to 2013 inclusive, in pounds sterling, (i) before high-rate neighbourhoods. Ward-level data are combined and (ii) after abatement. [300979] over three years, to comply with ONS’s confidentiality rules which do not permit abortion numbers of less Ian Pearson: Table 3.2 of the European Community than 10 to be published, in order to protect patient Finances White Paper of July 2009 (Cm 7640) gives the confidentiality. latest projections for the UK’s contributions to and We do not have any plans to change these data receipts from the EC budget, including the value of our collection arrangements. abatement, up to the financial year 2010-11. In line with Between 1998 (the baseline year for the Teenage all other public expenditure estimates, the Treasury Pregnancy Strategy) and 2007 (the latest year for which does not currently publish forecasts beyond 2010-11. As data are available), the under-18 conception rate has usual, these figures will, where necessary, be updated in fallen by 10.7 per cent; within the overall decline in the forthcoming pre-Budget report. under-18 conceptions, teenage births have fallen by 23.3 per cent. to their lowest level for over 15 years. Mr. Heathcoat-Amory: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer what forecast his Department has made of UK (a) contributions to and (b) receipts from the EU Truancy: Fines budget in pounds sterling for each calendar year from 2014 to 2020 inclusive (i) before and (ii) after Norman Baker: To ask the Secretary of State for abatement. [301009] Children, Schools and Families how many parents have been fined as a result of their children not attending Ian Pearson: In line with all other public expenditure school in (a) Lewes constituency, (b) Sussex and (c) estimates, the Treasury does not currently publish forecasts the South East in each of the last five years. [301281] beyond 2010-11. 101W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 102W

Mr. Heathcoat-Amory: To ask the Chancellor of the Ian Pearson: The methodology is set out in rating Exchequer what recent discussions his Department’s manual volume 5 section 200 for car parks and in the officials have had with (a) other EU member states individual practice note issued for each five yearly and (b) EU institutions on the EU Financial revaluation. These can be viewed on the Valuation Framework 2014-20. [301010] Office Agency’s website: www.voa.gov.uk Ian Pearson: HM Treasury representatives have discussions with EU counterparts on a variety of issues Research: Finance on a regular basis. Formal negotiations on the next Financial Framework have not yet started. Mrs. Curtis-Thomas: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer what steps he plans to take to increase European Investment Bank research and development expenditure; what assessment he has made of the effect of research and Dr. Cable: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer development tax credits on research and development what steps his Department has taken to help UK expenditure in the UK; and if he will make a statement. businesses apply for European Investment Bank funds. [300753] [300364] Ian Pearson: Specific tax relief was introduced in Ian Pearson: The Government are committed to helping 2000 for spending on research and development by UK businesses access European investment Bank (EIB) companies which are small or medium sized enterprises funding, whether direct loans for large projects and (SMEs). Relief was extended to larger companies in businesses or intermediated loans for small businesses 2002. Between 2003-04 and 2006-07 the amount of R and projects. and D expenditure supported increased by 10 per cent. In particular, over the last 12 months the Government a year, from £5.7 billion in 2003-04 to £7.6 billion in have: 2006-07, the latest year for which data are available. Announced that UK small businesses stand to benefit from up Since the introduction of the schemes, there have been to £4 billion of lending from the EIB between 2008 and 2011 over 36,000 claims for R and D tax relief, with over through intermediating banks. £3 billion of support claimed by innovative companies Called for the EIB to double its financial support for research in the UK, supporting £32 billion of R and D expenditure and development programmes in the automotive sector, by in total. making available ¤8 billion over 2009 and 2010 through the European Clean Transport Facility. Tax Allowances: Professional Organisations Announced that UK renewable and energy projects stand to benefit from up to £4 billion of new capital from the EIB, Mr. Austin Mitchell: To ask the Chancellor of the including a specific £700 million intermediated lending scheme Exchequer if he will estimate the tax revenues likely to for small and medium sized renewable energy projects. be raised as a consequence of ending the charitable However, while the Government can play a facilitating status and tax exemptions for which the professional role, businesses must apply directly to the EIB (or UK accountancy bodies operating as recognised banks in the case of intermediated lending) and applications supervisory bodies under the Companies Act 2006 are are assessed according to the EIB’s (or the relevant UK eligible. [301503] banks’) own internal appraisal processes. Ian Pearson: No estimates have been made. The Israel: EU External Trade professional accountancy bodies that are currently registered in the UK as recognised supervisory bodies do not have Dr. Starkey: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer charitable status and thus do not qualify for charity-related whether HM Revenue and Customs has had contact tax exemptions. with its Dutch counterpart in relation to its investigation into whether Ahava products originate in whole or in part from the Palestinian Occupied Territories. [300307] HEALTH Mr. Timms: There has been no contact. Health Warnings: Super-strength Lager Dr. Starkey: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer 16. Martin Linton: To ask the Secretary of State for what (a) volume and (b) monetary value of Ahava Health if he will bring forward proposals to introduce products was imported to the UK in the last health warnings on cans of super-strength lager. 12 months; and what proportion of such imports was [300154] eligible for the trading preference under the EU-Israel Trade Agreement. [300308] Gillian Merron: We are working with industry to include units, drinking guidelines and pregnancy warnings Mr. Timms: Commercial confidentiality makes it on labels. inappropriate to provide this information for an individual Where progress on industry’s voluntary commitments supplier. is slow, we can expect to legislate. Non-Domestic Rates: Parking Dementia: In-patients

Mr. Swire: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer 17. David Taylor: To ask the Secretary of State for what criteria the Valuation Office Agency uses to Health what recent representations he has received on determine the rateable value of reserved parking the standard of hospital care received by in-patients spaces. [301567] with dementia. [300155] 103W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 104W

Phil Hope: The Alzheimer’s Society report on the people get really good care wherever they live, and quality of dementia care in hospitals is a timely reminder whatever they or their family needs. Following our of the need for improvement of hospital care for people extensive consultation which closed on 13 November, with dementia. The national dementia strategy recognises we will publish a White Paper in the new year. the need to transform hospital services for people with dementia and deliver a skilled and effective workforce in hospitals. Care Provision

Hospital-acquired Infections 22. Tony Lloyd: To ask the Secretary of State for Health what plans he has to change the arrangements 18. Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for for the provision of care for the elderly and the Health what assessment he has made of the disabled. [300160] effectiveness of steps taken against hospital-acquired infections. [300156] Phil Hope: Subject to parliamentary approval, the Personal Care at Home Bill will mean that older people Ann Keen: The national health service is continuing and younger disabled adults will be better helped to live to deliver sustained reductions in Methicillin-resistant independently for longer in their own homes—something Staphylococcus aureus bloodstream infections and they tell us they want. C. difficile infections. However, one preventable infection is one too many and we must do all we can to keep This is a major step towards the setting up of a driving down all infections. national care service.

Community Hospitals Organ Donation Education 19. Mr. Robathan: To ask the Secretary of State for Health what recent assessment he has made of the 23. Mr. Hollobone: To ask the Secretary of State for effectiveness of his policy on the provision of local Health what discussions he has had with the Secretary community hospitals; and if he will make a statement. of State for Children, Schools and Families on the [300157] number of schools which have made use of the NHS Blood and Transplant Service’s Give and Let Live Mr. Mike O’Brien: The transforming community services organ donation education programme. [300161] programme is supporting primary care trusts (PCTs) to make local decisions about how they provide community Ann Keen: ‘Give and Let Live’ is a free educational services. We published guidance in January 2009 asking resource that helps young people decide if they want to PCTs to assess their community estates in the light of give blood, donate bone marrow or join the NHS organ their commissioning intentions, and produce estate strategies donor register. by April 2010. The programme is available to all United Kingdom state and independent secondary schools. NHS Dentistry The Secretary of State has many discussions with his Cabinet colleagues covering a variety of subjects and 20. Mr. Swayne: To ask the Secretary of State for areas. Health what steps he is taking to increase the number of patients who have access to an NHS dentist. Moreover, departmental officials are in regular contact [300158] with their colleagues in the Department for Children, Schools and Families on all aspects of promoting to Ann Keen: We have invested a record £2 billion in young people the importance of being a donor. dentistry and set up a national access programme to help the NHS deliver its goal of access for all who seek it by 2011. We therefore expect access to continue to Incinerators increase. The latest data shows that access has grown for the 24. Mr. Pelling: To ask the Secretary of State for fourth quarter running, with 721,000 more patients Health whether his Department has (a) conducted and accessing NHS services in the 24 months ending June (b) commissioned any recent research on the effects of 2009 than compared to the 24 months ending June the operation of incinerators on the health of local 2008. The next quarterly statistics will be published on residents. [300162] 26 November. Gillian Merron: The Department is neither Social Care Reform commissioning nor conducting any research in this area currently. 21. Mr. Evennett: To ask the Secretary of State for The Health Protection Agency has recently reviewed Health what plans he has for the reform of social care. the latest research on the health effects of modern [300159] municipal waste incinerators. They concluded that, while it is not possible to rule out adverse health effects Phil Hope: The Green Paper ‘Shaping the Future of completely, any potential damage from modern, well-run Care Together’ set out a vision for a national care and regulated incinerators is likely to be so small that it service that is fairer, simpler and more affordable—ensuring would be undetectable. 105W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 106W

Tuberculosis B calls (those conditions that are serious but not immediately life threatening) should be responded to within 19 minutes 25. Dr. Naysmith: To ask the Secretary of State for in 95 per cent. of cases. Health what recent consideration he has given to the Arthritis establishment of a national programme for the co-ordination of services to prevent and control tuberculosis. [300163] Paul Rowen: To ask the Secretary of State for Health how many primary care trusts (a) provided Gillian Merron: The responsibility for provision of information on inflammatory arthritis to GPs in the tuberculosis (TB) control services rests with local last 12 months and (b) plan to provide such commissioners. In 2004, the Department published a information in the next 12 months; and if he will make TB Action Plan for NHS professionals, managers and a statement. [301115] commissioners, which is aimed at improving early TB detection and completion of treatment. In 2007, the Ann Keen: Information on how many primary care Department launched a TB Toolkit for commissioners trusts provide information on rheumatoid arthritis to to secure the best TB services to meet local needs. general practitioners (GPs) is not recorded centrally. Information on inflammatory arthritis is available to Abortion health professionals, including GPs, through national health service evidence and Map of Medicine. Mr. Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Health The Department has also published a good practice what estimate his Department has made of the number commissioning pathway for inflammatory arthritis which of repeat abortions undertaken in relation to females supports clinicians in identifying cases of rheumatoid aged (a) 11, (b) 12, (c) 13, (d) 14, (e) 15, (f) 16, (g) arthritis and ensuring that they are set on the right 17, (h) 18, (i) 19, (j) 20, (k) 21, (l) 22, (m) 23, (n) pathway of care. This describes key symptoms, for 24, (o) between 25 and 29, (p) between 30 and 34 and example where patients should be referred for urgent (q) 35 years and over in each primary care trust area in treatment. each year since 2000. [300861] Cancer: Mentally Ill Gillian Merron: This information could be provided only at disproportionate cost. Mr. Baron: To ask the Secretary of State for Health how many cancer specialists have received training on Ambulance Services: Hornsey the provisions of the Mental Capacity Act 2005; and if he will make a statement. [301414] Lynne Featherstone: To ask the Secretary of State for Health if he will place in the Library a copy of the data Phil Hope: As part of the implementation of the held by his Department on the time taken for people in Mental Capacity Act (MCA), the Department made Hornsey and Wood Green constituency to get to funding available to the health and social care economy hospital under blue light conditions in each of the last for training purposes. In addition, the Department funded 10 years; and if he will make a statement. [300534] a range of training materials and booklets on the MCA. These included materials to be used by trainers in face Mr. Mike O’Brien: This information is not held centrally. to face training, e-learning materials and the booklets The Department does not require ambulance trusts in the Making Decisions series. to submit data on times from collecting a patient to All were made available to the national health service. arriving at premises providing national health service In addition, the Department encouraged primary care health care. The data that the Department does collect trusts (PCTs) to use the resources they received for on ambulance response times is published on an annual implementation to fund a MCA co-ordinator. Many basis in the statistical bulletin, Ambulance services, have done so and MCA co-ordinators have been active England. in developing local training plans and commissioning and arranging training. Ambulance Services: Standards The number of cancer specialists who have made use of the training is not held centrally; arranging training Mr. Roger Williams: To ask the Secretary of State for is a local issue. Training opportunities continue and we Health what his latest estimate is of the average (a) know that cancer specialists have been making referrals target and (b) actual ambulance response time to 999 to Independent Mental Capacity Advocates, which is calls in (i) urban and (ii) rural areas; and if he will an indication they are aware of the MCA. make a statement. [300288] Carbon Monoxide: Poisoning Mr. Mike O’Brien: The Department no longer classifies ambulance trusts as urban or rural, and therefore Tom Levitt: To ask the Secretary of State for Health performance data is no longer reported against these (1) if he will ensure that facilities to monitor blood categories. carbon monoxide levels through breath analysis are All ambulance trusts are required to meet the same available in every general practitioner’s surgery; national response time standards irrespective of location. [301365] Category A calls (those presenting conditions that may (2) what proportion of NHS patients recorded as be immediately life threatening) should be responded to tired all the time are monitored for carbon monoxide within eight minutes in 75 per cent. of cases and Category poisoning. [301370] 107W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 108W

Gillian Merron: This information is not recorded. requested. As at 17 November 2009, altogether there Tiredness is a possible symptom of a range of medical were some 99,800 HealthSpace accounts. conditions. Monitoring of carbon monoxide levels by breath Hip Replacements: Research analysis is often available in general practitioner’s (GPs) surgeries for use in smoking cessation clinics. Where Mr. Greg Knight: To ask the Secretary of State for they are not available in GP surgeries, they are available Health what research his Department has (a) in the many community locations served by the NHS commissioned and (b) evaluated on the risk of a hip Local Stop Smoking Service. replacement being required for those who have a history of jogging on concrete or other hard surfaces; Chronic Fatigue Syndrome: Research and if he will make a statement. [300574]

Paul Rowen: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Gillian Merron: The Department has not commissioned what recent research his Department has evaluated on any specific research or risk assessment into jogging on the causes of myalgic encephalomyelitis. [301252] hard surfaces, although the chief medical officer’s report “At least five a week: evidence on the impact of physical Ann Keen: None. activity and its relationship to health”includes a discussion The Medical Research Council (MRC) is one of the of the effects of physical activity on osteoarthritis. The main agencies through which the Government support report has already been placed in the Library. medical and clinical research. The MRC is an independent body which receives its grant-in-aid from the Department Hospital Beds: Scarborough and North East Yorkshire for Business, Innovation and Skills. NHS Trust Chronic fatigue syndrome/myalgic encephalomyelitis (CFS/ME) continues to be a strategic priority area for Mr. Greg Knight: To ask the Secretary of State for funding and the MRC remains committed to supporting Health what estimate his Department has made of the scientific research into all aspects of CFS/ME including number of hospital beds available within the region evaluations of treatments and studies into the biological served by the Scarborough and North East Yorkshire basis of the condition. NHS Trust whilst Bridlington Hospital is being In 2008 a new Expert Group was set up by the MRC refurbished. [300571] to consider how best to encourage new high-quality research into CFS/ME and to bring researchers from Ann Keen: This is a matter for the North Yorkshire associated areas into the field. The Expert Group has and York primary care trust (PCT). It is the responsibility met twice, in December 2008 and March 2009. of the PCT to plan, develop and improve services according to the health care needs of its local population. In addition, the MRC recently held a CFS/ME workshop This includes the appropriate provision of hospital beds and a note of the discussions will be published on the to meet anticipated demand. MRC website in due course.

Dementia: Research Hull and East Yorkshire Hospitals NHS Trust: Publications Mr. Burstow: To ask the Secretary of State for Health how much the Medical Research Council and Mr. Greg Knight: To ask the Secretary of State for National Institute for Health Research (Department of Health how much Hull and East Yorkshire Hospitals Health) spent on dementia research in 2008-09. NHS Trust has spent on the provision of newsletters in the last 12 months for which figures are available. [300340] [300469] Gillian Merron: Combined Medical Research Council and National Institute for Health Research (NIHR) Ann Keen: This information is not collected centrally. expenditure on dementia research in 2008-09 amounted This information can be obtained from the Hull and to some £29.9 million. The NIHR component includes East Yorkshire hospitals NHS Trust direct. the cost of the dementia and neurodegenerative diseases research network. Learning Disability: Cancer

Health: Screening Mr. Baron: To ask the Secretary of State for Health how many (a) men and (b) women with a learning Mr. Lansley: To ask the Secretary of State for Health disability waited over 18 weeks after diagnosis of when all patients with a summary care record will be cancer to treatment in each year since 1997; and if he offered HealthSpace; and how many people have will make a statement. [301412] registered each year since December 2003 in the early adopter areas. [300336] Ann Keen: The information requested is not collected centrally. Mr. Mike O’Brien: Any person aged 16 or over may The NHS Cancer Plan (2000) committed that no choose to open a HealthSpace account. It is not necessary patient diagnosed with cancer should wait longer than for patients to have a summary care record to take 31 days between diagnosis and first definitive treatment advantage of HealthSpace. Information on the take-up for cancer. The 31-day cancer waiting time standard to date of HealthSpace accounts is not held in the form was introduced for all cancer patients from December 109W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 110W

2005. Data to monitor national health service performance Musculoskeletal Disorders: Primary Care Trusts against this standard are published quarterly on the Department’s website at: Paul Rowen: To ask the Secretary of State for Health www.dh.gov.uk/en/Publicationsandstatistics/Statistics/ what assessment he has made of primary care trust Performancedataandstatistics/ funding levels for treatment of musculoskeletal HospitalWaitingTimesandListStatistics/CancerWaitingTimes/ conditions in 2008-09. [301116] index.htm The number of patients with learning difficulties are Ann Keen: No specific assessment of primary care not identified within this data collection. trust (PCT) funding levels for treatment of musculoskeletal conditions has been made. Learning Disability: Prostate Cancer All primary care trusts have undertaken a comprehensive needs assessment as part of developing their strategic Mr. Baron: To ask the Secretary of State for Health plans. what steps his Department is taking to ensure that the As long as PCTs meet national standards and guidance, prostate cancer screening programme is accessible for the local national health service is free to make decisions men with a learning disability; and if he will make a on spending priorities based on the character and needs statement. [301415] of their local population. Local NHS organisations are answerable to their local populations for the decisions Ann Keen: There is currently no national screening that they make. programme for prostate cancer. However, in March 2009, we announced that the UK National Screening NHS: Pensions Committee will review new evidence surrounding screening for prostate cancer. The Committee is due to report Steve Webb: To ask the Secretary of State for Health back to Ministers during 2010. how many (a) current, (b) retired and (c) deferred In 2002, as part of the Prostate Cancer Risk Management members of the NHS pension scheme (i) were members Programme (PCRMP), a pack of materials was produced prior to 1 April 2008 and (ii) have joined the scheme for use in primary care to help men make an informed since 1 April 2008. [300686] choice about having a prostate specific antigen (PSA) test. If a man wants a PSA test after consultation with Ann Keen: As at 31 March 2008 there were 1,336,576 his general practitioner (GP) and consideration of the active members, 411,458 deferred members and 583,705 information leaflet included for men, he may have one retired members of the NHS Pension Scheme. free on the national health service. In the year from 1 April 2008 to 31 March 2009, there The PCRMP packs have been formally evaluated and were a total of 155,100 new entrants to the Scheme. revised packs were issued to GPs in August 2009. The These comprised new members, deferred members who PCRMP Scientific Reference Group discussed whether rejoined and members who transferred in from other separate materials should be produced for men with a pension schemes. Retired members of the 1995 section learning disability. They concluded that as the programme of the scheme are unable to rejoin after retirement. It is was aimed at men with no symptoms of prostate cancer, not possible to give a breakdown of the joiners into new was not a population screening programme, and the members, deferred members who rejoined and transfers patient leaflet was an aide memoire following a consultation in. with a primary care practitioner, it would not be appropriate Source: to produce such materials. The primary care team should NHS Pension Scheme and NHS Compensation for Premature use their best clinical judgment in explaining the materials Retirement Scheme Resource Accounts 2007-08 and 2008-09 in. for men with a learning disability who are aware of the Patients: Transport programme or whose carers are aware of the programme, especially if the individual is at a higher risk of prostate cancer if, for example, his brother has had prostate Mr. Greg Knight: To ask the Secretary of State for cancer. Health (1) what estimate he has made of (a) the number of volunteers using their own vehicle to transport patients on behalf of the NHS and (b) the Mental Health Services mileage covered by these volunteers in the latest period for which figures are available; [300472] Chris Ruane: To ask the Secretary of State for Health (2) how many volunteers who used their own vehicle how many patients have been treated for mental illness to transport patients on behalf of the NHS were on the NHS in each of the last 10 years. [300410] reimbursed in 2008; and what his most recent estimate is of the equivalent figure in 2009 to date. [300473] Phil Hope: This information is not available. Most treatment for mental health problems occurs in primary Mr. Mike O’Brien: No assessment has been made by care settings, where information on the number of patients the Department of the use of voluntary drivers. Any treated for specific conditions is not collected. assessment of voluntary car schemes would be for the Approximately one in six adults in England has a local national health service to make. common mental illness, like anxiety or mild depression We are aware of the huge contribution that volunteer at any given time, with one in four adults experiencing drivers make to health and well being by offering transport mental ill health at some stage in their lives. Approximately free of charge to many vulnerable and potentially isolated one in 100 people are thought to have a severe mental patients and service users. The Department is currently illness like schizophrenia or psychosis. working to develop a strategic vision for volunteering in 111W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 112W health and social care which will acknowledge this Phil Hope: The NHS Information Centre for health contribution and highlight the importance of volunteer and social care does not collect the data requested. expenses being reimbursed. However, councils with social services responsibilities Pharmacy are responsible for the organisation of services in its area. Progress in Sight National Standard of Social Care for Visually Impaired Adults provides a Mr. Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for Health framework against which councils can benchmark their when he expects to lay the draft Pharmacy Order existing services and able them to focus more clearly on before Parliament. [300319] what they need to do in order to reach the required standard. Mr. Mike O’Brien: The draft Pharmacy Order 2010 was laid in both the Westminster and Scottish Parliaments on 11 November 2009. Sickle Cell Disease: Pain HOME DEPARTMENT Alcoholic Drinks: Young People Sarah Teather: To ask the Secretary of State for Health whether the National Institute for Health and Greg Mulholland: To ask the Secretary of State for Clinical Excellence plans to issue clinical guidelines for the Home Department (1) how many people working the management of pain in sickle cell disease. [301081] in (a) pubs, (b) bars and (c) nightclubs have been prosecuted for selling alcohol to underage persons in Mr. Mike O’Brien: We have not asked the National each of the last five years; [300350] Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence (NICE) to (2) how many (a) shop and (b) supermarket develop guidance on the management of pain in sickle workers have been prosecuted for selling alcohol cell disease. A proposal for a short clinical guideline to underage persons in each of the last five years. relating to the management of sickle cell crises in hospital is currently being considered through NICE’s topic [300351] selection process. Mr. Alan Campbell [holding answer 23 November Social Services: Sight Impaired 2009]: Data showing the number of males, females and other defendants proceeded against for selling alcohol Mark Hunter: To ask the Secretary of State for to persons aged under 18, in England and Wales from Health (1) what percentage of blind or partially-sighted 2003 to 2007 (latest available) are shown in Table 1. people have received a visit from social services in each Establishments are included as other defendants, it is of the last five years; [300764] not possible to differentiate between sales on and off (2) what percentage of blind or partially-sighted premises in the court proceedings database. people have been offered formal counselling to help Table 2 shows the number of penalty notices for deal with the trauma of sight loss in each of the last disorder issued for “Sale of alcohol to a person five years; [300765] aged under 18” by gender from 2004 to 2007 (latest (3) what recent assessment his Department has made available). of the adequacy of support for blind and partially- Statistics for 2008 are planned for publication at the sighted people. [300766] end of January 2010.

Table 1: Number of males, females and other defendants1 proceeded against at magistrates court for selling alcohol to persons aged under 182, in England and Wales from 2003 to 2007, broken down by police force area3,4 Force Sex 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007

Avon and Somerset Male 1 — 7 2 — Female — — 7 3 1 Other defendant 1———— Total 2—145 1

Bedfordshire Male 1 5 10 23 2 Female 1 2 — 1 — Other defendant — — — — Total 2 7 10 24 2

Cambridgeshire Male — 3 6 16 8 Female — 1 3 11 2 Other defendant ————— Total — 4 9 27 10

Cheshire Male 8 14 4 6 6 Female 7 6 4 — — Other defendant 1———— 113W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 114W

Table 1: Number of males, females and other defendants1 proceeded against at magistrates court for selling alcohol to persons aged under 182, in England and Wales from 2003 to 2007, broken down by police force area3,4 Force Sex 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007

Total1620866

Cleveland Male 1 6 11 8 8 Female 1 4 3 3 5 Other defendant 2———— Total 4 10 14 11 13

Cumbria Male 1 1 2 1 1 Female — — 6 — — Other defendant ————— Total 11811

Derbyshire Male 27 18 9 7 6 Female 10 4 4 1 1 Other defendant ————— Total 3722138 7

Devon and Cornwall Male — 7 5 4 3 Female — 5 3 2 2 Other defendant ————— Total—-12865

Dorset Male 7 6 30 6 2 Female 2 4 5 1 — Other defendant ————— Total 9 10 35 7 2

Durham Male — 2 2 — 1 Female ———— 2 Other defendant ————— Total—22—3

Essex Male 4 1 8 14 12 Female 3 1 — 2 2 Other defendant ————— Total 7 2 8 16 14

Gloucestershire Male — 1 4 9 3 Female — — 1 1 — Other defendant ————— Total—15103

Male 85 124 81 111 30 Greater Manchester Female 40 55 36 48 5 Other defendant 4 1 — 1 — Total 129 180 117 160 35

Hampshire Male — 6 7 2 4 Female — 3 4 — — Other defendant ————— Total — 9 11 2 4

Hertfordshire Male 1 7 3 40 21 Female — 1 — — 2 Other defendant ———— 1 115W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 116W

Table 1: Number of males, females and other defendants1 proceeded against at magistrates court for selling alcohol to persons aged under 182, in England and Wales from 2003 to 2007, broken down by police force area3,4 Force Sex 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007

Total 1 8 3 40 24

Humberside Male — 3 2 3 2 Female — 8 — 3 3 Other defendant ————— Total—11265

Kent Male 9 10 13 2 2 Female 3 3 1 — — Other defendant — 2——— Total 1215142 2

Lancashire Male 15 14 49 22 24 Female 8 8 40 10 3 Other defendant ————— Total 2322893227

Leicestershire Male 9 9 21 35 40 Female 6 — 6 10 15 Other defendant — 1——— Total 1510274555

Lincolnshire Male 9 3 7 5 2 Female 8 1 4 5 1 Other defendant ————— Total 17 4 11 10 3

Merseyside Male 25 13 12 12 21 Female 16 6 4 22 7 Other defendant 1———— Total 4219163428

Metropolitan Police Male 84 133 223 197 136 Female 13 22 28 24 18 Other defendant 16 12 2 15 22 Total 113 167 253 236 176

Norfolk Male 1 6 — — 1 Female — 3 3 — 1 Other defendant ————— Total 193—2

North Yorkshire Male 3 16 2 25 16 Female 4 6 1 16 13 Other defendant ———27— Total 7 22 3 68 29

Northamptonshire Male — — 7 11 7 Female — — 4 2 — Other defendant ————— Total ——11137

Northumbria Male 31 36 65 30 8 Female 7 14 14 10 4 Other defendant — 1 — 1 — 117W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 118W

Table 1: Number of males, females and other defendants1 proceeded against at magistrates court for selling alcohol to persons aged under 182, in England and Wales from 2003 to 2007, broken down by police force area3,4 Force Sex 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007

Total 3851794112

Nottinghamshire Male 5 — 6 26 3 Female 4 — 5 11 2 Other defendant ————— Total 9—11375

South Yorkshire Male — 4 11 8 4 Female — 1 7 2 3 Other defendant ———— 2 Total — 5 18 10 9

Staffordshire Male 3 5 14 13 16 Female 5 — 6 10 10 Other defendant ————— Total 8 5202326

Suffolk Male — 1 1 2 — Female — — 2 2 — Other defendant ————— Total—134—

Surrey Male 4 9 12 17 3 Female — 1 1 1 2 Other defendant ————— Total 4 10 13 18 5

Sussex Male 7 3 2 23 8 Female 1 1 2 9 3 Other defendant — — — 1 — Total 8 4 4 33 11

Thames Valley Male 2 19 6 28 14 Female 4 8 9 8 6 Other defendant — 1——— Total 6 28 15 36 20

Warwickshire Male 19 17 5 2 1 Female 7 9 2 — — Other defendant 1———— Total2726721

West Mercia Male 7 3 17 10 5 Female — 1 2 — — Other defendant — 1——— Total 7 5 19 10 5

West Midlands Male 20 34 53 55 40 Female — 11 22 18 16 Other defendant — — 1 1 1 Total 2045767457

West Yorkshire Male 1 17 9 14 8 Female — 4 6 3 1 119W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 120W

Table 1: Number of males, females and other defendants1 proceeded against at magistrates court for selling alcohol to persons aged under 182, in England and Wales from 2003 to 2007, broken down by police force area3,4 Force Sex 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007

Other defendant 1———— Total 2 21 15 17 9

Wiltshire Male 4 5 16 9 5 Female 1 3 7 1 1 Other defendant 1 2——— Total 6 10 23 10 6

Dyfed-Powys Male 5 15 4 12 6 Female — 9 2 4 4 Other defendant — — — 2 3 Total 5 24 6 18 13

Gwent Male — 8 13 14 8 Female 2 12 3 6 5 Other defendant — — — 1 — Total 2 20 16 21 13

North Wales Male 4 3 8 3 6 Female 3 2 2 1 2 Other defendant ————— Total 7 5 10 4 8

South Wales Male 24 27 40 56 22 Female 5 6 15 15 4 Other defendant — 1 — 1 3 Total 2934557229

England and Wales Male 427 614 807 883 515 Female 161 225 274 266 146 Other defendant 28 22 3 50 32 Total 616 861 1,084 1,199 693 1 Other defendants include companies and public bodies etc. 2 Includes the following offences: (a) Holder of occasional permission or his agent knowingly selling to, knowingly allow consumption by or allowing any person to sell, intoxicating liquor to a person under 18. Selling etc intoxicating liquor to person under 18 for consumption on the premises. (b) Wholesaler selling intoxicating liquor to a person under 18. (c ) Sale of alcohol to person under 18. (d) Allowing sale of alcohol to person under 18. (e) Persistently selling alcohol to children. 3 The statistics relate to persons for whom these offences were the principal offences for which they were dealt with. When a defendant has been found guilty of two or more offences the principal offence is the offence for which the heaviest penalty is imposed. Where the same disposal is imposed for two or more offences, the offence selected is the offence for which the statutory maximum penalty is the most severe. 4 Every effort is made to ensure that the figures presented are accurate and complete. However, it is important to note that these data have been extractedfrom large administrative data systems generated by the courts and police force. As a consequence, care should be taken to ensure data collection processes and their inevitable limitations are taken into account when those data are used. Source: Evidence and Analysis Unit—Office for Criminal Justice Reform Ref: IOS 043-09 Table 2: Number of penalty notices for disorder (PNDs) issued for sale of alcohol to a person under 18, England and Wales, 20041 to 2007, broken down by police force area Force Sex 2004 2005 2006 2007

Avon and Somerset Male — 29 25 33 Female — 27 29 27 Total — 56 54 60

Bedfordshire Male — 1 6 10 Female —173 Total— 21313

Cambridgeshire Male — 8 14 16 121W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 122W

Table 2: Number of penalty notices for disorder (PNDs) issued for sale of alcohol to a person under 18, England and Wales, 20041 to 2007, broken down by police force area Force Sex 2004 2005 2006 2007

Female — 3 15 6 Total — 11 29 22

Cheshire Male — 21 19 19 Female — 28 31 7 Total — 49 50 26

Cleveland Male — 10 10 27 Female — 23 13 38 Total — 33 23 65

Cumbria Male — 10 11 13 Female — 13 10 27 Total — 23 21 40

Derbyshire Male — 5 16 50 Female — 3 14 51 Total — 8 30 101

Devon and Cornwall Male — 32 54 31 Female — 50 61 38 Total — 82 115 69

Dorset Male 13 3 9 20 Female 9 19 20 15 Total22222935

Durham Male — — 1 12 Female ———13 Total — — 1 25

Essex Male 3 60 42 53 Female 4 60 52 58 Total 7 120 94 111

Gloucestershire Male — 17 28 44 Female — 25 26 42 Total — 42 54 86

Greater Manchester Male — 60 122 98 Female — 67 89 43 Total — 127 211 141

Hampshire Male 1 31 57 114 Female 1 36 52 91 Total 2 67 109 205

Hertfordshire Male — 2 30 46 Female — 1 11 21 Total— 34167

Humberside Male 1 13 22 46 Female 1 32 26 52 Total 2 45 48 98 123W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 124W

Table 2: Number of penalty notices for disorder (PNDs) issued for sale of alcohol to a person under 18, England and Wales, 20041 to 2007, broken down by police force area Force Sex 2004 2005 2006 2007

Kent Male — 8 3 16 Female —227 Total — 10 5 23

Lancashire Male 17 95 105 100 Female 13 95 101 90 Total 30 190 206 190

Leicestershire Male 2 22 26 89 Female — 24 33 61 Total 2 46 59 150

Lincolnshire Male — 10 21 15 Female — 16 36 39 Total — 26 57 54

Merseyside Male 2 44 56 72 Female — 29 71 103 Total 2 73 127 175

Metropolitan Police Male 12 113 190 264 Female 9 48 62 77 Total 21 161 252 341

Norfolk Male — — 5 17 Female — — 5 19 Total——1036

Northamptonshire Male 1 15 18 15 Female — 24 16 7 Total 1 39 34 22

Northumbria Male 1 24 47 44 Female — 24 37 23 Total 1 48 84 67

North Yorkshire Male — — 4 8 Female — — 7 17 Total——1125

Nottinghamshire Male 3 54 125 81 Female 6 63 140 87 Total 9 117 265 168

South Yorkshire Male 1 47 76 69 Female 1 60 82 90 Total 2 107 158 159

Staffordshire Male — 6 34 32 Female — 13 41 35 Total — 19 75 67

Suffolk Male — 11 14 7 Female — 8 7 13 125W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 126W

Table 2: Number of penalty notices for disorder (PNDs) issued for sale of alcohol to a person under 18, England and Wales, 20041 to 2007, broken down by police force area Force Sex 2004 2005 2006 2007

Total — 19 21 20

Surrey Male — — 22 57 Female — — 12 15 Total——3472

Sussex Male — 29 116 63 Female — 34 100 56 Total — 63 216 119

Thames Valley Male — 8 59 80 Female — 4 36 51 Total — 12 95 131

Warwickshire Male — 3 1 24 Female — — 4 13 Total—3537

West Mercia Male 1 4 11 16 Female — 18 23 20 Total 1 22 34 36

West Midlands Male 2 69 83 90 Female 4 45 60 45 Total 6 114 143 135

West Yorkshire Male 4 32 64 97 Female — 40 41 64 Total 4 72 105 161

Wiltshire Male — 5 9 15 Female —399 Total— 81824

Dyfed-PowysMale—659 Female — 12 4 11 Total — 18 9 20

Gwent Male — 9 27 37 Female — 11 23 34 Total — 20 50 71

North Wales Male 1 20 41 29 Female — 38 42 34 Total 1 58 83 63

South Wales Male — 70 67 28 Female — 53 50 25 Total — 123 117 53

England and Wales Male 62 1,006 1,695 2,006 Female 51 1,052 1,500 1,577 Total 113 2,058 3,195 3,583 1 This PND offence was added to the scheme on 1 November 2004. 127W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 128W

Greg Mulholland: To ask the Secretary of State for The agency has in place in the draft Immigration Bill, the Home Department how many people under the age currently under pre-legislative scrutiny, provisions for of 18 years have been arrested for alcohol-related acts the laying of regulations specifying retention periods. of disorder or violence in each of the last five years. The agency is formulating a retention policy that will be [300352] both mindful of the need to protect people’s privacy under Article 8 of the ECHR while at the same time Mr. Alan Campbell [holding answer 23 November ensure that immigration officers have the necessary 2009]: The information requested on arrests is not tools and powers in which to fulfil their jobs. This collected centrally. policy will be subject to public consultation with various The arrests collection held by the Home Office covers interested groups including the Information Commissioner’s arrests for recorded crime (notifiable offences) only, Office. broken down at a main offence group level, covering I should like to emphasise however that the UKBA categories such as violence against the person and robbery. overwhelmingly uses fingerprints, which is less intrusive, It is not possible to identify the number of arrests made rather than DNA for the purpose of immigration control. for alcohol related acts of disorder or violence from the Where DNA is used, it is done so only on a voluntary data on arrests reported to the Home Office. basis. Immigration: Polygamy Closed Circuit Television: Regulation Patrick Mercer: To ask the Secretary of State for the Mr. Swayne: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department with reference to the answer to Home Department what recent consideration he has Lord Pearson of Rannoch of 21 July 2009, Official given to the establishment of a TV Regulator in respect Report, House of Lords, columns 301-02WA, on of the use of closed circuit television to monitor public polygamy, whether officials in his Department have space; and if he will make a statement. [300267] now determined whether changes to the UK Border Agency’s entry clearance guidance are required in the Mr. Alan Campbell [holding answer 23 November context of polygamous marriages. [300989] 2009]: A review of the recommendations of the Mr. Woolas: I have amended the current entry clearance National CCTV Strategy, including those concerning guidance (SET 14.8) to read that any case where there is the regulatory framework, is currently under way. We evidence to suspect a divorce of convenience should be recognise the important role that CCTV plays in preventing referred to entry clearance support team for consideration and detecting crime and in raising public confidence. and advice. We will announce the outcome of the review to the House. Immobilisation of Vehicles

Crime: Milton Keynes Patrick Mercer: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether any documents issued by the Security Industry Authority indicate that it is Mr. Lancaster: To ask the Secretary of State for the permitted for a licensed clamper to place a clamp on a Home Department how many crimes of each type were vehicle displaying a disabled badge. [301023] committed by young people aged (a) under 16 and (b) between 16 and 18 years in the Milton Keynes local Mr. Alan Campbell: Regulation 6 (2)(a) of the Private authority area in each of the last five years. [300718] Security Industry Act 2001 (Licences) Regulations 2007, states that Mr. Alan Campbell: The information requested is not “the licensee shall not immobilise, remove or restrict a vehicle collected centrally. From the recorded crime statistics in accordance with paragraph 3 or 3A of Schedule 2 to the collected by the Home Office it is not possible to 2001 Act if the vehicle is an invalid carriage or if a valid identify the age of the alleged offender. disability badge is displayed on the vehicle or if the vehicle is an emergency vehicle which is in use”. DNA: Databases This is made clear on page 19 of the Security Industry Authority’s (SIA) publication, “Get Licensed”. This Patrick Mercer: To ask the Secretary of State for the states that, Home Department whether the judgement of the “when carrying out front line vehicle immobilisation duties the European Court of Human Rights in S. and Marper v. following conditions must be followed. A vehicle must not be clamped/blocked/towed if: the United Kingdom has been implemented in relation a valid disabled badge is displayed on the vehicle; to the functions of the UK Border Agency. [300239] it is an emergency service vehicle which is in use as such.” Mr. Woolas: The UK Border Agency is mindful of its This document is available on the SIA’s website at: obligation to ensure that its operations are compatible http://sia.homeoffice.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres/725E43BE-2163- with the European Convention of Human Rights. The 4E85-9151-6EAB15990BC1/0/sia_get_licensed.pdf case of S. and Marper found that Article 8 (right to Police: Newark privacy) was infringed by the collection and retention of DNA from those individuals arrested but later acquitted. Patrick Mercer: To ask the Secretary of State for the The Home Office conducted a public consultation exercise Home Department how many police officers there were from May to August 2009 and the Home Secretary in Newark constituency in (a) 1997 and (b) 2009; and made a written statement announcing the Government’s how many police community support officers there response to the judgement on 11 November 2009, Official were in the constituency in (i) 2002 and (ii) 2009. Report, column 25WS. [301003] 129W Written Answers24 NOVEMBER 2009 Written Answers 130W

Mr. Hanson: Police personnel statistics are not collected UK Border Agency helpline has received in the last by parliamentary constituency. Newark constituency is 12-months. [300368] within the Nottinghamshire police force area. There were 2,323 police officers in Nottinghamshire Mr. Woolas [holding answer 23 November 2009]: The constabulary as at 31 March 1997 and 2,380 police UK Border Agency has three principal call centres. For officers as at 31 March 2009. the period October 2008 to September 2009 they received Police community support officers were not introduced 4,888,923 calls. This is broken down as follows: until 2002-03. There were 243 police community support officers in Nottinghamshire constabulary as at 31 March Call centre Calls received 2009. Sheffield 889,944 This and other related data are published annually as Liverpool 1,574,226 part of the annual Police Service Strength Home Office IEB 2,424,753 Statistical Bulletin. The latest bulletin can be found at: Total 4,888,923 http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/policeorg1.html and bulletins for this and previous years are deposited Julia Goldsworthy: To ask the Secretary of State for in the Library of the House. the Home Department for what period of time the UK UK Border Agency Border Agency helpline has been out of order in the last 12 months; and what estimate has been made of Patrick Mercer: To ask the Secretary of State for the the number of calls that were not answered as a result Home Department how many telephone calls the UK of such unavailability. [300369] Border Agency helpline has received in the last 12 months. [300991] Mr. Woolas [holding answer 23 November 2009]: For the period October 2008 to September 2009 the call Mr. Woolas: The UK Border Agency has three principal centres have not had to close down due to system UK call centres. For the period October 2008 to September unavailability. 2009 they received 4,888,923 calls. This is broken down as follows: Patrick Mercer: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department for what periods the UK Border Call centre Calls received Agency helpline has been out of service in the last Sheffield 889,944 12 months; and what estimate he has made of the Liverpool 1,574,226 number of calls that were not answered as a result of IEB 2,424,753 such unavailability. [300980] Total 4,888,923 Mr. Woolas: For the period October 2008 to September Julia Goldsworthy: To ask the Secretary of State for 2009 the call centres have not had to close down due to the Home Department how many telephone calls the system unavailability. ORAL ANSWERS

Tuesday 24 November 2009

Col. No. Col. No. HEALTH...... 381 HEALTH—continued Alternative Medicine (Regulation) ...... 391 NHS Dentistry...... 384 Capital Funding (Hospital Trusts) ...... 390 NHS Governance...... 389 Equitable Life (Bexhill and Battle) ...... 504 Parking Charges (Offsetting)...... 386 Health Visitors (Greater London)...... 394 Smoking Cessation...... 387 Human Trafficking ...... 385 Social Care Reform...... 388 Independent Sector Treatment ...... 393 Topical Questions ...... 395 Mental Health Services ...... 392 Working Time Directive...... 393 NHS Constitution...... 381 Working Time Directive...... 395 WRITTEN MINISTERIAL STATEMENTS

Tuesday 24 November 2009

Col. No. Col. No. BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS...... 27WS INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT...... 61WS Chief Construction Adviser ...... 27WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 63WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 27WS Sri Lanka ...... 61WS

CABINET OFFICE...... 34WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 34WS JUSTICE...... 64WS Archival Services...... 70WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 64WS CHILDREN, SCHOOLS AND FAMILIES ...... 36WS Edited Electoral Register ...... 67WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 36WS Political Parties and Elections Act 2009 (Commencement)...... 68WS COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT . 38WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10)...... 38WS Gypsy and Traveller Caravan Count 2009...... 44WS NORTHERN IRELAND ...... 71WS Zero Carbon Standards (New Buildings) ...... 42WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 71WS

CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT ...... 44WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 44WS SCOTLAND...... 71WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 71WS

DEFENCE...... 45WS Departmental Expenditure (2009-10)...... 45WS SOLICITOR-GENERAL...... 72WS Supplementary Estimate (2009-10)...... 46WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 72WS

ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE ...... 47WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 47WS TRANSPORT ...... 73WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 73WS Essex Thameside and InterCity East Coast ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL Franchise ...... 73WS AFFAIRS...... 48WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 48WS (Ofwat): Capital End of Year Flexibility Draw Down...... 49WS TREASURY ...... 31WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 31WS H M Revenue and Customs DEL (2009-10)...... 32WS FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE..... 50WS National Savings and Investments DEL (2009-10) . 33WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 50WS General Affairs and External Relations Council .... 51WS Sanctions Regimes ...... 50WS WALES...... 74WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 74WS HEALTH...... 56WS Framework Powers Explanatory Memorandum .... 75WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 56WS Employment, Social Policy, Health and Consumer Affairs Council ...... 56WS WOMEN AND EQUALITY ...... 75WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 75WS HOME DEPARTMENT...... 57WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 60WS Resident Labour Market Test...... 58WS WORK AND PENSIONS ...... 76WS Violence Against Women ...... 57WS Departmental Expenditure Limit (2009-10) ...... 76WS WRITTEN ANSWERS

Tuesday 24 November 2009

Col. No. Col. No. BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS...... 74W ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE ...... 78W Bankruptcy: Hampshire...... 74W Carbon Emissions: Buildings ...... 78W Climate Change ...... 73W Christmas...... 78W Furs: Imports...... 75W Community Energy Savings Programme...... 79W Insolvency: Fees and Charges ...... 75W Departmental Assets...... 79W Students: Finance ...... 75W Departmental Food...... 79W Students: Loans ...... 76W Departmental Pay ...... 80W Telephone Services...... 76W Departmental Rail Travel...... 80W Unemployment: Young People...... 77W Energy: Mobile Homes ...... 80W Housing: Insulation ...... 81W CHILDREN, SCHOOLS AND FAMILIES...... 93W Renewable Energy...... 82W Academies...... 93W Warm Homes and Energy Conservation Act 2000 . 83W Building Schools for the Future Programme ...... 93W Departmental Air Travel ...... 95W FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE..... 55W Education: Assessments ...... 95W Departmental Official Cars...... 55W Family Courts: Guardians ...... 96W Family Intervention Projects ...... 97W HEALTH...... 102W GCSE ...... 97W Abortion ...... 105W National Curriculum Tests: Contracts ...... 97W Ambulance Services: Hornsey...... 105W Primary Education: Lancashire...... 98W Ambulance Services: Standards ...... 105W Sure Start Programme...... 98W Arthritis ...... 106W Teachers: Training...... 99W Cancer: Mentally Ill ...... 106W Teenage Pregnancy...... 99W Carbon Monoxide: Poisoning ...... 106W Truancy: Fines ...... 99W Care Provision ...... 104W United Church Schools Trust...... 100W Chronic Fatigue Syndrome: Research ...... 107W Community Hospitals...... 103W COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT . 64W Dementia: In-patients ...... 102W Christmas...... 64W Dementia: Research ...... 107W Climate Change: Conferences...... 65W Health: Screening...... 107W Departmental Conferences ...... 65W Health Warnings: Super-strength Lager...... 102W Departmental Consultants...... 65W Hip Replacements: Research...... 108W Departmental Disclosure of Information ...... 66W Hospital Beds: Scarborough and North East Departmental Official Cars ...... 66W Yorkshire NHS Trust ...... 108W Departmental Official Hospitality ...... 66W Hospital-acquired Infections...... 103W Departmental Official Visits ...... 66W Hull and East Yorkshire Hospitals NHS Trust: Departmental Recycling ...... 67W Publications ...... 108W Departmental Travel ...... 67W Incinerators...... 104W Food: Procurement ...... 68W Learning Disability: Cancer ...... 108W Homes and Communities Agency ...... 64W Learning Disability: Prostate Cancer ...... 109W Homes and Communities Agency ...... 68W Mental Health Services ...... 109W Homes and Communities Agency: Manpower ...... 73W Musculoskeletal Disorders: Primary Care Trusts ... 110W Homes and Communities Agency: Marketing...... 73W NHS Dentistry...... 103W Rent to HomeBuy Scheme...... 64W NHS: Pensions...... 110W Tenant Services Authority ...... 73W Organ Donation Education...... 104W Patients: Transport...... 110W CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT ...... 48W Pharmacy...... 111W Departmental Conditions of Employment...... 48W Sickle Cell Disease: Pain ...... 111W Departmental Food...... 48W Social Care Reform...... 103W Departmental Legal Costs ...... 49W Social Services: Sight Impaired ...... 111W Departmental Official Cars...... 49W Tuberculosis...... 105W Departmental Rail Travel...... 49W Departmental Recruitment ...... 49W Licensing...... 50W HOME DEPARTMENT ...... 112W Alcoholic Drinks: Young People ...... 112W DEFENCE...... 51W Closed Circuit Television: Regulation ...... 127W Armed Forces: Cadets...... 51W Crime: Milton Keynes...... 127W Armed Forces: Pay...... 51W DNA: Databases...... 127W Armed Forces: Recruitment ...... 52W Immigration: Polygamy...... 128W Armed Forces: Waste Disposal ...... 53W Immobilisation of Vehicles...... 128W Armoured Fighting Vehicles ...... 53W Police: Newark...... 128W Defence Estates: Sales ...... 54W UK Border Agency ...... 129W Departmental Assets...... 54W Nuclear Submarines: Decommissioning...... 54W HOUSE OF COMMONS COMMISSION ...... 47W Territorial Army: Finance...... 54W Members: Allowances...... 47W

ELECTORAL COMMISSION COMMITTEE ...... 47W INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT...... 55W Elections ...... 47W Departmental Manpower...... 55W Col. No. Col. No. INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT—continued TRANSPORT—continued Latin America: Overseas Aid ...... 55W Railway Network: Finance...... 61W Overseas Aid...... 56W Railways: Closures ...... 62W Sri Lanka: Internally Displaced Persons ...... 56W Railways: Finance ...... 62W Rolling Stock ...... 62W JUSTICE...... 83W Rolling Stock: Procurement ...... 63W Climate Change ...... 83W Thameslink: Rolling Stock...... 63W Drugs: Crime ...... 84W European Convention on Human Rights...... 83W TREASURY ...... 100W Offenders: Drugs and Mentally Ill ...... 84W EU Budget ...... 100W Office for Criminal Justice Reform: Finance ...... 84W European Investment Bank...... 101W Prisoners Release ...... 85W Israel: EU External Trade ...... 101W Young People: Crime Prevention ...... 85W Non-Domestic Rates: Parking ...... 101W Young People: Finance ...... 86W Research: Finance...... 102W Tax Allowances: Professional Organisations ...... 102W NORTHERN IRELAND ...... 78W Departmental Rail Travel...... 78W WALES...... 50W Departmental Disclosure of Information...... 50W TRANSPORT ...... 58W Departmental Official Cars...... 50W A5: M1 ...... 58W Departmental Taxis ...... 50W Bus Services: South East ...... 58W WOMEN AND EQUALITY...... 56W Departmental Pay ...... 58W Climate Change ...... 56W Departmental Rail Travel...... 59W Departmental Hotels ...... 57W Electric Vehicles: Milton Keynes...... 59W Departmental Official Cars...... 57W Helicopters: Accidents ...... 59W Departmental Pay ...... 57W Integrated Transport Smartcard Organisation: Departmental Training ...... 57W Finance...... 60W Departmental Working Hours ...... 57W M6: Walsall...... 60W Motor Vehicles: Safety...... 61W WORK AND PENSIONS ...... 77W Public Transport: South East ...... 61W Jobcentres: Domestic Visits ...... 77W Members who wish to have the Daily Report of the Debates forwarded to them should give notice at the Vote Office. The Bound Volumes will also be sent to Members who similarly express their desire to have them. No proofs of the Daily Reports can be supplied, nor can corrections be made in the Weekly Edition. Corrections which Members suggest for the Bound Volume should be clearly marked in the Daily Report, but not telephoned, and the copy containing the Corrections must be received at the Editor’s Room, House of Commons,

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CONTENTS

Tuesday 24 November 2009

Oral Answers to Questions [Col. 381] [see index inside back page] Secretary of State for Health

Debate on the Address (Fourth Day) [Col. 405] Debate adjourned

Petition [Col. 504]

King George Hospital (Ilford) [Col. 506] Debate on motion for Adjournment

Written Ministerial Statements [Col. 27WS]

Written Answers to Questions [Col. 47W] [see index inside back page]