Indija – Lietuva

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Indija – Lietuva Lietuva – Indija – Lietuva Liudviko GIEDRAIČIO interviu su Vilniaus universiteto Orientalistikos centro direktoriumi, indologijos ir budizmo studijų profesoriumi Audriumi BEINORIUMI Esat gal skvarbiausias Indijos žinovas Lietuvoje. Šiuo priešinga. Indiją laikau savo antraisiais namais, išties interviu rūpėtų paieškoti, ką tos milžiniškos šalies dvasi- daug laiko ten praleidžiu, bet kaskart vis labiau jau- nių įžvalgų, išminties klodai, tūkstantmečių istorijos pa- čiuosi lietuvis… Yra tokia labai prasminga (nuolat ją tirtis galėtų pasiūlyti pasimokyti ir Lietuvai, jos ateičiai, turiu omeny) dialogo filosofijos pradininko M.Buberio gyvastingumui. užrašyta Lenkijos chasidų sakmė apie rabiną Aizeką, Manyčiau, galimas toks pragmatiškas pasirinkimas. skurdžiai gyvenusį Krokuvos gete. Buvo labai dievo- Po Nepriklausomybės atkūrimo mūsų žmonių traukos baimingas. Sapne jam Dievas pasako, kad Prahoje po į tą šalį tikslai yra įvairiopi. Nemaža dalis lietuvių į Indi- Karališkuoju tiltu pakastas lobis, važiuok ir išsikask. ją važiuoja ieškodami naujumo, neatrastumo virpulio Aizekas tik numoja ranka, bet po kelių dienų ir vėl jam (Vakarų Europos kultūroje jaučiamės savi, pažįstantys). tas sapnas. Trečią kartą tą patį susapnavęs, nuspren- Kita nemenka dalis – turintys dvasinio ieškojimo pas- dė, kad reikia keliauti. Patraukia pėsčias iš Krokuvos katų, žmonės, važiuojantys į konkrečias religines ben- į Prahą. Suranda tą tiltą, koloną, po kuria turėtų būti druomenes – ašramas, hindų, jogų centrus. Jiems rūpi pakastas lobis, bet tiltą saugo čekų gvardiečiai. Aize- konkrečios religinės praktikos. Tokių, mano žiniomis, kas ateina čia kasdien, bandydamas išsitirt, kaip prisi- dauguma. Yra keliaujančiųjų ekonominiais, studijų ar taikius kast. Aizeką pamato sargybos kapitonas, ima jį darbo tikslais (tarp tokių aš). Tai įvairių mokslo sričių ir klausinėt, ko čia ateinąs, ką norįs veikti. Aizekas mato, orientalistikos studentai, dėstytojai, specialistai… kad tas gvardietis draugiškas, geranoriškas, jam atvi- Ar galima būtų sakyti, kad tos žmonių slinktys jau turi rai ir sako: Dievas sapne man liepė keliaut prie šio til- bent kiek apčiuopiamą įtaką Lietuvos kultūrai, kaitai? to, nes čia yra pakastas lobis. Kapitonas nusijuokė: ar Kaip minėjau, bene daugumos keliaujančiųjų į In- galima tikėti sapnais! Jeigu aš tikėčiau jais, tai turėčiau diją tikslai susiję su pasaulėvaizdžio, patirčių paieš- daryti visiškai priešingai. Kelis kartus sapnavau, kaip komis. Tai – nusivylusieji vakarietiškuoju skepticizmu, Dievas man liepia keliaut kažkur į Lenkiją, Krokuvos pesimizmu, nihilizmu, materializmu, vartotojiškumu, miestą, kur niekad nebuvęs, susirast kažkokį rabiną Ai- nerandantys atsparos krikščioniškoje praktikoje, pa- zeką, jo name po krosnimi yra lobis! Negi aš būsiu toks saulėžiūroje. Jie Indijoje jogos centruose medituoja, kvailas ir keliausiu į tą Krokuvą, ieškosiu kažkokio Ai- perima įvairias praktikos formas, grįžę kuria indiškus zeko, kaip jį surasčiau… Aizekas, viską supratęs, padė- religinius centrus, dalyvauja jų veikloje. Kaip tokie koja ir – namo. Išsiima lobį, už kurį pastato sinagogą… žmonės keičia aplinkinių santykį su Lietuva – nesiryž- Idėja tokia: norint atrasti lobį, kuris yra mūsų namuo- čiau apibendrinti, nes žmonės labai skirtingi. Vieni, są- se, metaforiškai suvokiant – židinyje, krosnyje, sakra- moningai ar ne, siekia persiimti nauja religine pasaulė- liausioje vietoje, kartais reikia atlikti tolimą, sunkią pi- žiūra, nors puikiai žinoma, kad hindu gali tik gimti, o ne ligriminę kelionę į kitą šalį, kitą kultūrą, kad suvoktum, tapti. Nuvažiavus į Indiją, ten kiek pagyvenus, manau, jog lobis slypi tavo namuose, tavo kultūroje. Indijos neįmanoma įsigyventi į religinius simbolinius kodus, tradicija, kultūrinis kitoniškumas, papročiai, gyven- prasmes, adekvačiai priimti bendravimo elementus. sena, socialinė sąranga tampa savotišku veidrodžiu, Jautiesi vis tiek kitos kultūros žmogumi. Ne kartą esu kuris padeda mums geriau pažinti, atspindėti save. girdėjęs nuogąstavimų, kad važinėdamas po Indiją, Jos tautų, kalbų, kultūrų, papročių, religijų, kasdienio studijuodamas, dėstydamas ten, prarasiu savo kultū- gyvenimo ypatumų pynė, įvairovė neišvengiamai tarsi rinę, tautinę tapatybę, tačiau mano asmeninė patirtis užaštrina klausimą – o kas aš esu, kas yra mano, kas 1 mes, mūsų kultūrinė, religinė pasaulėžiūrinė tapatybė, šeimos, kokia pagarba vyresniesiems, koks gilus ryšys kiek pajėgiam remtis savu kultūriniu paveldu, tradicija su kultūrine tradicija, akivaizdu, kad yra iš ko moky- (krikščionybės su baltiškuoju klodu nesupriešinu), ko- tis. Indija – ypatingo kultūrinio kitoniškumo regionas. kios grėsmės mūsų tapatybei, kas tyko šiuolaikinėje Nuvažiavę ten, daug kas patiria net kultūrinį šoką. Tai eurointegracijoje, kapitalistinėje vartotojiškoje visuo- juo labiau verčia klausti: „O kas gi aš esu?“ Pasak C. G. menėje… Jungo, Indija pirmiausia moko gręžtis į save patį, savo Bet Lietuvoje beveik visi „žino“: su Indija nuo seno- esmę, savo tikrojo „aš“ paieškas. Jungas teigia, jog vės esam labai „artimi“, net žodžių tapačių daug turim: Indija reprezentuoja kitokį žmogaus civilizavimo būdą „avis, šuva, svapnas, dhumas“… – be užspaudimo, be prievartos, be perdėto raciona- Lietuvoje dar tvyro romantiškas santykis su Indija. lizmo. „Didžiausio dvasingumo pavidale jūs įžvelgiate Mes manom, kad indai šneka beveik lietuviškai. Sans- gyvo autentiškumo pėdsakus, o neišsilavinusio, pusiau kritas mus tarytum vienija. Ieškoma bendrų indoeuro- nuogo kaimiečio melancholiškose akyse jus regite slė- pietiškų sąsajų. Taip – nuo XIX a. vidurio, nuo J. Basana- piningų tiesų pažinimą.“ Gyvenimas Indijoje dar nesusi- vičiaus, Vydūno, V. Krėvės… Senojo tikėjimo išpažinėjai traukė į galvos kapsulę, kurioje lokalizuojamas šiuolaiki- siekia susipažinti su indų archajine religine praktika, nių Vakariečių sąmoningumas. „Jie vis dar gyvena visu mitologija, pasaulėžiūra, dievų vardais. Juk Indija du kūnu, nekeista, kad vakarietis čia jaučiasi it sapne, nes tūkstančius metų atsilaikė prieš gana agresyvią krikš- visavertis gyvenimas Indijoje yra kažkas, apie ką galima čionizaciją, išsaugojo tapatybę, tradicijos gyvastingu- tik sapnuoti“. Tai iš esmės ir yra Indijos bene didžiausias mą visais pavidalais, tarp kurių ir archajiškasis klodas, įnašas į viso pasaulio kultūros lobyną. Turimos omeny vedų religinis lygmuo, kurio reikšmę išties sunku neigti, per daugelį tūkstančių metų suformuotos sąmonės la- bandant rekonstruoti baltiškojo apeigyno elementus. vybos formos, jogos meditacinės pratybos. Visa tai da- Esu dalyvavęs vediškose Ugnies apeigose Agnihomoje. bar adaptuojama ir Vakarų kultūroje… Mes turim vie- Žyniai jas atlikinėjo penkias paras, nepaliaujamai gie- ną žodį – protas. Sanskrite yra 40 žodžių, kurie nusako dojo vedų himnus, atnašavo Ugniai… Sunku suvokti įvairius proto lygmenis. Ir tai nėra sinonimai. Vien kalba veiksmų prasmę, bet sielą apėmęs virpuliukas gal buvo liudija, koks milžiniškas šioje srityje įdirbis. Kai verčiau į susijęs ir su tuo, kad liečiami labai gilūs, archetipiniai są- lietuvių kalbą „Jogos sutrą“, net Didžiojo lietuvių kal- monės klodai, ataidintys, matyt, ir iš senosios baltų kul- bos žodyno pagalba buvo bejėgė: mūsų tautos lingvis- tūros, mumyse glūdinčio sunkiai verbalizuojamo, tačiau tinis lobynas neatskleidžia, kad būtume turėję milži- psichės gelmėje dar gyvo paveldo. Krikščionybės ant­ nišką įdirbį, susijusį su žmogaus sąmonės gelmių kon- sluoksnis dar nėra labai giliai užklojęs mūsų baltiškosios templiatyviu pažinimu. Bet dirbant su indų estetikos, pasaulėjautos klodus. Penkias apeigų dienas smelkte dramos tekstais, kuriuose kalbama apie įvairias emoci- smelkė pojūtis, kad buvau nublokštas ne tiek į Indijos nes būsenas, išties atsiskleidžia, pasimato lietuvių kal- praeitį, kiek į savąją, jungiškai pasakyčiau, kolektyvinę bos turtingumas. Baltų senosios religijos sekėjai teigia, pasąmonę, suvoktą ne tiek iš religinių veiksmų, apeigų, kad esam turėję stiprų žynių, mūsų senosios kultūros vaizdinių, bet iš etnogenetinės gilumos, iš išgyvenimų. išmanytojų luomą, saugojusį sakralų pažinimą, kurį kry- Taigi ko mus moko Indija? žiuočiai esą sunaikino. Tuo visada suabejoju, nes kalba Dar XIX a. viduryje religijotyros tėvas Maksas Mü­ visa tai būtų išsaugojusi savąja struktūra, niuansuotom lleris parašė knygą „Ko Indija mus gali išmokyti“. Po reikšmėm. Kai kalbama apie žmogaus sąmonę, sielą, pusšimčio metų archetipinės psichologijos tėvas Carlas reikšmių, sąvokų paletės lietuvių ir sanskrito kalbose Gustavas Jungas vėl tokiu pat pavadinimu parašė stu- skirtumas labai didelis. Antra vertus, tautosakoje, mito- diją… Šių ir daugelio kitų mokslininkų nuomone, Indija logijoje esame išsaugoję itin archajiškus kalbos klodus. gali išmokyti pirmiausia religinės tolerancijos, žmogaus Kai indams sakau, kad Lietuvos bažnyčiose kreipiamasi esmės suvokimo, sąmonės gelmės pažinimo, savaran- „O Viešpatie Dieve“, jie pasijunta net priblokšti: kodėl kiškumo, dvasinio stabilumo. Kad ir kurią žmogaus kažkur šiaurėj gyvenanti postsovietinė tautelė sanskri- pažinimo sritį paimtume, ar tai būtų kalba, religija, fi- tiškai kreipiasi į hindų Dievą ir save vadina krikščionimis! losofija, teisė, menas, ar tradiciniai mokslai, – verta ke- Mat sanskritu tai skamba „O višpati deva“. Kalba išties liauti į Indiją, kurioje ligi šiol saugomi ir gyva tradicijos didžiausias mūsų turtas. perdava puoselėjami vertingiausi žmonijos patirties ir Esat Vilniaus universiteto Orientalistikos centro va- pažinimo lobiai. Mülleris sakė, jog Indija moko pažvelg- dovas, skaitote paskaitas,
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