272 NAW 5/18 nr. 4 december 2017 Interview with Simon Singh Julia Kuhn

Julia Kuhn Korteweg-de Vries Instituut Universiteit van Amsterdam [email protected]

Interview Simon Singh It would be great if politicians understood what science is

Simon Singh is a British science writer and author of the bestseller Fermat’s Last Theorem. draw some young readers towards maths Julia Kuhn and Sonja Cox met him in May at the Amsterdam Science Park, where he had that have not discovered their passion for just presented his book The Simpsons and Their Mathematical Secrets. it yet. On his website (simonsingh.net), he provides powerpoint slides for maths When Simon Singh proposed the idea of a point. If you know who Mandelbrot is, here teachers who may wish to use them in book about The Simpsons and mathemat- is one for you: class. ics, the response was one of shock and Indeed, it is easy to imagine how the Question: What does the B stand for in surprise. However, as Singh explains, many book could be used as an inspiration to Benoit B Mandelbrot? of the writers of the popular TV show are design an entertaining maths lecture. And Answer: Benoit B Mandelbrot. deeply fond of mathematics, some have it is a book Singh must certainly have en- advanced maths degrees. To keep them- Singh hopes that due to the connection to joyed writing: “My wife was also writing selves entertained, they hide references to the famous TV show, his book is able to a book at the same time, spending hours mathematics in The Simpsons episodes to and hours each day at the library doing see whether their audience would pick up her research. When she came home in the on them. evening, I’d still be doing my research lying Evidently, Singh was one of those view- on the couch watching The Simpsons.” ers who did. He draws our attention to Singh seems to enjoy telling such little many little hints to mathematical formu- anecdotes. Interviewing him is easy; it is las that my colleague and I had missed in evident that he is a great communicator. spite of being mathematicians and having After having completed a PhD in particle watched a non-negligible number of Simp- physics, he decided he would use that sons episodes. In his book, Singh uses communication skill for the promotion these references to take his reader on a of science and took on a job at the BBC fun and informative journey from Euler’s science department. equation via perfect numbers to the un- During his time at the British broadcast- solved problem of P versus NP and many er, Singh directed the emotionally captur- other topics from number theory and other ing documentary Fermat’s Last Theorem, areas of maths. My personal favourite are which won a BAFTA award for Best Doc- the ‘tests’ he provides at the end of each umentary in 1997. But Singh saw more chapter: a series of mathematical jokes to the story: “A picture is worth a thou- that the reader can use to test her under- sand words as we know, but still, there standing of the subject that has been ex- was just so much that we had to leave plained in the chapter. For each joke she out. This was the last thing I did for the can laugh about, she may give herself a Simon Singh BBC. I could have done this job forever, Julia Kuhn Interview with Simon Singh NAW 5/18 nr. 4 december 2017 273

but I was interested in trying something passed every test, we want people who are Society focusses most of its scepticism on else.” good because they have been thoroughly alternative medicine. When asked how this He decided to write a book about the challenged.” particular subject had caught his interest, subject. “I just thought it would be an in- People with the potential to become Singh tells us about a program he had teresting exercise. I suppose I learned how good scientists are an increasingly pre- watched on the BBC. “The presenter was a to write from TV, which needs drama and cious resource. “Science is important for professor, backed by the Open University, clarity. I started writing the book the same society”, Singh explains. “For a very long so I thought it should be very scientific, way I would start writing a TV program. The time, politicians did whatever they wanted very credible.” The show talked about a publisher seemed to think it would be OK.” to do according to ideology. They would woman undergoing major heart surgery in Fermat’s Last Theorem — in The Nether- tell scientists: ‘Go find me the evidence China that was carried out without a gen- lands published by De Arbeiderspers — that proves that I’m right.’ In the UK over eral anaesthetic, only using acupuncture. turned out to be a big success. “I thought the last twenty years this has changed in This could have changed the history of it would be great if the book would get a positive way. Now every department has medicine, had it been true. But the story into the science top 10. And then it got into its own chief scientist. And the government as presented was misleading: as a report the UK top 10, and then it reached No. 1, is slowly moving towards evidence-based of the Royal College of Anaesthetists point- and then it got translated, by now in thirty policy.’’ ed out afterwards, the woman in surgery languages. It’s amazing!’’ Never before had While he acknowledges this develop- may not have had a general anaesthetic, a book about maths made it to the top of ment, Singh also emphasises that there is but she had received so many sedatives the UK bestseller list. still a long way to go. “Sometimes people that she did not need it. Singh complained By now Singh has published seven misunderstand what ‘evidence-based pol- to the BBC, and eventually the broadcaster books in which he covers a range of top- icy’ means. They think it means that the admitted to having made a mistake. ics from different areas of science, mak- scientist tells the politician what to do but Together with Edzard Ernst, a professor ing them accessible to a broad audience. it is not that at all.” The scientist provides of complementary medicine, Singh decided He hopes to engage, to push more young the evidence but it is up to the politicians to investigate available evidence for the people to pursue a scientific career. And is effectiveness of alternative medicine. The maths becoming sexier? Singh thinks that, book Trick or Treatment? Alternative Med- luckily, it is. He praises free online resourc- “We don’t need people who icine on Trial is the compilation of their es such as XKCD, Assassin, Morning Break- think they are good because conclusions. “All my other books were pro- fast Cereal, and Numberphile that have they passed every test, moting science,” says Singh, “but this was helped this development. Recent movies we want people who are about the other side, challenging the ‘bad he has seen with his sons (he mentions Mr. good because they have been stuff’. We tried to be as fair as possible. We Peabody and Sherman, Big Hero 6, Cloudy thoroughly challenged.” just thought a parent spending € 100 a year with a Chance of Meatballs, Queen of on alternative medicine should invest € 10 Katwe) teach children that nerds are cool. in this book to find out what works and The problem is not to lose those kids to act upon it. And, of course, many oth- what doesn’t. However, it turned out to be along the way. “In England,” Singh ex- er considerations are important apart from my least successful book.” plains, “if you are good at maths, you the scientific facts. “It would be great if Worse still, it is a book that brought don’t get stretched at school, it’s just easy. politicians understood what science is, Singh an enormous amount of stress and You get really confident, you get excellent what it does and what it can provide for trauma, mainly due to a related column grades but you never get challenged.” He society.” he wrote in April 2008 for The Guardian in tells us about a school experiment car- The day before our interview, Singh tells which he accused the British Chiropractic ried out in the UK: Instead of calling upon us, he heard a radio show about the late Association of ‘happily promoting bogus those pupils that raised their hand to an- David MacKay, author of the book Sustain- treatment’. The chiropractors sued for li- swer the teacher’s questions, the pupils’ able Energy – Without the Hot Air. “Some- bel. It took two years, a second ruling and names were drawn at random from a bowl. body said to MacKay, ‘you are pro nuclear’, cost more than € 100,000 in defence costs “Interestingly, it was the really bright stu- and he answered, ‘I’m not pro nuclear, I’m before he was cleared on the grounds that dents who started skipping class because pro maths, and that’s it. It’s about the his statements were to be treated as ‘fair for the first time they were risking to get numbers and this is what the numbers say, comment’. questions they would not know the an- you can’t argue with them’.” Singh seems The scientific community rallied and swer to. It was embarrassing for them be- to agree. Real science is not a matter of supported Singh, calling for a reform of cause they had defined themselves as the opinion. the English libel law which they felt was ones who get it right.” Singh envisions a The battle against pseudo-science and stifling scientific debate. In the aftermath top-of-the-top group in which exceptionally quackery has taken up much of Singh’s of the case the ‘Defamation Act 2013’ be- bright students can learn to feel comfort- time in recent years. In 2012 he founded came law, which includes the defence of able about being confused. In which they the Good Thinking Society, a non-profit or- ‘responsible publication on matters of learn that not having succeeded yet is not ganisation advocating scientific scepticism. public interest’ and a clause that is de- equal to failure. “We don’t need people Similar to the pioneering Dutch ‘Vereniging signed to protect free speech in academic who think they are good because they tegen de kwakzalverij’, the Good Thinking journals. s