DAILY

YOUR VOICE IN PARLIAMENT

THETHE SECOND FIRST MEETING MEETING OF THE O FSECOND THE FIFTH SESSION SESSION OF OF THETHE ELEVEN TWELFTHT HPARLIAMENT PARLIAMENT TUESDAY 17 NOVEMBER 2020

ENGLISHMIXED VERSION VERSION HANSARDHANSARD NO: NO. 200 193

DISCLAIMER Uno cial Hansard This transcript of Parliamentary proceedings is an uno cial version of the Hansard and may contain inaccuracies. It is hereby published for general purposes only. The nal edited version of the Hansard will be published when available and can be obtained from the Assistant Clerk (Editorial). THE NATIONAL ASSEMBLY SPEAKER The Hon. Phandu T. C. Skelemani PH, MP. DEPUTY SPEAKER The Hon. Mabuse M. Pule, MP. (Mochudi East)

Clerk of the National Assembly - Ms B. N. Dithapo Deputy Clerk of the National Assembly - Mr L. T. Gaolaolwe Learned Parliamentary Counsel - Ms M. Mokgosi Assistant Clerk (E) - Mr R. Josiah CABINET His Excellency Dr M. E. K. Masisi, MP. - President

His Honour S. Tsogwane, MP. (Boteti West) - Vice President Minister for Presidential Affairs, Governance and Public Hon. K. N. S. Morwaeng, MP. (Molepolole South) - Administration

Hon. K. T. Mmusi, MP. (Gabane-Mmankgodi) - Minister of Defence, Justice and Security Hon. Dr L. Kwape, MP. (Kanye South) - Minister of International Affairs and Cooperation Hon. E. M. Molale, MP. (Goodhope-Mabule ) - Minister of Local Government and Rural Development Hon. K. S. Gare, MP. (Moshupa-Manyana) - Minister of Agricultural Development and Food Security Minister of Environment, Natural Resources Conservation Hon. P. K. Kereng, MP. (Specially Elected) - and Tourism Hon. Dr E. G. Dikoloti MP. (Mmathethe-Molapowabojang) - Minister of Health and Wellness Hon. T.M. Segokgo, MP. (Tlokweng) - Minister of Transport and Communications Hon. K. Mzwinila, MP. (Specially Elected) - Minister of Land Management, Water and Sanitation Services Minister of Youth Empowerment, Sport and Culture Hon. T. M. Rakgare, MP. (Mogoditshane) - Development

Hon. A. M. Mokgethi, MP. (Gaborone Bonnington North) - Minister of Nationality, Immigration and Gender Affairs Hon. Dr T. Matsheka, MP. (Lobatse) - Minister of Finance and Economic Development Hon. F. M. M. Molao, MP. (Shashe West) - Minister of Basic Education Minister of Tertiary Education, Research, Science and Hon. Dr D. Letsholathebe, MP. (Tati East) - Technology Minister of Mineral Resources, Green Technology and Hon. L. M. Moagi, MP. (Ramotswa) - Energy Security

Hon. P. O. Serame, MP. (Specially Elected) - Minister of Investment, Trade and Industry Minister of Employment, Labour Productivity and Skills Hon. M. Balopi, MP. (Gaborone North) - Development

Hon. M. Kgafela, MP. (Mochudi West) - Minister of Infrastructure and Housing Development

Assistant Minister, Presidential Affairs, Governance and Hon. D. M. Mthimkhulu, MP. (Gaborone South) - Public Administration Assistant Minister, Local Government and Rural Hon. K. K. Autlwetse, MP. (Specially Elected) - Development Assistant Minister, Local Government and Rural Hon. S. N. Modukanele, MP. (Lerala -Maunatlala) - Development Assistant Minister, Agricultural Development and Food Hon. B. Manake, MP. (Specially Elected) - Security

Hon. S. Lelatisitswe, MP. (Boteti East) - Assistant Minister, Health and Wellness

Hon. N. W. T. Makwinja, MP. (Lentsweletau-Mmopane) - Assistant Minister, Basic Education

Hon. M. S. Molebatsi, MP. (Mmadinare) - Assistant Minister, Investment, Trade and Industry Assistant Minister, Youth Empowerment, Sport and Culture Hon. H. B. Billy, MP. (Francistown East) - Development Hon. M. R. Shamukuni, MP. (Chobe) - Assistant Minister,Tertiary Education, Research, Science and Technology MEMBERS OF PARLIAMENT AND THEIR CONSTITUENCIES

Names Constituency

RULING PARTY (Botswana Democratic Party) Hon. L. Kablay, MP. (Government Whip) Letlhakeng-Lephephe Hon. Dr U. Dow, MP. Specially Elected Hon. M. R. Reatile, MP. Jwaneng-Mabutsane Hon. P. Majaga, MP. Nata-Gweta Hon. J. S. Brooks, MP. Kgalagadi South Hon. C. Greeff, MP. Gaborone Bonnington South Hon. T. Letsholo, MP. Kanye North Hon. T. F. Leuwe, MP. Takatokwane Hon. T. Mangwegape-Healy, MP. Gaborone Central Hon. S. N. Moabi, MP. Tati West Hon. T. Monnakgotla, MP. Kgalagadi North Hon. P. K. Motaosane, MP. Thamaga-Kumakwane Hon. O. Regoeng, MP. Molepolole North Hon. J. L. Thiite, MP. Ghanzi North OPPOSITION (Umbrella for Democratic Change) Hon. D. Saleshando, MP. (Leader of the Opposition) Maun West Hon. A. Lesaso, MP. (Acting Opposition Whip) Shoshong Hon. D. L. Keorapetse, MP. Selebi Phikwe West Hon. Y. Boko, MP Mahalapye East Hon. Dr K. Gobotswang, MP. Sefhare-Ramokgonami Hon. C. K. Hikuama, MP. Ngami Hon. K. K. Kapinga, MP Okavango Hon. G. Kekgonegile, MP. Maun East Hon. P. P. P. Moatlhodi, MP. Tonota Hon. T. B. Lucas, MP. Bobonong Hon. M. G. J. Motsamai, MP. Ghanzi South Hon. K. Nkawana, MP. Selebi Phikwe East Hon. O. Ramogapi, MP. Palapye Hon. Dr N. Tshabang, MP. Nkange Hon. D. Tshere, MP. Mahalapye West Hon. M. I. Moswaane, MP. Francistown West (Botswana Patriotic Front) Hon. T. S. Khama, MP. Serowe West Hon. L. Lesedi, MP. Serowe South Hon. B. Mathoothe, MP. Serowe North (Alliance for Progressives) Hon. W. B. Mmolotsi, MP. Francistown South TABLE OF CONTENTS THE FIRST MEETING OF THE SECOND SESSION OF THE TWELFTH PARLIAMENT TUESDAY 17 NOVEMBER, 2020

CONTENTS PAGE (S)

QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER...... 19-25

SPEAKER’S REMARKS ...... 1

Response To The President’s Speech Motion (Resumed Debate)...... 1-18, 26-52

TABLING OF PAPER

Botswana Savings Bank Audited Financial Statements for Financial Year Ended 31st March, 2019...... 26

Tuesday 17th November, 2020 RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT’S SPEECH Motion (Resumed Debate)

Tuesday 17th November, 2020. than for you to tell me that, it cannot be right, when I want to say something. We cannot work like that, you THE ASSEMBLY met at 11:00 a.m. are the person who is in charge of…

(THE SPEAKER in the Chair) MR SPEAKER: Honourable Boko! If you do not want P R A Y E R S to say what your procedure is, sit down.

* * * * MR BOKO: Procedure. Thank you, now let me go to the procedure. Mr Speaker, you are the one who SPEAKER’S REMARKS leads the proceedings of this House, The President stated in his address that Parliament proceedings will MR SPEAKER (MR SKELEMANI): Order! Order! be broadcasted on Botswana television and radio Honourable Members, good morning. Let us start the Botswana. We are surprised Mr Speaker, it cannot be business of today with a Motion. a coincidence that sometimes when it is discovered MR MOSWAANE: Procedure. Mr Speaker, I wanted to that we are attacking Members of Domkrag (Botswana know whether it is procedural for the live broadcasting Democratic Party) or raising issues, those proceedings of Parliament proceedings to be selective? We did not are not broadcasted on television for Batswana to see, see the debates of our Members of Parliament namely yet they were promised that they will see the Parliament Honourable Reatile and Honourable Yandani Boko. I proceedings , it cannot be right. That is the untidiness do not know whether the television was having some that is done by the leaders. You Mr Speaker, are the technical problems or what? So I wanted to know one who leads the proceedings of this House, so you whether it is according to procedure for the proceedings should put things in order. I am not supposed to go to of some Honourable to be broadcasted on television your office to tell you in private that there is untidiness while others are not? Thank you. that happened on Botswana Television (BTV). I should tell you in the presence of other Members of Parliament MR SPEAKER: I have absolutely no knowledge of and then you decide what to do. That is the procedure I what you are talking about. wanted to talk about. Thank you.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Point of procedure Mr MR SPEAKER: Honourable Boko, I said I do not Speaker. know what you are talking about. What you should do is, if you think that what was agreed has not been done, MR SPEAKER: No. ask what has happened and not state as if you know for RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT’S a fact that somebody did something deliberately by not SPEECH doing what we had agreed. If you get information and you ask those responsible, then you are entitled to say Motion that cannot be a reasonable answer to what you saw. That is how it should be, procedurally. That is why I (Resumed Debate) said, I do not know what you are talking about, because HONOURABLE MEMBER: On a point of order Mr I have no facts. Speaker. LEADER OF THE OPPOSITION (MR MR SPEAKER: I said now you can come Honourable SALESHANDO): Procedure. Mr Speaker, yesterday Boko. in the evening I watched the broadcast of the Parliament proceeding on BTV after the 9’Oclock news, which is MR BOKO: Point of order. Mr Speaker, let me explain supposed to cover the proceedings from 4.30pm until this to you. I think maybe you should understand what we adjourn. It is true that the proceedings of those your responsibilities are as the Speaker in this House, not who took the floor at that time were not aired on TV that I undermine what you are doing. When a Member because I was here in Parliament. So, I request that you of Parliament stands to talk about something that you inquire from the relevant authorities so that when we do not know, like I stood on a point of procedure, you come back here at 2pm you give an answer. It cannot should allow me to say two or three words so that you be correct that they can do as they please, because there hear what I am saying, then you can overrule me rather is an agreement. Maybe for this issue to be resolved,

Hansard No 200 1 Tuesday 17th November, 2020 RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT’S SPEECH Motion (Resumed Debate)

I humbly request that when Parliament resumes after HONOURABLE MEMBER: Clarification, I did not lunch, we are given an explanation. There must be a hear you well. valid explanation which we would like to know. MR SPEAKER: No! No! LEADER OF THE OPPOSITION (MR SALESHANDO): On a point of order. Sir, the silent HONOURABLE MEMBER: Further procedure. treatment is not an option. I made a request on behalf MR SPEAKER: The Minister is going to be asked, of the Opposition. If you do not agree with me, just say why what was thought would happen in running the so, and agree with BTV that it should not broadcast the proceedings of this House after the 9 o’clock news, did proceedings of other Members of Parliament, if that is not happen, did not take place? Parliament will then be okay. Your silent treatment sir is actually disrespectful. informed when the Minister comes. We will ask him and MR SPEAKER: I do not understand what is wrong that reply will be given to you Honourable Members, to with you. I said the only way you can accuse anybody the House. about not following is to ask those responsible. HONOURABLE MEMBER: ...(Inaudible)...

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Who is responsible? MR SPEAKER: Yes, that is what I am saying.

MR SPEAKER: You do not know? I am not responsible MR SALESHANDO: Point of procedure. We would for running television. gladly accept that explanation, but Mr Speaker, we are HONOURABLE MEMBER: Wow! adults; when a Member wants to say something and then you become furious saying, “no!” That is not how things MR SPEAKER: I have no power to run BTV. I cannot should be done. When I present an issue to you, and then order anybody to do anything on BTV, it is not my area. you ignore me, carrying on with your business, it is not No! proper. If you are the one doing that, not maintaining the decorum, where are we going to seek guidance from? HONOURABLE MEMBER: Procedure Mr Speaker. You will render this Parliament ungovernable. We HONOURABLE MEMBER: May I kindly assist you respect you, please respect us, and that is our humble Mr Speaker. request to you.

MR SPEAKER: No, listen. In terms of Government MR SPEAKER: Honourable Leader of the Opposition, procedures, we know or ought to know under which I have no problem with that, and when I am on the ministry BTV falls. floor and it is …(Inaudible)… all of us, that I am still explaining what will happen and somebody then wants HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Murmurs)… procedure as if what I am saying is un-procedural, MR SPEAKER: I hope we all remember what was said then of course, I will refuse to give them the floor, I about BTV covering the proceedings of Parliament, and will refuse! As soon as I finish with my explanation, any Honourable Member, of course is entitled to ask, that was not for BTV to then be under Parliament, and intervene, whether by procedure or order. That is how that was never the position. Everybody knows which the sequence should be, there is no issue of denying any ministry BTV falls under, and that is the ministry that Honourable Member their rights to speak, that cannot we can ask as to what happened. Whatever answer they be. I could never refuse that. have, they will tell us and we will make it available to Parliament. That is why I told Honourable Boko to ask MR REATILE: Point of procedure. Thank you Mr those responsible, instead of making a statement that Speaker. I appreciate how you said you are going to somebody is at fault, when we have not asked. That is resolve these issues, Mr Speaker, as time goes. Mr what is going to be done, the Minister responsible is Speaker, I believe the relevant ministry is the one that going to be asked and you will get the answer when he undermines you, because even when covering a match has come. Are we together now? or a game; they do apologise for the technical problem, HONOURABLE MEMBER: No sir. and explain what transpired. However, as the Leader of this House, if the relevant Ministry failed to render HONOURABLE MEMBER: Further Procedure. an apology to you, so that you can be able to explain to

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the Members of Parliament what caused the technical MR MOTSAMAI: That is my right, I own it, and I was problem, then they are undermining you Mr Speaker. sent by the people of Ghanzi South. I beseech you sir, Right now you are hunting for them to enquire from please respect us, we are protecting you, we respect you them what happened, then that is when you could give even when we are outside, that is evidenced by the fact an explanation to Parliament. I kindly request that if the that, every time when you pass we bow. Thank you sir. relevant ministry does not respect you Mr Speaker, at least they should respect this House; they should have MR MOTAOSANE: Point of procedure. I thank you a meeting with you because you are in charge of an Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker, I am actually rising on this institution called Parliament. When you meet them, you point because I suspect some Members want to interfere should discuss this issue. I am not lamenting because I with the decorum in the House. When a Member stands was not covered yesterday Mr Speaker, I am okay with up and says, it does not belong to the BDP (Domkrag), that. Wherever Batswana are, I am able to reach there where does the BDP (Domkrag) come in when someone and they will know what I debated on. I thank you. has failed to do their job? We should not be seen to be apportioning blame to people who are innocent. We are MR MOTSAMAI: Further procedure. No Mr Speaker, also here, and we do not know why the television did not with all due respect and humility, my request is that, broadcast the proceedings , we also need an explanation; things should not go that way. I believe when Botswana but now to say “the BDP (Domkrag)…” no… Television (BTV) is broadcasting the proceedings, they are doing so because it is something that this House HONOURABLE MEMBER: Procedure. agreed upon; they are not doing us a favour. They should not think they are doing us a favour, and I think you MR MOTAOSANE: …let these issues be taken to summoned the Minister because of the pressure from appropriate people, so that there could be an explanation. the Leader of Opposition when he sought clarification. If BTV had a problem, they should explain that ‘indeed, We do not want to put you under pressure by seeking we had a problem…’ or they could say ‘we broadcasted explanations Mr Speaker, but it means Ministries or something in the place of Parliament proceedings, Ministries do it deliberately. Mr Speaker, when BTV hence a repeat programme will be aired.’ Now it is comes here to broadcast, this Parliament is the one like the members of the BDP (Domkrag) are the ones which hires and fires the Ministers, it is the one that who instructed the staff at BTV not to broadcast the makes laws that allow for coverage and other things . proceedings after 4 p.m. We are not the ones who did They should not think that they are doing us a favour that…(Interruptions)…I beg for your protection on that Mr Speaker. They should also not think the television because even these instructions that you are given, I am belongs to the BDP (Domkrag), Motsamai or whoever, wondering who is more well versed between you and or even the opposition. This is a national television, so the Speaker, such that it appears as if he is now being the proceedings should be broadcasted and the views of prosecuted? I wonder what they are interrogating him the people be heard. Honourable Reatile or Honourable about… Motaosane may talk about an issue in Thamaga, and it HONOURABLE MEMBER: Point of order Mr would end up helping the people in Ghanzi South. That Speaker. is all we want. We do not want many other things. HONOURABLE MEMBER: Point of order Mr Mr Speaker, lastly there is this issue where you would Speaker. Ah, this person is not saying anything! just say, “no,” refusing to allow a Member to speak. I am one of the victims, whom you once said you were MR MOTAOSANE: I am still on the floor... not going to allow me to speak because you know me, I can see you are still on that notion of knowing us and HONOURABLE MEMBER: Politicise something denying us the opportunity to speak. Mr Speaker, today else! I want to tell you your Honour that, you have a right to MR MOTAOSANE: Moswaane, I am on the floor... guide this Parliament, you have the authority to give us the floor and order us to sit down, but you do not have a HONOURABLE MEMBER: No, take your seat. right to prophesy what it is that I am going to say before I even open my mouth. MR MOTAOSANE: You cannot order me, you are far from ordering me Moswaane, and you cannot! The HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Laughter!)... Speaker can order me, I am still on the floor, and you

Hansard No 200 3 Tuesday 17th November, 2020 RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT’S SPEECH Motion (Resumed Debate)

are just talking to us anyhow, hurling insults at us as MR MOSWAANE: Hey, man! We know that you you wish! worship the BDP (Domkrag), …

HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Laughter!)... MR MOTAOSANE: Do not say, “Hey man!” to me, I am not your child. Your children are there in Thamaga, MR MOTAOSANE: This is what you want to be I am not your child. shown on television, this is what you want… MR MOSWAANE: The BDP (Domkrag) cannot deal HONOURABLE MEMBER: Which insults did I hurl with you, you know that right? at you? MR MOTAOSANE: I am not your child. MR MOTAOSANE: This is what you want to be aired on television, insulting us. When you talk stop saying, MR MOSWAANE: My children are all over the “BDP (Domkrag)”. The BDP (Domkrag) is not BTV. country.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ah! You want to MR MOTAOSANE: Yes, they are all over the country, disrespect me so early in the morning! so do not treat us like your kids.

MR MOTAOSANE: Hey! We have had enough of MR SPEAKER: Order! Order!... your insults... MR MOSWAANE: So, stop the nonsense… HONOURABLE MEMBER: There is nothing you can do to me, say you are going to lose elections in 2024… MR MOTAOSANE: You have bad manners Moswaane... HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Murmurs)... MR MOSWAANE: I am saying you are a fool... MR MOTAOSANE: There is nothing I can do because that is how you are; you are an expert when it comes to MR MOTAOSANE: Just recently, you were this side… hurling insults. MR MOSWAANE: You were a fool; you will continue HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Murmurs)... being a fool like that…

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Hey! You are joking, MR SPEAKER: Honourable Moswaane... right… MR MOTAOSANE: You are the biggest thief among MR MOTAOSANE: Do not say “hey man!” to me, I all thieves; you took packages from people… am not your age mate… MR MOSWAANE: No! You are just a good for nothing HONOURABLE MEMBER: Oh my goodness, you, ! You are a witch , right… man! MR MOTAOSANE: …in Francistown...

MR SPEAKER: Honourable Moswaane... MR MOSWAANE: You are a witch…

MR MOTAOSANE: I am not your age mate; I do not HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Murmurs)... care what you say… MR MOTAOSANE: You have bad manners MR MOSWAANE: Are you saying I am not your age Moswaane… mate? What is our age difference? What am I lacking? MR MOSWAANE: You won elections through MR SPEAKER: Honourable Moswaane... witchcraft…

MR MOTAOSANE: I am on the floor. I have been MR MOTAOSANE: You have bad manners! given the floor to speak. Who are you to order me to sit down? MR MOSWAANE: You worn elections through witchcraft… HONOURABLE MEMBER: Point of order Mr Speaker. MR MOTAOSANE: If you think somebody is going

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to respect you for being arrogant, I am not going to do MR MOTAOSANE: You too! This arrogance of yours, that... who do you think you are?

MR MOSWAANE: Yes, just go away you good for MR SPEAKER: Honourable Motaosane! I am on the nothing… floor.

MR SPEAKER: Honourable Moswaane, you do not HONOURABLE MEMBER: Further procedure Mr have the floor... Speaker.

MR MOTAOSANE: I do not care about you! All you MR MOTAOSANE: You do not respect anyone, this can do is display this arrogance… boy does not respect us.

MR MOSWAANE: You are stupid, shut up! HONOURABLE MEMBER: Further procedure Mr Speaker. MR SPEAKER: Honourable Moswaane, you do not have the floor… MR SPEAKER: Honourable Motaosane, hold your horses! Honourable Members, I am quite sure that each MR MOTAOSANE: You cannot shut me up man! You and every one of us knows how to speak in all sorts of are a child, and I am telling you today that I am not manners. I am also quite sure that you know how we going to condone your cheap manners. can do our work when we disagree. There is only one HONOURABLE MEMBER: Further procedure Mr way we can do our work to the best of our abilities. Speaker. The starting point is where we listen to each other and we can disagree. That is how we should move in this MR MOTAOSANE: Who do you think you are? You House, by listening to each other. That we can disagree think that we are here to nurse you! We cannot come on is well noble. here to pamper you while you insult us however you want. May I plead with you that let us dispose of the work which is before us and we will deal with the issue of MR SPEAKER: Honourable Members! Honourable the television when we have the information. It does not Members! profit us to accuse anybody before we have the facts as HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Murmurs!)… to what happened and why it happened that way. We are just letting out our anger and in the end, we do not HONOURABLE MEMBER: Further procedure Mr achieve much other than saying, “I told them.” That does Speaker. not benefit this House. It does not benefit the Republic. We have the chance to say our views when we are given MR MOTAOSANE: No! the reply as to what happened. Now, I am quite clear that HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Inaudible)… Botswana Television (BTV) did not show what we had expected Honourable Members to be shown. However, MR MOTAOSANE: When you insult me, I am going let us get the explanation first and then we will have to be blunt with you Moswaane. Do you hear me? When the opportunity to react. As I was saying Honourable you insult me, I am not going to beat about the bush. I Members, let us wait for that moment and you will have know your conduct, it is undesirable! Who do you think the opportunity to react. you are? Every time you become… When the House adjourned yesterday, Honourable Boko MR SPEAKER: Honourable Motaosane! Honourable was on the floor and was left with 45 seconds. Motaosane! MR KEKGONEGILE: On a point of procedure HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Inaudible)… Mr Speaker. Thank you Mr Speaker. Good morning Honourable Members. Mr Speaker, the procedure is that MR MOTAOSANE: You too! You too! Whatever you when we are in this House, our responsibility and our want from me, I will give it to you! health are in your hands, and you also have to ensure MR SPEAKER: Honourable Motaosane! I am on the that we are safe when we are here. We have a challenge floor. Honourable Motaosane! in the country, and it seems like it is spreading. There

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are some COVID-19 protocols which we have to is going to happen upon my arrival. The Honourable observe as Members of Parliament and the nation. I am Minister advised that I could test before I leave and that concerned about us here that one of us may embark on upon my arrival, he will advise on what should happen. a journey and then come to Parliament as if nothing has Therefore, I was not told to undergo quarantine upon my happened. There are people close to us who always go on arrival. Mr Speaker, the Honourable Minister was well quarantine after travelling. I believe that, that on its own aware of my trip to Francistown and he advised that I shows that our lives are in danger. Honourable Tshere can go. I stand to be guided by the Minister. is on quarantine, Vice President (VP) and Honourable Kwape are also on quarantine but we see Honourable MR SPEAKER: Thank you Honourable Minister. I Rakgare here. He was watching a match in South Africa think the best way is to follow what I understand to be on the 14th of August and after the game he went on the rules, and that is for you Minister to remove yourself to address journalists. He mingled with many people. from the House. You will follow Honourable Dr Dikoloti Upon his return, he attended a briefing, I do not know so that he can clarify what measures should be taken if it was a Cabinet briefing or what, and then he went so that you also are not deprived of the representation to Francistown. He is from Francistown now and he you should give to residents of Mogoditshane. It is a mingled with many people from South Africa. Tanzania …(Inaudible)… thing but the …(Inaudible)…for you has recorded 500 deaths but VP was quarantined. South Honourable Minister to retire from the House, you will Africa has recorded more than 20 000 deaths but this follow Dr Dikoloti or the Permanent Secretary (PS) so gentleman is from Eastern Cape, a province which has that you get advice and we keep in touch. We have your recorded more than 1 800 deaths. Mr Speaker please phones; we will make sure that we contact you. Try also protect us. We plead that Honourable Rakgare should to contact the Honourable Minister or the PS so that leave Parliament and go on quarantine. After he submits we deal with this issue as soon as possible. Thank you his results, that is when he can continue with us here Honourable Minister. in Parliament. Otherwise, we are putting our lives in MR MMOLOTSI: Procedure. Mr Speaker, I support unnecessary danger . This is very irresponsible of the your decision. I am only worried that ever since the Minister. Thank you Mr Speaker. Honourable Minister came, he has touched on a number of places just as it was mentioned that he went to MR SPEAKER: Order! Order! Honourable Members. town. This means he got in contact with some people Thank you Honourable Kekgonegile. I was not myself from Francistown. So, what can be done under these aware that the Honourable Minister has been to a region circumstances? Moreover, his reason that he was in touch where COVID is ravaging people. In terms of the with Honourable Dikoloti, I do not think it is because he protocols as I understand them, I may be mistaken but is the Minister or we can agree to something. We all that is my understanding, that anybody who has been understand that the procedure is that one should be in to such an area has to follow the COVID rules, as it quarantine as soon as they arrive from another country. has happened to Honourable Dr Kwape and VP. So, That one is understood by everyone. That is why even Honourable Minister, what do you have to say about this the Vice President (VP) followed the same procedure or issue. I do not think I want to take the chance of having protocol. I think it is fine that way but something must Members of this House affected when we know or it be done about those who got in contact with Honourable has been brought to our attention that one of us went Rakgare when he arrived. This is a precaution to ensure to an area and they did not follow the COVID rules. that Honourable Rakgare does not infect those he got in Therefore, Honourable Minister, you have heard what contact with if at all he contracted the virus while that Honourable Kekgonegile said. As I say, I was not aware side. myself what area you had visited. I am sure you do not MR SPEAKER: Order! Order! Honourable Members, want your colleagues to be unduly worried. I am sure that is what is going to be done by those MINISTER OF YOUTH EMPOWERMENT, who are charged with looking after our health Corona SPORT AND CULTURE DEVELOPMENT (MR wise. It is obvious to me that the advice to be given is RAKGARE): Thank you very much Mr Speaker. I to cover everybody who might have been put to some have been looking around to see if the Minister of danger. I hope it will not mean that this House including Health and Wellness is here. I did consult before leaving you Honourable Mmolotsi, would go into quarantine for South Africa because I wanted to understand what immediately. Thank you Honourable Rakgare.

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MR BOKO (MAHALAPYE EAST): Thank you Mr we accommodate students in tents and nearby churches. Speaker. I have few seconds left. I believe we discussed We have never experienced that kind of situation before. this issue yesterday Mr Speaker, the relevant people That being the case, Honourable Molale heard my cry have heard them. . and promised to build a primary hospital. I appreciate that Honourable Molale even though it took you so long. Batswana sent me to repeat another issue which has to be directed to Honourable Molao who is not here HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Inaudible)... today. They felt that he made an irrelevant decision and want him to re-consider. They want him to reverse the MR RAMOGAPI: Yes, he agreed to build a primary decision he made of restricting people from donating school. Sorry if I said a primary hospital. books in schools, because that hinders their children Moving on to tertiary education sir, I want to emphasise from acquiring relevant knowledge from compassionate this issue, that you must pay attention because we have people. Thank you. a problem, we have people called professional bodies. They should be aware and know that they are not above MR RAMOGAPI (PALAPYE): Thank you Mr Botswana Qualifications Authority (BQA). BQA is the Speaker. Let me address issues from residents of only one which accredits schools. When our children Palapye and start with issues of health. Mr Speaker, graduate from engineering, piloting, nursing or other we have a great problem at Palapye, we do not have a courses, these people will then claim that they do not hospital. It was included in the National Development recognise that course, but the course being recognised by Plan (NDP) when the Former President Mr Mogae BQA. This is bad for our country because Government was a Vice President and a Member of Parliament spents a lot of money sponsoring these children. So look of Palapye. He was not a self-centered Member of into this issue Minister and make it clear that, these Parliament, he prioritised others before him and decided professional bodies are not above BQA. It is the only to consider Palapye later. We are also experiencing one even in South Africa it is the same thing. Otherwise, an acute shortage of doctors, residents of Palapye go we have to get these professional bodies in the system to the hospital from 6 o’clock in the morning until 3 to accredit a course. This will help deal with situations o’clock in the evening. I am grateful that Honourable where our children will graduate and not find jobs on the Sethomo Lelatisitswe visited Palapye and witnessed basis that their courses cannot be recognised. Some of this situation. The condition of Palapye hospital is a these professional bodies are under Honourable Mmusi very painful one sir, it is so heartbreaking. The doctors Kgafela’s Ministry. So he must also look into this issue. and nurses that we have are also demoralised because We must not allow them to bar our children because we do not have enough staff. Moreover, this hospital maybe they are trying to protect their market to avoid was not properly built. It requires maintenance which issues of congestion. You have to look into this issue, it you have long promised. The maternity ward is also a could be architects or anything. problem Mr Speaker. Fail and discontinue; Minister, we sponsor students, Mr Speaker, let me quickly address issues of education. invest in a them but when it comes to fourth year Firstly, our schools do not have resources at Palapye; the student is told that they have obtained fail and be it stationery or furniture. On top of that, we have a discontinue so they will not be sponsored, that means problem of accommodation. There is an acute shortage the student is going to stay at home. Imagine that we had of accommodation for teachers at Palapye. You will find already invested P25, 000 in her/him and there is only a situation where six families are sharing a house. That P5, 000 remaining to complete the course. Minister, be is really heart breaking Mr Speaker. careful here, already you have invested in this child so all is left is one semester then the child completes their Another issue is, teachers spend 15-20 years without studies. At least give them a loan and say, “since your promotion. This situation has greatly demoralised them. parents cannot afford, we are offering you a loan after So let the relevant Minister look into this issue. you complete the course you will repay it.” This will enable these students to complete their courses because Over-population at Palapye, we have a heartbreaking they end up roaming the streets with nothing to do. situation in primary schools because each one of them has an enrolment of 1000 students. You will recall that I Internal roads at Palapye; Mr Speaker, we are in big mentioned here Mr Speaker that, we are at a state where trouble. When we receive the rains that we have been

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praying for, we encounter problems of bad roads and are companies, private sector where a person can evict as such taxis fail to transport people, when there is fire people from their field. I will give you an example, there somewhere, the Fire Department is unable to put out is a company at Palapye called Shumba which wants to fire because of poor roads. We quickly need roads at evict people whereas it is a private sector. Let us make Palapye. These things are disheartening Mr Speaker clear distinctions on policies of how the Government because in some villages you will find a hospital, internal acts when she wants land for development. If Ramogapi roads, the village I am referring to is Moshupa. I am is a private business person and wants to evict another not jealous of Moshupa but there should be a balance Motswana, he should pay that person compensation and Honourable Members. if that Motswana wants to refuse he should say, ‘you are an investor and I also want to invest here.” One should Employment and economy; Honourable Members, the not just come and take another person’s land, that is not youth of Palapye and Botswana need jobs. Graduates right. are unemployed and we are talking about people with Degree, Diploma and Certificates. As the ruling party Churches; Mr Speaker the reason there is a rising you have a responsibility as you have promised people cases of gender based violence is because there are that you are going to create over 100 000 jobs. Right restrictions placed upon the church to pray, let us lift now, during the President’s address , he should have those restrictions and allow people to pray. Pastors have said, “out of the promises I made regarding creation implored that the number of congregants should be 300 of 100 000 jobs a year, this is what I have managed to depending on the capacity. If the capacity of the church do.” Rather than being silent about the issue. This is not can accommodate more congregants then it should be good for our country because this is what leads to an allowed to do so , we should not restrict the number to uproar as people make demands on the promises that 50. People are hungry for prayer in their spirit because were made to them. I am passing that one Mr Speaker. the cure for spirituality is not medicine but only the The other disheartening aspect regarding jobs is that, the word of God so they want to be given the chance to Government has announced the she is freezing posts, pray. Time for church should be increased… forgetting the promises she made. This is not good for the country. HONOURABLE MEMBER: Elucidation.

The other issue is land allocation. The youth of Palapye MR RAMOGAPI: …of two hours. I will yield later. have been on the waiting list for 40 years. So tell me, Two hours is too little but if you compare the two hours if a person has waited for such a longtime and they allocated to churches and the time given to bars, you are approaching their retirement what are they going can clearly see that Botswana Democratic Party thinking to develop their land with when they are allocated capacity is low. When you look at the fact that a bus can the land? The issue now is, by the time that person is carry 75 passengers to Maun, where they travel for 10 allocated land, they end up selling it because they do hours yet we are failing to lift restrictions on churches not have the resources to develop it. So, Honourable and allow them to convene, they will sanitise and follow Mzwinila let us speed up land allocation, we can ensure all health protocols because they can help fight this that when a child is born, they are allocated a piece of pandemic. land, I do not think that is impossible. Let us take action and ensure that people are allocated land. Mr Speaker, the main issue is that Sunday School should be allowed to pray. The reason children are fighting in Mr Speaker the other disheartening issue is fields. schools is because the Senior Sunday School in our Honourable Mzwinila I have a field called Masuakoloi. churches are not prayed for or spiritually counselled. Honourable Minister, from Palapye to Masuakoloi is That is the problem. about 8 kilometres but your Department of Land Board, not that I am addressing you, I want you to capture so Agriculture; Mr Speaker the agricultural demonstrator that you can listen, has relocated to Serowe which is 60 at my constituency has huge problems. Mr Speaker, kilometres. So people have to report all their land issues just imagine an agricultural demonstrator without to Serowe Land Board. Really! Honourable Members a toilet, where should customers go when there is no please think about Batswana who incur a lot costs water in his/her office. Why are we making agricultural travelling from there to Serowe. Still on the land issue demonstrators suffer? Ministry of Agriculture Honourable Mzwinila, let me quickly mention that there has completely turned their backs on agricultural

8 Hansard No 200 Tuesday 17th November, 2020 RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT’S SPEECH Motion (Resumed Debate)

demonstrators and veterinary assistants. Honourable discouraging to soldiers, just do the right thing for them. Members, we should do something better. Getting onto the Directorate of Intelligence and Security Still under agriculture Mr Speaker, we have problems. (DIS) Mr Speaker, there are employees of the DIS that… Palapye seems to be the hub. There is a house called poultry slaughter house which was allocated over P4 HONOURABLE MEMBER: Clarification. million to construct it. The contractor constructed it MR RAMOGAPI: Yes, I will yield for you let me without following the plan and right now it has been finish up. reported that it is going to be completely demolished but Honourable Kgafela’s office was supervising HONOURABLE MEMBER: Alright. through the Department of Building and Engineering MR RAMOGAPI: …there are those who were from Services (DBES), these are disheartening things. If you the Botswana Police Services. The arrangement is think that Palapye is where you can misuse Government that, when someone resigns from the Botswana Police funds then I am warning you! I am going to take action, Services they have to be paid, but up until now these I do not want Palapye to be a hub. A lot of funds; glass people have not been paid, they are about to retire, and projects, Morupule B mine all went there and when I others are even suing. We are saying no, that is not the last checked there was a poultry project, all the funds procedure, for people to be paid after they sue. There went down the drain. Honourable Members, we want to are some employees of the DIS who were on B scale, seriously create jobs. they have moved to scale C but instead of giving the Defence and security; Mr Speaker, we need to assist poor people what rightfully belongs to them they are people. Police officers need counselling. You mean silent, they are just waiting because these people have that we can fail to hire a Chaplain or a counsellor at the no one to advocate for them because they are the Police whereas there are Chaplains at the army who look disciplinary forces. Honourable Members, you have after soldiers spiritual wellbeing. Mr Speaker, I recently heard their plight, can you please pay these people. I encountered a disheartening situation at Palapye, a yield for clarification for a moment. young person who is a police officer had just attended MR MOSWAANE: Clarification. Honourable Member, a murder case and that officer could not eat saying the can you clarify the situation of soldiers, looking at the scene he witnessed was the most gruesome ever since fact that, there is the issue of experience and knowledge, he joined the Police force. So let us help them and offer and then you will find that someone who is very them counselling and know that at the end of the day knowledgeable and experienced is not promoted just they are human beings so they need support. because they cannot meet the requirements of physical Special Constables; it has been two years since they were fitness. How do you view this issue, because that person paid their gratuities. I wonder what is wrong with our is doing their military job and he is capable but when he Government because there are outstanding payments at is told to do a Cooper test or whatever it is that involves the BDF, teachers, Special Constables. Can you pay the running, he cannot manage to run but he is able to do his poor people, let us move forward so that things can be job effeciently? Please clarify that? better. Let these people also be hired accordingly. The other one that you should clarify Honourable Member, at Palapye there is a population of 40 000 When I get into the issue of Botswana Defence people. Are you still saying Palapye needs a primary Force (BDF) Mr Speaker, not so long ago there were hospital or a district hospital? I am looking at the fact promotions which we are told were done with…Firstly that, it seems like deaths in Palapye are increasing Honourable Member let me thank those who were Honourable Member. Thank you. promoted because that is something, we would like to see you being promoted. There is an issue that, the way MR RAMOGAPI: Thank you General. No Honourable they were promoted was not according to the agreement. Member, you are right. The issue is that, we are still Soldiers say that they agreed to run 2.4 kilometres waiting for a district hospital. The plan was that there which is physical fitness, and when they complete it should be a district hospital because of the presence of they qualify to be on the list of people who are going to A1 road there. People lose their lives there every day. get a promotion. Now the people who did not qualify We cater for areas likeTswapong, Mmadinare, and are the ones who were chosen for promotion. That is many areas of Serowe South Constituency.

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Even on the BDF issue Honourable Member, you are nowadays hospitals are already refusing to test them, right. Domkrag (Botswana Democratic Party) is out of they tell them to go to the private hospitals. That is not ideas, you can tell from the things they are saying. a good thing.

Hotel and tourism; Mr Speaker, there is this I am not supposed to forget to touch on the issue of overwhelming issue that involves hotels, and it also pensioners. Honourable Members, pensioners have done seems to involve corruption if you follow it closely. a lot for this country, so they should not be paid P500.00 There is something called block booking, whereby when but instead P1500. 00 or more. We cannot be surpassed the employees from the ministry are on a trip, they book by Namibia which gained independence just recently. It the whole hotel. There are certain hotels in Botswana was Mr Quett Masire who was on a plane fighting for and whether these Government employees go to Palapye its independence, and they surpass us by paying their or Gaborone they have block booking in those hotels. pensioners P1500.00. Let us be determined Honourable Block booking then prevents other hotels from having Modukanele, and consider pensioners, because they business, and only these certain hotels benefit. This cannot make a living with that small amount of money. should be looked into. What is also overwhelming about Please let us help pensioners, and pay them. block booking is that, if it happens that another ministry has still booked, and another one wants to book for a Let me thank them Mr Speaker, that at my Constituency workshop they want to do there, they cannot. So that they have appointed a female Kgosi, being the first time means that we postpone that workshop because there in the history of Palapye. These are good efforts we is no accommodation at that hotel we want all of us to are not supposed to forget. Those of you at the Ministry occupy. Mr Speaker, for the business and the economy of Local Government and Rural Development, you are of Botswana to grow, everyone has to take part. I have not supposed to forget the fact that Palapye is a town. concluded on that one. Declare Palapye a town. Right now Honourable Mmusi Kgafela has Botswana Housing Corporation (BHC) I also want to address the issue that things like local per houses whose value is low, because the place is a village. diem, maybe can assist us and put an end to this problem When someone wants to get a loan for a house worth P1 if it can be given to everyone and they choose where million, they are told that it will be discounted by 30 they want to book a hotel, instead of the same people per cent, which means that that person is not going to always benefitting. qualify easily at the bank. If Palapye was a town, its value could be high. We have to plan for developments Trade and investment. I have been given the Honourable Members, Palapye is at the center, it has responsibility to be the Honourable Minister of everything, and it deserves to be declared a town and Investment, Trade and Industry, so I am not supposed to whatever you say, Palapye will declare itself that it is forget it. Mole-Mole should listen attentively, his boss indeed a town. is speaking. Honourable Members, we have a problem regarding bars, let us balance things. Bars open only The youth; Honourable Members, we have an serious for a few days, from Thursday to Saturday they open problem, be considerate of the youth under the in the afternoon, but when you take liquor restaurants, internship programme. Even though we know that they can open every day selling alcohol. There is an members of Domkrag (Botswana Democratic Party) imbalance here, it is not okay for business to be like are not considerate of the poor people, these youths are this. So now it seems bar owners are envious of liquor paid P1300. 00, they work from 7:30 a.m. up to 4: 30 restaurants owners. Also if you look into this issue, you p.m., and they execute duties in their offices without any will find that it seems like others are being favoured. supervision, and we say this is just okay, it is normal. No, let us open bars and liquor restaurants at the same When we table a Motion the likes of Rakgare boast, time, and also close them at the same time, so that we knowing that he is going to reject the Motion. That is balance things. Also this thing increases the spread of not a good thing for the country. the virus because when they are from bars, they then go and crowd at liquor restaurants in large numbers. Let us Artists and event managers ; Honourable Members, really look into that Honourable Minister. people have been affected by COVID-19, let us see how we can assist them. Let us subsidise people who There are many issues with regards to liquor restaurants have been affected by COVID-19, and it will not be and bars. They are requested to test themselves and easy for them to get back on their feet. I will give an

10 Hansard No 200 Tuesday 17th November, 2020 RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT’S SPEECH Motion (Resumed Debate)

example; when we subsidise schools, which are also place to be promoted to. Good people let us expand our given sponsorship money by the Government do we posts and promote these people, so that their lives could really think we are doing the right thing here? Let us improve. There should be a clear policy that after five give subsidies to people like the youth and artists, who years one should be promoted, if they are not promoted, have not been doing anything since the beginning of they should then progress to another scale. This would COVID-19, there is nothing they have been doing. help us very much.

Secondly, I recommend that the levy on technical Couples; the President needs to keep us posted. When device, which are existing funds, should be given to the he ascended to power, he said couples would stay artists so that they would be able to assist themselves together. Nowadays in the State of the Nation Address during this difficult time. (SONA), I do not hear him touching on that statement. Members of the BDP (Domkrag), sometimes remind the I am moving on Mr Speaker, now coming to the issue President of his promises, and say, “sir there is this issue of Special Economic Zone. The President talked about of couples, how far are you with it?” Ever since it was Special Economic Zones, but every time he talks about captured when he ascended to office, he said, “Couples them he always leaves Palapye out. We have allocated will stay together.” That was it; he no longer talks about a piece of land for the Special Economic Zone (SEZ), it. It is important to keep the promises that we make to opposite Majestic. We want more jobs to be created from Batswana, so that they would know that when we speak there. Coal has everything you can think of. Therefore we would be serious. Otherwise, there would be what is we are saying, let the economy be diversified, and let called voter apathy. You would discover that someone is coal be utilised. We should not just export it, so that we in Gaborone and her husband is in Kasane. Oh no! This would be able to assist Batswana. is similar to having been sentenced to divorce. Let us seriously talk about these things, meticulously putting This situation where every time when we talk about them into consideration. Special Economic Zones, we leave Palapye and talk about Lobatse from there we jump to Pandamatenga; Private companies; they are really trying. They are doing I am saying there are lots of reserves, Palapye is a something about the economy, they create employment, place where more business could be created for the and they pay tax and so forth. Therefore, we need to Government. Palapye has everything you can think of, support them, and make the environment conducive and you cannot go wrong because business is in Palapye. to them. When they are seriously looking for land, we should allocate it to them, rather than just ignoring their Public Service; let us actually abolish scales A and concerns. Also, the Government should stipulate a B. How do we expect to sustain their lives with such minimum salary for those who work for these private a minimal salary? Let us make a review so that there companies; but they do that for labourers and unskilled could be a living wage, which would be a measure as to labourers. When it comes to professionals; carpenters, what an individual could buy, pay for transport and do bricklayers and others, they are exploited because there other things. is a shortage of jobs. We are in a situation whereby these professionals should have a minimum living wage; we Still in the public service sir, there is an issue of the C should at least say they should get this much because scale. The issue of the C scale is that, people piled up they are really taken advantage of. in one place, and this is even worse for teachers. When they reach C1, they stay there. Please open the ceiling. There is this other issue which breaks my heart when it Let us open up the ceiling, and ensure that an officer is comes to these private companies. As you can see that able to…even if they are not promoted to another scale, we are approaching December, those who are working let them go up through notches to the D Scale. This for security companies are going to cry inconsolably. would help and the moral of the employees could go up. The company owners are going to vanish with the It is not good for this country for employees to be crying salaries, and the workers would have no place to appeal sorely like this, and some of them even saying, “ever for assistance. We are saying this should be looked since I became a teacher I have never been promoted.” into so that when we reach that stage…if anything the “Ever since I became a public service employee,”… employer should be told, “we want you to pay people, those working at Botswana Television (BTV) have we are holding on to your money so that we confirm first long carried cameras on their shoulders; they have no that you have indeed paid the workers appropriately.”

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In other issues Mr Speaker, let us see where we are This will cause people to skip quarantine. I also have to taking our country to. When we are in Parliament let conclude by saying, we have to be exemplary because us not focus on the party colours; that will not take us what was done by Honourable Rakgare was wrong. anywhere. Let us take the value of Parliament high, As a Member of Parliament he knows the regulations particularly in regard to national issues. Issues that very well, and he is the one who always relays them affect workers, knowing that we can take them further to people, hence we have to condemn what he did Mr so that there would be a solution. It hurts that sometimes Speaker. When we teach people that they should be on the way the BDP (Domkrag) does things, one could say quarantine, even myself as Ramogapi, I have to be on they have a deficiency of ideas but when we say ‘here quarantine and not say I was waiting for the Minister is an idea, run with it,’ they refuse and they say, “no to…We are the ones who know the law. When you make we do not want that suggestion.” Sometimes we need a law, you also have to abide by it because it affects to be very clear, we need to know where we are headed, you; and it seems our colleagues on the BDP (Domkrag) where are we taking our country. are just at ease with this. If it were in another country he was supposed to resign or the ministerial position Like I was saying, when it comes to some other issues was supposed to be taken away from him, because he is like subsidy, we longer know how far it is or what irresponsible and he should not have done what he did. has happened because people were promised that they would be given a subsidy. Whilst they are there MR SPEAKER: Your time is up! waiting in anticipation, it keeps changing in the process, they cannot have access to it, but they are not given a MINISTER OF TERTIARY EDUCATION, comprehensive explanation. The ministry under which RESEARCH, SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY tourism falls keeps saying they are waiting for a subsidy (DR LETSHOLATHEBE): Thank you Mr Speaker. from Germany, and we keep hearing that those in the Thank you for giving me a chance to comment on the Okavango delta would be assisted. So those of us in State of the Nation Address (SONA) as presented by his other places are not sure whether it will affect us or not. Excellency the President of the Republic Of Botswana

The other point is about quarantines Mr Speaker. These Let me first stress the point which was raised by the hotels that are used as quarantines; the Government Honourable Members, that we should always remind is spending a lot of money, and there is no proper each other why we are here in this House, what we have monitoring; because where the Government has been sent here to do by people who voted us because volunteered to say we shall pay for water or this, when they are watching us. Honourable Members, I humbly the bill comes, it would be extremely high and the request that we should always address each other with ministry is requested to pay. These things should be love. Let us fear God when we do what we do. Even checked to confirm that indeed the service they offered when some of us are quiet, it does not mean that we is commensurate with the charges stipulated because cannot raise our voices. We do that out of respect for it would be a futile exercise, some people have now this House. reverted to looting through this system of quarantines. Honourable Members, let me take this time Mr Speaker, Also, still on that point of quarantines… through you and the Clerk of National Assembly , to MR MMOLOTSI: Elucidation. Whilst you are still appreciate Committees of this Parliament. I always took on the point of quarantines sir, mention that people time to watch these committees. You could see that there are quarantined, and the challenge is that whilst they was cooperation. As Ministry of Tertiary Education, are in quarantine like in Matsiloje and Francistown for Research, Science and Technology, we have benefited example, they are not given any medication or whatever. a lot from these committees. One could see that when They are just given food to eat, so what are they doing the Honourable Members are there, they cooperate and there? advise without pointing fingers insignificantly. You could hear that they want to advise the government to MR RAMOGAPI: That is a good question Honourable go forward. Maybe if we can adopt that spirit here in Member. Still on that topic of quarantines, there are Parliament, we could go somewhere. people who were once on quarantine Mr Speaker; from there they were asked to foot the bill for themselves… Mr Speaker, allow me to address residents of Tati East, meaning they are not going to be paid any salary at all. who sent me here.

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Lastly, I will address issues relating to another type of ISPAAD for Tati East and North East in general. constituency of mine, the Ministry of Tertiary Education, When you have five hectares at Tati East, you go around Research, Science and Technology. The President with pride even though this side five hectares is a mere addressed us about the current state of the nation. He small piece of land. You can see what you can produce talked to us about the way COVID-19 has affected us. out of that five hectares. As we have long been using Honourable Members, this shows that our economy is that piece of land, it has now lost value. If we can come having challenges. Therefore, we all have to pull our up with a special ISPAAD, maybe it can help people of socks and try to come up with solutions of what we can North East, Tati East in particular. Maybe if we can drill do. boreholes, group people and empower them to grow crops and benefit from that small piece of land. We I thank this Honourable House for passing the will leave one hectare and grow our zengwe “sorghum” Economic Recovery and Transformation Plan (ERTP) which we cannot live without. The other four or three and if we can all follow it and do the rightful thing, we hectares, we can rely on agriculture specialists to advise can go forward. I encourage public servants who are us on what we can produce, but having drilled boreholes responsible to ensure that ERTP becomes beneficial to which we can use for irrigation. Batswana. I also encourage public servants who manage government finances and other government assets to The other point that I want to address in relation to work hard and make sure that we preserve the little that agriculture is the issue of human/elephant conflict which we have. is found at Patayamatebele, Matopi and Matsiloje. This issue is a recurring concern. Even last time when I was If you can look at our economic growth from 2017, it at the meeting, they kept on saying, “No, we always was 2.9, and in 2018 it moved to 4.5. It was expected to hear you addressing this issue, but continue stressing it” be 4.2 in 2019 but it was 3 per cent. What scares me the Let us help each other. I advised them that we have to most is that, this year we are expected to have a negative growth. It is declared the worst economic crisis since learn to live with these animals. Honourable Minister, the great depression of 1930. Honourable Members, this please assist us to look into this issue. shows that we should all pull up our socks and preach When I touch on the issue that I want to talk about, I what we agreed in the ERTP, we should make use of thank the President on his initiative which assists us to government programmes and available parastatals. Citizen Entrepreneurial Development Agency (CEDA) develop our small stock. It is something that I appreciate. is the one that I want to mention because it presented I was with him when he donated bucks at Ditladi and guidelines which can assist Batswana to start businesses Themashanga. It is something that I appreciate because that we can manage to do to support our economy. Batswana are going to be have to use their small stock One thing that amuses me is that ,they are taking into to sustain themselves. consideration the innovators, something that a lot I also appreciate that the market that he secured is going of people do not want to risk. They have considered to benefit Batswana at large. So, I encourage residents innovators so that they can assist you if you have of Tati East to look into this issue. invented something. Botswana Investment and Trade Centre (BITC) should also be there so that they can The other thing that I want to appreciate in this speech is market our country at other countries. We should also that, the issue of Lobu Farm where there is goat project, sell our goods to the international community, so that is also going to be done at Impala Rural Training Centre. they can also benefit from the goods that we manufacture We are prepared, we are going to utilise that. That is here. something that we appreciate. We should be grateful because it is going to help us. Mr Speaker, allow me to move to agriculture. Like I always say, the whole North East constituency has a Mr Speaker, if you could allow me, I want to talk about shortage of land. One thing that I want to talk about is the issue of water. Honourable Mzwinila is here. I want that, even though there is shortage of land, the President to address the issue of water as it is well known that announced in his speech that Integrated Support there is water shortage in this country. There is still Programme for Arable Agriculture Development high shortage of water at Tati East. I want to thank him (ISPAAD) is going to be reviewed. Like I once said, because last time we were at Jakalas No. 2 to launch the the review should consider coming up with a special project which is going to assist our constituencies with

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water. One other thing that I am grateful for is that, the situations where we give it away as soon as we get it. State Of the Nation Address (SONA) by His Excellency I am grateful for the Land Management Reform Plan, states that this water is only going to be there at the it is going to assist the Minister so we have a speedy end of August 2021. I am starting to have panic attacks and efficient allocation of land which Tati East residents because Christmas is approaching in December. My have been complaining about. The most painful thing fellow home boys and home girls are going to move is, you will find that some residents of most villages back home. We are going to experience high water at Tati East were allocated in 2013. Let me also thank shortage. Minister, maybe I should give you short-term you Minister because I used to come to your office and solutions which I always talk about. I always talked you listened to me. I went home and realised that Tati about boreholes which are found in this village. Some have high yield, so we can make use of them. Thank Land Board has started allocating land at Tati East. I am you Honourable Mzwinila for looking into this issue. very grateful for that and also encourage those who are Boreholes at Butale and Siviya are being used again and getting those plots to protect them. that has improved the water crisis at those settlement. Honourable Minister, do the same thing at villages like Maybe I must highlight that Tati Siding villages and Tsamaya, Themashanga, Jakalas No.2 and Senyawe. Matshelagabedi areas are located near Francistown. Water Utilities Corporation (WUC) officers told me that This results in an increased number of people who they have checked yields of those boreholes and some are on the waiting list. Let me encourage you to come have double digits which shows that they have water. up with another strategy so you will be able to assist residents of these two villages. Minister, thank you for the jojo tanks that you have placed all over that area. It is something that the Moving on to roads Mr Speaker; let me highlight that residents of Tati East in the northern part are grateful roads are not in a bad state at Tati East. Our road network for. I encourage them to fill them up with water because is not really bad, all we need is regular maintenance and when they are empty, they are not beneficial to us. these roads are going to benefit us for a long time. Here is something which we have to do, as the villages are The other thing that I would like to pass on just as a growing we should take care of the side where the village reminder; when I was at the constituency on Saturday, I is developing to. I am saying this because you will find realised that most of the water which comes out of taps situations where we do not have bus stops, this compels just leaks into the ground. There are a lot of leakages in vehicles to stop anywhere beside the road which end up those pipes. We have done a good job as the Ministry damaging the road. I am not happy about a road from of Tertiary Education, Basic and those responsible for Tonota to Ditladi-Patayamatebele and Matopi-Matsiloje brigades; we have trained a lot of students who are at road. These roads are not tarred and are not taken care the villages and unemployed. Maybe Water Utilities of Minister. They are not graded on time, people who Corporation (WUC) should engage these students so reside there are really suffering. they can maintain pipelines in these villages. If they can engage these students, it will help us to reduce the high Moving on, I must highlight that Matopi and rate of leakages in villages. Patayamatebele residents are living near Dikgatlhong dam hence they love farming. Unfortunately, their crops HONOURABLE MEMBER: Clarification Mr get damaged along the way when transporting them to Speaker. the nearest market at Francistown. Their tomatoes and vehicles get damaged. This is a challenging situation DR LETSHOLATHEBE: I will yield. which hinder us from helping the country to achieve its HONOURABLE MEMBER: Elucidation. food security even though these people are devoted to farming. HONOURABLE MEMBER: I am here. Another point is that, we are intending to promote DR LETSHOLATHEBE: Mr Speaker, I would also tourism through Dikgatlhong dam. Unfortunately, like to address the issue of land. I have just mentioned tourists find it difficult to go there because of our road. that we are experiencing shortage of land at North East. I will go on my knees and urge the Minister to assess So I want to emphasise that, land is a very important this issue, I will be happy if you can consider these two resource which we have to conserve. We have to avoid roads.

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One of the things which I must address even though I am Science and Technology (BUIST) through e-learning. running out of time is Gender-Based Violence (GBV). We are grateful for that and also encouraging our Honourable Members, we are bothered by GBV and I institutions to use it. This is going to assist in terms of encourage every leader to address it when they take the rural-urban migration, it would not be necessary for floor. As we are a House which specialises in making someone to come from Tsamaya to UB. They will only laws, we have to come up with laws which can assist in come once in a while and go back home. It will also this line. We have Researchers and Psychologists, so let ensure that developments reach rural areas as people us discuss it with them, let us seek advice from them so will be present there unlike a situation where everyone we devise how we can deal with this issue. is migrating to town, those who come for studying or to find jobs. Let me take this opportunity to thank the First Lady, Atsile’s mother, for making efforts. She is busy fighting I would also like to talk about the Ministry for GBV because everyone is affected by this issue. We Honourable Moagi, my neighbour. Let me thank you have to discuss it from time to time, every time you get for the good job that you are doing. Let me start with an opportunity, you have to talk about it. Every leader the issue of the BCL mine, that there is light at the end who takes the floor must talk about GBV because people of the tunnel. We are looking up and supporting you are perishing because of it Mr Speaker. Minister; we are going to assist you with whatever you need because this mine is going to assist in terms of job Let me also thank the police, Honourable Ramogapi creation if it becomes a success. Not only that, there talked about what they go through because of this issue, is some hope for researchers because we seek to use but they are doing a commendable job under difficult nickel to make batteries for electric cars which we are conditions. Police officers, we notice and appreciate intending to produce one day. what you are doing. This issue reminds me that our police station at Matsiloje is included in the development plan I am grateful for the roof-top solar project and specifically and I am grateful. Let me also encourage the Minister to thank Botho University as they joined hands with you remember it because it is in a terrible state. to produce the roof-top project. This is a programme which we need to encourage. Allow me to compare it E-learning; Honourable Members, COVID-19 to Germany. I think Germany produces around 9.1 per awakened us, it opened our eyes concerning some things cent of her electricity from solar, that is the condition of which we have been taking for granted. It has showed us their weather. Unlike them, we are producing, if I am that e-learning is one of the most important things. right and I stand to be corrected, less than 1 per cent HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Inaudible)… from solar but we are dark in complexion because of too much sunlight. We are not utilising that. So I want DR LETSHOLATHEBE: I will accept if we were to support you on that because it is something which we wrong Honourable Hikuama, I will not shy behind must do. I also encourage other institutions like UB to this. It taught us that e-learning is something which benchmark from Botho, let them use corrugated irons we have to do in order to assist our kids. We launched which is our old roofing model, let them insert solar the e-Education Policy with the Ministry of Basic panels and generate electricity. They will be able to Education and it is going to assist our institutions in reduce their electricity costs. terms of finding how to use e-learning. It can greatly assist us because people can learn in the comfort of their I have to applaud the Government for the issue of homes. Just imagine someone sitting and learning at promotion of domestic cement production. I am happy Themashanga or Shashe Bridge. This will also help our for that because we have Matsiloje Cement Plant (MCP) institutions to accommodate international students. Just at Matsiloje. I take it that if we can be protective of imagine someone who is at Lagos, Nigeria… our own, it will help us to open companies like MCP, Batswana will also find jobs, my constituents will also HONOURABLE MEMBER: Clarification Mr greatly benefit from that. Speaker. Health Mr Speaker; many of the clinics which are at DR LETSHOLATHEBE: I will yield Honourable Tati East Constituency are small. Clinics like those in Hikuama. Someone who is studying at University of Tsamaya, Ditladi, Matsiloje, Butale and Jakalas 2 needs Botswana (UB) or Botswana University of International to be upgraded. Health posts have to be upgraded to

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clinics while clinics have to be upgraded to primary to think about to see how we can help children. Some hospitals. These will help relief Nyangabgwe Hospital. might hold reservations and say it might disadvantage Nyangabgwe Hospital is over-utilised; it should be the children but we will do what we call means testing a referral hospital but everyone close it even if it is in collaboration with Botswana Unified Revenue a minor disease seeks medical attention from there Service (BURS) and other stakeholders to see which which then leads to congestion. If we could consider students require assistance so that they can be assisted upgrading clinics like those at Tsamaya, Matsiloje to live better. Honourable Members, let us try to be and Matshelagabedi, this can convince people to visit independent and see how we can assist the Government. such clinics and primary hospitals. Just their outer It will depend on the mark, if both your parents earn appearance, I was looking at them recently and there are 40+, they should help the Government, I do not think I not in good condition so let us take action. I am grateful should pay for Honourable Hikuama’s child tuition fees that Jackalas 2 is one of the health posts in the plan to be and allowance. upgraded to a clinic. HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Murmurs)… When I started at the beginning of my debate, I DR LETSHOLATHEBE: …(Laughter!)… I think it is indicated that I will talk about my other constituents, something we need to review. One thing I would like to being the Ministry of Tertiary Education, Research, mention is that, if we do that we can be able to increase Science and Technology and I am going to start with the number of sponsored students. Our cut-off points is tertiary education; the students. Our Government has 36 points, we could go down to 34 points, but the honest done a wonderful job which majority of the countries do truth is that, if we go to 34 points, will we manage? not do, by sponsoring students through the Department Will our current budget allow? This year was the most of Tertiary Education and Financing (DTEF). The difficult, I was knocking on Minister Matsheka’s office Government pays for students tuition fees and personal time and again because I had a challenge where I was allowance of P1620.00, the money which my nieces not sure if there is money to sponsor first year students. and nephews constantly send me messages that it is not Honourable Members, let us be serious and see how enough and I want to agree with them. If you look at the we can help the Government and not only that, we are lifestyle of Gaborone, it is expensive therefore I agree talking about knowledge-based economy, let us look at with them that the allowance is not enough but as we sponsoring students for Masters and PhD so that they are complaining that the economy does not allow, if it achieve that. For us to sponsor students for Masters and did I would go and beg the President’s Cabinet for an PhD, is when we have money that we have saved from increase. However we will keep reviewing it in future. other people. Let us talk about it publicly, let us not be shy. I just want to ask this Parliament a question, do you not think it is now time to ponder on the issue I once One thing I would like to apologise to this nation is the raised this issue that, is it not high time for those issue of DTEF that there was a challenge especially who are financially-able to help Government? Most this year where students received their allowances and of us here were sponsored for tertiary education by sponsorship letters late. So we want to apologise to the Government, do you not think it is time that we assisted nation for that. DTEF employees did a very good job. the Government? I want to protect the students that They did their usual job in one month and usually it takes tuition should not change but we should review the three months, it was the negative effect of COVID-19. issue of allowance Honourable Members. I have stayed They had to be… in the University of Botswana (UB), I was a lecturer and I have seen some students struggling, you could see that MR MMOLOTSI: Elucidation. Thank you very much the student did not eat that morning because they had Dr. As you raise those issues sir, even earlier on you no money. You could genuinely see that they literally indicated that your ministry worked very well with came to school running because they did not have committees. Maybe I should take an opportunity to transport money. I have seen that since I have stayed thank you that indeed DTEF and the ministry in general in UB, lecturing there, I have seen students abusing since I am the Chairman of Education Committee, we alcohol because they have a lot of money; they are are very happy with how we were working together given an allowance at home and the ministry also gives regarding issues of students which include students who them P1 600.00. This is something I encourage parents were attending aviation school which recently closed

16 Hansard No 200 Tuesday 17th November, 2020 RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT’S SPEECH Motion (Resumed Debate)

down but most of them have left for school, so thank something they are willing to do and something I want you sir. to encourage, that we should have full confidence on our own. These are the people who will help us. If we are DR LETSHOLATHEBE: Thank you very much researchers, we do not see the colour whether it is red or Honourable Mmolotsi. It is one of the issues I was …(Inaudible)… in colour. There is no politics involved going to conclude with and extend my gratitude to you when we get to this field, a researcher is a researcher, Honourable Mmolotsi. Your committee helped us a lot, even if I once saw him at Umbrella for Democratic we had a lot in our plate but you sacrificed for us and Change (UDC) rally if I give him a task as a researcher, we will be eternally grateful. Your committee is the one there are ethics and laws regulating him. I would like which influenced my decision to talk about committees to implore our frontbench members and all members of at the beginning of my debate. Parliament to give us a chance, these are people who The other one I want to quickly talk about is Botswana want to serve us. Let me request that next time after the Qualifications Authority (BQA), whose mandate is economy improves we should ensure that we sponsor to protect the students. It is one of the issues which them to conduct researches. troubles Batswana everywhere even in the media. I want to inform this Parliament that we are taking action to see The other thing I want to address is the innovators here, how we can assist BQA. One of the things which was we do not support them, and we only know criticizing them. When I talk about the innovators what comes a challenge are people who were engaged as they were to my mind Honourable Tshabang, is the issue of the deemed to be experts to look at the learning programmes electric car. Students who are at University of Botswana and other programmes from BQA. We took the initiative (UB) whom you lectured Honourable Member, and to see how best to advice and work with them to speed those at Botswana International University of Science up that thing. My goal is that by April next year, there and Technology (BIUST), they invented a car, as an should be results from BQA and DTEF. One of the experiment. After the poor students made the car, it was initiatives we are going to implement is technology. We published everywhere that they manufactured a car that are always talking about Fourth Industrial Revolution moves on reverse only. I wondered where this car drove (4IR), we are going to use technology to link the on reverse, because I was there and it was moving students with schools and DTEF so that one can apply properly. On Monday I was not present I was at BIUST. for school and sponsorship in the comfort of their home I met the BIUST student and said to him, “oh! Nephew, at Shashe Bridge. I want us to agree that by December, how far are we with our project?” He said, “the way I we will have finalised this issue. was insulted Dr, I am not going to do it again.” I shed a tear. I was heartbroken that we do not know what we are One thing I want to mention is the issue of researchers doing, we are destroying our kids. and innovators. Mr Speaker, after holding kgotla Toyota that we have, if we can go back, and look at meetings at Tati East I came and held Kgotla meeting other peoples’ cars, maybe they drove on the side. They with the researchers and innovators through webinar. did not start by making perfect cars. Let us give our One thing I observed is that, the researcher might be innovators a chance. If they can do that, I am telling you from the Ministry of Tertiary Education, as long as we can go somewhere. I want to take this opportunity somebody was a researcher, it was an open Kgotla and to congratulate UB Associate Professor Opha Pauline I spoke to them which renewed my hope. I always say Dube in the Department of Environmental Science our nation is very educated. The Government did a very who the United Nations (UN) recently appointed her good job, a lot of people went to school, it is a nation as one of the 15-member panel that is going to look at which has spent a lot on our education sector. I think the 2023 Global Sustainable Development Report. They we are not utilising our researchers because during our were appointed by the UN Secretary General António meeting, they mentioned that they are willing to help Guterres. This indicates that the country has trust, just this Government. For example the decisions we made imagine, 15 members. It indicates that people from as Parliament and Cabinet, they are willing to write outside have trust in our people, but we do not have trust papers, even on Gender-Based Violence (GBV), they in them. I think it is something that if we can change our want to help. They want to write papers and advise attitude, we can achieve. accordingly on what can be done to address the issue of Electric car; I am not going to be afraid to talk about it. GBV, when it comes to solar, what is the best approach. Honourable Members, it is something we want to talk They are researchers and they informed me that it is about...

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HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Applause!)... cables. These cables are exported to manufacture Mercedes-Benz and BMW. There is also the bus body DR LETSHOLATHEBE: We are determined that we builders that are available locally, and this indicates that want to make that electric car. As the Tertiary Education, we can do it. It is only that we do not believe in our own. Research, Science and Technology, we got involved We do not believe in ourselves. I request that if you can because we saw in the past companies coming here give us the chance as innovators, we are going to achieve to manufacture cars; assembling them and they went that. I talked about the battery and glass project which outside the country. We said, “no, we do not want that.” Honourable Ramogapi mentioned. We want to assess it We want Batswana to be engaged throughout the value so that it can be revived. That glass should be used to chain. When it comes to the manufacture of batteries make the window screens of those cars and everything they should be involved, they should be involved in the that can help us. manufacture of almost anything. That is what might Mr Speaker, let me conclude by humbly requesting have delayed us. We are not going to shy away, because Honourable Members to fear and respect each other. It we are afraid of lewd talks. If we are to do it, we will do is something that those of us who are fearful, become it now. Definitely we are going to do it. Right now we frightened when you talk raising your voices at each have had talks with Botswana Institute for Technology other. Thank you Mr Speaker. Research and Innovation (BITRI). The ones that I sent to Honourable Moagi recently, regarding the issue of a MR LEUWE (TAKATOKWANE): Thank you Mr battery,they are doing a lot of research. We want people Speaker that I also have the time and opportunity to who will give us a role to play when they come to comment on the State of the Nation Address we were manufacture an electric car locally. We should not just given by the President on the ninth of this month. stand there and look on as 15 people are hired, and after Honestly he really addressed issues. Like I was saying that they go with their skills. We want them to come a few days back in an interview, we will expand it on here, and Batswana should take part everywhere in that issues which we believe he did not touch on . This is the electric car. We are going to manufacture it without fear time for me to expand it. Let me indicate those that he of anyone. Even if it starts driving on reverse like it is left out. He could not include everything. Honourable said, we are going to keep on doing it until we get where we want to be. We should not shy away from that. We Members have also expanded it to show that there are should not look at ourselves and say we are not capable. other points that could have been given attention. I This one, I am going to do it my leader. believe that the President did what we set him to do. When it comes to the State of the Nation Address we MR SALESHANDO: Point of elucidation. Let me expect a lot. Everyone has something to expect but congratulate you that you are the first one to stand and in most cases you cannot see all you expected in the say you are still going to continue with the electric address by the President. car like you promised. It is not that we undermine the efforts. Can you tell Batswana that it is something that So my request is that, the words that Honourable can be done within the current National Development Letsholathebe has been saying, let me ask God to Plan (NDP) 11, or are we saying something that is far protect me. To give me the strength to speak without from being achievable? Can it be achieved before 2024 provoking anyone, where they will end up requesting elections? for clarification, elucidation or anything more. Also give me the power and strength to use words that are not DR LETSHOLATHEBE: Thank you my leader. I wish provocative but are polite. I pray for that because I have for it to be like that Leader of Opposition. We are doing realised that these kinds of things, are the ones that delay different sections, then we get into talks through the our issues. You will find that when someone stands up Ministry of Trade with other companies. There are many they use words that even though we say are not insults, of them who have shown interest of being on board in they are not acceptable in this House. I wish that all regards to that issue. We stated that we do not want of us who are in this House as Members of Parliament where people will crowd to make an electric car like I should give it the dignity it deserves. Our language is said. I promise that in the near future, you will see the the one that give this House the dignity it deserves... results of the project. We will start manufacturing. There is a company whose name I forgot that manufactures HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Applause!)...

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MR LEUWE: The words that we use in this House are and be gravelled because people are now curving the ones that can give it the dignity it deserves. There their own roads on the side because they are afraid of are words which are not insults but are provocative. the protruding stones on that gravel. I also have the When you directed them to another person, they Khudumelapye-Metsibotlhoko road which has shown become scornful and abusive in a way. I pray to God that it needs to be tarred. It is about 16 kilometres that I should not use those words. Lastly, I pray to God (km) to 17km from Metsibotlhoko. I am grateful that to help me so that my language is not similar to the one I when Honourable Segokgo left that place, I asked him used at freedom squares. It should reflect that it belongs to pass by it just to appreciate it. He and his team did to this respectable House. Let me use important words just that and they even explained that it was in the in this House, those that can build and not break. May plan. Honourable Leuwe’s request is that if it is in the God protect me. plan, those to whom it has been promised should be kept abreast. They should be updated regularly. The I would like to start with those that I believe affect consultation which I am familiar with should be done; my Constituency. Roads; I will start by thanking because I know that my Government works through Honourable Segokgo the Minister of Transport and consultation. He should update the people and say, “this Communications who heeded to my request to go and see the Letlhakeng-Khudumelapye-Salajwe-Kaudwane is the situation regarding your road.” up to Khutse Game Reserve, that I always talk about. MR SPEAKER: Order! Order! Honourable Members, I am thankful for that, I wish that even when other let us try and obey the COVID-19 rules and adjourn the Honorable Members request him he should do the morning sitting and reconvene at 2 p.m. same. It is good that when I talk about the Letlhakeng- Kaudwane-Salajwe road, Honourable Segokgo is here. PROCEEDINGS SUSPENDED AT 1:00 P.M. FOR He knows what kind of road I am talking about. Mr APPROXIMATELY ONE HOUR Speaker, that road did me a big favour. When we were at the site, all the vehicles that we were traveling in, PROCEEDINGS RESUMED AT 2:00 P.M. four or five of them had punctures. It proved that it was a bad road. The very same Letlhakeng-Kaudwane road, MR SPEAKER: Order! Order! Honourable Members, contributes to the revenue of this country because it good afternoon. Let us start our business this afternoon leads to the game reserve. There is some revenue that with questions. it contributes. Although we cannot say if there are some funds it is generating, it should be considered the most, QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER we are saying we are the ones feeling the pinch. When SHORTAGE OF CLASSROOMS AND you are in Kaudwane, using that road on a daily basis, it TEACHERS’ HOUSES AT MCCARTHY’S RUST is more painful than having used it on that single trip we PRIMARY SCHOOL had with Honourable Segokgo; when their tyres burst. MR S. J. BROOKS (KGALAGADI SOUTH): Honourable Segokgo even visited Dikgosi for the asked the Minister of Local Government and Rural villages I have just mentioned, just to greet them. Their Development to state: biggest greeting was, “Honourable Minister please assist us with the Letlhakeng-Kaudwane road.” We are asking (i) if he is aware of shortage of classrooms and for this road to be built because when the President teachers’ houses at McCarthy’s Rust Primary came to Salajwe to hold his last Kgotla meeting there, School; and if so, he promised us that it would be put right at the top of the list for the next developments. That is why we have (ii) what is the plan moving forward, and when will hope and faith that the Letlhakeng-Kaudwane road will additional classrooms be built? be delivered. We are asking the Honourable Minister to ASSISTANT MINISTER OF LOCAL go to other countries and even the countries that come GOVERNMENT AND RURAL DEVELOPMENT here for tourism purposes; I believe if he could go there (MR MODUKANELE): Thank you Mr Speaker and and beg them on bended knees, they could support him good afternoon. Mr Speaker, I am aware that there is and have that road built. a challenge of shortage of classrooms and teachers’ I have the Khudumelapye-Sorilatholo road which houses at McCarthy’s Rust Primary School. Mr at least if it is not tared, it should be visited regularly Speaker, due to budgetary constraints, provision of

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additional classrooms and teachers’ houses could not be which could rectify this situation? I thank you Mr accommodated in National Development Plan (NDP) Speaker. 11 or District Development Plan (DDP) 8. McCarthy’s Rust will be considered along with other schools in the HONOURABLE MEMBER: Supplementary. I thank next development plan period. I thank you Mr Speaker. you Mr Speaker…

MR MOABI: Supplementary. I thank you Mr Speaker, MR SPEAKER: Moatlhodi. I thank you Honourable Minister. I understand your HONOURABLE MEMBER: Did he request for it? explanation. It seems this issue of classrooms is a concern throughout the country. You once came here MR MOATLHODI: You are imputing improper or the Minister of Education once came here and motives on the Speaker. I greet you Mr Speaker. pointed out that there are some caravans that are being Honourable Minister, just like my colleague, the assembled. Maybe you can clarify to this House how far Honourable Member for Tati West was saying that this they are. I thank you Mr Speaker. issue of classrooms and shortage of accommodation for MR MODUKANELE: I thank you Honourable teachers is affecting the whole country, your Ministry Member. I might not say with certainty as to how far has been having a programme specifically tailor-made the caravans are. The truth of the matter is that, as I for addressing this challenge, and it was called the have pointed out. we are in the process of considering Backlog Eradication Programme. Does this programme how the situation could be improved, including the plan no longer exist, to assist us in our outcry? I thank you period that shall follow. I thank you Mr Speaker. sir.

MR BROOKS: Supplementary. Thank you Mr Speaker. MR MODUKANELE: I thank you Mr Speaker. Let me Thank you Honourable Minister for the answer you have thank you my older brother. The truth is that as you have given. Minister my question is, delaying to respond to just said, this situation is affecting the whole country; such issues, especially when we talk about schools, do even in my constituency we have a similar challenge. you not realise that there are bad ramifications when it Every programme in place will be implemented to ensure comes to the education of children in the constituency that the situation is improved. As I have just said, maybe as a whole? I should make a general appeal to all the Members in this House that we should address these challenges as a My other question is; Honourable Minister, are you team. Let us also see if we cannot source anything from aware that most of the teachers, except three commute the Constituency Fund in order to try and improve these from Tsabong which is around 30km; from Tsabong to situations at our respective constituencies. As I have McCarthy’s Rust? Are you aware that they have rented just said, you are telling the truth, this situation affects private houses and they pay P1, 500.00 per month and all us in the country. Thank you Honourable Speaker, I their transport from Tsabong to McCarthy’s Rust on a thank you Honourable Member. monthly basis is around P650.00 Honourable Minister? How can you assist these teachers so that they would HONOURABLE MEMBER: Supplementary Mr feel dignified and be able to deliver fully at work, to Speaker. not compromise the teaching of children due to lack HONOURABLE MEMBER: Supplementary. of accommodation which is created by us, by doing things slowly; not responding timeously to their needs, BOTSWANA/SOUTH AFRICA BI-NATIONAL Honourable Minister? AGREEMENT OF 2017

MR MODUKANELE: I thank you Mr Speaker. Thank MR M. M. PULE (MOCHUDI EAST): asked the you Mr Brooks, the Honourable Member of Parliament Minister of Nationality, Immigration and Gender for Kgalagadi South. I am aware that out of seven Affairs to state progress on the Botswana/Republic of teachers who are there, four of them commute 25km South Africa Bi-National Agreement of 2017 relating to from Tsabong. Therefore, Honourable Member, maybe tarring of all roads leading to border posts between the we should collaborate on this matter and see to it that two (2) countries for ease of doing business and if there through the Constituency Community Projects (CCP) is no progress, what is the ministry doing to resuscitate and Ipelegeng, could we not manage to build houses the matter.

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Later Date. I thank you Mr Speaker.

SOCIAL WORKERS’ CONDITIONS OF MR MOSWAANE: Supplementary. Honourable SERVICE Minister, can you repeat yourself so that I can hear you clearly, are you saying that you are not aware of the MR M. I. MOSWAANE (FRANCISTOWN WEST): challenges that are faced by people who provide social asked the Minister of Local Government and Rural welfare services? Development if he is aware that social workers are aggrieved by their Conditions of Service and that their HONOURABLE MEMBER: Challenges of Social progression is limited; and if so, to state: Workers.

(i) if he has engaged them and what is the outcome; MR MOSWAANE: Is paragraph number one saying and that you are only hearing about this from me today? Honourable Minister, you should confirm it because (ii) when is he planning to review the social workers’ there are more challenges that you think. I believe payment structure. that you are aware, maybe you are trying to avoid the ASSISTANT MINISTER OF LOCAL question. Is it true that your ministry is not aware of GOVERNMENT AND RURAL DEVELOPMENT this? Thank you. (MR MODUKANELE): Thank you Mr Speaker. MR MODUKANELE: Thank you Mr Speaker. Thank Thank you Honourable Member. Mr Speaker, I am not you Mokgopeng. No Mokgopeng, like I just said, we are aware that social workers in my ministry are aggrieved not aware that social workers are aggrieved because of by the conditions of service. I am however, aware that their conditions of service. That is what I said. their progression is limited due to inadequate positions of higher grades in line with progression which is GUMARE PRIMARY HOSPITAL governed by the competency-based career path. This situation is not peculiar to my ministry, but cuts across MR K. C. HIKUAMA (NGAMI): asked the Minister the entire public service Mr Speaker. of Health and Wellness to update this Honourable House on the construction of the long promised Gumare Mr Speaker, I wish to bring to the attention of this Primary Hospital and to state: Honourable House that in order to ensure that officers do not stagnate at the lower levels, the position of social (i) if he is aware that the delayed construction of that workers is multiple-graded from C4/3/2/1 to enhance hospital has compromised the health of the people their progression. In other words, officers progress from of Gumare and surrounding villages; and C4 to C1 on the same post without the need to create (ii) when the Gumare community should expect new posts, if they perform satisfactory at lower levels. construction of the hospital to commence.

Mr Speaker, it should be noted that D scale positions MINISTER OF HEALTH AND WELLNESS (DR are middle management positions and social workers DIKOLOTI): Thank you Mr Speaker. Thank you like any other cadre, do compete with others for these Honourable Member. Mr Speaker, the construction of positions based on performance and when vacancies Gumare Primary Hospital could have been done but we occur. have a challenge of monetary constraints. We manged (i) Mr Speaker, my ministry continuously engage to build accommodation for nurses and the project was staff including social workers on their welfare, completed in 2012. Even though the construction of working conditions and progression through staff this hospital has not commenced, I can confirm to this welfare meetings and efforts are made to address Honourable House that the design and build consultants their conditions of service. of this hospital have been approved by Public Procurement and Asset Disposal Board (PPADB), (ii) Mr Speaker, time and again, the public service the pre-contract activities like Environmental Impact payment structure and conditions of service are Assessment (EIA) are complete. reviewed, and I am informed that this is to be undertaken soon by the Directorate of Public (i) Mr Speaker, I am aware that the delayed Service Management (DPSM). construction of this hospital compromises the

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health of the people of Gumare. As Ministry of MR MAJAGA: Supplementary. Thank you Mr Speaker. Health and Wellness, we are the custodians of Thank you Honourable Minister. Honourable Minister, the public health outcomes. We know very well one might want to know since we are in trying times that this seriously affects residents of Gumare. of COVID-19 in which you maybe be helpful, maybe We continue to assess what we can do in a short His Excellency the President can also assist using his period of time, or what we can do in the medium- powers, if funds permit as well as if there is something term to free people from the challenges that arise in the COVID-19 relief fund, so do you not see it fit from not being able to access the services that because all the feasibility studies have been done? the Honourable Member is talking about. Even Maybe you should air your grievances to him so that if though it is not something that we wish for, we there is something left, that hospital can be constructed are hoping that by the middle of 2022, Shakawe urgently. Constituencies that side, even Maun village hospital would be complete enough for us to use which is the hub of the tourism sector, Minister Kereng it. We will try and see how residents of Gumare is opening up, her efforts are noticeable as far as Kasane and surrounding areas can access services from it. but our hospitals are not in a state to accommodate tourists as well as the nation. If you compare Gumare (ii) Moving on Mr Speaker, we will be on the lookout right now and Shakawe which is work in progress, do and we will try our level best to ensure that the you not think maybe you can talk to the President as construction of this hospital takes place. We a Minister such that one of them can be built if you are expecting this project to be included in the manage to get some funds, especially Gumare hospital? National Development Plan (NDP) 11, that is if we can find funds. Thank you. DR DIKOLOTI: Thank you Mr Speaker. The truth of the matter is, all countries across the globe are challenged MR HIKUAMA: Supplementary. Thank you financially. It is our wish and I assure you that if we can Honourable Minister. Thank you Mr Speaker. source funds, we will build one at Gumare. Our only Honourable Minister, do I hear you clearly when you challenge is that we do not have funds Honourable, but say the main challenge is monetary constraints? Since we will see what to do as soon as we source them, we 2009 up to date, you are contradicting the answer that have a lot to do and it is very difficult right now. We are you gave last time, you said that you have sourced financially challenged because of this pandemic. So we funds for it and that it is at the design stage hence you will make a plan as soon as we source funds and make are continuing to insure that it is constructed. I do not sure that we deal with health issues because we are know if that is what you are saying or not. All that intending to be a healthy nation by 2023. I thank you. you are saying is that you are still assessing, what are KGONAMA FARM you now assessing? What are you assessing if at all it is at the design stage? We only want the date as to MR J. L. THIITE (GHANZI NORTH): Asked the when construction will commence. We want to know Minister of Land Management, Water and Sanitation when you are going to move from the design stage to Services if he is aware of Kgonama farm which is 20 construction. You would have done a good job if you kilometres (kms) South of Ghanzi township and is can clarify that. leased to a syndicate of farmers; and if so, to state:

DR DIKOLOTI: Thank you Mr Speaker. No, I answered (i) what was the original purpose of the farm; you Honourable Member. I said that construction will take place during this NDP 11. As for the answer (ii) who owns the farm; that we once gave saying that we have sourced funds (iii) the duration of the lease and its expiry date; somewhere, there is Setswana idiom which says, ‘o mpotse tsa kwa ke tswang, tsa kwa ke yang ga ke di (iv) the duration of the current lease; and itse,’ meaning that I can only be certain about the past and not the future, for it is not guaranteed. You might (v) if the lease is renewable and at whose instance. think that you have sourced funds somewhere, only for MINISTER OF LAND MANAGEMENT, WATER those funds to be used for other priorities which might AND SANITATION SERVICES (MR MZWINILA): arise along the way. I confirm that this hospital is going Mr Speaker, I am aware of the existence of farm to be constructed during NDP 11. 172–NK (commonly called Kgonama) situated about

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20km South of Ghanzi Township, which is leased to a is hope because the travelling restrictions are already syndicate of farmers. being eased.

(i) The original purpose of the farm was pastoral (ii) Mr Speaker, it is true that with the problem farming and it remains as such to date. of extreme social distancing and movement restrictions, phane harvesters we unable to sell their (ii) The farm is owned by Botswana Government harvest outside the country as they usually do. The (iii) The lease is for 15 years and it expires on 31 ministry carried out consultative meetings with the December 2024 district leadership in the Central District, including Selebi Phikwe area, whose main objective was to (iv) The duration of the current lease is 15 years. ensure that COVID-19 management was assessed in terms of making sure that harvesting of phane (v) The lease is renewable at the instance of the lessee does not contribute to the spread of Corona virus. giving the lessor six months prior written notice The outcome of these consultations resulted in before expiry of the lease period. I thank you Mr the department discording the export permit for Speaker. a while during the first extreme social distancing EXPORT OF PHANE period of lockdown.

MR K. NKAWANA (SELEBI PHIKWE EAST): The ministry however, through the Department of asked the Minister of Environment, Natural Resources Forestry and Range Reserve Resources has started th Conservation and Tourism if she is aware that: issuing permits for exports as of 12 October 2020, to allow for marketing and exporting of phane to (i) some families harvested tonnes of phane early this neighbouring countries. year; (iii) It is true that the amount recorded regarding the (ii) due to the COVID-19 pandemic, they were not collection of phane is quite a lot of money, there able to sell the harvested phane and that it is about is potential for a lot of income to be generated for to reach the best before use period; the families. The market price for a 50 kg bag of phane sold outside the country ranges between a (iii) that the harvest which is valued at several P1 000 and P 2 000 pula, which does justify that thousands of Botswana Pula will go to waste soon; phane worm has high economic value. (iv) prior to the pandemic, successful harvesters Mr Speaker, as I already indicated earlier, the ministry would sell their harvest to neighbouring countries has started issuing export permits to allow for those who especially South Africa; and have collected to export to sell so that we will not have (v) when will the Minister facilitate export to such the collected phane going into waste. external markets. (iv) The potential and successful harvesters identify MINISTER OF ENVIRONMENT, NATURAL their own market across the borders, mainly the RESOURCES CONSERVATION AND TOURISM Republic of South Africa as I have indicated, (MS KERENG): Thank you very much Mr Speaker, which was unfortunately affected by COVID-19 good afternoon. Mr Speaker, (i) The ministry is aware restrictions. The ban on international travel meant that there are families that harvested large quantities of that even those who were previously in possession phane from February until March. The values that were of export permits could not travel to South Africa recorded from Selebi Phikwe and surrounding areas that to sell their phane. So they have been affected like were reported in July 2020, was that there were 50 kg every other business that bank on travelling to and of bags amounting to a number of 7 638. Because of from South Africa for trade. COVID-19 pandemic Mr Speaker, causing restriction in movement, including a ban on international travel, these (vi) As I indicated, my ministry through the department restrictions affected the sale of phane across the borders, has started issuing export permits for phane and not only phane but also other veldt products that people other veldt product to facilitate the marketing of derive livelihood from. However, we believe that there these products. It is also worth noting that the

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export will be facilitated better after the anticipated MS KERENG: Thank you Mr Speaker, thank you opening of the borders between Botswana and Honourable Gobotswang. The issue that food items were neighbouring countries. I must say that it has permitted to be imported because they are essential, I do already been announced by the Ministry of Health not know if South Africa regarded phane as essential. and Wellness that borders will be opened on the I can only stress the point that movement of people first of December, including South Africa borders had to be restricted for some time, because we had to which will allow this business to continue trading. control COVID-19. Travel was not allowed because of COVID-19 control. I want to emphasise as I conclude Mr Speaker, that our clients, both buyers and dealers, will have to abide by I have already mentioned that borders are going to the COVID-19 restrictions and protocols, even as they be opened on the first of December like the Ministry resume their trading. Thank you Mr Speaker. of Health and Wellness have already said. That means trading of phane will be restored within the controls HONOURABLE MEMBER: Supplementary. of COVID-19. Let me highlight that going forth, the HONOURABLE MEMBER: Supplementary. Forestry and Range Resources Bill which we are working on, is going to assist us in terms of promoting MR NKAWANA: Supplementary. Thank you Mr gathering of phane so people can use it to improve their Speaker. Minister, we were told that food items fall lives. We have noticed that it has value and maybe they under essential goods and we imported them from have to be assisted so it becomes an economy which is South Africa as essential goods. What hindered us from more sustainable and valuable. Thank you Mr Speaker. exporting phane as an essential good to South Africa at MR MOABI: Supplementary. Thank you Mr Speaker. the time? Minister, thank you for that explanation. I think that MS KERENG: Thank you Mr Speaker. Concerning in future phane will be like other food stuffs and be essential goods, I believe we are the ones who declared recognised. As you indicated that it was not exported, I what we are going to permit from South Africa to think in future it will be recognised as Batswana’s staple Botswana, but when you talk about exporting phane, that food. When we talk about phane, we talk about food. In is a different issue. Mr Speaker, our major point is the other areas…the sale of phane put us through school so consultative meetings that we had indicated that it will I think such things can be recognised. The Honourable Member across the aisle asked a question that since it is be difficult for movements where people move without the phane harvesting season next month, what measures risking COVID-19 spread. Thank you Mr Speaker. have you put in place as the ministry to facilitate such? HONOURABLE MEMBER: Supplementary. I was hoping that by this time you would have measures in place because when this month ends, the harvesting HONOURABLE MEMBER: Supplementary. of phane will start yet you do not have any measures in place? Minister, I do not know what you can inform HONOURABLE MEMBER: Further supplementary. this House or Batswana regarding the issue of phane? DR GOBOTSWANG: Supplementary. Thank you Mr Thank you. Speaker. Honourable Minister, you have to be clear MS KERENG: Thank you Honourable Member. Phane when talking about the issue that we permitted food is very important as it boosts the economy and has even items to be delivered to Botswana because they do not put us through school. I grew up at Selebi Phikwe so I fall under essentials. Are you saying the procedure of was put through school by the sale of phane. So your South Africa was such that they do not import any food question was the harvesting of phane is about to start so item from Botswana? Number one. what measures have we put in place to facilitate such? Two; Like you said, phane has value in places that Honourable Member, let me explain that we are currently we come from. The most important point is that, it is holding discussions of such measures. The first thing is gathered by women who are breadwinners. It is greatly to prevent the spread of COVID-19 and ensure that there contributing to the economy. Maybe you should tell us are supplies like masks and how social distancing is what your ministry is planning in terms of gathering going to be tackled. Let me emphasise that my main aim phane during the upcoming season? Thank you. is to hold discussions with you to put safety measures

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in place to improve the facilities and social distance MR SPEAKER: The last supplementary Honourable looking at the control of the disease. I can promise you Keorapetse. that I will inform the ministry that all decisions we made during lockdowns which recommended that issuing of MR KEORAPETSE: Supplementary. Thank you Mr export permits should be halted will be reviewed. So Speaker. Let me ask the Minister if she does not agree you can go ahead and pave way for me by discussing with Honourable Lucas that the export fee is too high these issues at the constituency. Thank you. and is going to dent the underprivileged’s pockets because they are the ones relying on phane? That is the MR LUCAS: Supplementary. Thank you Minister. In first question. the not so distant time you increased the tax of phane The second question is that; during lockdown there was export to South Africa and the increment was a lot. a promise that the Ministry of Local Government and What informed that huge increment whereas you grew Rural Development will buy the phane as part of the up at Selebi Phikwe and you know very well that it is the food baskets which were distributed to the people. So I livelihood of most people more especially those who are would like to ask the Minister what arrangement they had underprivileged? because that did not happen, what could have happened? Since there was no export of phane to South Africa, why The second one is that the harvested phane at Selebi did the Government fail to use her purchasing power Phikwe, Bobirwa, Tswapong is estimated to cost close especially during the time when people were being given to P7 million. It shows that phane is the main source of food baskets so that it can be part of those food baskets income. What measures are you putting in place to ease distributed to the underprivileged during lockdown? its export to South Africa rather than increasing tax for What is your role? Why was phane not bought such that export permits? it ended up almost expiring like it did for some people?

MS KERENG: Thank you Honourable Lucas. I think MS KERENG: Thank you Mr Speaker. Your first we agree that phane is our most important natural question was whether I do not agree that the export fee resources for which we have to support Batswana, they is too high. I do not want to answer that question today I should harvest enough for trade. The question on what already indicated that I am still going to explain how we informed the exorbitant charges or fees, I request you to decided on those fees. When we talk about business; we notice a question sir so that I can research what informed do not only consider your losses, licenses, inputs we are that. There are a lot of reasons we consider through the also going to consider your business ethics, pricing and all those factors and how we can improve some factors advice of experts to look at all the factors in helping with which might otherwise prohibit one to make profit. So I the pricing when we change paid Government services. implore the Honourable Member to notice that question The other question is what measures we are putting in so that I can be able to analyse factors that informed that place to facilitate people to benefit more; I believe both increment. Furthermore as we assist Batswana to make me and you have the responsibility to meet and discuss a legitimate business we would do so with the assistance with the leaders, phane harvesters and those who trade of Ministry of Trade regarding inputs so that we strike with it to see how we can best facilitate this business. a balance. We cannot say that just because we want When I was talking about the Forestry and Range people to venture into business, then they should not be Resources Bill, it is the one which will assist us in terms charged any fee, I think that is not what we are saying. of regulations which will help those involved in the So it is better to allow me to research on Honourable trade not to be taken advantage of. This also makes the Lucas’s question and give a detailed answer. trade of phane and other natural resources to be more It was said that phane will be bought during lockdown business-like and you can build economies around that. but that did not happen. I am not sure if I am the Honourable, I implore you that even though sometimes relevant person to answer that question. Your question I engage you to do some things on my behalf although was, what was our role? Our contribution was ensuring it is not your duty, to start consultations and see how that phane harvesters can go and collect it. What I am we can build economies around phane and other natural trying to explain now is that it means that phane has resources, you do that. Thank you Mr Speaker. been harvested so we facilitate within the ministry as HONOURABLE MEMBER: Supplementary. borders are now open to issue them with export permits

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to export their phane. Perhaps you can ask Honourable to benefit the people of Khudumelapye, Salajwe and Molale and his ministry why they did not buy that Kaudwane, it is also going to benefit the whole country phane. Thank you Mr Speaker. because it is going to generate income for Botswana.

TABLING OF PAPER Thank you. Let me move to the Ministry of Defence. Let me start by thanking the Ministry of Defence, The following paper was tabled: especially its Minister Honourable Mmusi, who at all BOTSWANA SAVINGS BANK AUDITED times when there is a problem, responds to it. We are FINANCIAL STATEMENTS FOR FINANCIAL thankful for that, we wish all ministries could do that. YEAR ENDED 31st MARCH, 2019 There are numerous occasions there were situations in my Constituency and when I addressed those issues (Minister of Finance and Economic Development) with Honourable Mmusi, he responded as quickly as he could. We are thankful for that Honourable Mmusi in RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT’S your absentia. SPEECH I am greatly concerned with this Ministry of Defence Motion regarding people called Special Constables. It seems like Special Constables are treated unfairly, especially (Resumed Debate) when they reach 36 years of age, which is said to be MR SALESHANDO: On a point of procedure Mr the age at which the Police service cannot absorb you, Speaker. Mr Speaker, it has been a whole week now since you are past the age requirement they can hire you. Honourable Leuwe’s concern is that, we are the ones you said we should give you time to see if Honourable who put them there until they are 36 years. Is there Mzwinila can be forced to do his job to bring the answer any way that when they reach 36 years because we are he did not want to bring, because I am still waiting for it, the ones who put them there for a long time, we can I want to hear what decision has been made. consider hiring them in the Police service? Also these MR SPEAKER: Indeed, I want to give warning to both people are the ones who are effectively doing their of you that tomorrow when we deal with questions, I job. When we were at the Defence Committee with the will give the ruling. Police Commissioner, he explained that those people work hard and he believes that the way they are working When the House adjourned for lunch, Honourable hard, they are not supposed to be mistreated. Let the Leuwe was on the floor and he was left with 27 minutes, ministry come up with a better approach in regard to 55 seconds. those Special Constables because they are not the MR LEUWE (TAKATOKWANE): Thank you Mr ones who were supposed to take themselves to police Speaker. When I sat down, I yielded for Honourable training to be complete police officers and not Special Makwinja regarding an issue at the Ministry of Transport Constables. and Communications. Mr Speaker, I do not if she still... Local Government; I thank this Ministry very much, I yield for her. which is very broad, old, which also seems to be ASSISTANT MINISTER OF BASIC EDUCATION the only ministry with two Assistant Ministers, that (MS MAKWINJA): Elucidation. Thank you Mr indicates how broad it is. It encompasses the many main Speaker. Thank you Honourable Member. When you councils that are all over this country. It seems like they talk of the Letlhakeng-Khutse road, do you realise that are dealing with a lot, especially when you take the this road is one of the roads that go to areas we call department that falls under it of Tribal Administration. productive areas which can assist the economy to go the Tribal Administration if you may be aware, it is one of way we want like we said in our Botswana Democratic the first departments to be formed when Botswana got Party Manifesto? independence. If you can visit this department of Tribal Administration, it is a disaster because it has Dikgosi MR LEUWE: Thank you Honourable Makwinja, that under it, who I believe should be given the respect they is right Honourable Member. That is why I said it makes deserve, because they have played a major role for this money, it generates income. That is why I am saying country to be where it is at the moment. These Dikgosi, we should look at it that way that it is not only going are different. There are those who are paid, they can

26 Hansard No 200 Tuesday 17th November, 2020 RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT’S SPEECH Motion (Resumed Debate)

prosecute and sentence. Then there are those who are The first one is that, I am saying this in regards to my called Headmen of Arbitration, arbitrators. As they are Constituency. I am not saying this because I saw it in arbitrators, they also have payments they receive, which someone’s Constituency. I saw it in my Constituency are not salaries according to the law, we are told they are where there is a Chief Rep and there is no Headman of allowances. That thing, acts as a barrier because they are Arbitration. I believe that is a gap that should be closed. compelled to always be there most of the time and do That is why I am saying the ministry should assess that their arbitration duty. Their payments or allowances, do and see how these gaps can be filled. not match with the time they spend there. Maybe we can come up with a better idea in regards to how they work. What is happening at headquarters maybe taking Molepolole as an example, should happen at Letlhakeng, Secondly, the Headmen of Arbitration, they make the which is a smaller village. If it is a Chief Rep, we job for people at Records easier because many cases just should know that his assistant should be Headman of end with them without going to the Records Department. Records. When he is not there, the other one can do the The very same Department of Tribal Administration, we job. I believe that it can work if those gaps are closed believe that it cannot perform properly if it can take the Honourable Member. time it has taken at the moment without a Director. There has been an acting Director since 2018 to date, there was In this ministry, maybe if there is a vacant position at no Director of the Department. When the departments Tribal Administration, someone can be taken from meet, he cannot advocate well for the department like Council and be promoted to Tribal Administration. This the one who has been hired as the head of a department shows me that it is not impossible that those at Tribal because he is acting. Administration may be promoted and go to Council because both departments are under Local Government. This Tribal Administration Department, in the hierarchy, Even the scales of Government, are usually the same. you will find that sometimes there is a Senior Chief’s Let that be the case, others should not be transferred to Representative, Chief’s Representative, and then there the other side, whereas that side they cannot transfer to is no Headman of Records. This means that when you the other side. get to major villages, you will find that is the hierarchy; I was listening attentively to Honourable Kgotla it is Paramount, Deputy Paramount, Senior Chief’s Autlwetse regarding staff promotions. I would be very Representative, Chief’s Representative and Headman. grateful if you could do so Honourable Minister. Oh, Then you can see that that hierarchy is okay, they are he is not here. In any case, others are here. It would there according to their positions like it is supposed to be best if you could go and do that at the Tribal be. When you get to other smaller villages, you will find Administration as well, so that the people who work that maybe it is only a Chief Rep who has no assistant, here would also benefit just like those who work in which means that when he is on leave, his job suffers. Let other departments. Here at the Tribal Administration; us look into this situation that we cannot have a Senior there are people who are called Court Bailiffs, those Chief, a Chief Rep, but we do not have a Headman of who collect debts. We do not properly understand how Records and there is a Headman of Arbitration and let us those people are supervised, how they are employed and try to fill those positions. how their conditions of service are. Maybe if they could be publicised and let it be made clear how their work This Tribal Administration Department... conditions are going to be like, maybe things would be MR HIKUAMA: Clarification. Thank you Honourable in order. Revisit the conditions of service. Member. I want to ask if even at your areas, this situation Still under the Ministry of Local Government and you have mentioned is prevalent and similar to our areas Rural Development, I am requesting for an intervention where there is no Chief Reps, Senior Chiefs? According from this Ministry, at the Sub-District of Letlhakeng. to you, what can be done so that the department all over According to my knowledge I know that people who use the country can fill those positions and balance? motorbikes are those from Debonairs, but in Letlhakeng, MR LEUWE: Thank you Honourable Member. Is it not it is vice versa, it is not Debonairs. There is a motorbike that you have already answered yourself? They fill those in Letlhakeng running around gathering goats, sheep positions and it can balance like you have answered and cattle and stocking them in a kraal. What hurts me yourself. the most is that one beast pays P150 per day. If you go

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to matimela (stray cattle) one beast which is looked after inform you that people are awaiting to be allocated land is charged P15 per day, and then I ask myself which by your ministry sir; they are just waiting back at home criteria was used here; what were they looking at? If to be given plots. The Motion I brought here which was you look at this collection of cattle, it is a by-law, and turned into a question was suggesting that that policy when you consider matimela (stray cattle) it is an Act of should be amended. In my constituency, we still have Parliament, from here. Then my question is, is this Act land and please go ahead and allocate land to people. implemented properly? I suspect something is not going I heard one Member saying at his constituency land is on well, I do not think there should be a charge of P150 being allocated. per day as opposed to P15 per day for stray cattle. Still under your ministry, Honourable Mzwinila, there A village like Letlhakeng is surrounded by cattle posts, are some small villages where people reside, they do not they are everywhere. Even here in Gaborone when I have any other place they call home; that is their home, knock off, I would be blowing the horn for cattle. When but water has not reached those areas. Small villages I turn just here, going towards Block 9, there is cattle like Masope, Mosime, …(Inaudible)… Kolojane are all over until I arrive. However, the cry is not as loud as small villages where people reside. They do not have the one in Letlhakeng, where we believe there are cattle any other place they call home and that is where they all over. We need to feel the ministry’s intervention stay. If there is a way in which we can fight COVID, let in Letlhakeng, so that we know whether it is only in those people be assisted with water. Letlhakeng where this is supposed to happen, or it should apply everywhere. I would like to talk about the ministry responsible for wildlife. The Honourable Minister responsible for I am appealing to your honourable office, Honourable wildlife, I believe we are the ones who create the friction Molale, that regarding electricity at the constituency between humans and wildlife. When I say friction, I am I am representing, Takatokwane; there are only four not referring to myself. The Honourable Member who villages which do not have electricity. These four also happens to be my friend, when I say friction, he villages are under you ministry, they are regarded interprets it in a different way. I am not referring to as villages which are far from amenities. These four myself Honourable Saleshando. If the compensation villages are Kaudwane, Sorilatholo, Khekhenye and that is given when animals damage things belonging Tshwaane. Please support me and assist me to talk to the to Batswana was enough, the lamentation by Batswana Minister responsible for electricity, so that it does not would not be this loud. If we tried by all means to appear as if they are not considered. In our Government, keep wildlife in its habitat and not go where people we took a decision that villages that are far from live, this complaining done by Batswana would not be amenities would be given first preference when it comes this heightened and there would not be much conflict to things like these. Surprisingly at the constituency I between humans and wildlife. am representing, these four villages are the ones which Let me thank your ministry Honourable Minister, which have been left out; all the other villages have been addressed the issue about wildebeests in the Ngwaketse electrified. This is sending a very strong message to me area. You moved them to an appropriate place and that something is not happening in a proper manner. At calmed the cries which were heard there. This shows least some of those villages should be connected. that if you could to the same with other animals that Now going to the Ministry of Water; we thank you wreak havoc to people’s property, moving them from Honourable Mzwinila, the responsibility you gave to the those areas; you would prevent this friction. Batswana land boards, even if you could have included everyone, are aware that wildlife generates income for us, but the there would still be complaints; we know that. When issue is that even if you are keeping a dog and a chicken, we see people complaining about you, it means you are you would not want your dog which watches over you doing something right, you are busy working. We know at night to kill the chicken. Everything should be in its very well that you cannot satisfy us all and personally rightful place. Let us take the wildlife back to where I was not satisfied by some of the decisions you took, it belongs. If they are many, give a quota so that they but there was nothing you could do; at the end of the could be curled to a controllable number so that there day you had to make certain decisions. I cannot come would not be any friction between them and Batswana, here and attack you for the decisions you made. Let me which now makes it appear as if Batswana do not like

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them. I am moving on, especially because time is flying MR LEUWE: I would like to move to Agriculture. We too. are waiting for the review of the program with heavy hearts, but my plea is that when that program is reviewed, Basic Education; this ministry is very heart breaking, people should be consulted. When this program is especially in my constituency. The Ministry of Basic reviewed, Honourable Reatile’s committee also should Education is there everywhere in the country and this be consulted because it is all over the country gathering means the ‘shoe’ which is making me uncomfortable information about what people need. It should have an somehow also makes Honourable Hikuama input in that review so that people can later on see that uncomfortable wherever he is. When you go to all their contribution has been implemented. our schools, although Dutlwe is at the top; we have regressed to a state where a student writes on their lap, I appreciate the initiative concerning bucks. I am grateful there are no desks where they could write. Honourable that the President is donating bucks to people and I also Leuwe’s request is that Ministers should visit schools so believe that all the Honourable Members appreciate it. that when we talk, they would know what we are talking about because it would be things that they would have HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Murmurs)… also seen; just as I gave an example with Honourable Segokgo. MR LEUWE: The thing is sometimes we tend not to be open about what we truly want. When the President Still at the Ministry of Education, I suspect there is an went around the country donating bucks, no one said anomaly that I do not understand. You will notice that that he or she does not want a buck because Batswana someone is a Chief Education Officer and they are in want those bucks. They need them and there is no way the Letlhakeng Sub-District, overseeing all schools in I can stop the President from donating bucks to people in my constituency when I am well aware that they do Letlhakeng and when you look at their benefits, you will not have bucks and they need them. I believe that we notice that they are equal to those of their subordinates. are going to benefit from these bucks. If people who It is not easy to so supervise someone and have them are given bucks can go and look after them, I believe take orders from you when your salaries are equal. We that they will be as beneficial to them as we anticipate only see that in the police service Honourable Kapinga, because I noticed that these bucks are of a good breed. whereby when I am employed and I am given a number, the one who gets the one after mine considers me a DR GOBOTSWANG: On a point of clarification, Mr senior despite both of us being Constables; but I would Speaker. Thank you Mr Speaker, thank you Honourable not command them extensively. Therefore, this results Leuwe. Since you highly appreciate the initiative of in performance becoming low because you cannot give donating bucks and you are even saying that Batswana orders to someone whom you are at par with. Now when are grateful for it, do you wish that it can be a Government it comes to assessments, to be assessed, those who are program? Thank you sir. supervised by Chief Education Officers, they are at par with Headmasters whose schools they are overseeing. MR LEUWE: Thank you Honourable Gobotswang. When it is time to be assessed, they are assessed by I will greatly appreciate it if it can be a Government the Director, to show that indeed the person who has to program because maybe then it will improve; so that supervise them is the Director. I believe that this does those who did not receive those donations when it not portray us well and it makes it hard for us to have was still the President’s initiative can have a chance productivity in schools. When you get to these schools to receive those bucks. I know that you also like that and you find a senior teacher who is said to have a initiative because people at your constituency received portfolio, more especially at primary, you will find them and you did not object that. I agree with you on that he or she is the head of other senior teachers even that point Honourable Gobotswang. though their salaries are same. At least at secondary their salaries are not the same; the salary for portfolio HONOURABLE MEMBER: I was there when he senior teacher is more than salaries of other senior received it. teachers. Salary talks, you cannot supervise someone HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Laughter!)… who receives a salary that is more than yours. Hey! time is moving fast. HONOURABLE MEMBER: Elucidation.

HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Murmurs)… MR LEUWE: Hey! Elucidate.

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MR MOATLHODI: On a point of elucidation, Mr Minister Lelatisitswe said because when it was a Speaker. Thank you Mr Speaker. I am on the same responsibility of Ministry of Local Government and page with you Honourable, we are on the same page Rural Development, there was no clustering of vehicles Honourable Leuwe, Kopano’s father. I am on the same as he was responding about clustering of vehicles. Every page with you because I appreciate the President’s clinic and health post had a vehicle. You could not initiative and five people at my constituency have asked come across a situation whereby a nurse would tell you me to ask for bucks on their behalf…(Interruptions)… that he or she bought his or her uniform with his or her listen because I want to send you to the His Excellency own money. If it is possible, let us move clinics back to (HE) the President...Honourable Healy, leave him alone. Ministry of Local Government and Rural Development I want to send you to His Excellency (HE) the President. because it was doing well. I have five names of residents of my constituency who have sent me to come and ask for bucks on their behalf. I do not know what we were trying to rectify because So, since you meet the President every day at your I did not see anything that had to be corrected because caucuses, go and give him this list and do not send the Ministry of Local Government and Rural Development list of your constituency. Thank you sir. was doing well…

HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Applause!)… HONOURABLE MEMBER: Elucidation.

MR LEUWE: Thank you Nkamo’s father. I will submit MR LEUWE: Hey! Elucidation where …(Inaudible)… that list, but it will come after mine because I also have HONOURABLE MEMBER: It is the Minister of a list of my constituents who asked for those bucks but health and Wellness. the truth of the matter is that I cannot feed your children before I feed my child. You have the right to move to MR LEUWE: Is it the Minister of Health and Wellness? this side so that you can be closer to the President and Hey! Minister of Health… be able to submit your list quickly, not having to wait for the second man to submit it for you. HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Laughter!)…

HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Murmurs)… MINISTER OF HEALTH AND WELLNESS (DR DIKOLOTI): On a point of elucidation, Mr Speaker. MR LEUWE: Hey! Time is not on our side so let me Thank you Mr Speaker. Thank you Honourable Leuwe. quickly move to health issues. on the issue of health, I On the issue that you are raising, the ministry has taken would like to point out that Letlhakeng-Lephephe has a decision that we are going back to primary health a robust representative, Honourable Liakat Kablay. I wish to talk about the clinic of that constituency, care, but this time around doing it with the involvement not because maybe he cannot talk about it. We have of the communities, as well to make sure that we all long been promised a Hospital at the constituency, at have ownership of the preventative measures that are Letlhakeng Sub-District. I am addressing this issue to requested for health. We are moving in that direction. elucidate on what Honourable Kablay said, that we wish We are also decentralising to make sure that we that clinic can be built because the only hospital on our empower coordinators so that they can be able to take side is at Molepolole. When you look at the kilometres decisions there in order to ensure that questions are not from Tsetseng to Molepolole, they are more than 300. directed here, so that they stop at district level because So if a clinic can be built at Letlhakeng, it can support we believe that that is where you want to see people clinics in the surrounding areas. If there is one thing that being assisted. I wanted to tell you that you are debating I wish to touch on before my time elapses, it is an issue brilliantly; that is what the ministry intends to do and concerning Dutlwe clinic which is often destroyed by Batswana are going to be assisted. Thank you. the winds. As we speak, there is no clinic at Dutlwe. Are you not considering to do something better than that the MR LEUWE: Thank you Honourable Minister. We small clinic which is always blown away by the wind? would appreciate it if you can hasten to do that because the health situation is quite undesirable. The problem is Still on the issue of health, the Minister was just here that you were speaking English and most of the people telling us that provision of health services was better who are suffering at my constituency did not hear that when it was still under Ministry of Local Government you were contributing to what I was saying and that you and Rural Development. I also elucidate on what are promising them that you are going back to Primary

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health care because they refer to them as theirs and…you to say things that are not true about another member, are moving them back to Ministry of Local Government especially when they are spiteful about that issue. I hate and Rural Development. We would be grateful if that the Presidents’ programme with all my heart. So it is can happen. wrong for him to do that because the nation might think that I like it. Let me highlight that I hate the Presidents’ Gender Based Violence (GBV); Honourable members, programme where he donates bucks with all my heart. there is no Member of Parliament who can stand here So I urge him to withdraw those words Mr Speaker. I do and point out that GBV does not affect him or here. GBV not want to fight with anyone today. Thank you. affects us all, it hits us the same way and we all have to stand here and address it without hesitating. Sometimes MR SPEAKER: Honourable Boko, those are issues GBV is caused by cases whereby partners are staying between you and Honourable Moabi. You are friends, he in different areas even though there is a straightforward knows that you do not like it. I am sure he will withdraw policy which states that spouses should not stay far so you do not fight. apart. Let us try and ensure that spouses stay close to each other more especially in cases where people MR MOABI: Thank you Mr Speaker. If at all we were would have applied to swap with them. We should not gossiping, I withdraw. It was gossip, I am not going to deny them that opportunity only because some people tell others. I get your point Honourable Boko. Maybe I want to object that, even though it is an easy thing to do should also thank … so that they can stay together. Staying together is very HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Laughter!)… important. MR BOKO: Point of order. Thank you Mr Speaker. We Before I take my seat, still on this GBV issue, I plead are starting something which is not going to please us that we should kneel down and pray, let us call churches in this House. Tomorrow I will be standing and saying and let us talk to churches. Let us give them time as something which is not true, that Honourable Healy we have declared a prayer period, let us give churches whispered this to me, as an intention to tarnish the name of another member. Assuming I told him so, of course a slot to pray for this situation because it is now I did not, these are issues which are not supposed to be getting out of control. This is the first time in history allowed in Parliament. I know that I never said that to to experience what is currently happening; every day, him. Let us refrain from this thing where people were every week someone has to be buried due to GBV. chatting, assuming I said that, of course I did not, then Honourable Members, let us talk to churches, let us we bring them to Parliament. We have to discuss issues request that churches should be given a time to pray for which we discussed in Parliament. So this was said to this situation. We should observe if they practice social tarnish my name and to associate me with things that I distancing; if their place is big enough to accommodate am not interested in. As I have explained, I do not want them to exceed the stipulated number. Thank you Mr to fight with anyone today. So let him withdraw his Speaker...hey! Last time did I say that time should be words if he wants us to proceed with today’s business. reduced? Hey! There is nothing here… I am not in the mood to fight with anyone today. Thank MR MOABI (TATI WEST): Thank you Mr Speaker you. for giving me an opportunity to respond to SONA MR SPEAKER: Order! Order! Honourable Boko, as I statement by the President of this country. Let me start indicated, this is an issue between friends. I could never by thanking the President for this clear speech. I also be able to rule on it, so, it is a very difficult point of order. thank him for his initiative where he donates bucks and I It concerns the two of you but I am sure Honourable believe members like Honourable Boko and Honourable Moabi got your point. Lucas value it very much. Honourable Boko told me that he values it, that he wishes that he could get another one. MR MOABI: Thank you Mr Speaker. My friend Honourable Boko, I got your point. I sold you out. HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Laughter!)… HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Laughter!)… MR BOKO: Point of order. Thank you Mr Speaker. I have been expecting this, so I am not surprised for MR MOABI: Let me move on as I was commending reasons which he also knows. Mr Speaker, I do not the President’s programme and the SONA. He is a leader think it is the procedure of the House for a member who updated the nation and other leaders, who showed

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that he is interested in gathering ideas so he can take this Government is going to sponsor them. I support this country somewhere. That is commendable. We usually idea because when a teacher retires from work, a certain invite Ministers to our Constituencies so I want to thank youth will be appointed on their post. A teacher is also and commend them for doing a good job. I encourage going to employ some people when they open an early them to keep it up. childhood school. That is one way of creating jobs.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: But they never come to I also support the issue of early retirement even though I my Constituency. do not agree with him in terms of age that he suggested. I will say 55 because it is possible to get a job at age MR MOABI: Mr Speaker, I have talked about SONA 42 or 43 and you would not have accumulated much at speech which is clear. We never agree even when age 55. So age 55 would be better. He also talked about something is good. We sometimes fail to appreciate some incentives which may cause early retirement. We good things. The Honourable Members on the other side usually says that we never support any idea, as long as must have them so they can be used to offer assistance it comes from them. So I want to tell them that, that is to people who retire at age 55. So it is not like we oppose not true. We do not do that because we are against your everything. We sometimes support your ideas based on ideas. It is not like that. Some of you raised ideas which their nature. I support, ideas that can take our country somewhere. Member of Parliament for Tonota, Nkamo’s father, Member of Parliament for Maun West, Honourable talked about increment of old age pension and I support Saleshando, Leader of Opposition raised some ideas him. Let us increase it if resources permit us because the which I support. He talked about allocating land to cost of living is high Mr Speaker. This shows that it is our investors so they can bring about developments as not like we oppose all their ideas, there are those which well as create jobs. These developments are going to we support. This country belongs to all of us. No one can end up in the hands of Government. So I support his claim ownership of this country. That is why sometimes point. While still on investors, we still have a problem we have to support some ideas even though our party in Botswana. We believe investors are only white people affiliations differ. We may differ in some areas but there who bring about developments and invest. As a black is a proper way to do so rather than act the way we are person, it is difficult to go to Government offices and say that you want to invest. You will find that, they believe acting now, we can do so respectfully not attacking each it is impossible for Batswana to do that. So different other like we are not elderly people. I was hoping that Ministries which deal with these issues have to closely in this Parliament session, we would come back more assess these issues. matured and address each other maturely. Let us stop making people to have a certain perceptions about this MR MANGWEGAPE-HEALY: Elucidation. Thank Parliament as if we are people with no responsibility, you Member of Parliament for Tati West. I want to add they should take us seriously. We are leaders and we on to your point that, issues of foreign investors, not that have to act accordingly so that we do not discourage we do not want them, you will find that it is difficult for a person out there to stand for elections as he/she will a Motswana to invest, someone who wants to develop think there are no regulations, one can just say whatever our country, unlike foreign investors. If someone come they want to say. I take it that Honourable Members will as a foreign investor, the relevant Government officials correct such things. The only difference is that you are will assist them smoothly and as soon as possible. They on that other side of the aisle and I am here, we have only do not offer full support to Batswana. Thank you. one country, we do not have any other spare country, we only have our Botswana which belongs to all of us. So MR MOABI: Thank you Honourable Healy. That let the good behaviour this country is known for prevail. is what I want to highlight, that it is high time we believe in ourselves as Batswana. Let us refrain from Mr Speaker, my debate is structured in four headings; thinking that it is impossible for Batswana to compete development, economic empowerment, job creation and with foreigners, especially the whites. I am requesting wealth creation. different Ministries, the different Ministers to closely assess those kind of issues. Development: I will start with development. Mr Speaker, my constituency is in serious need of developments. Honourable Saleshando talked about early childhood; We have long complained about the Kalakamati- he pointed that if teachers can offer reception classes, Sekakangwe-Mbalambi road which connects to

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Zwenshambe and Gambule. It has long been reported to built a fire station worth P10 million. It is going to help be at the planning stage. To date, it is still at that stage rather than losing the North East Council which is worth but please do not forget us although we are very far off more than P150 million. That is one of the reasons I close to the Zimbabwean border but we are there as want departments to be established at Masunga. Batswana and we need developments like everyone else Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker, my constituency has a high number of vehicle theft occurring in Masunga and other Mr Speaker, we have Ntimbale dam which can be a surrounding villages, they pass Mbalambi. I request tourist destination but we have a challenge of roads. It that there should be a satellite police at Mbalambi has been a long time since we spoke about the Gulubane- since vehicles pass through that village and Mapoka, to Mambo-Masingwaneng-Sechele road which has never prevent thieves from passing through. been constructed. Did you hear how many villages I mentioned? It is clear that there are many people in Land allocation; we are complaining like everyone those villages therefore the road should be constructed. else, people have long applied for land and they are still I am pleading to you Honourable Members but I believe waiting. However Honourable Mzwinila gave us hope Minister of Transport and Communications is listening, indicating that there will be an improvement. he would make a plan for us. Economic Empowerment: Mr Speaker, Honourable Leuwe talked about Dikgosana in his debate, thank you Mr Speaker, there is dire shortage of accommodation very much Honourable. These people are very important at my constituency which I think Honourable Mmusi in our daily lives, they assist Dikgosi. We understand Kgafela noticed when he visited me recently. We still that they do not get a salary, they get an allowance see our teachers seeking accommodation out there in the however, I wonder if the relevant Ministers do not think village which is not good yet we expect them to produce it is important for them to have contracts they can use results. This includes nurses. at financial institutions. Those poor people are working with no contracts and some of them have interest in Mr Speaker, Masunga is a big village but we still applying for loans at the bank but do not have contacts have one primary. Relevant Ministers please consider whereas they work as Dikgosana. We should consider building the second primary. empowering these people and give them contracts even Mr Speaker, Tati Land Board; we have a land board if they can be temporary for five years. at Masunga and we do not have a sub-land board, we Mr Speaker, I will now talk about Village Development are a fully-fledged district at Masunga, North East so Committee (VDC); they work hard as we work with we request for a sub-land board Honourable Minister them and Councillors in terms of developments. So Mzwinila. I think if we can have a sub-land board at let us consider increasing their allowance if the budget Tati Siding, it would really help looking at people from allows so that they can sustain themselves. Parents villages like Matlopi and Matsiloje although they are Teacher Association (PTA); Mr Speaker, they ensure that not from my constituency but developments are for the schools and our students have proper administration. It benefit of all Batswana. Those people are not from my is high time they also get an allowance. I am sometimes constituency they come from Douglas Letsholathebe’s saddened seeing some travelling from Marobela to constituency but I think it is difficult for them to travel Mapoka and that person will be using his/her last thebe from Matlopi to Masunga Land Board. to pay for transport fare. So they should also be given an allowance so that they can transport themselves. Mr Speaker, as I indicated that North East District is a fully-fledged district, we still access some services at As it was recently indicated that there will be a Francistown but we are not a sub-council so we would commission set up to review salaries and allowances like departments at Francistown to also be established at of Dikgosi, Councillors; Dikgosi are important and I Masunga. Departments like agriculture, we still travel to recently saw this during COVID-19 when they were Francistown to access them but it is now time for such the ones assisting to spread awareness messages that departments to be decentralised to Masunga. we should follow health precautions. These are very important people who deserve a salary increase. The Department of Fire Mr Speaker, we have so many buildings at Masunga which if they can catch fire one Mr Speaker, as I am standing here, I was given a day, we are going to lose rather than if we could have full update of my constituency this morning by the

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Councillor. I want to show the significance of our Mr Speaker, we have the backyard garden programme Councillors, that as I am standing here, I know the state which our voters are encouraged to be involved in, but of my constituency. Everyone here knows the state of the problem is water. You will find that their water is their constituencies through an update they receive from expensive, they cannot afford it and maybe it is an old their Councillors. It is time as we indicated recently, woman who stays home and is not working. We should to review the salaries of Councillors because the poor look at this issue Honourable Mzwinila, that can we not people are not earning much Mr Speaker. We do not introduce a water subsidy for people who have backyard want a situation where if elections do not go their way gardens. We need to look at it in a more detailed manner we blame them for not using money wisely. It is not like Mr Speaker. they are earning a lot because that money is spent on fuel costs as they check on voters and the constituency Mr Speaker, we talked about (mashonja) mopane worm, so their salaries should be increased. Even if our salaries which I think I will just mention in passing because we as Members of Parliament are not increased, we can have talked about it here. The relevant Minister… wait and rather increase theirs, I think that will be fair MR REATILE: Clarification. Thank you Mr Speaker, Mr Speaker. let me thank Honourable Member. Before you continue, HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Murmurs)... let me understand this issue of water subsidy that Honourable Member, if it is possible that it can be MR MOABI: …(Laughter!)… As Members of introduced, because we have a challenge that now the Parliament we can wait and focus on increasing salaries income from diamonds that we had is not doing well at for Councillors Mr Speaker. the moment, and the tourism sector is not doing well, where are we going to get the money to subsidise water MR MOATLHODI: Point of clarification. Thank from? you Mr Speaker. You are right Angela’s father, you are right Honourable Member. I request that you conclude MR MOABI: Thank you Honourable Member, that is on what you are saying in regard to the pensions of what I was saying. Maybe let me start by saying if the situation permits, I have the trust and belief that next Councillors and Members of Parliament? year, the situation will allow us to do that the way I see MR MOABI: Thank you Nkamo’s father. Really these it Honourable Member. are the issues that we should address as this House, We talked about mopane worm Honourable Minister, because if we are going to forget them, even in future we we will get in touch with you to see that in our will be in this situation. I take it that we will cooperate Constituencies; at Bokalaka where I am from, Nkange, on this no matter which side you are on, it is an issue North East, Tati West, Phikwe, Bobonong, Tonota and that affects us all and we need to act on it. Thank you others, we earn a living through mopane worm. I think Honourable Member. plans will be made like the Honourable Minister just indicated. An Honourable Member who is a friend of mine Honourable Boko mentioned another issue that broke Job creation: Mr Speaker, we have a problem of food we my heart yesterday, indicating that issues of Gender- import outside our country. It is high time every district Based Violence (GBV), at times our sisters end up in establishes a food processing centre; there should be these situation, not because they want to but because of an egg collection centre, a meat processing centre, a their situation, which result in killings. This is caused vegetable centre and a dry grain storage where food that by unemployment in our country. Our people are we produce can be stored. I think that if every district complaining, you will find that they are not working. can do that, that will stop us from importing food from When a young woman is not working, where and outside and everyone who has grown food can take it how do they buy toiletries? When I say toiletries, you there. One will wonder who those customers will be and are elders you understand what I mean. Maybe if the where they will purchase those products from. It gets to situations permit, we will have to introduce a monthly a point where food… unemployment allowance so that they can also earn a living, so that when there is an interview at Phikwe, they MR LUCAS: Clarification. Thank you Honourable can be able to pay for transport and go for the interview. Moabi. Today you are right. When I heard you talk We will have to consider that if the situations permit. about the importance of the unemployment benefit,

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whereby those who are not working can maybe be paid wherever they are, if someone makes a mistake and does allowances, I realised that you are very right. not say something right, they should advise them like Honourable Member was advising me. I appreciate the There is this issue of mopane worm, I have indicated advice Honourable Member of Parliament for Tonota. earlier on that to export or sell mopane worm to other countries, has increased four times/four folds. What are HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Inaudible)… your thoughts in regard to it because really we make a living with mopane worm Honourable Member? MR MOABI: Yes, we speak Setswana a lot, you speak it the way you speak it and I speak it in an Ikalanga MR MOABI: I hear you Honourable Member, it seems way, but there is no problem because we speak the same like we are talking a lot about the issue of mopane Setswana, and we understand each other. Thank you worm because we all harvest it. The way Honourable Honourable Member. Minister Kereng answered it, she answered it earnestly and clearly. I take it that we are with you Honourable HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Inaudible)… Member, we will continue to work with Honourable MR MOABI: Milk centre; Mr Speaker, the President Member there, to assist you Honourable Member. talked about shortage of milk in our country. It is time HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Murmurs)… that now we experiment like we see what is being done in Kenya. Mr Speaker, homes in Kenya have a cow MR MOABI: As I have indicated about the food we each, which they milk every morning and then there is a produce will be taken to schools. Honourable Speaker, car which takes that milk to the milk centre. Even us as we will be eating millet, squash melon at schools; our own food that comes from our ploughing fields. I think we are facing this challenge of milk, it is high time we those are the existing issues. We still see in our country do what Kenyans do, we can start with 500 homes and students eating sugar beans from China, it is high time give them two cattle each, if a cow produces 30 litres, we stop importing food from those far places when two of them will produce 60 litres. Then there can be a we have beans that are produced by our parents in the car which takes that milk wherever it should be taken. ploughing fields, why is traditional food not eaten in With this initiative I am telling you, we cannot suffer schools, what is the problem? with shortage of milk…

Mr Speaker, we should create jobs for ourselves and feed HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Applause!)… ourselves and everyone should have a food processing centre in their Constituency Honourable Members. MR MOABI: …or suffer the way we are suffering with If we can do that, we will decrease the high import no milk. I take it that Honourable Minister of Agriculture bill and unemployment. I saw maize being imported and Honourable Manake are listening attentively and outside Botswana recently, and then I wondered how they can implement those kind of experiments. that happened because we have so much maize locally. These things should come to an end, and we should Harvesting of rain water; Mr Speaker, the Constituency consume things that are available locally and not those I am from has so many rivers. As you continue doing that are from outside the country Honourable Speaker. the review of Integrated Support Programme for Arable Agriculture Development (ISPAAD), include Small stock; let me thank the President like I indicated this issue to see how we can harvest water that flows earlier on, for seeing it as necessary or appropriate … freely during the rainy season. We have many rivers in my constituency, the likes of Zhalangemate, Zezumbe, MR MOATLHODI: Procedure. Thank you Mr Gwebasetjana, Ntomba, Ntshe, Vukwi and Mavange… Speaker. Let me help you Honourable Member of Parliament. “His Excellency the President of this HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Laughter!)… country,” not “President, President” like you are talking about someone harvesting Morojwa. “His Excellency MR MOABI: …and if we could make this programme the President of this country.” properly, this water could be harvested and we could use it. We would be able to plough the foliage which MR MOABI: Thank you Honourable Member. It is we could feed to the dairy cows. I believe you will look important that you are here to guide us and advise us into such things extensively, using the gabion system to this way. These are the things we wish to see, everyone harvest water.

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Mr Speaker since I can see that time is almost up, we not made to grow using injections. It is the Tswana have the performing artists, for whom this year is not chicken breed, which I am sure everyone of us here a good one. Let me request you Honourable Minister loves. It is high time Mr Speaker that when we come of Youth that the youth who are currently not thriving, up with programmes, we go around and teach people as it was mentioned that it will only be opened next about this breed. In my constituency Mr Speaker, I have year once the COVID has subsided, you should come already liaised with those who have the expertise. I have up with a programme which can revive them. I know, a gentleman called Mbaakanyi Lenyatso, the guru. He is I understand that maybe some have already sold their one of the people who have the expertise regarding this equipment or instruments in order to survive, once it is Tswana breed. opened, look for another programme that could assist the performing arts Honourable Member. HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Inaudible)…

Honourable Minister Mzwinila, I would like to thank MR MOABI: I wish the Ministry of Agriculture, could you. I saw the number of youth you appointed to your ask him to assist them with dealing with this Tswana boards; I would like to thank you for what you did sir. It breed, and if we could do so, we cannot stay for two was not enough nonetheless because we have so many weeks without chickens. young and capable people in Botswana. We should MINISTER OF HEALTH AND WELLNESS (DR seriously consider them Mr Speaker. We should see the DIKOLOTI): Elucidation. Thank you Mr Speaker, youth included in boards, maybe say the Chairperson I thank you Honourable Member, you are on the of the Citizen Entrepreneurial Development Agency right track regarding the Tswana chicken breed. Just (CEDA) and the Botswana Unified Revenue Service (BURS) boards being youth. Let us not just keep them to expand a bit on what you were saying, we have to there, let us give them a responsibility because we have appreciate that this broiler breed Ross, has come up as a the youth who have been given a responsibility to run result of extensive research. They were considering its the country… deficiency that when it takes in some feeds, how much time does it take to build flesh, and so forth. Let us not HONOURABLE MEMBER: Elucidation. mix them much, let us encourage its keeping and the MR MOABI: …in this very House. I will yield Tswana breed as well so that the people can pick what is Honourable. We have youth who run the country in this important. Thank you. House… HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Laughter!)… HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Inaudible)… MR MOABI: Sir, I am still saying let us support MR MOABI: …who were… the Tswana breed, which originates in our country. I have talked about Ross, it is from UK and the Ross HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Laughter!)… grandparent comes from the UK. We cannot encourage MR MOABI: …given a responsibility. Let us see the or support things that come from far when we have youth being given responsibilities in the various boards our own in Botswana. It is high time we believed in out there. Let every ministry take responsibility as to ourselves as Batswana… how the youth could be engaged. Mr Speaker, I am HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Applause!)… drawing to a close; last time I saw chicken farmers lamenting because there were no chicks. We have our MR MOABI: …we should not just have confidence in own Tswana chicken breed in our country and each things that come from outside. A time has come for us one of us here has that breed at home and we grew up to believe in our own things. You as Ministers, it is high eating it. When we talk about broilers, the Ross breed time you ensured that in your Ministries you support originates from the United Kingdom (UK), it came to local. Zambia and then Botswana. It is not our own breed, so what can happen if we could keep our own breed; it can Honourable Billy, I am yielding for you. be eaten in schools and be packaged as we always see HONOURABLE MEMBER: He no longer wants it. others packaged. This breed can yield benefits quickly because it does not even require too many feeds. It is MR MOABI: I take it that…

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HONOURABLE MEMBER: You are sucking up to that challenged me to embark on those issues, the the Minister of… reason why I am standing here today is as a result of talking about corruption. Mr Speaker, we are not going MR MOABI: I am yielding… anywhere. As a country, we were told that there is an MR MANGWEGAPE-HEALY: Elucidation. Thank amount of P100 billion that disappeared in Botswana. you Honourable Member. I wanted to elucidate on that Right now, it is in everyone’s eye that this thing has issue of young people and leadership, that in this country, collapsed. If there is something you have to be cautious we have a track record. The likes of Daniel Keatametse about as a Government, is to bring up false charges Kwelagobe; he was a Member of Parliament at the age against anybody, for whatever reason. of 26. Mr Festus Mogae was Permanent Secretary to the President at the age of 32. Sir Seretse Khama, he took If you are a responsible Government, no matter how this country in his early 40s, so the youth are the ones much you can hate a person, you should not use who have built this country. Let the youth be given an Government institutions to charge him or her for things opportunity because they have already proven that they that are not true just for political gain. We see cases have the ability. I thank you Honourable Member. being dropped, they are dropped before our eyes. When we look at the National Petroleum Fund (NPF) case, the MR MOABI: I thank you Honourable Member. Judge has ordered that the state does not have a case Actually it is true, I agree with you and we date far hence the charges against the accused people should back when dealing with issues of youth, the Botswana be dropped and that P82 million should be returned to National Youth Council (BNYC) and so forth and now so and so. This thing should come as a lesson, if we we are here in Parliament. Let the youth also be given are a government who learns from her mistakes, a an opportunity to run things as you have been pointing government who can admit her mistakes, if we still have out. Mr Speaker, I have debated at length, particularly conscience, we should not go through this again because regarding the Tswana chicken breed, which can benefit it is a disgrace. us in our country. In the event that during my debate I offended anyone, please pardon me in advance, that was MINISTER FOR PRESIDENTIAL not the intension. AFFAIRS, GOVERNANCE AND PUBLIC ADMINISTRATION (MR MORWAENG): On a While on that point, let me thank Honourable Nkawana point of clarification. Thank you Honourable Kapinga. who withdrew what he had said during his previous Let me ask, through you Mr Speaker…as the Executive, debate. That is the spirit we want as leaders that at times the government does not take part in deciding who when we err and we fail to address another Member should be prosecuted. That is my own understanding properly, one should come and apologise like I was and how our procedures are outlined. I believe that that apologising to my friend Honourable Boko there. Let us is the procedure that you know very well Honourable learn to do that Honourable Members, colleagues. With Kapinga. those remarks Mr Speaker, I thank you. MR KAPINGA: No Honourable Minister, maybe you MR KAPINGA (OKAVANGO): When I was do not know, the government does take part. If you are campaigning in Okavango, asking them to vote for me, the government and your ministries inform the nation the main subject that I talked about was corruption Mr that P100 billion disappeared in the country, as the Speaker. I would like to start my debate by pointing out President, Minister of Defence, Justice and Security, that the way things are going, we are not going anywhere Attorney General and Directorate of Public Prosecutions as a country in terms of fighting corruption. Division (DPP), and you allow things just to roll like that, knowing very well that there is no way P100 billion MR LEUWE: Procedure. No, the clock has started can disappear in this country without knowing who took moving, it was just stagnant Mr Speaker and we were it, you would have failed to carry out your responsibility. wondering how come Honourable Kapinga’s time is not If you are a leader and you go around saying that people moving. laundered P100 billion and you are going to deal with them, that you are going to prosecute them, you would HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Laughter!)… not be doing your responsibility as a leader. So I would MR KAPINGA: I will punish you Friction. … like to advise the Honourable Members that political (Laughter!)… I thank you Mr Speaker. The main issue leadership should not be involved in issues relating to

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court cases. We should leave them to the relevant people out in America. She was abused and killed. Her name so that they to do their job. If this was not political and is Polly Klaas. It was in one state California. Because for us to believe that you were not involved, when they are a country that learns from their mistakes, they things turn out like this, you should go and take action made mistakes when handling that case, they responded against people who you have appointed in the Attorney many days after the child was taken. They found her General positions, DPP positions because they have dead, having been abused. We should be realising failed to carry out the task that they were assigned to do that since we do not understand this GBV, we should and they have embarrassed us. Right now, people and conduct a comprehensive research and then we come up other countries are laughing at us because of the chaos with a comprehensive policy review which also include in our country. I know that you are not going to take the Standing Orders of police services, changing them action against anyone. We will forget, time will pass and completely so that every police officer will know that we will eventually pretend to have forgotten about this there is a different structure or format in dealing with because it is said that we are a nation that forgets easily. GBV. Instead of trying to set up units which you will not even afford to fund to cover the whole country, because I am moving onto Gender Based Violence (GBV). GBV is not concentrated only in Gaborone, it happens in Honourable Members, you cannot manage a serious the whole country, I believe every police officer should issue like GBV with a knee jerk reaction. This thing is be capacitated to deal with GBV. So I do not support the a systematic social problem. When it start being evident that gender based violence is increasing, we are not idea in which you are saying that a unit will be created. supposed to behave like…it is said that people at the Back in the days when there was a high trend of stock mines were banged with hammers on the knees as a theft, it was said that we are creating a stock theft unit. fitness test, and when you kick like this, they would say When it increases, we are creating specialised courts. that you are fit enough to go and work in the mine. It is not the solution. You have to look holistically into how you handle things because this is a system; it is HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Inaudible)… a criminal justice system. We should assess from the MR KAPINGA: Yes, it is true. Honourable Members, beginning to the end. From the police service, why is an issue like this one requires comprehensive research their preventive capacity failing to prevent these things? that will support policy that you will come up with as a We should ask ourselves if it is failing or not. Are the way to combat GBV. A comprehensive research should police officers able to prevent these things or are they be conducted. When I was a police office, we realised failing? that there was a high trend of rape cases which were now becoming uncontrollable, I advised my supervisors Two; why is it so hard for these issues to reach the police or that we should carry out research about rape and allied are they reported well? Why are they failing to investigate offences. We did that. We commissioned Dr Eva Procek, them the way they are supposed to investigate them? he conducted a research which resulted in change of Why is it hard for the DPP to prosecute them the way it policy and the law. The law changed, as a result of should? Why is it hard for the Courts of Law to finish the evidence which comes from the research by an these matters in a short period of time? independent researcher. That is what I would like to see Challenge regarding verdicts; if there is a challenge being done by the Government so that it does not seem regarding verdicts, what is it? We should not use a knee like our knees were knocked and then we kicked our jerk reaction to deal with such a serious issue. leg and decided that we will have a police toll-free line. Is there evidence that people were not able to reach the The other thing that we have to notice is that GBV is police on 999 hence the introduction of another toll free a social problem. It is a reflection of the condition in number which has more figures than 999? It takes some which our society is. I believe that the culprits study the good memory for one to remember 0800 600 or 144, but society that they live in, they 999 is there. There should be an investigation that since 999 is there, what is stopping people from reporting realise that they are no longer subject to effective GBV cases to the police, instead of rushing to introduce control by their relatives. In the past, uncles or members a toll-free number. who do not have authority over you used to deal with anyone who would do these things. This resulted in Secondly, I want to give you an example of how things what is known as social restraint. So nowadays, our are done. In the past years, a child was abducted on a sleep society is unable to impact and restrain anyone with

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such intentions. They cannot restrain people from doing I am moving on to Constitutional review Mr Speaker. that. We are saying, let people recognise the authority of Honourable Members, we have to respect our uncles, Dikgosana or whatever is there which is meant Constitution. We are not supposed to take it lightly, to manage conflict in our society. The other reason why we informed people that we are going to review the we are challenged by Gender-Based Violence (GBV) Constitution… is because we do not have effective, adequate conflict management structures because for you to defeat this MR SPEAKER: Order! Order! Honourable Kapinga, thing, you must deal with the root cause. As a nation of you will continue with the review of the Constitution Botswana, how do we manage conflicts between people after the health and the COVID-19 break. Honourable in a relationship or lovers? In the absence of uncles like Members, let us rise for COVID break. in towns, are parents, Dikgosana and social workers PROCEEDINGS SUSPENDED AT 4:03 P.M. FOR able to influence behaviour of these people? I have APPROXIMATELY 30 MINUTES realised that… PROCEEDINGS RESUMED AT 4:34 P.M. HONOURABLE MEMBER: Clarity. “EXCHANGE OF SPEAKERSHIP” MR KAPINGA: Yeah, I will give you Honourable Motaosane. I believe that is the root cause of all these …Silence… problems that we have. Those who are supposed to MR SPEAKER (MR PULE): I think we are now influence behaviour of people are not doing so and as a quorated. I request Whips to do their job, meet your result, people do not feel restrained to resort to violence. members before. MR MOTAOSANE: Clarification. Thank you Honourable Members, let me make a small request. Honourable Kapinga. You really went deeper and We planned our time for debates looking at the number I understand you very well Honourable. If I hear of days which we are left for us. It is clear that we are you well, you are saying it in the form of a properly running out of time because instead of focusing on our constituted family or relationship. Maybe you have to debates, we waste time on point of procedure and point clarify it because in most cases, you will find that these of order. So I encourage us to do our best so we save issues occur between lovers who are on their own. The time Honourable Members. question is, if they have a conflict as lovers, do they ever Let us resume the debate on this Motion. When the engage those people or approach me as an uncle and say, House adjourned earlier, Honourable Kapinga was on “I and my partner had a misunderstanding?” I hear you the floor and he was left with 18 minutes 27 seconds. but you have to make it clear. Thank you sir. MR KAPINGA: Thank you Mr Speaker. I am MR KAPINGA: Yes sir. You will find that parents proceeding with my debate sir. I was on the issue of the know about these things. Right now, there is a picture Constitution and… circulating of a person who killed his girlfriend. It is a picture of them at her father’s house. They know him. MR LUCAS: Clarification. Thank you Mr Speaker. He is I believe as a nation, parents who are responsible for already talking about the Constitution but he was still on managing these things, let us take our time to find out the issue of GBV. There is an anecdotal evidence which what hinder us from influencing the behaviour of these indicates that in many cases, these issues of passion people such that they do not resort to violence rather to killing were reported to the police. It also indicates that peaceful conflict management processes. sometimes the police treat an offence on threat to kill like common nuisance when they charge. You are a Another point is victim protection. We have to investigate former high ranking police officer and an attorney so, I if the person who is whipped, a woman who is whipped do not know the procedure used when charging people. with a stick from time to time, if she has to leave home I am saying this because you might find that they are to a place of safety, do our policies provide her with contributing to cases of passion killing? an option which allow her to do that? We are lagging behind in terms of victim assistance in Botswana. These MR KAPINGA: Thank you Honourable Lucas. That are things which we have to assess and analyse deeply is what I was saying earlier on when I was talking so that we come up with appropriate policies. about Standing Orders. The important thing is to teach

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our police about the law so that they understand what to pull a wool over peoples` eyes. It is a serious issue constitutes an offence, right from scratch. and let me further assure you that the President believes that the Constitutional review should be inclusive of all Secondly, the police act according to discretion. This people in Botswana, they should contribute and come is to say, a police officer has to base their judgement with ideas on how to build this country. Thank you. on the report placed before them. This discretion has to be supported by the Standing Order which covers every MR KAPINGA: Thank you Honourable Minister. police officer, including those who are at Gobojango, I believe in action not words. There are people who Tshane and Takatokwane. That expectation arises from have smooth tongues, talking is not doing Honourable the fact that the leadership, police headquarters should Minister. So, you have spoken, now all we want is give guidelines which indicate that in these kind of action, in fact Honourable Minister of Presidential conditions, here are the steps to take. I must stress that Affairs, you should know that the President is part and this is an important point, I once talked about a case of parcel of Government. In other words, you cannot have Polly Klaas’ who was killed in America. So it is very the Government that side and the President on the other important for police management to assess, revise and side. I heard you say the President and Government but upgrade these standing orders which can help police the President and Government are one and the same officers to exercise their discretion when it comes to law. thing. Let me continue.

Constitutional review; Constitution is the fundamental Next, Malaria funding... law of the state which should be respected more than any other law in a country like Botswana and it should DR TSHABANG: Clarification. Thank you Honourable Speaker and Honourable Kapinga. The President talked not be easily suspended. If Government believes in about this Constitutional review in 2019 during State of the Constitution, an honest Government is addicted to the Nation Address (SONA). Honourable Morwaeng the rule of law and it should reflect firstly through her informed us in the past Parliament that by this time attitude towards the Constitution. In other words, the there will be terms of reference for Constitutional mind-set, the attitude towards the Constitution is the review, he said that in Parliament. The President then only window which can indicate that indeed you are came and informed us that we will start next year but it addicted to the rule of law. is a complicated process. In your view, is it not a way to procrastinate this process, there is no political will? When I was taught Constitution law at University of Botswana (UB) by Professor Nsereko, he always MR KAPINGA: Yes sir, that is my argument that the emphasised that absolute power corrupts, and absolute most important thing is action rather than just taking. It power corrupts absolutely. So if you are a President who is better to do than talk. believes in the rule of law, your mind-set and attitude should reflect that you do not believe in getting more I am moving on to the issue of Malaria; I am from an powers through the Constitution and I do not see that area where cases of Malaria are rife Mr Speaker. I was attitude from the current Government. I do not see it informed that funding of Malaria prevention, the spraying anywhere, I have never heard any statement from the exercise was seriously underfunded. So Honourable President indicating that he believes that his powers Members, I want to state that if we underfund an could be reduced. I believe that in order to show that we exercise such as this one, we are endangering the lives respect the Constitution and human rights, we should of people of Okavango. Spraying is one measure which have what is called Human Rights Commission not what has been helping to reduce the incidence of Malaria at is being said here. A full Human Rights Commission Okavango. will show if we are moving in the right path. Basic education; Honourable Fidelis Molao, we have MR MORWAENG: Clarification. Thank you very many temporary teachers at Okavango and some have much Honourable Kapinga. I would like to clarify that many years being employed as temporary teachers. So, His Excellency the President believes in comprehensive we are pleading with you to take this issue seriously Constitutional review, so does the Government. because there is no how you can expect the performance Honourable Kapinga, let me assure you that the of students at Okavango to improve whereas the majority Constitutional review we are talking about, which His of the staff are employed as temporary teachers. We are Excellency the President is talking about is not an act not even talking about the infrastructure of their schools.

40 Hansard No 200 Tuesday 17th November, 2020 RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT’S SPEECH Motion (Resumed Debate)

There are people employed as boarding assistants. MR MAJAGA: On a point of elucidation. Thank you These people are working with no employee benefits; Honourable Member of Parliament for Okavango. Did they do not have medical aid or any other benefit apart I hear you correctly when you said it is okay that the from their salary. They lodged their complaint to the Chieftaincy or Dikgosi can come and address issues relevant authorities but there is no change. They are still here, and when they are not here it is a problem? Maybe being employed on temporary basis and it has been four you are not explaining this issue clearly that Dikgosi years now with no common employee benefits. that maybe we can say are in the Constitution, some of the things they sometimes do is that they leave their job Mr Speaker, in Okavango there are schools which are of Chieftaincy and join politics, like we saw the likes built using reed, I will not stop talking about this issue. of Dr Khama, Kgosi Lotlamoreng and Kgosi Tawana. I will raise it today looking at the fact that you cannot So at the villages, there are many paramount Dikgosi expect certain results while students are attending who are now involved in politics. Some Dikgosi leave lessons in classes built using reed. Right now, the the chieftaincy to join politics and when we criticise President was talking about digitisation, when we talk them, we are seen as though we are attacking Dikgosi, about these things we should not do so looking at the whereas they are the ones who started politics. Some of situation of Gaborone only. Are you digitising Gaborone them we know that they resign and come to Parliament, or the entire country? When you talk about digitisation when they fail, they can go to Dikgotla or wherever. but there is an area which has schools built out of reed, how do you digitise those schools when they lack the MR KAPINGA: Yes Honourable Member. The issue basic infrastructure? Do you think you can connect the that I want to emphasise so that everyone can understand right technology in those schools? You will respond is that Dikgosi are not the property of Government. later Honourable …(Laughter!)… Dikgosi are there to serve the whole nation and the There is basic infrastructure required for you to digitise, whole nation and this Parliament include Members of you cannot digitise in a reed structure. So this contributes Parliament on the other side, and Members of Parliament to the situation whereby even if Fourth Industrial of the Opposition, and they are also part of Parliament, Revolution is being discussed, it excludes people of they have the right that from time to time when there are issues, they can sit down with Dikgosi and talk to them. Okavango because they are lagging behind in terms of When they are sitting down and discussing issues with development of the constituency and their schools. So Kgosi, we should not say this Kgosi is being political. when you talk about Fourth Industrial Revolution, it During the campaign of 2019, I sometimes saw Dikgosi means you exclude them. being summoned under the pretext that they were going Bogosi; the President said Bogosi should not be to be briefed by the Minister about developments of politicised. Honourable Members, to be honest your the area, but they were being told to campaign for the point is that if Dikgosi are talking to the Opposition, Minister. I also found a Kgosi arguing with a voter they are being politicised but when they talk to the saying, “how can you say the Shakawe-Sehithwa road is ruling party, then they are holding discussions with not good, how can the people of this area vote Botswana Dikgosi, that is very wrong. Democratic Party when the road is like this, how can you say that, do you not know that Masisi is cleaning up HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Inaudible)… the country?” Kgosi arguing in a parking area, in public. Then you say Dikgosi are involved in politics when they MR KAPINGA: If we are here with you, what are we are the ones who are involving themselves in politics. discussing? …(Laughter!)… We have a right to address They think that when you support the ruling party, that Dikgosi and if you were honest people and you talk is when you are showing loyalty to the country, that is about inclusive Government, you should know that wrong. We should all send the message, Kgosi should the President and the Minister of Presidential Affairs know that he can work with a Member of Parliament have the privilege to address Ntlo ya Dikgosi, also the from the ruling party and Members of Parliament from Leader of the Opposition in equal measure, has the right the Opposition in equal measure because we are all to go and address Dikgosi regarding the governance lawfully elected representatives in this Parliament. of Botswana. He is part and parcel of the governance th of this country as Leader of the Opposition in the 12 Getting onto the issue of land, Honourable Members, Parliament. the Okavango area is an area that is troubled by poverty.

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People have long been requesting to be allocated plots, Mr Speaker, there is no problem with someone reporting plots which they can use to take themselves out of to another person how they are doing in their home. If poverty. Then you will find that a trust, sometimes even they are not well, they will say they are not well, and an individual, a trust has long requested a plot in 2003, if they are well they will tell you that no, we are fine. and up until now they have not been allocated that plot. So it is not a problem that when we are standing here, talking about the problems that people are facing, there Then you wonder that if you prevent a person from are those who will wonder why we are saying what we making a living like this, how do you expect them to get will be saying. themselves out of poverty. Mr Speaker, as a country, we are under threat of the MR MOATLHODI: On a point of clarification. I have Coronavirus. This virus Honourable Member, I wanted humbled myself Mr Speaker. Thank you Honourable to talk to my colleagues because we do not meet often, Member of Parliament. I want to hear your take on the we meet occasionally, but most of us do not meet, the poverty stricken people in regard to land allocation. virus is here, it is real and it kills. So we request that our colleagues at Constituencies, wherever Motswana is, we MR KAPINGA: Every resident of Botswana, every should try to listen to the advice of the health officials citizen has a right to be allocated land with the hope that and do what we are told so that we are not infected by when they have been allocated land like everyone, they this virus Mr Speaker. That is my request Honourable can do something in their lives that can improve their Member, as we hear that it is a dangerous virus and it economic status. does not have a cure, when it infects people with some health problems like me, we are so much at risk. I am getting onto the issue of electricity. There is an issue that is very surprising whereby you will find that Mr Speaker, as Government, we should consider what Botswana Power Corporation (BPC) has connected we can do about churches. Everywhere you go there are electrical cables in a village and people expect that complaints, believers want to be free to pray, and pray electricity will be connected to their homes, but when for this satanic virus to leave us. So Mr Speaker, I do not they go to BPC to request for connection of electricity, know what the problem is, what really is making it hard they are told that no, land board did not give you for our people to be allowed to meet in their churches certificates. Honourable Members, you know about and pray. this issue and you have long known about it, but you are dragging your feet to rectify it so that people like Mr Speaker, this virus is there. We know that there those in Mohembo East and the likes of Okavango can are some developments in our Constituencies and also use electricity just like any Motswana who has had I am going to focus on my Constituency, since it is a electricity connected for them in Botswana. So I do not Constituency that is left behind, that has a lot of poverty, know why you are dragging your feet, and have people I am going to focus on it so that Government can hear, living in appalling conditions. so that our people can hear that it is not like we are not saying anything in Parliament, the only challenge is that National Transformation Team; when you come here we would be told that there are no funds. I would like to to speak Honourable Members, I want you to tell us say even when there are no funds, even if we have been something about this task team which you established hit by a pandemic; know that we have made promises at and were boasting about, what has it done that you can our constituencies. We went around telling people in our show as the results of the team that you established. areas that we were going to do this and that for them. Thank you Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker, you are a Member of Parliament, you know MR KABLAY (LETLHAKENG-LEPHEPHE): that at your constituency in Mochudi East, when you Thank you Mr Speaker. Let me also thank the President hear something being said about it in Parliament that, for his speech that he put before us, to report on how his ‘this and that is going to be done,’ you would be the Government is doing and the problems his Government first one to be seen at the constituency to go and inform is facing. With the little knowledge that I have, I think them that my ‘Government is saying in such and such that that means that even us as Members of Parliament, a year, they are going to do this and this for you in this we have to come here to also report on how our constituency I am representing.’ People would be happy Constituencies are doing. and they would say, “Our Member of Parliament is

42 Hansard No 200 Tuesday 17th November, 2020 RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT’S SPEECH Motion (Resumed Debate)

representing us very well in Parliament. Let our Member remind him about the Tonota Primary Hospital which of Parliament continue, we are going to re-elect him was talked about in 1981. Maybe we should request His because he is fulfilling his assignment and mandate. He Excellency the President to go to Tonota, probably that brings back good reports.” When you leave that place, is when he would appreciate the importance of a hospital you would be happy Mr Speaker and the people you are in Tonota. Honourable Member, please; asseblief tog! representing would be happy too. MR KABLAY: I thank you my leader, Mr Moatlhodi. Mr Speaker, I am saying these words because it would I hear you sir, I believe the Honourable Minister is not be proper because we had been promised a primary listening to you. hospital in Letlhakeng up to Takatokwane and Salajwe I would like to talk about the bus rank that the Ministry of like my colleague Honourable Leuwe was saying. The Local Government has long promised us in Letlhakeng. issue is the Letlhakeng primary hospital. We are all The projects in Letlhakeng have now regressed. I do waiting for this hospital to be built. We know what the not know what the problem is. Is it a result of piling up challenges faced by our Government are. We know that Corona is there but life has to go on. We have to things saying they will be done? When we are hoping do like we are doing in other constituencies. Although they would be done, we keep being told that there are no here and there developments could be affected, they funds, until we got hit by a pandemic. Now everything have to be done nonetheless like it is happening in other is at a standstill because the pandemic has taken all constituencies. Back at the constituency, they would say the funds. Mr Speaker, people in my constituency are to me, “So the hospital project is failing here Kablay, beginning to have doubts about me. Everything that was but why are things being done that side?” We are one supposed to be done for them has been halted. What I am family, so we have to share the little resources that we going to say to the people? We had said we were going have. We cannot take all the developments and pile to upgrade health posts in Malwelwe and Boatlaname to them at one place, yet other areas also need them. become clinics, but those projects have been stopped. Everything is at a standstill. The day Kgotla meetings HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Applause!)… are opened for, what are we going to say to the people? The promises are there on the Government documents. MR KABLAY: We cannot do that. Mr Speaker, we They are captured and they are supposed to be done for have to try to put up developments here and there so the people. Right now, I am just dancing to one tune; I that it could be better. It should not be totally blank, no! do not know what to say to the people. The Honourable That is not how we should go about it. Minister does not have clear answers as well. We are Honourable Dikoloti is listening to me, please go and told there is no money, all the money has been taken by build the Letlhakeng Primary Hospital. The plot where Corona. I do not know how we are going to go about this hospital should be constructed is the one that was these things because these are things that affect peoples` used as the show ground. We got that showground for lives. People ought to have clinics where they can seek the purposes of building a hospital and we said we medical assistance. We take it that in our country, health would look for another plot for the showground. We are comes first. So if there are no health facilities, how will going to build a primary hospital in that piece of land. they be cured? If there is no good health, whom are we Indeed the show committee released it and gave it to going to govern because people are going to be killed us. Therefore, this is just a reminder that everything has by diseases? Mr Minister, I am glad you are here, please been done, so the Honourable Minister should just call see to it how you could assist us with clinics. caterpillars. Please invite me so that we can go and do Mr Speaker, we are facing challenges regarding roads. the groundbreaking, and commence the building of this This one about roads, I never want to leave it behind. hospital. There are no roads in the constituency I am representing. MR MOATLHODI: On a point of elucidation Mr We have long lamented about roads and we begged that Speaker. I thank you Mr Speaker. I thank you very much atleast there should be a thin layer of tarmac. We are my leader, my colleague. You are representing the people implementing the National Development Plan (NDP) of your constituency very well, 100 per cent. May God 11, I am sure it is going to pass and in my constituency strengthen your feet and your mind and everything, so there will not even be a single tarmac road. There is not that you can continue representing them like that. Please even one road there, none!

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HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Murmurs)… this and that, that is when they can scrape it a bit here and there. MR KABLAY: So one wonders what kind of life this is. As Honourable Kapinga was saying, our constituencies Mr Speaker, I understand the situation our country is in are still trailing behind in terms of developments. They but our people have long suffered because of the roads. are areas ravaged by poverty and for one to develop Ever since I came to Parliament, when Mr Mokgothu people, the roads have to be upgraded. There should was here as well, he talked about these roads. People be roads so that resources and amenities would be able have long been patient about the issue of roads. Ever to reach the people. People should have an interest in since I came to Parliament, Honourable Mokgothu creating businesses there so that our people would be came to Parliament still talking about these roads, able to develop themselves, and do certain things for people are now saying that they have always aired themselves because roads would be there. Unfortunately, this grievances to the Members of Parliament and they people are still being choked by the white dusty roads are still complaining to me about it, but nothing is and that is a problem. The Honourable Minister happening and they are asking me what could be the responsible for roads, even if you try to talk to him, he problem. Honourable Minister, please do something just giggles, probably saying, “look at this little foolish about these roads. Member of Parliament.” Mr Speaker, we do have electricity. I want to applaud HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Murmurs)… the Minister of Mineral Resources, Green Technology and Energy Security for what he has done, even though MR KABLAY: I do not know whether that is how he thinks. We cannot run the country like that; we cannot. there are a few areas which still do not have electricity. You have connected electricity to the areas which were If a constituency is big like this, there is nothing that remaining; Diphuduhudu and Loologane and I have to you can entice the people with when requesting for thank you Minister. I believe that you have a plan in place votes. If it can be said elections are going to be held for you to go and connect electricity at the remaining tomorrow, what I am I going to entice people with so that they can vote for me? What is it because nowadays areas so as to ensure that the whole of Lephephe has for one to be elected, people have to see a good record electricity. I do not have a shred of doubt that you will of accomplishment and say, “despite not having done do that because I can already see your efforts. all the things, at least there is an effort.” If nothing is Mr Speaker, we have challenges. As I have just said, happening at all… the President was here to address us about what he is MR MAJAGA: On a point of elucidation Mr Speaker. dealing with and what he is managing to do. So this is I will not use much of your time Honourable Member. a time for us to address him, we should not just come I thank you Honourable Kablay. The roads in your here to applaud him without informing him about constituency that you have been talking about since the challenges that are found at his constituency; that 2014 to 2019, such as the Kubung road, has none of is the President’s constituency. When he addresses them been constructed? This was a serious lamentation meetings there, he does not ask why I did not tell him in your constituency. Will they be constructed in NDP that there are challenges there. We always talk, the 11 or nothing is promising? District Commissioners have talked and I have talked to Ministry of Basic Education about one school called MR KABLAY: Thank you Honourable Majaga. Macheng at Sojwe. That school is dilapidated, it is as Honourable Member, the roads that I always talk good as dead. Students of this school are from areas like about going to Malwelwe, Botlhapatlou, Ngware, Diphuduhudu and Ngware. So parents of these students Diphuduhudu, Loologane, Moshaweng, Monwane are complaining that their children are not treated well and Mantshwabisi, nothing has been done. There is no at this school. The school is dilapidated; there are no single road that was constructed. At least if they could doors, ceiling and windows, and children just use these have done three kilometres, it could be much better. The buildings but it is a boarding school. So Mr Speaker, roads in the area I am representing are very pathetic. I parents are very angry. We long talked about these do not know what I am going to say to my constituents issues when Mr Arone was Minister of Basic Education because even grading the roads is a challenge. For the and we are still talking about them but nothing is being road to be graded, I have to run helter skelter and say done. I plead that the Minister should stand up and see

44 Hansard No 200 Tuesday 17th November, 2020 RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT’S SPEECH Motion (Resumed Debate)

what we can do about that school. Parents of those what do we do when a vehicle breaks down? People students are very angry Honourable, we should go and would then spend the whole day without drinking water see that it becomes a proper school as it should be. and children would not be cooked for at schools. We plead that Moshaweng settlement should be given We have a settlement called Loologane; it is a Sesarwa attention, we should see how we can assist these areas remote area. We moved people from Central Kalahari so that they can have water. Game Reserve (CKGR), some from Kgalagadi and other areas to Loologane. We built a police office for them Mr Speaker, we were once promised a cultural village at and clinics; all prestigious buildings are found there. Diphuduhudu and they rushed to go and allocate a plot There is only one thing that I always talk about, that we for it. Minister Tshekedi was the minister then, he rushed have moved these people but there is no Headman of there and promised people of Diphuduhudu that they are Record there. For these people to be put on trial, they going to build a cultural village, but even up to date they have to walk all the way to Sojwe and Lephephe to go have not done anything. I plead with the Minister that and be prosecuted there, and they go there with their they should attend this matter at Diphuduhudu, we have own Headman. Honourable Minister Molale’s ministry a plot that we want to use to ensure that the culture of has built him a Kgotla air conditioned office. So it is those people does not vanish. They should know how to a challenge to appoint this Kgosi to be Headman of build their houses which they used in the past as well as Record so that he can prosecute his people closer to how they used to make fire. This is one of the things that their homes, being with them. This is a challenge at we are waiting for at Diphuduhudu. Loologane. I request that the ministry should talk to the office of Kgosikgolo of Molepolole. I do not know Mr Speaker, I was thinking that if there is anything that if office of Kgosikgolo at Molepolole was enlightened is being changed, if Ministry of Local Government and about Loologane and areas like Diphuduhudu; that they Rural Development has something that they want to are special areas and how they should be assisted. I correct, they should inform us Members of Parliament. Right now there is confusion at my constituency, that would like to plead with the Minister that he should go Poverty Eradication programme has been changed at and do that. Moshaweng and other areas. People are given goats as clusters, a specific number of people are selected and MR MOATLHODI: Elucidation. Thank you Mr then they are given about 35 or 30 goats and then they Speaker. I am not negatively influencing you, so hear me are told that they are a cluster and that they should look out and understand me. When you start asking if office after those goats. People call me asking me to clarify of Kgosikgolo at Molepolole has been enlightened, this for them, but now as the Member of Parliament, people of Loologane and other areas have a right to I am not in a position to do that because no one has appoint their Kgosi. People who come from elsewhere informed me about the changes that have been made should not be appointed as their Kgosi while they are regarding the goats that are given out under the Poverty there. This is a developed and a democratic country. Eradication programme. They have not informed us that Next time I want to hear you telling me that residents they saw it fit to give people goats as clusters. This thing of Loologane have appointed their own Kgosi. He or has put me in trouble because I do not know how to she should not be appointed for them from elsewhere, answer those people. So I would like to ask the minister never! Otherwise we will turn from our graves. to tell us how they saw it relevant to use this initiative, MR KABLAY: Thank you Mr Speaker. No Honourable, what was wrong with the old one and how the current we have elected our Kgosi, the problem is that they one can be useful. are denying him the rights that will make him a Kgosi Mr Speaker, we have beautiful streams at Sojwe. whose office and position would allow him to rule that When you get to Sojwe and Shadishadi you will see settlement, to take action against his people and do other streams which are full of clean water. I would like to things instead of his people travelling 30 kilometers to ask the Minister of Environment, Natural Resources go and be prosecuted. Conservation and Tourism to visit or send her officers to Mr Speaker, let us talk about water. We have water Sojwe and Shadishadi to go and see if those two streams crisis at Moshaweng. A great tragedy has befallen that cannot be used as tourist attractions in our constituency settlement and the same thing applies to Boatlaname. so that people of Sojwe and Lephephe can benefit from There is no water, we are supported by a bowser. So the beauty of nature. This high unemployment, maybe

Hansard No 200 45 Tuesday 17th November, 2020 RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT’S SPEECH Motion (Resumed Debate)

young people can be interested to venture into it and see they tell me that these cracks keep increasing. So I how that beauty can... request the Minister to take action, ensure that residents of Letlhakeng are compensated so they can create jobs MINISTER OF ENVIRONMENT, NATURAL for themselves. RESOURCES CONSERVATION AND TOURISM (MS KERENG): Elucidation. Thank you Mr Speaker, Lastly Mr Speaker, let me talk about Remote Area thank you Honourable Kablay. It is clear that you are Dwellers’ Office (RADO) at Letlhakeng. It has really taking care of your Constituency. I saw the beauty completely ignored residents of Diphuduhudu, it is of Sojwe pans over the weekend and I have summoned failing to take care of students who are doing Form 1 officials from my office to go and map it accordingly. to Form 5. This office Mr Speaker, does not provide We are going to assess both Sojwe and Shadishadi pans students with toiletry; soap, colgate, what are they as they are located along Khutse Game Reserve route. expected to use while at school? When other students We are going to trail tourists and self-drivers, those who bath and brush their teeth, these students will be sitting travel to Khutse; we encourage nearby villages to group on the sun but Government issued funds such that themselves through Trusts which we are going to assist students from Diphuduhudu and Loologane can be such that the youth, women and the community will be assisted. This is a distressing situation Mr Speaker. As able to use that pan. I believe this pan can be used as a I speak, students from Diphuduhudu were admitted at meeting place for tourism activities, they can rest there Salajwe and Takatokwane and they went there without and they can start during Christmas. I am impressed. school uniform. Students from Diphuduhudu have nothing to wear while other students wear their school HONOURABLE MEMBER: Clarification. uniform. These students wear worn out trousers and MR KABLAY: Thank you my Minister. I am very unpolished and worn out shoes. happy that you also saw that beauty, residents of Sojwe, HONOUERABLE MEMBERS: ...(Laughter!)... Shadishadi and Lephephe are really going to benefit from it. HONOURABLE MEMBER: Clarification.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Inaudible)… MR KABLAY: Why is this happening when officers were appointed to assist these students, what are they MR KABLAY: Mr Speaker, it has been 10 years since doing Minister? Why do they take cars from Letlhakeng the Ministry of Local Government beautified our roads claiming that they are going to assist students from at Letlhakeng. We have beautiful roads which have Diphuduhudu? Mr Speaker, it is very wrong for officers electricity, the only problem is that when this road was of RADO from Letlhakeng to behave in this manner constructed Mr Speaker; when they tarred the road and when Government issued funds to assist these students. put up street lights, their houses developed some cracks We know that Diphuduhudu village is assisted through as they were using caterpillars. So Mr Speaker, residents Affirmative Action, if a student fails to perform well at of Letlhakeng have been waiting for compensation for school... 10 years, so they can use it to repair their houses. I MR MOTSAMAI: Clarification. Mr Speaker, I reckon am saying this because Molepolole Council promised that the Honourable Member is talking about the to compensate them for that purpose. Right now Mr distresses at his Constituency. I want to appreciate from Speaker, many of them have not yet been compensated him, when he experienced this situation, when he met but only a small number of them, but their houses have a RADO officer or a social worker who failed to assist cracked and are in a condition where they may collapse him then he met Council Secretary and others. What did at any time. The truth of the matter is that, we do not they end up telling him because it seems like he is fed up have money so most of us have only managed to build with them. Moreover, why are you so fed up with them one house. So they are not going to have shelter if this Honourable Kablay? Tell me so I can assist you if at all house cracks, collapses and injure them. The question there is a problem. Thank you. therefore is, what are we going to do about many people who reside at Letlhakeng? Mr Speaker, residents of HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Laughter!)... Letlhakeng have been consulted, all we have to do is to compensate them so they can repair their houses such MR KABLAY: Thank you Mr Speaker. Sir, I am saying that they do not collapse or further get damaged because these issues because I have complained about them

46 Hansard No 200 Tuesday 17th November, 2020 RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT’S SPEECH Motion (Resumed Debate)

everywhere, so I am very distressed. I want everyone to I was still talking about the Affirmative Action that at know about them because I do not want to compromise Diphuduhudu, our children are competing with their the lives of these kids. I do not want a situation where parents to work at Ipelegeng because they have nothing the President will visit Diphuduhudu tomorrow and they to do. Most of them still qualify to go to school but no will tell him about these issues, where he will ask me one is interested in sending them to schools. That is why why I did not raise them. My job is to talk about these you will find situations where people will be asking, “do issues, so I can talk to an officer but there is nothing that you know where I can find a herd man?” Yes, you can I can do if they do not want to assist me. Both of us do find them at Diphuduhudu, “do you know where I can not have that power Honourable, all we can do is to talk find a babysitter?” Go to Diphuduhudu. and go back to find if they did something about it only to find that there is no progress. For this reason, you will HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Applause!)… end up being distressed like me. MR KABLAY: That is the kind of lifestyle which my This Affirmative Action, if you can go there today, you constituents are living. On the contrary, the intention will find students from Diphuduhudu sitting at home. of Government is to improve the lives of these people This is because RADO office failed to make efforts so that they can look after their parents in future. Mr to send those kids to brigade or a school which offers Speaker, if the Government’s efforts are stagnant and textile training and this is what Government is saying. it is all because of one office, then we are expected to be silent and keep begging, we are not here to soothe HONOURABLE MEMBER: Clarification anyone Mr Speaker… Honourable Kablay. HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Laughter!)… MR KABLAY: That is the nature of RADO, they are failing in every area, I wonder if they do not prefer to MR KABLAY: …I was voted by people of assist their beneficiaries. Diphuduhudu.

MR MOSWAANE: Clarification. Thank you HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Applause!)… Honourable Kablay. The Honourable Member whom I MR KABLAY: The reason I am here is because I was love so much listed his distresses. Concerning the issue voted by people of Diphuduhudu. I thank you sir. of failing to adhere to instructions from a Member of Parliament, let me correct you by saying you actually MS MONNAKGOTLA (KGALAGADI NORTH): have more power which allows you to take three steps Thank you Mr Speaker. Good afternoon. I thank you for to solve that issue. If the situation does not change, I the time and opportunity you afforded me to comment am saying this because I do not want the nation nor on the speech by His Excellency the President. Let me residents of Diphuduhudu to believe that you are failing start by thanking Honourable Rakgare for supporting to do your job. There are three steps which you can take; women’s football team as we saw him traveling to South public servants have supervisors, before taking the third Africa, the women played excellently and ended up at step, you are free to consult Council Secretary, if the the finals although they lost to South Africa 2-1. It is a situation does not change, you may also proceed to the commendable effort. Permanent Secretary (PS) and the Minister. So, let it be Let me encourage the Ministry of Youth, Sports and clear that you are an Honourable Member. Thank you Culture to introduce women’s football at secondary so much. schools because it is good for them to start while they MR KABLAY: Thank you Mr Speaker. Sometimes we are young. Women football has a lot of potential and raise some issues but as long as they involve politics, can put the country on the map. These are the things I you are going to talk…(Inaudible)… such that I or would like to thank Honourable Minister Rakgare for. Honourable Molale will not be blamed if they fail in He should give the team the money he promised them if future, on the basis that we were told about them in they win against South Africa because they do not have Parliament… a sponsor, so they can keep doing a good job. The Government is reviewing Youth Development Fund HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Laughter!)… (YDF). As an Honourable Member of Parliament for MR KABLAY: …that it is recorded, he was there. That Kgalagadi North, I support YDF because I started my is what I believe in. business at the age of 27.

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HONOURABLE MEMBER: Women! Water; I can see the Government’s efforts to supply portable water and install water drainage system, these MS MONNAKGOTLA: If you are still young, you are commendable efforts. I want to talk about Kgalagadi have the strength to ensure that your business succeeds. North, I will not get tired of talking about water which is YDF can also enable these businesses to employ other supposed to be sourced from Ncojane to Matšheng area. youth. The only shortcoming I observed is monitoring; We do not have water! One Honourable Member said we need to change and perhaps benchmark from Local that not all projects will be mentioned in His Excellency Enterprises Authority (LEA) on their monitoring the President’s speech but I was hoping…People of process regarding Citizen Entrepreneurial Development Kgalagadi have extreme water shortage as compared Agency (CEDA) businesses. This is what I encourage to all areas in Botswana, even now, there is no water Government to undertake. at the hospital and schools, we bowse water from the Agriculture; the Government is reviewing all boreholes. I will never get tired of talking about this programmes for farming more especially Integrated project because we do not have water. Support Programme for Arable Agriculture Land… Development (ISPAAD). It is a commendable effort that she is reviewing programmes because some were not HONOURABLE MEMBER: Elucidation. better suited for our constituencies. Let me also embrace and acknowledge Government efforts more especially MS MONNAKGOTLA: May I please continue with the ones which encourage small stock farming and my allocated time. On the issue of land; His Excellency plead with the Honourable Ministers of Agriculture the President’s report shows a good initiative in land and Food Security that at Kgalagadi North we have small abattoirs. So they should support them by issuing allocation through Land Administration Procedure, them licences because a market has been secured as Capacity and Systems (LAPCAS). It is a good initiative! mentioned in His Excellency the President’s speech and There is the Land Management Reform Agenda which there are going to be slaughtered at Lobatse, Gaborone encourages mixed land use whereby if you have a field and Francistown, areas far away from Kgalagadi North. you can also build a lodge. It is a good programme For example; we have Kang Meat Market Abattoir and it because it is going to reduce land applications. These can reduce the transportation of small stock to Lobatse. are good initiatives being undertaken by the Minister of Furthermore, it is going to employ unemployed youth Land Management, Water and Sanitation Services. and reduce unemployment. Let me present it like that At Kgalagadi North, we do not have land for livestock before Honourable Ministers of Agriculture and Food grazing. Our land is reserved for wildlife, so if you can Security. consider allocating grazing land at Kgalagadi North we Still under agriculture, we can see that there is facilitation can boost BMC to be number one in the country. It is at Lubu Farm and it is going well. At Kgalagadi North one of the things we can do. we have Phuduhudu Artificial Insemination which has Education; the Government is doing very well in terms never been utilised, so I am pleading with this ministry of accommodation for teachers and school supplies. to allow us to use Phuduhudu Artificial Insemination However, I would like to urge the Government to focus in order to encourage farmers to breed quality stock so more at settlements because those children are suffering that we can sell them to Botswana Meat Commission and their performance is low. If you only focus on (BMC), and our small stock to Gaborone Abattoir children who are closer to the developments, those who because at Kgalagadi we do not have many diseases have no access to developments and are performing especially since farmers are selected. If the Ministry poorly will never see the light of day. So focus on of Agriculture and Food Security can consider these those who have no developments especially those at factors and open… settlements. People at settlements more especially HONOURABLE MEMBER: Elucidation. teachers are performing poorly, month end they go for the whole week. Those poor people do not have transport MS MONNAKGOTLA: …Phuduhudu Artificial because only big vehicles can travel on that terrain and Insemination, you could have done a good thing for to travel from Hukuntsi to Ukhwi you need a big vehicle those farmers and the country could strive because of in order to receive your salary at Jwaneng which takes agriculture. you an entire week to travel. Let the Ministry of Basic

48 Hansard No 200 Tuesday 17th November, 2020 RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT’S SPEECH Motion (Resumed Debate)

Education ensure that when those teachers come to get not only install the technology, then they do not know their salaries it provides transport for them to get back how to use that technology and then it becomes useless. to their destinations, so that students can continue with Those are some of the things that I saw it was necessary their studies and they are able to pass. It is some of the to talk about. things that I have seen. Even the students of settlements when schools are about to open, there is a school called Botswana Police; His Excellency the President Hunhukwe Boarding School, they are still using a truck indicated that crime has gone down. As a woman, there to be transported to school, but the policy states that is something that I can see is increasing with regards to students are supposed to be in a closed area. We act crime. There are drugs that are getting into Botswana, against this policy. Let us look at these things and rectify you will never know how they are getting into the them because those students are suffering. country when they are illegal. Let us look into this issue because it is destroying the future of the youth. We want I will get onto the issue of transport; citizen economic this country to have young people with bright futures, empowerment is evident Honourable Segokgo. Those who are intelligent and responsible because a country at Ministry of Transport and Communications who is a country because of the youth. Let these things be deal with roads are given tenders to maintain roads, looked into. Still on the Police Service, in the Kgalagadi even though the tenders of constructing roads are given North Constituency, we still have shortage of police to big companies, which come from outside. Maybe officers. Crime is too high… Honourable Member, you should consider those who do maintenance. Let them grow and construct bigger roads HONOURABLE MEMBER: Elucidation Madam. so that the money stays in the country. MS MONNAKGOTLA: …and even murder cases are When I get onto another one still on transport, the report high. If we can address this issue and at least have police by His Excellency the President indicated that the road officers at the settlements. Increase police officers at our from Charles Hill to Ncojane is already complete. Do area so that we can curb crime. not just end there Honourable Segokgo, let it go all the Getting onto wildlife management… way up to Hukuntsi and Tsabong so that it can ease the struggle. It should go through settlements, those women MR SPEAKER: Honourable Moswaane, can you who keep on having miscarriages, those roads…and switch off your microphone please. they can also assist us on tourism. Those are some of MS MONNAKGOTLA: Government is doing a good the things we should consider, let the Government look thing. I saw that there are going to be 45 camps at into this issue and ensure that that road does not end at Central Kalahari Game Reserve (CKGR), Transfrontier Ncojane, but at Tsabong. Let me get onto the issue of the Park and Khutse Game Reserve. Kgalagadi North railway; the President’s speech has indicated that there is surrounded by game reserves, we are between is going to be the construction of Mosetse-Kazungula Mabuasehube, Transfrontier, CKGR and Khutse Game and Mmamabula-Lephalale railway. I am asking where Reserve. At Kgalagadi North, CKGR is 40 kilometers is the Trans-Kalahari Highway railway, which will link away from Kang. Let me request the Honourable South Africa, Botswana and Namibia? We are talking Member responsible for tourism to open a gate for us about something that will create revenue. So let these at CKGR, so that we can take tourists inside CKGR. So things be looked into Honourable Member. that even our youth can have employment and we can When I get onto Ipelegeng; I can see that this Ipelegeng make a living. This can help our youth and it can also is new, but it is being developed because Ipelegeng grow our country. Looking at the fact that Kang is along employees are going to be taken to brigades while they Trans-Kalahari Highway. Tourists from Namibia and are also working. That is a good thing the Government South Africa, we can take them to CKGR and generate will be doing. When they complete their studies, they income for Botswana. We will build hotels at Kang. can be able to make a living. That is a good thing. Look into it, it is something important.

Let me also talk about Bogosi, that the offices of When I get onto health issues; pills especially those for Dikgosi will have Wi-Fi installed in them. Let Dikgosi the Human Immunodeficiency Virus (HIV) are available. and those who work at those offices be taught how to I can see that they are not a problem, our problem is use that technology. Let it be maintained properly, let us vehicles at the settlements. Those cars have long been

Hansard No 200 49 Tuesday 17th November, 2020 RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT’S SPEECH Motion (Resumed Debate)

by councils and then were used by clinics that are said on Saturday, of a woman who was murdered by her to be under the Ministry of Health and Wellness. They lover and this is a second woman. I had a funeral three break down transporting patients and women deliver weeks ago at the constituency. Violence starts with on roadsides. That is a painful thing. I request that this looking down upon another human being. issue be looked into. Those vehicles should be changed especially because we are far from services. Those are If you can look at the way women are dying, the painful things. painful part is that their bodies end up not being able to be viewed…All the Gender Based Violence funerals MR MAJAGA: Elucidation. Thank you Honourable that I attended in which women were murdered, their Member of Parliament for Kgalagadi. This issue bodies were not viewed. These are not people; it is just of vehicles since it is all over Botswana, especially ‘darkness’ as Honourable Saleshando was saying it is ambulances, in Remote Area Dwellers (RADS) and just ‘darkness’… settlements, you will find that it is a problem. As we are here in this respectable House of Parliament, can HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Laughter!)… we not maybe request the Honourable Minister of MS MONNAKGOTLA: It is darkness, they cannot be Health and Wellness and councils, that maybe we can seen. help each other so that RADS and settlements can have ambulances like it was done before, so that this situation HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Laughter!)… can be improved? Maybe we can start at settlements and MS MONNAKGOTLA: These women who die as a RADS villages because they already made the plan to result of Gender Based Violence, it is something very cluster ambulances. painful because these women leave children behind. A MS MONNAKGOTLA: Thank you Honourable child needs both a mother and a father’s love. A child is Member for those great words. I also request that these raised by their mother and father. We want our country clinics in settlements be returned to councils, looking at to have a future. Our future is these upcoming children. the many challenges they face. If we kill these children’s mothers, how are they going to grow properly because they need the love and guidance When I get onto COVID-19 issues, we see that the task from both their mothers and fathers? This is something force has done a good job, and our country has managed I have to state. to contain the virus. That is a good thing. Honourable Kekgonegile was saying that COVID-19 is rife at the When the Honourable Member said, “one would get on likes of South Africa and other countries and have many a train to Francistown, believing that they are going to deaths, but in Botswana the numbers are low. This Kgalagadi, so it is all gloomy (confusion and lack of shows that the task force team led by His Excellency knowledge) and this is not something I can spend most the President is doing an excellent job; especially when of my time focusing on.” No! Honourable Members we they put up a wage subsidy because business owners are abused in Parliament as women… were hard hit. That is something they came up with. HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Applause!)… Coming to the issue of gender equality; Honourable Members, there is no way I cannot talk about gender MS MONNAKGOTLA: That is not a good thing. You in this House because equality does not exist in this will hear men here talking about abuse, so let the good Parliament. If it could start in this House, maybe when example start in Parliament. I am saying let us start with we go to the people out there they could understand respecting women in Parliament. I was not talking about what we are talking about. a train, so someone cannot say I am getting onto a train thinking I am going to Kgalagadi. I have never said that. I would like to thank the Government that the Police That is something very painful. So let us start respecting Service is going to connect a toll-free number through each other… which an abused person can call to report their case. That was not possible before. MR KEKGONEGILE: On a point of procedure. Mr Speaker, I believe as Honourable Members of As I am standing here talking about violence and abuse Parliament, when we are here debating and the nation as the legislator for Kgalagadi North, there is a woman out there listening to us, we should be on the side of who passed away on Saturday. I have a funeral to attend truth and nothing else, not fabricating any stories

50 Hansard No 200 Tuesday 17th November, 2020 RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT’S SPEECH Motion (Resumed Debate)

against anyone. The fact is that Honourable Saleshando MR NKAWANA: On a point of procedure. Mr Speaker, responded to Honourable Monnakgotla in that way. It Honourable Monnakgotla is imputing improper has nothing to do with her gender; it has to do with the motives on Honourable Kekgonegile because what line of debate at that time, not that someone is a woman she is saying…What he is saying is that Honourable or what. It is wrong for Honourable Monnakgotla to use Monnakgotla should not use the gender card to shield a gender card in a Parliamentary debate. We are sending us from debating. She is actually abusing Honourable a wrong message of the root causes of Gender-Based Kekgonegile. Violence (GBV) to the nation. This is wrong and very un-procedural Mr Speaker. HONOURABLE MEMBERS: Further procedure Mr Speaker. MR SPEAKER: I personally do not have a problem with what Honourable Monnakgotla has said and MR SPEAKER: That is where I do not get it because she is not out of procedure. Let us leave her with her you would be saying procedure and then when the other interpretation of what Honourable Saleshando said in one is still saying something…the other one would chip his statement. Had he not said anything along those in saying further procedure. How do you then address lines, I would think maybe she is provoking him or two things at the same time? something. That is how she has interpreted his words. HONOURABLE MEMBER: So that you address MS MONNAKGOTLA: I respect this House Mr them at once because they are similar. Speaker. That is how I feel, and I am ashamed that when I speak as a woman, who feels hard-done, the MR SPEAKER: No, I do not want to do that, you Honourable Member then tries to defend. That hurts. are overburdening me. Let me respond to the one by Honourable Nkawana. If I understood Honourable HONOURABLE MEMBER: That is still abuse! Monnakgotla correctly, she stood up and said, “I am surprised that Honourable Kekgonegile can stand up and MS MONNAKGOTLA: He is abusing me, reiterating defend Honourable Saleshando.” That statement to me that I am nothing! He is buttressing it that I am just in does not relate to anything near to imputing improper darkness. I am quoting what is in the Hansard. When I motives. Unless I do not understand the definition of talk you cannot say I am in the dark… imputing improper motives. MR KEKGONEGILE: On a point of procedure. This HONOURABLE MEMBER: …(Inaudible)…. is what I mean Mr Speaker when I say Honourable Monnakgotla is wrongly using the gender card; using MR SPEAKER: No, she said, “I am surprised that it for the wrong reasons; political reasons. Right now Honourable Member defends Honourable Saleshando,” she is saying I am also abusing her when I am simply whom as far as she is concerned, she felt that the differing with her in terms of opinions, just because she statement that Honourable Saleshando used against is a woman. It is wrong and she is out of order. We are her, was violating her right as a woman. That is what not supposed to allow the House to bar the debate just she said. So, I do not know where exactly she is out of because there are men and women in this House. We procedure or order… should not be debating or interpreting issues on the basis HONOURABLE MEMBER: Further procedure Mr of saying if you have a different opinion from that of a Speaker. woman, you are wrong in this House. It is wrong. MR SPEAKER: Honourable Monnakgotla can you sit MR SPEAKER: Honourable Kekgonegile, I still down, Honourable Gobotswang is standing on a point maintain that well, she could be wrong, according to of procedure. your judgement but she is not out of procedure or order. She is only wrong because it does not sit well with you DR GOBOTSWANG: Procedure. Mr Speaker, what but honestly, she is not out of procedure. Honourable Monnakgotla wants to do is to say that a robust debate in this Parliament is somehow violence. MS MONNAKGOTLA: I thank you Mr Speaker, and When we are here as Parliament, we would be creating I appreciate your protection. problems for ourselves if we can allow the Honourable HONOURABLE MEMBER: Further Procedure Mr Member to say that a robust debate is violence, just Speaker, we are robustly critiquing you today. because she is a woman. When we proposed that Gender-

Hansard No 200 51 Tuesday 17th November, 2020 RESPONSE TO THE PRESIDENT’S SPEECH Motion (Resumed Debate)

Based Violence (GBV) is a crisis, it is an emergency ruling on a matter, no one should rise and bring it up and that it is urgent, the very same Monnakgotla voted again. When you hear me talking about an issue that you against that Motion. They then came up with some have made a ruling on, you should order me to sit down diluted Motion which was presented by Honourable so that we can carry on. You made a ruling, whether it Molale, the very same Motion that they have abandoned favoured Honourable Kekgonegile or it did not favour without implementing. The procedure is that we should him, you have ruled on his matter. If now some Members not trivialise GBV and then when there are robust are going to rise to talk about Honourable Kekgonegile’s debates you stand up and say that you are violated. No, issue, I believe that we are out of procedure Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker that is not right and it is not procedural. Thank you.

MR SPEAKER: Honourable Gobotswang, there MR SPEAKER: You are now accusing the Speaker. is utterly nothing out of procedure, as far as I am concerned. When you say that this debate is robust, that MR LEUWE: No! No! I am not accusing him Mr means that… I was here when Honourable Saleshando Speaker. debated. If Honourable Monnakgotla heard Honourable MS MONNAKGOTLA: Thank you Mr Speaker… Saleshando the way she heard him, and she did not respond only to respond to the issue when she is on the HONOURABLE MEMBER: Elucidation. floor, I believe that she is also on the mode of as robust MS MONNAKGOTLA: … for that utmost protection, debate. I am even bleeding. I think it means that… HONOURABLE MEMBERS: Yes! HONOURABLE MEMBER: Stress. MR SPEAKER: This means that to be honest, I do MS MONNAKGOTLA: Yes. I am really upset, I am not believe that she is as abusive as you say she it. I even bleeding Mr Speaker. think abusive is too strong a word to label Honourable Monnakgotla, as our mother Honourable Members. Let MR SPEAKER: Order! Order Honourable Members! us allow her to air her grievances. Honourable Monnakgotla, Order!

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Procedure. HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Murmurs)…

MR SPEAKER: Our conscience as men, we know MR SPEAKER: Order! Order! Honourable Members, what we are doing, what we are not doing and how we it is now 6 o’clock. I think we have debated it. It is debate. Honourable Members, let us allow Honourable now time for me to call upon the Leader of the House, Monnakgotla to air her grievances as a woman. I beg Honourable Mothibi Eric Molale to move a Motion of you. adjournment.

HONOURABLE MEMBERS: Procedure. MOTION

MR SPEAKER: Procedure Honourable Leuwe. ADJOURNMENT

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Thank you Mr Speaker. ACTING LEADER OF THE HOUSE (MR MOLALE): Thank you Mr Speaker. Before I close, HONOURABLE MEMBER: You are not Leuwe! You Botswana Democratic Party (BDP) members have been are not Leuwe! You are not Leuwe! asked to remain behind for a few minutes. Mr Speaker, HONOURABLE MEMBER: He said Greeff. I move that this House do now adjourn. I thank you Mr Speaker. MR SPEAKER: I said Honourable Leuwe sir. I did not hear you. Question put and agreed to.

HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Laughter!)… The Assembly accordingly adjourned at 6:05 p.m. until Wednesday 18th November, 2020 at 2:00 p.m. MR LEUWE: Procedure. Oh! I am a bit dark and you are light! Thank you Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker, guide us. I believe that procedurally, when you have made a

52 Hansard No 200 HANSARD RECORDERS Mr. T. Gaodumelwe, Mr T. Monakwe, Ms T. Kebonang HANSARD REPORTERS Ms T. Rantsebele, Mr M. Buti, Ms N. Selebogo, Ms A. Ramadi, Ms D. Thibedi, Ms G. Baotsi, Ms N. Mokoka, Mr J. Samunzala, Ms Z. Molemi

HANSARD EDITORS Ms K. Nyanga, Ms C. Chonga, Mr K. Goeme, Ms G. Phatedi, Ms B. Malokwane, Mr A. Mokopakgosi, Ms O. Nkatswe, Ms G. Lekopanye Ms T. Mokhure, Ms B. Ratshipa

HANSARD TRANSLATORS Ms B. Ntisetsang, Ms. M. Sekao, Ms. M. Rabotsima, Ms. B. Mosinyi, Ms. V. Nkwane, Ms. N. Kerobale, Ms K. Alepeng, Ms T. Motsau, Ms O. Phesodi

HANSARD LAYOUT DESIGNERS Mr B. B. Khumanego, Mr D. T. Batshegi, Mr K. Rebaisakae

53 Hansard No 200