Thursday Volume 546 14 June 2012 No. 14

HOUSE OF COMMONS OFFICIAL REPORT

PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES (HANSARD)

Thursday 14 June 2012

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Conservative-controlled Wiltshire county council, none House of Commons the less there have been some centrally based delays, so what can the Secretary of State do to assist in that pilot?

Thursday 14 June 2012 Mr Hunt: We are doing everything we can to reduce those delays, including seeking early clearance of state aid from Brussels, but we have put in place a competitive The House met at half-past Ten o’clock process that is led by local authorities, because we think that we will get the best results by putting them in the driving seat. That is why we have had a tremendous response, including from local authorities that, in almost PRAYERS every case, have agreed to match the money being put in by central Government, so in Wiltshire and throughout the country we will have an extremely good broadband [MR SPEAKER in the Chair] network, if not the best in Europe.

Duncan Hames (Chippenham) (LD): I welcome that response and hope the Secretary of State understands Oral Answers to Questions the eagerness in Wiltshire, south Gloucestershire and Swindon to proceed with their framework. Can he tell us anything about the timetable for reaching a resolution of the state aid issue with the European Commission? CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT Mr Hunt: I hope to meet Commissioner Almunia next week or, certainly, in the next few weeks to hasten The Secretary of State for Culture Olympics, Media that process as fast as possible, and we still very much and Sport was asked— hope that all local authorities will have signed their Superfast Broadband contracts by the end of this calendar year, so that the digging of trenches and the laying of fibre along poles 1. (East Ham) (Lab): What his policy can take place from the beginning of next year. is on competition in the supply of superfast broadband services; and if he will make a statement. [111297] Superfast Broadband

The Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and 2. David T. C. Davies (Monmouth) (Con): What recent Sport (Mr Jeremy Hunt): Our aim is to ensure that we progress he has made on his plans to ensure the UK has have as competitive a market for broadband as possible. the best superfast broadband network in Europe. That is why together with Ofcom we have taken a [111299] number of steps to ensure that the UK broadband market is one of the most vibrant and competitive in 6. Eric Ollerenshaw (Lancaster and Fleetwood) (Con): the world, including opening up BT’s ducts and poles to What recent progress he has made on his plans to competitors and introducing new guidance on street ensure the UK has the best superfast broadband network works and micro-trenching. in Europe. [111303] Stephen Timms: So why are the Government, through 7. John Howell (Henley) (Con): What recent progress the ill judged Broadband Delivery UK exercise, recreating he has made on his plans to ensure the UK has the best a taxpayer-funded monopoly for superfast broadband? superfast broadband network in Europe. [111304] Will the Secretary of State confirm that the number of firms on his framework has now fallen from three to 13. Andrea Leadsom (South Northamptonshire) (Con): two, and that all the deals so far have been with one of What recent progress he has made on his plans to those companies, which stands to receive more than ensure the UK has the best superfast broadband £1.5 billion? Is it any wonder that the European Commission network in Europe. [111314] is challenging the legality of what he is doing, or that Britain is lagging so badly behind on superfast broadband? The Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Mr Hunt: When the right hon. Gentleman’s party left Sport (Mr Jeremy Hunt): I have now approved 37 out of office, we had one of the slowest broadband networks 43 local broadband plans—that is, almost 90% across in Europe; we have put in place plans that will give us the whole country—and nine are in procurement. A one of the fastest. His party had plans that would not number of those are almost ready to begin delivery, and have seen the roll-out of superfast broadband until the other projects are being prepared for procurement 2017; we have brought that forward. We have also put in with support from Broadband Delivery UK, which is almost £1 billion of public money, so I think that our also finalising details for the broadband delivery framework results have been pretty impressive. contract. Mr James Gray (North Wiltshire) (Con): Wiltshire is David T. C. Davies: May I congratulate the Minister one of the pilot areas for the roll-out of superfast on the progress that he is making on superfast broadband, broadband in . Will increasing competition but ask that this not be done at the expense of those living among broadband providers hasten its arrival? Despite in remote rural areas, such as parts of Monmouthshire, the excellent efforts of the outstandingly good who have yet to see any form of broadband whatsoever? 447 Oral Answers14 JUNE 2012 Oral Answers 448

Mr Hunt: My hon. Friend is absolutely right, and the our minds. We are determined to put in place a structure whole purpose of the programme is to ensure that fast that makes sure that even if they are not in the 90% broadband speeds are available to everyone. Indeed, it is covered by 2015, they will be covered very soon afterwards the people in the most remote areas who stand to gain or we will have a structure that allows them to be the most in terms of preventing villages from being covered within that framework. depopulated and helping people who are disabled to get their shopping done. There are all sorts of very important Mr Nigel Dodds (Belfast North) (DUP): Developing benefits, and I hope that the £57 million that we have the best possible communications network is one of the allocated to Wales, which has been more than matched key priorities for Belfast city council and the local by the Welsh Government, will make that happen in administration in , and great progress Monmouthshire and throughout Wales. has been made. May I urge the Secretary of State to support Belfast’s bid for greater funding for superfast Eric Ollerenshaw: Can the Minister confirm that broadband, which is an excellent way of attracting the when community-led schemes to bring superfast broadband greater economic growth and further direct investment to remote rural areas, such as Broadband for the Rural that we need? North in my constituency, initially raise their own funds, they will not then be discriminated against on access to Mr Hunt: First, I should congratulate the right hon. future Government support? Gentleman, because Northern Ireland has some of the best broadband in Europe already. He is absolutely right. Mr Hunt: We are specifically trying to set up a scheme One of the other big differences between this Government’s so that, where people raise their own funds to solve policies and those of the previous Government is that broadband problems, it is possible to integrate that into we are not stopping at having superfast broadband for the national network. Our objective is to enable as the whole country but want our cities to have some of much local self-help work as possible, so I welcome my the best broadband in the world and to aspire to the hon. Friend’s initiative and those taken by his constituents. speeds that can be found in , Seoul and other cities. I hope that Belfast will be among them. John Howell: Large parts of my constituency suffer from rural broadband poverty, but at an official level it Chi Onwurah (Newcastle upon Tyne Central) (Lab): is often masked because neighbouring Oxford has good In the two years since this Government took office, they broadband, and the level at which it is integrated is too have not delivered 1 metre of extra fibre or one bit of great to show that granularity. What advice can my extra bandwidth. BDUK is still sorting out its super- right hon. Friend give about making sure that those fragmented contracting process. Up and down the country, areas of rural broadband poverty in my constituency hundreds of thousands of people are denied decent are recognised? broadband because the Government abandoned our universal broadband pledge. Does the Secretary of State Mr Hunt: The comfort that I can give my hon. Friend deny that, under Labour, this year everyone would have is that our ambition, which is vastly higher than anything had access to decent broadband to play their part in the that we had from Labour, is that by 2015 90% of the innovation economy? country will have access to superfast broadband. However, it will not stop there, because we will have a plan in Mr Hunt: Let me remind the hon. Lady that when her place for the other 10% which means that they will have party left office there was no money left. Quite how she a very good prospect of getting superfast broadband. thought that it was going to deliver universal access to In many cases—for example, in my own county of broadband by 2012 when it left the country’s finances Surrey—plans are being put forward whereby there will bust, I do not know. We took a plan that was clearly not be 100% access to superfast broadband by 2014. Good going to work and instead put in place a plan that has local authorities are thinking about the other 10% and much higher ambitions, with not only universal access making sure that they are not left behind, and we are to broadband but 90% access to superfast broadband doing everything we can to help them. and cities with ultrafast broadband—some of the fastest broadband in the world. Andrea Leadsom: In my constituency we have lots of rural areas that are not going to be part of the superfast Mr John Whittingdale (Maldon) (Con): One of the broadband roll-out. In one area in particular—in fact, alternative ways of making faster broadband available it is where I happen to live—there is a large community is through the roll-out of 4G mobile services, but has of parishes where two thirds of people are home workers the Secretary of State seen the analysis by Freeview that or involved in small businesses. What reassurance can suggests that over 2 million homes may have their my right hon. Friend give that we will be able to achieve digital television service interfered with as a result, and access to the existing national infrastructure of fibre-optic that the funds secured by the Government to counter cabling to avoid having to reinstall new cables? In this that interference may not be anything like sufficient? area, there is a rural grouping who are trying to gain Does he agree with that analysis, and what is he proposing access to existing infrastructure and being denied that to do about it? by private companies. Mr Hunt: I absolutely agree that the roll-out of 4G is Mr Hunt: The best reassurance for the people who another opportunity. One of the options proposed by live around my hon. Friend is probably the fact that she Ofcom would mean 98% coverage of 4G, which would lives there; I am sure that means that the issue will be extremely important in many of the rural areas receive a lot of attention. People in remote areas who about which hon. Friends are concerned. We have an do not have access to good broadband are at the top of ongoing consultation about the mitigation plans for 449 Oral Answers14 JUNE 2012 Oral Answers 450 people whose signals will be affected by these auctions. Mr Vaizey: I am not aware that we have had discussions Ofcom has not told me that it has any concerns about with News Corporation, but I will certainly look at the the plans that are in place, but I will listen to it very Department’s records. Local television is certainly an carefully in that regard. opportunity for local media, and—[Interruption.] I will write to the hon. Lady about this; I thank the right hon. and learned Member for Camberwell and Peckham Local Newspapers (Ms Harman) for that lesson in etiquette, which I shall take on board. Many local newspaper groups are interested in local television, and I think this is a potential opportunity 3. Jonathan Edwards (Carmarthen East and Dinefwr) for local newspapers. (PC): What recent discussions he has had on the future of local newspapers. [111300] Special Advisers

The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport (Mr Edward Vaizey): The 5. John Mann (Bassetlaw) (Lab): What arrangements Secretary of State specifically has had no recent discussions. he has put in place to recruit a new special adviser. However, I have taken part in a number of recent [111302] debates and events, including a Westminster Hall debate on 25 April, which was attended by no fewer than The Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and 50 colleagues, and a meeting with Johnston Press at the Sport (Mr Jeremy Hunt): I recently appointed Guy end of May, which 25 colleagues attended. Levin as my new special adviser, and he started this week. Jonathan Edwards: What discussions has the Minister John Mann: I thank the Secretary of State for that had with colleagues in the Department for Communities answer. Government special advisers are meeting as a and Local Government to extend the provisions of the group on a fairly regular basis, doubtless to get their Localism Act 2012 to include local newspapers as instructions from 10 Downing street. Will the Secretary community assets? Under the terms of the Act, that of State ensure that he receives a written report on those would offer threatened newspapers a stay of execution meetings, and that such reports are made public so that while alternative ownership models were explored. we can all see precisely what instructions 10 Downing street is giving to his and other special advisers? Mr Vaizey: I hear what the hon. Gentleman is saying. As he knows, the Department for Communities and Mr Hunt: We will be at least as transparent as the last Local Government has been successful in stopping local Government on these matters, if not more so. council newspapers competing with local newspapers, but local newspapers are private assets and I would be surprised if they could be registered as community Jim Sheridan (Paisley and Renfrewshire North) (Lab): assets under the right to buy. This is the first time I have Will this new special adviser be an additional cost to the heard this idea, however, and I will certainly let the taxpayer, or will he come from within the ranks of the Department for Communities and Local Government Government? know that it is being proposed. Mr Hunt: There will be no additional cost to the Government on top of the existing budget for special Simon Hughes (Bermondsey and Old Southwark) advisers. (LD): Will the Minister talk to our colleagues in the Department for Transport, who are now considering responses to consultation about transport adverts in Children’s Health (Advertising) local papers, to see whether his Department could support the presumption that public notices should be in local 8. Chris Ruane (Vale of Clwyd) (Lab): What assessment papers unless a clear majority of councillors and the he has made of the potential effects of advertising public think that there is better way of reaching the aimed at children on (a) childhood obesity and (b) public? children’s mental health. [111305]

Mr Vaizey: That consultation is being handled by our The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Culture, Liberal Democrat colleague, the Under-Secretary of Olympics, Media and Sport (Mr Edward Vaizey): No State for Transport, the hon. Member for Lewes (Norman assessment has been made. The rules on advertising Baker), and I am sure that he will not sit on the fence content standards are the responsibility of the independent when it comes to making a decision on that issue. regulators—the Advertising Standards Authority and Ofcom. It is for those regulators to assess the sort of (Bishop Auckland) (Lab): In recent material that is appropriate for different audiences. years, 242 local papers have closed. Meanwhile, Ministers are throwing £40 million into local television, which will Chris Ruane: Half the adverts aimed at children only add to the competition for advertising that local encourage them to gorge on junk food and become papers face. I know that Ministers have recently had obese, while the other half extol the virtues of size zero. some difficulty remembering all their conversations, but Is it any wonder that 20% of children suffer with mental will the Minister tell us when they last discussed local illness? Will the Minister look at the example of Sweden, television with News Corporation? which has banned advertising aimed at the under-12s? 451 Oral Answers14 JUNE 2012 Oral Answers 452

Mr Vaizey: Ofcom already has regulations in place Hugh Robertson: The programme is run by the to prevent the advertising of high fat, sugar and salt Organising Committee of the Olympic Games and products in children’s programming. I understand that Paralympic Games, so it is providing the resources. The those regulations have had an effect, in that the exposure incentives to schools to sign up included the fact that of young children to that kind of marketing has been the Olympics were coming here in any event and will be reduced by between one third and a half. very big news this summer, and the free games tickets that I mentioned. Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP): I thank the Minister for that reply. Do you feel that it is time for the relevant (Dulwich and West Norwood) (Lab): Health Minister and yourself to have a joint campaign The Get Set programme is inspiring young people across to address— the country through the Olympic values of equality, respect, friendship, courage and excellence. Forty years Mr Speaker: Order. The hon. Gentleman is becoming ago, those values came under attack during the terrible a more experienced Member by the day. I ask him not massacre of nine Israeli athletes at the 1972 Munich to use the word “you”. Debates, including questions, go games. Yesterday, I wrote to you, Mr Speaker, requesting through the Chair. He is asking the Minister for a that we mark that tragedy in this House with a minute’s response. Perhaps he will complete his question. We silence. Does the Minister agree that we should mark look forward to it. that tragic event, and will he undertake his own representations to you, Mr Speaker, on the matter? Jim Shannon: Thank you for that correction, Mr Speaker. Would the Minister consider having a joint campaign Hugh Robertson: I thank the right hon. Lady for that between his Department and the Department of Health question. Before I answer it, as this is the last DCMS to ensure that the effect of advertising on children’s questions before the Olympic games on 27 July, may I health is better addressed? record all our thanks to her and to all parliamentarians across the House—a number of whom are sitting at the Mr Vaizey: I will take on board the hon. Gentleman’s back of the Labour Benches—who have contributed to suggestion that I should meet colleagues at the Department the delivery of the London Olympic and Paralympic of Health to discuss what further measures we can take. games? The right hon. Lady is absolutely right to draw attention Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab): Has the Minister had an to the tragic events in Munich 40 years ago. My right opportunity to look at the Women’s Sport and Fitness hon. Friend the Secretary of State is attending a Foundation report that highlights that young people, in commemoration event in the Guildhall during the games. particular young women, have problems with image I visited the Israeli Olympic committee some years ago and participation in sport that are leading to higher when I was in opposition and am well aware of the levels of obesity? I realise that sport is not his area of importance of this matter to the state of Israel and to expertise, but what can his Department do to address the Olympic movement. I will do everything that I can the issues raised in that important report and to ensure to ensure that it is marked in an appropriate fashion. that more young people participate in sport? Children (Sport) Mr Vaizey: Sport is certainly not my area of expertise, in every sense of the word. One only has to look at me 10. Mrs Helen Grant (Maidstone and The Weald) to understand that. However, I do possess a talent for (Con): What progress he has made on encouraging watching sport. I can give the hon. Gentleman the good more children to take part in competitive sport. [111307] news that my colleague, the Minister for Sport, has read the report and is working with Sport England on its recommendations. The Minister for Sport and the Olympics (Hugh Robertson): Through the school games, we are encouraging all Get Set Programme schools to offer their pupils the chance to play more competitive sport. The number of schools participating 9. Stephen Lloyd (Eastbourne) (LD): How many is now more than 13,500. Additionally, 64 county festivals schools have registered for the Get Set programme; and of sport will take place this year, with more than if he will make a statement. [111306] 112,000 children taking part. We also had the inaugural national finals in May, where more than 1,600 of our The Minister for Sport and the Olympics (Hugh Robertson): best young athletes competed in and around the Olympic Nearly 26,000 schools and colleges in the park. I know that as a great champion of sport in the are registered with Get Set, which is 84% of those that county of Kent, my hon. Friend will be delighted that are eligible. Of those, 18,763 have gone on to join the the Kent school games were launched on Tuesday night. Get Set network, and of those, nearly 16,000 have qualified for a share of up to 175,000 free games tickets, Mrs Grant: Can the Minister update the House on which are being funded through a levy on corporate the success of the Government’s school games? hospitality. Hugh Robertson: Absolutely. This year’s school games Stephen Lloyd: I thank the Minister for that answer. were an unusually successful event, precisely because of What resources will the Department make available to the proximity of London’s Olympics. Thanks to the the schools that have signed up for the Get Set programme, work of my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State, the and what incentives are in place to ensure a high level of finals were able to take place in the Olympic park, participation from schools? giving young athletes the chance to compete on the 453 Oral Answers14 JUNE 2012 Oral Answers 454 same stretch of track that the world’s best athletes will Mr Barry Sheerman (Huddersfield) (Lab/Co-op): The compete on in six weeks’ time. As I said, more than Minister will know that young people are inspired to get 1,600 children had that opportunity. into sport by top sportspeople. Does he share my concern about what happened yesterday with the bidding for the Mr Gerry Sutcliffe (Bradford South) (Lab): When we Premier League broadcast rights? The empire of people left office, 90% of children were doing at least two hours who some of us do not think are fit and proper to have of sport a week, and some were doing a lot more. Does senior positions in the media has yet again got the bulk the Minister know what the current figure is? of Premier League matches. Hugh Robertson: That is an interesting point, but it is Hugh Robertson: Yes I do, because the Secretary of a very complex matter. One of the very first things that State for Education has helpfully—unlike under the I did as a new Minister was to secure an agreement from previous Administration, as the hon. Gentleman draws all UK sport governing bodies, to which the Premier that comparison—made physical education one of only League voluntarily signed up, to invest 30% of their UK four core parts of the school curriculum, so everybody broadcast income into the grass roots. If the league will at last be doing it. I am sure that the hon. Gentleman, makes more money, that means more money for the as a great supporter of sport, will support that. grass roots, which we should support. The interesting point about yesterday’s announcement was the arrival Damian Collins (Folkestone and Hythe) (Con): Football for the first time of BT as a partner. I hope that that remains a very popular competitive sport for people of produces more competitive tension in the market. all ages. Does the Minister share my concern about the loss in the High Court of HMRC’s case against the Mr Speaker: Pat Glass. Not here. football creditors rule, and will he discuss with his ministerial colleagues whether the Government may Registrar of the Public Lending Right legislate to get rid of that rule, for which even the chairman of the Football League has said he cannot 14. Tom Blenkinsop (Middlesbrough South and East find any moral justification? Cleveland) (Lab): What plans he has for the post of Registrar of the Public Lending Right. [111315] Hugh Robertson: One of the interesting things that came out of the Select Committee on Culture, Media The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Culture, and Sport’s report on football governance, in which my Olympics, Media and Sport (Mr Edward Vaizey): As the hon. Friend played a key part, was that almost nobody hon. Gentleman knows, we are consulting on the responsible for football at any level tried to defend the future of the Registrar of the Public Lending Right. football creditors rule. I know that he has a private Our proposed transfer of the function of the registrar, Member’s Bill to abolish it. I believe that HMRC is which currently exists as a standalone public body, contemplating an appeal against the decision, and clearly would contribute to the Government’s commitment to we want to wait and see how that plays out, but I believe simplifying the public bodies landscape and at the same it is a rule that has had its day. time maintain and ensure the effective, efficient and impartial administration of the PLR scheme. Derek Twigg (Halton) (Lab): One problem is that once young people reach the age of 16 and leave school, Tom Blenkinsop: I thank the Minister, but does he agree they tend to drop out of sport in great numbers. Many with the second children’s laureate, Anne Fine, that the people aged 16-plus go on to college and university. proposed reorganisation of the registrar is based purely What discussions has the Minister had with his colleagues on ideology and will cost the taxpayer more money in the Department for Education about how we can than it saves? address the problem and encourage more and more young people to continue with some sort of sporting Mr Vaizey: No. activity? James Wharton (Stockton South) (Con): I thank the Hugh Robertson: The hon. Gentleman makes a very Minister for the work he has done with me in representing good point. Indeed, if we look back over the past my constituents who work at the PLR, which is in my 20 years or so, we see that the one thing that nobody has constituency. Will he confirm that the Government’s really managed to address has been post-school dropout. preferred option for the reorganisation of the PLR is We are trying a new approach via the new youth sport one that will mean that jobs are not transferred from strategy, which will be the key component of the next Teesside to London? round of whole-sport plans. I very much hope that by linking schools much better to community clubs and Mr Vaizey: My hon. Friend has been absolutely putting people into colleges of higher education, which assiduous in representing the concerns of the people have not been well covered, we will tackle the problem who work at the PLR in conversations with me and in in the next cycle. writing to me. That stands testament to the active work of a great constituency MP. It is certainly part of our preferred option to ensure that jobs remain in the north Richard Graham (Gloucester) (Con) rose— and do not transfer to London.

Mr Speaker: Order. There is no hurry. I have seen the Dan Jarvis (Barnsley Central) (Lab): It is now increasingly hon. Gentleman, but I am saving him up for his own accepted that part of the long-term future of book question, which we will reach in due course. lending lies in e-books being available in all libraries. In 455 Oral Answers14 JUNE 2012 Oral Answers 456 order for our libraries to move into the 21st century, the process of assembling the necessary GB structures to tensions between the public lending rights scheme and support a team, in just the same way as golf is. I hope e-books must be addressed. Will the Minister therefore nobody stands in front of the ability of UK athletes to tell the House why he has not moved to implement the compete in an Olympic games for political reasons. extension of the public lending right to e-books, as mandated in section 43 of the Digital Economy Act 2010? Sir Peter Bottomley (Worthing West) (Con): My hon. Friend the Member for Gloucester (Richard Graham) Mr Vaizey: Part of the problem with e-books is that asked about the inclusion of a new sport, but some most publishers do not want e-books lent in libraries. I sports have been squeezed out of the Olympics. Does have had discussions with publishers on that on at least my hon. Friend the Minister agree that the French two occasions, and would happily discuss it jointly with should have a chance to upgrade their silver medal at publishers and the hon. Gentleman so he can hear their cricket, which they have held for the past 100 years, and views first hand. that we should bring Twenty20 cricket into the Olympics?

Olympics (New Sport) Hugh Robertson: That campaign is often run mainly by Australians—or used to be, until they slipped down 15. Richard Graham (Gloucester) (Con): What recent the test rankings. Personally, I think it is important that discussions he has had on nominating a new sport for for any sport trying to join the Olympic mix it should be the next Olympics. [111316] the height of an athlete’s career to win a gold medal. I think that that is the case for rugby sevens, but I would The Minister for Sport and the Olympics (Hugh Robertson): need persuading that the height of an international This is a matter for the International Olympic Committee, cricketer’s career would be to win an Olympic gold medal, but I am aware of the ambitions of a number of sports. rather than an International Cricket Council world cup. London 2012 will feature 26 sports in its programme. That will rise to 28 for Rio 2016, when golf and rugby Jim McGovern (Dundee West) (Lab): It has been sevens are added to the mix. Decisions about the 2020 brought to my attention that one of Britain’s greatest summer games will be taken by the IOC in 2013. ever Olympians, Dick McTaggart, who was born and brought up just down the road from me in Dundee, who Richard Graham: The Minister knows of one sport won a boxing gold medal in the 1956 Melbourne Olympics that is played by more than half a million people in this and a bronze medal in Rome in 1960, and who also country and many millions worldwide, on more than competed in the 1964 Tokyo Olympics, has been told 50,000 courts, and in which the current men’s world that if he wishes to attend the London Olympics he champion is from this country: squash. Does he agree should put his name in a lottery, and that if he is lucky that the case for squash is strong and that it should be enough to have his name drawn out, he could buy a supported as much as possible? Will he meet me, UK ticket for £250—and that might not even be for boxing; Sport and the World Squash Federation, which is it might be for synchronised swimming. Will the Minister headquartered here in London? Lastly, will he, and use his good offices to ensure that Mr McTaggart is indeed you, Mr Speaker, agree to join a team that I invited as a VIP guest to the London Olympics? intend to put together—a Lords and Commons squash team—to play squash on world squash day in October Hugh Robertson: I am not sure how Mr McTaggart this year to support the bid? has managed to get himself into that situation. There are two things he ought to do almost straightaway. Mr Speaker: We all look forward to the hon. Gentleman’s First, he should go to the national governing body for upcoming Adjournment debate on these matters—although boxing in Great Britain, whose president is the former some people might think he has already had it. Sports Minister—that would be a very good start. If that fails, however, he should approach the Olympians Hugh Robertson: I was heartily relieved that my hon. organisation run by the British Olympic Association, Friend identified the sport at the end of his question, which exists precisely to ensure that former members of before I had what is known as a Caborn moment. The the Olympic family can attend events. simple answer to his question is that I am well aware of Topical Questions the ambitions of squash, and indeed of lacrosse, netball and a number of other worthy sports. [Interruption.] That list could go on for ever. The decision is for the T1. [111317] (Wrexham) (Lab): If he will IOC, but I will do everything I can to promote those make a statement on his departmental responsibilities. British sports in which, as my hon. Friend correctly says, we would have a good chance of winning a medal. The Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport (Mr Jeremy Hunt): With permission, I would Kevin Brennan (Cardiff West) (Lab): The Minister is like to make a statement, as these are the last Culture, aware that rugby sevens will be a new sport in the 2016 Media and Sport questions before the London 2012 Olympics. Given the tensions about Team GB in football, games. are he and the UK Government discussing with devolved I would like to take this opportunity to express the Ministers how to get over the thorny issue of having a Government’s thanks to everyone involved in the UK rugby sevens team? organisation of this tremendous project and, on behalf of the whole House, to wish Team GB the very best of Hugh Robertson: To be honest, football is a bit of a luck in getting a record haul of medals this summer. one-off in that respect; there is absolutely no problem With 43 days to go until the opening ceremony, the with GB teams in the other 25 sports. Rugby is in the project is in a strong position. We have shown beyond 457 Oral Answers14 JUNE 2012 Oral Answers 458 doubt that Britain can deliver big construction projects young as six and which have had no external rating on time and to budget, and yesterday my hon. Friend whatever—in fact, they are being sold for profit by the Minister for Sport and the Olympics announced organisations. Will the Minister consider requiring the that there was still nearly £500 million in the contingency rating of such videos by the British Board of Film fund. We can also be proud of the legacy that the games Classification? will leave, including the transformation of east London, the regeneration of our industry and thousands The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Culture, more children taking part in Olympic sport through the Olympics, Media and Sport (Mr Edward Vaizey): I certainly school games. Some 2.7 million people have already share my hon. Friend’s concerns. As a result of the lined the streets to see the torch, but we can be confident point she has made, I will arrange to meet the British that the best is yet to come. Board of Film Classification to discuss the issue, and she would be welcome to attend. Ian Lucas: Freeview has been a hugely successful way of delivering free-to-air digital television services, but T3. [111320] Anas Sarwar ( Central) (Lab): its future is threatened by the upcoming 4G auction. Alex Salmond told the Leveson inquiry yesterday Will the Minister look at the £180 million that the that he secretly backed the BSkyB bid because of the Government have set aside to assist those whose signal positive effect it would have on employment in is affected, even though Sky will not like it? , yet at the same time his now Employment Minister was signing a motion against the bid, while his Mr Hunt: I am a Freeview subscriber, or customer, MPs in Westminster were also voting against it. Can myself. We have put in place a comprehensive programme, the Secretary of State tell us whether News Corp gave but Ofcom is now consulting on whether it is adequate, any indication of what the implications of the bid and we will listen carefully to any advice we receive would be for employment in Scotland? from it. Mr Hunt: I do not recall hearing any such implications T2. [111318] Eric Ollerenshaw (Lancaster and Fleetwood) myself. (Con): Following on from the questions about superfast broadband, I wonder whether my right hon. Friend T5. [111322] Karen Lumley (Redditch) (Con): With the would be prepared to meet the Broadband for the Rural entire country getting into the Olympic spirit thanks to North community group in my constituency or visit the the torch relay, which passes through Redditch in a Lancashire uplands, taste the air there and see what couple of weeks, will my hon. Friend look into the fact extra we can do to maintain the momentum of this vital that no local residents from Redditch will be carrying project. the torch? Mr Hunt: We would be delighted to provide support The Minister for Sport and the Olympics (Hugh Robertson): in any way we can, and certainly I or the Under-Secretary The best answer to that would be for my hon. Friend to of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport, my take the issue up with the London Organising Committee hon. Friend the Member for Wantage (Mr Vaizey), of the Olympic Games and Paralympic Games, which is would be delighted to meet him and his constituents. responsible for nominating people. She should just be aware that a number of people have been nominated by Ms Harriet Harman (Camberwell and Peckham) (Lab): the sponsors. However, places have gone to local people, Last year, the Secretary of State promised a Green so she may find them hidden in the sponsors’ allocations. Paper to set out his strategy for the creative and technology industries. These industries are vital for the future of the British economy, and it is his job to back them up. T7. [111324] Mr Jim Cunningham (Coventry South) Last week, the Green Paper was scrapped, and after a (Lab): Earlier, the Secretary of State said in reply to whole year of consultation and anticipation, there is one of my hon. Friends that there was no money left to now disarray. Is that because it has been vetoed by expand broadband when he came into office. Where Google, or is he a lame duck Secretary of State who did he get the money, then? cannot stand up for the industry? Mr Hunt: By extremely clever use of resources, by Mr Hunt: I am incredibly proud of our progress on agreeing a licence fee settlement with the BBC in record the creative industries in the past two years, including time, which allowed that investment to made, and by through tax credits for the video games industry, the setting up a structure in which local authorities were animation industry and high-end television production, willing to match fund money put in by the centre. and through putting in place plans for the best superfast broadband network in Europe. That is vastly more than T6. [111323] Anna Soubry (Broxtowe) (Con): Further anything that the right hon. and learned Lady’s Government to the answer given to the hon. Member for Wrexham achieved. We will continue with the legislative programme (Ian Lucas) about the cost to households receiving to ensure that Parliament passes a communications Bill free-to-view television and the impact of 4G broadband, before the end of the Session to give our creative and will the Secretary of State look again at helping digital industries the best possible competitive future. householders with the cost of installing professional filters to deal with the problem? T4. [111321] Andrea Leadsom (South Northamptonshire) (Con): Many parents across the country are very Mr Hunt: That is precisely what we are currently concerned about the content of sex and relationships looking at. There is a consultation under way and we educational videos that are being shown to children as are looking at the problem carefully. We take it very 459 Oral Answers14 JUNE 2012 Oral Answers 460 seriously and welcome any representations made by my the transfer was made from the old Olympic Park hon. Friend or any other Members to ensure that we get Legacy Company to the new London Legacy Development this right. Corporation. As I say, I do not want to get into discussions about how we might spend a putative underspend until John Cryer (Leyton and Wanstead) (Lab): Has the we have actually delivered it. The key thing is to make Secretary of State found time to explain the ministerial sure we deliver these games on time and substantially code of conduct to his new special adviser, and if so, under budget. when? Tracey Crouch (Chatham and Aylesford) (Con): The Mr Hunt: The hon. Gentleman can be sure that I will Sports Minister will be aware that one of the factors in be finding plenty of time to explain the ministerial code keeping girls involved in sport is the distinct lack of in a great deal of detail to my new special adviser. coverage in our national and local newspapers. Will he consider holding a round-table discussion with national T9. [111326] Fiona Bruce () (Con): Will the and local media organisations to address that issue in Minister join me in congratulating the Olympic silver the long term? and gold medallists Ann Brightwell—formerly —and her husband, councillor Robbie Brightwell, Hugh Robertson: One of the joys of my job is that I on the impressive array of sporting activities, involving end up having round-table discussions with the media all ages, that they are inspiring under the banner of on a pretty regular basis—we did five hours of it Team Congleton? Does he agree that just that kind of yesterday. The great thing provided by the Olympics, local leadership is key to achieving the lasting Olympic above almost any other sports event I can think of, is legacy of increased sports participation of all ages? the opportunity to promote the equality of sport. In Team GB, some of the most exciting prospects are our Hugh Robertson: I would be very happy to do that. female sportswomen. I wish them all the very best and Will my hon. Friend please send my congratulations to hope that they will drive the sort of improvement that them both? my hon. Friend seeks.

Julie Hilling (Bolton West) (Lab): Two weeks ago, we Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green): Does had the honour of welcoming the Olympic torch to the Secretary of State accept that a reduction in VAT Bolton West. It was a wonderful event and the community for hotel accommodation and tourist attractions would turned out in force. However, I have been concerned to deliver a huge boost to jobs and tourism in places such hear rumours and press reports that some of the community as Brighton and Hove, would bring us into line with the champions selected to carry the torch have been replaced rest of the EU, most of which has much lower VAT on by people who have paid to carry it. Does the Minister hotels and visitor attractions, and would deliver a net know whether those rumours are true, and will he be benefit to the Treasury? What’s not to like? investigating? The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Culture, Hugh Robertson: I have seen absolutely no evidence Olympics, Media and Sport (John Penrose): The industry that that is the case. The majority of torch bearers are is making this case very strongly to the Treasury and it nominated by LOCOG, which has specifically gone out is clearly an issue for the Treasury to respond to. What looking for community champions with the sponsors, is causing problems at the moment is that the industry is which is where quite a lot of the controversy lies. promising higher returns, as the hon. Lady rightly points LOCOG also wrote to the sponsors, discouraging them out, but the Treasury gets an awful lot of such promises from allowing executives to run with the torch and from a whole variety of different parts of the economy encouraging them to find as many local champions as and it would need some positive proof before it would possible. be willing to engage on such an issue.

Mr Don Foster (Bath) (LD): Will lottery good causes be among the beneficiaries of any underspend in the Olympic budget? LEADER OF THE HOUSE

Hugh Robertson: I think the key thing is to deliver the underspend first; then we will work out how to spend it. The Leader of the House was asked— House of Commons Reform Pete Wishart (Perth and North Perthshire) (SNP): Following the question from the right hon. Member for 2. Paul Flynn (Newport West) (Lab): What progress Bath (Mr Foster), can the Minister guarantee and assure he has made on the implementation of the Wright the charities and good causes that have lost out to the proposals on House of Commons reform in the last Olympics that they will get the contingency underspend? 12 months. [111329] Surely they deserve it, and it should not go back to the black hole of the Treasury. The Parliamentary Secretary, Office of the Leader of the House of Commons (Mr David Heath): This Government Hugh Robertson: Under an agreement concluded by have successfully implemented recommendations to the right hon. Member for Dulwich and West Norwood introduce elections to Select Committee membership, (Tessa Jowell), as soon as the land sales are completed established a Backbench Business Committee and, within on the park, the lottery will be repaid; indeed, that the last 12 months, introduced an e-petition system to memorandum of understanding was improved when achieve a greater degree of public participation. The 461 Oral Answers14 JUNE 2012 Oral Answers 462 majority of the remaining recommendations of the The Parliamentary Secretary, Office of the Leader of Wright Committee are a matter for the House rather the House of Commons (Mr David Heath): Following than the Government. the Procedure Committee’s report, we have updated and improved the e-petitions website. We have improved, Paul Flynn: Can we improve the choreography of the for instance, the wording of the site and the search and parliamentary week by doing what the Wright proposals submission functions, making the process easier and suggested—moving Prime Minister’s Question Time to clearer for the more than 3 million people who have Thursdays, allowing Wednesdays to be used for the signed an e-petition since August last year. increasingly important Back-Bench business debates? James Morris: Does the Deputy Leader of the House Mr Heath: As the hon. Gentleman probably knows, agree that one solution to the problem of debating the Procedure Committee is now completing and in the e-petitions would be for the Government to table a very late stages of production of a report on the motion allowing Westminster Hall sittings on Monday parliamentary calendar. We would prefer to wait and afternoons during which e-petition topics could be debated? see what suggestions the Procedure Committee makes rather than taking a unilateral view on what is best for Mr Heath: We are very sympathetic to that view. In the House. fact, we said in our response to the Procedure Committee’s report that we supported its proposals for a pilot. It is Harriett Baldwin (West Worcestershire) (Con): What for the Procedure Committee to present such proposals is the Government’s analysis of the effect of adopting in Back-Bench time, but we are working well with the the recommendations in the Wright Committee report? Committee to enable the House to reach what I hope I understand that the creation of the Backbench Business will be a swift decision. Committee was blocked by the previous Government. Mr Barry Sheerman (Huddersfield) (Lab/Co-op): I Mr Heath: It was indeed; there was no progress think that the Deputy Leader of the House will accept whatever under the previous Government on this matter. that our old friend Tony Wright, who was responsible I am very proud of the fact that we moved quickly to for the recommendations of the Public Administration establish the Backbench Business Committee. Speaking Committee, would want the House continually to evaluate personally, I think it has been a great success. It is the way in which their implementation is working. something that the House should have done some time There is no doubt about the success of the Backbench ago. I look forward to building on it in the years to Business Committee, but e-petitions seem to have been come, and I look forward to the review of the Backbench taken over by elements of the popular press such as The Business Committee’s work, which will give us an indication Sun and the Daily Mail. How are we going to react to of how the House views its performance more widely. that? It is not the way in which the system was intended to work. Ms (Wallasey) (Lab): The Wright proposals are about increasing ministerial accountability to this House, but there have been too many examples recently Mr Heath: The hon. Gentleman has raised an important of Ministers preferring to do anything other than appear point. This was never intended to be simply a cut-out- at the Dispatch Box to make statements on their own and-send-back element in a tabloid newspaper’s campaign, responsibilities or face departmental questions. This is a but there is no evidence that all e-petitions are of that huge discourtesy not only to you, Mr Speaker, but to type: in many cases, they constitute a genuine expression Parliament. To tackle this, might the Leader of the of public sentiment on a subject. Besides, we have the House consider introducing a penalty points system—or, filter of the Backbench Business Committee, which with a reshuffle on the way, a “three strikes and you’re considers whether the House has already debated the out” rule? issue in question, or will have an opportunity to do so in the near future. When the Committee considers it right for a debate to take place, it will stage one, and I think Mr Heath: That was what might be considered a bold that it is doing a very good job in that regard. However, attempt to transfer the answer for Question 1 that the we are constantly evaluating what has happened, and hon. Lady had prepared to Question 2. I do not think we are keen to learn from the experience in order to that the Wright Committee was in any way concerned make the arrangement even better. with the subject to which she referred. As she has raised the issue, however, let me remind her that the present Government have, on average, made more statements Legislative Programme than their predecessors. We made 191 in the last Session, an average of 0.7 per sitting day, which compares favourably 4. John Mann (Bassetlaw) (Lab): What recent discussions with the last Administration’s average of 0.4 per sitting he has had with ministerial colleagues on scheduling of day during the 2009-10 Session. We did almost twice as business to achieve the Government’s legislative programme. well as they did. [111331]

e-Petitions The Parliamentary Secretary, Office of the Leader of the House of Commons (Mr David Heath): My right 3. James Morris (Halesowen and Rowley Regis) (Con): hon. Friend the Leader of the House regularly meets What progress he has made on implementing the colleagues in Government to discuss the legislative recommendations of the Procedure Committee on programme in order to ensure that Parliament has an debates on e-petitions. [111330] opportunity to debate Government legislation fully. 463 Oral Answers14 JUNE 2012 Oral Answers 464

John Mann: There is no problem with debating Mr Heath: The hon. Gentleman has probably given Government legislation fully, because the Government the subject headings for the submissions he will put to have hardly any legislation to introduce in this increasingly the Procedure Committee. It is not for me to determine part-time Parliament. Given that they have no ideas to the outcome of this inquiry, but I look forward to present, will the Leader of the House make better hearing what the Committee has to say, because all of provision for Back Benchers, including me, who have a us have felt for some time that the matter is worth whole raft of Bills to introduce which the public would looking into. like to see implemented? Will he give us time in which to introduce them, or not? Mr Greg Knight (East Yorkshire) (Con): Is the Deputy Leader of the House aware that the Procedure Committee Mr Heath: We are seeing an interesting juxtaposition. would be delighted if the hon. Member for Midlothian Our Department is so often criticised for providing (Mr Hamilton) were to come along and give evidence to insufficient time for Members to consider legislation us? He is hereby invited to do so. properly, and now the hon. Gentleman is saying that there is too much time for them to do so. I remind him Mr Heath: I am happy to act as a conduit for that that, only a few weeks after the Queen’s Speech, 11 Bills invitation, and I hope it will be accepted. are already before Parliament. I entirely reject his criticism that there is any deficit in terms of the legislation that is House Business Committee before the House. 6. Mr Peter Bone (Wellingborough) (Con): What Christopher Pincher (Tamworth) (Con): I understand progress he has made on introducing a House business that during the last Parliament there was criticism of committee. [111333] the amount of time given over to scrutiny of legislation. This Government are remedying that. Can the Deputy The Leader of the House of Commons (Sir George Young): Leader of the House confirm that this Government will As I said in my answer to my hon. Friend on 19 April, always give over appropriate time for scrutiny of legislation we plan to honour our commitment in the programme on Report? for Government to establish a House business committee by the third year of this Parliament. Mr Heath: That is absolutely right, and I was one of those who led the criticism of the previous Government, Mr Bone: By decentralising power and reforming as so often we found that the time for scrutiny was Parliament, we can redistribute power away from an constrained. One of the key areas is Report stage. We over-mighty Executive. The House of Commons should have been very careful to allocate more time for that—very have power “over its own timetable.” Those are not my often more than one day—to enable Back-Bench Members words; they are the words of the Prime Minister. Why is to have their say. There is a quid pro quo, however: the Leader of the House dragging his feet? Surely he when we do provide more time, it is important that the should be supporting our wonderful Prime Minister? House uses that time in a sensible way and makes sure that matters that need to be discussed are discussed in a Sir George Young: We have not dragged our feet. As timely fashion. my ministerial colleague, my hon. Friend the Member for Somerton and Frome (Mr Heath), has just explained, Private Members’ Bills at the first possible opportunity in this Parliament we introduced a Backbench Business Committee, which had been obstructed by the previous Administration, 5. Mr David Hamilton (Midlothian) (Lab): Whether and we also made a commitment, which Labour never he has any plans to bring forward proposals to reform made, to introduce a House business committee by the the scrutiny of private Members’ Bills. [111332] third year. As I said in my reply to my hon. Friend the Member for Wellingborough (Mr Bone) in April, we The Parliamentary Secretary, Office of the Leader of propose to honour that commitment, and I reject his the House of Commons (Mr David Heath): I understand suggestion that we have dragged our feet. that the Procedure Committee has today announced that it will be conducting an inquiry into the procedures Natascha Engel (North East Derbyshire) (Lab): Will for consideration of private Members’ Bills and that the Leader of the House guarantee that any House it will put out a call for written evidence soon. I look business committee will be entirely separate from the forward to learning of its considerations and any Backbench Business Committee? recommendations it may put to the House. Sir George Young: I am very happy to give the hon. Mr Hamilton: Will the Deputy Leader of the House Lady the assurance she seeks. We plan to keep the address the fact that we currently have an archaic system, Backbench Business Committee in its current form. and give due consideration to the private Members’ The committee to which my hon. Friend the Member Bills issue? If we change our hours, such Bills could be for Wellingborough referred would look at Government introduced on a Tuesday or Wednesday night, with business, and the two would work in parallel; the second votes at the end of the debate. We must get rid of our would not displace the first. current archaic system, whereby the awkward squad on the Government Back Benches can talk out very good Mr Nigel Dodds (Belfast North) (DUP): May we Bills introduced by Members on both sides of the have a guarantee that when the House business committee House. is set up there will be full and proper representation of 465 Oral Answers14 JUNE 2012 Oral Answers 466 the smaller parties in this House, and that those Members check is available, as are facilities such as showers, will be able to participate fully? lockers, bicycle tools and pumps—more showers will be provided this autumn; and, finally, there is a loan scheme Sir George Young: I understand the concern the right for staff which can be used to buy cycles and safety hon. Gentleman expresses, and it is a concern that he equipment, and a cycle to work salary sacrifice scheme also expressed when we set up the Backbench Business for staff is being implemented. Committee. When the relevant proposals come forward, there will be an opportunity to take on board the Mr Speaker: I have no idea what more there could be representation he has just made. to ask, but I have a feeling that the hon. Member for Cambridge (Dr Huppert) will have an idea. Pete Wishart (Perth and North Perthshire) (SNP): So far, the Wright Committee proposals have been a disaster Dr Huppert: I thank my hon. Friend for that list. It is for the smaller parties—fewer places for us on Select good to see that the House is taking some steps towards Committees; exclusion from the Backbench Business promoting cycling to work here, but more could be Committee. We need an absolute guarantee that, this done to ensure that cycle parking is covered, that bikes time around, there will be representatives of the smaller are available for hon. Members and staff to borrow for parties on the House business committee. short trips around central London, that cycle training is available for those Members who do not know how to Sir George Young: The harsh reality is that the hon. ride a bike and would like to learn, and that people no Gentleman represents a minority party. He will know longer need a pass to exit this place by bike. that the way in which Select Committees are composed represents the balance in the House, and a Select Committee John Thurso: I am very grateful to my hon. Friend for would have to be very big indeed for him to have a place his lengthy but good list of aspirations. I know that he is as of right. We have recently changed the rules for the a highly committed co-chair of the all-party group on Backbench Business Committee to give access to him cycling and was a leading member on the parliamentary which he did not have before. As I said in reply to an bike run last Tuesday. I am sure that the members of the earlier question, we will look in the round at the proposals Commission and the management board, and the director for a House business committee when the opportunity general responsible, will have listened attentively to his presents itself. requests and will do everything possible to implement them.

HOUSE OF COMMONS COMMISSION Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline and West Fife) (Lab): Does the Commission believe that closing the road outside the Houses of Parliament would greatly assist The hon. Member for Caithness, Sutherland and Easter in trying to promote cycling? Ross, representing the House of Commons Commission, was asked— John Thurso: It is a subject on which the Commission Cycling has not yet deliberated but, as the hon. Gentleman has raised it, I am sure that the Commission now will. 7. Dr Julian Huppert (Cambridge) (LD): What proposals the Commission has to make it easier for hon. Members Several hon. Members rose— and staff to cycle to the parliamentary estate. [111334] Mr Speaker: Order. I am sorry to disappoint hon. John Thurso (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) Members; normally, I try to get through the whole list, (LD): The House actively encourages cycling to work: but there is considerable pressure on time today, so we officials work closely with the bicycle user group to will move on to the urgent question from Amber Rudd. review facilities for cyclists; a scheme is in hand to Just before she takes to her feet, I should just explain increase the number of bicycle parking spaces from that this absolutely will not run any longer than midday about 250 to about 350; the House supported and and it could run for a lesser time—we shall see. There is enabled the establishment of the Barclays cycle hire heavy pressure on time, this is important and we will station at Abingdon Green; a Dr Bike free maintenance now hear from Amber Rudd. 467 14 JUNE 2012 Fish Discards 468

Fish Discards Amber Rudd: I thank the Minister for that answer. This achievement on a discard ban is a welcome step forward. Fish discards are recognised universally as 11.32 am obscene and unacceptable and I want to press the Minister, if possible, on certain elements of the subject. Amber Rudd (Hastings and Rye) (Con) (Urgent What are his views on slippage in the timetable, on the Question): To ask the Secretary of State if she will plans for implementation and on the consequences of make a statement about the decision on fish discards the agreement for our fishing communities? arrived at this week in the European Council meeting of What confidence does the Minister have in the timetable? Fisheries Ministers. It has already slipped from the original proposals, so will 2018 not be considered by some as the marine The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for equivalent of the long grass? The industry is willing to Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Richard Benyon): move towards the ban, but what support will it get for I am very grateful to my hon. Friend for asking this the change in gears and working methods that will be question, as it gives me the opportunity to run through needed to meet the requirements? Everyone can and some of what we achieved in the small hours of the will welcome the commitment, but what structure will morning in Luxembourg. On 12-13 June, I represented be put in place to help delivery of the outcome while the UK at the Agriculture and Fisheries Council in working within a quota system? Luxembourg to discuss the reform of the common As the Minister will know, the problem of discards fisheries policy. This was a critical negotiation where I cannot be wished away without the means being provided. was asked to give my agreement on key elements of this What are those means to be? Maximum sustainable once-in-a-decade opportunity to reform the broken CFP, yield is at least as important as the discards announcement through agreement of a “General Approach” text. My and there is universal recognition that stock levels need aim has all along been to combine radical political to improve following years of overfishing. The statement ambition with a strong focus on the practical means to says that maximum sustainable yield should be achieved ensure early delivery. I am pleased to report to the “where possible” by 2015; what confidence does the House that we secured agreement to key planks of the Minister have in the phrase “where possible”? As the reform we are seeking. This includes some key demands level of available scientific data is ever increasing, does that I know the House has sought previously, and that the Minister agree that that adds weight to the target remain hugely important to the British public. and, one would hope, momentum towards achieving it We successfully made the case for measures to by 2015? progressively eliminate discards, with deadlines that I particularly welcome the regionalised approach set kick in quickly after the conclusion of the reform. The out in the announcement. The previous one-size-fits-all text provides for a landing obligation in pelagic fisheries approach of the common fisheries policy has failed. from 2014, and a staged implementation in our other Mesh sizes in Hastings were decided in Brussels, which fisheries between 2015 and 2018. Although not all was absolutely absurd. Will the Minister tell us how he member states shared our ambition for urgent action, a expects those welcome changes to impact on the everyday commitment to implement a landing obligation, with a ability of the small fishing fleets up and down the provisional timetable, is a major step in the right direction. country to carry on fishing? I know that he is acutely We also secured the inclusion of provisions setting aware of the need for a fairer allocation of quota to out a genuine regionalised process to replace the centralised support the smaller fishing communities. Can he tell us one-size-fits-all approach. The UK has led work with whether the proposed regionalisation addressed by the other member states over the last year to find solutions Fisheries Council will lead to a brighter future for the to that. The provisions allow us to work together fishermen of Britain? regionally—for example with other North sea member states, to agree the measures appropriate to our fisheries. Richard Benyon: My hon. Friend is right to raise the That is a crucial start in moving decision making closer question of the timings of any discard or land-all to fisheries. obligation. There is no doubt that the United Kingdom’s As for my other top priority, we secured a responsible ambitions were greater than some of the dates in the approach to setting fishing levels. Overfishing has been proposal. They are only proposed dates, but I can a central failing of the CFP, and the UK was adamant assure her that they are considerably better than some that the text should include a clear legal commitment, of the dates being discussed in the wee small hours, and deadlines for that, to achieve maximum sustainable which could definitely, and quite rightly, be construed yield in line with our international commitments. Through as slippage or kicking the issue into the long grass. the discussions in Council, the UK has played a leading Let us look closely at the dates. Unfortunately, the role in developing solutions and building alliances with reform will not be in place until the end of 2013, but other member states to shape the text we agreed in the from 1 January 2014 there will be implementation of a early hours of yesterday. discard ban on herring, mackerel and other pelagic This is not the end of the process. The Council of stocks. The year 2015 will see the emergence of white Ministers has now given a clear steer but the dossier will fish land-all obligations, so we will be well ahead with be co-decided with the European Parliament, so we will many stocks in many fisheries ahead of the 2016 date, continue to work with others to improve the legal which was seen by many as the measure. However, some provisions and we will also guard against any weakening will not come in until 2018, as my hon. Friend says. of the approach. This is a major step towards real Many of the fishermen in her constituency and elsewhere reform on a long and difficult road and I do not expect dislike the top-down management of fisheries for a these negotiations to conclude until well into 2013. variety of reasons, but often because of the controls 469 Fish Discards14 JUNE 2012 Fish Discards 470 that are imposed, such as catch composition measures Finally, what measures will the Government put in and effort controls. A lot of those are incompatible with place to make sure that smaller inshore fishermen and discards, so we have secured in the text a commitment their communities receive a fairer distribution of quotas? to remove those where possible. I look forward to The House will give the Minister one cheer for his working through the detail of that. efforts this week, but the future of our fishing industry On maximum sustainable yield, my hon. Friend is and the recovery of our fish stocks are too important to absolutely right. There is the international obligation sacrifice to yet another Euro-fudge. to fish to MSY by 2015 where possible. The difference now is that we are proposing that what was a political Richard Benyon: Let me start by formally welcoming statement should be a legal requirement. That is a the hon. Gentleman to his position. I look forward to major step forward. On the regionalised approach, it working with him in the coming months on these important has to be said that when we were starting this reform issues. He asked about the dates in terms of a discard ban. process, the UK was a lone voice in calling for an end to I should state quite clearly that when I was asked by The the top-down management of fisheries. We now have Guardian on Monday morning whether I would share the allies and have got that into the text, which is a major dates I was taking to the negotiations, I had very clear achievement. Let us look at what this means for the dates in my head, but we have a protocol—a courtesy—that small, inshore fleets. Like all fishermen, what they want we agree the UK line with all devolved Governments. I most of all are more fish to catch. Fishing to MSY will was very grateful to have the support of all the devolved mean that fish stocks will recover faster and better, so Governments in Luxembourg. We had a very good there will be more fish in the sea for such fleets to spirit in the UK delegation room—we work well together. exploit. They will also see an end to the system that my We agreed that UK line very clearly and we stuck to it. hon. Friend described in which eliminator panels sit in a The hon. Gentleman asked whether there was a vote particular net and mesh sizes are decided perhaps hundreds in the plenary meeting of the Council of Ministers. At or thousands of miles away from the seas in which those the end, the Danish presidency, which has been superb fishermen fish. This is a major step forward. There is throughout—it is a great ally of the British programme, much more work to be done and I assure her that it will and has led very well—asked people to register any not be through any lack of effort if we do not get opposition to the proposal. One or two small countries precisely what we want in the text. did so, and one or two slightly large countries did so too. We should be under no illusion: there are people Mr Tom Harris (Glasgow South) (Lab): May I begin who do not want the policy to be reformed, and do not by saying how disappointed I am that this important support the United Kingdom’s ambitions on discards, issue is being dealt with through an urgent question regionalisation and moving to sustainable fisheries. It is rather than a formal statement by the Government? up to our colleagues from all parties in the European Parliament to make sure that a robust position is maintained There are elements of this agreement that will be and that the Council of Ministers continues to push on welcomed on this side of the House and throughout the the deadlines that we have asked for. country, chief among them being the agreement in principle on a ban on the shameful practice of discards. The hon. Gentleman asked what the measure means However, any deadlines that were discussed were vague for a regionalised approach. I am really pleased that the and did not feature explicitly in the final agreement. United Kingdom position has been adopted, and we Why was this? Can the Minister tell the House if Tuesday’s pushed right through to the end to make sure that if a meeting ended with a comprehensive vote including all group of countries fishing in a sea basin decides on the participating members? A commitment without a deadline details of measures that are currently decided in the is no commitment at all. Without a legally enforceable Commission but which will in future be decided in deadline, what assurances can the Government give that those regionalised groups, the Commission can then the practice of discards will indeed end in the time scale implement that. In the original text, there was a clear he envisages? The Minister told on Monday indication that other measures could be imposed by the that as he entered negotiations in Luxembourg, the Commission in that process. We want to make sure that Government had where countries agree, we have a truly regionalised position—a truly bottom-up system of managing our “still not fully worked out its position” fisheries—and I think that will be welcomed. regarding a deadline. That is an extraordinary approach The hon. Gentleman is wrong about our dates on to negotiations. Does the Minister really believe that to maximum sustainable yield. We want to stick to our achieve the best outcome from negotiations we should Johannesburg commitment, which was a political announce in advance that we have no position—that we commitment, and make it a legal commitment so that have not made mind up our mind about what we want? we fish to MSY by 2015 where possible. He accepts that On the regionalisation of fisheries policy, will the the science is not always clear, but we want to hold Minister explain what practical differences will be made ourselves to account as much as possible. He asks about to the common fisheries policy that will represent an a fairer distribution among different sectors of the improvement on the previous one? The big disappointment industry. He knows—if he does not, he should—that I is the potentially devastating delay until 2020 of a have been working extremely hard on this. I want to commitment to reach sustainable levels of fishing stock, make sure that we keep all those small ports and creeks which will mean another eight years of guaranteed that support the local fishing industry in business. There overfishing. Tragically, once again politics has trumped is a social dimension to the management of the industry. science. Does the Minister agree that a failure to rebuild We have to maintain the diversity of the fleet, which is fish stocks more quickly will damage the UK fishing not easy, but it is a clear priority for the Government. I industry, particularly inshore fleets at the low-impact, hope that he, like his predecessors, will continue to sustainable end of the industry? support that. 471 Fish Discards14 JUNE 2012 Fish Discards 472

Several hon. Members rose— sorts of reforms he has achieved, and had it not been for his leadership and that of the UK Government we Mr Speaker: Order. If I am to accommodate colleagues, would not have got where we are. The issue of discards I need short questions and short answers. is of considerable interest to large numbers of my constituents, many of whom have written to me about Miss Anne McIntosh (Thirsk and Malton) (Con): I it. It is quite a complex matter, so will my hon. Friend congratulate my hon. Friend on what he has delivered consider sending a “Dear colleague” letter about discards and the progress that was made, particularly on to all Members of the House so that we can forward it regionalisation, which is music to the Environment, to our constituents? Food and Rural Affairs Committee’s ears. Will he update the House on the question of a register for UK fishermen Richard Benyon: I am very keen to involve all Members so that we can tackle the problem of slipper skippers, of the House. My hon. Friend, like me, represents a which will also help with discards? Will he confirm that constituency that is almost as far from the sea as it is it will be fish caught against quota on which we will possible to be, but we get letters from constituents who proceed, not just fish landed, as that is one of the main are massively concerned about the marine environment. issues with discards? Will he confirm that there will be I want to ensure that we keep up the political momentum support for fishermen to invest in the selective gear that on this and so want to work with Members on both has been successful in Denmark and Sweden? sides of the House to ensure that we keep up the pressure and are effective through all the institutions Richard Benyon: I am grateful to my hon. Friend that are involved so that ultimately we get the result we for her support. It is a priority quickly to overcome need. the absurd position that we do not know who holds quota in this country. We want to work with devolved Kelvin Hopkins (Luton North) (Lab): The Minister Governments to make sure that we have that register as will recall that I have called a number of times for the quickly possible to ensure that we know and perhaps to abolition of the common fisheries policy and the restoration slay some of the urban myths that football clubs and of historic fishing waters to member states. I still believe celebrities own quota. I have never managed to find out that that is the only final solution that will work, but in the facts about this. the short term we have inched forward. Will he explain The important point on discards is that we know how how the system will be policed, whether there will be to make this work. We begin with a really good experience penalties, precisely what will happen to the excess catches of working with the fishing industry. Catch quota schemes and whether Britain will be monitoring, and indeed will result in 0.2% of discards of cod for vessels in those policing, rogue vessels from overseas that are fishing in schemes. We want to incentivise fishermen not to catch British waters? fish that they would otherwise discard. We want to make sure, too, that where there is a land-all obligation Richard Benyon: Britain has been policing illegal there are supply chains that ensure that those fish are fishing, whether by UK or foreign vessels, and will eaten or go into other systems. We should not just continue to do so. I am pleased that we recently instigated transfer a problem out at sea to landfill. The most a very heavy fine on an overseas vessel fishing in our important thing is that we have time and a clear direction waters. I can assure the hon. Gentleman that I want to to ensure that we can use all the work that we have done ensure that fisheries are managed as close to member with the industry to make this effective and to stop the states as possible. There are some good words in the text problem in a practical sense. that allow member states to take action when it is right for them to do so. Subsidiarity is supposed to underpin Mr Frank Doran (Aberdeen North) (Lab): It is important a lot of European legislation, and I ask him to look at to welcome the progress that has been made in the the provisions we secured on regionalisation. Whether Fisheries Council and congratulate the Minister on the or not we had a CFP, we would still have to work with effort he has put in, but does he agree that the discards other countries because we are talking about an ecosystem, situation is complex, particularly in the mixed and fish that swim in our waters and those of other countries, white fisheries in the North sea—the situation is much and the historical fishing rights that go way back beyond easier to resolve in pelagic fisheries—and that we will the European Union, so I think we have a good message not resolve the problem through European rules? We and that it is something he can be pleased with. need practical regional measures, as has been shown in the Scottish prawn fisheries, where these practical Andrew George (St Ives) (LD): I, too, congratulate approaches have managed to reduce discards by over my hon. Friend on the progress he has helped to secure 70%. in the negotiations. Does he agree that if the regional dimension of the common fisheries policy is to succeed Richard Benyon: I entirely agree that there are fantastic it is critical that fishermen are engaged as key stakeholders practices in British waters that we want to see as part of in the management of those regions? the scheme and that it is not just a question of having a big-bang end to the practice. We want to use existing Richard Benyon: I am grateful to my hon. Friend, evidence and to work with the industry. I know that we who is absolutely right. For too long fishermen have felt can achieve that and look forward to working with the right at the bottom of the decision-making process, hon. Gentleman’s all-party parliamentary group on that. under layer upon layer of control. I hope that we can have a system that is simpler and closer to them. In Tony Baldry (Banbury) (Con): As a former Fisheries December I sat up late into the night discussing with Minister, I congratulate my hon. Friend on what he has Commission officials where an eliminator panel should achieved. People have been trying for decades to get the sit in a net that was to be used off the Shetlands. That 473 Fish Discards14 JUNE 2012 Fish Discards 474 is an absurd system. I hope that a more regionalised Neil Parish (Tiverton and Honiton) (Con): I, too, approach will mean that decisions are taken by fishermen congratulate the Minister, who has achieved a great deal and closer to where they fish. on discards in his time in office. I think that the local management of fisheries and fishermen owning up to Kevin Brennan (Cardiff West) (Lab): I, too, welcome the way fish stocks are managed are essential. We have my hon. Friend the Member for Glasgow South (Mr Harris) to ensure that cod discards, which are still going on in back to his rightful place on the Front Bench. The mixed fisheries off the south-west, are stopped as soon Minister said that he wanted particular dates for the as possible. implementation of the policy against these immoral discards. Did he achieve the dates he had in mind in the Richard Benyon: I am grateful to my hon. Friend, negotiations? who has been a hearty proponent of an end to the top-down management of fisheries and an enemy of Richard Benyon: No, but I failed to achieve them only discards both here and in the European Parliament, and by about a year. We can argue and quibble, but the I will continue to work on that. We should be very important thing is that we agreed a general approach. grateful to organisations such as Fish Fight for the part Had we not done so, we would have becalmed the whole they played in exciting popular culture in support of reform of this broken policy, possibly for years, and what we are doing, but it is also worth paying tribute to sent a message to the European Parliament that the the small groups of scientists, officials from DEFRA Council does not really think it is important, and those and other organisations that have been working to end who believe the current system works would have won, discards and reform this policy for a long time. which would have been a disaster.

Sheryll Murray (South East Cornwall) (Con): As Stephen Mosley (City of Chester) (Con): I give three someone who sat up into the early hours of the morning cheers for this agreement, which represents a huge step listening to the negotiations, I really congratulate the in the right direction. However, given that some European Minister. Can he confirm that any discard ban will not countries, most notably France, remain opposed to prevent fishermen from Looe, Polperro and the Rame some of its key elements, will the Minister ensure that peninsula in my constituency discarding seasonally prevalent he keeps up the pressure so that there is no slippage in fish, such as the red gurnard, that are not assessed as the proposals? under pressure by the Marine Conservation Society? Richard Benyon: I was pleased to welcome the new Richard Benyon: I thank my hon. Friend, who is very French Minister to the negotiations and very glad that I knowledgeable about these issues. I do not know the did not have to do what he did: ring his Prime Minister details stock by stock, but what we want is an end to at 4.30 in the morning to get his authority to support discards. There were proposals made in the negotiation the proposals. I can assure my hon. Friend that we work process that, through de minimis levels that we considered with every country that we feel can move this forward. much too high, would in effect have meant that there It is really important that we do not just sit back was not a discard ban. We must be clear about where we because we have a general approach agreed; there is a want to go, but we want to ensure that we work with lot more work to be done. I am grateful for my hon. fishermen in her constituency and elsewhere to achieve Friend’s his support. that.

Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP): I thank the Minister Andrea Leadsom (South Northamptonshire) (Con): for his statement. With Diane Dodds, a colleague and How miserable of the Opposition to refuse to applaud Member of the European Parliament, I have been working the remarkable progress made by my hon. Friend in an on this issue for some time and therefore give it a area of EU policy that has been calling out for reform cautious welcome. Does he accept that, in the spirit of for literally decades. Will he please tell us what the the agreement, further effort, known as reductions, in process is now for this to receive approval from the the context of the cod recovery plan for the Irish sea, European Parliament and what his concerns about that which affects Northern Ireland fishermen, will not be might be? imposed in future? Richard Benyon: We now enter a process of Kafkaesque Richard Benyon: One of the reforms we want as part complexity. The reforms will go to the European of the process is a greater movement to multi-annual Parliament’s Fisheries Committee in October, and we plans, which I like because they actually take power will then consider what it thinks of them. They will then away from politicians. The horse trading that goes on in go to the plenary session of the European Parliament. December is less possible when we have a good multi-annual They will then be examined again by the institutions plan. What the hon. Gentleman is talking about is a bad early next year through a trialogue process. We will then multi-annual plan, one that was not thought through come forward with a reform, hopefully about this time properly, does not work and in many cases achieves the next year, for implementation in January, which is in reverse of what was intended. I will work with him, 18 months’ time. Diane Dodds and anyone else to ensure that we get the right kind of multi-annual plans system within the reforms. Mr Speaker: I thank the Minister and colleagues. 475 14 JUNE 2012 Business of the House 476

Business of the House deal for the richest 1%, does the Leader of the House not think that the Chancellor should clamp down on unwarranted and exorbitant rewards for those at the 11.59 am very top? Ms Angela Eagle (Wallasey) (Lab): Will the Leader of With the Chancellor disgracefully ducking his own the House give us the business for next week? statement on banking reform later today, how are we ever going to get him into this Chamber to explain what The Leader of the House of Commons (Sir George has happened to his abandoned slogan: “We’re all in Young): The business for next week will include: this together”? We have also had an independent report MONDAY 18 JUNE—Consideration in Committee of this week on child poverty, which states that the previous, the Electoral Registration and Administration Bill Labour Government cut child poverty at a pace and (day 1). scale unmatched in any other industrial country. It reveals that measures that Labour introduced in government TUESDAY 19 JUNE—Debate on a motion relating to the application of article 8 of the European convention on stopped almost 1 million children growing up in poverty, human rights, followed by debate on a motion relating and it states also that measures introduced by this to financial services market abuse. Government were both “unfair” and “short-sighted”. The Institute for Fiscal Studies expects the number of WEDNESDAY 20 JUNE—Opposition day [2nd allotted day]. There will be a debate on disability benefits and children growing up in poverty to increase by 600,000 social care, followed by a further debate on a subject to over the next two years, but the Government’s response be announced. Both debates will arise on an Opposition is to try to redefine poverty, not to deal with the motion. problem. There we have it: a Government who cut taxes for the richest and make the poor poorer while trying to THURSDAY 21 JUNE—Motion relating to the work of cover it up. Will the Leader of the House finally find the British-Irish Parliamentary Assembly, followed by a time for a debate on fairness? The Chancellor in his motion relating to the mis-selling of interest rate swap Budget made the wrong decision, and he also chose the products to small businesses. The subjects of these wrong economic strategy. Britain is in a double-dip debates have been nominated by the Backbench Business recession made in Downing street. Next week the G20 is Committee. meeting in Mexico, and this is an opportunity for the Colleagues will wish to be reminded that the House Government finally to come up with a plan B, but I fear will meet at 9.30am on this day. that Ministers will have trouble even making it to the The provisional business for the week commencing G20 given that they are constantly U-turning. A holding 25 June will include: pattern over Heathrow seems like a more realistic ministerial destination than Mexico. MONDAY 25 JUNE—Consideration in Committee of the Electoral Registration and Administration Bill The Chancellor made good use of the recess to (day 2). perform mass U-turns on his omnishambles of a Budget, and I now understand why there are so many recesses at TUESDAY 26 JUNE—Opposition day [3rd allotted day]. There will be a debate on an Opposition motion, subject the moment: the Government have built time into the to be announced. parliamentary calendar to allow Ministers to slip out all their U-turns when the House is not sitting. Does the WEDNESDAY 27 JUNE—Conclusion of consideration Leader of the House agree that Ministers should have in Committee and remaining stages of the Electoral the guts to come to the House to announce their U-turns? Registration and Administration Bill (day 3). House building is down, homelessness is up, rough THURSDAY 28 JUNE—Business to be nominated by the sleeping is up and young people find it impossible to get Backbench Business Committee. on the housing ladder. What is the response of the I should also like to inform the House that the business Minister for Housing and Local Government? He spends in Westminster Hall for 28 June will be a debate on his time spinning figures that are palpable nonsense. In social mobility. what parallel universe can the Minister for Housing and Local Government describe a year-on-year drop of Ms Eagle: I thank the Leader of the House for 68% in the number of affordable housing starts as an announcing the business for next week. We are all “impressive” and “dramatic” increase? He claimed that particularly looking forward to the visit next Thursday there was a “net loss” of 45,000 homes between 1997 of Aung San Suu Kyi, which is the cause of the change and 2010, before deciding that that figure was not in the start time. sufficiently dramatic and press-releasing that we ended This week the part-time Chancellor has been whingeing up with 200,000 fewer homes. to a group of business leaders because they have not In fact, the Government’s own statistics show that by been publicly defending his decision to cut taxes for the May 2010, when compared with May 1997, there were richest 1%. This, in a week when we learn that FTSE an additional 2 million homes in England. Will the 100 bosses have awarded themselves an extremely generous Leader of the House therefore arrange for the Secretary pay rise of 12% on average, with one in four pocketing of State for Communities and Local Government to staggering pay rises of 40% or more. make a statement explaining the antics of the Housing How do the Government respond? On Second Reading Minister as well as his flawed understanding of simple of the Enterprise and Regulatory Reform Bill on Monday, mathematics? the Business Secretary announced that he is to water The pay of FTSE 100 bosses is spiralling out of down proposals, which were already inadequate, to give control, the number of children growing up in poverty shareholders binding votes on executive pay. Instead of is increasing, house building is down and homelessness encouraging business leaders to lobby for an even bigger is up. What we need from the Prime Minister and this 477 Business of the House14 JUNE 2012 Business of the House 478

Government are less PR and more delivery. To date, it is Several hon. Members rose— a pretty sorry record from an out-of-touch and incompetent Government. Mr Speaker: Order. A great many right hon. and hon. Members are seeking to catch my eye. I remind the Sir George Young: I begin on a consensual note and House that there is a statement on banking reform to agree with what the hon. Lady said about next Thursday, follow, and then a very heavily subscribed debate on when we welcome Aung San Suu Kyi in Westminster mental health under the auspices of the Backbench Hall. Business Committee. I am keen to accommodate as many colleagues as possible, but if I am to do so I “Part-time Chancellor”, the hon. Lady says, which is require short questions and short answers. all very well coming from a shadow Leader of the House who a few weeks ago assumed new responsibilities Dr Julian Lewis (New Forest East) (Con): At this for heading up her party’s policy unit. I hope that she is time of year, local groups such as New Forest’s Normandy not going to be a part-time shadow Leader of the Veterans Association commemorate the greatest amphibious House. invasion in history. In two years’ time, it will be the 70th On executive pay, the previous Government had 13 years anniversary of that invasion. May we have a statement but did absolutely nothing about it. Since January we from a Defence Minister indicating whether there will have been consulting on the most comprehensive reform be Government support for the surviving veterans to of governance on directors’ pay, and greater transparency revisit the beaches in 2014 for the 70th anniversary on what executives are paid; strengthening shareholder commemorations? rights by legislating so that they can hold companies to account; and calling on responsible business and investors Sir George Young: Let me begin by commending the to promote good practice. We will announce the final fortitude and bravery of those veterans who, 70 years package shortly and do in two-and-a-half years something ago, landed on the beaches of Normandy. At this stage, that Labour wholly failed to do in 13. planning for 2014 is in its incipience, but we will mark On child poverty, the previous Government’s target this important anniversary. The Ministry of Defence was to halve it by 2010. They failed. Although relative plans to work closely with the Normandy Veterans child poverty numbers fell over the past year, children Association, and once planning gets under way, we will were no better off in real terms, as it was largely due to a discuss with it some key issues, particularly what support reduction in median incomes. Absolute poverty also did we will be able to give to those who want to go to not change, so there are some perverse incentives in the Normandy in person to take part in the commemorative current system, given that, perversely, in a recession it service. seems that poverty statistics are getting better. That is why we are consulting on a better range for measuring (Hackney South and Shoreditch) (Lab/ child poverty, something that looks at the causes as well Co-op): There has recently been much discussion about as the monetary measures. In a report it will be announced proposals to change the regulation of child care. Many that the Government intend to consult in the autumn child minders, child carers and parents in my constituency on new, better measurements of child poverty, and have approached me with real concerns about what this when we introduce universal credits that will lift hundreds could mean for quality. Do the Government have any of thousands of children and families out of poverty. plans to pursue this agenda? Whether or not that is the case, will the Leader of the House find Government The hon. Lady asks for a debate about fairness. I have time for a debate on this, because I am sure that many announced a number of Opposition days, so she is other hon. Members would like to raise their constituents’ perfectly welcome to choose fairness as the subject of concerns about the implications of such action? one of them. Indeed, she might have chosen fairness for the debate yesterday; it would have been far better than Sir George Young: There will be an opportunity on the one that we had. Monday for the hon. Lady to question my right hon. As for the sittings of the House, we are now sitting Friend the Secretary of State for Education, who has in September, which we did not do at all during the responsibility for this. If she is unable to do that, for previous Parliament, and sitting like-for-like for more whatever reason, I will make inquiries of my right hon. days than the previous Parliament. Friend to see whether we plan any changes along the As for housing, under the previous Government house lines that she suggests. We want to drive up the quality building starts fell to the lowest level in peacetime since of child care, be it provided by child minders, day the 1920s. The hon. Lady asked what we were planning nurseries, or other settings in which early years assistance to do. We have plans for 170,000 affordable homes is given to young children. during the current spending review. We have reformed the planning system and we are making more public Henry Smith (Crawley) (Con): Last week my right land available to house builders. We are taking a range hon. Friend the Prime Minister met his Mauritian of steps to assist the housing market. counterpart, when I understand that the future of the British Indian ocean territory was discussed. May we Apparently, we do not deal with our problems in the have a debate on the importance of the right of self- same way as the Opposition. This morning we discovered determination of the Chagos Islanders in deciding the an interesting new technique for establishing party discipline future sovereignty of their islands rather than having from a prominent Labour blogger in the New Statesman, those decisions made in London, Port Louis or Washington? who wrote: “Challenge Labour and you’ll find a horse’s head on your pillow”. It is no wonder that one insider Sir George Young: I understand the strength of feeling was quoted as saying: on the issue that my hon. Friend raises. I sat next to the “We’re all being terribly positive at the moment.” ambassador for Mauritius at a recent dinner, where we 479 Business of the House14 JUNE 2012 Business of the House 480

[Sir George Young] Sir George Young: I bicycled to work, as did my hon. Friend the Deputy Leader of the House. discussed this. Foreign Office questions on Tuesday On Tuesday, I saw a picture in the paper of my hon. may provide a forum in which he can pursue these Friend taking part in Bike to Work day, and I am sorry issues in greater detail. that he got as wet as he obviously did. As regards the Tour de France, I encourage Yorkshire to engage with Helen Goodman (Bishop Auckland) (Lab): Yesterday the umbrella body, UK Sport, which would take the bid the Leader of the House told us that he thought the forward. In respect of the UK as a whole, I think that priorities for this Chamber should be the eurozone and Scotland has put in a bid for the subsequent year. It is Syria. This morning, two Secretaries of State made key important that Yorkshire puts its bid through the announcements—one on the definition of poverty and appropriate sporting organisation. the other on snooping. Yet three out of the four days of Government business that the Leader of the House has Jim Fitzpatrick (Poplar and Limehouse) (Lab): Will announced are on electoral registration. Why? the Leader of the House tell us when we might next be able to debate the benefit cap in Government time? Sir George Young: The time that the Government have Rent levels in London mean that that policy will have in the House is for their legislative programme. That is disproportionate effects on many families, and particularly why we are spending time on the Electoral Registration children. Jobcentre Plus tells me that it has written to and Administration Bill and why we had the Second 900 families in my constituency saying that their benefits Reading of the Enterprise and Regulatory Reform Bill are to be cut by an average of £200. This could lead to on Monday. I was referring yesterday to Opposition many thousands of children having to leave their homes days, when the Opposition can choose the subject. I in inner London. Mayor Boris Johnson has said that he suggested that instead of choosing the subject they is opposed to it. Will the Government give us some time chose yesterday, they could have chosen the eurozone or to debate it? some other subject. I am delighted to see that they have chosen a serious subject for next week’s debate, and my Sir George Young: This issue was debated substantially right hon. and hon. Friends will engage in that. It is for when the appropriate Bill went through the House. My the Opposition to choose subjects on which to hold understanding was that Labour supports a cap on benefits Ministers to account; Government time is available for in principle. In response to the hon. Gentleman—I Government Bills. hope that this will be helpful—a substantial amount of money is available in a transitional fund designed precisely Sir Bob Russell (Colchester) (LD): The summer of 2014 to stop families having to move house at short notice. I will mark the centenary of the start of the great war. In hope that his local authority, Tower Hamlets, can apply view of the Leader of the House’s earlier answer, may to the Department for Communities and Local Government we have a debate so that the whole House can discuss for the relevant funds in order to avoid any unnecessary how we can join in to commemorate the great war? hardship such as that which he has implied. Nadhim Zahawi (Stratford-on-Avon) (Con): The car Sir George Young: My hon. Friend makes a helpful industry is delivering some outstanding suggestion. He will know that the Backbench Business results. On top of Bentley, Nissan and Jaguar Land Committee is the forum for bidding for such debates. I Rover announcing 3,500 jobs, Aston Martin in Gaydon can only suggest that he presents himself to the newly has announced 150 jobs in bringing back a model to be established Backbench Business Committee and puts manufactured in the UK. May we have a debate about forward his proposal, which I am sure will have a lot of how we can support that industry and the supply chain support on both sides of the House. around it?

Mr Dave Watts (St Helens North) (Lab): Following Sir George Young: I am sure that all Members of the the unacceptable comments made by the Prime Minister House will have heard with sadness of the death of my to my hon. Friend the Member for Liverpool, Walton hon. Friend’s predecessor as Member for Stratford, (Steve Rotheram), may we have a debate on the John Maples, who died over the weekend. We send our snobbishness and elitism that are demonstrated on the condolences to Jane and his children. I hope that the Government Front Bench and were clearly demonstrated contribution that he made to politics encouraged my by the Prime Minister yesterday? party to encourage a broader range of candidates to come forward for selection. I am sure that that helped Sir George Young: I am not sure that any discourtesy enormously at the last election. was extended by my right hon. Friend. Speaking from My hon. Friend may have seen some figures that came memory, I think he called the hon. Gentleman a poet; out this morning indicating a very substantial increase I am not sure that that is a form of abuse. in car manufacturing output, which is one of our success stories. I was delighted to hear of the investment and Jason McCartney (Colne Valley) (Con): My right jobs in the area that he represents. Car manufacturing hon. Friend, like me, is a keen cyclist. May we have a in the UK grew by 5.8% in 2011. We are clearly very debate on the benefits of bringing the Tour de France to competitive in world markets. Yorkshire in 2016, for which a bid has gone in that has been supported by Welcome to Yorkshire, the county’s Keith Vaz (Leicester East) (Lab): As the Leader of tourism body? I am particularly looking forward to one the House knows, the Home Secretary published her of the legs being held at Holme Moss in my constituency. draft Communications Bill today.May we have a statement 481 Business of the House14 JUNE 2012 Business of the House 482 on the way in which Government Departments, and Mr Marcus Jones (Nuneaton) (Con): Unemployment particularly the Home Office, communicate with in my constituency has fallen since the general election Committees of this House? I have been waiting for five to 5.4%. Despite that good news, however, it is still far weeks for a response from the Home Secretary on a too high. My hon. Friend the Member for North number of very important questions. Will the right hon. Warwickshire (Dan Byles) and I are trying to help the Gentleman have a word with her, or may we have a situation by holding a local job fair on 28 June. Will my statement on the matter of providing timely replies? right hon. Friend welcome that initiative, and the similar work that Conservative Members are doing across the Sir George Young: My right hon. Friend the Home country? Will he also grant a debate in Government Secretary and her team do their best to respond promptly time on getting unemployed people back into work? to questions from the right hon. Gentleman’s Select Committee. I understand that there is a high volume of Sir George Young: I am delighted to hear about the correspondence between the Home Department and his job fair in my hon. Friend’s constituency. I know that Committee, and that, on occasions, responses are sought many hon. Members have helped to set up job clubs in within very short deadlines. None the less, we will try to their constituencies—[HON.MEMBERS: “Of all parties.”] raise our game and give the right hon. Gentleman and Of all parties. They have given support in that way, and his Select Committee the quality of service to which I pay tribute to the work that job clubs do in raising they are entitled. morale, enabling networking and finding suitable jobs for their members. I cannot promise an early debate Mr Peter Bone (Wellingborough) (Con): Gallay Ltd on employment, but there might be an opportunity in is a successful manufacturing company in my constituency. some of the debates chosen by the Opposition or the In February this year, it applied for a licence to export Backbench Business Committee in the days to come to 88 specialised air conditioning units to a previously talk about the important subject of unemployment and approved company. Unfortunately, the Department for the steps that the Government are taking to reduce it. Business, Innovation and Skills has still not approved the export licence, and the company is likely to lose the Diana Johnson (Kingston upon Hull North) (Lab): order to an American company. May we have a statement Later this month, it will be the fifth anniversary of the next week on why BIS is acting in this manner? devastating floods in Hull in 2007. Given the uncertainty Sir George Young: I commend what Gallay has been over the statement of principles, and over the Government’s doing in my hon. Friend’s constituency, in winning plans to provide reasonable house for my exports for air conditioning equipment in a very competitive constituents and others around the country, please may market. I understand that the order to which he refers we have a debate in Government time on what they are involves Egypt, where the internal security situation is going to do to protect householders? giving rise for concern. I will ensure that the Foreign and Commonwealth Office and BIS process the application Sir George Young: The hon. Lady raises an important for a licence as quickly as they can, consistent with their issue. I know that there has been a dialogue between obligation to ensure that such equipment is not put to Ministers and the Association of British Insurers to the wrong use. ensure that adequate household insurance is available to those who live on flood plains. I will ask the appropriate Mr Barry Sheerman (Huddersfield) (Lab/Co-op): I Minister—I think that it will be a Treasury Minister—to am sure that the Leader of the House will agree that, for write to the hon. Lady to bring her up to date with the at least 200 years, local newspapers have provided a discussions that are taking place, which I think are vital communication link between those elected to this related in some way to the investment that the Government House and our constituents. In today’s Culture, Media are making in flood protection measures in the areas and Sport questions, I was disappointed by the complacency concerned. of the Under-Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport, the hon. Member for Wantage Stephen Metcalfe (South Basildon and East Thurrock) (Mr Vaizey) in his response to two questions on the (Con): As my right hon. Friend will be aware, the Coryton subject. Papers such as The Huddersfield Daily Examiner oil refinery in my constituency has failed to find a buyer are crucial to the democratic process, yet many of them yet. May we therefore have an urgent debate on the are under threat. This month, for example, the Halifax importance of the refining industry to the UK economy? Courier changed to weekly and online publication only. During that debate, may we explore what further support This decline in our local newspapers represents a real the Government could give to the industry, and the threat to our democratic process. possibility of offering it some form of financial assistance —as we did to the —so that Coryton can remain Sir George Young: I am sure that every hon. Member open? would agree about the importance of his or her local newspaper. The Andover Advertiser is certainly an important Sir George Young: I understand my hon. Friend’s publication. I am sure that there was no complacency at disappointment at the plans to close the Coryton oil all in the reply from the Minister who replied to those refinery. It is disappointing that, so far, an alternative questions a few minutes ago, but, as the hon. Gentleman buyer has not been found. I understand that inquiries will know, there are trends throughout the country—and, are still being made by the administrators, who are indeed, throughout the world—that are making local looking at a range of options for the future of the newspapers less viable. I will get back to my hon. Friend facility. I am not sure that keeping the refinery open and see whether there are any further steps that we can indefinitely at public expense would be the best use of take, but hon. Members can also play their own part in resources, but we are working with Thurrock council’s making local newspapers readworthy by writing columns taskforce, which was set up in the light of the in them that make compelling reading. announcement, and I will ensure that my ministerial 483 Business of the House14 JUNE 2012 Business of the House 484

[Sir George Young] proposal to reduce the scope of the authority as well as change the licensing agreements from six months to two colleague at the Department of Energy and Climate years with no inspections on application for a licence; Change does all that he can to achieve a satisfactory understands that the GLA is a Government body which is outcome. Of course I understand the concern of those fully supported by employers including Marks and Spencer; who are losing their jobs. recognises the invaluable work which is carried out by its officers and staff to ensure the safety of workers across Jim Sheridan (Paisley and Renfrewshire North) (Lab): the UK; further notes that the GLA was established after May we have a debate on the activities of the so-called the cockle-pickers tragedy which occurred in Morecambe private benefit check firms? Those companies operate Bay in 2004, yet understands that the Government plans on a no win, no fee basis, and they advise people on to remove this area of regulation from the remit of the how best to claim welfare benefits. They can, however, GLA; asks the Government to recognise that any cut to subsequently claim up to 50% of the benefits back from the remit of the GLA will have entirely negative consequences; the most vulnerable people in our society. The Leader and calls on the Government to rethink its proposals of the House will be aware that the citizens advice which will put vulnerable workers at serious risk of bureaux already carry out that excellent work, and it exploitation, injury and death.] would be helpful if the Government could promote the The motion refers to a written statement sneaked out work that the CABs are doing in that area. on 24 May, just before the recess, which heralds cuts to the Gangmasters Licensing Authority. The House will Sir George Young: I think that the hon. Gentleman is remember that the GLA was introduced after the tragedy referring to Atos, the company that does the medical involving the Morecambe bay cockle pickers. The cuts assessments to find out whether someone is entitled to will result in an increased rate of death and injury in benefit. There is of course an appeal against the initial certain industries. Surely that merits a statement or even decision in those cases. I think I am right in saying that adebate. Ministers at the Department for Work and Pensions have asked for an independent review of the whole Sir George Young: I cannot promise an early debate. I assessment process and, so far, they have implemented have now seen the early-day motion, to which seven the recommendations of that review. I will make inquiries hon. Members have appended their names. I will write of the DWP to see what further steps are being taken to to the appropriate Minister and get a response to the ensure that benefit claimants who are entitled to benefit concerns that the hon. Gentleman has expressed. I am get the appropriate support. sure that the last thing the Government want to do is to “put vulnerable workers at serious risk of exploitation, injury and Greg Mulholland ( North West) (LD): May we death”, have an urgent debate on the situation facing British as the motion suggests. citizens in the Greek justice system, and on the inadequate support they receive from Foreign and Commonwealth Office staff? My constituent, Fran Prenga, is currently Karen Bradley (Staffordshire Moorlands) (Con): The languishing in custody in Greece—having apparently majority of employment in my constituency is provided not even been interviewed, never mind charged—in by small businesses. I am contacted regularly by such conditions that appear to fall below EU acceptable businesses that have concerns about what support they standards. May we have a statement from a Minister might receive from the Government and other agencies. and a debate on this matter? Will the Leader of the House find time for a debate on the support that is available to small businesses to reassure them and their employees that there is a great Sir George Young: First, I might have misunderstood future ahead, and that they can grow and help us out of the question from the hon. Member for Paisley and the recession? Renfrewshire North (Jim Sheridan). If I did, and if I got the organisation wrong, I will write to him. Sir George Young: I am grateful to my hon. Friend. I share the concern of my hon. Friend the Member Of course the Government want to support small and for Leeds North West (Greg Mulholland) about Greece. medium-sized enterprises. As she will know, a range of I also have a constituent who is tied up with the Greek measures has been introduced to promote apprenticeships judicial system. I know that the FCO often does all that and encourage lending. I would welcome a debate it can to help, but the Greek judicial system is somewhat on the matter, but cannot promise one in the immediate obscure and difficult to penetrate, and one often needs future. The Enterprise and Regulatory Reform Bill is to employ a local interpreter. There will be questions to currently in Committee. I am not sure whether she is a my right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary on Tuesday, member of that Committee, but that would be an and my hon. Friend might have an opportunity to raise opportunity to take the matter further. this matter again at that time. I will warn FCO Ministers that he is on the case. Paul Flynn (Newport West) (Lab): The Public Administration Committee, with its Conservative majority, John Cryer (Leyton and Wanstead) (Lab): Has the decided unanimously that Sir Alex Allan was not a fit Leader of the House seen early-day motion 196, tabled person to be the independent adviser on Ministers’ by my hon. Friend the Member for Hayes and Harlington interests. His collaboration yesterday with a political (John McDonnell)? stunt robbed him of any claim to be independent. When [That this House is greatly concerned by the Written can the House look at why the previous holder of the Ministerial Statement of 24 May 2012 on the future of office resigned, and how the office—a very good reform— the Gangmasters Licensing Authority (GLA) and the has been degraded and politicised by Sir Alex Allan? 485 Business of the House14 JUNE 2012 Business of the House 486

Sir George Young: I reject the hon. Gentleman’s Sir George Young: I understand the concerns of those description of Sir Alex Allan. The Committee on which who have lost a child in the tragic circumstances that my the hon. Gentleman sat in the last Parliament, on which hon. Friend has described. I will certainly pursue with there was an in-built Labour majority, produced the same the Department of Health whether a certificate can be recommendation about an independent adviser, and the issued in such circumstances. I will ask the Secretary of last Government rejected it. A similar recommendation State to respond to my hon. Friend as sympathetically was made in the report that was published in March, to as he can. which the Government will respond in due course. Kevin Brennan (Cardiff West) (Lab): The Queen’s Daniel Kawczynski (Shrewsbury and Atcham) (Con): Dragoon Guards, the Welsh cavalry, are in Westminster I have genuine concerns about the way in which the today lobbying about the future of their regiment because BBC covered the jubilee celebrations, the sky-rocket of the concern that the Government will cut it. May we salaries of senior executives at the BBC, the bias of the have a debate on the future of the Welsh regiments, with BBC and the licence fee of £145.50. When can we have a particular reference to the undermining of support for debate on the sustainability of this out-of-date and the Union that any further weakening of them would bloated organisation? engender? Sir George Young: The BBC is an independent body and is answerable for how it covers events such as the Sir George Young: I was at Defence questions on jubilee and the pageant. I understand what my hon. Monday, where the future of the regiments was raised. Friend has said. I am sure that the House would welcome Speaking from memory, I believe that my right hon. a debate on the BBC. I can only suggest that he presents Friend the Secretary of State said that work was still himself at 1 o’clock on a Tuesday to the Backbench under way on the appropriate configuration. There is a Business Committee to solicit a debate on the BBC. I Westminster Hall debate on Armed Forces day next am sure that he would be supported by Members from Tuesday, which may be an opportunity for the hon. both sides of the House. Gentleman to raise the matter when a Defence Minister will be responding. Jonathan Ashworth (Leicester South) (Lab): A few moments ago, when the Leader of the House cantered Alun Cairns (Vale of Glamorgan) (Con): The previous through his statistics on child poverty, he accidentally Government left Wales as the only nation in the UK forgot to report to the House that today’s figures show without a single mile of electrified railway. Many that the last Labour Government lifted more than 1 million Government Members are lobbying the Secretary of children out of poverty. Given that the Secretary of State for Transport about the electrification of the State for Work and Pensions is today talking about railways. May we have a statement on the matter to find shifting the goalposts—a change from the position that out her latest thinking? the Prime Minister took in opposition—and that much academic research expresses concern about levels of Sir George Young: If I remember rightly, my right child poverty in the future, can we have an urgent hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Transport has debate on child poverty in this House? announced the electrification of the Great Western line to Cardiff. I am sure that that has been well received in Sir George Young: Of course we can, if his party Wales. There will be an opportunity the next time we chooses it as the subject for an Opposition day. I have have Transport questions to press the Government on announced two Opposition days for the next two weeks. their plans to invest further in the railways in Wales. The subject has not been announced for the second half Alternatively, my hon. Friend could seek a debate on of the debate next week. I am sure that the shadow the matter in Westminster Hall or on the Adjournment Leader of the House will have heard the hon. Gentleman’s of the House. request, which would have been better directed to her than to me. The Government are anxious to see whether Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab): May we have a statement there is a better way of measuring child poverty than on the performance of the Child Support Agency, and the way we have at the moment, which has a number of in particular on the effectiveness of its support for the perverse consequences, one of which is that in a recession children of absent parents who are self-employed? child poverty rates appear to improve because they are measured in relation to median incomes. Sir George Young: There will be an opportunity to Chris Heaton-Harris (Daventry) (Con): Will the Leader put question to the Secretary of State for Work and of the House allow us a debate in Government time on Pensions on Monday week. We all know from our stillbirth certification? I have been after a Westminster advice bureau that the CSA is raised with us as a regular Hall debate on this subject for some time. Such a issue. If there is a particular instance that concerns the certificate would help parents who have a stillbirth to hon. Gentleman, I suggest that he writes to the Secretary come to terms with the death of their child, and give of State to see whether he can usefully intervene and recognition to the fact that the birth has taken place. put matters right. Following a previous question in business questions, the Leader of the House kindly got a letter sent to me from Gavin Barwell (Croydon Central) (Con): Some small the Department of Health. It seems that the only reason and medium-sized businesses in my constituency still we maintain the current system of stillbirth certification report difficulties in accessing finance. Although I welcome is to help the Department of Health and other Departments the Government’s national loan guarantee scheme and in the collection of statistics. the business finance partnership, may we have a debate 487 Business of the House14 JUNE 2012 Business of the House 488

[Gavin Barwell] that he has mentioned to enable them to stay in their own home. In the last spending review, we sought to on what else can be done to ensure that companies can ring-fence the DFG money so that the resources were access the working capital that they need to drive growth available to ensure that people did not have to move and create jobs? home if their existing home could not cope with a particular disability. I will make inquiries with the Sir George Young: The Government have introduced Department for Communities and Local Government a range of initiatives, including the StartUp Loans to see whether there is any action that we can take to scheme and the GrowthAccelerator programme. The help his constituents. £82.5 million StartUp Loans scheme is aimed at younger people who want to set up their own businesses. The Jeremy Lefroy (Stafford) (Con): Constituents of mine £200 million GrowthAccelerator programme is for 26,000 have been through the considerable distressed of seeing of England’s most ambitious small businesses, some of their son’s killer in an area from which he was excluded which I am sure are located in Croydon. by bail conditions, yet he was not returned to prison. May we have a debate on the rights of victims in those Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP): Recently, the circumstances? Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs commissioned a report from the Wildfowl and Wetlands Sir George Young: It sounds as though it was a matter Trust on banning lead shot for wildfowlers and on for the court in the first instance, when it discovered wildfowling shooting grounds. That has caused that the bail conditions had been broken, to return the consternation among members of the Countryside Alliance offender to jail. However, I understand the concern of and the British Association for Shooting and Conservation. my hon. Friend’s constituents, and I will raise the Will the Leader of the House agree to a statement or a circumstances that he mentions with my right hon. and debate in the House on that matter? learned Friend the Justice Secretary to see whether any action ought to be taken to ensure that bail conditions Sir George Young: I cannot promise an early debate, are properly enforced. but it is an issue that the hon. Gentleman might raise on the Adjournment of the House or in Westminster Hall. James Morris (Halesowen and Rowley Regis) (Con): I am sure that Members from both sides of the House The number of new apprenticeship starts has doubled would be interested in taking the matter further. in my constituency in the past two years, and I recently launched an apprenticeship challenge specifically to Robert Halfon (Harlow) (Con): Has my right hon. encourage small local firms to take on an apprentice for Friend seen early-day motion 167, which campaigns for the first time. May we have a debate about how we can Rachel’s law? encourage small firms to take on apprentices, so that we [That this House deeply regrets the fact that Mrs get the skilled and flexible work force that we need? Annette Courtney, a mother from Harlow, has had to sell her family home to enable her daughter to live independently; Sir George Young: I welcome what my hon. Friend notes that her daughter Rachel is 20 and has cerebral has done, and more MPs could do the same and remind palsy and high functioning autism, but that she has local employers of the resources that are available if achieved five GCSEs and is on target to gain a BTEC they take on an apprentice. Some £1,500 is available Level 3 in IT and an AS level in business studies; further towards the cost of doing so, and we have just made notes that Mrs Courtney has recently said that “Social available resources that will support up to 40,000 new Services have been involved in our lives for the last two apprenticeships. I would welcome such a debate, but I and a half years and we have been completely disempowered fear that I cannot promise one in Government time in by the system… Having stated that Rachel wishes to the immediate future. leave home when she leaves residential college and having experienced life away from home for the last two years, no Harriett Baldwin (West Worcestershire) (Con): May accommodation has been found to rent. Every avenue that we have a statement on security at the Palace of I have explored has been closed down and I am now in the Westminster? Following the theft of two laptops from process of selling my home to buy her a flat which will my locked office in Norman Shaw North during the leave me homeless”; concludes that Rachel is one of jubilee recess, I have learned that there have been 39 thousands of young adults with disabilities who are sent such thefts in the over the past home with no opportunity to develop their skills, or enter 12 months. Such a statement or debate would enable the workplace; and therefore calls on the Government to colleagues to learn about best practice in securing their bring forward proposals for Rachel’s Law, so that all valuable items. post-19-year olds with a disability, or disabilities, should they choose to leave home, would have adapted accommodation Sir George Young: I very much regret the theft from available to them to rent.] my hon. Friend of two laptops, which, as she said, were Annette Courtney from my constituency of Harlow in a locked room. I have had a discussion with the has had to sell her home to raise funds to ensure that Serjeant at Arms about this matter, and he takes it her adult daughter, who has special needs, gets suitable extremely seriously and is following it up. My hon. accommodation. May we have a debate on a level Friend reminds us, and indeed our staff, that we should playing field for young people with special needs? take whatever precautions we can to ensure that we do not leave valuable equipment in unlocked rooms, to Sir George Young: I understand my hon. Friend’s reduce the temptation towards such thefts. concern. My understanding is that the disabled facilities grant is aimed specifically at families such as the one Mr Speaker: I call Christopher Pincher. 489 Business of the House 14 JUNE 2012 490

Christopher Pincher (Tamworth) (Con): Thank you Banking Reform for recognising me, Mr Speaker. 12.44 pm Mr Speaker: I think the hon. Gentleman is referring not to an achievement on the part of my eyesight as The Financial Secretary to the Treasury (Mr Mark such but to the fact that his own appearance has changed Hoban): With permission, Mr Speaker, I would like to notably from that of earlier days. I say that for the make a statement on banking reform. edification of people who might be attending to our The financial crisis exposed a great many flaws in the proceedings. We look forward to hearing him. system. Banks borrowed too much, took risks they did not understand and bought securities that proved to be Christopher Pincher: All our appearances have changed far from secure. Banking groups became too complex since earlier days, Mr Speaker, as you and I well know. and interconnected to be managed effectively, regulators Youth unemployment in Tamworth has fallen to a failed to identify the risks and taxpayers paid the price. 12-month low, thanks in part to further investment in Between October 2008 and December 2010, European Jaguar and in BMW in Hams Hall. May we taxpayers provided almost ¤300 billion to prop up their have a debate on the steps that the Government are banks, with liquidity and lending support in the trillions. taking and will take to reduce business taxation and In the UK, the bail-out of RBS was the biggest banking regulation further, so that businesses can expand and bail-out in the world. create more jobs? Just as the crisis revealed many flaws, there is no single solution. The Government are reforming the Sir George Young: My hon. Friend’s beard has been substance and structure of the financial architecture, enormously welcomed by the Deputy Leader of the House. putting the in charge of prudential In a week or two, he may even be able to match the regulation. We have created the Financial Policy Committee hirsute nature of the Deputy Leader of the House’s face. to look at risks across the financial system. Our permanent My hon. Friend is right that the investment by Jaguar bank levy penalises short-term wholesale funding, and Land Rover and BMW has had an enormous impact. we have introduced the toughest and most transparent On what more the Government can do, on Monday we pay regime of any major financial centre in the world. had Second Reading of the Enterprise and Regulatory We have worked with our international partners to Reform Bill, which contains a number of measures to deliver robust, consistent prudential standards for banks overhaul employment tribunals and create a more and markets. enterprise-friendly society. The Government are on the The White Paper that we are publishing today sets case. out how we will implement the recommendations of the Independent Commission on Banking. The Government’s Glyn Davies (Montgomeryshire) (Con): Last week, reforms will form a key part of our broader programme Trax JH Ltd, a motor components manufacturer in my of reform. In the same way that the action we have constituency, announced a £4 million order from Renault, taken on the deficit has meant that UK debt is currently which safeguarded 50 jobs in the constituency. That was seen as a safe-haven asset by investors around the a hugely important announcement. Will the Leader of world, we will ensure that British banks will be resilient, the House provide an early opportunity for us to discuss stable and competitive, and so attractive to investors at the importance of the close, pragmatic working relationship home and abroad. between the United Kingdom Government, the devolved The eurozone crisis makes reform more, not less Governments and the providers of finance, which important. The link between the strength of a country’s underpinned the announcement? banking sector and that country’s stability could not be clearer. At the same time, our proposals reflect the Sir George Young: I very much hope that the firm in progress that has been made in European and international my hon. Friend’s constituency has the resources that it regulation since December. The Government welcome needs to deliver the order that it has just won. We have the European Commission’s bank recovery and resolution close dialogue with Welsh Assembly Ministers to promote directive, which will improve member states’ ability to the best output for UK Ltd. resolve cross-border banks without imposing costs on I mentioned a moment ago that the recent figures taxpayers. We will also continue to press for full Basel III from the motor industry were encouraging. The number implementation in Europe. of cars built in the UK last month showed an increase The goals of today’s White Paper are clear. First, of more than 40% on the same time last year, and I am since financial crises rarely repeat the pattern of the sure Members of all parties will welcome that figure. past, we must ensure that banks are more resilient to shocks. Secondly, we must make our banks more resolvable, Mr Speaker: I am grateful to the Leader of the House so that if they fail they do not threaten the provision of and other colleagues for their co-operation. vital services to the real economy. Seeing through those two goals will achieve our third—to curb risk-taking in Greg Mulholland (Leeds North West) (LD): On a financial markets. It must be clear that investors reap point of order, Mr Speaker. rewards when banks do well, but take the pain if banks fail. Mr Speaker: Points of order will follow the statement The Government will ring-fence deposits from on banking reform. the risks posed by international wholesale and investment banking. A ring-fenced bank will be economically and legally separate from the rest of its group and run by an independent board. The ring fence will not in itself 491 Banking Reform14 JUNE 2012 Banking Reform 492

[Mr Mark Hoban] Europe through the recovery and resolution directive. We intend to introduce the principle of depositor preference prevent a bank from failing, but it will insulate the deposits for insured deposits. Unsecured lenders to banks are of families and businesses, and if a bank does fail those better placed to monitor the risks that banks are taking essential parts of the banking system can continue and should take losses ahead of ordinary depositors. without recourse to the taxpayer. Our proposals on financial stability also improve The deposits and overdrafts of individuals and of competition in UK banking. The implicit guarantee to small and medium-sized businesses will, in general, be large banks distorts competition; its reduction will help placed in ring-fenced banks. To minimise the risks that to create a level playing field. However, we want to do a ring-fenced bank is exposed to, it will be prohibited more to encourage new entrants and promote competition. from conducting the vast majority of international We will shortly issue a consultation on reform to the wholesale and investment banking. It will not be permitted payments system. I welcome the reviews by the Bank of to carry out activities through branches or subsidiaries England and the FSA into the prudential and conduct outside the European economic area, or, except in limited requirements for new entrants to ensure that they are circumstances, with financial institutions. Beyond that, appropriate and not disproportionate. We strongly support and within certain constraints, firms may decide what the need for a stronger challenger bank to emerge from to put inside the ring fence. Ring-fencing will provide the divestment. We are engaged customers with flexibility, but not at the cost of financial with Lloyds and the European Commission to ensure stability. that the divestment process creates as strong a challenger The Government also propose to strengthen the ICB’s as possible. A more competitive banking system will work recommendations by applying strict controls to the use only—[Interruption.] of derivatives by a ring-fenced bank to hedge its balance sheet. That will ensure that a ring-fenced bank does not Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo): Order. take excessive risks when managing its own risks, as was Government Members do not need assistance from the the case with J. P. Morgan’s much publicised trading Opposition on where they should sit. The Minister is loss. making a serious statement to the House. Perhaps Governance of the ring-fenced banks will be important. Opposition Members could hear what he has to say. The Government propose to strengthen the ICB recommendations in that area, establishing separate Mr Hoban: That really sums up the Opposition. All risk committees and possibly also separate remuneration they can talk about is who sits where. They have no committees. However, it is important to focus these ideas on how to resolve this banking crisis. reforms where they will have the biggest impact, which is on the biggest, too-big-too-fail banks. We therefore I welcome the reviews by the Bank of England and propose that smaller banks, with less than £25 billion of the Financial Services Authority into the prudential mandated deposits, will be exempt from those requirements. and conduct requirements for new entrants to ensure Large, systemically important banks gain a competitive that they are appropriate and not disproportionate. advantage from the perceived implicit guarantee. Our However, as I have said, a more competitive banking targeted reforms will remove that advantage, helping market will work only if consumers are prepared to smaller banks and new entrants. change banks. The Government are pleased with the One of the clearest lessons from the crisis is that progress on the industry-led initiative to make current investors and creditors, not taxpayers, should bear the account switching faster and easier for customers. Providers costs of failure. That is why we have supported Basel III, covering 97% of the current account market have signed which increases bank capital to 7%, with a top-up for up and the scheme is on track to be launched next systemically important banks, and why we have pressed September. However, to switch, customers need better for that to be implemented across Europe, but to protect information, so the Government welcome the fact that taxpayers, the Government will go further. The largest the Office of Fair Trading and the Financial Conduct UK ring-fenced banks should hold an additional 3% of Authority will take forward the ICB recommendation equity on top of the Basel III minimum numbers. The to improve transparency across all retail banking products. Government also strongly endorse the introduction of a Work is already under way on a number of projects, binding minimum leverage ratio. The White Paper supports such as making account data available to customers the Basel proposal of a 3% leverage ratio for all banks, electronically, to enable them to shop around. including UK ring-fenced banks, and we will continue Financial stability is a prerequisite for growth. Our to press for the implementation of the Basel standard analysis suggests that the proposals in the White Paper through EU law. will cost, in gross domestic product terms, in the region Large ring-fenced banks should hold a minimum amount of £0.6 to £1.4 billion per annum. However, that should of loss-absorbing capacity—made up of debt or equity—of be compared with the estimate that the 2007 to 2009 17% of risk-weighted assets. Their overseas operations crisis has already cost the UK economy £140 billion, should be exempt from that requirement unless they which is one hundred times the maximum cost estimate pose a risk to financial stability. For smaller UK banks, of our proposals. as the ICB recommends, the minimum requirement The proposals, although ambitious in scale, are should be lower. proportionate in impact. They will promote financial To deliver those proposals, the authorities need a way stability while supporting sustainable growth and making to “bail in” bank liabilities so that bondholders, not the UK’s role as the world’s leading international financial taxpayers, bear the losses. The Government will work with centre secure. The reforms we are announcing today, European partners to ensure that the ICB recommendations together with the changes we are making to the regulatory on bail-in are credibly and consistently applied across architecture, demonstrate that the Government are 493 Banking Reform14 JUNE 2012 Banking Reform 494 determined to take action to deliver a stable and sustainable May I ask this champion of light-touch regulation to banking sector that underpins rather than undermines explain why, contrary to Vickers, it is right to allow economic growth. I commend this statement to the retail banks inside the ring fence to trade in derivatives House. and hedging products, which are among the controversial interest rate swap products that many small firms complain 12.54 pm they were mis-sold in recent years? I have said many times that the previous Government got bank regulation (Morley and Outwood) (Lab/Co-op): Let wrong. Those on the Government Front Bench also got me begin by thanking the Minister for notice of today’s it wrong, but they are getting it wrong again. The Treasury statement on the vital issue of banking reform. Chancellor should be careful about leaving the door too The reforms are so important that—we read in the wide open. newspapers—they are to be the subject of the Chancellor’s The Opposition agree with the Vickers view that we Mansion House speech tonight. need a minimum leverage ratio and higher equity The Minister said the statement was serious, and I requirements for larger ring-fenced banks, but will the am sure Opposition Members and Government Members Minister confirm that the Chancellor is setting a lower will all be thinking: “Why is the Chancellor not making minimum leverage ratio than the Vickers commission it?” Should I call him the part-time Chancellor? He was recommended, and that he is departing from the able to spend the afternoon on the Government Bench recommendation that larger banks should have tougher yesterday to support the embattled Secretary of State rules? for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport, but he is The Chancellor implied in December that he would seemingly unwilling, despite media trails, to come to the mandate those services specifically within the ring fence House today. What is the Chancellor running scared to provide clarity and certainty. Can the Minister explain of? Is he too busy this week on his other duties to be the why the Chancellor is now delegating that detailed task Chancellor, or is the truth that he is ducking answering to the Bank of England—the regulator—and not putting the questions because—once again—he is not on top of it in primary legislation? Will the Chancellor—or, on the details of his brief? his behalf, the Minister—commit to inserting in the Bill There are questions to answer. Last September, the the requirement that large UK retail banks should have Opposition welcomed the report by Sir John Vickers equity capital of at least 10%? Is not the real problem and the Independent Commission on Banking, which that the Chancellor is not in the driving seat on this sets out radically to reshape our banking industry. We agenda? urged the Government to implement the reforms without That takes me to our second test, on international foot-dragging or watering them down, but I fear that agreements. In December, I asked the Chancellor whether watering down is where we are heading. Is not the truth he was confident that he would get the necessary that, having failed to secure international agreement in international and EU-wide agreements to implement Brussels and Basel on tougher international banking Vickers. The answer is that he has not succeeded in standards, the Chancellor is now being forced to water delivering that. The Chancellor himself said at last month’s down and fudge the Vickers reforms? ECOFIN, when he refused to agree to an EU statement That is one area in which the Opposition would not on capital requirements, that they would welcome a U-turn from the Chancellor. The Minister “make me look like an idiot”— will say in his response that I am wrong, and that there is no U-turn, just as Ministers said we were wrong to a muttering idiot perhaps! Two weeks later, though, he spot U-turns on pasties, caravans, churches, charities signed up to exactly the same deal. The problem is that and skips, but a pattern is emerging with this Chancellor. there remains the risk that he will be overruled by the He declares, “This Chancellor is not for turning,” and EU. then sends along a hapless junior Minister to do the job There is a wider problem. We agree with the Chancellor for him. We can ask the Exchequer Secretary all about that the UK should not contribute to a eurozone-wide that. deposit insurance scheme, but the Commission’s proposals If the Chancellor is not watering down Vickers, why go much wider and are said to be intended to apply to will he not agree to the Opposition’s request to ask the the 27. The Chancellor gives the impression that he has Vickers commission to come back this autumn and a veto on the plans, so that they would apply only to the publish an independent report on progress in implementing 17. Will the Minister tell us, then, whether the proposals its reforms in the past 12 months? The Chancellor could for Europe-wide banking supervision will be subject to publish that report alongside the autumn statement, qualified majority voting under existing treaties, and when he will have to come to the House to explain why will he tell us how the Chancellor is doing building his failing economic plan has plunged our economy alliances across the EU to ensure that British interests back into recession. That is one area where a U-turn are properly protected and that Vickers is implemented? would be warmly welcome. That brings me to my final test: the impact on growth On progress against the three tests for banking reform, and the wider economy. first, to protect taxpayers, the Opposition support the Vickers conclusion that banking services should be Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo): Order. I safeguarded and ring-fenced. In November 2006, the hope that the shadow Chancellor will be brief, given Minister told the House that how much of the time allocation he has already taken. “light-touch…regulation is in the interests of the” Ed Balls: I shall put my questions briefly, Madam financial Deputy Speaker. I only regret that I cannot put these “sector globally.”—[Official Report, 28 November 2006; Vol. 453, questions to the Chancellor because he has not turned c. 995.] up. 495 Banking Reform14 JUNE 2012 Banking Reform 496

[Ed Balls] I have set out a clear programme of reform that responds to the mistakes of the previous Government and ensures We have consistently urged the Chancellor to take a a stable and sustainable banking system that underpins, swifter approach to competition and to have a growth not undermines, economic growth. objective for the new Financial Policy Committee. We and the CBI agree on that, but the Chancellor will not Mr Andrew Tyrie (Chichester) (Con): The White listen. The problem is that in those circumstances Vickers Paper just published contains an impact assessment, implementation could lead to a continuing impact on paragraph 104 of which makes clear a point that we business lending at the expense of small businesses. heard in extensive evidence—that costs to small businesses To conclude, we set three tests for Vickers, but on will rise as a consequence of these proposals. We also each one the Government are failing, causing uncertainty heard evidence that the scale of the rise would depend where we need confidence, lending and growth. They on the Government’s decision on the design of the ring are failing to take the lead on reforms in the EU, and fence. They have now published a lead option for that fudging and watering down proper taxpayer protection. design, so what is their estimate of the increased cost of We need a Chancellor who can do the economics, grip these proposals to small business lending? the detail and work full time on the job—someone who at least turns up in the House and answers questions on Mr Hoban: We have considered Sir John’s this vital issue. recommendations carefully, including the cost on banks, the economy and business, but we felt it was in the Mr Hoban: The shadow Chancellor was the Minister interest of business to ensure that a wider range of who stood by when bank balance sheets ballooned and products could be sold within the ring fence, including banks took on these risks. He did nothing to tackle that complex ones such as derivatives. We set out, in our problem. As the Governor of the Bank of England said cost-benefit analysis, to look at the cost of the package in May: as a whole, not to break it up into particular areas. I am “With the benefit of hindsight, we should have shouted from confident, however, that we will have a more stable the rooftops that a system had been built in which banks were too banking system in a position to lend to business on a important to fail, that banks had grown too quickly and borrowed more sustainable basis. Through these reforms, we hope too much, and that so-called ‘light-touch’ regulation hadn’t prevented to increase competition in the banking system, which is any of this.” in the interests of small businesses and will help to Only two politicians were quoted in the FSA’s report improve competition on price. I think, therefore, that on the failure of RBS as champions of light-touch this is a good package for businesses and will ensure the regulation—the shadow Chancellor and the former Prime stability of the economy. Minister, the architects and cheerleaders of light-touch regulation at home and abroad. They should recognise Mr Andrew Love (Edmonton) (Lab/Co-op): Next the costs that the British Government and economy Thursday, there will be a debate in the House on the have borne as a consequence of banking failure— mis-selling of derivative and hedging products to small £140 billion between 2007 and 2009. We must recognise businesses, yet the Minister has announced that these the need for a stable banking system to ensure stable will be allowed inside the ring fence. His excuse is that and sustainable growth in the UK economy. there will be stricter regulation, but are these not high-risk As Sir John Vickers proposed, we are ring-fencing products that should not be mixed up with deposits in retail banking, imposing the higher capital standards retail banks? required by him and introducing a binding minimum leverage ratio on banks. The shadow Chancellor asked Mr Hoban: The hon. Gentleman follows these matters some questions in the mix of his lengthy contribution, carefully. I do not know whether he, like me, has a but he did not apologise for his role in the banking fixed-rate mortgage, but that is actually a form of crisis. However, I shall respond to his tests. First, we derivative. These products are widely used and there is a have achieved international agreement with our European need for them. It is in the interests of businesses that partners to implement Vickers through capital requirements such products be within the ring fence—it will provide directive 4 and capital requirements regulation. We have much more control over their sale—although it is important achieved that goal and are working to introduce a to supervise properly the conduct of the banks selling binding leverage ratio with international partners. Vickers them. The Financial Conduct Authority is well place to can, therefore, be implemented through the existing provide that supervision, and with the tougher powers international regulatory framework. we have given it, that supervision will apply not only to The shadow Chancellor talked about a banking union. retail customers but to business customers. Banking union is a product of the requirement for fiscal union and will be needed to promote stability in the Andrea Leadsom (South Northamptonshire) (Con): eurozone, but that will not flow through to non-eurozone Does my hon. Friend think it amazing, as I do, that the EU member states—an important distinction to make. Opposition seem to take no responsibility for the tripartite Banking union is about the sustainability of the eurozone, regulation system that led to the complete disaster we not the EU. have seen? I congratulate him on working to ensure that The shadow Chancellor asked about hedging. Sir such a lack of accountability never happens again. John Vickers recognised the need to ensure that retail Does he agree, however, that more can and needs to be customers and small businesses could access the hedging done on new competition in banking, particularly on products necessary to manage risk on their balance access for new banking entrants? Will he continue to sheets. However, we have gone beyond Vickers in imposing assess—I keep asking him this—bank account portability, higher and tighter standards on how derivatives can be because it would be a game changer in the banking managed by a ring-fenced bank. sector? 497 Banking Reform14 JUNE 2012 Banking Reform 498

Mr Hoban: My hon. Friend, who is right to point out Jonathan Edwards (Carmarthen East and Dinefwr) the lack of an apology from the Opposition for their (PC): Considering that the banks are directly responsible role in the crisis, has persistently raised account portability. for the great recession that we have experienced since She will know that Sir John Vickers considered this 2008, is the Minister not concerned that delaying the matter in the report but opted for improvements to the implementation of the reforms until 2019, as reported switching process to make it easier and more straightforward in the press today, will leave seven years for the so-called for customers. It is important that we pursue that, golden goose to hold a golden gun to the heads of although full account portability will be an option if the ordinary working people and the real economy, and former does not prove effective. We also welcome the give ample time for the all-powerful financial lobby to work that the FSA and the Bank of England are doing water down the proposals? looking at the requirements on new entrants to the banking system to ensure that both the conduct and Mr Hoban: What we have been clear about, following prudential requirements are appropriate and not the Vickers proposals on the timing of implementation— disproportionate. Vickers suggested that the measures should be implemented by 2019—is that we are taking steps now to ensure that Mr David Winnick (Walsall North) (Lab): On banking there is a framework in place, so that banks understand reform, would it not have been appropriate to make at what the rules will be and can respond. Today’s White least some reference to the outright greed of those who Paper is part of that, and we will produce a draft Bill head the banks or to the millions of pounds that some later, which will be subject to pre-legislative scrutiny as of them get each year? Why no such condemnation—or well. There will therefore be a transparent process to is it the case that this Tory-led Government could not ensure that we implement the proposals. The proposals care less? What is all this business about “We’re all in it that Sir John Vickers made, such as ring-fencing, are together”? It does not appear so, does it? vital to ensure the stability of the banking system and Mr Hoban: The hon. Gentleman should reflect for a the stability of the economy. moment on what happened when his Government were in power. Bankers were able to take their bonuses in Mark Field (Cities of London and Westminster) (Con): cash in the year they were paid, while Lord Mandelson In the 14 months since the publication of John Vickers’s said that he was “intensely relaxed” about the filthy interim report, which other major global financial centres rich. What we have done since we came into office is put have gone down the route of proposing either a ring in place the toughest and most transparent pay regime fence along these lines or the gold-plating of capital of a major financial centre and ensured that shareholders requirements, which is also proposed, on top of Basel III, have a stronger voice over bank pay. We have tackled which was supposed to harmonise capital arrangements? the problem, which the previous Government simply neglected and allowed to fester and develop, thereby Mr Hoban: A number of countries have argued for contributing towards the crisis that we have seen in the the freedom to go further and impose higher capital banking sector. surcharges—Switzerland is one and Sweden, which has introduced higher capital surcharges, is another. It is Stephen Williams (Bristol West) (LD): Two of the our responsibility to ensure that we protect the stability core reasons why the Conservatives and the Liberal of the UK economy and the interests of the taxpayer, Democrats came together in coalition were to stabilise and respond to the structure of the banking system in our public finances and to reform Britain’s broken the UK. Bank balance sheets in the UK are many times banking sector. Our constituents tell us that they want larger than our economy. We are much more exposed to more banks that specialise in lending to small and risk. It is therefore right that we should take actions in medium-sized businesses, as well as ethical providers, the UK that help to protect the economy and the such as Triodos bank, which is based in my constituency. taxpayer, which is why we are introducing these proposals Will the Minister undertake to smooth the path through today. regulation for new entrants and also make it easier for people to move their money from existing banks to new providers? Anas Sarwar (Glasgow Central) (Lab): The Scottish Finance Secretary and the Scottish First Minister have Mr Hoban: My hon. Friend makes some important said that if Scotland were to become a separate country, points. We need to make the regime easier when it the Bank of England would remain the lender of last comes to authorising banks, which is why the Bank resort, while UK regulatory authorities would still oversee and the FSA are looking at prudential and conduct Scottish institutions. Can the Minister tell us what requirements, to ensure that they are appropriate and representations the Government have received from the not disproportionate, which is one of the criticisms that Scottish Government and whether he is aware of any many potential new entrants make. However, he is also other EU country that does not have its own central right that once we have new entrants to the market, they bank or regulatory regime? need to be able to attract business from other banks. We need to ensure that customers are able to switch their Mr Hoban: The hon. Gentleman raises an interesting accounts more easily. An industry-led initiative will be question. There are some important questions to be launched later this year which will help with that, but it answered about how the banks would be regulated if is also important that customers understand the costs Scotland were to become independent. As I made clear of their accounts and are able to use that money to help in my response to the shadow Chancellor, a fiscal union them shop around and opt for better-quality or new needs its own system of banking supervision and its providers, so that there is much more choice and diversity own resolution arrangements, and it is hard to see quite in the market. how things would work for an independent Scotland. 499 Banking Reform14 JUNE 2012 Banking Reform 500

Mark Garnier (Wyre Forest) (Con): I am grateful to Mr Hoban: The hon. Lady makes an important point my hon. Friend for his statement today, and also for about getting the balance right, but let us not forget that these measures, which go a long way in dealing with the the banking crisis cost this economy £140 billion between “too big to fail” problem, and in some ways deal with 2007 and 2009. An unstable banking sector costs the the “too small to start” problem. He will be aware that economy dear: it costs jobs, it costs tax revenues and it in the last 100 years, only one ab initio banking licence costs families. The important thing is to ensure that we has been granted. Part of the problem is a reluctance on get the banking system right, so that it is stable and the part of officials at the FSA to grant new banking promotes growth, rather than allowing banks to let licences. Will he look again at the issue of competition loose, grow their balance sheets unconstrained and take in the Prudential Regulatory Authority, in order to try on risks that they do not understand, which is what to help challenger banks enter the marketplace? happened in the lead-up to the financial crisis, when the shadow Chancellor’s system of regulation was in full Mr Hoban: My hon. Friend makes a good point. As I swing. have said, the Bank and the FSA are looking at prudential and conduct requirements to ensure that they are Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline and West Fife) (Lab): proportionate. However, the other thing I would say is Where is the Chancellor, and at what point did he that the implicit guarantee enjoyed by our bigger banks decide not to make the statement himself? distorts competition. Our reforms tackle that, helping to create a more level playing field for new entrants and Mr Hoban: It has always been the case that I would enabling them to compete properly with established make the statement today. This may come as news to players. the shadow Chancellor—it may be different from his experience when he was City Minister—but the Treasury Keith Vaz (Leicester East) (Lab): The Minister will is a team. We have worked together on these reforms, know that four weeks ago today the liquidation of the and it was always the intention that I would make largest bank to have gone bust in Britain—BCCI—was today’s statement. The shadow Chancellor should not completed, after 21 years. The foundation of the system believe what he reads on Twitter. introduced by the last, Labour Government was the Bingham report. The first part has been published; the Mr William Cash (Stone) (Con): Having invested so second part is still confidential. As far as I know, only much time advocating EU jurisdiction over banking in successive Chancellors have read it. Has the Minister the City, how are the Government going to protect the read the second, confidential part, and does he not both from that EU jurisdiction and think it is time to publish it, so that we can have a from qualified majority voting? proper understanding of the reforms that he has set before the House today? Mr Hoban: I think it is very clear that the emerging debate about a banking union flows from the problems Mr Hoban: I know that the right hon. Gentleman has we are seeing in the eurozone. It is important that the raised this matter on a number of occasions, and I am banking union helps resolve some of the problems in not going to give a different answer from those that I or the eurozone, but it is a consequence of having a single the Chancellor have given before. currency, not a consequence of having a single market. It is important for the eurozone to move ahead in Steve Baker (Wycombe) (Con): I congratulate my dealing with its problems and strengthening the banking hon. Friend on the measures relating to bail-in and regime within it. It is also important for the future of depositor preference in particular. However, I am sure the City to ensure that there are proper safeguards over he will remember that under the last Government the the functioning of the single market. FSA came under political pressure. Will his measures deal with that and ensure that, in future, banks are Mr William Bain (Glasgow North East) (Lab): With resolved under the rule of law? a double-dip recession made in Downing street, bank lending having fallen for five consecutive quarters and Mr Hoban: It is important that independent regulators businesses facing a shortfall of £190 billion in finance exist and that their independence is credible. Going over the next decade, why are there no further proposals back to the FSA’s report on the RBS failure, it was in the White Paper to diversify the range of banking interesting that the FSA clearly came under sustained institutions to make sure that finance gets into the real pressure from the shadow Chancellor and the then economy? Prime Minister to have a light-touch regulatory system, and we have seen the consequence of that. It is important Mr Hoban: I do not know whether the hon. Gentleman that there are clear rules to ensure that regulators act has yet read the White Paper. If he did, he would see a independently and that their regulation is seen to be section on competition that deals with encouraging credible. The shadow Chancellor should recognise that diversity, making it easier for new entrants to come into he got it wrong when he called for light-touch regulation the market and promoting switching. When the hon. and championed it throughout the world. Gentleman has read the White Paper, he might like to come back to me. Sheila Gilmore ( East) (Lab): Given the double-dip recession and the continuing fall in net Greg Mulholland (Leeds North West) (LD): One of lending to businesses, what exactly are the Minister’s the very important and positive aspects of the Government’s reforms going to do to stimulate the economy? Is there reforms has been transparency, particularly over pay not a risk that we are going for the stability of the and banking products. Will the Minister assure us that graveyard? there will also be a move to ensure greater transparency 501 Banking Reform14 JUNE 2012 Banking Reform 502 over bank lending figures, as small business organisations, the impact with more urgency so that the concerns that and indeed small businesses themselves, tell us that the have been raised can be assuaged? new lending figures provided often include existing loans and are simply not honest? Mr Hoban: Strong banks that are in a position to lend to businesses are absolutely vital to the long-term Mr Hoban: My hon. Friend is right, and I think future of our economy. We have seen that the mistakes transparency plays a key role in holding the financial of the past eventually catch up with people. They have system to account. We need to make sure that data on led to a weakening of bank balance sheets, which are lending is transparent, but we also need to focus on now being strengthened. We need not only strong banks, identifying other ways in which we can help small but schemes in place to sustain bank lending and to businesses. That is why the Government introduced the ensure a supply of credit to SMEs. national loan guarantee scheme—to help support lending to new businesses. That scheme is working; it is making Matthew Hancock (West Suffolk) (Con): In the week thousands of loans to small and medium-sized enterprises, we discovered that a plan put forward to the last which are benefiting from the lower interest rates that Government to prevent the run on Northern Rock was the scheme delivers. That is an important way to help ignored, I warmly welcome these proposals. How will businesses grow. the Minister ensure that as finance changes in the years ahead, the Vickers proposals to ensure separation will Ian Murray (Edinburgh South) (Lab): Why will the always stay up to date with new technology and new Treasury not agree to Opposition requests for the Vickers techniques? commission to implement a progress report on how the Government are doing with its recommendations? Is it Mr Hoban: My hon. Friend makes two important because the Government are trying to water them down? points. He is right to highlight Hector Sants’s comments this week about how the previous Government ignored Mr Hoban: The process we are going to go through his proposals, leading to a run on Northern Rock that is a very transparent one. We have published a White triggered widespread financial instability. If his proposals Paper today, setting out clearly our response—our detailed had been listened to, we could have had more financial response—to John Vickers’ recommendations. As I said stability, which would have been to the benefit of the earlier, we are going to publish a draft Bill, which will be economy. subjected to pre-legislative scrutiny. We are being very My hon. Friend is also right that finance changes. Part transparent about how we are implementing Sir John of the problem of the previous Government’s regime was Vickers’ recommendations. I hope that the hon. Gentleman that it did not keep pace with changes in the markets. will work with us and ensure that the recommendations The previous Government clearly did not understand get through, so that we remedy the mistakes of the past. what was going on in the banking sector, despite the many meetings between the City Minister and the banks, Richard Fuller (Bedford) (Con): I welcome the Minister’s but I think the regime that we are putting in place is proposals for the long-term protection of depositors, forward looking. We will have the Financial Policy but he will be aware that many of us are concerned Committee looking at emerging threats to financial about the supply of credit to businesses in our economy stability, and both our introduction of the Vickers right now and the impact right now of these long-term reforms and the rules of the Prudential Regulation proposals. What analysis has the Treasury made of the Authority will help to ensure that the ring fence is kept impact on credit from these proposals in the near term? up date and meets not just the needs of business, but the May I suggest that the Minister continues to monitor need for a strong and stable economy. 503 14 JUNE 2012 504 Points of Order Backbench Business 1.26 pm [1ST ALLOTTED DAY] Greg Mulholland (Leeds North West) (LD): On a point of order, Mr Speaker. I have raised previously the awful case of the Prenga family, with Fran Prenga in a Mental Health Greek jail. To my astonishment yesterday, I discovered that MPs’ parliamentary offices cannot phone numbers Mr Speaker: At this stage, there is no time limit on abroad, so I was unable to phone embassy and consular Back-Bench contributions. Let us see how it goes. staff in Greece, unable to contact the family and unable to speak to the office of Edward McMillan-Scott, MEP, who is assisting in this case. It is clearly an absurdity to 1.26 pm have to get my constituency office to make calls that I need to make myself from London. Could this matter Nicky Morgan (Loughborough) (Con): I beg to move, be addressed as a matter of urgency? That this House has considered the matter of mental health. I am particularly grateful to all members, old and Mr Speaker: I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman new, of the Backbench Business Committee for allocating for his point of order. The matter is one to be taken up time for this debate in the Chamber. The effort to secure with the director of Parliamentary Information and the debate has been done jointly with my hon. Friend Communications Technology. I am happy to do so, and the Member for Broxbourne (Mr Walker), the chairman then refer back to the hon. Gentleman as quickly as I of the all-party group on mental health, which he has can. He has raised a pertinent point, which requires a led so well, and with my hon. Friends the Members for timely response. I hope that will be to his satisfaction. Worthing West (Sir Peter Bottomley), for New Forest East (Dr Lewis) and for Halesowen and Rowley Regis (James Morris)—I hope I have pronounced that one correctly—and the hon. Members for Dagenham and Rainham (Jon Cruddas) and for Foyle (Mark Durkan). We were quite clear when we put in our bid that we wanted a full debate on the Floor of the House. Why? It is at least four years, and probably slightly longer, since the general topic of mental health was debated in Chamber. That is a long time, given that 25% of the population—one in four people—will experience a mental health problem at some point in their lives. Just imagine if this were a physical health condition and it had not been talked about by Members in the House of Commons other than in very specific ways such as Adjournment debates for a very long time. Mental health comes at an economic and social cost to the UK economy of £105 billion a year, yet mental health has been a Cinderella service—poorly funded compared with other conditions and not spoken about nearly enough either inside or outside this House. It is the largest single cause of disability, with 23% of the disease burden of the NHS, yet the NHS spends only l1% of its budget on mental health problems.

Mr (North Durham) (Lab): Does the hon. Lady agree that it is not only a matter of the effects on individual mental health because mental health issues can lead to physical disabilities, leading to extra costs to the NHS on top?

Nicky Morgan: I entirely agree with the hon. Gentleman. The Centre for Mental Health has shown that for a person who has a physical and a mental health condition, the costs of treatment are increased by 45%. Those are additional costs around mental health problems, which are often untreated initially and then have to be treated at a later stage, so the hon. Gentleman is absolutely right. According to the Centre for Mental Health, only a quarter of people with mental health conditions—children as well as adults—receive any treatment. I have no reason to doubt that statistic, and I find it shocking that 505 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 506 three quarters of people with mental health conditions It can strike anyone, often very unexpectedly. That are not being treated. We should ask ourselves why that includes people in senior positions such as Members of is. Parliament, company directors and school governors. I Recent figures have shown that depression alone is am sure that my hon. Friend the Member for Croydon costing the economy £10 billion a year. As we all know, Central (Gavin Barwell) will refer to the private Member’s we do not have a lot of money to spend, so we should be Bill that he will be presenting, which would end working as hard as we can on preventive measures. One discrimination against people in such positions who in every eight pounds spent on dealing with long-term have mental health conditions. conditions is linked to poor mental health, which equates I expect that during today’s debate we shall hear to between £8 billion and £13 billion of NHS spending about new mums with post-natal depression. For them, each year. a time of life that should be one of the happiest is often I welcome the Health and Social Care Act 2012. I one of the most difficult. I welcome the recent Government hope that today’s debate will be conducted on pretty announcement that health visitors will be properly trained non-partisan terms, but I realise that that may strike to recognise signs of post-natal depression, which I Opposition Members as a controversial comment. I think was long overdue. I expect that we shall also hear welcome the opportunities that the Act offers for the about veterans from our armed forces who suffer from commissioning of mental health services. I spoke in mental health conditions, and about older people who the Third Reading debate, and I especially welcomed the suffer from dementia. Particular issues affect our black Government’s acceptance of an amendment tabled in and ethnic minority communities, as well as those who the other place to ensure parity between physical and find themselves in the criminal justice system. I am sure mental health. Although those are only words in a Bill, that we shall hear from the Minister abut the Government’s they are very important words, and they send a very clear widely welcomed framework document “No health without signal not only to sufferers from mental health conditions mental health”, which was published last year. We now and their families, but to those working in the NHS. I await the detailed implementation plan on which the hope that, in his annual mandate to the national Department of Health is working alongside leading commissioning board, the Secretary of State will insist mental health charities. that the board prioritise mental health. I want to talk, very briefly—I have noted Mr Speaker’s How are we to achieve parity between physical and strictures about time limits—about three specific matters: mental health conditions? The question is about money, listening to patients, integrated care, and the wider certainly, but it is also about awareness. Confessing to mental health well-being landscape. We made it clear having a mental health condition carries far too much during the passage of the Health and Social Care Act stigma. That is part of the reason for our wish to hold a that one of the developments that we wanted to see, as a debate on the Floor of the House. If we do not start to Government, was “No decision about me without me”. talk about mental health in this place, and encourage That means patients having a voice in their care. It others to talk about it, how can we expect to de-stigmatise seems to me from my discussions with those in the mental health conditions and enable people to confront mental health system who have been sufferers that once their problems? the initial crisis has been dealt with, they tend to want I find it interesting that, when I was preparing for the choice and involvement in their treatment. They are debate, a few people who had initially said to me “Yes, facing a lifetime condition. They will have to self-medicate, go ahead, mention my name” came back after thinking look after themselves and identify the point at which about it for a couple of days and said “Actually, I would they may be deteriorating or potentially reaching crisis rather you didn’t, because I have not told my employer,” point for years and years to come. They want a voice. or “I have not told all my friends and my family.” It is They want to be heard by the health care professionals, clear that mental health conditions still carry a considerable and I think that it is up to us as a Government to help stigma. Admitting to having been sectioned is traumatic, them to achieve that. especially when the information appears on Criminal Records Bureau checks connected with job applications. John Pugh (Southport) (LD): The hon. Lady has just I welcome the work of Time to Change, which has said that people who suffer from mental health problems been funded partly by the Department of Health as well have a lifelong condition. I think that many people have as by Comic Relief. I also welcome the Sunday Express an occasional mental health problem. campaign on mental health. However, the de-stigmatisation of mental health conditions is down to all of us, and it Nicky Morgan: I am not sure that I entirely agree is especially important for those of us who are employers with the hon. Gentleman. I agree with him that people not to discriminate against people who may be working often enter the system at a time of crisis and experience for us and who tell us that they have a mental health a single episode, but others who experience episodes condition. I hope that today’s debate will constitute will get better. For years they may have no problems at another firm step on the path to ensuring that mental all. The hon. Gentleman shakes his head, but I can tell health conditions are de-stigmatised, because I think him on the basis of the experience of constituents and that without that de-stigmatisation, successful treatment family members that it is possible to go in and out of will be very hard for a person to achieve. the system. One of the hardest things for people to We asked for today’s debate to be kept deliberately accept when they are diagnosed with a mental health general, so that Members in all parts of the House condition is that they will be on drugs for years and could raise many different issues on behalf of their years. That is often difficult for people to admit, particularly constituents and, perhaps, themselves or their families when they are striking up a new relationship or working as well as looking at the mental health policy landscape. for a new employer. I think that that is why people want Mental ill health is no respecter of age or background. to have a voice in the way in which they are treated. 507 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 508

[Nicky Morgan] a mental health condition, so that children can avoid multiple assessments and need not re-tell their story According to MIND, people are three times as likely each time they see a new person in the system. However, to be satisfied with their treatment if they are presented there must be a clear care pathway, whatever the point with a choice of treatments, and failure to stay on at which access is gained to the mental health system. medication is the main cause of relapses, when people The other thing patients are calling for is the ability often have to re-enter the system at a time of crisis. to self-refer. We need to do all we can to prevent people There is a need to work with and trust health professionals. from reaching crisis point, and often it is patients themselves According to a recent study by the University of Kent, who are best able to tell when they are about to reach “Low levels of trust between mental health patients and that point. My West Leicestershire clinical commissioning professionals can lead to poor communication which generates group is developing an acute care pathway in partnership negative outcomes for patients, including a further undermining with Leicestershire Partnership NHS Trust. It plans to of trust”, replace the many and varied access routes to secondary and care and mental health services with a single access “trust can play a significant role in facilitating service users’ initial point, in order to provide speedy access at times of and ongoing engagement with services, the openness of their greatest need. That move has come out of both patient communication, and the level of co-operation with, and outcomes from, treatment or medication.” and GP feedback. In 2009, a mental heath in-patient survey by the Care Quality Commission revealed that in some mental health Mr Robert Buckland (South Swindon) (Con): I trusts as few as 40% of people diagnosed with schizophrenia congratulate my hon. Friend on securing this debate, felt that they were involved as much as they wanted to and I am particularly interested in the proposed single be in decisions about their care and treatment. I am no access point for services. That could be useful not only health professional—I hope that some Members who for acute services, but for non-acute services and well-being are health professionals will speak later this afternoon—but provision. Does my hon. Friend agree that well-being what people have said to me suggests that medication is provision is an important part of mental health provision? not always the answer, at least in the long term. Research by Platform 51 has found that a quarter of women have Nicky Morgan: My hon. Friend is absolutely right, been on anti-depressants for 10 years or more, that half and I shall talk about well-being shortly. We often talk of women on anti-depressants were not offered alternatives about these subjects in very negative ways. If we all talk at the time of prescription, and that a quarter of women about our mental well-being, and are regularly asked on anti-depressants have waited a year or more for a about it when we see our GPs, that will help a lot to review of their medication destigmatise mental health issues. I welcome the Government’s investment of £400 million I want to touch briefly on secondary care. One of the in treatments under the improving access to psychological Sunday Express campaign demands is that all hospitals therapies programme. I should add, to be fair, that that should be therapeutic environments where people with builds on announcements made by the last Government. mental health problems feel safe and are treated with I also commend the report by the Centre for Social respect and have someone to talk to. In a debate in this Justice on talking therapies, which calls for a broadening House last November, I mentioned patients who abscond of therapies. Every patient is different, and patients will from secondary care units, and in particular the tragic respond differently to different medications and therapies. case of my constituent Kirsty Brookes, who was able to Mental health patients must have real choice, and I escape from a unit in Leicester and subsequently hanged think that Any Qualified Provider and Payment by herself. I am sure the Minister will remember that Results must be extended to them in the way in which debate, and our discussion of the definition of absconding. they are being extended to patients with physical health The Care Quality Commission has published its first conditions. We must also ensure that patients’ voices are report on absconding levels, and I welcome that, but the heard within the management structures of both clinical picture in respect of absconding and escape numbers is commissioning groups and health and wellbeing boards, still unclear. The numbers provided in this first CQC whose job is to hold services to account for the care that report need to be broken down further, therefore, but they are giving. the report showed that in the year in question—2009-10, I expect that Members will refer to integrated care: I think—there were 4,321 incidents of absence without leave the need for all services to work together. Poor mental from secondary care. Some of them were, of course, far health has an impact on every area of Government more serious than others; some will have involved a policy: health care, benefits, housing and debt, social person missing a bus on the way back to the unit, while exclusion, business and employment, criminal justice others might have ended in tragic circumstances. I make and education, to name but a few. One person with a this point not to beat up on secondary care providers mental health condition may need help from many different and health providers generally, but we must know the agencies, but too often care is not joined up, and each scale of a problem before we can begin to tackle it. agency deals with its own bit and passes the person on. The impact of the voluntary and community sector Sometimes there is no follow-up, and the person is lost on mental health must not be forgotten either, and I in the system. hope Members will talk about that. The sector offers In a 2011 survey, 45% of people contacted by MIND vital support, and it must be part of the commissioning said that they had been given eight or more assessments landscape. by different agencies in a single year. YoungMinds, which campaigns on behalf of children and young Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Lab): I congratulate people with mental health conditions, has called for one the hon. Lady on securing this important debate. Many worker to be allotted to each child needing support for smaller voluntary sector organisations give a very good 509 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 510 service and understand their communities. Under the asked, but I thank my constituent Jo Gibbs, who recently commissioning process, however, they often lose out brought me a letter outlining her concerns about these to very large enterprises—large charities and medical changes and the anxiety and pressure they are causing companies—that have no real understanding of the local her and others. community, particularly ethnic minority communities. Does the hon. Lady agree that the Minister needs to Julie Hilling (Bolton West) (Lab): I congratulate the consider that issue further? hon. Lady on securing this debate, and on her speech. On welfare reform, does she share my concern that Nicky Morgan: I agree; that is an issue. The commissioning people with mental health issues are being kicked off structures are being changed, with local GPs now deciding disability support allowance? Increasing numbers of what care they want to buy and where they want to buy people in that situation are coming to see me. Recently a it from. I hope that change will allow them to explore constituent came to me who is bipolar on the Asperger’s the value of smaller organisations, which tend to know spectrum and who scored zero in the assessment for particularly well the people they are treating. Although that allowance. such organisations might not have the clout of large organisations, they are often more successful in terms Nicky Morgan: I thank the hon. Lady for her of patient care. I am sure the Minister has heard that intervention. I am sure we will all have similar constituency point. cases. A survey by Mind found that most people with I want to thank one of my regular correspondents, mental health problems want to work but may not be Mike Crump of My Time, a community interest company well enough. For some people, employment—the right based in the . He may well be in the Public employment with the right employer and the right Gallery for this debate. My Time provides evidence-based, support—is the right way forward once they are better. culturally sensitive professional counselling and support For other people, however, employment is not the answer. services. He said to me that a great deal of many The hon. Lady is right that assessors have not always people’s recoveries understood the mental health needs of certain people. “is owed to therapies based on basic common sense not the The Government have tried to address that through the miraculous powers of a tablet or the mysterious wonders of the two Harrington reviews. The system is never going to be medical profession.” perfect. That is where Members of Parliament come in; Let me turn briefly to policing. My chief constable in we will be making arguments on behalf of our constituents. Leicestershire is also the Association of Chief Police I understand the hon. Lady’s point, however. We need Officers mental health lead. In Leicestershire in 2011-12 to do more, and we need to promote awareness of there were 444 detentions under section 136 of the these issues. Mental Health Act 1983, which gives powers to take a Other aspects of modern life do not help, such as person to a place of safety. Leicestershire police deals loneliness and isolation. We live in an ever busier world, with serious incidents involving mental health issues but people lead more isolated lives. We must not forget on a daily basis, and it has provided me with a snapshot the question of families either. Sometimes they can be of what happened on the jubilee weekend. From 8 pm the cause of a person’s problems, but at other times they one night to 7 am the next morning it had dealt with can be the solution. I commend the Centre for Social 10 incidents in which mental health conditions or concerns Justice for its work and its report, “Completing the were clearly prevalent. That night, police officers spent Revolution”, about the importance of families and how four hours with a man in hospital after he was detained significant family breakdown can be in respect of mental under section 136. I therefore ask this question: are health problems. the police the right people to be dealing with such incidents? This is an important debate, but it is only one step along the path of giving mental health the priority that I hope Members will talk about the criminal justice Members clearly feel is needed given the number of system, and the fact that nine out of every 10 prisoners them present today. I look forward to hearing their have a mental health problem. The Government are views. We need to talk about mental health far more investing more than £19 million this year in diversion openly, and we need to make it much easier for people services, but it is still taking too long to get prisoners to find out information about how they can get help out of prison and into secure hospitals. before they need it. It is too late when people reach Finally, I want to talk about the mental well-being crisis point. landscape. All of us have mental health; it is just that I look forward to the no health without mental some people’s is better than other people’s. We need to health framework being implemented. Talking must get to a situation where it is as normal to talk about our never stop, but we must now also start implementing. I mental well-being as about our physical well-being. thank everybody who has contacted me in the run-up Public health policy has a role to play. Local authority to this debate and shared their often very personal public health services are key in promoting good public stories about their experiences in the mental health health. I welcome the Leicestershire joint strategic needs system. The House is all too often known for Members assessment chapter on mental health, which was published shouting at each other. I hope today shows that we are recently. It makes it clear that mental health is important about more than that, and I hope we can all agree with and says that it cannot be seen in isolation, as many the motion before us, as mental health is a huge priority factors contribute to mental ill-health, including the for Britain and for our constituents, whether they are economic instability at present—which I am sure we sufferers or carers. Working together, we can come up will hear about this afternoon—and the welfare reform with integrated care that responds to the needs of changes, such as asking people whether they are fit enough patients and gives our mental well-being the prominence to go back to work. I think such questions need to be it merits. 511 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 512

1.50 pm this. Mind has said in the briefing note it sent to us for today that about 22% of its funding at the local level Mr Kevan Jones (North Durham) (Lab): I congratulate has been cut, That is a shame because, as I said, those the hon. Member for Loughborough (Nicky Morgan) organisations are sometimes the best at not only being and the Backbench Business Committee on securing advocates for local mental health services, but at providing this debate, and I pay tribute to her very well-informed care. In regions such as my own in the north-east, contribution. She is obviously a great champion for funding is vital for those organisations. When I talk to people who in many cases do not have a voice in the local mental health professionals and charities, I find health system. Let us hope that by securing this debate that it is unfortunately a fact of life that economic we can give those people the voice they need, and not conditions at the moment mean that the demand for only, as she says, in the health service; we also need to services is increasing. get the message across to employers and others that mental health issues are not an inhibitor to a good and The hon. Member for Loughborough referred to the successful career and a fulfilled life. I shall discuss that Health and Social Care Act 2012, and I agree with her in a moment. that it does present some opportunities, if things are I declare an interest as the president of my local done properly. Chester-le-Street Mind, under the great Chester-le-Street Mind group. I have had an interest in leadership of Helen McCaughey and her husband, mental health for a number of years. The hon. Lady Charles, delivers a local therapy service, commissioned mentioned the role of the voluntary sector. It plays a by the primary care trust, and it is great. It is carried out fantastic role, not only in promoting the issue of mental in the community, and that is the model that I like to health but in delivering services. In some cases, these see. The only concern I have, from talking to GPs over organisations are better vehicles for delivering this localised the years, is that although some of them are passionate help than some of the larger companies referred to by about mental health and understand it, others do not. my hon. Friend the Member for Islington North (Jeremy The challenge for the new commissioners is to take a Corbyn), or even the NHS itself. bold step and say that some of these services can be delivered in the community by groups such as Chester- The hon. Lady said that one in four people could le-Street Mind and others. The Government might have suffer from mental health problems in their lifetime. to be aware of that nationally. As my hon. Friend the The hon. Member for Southport (John Pugh), speaking Member for Islington North said, this does not have to from the Lib Dem Front Bench, is both right and wrong involve just large companies, because the approach in what he said. Some people do have mental health I have described would be effective. That is my only issues because of events in their life—crises happen and concern: that although I know some very good GPs, people can get over them in a short time—whereas including my own, who have a clear understanding of others have long-term conditions that have to be lived mental health issues, others are not very good at giving with throughout their life, by way of drug treatment this appropriate priority—I am sure that hon. Lady is and other effective therapies, as the hon. Lady said. aware of some of those. We are thus presented with There is a big difference between those two situations. both an opportunity and a risk. Anyone in this Chamber or any of their family members could suffer from short periods of mental health illness or be long-term sufferers. That is the important thing to The Minister of State, Department of Health (Mr Simon get out of today’s debate. Burns): I am extremely grateful to the hon. Gentleman because he is making an extremely good point, but does We also need to address the cost, which the hon. he agree that, under the reforms and the new NHS, a Lady mentioned. I am thinking not only about the cost crucial role will be played by the health and wellbeing to the NHS, and the personal cost to individuals and boards, which are there to monitor and ensure that the their families, but about the cost to UK plc. I reiterate local health needs of local communities are provided that mental health issues can affect anyone. I know for? general practitioners who have gone through periods of severe depression. I know one who works as a consultant cardiologist and is brilliant in his field but who lives Mr Jones: Yes, that is one of the key roles of those with mental health issues, and has for many years. He boards. Again, however, it will be important to ensure has a very understanding employer and is very open that we get the right people on those boards—for example, about it. Let us not say that there are any boundaries in counsellors who really understand mental health on mental health, because there are not; these issues can those boards. As the hon. Member for Loughborough affect anyone in society. said, people have empathy in respect of cancer, but do I wish to discuss two issues, one of which is the effect not quite understand mental health. I agree with the of funding on mental health. The other relates to the Minister that it is important that the boards are the welfare reform changes, to which my hon. Friend the counterweight to ensure that that happens, but I think Member for Bolton West (Julie Hilling) referred. They that central Government also have to play a role in are having a disproportionate impact on people with ensuring that it happens. As I say, we have some great mental health issues. I accept the view of the hon. opportunities here and the commissioned work that Member for Loughborough that we do not want to get Chester-le-Street Mind delivers is excellent. In addition, into a party political debate, but there is unjoined-up it is cheap compared with some of the major contracts thinking in some parts of the coalition’s policy. I must in terms of delivery, because it is delivered by well-trained say that I saw exactly the same thing when I was a professionals and by very committed and hard-working Minister, when one Department does something that individuals in the community. has an effect on others, and it is sometimes difficult to A lot of mental health charities also rely on charity get round those circles. However, local authorities in the funding from organisations. In the north-east this funding north-east are clearly having to cut back on funding for comes from, for example, institutions such as the Northern 513 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 514

Rock Foundation, which has now been taken over by We must try to get a system in which employers, even Virgin Money. There is real concern that as those sums in these tight economic circumstances, understand the contract, the money going into mental health services mental health issues and can make adaptations. Whether from those groups will also contract. We need to keep we support employers who take people with mental an eye on the situation to ensure that, be it through the health issues on for a certain period or whether we do lottery or through organisations such as the Northern other things, we need to think it out a bit more than it is Rock Foundation or the County Durham Community at the moment. Foundation, where funds are limited because of the economic crisis, mental health gets its fair share of the Nicky Morgan: One statistic that I did not use in my funding available. I mean no disrespect when I say that speech was that only 1% of the access to work funding, people give happily to Guide Dogs for the Blind or to which employers can use to help to smooth someone’s cancer charities, but it is very much more difficult to get path back into employment, is used for mental health a lot of people to recognise and give money to mental facilities. It could be used for counselling or support health charities, unless they have been through or had a workers, but only 1% is spent on such provision in the family member who has been involved in mental health context of the prevalence of mental health issues in the issues. We need to be wary of that, too. general population. I now wish to discuss the welfare benefit changes, which my hon. Friend the Member for Bolton West Mr Jones: The hon. Lady makes an important point mentioned. I commend Mental Health North East, a that should be considered. That is where we need to join very good group in the north-east that has interacted up the two relevant Departments. with the Department of Health. It is an umbrella group of mental health charities that not only campaigns for Mental Health North East has carried out a survey and raises awareness about mental health but delivers and I thank that organisation and Derwentside citizen’s services to mental health charities and individuals. The advice bureau for the examples I am going to use. Like organisation is run by a very dynamic chief executive, the hon. Member for Loughborough, I asked whether I Lyn Boyd, and is made up of paid individuals and a could use names. One person said that I could, but late large number of volunteers, many of whom have personal last night she rang me to say no. I am sure that people experience of mental health issues. They are very good will understand why I use letters to refer to these advocates, not only ensuring that mental health is kept individuals rather than their names. high on the political agenda but interacting very successfully The first case is that of Mr A, a 50-year-old man who with the Department of Health in consultations and lives alone and received ESA. He suffers from depression, so on. anxiety, agoraphobia and anger issues. Despite the support One piece of work that that organisation has considered he is getting and the drugs that he is taking, he was is on a matter that I have increasingly seen in my called by ATOS to a work-related interview. He got no constituency surgeries. There are people with mental points at all even though he finds it very strange to go health issues who were on the old incapacity benefit and outside the House, let alone to interact with people. He are now on the new employment support allowance and decided to appeal and attended the appeal. There is a who are, frankly, being treated appallingly. The way that huge backlog in the appeals system that is adding to is being done is costing the Government more money in people’s anxiety as they are having to wait a long time, the long term. I know that it is not the direct responsibility and the pressure on citizen’s advice bureaux and local of the Department of Health, but some thought needs welfare rights organisations to support those appeals is to go into how we deal with the work test for people creating a crisis in some of them. When I give some of with mental health illnesses. I am one of the first to these examples, Mr Speaker, you will see that they recognise that, as most of the professionals say, working should never have gone to appeal in the first place. is good for people’s mental health; it is important to say This case was very interesting. Mr A turned up at that. However, we must recognise that certain people the appeal, which, as my hon. Friend the Member for will have difficulties with that. If we are to get people Islington North mentioned earlier, caused him huge with mental health problems into work, we must ensure stress as he thought he was going to lose. He turned up that the pathway is a little more sympathetic than the in the afternoon, and his appeal had been heard that one we have at the moment. morning without his being present and his award had Another massive problem is the work needed with been granted on the basis of the medical evidence. If employers. If employers are going to take on people with the appeal hearing could do that, why could ATOS not mental health issues, they will have to be very understanding do so? The reason is that ATOS is not taking medical to cope with those individuals. evidence into account at all. The second individual is from Stanley in my constituency Jeremy Corbyn: Many of those who are taken for and I have known this young lady since she was in her work-related interviews by ATOS are declared fit for early 20s. work, only to win an appeal to show that they are not. On many occasions, the levels of stress they have been Sir Peter Bottomley (Worthing West) (Con): In the through in going for the interview, failing it and winning hon. Gentleman’s example, was ATOS setting its own an appeal are very detrimental to their health. Does my procedures or was it following the instructions under hon. Friend agree that the Department must be far the contract? more sensitive about that and think a lot more before it starts to call people in for these interviews? Mr Jones: Having seen the form, I think it was Mr Jones: I totally agree and I shall give some examples according to the contract, and this is where things needs of that in a minute. tweaking. We need a special form for people with mental 515 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 516

[Mr Kevan Jones] “Not at all and there was a great deal including an advocate (myself) attending the Medical. Nothing that I said” health issues, rather than using the generic form for seemed to make a difference. Yet another: people with other disabilities, too. That is the important “Generally, clients feel that mental health is not taken into point that needs change. consideration” Miss B, as I will call her, is 36 and a single parent who and is not being focused in the way that physical disabilities lives in Stanley in my constituency. She has a very are. supportive family and receives huge support from her “Most clients believed that their own medical evidence had local Sure Start and her local community mental health been completely disregarded” team. She has been unemployed, suffers from bipolar at the interviews they attended. Another issue that was depression and is on a cocktail of medication. Although commonly raised was how little time it took—less than everyone has been told not to contact her directly but to 15 minutes in most cases. contact her mother, ATOS contacted her directly. She Question 6 asked about the impact on individuals. lives independently just down the street from her mother, Let me quote some of the answers directly: which is good, but everyone has been told to contact the “Despair. Resignment to the cruelty dished out” mother because she does not quite understand. When ATOS contacted her with a telephone request for interview, by the system. according to her mother it sent her into an absolute “Very distressed, anxious, scared”. panic. If her neighbour had not been there to help her, “Very stressed, confused, angry and frightened as you can it would have caused huge problems. imagine, these people are already existing below the poverty line” Miss B went to the interview and failed it, getting no and this increases stress levels. points. She is now having panic attacks, she has had Judging by those examples, the system needs to be episodes where she has felt suicidal, and without support changed. It is inefficient, it is causing huge problems for her child would have been taken into care. She was individuals, and is also costing the system more. What nearly hospitalised because of the stress. She has now we need to do, possibly through the Department for had to wait upwards of eight months for her appeal to Work and Pensions and the Department of Health, is be heard, but in the meantime, and not just because of come up with a specific work test for people with mental the ESA, her housing benefit has been stopped so she is health issues, and recognise that individuals have to be in debt. It is one thing after another, which is not what supported. someone with severe mental health illness needs and that Now I am going to throw my notes away—I thought is why we must refine the system. That woman has been long and hard last night about whether to do this—and waiting for an appeal for eight months now and, knowing talk about my own mental health problems. 1n 1996, the case as I do, I have no doubt that she will win. I suffered quite a deep depression related to work and My final example is Mr J, a 52-year-old who suffers other things going on in my life. This is the first time I from mental health illness, partly as a result of his have spoken about this. Indeed, some people in my family separation from his partner a few years ago. He suffers do not know about what I am going to talk about today. from very severe depression and is on antidepressants. Like a lot of men, I tried to deal with it myself—you do He has tried to help himself by going to cognitive not talk to people. I hope you realise, Mr Speaker, that behavioural therapy sessions. In January 2012, the what I am saying is very difficult for me. Department for Work and Pensions wrote to ask him to I have thought very long and hard about this and did attend an ATOS interview, which caused him to withdraw not actually decide to do this until I just put my notes from his treatment programme. That was not good for down. It is hard, because you do not always recognise him. Very insensitively, ATOS then rang him on Christmas the symptoms. It creeps up very slowly. Also, we in eve to organise the appointment. Again, despite the fact politics tend to think that if we admit to fault or failure that a lot of medical evidence was presented, ATOS did we will be looked on disparagingly by the electorate and not take any of it into account. our peers. Whether my having made this admission will There is another thing that ATOS is getting completely mean that the possibility of any future ministerial career wrong, or at least has an inconsistent approach to. Mr J is blighted for ever for me, I do not know. I was a took his son, who is one of his key supporters, along Minister in the previous Government and I think that with him and asked whether he could make representations most people on both sides of the House thought I did a on his behalf. He was told no. In other cases, people reasonable job. have taken their community psychiatric nurses with We have to talk about mental health issues in this them only for them to be told to sit outside the interview place, including people in the House who have personal while the individual goes in. ATOS is being inconsistent experience of it. As I have said, I thought long and hard in its approach and is clearly not taking on board any of last night about doing this and I did not come to a the medical evidence that is put forward. Mr J appealed decision until I put my notes down just now. Whether it and, as in the first case I cited, the appeal went through affects how people view me, I do not know; and frankly on the basis that the medical evidence presented was I do not care because if it helps other people who have good enough. What is ATOS doing? What concerns me depression or who have suffered from it in the past, about these cases is the cost not just to the individual then, good. but to the health service and the local NHS. Politics is a rough old game, and I have no problem Let me highlight the findings of the survey I mentioned with that. Indeed, I am, perhaps, one of the roughest at and read some quotes from it. In response to a question times, but having to admit that you need help sometimes about whether medical evidence was taken into account, is not a sign of weakness. I also want to say to you, someone said that it was “not even looked at.” Another Mr Speaker, that we need to do more here to support response was: Members with mental health issues. In terms of 517 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 518 occupational health, we have an excellent individual in places. I operate to the rule of four, so I have to do Dr Madan, who understands mental health issues very everything in evens. I have to wash my hands four times well. I know of only one other Member who has suffered and I have to go in and out of a room four times. My from mental health problems because a colleague on wife and children often say I resemble an extra from the Labour Benches has spoken to me about her mental “Riverdance” as I bounce in and out of a room, switching health issues and depression, but it is important to get lights off four times. Woe betide me if I switch off a the message across to individuals that if they are having light five times because then I have to do it another problems they can go and see Dr Madan and her team. three times. Counting becomes very important. May I also highlight to you, Mr Speaker, the problems I leave crisp and biscuit packets around the house that Dr Madan has with getting funding for treatment because if I go near a bin, my word, I have to wash my afterwards? The hon. Member for Loughborough hands on numerous occasions. There has to be an mentioned drugs, and they are part of the answer, but upside to a mental health problem. I thought that the they were not the solution for me. Things like cognitive upside would be that I would not get colds, because behavioural therapy can be far more effective. As I apparently if you wash your hands a lot, you don’t get learned over many years, it is about how you think. colds, but I wash my hands hundreds of times a day and Dr Madan raised an issue with me regarding an individual I get extremely cheesed off when I end up with a heavy for whom she was trying to get funding, but the House cold. authorities were not prepared to do it. If she comes to OCD is like internal Tourette’s: sometimes it is benign you, Mr Speaker, regarding any Member who wishes to and often it can be malevolent. It is like someone inside have mental health support you have to say yes because one’s head just banging away. One is constantly striking it is not easy for Members of Parliament to go to their deals with oneself. Sometimes these are quite ridiculous own GP or local community to talk about these issues. and on some occasions they can be rather depressing Sometimes, it is perhaps better for them to have treatment and serious. I have been pretty healthy for five years but and find solutions here rather than in their constituency. just when you let your guard down this aggressive friend That is a plea to you, Mr Speaker, and I would be comes and smacks you right in the face. I was on grateful if you took that on board. holiday recently and I took a beautiful photograph of As I have said, I do not know whether I have done the my son carrying a fishing rod—hon. Members may right thing. Perhaps I will go home tonight and think I know that I love fishing. There was my beautiful son have not, but I think I have. I hope that it does not carrying a fishing rod, I was glowing with pride and change anyone’s view of me. Most people might think, then the voice started, “If you don’t get rid of that “Christ, if it can happen to him, it might happen to photograph, your child will die.” You fight those voices anybody.” On that note, let me put on record my thanks for a couple or three hours and you know that you for the opportunity to debate this issue. Let us go out really should not give into them because they should and champion this issue. not be there and it ain’t going to happen, but in the end, Finally, let me say to every hon. Member present and you are ain’t going to risk your child, so one gives into to those who are not present that although being an MP the voices and then feels pretty miserable about life. is a great privilege—I have always thought that; it is a But hey, there are amusing times as well. I do not feel great thing that I love—it also has its stresses. Unless particularly sorry for myself, because my skirmish with someone has done it, they do not know what those mental health is minor. There are people who live with stresses can be personally, in terms of family, and in appalling mental health problems day in, day out, which terms of what is expected of us in the modern technological is why I when I became an MP, I regarded it as a age. A little more understanding from some parts of the wonderful opportunity to try to help them. I hope that I media and some constituents about the pressures on the have an insight into some of their pain and agony and modern-day MP would be very valuable. the battles that they go through on a daily basis. Many people are frightened and feel excluded. 2.16 pm My first year and a half in Parliament was absolutely Mr Charles Walker (Broxbourne) (Con): It is absolutely appalling. It was very, very difficult. My constituents fantastic to follow the hon. Member for North Durham thought that I was a jolly fellow—that is how I came (Mr Jones). I was a researcher here in the early 1990s across—but I remember sitting in my office going through and a few Members present were here at that time. They my post. A book arrived with a letter saying, “Managing will remember the debates about homosexuality. There your Tourette’s”. I thought, “Oh my word, someone has were some discriminations, as there still are, in relation spotted me on television. I’m done for. They’ve sent me to homosexuality, and people were beginning to feel a book and I’ll be outed in the newspapers: ‘Walker’s a very uncomfortable about that. Many colleagues came loony’”. My constituents will turn their backs on me, to this place to take part in those debates, and they my association will throw its hands in the air, and my would say, “These discriminations against homosexuals children will be chased through the playground.” I sat in are disgraceful, but I am not gay myself.” They did not cold terror for 10 minutes, wondering how I would want to be perceived as gay because they had an interest navigate my way through this. I then picked up the letter in those matters. and realised that it was a circular that it had gone to all I am delighted to say that I have been a practising 650 MPs, so I took great comfort from the fact that fruitcake for 31 years. It was 31 years ago at St John’s probably 50 others were having the same emotions as Wood tube station—I remember it vividly—that I was me. visited by obsessive compulsive disorder. Over the past We can talk about medical solutions to mental health 31 years, it has played a fairly significant part in my life. problems, and of course medicine has a part to play. In On occasions it is manageable and on occasions it reality, however, society has the biggest part to play. becomes quite difficult. It takes one to some quite dark This is society’s problem, and we need to step back from 519 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 520

[Mr Charles Walker] is that. That is the end of the matter, because we recognise that there is stigma and discrimination. I am afraid that our own prejudices, park them and embrace people in our ultra risk-averse world, that is a career death with mental health problems. You only get one chance sentence for those people. We need to sort that out. at life. You get about 80 years-ish. If you have severe I join the hon. Member for North Durham in saying mental health problems, you get about 65. Can you that I am not frightened any more. Like him, I am imagine going through your whole life feeling miserable, pretty middle-aged, and I do not care what people think excluded, discriminated against, with little hope? I cannot. of me any more. When people come up to me and say, I have a wonderful vocation, I have a loving family, and “Mr Walker, we think you an absolute rotter and so-and- I have a comfortable lifestyle, so I know, even when so”, with OCD, I would probably have said a lot worse things are bad, they will get better, but a lot of people to myself 20 minutes earlier. It is not such a big deal. I are not in that position, and we need to reach out to am not frightened any more. It is a really good place to them. be, and we need to ensure that many hundreds of I am really excited about the speech by the hon. thousands can be in that place as well. Not being Member for North Durham—I am very excited about frightened is a really good thing. Hon. Gentlemen, hon. that—and I am excited about the fact that my hon. Ladies and friends: rock and roll, as they say. Thank you. Friend the Member for Loughborough (Nicky Morgan) secured this debate. We are making progress and moving 2.26 pm in the right direction. We will hear from my hon. Friend Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP): I am privileged to the Member for Croydon Central (Gavin Barwell) in a be in the Chamber to hear some of the speeches that few moments—or hours—about his private Member’s have been made, including those by the hon. Members Bill. Many colleagues in the House are taking part in for Broxbourne (Mr Walker) and for North Durham the debate. I think that some colleagues would like to be (Mr Jones). It is a great privilege to hear what they said. here but, again, if they are here discussing mental I congratulate the hon. Member for Loughborough health, some people might feel that they have a problem. (Nicky Morgan) on raising the matter in the Chamber. Look, it is a not a problem, it really is not: let’s get over She said that everyone has mental health issues; I suppose it guys, and move on. it is a matter of how they deal with that and control it. Media reporting has improved and we do not often We all have a breaking point. I hope that I never reach see headlines such as “Frank Luno”, which was totally that breaking point, and that others do not do so either. indefensible. The media are beginning to get on board, As an elected representative, in my interaction with because there are many people in the media who suffer constituents in my office, I see very clearly how people from mental health problems. As the hon. Member for deal with depression. As the hon. Member for Strangford, North Durham alluded to at the beginning of his I wish to express views on behalf of my constituents, speech, who are these people out there? They are doctors, ever mindful of the fact that health in Northern Ireland nurses, teachers and soldiers; they are all around us. is a devolved matter. However, the debate is on mental Why would the hon. Gentleman’s constituents think health generally, so the issues in Northern Ireland are any differently of him now than they did 20 minutes every bit as relevant as those in Broxbourne, North ago? In fact, they will respect him a great deal more. Durham, Loughborough and anywhere else in the United Why would my constituents think any differently of me Kingdom. Every day I deal with those issues, whether now than they did 10 minutes ago? Those who disliked through employment and support allowance appeals or me will continue to dislike me; those who like me will disability living allowance appeals, or by interacting continue to like me; and those who were slightly agonistic with people and the way in which they deal with their could go either way. benefits. Here we are, having a great, great debate. The all-party An issue that has been highlighted in the Chamber is group on mental health is going from strength to strength the difficulties that can arise. That was an issue before and, for the first time, I am feeling really positive and the economic downturn, but it is a bigger issue today, very happy. I am not going to speak for much longer, because people find it harder to deal with the economic but I want to say two things. We need to sort out and financial realities that face them, which compounds independent mental health advocacy for people who their problems. In all honesty, over the past year or face incarceration or are on community treatment orders. 18 months, I have seen greater need in people who suffer Access to representation is patchy across the country, from depression, as they have had to deal with issues and we need to sort that out, because we cannot lock up with which they have never had to deal before. We have people who do not receive proper advocacy or constrain debated many great issues in the Chamber in the two their liberties without proper advocacy. years in which I have been an MP, but this issue is We also need to address Criminal Records Bureau certainly one of the most important. checks under the heading “Any other relevant information” I want to deal with two issues. I want to talk about that are entirely at the discretion of the chief constable. mental health from the perspective of Northern Ireland, I am aware of a number of people who have had mental and I also want to touch on an issue the hon. Member health problems and have been detained for a short for Loughborough mentioned when she talked about while. The police became involved, because they took the armed forces. There are problems for our soldiers those individuals into detention or to hospital. They go and service personnel returning from the battlefield, for a job perhaps as a counsellor or working in the whether Afghanistan or Iraq, because their memories charitable sector. They have a clean record but under of those conflicts do not finish when they get off the “Any other relevant information” the chief constable plane or boat after returning home; they are still with can say, “We are aware that this person was detained for them many years after the conflict. I feel strongly about a mental health problem at this institution. We are not that for those who returned from both Iraq and aware that they are a threat to adults or children”. That Afghanistan. 521 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 522

Good mental health should be a priority for us all, as preventing mental health problems and ensuring early every Member who has spoken so far has indicated. In intervention. Many personal issues affect mental health, Northern Ireland we have also made it a priority. However, including drink, drugs, working conditions, homelessness, Northern Ireland—I say this with respect—has been poverty, unemployment and risk-taking behaviour, whether underfunded for many years, owing to direct Government smoking or unsafe sex, and those issues affect many of reasons and others. The figures show that mental health the people who come to my office with these problems. is a greater issue in Northern Ireland than it is in other Let us address these problems first by strengthening parts of the United Kingdom. People would say that individuals, by addressing emotional resilience and that is perhaps because of the 30 years of the troubles, by promoting self-esteem, life skills, coping skills and which I think is probably true. When someone is under communication skills. We also have to strengthen pressure or stress and worried about whether they will communities. Those are the issues I feel are important. live or die, they turn to drink, drugs or other things, and That means addressing the issue of social inclusion, that affects their lifestyle. Ultimately, a great many improving neighbourhood environments, which make a people in Northern Ireland suffer from depression and difference. In relation to teenagers, we also have to try mental health issues because of our country’s past. I am to address the anti-bullying strategies in schools. Those glad to say that we have moved on. We now have a are important because bullying is one of the things that partnership Government and we are working together lead to young people having these depression issues. to ensure that there is a future for everyone, and that in We also have to reduce the structural barriers to the future there is a lessened threat of terrorism. mental health, which means access to education and The British Medical Association in Northern Ireland meaningful employment. I know that that everyone will has done significant research on mental health there. agree with that, but at the end of the day we need to When the hon. Member for Loughborough introduced have a strategy in place to address mental health issues, the debate she mentioned a number of the points that and that is what we are seeking to do through this are also in the BMA’s report, so I could not help but debate. We all agree that there is absolutely no doubt wonder whether she had perhaps seen the same report. that we all support the issue and the vulnerable people It contained a number of points that she referred to and affected, people who we meet every day and who need commented on. I think that the reason those points are real help. so similar to what she said is that the same issues are in the community is a great worry for us all as just as relevant in Northern Ireland as they are in elected representatives. Every one of us will have dealt Loughborough and the rest of the United Kingdom. with families, with people whom we know personally or I would like to touch on how we can improve the with people from families that we know personally who situation. I know that the Minister will have a detailed have lost loved ones—who took their own lives because and helpful response to the debate. To start with, it is a they felt that there was no way forward. They were taboo subject. I think that the Government and policy coming off the back of terrible depression or terrible makers must strive to ensure that the stigma, which pressure, and did not know where they could go next. Members have talked about, and the clear discrimination and fear that surround mental health are eliminated or Mr Kevan Jones: We have been talking about the addressed by focusing on promotion, education, prevention voluntary sector, and in my constituency there is a very and early intervention. Those are the four headlines the good organisation, which also came about as a result of BMA puts forward in its suggestions. There is clearly a a personal tragedy for the individual—a woman called work force planning problem that, in some occasions, Shirley Smith, who runs If U Care Share. Her 19-year-old occurs simply because of reductions in staffing levels. son died, and it is about young people and talking There are a number of things we need to do, and about those issues. She goes into schools, youth groups perhaps the Minister, when he responds, can tell us how and football clubs to do so. Does the hon. Gentleman the issue of mental health will work within the staffing think we should have a national strategy on that to restrictions and assure us that that concern will be taken ensure that it is part of the curriculum as well? on board. The Northern Ireland Executive’s programme for Jim Shannon: Yes, I do. When a constituent of mine government made a commitment to work for a healthier died in a car accident on a Sunday night, I went to her people and identified mental health as a priority. It also house on the Monday night, and her father just wanted set out targets to try to address the issues. The person to speak and to talk about his daughter. That is the who suffers from mental health problems is only part of issue. On many occasions, it is just a matter of having the problem. When a constituent with mental health someone to talk to, someone who can lend a sympathetic problems comes to my office, as they do to the offices of ear when it is needed most, so I wholeheartedly agree other Members, there is not just one person sitting in a with the hon. Gentleman on that matter. chair in front of me, because they are usually accompanied Back in 2005, the then Secretary of State for Northern by someone else; there is a family circle, children, mums Ireland, who had some responsibility for health, the and dads and everyone involved. While one person right hon. Member for St Helens South and Whiston might suffer from mental health problems, half a dozen (Mr Woodward), set up a task force to develop a suicide people could be affected by the ripples. prevention strategy for Northern Ireland. It is paying I am also concerned about teenagers who suffer from some dividends in relation to a decrease in the number depression. Between 10% and 20% of our teenagers will of , but the number is still at a very high level. suffer from depression at some point in that short Other Members have touched on dementia and period of their life. I believe that there has to be recognition Alzheimer’s, and after wearing my hat as a councillor of mental illnesses, notably depression, and it means for 26 years and as an Assembly Member for 12 years, that we need to look beyond good mental health and at before being privileged to enter this House, I must note 523 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 524

[Jim Shannon] The work done for our soldiers in the Akrotiri centre, which cost £4.5 million to build, gets them ready for life that the number of people with Alzheimer’s and dementia back home. is greater today than ever before. I do not know the Those soldiers have seen in Afghanistan the most reasons why, but they are real, the statistics prove it and horrific things that we cannot begin to visualise. They we have an issue there as well. have seen friends and colleagues killed or injured, some On employment and support allowance appeals, the with life-changing injuries. We know of those people hon. Gentleman made an interesting point about those because we have met some of them, and we are humbled who have mental health issues, because when they go to when we do so. The bullets and the bombs are intermingled an ESA appeal the issue is clearly not a physical one, with the stress, the trauma, the bad memories and the because physically they can walk about, move their nightmares—those are all part of the things they have hands, brush their hair—if they have any, unlike me—or to face long after they leave the Army. While the Army, put a hat on their head. They are asked whether they the and the look after their can do those things, but those are not the questions that personnel, the forces associations do likewise. We recognised a person with mental illness needs to answer. They need from our time in Akrotiri, as we have in our constituencies, to answer the questions, “Are you moody?”, “Do you that once soldiers are out of the Army they are often fall out with people?”, “Are you aggressive?”, “How do distanced from those associations too. The Royal British you cope with difficult situations?”, “Do you start a Legion might not always be at hand for them. They task that you cannot finish?” Those are the questions might have no friends or their marriage might have split for a person who is depressed, and I agree with the hon. up. They might turn to drink and drugs, but that will Gentleman, because the appeals panel—the chair and give only temporary relief and they are still on their those who deal with such tribunals—need to understand own. I am mindful that defence is not the Minister’s those issues better, so that an appeal can be presented in portfolio, but I hope that when he replies he will consider a way that people understand. the welfare of our soldiers who have returned from It has been stated that everyone has mental health Afghanistan, are not in the forces any more because issues. No one is immune, and although stress is greater they have left or retired, and are now apart from the among the poor and the unemployed it applies throughout ritual and discipline that they were once very much society. Good mental health is crucial to the overall part of. well-being of an individual, of societies and of countries. Every one of us will be aware of constituents who In Northern Ireland there are about 150 suicides each have lost control because of the memories and nightmares year: 41% are single males, and 22% are males between of what they have seen. Whenever the memories flood 25 and 34 years old. Some 50% of suicides in the UK back and the flashbacks reappear, they relive what they involve psychiatric patients, and one reason is a loss of have come through, and then they face their demons contact; in that context I want to talk about soldiers, alone. We need to face up to this issue confronting those about a loss of contact by the health service and about who have served, and are serving, in the Army, the Navy treatment non-compliance, whereby people do not take and the Air Force. The health service needs to address it the medication that doctors give them. UK-wide, in England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland. The plight of our soldiers should be a priority Figures for the United Kingdom as a whole indicate for this Government, as I know that it will be. I commend that depression accounts for about 60% of the country’s the motion to the House and hope that Members will main health problems, alcoholism about 10%, Alzheimer’s support it. about 8% and severe stress about 6%. That leads me on to that second issue, which is to do with our soldiers. 2.43 pm The week before last I had the opportunity to go to Cyprus with the armed forces parliamentary scheme. The Minister of State, Department of Health (Paul Some MPs in the Chamber will be members of that Burstow): There is no health without mental health. In great scheme, some will be aware of it and some will that simple statement I sum up the coalition Government’s have been members in the past. We have an opportunity approach to mental health. to meet soldiers and to hear about strategic issues so In contributing to this important debate, I start by that we can present them to the House in an informed congratulating my hon. Friends the Members for and knowledgeable way. Loughborough (Nicky Morgan) and for Broxbourne When we were in Cyprus two weeks ago, we noted its (Mr Walker), among others, on tirelessly pursuing the importance from an Army and a strategic point of view, case for having this debate on the Floor of the House. It but we had not realised that it is halfway to Camp is one of the rare debates that we have on this subject, Bastion in Afghanistan. There is a new scheme in and it clearly airs the issues that are so important to so Cyprus whereby soldiers returning home from Afghanistan many of our fellow citizens. come through a so-called decompression centre in Akrotiri; The hon. Member for North Durham (Mr Jones) last year 30,000 did so. They call it decompression said that it was a privilege to have the job—the vocation—of because it helps them to unwind after what they have being a Member of Parliament, and I could not agree experienced in Afghanistan over the previous few months. with him more. Sometimes, that privilege involves the The sun is usually shining, which makes a big difference. surprise that we can still experience in the Chamber They have a chance to shower, to have their kit completely when debates are genuinely authentic and when people dry-cleaned, and to have a good meal. They have access speak from the heart. I thank him for his candour and to mobile phones, and they are able to speak to their honesty; we need more of that. The chair of the all-party doctor, padre or commanding officer. They have a parliamentary group on mental health, my hon. Friend chance to get back into normal life—to step down and the Member for Broxbourne, talked, with humour and get themselves ready to go back home to their family. much besides, about his experience with obsessive 525 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 526 compulsive disorder. Anyone living and struggling with how to ensure that health services are properly such conditions, who has not perhaps reached the point commissioned in custodial situations. I would be only of wanting to talk about it, will feel huge respect for too happy to meet her and the ACPO mental health both Members for bringing the attention of the House lead to discuss those issues further. to these matters. They have made us all wake up to something that we ought to know, but that we too often Jeremy Corbyn: Will the Minister look carefully into forget. That is that mental health is not a “them and us” the circumstances of people who die either in police game; it is about us—all of us. It touches us all in one custody or in a mental health institution as a result of a way or another. mental health issue, to determine whether adequate I am probably not going to be able to do justice to forms of inquest and inquiry exist, and whether adequate every contribution in the debate, not least those that I lessons are being learned from the experiences? In view have not yet heard, but I assure hon. Members that of what is going on in one or two inquests at the I will continue to listen throughout the remainder of the moment, I feel that there are some quite serious deficiencies debate, and that if any issues arise that I have not in that area. covered in this speech, I will write to the Members Paul Burstow: I thank the hon. Gentleman for his concerned to address those points. question. May I undertake to write to him about that The hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon) matter in more detail? It has come up in our work on made some important points about the support for our our suicide prevention strategy in relation to the nature veterans, and for our armed forces more generally. This of suicide verdicts, and narrative verdicts in particular, Government have done a lot in that regard—not least in coroners’ courts. I would be happy to come back to the commissioning by the Prime Minister of my hon. him on that issue. Friend the Member for South West Wiltshire (Dr Murrison) In the past year, we have made progress across a to produce his report, “Fighting Fit: a mental health broad front. We have committed £400 million to make plan for servicemen and veterans”. The report deals with psychological therapies available for adults of all ages, many of these issues, and the Government take them, as well as for people with long-term health conditions and the action that they require, very seriously. and with severe and enduring mental illness. When it comes to our focus on recovery, the latest figures show Mr Kevan Jones: I congratulate the hon. Member for that 44.4% of those who complete programmes recover South West Wiltshire (Dr Murrison) on the report, but and that more achieve lasting improvement. That puts would the Minister acknowledge that it built on a lot of us on track to achieve our target rate of recovery of the work done by the previous Government, which I over 50%. was responsible for? Given that we know that the first signs of more than half of all lifelong mental illnesses can be detected in Paul Burstow: I hope that there will be cross-party adolescence, we have to go further. That is why the consensus on these issues today, and I shall take the Government are breaking new ground by investing in a hon. Gentleman’s question in that spirit. He makes a new training-led approach to re-equip children and fair point. This is about building on what is working, young people’s mental health services to offer a range of and ensuring that it can work even better. The work psychological therapies. I pay tribute to the leadership done by my hon. Friend the Member for South West shown by YoungMinds. Without its support, we would Wiltshire has certainly accelerated the pace. not have come as far in this area as fast as we have. When the Deputy Prime Minister and I launched the I want to say something about the necessity of achieving mental health strategy last year, we recognised the need the best possible outcomes for people in mental health to tackle the root causes of mental illness as well as crisis. Secondary mental health services across the country ensuring that community and acute services provide have made significant changes, both in community and timely treatment and care. We placed a strong emphasis hospital settings, including the provision of alternatives on recovery from a human, rather than just a medical, to psychiatric hospital admission. For example, more perspective. We also made it clear that delivering significant than 10,000 people with an early diagnosis of psychosis improvements in people’s health and well-being requires were engaged with early intervention services last year. parity of esteem between physical and mental health. That is the highest figure ever recorded. The improvements I know that some hon. Members are concerned that in community-based early intervention services are driving not enough emphasis has been placed on acute and up standards of care, as well as reducing the demand for in-patient care. Let me be clear. Our plans to provide a hospital admissions. I freely acknowledge that there is safe, modern, effective mental health service give equal more to do and I take on board the point that my hon. emphasis to the full range of services, from public mental Friend the Member for Broxbourne made about the health and prevention through to forensic mental health need to look at the variability in the accessibility of services. This is about people receiving high quality, mental health advocacy. appropriate care when they need it. If services can intervene The development of recovery-focused services is a early—the case for that has already been powerfully critical part of the Government’s strategy. That work is made—so that mental health problems can be managed being led by the NHS Confederation’s mental health in the community before more serious problems develop, network and the Centre for Mental Health. They are that should result in acute in-patient care being made supporting pilot sites that cover almost half of England available more quickly for those who need it. and are making the kind of changes that service users My hon. Friend the Member for Loughborough have sought for years. The programme has identified mentioned the concerns raised by the Association of 10 key changes to the way in which staff work, the types Chief Police Officers about places of safety. In partnership of services that are provided and the culture of organisations with the Home Office and the police, we are examining to embed recovery principles into routine practice. 527 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 528

[Paul Burstow] Mr Matthew Offord (Hendon) (Con): The Minister says that the Government wish to reduce the stigma When I visited the South West London recovery surrounding mental illness, and I accept that. Does he college, I heard powerful personal testimonies from agree that the decision of the Department of Health in people who were living purposeful and fulfilling lives, 1994 to hold an independent inquiry into every death and who were living with their illness rather than having involving someone who has suffered mental illness or to be cured of symptoms or illnesses. It is important been part of the mental health system continues to that recovery is not just seen in medical terms, but is perpetuate that stigma? self-defined. Students at the college learn not only how to manage their condition, but skills to help them back Paul Burstow: That is an important and challenging to work and to form new relationships. Some become point, and I will want to go away and think about what lecturers at the college themselves. I was told that being we do. For patient safety, we still need to learn lessons called a student, rather than a patient, helped people when things go wrong in our system, acknowledge take control of their recovery, gave them more confidence when things have not been done properly and put and, crucially, made them feel normal, as opposed to them right. In that sense, confidential inquiries are an being treated as a helpless, passive recipient of care. important part of the learning mechanism. One point Part of a good recovery is the ability to exercise more of frustration that I hear in debates in the House and control over one’s life. In health care, that means that see in correspondence from hon. Members is the sense there must be more shared decision making and choice. that lessons are not learned. As part of our reforms, In opening the debate, my hon. Friend the Member for with the NHS Commissioning Board taking on Loughborough mentioned the principle of “no decision responsibility for patient safety, we need to ensure that about me without me”. Undoubtedly, the any qualified that is not the case in future. provider policy and tariff reform have a part to play in We are investing £16 million in “Time to Change”, that. and we were delighted when Comic Relief decided to put in an additional £4 million, one of the biggest Adam Afriyie (Windsor) (Con): Many of us recognise grants that it has ever made. that many people who come to our constituency surgeries, perhaps with a housing benefit inquiry or other benefit I wish to make another point that touches on the inquiry, are actually struggling with mental health contributions of my hon. Friend the Member for challenges. It seems to me that the lack of control that Broxbourne and the hon. Member for North Durham. results from the way in which Government services are One in five people still think that anyone who has a designed can be a great contributing factor to stress history of mental health problems should not be allowed and, therefore, to depression. The Minister is speaking to hold public office. How many former Presidents, about control. Can the design of public services, such as Prime Ministers or Ministers would have been excluded housing benefit and other benefits, be taken into account if that view had been applied? [HON.MEMBERS: “Churchill.”] as a way of relieving the stress on a great number of our Precisely. Such a law is as outdated as asylums and as constituents? outdated as many of the attitudes that sit behind it. It has to be consigned to the history books just like Paul Burstow: That intervention rather helpfully moves asylums have been, and under the coalition Government’s me on to the point that has been made by several hon. watch, it will be. I congratulate the hon. Member for Members about Atos. Although it is not my ministerial Croydon Central (Gavin Barwell) on securing a slot for responsibility, a number of important points have been a private Member’s Bill on the subject. made about how it operates in particular cases. I will Looking ahead, although we have made progress ensure that those points are taken into account by my there are still big challenges to tackle. Reference has ministerial colleagues at the Department for Work and been made to the implementation framework that will Pensions. I will gladly pass them on. be published to support the roll-out of the “No health without mental health” strategy. That framework has Stephen Timms (East Ham) (Lab): The Minister will been produced in conjunction with five national know that mental health charities have proposed changes mental health organisations—Rethink Mental Illness, to the mental health descriptors in the work capability the NHS Confederation, the Centre for Mental Health, assessment for employment and support allowance. There Turning Point and Mind—and many others have been seems to be some delay in implementing those. Will he involved. pick that up in his discussions with his colleagues? We have previously had a very good debate about Paul Burstow: I will certainly act as the messenger “Listening to Experience”, Mind’s excellent report on and pass that point on, as the right hon. Gentleman has acute and crisis care, and Mind’s policy team have been requested. directly involved in ensuring that the framework delivers Stigma has been referred to in this debate. It is on those issues. It will provide a route map for every undoubtedly one of the biggest barriers to access to organisation with contributions to make to improve the mental health services in this country. The Government nation’s mental health. It will spell out how progress are determined to reduce the prejudice and discrimination will be made, measured and reported. that surround mental health, but we recognise that we What does success look like? To me, it means more cannot do that on our own. That is why Mind and people having access to evidence-based psychological Rethink Mental Illness have developed a major anti-stigma therapists; services intervening earlier, particularly for programme called “Time to Change”. That campaign is children and young people; services focusing on recovery working and is delivering significant behavioural change and people’s needs and aspirations above all; and service across society.That is why the Government are contributing users and carers being at the heart of all aspects of the substantial amount of £16 million up to April 2015. planning and service delivery. 529 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 530

Today, economists tell us that mental ill health in this provision, but of worklessness, benefits, the criminal country costs £105 billion a year, and that is just in justice system and addiction—still exist on the fringes England. If we succeed and put in place the right of our national debate, getting so little airtime and combination of public health, anti-stigma policies, accessible attention. As other hon. Members have acknowledged, psychological therapies and excellent community and the House, sadly, rarely applies itself to mental health. acute services, we can dramatically reduce that figure. Perhaps that reflects our national stiff-upper-lip tendency Put another way, if we can deliver the right evidence-based not to talk openly about mental health, which in turn treatment to children and young people so that their might help to explain why our public services are designed conditions do not persist into adulthood, we can prevent for the 20th century rather than the 21st. as many as two in five of all adult mental health disorders. As a society, we have made huge progress in John Pugh: The right hon. Gentleman seems to be how we recognise people’s mental illness, but despite forgetting that we had appreciable mental health legislation that we have not fully accepted that mental health is in the last Parliament—the Mental Health Act 2007. equal to physical health and that parity of esteem is needed between the problems of the body and the : I am proud of the improvements we problems of the mind. That is the challenge— made in the last Parliament, but I did not come here today to say that everything the previous Government Dr Julian Lewis (New Forest East) (Con): Will the did was right and wonderful. I will talk a little about Minister give way? those improvements, but given my failure to sing Labour achievements, I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for Paul Burstow: I will. doing so. Dr Lewis: I have waited many years to intervene on a We are reticent to talk about mental health as much Minister in his final sentence, and I have achieved that as we should. There is a complacency in the public today. debate—that is not to make a political point, because it Does the Minister accept, having made a convincing involves hon. Members on both sides of the House. The case for people being able to live with their illnesses by complacency goes throughout the civil service and the being at home, that part of the reassurance that they Government. To reflect on my time in government—not need to do that is to know that in periods of acute crisis, just in the Department of Health, but in the Treasury there will be a bed available for them should it be and the Home Office—it is remarkable how few submissions needed? That should be not only for detained patients or meetings I had relating to mental health, given that it but for voluntary patients. underlies the spending of hundreds of millions of pounds of public money. Indeed, £105 billion is the estimated Paul Burstow: One thing I did not say—I was trying cost of the full burden of mental health to this country. to cut down my remarks—was that there is an essential That complacency is not shared by everybody and I need to give more people the ability to control their congratulate the hon. Lady on introducing this debate. health care through crisis plans. Crisis plans are an We have heard two unbelievably powerful speeches, opportunity for people to make a statement in advance from my hon. Friend the Member for North Durham on how they wish to be treated in the event of a mental (Mr Jones) and the hon. Member for Broxbourne health episode that requires an intervention from mental (Mr Walker), to which I will turn at the end of my health services. We know that when the plans are in place, remarks. My hon. Friend the Member for Hackney they make a huge difference to the need for admission, North and Stoke Newington (Ms Abbott), who leads and that they can reduce the length of stay. We need to on these matters for the shadow health team, has rightly ensure that there is a sufficiency of beds so that people pointed out how mental health lies under the whole can get appropriate treatment, but we also need to public health challenge. We will soon introduce Labour’s ensure that there is much more focus on good, community- public health review. based intervention at an early stage. Getting that balance We are beginning to wake up from our complacency. right is always difficult for health commissioners to I am leading the debate for the Opposition to show that achieve—I know my hon. Friend is struggling with that that comes from the top. We see the mental health in his patch at the moment. challenge as central to health policy. Indeed, I made a Those are the challenges the NHS faces. They are point of making my first speech on returning as shadow challenges not just for our health commissioners and Health Secretary on the subject of rethinking mental providers but, as this debate has clearly demonstrated, health in the 21st century at the Centre for Social Justice. for our whole society. We can transform mental health I must be honest: I shared the complacency about the in this country only if we transform our attitudes. This mental health debate, or perhaps did not give it enough debate plays an important part in that. attention, but two things changed that when I was a Health Minister. First, I spent a day work-shadowing 3pm an assertive outreach team in Easington. I will never Andy Burnham (Leigh) (Lab): I begin by giving my forget what one of the team told me about the early apologies to the hon. Member for Loughborough (Nicky ’90s, when the mines closed and GP referrals for support Morgan) for missing the beginning of her speech, and were piling up on clinic desks, but there simply was no by congratulating the Minister on his excellent and support to offer people. She said that that lay behind thoughtful speech, to which I can hopefully add something. the social collapse in those mining communities. People I have high hopes for the debate. I hope it will help us facing difficult times were given no help. to confront a major paradox: how can a subject that is A second thing made me think differently. When I so central to the big public policy challenges we face as became Health Secretary in June 2009, I inherited Lord a country—the challenges are not just of public health Bradley’s report into mental health problems and learning 531 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 532

[Andy Burnham] completely—explained by the separateness within our system. If someone is labelled a mental health patient, disabilities in the criminal justice system. I will never they are treated in the mental health system, and forget sitting in my office at Richmond house reading consequently their physical health needs are neglected. that about 70% of young people in the criminal justice system have an undiagnosed or untreated mental health Andrea Leadsom (South Northamptonshire) (Con): problem. If that is not truly shocking to every Member Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that, right from the and does not make us do something, frankly nothing very start, the way in which a baby’s brain develops— will. That was the moment that changed how I thought, whether development is healthy, through a loving bond, and I have tried to follow it through ever since. or not—can have profound implications for future physical I mentioned that we had a public service designed for health, and therefore life expectancy? It starts as early the 20th century, rather than the 21st century, and I as that. want to illustrate that point with reference to my own constituency. The world that gave birth to the NHS was Andy Burnham: I completely agree, and obviously a very different place. When the NHS was set up, Leigh, that was one of the major conclusions of the Field like Easington, was a physically dangerous place to live report, which the hon. Lady’s Government commissioned. and work in. Working underground exposed people to The problem is not just the separateness of the system, coal dust, explosions and accidents, and people had no although that is one of the factors; rather, it starts much choice but to lock arms, look out for each other and earlier. We need to take that broad view. face the dangers together—that is how it was—and that spirit of solidarity was carried over into the streets above. More co-location of acute care and mental health care within the same hospital would be a good thing to Like many places in this country, then, Leigh in the encourage. We heard on the radio this morning about ’50s was a physically dangerous place but emotionally the RAID—rapid assessment interface and discharge— secure, because people pulled together. In the 21st century, service in , which is an excellent example of however, that has completely reversed. We now live in a that and something we need to follow. That is part of physically safe society—our work does not generally the culture change we need in the NHS. The other part expose us to dangers—but it is emotionally far less secure of that change is that practitioners dealing with mental than it was for most of the last century. The 21st century health, particularly GPs, at the primary care level, should has changed the modern condition. We are all living not just reach first for medical interventions, rather longer, more stressful and isolated lives, and have to than social or psychological interventions. However, I learn to cope with huge and constant change. Twentieth- am afraid that that is what we do. Let us look at these, century living demands levels of emotional and mental more startling statistics. In 2009, the NHS issued 39.1 million resilience that our parents and grandparents never needed, prescriptions for anti-depressants—there was a big jump yet the NHS does not reflect that new reality; essentially, during the financial crisis, towards the end of the last it remains a post-war production-line model focused on decade. That figure represented a 95% increase on the episodic physical care—the stroke, the hip replacement, decade, from the 20.2 million prescriptions issued in the cataract—rather than the whole person. That is the 1998. Were all of those 40 million prescriptions necessary? issue to confront. Of course they were not. The demands of this society and the ageing society require a change in how we provide health and social Prompted by my north-west colleague, the hon. Member care. We need a whole-person approach that combines for Southport (John Pugh), let me pick up the point not only the physical but the mental and social, if we about Labour’s successes. We did address some of these are to give people the quality of life that we desire for issues. The improving access to psychological therapies our own families. That one in four people will experience programme is something I am very proud of taking a serious mental health problem makes this an issue for forward as Secretary of State, because it began to give all families and people in the country. It also means that GPs an alternative to anti-depressants and medication mental health must move from the margins to the centre to refer people towards. That was an important of the NHS. development, and—credit where it is due—it was Lord I shall say a couple of things about that necessary Richard Layard who made such an incredible change, culture change. How can it be that an issue that causes by pushing so determinedly for that programme. so much suffering and costs our society so much still accounts for only a fraction of the NHS budget? It Jeremy Corbyn: My right hon. Friend is making an cannot be right. We also have to consider the separateness important point. Too often GPs reach for medicine of mental health within the NHS. This has deep social when they should be reaching for counselling. They roots—the asylum, the separate place where people with should be offering a more supportive environment, but mental health problems were treated, the accompanying when we get high-speed GPs with little time to talk to stigma and suspicion about what went on behind those patients, they tend to prescribe medicines when they four walls. Essentially, we still have the same system in ought to be doing something else. Does my right hon. the NHS, with separate organisations—mental health Friend agree that we need to go a lot further than we trusts—providing services on separate premises. That already have? maintains the sense of a divide between the two systems and raises a huge health inequalities issue. Andy Burnham: I completely agree. I do a lot of work The wonderful briefing that Mind, Rethink and others shadowing, and I recently shadowed a GP.What amazed have prepared for this debate contains this startling me was how many of the people coming through his statistic: on average, people with severe mental health door were the people who also come through our doors problems die 20 years earlier than those without. What on a Friday and Saturday. They are not necessarily an unbelievable statistic! Why is that? It is partly—not looking for something to take to the chemists; they are 533 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 534 actually just crying out for help, in one way or another, Andy Burnham: I welcome what the Minister has said, with a problem they are struggling with. That GP was but I say clearly to him that we are going to be vigilant very good and did not prescribe, but referred lots of about this. We do not want to see things slipping people to the IAPT service, as I sat there with him. backwards, as we fear they may well do under this NHS However, he said that across Coventry, where he was reorganisation. based, many others were not doing the same. The hon. Member for Strangford made an important point about service personnel. I would like to pay Chris Ruane (Vale of Clwyd) (Lab): The Minister tribute to the organisation Combat Stress, which has mentioned the number of prescriptions that have been done a wonderful job—voluntarily, I think, for many issued. I received a parliamentary answer a couple of years—giving some help and hope to people who come days ago which said that in 1991 there were 9 million back here only to find that the statutory services are not prescriptions. The Minister mentioned the figure of providing anything for them. We have to absorb what it 42 million, but from 2010 to 2011 the number went up has done and the changes it has made into the mainstream by 4 million. In the years before that the increase was to provide much better support. It is beginning to usually 2 million a year, but in one year the figure happen, but there is further to go. increased by 10%, or 4 million. When I asked the Minister what his assessment was of the reason for those increases, On benefits appeals, I echo a point made by my hon. there was no conclusive answer. We must get to the Friend the Member for North Durham. As he said, the bottom of why these prescriptions are being issued and number of employment and support allowance cases why they have gone up by 500% in a 20-year period. going to appeal is ridiculous. In 2009-10, the first full year of the ESA regime, 70,535 cases went to appeal at a Andy Burnham: We must. Perhaps I am about to cost of £19.8 million. In 2010-11, there were 176,567 cases make more of a political point, but as has been mentioned at a cost of £42.2 million. If the Government want to so eloquently today by my hon. Friend the Member for cut waste from the benefit system, they have to get a North Durham, as well as the hon. Member for Strangford grip on that. What we find is that 38% of cases—almost (Jim Shannon), although the trend is upwards—that is four in 10—are overturned on appeal; those cases should happening come what may: I mentioned the financial not have to go to appeal. My hon. Friend also mentioned crisis, during which the rate has jumped up, including in the human cost. The financial cost is bad enough, but our time in government—the cumulative effect of some the stress that people with mental health problems are of the benefits changes on some of the most vulnerable put through as they go through that process is, in many members of society, coupled with the withdrawal of cases, unbearable. The Minister really needs to talk to social care support by councils, means that, right now, his Department for Work and Pensions colleagues to some people out there are suffering very badly indeed. encourage them to get a grip on this important problem. That is part of the explanation of the worrying figures The Atos system is simply not working; it is actually that my hon. Friend has just given the House. The making life a lot harder for some of the most vulnerable Government need to have a look at what is happening people in our society. Ministers need to look urgently out there and whether or not some people are struggling at it. with mental health problems because of the extra stress Let me conclude with a point about stigma. I have that other factors, particularly financial, are putting picked up from today’s debate the fact that the hon. upon them. Member for Croydon Central (Gavin Barwell) is bringing I welcome the Minister’s commitment to the improving forward a private Member’s Bill along the lines of the access to psychological therapies programme, but I hear Bill introduced in the other place by Lord Stevenson, to that waiting times for it are increasing in parts of the whom this House should pay tribute. It is wonderful to country where GPs face much longer referral times. hear that the hon. Gentleman will introduce that private Indeed, a Mind survey of 2011 said that 30% of GPs Member’s Bill. Currently, a person who has had a were unaware of services to which they could refer serious breakdown and has been sectioned under the patients, beyond medication. That tells us that we still Mental Health Act 1983 is barred from being an MP, a have quite a long way to go. IAPT needs protecting and juror, a school governor or a company director. What nurturing; it needs to come with a national direction message does that send out? It says that recovery is not in the operating framework. In the new and changing possible—a message that we might have put out about NHS world, we cannot allow it to be simply whittled cancer in the ’50s or ’60s: “Once you have had it, it is a away. More broadly, we need to look carefully at black mark; that’s it, you’re finished.” We urgently need commissioning and find out whether GPs have the right to change that. Today’s debate has probably achieved skills to commission properly for mental health. We need some change. The Minister indicated his full support to consider what the precise commissioning arrangements for the private Member’s Bill and I can pledge the full for mental health are, as there is still some confusion support of the Opposition for it. We wish the hon. out there about them. Gentleman all good luck with it. I think that today’s debate can begin to change social Paul Burstow: One of the key aspects of the NHS attitudes in the broader debate on mental health in this Commissioning Board’s work in authorising clinical country. For the reasons I have set out, I think our commissioning groups will be to assess their capacity to debate has been historic, but we have a long way to go. commission in mental health. As I am sure the right When the Norwegian Prime Minister, Kjell Magne hon. Gentleman knows, the Royal College of General Bondevik had to take some time off, he publicly admitted Practitioners is currently exploring what the extra year that it was for depression. That was the reason he gave. of education and training will involve, as we move Imagine a Prime Minister doing that! But he did so, and forward to ensuring that mental health is part of it. I he changed the culture in . Moreover, he went think it is a very important innovation. on to be re-elected and to become Norway’s longest-serving 535 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 536

[Andy Burnham] In the 18th century, it was possible to cross the river to Bedlam and gawp at people gesticulating, ranting, non-Labour Prime Minister since the second world war. performing odd rituals, talking to no one in particular, That constituted incredible bravery and political leadership, exhibiting delusory beliefs in their own power, or expressing and I think that we have seen two more examples of paranoid fears about their foes. The nearest 21st-century those qualities today in the speeches of my hon. Friend equivalent is probably Prime Minister’s Question Time. the Member for North Durham and the hon. Member [Laughter.] That is not an entirely facetious point. The for Broxbourne. That is the kind of leadership that dividing line between robust mental health and mental changes social attitudes to mental health. Both Members illness is, in fact, a fine one. Statistics show that the bulk deserve enormous credit for what they have said today, of people of working age who either report or are and I think that both have taken a major step towards diagnosed with mental health problems are not, in changing the political debate. general, those who suffer from the terrible scourge of I believe that we must all go back to first principles. schizophrenia. The hallucinations and delusions often I mentioned the start of the NHS. In 1948, the World associated with that disease currently affect less than Health Organisation defined health as 1% of the population, and are treated more benignly “a state of complete physical, mental and social well-being and and more effectively than ever before. Moreover, numbers not merely the absence of disease or infirmity.” are not substantially on the increase. Whatever differences we may have about precisely how Most mental health problems occur when the anxieties, we should construct the NHS, I think that today Members the fears, the stresses and the dark moods to which we in all parts of the House can unite behind that definition, are all prone become insupportable, prolonged and with the emphasis on prevention and well-being. I think disabling, and the individual is no longer able to cope in that we can all commit ourselves to making major any ordinary sense but breaks down and loses control, changes in the way in which mental health is seen in the social capacity and, sometimes, insight into his or her House of Commons, the Government and the country, condition. That is on the increase: it is the major mental and begin to create a system of care for the 21st century health challenge that we face. that recognises the difficult, stressful lives that people Mental health is a genuine continuum. The mentally are leading and gives them support when they need it so ill do not have viruses, germs, cellular patterns or physical that they can fulfil their potential. impairments that the well do not have. They have the same gamut of emotions that we all have—often exaggerated, Several hon. Members rose— accentuated or uncontrollable, but in no way unique or uncommon. We all possess a shared vulnerability to Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Lindsay Hoyle): Order. Given mental health issues which could be described as a that 19 Members wish to catch the eye of the Chair, it tendency to neurosis, managed with differing degrees of would be beneficial if each of them could aim to speak success at different times in our lives. That is why I took for about eight minutes. I hope that that will make it issue with some of the comments made by the hon. possible for everyone to contribute. Member for Loughborough. There is a nugget of truth in the American belief that 3.21 pm we could all benefit from an element of psychiatry. As I have said, we share a common vulnerability, and for a John Pugh (Southport) (LD): Let me begin by variety of reasons—fairly complex in many cases—one commending those who have spoken about their own in four, or one in six, citizens falls victim to that vulnerability. problems today. I assure them that they have done their We have learnt not to be too judgmental about those prospects no harm whatsoever. They have risen appreciably who do, and not to stigmatise them. We recognise that in the esteem of the House, although whether that is the the vulnerability they display is often a product of key to promotion I do not know. circumstance, and that it is as frequently related to desirable traits—empathy and sensitivity, for instance—as Mr Kevan Jones: I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman, to undesirable ones such as self-obsession or lack of but the use of language is very important when it comes self-control. However, although that recognition is now to mental health. I do not consider it to be a problem. widespread, it does not eradicate stigma, nor does calling My own experience has made me stronger. I think we everybody “service users” as if they are some kind of should be careful about how we use language: we should consumer, and nor does saying mental illness is just the not describe mental health as a problem, because it is same as physical illness, because it is not. not. The big problem for those with a record of mental John Pugh: I think that the expression used nowadays health issues—particularly, perhaps, in respect of the is “issue”. workplace or getting off benefits and back into the workplace—is the bias of the wider world in favour of those who have not illustrated our common vulnerability. Sir Peter Bottomley: The hon. Gentleman and I would That bias is rather like having a—rational—preference probably agree that it is an experience. for people with a stronger immune system. There are other vitiating factors at play, of course. People who John Pugh: We will settle for “experience”, then. suffer from mental illness often suffer from a lack of I congratulate the hon. Member for Loughborough confidence, for example. There is also the fact, which (Nicky Morgan) on introducing the debate, although has not so far been acknowledged, that a mental health she omitted to mention the Mental Health Act 2007, diagnosis can sometimes be misused for employment over which the House laboured long and hard to, I hope, and benefit reasons. The big problem is this bias and some good effect. discrimination, however. 537 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 538

There are only two real remedies for that. One is from this ourselves in our own lives and in our own better public education about what mental health actually families, know people who have. Public attitudes have is and what mental illness and frailty actually are. I come a long way since the late Tom Eagleton was driven would put more faith in the second remedy, however: out of the US vice-presidential nomination in 1972 having a public mental health campaign that is geared because he had had treatment for severe depression. He, in positive directions, as described by the hon. Member to his credit, later went on to become a Senator, elected for Loughborough. Having said that, we must acknowledge with 60% of the vote, so the timidity of the political that the active pursuit of mental well-being is a bigger establishment in the US in 1972 was overturned by a and more significant task than we currently recognise. much more generous political atmosphere some years Corporate Britain, business Britain and every public later. We should remember people like him, who, in service in Britain needs to be seriously engaged with the many respects, paved the way for it. Layard agenda and to accept that we need to promote We have to understand that about 4,000 people a year well-being at work—including here in Parliament. We in this country commit suicide. The figure varies a bit must create a wholesome workplace, and therefore bother from year to year, but it is about 4,000. That is a very about the happiness of the workplace and the individuals large figure indeed, which is why I intervened on the in it. Minister on the question of deaths when people are in We may need to tackle a huge fallacy, however: the care or in custody, and I am looking forward to his idea that we either have mental health or we do not, so response. As a society, we have to think a bit more we are either employable or we are not. That ignores the carefully about the terror that some people live their fact that many people in employment—in senior jobs, lives in, which ends in a lonely suicide. These are people even—have mental health issues, some of which might who were unable to seek help or support from anybody not always be diagnosed. Sometimes they work them else, and were probably reading in the papers, hearing out in the office and the workplace in a wholly unsatisfactory jokes on television and being the butt of comedians’ way, and sometimes to the detriment of their colleagues— jokes about “sad nutters”, “desperate people” and so although not always, in certain professions, to the detriment on. As a society and as a community, we need to reach of customers and profits. Sometimes people mask their out to people who are going through their own tensions symptoms and problems through alcoholic self-medication. and their own crises. If we cannot do that, the number There was a time when employers would have walked of suicides will not fall and is likely to increase. away from considering issues such as personal safety at In my community, we have a good mental health work, and there was a time when they would have service. We have a trust that operates in Camden and walked away from issues of employment legislation and Islington, which is quite a small geographical area for it the rights of people at work. Nowadays, however, most to operate across. It is certainly much smaller than employers are keen to stick “Investors in People” logos many others in other parts of the country, and my right on their notepaper to show that they are a good employer hon. Friend the Member for Holborn and St Pancras in that respect. The next, and most obvious, stage is the (Frank Dobson) and I fought very hard to ensure that it pursuit of the wholesome workplace, in a move beyond was operated on a relatively small basis because we felt the “Investors in People”initiative. That must be encouraged that that would provide for a better service that was by public health bodies and by large public and corporate more in touch with the local community. I hope that it organisations. Indeed, to some extent it already is will be able to continue in that way, but I am saddened encouraged: 41% of large companies now have a mental to have to report that this year the trust plans to deliver health policy. That represents appreciable progress. what it describes as For most of us, work is where we spend most of our “£75.1m savings across the acute sector; £46.7m from acute time, and it is where our feelings of self-worth are either productivity and £28.4m through changes in care setting and confirmed or demolished—that is certainly true of this other demand management initiatives.” place. It is where people find meaning to their lives— That is quite a big cut in desperately needed services in although we do not always succeed in doing that here. an area that suffers from a very high level of need for Indeed, we in Parliament cannot honestly say our working mental health care and treatment. environment is wholly conducive to good mental health. My own local Islington borough council, to its credit, Let me conclude by reiterating my key point: we instituted the fairness commission after the 2010 elections. cannot help people with mental health issues without The council has said: making it manifestly clear that in everyday work and everyday life mental health is everybody’s issue. “The work of the Islington Fairness Commission highlighted the wide-ranging impacts of challenges to mental health and 3.29 pm wellbeing for people, communities and services in Islington, particularly during a period of economic uncertainty and financial hardship.” Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Lab): I welcome A number of recommendations are then made, with the this debate, and I will do my best to stick to the eight council going on to state: minutes that you have suggested, Mr Deputy Speaker, to ensure that everybody gets to make a contribution. It “Levels of need are exceptionally high in Islington. There were is valuable to have this debate and to raise the whole 3,152 patients on serious mental illness primary care registers in Islington in 2010/11, representing 1 in every 65 patients. There are issue of the stigma surrounding mental health. I pay a an estimated 31,000 adults and 3,000 children and young huge tribute to my hon. Friend the Member for North people…experiencing mental health problems…There are an estimated Durham (Mr Jones) and the hon. Member for Broxbourne 3,500…drug users, and 10,000 problem alcohol users, with 46,000 (Mr Walker) for speaking out, because it is necessary to adults in total drinking at hazardous or harmful levels. Underlying do so. The public need to understand that everyone rates of mental health and substance misuse problems in prison knows somebody who has suffered from degrees of reach in excess of 90%.” depression or many other conditions. I am sure that all My borough contains two prisons. We have to examine of us, even if we do not believe that we have suffered those issues seriously as a House and as a society. 539 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 540

[Jeremy Corbyn] financially burgeoned organisations rather than local charities and voluntary sector groups with a specific base, The other point I wanted to make was that the which are often much more effective and provide a very economic issues associated with stress are very serious good service. I would be grateful if the Minister could indeed. Obviously, one such issue is unemployment, but give us some good news on that, or if he could write to others are housing and overcrowding and, often, the me about how those issues could be brought out. domestic violence that results. My hon. Friend the Member In my community, we have a number of very effective for Hackney North and Stoke Newington (Ms Abbott) charities that work with victims of domestic violence and I share the Finsbury Park Homeless Families Project and racist abuse, which, fortunately, is not an enormous unit, which is based in her constituency but does wonderful issue but nevertheless exists. We also have a large number work to support families in both our constituencies. of people who have experienced torture and violence The unit’s staff point out that the severe problems of and are either asylum seekers or have achieved refugee the people who come to see them are usually related to status. I thank those charities for the work they do. serious overcrowding, housing uncertainty and lack of Nafsiyat, an intercultural therapy centre based in Finsbury secure tenancy. Various levels of stress and mental Park, has done good and groundbreaking work on health issues pertain to that. In solving these issues, we cultural values and dealing with stress and the victims must consider the economic factors. of violence. The Maya centre deals with women who We should also consider very seriously the levels of have suffered similar problems. We also have the Women’s stress and depression among young people. Growing up Therapy Centre, ICAP—Immigrant Counselling and as a young person in any community is not easy. They Psychotherapy—which gives enormous support to other are faced with enormous pressures from a consumerist people, and the local Refugee Therapy Centre. They all society to achieve and to have. Many cannot fulfil those do very good work, all have difficulty coping with the ideals and will never be able to fulfil those ambitions. demands placed on them and all have financial issues. The levels of stress we are forcing on to young people When the Government talk about increased money for result in some cases—although, thankfully, only a very mental health, they should think very carefully about small number—in serious illness or even suicide. how the contracts are negotiated, as they often force very low rates of pay on the voluntary sector to undertake Yvonne Fovargue (Makerfield) (Lab): To return to the the kind of work that is done. The Minister needs to social pressures, does my hon. Friend agree that debt is think quite carefully about that. a considerable social pressure? I ran a scheme where The housing issue has been referred to and the number debt advice was provided on prescription and paid for of homeless people in this country is rising, as is the by the PCT. Independent analysis reckoned that at least number who are suffering from stress. Locally, we have three suicides had been prevented by early access to a group called the Pilion Trust which has recently been debt advice. Does my hon. Friend share my concern given a donation—I am grateful to the Amy Winehouse that that access might well now be restricted? Foundation for that—to help in its work in providing a night shelter, but a night shelter is not a solution to Jeremy Corbyn: I completely endorse what my hon. homelessness problems. A solution to homelessness Friend has said and the great work she has done in problems is having a requirement regarding re-housing supporting advice agencies and dealing with such issues. and a much more aggressive housing programme in this My borough recently opened a new citizen’s advice country. bureau—I congratulate the council on being able to I conclude by saying that too many people commit fund and reopen it—and it has been inundated with suicide and suffer from mental health issues and stress people with serious debt issues. It offers serious debt in their lives. We cannot change all of that but we can advice and a great deal of help. We have also given a lot change the approach to mental health issues. We can of support to a credit union that is working very well look at the good work that is done and support people with a large and fast-growing membership. People are in that work. We can say to those who have gone accessing a limited amount of credit and support, and it through depression and crises, “That is not the end.” is far better that it comes from that source than from the Such people are contributing to our society and will high street loan sharks who are appearing all over the succeed later in life. We should recognise the value of country and bleeding people dry with the excessive rates everyone and not consign people to a mark that indicates of interest that they charge. they have become unemployable and have no future. There are some things we can do, but my point is that That is as bad as what the asylum system did in the past. if a young person worked hard in school, did well, We can do better than that and learn from others and studied hard and got good grades but is still unemployed the good experience they have had. and after a while becomes almost unemployable, it becomes a source of enormous stress about the future. 3.41 pm I want to bring up two more issues before I conclude. Gavin Barwell (Croydon Central) (Con): First, I thank In my part of London and, I suspect, many other parts the Backbench Business Committee for securing this of urban Britain, many victims of domestic violence, debate. In my limited experience in the House, the usually women, seek support and therapy. The voluntary Committee’s debates often show the Chamber at its sector is often best placed to provide that support and best. I also want to congratulate my hon. Friend the therapy and that was why I intervened on the hon. Member for Loughborough (Nicky Morgan), who is Member for Loughborough (Nicky Morgan) when she one of the stars of the 2010 intake on the Government introduced the debate to make the point that when side of the House. She is an example of the work that commissioning is done by the primary care trusts or the Lord Maples, who sadly passed away this week, had wider trusts that deal exclusively with mental health issues, done to diversify the make-up of Members on our it tends to be skewed in favour of the very large and Benches. That is about a lot more than tokenism. 541 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 542

As a number of Members have said, I came fourth in will be affected by depression than any other health the private Member’s Bill ballot. I found that out because condition. The law as it stands sends out the message my inbox was suddenly swamped by a large number of that if someone has a mental health condition their e-mails congratulating me, and my mobile phone and contribution to public life is not welcome. desk phone started ringing at the same time. For a Lord Stevenson’s Bill had four aims: first, to repeal Back-Bench Member it is a fairly rare opportunity to section 141 of the Mental Health Act 1983 under which change the law of this country. I have taken my time a Member of Parliament, of the Scottish Parliament, of and thought long and hard about what I wanted to the Welsh Assembly or of the Northern Ireland Assembly bring forward. On Wednesday, I will be presenting the automatically lost their seat if they were detained under Mental Health (Discrimination) Bill, which was introduced the Act for more than six months. There is no equivalent by Lord Stevenson of Coddenham in the last parliamentary provision to remove an MP if they suffer a physical Session, as the right hon. Member for Leigh (Andy illness that affects their ability to perform their role and, Burnham) has said. I am doing that partly for personal furthermore, someone who lacks mental capacity, as reasons. Two of my closest personal friends suffer from defined by the Mental Capacity Act 2005, can be detained mental health conditions, and two teachers who had for up to 12 months and not lose their seat. a very formative role in my education, when I was a teenager, have also suffered from mental health conditions. Secondly, the Bill would amend the Juries Act 1974 My predecessor, the former Member for Croydon Central, significantly to reduce and better define who is ineligible Andy Pelling, who some Members in the House will for jury service. At the moment, the Act says that have known, also suffered from a mental health condition. mentally disordered persons are ineligible. The definition of a mentally disordered person is extremely wide and In addition, since I have been a Member of the includes people who manage their mental health condition House, in my surgeries I have met a significant number through a prescription from their GP or counselling of constituents who are suffering, including people from a psychiatrist, thus eliminating all sorts of people whose children have been detained under the Mental who would make excellent jurors. Only 2% of people Health Act 1983. There is one gentleman I will never forget tick the box, but many more should probably do so. Not who came to my surgery suicidal because he had lost his only is the law discriminatory but it is ineffective. If job and was at risk of losing his home and the ability to someone is on trial, they have a right to be confident support his family. A couple of weeks ago I visited the that the jury is of sound mind. The Bill would better South London YMCA and met a man who had witnessed define who should be ineligible, thus making it much someone commit suicide and had gone to his GP for more likely that those people would identify themselves help but had not received proper help and had suffered in the process. a breakdown. His marriage had broken up, he had lost his job and he had ended up sleeping in the park. So my Thirdly, the Bill would amend the Companies (Model decision has been prompted by a mix of personal reasons Articles) Regulations 2008, so that someone no longer and what I have seen as a constituency MP. ceased to be a director of a public or private company The Bill is supported by the Royal College of purely because of their mental health. All companies Psychiatrists, Mind, Rethink Mental Illness and the are required by statute to have articles of association, Law Society. Its purpose is very simple: to remove the and model articles operate where a company has failed last significant form of discrimination in law in our to draw up its own. Many companies incorporate them society. This country has changed a huge amount since into their own articles. They include a provision that I was a young child. I remember the first Asian family someone ceases to be a director if a registered medical moving into our road when I was growing up. Some of practitioner who is treating them gives a written opinion the people who lived in our road put pressure on the to the company stating that they have become physically people selling their house not to sell to an Asian family. or mentally incapable of acting as a director and they I also remember the arguments about section 28 and the remain so for more than three months—in other words, language that was used in my school playground. We the correct test of capacity. However, they go on to have made a huge amount of progress since then as a include a totally unnecessary additional provision relating country, but we have not got there yet. To our shame, solely to mental health. however, the law still discriminates against those with a Finally, the Bill would amend school governance mental health condition. An MP or a company director regulations so that people detained under the Mental can be removed from their job as a result of a mental Health Acts would no longer be disqualified from holding health condition even if they go on to make a full office as school governors. Clearly, while someone is recovery. Many people who are perfectly capable of detained they are unable to attend governors’ meetings, performing jury service are disbarred from doing so. If but that may be for only a short time, and there is no my private Member’s Bill is approved by the House, we reason why they should not resume their role. will look back in a few years’ time and be amazed that I am delighted that the Government have dealt with the nonsense I have described was on the statute book one of those issues—the School Governance (England) in 2012. (Amendment) Regulations 2012 came into force on As my hon. Friend the Member for Loughborough 17 March, and rightly set the disqualification test as said, one in four of us will experience a mental health failure to attend six meetings in a period of six months condition in our lifetime; three in four of us will see a without consent from the governing body.The Government member of our immediate family experience such a made a public commitment, when they published their condition. As the right hon. Member for Leigh said, the mental health strategy, to change the legislation in numbers have increased because, while the physical relation to Members of Parliament. I hope that they conditions in which we live and work have improved, will support the rest of the Bill. In other place, Lord our lives are busier and much more stressful. The World Wallace of Saltaire said that the Government were Health Organisation estimates that by 2030 more people considering the detail of what was proposed on jury 543 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 544

[Gavin Barwell] or 59% of their children are mentally ill? The UK is not far behind. We follow the Anglo-American pattern, service, and he hoped that the Bill would be reintroduced because 22% of our children experience mental health in this Session. I hope that it receives all-party support, problems, and they are the lucky ones, because 74% of and I was delighted to hear what the right hon. Member children in care homes experience mental health problems, for Leigh had to say. as do 46% of those who are fostered. Some 90% of I want to end with two simple contentions. First, prisoners have mental health problems. Obesity is also a Parliament, schools, companies and the court system problem. At age five 10% of UK children are obese, but benefit from the involvement of people with experience by age 10 the figure is 20%. What is happening in that of mental health conditions. Indeed, our debate has five-year period to make those kids consume the sugars, been illuminated in particular by the contributions of fats and salts that will react with their bodies? Those my hon. Friend the Member for Broxbourne (Mr Walker) fats will react with the fats in their brain and their and by the hon. Member for North Durham (Mr Jones). myelin sheaths and neural pathways. It is an epidemic I do not know the hon. Gentleman very well, but I have that is growing out of control, and we will be picking up always pictured him—and I think he would regard it as the costs, including the financial costs and health costs a compliment—as a bit of a political bruiser. For someone for the individual and their families, for decades to come. with that reputation to have the courage to say what he I recently received an answer to a parliamentary question. said will change people’s opinion of him, and very It showed that in 1991 almost 9 million prescriptions for positively. The whole House has a high regard for what antidepressant drugs were dispensed in the UK, but by he has said, but I am sure that when we move on to 2011 the figure had increased to over 46.5 million, a other debates, normal hostilities will be resumed. 500% increase. When I asked the Minister for his assessment A school may have a pupil with a mental health of why that was so, he replied: condition; in a court case, the accused’s state of mind “We are unable to provide a conclusive account for the increase may be a key issue. How much better will that school be in the number of prescription items dispensed.”—[Official Report, if a governor has experience? How much better will that 30 April 2012; Vol. 543, c. 1286W.] court case be if there is a juror with the necessary We do not know what is making the kids obese and we experience? The Bill will directly help a relatively small do not know what is turning our population into legal number of people, but it also sends a clear message that addicts. Those statistics are just for antidepressants and discrimination is wrong: people have a right to be do not take into account the other drugs taken to help judged as individuals, not labelled or stereotyped. us sleep, keep us awake, keep us happy or manage our In September, the excellent Time to Change campaign, sex lives, although I never use them. There are other run by Mind and Rethink Mental Illness, surveyed ways, because drugs are just one way of handling it. 2,700 people with mental health conditions. Of those, One-to-one counselling is another way, but it is very 80% said that they had experienced discrimination, two expensive. There is a third way: self-help. One of the thirds were too scared to tell their employer, 62% were best ways of self-help is mindfulness. too scared to tell their friends and, worst of all, more Mindfulness has been around for 2,500 years. To give than a third were too scared to seek professional help. a definition, mindfulness means paying attention in a Having a mental health condition is nothing to be particular way; on purpose, in the present moment and ashamed of or to keep a secret. It is high time we non-judgmentally. In other words, it means someone dragged the law of this land into the 21st century. just focusing—not being chased by their past or worried by their future, but experiencing what they are experiencing 3.50 pm there in the moment. Chris Ruane (Vale of Clwyd) (Lab): Most of the Mindfulness has been taught very effectively in America contributions we have heard so far today have concentrated over a 30-year period and more recently in this country on mental ill health, but I also wish to address mental over a 10 to 12-year period. It involves an eight-week health and well-being, and not just for those who have course, two-and-a-half hours’ taught lessons a week experienced mental health problems, but for the whole and 45 minutes’ meditation at home for six days a week, population in general. and it is taught in groups of eight to 20, so the costs are Over £400 billion worth of illegal drugs are traded minimal and the benefits are unbelievable. It is out around the world ever year, which is the same amount there, but it has not been taken up—even when NICE that is spent on energy, or 8% of the world’s wealth. recommended it as a more effective means of treating When that is combined with the amount spent on repeat-episode depression. In 2004, it recommended the alcohol, cigarettes, legal drugs to help us over depression, programme as being better than pills, but it has not over-eating and the amount spent trying to fix all those been taken up. GPs and, dare I say it, Ministers do not problems, we are probably talking about 20% of the know about it. I have quizzed Irish and British Ministers, world’s wealth being spent on, essentially, escaping from and they do not know about it. reality. That is a modern reality that has many causes. We need to look at the debate in the round and consider Mr Kevan Jones: I am listening carefully to my hon. all the factors, including nutrition, advertising, the farming Friend, but my experience is that, although group therapy industry and work practices, because they all have an might work for certain individuals, for many it does not. impact on what certain Members have so eloquently One thing that my right hon. Friend the Member for described today. We should look not just at the pinnacle Leigh (Andy Burnham) did in the previous Government, of the problem, but what is behind it. and which has made a real difference, was to open up Statistics show that 29% of US school children have cognitive behaviour therapy treatments, as they have mental health problems. At what point will American been a substitute for drugs. So no one treatment is a society say, “Enough is enough”? Is it when 39%, 49% silver bullet for mental illness. 545 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 546

Chris Ruane: Absolutely. Cognitive behaviour therapy debate of which the previous speakers and the Backbench is fantastic, and mindfulness has now been tacked on to Business Committee should be proud. I missed out on a it to make it even more effective. The group therapy lunch the other day and went with my hon. Friends lasts only for eight weeks; after that the individual can the Members for Broxbourne (Mr Walker) and for handle it themselves. I have practised it for five years Loughborough (Nicky Morgan) and others to appear now, and I have been on the formal course. in front of the Committee. They were tough and they It was Descartes who said that the mind is separate were clear. We made our point that the subject needed a from the body and the body separate from the mind, debate, and the issue then was whether it should be in but in eastern philosophy and medicine that is not the Westminster Hall or in the Chamber. I think that if it case: body and mind are inter-related. Mindfulness can had been in Westminster Hall the impact would not be used to combat pain, stress, eating disorders, addiction, have been so great. anxiety and psoriasis, but it has been recommended in When I was first elected to the House of Commons, if the UK only for the treatment of repeat depression—and a Member of Parliament was thought to have gone it has not even been used for that. mad, the Speaker would refer them to two people In America they use it in the prison service, in the nominated by the Royal College of Surgeons. One of police, fire and emergency services, including on those my early interventions was to suggest that psychiatrists with witness trauma, in the health service for a range of might be rather more useful. If the Bill taken up by my medical conditions, to improve heart and cancer treatment hon. Friend the Member for Croydon Central (Gavin and, even, in Congress. Congressman Tim Ryan, its Barwell) gets through, perhaps that approach will be expert on the subject, has just written a book, “A thrown away in turn. Mindful Nation”, about how mindfulness can be used Again when I was first elected, The Times and The across the board. Daily Telegraph would report debates and pick up a good So there are other ways that we have not explored, point from everyone’s speech. If that happened after but they have been around for 2,500 years and proved to today’s debate, people’s understanding of the experiences be effective. There are experts in mindfulness, such as of the lack of mental health, and of more extreme, Jon Kabat-Zinn who pioneered it in America, and occasionally disabling mental illness would become greater, experts in positive psychology, such as Martin Seligman. deeper and wider. That would give comfort to the Freud believed that if a person was mentally ill the most hundreds of thousands of people who care for people they could achieve was wellness, not happiness, but who are experiencing the lack of mental health. Martin Seligman, who headed the American Psychological Association, turned that around 20 years ago and developed Andy Burnham: I apologise for interrupting the hon. positive psychology in America. Gentleman so early on, but he is making such an We have our own experts: Professor Richard Layard, important broader point about media coverage of mental a Labour Lord in the other place; and Felicia Huppert, health. Would he want to pay tribute to the Sunday the mother of a famous Liberal MP based in Cambridge, Express, which has led a campaign that was mentioned who has a theory that if we shift the whole wellbeing by the hon. Member for Loughborough (Nicky Morgan)? curve, including on the right-hand side those who are One would not necessarily expect a newspaper to run a mentally ill and on the left-hand side those who are mental health campaign, yet it has. That is precisely the positive, across and make the whole population happier, kind of media leadership that we need to see on this issue. the greatest impact will be on the unhappiest—on those with mental health problems. Sir Peter Bottomley: I join with the right hon. Gentleman There are also impacts on the polices that we develop in saying that. I was trying to say things that had not throughout society and on what makes people happy. been said already, and there has already been a tribute On the Office for National Statistics’ list of what makes to the Sunday Express. I would add that several journalists people in the UK happy, No. 1 is living next to a park or have been prepared to speak about their own medical having access to a swimming pool; No. 2 is having conditions that have challenged their ability to live or to access to cultural services such as libraries; No. 3 is work effectively. I am not saying that we should all have being physically healthy; No. 4 is having time to relax to spend our time saying what our physical or mental and enjoy oneself; No. 5 is living in a fair society; No. 6, experiences have been, but it does help if it is regarded the only one involving money, is having enough money as being as normal to talk about having had an episode to do what one wants; No. 7 is freedom; No. 8 is being of depression as of having had a basal carcinoma content with one’s situation; No. 9 is people looking removed or having recovered from a broken hip. after each other; and No. 10 is the smell of freshly I pay tribute to the hundreds of thousands of people ground coffee. who care for those experiencing the lack of mental Only one pertains to money, yet our whole society is health. I also pay tribute to the professionals, particularly geared to making money. Those are the values that we to Lisa Rodrigues, who is chief executive of the Sussex and Governments of both parties have adopted, but Partnership Trust. She has spoken of the services it now we need to develop policies that recognise the provides across East Sussex, West Sussex, Brighton and situation and the position of mental health in society. It Hove and Hampshire, and the 27,000 young people is the No. 1 issue affecting our society, and we need to with whom she and her colleagues come into contact look at it in the round. each year. They are not all experiencing real disability, but some will. 3.59 pm When I became Roads Minister, one of my ambitions Sir Peter Bottomley (Worthing West) (Con): It is a was to try to get the number of road deaths down below delight to congratulate the hon. Member for Vale of the suicide rate. Young people’s suicides number about Clwyd (Chris Ruane) on his speech. We are having a 900 each year. The total number of road deaths among 547 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 548

[Sir Peter Bottomley] someone, even if we are untrained. It suggests avoiding the “Why?”question, as that can be regarded as challenging. adults and young people is 1,800. The road deaths figure Instead, it suggests asking: has come down from 5,600 a year to 1,850. Would it not “When—‘When did you realise?’Where—‘Where did that happen?’ be good if we could do the same thing for self-destruction What—‘What else happened?’ How—‘How did that feel?’ In an and the penalties that that imposes—not only the shortened ideal world what would you like to happen next? Would you like life but the damage to those around the person who has me to come with you?” died? Standing beside people in that way can be a pretty My wife was a psychiatric social worker before she effective approach. became a Member of Parliament, a Health Minister, I want to give the House one or two examples from and then Secretary of State for Health, when she took the weekly newsletter from Lisa Rodrigues of the Sussex mental health issues very seriously. She worked with Partnership Trust. I try to send it on to two or three those at the Maudsley Institute of Psychiatry where, other people each week, to whom some of the points with one of her colleagues, Peter Wilson, she ran a might be relevant. One week she talked about cancer, support service for teachers. If we are to start being describing how, in the 1950s, Sir Richard Doll and concerned with young people, we need to make sure others had started to examine the causes of lung cancer, that those who are in contact with them—parents, and and to realise that asbestos could also have a serious teachers in primary and secondary schools—have an effect on breathing. She wrote: understanding of what is normally unhealthy, if I can “So why am I talking about cancer? It is because today put it that way. dementia is where cancer was all those years ago…Why Sussex? One young person in four experiences some kind of Because we have the highest percentage of old people in the mental health episode. We need to know how much of country living here. And why me? Because specialist mental that involves a relatively normal experience from which health services hold the key to unlocking the potential in primary care, acute hospitals, local authorities, the voluntary and nursing they will recover. We also need to identify the one in 10 home sector to provide better treatment and care to people with who will probably need help from someone with experience dementia, and support for their families.” or specialist qualifications, and the 2% or 3% for whom Lisa Rodrigues also recently attended a conference the experience will be disabling. on how to get the various groups to work together more YoungMindsis an association with which Peter Wilson effectively, which is vital for people and their families was associated—I think he might have created it. It has and carers. If only they could find a one-stop shop to a manifesto in which young people say that if they can refer them to a place where they could be embraced as a get help when they are young, many more of them person, a household or a family unit. She said that if we could be kept out of prison and psychiatric hospital, could get our mental health services working more and kept in work and leading the kind of life that effectively, our physical health services would have far contributes to society. less to cope with. That point has also been developed by I once met someone who had had experience of other hon. Members this afternoon. She also wrote in schizophrenia. There was a fine mental health project her newsletter: just outside my former constituency, and he told me “We have a dream. In our dream, our psychiatrists, nurses, that he was glad to have got to know about it. He social workers, psychologists, therapists, care staff, receptionists became a client of the project. Six months later, he and anyone else who comes into contact with the 100,000 people became a volunteer. A year later he wrote to tell me that we serve each year will have the best possible tools to do their it was the proudest moment of his life, as he was now a jobs. This will include a small, lightweight…portable device via taxpayer with a paid job. He was given the opportunity which they can access patient records” to take those steps forward, in an environment in which and the background of all the people they are in contact everyone knew what was happening and could share in with. Up to now, that has not been possible. it and give support when appropriate. Those opportunities Lisa Rodrigues talks every two or three weeks about matter. employees who have done something special. In one Had there been more time, I would have been tempted example, she talks about the staff who have worked on a to talk about a range of issues, giving a sentence or two clinical reception and their helpfulness to patients and to each, but I do not think that that will be possible. I other visitors. She goes on to mention a person whom I would say, however, to those who suffer at times, or have not met called Jackie Efford, a nurse in the health constantly, from depression, anxiety, obsessive compulsive team at Lewes prison, who disorder, phobias, bipolar disorder, schizophrenia or “works flexibly so that, when prisoners arrive late into the night, personality disorders—I could go on—that information she comes in to assess them and respond to any urgent physical or on most of those conditions is available on the websites mental needs. Imagine being a prisoner and what a difference it of the organisations that provide help. would make to have a meeting when you first arrived with a compassionate and effective nurse.” About 31 years ago, I was appointed to the council of Mind, formerly the National Association for Mental Lisa Rodrigues also talks about the child and adolescent Health. The reason for that was that the then Conservative mental health services. She says that the name is Government wanted to give the organisation their support, “no longer fit for purpose. The word adolescent has negative and its then general secretary was thought to be left-wing; connotations. And young people don’t respond positively to the I was there to provide balance. I am not sure how my term mental health.” Whips would regard that decision today. [Laughter.] We must find the right language, not for political correctness, The Mental Health Foundation does good work, and but to help people more effectively. I also pay tribute to the Samaritans for the help that It would be easy to say more on this issue. However, they give to people about whom they are concerned. I want to end by saying that if we have to wait another Their website contains information on how we can help year to develop these themes, Parliament will not be 549 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 550 doing its job properly. We should not have to rely on the unhygienic and often poorly managed private rented pleading and cajoling that we provided at the Backbench housing, which is sadly a fast-growing sector of tenure Business Committee. Debates on this matter ought to in the London borough of Newham. be built in, rather than bolted on. In my constituency, there is a high level of need for services that will enable the people of Newham to be 4.10 pm self-sufficient and lead independent, successful lives. Lyn Brown (West Ham) (Lab): It is a pleasure to My concern is that the process used to allocate the follow the thoughtful contribution of the hon. Member resources needed to support those services is fundamentally for Worthing West (Sir Peter Bottomley). I am very glad flawed. It is skewed in a way that significantly disadvantages to be in the Chamber to speak alongside those who have my community. made exceptional speeches today, including my hon. Since 2006, if not earlier, the population estimate for Friend the Member for North Durham (Mr Jones) and Newham has clearly been an underestimate by the Office the hon. Member for Broxbourne (Mr Walker) to name for National Statistics. The under-count was estimated just two. at about 60,000 people until, in November 2011, the I will highlight three things. The first is the key ONS went some way towards recognising the historic factors that are linked to mental well-being and the underestimate by provisionally estimating the population characteristics of my local borough of Newham. The at 272,000, an increase of 32,000. That significant increase second is what resources are available to my local health of 13% is, by the way, the largest change in any London authorities and mental health services. The third is the borough. However, the new figure still falls some need for those resources to be improved in the light of 30,000 short of the population estimate made by an what we know works in improving mental health. independently commissioned study. That is a shortfall The need for a robust strategy to promote well-being in excess of 10%. is illustrated by the correlation between the determinants The real population of the borough stands at roughly of mental ill health and some of the characteristics of 300,000. That is the figure that should drive resource the population of my borough. As my hon. Friend the allocation, because it relates to the real world and real Member for Vale of Clwyd (Chris Ruane), who is no need. However, the ONS mid-year estimates are used to longer in his place, attested so powerfully, one such determine how the national funding pot is allocated to determinant is age. The rates of mental illness vary local areas, even though they do not accurately reflect across age ranges, but it is a sad fact that younger the true population of my area. Given the level of need people are more likely than the elderly to experience in my constituency, to say that resources are not allocated mental ill health. A high proportion of mental health on a level playing field is an understatement. problems develop between the ages of 14 and 20. One in The effect of an inadequate allocation system is 10 children between the ages of five and 16 have a compounded by a reliance on historical spend to determine mental health problem, and such problems may well current needs. That means that my local primary care continue into adulthood. trust has consistently struggled to find resources to deal The borough of Newham has one of the youngest with persistent need. Figures in the House Library tell populations in the country. The number of young people me that expenditure per head on mental health in with mental health problems is therefore greater than Newham in 2010-11 was £208.93. That compares with elsewhere. Some 40% of the borough’s population is £447.21 in Westminster and £331.81 in Kensington and made up of people under the age of 25. As nearly 10% Chelsea. I wish to hammer home the point that the of people aged between five and 16 experience mental spend for Newham is based on the ONS population health problems, statistically we can expect 4,262 of the estimate, so the real spend per head is even lower. children and young people in Newham to experience The shadow health and wellbeing board for the London such problems. That clearly has an impact on the needs borough of Newham has discussed the matter at length of the population of Newham and on the type of service and agreed a robust strategy, with a clear focus on that it requires. It should be funded to cater for those needs. maintaining resilience within the community. It wants We all know that there are other important determinants to support people by ensuring that they possess the of the mental health of a community. One of those is skills and resources that will enable them to negotiate deprivation. Common mental disorders such as depression, successfully the challenges that they experience. anxiety and obsessive compulsive disorder are more Let us face it: we know from evidence what works. prevalent in deprived households. Again, Newham suffers The health and wellbeing board has indicated that it from high levels of deprivation. It is ranked the third wants to focus its activity on parenting skills and pre-school most deprived local authority in the country and 51.5% education to set up an early family environment that of its children live in poverty. The index of deprivation supports children’s emotional and behavioural development. ranks the borough fourth in the country for the proportion It wants to support lifelong learning, with health promotion of children aged between nought and 15 living in an in schools and continuing education, as schools are a income-deprived household. That is just one measure of really important resource, particularly for children facing deprivation, but I am sure hon. Members will agree that difficulties at home. it is a worrying one. The board also wants to find a way of improving In addition, the decline of owner-occupation and the working lives in the borough, as one in six people in the increase in the private rented sector changes the very nature work force are affected by mental health problems, and of local communities. Support networks that people a way of supporting a good and healthy lifestyle by rely on—their friends and family, and wider communities encouraging exercise and good diet. It wants to encourage such as their church and faith—are disintegrating as the learning of new skills and the taking-up of creative housing pressures force families to move home, leave pursuits—social participation that promotes mental well- their communities or remain in overcrowded, sometimes being across the piece. The board is also supporting 551 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 552

[Lyn Brown] Of the callers who were contacted, 74% were male and 26% female. Army veterans made a total of 2,248 calls. communities through environmental improvements. The second largest group of callers were family, friends Environmental predictors of poor mental health include and carers of the victims, who themselves were therefore neighbourhood noise, overcrowding, fear of crime, poor victims. Seventy-seven per cent. of callers called about housing and so on. Finding out what to do is frustrating, themselves. Perhaps tragically—I hope the Minister but it is also frustrating that resources are being rather makes a note of this—just 6% of callers were given the unfairly allocated. Newham is poorly served in that number and contact details by a health professional. regard. The call centre seems to be catching on. In March, it I thank the Backbench Business Committee for creating received 286 calls, but that doubled to 604 the following this opportunity to discuss an issue that is often invisible, January. The organisation is funded by the Government, and on which there is not enough focus and debate. and I plead with the Minister to keep the funding going. Poor mental health has an extraordinarily detrimental I am sure he will. impact on huge numbers of people in our communities. The average post-service delay is a staggering 13 years. We could and should be dealing with the problem in a The Minister should be aware that after such a delay an plethora of holistic ways in our local communities. individual’s condition will have developed in complexity, Newham is severely under-resourced in the face of meaning that their recovery treatment can last for years, significant pressures on mental health provision. I am whereas if treatment is early, it can last just weeks and glad to see the Minister of State, Department of Health, months. Early diagnosis and referral can lead to faster the right hon. Member for Chelmsford (Mr Burns), in and cheaper treatment, and greater success, and can the Chamber. I know he has listened to me and, given mean that the potential side effects of alcoholism, drug that he is a former Whip, that he is a very honourable problems, which have been mentioned—[Interruption.] man. I shall write to him to push the case for greater funding for Newham as we continue to fight for the resources that my communities desperately need to Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Lindsay Hoyle): Order. Will access better life chances, which includes better mental the Minister wait while the hon. Gentleman is standing? health. The Minister was right in my line of vision, and it is not fair to the person speaking. This is the third time it has 4.21 pm happened. Sir Paul Beresford (Mole Valley) (Con): It was beginning to look like a Whips’ cabal in the Chamber. I was quite Sir Paul Beresford: As mentioned by several Members, worried. A number of hon. Members, particularly the the result can often be imprisonment, yet all these side hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon), who is effects could be avoided. On average, it takes veterans busy disappearing from the Chamber, mentioned care just over 13 years from service discharge to first approach for, and the mental health of, veterans—[Interruption.] Combat Stress. This is an ongoing issue for veterans. I am making a plea to keep my small audience. To my Community outreach teams across the country now delight, the shadow Secretary of State mentioned a famous provide much support for veterans. They provide support organisation in that field: Combat Stress—[Interruption.] and advice in veterans’ own homes and nearby community- He is also leaving the Chamber the moment I mention based clinical care. Yesterday, we made much of the him. He can read my speech in Hansard as he has Falklands war, which ended 30 years ago today, on obviously been urgently called away. 14 June 1982. Of the 4,800 veterans Combat Stress is Combat Stress was supported by the previous helping, 221 served in the Falklands war. The youngest Government as it is by this one. Combat Stress clients— is 46 and the oldest is 74, and on average the Falklands ex-servicemen, or veterans—suffer from the appalling veterans have waited 15 years before going for help. conditions of post-traumatic stress disorder, depression Last year, 18 Falklands veterans contacted Combat or anxiety, or all three. Anyone who has seen such Stress for the first time, and this year, to date, 10 have individuals with such conditions will recognise that they contacted it. But of course the case load is not just from are exceptionally debilitating. They destroy the normal the Falklands. Of the 4,800 ex-service men and women life of victims and those around them. being treated, 589 served in Iraq and 228 served in Combat Stress has three centres—the main one is in Afghanistan. Between 1 April 2010 and 31 March 2011, my constituency—an outreach service throughout the Combat Stress received 1,443 new referrals. nation and a liaison team. It has been making a difference Having set the scene, I shall touch on a few key points for some considerable time. Some 83.5% of Combat for the Minister to consider. First, all the UK Governments Stress clients are ex-Army. Three per cent. are female. must acknowledge the ongoing need. Most of the Most of the veterans contact the Combat Stress service Governments contribute considerably towards Combat themselves or through family referral, but only 3.6% are Stress and its costs. Combat Stress estimates that in referred by general practitioners, 6.9% by community 2012, 960 service personnel will leave the armed forces health teams, and 0.3% by a hospital service. I hope the with the likelihood of suffering from PTSD. I shall Minister thinks about that. follow up a point made by the hon. Member for Strangford. To make access to those services more available, We must persuade the MOD to look specifically at their Combat Stress set up a 24-hour helpline in March last decompressing veterans-to-be and, if there is any suspicion, year. It may interest the House and the Minister to to refer them to Combat Stress. It would make treatment consider statistics from the helpline from March 2011 by Combat Stress easier, because it would be given to January 2012. Combat Stress received 6,279 calls, earlier, and all the pain and suffering of these men and including voicemails. A few people hung up—a tragic women could be reduced to a tiny fraction of what it is few calls were silent, which I think says a lot. for many of those in Combat Stress now. 553 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 554

That brings me to the crux of the problem, which has that we have this debate today. I want to focus on the been touched on. Because mental illness is not a physical huge challenge of providing high-quality mental health but a mental wound, a stigma is attached to it. A lot of services in what are difficult economic times. Given the Members have mentioned that. Combat Stress tells me tone of the debate, I do not want to turn this into a that 81% of veterans with a mental illness feel ashamed piece of political knockabout, but I do want to speak or embarrassed, which often prevents them from seeking about the reality of the situation in my constituency, help—it certainly delays them seeking help—and sadly where a number of mental health facilities either are one in three veterans are too ashamed of their condition threatened with closure or have already been scaled ever to tell their families about it. As a result, many of back. those families break up. Among the other side effects are The shadow Secretary of State for Health spoke crime, disorder and alcoholism. This is a mental health earlier about how the mental health system is somewhat problem, then, that could and should be alleviated early. separate from the rest of the NHS. However, the mental Much has been done to raise the profile of the condition health system is also facing considerable budgetary and the availability of help, so that those individuals do pressures—just as the rest of the NHS is—which is not feel that they are unique or, perhaps, weak. Much having an impact on some of the people we represent. needs to be done to encourage them and their families During the parliamentary recess I visited a continuing to seek assistance. We need to put these valuable individuals care home for elderly mental health patients which is back on their feet—and they are valuable: they have wholly funded by the NHS. The patients there are already performed valuable service, and there is still elderly people, often in their 60s, 70s or 80s, who have valuable service available if we can do that. Amazingly, been sectioned and who have significant mental health there appears to be a considerable lack of understanding needs, in terms of both medical and care support. The among GPs. Research conducted in September 2011 centre, in Granville Park in Lewisham, is threatened showed that only 5% of the veterans receiving help from with closure. The service is excellent and the care provided Combat Stress had been referred by their GP. Perhaps is exemplary, and the families of the people who live those GPs failed to recognise the condition or were there are incredibly concerned by the proposal to shut unaware of the existence of Combat Stress—or, more the unit down. South London and Maudsley NHS likely, both. I urge the Minister to ensure that the word Trust is consulting on the closure. It claims that it has is spread among our GPs. Combat Stress has done a too many beds of that kind and says that it wants to clinical audit, and it would appear that approximately scale back provision in Lewisham. 80% of the veterans who come to it for clinical treatment My constituents know that many more elderly people tried to get help from their GPs or other specialist have significant mental health needs so it is hard for services first, and did not get it. Appallingly, that support them to understand why a mental health centre should and treatment was not forthcoming. It should be. be closed. I have to say that the way in which the I hope that the Minister will consider joining me in a consultation has been conducted is far from perfect. visit to Combat Stress, to see the value of the work first Parts of it just do not make sense. I have raised my hand, to understand its difficulties and to help to build concerns with the PCT and the South London and on the opportunity to prevent some of the tragedies Maudsley NHS Foundation Trust. that we see. We need to remember that for those veterans Also threatened with closure are therapeutic care the physical war is over, but the battle is still raging in services for adults who have much lower mental health their heads. needs. A fantastic centre, known as the network arts centre in Lee, has been threatened with closure. I hope 4.31 pm that the South London and Maudsley NHS Foundation Heidi Alexander (Lewisham East) (Lab): I want to Trust will find a way to maintain the provision by keep my remarks quite brief, because I know that many setting it up as some form of social enterprise. This is a other hon. Members are keen to speak. Let me start by place where adults with mental health needs—perhaps apologising to the hon. Member for Loughborough not as significant as others’, as I said—can come together (Nicky Morgan) for not being in the Chamber for the and enjoy arts-based therapy in a setting that helps start of the debate. I heard some of her thoughtful and them to take the next step towards their recovery. I am comprehensive remarks on the television before I got in hopeful of finding a way through that situation, but here, and I congratulate her on securing this debate. when services like this are threatened with closure, it is a May I also say how powerful and honest the speeches matter of huge concern to the people who use them. that we heard from the hon. Member for Broxbourne I said that I would focus my remarks on the challenge (Mr Walker) and my hon. Friend the Member for of providing high-quality mental health services in difficult North Durham (Mr Jones) were? I echo what the Minister economic times, and the budgetary pressures faced by said earlier, which is that this place is often at its best public services is one of them. Another is the greater when people speak from their personal experience, rather uncertainty that individuals themselves face, which some than quoting statistics from briefings that we have been hon. Members have touched on. A few weeks ago, I sent or things that we have read in the newspaper. It visited Mencap in Lewisham and met a group of people reassures everyone outside this place that we are also who were primarily carers for people with mental health human beings, as well as Members of Parliament. difficulties. The questions they wanted to ask me were I have little expertise in this matter. Having said that, about the work capability assessment for the employment I have a close family member who has suffered obsessive and support allowance; they wanted to ask me about compulsive disorder and psychosis in the past, and I the process their loved ones would have to go through in have two very close friends who also suffer from OCD. transferring from disability living allowance to personal I know how difficult it can be for them to overcome independence payments; they wanted to ask me about some of the challenges they face, so I think it is important the changes to local council provision of day centres. 555 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 556

[Heidi Alexander] of what I have heard from others—that there are many GPs out there who provide an excellent service, which I What struck me was the great deal of uncertainty in the think can only be assisted by a move towards longer lives of people living with mental health problems and appointment times and better training. the people who are caring for them. We have heard today about the various terms that We heard from the shadow Secretary of State about people use for mental illness. Earlier, we heard it described the importance of getting advice and support to people as a mental health “experience”. I would say to anyone who in difficult times, and he mentioned the miners in Easington. is listening to the debate that an experience of depression That brings it home that we all—the Government and makes many people stronger and more understanding. I councils—need to recognise the importance of getting am absolutely sure that my own experiences of depression that local advice and support to people when they face and recovery—recovery is very important—caused me this uncertainty, which only adds to people’s stress and to become a much more sympathetic doctor, and I hope problems. that it made me a more sympathetic and understanding The mental health charity Mind sent me some details MP, able to recognise the issues in others and respond of its information line. It told me that in the last to them appropriately. 12 months, it had received 40,000 inquiries, but that I want to sound a note of caution about employment unfortunately, because of the pressure it is currently under, and depression. Many Members have rightly mentioned two out of five of those calls went unanswered. Since the issues surrounding Atos assessments, and I was glad the start of recession, Mind has seen a 100% increase in to hear the Minister say that he would address himself the number of calls relating to personal finances and to some of the concerns that had been expressed, but I employment. We need to understand the worries of think that we should be careful about making assumptions. people out there, and find a way to do more to recognise We should not assume that people with depression are the importance of the local services that provide support unable to work; we should individualise the position. and assistance. When I returned to work after having a baby, I was I said that I would be brief as others wished to speak. still suffering from severe panic attacks—especially when I think we have had a thoroughly excellent debate and travelling on the underground—and in retrospect, I I congratulate those who made it happen. I look forward realise that I was still significantly depressed, but going to hearing the remaining contributions. back to work was part of my recovery. I know that it can be difficult to challenge the ideas of people who are 4.38 pm depressed, but I think it important to present them with Dr Sarah Wollaston (Totnes) (Con): I congratulate challenges and encouragement at some level, because my hon. Friend the Member for Loughborough (Nicky depression is sometimes followed by a crisis of confidence, Morgan) on securing this important debate, and I pay and getting back to work is part of the road to recovery tribute to my hon. Friend the Member for Broxbourne from depression, however difficult it may feel. We should (Mr Walker), whose speech has immediately entered the not make generalisations and assume that no one can list of my top 10 favourite speeches. I thank and commend return to work when they are depressed. him for the work he has done over many years as chair I pay tribute to all those who help people with mental as the all-party parliamentary group on mental health. illness, including the many volunteers in all our I state from the outset that I am married to an NHS constituencies, and I pay particular tribute to a voluntary consultant psychiatrist and that my husband is involved group in my constituency called Cool Recovery. It is an in providing briefings to all Members on behalf of the independent mental health charity which cares for a Royal College of Psychiatrists. For that reason, I think number of people—not only those who have experience it best for me to confine myself mostly to some personal of depression, or are currently living with depression reflections and some concerns that have been raised in or other forms of mental illness, but those who have my constituency, and in particular to address the issue recovered from mental illness, and those who care for of stigma. people who suffer from it. As we have been told today, one in four people will I feel that such voluntary sector groups are essential experience mental illness at some point in their lives. We if we are to realise some of the benefits that can come have heard powerful speeches about that from a number from the Health and Social Care Act 2012. I was of Members. Like the hon. Member for North Durham concerned to hear from the volunteers at Cool Recovery (Mr Jones), I have experienced severe depression: at the that they do not feel they have been sufficiently involved happiest time of my life I experienced an episode of in the commissioning process, and that there are real post-natal depression, so I know what it is like. I am anxieties about the extent to which the user voice and sure that many other Members and people who are the voluntary sector voice are currently being heard in following today’s debate will know exactly what it is like the new arrangements. Perhaps the Minister will give us to genuinely to feel that your family would be better off an update on what is being done to ensure that there is without you, and to experience the paralysis that can adequate representation for the user voice and the voluntary accompany severe depression. sector at every stage on HealthWatch, on health and It has been rightly said today that there is concern wellbeing boards, and right up to national level at the about the way in which some GPs handle depression, NHS Commissioning Board. but I want to make it clear that in my own case, accepting that I had a problem and seeing my GP was Paul Burstow: I give an undertaking to answer those very much part of the road to recovery. I think that we points in the letter that I will write to Members. should be careful when we talk about how GPs manage depression, because I can tell the House—not only on Dr Wollaston: I thank the Minister for that, and the basis of my personal experience, but on the basis I look forward to reading his response. 557 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 558

I was pleased to hear that my hon. Friend the Member and very few MPs are trained counsellors or therapists. for Croydon Central (Gavin Barwell) will introduce a At times, however, we find ourselves taking on that role Bill to remove stigma. From talking to service users and and doing our best. those who have recovered from mental illness, it is clear Plymouth has a number of organisations that work to me that they are entirely capable of taking a full part with people across the full range of conditions; the in every aspect of life in their community and workplace, Samaritans and Plymouth Mind are excellent. Mind and in our national life. I was glad that the Minister has been in touch with me to express serious concerns and shadow Minister gave their full and unconditional that, at a time when more people are struggling, money backing to that Bill, as it will mark a very important is a huge problem, relationships are failing, young men step in removing the stigma of mental illness. I also join and women are returning from war and housing pressures the Minister in paying tribute to the work of Time to are intolerable for some, the main provider of mental Change, and I hope he will commit to continue to give health services, Plymouth Community Healthcare, is no support to that organisation. longer structuring mental health as a specifically defined Some 22% of the disease burden in England comes directorate of health care and appears to be shifting from mental health issues, and it is time that we recognised resources from mental health to generic health services. that in our local and national commissioning. The My right hon. Friend the Member for Leigh (Andy mental health strategy is excellent, but we now need to Burnham), on the Front Bench, talked about bringing ensure it is implemented. I know the Minister has set up mental health closer to acute care, and that is obviously a cross-ministerial group centrally, but who in this new a better approach. Mind is concerned that in Plymouth system will be accountable for the successful implementation the limited funds are being shifted away from mental of the strategy locally and regionally—and what levers health support. The charitable sector, too, is struggling for change can they exert, and what sanctions will there as a result of a reduction in resources. There are some be if it is not carried out? truly excellent support groups in Plymouth, and I pay huge tribute to the staff and volunteers at those, many 4.46 pm of whom have come through mental health illness themselves. There are far too many of them to name, Alison Seabeck (Plymouth, Moor View) (Lab): It is but I just wanted to put that on the record. a privilege to follow the hon. Member for Totnes (Dr Wollaston). She has great personal and professional I have mentioned housing pressures. How many of us experience in this field. I congratulate the hon. Member have constituents who are living in desperately overcrowded for Loughborough (Nicky Morgan) on securing the situations? We encounter pressure on parents because debate, and I apologise to her for missing her opening their children have turned up, perhaps with their speech as I mistimed my arrival in the Chamber. I will grandchildren. A woman who came to my surgery is read it in Hansard, however. sleeping on the sofa in her front room while the rest of This is a very important debate. Mental health problems the house is taken up by her children. These people are stigmatise. We have heard harrowing stories from colleagues clearly struggling. Many of them are on antidepressants on both sides of the House about how mental health or more powerful medication, and some are suicidal. issues affect our constituents—and also Members of Our caseworkers also deserve enormous credit for the Parliament. I pay tribute to my hon. Friend the Member way in which they sometimes have to support people in for North Durham (Mr Jones) for his brave speech; he those circumstances. will now only have greater respect. It was interesting to Equally, housing officers often cannot manage the hear how his experience made him stronger. The hon. tide of human misery that they face. People with mental Member for Totnes made that point, too, from her own health issues are much more difficult to deal with. A experience. The hon. Member for Broxbourne (Mr Walker) housing officer can understand someone who has a made a speech that managed to be entertaining despite physical disability, as it is often obvious—it is there in the seriousness of the subject under discussion, and all front of them and it is not invisible—and they can offer I have to say in response is “rock ’n’ roll.” adaptations or a possible move. Things do not work in Mental health problems are met with intolerance and the same way for people with mental health issues, and discrimination, and sometimes fear. When I was growing it is much more difficult to deal with those. up, the terms used to describe people with mental illness As we have heard repeatedly, mental health cuts included lunatic, nutter, headcase and maniac, all of across every area of our society. We have heard a great which have associations of dangerous or unpredictable deal about the need and support for our armed forces behaviour. No real effort was made to understand or and the excellent work done by organisations such as support. The usual solution chosen was to lock people Combat Stress. We have heard about the iniquitous away, or to stay away from them. treatment of people at the hands of Atos and about Many people, especially men, are reluctant to admit problems faced by those in the criminal justice system, they have problems or that they are feeling depressed or but there are other areas to address. The hon. Member are hearing voices. Some people do not understand that for Totnes touched on the issue of young women, who their lives are being affected by the state of their mental clearly often need support both before and after childbirth. health. We find in our surgeries that people sometimes Midwives are potentially very important in that scenario, start talking about one problem, but when we dig we and I would be interested to hear from the Minister on find layers of issues, including mental health issues. what guidance and training they specifically receive on About 60% of the people I see have an underlying supporting women in those circumstances. mental health issue, ranging from severe stress to serious Work is also being done to address the needs of psychotic conditions, and I do not think my constituency children. The Minister mentioned the work of YoungMinds, is unusual in that regard. Teasing out what support they but we are still failing very many young people. Recent have, or have not, sought can require great sensitivity, media reports on suicides highlighted just how difficult 559 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 560

[Alison Seabeck] At a family level, at last count there were three suicides in my extended family. I know a number of it can be for young people who are being bullied or are people who have had depression and, unfortunately, a struggling through other personal issues. Tragically, family member has recently been diagnosed with early schools and other responsible adults have failed to onset dementia. I myself have had moments of, shall we recognise what was going on in their lives. I pay tribute say, fluctuating mood, perhaps a bit more so since I to the incredibly well-informed speech by the hon. have been in this place, so I feel that I have first-hand Member for Worthing West (Sir Peter Bottomley), which experience through my family and myself of how prevalent specifically dealt with those issues. YoungMinds, which the problems are. was praised by the Minister, is concerned by the service I know from my professional experience that the cuts and reductions in provision for child and adolescent nature of this topic means that it is something one does mental health. We also have to address an issue about not forget. I recall clerking in a patient who was a the transition from support in that area into adulthood. survivor of Auschwitz—I remember the tattoo quite That area needs a lot more attention, and I hope that clearly—and the following day, that person hanged the Minister will address some of these specific issues in himself. I remember the relative of a senior member of his correspondence with us. the Ministry of Defence at the time breaking down in Finally, I wish to offer my support to the hon. Member front of us, which was a quite shocking incident for me for Croydon Central (Gavin Barwell) in his attempt to as a medical student. make significant changes on the whole issue of stigma. Finally, I remember a case—I only remembered this Intolerance or discrimination in employment, and as I listened to the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim preventing people from holding public office because Shannon)—of somebody who had been a victim of the they have been sectioned, is wholly unacceptable. He is troubles in Northern Ireland and had been relocated to right to say that this archaic piece of legislation needs to where I was working under the witness protection scheme. be binned, and I welcome the support that he has That gentleman had experienced guns being held at his received from the two Front-Bench teams. I also welcome temple, in his mouth and so on, and I was in a position the fact that we will have a further opportunity to to be able to help him. debate some of these crucial issues and just get it out there. The nature of this subject means that it tends to throw up cases that are quite memorable and emotive. Several hon. Members rose— I feel strongly about it. Locally, I have done my bit. I have met Rethink Mental Illness and the first hustings Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans): Order. As hon. I attended during the 2010 general election campaign Members can see, about nine Members are trying to was run locally by a mental health charity. Broadmoor catch my eye and we have just over an hour. We want to hospital is in my constituency, at Crowthorne. I have get everyone in, do we not? If everybody speaks for only visited there and I would encourage everybody to visit six or seven minutes we can accommodate everybody, Broadmoor hospital. It is a very interesting place to so I ask Members to be time-focused, please. visit with recidivism rates that are, I imagine, the envy of the prison system. 4.54 pm I have done my bit to try to raise the profile of the discussion and debate around mental health services, Dr Phillip Lee (Bracknell) (Con): I congratulate my because this is a significant area of concern. About hon. Friend the Member for Loughborough (Nicky 800,000 people have dementia in this country at the Morgan) on securing this important debate. There have moment and that number will rise—it will double. That been some very impressive speeches, not least from the is because of ageing and lifestyle, depending on whether hon. Member for North Durham (Mr Jones). I have the it is Alzheimer’s or vascular dementia. The estimated pleasure of being, like him, a member of the Administration cost of mental health is £89 billion by 2026, although Committee because very early on in my time here at perhaps that figure is out of date as I heard the shadow Westminster I realised that there were quite significant Secretary of State give a larger figure. Half of that is mental health problems among my colleagues. A few of due to loss of earnings in the work place. The significance them had approached me so I went to the usual channels, of this topic cannot be overstated. wanting to know what support was available for colleagues. Unfortunately, more than half of people with anxiety As a consequence, I was put on the Administration disorders do not interact with the service and about a Committee and I am now also on the medical panel. I third of those with depression do not interact with it. am encouraged by the support available to colleagues if The services we have cannot deal with the demands they choose to use it. being placed on them, so God only knows what it will I congratulate the shadow Front-Bench team on what be like when everyone starts turning up to see me as a appears to be a decision to lead with mental health. It is GP or, now I am here, me as an MP. I fear that this will an important decision that is politically astute and need some realism on the part of the current Health those on the Government Front Bench ought perhaps team and any future Health team that might come from to reflect on their goals in that area. My advice would the Opposition side in terms of rationing and prioritisation be not to be overambitious. of resources. For example, I read that we are now giving I want to reflect on my experience in this area, my fertility treatment to everybody. I am sorry, but if I were family experience and my professional experience before to prioritise where my funding was going, I know it saying a few brief words on GP commissioning. I have would go to mental health before it went to fertility heard mention of the police and the concerns about treatment. I know that is a difficult thing for people to their involvement in this area, so I shall comment on accept if they have fertility problems but we have to that. Finally, I want to mention the Human Rights Act. make decisions and I know where my priorities lie. 561 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 562

Let me address GP commissioning and some concerns The problem on the Surrey-Berkshire borders is that that I want to raise with Front Benchers. There is some there is a difference in the mental health care provision unease in my profession about the commissioning of from each trust. There is a perverse situation in which psychiatric services—more so than for diabetes, hypertension people registered at the Royal Military Academy, whether or any cardiac service. In a recent poll that I saw, about personnel or family members, receive different levels of 70% expressed significant concerns about this issue. I care. I would appreciate a written response on this from want to flag this up because most GPs do not get a lot the Minister or from the Ministry of Defence. We may of psychiatric experience when they are training. I be able to address that with commissioning groups, but happened to do a post in which I worked with depression it is important, particularly given the comments by some and dementia as a junior but quite a few do not. That of my colleagues, with reference to our armed forces. needs to be borne in mind. Perhaps we need to look at Finally, may I congratulate everyone in the mental training in the way that my hon. Friend the Member health sphere and anyone who is delivering care. They for Totnes (Dr Wollaston) mentioned earlier. The do so in often challenging circumstances. Doctors, nurses commissioning of mental health services is complex and so on need all the support that they can get in a and difficult, and we need to be cautious. I have been service that will be increasingly important to us in future. broadly supportive of the Government regarding commissioning but psychiatric services are different. 5.5 pm Another matter that I want to raise is about the Dr Julian Lewis (New Forest East) (Con): Unlike the police. I heard the earlier comments about the police doctors who have spoken from the Conservative Benches, force and I know that the police are not terribly enthusiastic my hon. Friends the Members for Bracknell (Dr Lee) about getting involved in acute psychiatric crises, but let and for Totnes (Dr Wollaston), who spoke with such me tell hon. Members an anecdote. A good friend of expertise, I have absolutely no medical qualifications mine attended a psychiatric hospital at which someone whatsoever, but that has not stopped me giving my had been brought in by the police. Six policemen had opinions on this subject in the past, and I am afraid that brought in that person, who was in a violent state of it is not going to stop me today. mind, and there was one female psychiatrist there. The six policemen had stab vests on and she was wearing a I see from the index on my website that this will be blouse. Somebody has to do that work and I am slightly the ninth speech that I have made on the Floor of the concerned about who will do it if the police want to get House or in Westminster Hall on mental health. Many out of it because the psychiatrists on the front line do of those speeches were supported by my hon. Friend not have the same protections that the police have. the Member for Broxbourne (Mr Walker), and I do not think we will ever hear a finer speech than the one that On the Human Rights Act, let me highlight that he made today. In passing, I pay due credit to the hon. whereas when people come on to the parliamentary Member for North Durham (Mr Jones), whose interest estate they have their bags checked, psychiatrists cannot in these matters I have known about for a long time, check the bags of a patient they are about to assess even although not his personal history. if that patient has displayed violent intent. So someone could come in with a bag with knives and guns in it and The speeches that I have made in the past have tended the psychiatrist cannot investigate that bag or have it to concentrate on three themes: the importance of separate searched because of the patient’s human rights. I would therapeutic environments for people who have to be very much like the Front Bench team to look at that and admitted when they are acutely mentally ill—it is obviously get back to me. unwise to have psychotic patients cheek by jowl with people suffering from suicidal depression, for example; I want to take this opportunity to ask a few questions the importance of single-sex wards, particularly in mental and re-emphasise that the knowledge base of GPs in health units, although that applies to the NHS hospital this area needs to be improved, particularly for network as a whole; and the importance of making commissioning. I should like to know what the Government adequate bed numbers available for people who require propose to do in this area. On the issue of choice, it is all periodic admission to a mental health unit. very well wanting patients to be able to exercise choice We heard from the Minister about the new emphasis but if they are not capable of doing so because they are on recovery-based programmes, and I am all in favour profoundly depressed, demented or psychotic how on of that. There is everything to be said for that, but even earth can they exercise that choice? Is the Minister confident its most ardent advocates do not deny that there will that patients will get the care they need? I welcome the always be a need for in-patient beds for some people £400 million for talking therapies, but I should like to some of the time. I am concerned that the cuts imposed know where that money is being spent. What is the on in-patient beds may mean that if we are not very breakdown of the expenditure of that money? Is the careful indeed there will be enough beds available in Minister confident that it is being spent in appropriate future only for people who are sectioned. Those people areas? Anecdotally, I am hearing that it is not making who wish to receive the support and the underpinning—the much difference on the front line. fall-back position—of an in-patient bed when they are What can be done with regards to the Human Rights experiencing an acute episode may be unable to secure Act and the example I have given? We should look at one. this. Perhaps it is an issue for colleagues in another It has rightly been said that a debate at national level Ministry, but I would appreciate a response about this. brings out the best in people in the House of Commons. Finally, let me raise a local issue. The Royal Military However, the debate at local level does anything but Academy at Sandhurst is in my constituency—or at bring out the best, given some of the schemes, plans and least the parade ground and the buildings are. The measures that have been introduced. In that connection, residential accommodation is in the constituency of my I pay tribute to the hon. Member for Lewisham East right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Education. (Heidi Alexander) who, in a measured and thoughtful 563 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 564

[Dr Julian Lewis] Even though the community care policy is widely accepted, the issue of mental health is not accepted by way, made a speech that has become all too familiar to the majority of the British public. I say that with me. She talked about the way in which Granville Park in evidence from the 2010 public attitudes survey showing her constituency has been scheduled for closure on the that, although people are broadly sympathetic towards basis of a consultation that she regarded as somewhat those who suffer from mental illness, some of their suspect. attitudes are worse than when the Department of Health I refer the hon. Lady to the Adjournment debate on first commissioned the poll in 1994. I believe that it is the Floor of the House introduced by my hon. Friend fear that drives this county’s mental health system; not the Member for Burton (Andrew Griffiths), who discussed the fear of those who suffer from mental illness, but a similar techniques that were used in his constituency, fear that is perpetuated by the actions of vested interests and to my own experience with the Southern Health and perpetuates the stigma. I believe that it occurs foundation trust, which used a similar method to make through three main areas: mental health lobby groups, 35% cuts in in-patient beds for acutely ill adults, even politicians and the media. though bed occupancy figures were consistently over First, fear of those who are mentally ill has been fuelled 90%. The pattern seems to be something like this: they by lobby groups that use the rare cases of homicide to hold a consultation; they make assertions based on, at keep mentally ill people in the public’s consciousness. best, subjective surveys of what they say people want; Although their motivations are honest, the reality is they then rely on pseudo-independent “expert” research, that their actions promote a fear that is not always which usually turns out not to be independent at all; conducive to their aims. I do not intend to criticise and finally they bulldoze their pre-existing plans through. individuals who have suffered terrible personal tragedies, Therefore, to take the message that Mr Speaker always but highlighting mental health issues as aggravating used to give when teaching the art of rhetoric, which is causes in deaths will not reintroduce a policy of asylum that a speech should have at most two main points, the hospitals for severely mentally ill people. That behaviour main point in my speech is the need for the objective alienates other mental health charities, which consider monitoring of statistics so that when we are reconfiguring it to be unproductive. services we at least know whether there really are spare Secondly, we as politicians have to take responsibility beds before we close services down. for reducing stigma. As I have already said to the I would like to be fairly positive in this debate, brief Minister, the political decision to hold an independent as my contribution necessarily is, so I would like to say inquiry into every homicide involving a mentally ill that the health overview and scrutiny committee of person has exacerbated public fear. Following the Ritchie Hampshire county council, despite the harsh words I report in 1994, the Department of Health ordered that have had to use about it in the past, appears to be taking an inquiry should be held into every homicide involving on board some of my concerns by seeking to ensure, as mental health services, but mental health professionals it has stated in its minutes, describe the environment in which they now have to work as an inquiry culture, whereby staff are made aware that “that further bed reductions are being safely managed” any variation from recommended perfect practice could and that it is lead to an unpleasant afternoon in front of a cynical “made aware by the commissioner and provider should future committee and the humiliation of being named in one acute inpatient bed demand regularly exceed bed availability in of their reports. Those inquiries are viewed by mental the service.” health professionals as a threat, rather than as a corrective I think that it is terribly important that in the process mechanism to enforce a “safety first”culture that promotes of reconfiguring we do not simply say that we are a perception among the public that every death is recreating a new system in the community while decimating preventable. the system that allows people the safety net of an acute It is easy for politicians to fall into that trap of trying bed during those episodes when they are really ill. As I to face both ways; indeed, the previous Government did said in my brief intervention on the Minister, if people fall into it to some extent. They were described as are to have the confidence to get on with their lives and “compassionate” when they embarked on what the know that they can have useful and fulfilling careers Mental Health Commission called even while living with and managing a mental illness, it “the quickest and most dynamic transformation of policy in the is absolutely vital that they also know that, on the rare history of state intervention in mental health illness,” occasions when they really need the ultimate support of but to the public they presented an authoritarian face, a few nights or even a week or two in an acute unit, a capitalising on the alarm caused by the random attack bed will always be available for them. on Jill Dando and the assault on George Harrison. The third influence on mental health policy is provided 5.12 pm by the media. Comments have already been made about Mr Matthew Offord (Hendon) (Con): I will keep my the front page of The Sun in 2003, when it faced a remarks short, as time is certainly against me. I want to significant backlash for branding Frank Bruno “Bonkers” focus on the stigma of mental illness and the reasons after he had been taken to a psychiatric hospital. But why I think it continues to exist. We often recoil in that was not an isolated story. There have been many horror when we think of the old asylum system in others, such as “Doc freed psycho to kill” and “Psycho which people were locked up for various reasons. I killer was a time bomb waiting to explode”. They all believe that the care in the community system has been inflame public outrage and continue to promote among welcomed by most people, and I say that with evidence the public a perception that mental illness equates to from the 1994 Richie inquiry into the care and treatment dangerous murderers whom doctors allow out on to the of Christopher Clunis, which broadly endorsed the street, free to roam and to kill at will, but that is simply community care policy. not the case. 565 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 566

Figures show that there has been no increase in severe, enduring mental illness die 15 to 20 years younger killings by people with a mental illness in the past than on average. That is partly due to high levels of 40 years, during which time many mental hospitals have smoking and use of other drugs—in effect, self-medication. been closed in favour of care in the community. Less There is also evidence that people with mental illness than one in 10 murders is committed by someone with a suffer discrimination in relation to their physical health. mental disorder, and over the past 40 years that number They do not get seen as quickly and they do not get has decreased as a proportion of all homicides, as the treated as well as those in other parts of the NHS overall murder rate has increased over the same time. dealing with patients who do not suffer from their On the representation of mental illness on television, conditions. the Scottish Recovery Network found that 45% of The prescription for Ministers appears to be this: characters with mental health problems in soap operas more talking treatments; better physical care; concerted were portrayed as violent or as posing a threat to other action to reduce stigma; and more direct payments people. In real life, it was very concerning when in 2007 for those who can cope with them, allowing those on Nikki Grahame, someone who clearly has mental health benefits to buy their own care rather than relying on issues, and , who suffers from Tourette’s, social services. were allowed on “” simply to increase its viewing figures. Several hon. Members rose— Kerry Katona has admitted that when she sought to go on the same programme on in 2010, she Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans): To help the failed the psychological test, as she had just come off remaining speakers keep to time, I am introducing a her bipolar medication and a doctor advised her that it six-minute limit. would not be sensible to appear. In 2011, however, when the show went over to Channel Five, that broadcaster 5.20 pm did not produce any psychological tests and she was Mr Robert Buckland (South Swindon) (Con): I speak allowed to go on, the consequences of which could be as somebody with not only constituency experience of seen each day. mental health issues but nearly 20 years of professional The biggest change over the past decade has been the experience of dealing with a number of cases involving increase in protests from people with mental health clients with mental health problems committing serious problems who use the services on offer. Their dissatisfaction crimes such as murder, and crimes right through the is with treatment, its greater emphasis on risk reduction criminal spectrum, many of whom have required the and containment and its narrow focus on medication. input of consultant psychiatrists and the assistance of Those who suffer from mental health problems dislike the provisions of the Mental Health Act 1983. For the heavy use of antipsychotic and sedative drugs, given many years, it struck me that the question of why those their side effects, with some even rejecting completely people ended up in that situation was never adequately the biomedical approach, which defines mental health answered. Years after my first experience with a such a problems as illnesses to be medicated, rather than as client, I am still struggling to answer that question; social or psychological difficulties to be resolved with perhaps it never will be adequately answered. other treatments, including talk therapies, for example. Mental health conditions are an integral part of what There were some good measures in the Mental Health being a human is all about; they are with us every day of Act 2007, but there were also some negative ones, so I our lives. We are all, parliamentarians or otherwise, a ask the Minister to address them and, in particular, to little more brittle than we sometimes care to admit. outline the benefits that he thinks the 2007 Act has Some of the testimony that we have heard today has introduced or, if he does not think that it has introduced shone a welcome light on the realities of what it is to be any, the coalition Government’s policies to address the a human. Remembering that rule will guide us much need for legislation that is fit for the 21st century. more effectively as a society when we deal with mental The public and politicians want to be assured that the health and the sad stigma that still pervades mental services people receive from mental health organisations health issues far too strongly. However, I will not reiterate are safe and will protect people from such rare but what other hon. Members have said about stigma. catastrophic attacks as those that have occurred in the I repeat my congratulations to my hon. Friend the past. People with mental health problems, and their Member for Loughborough (Nicky Morgan) on securing families, however, want to be assured that the services this debate. It is not an overstatement to call it historic, are responsive and supportive, not coercive. They want because many of the comments that we have heard will to be included as active partners in, not passive recipients be remembered long after it is over, and not only by of, their care. However, a coercive service whose priority interested people in the mental health community. That is public safety is vote-catching, while concern with civil is an excellent example of how this place can really help liberties for a minority group, and one with a dangerous to make a difference in our wider society. image at that, is not. As a constituency MP, I take a huge interest in Patients continue to be treated with drugs rather than mental health issues in my area. Swindon, like many therapy, yet the constant cry is for more talking treatments, other towns of its size, has its fair share of mental which NICE now accepts work for conditions such as health challenges. We have excellent local voluntary schizophrenia. Carers are still neglected; their views are organisations that are increasingly working together to ignored and they lack support. There is huge variability, improve provision. In response to the hon. Member for with some places having great services while others, as Islington North (Jeremy Corbyn), the way to deal with has been described today, have appalling services. the challenges of commissioning is for local voluntary Perhaps the biggest scandal in mental health provision groups increasingly to come together to co-ordinate is in physical health. Evidence shows that people with their activities and to make bids for tenders. That is 567 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 568

[Mr Robert Buckland] I rise today to make a plea to the Minister. He graciously attended an Adjournment debate that I secured what is happening in my constituency. Only last Friday, on the closure of the Margaret Stanhope centre, a I was at a meeting of Swindon Charities Working mental health facility in my constituency. It was as a Together, where those from the carers centre, Swindon result of his intervention that the consultation was Mind and other organisations were all talking to each extended, and I was grateful for that. The end result, other and co-operating, because they recognise that if however, was that the local PCT—South Staffordshire they do not, the scenario envisaged by hon. Members PCT—took the decision to close the centre. As a newly whereby the big players secure every commissioning elected Member of Parliament, I assumed that such tender will become even more prevalent. We must avoid decisions would be taken based on facts and evidence, that if we are to develop genuinely local and properly and that there would be hard facts to enable the PCT’s tailored mental health services. claims to stack up. I assumed that its claims about the Much has been said about the importance of involving provision that was going to replace the Margaret Stanhope service users themselves, and I cannot place enough centre would be demonstrable. As my hon. Friend the emphasis on that. We have a wonderful organisation Member for New Forest East said earlier, however, the in Swindon called SUNS—the Service User Network reality was a mind-blowing situation, in which the inability Swindon—which runs a listening line that is operated of the PCT to make any of its claims stack up throughout by service users, for service users. So, on those lonely the process became apparent. I was disappointed, but Friday and Saturday nights, if those people with mental not surprised, that the PCT dismissed the petition organised health conditions have nowhere else to turn, they can by my local newspaper, the Burton Mail, to save this ring their friends, talk to them and work through their much-loved facility, which some 8,200 people signed. problems. That saves thousands of pounds that would The PCT decided to dismiss it because, it said, the otherwise be spent on the use of crisis teams in the petition did not deal absolutely to the letter with all the acute services. That is diversion. That is the kind of options that were in the consultation. therapy and approach that we need to encourage more. Throughout the consultation, the PCT made a number There is also much that can be done in the workplace. of claims. To start with, it said that it had carried out a The Mindful Employer organisation is one of the largest pilot scheme and could demonstrate that it could reduce networks of employers in the country. It brings together the need for in-patient care by a third. Understandably, local businesses, shares best practice and emphasises we asked for the evidence to back that up. After five the fact that it makes good business sense to manage the weeks of asking, it eventually provided me with some stresses and strains of the work force more sensibly. I occupancy rates. We then asked for further occupancy am proud to be what I regard as a mindful employer. rates, because the initial ones did not stack up. We One of my employees here in Parliament, Christopher asked for daily occupancy rates. It took a further two van Roon, has suffered from a mild bipolar disorder—I months for the PCT to give us that information. When have his permission to say this to the House—and he we analysed it, it showed that far from reducing the manages it with the help of his employers, my hon. need for in-patient beds by a third, only stays of more Friend the Member for North Swindon (Justin Tomlinson) than 90 days—a minute part of in-patient care—had and me. He has worked here for two years while dealing been reduced by a third. The vast majority of the with his mental health condition. He enjoys his work figures had stayed the same and one-day admissions and being part of a healthy workplace. had actually gone up. That is an example of how people with mental health We looked further into what the PCT was saying. It conditions can be brought back into the workplace and had claimed that an independent report by Staffordshire shown that there is a way forward. The idea that mental university had said that closing the facility would not health conditions somehow mean a dead end for people’s have an impact. When we looked at the report, we lives has to be ended. That is far from the truth. As found that the professor from Staffordshire university other hon. Members have said, such experiences can who had conducted it was also employed by the PCT. often make people all the stronger. She was on the payroll of the PCT, and yet it was praying My thanks go to all the organisations in Swindon in aid her report. that do so much for mental health provision in my constituency, and also to the army of family members We cited a benchmarking report by the Audit and carers who, in an unsung way, do so much to support Commission, which demonstrated that the PCT had those with mental health conditions. I am delighted to among the lowest provision of mental health beds in have taken part in the debate, and I commend the the country. It stated that of 46 mental health trusts, motion to the House. Staffordshire had the lowest provision. Surprise, surprise, the following quarter’s evidence showed that my PCT 5.27 pm had the highest provision. It had shot up from the Andrew Griffiths (Burton) (Con): I too offer my thanks lowest to the highest. When we explored that a little and praise to my hon. Friends the Members for more, we found that the PCT had included beds such as Loughborough (Nicky Morgan) and for Broxbourne those for eating disorders and drug and alcohol problems. (Mr Walker) for securing the debate and for putting It had lumped them all together to fix the figures. mental health at the centre of Parliament and the centre The most worrying thing for me was that when I of our thoughts today. I also want to thank my hon. attended the final hearing where the decision was made, Friend the Member for New Forest East (Dr Lewis). lay members on the panel were asking basic questions Over recent months, he has played Starsky to my Hutch such as how many beds were available and what the in relation to mental health debates. He also managed occupancy rates were, even after a four-month consultation. to make my speech today in a much more succinct and They clearly did not have any of the information that erudite manner than I could ever hope to do. was necessary to make such an important decision. 569 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 570

I urge the Minister to think long and hard about how end, where there is real neglect and abuse, are the ones we can bring rigour into such decisions. Mental health who go on to become drug addicts or violent criminals. issues can affect any family, rich or poor, and are no In fact, research shows that 80% of long-term criminals respecter of intelligence, upbringing or anything like have attachment problems stemming from babyhood. that. It is essential that there is a rigorous, accountable A sad truth about our society is that research shows and transparent process before PCTs are able to decide that 40% of children aged five are not securely attached. to do away with these vital beds. I urge the Minister Of course, that does not mean that they all go on to to consider how the Government can provide those become psychopaths or murderers, but it does mean reassurances. that we are raising generations of babies and young children who do not have the emotional capacity to 5.33 pm meet the ups and downs that life throws at them. They Andrea Leadsom (South Northamptonshire) (Con): will have a much greater tendency than other people to I congratulate my hon. Friends the Members for mental illness. They will struggle to have all the things Loughborough (Nicky Morgan) and for Broxbourne that we perhaps take for granted, such as a secure (Mr Walker) on what has turned out to be a fantastically family and a decent job, and they will be less robust in refreshing debate, which has been part debate and part their emotional make-up. group therapy. There is much that we could do to support people. I want to add my own personal contribution. Like my We heard yesterday in the debate on early intervention hon. Friend the Member for Totnes (Dr Wollaston), I about how much more could be done to support social suffered from post-natal depression. It is unbelievable workers and destigmatise going to children’s centres how awful you feel when you are sitting with your tiny and seeking help. One very good example came from baby in your arms and your baby cries and so do you. the right hon. Member for Birkenhead (Mr Field), who You cannot even make yourself a cup of tea. You just has talked about it for a long time. Why do we not feel so utterly useless. Looking back on that time, I ensure that people go to a children’s centre to register genuinely agree with my hon. Friend that going through their baby’s birth, and then to get their child benefit? that experience makes you a better person. It also That would instantly mean that most people would use makes you determined to do something for other people children’s centres, so it would destigmatise them. in that situation. Children’s centres should not just be places where Post-natal depression is a key issue for women as people go for antenatal and post-natal check-ups; people individuals. Like many others, I got over it with the help should be able to go there for psychotherapeutic support of a good family and husband, and by going back to such as that offered by the Oxford Parent Infant Project, work. Many people do not get over it. Although the the charity of which I was chairman for nine years. It consequences are profound for those women, the provides psychotherapeutic support for families who consequences for their babies are often even more profound. are struggling to bond with their babies. Social workers, I want to talk briefly about the experience of a baby. health visitors and midwives love it because it is somewhere When babies are born, they are about two years premature. to which they can on-refer people. We hear a lot of talk Their brains have barely developed. They have all of the about training for health visitors, but no talk about neurones but none of the neural pathways are laid what they should do when they spot attachment problems down. That happens only during the first two years of and what help they should provide to families to turn life. The peak period for the growth and development of the situation around. OXPIP has shown how incredibly a baby’s brain is between six and 18 months, and that easy it is to do so, because both mother and baby are growth is literally stimulated by a loving relationship extraordinarily receptive to being supported in such a with an adult carer—usually their mum, of course. If a way as to develop the attunement and empathy that baby’s mum has a lovely, smiling face and always picks they need for a good relationship with each other. them up, cheers them up, hugs them, feeds them and Mums who adore their babies do not allow partners changes them whenever they cry, their brain becomes to stub cigarettes out on them. They do not shake them hard-wired to understand that the world is a good to death or neglect and ignore them when they are place. They will go on to be a person who can deal with crying. It is all about building an early relationship. It is life’s ups and downs, and who retains the idea that the greatly in the interests of our society for sound relationships world will be good to them. to have been built by the age of two so that we do not It is like Harry Potter. He had loving parents until he constantly have to deal with the consequences of failed was two, but then along came Lord Voldemort and attachment later in life. murdered them, and he had an unspeakable experience 5.38 pm until he was into his teens and escaped to Hogwarts. What kept him on the straight and narrow, and James Morris (Halesowen and Rowley Regis) (Con): understanding right from wrong, was his secure foundation. I welcome this important and timely debate. As other I put it to the Minister that that is how to secure good hon. Members have said, mental health issues are often emotional health for our society. marginalised in debates about health in general. Mental If babies do not have a secure bond—usually with health must take centre stage, because mental health mum, but it can be with another parent or with adoptive problems are widespread across the social system and parents—their brain develops in such a way that they affect people of all ages. expect to have to fight or withdraw. Those babies are the As Members have pointed out, there has often been a people who go on to fail to cope with what life throws at stigma attached to mental illness, but we are beginning them. They struggle to make friendships, and they are to tackle that stigma head-on both here and, increasingly, the people who are bullied or become victims, or indeed through other public figures talking about their mental become bullies themselves at school. Babies at the acute health problems. 571 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 572

[James Morris] treatment that has dominated thinking in our health system for far too long. We need an integrated approach As we attack that stigma, we must also examine at a local level that takes the best talking therapies and whether our approach to tackling the problem is fit and gives people access to the treatment they need. As the appropriate for the 21st century. Our approach to mental debate has illustrated, we also need a commitment from illness over a number of decades has been based on the Government to place mental health as a top priority what I would call the psychiatric model. The model has within our health service as we seek to tackle the medicalised mental illness and treated it as something problem. to be dealt with using drug-based therapies. It is dominated by a concern for short-term relief rather than long-term 5.44 pm cure. That approach has dominated our thinking about mental illness in mainstream health. In my view, it John Glen (Salisbury) (Con): In the short time available, needs to change, which is why I broadly welcomed the I wish to address two subjects. First, I shall consider recommendations in the Government’s “No Health without mental health in the military and the excellent progress Mental Health” strategy, particularly its emphasis on made since the election, and refer to the work of my improving access to psychological therapies. The friend and constituency neighbour, my hon. Friend the Government are investing £400 million over the spending Member for South West Wiltshire (Dr Murrison). Secondly, review period, which is a welcome development. I want to reflect on my experiences dealing with constituents People who suffer from a range of mental health over the past two years. I think that many Members problems need clear access to a range of talking therapies, have been surprised by the sheer number of individuals but it has become fashionable to be sceptical about who come to surgeries with mental health problems and the effectiveness of long-term approaches such as associated issues. I want to refer to several of my psychoanalysis and psychotherapy, and we must not experiences with constituents. fall into the trap, as we do in many aspects of modern Soon after I was elected, one constituent told me life, in focusing on therapies that have a short-term about the treatment of her brother, who had recently effect. I believe strongly that psychoanalytical and committed suicide. She was unhappy with his experience psychotherapeutic approaches can help to treat a range and that of her brothers and mother during the previous of mental health problems, from anorexia and psychosis 20 years, so we convened a meeting with relevant health to schizophrenia. We should not be embarrassed to professionals. I sat in the room for an hour and a half, advocate the use of such therapies. as we went through the history of that poor man’s At the same time, we need an integrated approach at experience over 20 years. We have had an excellent a local level. I am impressed by the approach taken in discussion this afternoon about the different investments, Sandwell, part of which I represent. A GP-led approach and new policies, resources and approaches, but it struck to mental health care in Sandwell has borne results. The me in that meeting that the real challenge was to join up area has high levels of mental ill health, and high social all the different components that make for a proper deprivation and unemployment. Local GPs, led by Dr Ian solution for that family as a whole. Walton, agreed that depression should be a top priority. We were given an excellent briefing in the run-up to They developed an integrated mental health care approach this debate, but one comment, in particular, from Mind emphasising greater choice, and helping to build emotional and Rethink struck home. They wrote that resilience and independence. The approach shifts the “whilst many people with mental health problems receive excellent focus to mental well-being rather than mental illness. care, all too often people face barriers in getting the care that they As other hon. Members have pointed out, GPs are an need as people’s journeys to recovery are rarely linear or important first gateway into NHS mental health services straightforward.” and the early identification of treatment for mental That is the key issue. People do not know what to health problems. Big steps have been taken in Sandwell expect, and because many of these conditions are unseen to improve GP training to deal with patients presenting and the future is unknown, a great deal of fear creeps complex mental health problems, and Dr Walton and into families doing their best for a struggling relative. his team have invested time in GP training to improve That leads to great tension and anxiety, so it is incredibly the efficacy of early diagnosis. important that as we move to a new commissioning Improving early diagnosis of mental health problems environment, we give local providers of appropriate is a fundamental part of the integrated model that has support a voice and enable them to be commissioned. been successful in Sandwell. It frees resources in secondary These decisions must be based not on numbers and care and allows people to deal with their mental health spreadsheets but on the practical experience of local problems in community and family settings. The Sandwell people. model emphasises positive self-help, access to appropriate The “Fighting Fit” report was a valuable piece of talking therapies and a focus on specialist programmes work commissioned in the first few weeks of the tailored to the needs of patients, which other hon. Government taking office. It is important to think Members have mentioned. It also emphasises the about mental health in the armed forces in the same importance of partnership working with schools, health, way as in other areas, but it is difficult to do so, given employment and other social providers. the culture in that environment. We heard some excellent Dr Walton and other local GPs have helped to transform statistics and useful perspectives from my hon. Friend mental health care in Sandwell, with consistently high the Member for Mole Valley (Sir Paul Beresford) recovery rates using IAPT of 63%, compared with a underscoring the fact that many people in the military national average of just 44%. As we seek to tackle the suffering from mental health issues do not take their major problem of mental health across our country, we first step towards accessing care until more than a need that greater emphasis on talking therapies. We decade—13 years, on average, we are told—after they need to challenge the psychiatric model of mental health leave the services. 573 Mental Health14 JUNE 2012 Mental Health 574

It is pleasing that progress is being made on the to look at as a House. My interest in this whole matter principal recommendations in the “Fighting Fit”report—on began in 2000, shortly after I was selected as the candidate increasing the number of mental health professionals in Plymouth, Sutton, when I went out with the people conducting outreach work, on the establishment of an from one of the churches and saw them handing out online early-intervention service and on a veterans’ soup and sandwiches to various people. Plymouth, being information service. That progress is welcome, but much a major—indeed, principal—naval port, most certainly more needs to be done to educate new recruits and has a lot of veterans issues. There was a man on that personnel throughout their career on the need to be occasion who had left the Army and was sleeping open about their mental health, to admit to it and to rough. He had come across real problems because he seek support from the relevant authorities. had taken to drink—he had obviously taken to drugs as As everyone has said this afternoon, mental health well, which was also a very big issue. issues do not discriminate by age, background, career or Indeed, when my father served in the Navy—he went profession. That is the key message that we need to get in as a boy sailor at the age of 14, serving in Dartmouth into every aspect of life in our country. We need to and subsequently in the second world war—he had the continue to de-stigmatise mental health issues. We need job of picking up the head of a man he was sharing a to work for earlier diagnosis and smarter commissioning cabin with and throwing it over the side, into the sea. I arrangements, and to invest in preventive measures to think that would most certainly have given me the ensure that we achieve the maximum benefit to our heebie-jeebies, I can tell you that, although it did not society—that is, a lower rate of mental illness in the seem to affect him at all. future. A number of Members have made a series of points As someone who recently endured the misery of in this debate which I fully agree with. I was going to seeing those very close to me suffer when a relative was talk a little bit about the position now, as we commemorate in and out of mental hospital, I realise that this issue is the Falklands war, 30 years on, but my hon. Friend the very painful and difficult to talk about, and I commend Member for Mole Valley (Sir Paul Beresford) has already those Members who have spoken so openly about their dealt with that. However, we have to recognise that the experiences and conditions this afternoon. families are the first people to get to know whether mental health issues are arising and how combat stress 5.50 pm affects them. We need to remember that at the time when my father ended up having to deal with these Oliver Colvile (Plymouth, Sutton and Devonport) issues, there were no mechanisms in place to look after (Con): I, too, congratulate my hon. Friends the Members his mental health or even try to take it forward. As for Loughborough (Nicky Morgan) and for Broxbourne others have said, my hon. Friend the Member for South (Mr Walker) on securing this Backbench Business debate West Wiltshire (Dr Murrison) has produced a very in the first place. Indeed, this is an historic moment, for good report, which has very much formed the basis of the simple reason that it must be the first time that three Government policy in this area. former association officers of the Battersea Conservative association have found themselves speaking in the same I ended up talking to Mind during the course of the debate. last few days. The hon. Member for Plymouth, Moor View (Alison Seabeck) and I are speaking as one, as she Sir Peter Bottomley: It won’t happen again. made the point that the amount of money devoted to mental health in Plymouth is an issue. It seems that Oliver Colvile: I am sure my hon. Friend is quite money has been taken away from mental health to be right. given to those who suffer from physical ailments. I think that we most certainly need to look at that. I have followed this issue very closely, because in my maiden speech I gave a pledge that I would try to raise Last week, during the jubilee recess, I visited the the issue of mental health for our veterans during the Glenbourne mental health unit at the Derriford hospital. course of my time in the House of Commons, however I was told that it had seen a significant rise in the short or long that might end up being. I hope very much number of people with mental health issues, especially that I have been good to my word. Only too often when from the military, and I was told how important it was we have had debates on mental health or veterans issues to ensure that something was done about it. in the House, we have found that it has been the Armed We must make sure that we adopt a proactive campaign Forces Minister answering, and although he has always so far as stress and mental illness are concerned, and done a brilliantly good job of explaining what is going that we give our support to those organisations that are on, the debate has unfortunately never had a joined-up in the business of delivering it, while also ensuring that feel about it—for instance, by including Ministers from we have trained GPs to look after people. The Jesuits the Department of Health. That is why I very much have a saying, do they not—“Give me the child until the welcome this debate. age of eight, and I will show you the man”? That was I congratulate both the hon. Member for North very much the issue that my hon. Friend the Member Durham (Mr Jones) and my hon. Friend the Member for South Northamptonshire (Andrea Leadsom) raised for Broxbourne on their sheer candour in speaking in her contribution, for which I was grateful. about this issue. If we could capture my hon. Friend’s Let me finish on a small note. We need significantly energy, we would sort out the national grid once and more joined-up government between Departments. We for all. should not be talking only about the Ministry of Defence, I recently had a Falklands veteran come to talk to me but about the Department of Health, the Ministry of about how he feels he is being discriminated against in Justice and the Department for Work and Pensions. If his benefits. That is something we most certainly need we can do that, we can make real progress. 575 Mental Health 14 JUNE 2012 576

5.56 pm The point has been made that many different treatments work and that we should respect that. I entirely take the Nicky Morgan: I am sorry that in the short time shadow Secretary of State’s point about moving the available, I will not be able to mention all of the NHS into the 21st century. His point about the physicality fantastic speeches we have heard this afternoon. We can and the separateness of our mental health trusts and definitely say that we have considered the motion fully—and buildings was a good one. I had not considered that we should all be very proud of that achievement. point before; the right hon. Gentleman was absolutely I shall make a few brief points to draw the issues of right. the debate together. First, we all agreed that the debate The hon. Member for Lewisham East (Heidi Alexander) was somewhat overdue and that it was time that mental talked about the many challenges faced by local mental health was discussed more often in the Chamber. I hope health services and those working in them, and her that we have shown the House of Commons at its best. I speech perhaps best summed them up. We have also certainly think we have; I think this is one of the best heard concerns about the work capability assessments. debates I have attended since I was elected just over two years ago. We were right to hold out for a debate in the My hon. Friend the Member for Plymouth, Sutton main Chamber, which was an important issue. and Devonport (Oliver Colvile) argued that different parts of the Government needed to work more closely Secondly, we have shown that Members of Parliament together in the sense that a number of different Ministers are not immune to mental health experiences. I would could have sat on the Front Bench to talk about this like to pay particular tribute to the speeches of the hon. issue. Member for North Durham (Mr Jones) and of my hon. Friends the Members for Broxbourne (Mr Walker), for Finally, I want to thank all the speakers, the Backbench Totnes (Dr Wollaston) and for South Northamptonshire Business Committee for securing the debate, everyone (Andrea Leadsom), who should win an award for bringing who has watched it outside and, as my hon. Friend the the name of Harry Potter into her speech. Member for Bracknell (Dr Lee) mentioned, everyone currently working within the mental health system. We have shown this afternoon why it is so important for my hon. Friend the Member for Croydon Central Question put and agreed to. (Gavin Barwell) to introduce his private Member’s Bill. Resolved, I am sure that we all wish him well with it and look That this House has considered the matter of mental health. forward to working with him on a cross-party basis— another significant achievement from today’s debate. I thank both Front-Bench teams for their support for my hon. Friend’s private Member’s Bill. BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE (19 JUNE) I think it was the Minister who said that this issue is Ordered, not about them and us; it is just about us. Mental health That, at the sitting on Tuesday 19 June the Speaker shall put affects everybody within society, and it is up to all of us the Questions necessary to dispose of proceedings on the Motion to challenge stigma. Mention was made of media leadership, in the name of Secretary Theresa May relating to immigration not later than four hours after their commencement; such Questions particularly of the campaign run by the Sunday Express. shall include the Questions on any Amendments selected by the Mention was also rightly made of the importance of Speaker which may then be moved; proceedings may continue, using the right language when we talk about mental though opposed, after the moment of interruption; and Standing health. That is certainly something that I shall take Order No. 41A (Deferred divisions) shall not apply.—(Michael away from this debate. Fabricant.) 577 14 JUNE 2012 Walsall-Rugeley Line 578 (Electrification) Walsall-Rugeley Line (Electrification) of all colours since the early 1960s—20 years before I was even born. It really is a project whose time has Motion made, and Question proposed, That this House come. do now adjourn.—(Michael Fabricant.) Mr David Winnick (Walsall North) (Lab): I must declare 6pm an interest, as not only do a good many of my constituents use the line, but I myself use the section between Mr Aidan Burley (Cannock Chase) (Con): Thank Birmingham New Street and Bloxwich North. I therefore you, Mr Deputy Speaker, for allowing a debate on the understand perfectly the position that the hon. Gentleman electrification of the Chase line, which is the line from is describing. Walsall, just outside Birmingham, to Rugeley in my This is, of course, an all-party effort, and I am sure Staffordshire constituency. that the hon. Gentleman will not wish to make any The Chase line is actually a key section of a longer party propaganda points. I certainly have no wish to do rail route running from Birmingham New Street up to so, and nor has my hon. Friend the Member for Walsall Rugeley Trent Valley, but whereas the section from South (Valerie Vaz). For the reasons that have been Birmingham New Street to Walsall is electrified—taking given, the project has all-party support. However, is it in Duddeston, Aston, Witton, Perry Bar, Hamstead, not also the case that electrification could create well Tamebridge Parkway, Bescot Stadium and Walsall—the over 1,000 jobs? As the hon. Gentleman knows, jobs are section from Walsall to Rugeley is diesel only. Hence the urgently needed in our part of the world. onward journey to Bloxwich, Bloxwich North, Landywood, Cannock, Hednesford, Rugeley Town and Rugeley Trent Mr Burley: Indeed. I believe that the exact figure is Valley is considerably slower, with poorer passenger 1,386, and that is part of the economic case that I hope service and fewer, older trains. to put to the Minister this evening. It goes without saying that this is the key rail route Since the general election, the upgrading of the Chase for my constituents. Thousands of them use the line line has been one of my key priorities. I have been daily to commute to and from work—usually in the city working closely with all the key players, including the of Birmingham—and many commute to Walsall for councils, Centro, Network Rail and London Midland, work as well. At weekends, it is the main route into the operator of the trains on the line. I have already Birmingham for shopping, leisure and social life. hosted two successful stakeholder meetings, bringing Birmingham is the second city of this country, and fast, together all the key players to discuss how we can frequent and reliable services to and from that vital proceed with the development of the line. economic hub are essential to the economic growth of It is fair to say that there has been massive historical towns such as Cannock, Hednesford and Rugeley, just frustration as to why this line has not been electrified at 15 miles away. some point in the past 20 years, and why the scheme Let me take this opportunity to pay tribute to Keith is still not included as a named scheme for control Fitch and the members of the Cannock Chase rail period 5—CP5—as part of the high-level output statement, promotion group, who have campaigned tirelessly over or HLOS, due to be published by the Department in many years for the reintroduction and, now, for the July this year. I am aware that reference was made to development of passenger services on the Chase line. I Rugeley-Walsall electrification in the initial industry also thank John Morgan, the principal planning officer plan in September 2011, but only as a “candidate scheme” at Cannock Chase district council, who is responsible rather than as a commitment. That was extremely for the railways and is a long-time campaigner for the disappointing as we had hoped that the strategic importance electrification of the Chase line. It is a cliché nowadays of the project would have been recognised and there to say that people have worked tirelessly for a cause, but would have been a firm commitment in the Government’s the work that John has done over the years with successive HLOS announcement for CP5. council administrations and Members of Parliament I am pleased, however, that since the election we have has been far above and beyond the call of duty. It can managed to persuade Network Rail to fund the west really only be described as a labour of love, stemming midlands line speed improvement scheme for the Chase from his passion for the railways. John is watching in line. This speed upgrade from 45 mph to 75 mph, the Gallery tonight. After some 35 years of commitment announced in the Chancellor’s autumn statement, will to the railways and the electrification of the Chase line, not only help support our efforts to bring business to it would be a fitting end to his career for him to see his the area, but it will reinforce the message that Cannock goal finally realised. Chase is the place to come to in south Staffordshire. However, Network Rail has not set any time scale for Gavin Williamson (South Staffordshire) (Con): I the line speed upgrade, and it may not happen until congratulate my hon. Friend on securing the debate. after the current Walsall to Rugeley re-signalling programme Does he agree that people have been campaigning for is completed. Options are being drawn up over the next the electrification of the Chase line because they know six months, but the funding does not have to be spent that it will bring massive economic benefits to his until March 2014. This means it could take a further constituency as well as mine and many others? two years before my constituents see any improvements. The line speed improvement is, however, only a sticking Mr Burley: The short answer is absolutely, and I shall plaster on the wound; the real fix that has long been say more about that later. One of the startling facts that needed is the electrification of the Chase line itself, and I discovered when researching for my speech was that I would like to take this opportunity to explain to the the electrification of the line has been a project for Minister why that is the case. Over recent years, the various council administrations and Members of Parliament Rugeley-Cannock-Walsall-Birmingham line—the Chase 579 Walsall-Rugeley Line 14 JUNE 2012 Walsall-Rugeley Line 580 (Electrification) (Electrification) [Mr Burley] Although Centro and other local stakeholders feel that the west midlands and Chilterns route utilisation line—has continued to go from strength to strength. strategy process did not consider the case for electrifying Increased passenger growth of 10% per annum or more the route as effectively as it could have, recent work by has been achieved in recent years. Over half a million Network Rail demonstrates that the electrification scheme passenger journeys a year are now made just from the has a positive business case and a benefit-cost ratio of three stations in my constituency. The Chase line now 1.2, even without the inclusion of the wider strategic has the second highest levels of passenger growth in the benefits that will arise from creating an alternative Centro area. Yet despite that, the route has seen a electrified rail connection between the west midlands reduction in services and shorter trains, most recently and the west coast main line, which links the region to last December through the service level commitment the north-west and Scotland. changes, as a direct result of a shortage of diesel trains. The Minister may not be aware that recent work That is because the Chase line is the only Centro route undertaken by KPMG for Centro has also identified operating out of Birmingham New Street where diesel significant further regional economic benefits from the trains have to operate. That has resulted in an inefficient electrification of this route, which, again, are not included mix of diesel and electric services between Birmingham in Network Rail’s business case. KPMG’s analysis indicated and Walsall, in order for diesel trains to operate north that electrification would generate an additional £113 million of Walsall on the non-electrified section to Rugeley. of gross value added benefit per annum and support the Therefore, in spite of having one of the highest annual creation of 1,370 additional jobs, as has been mentioned. passenger growth figures in the west midlands, passenger That is why Centro and others locally are so passionate services on the route had to be reduced from December about seeing the Government confirm the Walsall to 2011 as a direct result of it not being possible to operate Rugeley electrification as a high priority scheme for the whole Birmingham-Walsall-Rugeley service with 2014 to 2019 in the Secretary of State’s forthcoming electric trains and the need to transfer scarce diesel high-level output statement on rail investment. That is rolling stock to provide capacity on other routes. also why both Centro and the West Midlands Regional The situation is predicted to get even worse. From Rail Forum have now identified the scheme as the No.1 2013, the Chase line will have the lowest service frequency electrification priority for the whole of the west midlands of any suburban route radiating from Birmingham and region. yet still have one of the highest passenger growths. So I say to the Minister that we urgently need to address this Valerie Vaz (Walsall South) (Lab): I congratulate the contradiction of passenger growth and reduced services, hon. Gentleman on securing this debate. It may seem to and the only solution is the electrification of the Chase be a bit geeky and for train-spotters, but this subject is line. That must be included in CP5. very important for our constituents. I am pleased that Walsall is not being ignored, because it usually is. Will Mr Winnick: On the point about last December’s he say whether any of this is part of the High Speed 2 reduction in service, many of my constituents have bid? Will we be able to have a bit of slippage in that bid pointed out to me that people took to the roads instead. in order to see this scheme come to fruition? There is already a lot of congestion on the roads from Birmingham to my constituency and that of the hon. Mr Burley: I thank the hon. Lady for her intervention, Gentleman, and it would get even worse. and I will come on to deal with HS2 and the way it connects up a little later in my speech, when I believe I Mr Burley: As the hon. Gentleman will be aware, the will address her question. I also thank her for signing railways have undergone a renaissance in recent times the letter to the Secretary of State, which I should also and it seems perverse that at a time when more and mention, from just about all the MPs along the line in more people wish to use the railways we are in effect support of the scheme; as has been said, this is a forcing them on to roads that are already heavily congested. cross-party effort, as we all want to see this happen. I am sure that, like me, the hon. Gentleman is a regular driver on the M6 and surrounding roads, so he will Although Centro and other regional stakeholders know that traffic congestion is a major problem on strongly support the electrification of the Walsall to them. We need more people on the trains, not fewer. It is Rugeley route, the train operator, London Midland, therefore perverse to force them on to the wrong mode also believes that electrification would deliver ongoing of transport. operational cost savings, improved journey times and reduced crowding. Electrification work will make it Mr Winnick: I rely entirely on public transport. easier to create a larger loading gauge, allowing the increasingly common W10 containers to be transported. Mr Burley: Excellent. In the longer term, electrification could allow services Given the history of this scheme, it is astonishing that such as the Birmingham to Liverpool service to run via this small 15-mile section of track has not already been Walsall, significantly improving Walsall’s connectivity electrified. The scheme originally had a high-profile to Stafford and the north-west, and giving new commercial inclusion in the former Railtrack network management opportunities to serve a town that is now larger than statement in 1999, including a detailed pre-feasibility Wolverhampton, as I learnt yesterday. study showing it was deliverable. It was again identified The Minister will be aware that the electrification in Network Rail’s electrification strategy 2009, and in strategy as part of the network route utilisation strategy its west midlands route utilisation strategy in 2011, as a identified the following gaps as driving whether a route scheme that should be fully considered in more detail as should be considered for electrification: part of the west midlands and Chilterns route utilisation “Type A—Electrification to enable efficient operation of passenger strategy. services…Type B—Electrification to enable efficient operation of 581 Walsall-Rugeley Line 14 JUNE 2012 Walsall-Rugeley Line 582 (Electrification) (Electrification) freight services…Type C— Electrification to increase the availability by 20 key stakeholders, including the chairs of the of diversionary routes…Type D—Electrification to enable new Greater Birmingham and , Black Country and patterns of service to operate”. Staffordshire, and Stoke local enterprise partnerships, The Minister can take comfort that the Walsall to the leaders of all the metropolitan, county and district Rugeley line electrification would cover all those gap local authorities on the route, private sector business types. leaders, the chamber of commerce and six MPs with The Minister will also be aware that Network Rail constituencies along the route, some of whom are in has identified a number of criteria to be considered their places tonight, all giving their unequivocal support when looking at whether to develop a project for CP5. for Walsall to Rugeley Chase line electrification. As can Again, we in the west midlands strongly believe that all be seen from the number of MPs from both sides of the these criteria, as set down by Network Rail, are met. House who signed the letter to the Secretary of State Tonight, I just want to highlight three key criteria, the and who are here tonight, this scheme has the support first of which is affordability. Railtrack commissioned of the region. Atkins in 1999 to undertake a pre-feasibility study into The scheme has the strong support of my hon. Friend the electrification of the route, and, with the exception the Member for Lichfield (Michael Fabricant), who has of clearance issues in the Walsall station area, the route already written to the Minister about this matter but appears to be straightforward to electrify. It must be cannot take part in this debate because he is a Whip, remembered that the line was earmarked for electrification even though he is sitting in front of me on the Treasury in the 1960s as part of the west coast electrification Bench tonight. It also has the strong support of my scheme, and that all the bridges and other structures hon. Friend the Member for Stafford (Jeremy Lefroy), were rebuilt with electrification clearances. Atkins assessed who has publically given his firm support, saying: the cost of electrification as approximately £32.6 million, “Electrification of this line is a vital, not simply for local and plus an extra £6 million to achieve W10 gauge clearance. regional transport, but for the national network as it provides However, it is worth noting that the recent work by alternative routes for electric only trains.” Centro reduces that to just £30 million, or £1 million It also has the support my hon. Friend the Member for per mile of track—15 miles in each direction. Aldershot (Mr Howarth), who was the former Member The second criterion I want to draw to the Minister’s for Cannock and Burntwood and is now the Under- attention is value for money. There should be a financially Secretary of State for Defence, He cannot speak in the positive benefit-cost ratio of more than two. We believe debate as he is a Defence Minister, but he wanted me to that the multiple benefits that the route drives have inform the house that when he was the Member for already resulted in a positive BCR of 1.2. That will be Cannock and Burntwood in 1983 to 1992, he tried to further enhanced by the KPMG work, which will push get the line to be upgraded, saying then: it over 2. Network Rail’s business case assessment is “It would provide an invaluable alternative for occasions when narrowly defined and has been superseded by the Centro- the West Coast mainline between Rugeley and Birmingham commissioned KPMG work that takes into account the International is out of action for repairs.” wider benefits such as job creation and economic It is even supported by the Government Chief Whip, development. As has been mentioned, it would mean himself a user of the Chase line in his former life as a more than 1,300 new jobs and a gross value added of councillor on Cannock Chase district council and as £113 million, which are not reflected in Network Rail’s a coal miner in my own constituency. It also has the more tightly defined business case, which still gives a cross-party support of all the MPs along the route, positive BCR. We therefore urge the Minister to take including the hon. Members for Walsall South (Valerie that into account as part of her decision process for Vaz) and for Walsall North (Mr Winnick) and my named schemes in CP5 as part of the HLOS next hon. Friends the Members for Aldridge-Brownhills month. This is a capital scheme that will trigger economic (Mr Shepherd), for South Staffordshire (Gavin Williamson), development and job creation across the west midlands. for Stafford and for Lichfield. The third criterion for Network Rail that I want to I know that the Minister, quite rightly, will not be draw to the Minister’s attention is the extent to which persuaded simply by pleas from MPs. I am aware that economic growth is driven. As I hope we are showing such schemes require more than just special pleading; tonight, the service improvements arising from the scheme they require cold hard facts and benefit-cost ratios, and would drive significant economic growth in the Walsall that is what I have tried to convey to the Minister and Cannock areas, which are badly affected by the tonight. As I have said, recent work by Network Rail economic downturn. The freed-up capacity elsewhere this year has already established that this £30 million on the network would also support wider economic scheme has a positive business case with a BCR of 1.2 growth in the west midlands. There would also be the and the further research by KPMG commissioned by ability to redeploy diesel capacity on the busy Snow Hill Centro shows that that can easily increase to more than network, which would help the economy of Birmingham 2 when the wider economic benefits are taken into city centre to develop further. Without the electrification account. An investment of £30 million will give the west the current service on the line could worsen, leading to midlands a regional gross value added benefit of economic growth constraint. £113 million and the regional employment impact will I believe the scheme meets all the key criteria for create nearly 1,400 jobs. That seems like a good return electrification set down by Network Rail and that is to me and one that meets the Network Rail investment why all our local stakeholders believe that Walsall to criteria. Rugeley electrification strongly meets Network Rail’s I am conscious that this bid would be in competition criteria for CP5 named schemes for 2014 to 2019. As a with other bids for electrification and must therefore be result of all this, on 18 May I sent a letter to my right competitive. Before this debate, I listened to a recent hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Transport signed Adjournment debate secured by my hon. Friend the 583 Walsall-Rugeley Line 14 JUNE 2012 Walsall-Rugeley Line 584 (Electrification) (Electrification) [Mr Burley] promotion group. Like my hon. Friend the Member for Cannock Chase, I think it is right to single out for Member for Loughborough (Nicky Morgan) to ask for praise John Morgan of Cannock Chase district council. electrification of the midland main line at a capital cost As we have heard from my hon. Friend, Mr Morgan’s of a rather whopping £530 million, with more than 50 knowledge of the Chase line is unsurpassed. I am told bridges needing to be rebuilt. The Minister, who is also that he has shown huge dedication over many years in replying to this debate, said then that seeking the upgrade he wants to see. “we will need to strike a balance” Subject to affordability, the Government support the between different types of project and that what gets progressive electrification of the rail network as a way funding depends on a of reducing the cost of running the railways, improving “fair assessment of competing priorities elsewhere on the rail services for passengers and reducing carbon emissions network.”—[Official Report, 16 April 2012; Vol. 543, c. 148-49.] from transport. Electric trains are more reliable, quieter Given that this project would cost only £30 million and and more comfortable than their diesel equivalents. would need only two bridges to be slightly modified, I They are also better for the environment and cheaper to hope the Minister can recognise it as an easy win—a operate. The Government believe it is essential that the piece of low-hanging fruit that she can grasp. It is one cost of running the railways should come down. In of those different types of project that should be considered March we published plans for achieving major efficiency on its own merits next to the big boys. savings in our Command Paper. We believe that further electrification can assist us in delivering our goal of a In conclusion, if ever there were a time for this more efficient rail network. That is one reason why we scheme to be delivered by the “greenest Government are going ahead with significant electrification programmes ever”, it is now. It has been in the planning stage since in the north-west and on the great western line. the early 1960s—20 years before I was born—and it has been pursued by former MPs for Cannock Chase of We accept that there is a positive business case for both political colours as well as by local councils and proposals to extend electrification on the Chase line. I regional authorities. The local enterprise partnerships also note the strong local support and the long-running see it as essential to the commercial interests along the nature of the campaign, as well as the regional support routes. They also think it essential to connecting the that has been outlined by my hon. Friend the Member benefits of HS2 to the area and driving job creation and for Cannock Chase. I agree with him that considerable economic growth. KPMG’s analysis has demonstrated benefits could be delivered if it were possible to fund that this electrification and consequent passenger service electrification of the line. That would allow more energy- improvements would dramatically improve accessibility efficient electric services to operate and would remove to labour and goods markets, stimulating economic the existing inefficient and resource-intensive mix of growth and job creation and increasing productivity for diesel and electric services between Walsall and the west midlands as a whole. Birmingham. That could reduce the cost of running the service, which is always an important factor. An added The electrification of this 15-mile strategic missing advantage would be the release of the diesel rolling stock link in the electrified rail network of the west midlands used between Birmingham and Rugeley Trent Valley for would create an alternative route to the north-west for use elsewhere on the network. Electrifying the Chase passenger and freight services, relieving the existing line could also provide wider economic benefits, as my congested Birmingham to Stafford main line, so this is hon. Friend rightly identified—for example, by broadening not just a local rail scheme. It would offer regional and access to labour and goods markets, and by boosting national benefits, but it is essential, if those benefits are productivity and job creation in the area. to be realised, that these outputs form a key part of the A key factor in considering the case for the further Government’s July announcement on the high-level output electrification that my hon. Friend wants is the fact that specification. I therefore ask the Minister to reflect the Chase line is an entry point for trains to the nation’s positively on the strong business case for this project. second city. In recent years the line has become an When she does, I hope she will reach the same conclusion increasingly important commuter service in and out of as we have—that the electrification of the Walsall to Birmingham. The electrification between Walsall and Rugeley Chase line should be included as a named Rugeley could therefore be a way to strengthen peak scheme for CP5 as part of the high-level output specification capacity into Birmingham. Currently, as we have heard, due to be published by her Department next month. the only electrified route from the west coast main line to Birmingham from the north is the Wolverhampton 6.22 pm line. Electrification of the Chase line could offer a The Minister of State, Department for Transport second electric route via Walsall from those destinations (Mrs Theresa Villiers): I congratulate my hon. Friend in the north. the Member for Cannock Chase (Mr Burley) on securing That provides an opportunity for the development of this debate on such an important issue. It is very timely services through Birmingham, Walsall, Stoke-on-Trent, because decisions on the Government’s high-level output Crewe, Liverpool and elsewhere in the north. It would specification are imminent. I have been impressed by deliver an electric diversionary route from the west the determination of the coalition of different organisations midlands to the north for passenger services from campaigning for full electrification of the Chase line, Birmingham New Street and for freight services, relieving and I pay tribute to the work of my hon. Friend, who the line through Wolverhampton. As well as improving has this evening put the case for that improvement to local and regional services, electrification could have a the House with passion, clarity and detail. I also note strategic national value. the support of my hon. Friend the Member for Lichfield The benefits of electrification could be considerable (Michael Fabricant), who is in his place, and the work and I am clear that this project is a serious contender done by many others, such as the Cannock Chase rail for funding. The Government are considering how much 585 Walsall-Rugeley Line 14 JUNE 2012 Walsall-Rugeley Line 586 (Electrification) (Electrification) funding will be available for rail investment in the Mrs Villiers: I welcome the hon. Gentleman’s restatement five-year CP5 period up to 2019 and how it should be and, yes, I am very much aware of that. allocated between competing priorities. We will announce We recognise that there is a business case for a our decisions on the HLOS 2—high-level output number of the schemes identified in the industry plan specification 2—statement by the end of July. The case that are supported by Centro, including greater peak for electrification of the Chase line will be considered as capacity into Birmingham and extra capacity between part of that process. I shall ensure that the deliberations Birmingham and Tamworth and in the Worcester area. and points made in this debate are fed into that process. Whether we can give the go-ahead to Chase line The project has been chosen by Centro and the west electrification and Centro’s other aspirations depends midlands regional rail forum as their No. 1 electrification on what is affordable within available budgets. We also priority for the west midlands, and it is supported by have to weigh up competing priorities elsewhere on the the business community and the local enterprise partnership. rail network. Decisions on HLOS 2 have not yet been That local support is something that we shall take into taken, but this debate will provide very useful input into account in our forthcoming decisions on what can go the Government’s thinking on this important matter. It into the next HLOS. As we have heard, reference is is worth remembering that Chase line passengers are in made to the project in Network Rail’s initial industry line to receive improved services with a £5.4 million plan, which sets out the options for funding in CP5. I package of improvements announced by Network Rail note my hon. Friend’s concerns about the approach to in 2011 to increase line speed on the Chase line from the scheme by Network Rail in the industry plan but, 45 mph to 75 mph, reducing journey times for passengers like him, I am pleased that additional work has been travelling from all stations on the line. undertaken since the plan’s publication further to develop We fully understand that the aspiration is to go the business case and respond to comments from further, and we recognise the strength of support for stakeholders in the west midlands and achieve a clearer electrification, which is something that we will consider understanding of the underlying evidence and facts on with great seriousness in the weeks between this debate what electrification would mean and what it would cost. and the announcement that we shall make in the summer on which projects can receive funding in the CP5 control period between 2014 and 2019. Mr Winnick: The Minister mentioned stakeholders. Question put and agreed to. I am sure she will bear in mind the point that I made earlier that this has the support of all the Members of Parliament, and there is absolutely no political controversy 6.30 pm whatsoever. House adjourned.

143WH 14 JUNE 2012 Piracy (Somalia) 144WH

Jim Sheridan (in the Chair): Unfortunately, I am Westminster Hall advised that we have to keep going. I can only apologise. Richard Ottaway: Thank you for addressing the point, Thursday 14 June 2012 Mr Sheridan. The tenth report of the Foreign Affairs Committee is about piracy off the coast of Somalia, a major problem [JIM SHERIDAN in the Chair] that costs industry and the world economy billions of dollars and threatens lives. The Indian ocean has become Piracy (Somalia) a no-go area for small vessels and is dangerous for large [Relevant documents: Piracy off the coast of Somalia, ones. The causes of the problem are many. First, at the Tenth Report from the Foreign Affairs Committee, Session heart of it is the fact that, despite the introduction of 2010-12, HC 1318, and the Government Response, Cm 8324.] military forces and private armed guards, still the majority of vessels are unarmed. Secondly, there is a willingness Motion made and Question proposed, That the sitting to pay ransoms—a controversial point to which I will be now adjourned.—(James Duddridge.) return. Thirdly, there are too few naval forces. Fourthly, the pirates are able to operate with relative impunity 2.30 pm inside Somalia. Richard Ottaway (Croydon South) (Con): I welcome The United Kingdom Government are well aware of the Under-Secretary of State for Foreign and the problem and are taking a leading role and, although Commonwealth Affairs, the hon. Member for North the Committee makes constructive criticisms of that West Norfolk (Mr Bellingham), who has been dragged role, we congratulate them on the steps that they are back at short notice, for reasons beyond his control, but taking. Concerted international action is needed. The it is to the benefit of the House that he is here today. number of prosecutions has increased, but 90% of May I raise a point of order, Mr Sheridan? This is a those detained are released. There is greater use of debate on the report of the Foreign Affairs Committee, armed guards and we have regulation and guidance for which I chair, about piracy off the coast of Somalia. armed guards. Vessels have been following best management One of the key recommendations was that the guidance practices. There are issues to do with tracing financial for the use of private armed guards on British ships be flows: the Committee’s opinion is that financial flows revised. In its response, the Foreign Office said that the can be tracked—some of the most sophisticated equipment guidance would be coming out in April. Then we were for that purpose is available in this country—and that advised that it was coming out in May. I have no quarrel more can be done in this regard. The Committee believes about that, because it is important to get it right. I was that there should be at least one UK vessel permanently informed at 2.25 pm today that the guidance was published on station. Of course, we have to support development at 11 am this morning and we do not have copies of it. in Somalia. I shall deal with those points in turn. We have not seen it. No effort was made to get it to us at The UK is a big player in the world shipping industry, 11 am. Would it be appropriate to adjourn for 10 minutes and our part of it is based just a mile or two up the road while the guidance is made available, so that we can from here. Shipping and its management comprises have a quick look at it? 1.8% of gross domestic product. Piracy poses a threat to the UK’s economy and the security of British assets Jim Sheridan (in the Chair): Unfortunately, we have transiting through the area. Some 40% of world trade to proceed with the business of the House. It is extremely moves through the region of the Indian ocean, around discourteous of the Department to treat the Select the Horn of Africa, into the Red sea. The danger zone Committee as it has done and I am sure that the now stretches over to the coast of the Indian ocean. appropriate people will be aware of exactly what has Much of the cargo is insured here in the UK. The total happened. However, I am unclear how that can be cost of addressing the threat to Britain, the assets and remedied at this late stage. Does the Minister wish to the industry is believed to be in the region of $8 billion say something? to $12 billion per annum. Attacks on vessels in the Indian ocean have decreased The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Transport in the last quarter. In the first quarter of 2011 there (Mike Penning): I am the Minister responsible for the were 102 attacks, 16 of them successful, whereas this guidance, although it is not my debate. Clearance was year there were only 43 attacks and only nine were delivered to us only this morning from the Ministry of successful. That downward trend is welcome. To give an Justice, and I published it as soon as possible. I apologise idea of the sums involved, in 2011, ransoms amounted to the Chairman of the Committee because he was not to $135 million. The opinion of some observers and given a copy of it. The Chairman is correct: the guidance witnesses who gave evidence to the Committee was that has to be right, which is why we have published it today. some of that money is going to al-Shabaab, which it is Copies will be here for Committee members before the believed has connections with al-Qaeda. end of the debate. Since piracy started in the region, some 3,500 crew Jim Sheridan (in the Chair): Will the absence of the members and officers have been taken captive and been information impact in any way on the debate? held, and in the last four years 62 have been killed. Currently, 12 vessels are held and 178 hostages are still Richard Ottaway: I appreciate the Minister’s explanation. in captivity. That the figure is lower than it was reflects a I gather that the delay was due to the need for clearance welcome trend, but it is important to state that the level by another Department. However, a large section of my of detention remains unacceptable. It must not be believed speech relating to this matter and posing questions is that we have been successful and this situation must not now, frankly, academic. become the status quo. 145WH Piracy (Somalia)14 JUNE 2012 Piracy (Somalia) 146WH

[Richard Ottaway] In the Government response, as I pointed out in my point of order, clarification was promised by April The peak from which we are coming down was 2012, which then became May, then June. I have no idea reached in autumn 2011. I think the reason why the why there was a delay, but I like to think that it was trend is now downward is that the self-defence mechanisms because international co-ordination and consultation are beginning to make progress. The implementation of with the IMO were necessary. Indeed, earlier this year, best management practices is clearly having a serious at the invitation of the Department for Transport, I effect. It is too soon to see if this is a long-term trend, attended a particularly constructive piracy conference but it is promising. For the benefit of the House, I at the IMO. What is important, however, is that the UK should say that best management practices involve self- plays a leading role in the establishment of any guidance, protecting measures, including careful manoeuvring of and that is why I regret the new guidance not being ships, having safe rooms on ships and using detection available for us to see, because we cannot really comment. equipment. I commend the industry on the implementation We are in limbo—the guidance is out but we are unable of these practices, as does the Committee, and on the to comment on it today. The UK should be playing a results that this is achieving. leading role, but the issue is current. I want to ask the Government whether they have been happy with the use Mr John Spellar (Warley) (Lab): Does not this highlight of armed guards on ships from implementation up a further problem, which is that it is not so much the to now. How many applications have been received to cargo or the vessel but the crew that is the main financial establish armed guards on board a ship? inducement? All the measures the hon. Gentleman has The House might be interested to know about the mentioned apply to the large multinational, well organised Italian ship Enrique Lexie, which was carrying two modern fleets, but many smaller operators with smaller Italian marines on board. Though the facts are in vessels are becoming more vulnerable. Those measures, dispute, there was an exchange of armed fire with small welcome though they are, can therefore only be regarded vessels and two fishermen were killed. For reasons that as part of a package, because they deal with only part of are not clear, the Italian vessel then went into an Indian the problem. port and the marines were arrested amid a dispute about whether the incident took place in international Richard Ottaway: The right hon. Gentleman is absolutely or territorial waters. The matter is unresolved, but the right. For small vessels the region is, in truth, a complete incident highlights the importance of the need for clear no-go area. For the piracy of the 17th and 18th centuries, guidance and international agreement on the use of the prize was the cargo, and the crew walked the plank force. or went over the sides, but that has changed; now, the We can see how easily diplomatic incidents can occur crew are equally valuable. That attitude of the pirates is in the absence of proper guidance or internationally causing the problem. That is not to say that the cargo is agreed standards. That is mainly because so many factors not still important—shipowners are paying substantial are involved in international waters, such as a British sums to get their cargo out—but as we see particularly ship with a foreign crew going into another country’s when yacht crews are held, in international terms the waters; several jurisdictions are in play. I was interested yacht is worth nothing while the owners still have a high to read that the IMO has called for an international value. standard for the use of armed guards, so I shall read the The Government initially resisted the establishment newly published guidance with interest to see whether of private armed security guards on board British vessels. such a standard has been established. I hope that a When the Minister gave evidence to us during our Minister might be able to summarise the guidance when inquiry, the Government’s position was that armed he makes his contribution to the debate. guards would not be welcome. However, the Prime Minister announced in October or November last year Jim Sheridan (in the Chair): Order. I have every that we will now put armed security guards on board sympathy with the hon. Gentleman and his predicament, British vessels, and that view is echoed by the International but I am reliably informed that document is winging its Maritime Organisation. The Committee welcomes the way towards us and should reach us in the next 10 minutes U-turn. or so. At the end of the debate, he will certainly have the The operation of a private armed guard on board a opportunity to sum up, by which time he might have British vessel is subject to British law—the law of the had a chance to read the document, as will other flag applies on board any vessel. The Government Members. I am sure that my co-Chair will be sympathetic published interim guidance, at the heart of which was a to his position as well. policy based on the Crown Prosecution Service policy of lawful self-defence. We were critical of that, because Richard Ottaway: That is very helpful, Mr Sheridan, the CPS guidance was not written with piracy in mind. and I am grateful to all those involved in expediting the Indeed, it states: availability of the guidance. “If a…firearm…was used…this may tip the balance in favour To conclude on armed guards, I hope that UK rules of prosecution.” can influence the international debate, to the benefit of To me and to the Committee, that seemed to be off-loading everyone concerned. responsibility for the use of armed guards on to shipowners. Another issue that we identified is that there are no The simple question we posed in our report was: if regulations on the movement of weapons, and in that armed guards on board a ship see an armed skiff part of the world, a lot of weapons are moving around. approaching, can they open fire? That is the test. The We clearly need to have a regime for such movements, initial interim guidance contained little to help make a and I welcome the UK’s introduction of a revised judgment on the use of force. licensing regime in February this year, although that 147WH Piracy (Somalia)14 JUNE 2012 Piracy (Somalia) 148WH does not tackle the difficulty of floating armouries. Richard Ottaway: I cannot go to our precise conclusion Believe it or not, some ships out there will lend guns to quickly, but we believe that it would be a good idea if ships that enter the danger zone and get them back there were prosecutions in this country, if only to when they leave. All that is outside the control of any demonstrate that we mean business. The important organisation, and an international approach to that thing is that there are prosecutions, and if a memorandum difficulty would be appropriate. of understanding is working effectively, it is a pragmatic The naval response has been better than expected— solution. possibly damned with faint praise—but the truth of the Turning to ransoms, I said earlier that $135 million matter is that the Indian ocean is not safe, and to have a was paid last year, and in our judgment the Government 30-minute response throughout the ocean would require have been slow to track the flow of money. It might be the deployment of 80 warships at any given moment, an effective means of countering piracy if the flow of which will clearly not happen. The strategic defence money were tracked. An international taskforce on review under way in this country can only heighten the ransoms has been established recently, but it is controversial impact on the availability of British ships for deployment, because it attempts to prevent payment of ransoms. It is but the UK could have a role to play in providing worth noting that the Chamber of Shipping has expressed leadership in operations—we have a good record—perhaps concern that the international policy and that of the with other countries supplying the ships. As reported by UK is to try to prevent the payment of ransoms. the Ministry of Defence, however, last month HMS Westminster foiled three attacks. Can one of the Ministers The Foreign Affairs Committee is worried about present tell us what happened to the suspects from those that. In our view, the only way to recover vessels is to incidents? Were they detained, released or fended off pay ransoms, which is particularly appropriate when with no detentions? As I understand it, there have the use of force is ruled out. In all honesty, there is no certainly been no prosecutions. other way for shipowners to recover their property. The position can be likened to a mugging of a man in the What is needed is international co-ordination. We street. If he were subject to a violent attack, no one have the successful UN contact group on piracy and would tell him not to pay anything because it will only recently—established in February this year—the Regional encourage more muggers. I invite the Government to Anti-Piracy Prosecutions Intelligence Co-ordination Centre take a hard look at the matter and to say whether in the Seychelles. The centre has to be welcome. It will Government policy is unchanged. co-ordinate information on ransoms and target the kingpins in the piracy world. British hostages have been taken as victims of piracy, On the naval response, one of the unexpected side and the Committee welcomes the release of Judith effects is how the international operations have been Tebbutt. We did not refer to her in our report because getting on quite well with one another. We considered a she was still in captivity while we were drafting it, and recommendation on whether they should be co-ordinated we concluded that it would be too sensitive to comment. by a single organisation, but we reached the conclusion We are delighted that she has been released. We understand that there were bigger fish to fry, rather than having that that there are prosecutions in Kenya and that a ransom sort of upheaval at the moment. We have Russian, was paid. I would be interested to know from a Minister Chinese, Indian, British and NATO ships there, and whether that payment was tracked and whether a given the lack of a big umbrella organisation, the close prosecution is expected. We also took evidence from the co-ordination is very welcome. Chandlers, and we are delighted to hear that only last week they set off to continue their voyage around the Turning to convictions, it is difficult to obtain evidence world, but I am reliably informed that they will avoid in such situations. Our Committee recommended that the Indian ocean. more effort should be made, perhaps with the use of video links for witnesses. There are difficulties with At heart, the solution to the problem lies not offshore, various national laws because piracy is a crime in some but onshore in Somalia. There is no easy solution for countries but not others. Implementing such proposals that troubled country. African Union troops are clearly can be expensive for poorer countries. making progress. We have had two excellent conferences To date, no suspect has been brought back to the UK on Somalia. One was here in the United Kingdom in for prosecution. We have transfer agreements with Kenya February, which I believe is producing results, and I and the Seychelles, and I welcome the new agreement congratulate the Foreign Office on putting it on. The with Mauritius, as I hope that it will result in more other was in May in Istanbul, Turkey, at which I gather prosecutions of suspects. Will the Minister who responds serious progress was made. The Department for on the memorandum of understanding with Mauritius International Development is putting in £83 million, of indicate the conditions that suspects are held in and which £6 million will go on counter-piracy. whether that is monitored. I wish the Government well We treat the subject very seriously. Our report is with implementation of the memorandum of important. understanding, which sounds to our Committee to be a pragmatic solution. However, if it fails, I hope that the Minister involved will note that the French are now Jim Fitzpatrick (Poplar and Limehouse) (Lab): I engaged in their second trial of suspects. apologise for not having had the chance to read the Select Committee’s report, but I look forward to doing Mr Spellar: Will the hon. Gentleman, and later a so. I take it that the hon. Gentleman did not have an Minister, clarify the position on bringing captured pirates opportunity during the Committee’s examination of back to the UK for trial, given the real risk of applications the evidence to speak to welfare organisations such as for leave to remain? Is it not better—this is why the the Mission to Seafarers and Apostleship of the Sea, Mauritius agreement is so welcome—to support efforts which have dealt with some of the hostages before, in the region? during and afterwards. 149WH Piracy (Somalia)14 JUNE 2012 Piracy (Somalia) 150WH

Richard Ottaway: The hon. Gentleman will be pleased People are held in Somalia, having been captured off to see that we took written evidence from seafarers, and the coast. For example, MV Iceberg 1 is still being held; we quote some of it in our report. two people are dead and others have been held for more In conclusion, I look forward to hearing how colleagues than 800 days. We know that the longer it takes to get a view this difficult subject. ransom paid the longer people are held in captivity, and that when a ransom is paid, they are likely to be released. Few UK citizens have been affected. 2.56 pm Martin Horwood (Cheltenham) (LD): The hon. Eric Joyce (Falkirk) (Ind): I commend the hon. Member Gentleman goes to the heart of the knotty moral problem for Croydon South (Richard Ottaway) on his excellent of paying ransoms. Is not the problem that although report. I am not a member of the Committee, and I will paying a ransom may well save the life of an employee not detain the Chamber for long, but I was interested in or a loved one, it encourages the taking of hostages and the recommendation in paragraph 27 of the Government’s the risking of other people’s lives? Indeed, it pays for response: that to be facilitated. Surely we must encourage shipping “We conclude that the Government should not pay or assist in companies, and others, to take a firm stand against the the payment of ransoms but”— payment of ransoms. crucially— Eric Joyce: The hon. Gentleman describes the point “nor should it make it more difficult for companies to secure the safe release of their crew by criminalising the payment of ransoms.” that we all regard as central to the question. Paying ransoms may encourage pirates, but my instinct is that As the hon. Gentleman said, the Chamber of Shipping pirates in Somalia are looking not at the policies of sent a strong briefing to hon. Members here and elsewhere. international Governments but at the fact that it is There are many acronyms, concepts and ideas involved possible to get a ransom payment. I greatly doubt that in the debate about using armed guards, the payment of Governments across the world will agree not to facilitate ransoms and so on, and there have been recent examples ransom payments. Indeed, I can list—we all can—the of people being taken captive for a ransom elsewhere in Governments who are highly likely to encourage the the world on land and at sea. It is self-evident that if facilitation of ransom payments. Therefore, if we say someone demands a large amount of money for a loved that we will discourage such payments, British citizens one, and that they will be killed or executed if it is not will be affected but no one else. It is true that the UK paid, everyone would want to avoid that. has considerable influence because of its importance in The taskforce’s general direction of travel on ransoms, the maritime industry and the presence in the UK of announced on 31 May, was to reduce or constrain the International Maritime Organisation, but it is highly payment—although I may be wrong, and a Minister unlikely that other countries would agree not to pay may correct me. It is most unlikely that anyone could ransoms. convince foreign Governments not to pay, and not to If there was a billionaire whose daughter had been assist or facilitate payment. Indeed, there are examples captured and was about to be shot, and there was a of foreign Governments—it is probably best not to say £2 million ransom, would they pay it or would they say, which ones—possibly making payments, and certainly “No, I don’t think I will because it’s just going to of Governments facilitating payments. Even if the UK encourage others.”? Of course they would pay it. If obtained agreement from some members of the taskforce, people are discouraged from taking up kidnap and it is most unlikely that the payment of ransoms would ransom insurance, the risk is that we will end up with stop. Pirates would still be attacking ships and taking only rich people being able to secure their safety. We people hostage. They would not be taking people hostage know of one or two cases, including that of Judith on the basis that their country was one that would Tebbutt who luckily was able to secure a large amount facilitate a ransom payment. The risk is that we could of money—$1 million—to secure her freedom. If no end up with a two-tier situation, and some people kidnap and ransom insurance is paid, other employees would be released eventually. As the hon. Gentleman will be at considerable risk of exposure. said, Judith Tebbutt was released after payment of a The case of Khalil Dale in Pakistan is relevant, if $1 million ransom, and it was reported that someone, perhaps only tangentially. The non-governmental perhaps even a news agency, helped to pay £500,000 for organisation in question was described as “brave” for the Chandlers. A sad recent example was a Scotsman, taking a decision that led inevitably to Khalil Dale’s Khalil Dale, who was kidnapped in Pakistan. There was death. I did not regard that as brave. I thought it was a evidently and clearly a financial imperative in the demands businesslike decision that, in the worst case, saved the of the people who kidnapped him, and his employer, organisation money because kidnap and ransom insurance the International Committee of the Red Cross, said that is expensive. Commercial companies can build insurance its policy, as the Government suggested, was not to pay into their expenditure and planning assumptions, and it ransoms. seems a bit too easy for employers to say, “Well, the There is a distinction between a Government who Government say that this is the best thing to do.” If make a political policy decision not to pay ransoms, someone who works for an NGO is unfortunate enough and an employer. For many different reasons, and given to get captured and a ransom is not paid—imagine, for the scale of their work, the Government’s exposure to example, someone on land in Somalia—they are much risk is far greater than that of any employing organisation, more likely to be held for many months, or even killed. and seafarers belong to the latter group. It therefore If they are lucky enough to be employed by an organisation seems quite improper to constrain employers who may that has paid kidnap and ransom insurance, there is a have seafarers at sea from paying ransoms in cases when strong chance that they will be released. That is the they could get someone released. realpolitik of the matter. 151WH Piracy (Somalia)14 JUNE 2012 Piracy (Somalia) 152WH

In conclusion, we should be cautious about assuming committee, have erred consistently on the side of that just because we say, “This is a jolly good thing”, considerable over-optimism and rose-tintedness. We have everybody else will agree. If we decide to discourage, or been told that we are getting on top of the problem, and in the worst case, make it unlawful to pay kidnap and figures are produced to indicate that that may be the ransom insurance, employees—the people about whom case. We have been told that the numbers of merchantmen organisations must be concerned—will be exposed to held hostage are going down, as are the numbers of much greater risk. That is why in this dilemma I come ships that have been taken. However, those are not the down strongly on the side of paying kidnap and ransom key figures. If we honestly ask ourselves, “Is piracy insurance, and I think NGOs ought to do that as well. paying?” only two statistics really matter. First, what is happening to the size of the ransom money being paid 3.4 pm out? Secondly, what is the degree of risk to which pirates are exposing themselves? Sir John Stanley (Tonbridge and Malling) (Con): I am pleased to follow in the wake of my hon. Friend the The Committee, in our report, comes up unequivocally Member for Croydon South (Richard Ottaway). We with the answers on those two key figures. With regard have been the beneficiaries of his naval and nautical to the money, at the end of paragraph 111, we state: expertise over the course of this inquiry. “The latest information from Northwood HQ is that ransom payments in 2011 have already totalled $135m—a further substantial I start, Mr Sheridan, by wholeheartedly endorsing increase and a new record.” your comments at the opening of the debate about the On the ransom money test, we are losing comprehensively. gross discourtesy that the Government have shown to The ransom money is going up; indeed, a new record the Committee by failing to make available a crucial has been set. On the risk test, there is a key sentence in document that had been promised by the end of April. our report at the opening of paragraph 74: We are grateful to the Minister for trying to ensure that “Around nine out of 10 piracy suspects detained by forces the document appears before the end of the debate, but engaged in multinational operations are released without trial.” you will be first to appreciate, Mr Sheridan, that in such Nine out of 10 captured pirates are just released. Therefore, a complex and technical area, the Committee should the honest answer to the question “Does piracy pay?” is have seen the document days earlier in order to study it yes, it does; it is a growing source of huge sums of and, if necessary, take advice from the Committee staff money and it is largely risk free for those who engage in before the debate commenced. it. That is the point we are at, and it is singularly serious. Piracy is emphatically not a marginal, peripheral What do we do in this situation? Yes, in a perfect world issue. In my view, it is wholly central, above all on world, there would be an up-and-running criminal justice humanitarian and human rights grounds. Piracy is one system in Somalia. There would be a splendid criminal of the worst forms of human rights abuse that we see justice system, with splendid courts, and those people anywhere in the world. Thousands of innocent seamen would be put where they belong—in jail, for many and seafarers have been taken hostage and held in years. However, that is an illusion. We will not be at that captivity under intolerable conditions. Many have died, point for years. and nearly 200 people are in captivity today, some of On the naval side, as the Chairman of the Committee, whom have been exposed to torture, and threats of my hon. Friend the Member for Croydon South, rightly torture, in order to increase the degree of pressure for pointed out, the geographical scale of the sea operations ransom money. This is a vile humanitarian abuse. is such that there is no conceivable prospect of being Equally important are the international maritime able to produce the massive armada of naval forces that ramifications of Somali piracy. A few years ago, most would be in a position to respond quickly to a threat of of us would have said that piracy was relatively confined piracy in such a huge area of ocean. Therefore, we are in sea terms; it was a risk in the maritime choke points left with just one solution. We must put armed guards such as, for example, the Gulf of Aden. As Somali on the merchant vessels, and those armed guards must piracy has developed, however, pirates have become be in a position to ensure that not a single merchantman more and more audacious, and more and more skilled. on the ship is taken hostage and the ship is not captured They have acquired mother ships and dramatically increased in any circumstances. the range of piracy. Piracy now extends vastly further in The Government, after a long delay—I have to say geographical or sea terms than at the outset of this that they were continuing the policy of the previous malevolent trend. Government—have performed what the Chairman of If we were starting the report today, I would suggest the Committee rightly pointed out is a complete U-turn, to my Committee colleagues that we call it not “Piracy a very welcome U-turn, and have accepted the policy of off the coast of Somalia” but “Piracy in the Indian placing armed guards on UK-flagged ships. However, ocean.” Piracy is a form of criminality that, if allowed that can be only half the policy. It is not enough to say to take root, has the potential to expand beyond the that we will put armed guards on the ships and create a Indian ocean. We already have what appear to be copycat new form of arms export licence that enables weapons attempts off the west African coast, and pirates are a to be supplied to them. I have, not least in my capacity risk in the Caribbean. We are talking about an international as Chairman of the Committees on Arms Export Controls, maritime threat, which is why the issue is so important a number of detailed questions about that form of and why I believe that the Foreign Affairs Committee licence, but I shall be delivering them in writing to the has done a considerable service to Parliament and the Minister. I will not take up hon. Members’ time with wider international community by producing this weighty them now. and well-researched report. It is not enough to say that we will allow armed All the manifold briefings that I have had on Somali guards and will have a licensing system to get the piracy, both in the course of the inquiry and as a appropriate weapons and ammunition to them. We member of the NATO Parliamentary Assembly’s defence must have in place the right, requisite rules of engagement, 153WH Piracy (Somalia)14 JUNE 2012 Piracy (Somalia) 154WH

[Sir John Stanley] I urge the Minister to accept that recommendation. and that is where I believe that the Government are 3.19 pm seriously falling down in policy terms. The Government’s position appears to be that we state the policy—we say Martin Horwood (Cheltenham) (LD): I congratulate that we are in favour of armed guards—but we will not the hon. Member for Croydon South (Richard Ottaway) give any help or support with regard to the circumstances and his Committee on securing this timely and important in which lethal weapons can be used. I refer hon. debate and the whole Committee on the report, which is Members to what the Government say on page 5 of an authoritative and important contribution to British their response: policy making in the context. “It must remain for shipping companies and private security The problems associated with piracy are well understood companies to agree between themselves upon the guidance on use by everyone here. It is conducted on a staggering scale of force within which armed guards are to operate.” in the Indian ocean, and I think that the report suggests That, to me, seems to be a very serious cop-out. I do not that between 1,500 and 3,000 pirates are operating believe that the Government can responsibly say that there. It affects trade through the Gulf of Aden worth we have a policy of putting armed guards on British-flagged hundreds of billions, if not trillions, of dollars to the merchant ships and then refuse to accept any responsibility global economy. Any disruption of that trade certainly whatever for describing the circumstances in which affects not just British companies, but companies all those armed guards can use their weapons. over the world, and the insurance and other markets that support it. There are disturbing trends, which the When I look at how the Government try to justify the Select Committee drew attention to, including—and policy, I have to say that it does not stand up as far as I probably most worryingly—increasing violence against am concerned. The Government’s justification, also on hostages, which was not a particular characteristic of page 5 of their response, is that Somali piracy a few years ago. On top of that, there is “the introduction of government-prescribed rules on the use of the fact that such piracy has been going on for decades. force would blur the distinction between private maritime security personnel as civilians only acting in the context of self-defence, The international community despite, I think, nine United and military personnel who may be authorised to use force for Nations Security Council resolutions and three other reasons.” multinational naval operations, has not remotely cracked My first point is that armed military personnel are the problem. As we have heard, the amount of ransom used and have been used with considerable regularity to that is being paid is on the increase. board and to be on board civilian ships in a variety of That is not to say, however, that there are not some circumstances, so the Government have ample experience positive signals. In Somalia, the situation on the ground of that; and in all those circumstances, those armed seems more promising than for many years. That is military personnel have rules of engagement, so the partly due to the courage of African Union and other Government have in their possession rules of engagement international forces, which have secured more territory that deal with the type of situation we are discussing. than for many years. There is some evidence that progress I would question the Government when they say that is being made against forces such as Al-Shabaab, although the armed guards on British-flagged merchant ships are it continues to control huge swathes of the country. acting only in the context of self-defence. I do not know whether that is meant to imply the armed guards’ own Rory Stewart (Penrith and The Border) (Con): Will self-defence. They have a much wider role. Their key the hon. Gentleman reflect on how serious or sustainable role is, of course, to protect and ensure the safety of all the progress in Somalia is? Is he confident that in three the civilian crew members on board the ship and, in the years’ time Somalia will be significantly better than it is process, ensure the safety and retention of that ship today? under the control of the crew’s master and the ship’s crew. That is their wider role. Martin Horwood: I cannot predict the future, but the fact that Mogadishu is now an overwhelmingly secure In those circumstances, when the Government have city, which was far from true only a few years ago, and abundant expertise in the area and, as a matter of that the Foreign Secretary and International Development course, have rules of engagement that they apply to Secretary can visit cities such as Mogadishu with a service personnel who have to go on board civilian degree of confidence about their personal security is a ships, and given that the Government now have a clear quite dramatic shift, as I am sure that the hon. Gentleman policy in favour of armed guards going on to British-flagged would acknowledge. I do not say that securing a military merchant ships, it seems to me to be wholly incumbent solution is the only path forward, but the fact that on the Government to accept the necessity of making African Union troops and others have made enormous clear what the rules of engagement are. sacrifices, displayed great courage and secured a large I come back to the conclusion that the Committee amount of territory should not go unnoticed. draws in paragraph 37. To me, it is the single most There is also progress in the sense that areas of the important recommendation in our report. It should be internationally recognised territory of Somalia—mainly, read in full, but I shall quote just the key sentences: in practice, self-governing areas such as Somaliland and “The Government should not offload responsibility onto ship Puntland—have achieved a reasonable degree of peace owners to deal with the most difficult aspects of handling private and security. The Government have shown wisdom in armed guards…The Government must provide clearer direction promoting a flexible attitude to territories such as on what is permissible and what is not. Guidance over the use of potentially lethal force should not be left to private companies to Somaliland. The creation of the Somaliland Development agree upon. We recommend that the change of policy be accompanied Corporation, which the Government supported earlier by clear, detailed and unambiguous guidance on the legal use of this year, is a positive development. Trying to exploit force for private armed guards defending a vessel under attack.” the economic potential of the relative peace of areas 155WH Piracy (Somalia)14 JUNE 2012 Piracy (Somalia) 156WH such as Somaliland is a practical contribution to the Martin Horwood: As I said, it is a horrendously provision of an alternative economic model to the difficult thing to say to an individual family or a company, chaos and piracy prevalent in other parts of the Somali “You should not pay,” but Governments must consider territory. It is exactly right that the Department for the larger picture and the fact that ransoms fuel the International Development is prioritising development whole situation and that every payment of a ransom on the ground and the provision of economic alternatives supports future piracy. to people in Somalia. The convening of the London conference earlier this Richard Ottaway: To use the illustration of a mugger, year was an important step, not just in relation to does the hon. Gentleman think that the best advice to tackling war and conflict in Somalia and getting a give a mugging victim is, “Don’t hand over your wallet, co-ordinated regional approach, which the Select Committee because that will stop mugging in the future.”? asked for, but in making concrete contributions to progress on anti-piracy initiatives, including some things Martin Horwood: That is the police advice— that have been mentioned: the taskforces on ransoms [Interruption.] The police advice is to co-operate, I and the wonderfully named—let me get it right—Regional know, but that is where someone is at imminent risk Anti-Piracy Prosecutions Intelligence Co-ordination Centre. themselves. The right hon. Member for Tonbridge and I am sure that Hansard will report that I got that Malling set out the situation: it is a balance of risk and fluently right. The substantial financial commitment reward. The Government and the international community that the Government have made to RAPPICC is welcome, are addressing the risk element, because they are stepping and we have provided its first director, Garry Crone. up self-defence measures, and there is greater international That support is welcome and exactly the kind of lead in co-ordination and increasing provision of private armed international co-ordination that the Select Committee security forces and armed guards. The risk element is asked for. therefore increasing slightly, but the rewards are On ransoms, Her Majesty’s Government’s instinct stupendous—hundreds of millions of dollars—and we is exactly right. Briefings from non-governmental must try to reduce the rewards or the economic model organisations such as Saferworld, which has talked to behind piracy will thrive. civil society in Somalia, make it clear that the economic I am afraid that this situation is the classic philosophical model of piracy brings, in some cases, the most effective prisoner’s dilemma, where the individual action may be wealth provision into the local economy. If we can difficult to take, but the result on a larger scale is clear. disrupt that business model and suggest that a peaceful, Saferworld says clearly in its briefing, from its research normal economy and society would be a more profitable on the ground in Somalia, that the continued payment way to develop—as we would obviously hope—we will of ransoms fuels and exacerbates the problem. We want have some chance of defeating the root causes of piracy. to tackle those things and want people to be safer. If we continue to fuel the ransom economy and pay The hon. Member for Falkirk (Eric Joyce) asked money, that will be a massive incentive for Somalis to what would happen to British ships in that situation continue with piracy and to allow it to spread. If, as the and whether British hostages would be more at risk. I right hon. Member for Tonbridge and Malling (Sir suspect that Somali pirates are quite good business men John Stanley) said, risk and reward are so imbalanced, and can spot a red ensign, a white ensign or whichever why would piracy not spread down the coast of Africa? British flag happens to be flying. If Britain acquired a Why would not that model be emulated in other parts reputation for not paying ransoms, it would balance out of the world? the risks and rewards of attacking a British vessel and Eric Joyce: I thank the hon. Gentleman and will be they might think that it would be better to attack brief. Does he not think that the thing for a responsible somebody else’s. employer to do, if two dozen employees are captured The principle has been established in other fields. It and a ransom is demanded—they may well be executed—is used to be more common practice for ransoms and to pay it, as opposed to the view of NGOs, which payments to be made when hostages were taken in appear on the whole to want to leave them to die? international terrorist situations, such as airfields. There was a concerted international drive to stop any hostage Martin Horwood: No. I think that paying is profoundly payments being made in those situations, and that form irresponsible. There are even more extreme cases than of terrorism has largely disappeared. It has sadly been that of an employer. It is difficult to tell someone whose replaced by many others. It is critical that we disrupt the loved one has been kidnapped—it would be difficult for business model of piracy. That was not the only issue me if one of my loved ones had been kidnapped—and that I was going to address; I will move quickly on. other members of the family, “You should not pay.” That is a terribly difficult thing to say to someone, face On the military front, the moves towards international to face. However, in the bigger picture, people are co-ordination are good. I note the existence of the kidnapped because other people have paid ransoms, European naval force. We ought to agree between these which paid for the boats and motherships and the four walls not to tell the hon. Member for Stone (Mr Cash) lifestyle of the pirates that makes future ransoms, kidnaps about it. It is very effective, and a British operational and piracy much more likely. We must try to disrupt commander is in place. The rejection of the catch-and- that business model. Trying to find a simple military release approach was rightly highlighted by the Foreign solution is only half the answer. I am afraid that I think Affairs Committee. It is important that that approach is that the Government’s instinct is right. abandoned, so increasing the risk that pirates face. We need more effective action to prosecute, using every Richard Ottaway: What does the hon. Gentleman available international or national legal jurisdiction that think would have happened to Judith Tebbutt and Mr and we can find. The British Government are taking a lead Mrs Chandler if no ransoms had been paid? in that. 157WH Piracy (Somalia)14 JUNE 2012 Piracy (Somalia) 158WH

[Martin Horwood] this whole discussion, show how important Somali piracy is. I would like to sound a note of caution, The report highlighted other issues, rightly including however. The most important thing in the debate is not the disappointing progress to date in tracking financial to get dragged in too deeply, or to be too ambitious in flows—tens of millions of pounds are being trafficked. what we feel we can achieve on the ground in Somalia. The Government and, indeed, the international community There are very grand theories going around about the have been slow to provide ways to track it down and importance of Somali piracy and linking it to theories disrupt the flow. It is an important step in disrupting of state building, economic development, regional stability the pirates’ business model. It will be interesting to hear and terrorism. The hon. Member for Cheltenham (Martin the Minister’s view. Horwood) made a number of those arguments. They The Foreign Affairs Committee is a little inclined are powerful, partly because a powerful industry supports always to want Britain to be the country taking the them, trying to draw us ever deeper into Somalia. The lead. These are global problems. Likewise, it insists that components of that industry are various, but there are Britain plays the leading role in the naval operation. four. Although Britain is an important naval power, perhaps The first is what I call the “forward school”, represented given our financial situation and the fact that it is a by people like my father, who quite like the idea of global problem affecting global business and threatening grand naval operations and keep talking about sending the lives of nationals of all countries, it is not absolutely out Q-boats and remembering Julius Caesar attacking necessary to have at least one British naval vessel on the shoreline. That is the naval “use it or lose it” operation all the time. This must be done through approach, where a military complex likes to expand its international co-ordination. area of operations to justify its existence. On the prosecution of pirates when they are visible, The second is, of course, the Somali Government the report says: themselves, who find it very convenient to use Somali Gathering evidence to secure a successful prosecution for piracy to attract international attention and resources. piracy is clearly challenging, but when pirates are observed in They are increasingly adept at manipulating international boats with guns, ladders and even hostages, it beggars belief that they cannot be prosecuted.” sentiment on human rights and terrorism to attract more resources into their Government. That is exactly right. I will be interested to hear the Minister’s comments on progress on the international The third component is think-tanks. There is now a front. major industry, particularly focused on Islamic radicalisation and counter-terrorism, that is keen to connect Somali I think that the right hon. Member for Tonbridge and piracy with the obsessions of Washington think-tanks Malling was a little uncharitable in his comments on the with the proliferation of al-Qaeda. use of force by private armed security forces. The UK legal situation is pretty clear. The Library briefing quotes Finally, as the previous speaker pointed out, there are an international law firm called Ince and Co., which the aid agencies, which find it extremely convenient to says that use Somali piracy to argue for more investment in development operations in Somalia. Connections are “the use of force in deterring or preventing what is a criminal act” perpetually made, and were made by the hon. Gentleman, is justified. It continues: with governance, failed states, economic development “In the UK…lethal force is normally only allowed where there and alternative livelihoods, as they are in Yemen, Congo, is serious and imminent threat to life. The decision to use lethal Chad, Afghanistan and Sudan. force must be reasonable and the force used proportionate.” Further clarification on the exact definitions and terms Martin Horwood: I recognise the hon. Gentleman’s will be obviously welcome whenever it arrives through long and genuine experience in the field, but having the door today, and Government are working to provide worked for a development NGO I think the suggestion that. Ince and Co. goes on to make the point that rules that the NGOs are in some way fostering an image of on the use of force need to be internationally agreed Somalia in particular for the benefit of their business and as standardised as possible. That is required model and to encourage spending on development is internationally. The IMO ought to be taking a lead, but rather extraordinary and, indeed, really offensive. it is possibly the slowest organisation in the world at doing almost anything. Rory Stewart: I am very happy to share endless In deference to other Members, because we were statements from almost every major NGO and development distracted, I will move swiftly to a conclusion. It is agency that has attempted to draw links between their imperative to tackle the situation on the ground and programmes on the ground in all the areas the hon. provide different economic models. We should use the Gentleman and I mentioned and state instability, and example of Somaliland positively to look at fisheries indeed piracy itself. It is entirely normal. We have seen it and try to present an alternative way of providing all the way from Congo to Afghanistan. Somalia is prosperity in the longer term for the people of Somalia, absolutely no exception. so that this appalling trade does still not offer the attractions that it does now. The problem with that kind of argument is twofold. First, there is a theoretical problem: the strong link between state instability, governance and developmental 3.34 pm poverty and piracy is yet to be proven at any theoretical Rory Stewart (Penrith and The Border) (Con): The level. Secondly, the actual links, as Anja Shortland whole debate is a tribute to the astonishing attention argued in a recent academic paper, are very fragile currently being paid to Somalia. In fact, the increase in indeed. No link has so far been effectively established African Union troops from 12,000 to 17,730, and indeed between the piracy and al-Qaeda, and very few substantial 159WH Piracy (Somalia)14 JUNE 2012 Piracy (Somalia) 160WH links have been established between piracy and the To conclude, the context needs to be put in place. The al-Shabaab movement itself. As for statements about limited obligation that we have needs to be asserted: in development and state building, Anja Shortland argued other words, we do indeed have an obligation to the that it is very doubtful whether the contribution of Somali people, as we have an obligation to the people of piracy to the Somali economy is anything other than Congo, Sudan, Afghanistan and our own people, but marginally positive at the moment. the threat posed by Somali piracy and by Somali state I am not saying that Somali piracy is not an evil in instability to UK national interests is limited. It is a itself, or that poverty in Somalia is anything other evil. threat but it is one threat among many. Somalia is one Both those things are true and important. Attempting of perhaps 40 countries in the world with which the to connect the two, however, draws us into a dangerous United Kingdom and the international community needs policy position. The solution is humility and context. to be concerned. We should not be raising the expectations Instead of endlessly inflating the problem of Somali of the Somali people through talk of our ability to piracy in order to draw in more resources, we need to deliver solutions that we cannot deliver. acknowledge the reality of our situation. This is not a recipe for pessimism. It is instead to We need to acknowledge first that, as many hon. suggest that we can make developmental progress, but Members have pointed out, we have made little progress we will not be able to achieve governance, rule of law, or on Somali piracy over the past five years. We have state stability. We may be able to contain Somali piracy, invested surprisingly little in the issue, despite an enormous but we are extremely unlikely to be able to eliminate it. amount of rhetoric. Despite nine UN resolutions and Our objectives should be limited to ongoing counter-piracy three multinational task forces, the reality on the ground operations, some development operations and an attempt is that there has been an increase in both the number of to increase the likelihood of a political settlement and attacks and the amount of ransom money being paid. decrease the likelihood of civil war. Any attempt to Moreover, despite an enormous amount of rhetoric and claim that we can do more is likely to mislead the the idea that people read in that British people, disappoint the Somali people and draw this is the No. 1 priority of the British Navy, we have us into a situation into which we should not be drawn. often only one ship or perhaps none at all in the region; in fact the matter does not actually classify at the 3.44 pm highest priority level for our naval operations. Part of that may be due to mixed signals, influenced by the fact Mr John Spellar (Warley) (Lab): I congratulate the that the majority of the crews, unfortunately, are not Chair of the Foreign Affairs Committee and his colleagues citizens of OECD countries, and the majority of the on their report. The detailed work that has been undertaken ships involved have nothing to do with Britain itself. and the drawing together of a number of difficult issues However, there are much more fundamental limits show the value of Select Committees. One does not constraining us and, unless we acknowledge those limits, necessarily have to agree with every line of the conclusion. we are going to get ourselves in trouble. Those limits are We just need to see the thread of the work that enables a threefold. First, there is a limit of abstraction. Statements debate to take place, and I am pleased that it was about governance, rule of law and economic development acknowledged in the Government response. in Somalia are extremely vague and ill-focused. We have Would you indulge me for a minute, Mr Sheridan, so a poor understanding of governance and rule of law that I can pay tribute to Lord Peter Archer of Sandwell structures on the ground in Somalia, very little idea of who died today? He was my predecessor in the Warley what kind of country the international community could constituency. He served for some 26 years in the House turn Somalia into, and few models to put forward. The of Commons and 20 years in the House of Lords and isolated lives of our diplomats and other international made a considerable contribution to both Houses and officials, because of security issues and short tour lengths, to his own constituency. If there was anyone to whom and lack of linguistic expertise means that their the phrase, “A fine Christian gentleman” applied, it was understanding of what is happening at rural level in Peter Archer. He was a man of formidable intellect. His Somalia is extremely limited. All of that is disguised father was a toolmaker in Tipton. Peter rose to high within a very optimistic language, which talks about a levels in the law, but never forgot his roots. He always land-based solution, without any evidence that we have served his constituency well. In some ways, he was a the knowledge, the power or the legitimacy to achieve hard act to follow; his reputation as a Member of that kind of solution. Parliament in the constituency stood very high, and I only hope that I have matched up to his standards in Martin Horwood: I will resist the temptation to debate that regard. I am sure that the feelings of Members here Anja Shortland’s conclusions, which I think demonstrate who knew him will go to his wife and family. exactly the opposite of what the hon. Gentleman is I am pleased to see two Ministers here today. Let me saying, but on the specific point about the lack of a briefly damage their careers by saying that they have positive model, what about the example of Somaliland—he played a proactive role in dealing with this issue. If may regard it as a different territory, I suppose—and some other Departments had been as forward leaning, the British Government’s support of the Somaliland we would have made progress, and today’s problems are Development Corporation? Does not that look like a an indication of that. I hope that we will improve the positive alternative model of development? rate of our response to this evolving situation. As the right hon. Member for Tonbridge and Malling Rory Stewart: The problems in the al-Shabaab-controlled (Sir John Stanley) mentioned, the problem began off areas and in Puntland are completely different from the Somali coast. Then we saw it moving along the those in Somaliland, and attempting to read from one coast of Aden. Indian Ministers are extremely concerned across the other is highly misleading. about how close the problem is getting to India. We 161WH Piracy (Somalia)14 JUNE 2012 Piracy (Somalia) 162WH

[Mr John Spellar] seen the evolution of tactics; as we have managed to move, so too the pirates’ tactics have changed. That is have seen the movement from skiffs to mother ships, the not surprising. involvement of spotters in ports and allegations of What we need to see is Departments working together intelligence gathering elsewhere. We are now seeing and not just individually. We were discussing the issue imitation tactics in the Gulf of Guinea, and I have of armed guards and what are sometimes the problems heard reports, which I have not validated, of similar of Government co-ordination, including in real time, as problems off the coast of South America. We have seen well as the other work we have to do. I fully understand changes in the levels and manner of response. the frustrations that sometimes arise from working The hon. Member for Cheltenham (Martin Horwood) through the IMO. We must also co-operate with other talked about Britain taking a lead, which is absolutely countries, and I join colleagues in paying tribute to the appropriate. A major part of our naval doctrine is to naval patrol; it is a very good example of international secure the world’s sea lanes not only for British vessels co-operation. We must get partners to work together but for the world’s vessels. Maintaining free passage of and we have to recognise that time is of the essence. We vessels throughout the world is an important contribution cannot always be playing catch-up. I am not saying that and is core to our basic philosophy and our national military solutions are the sole solution; they are not. interest. [Interruption.] I was wondering how long I However, we must see a step change in operational would have to speak before the documents arrived. One tempo. hears a distant trumpet blowing over the horizon as the cavalry appears. I hope that the Minister will indicate [MR GRAHAM BRADY in the Chair] whether that basic philosophy is still a doctrinal priority In some cases, the response reminds me very much of for the Ministry of Defence, our armed forces and the when we were dealing with the foot and mouth epidemic British Government. in 2001. The civil servants in the Ministry of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food were working extremely hard to Secondly, we have talked quite extensively about the deal with it, but it was only when we changed the impact on world trade, the amount of money that is operational tempo, by bringing in the Ministry of Defence being paid, the impact on the willingness of seafarers to and the armed forces, that we managed to deal with the go through these routes, the rise in insurance premiums spread of a virus that was outrunning our ability to and the potential risk to supply chain management for handle it. The ability to focus on the outcome rather many countries. The effects of the tsunami in Japan and than the process is crucial. It is very important that we the floods in Thailand were felt right across Europe. get that message across. Indeed, the Committee alludes Much of the British car industry and other industries to it in paragraph 63 of its report, which says that the experienced disruption in the supply of component Government must parts because of those particular events. If the passage into the Suez canal became too unsafe for seafarers to “respond flexibly to changes in the pirates’ tactics.” risk using it, the additional journey would cause not That is extremely important in this context. only extra costs but considerable disruption for British The Government should also look much further at industry. the issue of the pirate bases on land. The Minister and indeed other colleagues who have spoken to those of We should not underestimate the impact of piracy on our forces that have been involved in dealing with the the countries in-region. I remember talking to the Kenyan pirates, particularly the , know of their Government about cruises. Cruise terminals are big frustration at the restrictions they face when they see business, providing a considerable amount of employment the pirates at the start of the piracy season—when the in many parts of the world. Up to about the middle of sea conditions become more favourable—assembling last year, the number of cruise ships visiting Kenya went all their equipment on the beach, ready to launch an down from about 60 to one—interestingly that one was operation. Our forces are hugely frustrated at their from Saga, which shows the redoubtable spirit of British inability to go in and destroy that equipment and disrupt pensioners. We can imagine the impact on many workers the pirates’ operations. Would that solve piracy entirely? in Mombasa and indeed on the tourist industry there. No. Would it change the balance of trade and disrupt In the future, therefore, cruise liners and the yachting the pirates’ operations? Absolutely certainly. It appears business will be affected, which will have a considerable that there has been some evolution of doctrine in that impact. We have talked about development, but such an regard; I merely say that it demonstrates the point, impact creates the conditions for further instability. because it took far too long and therefore enabled the That should concern us very considerably. cycle of piracy to continue. It is fair to say that throughout the current epidemic I realise that the Minister will be under some constraints of Somali coast piracy the Government have tended in this regard, but can he give some indication as to how towards finding the right solutions but they have not we could evolve our approach with international partners, necessarily always moved at the requisite pace. One of for example on developing air surveillance? I appreciate the images that we must get away from is the Somali that the area is very substantial, but I also appreciate pirates as mindless hooligans. I am not talking about that, for instance, the US is developing considerable the expendables who, for an extra few per cent, will military resources in the region, particularly in Djibouti want to be the first ones on to the vessel. I am talking and Yemen. Can the Minister say to what extent we will about the people who are behind them—the people who be able to utilise those resources to get a better picture organise the schemes and who are involved in the of the pirates’ operations in the area? organisation of the money. The amount of money that I now come to the very thorny issue of ransoms. we are talking about requires considerably sophisticated There has been a spirited debate between colleagues organisation, including the spotting of targets. We have today and I fully understand why—it is inevitable. A number 163WH Piracy (Somalia)14 JUNE 2012 Piracy (Somalia) 164WH of us will have received representations from the shipping his work. As we stated in our response to the report, we industry, and indeed from the trade union representing are grateful to the Committee for examining this important seafarers. Very properly—I do not say that in any subject in such detail. Obviously, we entirely accept that disparaging way—they have outlined their duty of care there is still a lot to do. to their members, including seafarers. However, I wonder We welcome many of the Committee’s conclusions. if there is any doctrinal difference between paying ransoms We recognise the important contribution that the inquiry for seafarers, kidnapping and hostage-taking. The same has made and we will continue a close dialogue and broad strand runs all the way through, namely that a discussion. As the Committee has noted in its report, company—absolutely understandably and rightly—is piracy is not new but a type of criminality that has most importantly concerned with its duty of care to the existed for many centuries. Indeed, the Under-Secretary welfare of its employees, the seafarers; there are some of State for Transport, my hon. Friend the Member for commercial aspects, but that is the most important Hemel Hempstead (Mike Penning), who is the Minister consideration. with responsibility for shipping, pointed out, it has been However, as the hon. Member for Cheltenham rightly going on since about 2000 BC. However, the recent said—my praising a Liberal Democrat makes this a evolution of maritime piracy off the Horn of Africa has historic day—the problem is that when someone pays a had a big impact both on the region and worldwide. ransom, they put at risk the next vessel that goes In this globalised world in which millions rely on the through that region. Is it easy? Of course it is not. A 23,000 ships that sail through the Gulf of Aden and the Government that have traditionally taken a very hard Indian ocean each year, the impact of Somali-based line on hostage-taking—the Government of Israel—recently piracy is felt here and throughout the global economy. came to an agreement regarding an exchange of hostages The World Bank has estimated that the total cost to the for prisoners in Israeli jails. I do not underestimate the world economy, through extra costs placed on shipping difficulty of the issue. Rarely do I regret losing office, and higher insurance premiums, is about $7 billion. and I must say that I do not envy Ministers involved in these sorts of decisions, when there is no self-evidently The right hon. Member for Warley (Mr Spellar) right decision to make. mentioned the impact on Mombasa. Recently, I visited Mombasa and saw the situation for myself. We had a Nevertheless, there needs to be a consistent level of seminar on board HMS Westminster, where many of policy. Regarding hostages and kidnappings, British those representing the tourism and hospitality industry Governments of all parties have had a long-standing made the point that no cruise ships visit Mombasa now. consistent policy of not paying ransoms, for the reasons The right hon. Gentleman gave the correct figures, but that I have outlined. We have done that even though the he might have pointed out that the one ship that visited Governments of some other countries have taken a Mombasa last year came under pirate attack. different stance. I recognise the difficulty; it is not The cost of piracy is huge. Of UK gross domestic a completely open and shut case. Equally, however, we product, £10.7 billion comes from the shipping industry. have to recognise the good faith of those who have to Since 2008, Somali pirates have hijacked about 175 make those decisions. vessels, taken 3,000 seafarers captive and received more There is still considerable truth in the Kipling line than £200 million in ransom payments. As my hon. that the problem with paying the Dane-geld is that you Friend the Member for Croydon South pointed out, the never stop paying the Dane. I fully acknowledge those crisis peaked in autumn 2011. We cannot be complacent, who say, “Look, if a member of my family was involved but it is important to note that, although the tempo of or taken hostage, I would want to pay, or I would want attacks has not changed, the number of attacks resisted the Government to make the concession.”But Governments has greatly increased, so much so that only seven vessels have to look at the issue in a different light. and 214 hostages are currently under pirate control. I therefore very much welcome the report, Mr Sheridan— Those figures come from research by EUNAVFOR—the [Interruption.] Sorry; Mr Brady. What more would one European Union Naval Force Somalia. expect from the chairman of the 1922 Committee than I agree with the right hon. Member for Warley that it the ability seamlessly to slip into the situation? The is essential that the UK continues to take a leading role report is very welcome, because it provides a proper in the international community and that the international balance. As I have said, I congratulate the Ministers on community continues to work closely together to tackle their work on different aspects of this subject. My main and end the threat of attack by pirates. It is rarely the point is that we need to ensure that we react to the case that UK nationals are affected by such attacks, but changes—there will be further changes in tactics and one of the first duties of a Government is to protect our problems—to improve the operational tempo and to citizens. As my hon. Friend the Member for Croydon speed up the pace of decision making. That might even South said, the Committee looked carefully at the handling mean that colleagues have the chance to read one or two of the case of Paul and Rachel Chandler, who suffered words of the new guidance. I am sure that the Ministers a terrible ordeal. I spoke to Rachel Chandler after her will convey back the concerns raised in the debate. release, and I know how horrendous the experience was. As we set out in our response, we will continue to work 4.1 pm on all the options available to us to ensure that those behind their ordeal are brought to justice. We have also The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Foreign conducted a full review of the handling of their case to and Commonwealth Affairs (Mr Henry Bellingham): It see what lessons can be learned, including on the need has been a great pleasure to listen to this wide-ranging, to ensure that the early engagement offered by the UK rich and varied debate. I pay particular tribute to the mission responsible for co-ordinating our response on Chair of the Foreign Affairs Committee, my hon. Friend the ground is actually provided. The results of that the Member for Croydon South (Richard Ottaway), for review are annexed to our response. The Government 165WH Piracy (Somalia)14 JUNE 2012 Piracy (Somalia) 166WH

[Mr Henry Bellingham] targeted unless there is sufficient intelligence—obviously, aerial photography and satellite intelligence are needed. are committed to providing the best possible support to As the right hon. Member for Warley pointed out, it is those who fall victim to piracy and their families, tailored, important that all countries engaged in the operations of course, to the families’ wishes. use their assets to the maximum possible advantage so Similarly, the Government are committed to continuing that we can pool information. Indeed, that is what is to take a leading role in the international community, happening. I very much hope that that action sent an including through the Contact Group on Piracy off the extremely strong signal that there is nowhere for these Coast of Somalia. We continue to lead the working people to hide. Although we will be very cautious to group responsible for naval co-ordination and regional avoid loss of life or injury to people, when we can target capacity-building activity, working with our partners to assets onshore, we will. minimise duplication and encourage the widest possible The Committee has recognised the role that the industry participation by the international community. An can and does play in protecting vessels against pirate unprecedented number of nations have engaged in the attacks, and the success of the self-protection measures international naval response in the Gulf of Aden and in reducing ships’ vulnerability to attack. We continue the Indian ocean—sharing information, co-ordinating to encourage the shipping industry to maximise adherence operations and remaining steadfast in the face of the to best management practice, and welcome the high challenge. level of compliance that we see among the UK flagged As I think two speakers today pointed out, an fleet. I pay tribute to the work done with the shipping encouraging dimension of that activity is the number of industry by my hon. Friend the Shipping Minister. As non-aligned countries taking part, including China and soon as he came into office, he made it clear to the Russia, for example. We have Operation Atalanta, NATO’s industry that part of the solution lay in its hands and Operation Open Shield and the Combined Maritime that it really had to drive forward best management Task Force. We welcome that, and we will continue to practice and ensure that it was used absolutely uniformly. lead from the front by providing the operational commander The statistics show that of ships that have been successfully for EUNAVFOR and the headquarters at Northwood attacked by pirates, very few have been those that of both the EU and the NATO operations for the adhered to best management practice, and none had duration of their mandates. To answer the question private armed security personnel on board. I pay tribute from the right hon. Member for Warley, this is indeed a to my hon. Friend for his work in pushing that agenda. key defence strategy. I share his belief that one of the Following the Government’s announcement last autumn most important responsibilities and duties of the Ministry that we would allow the use of privately contracted of Defence and the Royal Navy is the protection of armed guards on board UK flagged vessels, the Committee British interests, but not only from a little Englander looked carefully at the issue. As the Chairman of the perspective. When there are threats further afield, where Committee pointed out, the Department for Transport we have the resources and platforms from which to published before Christmas last year interim guidance tackle them, we will do so. That is why the Royal Navy for UK flagged vessels on the use of armed guards to has been prominent in providing vessels for the operations. defend against the threat of piracy in exceptional In Kenya, I had the chance to visit HMS Westminster circumstances. The guidance included a section on the when she was moored in Mombasa on a courtesy visit, use of force in the case of an attack. Since then, we have and to be briefed by the captain on the operations that revised the guidance on the rules on use of force. his forces had carried out. I can inform the House they The revised guidance was published this morning, had indeed intercepted three separate groups of pirates and I apologise to the Committee and the House for its and were able to capture a lot of equipment—in fact, a not being made available earlier. That it was not published skiff captured from the pirates was on board. Unfortunately, sooner is due to the fact that a substantial amount of not enough evidence was available to guarantee a successful extra work involving the devolved Administrations was prosecution in those cases. One of the most important needed, as was final sign-off from the Ministry of points to remember is that it is not only a question of Justice. It was not for want of my hon. Friend the having enough evidence to prosecute. Until now, we Shipping Minister pushing the matter very hard indeed. have taken a robust line on whether the evidence would I am sorry that we did not let the Chairman and stand up in court, but one of the drivers has been lack members of the Committee have a copy of the revised of detention and prosecution facilities in the region. I guidelines when they were made available at 11 o’clock shall return to that in a moment, because we have made this morning. There are lessons to be learned from that. substantial progress. I wonder whether it will be possible, perhaps in Government Naval forces continue to have a positive impact. The time, to have a further short debate specifically on the recent action by EUNAVFOR to target onshore pirate revised guidelines. logistics dumps was a welcome step forward in the The revision published this morning provides greater evolving rules of engagement of our naval forces in the clarity on what UK law says on the use of force. As the region. It was a further demonstration that those behind hon. Member for Cheltenham (Martin Horwood) pointed piracy cannot act with impunity at sea or on land. It out, the starting point must be our current common was also a good example of how the EU is delivering and statute law, which is pretty clear about what one concrete results in the implementation of a common can and cannot do. Obviously, companies must seek security and defence policy. The action was short and independent legal advice as necessary when developing sharp—I understand that it took seconds rather than the rules on use of force. minutes in terms of the firepower used—but it did substantial damage and took out a large amount of In the revised rules we go into a lot more detail, equipment. That sent a strong signal. On the other making it clear, for example, that it is hand, there is no question of any logistics dumps being “illegal to use force for retaliation or revenge.” 167WH Piracy (Somalia)14 JUNE 2012 Piracy (Somalia) 168WH

That might be perfectly obvious, but the guidance continues: He will know the work done by the armed guards, who “If the threat ceases, the defences of self defence, defence of we often employ from companies such as G4S. I will another…no longer apply”, certainly consider whether the document can be made and if a private security detachment available. “believes a threat is imminent, it is not necessary for them to wait I want to make a few additional points. I think that for the aggressor to strike the first blow before using reasonable the Committee was looking for clear but comprehensive and proportionate force to defend themselves”. rules of engagement, and we have not gone as far as it Again, that is clear. It is part of a graduated response. would have liked. That is, first, because companies must Earlier today, I was talking to experts in the Department seek independent legal advice. Furthermore, merchant for Transport and the Ministry of Defence, and they shipping can be subject to multiple jurisdictions. On believe that we have struck a much better balance. We board a UK flagged vessel, persons are subject to UK make a lot more information available. For example, we domestic laws; they may also be subject to different make it clear that if domestic jurisdictions and equivalent laws depending “armed guards sighted a pirate skiff”— on the offence committed, the nationality of the person taking the action, the person against whom the action is a skiff that might be equipped to undertake acts of taken, and whether such an action takes place in piracy— international or territorial waters. It is not straightforward, “but there was nothing to indicate that the skiff was actively and it can be incredibly complicated. I do not like to see undertaking an act of piracy, it would be illegal for armed guards to use force against them.” advice saying that it is up to the court to decide, because it brings to mind the debate in the previous Parliament However, that would not, of course, preclude firing on what force a household can use to defend its property: warning shots. All the evidence is that the pirates are time and again Minister would say that it was up to the cowards. They value their lives—they are not suicide court to decide, but actually we did not want householders merchants—and the indications are that when warning dragged into court. However, in the unfortunate event shots are fired they scarper off pretty quickly. of such a case going to court, it is up to the law of the We have made it clear, and I say again to my hon. land in that particular state or jurisdiction to determine Friend the Member for Croydon South that this is work whether the force used in the unique circumstances of in progress. The revised guidelines are an important the case was lawful. step forward in response to his Committee’s work. We That is why we have not gone into the level of detail will listen to what people in the industry say about the that the Chairman of the Committee would perhaps revised guidelines, and we will obviously listen to what like to have seen. We have not laid out rules of engagement the Committee says, and if we need to make further and rules on the use of force that cover every single amendments, my hon. Friend the Shipping Minister has eventuality. There has to be a graduated approach, and made it clear that he will do so. we must take the realpolitik view that every single circumstance and occasion will be unique. To be too Richard Ottaway: The Minister has gone right to the prescriptive would be a mistake. heart of the changes to the guidelines, and has pointed out that paragraph 8.13 states that if armed guards In addition to producing our national guidance, we—I sight a skiff but there is nothing to indicate that it is say “we”, but it is more or less my hon. Friend the actively undertaking an act of piracy it will be illegal for Shipping Minister—have played a leading role in the armed guards to use force. Can he confirm the corollary development of international guidance on the use of that if there is evidence, that is effectively a green light private armed security personnel for our leading role in to use force in retaliation and self-defence? the contact group. After detailed work within that body, the contact group has handed its conclusions to the Mr Bellingham: Yes, indeed. It is about a graduated IMO to develop further, and such international guidance response, and about the members of the armed detachment will be made available. As I said, this is work in progress using their intelligence. If they believe that they or the and further work is going on, first, on the national vessel they are protecting is threatened, they can of guidance that I mentioned and, secondly, on the course use force. They would probably start by firing a accreditation process. That is very important. I congratulate warning shot. If the skiff then disappeared, all well and my hon. Friend on that work and I hope that he carries good, but if it came closer and it was obvious that there on working tirelessly on this agenda. were weapons on board, it is perfectly clear from the I think it has been widely accepted that a combination revised guidelines that the armed guards would not of more robust naval activity, industry self-protection have to wait until a shot was fired at them or in their measures and the use of private arms security personnel direction. We go a long way to giving the clarification have all contributed to the reduction in the number of that is need. successful hijackings in the Indian ocean, but such activities at sea are only part of the answer. We should Sir John Stanley: As the Minister is aware, his not lose sight of the fact that the way to combat piracy Department employs private armed security guards in a is obviously on the land. That point was made by the number of locations around overseas embassies and Chair of the Committee, the hon. Member for Cheltenham high commissions. Will he make available a copy of and the right hon. Member for Warley. We must look at those rules of engagement to the members of the the political strand, and I will come on to that in a Committee? moment in response to the comments made by my hon. Friend the Member for Penrith and The Border (Rory Mr Bellingham: My right hon. Friend was a senior Stewart), but in terms of sustainable solutions on the Minister and had a distinguished military career, and he land, one of the things I was very keen to discuss with has stayed in many embassies and high commissions. the shipping industry—it also featured in the London 169WH Piracy (Somalia)14 JUNE 2012 Piracy (Somalia) 170WH

[Mr Bellingham] youth clubs? There is a danger in trying to connect £2 million development projects to the much grander conference on Somalia—was what we can do to reward objectives of creating a stable Somali state. those communities, villages and small towns that have driven the pirates out. For example, in Puntland and Mr Bellingham: I am very grateful to my hon. Friend Galmudug, the local militia have taken control of coastal for intervening. I was referring specifically to those fast communities that have previously been subjected to impact schemes in the coastal communities. Of course, pirate activities. Those communities need to be rewarded, DFID has a very large development programme in and rewarded quickly. That is why we have worked very Somaliland. It has also committed a lot of money to hard indeed with the shipping industry, which I am south and central Somalia. Much of the money in pleased to say has been very proactive on that score, Somaliland will go into big ticket items around education, and been able to make some progress. health and infrastructure. In Somalia itself—the south I am very pleased to say that when the Secretary of and central regions—one of the tragedies is that so State for International Development was in Garowe, he much money has had to be spent on relieving famine was able to open a new fish market for which money and on humanitarian relief. If a fraction of that money was provided by his Department. We have also, for had been put into building communities, infrastructure example, established new youth club facilities in parts of and public services, a lot of those services would be far Puntland and looked at projects to increase existing more advanced. capacity for vocational training and help similar training I take on board what my hon. Friend said just now facilities in parts of Puntland and Galmudug. I am and in his excellent contribution about diplomats having delighted that the UK Government have come up with limited reach, the shortage of language skills, the lack £2 million for those projects, which has been matched of attention being applied and, indeed, the fact that by a $2 million pledge by the four shipping companies perhaps we are getting a bit too over-optimistic and that are also very concerned and interested in that giddy about what might be achievable. However, I say to agenda. We are very keen to ensure that money goes him that throughout the work done since I took over into those communities that have successfully driven this brief in May 2010—I have worked with the Foreign away the pirates. Secretary and received a lot of encouragement from our I should also point out that as well as those fast Prime Minister—I think we have been realistic about impact schemes on the land, it is incredibly important our expectations and we have been careful not to raise that those pirates who are caught are taken for detention, expectations. prosecution and then imprisonment. Part of the problem On the other hand, the reason the London conference with catch and release was, first, the difficulty of getting was well timed is that for the first time for a generation— a robust prosecution package and, secondly, the question almost since the events of “Black Hawk Down”—we of where to take the pirates. In answer to the point are seeing areas of relative stability throughout Somalia. made by the right hon. Member for Warley about In Somaliland, a functioning Government, who were whether we would take pirates to the UK, yes, of course elected in a free and fair election, are becoming a we would. If UK citizens or service personnel were positive development partner. As the hon. Member for injured by pirates, of course, we would look at the Cheltenham pointed out, the African Union Mission in evidence and we would consider bringing them to the Somalia is making substantial strides in freeing Mogadishu UK for detention and prosecution. from the curse of al-Shabaab. Progress is being made by The most important thing is to ensure that we build Ethiopians in the west of the country around Beledweyne up regional capacity for detention, prosecution and and Baidoa—indeed, AMISOM will soon be sending imprisonment. I am absolutely delighted that more forces into the west of the country. We are also seeing pirates are now being brought to justice. We recently progress by the Kenyans in the south, and they are agreed a new memorandum of understanding with the about to re-hat as AMISOM troops, as soon as they Government of Tanzania, under which UK naval assets sign an MOU with the UN. will be able to transfer suspected pirates caught at sea We have got those areas of relative stability. The key for prosecution in the Tanzanian courts. That has been now is to try to win the peace. We do have diplomats—in followed as recently as last Friday with the signature of fact, our new ambassador to Somalia, Matt Baugh, is a our Prime Minister and the Prime Minister of Mauritius brilliant linguist—so we are intensifying our engagement on a new MOU between us and the Government of and involvement. When I was recently in Mogadishu, I Mauritius, which will put UK money into Mauritian had a chance to select the site for our new embassy. It is prisons and ensure that the Mauritian Government will still just a building plot, but our plan is to build an be able to take more suspected pirates for detention and embassy and to have more activity and presence on the prosecution. Most important of all, the point being put ground, as security allows. Again, as the hon. Gentleman to us by all these countries is that they will detain pointed out, the Foreign Secretary, the Secretary of pirates and prosecute them, but they do not want to go State for International Development and I have been to to the expense of imprisoning them; they believe that Mogadishu. We are sending people in regularly and those convicted should be imprisoned in Somalia or they stay overnight in the UN compound. Somaliland. I also point out to my hon. Friend the Member for Penrith and The Border that it is all very well the Rory Stewart: Will the Minister reflect a bit on the international community doing its bit, but it is crucial gap that has emerged between the objective—governance, that the Somalis also accept the scale of the challenge rule of law and state stability—and the programmes we and make the most of the opportunities. That is why we are implementing, which are relatively small-scale must have an ongoing political process. The transition development programmes, such as fish markets and period of the Transitional Federal Government comes 171WH Piracy (Somalia)14 JUNE 2012 Piracy (Somalia) 172WH to an end in August. It is essential that we get new This work must continue. Obviously, it will cost money political structures in place that are more inclusive and and a number of countries have made a few contributions. more representative. We have recently had the international So far, we have been the single largest bilateral donor to conference in Istanbul, which the Foreign Secretary and the programme, and we are calling on other countries to I attended, and there will be another international step up to the plate. A number of commitments were contact group meeting in Rome in about a month’s made at the London conference, with the promise of time. The whole international community is agreed that money to go into such work. We hope that that money the transition will come to an end. The new constituent will be forthcoming, particularly from those larger countries assembly will soon be in place and it will elect a new that have made such commitments. parliament and appoint a new Government. I suggest to As has been pointed out, the piracy business model is my hon. Friend that when we have a new Government incredibly lucrative. The risk-reward ratio shows that and a new parliament who are more representative and the risks to the pirates have been minimal hitherto, but inclusive, and who carry more support among those the rewards have been absolutely huge. We think that areas of stability within Somalia, we will have an the figure that I gave of £200 million-plus paid out in opportunity to move the whole process forward. If that ransom so far is very conservative and that the true is combined with the international community’s weight figure could be far higher. It is important that we bear and effort in development and assistance on the ground, down on the kingpins of piracy. The London conference there will be grounds, not for getting carried away, but saw two developments in that area, and they complement for cautious optimism and for confidence that it is our existing work on tracking the financial flows of worth our while to continue the investment and efforts piracy. we put in. First, the Prime Minister announced the international Returning to burden sharing in the region, we recently taskforce on piracy ransom payments, which brings signed a statement of burden-sharing principles with together experts from a number of countries with different the Governments of Tanzania and Mauritius, with whom, experiences involving the payment of ransoms. It will as I mentioned, we have new arrangements; the Seychelles, look at what more could be done to tackle the growing with whom we have an effective MOU; and Kenya, with size and use of ransom payments. The taskforce will whom we continue to work closely to discuss the prospects consider the views of a wide range of key organisations, for a resumption of our bilateral arrangements. particularly our partners in the shipping industry, and I understand that when the Foreign Affairs Committee will form recommendations that will then be put to the recently visited Kenya, it had discussions with Kenya’s international community. We expect the taskforce to Foreign Minister and, probably, Professor George Saitoti, conclude its work by the autumn. who was tragically killed in a helicopter crash a few I say to the Chairman of the Foreign Affairs Committee days ago, about whether we could get the bilateral that nothing is predetermined and to the hon. Member arrangement for the transfer of pirates back on track. I for Falkirk (Eric Joyce) that we do not have any set, am grateful to the Chairman of the Committee for the predetermined ideas. We hope to work with the shipping work that he has done, and I hope that Kenya will not industry and carry it with us. Countries face dilemmas only carry on accepting pirates, but reactivate the MOU, when addressing ransom payments, and we have heard because it is incredibly important. Kenya is a big regional today some powerful speeches outlining the arguments player and it is important that it does that. for and against. The bottom line is that the UK Another positive development to come out of the Government’s position is strong and consistent: we do London conference was the agreement between the not outlaw ransom payments—we have not banned Seychelles and Somaliland to start the process of post-trial them—but neither do we facilitate or encourage them. transfers of prisoners, whereby pirates convicted in the Furthermore, it is worth pointing out that most countries Seychelles can be transferred to Somaliland to serve that do facilitate the payment of ransoms have had their sentences. The first such transfer of 17 prisoners more personnel kidnapped in Africa, more smaller vessels took place in late March, and we understand that pirated and more people taken hostage than the UK. I further exchanges are being planned for the coming do not think that it is an accident that we have a robust months. Puntland is also in the process of agreeing line on this. We as a Government will not facilitate it. If similar arrangements with the Seychelles, and we are pirates or hostage-takers take a Brit hostage, they will pleased that Mauritius has recently made progress in know that the UK Government will not come up with a setting up a similar scheme with both Puntland and the cheque, unlike some countries. transitional federal Government. All that important I agree entirely with the hon. Member for Cheltenham work means that pirates will be able to be taken to those that if a Government condone and facilitate the payment areas for the purposes of detention and prosecution, of ransoms, that will only encourage more pirates and and they will then be sent to either Puntland or Somaliland hostage takers. However, I entirely take on board the to serve their sentences. point made by the hon. Member for Falkirk, who The main criticism from countries in the region was touched on the tragic case of a merchant vessel that has that they did not want to bear the cost of imprisoning been pirated and the ransom not paid. The crew members such people—many of whom are sentenced to long are rotting in hell, which is an appalling situation. terms of imprisonment—and that they should serve I assure Members that what has been said in this their sentence in Somalia, so that problem is being debate will be fed through to the taskforce. Nothing has addressed. I am very pleased that the UK Government been predetermined, and this is very much a work in have been able to put a lot of money into building up progress. We will work with and listen to the industry. I the judicial capacity. I thank the United Nations Office have read the brief sent to the House by the Chamber of on Drugs and Crime, which is one of our key partners Shipping. It is a powerful set of representations, which, on that agenda. of course, we will not ignore. We are a great maritime 173WH Piracy (Somalia)14 JUNE 2012 Piracy (Somalia) 174WH

[Mr Bellingham] has gone from bad to worse. On the other hand, as I have said, a number of strong indicators mean that we nation and the last thing we want is for those companies can be, not ridiculously, but cautiously optimistic that in our shipping industry, which plays a vital part in our we can look forward to progress on the ground in economy and is part of our growth programme, to go Somalia. Indeed, if places such as Puntland have proper offshore, away from the UK. local government in place and their militias and police Secondly, the Prime Minister signed an agreement are able to drive pirates out of those communities, and with the Government of the Seychelles to work together if the same happens in Galmudug, the solution lies on to create the Regional Anti-Piracy Prosecutions Intelligence the land. The African Union Mission In Somalia has Co-ordination Centre, or RAPPICC—what an appalling taken control of Afgooye, which is north of Mogadishu; acronym—in the Seychelles. The project will bring together it is looking, through new consulate operations, to head a number of international partners to pull together the south to Kismayo, and on the way, hopefully, take a material that we have to create evidence packages to number of villages and towns that have currently hosted bring those behind the piracy business model—the pirates. If we can then reinforce that by building up negotiators, the financiers, the co-ordinators and the stability and putting in substantial amounts of money—not kingpins—to justice. penny-packet sums, which obviously are needed in some places to reward communities who have driven away the At the London conference, Holland announced that pirates, but substantial development—into services, it would provide ¤300,000 and two members of staff to infrastructure and building that community, the Somalis RAPPICC. Other countries have also promised money, deserve nothing less, and by working with them we can and we hope that the United States will go firm on its give them a better future. promise to commit. Furthermore, as I think the hon. Member for Cheltenham pointed out, we have seconded The Committee can be proud of its work in contributing a director to RAPPICC from the Serious Organised impressively to the debate. We will go on working with Crime Agency. While the new building is being built, it to find solutions to this scourge, this problem, this the centre will start its work in temporary offices in the evil. I look forward to further exchanges with the Chairman Seychelles from this week. We hope that the new building and the members of his Committee; I thank them again will be finished by the end of the year and that my hon. for their work. Friend the Shipping Minister will be able to open it. The new initiatives will complement what we already 4.40 pm do with our partners to track and tackle the financial flows of piracy. We are keen supporters of working Richard Ottaway: I am grateful to the Minister for group 5 of the contact group on piracy off the coast of the very detailed response that the subject deserves. Somalia—the working group is chaired by Italy—which I will not detain the Chamber for long. I have three is charged with co-ordinating and driving forward quick points. The right hon. Member for Warley international activity to track and stop the money. (Mr Spellar) intervened to ask about the Committee’s We are committed to the work of the financial action position on prosecution policy. I happily confirm that taskforce, in which we work with regional partners to the Committee’s position is as I, and the Minister, set establish effective regimes against money laundering out. It is preferable for a prosecution to be successfully and illicit financing. We continue to encourage a greater dealt with locally, otherwise it should come back to the flow of information from our partners in industry to United Kingdom. ensure that all possible levers can be utilised to follow We have had interesting divisions on ransoms. The and stop the money, and stop those behind the practice truth of the matter is that there is no answer; both of piracy. We need to do more to understand those arguments are right. There is merit in both sides of the flows, to interpret them better, to intercept and disrupt argument. Frankly, it is better to focus on preventing them, and to use all mechanisms at our disposal, including capture than on paying a ransom. There is a difference examining money laundering laws in many different between corporate interest and the private interest of countries and the work of Interpol. I hope that RAPPICC the yachtsman. will help us raise our game substantially. I will conclude with some comments on the guidance. In conclusion—I have probably spoken for too long I am grateful to the Department for Transport for already—Her Majesty’s Government will continue our providing the guidance during the debate. I have had a multi-dimensional approach to tackling and undermining brief chance to look at it. There are clearly substantial the different parts of the piracy model. Progress is being changes, which are welcome. The Minister is right to say made. There is no question but that pirates have had a that it is not as much as we were calling for. It is very tough time, because while the number of attacks probably best to say that in the preparation of our has not been reduced, the number of successful attacks report, we have had legal advice and I will run the has reduced substantially. Navies have become more guidance past our lawyers. I recognise, however, that robust in their response and, as I have mentioned, there are important changes. I also note that the Crown action and logistics on land have sent a very strong Prosecution Service guidance is still incorporated. I signal. The industry is now incredibly professional, and suspect that there is no alternative, because that is the the fact that not one single vessel with private armed law of Britain. Perhaps therein lies the problem—if we guards on board has been successfully hijacked is a very are to have a separate law out in the Indian ocean, it strong and good sign of why we changed the guidelines would require primary legislation that may not currently and of our ongoing work. be in the coalition’s plan. As so many hon. and right hon. Members have The guidance has also thrown up an interesting pointed out, the problem is the result of a failed state. It distinction in devolved law, distinguishing Scottish law is one of the symptoms of a country, Somalia, which and the law of England and Wales. I am not quite sure 175WH Piracy (Somalia)14 JUNE 2012 Piracy (Somalia) 176WH exactly which applies when the red duster is flying on a and Wales. [Interruption.] That is very interesting; piracy ship. However, it is interesting to note, under footnote off Scotland will have to be investigated. 15 of paragraph 8.10, that the use of lethal force in Clearly, a lot of questions need to be considered, and Scotland will only be justified in defence of life, or by a the Committee will do that. The Minister’s suggestion victim resisting rape. That is quite a high bar. that we have a further short debate on this subject is constructive. It may not be inappropriate for the Shipping Mike Penning: I am very proud to represent the red Minister to debate it, but I leave that to others to decide. duster for the UK; this is not a devolved matter. If Mr Brady, I am very grateful to you for chairing the someone is on a British-registered red duster ship, UK debate, which has been particularly constructive. law prevails over international law. Question put and agreed to. Richard Ottaway: I am grateful for that intervention, which begs a question about the need for a footnote 4.44 pm about distinguishing Scottish law and the law of England Sitting adjourned.

37WS Written Ministerial Statements14 JUNE 2012 Written Ministerial Statements 38WS

The GAC was chaired by the Danish EU presidency, Written Ministerial Mr Nicolai Wammen, Minister for European Affairs. A provisional report of the meeting can be found at: http://www.consilium.europa.eu/uedocs/cms_data/docs/ Statements pressdata/EN/genaff/129266.pdf Multiannual Financial Framework Thursday 14 June 2012 The General Affairs Council focused on the proposed multiannual financial framework (MFF) for the period BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS between 2014 and 2020. The meeting was the first discussion of all areas of the MFF and looking at all National Minimum Wage areas of the latest version of the “negotiating box text”. This text is not binding but will set the tone and the direction of future discussions on the MFF. The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Business, The version of the negotiating box text discussed at Innovation and Skills (Norman Lamb): I am pleased to the General Affairs Council, which I have deposited in announce that the Government have today written to the Library of the House, contains positive language on the Low Pay Commission setting out the remit for their the need to focus EU spending on areas that promote 2013 report. growth. It also explicitly states that, The Government support the national minimum wage “it is essential that the future MFF reflects the consolidation (NMW) because of the protection it provides to low-paid efforts being made by Member States to bring deficit and debt workers and the incentives to work it provides. Our aim onto a more sustainable path”. is to have NMW rates that help as many low-paid This is helpful to us; however there were less helpful workers as possible, while making sure that we do not parts of the text with options for macro-economic damage their employment prospects. conditionality and reform to own resources, including the rebate and the possibility of a financial transaction The Low Pay Commission (LPC) is asked to: tax. Monitor, evaluate and review the levels of each of the different NMW rates and make recommendations on the I argued that text relating to the UK rebate should levels it believes should apply from October 2013. not be in the negotiating box for discussion, as any changes to the own resources decision, including those Review the contribution the NMW could make to the employment prospects of young people, including those in required to amend the UK rebate, require consensus apprenticeships. As part of this review, the LPC is asked to among member states. The UK would not agree to any consider the implications of the introduction of the raising changes to the UK rebate or any new own resources of the participation age in England on the youth rates and such as a financial transaction tax and therefore their the apprentice rate. inclusion was . Review the accommodation offset. At the meeting I also reiterated points I have made at Evaluate the regulations for salaried hours workers and previous meetings of the GAC: that at least ¤100 billion consider whether there are any measures that the Government of savings had to be made from the proposals made by could take to ensure that it is as simple and easy as possible the Commission and that reste à liquider (RAL or for employers to make sure they are paying at least the unspent commitments) remained an important issue to NMW and for individuals to be confident that they are being paid at least the NMW. be resolved. In evaluating and making recommendations in the June European Council areas set out above, the LPC is asked to take account of There was also a presentation of the agenda for the the state of the economy and employment and June European Council which will cover the MFF, unemployment levels. There is also the wider policy justice and home affairs, and possible foreign policy context to consider, including pensions’ reform, the issues if the circumstances allow. The main focus of the introduction of universal credit, the raising of the personal June European Council however will be on the growth tax allowance, any implications of the proposed abolition agenda, in particular the completion of the European of the Agricultural Wages Board for England and Wales Semester—which gives macro-economic and fiscal guidance (pending the outcome of the legislative process), and to member states, and the ideas the European Council other Government reforms that may affect the NMW. called for in March. Timing G20 Summit in Los Cabos The LPC is asked to report to the Prime Minister, The presidency also discussed the preparations for Deputy Prime Minister, and the Secretary of State for the G20 summit in Los Cabos. The discussion followed Business, Innovation and Skills by the end of February the priorities for the EU set out in the joint letter from 2013. EU President Herman Van Rompuy and the President Copies of the remit have been placed in the Libraries of the European Commission Jose Manuel Barroso to of both Houses. member states. These were: growth and employment; strengthening the international financial architecture; progress on financial sector reform; and tackling food FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE security and promoting development. General Affairs Council Croatia Finally, I welcomed the Commission’s recent report on Croatia, underlined the importance of continued The Minister for Europe (Mr David Lidington): I monitoring of the fulfilment of commitments, and noted attended the General Affairs Council (GAC) which met that completing the process successfully and credibly in Brussels on 29 May. was important for both Croatia and the EU. 39WS Written Ministerial Statements14 JUNE 2012 Written Ministerial Statements 40WS

HOME DEPARTMENT Justice and Home Affairs Council

The Secretary of State for the Home Department Disclosure and Barring Service (Appointments) (Mrs Theresa May): The Justice and Home Affairs (JHA) Council was held on 7 and 8 June in Luxembourg. My right hon. and learned Friend the Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice and I attended on The Minister for Equalities (Lynne Featherstone): The behalf of the United Kingdom. The following items new Disclosure and Barring Service (DBS) will bring were discussed. together the work of the Criminal Records Bureau and the Independent Safeguarding Authority, and represents The Council began in mixed committee with Norway, an important element of the Government’s reforms to Iceland, Liechtenstein and Switzerland (non-EU Schengen the disclosure and barring arrangements. states) with an update on the second generation Schengen information system (SIS II). Commissioner Malmström I am pleased to announce that the following senior reported that the delivery of SIS II remained on schedule appointments have been made to the DBS: for the first quarter of 2013. Initial feedback on the Chairman of the Disclosure and Barring Service: Bill Griffiths, Milestone 2 tests had been positive, with a full report formerly chair of the Forensic Science Service due in July. The UK supports the current SIS II project. Chief Executive: Adrienne Kelbie, currently deputy chief Next, the presidency led a political debate on Schengen executive and corporate director of Business Support for governance based on the first biannual report from the Hull city council. European Commission. The Commission called for more These appointments will take effect later this year. accurate and current data on secondary flows within the EU; looked forward to the swift adoption of the visa liberalisation temporary suspension mechanism; and encouraged member states to make better use of Modern Workplace Consultation the Schengen information system and supplementary (Government Response) information request at the national entry (SIRENE) bureaus. It also drew the Council’s attention to the non-binding guidelines contained in the report on The Minister for Equalities (Lynne Featherstone): Today temporary residence permits and travel documents and the Government are publishing their response to an on the exercise of police powers in internal border element of the modern workplaces consultation. This is areas. There was some agreement by member states on our proposal to require employers who lose an employment the need for more accurate data on secondary movements tribunal case on equal pay to carry out a pay audit. within the Schengen area and on the need to reach swift We have considered the responses to the consultation agreement with the European Parliament on the visa carefully, and we intend to proceed with this proposal. suspension mechanism. The UK also highlighted the This will mean that an employment tribunal which importance of tackling criminality, human trafficking, finds that an employer has discriminated on grounds of abuse of free movement, document fraud and the need sex in contractual or non-contractual pay will be obliged for an effective returns policy to combat illegal migration, to order the employer to conduct a pay audit in cases including the readmission agreement with Turkey. where continuing discrimination is likely. An audit would The presidency called on the Council to accept its not be ordered if an audit has been completed in the compromise on the two legislative instruments: the Schengen last three years, the employer has transparent pay practices evaluation and monitoring mechanism (SEMM) and or the employer can show a good reason why it would the Schengen borders code (SBC). Where the evaluation not be useful. Micro businesses will initially be exempt of a member state showed persistent and serious from the proposals. shortcomings threatening public policy or internal security, the Council would be able to reintroduce internal borders The Government intend to issue a further consultation for up to two years through the amended SBC. The only later this year on the exact details of how the audits will outstanding issue for the SEMM was the change in operate and what publication requirements will apply. legal base from article 77 TFEU to article 70. We will work closely with business organisations and other interested stakeholders throughout this process, Member states agreed to change the legal base, which and we will seek an opportunity to bring forward legislation the UK welcomed as rightly reflecting the UK’s partial when parliamentary time allows. participation in the Schengen acquis. While the UK had yet to complete its domestic parliamentary processes, This proposal will supplement “Think, Act, Report”, the Government position was not to opt out. The UK which is a simple, voluntary, step by step framework to also noted that the compromise package on the SBC help companies think about gender equality in their correctly reflected that it was for the Council to decide workforces, on key issues like recruitment, retention, on the imposition of internal border controls rather promotion, and pay. Between them, these measures than the Commission. show our commitment to use of voluntary measures in The presidency concluded agreement on the proposals most circumstances, and to act firmly where there is and said that the European Parliament would be need. approached to launch formal trilogue discussions on The response will be published on the Home Office the SBC and to hold informal discussions on the SEMM. website at: www.homeoffice.gov.uk/equalities and a copy The Commission issued a declaration reserving its rights will be placed in the House Library. Responses to other under the treaties to challenge the legal base and balance elements of the modern workplaces consultation will be of institutional competencies before the European Court published in due course. of Justice. 41WS Written Ministerial Statements14 JUNE 2012 Written Ministerial Statements 42WS

Over lunch many member states acknowledged the The Council adopted the Council conclusions on a case for revising the data protection directive, but raised global alliance against child sexual abuse online. The concerns about the effect on the processing of information Commission noted they had been in close contact with by member state authorities and about whether the the USA and would raise the global alliance at the proposals respected subsidiarity. Obligations on data 20 and 21 June EU-US ministerial. The UK supports controllers and the effect of the directive on existing this initiative. international agreements were also discussed. The Council also adopted the Council conclusions The main Council started with a discussion on the on the Europol information system (EIS) in the fight common European asylum system. The presidency updated against cross-border crime. The UK supports the increased the Council on progress in trilogue with the European use of the EIS. Parliament on the Dublin regulation and reception A brief update was presented on legal migration conditions directive, with the asylum procedures directive proposals. Trilogue with the European Parliament had to follow shortly thereafter, and noted the adoption by commenced on the directive on intra-corporate transferees the Commission of its proposal for a revised Eurodac while the seasonal workers directive was still under regulation. During the discussion the Commission reminded discussion at working group level. the Council of the need to ensure the new asylum The presidency informed the Council that negotiations package added value and was consistent with the case were ongoing on the proposed visa reciprocity mechanism law of the European courts. In general, member states and visa liberalisation suspension clause. The UK has welcomed the new proposal on Eurodac. The UK has not opted in to these measures and does not take part in opted in to the Dublin regulation and is considering its Schengen visa arrangements. participation in the new Eurodac proposal. The UK has not opted in to the two other directives. The Justice day began with presidency reaching a general approach on the directive access to a lawyer. The presidency urged the Council to maintain This is the third proposal on the EU’s criminal procedural momentum on the solidarity measures being deployed rights road map, and it sets minimum standards for the to support member states under pressure and to ensure rights of defence. The UK did not opt in to this directive the necessary follow up was discussed at a political because the Commission’s proposal as originally drafted level. The presidency provided an update on the Greek would have had an adverse impact on our ability to taskforce and made suggestions to involve the UN investigate and prosecute crime. The UK explained that Refugee Agency (UNHCR) in the registration and the concerns which had led them not to opt in had been processing of asylum claims; increase the necessary resolved in this text. Cyprus will take forward negotiations staffing for the three new services; and provide for with the European Parliament during their presidency. further involvement by the International Organisation The Government will consult Parliament on any decision for Migration and Frontex on returns. The European to opt in post adoption. Asylum Support Office presented a quick overview of The Council also reached a general approach on the asylum trends in the EU. The Commission supported regulation on jurisdiction and the recognition and constant monitoring of the solidarity effort but warned enforcement of judgments in civil and commercial matters that asylum challenges would not be dealt with effectively (Brussels I). The UK noted it had not completed by focusing on illegal migration trends. The UK takes parliamentary scrutiny on the proposal. the view that solidarity work should focus on preventative action and practical co-operation. Next, the presidency secured agreement for a multi- annual framework for the European Union Agency for In a discussion on readmission agreements, the presidency Fundamental Rights (FRA) for 2013-17, which sets out hoped the Council conclusions on co-operation with the themes for its work. The presidency’s text excludes Turkey would be agreed soon, which would allow swift police and judicial co-operation in criminal matters. progress to be made on the EU-Turkey readmission The UK supports the decision not to extend the remit agreement. The earliest adoption date would be 21 June, and believes it should not be extended until after the at the Employment, Social Policy, Health and Consumer FRA’s planned evaluation. The framework will be sent Affairs Council. It appealed to the two member states to the European Parliament for its consent. with outstanding reservations to agree the conclusions The presidency reached a partial general approach before that time. The UK supports the rapid conclusion on two draft regulations establishing two new funding of the EU-Turkey readmission agreements, which will programmes—the justice programme and the rights be subject to a UK opt-in decision. On Pakistan, the and citizenship programme, for the period 2014-20. Commission were in Islamabad on 12 June to discuss These are successors to the existing funding programmes implementation of the readmission agreement and invited in the current Fundamental Rights and Justice framework. delegations to attend. As the draft regulation for the proposed justice programme Presenting his biannual report, the EU counter-terrorism has been issued under title V of the treaty on the co-ordinator (Gilles de Kerchove) spoke of the importance functioning of the European Union (TFEU), the UK of ensuring co-operation between EU agencies in combating opt-in applies. The UK has not opted in to this programme. terrorism and suggested Frontex could begin to play a The opt-in does not apply to the draft regulation establishing role in combating terrorism at the EU’s external borders. the rights and citizenship programme and the UK put He also highlighted the link between security and down a scrutiny reservation on the article regarding the development and called for EU action to prevent the protection of financial interests of the Union. emergence of terrorist safe havens in Africa. The UK There was an orientation debate on the Commission’s supports work being done in these areas of concern in proposal for a common European sales law (CESL). the CT field and encourages future EU engagement on The purported aim of the CESL proposal is to stimulate this work. growth by facilitating cross-border trade, providing legal 43WS Written Ministerial Statements14 JUNE 2012 Written Ministerial Statements 44WS certainty and simplifying the process for businesses and A policy debate was held on the blue belt pilot project consumers. The CESL would not replace existing national which had been initiated under the Belgian presidency laws, but would be an alternative regime to the existing to look at reducing administrative barriers to sea trade, contract law regime in each member state. The Cypriot especially in the area of customs formalities. The presidency presidency will continue negotiations on the proposal. concluded that there was support for the Commission The Government are currently evaluating the results of taking initiatives to follow up the project, including their recent call for evidence on this proposal. legislation, though there would need to be analysis first The presidency also reported on three other negotiations to ensure benefits would justify costs. I noted that there which were in trilogue with the European Parliament. would need to be much greater clarity on benefits before They hoped to have a first reading deal finalised by the any consideration was given to setting the project in a end of the month on the victims and cybercrime directives; legislative context. regarding the victims directive the Government have Under any other business, the Commission provided written to both Houses requesting scrutiny clearance. an update on the inclusion of aviation in the emissions The European investigation order was unfortunately trading system (ETS): compliance with the 31 March proceeding much more slowly due to delays in the emissions reporting deadline had been high, although European Parliament. Chinese and Indian airlines had refused to comply with Over lunch there was an orientation debate on the the ETS following a direction from their respective data protection regulation which covered public and administrations. The US Senate held a hearing on the private sector obligations and the balance of protection ETS prohibition Bill on 6 June—DG Clima testified at of personal data and administrative burdens. the hearing. Discussions at the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO) continued, the next significant meeting would be at the end of June, when the ICAO TRANSPORT Council would discuss market based measures. I stressed the need to continue to maintain a united EU position EU Transport Council to opposition. I highlighted that what we want is a global deal, with a target and specific measures. The Secretary of State for Transport (Justine Greening): Also under other business, the Commission reported I attended the final Transport Council under the Danish on delays in the introduction of the European electronic presidency (the presidency) in Luxembourg on Thursday tolling service (EETS) which should allow drivers to 7 June. pay road tolls in any country with a single on-board The Council reached a partial general approach on unit and account. Finally, the Commission reported on two multi-annual financial framework (MFF)-related the recent conference on piracy and maritime transport. regulations: a proposal for a regulation of the European I also met with my French, Dutch and Italian Parliament and of the Council establishing the connecting counterparts to discuss EU and bilateral issues in the Europe facility and a proposal for a regulation of the margins of the Council. European Parliament and of the Council on the implementation and exploitation of the European satellite Fixed Penalty Notices for Careless Driving navigation systems. I made statements on both regulations saying that The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Transport while we supported what had been negotiated so far in (Mike Penning): The Department has today published a the text, we could not formally support the draft regulations consultation paper on changes to the treatment of penalties ahead of the agreement on the overall MFF negotiations for careless driving and other motoring offences. This as this might prejudge the overall MFF budget. follows up key commitments from the Government’s On the proposal for a regulation establishing the strategic framework for road safety published in May connecting Europe facility, I supported an Irish proposal 2011. that would allow co-funding for road schemes where With careless driving, the current enforcement process there were isolated (rail) networks as defined in the is time consuming and inefficient. We are therefore TEN-T regulation. I also stressed that our participation proposing to make careless driving a fixed penalty in the core corridors was subject to the provisions of offence and open to the offer of education training. We Art 172 of the treaty that require member state approval believe this will help the police to enforce against this and would be kept under review until we saw the final offence more efficiently. It will also provide greater requirements in the TEN-T regulation before finalising flexibility in dealing with those low level careless driving our position. behaviours that fall below the threshold for a court The Council reached a general approach on a proposal summons, enabling the greater use of educational training. for a regulation of the European Parliament and of the We will also be consulting on raising the level of Council on the establishment of rules and procedures many motoring fixed penalty notices, including increasing with regard to the introduction of noise-related operating the penalty levels for many (usually endorsable) road restrictions at European Union airports within a balanced traffic £60 FPN offences to £90. We have broadened the approach and repealing directive 2002/30/EC. I was scope of the measure and are consulting on other able to welcome the general approach text, which would options including increasing the levels for non-endorsable reassure the public that at the local and EU level we offences, motor insurance offences, and graduated fixed were taking noise management seriously. penalties—all by a similar proportion. The presidency provided progress reports on two Most of these penalty levels have not been increased proposals to bring EU law in line with provisions of the since 2000 and are lower than other fixed penalties such 2006 (ILO) maritime labour convention, noting some of as for disorder. This risks offences being perceived as the outstanding issues following official level discussions. minor infringements. In addition, increasing penalty 45WS Written Ministerial Statements14 JUNE 2012 Written Ministerial Statements 46WS levels will encourage the introduction of educational the universal credit, personal independence payment and courses for other offences, such as not wearing a seat working-age benefits (decisions and appeals) regulations belt and the proposed careless driving fixed penalty. 2012; There are no proposals to make any changes to the universal credit, personal independence payment and penalty levels for parking restriction FPN offences. working-age benefits (claims and payments) regulations 2012; These measures will play an important role in improving the jobseeker’s allowance regulations 2012; and road safety for all road users as well as maintaining the employment and support allowance regulations 2012. compliance with motoring laws. In addition SSAC will scrutinise the draft housing The consultation documents can be found on the benefit (benefit cap) regulations 2012 and the draft Department’s website. An electronic copy has been universal credit regulations 2012. The universal credit lodged with the House Library. regulations provide detail of the new single benefit, including entitlement, elements of the award, calculation of income and capital, and claimant responsibilities. I WORK AND PENSIONS have asked the Committee to consider this set of regulations, which are not covered by the Social Security Administration Act 1992, for consultation over the summer in addition Draft Universal Credit Regulations to those sent for formal scrutiny. The Committee will decide today whether it intends The Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Mr Iain to consult on these regulations and what form that Duncan Smith): The Welfare Reform Act 2012 sets out consultation will take. the overall framework for universal credit. The Draft universal credit regulations, along with other implementation of these arrangements will require the sets that are selected for consultation, will be published passage of detailed regulations. on both the SSAC and DWP website shortly along with The Department, as required by the Social Security details of any consultation process. I will place a copy Administration Act 1992, has submitted the following of the draft regulations in the House Library. We intend draft regulations to the independent Social Security to lay the final universal credit regulations before Parliament Advisory Committee (SSAC) for formal scrutiny: later in the year.

5P Petitions14 JUNE 2012 Petitions 6P

Spending Review in October 2010. The Government Petition also announced the list of local major transport schemes that will be funded in this spending review period on Thursday 14 June 2012 29 November and 14 December 2011. OBSERVATIONS Proposals for an M4 link road were not included in such plans given that a funding proposition had not been previously made to Government. No new local TRANSPORT transport schemes will now be considered for funding M4 link road (Kingswood) before 2015. The Petition of residents of the Kingswood constituency, The Government are considering a new system for Declares that an “M4 link road” near Emersons prioritising and funding local major schemes after 2015, Green would help to reduce congestion on the M4 from in particular, whether funding should be devolved so the Kingswood area; that such a road would reduce that decisions can be made at a more local level. A journey distances by residents by a significant distance consultation describing how this system might work and thereby reduce pollution; and that a link road (https://consultation.dft.gov.uk/dft/2012-04) was launched would also help to boost the local economy and help to on 31 January 2012. This consultation has now closed create local jobs. and we are considering the responses. The Petitioners therefore request that the House of For local schemes such as this, that can unlock Commons urges the Government to consider the employment and housing development, we would expect construction of a link road between the M4 and the Local Authorities and Local Enterprise Partnerships to Avon ring road (A4174). consider a range of funding sources including private And the Petitioners remain, etc.—[Presented by Chris sector contributions. Skidmore, Official Report, 26 April 2012; Vol. 543, The Government have provided £770 million for the c. 1208.] Growing Places Fund which aims to set up revolving [P001024] local funds to address infrastructure constraints, promote Observations from the Secretary of State for Transport: economic growth and the delivery of jobs and houses, The Government have set out their plans for future as well as planned new flexibilities open to Local Authorities investment for the strategic road network as part of the such as Community Infrastructure Levy and Business outcomes of the Government’s 2010 Comprehensive Rate Retention.

521W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 522W

Since September 2011 we have been routinely collecting Written Answers to data on formal complaints to DEFRA and its agencies.

Service Standards Questions Service Standards Complaints received Complaints 1 September received 2010-11 2011-31 March 2012 Thursday 14 June 2012 Core DEFRA 5 3

Executive agencies ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL AFFAIRS Animal Health and Veterinary 46 33 Laboratories Agency Complaints Rural Payments Agency 1,378 596 Food and Environment 16 9 Research Agency Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Centre for Environment, 11 Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many Fisheries and Aquaculture complaints about the work of her Department and each Science of its agencies and non-departmental public bodies Veterinary Medicines n/a 1 Directorate were received in (a) 2010-11 and (b) 2011-12; and if n/a = Not available she will make a statement. [108945] Empty Property Richard Benyon: DEFRA does not routinely keep Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for central records of all complaints for its Executive agencies Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many buildings and non-departmental bodies and fuller data could be owned by her Department and the bodies for which she obtained only at disproportionate cost. is responsible have been empty for more than two years; The data in the following table reflect two snapshots, and if she will make a statement. [110860] one for 2010-11 and one for the second six months of 2011-12, based on formal complaints about the standard Richard Benyon: No buildings owned by Core DEFRA of services provided to the public by core DEFRA and have been empty for more than two years. its agencies. These are complaints that have reached the There are 13 buildings that have been empty for more final stage of core DEFRA or its agencies internal than two years for which the Secretary of State for complaints procedures (eg in core DEFRA this involves Environment, Food and Rural Affairs, my right hon. internal, independent review by the Service Standards Friend the Member for Meriden (Mrs Spelman), is Complaints Adjudicator). The majority of complaints responsible; they are shown in the following table. All are resolved prior to this stage and are not logged but one are buildings held by the Forestry Commission centrally. and part of the public forest estate, which is owned by If complainants are still dissatisfied after the internal the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural procedures have been exhausted, they can ask their MP Affairs and placed at the disposal of the Forestry to refer their case to the parliamentary and health Commissioners under Section (3) 1 of the Forestry Act service ombudsman. 1967.

Holding body Asset name Asset address Asset description

Forestry Commission Warren Cottage Lynford Cross + Lynford, Norfolk Derelict house 20 years +. Private water water supply supply for 14 non-Forestry Commission houses. Capital project 2011-12 to improve water supply to enable disposal of property in the future. Forestry Commission Hazelborough Mech Workshop Hazelborough Wood, Poor wood framed structure. Northamptonshire Forestry Commission Fernworthy Store — Store building. Forestry Commission Luxborough Pol Store — Store building. Forestry Commission Haughmond Office Haughton Crossroads, Shrewsbury, Timber building with felt roof/redundant Shropshire, SY4 4RW small office. Forestry Commission High Stand Office Armathwaite, Carlisle, Redundant small forester office. Forestry Commission Bakerstead Barn Eskdale, , Cumbria, CA19 Stone building. 1UA Forestry Commission Bothy Grizedale, Ambleside, Cumbria, LA22 Single storey stone clad former bunkhouse. OQJ Forestry Commission Old Bike Hire Unit and Picnic Area Grizedale, Ambleside, Cumbria, LA22 Former bike shop—timber shed. OQJ Forestry Commission Hawkhope Farmhouse Falstone, Hexham, NE48 1DD Redundant dwelling on three storeys. Forestry Commission Brown Head Farmhouse Brown Head Farmhouse, Cropton, Dilapidated bothy. Pickering, NO Forestry Commission Low Leaf Howe House Low Leaf Howe, Stape, Pickering, Y018 Detached stone walled farmhouse, semi 8HP derelict. Agriculture and Horticulture The Former Pig Unit Hitchin Rd, Stotfold, Hitchin, Herts Former pig unit—site is being sold and Development Board SG5 4JG currently under offer. 523W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 524W

Rural Areas: Business We set out, in our White Paper, The Importance of Teaching, how schools will be freed from central Simon Kirby: To ask the Secretary of State for Government direction, and how we will trust the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what steps her professional judgment of teachers to decide on the Department has taken to promote the interests of rural teaching that best meets the needs of their pupils. businesses. [110884] Consistent with that principle, we have also protected front line school budgets, and reduced central Government programmes, so that schools can also decide how to use Richard Benyon: DEFRA works across Government their resources to meet local priorities. We therefore ensuring measures designed to support business and have no plans to create a database of personal finance economic growth are having proportionate and positive education teaching resources and volunteers. Schools impacts in rural areas. are aware that there are a number of sources available On 29 November 2011, the Government announced from which they can obtain useful information, including, a strong package of new measures, designed to stimulate for example, the Personal Finance Education Group, sustainable growth in the rural economy and help businesses who have a wide range of resources on their website reach their full potential. The results of this include the aimed at teachers and finance education practitioners. establishment of five Rural Growth Network pilots in 2012-13, which are designed to stimulate sustainable growth in the rural economy and to help businesses WORK AND PENSIONS reach their full potential, and the targeting of £100 million of Rural Development Programme for England Housing and Council Tax Benefits funding at meeting Rural Economy Growth Review priorities. : To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions what the average weekly payment of (a) Broadband connectivity is also vital for small businesses council tax benefit and (b) housing benefit was to a (i) to be able to compete and grow and access new markets. private renter and (ii) social tenant in each year since To complement the Government’s £530 million investment 1997. [110454] to support the roll out of broadband across all rural areas, DEFRA and Broadband Delivery UK have Steve Webb: The available information requested has established the Rural Community Broadband Fund. been placed in the Library. This £20 million fund provides grant support to enable communities and businesses to access superfast broadband Housing Benefit in hard to reach locations. Mr Laws: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (1) how many people aged 18 to 21 years old claimed housing benefit in the latest period for which figures are available; [110485] EDUCATION (2) how many people aged 18 to 21 years old claiming housing benefit also claimed (a) jobseeker’s Financial Services: Education allowance and (b) employment support allowance on incapacity benefit in the latest period for which figures Fiona Bruce: To ask the Secretary of State for are available. [110486] Education if he will consider the creation of a database Steve Webb: The requested information on the number of personal finance teaching resources and volunteers of housing benefit claimants by age is provided in the to help young people; if he will consider a scheme to following table: quality mark such resources where they are made available to teachers; and if he will consider using the Housing benefit recipients by age: February 2012 Personal Finance Education Group charity to deliver Age Number of recipients such a scheme. [110794] Total 5,004,500 18-21 156,890 Mr Gibb: Finance education is currently taught as Source: part of Personal, Social, Health and Economic (PSHE) Single Housing Benefit Extract (SHBE) education. The last OFSTED survey of PSHE, in 2010, Information on the numbers of housing benefit claimants included limited evidence about the teaching of personal also claiming (a) jobseeker’s allowance and (b) finance education because the subject was relatively employment and support allowance is not currently new. We are looking at the quality of finance education available, and could be provided only at disproportionate as part of a review of PSHE to determine how we can cost. improve the quality of all PSHE teaching. Notes: Support from businesses in and outside the financial 1. Age groups are based on the age on the count date (second services sector is important in helping schools with their Thursday in the month), of either: finance education programmes. Schools are already drawing (a) the recipient if they are single, or on expertise from financial institutions, and organisations (b) the eider of the recipient or partner if claiming as a couple such as the Citizens Advice Bureau, to help deliver 2. Recipients are as at the second Thursday of the month. financial capability education. However, we want schools 3. SHBE is a monthly electronic scan of claimant level data direct to have the flexibility to use their judgment about how from local authority computer systems. It replaces quarterly best to deliver finance education, including which external aggregate clerical returns. The data is available monthly from partners to use, rather than for Government to approach November 2008 and February 2012 is the most recent available. businesses directly. 4. Figures are rounded to the nearest 10. 525W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 526W

Human Trafficking Pensioners: Social Security Benefits

Mr Bone: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Mr Crausby: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Pensions what training his Department provides to and Pensions what plans he has to provide information enable its staff to recognise victims of human for pensioners who are paid benefits by Giro cheque trafficking. [111757] about changes to the method of payment. [111599]

Chris Grayling: The learning programme for the Steve Webb: We are writing to those currently being Department for Work and Pensions focuses on raising paid by cheque to tell them that cheques are ending and awareness of the customer’s personal circumstances that they must let us know how they want to be paid in and also recognises that these can affect individuals in the future. We will ensure that people are clear about different ways and will change over time. their payment options once cheques end and that, for All staff receive foundation learning which covers those moving to the new Simple Payment service, the excellent customer service, diversity and customer needs. change is as seamless as possible. These deal with the wide range of circumstances that our customers may have, some less obvious than others, Mr Crausby: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and stress how important it is to look for signs where and Pensions how many pensioners were receiving the customer does not give us this information directly benefit payment by Giro cheque on the most recent and to offer appropriate support. date for which figures are available. [111600] In particular the learning programme for Jobcentre Plus advisers is regularly updated to ensure advisers Steve Webb: The information is not available in the have up-to-date skills to deal with any customer interaction, format requested as data held relates to “payment accounts”. and supports them in making relevant and appropriate A customer may receive benefits in the form of a decisions on individual customers. The key messages separate cheque payment for each benefit to which they throughout the learning focus on providing a personalised, are entitled or a single, combined, payment. Each of flexible service to customers and treating them as individuals, these payments is termed a payment account. building strong relationships with them. In February 2012 the total number of pension credit The learning provides an understanding of why this and retirement pension payment accounts totalled 56,380. approach is important; what it means to the claimant; There were an additional 6,920 payment accounts relating what it looks like and how it works in practice. It to attendance allowance. We are unable to quantify the further supports the adviser to identify the range of number of any additional payments accounts for other claimants and the level of individual support they would benefits to which pensioners may be entitled. need to provide. These figures represent less than 0.5% of the total pensions payload. Legionnaires’ Disease: Edinburgh Pensions Mr Darling: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions on how many occasions the Health and Safety Executive in Scotland has visited the premises Mr Frank Field: To ask the Secretary of State for operated by (a) North British Distillery Company, Work and Pensions what the (a) basic state retirement Edinburgh, (b) Macfarlan Smith, Edinburgh and (c) pension, (b) SERPS and S2P awards were as a Burton’s Biscuit factory, Sighthill, Edinburgh, for the proportion of average earnings for (i) men and (ii) purpose of ascertaining that measures to prevent the women with a lifetime of average earnings in each of development and spread of Legionnaires’ disease have the last 30 years. [108296] been taken in each year from 2007 to 2012; and if he will make a statement. [111773] Steve Webb: The information requested is as follows: The information on basic state retirement pension is Chris Grayling: HSE inspectors have made the following provided in the following table. visits between 2007 and 2012 for the purpose of assessing the measures in place to manage legionella risks at these Basic state retirement pension rate as a percentage of average earnings companies: Rate as a percentage of average earnings Date of uprating Female Male (a) North British Distillery Ltd No specific visits to assess the management of legionella risks. November 1981 32.4 21.1 Last inspection was 15 March 2010 to assess their management November 1982 33.2 21.3 of major accident hazards. November 1983 31.3 20.3 (b) Macfarlan Smith Ltd November 1984 30.5 20.0 A visit to assess the management of legionella risks was carried November 1985 30.3 19.9 out on 4 February 2010. July 1986 28.2 18.7 (c) Burtons Foods Ltd April 1987 26.7 17.6 A visit to assess the management of legionella risks was carried April 1988 25.1 16.7 out on 17 June 2008. April 1989 23.9 16.2 Inspections are only one tool that HSE has available April 1990 23.3 15.9 to help companies meet their legal obligations to control April 1991 23.4 16.3 and manage the risks in relation to legionella. HSE also April 1992 22.5 15.9 provides free guidance in addition to ongoing work April 1993 22.2 15.9 with water treatment firms and trade bodies. April 1994 22.0 15.9 527W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 528W

Basic state retirement pension rate as a percentage of average earnings Additional Pension (AP) at award as percentage of average earnings Rate as a percentage of average earnings in the year pension age is reached Date of uprating Female Male AP at award as percentage of average earnings in that year April 1995 21.7 15.6 Financial year April 1996 21.6 15.6 pension age reached Female Male April 1997 20.8 15.0 1995-96 14.9 17.7 April 1998 20.5 14.8 1996-97 15.9 18.8 April 1999 20.2 14.7 1997-98 16.2 19.2 April 2000 19.6 14.3 1998-99 17.3 20.2 April 2001 19.8 14.5 1999-2000 16.6 19.5 April 2002 19.5 14.4 2000-01 16.6 19.8 April 2003 19.3 14.4 2001-02 16.4 19.6 April 2004 19.1 14.5 2002-03 16.1 19.2 April 2005 18.8 14.4 2003-04 16.1 19.2 April 2006 18.7 14.3 2004-05 16.0 19.3 April 2007 18.8 14.4 2005-06 15.1 18.3 April 2008 18.7 14.3 2006-07 14.5 17.5 April 2009 19.0 14.8 2007-08 15.7 18.6 April 2010 19.0 14.9 2008-09 15.5 18.1 April 2011 19.8 15.5 2009-10 15.4 18.2 Notes: 2010-11 15.0 17.9 1. The table is for men and women under age 80 on their own national insurance contribution. 2011-12 14.7 17.4 2. People with a lifetime of average earnings are expected to be Notes: entitled to the full rate of basic state pension. The figures for females 1. The table is for men and women under age 80 on their own national are therefore calculated by dividing the full rate of basic state pension insurance contribution. by average earnings for females. The figures for males are calculated 2. The figures for females are calculated using the average earnings for by dividing the full rate of basic state pension by average earnings for females. The figures for males are calculated using the average earnings males. for males. 3. Average earnings are the means of gross (£) weekly pay for full-time 3. Average earnings are the means of gross (£) weekly pay for full-time employees in United Kingdom. employees in United Kingdom. 4. Average earnings figures for the period prior to 1997 are taken from 4. Average earnings figures for the period prior to 1997 are taken from the New Earnings Survey (NES) estimates of earnings for all adults. the New Earnings Survey (NES) estimates of earnings for all adults. 5. Average earnings figures from 1997 onwards are taken from the 5. Average earnings figures from 1997 onwards are taken from the Annual Survey of Hours and Earnings (ASHE) which replaced the Annual Survey of Hours and Earnings (ASHE) which replaced the New Earnings Survey (NES) in 2004. New Earnings Survey (NES) in 2004. 6. Average earnings for months other than April use the figure for 6. Average earnings for each financial year use the figure for April at April of the same year. the start of that financial year. 7. The rate of basic state pension as a percentage of average earnings 7. AP includes State Earnings Related Pension Scheme and state between 1971 and 2010 is published in table 2.1 of The Abstract of second pension. Statistics for Benefits, National insurance Contributions, and Indices Source: of Prices and Earnings, 2010, Department for Work and Pensions: DWP calculations http://research.dwp.gov.uk/asd/asd1/abstract/abstract2010.pdf 8. The figures for April 2011 are based on the latest earnings data Social Security Benefits: Greater Manchester from ASHE for April 2011 which is subject to revision later this year as standard practice. Source: Graham Stringer: To ask the Secretary of State for DWP calculations Work and Pensions how many people in Blackley and Broughton constituency will be eligible for fewer benefits (b) The information on additional pension is provided upon the introduction of the benefit cap in April 2013. in the following table: [111059] Additional Pension (AP) at award as percentage of average earnings in the year pension age is reached Chris Grayling: The information is not available for AP at award as percentage of average Blackley and Broughton constituency. earnings in that year Financial year Following the concessions made in the House of pension age reached Female Male Commons on 1 February, we estimate that the introduction of an exemption for those in receipt of the support 1982-83 3.3 3.8 component of employment support allowance and a 1983-84 4.1 4.8 grace period of 39 weeks for claimants who have been 1984-85 5.2 6.2 in employment for 52 weeks or more before leaving 1985-86 5.8 6.8 work will reduce the number of households affected by 1986-87 6.5 7.7 the cap to around 57,000. 1987-88 7.5 8.7 This assumes that the situation of these households 1988-89 8.2 9.5 will go unchanged, and they will not take any steps to 1989-90 9.0 10.5 either work enough hours to qualify for working tax 1990-91 10.0 11.7 credit, renegotiate their rent in situ, or find alternative 1991-92 10.6 12.5 accommodation. In all cases the Department is working 1992-93 11.5 13.9 to support households through this transition, using 1993-94 12.7 15.3 existing provision through Jobcentre Plus and the Work 1994-95 13.9 16.7 Programme to move as many into work as possible. 529W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 530W

Universal Credit Veterans

Stephen Timms: To ask the Secretary of State for Karen Lumley: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Work and Pensions whether he plans to offer IT and and Pensions which projects providing assistance to training assistance to housing associations so that they veterans his Department is funding in Worcestershire. can assist in the roll-out of universal credit. [111469] [111001]

Chris Grayling: We are not currently funding any Chris Grayling: We recognise that registered social organisations or projects in Worcestershire which provide landlords are important partners in helping to make assistance specifically to veterans through Flexible Support universal credit (UC) a success and the UC programme Fund or any other DWP funding. is currently developing an approach to working with them during UC roll-out. We are building the UC The following special points should be noted: system to maximise the numbers of people who are able In May we approved £3,540 start up costs for a Work to make their own claim online and it is expected that Club in Kidderminster run by a registered charity called the vast majority of claimants will do this. As such we Forces Support. The charity support families who have do not envisage housing associations requiring specialist lost a serving member of the forces, although the Work IT training in order to assist claimants in using the UC Club is aimed at supporting unemployed people in website. Kidderminster and is not specifically for veterans. Jobcentre Plus has an armed forces champion covering Stephen Timms: To ask the Secretary of State for Herefordshire and Worcestershire who acts as the liaison Work and Pensions who he proposes will determine between the forces, including the Territorial Army, and whether a person is classed as vulnerable for the purposes staff in the local jobcentres. They also attend local of direct payment of rent, or permitting fortnightly liaison groups which support ex-forces personnel to payment periods, when universal credit is introduced. ensure they are kept up to date with the Jobcentre Plus [111470] offer including the Get Britain Working initiatives, the YouthContract, new enterprise allowance and the Work programme all of which can be accessed as early entry Chris Grayling: We are still considering how payment by ex-forces personnel. exception arrangements will work in universal credit. We envisage that the delivery of payment exceptions In addition we will look to use our Flexible Support will be through the core UC delivery organisation and Fund to provide specialist one off training. Examples decisions will be taken by a decision maker. have included SIA licence (security industry) and a locksmith qualification (self employment). We also have a range of FSF grant funded projects in Worcestershire Stephen Timms: To ask the Secretary of State for covering business start up advice, offender support, Work and Pensions with reference to the answer of 31 IAG, job broking and routes into training, parenting January 2012, Official Report, column 523W, on and relationship support, and homelessness support. universal credit, whether it remains his policy that new claims to tax credits will end in April 2014; and if he Ex-forces customers with health issues are supported through our DEA network, as well as employment will make a statement. [111608] related support. Our DEAs and advisers have links with a range of local partners and organisations to which we Chris Grayling: I can confirm that new claims to can refer our customers for specific support, which universal credit will be taken from October 2013 with includes mental health, drug and alcohol, anger new claims to the current benefits and credits, including management, housing, relationship support etc. tax credits for working age claimants, being gradually phased out by the end of April 2014. Work Capability Assessment

Stephen Timms: To ask the Secretary of State for Stephen Timms: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions with reference to his answer of Work and Pensions with reference to his answers of 7 July 2011, Official Report, column 1320W, whether it 24 November 2011, Official Report, columns 569-70W remains his policy that, from October 2013, all new and 17 May 2012, Official Report, column 295W, if he applications for out-of-work support will be treated as will provide statistics drawn from the Department’s claims to universal credit; and if he will make a statement. Management Information System on the total number [111697] of work capability assessments resulting from reassessment which have been completed to date. [111696] Chris Grayling: I can confirm that new claims to universal credit will be taken from October 2013 with Chris Grayling: The data requested is not available. new claims to the current benefits and credits being Official statistics on work capability assessment outcomes gradually phased out by the end of April 2014. for claimants going through the incapacity benefits From April 2013 we will be accepting claims for reassessment programme have now been published and universal credit from a small number of claimants in the Department plans to update these official statistics the Greater Manchester and area. This will be on 3 July 2012. As Official Statistics in this area are now an early controlled implementation and will ensure that available and an update is forthcoming the Department we can learn from our experiences in advance of the does not produce or release other, similar analyses of formal October 2013 go live. the data. 531W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 532W

The latest publication can be found on the Departmental Information on section 22 permits issued since 1985 is website here: not held in the format requested. The Traffic Commissioners http://research.dwp.gov.uk/asd/workingage/ publish in their annual report the numbers of section 22 index.php?page=esa_ib permits issued in Great Britain, copies of which are available in the House Libraries. In 2010/11, 86 section Work Experience 22 permits were issued.

Chris Ruane: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Motor Vehicles: Insurance and Pensions if he will estimate the number of Government-sponsored unpaid workers who were in work placements that (a) were and (b) were not classed Karl McCartney: To ask the Secretary of State for as being of community benefit in the latest period for Transport (1) what steps her Department is taking to which figures are available. [111710] tackle (a) uninsured drivers, (b) fraudulent insurance claims and (c) the cost of motor insurance; [111052] Chris Grayling: The Government do not sponsor (2) what steps have been taken in the last (a) two unpaid workers in work placements. Jobcentre Plus and (b) five years to tackle uninsured drivers. [111074] offers unemployed people a range of employment support programmes to help people get back to work, and the Mike Penning: The Department has taken a number information available is published. of steps to tackle uninsured driving, fraud and the cost Statistics published on 16 May for the period January of motor insurance: 2011 to February 2012 inclusive for the Get Britain (a) The continuous insurance scheme (CIE) introduced last Working measures can be found at: year has enabled enforcement action to be taken against those who keep a vehicle without insurance. CIE supplements police http://statistics.dwp.gov.uk/asd/asd1/pwp/ powers introduced in 2005 to seize uninsured vehicles being pwp_gbw_may12.pdf driven on the road. Statistics for Mandatory Work Activity, released on (b) Working with the insurance industry to allow them access 12 June for the period May 2011 to February 2012 to DVLA driver details on penalty points and disqualifications to inclusive, can be found at: reduce fraud. http://research.dwp.gov.uk/asd/asd1/pwp/mwa_may12.pdf (c) On 2 May the Secretary of State for Transport hosted a cross Government summit with the insurance industry on measures Working Conditions to reduce the cost of premiums to lessen the incentive drive while uninsured. John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions how many investigations into excessive Motor Vehicles: Registration heat in the workplace were conducted by the Health and Safety Executive in each of the last five years. Dr Alasdair McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State [111611] for Transport what action she intends to take to harmonise the systems for retention of vehicle Chris Grayling: The number of investigations into registration marks pending transfer between Northern excessive heat in the workplace conducted by the Health Ireland and Britain. [111005] and Safety Executive in each of the last five years is as follows: Mike Penning: Officials are currently reviewing the changes required to allow registration marks to be Number of investigations retained by customers in Northern Ireland in the same 2007-08 45 way as in Britain. Any changes to regulations are anticipated 2008-09 30 to be introduced next year. 2009-10 30 2010-11 14 Railway Network 2011-12 8 Paul Blomfield: To ask the Secretary of State for The above information is current as at 12 June 2012 Transport over what distance the railway track in and includes both investigations which have been completed Rugby has been remodelled to facilitate higher track and those which are ongoing. speeds as part of the enhancement works of the railway infrastructure since 1998. [110927]

TRANSPORT Mrs Villiers: The reconstruction and remodelling of Rugby station layout and the associated changes to Bus Services signalling took place over approximately 15 miles.

Mr Evennett: To ask the Secretary of State for Paul Blomfield: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport how many operators have permits to run Transport what the (a) former speed and (b) new community bus routes. [111524] higher speed was each time the railway infrastructure was enhanced in Rugby since 1998. [110928] Norman Baker: The Traffic Commissioners are responsible for issuing permits under section 22 of the Mrs Villiers: Reconstruction and re-signalling of the Transport Act 1985 to organisations operating without Rugby station layout area increased line speeds from a a view to profit to provide community bus services. maximum of 75 mph to a maximum of 125 mph. 533W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 534W

Paul Blomfield: To ask the Secretary of State for Train operating company Station Transport what phases of enhancement work have been undertaken on the rail infrastructure in Rugby since Beaconsfield 1998; what (a) new platforms, (b) newly positioned Bicester North platforms and (c) other structures were constructed in Birmingham Moor Street each phase; and what the (i) dates and (ii) costs were of Denham each phase. [110929] Gerrards Cross Mrs Villiers: Development and reconstruction of the Great Missenden station and track layout in use today took place between Haddenham and Thame Parkway 2004 and 2009. Network Rail estimated the total cost of High Wycombe the project at £190 million. London Marylebone Nicky Morgan: To ask the Secretary of State for Northolt Park Transport what assessment her Department has made Princes Risborough of the benefits accruing from renewal of the flyover Seer Green and Jordans provided as part of the enhancement works to railway Stoke Mandeville infrastructure undertaken in Rugby since 1998. [111362] Warwick Mrs Villiers: The Department has not specifically Warwick Parkway appraised the refurbishment of the flyovers at Rugby Wendover that were completed in 2008 as part of the West Coast modernisation programme. The strategy for modernisation East Coast Darlington of the West Coast Main Line was appraised by the Durham Strategic Rail Authority at route-wide level and is reported in “The Modernisation of the West Coast Main Line” published by the National Audit Office in 2006. East Midlands Trains Melton Mowbray

Railway Stations London Midland Acocks Green Apsley : To ask the Secretary of State for Aston Transport which train operating companies have made Berkhamsted requests to (a) close and (b) reduce opening hours at Bletchley station ticket offices in the latest period for which Berkswell figures are available; and in respect of which stations Birmingham Snow Hill such applications have been made. [110066] Blake Street. Mrs Villiers: Since May 2010: Bournville (a) there has been a request from one train operating company, Butlers Lane London Midland, to close station ticket offices as shown in the Canley following table. Chester Road (b) there have been requests from seven train operating companies: Chiltern Railways; East Coast; East Midlands Trains; London Coleshill Parkway Midland; Northern Rail; Southeastern; and South West Trains, Coseley to reduce opening hours at station ticket offices as shown in the table. Cradley Heath Droitwich Spa Train operating company Station Dudley Port

Requests to close station ticket offices Edrington London Midland Adderley Park Five Ways Bescot Stadium Four Oaks Cheddington Gravelly Hill Duddeston Great Malvern Quarter Hall Green Lye Hampton-in-Arden Small Heath Hamstead Witton Hartford Wythall Hemel Hempstead Kidderminster Requests to reduce station ticket offices Kings Langley opening hours Chiltern Railways Aylesbury Vale Parkway Kings Norton Aylesbury Langley Green Banbury Lea Hall 535W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 536W

Train operating company Station Train operating company Station

Leighton Buzzard Sherborne Lichfield City Templecombe Lichfield Trent Valley Long Buckby Malvern Link LEADER OF THE HOUSE Marston Green Northfield Nuneaton DEFRA Question Time Old Hill Olton 8. Miss McIntosh: To ask the Leader of the House Perry Barr what the reasons were for reducing the allocation of oral questions to the Department for Environment, Redditch Food and Rural Affairs; and if he will reconsider that Rowley Regis decision. [111335] Sandwell & Dudley Selly Oak Sir George Young: In April 2011, following a request Shirley from the Official Opposition, the Government increased the time allocated for oral questions to the Deputy Smethwick Galton Bridge Prime Minister. As a consequence of this change it was Smethwick Rolfe Street necessary for other changes to be made to the oral Spring Road questions rota, including reducing the allocation of oral Stechford questions to the Department for Environment, Food Stourbridge Junction and Rural Affairs. Stourbridge Town While the status of the oral questions rota is kept under review, I have no current plans to increase the Stratford upon Avon amount of time allocated to Department for Environment, Sutton Coldfield Food and Rural Affairs oral questions. Tame Bridge Parkway Telford Central The Hawthorns Consideration on Report Tile Hill Tipton 9. Simon Hughes: To ask the Leader of the House what discussions he has had on ensuring that sufficient Tyseley time for debate of new clauses and amendments to University Government Bills is given at Report stage. [111336] Walsall Wellington Sir George Young: The Government recognises the Widney Manor value of parliamentary scrutiny of legislation. This Government has provided more days than the last Winsford administration for Report stages and where necessary Wolverton we will provide more than one day for Report stage. Worcester Foregate Street Worcester Shrub Hill Wylde Green Ministerial Statements Yardley Wood : To ask the Leader of the House if he will take steps to introduce penalties for Ministers who Northern Rail Halifax do not meet the House’s expectations in respect of Northwich ministerial statements. [111327] Mexborough Thorne North Sir George Young: As I said to the right hon. Gentleman Wilmslow in my written answer to him of 22 March 2012, Official Worksop Report, column 796W, Ministers are always mindful of the requirement of the Ministerial Code that, “when Parliament is in session, the most important announcements Southeastern Canterbury East of Government policy should be made in the first instance in Sittingbourne Parliament”. Tunbridge Wells The proposition that there should be specific penalties imposed by this House, over and above those already available, was considered and rejected after the debate South West Trains Feniton which took place on 5 December last year. 537W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 538W

FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE Mr Lidington: The UK fully supports Bosnia and Herzegovina’s NATO membership aspirations. At the Atos Chicago summit on 20-21 May the UK and Allies welcomed the political agreement reached on 9 March Tom Greatrex: To ask the Secretary of State for 2012 on the registration of immoveable defence property Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs (1) what the total as state property. This agreement is an important step monetary value is of each contract between his towards fulfilment of the condition set by NATO Foreign Department and Atos; [111172] Ministers in Tallinn in April 2010 for the full participation (2) when each contract between his Department and of Bosnia and Herzegovina in the Membership Action Atos was most recently (a) agreed, (b) renewed and Plan process. The UK urges Bosnia and Herzegovina to (c) extended. [111173] implement the agreement without delay in order to start the first MAP cycle as soon as possible, and looks Mr Lidington: The Foreign and Commonwealth Office forward to a review of implementation of the agreement has no contracts with Atos. in the autumn. Bahrain Pay

Dan Rogerson: To ask the Secretary of State for Rachel Reeves: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what consideration Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what the (a) he has given to the human rights records of members of highest, (b) median, (c) median full-time equivalent the Bahraini government who plan to visit the UK and (d) lowest full-time equivalent salary was paid by during the London 2012 Olympic and Paralympic Games. (i) his Department and (ii) its associated public bodies [111090] in (A) 2010-11, (B) 2011-12 and (C) 2012-13. [111026]

Alistair Burt: The Government has been clear that Mr Bellingham: The following table indicates the regardless of the country concerned where there is independent, highest, median, median full-time equivalents and lowest reliable and credible evidence that an individual has full-time equivalents for the Foreign and Commonwealth committed human rights abuses, the individual will not Office (FCO) and its associated bodies. normally be permitted to enter the UK. The location related allowances are taken into account Bosnia and Herzegovina for Westminster Foundation for Democracy and Great Britain China Centre but not for the FCO, FCO Services, Karen Lumley: To ask the Secretary of State for British Council or Wilton Park. Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs when he expects The lowest salary figures for Westminster Foundation Bosnia and Herzegovina to fulfil the criteria needed to for Democracy have been withheld due to data protection start the process to enter NATO. [110975] concerns given the small data sample.

FCO table of salaries £ 2012-13 2011-12 2010-11

FCO Highest 180,000 180,000 193,837 Median 27,911 27,911 27,513 Median FTE 28,451 28,451 27,778 Lowest FTE 16,635 16,470 16,135

Wilton Park Highest 115,000 115,000 115,000 Median 21,432 21,432 18,974 Median FTE 21,432 21,696 21,432 Lowest FTE 16,635 16,635 16,135

FCO Services Highest 131,000 131,000 131,000 Median 27,487 27,650 27,421 Median FTE 28,039 28,039 27,639 Lowest FTE 15,750 15,750 15,246

British Council Highest 169,383 169,383 169,383 Median Median FTE 33,075 33,075 31,500 Lowest FTE 15,000 15,000 15,000

WFD Highest 97,000 97,000 97,000 Median 32,509 32,509 35,883 Median FTE 35,464 35,464 35,883 539W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 540W

FCO table of salaries £ 2012-13 2011-12 2010-11

Lowest FTE 1— 1— 1—

GBCC Highest 72,450 72,450 72,450 Median 39,197 39,197 31,590 Median FTE 39,197 39,197 35,074 Lowest FTE 27,507 30,849 31,153 1 Withheld data protection concerns

Procurement The Prime Minister emphasised this most recently in a short discussion with President Rajapaksa at the Tom Greatrex: To ask the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Secretary General’s lunch on 6 June. Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what the total (a) The Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth number and (b) value of contracts issued by (i) his Affairs, my right hon. Friend the Member for Richmond Department and (ii) bodies for which he is responsible (Yorks) (Mr Hague) made the same points when he met which were awarded to small and medium-sized enterprises the Sri Lankan Minister for External Affairs on 6 June. was in the latest period for which figures are available. With international partners, we will continue to encourage [111174] Sri Lanka to make early progress, including during the Universal Periodic Review of Sri Lanka at the Human Mr Lidington: The Foreign and Commonwealth Office’s Rights Council in October. spend with small and medium-sized enterprises (SMEs) Syria has been reported in the Cabinet Office report, “Making Government business more accessible to SMEs—One Year On”: Dan Rogerson: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what recent www.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/resource-library/making- discussions he has had with his counterparts in Russia government-business-more-accessible-smes-one-year on the situation in Syria and the need to protect the Recruitment civilian population in that country. [111464] Alistair Burt: The Secretary of State for Foreign and Stephen Timms: To ask the Secretary of State for Commonwealth Affairs, my right hon. Friend the Member Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs pursuant to the for Richmond (Yorks) (Mr Hague), discussed the situation answer of 21 May 2012, Official Report, column 489W, in Syria with his Russian counterpart, Sergei Lavrov, in on recruitment, to what extent his Department and its Moscow on 28 May and again in the margins of the non-departmental public bodies and executive agencies Heart of Asia conference in Kabul on 14 June. They used name-blank CVs or the blind sift function on the agreed that the situation in Syria was worse in all Civil Service Resourcing e-recruitment system to respects since their 28 May meeting. The Secretary of recruit staff in the last year. [110967] State reiterated his welcome in principle for the Russian suggestion of an international conference on Syria, Mr Bellingham: The Foreign and Commonwealth which should set out the principles of a political process Office (FCO), its non departmental public bodies and in Syria, including a plan for political transition and full executive agencies follow the Civil Service Commission implementation of the Annan Plan. Recruitment Principles. Appointments are on merit through fair and open competition and all our assessments are Thailand competence or skills-based. Our recruitment processes include a variety of assessment tools, including online Angus Robertson: To ask the Secretary of State for numeric and verbal reasoning tests and assessment centres Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what reports he where assessors have no access to CVs or any other has received on the level of insurgency in Southern personal details about candidates. The FCO is currently Thailand. [110753] in discussion with Civil Service Resourcing about the possible future use of their e-recruitment system. Mr Jeremy Browne: Our embassy in Bangkok monitors the situation in Southern Thailand closely. The Thai Sri Lanka authorities claim that the situation is improving hence lifting martial law in some districts in the southern Mr Buckland: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign provinces. However Southern Thailand is still governed and Commonwealth Affairs what steps his Department by emergency decree and we have seen no solid evidence plans to take to support the implementation of the UN that the overall situation has improved. We regularly Human Rights Council resolution on Sri Lanka. raise our concerns about the situation in Southern [111135] Thailand with the Thai authorities. The UK has also funded a number of small-scale projects in Southern Alistair Burt: We pressed for and welcomed the resolution Thailand, including one with the non-governmental on Sri Lanka agreed at the UN Human Rights Council organisation Deep South Watch, which was designed to in March; and we have called on the Government of Sri capture casualty/fatality data in Southern Thailand more Lanka to play its part in implementing the resolution. accurately. Since then, Deep South Watch has provided 541W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 542W the embassy with monthly reports on developments. I have met with representatives of the Scotland Malawi The UK has also invited experts involved in the Northern Partnership to discuss ways that the Scotland Office can Ireland peace process to share experiences with the support events to commemorate the 200th anniversary relevant Thai decision-makers. We will continue to offer of Dr David Livingstone’s birth. A follow-up meeting such expertise and to work closely with our diplomatic including representatives of the Scotland Office, Foreign partners in this area. and Commonwealth Office and the Department for International Development is scheduled to take place Ukraine later this month. Pay Mr : To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what the Government’s policy is on official ministerial visits to Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Ukraine during the European football championships. Scotland how many staff working for his Department are employed through off-payroll engagements costing [109978] less than £58,200 per annum; and if he will make a Mr Hague: The Government fully supports England’s statement. [110827] participation in Euro 2012. We hope this is a successful tournament for the England team, the fans, and the David Mundell: With the exception of three temporary people of Ukraine and Poland. agency staff who are paid significantly less than £58,200, no other staff working in the Scotland Office are paid No Ministers will be attending group games at Euro through off-payroll engagements. 2012. We are keeping attendance at later stages of the tournament under review.

WALES Atos SCOTLAND

Atos Tom Greatrex: To ask the Secretary of State for Wales what the total monetary value is of each contract between her Department and Atos. [111193] Tom Greatrex: To ask the Secretary of State for Scotland when each contract between his Department Mr David Jones: None. The Wales Office does not and Atos was most recently (a) agreed, (b) renewed directly hold contracts with Atos but uses the buying and (c) extended. [111215] power of larger Government Departments such as the Ministry of Justice. David Mundell: The Scotland Office does not have any contracts with Atos. Tom Greatrex: To ask the Secretary of State for Wales when each contract between her Department David Livingstone and Atos was most recently (a) agreed, (b) renewed and (c) extended. [111194] Tom Greatrex: To ask the Secretary of State for Scotland what discussions he has had with ministerial Mr David Jones: The Wales Office has not directly colleagues in the (a) Foreign and Commonwealth Office agreed, renewed or extended contracts with Atos, but and (b) Department for International Development on uses the contracts through the Ministry of Justice. (i) Malawi and (ii) plans to commemorate the 200th anniversary of Dr David Livingstone’s birth in 2013. Pay [111127] Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Wales David Mundell: Scotland Office officials are in regular how many staff working for her Department are employed contact with counterparts at the Foreign and through off-payroll engagements costing less than £58,200 Commonwealth Office and Department for International per annum; and if she will make a statement. [110826] Development. A meeting of the three Departments is due to take place to discuss plans to commemorate the Mr David Jones: None. 200th anniversary of Dr David Livingstone’s birth in 2013. Procurement

Tom Greatrex: To ask the Secretary of State for Tom Greatrex: To ask the Secretary of State for Scotland what discussions he has had with (a) the Wales if she will give the total (a) number and (b) Scottish Government and (b) key stakeholders in Scotland value of contracts issued by her Department which on (i) Malawi and (ii) plans to commemorate the 200th were awarded to small and medium-sized enterprises in anniversary of Dr David Livingstone’s birth in 2013. the latest period for which figures are available. [111195] [111128] Mr David Jones: The Wales Office has not issued or David Mundell: I have had no meetings with the awarded any contracts to small and medium-sized Scottish Government to discuss Malawi or plans to enterprises in the latest period. The Wales Office does commemorate the 200th anniversary of Dr David not directly award contracts but uses Ministry of Justice Livingstone’s birth. or other larger Government Departments. 543W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 544W

ATTORNEY-GENERAL and executive agencies used name-blank CVs or the blind sift function on the Civil Service Resourcing Atos e-recruitment system to recruit staff in the last year. [110972] Tom Greatrex: To ask the Attorney-General (1) what the total monetary value is of each contract between The Solicitor-General: The Law Officers Departments his Department and Atos; [111217] do not currently use the Civil Service Resourcing (2) when each contract between his Department and e-recruitment system. Atos was most recently (a) agreed, (b) renewed and (c) extended. [111218] Regulation

The Solicitor-General: The Treasury Solicitor’s Gordon Banks: To ask the Attorney-General which Department, Attorney-General’s Office and HM Crown regulations the Law Officers’ Departments repealed Prosecution Service Inspectorate do not hold any contracts between 1 February 2012 and 31 May 2012; and what with Atos. the anticipated total savings to those affected will be of The Serious Fraud Office (SFO) joined a DWP contract repealing such regulations. [112080] for occupational health services (OHS) with Atos on 15 February 2010. This contract runs until 2013. It cost The Solicitor-General: None. £6,294 in 2010-11 and £4,492 in 2011-12. The Crown Prosecution Service (CPS) has a contract for OHS with Atos. This contract began on 1 February 2006 with an initial term of three years with the option HEALTH to extend for a further two years. The option to extend was exercised and the contract continued until 31 January Cancer: Drugs 2011. Pending the introduction of a new pan-Government framework contract for OHS by the Government Mr Baron: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Procurement Service, the Department has continued to how many applications there have been to the Cancer use the services of Atos for its OHS requirements. Since Drugs Fund to date; and how many such applications February 2006 CPS has spent £0.7 million on these were (a) approved or (b) declined by (i) age, (ii) services. gender, (iii) ethnicity and (iv) deprivation. [109924] EU Law Chris Skidmore: To ask the Secretary of State for Graham Jones: To ask the Attorney-General what Health how many cancer patients in (a) England and assessment he has made of whether a ban on the (b) each strategic health authority region have import of foie gras into the UK would contravene EU accessed drugs through the Cancer Drug Fund since its inception; and what the total cost to the NHS was in law. [112083] each region. [110259] The Solicitor-General: By long-standing convention, observed by successive Administrations and embodied Paul Burstow: The Department does not collect in the Ministerial Code, the fact that the Law Officers information on the number of applications made to the may or may not have advised or have been requested to Cancer Drugs Fund. advise on a particular issue, and the content of any Information on the number of patients who have advice, is not disclosed outside Government. received cancer drugs and spend by strategic health authority (SHA) under the interim cancer drugs funding Recruitment arrangements in 2010-11 (from October 2010 to the end of March 2011) and under the Cancer Drugs Fund Stephen Timms: To ask the Attorney-General pursuant (from April 2011 to the end of February 2012) is shown to the answer of 21 May 2012, Official Report, column in the following table. Final figures for 2011-12, based 489W, on recruitment, to what extent the Law Officers’ on the final accounts, are expected to be available by the Departments and their non-departmental public bodies end of June.

Number of patients funded from April Total number of Amount spent in Number of patients Amount spent 2010- 2011 to end February patients funded since 2011-12 (to end Strategic health authority funded 2010-111 112 (£000) 2012 October 20101 February) (£000)

North East 420 5,249 629 1,049 4,743 North West 266 7,400 929 1,195 8,034 Yorkshire and the Humber 178 1,400 738 916 2,840 East Midlands 178 3,157 799 977 3,649 West Midlands 292 2,400 1,508 1,800 11,973 East of England 246 4,286 1,169 1,415 8,967 London 443 5,915 1,209 1,652 19,020 South East Coast 306 2,159 1,036 1,342 9,455 South Central 290 3,200 714 1,004 1,919 South West 161 3,088 1,168 1,329 9,930 545W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 546W

Number of patients funded from April Total number of Amount spent in Number of patients Amount spent 2010- 2011 to end February patients funded since 2011-12 (to end Strategic health authority funded 2010-111 112 (£000) 2012 October 20101 February) (£000)

Total 2,780 38,254 9,899 12,679 80,529 Notes: 1. Some individual patients may be double-counted where a patient has received more than one drug treatment through the Cancer Drugs Fund. 2. This figure includes end of year spending commitments. Source: Information supplied to the Department of Health by SHAs

Contraceptives and Transplant and Anthony Nolan for further implementation of the recommendations and the funding Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Health available for this for the 2012-13 business year. This will (1) who will be responsible for monitoring out of area include an increase in the number of cord blood units payments for contraception services from April 2013; stored in line with the review by the Stem Cell Strategic [111004] Forum. (2) pursuant to the answer of 24 May 2012, Official We have also recognised the shortage of Black, Asian Report, column 860W, on genito-urinary medicine, and Minority Ethnic donors on all major international what steps he plans to take to ensure that a (a) person stem cell registries. This is the reason for focusing on can access contraception services outside the local collection centres at hospitals based in ethnically diverse authority area that they live in and (b) service provider communities. will be paid for providing contraception to a person Food who lives outside their local authority area. [111144] Valerie Vaz: To ask the Secretary of State for Health pursuant to his oral answer of 27 March 2012, Official Anne Milton: We intend to make regulations under Report, column 1336, which high street outlets are section 6c of the NHS Act 2006 (as inserted by section sharing and showing calorie information as part of the 18 of the Health and Social Care Act 2012) that will Responsibility Deal. [111293] require local authorities to commission confidential, open-access contraception services. This legislation will Anne Milton: 45 businesses, including high street ensure that local authorities cannot restrict access to outlets, are currently signed up to the out of home these services only to people who are resident in their area. calorie labelling pledge and either have introduced or The ring-fenced grant for public health will allow are in the process of introducing calorie information. local authorities to fund the provision of services mandated These are as follows: through regulations, including contraception services. Artizian Local authorities will be responsible for paying the ASDA providers of the services they commission. If they wish Bartlett Mitchell Ltd to, local authorities may come to arrangements for Burger King United Kingdom Ltd payments to be made or received in respect of contraception Camden Food Co. care provided to people from outside their local area. Co-operative Group (The) Compass Group UK and Ireland Cricketer Farm Cord Blood: Donors Dominos Pizza Group Ltd EAT Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Greggs plc (1) what representations he has received from (a) Harper Adams University College individuals and (b) organisations on the availability of Harvester Restaurants umbilical cord blood donation; [111129] ISS Facility Services—Food and Hospitality (2) if his Department will take steps to make KFC UKI umbilical cord blood donation more widely available. Kraft Foods UK [111130] London Bread & Cake Company Marks & Spencer Anne Milton: In July 2010, the Department asked McCain Foods (GB) Ltd NHS Blood and Transplant (NHSBT) to lead a review McDonald’s Restaurants Ltd on the future of unrelated donor stem cell transplantation Merlin Entertainments Ltd in the United Kingdom. The UK Stem Cell Strategic Midcounties Co-operative Forum was established and considered views from scientists, MITIE Catering Services Ltd clinicians, economists and patient representatives working Morrisons Supermarkets plc in this area. The published review, ‘The Future of Nestle UK Unrelated donor Stem Cell Transplantation in the UK’, Odeon Cinemas Ltd included 20 recommendations on stem cell transplant Pizza Hut (UK) Ltd services, including the improvement of the provision of Pret A Manger cord blood stem cells. A copy has already been placed in Rodda’s the Library. Royal Liverpool and Broadgreen University Hospitals NHS The Government welcomed the report and allocated Trust £4 million to NHSBT and Anthony Nolan to improve Sainsbury’s Supermarket Ltd patient outcomes. We are in discussion with NHS Blood (Seven) 7 Day Catering Ltd 547W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 548W

SkinniMalinx Ltd with the aim of improving the health service response to Sodexo victims of human trafficking. The toolkit will be finalised Southern Co-operative (The) by December 2012. Starbucks Coffee Company There is already guidance on related areas such as Subway International B.V. domestic and sexual violence, and the Department continues Tesco plc to work closely with professional bodies on improving the health service response to victims of violence. The Real Greek Food Company Unilever UK Ltd Incinerators: Health Hazards United Biscuits (UK) Ltd Waitrose Warburtons Ltd : To ask the Secretary of State for Health for what reason the Health Protection Agency decided Wimpy Restaurants Group Ltd not to examine the effects on human health of YO! Sushi incinerators in August 2003. [110900]

Health Professions Council Anne Milton: Since the Health Protection Agency (HPA) was formed in 2003, it has kept the literature on Robert Halfon: To ask the Secretary of State for the health effects associated with emissions from incinerators Health what steps his Department takes to oversee the under regular review. In 2005, the HPA published a work of the Health Professions Council (HPC); what position statement on the public health consequences of sanctions he has made available to the HPC to regulate municipal solid waste incineration. Following developments psychologists and other health professionals; what guidance in the literature in September 2009, the HPA published he provides to the HPC to enable such regulation; what its updated position statement: The impact on health of guidance the HPC provides to its members; what timescale emissions to air from municipal waste incinerators. the HPC normally works to when it receives a complaint; http://www.hpa.org.uk/web/HPAweb&HPAwebStandard/ and if he will make a statement. [111295] HPAweb_C/1195733829068

Anne Milton: The Health Professions Council (HPC) Muscular Dystrophy is an independent statutory body established under the Health Professions Order 2001. The legislative framework Tom Blenkinsop: To ask the Secretary of State for in which it operates is set out in that order and any rules Health how specialised neuromuscular services will be made by the council. delivered under the new NHS Commissioning Board; The Department does not issue guidance to the HPC and if he will make a statement. [111013] about the way that it undertakes its functions. Oversight of the Health Professions Council is through Paul Burstow: As set out in the Health and Social the Council for Healthcare Regulatory Excellence (CHRE), Care Act 2012, the Government’s intention is that from which conducts annual performance reviews of all the April 2013 the NHS Commissioning Board (NHSCB) health professions regulators. Its most recent performance will directly commission specialised services that are review report was laid before Parliament on 28 June currently commissioned at both national and regional 2011. In respect of the HPC it commented that: level. ‘The median time taken from receipt of initial complaint to the Commissioning these services directly, through one final investigating committee decision was five months. The median national commissioner to a national standard will ensure time taken from final investigating committee decision to final consistency in planning and funding of specialised services fitness to practise hearing decision was nine months. The median for the benefit of patients with rare conditions. time taken from receipt of a complaint or information indicating the need for an interim order referral to an interim order decision The Department is working with NHS colleagues was13days.’ who currently commission specialised services towards The report is also available at: producing a list of services for direct commissioning by www.chre.org.uk/_img/pics/library/110623_Final_-_CHRE_ the Board. The final list of services will be subject to Performance_Review_report_2010-11_(Colour_for_web_- consultation with the Board and then will be captured _PDF_version).pdf in a set of regulations from the Secretary of State for Health, the right hon. Member for South Cambridgeshire Health Services: Human Trafficking (Mr Lansley), to the Board. We are not at the stage where we can announce the final list. However, the list of services as currently set Mr Bone: To ask the Secretary of State for Health out in the Specialised Services National Definitions Set what training his Department provides to enable NHS will form the solid basis for the services that the NHSCB staff to recognise victims of human trafficking. [111755] will directly commission. Anne Milton: The content and standard of health care training is generally the responsibility of the Musculoskeletal Disorders independent regulatory bodies. However, given the Government’s commitment to tackle human trafficking Mrs Riordan: To ask the Secretary of State for Health and violence against women and children, the Department what assessment he has made of the extent of regional of Health is working with a third sector strategic partner variation in the NHS provision of musculoskeletal services. to develop a training toolkit for health professionals [110925] 549W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 550W

Paul Burstow: Assessment of the extent of variation SMIs are produced with the involvement of microbiological in expenditure by primary care trust area on a number professional organisations and societies and undergo of musculoskeletal procedures is published in the NHS peer review. Atlas of Variation which is available at: Nurses www.rightcare.nhs.uk/index.php/nhs-atlas/atlas-downloads We are also aware of variations in the quality of Jim Shannon: To ask the Secretary of State for provision of musculoskeletal services in the national Health if he will consider the effect of patient numbers health service, alongside many examples of good practice. on nurses’ ability to give high quality care; and if he We intend to hold the NHS to account, through the will make it his policy that the patient to nurse ratio NHS Commissioning Board, for achieving sustained should decrease. [112203] improvements in the quality of life of all patients with long-term conditions, and in outcomes relating to recovery Anne Milton: It would not be appropriate to mandate from episodes of ill-health and injury. We are working patient to nurse ratios. Decisions about staff to patient in strategic partnership with the members of the Arthritis ratios are best made by local clinicians and managers, and Musculoskeletal Alliance to identify measures that and will vary according to the individual needs of will help accelerate improvement. In addition, there are patients. many existing sources of guidance for commissioners There is guidance available to trusts to assist them in and providers who wish to improve their musculoskeletal setting safe staffing levels. For example the Royal College services, including clinical guidelines and other guidance of Nursing guidance and Safer Nursing Care Tool from the National Institute for Health and Clinical developed by the NHS Institute for Innovation and Excellence (NICE). We have asked NICE to develop Improvement. quality standards for some of the major musculoskeletal conditions; so that patients and commissioners can The Care Quality Commission (CQC) requires registered have a clear view of the standards of care which the providers to take appropriate steps to ensure that, at all NHS should be aspiring to achieve. times, there are sufficient numbers of suitably qualified, skilled and experienced persons employed for the purpose of carrying on the regulated activity. The CQC guidance Mrs Riordan: To ask the Secretary of State for Health about compliance, references guidance set out by, for how the Long Term Conditions Outcomes Strategy will example, professional bodies. (a) address the needs and expected future needs of people with musculoskeletal conditions and (b) take Psoriasis into account demographic changes. [110926] Mr Bone: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Paul Burstow: The Long Term Conditions Outcomes what information his Department holds on the proportion Strategy will be generic, rather than condition-specific. of patients suffering from severe psoriasis who have It will encourage service planners to conduct thorough received a psoriasis area and severity index assessment. assessments of present and future demand and to [111341] commission joined-up services/ meeting the holistic needs of people with long-term conditions. We recognise that Paul Burstow: The Department does not collect data demographic changes are leading to an increase in on the numbers of people with severe psoriasis who many types of long-term conditions, including have received a psoriasis area and severity index assessment. musculoskeletal ones, and the strategy will describe a vision for how services can operate to meet these pressures. Social Services

Valerie Vaz: To ask the Secretary of State for Health NHS: Laboratories what plans he has to bring forward legislative proposals to reform social care in the 2012-13 Session. [111087] Mr Mike Hancock: To ask the Secretary of State for Health what guidelines his Department has issued to Paul Burstow: The Government plans to publish a NHS trusts on adopting the Health Protection Agency’s draft Bill shortly, for pre-legislative scrutiny in this recommended swab analysis procedure in NHS laboratories. Session. This is the first comprehensive reform of social [110043] care law in over 60 years and is a unique opportunity to modernise the legal framework. That is why we will Anne Milton: The Department has not issued any carry out pre-legislative scrutiny on the Bill, to give guidelines of this nature and would not expect to do so. those with experience and expertise in care and support However the Health Protection Agency (HPA) has statutory the opportunity to influence and shape the proposed authority to make recommendations directly and in legislation. We remain committed to introducing legislation public. at the earliest opportunity to establish a sustainable legal framework for adult social care. There is insufficient information to identify the type of swabs to which the hon. Member refers. However, Thalidomide the Standards for Microbiology Investigations (SMIs) cover the processing of a variety of swabs. Cathy Jamieson: To ask the Secretary of State for The HPA provides a secretarial function for United Health when he plans to decide whether financial support Kingdom SMIs. UK SMIs comprise a collection of for people affected by Thalidomide will continue beyond recommended algorithms and procedures covering all the three year pilot scheme; and when he plans to stages of the investigative process in microbiology The release the details of any such further support. [111605] 551W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 552W

Paul Burstow: The Thalidomide Grant is a three-year January-March 2012, tables rv.06 and rv.06.q, from the Library pilot, running from April 2010 until March 2013, to of the House and from the Home Office Science, research and explore how the health needs of Thalidomide survivors statistics web pages at: can best be met in the longer term and how such a http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/science-research/research- scheme might be applied to other small groups of statistics/migration/migration-statistics1/ geographically dispersed patients with specialised needs. Departmental officials met with members of the National Bigamy Advisory Council to the Thalidomide Trust in June 2011, to discuss their evaluation of the first year. Further Mr Spellar: To ask the Secretary of State for the meetings will be held to discuss years two and three and Home Department what her Department’s policy is on we will consider the future of the grant further into the bigamous marriage in respect of applications for leave pilot. to enter or remain. [111371] This corrects my written answers to the hon. Member for Midlothian (Mr Hamilton) on 17 May 2012, Official Damian Green: If a person is applying for leave to Report, column 359W, and the hon. Member for Belfast enter or remain in the United Kingdom on the basis of East (Naomi Long) on 24 April 2012, Official Report, their marriage, that marriage needs to be valid in UK column 875W, in which I stated that officials last met law. the trust in June 2010. I regret these errors. A person cannot rely on a bigamous relationship that is not valid in UK law to support their application. If he or she has acted illegally in contracting a second marriage, the UK Border Agency may refer the case for prosecution. HOME DEPARTMENT Asylum: Deportation Crown Prosecution Service

Kerry McCarthy: To ask the Secretary of State for Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for the the Home Department how many refused asylum Home Department what estimate she made of the seekers have been returned to (a) Zimbabwe, (b) Iran, annual savings which would be achieved by the police if (c) Iraq and (d) Somalia annually since January 2010. Crown Prosecution Service and police staff were co-located [111382] in York prior to the opening of Athena House in York; and what estimate she has made of such savings made Damian Green: The following table shows the total by the police in each year since Athena House was number of asylum cases removed or voluntarily departed opened. [111151] to Iran, Iraq, Somalia and Zimbabwe from the UK in 2010 and 2011. Nick Herbert: None. Decisions about the most effective use of available resources, including where staff should Removals and voluntary departures1, 2, 3 of asylum cases to Iran, Iraq, Somalia and Zimbabwe4, January 2010 to December 2011 be located, are rightly a matter for the Chief Constable Total asylum cases removed or and Police Authority locally. voluntarily departed to: 20105 20115 Driving Offences: Insurance Iran 129 126 Iraq 537 332 Somalia 10 10 Karl McCartney: To ask the Secretary of State for Zimbabwe 231 132 the Home Department how many drivers were arrested on suspicion of making fraudulent insurance claims in 1 Includes enforced removals, people departing voluntarily after notifying the UK Border Agency of their intention to leave prior to their (a) 1997, (b) 2002 and (c) 2011. [111037] departure, people leaving under Assisted Voluntary Return Programmes run by Refugee Action (prior to April 2011, run by the International Nick Herbert [holding answer 13 June 2012]: The Organisation for Migration) and people who it has been established information requested on arrests is not collected centrally. left without informing the immigration authorities. 2 Figures include dependants. 3 Removals and voluntary departures recorded on the system as at the Entry Clearances: Higher Education dates on which the data extracts were taken. 4 Destination as recorded on source database. 5 Provisional figures. Figures will under record due to data cleansing Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for and data matching exercises that take place after the extracts are the Home Department what estimate she has made of taken. the likely effect of changes to the regulations for Tier 2 It is not possible within these figures to say what visas on the number of foreign academics wishing to stage in the asylum process these people have reached at work at UK higher education institutions who specialise the time of their removal, including whether their claim in teaching STEM subjects; and what assessment she was refused at that point, because those departing has made of the potential economic benefits of such voluntarily can do so at any stage without necessarily changes. [111156] notifying the UK Border Agency. The Home Office publishes quarterly and annual Damian Green: No academics have been excluded as statistics on the number of persons removed or departed a result of Tier 2 changes. Foreign academics have the voluntarily from the UK within ’Immigration Statistics’. requisite skills and salary levels to qualify for Tier 2. The data on removals and voluntary departures by The annual limit for Tier 2 has been undersubscribed country of destination is available in the latest release, and, even if the limit was reached, academics are given Immigration Statistics: high priority when allocating places. 553W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 554W

From 14 June we are making changes to the operation I have placed a copy of the MAC’s report in the Library of the Resident Labour Market Test to better fit higher of the House. The report and accompanying research education recruitment practices, and to allow higher are also available on the Home Office website at: education institutions to select the best candidate for www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk the role, regardless of whether they are a resident or The Home Office is currently undertaking research to migrant worker. build a picture of the local impacts of non-EEA migration In addition to these generous provisions in Tier 2, to the UK. The resulting data will enable an assessment academics who are world leaders in their field can apply of the impact of migration on public services, such as in the Tier 1 (Exceptional Talent) route. There are also social housing, at the regional level. The research will be further provisions for sponsored researchers in Tier 5. published in 2013. The Government has made clear that it is committed to attracting the brightest and the best migrants and has Olympic and Paralympic Games 2012: Security had no representations from the sector about negative impacts. Bill Esterson: To ask the Secretary of State for the Full impact assessments for Tier 2 changes have been Home Department what recent assessment she has published on the Home Office website and I have placed made of the suitability of Close Protection UK to copies in the Library of the House. provide security services at the London 2012 Olympic and Paralympic Games. [111240] Entry Clearances: Overseas Students James Brokenshire: I refer the hon. Member to the Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for answer given on 13 June 2012, Official Report, column the Home Department how many Tier 4 visas have been 481W. rejected on the basis of not meeting English language requirements (a) prior to and (b) after 21 April 2011. Pay [111145]

Damian Green: Refusals of visas for not meeting the : To ask the Secretary of State for the English language requirement are only collated for Home Department whether Rob Whiteman received a settlement visas. bonus in 2011-12; and what the value of any such bonus was. [111088] Since April 2012, a Tier 4 applicant to a privately funded college has been required to provide an English Damian Green: Rob Whiteman has been employed as language test certificate as evidence of English ability. chief executive of the UK Border Agency since September During the financial year 2011-12, approximately 15% 2011. He did not receive any bonuses during the 2011-12 (39,454) of Tier 4 visas were refused; the reasons for financial year. Bonus awards for Home Office Board refusal are not collated. members, including Rob Whiteman, for the 2011-12 For Tier 4, it is the responsibility of the sponsor performance year have not yet been considered. (college) to assess the English language level of the student. The sponsor must clearly state on the sponsor Police and Crime Commissioners management system when they assign the Confirmation of Acceptance for Studies (CAS) how they have assessed the English language level. Mr Bone: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what steps she is taking to promote awareness Health Insurance of the elections for police and crime commissioners. [111337] Gordon Henderson: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department how many staff working in her Nick Herbert: The election of 41 police and crime Department are entitled to private health care as part commissioners (PCCs) on 15 November is at the heart of this Government’s commitment to bringing local of their remuneration package. [111257] accountability to policing and giving the public a say in Damian Green: No officials in the Home Office or its how crime is tackled in their area. This is why the Police agencies (UK Border Agency, Identity and Passport Reform and Social Responsibility Act 2011 requires the Service and Criminal Records Bureau) are provided Electoral Commission to take steps to raise public with private health insurance as part of their employment awareness of the election and how to vote in it. Home package. Office Ministers and the Home Office, working with our partners in policing, will support this awareness-raising Immigration by undertaking a range of activity, through various media, to explain the purpose and role of PCCs to the public. Nicholas Soames: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department if she will undertake an assessment of the effects of immigration at regional level in the Race Relations: EU Action United Kingdom. [111065] Mr Raab: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Damian Green: No assessment has been made of the Department whether the UK has fully implemented EU impacts of migration at the regional level. The independent Council Framework Decision 2008/913/JHA; and what Migration Advisory Committee (MAC) published an assessment her Department has made of its effectiveness analysis of the impacts of migration on 10 January. in combating racism and xenophobia. [111068] 555W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 556W

Lynne Featherstone: The UK Government fully complies Dr Huppert: To ask the Secretary of State for the with the provisions of the Framework Decision 2008/ Home Department whether the criteria for UK Border 913/JHA on combating certain forms and expressions Agency staff bonuses include rewards for the number of racism and xenophobia through the use of existing of failed asylum seekers sent back to their country of domestic legislation and common law. origin. [111046] Although the UK has no specific criminal offences of Damian Green [holding answer 13 June 2012]: Bonuses publicly condoning, denying or grossly trivialising crimes are awarded to a maximum of 35% of staff, whose of genocide; crimes against humanity; war crimes; and performance has significantly exceeded that which was crimes against peace (as required in Article 1 (1) (c) and set out in their individual objectives. Performance is (d) of the Framework Decision), conduct of this type measured against both the objectives, competencies and carried out in a manner likely to incite violence or personal development needs required for the role. Each hatred would be covered by existing offences. staff member’s objectives would have been agreed with While no formal assessment of the framework’s their line manager at the start of the performance year effectiveness has been undertaken, post-legislative scrutiny at a local level in a personal development review plan. of the Racial and Religious Hatred Act was undertaken The Home Office does not hold centrally any information and is available from the Vote Office and at: on objectives. http://www.official-documents.gov.uk/document/cm81/8164/ 8164.pdf Work Permits: Balkans Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for Stop and Search the Home Department what estimate she has made of the waiting times for Bulgarian and Romanian students Heidi Alexander: To ask the Secretary of State for the applying for work permits in (a) 2007, (b) 2008, (c) Home Department what recent discussions she has had 2009, (d) 2010, (e) 2011 and (f) 2012 to date. [111146] with the Association of Chief Police Officers and senior police officers on the use of section 60 notices Damian Green: The UK Border Agency aims to under the Criminal Justice and Public Order Act 1994. decide 95% of Bulgarian and Romanian student work [110811] permit applications within six months of receipt. This has been achieved for each year since 2007 to date. Nick Herbert [holding answer 11 June 2012]: Home Office officials discuss these issues with the Association of Chief Police Officers regularly. TREASURY

Terrorism: EU Action Business: Finance Simon Kirby: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer Mr Raab: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home what progress has been made on the introduction of the Department what changes to UK anti-terrorism laws Business Finance Partnership. [110985] resulted from EU Council Framework Decision 2008/ 919/JHA. [111067] Mr Hoban: The Business Finance Partnership relies on negotiating co-investment from private sector investors James Brokenshire: The UK has a comprehensive to maximise the impact of the £1.2 billion allocated to range of terrorism offences. No changes have been the scheme by securing additional matching funds. All made following the EU Council Framework Decision the money allocated to the scheme is currently in the 2008/919/JHA. process of being invested and it is expected that these investments will be finalised by the end of the year. UK Border Agency In particular, as announced at Budget 2012, the Government have decided to invest up to £700 million Ian Lavery: To ask the Secretary of State for the in a shortlist of up to seven funds that lend to mid-sized Home Department what indices the UK Border Agency companies. Due diligence and commercial negotiations has used to calculate annual resource budget uplifts for on these potential investments are expected to complete each of its contracts with the private sector in each of by late summer. On 31 May 2012, two requests for the last five years. [110481] proposals were published, one requesting proposals for investing a further £400 million in funds that lend to Damian Green: There are a number of different indices mid-sized businesses and a second requesting proposals that can be included in UK Border Agency contracts to for investing £100 million in non-traditional lending calculate annual resource budget uplifts, for example channels that can reach small businesses. These requests the RPIX (RPI minus mortgage interest payments). close on 20 July 2012, and subject to due diligence and The indices used vary on a contract by contract basis commercial negotiations the related investments are and are dependant on the service being provided as well expected to be finalised by the end of the year. as the market, among other factors. Conservative Party and Liberal Democrats The UK Border Agency is unable to specifically outline, contract by contract, the indices used in each of Cathy Jamieson: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer its contracts for the past five years as this information is pursuant to the answer of 17 May 2012, Official Report, not centrally held. To provide this information would column 304W, on Conservative Party and Liberal require a manual search of each of our contracts, and Democrats, when he plans to publish a summary of this would incur disproportionate cost. responses. [111606] 557W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 558W

Mr Gauke: I refer the hon. Member to the answer I Mr Hoban: The Treasury receives regular updates gave on 17 May 2012, Official Report, column 304W. from the Equitable Life Payment Scheme, and these will form the basis of the progress report due to be published Corporation Tax in the summer. EU Budget Mr Meacher: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer how many of the 1,000 largest companies Andrea Leadsom: To ask the Chancellor of the paid no corporation tax in each year since 2005; and Exchequer what estimate he has made of the cost of how many such companies paid (a) less than £10 converting the UK’s contribution to the European million and (b) between £10 and £20 million in each of Union from pounds to euros. [110942] the last five years. [111239] Mr Hoban: All UK contributions to the EU budget Mr Gauke: There is not an accepted methodology are paid in sterling. HMRC could use to identify the 1,000 largest companies. Additionally, in most cases, large firms will operate Andrea Leadsom: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer through a group structure comprising of many companies. what steps the Government takes to mitigate the potential Information on the amount of corporation tax payable currency gain or loss from converting the UK’s contribution and the number of companies by the size of their to the EU budget and receiving funds from the EU. liability is available in table 11.6 of HMRC’s National [111078] Statistics which can be found at the following internet address. Mr Hoban: All UK contributions to the annual EU budget are paid in sterling. Receipts from the EU budget http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/stats/corporate_tax/ct-menu.htm are converted from euro to sterling at an exchange rate prevailing at the time the transaction is due to take Rachel Reeves: To ask the Chancellor of the place. The Government does not have a central exchange Exchequer what the average rate of corporation tax rate risk mitigation mechanism with respect to receipts paid by (a) FTSE 100 companies and (b) companies from the EU budget but Government Departments and with profits greater than £1,500,000 was in (i) 2009-10 agencies that receive EU funds may choose to make and (ii) 2010-11. [111604] individual exchange rate risk mitigation arrangements.

Mr Gauke: In 2009-10 and 2010-11, taxable profits Gambling were subject to either the main rate of 28% or the small profits rate of 21%. Companies with taxable profits Fiona O’Donnell: To ask the Chancellor of the between £300,000 and £1.5 million would have received Exchequer when the consultation on offshore gambling marginal rate relief. will commence. [111081]

Credit Unions Miss Chloe Smith: The consultation “Taxing remote gambling on a place of consumption basis: consultation on policy design” was published on 5 April. The Cathy Jamieson: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer consultation closes on 28 June 2012. what recent assessment he has made of the effect on The consultation document is accessible on the HM credit unions of erroneous claims for mis-selling of Treasury website: payment protection insurance. [R] [111530] http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/consult_tax_remote_ gambling_consumption_basis.htm Mr Hoban: There has not been a significant effect regarding mis-selling Payment Protection Insurance (PPI), Personal Savings or erroneous claims for mis-selling of PPI, on the credit unions sector. Only a minority of credit unions were Fiona Bruce: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer involved in PPI due to the generally small size of credit if he will take steps to create a savings culture in the unions and small size of loans issued. UK; and if he will make a statement. [110795] The Government supports the work that the Financial Services Authority, the Competition Commission, the Mr Hoban: The Government’s savings strategy is Financial Ombudsman Service, and the Office of Fair based on the principles of freedom, fairness and Trading are undertaking to recompense customers who responsibility, so that it meets the needs of consumers have been mis-sold policies, and to prevent cases of while remaining effective and affordable. In particular, mis-selling in the future. the Government aims to encourage more lower and middle income households to start saving and to save Equitable Life more, especially for the long term and retirement. The Government has taken steps to support existing savers and encourage new savers, including: Caroline Lucas: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer pursuant to the answer of 17 May 2012, Official Report, 1. Promoting choice by providing flexibility to consumers in a competitive market. This Government introduced the Junior ISA, columns 297-98W,on the Equitable Life Payment Scheme, removed the effective requirement to annuitise at age 75, and how frequently (a) he, (b) his special advisers and (c) announced at Budget 2012 that the Government will work with officials in his Department receive progress reports on industry to improve competitiveness and transparency in the ISA the Equitable Life Payment Scheme. [111251] market, including encouraging industry to make use of the 559W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 560W technological advances in how information and funds can be The review collected information in relation to off transferred to bring further reductions in the time taken to payroll engagements that cost the Government more transfer a cash ISA between providers. The Government also than £58,200 per annum—the senior civil service pay welcomes and strongly supports the Independent Commission on minimum—in central Government Departments and Banking (ICB) recommendations to make it easier for personal customers, small businesses and charities to switch their bank their arm’s length bodies. The review did not collect account. The Government is clear that the new switching proposals information in relation to non-senior staff engaged off need to be fully implemented by the industry by September 2013 payroll in any public sector organisation. The publicly and will monitor progress closely through quarterly interim reports. owned banks were outside the scope of the review, as I 2. Promoting fairness in incentives to save by introducing set out on 14 May 2012, Official Report, column 44W. automatic enrolment of employees into a pension scheme from The review was financed from within existing Treasury October 2012, reforming the way pensions tax relief is restricted and departmental budgets—and no estimate of the and indexing ISA contribution limits to inflation. overall cost of the review has been made. The review 3. Promoting personal responsibility within the saving, debt was led by officials in the Treasury’s Public Spending and protection system so individuals are equipped to exercise Group, supported by officials from across the Treasury, effective choice and plan for expected and unexpected events. This Government has introduced the Money Advice Service, Cabinet Office, HMRC and other Government which amongst other services provides a free financial ‘health Departments. No external legal advice was sought by check’; asked an independent steering group to devise a suite of the Treasury as part of the review. simple financial products to help increase the number of new The review’s recommendations will be applied to participants in savings and protection insurance markets by providing straightforward, easy to understand products; and worked with existing contracts, subject to ensuring value for money industry and consumer groups to establish a ‘default’ open market for the taxpayer. As Departments are currently taking option, which requires retirees to make an active choice about forward these recommendations, it is not yet possible to their provider and the shape of their annuity. estimate the number of contracts that will be unwound as a result of the review. However, Departments will Procurement report to Parliament on the outcome as part of the 2012-13 annual report and accounts process.

Tom Greatrex: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer what the total (a) number and (b) value of contracts Recruitment issued by (i) his Department and (ii) bodies for which he is responsible which were awarded to small and medium- sized enterprises was in the latest period for which Stephen Timms: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer figures are available. [111177] pursuant to the answer of 21 May 2012, Official Report, column 489W, on recruitment, to what extent his Department and its non-departmental public bodies Miss Chloe Smith: HM Treasury’s spend with small and executive agencies used name-blank CVs or the blind and medium-sized enterprises has been reported in the sift function on the Civil Service Resourcing e-recruitment Cabinet Office report, “Making Government business system to recruit staff in the last year. [110953] more accessible to SMEs—One Year On”, which is available online at: Miss Chloe Smith: Neither name blank CVs nor the www.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/resource-library/making- government-business-more-accessible-smes-one-year blind sift function on the Civil Service Resourcing e-recruitment system are used by HM Treasury, its non-departmental public bodies or agencies. Public Sector: Pay

Rachel Reeves: To ask the Chancellor of the Tax Allowances: Charities Exchequer (1) how many public sector workers are being paid off-payroll in (a) the NHS, (b) non- Mr Spellar: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer maintained schools and (c) publicly-owned banks; and with reference to the answer of 30 April 2012, Official if he will publish the details of any such arrangements; Report, column 1203W, on tax allowances: charities, [111466] what procedure is used by HM Revenue and Customs (2) with reference to his review of the tax arrangements to recognise organisations as charitable organisations of public sector appointees, how much has been spent for tax purposes. [111520] on legal fees relating to the review; how much the review cost; how many staff in his Department were allocated Mr Gauke: Charities and other organisations seeking to the review; how many deals he considers are too recognition by HM Revenue and Customs (HMRC) of expensive to unwind; and if he will publish all exemptions their entitlement to UK charity reliefs need to fill in a to the rules and the reasons for them. [111467] charity application form (ChA1). HMRC checks the details on the form and, if satisfied that the organisation Danny Alexander: On 23 May, Official Report, is entitled to UK charity tax reliefs, issues a charity columns 1159-61, I announced the findings of the ‘Review reference number. of the Tax Arrangements of Public Sector Appointees’. Detailed guidance on the process is available on the This set out the extent of senior off payroll engagements HMRC website: across Government—and made recommendations to ensure that Government employers can assure themselves http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/charities/tax/recognition.htm that their senior off payroll staff are meeting their tax The definition of a charity for tax purposes is set out obligations. in part 1 of schedule 1 of Finance Act 2010. 561W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 562W

Taxation: Multinational Companies The costings for the reforms to the controlled foreign companies (CFC) rules did not include any assessment Catherine McKinnell: To ask the Chancellor of the of the Exchequer impact of groups returning to the Exchequer (1) what assessment he has made of the UK. impact of reforms to the controlled foreign companies The changes to modelling and data referred to on regime on developed countries; [111075] page 14 of the “Budget 2012 Policy Costings” document (2) what estimate he has made of the value of reflect further analytical work undertaken since Budget revenue from corporation tax forgone under the 2011 and changes to the detailed policy design. As there changes to the controlled foreign companies regime; is no precise way to separate these impacts they are [111076] presented together. (3) what estimate he has made of revenue expected to VAT: Listed Buildings accrue to the Exchequer from companies returning to the UK as a result of reforms to the controlled foreign John Robertson: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer companies regime; [111077] what assessment he has made of the potential effect of (4) what the changes are to modelling and data the levying of VAT on approved alterations on the referred to on page 14 of the Budget 2012 Policy upkeep of listed buildings. [111309] Costings document, which made a difference to the costing of reforms to the controlled foreign companies Mr Gauke: An assessment of the impact of levying reforms between Budget 2011 and Budget 2012. [111086] VAT on approved alterations to listed buildings was set out in the consultation document ‘VAT: Addressing Mr Gauke: The Government has not undertaken an borderline anomalies’ published at the time of the Budget. assessment of the effect on other countries of the proposed An updated assessment will be published as part of the changes to the controlled foreign companies (CFC) Government’s response to the consultation. rules as these rules are designed to protect the UK Exchequer by preventing artificial diversion of UK profits. ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE Such an impact assessment would need to focus primarily on the nature of tax regimes in other countries Biofuels and the interactions of multinational companies with those tax systems, making it an assessment not of our Chris Heaton-Harris: To ask the Secretary of State tax rules, but of the tax rules of those other countries. for Energy and Climate Change what the (a) designed The Government do not think that such an assessment output and (b) average load factor is of each bio-mass would be feasible. power station in the UK; and how many megawatts of The cost of changes to the controlled foreign companies electricity were produced from bio-mass in 2011. (CFC) rules were set out in table 2.1 and 2.2 of Budget [111678] 2012. The total cost of £910 million in 2018-19 is detailed in the 2012 Policy Costings Document available Gregory Barker: Provisional 2011 data for the designed on the HM Treasury website. output (installed capacity), load factors and electricity http://cdn.hm-treasury.gov.uk/budget2012_chapter2.pdf generation for biomass power plant, are given in the http://cdn.hm-treasury.gov.uk/ following table. Final figures for 2011 will be published budget2012_policy_costings.pdf on 28 June 2012.

Installed capacity (as at 31 December 2011) (MW) Generation (GWh) Load factor (percentage)

Landfill gas 1,062 5,345 58.5 Sewage sludge digestion 203 755 43.9 Biodegradable municipal solid waste 504 1,732 42.1 combustion Animal Biomass 161 756 57.6 Plant Biomass 1,074 1,626 26.8 Biomass co-fired in fossil fuel power n/a 3,061 n/a stations

Capacity is not given for biomass co-fired in fossil Carbon Emissions fuel power stations, as this is not dedicated biomass capacity.A load factor can also therefore not be calculated. Martin Horwood: To ask the Secretary of State for However, in 2011, the part of fossil fuel installed capacity Energy and Climate Change whether low carbon generation used for co-firing was provisionally estimated as 349 projects which make final investment decisions before MW. the contract for difference mechanism becomes law will be eligible for a contract under the scheme. [111054] Data from table ET 6.1 of Energy Trends, available at: Charles Hendry: The electricity market reform White http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cms/statistics/energy_stats/ Paper of July 2011 set out the Government’s commitment source/renewables/renewables.aspx to work actively with relevant developers to enable early 563W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 564W investment decisions to progress to timetable wherever product, and the UK has a further seven operational possible, including those required ahead of implementation refineries. Consequently, there are no significant risks of the feed-in tariff with Contracts for Difference (CfD). to security of fuel supply or energy resilience should The draft Energy Bill contains a number of provisions refining activity stop at Coryton. which would enable the Government to issue what are called “investment instruments” at an early stage in Energy Supply advance of the regime for CfDs being established. These instruments would be broadly similar to CfDs and the Chris Heaton-Harris: To ask the Secretary of State provisions in the Bill permit the Secretary of State to for Energy and Climate Change what plans his issue them on terms and conditions he considers are Department has to continuously match supply and appropriate. What is actually offered (if at all) in relation demand in the grid. [111670] to projects will depend on the projects that come forward and the outcome of any engagement. Charles Hendry: National Grid, as the National Electricity Transmission System Operator, is responsible Carbon Emissions: Shipping for ensuring electricity supply and demand are balanced in real time. John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for The electricity market reform White Paper recognised Energy and Climate Change when he expects emissions there will be new challenges to the balancing of supply from the shipping industry to be included in the UK and demand of electricity in future as a result of changes carbon budget; and what recent discussions on this to the generation mix and demand profiles as we matter he has had with the Secretary of State for decarbonise. We intend to publish a document this Transport. [R] [112279] summer which will make an assessment of the future challenges to the electricity system and highlight areas Gregory Barker: Emissions from domestic shipping where Government action may be required. are already included within the UK’s carbon budgets. International shipping emissions are not yet included Energy: Coventry with this framework; however, the Climate Change Act also requires the Government to consider whether to Mr Ainsworth: To ask the Secretary of State for include these emissions this year. The CCC have provided Energy and Climate Change what assessment he has us with advice on this issue and we are now working made of the average proportion of household expenditure closely with the Department for Transport to consider on energy bills in (a) Coventry and (b) Coventry the Government’s response. The Government will respond North East constituency in each of the last five years. to the report by end 2012 as required by section 30 of [111751] the Climate Change Act. Charles Hendry: Data on spend on energy bills is Coryton Oil Refinery available from the Living Costs and Food Survey, run by the Office for National Statistics (ONS). The following : To ask the Secretary of State for table shows the average weekly spend on electricity, gas Energy and Climate Change whether his Department and other fuels for households in the West Midlands, has received any representations from the administrators along with the proportion of total household expenditure of Coryton Oil Refinery in respect of the provision of that this accounts for. The data are shown as three-year state aid. [111528] averages because sample sizes are not sufficient to produce data for a single year. These averages cover the five-year Charles Hendry: The administrators of Coryton Oil period from 2006 to 2010, with data for 2008-10 being Refinery have contacted the Department on 15 May in the latest available. Data are not available below regional respect of the provision of government assistance for level, so we are unable to provide figures by constituency. the refinery. These representations are necessarily commercially confidential. Average weekly spend on As a proportion of total fuel and power (£) spend (%)

Caroline Flint: To ask the Secretary of State for 2006-08 17.70 4.8 Energy and Climate Change what assessment his 2007-09 19.70 4.4 Department has made of the implications for (a) the 2008-10 20.70 4.8 security of UK fuel supply and (b) UK energy resilience of the potential closure of Coryton Oil Refinery; and if Fuel Poverty: Kent he will place in the Library a copy of any such assessment. [111529] Mr Evennett: To ask the Secretary of State for Charles Hendry: The Department has assessed the Energy and Climate Change what recent estimate he implications for (a) the security of UK fuel supply and has made of the number of households in (a) (b) UK energy resilience of the potential closure of Bexleyheath and Crayford, (b) Erith and Thamesmead Coryton Oil Refinery. As part of this process the and (c) Old Bexley and Sidcup constituency living in Department has been in close contact with fuel suppliers fuel poverty. [111894] who use Coryton. London and the South East England are served by a number of supply points and suppliers Gregory Barker: In 2010, the last year for which data have plans in place to maintain their fuel supply operations are available, the number of households in fuel poverty in the event of the closure of the refinery. There is a was estimated to be: healthy, global market with supplier diversity for refined (a) 4,100 in Bexleyheath and Crayford (12.5%); 565W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 566W

(b) 4,100 in Erith and Thamesmead (10.2%); Heat rejected by power stations comes from fossil or (c) 4,000 in Old Bexley and Sidcup (12.3%). nuclear fuels and is not classified as renewable under the RED. Fuel Poverty: West Midlands As set out in the strategic framework for low carbon heat, published in March, we are keen to promote the recovery and re-use of heat, including from power Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for stations. In the strategy we undertook to consult on Energy and Climate Change what recent estimate he policy proposals by March 2013. We are investigating has made of the number of households living in fuel options to support this form of heating as part of these poverty in (a) Birmingham, Ladywood constituency, proposals. (b) Birmingham and (c) the West Midlands in the most recent period for which figures are available. Mike Weatherley: To ask the Secretary of State for [112222] Energy and Climate Change if he will consider reclassifying waste heat from power stations as a renewable resource Gregory Barker: The following table shows the number where it reduces emissions of carbon dioxide by displacing of households living in fuel poverty by parliamentary gas burnt for heating. [111094] constituency, local authority and region, for the latest available year, 2010. Gregory Barker: Heat rejected from power stations comes from fossil or nuclear fuels so it is not classified Fuel poor households Percentage living in fuel Area (Thousand) poverty (%) as renewable under the Renewable Energy Directive. As set out in the strategic framework for low carbon Birmingham, 10.8 23.4 Ladywood constituency heat, published in March, we are keen to promote the Birmingham, local 93.3 23.3 recovery and re-use of heat, including from power authority stations. In the strategy we undertook to consult on West Midlands, region 484.9 21.6 policy proposals by March 2013. We are investigating options to support this form of heating as part of these proposals. Heating Mike Weatherley: To ask the Secretary of State for Mike Weatherley: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change what assessment he has Energy and Climate Change what the rate of return on made of the contribution of combined heat and power capital is for combined heat and power and district and district heating to reductions in carbon emissions; heating schemes. [111091] and if he will make a statement. [111095]

Gregory Barker: Various fuel types and technologies Gregory Barker: As recorded in the Digest of UK can be used for CHP and for district heating, at a Energy Statistics (DUKES) 2011, combined heat and number of different scales. Therefore, rates of return on power (CHP) reduced carbon emissions by 13 million capital are dependent on particular circumstances and tonnes of CO2 in 2010 when compared against electricity vary considerably between different schemes. Following generated from fossil fuels. CHP saved 9.3 million tonnes the publication of a Strategic Framework for Heat, CO2 when compared to all fuels, including renewables officials in the Department are looking closely at barriers and nuclear. to the development of CHP and heat networks, including These figures include district heating schemes that but not restricted to commercial and economic issues are connected to CHP plants. We currently do not have such as rates of return. data on district heating schemes fuelled from non-CHP sources. Mike Weatherley: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change what plans he has to Nuclear Power Stations provide grants to fund feasibility studies for combined heat and power and district heating schemes in the remainder of the comprehensive spending review period. Martin Horwood: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change if he will publish any [111092] evidence used to determine the strike price that new nuclear power stations will receive under the contract Gregory Barker: We are currently working with a for difference support mechanism. [111055] number of cities exploring the potential for low carbon heat networks to consider ways in which the Department Charles Hendry: There will be full transparency over can assist their development. the terms agreed following the negotiation of nuclear generation contracts. However, as set out in the draft Mike Weatherley: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy Bill 2012, the Secretary of State may not disclose Energy and Climate Change if he will consider information that consists of trade secrets or sensitive extending the Renewable Heat Incentive to waste heat commercial information, unless the person to whom the from power stations. [111093] information relates consents to the disclosures.

Gregory Barker: The primary purpose of the RHI is Martin Horwood: To ask the Secretary of State for to increase renewable heat generation in order to contribute Energy and Climate Change (1) whether strike prices to our legally binding EU 2020 renewable energy target for new nuclear power stations will be negotiated on a as set out in the EU Renewable Energy Directive (RED). site-by-site basis; [111056] 567W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 568W

(2) how contract for difference strike prices for new Mr Jeremy Hunt: Adam Smith received his contractual nuclear power stations will be determined. [111057] monthly salary for April. Contractual payments were made in line with the terms of his employment, namely Charles Hendry: The draft operational framework for five weeks’ notice in lieu and outstanding annual leave. the proposed feed-in tariff with contracts for difference No further payments have been made. (published as Annex B to the draft Energy Bill 2012) states that, for nuclear ¦projects, the level of the strike Ms Harman: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, price will be determined through an administrative price Olympics, Media and Sport (1) if he will place in the setting process until the conditions are in place to move Library the clear requirements, referred to in his to competitive forms of price discovery. To begin with, Department’s statement of 26 April 2012, that were set under FID enabling, this process will involve negotiation out for Adam Smith to follow in his contact with News with developers on a project by project basis. Corporation for the News Corporation bid for BSkyB; and what arrangements were made to ensure compliance with such requirements; [111699] (2) if he will place in the Library a copy of each CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT document relating to the authorisation of Adam Smith as a point of contact with News Corporation for the Engagements: Newspapers News Corporation bid for BSkyB. [111748]

12. Pat Glass: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Jeremy Hunt: All legal and policy advice on my Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport which newspaper Department’s handling of News Corporation’s bid for proprietors he has met since the start of the Leveson the remaining shares in BSkyB and records of meetings at which this was discussed, was contained in the evidence Inquiry. [111310] I submitted to the Leveson inquiry, which I have now Mr Jeremy Hunt: Each Cabinet Minister publishes a placed in the House Library. list of meetings on a quarterly basis. These are available on the Cabinet Office website. Ms Harman: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport whether his Department’s Permanent Secretary gave prior authorisation for Adam Atos Smith to act as a contact point for the News Corporation bid for BSkyB. [111749] Tom Greatrex: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport what the total Mr Jeremy Hunt: In his statement to the Leveson monetary value is of each contract between his Department inquiry, the Permanent Secretary said that he approved and Atos. [111205] of and helped establish the process to support my decision-making, which included a role for Adam Smith, John Penrose: The Department currently has two which he saw as a normal and acceptable part of such a contracts with Atos. The first is for a managed ICT decision-making process. service which is approximately valued at £25 million. I will arrange for a copy of this statement and its The second is for technical advice in relation to the supporting evidence to be deposited in the Libraries of Mobile Infrastructure Project (MIP) which is valued at both Houses. approximately £1.2 million.

Tom Greatrex: To ask the Secretary of State for Ms Harman: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport when each contract Olympics, Media and Sport what legal advice not to between his Department and Atos was most recently meet representatives of News Corporation he received and from whom in November 2010; and what involvement (a) agreed, (b) renewed and (c) extended. [111206] his Department’s Permanent Secretary had in this advice. [111750] John Penrose: The Department currently has two contracts with Atos. The first is for a managed ICT service which was (a) agreed on 1 December 2007. It Mr Jeremy Hunt: All legal and policy advice put to has not been renewed or extended as the contract runs me on this subject by officials, is part of the package of until 1 December 2014. evidence I submitted to the Leveson inquiry, which I have now also placed in the Libraries of both Houses. The .second contract is for technical advice in relation to the Mobile Infrastructure Project (MIP) which was Helen Goodman: To ask the Secretary of State for agreed on 15 March 2012. It has not been renewed or Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport whether he sought extended. any advice from his Department’s Permanent Secretary on taking responsibility for the decision on the News British Sky Broadcasting: News Corporation Corporation bid for BSkyB; and what such advice he received. [111752] Helen Goodman: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport whether Adam Mr Jeremy Hunt: As I explained when I appeared at Smith received any severance package upon resigning the Leveson inquiry on 31 May2012, I received legal from his Department; whether Adam Smith received and policy advice from officials when I took responsibility any payment in lieu of notice; and if he will place in the for News Corporation’s bid for the remaining shares in Library details of any such severance package. [111635] BSkyB. My Permanent Secretary was involved in this 569W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 570W process and has also provided evidence to the inquiry. I Total spend on food advertising have deposited all the written evidence that I submitted to the Leveson inquiry in the Libraries of both Houses. 2007 404,024,262 A copy of the statement given to the inquiry by the 2008 725,129,654 Permanent Secretary, along with its supporting evidence, 2009 700,985,884 will be deposited in the Libraries of both Houses. 2010 841,265,230 Diamond Jubilee 2012 2011 819,758,591 Source: Nielson: Mr Godsiff: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, http://www.nielsen.com/uk/en.html Olympics, Media and Sport what estimate he has made of the cost to the public purse of the Diamond Jubilee Health Insurance celebration. [112070] Gordon Henderson: To ask the Secretary of State for Hugh Robertson: The national events that took place Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport how many staff in over the four day Jubilee Weekend in London, were his Department are entitled to private health care as funded by the organisers, and through individual donations part of their remuneration package. [111111] and corporate partnerships. Costs for elements of support and coordination falling to the Department for Culture, Media and Sport, including certain stewarding and John Penrose: There are no officials in the Department temporary structures built for the public and media, are that have private healthcare funded as part of their still being finalised. employment terms and conditions.

Digital Technology Leveson Inquiry

Mrs Grant: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport what recent assessment he Jim Sheridan: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, has made of the extent to which the principles of digital Olympics, Media and Sport what representations he has inclusion are taken into account by his Department’s received from media groups since the start of the Leveson website. [110932] Inquiry. [111311]

Mr Vaizey: The Department is constantly striving to Mr Jeremy Hunt: Each Cabinet Minister publishes a ensure that its website offers a fully inclusive experience list of meetings, including those with the media, on a for all visitors. We ensure the website is compliant to quarterly basis. These are available on the Cabinet Web Content Accessibility Guidelines (WCAG) priority Office website. My Department regularly receives 1 and 2 (AA standard), adheres to World Wide representations from media groups in the normal course Web Consortium (W3C) guidelines and follows of business. recommendations set out by the Government Digital Service. This includes providing users with guidance on Steve Baker: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, how to make the website more accessible for them, Olympics, Media and Sport what the cost to the public through changing browser settings and font sizes. Our purse of the Leveson Inquiry has been to date; and accessibility page has more information: what estimate he has made of its total projected cost. http://www.culture.gov.uk/accessibility.aspx [111686] We test our site using screen readers, automated validation tools and by manual checks. During major Mr Jeremy Hunt: The cost of the Leveson Inquiry to site redesigns we have also undertaken accessibility the public purse to date is about £3.2 million, which testing with users from a spectrum of disabilities—visual, represents payments made. The total cost for Part 1 of cognitive and motor. We look to reflect and promote the Leveson Inquiry from start-up in July 2011 is currently best practice, including the ‘10 principles of inclusive projected to be about £5.6 million. web design’: http://www.culture.gov.uk/what_we_do/ Listed Buildings telecommunications_and_online/8161.aspx across our site and our social media channels, and we aim to subtitle the majority of our video content. Dr Phillip Lee: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport what assessment Food: Advertising he has made of the effect on heritage of the decision to remove VAT relief for restoration and maintenance Chris Ruane: To ask the Secretary of State for works to listed buildings; and if he will make a statement. Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport if he will estimate [107608] the amount spent by the private sector on advertising foodstuffs to (a) children and (b) adults in each of the John Penrose: The Department has encouraged its last five years. [111652] stakeholders and arms’ length bodies to identify the impact of this change and respond directly to HM Mr Vaizey: The Department has made no estimate. Revenue and Custom’s consultation. We will be extending However, according to the latest industry data, the total the assistance provided by the Listed Places of Worship spend on food advertising in the last five years was as Scheme to ensure that alterations to listed places of follows: worship receive additional support. 571W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 572W

Misleading Advertising Hugh Robertson: The Department for Culture, Media and Sport (DCMS) is not providing training for its staff working on the Games to recognise victims of human Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, trafficking, as DCMS staff will not have frontline Games- Olympics, Media and Sport what assessment he has time operational responsibilities for this issue. Personnel made of the effectiveness of the Advertising Standards who are involved in combating trafficking, such as Authority (ASA) in dealing with misleading advertising; police officers, are provided with training and awareness whether the ASA verifies that companies comply with material as part of core policing business. its rulings; how many companies were subject to more than one ruling by ASA in the last 12 months; and what To date, DCMS is not aware of any evidence of an assessment he has made of the effectiveness of ASA increase in human trafficking as a result of the Games. rulings in dealing with misleading claims in advertising However, the Government remains vigilant, and has by (a) Nestle and (b) Ferrero. [110977] measures in place to deal with any potential increase. Radio Frequencies Mr Vaizey: No assessment has been made. The matters raised are operational ones for the Advertising Standards Ann McKechin: To ask the Secretary of State for Authority (ASA), which is independent of Government. Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport what recent progress Accordingly, my officials spoke to the ASA, who he has made on the auction of 4G spectrum; and if he advised that in 2011 they handled 19,510 complaints will make a statement. [111313] about misleading advertising across all sectors and 31,458 complaints overall. As a result of their action, 4,591 ad Mr Vaizey: The matter raised is an operational one campaigns were amended or withdrawn in 2011. for the independent regulator, the Office of Communications (Ofcom). Accordingly, my officials have spoken to Ofcom, The ASA requires assurances from advertisers subject who have advised that they will issue a statement in the to adjudication that they will comply with its rulings, summer. and the ASA will take compliance action should such assurances not be received. Tourism: North Yorkshire 330 advertisers have been subject to more than one upheld ASA adjudication over the past 12 months. Tom Blenkinsop: To ask the Secretary of State for Approximately two-thirds of these were subject to just Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport what steps VisitBritain two rulings. However, the ASA has noted that multiple and VisitEngland are taking to promote tourism in (a) rulings are not a direct corollary of non-compliance East Cleveland and (b) the North York Moors. [111263] but, rather, reflects the amount of advertising produced by large advertisers. John Penrose: The Department sponsors VisitBritain, The ASA’s monitoring team undertakes a significant which is charged with promoting Britain overseas, and amount of ongoing work monitoring the effectiveness VisitEngland, which is responsible for promoting England of the rules, including, since 2007, three proactive within the UK and to selected overseas markets. Funding monitoring surveys of the food and soft drink sector. is based on tourism destinations rather than apportioned Their 2009 food and soft drink advertising survey revealed on a regional basis, but is intended to ensure that an overall compliance rate with the rules of 99.4%. tourism assets and destinations receive coverage in national marketing campaigns. The Government also recently announced a major Olympic Games 2012 initiative to support both international and domestic tourism promotion. Including money from the GREAT campaign and private sector support, VisitBritain is Mr Anderson: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, investing over £120 million in an international marketing Olympics, Media and Sport what consideration he has programme. Over the next four years, this is expected to given to using UK-built vehicles for official use during deliver 4.6 million extra visitors from overseas, £2.27 the London 2012 Olympics. [111114] billion in extra visitor spend and over 50,000 job opportunities. VisitEngland’s domestic tourism campaign Hugh Robertson: The Department for Culture, Media is supported by a £5 million investment from the Olympic and Sport has given no such consideration. The London budget and is expected to deliver up to 12,500 new job Organising Committee of the Olympic Games and opportunities and £500 million in extra visitor spend Paralympic Games (LOCOG) is the private company over four years. This promotion includes an invitation responsible for staging the London 2012 games. LOCOG to the industry to join up in a 20.12% discount or appointed BMW as the automotive partner for the special offer incentive for consumers. games back in 2009, and is working on the details of the In addition, the Regional Growth Fund Project, ‘Growing 4,000 cars required for its fleet, including low-emission, Tourism Locally’, which is managed and co-ordinated diesel, hybrid and electric cars. LOCOG also procured by the National Tourist Board, VisitEngland, aims to c1,600 buses and coaches in early 2010, which will be stimulate increased visitor spend across England, provided by a range of companies across the UK. particularly in areas that are facing challenging economic times, but which have tourism growth potential. Mr Bone: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, VisitEngland is also working with the Department for Olympics, Media and Sport what training his Department Environment, Food and Rural Affairs and Natural provides to enable its staff involved with the London England on rural economic growth, in particular, 2012 Olympics to recognise victims of human trafficking. opportunities made available for tourism through the [111754] Rural Development Programme for England. 573W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 574W

INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT Mr O’Brien: The UK Government supports the Clean Technology Fund (CTF) and sits on the Trust Fund Atos Committee which reviews country-owned investment plans and projects. The UK has been instrumental in Tom Greatrex: To ask the Secretary of State for ensuring that the CTF meets both climate and development International Development when each contract between objectives, providing broader benefits for local populations. his Department and Atos was most recently (a) agreed, This includes poverty alleviation, access to renewable (b) renewed and (c) extended. [111203] energy, improved air and water quality, and local industrial development potential. Mr Duncan: DFID has four centrally awarded contracts Mexico’s investment plan was endorsed in 2009 by in place with Atos, including two Framework Agreements. the CTF Committee. It supports the low-carbon objectives Details of the contracts, including title, type and in the country’s 2007-12 National Development Plan, start/end dates are as follows. No decision to extend its National Climate Change Strategy and Special Climate these contracts has been taken at this time. Change Program. Projects have now also been approved and are being implemented. Contract title Contract start date Contract end date

Safety and Access to 14 March 2010 13 March 2014 Justice Programme Pay Federal Public 24 January 2011 24 January 2016 Administration Reform Programme in Nigeria Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Fragile and Conflict 1 February 2012 31 January 2014 International Development how many staff working Affected States for his Department and its non-departmental public Framework Agreement bodies are employed through off-payroll engagements Governance and 1 March 2012 28 February 2014 costing less than £58,200 per annum; and if he will Security Framework Agreement make a statement. [110829]

Developing Countries: Water Mr Duncan: DFID recently conducted a comprehensive review of tax arrangements for public sector appointments in contract at 31 January 2012. This was a government-wide Mr Ainsworth: To ask the Secretary of State for review commissioned by Her Majesty’s Treasury. International Development what programmes and projects his Department funds which support the provision of DFID had 77 appointments off payroll at 31 January clean water and sanitation in developing countries. 2012 and at an annual cost to the Department of less [111468] than £58,200: 76 contracted through an employment agency or consultancy firm and one non-executive director. Mr O’Brien: Full details of the Department for DFID will continue to review all non-payroll International Development’s (DFID’s) current water, arrangements to ensure that all appointments meet sanitation and hygiene (WaSH) portfolio are available their tax obligations and that the contractual arrangement from the WaSH Portfolio Review on the DFID website: is the most appropriate for the situation. http://www.dfid.gov.uk/Site-search/ ?g=wash+portfolio+review Stephen Gilbert: To ask the Secretary of State for DFID is implementing nine major WaSH bilateral International Development what steps his Department programmes in Africa (Tanzania, Mozambique, Malawi, has taken to introduce regional pay since 20 March Zambia, Zimbabwe, Ethiopia, Democratic Republic of 2012; and if he will make a statement. [111543] Congo, Nigeria and Sierra Leone) and four in South Asia (India, Bangladesh, Nepal and Vietnam). We also Mr Duncan: DFID’s pay freeze concludes this year. contribute to the results achieved by multilateral DFID, in line with the civil service pay guidance for organisations including the European Commission, the 2012-13 issued by HM Treasury, will submit a three-year World Bank, Unicef and the African Development Bank. pay strategy to the Cabinet Office which, among other At the Sanitation and Water for All High Level things, will explain how DFID is going to move to a Meeting in Washington on 20 April 2012, the Secretary more market-related pay structure. of State for International Development, my right hon. Friend the Member for Sutton Coldfield (Mr Mitchell), announced that the UK has doubled its results ambition Publications for the number of people we will reach with WaSH programmes and committed to reach at least 60 million Jonathan Ashworth: To ask the Secretary of State for people by 2015. Details of how we will deliver the International Development how many (a) circulars scaled-up ambition are under development. and (b) consultation documents were issued by his Department in each of the last two years. [110511] Mexico Mr Duncan: DFID has issued 12 consultations in the Kerry McCarthy: To ask the Secretary of State for last two years: International Development if he will take steps to ensure June 2010 to May 2011—nine consultations that aid to Clean Technology Fund projects in Mexico is directed towards generating affordable, renewable June 2011 to May 2012—three consultations energy for the indigenous population. [111137] There have been no circulars. 575W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 576W

Recruitment Nick Harvey: The following table provides the establishment and strength information for Service Stephen Timms: To ask the Secretary of State for personnel in infantry battalions. International Development pursuant to the answer of 21 May 2012, Official Report, column 489W,on recruitment, Division Unit Establishment Manning to what extent his Department and its non-departmental Guards 1 Grenadier Guards 536 520 public body used name-blank CVs or the blind sift 1 Coldstream 535 462 function on the Civil Service Resourcing e-recruitment Guards system to recruit staff in the last year. [110959] 1 Scots Guards 603 545 1 Irish Guards 537 483 Mr Duncan: DFID does not yet manage recruitment 1 Welsh Guards 530 506 through the Civil Service Resourcing e-recruitment system. DFID is currently in discussions with Civil Service Resourcing with the aim to introduce the system in the Scots 1 SCOTS 535 517 second half of 2012. 2 SCOTS 528 448 DFID does though manage external recruitment for 3 SCOTS 537 520 all grades below the Senior Civil Service through an 4 SCOTS 608 460 e-recruitment system and all sifting is done blind. The 5 SCOTS 556 465 personal details section of the application process is not available to the recruiting manager until after this part of the process is complete. Queens 1 Princess of Wales 599 594 Royal Regiment 2 Princess of Wales 535 541 Syria Royal Regiment 1 Royal Regiment 599 601 Fusiliers Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Secretary of State for 2 Royal Regiment 532 523 International Development what steps his Department Fusiliers is taking to work with the UN Refugees Agency on 1 Royal Anglian 571 565 meeting the needs of Syrian refugees. [111498] 2 Royal Anglian 538 528 Mr Duncan: I recently visited the border between Jordan and Syria and I saw first-hand the devastating Kings 1 LANCS 571 551 harm the violence is having on the increasing numbers 2 LANCS 523 489 of Syrians who are seeking refuge in neighbouring 1 YORKS 533 408 countries. I also saw the commendable work the United 2 YORKS 532 487 Nations Refugee Agency (UNHCR) and governments of neighbouring countries are doing to support those in 3 YORKS 599 593 need. The UK is working with UNHCR to address the Prince of 1 MERCIAN 533 494 critical needs of Syrian refugees in Jordan, Lebanon, Wales Turkey and Iraq. We have committed £2 million to 2 MERCIAN 527 439 provide safe accommodation for nearly 2,000 people 3 MERCIAN 604 507 fleeing their homes as well as providing food for up to 1 Royal Welsh 527 501 1,200 and water and sanitation for 800 people. 2 Royal Welsh 575 529 UNHCR and UN agencies are working with local partners to allocate UK funding flexibly to respond to a rapidly changing situation to ensure aid reaches those Rifles 1 RIFLES 532 504 who need it most. The UK also provides substantial 2 RIFLES 528 506 core funding to UNHCR for its operations globally, 3 RIFLES 527 511 including in this region. We remain in regular contact with UNHCR to ensure the humanitarian response is 4 RIFLES 571 551 effective and coordinated. 5 RIFLES 599 575

Royal Irish 1 Royal Irish 554 554 DEFENCE Para 2 PARA 553 463 Army: Manpower 3 PARA 548 500

Mark Lancaster: To ask the Secretary of State for In addition to the battalions shown above, there are Defence what the actual manning against establishment three incremental Guards companies whose primary figures is for each infantry battalion; and what proportion role is Public Duties but which can also be used to of soldiers is (a) English, (b) Scottish, (c) Welsh, (d) augment the other Guards battalions as required. The Northern Irish or (e) of Commonwealth extraction by establishment and strength information for these elements birth. [111080] is as follows: 577W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 578W

Mr Maude: As part of my Department’s transparency Unit Establishment Manning programme, details of contracts above the value of Nijmegen Company 100 104 £10,000 are published on Contracts Finder: Grenadier Guards http://www.contractsfinder.co.uk 7 Company Coldstream 100 102 Guards F Company Scots 100 100 Average Earnings Guards

It is not our policy to release corresponding data for Hugh Bayley: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet 1st Battalion the Parachute Regiment. Office what the average household income was (a) on Information relating to the birth nationality of personnel the latest date for which figures are available, (b) in is not held in the format requested. 2010, (c) in 1997 and (d) in 1992 in the areas covered in 2012 by (i) York travel to work area, (ii) City of York Army: Scotland Council and (iii) York Central constituency (A) in cash terms and (B) at 2012 prices. [111430] Mark Lancaster: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence whether recruits will be allowed to choose the Mr Hurd: The information requested falls within the infantry cap badge within the Scottish regiments that responsibility of the UK Statistics Authority. I have they join. [111079] asked the authority to reply. Letter from Stephen Penneck, dated June 2012: Nick Harvey: Recruits joining the Royal Regiment of As Director General for the Office for National Statistics, I Scotland (The Scottish Division) are allocated to a have been asked to reply to your recent question asking the particular battalion of the regiment during weeks 10 to Minister for the Cabinet Office, what the average household 12 of initial training at the Infantry Training Centre in income was (a) at the latest date for which figures are available, (b) Catterick. All recruits in the Royal Regiment of Scotland in 2010, (c) in 1997 and (d) in 1992 in the areas covered in 2012 by are given the opportunity to prioritise their choice of (i) York travel to work area, (ii) City of York Council and (iii) battalion, with the final allocation based on the operational York Central constituency (A) in cash terms and (B) at 2012 needs of the battalions, balanced with the wishes of the prices (111430). individual. In addition, recruits cannot be assigned to Table 1 shows the average net weekly equivalised household battalions that may deploy while they remain under 18 income for the City of York Council and York Central constituency areas, both before and after housing costs, for the years 2007/08, years of age. the latest available, and 2001/02, the earliest period for which data Recruits wishing to join another infantry regiment are available, in cash terms and 2011 prices. These figures are also recruiting in Scotland may choose alternatively to based on small area income estimates published by the ONS. The join The Scots Guards or The Parachute Regiment. data in the table have been adjusted to 2011 prices using the implied expenditure deflator for the household sector. Defence: Procurement Small area income estimates for the York travel to work area are not currently produced. Mr Kevan Jones: To ask the Secretary of State for These estimates, as with any involving sample surveys, are Defence pursuant to the answer of 23 May 2012, Official subject to a margin of uncertainty. Report, column 721W, on defence: procurement, what Table 1: Average net weekly equivalised household income in the City discussions his Department had with HM Treasury on of York council and York Central parliamentary constituency areas, the assumed annual 1% annual increase to the equipment 2001-02 and 2007-081, 2 and equipment support budget from 2015. [110649] £ per week City of York council York Central parliamentary Peter Luff: The Chief Secretary to the Treasury agreed constituency that the Ministry of Defence should plan on an annual Mean Mean Mean Mean 1% real terms increase in spending on the Equipment income income income income programme from 2015 to 2020. This was originally (before (after (before (after agreed during the preliminary work on Planning Round housing housing housing housing 12 announced by the previous Secretary of State for costs)3 costs)3 costs)3 costs)3 Defence my right hon. Friend the Member for North (A) In 2001-02 370 340 360 310 Somerset (Dr Fox), on 18 July 2011. This planning cash assumption has not changed. terms 2007-08 480 400 460 370

CABINET OFFICE (B) In 2001-02 470 430 450 400 2011 prices Atos 2007-08 540 450 510 410 1 Incomes are presented net of income tax payments, national Tom Greatrex: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet insurance contributions and council tax. Office (1) what the total monetary value is of each 2 Figures rounded to the nearest £10. contract between his Department and Atos; [111211] 3 Housing costs include rent (gross of housing benefit), water charges, mortgage interest payments, structural insurance, ground (2) when each contract between his Department and rent and service charges. Atos was most recently (a) agreed, (b) renewed and Source: (c) extended. [111212] Office for National Statistics 579W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 580W

Business: Richmond Upon Thames Charitable and Voluntary Organisations

Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Grahame M. Morris: To ask the Minister for the Office what estimate he has made of the number of Cabinet Office what support his Department is giving micro-businesses in Richmond Park constituency. to charitable and voluntary organisations seeking [111577] funding from his Department. [110363]

Mr Hurd: The information requested falls within the Mr Hurd: We have made grants available to a wide responsibility of the UK Statistics Authority. I have range of frontline charities and social enterprises and asked the authority to reply. the infrastructure organisations that exist to support Letter from Stephen Penneck: them. As Director General for the Office for National Statistics, I We have also put in place Big Society Capital, the have been asked to reply to your recent Parliamentary Question world’s first social investment institution. concerning what estimate has been made of the number of micro-businesses in Richmond Park constituency. [111577] Civil Servants Annual statistics on the number of enterprises are available from the ONS release UK Business: Activity, Size and Location Mr McCann: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet at: Office what range of appraisal markings, and how www.statistics.gov.uk many markings in each grade, were given to civil servants, The table below contains the latest statistics available, which by grade, in the most recent year for which figures are show the number of enterprises in Richmond Park constituency available. [110875] by employee size band. Count of VAT or PAYE enterprises in the constituency of Richmond Mr Maude: Appraisal markings are determined by Park by employee size band individual Departments. 0-9 Micro Mr McCann: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Richmond Park 5,980 Office what the average bonus paid to civil servants Note: The above figures have been rounded to the nearest 5, to avoid was, by grade, in the most recent year for which figures disclosure. are available. [110876]

Business: West Midlands Mr Maude: Since May 2010, non-consolidated performance-related pay (NCPRP) for senior civil servants Mr Godsiff: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet (SCS) has been cut back, reducing the number who Office how many (a) micro, (b) small and (c) medium- receive awards from 65% to 25% and rewarding only sized businesses there were in (i) Birmingham, Hall exceptional performance. This has delivered savings of Green constituency and (ii) the West Midlands in the around £15 million. latest period for which figures are available. [111443] The level of average awards made by each department and agency is published on departmental websites and Mr Hurd: The information requested falls within the data.gov.uk. responsibility of the UK Statistics Authority. I have asked the authority to reply. Mr McCann: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Letter from Stephen Penneck, dated June 2012: Office how many civil servants, by grade, were subject As Director General for the Office for National Statistics, I to disciplinary penalties in the year ended March 2012. have been asked to reply to your recent Parliamentary Question [110882] concerning how many (a) micro, (b) small and (c) medium-sized businesses there were in (i) Birmingham, Hall Green constituency Mr Maude: Disciplinary penalties are a responsibility and (ii) the West Midlands in the latest period for which figures of individual Departments. are available. [111443] Annual statistics on the number of enterprises are available Emergency Planning College from the ONS release UK Business: Activity, Size and Location at: Miss McIntosh: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet www.statistics.gov.uk Office if he will visit the Civil Service Emergency College The following table contains the latest statistics available, which at Hawkhills, Easingwold; and if he will make a statement. show the number of enterprises in Birmingham, Hall Green [110629] constituency and the West Midlands by employee size bands. Count of VAT or PAYE based enterprises for the constituency of Mr Maude: I would like to take this opportunity to Birmingham, Hall Green and the West Midlands by employee size pay tribute to its valuable work in sports safety training bands in support of the Olympics. I intend to visit in due 0-9 10-49 50-249 250 + course to see this for myself. Micro Small Medium Large Total Employment Birmingham, 2,210 210 20 5 2,445 Hall Green Hugh Bayley: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet West 149,100 15,090 2,705 690 167,585 Midlands Office how many full-time equivalent civil service posts Note: there were (a) on the latest date for which figures are The above figures have been rounded to the nearest 5, to avoid available (b) in 2010, (c) in 1997 and (d) in 1992 in (i) disclosure. the area currently covered by the City of York plus the 581W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 582W

DEFRA central science laboratory at Sand Hutton Government Departments: Procurement and (ii) the area currently covered by York Central constituency. [111416] Nicholas Soames: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Office what steps he has taken to improve the process Mr Hurd: The information requested falls within the of government procurement. [109409] responsibility of the UK Statistics Authority. I have asked the authority to reply. Mr Maude [holding answer 24 May 2012]: The programme of procurement reform we have initiated is Letter from Stephen Penneck, dated June 2012: unprecedented and has already yielded billions of pounds As Director General for the Office for National Statistics, I in savings for the taxpayer, including through tighter have been asked to reply to your recent Parliamentary Question controls. asking how many full-time equivalent civil servant posts there were (a) at the latest date for which figures are available (b) 2010, A reformed Government Procurement Service is leading (c) in 1997 and (d) in 1992 in (i) the area currently covered by the the way in letting cross Government deals which standardise City of York plus the DEFRA central science laboratory at Sand requirements and leverage Government’s buying power Hutton (ii) the area currently covered by York Central constituency to full effect. (111416). We have introduced a new LEAN sourcing process The Annual Civil Service Employment Survey has been carried for central Government which aims to reduce procurement out by ONS since 2006. Prior to this the survey was called the time scales by at least 40%. I have mandated that all Mandate Collection and was carried out by Cabinet Office. Departments, should procure all but the most complex Therefore the data provided is for the latest year available, 2011, and 2010. goods and services within 120 days using more open competitions so that new and different types of suppliers The data are provided for York plus the DEFRA agency at and business models can flourish. We have also removed Sand Hutton and are shown at Annex A. These data are not available by parliamentary constituency. various obstacles in the process itself such as unnecessary or over burdensome pre-qualification questionnaires. The survey reference points for the data are 31 March for both 2010 and 2011. Details of all our procurement reform can be found on the Cabinet Office website at: The data for York plus Sand Hutton are shown at Annex A. http://procurement.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/ Civil service employment in York plus DEFRA agency at Sand Hutton1 Health Insurance Permanent employees (full-time equivalent) 2 2 2010 2011 Gordon Henderson: To ask the Minister for the York plus DEFRA 3,060 2,840 Cabinet Office how many staff working in his agency Department are entitled to private health care as part 1 The Annual Civil Service Employment Survey uses post code to of their remuneration package. [111113] derive location and assign to a NUTS3 region. The figures provided are for the NUTS region York plus the former Central Science Mr Maude: The Civil Service Management Code Laboratory (CSL), now Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (DEFRA). precludes the provision of private health care from 2 Survey reference date 31 March. reward packages for staff. Note: Numbers are rounded to the nearest 10, and numbers less than five Leonard Cheshire Disability are represented by ‘—’. Source: Annual Civil Service Employment Survey Gordon Banks: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Office when (a) he and (b) Ministers from his Department last met representatives from Leonard Cheshire Disability. Mr Godsiff: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet [111636] Office how many (a) full-time and (b) part-time jobs equivalent to 24 working hours or fewer each week have Mr Maude: As part of my Department’s transparency been created in (i) the UK and (ii) Birmingham, Hall programme, details of ministerial meetings with external Green constituency in each month since May 2010. organisations are published on the Cabinet Office website [111445] at: http://www.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/resource-library/ministerial- Mr Hurd: The information requested falls within the gifts-hospitality-travel-meetings-external-organisations-october- responsibility of the UK Statistics Authority. I have december-2011 asked the authority to reply. Office for Civil Society Letter from Stephen Penneck: As Director General for the Office for National Statistics, I Mr Thomas: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet have been asked to reply to your Parliamentary Question how Office with reference to the answer of 17 October 2011, many (a) full-time and (b) part-time jobs equivalent to 24 working hours or fewer each week have been created in (i) the UK and (ii) Official Report, column 725W, on the Office for Civil Birmingham, Hall Green constituency in each month since May Society: manpower, how many staff were working for 2010. (111445) the Office for Civil Society in May (a) 2010, (b) 2011 and (c) 2012; and if he will make a statement. [109472] Estimates of new jobs created are not available. Information is available for net changes in level, which reflects both jobs lost and people who have been recruited into existing jobs that were Mr Hurd: On 30 April 2010, there were 54 full-time vacant. Consequently this does not give any useful information equivalent (FTE) staff working on civil society projects regarding the actual level of new job creation. in the Office of the Third Sector. 583W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 584W

The Office for Civil Society (OCS) was created in Voluntary Work June 2010 as part of the Efficiency and Reform Group (ERG). Dr Phillip Lee: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet In May 2011, OCS had an agreed headcount of Office what steps he is taking to reduce the 92 FTE. In May 2012, OCS has an agreed headcount of administrative burdens of volunteering. [110009] 88 FTE. Mr Hurd: One of the priorities of the coalition is making it easier to volunteer. Third Sector We are working to implement the recommendations made by the Civil Society Red Tape Task Force in its Jon Trickett: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet May 2011 report ″Unshackling Good Neighbours″ as a Office how many meetings his Department has had recently published ″One Year On″ report shows. with the Department for Work and Pensions to discuss The Cabinet Office has also launched the Red Tape the role of charitable and voluntary organisations in Challenge Civil Society theme to identify remaining the delivery of the Work Programme since June 2011. burdens. The Red Tape Challenge can be accessed at [110739] www.redtapechallenge.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/home/index/

Mr Hurd: The Cabinet Office is in frequent discussion Voluntary Work: Young People with the Department for Work and Pensions at ministerial and official level. Mr Graham Stuart: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Office whether he has considered expanding Chris Ruane: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet the National Citizen service to include year 10 students. Office what indicators his Department is using to [110613] measure the success of the Big Society programme; and if he will make a statement. [111711] Mr Hurd: The vision for National Citizen Service is that it is a ’rite of passage’ for young people, to mark Mr Hurd: Departmental Business Plans set out clear the transition to adulthood. priorities across Government. Within the Cabinet Office, There are currently no plans to offer the programme this includes what we are putting in place to support the to year 10. growth of big society, reporting progress on initiatives such as Community Organisers, Community First, National Working Hours Citizen Service, and Big Society Capital at: http://transparency.number10.gov.uk/business-plan/1/79 Mr Godsiff: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet We continue to report publicly on progress against these Office what average number of hours was worked per priorities. week by people employed in (a) the UK and (b) In addition we have carried out an evaluation of a Birmingham, Hall Green constituency in May (i) 2010, key big society programme, the National Citizen Service, (ii) 2011 and (iii) 2012. [110937] to determine its effectiveness in creating a more engaged, cohesive and responsible society. The results have been Mr Hurd: The information requested falls within the published and are available at: responsibility of the UK Statistics Authority. I have asked the authority to reply. www.natcen.ac.uk/study/national-citizen-service-evaluation Letter from Stephen Penneck, dated June 2012: As Director General for the Office for National Statistics, I Voluntary Organisations have been asked to reply to your Parliamentary Question asking the average number of hours worked per week by people employed in (a) the UK and (b) Birmingham, Hall Green constituency was Andrew Gwynne: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet in May (i) 2010, (ii) 2011 and (iii) 2012. (110937) Office what estimate his Department has made of the The Office for National Statistics (ONS) compiles statistics on economic value of training in voluntary youth Average Hours Worked for local areas from the Annual Population organisations in (a) Denton and Reddish constituency, Survey (APS). Estimates for the UK have been provided from this (b) Greater Manchester and (c) nationally in the latest source for consistency. However, these UK estimates will differ from those in the National Labour Market Statistics Bulletin period for which figures are available. [111573] which are produced from the Labour Force Survey. The table gives the mean actual number of hours worked per Mr Hurd: The Cabinet Office has made no such worker per week for the geographies requested for the 12 month estimate. APS periods ending September 2010 and September 2011, the However we understand that voluntary organisations latest period for which figures are available. Data for 2012 are provide an excellent level of training to both their staff currently not available. and volunteers. The opportunity for young people to As with any sample survey, estimates from the APS are subject engage in volunteering is particularly valuable during to a margin of uncertainty. this current economic climate as it allows young people Mean hours worked per worker per week in the United Kingdom and to boost the skills, knowledge and confidence they need Birmingham Hall Green constituency to find permanent paid employment. The Cabinet Office 12 months ending recognises these benefits and in 2011 launched the September 2010 September 2011 National Citizenship Service to encourage young people United Kingdom 31.8 31.7 to volunteer in their communities. 585W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 586W

BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS ensure that people from all ethnic backgrounds are able to access apprenticeships and are supported throughout the apprenticeship. Apprentices Information on the number of apprenticeship starts and achievements is published in a quarterly Statistical Stephen Timms: To ask the Secretary of State for First Release (SFR). The latest SFR was published on Business, Innovation and Skills how many (a) men and 29 March 2012: (b) women from each ethnic group in each age group http://www.thedataservice.org.uk/statistics/statistical firstrelease/ (i) started and (ii) completed an apprenticeship, by sfr_current duration of apprenticeship, in each of the last six years. Breakdowns by gender, age, ethnicity and length of [111031] stay are published in Supplementary Tables at the following links: Mr Hayes [holding answer 13 June 2012]: Iam http://www.thedataservice.org.uk/statistics/statisticalfirst release/ placing in the Libraries of the House data that show sfr_supplementary_tables/Apprenticeship_sfr_supplementary apprenticeship starts and achievements by gender, ethnicity _tables/ and age between 2005/06 and 2010/11, the latest full http://www.thedataservice.org.uk/statistics/ year for which final data are available. statisticalfirstrelease/sfr_other_statistics/ I have also made data available that show apprenticeship Apprentices: Medicine achievements by duration between 2009/10 and 2010/11. These are the latest years for which data on both unadjusted and adjusted measures of length of stay are Mr Virendra Sharma: To ask the Secretary of State available. for Business, Innovation and Skills what support is available through the National Apprenticeship Service Care should be taken when interpreting and comparing for people wishing to work in clinical research. [111021] the length of apprenticeships across years as it does not account for the change in the mix of apprenticeship Mr Hayes: A number of apprenticeship frameworks levels and frameworks. For example, if a greater proportion cover aspects of clinical research; namely Laboratory of apprenticeship achievements were by frameworks of and Science Technicians (Intermediate and Advanced a typically shorter length, this would bring down the levels) issued by SEMTA (Sector Skills Council for overall length despite no change in the length of a Science, and Manufacturing Technologies) particular framework. Therefore a better comparison is and Life Science (Higher) issued by Cogent. The National at Sector Subject Area, which addresses some of these Apprenticeship Service provides funding towards the issues. I have also placed data in the Libraries of the costs of delivering these frameworks, as well as working House that show the average length of stay of with the sector, employers and potential apprentices to apprenticeship achievements by Sector Subject Area promote their take up. and level. Prior attainment can affect the length of time it takes Apprentices: West Midlands to complete an apprenticeship because it may take less time to acquire a particular skill. There are, therefore, Mr Godsiff: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, two measures of duration. The adjusted measure is Innovation and Skills how many apprentice starts there intended to exclude those apprentices with some prior were by 16 to 18 year-olds in (a) Birmingham, Hall attainment, as they are unlikely to be fully funded. It Green constituency and (b) the West Midlands in (i) does not account for breaks in courses or transfers onto 2010, (ii) 2011 and (iii) 2012. [111408] other courses, which could also affect the length of time taken to complete an apprenticeship. We hold more Mr Hayes: Table 1 shows the number of apprenticeship confidence that the adjusted measure is a more accurate programme starts aged under 19 in (a) Birmingham, reflection of the average apprenticeship length. Hall Green parliamentary constituency, (b) the West Additionally, the average length of an apprenticeship Midlands and (c) England for academic years 2009/10 programme does not necessarily reflect the guided learning to 2010/11, the latest full years for which final data are hours or the actual length of time in learning. For these available. reasons the average length should be seen as contributory Table 1: Apprenticeship Programme Starts by learners aged under 19 by information to any broader assessment of the apprenticeship geography, 2009/10 to 2010/11 experience and quality. Full Year Although diversity issues are wider than apprenticeships, 2009/10 2010/11 apprenticeships are an important route into many sectors Birmingham, 200 280 and the Government are keen that apprentices reflect Hall Green the diversity of the population. West Midlands 13,590 15,690 The National Apprenticeship Service (NAS) recently England total 116,800 131,700 undertook a series of diversity pilots that looked at Notes: 1. Figures are rounded to the nearest 10 except for the England totals which are encouraging diversity within apprenticeships. Pilots have rounded to the nearest 100. finished and a final report is due to be published later 2. Age is based on age at the start of the programme. The figures include a small this month. number of under 16-year-olds. 3. Geography is based upon the home postcode of the learner. The England Officials in the Department for Business, Innovation totals include some postcodes which are not known. Geographic information is based on boundaries of regions as of May 2010. and Skills have has also met with the Commission for Source: Equality and Human Rights, the TUC and NAS to Individualised Learner Record 587W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 588W

Information on the number of apprenticeship starts Arts. We recognise that access to finance is critical for is published in a quarterly Statistical First Release businesses to survive and grow and that small and (SFR). The latest SFR and supplementary tables were medium-sized companies face particular challenges. published on 29 March 2012: In 2009, the Department published research undertaken http://www.thedataservice.org.uk/statistics/ by SQW Consulting which explored the existence and statisticalfirstrelease/sfr_current size of the equity gap affecting SMEs (‘The Supply of http://www.thedataservice.org.uk/statistics/ Equity Finance to SMEs: Revisiting the Equity Gap’). statisticalfirstrelease/sfr_supplementary_tables/ This research found the equity gap stretched for funding Apprenticeship_sfr_supplementary_tables/ amounts of £250,000 to at least £2 million (with some Arms Trade putting the ceiling at £5 million) for the majority of SMEs seeking equity finance. However, in the case of sectors requiring complex research and development or Paul Flynn: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, large capital expenditure, the gap may extend up to £15 Innovation and Skills what the priority markets will be million. for the UK Trade and Investment Defence and Security Organisation in 2012-13. [111508] The Department has also undertaken a number of public consultations, including ‘Financing a private sector Mr Prisk: The UK Trade and Investment Defence recovery’, which asks about conditions affecting SMEs and Security Organisation 2012-13 list of priority markets raising equity finance. is: Simon Kirby: To ask the Secretary of State for Australia Business, Innovation and Skills how many Enterprise Brazil Capital Funds had been set up by May 2012. [110984] Canada Europe/NATO/EU (as a collective market) Mr Prisk: By May 2012, 11 Enterprise Capital Funds India (ECF) had been set up. Since the ECF programme was Indonesia launched in 2006, over £130 million has been invested in Japan more than 120 small and medium-sized enterprises(SMEs). Kingdom of Saudi Arabia A new £40 million ECF was announced in April to Kuwait invest in UK cloud computing and Software-as-a-Service companies. Government will commit up to £25 million, Libya with the remainder coming from the private sector. Malaysia The Government has committed a further £200 million Qatar to ECFs over this spending review period to April 2015, Oman providing more than £300 million of venture capital South Korea investment for early stage innovative SMEs with the Thailand highest growth potential. Turkey UAE Simon Kirby: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, USA Innovation and Skills what steps his Department has taken to raise awareness of the Enterprise Finance Atos Guarantee to (a) small and medium-sized enterprises and (b) others. [110990] Tom Greatrex: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills when each contract Mr Prisk: The Government has actively promoted between his Department and Atos was most recently the Enterprise Finance Guarantee scheme (EFG) as (a) agreed, (b) renewed and (c) extended. [111185] part of the ‘Business in You’campaign launched by the Prime Minister in January 2012. We are working alongside Norman Lamb: Central records indicate that no payments the private sector, local enterprise partnerships, and have been made to Atos in the current financial year. business support organisations to raise awareness of the Accordingly the Department has no existing contracts range of Government support available to small and with Atos. medium-size enterprises. Information about EFG is easily accessible on the Business: Finance BIS website and on the websites of the major high street banks, who are committed to support EFG as part of Simon Kirby: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, the Business Finance Taskforce commitments. Innovation and Skills what assessment his Department has made of the barriers to young innovative firms Commercial Agents: EU Law obtaining equity finance. [110983] Tom Greatrex: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Prisk: The Department regularly assesses the Business, Innovation and Skills what legislative protection barriers for small and medium-sized enterprises (SMEs) is currently in place to ensure the payment of commercial raising equity finance by monitoring investment statistics agents by firms. [106976] and research produced by external organisations such as the British Private Equity and Venture Capital Norman Lamb: Part III of the Commercial Agents Association, European Venture Capital Association and (Council Directive) Regulations 1993 (S.I. 1993/3053) National Endowment for Science, Technology and the deals with the remuneration of the commercial agent. It 589W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 590W makes provision for the date on which commission Letter from Stephen Speed, dated 22 May 2012: becomes due. The parties cannot contract out of these The Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills has provisions. Therefore, if the principal fails to make the asked me to reply to your question asking how many complaints due payment, the commercial agent may be able to about the work of his Department and each of its agencies and bring a claim against the principal. These regulations non-departmental public bodies were received in (a) 2010-11 and have their origin in EU legislation, namely the EU (b) 2011-12; and if he will make a statement. Council Directive 86/653/EEC on the co-ordination of Complaints made to The Insolvency Service about its work the laws of the member states relating to self-employed were 269 in 2010/11 and 330 in 2011/12. commercial agents. These regulations have been amended Letter from David Williams, dated 22 May 2012: twice since then (in 1993—S.I. 1993/3173 and in 1998—S.I. Thank you for your question addressed to the Secretary of 1998/2868). State for the Department of Business, Innovation and Skills asking how many complaints about the work of his Department Tom Greatrex: To ask the Secretary of State for and each of its agencies and non-departmental public bodies were Business, Innovation and Skills whether his Department received in (a) 2010-11 and (b) 2011-12; and if he will make a statement. 108940 has had discussions with the European Commission on the provisions in EU Council Directive 86/653/EEC The UK Space Agency became an executive agency of the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills on 1 April 2011 relating to pay, when paid clauses in commercial contracts. and no complaints have been received regarding the work of his [106977] Agency during the financial year 2011/12. Letter from Dr Vanessa Lawrence CB, dated 18 May Norman Lamb: This Department has had no such 2012: discussions with the European Commission, and has no plans to do so. As Director General and Chief Executive of Ordnance Survey, I have been asked to contact you in response to your parliamentary question asking the Secretary of State of the Department for Tom Greatrex: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills, how many complaints about the Business, Innovation and Skills what representations work of his Department and each of its agencies and non- his Department has received on possible changes to EU departmental public bodies were received in (a) 2010-11 and (b) Council Directive 86/653/EEC to the EU Directive 2011-12. 3053 to ban the use of pay, when paid clauses. [106978] The total number of complaints received by Ordnance Survey in this time period was: Norman Lamb: This Department has received no (a) 2010-11: 594 complaints such representations. (b) 2011-12: 789 complaints These figures are published in our Annual Reports. Complaints These figures reflect correspondence of many types, including cases which raise issues about the currency and depiction of specific map features of interest to particular individuals, and Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, those which reflect misunderstandings about the nature and Innovation and Skills how many complaints about the scope of Ordnance Survey mapping, as well as complaints about work of his Department and each of its agencies and the performance of Ordnance Survey. non-departmental public bodies were received in (a) Letter from Tim Moss, dated 18 May 2012: 2010-11 and (b) 2011-12; and if he will make a statement. [108940] I am replying on behalf of Companies House to your Parliamentary Question tabled 17 May 2012, UIN 108940 to the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills. Norman Lamb: Formal complaints against the In 2010/11 Companies House received 24,971 complaints about Department are published in the Parliamentary and its work, 11,995 of which were found to be justified after investigation. Health Service Ombudsman’s Annual Report. In 2011/12 the number of complaints was 18,025. 5,700 of these Information regarding the Department’s non- were found to be justified after investigation. departmental public bodies is not held centrally and A very substantial number of complaints in 2010/11 were could be provided only at disproportionate cost. received following the implementation of the new Companies Act. These reduced in 2011/12 as customers became familiar with I have approached the chief executives of the Insolvency the Act and Companies House made upgrades to its guidance Service, Companies House, the National Measurement and services. Office, the Intellectual Property Office, UK Space Agency, Letter from Peter Mason, dated 23 May 2012: Ordnance Survey, Met Office, Land Registry and the Skills Funding Agency and they will respond to the I am responding in respect of the National Measurement hon. Member directly. Office (NMO) to your Parliamentary Question tabled on 17 May 2012, asking the Secretary of State, Department for Business, Letter from Geoff Russell, dated 13 June 2012: Innovation and Skills about the number of complaints about the Thank you for your question asking the Secretary of State, work of his Department and its agencies. Department for Business, Innovation and Skills how many complaints NMO received one complaint about its work during 2010-11 about the work of his Department and each of its agencies and which fell to be considered under our formal procedures; this non-departmental public bodies were received in 2010-11 and complaint was subsequently resolved. 2011-12. No complaints under the NMO’s formal procedures were Please be advised of the following figures in respect to complaints received in 2011-12. received by the Skills Funding Agency: Letter from John Alty, dated 24 May 2012: 1 April 2010 to 31 March 2011 a total of 45 complaints about I am responding in respect of the Intellectual Property Office the SFA to your Parliamentary Question tabled 17th May 2012, to the 1 April 2011 to 31 March 2012 a total of 28 complaints about Secretary of State, Department for Business, Innovation and the SFA. Skills. 591W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 592W

The number of complaints received by the IPO are as follows: Exports: Bahrain a) Total for 2010-11 (Apr-Mar) = 118 (55 Formal, 63 informal) Katy Clark: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, b) Total for 2011-12 (Apr-Mar) = 88 Innovation and Skills who the end-user is of the goods (42 Formal, 46 informal) licensed for export in the fourth quarter of 2011 to Bahrain and described as equipment employing Letter from John Hirst, dated 22 May 2012: cryptography and cryptographic software. [111345] I am replying on behalf of the Met Office to your Parliamentary Question tabled on 17 May 2012, UIN 108940 to the Secretary of Mr Prisk: All export licence applications for strategic State for Business, Innovation and Skills. goods are assessed on a case-by-case basis by the Export The Met Office encourages and records a considerable amount Control Organisation within this Department against of feedback from the public ranging from helpful comments the Consolidated EU and National Arms Export Licensing about how we could improve our services to genuine complaints. Criteria. A licence will not be issued where to do so We also monitor feedback of various kinds through the press and other media, such as followers on twitter, including some on would contravene the criteria. forecasts not actually made The publicly available information on licensing decisions by the Met Office. published in the annual and quarterly reports on strategic All feedback is evaluated and where possible responded to. It is export controls, available to view at difficult to be precise about the number of genuine complaints https://www.exportcontroldb.bis.gov.uk/eng/fox made, without going back and analysing all feedback received. does not include information on specific end-users. This However, in 2010-11 and 2011-12 we recorded a total of 2,882 is because in principle the disclosure of such information and 3,550 items of feedback respectively. would threaten to contravene expectations of confidentiality I hope this helps. and the protection of commercial interests in the licensing Letter from Annette Davies-Govett, dated 21 May process. With that in mind, I am however prepared to 2012: inform you in this case that the stated end-users were a I write on behalf of Land Registry in response to your commercial airline and a provider of public mobile Parliamentary Question 108940 tabled on 17 May 2012 which telephony services. asked the following: To ask the Secretary of State, Department for Business, Innovation Manpower and Skills, how many complaints about the work of his Department and each of its agencies and non-departmental public bodies were Mr Bone: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, received in {a) 2010-11 and (b) 2011-12; and if he will make a Innovation and Skills how many people employed by statement. his Department are based in London. [111339] The information regarding the number of complaints received by Land Registry during the specified periods is set out below. For comparative purposes the total number of applications received Norman Lamb: The following table shows how many during each period has also been included. As you can see, the people employed by the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills (BIS) are based in London. Figures number of complaints received represents significantly less than 1% of applications received overall. include all staff on BIS payroll as at 30 May 2012.

Volume of Number applications Year Complaints received (million) BIS London based staff (without UKTI) 2,008 BIS London based staff (including UKTI) 2,474 2010-11 3,217 20.5 2011-12 2,193 23.3 Manufacturing Industries: Training I hope that you find this information useful. Mr Evennett: To ask the Secretary of State for Conditions of Employment Business, Innovation and Skills what recent steps his Department has taken to improve manufacturing skills in London through (a) apprenticeships and (b) higher Mr Umunna: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, education courses. [111525] Innovation and Skills what meetings (a) he and (b) Ministers in his Department had with Adrian Beecroft Mr Hayes: Manufacturing skills are high on this as part of his review into employment law. [110732] Department’s agenda. On apprenticeships, final data for the 2010/11 academic year shows that there were Norman Lamb: The Secretary of State for Business, 2,330 apprenticeship starts in London in the engineering Innovation and Skills, my right hon. Friend the Member and manufacturing technologies sector subject area, up for Twickenham (Vince Cable), has not met Adrian by 45.1% on 2009/10. The National Apprenticeship Beecroft. Service is working with employers to further promote The Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change, and prioritise expansion in this sector, and in London my right hon. Friend the Member for Kingston and overall. Surbiton (Mr Davey), met Adrian Beecroft on 20 July On higher education courses, universities are autonomous 2011 in his role as the then Minister for Employment bodies and make their own decisions about the courses Relations, Consumer and Postal Affairs in advance of they provide to meet the changing needs of their students. writing to him on 29 July 2011 to commission the We do not hold specific data on manufacturing skills in report. My right hon. Friend also attended another London. We have asked the Higher Education Funding meeting with Mr Beecroft on 11 October 2011. Council for England to continue to prioritise strategically 593W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 594W important subjects such as engineering and manufacturing Challenge. These initiatives identified a number of barriers and vulnerable subjects (SIVS) when allocating the to successful retail performance and growth, which the teaching grant. Government is addressing. New Businesses As a result the Government has committed to extending small business rate relief and announced that 160 regulations Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, impacting on retailers or their customers will be scrapped Innovation and Skills how his Department (a) monitors or simplified. We are also conducting a review of and (b) regulates the support from (A) the Business employment law. Enterprise Fund and (B) other publicly-funded In March, the Government’s formal response to the organisations for start-up businesses in England. recommendations made by Mary Portas in her report, [110797] “An Independent Review into the Future of our High Streets”, was published by the Department for Communities Mr Prisk: The information is as follows: and Local Government. (a) The Business Enterprise Fund (BEF) is: (a) monitored in its use of the Enterprise Finance Guarantee Following a competition launched by the Minister through oversight by Capital for Enterprise Ltd (CfEL) for Housing and Local Government, my right hon. (which includes audit and enhanced audit); (b) regulated Friend the Member for Welwyn Hatfield (Grant Shapps), by the Companies Act as a company limited by guarantee 12 towns across the country have now been selected as (as Bradford Enterprise Agency Ltd). BEF is also signed ’Portas Pilots’, benefiting from a share of £1 million to up to the Community Development Finance Association help turn around their high streets and road-test the (CDFA) Code of Practice a voluntary code used by the collaborative, local ‘Town Team’ approach recommended Community Development Finance Institution (CDFI) by Mary Portas. sector. (b) Other CDFIs are: (a) monitored by CfEL in Students: Loans relation to their use of the Enterprise Finance Guarantee or any funding agreements which were previously held Mr Marsden: To ask the Secretary of State for with a Regional Development Agency (b) regulated by Business, Innovation and Skills what assessment he has the legislation which is relevant to their structure. The made of the potential effects on education provision vast majority are signed up to the CDFA Code of for people aged 16 to 24 of the introduction of 24+ Practice. The Government’s new Start Up loans scheme Advanced Learning Loans. [111792] will also be monitored by CfEL. Overseas Trade: Gabon Mr Hayes: The introduction of 24+ Advanced Learning Loans will not affect the funding available for Further Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Secretary of State for Education for those aged under 24, or for adults of any Business, Innovation and Skills whether he plans to post age accessing provision at Level 2 or below. Government UK Trade and Industry staff to Libreville in Gabon; grant funding for Further Education is being focused and what proposals he has to support companies and on young people, those with low skills and those seeking organisations that wish to do business in Gabon. work. [110893] Mr Marsden: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Prisk: UK Trade and Investment (UKTI) has no Business, Innovation and Skills what assessment he has plans to post staff in Gabon. We have recently reviewed made of the potential effects on the public finances of UKTI’s presence across the globe in order to ensure we the introduction of 24+ advanced learning loans in (a) have the appropriate coverage within existing resources. 2013-14 and (b) 2014-15. [111795] In that review we concluded not to extend services in Gabon. UK Trade and Investment has staff in 96 Mr Hayes: The Department for Business, Innovation markets which account for 98% of world GDP. Gabon and Skills will publish a Regulatory Impact Assessment is covered by the British high commission in Cameroon. of 24+ Advanced Learning Loans following clearance Political support from the Head of Mission in Yaoundé by the Regulatory Reform Cabinet Committee. This in respect of lobbying for a particular contract or will include an assessment of the costs and benefits of business with interests in Gabon is available. UKTI also introducing loans. provides very basic information on Gabon and other markets in which we do not have personnel via the relevant country pages of the UKTI website. Support Summertime for UK-based companies interested in Gabon is also available from private sector business multipliers. Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Secretary of State for Retail Trade Business, Innovation and Skills what progress he has made in conducting his proposed study to review the Mr Buckland: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, scope, quality and robustness of the available evidence Innovation and Skills what steps his Department is on changing the clocks by one hour. [111504] taking to help support the retail sector. [111489] Norman Lamb: David Simmonds Consultancy have Mr Prisk: The Government is actively working to carried out their initial research on this study and are help all retailers. Retail is vitally important to local and now seeking information from relevant Government national economies. This was why it was chosen to be Departments and interested parties. All information one of the first sectors to be the subject of a growth will be collated in a report which is expected to be with review, and was the first theme chosen for the Red Tape the Department in July 2012. 595W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 596W

COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT http://www.communities.gov.uk/housing/housingresearch/ housingstatistics/housingstatisticsby/stockincludingvacants/ Conferences livetables/ The number of long term empty homes is down by just over 21,500 since 2010, the biggest year on year Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for decrease since 2004. Communities and Local Government how much was spent by (a) his Department and (b) the Homes and Communities Agency on accreditation for conferences First Time Buyers in 2011. [110389] Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for Robert Neill: Neither the Department for Communities Communities and Local Government how many first-time and Local Government nor the Homes and Communities buyers have (a) registered an interest in, (b) applied for Agency routinely identify accreditation costs, for either and (c) bought on the Government’s FirstBuy scheme. attending external conferences or in running any ourselves. [110402]

Debts Written Off Grant Shapps: The Homes and Communities Agency, via its network of local HomeBuy agents, responds to Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for around 11,000 inquiries a month regarding FirstBuy Communities and Local Government how much bad and shared ownership. Over 8,000 applications have debt was written off by his Department in (a) 2010-11 been received for the FirstBuy scheme with over 6,000 and (b) 2011-12; and if he will make a statement. reservations being placed by eligible applicants. [110221] The FirstBuy prospectus was published by the Homes and Communities Agency in April 2011 and allocations Robert Neill: The amount written off by the Department were announced in June following the bidding competition. for 2010-11 is contained within the published annual The contracts were signed over the summer, with the report and accounts. first homes being available for sale from September http://www.communities.gov.uk/corporate/about/howwework/ 2011. corporatereports/reportsaccounts/annualreports/# Official statistics published by the Homes and The Department’s 2011-12 accounts have yet to be Communities Agency on 12 June show that there were finalised and will be published in due course. 2,994 sales to the end of March 2012, illustrating how The vast majority of the Department’s programme the scheme is on course and on target. bad debt write-offs relate to the European regional development fund 2000-06 scheme that the Government Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for has inherited from the last Administration. Communities and Local Government how many lenders are participating in the Government’s FirstBuy scheme. [110403] Disclosure of Information Grant Shapps: There are currently 21 lenders offering Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for mortgages on FirstBuy, ensuring coverage of 69% of Communities and Local Government how much his the mortgage market. The Homes and Communities Department spent on the updating of published data in Agency are also in discussions with a number of small line with the Government’s transparency agenda in lenders about participating. each month since September 2011. [110713] Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for Robert Neill: The Department has not spent any Communities and Local Government how many loans money on external goods and services in relation to from the Government’s FirstBuy scheme have been publishing information online since September 2011. repaid on resale of the property with the Government’s Online publication, together with strengthened financial share being reinvested in more affordable housing. controls, has helped save taxpayers’ money, as illustrated [110404] by the three-quarters reduction in Government Procurement Card expenditure since we published every item of Grant Shapps: The FirstBuy scheme will help around spending online. 10,500 first time buyers by March 2013. House builders have reported over 6,000 reservations since the scheme Empty Property opened in September 2011. There have been no FirstBuy equity loan redemptions Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for since the scheme opened in September 2011 but we Communities and Local Government how many (a) would not expect there to be at this stage. Under the empty homes and (b) homes which had been empty for terms of the scheme the Government will benefit from more than six months there were in each region in each any equity uplift in the value of the property and any of the last five years. [110410] receipts will be reinvested to deliver more affordable homes. Andrew Stunell: Data on empty homes can be found As a comparison, there have only been 157 redemptions in the Department for Communities and Local Government (105 as a result of full sales and 52 as a result of either live tables on dwelling stock. Live table 615 shows partial or full “staircasing”) under the previous empty homes by Government region for all vacant and Administration’s HomeBuy Direct scheme which was long-term vacant homes: launched in September 2008. 597W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 598W

Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government how many Communities and Local Government whether he has households in each parliamentary constituency have made an estimate of the average deposit required of a participated in the FirstBuy scheme to date. [110419] first-time buyer. [110441]

Grant Shapps: The FirstBuy equity loan scheme will Grant Shapps: The Council of Mortgage Lenders help an estimated 10,500 aspiring home owners in England estimates that the average first time buyer deposit is by March 2013. over £26,000, based on the median advance and the median percentage advance for homes purchased by The FirstBuy prospectus was published by the Homes first time buyers in 2011. and Communities Agency in April 2011 and allocations were announced in June following the bidding competition. We recognise the particular challenges faced by first The contracts were signed over the summer, with the time buyers and are providing a range of options intended first homes being available for sale from September to help them and others into home ownership. These 2011. include: the NewBuy Guarantee scheme, which provides prospective Official statistics published by the Homes and buyers with access to higher loan to value mortgages on new Communities Agency on 12 June show that there were build properties; 2,994 sales to the end of March 2012, illustrating how FirstBuy, that helps first time buyers who are struggling to get the scheme is on course and on target. onto the property ladder due to the need for larger deposits and, Housebuilders have found significant interest from Extending the Right to Buy discounts to give more tenants the first time buyers, reporting so far over 8,000 applications, chance to own their home. and over 6,000 reservations by eligible applicants. Through our measures many more first time buyers We do not hold data on sales at constituency level. are able to buy their own home, with mortgage interest payments for new borrowers at their lowest levels for 14 years. And mortgages for first time buyers are much Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for more affordable, with first time buyers spending just Communities and Local Government if he will estimate 12.5% on mortgages compared to 19.6% spent in 2008. the average age of an unassisted first-time buyer in England. [110423] Homelessness Grant Shapps: There are a number of different measures Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for by different commentators. The Council of Mortgage Communities and Local Government whether he plans Lenders’ most recent estimate of the average age of to introduce a national telephone helpline for No unassisted first time buyers can be found through this Second Night Out nationwide. [110429] link: http://www.cml.org.uk/cml/publications/newsandviews/104/ Grant Shapps: On 15 December 2011 I announced 390 my intention to ensure that a national ’No Second We recognise the particular challenges faced by first Night Out’ telephone line would be in place by Christmas time buyers and are providing a range of options intended 2012. to help them and others into home ownership. These The reporting line will be, for the first time, a single include: national line covering England with an objective of the NewBuy Guarantee Scheme, which provides prospective improving systems for dealing with rough sleeping. It buyers with access to higher loan to value mortgages on new will contribute to tackling rough sleeping and single build properties; homelessness through identification, accountability and FirstBuy, that helps first time buyers who are struggling to get challenge to local authorities and their partners in onto the property ladder due to the need for larger deposits; and addressing rough sleeping. Members of the public will Extending the Right to Buy discount to give more tenants the be equipped to bring rough sleepers to the attention of chance to own their home. an appropriate authority, to be empowered to understand Through our measures many more first time buyers the local response mechanisms and to receive timely are able to buy their own home, with mortgage interest feedback on action taken and the outcome of their payments for new borrowers at their lowest levels for 14 report. years. And mortgages for first time buyers are much more affordable, with first time buyers spending just Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for 12.5% on mortgages compared to 19.6% spent in 2008. Communities and Local Government whether the ministerial working group on homelessness has discussed the rise in homelessness and rough sleeping since May Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for 2010. [110461] Communities and Local Government how much his Department has spent on promotional material for the Grant Shapps: Homelessness is half the average rate Government’s NewBuy Guarantee scheme. [110433] that it was under the previous administration and remains lower than in 28 of the last 30 years. Grant Shapps: The Department for Communities and The coalition Government is committed to tackling Local Government, and Government as a whole, has homelessness. We are investing £400 million in homelessness spent nothing on promotional material supporting the prevention over four years (2011-12 to 2014-15). On top industry-led NewBuy Guarantee scheme. NewBuy is of that we provided an additional £70 million last year being promoted by house builders and mortgage lenders. to help local agencies prevent and tackle homelessness. 599W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 600W

The aim of the working group is to prevent and been announced and final decisions are expected shortly. tackle homelessness and improve the lives of those who Details of the short/reserved lists, as at the end of May, do become homeless. By bringing the relevant Government can be found on the following website: Departments together, we are addressing the multi-faceted http://www.homesandcommunities.co.uk/get-britain-building issues that contribute to homelessness. Details of Decent Homes and Large Scale Voluntary Transfer gap funding can be found at the following link: Housing http://www.homesandcommunities.co.uk/ourwork/existing- stock Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for For the Homes and Communities Agency land-based Communities and Local Government what capital projects delivery programme, for the Property and Regeneration the Homes and Communities Agency will have in (a) sub-programme, I am placing a copy of this information 2012-13, (b) 2013-14 and (c) 2014-15; and what he in the Library of the House. For the Economic Assets proposes the budget for each will be in each such year. sub-programme (for sites which transferred to the Homes [110381] and Communities Agency from the former regional development agencies in 2011) the assessment process is Grant Shapps: Ministers set the overall strategic vision still ongoing and no decisions have yet been made on for the Homes and Communities Agency and its role planned or indicative allocations. and activities, and its operating and financial framework, and agree its overall budgets and delivery programmes For the Kickstart and Accelerated Land Delivery at a high level through approving its corporate plan programmes, I am also placing a copy of this information each year. Translating high level delivery programmes in the Library of the House. into individual capital projects, and determining the Housing Benefit annual budget for each individual project, is largely an operational issue for the Homes and Communities Agency. Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for The agency has published extensive information on Communities and Local Government what estimate he its planned capital allocations for 2012-13 to 2014-15, has made of the increase to the housing benefit bill as a across most of its programmes, on its public website. result of the Government’s Affordable Rent model. These are [110437] planned allocations which can be subject to change. Information for the following programmes may be Grant Shapps: The impact on housing benefit of the found at the following web addresses. In most cases the affordable rent model was assessed in the “Impact information is displayed by area and reflects differing Assessment for Affordable Rent”, available on the periods over the spending review period rather than Department’s website: being on the basis of on an annual profile. Where http://www.communities.gov.uk/publications/housing/ annual profiles are provided future years (2013-14, and rentimpactassessment 2014-15) are indicative and maybe subject to change. Under the new Affordable Homes programme 2011-15, Affordable Homes Programme allocations published: offers exceeded expectations, meaning we now expect to http://www.homesandcommunities.co.uk/affordable-homes provide up to 170,000 affordable homes, including Planned allocations for 2012-15 made during 2008-11 commitments, by 2015, compared with the 150,000 under the former National Affordable Housing Programme originally estimated - for no more capital grant. The were published at the time. major innovation of the Affordable Homes programme was the introduction of Affordable Rent. This allows Homelessness Change Programme allocations published: housing providers to lever in a greater proportion of http://www.homesandcommunities.co.uk/sites/default/files/ private finance by increasing rents to up to 80% of the our-work/homelessness-change-programme-allocations- market level, meaning that more people are able to 191011.csv benefit from a sub market rent for every pound of and taxpayers’ capital investment. Around £19.5 billion is http://www.homesandcommunities.co.uk/sites/default/files/ being invested in much needed affordable housing. The homelessness_change_additional_allocations_to_2015.csv Government is investing £4.5 billion to deliver up to Traveller Pitch Funding allocations published: 170,000 new affordable homes from 2011-15 and the http://www.homesandcommunities.co.uk/sites/default/files/ total funding contributed by providers to deliver these our-work/tpf_allocations_january2012.csv properties is around £15 billion. Empty Homes allocations published: Because we have been able to provide more homes http://www.homesandcommunities.co.uk/sites/default/files/ with the original budget than we anticipated at the time our-work/eh-2012-15-providers.csv of the original impact assessment, there will be some Clusters of empty homes was announced on 29 May, further impact on the housing benefit bill. DCLG therefore a breakdown is available on the at the following website: agreed to cover the anticipated £56 million increase in housing benefit costs associated with this increase. http://www.homesandcommunities.co.uk/ourwork/clusters-of- empty-homes Housing: Construction FirstBuy and Mortgage Rescue are not organised on a capital projects basis. Further these are demand led Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for programmes and therefore allocations are not provided Communities and Local Government (1) how many in advance of applications by individuals. homes were built on public sector land released for The assessment process for Get Britain Building house building (a) between May 1997 and April 2010 continues, but shortlisted and reserve schemes have and (b) since May 2010; [110394] 601W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 602W

(2) how many hectares of public sector land were spending review period. We are also working with smaller released for house building (a) between May 1997 and public landholders to maximise the release of their April 2010 and (b) since May 2010. [110395] surplus land for housing.

Grant Shapps: Information about the number of homes Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for built and hectares of land released for house building Communities and Local Government (1) how many between May 1997 and April 2010 is not held centrally. bids have been received for the Government’s Build Now, Pay Later scheme; and how many have been As part of this Government’s public land programme, successful; [110399] and for the first time, major land holding Government (2) how many hectares of public sector land have Departments have published disposal strategies, setting been released under the Government’s Build Now, Pay out their plans to bring forward land for development Later scheme since May 2010; and how many homes and deliver growth. We have also put in place mechanisms have been built as a result. [110400] to, monitor delivery of the programme, including scrutiny by Cabinet Committee. I refer the hon. Member to the Grant Shapps: Build Now, Pay Later is not a scheme report published on 7 May 2012, ‘Accelerating the release that we are seeking bids for. To get development moving of surplus public sector land—progress report one year and new homes built Departments have committed to on’, which says more about progress to date. As the release as much land as possible on Build Now, Pay programme goes forward we will continue to report on Later terms, where there is market demand and where it progress. represents value for money and is affordable. More detail including examples of where it has already been Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for used are set out in ‘Accelerating the release of surplus Communities and Local Government (1) with reference public sector land-progress report one year on’ (May to the Housing Minister’s announcement of February 2012), which is available in the Library of the House. 2011 of Government plans to accelerate the release of public sector land to deliver up to 100,000 homes, (a) Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for how many hectares of land have been released, (b) Communities and Local Government pursuant to the what the estimate is of the number of homes that could answer of 17 May 2012, Official Report, column 246W, be built on that land and (c) how many homes have on housing: construction, whether the figures of been built on land so released; [110397] £100,000 and £150,000 accorded to the National Self (2) how many jobs have been supported as a result of Build Association include the site cost. [110408] the Government’s plans to accelerate the release of public land; [110398] Grant Shapps: The figures were drawn from the National Self Build Association report ‘An Action Plan to promote (3) how many hectares of land have been identified the growth of self build housing’, which states that in each region under his Department’s Public Land “the vast majority of self builders spend between £100,000 and [110422] Initiative; £150,000 on the construction of their home (plus the site cost).” (4) which Government Departments (a) have and For example, Fairgrove Homes are currently selling (b) have not published their land disposal strategies. plots in Nottinghamshire to self builders for £40,000 [110396] and will build a good sized three bed home for a further £90,000. And at Ashley Vale in Bristol the community Grant Shapps: I refer the hon. Member to the report built their homes for less than £150,000 each, including published on 7 May 2012, ‘Accelerating the release of land and all building costs. surplus public sector land—progress report one year on’. This describes the progress we have made in the Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for past year to accelerate the release of surplus public land Communities and Local Government what the average and is available in the Library of the House. density of new dwellings was in each (a) region and (b) local authority area in each year since 2010. As the report sets out we have identified land with [110436] capacity for around 102,430 homes, which amounts to the release of over 7,700 ha of public land across the Andrew Stunell: Information on the average density country. The release of this land over the spending of new dwellings in each Government region for 2010 and review period could support as many as 25,000 jobs. in each local authority for 2007-10, the latest information Sites will be released to the market over the spending available, can be found in Tables P231 and P232 of the review period. Release dates will vary, in part due to the Department’s Land Use Change Statistics at type of site and what preparatory works are needed to http://www.communities.gov.uk/planningandbuilding/ make it ready for sale. Development will then be subject planningbuilding/planningstatistics/livetables/landusechange/ to the local planning process and local authorities will The density of new housing at local authority level is want to work with local people and developers to meet only published as multi-year averages as it can be highly housing needs. volatile at more frequent intervals. The Homes and Communities Agency and four major landholding Government Departments—Defence, Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport, Health and Environment, and Environment, Communities and Local Government how many new Food and Rural Affairs—have published their land (a) affordable homes and (b) homes for social rent release strategies, setting out details of their land with were built in each (i) region and (ii) local authority area capacity for housing that they intend to release over this in each year since 1997. [110439] 603W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 604W

Andrew Stunell: Estimates of the number of affordable Deal for Older People’s Housing. However, senior officials and social rented homes delivered in each local authority within the Department’s Homelessness and Support area are published on the Department’s website at: Division regularly meet with housing and care providers http://www.communities.gov.uk/housing/housingresearch/ to discuss older people’s housing. housingstatistics/housingstatisticsby/ The industry-led guidance on housing for older people affordablehousingsupply/livetables/ is not for Government to publish. We understand from New affordable housing can be delivered through the industry group developing the guidance that they new build and acquisitions, although the majority (88%) plan to publish it this summer. of the additional supply in 2010-11 was through new build. Local Government Services

Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for : To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government (1) what assessment Communities and Local Government what steps he is he has made of the number of jobs supported to date in taking to support council staff who want to make construction and related industries by increasing demand in-house bids under the community right to challenge for newly-built homes as a result of his Department’s draft statutory guidance. [111050] NewBuy scheme; [110443] (2) what assessment he has made of the likely future Andrew Stunell: The Localism Act 2011 lists the increase in housing supply in the future as a result of following as relevant bodies—those eligible to submit the Government’s NewBuy Guarantee Scheme. [110448] an expression of interest to run services on behalf of a relevant authority: Grant Shapps: The Government are committed to (a) a voluntary or community body; reviewing the NewBuy Guarantee scheme in 2014. This (b) a body of persons or a trust which is established for review will include an assessment of the number of charitable purposes only; additional homes built and jobs supported by the scheme. (c) in relation to a relevant authority, two or more employees of The Home Builders Federation has estimated that at that authority; or least 25,000 additional new homes will be built in total (d) such other person or body as may be specified by the as a direct result of NewBuy. This number of new Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government, the homes would support up to 50,000 additional jobs. right hon. Member for Brentwood and Ongar (Mr Pickles), by regulations. Housing: Older People Draft statutory guidance gives further explanation of provisions in the Localism Act and associated regulations. It does not alter provisions in the Act which set out the Heidi Alexander: To ask the Secretary of State for circumstances in which employees may take advantage Communities and Local Government (1) when the of the right. industry-led guidance on housing for older people will be published; [110877] There has been some confusion as to the intention of paragraph 9.5 of the draft statutory guidance. For the (2) what discussions he has had with housing and avoidance of doubt, we intend to remove this paragraph care providers to deliver the New Deal for Older when the final version is published on commencement People’s Housing; [110878] of the legislation. (3) what recent steps he has taken to implement the New Deal for Older People’s Housing. [110879] Hilary Benn: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government what assessment Grant Shapps: Since the publication of the New Deal he has made of the compatibility of draft statutory for Older People’s Housing in the Housing Strategy guidance on the community right to challenge with the (November 2011), the Department has published the duty of best value. [111051] Lifetime Neighbourhoods report (December 2011) to share good practice and enable local partners to create Andrew Stunell: The purpose of the draft statutory age-friendly, inclusive neighbourhoods. The Department guidance on the community right to challenge is simply also published the national evaluation of the handyperson to provide further explanation of provisions in the programme in January 2012. In addition, FirstStop has Localism Act 2011 and associated regulations. It does published several independent reports funded by the not seek to change any aspect of the duty of best value, Department: the evaluation of FirstStop by Cambridge and it is acknowledged in section 6 of the guidance that university, value for money case studies of two local authorities will need to comply with this duty. FirstStop partner services, and helping older people There has been some confusion as to the intention of choose the right home for them: an introduction to the paragraph 9.5 of the draft statutory guidance. For the costs and benefits of providing advice and support. avoidance of doubt, we intend to remove this paragraph The National Planning Policy Framework, published when the final version is published on commencement in March 2012, sets out that local planning authorities of the legislation. should plan for a mix of housing based on current and future demographic trends, market trends and the needs Local Government: Assets of different groups in the community, such as older people. Hilary Benn: To ask the Secretary of State for Ministers from the Department for Communities Communities and Local Government when he intends and Local Government have not had any recent discussions to publish guidance for local authorities on assets of with housing and care providers to deliver the New community value. [110902] 605W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 606W

Andrew Stunell: My Department intends to publish Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for non-statutory guidance in the form of an Advice Note Communities and Local Government how many to local authorities on the assets of community value homes have been built as a result of the Government’s legislation. NewBuy Guarantee scheme. [110393] As part of the development of the regulations DCLG officials have been providing partners in the local authority Grant Shapps: The Government is committed to sector, including the Local Government Association, reviewing the NewBuy Guarantee scheme in 2014. This with a series of update notes to help them prepare for review will include Government’s assessment of the the commencement of the new scheme. number of additional homes built as a result of the The notes have given the sector practical information scheme. on what the regulations will include and given them an The Home Builders Federation estimates there will opportunity to ask questions around implementation be at least 25,000 additional new homes built as a direct issues. We issued a substantive version of the note to the result of NewBuy. sector on 21 April, and are taking into account their feedback which will be reflected in the final version. Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for We intend to publish the Advice Note prior to the Communities and Local Government how many (a) Statutory Instruments commencing as a way of helping lenders and (b) housebuilders have signed up to the local authorities prepare for implementation of the Government’s NewBuy scheme; how many are not scheme. members of the Home Builders Federation; and what targets have been set for the number to sign up by the end of 2012. [110444] Mortgages: Government Assistance Grant Shapps: As of 13 June 2012 five lenders (Barclays, Halifax, Nationwide, NatWest and Santander) and 13 Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for builders (Barratt, Bellway, Berkeley, Bloor, Bovis, CALA, Communities and Local Government (1) how many Crest Nicholson, Fairview, Linden, Morris, Persimmon, people have been rejected for loans provided through Redrow, and Taylor Wimpey) were operational—which the Government’s NewBuy Guarantee scheme; [110390] is to say able to conduct business transactions—under (2) how many people have applied for loans provided the NewBuy Guarantee scheme, ensuring coverage of through the Government’s NewBuy Guarantee 73% of the mortgage market. One of those builders is Scheme; [110450] not a member of the Home Builders Federation. (3) how many people have been accepted for loans No targets have been set regarding the number of provided through the Government’s NewBuy builders participating in the scheme, though Government Guarantee Scheme; [110451] is working with partners to promote take-up. (4) how many people have been rejected for loans provided through the Government’s NewBuy Guarantee Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for Scheme. [110452] Communities and Local Government what the average percentage deposit is for mortgages offered under the Grant Shapps: The Government will collect data on Government’s NewBuy Guarantee Scheme. [110446] offers and completions under the NewBuy Guarantee scheme as these will define the extent of its liability. The Grant Shapps: All mortgages eligible under the NewBuy Government will not be collecting data on applications Guarantee scheme will require a deposit of between 5% for loans. and 10%. Government’s assessment of the average percentage Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for deposit under the scheme will be included in its review Communities and Local Government (1) what checks after two years. are in place to ensure that a property purchased through the Government’s NewBuy Guarantee scheme Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for is the applicant’s main home and not a second home or Communities and Local Government what assessment buy-to-let investment; [110391] his Department has made of the potential financial (2) what checks are in place to ensure that successful risk to the Exchequer of the security provided by applicants to the Government’s NewBuy Guarantee Government to loans provided under its NewBuy scheme are UK citizens, or have indefinite leave to Guarantee scheme. [110447] remain in the UK. [110392] Grant Shapps: I refer the hon. Member to the financial Grant Shapps: Those accessing mortgages under the minute which was laid before the House on 19 March, NewBuy Guarantee scheme are required to confirm to which explains the arrangements in detail. the mortgage lender at point of application: that the property being purchased is the applicant’s main home Private Rented Housing and not a second home or a buy-to-let investment; and either that they are a UK citizen or that they have indefinite Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for leave to remain in the UK. Communities and Local Government what plans his It is a legal requirement for applicants to provide Department has to improve protections for tenants in lenders with this information honestly and accurately. the private rented sector. [110462] 607W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 608W

Andrew Stunell: The current legislative framework JUSTICE already provides strong protections for tenants in the private rented sector while ensuring that the burdens on Alcoholic Drinks: Misuse landlords are not such as to inhibit much needed growth in supply. Local authorities have extensive powers to John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for take action against landlords letting poor quality or Justice (1) what steps will be taken to assess offenders’ badly managed properties through the Housing Act alcohol problems and addictions prior to the 2004. We are encouraging local authorities to make introduction of compulsory sobriety schemes; [111638] more effective use of their existing powers to tackle criminal landlords, as outlined in my Department’s (2) what guidance will be given to courts in cases of press notice of 30 April 2012 on ″beds in sheds″. offences where the offender has significant alcohol addiction problems when imposing a sentence of The Housing Act 2004 also provides for protection of compulsory sobriety. [111639] tenants’ deposits. In common with all businesses, landlords, and their agents, are also subject to consumer protection Mr Blunt: The new alcohol abstinence and monitoring legislation and health and safety regulations. Finally, requirement for community orders imposed under the the Housing Act 1988 endorsed well established protections Criminal Justice Act 2003 was introduced by the Legal against unlawful eviction and excessive rents. The Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of Offenders Act 2012. Government do not have plans to add to this range of The provisions of the 2012 Act make clear that a court protections. can only impose an alcohol abstinence requirement if it is satisfied that the offender is not dependent on alcohol. Right to Buy Scheme Children: Maintenance Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government how much his Department has spent on promotional material for the Cathy Jamieson: To ask the Secretary of State for Right to Buy scheme since May 2010. [110432] Justice what steps he is taking to ensure that HM Courts and Tribunal Service hears appeals relating to Grant Shapps: I am committed to ensuring tenants the Child Support Agency as quickly as possible. have full information about the Right to Buy so they [111579] can make an informed decision as to whether it is the right choice for them, especially since the reinvigoration Mr Djanogly: Appeals against decisions relating to of Right to Buy in April 2012 increased the maximum the Child Support Agency are heard by the First-tier discount to £75,000. Tribunal—Social Security and Child Support (SSCS). Since May 2010 we have spent £106,761.96, excluding In order to ensure equal access to justice for appellants VAT, on materials to inform eligible tenants about their across the range of appeals heard by the Tribunal, a rights to the right to buy scheme. These include Right to ‘first in, first out’ policy operates across all appeals to Buy application forms and booklets for tenants, posters ensure that the oldest cases are listed first. and other materials for local authorities to use to inform Her Majesty’s Courts and Tribunals Service (HMCTS) tenants about the new discounts, and advertisements in is working hard to increase the capacity of the SSCS social housing newsletters about the changes. It also Tribunal and reduce waiting times. It has implemented includes the new Right to Buy page on Facebook and a range of measures which include recruiting more Google adwords directing tenants to the Direct.Gov judges and medical panel members; increasing content on Right to Buy which has been viewed around administrative resources; securing additional hearing 170,000 times and from which the Right to Buy booklet venues; increasing the number of cases listed in each and forms have been downloaded several thousand Tribunal session; running double shifts in its largest times. processing centre; running Saturday sittings in some of To place this targeted spending in context, the the busiest venues; and setting up a customer contact Department under the last Administration spent £6.3 centre to deal with telephone inquiries. million just on TV,radio and press advertising in 2008-09 All of this is having a positive effect. The total and £4.4 million in 2009-10. number of disposals has increased significantly from 279,000 in 2009-10 to 380.000 in 2010-11 and the tribunal Sports: Clubs expects to dispose of around 435,000 appeals in 2011-12, with the capacity for half a million disposals in 2012-13. Hilary Benn: To ask the Secretary of State for Disposals outstripped receipts for the 12 months between Communities and Local Government whether sport January 2011 and December 2011, and the number of club supporters’ groups will be eligible for funding cases waiting to be heard reduced by over 44,000 between April and December 2011. The average waiting time has from the right to bid fund. [110901] stabilised nationally, and is beginning to fall across Andrew Stunell: It is our intention for the Community many venues. Right to Bid to support the continuing use of recreational and sport facilities, and to empower local voluntary and Claims Management Services community groups. We are in the process of agreeing the eligibility criteria for community groups wishing to Mr Weir: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice if access funding to use the Right to Bid. Further details he will consider introducing proposals to bring claims will be available when the support programme is launched management firms within the remit of the statutory later this year. Legal Ombudsman. [109670] 609W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 610W

Mr Djanogly: The Legal Ombudsman is currently Contempt of Court: Sentencing preparing a business case proposing that consumer/client complaints about claims management companies should Gloria De Piero: To ask the Secretary of State for fall within its remit. Upon receipt of that business case, Justice (1) how many people have received custodial I will consider whether or not the provisions in the sentences after being found guilty of contempt of court Legal Services Act 2007 to extend that Act’s complaints in (a) magistrates courts and (b) Crown courts in the handling regime to claims management companies should latest period for which figures are available; [109990] be commenced. (2) how many people have been convicted of Closed Material Procedures contempt of court in the last five years; [111072] (3) how many people have been prosecuted for : To ask the Secretary of State for Justice contempt of court in the last five years. [111073] which government department made the decision to use a closed material procedure on each occasion on Mr Blunt: The number of defendants found guilty which that procedure has been used in each of the last and committed to immediate custody under sections 8 10 years. [111063] and 14 of the Contempt of Court Act 1981 at the Crown court in England and Wales, from 2007 to 2011 Mr Kenneth Clarke: Closed Material Procedures (CMPs) (latest available) can be viewed in the following table. are available in a number of different contexts, including A finding of guilt for contempt of court may result 14 different contexts in legislation referred to in written from an incident occurring during an ongoing trial for evidence to the Joint Committee on Human Rights on another offence. Data available from the Crown court the Justice and Security Green Paper (and published by on convictions and committals to custody for contempt that Committee). How CMPs are initiated depends on of court given in the table are on a principal offence the type of proceedings concerned, and it is not always the basis. This is where the heaviest penalty that was imposed decision of the Department. In some cases, such as the was for contempt of court. Special Immigration Appeals Commission (SIAC), Information about contempt of court at the magistrates the decision to refer a case to a closed procedure lies courts is included in a miscellaneous group of offences with the Secretary of State (in the case of SIAC, the that cannot be separately analysed. Home Secretary). In other cases, such as TPIM proceedings, CMPs are automatically available. In contexts such as Number of defendants found guilty and committed to custody at the Crown court under sections 8 and 14 of the Contempt of Court Act Employment Tribunal proceedings the relevant Secretary 1981, England and Wales, 2007 to 20111,2 of State applies to the court. In other cases, including Found guilty Immediate custody some Norwich Pharmacal claims and some judicial reviews, there is no provision for CMPs in legislation, 2007 11 5 but CMPs have been held either at the order of the 2008 10 8 court (though that is no longer possible in civil damages 2009 29 12 cases following the Supreme Court judgment in Al Rawi 2010 37 19 and Others in July 2011), or with the consent of parties 2011 39 16 to proceedings. 1 The figures given in the table on court proceedings relate to persons CMPs have been used in cases involving a number of for whom these offences were the principal offences for which they Government Departments, including the Home Office, were dealt with. When a defendant has been found guilty of two or more offences it is the offence for which the heaviest penalty is the Foreign and Commonwealth Office and the Northern imposed. Where the same disposal is imposed for two or more Ireland Office. Figures are not held centrally on which offences, the offence selected is the offence for which the statutory Departments are involved in specific types of litigation, maximum penalty is the most severe. and this includes litigation involving Closed Material 2 Every effort is made to ensure that the figures presented are accurate Procedures. and complete. However, it is important to note that these data have been extracted from large administrative data systems generated by Community Orders the courts and police forces. As a consequence, care should be taken to ensure data collection processes and their inevitable limitations are taken into account when those data are used. Heidi Alexander: To ask the Secretary of State for Source: Justice what estimate he has made of the average cost Justice Statistics Analytical Services—Ministry of Justice of supervising an individual under the proposed Court Orders: Compensation intensive community punishment order. [111294] John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Blunt: ‘The Punishment and Reform: Effective Justice if he will take steps to ensure that compensation Community Sentences’ consultation proposes to develop orders are related to the disposable income of an Intensive Community Punishment Order for offenders perpetrators. [111637] who deserve a significant level of punishment, but who are better dealt with in the community to maintain ties Mr Djanogly: In cases involving death, injury, loss or with work and family. As set out in the impact assessment, damage, the courts are required to consider making a the consultation asks respondents for their views on compensation order, and to give reasons if no such how ICPO could work and MOJ will assess the impacts order is made. Magistrates courts can order compensation when the final proposal is developed. up to a maximum of £5,000 per offence but there is no The impact assessment that MOJ published alongside financial limit in the Crown court. Courts are however the consultation can be found on the following webpage: required to have regard to the financial means of the https://consult.justice.gov.uk/digital-communications/ offender when deciding whether to make a compensation effective-community-services-1 order and when deciding on its amount. 611W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 612W

In order to assess the defendant’s financial means HMCTS has achieved this by focusing on early courts will review a means form when it is supplied by compliance with financial impositions by using a number the defendant. In cases where the defendant does not of methods such as use of telephone and text message attend court or no means information has been supplied reminders to defaulters, intelligence tracing tools, increased the sentencing guidelines say the court can assume a use of enforcement sanctions like deduction from benefit relevant weekly income of £350 for the defendant and orders and attachment of earnings and targeted payment set financial penalties, including compensation orders, blitzes on specific groups of defaulters. There are a based on that amount. number of other initiatives being developed to further improve the collection of financial penalties.

Courts: Fines Financial penalties include amounts for fines, costs, prosecution costs, legal aid. victim surcharge, compensation and unpaid fixed penalties and penalty notices for : To ask the Secretary of State for disorder that are registered as fines for enforcement. Justice how many people were given court fines in each Accounts still open include fines that are being collected of the last four years; and how many of those fines by instalments, those with deductions from benefit and were paid in full. [111292] those which have been given time to pay. Table 1: Offenders sentenced to a fine 2008 to 20111 Mr Djanogly: The Ministry of Justice collects and Total publishes data on the sentence given for the principal offence each offender is charged with. Table 1 shows the 2008 890,296 number of offenders sentenced to a fine for their principal 2009 946,146 offence between 2008 and 2011, we do not collect 2010 893,931 centrally data on offenders who received a fine for a 2011 851,607 secondary offence. Prior to April 2011 HMCTS did not 1 Data taken from Criminal Justice Statistics Quarterly Update to December 2011. record, at a national level, the time taken to collect Notes: financial penalties and so cannot say how many were 1. Excludes data for Cardiff magistrates court for April, July and August 2008. paid in full prior to this date. Table 2 shows the number 2. The figures given in the table on court proceedings relate to persons for whom these offences were the principal offences for which they were dealt with. When of accounts opened since April 2011 and closed by the a defendant has been found guilty of two or more offences it is the offence for end of December 2011, the latest data available. This which the heaviest penalty is imposed. Where the same disposal is imposed for includes fines paid in full and any which have been two or more offences, the offence selected is the offence for which the statutory maximum penalty is the most severe. legally or administratively cancelled, we are unable to 3. Every effort is made to ensure that the figures presented are accurate and separate these without manually inspecting each account complete. However, it is important to note that these data have been extracted which would incur disproportionate costs. Last year from large administrative data systems generated by the courts and police forces. As a consequence, care should be taken to ensure data collection (2011) HMCTS collected £277 million in financial penalties processes and their inevitable limitations are taken into account when those compared to £251 million in 2008 and 2009, a 10% increase. data are used.

Table 2: Financial Impositions in England and Wales Accounts Opened and Total Imposed in Period (£) Total Collected in Period1 (£) Accounts Opened in Period Closed in Period2

April to December 2011 3294,000,000 3209,000,000 4964,000 4420,000 1 Total collected includes payments made against fines imposed prior to April 2011. 2 Accounts closed will include those paid in full and any legally or administratively cancelled. 3 Rounded to nearest £ million. 4 Rounded to nearest thousand.

Crimes of Violence Domestic Violence

Helen Goodman: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Sheerman: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice what assessment his Department has made of Justice how many men were reconvicted of domestic the evidence to support the hypothesis that viewing violence offences within (a) one year and (b) two years violent videos or films could have been a factor in cases of completing a domestic violence-related programme administered by the probation service in England and in the criminal justice system. [109283] Wales in each year since 2005. [110806]

Mr Vaizey [holding answer 12 June 2012]: Ihave Mr Blunt: Domestic violence is not recorded as a been asked to reply on behalf of the Department for specific offence type and as a result we are currently not Culture, Media and Sport. able to identify how many men who have completed The Government keeps abreast of the academic research domestic violence programmes administered by probation on this subject, but when viewed as a whole, there is no trusts, have been re-convicted of domestic violence related persuasive evidence of a causal link between violent offences. material in films and videos and violent behaviour in real life. Human Trafficking However, we believe it is important to ensure that children are not exposed to inappropriate material and Mr Bone: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice that is why there is a classification system in place—operated what training his Department provides to enable its by the British Board of Film Classification. staff to recognise victims of human trafficking. [111753] 613W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 614W

Mr Blunt: Prison and probation staff receive core Date (Friday) Estimated available capacity training in assessing and managing offenders’ risk of harm, in order to develop a plan to manage offenders’ 26 October 1,570 risk of harm. In developing a risk management plan, 2 November 1,605 offender managers (probation) and offender supervisors 9 November 1,605 (prisons) need to use all available information about 16 November 1,605 offenders, in order to, amongst other things, identify 23 November 1,605 individuals who might be at risk from those offenders, 30 November 1,605 including victims of human trafficking. 7 December 1,605 Offenders convicted of the most serious sexual and 14 December 1,605 violent offences fall to be managed under the statutory 21 December 1,605 Multi-Agency Public Protection Arrangements (MAPPA). 28 December 1,605 Within MAPPA, the police, probation and Prison Services are required to work together to manage the risks It is expected that all of these places will be available presented by eligible offenders. Thus, for MAPPA-managed to hold prisoners, although actual usage will depend on offenders, local police who have intelligence and information regional population pressures and the operation population that offenders are engaged in, or might be engaged in, management needs of NOMS. human trafficking, would feed such intelligence and The following table shows the number of prisoners information into risk management plans, in order to held in HMP Oakwood in each week since its opening. protect known and potential victims. Assistance is available from the UK Human Trafficking Date (Friday) HMP Oakwood’s population Centre which provides tactical advice via a 24/7 helpline 2012 and can deliver bespoke training material on request. 27 April 17 Awareness of human trafficking may be raised amongst 4May 43 prison and probation by means of training and guidance 11 May 42 produced by the Home Office. 18 May 59 25 May 93 Oakwood Prison 8 June 163

Sadiq Khan: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice These figures have been drawn from administrative (1) when he expects HMP Oakwood to reach full IT systems, which as with any large scale recording operating capacity; [111060] system, are subject to possible error with data entry and (2) how many prisoners he expects to be held in processing. HMP Oakwood in each week until December 2012; [111061] Offenders: Mental Illness (3) how many prisoners have been held in HMP Oakwood in each week since its opening. [111062] John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice what steps his Department has taken to reduce Mr Blunt: HMP Oakwood’s certified normal crime amongst offenders diagnosed as having two or accommodation is 1,605 places and it is expected to be more mental illnesses. [111641] fully operational by 2 November 2012. The forecast build up of operational capacity at HMP Oakwood is Mr Blunt: Information specific to offenders who have set out in the following table: two or more clinically diagnosed mental illnesses is not held centrally. Date (Friday) Estimated available capacity It is unlikely that most offenders with mental disorders 2012 offend primarily as a direct result of their disorder. It 15 June 221 may however be a contributory factor and may also 22 June 292 undermine an individual’s ability to engage with 29 June 363 interventions which support rehabilitation and reduce 6 July 434 reoffending. 13 July 505 We are committed to tackling the underlying physical 20 July 576 and mental health issues which some offenders have. 27 July 647 Our priority is to ensure that those with mental health 3 August 718 problems are identified as early as possible in the criminal 10 August 789 justice system, so that the right treatment can be provided 17 August 860 in the most appropriate setting. An example of this is 24 August 931 the reconfiguration of services for offenders with personality 31 August 1,002 disorder, so that disorders can be identified earlier and 7 September 1,073 more offenders offered effective treatment. 14 September 1,144 We are working closely with the Department of Health 21 September 1,215 to deliver the commitments outlined in the Mental 28 September 1,286 Health Strategy 2011 and the Breaking the Cycle Green 5 October 1,357 Paper including: 12 October 1,428 19 October 1,499 Further developing liaison and diversion services for offenders with mental health issues and other vulnerabilities in police 615W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 616W custody suites and at courts, and rolling out these services by 2014 issues relating to the extension with key stakeholders, (subject to business case approval); and including representatives of the RTA Portal Company. testing options for intensive, treatment based alternatives to I have not received any written representations on custody. these issues directly from the RTA Portal Company, In addition, provision in the Legal Aid, Sentencing other than in connection with these meetings. However, and Punishment of Offenders Act 2012 will make it I am aware of the company’s concerns about the practicality easier for courts to use the mental health treatment of implementing modifications to the RTA Portal resulting requirement as part of community orders by simplifying from extension of the RTA Protocol by April 2013, and the assessment process and ensuring that those who my officials are working with the company to address require treatment receive it as early as possible. these concerns. (2) The revision of the RTA Protocol and the supporting Personal Injury: Compensation Civil Procedure Rules is being taken forward by a sub-committee of the Civil Procedure Rules Committee. Mr Slaughter: To ask the Secretary of State for It is not appropriate, therefore, for me to comment on Justice (1) what (a) meetings he has had with and (b) the timing of the publication of any such revision. Any representations he has received from PortalCo on the modification of the RTA Portal is a matter for the RTA practicality of implementing changes to the RTA portal Portal Company. by April 2013, in respect of inclusion of (i) higher value (3) The definition of a public liability personal injury road traffic accidents, (ii) employers’ liability claims, claim for the purposes of the extended RTA personal (iii) public liability claims; and if he will make a statement; injury scheme will be set out in the relevant Pre-Action [110535] Protocol. (2) when he expects to publish draft rules to extend (4) The RTA Portal is run by the RTA Portal Company, the RTA portal to (a) higher value road traffic which is a privately owned and privately funded enterprise. accidents, (b) employers’ liability claims and (c) Therefore, this Department does not hold the information public liability claims; and if he will make a statement; requested. However, I understand from the RTA Portal [110536] Company that since its go-live date in April 2010: (3) what his definition is of a public liability personal the main reason for drop out at Stage 1 is timeout in the injury claim; [110537] absence of a decision by the insurer with regard to liability (4) how many and what proportion of claims (356,529), representing 26% of submitted claims; and dropped out of the RTA portal at each stage in the the predominant reason for drop out at Stage 2 is caused by a most recent 12 months for which figures are available; timeout for no response (34,335) which represents 2.5% of submitted claims. and what the predominant reason was for dropping out at each stage; [110538] The RTA Portal Company does not hold information about cases which have proceeded to Stage 3, as this is (5) how many and what proportion of claims for (a) not a function of the RTA Portal. road accidents, (b) employers’ liability and (c) public liability dealt with in the (i) fast track and (ii) portal he (5) The potential impact of increasing the small estimates will be dealt with under the small claims claims personal injury limit on the number and proportion system under his proposal to increase the limit for small of RTA, employer’s liability and public liability claims claims to £5,000; and if he will make a statement; using the fast track and the RTA Protocol will be [110632] assessed in the light of responses to the forthcoming consultation on increasing that limit. (6) if he will place a copy of Professor Fenn’s report on the Road Traffic Accident portal system in the (6) I can confirm that a copy of Professor Fenn’s Library; [110633] report will be placed in the Libraries of both Houses on (7) what his policy is on the use of the Road Traffic publication. Accident portal by unrepresented claimants when (7) The RTA Pre-action Protocol allows unrepresented bringing a personal injury claim; and whether such claimants to bring a personal injury claim. The operation claimants will be required to use the portal in the event of the RTA Portal in this regard is a matter for the RTA of an increase in the small claims limit; [110637] Portal Company. The use of the RTA Protocol and (8) what assessment he has made of the likely change RTA Portal by such claimants in the event of an increase in the number and proportion of claims that will enter to the small claims PI limit will be reviewed in the light the Road Traffic Accidents portal if his proposal to of the forthcoming consultation. increase the small claims limit for personal injury (8) The potential impact of increasing the small claims to £5,000 is implemented. [110644] claims personal injury limit on use of the RTA Protocol (and, therefore, on use of the RTA Portal) will be Mr Djanogly: (1) The Government’s announced its assessed in the light of responses to the forthcoming intention to extend the Pre-Action Protocol for low consultation on increasing that limit. value personal injury claims in road traffic accidents (the RTA Protocol) on 9 February 2012. The extended Mr Slaughter: To ask the Secretary of State for scheme will be implemented by April 2013 and will Justice (1) what (a) discussions he has had with and include road traffic accident, employer’s liability and (b) representations he has received from (i) the medical public liability claims up to a value of £25.000. I met professional bodies, (ii) the insurance industry, (iii) with members of the RTA Portal Company Board on private medical companies and (iv) other private 1 March 2012 to discuss issues arising from the extension medical bodies on his proposal for a panel of doctors in terms of the modification of the RTA Portal. On for whiplash claims; and if he will make a statement; 22 March 2012, I hosted a roundtable meeting to discuss [110631] 617W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 618W

(2) on what dates he has met representatives of the These figures have been drawn from administrative insurance industry to discuss his proposed increase in IT systems, which, as with any large scale recording the small claims limit for personal injury claims; what system, are subject to possible errors with data entry matters were discussed; and what other representations and processing. he has received from the insurance industry on this Information on offenders’ residences is provided by proposal; [110638] offenders on reception into prison and recorded on a (3) what discussions he has had with Lord Justice central IT system. Addresses can include a home address, Jackson on his proposed increase in the small claims an address to which offenders intend to return on limit for personal injury claims; and what matters were discharge or next of kin address. raised during these discussions. [110639] If no address is given, an offender’s committal court address is used as a proxy for the area in which they are Mr Djanogly: On 2 May 2012 I attended an insurance resident. This is the case for one of the prisoners in this summit and confirmed the Ministry of Justice will be answer. No address has been recorded and no court consulting on: information is available for around 3% of all offenders. (i) options to raise the small claims threshold for personal injury claims Prisoners: Repatriation (ii) the use of independent medical panels There have been no ministerial discussions with Mr Raab: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice representatives from medical professional bodies, the how many individuals sentenced to jail in the UK were insurance industry or private medical companies about transferred to serve their sentences in other EU these issues. However, as part of the consultation member states in each year since 2009 under the terms development process, we will engage with stakeholders of EU Council Framework Decision 2008/909/JHA; prior to the launch of the proposed consultation on this and how many individuals sentenced to jail in other issue in July. EU member states were transferred to serve their Representations on the use of independent medical sentence in the UK under that decision in each year panels have been received from: since 2009. [111069] The Chartered Society of Physiotherapy Mr Blunt: Council Framework Decision 2008/909/JHA The British Osteopathic Association on the application of the principle of mutual recognition Medicals Direct Group Health to judgments in criminal matters imposing custodial Medicolegal Wessex sentences or measures involving deprivation of liberty IPRS Group for the purpose of their enforcement in the European NeuroPAS Global LLC Union was adopted on 27 November 2008. It entered into force on 5 December 2011. To date nine member The Royal Buckinghamshire Hospital states including the United Kingdom have implemented The Association of British Insurers the framework decision. No prisoners have yet been No discussions have been held with Lord Justice transferred into or out of the United Kingdom under Jackson on the proposal to consult on raising the small this arrangement. claims limit for personal injury claims. Probation Prisoner Escapes Mr Raab: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Mr Spellar: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice how many individuals subject to probation measures what reports he has received of the escape of and imposed in the UK have had their probation measures attempts to recapture John Anslow; and if he will make supervised by the authorities of another EU member a statement. [111368] state under the terms of EU Council Framework Decision 2008/947/JHA in each year since 2009; and how many individuals subject to probation measures Mr Blunt: The Prison Service investigation into this imposed in other EU member states have had their incident has now been completed and the recommendations probation measures supervised by the UK authorities made as a result of the inquiry are being implemented. under that decision in each year since 2009. [111066] Criminal investigations by the police into the case continue. It is anticipated that a written ministerial statement Mr Blunt: To date, no offenders subject to community relating to the Prison Service investigation will be made sentences imposed by courts in the United Kingdom before summer recess. have been supervised by the authorities of another EU member state; and no offenders sentenced in other EU Prisoners on Remand: Females member states have been supervised by authorities in the UK under the terms of Framework Decision 2008/ Karen Lumley: To ask the Secretary of State for 947/JHA. Justice how many women from Redditch are being held in custody. [111000] Reparation by Offenders

Mr Blunt: As at 25 May there were two female Mike Wood: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice offenders originating from the Redditch constituency for what offences he proposes that restorative justice area who were held in female prisons. practices will be applied. [111957] 619W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 620W

Mr Blunt: Restorative justice offers victims an Government expects police and crime commissioners to opportunity to be heard and to have a say in the work constructively with other local leaders to transform resolution of offences. It can only meaningfully take services aimed at improving public safety. place where the offender admits responsibility and both they, and their victim, are fully able and willing to Social Security Benefits: Appeals engage in a restorative process. We plan to develop a cross-criminal justice system Mr Ainsworth: To ask the Secretary of State for framework for restorative justice to provide guidance to Justice (1) what proportion of appeals to the Tribunals local practitioners on how restorative approaches can Service regarding (a) disability living allowance, (b) be effectively developed across the system and when employment and support allowance, (c) income they will be appropriate. We will draw upon existing support, (d) jobseeker’s allowance and (e) tax credits evidence and practices that are already in place with the were successful in (i) 2010, (ii) 2011 and (iii) 2012 from aim of spreading best practice across the system. appellants in (A) Coventry, (B) the West Midlands and (C) England; [111632] Mike Wood: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice (2) what the average length of time was for the if he will consult the victims of serious crime on the use Tribunals Service to administer a First-Tier Tribunal of restorative justice practices. [111958] social security and child support appeal in respect of employment and support allowance from appellants in Mr Blunt: Restorative justice can only meaningfully (a) Coventry, (b) the West Midlands and (c) England take place where the offender admits responsibility and in (i) 2010, (ii) 2011 and (iii) 2012. [111633] both they, and their victim, are fully able and willing to engage in a restorative process. Mr Djanogly: Appeals against decisions made by the The Government’s response to the ‘Getting it right Department for Work and Pensions on an individual’s for Victims and Witnesses’ consultation will be published entitlement to social security and child support are shortly. This will set out the additional work we propose heard by the First-tier Tribunal (Social Security and to undertake to enhance the roles of, and engagement Child Support). of victims in restorative justice. Her Majesty’s Courts and Tribunals Service (HMCTS) Road Traffic Offences does not hold data specific to Coventry or the West Midlands. However, the majority of social security and child support (SSCS) appeals from appellants in Coventry John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for are heard in the hearing venue in Coventry, although Justice what steps his Department has taken to reform this venue also hears appeals from other nearby locations. the criminal justice system in order to improve public safety and the performance of the Probation Service; The majority of SSCS appeals made by appellants and what the outcomes of these initiatives were. [111640] from the West Midlands are heard in the hearing venues in Birmingham, Coventry, Hereford, Stoke, Mr Blunt: On 27 March we published proposals to Wolverhampton, Worcester and Kidderminster, although deliver more effective and efficient probation services, these venues also hear appeals from other nearby locations. alongside proposals for reforming community sentences. The data are provided for the financial year 2010-11, The Government is seeking to extend competition in as data broken down by financial year is more readily probation services and give probation trusts a stronger available, and for the period from 1 April to 31 December role as commissioners of competed services, in order to 2011, the latest date for which information is available. better punish and reform offenders and protect the The following table shows the proportion of appeals public. The consultation closes on 22 June. regarding (a) disability living allowance, (b) employment This Government has also legislated to introduce and support allowance, (c) income support, (d) jobseeker’s police and crime commissioners, who will have a crucial allowance and (e) tax credits which were successful in role to play in this context. In addition to their core the financial year 2010-11 and from 1 April to 31 policing function, police and crime commissioners will December 2011 (the latest date for which information is have a remit to cut crime, and will have commissioning available) at the hearing venues in Coventry, the West powers and funding to enable them to do this. The Midlands and England.

Successful appeals Percentage Coventry West Midlands England 1 April to 1 April to 1 April to 2010-11 31 December 2011 2010-11 31 December 2011 2010-11 31 December 2011

Disability living 39 45 29 30 38 39 allowance Employment and 33 34 29 33 37 37 support allowance Income support 27 54 31 31 29 26 Jobseeker’s allowance 20 14 19 16 14 16 Tax credits 10 15 15 8 10 10 1 The figure appears as 0% due to the very small number of appeals. There were nine tax credit appeals heard in the Coventry hearing venue in 2010-11. 621W Written Answers14 JUNE 2012 Written Answers 622W

The following table shows the average time taken to have disposed of around 435,000 appeals in 2011-12, from receipt of an employment and support allowance with the capacity for half a million disposals in 2012-13. (ESA) appeal to disposal by the tribunal in the financial Disposals outstripped receipts for the 12 months between year 2010-11 and from 1 April to 31 December 2011 January 2011 and December 2011, and the number of (the latest date for which information is available) at the cases waiting to be heard reduced by over 44,000 between hearing venues in Coventry, the West Midlands and April and December 2011. The average waiting time has England. stabilised nationally, and is beginning to fall across ESA appeal times from receipt to disposal many venues. Weeks Squatting 1 April to 2010-11 31 December 2011 Gordon Henderson: To ask the Secretary of State for Coventry 21.1 36.3 Justice whether the Government plans to review the law West 22.5 33.3 on adverse property possession. [110930] Midlands England 19.3 24.7 Mr Djanogly: We have no plans to review the law of England and Wales relating to the ownership of land by HMCTS is working hard to increase the capacity of adverse possession. the SSCS Tribunal and reduce waiting times. It has implemented a range of measures which include recruiting Terrorism: Ex Gratia Payments more judges and medical panel members; increasing administrative resources; securing additional hearing Mr Spellar: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice venues; increasing the number of cases listed in each how many applications his Department has received tribunal session; running double shifts in its largest for the ex gratia scheme for victims of terrorist acts processing centre; running Saturday sittings in some of overseas. [111369] the busiest venues; and setting up a customer contact centre to deal with telephone enquiries. Mr Blunt: As at week commencing 12 June 2012, All of this is having a positive effect. The number of there have been a total of 12 applications to the ex disposals has increased significantly from 279,000 in gratia scheme for certain victims of terrorism overseas 2009-10 to 380,000 in 2010-11 and the tribunal expects which opened on 16 April this year.

ORAL ANSWERS

Thursday 14 June 2012

Col. No. Col. No. CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT...... 445 HOUSE OF COMMONS COMMISSION...... 465 Children (Sport)...... 452 Cycling...... 465 Children’s Health (Advertising)...... 450 Get Set Programme...... 451 Local Newspapers...... 449 Olympics (New Sport)...... 455 LEADER OF THE HOUSE ...... 460 Registrar of the Public Lending Right ...... 454 e-Petitions ...... 461 Special Advisers ...... 450 House Business Committee...... 464 Superfast Broadband ...... 445 House of Commons Reform...... 460 Superfast Broadband ...... 446 Legislative Programme...... 462 Topical Questions ...... 456 Private Members’ Bills ...... 463 WRITTEN MINISTERIAL STATEMENTS

Thursday 14 June 2012

Col. No. Col. No. BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS ...... 37WS HOME DEPARTMENT—continued National Minimum Wage...... 37WS Modern Workplace Consultation (Government Response) ...... 39WS FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE..... 37WS General Affairs Council ...... 37WS TRANSPORT ...... 43WS EU Transport Council ...... 43WS HOME DEPARTMENT...... 39WS Fixed Penalty Notices for Careless Driving...... 44WS Disclosure and Barring Service (Appointments) .... 39WS WORK AND PENSIONS ...... 45WS Justice and Home Affairs Council...... 40WS Draft Universal Credit Regulations...... 45WS PETITION

Thursday 14 June 2012

Col. No. Col. No. TRANSPORT ...... 5P M4 link road (Kingswood)...... 5P WRITTEN ANSWERS

Thursday 14 June 2012

Col. No. Col. No. ATTORNEY-GENERAL ...... 543W BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS—continued Atos ...... 543W Students: Loans ...... 594W EU Law...... 543W Summertime...... 594W Recruitment ...... 543W Regulation ...... 544W CABINET OFFICE...... 577W Atos ...... 577W BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS...... 585W Average Earnings ...... 578W Apprentices...... 585W Business: Richmond Upon Thames ...... 579W Apprentices: Medicine ...... 586W Business: West Midlands...... 579W Apprentices: West Midlands ...... 586W Charitable and Voluntary Organisations ...... 580W Arms Trade...... 587W Civil Servants...... 580W Atos ...... 587W Emergency Planning College...... 580W Business: Finance...... 587W Employment ...... 580W Commercial Agents: EU Law ...... 588W Government Departments: Procurement ...... 582W Complaints ...... 589W Health Insurance...... 582W Conditions of Employment...... 591W Leonard Cheshire Disability ...... 582W Exports: Bahrain...... 592W Office for Civil Society ...... 582W Manpower...... 592W Third Sector...... 583W Manufacturing Industries: Training ...... 592W Voluntary Organisations ...... 583W New Businesses ...... 593W Voluntary Work ...... 584W Overseas Trade: Gabon...... 593W Voluntary Work: Young People...... 584W Retail Trade ...... 593W Working Hours ...... 584W Col. No. Col. No. COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT.. 595W HEALTH...... 544W Conferences ...... 595W Cancer: Drugs...... 544W Debts Written Off ...... 595W Contraceptives ...... 545W Disclosure of Information ...... 595W Cord Blood: Donors ...... 545W Empty Property ...... 595W Food ...... 546W First Time Buyers ...... 596W Health Professions Council...... 547W Homelessness...... 598W Health Services: Human Trafficking ...... 547W Housing ...... 599W Incinerators: Health Hazards...... 548W Housing Benefit ...... 600W Muscular Dystrophy ...... 548W Housing: Construction...... 600W Musculoskeletal Disorders...... 548W Housing: Older People ...... 603W NHS: Laboratories...... 549W Local Government: Assets ...... 604W Nurses...... 550W Local Government Services...... 604W Psoriasis...... 550W Mortgages: Government Assistance...... 605W Social Services...... 550W Private Rented Housing ...... 606W Thalidomide...... 550W Right to Buy Scheme ...... 607W Sports: Clubs ...... 607W HOME DEPARTMENT ...... 551W Asylum: Deportation ...... 551W CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT...... 567W Bigamy...... 552W Atos ...... 567W Crown Prosecution Service...... 552W British Sky Broadcasting: News Corporation...... 567W Driving Offences: Insurance...... 552W Diamond Jubilee 2012...... 569W Entry Clearances: Higher Education...... 552W Digital Technology...... 569W Entry Clearances: Overseas Students ...... 553W Engagements: Newspapers...... 567W Health Insurance...... 553W Food: Advertising ...... 569W Immigration...... 553W Health Insurance...... 570W Olympic and Paralympic Games 2012: Security..... 554W Leveson Inquiry ...... 570W Pay...... 554W Listed Buildings ...... 570W Police and Crime Commissioners...... 554W Misleading Advertising ...... 571W Race Relations: EU Action ...... 554W Olympic Games 2012 ...... 571W Stop and Search ...... 555W Radio Frequencies ...... 572W Terrorism: EU Action ...... 555W Tourism: North Yorkshire...... 572W UK Border Agency ...... 555W Work Permits: Balkans...... 556W DEFENCE...... 575W Army: Manpower ...... 575W INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT...... 573W Army: Scotland...... 577W Atos ...... 573W Defence: Procurement...... 577W Developing Countries: Water ...... 573W Mexico...... 573W EDUCATION...... 523W Pay...... 574W Publications ...... 574W Financial Services: Education ...... 523W Recruitment ...... 575W Syria...... 575W ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE ...... 562W Biofuels...... 562W JUSTICE...... 608W Carbon Emissions...... 562W Alcoholic Drinks: Misuse...... 608W Carbon Emissions: Shipping...... 563W Children: Maintenance ...... 608W Coryton Oil Refinery ...... 563W Claims Management Services...... 608W Energy: Coventry ...... 564W Closed Material Procedures ...... 609W Energy Supply...... 564W Community Orders ...... 609W Fuel Poverty: Kent ...... 564W Contempt of Court: Sentencing...... 610W Fuel Poverty: West Midlands ...... 565W Court Orders: Compensation...... 610W Heating ...... 565W Courts: Fines ...... 611W Nuclear Power Stations...... 566W Crimes of Violence...... 611W Domestic Violence ...... 612W ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL Human Trafficking ...... 612W AFFAIRS...... 521W Oakwood Prison ...... 613W Complaints ...... 521W Offenders: Mental Illness ...... 614W Empty Property ...... 522W Personal Injury: Compensation...... 615W Rural Areas: Business ...... 523W Prisoner Escapes ...... 617W Prisoners on Remand: Females ...... 617W FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE..... 537W Prisoners: Repatriation ...... 618W Atos ...... 537W Probation ...... 618W Bahrain ...... 537W Reparation by Offenders ...... 618W Bosnia and Herzegovina ...... 537W Road Traffic Offences...... 619W Pay...... 538W Social Security Benefits: Appeals ...... 620W Procurement...... 539W Squatting ...... 622W Recruitment ...... 539W Terrorism: Ex Gratia Payments...... 622W Sri Lanka ...... 539W Syria...... 540W LEADER OF THE HOUSE ...... 536W Thailand ...... 540W Consideration on Report...... 536W Ukraine...... 541W DEFRA Question Time...... 536W Col. No. Col. No. LEADER OF THE HOUSE—continued TREASURY—continued Ministerial Statements ...... 536W Public Sector: Pay ...... 559W Recruitment ...... 560W SCOTLAND...... 541W Tax Allowances: Charities...... 560W Atos ...... 541W Taxation: Multinational Companies ...... 561W David Livingstone...... 541W VAT: Listed Buildings ...... 562W Pay...... 542W WALES...... 542W TRANSPORT ...... 531W Atos ...... 542W Bus Services ...... 531W Pay...... 542W Motor Vehicles: Insurance ...... 532W Procurement...... 542W Motor Vehicles: Registration...... 532W Railway Network ...... 532W WORK AND PENSIONS ...... 524W Railway Stations ...... 533W Housing and Council Tax Benefits...... 524W Housing Benefit ...... 524W TREASURY ...... 556W Human Trafficking ...... 525W Business: Finance...... 556W Legionnaires’ Disease: Edinburgh...... 525W Conservative Party and Liberal Democrats...... 556W Pensioners: Social Security Benefits ...... 526W Corporation Tax ...... 557W Pensions...... 526W Credit Unions ...... 557W Social Security Benefits: Greater Manchester ...... 528W Equitable Life ...... 557W Universal Credit...... 529W EU Budget ...... 558W Veterans ...... 530W Gambling...... 558W Work Capability Assessment...... 530W Personal Savings ...... 558W Work Experience...... 531W Procurement...... 559W Working Conditions...... 531W Members who wish to have the Daily Report of the Debates forwarded to them should give notice at the Vote Office. 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CONTENTS

Thursday 14 June 2012

Oral Answers to Questions [Col. 445] [see index inside back page] Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport Leader of the House House of Commons Commission

Fish Discards [Col. 467] Answer to urgent question—(Richard Benyon)

Business of the House [Col. 475] Statement—(Sir George Young)

Banking Reform [Col. 490] Statement—(Mr Hoban)

Backbench Business [1st allotted day] [Col. 504] Mental Health Motion—(Nicky Morgan)—agreed to

Walsall-Rugeley Line (Electrification) [Col. 577] Debate on motion for Adjournment

Westminster Hall Piracy (Somalia) [Col. 143WH] Debate on motion for Adjournment

Written Ministerial Statements [Col. 37WS]

Petition [Col. 5P] Observations

Written Answers to Questions [Col. 521W] [see index inside back page]