4043 Constitution [ 13 DEC. 1968 ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1964 4044 the Bill. It is not necessary at all to have such a THE DEPUTY CHAIRMAN : First let him legislation because the framers of the finish. I do not want other Members to get up Constitution had considered all these points when one Member is already on his feet. This immediately after achievement o tendency is growing in the House. independence. At that time things were very normal in the country and all possible aspects SHRI KRISHAN KANT : The hon- of the matter were taken into consideration. Minister is here now; otherwise he would go Lengthy debates were held and after those away. lengthy debates Chapter XVIII of the Constitution was enacted and all these articles, SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : After five article 352, 359 and 360 were made part of the o'clock let him come. Constitution. SHRI AKBAR ALI KHAN (Andhra With these words, Madam, I oppose the Pradesh) : May I, through you, appeal to Mr. amending Bill introduced by Mr-Bhupesh Bhupesh Gupta ? Yes, it is your right. You are Gupta and hope that the House will throw it in possession, because the person who is to out. reply has been called and you are the person. In view of the difficult situation, about which I am sure you are also exercised, we would like to hear the Education Minister. REFERENCE TO SITUATION IN THE BANARAS HINDU UNIVERSITY SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : Can I say, Madam, that I am second to none in SHRI KRISHAN KANT (Haryana) : having a statement of the kind______{In Madam, before the hon. Mr. Bhupesh Gupta terruptions) . Please let me finish. Wait ... replies I would like to bring to the notice of the Education Minister who is here now that this THE LEADER OF THE HOUSE (SHRI House almost unanimously demanded that JAISUKHLAL HATHI) : I agree with Mr. there should be a Committee appointed by the Bhupesh Gupta and we can take up this Visitor to look into the affairs of the Banaras question after five o'clock. I agree, after five Hindu University where things are going from o'clock. bad to worse. About this myself, Mr. Bhargava, Mr. Chandra Shekhar and Mr. Rajnarain, gave {Interruptions) a motion but it was not admitted. Now the House is going to close for two or three days. THE DEPUTY CHAIRMAN : At The situation is getting from bad to worse. five o'clock. Now that the hon. Education Minister is here I demand that a Committee be appointed by the SHRI JAISUKHLAL HATHI : I shall Visitor to go into the affairs of the Banaras request my colleague. He will be here at five Hindu University forthwith otherwise the o'clock. situation will become still bad. Students have stopped studies and there is no control of the THE DEPUTY CHAIRMAN : I think that Vice-Chancellor. We cannot delay any more. the demand of Mr. Bhupesh Gupta is reasonable that he should reply and that the {interruptions) Education Minister be available at five o'clock SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA (Wes1 Bengal) : in our House. After 5 o'clock let him make a statement. Under the rules you cannot do it till 5 o'clock. Today is non-official day and it is meant for non-official busines s THE CONSTITUTION (AMENDMENT)BILL, 1964 SHRI A. G. KULKARNI (Maharashtra) : {To amend articles 352 and 359 and You co-operate with us to request him to insertion of new article 360.4)—contd. appoint the Committee. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : Madam, I am {Interruptions) very sorry that when this non-official Bill was being discussed some hon. Members, who SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : You are were not even present in the House, suddenly taking away the non-official time. jumped up, along with the Education Minister, and demanded that the time from the Private Members 4045 Constitution [ RAJYA SABHA ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1964 4046

[Shri Bhupesh Gupta] Day be taken away SHRI A. G. KULKARNI : What in order that the Edu" cation Minister should Government? make a statement here and now, at once. I think it is not a very good attitude. I am fully SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : Ricketty with them that the Minister should make a Government, a Government which has no statement, but I would also ask them why it sense of proportion, neither proper back cannot be made at five o'clock. The heavens sight nor foresight...... would not come down. SHRI A. G. KULKARNI : Like the United SHRIMATI SHAKUNTALA PARAN- Front Government. JPYE (Nominated) : It has been decided now. Do not go back to it. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : Such is the SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : I will take a Government on behalf of whom my friend was little time and let me proceed as I like. At speaking. He was undoubtedly put in a that time you did not get up to oppose the predicament to hold the baby of Shri Gulzarilal Congress Members. I consider it to be an Nanda and others, when he was not perhaps in incursion into the rights of the House. I am the Council of Ministers. I share his agony and with you as regards the statement or difficulty in attempting to make out a case when whatever announcement he has to make. no case could be made out. Now, he has made it However, please let me proceed. known. Now, from this side of the House all of us have spoken and given reasons as to why the We have listened to the speech of our emergency powers have to be curbed. I am not friend, the Deputy Minister of Home proposing in my Bill the abolition of the Affairs.... provision of emergency as such. What I have SHRI A. G. KULKARNI : Not Home proposed in this amending Bill are some checks Affairs, but Law. and balances, some safety valves, in order that the emergency powers could not be used in the SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : I am very authoritarian, undemocratic, dictatorial and sorry, I elevated him to a higher position. tyrannical manner in which they used it during the fateful years of continued emergency since SHRI A. G. KULKARNI : Do not. 1962. The points that we have made have not been answered. The hon. Minister has taken SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : Anyhow, he pains to read out the Constitution and I am glad is the Deputy Minister of Law. He came to that at least for the first time perhaps he has read answer this and I insisted that Mr. Chavan those provisions of the Constitution. But this we should come .... all know. We need not be reminded of what is SHRI MOHAMMAD YUNUS SA-LEEM contained in the Constitution. We have to be : And he did. told why they should not be changed. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : .... SHRI MUHAMMAD YUNUS SA-LEEM : because it relates to the activities of the I have given reasons as to why they should not Home Ministry. As you know, emergency, be changed. is administered under the leadership of the Home Minister. I was sorry that Members SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : You have tried opposite did not voice their support that to say something. You have tried to say it should be so. Never I objected to his something as to why they should not be speaking. In fact, I welcome it. He spoke. I have no quarrel with that. Mr. Chavan changed, but you could not say anything more came, sat a while and he was good enough than what the Constitution has already said, to ask me whether he could leave. I said, beyond what the words of this article already democracy is on the way out and he could say. We expected from the hon. Minister some ust as well leave. I indicated to him that arguments reasoning to meet the arguments put he can go. Such is ihe position. Now forward by the votaries of the change and that Let me ...... is exactly what he has not done. SHRIMATI SHAKUNTALA PARAN- IPYE : You are the boss. One speaker from the other side was Mr. Parthasarathy. Well, he spoke with some SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : Now, measure of gusto. I do not know whether it was let me deal with the proposition. My friend, matched by ["conviction^ but he had to speak who was intervening on behalf of the and he spoke. He Government, ricketty Government, mo rally bankrupt Government ...... 4047 Conxion [13 DEC. 1968] (A-0 «• "64 4048 learn anything. What is surprising is they are immediately started his speech by attri- not even in a mood, manifest or visible buting motives to me or motives to the party to mood, of learning anything. That is the which I belong. He said that the communist tragedy of the Congress Party and the party wanted democracy to be finished, Government. and hence they sponsored a measure of this kind. Nothing could be a more nonsensical Madam Deputy Chairman, it is not a question statement that the one that he made when he of our not being concerned about the security spoke on this Bill. I say this because during of the country. All of us are concerned about the period of emergency Fundamental Rights the security of the country. Was not Mr. Jaya have been affected and complaints have been Prakash Narayan concerned about the security made by every single man outoide the Govern- of the country? Was not Mr. Setalvad ment, men of eminence, whose words concerned about the security of the country? matter in our public life. Mr. Setalvad had Were not the High Court Judges who spoke spoken very strongly against it. I had quotrd against the measure concerned about the those things. Former Chief Justices of the security of the country? Was not the Indian High Courts had spoken against it. I also press concerned about the security of'the brought to the notice of the House, in due country? Therefore, it is altogether an course, that most of the leading newspapers irrelevant argument when an attempt is made to had written against the use of the emergency join issue with us on the ground of security of powers. Then, Mr. Jayaprakash Narayan the country. Workers gave more donations in had spoken against the use of emergency small coins than the entire capitalist class. powers. Shri Raja-gopalachari, who Who does not know that at the time of the belongs to the other pole in politics, had also Indo-China conflict the Delhi workers and spoken against the emergency. Everyone is other workers donated much more than the against it. My friend, Mr. Ramachandran, capitalist class in Delhi? Therefore, it does a devoted Gandhi-ite, whom I respect, not lie in the mouth of the Treasury Benches had also, I believe, an occasion to speak to teach the working people or the against the use of such emergency powers, etc. organisation which respresents them that the security of the country has got to be protected SHRI AKBAR ALI KHAN : He wanted to and safeguarded. We all stand for it. But speak today also. when in their hands the emergency power be- came the power to be used for the security of SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : I would very the Congress Party. The security of the nation much like him to speak. I can yield even was confused with the security of the now. In fact, I was requesting him to give us Congress Party. The Presidential advice over this matter. But there is one Proclamation was grossly abused in order to party, one group of men, who have never maintain the shoddy, declining, decadent and taken the opinion of the country seriously and decrepit Congress rule. That is what I am responsibly. It is the Congress Party and in saying. Now meet this argument. I point particular these men who happen to occupy out and I repeat that according to our reckoning the Treasury Benches. That is an example during the period of the emergency not less of how emergency creates some autocrats, than 70,000 people belonging to the left tyrants and dictators who believe in the democratic movement, trade unions and mass defying of public opinion and in putting organisations, had been in prison at one time or their group or sectional opinion above the other under the D.I.R. What is your figure? opinion of the nation as a whole. They will He should have told us. He should have given claim they are the nation. They will claim his figure if my figure is wrong. He has not they are the representatives of the people. done such a thing at all. All he says is that it That myth has been exploded in the was necessary. Most of the opposition Fourth General Election, when the leaders and others had suffered in one way Congress Party, the meantors of the or the other. Who does not know it? Yet, you emergency regime, the philosophers of the cannot maintain the security of the country emergency crimes, the executors of without the cooperation of the opposition. Fundamental rights and liberties, had been Everybody knows it. The Congress Party, you defeated in nine out of seventeen States in the do not know how io look after and country. maintain the security of the Uttar Pradesh Congress or Bihar Congress or Haryana They have lost the Government in the Congress, and you boast here that you alone majority of the States. I thought at least shall maintain or safeguard the security of the some oi them would learn something, some lesson, but like the Bourbons they never 4049 Constitution [ RAJYA SABHA ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1964 4050

[Shri Bhupjsh Gupta] country. Fancy the ts that statement? Where is Mr. Gulzarilal Congress Party looking after the nation all by Nanda ? Where are those people whom he itself when it does not know how to look after indicated behind their back on the floor of the its own household affairs where it has created a House? Where is Mr. Namboo-diripad or Mr. terrible mess. Therefore, better learn to Jyoti Basu and where is Mr. Gulzarilal Nanda maintain and safeguard your party organisation and his deputy who came and trotted out the by observing the party rules. fatuous statement to disgrace our parliamentary institutions? We see today, since they talk about security, young Congressmen are opposing the move by SHRI M. N. KAUL (Nominated) In the some people to drop the disciplinary wilderness. investigation against Mr. Hanu-manthiah. I say this thing because of their conception of SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : Life has shown security. These are the people that decide to that Mr. Nanda is not to be accepted by the hold investigation and then they drop it because people for having done such a thing. Life has they fear that Mr. Hanumanthiah will wash a again shown that his accused are to be lot of dirty linen before the commission of rewarded for the manner in which they have inquiry and expose Mr. Nijalingappa and the been treated by the Congress rule. whole lot of them. Therefore, they drop it. SHRI M. N. KAUL : He is a mild SHRI M. P. SHUKLA (Uttar Pradesh): politician. Madam, how are these things relevant here ? SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : Yes, yes Mr. SHRr BHUPESH GUPTA : I will tell you Gulzarilal Nanda is a mild politician In fact he how it is relevant. was the Deputy Chairman of the Planning THE DEPUTY CHAIRMAN : You come to Commission, I believe, or a Minister of Labour. the Bill. Most of us liked him. He is a mild man. You see how emergency corrupted even Mr. Nanda. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : I have very great That is the point. The emergency made a Mr. regard for him. Since I was with him in London Morarji Desai out of Mr. Nanda. That is the together I am very grateful. Quite right, I will tragedy of the emergency. That is why we tell you how it is relevant. It is relevant because would not like the emergency. Well, here is our you are asking us to place this unbridled emer- esteemed friend Shrimati Raja-gopalan, a kind- gency power in those misfit and bungling hands hearted lady, excellent in her behaviour, Mr. Nijalingappa is not a small fry. He is the although sometimes she abuses me for nothing. leader of the party which occupies the Treasury But if you place her in Nanda's position and Benches. Mr. Hanumanthiah is not a small give the emergency pow r, I do not kn .w wiiat coin. He is the Chairman of the Congress-run will be come ofher. I shudder to think of it. Administrative Reforms Commission. If these men are to be given emergency powers in this SHRI M. P. SHUKLA : She would use it to manner, certainly we should be a little cautious the advantage of the country. about it at least, if not something more. That is why I am saying this. I am sure my friend, Mr. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : That argument Shukla, is really convinced about the relevancy we heard in 1965. oi the point that I am making. I am sure you are. You have to view this thing in the SHRI M. P. SHUKLA : Do not go on background of the political realities. The supporting unpatriotic elements in the society. Congress Party and the Congress Government used the emergency powers for suppression of SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : You are quite democratic rights and liberties. Don't you right. Why should I support unpatriotic remember how Mr. Gulzarilal Nanda as the elements? I entirely agree. But what sort of Home Minister of the country stood up here patriotism was that when Mr. K. B. Sahay and produced his despicable monstrosity called taking advantage of the emergency made the statement of February 1965 in which he money, turned his several thousands into made certain charges against whom they call several millions? the Lefl Communists ? Where is that book ? Where SHRI M. P. SHUKLA : I think the hon. Member is absolutely irrelevant. 4051 Constitution [ 13 DEC. 1968 ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1964 4052

THE DEPUTY CHAIRMAN : 1 think so. he forgot one fact. He did not take notice of what I said. The emergency powers were used SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : I object to against the members of the minority that community in a most unjust and atrocious manner in 1965. We made certain allegations THE DEPUTY CHAIRMAN : You should on the floor of the House when eminent MPs, not mention names. You speak on the Bill. MLAs and political workers belonging to the minority community whose bonu fides or SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : He was the pavriotic credentials not only could not be Chief Minister questioned but had been established in the course of the freedom struggle, were put in SHRI M. P. SHUKLA : He is insinuating detent on without trial under the DIR. Seven against persons who cannot come here and hundred people belonging to the minority defend themselves. community....

SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : They were part SHRI MOHAMMAD YUNUS SA-LEEM : of the Government, of the emergency regime. 1 have conceded that in several cases there has What happened to Mr. Biju Patnaik, the Chief been misuse of powers. That will not justify Minister of Orissa, who was administering the your excluding article 22 from the operation of emergency powers. Where is he now? Was it article 359 of the Constitution. patriotism vhat he displayed? I should like to know from you. You ask Mr. Nijalingappa what was Mr. Hanumanthiah at chat time SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : I am gland But during the emergency... when you should make a concession of a Himalayan type, you have given me a mole- THE DEPUTY CHAIRMAN : You speak hill only. Now, your concession should be big. on the Bill. Seven hundred people in West Bengal belonging to the minority community including MPs SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : I am giving a like Syed Badrudduja who was not a small definition of patriotism. These are not man were arrested and we could not get them convenient. You kindly listen. I say these released. They had to remain for months in jail were the unpatriotic acts fostered by ihe under the emergency. Today he is a Member emergency. That is why I am opposed to of Parliament. This Syed Badrudduja had emergency. been with the freedom movement all the time facing the brunt of the attack of the Muslim It made ihe Congress Chief Ministers League. And yet, under the emergency rule, tyrants. Some of them were made corrupt and in free India, he had to suffer detention without they indulged in money-giving under the trial. And you think that it is a small thing. power of the emergency putting the Well, in Maharashtra, 600 people were Opposition in prison. That is why I am saying detained without trial, people belonging to it. 1 have no interest in personally accusing the minority community for their only crime anybody. I am accusing certain institutions of having been born to Muslim parents. This is ami their incumbent officers during the period not a small thing You should be ashamed of it. It of the emergency. I hope my good friend will is a collos-sal blot. We talk about a secular not make more interruptions like this. State. At the time of the Indo-Pakistan conflict under the emergency powers not only SHRI M. P. SHUKLA : I hope you will democratic rights but secularism itself was stop abusing also. trampled under foot in order to detain people, patriotic people, belonging to the SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : I like your minority community. Well, admit it now at interruption because you give me a chance. I least. You do not even do so. I know how the would not have mentioned all this kind of minority members had been subjected at that things were it not for your ki.id interruption. time to all kinds of illegal and wrong orders and Therefore, you helped me by interrupting. I so on. I need not go into that. Therefore, I am grateful to my hon. friend. think you would understand at least now after so Madam Deputy Chairman, a Minister many years that something went very wrong. I belonging to the minority community spoke would have expected from the I Government— on this subject on behalf of the Government. thai is why 1 wanted to (Interruptions) I am sorry that 4053 Constitution [ RAJYA SABHA ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1964 4054

[Shri Bhupesh Gupta] hear the Home corporates not only the spirit but also the Minister—that even at this late hour, as a letter of the DIR in some way. I do not matter of political gesture, he would at least know how many measures of this kind frankly admit that they did commit very grave would come. The DIR now is being re- errors and that certain things went very wrong, enacted in the form of legislation, in the that never such things will they do. form of Ordinance, piecemeal, but none the less, on the basis of a calculated design on the part of the Congress Government. Then, you play with the rights of the What is that design? That design, their citizens. We could not go and question your plan, is to attack the working people and orders in a court of law because all the rights the working class movement in the coun have been suspended. And the fundamental try, to take away the liberties which the right under article 19 was made so absolutely working class movement has won and the inoperative as also the other rights under the trade union and other rights. And that is Constitution. We oould not seek remedy in why they are bringing forward such mea respect of them in a court of law. They also, in sures. The right of collective bargaining, effect, became inoperative. Was it not a the right to strike, these are to be taken serious thing? At least, you should deal with it, away first from the Government employees in ihe course of a speech on behalf of the and then from other employees belonging Government, more seriously than I. That is to the private sector. That is their plan, what I would like to ask. Therefore, kindly ...... Then, Madam Deputy Chairman, with regard to the other points that he has made, We SHRI M. F. SHUKLA : On a point of order. have closed the emergency chapter in the sense The hon. Member is replying to the debate. He of law and the Constitution-There is no is not having a general discussion over the Bill. emergency today. That chapter, legally and He is traversing beyond his scope. constitutionally speaking, has been closed. But the erosion of our public life, erosion of the THE DEPUTY CHAIRMAN : I have drawn administrative system by the emergency must his attention to keep to the Bill. be borne in mind. This habit of the emergency is there, the legacy of the emergency is haunt- SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : I do not know ing, the dark shadow of the emergency had what you have brought my attention to. I am lengthened so far and wide that many of us saying about curbing freedom, etc. Am I to with good ideas and concepts find outselves make a speech of the Deputy Minister ? I am lost in the way. That is what I am saying. not expected to make that. Now, you see what is happening- The SHRI M. P. SHUKLA : We are her emergency is gone; the D1R is gone tech- to function under the rules and procedures and nically. But the Covernment of India copies not to hear his harangues all the time and from the DIR and enacts legislation, the abuses. Essential Services Maintenance Bill which is being discussed in the other House. Actually, it SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : I entirely agree is an attempt to incorporate some of the that I am expected to function under the rules provisions of the Defence of India Rules. Let and my hon. friend. . . us be clear about it. SHRI M. N. KAUL : If your Bill is SHRI M. P. SHUKLA : You are always accepted, in spite of that the Government have expected not to transgress the rules. powers under the law and the Constitution. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : My esteem-ed Your Bill is then ineffective. friend is also expected to function under the SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : Now, as I was rules of common sense. Common sense should saying, the emergency has got the Government be on your side. into this habit. Now, they cannot think of SHRI M. P. SHUKLA : Which you always ruling the country and arranging the affairs without such mea. sures as were given them lack. under the emergency and under the DIR in SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : Now, why have particular. That is what I am trying to make I brought forward this Bill ? I have brought out, Now take the efrexample, the Indianail- forward this Bill to indict the Goverment. I ways (Amnedment) Bill. That also in- know tlie fate of the Bill. I have brought forward this Bill precisely to say what I am saying. Otherwise, why should I wait for four years to move this Bill? It was introduced in 1964, as you know. 4055 Constitution [ 13 DEC. 1968 ] (Amdt.) Bill, l£64 4056

So these emergency powers have put the Madam, you will at least now admit that in Government in the habit of emergency and Andhra Pradesh the emergency power was despotic rule. This is what we see today. administered by Mr. Nambiar, the I.G. of Police of Andhra Pradesh. Where is he now ? Madam Deputy Chairman, everything is He is facing investigation on charges of relevant. Though emergency is not there in corruption, bribery and what not, and the Uttar Pradesh, certain other emergencylike Andhra Pradesh Government had to remove powers are being used to attack the teachers him. That man was in charge of the and the students to put them in jail and administration of the power given under the detention. Three thousand people have been emergency and by the D.I.R. and other arrested. Can you deny that this is not being provisions. This is what has happened. I think done ? Can you define the provisions under you should at least take a note of this. Madam which they are being arrested and put in Deputy Chairman, the police became haughty detention and being put behind prison bars ? all over the countiy, and even today it Are these not the same as the provisions continues to be so. Though they were never obtaining under the Defence of India Rules? responsible, emergency made them all the more Whether I should be glad or sorry, I do not irresponsible, haughty, aggressive and know, because my friend is going away. His-. completely callous and soulless in relation to presence was stimulating all the same. That is the rights and privileges of the people, even to what is happening in Uttar Pradesh. In the life and property. That is why today we find the name of law and order they have arrested Shri police atrocities going on all over the country, Rustam Satin, a leader of our Party, a Minister on a scale never known before, all over the in (he United Front Government, a person who country more so in those States which are was himself in charge of the police under the under the Centre's rule today under Presidential Charan Singh Ministry. He is now put in Proclamation. prison on the ground of maintaining law and order under special powers which the Uttar Pradesh Government has assumed. This very Madam Deputy Chiarman, here one should Uttar Pradesh Government cannot stop keep in mind how the emergency powers are robberies, dacoities and arson which are taking being used or the powers flowing from the kind place. That is their emergency power. Madam of emergency proclamation in the States like Deputy Chairman, emergency powers were Uttar Pradesh and so on. In every way we have never used to stop rioting and other things. So suffered. I suggested six months and then three we know very well how they are being used. months by a resolution of Parliament. It should From every angle rights have been curbed. be accepted. I am not taking away anything Another contribution of the emergency was from Parliament. Let Parliament discuss it and that it made bureaucracy all powerful. It made pass it. If Parliament thinks that emergency it swollen-headed. It made it corrupt. If you go should continue we have to accept it. I am not into the records of the Vigilance Commission asking you to accept my suggestion absolutely. you will find that in the period of emergency Obviously the Government commands there have been more cases of corruption in majority and for them there should be no the administration which the Vigilance difficulty in accepting it. But they do not like it Commission has dealt with. Just go through because emergency powers must not be the period and compare the records of the questioned in Parliament or before the public emergency period with the records of the in a responsible manner. Emergency powers earlier period or the period now. You will find are meant to be autocratic powers used from that more corruption cases took place and were behind the scene sometimes— and certainly in reported to the Vigilance Commission. a dark and cowardly manner. That is why they Emergency bred corruption because it enabled would not like Parliament to be entrusted with the bureaucrats and others to seek protection the power to review after six months as to behind the emergency powers. whether emergency should be continued or not. Who does not know that the emergency Now, that attitude is incomprehensible. But we powers were used to silence the petty go- know that they cannot think of making a vernment officials, clerks and others. These change in a better direction. powers were used to make them work more and harder. Everybody knows it. Therefore, a Then I suggested that at least the provision kind of reign of terror was created in the regarding fundamental rights should be administration. Intimidation became the order accepted. I should be allowed to go to a court of the day where men at the top could get on of law and seek remedy in regard to with all types of corrupt practices. fundamental rights if I think the executive has wrongly attacked my fundamental rights. Why should the Government not 4057 Constitution [RAJYA SABHA] (Amdt.) Bill, 1964 4058

[Shri Bhupesh Gupta] trust their own courts misadventure, sometimes by their evil design, and place it in the hands of the courts to sometimes by their absent-mindedness and decide as to whether the fundamental rights sometimes by the combination of all these have been violated or not? Why is the factors these people have made Parliamentary Government shying away from this democracy perish and have left sometimes the proposition even which I supported, I do not shadow of it taking away the substance out of know. it. Guy Fawkes did not kill Parliamentary democracy in the European countries. He Madam, we talk so much about the chapter could only burn the building. But these people, on the fundamental rights. There is a provision these political arsonists, incendiarists, who for enabling the Government to detain people belong to the Congress Party, are burning our without trial. Now there are certain safeguards Parliamentary institution by their criminal acts given in article 22 in case of detention without some of which may not be visible to the public trial. Under emergency the safeguards are at a given time, but others are visible. frozen. Nobody can go to a court of law to ask for the operation of these safeguards or seek remedies under article 22 of the Constitution They are the greatest arsonists and in- with regard to the detention, with regard to the cendiaries of parliamentary democracy. The charge-sheet, with regard to the period of time arsonists certainly require petrol, matchbox during which one can be detained etc. No and so on, and the Emergency powers provide Emergency takes away all these rights. Even them such things. Madam Deputy Chairman, I bail is not accepted by the Government. do not wish to take much timej All that I say is, I know this battle is lost on the floor of the My friend said, well, in times of national House as along as the treasury benches are emergency anti-social and anti-national people occupied by the inheritors of the Emergency must suffer. This is how the dictators talk. If powers. . . one is anti-social there is law to punish him. There is law to punish the anti-national people SHRI JAISUKHLAL HATHI : Occupied by if they are about to commit—or if they whom? commit—any cognisable offence. And, besides, there is the nation to condemn them. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : Occupied by Why are you not accepting it? They would not neglected men like you and arrogant men like accept even that. So from all that the Mr. Morarji Desai. You are neglected. Government have said it is quite clear that they (Interruption) Everybody knows how in this are not interested in making a change. They set-up you are, if you have in mind Mr. have not learnt anything from the past Morarji Desai on the one side, Mr. Chavan on experience. The emergency mentality has the other side and Shrimati Indira Gandhi gripped them; it has corrupted their soul, their smiling all the time meaning nothing. That is understanding and has darkened their vision. the position. So, these are the people. You are That is why they are not in a position to see the people. You do not realise it. We are, some reason. That is why we from this side of therefore, conscious that unless you are the House try to throw some light on what we removed from power, the question of fight consider to be the right thing which they would against the principle of Emergency, the not see. negative, horrid, repel-lant, reactionary principle of Emergency, is precisely fight Madam Deputy Chairman, all of them are against you, is fight for ousting you from ready to vote against this thing. From their positions of authority and power. faces I can read that they are ready to shoot at this Bill when the order comes from the SHRI N. SRI RAMA REDDY (Mysore) : Treasury Benches. I know that is how Speak in the market-place. democracy is ended. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : You are on the SHRI MOHAMMAD YUNUS SALEEM : way out. The only thing is, you do not realise You have no face to talk of democracy. it. Marie Antoinette did not realise that she had SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : If you go ceased to be the Queen of France till the through the history of Parliamentary de- guillotine dropped on her neck. Even when she mocracy you will see that Parliamentary was sitting in the cell, she felt she was the democracy has been ended from within by the Queen of France. Only when the guillotine people who are supposed to protect, nourish it, made such thinking impossible did she cease to and strengthen it. But by their think as the Queen... 4059 Sterilisation of [13 DEC. 1^68] the Unfit Bill , XS 4060

SHRI N. SRI RAMA REDDY : We are THE STERILISATION OF THE UNFIT aware of the Naxalites in this country. BILL, 1964 SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : We do not SHRIMATI SHAKUNTALA wish to use the guillotine. But certainly the PARANJPYE (Nominated) : Madam, I beg to electoral verdict will act as the guillotine and move : we expect the electoral verdict of the people to act as the guillotine as far as you are "That the Bill to prevent the procrea^ tion concerned. I know that your neck is thick of human beings of undesirable physical enough, not easily breakable. But all the and mental conditions by certain types of same, I think our people will see to it that you people be taken into consideration." lose your power. So the question of eliminating this emergency power is the Madam, my friend, Mr. Bhupesh Gupta had question of conquest of political power by the been saying that such and such Bill, of his had left and democratic opposition parties. That is been waiting for 4J years before we took it for how we view this matter. Therefore, Madam, consideration. I can say the same. But My I would end so that the Sterilisation Bill can friend Mr. Bhupesh Gupta has only himself to be taken up. All the time I was also speaking blame if his present Bill waited all this time against sterilisation of democracy which they because it was another Bill of his own, also are doing. Therefore, I think I have also Constitution Amendment Bill, which had spoken on that subject in the larger context. taken, over a year, in this House. Madam, we So I would ask the House to support my Bill. are talking very much about democracy. I Madam, before I sit down, you please say "sit think it is high time that something was done down" and I will sit down. to allow a certain amount of time for every Bill and every Resolution so that all the Bills and THE DEPUTY CHAIRMAN : Now sit all the Resolutions moved by private down. Members, get an opportunity of being discussed in this House. . SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : All right. SHRI N. SRI RAMA REDDY (Mysore) : THE DEPUTY CHAIRMAN : The .... before the Member concerned ceases to be question is : a Member. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA (West Bengal) : "That the Bill further to amend the Speak, speak on the Bill. Constitution of India be taken into consi- deration." SHRIMATI SHAKUNTALA PA- The motion was negatived. RANJPYE : I am going to speak on a Bill which will not interest him. I am going to talk about sterilisation. He is a bachelor.

SHRI ARJUN ARORA (Uttar Pradesh) : He THE CONSTITUTION (AMENDMENT) needs sterilisation, all the more. BILL, 1964 SHRI OM MEHTA (Jammu and Kashmir) : {To amend Article 143) Why not start with Mr. Bhupesh Gupta? SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA (West Bengal) : Madam, I beg your permision to postpone SHRIMATI SHAKUNTALA discussion of the second Bill that stands in PARANJPYE : It is starting at the wrong end. my name, the Constitution (Amendment) He has to get married and give the country Bill, 1964 (to amend article H3)- some of his worthy off-spring before I can speak to him about sterilisation. {Interruption) {No hon. Member dissented) My time is short. I do not think I will be able to THE DEPUTY CHAIRMAN : Consi- say all that I have to say on this Bill to-day. But deration of the Constitution (Amendment) what I am going to say is that this is not the first Bill, 1964 ( to amend article 143), is post- time that a Bill of this content has been moved poned. in this House. I believe it was 12 or 13 years ago that Shrimati Leelavathi Munshi moved an Now we go to the Sterilisation of the exactly similar Bill in this House.. Unifit Bill, 1964. There are only four minutes more. Shrimati Shakuntala Paranj-pye.