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1601 Criminal Law [ 2 MAY 1961 ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1981 1602
SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA; I doubt. 1 was SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I say that you here, the Secretary was here and perhaps did not have any authorisation. Therefore, Shrimati Yashoda Reddy was here but the you could not have thought that Mr. Patil person concerned was not here. Therefore, I could have moved it. think my submission is this that this Bill has lapsed as far as this Session is concerned and MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: You overshot I think, with good grace, the Home Minister your mark. can take it up in the next Session.
SHRI M. P. BHARGAVA: May we know THE CRIMINAL LAW (AMENDMENT) from the hon. Member, under what rule? BILL, 1961 THE MINISTER OF STATE IN TH* MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN; Do you want MINISTRY OF HOME AFFAIRS (SHRI a ruling? B. N. DATAR): Sir, I move:
SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: You seem to "That the Bill to supplement the criminal have made up your mind. Therefore, if you law, as passed by the Lok Sabha, be taken give a ruling against me, I think in public into consideration." interest and in the interest of Parliament, you will administer a severe rebuke to the Sir, I would not deal with the point of order Minister. which you have already overruled but I cannot help making one> observation before I SHRI M. P. BHARGAVA; Where is the deal with the Bill that my hon. friend's occasion? uncalled for impatience to get this Bill MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: There cannot postponed is a pointer in the direction of th« be a point of order in a vacuum. Before I need of this Bill itself. called upon the Home Minister you took all the time and the time ran and it become one SHRi BHUPESH GUPTA (West Bengal): o'clock. Therefore you were absent?
SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: How could you SHRI B. N. DATAR: It is entirely wrong on have called him? the part of the hon. Member to say that. So far as this Bill is concerned, this had to be brought MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Perhaps Mr. forward on account of certain developments, Patil would have moved it, I do not know, but as you are aware, during the last 2 years or so before I could call the Home Minister, you and on a number of occasions, when the Home got up. Ministry's Demands were under consideration or questions relating to the Home Ministry SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: You have raised were under debate either in this House or the an important point. other, a number of hon. Members made the suggestion that something ought to be done MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: You should immediately to sfopThe mischief that was have left it to me. being done, especially in the border areas of India. Now, I need not go into the various SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Perhaps, I agree, happenings that took place during the last 2 or Mr. Patil would have moved the Bill but did 3 years, but suffice it for me to say that apart you have in your possession an authorisation from what others have done, apart from what letter from Shri Lal Bahadur or Mr. Datar? foreigners have done, apart from the foreign periodicals that carried on an insidious MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: It is propaganda, there were unfortunately in India hypothetical. It does not arise now. Mr. Datar. certain persons who did not act as they ought to have, because this was a question, • 1603 Criminal Law [ RAJYA SABHA ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1604 [Shri B. N. Datar.j | India in respect of three matters. in the first instance, of the geogra- I Secondly, it also deals with the removal phical integrity of India and secondly, the of certain persons who are carrying on interests of public welfare and undesirable activities in certain areas security had been greatly involved. which are called notified areas. And Under these circumstances, the Gov- lastly, so far as certain writings and ernment of India had to take certain steps; documents are concerned. Government and so far as the publications, the highly have taken to themselves and they also objectionable publications, that entered give to the State Governments certain India, are concerned, the Government necessary powers for forfeiting all such have some powers under what is known objectionable materials ana their seeing to as the Sea Customs Act and therefore, it that these things are not carried on by by resort to these powers, the the persons. Therefore, as I have pointed Government have prohibited the entry out, this is a supplementary criminal law into India by Sea, land or air, any of the land. literature which is false in itself, which is highly objectionable and damaging to So far as the new offences that have the interests of India. This is so far as the been' created are concerned, may I invite foreign periodicals were concerned but your attention to clause 2 of the Bill here the larger question with which which makes a provision for a new we were unfortunately concerned was offence—the first offence under this the conduct of certain Indians of a party Bill? This clause reads thus: also and therefore the Government had to consider whether in their armoury of "Whoever by words either spoken or criminal law there were sufficient pro- written, or by signs, or by visible visions for stopping these highly un- representation or otherwise, questions desirable activities, unfortunately, of the territorial integrity or frontiers of Indians themselves. That is the reason India in a manner which is, or is likely why in response to an appeal made to be, prejudicial 'to the interests of the by hon Members of this House and -the safety or security of India, shall be other, the Government considered the punishable with imprisonment for a whole question and came to the term which may extend to three years, conclusion that the criminal law as it or with fine or with both." was available was not sufficient, was not adequate, to deal with certain matters Therefore, as I said, this clause makes which had to be dealt with strongly in the provision for a new penal offence, interests of the territorial integrity of namely, the action of those who question India in the first instance and of public the territorial integrity or the frontiers of safety and security in a general manner. India. So far as this question is concerned That is the reason why the Government it is a question of India's national had to consider the whole matter and existence and so far as the executive side after considering the whole matter, is concerned, we are taking care to see the Government came to the conclusion that our frontiers are fully protected and that a supplementary criminal law, a that no act is done by any person to piece of criminal law legislation which is trample under foot, the territorial integrity to be supplementary to the one that we of India. But there are certain persons have already, ought to be passed by who may question the territorial integrity Parliament. So the present Bill was of India and there are certain manners in introduced in the other House and has which all these things are done and so we been duly passed. It has come here for have a provision in this clause, which the approval of this honourable House. states: So far as this Bill is concerned, it "Whoever ...... questions the ter makes provision for certain new ritorial integrity or frontiers of offences. It adds to the penal law of India in a manner which is, or is
1605 Criminal Law r 9 MAV IQRI T 1606
likely to be, prejudicial to the interests of "and thereupon, for so long as the the safety or security of India" notification is in force, such area shall be a notified area for the purposes of this section." This offence can be committed in any part of India and so it has been so generally worded that wherever any person commits such an And this offence is dealt with in subclause (2) offence, he is liable under this clause 2 of the of the same clause. I shall read sub-clause (2). Bill to be punished. Therefore, as I said, this It runs thus: is the first offence and the punishment provided for is three years' imprisonment, or "Whoever makes, publishes or fine or both. circulates in any notified area"— the words "makes, publishes or circulates" may please be specially noted— In the other House, when this Bill was under consideration, objection was taken by "any statement, rumour or report." certain hon. Members that this offence was so serious, that it was of such a serious character These are three expressions which we have that the punishment prescribed under this purposely used and my "hon. friend, Mr. clause was very lenient. All the same, the Mani, objects to the expression "rumour". Government do not wish to be vindictive, Now, what is done by certain persons is that though the process of law and the needs of they make, publish or circulate any statement law have to be fully satisfied. Therefore, this and sometimes, they might even contend that punishment of imprisonment for three it is a rumour which ought not to be relied years—the highest punishment under the upon. But so far as the safety of that area is law— has been duly prescribed. concerned, may I point out to my hon. friend and also to the honourable House that a rumour, especially when that rumour Is Next, I pass on to the next offence which spread, is far more mischievous and far more has Ibeen provided for. In order to understand harmful than any other statement put before that offence, which has been dealt within sub- the public? That is the reason whv the word clause (2) of clause 3, I have to refer first to "rumour" has been purposely used, especially subclause (1) of clause 3 where provision has Th respect of an area like tihe frontier, where been made for declaring certain border areas we have Io deal with large mountainous as notified areas. Therefore, for a proper regions, where the areas are sparsely populat- understanding of the second offence, as ed and where the rumour passes from place to described in sub-clause (2) of clause 3, I shall place. Therefore, it is absolutely essential not have to read the other parts of clause 3 also. only to prohibit such statements but also to Sub-clause (1) of claused reads thus: prohibit the spread or circulation of any rumour and an offender will not be heard in "If the Central Government'considers any court of law to say, "Sir, it was merely a that in the interests of the safety or security rumour which I passed on." To pass on such a of India or in the public interest, it is rumour or to circulate such a rumour is as neeessary or expedient so to do, it may, by harmful and mischievous to the interests of notification in the Official Gazette, declare India as any other act. Perhaps, it is so even to any area adjoining the frontiers of India to a larger extent than the other acts of mischief be a notified area;"— which a man might commit. That is the reason why WP have made a reference to state ments and to rumours. the words " adjoining the frontiers of India" may please be noted— 1607 Criminal Law [ RAJYA SABHA ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1608 [Shri B. N. Datar.] Certain other provisions have been made with regard to the issuing of A statement may be made in a public permits, with regard to exempting certain meeting or it may "Be a written categories of persons from any action statement or it may be a rumour or what under this Bill. Sub-clause (3) deals with can be called a report. For exam, pie, a so-called social worker or a political this. In the other House, this question worker may go and purport to make a was specifically raised as to whether the report. So, the making oi a report is also issue of such a notification is likely to a heinous thing so far as the underlying affect innocent persons who might have object is concerned. So, it is made clear occasion to go there like tourists, like that it is not merely a statement or pilgrims and others. For that purpose, rumour, but also a report that is meant. power has been taken for exempting And these are also qualified by certain certain el&ss of persons. expressions. A description has been given as to which statement, which "... subject to any exemption* for rumour or report is of an objectionable, which provision may be made by a penal character. It should be of a nature notification issued under subsection "which is, or is likely to be, prejudicial (1), no person who was not to the maintenance of public order" in immediately before the said day a that place. As you are aware, if false resident in the area ..." rumours are published, then naturally they will create panic and it will be very This may kindly be noted. The qualifying difficult for the authorities of law and words are these. If a person was not a order to maintain law and order in that resident immediately before of that area, area. That again, therefore, is an offence and if he comes from any part of India, of a serious character which has to be then naturally he comes within the prohibited. Therefore, here it is said: purview of this particular sub-clause. If "prejudicial to the maintenance of public he wants to go there, he shall have to take order or essential supplies". Essential a permit from the authority provided for supplies also are mentioned. That also in the Bill. has to be met. Suppose a false rumour is purposely published or circulated that the arrangements for the supplies are not ". . . in the area declared to be a working properly, or that the notified area by the notification shall Government is not looking after the enter or attempt to enter that area or be interests of the people properly, then therein except in accordance with the that also constitutes, wbat I would say, a terms of a permit in writing granted to menace to the good conditions that have him by a person, not below the rank of to be maintained there. There are certain a magistrate of the first class, specified classes of persons, there are certain in the said notification." parties which are interested in tampering In addition to declaring an area as a with our services, and proper steps will notified area, provision has also been haye to be taken in this respect That is made for the issue of permits in appro- the reason why three purposes have priate cases in respect of a person who been mentioned, and if anything is done was not immediately before a resident of either in respect of maintenance of that area but who wants to go there. public order, essential services or ser- Now, whenever a permit has to be vices in general, then such a statement issued, then all the questions will have to or such a rumour constitutes an action be considered, his antecedents also will which is penal and it has to be duly hav* to be enquired into, and then the punished by law. This is the second type permit might, be granted or might also be of offence which has been provided for refused in appropriate cases. here. 1609 Criminal Law [ 2 MAY 1961 ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 i6l0
Now, Sir, I pass on to the sub-clause (4), The other precautionary steps that where provision has been made for the Government will have to take is mentioned in search of such a person, entering or clause 4: attempting to enter, or being in, or leaving, a notified area. I need hardly say that the "(1) Where any newspaper or book as search has to be comprehensive and the defined in the Press and Registration of vehicle or conveyance by which he cornea Books Act, 1867, or any other document, will also have to be duly searched. It has wherever printed, appears to the State Gov- been provided, in respect of women, that ernment to contain any matter the no woman shall be searched in pursuance of publication of which is punishable under this sub-clause excep: by a woman section 2 or sub-section (2) of section 3, the authorised in this behalf by the police State Government may . . ." officer. The provision for substantive offence comes in after the sub-clause dealing The word "document" has been defined in the with the power to remove this person Bill. I need not read the other portions. The physically from that area. Sub-clause (5) State Government will have the power of makes provision for this. If any person is in a forfeiting all such documents or copies and notified area in contravention of the can also make a search by entering into a building wherever it is necessary. This ia an provisions of sub-clause (3) then, additional provision just as we have made without prejudice to any other pro- provision for the issue of a notification, of ceedings, that means, action can be taken granting permission in proper cases to a against him in a court of law for the person who is not a resident in this area. This punishment of the offence that he has provision is very important so far as the committed, he may be removed from there by prevention of mischief is concerned. or under the direction of any police officer. DIWAN CHAMAN LALL (Punjab): This DR. W. S. BARLING AY (Maharashtra): refers only to printed documents but what May I ask a question for the sake of happens if they are written by hand and clarification? cyclostyled? SHRI B. N. DATAR: I shall consider that. MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: After he finishes his speech. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Do not provoke him. SHRI B. N. DATAR: Would not the hon. Member like to wait till I finish my speech? SHRI B. N. DATAR: I believe it would come under "document" if I mistake not. I shall, The substantive offence is dealt with in however, look into it-Forfeiture has been sub-clause (6): referred to in clause 4. There is a further "If any person enters or attempts to provision, sub-section (3), which says, 'In enter a notified area or is therein in subsection (1) "document" includes also any contravention of any of the provisions of painting, drawing or photograph, or other sub-section (3), he shall be punishable visible representation.' with imprisonment for a term, which may extend to one year, or with fine, or with SHRT BHUPESH GUPTA: Suppose both". if is written in invisible ink? SHRI B. N. DATAR: Let the hon. Thus, Sir, you will find that in subclauses (2) and (3), provision has been made to Member hold himself in patience. meet three type* of offences, one under sub-clau=c (2) and two under sub-clause (3). I6II Criminal Law [RAJYA-SABHA] (Amdt.) F . 1612 [Shri B. N. DatStr.]" . law is concerned? But I shall examine this 3 P.M. point.
In clause 5 a provision has been made for SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Truth will not be approaching the High Court in revision. defence? Whenever any such order of forfeiture has been passed in respect of any document, SHRI B. N. DATAR: Not merely the then the ends of justice require that th? spreading of the so-called truth, it may be matter ought to go to the High Court and that garbled truth, it may be partial truth but the also has been provided for. The clause says: most objectionable thing is the manner in which it is done. I would submit, Sir—I am "Any person having any interest in any subject to, correction—that even il' there is an newspaper, book or other document in element of truth here and there, that will not respect of which an order of forfeiture has necessarily be a defence, much less an been made under section 4 may, within offective defence in an two •months from the date of such order, action under sub-clause (2). apply to the High Court to set aside such order on the ground that the issue of the newspaper, or the book or other document Now, Sir, I' would pass on to the in respect of which the order was made did circumstancas and the manner in which not contain any matter of such a nature as propaganda is being carried on. Before that," is referred to in sub-section (1) of section with regard to'the point that my hon. friend has 4." raised, if even the expression of truth is prejudic'al to the interests of security, then I am' afraid truth will not be a defence* at all. So, you will find these arie the main provisions of this Bill. Sir, hon. Members are entitled to ask about the type of propaganda that is carried on by DR. W. S. BARLING AY; May I now ask certain parties. My hon. friend's party, Shri a question? It is only with a view to getting Bhupesh Gupta's party naturally comes very .some clarification. If the hon. Minister prominently into this picture and therefore we refers to clause 3(2), it reads: have to consider the type of propaganda that this party—and it is quite likely other parties "Whoever makes, publishes or also— might carry on; it is not a question of circulates in any notified area any likely, it is just positive that the party or others statement, rumour or report which is, or is might give some other name with a view to likely to 'be, prejudicial to the placing people off the guard. Therefore, it is maintenance of public order or essential that all such persons, all such parties, who supplies ..." carry.on such things will become liable under this clause. The point that I want to be clarified is this. Suppose the statement or rumour or report, Now, I would mention the type of whatever it is, is true; will that be a defence propaganda that is done. As I have pointed to a prosecution under this clause? out, this is an area of long distances, of mountainous regions, and it is possible to SHRI B. N. DATAR: My hon. friend has spread false rumours here and to carry on asked the question as to whether truth is a propaganda in a manner which perhaps complete defence. May I point out to him according to them might ,-uit their that in civil cases truth is a complete defence convenience but which would barm the so far as tort is concerned but I am afraid it interests of the nation. I won't go into the may not b« so so far as the criminal question of India and China because that has been discussed h«re on a number 1613 Criminal Law p&'-MAY 1961 ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1614 of occasions but I would summarise as against India's policy. In fact, the Prime briefly as possible the type of subtle, Minister has on a number of occasions pointed insidious propaganda tliat is cairied on. In out how he is anxious to enter into what can the first place, they^ say - that China has be called an honourable .compromise in a not committed any .aggression at all. spirit o.f peace and harmony but all the same this false propaganda is being carried on that India is not ready while the other country is SHRI P. N. SAPRU (UttarPradesh): India ready for settling this matter by compromise. has committed aggression, not China.. That Then my hon. friend will always bring in the is what they say. Congress Party in time, out of time, in place and out of place and I was amazed to find that Sam B. N. DATAR: I am just coming in the amendments that he has proposed he to that, if the hon. Member waits a little. They has brought in the Congress Party as well. say that China has not committed any Now, the propaganda is that the Congress aggression and then they say that India'' has Party tries to divert the people's attention from committed aggression. Then they further say its own mis-government and . to win the —they put it in a general way—that so far as general elections of 1962. May I point out to India's territorial borders are concerned, they my hon. friends that this propaganda is not of are not fixed at all. In the first place their today? It is being carried on by these friends case is that there is no aggression at or these parties for a number of months, if not all; secondly, they say that there is for a year o* two, when people were not aggression by India and inconsistently enough thinking of any general elections at ajl? It is they say further that the bor-. der has not only recently that the general elections are been properly demarcated. This is one type of appearing on the hori-zon but long before that propaganda that is being carried on. Then, all these allegations were being made. China, they say, is a socialist country. It may or may not be socialist; we are not -concerned with it. It is perfectly open to them to call it Then, Sir, as you are aware the Dalai Lama whatever they like but they want to assure the has been given shelter here. That itself is people that China will never invade India as no misrepresented and they say that the Dalai socialist country will commit aggression. Lama i§ under the influence of Western impe- Now, I would not go into the theoretical or rialism. These are all catchy expressions ideological aspect of this, but taking the which we find abundantly not only in other conditions as they are, it would be entirely writings but in my hon. friends' speeches here wrong to say that a country is a socialist on the floor of this House. They say that the country in the first instance and then to draw, Dalai Lama is under the influence of Western what some of these people want us to believe, a imperialism and the Government ought not to conclusion and an inference that they would keep him in India. Then they say that the never commit aggression because they are areas in Tibet under the control of China have bound by that particular ideology. It is for progressed much more than the frontier areas the House to see whether there is any such of India. The progress in Tibet has been ideology in the first instance, whether it is of possible only by following the socialist such a type as to protect India against system. Whether that system is bedng aggression and whether they would or would followed, I would not discuss the question not do these things. Another thing which they here. These are some of the points that they say is this. China wants the dispute to be settled have made and they want to take advantage of amicably but the Government do not desire this. the so-called neglect of the fron- This is directly a charge 16I5 Criminal Law [ RAJYA SABHA ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1616 [Shri B. N. Datar.J tiers. In the first aware, and the honourable. Housa is place, our frontiers -were never neglected. aware of the type of insidious propaganda, highly harmful propaganda, and I may add anti- national and unpatriotic propaganda that is SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I am glad that the Home Minister has come. Let him save unfortunately being carried on by the sons of the Minister of State from the irrelevancies. our own soil. That is the most unfortunate part of it and that is the reason why the MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Order, order. Government have had to bring forward a Bill Let him continue. for the purpose of preventing the perfor- mance of such actions. And where they SHRI B. N. DAT AR: Whatever is have been actually done by overt acts, then inconvenient is irrelevant to my hon. friend. naturally they have to be punished. They have to be brought before a court of law. After SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Is Tibet relevant the whole thing is considered, the court of here? law might come to the conclusion that this is an offence, if the offence ha3 been committed, on SHRI B. N. DATAR: Then, there are other the basis ot the evidence that is led before instances which I need not make reference to. the court of law. If it is satisfied that any I nee'd not also point out how attempts are one of the offences is committed hy the being made t0 magnify so-called small accused, then naturally you will agree that grievances and to organise certain classes of such a person has to be punished in the people not only against the' Government of interests of the security of India, the safety of India, but against the integrity of India itself. India, and may I add, the sacredness of the That is the most unfortunate part, a very sorry border of India. It is for this purpose that this part of the whole affair. Bill has been brought forward and I am quite confident that hon. Members of this Then, Sir, they say that India's maps are House will lend their full support to the incorrect. That means necessarily by provisions of this Bill in view of the great implication that the maps given by China are national stakes involved herein. quite correct. That is the reason why we have to make it an offence, as I have pointed out, The question was proposed. namely, any person who questions the SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Mr. Deputy territorial integrity of India becomes an Chairman, I rise to oppose this Bill . . . offender under this Bill. It is only for this purpose that it has been done. SHRI P. D. HIMATSINGKA (West Bengal): Naturally.
Then,' Sir, there are various other instances SHKI BHUPESH GUPTA because I think it where the Prime Minister is personally and is wholly unwarranted by facts and unjustified most undeservedly attacked. There are •ome by moral considerations today. We have heard papers and some writings where it has almost the speech of the Minister of State in the been stated that the Prime Minister has made Ministry of Home Affairs. Towards the end of statements which are inaccurate, which are his speech he was saying so many things as if absolutely wrong. In fact, I would say even the everything is relevant to the provisions of the word 'false' is there, because the expresion Bill or comes within the mischie* of this used is 'jhooth'. I would not go into all these measure. But then the Minister of State in the things further, since the House is fully aware Ministry of Home Affairs is a gallant person of their outbursts through other sources. The and he has to do a bit of fighting here. Right Government are at 1617 Criminal Law [ 2 MAY 1961 J (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1618 the outset I wish to say that we are not dishonest beoause the real motive of the Bill discussing this thing in a border. Nor you, is closed, is disguised. The real motive of the Sir, are a border guard. Therefore, let us Bill is to indulge in political persecution of discuss it somewhat dispassionately, certain sections of democratic public opinion objectively and on merits. in the country. Since he did not name Now, Sir, at the outset I should make a anybody, Ineed not name anybody here few things clear. I can well understand either. This is the intention of the Bill. genuine patriotic concern for the territorial Another intention of the Bill is to intimidate integrity of our country and I fully share certain sections of the people and to that concern. Now, this is not the issue at all. give concessions to certain other sections As I proceed I shall show how this Bill has of the people. I call it cowardly because this something else in mind. And the Bill is so is a concession to the Rightist elements in the worded that it does not say all these things, I country who have been clamouring for some believe, but even so, Home Minister in kind of action against the Communist Party another place had to say that this was an ex- and other forcea like the Communist traordinary measure containing certain harsh Party, with a view to disrupting and provisions. I like Shri Lal Bahadur Shastri, dividing the broad democratic movement in because he believes in plain speaking. And the countrj'. This is a coneess'on. And the h that matter he spoke plainly, although hon. Minister was right in saying that some he sought to justify his measure. It is not people in either House demanded it. I counted his baby, but a baby handed to him to be them from the proceedings of both the Houses. nursed and reared. I am sorry for Shri Lal You can count them on your fingers. A few Bahadur Shastri. He might have been given people have demanded it. And if you go into a better assignment when he came to the the names of those persons, you will find that Ministry of Home Affairs. This Bill has a most of them belong to those sections of oublic different purpose. The intention of this life which assail the foreign policy of the Bill is entirely different. And I make Government of India, castigate the Prime bold to say that it is irresponsible, dishonest Minister for having adopted this foreign and cowardly. I say irresponsible because policy and seek to discredit the foreign policy extraordinary powers are being given to the of the country. Such are the people, the Rightist executive and to the police officers to elements. I can add to his knowledge by play fast and loose with the liberties and rights saying that a measure of this kind is already of the people. In fact, we know 'hat it will acclaimed outside India by the imperialists and be grossly abused. We have had the professional anti-communists. Therefore, experience of many such measures. the Home Minister, at least the Minister of Therefore, the hon. Mem'bers, who may State in the Ministry of Home Affairs, is in think that it is ncit so bad, will bear it in mind such a good company that way. Choose that it is liable to be grossly abused. your company as you like. But I may say Even if you assume that there are certain that this is a company which according to our things which can be justified in it, I do not foreign policy at least yon should avo'd. assume it, because the measure will be Therefore, this is the measure that we are deal- administered not by the hon. Members of this ing with and I would ask the hon. Members House, nor even by Shri Datar but will be to consider it on merits. Now, they think that by administered by the Superintendents of passing this measure they would be able to Police, by the Police Inspectors and placate 'hose who are criticising them from the Sub-Inspectors and by the C.I D. men who rightist position. They think that by passing did not know hew to present a report about this measure they would be in a position to the Assam riots and kept the Government take the wind out absolutely in the dark. It is 1619 Criminal haw [ RAJYA SABHA ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1620 [Shri Bhupesh Gupta.] of the sails,of Right have been talking all these things that you reaction and pretend to the country as if they have been talking here. I take it that those who are the fighters. But then you are undermining stand for the defence of the foreign policy and the principle. You are appeasing the hands the strengthening of it would not mind that that will smite you, not today, maybe there should be common efforts to defend it, tomorrow.-We have seen that appeasement would not like to see the forces that defend the of'this nature in the political life of the foreign policy oi the Government of India country leads not to better development in dissipated and disrupted by the machinations political life but leads to serious, bad and manoeuvres of the forces of reaction. This development and. to the ftengthening and is a pertinent question to ask. Therefore, when emboldening of the forces of reaction. I am these hon. Members opposite will support this sorry.that the Congress Party should have measure, I will have Tio personal grudge done this thing. against them; I will argue with them. It is But then, Sir, I know that many Members these hon. Members particularly I wish to perhaps in this House will be supporting this address today, because I think they should not measure. I do not put them in the same at least misunderstand our position, .they category. Among them there are peopie who should not permit themselves to be carried are professional anti-Communists. They cannot away by the malicious, mischievous, lying, go to hed-without running down the disgraceful propaganda that is indulged in by Communists. The dream of their dreams is certain sections in the country, reactionary how to hit the Communist Party. Anti- sections. Communism is their article of faith. But Now, Sir, I am reading out from a letter there are others who are right-minded people written to the "Times of India", dated the 27th who rightly support the foreign policy of the April, by Shri J. P. Narayan. Nobody will say Government, who may be upset by the that he is friendly to the Communists. He does developments that have taken place in the not take kindly to the Communists, and he border but who stand for decencies in writes about the Indo-China border dispute: public life and the stand of the Prime Minister for the solution of the problem peacefully. "May I add at this point that a mattor like To these people I can say that they have this should not be made into a football to been somewhat misled. They are not be kicked about in the game of party misled, they are very eminent and intelligent politics." people. They have permitted themselves to be carried away by the passions of the moment, This is what Shri J. P. Narayan said. You by the prejudices of Ihe moment or certain know Shri J. P. Narayan, and you know what wrong presuppositions. Some of them do not view he takes of the Communists in many even have prejudices. I do not call them matters, btrt he does say that this matter is anti-Communist. I am" sorry that being kicked about like football by certain today a situation has arisen when the people. I do not say that Shri Lal Bahadur is foreign policy of the Government is assailed the centre forward. I do not say that at all. But and attacked outside by the forces of Right it is a fact that this issue is being used as a reaction—and that voice will soon be heard football by some people, maybe our P.S.P. in this House—and that those who support the friends are the centre forward and the half foreign policy of the Government should have backs are the Swatantra Party. I do not see permitted themselves to be so divided in a who is the goalkeeper, but Shri Lal Bahadur is situation like this. The Government is helping becoming the goal-keeper. I would ask him that process. Sir, you might say, what is after not to be Ihe goal-keeper. He is not of that all the Communist Party? Well, if the type. Even if he says Communist Party were not a force, then you would not 1621 Criminal Law [ 2 MAY 1961 ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1622 wrong things against me, even if Re attacks DIWAN- CHAMAN LALL: Then why are me, I know I would never put him in the same you worried about this measure? category as I would put some other people. We are not carried away by temporary SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I v/ill tell you. I passions like some hon. Members opposite. lenow, I know. 1 have to convince you. I We judge people by their whole behaviour, by know why I am worried about it. I am coming their entire policies, by their entire attitude in to that. You are saying so many things against life, by their entire posture in the political life us. These I repudiate, these are not true. of the country, and not by what they may say "Satyameva Jayale" is written there, and at a given moment under certain stress of falsehoods and lies are trotted out on the floor circumstances. of the House in the name of protecting the integrity of the country. Is this the way in Now, Sir, as far as the position of the which we are going to behave in our public Communist Party is concerned, that is my life? If there is anyone who can come with Party, I knew what would come and I came concrete facts, with concrete evidence, let us ready for it. That was done in the other place, discuss it, and we shall make amends for it, and here Mr. Datar did not take the name of but not because it is vaguely alleged the party in the beginning but then went on as somewhere something had been written. if he might be commiting a great sin if he did Where? Who? What? Nothing. Because I, Mr. not take the name of the party, and therefore Datar, by the grace of the Prime Minister, the he brought in the name of the party, and then Minister of State in the Ministry of Home he was full of utter irrelevances. Anyway I Affairs, have decided to make the allegation, think the matter should be set at rest. I would and the allegation shall pass.' That shall not invite the attention of the House to a pass. This is what I say on the floor of this resoiution passed by the National Council of House. Therefore, let us be clear about this our party last February at Delhi, and there it is thing. stated: Sir, no responsible party or citizen in the country would go against the integrity of our "The Communist Party of India has country, more "especially when we have just already declared in the Meerut Resolution won our independence. The only occasion in that it upholds the traditional border in the the recent period when the integrity of India western sector and the MacMahon Line as was defied and disregarded was when the the de facto boundary in the eastern Central Government and tbe Prime Minister gave on a platter a part of the Berubari Union sector." to Pakistan. But since the Prime "Minister was concerned and he gave it, the Constitution was This is what we have stated. Now, this much amended fo validate an invalid act, to legalise is stated there, and our activities are guided by an invalid act. Even we have criticised the the stand we have taken up. Whatever you Prime- Minister, we have never questioned his may say about us, we are a disciplined party. bona fides. He had done it mistakenly, perhaps We discuss and debate, but once we take a he was wrongly advised, but he had done it, as decision, we consider it a matter of honour to we say, even in the midst of very strong criti- stand by that decision. I can declare on the cism. He had done it in the belief that it was floor of the House that there is not one necessaryri,& do so to settle the border dispute between West Bengal and Assam on Communist anywhere tn ihe country who is - not adhering to the resolution or implementing the one hand and East Pakistan on the" other. the resolution that J have just read out. He had done so in the expectation that that 1623 Criminal Law [ RAJYA SABHA ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1624 [Shri Bhupesh Gupta.] should toe given to Pakistan to settle the would lead to the betterment of relations dispute, suppose he had said this, well, he between India and Pakistan. We did not come would have come uqder the mischief of this down upon the Prime Minister or assail him. measure. I know that he would not have been There were others who did not support him, arrested because he is the Prime Minister. who did not support this measure and who Suppose Acharya Kripalani was the Prime took advantage of this act on the part of the Minister and Jawaharlal Nehru was in the Prime Minister to assail and attack him opposition benches and this measure waa in publicly and question his good faith, question force, would he not have been arrested? He his bona fides. But we never did it. Let it be would have been arrested. But people may known. Assuming . . . give optfttons. Howwdo you take them like that? I shall come to that point.
DT;. H. N. KUNZRU (Uttar Pradesh): You were attacking him all right; you attacked the But I am making this point very clear that Prime Minister all right. when we deal with a matter, we must go into the heart of the problem. Therefore, the integrity of India has never been challenged SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: We did not and I would show how it has not actually been attack him. Dr. Kunzru. When we attack, we threatened by our people, by any party—well, do it. I do not know if there is any surreptitious party—by any party which is functioning DB. H. N. KUNZRU: You did it in this openly or by any right-minded citizen. Why is House. a sort of bogey being created about it? They do so because there are certain otfiar SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: But I never objectives in their minds. questioned his bona fides. No, no. Of course, I criticised him. You sometimes criticise Now, let me come to the genesis of-the Bill. him. That is very important. He made some reference to it. Some Members demanded it. SHRI MAHESWAR NAIK (Orissa): Yen So they got men. We could not help it. We did come out with the truth. not like it. They were Hamlets in this matter, half-consenting and half-not-consenting. Then when approaches were made, they fell in for SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: What can I do? it. They permitted themselves to be reduced, Sometimes the hon. Member is relevant and I First of all, it dJes not speak well of a like relevancy. government-What did you do? What was your stand? Then let me come to the next point. He The point is that I criticise him. I agree. Dr. did not recite it, he just mentioned some Kunzru is a respected person. He is not like people. In August and September the matter Mr. Datar who says something which is not came up in this House and in the other House absolutely very good, which has no evidence also and later on on November 21 also it came or proof. He is right. I criticise him I agree. up. And an anti-Communisit hysteria was But I never question his bona fides. That is sought to be roused by some people and as far there in the proceedings of the House. On the as I can see. on the 21st of November in the contrary, I said that we supported the Nehru- other House, Shri Ram Subhag Singh asked: Liaquat Pact. Now, suppose this measure was "May I know whether the Government there before and the Prime Mmlr.tar under those circumstances had made a statement publicly at a meeting that in his opinion part of the Berubari Union 1625 Criminal Lav [ 2 MAY 1961 ] (Amdt.) Bill 1961 1626
intend to introduce any measure to put a curb tary of the Communist Party wrote to the on guch activities in the entire area?" and Prime Minister: Shrimati -Renu Chakra-vartty on behalf of the "Shri Jawaharlal Nehru, Prime Communist Party just got up and said: "That Minister, Government of is the main point." Well, it went on. An India, New Delhi. adjournment motion came up. K discussion took place. Now allegations have been made Dear Sir, and these allegations form the basis of it. Some pf these allegations have been proven In your speech in the Lok Sabha on 31st to be untrue, to be" Incorrect. Let us come to August, 1960 you referred to "The New Age" what happened in this House. weekly, the organ of our Party and stated that "The New Age" has carried on a consistent, a In August last year the Prime Minister made blatant, a pernicious and a false propaganda certain allegations in this House. He said—he on this issue . . ." was replying to the debate on foreign affairs— something against the paper "New Age". That is the India-China border issue— When f asked him to substantiate that allegation, he merely mentioned the thing and "Earlier in the Rajya Sabha on the 18th left it at that and said something against the August, you had said: Communist Party. Then when the matter came up again in the Lok Sabha a few days after, " 'The New Age' has been carrying on Comrade Mukerjee similarly challenged it and not only unpatriotic but a most anti- he could not adduce an evidence. He made a national campaign." broad statement that he had said this thing in the Rajya Sabha anti that he was saying it in In the course of the above debate on the the Lok Sabha. There again "New Age" was foreign affairs, you had also referred to the mentioned. When the Prime Minister made activities of the Communists in the border allegations against the major opposition party areas. Naturally we take a very serious view in the country and on the floor of Parliament, of these charges. I would request you to we naturally took it seriously not from any inform me which particular item in "The New narrow point of view, but from a broad point Age' you object to."— of view. Our Central Executive was seized Of the entire matter and we considered the state- Underline the words "which particular item ment made by the Prime Minister in this you object to." House and in the other House. And after that our General Secretary was instructed to write a "I also request you to inform us about letter to the Prime Minister to find out from the specific facts relating to Party members' him exactly what was his complaint. We were activities in the border areas." not clear about the complaint the Prime Minister had in mind because we have great We asked if the Prime Minister had taken respect for the Prime Minister. And when he exception to any passage in it— let us point made certain allegations, we natura-ally out—and if we were wrong, we would correct wanted to find out first from him and after ourselves. And he was also saying something hearing from him, we thought that on the basis about party members. We had hundreds of of what he said we would be holding an thousands of members and sympathisers of enquiry. And this is what the General Secre- the party who would like to know if he had anybody in mind. That letter was dated the 16th September, 1960. Then we. received a reply from the Secretary to the Prime Minister dated the 18th 1627 Criminal Law [ RAJYA SABHA ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1628 [Shri Bhupesh Gupta ] September, 1960, or some such thing occurred. One may or may that is from Mr. K. Ram: not like some of the criticisms in these articles, or some of the explanations or some of these "Dear Sir. things said in these articles. But I challenge here—papers are there in this Library—there The Prime Minister has read your letter is not one article in any issue of New Age dated September 16, 1960. He has asked me which questions the integrity, the territorial to tell you that it is not merely an item here integrity, of our country. That is point No. 1., and there in "The New Age' weekly which he There is not one article which any fair-minded had in mind, but repeated articles and big man, if he is not prejudiced politically against headlines, all intended to give an impression our party, would say is anti-national. There is that China was right and that India was wrong not one article or a group of articles—very few in regard to the frontier disputes. A reference appeared in that entire period—which would to many issues of 'The New Age' in the course substantiate the charge that New Age was of the last two or three months . . ."— running an anti-national campaign. Therefore, Sir, I say the Prime Minister, as sometimes Hon. Members will kindly note the' words happens with him, was misinformed. I thought "last two or three months"— that after the departure of Mr. M. O. Mathai he "will indicate this. The Prime Minister has would be better advised, but it seems that no time to read all these issues, and he is those who advise him today do not care to going out of Delhi tomorrow."— read things carefully and advise him properly for which they place the Prime Minister in a At that time I think he was leaving, abroad— position where he has to make a statement "As for the activities of some which he cannot substantiate even after being Communists in the border areas, the Prime written to by the General Secretary of the Minister mentioned the particular districts Communist Party of India. concerned. His information was based on SHRI N. SRI RAMA REDDY (Mysore): reports of speeches made in these border The hon. Member made a speech on the areas. international affairs in reply to the Prime Yours faithfully, Sd. K. Ram." Minister's speech. Did he ever condemn the action, .of China in his speech here in this Now, we got this letter. Light was :£
"How could the police report on what Now Shri Krishna Bhatt is the third name, transpired at a meeting of the District and here I am sorry to say that we do not. know Executive Committee where none but of any such person as being a member of the members can be present? I c^ti definitely Communist Party. Have you started recruiting state that the border jssue was n»t at all members for our party? Well, Sir, I have been discussed in the one of the members of the present leadership of ~said meeting. As for my stand on the border the party and I can tell you that we do not have issue it is entirely guided by the Meerut on our membership rolls any-such gentleman as Resolution of the National Council of the Shri Krishna Bhatt. They seem to be Party"— that was our earlier Resolution; discovering members itor the Communist Party. we had not passed the Delhi Resolution— I should request Mr. Datar: "Please do not do " which stands for peaceful so. We can look after ourselves and recruit *~ and honourable settlement of the dispute. I members on our own." And that gentleman, I have expressed my views on these lines am told made a certain other statement. not only in numerous public meetings all Naturally, when his name was mentioned, not over West Bengal but also in the Assem- being as Communist, he got more funky.. At bly last year. I think the said Intelligence least we would not be so funky. but perhaps he report is actuated by the pernicious motive got more funky. Therefore, you misfired, of discrediting me in particular, because I utterly misfired in respect of all the three happen to enjoy wide popularity and names. respect in all sections of public including many Congressmen in Darjeeling district." Now, Sir, look at what will happen to our country ;f such are the advisers of the Prime And I can tell you, every word he says is Minister, such are people who prepare true. He raised this point on the floor of the confidential ports for the Prime Minister, on Assembly to repudiate the charge, and the which, major policy decisions are taken, or Speaker of the West Bengal Assembly was Bills formulated, of the kind that we have good enough to give him a chance to repu- today. Shri Lal Bahadur 1633 Criminal Law [ 2 MAY 1961 ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1634 Shastri is a good man, a lovable person. We know how many of these constituent States of only request him to pay a little attention to his India demanded that for the sake of border Intelligence service, because it seems that security or for the territorial integrity a some people belonging to his Intelligence measure of this kind would be needed. How service, sitting in their homes after coming many States wrote to the Central Government from a cinema, write reports about advising them that a measure of this kind Communist Party meetings. Naturally, things should be passed? Not one, Sir. I say not one. are fabricated because here, again, the salary If Mr. Datar perchance says that it is all goes on production basis. It does not matter wrorig, 1 should ask him on honour to whether you produce falsehood or truth but produce the letters before the House, before production must be there. Therefore, this ig you, Sir, with proper dates and so on, so that the position. we can compare whether now or before the Bill was formulated any State in India, whose Now, these are the slants given to border touches a foreign country, had ever the situation on the border. Here written to the Government of India asking again I would argue with Shri Lal them for a measure of this kind. I said that Bahadur, because today be may ■ not none wrote. And yet the Central Government, see, tomorrow he will see my point. because some people in Parliament made a There may be subjective reasons for noise, some sections of the press, wrote this measure rightly or wrongly, I do something, had to conceive a measure of this not go into it. Some people may feel kind and deliver the child here. Such genuinely also that some measure has is the position. to be taken with a view to protecting .... the integrity of India. There may also be others who may think that Now, Sir, let me come to the points one by this measure would give them a good one, I am giving you official evidence. First ammunition to strike at the Commu of all, take it that other evidence is not there. nists, to carry on anti-communist pro Generally, it happens that when the situation paganda, to rouse feelings of prejudice becomes serious, the State Government writes against the Communist Party. But to the Centre asking for Central legislation. In these are subjective considerations. this case it was not done. And what else is re- The question is: Is there any objective quired to prove that there was no objective justification for a measure of this justification for a measure of this kind? kind? This we have to deduce from the facts of life, from the realities of Then, Sir, let me come to the State of West the national situation. Sir, I submit Bengal, Dr. B. C. Roy. Is he a Communist? before you that the objective situation No. He is not a Communist. He is the tough does not justify the promulgation of a anti-communist Chief Minister of West measure of this kind. First let me Bengal. When Mr. Sanjiva Reddy, after his state why I say so because I want to visit to Calcutta, mentioned something about convince a reasonable map like Shri the bad border situation or activities on the ]Lal Bahadur. , border in West Bengal, Dr. B. C. Roy, who knows how to look after himself better than many people who pretend to look after him, Sir, there are a number of States whose immediately said that it was all wrong. There border touches foreign countries. For was nothing. He repudiated the Congress example, there is Assam, there is West President's statement. Bengal, there is Rajasthan, there is Uttar Pradesh, Punjab, Jammu and Kashmir, leave DR. H. N. KUNZRU: All wrong? alone the Manipur territory or Himachal Pra- desh. Now, they touch variously the borders of Burma, Nepal, China and Pakistan. Am I right or am I wrong? I am right. Now, I would like to 1635 Criminal Law [RAJYA SABHA ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1636
SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: When Mr. held his press conference and the newsmen Sanjiva Reddy accused the Communist Party bombarded him with questions about activities of certain activities or some wrong activities in the border and he said in plain language on the border, Dr. B. C. Roy, that tough man, that there was no Communist activity nor said, "I know my State and I know that there were there any Communists in the district. I is no such thing as has appeared in the press". have given you the name of the District Mr. Sanjiva Reddy must have felt Magistrate and the date of his press embarrassed. conference. It was said by the District Again, when a Jana Sangh member raised a Magistrate and not anybody else. question in the Lucknow Assembly of Now, let me come to the Prime Minister certain alleged activities of Communists and himself. On the 21st of November in the Lok others in the border area, Dr. Sampurnanand, Sabha he made a statement which is the then Chief Minister, stood up on the floor of significant. When people were shouting about the House to say that enquiries had revealed the activities of the Communists in the border that there were no such activities. Then, Sir, areas, he made one thing clear and I am later on, as you know, Mr. Sanjiva Reddy quoting him. The Prime Minister said: himself said that there was no truth in it. He toured Himachal Pradesh extensively and "... But there is no question after returning to Simla he met pressmen. He of insecurity in our border area or toured, to be exact, from the 17th to 30th of subversion being noticeable in September. He told them that the border those areas." there was not a live border. To whom did he Therefore, you see, Sir, that in order say that? To the paper called "Challenge" to give you an idea of the situation in the published from Simla, edited by Mr. J. N. Kaul, border areas I have not only quoted a the local secretary of the Tibetan Committee magistrate, I have quoted the Prime Minister, I and Camping Organiser of the anti-communist have quoted two Chief Ministers and I camps in that area. The paper published have also quoted Mr. Sanjiva Reddy saying from Simla and edited by him published the that the Himachal Pradesh border was not interview of Mr. Sanjiva Reddy in which he a live border at all. I have also quoted the paper said that there were no political activities "Challenge" edited by a very well-known anti- in the border area. Can I produce communist. Such is the position. Therefore, any better evidence in my favour or for my one has to ask what has happened since then. proposition than the one that I produce in this These relate to last year and since then what particular case? has happened? Has the situation deteriorated Then, Sir, take another case after that. Here since then so much as to justify the sponsoring again, there is a newly-created district of Uttar of this Bill in this House? I submit, Sir, the Kashi. The District Magistrate of Uttar Kashi situation, if anything, has improved. The held a press conference where he was situation was never bad that way. It was built bombarded with questions about the situation up when they talked about all kinds of things in the border area and the District Magistrate against the Communist Party, but in of Uttar Kashi said that there was nothing like actual fact the border was not that way that; there was no such prejudicial activity in threatened. the border area. Since Shri Lal Bahadur would Now, internally from within the country be asking for other reports from his advisers, I nobody was carrying on activities against the thought I should better tell him so that he can integrity of the check up. On the 31st October, the District country. Now, it has im-4 P.M. Magistrate, Mr. Ushapati Bhatt proved and yet we find the Bill before us. I could have 1637 Criminal Law [ 2 MAY 1961 ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1638 anderstood it if, since that time, the dur, will describe him. The other day in the Government could show that the situation has other House, I was interested to note that he deteriorated or is not as good as it was or if it was saying that somebody's son was a were bad according to them, it has become Communist. I hope he will not say that Dr. B. worse. Then I could have understood the C. Roy's niece is a Communist when I quoted meaning in sponsoring this measure but they Dr. B. C. Roy. Then there is another paper, have not done. They have not given any such Karma Boomi, the oldest and perhaps the most evidence before the House. Therefore, respected weekly of Garhwal, edited by Mr. objectively it is not a fair way to put it like Dhulia, an old Congressman. He protested that. I have given the official evidence. Now, I against this kind oi propaganda being would give some unofficial evidence to justify launched against the Communist Party. There what I am saying and for the consideration of are many fair-minded Congressmen in this the hon. Minister of Home Affairs. This House and outside also. They do not like that evidence I take not from papers which are in for petty political reasons, falsehood should be any way sympathetic to the Communist Party circulated, that a party should be slandered or which may be regarded as sympathetic to and maligned in this manner. There again, he the Communists. I take the Hindi weekly wrote and criticised the "Hindustan Times" of Sarhadi, edited by a Congress M.L.A. from Birlas for having indulged in such Communist Kedarnath constituency. His name is Narendra baiting and anti-Communist propaganda. I Singh Bhandari and on the 25th July 1960, he may mention for the Minister's benefit that in wrote: the issue of 22nd October, he wrote such things. "When some newspapers and responsible political circles began saying that the Then there is another paper called activities and propaganda of the "Satyapath", edited by Lalit Prasad Nithana. Communists in the hilly districts of Uttar He is now called a former General Secretary Pradesh are increasing, at that time with full of the Garhwal District Congress Committee. responsibility we stated that it was incorrect On 22nd June 1960 he wrote in his paper that . . . There are no Communists in the region there is no concrete evidence of any anti- and the couple or so of Communists that are national propaganda by the Communists. I there, are doing no such propaganda that hope that Mr. Datar, who knows everything, harms the country. The Chief Minister of has kindly noted what an ex-Congress the State, Dr. Sampurn-anand had also Secretary of a District had said. stated that it was not true that in the hill districts such literature is being distributed Then perhaps I have left out one important which incite the local populace. Despite this thing about the P. S. P. Here again I would some weekly papers that are published from point out to you what a P. S. P. leader in U. P. the hills and some local officials go on said because I know that our friends of P. S. repeating the baseless and unwarranted P. here might get up against me. Mr. Narayan story about such propaganda. We consider Dutt Tewari, the Deputy Leader of the P. S. P, this unfortunate for we know that there is a in the U. P. Assembly, after a tour of lot in Nazi Propaganda Minister Dr. Pithoragarh, Chamoli and Uttarkashi areas, Goebbels's statement that if a lie is repeated said that all these allegations were not true over and over again, it can be passed off as and they were false. He actually gave an truth." account of the miserable condition of the people there, of the people who lived there He is not a Communist. I do not know and so on. That is what the P.S.P. how our friend, Shri Lal Baha- 1639 Criminal Law [ RAJYA SABHA ] (Amdt.) Bill. 1961 1640 [Shri Bhupesh Gupta.] Deputy Leader said. he did from the border area, he would say I know that my friends of the P. 'S. P. might something about the anti-national activities, like to say things against me but there, their activities directed against the integrity of India Deputy Leader repudiated the false since he is a big man also and something allegations that were made against the against the Communist Party but significantly Communist Party. Sometimes people come to enough, on the 24th of last month, when he the truth and there he said the truth that it was was making a speech in the Lok Sabha, not a the position. I cannot hold the temptation word did he utter about the anti-national because our friends of the P. S. P. will be activities of anybody and it is good that he did attacking us and I anticipate it. The P. S. P. not say anything against the Communist Party. leader there said: There you are. People coming from those areas do not accuse us. Mr. Manabendra Shah "The internal factors which caused did not accuse us. discontent in the area largely flowed from the disappointment of the people whose expectations had not been fulfilled after the DIWAN CHAMAN LALL: But nobody is creation of the border districts. Official accusing you here, if you do not question the propaganda which accompanied the integrity of our borders. formation of these districts had raised hopes of a considerable improvement in their liv- ing conditions Though officers had been SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I know that you posted in the new districts, their offices had will not but some people will do. You are not started functioning." going to come to my rescue later. I need your help and that of all kind persons today This is what the P. S. P. leader said. because we are being unjustly maligned by certain people, small numbers, of course, but PROF. M. B. LAL (Uttar Pradesh): Where loudly and vociferously. Therefore this is the has Mr. Tewari said that the Communists are position. Therefore, I think, that what I have not creating mischief there? said has abundantly made it clear to this House that from non-official evidence and SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: You will say from the official evidence that I have what you have to say but the Deputy Leader mentioned, there is no objective justification of your party said it. for sponsoring a measure of this kind. This is my important submission. You see, I was PROF. M. B. LAL: I stand by every word of shocked—I don't know if you were shocked— it. when Mr. Datar was saying that this Bill was SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Undoubtedly, needed for our national existence. Well, I you are a very right-minded person and I will think such a fatuous utterance should not be see the demonstration of it here. I am looking made from the Treasury Benches, because I forward to it anxiously. After all you are a consider our national existence to be professor, Mr. Lai, and I have great respect something much stronger, much nobler and for you. much bigger than to be spoken of in this manner, as though if Mr. Datar had not Another important non-official authority I brought forward this Bill, our national will quote. Shri Mana-bendra Shah, the existence would disappear and that the nation representative in Lok Sabha from Tehri would go out of existence altogether. Do not Garhwal made a speech on this Bill and one speak like that. Say that you need this Bill to vould have expected that coming as beat up some people, to arrest 1641 Criminal Law [ 2 MAY 1961 ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1642 .some people, and do nol try to make it look indulge in such kinds of statements. I read as if such a Bill is needed ior our national Shri Lal Bahadur Shastri's speech—moderate, existence. Our national existence is something soft and persuasive. But being in the Home far stronger than what you would make it by Ministry, he is interested in getting the Bill statements of this kind. I do hope the hon. through. But I read it very carefully and it Minister of State in the Ministry of Home showed the quality of the man. I do agree it Affairs would choose his words in such a way shows the quality of the man, because he is that at least outside they do not give a wrong not provoked to make things look ridiculous impression. or to make wild allegations. He even paid a tribute to a speaker, to Shri Indrajit Gupta, Sir, when I heard him, I was reminded of which Shri Datar would not have done. He what was said by Pakistan authorities in said Shri Indrajit Gupta made a nice speech. I 1954. When certain things developed must say Shri Lal Bahadur Shastri, though in between India and Pakistan, the substance it was very wrong, made a nice authorities in East Pakistan, before speech, nice man that he is. Iskander took over and also after he took over, began to say "Our national existence is Here I come to another aspect of the matter. at stake" and then they issued regulations You see, mention is made in clause 3 to and orders in the name of territorial public interest. In subclause (1) it says: integrity of the country, intended to harass, arrest and persecute the Communist Party and "If the Central Government considers the Congressmen also. We shared the that in the interests of the safety or security same prisons—Communists and Con- of India or in the public interest," gressmen—in Dacca and other jails. Is that to be repeated here by this kind of a statement? So, it is said that in the public interest, this If reaction gets entrenched, some day we measure is called for. And in sub-clauses (3) may be landed in such a situation. and (4) certain powers are given to regulate Therefore, do not emulate, for goodness' certain entries, to regulate the entrance of sake, the Pakistan authorities who exploited certain people to an area. One would have the border disputes for bolstering up thought that something would be told as to reaction and to persecute the Communists and why these were necessary. But the hon. democratic parties including Congressmen, Minister has not told us anything on that. One former Ministers of the Congress Party in type of alleged activity he has not mentioned East Pakistan and other places. Sir, we at all in this House or in the other House, cannot endorse by statements of the kind that significantly enough. When the Bill is the hon. Minister in the Ministry of Home supposed to be in the public interest and there Affairs has made, action that took place in are even provisions for controlling the Pakistan. Maybe it will be posthumous movement of some people within the country endorsement of such action; but nonetheless, if from one area to a notified area, he has not such things are said, you wiH be provoking ' mentioned about certain activities, which it is President Ayub Khan or somebody to say, my duty now to do. I ask the Government to "Did I not say these things? Here is India saying take note of what I am saying and I wish to such things. We showed the way to India." invite the attention of the new Home Minister Sir, anti-communism is an outmoded and of the Government of India to subversive and exploded weapon in the hands of reaction. prejudicial activities indulged in hy some But if you use it like this, I think the situation foreign nationals in the border regions of will •"be bad for all of us. Therefore, I Kalimpong and other places. I have tabled an ■would request my hon. friend not to amendment to this effect. 1643 Criminal Law [ RAJYA SABHA ] {Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1644. [Shri Bhupesh Gupta.] It is for them to India but is against any prejudicial activity by have taken note of it, but they have not taken foreigners against a neighbouring country? note of it. That only shows the intention of SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I have given an these people who have formulated this amendment and I may say that I am against measure. Here, it . is a very interesting story prejudicial activities by anybody, whether that I have to bring to your notice. I have done foreigner or national. I make that perfectly some hard work here. I hope the House will clear. But the point now is this. You have bear with me a little when I give hon. heard the hon. Minister in the Ministry of Members certain news, again documented and Home Affairs, Shri Datar. You have read the substantiated by facts which I can place speeches in the other House. But no mention is before the House. made anywhere of this, as if it is the I have in mind George N. Patterson, Communist who must be lambasted and correspondent to the Daily Telegraph of hanged. Nothing is mentioned about the other London who came to the limelight in type, the real type of anti-national and preju- connection with the Tibetan counter dicial activities—they are such even according revolution in 1959—a name which was to the criteria of the Government—indulged in mentioned in this House, residing ' in on our soil by foreigners, even when books Kalimpong since 1950, ever since he fled have been written by them and published from from Tibet when the new regime was London, and sold in Delhi, Calcutta and established in China and Tibet. His activities Bombay, and available even in the Parliament were in Kalimpong in support of the exiled library as well. That is strange. He gets so Tibetan residents there. Patterson, in his books many reports from so many quarters. Does he like "Tragic Destiny" published in 1959 and not get the time to read so many books? That "Tibet in Revolt" claims to describe how he is what I would like to ask. Here is the book, from Kalimpong helped and contributed to the "Tragic Destiny". I will mention only a few organistion of this revolution in Tibet in 1959, instances. I do so, because many copies are in collusion with the Tibetan residents in not available. Most of them are sold out and Kalimpong and other elements inside Tibet. In they are costly books. Here is what George these books he makes no secret of his part in Patterson writes. What he writes I do not organising meetings between the Tibetan rebel vouch for here. He says so-many things leaders and the U.S. officials and ethers in against everybody, including the Government Kalimpong. Here are the two books, written of India, I do realise. But at the same time, by George N. Patterson, "Tragic Destiny" and here is a man who confesses his own crimes, "Tibet in Revolt", and the pages of these two no - matter what statements he makes about books are full of confessions of subversive the Communist Party or the Congress Party or and prejudicial activities, activities which go the Government or anybody else. against the interest of the country, and yet I do not find any kind of a reference by the SHRI M. H. SAMUEL (Andhra Pradesh): Government to any of these things. Why is it Suppose I write, a book— Tragic Destiny of so? Why does not the Government to take that the Communist Party in India—would it be a into account, I would like to know. prejudicial act on my part, in your opinion? DIWAN CHAMAN LALL: I do not SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: No, want to interrupt my hon. friend, but I would because you will never write such, a book, like to ask hirn this. Is this the position then being a better writer. that my hon. friend is not against any prejudicial activity regarding the safety and security of 1645 Criminal Law [ 2 MAY 1961 j (Amdt.) Bill, 1991 1646
SHRI M. H. SAMUEL: But the way you are been broken when Chiang Kai-shek's National going, I might do it very soon. Party failed. They had no previous contact with Tibet which would have provided them SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: You w.ll never with an opening for a more direct interest." He do it, and if you do it, you will forfeit your mentions British, American and Indian literary career, because even as it is, you have officials. "Having provided all the necessary a hell of a trouble in getting your . . . information to the British, Indian and American officials, I decided that it was now MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Mr. Gupta, it time to make for Kalimpong to see whatever is time. Tibetan official might be there who in turn would be able to pass on the news to Lhasa." This is how subversive activities go on at SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I will take a Kalimpong. It is admitted here and he makes a little more time, Sir. boast of his activities. This is very interesting. He says that he came, met the officials of the MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: B as brief as e British High Commission who put him in possible. touch with the Secret Service men of the United States of America and other people. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Sir, it is important and I will take some time. I wish to Then he passed certain information, took draw your attention to pages 14, 22 and 23 of certain things and then went to Kalimpong to this book. I feel like presenting a copy of this carry on his activities. This area will probably book to you. It is very important. Here you see be soon turned into a notified area but he went how things on the border went on. I need not to live in the house of the mother of the Dalai mention how Mr. George Patterson came to Lama. He saw armed servants there and he India in 1950 through Sadiya. He entered . was surprised to see armed servants there of Calcutta from there and he says: the Dalai Lama's mother and brother. I ask the hon. Minister, "Do you have any such "I am here to get what help I can from information that people were armed, that whatever source. When' I have done all I people were keeping little private armies can in Calcutta I want to go to Kalimpong there?" Mr. Patterson testifies to it, being a and if there are any Tibetan officials there party to all kind of conspiracy that went on get them to pass on the information to their there. You come across such a statement made Government in Lhasa." by the author in pages 80 and 81 of the book. I would then draw your attention to page 84 "The official got in touch with several which is very interesting: people on the telephone and then laid it back on its rest. I have made arrangements "The news I took to Calcutta created a for you to meet one of the top Security sensation and the diplomatic telephone officials in Calcutta tomorrow morning. between New Delhi, London and When you have finished with him, perhaps Washington hummed with the questions and you would get into touch with me again and answers. Difficulties multiplied as arrange- we'll fix another meeting when I can write ments for escape progressed. As it had to be down some of the information so that I can kept absolutely secret, only the top officials pass it on to Delhi and London." were informed of what was required and Taktser had no passport. Sufficient money This is what he writes. The Americans were for an extended stay in the U.S. would have interested but as the British official had said, to be given with the con- "Not in a position to do anything even if they had wanted. The link with China had 1647 Criminal Law [ RAJYA SABHA J (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1648 [Shri Bhupesh Gupta.] 150, to Apa Sahib Pant and his impression is sent of the Reserve Bank of India, which was out given. It is very interesting. I know that this of the question in such secretive procedures; exit man is against Government also. He writes permits to leave the country and bypass customs that he met the representatives of the Tibetan formalities would have to be obtained. Slowly revolt and told them that an American agent all those problems were resolved. In the United would be sent. States the Committee for Free Asia, a non- MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: All this is not Communist association of businessmen, invited relevant to the debate. Taktser to go to America at their expense as their guest. Th Indian and U.S. Government issued e SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: It is relevant affidavits and lieu of a passport, accepting the because this comes under the activities on the Dalai Lama's letter as of sufficient bona fides.'\ border.
This is what the author writes. Mn. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Activities Kalimpong conspiracy was hatched prejudicial to the interests of India. in order to circumvent the pass port rules to smuggle some people SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Let them say out of the country and written by that this is not prejudicial to India. the person who was in it true or false, I do not know. He writes it. MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: This Should your attention not have been happened in 1951. That is why this Bill has drawn to it? That does not seem to come up. have been done. Then he writes as to how he organised the escape of SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Not in 1951 but the Dalai Lama. On page 109, he in 1958-59. Let them say so. You would says that Gompo Sham, his wife and understand it, and so let me proceed. I am himself had to go to Formosa, not to entitled to say it. If they can say about the United States. On page 122, he Communist activities on the border, I am pre- writes, "I would guarantee his pared to quote from the author of these books (Rapga Pangdatshang) anti-Commu all these activities. Can they produce a book nist sincerity". He was guaranteeing by the Communist? the sincerity of Rapga Pangdatshang About Apa Sahib Pant, he says, "His who was a brother of the Governor of impression of Rapga was that he was an able a province in Tibet which had revolt and sincere man, but that he overestimated the ed. He writes on page 136 that "it was strength and ability of the Kham and Amdo absolutely essential that Tibet tribesmen and underestimated the magnitude revolt and present India and other countries of the obstacles in the way of complete with a fait accompli." He writes further, "The Tibetan independence". These are all American argued with Rapga that co-operation important, and I wish I had a copy to present with the Indian Government was essential." He to you. On page 174, he says, . . . adds further that the American representatives had drawn up a programme. I would like to MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: You seem to know whether such things are or not covered. be trying to camouflage . . . On page 138 he says that the U.S. representative promised to put before the SHRI N. SRI RAMA REDDY: May I know appropriate officials, after returning to how the House is interested in what happened America, the suggestion for appointing a there? special agent. There is reference, on SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Because that page area will soon become a notified 1649 Criminal Law [ 2 MAY 1961 ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1650 urea. If the House is interested in j does not have a word of condemnation to say what the Communists are doing in i against it while he is full of condemnation, Kalimpong and Mr. Datar makes a vituperation, attacks and accusation against statement, the House should be jolly well us. Therefore, I call it diversion. It is diverting interested in what George Patterson was the attention of the country from the really doing and his men are doing in nefarious, prejudicial. anti-national and even Kalimpong. He writes, •'When the anti-Government activities that are carried on Lhasa officials in the Dalai Lama's by people like him in that area. entourage returned to Lhasa they had made arrangements with private dealers Then, Sir, in the "Tibet in Revolt" how the in India to send in large supplies of arms Dalai Lama escaped is described and how and ammunition—not for use but for they are doing it from Kalimpong. profit." Everybody knows and it went across Then on page 84 reference is made to "The the border. Was. that act in the public Tibet Mirror" a paper published in interest? Was it not a prejudicial act? Is it Kalimpong. Here an interesting thing is said. something which is to be ignored in your They were getting briefing. What a tirade against the Communist Party, in your shocking thing! talk against the Communist Party? This is what George Patterson writes in his book. MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Speak All the arms and ammunition that something about your activities. passed across the border are mentioned SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: That Mr. Datar here. What about your police which will tell you. You know I am a very fine produced such a report, false report, and person. gave it to the Prime Minister? Did it make any investigation into such activities MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Allegations on the border? This is a pertinent are made against you. question to be asked by me and other Mem- bers of the honourable House here. On SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: You know my page 133, he says, "On the 4th August activities; for nine years we have been meeting of all leaders from all parts of together and I know how you like our Tibet held in Kalimpong, it was decided on activities. what is to be done in view of India's refusal to help and for non-cooperative attitude." I It says here: am not, therefore, against India or the Government. "The guerrilla leaders and "To make matters even more tense, the delegates had been advocating an editor of the only Tibetan newspaper.' The extreme course of action by proposing an Tibet Mirror, published in Kalimpong, had attack on Sikkim and Bhutan with an received several pages of typed foolscap uprising of Tibetan nationals in sympathy with details of briefing for the use of in Kalimpong and Darjeeling. There American troops in Tibet and had been were about 20,000 guerrillas between Lhasa asked to publish it in his newspaper. and Sikkim, and, 7,000 of the best fighters Fortunately he was perturbed and he most feared by the Chinese on the border of consulted some officials. On their advice he Bhutan". This is what he says. Here is a did not publish, but the information was not meeting of the rebel leaders who wanted to secret and had been passed round, thereby attack Sikkim and Bhutan. Even though heightening the expectation." it was held in Kalimpong on August 4 and is Sir, what does it show? Here is a paper stated by one who organised and participated getting briefing. But New Age was being in this meeting, we see that the hon. Home mentioned, not. The Tibet Mirror, published Minister or the Minister in the Ministry of Home Affairs, Mr. Datar, in Kalimpong, which, according to Mr. George Pat- 1651 Criminal Law [ RAJYA SABHA ] (Amdt) Bill, 1961 1652 [Shri Bhupesh Gupta.] terson, was and all these things. If meetings are receiving American briefs to publish asking organised by the guerrilla bands in American troops to take action in Tibet. The Kalimpong don't you think you are publication was stopped because of certain endangering the safety? Don't you intervention perhaps of some officials. Ali think these are against national this is not mentioned but New Age has interests, against public interest? The become an abses-sion with them. Then he fact that such an intelligent man as says on page 117: Mr. Samuel gets up and asks me this question only shows how the infec "I told the Government official all this." ' tion of anti-Communism affects even right-minded persons. I am only A plan is accepted. sorry. I would like to present it to "After consultation with New Shri Lal Bahadur Shastri because Delhi my plan was adopted." when it came into my hands he was not there and his people will not He prepared certain plans. Then he says he tell him about such things. told the Government of India and then they You see such activities had been going on. were accepted after consultation. Such are the publications. They are all there to expose how you are proceeding in this matter. You ignore Sir, many things have been said about the all these things; you pick up the New Age provisions of the Bill. I shall deal with them as which anybody can read at any time. I would I come to the various aspects of the matter J ask the Government: Is that the way to handle when the amendments come up. What -would such a matter? And again here is another like to state here is this. Here you say thing. You see, I have worked; it is hard work. territorial integrity but then the scope of the Here is a handbill on art paper issued in Bill is far wider. It is not merely territorial Kalimpong and circulated widely. Have you integrity'— for Mr. Samuel I must point" got that? Chiang Kai-shek's picture is given out— safety and security of India. I think you there—a colourful picture—and there is a are not safe when the Tibetan rebel leaders report in Chinese language and in anovner hold a meeting in Kalimpong and Talk to the language and also in English. It is President American official. About the security of India, Chiang's message to the Tibetans. This was would Shri Lal Bahadur Shastri feel secure if circulated widely in the Kalimpong area and it somebody were to whisper in his ear in his came into my possession because I come from bed, "When you are sleeping other people near West Bengal. There is no mention about it. the border in; Kalimpong—the Tibetan rebejls— are meeting and discussing the ques- SHRI M. H. SAMUEL: How is it subversive tion of even- doing something in Bhutan and against India, I want to know. It may be STkkim and discussing about transhipment of subversive against China. arms "and so on"? Would he sleep? Certainly SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: If you think that not; he would pass a sleepless night. He would it is in public interest from the point of view not sleep. of India, say so. The Prime Minister opposes this thing and that is why Mr. George SHRI P. D. HIMATSINGKA: Thi? will take Patterson criticises you and the Prime notice of them. Minister in his book. You say safety, security, public interest SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: That is why I am saying this. I am saying these things so that he takes notice; so far he does not seem to have taken any notice of these things. I would have perhaps nothing much if only 165 3 Criminal Law [ 2 MAY 1961 ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1654 the expression 'territorial integrity' were there, SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: If he says now, not the expression 'public interest' has been then I need not pursue this matter but he put in. I would like to know Irom the Home would not say. I read out this statement. Who Minister this thing. Suppose somebody makes is this person who made this statement? Not a a speech of this kind, would that come under Communist against whom you are up in arms, the mischief of this measure? but the Leader of your Party, Shri Jawaharlal Nehru, currently engaged in finding two "I am not going into the long history Deputy Leaders. That is the position. Sir, the because I do not want to take much time. It law is law. Once it is passed, I say that Pandit is a complicated thing but we have always Jawaharlal Nehru would not be in a looked upon the Ladakh area as a different position—nobody would blame him; he is a area as, if I may say so, some vaguer area courageous man—to say what he has said so far as the frontier is concerned because without attracting the penalty of the law. Let the exact line of the frontier is not at all Mr. Lal Bahadur Shastri come to the House clear as in the case of the McMahon Line. tomorrow and tell us that such a statement When we discovered in 1958, more than a would not attract the provisions of the law. If year ago, that a road had been built across he says that, I will stand corrected. If he does Yehchong in the north east corner of not say that, then it would be clear to the Ladakh, we were worried .... It is a relevant House how wide the law is. Now, the fact that question but the fact of the matter is that we he is the Prime Minister, the fact that he may just are not within hundred miles of that say something today, does not mean "that he was absolutely unreasonable or was talking area." through his hat at that time. He was saying The same gentleman, a very important something in the circumstances as any person—I do not want to go into the details-^- reasonable man would say, because says here when he was speaking about the everybody would like to find out the position. Aksai Chin area: If such a law were there he could not have said such a thing in public without being "But I distinguish it completely from liable to be arrested By Mr. Lal Bahadur other areas. It is a matter for argument as to Shastri and put into prison. But then he would what part of it belongs to us and what part say he was the Prime Minister of the country of it belongs to somebody else, ft "is not at and that would have been his protection. all a dead clear matter ... I cannot go about Therefore, you see how wide the law is. doing things in a matter which has been Now, they say in clause 3(2): challenged, not today, but 'or a hundred years." "Whoever makes, publishes or circulates in any notified area any statement, rumour Would the hon. Home Minister tell us or report which is, or is likely to be, whether statements such as these would come prejudicial to the maintenance of public under the mischief of the law or would they order or essential supplies or services in the not? Sir. can I get this guidance from him? said area or to the interests of the safety or Sir, will you kindly tell him? security of India, shall be . . ."
THE MINISTER OF HOME AFFAIRS (SHRI Now, you have the provision of the Defence LAL BAHADUR): Whatever I Tiave to advise you, I shall do so tomorrow. of India Rules imported here. You have the provision of'the Preven-
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: He will reply to you. 1655 Griminal Law [ RAJYA SABHA ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1656 [Shri Bhupesh Gupta.] tive Detention Act getting the ground for promulgating an order imported here. Now, what has this got to do under Section 144 of the Criminal Procedure with the territorial integrity? What has this got Code restricting the movement of Shri to do with any other part oi India as far as Pa [Shri Bhupesh Gupta.] and if the meeting MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: You have cannot come' to an agreement and if there is taken a sufficiently Jong time. serious divergence of opinion, then refer the matter to the Prime Minister. I have faith in SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Tomorrow I will the Prime Minister in this matter. But they do continue. not say that I have faith in him. MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: You are MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Please wind speaking on the amendments. We will be up. taking the amendments later on. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I will continue tomorrow. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Tomorrow, in the beginning.... MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: You have already taken one hour and . . . MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Tomorrow we have got five hours. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: You have been good enough. You know I am a persecuted SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I will say man. something more tomorrow. MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: You are persecuting others. MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: You take five minutes more and finish the SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: No, Sir. I will speech. continue tomorrow because nobody is speaking today. You have been very good and SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: It should go on I must say that you know that a man who is tomorrow. I have certain other points. wrongly attacked and sought to be persecuted should be given his right of self-defence MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: It wiH go but atleast. It is a very healthy experience I am after your speech. having from " the Chair. It is a good thing and also a very SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: No, Sir. I beg of relevant thing. Nothing is irrelevant. you . . . Therefore, I say, leave it to the Prime Minister. I say, during the time of the election, two months before the date of MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Please finish. polling . . . SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I am not MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: You may finishing. My thoughts will be rushing. take another Ave minutes and finish the speech. MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Please wind up. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: No. Sir. I will continue at most.... SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I would require a little more time. I will require a few minutes MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: We will sit more. I would not ask the House to sit any till you finish. more because I am not in a hurry to pass this measure. I am not hi a hurry. Tf they say that SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I will not put they can wait till the next session . . . you to that trouble. I do not like it 1665 Criminal Law [ 2 MAY 1961 ] (Amdt.) Bill, 1961 1666 AN HON. MEMBER: He does iot want the MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: AU measure at all. right You continue tomorrow. The House stands adjourned till 11 '00 A.M. tomorrow. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: 1 am not in a hurry in any case. Therefore, you can adjourn The House then adjournec at the House since it is five. I will come five of the clock till eleven of the tomorrow. You adjourn the House. clock on Wednesday the 3rd May, 1961. GMGIPND— RS—161RS—14 -6-61—550