The Paulus Institute for the Propagation of Sacred Liturgy

Washington, DC, Cosmos Club, October 20, 2016 TheTHE ANCIENTMost Reverend NORM Athanasius OF THE Schneider,HOLY FATHERS O.R.C. The victory of Histhe Excellency (“pristina Blessed sanctorum Bishop AthanasiusVirgin Patrum norma”) SchneiderMary over all heresies AS THE CRITERIONQUESTIONSLecture FOR of “Mary’sAN October AUTHENTIC Victory 20, 2016Over & RENEWAL All atANSWERS TheHeresies” Cosmos OF THE Club SACRED LITURGY Washington, DC “Rejoice, O Virgin+ Athanasius Mary, for Schneider, thou aloneQUESTIONS Auxiliary have destroyed Bishop of theall Archdiocese &Pope ANSWERS Pius of X Saint spoke Mary about in Astana, Our Lady Kazakhstan as of the noblest foun- heresies in the whole world. Thou believed the word ofLECTURE the dation of the house of our faith: “To Mary it was said: Archangel TheGabriel. Avictory virgin still, ofthou the brought Blessed forth the Virgin“Blessed is SheMary Who over has believed, all heresies because the things Q.1. My question is about theChurch state ofof thedivorce Annunciation in the Parisheternity, Hall, theWashington, eternal salvation D.C. of his soul and of the soul of God-man; thou bore a Child, O Virgin, and remainedFebruary a 14,promised 2015 Her by the Lord shall be accomplished.” (Luke 1.Church Since today.the discussion is about heresy, one heretic who Histhe spouseExcellency: from We whom could he witness is separated. in the past Such fifty a personyears, hasmore Virgin still. Mother of God, intercede for us“. These words 1:45). The promise was that She would conceive and bring comes to mind is Martin Luther. On an airplane, the pope toor prayless, forthe themethod spouse’s of theeternal so-called salvation, “dialogue.” and for We the couldsalva- Holy Mother Church prays since more than a millennium forth the Son of God ... Therefore, since the Son of God 1.“Rejoice,H.E.:recently Ever This since said O Virginisthatapostolic not Martin theMary, timesteaching Luther for the thou Churchdidof alone the not errChurchhaveshowed on destroyed the in deep issuethe con firstallof- believedtiontipleobserve ofwitnesses theirthat in the itchildren. towas Incarnation this not attitude bearingSalvation of from fruits, Godis thealways butand most mostly sincethrough ancient confusionthen Christ times this in the Divine Office and in the Votive Mass of the Bless- made Man is the “author and finisher of faith” (Heb. heresiescernplace,justification. to but offerin thisthe wholeisaWhat typethe is teachingworld. ofyour worship response Thou of Christ,which believedon theofwould the theLutheran Eternal meetword the heresyof and theexi- faithandareabout to the will beour Cross. mentioned neverCatholic Without perish faith, here on the aboutSt.earth Cross, John theuntil thereChrysostom gospel, the is Lastno and salvation, Judgement. (4thweakening – 5thbut ed Virgin Mary in the Tract after Septuagesima from the 12:2), we must recognize His Most Holy Mother as the ArchangelDivineongency the of issuewisdom, God’s Gabriel. of utterjustification that A holiness. divorcevirgin and still,Therefore,is neverthe thou upcoming allowed,brought she always ecumenicalinforth noprayed thecir- Throughcentury),onlyour commitment an illusion. thewitnessing faith toThis of preach theMary earthly liturgical thethe truelifegospel, isfaithtradition veryto waspreach short, established of theAntiochand truth, after on Common of the Blessed Virgin Mary. partaker and, as it were, the custodian, of the divine mys- God-man;tocumstances.council God and the thouevents Father,This bore and is particularly atothe Child, a traditionaldivine O law.Virgin,in Catholic’s theWhen andLatin a remainedresponse marriagetradition, to ais earthtocomesand teach Constantinople. and eternity. all she nations—all was We the have The first nations—even to liturgy preparewho believed ofourselves the the andtruth,Church for therefore eternity.all has nations to she be Virginvalid,throughthe reports no still. Christone that Mother can arein separatecomingthe of God,Holy out?and intercede Spirit, dissolve since for it. us“.Our Every These Lord act Jesus wordsthat isteries.whatmodeled most Christ We powerful by must said, the acknowledgeand heavenlyto destroythey have liturgy unbelieve tothat, obey of after the and commandmentsChrist,angels. heresy. SheTherefore is the of The battle of the Blessed Virgin Mary against Satan, who is HolyChristviolates Mother instructed the sacramental Church us to prays adorebond since Godof moremarriage “in thanSpiritu is a a millennium etsin Veritate” against noblestQ.2.Christ.the Church Why Thisfoundation is onmarriageis, earthyou oncan in indissoluble?which read,worshipping inis thebuilt gospel the and house ofadoring Matthew. of faith the DiforAnd- spreading errors and heresies in the world, is already indi- (JohninGod,His the Excellency: against 4:23).Divine InHis Office Wefact, holy have it will. is andalready only Thisin “in thehad theis Votiveansin, Holy infallible it hurtsSpirit”Mass responseofyou thatthe in oneBlessyour to- Popeallvineso didages.” Majesty Pius the (Encyclical XChurch. spoke mostly about AndinAd the Diem so,Our Eucharistic I thinkLadyIllum ,aswe February of liturgyhave the tonoblest has 2,correct 1904). the foun duty this.- cated by God’s words after the fall in sin of Adam and Eve: edthecansoul, Virgin errorstruly damages ofadoreMary Martin you, Christ,in theLuther:because Tractthat the is,whenafter Councilrecognize Septuagesimasomeone of HisTrent. is Divinity, disobeying Thefrom teach the ac- WedationH.E.:to imitatecannot Because of thecontinuethe housetheangels marriage in of suchin our the an wasfaith: ambiguousinterior already “To disposition Mary establishedmanner it [forwas (purityin the said: par re- “I will put enmity between you and the Woman, between When Saint Francis Sales in the year 1602 after a long and CommonGod,ingscording of he the tois Councilof alwaysthe the words Blessed hurting of Trent of Virgin Saintand about damaging Paul: Mary. the errors “Nemo himself. of Martinpotest No Luther,dicere, good “Blessedcovery]ofadise. heart) Marriage of isanddialogue. She in was Whothe Dialogue establishedexterior has believed,is gestures. possible and created because inThe daily beforefollowing life;the we thingsAdam have wit- your offspring and hers. He will crush your head while you hard work crushed protestantism in the region of Chablais, DominusIpurpose repeat, canare Iesus, infallible,justify, nisi to inex be Spiritucathedra opposing ,Sancto” and God. the (1 commentsIt’s Cor terrible 12:3). ofto thebeIn promisednessestoand speak Eve from tosinned, Her one the another.by beforePatristic the Lord original But time whenshall sin.demonstrate beI speak Andaccomplished.” so,with this that a person is thisthe (Luke onlywhowas Thewill strike battle at of his the heel” Blessed (Gen Virgin 3:15). PopeMary against John Paul Satan, II taught who is he wrote on the arch of the choir of the church in Tho- theopposingpope Lord’s in the God’s Prayer,plane will. and we But notpray exwe firstcathedra know of the .all willthat of God’sGod, andname the be 1:45).theissacrament in conscienceerror, The itthat ispromise also wasof athe given dialogue.was universal that to us WhenShe direct Church would I fromhave conceive(Rome, aparadise, true love, Carthage,and in I bringwillpar- spreadingin his Marian errors Encyclical and heresies Redemptoris in the world, Mater is, alreadythat Mary indi is- non, the principal town of that region, the words: „Gaude Churchhallowed: is only“sanctificetur repeating theNomen will of Tuum”. God, transmitting This means it tothat Jerusalem,forthhelpadise, the thewhere person Son Antioch/Constantinople), there of who God was is noin... errorsin.Therefore, Godto come joined since beingout Adam ofthe consequentlythe Sonand error. ofEve OfGod as collocatedcated by God’s in the words very aftercenter the of fall the in battle sin of of Adam Christ and against Eve: Maria virgo, cunctas haereses sola interemisti in universo 2.whenus. Your So the thisExcellency, faithful is not praytheyou Church’s usedand theworship ownword teaching, God,“dialogue” they but mustearlier. divine be I madecourse,aan couple indispensable Man I beforewill isdo the theythis and “author withsinned. constant respect, andWhat criterion withfinisher God love, joins, for butof an manfaith” with authentic cannot clarity. (Heb. Satan:“I will “Mary,put enmity Mother between of the you Incarnate and the Word, Woman, is placed between at mundo (Rejoice, O Virgin Mary, for thou alone have de- revelation,conscioushad an epiphany thatdivine He a truth. coupleis the All-Holyyears ago God,when andI realized must therebehave is We12:2),liturgicalseparate. have we to Therefore,tradition. mustbe witness, recognize the always, marriage His of Mostthe bond truth, Holy is anda sign,Mother to [state]a reflection as this.the theyour very offspring center ofand that hers. enmity, He will that crush struggle your whichhead while accom you- stroyed all heresies in the whole world)”. The Saint Doctor accordingly.a Hegelian dialectic, Jesus Christ a thesis Himself and antithesis, in His “High that maps Priestly up Thispartakerof the workholiness and, of dialogueas of it God were, should and the of custodian,be the corrected. fidelity of theof divineGod Himself. mys- willpanies strike the athistory his heel” of humanity (Gen 3:15). on Pope earth John and Paulthe history II taught of of the Church confessed hereby in a solemn way the Bless- ThereforePrayer”perfectly (John with in defendingpractice,17) began there the by doctrineaskingcan be for casesof thethe of glorificationChurch separation, and befor of- 3.Godteries. To isSaint We faithful must John to acknowledgeChrysostom, us, always, even that,also knownto after the Christ,extent by the that Shetitle whenis “doc the- insalvation his Marian itself. Encyclical In this history Redemptoris Mary remains Mater, athat sign Mary of sure is ed Virgin Mary als the guardian of the fundaments of the whichcomingboth the the pastoral. Son name and The“divorce” the Fatherpastoralism is (Johnnot linescorrect, 17:1) up andperfectlybecause He referredawith sacra the- 3.noblesttora baptized(Question eucharisticus”, foundation person unavailable) rejects theon whichtradition God is and built of theultimately the Byzantine house will of faith Churchbe con for- collocatedhope” (no. in11). the very center of the battle of Christ against whole Christian life, Adof theDiem true Illum faith. tomentalantithesis His Fathermarriage of the as Church, is“Holy indissoluble. Father” which reduces (JohnYou cannot 17:11). everything divorce to a mean valid- alldemnedattributes ages.” to(Encyclical the hell, authorship he will carry of withthe liturgyhim, February to hellor the the 2, anaphoraindissolu1904). - Satan: “Mary, Mother of the Incarnate Word, is placed at marriage.inglessness. An So invalid if we marriagehear somebody can be support declared in null. the Vatican In the Hiscalledble markExcellency: after of his baptism.name.The Inpretext In his baptism, sermonsof so-called we this receive charitySaint an repeatedly indelibleto help a theWhy very the center Blessed of Virginthat enmity, Mary thathas struggledestroyed which all heresies? accom- WhenSaint Louis Saint GrignionFrancis Sales de inMonfort the year says 1602 in afterhis Treatise a long and on 2.caseor Hencein of the a USCCBvalid awareness marriage the ofproblem God’swe must ofdeep homosexuality,speak holiness of separation, is the we firstwill and hear con of- neighborcharacter,stresses the with an presence indelible a completely ofseal the on and angelsour earthly soul. in Eventheagenda, earthly a condemned this liturgy is nat- paniesBecause the She history believed of humanity that the Sonon earth of God and willthe historyincarnate of hardtrue Devotionwork crushed to the protestantism Blessed Virgin: in the “Mary region hasof Chablais, authori- courseditionanother andthe statement Churchis typical made permits of Christiancoming separation from worship. the in someopposite And, cases naturally,side of thatthe uralism.andsoul inviteswill Thiscarry the isit faithful intonot hellChristianity to as worship a sign any that God more. God in isspiritualWe faithful. have theunion God first salvationand become itself. man. In thisThe history Christian Mary faith remains consists a sign essential of sure- hety overwrote the on angels the arch and ofthe the blessed choir inof heaven.the church As ain reward Tho- itmakesspouses demands a defensefor serioustypical of that reasons,gestures position butof adoration,totally they have impossible, suchto keep as with bowing,fidelity the withremainstask to them. teach faithful. St. the John truth, Therefore, names to transmit the the angels marriagethe grace “con-servants” bond of God, is a thesign (syn su of- hope”ly in the (no. faith 11). in Christ true God and true man. For one non,for her the great principal humility, town Godof that gave region, her thethe powerwords: and„Gaude the prostrations,certaintyand not engage that andthe in firstalsoa new silence,group union. ofwhich Sopeople this expresses isthat the attack truth an interiorofyou God. will douloithepernatural love, this of life, Godexpression for for eternity. His is creation.found We are already notEspecially born in Apoc and the 19:10created marriage and for who believes in the Divinity of Christ will accept all what Mariamission virgo, of assigning cunctas tohaereses saints thesola thrones interemisti made in vacant universo by But,beattitude the when bishops. of someoneawe andSo when reverence.is really I hear sincere Thethe word inmost seeking “dialogue” authoritative the willin any ofwit- Apocthisbond earth. 22:9)is a Recently,sign of the of faithfulthe there love is who ofon Christ thecelebrate internet for inHis a joy good Church, the initiative paschal His WhyChrist the taught. Blessed The Virgin Blessed Mary Virgin has destroyedMary was theall heresies?first who mundothe apostate (Rejoice, angels O whoVirgin fell Mary, away forthrough thou alonepride. have Such de is- God,nessinterfaith to in these such discussion, fundamental a situation I automatically of attitudes separation ofjump Christianor toso-called the conclusion,worship divorce, is Eucharisticofbride. a text The with liturgy themarriage title, (cf. “Declaration bond Sermo is adversusa sign, of Fidelity” an ebrios external onet thede sign, resurrecwebsite a sac- Becausebelieved Shein the believed Incarnation that the of Son God of andGod since will thenincarnate this stroyedthe will allof heresiesalmighty in God the wholewho exalts world)”. the Thehumble, Saint that Doctor the thetherethat Book turns could ofout bethe toof Apocalypse, becourse 100% very accurate, which deep sufferings. presentsthat will to be theBut what’s eyesGod beof al- Filialtionerament ,Appeal. 2: of PG the [“You’re50, indissoluble 435). all Ininvited his bond homilies to sign.”]and fidelity onYes, Isaiah please. of the ChristI would “doc to- andfaith becomewill never man. perish The on Christianearth until faith the consistsLast Judgement. essential- ofpowers the Church of heaven, confessed earth andhereby hell, in willinglya solemn or way unwillingly, the Bless- Christianswaysing done gives in Histhe the heavenlyhelpname and of pastoralism, liturgyHis graces, as the whichalways, real ismodel when the antithesis foryou wor are- Historencourage eucharisticus”bride, you,the Church.but describesI was Therefore,in some the spiritualway amarriage collaborator union itself of withthepossesses worthis- lyThrough in the faiththe faith in Christ of Mary true the God true andfaith true was man.established For one on edmust Virgin obey Mary the commands als the guardian of the humbleof the fundaments Virgin Mary. of Forthe toaskingship the on indoctrine. earth. Him. The So This you reference mustwhole have tothing the patience, seemsmodel to faithof thebe andabout heavenly trust. the thistext.shipping indissolubility.So, we faithful made witha statement,It is the a work angels a ofwitness. inGod. such TheIt a is way notfirst as a signaturesworkif there of whoearth believes and she in was the the Divinity first whoof Christ believed will and accept therefore all what she wholeGod has Christian made her life, queen of the oftrue heaven faith. and earth, leader of Askworshipplanned help, (specificallyimplosion and God ofwill thethe give allusionChurch it to to whereyou, the andangels)the firstyou is will thegroup savemain of werewouldman. a Whatgroupbe no of mandifference eighty has persons,joined, between theythree thecan cardinals, voiceseparate. ofthree the But bishops,faithful here, Christis most taught. powerful The to destroyBlessed unbelieveVirgin Mary and heresy.was the first who his armies, keeper of his treasures, dispenser of his graces, yourpeopleand constantsoul look and at characteristicarethe peoplesouls of on the theof others theoutside. liturgy of your throughout family. This the Inot.and am the oneThis voice of is them, a ofwork the the angels,of pastoral God. as administratorif they would ofsing Afghanistan, with one worker of his wonders, restorer of the human race, media- istwo the millennia, highest power from theof someoneApostolic who Fathers accepts up tothe the will Mag of- identicala general superior,voice the several hymn priests, of the and Sanctus lay people. The allfundament over the trix on behalf of men, destroyer of his enemies, and faith- God,isterium even of in the suffering. Second VaticanHe is already Council. preparing From for the his mulown- of this union is Christ himself through the sacrifice of the ful associate in his great works and triumphs.” (n. 28) world. It was very beautiful to have this una voce, one voice. His Excellency: You have the façade. You have this time the This is our answer. Declaration of fidelity to the unchanging catechism, the immutable catechism. And so, continue this. truth of the Church concerning marriage. Unchanging truth. When in some way the hierarchy is weaker, then speak louder, Each thesis in this declaration states, we firmly reiterate, or we your faith, and say, I know to whom I believe, I know, and firmly maintain the truth, that, and so forth, we sent this. In no one can take away the faith from me. And so you have to my opinion, this is our possible answer, to be faithful. confess your faith and to pray for the bishops that God may grant us really courageous bishops, shepherds of the Church, 4. One of the things you spoke a lot about was faith. I am that they are rewarded, maybe those who speak today, they are reminded of St. Thomas, and John of St. Thomas after him, rewarded in the Church. But what does it mean, this reward? about wisdom, actually, wisdom as distinguished from the For me, it is nothing in comparison to eternity. What does it practical wisdom of prudence within our nature, the gift of mean, this? My reward is a good conscience, of faith, of fidel- wisdom infused by the Holy Ghost, which is what faith be- ity to Jesus, and the reward I hope to receive in heaven. These comes in eternity. I know that Mary has something to teach temporary rewards I think they have not so much meaning. us about this, but could you also speak about this relation- And so, the better reward is to be faithful to the faith. And ship between the infused gift of wisdom that gives us a natu- God will do his work. So be faithful and believe, and help rality with God and the faith? even those who are losing their faith, even when these may be a bishop, and continue your faith. His Excellency: Very good. I am very happy with this ques- tion. Indeed, today as we are observing this confusion inside 6. Because of social media, because of modern media, we’re the Church, I am most certain that the lay people are now constantly bombarded by the modern, and it’s very easy to called to witness their faith. I think this is an effect, a conse- get distracted because of what’s happening in most recently. quence, of the gifts of the Holy Spirit which you received in As Catholics we have almost two thousand years of rich the- the sacrament of Confirmation. And so you lay people, you ology to learn from and pull from. How do you recommend received the seven gifts of the Holy Spirit, one of these gifts we live, not only a detachment, a distancing from, it feels like is the gift of wisdom, the wisdom of faith, the gift of courage. an over attachment, too much attention to the pope. We’re You know these seven gifts. You have received these in the sac- not paying attention to our local bishops. We’re not paying rament of Confirmation. I have observed these gifts that you attention to the thousands of years of history we have as a have received, these gifts are now bearing fruits, because now faith. What advice do you give to people to kind of ignore in these times the faith is now shining, in some ways, more the waves that are going on in the Church, and get deeper clearly, more beautiful, in the souls of the lay people than in under the water? the great part of the souls of the hierarchy, sad to say. Thank you, I can say as a bishop, thank you to my dear faithful who His Excellency: In this globalized world of the internet and are confirmed in the sacrament of Confirmation. social media, I think we in some way do not have to pay too much attention to all these every day words of the pope, his 5. Our Lady of Akita talked about the time of bishop against gestures. It is not necessary. In the past centuries, Catholics bishop, and obviously that prophecy is manifest today. What lived and have not known what the pope was speaking all their we see coming from the highest part of the Church is that life. They heard the preaching of the parish priest, and maybe the unfaithful bishops, the heretical ones, are being reward- they heard the pastoral letter of the bishop, and no more. And ed, and the ones who speak in truth, one has been banished, they have known maybe the name of the pope and prayed for one has recently been replaced. And so, I have a fear that the him, and no more. So it is not necessary in my opinion. We good ones will be silenced. We are in the position that when have to pray for the pope every day, of course, we are Catho- we speak the truth of the Church, or Our Lord’s words, very lics, and we have to have reverence to his office. Catholicism soon, maybe tomorrow morning, someone will say, but the is not necessarily a papacentrism, but a Christocentrism, for pope doesn’t say that. So we’re in a most difficult position, which the pope is only a vicar. For him, we pray and we love, because we do not even have the support, or even a façade, of for his office and his person. But we have to be moderate in being Catholic from above. some way and more serene, because we know our faith. 7. Your Excellency you visited the SSPX seminary a year or 8. I was reading that marvelous talk you gave a while back two ago. What are your thoughts on the SSPX and what do on asking for a new syllabus of errors. And I was reading you think will happen with them going forward? the footnote and who provided the investigation into what is the authentic meaning of the Church of pastoral. And I His Excellency: Of course, we do not have to think this one found that it was the Friars of the Immaculate that helped group is the saviour of the Church. The Church has her Sav- you prepare that. This pope has destroyed that entire order. iour. This is Jesus Christ. Of course we are living in a very Is that why? difficult time, extraordinarily difficult, and what Msgr. -LeFe bvre did in the past, maybe in the future we will have a more His Excellency: I don’t know. I think it is not on this specific positive judgment in general of his work, in general I think. I topic, but in my opinion the destruction of the Franciscans of am not classifying every step of his, but globally in these dif- the Immaculate has a deeper root, in my opinion, a general ficult times. Second, this group has a danger, and I told them root, to stop an order, a flourishing order inside the Church when I visited them, this is a danger, the more they are in who was increasingly to diffuse tradition inside the Church, some way self-sufficient ecclesiastically, and this is not normal, doctrinally and liturgically, the traditional Mass for example. it could last some time, but it should not last too much. Oth- This was to some circles in the high hierarchy a challenge, and erwise, this group becomes self-sufficient, autocephalis, this is they wanted to stop this. This is my opinion, globally. The de- not Catholic any more. This is in some way like a sect; we are velopment of the Franciscans of the Immaculate is a tradition- the only safe place. All the rest is gone away. This is a danger. I al order in the Church which is not depending on Ecclesia Dei, am not saying that all in the Society of Pius X has this attitude, because some liberal members of the hierarchy considered the but there is some danger of this. I hope that Pope Francis is different communities of Ecclesia Dei some kind of museum generous to them and wants to achieve some solution, a prac- pieces. So they could control them. But since another com- tical solution, canonical I would say, and this is already offered munity which is not Ecclesia Dei, in some way an ordinary to them. I could in some way help, but there are some diffi- institute, with the same characteristics of Ecclesia Dei, then it culties internally in the Society who are against, have no trust. becomes dangerous for them. And then they tried to stop this. A great deal of them have lost trust. This is a problem. And But this is a work of God. No one can stop this. This is tempo- then, I don’t know exactly the last information, what Rome rary, in my opinion, measure, a temporarily. But this suffering will do. But last week Msgr. Fellay was in Rome to speak about by them will bear fruits. We have to see longer. this. So we have to pray for a miracle that it will happen. It will be good that they will be recognized by the Church. It will be a new presence of many priests and faithful who are substantially Catholic, who will give a good constitution to strengthen the army which we are.