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The Association for Diplomatic Studies and Training Foreign Affairs Oral History Project Labor Series The Association for Diplomatic Studies and Training Foreign Affairs Oral History Project Labor Series GEORGE CABOT LODGE Interviewer: Morris Weisz Initial interview date: February 24, 1993 Copyrig t 1998 ADST TABLE OF CONTENTS Bac ground Department of Labor 1954-1960 Director of Information 1954-1956 ILO Conference, Gene,a Asst. Secretary, International Labor 1956-1960 ..S. go,ernment position on So,iet re-entry into ILO /ie0s on go,ernment relations 0ith employer and labor International Labor Organi1ation 1959-1960 Chairman, Go,erning Body African 2egional Conference Department of Labor 1961 Assist. Secretary for International Labor Spearheads for Democracy 2adio sho0 in India 0ith Asho e 3ehta 4The Truth about the American Economic System4 Author, teacher After 1961 The Ne0 American Ideology The American Disease Perestroi a for America /ie0s on ideology /ie0s on labor attach7 8ualifications INTERVIEW 1 &: T is is Morris Weisz interviewing George Cabot Lodge on is wor) in t e government and since t en in t e field of international labor. Today is Wednesday, February 24, 1993, and we are seated in George.s beautiful otel room in Was ington, D.C., and e as been )ind enoug to give us some time to be interviewed for our Labor Diplomacy Oral History Pro2ect. George, would you tell us your bac)ground and ow you got into t e Labor Department and into international wor)3 LODGE9 I 0as a ne0spaper reporter after graduating from Har,ard College in 1950. I 0ent to 0or for the Boston Herald as a political reporter co,ering the state house, and I 0as firmly con,inced that my life 0as going to be in journalism. One of the reasons 0as that I had such a bad stutter that I could hardly spea , so I concluded that I had to do something 0hich in,ol,ed 0riting rather than tal ing. One day I inter,ie0ed the Secretary of Labor, :ames P. 3itchell, 0hen he came to ma e a speech in Bangor, 3aine. He landed at the airport in Boston and I dro,e in the car 0ith him from Boston to Bangor. I remember I as ed him 96 8uestions. I had them all 0ritten out from ha,ing researched his life in the ne0spaper morgue. At the end of the inter,ie0 he said, 4Listen, I need a speech 0riter, so 0hy don't you come do0n and 0rite speeches for me?4 For a ,ariety of reasons, 0hich I 0on't go into no0, that sounded appealing. Among other things, the pay 0as three times 0hat I 0as ma ing as a ne0spaper reporter, so at great personal sacrifice so to spea I 0ent to Washington. &: 4ou were married at t e time3 LODGE9 I 0as married. I had three children. I came do0n and 0ithin about a month miraculously I found myself Director of Information in the Department of Labor, 0hich 0as a ,ery big job for somebody li e me 0ho at the time 0as 27 years old. I had flags behind my des and field offices and lots of staff and 0e put out all the publications of the Department of Labor. Then in :une of that year--I 0ent do0n there in about February- -it 0as the famous year that the 2ussians came bac into the International Labor Organi1ation (ILOA after an absence of, I guess, since World War II. &: Would t is ave been 19533 LODGE9 This 0as 1954, I belie,e. &: O , yes, Wil)ins ad been t e... LODGE9 Wil ins 0as the Assistant Secretary. So the 2ussians came bac into the ILO, because all of the data on forced labor in the Gulag 0as beginning to come out in those years, and it 0as coming out through the ILO, so that the ILO Conference that year 0as peculiarly eBciting politically. There 0as an item on the agenda to pass a con,ention on forced labor on the basis of all of this documentation. So the Secretary, 3r. 3itchell, 0as concerned about the debate and the contro,ersy. The 2ussian delegate 0as a ,ery distinguished 2ussian diplomat, Amosas Aritunian (phoneticA, 0ho I thin later 0ent on to become the So,iet Ambassador to Canada at a time 0hen Canada 0as the place 0here 2 the So,iet North American spy ring 0as organi1ed. Aritunian 0as one of their real hotshots. The Secretary 0as concerned about the delegation, so he said to me one day, 4Loo , you better go 0ith the delegation to Gene,a.4 And I said, 4But 0hat am I supposed to do?4 And he said, 4Well, I don't no0. I can't ma e you a member of the delegation because you don't no0 anything. Why don't you just...4 &: If I )new Mitc ell, e did not say, 64ou don.t )now anyt ing.6 LODGE9 Well, implicit 0as... I mean I had no portfolio 0hich 0ould justify my official presence on the delegation. I 0asn't an eBpert in anything, and so he said, 4Why don't you just go and ma e yourself useful.4 So I read e,erything I could read on forced labor and I remember getting on the plane at Idle0ild Airport, as it 0as then called, 0ith a trun , literally a trun , full of all of this data coming out about forced labor in Cthe So,iet .nionD. &: E8cuse me, t e ead of our delegation t en was our Assistant Secretary for International Labor Affairs Ernest Wil)ins3 LODGE9 That's right. So I got on the S0iss Air plane, and as you remember in those days Go,ernment officials 0ent first class, so I 0as sitting in the first class cabin of S0iss Air, sopping up ,od a, 0hen 0ho should come and sit beside me but Warren Burger, 0ho 0as then a young assistant to... &: A member of t e Delegation 9to t e ILO Conference:3 LODGE9 Ees. He 0as an Assistant Attorney GeneralF later, of course, he 0ent on to become Chief :ustice of the Supreme Court. So there 0e 0ere sitting neBt to each other, enjoying the hospitality of S0iss Air, and he said, 4By the 0ay, do you no0 anything about the ILO?4 And I said, 4Boy, do I no0 anything about the ILOG4 and I ga,e a speech gro0ing out of all of the briefing documents that I had been collecting, telling him about the ILO. He said, 4Because I am...4--I forget 0hat his title 0as, but he 0as an assistant delegate or something li e that. So 0e got to no0 each other ,ery 0ell in that S0iss Air plane, and 0hen 0e got there, of course, the rest of the Free World 0as loo ing to the .nited States for leadership. The French and the British and e,erybody else 0ere saying, 4What are 0e going to do about this ,ery important debate coming up on forced labor and 0ho is going to say this and 0ho is going to say that and so on?4 Well, for one reason or another, 3r. Wil ins 0asn't feeling 0ell. He had a bad stomach problem and he 0as in his room. He had a difficult time, I thin , in those early years ma ing a decision. The debate came nearer and nearer, and 0e in the ..S. Delegation 0ere not ,ery 0ell organi1ed. So I said to myself, 4What am I supposed to do no0?4 and I remember calling 3r. 3itchell and saying, 4Eou no0, 0e ha,e a bit of a problem here. The Free World is loo ing to us for leadership, and 0e are not really ,ery 0ell set up.4 (Pause in the tapeA Well, so any0ay, I 0as in,ol,ed in 0riting speeches for Warren Burger and the others 0ho 0ere leading the debate on force labor and... 3 &: Was P il Delaney t ere3 LODGE9 Phil Delaney 0as there for the AFL-CIO. So that's 0hat I did and then a year or so later--I don't remember eBactly, in 1956 perhaps.--3r. Wil ins 0as ill and resigned and the Secretary appointed me Assistant Secretary. At the time, I said, 4Are you sure that you 0ant to name me to this job?4 because at that time I still had a ,ery bad stutter. I said, 4Ho0 am I going to lead the Free World against the forces of e,il, if I can't spea ?4 He said, and I'll ne,er forget it, 4Don't you 0orry about it. I don't 0orry about it.4 So I said, 4O ay.4 I remember the day I o,ercame my stutter. We 0ere at an ILO Conference in :une of 1956. Amosas Aritunian (phoneticA 0as still the 2ussian delegate, and he 0as ma ing a speech in 0hich he referred to the Taft-Hartley Act as 4the sla,e labor act.4 The rule 0as that if the So,iet delegation or any of the other delegations too a crac at the ..S. and named the ..S., 0e had to... &: to ma)e an immediate reply. LODGE9 ...0e had to stand up and say something. So I said, 4O ay, here it is.4 .p goes my hand and I climbed those stairs in the old League of Nations Building there, you no0 the Palais des Nations. It must be fifty feet up to the podium, and there's Aritunian li e a bear behind the podium glaring do0n at me.
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