Queensland
Parliamentary Debates [Hansard]
Legislative Assembly
TUESDAY, 19 NOVEMBER 1912
Electronic reproduction of original hardcopy
Adjournment. [19 NovEMBER.] Wee JVlcwy1·egor Tramway. 2527
LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY.
TUESDAY, 19 NOVE)IBER, 1912.
The SPEAKER (Ron. W. D. Armstrong, Lockyer) took the chair at half-past 3 o'clock.
PAPER. The following paper, laid on the table; was ordered to be printed:- Statistics for the State of Queensland: for the year 1911. QUESTION. CouxcrL's OPINION-RESTORATION OF PATENTS .. Mr. FIHELLY (Padd·ington) asked the Secretarv for Public Instruction- " i. On what date w WEE MACGREGOR TRAMWAY AGREE MENT BILL. I~ITI.ATION. The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS CHon. \Y. T. Paget, 1fiackay) moved- " That the House -,,ill, at its next sit ting, resolve itself into a Committee of the vYhole to consider of the desirable ness of introducing a Bill to empower the Commissioner for Railwa:~' to enter into an agreement with the Macgregor Cloncurry Copper Mines, Limited, with respect to the construction by the com pany of a tramway connecting its 1nines with the Malbon to Sulieman Creek State Railway." Mr. RYAN (Barcoo): From the form in which this motion has been moved by the Secretary for Railways, I see that this. must mean a syndicate railway, and I regret that the Secretary for Railways has not seen fit to give some explanation as to the nature of the agreement which is proposed to be entered into with the Macgregor Cloncurry Copper Mines, Limited. He might have known when I called "Not formal" that my desire was to obtain whatever informa tion he might be pleased to give. The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I will give· the information at another stage. Mr. RYAN : It is well known to the han. gentleman that this party is opposed to syndicate railways, and it must also be well known to him, and to the Government, that proposals in the nature of syndicate rail ways are likely to meet with very strenuous opposition from this side of the House. It Mr. Ryan.~ 2528 Wee Macgregor Tramway [ASSEMBLY.] Agreement Bill, .is the general desire to cloee the session on leads to a eul de sac. It does not go through December 6th, and I do not think the han. pastoral or agricultural country,_ and _the~e gentleman is likely to facilitate that result fore it i~ distinctly a miueral !me w1th 1ts by not giving information when " not attendant circumstances-that is to say, every formal " is called to a motion of this kind. 100 000 tons of ore taken out brings the end w~ are !'bsolutely in the dark, if we allow of ~sefulness nearer whereas a line passing .this motiOn to go, as to the nature of the through a district' in which _there is not proposal. only mineral areas, but agncultural . and The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS; We have pastoral interests, provid~s a contmual till sunrise to-morrow. freight. The proposal wh10h the Mmis~er seeks leave to introduce is one by whwh Mr. RYAN: Till sunrise to-morrow, but the Commissioner can enter into an agr~e .still there will be one stage passed in which ment to supply certain material on whwh we can put up a fight on this matter, and interest will be paid at the rate of 5 per there must be some special reason why the cent. The company will do all the wc;>rk, hen. gentleman has not seen fit to give us which is estimated to be about two-thuds an idea of the nature of the agreement. of the total value. The construction of the I trust some other member of the Cabinet line will supply work for a 11umber of men, will see fit to rise and give an explanation and wiil open up a district the reports of as to what this proposal means. It rna: be which we know from our own departmental that this party rna;;· desire to move an officers arc of a verv satisfactory nature; amendment to this motion with a view to that will ~ive work "to miners .for a long enlarging the scope of it, otherwise, if we time, and ~ill supply the. Comi~Iissioner wit_h afterwards proceed with the Bill, we may frei..,hts outward and freights mward. It ts find that we will be tied down by the a ·p~oposal that has in it all the elements motion. From the Press reports which I of good business, ':'nd I . hope han. _membe~s saw quite recently, I conclude that this mat will be content With this mformat10n until ter has been before a meeting of the party, thev see the Bill which will be introduced m and it must be that every Minister is ac quainted with the nature of the proposal, du0 course. ' and before it goes through, I trust some Mr. RYAN: What about payment of the member on the front Treasury bench will principal? rise and give us some information, and if The PREMIER : It is merely proposed to it is not forthcoming, I trust some other provide rails and sleepers on a payi~ent of member on this side of the House will en 5 per cent. per annum, With the nght to deavour to elicit the information I have en take up our rails whenever we want them. deavoured to elicit. Mr. MAY: Will you have the right of re The PREMIER (Hen. D. F. Denham, purchase? Oxley) : In order to facilitate business, and with a view to relieve the hen. member's The PREMIER: Yes, all that is provide~; mind, I think, when he sees the Bill to they can either purch!'se from the Commis morrow, he will be quite satisfied that this sioner or the Commissioner can purchas~ is not what is technically known as a syndi from them. As for scr,ap iron, rr.ils that cate line. To begin with, it is a tramway have been laid down many years have line to be built under the Mining Act. Leen taken up and found tc;> be m pe~ fect or.der. It is a sound busm.ess _Propo~I Mr. LENNON : What will be the gauge? tion, and the House can deal with It c;>n Its The PREMIER : 3 feet 6 inches. Last merits as such. The hou. member ;sa1d .he year, before I came to the Chief Secretary's desired some information. I have g1ven m office, negotiations had been entered into fnrmation which I think is Sl}fficient, a?d with my predecessor by the Wee Macgregor I sincerely hope the Hou~e will _deal w!th people for the construction of a I'ailway on the Bill on its merits. It IS a proJect whwh the same principle and terms and condi should be dealt with in the sa.me m~nner tions as the Mount Elliott line, and the as any other railway-purely on Its merits. negotiations had proceeded pretty well to Mr. LENNON (Herbert): I listened w~th .the v>int of signing on, but I must confess great care to the statement of the Premier I wao not enamoured of the proposal in that givmg information that the Secretary fer form. Towards the end of last session the Railways evidently desired not to convey to 0ompany was desirous that we should com plete arrangements. I was not very in the Committee. dined so to do, because at that time I was The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: Not at all. not fully satisfied as to the mineral-bearing Mr. LENNON: The Premier told us that qualities of the neighbourhood. Now, the it was proposed to enter in~o agree.ment, proposal before the House is quite a dif but it did not mean a syndicate railway. ferent thing. The mining company proposes That was a mere euphemism. to lay the tramway bed and do all the work The PHEMIER: I was asked for .informa in connection therewith, and the Bill simply tion, and I have given it. I thmk that asks that the Commissioner may enter into negotiations with the company for the use is a fair thing. of rails and sleepers, the estimated value of Mr. LENNON : The hon. gentleman has which is approximately £27,000, on which inferred that this agreement will provide, the company will pay the Commissio11er 5 amongst other things, for the supply of rails per centum per annum. The Bill that and sleepers on payment of interest 31nnually will oo SU·bmittt>cl to-morrow will give just at 5 per cent. Whilst it may _be .a fa1r retur_n the outlines of the agreement, but it is a on the rails, anyone knows It Is not a fa!r proposition of a business character, and can return on sleepers, because the sleepers 111 l:e considered by the House altogether apart, twenty years will be as rotten as the agree I talm it, from party predilections as to ment itself. what comes under the category of syndicates The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I suppose or c1herwise. It is a vast mineral area which the line has to be maintained. [Mr. Ry~'', Wee Jl!laegregor Tramway [19 NovEMBER.] Agreement Bill. 252!) ::.Vir. LENKOJ\": \Ve know, if the line is a sleeper. The only part of the line that taken over by the Secretary for Railways time will have any eftect on-the rails and m twenty years' time, the sleepers will not the sleepero-the Government are supplying; be worth removing; the rails might be and the company are going to find the worth taking up, but I am satisfied, from labour and do the earthwork. I never my own experience of the North, that the listened to a more absurd proposaL Why sleepers wiil not be worth carting away. do not the Government build the line them The hon. gentleman also inadvertently de selves? I have no doubt that the line will precated mineral lines, which he said were pay; but why don't the Government borrow not like lines ·going through pastoral dis the money and build the line themselves? tricts. He said the railway would depcmd Then they would have the /llatter in their on the mineral resource" of the district, and own hands. If this goes to a division, I will in a few years' time those resources might vote against the proposaL peter out, and we will find the railway a non :\1r. WIENHOLT (Fassifern): I just wish paying one. As a matter of fact, what he al to say that, though I intend to support the ludes to as mineral railwa;.. , at the present motion now before the House, I do not wish time are the best pa,ving railways in the State, it to be understood that I bind myself in and some of the railways he spems to regard any way as to what position I shall take up as of supreme importance, like the Killarney when I see the Bill. line and others going through agricultural and dairying districts, do not pay, and can Mr. MURPHY (Burke): The Premier not pay. because the carrying of cream on has pointed out that he is desirous of bring our railways is not a very paying proposition. ing the se;sion to a close early next month; Though the carrying of copper matte is a and I think it would be better to allow this different matter by means of horses, and railway connectiDn v,ith the Wee Macgregor though I would very much prder this rail to stand over until the Government can raise way to some of the railways that have been the money and construct the railway. That turned down, I thiiJ.k it would be very much ''"ill give more satisfaction to the member for the district and the people he repre bettc:r for this ~ailway to be constructed as a State railway. sents. The PRE}llER: I should not have as much Yrr. MAY (Flinders): I may ,,a:· at once confidence in building it as a State railway. that I want a line constructed from the Malbon line to the Wee Macgregor; and Mr. Ml:RPHY: That was precisely the when one is constructed it will have to go attitude taken up by the hon. gentleman's further, because there is an illimitable belt predecessor with regard to the Mount of copper in the neighbourhood. \Ve might Elliott line and sundry other railways; yet, sav it will not bo until the Day of Judgment almost as soon as those railways were com that the ore in that diccrict iR worked out. pleted, the Government took them over. So I am only sorry the line has been brought far as the '"-ee Macgregor peo2_1le a.re con forward as a syndicate line. Of course, we cerned, they have an opportunity under the cannot say unhl we have studied the agree tramway provisions of tho Mining Act of mont what it is to be; but, from the infor building tramways to connect with the exist mation vve have received, it appears to be ing railway ; and we know that several purely a syndicate line. tramways have already been constructed The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: \Yould you under those provisions of the Mining Act. call the Th!ount Elliott Railway a syndicate, In the case of Stannary Hills and Mount line? Molloy, no application had to be made to Parliament for the construction of their . Mr.. MAY: It was a syndicate line until tra1nways. 1t was taken over; and whjln the Govern ment see this line will pay, the same as the Mr. GRANT: How are they paying? Mount Elliott line, they will take it over in The SPEAKER : Order ! the same way. I have no doubt it will pay tho same as the Duchess line, which paid Mr. MURPHY: They are not paying too from tho time th0 first train started. I will well. I do not see why at this late hour of have more to say on the question when I the session members should be asked to con have seen the agreement. If they are sider a railway proposal that was only allowed to do so, tho company building the brought to light during the past few weeks, line will put up the fares and freight 50 and which the member for the district and or 70 per cent. more than is paid on the the people of that district are not anxious Government railways in the North; and it to get as a syndicate rail way. should be specified in the agreement that they should not charge more than is charged Mr. GRANT (Fitzroy): I am going to on the Government lines. support this motion, because the people in terested in the construction of the railway Mr. PAYNE (Jf itchell) : I regard the pro arc going to find two-thirds of the cost, and posal before the Chamber as a shandy-gaff the line will open up a lot of virgin mineral kind of affair. Seeing that the Government country. I will always support lines to are prepared to find the rails and the mineral fields, where the people of the dis sleepers, is it not peculiar that they am not trict are takin/2" some of the risk themselves. prepared to do the n·'t of the work? I The Mount Elliott people took a certain think this proposal will prove more com amount of risk; and that is what the Wee plicated than a straight-out syndicate rail ::\1acgregor people are going to do. The only way. It ~ill be very difficult in a year or way we can help the mining industry is by two to arnve at any reasonable undPrstand giving cheap means of transport, and if they ing with regard to taking the line over or are willing to pay two-thirds of tho cost, selling the line. and we are getting 5 per cent. on our money, The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: It is per I think it is a fair business proposition. fectly clear in the agreement. Mr. THEODORE (Chillagoe): I do not Mr. PAYNE : I do not know how you agree with the han. member who has just .are going to make allowance for the life of resumed his seat as to tho risk taken by the 1912-7 Q Jlh·. TheodoreJ 2530 Wee Macgregor Tramway [ASSEMBLY.] Agreement Bill. people who are going to construct this rail return from this line. I think as a representa W."-Y·. I grant that the people resident in the tive of an agricultural district th«t this line d1strrct-prospectors and . others-ar:e going will benefit the whole of Queensland, and I to bea.r a large burden m connectiOn with have very much pleasure in supporting it. the r~1lway; b':lt the persons who are going t~ b';11ld the railway are not resident in the Mr. HARDACRE (Leichhardt) : The hon. distrwt.. The people constructing the rail gentleman who just sat down said that the Way Will have the use of a large sum of farmers looked beyond their farms sometimes. mone,Y from the Government to further their That is ,an unusual attitude for ,farmers to own 1pte~·ests; and the people who reside in take up. ~he distnct, who are not connected with the The SECRETARY FOR AGRICULTURE : Not «t mterests of the company, who will be all. workers for. the company, who will have to stand the ~Igher cost of living brought about Mr. HARDACRE: I ask the hon. member by the existence of a syndicate railway for Drayton what attitude he would take those are the people who will carry risk up-- w_ith<;mt any commensurate return. In thes~ The SPEAKER : Order ! The hon. mem distncts, the Wee Macgregor peopl Jmow where we are if the Government is " (2) That the plan, section, and book h_ui1ding the railway. That would be a of reference be forwarded to the Legisla c.tnmple way of doing it, and a business way. tive Council for their approval, by mes The PREMIER : This is equally simple, .and sage in the usual for~/' much better for the Gov·ernment. Mr. GRANT: I cannot vote for this motion for one or two reasons: one is, that Mr. HARDACRE: This is not simple at the House should be given very mu later ? And in spite of their repeated Mr. THEODORE: I have no doubt thar promises, that no fresh lines would be in troduced this session, here we have another in Committee the Minister for Ra1lw~ys:, new line proposed. I say the Government will give us a good dea! of mfo_rma!w;' railway policy will not stand inspection. I that is essential to a proJect of thLS kmo. want to know, before I vote for this line, The SECRETARY FOR HAIL WAYS: I will give· the prospect of this line paying. Has the you all the information possible. Etheridge line paid? Has not the Govern ment had to spend £41,000 in making up the Mr. THEODORE: I think that all ,avail, 2~ per cent. interest necessary up.der the able information should be given, ano. th>:t agreement? Has the Stannary Hills line the hon. member for Fitzroy was fully Justi paid ? Has the Mount Garnet Railway paid ? fied in the questions he has raised. I have Has the Mount Molloy Railway paid ?-all in risen at this stage m order to refer. bnefiy that district. to the remarks of the hon. member m CO';' nection with the mineral resources of tins Mr. MuRPHY: They never cost the State a penny. district. I am sure that he is l~bourmg.· under an absurd delusion when he 1magmes Mr. GRANT: All the more reason whv that those mineral resources are exhausted. this should not cost the State a penny. Here No person w·ho has any knowledge of the are four mineral lines in one district, and district would ever advance such a supposi we art' asked to pay £127,000 in building tion. It is quite well known that many of another· line. Under the agreement the the richer pockets of ore are worked out m, Chillagoe people collect £100,000, and got North Queensland, but it is al.so well known 4 per cent. from the Government for it. a,nd no one who knows anythmg of Northern Treasury bills that can be bought and sold Queemland can deny-that there are st1lL any day because they have the security of vast undeveloped mineral resources. In or~er the country behind them, and although the to instruct the hon. gentleman, I wo'-!1~ hke· Government have to get 3 per cent. from the to point out that the mining _authont;es m Chillagoe Company if the line does not pay, Qucens:and have prepa~ed ~ l;st of ;nmeral what security .is th~ye behind tl>..o Chillago-e products existing in th,Is d1strwt whwh e_an Company? When the Many Peaks line was be worked profitably 1f transport fam)lties passed we got an estimate from the Mount and cheap coal and coke are p_rovided. Morgan Company of the tonnage of ore in The metallic nroducts known to ex1st the;re· sigFit and the ore reserve. vVhen the Dawson include: Copp.er, tin, ~ilver, lea~, gold, J:ns Valley line was passed, we got the same muth, anti1nony, zinc, Iron, plattnun1, rut~le, estimate, and the Government Geologist's molybdenum, wolfram, coal. Non-metalhc: estimate of so many million tons of coal Limestone, gypsurn, flu?~spar, asbestos.. The there. hon. gentleman is smihn!l',.. but he snnp.ly Mr. WINSTANLEY: Not worth the paper it does not know the poss!hiht~es .of .that dis is written on. trict when he imagines that It 1s nearly exhausted. Mr. GRANT: Do you mean to say the The CHAIHMAN : I must ask the han. Government Geologist's report is not worth the paper it is written on? member to address the Chair and not the· han. member. Mr. 'VINSTANLEY: Yes. Mr. THEODORE : The ~~n. member. is Mr. GRANT: Well, on what ground ar:e apparentlv basing his oppositiOn to the !me· you going to support this line? on the gr~und that the district is worked out: but that is absurd, because those who _kn~w Mr. THEODORE: Actual test. the district know that m sp1to of mme~al wealth that has been taken out, there are· Mr. GRANT: Tests of the coal itself. still very large quantities of ore to ~e de Mr. THEODORE: Yes. veloped, and which can be worked pro~t- ably so long as cheap coal and coke are avml Mr. GRANT: What is to support the coal able. It can safely be stated that . i¥J:ou':t if the mineral is not there? If the copper Molloy would be a profitable propositl~t £i or lead ores are not there, what is to sup tbcy had not to pay £2 15s. for coke an port the mine ? for coal. The same can be. said about Mo':'nt Mr. THEODORE : You are labouring under Garnet, O.K .. and other mmes m the distrwt. a delusion. I shall have something more to say when we The PRE:.IiiER : Wait until the Minister go into Committee on the questwn. give•o all the facts. Mr. WIENHOLT: I am entirely opposed to this railway-in the first. place, be~ause· Mr. GRANT: I want to give timely the people of the country w1ll regard It as notice of the sort of information that I think: should be given in introducing a railway a distinct breach of faith; and, secondbly, of this kind. if it is true, as stated by the h<;m. mem er for Fitzroy, that the company 1s gomg to The PREMIER : The Minister does not need take a certain amount of Go_v<;'rnmen~ st.ock, any instruction. I say that that is a most vwwus pr.mmple, and I shall do my best to oppose It from Mr. GRANT: Doesn't he? He needs a. start to finish. good deal of instruction sometimes. Here is a line the Government introduce after the. iVh-. RYAN: That applied to the previous Premier stating that ther<> would be no line also. lines introduced this session. We hear that; Mr. WIENHOLT: This is giving the the map of Europe is to be changed by the Balkan war, and the Premier is chang capit.alist a chance, where the small man adndd ing his railway policy just as quickly. :r: the farmer has no chance at a~l. ~e&'ar e cannot support this line unless I am thor as a business proposition, I thmk :t IS .also oughly assured that there are plenty of extremely doubtful. But I opp~se. 1t lhie~~ mineral resources to develop, and that the. as a breach of faith. We were d1s~mct Y to d railway will pay. during the session that no new hues woul be passed, and that the lines at present. [Mr. Gran~. ll:E ount Mulligan [19 NovEMBER,] Branch Railway. :passed would be completed before any new affords a fair inducement in that direction. lines would be started. When I told the On the other hand, I feel that I ough_t to people in the country who were affected by oppose any line, whether to Mount Mulligan this, their common sense made them take it or anywhere else, until the. North Coa~t line ,exceedingly well. How can I explain now to is pushed on with more vigour than It has them, in the face of the promises made by been in the past. It has been stated from the Government, that there are other rail the Treasury benches within the last two or ways being brought in which will be con three months that no fresh railway pro structed before the railways already passed? posals would be introduced this session. That It is exactly like a lot of people waiting at statement was supposed to allay all doubts ,the door of a theatre who expect the doors and all hopes on the part of the people to be opened at 7 o'clock, and an announce throughout the length and breadth of the ment io made that through some failure in land, and then, without any apology or the arrangements they cannot explanation at all the Government comes [4.30 p.m.] open until half-past 7. There may down to-day and 'pi:oposes two additional be a certain amount of grumbling lines How will the people regard these but they recognise the inevitable. But im prop~sals, who haye had their partic':'lar mediately after the doors are opened, and lines turned down? As -I stated at startmg, two men from awac· at the back get in I approach this matter with mixed feelings, first. One can naturally understand a con and I therefore have to suspend judgment, siderable amount of grumbling under those and if the Government can satisfy the Com conditions, and rightly so. I do not say the mittee that the inducements to construct a 'Government or the State are being exactly State line to Mount Mulligan are sufficient, bribed, but the company are undertaking possibly I will support the line.. If they do to take up £100,000 worth of Govern not satisfy my mind on that pomt, ~ reserve ment stock, which is in itself an ex to· myself the right to onpose the hne, JUSt cellent invcctment. No trustee could do as I opposed every other· synd_icate !ine.,_ The better than invest in Queensland Go remarkable thing in connectiOn with ,hose vernment stock at 4 per cent. }J. condi t..-o proposoJs is : in the case of the present tion of that sort does more to damage the one the Government propose to run a branch credit of the State than anything I can p;:,s line connecting with a syndicate railway, i>ibly mention. I suppose we have no hope and in the other case they propose to run a of tho Premier or the Secretary for Rail syndicate railwav to connect wlth a G'?vern " ays, but as it is a non-party measure, we melt linf'. The Government should go. Ill for have a chance of appealing to the Treaatner, all svndicate railways or all St de raih a:• s. and see how he looks unon a condition 0f The lwescnt proposa:l is a sort of " ~ow '''?U this sort. The han. gentleman has just see it and now you don't." There IS no dis floated a loan of £2,000,000 in London, which trict in Australia so rich in mineral resour~s I am pleased to see has been very success as that particular district, but whether It ful. Now the Government are going to break will offer sufficient inducement for the c~n faith with the country for a paltry £100,000. struction of a line costing £4,080 per mile We have all our railway propositions before is another matter. I think the Secretary for us, which will cost millions in the next two Railwavs should have affDrded the House ,or three years, and for the sake of £100,000 more ;;;formation. We know very well th>:t we are going to throw that promise away, influential gentlemen are at the head of this and the people of the country will not know Mount Mulligan syndicate_, and they, pos where they are. I do not wish to delay the sibly have been able to mfluence the Go measure at this stage, although I intend to vern~ent to construct this when otheJ:S have vote against it right through, as I do not bee;; unable to get railways. think it is a just proposal. In regard to a Tho SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: Not in business proposition, there is one thing that fluence them improperly. men should avoid, and that is to be narrow and parochial. At the same time, I do not Mr. LENNON: I do not know. I hope, think the proposition, from the country's of course, that the G'overnment will be able point of view, is a sound one. In the pro to satisfy the Committee that the resources position we have already passed, I find from of Mount Mulligan are such that the. State the Premier's statement that two-thirds of is justif1ed in spending £100,000 odd m th.e the cost is to be taken up by the company con Valley line to its terminus. What is right mier recently in connection with this rail- for one ought to be right for the other, and way that one seam can be worked for the from what I remember of the reports given next 200 years. Of com·se, whether tbat will in connection with the :Dawson Valley line, eventually turn out to be correct or not, they were a great deal more favourable none of us will be able to tell. So far as the than the information laid on the table of the coal seams are concerned, they are not so. House· in connection with the Mount Mulli liable to cut out as gold seams. I think the gan line. Personally, I am of the opinion construction of this railway will be of great that we should only go in for one kind of assistance to the Chillagoe district. Thw railways-that is, State railways. That is deputy leader of the Labour party, Mr. Th~o the policy of this party-we stand against dore, gave us an intting speech wi!h syndicate railways every time, and that is the regard to the mineral resources of the Chil reason ·why I voted against the line brought lagoe district and of course, we always before· the House a while ago. It seems to know that th~ me~ber for the district can me the Government have done what the generally make out an excellent. cas<>; for a hon. member for Fassifern said-they have railway which is going to ~ssist his own broken faith with the country twice. They district still at the same time, we must have stated to the country they were going nealise 'that this railway will open up a big on with a vigorous railway policv. They coal mine at Mount Mulligan which w~ll said that before they went to the· country. enable the small working miner to obtam It was going to be pressed on very rapidlv, cheap fuel, and that, of. coUI·s~, will be of and gomg to be accomplished in a short great assistance to the mmmg mdustry. As time, and the very first thing after they one who represents a mining distric~, I a;n were returned to the House they had to say always prepared to give a vote w_hi_ch wiii they had not the money to go on with those assist in tho development of any mmmg dis railway propositions. trict, and I hope when we get mto Com The PRE1IIER: That is not true. Utterly mittee the information given by the Secre-. untrue, because we are doing it. tary for Railways will be satisfa?tory_, and that we will be able to support this railway. Mr. ADAMSON: Whv have some of those railv:ays been stopped "if the Government Mr. BARBER (Bundaberq); It see~s. to· have the money to go on with them? me that if the prospects of this propositiOn are as good as they have been made out. by The PREi\flER: Till they reach the point to the Secretary for Railways and the Premier, which thBy were intended to be carried. the Government should have undertaken to· Mr. ADAMSON: Did the Premier say build the line themselves. that thB Dawson Vallev linB had bBen The PRE}IIER : What line? carried to the point wherB it was intended The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: vVe propos€l' to stop? to build it. The PREi\HER: "With no vote on the Esti The PRE}IIER: This is a State railway. mates this year, yes. Mr. BARBER: It is not a State railw>;y Mr. ADAMSON: Why did the hon. in the sense that we understand State. rail gentlen spent per Fihelly Stnven~: Foley Stodart annum _on the Great Western and North Forsyth Swayne C?ast ]ID(<·s than was anticipatC>d when the GHdr1y Theodore Bills were before the House. It was nhen Gillies Trout stated that between £9.000,000 and Grayson Vowles £10.000,000 would be required, and that it Gunn VJp],oby Hardacre White ":'auld take nearly ten yeurs to construct the Yvi!liams lmf'A; therefore, I do not think an accusa Hodge Hunter ., VVinstanley tiOn of u?-necessary delay should be made. and Mr. McCormack. No _man IS more anxious than I am to S€e Tellr,-s: Mr. Douglas agrwu!tural lines . built in various districts NOES} 5. as rapidly as possible: .and if I thouo-ht this Mr. Barber Mr. Luke would delay the construction of those~lines I Coyne vl'ienholt would vote against it: but it appPars to :me Grant that no ~uch delay will occur owing to the Tellers: Mr. Grant and Mr. Wienholt. mtroductwn of this measure. Resolved in the affirmative. jJf r. Bebbington.] 2536 Mount Mulliyan [ASSEMBLY.] Branch Railway. COMMITTEE. Commissioner for Railways with the coal necessary for the carrying on of the work in (111r. J. Stodart, Logan, in the chair.) the Uairns system of Government lines, on The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: an agreement that would be reasonable and The prol'osit!On before the Committee is the acceptable to the Commissioner. Just here eonstructwn of a State railway from a point I might read a letter in that direction. on the Chillago0 Railway, near Dimbulah, :Mr. RYAN: TheY will raise the money on to a place called Mount Mulli the strength of us passing the railway? [5 p.m.] g!tn, to the North, where exten- sive coal measures have been The SECRETARY .FOR RAILWAYS: found and partially• developed, and they Why shouldn't the• have been reported on by those who have Mr. RYAN: \Yh) shouldn't the State do lately been working the propositions. In it? July last the Premier made a statement in The PRDIIER: So they probably wou:d this House that no new lines would be in next year. troduced this session, and he made use of Mr. RYAN : I am glad that you adm:t these words. After saying that the lines that you cannot do it this year. whwh were under construction would be Tho PRE)UER: '1Ye got all v,e asked for, pushed forward until completion at a point which the other States could not get. when they would be made reproductive, he .Mr. RYAX: You cannot get away from the went on to say- fact that they are raising the money on " Further, it is not practicable to the strength of us paE.oing· the railway. table the plans of any railways this ses The PRE1IIER: Tho public interest necessi swn, the sLn·;·eyors and drafting staff tates the building of the line, and it is the bemg fully occupied in .getting ready public interest that we have got to consider. the workmg plans of railways now in hand." The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I He also >Yent on to say- will read the letter at some other timi'J. The " I ho1ce that thi' work mav be so far question for the Committee to consider is forward. by next session as 'to warrant thi•·, that as soon as the money will be made the _tablmg of o_ther very desirable con available, and as no line authorised by nect1ons, devrations, and extensions." this House will be delayed by the construc This proposal now before the House may tion of this line-the question for the Com· be looked upon somewhat as departing from mittee to consider is not whether it is a the course laid down by the l€ader of the departure from the statement made by the Governmc·nt on July 31st. Premier given in July last-a statement Mr. RYAN.= So it is, absolutely. You have made in perfect good faith, and the state no explanatwn to show that is otherwise. ment which I make now is also made in perfect good faith-I say that the only The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: question which we have got to consider I would pomt this out that the surveys and is whether we are prepared as a Com the plans and specifications for this line mittee to assist a big portion of mineral were not carried out bv Government sur country in North Queensland to live a long veyors. The Government' surveyors were not life by allowing them to get cheaper fuel !aken from the work they were engaged on than they can get at p~esent, which is m ord<;r to . expedite It. The surveys in absolutely necessary for carrying on the low eonnectwr: with the proposal now before us grade propositions, or wbJ:lther we are not. were earned out by the Chillagoe Company's The company will provide the coal for the surveyors. In that direction, therefore, it use of the Commissioner on the Cairns sys was not a departure from the poliq laid tem-! will give the amounts later-on an down. · agreement that will be made to the satis Mr. J'lfURPHY: Who will pav those sur- faction of the Commissioner, and the com veyors? · pany is prepared to purchase 4 per cent. The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS- debentures to the extent of the cost of the The Railway Department, I presume. · line. \\:""hen the negotiations were being car Mr. RYAN: It is only ,;, quibble. cied on, it was on the understanding-a ten Mr. MURPHY: Then they are Government tati,·e und0l'Standino·-that the line might cost vurveyors. £100,000, but the~ railway officers subse The SEC:RETARY FOR RAILWAYS: quently estimated the cost of the line at .J. wou!d pomt ot:t that this survey was made £125,000. ~ot With the object at that time of making Mr. HUNTER: Do the Government get a 1t a Government railway at all. guar0ntee agains.t any loss 1 Mr. RYAN : It would be better not to ex The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: plain at all. Yes. The line will be under the 1906 Act, The CHAIRMAN : Order ! and will be' exactly on all-fours with any The SEc_~ETARY FOR RAILWAYS: other railway built in this State. It is a ~h& propositiOn at that time was that the State railway pure and simple. lme should be built ~mder agreement on Mr. GILLIES: Most of it goes through the. terms and on the lines of the Etheridge Crown land. R;mlwa_Y, and after a very great deal of diScussiOn and negotiations-I did not care The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS : for the tern;s on which the Etheridge Rail It is practically all Crown land. In this way was bmlt, as I did not think thev were connection I cannot claim that it is an the_ best terms procura):>le-in t~e end, the argicultural railway. If I could claim that C~Illagoe Company said that If we built it was an agricultural railway, doubtleRS this as a Government railway upon the re it would carry a little more weight with ports of the development of the coal some of our friends in the House who repre· measureg there that they would subscribe to sent agricultural interests. I was in the 4 per cent. Treasury bills to the extent to Chillagoe district myself twelve months ago, the cost of the railway. They would not and I pro110sed to visit Mount Mulligan. <:mly do that, but they would provide the but the rivers were all flooded, and it was [Ron. W. T. Paget. Mount Mulligan [19 NovEMBER.] Branch Railwa,y. 2537 stone drive for the purpose of testing the briefly to give the tests made of this coal continuity of the seams and obtaining by th0 Railway Department from Carrns to samples for testing purposes, in accord Mareeba, climbing up the range- ance with proposals agreed upon with the Mines De.partment. " Cairns to Mareeba, full lo>:d up range. Engine steamed exceptronally " The work resulted in the location and proving of a third seam, which well. Coal reported excellent, equal to average Newcastle. Only 34 cwt. use~, .although already known and prospected as against 2 tons usually used over thrs to some extent at the outcrop, had not section. ~ previou·•ly been considered by the com " Cairns to Mareeba. Boiler. steamed pany of sufficient value to take into .account. exceptionally well th<: whole trr~. Ra_n Cairns to Mareeba wrthout cleamng ~re " The proving by the stone drift that or ash pan. Consumption per ~?n mrle "this third seam contained a portion 2 .36, as against .47 Southern coal. feet 3 inches thick of coking coal, so disposed in the seam as to be workable, Other tests show a consumption of .40, as entirely altered previously existing ideas against .47, and .38, a.s against . .47. So t.\J.e with respect to the coke question by whole of the tests earned out wrth coal smt supplying a way out of that difficulty. able for locomotive purposes show that the coal is superior to the coal brought from the "A sample of the newly opened up South. There is nothing said about the coal seam of coking coal was tested at the from the scam \\ hich is reported to be SO mine under the supervision of the In per cent. bf'tter than the coal ":e use on the spector of l'v1ines, l'vlr. Horsley, who re Cairns sy<;tem at the present tn":'e. I have ports that a sample charge of 600 lb. heard it said that 2,\; tons o.f thrs coal was yielded 287 lb. of bright hard coke, used where 4~ tons of ordmary coal was also 28~· lb. fin~ coke and coal not quite used. naked. The total would be equivalent to a yield of about 52 per cent. of the Mr. RYAN: What do you mean by ordi coal charged. This is not, comparatively nary coal? spec'tking, a high yield, but as explained The SECRETARY FOR R4ILWAYS: in the report it might have been some The coal we are using on the Carrns system. what higher but for a leaky condition vf the oven. Mr. RYAN: What coal is that? " It is still the company's intention The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAY~: that the coal from the 6 feet No. 1 seam Ipswich coal. I cannot find any o.ffimal will supply the wants of the railways record in regard to the co':'! to whrch I and other consumers for stE'am raising. refer, so I refrain from makmg use of that argument. " Accordingly a 5-ton sample of this No. 1 Fcam for a railway test was taken Mr. RYAN: Cannot you bring coal cheaper under the supervision of the Inspector from Ipswich to Cairns than from Mount of Mines from the place where the seam Mulligan to Cairns? is cut by the new stone drift, and a test The SECRETARY FOR RAILW~YS: Df this sample by the Railway Depart I will give the hon. gentleman that .mfo.r· ment is just about to be made. mation. Mr. Stones was asked ':' questron m " Steam te·,ts have already been made connection with the 2 feet 3 mches seam, of what is considered the same coal of that is the band of coal of the very best samples taken from tho old No. 1 tunnel, quality: and he said that. if he. were to and the results, though showing the un mine from it 250 tons darly, whrch. could ,creened coal to have a high percentage easily be done, there is sufficient coal m that of ash and to be rather wasteful, proved seam to last 278 years ; "o we. need n;:>t fear that it burned well in the boilers. It that the supply will run out m our. tnne, at was considered advisable, however, that any rate. 1'he Commissioner, in hrs report, the Fample to be tested by the railways savs that as only Crown lands are affected, should be taken from the point where the cost of resumption may be :egarded as it is proposed to commence operations on nominal. ·with regard to the estrmated cost, the coal in the future, and accordingly he says- . . the abovementioned 5 ton test which the " The cost of the 29 miles 27 chams rs Inspector of Mines is now arranging at estimated at £117,781, exclusive of land Cairns was decided on." and rolling-stock, equal to £4,015 per mile. To this must be added £8,000 for rolling-stock making a total of £125,781, Some of the coal was sent along just as the or £4,278 p~r mile." · Garnet, Mount Molloy, and Mungana. \Vith Hugh C. Mainwaring, and E. J .. J. Rodda. respect to revenue and expenditure, the I have here a letter which I desire to read Co1nrnissioner says- to the Committee. It is from A. J. Thynne, " The revenne at the start will be de representative of the Chillagoe Company, rived chiefly from the carriage of coal and is dated 11th November, 1912- and coke for the Chillagoe Railway and ·• The Hon. the Minister for Railways, 3Iinos, the Cairns Railways, the Ethe Brisbane. ridge linE\. and general district require ·· Sir,-\Vith reference to our var_ious ments, but given the advantage of intervi<>ws in the matter of the Mulligan cheaper fuel, which tho working of the Railway, ~;posal require a large staff of men to carry Mr. RYAN: Well, call it what you like. it out? I want to be satisfied more than " A rose by any other name would smell as the Minister has explained as to what .ar sweet." They are getting something that ~rangement will be made for carrying ma will bring a very considerable profit to their terial over the private railway of the Chil coffers, if the coal is there. lagoe Company ? The PREMIER: I hope they will get a The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: The Com profit; it is time they got some. missioner has a way-leave now to carry on Mr. RYAN: And they are getting this the work. profit at the expense of the State. Mr. RYAN: A way-leave? What is this The PREMIER : No ; they are not. way-leave? Mr. RYAN: If the profit is there, I say The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: An agree it ought to be got by the State. I am very ment for the Commissioner to run his roll pleased that the han. member for Musgrave ing-stock over another man's railway. nods assent, and I would like to see some Mr. RYAN: But he does not run his provision made by which the Government rolling-stock over another man's railway could take over that portion of the Chillagoe ~and carry material over it without paying Railway which connects with the Cairns for it. Railway system. The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I told you HoNOURABLE MEMBERS : Hear, hear ! .that we paid .l;d. per ton per mile. Mr. RYAN: If that was done a good deal Mr. RYAN: You did not say so before. of the objection that I now see to the proposal would be removed. The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: Yes, I did. Mr. WILLIAMS: Supposing the railway is Mr. MuRPHY: I did not hear you. lost? Mr. WHITE: I heard him say so. Mr. RYAN: It can be taken over now at Mr. RYAN: I did not hear the Minister a certain time under certain conditions, I say so, but I am quite willing to take his believe~ word that he did so without any other con The PREMIER : I think it is fifty years, is firmation. I do not approve of a railway it not? being made to link up with a private rail way, and no other means of getting into Mr. RYAN: I would like to see that time communication with other State railways. shortened, on just terms to the companies. Every ton of coal that goes from Mount They have an asset there now which they ~Mulligan for the Cairns Railway system value at a certain figure. Take it over at a must go over the Chillagoe Railway, and it proper vaJuation and then build that railway must be a great benefit to the Chillagoe to Mount Mulligan and let this :!rd. per ton cCompany. I have no doubt that after this per mile go into the coffers of the State; railway is passed, we shall see the shares that is, if the credit of the State is such as we of the Chillagoe Company jump up consider are led to believe it is. .ably. The bon. gentleman was candid enough The PREMIER : It is unquestioned in this in reading from some notes to say that it debate. was going to benefit both public and private Mr. RYAN: Very well; all the more railways. reason for doing what I am suggesting. The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: It must. Jt Capitalists would very readily be induced th.a t should go to the State. The Govern ment are going to commit a breach of faith We indicated that with the loan money avail with the country and a breach of faith ·rith able we could do only certain work. Now, in the pn,>qent case, a special amount of money their support ' when I •was i:n the North, but 40 inches of ful. Operations have been restricted, but there ;rain fell over that usually arid region, and is plenty of ore." Then as to Mount Molloy, .consequently the whole of the watercourses " Copper, lower grade, company reformmg, were wild torrents, and it was quite impos and with cheap fuel the mine can be worked sible to go there. I am informed that a with succ<>ss." Then as to the Mammoth, man of high reputation, a man named, I practically a new mine, " A copper and think, Watson, was going up there to re gold mine." 'Therefore, for an han. mem port on the proposition. But he was a pas ber to speak about a grand district such as senger in the Yongala, and he was lost with that extensive district as being worked out, her. This sad event delayed report. \\as saying something that was rather ~n The company then secured the services of wise, unless he had a very good foundatwn another man, and about this time laet year for making the statement. VVhat, th~_m, IS the reports came in, and whilst I was most the question? That considerable bodiCs of earnestly desirous that this line should be low-o-rade ore are now m the neighbour built, so that coal might be obtained for hood: admitted on all hands, but it is cost that big mineral district, on the report that ing .£3 5s. a ton for coke. The finding of was then submitted I was not by any means this coal dqJosic will secu;e to them ': coke satisfied. I was preosed hard by the com at a very much lesser pnce whiCh ,,nil en pany to proceed, but not being satis able minos working for no profit, or very fied, I declined to proceed. Now we little profit, to be worked succe~sfully, and have satisfied ourselves beyond all doubt will doubtless open up other d1stncts tJ:tat -beyond all reasonable doubt-and although now are neglected. As to the coal depo.sJts, I know how uncertain the s<>ams in officers of the Mines Hepartment hav': given the Bundamba. district are, every rea their finding,. The practical _workmg of •Jonable pr·ecautwn has been taken to as the railway has shown very satisfactory re sure ourselves of the permanency of the sults. As to working out the mineral o~es, coal and of the value of this that is another element, and I do not thmk [7.30 p.m.] coal. Therefore, the first propo- it can be said that the vast district round sition is supported: that there Chillagoe is in anywise exhausted. Another is a deposit. Just now, as I passed through point is this: Will the State .suffer loss? my room, I met the Under Sec~etar 0: for Ll..ssumino- for one moment that 1t rs correct Mines, Mr. Macdonald; and I thmk, Judg that the" ores are nearly exhausted, or in ing from the remarks made about t_he 1Jnder five or ten lt:ars the ores will become ex Secretary and his staff last Wflek, rt will be hausted· eve'n so. this line will be a profit allowed that he is a gentleman whose able in~e·-tment f01· the Commissioner, be word can be depended on, and I said to cause the. saving in cost of coal will J:le him: " Can it be acc.J.rately stated that the equal, at any rate, to the interf'lt that. will ores in that neighbourhood are exhausted?" be payable on the construction of the lrne. He said, and I took it down in writing, '' To . say that the ores are exhausted is utterly Mr. FoLEY: A good coal-mining proposi ridiculous." I asked, "Are you satisfied as tion is better than a goldmine any day. to the coal and investigations there?" The PREMIER : I am quite sure of that. ''Yes," he said, "and no greater service A coalmine of course, is a big factor any can be rendered to that district than cheap where. vVhere there is a big coalmine there fuel." He went on to say that if the wood you usually find industries thrive and come was denuded, they would be thrown back to the front and the main thing in this on coal or coke. Then as to the exhaustion neighbourhoo'd is that they haye discov~red of the district; that can be spoken of by a mine which they say is mexhaust1ble. those who know the district. I do not know Therefore, you have three thi':gs brought the district. I just passed through on the together. First of all the deposrt of coal of Tailway line. There are those in the House proved capacity for coke, and that means who do know the district, and can speak ch<'aper fuel to deal with the ore. You from experience. My colleague gave the have something else, which, if we were amount of money spent in that neighbour merely selfish, or wanted t~ shelye ou1·selv~s hood. Can it be possible investors would behind a statement made rn thiS House m spend .£7,000,000 on mineral areas that August, we might do it-I say if we were may, at this stage, be said to be ex merely selfish, we would have regard t9 the hausted? I asked Mr. Macdonald what population there. The large population about Einasleigh, and he said, "It is which population, unless they can get a only just Row opening up, and they have cheaper fuel, must be scattered, _and . what just completed the works at Fan wth.'' a ·''ad rebuff it would be for that brg mmeral There :vou have practically viTgin country, area of North Queensland if the present I take it, from that expr ThP PREMIER : That was the impression not many unemployed. At any rate thcrc on me· mind-that if we had adopted the have been no demonstrations and no com Ether:idge agreement we would have kept plaints. There may have been somo, but I faith with the farmers. have not heard of them but I know a num lYir. \VIENHOLT: I never mentioned the ber of men are coming f;om the neighbou~ing Etheridge. I said let them build it them States into Queensland at the present trme. selves. That number may increase, and if it does incrPa ~o, and "\Vo can find work for them on The PREMIER: I must apologise to the this lin:-- han. member for Fassifern. He says he would give them the opportunity of building Mr. RYAN: Will this line interfere with it themselves. He knov. s quite well that the the Dawson Valley and Blackall lines? proposition proposed was that of the The PREMIER : It will interfere with no Etheridge. I consider the Etheridge agree lines. Twelve lines will be finished in ment was not a good agreement. This is a April, ;md six more lines are in course of line that the Commissioner recommends. It construction. will bP readily understood that nearly every 1\..lr. GRANT: What do you mean by report that comes in from the Railway Com finished? missioner indicates that during the first year or so there will be a loss, yet the Railway The PREMIER: The Dawson Valley line Commis·Jioner says from the very jump that ;s fini·hcd down to the point where it will this line will pay more than 3 per cgnt. 2erve the Lands Department. Over 300,000 Better than tho Etheridge agreement: of acr'- 1 of land will bo brought within the course it is. In that < ase, there were con coutc ol of that line, and the So nth Aus ditions upon which wo had to repurchase, t". alian fanner:~~ to \vhon1 a pathetic refer. but here the company pays 4 per cent. for cnc ~~ ,., a·· made a few wDeks ago, will all be their stock-a price at which anybody else served from Dundee; and, if the line went can buy stock. That moneJ is to be ear on 10 miles further, thev would not go to rt, marked for a special purpose. Is that not as Dundee would be" their station. The a fair proposition? Seeing that the State Lamls Department say they would like it itself had more to gain than Chillagoe-I C'uriod on as speedily as possible to the say that advisedly. I say, much as Chillagoe coal mines. because Rannes is affected by has to gain by the construction of this prickly pear. As far as agricultural settle line, the State has more to gain. First of nlent is concerned, over 300,000 acres are all. it has to retain and preserve the reputa available. The policy of the Government has not been departed from, unless you ;e tion of that mine~al belt in the North. Then it ho. s to retain, by the operation of the gard it as a departure to F+ecure a spec_Ial line, a large population in the North. Then, sum of money for the construction of a !me further, it has to maintain a freight upon of paramount importance to the North. the railway line. That is the proposition Mr. HUNTER: The Minister says the policy put before the Committee for its deter is altered. mination, and every member of the Com The PREMIER : I am speaking for my mittee should deal with this as they do with self. The issue before the Committee is any other railway-just deal with it purely whether this is a good line. Is the coal on its merits. I can only remember one property a good property, and will ~he line railway in the ten years I have been here help North Queensland? If it will h_elp that was not what you might call dealt with North Queensland, we are justified in bm_J~ absolutely on its merits. ing the line ; and if anybody can get polrtr Mr. RYAN : Port Alma? cal satisfaction out of that, he is entrtled to it. The PREMIER : Yes. That was a line in Mr. THEODORE: In my opinion, this connection with which a great deal of pres line will prove of immeasurable benefit to sure was brought to bear. the mining industry of North Queensland, Mr. RYAN: Who brought that pressure? particularly in the hinterland of G_au·ns. Mr. THEODORE: On whom was it brought MDmbers have referred to the necessrty ol to bear? finding a cheap fuel supply, as bc;ing _of paramount importance to the mmmg m The PREMIER: We know quite well that dustry; and there is no question about that. a vote "as taken, and the amount on the The only difficulty is as to "·hether there 1s Estimates for the construction of that line sufficient coal of good quality at ~Iount was eliminated, and pressure was brought Mulligan, and whether there are sufficr~nt to bear to bring members back to the House. mineral deposits to W'1rrant the openmg However, I do not wish to deal with that 1ip of the coalmine by the construc matter. Anyhow, I do not think there tion of this costlv railway. Any hon. should be anything in the nature of pressm:e member who knows 'the resources of the dis in connection with this line, and every mem trict concerned will have no doubt in that ber of the Committee can deal with it in direction. In ill'' opinion. the coal property any manner they please. If they choose to which will be served by this line is of such resort to political exigencies, and put them value as to justify the expenditure of the above the requirements of the interests of money required in the construction of the the North of Queensland ; if they choose to railway. I would like to supplement the· do anything that will be inimical to tJ;Ie statement made by the Chief Secretary, on interests of North Queensland, I regret rt. the authority of the Under Secretary, wrth Southern Queensland has prospered largely regard to the low-grade oro and other ore because of what the North has done for us. propositions in the district; and, for the These are the only two railway propositions benefit of han. members, I would like to that have been introduced this year. Both deal with that question a little more fully are of an acceotable nature, and both have than the Chief Secretarv did. The han. to do with the -great North. It is quite pos member for Fitzroy asked" for concrete state sible that we may be very !l'lad next year ments as to what mines can supoly low to have this avenue of labour for men. !l'rade ore or other ore supPlies which C':1ll Happily, to-day, as far as I know, there are be treated on a commermal basis in the dis, [Hon. D. F. Denham. ll!Jount Mullir;an [19 NovEMBER.] 2547 trict, and caa L · made a' ,ulabln by a chc ap Mr. THEODORE : The Chillagoe Com fuel supp:y. The Governor Nmman Tiline pany is not the only company that is going is a big low-grade ore proposition, which to benefit by the construction of this line. would be made considerably more profitable There is the Irvinebank reverberatory fur with cheap fuel. In the same Irvinebank nace, the Klond;7ke copper smelter, and the group of minec, the Vulcan has more ore in Chillagoe smelter-they will all be able to sight than has been taken out, and this has work to advantage with a cheaper fuel not been dealt with bccau,e of the high cost supply. of fuel. The large-t body of ore opened up Mr. GRANT: Mount Garnet closed when in that mine is at the 750-feet level. but the the price of copper was high. mine has 'been c\c.-eloped to the -1,400-fect level. It is certainly a low-grade ore, and Mr. THEODORE: The fact is that the it has not so far been found profitable to Mount Gamet Mine showJ as high valnes deal with on ac:JOunt of the high cost of fuel. as ever, but tho ore has become more It goes ovm· 2 per cent. for tin. Other mines complex and refractory, and cannot be in that group includ£ tho Stella and Pompeii worked with advantage when fuel IS but they all would be much more profitabl~ expensiVe. The opening up of a good with a cheap fuel supply. Then there is the coal supply at Mount Mulligan, _or any Einasleigh Mine, which has a big supply of where else in North Queensland, Will be of ore in sight-about 71.000 tons of nearly 6 per immeasurabl" value. The official reports as cent. ore. No one can estimate the possibilities to the quality and quantity of coal are of that mine with the advantage of cheap highly favourable; and it is stated that ths fuel. The Smith's Creek Mine, after working 2 feet 3 inches will supp!y the present de· a number of years, was closed down, not mand for 280 years. because of failure in the ore supply, but The P RE'IIIER : At tho rate of 250 tons a oocause of the high cost of fuel. Mount day. Garnet was closed down for the same reason Mr. THEODORE: The tests go to show the ore being of too low a grade to work pro' that those made recently were better t~an fitably. At Stannary Hills, the Black Rock those taken in the earlier days of the mme. wit):t a 2 per cent. tin, has a hig ore supply: It appears that the further they go into the which can be easily worked by tunnelling, seam the better the qualit,, of the coal. In but at present it cannot be touched because a few weeks the seam has in of the bigh working costs. [8 p.m. J creased in thickness from 25 Mr. -WHITE: \Vas e.-er any mane:; mad0 at inches to 27 inches. The·,e tests Stannary Hills? were all taken under. the strict-est supervision Mr. THEODORE: Never, because of the of Government officers. The te;ts were high cost of fuel. , carried out in the -locomotives under close supervision of locomotive expert~. The tests Mr. GRA;,T: Any at Smith's Creek? are all published in the law't Issue of the Mr. THEODORE: No, for the same 1l:l ining J oUJ·nal, and it will be _found from reason. that that the tests were descnbed as fol Mr. GRANT: And at Mount Molloy? lo,vs: ~"·The stoking was {_ asy vYork, e,nd the ::\Ir. THEODORE: Yes. Mount Molloy vehicl(;s excentionallv clean after the run, paid a great amount of money in dividends, the coal emitting littie smoke. The test was but ultimately cloRed down oocause they could made on 19th September 1912." These were not carry on profitably. the remarks that were 'made against -each test. The tests as shown in the report in the Mr. GRANT: They closed down because journal were highly .. The coal of the low price of the metal. sa;tisf~ctory was found to be very '!ugh 1n heatmg p<_>wer, Mr. THEODORE: The hon. g·entleman with comparatively little ash, ,and no clmker does not seem to realise that in these cases at all. the ore is still there. At the present time Mr. GRAKT: Did you say, "No ash"? there arc 25,000 tons of 3~- copper ore in sight a-t Mount Molloy. Mr. FoRSYTH : There is plenty of ash. Mr. GRA;,T: After all, the price of fuel is Mr. THEODORE : Tho tests showed that a small item in any mine. there was comparatively little ash and no clinker at all. Compared with some of tJ;e Mr. THEODORE : It is a very large item best coal produced in other parts of Australia when from £2 lOs. to £3 lOs. per ton is the coal stood a splendid test.- There was paid for coke, and anything up to £2 lOs. an entire absence of clinker and cinder. a ton is paid for coal. When it can be got at half the price, it will make all the differ The bell indicated that the hon. member's ence between profit and loss. At the O.K. second portion of time had expired. Mine divid~nds were paid for a time, on Mr. THEODORE : I shall take another account of the rich ore that was found; but, five minutes. I have been watching these when the ore declined in value, they were tests very carefully, because I have been unable to work at a profit on account of the greatly interested in this matter, as I wanted high cost of fuel and coke. Then there is to see if a cheap fuel could be discovered for the Mitchell River Antimony Mine, which the benefit of the mining industry in Nor~h cannot be profitably treated because fuel is Queensland. I am satisfied that all dis too expensive. Of course, it can be treated, passionate inquirers must he convinced that but not cheaply enough. Then there is the this coal is of excellent quality for the pur Chieftain Mine at Cardross. with a 3-feet poses for which it is required-nam-ely, steam lode of 10 per cent. copper. 2 pennyweights raising and for coke. Mr. McDermott, the gold, and 8 ounces silver. The lode is 5 feet general manager of the Chillagoe Company, wide under foot, with 12 per cent. copper, 8 informed me in the early part of this year, pennyweights gold, and 6 ounces silver. when I was up in that distdct, that they The hon. member for Fitzroy does not seem would be able to bring the coal to the com to know anything aT>out the Daintree Mine pany's line at Dimbulah at a cost of 16s. on the Copperfield River. per ton. Mr. GRANT: I said the Chillagoe Com Mr. GRANT: How far is that from the pany had not the ore reserves. mine! Mr. Theodore] 2548 Mount Mulligan [ASSEMBLY.] Branch Railway. Mr. THEODORE: Twenty-nine miles. Mr. MuRPHY : That is a good r€ason why They pay 46s. a ton for coal at Chillagoe and 44s. a ton for coal at Irvinebank, so it will the railway should not be built. be seen that a considerable saving will be Mr. THEODORE: No, it is not. If the effected in the price of coal if this mine is coal supplies are not opened up_ by means open€d up by a railway. They pay some of a railway then the rnmmg mdustry m thing like 70s. per ton for coke up there, and the North wd! go out of existence altogether. 18s. a ton for firewood, so it will be seen But the Chillagoe Company have control oyer that it is an advantage to get coal from this all the coal-bearing .areas in that distnct. mine. Anyone who realises the prices I point this out to th€ Government now so charged for fuel at the present time in that that they will be able to prote~t the other district will see how necessary it is to try us€rs of coal ·and coke. There IS a dang!'r to get fuel at a cheap rate for the benefit there and the Government can prevent rt. of that district. The opening of this coal Ther~ is no justification for allowing the seam will mean the salvation of the mining Chillagoe Company to have •a monopoly_ to industry in that district. It is because of the exclusion of everyone else. It IS grvmg that that I support this proposal. I regret them the power to crush competing compa that the Standing Orders will not permit me nies out of existence. The Mammoth Com to speak at much greater length on this pany are paying £3 lOs. per ton for coke matter, but I would like to point out that I brought to Munrrana at the preP. mt time, and am sorry the the Government have allowed if they have to"' compete with the. Chillagoe a priv.at<:> company to get control over the Company for the purchase of rnm_eral ore whole of that coal-bearing area. it goes without saying that they w1ll be at OPPOSITION MEMBERS: liear, hear! a grBat disadvantage. Mr. THEODORE : The first coal prospect Mr. WIENHOLT: The Chillagoe Comp.any ing areas were taken up about five years ago cannot give a preference over the lin€. by Messrs. Richards and Arbouin. The Mr. THEODORE: It is not <1 question of areas were worked and the Government knew preference. If the Ch_illagoc Company con that there was valuable coal to be obtained trol the whole coal-bearmg area they need not there. The Government should have then sell Mr. FORSYTH (Murrumba): It is quite well be lifted up and sold for old iron. And evident that if something is not done by way the same thing applies to other lines else of agreement, then anyone who wants to pur where. Building railways into minmg cen Mr. FORSYTH : Of course they have, to run along the ]ode, We talk about tens but it is a matter of fact that, although and hundreds of millions of tons of coal thm· made that sum on the railways, they there but how can you tell? can"not pay debenture interest. ' Mr: THEODORE : The geologists can tell. Mr. THEODORE: Only £4,000. Mr. FORSYTH : All I can say is that I Mr. FORSYTH: Now, I think it will am not particularly struck with the figures stand to reason that if they had not the that are given. I have seen sue~ figures railwa:-· the~-- would not go on with these before, We have lots of figures hke that. mines. vVould they go on smelting ore This reminds me of the prospectus of a from all parts if they had not the profit company trying to get _people to buy shares. from tho railway to keep them going? That They give you glowmg a~counts of the is the que,tion I am asking. I venture to prospects, which often end m smok~, T~e predict that if they had not that profit they Government Geologist can only gi_ve his would shut the mines up. opinion, and that opinioJ:?- !nay be nght or The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: That is a wrong, I have seen opmwns by Govern reason why they want cheap fuel. ment Geologists that were all wron_g. But I have no desire to block the railway. I Mr. FORSYTH: That is so, and cheap have every desire to give assista;>ce to the fuel will recoup them to a certain extent, people in the North, who want railway com but with copper at £100 a ton, as against munication, but I only want, before we start £50 or £60, some time ago, would the extra this thing, before we get the money at all, difference between what they are paying that we should snend some more money_ to now for coke and the price they would pay see if it is exactly what it is s~id _it is gomg then, would that pay them? to be. A tunnel through a hill IS not suf The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: A difference ficient in my estimation. of £8 a ton. I\~r. I.-EXKOX: ...I\ tunnel is rr,~~~y the best Mr. FORSYTH : Very well, and if copper to,,t you can make. went down to £50 a ton, where would they :Mr. FORSYTH : A tunnel is a Yery good be? vVo must bear in mind the fact that thing, but I have seen tunnels and di~mond they have been working under very good drills driven all through the country m the conditions. Cloncurry district, for instance, and they Mr. THEODORE: You are stating their happened to pass through a lode. Then historv m:der ven· bad conditions. For they snnk a shaft, and foun? there was no years 'copper "as £58 a ton. thing there. I have no desue to blo9k the railway being built, but nt the same time, I Mr. FORSYTH: Yes, but I am quoting say that the Goyernment should allow the from their balance-sheet for 1912. company to build the railway and let them :i\ir. THEODORE : Yes, after a few months take tho risk of good conditions. I-IoNorRABLE ME)1BERS: H0ar, hear~ Mr. FORSY'l'H: In suite of the fact that JYir, THEODORE: Kever mind, they are not copper has jumped from £50 to £70 a ton doing it. there is still a loss, and the point is this ; :VIr. FORSYTH: In doing that, conditions That, suppose they get this line and the could be put in the agreement to protect the coal there and the coke from this mine, which public in every way, so that they c'?uld not we are told i~ going to do so much, would charge exorbitant prices for tr~vel~mg and that make thiS company pay? freight. I say myse)f that this !me may Mr. MeRPHY: That is their business. or may not pay ; but If the ~ulk of, the mem bers present think it is a right thmg to do, Mr. FORSYTH: Hone -tly, I very much I hope that it will turn out to ~e the -;ery doubt it. They have a terrific liability to good thing that some of , our frrer.ds thmk, their shareholders of £500,000, and a total I think it is a good thmg. to be able to liability of a million of money, Take that deye]op a coal-mining distnct, _,o long as at 4 per cent. if you like-I believe that the coal is there. Thev tell me It would be the interest on the debentures is 6 per cent., a yery good thing for "eY' rybody, for the not 4 per cent-and you can form your own Chillagoe railways, and tor the Gover;>ment, conception of what a fearful load they have once the coal and coke are produced m that on their backs, and yet they are go'ing to ,,,,_rticul ar district, but I am glad that the 1 'ke rnore. Somcb0dy <>lse has got to find hon, member for Chillagoe raised the ques· tlus £100,000, and the Government will have tion of proteding the public. to pay 4 per cent. ; the comnanv has not to HAJ\IILTON: \Ve are giving them a find. the money. With regard -to the sug i\~lr. gestions of the leader of the Opposition to blank cheque. buy the Chillagoe Mine, it would he the Mr FORSYTH: They would have t_o worst day's bt>·~ine~s the Governn1ent ever prov~ what the coal cost them at the pit did, bee:· use the mine 'vould burst up straight; head and would have to charge only what pa:r, there is no hope at all. I do not aware that this area embraces a large num obj.ect to spending money on mining specu ber of local "'uthorities, but should the com latiOns, .but we want to be particularly care. pany not succeed-I prefer that they will ful that the country is not put to a big succeed-but should, unfortunately, anything expense and then find that the happen that would cause the company not to [8.30 p.m.] mine does not pay. I hope and succeed; should the Mount Mulliga.n coal trust before we go on with this measure"> not realise expectations. Y' an:d coke for tl:e Chillagoe Railway and they will turn out. I think Mr. Stone, the ~mes, . th~ Cauns Railways, the Ethe manager, is a thoroughly capable and hon ndge hne, and general district require est man; but I have had some experience ments, but given the .advantage of in mining as regards putting holes into the cheaper fuel_, whic~ the working of the ground, and I think, even unknown to him· Mounp Mulligan Mme should provide for self, Mr. Stone's reports are very much in the distnct, I haveno doubt that many the character of a mining prospectus; and low-grade copper, silver, •and lead mines I say that the Government should be quite now closed down woul-d be worked." satisfied as to the coal supply before they I fully believe ~hat myself. I believe that saddle the State with the cost of the con the fact of gettmg cheap fuel, if the safe struction of this railway. If the guarantees g:>ards tJ:at appea:· to be necessary .ar-e pro which I have mentioned are forthcoming, VI?ed, _will result I': the reworking of many I will vote in accordance with my original ~nmes m that distnct that :have been lyina natural impulse to warmly support a new I~~e for many years past. The difficulty railway for North Queensland. anses here, th~t the Government have not ~mly beo:n remis~-they have been very lax Mr. DOUGLAS (Cook): I am very glad mde~d 111 allowmg the whole of that coal to be able to be here this evening to sup bearmg country to pass out of the hands of port this measure. It is interesting to· the ~tate and into _the hands of a monopoly. notice that this measure is not being dealt Talk about.the remiss':ess of the Government. with on party lines; and it is particularly One gets tued of trymg to remember then pleasing to those of us who belong to the· they are of so fi·,cquent occurrence, but here1 North to see the introduction of a measure IS . one • that crops up very prominently· in which, I believe, is of great national im this matter-that. the Government l1ave ,al portance to the North of Queensland. I, as lowed th,;ct splendid area to pass out of their member for that particular d>strict, am, of possession. course, particularly interested, but it does not affect only one district. I am one of Mr. RYAN: That is part of their policy. the few here who have had an opportunity Mr. LENNON: It seep1s to me to be part of personally inspecting the Mount Mulligan of the Gov:ernment's policy. I consider that Mine in the early part of this year. M:r:. even at this eleventh hour this thing should Stones, the manager, took me to Nos. 1 not . be hurried through-I would even go and 3 seams, and, although I am not an ex the length of s_ay111g that t_his railway should pert, and do not profess to know much about be held over till next sesswn, and an agree minerals and ores, still, I could not but be ment should be ':rrived at so that other impressed with the size and magnitude of compet111g compames should not be practi the seams. The expert reports that the· cal~y strangled by this monopoly of the No. 1 seam is not the best. When I was Chi!Iag;oe Compa~>y, ?ecause, if they control there, there was a tunnel being driven, the rmlway service m the district, and on with the a;,istance of Government money, top of that control. the f:>el supply, no other which was advanced to the extent of some· company can possibly hve except by their .£2,000, as they desired to be absolutely sanct~on, and the~e should be a stipulation satisfied that the mine was of undoubted ?f this character m the agreement, and see value, and that the seams were of better ~ng that th~ Government is not only build quality than those that, up to that time, had mg th_e railway, but has advanced £2,000 been unearthed. There were a number of to assist the company in pro*pecting the experienced miners driving through to the Mount Mulligan field, . the Government No. 2 seam. If hon. members desire to. should. be entitled to receiVe its supplies of know the history of this coalfield, they will coal at a profit of 5 per cent. over and find a very excellent little pamphlet pro above the price of the coal at grass. The duced by Mr. Ball, the Government geolo Government should . stan~ on the ground gist, during the early part of this year. floor of preference 111 tlus matter· and it Mount Mulligan Coalfield came to light some should be provided in the agreerd0nt that five years ago, when a prospector was the users of fuel for smelting or steam pur searching for precious stones on the moun poses should be able to obtain their co a 1 tain, when he observed a smutty seam; at 10 per cent. above the cost at grass. The which has turned out to be this valuable· last Government made a promise in re"'ard mine. Of course, the Labour party would'. to the Dawson Valley coalfields that" the like these mine.'! to be worked by the coal would be preserved for the State; but State. I think that suggestion was made. !he pres'!nt Government are utterly reckless It is desirable, if possible, to endeavour to· m throwmg away the natural advantages of arrange that the price charged for coal shall t!>e State as contained in these Mount Mul not be excessive. The opening up of this ligan coal measures ; and they ask this corn_ coal seam is going to confer a considerable· pany to len_d ~150,000 to enable them t the company and district, he would men have given out in some parts, a_nd the tion that, under a contract recently made, timber available in other parts IS of a they could now get coke at several shil very poor quality. Both coal and coke· lings per ton less than the prices paid are now being importe~ from t~e South for it a year ago, but it would still cost, by the larger compames, ~nd It seems landed at Chillagoe, about £3 per ton. likely that coal and coke wrl~ eve':'tually With two furnaces in blast, the average supersede wood generally, thrs' being .al consumption of coke was about 15,000 ready the case at the Irvinebank works tons per annum, making up a coke bill particular:Jy." . of £45,000, but if Mount Mulligan was I think that the prospect of finding ~ mar available, equally good coke could be ket for coal quite JUStifies the opemn15 up· obtainable at an outside cost of £1 lOs. of the mine and, as mentioned per ton. Then there would be an equal [9 p.m.] in the Co~issioner's rep'?rt, saving of about 50 per cent. in the coal the saving in the cost of work~ng bill, which was also a large one. The re the line with Mount Mulligan coal, as agamst duction in the treatment costs would per Southern coal, is £4,000 a year. Of course, mit the handling of large quantities of ore, he based his calculations largely on . the which could not now be touched except steaming qualities of the Mount Mulligan at a loss. The company would have coal. The official tests which were made . on saved half a million of money if Mount the railways gave it a better steammg Mulligan coal had been opened up five capacity of something like 80 per cent., as years ago.' " compared with Southern coal. That is an imnortant statement on behalf The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS : Where did of the Chillagoe Company, and it has been you get that ? said that the Chillagoe Company has not Mr. DO"CGLAS: I will quote i~ from the paid, and I quite believe that is so. The Jiining Journal. I thin!< that tn~s IS 5he railway and concessions they have enjoyed most important feature _m connect,Ion v.Ith have, I believe, enabled them to carry on. the proposition, bec.mse It shows the actual I think, taken as a whole, the company test. which have been made under the super has done a good deal for Northern Queens VISIOn of the Governm'.'nt Inspe:;tor of land. But in regard to giving them a Mim·,, Mr. Horsley. This report IS dated monopoly over these coal seams, I think it is lOth October, and it is taken from the Ga desirable that the price of coal should be 1 rernment Jiining Journal of 15th Novem fixed at not more than a certain an1ount. ber, and reads as follows:- The statE'ment was made by the hon. member " Referring to the Mount Mulligan for Fitzrov that the mineral resources of Coalmim·, I have the honour to report Northern Queensland were practically ex furthPr, as follows:- . . hausted. Well, the hon. member has thrown upon the House the responsibility of proving '" The mining, bagging, .a!'d werghmg to the country that the justification of spend under· my personal superVISIOn ?f the 5· ing £120,000 must depend on the future mine tons Fample' of coal for steamrng tests ral rP>ources of the district. Of course, it is were completed on 3rd instant.. They rather a hard task to place the onus upon ,,·ere mined as would be done In ordl" the Committee of proving that the mineral nurv con11nercial worlnng of tl_le coa , exc~pt that no cleaning or sortrng ~as· resources are not exhausted. done on the surfaca, as Mr. Stones m The PREII!IER: The hon. member for Chil ·forms me is the custom at most coal lagoe dealt with that. mines. The samples were bagged under· Mr. DOUGLAS: Yes, at considerable ground, marked, and transp?rted, so length, and referred to various mines. In that no confusion could possrbly take the IrYinebank group, I understand there is place. . d . the Governor Norman Mine, which has been " Before mv receipt of your w_ue m· worked for a considerable time. That mine, structions, M;. Townley. locomotive fore so we understand, has a considerable quan man at Cairns, had t~sted the sample tity of ore in front of it, but simply because from No. 2 seam, 25 mches coal, with the cost of smelting is so high, the mine has results as under :- lately been unworked. There are other Nett weight loaded on tender-5 tons· mines in the some position, the Girofla, the 1 cwt. 0 qr. 23 lb. Lady Jane, Stella, Rainbow, the Pompeii, Engine used-Class B 15. . . and various others, which will work profit Route run-Cairns t !kept open f;r the sake of keeping the rail that the railway will earn 1 per cent. Of way going. The Chillagoe Company has course, the Railway Commissioner says he spent a great deal of money, and they have is going to make £4,000 profit out o~ _the to spend more and more money, but where coal. 'l'his should be a business proposrtron. have been the dividends? Those people should construct the ~ailway The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: The divi themselvB.o, and if the Railway Commrsswner -dends have been for the working man. found he could buy coal from them cheaper M~. WHITE: I presume that the men than he can elsewhere, then let him buy i~, who have been working in the North have and that would be a sound busmbss proposi ,earned their money. I do not suppose that tion. There is a bait held out here-the they were paid by the Chillagoe Company Commibioner holds it out himself-that . he . simply to look at the mine. Wages are very is going to get this coal at a _very low prwe. high in the North, and they will be higher in He says he is going to get rt at £1 lOs. a the Mulligan field than at the Burrum, and ton. it will not pay them to mine ~oal up there Mr. THEODORE: Don't you believe it. and take it to the port. Mr. WI-liTE: I say when those people g_et Lieut.-Colonel RANKIK: Why? that coal, the Railway Commissioner wrll Mr. \VHITE : Because of the cost of rail 110t get it at a less price tha:r they can get age. My opinion is that the opening of this for it elsewhere. The Premrer stated that railway will have absolutely no effect in the whole of the interests were in the North. making the Chillagoe mines a success. If I As a matter of fact, the whole of ~he in thought for a moment it was going to make terests of this railway and the Ch1llagoe tl:em a suceess-- Company are centred in the big: capi~als of Australia, and a good many are m Bnsbane. Mr. E. B. C. CORSER : They want every The Chillagoe Company is run by. a pretty . encouragement they can get. smart division, and I think this rs one of ::vl:r. 'WHITE : They want all the encour the smarteo.t tricks they have ever perpe agement they can get to exploit the public. trated on the nublic. The Premier stated Immediately this railway is passed in the that we shoull consider the interests of House, it will be the cause of sending up l-he Queensland. I do not wan~ to give I!' ;;ilent 8hares of the Chillagoe Company, and it is vote on this matter, and m my oprnwn I for the object of benefiting a few people in shall be voting in the best interests in vot Brisbane, Sydney, Melbourne, and elsewhere ing to turn down this scheme. I shall cer .at the expense of the general public. \Vh~ tainly vote against the railway. opened up this coalfield? £2,000 of Govern * Mr. VOWLES (Dalby): I intend t? oppose ment money were used to oven up this fielcl, this railway also, and I want to grve some and now we are asked to agree to the e.x reasons. _penditure of another £100,000 in construct Mr. HUNTER: We know them now. ing a railway to bolstor up the mming in ·dustry in the North. These people are about Mr. VOWLES : I object on principle. to to exploit the public, and I am mrpris"ld this line being passed. As a representative th-:l business men in the Cabinet rave not of a farming constituency-one who had a seer. the whole object of this scheme. I railway promised towards the end of la~t think the principle is bad in this re.spect : session, and as one who went before hrs people who have money can come forwa:rd constituents and told them that the GovBl:n ar.d take up 4 per cent. debentures, and thev ment had promised a railway, and had ad can get a railway constructed for them"elves. vanced a sum of £10,000 towards its con I v.ant a railway in the Burnett Valley, struction-! was given a promise through but there aTe a lot of poor farmers ther-e, the Hon. the Secretary for Railways that the and they cannot afford to take up £100,000 railway was going to be immediately con worth of debentures to construct a railway. structed, and on that promise the farmers You are putting the rich man on an entirely bought agricultural machinery, and I could different footing to the poor farmer. I •up• not in justice support the line. pos<; the deputy leader of the Oppooition Mr. \VIENHOW': Why don't the farmers buy win vote for this railway, because it hap Government stock? pens to be in his own district, although it is against his principles. Mr. VOWLES: The farmers have not the money to buy Government stock, and when Mr:. GILLIES : It is not in his Jistrrct. the Premier talks about that he talks non Mr. '\VHITE: I sincerely hope tne Com. sense. We know that in the same district mittee, in its wisdom, will turn down this he has turned down a small line-that is, an railway. I am not against the Government extension of the Oakev-Mount Russell line in any shape or form, but I have looked at for which some individuals offer.ed to supply this matter from all points of view, and I the capital. believe the principle is a bad one. Other Mr. E. B. C. CORSER: That is not a railways have been stopped, but because this parallel case. company are prepared to take up £100,000 Mr. VOWLES: It is a pa<:allel case. We worth of debentures, they can get a rail. are told now that if we want to get our way. There is no 3 per cent. guarantee in connection with this railway. railways, the unfortunate farmers have to club together to find the money, and then The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: \!es, thE>re they will get precedence. If they do not do is. that, they can remain till the Day of _Judg Mr. WHITE : Don't tell me that. This ment. Whether it is a change of polrcy or railway is going thr~mgh barren oountry-, not, I tell you it is repudiation. We were and where are you gomg to get 3 per cent. ? told distinctly by the Premier that .no fur You cannot get the 3 per cent., unless you ther lines would be constructed untrl those get it h:om the Government, because the under construction were completed, and not greater part goes through Government land. only are new lines being constructed, or The Government have to pay 4 per cent. to propo,ed to be constructed, but in connection the people who find the money to construct with some of those which were under con this railway, and I honestly do not believe struction at the time the Premier made that Mr. Vowles.] 2558 Mount Mulligan [ASSEJiilBLY.] Branch Railway. speech, the men have been taken off alto Mr. Mc\'ORMACK: The hon.• member ad g:ether. Tha~ is so in connection with the voc,lted an import duty of £7 a ton to bolster !me from MI_les to Taroom. There are no up the sugar industry. men on tf!at !me, and the same applies to the Walia! !me. We are told that the interests Mr. WHITE": That is not bolstering it up. of the North are identical with the ill Mr. McCORMACK: The products of the terests . of the South, and that the mining Chillagoe mines have to compete with the fields, If they are prosperous, will give an products of mines worked by black labour; ~mtlet for the produce of the Downs. That but they do not ask for protection. I believe IS absolutely true, but how are we going to the mining indu,try in Australia pays the ge~ our ~roduce to market, if we have no highest wagc9 pa·id to miners in any part of railway hnes? Carry it on our backs, I sup the world; and it is well known that the in J?Ose?. \V e have. been told that one reason dustry can pay 16s. Sd. a d' The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: They stated it took ..~bout 3 tons of coal to make 2 to:" last week that they would take coal. of coke. The Government . are perfeJtly right in opening up a coal district in the Mr. McCORMACK: Another importan·"· North. It will not affect the people of Bun matter for consideration is the fact that in damba or the people of Burrum, bcJa:tse North Queensland the wood fuel is almost the greater part of tho coal taken up J\iorth used up. At Irvinebank in the course of a few years it will be necessary to shift the is supplied by Kewcastle. smelters if they cannot get fud. Small Mr. RYAN: vVhat harm if it did &ffcct tramlincc haYe been run out 8 or 10 miles them? to e1•ery piece of country on ·.,·hich there was Mr. CRIBB : I quite agree that it wo:cld timber, and timber has been brought in by not be right to be so selfish as to stop an wagons 8 or 10 miles ; and the wood Jus been enterprise in another part of the country taken off. L :ttcr on there will be a proposi because we may be affected by its develop tion to ·hiic rL· smelterc to where the fuel is; ment. This is a big country, and the more and thr:' would be c. good thing. country we can open up the better for the· :Ylr. WHITE: \Vhy not usn the Barron Falls? State as a whole. I ki.ow nothing of the quality of the other minerals in the dis :Mr. l'tlcCOR'\1ACK . vVhat for? trict in quc-.tion, but I am satisfied that the Mr. \VHITE: For fuP!. "orking of a 2-foot 6-inch seam of coal Mr. McCORMACK: We are dealing with will pay very welL coal at present. A lot has been said, especi Mr. GILLIES: While I should be sorry ally by the hon. member for lYiusgrave, to sa:· am·thing on this question that might about the cost of raic·ing the coal. The be construed into throwmg cold water on wageq for mining are about the same all the very important proposal before the Com over Australia. mittee, I think I am justified, after th<; Mm Mr. ·WHITE: Oh, no; they are higher in isterial statement made by the Premier on the North. July 31st, in asking what . effect the con Mr. McCORMACK: The Broken Hill str:uction of this railway wrll have OJ?- the people pay more for smelting than the Chil two lines in my district already sanctwned lagoe people, and one set of people are near by Parliament'? the coast, and the other are in the back The PRE:\IIER: None; common sense country. The wages of miners should tell you that. [10 p.m.] are higher in the coal industry Mr. GILLIES : That being so, I ·should than in other mining. Men en like the Premier to give some indication by gaged in coalmining make .£1 a day and interjection as to when those promised lines more at Nmvr 'tstle. Tin real trouble in New will be built. castle and othe1· districto. is that there is not The PREMIER: When we get loan money. enough work for the r"en. The cost of rais ing coal will be no greater in North Queens Mr. GILLIES: We were told some time land than it is in Kewca .,tle. ago that there was a shortage of money-tha't An Ho:t\"OURABLE MEMBER : The seams are the eighteen lines under _construction woul~ very much larger there. be completed to certain pomts, and that until the other ten lines to be constructed were Mr. :McCORMACK : And very much well in hand, further lines .would not be dirtier. A 3-foot clean seam is very much tabled. That is my justification for asking cheaper and better to work than a 6-foot what effect the construction of this railway dirty seam. There is clay underneath the will have on the lines to be built in my coal, and the.'- hole out the clay and break electorate. The Minister for Railways down the coal, and miners will be able to knows the exact position, and knows that make as much money as they are earning there are 400 or 500 bona fide selectors Walt in Newcastle. I shail support the motion. ing anxiously for some indieation as to whe!' The bell indicated that the hon. member's those railways will be constructed. As to this time had expired. proposal, I belie1'e it is a sound one. The Mr. CRIBB (Bremer) : I think the con hon. member for Chillagoe and .the. ho!'. struction of this line will be a good thing member for Cairns know the distnct m for the country. My experience of coal which it is to be built, and all about the measures in the Bundamba district is that industries carried on there. But while I am the very best seam > is just as well to safeguard the small men in or demerits of the proposal now under con particular. With regard to the other phase sideration I have nothing to say. I simply ?f the que~tion, it appears to me that there say that until the Dawson Valley lme in par IS a splendid opportunity for the Government ticular and the other lines which have been to demonstrate the wisdom of establishing promised by the Government are gone qn >t State coalmine. We are told that it will with, we are not justified in passing such lines be made a part of the agreement that the as this. It has been rather refreshing to Crown shall be assured of a sufficient supply hear, for the first time this session, hon. of coal at a reasonable price, but we know members on the other side expressing clearly that it is an utter impossibility to m,ake any and unequivocally their opinion regarding the .hard and fast agreement as to the supply of Government's broken prorrnse~ regarding rail