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Ernest Martin Hopkins '01 President, Emeritus

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Ernest Martin Hopkins '01 President, Emeritus Ernest Martin Hopkins ‘01 President, Emeritus An interview conducted by Edward Connery Lathem ‘51 Hanover, NH Manset, Maine April 6, 1962 – May 21, 1964 Reels 23-33 Rauner Special Collections Library Dartmouth College Hanover, NH Ernest Martin Hopkins Interview Reel #23a Lathem: This is a scrapbook session being held in Baker Library on Friday, April 6, 1962, continuing the tape recording of President Hopkinsʼ memoirs, a scrapbook session starting with events in the year 1933. [Pause] Hopkins: Well, sometime around the 4th. I don't know exactly when. I want to go somewhere before commencement. [Laughter] I don't know just where. Lathem: I can understand that. Did you get over to Montpelier? Hopkins: Yes, I was there yesterday. Lathem: Ah. Howʼs Mr. Davis? Hopkins: Heʼs fine. Honors coming thick and fast. Heʼs written… Named insurance man of the year by the insurance companies and he has just been made, I donʼt know whether an officer or not, but a member of the Vermont Bankers Association. [Laughter] Lathem: My goodness. They are coming thick and fast. Hopkins: Yeah. It just caught my eye. [inaudible] good for the United States. I want to know where I got that idea. [Laughter] Lathem: Is this going to work out all right? Can you see the clippings well enough at that angle? Hopkins: Yes, I can see fine, thank you. Lathem: This is a… I thought weʼd go on with a scrapbook for a while, at least. We left off at this point, quite some time ago. Youʼd spoken about Horace P. Taft of the Taft School and this clipping, which is dated April 1933, headed Depression Good for the U.S. says Dartmouth president, made me wonder whether you had any impressions youʼd like to tell me about of depression years at the college in general, what the atmosphere was like. Iʼve come at one specific thing, I wish youʼd tell me about something Iʼve heard over and over again and that is your announcement to the faculty that thereʼd have to be an across the board cut. Hopkins: That was the most astonishing event of my career I think. 2 Ernest Martin Hopkins Interview Lathem: Oh. Hopkins: We went over it very carefully with the trustees and I said I saw no chance of our keeping the scale without leaving the college very much in debt and that I thought it would be in the interest of everybody to get through the year with the smallest deficit we could and I felt very sure that the faculty would understand that. And the trustees were very doubtful about it as an administrative measure. That is that they felt that it would create a certain feeling that would handicap us for years but I felt pretty certain in regard to the thing. And I also felt very certain that the faculty themselves would be better off to take, Iʼve forgotten, I think it was a ten percent cut and end the year in reasonably good shape financially and ready to go when the depression was over. Well I rather guess that I did one of the best selling jobs of my career. I felt pretty strongly about it and I told the faculty my reason. I told them that it was not fully acceptable to the trustees because they felt that the other method would be better so that the responsibility was fully mine for making the proposition but that I had made it and the trustees had accepted it and that it would have to be made operative right way. Still assuming that self-interest would be pretty largely predominant I finished up and got one of the greatest ovations I had ever gotten. It was the fact that they not only accepted it but seemed enthusiastic about it and my memory isnʼt very clear but I think we restored the old scale the next year. Certainly did within a couple of years. I think we did the next year. Lathem: I had heard that story in substance or in bits and pieces at one time or another and Iʼd never known the exact details of it and that it was factual. Hopkins: I havenʼt any confidence either for the college or the nation either for this deficit spending. It seems to me as far as I can analyze the thing that it always results eventually in harm to everybody and I feel the same way about war as a matter of fact. I mean I would far rather with all of its hazards precipitate a war if it was certain to come eventually and the sooner it came the better I think. I thought that Kennedy had backed up and I was very enthusiastic about it the other day on the statement that we would never take the first step. [Laughter] But he evidently got frightened out of it before the next day because… Whether or not we would. 3 Ernest Martin Hopkins Interview Lathem: Did enrollment in that depression era drop as income, of course it dropped, because youʼre… Hopkins: Income dropped as I remember it. Enrollment did not. No, I think it did not. Iʼm very fuzzy about those things… Lathem: Has it been the case that youʼve had impressions of a really changed atmosphere of the college at different periods that… Hopkins: Very definitely. Lathem: And would that have been one of them? Hopkins: That would have been one of them, yeah. Very definitely. And, well I would say, along that line that from my own personal point of view, the twenties were certainly the most anxious time that I ever lived through. Everybody seemed to be wanting to make as much in their pool as they could [Laughter] It was a natural objective of students and everybody else and to some degree faculty too because they… Wild ideas were particularly prevalent at the time and we had to subsequently… I… An illustration of what I mean… The Ps Uʼs telephoned up at Carnival time and they said weʼve got a wild woman down here and we donʼt know what to do with her. This was about two oʼclock in the morning. Lathem: Called you at the house? Hopkins: What? Lathem: Called you at the house? Hopkins: Yes. Well, I says, as a matter of fact, thereʼs nothing I can do about it but itʼs obviously a police matter and if sheʼs really troubling you, why Iʼd tell the police to throw her out of town. Well, I forgot all about it. That summer I went with Ann over to Bar Harbor to the movie and Constance Bennett was putting on a beautiful show there and Ann turns to me and she says, thereʼs your girlfriend. And I says, what do you mean? And she says, sheʼs the girl you threw out of town during Carnival time. [Laughter] Well, things like that were happening almost every day. I mean… Lathem: This was Constance Bennett herself who had been to Carnival? 4 Ernest Martin Hopkins Interview Hopkins: Yeah. She was the guest of the Psi U house; Iʼve forgotten whose guest she was. Joan… The relationship among those sisters seems to be very peculiar but Joan laughed about it the next year. She said she would be shy on coming here. [Laughter] And I had to tell Budd Schulberg that he had to keep Scott Fitzgerald out of sight. He was in the hotel making a mess of himself. Things like that happening all the time. Lathem: Did Fitzgerald come more than that one time? Do you suppose? Hopkins: Not that I know of. Lathem: Yes. And Schulberg had brought him as his guest? Hopkins: Yes, Schulberg had brought him and they were very thick. As a matter of fact, Schulberg told me later about his visits down there. Fitzgerald may have been here other times but thatʼs the only time I knew about. Lathem: Yes. Hopkins: Everything seemed to come in in the twenties. It began, it began… It got to the point where it corrected itself toward the end of the decade. Lathem: Corrected itself in the sort of satiation of excess? Hopkins: Yeah. Lathem: Thatʼs interesting. Hopkins: Yes. Well, the, I donʼt remember who... Some one of the alumni said to me last year, he was speaking about that period and he says, I think everybody began to be fed up with being a damn fool and that was about what it seemed like. Lathem: Thatʼs very interesting. I never really had that kind of analysis of it before but one could see how it would happen if it ran long enough. But then toward the end of the twenties this occurred and then the early thirties would have been quite a different matter. Hopkins: Iʼm talking of course wholly on impressions. Lathem: Yes. 5 Ernest Martin Hopkins Interview Hopkins: There would be a great deal of difficulty in proving anything but my impression is very definite that from, weʼll say ʼ30 on to the Second World War, you had a pretty steady group that… Of course with the… Iʼm not even sure that under the same conditions again youʼd get the same results if you didnʼt have Prohibition. Prohibition was the great disturbing factor in the whole situation. Itʼs odd how things come about. I… We had three boys who nearly died from bad liquor that they got down at White River Junction and Iʼd known Joe Pilver for a long while. Pilver… Do you know the Joe Pilver place in Norwich? Lathem: I donʼt think I do.
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