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House of Lords Official Report Vol. 774 Monday No. 42 10 October 2016 PARLIAMENTARYDEBATES (HANSARD) HOUSE OF LORDS OFFICIAL REPORT ORDEROFBUSINESS Death of a Member: Lord Borrie ....................................................................................1663 Questions Investigatory Powers Bill ..............................................................................................1663 High-Cost Credit and Debt Management ....................................................................1664 Calais: Children with UK Family Links.......................................................................1668 France: Dublin Regulation ...........................................................................................1670 Investigatory Powers Bill Order of Consideration Motion .....................................................................................1672 Wales Bill Second Reading.............................................................................................................1672 Calais Jungle Statement......................................................................................................................1697 Next Steps in Leaving the European Union Statement......................................................................................................................1701 Wales Bill Second Reading (Continued) ........................................................................................1713 Sexual Violence in Conflict (Select Committee Report) Motion to Take Note ....................................................................................................1740 Lords wishing to be supplied with these Daily Reports should give notice to this effect to the Printed Paper Office. No proofs of Daily Reports are provided. Corrections for the bound volume which Lords wish to suggest to the report of their speeches should be clearly indicated in a copy of the Daily Report, which, with the column numbers concerned shown on the front cover, should be sent to the Editor of Debates, House of Lords, within 14 days of the date of the Daily Report. This issue of the Official Report is also available on the Internet at https://hansard.parliament.uk/lords/2016-10-10 The first time a Member speaks to a new piece of parliamentary business, the following abbreviations are used to show their party affiliation: Abbreviation Party/Group CB Cross Bench Con Conservative DUP Democratic Unionist Party GP Green Party Ind Lab Independent Labour Ind LD Independent Liberal Democrat Ind SD Independent Social Democrat Ind UU Independent Ulster Unionist Lab Labour LD Liberal Democrat LD Ind Liberal Democrat Independent Non-afl Non-affiliated PC Plaid Cymru UKIP UK Independence Party UUP Ulster Unionist Party No party affiliation is given for Members serving the House in a formal capacity, the Lords spiritual, Members on leave of absence or Members who are otherwise disqualified from sitting in the House. © Parliamentary Copyright House of Lords 2016, this publication may be reproduced under the terms of the Open Parliament licence, which is published at www.parliament.uk/site-information/copyright/. 1663 Death of a Member: Lord Borrie[10 OCTOBER 2016] High-Cost Credit and Debt Management 1664 House of Lords High-Cost Credit and Debt Management Monday 10 October 2016 Question 2.30 pm 2.39 pm Asked by Lord Sharkey Prayers—read by the Lord Bishop of Norwich. Toask Her Majesty’sGovernment what assessment they have made of the harm to consumers caused Death of a Member: Lord Borrie by unsolicited real-time promotion of high-cost Announcement credit and of debt management solutions. 2.36 pm Lord Young of Cookham (Con): My Lords, the The Lord Speaker (Lord Fowler): My Lords, I Government have transferred responsibility for the regret to inform the House of the death of the noble regulation of high-cost credit and debt management Lord, Lord Borrie, on 30 September. On behalf of the firms to the Financial Conduct Authority. This more House, I extend our condolences to the noble Lord’s robust regime is helping to protect consumers better. family and friends. The Financial Conduct Authority is currently reviewing its consumer credit rules in relation to cold calling, Investigatory Powers Bill: Trade Union and particularly to high-cost credit and debt management, Political Activities and expects to publish the outcome of the review by Question the end of the year. 2.37 pm Lord Sharkey (LD): Cold calling is a huge problem. The FCA acknowledges that many of the 30 million Asked by Baroness Jones of Moulsecoomb cold calls selling fee-paying debt management services To ask Her Majesty’s Government what plans were misleading and damaging, and affect the most they have to strengthen provisions in the Investigatory financially disadvantaged in our society.As the Minister Powers Bill to increase the protection of data relating said, the Government promised that the FCA’s review to trade union and political activities. of cold calling will be published before the end of the year. Will the review look at why cold calling for The Minister of State, Ministry of Defence (Earl mortgages has long been banned but not for high-cost Howe) (Con): My Lords, the Government have already credit or fee-paying debt management services? strengthened the provisions in the Investigatory Powers Bill by accepting a Labour amendment to add protections Lord Young of Cookham: The answer to the last for trade unions. It is already illegal for the security part of the noble Lord’s question is in relation to what and intelligence agencies to further the interests of any happened with the introduction of the right to buy, political party. The Bill goes further by putting the back in the 1980s. There was some mis-selling by Wilson doctrine on to a statutory footing, requiring mortgage brokers, targeting council house tenants who the Prime Minister’s approval for the targeting of had the benefit of a huge discount. They were not parliamentarians’communications in addition to Secretary really interested in the creditworthiness of those people of State and judicial commissioner authorisation. as mortgage borrowers and that is why that measure was introduced. On cold calling, the Government will Baroness Jones of Moulsecoomb (GP): I thank the introduce legislation through the Digital Economy noble Earl for his Answer. He has opened up all sorts Bill which will place, via the Information Commissioner, of trapdoors that I would like to go down, but has he a statutory obligation on a code for cold calling. In met organisations such as the Blacklist Support Group, this year’s Budget, additional provision was made to the NUJ and Liberty, which have documented evidence protect particularly vulnerable people from cold calling. of police and security service wrongdoing and illegal activities, so that we can be sure that the safeguards Lord Watts (Lab): My Lords, should not the are strong enough? Government take action now to put a finite figure on what credit organisations can charge? Normally, the Earl Howe: My Lords, I have had round-table meetings poorest people in the community pay the highest rates with a number of organisations, including those of interest. representing the journalist profession and freedom of information bodies.The adherence of any public authority Lord Young of Cookham: The noble Lord is quite to existing legislation is an issue for the commissioners right. That is why we introduced a cap of 0.8% on and the relevant courts or regulators, and any complaints payday loans. That means if you borrow £100 for a can be followed up through those channels. The Bill day, the maximum amount that can be paid in interest we are debating provides for a whole range of safeguards is 80p. in addition to those that currently exist: statutory oversight of the use of investigatory powers and greater Lord Naseby (Con): This review being undertaken powers for the Investigatory Powers Commissioner to by the regulator,the FCA, is very welcome. Nevertheless, carry out investigations. In addition, we are creating a it is not just cold calling, is it? Advertising is allegedly number of offences. I hope the noble Baroness will see controlled but I watched an advertisement last night that we have done our best to strengthen the safeguards on television that was highly questionable. Is it not a that exist under current legislation. matter of bringing together all the authorities—the 1665 High-Cost Credit and Debt Management[LORDS] High-Cost Credit and Debt Management 1666 [LORD NASEBY] the noble Baroness said. We transferred responsibility Advertising Standards Authority, the FCA and other from the OFT to the FCA simply because it has a direct selling bodies—to have not just a review but an more robust regime for dealing with any misuse of action plan to sort this out? Many elderly people are cold calling. being duped out of thousands of pounds. Is it not time we really took action on this issue? Lord Campbell-Savours (Lab): My Lords, what measures have the Government been able to take in Lord Young of Cookham: I understand the strong relation to the calls that come from overseas, which I feelings held by many noble Lords on this subject. As I understand are now the majority? said, in this year’s Budget, a large sum of money was identified to help vulnerable people and enable them Lord Young of Cookham: If the calls come from to stop these sorts of calls being made. On cold calling overseas, obviously the response that we can take in by debt management companies and credit companies,
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