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Retrobrew Computers Forum Work in Progress Subject: Plasmo's 68k pathfinder projects Posted by plasmo on Fri, 31 Mar 2017 19:48:09 GMT View Forum Message <> Reply to Message It is interesting to see recent flurry of activities about the 68000 family. IMO, the 68xxx along with National's 32xxx are two most elegant 32-bit computer architectures of their time. Let this be a lesson to aspiring computer architects: elegant does not mean success, quite the contrary in fact. The wonderful thing about homebrew is we can ignore what the market picked and chose the elegant one over the successful one. I too am a fan of 68K and coincidentally starting to get reacquainted with the 68K in the last three months. I used the 100mm x 100mm pc board format as pathfinder vehicle for my exploration of 68K mainly because it is cheap and I can throw away the board if it didn't worked out. I call them the Tinyxxx, mainly because it is tiny. I've designed & successfully boot up three (68000, 68020, 68030) and am working on the 4th (68040). I posted my experiences on EASy68k forum, but it went down in the past few days due to malicious software. I'm working on wiki of the Tinyxxx on the RetroBrew web under builderpages 'plasmo'. I'm posting all the design information I can think of there. It is work in progress. https://www.retrobrewcomputers.org/doku.php?id=builderpages: plasmo:start Subject: Re: Plasmo's 68k pathfinder projects Posted by mikemac on Fri, 31 Mar 2017 20:13:07 GMT View Forum Message <> Reply to Message So that's where all of the 68030s have been hiding! A 030 design is my next project, after getting the current one "Mike's first 68K" https:// www.retrobrewcomputers.org/forum/index.php?t=msg&th=145& amp;start=0& finished. I look forward to see more details of your Tinyxxx designs. Subject: Re: Plasmo's 68k pathfinder projects Posted by yoda on Fri, 31 Mar 2017 20:29:29 GMT View Forum Message <> Reply to Message plasmo wrote on Fri, 31 March 2017 14:48It is interesting to see recent flurry of activities about the 68000 family. IMO, the 68xxx along with National's 32xxx are two most elegant 32-bit computer architectures of their time. Let this be a lesson to aspiring computer architects: elegant does not mean success, quite the contrary in fact. The wonderful thing about homebrew is we can ignore what the market picked and chose the elegant one over the successful one. I too am a fan of 68K and coincidentally starting to get reacquainted with the 68K in the last three months. I used the 100mm x 100mm pc board format as pathfinder vehicle for my exploration of 68K mainly because it is cheap and I can throw away the board if it didn't worked out. I call them the Tinyxxx, mainly because it is tiny. I've designed & successfully boot up three (68000, 68020, 68030) and am working on the 4th (68040). I posted my experiences on EASy68k forum, but it went down in the past few days due to malicious software. I'm working on wiki of the Tinyxxx on the RetroBrew web under builderpages 'plasmo'. I'm posting all the design information I can think of there. It is Page 1 of 71 ---- Generated from RetroBrew Computers Forum work in progress. https://www.retrobrewcomputers.org/doku.php?id=builderpages: plasmo:start I would be interested what you are doing on the 040. I am getting ready to send out a board. It is what I call the lite version - will have 2Meg of static Ram to debug all the base logic followed by a full version with dynamic RAM. That is what is the part I am most concerned about and of course the base design. I want to do the lite version for debug now as it will be a smaller board and the cost won't be as high. The full version will probably have to be a 4 layer board which will drive the cost up. Subject: Re: Plasmo's 68k pathfinder projects Posted by plasmo on Fri, 31 Mar 2017 21:08:37 GMT View Forum Message <> Reply to Message Pictures of the three Tinyxxx boards. The 100mm x 100mm is in fact quite adequate for a reasonably complex design. In the 68030 case with the DRAM working, I believe I can get rid of the 40-pin expansion header, the 32-pin 8-bit RAM, the 3x 74240 buffers and replace them with an IDE interface & video, well on its way to a standalone system. Tiny302 Tiny020 Tiny030 File Attachments 1) Tiny302pcb_all_LED.jpg, downloaded 3666 times 2) DSC_22100307.jpg, downloaded 3530 times 3) DSC_24280325.jpg, downloaded 3536 times Subject: Re: Plasmo's 68k pathfinder projects Posted by plasmo on Fri, 31 Mar 2017 21:13:37 GMT View Forum Message <> Reply to Message Yoda, Regarding my plan with Tiny040: I was hung up on figuring out a way to iterate boot software rapidly on Tiny040. I was planning on a SIMM72 flash that can be programmed on Tiny030's SIMM socket and then move to Tiny040's boot SIMM socket. At this point I think that's more elaborate than necessary. I already have a monitor that runs fine on 68000/68020/68030 so just put that on 4x flash on the Tiny040 board in sockets and make them programmable insitu, add 68681, SIMM72 socket for DRAM, mc88915 for Page 2 of 71 ---- Generated from RetroBrew Computers Forum clock control and EPM7128SQC100 for glue logic & DRAM controller. That should fit within the 100mm x 100mm format. This scheme should get 68040 to boot and start software development. Insitu reprogramming of the flash should allow me to upgrade the software as it evolves. Subject: Re: Plasmo's 68k pathfinder projects Posted by yoda on Fri, 31 Mar 2017 22:25:51 GMT View Forum Message <> Reply to Message Hi Plasmo I don't quite understand what a SIMM Flash is. My design is a 68040 with 68150 bus controller. I plan a 68681, 68230(for a timer) and 16 IDE interface. I am using EPM7128SLC84 for glue logic (I am almost out of pins so I may have to addd a couple TTL chips to free some pins). I am planning a second EPM7128SLC84 and 2 72 pin simm's up to 256MB of memory. How flexible is your memory controller and would it handle something like that. I don't think it fits in 100X100 board. My biggest concerns are the 68150 debug and DRAM. I know the other devices work well and debugged that code on Gryphon and Xagdin boards. The way I do debugging is to use a cross compiler on my Mac. Once I have serial port working, I have Xmodem in my code base so I can transfer binaries very quickly (20-30 seconds) into SRAM and do debugging and when I have a certain amount of code working I will reflash my flash with latest and greatest. All I have to do is relink the code at a different start address which I have as link script and just choose a make target of ROM or RAM to change. Dave Subject: Re: Plasmo's 68k pathfinder projects Posted by mscane on Fri, 31 Mar 2017 23:09:09 GMT View Forum Message <> Reply to Message Guys, I'm kind of stuck in the 8 bit world (Z80) and have not done anything much on the 68K, or the x86 for that matter. I do have a mini 68k board up and running but I have not done much with it. I'm curious as to what software/OS you run on your 68K boards? I know CP/M 68K is available but it doesn't seem all that popular. With all that address space available I would have thought there would be a range of OS available but I haven't heard of any. Perhaps all the development went into Unix? Page 3 of 71 ---- Generated from RetroBrew Computers Forum I'm interested to hear your thoughts. Cheers! Max Subject: Re: Plasmo's 68k pathfinder projects Posted by jcoffman on Sat, 01 Apr 2017 02:01:14 GMT View Forum Message <> Reply to Message Max, The last 68k round I was involved in was the KISS-68030. At that time, the CP/M-68 ROM from the Mini-M68k was evolved to common source code for both boards. The extra, is that the KISS ROM can boot Will's port of 68K Linux. --John Subject: Re: Plasmo's 68k pathfinder projects Posted by plasmo on Sat, 01 Apr 2017 02:24:35 GMT View Forum Message <> Reply to Message yoda wrote on Fri, 31 March 2017 15:25Hi Plasmo I don't quite understand what a SIMM Flash is. My design is a 68040 with 68150 bus controller. I plan a 68681, 68230(for a timer) and 16 IDE interface. I am using EPM7128SLC84 for glue logic (I am almost out of pins so I may have to addd a couple TTL chips to free some pins). I am planning a second EPM7128SLC84 and 2 72 pin simm's up to 256MB of memory. How flexible is your memory controller and would it handle something like that. I don't think it fits in 100X100 board. My biggest concerns are the 68150 debug and DRAM. I know the other devices work well and debugged that code on Gryphon and Xagdin boards.
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