Legislative Assembly 4603 5 October 1993

TUESDAY, 5 OCTOBER 1993 PETITIONS The Clerk announced the receipt of the following petitions— Mr SPEAKER (Hon. J. Fouras, Ashgrove) read prayers and took the chair at 10 a.m. Railway Services From Dr Watson (22 signatories) praying OFFICIAL PHOTOGRAPH OF NEW that the Parliament of will enact PARLIAMENT legislation which secures the services provided Mr SPEAKER: Order! I ask honourable by 29 railway branch lines which are to be members to resume their seats so that the closed. official photograph of the Forty-seventh Parliament can be taken. Dam, Wide Bay Creek ASSENT TO BILLS From Mr Perrett (715 signatories) praying Assent to the following Bills reported by that the proposed dam on Wide Bay Creek be Mr Speaker— not built. Integrated Resort Development Amendment Bill; Bridge, Jimboomba Creek Willows Sports Complex Bill; From Mr Lingard (3 511 signatories) Workers’ Compensation Amendment Bill; praying for the Department of Transport to Queensland Tourist and Travel Corporation provide immediate finance for the construction Amendment Bill; of a new bridge across Jimboomba Creek at Wet Tropics World Heritage Protection and Jimboomba. Management Bill. Petitions received. PARLIAMENTARY COMMISSIONER FOR ADMINISTRATIVE INVESTIGATIONS STATUTORY INSTRUMENTS Report In accordance with the schedule Mr SPEAKER: Honourable members, I circulated by the Clerk to members in the have to report that I have received the Chamber, the following documents were nineteenth report of the Parliamentary tabled— Commissioner for Administrative Investigations, Queensland for the period Breakwater Island Casino Agreement Act— 1 July 1992 to 30 June 1993. Breakwater Island Casino Agreement Ordered to be printed. Variation Regulation 1993, No. 347 New South WalesÐQueensland Border Rivers Amendment Act— PAPERS TABLED DURING RECESS Proclamation-the provisions of the Act not Mr SPEAKER: Honourable members, I in force commence 17 September 1993, have to advise the House that papers were No. 348 tabled during the recess in accordance with Primary Producers’ Organisation and Marketing the details provided on the Daily Program Act— circulated to members in the Chamber. Primary Producers’ Organisation and The Clerk of the Parliament— Marketing (Egg Marketing Boards Extension) Regulation (No. 3) 1993, 28 September 1993 No. 349 Queensland Industry Development Corporation Annual Report for 1992Ð93 Recording Of Evidence Act— 4 October 1993 Recording of Evidence Amendment Regulation (No. 1) 1993, No. 351 Parliamentary Service Commission Annual Sawmills Licensing Act— Report for 1992Ð93 Ordered to be printed. Sawmill Licensing Amendment Regulation (No. 1) 1993, No. 350. 5 October 1993 4604 Legislative Assembly

PAPERS I take the opportunity to acknowledge The following papers were laid on the publicly that 1993 marks Mr Stephan’s tenth table— year of continuous service as a member of the Committee of Subordinate Legislation. (a) Deputy Premier, Minister for Administrative Services and Minister for I take the opportunity also to express the Rural Communities (Mr Burns)— committee’s appreciation for the work carried Administrative Services out by the secretary, Madeline Cook. I would Department—Annual Report for like also to recognise the contributions made 1992-93 by our legal adviser, Dr Don Gifford; part-time assistant, Helen Grant; Monica Hayes, who (b) The Treasurer (Mr De Lacy)— provides secretarial support to the committee; Queensland Investment and Rex Klein and the committee secretariat. Corporation— Annual Report for 1992-93 I move that the report be printed. Queensland Office of Financial Ordered to be printed. Supervision—Annual Report for 1992-93 QUESTIONS UPON NOTICE (c) Minister for Housing, Local Government and Planning (Mr Mackenroth)— 1. School Dental Service Reports of the Local Government Mr HORAN asked the Minister for Commissioner in relation to Reviews Health— of Internal (Electoral) Boundaries— City Councils—Hervey Bay, “With reference to the Government’s Logan allocation in this year’s budget to extend Shire Council—Banana. the school dental service to years 8, 9 and 10 and the current policy of Dental Association that all LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY dentists use handpieces suitable for heat (PARLIAMENTARY SERVICE COMMISSION) sterilisation, that all handpieces be Tabling of Documents sterilised by Autoclave before use with each patient and that these procedures Hon. T. M. MACKENROTH be in place by the end of 1993— (Chatsworth—Leader of the House) (10.04 a.m.): I lay upon the table of the House Will he guarantee that these the Statement of Recurrent Expenditure of the infection control arrangements will be in Office of Speaker for the period 1 July 1992 to place at every school dental service by 30 June 1993 and the Estimates of the that date?” Legislative Assembly, the Parliamentary Mr HAYWARD: I seek leave to table the Service Commission and the Parliamentary answer and have it incorporated in Hansard. Service for 1993-94. Leave granted. As the Honourable Member has noted, this COMMITTEE OF SUBORDINATE Labor Government will extend the School LEGISLATION Dental Service to students in years 8, 9 and 10 commencing this financial year. The extension Report will begin with year 8 and will be progressively Mr J. H. SULLIVAN (Caboolture) (10.05 implemented through years 9 and 10 in coming a.m.): I lay on the table of the House the years. annual report of the Committee of Authoritative advice on infection control in Subordinate Legislation. I would like to thank dentistry can be found in the National Health members of the committee, Deputy Chairman, and Medical Research Council’s approved Len Stephan, the member for Gympie; Mr Guidelines for the prevention of transmission of Denver Beanland, the member for viral infection in dentistry(1992). Indooroopilly; Mr Gordon Nuttall, the member These guidelines recommend the use of a for Sandgate; Mr Peter Pyke, the member for sterile handpiece for each patient and Mount Ommaney; Mr Stephen Robertson, the autoclaving as the preferred method of member for Sunnybank; and Miss Fiona sterilisation. Simpson, the member for Maroochydore, for The NH&MRC guidelines provide the basis for their valuable contribution to the work of the the policy that has subsequently been committee. developed by the Australian Dental Association. The ADA’s policy on this matter states: Legislative Assembly 4605 5 October 1993

“The Association, recognising that to reputation as a high performance funds achieve autoclaving of handpieces may manager. require a considerable outlay for new In its fifth year of operation, the return of 11.4% equipment, recommends that universal is a satisfying result given that it compares with sterilisation of handpieces by autoclaving an asset weighted average return of 10.9% as be introduced in practice over the next 18 measured by the In Tech Survey of Pooled months, to be implemented by the end of Superannuation Funds. 1993.” QIC has been able to successfully combine the Members will note that this is a desire to maximise client returns with the need recommendation from the ADA to its members. for a disciplined and conservative approach to In my meetings with the ADA the Association investment management. has been pleased to point out that dentists The returns for the five largest pooled were moving quickly to implement the superannuation funds in the In Tech survey is recommended policy. The Association is listed as follows: justifiably proud of its record of effectiveness in the area of professional self regulation. FUND RETURN SIZE OF FUND The performance standards of the School MLC Growth 12.7% $893 million Dental Service are also of a comparable level to MLC Balanced 12.2% $2.7 billion those in private dentistry. BT 10.8% $3.8 billion WESTPAC 10.3% $893 million Heat sterilisation of instruments using the steam AMP Market Linked 9.1% $931 million autoclave has been accepted practice in AMP Balanced 7.6% $2.6 billion school dental clinics since 1975. Older However, it must also be remembered that the equipment that could not withstand the rigours real proof of a funds managers performance is of repeated autoclaving is being replaced. in consistency over time. It is therefore even I am advised that this replacement program will more pleasing to note that over a three year meet the ADA’s recommended deadline. period, QIC’s average annual net return of Finally I should point out that, despite the 12.1% easily exceeds the pooled sensationalist, media driven approach to health superannuation funds average of 10.3%. policy sometimes adopted by Members QIC is in the business of managing investments opposite, the public is entitled to be confident on behalf of a number of public sector in the standards of infection control adopted superannuation funds. by the dental profession. Therefore the members of public I will quote again the words of the Australian sector superannuation funds and the Dental Association. The Federal President of Government as the employer reap the benefits the Association, Dr Fred Widdop recently said: from QIC's performance. “..the facts are: There is no confirmed For those Government employees who instance of a patient catching a disease participate in accumulation schemes, these from a dentist’s handpiece, anywhere in benefits are realised immediately through the world (and certainly not in Australia).” above average returns credited to members Australian dentists are out there doing a good accounts. job and the School Dental Service can hold its For defined benefits funds (which means the own with the best of them. benefits are calculated according to salary, contribution rate and length of scheme membership) members can rest assured that 2. Queensland Investment Corporation the solid performance of QIC enhances Mr BARTON asked the Treasurer— considerably the financial strength of their fund. “As the Queensland Investment Corporation has announced a return on The Government also gains through the investment performance enhancing the viability investment for the year 1992Ð93 of of its superannuation schemes. The history of 11.4 per cent, how does this return having fully funded, actuarily sound compare to the returns of other major superannuation schemes has been a major investment houses in Australia and what factor in the maintenance of our unchallenged does it mean for the Government clients AAA rating. of the QIC and the 's costs for superannuation?” 3. Education Funding Mr De LACY: I seek leave to table the answer and have it incorporated in Hansard. Mr BARTON asked the Minister for Education— Leave granted. “With reference to the Leader of the The Queensland Investment Corporation Opposition's comments on ABC radio has in 1992/93 once again justified its earlier this week where he was critical of 5 October 1993 4606 Legislative Assembly

the Government's plans to increase the I am advised that up to 1700 teachers have level of funding for education to the already left the education system and the national average and claims that there Kennett Government plans to cut another 2400 has been no increase in service teachers. delivery— Premier Kennett and the Education Minister have refused to rule out the forced sackings of Is he aware of any other plans or teachers. proposals being pursued that would improve the level of service to students in After closing 55 schools last year, the Kennett Government last week confirmed that it be schools?” closing another 100 schools across the State. Mr COMBEN: I seek leave to table the Mr Borbidge’s criticisms of the Queensland answer and have it incorporated in Hansard. Government’s policy of increasing education Leave granted. funding to the national average can only mean he supports the policies of slash and burn I am aware of the Leader of the Opposition’s being pursued by the Victorian conservative criticisms on ABC Radio of the Government’s government. policy to increase the level of funding for education to the national average and his I challenge the Leader of the Opposition to claims that there has been no increase in declare his position. Does he support service delivery. increases in education funding or does he support the policies of the Kennett Clearly the Leader of the Opposition is out of Government? touch with what is happening in the Education Department or even schools in his own electorate. 4. Q Promotions Pty Limited As I have detailed in the House before schools Mr BEANLAND asked the Minister for and students throughout the State and in the Tourism, Sport and Racing— Leader of the Opposition’s electorate have benefited from the $384 million annual real “(1) Did he approve the registration of the increase in education funding, including business name, Queensland's increased funds for capital works, school Racing Incentive Scheme, by grants, literacy and numeracy and computers in Q Promotions Pty Limited? schools. (2) If so, when did he grant approval Over the past four years this Government has and did he seek legal advice from lifted level of funding for education so spending on our State’s children has risen from the Government's legal officers one of the lowest in the nation to one of the before doing so? highest. (3) Why did he not register the QRIS Given these achievements and the criticisms by name as being the property of the the Leader of the Opposition the people of Queensland Government, in view of Queensland are entitled to ask what other the fact that the total funding for the plans, proposals or policies would the QRIS, $1.5m, is met by the Opposition pursue if they were the Queensland Treasury?” Government. Mr GIBBS: I seek leave to table the Well it seems the Leader of the Opposition has answer and have it incorporated in Hansard. only one policy and that is to stop the increases in education funding. Leave granted. In particular, I draw honourable members The answer to the Honourable Member’s attention to his comments in a Courier-Mail questions are as follows:- feature article on him some weeks ago where (1) The name, Queensland Racing Incentive he proudly claimed “Labor’s Achilles heel” as: Scheme (QRIS), was supported by the "The Government’s obsession with taking Queensland Bloodhorse Breeders spending up to the national average". Association (QBBA) for the modification Clearly Mr Borbidge is opposed to this of the Racing Incentive Scheme to more increase in education spending. specifically target Queensland-bred horses. The registration of the QRIS logo Clearly he supports the policies being pursued was performed by Q-Promotions Pty Ltd. by his conservative colleagues in Victoria Q-Promotions is a non-profit company where they are gutting the education system. appointed by the QBBA to be the The Victorian Budget delivered last month marketing and promotion arm for the confirmed the Kennett Government’s plans to QRIS. Cabinet approved the QRIS cut a further $145 million from the education concept to be co-ordinated by Budget. Q-Promotions, and the Government has allocated $1.5 million from the Racing Legislative Assembly 4607 5 October 1993

Development Fund as added stakes for Leave granted. Queensland-bred horses competing in approved races. The $1.5 million will not 1. The Australian Bureau of Statistics is go through the books of Q-Promotions or currently compiling 1992/1993 financial year’s the QBBA. The races will be allocated criminal statistics and these will not be available and supervised through the normal until November/December 1993. process, whereby the Queensland The number of appearances resulting in Principal Club approves programs Community Service Orders imposed by the submitted by race clubs. Magistrates Courts, was: (2) Approval for the QRIS was given by 1990/91—7,187 (6,013 Males and 1,174 Cabinet and as such was subjected to Females) due processes for a Cabinet decision. 1991/1992—10,003 (8,443 Males and (3) It is rather interesting to observe that here 1,560 Females) we have a situation of a Government The source of these statistics is the Australian liaising with the QBBA in order to Bureau of Statistics. Attached is Table 23— stimulate the Queensland breeding Magistrates Courts Appearances Resulting in industry and to provide incentive stakes Community Service Orders: Offence Group by money for Queensland-bred animals. The Type of Disposal, Queensland, for the 1990/91 Opposition, so-called proponents of and 1991/92 financial years. private enterprise, seeks to destroy the 2. The number of appearances resulting in initiative taken by the QBBA, which is a conviction for breach of Community Service private enterprise incorporated Orders imposed in the Magistrates Court for association and has as its primary aim the 1990/91 and 1991/92 was 567 (489 Males and promotion and advancement of the 78 Females) and 324 (282 Males and 42 interests of the bloodhorse and its Females) respectively. breeders in Queensland. The Government supports this initiative of the The source of these statistics is the Australian bloodhorse breeders of Queensland and Bureau of Statistics table 14b Magistrates does not consider it appropriate for Courts Appearances Resulting in Conviction: Government to involve itself in the day-to- Offence with Most Serious Outcome by Type day operations of the Scheme. of Disposal, Queensland. As previously Therefore, it would not be appropriate for mentioned, the 1992/93 financial year’s criminal the Government to be registering statistics are not available. business names or logos. This function is 3. No statistics are kept regarding offenders better left within the industry, and the who have been further dealt with by the Courts Government’s role is to support industry for breach of Community Service Orders. initiatives. This venture has been hailed by the bloodhorse breeders of Queensland as the most significant ever in QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE terms of developing and promoting the Director, Queensland Government Office, thoroughbred breeding industry in Tokyo; Mr R. Tilley Queensland. Mr BORBIDGE: I ask the Premier: can he confirm that his appointment of Mr Ronald 5. Community Service Orders Tilley as Director of the Queensland Mr BEANLAND asked the Minister for Government Office in Tokyo was reversed Justice and Attorney-General and Minister for shortly after it was reported that Japanese the Arts— police had arrested three men connected with the same company with which Mr Tilley had “(1) How many community service orders been involved? were imposed by the Magistrates Mr W. K. GOSS: I cannot do that. I am Courts in 1991-92 and 1992-93? not aware of any connection between the (2) How many breaches of the terms of reported arrest of various individuals in Japan community service orders imposed and the termination of the proposed by the Magistrates Courts in each of appointment of Mr Tilley. Apart from that, all these periods have been reported? that I can say is that, at this stage, the reasons for the termination, which was (3) In how many of the cases in (2) have decided by Mr Harris, the Director of the Trade offenders been further dealt with by and Investment Development Division, remain the courts for breaches of such personal between the department and Mr orders?” Tilley and may be the subject of litigation. Mr WELLS: I seek leave to table statistics and have the answer incorporated in Hansard. 5 October 1993 4608 Legislative Assembly

Director, Queensland Government Office, agencies and other agencies with an interest Tokyo; Mr R. Tilley and information in this area. The Mr BORBIDGE: I ask a further question recommendation from the selection panel and of the Premier: why did he recommend to the the department came not only after the Governor in Council the appointment of Mr normal selection and interview process but Ronald Tilley as the new director of the also after checks had been done with those Queensland Government Office in Tokyo agencies. when there had been extensive media Mr Borbidge interjected. coverage of investigations by Japanese law Mr SPEAKER: Order! I warn the Leader enforcement agencies into Mr Tilley’s business of the Opposition under Standing Order 123A. affairs? Did the Premier contact those Japanese law enforcement agencies prior to making this appointment? Gordonstone Mine Mr W. K. GOSS: The appointment did Mr PITT: I direct a question to the not proceed. Mr Tilley did not come into the Premier. Given the importance of the mining department on the basis of any interview or industry to Queensland and Australia, can the selection process carried out by me. The Premier outline to the House the importance normal advertisement and selection process of the new coalmine at Gordonstone, which is was carried out by the department and a being opened today? What role has the State panel organised by the department. Unlike the Government had in the development of that previous Government, this Government does project? not comprise politicians who make political Mr W. K. GOSS: I am pleased to inform appointments of their mates and hacks to members that the Gordonstone coalmine in overseas offices. The Leader of the central Queensland will open today. It is Opposition may prefer the old—— another initiative of this Government which Mr Borbidge interjected. has brought great benefits to this State. It Mr SPEAKER: Order! The Leader of the involved 800 jobs in the construction phase Opposition! I am on my feet. I cannot hear the alone. The sum of $500m was spent in the Premier. I demand order. I call the Premier. development phase, much of it with Australian companies. It now involves 450 permanent Mr Gilmore interjected. jobs and an annual injection into the Mr SPEAKER: Order! The member for Queensland economy of $80m. In addition to Tablelands! I warn him under Standing Order those massive economic benefits and 123A. employment creation benefits, the mine is Mr W. K. GOSS: The Leader of the also very much a breakthrough in Opposition may prefer the old system under environmental terms, because it involves the the Nationals whereby the Government of the monitoring and management of the day—the politicians—would appoint their environment and the restoration and mates and party hacks to overseas offices. rehabilitation of the site to new high The policy of this Government is to appoint standards. Once again, this initiative was people who have expertise in trade and introduced by this Government, because commerce, particularly in that overseas issues such as that were ignored by the country. This Government’s policy is also to previous Government. When the mine is have an independent panel select those finished its business, a picturesque and persons. healthy landscape will remain. Mr FitzGerald interjected. I draw the attention of the House and the community to the benefits of the mining Mr SPEAKER: Order! I warn the member industry generally for Queensland and for Lockyer under Standing Order 123A. Australia. Mining in Australia provides benefits Mr W. K. GOSS: And furthermore, it of about $28 billion per year in exports, makes those recommendations to 80 000 people in direct employment and over Government only—— 200 000 people in indirect employment. The Mr Borbidge: You got it wrong. bottom line is that the mining industry is very important to Queensland and Australia. Mr W. K. GOSS: I ask the member to Lately, there has been some criticism from listen. It makes the recommendation to some quarters about people and some Government on the successful applicant only Governments being too concerned about the after the normal interview and selection interests of the mining industry. I want to place process has been completed and appropriate on record—and I will be saying this to the checks have been made with law enforcement Legislative Assembly 4609 5 October 1993 mining industry community later today when I introduced it. Yet the Leader of the Liberal open the mine—that anybody who is not Party sanctimoniously says that we have concerned about the mining industry is not introduced a new tax. concerned about jobs and a stronger Mr Hobbs: It’s a new tax and you know it. Australian economy. Mr SPEAKER: Order! The member for I also give credit to the main partner, Warrego! Arco, the American company. When we were trying to work with Arco to get that mine off the Mr De LACY: Despite all the things that I ground, it could not have proceeded with the have just said, the member for Warrego says mine under the then operative foreign that it is still a new tax. That tax has been in investment guidelines. Only after personal place for 12 years. submissions from me to the then Federal Mr Hobbs: It’s expanded. Treasurer, Mr Keating, was there a relaxation Mr De LACY: It has not expanded. It is of the guidelines and the company was able not imposed upon a single transaction that to proceed in circumstances in which no was not taxed before. If the honourable Australian equity was prepared to come member were fair, he would admit that we forward. Arco has been prepared to do that. I have abolished a tax. We have not introduced give credit to that company and to the former a new tax. We have not expanded the ambit Treasurer, Mr Keating, for his commitment of the old tax. and dispensation to allow that mine to proceed. Domestic Coal Royalty Bank Accounts Tax Mrs SHELDON: In directing a question to the Treasurer, I refer to his transparent royalty Mr PITT: In directing a question to the on domestic coal, which is a dangerous tax on Treasurer, I refer to the claim that the jobs, and particularly to the many jobs Government is introducing a new tax on bank provided by big private sector employers such accounts, and I ask: is there any truth in this as Queensland Nickel, Queensland Cement claim? and Lime, MIM and Queensland Alumina Mr De LACY: The short answer is no, Limited who rely on domestic coal in their there is no new tax. In fact, the tax is so old furnaces. Under the Treasurer’s plan, QAL will that it was introduced by Malcolm Fraser. This pay an extra $2m per year. So in terms of Government has done absolutely nothing to jobs, the Treasurer’s new tax burden may cost expand the types of transactions on which the up to 50 positions in that workplace alone. I tax applies. It applies to exactly the same ask: how much will each of those companies transactions as it did in the past. It applies on pay and how many Queenslanders will lose withdrawals from cheque accounts. This their jobs as a result? Government has done absolutely nothing to Mr De LACY: The honourable Leader of change that. In the Budget, we increased the the Liberal Party is reaching new standards in tax by 10c as a trade-off for abolishing cheque the questions that she asks. stamp duty. That is all that happened. From listening to the Leader of the Liberal Party Mrs McCauley: Just answer it. carrying on, one would think that this Mr De LACY: I will answer it. The number Government had introduced a new tax. We of jobs that will be lost is nil. That is the short did not introduce a new tax. answer. The Leader of the Liberal Party talks The Leader of the Liberal Party ought to about it costing QAL $2m. The fact is that, at have a look at what has happened in other the behest of the mining industry, we have States. We actually had this tax imposed been reviewing the coal royalties system for upon us or transferred to us from in the last two or three years. We have 1991. As soon as it was transferred, the introduced a regime that has received Liberal State of New South Wales doubled it. universal acceptance from the mining industry. We did not double it at all. The other States of The honourable member refers to the Australia also doubled it. Not only did they domestic coal royalty. It is anomalous, and it double the bank accounts debits tax but they would be anomalous to have a royalty of 7 per also introduced another new tax called the cent on export coal and to have a royalty of 5c financial institutions duty, which caught up all per ton, which has been in place for over 100 the transactions that were not covered by the years, on domestic coal. That would be bank accounts debits tax. If we introduced tantamount to a subsidy on domestic coal and that tax in Queensland, it would be worth the users of domestic coal. something like $100m. We have not 5 October 1993 4610 Legislative Assembly

In the last day or two, many comments Mr SPEAKER: Order! I have plenty of have been floated about increases in time today. electricity prices. I hope members opposite are Mr De LACY: Mr Speaker, I assure you not hanging by their fingernails waiting for that I do not need any prompting to answer those so-called increases in electricity prices in questions from the Leader of the Liberal Queensland, because there simply will not be Party. I read the article in the Australian real increases in electricity prices as a Financial Review. If the Leader of the Liberal consequence. Party was fair, she would say that it was As for its impact on the other users—just mostly a positive article. let me say that the tax is on the producers; it is not on the users. To the extent that they It made no reference to the fact of the have to negotiate or renegotiate the prices, domestic royalty; it referred to the fact that the that is up to them. However, we have had institutional investors may not be investing in some discussions with all of those users. In the purchase of the power station. The fact, just last week, I discussed it with QAL, honourable member needs to understand that and as a consequence of our discussions, we what was implied in that article is that there propose to increase it by 1 per cent a year are different investment objectives between over seven years. So the $2m impact on QAL those who are investing in the power station that the honourable member is talking about and those who have a stake in the Boyne is going to be in seven years’ time. It will be Island smelter. It is in the interests of the increased by only 1 per cent a year. Boyne Island smelter operators to give as low a price as possible for power. That may mean Mrs Sheldon: It is going to cost QAL that the return on investment for the power $2m. station is not as great as that which Mr De LACY: That is a fact. The increase institutional investors would like. That is a of $2m will be in seven years’ time—not matter between the institutional investors and today—because, starting next year, it will Comalco. increase by only 1 per cent. We have The honourable member calls it a undertaken to review it in three years’ time to “transparent” royalty—as though there is consider its impact on domestic users, and we something wrong with a transparent royalty, will do that. However, to try to beat up a story even though the industry has been calling for and pretend that it is going to cost jobs in transparent royalties since the National Party Queensland is just wrong. It is absolutely introduced its hidden royalties 20 years ago. outlandish. So the industry has been calling for a transparent royalty, and we are giving them a Coal Tax transparent royalty. Mrs SHELDON: In directing my next There was nothing in that story in the question to the Treasurer, I again refer him to Australian Financial Review that made his transparent royalty system on domestic reference to the fact that the domestic coal coal and the page 1 report in the Australian royalty would have an impact on whether or Financial Review yesterday about his not the sale of the Gladstone Power Station Gladstone Power Station deal hitting a snag. goes ahead. The implication in the last part of Given that Comalco is desperately seeking a the honourable member’s question about how way to overcome abysmal world prices for many jobs or what export income would we aluminium, and is buying the station to secure lose in Queensland if we lose the sale of the a cheaper supply of power and justify a billion- power station and we lose the consequent dollar expansion of the Boyne Island expansion of the Boyne Island smelter is just aluminium smelter, I ask: how many wrong. Once again, it just proves that the permanent and construction jobs, and how honourable member is not able to draw the much tax revenue and export income will be right conclusions, even though she goes out lost to Queensland if his coal tax sinks this of her way to read the Australian Financial billion-dollar project? Review. Mr De LACY: The—— Mrs Sheldon: Oh, Wayne’s prompting Queensland Manufacturing Industry you. Mr LIVINGSTONE: I ask the Minister for Mr SPEAKER: Order! Business, Industry and Regional Mrs Sheldon: Well, he just did. Development: is he aware of recent comments on the level of State Government taxes and charges and their impact on Legislative Assembly 4611 5 October 1993 manufacturing industry in Queensland? Can In the manufacturing sector, we have the Minister inform the House as to whether seen significant growth in manufacturing there has been any growth in manufacturing exports, with $5.2 billion last year as against in Queensland in the past four years? $3.2 billion when we first came to Government Mr ELDER: I certainly can inform the and, in fact, it was the first time that they House that there has been significant growth outstripped exports of raw materials of $4.9 in the manufacturing sector in Queensland billion. What we have seen is a significant over the past four years. In this State, when broadening and maturing of the Queensland the Opposition was in Government, they were economy, particularly in the manufacturing happy to either dig it up or grow it and ship it sector. We have also seen a significant overseas. There was little manufacturing; diversification of that sector. A good example there was little value-adding. One only has to of that would be the $43m Evans Deakin light look at ABS figures and the previous National rail contract to Kuala Lumpur that was Party Government’s own record—they announced this week. That will create more demonstrate that trend. jobs in the Maryborough district. I know that the member for Maryborough will be pleased In terms of manufacturing growth, this with that. In all, there has been a significant Government has achieved—— increase in manufacturing in this State, all Mr Elliott interjected. because of the taxation and industry policies Mr SPEAKER: Order! I warn the member put in place by this Government. for Cunningham under Standing Order 123A. Mr ELDER: In terms of manufacturing Local Authority Leaders growth, this Government has implemented the Mr LIVINGSTONE: My second question following very simple and good measures. It is to the Minister for Housing, Local has achieved growth in employment over the Government and Planning. I refer the Minister last three years from 135 000 to 175 000, to discussions that have taken place recently with 10 per cent growth in the last year. In among members of the Local Government terms of our productivity in the manufacturing Association about the title of council and shire sector— in the March quarter of this year, leaders in Queensland. What does the there was a 45 per cent increase in output—a Government intend to do in respect of this 16 per cent increase in production in this issue? State, compared with an increase of around 0.8 per cent nationally. Why? Because taxes Mr MACKENROTH: In answer to the on business in this State are lower. Input honourable member’s question—on the last taxes are lower in this State than they are in day that Parliament sat, I mentioned that I any other State in Australia. We have a far would be meeting with some lady chairmen to more competitive environment that enables talk to them about the title. Can I say that the businesses in this State to grow. Government has left no stone unturned in relation to this matter in an effort to come up I have heard the talk from the Opposition with an appropriate title for the elected leaders about labour costs and add-on costs. Let me of local authorities in Queensland. I had the say that it costs twice as much to employ Parliamentary Counsel check for me on the someone in Victoria than it does to employ meaning of the word “chairman”, because it someone in Queensland. In New South Wales has been said in local authority circles over the and Victoria, those costs are in excess of last year that the word “chairman” comes from $1,500 and $1,900 respectively, while in the word “manus”, meaning the hand—in Queensland they average around $900. other words, to manage the chair. The The Opposition says that payroll tax is Parliamentary Counsel advises me that, another tax that is an impost on business. The although he is not an expert on the word payroll tax threshold in this State is $700,000. “chairman”, he has checked it out with Most small businesses in this State do not pay Professor John Frow, who is Professor of payroll tax. In other States, the payroll tax English at the , and threshold is $500,000. Opposition members Dr Bernie Cox, who is Director of Teacher should consider the rates of those companies Education at the University of Queensland. He that do pay payroll tax. They pay 5 per cent, has also checked with the reference services compared with the national rate of 7 per cent. of the State Library of Queensland and the Companies in this State exist in a far more reference services of the University of competitive environment, and that has been Queensland. The consensus is that the fostered by the policies of this Government. Oxford English Dictionary is the authoritative source on its derivation. 5 October 1993 4612 Legislative Assembly

The word “chairman” was first mentioned land. I can assure him that bottom land has in 1654, when it was used in relation to a chief been sold as well. If one was going to put a being the man in the chair—and I emphasise big dam in there, one would have to fill that the word “man”. The second mention was in before one filled anywhere at the top. The 1660, when Sir G. Downing was referred to as land is being sold in accordance with the the chairman. There is no mention in the schedule agreed to by the South East Oxford English Dictionary of the derivation of Queensland Water Board. All the land that “man” in chairman and, in particular, no was formerly purchased by the previous support for the view that the word is derived Government to carry out this work will be from the Latin “manus”. I am informed that it is disposed of in accordance with that schedule at least equally arguable that the “man” in over a period, depending on the commercial chairman comes from the Anglo-Saxon “man” viability of sales. meaning human being. This is supported by An honourable member interjected. the entries that I have mentioned. If this view is correct, the term “chairman” has always Mr SPEAKER: Order! I warn the member been gender specific in the English language. for Southport under Standing Order 123A. Therefore, State Cabinet certainly could not Mr VIEVERS: I rise to a point of order. I refer to the ladies who are heads of local did not say a word. authorities in this State as men and, therefore, Mr SPEAKER: Order! There is no point of the new Local Government Act will refer to all order. The member will resume his seat. I elected leaders of local authorities in this State warn him again under Standing Order 123A. as mayors and elected representatives as councillors. Evans Deakin Industries Ltd Wolffdene Dam Mr BENNETT: In directing a question to the Minister for Transport and Minister Mr LINGARD: In directing a question to Assisting the Premier on Economic and Trade the Minister for Primary Industries, I refer to Development, I refer to the article in last the Goss Government’s absolute guarantee in Saturday’s Courier-Mail announcing that the 1989 to the people of the Wolffdene area that Queensland company Evans Deakin the Wolffdene dam would not be built. Since Industries Ltd has won a $43m light rail then the properties previously purchased by contract in Malaysia. I ask: what role has the the Water Board in the higher areas have Queensland Government played in facilitating been sold, but properties in the lower areas the signing of this contract? have been retained. Can the Minister give the people of the Wolffdene area an absolute Mr HAMILL: It was in fact a very welcome assurance that no investigations are under development to see Evans Deakin win this way and that there are no intentions to build a $43m contract for supplying light rail to Kuala weir, or a water treatment pond, or whatever Lumpur. Evans Deakin is in partnership with else it might be called, in the area where it AEG Bahn Systeme, a German company. was originally proposed to build the Wolffdene The benefits of the contract will be felt back dam? here in Queensland and, indeed, in Maryborough, where Evans Deakin runs a Mr CASEY: When it comes to the very successful manufacturing enterprise. honourable member, I am afraid that it takes Some 80 jobs will be generated over 12 a long time for things to sink in. As per the months, which will be of great benefit to that commitment given by the Goss Government community. It is very significant that, in the prior to its election in 1989, this Government article referred to by the honourable member, immediately took every step possible to stop the Chief Executive of Evans Deakin, Mr the construction of a dam at Wolffdene as Dennis O’Neill, remarked that the contract proposed by the former Government. The came about as a result of three years’ work by construction of that dam would have resulted Evans Deakin in trying to develop this in major disruption to property owners in that particular export. I might say that it area. This Government has met that demonstrates the commitment of Evans commitment and it will continue to meet that Deakin Industries to forge ahead and open up commitment. an export market. Evans Deakin has been There is no change—I repeat, “no very successful over recent years both in change”—in policy as regards the Wolffdene terms of its manufacture of rolling stock and dam. Of course, the member is so stupid that also its export of sugar mills onto world he says that the Government is selling off the markets. bottom land and not selling off the higher Legislative Assembly 4613 5 October 1993

With respect to this particular contract—I cent. The Queensland Government has been well recall the development work being put in pleased to support the strategic plan that has on that Malaysian market because Mr O’Neill, been brought forward by the Gladstone Port the Chief Executive of Evans Deakin Authority, which envisages substantial Industries Ltd, accompanied me on a trade expansion of the port of Gladstone over the mission to Malaysia back in 1990. During that next 10 years. trip, we had discussions with the Malaysian The port of Gladstone contributes Transport Ministry and officials in Kuala substantially to the economic growth of the Lumpur to try to take advantage of this region. The board of the Gladstone Port opportunity for Australian and Queensland Authority should be congratulated on the manufacturing industry and open up a new vision that it has brought to the management line of exports into what is a very dramatic and of the port and on its commitment to and growing market right on our doorstep. I think confidence in the continued growth of this demonstrates quite clearly the wisdom of Gladstone as a major industrial centre of the Goss Government’s approach to trade central Queensland. development in South East Asia. The success of Evans Deakin in winning a contract in Malaysia is a good example, but there are Enterprise Bargaining also cotton exports to Indonesia and sugar Mr SANTORO: In directing a question to exports to Taiwan. This Government’s the Minister for Employment, Training and enterprise in developing trade links with our Industrial Relations, I refer to Cabinet’s near neighbours is resulting in substantial decision dated 30 August 1993 on enterprise contracts being won by Queensland bargaining in the Queensland public sector, companies and is further developing our which was predominantly reported in the capacity as an exporter in the dynamic September edition of the SPSFQ publication, Asia/Pacific region. Public Sector Voice, and I ask: do those arrangements for agency-based bargaining Port of Gladstone include those officers or agencies who are officers of the Senior Executive Service? If Mr BENNETT: I direct a question to the not, what is the basis for increasing rates of Minister for Transport. Gladstone has been pay applicable to the SES, and why is there referred to as the future economic one rule for Dr Coaldrake and his band of powerhouse of Queensland. I ask: could the Mexicans and another for the bulk of honest, Minister please inform the House what role the hardworking public servants? port of Gladstone will play in the development of the city? Mr FOLEY: The honourable member’s question is based upon a false premise. The Mr HAMILL: Earlier, the Premier told the assertion that there is one rule for Dr House that it is a red-letter day for Coaldrake and others and one rule for other Queensland with the official opening of the persons is simply not founded in fact. The Gordonstone mine. It is also a red-letter day honourable member referred to the article in for Gladstone because, as the mining industry Public Sector Voice, a copy of which I have. is providing substantial benefits into the He referred correctly to the developments in community around Emerald, likewise the the enterprise bargaining principles that were development at Gordonstone is generating set out by Cabinet in its recent decision. further benefits for the community in Gladstone. Gladstone is a partner in the I take note of that, because that is the Queensland mining industry. The enormous same honourable member who, but a few development that is taking place at the port of weeks ago, purported to argue in this House Gladstone demonstrates quite clearly the that little was happening on the enterprise significance of the mining industry not only for bargaining front. I am grateful that the the economy of the State but also for the honourable member has drawn the attention economy of central Queensland. of the House to this, because modesty would have forbidden me to draw it to the attention Throughput at the Clinton wharf, the coal- of the House. handling facility at the port of Gladstone, is being extended so that, over the next two I thank the honourable member for years, the coal-loading facility at that point will adopting the words described in the article. I be able to handle a 30 million tonne capacity. assume that he referred to that The port of Gladstone itself continues to see paragraph—and I am provoked into this— significant trade growth. Over the last financial which stated— year, trade in the port increased by 3.9 per 5 October 1993 4614 Legislative Assembly

“The new measures adopted by the Under that provision already, the Powers Government are welcomed by the Union, Brewing award has been made and recently and the efforts of Matt Foley in particular the Coachtrans award was made by none are appreciated as he has displayed other than Commissioner Dempsey of the vision and astuteness in the field of Industrial Relations Commission in accordance industrial relations.” with the enterprise bargaining principles set I thank the honourable member for drawing out in the State wage case. The honourable that to the attention of the House. I am member should be aware that this legislation grateful that he has led us where modesty has been in operation for some three years in would otherwise have forbidden. Queensland. Mr Santoro: What are your views on Brereton’s expressed view? Enterprise Bargaining Mr SPEAKER: Order! I warn the member Mr SANTORO: Another non-answer, Mr for Clayfield under Standing Order 123A. Speaker. Mr FOLEY: I have drawn this to the Mr SPEAKER: Order! I ask members not attention of the Honourable Laurie Brereton, to comment on answers. the Federal Minister: the legislation has Mr SANTORO: I ask the Minister for achieved the two goals of the Labor Employment, Training and Industrial movement, namely, to ensure fair and Relations: is he aware of the Federal Industrial adequate protections for the rights of working Relations Minister’s longstanding campaign to people and to ensure labour market flexibility, include—and I really stress this—within the which is conducive to a high-productivity enterprise bargaining system, non-unionists? I economy such as we have. ask the question very deliberately: does the That balance that was so ably struck fully Minister support his Federal ministerial three years ago by the Honourable Nev counterpart in his often—and I repeat, often— Warburton when he introduced that legislation expressed belief that non-unionists—I repeat, to the House has seen the possibility of non-unionists—should be included within the enterprise bargaining in Queensland in enterprise bargaining system, or does he accordance with the principles set out in the side—and I again repeat, does he side—with State wage case of 1992 and under section the union movement in his attempts to scuttle 105 of the Industrial Relations Act. That the Brereton plan? A very specific answer! striking of the balance between the protection Mr FOLEY: I thank the honourable of the rights of workers and the need for member for the question. The matter has labour market flexibility is what the whole been on the political agenda for six months, current debate is about. People throughout and I have waited patiently for a question from Australia have looked with envy at the balance the honourable member. that has been struck here in Queensland and Mr Santoro interjected. at the way in which the Government has been able to generate 58 000 extra jobs over the Mr SPEAKER: Order! The member for past two years. Clayfield. Mr FOLEY: I have had to wait for the rybuck shearer from Burdekin to pose the Government Assistance to Industry question in the House. In the past couple of Mr BREDHAUER: I ask the Minister for weeks, the honourable member has been Business, Industry and Regional going about the countryside saying, “What is Development: can he outline any Government the Queensland’s Government’s attitude on assistance measures to industry which help this? What is Minister Foley’s attitude?” Yet, make companies more competitive and over the six months during the course of which efficient? the debate raged, he asked no questions at Mr ELDER: As a Government, we have all in the Parliament. been very pro-active indeed in that area. We Let me explain to the honourable have looked at the manufacturing and growth member that the Queensland Government cycle of companies and broken it down into made provision three years ago in this House, three phases: support where it is needed for through the efforts of the Honourable Nev research and development, support in the Warburton, to introduce legislation that has productivity stages at which they need been in place under section 10.1, now section assistance in terms of efficiencies and support 105, of the Industrial Relations Act, to allow in terms of targeting export opportunities. enterprise bargaining in the non-union sector. Legislative Assembly 4615 5 October 1993

In the research area, the Government quality items into Asia. We have the expertise has had to meet a gap in funding with the in this State to achieve that. Queensland Grants for Research and This afternoon, I will be travelling to Development or, as we call them, Q-GRAD. Canberra to visit Minister Griffith to consider That helps companies to develop that product how we can access some of that extra money through to the productive phase. The National for rural and regional Queensland. This State Industry Extension Service is vitally important has a productive economy. We offer better to help companies improve their efficiency, investment for those funds than do States improve their effectiveness, improve their south of the Tweed. We have growth in our productivity and, as I said before, give them a manufacturing sector across all areas, competitive advantage. including employment, manufacturing and Beyond that, through the Premier’s exports. That is a positive sign for this State. Department, another initiative of this Government which assists at the export phase, is the Queensland Export Education for Aborigines and Torres Strait Development Scheme. These three schemes Islanders are being targeted to assist companies in this Mr BREDHAUER: I ask the Minister for State to move their product through the Employment, Training and Industrial system so that Queensland’s economy can Relations: can he advise what role his broaden and mature. department is playing in promoting education The National Industry Extension Service for Aborigines and Torres Strait Islanders has been vitally important to this State, through RATEP—the Remote Area Teacher particularly for regional Queensland. In the Education Program—and the Aboriginal recent State Budget, funds for that scheme ranger training program? were increased by 35 per cent to $4.8m. The Mr FOLEY: I thank the honourable Federal Government has recognised the member for his question. His interest in and importance of the scheme and has provided commitment to the education of Aboriginal an extra $12.5m funding for it. As I said earlier and Islander people, particularly in remote to the member for Cook, the scheme is locations, are to be commended. The Remote beneficial to regional and rural Queensland. Area Teacher Education Program is indeed an Mr Connor: Ipswich is the unemployment inspiring program. I had the pleasure of capital of Queensland. visiting with the honourable member remote communities such as Kowanyama and Mr ELDER: The Paladin of the Mornington Island. I witnessed Aboriginal Queensland Parliament—have mouth, will people using the latest computer-aided travel. When it was in Government in this learning technology to train within their own State, the Opposition had a regional network communities so that they have the opportunity within my department of six offices and 12 to become community teachers. The people. Since we have been in Government, technology being used has been developed in those numbers have been expanded. We close cooperation with the James Cook now have some 13 offices and over 25 per University and has been developed in a way cent of my staff based in regional which is sensitive to and respectful of the Queensland. Who benefits from that? educational, intellectual and cultural traditions Regional businesses in the electorate of the of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander member for Cook; in the electorate of the Australians. member for Mulgrave; in the electorate of the member for Whitsunday; and in the The program is all about delivering electorates of Opposition members. When in training into the workplace and into the Government, the Opposition ignored the community. That is what the new technology industrial sector. My department, through the enables us to do. Whether it is the use of expansion to which I just referred, has computer-aided learning facilities such as assisted the industrial sector. RATEP, or whether it is the use of video conferencing facilities which allow the TAFE We have increased by some 30 per cent college at Mount Gravatt in to deliver the number of regional and rural Queensland a course in hydraulics to workers at the companies that are accessing the program. Comalco plant at Weipa, the same principle is Over the past 12 months, we have increased employed. funding to regional Queensland from $1.9m to some $2.2m. This Government realises that The Remote Area Teacher Education our future lies in exporting short-run, high- Program began in 1991. The first five students graduated in May 1993. I met one of those 5 October 1993 4616 Legislative Assembly students in Kowanyama. That lady had been Mr HAMILL: I do not believe that the a teacher aide in her own community. She honourable member for Caloundra is in any had gone through the program, had been way associated with that very dangerous able to obtain qualifications and was invention. The witch’s broom allows in-line employed as a community teacher. I spoke skaters to travel at speeds up to 80 kilometres with a number of students on Mornington per hour. I suggest that any reasonable Island and on Badu Island in the Torres person would regard skaters travelling at such Strait—— speeds along our roadways and footpaths as Mr SPEAKER: Order! The Minister is not only endangering themselves but also debating the question. endangering other pedestrians or road users. It is akin to the backpack which earlier this Mr FOLEY: May I finish the sentence, Mr year was proposed to propel in-line skaters at Speaker? high speed. I want to assure the House that Mr SPEAKER: Yes. the provisions which are being drafted to Mr FOLEY: Those persons were able to proscribe the use of those jet-packs for in-line complete that part of their course and are able skaters will also proscribe the new witch’s to go on to further studies to achieve higher broom, which is a motorised contraption which qualifications through the use of the same allows a skater to travel at high speed. technology. Quite frankly, anyone who is contemplating purchasing one of those contraptions—at a price which is reported to Sexually Explicit Material in Schools be some $1,780—would be well advised to Mr QUINN: In directing a question to the save their money. There is no place for them Minister for Education, I refer him to an on Queensland’s roads, and there is no place incident in which Year 10 students had access for them on Queensland’s footpaths. to sexually explicit material supplied by an Mr Gibbs interjected. officer of the Queensland AIDS Council during a HRE course at a Brisbane high school, and I Mr HAMILL: The Honourable the Minister ask: is this material being supplied to all offers to put on a special race— maybe a schools and/or to teachers at schools which handicap race—at Indy. I advise the the AIDS Council visits? Does the Government manufacturer to bring its mind to bear on believe that this material is appropriate for more useful and safer devices rather than school students and, if not, what action has endangering the lives of young people and the Government taken to ensure that such an other road users. incident does not occur again? Mr SPEAKER: Order! The time allotted Mr COMBEN: As I am not aware of the for questions has expired. specifics of the material to which the honourable member refers—but I assume that MATTERS OF PUBLIC INTEREST it is connected with the report about Dakabin high school in the weekend papers, about Director, Queensland Government Office, which I have already asked for further Tokyo; Mr R. Tilley information—I ask the honourable member to Mr BORBIDGE (Surfers Paradise— place the question on notice. Leader of the Opposition) (11 a.m.): The Mr QUINN: I do so accordingly. atrocious record of this Government in making senior appointments, particularly in its second term, is very revealing on the issue of rhetoric Rollerbladers versus performance. If we believe the Mr SZCZERBANIK: I ask the Minister for Government—if we believe the Premier this Transport: is he aware of a new invention morning—all is sweetness and light: do not which uses a small motor to propel blame him; he is only the Premier; he is not rollerbladers at speeds of up to 80 kilometres accountable; it is always someone else’s fault. an hour? In view of the danger that such an If we look at the record—if we look at the invention could pose on our roads, will the reality—all we can see is incompetence, buck Minister be approving its use? passing, deceit and arrogance. Mr HAMILL: Yes, I am aware of an I wanted to refer particularly today to the invention from the Sunshine Coast. It is called latest absolutely disgraceful performance of a witch’s broom. this Government in the on-off appointment of Mr Ronald Tilley as the Queensland Mr Gibbs: Mrs Sheldon. Government’s most senior overseas representative to the position of director of the Legislative Assembly 4617 5 October 1993

Tokyo office. Few, if any, of the appointments equivalent in the capital to the Tokyo of Queenslanders outside this State are as appointment in terms of seniority and important as this posting. Japan is our major importance. Behind the Government, as it trading partner. It is also a country where form approached this appointment, was a very and face are all-important. Things must be clear set of parameters established by Tony done properly. Any appointment to the Tokyo Fitzgerald. The commissioner had provided, in office must be considered very carefully his final report to the previous Government, a indeed. Yet now we see the entire State of very clear set of guidelines for how Queensland embarrassed by another appointments to the CJC should be handled. example of the glaring incompetence of, and He was prepared to tolerate, in the first lack of attention to, performance by this instance, on the basis of expediency, the Government. appointment of the inaugural chairperson by Mr Tilley’s appointment, announced in the Executive without reference to the August, was cancelled just weeks later, in Parliamentary Criminal Justice Committee. September, on the apparent basis of Thereafter, it was plain from the language in concerns well known to the Government his report that he intended that successive certainly no later than May. In other words, the appointments would only be made with the Government well knew that there were direct and total involvement of the committee. potential problems with this appointment at But what did we see from this least three months prior to its being made, but Government? We saw a blatant attempt to went ahead and made it and then had to railroad Mr O’Regan—the Premier’s avowed cancel it. If the Government tried, it could not personal choice for the job—into the have embarked on an episode more designed headquarters at without reference to to make us the laughing stock of the the PCJC. The Premier, with the clear Japanese business world. complicity of his Attorney-General, sought to I must admit that, when I saw the take advantage of the technicality whereby appointment, I was surprised—given what was the PCJC remained in limbo—was effectively then known about the concerns being non-existent—until this place was reactivated expressed in relation to Mr Tilley—that it had after the election. The so-called guardians of been made. No particular inside knowledge Fitzgerald used one of the cheapest, nastiest was required to be aware of the problems. All and most transparent tricks possible to try to one had to have was the price of a get past the people of Queensland an newspaper. appointment that they wanted to ensure was made. I want to make it very clear that Mr Tilley’s position to date remains unclear. He has been History has recorded that this move involved in a police investigation concerning ultimately got the short shrift it demanded, but some potentially very significant wrongdoing, only after the Opposition, along with other but nothing yet has been proved and no guardians of reform in this State, forced the charges have been laid. But the fact that he Government to defer to the committee. And it was under a cloud as a result of his took some doing. The Government did not like associations with some Japanese not getting its own autocratic way. businessmen was, as I said, accessible to the And then we had the equally unedifying Government via the price of a newspaper. spectacle of the assassination of part-time Although I wanted to make particular commissioner, Dr Janet Irwin, and her mention of that bungle today—considering it replacement by Barbara Mason. Who can brought to mind the growing record of this forget the Mason appointment? We should Government as being one of absolute never forget it, because the parallels with Mr negligence and mindless incompetence— Tilley are immense. References which were when one looks back at its record over the personally and persistently plugged and past 12 months, a retrospective on some of promoted by the Premier were nothing of the the most important appointments it is within sort. They were denied by their the power of Government to make over that authors—authors who included a former period provides a fitting tribute to the first year Governor of the State of Queensland, Sir of the second—and undoubtedly the last— Walter Campbell; a former Police term of this silly little Government. Commissioner, Noel Newnham; and a former Treasurer, Sir Llew Edwards. Let us consider the situation immediately after the 1992 election. The Government In that episode, we were treated to the wanted to appoint Mr Rob O’Regan, QC, to abysmal admission by the Attorney that, in the chairmanship of the CJC, at least the relation to one of the most sensitive 5 October 1993 4618 Legislative Assembly appointments in this State, he had made just appointment as director in the Queensland one phone call to check on the standing of a Government’s Tokyo office. The appointment person he proposed should have access to was announced after consideration by a some of the most sensitive documentation in Premier’s Department selection committee. the history of this State, who had been Queenslanders might well ask: what did they dismissed by her employer on the basis of an consider? Just a few weeks later, the alleged breach of the Privacy Act in relation to appointment was reversed. And it was credit information, and who was further reversed the day after police in Japan arrested accused by her employer of then engaging in three men connected with the same company a bid to cover up that alleged crime. This was with which Mr Tilley had been involved. the sort of person whom the Attorney and the There are at least as many questions in Premier were willy-nilly prepared to see this miserable episode as there were in become a commissioner of the CJC on one relation to the earlier bungled appointments. phone call. For instance, Mr Tilley’s contract was The Premier was dismissive of any terminated about a month after his criticism. “One had slipped through the net,” appointment, and still a month before he was he said, in what I think proved to be the last due to take up a three-year term. The people interview with the late 7.30 Report presenter of this State deserve to know what sort of bill Pamela Bornhorst, who has been made to they are going to have to foot for that suffer, like Janet Irwin, Max Bingham, Noel cancellation. The contract was for three years, Newnham, David Blizzard, Noel Gillard and and we have already seen from Premier’s Howard Baker, for this Government’s inability Department annual reports that appointees of to perform where it really matters—on the job. this Government can be given at least up to The parallels between the Mason effort $160,000 a year. What will it cost to cancel an and the Tilley effort are quite stark. As with Ms appointment that should never have been Mason, all that was required in relation to the made and which had not even begun? And Tokyo appointment was the slightest of effort how is the Government going to make up the to avoid embarrassment—the slightest damage that it has done to our reputation in pretence at due diligence. Let us have in mind Japan? Or is this just another one that has that Mr Tilley’s appointment was made in slipped through the net? August, and let us look at what the What a chain of gross incompetence! Government could have known had it had the What a chain of Goss incompetence! Unless price of a Courier-Mail at the end of May. this Government starts thinking about what it John Wright, from the Courier-Mail’s does and stops being preoccupied with Tokyo office, wrote at that time in a preening itself in the mirror, we might all be prominently published story that Japanese advised to try to slip through the net. This is a police had questioned a former Tokyo-based bungled appointment which, as I said at the Australian diplomat over an alleged $30m outset, is a disgrace and is part of a rapidly investment scam. The story said that the growing list of bungled appointments by this former diplomat, Mr Ronald Tilley, had been a Government. trade commissioner with the Australian Time expired. Embassy in Tokyo until the mid-1980s, whereafter he worked in the tourism industry on the Gold Coast. According to press reports Wik People’s Claim in Japan, the company with which Tilley was Mr BARTON (Waterford) (11.10 a.m.): connected collected $75m from over 300 Resolution of the Wik people’s claim is investors between 1984 and 1991 and told important to the Wik people, all them that their money would be invested in Queenslanders and, indeed, all Australians. Australian property. Instead of buying We could not leave a question mark hanging property, the company had used at least over all titles issued back to 1957 and before $30m of the funds to buy real estate, sponsor that. It is most important that we resolve this sporting competitions and set up numerous issue. I support the actions being taken by the shelf companies in Australia in contravention Queensland Government and the Australian of Japanese law. Government to the effect that, after the According to the Courier-Mail story, Mr debate is concluded, agreement will be Tilley said that police had spoken to him twice reached on a non-discriminatory basis on about the matter and he had given them a general validation of all titles—not just Weipa. statement. That was in May. In August, the We must do that to resolve this most difficult Government announced Mr Tilley’s and most emotive of issues. We must also accept that the Mabo decision determined Legislative Assembly 4619 5 October 1993 that native title is part of the common law of draw their alumina for use in that smelter from Australia. QAL in Gladstone. That alumina, of course, is The Mabo decision overturned the basis produced from bauxite from the Weipa mine. of land ownership within this country and this There are other smelters in Australia, including State. We cannot simply allow the decision in Tomago in Newcastle, where the partners the Wik people’s case to find its own level—its include Pechiney of France, CSR and AMP. own resting place. That is why it is important Again, they are dependent upon the Weipa that the discussions that have taken place mine being able to produce. between the Australian Government and the We must ask ourselves: what does this Queensland Government resolve this issue. It mean in terms of jobs? There are thousands is also important that the discussions that are of jobs in the mining industry in Queensland continuing even today between the various alone, including 740 employees in Weipa. Aboriginal groups and the Australian Both QAL and the Boyne smelter have similar Government resolve this issue. The Wik numbers of employees. There is also the people certainly do have rights—maybe not impact of the multiplier effect. Jobs are the rights that they claim, but Mabo would involved in shipping the product; coal indicate that they do have prior ownership suppliers; caustic soda; electricity; engineering over those lands. Decisions being taken by support; and local authorities. The investment the Federal Government and the Queensland to date is many billions of dollars. The Government are courageous. But I stress that production value of Comalco alone is $1.1 we cannot turn back the clock. We must billion per annum in Queensland alone and accommodate the development that has $1.3 billion per annum in Australia. taken place to date in Queensland and I want to stress that I am concerned Australia. We cannot simply go back to the about this issue because, unless the decision point at which white settlement took place in on the Wik people is resolved in the manner Australia and start all over again. that is being discussed by the Australian and Comalco, in particular, has very significant Queensland Governments—or essentially investments in Queensland that are important agreed to by the Queensland and Australian to jobs in this State. Those investments Governments—at risk in this State alone will include the Weipa bauxite mine and be some $1.75 billion in investment in the beneficiation plant and the QAL alumina plant purchase of the Gladstone Power Station and at Gladstone. Those investments involve the construction of the new capacity at the Comalco and a number of overseas partners. Boyne smelter for some 200 000 tonnes of Comalco’s current investments also include alumina production. This involves a third pot the Boyne smelter—with partners—and line, which will double the capacity of the Comalco Products in Brisbane. Those are smelter. This will mean many hundreds of jobs investments in Queensland alone. Comalco in the construction phase, plus a higher also has another investment at Weipa with its permanent production and maintenance work kaolin mine and processing plant. Although force. There is also the possibility of a new that is not an aluminium industry based alumina refinery being built at either Weipa or investment, it is nonetheless a significant Bowen. Comalco has indicated that it is close investment by that company in this State. to a decision on commitment to construct that Comalco has other major investments in this new alumina plant. To my knowledge, that region, including the Bell Bay smelter in plant has been under consideration for 15 Tasmania; the Southern Aluminium wheel years. A great deal of work has gone into plant in Tasmania, which is exporting high- studies to determine whether it will be built. grade aluminium wheels to Mercedes Benz Why must title be confirmed as proposed and BMW in Germany; and the Bluff smelter by the Queensland and Federal in , which relies for its production Governments? Firstly, investors will not finance on alumina that is produced in Gladstone. those new projects if there is any risk to land Each of those operations is ultimately title and the production of bauxite. Investment dependent upon the Weipa mine not only houses are very cautious. They are now being able to continue but also being able to investing mainly superannuation funds. I expand. As I said before, Comalco has assure the House that the superannuation partners in QAL. QAL Alumina supplies many trustees watch all their investments very overseas smelters. One which I visited some closely indeed to make sure that what is being years ago, and which has just been done with their dollars is not putting them at duplicated, was the Becancour smelter in risk. If there is any perceived risk in terms of Quebec Province in Canada. Some of the those investment houses, the investment partners, including Pechiney and Alcan, also dollars will not be available. This was 5 October 1993 4620 Legislative Assembly

Comalco’s problem until the announcement We have some tough decisions to make. on 20 August by the Federal Government of The Wik people must receive appropriate legislation to validate title. Of course, that compensation and support. On completion of decision by the Federal Government was mining, there is no reason that title cannot supported by the Queensland Government on and should not revert to the Wik people. that day—20 August. These types of Regeneration of the land at Weipa is a credit investment decisions may not have been a to Comalco. The Wik people would not receive problem in the 1980s, but certainly post Bond, a lunar landscape such as the Nauruans have post Christopher Skase, post the problems in recent years. It is not in the Wik people’s that the Westpac banking corporation has interests for those projects to be lost. A fair experienced, post the problems experienced solution is being found. The steps being taken by National Mutual and, of course, post the by the Federal Government and this State Mabo decision, banks and investment houses Government are very necessary in the simply will not take risks if there is any interests of all Queenslanders. possibility that land title will no longer exist. Another aspect that concerns me greatly is that we need to understand that we face the prospect of losing what we have now, not Mr SANTORO (Clayfield—Deputy Leader simply failing to gain new investments. of the Liberal Party) (11.20 a.m.): I want to talk Queensland has the only integrated about a matter of great importance to aluminium industry in Australia. We have Queenslanders, that is, the continuing murky mining, refining, smelting and some final backroom deals taking place within the product, although at this time it is at small Queensland ALP. The faceless men of the levels. We do not have the luxury of saying, Labor Party of the 1950s have given way to “Let’s hold what we have and accept that we bullies and number-crunchers who are quite cannot expand.” If we did this, the world’s ruthless in getting their own way. This is a aluminium industry would look to other matter of vital interest to the people of suppliers. Queensland, because they have to deal with this Government. They need to know just who For example, Guinea in West Africa has a it is they are dealing with, and from where larger mine and higher-grade bauxite. In the members of the ALP Government derive their Caribbean there are large mines with higher- support. grade bauxite in production. With no expansion capacity, some risk to existing The most recent display of brute, supplies and potentially falling market share factional power was that seen during the as customers turn to suppliers who are more Labor Party pre- secure and who can expand to meet demand, selections. Three sitting Labor aldermen were Comalco could probably run down dumped, purely for factional reasons. It is a maintenance and not invest in new sad day when a political party dumps elected technology in its existing plants. What we members whom it praises publicly as being have now would stagnate. I accept that, over hardworking and competent, purely because time—possibly over several decades—it could the factional bosses want to exert their be forced ultimately to close. influence. Members opposite say constantly that their aldermen are hardworking and In the interim, we would have the classic effective. It is an even sadder day when the problems of a rust-belt industry, ageing work Lord Mayor seeks to relieve their pain by force, declining productivity, loss of motivation, making an outrageous grab on the loss of potential earnings, bad industrial superannuation fund of the council. With a relations due to the frustrations brought about stroke of the pen, he increased their level of by all the earlier issues, lower living standards superannuation entitlement by $20,000 for and the decline of towns and cities where the aldermen, $33,000 for the Lord Mayor, and mines, plants and smelters exist. Coupled with made general increases across-the-board of this would be the loss of other industry which 150 per cent. the planned new developments would encourage. For example, consideration has The ALP in Queensland and nationally been given to foundries and machining plants believes that it can treat the people—the for auto exports and specialist alloy electors—like dirt, and get away with it. The production. Therefore, numerous small residents of Brisbane—even the Labor Party businesses to service and support these new voters of Brisbane—want to be able to elect industries as a result of the trickle-down and the candidates who will do the best job for multiplier effects would also come into them. They do not care whether or not that existence. candidate comes from the Left, the Right, or Legislative Assembly 4621 5 October 1993 the centre. Sadly, many ALP supporters are defeated for the Labor Party’s endorsement in being denied the chance of doing that, and of the city council ward of Moorooka. The supporting their sitting alderman, because the Premier spent a good deal of time personally factional bosses—the union heavies—could lobbying for Mr Mickel, the AWU’s candidate, not care less about finding the right man or but to no avail. I am told that people within the woman for the job. All they want to do is Premier’s office are actually thinking that they increase their personal power and prestige would be better off working under Mr Beattie, through factional deals and number-crunching because at least he is able to deliver factional or, as it should be called, people-crunching. support to somebody such as Mr Hinchliffe, It now appears that even the Deputy whom everybody knows was his favourite. Mayor of Brisbane, Alderman John Campbell, Nevertheless, there is talk of people not being is in danger of losing his job as Deputy Labor happy working in the Premier’s office because Leader—if he was to win, that is—because the it is not worth very much when the Premier Left Wing does not want him, given his dismal cannot even deliver an endorsement for a performance in protecting those members of Brisbane City Council ward to his principal his own faction who lost their endorsements. private secretary. Of course, members of the overall team Mr FitzGerald: He will never work there. certainly will not support a Left Winger such as Mr SANTORO: I take that interjection John Campbell, who is the Mayor’s choice for from my honourable colleague. Mr Beattie’s Deputy Mayor, because the Mayor is not loyal performance is certainly much better than that to the team; he is loyal only to the whims of of the Premier in many areas, particularly in the leaders of the Left faction. However, delivering factional support. despite this mayhem at the city council level, it appears that the sway of the Left Wing of the The personal animosity between the ALP in Queensland is increasing. Others refer Premier and Lord Mayor Soorley is well to that section of the party as the “loony Left”, known. No-one was more surprised than the but I will not do so. Premier when Mr Soorley won the mayoralty. He immediately sent ministerial staff to the Even the Premier is finding the going Lord Mayor’s office to keep an eye on things tough, now that Bill Ludwig and his AWU and to keep Alderman Soorley under control. mates are finding it more and more difficult to Now it appears that the Left is exacting its call the shots. It seems that the AWU’s power revenge by causing the Premier and the AWU base was eroded somewhat when Paul some problems. Honourable members will Keating won the Labor leadership. That is not remember the ongoing saga earlier this year surprising, given that Mr Ludwig publicly about which faction would win the State threatened ALP members who supported Secretary’s job at Labor Party headquarters. Keating with death. The Left wanted that job, as well as the Mr Beattie: Would Paul Everingham ever position of Assistant Secretary. In the end, the do that? AWU won out, and its choice was elected to Mr SANTORO: Never. But I will tell the the position, but at a cost which has seen the honourable member what happened. Mr Bill Left get what it has wanted ever since. Ludwig did threaten Labor members in that All honourable members on this side of way. Since then, whether coincidental or not, the House have been following with the AWU and the Premier’s faction has lost a amusement, interest and considerable dismay considerable amount of its clout. Just ask the goings-on within the Ipswich City Council. whingeing Wayne Swan, who really felt that In that case, we have a Labor council which is he did have something to whinge about when controlled by the Left, and which has chosen the Prime Minister bucketed him in front of the to dump its own leader because he wanted entire Labor caucus for daring to criticise the the council to be accountable. Alderman Federal Budget, for which he then voted. Mr Underwood believes that the reason he was Swan’s motives may well have been expelled from the ALP caucus was his plan to opportunistic and his comments motivated by release material relating to expenses of past self-interest but, no matter, he made his point. Labor councils in Ipswich. The mayor wanted He also made an enemy of the Prime Minister to make public the details of aldermanic and his supporters. expenses for the past 110 years or so, It is no wonder that the AWU’s hold over including travel and entertainment expenses. the ALP is not what it was in the heady days More interestingly, he planned to expose after the 1989 election. Even the Premier had details of council-paid work on the properties to eat some humble factional pie when his of the Ipswich City Council aldermen, including own private secretary, John Mickel, was 5 October 1993 4622 Legislative Assembly construction work, repairs, mowing, gardening Government to drop its education cuts if their and painting. union affiliated with the ALP. There was no Mr Beattie: You don’t believe that. question in Dawson Petie’s mind that they would get a better deal if they gave money to Mr SANTORO: I do believe that. Because the Labor Party. This is what the people of he required this level of accountability, the Left Queensland are facing these days. They are Wing of the ALP chose to dump Alderman facing increasing union pressure and Underwood, so that its past dealings could increasing union intimidation of ALP remain hidden in the shadows. A member of Governments at all levels. Irrespective of the ALP who has tried to live up to the ideals whether it is at a city council level or at a State of accountability has been assassinated by his level, the heavies are moving in. If they do not own party, apparently because he just did not get their way, the heavies act as I have realise that hypocrisy is the key. Members of indicated. the ALP say that they believe in accountability, they tell people that they Time expired. practise it, but they then turn around and do the exact opposite. Enterprise Agreements Even Alderman Underwood calls the Labor Party’s campaign against him a Mr NUTTALL (Sandgate) (11.30 a.m.): It campaign of evil. The Left Wing, acting at the is interesting to note that today in the gallery behest of its union bosses, is ruthlessly we have some children from one of Brisbane’s attempting to undermine a democratically schools. I think it is important that those kids elected mayor. Union leaders in Ipswich say have a good look at the Opposition that they that they will not support Alderman have in this State of Queensland, because Underwood because he has not given them a right underneath where they are sitting there fair go. What is the reason for their anguish? are four members of the Opposition, and out The mayor actually wants to reform the of those four members there is only one from council’s industrial relations practices. the Liberal Party. When they go back to Alderman Underwood says that the two issues school—— at the heart of this debacle are corruption on An honourable member: Two. the part of council members and excessive union power. Undoubtedly, these two are Mr NUTTALL: There are two. I stand linked. As the mayor noted, union leaders corrected. have actually turned up at council meetings to Mr LAMING: I rise to a point of order. The ensure that the Labor members voted in the point of order is that it is an inaccuracy. There way in which they were told to vote. That is are two members of the Liberal Party here. blackmail, and should be treated as such. Alderman Underwood said— Mr SPEAKER: Order! There is no point of order. “It was like watching a puppet show, with the puppeteers sitting up in the Mr NUTTALL: It clearly shows that they empty gallery”. are very touchy about that issue. So when the children go back to their classrooms and when This is truly outrageous. It highlights how they do their assignments on Parliament, they union power actively undermines democratic should make sure that they report that only government in this nation, and shows us all two members of the Liberal Party were in their where the balance of power in a Labor Parliament when they came to visit. It is a Government really lies. This is the ugly face of disgrace to the Liberal Party and a disgrace to unionism. It is a flagrant grab for power, based the Opposition. on what the Mayor of Ipswich calls blackmail and intimidation. We have heard today another tirade by I ask Government members: who do they the member for Clayfield not only regarding support? Do they support Alderman the ALP but again attacking the trade union Underwood, the democratically elected mayor, movement. As recently as last week, the or do they support the Left and its hijackers of member for Clayfield attacked the issue of the council? The arrogance of union leaders enterprising bargaining in Queensland. I have and factional bosses borders on the stood up in this Chamber on a number of incredible. Honourable members should occasions and espoused the virtues of remember the recent comments by the enterprise bargaining and the worthwhile Secretary of the Queensland Branch of the contribution of the trade union movement in ACTU, Dawson Petie, who said that teachers this State. would have a better chance of convincing the Legislative Assembly 4623 5 October 1993

This morning, I intend to deal further with gives them meaning in life. It gives them the that subject and refer particularly to some of opportunity to build on their careers, and it the enterprise agreements that we have gives them the opportunity to say to their managed to achieve in this State through children that Queensland is a good State in cooperation with the trade union movement which to work, that we do have a good and employers. Most particularly, I would like industrial relations system and that it is one of to address claims that this Government is which we should be justly proud. standing in the way of productivity agreements The enterprise bargaining agreement at that are being established. Already there are a the Golden Circle Cannery at Northgate has significant number of enterprise bargaining been an outstanding example of the merits agreements registered in Queensland involved in a consultative and a participative workplaces, and there are approximately 53 approach between employees and agreements which are certified with the management. They have so far implemented Queensland Industrial Relations Commission measures such as flexible shift work and which cover a wide range of industries in arrangements which match the changing this State. needs of that enterprise. In addition, they These agreements, of course, typically have a continual program of employee have two objectives: firstly, and most training, and skills development has become importantly, to achieve productive and flexible essential in creating a more productive working arrangements which are necessary to workplace. Once again, long-term benefits maintain a high level of competitiveness here have flowed on to the workers involved, and in Queensland. Of course, Queensland can continuous reviews will take place to ensure only continue to be successful internationally that improvements in productivity and through the cooperation and teamwork of efficiency take place in that enterprise. both the work force and employers. These Employee participation has been encouraged agreements must be framed to produce a win- by management in the implementation of all win situation for all parties involved. More measures at the workplace. Through this, both specifically, I believe that enterprise the management and the employees have agreements in Queensland produce flexibility obtained a greater understanding of their for the employees as well as flexibility for the longer-term objectives. employer. These agreements guarantee Recently, in the Brisbane press, we have that workers will also have the flexibility to read that industrial disputes are now at an all- receive wage rewards for bringing about time low in not only Queensland but also greater productivity and efficiency through Australia. That is mainly attributable to the workplace change. Towards this end, this cooperation between workers and Government firmly stands by its commitment management in negotiating enterprise to protect the current conditions enjoyed by agreements. As I have said before in this workers in this State. We firmly believe that Chamber, most enterprise agreements now enterprise bargaining is a great means to build have what are better known as dispute settling up an ongoing trust and cooperation which is procedures to deal with disputes in the to everybody’s advantage. workplace. Gone are the days where The Golden Circle Cannery, which is management might lock the workers out and located at Northgate, is a clear example of gone are the days where the workers would such an agreement in practice in this State. just walk out the gate. There are processes in Both the unions and management have sat place so that workers can go through various down to increase significantly Golden Circle’s steps with management to work towards a competitiveness in that industry and offer resolution, thereby avoiding disputes. secure and worthwhile employment for all Prior to being elected to this Assembly, I employees. In my electorate, when I talk to worked in the electricity industry. people who are employed, particularly out at Northgate, I find that they do not want a lot in Mr Budd: You did a good job. life. The main things that they are looking for Mr NUTTALL: I will take that interjection. I in life are a secure job, a reasonable wage thank the honourable member very much. In and a decent quality of life. I do not think that that industry, I had the opportunity of visiting that is a lot to ask for in this world. Through not only all of the power stations here in enterprise agreements, we have been able to Queensland but also a number of the manage to secure for most workers who are electricity boards. I conducted a number of involved in enterprise agreements some form courses for those electricity boards and in the of employment and the knowledge that they power stations on the issue of enterprise have some security of tenure in their jobs. It bargaining and on how enterprise bargaining 5 October 1993 4624 Legislative Assembly would work. Following negotiations between the curtain down on one of the most callous the Queensland Electricity Commission and cutbacks of the Goss Government, Minister the unions, I am pleased to say that the Hayward and his bureaucratic Health electricity industry was one of the first Department. The closure of the maternity industries to have an enterprise agreement section today, coming on top of last week’s registered in this State. The benefits of that closure of the Department of Medicine, the are already flowing through. Of course, much medical ward, coronary care, intensive care has been said recently about electricity prices and accident emergency, means that the QEII in Queensland. It can be said that electricity Hospital at Nathan, in the midst of Brisbane’s prices have increased at only half the CPI southern suburbs, has ceased to exist as a rate, which has to be attributed largely to the community general hospital. increase in productivity and efficiency in the The QEII Hospital becomes another workplace by those people. victim of this high-cost, low-service Goss The whole idea of enterprise bargaining is Government. QEII joins the country about jobs, jobs and more jobs. It is about courthouses, the railway closures and the being efficient and about being productive, education and hospital cutbacks on the ever- and it is about cooperative attitude. We also growing list of Goss Labor failures to deliver try to ensure that minimum standards are basic services to the people. The destruction maintained. Of course, basic working of the QEII Hospital as a community general conditions are included in that. I also want to hospital demonstrates again that the Minister point out the important role of the Queensland for Health is driven by his bureaucrats, mostly branch of the ACTU. I want to point out the imported from interstate, instead of important role that it plays and the important responding to the people. Interstate Labor- role played by union officials and union friendly bureaucrats and an interstate delegates in the workplace towards bringing consultant have decided what they think is about these genuine reforms in the workplace. right for the people of Mount Gravatt, Enterprise bargaining and genuine reforms in Sunnybank, Mansfield and Archerfield, and Mr the workplace do not come about easily; they Hayward just follows blindly. come about through a long process of The fiasco of the future of QEII has been consultation. They come about through a long going on for a year and a half now, and the process of sitting down together and working final nail in the coffin came in June when the out the best way to improve productivity. Gone Treasurer announced a $20m cut to health are the days of management prerogative. services, including a $10m cut to the QEII Those industries that are thriving and surviving Hospital. The Treasurer said that the $10m are industries which sit down with their workers was required for operating costs of new and work on a collective basis. To that end, I hospitals, such as the facility at Logan. congratulate the union movement in this Starved of money, there was nothing left to do State. I congratulate the responsible other than to follow the bureaucratic employers on their attitude towards enterprise recommendations and rip away that wonderful bargaining. facility and team of staff who have served the community so well. QEII Hospital The QEII Hospital has served Brisbane’s Mr HORAN (Toowoomba South) south side well. It is located between the (11.40 a.m.): In rising to speak in the Matters South East Freeway, the Pacific Highway, of Public Interest debate today, I make Orange Grove Road, Beaudesert Road and comment on the previous speech by the Ipswich Road. It is located adjacent to the member for Sandgate and the smart alec way ANZ Stadium, Archerfield Aerodrome and in which he introduced the school children in Griffith University. There are seven nursing the gallery into his speech. It is a pretty low homes in the area. It is a dense industrial standard for this House. We in Opposition area. It is a densely populated area. I could have done the same, if we had wished, estimate that at least 120 000 to 150 000 because sitting opposite us are only two of the people are in the immediate vicinity, many of 18 Ministers who are interested enough to whom are elderly people who retired there come into the House to listen to the Matters of because of the presence of the hospital. Public Interest debate. That the honourable Shortly, the Brisbane South Regional member started his speech in that way shows Health Authority will cater for well over 700 000 the pretty low content of his speech. people, including the 120 000 people in the Today at 8 a.m., the maternity section of area of QEII. It has been said that the Logan the QEII Hospital closed down. That brought Hospital is where the people are. What Legislative Assembly 4625 5 October 1993 happened to the 120 000 people around the enhance those services, provide some private QEII Hospital? Have they mysteriously services and enhance the involvement of the disappeared and no longer require a hospital? university in medical education. It did not even Mr Borbidge: That’s where the Premier get consideration from the Minister or his is. department. Mr HORAN: It is where the Premier is, So what will the community in the areas down at the Logan area. The National Party around QEII Hospital lose? The 120 000 recognised the growth of the Logan area and people in the immediate vicinity of QEII have purchased the site for the Logan Hospital. The now lost their accident and emergency National Party funded Stage 1 of the Logan service, intensive care facilities, the cardiac Hospital in the 1987, 1988 and 1989 Budgets, care unit, the medical ward, the maternity and that stage was opened in May 1990. services and the paediatric services, as well as However, the National Party never built the some elective surgery. The result is that Logan Hospital to take the place of QEII. anyone who has a heart attack or an asthma Logan was to be a new, additional facility for attack must travel at least 10 to 15 minutes the booming population of the Logan and further by ambulance to the PA, the Mater or Beenleigh areas. the Logan Hospital. The perfectly good, community-serving Imagine if an accident were to occur at hospital at QEII should have been left alone. the Archerfield Aerodrome, the ANZ Stadium It had one floor unused, and how simple it or Griffith University. How much precious time would have been to make use of that for would be lost? It is all called a reduction in expansion of elective surgery, such as service and a reduction in the quality of care orthopaedics. All of the infrastructure was that can be given by the Government. there, including intensive care, ready to go. Ambulance officers, police and local GPs have But, no—for political reasons, QEII was all been directed to bypass QEII because it drained of money to fund the staffing and can no longer take any patients who require resources of Stage 2 of Logan Hospital. It has hospitalisation. A letter to all GPs in the area been another financial bungle in a long list of from the medical superintendent of QEII crises in Queensland Health. It all started with stated that the 24-hour acute primary care unit the observed push to move the Mater will provide a referral service and does not Children’s to QEII so that the staff at QEII include cases likely to need admission. The could be pushed down and used at Logan. letter stated that dislocations, simple fractures That observed push at the Mater kids never and sporting injuries can be tended, along came about. with simple skin procedures, removal of foreign bodies and day cases such as Then we had the Solomon report—an toenails, bumps and lumps. interstate report giving five options for the QEII Hospital, with not one of those options—not At QEII, cardiac care will no longer be one—recommending that the Government provided. That service cutback concerns many leave it alone. Obviously, Solomon had his middle-aged and elderly people. Time is of the riding instructions before he ever undertook essence in saving someone with cardiac the report. Every single option of the five that arrest. For any heart attack victims in the he gave certainly showed that there would be region of QEII, it now means a longer time a downgrading in the size of the accident and span to reach expert attention. It is now too emergency unit at the QEII Hospital. dangerous to take to QEII anyone with a suspected heart attack, asthma or any Then we had the fiasco of the Health condition likely to need hospitalisation. The Department and the Minister trying to push patients must be transferred to A and E at the one of the best gynaecological services in PA Hospital. The Opposition has already Queensland, located at the Princess pointed out the shortage of staff, both senior Alexandra Hospital, to QEII Hospital and trying and junior, and the lack of space at that to push the gynaecologists from QEII down to facility. Logan. That all failed because of the refusal of those medical officers to undertake such a So what are the people of Brisbane’s ridiculous venture. Again the Government southern suburbs getting in return? There will could not leave good services alone. It was be a 24-hour acute primary care centre at about change for the sake of change without QEII, which is doomed to fail because no-one knowing what that change was for. will refer a patient to the centre in case the patient’s condition is serious and requires Then there was the offer from Griffith hospitalisation. Wards will be used as University to move into QEII Hospital, retain all replacement wards for wards at the PA the services that are there at present, 5 October 1993 4626 Legislative Assembly

Hospital while refurbishment takes place at those south side electorates for taking away that hospital over a number of years. Elective from them what any community should surgery, particularly in the areas of have—its own excellent general hospital. orthopaedics and urology, will continue at QEII. Gynaecological elective surgery will continue only on a limited basis. Local Authority Boundaries All elective surgery at QEII will be Mr McELLIGOTT (Thuringowa) undertaken with the intensive care unit now (11.50 a.m.): By passing legislation, this gone. I understand that only three high- Parliament has established the Office of the dependency beds will be kept. In the past 12 Commissioner for Local Government. Since months, more than 40 patients undergoing Greg Hoffman’s appointment as routine elective surgery had to go to the commissioner, he has been undertaking a intensive care unit before returning to their whole series of references sent to him by the ward. As well, the Medical Department has Minister for Local Government. Most, if not all, closed, so there is no medical back-up for the of those references refer to the external or surgeons. There will be two floors, or 90 beds, internal boundaries of the State’s local for psycho-geriatric patients. Health authorities. I want to make some general professionals say that there could not be a comments about the process and also refer to worse place for such patients. They will be the particular recommendation that the locked up in airconditioned, upper-level floors commissioner has made in respect of without access to verandahs, fresh air or and Thuringowa cities. ground level, as recommended in the modern First of all, in a general sense, I want to care of such patients. express alarm—although perhaps I should not What about the convenience that QEII have been surprised—at the response by gave to patients and their relatives? They had some elected members of local authorities to convenient parking and up to six buses per the process of review undertaken by the hour stopping at the hospital. It was easy for commissioner. I think that those hundreds of visitors. How does one catch a bus to the elected members of local authorities across Logan Hospital? How inconvenient are parking the State should understand that none of us and transport at the PA for people from the who serve in elected positions are guaranteed suburbs around QEII? It is nothing other than tenure or guaranteed a career beyond the lost services, lost conveniences and the lost term for which we are currently elected. They security of a nearby community general should not expect to influence the electoral hospital for those people. Imagine a city the boundaries on which they will presumably size of Townsville, Toowoomba or place themselves for re-election at the next Rockhampton without a general hospital. It is election, whenever that might be. Similarly, I no different for the communities around QEII. believe that they should not expect to have That area is even bigger, with 120 000 any say or meaningful input into the decisions people. of the commissioner. The destruction of QEII as a good Those of us who serve in this place and community general hospital has been a fiasco at Federal level understand that our and debacle since day one. It has only boundaries are set by independent authority, happened because the Goss Labor and so it should be in the case of local Government and Queensland Health have government. I therefore criticise those elected mismanaged the financial planning of the members of local government who have tried Logan Hospital, and the people of the Mount to criticise the process and, in my view, have Gravatt, Mansfield, Sunnybank and tried to influence the result. After all, there has Archerfield electorates are paying the price for not been a wholesale review of local authority the high cost, the financial bungling and the boundaries in this State since a commission of mismanagement of Health Minister Hayward inquiry in 1928, so I think that we should all and Queensland Health. appreciate that the time for review is certainly well and truly overdue. The Minister and his bureaucrats just could not leave an excellent community facility As I mentioned earlier, the commissioner alone. It is change for the sake of change. has produced a preliminary report on his Cover up the financial mismanagement and review of the external boundaries of the cities mistakes and let the people find their own way of Townsville and Thuringowa. I want to to some other inconvenient hospital. The comment on that preliminary report. My Health Minister and local Labor members will submission is that the recommendations forever stand condemned by the people in contained in that preliminary report are both ill- conceived and unacceptable. The proposal to Legislative Assembly 4627 5 October 1993 formalise joint arrangements, in my view, came to a formal agreement without any represents unnecessary bureaucracy and authority from their councils casts serious additional costs without any obvious benefits. doubts over the whole process. Any process Additionally, the report does not bring to an that allows elected members with an obvious end the uncertainty that has hung over the vested interest to negotiate over an outcome twin cities, but adds to it by proposing that and even use ratepayers’ funds to promote joint arrangements be subject to ongoing their opinions cannot be said to meet the review and possible change. demand for open, fair and accountable My preference remains the merger of the Government. two local authorities, which is identified in the There has been an argument that local report as option 1. However, if for whatever government becomes ineffective when it reasons this option is seen to be exceeds a certain population base. But I unacceptable, I believe that it makes more would argue that a population base of sense to simply do nothing. I find the upwards of 200 000 is not large in terms of arguments supporting the recommendations adequate representation, as evidenced by the unconvincing. Indeed, my impression is that, success of the Brisbane City Council. I make having decided the outcome, the the point that the Federal member for Herbert commissioner then tried to justify that represents all of Townsville and Thuringowa decision. On the other hand, logic and weight and areas beyond with a staff of nine. of argument surely supports the adoption of The survey conducted by the option 1 as demonstrated in the information commissioner indicated that a mere 11 per paper. Although I certainly do not suggest cent of respondents had had direct contact anything improper, I can appreciate that the with an alderman, while only 22 per cent had commissioner would have been under actually visited the administration office of their enormous pressure, given the united council. In the preliminary report, human opposition of both councils to amalgamation. I resources consultants identified savings of place on record my respect for the ability and around $900,000 to $1m per year arising from integrity of Greg Hoffman, whom I have known a merger. I simply do not accept that a for many years and who is well respected in merged council could require an additional local government circles. level of management, as suggested by the I have to say that I have always objected commissioner’s report. Indeed, the proposed to the part played in the review process by joint arrangements impose a further level of current elected members of both councils. I management. thought that the days when politicians I reject the assertion that Townsville and determined their own electoral boundaries Thuringowa are developing separate were gone. Clearly, the elected members had identities. I challenge the commissioner—or a very direct vested interest in the outcome of anyone else, for that matter—to show me on the commissioner’s considerations. It is the ground where the separate identities extraordinary, in my view, that apparently the become obvious. Indeed, the two boundaries last thing that the commissioner did before run through the backyards of residents. drafting his preliminary report was to Clearly, it is impossible to identify those meet—reportedly for some nine hours—with separate identities. It is a nonsense to elected members. The emphasis appears to suggest that the Thuringowa council has in have been always on reaching agreement on any way contributed to the population growth joint arrangements. I can see no other reason that has occurred within its boundaries. Had for involving those elected members. there not been political interference in 1986, It is deplorable, in my view, that both there should have been a further boundary councils used substantial amounts of adjustment between Townsville City and ratepayers’ funds to promote arguments in Thuringowa Shire at that time. Ultimately, we favour of retaining their positions. Similar would have a reached a situation in which the resources were clearly not available to those Shire of Thuringowa would cease to be viable who had an opposing point of view. and therefore cease to exist. Revelations disclosed in the Townsville Bulletin In his preliminary report, the of 21 September 1993 that Mayors Mooney commissioner has acknowledged that the and Tyrell had actually done a deal over which urban areas of Townsville and Thuringowa are land was to be transferred from Thuringowa one greater Townsville. There is nothing in the City to Townsville City in an attempt to avoid preliminary report to justify dividing this greater amalgamation showed that local government Townsville into two local authority areas. in Queensland has returned to the pre- Certainly, most people acknowledge that this Fitzgerald days. The fact that the two mayors 5 October 1993 4628 Legislative Assembly country is already over-governed. There is There is also the question of simply no justification to maintain two mayors representation on those committees. Both and 21 aldermen to deliver local government councils are comprised of part-time aldermen, services to the area. and it must be increasingly difficult to find It is not feasible, I suggest, or even members with the time to serve on them. As I demonstrably supportive to argue that we understand it, the regional office of the need seven aldermen to represent one Department of Housing, Local Government division of the proposed Thuringowa City. and Planning has responsibility for regional There is no current definition for a “city”, planning and already has a process in place. although I am aware that in the draft Local Why duplicate that process? Government Act which Parliament will consider Time expired. in the not-too-distant future, it is provided that Madam DEPUTY SPEAKER (Ms Power): an area should not be regarded as a city Order! The time for the Matters of Public unless it is “recognised generally as the central Interest debate has expired. source for the provision of commercial, industrial, health and public sector services for a region”. Clearly, by that definition, there can APPROPRIATION BILL (No. 2) be only one central source of those services in Resumption of Committee one region, and that central source in this case is clearly Townsville. Thuringowa has no Debate resumed from 17 September identifiable central source for any of those (see p. 4601) on Schedule 1— services. I do not understand why anyone would try to pretend otherwise. Deputy Premier, Minister for Administrative The statement contained in the Services and Minister for Rural preliminary report that “Thuringowa is the only Communities city local government in Queensland without a Hon. T. J. BURNS (Lytton—Deputy well-known, recognisable name” simply speaks Premier, Minister for Administrative Services for itself. I cannot imagine why we would want and Minister for Rural Communities) to retain a city which is not well known, which (12 noon): The 1993 State Budget provides a is not recognisable and which is not, in any blueprint for the Goss Government’s case, a city. To continue the recognition of the continued drive to improve the level and two cities will only reduce the status of standard of public sector services and Townsville over time. As an example, within facilities. The Administrative Services the next 15 years or so, a major bypass Department has a big role to play in the highway will be constructed, which will direct efficient provision of a wide range of those highway traffic around Townsville and into public sector services and facilities. Thuringowa. Presumably, there will be directional signs at the southern entrance that As Minister for Rural Communities, I am actually direct traffic to Thuringowa. That pleased that the Budget also contains should be totally unacceptable to anyone with numerous initiatives to benefit rural and a general love and concern for the future of remote communities across our vast State. Townsville. These include— As to the joint arrangements—the more than half of the Government’s total proposal introduces a complex new level of $3.4 billion Capital Works Program to be bureaucracy. If, as has been stated on undertaken outside the south-east numerous occasions, the two councils can corner; and do operate in a cooperative and efficient a level of per capita spending on capital manner, there seems to be no reason to do works in rural and regional Queensland anything. Why impose yet another series of up to 12 times higher than that in committees with support staff, etc., if there are Brisbane and the south-east corner of the unlikely to be problems with the councils State; working together? On the other hand, if there $45m in education capital works in rural are likely to be disagreements, it is and provincial areas; unacceptable, in my view, to have those disagreements resolved by an unelected $37.6m to complete the $60m School commissioner. The merger of the two councils Refurbishment Program benefiting about would mean that one elected authority would 1 500 schools, including 800 schools in make the decisions. Under any criteria, that is regional Queensland; more efficient, more accountable and certainly a big slice of the initial $150m for more responsible. Legislative Assembly 4629 5 October 1993

rebuilding Queensland hospitals Those projects give a taste of the wide variety earmarked for rural and regional centres; of works projects undertaken by ASD for client funding of $375,000 to expand the departments throughout Queensland. successful Queensland Government Accelerated Capital Works Program Boosts Agent network; and Jobs continued funding for the Office of Rural Other speakers will talk in more detail Communities. about the Capital Works Program, but I do I want to make a few general remarks want to mention the State Government’s about certain aspects of the Administrative special Accelerated Capital Works Program— Services Department. However, I know running since January 1991—which has members of my committee are wanting to injected about $350m into the building and speak in greater detail about specific construction sector. A total of 150 public programs within ASD, so I will be leaving it up sector building projects were brought forward to them to expand on some of the subjects I to stimulate economic activity and secure jobs mention. at a time of economic downturn. Capital Works Program The Accelerated Capital Works Program will come to an end during the 1993-94 The Administrative Services Department financial year. Some of the last projects being will oversee a Capital Works Program worth completed under the program include the new $561m on behalf of client departments during Government high-rise office centre at 111 1993-94. The program includes about $150m George Street and a new Government office worth of health projects and $87m for building at Rockhampton, with $34.7m being convention centres in Brisbane and Cairns. provided for construction work on the $92m Other capital works projects include new TAFE building at 111 George Street. Work is due for college facilities, child care centres, police completion by June 1994. An amount of buildings, and new schools at various $14.3m is being provided for construction of locations around Queensland. In addition, the the six-level Government office building in Government is also involved in establishing Rockhampton scheduled for completion in new casinos in Brisbane and Cairns. February 1994. Office space totalling 7 000 Highlights of the Capital Works Program square metres will be provided for several over the last year include— Government departments, at a total cost of completion of the $25m State Archives $24.3m. This office building will enable a wide Building at Runcorn; range of Government services to be offered from the one convenient location. completion of Stage 1 of the Cliffs Boardwalk from South Bank to Kangaroo I want to touch briefly on some other Point; significant capital works and property related initiatives currently being handled by ASD. redevelopment of the Brisbane Cricket Ground to accommodate the Brisbane Cairns Casino Site Bears AFL team and test cricket The Cairns Port Authority site has been matches; selected as the site for the location of the opening of the $40m Cairns Court House Cairns Casino. An amount of $950,000 is and police headquarters; being provided as the final payment in relation to the acquisition of the existing port authority completion of the $2m second stage of a site for a casino and the erection of a new Corrective Services training and office building for relocation of the Cairns Port development centre at Wacol; Authority. a number of new primary schools and Roma Street Railway Land schools of distance education; A total of $54m has been allocated in completion of construction works at 1993-94 for the purchase of land, including Caboolture, Childers and Nambour the purchase of the Roma Street rail yards in Hospitals; central Brisbane. Future use options for the new TAFE projects at Kangaroo Point, Roma Street site are under consideration by Gateway, Yeronga, Mackay and South the Government. Brisbane Colleges; and Belmont Rifle Range commencement of work on the new An amount of $4.117m has been Townsville work-based child care centre. provided for the purchase of the Belmont Rifle Range. This property was acquired by the 5 October 1993 4630 Legislative Assembly

State from the Commonwealth Government caused by years of neglect by previous on the basis that its existing use will be Governments. maintained. The property is being leased to Neighbourhood Safety Audit Program the Queensland Rifle Association as parent body for the various user groups. One of the initiatives started during the year was the Neighbourhood Safety Audit Gabba Towers Program. The Budget contains $500,000 to Towers building adjacent to continue the program—a community service the Brisbane Cricket Ground was purchased initiative designed to improve personal safety. initially to accommodate the Open Access Placement of this program within Learning Area of the Education Department, Administrative Services Department was seen with other departments taking up space as it as the best way to use existing regional becomes available. It is expected that this infrastructure to enhance delivery of the project will be finalised by October 1993, and program. The Neighbourhood Safety Audit more than $2.3m has been allocated towards Program is a personal safety initiative, the cost of this project. designed to develop a process to help local $3.2m for Public Sector Housing communities reduce crime and improve personal safety. Other speakers will have The Public Service Housing Scheme more to say on this program. provides housing in communities which are not adequately serviced by the private rental Office of Rural Communities market. After extensive consultation with The Office of Rural Communities within unions and appropriate departments, an the Administrative Services Department appropriation of $3.2m was provided in the continues to provide a whole-of-government Budget to buy or build new housing in regional approach to issues affecting people in rural and rural areas. The allocation will be funded and remote areas. ORC undertakes research through the disposal of houses in centres and monitoring of social and economic issues which have a substantial private rental market. affecting rural communities and is also Future of Boggo Road Gaol Site responsible for ensuring compliance by State Government departments with guidelines for In August 1993, the State Government altering staffing levels for rural services. The called for expressions of interest for office acts to ensure that all departmental development proposals for the old Boggo programs take into account the needs of rural Road prison site at Dutton Park. Q-Build and remote communities. For the 1993-94 Property Management within the financial year, ORC will receive consolidated Administrative Services Department is funds of $913,000. marketing the 8.3 hectare site. Expressions of interest for acquisition of all or part of the site Other initiatives with implications for the close on 1 November. Rural Communities side of my portfolio include— Asbestos Identification a total of $375,000 made available to In the mid-year Budget review, Cabinet begin expansion of the existing network approved an amount of $100,000 to enable of Queensland Government Agents; Maintenance and Operations to investigate the extent of asbestos in Government expansion of the successful Q-Dial rural buildings. The amount of $66,000 was carried information service; forward into the 1993-94 financial year for provision of a comprehensive Rural subsequent expenditure. Services Directory for each region of the School Refurbishment Program State; An allocation of $37.6m is provided in the the launch of a new Statewide video- 1993 State Budget to complete this special conferencing network; $60m School Refurbishment Program. About funding for the remote commercial 1 500 Queensland schools, including about satellite television services to outback 800 in rural and regional areas of Queensland; and Queensland, will benefit from this special one- expansion into rural Queensland of SBS off program designed to improve school programs. facilities and generate jobs. The School Refurbishment Program—funded from the I know that the member for Kurwongbah, increased tobacco tax—was a commitment Margaret Woodgate, wants to speak on those made during the State election campaign to issues in greater detail. tackle the backlog of school maintenance Telecommunications Legislative Assembly 4631 5 October 1993

I would like to talk briefly on one issue projects being undertaken by some of those that has emerged over recent years, and organisations. which will continue to play a large part in the In conclusion, I want to say that the delivery of services to rural areas—the subject Administrative Services Department has of telecommunications. Many of the improved continued to strive for efficiency in the services we as a Government can offer people provision of its services to other departments in rural and remote areas depend on and public sector bodies. Since December telephone, computer or satellite links. I was 1989, many structural changes have taken recently in Canada and had the opportunity to place within ASD as it was transformed from take part in a lengthy video conference across the old Works Department. Many of those provinces from the east to the west coast to changes have relied upon changes in attitude talk about issues affecting rural communities. by its staff. Last year during the Estimates In Queensland we are making greater debate, I thanked all ASD staff members for use of such modern technology through our their efforts in providing the best possible Government Agents network, the Q-Dial service to their clients. I want to repeat that program, satellite TV programming and video- message today. From the senior officers conferencing facilities. As the major through to regional managers, workers and coordinator of State Government apprentices, cleaners and security guards—all telecommunications, the Administrative of them are doing their best to provide the Services Department will continue to play a services that a Government must provide to its significant role in this regard. customers and staff. Modern telecommunications techniques Since the ASD Estimates were debated and systems can deliver a better standard of at roughly this time last year, the department services and provide better access to services has been subject to a review by the Public for country people. But it can also deliver Sector Management Commission. This has savings to all taxpayers. For example, there been part of the ongoing review process will be considerable savings to taxpayers as a across the Government that was instituted result of the decision in August 1992 to after the 1989 election. The PSMC report will appoint Pacific Star Communications to no doubt recommend changes designed to manage and coordinate all of the State further improve service delivery, accountability Government’s telecommunications services. and efficiency. The department, its staff and I, This arrangement is overseen by Q-Tel within as Minister, all face new challenges in the year the Administrative Services Department. ahead as a result of those recommendations. Pacific Star—a Queensland company— I look forward to working with all staff members was chosen to manage the Government’s of ASD and ORC to meet those challenges. telecommunications business worth around Mr LINGARD (Beaudesert—Deputy $100m each year. Its role is to negotiate the Leader of the Opposition) (12.12 p.m.): Before best possible deals for the State Government, proceeding with a detailed examination of the which is Queensland’s biggest single Estimates for the Department of telecommunications customer. By November Administrative Services and the Office of Rural 1993, all Government departments and Communities, I intend to raise in this Chamber agencies are expected to be signed up with the issue of how departmental Estimates are Pacific Star. Potential telecommunications debated and examined. Members have only savings for the Queensland public sector in the Budget papers and, if they are lucky, the 1993-94 financial year have been annual reports of a department on which to estimated to be as high as $17.1m. make assessments as to whether There are a number of units within ASD departments are functioning effectively and that I have not mentioned specifically— efficiently. I admit that, this morning, I was visited by a special messenger from the Q-Fleet; Minister’s office. That person, who will possibly Goprint; be given a special office in that new CITEC; Government building at Rockhampton, agreed with my opinion. I know that this is a criticism, Queensland Purchasing and Sales; but the Budget papers are all that members Warehousing and Distribution; have on which to assess whether there is any Media and Information Services; and undue waste of resources and taxpayers’ money in these Estimates. Queensland State Archives. I am sure that members of the Other speakers will talk about the programs or Government would agree with me that the 5 October 1993 4632 Legislative Assembly whole process of Estimates debates needs to more than anticipated was spent in that one become more professional and to be handled program alone, and the department employed in a way in which criticism can be justifiably an additional 500 people. made where it is deserved. But more The Minister may try to tell us that this importantly, when departments, public was because additional work was undertaken servants and, indeed, their Ministers are doing or that other areas of the public service were a credible job, that effort should be transferred to the building program. But this recognised. The current system only lends does not account for the unforeseen itself to criticism and heartache within this expenditure. Any transfers of functions would Parliament. I urge the Deputy Premier and also involve a transfer of the appropriate other members of the Government to budget. If one thought that a blow-out of seriously consider implementing Estimates $95m in 1992-93 or some 17 per cent was committees in which the Minister and senior extraordinary, then the Estimates for 1993-94 officials of his or her department sit down with show that the Budget will increase from appropriate members of the Opposition and $689m to $942m. The extraordinary thing is discuss openly and frankly the entire budget that the number of full-time employees will of each department. The Commonwealth drop by some 470 to bring that figure back to Government has had such a system in the estimate for 1992-93. But amazingly, in operation for decades. It brings open and 1992-93 the department had 3 677 accountable government that much nearer to employees who were going to be paid $51.2m reality and ensures that taxpayers can see in salaries. In 1993-94, 3 200 employees will that they are getting value for money. be paid in excess of $111m. In other words, I realise that Estimates committees would the salary component has doubled but there be the bane of Government officials, as they has been a 10 per cent drop in staff. have been for Commonwealth officials. But The Minister will point out the note at the they do provide an opportunity to debate the bottom of the relevant page in the Budget Budget intelligently. This allows the Opposition papers that talks about the Maintenance and and the public to see what is happening inside Operations operating account being each department. Given the number of transferred into the Q-Build Trust Fund. But Commonwealth officials employed by the this still does not detract from the fact that Goss Government, I am sure that the salaries within the department have doubled implementation of such a scheme would not even though there are far fewer staff be impossible. I urge the Deputy Premier to numbers. In fact, in 1993-94, the average discuss this matter with the Premier and his salary for each staff member in the building other Cabinet colleagues. program of the Administrative Services A few weeks ago in this Parliament during Department will be $35,000. But when one the Budget debate, I queried how, in 1992-93, looks at total current outlays for that number the Queensland Government had run up a bill of staff, one finds that they cost the for $2 billion in unforeseen expenditure. Queensland taxpayer $100,000 each. Today, we will see where $150m of that The Budget papers talk about the need expenditure went in the Department of to ensure that the building services are Administrative Services. The Administrative commercially competitive and professional Services budget blew out by $150m last and deliver timely, cost-effective and quality financial year. The department spent 15 per service. The Budget papers also mention that cent more than it budgeted for—15 per cent Q-Build Project Services had an annual more—when inflation in Australia is running productivity increase of 24.9 per cent against between 2 per cent and 3 per cent. Where did a target of 10 per cent. I would congratulate that $150m go? It can be broken into two the employees of Project Services on such an parts. An additional $53m was spent from the increase if it was quantified in the Budget. Consolidated Fund and $94m was unforeseen Unfortunately, members have no idea what expenditure in the Trust and Special Funds. that productivity increase amounts to and just When one looks at the program budgets of how commercially competitive, timely and cost each area within the department, one starts to effective the department was. Certainly it get some idea of how all that money has would appear from the previous figures that I disappeared. have quoted that any productivity increases Under the building program for the seem to be costing the Queensland taxpayer department, the estimated budget in 1992-93 an amazing amount of money. I look forward was $594m, with 3 192 full-time employees. to the Minister’s explanation as to where all The reality was a budget blow-out to $689m, this money is being spent and where the with 3 677 employees. In other words, $95m productivity increases are taking place. Legislative Assembly 4633 5 October 1993

The Budget papers mention briefly the Despite this vast number of motor vehicles functions of Q-Build Maintenance and and huge budget, the total savings of 1992- Operations. Information being received by the 93 in establishing Q-Fleet amounted to Opposition from the public service indicates $1.3m. These are savings produced by the that the maintenance of Government bulk purchase of vehicles, savings on motor buildings is steadily being reduced. vehicle insurance and vehicle disposal. In Consequently, buildings, lifts and fittings are order to achieve this saving of $1.3m, we had deteriorating rapidly. One has only to look at to establish an organisation of over 100 the lifts in Mineral House to see that people and a budget of $143m. It will be maintenance, other than in the Executive interesting to compare how much it cost to run Building, is not being undertaken. The Budget motor vehicles under the previous National papers talk a lot about performance indicators Party Government with how much it costs and reduction in overheads as a percentage under the present Labor Government. Of of sales, but these are meaningless when course, any comparison would be very difficult public servants in numerous departments are when we consider how rapidly the motor complaining of deteriorating maintenance vehicle fleet has increased under the Labor standards. I seek the Minister’s assurances Government. The 1992-93 Program that maintenance levels will be maintained Statements indicate that Q-Fleet was and increased when necessary to ensure that responsible for 4 183 vehicles, yet this year public servants are provided with safe and the vehicle fleet now comprises 7 220 comfortable working conditions. vehicles. I am fully prepared to accept that not I note that unforeseen expenditure in all of this increase was due to the purchase of 1992-93 in the Q-Build Trust Fund amounted additional new motor vehicles, but there is no to $77.34m. However, in the Program doubt that the number of vehicles which are Statements, total intra public account now owned by the Government and which are unrequited transfers amounted to $57m. I ask given to public servants as part of their salary the Minister to explain the discrepancy packages has increased dramatically, as has between the Program Statements and the the fuel bill to go with them. Unforeseen Expenditure papers. The Budget Program Statements talk I turn now to the Information and about $10m in either direct or market returns Communication Services Program of the to the Government. In 1993-94, this figure department—a program which, throughout the represented a 7 per cent return on net outlays Centre for Information Technology and should it occur, but again I ask the Minister to Communications—CITEC—provides give a full explanation of what these returns information technology and communication are. I ask him to give an explanation of how services for the Queensland Government. I they are calculated, and to prove that they are am happy to report that CITEC was one of the anything more than a convenient accounting few areas of the department which managed exercise. to maintain its blow-out in expenditure in The accounts for Goprint would certainly 1992-93 to only 10 per cent, or an additional appear to indicate that the organisation is $6.5m. I note that, this year, its salaries and becoming more cost effective and efficient wages budget will increase by nearly 10 per each year. The number of staff has declined cent, and that staff numbers will increase by by nearly 40 over the past two years, and the slightly less than this figure. Compared with salaries bill will decline in the same period by some other areas of the public service, some $1.5m. Whether this is due to increased particularly those under the control of the efficiency, or whether public servants are Premier, the Deputy Premier does not appear leaving because they are thoroughly fed up to be excessively extravagant in this area. and demoralised is another issue, but the According to the Budget papers relating to organisation appears to be making a healthy unforeseen expenditure, some $6.5m return. I congratulate the staff of Goprint for occurred in the CITEC Trust Fund, yet in the the efforts that they are making. Unfortunately Program Statements no mention is made of for the Government, a couple of weeks ago this amount. Once again, I seek an Goprint seemed to experience some difficulty explanation of what has occurred in that in determining who should pay for what regard. services that are being provided to the ALP at One of the largest programs under the 16 Peel Street, South Brisbane. This was Minister’s control is that of Q-Fleet, which will another of those intriguing exercises involving have outlays in excess of $140m during this the Labor Party and its difficulty in keeping current financial year, and will have well over track of invoices and receipts. This was the 7 000 vehicles under its management. case in which Wayne Goss and, presumably, 5 October 1993 4634 Legislative Assembly the Minister decided to send over $2,000 we get an organisation that has the interests worth of Budget papers to the ALP for use by of the rural community uppermost, or do we the ALP and to bill the Premier’s get a body more interested in promoting Department—that is, the Queensland Labor Party policy? If we look at the history of taxpayer—for the privilege. This is nothing this office, we find that it was established more than fraud and misappropriation— initially as a unit within the Office of the especially if those papers were used at the Cabinet. It was established to try to overcome special breakfasts—of public moneys and the disastrous situation brought about by Ed could only have been authorised at the Casey and his ministerial advisers. highest levels of the Premier’s Department by We all know that the Office of the Cabinet the Premier and the Deputy Premier. It shows is staffed largely by staunch ALP supporters. once again the extent of corruption, and it In fact, if one is not a member of the ALP, it is includes the Premier of this State. virtually impossible to get a position within that The area conveniently called “Services” in organisation. Consequently, it is difficult to the Budget, which includes the Media and believe that staff members of the Office of Information Service of the Government, has Rural Communities are not also staunch grown dramatically over the last 12 months. In supporters of the ALP. If we look at the the 1992-93 Budget, an amount of $11m and Budget papers to determine what functions a staff of 82 were estimated to operate that the Office of Rural Communities is engaged unit. In actual fact, gross outlays ended up in, we find identified opportunities for being $32m, with 318 staff. The Minister will Government to improve its marketing and tell us that this was because a number of communication in rural and remote operational units and one business unit were communities; to expand the distribution of the lumped under this heading. Even so, the office’s newsletter; and to promote gross outlays in 1993-94 are expected to implementation of the guidelines for increase by an additional $14m over last year, withdrawal or reduction of services in rural with no increase in staff. I have no doubt that communities. this sort of expenditure buys an awful lot of If a previous Speaker of this Parliament media influence. It certainly was enough to had said that he represented the ensure that the ABC board, and particularly Government, or had said something about the Janine Walker, Quentin Dempster and David Government, Government members would Hill, could be persuaded to remove Pamela have shot him, and they know that. What a Bornhorst from her position. I find it ironic that great indictment that statement is from the the National Party at no stage ever attempted Office of Rural Communities. Fancy talking to remove Quentin Dempster from his position about promoting the Government’s viewpoints when he was hosting the 7.30 Report. and reducing or totally closing down Before I turn to discuss the activities of Government services! We have 13 the Office of Rural Communities, I would like Government agent offices throughout to give the Minister the opportunity during this Queensland working overtime to ensure that debate to convince this Parliament that he the ALP’s point of view is forced upon every does know what is going on in his department rural producer in Queensland. I ask the and to advise us of the full details of the CJC Minister: how many properties has the Office investigation into the Q-Build property of Rural Communities been able to save since management area of his department. its inception? How many new Government Perhaps the Minister would prefer to admit services have been provided in rural that, in the months since I have asked him a Queensland as a consequence of this office question about this, he has still not been able being established? Unfortunately for rural to find out what is happening in this part of his Queensland, the Office of Rural Communities portfolio. is spending half its time doing nothing more I turn now to an examination of the Office than promoting and circulating Labor Party of Rural Communities. I would like to start my propaganda. Perhaps if this effort was examination of this section by congratulating redirected towards assisting rural Queensland, the Minister on maintaining this office. It was a instead of a hearts-and-minds campaign for concept of the National Party, and it is votes, the office of the Minister would be more something in which the Opposition takes great highly regarded. pride. I note that the salary component for this I would finally like to ask the Minister what office has risen by $90,000 to $565,000, yet he is going to do, and what the Office of Rural the number of employees has declined. In Communities is going to do, to ensure that fact, the average salary is $47,000 per 200 staff are not cut from the Department of person. What do we get for this money? Do Primary Industries, and that the department is Legislative Assembly 4635 5 October 1993 not gradually emasculated until it is nothing strewn around various departments. It is no more than a small policy unit unable to understatement for me to say here today that provide any services for the primary producers our predecessors had little interest in of this State. Yesterday, people were told that improving the efficiency of delivery of $1.1m would be spent on the building for the Government services. Like so many of the Department of Primary Industries. Obviously, other reforms left up to this Government, it many people would ask: why spend that was up to the Goss Government to give the amount of money when the Government is service delivery obligations of Government a dismissing so many people from DPI? It will be corporate footing. The centralisation of all reduced by 150 people under this Budget business and service units of Government alone. It is quite obvious that rural under the umbrella of the Administrative communities have been neglected by this Services portfolio was the first step in the Government. I say to the Minister and to direction of this corporate process. Government members that people in rural Since then, our Government business communities would regard them exactly the units have taken up the challenge to perform same as the little boy who was told by his on a corporate basis and deliver a cost father that every time he did something wrong effective and efficient service to their clients. I the nail would go into the piece of wood and have sat in this place for four years and that every time that he did something right listened to the members opposite who have one of those nails would be extracted. This is nitpicked at the few examples of where minor exactly what has happened. mistakes have been made by a few officers of The Minister might have gone out into this department. rural areas since the initial decisions were Unlike those few critics, I understand that made about rail line and school closures, but this department deals with everything from still the holes are there in the wood and those leaking taps to complex computer systems, to people know that the Minister allowed the management of the biggest car fleet in Cabinet to make decisions which proposed a Queensland, to negotiating sales and reduction by one-third of railways in rural purchase of significant parcels of land, to areas. The Minister allowed that to happen. organising tendering arrangements and He allowed that nail to be put into that piece construction of huge projects like the $100m of wood. He might have pulled the nail out, 111 George Street building and the $170m but the hole is still there. The Minister was conference centre complexes and the intricate party to the Cabinet decision to cluster schools archiving of Queensland’s history—not to in rural areas. The move to cluster such mention the employment of almost 4 700 schools is an obvious indication that the people. It is a huge business concern and is schools would be closed down eventually. The apt to make the odd mistake. Minister allowed his Government to close courthouses and replace them with public In fact, while on the subject of the servants from the city. He allowed the Cabinet efficiency, I would like to place on record my to impose a vicious user-pays system on the appreciation of the cooperation extended to rural community. He has allowed this me by the Q-Build Sunshine Coast and Government to promote the city areas, to Metropolitan East Q-Build regional offices. As I promote South Bank, to promote Lang Park, regularly visit schools within my electorate, I to promote the Indy, to support Compass, and am sometimes apprised of outstanding to support the cricket ground promotion, but maintenance needs at these schools by he has given virtually nothing back to the rural members of the school community. I have to areas of this State. say that on bringing these matters to the attention of the relevant Q-Build office, they Mrs WOODGATE (Kurwongbah) are always dealt with promptly and (12.32 p.m.): I do welcome this opportunity to satisfactorily. rise this afternoon to support the Estimates of the Department of Administrative Services and I turn now to the issue of the School the Office of Rural Communities. It is worth Refurbishment Program, the $60m job noting that both these departments are the creation initiative announced by this creation of this Labor Government. In the Government prior to the last State election. I case of the Administrative Services well remember the feigned outrage of Department, the honourable members who members opposite when this program was came into this place with me in December announced. I think we all remember. It will not 1989 will recall that, prior to our occupation of work, they said. It is a pork barrel. The money the Treasury benches, the administrative and is not there, they cried. Do not believe them, business side of Government in this State was they moaned. However, the proof of the 5 October 1993 4636 Legislative Assembly pudding is in the eating, and it is now time for I now wish to spend some time on the those doubting Thomases across the other other element of this Minister’s responsibilities, side in their rightful place to sit down and tuck and that is the Office of Rural Communities into a large helping of humble pie. touched on by the previous speaker. Might I If they had the good grace to admit it, the say that this Minister, with his long association School Refurbishment Program has been the with Queensland rural areas, is ideally suited real success story this year. I challenge any to administer this departmental responsibility. I member opposite to get up here today and might point out that when in office the tell me that the schools in his or her electorate National Party did not consider rural matters to have not done well as a result of this program. warrant such specific attention, Of course, they would be hypocrites if they did notwithstanding what the previous speaker because everybody knows that they treated said, otherwise it would have created such a school maintenance in this State about the structure itself. same way as Christopher Skase treated his My interest in rural matters extends also creditors. into the area of the Premier’s Northern Rural It is to this Government’s credit that it did Task Force, which is made up of Government not roll out the pork barrel by allocating funds members who give of their time to travel the by electorate from the $60m fund. Any length and breadth of the State talking to rural examination of this program will show that and provincial Queenslanders about matters each school, regardless of who the member which affect them. I have found my is, has got, and is getting, a fair go. involvement in the task force to be rewarding and I have been impressed by the candid Mr Quinn: Stick around. advice which I have received from the men Mrs WOODGATE: I will be sticking and women outside the south-east corner. around for more years than the honourable If I could offer a bit of advice to the member. In terms of my own electorate, the National Party, perhaps it could improve the School Refurbishment Program has been a “boy from the beach” image of the leader by godsend. My electorate, the present setting up units which have specific reporting electorate of Kurwongbah, the new electorate responsibilities on rural matters similar to those I still call it, is a conglomerate of former Labor which have been so successful for this and National Party electorates, and without Government. One of the most common choosing to name particular schools even the complaints that I receive as I travel around most casual observer could have identified the Queensland is that people who live outside Labor electorate schools from the National Brisbane have a great deal of difficulty in Party schools by simply looking at the state of gaining easy access to the range of services the buildings. However, I am pleased to say available to them. Regrettably, many non-rural modestly that following four years of my people take for granted the fact that they constant representation and lobbying, the have services at their doorstep that rural good people of Kurwongbah are starting to people simply do not know about or have little see improvement in the state of their schools. access to. Thanks to the creation of the Office Under the School Refurbishment of Rural Communities by this Government, this Program, around $240,000 has been problem has been addressed. allocated to address the outstanding In 1992, the first publication of the maintenance problems in my electorate. To Queensland Rural Services Directory was date, over $216,000 has been spent and released. This document related to central, every school has received some much- northern and north-western Queensland. A needed attention. The projects have ranged similar document is being prepared by the from painting to upgrading playgrounds, Media and Information Service to cover the security lighting and erosion control. I can southern rural areas. Incidentally, it is worth advise this Chamber today that this has been noting that the Media and Information very much appreciated by the school Service, which is a business unit of the communities concerned. Administrative Services Department, won the The offshoot of all this is that over 275 contract to produce that publication. Again I person-weeks of employment are being would suggest that this is proof positive of this generated. In other words, while fixing up the Government’s success in placing this schools in my electorate left at such a department on a more commercial basis. miserable standard by previous Governments, I refer briefly to the comments by the School Refurbishment Program has members opposite, who would have us created much-needed jobs. believe that they did not remove services from Legislative Assembly 4637 5 October 1993 rural Queensland. What a lot of rot! The facts that those guidelines ensure that, when are that almost from the day they took over in Government departments are considering 1957, railway lines, court houses and other reducing or withdrawing services in rural services were removed from rural people by communities, local consultation and the National Party or its forerunner, the alternative access to those services is Country Party. That is history. It cannot be provided. Our friends opposite have never argued with. Unlike the Nationals, this Minister been able to come to grips with consultation. set in place a trial of establishing 13 Queensland’s recent history has been Queensland Government Agent Pilot Project marred by the worst drought in living offices throughout the State to determine humankind’s memory. Honourable members whether or not there was a need to replace such as me who have travelled around the the services previously offered by State and talked to the average person in the courthouses. street realise what emotional and financial I am pleased to inform this House that, hardship the drought has created for rural recently, the trial was independently Queensland. We do not resile from that. The evaluated, and the result was a stamp of fact that we live down here does not mean approval for the project to be extended. that we do not know what other people are Again, our Government—unlike the Nationals suffering. We all have relatives. We talk to who closed the courthouses and walked away people. We have a bit of a heart. from them—is committed to maintaining Fortunately, others have also realised the services to rural Queenslanders. Accordingly, plight of those whose lives have been wrecked a perusal of the Budget papers will reveal that by drought. I want to place on record in this $375,000 has been set aside in the Budget to place today my appreciation to the Courier- provide for the extension of the QGAPP Mail, Channel 9 and the Metway Bank for their programs. role in establishing the Queensland Drought Recently, I was interested to read a copy Relief Appeal back in April of this year. That of a press release from the member for appeal enabled generous individuals, Western Downs, Mr Littleproud, in the business people and other organisations Western Star, in which he referred to the throughout our great State to help ease the Government offices. He stated that the burden of drought on rural Queenslanders. Government has now shelved the program, The support that the appeal received was leaving many small country towns isolated terrific. I even noticed some members of this from access. Either he does not know how to place who, when it was announced that the read the Budget papers or he does not tell the Fourex brewery would donate a percentage of truth. In relation to the Queensland its sales to the appeal, put their shoulder to Government Agent Pilot Project, page 43 of the bar to help their country constituents. Budget Paper No. 2 states— The role of the Office of Rural “Funding of $375,000 is provided in Communities in that appeal was to draw up 1993-94 for expansion and improvement guidelines for the administration and allocation of the scheme.” of funds to all of the needy families in the That is a complete contradiction of what we drought-declared communities. To date, the read in that press release in the Western Star. Office of Rural Communities has arranged for I would like to table that, if I could. $1.6m to be distributed by community committees established by the local Mr Burns: Never let the facts interfere authorities. Incidentally, honourable members with a good story. might be interested to learn that, to date, the Mrs WOODGATE: Never let the facts appeal has netted approximately $1.8m. That interfere with a good story. That is another is a fantastic figure. example of rubbish and untruths being An honourable member: Hear, hear! peddled in the bush by the National Party. It is an absolute disgrace! Let us have truth in Mrs WOODGATE: They need a “Hear, print. We talk about truth in sentencing. Let us hear!”, indeed. May I also take this opportunity have truth in printing. to congratulate the Minister on his personal contribution in promoting the appeal and Further to the creation of those offices in generally adopting a hands-on approach in rural areas, guidelines for implementing assisting the Queenslanders who found departmental proposals for rural service themselves in such a desperate situation. withdrawal or reductions have been prepared and are now administered by the Office of Another innovation of the Office of Rural Rural Communities. It is important to realise Communities worth mentioning here today is the Bush Telegraph that was alluded to by the 5 October 1993 4638 Legislative Assembly previous speaker in the debate. I have already motor vehicle did to the dray all those years mentioned that the most common complaint ago. that I hear when I travel around the rural parts Finally, in summing up, let me say that is the lack of information on the Government this department is very much the quiet initiatives and the new schemes that are achiever of the Government. It is not a available. The monthly Bush Telegraph department that creates headlines. It is the provides that information. More importantly, it engine room of Government which enables it provides a forum for rural people to contribute to go about its day-to-day business in a most articles about successful community schemes efficient and cost-productive manner. I to enhance rural economic and social congratulate the Minister on the Estimates of development and thereby encourages the his department. cross flow of information between our rural communities. Mr COOPER (Crows Nest) (12.46 p.m.): I, too, have pleasure in taking part in this debate Another initiative that has improved the on the Estimates. I confine my remarks to communication channels to Government for rural communities. Obviously, Rural rural and provincial Queenslanders is the Q- Communities covers a massive area. It Dial program. That is a rural information touches upon so many aspects of life. It service based on country agricultural show crosses into the area of the Department of circuits, staffed by a field officer employed by Primary Industries. It is a good opportunity to the media. In my case, the Dayboro, the Pine bring to the attention of honourable members Rivers and the Samford shows have all had Q- some of the things in which the Government is Dial people at the shows. They are received either succeeding or failing. very, very well. They appeared at 26 shows throughout rural Queensland, and in the I listened to the member for Kurwongbah. forthcoming year we are planning to expand I have always had a lot of time for her. that service further. However, she is slipping into the mode that some National Party members did when we I should also like to make mention of the were in Government. When one is in other initiatives brought about by the Minister Government, one tends to believe the to improve the lot of rural Queenslanders. One propaganda that is given out. We slipped into notable example is the $1.3m provided to that dangerous mode. The best thing that enable 100 000 rural Queenslanders to view Government members can ever do is to listen improved television programming, known as to what the people say, particularly about the Remote TV Service, jointly funded by the services. The delivery of services was the State and Federal Governments and the theme of a large part of the honourable Queensland Satellite Television Service. That member’s speech. now gives those rural Queenslanders the opportunity to view commercial television Delivery of service is what worries the programs. This month will see the provision of people the most. The portfolio of Rural SBS radio to those same 100 000 rural Communities covers a wide area, including the Queenslanders. Again, I can report to the Ambulance Service, rural fire brigades, fire Chamber that those initiatives have been brigades in general, police, the education much appreciated by the people of rural system, the health system, the DPI and water Queensland, and I am proud to claim them as resources. The list goes on endlessly. If Labor Government initiatives. Government members were to listen to the people—the recipients of the service, the However, with the little time that I have people who have suffered as a result of the left, I have saved what I regard as the best fact that the services do not get through as news till last. That is the new Statewide video- they once did—they would realise that conferencing network managed by the something is wrong. Administrative Services Department. The potential of that audio and television network The Government is falling into the trap of is absolutely mind blowing. Although it is throwing great volumes of money at a currently located at only 18 centres throughout problem. Whether it be the education system the State, there can be no doubt that this or the health system, hundreds of millions of telephonically driven technology is the ultimate extra dollars have been spent. Yet the in reducing the tyranny of distance in this teachers, the students and the parents in the great State of ours. Its educational value, its education system and the patients in the cost efficiency and its ability to link up with health system will say that the service has interstate and even international networks will deteriorated alarmingly and dramatically. One do to communications in this State what the does not have to ask the teachers. Whatever their political views—and they are certainly not Legislative Assembly 4639 5 October 1993 all with the Opposition—they will volunteer a location in which the Government intends to mood of despair and hopelessness in terms of construct a dump. However, I am not referring the services that they must deliver. to that matter. The kindergarten committee in The same can be said for the ambulance Toogoolawah required a building in order to officers. They are certainly not our way establish a kindergarten in the area. I believed politically, in any sense of the word. Their that it would take quite some time for those union is far, far to the left of the National people to find a building, knowing full well that Party. However, those people are desperate. they do not have a lot of money. However, They want to deliver a service. That is what within a matter of weeks of my having they are there for. They are career officers and approached the Minister, a demountable was professional officers. When they want to made available. The next step is to establish a deliver a service to the people and the permanent building in the school grounds, wherewithal to provide that service has been where plenty of spare land is available. The cut, they express extreme anxiety, which they kindergarten committee will certainly need have been doing. They are hitting the button some coordination and help with that project. I when they say that the Ambulance Service is will be in touch with the Minister’s office at a in total disarray. No-one can deny it. The later date with regard to that project. patients feel it. The ambulance officers who To me, that is what representing deliver the service at the coalface know it. constituents and being a Minister is all about. I That causes the Opposition extreme concern. have been a Minister, and I have seen many Therefore, although a lot of money is situations requiring the application of being spent in certain areas, that money is not commonsense rather than bureaucratic being well spent. No programs or processes bungling. Ministers need to avoid bureaucratic are in place whereby one can see the delivery intervention so that they can actually make a of that service from the top, all the way down decision. I have witnessed the problem of to the people who need it most. That is what bureaucrats worrying about setting precedents we are all about—delivery of service. All of the for helping people on the ground. Heavens Government departments should act in the above, that is why members of Parliament are interests of delivery of service. If the elected—to deliver services to the people and Government does not hit the button and get to be representatives of the people. Certainly, the services through to the people, something we have to be sensible. We cannot deliver is radically wrong and great attention must be everything, and we know that, but we also given to that. have to apply a large degree of commonsense. I concur with the comments by the member for Kurwongbah about rural industry. I want to touch on some of the areas to Rural services are delivered to a large number which the Minister has referred in recent times. of areas. The need for rural services exists not Again I refer to the delivery of rural services. too far outside the cities. It was very heart- Rural people have been under tremendous warming to see the response of city people to pressure for over 10 years from foreign the major drought being experienced in this imports. That is an issue on which there is State, which is quite rightly referred to as the agreement and understanding among some worst in living memory. City people responded political representatives. However, I believe beautifully to the needs of the rural people that the political representatives in the Federal who are feeling the effects of the drought. sphere have listened too closely to the That assistance will never be forgotten. It has bureaucrats who advise them. All Federal knitted the city and the country together in a parliamentarians—the Democrats, the way that will never be broken. A major gap Liberals, the Nationals and Labor members— once existed between the city and the have become imbued with the idea that a country. During this time of adversity, an level playing field exists in the market, which is everlasting bond has been created. absolute and utter garbage. I want to commend the Minister, but he I am one of those who would love to see will not shut up; he is too busy talking. a few waves of B52s floating over Canberra to attempt to impart some commonsense into Mr Burns interjected. the attitudes of those bureaucrats. They are Mr COOPER: This is the rap, and the absolute pie-in-the-sky ratbags, who promote Minister might as well listen. Very recently, I a level playing field and foreign imports found it necessary to approach the Minister pouring into the country while our own people about a certain issue. Toogoolawah is a small are put out of work. Can any honourable country town in the beautiful Brisbane Valley. member see sense in that? Surely to heaven It should not be forgotten that that is the we can see that foreign imports cause unfair 5 October 1993 4640 Legislative Assembly competition. In many instances, the countries no practical idea about education for rural that are exporting to us, including America kids. and some of the Third World countries, are Most members have experienced the subsidising their producers and making their early rises necessary to get the kids to school products nice and cheap here. It is a crazy on the bus and the fight to attain a school bus scenario, and our producers have to wear it. service in the first instance. Students who are It is a great shame to see all of the presently travelling for more than 30 minutes experience possessed by the people who or 40 minutes on a school bus may find that have been on the land for four and five their principal has been taken away and that generations going out the door not just they are starting to be treated as second-rate because of drought or recession but also students. That is evidence of a dual system. because of foreign imports. We are putting There is one system for the city areas, where our own people out of work and onto the dole a good system operates that takes into queues. Our country is becoming account all of the needs of students. There is unproductive because of Federal policies that another system—and this occurs not far west are simply not working. Yet still the Federal of Ipswich—for the rural areas. Students are politicians and bureaucrats are on this kick of treated as second rate and they do not the level playing field. To me, the idea of a receive anything like the service delivered in level playing field is an absolute farce. Those the city. To me, that is utterly wrong. The who believe in it sincerely have my sympathy. Opposition would fight that tooth and nail. Rural people require rural reconstruction Rail cuts have been mentioned. We are of a proper and lasting nature, not just the yet to find out exactly where they will fall. I hand-to-mouth approach which dictates that have written to the Minister—and some very we need only put food on the table. I am sure good submissions have been prepared by the that the Minister has taken note of that fact, Millmerran Shire Council, the Jondaryan Shire but we have to put such philosophies into Council and the Rosalie Shire Council—on the effect. The problem must be considered in proposed closure of the Oakey line. It is my depth and any reconstruction must take into opinion that neither Government has really account the next five, 10, 15 or 20 years. In given Queensland Rail a chance. It needs to the past, some financial bodies did offer have greater opportunities to compete, to be assistance. I refer to the Agricultural Bank and innovative, to be more constructive and to be the QIDC. In my opinion, those organisations more flexible in its approach. If that were to have lost the plot in terms of the delivery of occur, instead of cutting railway lines and long-term financing and do not take into closing them down, perhaps we could do account the vagaries of the rural sector. The better. That is the approach that I take to problem does not run from one financial year Queensland Rail. I do not believe that it has to another. It is seasonal and it is driven by received the attention that it richly deserves market forces. The rural sector is subjected to and it should be given a second chance. a whole range of factors and rural financing I mentioned rural health, the enormous has to address those factors. No organisation general cost increases to patients and the has really taken up the cudgels and tried to general dramatic slip in services in both the come with grips with that fact. That is Ambulance Service and the health system. extremely unfortunate. One really has only to listen to the people on I mentioned earlier some of the areas the ground to realise that something is that I believe are in need of attention, and not radically wrong. Next year, rather than merely just in monetary terms. I have mentioned the trying to come up with hundreds of millions of education system. Some boffins think that extra dollars, I suggest that the Government school clustering is a good concept. In fact, try to work out how that money can be better clustering means taking principals out of spent and how those services can be better schools and closing schools as they wither on delivered to the people. They should be the the vine. Clustering means that students will No. 1 criteria of any Government rather than it have to be bussed a hell of a lot further than running around saying, “We have increased they are already. It means generally taking the budget by 6 per cent; therefore, things services away when those services are should be all right.” It simply does not work working and should be allowed to continue to that way. work. I do not believe that the issue of I have mentioned some of the leaders of clustering is resolved. I believe that it is on the rural organisations. They need to have a backburner only for the moment. The people darned good look at the plight of some of their who promote that sort of rubbish simply have members. If those organisations were to look Legislative Assembly 4641 5 October 1993 closer at some of the services that they storage shed and replacement carpet in one believe are starting to filter through and of the blocks of the school. The Hemmant discuss them with their members, they would preschool was also granted funds for the discover that their members know otherwise. repair and replacement of carpet tiles and Those producer leaders should not be so guttering. conscious of having to scratch the back of Our next port of call was the Murarrie Government. They must do their job according State School. Mr Michael Quinn, the principal, to the wishes of their membership and not and the P & C association members gave us according to the worthless commitments that a typically warm and friendly Murarrie greeting. they might obtain from the Government. They Approval was granted for the provision of a must fight more strongly. They should not new tuckshop, which the school has needed accept what a Minister has to offer merely badly for a number of years. The previous because he or she was nice enough to let tuckshop was badly sited, very small and had them in the door. They should be able to say, no security. I am pleased to say that the new “The Minister let us in the door, but this is what tuckshop will be near the covered walkway we actually achieved.” Those leaders must and play area and has facilities to serve analyse what they have actually achieved students from both sides. As well, provision from the Government and what they have was made for the making safe of playground lost. If they do, they will find that they come equipment, external repainting and general out on the wrong side of the ledger. repairs. I mentioned the subject of crime moving At Cannon Hill State School, principal into rural sectors. I will deal with that in more Noel Ashford and P & C association members detail in Estimates. Again, it is not requested and received the provision of merely a case of throwing money at landscaping of the hard playground areas. something; the community must be involved That school is a large school in the Bulimba heavily with the Police Service. That body has electorate, but the majority of the outside area in place some very good schemes such as is covered with asphalt. Only one oval is Neighbourhood Watch and Rural Watch and available for children to play sports. That other schemes related to the law-and-order landscaping will soften the schoolground and issue. Obviously, with crime moving heavily provide seating so that teachers can conduct into the rural sector, much more has to be classes under the trees in the schoolyard in done. hot weather. Time expired. We next visited the Balmoral State High Sitting suspended from 1.01 to 2.30 p.m. School, where the principal, Bev Farley, Mr PURCELL (Bulimba) (2.30 p.m.): I pointed out to the Minister the need to repaint would like to begin my speech on the a number of blocks as well as to replace Estimates for the Administrative Services furniture, guttering and a roof over the Department by discussing the State School covered walkways. As well as those Refurbishment Program and its impact on my improvements, approval was given to finance electorate. Earlier this year, I contacted the the conversion of two chemistry rooms with Minister, Tom Burns, regarding work needed fixtures into standard teaching classrooms on schools in the Bulimba electorate. He very which were badly needed. kindly agreed to set aside time to travel Approval was given to the request by Mr around my electorate and visit every school Earl Taylor, the principal of the Morningside personally and assess their needs first hand. State School, and his P & C association for We commenced at 8.30 a.m. at the landscaping and external and internal painting Hemmant State School, where the teaching of both the school and the preschool. principal, Colin Moynihan, and members of Recently, I was invited to that school to the Hemmant P & C Association brought to celebrate the seventieth birthday of Sid the Minister’s attention the desperate need for Holcroft—or Siddie, as he is known at the playground equipment for the children. Those school. Three or four years ago, Sid walked in children had had no playground equipment for off the street to the Morningside State School a number of years. Approval was granted on a and asked if he could assist in any way. Since dollar-for-dollar basis and the equipment has then, Sid has worked on the gardens at that since been installed. I thank the Minister on school, with assistance from three mothers of behalf of the students of the Hemmant State students at the school. The money that has School for his understanding and prompt been set aside for landscaping will be put to attention on this matter. As well, approval was very good use by that school. given for the provision of a badly needed 5 October 1993 4642 Legislative Assembly

Bulimba State School principal, Bob apprentices in the construction industry. That Shearer, and members of the P & C will be worked out with the construction association received approval for the industry for the employment of apprentices on upgrading of the tuckshop and the making Government buildings so that even private safe of playground equipment. contractors who win Government work will Mr Littleproud: What school is that? have a responsibility to train apprentices on Government work. I might add that it is the Mr PURCELL: That is the Bulimba State policy of this department to encourage School. Dennis Hohnen, the teaching apprentices to gain experience with private principal, and members of the P & C contractors. association at the Norman Park State School requested and received the provision of The department has a commitment not landscaping and paving of a much-used walk only to tradesmen but also to the training of its area, as well as maintenance work. As well, it builders’ labourers, with an intake of five was brought to our attention that the pool had labourers on traineeships. This is a forerunner a bad drainage problem. Because the water for traineeships not only for Queensland but from the oversplash was not dispersing, a also, I believe, throughout Australia. I health problem was being created. The personally believe that apprentices as we now swimming club is grateful that the problem know them will cease to exist in the future and was attended to promptly by the Works all training for the building industry will come Department. The swimming pool is available through traineeships. Trainees will then be not only to children of the area but also to able to branch out into other modules of adults. A program has been put in place to training, whether they be carpentry, bricklaying allow adults to make regular use of the pool or painting, making workers in the construction for training and swimming. industry a more rounded and flexible work force. Unfortunately, because of time constraints, we were unable to visit the Seven Q-Build has also kept alive trades which, Hills State School. However, I visited that without its support, would have died out. An school later and inspected it along with excellent example of that is stone masonry. Edward Danulewski. We forwarded a list of Because of the style of many of the items to Tom Burns to consider, and approval Government-owned buildings, stonemasons was given for the delivery of awnings and the and their apprentices are kept in employment extension of some walls. on a full-time basis. Honourable members may be interested to learn that the As my predecessor, Ron McLean, stated department’s stonemasons and their on many occasions, when Labor came to apprentices are currently assisting in the Government there was a great discrepancy restoration of St John’s Cathedral in Ann between the condition of schools in Labor- Street. held electorates and that of those in the former Government-held electorates. One of I turn now to a problem with which the this Government’s major tasks has been to Minister has grappled for many years, along ensure that children in this State are not with my predecessor, Ron McLean. I refer to discriminated against either in classroom or in the A. J. Bush rendering plant which has been playground conditions because of the political responsible for an offensive odour permeating representation of an area. The Goss the air of Murarrie and surrounding suburbs. Government and the Minister are to be Honourable members who have had occasion commended for not playing politics with the to travel on the Gateway Bridge would have at well-being, health and safety of Queensland some stage been aware of that unpleasant children. odour. One has to wind down the car window to pay the toll and, as soon as one does, one I now wish to speak on the subject of cops the unpleasant smell. Over the years, apprentices. The Maintenance and the people of Murarrie have been made Operations Unit of the Department of promise after promise by the former Administrative Services employs some 352 Government that the matter would be apprentices. That makes the department the rectified, but it was not until the election of the biggest employer of apprentices in Labor Government that a greater priority has Queensland and in any other State of been attached to solving this environmental Australia—possibly anywhere in the problem and the impact that it has on the Commonwealth. The Government has made residents of the area. I am very pleased to say a commitment to retain the day labour force. that the end is in sight. By the end of summer On 16 November 1992, Cabinet approved a 1994, the people of Murarrie will no longer policy formulation for employment of have the foul stench wafting through their Legislative Assembly 4643 5 October 1993 homes day and night. This Government, In the 12 months that I have been a eager to address the problem, set aside $9m member of the Minister’s legislative to assist A. J. Bush to relocate to a more committee, I have taken a keen interest in the suitable site and upgrade to an overall operation of the department. I pay environmentally friendly processing operation. tribute to the workers employed by the The structure has been completed, with department, most particularly to those field processing equipment installed and a new staff upon whom the Government is heavily $2m boiler expected to fire on 1 November, dependent and without whom the department when half of all the processing work will be would be less effective. moved to the new plant. I have personally Mr QUINN (Merrimac) (2.43 p.m.): I join in visited the site and agree that it is ideally this Estimates debate to focus on the located, well outside the town of Beaudesert. Minister’s Department of Administrative It will house the most modern, environmentally Services and, in particular, on the provision of friendly rendering technology in the world maintenance programs and refurbishment today. The head office and truck maintenance programs within State schools throughout unit of A. J. Bush will remain at Murarrie for Queensland. At the outset, I place on record the time being, thereby continuing to employ that the School Refurbishment Program in local people, but no rendering will take place particular has been very beneficial to schools. at the Murarrie site. It has involved the much-needed upgrade of The Administrative Services Department facilities. The allocation of $60m over two covers many and diverse Government years has been welcomed by teachers, departments. Besides the aforementioned parents and children within schools. departments, it also covers Goprint, the To determine exactly what is going on Centre for Information Technology and with the funding arrangements within these Communications, Media and Information programs, I lodged several freedom of Service, Legal and Contractual Services, information requests with the Minister’s Queensland State Archives and, last but by department. No doubt the Minister would be no means least, the Office of Rural aware that I did access and analyse that Communities. Having lived and worked on the information. The two programs that I wish to land for over half my life, I can truly empathise speak about are the Asset Maintenance with our country cousins because of the recent Program and the School Refurbishment harsh drought conditions that many of them Program. The Minor New Works Program was have experienced. I congratulate the Minister not available to me in a form that I wanted. It on his sympathetic and dedicated approach to was available from the Minister’s office only on those people and the countless hours that he an electorate-by-electorate basis for the 1991- has spent out west meeting with and speaking 92 year. After that, it was handled by regional with those people in an attempt to fully Education Department offices, which no understand their plight and to assist them. longer keep that information. However, they Rural living is not easy, even in the good do maintain information on a school-by-school years. In the city we tend to forget that those basis within the regions. So for someone who people live in virtual isolation. We take it for wishes to see where the money is being spent granted that we can walk down the street to a on an electorate-by-electorate basis, this bank, a shop or any other services that are makes it much more difficult to access that freely available and open in the city. If those information. Unless one is prepared to devote rural towns have those services at all, the an inordinate amount of time to accessing this hours for which they are open are not the information, one can no longer find out where same as they are here in the city. People in minor new work is being undertaken those towns have to depend on whatever throughout the State on an electorate-by- communications are available to them. Tom electorate basis. I know that this is not the Burns has tried and, I believe, succeeded in Minister’s fault, because that information is giving those people some hope for the future now held by the Education Department. I shall through his personal visits, which were morale raise this matter during the debate on the lifting and assured our country neighbours that Education Department Estimates. they are not forgotten. The Government was I return to the two programs about which I prepared to listen and provide assistance with wish to speak today. As I said, I did access the practical organisation of drought relief. I the information about the Asset Maintenance say to the Minister, “It was a job well done, Program and the School Refurbishment Tom.” Program from 1991-92 to this year. One must bear in mind that the funds are supposed to be allocated on a needs basis, not a political 5 October 1993 4644 Legislative Assembly basis or as a result of political representation— electorates. Eight of the nine Liberal Party as several members have indicated today. electorates show below-average expenditure. Some anomalies exist within the system. I am On a region-by-region basis, some not looking at one individual year or program. I anomalies exist. I instance the Gold Coast am looking at these two programs over a region, because it is the one that I know best. number of years. Members can get a fairly That region contains eight electorates: two accurate idea of where the money is being Liberal, four National and two Labor. Not one allocated, and some disturbing facts come to of those electorates has above-average light. expenditure. As I said, it may be a factor that Given the make-up of country there are some new schools in that region. I electorates, where there are many small acknowledge that some of them are new, but schools and teacher accommodation units, not all of them are new schools. In fact, one one would expect those electorates, which are could count on one hand the number of new mostly National Party electorates, to have schools constructed on the Gold Coast over higher than average expenditure. By and the past five years—only one to my large that is the case. I have done an analysis knowledge and that is the Worongary Primary of the programs. At the top of the list are School at Nerang. The eight electorates on seats such as Gregory, Mount Isa and the Gold Coast account for just over 6 per Warrego, which have a high expenditure—in cent of the funding. Yet those eight the order of $3m—and double the average electorates roughly correspond to the south expenditure spent in each electorate across coast regional education region, which has the State. That is to be expected. But when something in the order of 14 per cent of the one considers the way in which the funding school population. So this Government is has been distributed on a political basis, that giving 6 per cent of the funding to 14 per cent is, electorate by electorate within the political of the school population. If that is not an parties, one starts to see some anomalies. anomaly, I am not standing here. For instance, the ALP Government has Mr Burns: You are getting 6 per cent of roughly 60 per cent of Queensland electorates the vote, also. and they receive roughly 61 per cent of the Mr QUINN: I repeat that it is 14 per cent funding. One cannot argue with that analysis of the school population. and that large number of electorates. The National Party has 29 per cent of the Mr Burns: You go and look at each of electorates, which receive higher than average them to see whether they are in good order or funding. Those electorates receive about 32 not. per cent or 33 per cent of the total funding. Mr QUINN: I acknowledged that it is on a The real problem comes to light when one needs basis. I have just pointed out some of considers the Liberal Party electorates. the anomalies; I have not drawn the Although the Liberal Party has roughly 10 per conclusions yet. Here they come. The Minister cent of the electorates, its electorates receive asked why the electorates represented by only 7 per cent of the total funding. Therefore, Liberal Party members have been so poorly it appears that the National Party is being treated in terms of funding and why the Gold subsidised at the expense of the Liberal Party. Coast has continued to be ignored in terms of According to the list of expenditure in funding. There may very well be reasons for electorates, the bottom three electorates are that, and perhaps I can help the Minister with all Liberal Party electorates. Eight of the nine the answers. During the last election Liberal Party electorates have below average campaign in Noosa, there was a plan put expenditure. Only one is above average. As I forward by the then member for Noosa, Ray said, one would expect country electorates to Barber, who was an unsuccessful candidate. have higher than average funding. Nerang, In his 11-point plan, as part of the Labor which is one of the fastest-growing electorates Party’s commitments, was an allocation of in Queensland, has an expanding population more than $500,000 for upgrading local base, some old schools and some new schools as part of the $60m School schools. So the maintenance demands of that Refurbishment Program. One would have electorate would not be great. But it is thought that if that is a commitment, that is something of an anomaly when the lowest based on needs. True? Over the past two expenditure on a Liberal Party electorate is years, an amount of $180,000 has been about $700,000 and the highest expenditure spent in the Noosa electorate on schools is over $3m—four times as much. Four of the refurbishment. It was claimed that $500,000 bottom 10 electorates and seven of the was needed, and $180,000 has been spent. bottom 30 electorates are Liberal Party Why the discrepancy? Because there has Legislative Assembly 4645 5 October 1993 been a change in the elected member. Out The decisions are not made on a needs basis; goes the Labor member, in comes the Liberal they are based on political considerations. member and then there is a cutback in the Mr SZCZERBANIK (Albert) (2.54 p.m.): I funding. If that is not a political decision, then welcome this opportunity to participate in the what is? Other people may say well, “You debate on the Estimates for the portfolio of really needed only $180,000.” The question Administrative Services. The seat of Albert is then is, “Why did the Government allocate located in what is regarded as Australia’s $500,000?” Was that a pork-barrelling fastest-growing region. The corridor between exercise? Was that a political promise? Brisbane and the Gold Coast is continuing to Government members cannot have it both develop rapidly. New houses are being built, ways; it is one or the other. industry is being established or relocating, and The fact is that the level of funding for each year thousands of new families settle each electorate under the Asset Maintenance there from other States, or other parts of Program and the School Refurbishment Queensland. I noted that an article in the Program is being influenced by political Courier-Mail last week indicated that the net decisions. The Minister said himself, “I will gain for Queensland is about 1 000 people a have a look at your electorates and I will see week coming to this State. If it is so bad here what has to be done.” If the decisions are in Queensland, why are people leaving the made on the basis of need, there should be other States? Why are they coming to live in no elected representation at all involved. the south-east corner? Those people who Officers of the Minister’s department should argue that Queensland is not the most go round the schools, they should make their progressive State in Australia need to get their submissions and the schools should be heads read. judged on needs-based criteria. That is a One of the important responsibilities for needs-based decision, not when the Minister the State Government is to provide public makes political representations and then facilities for this growing population. The changes the order of need on a political basis. Administrative Services Department is That is what the Minister has done. responsible for much of the planning and the Mr Burns: Not at all. provision of those facilities. I would like to talk Mr QUINN: It is a hypocritical process, about capital works. The 1993 State Budget and it is reprehensible because the Minister details numerous capital works projects within said that that would not occur if there was a the south coast region stretching from change of Government; yet the Minister is Brisbane’s southern outskirts to the New doing it. This Government can no longer claim South Wales border. This rapidly expanding to be administering the funds fairly. The fact is region is certainly receiving its fair share of that this Government is damned by its own new facilities in the shape of schools, school statistics as indicated by those lists. If the ALP capital works, TAFE projects and new police members want to have a look to see how and health facilities. A measure of the growth badly they have done, they are quite in the region is the demand for new schools. welcome. The member for Brisbane Last year, the State Government spent Central—his electorate is well down the list. He $62m throughout the State to complete new is obviously not in favour. A few of his friends school works in time for the start of the 1993 are probably down there, too. One can see school year. Of that amount—and I note that who is not in favour. The electorates of the member for Merrimac is eagerly awaiting Brisbane Central, Everton, Mount Coot-tha, this—$11.5m, or one-fifth, was spent in the Greenslopes, Kurwongbah and Bulimba are area between Brisbane and the Gold Coast. all well down the list, yet the members who So the criticism that the members for represent those electorates all stood up in this Merrimac and Nerang make of this place and said what a great job they are Government is quite wrong. That figure doing. Their electorates are well down the list, speaks for itself. The 1993 State Budget and well below the average. contains more than $19.5m for educational As I said, some electorates are really high capital works this financial year in the south on the expenditure list. Kallangur is almost coast region, so this Labor Government is $3m, Mount Gravatt is almost $3m, South continuing that process of providing money for Brisbane is almost $3m, yet Kedron is only education. That amount is split between $800,000 and Barron River is only $800,000. slightly more than $10m for primary schools As I said, the figures indicate that political and just under $9.5m for secondary schools. considerations are being taken into account. Within my seat of Albert, the major school projects include Stage 1 of the new Windaroo State High School, costing more than $4.7m, 5 October 1993 4646 Legislative Assembly and a new two-storey general learning block at in that area. I do not know how much money Cedar Creek State School costing $455,000. I you can throw at the south coast and make went to the people at Cedar Creek about this them happy. project because the former National Party People in the Albert electorate will benefit Government was going to flood that area, and from some of the $6.25m allocated to help all the school buildings on that site were projects in the south coast region. That is demountable and transportable. That general more money we are spending, yet the learning block will provide concrete evidence honourable member is saying that we are not that this Government is committed to not spending enough down there. Of direct building the Wolffdene dam. benefit to them will be Stage 3 of the Logan Mr Littleproud: What are they going to Hospital for obstetric and neo-natal facilities do with the weir? costing $1.4m, $250,000 for a day surgery Mr SZCZERBANIK: A number of projects unit at the Logan Hospital, and $1.1m for the at the Helensvale State High School are provision of a community health care facility at planned, including a new general studies and Beenleigh. At this stage we do not have a staff amenities block costing $934,000 as well site. I know that the member for Waterford, as a smaller project costing close to $70,000 who sits next to me, is plugging for it to go in to provide extra laboratory space, extra art his electorate and I have been out there space and extra home economics facilities. A plugging for it to go in mine, but the benefits new general learning block is being provided go to the community as a whole and I do not at Windaroo State School at a cost of care where it goes. That is more money we $305,000, and Oxenford State School will are spending on the south coast region, yet receive a new amenities block costing the honourable member for Merrimac keeps $108,000. arguing that the Government is not spending enough money there. Also, close to $1m has I note that the member for Western been allocated for TAFE projects in the south Downs referred to weirs. I have always told coast region, including $300,000 for the those people that the Government is looking commencement of planning for an at constructing weirs in that region. They engineering and applied science building at certainly know that. Until the studies are the Logan TAFE. carried out, I do not know where the weirs are going to go, but the people in that area are All these capital works projects will provide well informed. I always tell them that we need direct benefit to the people in Albert. They to get the water from somewhere, but where show that the State Government—and it is a that will be, I do not know. The honourable Labor State Government—is catering for member can conjecture all he likes on where growth in the south coast region and is the weirs will be placed, but no-one really meeting the demands for new and upgraded knows yet until studies, including flood studies, facilities and services. are carried out. I have always been open with Another project I would like to talk about the people in that area. I do not know what is the School Refurbishment Program. This the member for Beaudesert is trying to Budget contains $37.6m to complete the portray, but I have always been open with the successful School Refurbishment Program. people who live at Cedar Creek. I do not know This program started last year, and has cost a what the honourable member is trying to total of $60m. It has had remarkable impact imply. on the standard of school facilities throughout An Opposition member interjected. Queensland. About 1 500 Queensland schools, including about 800 in rural and Mr SZCZERBANIK: That is fine—I always regional areas of Queensland, will benefit from tell the people. As I said earlier, there are the School Refurbishment Program. That other education works projects scheduled again shoots down the honourable member’s elsewhere throughout the south coast region, argument that we should spend all the money and I am sure that other local members will on the south coast. No, we cannot. We need mention them. to spend it all over Queensland and make This year, $15.6m will be spent on sure the benefits are spread throughout the education in Albert, which makes a total of State. This Government is doing that, not just $17.5m since 1991. That is just in State looking at the south coast or Brisbane, where education capital works. The other capital all our members are, but rural and regional works include police stations and the $350m areas as well. to be spent on the Gold Coast rail link, yet the The $60m program has been funded member for Merrimac whinges that the from the increased tobacco licence fee and Government is not spending enough money Legislative Assembly 4647 5 October 1993 was a commitment made during the 1992 Party electorate. It had not been painted or State election campaign. That has been otherwise maintained for about the past 15 implemented on top of the normal years. If one looks back through the principal’s maintenance Budget of more than $40m. The notes, he has been trying for covered increased tobacco licence fee is helping make walkways in that school for years and years, our schools better places for students and as have all preceding principals, but they were staff. At the same time, refurbishment never provided. Tom came down and had a programs will help to generate jobs. The $60m look at it and thought it was appropriate that being spent under the program is on top of money be spent on it, and allocated it. the regular school maintenance program It was pointed out to him that the building spending. This special one-off program is has only one external fire exit. To get to the aimed at tackling the backlog of school other fire exit one has to go back through the maintenance that built up because of years of building. The department is working on a way neglect by previous National Party and Liberal to provide another external fire exit. That is not Party Governments. going to cost us pennies, but we have to do it The projects being undertaken include for the safety of our kids. works such as internal and external repainting I would also like to comment on the of some of the blocks, replacement of floor Neighbourhood Safety Audit Program. I am coverings, and long overdue general repairs. pleased to see that this Budget contained half We would never have been able to address a million dollars in funding for the Fitzgerald the backlog of maintenance in our schools inspired community policing initiative, the without the extra money from the increased Neighbourhood Safety Audit Program. The tobacco licensing fees. A total of 73 projects program was launched in March this year, and have been identified in the Albert electorate is run jointly by the Administrative Services under the School Refurbishment Program. Department and the Police Service. It is These are being undertaken at about 14 designed to allow local communities to identify preschools, State schools and high schools in and reduce potential personal safety risks in my electorate. The estimated cost of these public areas. It is aimed to improve crime projects is close to $370,000. prevention and help make local communities At this point, I must thank Minister Tom safer. A special neighbourhood safety audit Burns for his continued interest in the School unit was established within the Administrative Refurbishment Program. He has always Services Department to coordinate the shown a willingness to see at first hand the Neighbourhood Safety Audit Program and to progress of the refurbishment program and to administer funds. discuss further requests with school officials The Neighbourhood Safety Audit and P & C officers. In March this year, the Program involved communities in an Minister accepted my invitation to look at inspection or audit of their neighbourhoods to possibility of adding some projects to the identify any areas that may pose personal School Refurbishment Program at a number safety risks. These could include the lack of of schools. I am pleased to say he came and lighting in dark areas, overgrown foliage near saw and agreed to fund a number of these bus stops, in parks or near railway stations, or projects. One of those projects involved a the lack of public phones in isolated areas. school playground at the Helensvale State The State Government can provide grants of School. I had been lobbied by the deputy up to $1,000 on a sliding scale, depending on principal there, Val Falks, for quite a number the size and complexity of the area being of months about it. Tom Burns came and had audited. Existing groups such as a look at the project and agreed that it was Neighbourhood Watch, police community needed. The old school fort and the consultative committees, progress playground did not come up to occupational associations and community centres are health and safety standards, and he agreed eligible to apply. Next week, I hope to talk to a to fund repairs. There is $60,000 worth of work Neighbourhood Watch at River Downs to see going into that school. Half was funded by the whether they will get involved with the local P & C—and they were quite happy to fund community at Helensvale to investigate it—and half by the State Government, so whether we can institute the safety audit twice as much work is being generated in that program in Helensvale, which is a closed area. community. It has set natural boundaries. The The other project that the Minister came program would work very well down there, so I to look at was the provision of covered will take that up with them and we will get the walkways at the Beenleigh State School. Prior ball rolling. to my election, that school was in a National 5 October 1993 4648 Legislative Assembly

Once the audits have been completed “The Office of Rural Communities and the potential safety problems have been (ORC) advises the Deputy Premier as identified, the local communities then contact Minister for Rural Communities on all relevant organisations such as the local policy matters coming before council, Queensland Railways, Telecom or the Government which have implications for State or Federal Governments to have them rural communities. ORC places particular rectified. The Fitzgerald inquiry stressed the emphasis on carrying out this need for the community to work with the local responsibility in collaboration and police in a fight against crime in their local consultation with all relevant stakeholders area. It needs to be stressed that police including co-ordinating research efforts on cannot do everything on their own and that various aspects of social and economic the community has to be involved in looking development in rural communities.” after its own area. The report saw a need to The achievements of the program during involve local community members in the year make one wonder and make for developing innovative approaches to crime some mirth. The Budget notes state that the prevention, and in response to this, a program has— community crime prevention initiative was trialled in the Morningside area in Brisbane in “Assisted Government Departments early 1992. The pilot scheme identified a develop appropriate strategies and number of such potential personal safety risks programs for implementing effective and and has been successful in having many of efficient service in rural communities.” them rectified. The State Government grants I do not know about the effective and efficient will facilitate the implementation of the service. The notes then state— program throughout Queensland. Each Q- “Promoted effective change Build regional office throughout the State has processes for Government service a safety audit liaison officer, who will assist delivery through implementation of the local community groups who choose to adopt Guidelines for Withdrawal or Reduction of the program. There are now around 30 local Services in Rural Communities.” communities operating neighbourhood safety audits throughout Queensland. I have met Withdrawal and reduction is what is with John Luterall, who is the head of the happening. program, and again I stress to the Minister Let us have a look at what the ALP that we will get one of these programs Government has done to rural communities operating in Albert. while it has been in power. I recognise the fact Time expired. that the Minister has had to carry some very hot potatoes created by the Minister for Mr RANDELL (Mirani) (3.09 p.m.): Thank Primary Industries. That Minister does the you, Madam Temporary Chairman, for damage and the Minister for Rural allowing me to take part in this debate today. Communities must try to cover for him. This Firstly, I congratulate the Q-Build officers in Minister has also handed one back to the Mackay. They are doing an excellent job in Minister for Primary Industries. The fishing that area. I can only speak from what I see inquiry is a hot potato that the Minister for when I am in my electorate office and from Primary Industries now has in his hands. I the congratulations and thanks that I hear hope that he makes a very good fist of that. I from school principals. Those Q-Build officers suppose that the Minister will give the Minister do a magnificent job. I have nothing other for Primary Industries some advice. I hope than praise for them. I know them personally. I that he does. Seven years ago, when the offer my congratulations and acknowledge a National Party was in power, the Minister job well done. If we have more such asked me what we were going to do about the people—and I have no doubt that we have fishing industry. them in Brisbane and other parts—my congratulations go also to them. Mr Burns: You didn’t do it. The Budget notes for the Office of Rural Mr RANDELL: I know. Communities state that the program goal of Mr Burns: We’re having a go. the Office of Rural Communities is— Mr RANDELL: The Minister is having a “Provision of policy advice for go. I congratulate him on that. I wish that he Government to ensure fair treatment of had kept control of the fishing inquiry. I rural communities in relation to honestly say that. I have enormous admiration Government policy initiatives.” for the Minister because of his dedication to The Budget notes state further— Legislative Assembly 4649 5 October 1993 fishing. I do not think that the Minister is as damage to the ALP Government. What about good a fisherman as I am. daylight saving? Hansard records that the I also recognise the fact that the Minister Minister voted twice in this very Chamber for sat in Cabinet when a lot of those decisions daylight saving. Then he went into rural areas were being made. As Deputy Premier, he and said, “I do not agree with it. My certainly would have had an enormous colleagues should not have done that.” I influence on some of the decisions that were remember the Minister talking very made on rural areas. One that comes to mind sarcastically about the rural people saying that is the closure of railway lines. The Minister the curtains would fade and that the cows must have been expecting this. He sat in would not milk. However, immediately the flak Cabinet when it made the decision to close became too hot, the Minister rode out into the those lines. Cabinet decided that one-third of rural communities on his white horse with guns the railway lines in Queensland would be blazing and said, “I do not agree with the closed for economic reasons. The Minister Government. It is not supposed to do that.” went along with that, yet when the uproar Mr J. H. Sullivan: Did he talk on that started, which did enormous damage to the legislation? Government, the Minister went straight out Mr RANDELL: No. He did not speak to into the rural communities and said, “This is the last lot of legislation, as far as I know. I not good enough. The Government should have not had a chance to look. I will look at not be doing it.” However, the Minister sat in his previous speeches. I can remember some Cabinet—— of the things that he wished were not in Mr Burns: I did. Hansard. Mr RANDELL: The Minister sat in Cabinet While the ALP has been in power and in and helped with those decisions. He knows as charge of rural affairs, and while we have had well as I do from being in Cabinet that, if he the Minister’s committee, what have we seen? did not agree with what happened in Cabinet Ambulance boards, hospital boards and fire and he went against his Cabinet colleagues, boards have all been disbanded. They have he should have resigned. lost their identity. They have all been Mr Burns: What should I have done? changed—and not for the better—despite widespread community uproar and Mr RANDELL: If the Minister did not widespread community concern. agree, he should have resigned. As I said before, railway closures will be Mr Burns: Under those rules, you would done gradually. In all of the little towns in my never have made it in here. You would still be electorate, their personnel have been either at Sarina on the farm. made redundant or shifted to other places, Mr RANDELL: Why? with a consequent decline in services in those Mr Burns: You would have had to resign little towns. Businesses such as hotels, shops every time you were wrong. and schools have all been affected by those people leaving. At the last election, the Mr RANDELL: No. I am not saying that. I Minister supported the ALP candidate against am saying that Cabinet makes collective me in that electorate. He went to Carmila, St decisions, and the Minister knows it. If he Lawrence, Ogmore and Marlborough. The disagrees with his Cabinet colleagues and Minister was chased out of Ogmore because says it publicly, he is duty bound to resign. the Government closed the TAB. He has seen However, that has gone by the board. what is happening, but what has he done The Minister has formed committees and about it? Not a thing. said, “We will look at whether the lines should Freight charges have increased be closed or open.” More importantly, the astronomically and, in most towns, under the Minister has said to rural people, “Prove to me railway policy we cannot even get the freight why those lines should remain open.” Of dropped off at our railway. It must go to course, we all know that the lines will be Mackay and come back on the road. Is that closed at some time. The Government will do economic? Courthouses have been closed it slowly because it got such a mauling last and police stations have been downgraded, time. with inadequate staff, facilities and finance. Mr Campbell: You’ve closed lines. How Those police stations are supposed to operate many lines have you closed? efficiently in rural areas. The Stock Squad has Mr RANDELL: The honourable member been downgraded. The Minister could have will have his chance later. The Government will put his teeth into all of those things, but he close the lines in the way that will do the least has not done so. 5 October 1993 4650 Legislative Assembly

There has been a downgrading of nearly public relations. They recognise more and every Government service in the bush. For more the facade that the Government is example, the DPI people have gone from the putting up. field—practical people who could make a Time is going very quickly. I draw great contribution to the productive areas of attention to the working conditions in this the State. Heaven knows, we need those House of the Opposition members, including productive sectors when we think of the the leaders of the opposition parties. Those welfare State that the ALP Government has conditions are certainly appalling. To me, they created. Stock inspectors have gone. are in breach of the workplace health and Following the outbreak of anthrax in safety standards. The Minister should consider Rockhampton, how long did it take to get that. Opposition staff are crowded into an people there? I do not blame the office with no windows, inadequate ventilation departmental officers there. I give them the and lighting, and no natural light, with highest praise for working under great computer and photocopying equipment difficulties. Horticulturists have gone. However, placed in corridors and tea rooms. The when one looks at the Budget, one sees that Government has established the wonderful the number of bureaucrats has increased. The EARC and CJC. What do they say? They say service has become top heavy with that conditions should be upgraded. The bureaucrats. Minister knows that those conditions should We receive less money for rural roads; be upgraded. The Government is being registration fees for rural transport have vindictive. Five Liberal staff are crowded into increased; and water charges for irrigation one small room with exposed electrical wiring have increased—all in productive areas. What and a generally cluttered working has the Minister’s committee done to relieve environment. Most of those people are public those imposts on rural communities? It has servants. They enjoy office facilities far inferior done absolutely nothing. That committee to those enjoyed by public servants in most could be disbanded and nobody would take other areas of the Government. But the any notice. I would like to think that the Government does nothing about that. It has Minister in his wisdom recognises the fact. I taken no notice of the recommendation of the wish that he would be a bit more aggressive in independent EARC—the holiest of the holy. certain areas. The Government is not interested in the I know that this is a Commonwealth difficulties being experienced by the matter, but post offices in rural towns have Opposition. It is interested only in ensuring been closed. We have a community mail bag. that its Ministers enjoy the privilege of palatial Land rental for pastoralists has increased 300 offices with 193 staff to service their needs. per cent—honourable members can ask Conditions for Opposition members are Howard Hobbs about it—and more in certain generally inadequate. Members would be cases. At a time of the worst drought in aware of the substantial role played by the Queensland, that is the sort of sympathy that secretaries at Parliament House. Each of we get from the ALP Government. Those those secretaries does work for at least 12 rental increases could be the last straw for members. Now their numbers are to be rural people. Some of them are hanging on by reduced—cut by half—and they will be placed their fingernails. That is happening in the in a pool. Where are the facilities to help productive areas, yet it does not seem to Opposition members? Government members concern the Government. should be aware of these problems. The latest is that coal taxes will increase, Mrs Woodgate: Only out of session. along with electricity charges. I recall, as the Mr RANDELL: Fair go! The work Minister will recall, when he as the Leader of performed by the secretary on our floor should the ALP Opposition led his party out of the be recognised. House in protest at the National Party Government’s introducing electricity Opposition members should be given equalisation schemes throughout Queensland decent working conditions and proper to make sure that country people had a fair assistance. At the moment, we are not getting go. The Minister recalls that. He should not try a fair go. Government members are all right. to tell me that the great committee that he They enjoy access to the bureaucracy and has set up is doing any good for rural people. ministerial staff, who write speeches for There is more to it than riding around on a Government members and assist in the public relations exercise and telling everyone preparation of parliamentary business. what a wonderful job the Government is Opposition members have no resources, other doing. People in the rural areas do not want than their hard-working electorate secretaries, Legislative Assembly 4651 5 October 1993 to call upon. It should be borne in mind that, The TEMPORARY CHAIRMAN: Order! I when staff and facilities at Parliament House have made my ruling. I ask the member to are reduced, it affects the Opposition more continue. than it does the Government. That is what this Mr RANDELL: Madam Chairman, if you proposal is all about—making things harder for are to gag me on this, I would just like to say the Opposition. I cite the example of the that, when I was the Minister for Works and Premier’s Department. The Premier has 500 Housing, I had a lot to do with the lifts in this staff, whose salaries average $51,000 a year. building, and I think that the present Minister That amounts to $25.5m in wages for the would, too. Premier and his staff, yet the Government wants to take away three secretaries from Mr LIVINGSTONE (Ipswich West) (3.23 Parliament House, all of whom assist p.m.): I rise in support of the Estimates of the members of this place immeasurably. Department of Administrative Services and Office of Rural Communities. The Committee The Office of the Cabinet has an has already heard from my colleague the Environment and Land-use Planning Unit, an honourable member for Kurwongbah about Economic Policy Unit, a Legal and the necessity for creating a business-driven Administrative Policy Unit, a Mabo Unit, a Ministry in the form of this department. I wish Social Policy Unit and a Women’s Policy Unit. I to refresh the memories of members opposite. point out the contrast between those I get sick and tired of hearing about how resources and the resources that are provided effective government was under the National to Opposition members. Party. Before I was elected to this place, I ran The TEMPORARY CHAIRMAN (Ms a chain of small businesses in Ipswich. If I had Power): Order! I have given the member for run those businesses like the National Party Mirani quite a lot of leeway in his speech, but ran the business affairs of the Queensland we are dealing with the Estimates of the Government, I would have gone broke. Deputy Premier and not those of the Premier. For example, when we came to office in The Estimates of the Premier’s Department 1989, the newly elected Minister, Ron were debated a fortnight ago. I ask the McLean, asked a number of questions. Firstly, member to confine his remarks to the portfolio he asked, “How many cars do we own?” He of the Deputy Premier. was told that the number was 10 000, but Mr RANDELL: Thank you, Madam further investigations revealed that we paid Chairman. I think that my remarks must be registration on 15 000 cars. He asked, “What getting under the skin of Government land does the Government own?” The answer members. I was pointing out the contrast was, “We do not know.” He asked, “What between the resources provided to the buildings are we renting?” The answer was, Opposition and those provided to Government “We do not know.” He asked, “How much rent members. I do not think that there is anything do we pay?” The answer was, “We do not wrong with that. However, Madam Chairman, know.” He asked, “What are the terms of the you have made a ruling which gags me, and I leases?” Again, no-one knew the answer to will have to abide by that ruling. that question. After 32 years in Government, I draw the attention of the Minister to a one can understand why members opposite real and very urgent need. Government are very sensitive, because their performance members should support me on this issue. I was absolutely pathetic. Just imagine if refer to the need for another lift in the anyone tried to run a business in that manner. Parliamentary Annexe. They would be out the back door quicker than one could say, “Alan Bond”. The TEMPORARY CHAIRMAN: Order! It is not appropriate to discuss the Parliamentary I am told that under the National Party Annexe in the Estimates for this department. system of vehicle management—or “mismanagement”, I should say—the Works Mr RANDELL: Madam Chairman, it Department bought and supplied the vehicles comes under the responsibility of the and the client departments did as they Department of Administrative Services. pleased with them. Apparently it was the case The TEMPORARY CHAIRMAN: Order! that a department would notify the Works The responsibilities of the Parliamentary Department that a certain vehicle required Service Commission are not within the domain replacement. The Works Department would of the Deputy Premier. I ask the member to carry out the necessary arrangements to confine his remarks to the responsibilities of ensure that a vehicle was ordered and paid the Deputy Premier. for, ready to be picked up. The client Mr RANDELL: I cannot believe that. department would then pick up the new car 5 October 1993 4652 Legislative Assembly and keep the old one until it suited that At the other end of the scale, we have department to return it. By that time, the old also improved the auctioning of vehicles. We car was in the same condition as St George have upgraded the Q-Fleet auction facility to was after playing the Broncos. make it a one-stop shop: buy the car, register However, the change of Government in it and drive it away. From speaking to people 1989 meant the end of the Stone Age and who have purchased cars in this way, I believe the beginning of the computer age in vehicle it to be a most effective way of buying a management. Just as most of us in this place vehicle. It is also worth noting that, in keeping who have graduated from slates to computers with the Government’s policy of have experienced difficulty, the development regionalisation, Q-Fleet has established of Q-Fleet has had its share of problems. disposable depots in regional centres. Also, However, I am happy to say that we have for the first time, Q-Fleet has set up client come a long way from the hopeless and advisory committees in regional Queensland ridiculous situation in which the State to improve its client relationship in those Government fleet found itself four years ago. areas. For example, four years ago, who would have Another success story worth commenting believed that the State Government could on is the Q-Fleet short-term hire service—a have boasted among its vehicle clients bodies service which takes into account the fact that such as shire councils? Who would have very often clients require the use of vehicles believed that the Q-Fleet workshop—which for only short to medium terms. This scheme under the Nationals was so dilapidated that it started off with just 25 vehicles and has, could not pass a Workplace Health and Safety because of its popularity, grown to a fleet of inspection—would be in a position to boast 125, with vehicles being hired out on average Suncorp preferred repairer status? for 90 per cent of their working life. I bet We have come a long way since we that many car hire companies wish that they grabbed the reins of power. Since 1 July could achieve similar returns. All in all, I 1992, exactly 4 447 orders for new vehicles believe that Q-Fleet deserves some praise. It have been placed. As at 30 June last, the took over a rundown FJ and, although it has fleet stood at 7 220. By the beginning of not yet turned it into a Caprice, it certainly has 1994, we expect that number to increase to achieved Commodore Calais status. over 8 600. Before we hear the bleats of the I turn now to the Q-Build Maintenance uninformed across the Chamber shouting and Operations unit of the department. For “more cars for public servants”—whom years, we have all been regaled with tales of members opposite seem to hate, judging by the inefficiency associated with the use of day their recent public remarks—I point out to the labour, or field staff, as they are known. It is Committee that Q-Fleet is growing because it my view that much of the reputation that is out there making its mark in the corporate workers in the old Works Department, and world. It is doing what all successful now Q-Build, have had to endure is ill- businesses do, that is, it is expanding. deserved. I want to put on record some of the Some members in this place may important advances made by Q-Fleet. Firstly, remember the purge of this work force in the the purchasing policy has become far more early 1970s carried out by the National and sensible. Most of the vehicles required by Liberal Parties when about 900 workers were Government employees are pretty well thrown onto the dole queue without any standard in design. Therefore, it makes sense redundancy packages. It was said then that that Q-Fleet should make the order of colour, they were inefficient and that private make and so on on the basis of the best deal enterprise could do the job better. Yet, that it can achieve. Obviously, there is a remarkably, the schools built by those workers greater opportunity to bulk buy under that still stand unmoved in my electorate as arrangement than if we went back to the days monuments to the skill of those tradespeople. of ordering “X” number of green Falcons and I know that the same will not be said about “X” number of blue Holdens. Already, the some of the jerry-built buildings let out to initiative is proving cost effective and it is tender to the paper bag mates of the National returning dividends. For example, in the last Party when the Bjelke-Petersen Government’s three months, two bulk-buying arrangements tendering system made the Russell Island have been organised. One deal, involving 300 land scandal look like an honest mistake. vehicles, saved the taxpayers $275,000, and My own experience with Q-Build the other, involving 150 vehicles, saved them Maintenance and Operations workers tells me $150,000. that it provides a great service to the taxpayer. Legislative Assembly 4653 5 October 1993

I well remember the way that this Government their parents chose the democratic right to was able to mobilise the work force at a vote Labor. moment’s notice to rebuild Charleville when it Having travelled around the State quite a was destroyed by the floods. When some bit, I can say without fear of contradiction that, vandal smashes into a school or burns a when I became the member for Ipswich West school down, those workers are on the job in December 1989, the schools in my within hours making it safe, cleaning up the electorate were among the worst provided for damage and restoring the facility. in the whole of Queensland. Thankfully, Tom One particular innovation of this Burns and his predecessor, Ron McLean, and Government in this area has been to provide Education Ministers Braddy and Comben a call-out maintenance service to schools. have taken the time to inspect schools in my Before we won Government, the Nationals electorate and have agreed with me. I can endorsed a system whereby urgent look back over the last four years with a sense maintenance often took weeks to attend to. It of pride and achievement in knowing that at is now the case that a tradesperson who is least learning conditions are improving for the multiskilled—I might add that the notion of children in Ipswich West. I acknowledge that multiskilling comes from a cooperative attitude we still have a long way to go in some to unionism from Labor Governments rather schools, but I can assure all concerned that than a confrontationist one by National and finally we have a Government that treats Liberal Party administrations—is equipped with school children equally, regardless of where enough gear and the autonomy to purchase they live or how their parents vote. I will ensure essentials to fix most problems straight away. that, while I am the member for Ipswich West, As I go around the schools in my electorate, I improvements to our school facilities will am constantly reminded by school continue. communities of the effectiveness of that A measure of this Government’s concern service. As one principal said to me, it is like for the decades for neglect of maintenance having a carpenter in the back cupboard. The under the previous National and Liberal Party school merely has to make a call to Q-Build Governments at State schools throughout and it is there. I understand also that the cost Queensland is that it was prepared to earmark is around $25 per hour. I defy anyone in this $60m from revenue obtained from the place to provide such an on-call service at increased tobacco licensing fee to address such a reasonable rate. that problem. In terms of the electorate of The member for Merrimac, who is not in Ipswich West, this scheme has enabled some the Chamber, commented that this $630,000 to be expended on addressing Government was pork-barrelling. I am amazed maintenance problems which have plagued that a member on the opposite side of the the schools in my electorate for years. Chamber could have the hide to talk about Mr Bredhauer: Long overdue. pork-barrelling. I have with me a document which members opposite would be sick of Mr LIVINGSTONE: I take the interjection. hearing about and seeing. I certainly was not It certainly is long overdue. In fact, every going to produce it today. However, after school in my electorate has benefited from hearing members opposite talking about pork- this program. Recently, for example, approval barrelling and, in particular, the members of was granted to relocate pottery kilns at Ipswich the Liberal Party saying that they are receiving State High School under this program, a job a bad deal, I must point out that this that should have been done years ago if document contains details of 292 jobs which those who now sit opposite had any were allocated, and the Liberal Party did not consideration for the welfare of students get one in all of Queensland. That was under attending that school. This program has also a National/Liberal Party Government. The created over 750 person weeks of work for Liberals and the Nationals were coalition unemployed building workers in the Ipswich mates, and the Liberals are wanting to jump area. I am proud to report that, as of today, back into bed with the Nationals. I do not 108 projects under this program have been understand how the Liberals can claim in this completed in my electorate, with just over 30 place that the Government is pork-barrelling more to be completed before the budgeted and that the Liberal Party is doing badly. For amount is expended. years in the coalition, Liberal members sat I give credit also to the Minister for his back, shut up and copped it sweet. What wisdom in agreeing to set aside $1.8m from hypocrites! The seat that I represent in this the School Refurbishment Program to address place is a typical example of the persecution the backlog of applications for subsidy under that school children had to suffer because the School Improvement Subsidy Scheme, 5 October 1993 4654 Legislative Assembly which, as honourable members would know, is those places that are sadly lacking in access administered by the Education Department. to Government services. I hope that the By releasing these funds, the Minister has speed of replacement of those services is enabled schools such as the Rosewood State faster in the future than it has been in the School, which have worked hard to raise the past. necessary half cost of playground equipment, I said that I would speak about rural to provide a safe playground environment for affairs. Firstly, I want to speak about a their children. syndrome that has been going on for many Finally, let me say that any department is years. I have been living in what is now the only as good as its Minister and workers. I Western Downs electorate and that part of believe that, in the bad old days of the Queensland all my life. I have taken a keen Nationals, the workers from all levels of this interest in what has happened in local industry department copped a lot of crow for the and the various towns. It must be agreed that inadequacy of leadership at a political level. there has been a long-term trend of fewer That is no longer the case. Earlier, the Minister people being involved in agriculture. The really mentioned that the PSMC has carried out an small towns are dying. Yet some regional evaluation of the management of this centres are growing. That is a general trend. department. I am interested in seeing what My memory goes back to pre-1957, when the PSMC had to say. I would also be there was a Labor Party Government in interested to hear what defence members Queensland. I remember going to a little place opposite have to offer for the disgraceful way called Brigalow when we delivered cattle. That in which they handled this area of town had a butcher shop, a cafe, a drapery responsibility when they were in Government store and a hardware store. But, today, it does in this State. not even have a butcher shop. It has one cafe Mr LITTLEPROUD (Western Downs) and a general store. That general trend is (3.38 p.m.): It is my intention in this debate to being multiplied hundreds of times across touch on a number of issues that relate to the Queensland. quality of life in rural Queensland and other Mr Burns: And across America, across matters that come under the control of the Canada. Deputy Premier. Before I do that, I table Mr LITTLEPROUD: There is a reason for documentation spoken about recently by the this general trend of small towns dropping off. member for Merrimac. That documentation Some are international reasons—whether it is contains figures detailing expenditure on the prices on commodity markets, trading blocs, ASD maintenance program. Because the protectionism or all sorts of other things that School Refurbishment Program has been affect us on an international scale. Some of bandied about this Chamber for some time, I the reasons are national. It depends on the table that documentation so that other Government of the day; how it organises its members can study it. tax policies; what sort of investment Earlier, the member for Kurwongbah saw opportunities exist; the amount of money fit to quote from the Western Star newspaper provided for roadworks in the State; the which is published out of Roma. She quoted provision of Government services; from an article in which I was speaking about Government charges; and allocations to road Government agent offices. I thought it systems. On the local scene, this trend can be pertinent that I should add to the comments affected by competition between retailers. already made. I was acknowledging that the Some people have more get-up-and-go and Deputy Premier himself had realised that it bigger businesses and can afford to work on was a mistake to close down all the Clerk of slimmer margins. All of those sorts of things the Court offices. The new way of delivering have added to the syndrome of small towns the same sort of Government services to the dying while some towns survive and even get people was through Government agent larger. offices. One of those agent offices is located It cannot be denied that the rate of loss at Miles, and I acknowledge that it does a changes. Sometimes it accelerates and good job. But the criticism that I was making sometimes it is held back a bit. Governments was that something like 63 offices were closed have a role to play in the rate of that loss; so, down and, to date, fewer than 20 have been too, have the weather and markets. But since reopened. The member for Kurwongbah said 1990, we have witnessed expensive funding that $375,000 has been allocated in this caused by the Federal Government’s year’s Budget to alleviate the problem. I do mismanagement of the economy. We have not believe that $375,000 will be enough to also experienced severe drought, although establish 50 offices across the State to service Legislative Assembly 4655 5 October 1993 no-one can be blamed for that. Together with they know that, down the track, there will be a decisions made by this State Government, all real crisis unless something happens. of those things impacting at once have put us I remind honourable members of into a very parlous situation, especially in rural comments made recently by Mr Mackenroth Queensland. I am particularly worried about when he spoke about the cost of infrastructure those sorts of things. of the ever-burgeoning and ever-growing I turn to water supply. I realise that this south-east part of Queensland. When one comes within the portfolio of the Minister for considers the enormous costs of building Primary Industries, but in the context of rural roads and providing electricity in that part of communities I want to talk about the viability Queensland, if we could redirect some of the of small country towns. In the far west of population growth of Queensland to some of Queensland, people depend on bore water in the provincial cities we would be doing a great the Great Artesian Basin. People in that favour not only to those people but also to region are not facing a water crisis at present. taxpayers in general. If we could assure But in the Darling Basin and along some of quality of life—and water is part of that—and the rivers on the Central Highlands, the small get people to relocate to those western areas, towns that rely on surface storage of water are they would find that it is a pretty good place in in a near-crisis situation. I refer to Jandowae, which to live. First of all, land is cheaper there. Kogan, Condamine, Miles, Chinchilla, Dulacca The quality of life in terms of rearing a family is and Brigalow—all small towns in my electorate often better, although one might miss out in and all dependent upon surface storage. terms of access to higher education. Some of those towns are already out of water. Mr Burns: Security is better. Others will be out of water by Christmas unless they receive relief rain. There are 3 000 or Mr LITTLEPROUD: All of those sorts of more people in Chinchilla. If the surface water things. If we could aim towards putting some supply runs out, they will have one hell of a sort of population growth back into those crisis on their hands. I pay tribute to the Murilla areas, that would be for the betterment of Shire Council, which is presently experiencing Queensland. At the moment, there is a enormous problems in trying to overcome a particular trend in that a particular class of surface water supply problem in Miles, people are relocating to those regions. I refer Condamine and Dulacca. One must ask: what to people who do not need jobs. Retirees are about the planning in the past? relocating from the southern States. Even some retirees from the coastal areas are Mr Campbell: What about it? prepared to relocate to towns that are within Mr LITTLEPROUD: That is exactly what I three or four hours’ drive of coastal cities. intend to address. Those people are not fools. Unemployed people are also relocating to They have made use of engineering studies. those areas. Unfortunately, some people saw When they design water storage, they work the chance to buy up land cheaply and divide out future usage. They also look at weather it into farmlets of 100 acres. People relocated patterns and storage capacities. We must from urban poverty to rural poverty. In some understand that that area is suffering from cases, they did it knowingly and are quite one of the worst-case scenarios ever. I do not happy. In other cases, they fooled themselves blame the people who established the water and got into one hell of a mess. storage facilities in the past. For example, I believe that if the Parliament of when it was built a few years ago the Queensland and the Government of Chinchilla weir was built to hold about three Queensland can think of ways in which we can years’ water supply. Things were going along make it more attractive for people who are still pretty well until we got into the worst-case in the productive sector of their lives to scenario. We cannot over-design to the extent relocate to some of those provincial towns, that we waste money. That would be just that would be for the benefit of those people throwing money away. But this Government in terms of lower costs. It would also benefit will have to keep an eye on what goes on, the taxpayers, because the Government unless that area receives relief rain. would not have to pay for the infrastructure. Contingency and emergency measures will have to be put in place. Towns further west Mr Bredhauer interjected. are all right. But there is no access to the Mr LITTLEPROUD: That was put in place, underground aquifer for those towns that are but that is only one of the answers. It is facing a crisis. All sorts of restrictions have interesting that the member for Cook should been placed on watering. People are even mention education, because that is the next exerting their own control measures to make matter that I want to talk about. The needs of sure that the water supply lasts longer. But education have increased over the years. 5 October 1993 4656 Legislative Assembly

Once upon a time, people were prepared to grown and not too far from where the cattle be educated only as far as scholarship level. are bred in the west and north-west of Since then, most people want to complete Queensland. It is an ideal place for those sorts their Junior and Senior levels of education. As of facilities. That is the change that is taking well, many people seek higher education— place. Fewer people are involved in looking either TAFE or tertiary education. By and after those sorts of things. Recently, I visited a large, Governments of the day have met that feedlot which has 5 000 cattle and a staff of demand, so much so that most children in only 10 to run it. Queensland have access to a secondary Mr Bredhauer: You look like you’ve put school education. In terms of tertiary on a bit of weight, too. education, an initiative of the Sherrin report was to create open learning centres where Mr LITTLEPROUD: I have, but some of it people have access to courses from is grain fed—cereal every morning. universities in Queensland. Those centres are That is a change that is occurring on the playing their role. It is not the complete land. It is a much more productive system, yet answer, but they are playing their role. fewer people are involved. To think that a To some degree, rural communities are feedlot of 5 000 head of cattle has only 10 making some inroads into TAFE. I believe that staff is an indication of the enormous change the Deputy Premier should exert some that has occurred in the use of land and the influence on the present Minister in charge of number of people involved. We have to be TAFE. Although he has spent enormous aware of that. However, the people who are amounts of money and increased the number going to remain on the land are going to need of TAFE places in Queensland, the allocation access to high-quality services, and we have of those places across the State is unfair. The to have the policies in place to make sure that Government is doubling the provision of TAFE they have the educational facilities and the places in the cities and leaving large, quality-of-life facilities to cater for them. provincial towns without any TAFE facilities. There has been debate in the Chamber Dalby is a good case in point. A total of about the railway lines. One thing that will 16 000 people live in that district, which has occur is a change in the grain markets. With access to another 20 000 people. However, so many thousands of head of cattle being only part-time TAFE facilities are available grain fattened in the grain-growing areas, the there. Mr Foley needs to be reminded that, grain industry will change from a although he has done a good job in predominantly export industry to an industry increasing the number of TAFE places, if the that sells most of its produce on the local allocation is to be undertaken on a fair basis it market. In some cases, the grain will be should be reconsidered. transported by rail. However, in many cases, In response to comments made by the the grain will be going straight from the farm to member for Kurwongbah, I shall talk about the end user by road. We now have all of Government agents. At the outset, I spoke those facilities in the country regions. When about the long-term trend in agriculture and there is a boom grain season, we will still be life in rural Queensland. I want to talk now able to receive the grain and export it. At the about the future and what I envisage same time, we have to maintain those silos. In happening in the Western Downs area, which fact, I think that they will be used for is well known for agriculture and livestock. warehousing. Grain will be kept in those silos Even though the number of people involved in until such time as end users can have access industries in that area is decreasing, the level to it, rather than the grain being left on the of productivity has increased enormously. farm. There have been tremendous changes Land has been cleared and ploughed. All in the bush, and there are going to be just as sorts of new pursuits are under way. I many changes to the way in which rural envisage enormous changes in that area of industries operate in the future. It is important which the Government must be made aware. that the Minister responsible for rural For example, in recent years the beef industry Queensland has a good understanding of has turned away from grass-fed beef towards those trends, and the needs and grain-fed beef, whereby cattle are held in requirements of rural Queensland. feedlots for 100 days or more to meet the very I know that the Minister has just come stringent requirements of overseas markets. It back from Canada and the USA. He probably is estimated that the number of cattle in had a look at the trends in those countries. He feedlots in Queensland will double by the turn made mention of the fact that small towns die of the century. Feedlots are being established in those countries, too. Perhaps we can learn in that part of Queensland where the grain is from that. Certainly, we have to make sure Legislative Assembly 4657 5 October 1993 that we supply the necessary quality-of-life this Government will be user friendly. They will facilities to the people in those areas. not be the hothouse-type buildings which were Mr Burns interjected. often the hallmark of those Governments which preceded this Government. The new Mr LITTLEPROUD: In concluding, I designs are more attuned to the climate, and reiterate that there is the potential for a real they are more in tune with local needs. crisis in the Western Downs region with regard to water storage. I notice that the Minister is This financial year will also see the indicating that he is well aware of that matter. continuation and completion of two major However, I want to emphasise that it is a most projects in the Brisbane metropolitan area. urgent matter and that it presents a more From Parliament House, we can see the new serious problem than many of the other State Government office building at 111 problems—for example, financial George Street and, to the south of us, the problems—that we are facing at present. Brisbane Convention and Exhibition Centre, which together will add $300m worth of Mr T. B. SULLIVAN (Chermside) construction to our State’s economy. Another (3.52 p.m.): In rising to support the Deputy project which will be completed this financial Premier in this Estimates debate, I wish to year is the office building in Rockhampton that make particular reference to the areas of will accommodate many of the State capital works and the School Refurbishment Government departments located in that city. Program. Both of these areas warrant a The Minister’s department is the project mention in this place because they represent manager for the construction of that building. a significant component of the Government’s As I understand it, when the National Party systematic attack on unemployment in this Government had control of the Treasury State. Unlike those who sit opposite, this purse, it was considering the construction of Government does understand that one of the that building. However, it seems that it best ways to create jobs is to fire up the abandoned the idea. I believe that some building industry. Even with the technological members of the Opposition might be able to advances of our modern world, the building explain the reason for that decision. I have industry remains a very significant source of heard that a couple of senior people in the employment generation with a very quick start- party in Rockhampton decided against it. It is up rate. It is for this reason that the a shame that the member for Keppel, Mr Government has put as many of its resources Lester, is not present. He may have been able as it can into this initiative in order to create to throw some light on the issue. jobs. Mr Bredhauer: He’s seldom here. The allocation in this Budget for capital works totals over $650m. This will result in Mr T. B. SULLIVAN: I know that. I am nearly 400 000 pay packets being distributed sure that the National Party’s opposition to this weekly throughout Queensland which, of centralising of Government departments in course, will generate employment in other one building had absolutely nothing to do with sectors of the Queensland economy. the fact that the National Party had previously Employment will be created not just in the been leasing a building in Quay Street, building industry but across other industries. Rockhampton, which it owned, to the This Government looks after the regional and Education Department for something like remote areas as well as the south-east corner. $100,000 a year. I know that that would not have been part of its thinking in opposing the Apart from the fact that they will create building. jobs, I point out that these construction projects will also serve to improve both the Mr Ardill: The same thing at Southport quality and quantity of the Government-owned and Burleigh. facilities in this State. I cite, for example, the Mr T. B. SULLIVAN: The same thing $30m worth of new and replacement schools happened at Southport and Burleigh, too. It is that have been generated by this year’s a pattern that had developed. Budget. As a former teacher, I take particular I turn now to Health. I note that almost interest in the quality of educational facilities. I $55m will be spent on capital works to improve have travelled through a number of areas in facilities offered by Queensland Health. Again, the State with the former Board of Teacher the Minister’s department has done a great Education and, recently, with the Public Works job of supervising and taking control of the Committee, and I have inspected hundreds of expenditure of those funds. Among these school buildings, both in the Government and redevelopments will be the Toowoomba non-Government sector. I can assure the nursing home. I trust that the members for Committee that the new schools to be built by Toowoomba North and Toowoomba South will 5 October 1993 4658 Legislative Assembly not be claiming any credit for this The Liberal and National Parties, when Government’s initiative because, as those of they occupied the Government side of the us who have been in this place even for a House, used to skite about the crane-led short time know, the former member for economy. They claimed that all was great in Toowoomba North, John Flynn, lobbied this low-tax State, yet the reality did not match consistently for this facility. their rhetoric. Their surreptitious increases in I now wish to turn to the School hidden taxes went unnoticed among the hype Refurbishment Program, which has been of their disgraceful waste of funds during the referred to by some other speakers. It appears boom years and their disregard of essential that the National and Liberal Parties, which service in a number of areas, especially were in Government for over 32 years, must education, health and policing. Fortunately, have thought that the educational institutions that has been redressed by this Government. of this State were some sort of hotbed of To correct the coalition legacy of waste, political intrigue or mental subversion. Why pork-barrelling and neglect, this Government else would they have put someone at the took a tough decision. It increased the helm such as Mr Lin Powell who, year after tobacco licence fee to raise extra funds, but year, denied even basic facilities such as unlike our predecessors there was no sleight photocopying to teachers in Queensland of hand or backroom deal to conceal the truth schools. Our predecessors refined the process from the electorate. The very day after the of poor attention to schools even further by election was announced the Premier told the singling out those schools in Labor electorates people of Queensland that the tobacco for special treatment. By that, I mean that if a licence fee would need to be increased. As school in a Labor electorate needed any well as that, he said that the result, the $150m attention, it was certain to be placed at the raised by the tobacco licence fee, would be bottom of the pile. I was amused by Mr spent on bringing our schools and hospitals Quinn’s comments, and I will come back to up to scratch. The Premier was up front, he those a little later in my speech. was honest, he was open, and, thankfully, the I remember when the QTU conducted an Queensland electors endorsed the Premier’s audit via its teachers throughout the State to $150m job creation and refurbishment plan see what resources were available in the and returned this Government. schools. One could tell by the list of resources It is pleasing to report that from that that were reported which schools were in program $60m was earmarked to upgrade National Party Ministers’ electorates, which schools and create employment. I have much schools were in National Party electorates and pleasure in stating that up to today some which schools were in Labor electorates. It $44m has been expended, which has resulted stood out like a sore thumb. In fact, one in some 52 000 weeks of employment for school principal from a Labor electorate told Queensland workers. Also, I would like to say me that, apart from Labor winning that, unlike the situation under the Liberals Government in 1989, his next best hope of and Nationals, the Government did not play getting anything done in his school was for favourites in the allocation of these funds. I some of the local vandals to burn it down so challenge any member of the Opposition to that he could start again. He said that it was rise in this place and tell the House how they the only way that he could get the former have been badly treated. The member for National Party Government to put any money Merrimac tried to do that before, and in a into the essential maintenance of his school. couple of minutes I will explain why he was so Fortunately, Queenslanders did get a far off the mark. In fact, we might now look at Labor Government in 1989, and subsequently some of the inane comments from the this Government increased education funding member for Merrimac. He said that Gold to start to address three decades of disregard Coast schools had 14 per cent of the for Queensland’s schools by our population, yet received only 9 per cent of the predecessors. However, even the record funding in this area. He did not state, but he Budgets that this Government has brought hinted, that his electorate should get more. down to try to combat the former neglect of Then he went on to say how other electorates education in this State were not enough to were favoured. He used Kedron as an address the reality of the dilapidated schools. example. Of course, that is the electorate of It was necessary to find extra money before the Minister for Education, Mr Comben. some schools literally fell down around the Let us look at some of the figures. In the students’ ears. School Refurbishment Program, Kedron, the electorate of the Minister, is getting just on $300,000 and the electorate of Merrimac, Mr Legislative Assembly 4659 5 October 1993

Quinn’s own electorate, is getting $356,000. are old, wooden schools. Because they had So even if we took—and this is not a good been neglected, they needed a lot of work. Of criterion—only the money spent—what Mr course, the more they were neglected, the Quinn said was wrong, dead wrong. Yet we more expensive it was to replace rotted have to consider the types of schools in these panelling and very poorly painted areas. Even areas. When reference is made to the post-war schools in my electorate such as maintenance and refurbishment, one has to Somerset Hills State School, Wavell State look at what needs to be maintained and High School, Craigslea State School and refurbished. The majority of the schools in Mr Craigslea State High School had been Quinn’s electorate are nowhere near the age desperately crying out for maintenance and of the high maintenance buildings of the refurbishment money for some years. inner-city Brisbane schools and some of our Fortunately, under Minister Tom Burns that other regional centres. So when one looks at money has started to become available and the high maintenance timber buildings in through the very brave decision to increase schools that are 50 to 100 years old, of course the tobacco licensing fee, some of that money much more has to be spent on maintenance has become available. and refurbishment, especially when no money The job is not yet finished. It was a has been spent over the past 30 years. So massive task. I believe that the refurbishment when one looks at needs of each of the backlog was something like $120m, but electorates, a lot more should be spent in through the work of this Minister a lot of that some of the older schools in inner-city backlog has been eliminated. By the end of electorates. Mr Quinn is wrong on that count, the program, over $420,000, creating about just as he is wrong on the figures. I am not 500 weeks of employment, will have been sorry to say that with him as the Opposition spent in my electorate on very necessary spokesperson, I can see why some of the projects that should have been carried out coalition are settling in for a very long stay in years ago. I can assure the good people of the Opposition benches. Chermside that I will continue to fight the good Apart from the obvious improvement that fight for decent classroom facilities for their this Government’s program has brought to our children as long as I continue to be their schools, there is another more human side to member. the program. In talking to some colleagues, I I wish to place on record my thanks to the have heard of examples such as the first ever Minister for his hands-on approach to carpet-laying apprentice from central administering this program. It is reassuring, to Queensland being indentured to a Gladstone say the least, that we have got a Minister who firm as the result of the increased business regularly visits schools and monitors the that resulted specifically from this program. program. I invite him to drop into schools in There is the contractor who would have left my area whenever he is on the road. Blackall due to lack of work, which would have Fortunately, with Gympie Road and Sandgate deprived the area of his services, had not it Road running through my electorate, the been for a second chance given to him by the Minister has, on more than one occasion, refurbishment work from this scheme. Then made arrangements to drop into schools in there is the painter from the Wide Bay area my electorate. He has been well received, and who had been unemployed for months. He I am thankful for his interest. told his local member he had given up hope of ever getting back into his trade. Having Finally, I would like to place on record my heard about the refurbishment program, he thanks to the administration and field staff of started bidding for jobs and he is now one of Q-Build metropolitan east region for their the best painters we have working on this excellent work under difficult circumstances. program in the area. That is the sort of work They have a difficult job trying to match up the that can result when the Government is jobs, trying to get the ordering done and the prepared to put money into the maintenance supplies to arrive on time. I have some and refurbishment of essential facilities. understanding of that task, having had dealings with some of the officers. They are I am pleased to report that my electorate doing excellent work. I support these of Chermside has received its fair share of Estimates. I commend the Minister’s work to funding from the program, with almost the Parliament. $240,000 being spent since the program began. Schools such as Virginia, Stafford Time expired. Heights, Chermside and Wavell Heights were Mr ROWELL (Hinchinbrook) (4.08 p.m.): I grossly underfunded for maintenance by the am pleased to join this debate on the Liberal and National Party Governments. They Estimates of the portfolio of Administrative 5 October 1993 4660 Legislative Assembly

Services and Rural Communities. I think it is we tried to assist the graziers with cane tops quite important that I acknowledge a few and trash. That was of mutual benefit. things that have been done in my area as far Unfortunately, we had some adverse publicity as Administrative Services is concerned. from the officers of the Department of Primary Initially, there was a great deal of support from Industries. I want to place on record that they the Department of Administrative Services and said on the radio that what we were trying to certainly the Education Department when do had little or no benefit in terms of there was an attempt to remove the old feedstock, despite the fact that they were well Mission Beach school building from Mission aware that supplementary feeding in terms of Beach. As a result, the consultative committee the cane tops and trash would be of benefit. for cassowaries and the Mission Beach Mr T. B. Sullivan: What’s that got to do Progress and Development Association will be with Admin. Services? providing an interpretative centre, which I think will do great work in the Mission Beach area. I Mr ROWELL: We are talking about the had some dealings with the Administrative difficult circumstances in rural communities Services Department on this issue, and while I from time to time. Unless one lives under was sorting out prices and so on, I have to say those conditions, one would not appreciate that I received a great deal of assistance from some of the adverse conditions that they face. the Minister’s department, which allowed that Our sugar industry is fairly buoyant now. The building to be transferred into the names of value of the dollar is down. Although prices the trustees, particularly the Johnstone Shire are not fantastic, they are quite reasonable. Council. The banana industry is worth about Of course, we have seen some major $200m. The sustainability of those rural changes to the Department of Administrative industries is very important. From time to time, Services. We have seen a major blow-out in we are very dependent on the Primary its budget. I do not think that my electorate Industries Department to provide advice. The has received any significant support from rural industries and communities that are so Administrative Services except for the minor dependent on agriculture for their future must repairs that were required at schools and have back-up support. I am sure that the hospitals. But generally—— Minister is well aware of the need to not reduce staff levels in the Department of Mr McElligott: You’ve got a new hospital. Primary Industries but to enhance them and Mr ROWELL: That is right, or part of a provide facilities such as the Wet Tropics new hospital, anyway. I would like to research station that has been proposed at acknowledge the presence in the Chamber of Innisfail. That station has the ability to absorb a former Minister, who worked very hard after many of the problems that could be faced by deciding not to provide a new hospital for the rural communities in my part of the world. Ingham region. In the Bloomfield area, a major outbreak Mr McElligott: Never. of black sigatoka has occurred. The member Mr ROWELL: How we got it does not for Cook is in the Chamber. I am sure that he matter. We got the blasted thing, and that is also is quite concerned about it. What that important. I would like to speak about disease could do to a rural community right another matter in the Estimates debate. I through to the northern area is a major have heard from members of the Opposition concern. I have written to the Minister for about problems being experienced by Primary Industries requesting that he give communities in the western regions. I maximum support to that industry to eradicate sympathise with the problems caused by the black sigatoka. If that is not done, the $200m drought and by the number of people who are industry could collapse. The quarantine leaving those areas. I am sure that that is of aspects are also very important. I do not know particular interest to the Minister. In recent how those bananas arrived there. Bananas times, depressed wool prices and bad with those types of diseases are not supposed droughts and floods have created conditions to be brought into Australia. under which it is almost intolerable for people An honourable member interjected. to live. I can understand their exasperation Mr ROWELL: The major banana-growing with their problems. I live in an area that is countries in the world are faced with that very progressive in terms of agriculture and problem. It is one of the reasons that we have certainly has the ability, under most seasonal been able to keep banana imports out of conditions, to survive pretty well. Queensland and out of Australia in general. The Hinchinbrook electorate is very Our rural communities are very, very dependent on the sugar industry. Recently, dependent upon agricultural pursuits. I am Legislative Assembly 4661 5 October 1993 sure that the Minister would take into account Madam TEMPORARY CHAIRMAN: anything adverse to them. Ambulance services are not the responsibility Tourism is another form of diversification of the Deputy Premier at all. for those rural communities. In my part of the Mr ROWELL: Yes, but if the Department world, we have some marvellous places where of Administrative Services does work on we could look at tourism industries. We need schools, hospitals and that sort of thing, it is the infrastructure such as boat ramps to probably quite important that I talk about it, enable access to the open seas so that with your indulgence. tourists can get out to the coral reefs and Madam TEMPORARY CHAIRMAN: No. I islands. Those things are very important for am telling the honourable member that the rural communities. I am sure that the Minister Ambulance Service is the responsibility of the is well acquainted with Dungeness. The mouth Minister for Police and Emergency Services. of the river is blocking up. Access to the open sea is causing concern. That region has a lot Mr ROWELL: What about schools? Can I of potential for our rural community. Gaining talk about schools? access to the sea for fishing is a matter of Madam TEMPORARY CHAIRMAN: In the concern. areas for which the Deputy Premier is Job opportunities are a major issue that responsible. must be considered. We face a downturn in Mr ROWELL: I can talk about schools. opportunities for people throughout rural Quite a bit of concern has been expressed communities. We must turn that around. I about the upheaval in schools. It is important heard the member for Western Downs speak that a good maintenance program is provided about the necessity for training colleges and for schools. more updating in the form of further Mr Veivers interjected. education. Rather than going to the regional levels, we will lose a lot of our most talented Madam TEMPORARY CHAIRMAN: and young people from those communities. Order! I warn the member for Southport that I That is a major concern to me. The only jobs will not have my rulings taken lightly. I have that are available in those communities made my ruling to the member for involve rural pursuits. Hinchinbrook. I ask him to continue and observe that warning. In rural communities, land rents are a major problem to many people. Those rents Mr ROWELL: I would like to raise with the have increased substantially. There has been Deputy Premier a matter about which I was recategorisation of land rents. If that quite concerned, and that is the Rural continues, many people will find it very difficult Communities Policy Committee that came to to survive. I do not believe that regionalisation Hinchinbrook some time back. The committee has benefited my electorate. The Ambulance informed me that it was coming. I thought that Service is copping a high degree of flak it was appropriate that I attend its meeting because—— and listen to what the committee had to say. When I arrived, police, ambulance officers, fire Madam TEMPORARY CHAIRMAN (Ms brigade officers and people from schools were Power): Order! I remind the member for there. They were all very concerned about the Hinchinbrook, as I reminded the member for direction of the Government’s policies. Mirani, that the Deputy Premier is in charge of Rural Communities. He is not responsible for I sat there listening, without a word to all areas of rural policy. I ask the honourable say. After a very short period, I was told to member to contain his remarks to the area of leave. I thought that was an utter disgrace. I Rural Communities, not policy areas for which thought that was terrible. There I was, the other Ministers are responsible and which will member for Hinchinbrook, witnessing people be covered in the debate on their Estimates. from various Government departments—some of them were from the police department, Mr ROWELL: Could you give me a ruling some were from fire brigades—all listening to on what constitutes Rural Communities? the Rural Communities Policy Committee. Madam TEMPORARY CHAIRMAN: That is where I link up the importance of Regionalisation does not constitute a transport and railways. responsibility of the Deputy Premier. Mr Veivers: You weren’t allowed to stay. Mr ROWELL: We will talk about Mr ROWELL: No. They told me that I rationalisation in rural communities, then. We would have to leave. I was taken aback by are looking at ambulance services, that. I thought that it was an absolute hospitals—— disgrace. Just imagine a person who 5 October 1993 4662 Legislative Assembly represents a rural electorate going along to program is provided. This includes financial meet the rural communities policy unit and not and project status reporting on an as-required being allowed to even say a word. I had to or on a monthly basis. Further to this, these leave. I was absolutely stunned that a program guidelines are provided to clients, Government that is supposed to be open, and this is backed up with central and regional accountable and honest would not allow me familiarisation sessions so that clients are fully to listen to what those departmental officers cognisant of operational procedures of asset had to say. maintenance. Mr Veivers: You were an elected The responsibility for asset maintenance member and you weren’t allowed to stay. falls within the charter given to the Mr ROWELL: That is quite surprising. maintenance and operations business unit. It Would one expect that from the Government? is this section which I regard as the most Would one expect that of people who visible of this department’s activities. It is from represent an honest, open and accountable this business unit that field staff are employed Government? They were the facts. I was and, on any given day, honourable members stunned by that. I turn now to the problems will find those workers repairing, replacing and associated with railways. refurbishing Government buildings throughout the State. It is pleasing to note that, at a time Mr Veivers: Did you appeal to Mr Robert when the building industry is shying away from Schwarten? providing apprenticeships, this department Mr ROWELL: No, I did not appeal to him has indentured 90 apprentices to bring the at that time. I want to refer to railways during total number of apprenticeships offered to the very short period that I have left. I have 352, therefore making this department the had several interjections, and I do not want to largest trainer of apprentices in Australia. get caught up with any more. A substantial Since our election, this department has problem exists with railways right throughout gone out of its way to promote Queensland. I am aware that the Deputy apprenticeships to women. Regrettably, at this Premier is considering the problem. Although stage, the department has been able to there have not been any railway line closures entice only four women to take up the offer. in the Hinchinbrook electorate, I am well aware Nevertheless, it is a start. I feel certain that, that the area will probably lose at least 22 with the current focus on gender equity shunters, porters and locomotive drivers. Last programs in our schools, that figure will year, we saw the loss of almost 40 members continue to climb as more and more women of fettling gangs, and any further losses will realise that a trade is a career option. only compound the problem. Another responsibility of the business unit Time expired. is the strategic management of the problem Mr NUTTALL (Sandgate) (4.23 p.m.): In associated with asbestos in Government supporting the Estimates before the buildings. It is not my intention to labour the Committee, I wish to firstly address the issue point, except to say that this complex problem of the responsibility of the Administrative is being attended to by this department. I also Services Department for carrying out note with interest the commitment that the maintenance on Government building assets. business unit has to training its workers. A This year, over $81m will be made available to training and development strategy has been this department for what is termed the Asset developed right across the department and, Maintenance Program. Basically, this is a following on from this, a training plan has program designed to ensure that our building been implemented within maintenance and assets do not become liabilities for future operations to enhance the personal and generations. The sad truth is that, if the professional development of staff employed Liberals/Nationals had paid more attention to by the business unit. this aspect, we would not need to be raising I also note this department’s commitment funding for initiatives such as the School to the very fundamental principle of improved Refurbishment Program, which is designed to workplace health and safety, with the resultant address the neglect which characterised the injury rate falling quite considerably. Most coalition’s approach to maintenance in this particularly, I mention the efforts of the Burnett State. regional office, which has achieved in excess Other speakers have made mention of of a 284 000 day injury-free record. Workers the fact that the focus of this department is there were awarded this Minister’s safety providing services to clients and, in keeping award for excellence, as well as the National with this, a total maintenance management Safety Council of Australia’s award of merit. Legislative Assembly 4663 5 October 1993

To be consistent I, too, pass comment on Firstly, I wish to personally thank the Minister, the $60m School Refurbishment Program. Tom Burns, for his willingness to give of his The simple facts are that the schools within precious time to visit the schools within my my electorate were allowed to be run down to electorate. I know that I speak for the entire the extent that they were at Third World Sandgate school community when I say to the standards. Other Government speakers have Minister that his efforts are very much drawn attention to the disgraceful persecution appreciated. of school children in Labor electorates such as Secondly, I thank the Metropolitan East mine. However, I intend to make further regional manager, Gordon Gillam, and his mention of this outrageous practice, because I staff for their untiring efforts in making the want to make sure that the Nationals and the School Refurbishment Program the success Liberals, who now profess fairness, are not story it is within my electorate. I know the allowed to forget that damnable sin against attitude of those opposite to unemployed innocent children. people. They regard them as dole bludgers The facts are these: my predecessor, Nev and second-rate citizens. But let me say that Warburton, was relentless in his pursuit of there is nothing second rate about the work corruption in the National Party State that these people have performed under the Government, and his stand was vindicated by School Refurbishment Program. I support the the Fitzgerald report. The National Party in Estimates before the Committee. turn pursued Mr Warburton, firstly by using the Mr STEPHAN (Gympie) (4.31 p.m.): It is public purse to fund unsubstantiated claims of with much pleasure that I join in this Estimates defamation with the intention of rendering him debate. For many years, the debate on the destitute. How sweet it was that, when Bjelke- Estimates of this department has been a Petersen fell from grace and could not fund good news story. However, after hearing the action, he actually had to pay Nev Government members, I am not sure that that Warburton’s considerable legal costs. is the case. Mr Bredhauer interjected. Mr Laming: Soon to be in Opposition. Mr NUTTALL: He has photocopied and Mr STEPHAN: That is right. The member framed that cheque. for Albert seemed to be confused about what The second strategy was to starve the is occurring. He was confused about a school Sandgate electorate of its rightful share of the which was in the electorate of a former tax dollar. When we won Government in 1989, National Party Minister. We have heard on the state of public facilities and services in my many occasions complaints from Government electorate was nothing short of pitiful. Since members about how the National Party then, this Government has slowly but surely treated schools which were in electorates of beavered away at providing the good electors Government members, and especially those of Sandgate with decent public facilities, such of Ministers. However, the member for Albert as a state-of-the-art police station and watch- stated that a school that had been house which are currently being constructed; a represented by a former National Party new bus/rail interchange which is to be Minister had been waiting for 15 years for work constructed; new roadworks for the Gateway to be carried out on a covered area. Arterial Road and the Deagon deviation road; Government members should get their story increased public housing; and other various straight. On the one hand, they say that improvements to public buildings. schools were looked after well by the former Although school improvements Government if they were in the electorate of a skyrocketed in Sandgate thanks to this member or Minister but, on the other hand, Government’s equitable treatment, it was still the member for Albert has claimed that the not enough. When I picked up the reins from opposite is the case. Nev last year, the schools in my electorate As well, the member for Albert was were still quite shabby. However, thanks to the confused about the water storage area in his School Refurbishment Program, all of my electorate. It is well known that, leading up to schools are now looking like educational the 1989 election, the siting of the Wolffdene establishments of the twentieth century rather dam was a big issue. We could be excused than something that could easily have formed for thinking that, as far as this Government is the backdrop for a drama production from concerned, the Wolffdene dam would never Dickens. raise its head again—but that is not the case. I place on record my appreciation to Mr Lingard: It was an absolute promise. another group of people who have caused the improvements which I have outlined to occur. 5 October 1993 4664 Legislative Assembly

Mr STEPHAN: That is right. It was a “Promoted effective change promise that the Government gave, and one processes for Government service which we thought that it should keep forever. delivery through implementation of the Now we find that it is not going to call it a dam; Guidelines for Withdrawal or Reduction of it will be a big weir. Services in Rural Communities . . .” Mr Lingard: Wolffdene weir. The Government should hang its head in Mr STEPHAN: The Government has shame for wishing to withdraw or reduce changed its mind on the way it is going. It is services in any community, let alone the rural no wonder that the member for Albert is community which has given so much to the confused, because the Government is also State in many respects, whether it be along confused. This indicates the change in the coast or inland, and whether it be in cattle, attitude that occurs within the Government sheep, fruit and vegetables, cane, and so on. from time to time. The Government is proud that it was able to put in place guidelines for withdrawal or At this stage, I compliment many of the reduction of services in rural communities. I departmental officers under this portfolio, hope that next year, if the Minister is still in particularly those in Q-Build. Recently, I had office, he will be able to claim that he has built the opportunity to accompany Mr Bob Hunn up or maintained the services that are through the schools in my electorate. The supplied and has made sure that those who School Refurbishment Program was a live in the remote areas of the State have successful program. An allocation of funds been given encouragement and support by was made to schools and we visited them to the Government. I wait with great expectation determine whether the funds had been to see what his attitude will be in the next 12 allocated according to the priorities that the months. schools set. When the principals were asked about the top priority, in some instances they Another achievement claimed by the said, “No, that building was painted two or department was that it identified opportunities three years ago. We do not want that painted for Government to improve its marketing and again. We will spend it somewhere else.” That communication in rural and remote program introduced by the Minister was well communities. Again, I question where the appreciated by the schools, by the citizens marketing programs have been put in place. I and by me as the local member. question what the Minister has done to assist those in remote communities. At this stage, I thank Q-Build and the officers of the Parliamentary Service who Yet another achievement claimed by the assisted in moving the office of the member department was that it— for Gympie in a short time. I received notice “Examined the needs of specific from my landlord that I had four or five weeks groups in rural communities; and to vacate the premises. I thank those officers Provision of policy advice on the whole of for the speed with which they were able to Government impacts of structural effect the transfer of my office. adjustment and drought.” There are other aspects of the Minister’s The Minister had the opportunity in the last 12 department that need scrutiny. Under the months to ascertain what was required to heading “Office of Rural Communities” in the alleviate the problem of drought, yet we have Program Statements in the Budget papers, not seen any program of assistance and we see “Performance 1992-93”. Under that encouragement to people in that heading appears the statement— predicament. In the past, money has been set “During the year, this program aside in good times for drought relief so that it achieved the following: can be used in times of need. That would assist to encourage people in difficult Assisted Government Departments circumstances. develop appropriate strategies and programs for implementing effective The annual report of the Minister’s and efficient services in rural department makes the following comment— communities . . .” “. . . working closely with the Transport I have not found that we have effective and Department to find ways of improving efficient services in my electorate or in other public transport in and between rural rural parts of Queensland. The opposite is centres . . .” often the case. This Government initially decided that one- In the next paragraph, the Minister’s third of railways in Queensland would cease program states that it— operation. Hopefully, the Government will Legislative Assembly 4665 5 October 1993 have a close look at every one of those lines I wrote a letter about this matter to the to ensure that they are kept on line and Minister, Mr Casey. About five or six weeks continue to provide a service to the later, I received a reply from the Minister’s communities that they have helped to office. The letter, which was signed by one of develop. the Minister’s departmental officers, stated— The annual report also talks about— “The Honourable E. D. Casey, MLA, “. . . initiating collaboration between the Minister for Primary Industries, in his Lands Department and the Corrective absence overseas, has asked me to reply Services Commission to control the to your representation on behalf of the spread of noxious weeds in rural and Sub-Tropical Seedgrowers Association remote areas.” . . . ” That is a step in the right direction. But this That letter was dated 1 October. The Minister Government is not tackling the problem of the returned a day or two after that, and it is a pity spread of noxious and problem weeds that that he did not sign that letter which was being flourish throughout dry seasons and during sent to a member of Parliament. The letter good weather. stated further— Mr Beattie: You are a world expert on “The area of research to which you weeds. refer has been closely examined by officers of the Department. They have Mr STEPHAN: No. But there are a lot of advised me that, while the identification noxious objectors in close proximity to me. of that particular weed species is of Queensland has a great number of noxious importance, given the limited resources weeds. A State Government coordinating available for rural research, it is not an group has been set up to tackle the serious area of which can continue to be funded threat to pastoral and subtropical Queensland solely by the government. of Giant Rats Tail Grass. A member of the relevant local authority has been chosen to Government funding for this research represent the Local Government Association work has been withdrawn.” on that coordinating group. The council has That is the pity of it all. It states further— donated $1,000 towards research on the “However, the opportunity is available elimination of that particular weed and has for the industries involved, particularly resolved to investigate the establishment of a those which benefit directly from the reserve fund with that money. research, to provide funds for its The Sub-Tropical Seedgrowers continuation. In addition to the rural Association hoped to get some support for research funding bodies, organisations that research from the Minister for Primary such as the Sub-Tropical Seedgrowers Industries. It wrote to him on 26 August and Association, the Seed Industry stated— Association of Australia, and the local “It is of great concern to members of authorities in the area concerned, all of my Association that the above work”— which could be considered to benefit from the research, have already been that is, DPI research to identify seeds of Giant approached for contributions in this Rats Tail Grass— regard.” “has reportedly been classified as ‘Low They have already started to make Priority’ by DPI and that Miss Alison contributions. It is a pity that, under these Vieritz (Agribusiness Group—Standards) sorts of conditions, money cannot be made is to be redeployed, despite making available to encourage those industries, considerable progress with her work on individuals and organisations that have been this important problem. helping themselves and helping this great . . . State to develop. Due to its rapid spread, Giant Rats Mr Beattie: What have you done about Tail Grass has become a major weed, lantana? affecting rural producers and local Mr STEPHAN: Lantana is not spreading authorities from Far North Queensland to as much as Giant Rats Tail Grass. Lantana is the NSW border. A successful conclusion still a problem in the northern part of to Miss Vieritz’s research on seed Queensland, too. But it is not a high priority as identification is vital to the fight against a noxious or dangerous weed. this menace and to curtail its future spread.” Time expired. 5 October 1993 4666 Legislative Assembly

Mr CAMPBELL (Bundaberg) (4.46 p.m.): learning system, many people in country It is with much pleasure that I join this areas are now able to network with other open Estimates debate. I listened with interest to learning centres to undertake tertiary what the members for Western Downs, education while still living in those small Hinchinbrook and Gympie had to say about communities. That extra service is being rural communities. What concerns me is that, provided, and this Government should be as time changes, there is a need for a change recognised for the services that it is providing. in services to rural industries and rural Many members have talked about school communities. This must be accepted and maintenance. I believe that this Government understood. I believe that there are areas in is being recognised for what it is doing in which the service to our rural communities has terms of school maintenance. We should be increased and been improved to a level of appreciated for that. Much of the school which this Government can be proud. maintenance that this Government has had to I intend to speak about rural health, do was catch-up work that the previous especially women’s health. The initiatives that Government did not undertake on schools in have been implemented for rural women have Labor electorates. For example, in 1965, been outstanding. As a Government, we can under the National Party the Works be proud of that. However, those services are Department built over two tennis courts at the not recognised by the members of Parliament Bundaberg High School. It said that, when it who represent those areas. It disappoints me built over those tennis courts, they would be to think that representatives of those rural replaced. Those school tennis courts were not communities do not appreciate and replaced until two years ago by this understand the needs of rural women and the Government. Year after year, the P & C way that this Government has been able to committee would request, “Please give us meet those needs. back those tennis courts”, but the National The other sector of need that has been Party refused to do so. It did not recognise the taken advantage of in rural areas is housing. P & C committee and its needs. It was not Various towns and cities in rural areas of until the Labor Party returned to Government Queensland never had public housing that it picked up the tab to replace those provided until this Government came to office. tennis courts. Throughout Queensland, this This Government provided that extra service. Government has had to fix those things that were not done by the previous Government. Mr Bredhauer: Through the Minister. I also want to thank the Minister for the Mr CAMPBELL: Through this Minister. replacement of the West Bundaberg State The member for Western Downs spoke about School swimming pool. That was built back in rural water supplies. Which Government, for 1946 by the parents of the children who the first time in decades, introduced a small attended the West Bundaberg State School. country towns rural water supply scheme? It It has now been replaced. For years and was this Government and no other years, that project had been put off. The Government—not the National Party. It was previous Government knew that the pool had the Labor Government that recognised the to be replaced because it was over 40 years real service needs of those communities and old, but it was not until this Government came met them. to power that it was replaced. I advise We must realise that services and needs honourable members that I shall be opening change. Every time that we put more money that pool in two weeks’ time. into a new road to make shorter travelling I also recognise the Q-Build workers in times between some cities, we reduce the Bundaberg and the surrounding region. They needs in some of the smaller towns because do a great job. I believe that when public people are bypassing those towns. The same servants do a good job, they should receive applies to refrigeration. At one time, a little not only the public’s appreciation but also that shop had the only refrigeration in an entire of other Government departments. I have to district. Now, every home has its own electricity say that from reading the report—and this is and refrigeration. So those needs are something that gave me a great deal of changing. As well, the number of rural workers pleasure—one can see that the Minister came is being reduced through technology. Once through and was able to make a presentation again, there is a reduced need for some to the Burnett regional office for achieving a services. We must be prepared to recognise continuous record of 284 848 work hours free the needs of rural communities. In some of time lost owing to injury. It was a great areas services are improving, for example, in achievement for those workers not to have relation to education. Through the open one accident. That is a testimony to the Legislative Assembly 4667 5 October 1993 workplace health and safety initiatives which Government projects, they get paid for that have been put in place by this Government work. and which have been adopted by the ordinary It is good to know that on 28 June 1993, workers. This resulted in the staff at the Cabinet made a decision to give greater Burnett regional office being awarded the security of payment by the use of Australian inaugural Minister of Administrative Services Standard 2124, Major Traditional Building Safety Award of Excellence and the National Construction in the Public Sector. That will Safety Council of Australia Award of Merit. mean a greater measure of security of That was in recognition not only of their work payment to subcontractors working in the but also the quality of their work. public building construction industry. Cabinet Bundaberg has the first TAFE college approved the incorporation of initiatives within child-care centre to be opened in Queensland. the State Purchasing Policy, thereby I have to say that the work that Q-Build carried extending their use across the whole of out on that project was superb. The job went Government, and ordered that the Director- out to private tender, and it was stuffed up. General of the Administrative Services Who did the Government get to clean up Department be charged with the responsibility some work that was not done properly by of administering the contract conditions. outside contractors? Q-Build! And it did a It is important to note that that decision good job. Nine apprentices were employed on has been taken across the whole of that job. It was completed under budget and Government. In summary, the contractual the quality of work was really superb. I provisions for security of payment of congratulate those workers on the quality of contractors will mean that the normal security the work that they carried out on that TAFE payment—to be in the form of cash or a bank child-care centre. That project also gave those guarantee—will be available to satisfy nine apprentices a chance to learn. I wish to subcontractors’ charges after claims of the congratulate the Minister on now having 352 principal are satisfied. This overcomes the apprentices employed by the department. I legal difficulties with a bank guarantee. Often, also congratulate Mr McLean, the previous although there was a bank guarantee, Administrative Services Minister, who started subcontractors could not get that money. In off the great work. It is the largest Government addition to that, there is the requirement of an department in Australia employing additional security of 5 per cent of the contract apprentices. sum, which will be available to satisfy I would like to bring to the notice of subcontractors’ charges as a first preference. members on both sides that, over many Alternatively, the contractor may set up a years, members have complained about work retention trust fund in respect of security and that was done on Government contracts for other retention moneys held against the which subcontractors and suppliers were not subcontractor. Except for minor capital works, paid. It happened again and again. I subcontracts will be required to be in the form remember that many good suppliers and of Australian Standard 2545, Subcontract subcontractors who worked on the Conditions. In other words, the Government is construction of buildings such as TAFE going out of its way to make certain that colleges and schools never received payment. subcontractors and suppliers do get paid. Time and again, members said that that was The next step is the proof of payment wrong; that when work was done for the clauses, which provide for, firstly, a Government, all the people who were involved subcontractor payment recording system and, should get paid. I congratulate this Minister on secondly, notification to the principal of any implementing a system that will give greater subcontractor who has not executed a record security of payment to subcontractors. That is of payment form. In such instance, the something that needed to be done decades notification by the principal—that is, the ago. It was not until the work done by this Government or the department—to the Minister and by this Government that we could subcontractors of the relevant progress say that something has been done that has payment to the head contractor would enable really helped the small-business person. If a subcontractor, if he or she so chooses, to members want to know how to help small- take action under the Subcontractors Charges business people or how to help a small Act. In other cases, we are making certain that contractor, I can tell them that it is to make the subcontractor now understands when the certain that they get paid. It is important that if payments are being made to the principal they do work, they get paid for that work. We contractor. At the time of progress claims, must ensure that when people work on statutory declarations are to be provided by the principal, upon request, that all 5 October 1993 4668 Legislative Assembly subcontractors and workers have been paid all amount of electricity. The one at Goondiwindi moneys due and payable to them. As a safety was perfectly prepared to give that sort of net, there is a default provision in the event of guarantee. Obviously such a large piggery the failure to comply with the foregoing would require a very large amount of energy requirements. These conditions will take effect to keep the farrowing sheds warm in winter for all of the Administrative Services and cool in summer, for lighting and for the Department’s contracts after 1 July 1993, and running of grinding mills for mixing feeds and the State Purchasing Policy requires all so on. Unfortunately, the North West County agencies to use the new contract conditions Council took the attitude that it would require a from 1 October 1993. capital contribution, and the grazing operation I congratulate the Minister on taking this which is putting in this piggery had to spend initiative, because it is one that has been something like $26,000 of its own money called for not only by members of the when it was tremendously short of cash Government but also by members of the because of the droughts and other problems Opposition. When Labor members were in in that area, as the Minister would know. The Opposition, we called for this type of operation had to find $26,000-odd of its own safeguard to be implemented. It is one of the hard-won funds to make a capital contribution. joys of having been a member of the That is making unlevel the so-called even Opposition and now a member of the playing field we are all looking for when all one Government to be able to say that when operation has to do is give a guarantee of Labor members came to Government, they usage and a competing operation just a few did the things that they called for when in miles down the road is required to kick in Opposition. I congratulate the Minister on the $26,000 of its capital up front. Obviously the presentation of his Estimates. Minister, being a very fair person and, earlier Mr ELLIOTT (Cunningham) (4.59 p.m.) In in his life, having been an entrepreneur in the rising to take part in this Estimates debate, I fishing industry, would understand how would like to raise a few problems which are of necessary it was for him to be able to buy his great concern to me. As he is responsible for fish at the price paid by the opposition bloke rural affairs, as he has shown some interest in down the road if he was going to make some the bush and as he has travelled to the bush money out of the exercise. and seen what is going on, I ask the Minister Mr Vaughan: Why wasn’t his piggery in to take note of my representations on behalf the same place as the other guy’s? of my area, and the area represented by the Mr ELLIOTT: He happened to have land member for Warwick along the border, in in the North West County Council area and he regard to the supply of electricity by the North happens to live in the North West County West County Council. Those people who live Council area, so it would be foolish for him to along the border are in a unique situation in buy other land and run his piggery in the that they do not get their electricity from SEQEB area. I am sure the Minister has taken Queensland. Of course, because the Minister on board what I am saying. He knows the has been a member for even longer than I Goondiwindi area quite well. I sometimes go have, he would know that the previous to the indoor basketball arena where his name National Party Government equalised tariffs has been put up as being a patron or some throughout the State. That, of course, was of great supporter of the sport, so I am sure that tremendous assistance to a lot of people in he is very interested in the Goondiwindi area. the bush, particularly those in remote areas. Of course, this has left us with the situation of This piggery will employ a large number the North West County Council. It has left us of people, as the existing piggery already with two classes of people: one group of does. It will probably be one of the biggest people who get their electricity, as in the case employers in the area and as such is very, of my electorate, from SEQEB; and those very important to the economy of the people who get it from the North West County Goondiwindi area. I ask the Deputy Premier to Council. take this matter up with his colleague because at this stage I get the feeling that we are The problem that I have raised with the being fobbed off. The people involved and I Minister’s colleague the Minister for Minerals had a deputation with the Minister first of all and Energy, the Honourable Tony McGrady, is and then there was another deputation with that of a large piggery operation which is the chairman of the Waggamba Shire. going on or has gone on in the Goondiwindi Everyone appeared to be very sympathetic, area, and a similar operation at Millmerran. but it was a little like that Yes, Minister For the one at Millmerran, all that was actually program: nothing much seems to be needed was a guarantee of usage of a certain Legislative Assembly 4669 5 October 1993 happening. As far as I am concerned, unless The other matter that I would like to raise someone tells me otherwise, we are being in the few minutes left to me today is that of fobbed off and nothing is happening. So I small schools generally. We all know that, for again ask the Deputy Premier to take it up a long period, it has been a problem to keep a with his colleague and indicate to us just lot of these small schools viable. No-one exactly what the story is, because it is quite denies that, but it seems that there is a serious to the people concerned. definite agenda—I do not know where it is The other matters that I would like to coming from—to undermine these small raise relate to education generally in the schools. As someone whose kids go to a Cunningham electorate, and the Darling small school—mine go to the Jondaryan State Downs area for that matter because both the School—I know what a tremendously valuable member for Crows Nest and I recently did a part the educational program plays in their life quite extensive tour through the whole of the and how it gives them an understanding of Darling Downs and southern downs. We went how to get on with other people because to a lot of different schools and we were very children from all walks of life go to those alarmed at the low morale of teachers, schools. It is very important for young kids to particularly the principals of both the State go through that experience. Children at those schools and the high schools. It is very evident small schools have an empathy with their that those people are being put under a teachers, their class mates and the people on tremendous amount of strain. First of all the the P & C which perhaps is not the case in PSMC and various other bodies put these some of the bigger schools. It is a very people in the position where they had to valuable experience for all children and helps reapply for their own jobs. That is really not an them in their future careers, and as such I feel unstressful situation. I guess those of us who it is very unfortunate that people are trying to are in marginal seats could say that we are undermine those schools. asked to reapply for our jobs. I will give an example. The Ramsay State Mr Burns: Every three years. School in my area is probably under threat to some degree, and I would hate to think that Mr ELLIOTT: Every three years, and that that school will ever close. At the moment it is not an unstressful situation. Those people has about 12 or 13 pupils. In this area who went into the public service, particularly development is taking place and people are into the teaching profession, probably thought coming into the area; they are not just leaving that they had a relatively assured job, or they the area. Vale View School is probably under would have gone into private enterprise where an even greater threat. There are they may have made more money. They subdivisional programs not too far away from certainly have had a lot of pressure put on that school. I know the school has enrolled them. They are now being asked to write some new children for next year, so it is endless reports, spend a lot of time going to important for all of us to lend our support to seminars and the like, and have had a ensure that those small schools do not tremendous amount of control taken away close—that they stay open—so that people from them in the running of their schools. We can continue to have the opportunity to send had a good operation going with the P & C their children to these schools. The associations and the principals and things teacher/pupil ratios have been good in a lot of were working quite well, I thought, but I am these schools, even though some have rather surprised at the attitude that has been multiple classrooms. They have some very taken, because the bottom line is that the good facilities that have been provided by the morale of these teachers, and the principals in P & C and the community, such as tennis particular, has been shot down. It has been courts, so they are really community centres in shot to pieces. those small areas. They are not just schools; For my money, there is far too much they are very much the heart and soul of their input by the resource centre in Dalby. It is particular community. So I ask the Minister, trying to dictate where the principal/association who is responsible for rural matters, to look meetings will be held, what will be done, and into what I see as a problem in my area. how it will be done. If the Deputy Premier, as It has been a pleasure to take part in the the Minister involved in rural matters, wants Estimates debate today. I have found the these people to stay on in the long term and if Deputy Premier to be someone who is he wants to have good schools out in the prepared to listen. He does not always win, bush, he should ensure that that sort of thing but I hope he does win some of the battles on is not allowed to continue and that these our behalf, particularly the couple that I have people are looked after better. just raised. 5 October 1993 4670 Legislative Assembly

Hon. T. J. BURNS (Lytton—Deputy term “unforeseen expenditure”. I used to ask Premier, Minister for Administrative Services the same sort of question. It does not mean and Minister for Rural Communities) that a department has estimated that a job will (5.10 p.m.), in reply: I thank the honourable take $6m but ends up spending $7m. It members who have contributed to the debate. occurs when the department is required to do It has been an interesting debate. The debate new jobs and must ask for more money. on the Estimates of the Administrative Advice from the department is that, when the Services Department is always interesting, department changes its priorities or introduces because most honourable members are initiatives, such as the School Refurbishment affected in some way in our electorates by Program, which was an election initiative, it actions of the department and the workers in must expend funds and it must obtain the department. If it is not schools that are approval from Treasury to spend the being repaired, maintained or built, it is additional appropriation. hospitals, police stations and other buildings, The Government’s initiative of the School which are all part of the maintenance Refurbishment Program represented $20.5m program. of unforeseen expenditure. Additional property I refer firstly to the member for sales undertaken on behalf of Treasury Beaudesert, Mr Lingard, who asked for the represented $5.2m of unforeseen introduction of Estimates committees into the expenditure. The Government’s decision to House. Considering that he was the Speaker purchase some CBD buildings previously in previous Parliaments, he is a bit game owned by the Workers Compensation asking for that now. The National Party Board—a decision was made that those Government had an opportunity for 32 years buildings should not be owned by that board to do it. It is a bit hot, early in the years of this and that they should be Government Government, to be asking for Estimates buildings—took a total of $28.4m of committees. unforeseen expenditure. The honourable member raised a My department also sought unforeseen number of questions about the Estimates and expenditure for the purchase of the the spending in my department. I have the Woolloongabba Towers of $3.2m; additional answers from the department. The salary bill land, including the Cairns casino land, of for Q-Build business units decreased from the some $3.8m; the purchase of additional motor 1991-92 year to the 1992-93 year by $4m, vehicles for Q-Fleet of some $7.6m; the that is, from $54.9m to $50.9m. That was creation of an additional business unit, largely as a result of downsizing in Project namely, Warehouse and Distribution and its Services. The productivity figure for Q-Build associated budget allocation of some $4m; Project Services for which Mr Lingard asked the repayment of loans on behalf of CITEC of was an increase of 24.9 per cent. That was over $5m—we reduced its capital debt; and over a targeted figure of 10 per cent. That is additional capital and fit-out works carried out an excellent achievement. by client departments on all sorts of buildings Mr Lingard criticised the Q-Fleet budget of some $45m. The honourable member and the number of employees. I point out to criticised the Government for not carrying out the House that Q-Fleet’s salary bill for 99 maintenance. That is the sort of maintenance employees was only $3.1m. That is an and fit-out work that the department was increase of only 11 employees, who are doing. responsible for looking after an extra 3 000 A further matter raised was the reduction cars. The bulk of the budget for Q-Fleet in maintenance work undertaken by Q-Build consists of an asset base of some 7 000 Maintenance and Operations. The honourable vehicles, which is worth some $88.6m. We are member made reference to the lifts in Mineral buying the vehicles and leasing them. We House. Members of my Maintenance and must build up that asset base. That is where Operations section advised that, last year, the that money went. The reason for the number department undertook a complete internal of cars and employees is that more and more refurbishment of those lifts, which included individual departments are transferring their fixing door closings. They cannot understand vehicle fleets to Q-Fleet because we are giving why the honourable member said what he did. them a good deal and doing a good job on The department has a standard maintenance their behalf. contract with the lift supplier for ongoing care Mr Lingard went on to comment about and attention. We are totally unaware of any my department’s unforeseen expenditure and concern being raised by any staff or individual showed a lack of understanding about the regarding those lifts. If the person who fed the honourable member that story has any further Legislative Assembly 4671 5 October 1993 information, he should give it to me. We have legitimate argument about shifting a staff maintenance contracts, and the lift people are member, I need a better argument than one supposed to carry out that work. that it is a lot easier for the bloke or that he By his continued reference to the CJC, wants to work in the bigger town. the honourable member was being unfair to If a Minister says that the only way of our business units. My department is unaware making a program work is putting a person in of any investigation by the CJC into Q-Build a certain area, I do not have the right to say Property Management. That does not mean that the Minister should not do that. In that no investigation is going on. I should conscience, I would not try to say that that point out that the CJC is not obliged to report Minister should not do that. However, I stick details of any investigation that it is my nose in as much as I can. We have a staff undertaking to either me or my departmental of 10. Our job is to adopt a whole-of- officers. That could have been lobbed from Government approach to decisions and to see somewhere else. The CJC has been looking that things do not happen in the same way as into a number of matters with respect to Q- happened with courthouses. We try our very Build Maintenance and Operations, and a best in that regard. number have been referred by us. To date, I Margaret Woodgate is the hardworking am told that all of those matters have been secretary of my committee, as she was when I resolved to the satisfaction of the CJC. was the Minister for Local Government and The bill for the Budget papers, which was Housing. She raised the question of QGAPP sent to the ALP head office, was incorrectly and support for the departmental staff. She invoiced to the Premier’s Department. That has always been very good with was a genuine mistake. The manager of representative work. She is a member of the Goprint has been very apologetic about it. He Premier’s Rural Task Force. She is always is even more embarrassed now over the keen to chase us out to the bush. She makes whole thing. I can accept that people make certain that we get out there and talk to mistakes. Make no bones about it, Rex Ward people. She is a very valuable asset to me, is a really good bloke. He has done a good and I thank her for her support today. job. Some honourable members today have Mr Cooper, the member for Crows Nest, acknowledged the success of Goprint. raised the question of the level playing field. Everybody makes mistakes, as Margaret His argument carries no weight with me. I do Woodgate said earlier. not believe in level playing fields. I do not The suggestion that QGAPP is acting as believe the argument that is put up by the an agent for the Labor Party is laughable. The rationalists, and I never have. Having been in issuing of a driver’s licence, the payment of Parliament, I know that, if ever the day were to rents for Government housing and the issuing come when every Government in the world of stock licences, to name but a few, can agreed and everybody had a united front, hardly be seen as ALP propaganda. However, there would be a whole line of Oppositions it is the same story. In Opposition, one must with a policy that would change the position if be critical of some things. they were to get into power. The next day and When I listen to people talking about the the day after, Governments around the world Office of Rural Communities and matters such will change. as that, I think that, next time I go into a Some people believe that, one day— phone booth, I ought to rip off my clothes and some fabulous day—everybody will trade see whether there is a Superman suit honestly and fairly. Last week, I was in underneath. People seem to think that the job Canada. The Province of Ontario and the of the Office of Rural Communities is to tell all Province of Quebec were arguing with each departments what they can do, to tell them other and banning building workers from that they cannot remove their staff, they working between one State and another. That cannot reduce staff, they cannot close schools is how far they go with protection. Rural and everything else. I try to go into the producers in the meat industry should be Cabinet and ask what will be the effect on aware that the Canadian elections are being rural communities of decisions to change staff. held now. I guarantee that, in the next month On a number of occasions, I have told or two, Canada will give the Australian beef Ministers that they should not move a staff industry another whack with quotas or provide person from, say, Cloncurry to Mount Isa or other protection for its own industry. from Cunnamulla to Charleville. I have said, Everybody is running for cover. At the “You are reducing the staff in that town.” cattlemen’s conference everyone was up the Although another Minister might have a ribs of everyone else. Protection is part of the 5 October 1993 4672 Legislative Assembly world scene today. We in Australia are all into administration block was No. 4 on the list. deregulation. We are all into open playing However, the school committee voted to have fields. I have been around long enough to see that changed.” I said, “Who is on the school that it will come back the other way. committee?” One of the ladies said, “The Mr Quinn made the sort of criticism that teachers. They changed the administration can be made when one starts to look at block from No. 4 to No. 1, and they put the figures and draw up long lists. I ask the domestic science block further down the list.” honourable member for Merrimac to consider That was a good lesson for me. In future, the schools in Pat Purcell’s electorate. Most of I will be considering the construction of those schools are 100 years old; most of them administration blocks. I will be considering are wooden; most of them have fibro roofs or some of the priorities laid down by my the old-style iron roofs; and most of them departmental people and by the have the old wooden windows. Maintenance headmasters. I am prepared to go with the in those schools is a heavy burden. local member of Parliament and say to the Electorates such as Merrimac, Nerang and people at the coalface, “Is this what you want Albert have new schools which are brick done?” I always say to members that if they buildings, with aluminium windows, tile roofs, invite me to their electorate and I have the modern interior facilities, paved areas and time to visit, I want some P & C people driveways—facilities that were never provided present. If $20,000 worth of maintenance in older schools. work has to be carried out and the P & C wants to reallocate the funds, I am prepared The Government has received many to consider such a proposal if it is sensible. submissions from P & Cs to dig up bitumen in school yards because it is allegedly too hard It is erroneous for the member for on the kids’ feet. When I first became a Merrimac to claim that, because of the figures member of Parliament, most schools per se, Opposition electorates have been requested that bitumen be laid. We do not lay treated unfairly. I can assure the honourable member that there has been no interference. bitumen now. Instead, we lay pavers and we Some money has been set aside, and it is plant gardens in beds. When I became a fortunate that that occurred. In addition to member 21 years ago, no school had gardens everything else, the workplace health and and landscaping. People used to say that it safety people have started to say that the so- would be dangerous to the kids to plant called adventure playgrounds cannot be flowers. It was more dangerous on the flowers! adventurous any longer. As a result, $13m The honourable member for Merrimac worth of goods and services have been may well go through that FOI exercise, but I condemned, and we have to find funding to say this to him: I have not interfered in any correct that. Next year, the Opposition will be way with the SRP. However, I did set some able to ask questions about that issue, money aside, because if a member of because I will have overspent the Estimates. Parliament comes to me and says, “I have a In some cases, people have simply dug up problem with a school in my area”, some those playgrounds. money must be available to rectify that The honourable member for Chermside problem. Members of Parliament and the raised the issue of a preschool in his headmasters of schools do not see eye to eye electorate. We say that, in preschools, on many of these issues. P & Cs and the children’s playing and climbing equipment is a headmasters of schools do not see eye to eye necessary tool for their education. We give it a on many of these issues. high priority. But the workplace health and I cite an example of that. I travelled to Mr safety people say, “You have to pull these Stephan’s electorate of Gympie because I things out.” Some schools are pulling out was asked to drive a bulldozer for the start of playground equipment that has been there for a new administration block at the Gympie 50 years and on which no-one has ever been State High School. I went up there thinking injured. But suddenly there is a new set of that it would be a nice and easy PR session. I rules, and away we go. A lot of money is got my photo taken, and then two ladies involved and many decisions have to be grabbed me as I got down from the bulldozer made in that regard. and said, “Come over here. Why are you An honourable member interjected. building an administration block here?” I think Mr BURNS: Quite truthfully, I do not think that a total of $450,000 was being spent on that it is covered in the Workplace Health and that project, and I thought that they would be Safety Act, because I am not too sure that it is pleased about it. They said, “The domestic a workplace. science block was top of the list here, and the An honourable member interjected. Legislative Assembly 4673 5 October 1993

Mr BURNS: It is? I will take the member’s quality of life available in the country. They say word for that. that it is better to live in the country because John Szczerbanik, the member for Albert, there is cleaner air; there is more security; and referred to the neighbourhood security rapes and murders do not happen in country programs. That is one of that best little areas to the degree that they do in the city. programs that we have going. The project An honourable member interjected. aims to trim trees, tidy up around bus stops, check lights and ensure that the local area is Mr BURNS: Yes, suicide rates are much safe. I am not building up a large higher, for a number of reasons. Droughts administration for that project. There is one have a lot to do with that; stress has a lot to fellow, a young lady who helps him and a do with that; and the failure to be able to find policeman. Between the three of them, they a job has a lot to do with it. However, that try to get around and talk to people in various does not threaten one’s neighbour; that is a communities. If honourable members are personal hazard. In America and Canada, aware of community members who want to people are told that if they bring their kids to establish a neighbourhood safety audit, the the country, there are better conditions and procedure is that up to $1,000 will be given to better air, and the children will be able to play the committee, but people must do that sport in a better environment. through my department. Because I am trying Country areas in the US and Canada to keep administration costs low, the fellow in have many things going for them. They have charge of the program has a high workload their own little county banks that support ahead of him. I thank the member for Albert them. Those small banks are prepared to lend for his support for the program, for the work money. They are not getting out of the smaller that he has done in his area and also for his towns as Westpac is in this country. Those invitations to visit his area. small banks are out there helping. As well, Jim Randell, the member for Mirani, country areas in the US and Canada have spoke about staffing levels. The situation is school boards which hire their own teachers. that there are more departmental people in The councils collect the rates for running the the country now than there were previously, schools, and they make a decision to employ but they are not all in the areas in which better teachers, more teachers or specialist people want them, and they never will be. As I teachers. They sell those attributes to the mentioned earlier, recently I visited Canada people. However, those countries are and America to observe what they are doing encountering the same problems that we are. about rural towns. I think that the member for It is not the Queensland Government— Western Downs, Mr Littleproud, hit the nail whether it is National or Labor—that is creating right on the head during his contribution the problems. It is a part and parcel of the today. When we sat down to talk, the people trend whereby people are moving to the in the USA and Canada asked me why I was bigger cities. We have the devil’s own job of there. I explained to them that we have little moving them back the other way. We are country towns in which a large percentage of trying, and we have to keep trying. the work force has been reduced because of modern technology. For example, with Don Livingstone, the member for Ipswich modern feedlots, a tremendous number of West, raised the subject of school security. cattle can be processed with a staff of only 10. We are spending a lot of money on school Previously, farmers could never fatten so security, but every weekend I pick up the many head with such few people. newspaper and read that another school has been burnt or vandalised. At present, 237 Another problem is that, with modern schools have an electronic security system, or education, kids go off to high school and to guards patrolling them. There are 1 850 university but they do not want to come back schools throughout the State. It will take a lot and work on the land or in the small towns of dough to finish that project. However, I because no meaningful jobs are available. thank Don for the work that he has done on The people around the room from the central school security. west of Canada and the USA all nodded their heads. They have exactly the same problems. Terry Sullivan, the member for In fact, one fellow said to me, “If you find the Chermside, spoke about the Capital Works answer at the end of your trip, drop me a Program. Marc Rowell spoke about the note. We are looking for a solution to the Mission Beach school and regionalisation. same problems.” Regionalisation is occurring in most other In America and Canada, they try to places overseas. It is true to say that some overcome those problems by promoting the towns are becoming quite large. People are moving from the little towns to places such as 5 October 1993 4674 Legislative Assembly

Longreach, Emerald, Charleville, Hughenden America can ring those services. That could and Mount Isa. The little towns around those be a solution to some of our problems. centres are suffering. As the Americans put it Time expired. to me, those little towns have to learn to feed off the bigger towns and not other way around. Legislative Assembly The Americans also told me about an (Parliamentary Service Commission) activity undertaken by their councils and Hon. T. M. MACKENROTH suggested that our local authorities do the (Chatsworth—Leader of the House) same. From time to time, councils in America (5.30 p.m.): It is with great pleasure that I rise go interstate to promote the attributes of their to speak to the Estimates for the Legislative particular region. For example, Queensland Assembly and Parliamentary Service local authorities could take a trade show over Commission. In speaking to these Estimates, I the border and say, “If you are going to come point out to the Committee that in the to Queensland, you should come to Westminster tradition, I am joined by the Rockhampton or Townsville, because the Speaker of the Parliament, the Honourable potential exists for jobs and a better quality of Jim Fouras. This is the only occasion during life. There are opportunities outside of parliamentary sittings when the Speaker is Brisbane.” Perhaps in that way we could able to play such a part in parliamentary redirect some of the people who are coming debates, and he does so in an advisory to the south-east corner. capacity in his dual role as Speaker and One honourable member asked about Chairman of the Parliamentary Service TAFE facilities. New TAFE facilities are being Commission. constructed this year in Roma, and The Parliamentary Service Commission Normanton right up in the Gulf. Last year, new was established in 1988 pursuant to section 5 TAFE campuses were opened in Bowen, of the Parliamentary Service Act 1988. The Cannonvale, Cherbourg and Thursday Island, commission consists of the Speaker, who is and new TAFE buildings were opened at Chairman, the Chairman of Committees, the Mackay and Townsville. There is a continuing Leader of the House, one other Government expansion program, and Matt Foley is doing a member, the Leader of the Opposition or good job in that area. nominee, and two other non-Government I thank Gordon Nuttall and Clem members. Campbell for their support, especially in the Section 7 of the Act outlines the functions area of security of payments for contractors. I of the Parliamentary Service Commission, as will have a look at the North West County follows— Council electricity problem. Len Stephan (a) to determine major policies to guide talked about work and the guidelines for the the operation and management of withdrawal of services. I had to set guidelines the Parliamentary Service; because previously there was no such thing. Departments used to say that they wanted to (b) to prepare budgets for the remove a service and they just did so. Now, Legislative Assembly, the we say that they ought to talk to the commission and the Parliamentary community—the users in the area. The Service; Americans said this to me: you will never (c) to determine the size and supply the service face to face. You will never organisation of the Parliamentary be able to do it. Modern technology is the only Service and the services to be way to go. In America today, it is all provided by the Parliamentary computers; it is all video conferencing— Service; modern technology is adopted to deliver (d) to be the employing authority for services. officers of and employees in the In Omaha, 100 000 people are working in Parliamentary Service, determining country towns answering the 008 phone their remuneration and other terms numbers—the “Do not send any money” sort and conditions of employment; and of television advertising. There are 100 000 (e) to supervise the management and people in jobs in country towns because delivery of the services to be telephone services can be connected to those performed by the Parliamentary places. People do not need to live in Service. , or New York to work for those companies. People from all over The Estimates before the Committee have been approved by the Parliamentary Legislative Assembly 4675 5 October 1993

Service Commission. The Parliamentary played in the area of property management, Service Commission continues to maintain the particularly in respect of electorate offices. The independence of the Parliament whilst new program structure represents a significant recognising its responsibilities with respect to change from the previous structure, although overall budgetary constraints. The 1993-94 most subprogram names and functions Parliamentary Service Commission estimate of remain unchanged. $35.314m represents an increase of 1.3 per Funding is sought for the Parliamentary cent over the commission’s actual expenditure Services Program, which provides procedural, in 1992-93. research, information and reporting services to This year’s Estimates include a number of assist members of Parliament to undertake new expenditure initiatives, including— their constitutional and parliamentary duties. the provision of additional electorate The program also promotes awareness and office equipment—$267,000—as knowledge of the Parliament in the community recommended by the Electoral and and among special interest groups, including Administrative Review Committee; school children. An amount of $5,946,000 is being sought for this program. Significant the commencement of a 15-year, $12m allocations within this program include— stone restoration program for Parliament House—$390,000 this financial year; and $753,000 for the Table Office, which provides procedural and programming the engagement of the Administrative advice and documentation to members; Services Department to conduct a review of accommodation within the $1.8m for the Parliamentary Library, parliamentary precinct—$250,000. which provides research and information services to members and approved These and other new expenditure users; initiatives will be funded through a number of savings initiatives, including— $1.3m for Hansard, which reports parliamentary debates, conferences and the rationalisation of services provided in evidence given before parliamentary the areas of catering, Hansard, security, committees and commissions of inquiry; attendants and secretarial support; $1.5m for parliamentary committees and the negotiation of more cost-effective the provision of research and service arrangements with the administrative support to those Administrative Services Department in the committees; and areas of parliamentary precinct cleaning and maintenance, and also metropolitan $179,000 for the Education and Protocol electorate office support; Office. the adoption of a new policy covering the During 1993Ð94, this program will focus travel arrangements applying to members on the fulfilment of its objectives as set out in of the Legislative Assembly in line with the corporate plan. Particular outcomes which those applicable across the whole of the will be sought include— public sector; and the expansion of the public education the pursuit of the structural efficiency seminar program to the private sector principle, including a comprehensive and the media; review of the Parliamentary Service the release of further publications on the Award—State and the implementation of Parliament for use by teachers and the job redesign process. students; These savings initiatives promote a more the making of a video on Parliament for efficient Parliamentary Service without use in tertiary institutions; compromising service delivery. the development of work plans by each The major function of the Parliamentary office to ensure that the objectives Service Commission is to determine policy and contained in the corporate plan are met; supervise the management of the services the completion of the job redesign provided by the Parliamentary Service. The process for the Committee Office, Parliamentary Service is operating under a Education and Hansard offices, new corporate plan in 1993-94 and a new Parliamentary Library, and Speaker’s program structure has also been introduced. Office; The new program structure reflects a change in focus for the Parliamentary Service and information systems in Hansard will be recognises the important role now being further developed to enable greater 5 October 1993 4676 Legislative Assembly

efficiencies in the production of parliamentary precinct, the development of a transcripts; comprehensive electorate office property a review of printing procedures and costs; management policy, and the negotiation of a more cost-effective relationship between the implementation of the plan for Administrative Services Department and the computerising aspects of the Table commission. Office’s operations will continue, focussing on options to automate the A major new initiative to be undertaken within this program is the stone restoration indexing of the Votes and Proceedings, program for Parliament House. This initiative the establishment of electronic procedural represents a planned approach to stone databases and further enhancement of repairs over the next 15 years, with all project computer-aided preparation of the Votes work to be undertaken by the Administrative and Proceedings and the notice paper; Services Department. Parliament House is the greater emphasis on maintaining efficient No. 2 Heritage listed building in the State, and secretariat teams and effective planning the restoration program will ensure that the of inquiries; physical condition of Parliament House is a Committee office bulletin will be maintained at a level befitting its Heritage published for the autumn and Budget status. sittings; and Another initiative is the accommodation the Parliamentary Library will continue to review of the parliamentary precinct, currently build on the services it provides to being undertaken by the Administrative members, with major projects for this year Services Department. The Electoral and including the extension of its newspaper Administrative Review Commission database to provide full text for all articles recommended that the Parliamentary Service selected and, in addition, full text entries Commission conduct a review of the and associated subject indexing will be accommodation needs of staff and provided on Parl-Airs for all Queensland parliamentary office holders. The review is Bills, as well as Votes and Proceedings. currently being undertaken and is expected to be completed by May 1994, with The level of client satisfaction with the recommendations to the Parliamentary services provided by the program will be Service Commission by June 1994. surveyed in the first half of 1994 as an indication of where performance can be The Corporate Services Program provides improved. The program will also institute administrative, financial and technical improved feedback, appraisal and staff resources to executive management, development procedures to raise the skills of members of Parliament and the other two all staff and to improve the quality and programs of the commission. An amount of timeliness of the program’s services. $15,828,000 is being sought for this program. Major allocations and activities within this The Property Management and program include— Parliamentary Support Program seeks to maintain and improve the physical $866,000 for Information Technology environment and support facilities of the Services, which provides network and Parliament. An amount of $13,540,000 is central computing infrastructure, training being sought for this program. Major and advice to users within the allocations and activities within this program parliamentary precinct and electorate include— offices; $3.3m for building services to cover the $370,000 for the maintenance of human maintenance of the parliamentary resource management and industrial precinct to ensure an acceptable working relations services, personnel and payroll environment; administration; $560,000 for the provision of accounting $6.5m for the provision of electorate and financial management systems, offices support for members, including auditing and budget services; accommodation, electorate office staff, stores and stationery; and $573,000 for the provision of $2.386m for the provision of security and administrative support, including attendant support. members’ secretarial services, stores and stationery and purchasing services; and The emphasis for this program in 1993-94 will be on the rationalisation of maintenance and $12.631m to cover the costs associated cleaning services provided within the Legislative Assembly 4677 5 October 1993

with members’ salaries, allowances and will still be able to talk about other departments. services. I wish to place on record my appreciation A key initiative is the wide area network for the Estimates that were tabled this project connecting members’ electorate offices morning in the House. Whereas they are fairly with Parliament House. This project is being detailed, they leave a lot to be desired with trialled and will provide members with a regard to the finer details. I have said before computer link between their electorate offices in this Chamber that I hope that this is the last and Parliament as well as the ability to access time that members will debate the Estimates the Parliamentary Library database. The in this manner. I am sure that members would project to date has been very well received by like to question particular public servants on both members and electorate officers who how they arrived at some of these line items. I have participated in the pilot. would not expect this Minister to answer each In recent years, there have been of those queries. considerable changes in the financial and The Minister spoke about servicing administrative responsibilities of the members of Parliament and this institution of Parliamentary Service and the commission. Parliament. Members are talking about These changes have had a significant impact appropriating a Budget of some $35,314,000 on the direction and level of resources utilised from the public purse to provide this institution by the Parliamentary Service. In response to with a budget to maintain its services for the these changes, the Parliamentary Service next 12 months. That is the basis of this Commission has, in 1993-94, sought to debate. I regret to say that this is not a debate ensure that available resources are directed to about whether or not some members of achieving the commission’s goals. Today’s Parliament have their noses in the trough. It is debate will give members the opportunity to right that members of the public have all the suggest any areas of the Parliamentary facts explained to them in an accurate way so Service which could be improved, but I should that they can ask themselves, “Is it worthwhile point out to members that a balance needs to having a Parliament in Queensland for some be struck between what they would like and $35m a year, or can we do without it?” That is what the community can afford to pay for. a fair question that should be debated In conclusion, the Parliamentary Service amongst the general public. has improved considerably over recent years As to the various sections of the and services will continue to be improved. I Parliamentary Service Commission and the commend the Estimates to the Committee. Office of the Governor—I notice that, Mr FITZGERALD (Lockyer) (5.43 p.m.): It according to Budget Paper No. 3, only a is with pleasure that I rise in the debate before couple of lines are devoted to the Office of the the Chamber today. There has been some Governor. I made some inquiries about this. It confusion about the extent of this debate. In simply states the program outlays for the fact, I prepared a large portion of my speech Office of the Governor. Then there are some based on page 27 of the Program dots. The current grants and subsidies are Statements, Budget Paper No. 3. I am shown as $2.395m. Then there are another advised by the Table officers that this covers a couple of dots. The grants for capital outlays more extensive section than that upon which I are shown as $214,000. And that is it. That is am allowed to speak. Whereas the programs the Budget statement for the Office of the come within Legislative and Executive Governor—two lines that add up to $2.609m. Services, I understand that members are Members are debating that particular line debating the Executive and Legislative item. I shall explain to members how this Services. As I said, there has been some came about. I understand that it is a tradition confusion about the extent of this debate. I that the Governor manages the money that is regret that I am now unable to speak to a lot allocated by this Parliament, and that is the of the material that I have prepared. I accept end of the story. I understand that, by that there is always a bit of confusion with tradition, there is absolutely no auditing of the Estimates debates and that there is always an amount of money—$2.609m—that is overlapping of services. However, the Minister allocated to the Office of the Governor. for Administrative Services does not have a Mr Welford: Are you a republican? very big budget, and he is spending money Mr FITZGERALD: I have just explained on behalf of every other department. So, this to members. I know that all members in provided that members are clever enough and this Chamber, and particularly the honourable the Chair allows them to get away with it, they member for Everton, would be well aware that this has been the tradition. We respect the 5 October 1993 4678 Legislative Assembly monarchy. The Office of the Governor is the to be made for the setting up of that particular head of this Parliament. However, I thought committee system. that it was worthwhile raising that point. I will not speak about the location of Some of the other line items in the those particular offices; that will be Program Statements are just as explanatory. expenditure that will be required in next year’s In relation to the Office of the Speaker, one of budget. I see that there is no provision for it in the items is simply “Extra Remuneration”. This this year’s budget. I understand that the also appears in quite a few of the line items Parliamentary Service Commission made a relating to security, the catering staff and other decision not to continue with planning for an sections. I would like to know exactly what that office block in the precincts of Parliament covers. Was it an ex gratia payment or money House between the annexe and this building. that had to be found for some specific I think that that is a retrograde step, because purpose? “Extra Remuneration” is a loose wherever we went as a parliamentary technical term. committee, we found out that most of the other Parliaments required their committees to Under the Office of the Clerk there is a be located within a reasonable distance of large provision for payroll tax. If that is not Parliament House. In other words, it was taking it from one hand of Government and desirable to have everybody close to putting it into another hand of Parliament House. Of course, it is impossible Government—— to do so. The Opposition complains about Mr Mackenroth: It’s always been there. this, because it likes to have its offices close to Mr FITZGERALD: I know that it has the House; the Whip likes to have an office always been there. I just wish to explain to the close to the House and the Ministers, of course, as we all understand, have to be general public that money is going from one reasonably close to the Chamber if they are Government department to another going to conduct Government business while Government department, and the Treasury the House is in session. So I believe that we hands the money back. So the actual cost to should have facilities close to Parliament the public purse should really be minus that House to enable us to operate efficiently and sum of money. effectively. Mr Mackenroth interjected. Another point that can be made from the Mr FITZGERALD: It would appear to be figures that are presented to us is the cost of reduced by that amount. It is rather members’ telephone calls. The general public substantial. The figures that have been should know what these amounts are. Of provided to members include the costs of course, they have been tabled in Parliament running the various parliamentary committees. so that they are now public knowledge. I point I was rather surprised that some of those out that the reimbursement that members committees are operating so cheaply. It is a receive for calls made from home is 85 per reasonably tight budget. I serve on the EARC cent. Some members who hold a particular committee. I know that this budget will office receive a 100 per cent refund on their probably be its last, because that committee home telephone bills. That does not include has recommended that the EARC itself be the Ministers. Therefore, the average cost of wound up. It would be natural to assume that telephone calls to the Parliament appears to the parliamentary committee would also be be approximately $1,000 per member a year. wound up as soon as it finishes the reports That seems to be the average of the cost of that it has in front of it. However, I imagine the members’ home telephone bills. That is an indication of the amount of work that that it would be rather difficult from a members carry out from their homes. It does Parliamentary Service Commission point of not cover the Ministers’ telephone bills view to budget exactly for the expenditure on because, as I understand it, their home committees. We presume that the telephone bills are paid by their departments, parliamentary committee reports, and the because it is departmental spending, and is Parliament makes up its mind about what not covered by the Legislative Assembly. committee system it is going to set up. I do not wish to indicate what the parliamentary Another item is the former members’ committee may or may not recommend, but it entitlement. Recently, we have heard a lot about the gold pass for former members. I is common belief that there will be an wish people would understand the difference extensive committee system implemented in between the drain on the public purse of a this Parliament. Therefore, provision will have former member of the State and the drain on the public purse Legislative Assembly 4679 5 October 1993 of a former member of the Federal my constituents very clearly—that I do not Parliament. I do not think that the drain on the mind paying $30 for a meal at the public purse for Queensland’s former parliamentary refreshment room, provided I members is extraordinary. I get rather upset at receive a meal allowance from the times when I listen to public debate about Parliamentary Service Commission of $30 for former politicians being kept, and travelling or that meal. As a member of Parliament who is flying throughout the country willy-nilly. Of working here, I think that I am entitled to course, we know that it is just not possible for receive a meal allowance, the same as if I former State members of Parliament to do were a coalminer or anyone else who was that. They will pay their own way, and so they working overtime. I believe that I am quite should. They have a certain entitlement, and entitled to receive such an allowance. If the the figures relating to those entitlements are media believes that it is something that it indicated. wants to sensationalise, I plead with it to come I think that it is important to note that rail up with the full facts. Whatever the cost of the passes cost the Parliamentary Service meal, this institution requires members to be Commission $30,000 for the year. As I here and to dine here. I am not frightened to understand it, the Family Services Department say that in public. If the cost of those meals is still does not pay for pensioners’ rail service levied at a certain amount, so be it. concessions, and the railways have to carry From my observations in recent times, it those passengers for free. So it is a matter of is regrettable that—and I have no detailed which department acknowledges the invoice knowledge of the financial affairs of the for this expenditure, and which department is Parliament, even though we are debating the responsible for that amount of money. Estimates—a lot of people have been allowed I would like to say to the Chairman of the to enter Parliament House and to eat at the Parliamentary Service Commission that I was cafeteria and, therefore, more money is very disappointed to read on the front page of turned over. I always understood that the today’s Courier-Mail an article that indicated cafeteria meals were subsidised, so I thought what these Estimates, that were to be tabled that the more people who were subsidised in the House later in the day, were going to through the cafeteria, the more money the be. I thought that that was regrettable. cafeteria was going to lose. Besides the inconvenience to staff working in Parliament Mr Mackenroth: That is not true. House and members of Parliament who wish Mr FITZGERALD: I just said that the to dine in the cafeteria from time to newspaper report referred to Estimates that time—particularly when the House is not in were later tabled in the House. I find that session, members often have a quick regrettable. lunch—and finding that the cafeteria is full, I Mr Mackenroth: I think that it refers to thought that it was disgraceful. I thought that it last year’s annual report, not to the Estimates demeaned the Parliament. At the same time, for this year. There is a difference. I understand that, a couple of years ago, the Department of Works across the road had a Mr FITZGERALD: The article refers to the cafeteria which closed down because it was Speaker indicating what the subsidy for the losing too much money. Consequently, cost of food is going to be for next year, so people came to Parliament House to eat. surely this article deals with this year’s Estimates. The article refers to the Speaker The headline in the Courier-Mail reads, stating that he hoped to reduce the subsidy “Taxpayers fork out $1.2m on MP menu”. The by $400,000 next year. Obviously, there has fact is that that amount of money covers the been a quickening of public awareness of the cost for everybody who works at Parliament cost of Parliament. I find it regrettable that the House. Of course, the article looks better general public will probably take the view that when the letters “MP” are placed in the members of Parliament are receiving cheap headline. meals. That will be the greatest issue. An honourable member It includes Mr Mackenroth: The 7.30 Report has journalists. done a segment for tonight’s television. Mr FITZGERALD: Yes, it includes Mr FITZGERALD: I presume that it would journalists. I do not blame Tony Koch for the do so. If a report was issued to the general article’s headline, because I imagine he is a public that stated that members receive very honest and reputable reporter. subsidised meals, which is costing the Mr Mackenroth: Be honest, if you read taxpayers a certain amount of money, I would the article—— put it to the general taxpayer—and I say it to 5 October 1993 4680 Legislative Assembly

Mr FITZGERALD: I am saying that, made. That is going to continue in all sections obviously, the subeditor has misled the public. of the Parliamentary Service. Many people read only the large print, and I do not believe that the Parliamentary nothing more, and say, “There they are at it Service organisational chart is correct because again.” I believe that it is most regrettable that I do not believe that the Parliamentary Service that particular item appeared. Commission really is at the top of the tree. As I understand that the Parliamentary Treasury or Executive Government provides Service Commission has made a decision to the funds, I believe that in the organisational reduce the number of staff, or the services chart “Treasury” or “Executive Government” provided by staff, on some of the floors of the should appear above “Parliamentary Service annexe. I have not seen a direction to that Commission”. I prefer a Parliamentary Service effect yet, but I want to pay tribute to the staff Commission which has to inform Treasury of who work on members’ floors, because some the amount of money required and for the of them work extremely hard, particularly commission to manage a budget for that during session. The Parliamentary Service amount. The Treasury then has to raise and Commission Annual Report shows a flow supply that amount of money. The general chart. It shows the Parliamentary Service public can then condemn or condone the Commission at the top, an arrow going to the Parliamentary Service Commission’s actions. Speaker, then to the Clerk of the Parliament, Because members of that commission and/or then to the Deputy Clerk and then to various members of Parliament suffer the indignity of other areas. I believe the flow chart is wrong. I having insults hurled at them from time to time believe there should be a higher authority by the newspapers and by their constituency, than the Parliamentary Service Commission. I they have to justify the amount of money they do not believe that the Parliamentary Service are spending. I think that is quite a good way Commission has the money to do what it to go about it. I believe that all members of wants to do, because I am damned certain Parliament should be able to justify the that the members of the Parliamentary amount of money that is spent by this Vote Service Commission would have given that before the Chamber this evening. budget just a little bit more so that some extra Sitting suspended from 6.03 to 7.30 p.m. services could have been provided. Mr BEATTIE (Brisbane Central) I know that Information Technology (7.30 p.m.): It gives me a great deal of Services is struggling for funds. I know there pleasure to rise this evening to speak to the are demands from the Parliamentary Library Estimates for the Executive and the to provide extra funds. I know the trials that Legislature. In doing so, it is appropriate to they have had with members, and I was say at the outset that, when we talk about fortunate to be one of those members who Estimates for this place—the Parliament—we received extra computer facilities so that as members of Parliament need not be contact can be made with my electorate hesitant about supporting reasonable office. From what I have seen of that trial, I Estimates. I am firmly of the view that the would like to stress the importance of people of Queensland are not shy about continuing with it. I will be recommending to believing that their Parliament should be the Parliamentary Service Commission that it properly funded and properly supported. provide the service to all members of Parliament. I spend a lot of time in this When we go through the Estimates, I Chamber. I can go to my office, as I did know that honourable members will look at the earlier, and check what mail has come in. necessary accountability processes. We all There may be a message from my secretary support that. However, no-one need be shy to ring three people with a bit of a story. If my about the importance of funding this place secretary has a letter that she has typed for properly. Frankly, if the Parliament of my approval, I can put it onto the screen Queensland is not adequately funded, it will straightaway and have a look at it. I can have not operate properly. If it does not operate it sent out the same afternoon if I so desire. properly, questions will be raised about its That type of service should not be cut back. future. A debate is going on about the future role of the States, the Commonwealth and The committee system of this Parliament local government. We must make sure that is obviously going to expand greatly. I stress we carve out an important niche for ourselves. that the Parliamentary Service Commission One of the ways of doing that is to support the needs to hold a tight rein. Hansard has been effective running of this place. held on an extremely tight rein and considerable adjustments have had to be In preparing for this Estimates debate, I had a look through some of the relevant Legislative Assembly 4681 5 October 1993 contributions over the years about the Mr BEATTIE: I do not think that we ought importance of Parliament. I was minded of to do that. We will leave the Szczerbaniks out these words— of it. That is not one of the traditions that we “If today our action employs among need. its different weapons that of parliament, That brings me to the issue of that is not to say that parliamentary parliamentary committees, which, as all parties exist only for parliamentary ends. members would be aware, is a matter close to For us parliament is not an end in itself, my heart. When the Fitzgerald inquiry report but merely a means to an end.” was formulated, or brought down, Commissioner Fitzgerald made some telling The person who said that was Adolf Hitler in remarks about Parliament and about the need 1930. He was only about abusing Parliament. for a committee system. When he was talking He never saw Parliament as having a proper generally about committees, he said— role, but simply as a vehicle for the Executive or the dictatorship that eventually came. That “. . . committees have become a vital and is the sort of attitude that attacks the very spirit energetic part of giving effect to the of Parliament. democratic process.” To be balanced, I must point out that And he was right. Of Parliament, he said— Winston Churchill had a different view. He “Procedures which allow it to obtain said— and analyse information are essential.” “Democracy is the worst system Of course, that is done by parliamentary devised by the wit of man, except for all committees. In 1989, the then Leader of the the others.” Opposition and now Premier, Wayne Goss, In other words, he accepted the importance of described two of this Parliament’s committees this place. as effective watchdogs of the public interest, and he was right. I was looking at a quote from Edmund Burke. He said— It is acknowledged that other forms of appeal, review and scrutiny do exist, but those “You choose a member indeed”— should not, and must not, be allowed to that is, when people vote for someone— replace this Parliament’s responsibility to act as the final overseer of the public interest. The “but when you have chosen him”— Parliament represents the people of this State or her, obviously. It was “him” at the time when and should not shirk from its role of scrutiny of he wrote it— existing and future Governments and “he is not a member of Bristol, but he is a bureaucracies. member of parliament.” If we do not accept that philosophy, which is the spirit of what Fitzgerald was all That has been the British tradition, and that about, the contribution that we could make to tradition recognises the importance of this accountable democracy in Queensland is place as an institution. severely crippled. Parliament is not just an Many of us would be watching with some extension of the Executive. We must bear that interest a slightly divergent situation in Russia in mind. Parliamentary committees are an now, where the Parliament has been invaluable extension of the Parliament itself dissolved by President Yeltsin, but dissolved and, as agents of the Parliament, are able to because it is no longer representative. We do many things that the Parliament, because need a Parliament that is representative and of its size, is unable to do. They question, they that is relevant. However, to be all of those examine and they cut through the things, it must be properly funded. We should undergrowth of the bureaucratic jungle. In not be wimpish about arguing that this place doing that, they also provide one of the few should be properly funded. From time to time, opportunities for the private sector and the I get a bit distressed when I see people argue public to have an input into the parliamentary about the appropriate funding of this place. It process, that is, through the committees. must be funded properly. However, for committees to be properly Mr Szczerbanik: My ancestors had the effective, they must have adequate financial, right idea. travel and staffing resources and must be able to meet freely and investigate matters without Mr BEATTIE: What did they do, pray tell? fear or favour. After all, committees do Mr Szczerbanik: Shoot them. represent the Parliament—the highest authority in the State—and the investment in 5 October 1993 4682 Legislative Assembly them can be returned many times over I mean this Chamber over the years. It is not, financially, as we have found on the Public and those of us who are members of Works Committee—and I am sure that the committees will realise that. chairman, Judy Spence, would agree with In passing, I have mentioned the tabling that—through improved processes, better procedures for committee reports. I would add consultation and enhanced service delivery for that many of the procedures of this Parliament the people of the State. are lodge overdue for reassessment. A Committees in Queensland are relatively Parliament should be a vital, energetic body new and continue to be opposed—and last that reflects the demands of the time. It year I was disappointed to hear one cannot do that if it is not prepared to critically Opposition member raise this—by some who examine itself from time to time and to put do not yet recognise that in Parliaments procedures in place which acknowledge those worldwide committees are increasingly the demands. avenue by which the Parliament’s most In line with what the Leader of the House effective work can be done. All one needs to said earlier—that this debate provides an do is look at the American Congress. opportunity to make constructive However, committees are new and must be suggestions—let me make a few. In my view, nurtured. There are some things that we as a there is no need for our opening prayer to be Parliament have not yet done to see them couched in its present language. It is too operate to the greatest effect. In saying this, I verbose. I think that we should change it. do not in any way want to be critical of the Before anyone from the fundamental Right progress that has been made to date. The attacks me, let me say that I share Christian Clerk and the Deputy Clerk, Michele Cornwell, principles, but this prayer is out of date and it in particular have done an extraordinarily good needs reform. Why not make it more relevant job in that area. I congratulate them on that to today’s society and the purpose of this and I wish them well with the further advances place? Why do we not make the petition that, no doubt, we will make. process more accessible and remove some of As I have said, committees are agents of the antiquated wording that we demand? Why the Parliament and report to it. It is proper—as do we not look at our Bills procedures, at our is the case in other Parliaments—that those rules of debate and at our question reports should be subject to debate so that procedures? Parliament is the strength of this the Parliament can decide whether or not it will State, and we should all work to exercise it accept or reject their recommendations, which and make it even stronger. I would urge that brings me to an old chestnut that I have those issues be considered as part of an raised here many times before. We ongoing process. I do not seek radical reform, desperately need to look at the Standing but I seek a gradual change that is necessary. Orders of this honourable institution. They did In saying those things, I do not want my fall off the back of the ark heading west, and it position to be misunderstood. In recent years, is about time that there was a major overhaul we have come a long way. I congratulate the of those Standing Orders. I know that there Parliamentary Service Commission, the Clerk have been some difficulties getting agreement and his staff for the progress that we have between the political parties in this place. made. However, that does not mean that we However, it is about time that we took a should stop there. We must go further. bipartisan approach to the reform of the Standing Orders. They should be changed in In terms of other issues, I want to put on line with some of the Federal Standing Orders, record my appreciation of the role played by to enable debate on parliamentary committee the Education and Protocol Office. It is doing reports and so on. It is not such a huge a first-rate job. Any members who saw the change in itself, but it is an important change video that was produced, called Queensland to make committees more relevant. Parliament for the People, would have to agree that it is doing an excellent job. From Apart from placing the committee time to time, when Graeme Kinnear, Ted function and its reporting responsibility in Newton or Michele approach us, honourable context, it would, as Fitzgerald sought, help members speak at education seminars. One separate the Parliament from the Executive will be held this Thursday at which I, along with and prove that the Westminster model of other honourable members of this Parliament, parliamentary democracy is alive and well in will speak as part of the educative role. I think Queensland. Too often, distorted accusations that the Education and Protocol Office has are levelled at this Parliament that it is merely been one of the major advances in recent an extension of the Government. I do not times. It is important that we place on the mean this Assembly in its current context, but Legislative Assembly 4683 5 October 1993 public record our appreciation for the work of In conclusion, I want to raise a general that office. issue. It relates to the parliamentary It is also important that I express my committee that I used to chair. On 16 July appreciation for the work of the Hansard staff, 1991, my parliamentary committee tabled a who I think do an excellent job not only here report on an independent investigation into but also with the parliamentary committees. the allegations made by Robert David Butler They turn into English many speeches which on Channel 7 regarding Inspector John are unintelligible and simply not able to be William Huey. I want to raise that issue understood. Our speeches read much better because when such reports are tabled in the the next day. House—and public money is used to produce them—it is important that members read Mr Perrett interjected. them. Some contributions have been made in Mr BEATTIE: Indeed, the speeches of recent times by an honourable member from the honourable member are some of the ones the Gold Coast in relation to matters involving to which I refer. former police officers Harris and Reynolds I also want to thank the dining room staff; relating to Huey. Nowhere in that public the secretaries; the library and other debate, either in the newspaper coverage or parliamentary staff; the travel people; the in this Chamber, has any reference been electorate officers; the various support people; made to that parliamentary committee report. and administrative services, all of whom I think Frankly, I think that if we are going to come work incredibly hard. Recently, my office was into this House and defame people such as broken into—for the second time in the last Huey, they deserve the courtesy of an couple of years—and I was given first-class examination of the facts. service by this Parliament in order to rectify the That report, which was tabled on 16 July problem. 1991, has not been examined as part of the There is one matter to which I want to public debate. I urge the honourable member refer in detail. I think that it is important concerned to stop listening to Robert Butler. that we are making progress in the computer That man has been found to be a shonk not area. I take up the comments by the Leader just in Carter’s report, wherein it was stated of the House about the trial involving six that the man is a liar; that has also been the members linking their computers into those in conclusion reached by two independent New the library and other parliamentary places. South Wales police officers. Those officers That is important. I am pleased that we are came to Queensland to examine the Huey doing that. I know that the honourable matter, because Butler came along to my member for Mansfield was one of the people parliamentary committee at the time and involved in that trial, and no doubt she will made a whole lot of sweeping allegations. speak on that subject. It is all very well to Those two independent police officers from embrace such technical advances but, in my New South Wales—who could not have cared view, if we are to function effectively, we need less about the local scene—conducted a a second staff member in electorate offices. proper investigation and found that the Whether we start with a part-time person and allegations were totally unsubstantiated. move to a full-time person remains to be If this Parliament is to win the respect of seen. My opinion is that we need two staff the community, members have to check their members. Federal members have three; we facts before they come in here. It is all very need two. In common with many people here, well to score the one-day cheap shot, the one- my office works incredibly hard and we need day headline—that may be good politics. the extra staff to back us up. However, in this case, the honourable The restoration of the stone work of member in question is attacking a man Parliament House is another matter to which I without giving him the benefit of an want to make brief reference. I was pleased to examination. see that an amount of $730,000 has been Butler has to be one of the greatest allocated to that project. As the Speaker shonks of all time. He came to my pointed out at the Colonial George Street parliamentary committee and gave us all the Festival at the weekend, Parliament House is information. We demanded it. In fact, I said to a heritage building. I am pleased to note that him—and honourable members of the restoration of the stone work is being committee who are still here will recall undertaken. Parliament House is an important this—“You leave all the new material you have heritage building. behind. You have a certain time to provide the rest of the new material. Do not say you have not been given an opportunity.” Every one of 5 October 1993 4684 Legislative Assembly the documents and the information that was ministerial staff. At present, there are three provided were examined. The independent times the number of staff than existed under police officers found that Huey had no case to the previous Government four years ago. We answer. I do not know Huey; I have never met have seen a huge increase in the Executive the man, but I know that he is being roasted arm resources, the ministerial staff and the in a very unfair manner. The parliamentary Office of the Cabinet—an overall 25 per cent process is being abused to attack that man, increase in Government expenditure. and the full facts are not being put on the It is terribly important to look at the table. I urge those involved in this shonk to funding of this establishment. In that regard, I examine Robert Butler, who is pursuing a very want to address a number of important items. clear agenda, to examine themselves and to First of all, there is the televising of Parliament. examine their responsibility to the dignity of The report of the Parliamentary Committee for this Assembly. Electoral and Administrative Review on Time expired. information and resource needs of non- Mr BEANLAND (Indooroopilly) Government members of the Queensland (7.45 p.m.): I rise to speak on a number of Legislative Assembly contained a issues, mainly the televising of Parliament, the recommendation that the proceedings of this proposed Budget Estimates committees, Parliament be televised. Of course, that Opposition staff resources, the library and the matter was also mentioned in the EARC Ombudsman’s report. I also want to make report. That report came down in December some general comments. 1991. The report of the parliamentary committee came down in March 1992. To At the outset, let me congratulate all the date, all we have heard is a deafening silence. parliamentary staff, who function in this place No action has been taken at all. If Labor under what are at times very difficult backbench members were genuine in their circumstances. It is fair to say that at present desire to achieve the effective operation of they are facing extremely difficult this place, they would be pressing for the circumstances. I particularly acknowledge the televising of this Parliament. They talk a great Clerk and the Deputy Clerk for the role that deal about open and accountable they play in the functioning of this place in an government and the effectiveness of this atmosphere of continuous upheaval. place, but what a farce it really is. The proper funding of Parliament is a vital Even the proceedings of the Kremlin are key to the efficient and effective operation of televised. The EARC report outlines the history Government. After all, we hear a great deal of the televising of the Federal Parliament. from Government members about the Every evening during session, we can see separation of powers—the Legislature, the question time and other business of the Executive and the judiciary. We constantly see Federal Parliament on television, yet there is an upgrading of the resources of the nothing about the State Parliament, unless Executive and, from time to time, improved press conferences are held. That is simply not resources for the judiciary. However, the good enough. Regardless of the number of Parliament—the Legislature—seems to miss viewers and the newsworthiness of the out. Of course, we know that, at the end of debate, the media ought to be able to televise the day, both of those other arms are the proceedings of this place. After all, responsible to this Parliament. Therefore, it is television is one of the major means of terribly important that this Parliament be given transmitting news in this day and age, adequate funding. particularly with the tyranny of distance. Not There is plenty of funding for the everyone can attend Parliament to see how it Executive arm. In fact, expenditure was up 25 functions. What does the Premier have to per cent over the past four years. The Office hide? What does the Ministry have to hide? I of the Cabinet now has 75 staff, costing suggest that they are embarrassed about their $7.4m. Four years ago, prior to the change of behaviour in this place. They are always Government, there was no Office of the looking for excuses and they are continuously Cabinet, no 75 staff and no $7.4m. Of course, hiding behind a wall of secrecy. It is all part of the Office of the Cabinet serves only to the deceitfulness that goes on in this place. I second-guess the various ministerial am sure that, if we got over this lack of departments. That is where the decisions accountability, the effectiveness of the should be made. All it means is that the operation of this Chamber would improve Premier does not have confidence in his own considerably. Therefore, I appeal to the Ministers and in his own departments. Of Premier and to the Minister to once again course, we have seen a huge increase in the consider the matter. Legislative Assembly 4685 5 October 1993

I will now address the cost of introducing client demand and needs. They were nice televising of Parliament. The networks have words from the parliamentary committee, but made a submission. I know that one of the that was all they were. At the end of the day, arms of Government came up with a price of members of Parliament are not in receipt of over $2m. I do not believe it will cost that the depth of research that can be obtained much. I am sure that the networks would look from the Commonwealth Parliamentary Library at another way of attacking the problem so on a broad range of issues. As well, they do that the cost is reasonable and we can get on not receive personal briefings by research with the televising of this Chamber. If staff. In Queensland, because of the pressure Parliament were to be televised, the of time and the lack of resources which the community’s attitude towards the Parliament Parliamentary Library has, members simply would improve greatly. What has the receive a press clipping service. Government got to hide? If it is genuine about Members know that a number of openness and accountability, televising of computer services have been cut back Parliament will be allowed to proceed. because of the cost. As I have pointed out, I turn now to the Parliamentary Library. In when it comes to cost, the Executive arm of recent times, significant changes have Government always has plenty of money; but occurred in the library. Recently, I made a when it comes to servicing this place, the lengthy submission to the Speaker and to the cutbacks continue apace. That is what is leaders about the library. The service provided happening. We are not keeping up with the by the State Parliamentary Library is falling technology and the amount of material that well behind that provided by the members are required to grasp in their day-to- Commonwealth Parliamentary Library, whose day activities. I appeal again, Mr Chairman, to service covers a broad range of issues. It is you and to the Minister to look at that area. not the fault of the library staff, whom I I turn now to resources for Opposition congratulate on the splendid work that they do staff. The Electoral and Administrative Review under difficult operating conditions because of Commission produced a very lengthy and the changes and cutbacks which the detailed report on the resources of staff, as Government is currently making across-the- did the parliamentary committee. Those board in the Parliamentary Service area. But reports were delivered a couple of years ago, that does not account for the fact that, yet nothing has happened in relation to them. through a lack of staff and the tremendous In December 1991, Ministers employed 185 pressure that is put on the Parliamentary staff members—an averaging staffing level of Library, at the end of the day members do not 10. The parliamentary committee confirmed get the type of research and the grade of that the opposition parties’ staff establishment research that they look for. In many cases, the should be maintained at 20 per cent of the material supplied is vastly inferior to that which staff establishment of ministerial offices, again Federal members receive from the as a check and balance on ministerial offices. Commonwealth Parliamentary Library. As the Minister knows, if his staff increases, These days, a huge volume of reports the Opposition’s staff increases. That is an are produced. It is impossible for members of incentive to keep down ministerial staff— Parliament to read them all. Therefore, they another form of accountability. rely more and more upon the resources that The Electoral and Administrative Review the Parliamentary Library research staff have Commission recommended also that the staff to provide them with summaries and establishment of the opposition parties should necessary points that they must raise. The reflect parity with the salary profile of library has very well qualified staff. I am not in ministerial staff. None of that has happened. If any shape or form having a go at them. But I Opposition offices received a similar number am certainly having a go at the cutbacks that of staff, the figure would be in the vicinity of 37 have been brought about by the Government staff members. The number would probably in this place and the way in which the library is be greater today, because I am sure that treated. additional staff numbers have been added to The EARC report made significant ministerial offices. Certainly, there would not recommendations about the library. It have been a decrease in numbers. The recommended that the Queensland Minister for Primary Industries has appointed Parliamentary Library should put in place a 19 ministerial staff. Some Ministers have three system for assessing client satisfaction with times the number of staff that Ministers had the research and reference services provided four years ago. We have had cutbacks in by the library, in order to ensure that the library services, no increase in staff numbers in services offered are resourced in line with the library, and no additional resources which 5 October 1993 4686 Legislative Assembly are needed in this place. However, there is a Mr Mackenroth: You tried that. plentiful supply of funds for the Executive arm Mr BEANLAND: I tried it, and I want to of Government. keep trying it. There is a real need to improve I turn now to Estimates committees. the way in which question time functions and Twelve months ago, EARC recommended the to upgrade the role of backbenchers, which I introduction of Estimates committees. One have already outlined, to ensure that there is would have expected that mention would an effective role for members in this place in have been made of those following the contrast to control by the Executive arm of election and that they would be in place by Government, which continually sees its now. I appeal for consideration to be given to resources upgraded. the introduction of Estimates committees. We I conclude on the role of the have a growing Executive arm of Government. Parliamentary Service Commission and the History is about the levying of taxes and Ombudsman, who is an officer of this expenditure of those taxes without Parliament. The report tabled today in this parliamentary consent. That is well and truly Chamber highlights the fact that the outlined in EARC documents. However, in this Ombudsman is most unhappy with aspects of place, we still use a very antiquated system to the Government’s activities, particularly in debate the Budget Estimates. relation to corporatisation legislation. He We do not have a proper parliamentary roundly attacked this Government for its failure scrutiny system of Estimates committees so to allow new corporate identities to be that Ministers and senior public servants can supervised by the Ombudsman. be brought before those committees and Time expired. questioned about the effectiveness and efficiency of their departmental operations and Mr D’ARCY (Woodridge) (8 p.m.): This is the way in which funds are being spent. There one debate in which I could really have a field is not a word of it. I understand that the day. But being a forward-looking person, I will Minister wanted some suggestions, which he try to look to the future. From listening to is receiving. I look forward to his putting them some Opposition speakers, one would think into operation. I look forward to a bit of action, that we are suffering from a terrible malaise. I something which he is very reticent to take shall give honourable members a bit of when it comes to this place. His party background on improvements that have been abolished the Upper House, which was the made in the provision of resources during my House of review. We have only one House of long experience in this place. Some members Parliament in this place. Therefore, it is even opposite will perhaps blush with shame when more imperative that we have a proper they hear about some of the conditions that Estimates committee in this post-Fitzgerald existed under their former Governments. era. There was no opportunity to form an effective Opposition in those days. The Government espouses that it welcomes open and accountable When I first became a member of this Government. Yet what we see in action is Assembly, members did not have secretaries, vastly different from the rhetoric. All we have is let alone electorate offices. There was no such chatter. We hear the chatter from the thing in my first term in the Parliament. That chattering classes about open and came much later. When members consider accountable Government, yet there is no real what they have today in a general sense in action to back that up in sheer work, allowing the Parliament, they might all have a this place to function as it should. complaint or two. There are plenty of things that could be improved and done at very little In outlining the benefits of televising cost, and I will outline them later. The fact is Parliament, the Estimates committees and that times have changed. Government is a adequate resources for Opposition staff, I much more serious business than it was. believe I present a very clear case for open Governments handle very big Budgets. and accountable Government. This Goss Parliamentarians must live up to the Labor Government regularly tells the people of conditions to which they aspire. If we do not Queensland that they are in for sweeping look to the future of the State from our changes, yet that is far from the truth. We get position here, there is no chance of the State a wall of secrecy in this post-Fitzgerald era. progressing as it should. Each and every I will touch briefly on the need to upgrade member of Parliament is held in much better Standing Orders and improve question stead by this Labor Government than they time—matters that I have alluded to on a were by any conservative Government. number of occasions in this Chamber. Legislative Assembly 4687 5 October 1993

Before I became a member of committees into account. I was talking about Parliament, I saw Cecil Carey, the former real parliamentary committees. member for Albert, standing in a classroom full Mr Bredhauer: He is complaining that he of teachers and principals bemoaning the is overworked. conditions under which parliamentarians worked. Most people were shocked by that. I Mr D’ARCY: I realise that. The fact of life am sure that the honourable member for is that the committee system is quite valuable. Mansfield was there at that time. I believe that It is a tragedy that, in Opposition, some of our she was sitting beside me. Some people were Ministers were not exposed to that system. shocked that the National Party, even in The committee system has become a part of Government, put up with some of those the British Commonwealth, Commonwealth conditions. In recent times, things have Parliaments, the American system and every improved dramatically. Parliamentarians now other major parliamentary system in the have reasonable conditions that are paid for Western World. Most of our current Ministers by the Parliamentary Service Commission. have not been exposed to that system. That Those conditions have quite a bit to do with is a shame, because perhaps they do not the field of communications and the new understand it as well as they might. A ideas that are being trialled. At every turn we committee system is not something to be are attempting to continue to streamline the frightened of or sneezed at. The people of processes of what we expect in the year 2000 Queensland are demanding that we move and the twenty-first century. into the twenty-first century. The only way to do that is with a true committee system. The member for Toowong spoke about conditions for members of the Opposition. I I was pleased to see the Deputy Clerk of was Deputy Leader of the Opposition during the Parliament travel overseas recently to 1981-82. I had no facilities at all. The only England. She has had vast experience of the thing that I got was a small increase in salary various committee systems in Australia, of about $1,000 a year. I had no staff, no having worked in the Senate—where my good facilities and no extra room. After that time, friend Lionel Murphy introduced a very wide- things started to improve. I am sure that ranging committee system—and various other conditions were no different 10 years prior to places. We must adopt on a global basis the that. But things have changed under this EARC recommendations in relation to a Government. There have been some very parliamentary committee system. Our current positive moves. We are looking at moving into committee system within the Parliament is the twenty-first century. working as far as it is allowed to work, but it should be extended. One Opposition member I congratulate the Government on the noted that members probably would not be moves that are being made towards the having this direct debate in this Chamber on committee style of Government. The EARC the Estimates if they had been able to use a report on parliamentary committees has been system such as that operating in most western released. Some parliamentary committees are countries whereby they could talk to the already operating. Under previous people who actually draw up the budgets National/Liberal Party Governments, the within departments. But that does not Liberals made some moves towards a PAC. preclude this debate, which should always As members would be aware, that caused a take place within this Chamber. split between those parties. That was a very interesting period. Some committees did I was fortunate to look at the committee come into existence. The Premier of the day, systems that operate on an Estimate and Sir Joh Bjelke-Petersen, set up the Education legislative basis throughout Australia. As a Committee to keep Mike Ahern out of his hair. member of the PAC, I was also able to see He made him the Chairman of the Education the Senate EARC committee in operation. Committee, which was an all-party committee. When I was in England, I saw the system I think that it was the only parliamentary working in Westminster. I also saw the committee that served as a parliamentary committee system that operates in New committee in real terms during the time of the Zealand. The implementation of the EARC Bjelke-Petersen Government. recommendations would probably result in an extension of the best of those systems. That Mr Milliner: I was on the Printing would give the Parliament a legislative role Committee for 12 years and it met three whereby members of committees can talk to times. people drawing up budgets. If the Mr D’ARCY: I did not take standing parliamentary system works correctly, it takes away a lot of the humbug in many of the 5 October 1993 4688 Legislative Assembly departmental reports. I am not being unkind question marks over them. Members sign to members, because I do have some dockets, and they believe in their own minds financial expertise, but I would find it very that that docket is totally legitimate. I cannot difficult to make any sense of the figures that see why, even if the Parliamentary Service are generally presented in reports without Commission reduces some of the costs, it going into in-depth research and being able to does not save the cost of all that processing question departmental people or the Auditor- and give members an allowance. That system General as to how those figures were arrived has been adopted in other Houses of at. Parliament, and I cannot understand why that We are moving towards a committee does not occur here. There is some mental system that will provide a legislative review blockage there that still allows that scrutiny of system and an Estimate review system while such things as Cabcharge to occur, and it is retaining the overall pattern whereby totally wrong. committees such as the PAC and others can Ever since I have been a member of this make a contribution to the legislative life of the Assembly, a journalist has taken a cheap shot State. That would be a tremendous at the parliamentary dining room. As an advantage. Unless that occurs, we will not be honourable member pointed out earlier, moving forward with other Parliaments. Parliament House is second on the list of I congratulate the staff with whom I have heritage buildings in this State. It is the worked. One member mentioned the premier institution in this State. We must Parliamentary Library staff. In my time as a maintain it at a reasonable level without member, that staff has always been a ducking for cover and having people running tremendous help. They have put together away every time some journalist or newspaper some tremendous packages for me and have takes a cheap shot. I will just read some of the always bent over backwards and been headlines over the last few years which I have tremendously helpful whenever I have needed dug out, with the help of the Parliamentary anything. I think that the staff of the various Library. There was a positive one from Peter committees—the PAC, EARC and the Public Trundle in 1975 with the headline, “MLAs pay Works Committee—and those whom I have more to eat”. Then he had a shot at us. seen working from the committee staffroom Another headline in 1977 stated, “Politicians are dedicated. They are certainly looking at a like their meals cheap”. A headline in 1978 reform of the public sector, and giving stated, “A budget meal to fill the MP’s Bill”; Queensland better value for money. and “Fatcats dine in style and we foot the bill”, by Ken Gordon, in the Truth, of course, in As for electorate officers—I know that we 1980. That article stated that it cost are introducing streamlining into procedures, Queensland taxpayers more than $250,000 a but all the streamlining in the world does not year to feed our 82 State politicians. Another take away from the work that our electorate headline stated, “Taxpayers have to pick up secretaries do, particularly when we are going MPs’ tab”, and the article referred to taxpayers to lose some of the backbench staff within the subsidising the Parliament to the tune of parliamentary precincts. Anyone who does not $900,000. Another article stated, “Round-the- believe that his or her electorate secretary clock drinks for our stay-awake MPs.” Even an works long and difficult hours with complicated editor got going and wrote an editorial titled, machinery to preserve his or her members’ “The perks of State Members”. It goes on, and integrity does not know what politics is about, it is going to go on ad infinitum, no matter or does not represent a difficult seat such as what we do. Woodridge. However, the fact of life is that members do need extra help in that regard. However, I seem to receive some very Instead of the new-fangled gadgets that are large tabs. I query the way they are put being tried out from time to time, perhaps we together. That is another point, and I will not could investigate ways of supplying more help have time to go into it. I just did a quick check at electorate office level. and found out that, in the bar, an ordinary stubby costs $2. I know where they can be I want to raise a couple of matters. bought. A nip of spirits costs $2.20 plus splits. Historically, I have been through most of the A beer off the tap costs $1.30—but one inquiries that have raised their heads either cannot buy a beer off the tap in the Members’ completely or otherwise at one time or another Bar. The wine cellar has gone to pot because in this Chamber. Members of Parliament are the wine is too dear and one can buy it still open to scrutiny on things that should not cheaper at any hotel. The same applies to the be open to scrutiny. In other words, matters price of beer. The cellar that was operating in are raised in this Chamber which have quite a commercial manner is now not Legislative Assembly 4689 5 October 1993 working. Some other parties have tried to non-negotiable, the strategies proposed to lease out the dining room facilities and charge achieve those savings will need to be full prices. To some extent, that has worked, considered by the Savings Task Force recently but in other areas, it has not. established by Cabinet. So much for no All of those journalists who complain interference by the Executive! The PSC has forget that they receive a meal allowance. As no say in how much money it needs or wants, workers in this area, we should be treated in and now it has had very little say in where the the same way. I am not complaining, for the savings are to be made. In fact, the Chairman simple reason that nobody is going to listen to of the PSC appeared before the Budget me, but it should be put on record, and I am Review Committee, and he likened this to the putting it on record that that is the case. role of the head of a department who has to justify expenditure. This is quite a wrong Time expired. analogy. He is not a departmental head, and Mrs McCAULEY (Callide) (8.16 p.m.): we are not a Government department. Last year, I said in my speech on these Parliament is a unique body and, as such, Budget Estimates that the Parliamentary should be responsible for the running of its Service Commission was the worst committee own facilities, without any suggestions from on which I have ever served. I believe that it the Treasurer. now behoves me to look at the workings of If the Government intends, as it obviously the commission over the past year and see does, to treat Parliament as just another whether I continue to have the same opinion Government body or a Government that I had last year. department, then why does it persevere with When the PSC was set up, it was with the the Parliamentary Service Commission—a idea of it being an autonomous body. The body of people who are paid to serve and to then Minister for Finance, Brian Austin, said— make decisions, yet we find that the chairman “The Executive arm of Government of the commission makes all the major will have no control over the commission.” decisions without any consultation at all with us. When we start to question those decisions In the debate on the Parliamentary closely, he totally loses his cool. Those riding Service Bill, the present Minister who serves instructions to him come from either the on the PSC, Mr Mackenroth, said— Premier, the Treasurer or Mr Mackenroth. “. . . the commission itself will set the I object to being asked by fax on 12 budget; the commission will bring that August to agree to a proposed trip to New budget before the House; the House will Zealand by one of the parliamentary approve the budget and it will be sent to committees that is due to take place four days the Executive arm of Government whose later. I would imagine by that stage that responsibility it is to find the money.” passports have been organised, that tickets Does the honourable member remember have been booked; in other words, it is a saying that? complete nonsense asking for my agreement Mr Mackenroth: 1988. to something which is going to take place anyway, and which is virtually a fait accompli. Mrs McCAULEY: Yes. Let me focus on those parliamentary Mr Mackenroth: That, I might add, is in a committees and the work that they do. Lots of totally different way to the way it works. reports come forward, but rarely is anything Mrs McCAULEY: It was certainly wide of decisive done about them. For example, I the mark. The Treasurer, Mr De Lacy, refer to the Parliamentary Committee for expressed his concern during the same Electoral and Administrative Review and its debate—although he was not the Treasurer at report on whistleblowers and the need for that time, of course—about the involvement of protection for council employees, who the Executive in the PSC. He said— reportedly alleged corruption to the CJC on 9 “I am concerned that in Queensland October 1990. On 19 October 1990, the then the changes have been initiated—and will Minister for Local Government, Mr Tom Burns, continue to a certain extent to be said that he would introduce such legislation directed—by the Executive.” into Parliament in March 1991, and we are still waiting! The Public Works Committee—a That is the same person who wrote to the more useless committee it would be hard to Chairman of the PSC recently in his capacity find—recently brought down a report of an as Treasurer, suggesting areas where funds inquiry into the Queensland Centre for could be saved and stating quite categorically Advanced Technologies. Its first that while the targets that have been set are recommendation was that all those involved 5 October 1993 4690 Legislative Assembly with the establishment of the facility be I turn now to the Education and Protocol congratulated. We paid good money for that Office, which is the baby of the Chairman of sort of nonsense. It was absolutely useless. the PSC. This division costs more than What a waste of time, effort and $180,000 each year to run and the staff has money—particularly money. expanded to three, one of whom is a Labor The Public Accounts Committee issued a Party hack for whom it seems a job cannot be report on the financial administration of found anywhere else. I must make it clear that Aboriginal and island councils, and we will I have nothing against the people who work in know that they are a useful bunch when the this division, but I feel that the whole set-up is outrageous mismanagement of those councils a gross waste of money at a time when we ceases. But it has not happened yet, nor will are required to watch our pennies. It is a it, is my guess, if what I am hearing about luxury that we cannot afford and it should not Woorabinda is true. The Travelsafe be there. The Education and Protocol Office Committee produces high quality reports, and has produced two videos for schools and a it seems to be far more professional than any third is presently in the making. I believe that of the other committees, but the irony of that this cost is not justified and that such projects is that, unlike all the other hangers on, its are not the role of Parliament. This office is members do not get paid to serve on that also producing a parliamentary and electoral committee. education Fastfacts compilation, which again I do not believe we can afford. Today I asked for information about various trips that various committees have If the Education Minister wants to see the been on. I asked the Chairman of the PSC at youth of this State educated in the workings of our last meeting whether I could have that Parliament—and we would all agree with information and, today, when I contacted the that—then he should foot the bill, not the Clerk and said that I did not yet have that PSC, at the expense of, say, our library information, eventually the word came back to service which has suffered a very real cutback me that I could not get that information today, in funds in the past 12 months of some 4.3 that I could not get it until the next PSC per cent. This is despite the fact that total meeting. I found that rather interesting. information requests to the Parliamentary Library have increased to a figure of more In an effort to save funds within the PSC than 8 500 in the 1992-93 year. Let me say at budget, all areas of administration have been this point that I am more than pleased with looked at to ascertain efficiency and the service that I receive from the people who overmanning levels, and cutbacks in staffing staff the Parliamentary Library. They are have been made in some areas. I have no always eager to please. At the moment, we quarrel with that, but the way in which this has are working our way through some concerns been done leaves a lot to be desired. At a that members have expressed about the recent PSC meeting it was moved and service provided to them. I guess there are seconded by Government members that there perhaps some weak links there. However, I did be no sackings or involuntary retrenchments, call a meeting at one stage, and I had to and we all agreed. This move was to try to cancel it because I could not get anybody to settle down the staff who have been abuzz come along to it, so I do not know whether the with rumour for some considerable time over concerns are all that great. Nor should budgetary cutbacks and because of prior educational videos be made at the expense actions in dealing with the rationalisation of of providing a decent electorate office for staff issues. For example, I know that the someone such as the member for Burdekin, security staff were told that there had to be whose electorate facilities leave a great deal eight voluntary early retirements from their to be desired, I understand. ranks or they would all be downgraded to the pay status of attendants. What is that if it is A noticeable trend of the management of not threat and intimidation? this complex has been towards employing more middle management staff at a cost of Having achieved the curtailment of staff jobs in the service sector. I could cite several thought necessary in the security area, an in- examples of this, but lack of time precludes service training course was commenced me from doing so. They are readily available. immediately at the Police Academy which left It concerns me that we are putting on people the place so grossly undermanned that two in the middle management area and dropping men over 65, who have been retired for more them off at the bottom end. than a year, were brought in to fill in. How is that for management of resources? It is not There has been a proliferation of very good as far as I am concerned. paperwork in the daily routine of this place. A copy of the Votes and Proceedings and the Legislative Assembly 4691 5 October 1993

Orders of the Day is put on all members’ arise because members live here. When desks and then, when we come into the members are living here, they do not want the Chamber, we get another copy of the Orders place to have a sterile atmosphere. They want of the Day and a copy of the Daily Program. I it to be a bit more friendly and homely, I see that we now get an information bulletin on guess. our various committees called Committee Finally, to end on a positive note, things Update. That comes out—— are not all bad. I am very grateful for the extra Mr Mackenroth: Don’t you like that? equipment that members have been given for Mrs McCAULEY: No, I do not. I do not their electorate offices. The 008 number has see any point in it. It is a waste of money. made a tremendous difference to the area Why do it? We do not need it. We also get a that I service, which is the sixth largest in the document called Business of the Assembly State, and covers some 71 000 square which, again, we do not need. We do not kilometres. I can tell honourable members that need it at all. It is a waste of money. When we it is ageing me fast. The other equipment for are looking at cutting costs, why do we not cut which I am extremely grateful is the mobile the costs there? It is as simple as that. phones. All of those things have made my life a great deal easier. They have also made the Mr Mackenroth: Get the Opposition to life of my electorate staff a great deal easier. I do up a list of all the things they don’t want. am thankful for that equipment. If we cannot Mrs McCAULEY: I raise all of these have extra staff, then the extra equipment will matters at the PSC meetings and, of course, I serve, and it is certainly very welcome indeed. get rolled. That is why I raise them now. I would just like to say that I do not think Mr Mackenroth: Kev Lingard repeatedly the use of this complex for political tells me that the Parliamentary Service purposes—a number of political functions Commission should be abolished. have been held here of late—is something Mrs McCAULEY: I would not hesitate to that ought to be encouraged. I do not think say that the running of everything for which that having political functions on the barbecue the Parliamentary Service Commission is level is something that we should be seeking responsible has deteriorated badly since the to foster in this place, particularly if the Goss Government came to power. I believe function is being held to raise funds. I think that conditions will get to the stage at which that goes against all of the things that this the only solution to the many problems we will whole complex stands for and what it does. I, encounter in regard to running this complex for one, am not keen to see Level 7 put to will be for members to live outside it. Of use as a fund-raiser for members’ political course, as this is the only Parliament in parties. Australia where members actually live on site, Mr Mackenroth: Say some nice things we do have some problems that are unique to about me for two minutes. this complex in areas such as security. I am Mrs McCAULEY: No, I will just sit down ever mindful of the fact that we live here, our instead. It is easier. families come in to see us, and our friends come in to see us. If we make security too Ms POWER (Mansfield) (8.29 p.m.): In stringent, our friends and families will not feel this year’s annual report, the functions of the welcome in this place. We have to be mindful Parliamentary Service Commission are of that. outlined. Paragraph (c) states that the size and organisation of the services to be Because of the pressures caused by provided by the Parliamentary Service is one limited space in this complex, I think the day of those functions. will come when members will have to look very seriously at living outside of it and being paid The commission was established primarily a living-away-from-home allowance so that to ensure that the interests and views of they can get away from the place. Those members are represented in the floors that now comprise members’ offices will administration of the Parliament. At the end of be used for something else. In fact, a the day, that objective must be the measure submission on that is currently being by which the success or failure of the considered. A study is being undertaken to commission is judged. It is those two ascertain whether or not that is a viable objectives that I wish to address firstly. proposition. It is certainly something that I Over the past few years, the commission have thought about long and hard. I think that has begun a program of reform, and those is probably what will happen, simply in an changes have attracted praise in some areas effort to solve some of the problems that do and criticism in others. Since my election, I 5 October 1993 4692 Legislative Assembly have found most members of staff to be Parliament to members’ offices on the pilot helpful and willing to please. The nature of this program through Parl-Airs. I have been place is that sometimes it is very hectic and, at pleased to trial the pilot program in my other times, it slows down almost to a electorate and in Parliament House. Although standstill. To organise workers and resources it would be difficult to cost the efficiencies that under those conditions is not easy, and that have occurred from the use of the computer, it cannot be denied. has certainly been useful in our office. The commission has had some measure The first issue that I would like to look at of success, but it is quite obvious, as usual, is that of the time-saving factor. Through the that the number of workers—that is, those pilot program, I have been able to send who provide the service—has been reduced messages from the electorate to the House. but that the middle management—the My electorate staff have been able to put organisers and the supervisors—has remained things onto the computer if I am not available static or increased. I note that that issue was either by phone, by fax or by beeper. I have raised by the member for Callide. That will then been able to access those things. I have probably be a first in this place that the also been able to access the information on member for Callide and I have agreed on a the computer rather than going through files point. and Hansard. There is quite a big time saving Whether the commission has been more between pushing a button on a computer and successful than the previous administration is filing through 500 or 600 pages of Hansard. debatable. It is probably worthy of debate, but In terms of serving my I do not intend to canvass the whole issue in constituency—when people ring up or come the Estimates debate tonight. For whatever into my office wanting some information on a the system, the service here and in the Bill that has been introduced into the House, electorate is what really counts. Despite the on the computer I am able to refer them media infatuation with subsidised meals and immediately to the Minister’s second-reading drinks, they probably appreciate that service speech. If they want to see quotes from the much more than I ever do. Opposition or know what the position of the The commission provides many services Opposition was on the Bill, I am able to pull up that, as a member, I appreciate and that flow the speeches of Opposition members. If on to my electorate and my constituents. people want that information to take back to Those services have enhanced my ability to their organisation, I am able to print it. That is function as an effective member. Every certainly much easier than trying to photocopy member plays numerous roles. Functions a Hansard pamphlet with about 1 000 pages depend on the electorate in which one serves, in it. its marginality, the number of years one has Quite often, information is much easier to been in the service, the size of one’s find, because one simply types the name of electorate and the roles that one holds in the the Bill and the information comes up. It is all Parliament or in one’s party organisation, to there. It prints off nice and neatly, and people name a few. can take it away. During the pilot program, No-one would dispute that, because of all numerous constituents commented on how of those variables, some services are more efficient that has been and asked why were useful to some members than to others. For not some other members on the south side me, the introduction of the members’ network lucky enough to have it. For that very reason, I pilot program through Information Technology have also done a bit of work for some of my Services has been very useful. In the past neighbouring members. year, the major introduction of computer During sitting times, it has been very technology has aided the production of Votes useful to my electorate staff. Although I am and Proceedings and the Order of Business only 20 minutes down the road, sometimes paper, as well as the pilot program in the they do not see me from Tuesday till electorates. Thursday. They are able to put all of my After engaging a consultant to assess the messages on the computer and send them in needs of the Table Office, the hardware has to me. They can send letters in for me to been upgraded to ensure compatibility check, sign and then send back through the between the users of the network. During the E-Mail system. year, as a result of that new technology, As well as that, speech writing and other efficiencies, improved work practices and cost services have been certainly improved by my savings were achieved. The Table Office now ability to access the library and carry out provides the full text of Bills introduced into the research through Easy Search. Firstly, it is a Legislative Assembly 4693 5 October 1993 big saver on paper because I do not need the research and other purposes. Our operation in library to send me out 55 pages of every that respect has changed. During those hours, article that it holds on a topic. I can call up the we can activate the computer for information information on the screen and decide which and we can follow it up with the library the next articles are useful to the area of research that day. We try also not to activate the system I want. I then only need to order those from more than about three times a day. We let the the Parliament and print off the one or two information build up into a file and do it all in sheets to fax back to the library. When I one go. became really clever, I could E-Mail them back As I mentioned earlier, I have new staff, to the library. It took us a few weeks of and both staff members commented on the practice before we could do that. help that the technology section gave us. The other good part about having that After their initial training, they found that the information on the computer is that, during the system was easy to use. When they were in day, one gets busy. One does not always trouble, they had only to make a phone call have the luxury of doing research during the and they received quick and helpful day. For some reason, the phone rings or responses. The staff in that section were very constituents think that they should have my patient with us as we worked through it. That time. We have been able to access the paid off in the end. research section in the evenings and on the The E-Mail component of the technology weekends, either in the electorate office or, allows members to do a whole range of being a city member, I have the luxury of things. As I said earlier, we are able to send being able to come in here and use the messages from the electorate office into the computer in my office. Parliament and vice versa, and we can also The second part of that is that I do not send documents. If somebody drops off have to wait for a library staff member to do information and letters are typed up, they can the work. I would say that I have eased the be sent back here. In addition, my electorate burden of some library staff, thus allowing staff can be in constant contact with the other members to access their services. They parliamentary staff. That has helped to bridge are probably grateful for that. the gap between a “them and us” mentality. The other part that has made a big We learned the skill of taking our Electsys difference is that the computer system has straight from a document and putting our changed the way in which the electorate office updates on the computer. We even learned operates. We trialled the pilot program at the that we were supposed to do back-ups every same time as I changed my electorate staff Friday, or a couple of times during the week. from one operator to a job-share arrangement Because we seem to be using the computer a between two other members. It was a very lot more, those things do not slip our mind as detailed learning process. I pay tribute to the often as they probably did before. We do all technology staff for their patience and their our stationery orders by document exchange cooperation with our learning process. At the on the E-Mail. That means that one can look end of the day, it was worth while. I think that back over what one ordered last time and the technology staff would say that our office make changes to the order so that one knows has been very successful at using the new what one has been ordering and can keep an technology. eye on it. I am sure that will be a cost saving. We try to make sure that we do not log In the past, I had no idea what I had ordered on all day, every day, because that is a big on the last occasion and I often reordered the cost. We log on for mail both in the morning same items. and the afternoon. We are able to pick up We also started to use the notebook information that I would have sent out to my section in the trial. That program means that staff or that officers at Parliament House have members can keep current constituent sent out. I know from talking to my officers matters on file. If a constituent rings up to find that they both feel as though they are out where he or she is in the process, we employees of the Parliament rather than simply have to turn on the computer, bring up officers out in an electorate. notebook and all the information is presented We have also been able to change our about where a matter has gone and its office hours. Having that facility, we can open progress. Members can appreciate that as my up to meet the needs of our working clients. office has two part-time employees, two We now operate from 4.30 to 6.30 three volunteers and myself coming and going, that afternoons a week. We find that we can is a very efficient use of our time and effort. operate by logging onto the computer for 5 October 1993 4694 Legislative Assembly

We do not have to go to the filing cabinets to on my speech list. I knew that I had not made find all that information. as many speeches as were detailed on the Looking to the future, I hope that the list. I have had to fine-tune my use of Easy next group of people who participate in the Search and, rather than looking for my name, trial are members of committees, such as the more often than not I look for my electorate. Parliamentary Committee for Electoral and Mr Bredhauer interjected. Administrative Review, although three of its Ms POWER: No, thank you; definitely members are already part of the trial, being not. It certainly has been a time saver, in that the members for Lockyer, Caboolture and one can simply log on when it is myself. I believe that we would save an awful convenient—whether that be early in the lot of time and paper—and probably even morning, late in the afternoon or in the lunch some meetings—by having the committee’s hour if one gets a bit of peace. One does not paperwork all done on the computer and need to print everything off; it is just displayed simply sent out to our offices. No paper would on the screen. People can make decisions have to be used; it would simply be on the about what they want and need rather than computer screen. One could make the having the library—— changes and E-Mail the document to the next member, who would be able to make Time expired. comments. I found it to be quite a secure Mr SANTORO (Clayfield—Deputy Leader system. One logs on and has a personal of the Liberal Party) (8.44 p.m.): It is my great security number. I do not think that the pleasure to participate in the debate on the committee system would lose any information Estimates of the Executive and the by using the system. Certainly, for members Legislature. In the brief time available to me, I such as the chairperson of the Parliamentary wish to make some brief comments about the Committee for Electoral and Administrative general running of the Parliament and to Review, the member for Barron River, and the make mention of the basic lack of reform in member for Hinchinbrook, I am sure that it this place since Labor came to power. I also would save a number of trips to Brisbane for wish to place on record my appreciation to meetings to look over draft copies of reports. I several people and departments for the hope to see that extension embraced. I excellent service that they provide to members believe that it would be a useful exercise in of this Parliament, despite some very difficult cost cutting not only in travel but also in the problems with which they are confronted. number of trees that we kill each time we There have been some welcome produce a committee report. changes to the running of this House since I am sure also that we could have our the Government came to power—and travel arrangements E-Mailed out to us. Any members on this side of the House changes that we wanted to make could then acknowledge that fact—including the Matter of be sent back, and so the list goes on. I Special Public Importance debate each believe that, at the end of the day, the only Wednesday, the second Adjournment debate limitations to the pilot scheme would be the and the relaxation of restrictions on the abilities of members and their office staff. As availability and distribution of Hansard proofs. one made more creative and frequent use of However, beyond these changes it is difficult the system, one would find that it would to notice much progress in the area of become a daily part of one’s existence and parliamentary reform. As I say this, would make life much easier. Government members should remind I turn now to Easy Search. In doing so, I themselves of the fact that the establishment pay tribute to the library staff and computer of the EARC and the CJC parliamentary services for the development of Easy Search. committees found its impetus from forces When we first started working with Easy outside of this place and were established by Search, I have to say that I had a lot of legislation introduced by the National Party trouble. We wanted to find speeches—— Government. Those committees have already done much pioneering work towards helping Mr Bredhauer: “Hard Search”. to restore a proper balance between the Ms POWER: It was not the program Executive and the Parliament. This should be itself. I am afraid that I have the unfortunate recognised and it should be appreciated by luck of having a name that everybody likes to everybody inside and outside of this place. use in their speeches. When I logged on to The previous CJC parliamentary find speeches that were made by “Power”, committee was fearless in its independent every time members made comments about tackling of the tricky issues which came before “power” during their speeches, they came up it. Similarly, the current Public Accounts Legislative Assembly 4695 5 October 1993

Committee is doing much good work and is today, as much as they did in those very rapidly establishing a reputation for a desire to controversial and turbulent times. relentlessly pursue accountable financial The key element in any process of reform administration through the intense scrutiny of is to allow individual members of Parliament to senior management within the public sector. give voice to the views of their constituents. At At the same time, the committee is present, the vast majority of the time of establishing a relationship with the Auditor- Parliament is devoted to the agenda dictated General of this State which will further by the Government, that is, its program of enhance the achievement of that objective. legislation, which takes precedence over all As a Liberal, I am particularly proud to be other matters. Irrespective of the worth or a member of the parliamentary Public urgency of Government legislation, there is no Accounts Committee. It should not be doubt that the Parliament cannot fulfil its forgotten that the formation of this committee proper role if opportunities for debate on other was dear to the hearts of many Liberals in matters are reduced. Accordingly, the previous Governments; so much so that submission of the Liberal Party several years Liberals such as Terry White were prepared to ago contained suggestions designed to pay the ultimate political price to ensure its broaden the opportunities for members to establishment. I concurred totally with the raise issues of concern, participate fully in earlier contribution by the member for debate and be able to probe Government Woodridge. I have been listening to each and decision-making processes. Those every one of the contributions that have been suggestions were not offered in a partisan made—— sense but simply recognised that the extent Mr Bredhauer: Including his contribution and complexity of many issues makes it about the parliamentary catering service? increasingly difficult for members to pursue their proper role under existing arrangements. Mr SANTORO: I certainly did, yes. I listened to that point and agreed with it. In For example, in relation to question time, fact, I found that there was very little in what we put forward that question time should the member for Woodridge said with which I proceed for one hour on each sitting day. disagreed. Questions on notice should be tabled only, thus removing the need to read them, To appreciate just how little has changed consequently taking up the time of members in this place since the Labor Party came to wishing to ask questions without notice. It was power, I wish to quote extensively from a also suggested that all members, except party submission which the Liberal Party made to leaders, should be limited to one question on the Office of the Speaker during the life of the each occasion, giving more members the last Parliament. Many of the suggestions opportunity to seek information. We also put contained in that submission were and still are forward that party leaders should retain the commonsense suggestions. I put them right to ask two questions on each occasion. I forward again for the consideration of all appreciate that removing the opportunity of members with a view to encouraging attention asking a second question may also take away and discussion in this place and outside about from the opportunity to follow up and therefore their desirability or otherwise. be more incisive and seek out even further It is vital that the Legislative Assembly be information. Nevertheless, those ideas were seen as a Chamber in which the views of put forward. I think that it would be good if individual Queenslanders will be heard. As Government members were to encourage a was indicated in the Fitzgerald report— debate in relation to these matters so that the “No Government will have all the views of all members can be freely listened to ideas, expertise and insight on any and canvassed within this place. particular topic. As well, Governments are We suggested that proper opportunities not the only bodies which have these should be provided for debate of ministerial attributes. Whatever the expertise statements. Upon the delivery of a ministerial required, the solution to any problem is statement, spokespeople from the coalition something about which people can and should have the opportunity to speak. The do reasonably differ. The best result will debate may then be adjourned and revived be produced from rational debate by on a later date or continued immediately. those with opposing views . . . Parliament Again, that would eliminate the sham that the is a forum for those differing views.” current practice of ministerial statements is. Fitzgerald said that approximately four years Opportunities should be extended to ago, and those sentiments still hold true allow for the introduction of private members’ 5 October 1993 4696 Legislative Assembly

Bills. We appreciate that an historic occasion parliamentary debate and help restore the was experienced in this place several months public’s confidence in the Parliament. ago when the honourable member for For a Legislature to work well, it must be Yeronga introduced his Bill quite successfully. well served by its officers. I take this But I wonder how much similar opportunity will opportunity to place on record my personal be afforded to members of the Opposition if appreciation for the splendid and professional that issue is pursued regularly. The only other work which is undertaken on our behalf by the attempt by a member of the Opposition to put officers of this Parliament. All members in this forward a private member’s Bill enjoyed the place would appreciate the tremendous strain limited success that the smiles on the faces of under which the professional staff have been members opposite indicate that it had. working. Much mention has been made of In relation to urgency debates—practical those pressures and of the strain. The Budget difficulties ensure that the opportunity for cutbacks have affected all departments within Government or Opposition members to raise the Parliament, but it is a credit to the issues of concern is limited. Requirements of professionalism of the managers of the major notice ensure that many matters of urgency departments that they have shouldered the quickly lose their urgency if and when they are increasing responsibilities with a dedication to eventually debated in the form of a motion. maintain and, in many cases, improve the Urgency debates and debates on matters of level of service required. I refer particularly to public importance are debated regularly in the the management and staff of Hansard and Federal Parliament without undue disruption the Parliamentary Library. These two to the Government’s legislative program. Such departments are essential to the proper debates can be initiated by members of either functioning of the Parliament, and particularly the Government or the Opposition. in helping to keep the Opposition abreast of As to Adjournment debates—the the issues of the day. The Opposition in this Queensland Parliament should have an place appreciates the quality and punctuality Adjournment debate at the conclusion of each of the service received from the Parliamentary day’s sittings. Again, I submit that this will not Library and from Hansard. It is for this reason impinge upon the legislative program of the that we regret the pressures that these Government. However, it will provide an departments are under and the steady additional opportunity for members to raise moving out of staff. I remind members issues of concern. opposite that, if these services are diluted, all members will be affected, including those who The other issue that has often occupied today are in Government. my mind relates to the role that the electronic media should be playing in the deliberations We have had research and Hansard of this place. The Commonwealth Parliament facilities which are the envy of other presently allows the recording of debates for Parliaments throughout the country and we replay during news or current affairs programs. should not let them be downgraded in too Although general televising is not permitted, much of a hurry. I wish to place on record debates of major importance are televised. today my personal appreciation to those This occurs generally in relation to major Hansard people and library people who have economic statements by the Government and left the service of the Parliamentary Service the response by the principal Opposition Commission or are about to leave. Members spokesman. The joint sittings following the opposite may not be aware that last Friday the 1974 double dissolution was one example in Deputy Chief Hansard Reporter left the office which such an event was televised. The of Hansard. I am sure that I am speaking on electronic media should have access to the behalf of all members when I say that we wish live taping of parliamentary proceedings for Keith Hoffman and his family the very best. replay. After every election there develops an These suggestions were made to give enormous need to relocate existing members members a greater opportunity to raise and into new electorate offices, as well as a need debate issues. They were not designed to to find offices for new members. This need frustrate the legislative program of the becomes even more acute after each election Government. I submit through you, Mr which follows a redistribution. I am sure that Chairman, to the Speaker that these members on all sides of this place have suggested changes can be accommodated in appreciated the great amount of assistance existing arrangements with minimal disruption. which has been provided to them by various In my view they will enhance the quality of departments and various officers within these departments. Legislative Assembly 4697 5 October 1993

From my personal point of view I wish to am sure that I am speaking again on behalf of pay a special tribute to the relevant sections of all members when I say that we appreciate Q-Build and the corporate section of this the services of the members of the Parliament for services rendered during my Parliamentary Service Commission. recent move to my new electorate office. In Mr Chairman, before I conclude, could I particular I wish to thank Ron Beale, Peter put in a plea through you to the Speaker for McDougall, Rob Brown, Keith Tidy and additional promotional items. Often I am Gordon Gillams from Q-Build and Bob Reilly, embarrassed when I visit other Parliaments, Barry Hensler, Bob Fick, Terry Postans, particularly overseas Parliaments, and we are Wayne Tucker and the many other officers in presented with gifts that truly reflect the culture this place who made my recent move to my of the country in which those Parliaments new electorate office a success. reside. It is my view that the quality of the One aspect of this place that is of great items that we provide for other Parliaments concern to me is its security. Security staff has could be vastly improved. I am not saying that been slashed and all members have noted they should be expensive. this, particularly when we walk or drive through I was going to speak about the possible various entrances to the Parliament only to reintroduction of an Upper House, but I may find that these are unattended. I need not leave those thoughts to another speech. I describe at this stage the possible have gone on record in this place as saying consequences of these security lapses, and I that I am a firm believer in the introduction of am certainly not trying to blame the current an Upper House which would serve as a and small group of professional and dedicated genuine House of review. I look forward to security staff. But I do believe that this area of elaborating at a later stage on that matter. activity in this place should be of great concern to all members and should be Finally, Mr Chairman, I thank you and Mr urgently addressed and reviewed by the PSC. Speaker. On a good day, both of you are a pleasure to work with, but on a bad day you There are many other people of the test us as much as we undoubtedly test you. professional and domestic staff here at However, we respect the positions which you Parliament House whom I could mention and and the various Deputy Speakers occupy and thank. However, time does not permit me to we look forward to working with you all to do so. I thank all of them for the wonderful make this a better place in which to work. service rendered. Mr CAMPBELL (Bundaberg) (9 p.m.): I I do wish to thank specifically the have listened with interest to members of the secretaries within the Parliamentary Annexe Opposition and Government members during who slavishly work for members on both sides this Estimates debate. When considering the of the Chamber—particularly in the pressure of actual funding for Parliament, I suppose that, parliamentary weeks. Ably managed by Mrs over time, I have come to the conclusion that Brenda O’Donnell, they achieve an enormous it would be best if the Parliament of amount for all of us. For this great work we are Queensland followed the tradition of the truly grateful. Federal Parliament, that is, if this Parliament To the parliamentary attendants who are had its own appropriation. In the Federal always available in their usual courteous and Parliament a special Appropriation Bill for the obliging way, I say, “Thank you”. Parliament itself is passed and presented. I I thank the Clerk and Deputy Clerk, who believe that, if we are to be seen as being continue to provide for us quality information totally in control of our own destiny and not and research which is a pleasure to receive just an arm of the Executive, it would be because it is succinct and, more importantly, appropriate to consider the Parliament being draws from the experience of Parliaments not able to present its own Appropriation Bill, as is only in Australia but also overseas. As a result done in other Parliaments. Some criticism has of knowledge gained following astute travel been expressed tonight and over a long and through good research capabilities, we period that, in reality, the Parliamentary are able to obtain very good advice. Service Commission does not run its own budget; that it is always there at the will of the The Parliamentary Service Commission is Executive Government. I believe that the a very controversial body and from time to Parliamentary Service Commission is a time receives an enormous amount of flak responsible organisation and body that could from members on both sides for decisions have its own Appropriation Bill. which many of us do not quite understand. However, the members of the commission Last year, there was a change in the certainly give a lot of time to the commission. I whole Budget program. It is important to 5 October 1993 4698 Legislative Assembly realise that, next year, for the first time reports. I believe that those reports belong to members may have what I regard as a proper the whole Parliament; therefore, they should Budget debate. It is inappropriate to talk be debated by the Parliament. about a Budget for 1993-94 that starts on 1 This Parliament has extended sitting July 1993 when the Budget is not brought times. Honourable members who have not down until September and members are still been here for long might not realise that, in debating it in October. How often has the past, Parliament did not meet at 10 something that has already occurred been o’clock; it used to meet at 11 o’clock. It now announced in the Budget? It is silly nonsense sits on Fridays. The Parliament is sitting more that this situation has continued for decades often. During one particular week, not only did when, in reality, it was not a proper Budget. A the Parliament sit on four days but it also sat Budget covers a financial year and, during until after midnight on three nights. That is that year, there is the financial appropriation or excessive and inappropriate. I believe that financial responsibility to handle that Budget. I Friday sittings should be reserved for believe that, next year, that will happen in this legislation and committee reports only, so that Parliament. members have a specific time during which to In June, the Federal Parliament will bring debate legislation. Notice could be given of down a Federal Budget. I believe that, for the that legislation, so that no games would be first time, we will bring down a Budget in late played by members on either side of the June or early July. It would be more Chamber. Members would know what appropriate to the operation of a Government legislation would be debated and, if they to bring down a Budget at the beginning of a wished to debate it, would remain in the financial year, not during the financial year. It Chamber. If committee reports were to be is about time that we considered getting rid of debated, that would be done without the cut some of the old shackles and looked towards and thrust and the games that are played in financial responsibility in 1993 and beyond. I this Chamber during question time and at believe that this will be one of the biggest other times. Although there has been an changes that will be made in the Parliament. It extension of sitting times, members do not would bring more relevance to a State Budget have time to debate committee reports. No to bring it down at the right time. extra time has been allocated to debate on Last year, I complimented the Treasurer legislation which is now debated very late at for changing the concept of the presentation night without due regard and prominence for of the Budget. For the second year, this this place. Chamber has not gone into a Committee of There are two aspects of this place. Ways and Means and Committee of Supply, Firstly, there is the Executive Government. We which, in reality, no-one understood. The are also here as legislators. Quite often, that present Chairman of Committees and I important role is pushed aside until late at introduced this new proposal. I believe that night. At that time, members of the the system is better understood. I also Government are requested not to speak to understand that we must perhaps go even that legislation. For some unknown reason, we further. cannot gag the Opposition but, because of I shall take up a point made by the the lack of time, no member on the member for Brisbane Central. We will not be Government side can speak. That is an affront seen to have a proper, appropriate and to Government members. It is imposed upon acceptable committee system until we start them again and again. That is wrong. debating committee reports in this Chamber. I turn to another situation that I believe is Until that occurs, the Parliament will not be important. The word “Parliament” is derived operating appropriately and properly. This from the word “parle” meaning “to speak”. But matter was mentioned by the member for if people speak, others must listen. Much of Broadwater, who probably does not the time no-one is listening to the member appreciate or understand most things. I who is speaking. If it is so unimportant for believe that, if the particular report to which people to be speaking here, why have a the honourable member referred two or three Parliament? If it is so unimportant that no-one times had been debated in this Chamber, wants to listen and we must have a roster to those issues could have been brought out. A force members to be here, I really must lot of good work has been done by members question what Parliament is all about. Why are of committees. However, they have never had there extra sitting times when people who do a chance to debate particular points in the not want to be in the Chamber are forced to Parliament. It is not only the province of be here through a roster, and others are not Executive Government to respond to those even allowed to speak? That is ironic. I believe Legislative Assembly 4699 5 October 1993 that this is the most important House of everything else must be covered. Usually, in Queensland—the Parliament of the people. any canteen, staff wages are paid by the I turn now to a matter raised by the organisation as a whole. What is the member for Woodridge about whether the difference between paying the wages of validation and accountability of the allowances somebody serving food in the cafeteria and and entitlements for members should be an attendant at the front desk? That is just changed to an allowance. It is time that another service in Parliament House. Why is it members stood up for themselves. The one so bad and so belittling for the catering staff to issue that often arises is members’ travel. We be treated in such a way—as if their wages must get rid of some of the excessive are a perk of the members of Parliament? It is accountability so that we can have a workable a shocking indictment of the media and the system that allows members to do their jobs. public for their pettiness. Members are aware of the procedures Mr Mackenroth: Most of them get about involved with a $3 taxi voucher. I mentioned $20 meal allowance for tea, and then go there previously in this Chamber that it goes through and pay $4. 32 processes. That is ridiculous. The public already knows that there is an allowance of Mr CAMPBELL: That is the situation. approximately $8,000 for members’ travel. Parliament is probably the only place where its Why not give it to those members and save workers, who live away from home, do not the administrative procedures? Many people receive a meal allowance because the meals are involved in administrative work just to are not paid out at the full rate which would validate a taxi voucher. That does not add to cover all the wages. That has been accepted, this place by way of better decisions. At no but every year we get the same criticism and extra cost those efforts could be put into condemnation. Let us leave it at that. better administration for the committees. I am I still say that there must be a better not asking for any more from anyone. I just catering system. In the year 1993, I find it very ask that the system be made more workable. difficult to accept a system that we still sign Something that is really annoying is that blank forms for everything that we get through under the parliamentary travel entitlements it catering. There must be a better accounting is not allowable to go to the funeral of a fellow system than just signing a blank form that member of this Parliament. If a member dies, shows that we have accepted those goods. it is not within the parliamentary guidelines for There can be a better system; it is done in us to attend his funeral. It was not within the other places and a more accountable guidelines to travel to the funeral of Jack system should be put in place here. It should Duggan. I find it obscene that we have a be easy to understand and it should be system that will not regard as parliamentary introduced in order to save money. travel our going to pay our respects to a I believe that we have to thank, first of all, person such as Jack Duggan. I find that Hansard, which has done a fantastic job. Over obscene when it is acceptable for the the years, it has saved hundreds of thousands Executive members of Government, the of dollars for this organisation. Not only that, it Leader of the Opposition and perhaps the has done a good job in converting our words spokesman for Tourism and Travel, to be able to print while ensuring that the meaning is to go to the picnic races at Cairns. That is retained, which is always difficult. Also we acceptable parliamentary travel. Can have to thank the cleaning, security, library, honourable members understand that catering and attendant staff. On behalf of all obscene situation? We cannot pay our members of Parliament, I thank them very respects to a member of Parliament who is much for the job that they do, often under now deceased, yet we can go to the picnic trying conditions. The member for Callide races if we are members of the Executive brought up one major point. Government. We really have to say, “Let us take it out of the system, give it to the Time expired. members and let them handle it.” It will be Mrs SHELDON (Caloundra—Leader of cheaper and easier, and it will overcome a lot the Liberal Party) (9.15 p.m.): The timing of of the very petty things that are occurring in the Estimates debate and the budgetary this Parliament now and the petty aspects of money trail members have followed has been the 7.30 Report tonight. an instructive guide to the dubious priorities of Parliamentary catering is similar to any this Labor Government, but only for anyone canteen system in any organisation, State prepared to read between the lines. Through Government department or private enterprise the Department of the Premier, the Deputy system. The cost of food, drinks and Premier, Administrative Services and now into 5 October 1993 4700 Legislative Assembly the Executive and Legislative area, we have insistence of the Premier, in this Budget. They witnessed a steady trend in budgetary will be facing a difficult job market worsening in expenditure that is now as predictable as it is Queensland as a result of the public sector disturbing. Basically, we have seen outlined a strategies introduced by this Government. shift in expenditure away from the open and Mr Mackenroth: Voluntary. accountable business of Government and into the shadows, into cover-ups and into back Mrs SHELDON: The Minister says, pockets of many Labor mates in the “voluntary”. Voluntary redundancies when they bureaucracy on highly paid consultancies and know that if they do not take a package and on the Minister’s staff. We see parliamentary get out, at the end of the day they are not attendants, Hansard reporters, security going to have a job anyhow. workers and caterers sacked while numbers Mr Mackenroth: That is not true. on ministerial staff increase almost every day. Mrs SHELDON: The honourable member Hospitals are in crisis, doctors are quitting, and should speak to them. These 16 are not the patients are dying while the Government jet favoured Labor Party apparatchiks who serves as a ministerial taxi. We get more fat surface in the Queensland Public Service as cats with mobile phones and free Government executive bureaucrats; they are average cars while the State Government Ombudsman workers who should have been entitled to claims that he is shackled by corporatisation. much better prospects under a Labor Government expenditure is lavished on Government. the public sector in a shameless attempt to The ANZ statistics show a dangerous politicise the bureaucracy and lock Labor in trend in unemployment that must be power, while taxes are imposed by stealth on addressed. They show Queensland job a range of daily bank transactions of average advertisements in September fell 0.5 per cent Queenslanders. Real initiatives needed to compared to a national average increase of 4 promote private enterprise and private per cent. Labor’s job record in Queensland is investment in this State are ignored, while the now worse than it is in any other State. In job queues get longer and longer. Many September, Queensland was the only State to times, the self-promoting priorities and self- record negative growth on the ANZ scale. serving initiatives of this Government have been documented in this House, and in this A Government member: You’re a area of expenditure there are more and more hypocrite. such examples. Mrs SHELDON: No; my friend and his As I consider the latest political games Government are hypocrites. Down in the old that Labor is playing with taxpayers’ dollars, I Labor party rust belt, Western Australia want to highlight the result for those at the increased 9.6 per cent on the ANZ series, and other end of the spectrum. Victoria increased 9 per cent. Queensland’s annual percentage rate was 5.6 per Mr MACKENROTH: I rise to a point of cent—again, the worst performance of any order. I think that the Leader of the Liberal State. Victoria increased 31.3 per cent and Party picked up the wrong speech. Western Australia increased 41.2 per cent. The CHAIRMAN: Order! There is no point Even on trend estimates, Queensland lags of order. behind the rest of the country with just .0 5 per Mrs SHELDON: At present, cent. Queensland’s most politically powerless group We are debating how far in the trough is the unemployed. The unemployed are most the Labor Party’s best mates have their often ignored by Queensland’s Labor elite, but snouts positioned this week, and out there the they are quoted again and again in Labor dole queues are growing. So be it. propaganda. They are regularly sailed down Politicisation is written all over the the river by the promises of the Premier and Government’s allocations under the Executive his big-spending Treasurer. While today the and Legislative program. Department of the Premier and offices of the The CHAIRMAN: Order, the member will Ministers overflow with wine and roses, the resume her seat. Could I please ask the ANZ job advertisement statistics for member to explain to me the relevance of her September have been released and tell a very contribution at present to the Estimates before different story about the prospects out there in the Committee? the street. As members are aware, 16 staff members from areas which serve members of Mrs SHELDON: I think that it is very this House have been cut from the payroll of relevant, because one of the major thrusts I the Parliament Service Commission, at the am speaking about is the redundancies that Legislative Assembly 4701 5 October 1993 have happened under the Parliamentary I know that my staff are the most Service Commission, at a time when we have neglected and impoverished group in the record high unemployment. I am just noting whole of Parliament House when it comes to how that unemployment is affecting the State accommodation and support. I am talking of Queensland. about my staff, not about myself. I invite all The CHAIRMAN: I will listen with interest members of the Labor Party to come up to to the next few minutes of the member’s the dog box that my five staff have to sit and speech. work in and realise—— Mrs SHELDON: Mr Chairman, thank you. Mrs Woodgate interjected. As I said, politicisation is written all over the Mrs SHELDON: I hope that the member Government’s allocations under the Executive for Kurwongbah is not saying that it is right, fit and Legislative program. Even the title gives and proper that my staff have to work in that the game away. One could call it the “haves area, because when Government members and have nots” program, because what the were in Opposition—before Mike Ahern gave Executive now has, the Legislative has not. them what he did—they found themselves in Just look at the allocations. Every time the similar circumstances. I do not agree with the Treasurer saw the word “Legislative”, he pulled circumstances that prevailed when out the razor and the allocations were cut. Government members were in Opposition, but Every time he saw the word “Executive”, he I think it is quite remarkable–— became all soppy and out came the taxpayer’s cheque books. Mrs Edmond interjected. Starting from the beginning, we are Mrs SHELDON: Does the member for informed on page 38 of the Program Mount Coot-tha not find it remarkable that the Statements that the goal of the Parliamentary only person in this Parliament who was Service Commission is to provide high-quality prepared to change the position of the procedural research, information and reporting Opposition was Mike Ahern? It was not services to assist members of Parliament. members opposite. This Government has not Who failed? The members of the library? The improved the conditions of Opposition members of the research teams? members one iota. It has not approved one Mr Szczerbanik interjected. increase in staff. Mike Ahern increased the staff numbers of Government members when Mrs SHELDON: I am talking about the they were in Opposition. However, the great, services that are provided to people such as honest, open brokers opposite—who are now the honourable member. Obviously, he does in Government—who look after their workers not receive enough of them. I think that would so well will not look after my workers. They let have sounded a bit “legislative” to the them work under conditions that none of the Treasurer—a bit even-handed. Some of those people in their labour unions would put up members being assisted by the Parliamentary with. They work under conditions that would Services Program are members of the be unacceptable to any union; conditions that Opposition. Some are even Liberal members. are not acceptable under workplace, health What a surprise it is to turn the page and find and safety regulations. But because they are that total current outlays in this area are cut by Opposition staff members, that is good 45 per cent to $5.8m and net outlays are cut enough. I ask members of the Government to by 48 per cent to $7.5m. examine their social justice programs, On the next page, page 40, the goal of because they are not delivering. the Property Management and Parliamentary Mr Bennett: Are they members of a Support Program is stated as being to union? maintain and improve the physical environment and support services of Mrs SHELDON: In fact, some of them Parliament. I think the Treasurer thought that are. They are members of various unions. sounded a bit “legislative” as well, because on Mr Bennett: See their union rep. page 41 the Property Management and Mrs SHELDON: They have done that. Parliamentary Support Program cops, you But, strangely enough, their union reps are might say, the rough end of the pineapple for not particularly interested in them. They take its sins. For endeavouring to give members a their funds, but they are not particularly fair go in terms of their accommodation and interested in them. support, this little program loses 27.7 per cent of its current outlays and 25.2 per cent of its The next program put on the rack by the net outlays. Treasurer is Corporate Services on page 42. Here the plot becomes a little confused, 5 October 1993 4702 Legislative Assembly because in this area comparisons on “The essential requirement is that expenditure are just not possible due to the there must be no significant impact on inclusion of members’ salaries. Strangely, service delivery from these savings, nor when it came to Corporate Services in the should they involve staff redundancy debate this morning on the Estimates of the programs.” Administrative Services Department, figures The word “voluntary” was not used. I repeat— were again distorted by the transfer of fixed capital expenditure to the Building Program. “. . . nor should they involve staff Perhaps the Treasurer, who is so determined redundancy programs.” to cut everything legislative and build up The Treasurer also stated— anything executive, is unsure what to do with “In regard to the rationalisation of anything corporate. However, given the services savings proposal, I request that lengths to which the Government has gone to the Parliamentary Service Commission promote every possible piece of good news in review the following areas with a view to the Budget, one would have to be very implementing savings of $1m in 1993-94, suspicious of its reasons for denying us a increasing to $2m on an ongoing basis.” comparison that we might find is positive. We can only assume the worst, that is, that May I add that, due to these cuts, the expenditure by the Goss Government will number of parliamentary attendants has been once again be uncontrolled, with maximum slashed from 20 to 14, secretarial staff on the benefit going to the increasing number of floors of the members from five to two, and bureaucrats who, as I said before, are Hansard staff from 18 to 11. We all know now extremely well looked after. what is happening in regard to our catering staff, whose numbers are similarly going to be This hypothesis is strengthened when the slashed. The retrenchment of the Hansard figures from this morning’s debate on the typists has meant that the budget for overtime Deputy Premier’s Estimates are separated has been reduced by $25,000; library staff and adjusted. In that case, net outlays were overtime is cut by $2,000; committee up 72.1 per cent. I invite honourable members secretariat overtime is cut by $12,500; to compare them with those of the catering staff overtime is cut by $34,000; Parliamentary Service Commission. They have attendants’ overtime is cut by $20,000; and risen from $7.33m to $12.62m. Total current security staff overtime is cut by $15,000. It is outlays were also up by $4.402m, or 55.4 per very interesting, is it not, that the numbers of cent. On the executive side of the argument, the people who perform services that are vital we have the example of the Queensland to enable us, the members of this Parliament, Parliamentary Counsel, whose annual report to carry out the duties for which we are reveals a level of executive excess that would elected, have been slashed quite mercilessly. make sentimental tears well in the eyes of the Treasurer. On page 31 we see that the value Mr Santoro: It is outrageous. of consultancies is up by 196.9 per cent. It Mrs SHELDON: Yes, it is outrageous. I should not be forgotten that $2m has to be agree with the member for Clayfield. cut off the Parliamentary Service Commission Mr Beattie interjected. budget, which services all members of Parliament and the functions that are Mrs SHELDON: The member for performed by members in this place. I ask Brisbane Central thinks that they are foreign, Government members: where is the equity does he? He thinks that these cuts—which go and justice in that? to the heart of the operation of this Parliament—are good stuff, while the Current outlays are up 25.8 per cent, $390,000 allocated to fixing the stonework— telecommunications are up 55 per cent, motor which is important—is comparatively vehicle costs are up 54 per cent and other superfluous. I am aware ongoing savings are administrative costs are up 30 per cent. All required, but one-off expenditures like the members are well aware of the $1.8m worth of amount allocated to stonework may well have cuts imposed on the Parliamentary Service been able to be reserved for a more Commission by the Treasurer. However, in appropriate time. The nature of the applying these cuts, I am sure he would admit redundancy payments, which were part of the that the axe has fallen very carefully in some Government’s long-term measures, have not rather predictable areas. It has been wielded helped achieve the necessary short-term with wild abandon in others. In the Treasurer’s savings that were required. As a result, the instructions to the Speaker regarding a target account budget for Administrative Services for administrative savings, he stated— actually increased from $527,000 to $573,000 once the supposed savings were taken into Legislative Assembly 4703 5 October 1993 account. Similarly, the budget for the Hansard achieved by people who really want to be account has increased from $1.31m to members of that commission, see it work $1.335m. successfully and work cooperatively in a Time expired. bipartisan manner. Dr CLARK (Barron River) (9.30 p.m.): First In contrast to the delivery that we heard of all in this debate tonight, I congratulate the tonight from the member for Callide, I would staff who work here in Parliament House and like to make some more positive comments who make our roles that much easier to about the services provided to members by perform. I thank everyone from the Clerk right the commission. I, for one, really appreciate through to the gardening staff, because each them. Firstly, turning to the electorate office person makes his or her own particular support program—I have welcomed the contribution to the functioning of this unique additional equipment that we have been able institution. Particularly, too, I put on record my to purchase up to the value of $3,000. I used thanks to the staff of the committee office. As that allocation to purchase for myself a mobile a chair of a committee, I recognise the long phone. I know that some people may feel that hours that those staff members put in, quite mobile phones are some extravagance and often working late at night so that we can are unnecessary for members of Parliament. finish important reports. In the past couple of However, I can say that, in particular as a months, there was one instance of a staff woman, when I am travelling in my car at member staying back here until 11 o’clock at night, I appreciate having a mobile phone. It night working with me and the research makes me feel a lot safer. I know that it director of my committee. That sort of makes my family feel more secure knowing commitment and dedication should not go that I am contactable, or rather, that I can unrecognised. contact them if I have a problem of any kind. I express my thanks to my research Under that allocation, we have been able to director and research officer for the access a whole range of useful things. It is commitment that they have to the work of the enabling us to improve the functioning of our Parliamentary Committee for Electoral and offices and improve the service to our Administrative Review. I express my thanks constituents. also to Michele Cornwell, the Deputy Clerk. On that aspect, some of my constituents Her personal commitment to the committee have been most grateful to be able to access system in this Parliament is unquestioned. the 008 number that is now available for She plays a very important leadership role in people in the furthermost parts of my extending and enhancing the work of the electorate. My electorate now is relatively committees of this Parliament. small. I know that to other members with I will talk later in some detail about the much larger electorates the benefit is even committee system and what may or may not greater. The electorates of some members happen to that system in the future. I will, of comprise a number of STD areas. I note again course, not pre-empt my report but rather with interest that, in last year’s debate, the comment on some of the recommendations in member for Callide complained bitterly about EARC’s report itself. the cost to her constituents of contacting her, for those very same reasons. Did she tonight Although the staff of Parliament House recognise that that service has now been deserve appreciation, I believe that Mr provided and that her constituents have been Speaker, acting in his role as Chairman of the benefited? Of course not! She never wants to Parliamentary Service Commission, deserves see anything positive that is provided by the our sympathy. He certainly has mine. It must Parliamentary Service Commission. be very trying to have on the commission a member committed to its demise. I refer, of The security measures in my office are course, to the member for Callide, who last another thing for which I am grateful. I am one year in the Estimates debate likened herself to of those members who do not have a back a member of the 1922 suicide squad of the door to their electorate offices. I now have the Upper House and said that she was, “intent on comfort at least of having a security system blowing up the PSC from the inside”. She is with an alarm. I assume that, if I press that red obviously still trying. button that now sits just below my desk, someone will come rapidly and rescue me From what she said tonight, it is clear that from whatever threatening situation I face. she has such a very negative attitude that it must be very tiresome for the chairman of the Mr Beattie interjected. commission to deal with someone with such Dr CLARK: It is very comforting to know an attitude, when so much more can be 5 October 1993 4704 Legislative Assembly that I will also have my colleagues come as has been derided in a most appalling manner well as the police. by the member for Callide, is the Education Mr Hollis: It’s a very generous offer from and Protocol Office of this Parliament. I could the member for Brisbane Central. hardly believe my ears when she described the work of the education office as a gross Dr CLARK: It is an exceedingly generous waste of money and a luxury that we cannot offer from the member for Brisbane Central. afford. That is just outrageous. At the very The CHAIRMAN: Order! Exceedingly least, it is the lack of parliamentary education generously, he is not in his correct seat. Order! that could be considered as a threat to The member will return to her speech. democracy. I do not think that is taking it too Dr CLARK: By the time the member for far. It is vital that the community, and Brisbane Central arrives, whatever will have particularly our young people, do know what happened will have happened. I know also the Parliament is for and that they do know that my secretary, Betty Modric, appreciates the role that it plays in our democracy. That a the security of that system. I would like to put member could express a view that education on record my appreciation for the work that should not be a priority of this Parliament is she has done. Miss Modric has been my really, really depressing. secretary now for some four years. It is a very Mrs Edmond: Maybe the member for demanding and trying job. All honourable Callide has a vested interest in keeping the members owe a great debt of gratitude to our constituents in Callide ignorant. electorate officers for the sorts of things that Dr CLARK: That could be said of the they must put up with. Not too many other previous Government in this State. It did that people must tolerate the sorts of conditions Government no harm at all that people did not under which those people work. realise how democracy should function. We The member for Brisbane Central talked hope to redress that lack of understanding. about the need for a second staff member in Those programs from the parliamentary our electorate offices. I, for one, would really education office are very important. I was very appreciate and make good use of that. From pleased to be able to contribute to the last my own electorate allowance, I pay for video program that those officers made about someone to work a couple of days a week in the workings of the Parliament. That was their my office to improve the service that I can second video. The one that came out provide to my constituents. I would repeat that previously was called Queensland Parliament call, which I have made in this place before, for the People. It is now out in our schools for some thought to be given to additional performing a very valuable role in educating staff members for our offices. our young people. A further service that has been provided Mr T. B. Sullivan: Dr Clark, do you think to our electorate officers which has been very that the member’s criticism of her colleagues valuable is the seminars that have been run for their participation in the committees would by the Parliamentary Service Commission. It is be welcomed by her colleagues? very important for our electorate officers to be Dr CLARK: I intend to address the matter able to get together, share the issues and of the committees. I must say, once again, concerns that they have and look at how they that the performance of the member for might improve their performance. Recently, a Callide was very disappointing. She stood in seminar was held in Townsville. It was very this place condemning just about every good to see a seminar being held in regional parliamentary committee that we have. She Queensland, recognising the difficulty and the did exactly the same thing last year. cost of getting people from north Queensland down to Brisbane. We look forward to that Mr J. H. Sullivan: It wasn’t any better continuing. than the last time. Tonight, we heard of the pilot computer Dr CLARK: Absolutely not. Last year, the program in which the member for Mansfield member for Callide complained about the has been involved. Although I must confess money being spent on the staff of our that I am a bit of a phobic when it comes to parliamentary committees. This year, she tried computers, I look forward to the challenge of to denigrate the working of those committees, having such access and such facilities with my including the work of my parliamentary own computer in the office to link me to the colleague the Chairman of the Parliamentary services that she described. Public Accounts Committee, by actually trying to put on him something that happened in the One other thing that I would like to spend last Parliament. The member for Callide did some time talking about tonight, which again not recognise, as has been recognised now, Legislative Assembly 4705 5 October 1993 the fine work that that committee is from what is happening in other Parliaments. undertaking. The work of that committee is We have tried also, though, to see what is actually being recognised by, of all people, best for this Parliament. Peter Morley in the Courier-Mail, who Every Parliament is different. Each commented on the latest investigation of the Parliament needs to consider the system that PAC into the DPI, which is causing some is going to meet its needs in the most discomfort to the Minister for Primary appropriate way. We are trying not to simply Industries, Mr Casey. adopt a copycat approach; we are trying to I have two things to say to Mr Casey. find a system of committees for this Parliamentary committees are supposed to Parliament that extends the present system. make Ministers feel just a little uncomfortable, We recognise that the present system is not but, more importantly than that, they are adequate and that some gaps exist, primarily supposed to make the bureaucrats feel very among them the Estimates system. I sincerely uncomfortable. I hope that, in the fullness of hope, in fact, that this will be the last time that time, Mr Casey will come to see that the we have a debate of this sort for the Public Accounts Committee will be of Estimates. I sincerely hope that, next time, the assistance to him by calling those bureaucrats way in which we debate the Estimates and the to account. Peter Morley stated— way in which we inquire about the Estimates “What is encouraging about the DPI of this Parliament will be very different. The episode is the fact that the Parliamentary member for Indooroopilly, who referred to this Accounts Committee, led by Labor’s Ray matter, might be much happier the second Hollis, is prepared to do the job it was set time around with the way in which we debate up for and not be a Government lap the Estimates. I look forward to that time. dog.” Mr LAMING (Mooloolah) (9.45 p.m.): I The honourable member would never be such speak in this debate in the knowledge that it is a thing! The comment by Peter Morley a very important area. This budget area is continued— responsible for the functioning of the House and our electorate offices. Starting with this “It is refreshingly different for a Labor Chamber, I want to make some specific chairman to start inquiring, prying, remarks. I am not aware of how often the prodding and opening up those areas Standing Orders Committee has met during which have been the subject of the life of this Parliament. I have had reason controversy.” to write to that committee to bring a matter May there be more of it! forward for discussion. Although my letter was The other committee that has done a sent in June this year, I have yet to receive good job and whose recommendations have any acknowledgment from the committee. been accepted and implemented by this The matter to which I referred was the Government is my own committee. Some 80 swearing-in ceremony of members at the per cent or more of the recommendations of beginning of each Parliament. All members the Parliamentary Committee for Electoral and would be aware that this function is carried out Administrative Review have been accepted by by the Premier and Deputy Premier. I the Government and implemented, bringing acknowledge that this may be seen as only a sweeping reforms in the electoral system of ceremonial function, but I believe that such this Government and public administration. things often set the tone for other procedures. I want to mention briefly the current I ask all members as well as the Leader of the review in which our committee is engaged, House to consider whom they believe is the namely, its review of the parliamentary most appropriate person to swear in committee system. We have taken a great members. Should it be other members who deal of trouble in preparing our report on that have just been re-elected? Should it be the topic. I make no apologies for the fact that it person who assents to our Bills, the has taken a long time. We sincerely hope that Governor? It could well be a person from the it will be tabled at the end of the next judiciary—that is a nice separation of parliamentary sitting week. It is the result of a powers—such as the most senior Supreme lot of research work and a lot of thought by all Court judge. Or it could be a person from the of my committee members. We have been to Parliamentary Service Commission. The Clerk South Australia and Victoria. We have been to of the Parliament would seem to be a the Senate in Canberra. When I visited reasonable alterative. Western Australia, I also had a look at what What happens in the other States? A was happening there. We have tried to learn review of the procedure used in other 5 October 1993 4706 Legislative Assembly

Parliaments indicates that, in the majority of convention suggests the pre-eminence of those institutions, the task of swearing in Parliament with the Government—and the members has either been undertaken by a bureaucracy, through Ministers—being deputy of the Governor—in most cases the formally answerable to the Parliament and in chief judge or a Supreme Court judge—or by theory subject to parliamentary control. The the Clerk of the Parliament. In the United pre-eminence of the Parliament is further Kingdom and New Zealand, the oath is emphasised by the fact that Ministers in administered by the Clerk of the House for Queensland are, by convention, selected from both Upper and Lower Chambers. In among parliamentarians. Tasmania, the oath is administered by the If there is to be any movement towards Speaker of the Legislative Assembly. In establishing a more appropriate relationship Western Australia, the oath is administered by between the Parliament and the Executive, it a judge of the Supreme Court or, occasionally, is necessary for their respective roles to be the Chief Justice. In South Australia, the oath clearly delineated in practice and in procedure. is administered in the Lower House by the A small but important reform relating to the Clerk. In the Upper House, the oath is swearing in of members of Parliament would administered by a Supreme Court justice. In be a move in this direction. Victoria, the oath is administered to the Upper House by the Chief Justice and by a Supreme There is an alternative, and the options Court judge in the Lower House. In New South are either for the Clerk to swear in members or Wales, the oath is administered by the for the Governor to appoint a deputy to Premier and two other commissioners, undertake the task. The convention is that the presently the Leader and the Deputy Leader Governor cannot undertake this task in a of the Coalition. The Premier swears himself in Lower House of Parliament. after being appointed by the Governor, then The present procedure also calls for swears in the commissioners, both of whom members to be sworn in on an electorate are senior Ministers. Queensland has the alphabetical order and in groups of three. same procedure as that in New South Wales. Proceedings could be expedited if members The use of the Clerk of the Parliament, were to be sworn in groups of ten with those the presiding officer or a member of the taking oaths first and those making judiciary to swear in members gives emphasis affirmations second. A revision of this to the separation of the Executive from the procedure would ensure a more systematic, Parliament by ensuring that members are not effective and dignified arrangement. sworn in by members of the Government. This Another practice which demands review is removes any connotations of the Parliament the swearing in of Ministers as members of being an instrument of the Government and Parliament at the same time as they are being assists in reinforcing the tradition of Parliament sworn in as Ministers and members of the being the House of the people’s Executive Council. The practice emphasises representatives. The theory of parliamentary and links the duality of their roles and democracy makes the Government reinforces their role as being members of the responsible to the people through the Government before being members of the Parliament. However, because of Parliament. These problems could be avoided Queensland’s system of Government there is if Ministers were sworn as members in the a blurring of the functions of the Legislature Chamber at the same time as all members. and the Executive. That blurring has the effect Preliminary research can find no explanation of enhancing the powers of the Executive at as to why these particular procedures have the expense of the Legislature. evolved in this Parliament. Under these circumstances, there is little There are no constitutional or legal tradition in Queensland of the separation of obstacles to implementing the reforms that I Executive and legislative powers. This problem propose. I understand that the Standing is exacerbated by the impact of rigid political Orders may not need to be changed, but it party discipline and also by the consequences would be preferable to ensure future of unicameralism. For these reasons, the conformity. In his reply, would the Minister Queensland Parliament has been accused by advise whether the Standing Orders many observers of failing in its legislative Committee will consider that proposal? Reform responsibility to fully and properly consider of this fundamental procedure will help in proposed laws. The Westminster model of reinforcing the independence and pre- responsible Government rests on the eminence of the Parliament. It is within the fundamental convention that the Government area of the pre-eminence of Parliament that I is collectively responsible to Parliament. This Legislative Assembly 4707 5 October 1993 find the second area to which I would like to social issues, Governments are damned if refer. they do and damned if they don’t. With some It is no secret that parliamentarians are of the issues that face this Government at the not held in high esteem in the community. moment, I am sure that a referendum would This can be seen as both bewildering and provide a very desirable escape route. disappointing. Bewildering, because of the I believe that CIR was ALP policy some fact that should it not be seen as one of years ago and was then dropped from the society’s greatest compliments to be elected platform. I would like the Minister to comment by a majority of constituents to be their on his Government’s position at this time. representative in this place? Disappointing, Would he consider introducing legislation into because one of the results of the low esteem the House so that it could be debated? that we sometimes endure is that good men My final area of comment is to do with and women are reluctant to come forward and our electorate offices, where the real work for seek public office at any level of Government. our constituents is done. I hope I am correct when I say that much of this lack of esteem—resentment in some Mr J. H. Sullivan interjected. cases—stems from an appalling public Mr LAMING: I thank the honourable understanding of the role of Parliament and member for the invitation. I will give that some the often heavy responsibilities of a member, consideration. The Clerk of the Parliament, in either in Government or in Opposition. his review in last year’s annual report of the During my time at school there was very Parliamentary Service Commission, remarked little education about the role of Parliament. I that this past year has seen the undertaking believe that this situation is improving, and I of a number of significant initiatives which will would like to compliment the work of the enhance the commission’s role focus and Education Officer, Graeme Kinnear, in more clearly define a pathway for strategic preparing his videos on this subject. We do direction for the future. The Speaker told us have a lot to be proud of when observing our that the report was specifically developed to parliamentary system. It has served us well. reflect the commission’s commitment to Very few countries in the world have our openness and full accountability. The record of stable and democratic government. commission is to be commended for the Any suggestion of change—and I suggested results of their efforts. This year’s report, just to one a few moments ago—must be examined hand, also refers to significant progress in closely to ascertain whether or not it is an improving services to members. improvement. Unless it can be clearly shown Both the Clerk of the Parliament and the that it is, we should take care. Speaker have made mention of the support, I believe, like most people, that change is dedication and enthusiasm of all staff of the inevitable, but not every change that is put Parliamentary Service. I would like to add my forward should be seen as inevitable. I hope personal thanks and appreciation to the that all Australians take this point of view when support staff who have assisted both myself fundamental changes to our Constitution are as a new member and my electorate officer as proposed. Members might be excused at this a new employee to find our way around the point if they considered my remarks to be that maze of departments and administrative of an arch conservative. This is, of course, the hurdles. My electorate officer, Mrs Lyn Parker, danger of attempting to tie tags on people. has made particular mention of Mr Wayne My suggestion regarding the swearing in of Tucker—Information Technology; Mr Barry members, although not radical, is a Hensler—Electorate Office Support; Mr Steve suggestion for change. Hill—Assets Management; Mr Ray Frederick— Purchasing Officer; Mrs Brenda O’Donnell— In my first speech in this Chamber, nearly Stenographer; the officers in the Bills and 12 months ago, I referred to the judicious use Papers Office; and the library staff and many of citizen-initiated referenda in certain others who have been of great assistance not legislative areas as going a long way towards only to me but to all members of this avoiding the excesses of Executive Parliament. The assistance of these people Government, particularly in a one-Chamber has always been friendly, polite and Parliament. I have had no reason to change courteous. In response to queries or requests, my mind; in fact, my viewpoint on this matter their assistance has been extremely prompt, if has firmed. As well as providing advantages to not immediate. Their support has been the legislative process, I believe it would invaluable. remove some of the reasons why politicians are not held in high regard. With many of our Although I cannot fault the efforts of these officers to help equip our electorate 5 October 1993 4708 Legislative Assembly offices, I do, however, have to question the membership of this exclusive club is standard of photocopiers, the telephone temporary, to say the least. If anyone believes system and the security system still in use in that that is not the case, he or she need only these busy offices. Considering the limited look at the honour boards outside this time available to our electorate officers, any Chamber to understand how many people avenue available to reduce time wastage have been through these corridors in the time must be explored. Honourable members that the Parliament of Queensland has been would all have to agree that we generate a in existence. substantial amount of correspondence and A wise person once said to me that a paperwork—all of which needs to be politician needs two attributes to succeed: the photocopied. At the moment, that copying is first attribute is the ability to be elected and done laboriously rather than easily, slowly the second attribute is the ability to be re- rather than quickly. This is inefficient and not elected. I think that really sums it up. necessary. At the very least, we should have Members can have the most elevated opinion available to us in each electorate office a of their own importance, but unless we are re- photocopier which automatically feeds and elected by getting a majority of votes each collates, not a photocopier which will copy only time that we stand for election, we will not be one page at a time and requires the user to sitting in this place. Therefore, we will not be continually raise and lower a lid—tedious, time able to contribute our particular skills to the consuming and unnecessary. A provision to Parliament of Queensland. allow automatic double-sided copying to be done is also necessary. On an occasion such as this, it is important to understand the history of the The Commander phone system is parliamentary complex. I venture to suggest antiquated and, in current business practice, that this Parliament is indeed a very complex inadequate to cater for current demands. One facility in itself. As members sit here debating line to handle constituent inquiries, that same Estimates, new legislation or other issues, we line to discuss issues with Government must appreciate that associated with that officers, local government, etc., with no “call debate and the way in which we produce the waiting” facility, is most inefficient. In the laws of the State of Queensland is a very public’s eye, this perpetuates the impression sophisticated backup system that ensures that that it is impossible to make contact with one’s our words are recorded accurately, that the local member or a Government department. intent of the Parliament is recorded and We not only have to do our job in the implemented and, therefore, that we, the electorate; we all have to be seen to be doing members of this exclusive club, do the work it. Being accessible is part of that job. The old for which we are primarily elected. Commander phone system does not provide Of course, it is much more than that. As adequate modern accessibility. I would like to the elected members of the Parliament of hear the Minister’s comments on this. Queensland, we treat this place as a home. Mr McELLIGOTT (Thuringowa) This applies particularly to the country (9.58 p.m.): On 22 October this year, I will members, who depend on the have been in this place 10 years. accommodation that is provided here. We Government members: Hear, hear! depend on the catering staff to feed us. We also depend on the security staff to ensure Mr McELLIGOTT: I was expecting a that our safety is not put at risk during our standing ovation, but I will accept the “hear, attendance here. Unfortunately, it is a fact of hears” from my colleagues, because it is an life—best evidenced by what has happened in important day for me. The reason I mention Moscow recently—that Parliament House is that is simply to try to impress upon members not necessarily the safest place to be on the historical significance of this place. The Earth. Members depend on the security staff first time that I came into this parliamentary and all the people associated with this complex, I could not help being struck by the parliamentary complex to ensure that we are traditions associated with it. I came here as a able to perform the duties for which we were country boy on my second ever visit to elected. I am very pleased that, during this Parliament House. I hope that other members debate, many members have thanked all the who have come before my time and since staff of the complex. I certainly endorse those have also felt that sense of history. views. This has been described as the most The other important part of our operation exclusive club in Queensland, and indeed it is. is our electorate offices. I feel somewhat At any one time there are only 89 members. ashamed that, in recollection, I doubt that, All of us who sit in this place realise that our Legislative Assembly 4709 5 October 1993 during my time as a member of this place, I operations of this place. For example, I am have ever paid a tribute to my electorate often pulled up in the street and asked what secretary. I take the opportunity to do that the weather is like in Canberra. People tonight and thank Lyn Rooke, who has been assume that, when I fly away from my my electorate secretary for over eight years. In electorate, I am going to Canberra rather than common with the electorate secretaries of all to Brisbane. other members, Lyn has been a very essential Mr Springborg: Do you ever have people part of my electorate operations and the come up and ask you what you are going to service that I am able to provide to my do when you become Prime Minister? constituents. Lyn is an extraordinary person—as, I am sure, are all electorate Mr McELLIGOTT: No, they have not secretaries. She gives much more of her time gone to that extent. But I can understand why and energies than I could reasonably expect. they would ask that of the honourable She has become an adviser to some of my member. People also ring me and say, “I read constituents on a whole range of things. I am in the paper that Parliament is sitting quite amazed to discover the extent to which tomorrow. Will you bring this matter up for she provides advice in some situations. She me?” They assume that we can simply resolve provides financial advice to some people. She their problems as we sit in the Parliament. It is certainly provides a lot of advice on people’s important to expand the education of school personal concerns, emotional concerns and children and the community at large. It is so on. While it might be argued that members pleasing to note that, according to the annual of Parliament are not in that business, report of the Parliamentary Service nevertheless the fact of life is that, when a Commission, the number of visitors to this constituent comes through the door seeking place has increased substantially during the our assistance, we do our best to provide it. past year. I certainly support that. Lyn has certainly done that. I have mentioned the service to members I was interested to hear some of the and the excellent job done by the staff of this comments, particularly from Opposition place. I reiterate the point that other members members, about the additional needs that have made about media criticism of the they feel they have, particularly in their catering section. It is ridiculous that people electorate offices. Some of them were choose to ignore the fact that members of gracious enough to acknowledge the Parliament are not paid a living away from additional facilities that have been provided to home allowance, as would any other them by this Government. The member for employee of any organisation. I am sure that Woodridge commented on the provision of if those people who criticise the so-called facilities for members in the past. I want to talk cheap meals and drinks in this establishment about that as well. I go back to the days when were sent away with their jobs they would the late Percy Tucker was a member of this demand a living away from home allowance, Chamber. I remember calling at his home, which would be more generous than that to where his office was located under the house. which members are entitled. He had no electorate secretary. He had a Interestingly, a number of members manual typewriter on which he typed all his spoke about the future. The member for own letters. He saw his constituents under the Bundaberg made an excellent speech in that house at his own private residence. I also regard. He spoke about the way in which the remember the late Tom Aikens. If a sporting operations of this place could be improved. organisation saw fit to elect him as its vice- Whilst I certainly do not expect to see president, it invariably got a handwritten letter substantial changes in my lifetime, I believe from Tom with a $2 note pinned to the top that there are a number of very serious issues left-hand corner. That was the extent of the that future generations will address. Many of sophistication that members of Parliament those arise from the fact that Queensland is enjoyed in those days. So if members of the geographically a very large area. It is also Opposition feel concerned about the facilities heavily decentralised. In the 35 years that I and equipment that they have in their have lived in north Queensland, there has electorate offices, I reiterate the point that we been a movement—sometimes more have come a long way since then. organised than at other times—towards north I join with other members in stressing the Queensland becoming a separate State. importance of education in relation to the There is also talk about the secession of the operations of the Parliament. One regret of Torres Strait islands. Those sorts of arguments mine is that there is still a very severe lack of will continue to arise and will need to be understanding in the community about the addressed. 5 October 1993 4710 Legislative Assembly

I understand that north Queenslanders saying that people shall not kill each other, or tend to be a bit paranoid about being shall not commit rape or whatever. All we can I controlled from far-away Brisbane. do is say that if they do these things, then Nevertheless, there is an argument that these are the punishments that they can perhaps the decision-making powers need to expect to incur. come a little closer to home and that, I do not know that we have created what therefore, the Parliament of Queensland as it I would see as a fair and just society through currently exists may need to change at some the political process. I say, for example, that it time in the future. Although I certainly endorse is not fair that one million Australians are the traditions, I understand that we must look unemployed; it is not fair that women cannot ahead and be prepared to make changes walk the streets without fear of being attacked; where change is demonstrably for the good. it is not fair that young children cannot live in a My personal opinion is that Australia is secure family environment without fear of overgoverned. I believe that we probably really being abused, either physically or sexually. So need only two levels of government. As I said, there are a lot of things about our society that, I do not expect changes to occur in my in my view, are not fair and just, and I doubt lifetime, so I have not given a lot of thought to the ability of the political process to ensure what those two levels should be. However, I that those unfair practices are, in fact, made do not believe that we really need three levels fair. As I say, I express some concern that the of government to administer a country with a political process has not been as successful population the size of Australia. I suspect that as it might be. Whether that is because the the most likely combination would be a way in which this place operates or not, I am national Government. We are one country, so not sure. clearly there needs to be one national, central There have been a number of Government. I do not see how we could suggestions made tonight about the escape from that. This suggests to me that implementation of a committee process. I the second level of government would be think that that will certainly be an some sort of regional government. Whether advancement. I believe that Governments that would be created by abolishing the States need to be subjected to greater scrutiny. By and altering the system of local government in the same token, I think that the expectations some way or whether it would be achieved of the community have certainly increased simply by creating more States, I am not sure. since when I was first elected to this House. I But I believe that we do not need three levels think that the demands that people make on of government in this country. Considering our their elected member and, in particular, the day-to-day operations as members of Government of the day, are probably getting Parliament, I believe that members would almost to the stage at which they are come to that very same conclusion. There is exceeding the ability of any Government to an enormous amount of duplicated effort and, provide, and most importantly, to finance therefore, an enormous amount of duplicated those expectations. I think that there are costs that could and should be addressed by enormous challenges ahead and, as I said, I a clearer understanding of the needs of the will not be here to see some of those things community and the way in which we satisfy achieved. I guess none of us will be, but it will those needs. be interesting to see how the process of I want to conclude by reflecting on the government develops, and as we do that, I success or otherwise of the political process. I think that all of us need to recognise the have to say that, as I reflect on my 10 years in history of this place. this place, and seven and a half years Mr SPRINGBORG (Warwick) previous to that in local government, the (10.13 p.m.): In rising to participate in this political process has shown itself to be debate tonight, I would like to say that, by and deficient in some areas. By saying that, I large, it has been a constructive debate by mean that I doubt that we have been able to both sides. After listening to the debate today resolve, through the political process, some of on the Estimates for Executive and the major issues that face the people who we Legislative, I am firmly of the opinion, as I seek to serve. I think that those issues mainly have been since I came into this place, that come under the heading of social issues. I there are very few things that really do divide guess that it comes back to the comment that the Opposition and the Government in this has been made in this House on many Parliament. By and large, when one sits down occasions, and that is that the Parliament and reads many of the speeches that have cannot legislate for people’s behaviour. been made in this Parliament, and if one sits Simply, that means that we cannot pass laws down and listens to a lot of the contributions Legislative Assembly 4711 5 October 1993 which have been made in this Parliament by First of all, I would like to express some members of the Opposition and by members dismay over the length of time that it has of the Government, one does come to the taken me to be able to achieve an upgrade of very firm opinion that we generally are of very my electorate office. When I came into this similar mind. place, I could have said, “Okay, I want to Unfortunately, we live in an adversarial move to a new venue, get a new, you-beaut, system in which, for an Opposition to be able whiz-bang electorate office, freshly painted to gain Government, whether Labor is in with partitions, and all of those sorts of things.” Opposition or whether we on this side of the But, no, I took over the office of the former Chamber are in Opposition, we have to point member for Carnarvon, Mr McKechnie. By out the little differences with regard to our and large, it is a reasonably comfortable policies and our platforms. Can honourable office, but it is one very much in need of new members imagine us going to the polls carpet, a paint job and partitions so that when advocating that we are exactly the same? By my electorate officer is talking to a constituent, and large, we are not exactly the same, but he can do so with some degree of privacy. I we are very close. We might differ in some of am heartened to see that only today, my our beliefs on social issues, but by and large, office has been visited by representatives of a lot of our beliefs are largely the same. In electoral support with a view to upgrading that order to come into Government in this State office. That has been a long time in coming. I and nation, we have to concentrate on those believe that I have been very persistent, but differences. very tolerant. They are the sorts of problems that need to be overcome. That concentration has caused a general degradation of the standing of politicians and I would like to congratulate my two staff the political process. That is unfortunate. I members, in particular my official electorate think that we all strive to improve our standing, officer, Mr Ian Jackson, who has been my and we would all like to see a situation in offsider for the past four years, and who which that problem is overcome and becomes served with the former member for Carnarvon a thing of the past. However, I do not believe for about seven or eight years. He is a person that by virtue of the things that I have said of great experience. He does not bring politics earlier, that that is going to happen. into the electoral office, but serves the electorate extremely well. I do say to people In common with other members of that I could probably die and unless I had to Parliament, I would like to congratulate the go to a public function, or a meeting, or turn staff on the wonderful work that they do, up in Parliament, people would not know that I whether they be the Hansard staff, who do a was missing. That is how good my electorate terrific job, as has been pointed out, in officer is. I also congratulate my part-time deciphering and making some very twisted electoral assistant, who I have in Warwick—an speeches with twisted English—and, I area in which I felt the need to provide a part- suppose, we are all guilty of that—seem like time officer at my own expense. When the good speeches, or whether they be the electorates of Carnarvon and Warwick were attendants who sit in the corner and in other combined, I was faced with the situation in parts of Parliament House and attend to our which I would have had to close one office. needs. They all need to be congratulated. I Instead of doing that, I kept my full-time office also congratulate the catering staff and in Stanthorpe and, at my own expense, security. placed a part-time office with a part-time Mr Mackenroth: The attendants do work electoral assistant in Warwick. Mrs Jane in the complex, not just sit in the corner. Grieve performs an excellent role in Warwick. Mr SPRINGBORG: What I meant was, She has fallen straight on her feet. She was figuratively speaking, that the attendants sit in the executive assistant, or director, of the the corner of this Chamber and attend to our committee that actually formed the desires throughout the day. I hope that that Stockman’s Hall of Fame in Longreach, so has clarified what I meant. she has a great deal of experience in dealing with the public. She does her job extremely In the time that is left to me, I would like well. to point out a number of things. Some of those things have been mentioned earlier I would like to endorse the calls of other today, but I feel the need to reiterate them. I members of Parliament tonight, both on the would also like to refer to some other areas Opposition and on the Government side of that I believe we could reform, and some in Parliament, for extra facilities. Let us forget which I believe we are heading in the right about the past. I think that in the late 1980s direction, but we have a little bit further to go. many of those matters were being addressed. 5 October 1993 4712 Legislative Assembly

We cannot go around with a constantly not think the public know about these things. vengeful attitude. There is need for extra If the media know of them, they have been facilities and for extra Government-funded completely dishonest in not informing the staff. Let us be honest. Members travel members of the community of the real and around the countryside, and more and more true situation. demands are placed on us. We have more A great innovation in this reports to complete. We try to be honest and Parliament—and I might end up disagreeing accountable. We are improving in that regard, with one member on this side of the but we make a rod for our own backs through Parliament about this—is our Daily Program. I the Fitzgerald process, EARC, PEARC and a made mention of it last year in the Address in lot of the things that have happened as a Reply debate. As the 89 legislators in the result of those reforms. So we as members of State Parliament, we are supposed to be Parliament feel a greater need—and we have among the 100 or so leading citizens in this a greater need—to become more aware of State. We have 24 Federal members and 12 the issues. senators but by and large we are supposed to Members go into their electorate offices be able to run our own show in this State and and watch the amount of paperwork build up. tell people in the community the way that they They see things that get filed in the round file should be directing their lives. We try to make because, quite frankly, they do not have time decisions in this place that will make our to research them or go through them. They society a better one, yet we have come into miss some of those things, and everybody this place week after week, month after who is anybody and who has access to a word month, year after year, not knowing what we processor fancies himself as being able to will be doing from one moment to the next. So produce a personalised letter to any member the Daily Program is a pretty good innovation in this State. I suppose one could argue, “I am because at least it gives us some idea of what going to deal only with things in my is happening. I would like it to be improved as electorate”, but by and large, there is a certain we go along. I endorse a lot of the comments obligation to attend to the person from Cairns of the honourable member for Bundaberg. who has written a letter that begins, “Dear Mr We have talked about this before. We need a Springborg”. Changing technology has meant structured program. I would like to see actual increasing demands, and I believe that in the times for legislation and adjournment so we not-too-distant future, if not now, there is that can plan things. need for a research officer, or an extra staff Mr Mackenroth: Di McCauley said we member, to be made available to all members should scrap all those things. of this Parliament. Mr SPRINGBORG: The honourable That goes hand in hand with the extra member should just settle down for a facilities. I do welcome the provision of the moment. We do not want him to have a extra $3,000 which has been made available coronary. I did say that I might have a to members of Parliament and I have found disagreement with a member on this side of that very handy. Over the last few years I have the Chamber. purchased a lot of the equipment on the list of suggestions, such as a mobile phone, and I I congratulate the Parliament on have purchased three extra computers so that introducing the Daily Program which was I have one here, one in my office at home recommended by the Deputy Clerk, the Clerk, and one in my Warwick office, as well as two the Government and certain members on this fax machines, to service my electorate side of the Chamber, because such adequately. By and large I have done that out innovations will make our Parliament a better of my electorate allowance. At the end of and far more professional place. each year I end up thousands of dollars In the time left to me, I turn to the issue behind. No doubt I am not the only member of subsidisation of meals in Parliament House. of Parliament who ends up in that position. It has been talked about ad nauseam today, I am given something like an $8,000 car but I want to make a few points about it. allowance. The cost of running my vehicle last When I am home, there is nothing I enjoy year, including lease, fuel, and repair costs, more than a feed of mutton chops and was about $19,000, so obviously I had to potatoes. That would cost me almost meet some of that cost out of my electorate nothin—maybe a dollar—because we grow allowance. That has an effect on the amount everything in the backyard. Down here it of mail I can send, the donations I can make probably costs $20-odd a day for meals, cups and all of the other things which come hand in of coffee and various other things. As has hand with being a member of Parliament. I do been pointed out, an employee of the Legislative Assembly 4713 5 October 1993

Government or private enterprise would be Ring him up and get the right box ticked. Just given a meal allowance. Probably only a believe me. quarter of it would be spent and the rest put in Mr SPRINGBORG: We have ticked the the kick. So let us be honest and let the right box, but that is the sort of thing that we members of the media be honest on this are doing by trying to be more accountable. I issue, because I quite honestly prefer to eat at think we are making a rod for our own backs. home with my wife and my new addition to my family, my daughter. Now, I only get to do that Mr Campbell: If you don’t tick the right a couple of nights each week and I think that box, you’ll end up in goal. we need some sort of compensation here. I Mr SPRINGBORG: In consultation with am not saying that I do not enjoy the the travel officer, I ticked the box that said that company of honourable members opposite, it was legitimate electorate business. Nobody and particularly members on this side; can argue against that. I would like to raise however, I think there is a certain enjoyment in another point. We are allowed to travel being able to be at home with one’s family anywhere in Australia, Papua New Guinea or and enjoy their company. That is something New Zealand with our travel allowance. That is that people do not think about when they probably fair, but in this day and age when we criticise this place. Too often, I get to see my are supposed to be pushing out towards Asia wife and child maybe two or three days a and be more aware of overseas issues—I week, and on two or three of those nights, know some honourable members on the one often comes in, picks up—— Government side share my views—I believe Mr Bredhauer interjected. that if we can honestly conduct parliamentary business in countries other than New Zealand Mr SPRINGBORG: Well, sometimes not and PNG, we should be able to do that. If we even in the week, but the honourable member get the approval of the Premier or the Cabinet for Cook knows what I mean. Many of us go and provide a list of the people to whom we through this. I often go home, say “Hello”, sit have spoken and present a report to this down, have a cup of tea, leave the washing, Parliament, nobody could argue against that. I grab a new set of clothes, and head off again. think we need to be more broad-minded. Unfortunately, that is the way of a member of Parliament, and it is often not appreciated by Time expired. the public. Mr DAVIES (Mundingburra) (10.29 p.m.): In the three minutes left to me, I would I listened to the previous speaker’s comments like to turn very quickly to a couple of other and, by and large, I agreed with most of what aspects. By trying to be far more accountable he said. I would like to reflect for a little while to the people, to the media and to ourselves, on the change to the duties of a member of we often make a rod for our own backs. I think Parliament. These days, the duties expected we have done that. If one looks at our travel of a member of Parliament are becoming claim form, we have got to spell out travel “A increasingly specialised and complex, and to J” or “A to K” or “A to L or M”. The other they often require courage and sensitivity. night, I had occasion to charter a plane to With those responsibilities of office comes the travel from here to Stanthorpe to attend a expectation of the community that members very, very important public meeting attended will carry out their duties honestly and by the Honourable Minister for Education to effectively. However, the public perception of address the issues of clustering, school the performance of members is negative. support centres and secondary school teacher The main reasons for that are the media cutbacks. I was here during the day. I did not coverage of the minor issues and the think I would be able to drive back in time and dishonest way in which the media portrays I was not able to, so I chartered a plane. The members of Parliament. Although individually other day I got the bill with a request, “Can we work incredibly hard in our electorates, it is you please fill in the particular area here that sometimes very difficult to get that across with you feel that covers that charter?” That was the type of media coverage that we have had legitimate electorate business, but I had to tonight and yesterday in terms of members’ ring up the travel officer and say, “Look, the benefits and the meals in this place. That is a claim form lists options A to L, and I still do not petty type of coverage. As has been said by know where I fit.” At the end of the day we many other speakers in the debate today, if worked out a particular area which we thought proper meal allowances were paid, people would fit. would be quite happy to pay the full cost of Mr Mackenroth: I’ll give you the drum. meals. However, meal allowances are not paid. 5 October 1993 4714 Legislative Assembly

New members of Parliament receive no Budget Estimates, and that is what members formal training in their duties and their are doing here today. responsibilities. They learn on the job by The domestic committees are concerned observing experienced members. However, with the operation of the Parliament. All even experienced members are faced with a Parliaments appoint committees to deal with rapidly changing Parliament. The committee the internal services and day-to-day affairs of system is an example of the new role of the the Parliament. The only continuing domestic Queensland Parliament. The Public Accounts committees in Queensland are the Select Committee, the first statutory committee, was Committee of Members’ Interests and the only established in 1988. The developing role Printing Committee. The Queensland of the Parliament in the scrutiny of Parliament has a number of standing Government generally has meant more duties committees. They are the Printing Committee, for backbenchers. the Standing Orders Committee, the The first Criminal Justice Committee Subordinate Legislation Committee and the learned on the job and was mindful of the Privileges Committee. At one point in time, the need to take steps to ensure that subsequent Travelsafe Committee was such a committee. committees would be better prepared to deal Moving on to select committees, we have with the often unexpected events that the Travelsafe Committee and the Members’ confront the committee. In its report No. 13, Interests Committee. Between 1860 and the committee therefore recommended that 1902, the Queensland Parliament, by future members of the Criminal Justice resolution, appointed numerous select Committee be briefed on the complex issues, committees. However, until the 1970s, select functions and responsibilities of committee committees were not in use as an aid to the membership and recommended to the Parliament. Between 1974 and 1978, four Parliamentary Service Commission that such a select committees were appointed to report to briefing be developed as soon as possible. Parliament within a set period. The Privileges Suffice to say that, although the PSC has Committee and the Subordinate Legislation developed a two-day induction course, that Committee were two such committees. two-day induction course is only for new However, as those committees were not members of Parliament and only one hour required to present their final report or findings has been allocated for an examination of the by a certain date but to report to the committee system. The Parliamentary Service Parliament as and when the need arose, it Commission could take on board the was clear that they were not true select recommendation contained in report No. 13 of committees. Since that time, both of those the first PCJC, as follows— committees have been converted to standing “The Committee recommends to the committees under Standing Orders 207A and Parliamentary Service Commission that 207B. an induction program for future members In March of 1990, a Select Committee of of the Parliamentary Criminal Justice Inquiry into Ambulance Services was Committee be developed as soon as established by the then Minister responsible possible.” for that service, Mr Mackenroth, who is That should happen not only for the PCJC but presiding over this debate tonight. That also for all committees of the Parliament. committee completed its inquiry, reported to the Parliament on a specified date and was The committees of the Queensland then dissolved. That committee was a true Parliament are the Committee of the Whole, select committee in character and function. the domestic committees, the statutory committees, the standing committees and the As I mentioned earlier, the statutory select committees. The Committee of the committees have had a very recent history Whole is comprised of members of the going back to the Public Accounts Committee, Parliament. It developed in the House of which was established in 1988. Currently, the Commons and, when sitting as a Committee statutory committees are the Public Accounts of the Whole, it became practice that all Committee, the Criminal Justice Committee, members present could be heard and that the the Electoral and Administrative Review Parliament was not bound by the usual formal Committee and the Public Works Committee. rules of debate. Historically, the Committee of The advantage enjoyed by statutory the Whole is the vehicle for dealing with committees created by an Act of Parliament is financial business. In the Queensland that they have the protection of being Parliament, the Committee of Supply is a entrenched in legislation, which specifies their Committee of the Whole which considers statutory functions and the matters on which Legislative Assembly 4715 5 October 1993 each committee is to inquire and report to the we stated that the Criminal Justice Parliament. Statutory committees are also Commission had been involved in a subject to the Standing Orders of the ‘secret deal’ with the Queensland Police Parliament. Each of the Acts which constitute Union. Queensland’s four statutory committees It was alleged that the effect of that contains a section that acknowledges the deal was to grant the early retirement of application of the Standing Orders of the Mr Gordon Harris and Mr John Reynolds Legislative Assembly. from the Queensland Police Service in In terms of the operation of the Criminal order to buy their silence from making Justice Committee—on 10 September, damaging allegations against the CJC because of what I could only describe as the and pursuing Supreme Court litigation biased reporting of a particular news outlet in against that body. Queensland—the Sunday Mail—I believed We accept that there is no that it was necessary to make a statement to foundation for these statements and the Parliament on the issue of the so-called regret that they were ever made. Medusa tape. I will not repeat the statement that I made on 10 September. However, for The Sunday Mail is glad to correct its the record, I will read a letter from the errors and apologises to the officers of Chairman of the Criminal Justice Commission the CJC named in the articles, namely Mr which was forwarded to me shortly after that, R S O’Regan QC, Mr Marshall Irwin, Mr on 20 September 1993. The Chairman of the Mark Le Grand and Mr Bob Marxson, for Criminal Justice Commission stated— any distress or embarrassment which they have suffered as a result of those “I wish to thank you and the articles.” members of your Committee for the prompt action taken following the Hon. T. M. MACKENROTH discussion of the so-called Medusa Tape (Chatsworth—Leader of the House) at the joint meeting on 10 September. (10.39 p.m.), in reply: I thank all members for their contributions to the debate tonight. It has The statement which you made in been an interesting debate, and it has been the House on behalf of the Committee different from debates on the Estimates of the has, I am sure, done much to allay public Legislature in previous years in that I do not disquiet caused by the grossly inaccurate think that members asked for as many things articles in the Sunday Mail. Unfortunately for their electorates and for larger amounts of that newspaper seems to be persisting in money to be spent on various things. In that its deceitful course but no doubt as a regard, the debate has been a little bit result of your Committee’s action the different. credibility of what it now chooses to write has been greatly diminished. The debate itself started off differently when the Leader of Opposition Business in The Commission, of course, accepts the House started off on the wrong page of that it is accountable to the Committee the Budget and spoke about the Governor. I and that the Committee is entitled to believe that he was saying that he thought the subject the Commission’s actions to close Auditor-General should have a look at the scrutiny. However, it is reassuring to know Governor’s expenditure. It shocked me that that the Committee, like the Commission, that would come from a person who, in the will not acquiesce in criticism which is as past, always supported the Queen and, I unjust as it is mischievous.” guessed, would believe that nothing wrong It was only six days later, in the Sunday would happen in that respect. The member Mail of 26 September 1993, in a quite then went on to talk about the need for line inconspicuous position—page 4, on the top items in relation to this debate. left-hand side—that an apology to the Criminal The budget for the Parliamentary Service Justice Commission was published in, I might Commission is looked at more closely by say, very feint print. The first time that I went members of Parliament than is any other through the newspaper, I missed it. I will read budget. The Parliamentary Service into the record that apology. It is important as Commission has the opportunity to put it shows the role that parliamentary forward its proposed budget and then to go committees can play in assisting to correct the through the line items of every single part of public record. The apology stated— the budget. It has the opportunity to change “In a series of articles in The Sunday that. As members are aware, the Mail in August and September, Parliamentary Service Commission is made up concerning the so-called ‘Medusa Tape’, of members of both the Government and the 5 October 1993 4716 Legislative Assembly

Opposition, so an opportunity exists for all the $15.” Journalists do not say that, but that members to have a great input into the is in fact what occurs. They also make budget of the Parliamentary Service reference to the cheap grog. We all know that Commission—more than any other budget of the days of cheap grog here stopped many, any other department. Although the line items many years ago. The price of alcohol here is as individual items may not be in the budget the same as it is in any public bar. The papers, certainly the opportunity for input assertion that the price of take-away alcohol is existed. In fact, we held a special meeting to more expensive here than it is across the river go back through some of those items. at one of the liquor barns certainly is wrong. Another matter that was raised by Mr Mr FitzGerald started with the wrong page and FitzGerald and by a number of other members Mrs Sheldon then—— was the question of meals in the Mr FitzGerald interjected. parliamentary complex. Members referred to Mr MACKENROTH: But the member did the way in which the media treats what is acknowledge that he was on the wrong page called the subsidy on our meals, and the fact at one stage. The Deputy Leader of the that we do not receive a meal allowance and Coalition raised the cutbacks in expenditure at that we pay for the actual ingredients rather the Parliament. There have been no cutbacks than the labour costs. I understand that in expenditure. The actual expenditure has tonight the 7.30 Report made a comparison increased. The Deputy Leader of the Coalition between members of Parliament and dogs. quoted from page 41 of the Program There is no lower standard of journalism than Statements. At the bottom of that page, it that which was exhibited by that program this states— evening. The worst aspect of the matter is that the 7.30 Report was able to make that “Note: The Parliamentary Service comparison and to put the show to air in the Commission adopted a new program way that it did because it was assisted by a structure effective 1 July 1993. member of Parliament. Comparisons between the years are difficult due to a reallocation of activities It is stupid to try to bring one’s own mates between programs.” down, and that is what occurred. Of course, everyone has been blaming Mr Davidson from If the Deputy Leader of the Coalition is to be Noosa, because he was the one who earlier in fair about citing any sections of the Program the year criticised members for accepting a Statements, she must include the note at the pay rise. It was quite easy to pin the blame on bottom of that page. him. However, we have now discovered that it The Deputy Leader of the Coalition was the member for Clayfield, Mr Santoro, referred to the Treasurer’s letter about no who rang the member for Noosa and asked redundancies and the fact that he had asked him to take a certain course but did not tell for an administrative savings target of him why. It is easy for a person to set up his $165,000. Certainly, that is true, but the mates in general, but for a person to set up administrative savings target has nothing to one of his own mates is really sinking to the do with the redundancies. It is a different lowest level. As a member of Parliament, it is matter. The administrative savings target is to easy at any time to get into the media if one be made in administration and not in wages. wants to criticise other members of Parliament The status of redundancies at Parliament or what we do here. But to go out and to House—and this matter was raised by a defend it, one would not get that—— couple of members—is that they are Mr Borbidge interjected. voluntary. It was moved at a meeting of the Mr MACKENROTH: I will not walk away Parliamentary Service Commission and it was from that. I did. Perhaps I learned. To line up accepted unanimously that all staff be advised on the lawn a meal after that story appearing that any redundancies were to be voluntary in the newspaper today, one would be fairly and that nobody would be asked to leave and slow if one did not know what the 7.30 Report nobody would be sacked. As I understand it, was about. As soon as I saw them, I knew. As some staff members have been very eager to soon as every other member of Parliament take the early redundancy packages. They do saw them, they knew as well. not have to take them, and they have been told quite clearly that they do not have to take No balance was given to the story. them. Journalists do not say, “But we also can get cheap meals and, if we work at night-time, the In some respects, this place certainly was ABC will pay us a meal allowance of about overstaffed. The Speaker advises me that $20. We can get a meal for $5 and we keep there were 40 staff members in the security Legislative Assembly 4717 5 October 1993 section. As to the attendants—I can recall a able to go back to their jobs when they were number of years ago one Speaker who, every required. It is wrong to say those things about time he saw a corner that was vacant, Mr Moroney because he has taken the believed that we needed another attendant to opportunity to work outside this place for three protect him because he was sure that he was years. going to be attacked. The attendants are There seems to be a suggestion that in laughing because they know very well to some way the education office is trying to do whom I am referring. something wrong. The education office is An honourable member interjected. trying to put in place a proper education Mr MACKENROTH: No, they never got system for young people at school. A number him. Even if we had no attendants and no of years ago, I arranged for the pupils of a security staff here, nobody would have wanted school in my electorate to visit Parliament to get him. Because he had an obsession with House. Following the visit, I asked them to security, he kept adding to the numbers of write an essay about the event. They talked attendants and security staff who serviced this about the chandeliers in the Legislative place. The attendants who worked here had Council Chamber, about the carpet and the jobs, and that was great, but some of those wallpaper. Not one of them spoke about the people did not have productive jobs outside of Parliament. I wondered what was achieved by session. The Parliamentary Service those children coming here. They learnt Commission has offered to attendants and to nothing about the Parliament. security staff the opportunity to take a Through the education office, we are redundancy if they wish. By reducing the providing for young people a very basic numbers of staff, we can roster on casual staff education in government and the when the House is sitting, and we have the parliamentary process. We have extended right numbers of staff when the House is not that to high schools and are looking to sitting. Over time, I think that we will find that extending it to tertiary institutions. Members the system will work very well. I am sure that should applaud that initiative. They should not members will agree with that. I do not know be criticising it and saying, “Why are we how many times I heard the comment, “There spending that much money?” I think, from are too many attendants sitting on level 3 memory, that it is $165,000. It is a very small behind the counter.” It was not the attendants’ portion of our total budget and it is being used fault; it was the job that they were given. We to educate a very large number of people have put in place a system whereby people throughout the State. Over the years, it will be can leave if they wish. It is very important that money very well spent. people understand that nobody has to leave. Mr Laming raised an issue about the Another matter that was raised by some Standing Orders Committee. It is the first that I members of the Opposition was the Education have heard that members were in some way and Protocol Office. A statement was made offended at being sworn in by the Premier, the by one member of the Opposition—I think that Deputy Premier and another member of it was the member for Callide—that Tim Cabinet. I have been a member here for 16 Moroney, who has been seconded to that years and I must be honest and say that it office, was a Labor Party lackey. I find that had never struck me before. I remember that, offensive on behalf of Mr Moroney. He was a when I was in Opposition, a former Premier staff member of this Parliament who worked in objected most strenuously to members of the the library for many years. Mr Moroney took Opposition eating with Government members. up a secondment to a Minister’s office. That I used to enjoy the discomfort that he secondment was on the basis that he could obviously felt at swearing us in. It was great to return to his job at the Parliament. The see that happen every three years. It has Minister retired at the last election, and Mr never occurred to me that people were Moroney returned to Parliament House. I do offended by it. The next time that the not believe that, simply because he worked in Standing Orders Committee meets, we will a Minister’s office for three years, that person have to put that suggestion in the appropriate should be branded as a lackey. He had a job place on the agenda. The honourable here before that secondment. The principle member asked me to comment on the matter, that applies to secondment is that a person and I have. returns to the department or to the area from Other matters were raised about the which he or she came. The same should Standing Orders. Over the four years that we apply to the staff of Parliament House. A have been in Government, we have changed number of other staff in this institution have been seconded to other areas and have been 5 October 1993 4718 Legislative Assembly the Standing Orders, and we will continue to look at them. Bardon Professional Development Centre Mr FitzGerald: You said that you had Mr QUINN (Merrimac) (10.56 p.m.): I rise changed them. That is a parliamentary thing. tonight to condemn the Government for its Mr MACKENROTH: I am speaking on sale of the Bardon Professional Development behalf of the Parliament. Centre, which is expected to be finalised within Mr FitzGerald: You said, “We in the next month. This centre, on 9.2 hectares Government have changed it”; the Parliament of Crown land, was built in 1977 with a Federal changes it. grant for the purpose of education and won an architectural award for design excellence Mr MACKENROTH: Over the four years and its integration with bushland. It is used by since we have been in Government, they over 700 groups, including more than 20 have been changed. State schools, many non-profit community Mr Borbidge: You are speaking as a groups affiliated with education and health, as statesman. well as various Government departments and Mr MACKENROTH: The Leader of the business groups. Opposition knows that I am a statesman. That The Education Minister indicated that the goes without saying. I was not going to centre must be sold because it lost $250,000 mention who the person was, but I will now. last year and that the PSMC in a report had Honourable members would all remember the identified the centre as not essential to the opportunity that was given to the Opposition core business of the Department of to have 3 000 extra questions a year, and Mr Education. Yet, suspiciously, the Government Borbidge knocked it back, because he was refuses to release a copy of that report. Efforts the deputy leader and he did not want the by the media and local interest groups to prise leader to show him up. I would like to put that the report from the Minister’s grasp have opportunity back on the table. When I was failed, despite using FOI, because of the sitting here earlier, I looked to the back bench Minister’s stalling tactics. of the Opposition and thought that there were If the report does indeed recommend the a few of them who have been here for quite a disposal of the centre, then why is the while and they have not asked a question, yet Government refusing to release the required there seems to be this great call for wanting to documents? Inevitably, the conclusion must change the system. They have not put their be drawn that there is something to hide as names on the list. Perhaps the Standing the Government moves as quickly as possible Orders Committee can look at the way in to finalise the sale. It is believed that the which question time is structured. report makes recommendations about the In previous years, members of the centre’s management, which almost all users Opposition have challenged me to abolish the acknowledge could be changed to improve Parliamentary Service Commission. They all the centre’s financial performance, thus know that the last time they did that I was nullifying the need for the sale. The going to take them up on it, so none of them Government is keen for the sale to proceed have challenged me tonight. The offer is still because the realised value of the property there. If they want it abolished, I will abolish it would be useful in extricating the Education tomorrow, or as soon as we can get the Minister from some of his budgetary problems. legislation prepared for it. Through Q-Build, the Government has Mr Fouras: I would vote for that. called for expressions of interest and has Mr MACKENROTH: The Speaker advises approached the Brisbane City Council me that he will vote for it. If that were the requesting an indication as to the level of case, he might not have the opportunity to sit development that the council would consider beside me in this debate. He must find sitting appropriate for this site, undoubtedly to on the front bench boring. maximise its attraction to potential purchasers and thus increase its sale price. Progress reported. Most Bardon residents would be horrified to know that the Labor council favours ADJOURNMENT medium density residential development, and Hon. T. M. MACKENROTH informed Q-Build of such by letter on 15 (Chatsworth—Leader of the House) February 1993. This decision will have (10.56 p.m.): I move— detrimental effects on the local area. Traffic along Simpsons Road will increase “That the House do now adjourn.” dramatically, thus posing higher risks for Legislative Assembly 4719 5 October 1993 children attending the nearby Bardon State time. This sale is unnecessary, and the School. In all, the general amenity of the area nudge-and-wink deal struck by the Labor Party will suffer and the quality of life enjoyed by is a deceitful and underhand connivance that local residents will be changed forever. is designed to ride roughshod over the It is at this point that the conduct of residents’ concerns, and should be Brisbane’s Lord Mayor Soorley comes into condemned as such. question, as the Civic Cabinet chaired by Soorley has supported this decision. Why has Caboolture Electorate Soorley agreed to medium density usage and why has he not had the courage to tell the Mr J. H. SULLIVAN (Caboolture) (11.01 local residents exactly what his council’s role in p.m.): I would like to speak this evening about this shameful exercise has been? Is it any matters concerning the Caboolture electorate, wonder that, today, neither he nor any of his which I represent in this place—— Labor aldermanic colleagues have raised so Mr Bennett: And ably so. much as a whimper against the Government’s Mr J. H. SULLIVAN: I thank the proposal? Why is the Labor council not raising honourable member for that interjection. By a voice in defence of this important open any measure, the Caboolture electorate is in a space, while at the same time borrowing part of Queensland that could be considered money to purchase bushland around the city to be amongst the fastest growing areas in fringes such as the recent purchase of the the State. Caboolture township itself is taking Deagon wetlands? on much of the look of Sydney’s west 25 Obviously, the council is content to sit years ago. Each year, the Caboolture Shire back and see the State Government use a Council approves more than 2 500 new ministerial rezoning to force the issue past homes. Growth of that nature carries with it a local community outrage. Such a rezoning heavy responsibility, which I am pleased to would need to be advertised, but the say has been met conscientiously by the Goss community would have no right of appeal Government. against the Minister’s decision. This tactic Early in 1990, the former Minister for would deny the public the right of objection Administrative Services, Mr Ron McLean, that would exist if the rezoning was processed visited my electorate and inspected the by the council. Caboolture High School. Mr McLean told me One can only assume that the Brisbane on that occasion that, although the City Council is in collusion with the State Caboolture High School was in an electorate Government, that Soorley is acting as Wayne that had been represented by the National Goss’ puppet again—after all, there is nothing Party, it was the worst that he had seen in thicker than Labor mates when it comes to Queensland. Fortunately, he later found one backroom dealings. How else can it be in the Cleveland area, which is represented by explained that, despite continuing public Mr Briskey and is also a former National Party opposition to the Bardon disposal, not one area. Urgent maintenance was undertaken as Labor representative at State or local a result of that visit. government level has had the guts to Caboolture High School has always had a represent their constituents honestly? big enrolment and probably always will. That is While the Labor State member for Mount because it provides curriculum opportunities Coot-tha has fallen silently behind the for people in the area. The 1 200 student limit Education Minister, local alderman Helen for permanent buildings is probably too small Abrahams and aldermanic aspirant Lee for that school. Since this Government came Duffield have deliberately gone missing in to power, it has provided new performing arts action. We have heard not one word from blocks and a new science block at that school. them and are unlikely to do so in the future as A new home economics block is under they are part of the silent acquiescence by the construction. More importantly, next year a Brisbane City Council. The sale of the Bardon new high school taking Year 8 students will Professional Development Centre has been open in Caboolture. The relevant Minister, Pat signed and sealed by the Labor Party behind Comben, favours naming that school after the closed doors, in spite of public concern about first teacher in what was then the Moreton Bay the site’s environmental and community value. colony, namely, Mrs Ester Roberts. The This deal makes the constant claim by Soorley Minister’s ideas in that regard are quite and Goss that they are defenders of the commendable. environment nothing but a convenient farce to During the time that this Government has be trotted out for public display at election been in power, a new primary school has 5 October 1993 4720 Legislative Assembly been built at Banksia Beach to relieve the establishment of that hospital. We were overcrowding at the Bribie Island State concerned about the site. School. The Tullawong State School has been Time expired. built in the Caboolture West area. That has relieved pressure from the Caboolture State School in George Street. Also during that Yandina Highway Route time, the Caboolture Police Station has Miss SIMPSON (Maroochydore) (11.06 become a 24-hour station. We drastically p.m.): The new Yandina highway route should reduced its operational area with the opening be chosen where the least number of homes of the Deception Bay Police Station and the and jobs have to be destroyed, where homes ceding of part of its operational area to the are not flooded by road embankments and Bribie Island Police Station. We also increased the cost is not excessive, so that it can be built the number of uniformed officers at the quickly to solve the present highway problems. Caboolture Police Station by over 50 per cent. I am very concerned by the large number of The Bribie Island Police Station has also had distressed people in the community, an increase in numbers, but it also has an particularly those many residents whose additional area to look after. Many residents in homes are now, for the first time, under threat my electorate believe that there could be a from the eight new route options designed by stronger police presence in the Beachmere consultants Ove Arup. I am fully aware that by area. saying what I am going to say, some people As to ambulance services, which have will try to shoot the messenger rather than been much maligned in recent months in this look at the facts. Despite personal threats to place—the Bribie Island ambulance station my safety by the less scrupulous, including a has fared particularly well. When this member of the Bypass Yandina Organisation, Government came to power in 1989, 50 per I will not be intimidated into silence while the cent of all ambulance calls in the Caboolture public interest is under threat. centre—of which the Bribie Island subcentre I believe that, if the community has had was part—came from the officers on Bribie to go through another 12 months of hell while Island. Yet there were four operational officers a decision is delayed, it deserves to know that on Bribie Island compared with 14 in the $100,000 report from Federal Caboolture. Now we have a more equitable Government-paid consultants Ove Arup is number of officers. However, this is proving to above reproach. This has not happened. The be an embarrassment because we are report is dangerously unprofessional. Over the running out of space. I had hoped that we past few weeks, I have asked Ove Arup to could begin planning for a new ambulance explain some of the major anomalies. I am still centre on Bribie Island in the same way as we waiting for answers. I have drawn some of are planning to replace the ambulance centre these anomalies to the attention of ministerial in Caboolture. minders, but they do not want to know about it I suppose that one achievement of this because they say that it is a professional Government which is very welcomed by the company. Like Pontius Pilate, they wash their people of my electorate is that, on 17 hands. So I wonder: are they deliberately October, the Caboolture Hospital will be trying to hide these facts in order to do a snow opened. That hospital was a cornerstone of job on the Federal and State Transport our election campaign in the Caboolture Ministers? Any Government that accepts Ove electorate in 1989. The then Opposition Arup’s report and advice based upon it without Leader, Mr Goss, went to Caboolture and told query could make a very expensive the people of that town that, in its first term, mistake—even a fatal mistake—as regards his Government would build that hospital if it people’s personal safety on the flood plains was elected in 1989—as it was. That hospital and a new highway where less than desirable had been promised, but not built, by every and inconsistent sharp curves are proposed. successive National Party and Liberal Party That appears on page 68 of their report. candidate and their Ministers since the As I studied Ove Arup’s report and election of 1977. It took the Goss Government sought independent advice upon it, I was to build that vital community asset. I believe sickened that a report which will be used to that, despite the negative bleatings of influence the lives of the 3 500 people living in members opposite, the people of Caboolture the surrounding district and 700 people in the will be well served by that hospital once it town could be so badly put together. First of begins operations shortly after the official all, let us look at the cost. The Queensland opening. There have been some hiccups in Transport Department stated at public meetings that a 1991 construction estimate Legislative Assembly 4721 5 October 1993 for the central resumed bypass was between There were a number of other anomalies, $20m and $25m. Ove Arup’s central option in including the forecast traffic flows which, the report costs $41.9m. That is a big jump in somehow, make about 9 000 local vehicle cost for what the report intimates on page 69 movements disappear from the local and is essentially the same route. An extra two through traffic situation. This misinformation, kilometres does not add $20m. obviously, has been used to base a lot of Imagine my surprise when, upon reading other furphies such as the routes would need the road cross-sections in the back of the upgrading to six lanes just after the turn of the report, I found that Ove Arup’s central route century. was five metres higher in the centre of town Those things have serious consequences than Queensland Transport’s own route. That on the consultancy process and what Ove is almost double the height. In fact, Ove Arup has been telling the people of Yandina. Arup’s design is very similar in height to what So what sort of report gives greater the Bypass Yandina Organisation lied about importance in its almighty planning balance right from the start. That makes me very sheet to picnic spots and highway rest spots suspicious. I have copies of those cross- than to the impact of flooding? Why are sections if any doubting Thomas wishes to highway construction costs less important than read them. There are similar increased heights Mount Ninderry, whatever that may mean? over the railway line for the central Ove Arup Why is a major primary industry, the sugar route compared with the Main Roads route. industry, given very little importance in the There are also similar discrepancies when one overall planning analysis, even though, as a compares it with the western option. land-locked industry, it is the one that stands If anyone could have deliberately set out to be most critically affected? to do a job on Queensland Transport by over- Time expired. designing the alternatives, Ove Arup has done it. One can look at the question of how many homes are going to be destroyed by the eight Mr P. Channell proposed routes. One would imagine that this Mr BEATTIE (Brisbane Central) would be the most important question if one (11.11 p.m.): On Monday, 20 September were studying social impacts. Well, not in that 1993, the life of Peter Douglas Channell was $100,000 report! When the consultants told tragically ended by a freak accident just me that the number of homes affected was outside Sale in Victoria. Tonight, I wish to pay not really relevant because the routes were tribute to Peter Channell not only because he not set in concrete, one of the other was a close friend but also because he was a consultants told me to count the houses on great Queenslander. the map. That sounds simple enough. But not Peter Channell’s life of only 45 years was all the houses are marked on all the routes. Of too short, and to die in the tragic way he did course, on the central route a number of has left his family and friends stunned and buildings under the line are owned by the numb. We are left with the unanswerable taxpayers because they have been resumed. question as to why this painful freak tragedy Imagine my surprise when I found buried had to happen at such a young age to such a on page 77 of the report in a noise column a compassionate, gifted and caring person. reference to the number of residences which My deepest sympathies go out to his would allegedly be wiped out by the respective family. No words can adequately convey the routes. I was further surprised when Ove feelings of my family to his wife, Libby, his four Arup’s report stated that there would be 10 children, James, Matthew, Tim and Alexandra, residences under the central route. I was the children’s mother, Dianne, Peter’s mother, surprised because the Queensland Transport Mrs Channell, his sister, Lesley, nephews central route affected probably four houses at Douglas, Jeffrey and Andrew, brother-in-law the most, two of which were resumed, and the Tony Drake and the rest of the family. remaining two were the subject of resumption notices. Samuel Johnson once wrote that what matters is how a man lives. Peter was not an “So where did the other residences come observer of life, he was always a key player; from?”, I asked. The consultants conceded never just a spectator. As a lawyer, he was a that as the maps were high-level aerial powerful lateral thinker—a unique quality photography, some of the residences could which enabled him to find legal solutions for be sheds and, indeed, most of them were his clients, whether it was in the industrial industrial sheds and included the old bowls arena, or fighting defamation cases for the club, not residences as stated in the report. Labor Party. Peter was President of the 5 October 1993 4722 Legislative Assembly

Queensland Law Society in 1988, a member disappointed. He delivered the goods, of the Law Society Council from 1981, a whether it was defending the party leadership founding member of the Labor Lawyers’ in the Bjelke-Petersen defamation actions or Association, the Caxton Street Legal Service applying at short notice to the Supreme Court and the Youth Advocacy Centre. He was also on election day for an injunction. He was the a Legal Aid Commissioner from 1983 to 1989. party’s confidant and he was an integral part As President of the Law Society, he was of the lives of the Labor Party leadership in prepared to give up a year to serve the legal this State for over 13 years. community, and inevitably pay the enormous It was Peter Channel, for example, who personal and financial price that entailed. planned the party’s appearance before the During his presidency, he initiated the Fitzgerald inquiry in 1988. Peter Channell was process which led to the introduction of the motivated by high ideals and commitment. He practice management course, he relaxed the worked hard at making his ideals a reality. He advertising restrictions for solicitors and he was an idealist who believed in a better world. initiated a management review of the society. He was committed to the principles of social He was a long-term member of the ALP and justice, equity and fairness. In our many the convenor of the ALP’s legal policy discussions, his idealism burned through committee. He was also the ALP’s solicitor for strongly. I remember him gently taking me to 13 years. task after I voted to change the uranium policy In the many years during which I worked for the party at a national conference during with him as ALP secretary, and also during the the 1980s. That was his commitment. 14 months when I returned to law with him, As a father, he loved his four children. He firstly at Hawthorn, Cuppaidge and Badgery took a great deal of pleasure coaching son and then as he established his own firm, Peter James’ Wests junior cricket team with his Channell and Associates, I found myself not nephew, Douglas, in 1990 and 1991. He was only frequently admiring his enormous legal proud of Matthew’s cricketing prowess, James’ skills and his passion for the law but also his determination of spirit, Timothy’s quick-thinking thoughtfulness for others. He always tried to mind and, of course, his youngest and only help any financially embarrassed clients, and daughter, Alexandra. time and time again I saw him reduce bills to Peter loved his family. He stood by his clients who had trouble paying. He believed sister, Lesley, when she lost her husband five they were entitled to their day in court. He was years ago, and he developed a close, warm a good lawyer, but a lawyer who practised the and fatherly relationship with Lesley’s three law with compassion and heart. As a result, he sons, Douglas, Jeffrey and Andrew. was well respected across the whole legal profession and by his clients. He would have Sadly, Peter’s untimely death reminds us made an ideal Supreme Court judge. all of what little control we have over our own mortality. It is said that people never die, they In 1980, Peter became the ALP’s live on in our hearts. Peter Channell was a solicitor, after Federal intervention in great human being and he will always live on Queensland. As the party under the guidance in the hearts of many. of , the late Dr Denis Murphy, Manfred Cross, Ian Brusasco, Terry Hampson and others fought to rebuild, it was Peter Unexploded Ordnance on Sunshine Coast Channell’s legal advice that won the day in Mr LAMING (Mooloolah) (11.16 p.m.): I court and put the first building blocks in place must again bring to the attention of this House for the ALP’s election win in 1989. Peter the matter of the danger of remaining Channell was one of the key advisers who unexploded ordnance in places such as the helped make the modern Labor Party possible Sunshine Coast. This threat is made up of the in Queensland. Again, in 1982, when Denis remaining unexploded artillery shells and Murphy and I were looking for talented ALP grenades in these areas. I believe there are candidates and, in particular, a good lawyer, it other areas, such as those within the was Peter Channell who suggested to us a electorate of the member for Beaudesert, young, talented lawyer named Wayne Goss. which are in a similar situation. The areas to As Ian Brusasco, the chairman of the which I refer on the Sunshine Coast were Labor companies and the party worked to once mainly considered sandy waste areas consolidate the financial base of the party, it but now have become some of the most was Peter Channell who provided the legal sought after real estate not just in Queensland advice and got the job done. We trusted him, but in Australia. we relied on him and we were never Legislative Assembly 4723 5 October 1993

But unexploded ordnance, or UXO, from that letter, which has left me quite remains. This situation is very hazardous. We bewildered. It states— have been fortunate so far, but we should not “The Commonwealth has not push our luck. As a councillor at Caloundra 10 received any such request for assistance years ago, I requested Federal assistance with from the Queensland Government.” this problem. I reckoned that they should accept the responsibility to clean it up. They I can only deduce from the letter that either knocked me back at that time, and the our Minister was in error when she said that unexploded ordnance remained. Since then, she had asked for financial assistance, or we have had more homes built on the Senator Ray was in error when he said that he Sunshine Coast, and more bombs have been had received no such request. Still the UXO found. Then in 1991 we saw the introduction remain. of the Contaminated Land Act. This was the I now table a clipping from the Sunshine mechanism to flick the problem to local Coast Daily of 14 September where a live government, and still the UXO remained. hand grenade was dug up in a coast So I ask: what about the principle that the backyard. I believe it is time—well past time, in polluter pays? This Government has said that fact—for this Government to insist this time, if it believes in this principle. That was declared it was not done before, that the Federal earlier this year. That is great, but who is the Government accept its responsibility, just as polluter? In this case, clearly it is the Federal Britain has accepted its own responsibility at Government. So do they believe in letting or Maralinga. forcing the polluter to pay? It seems to me that they like to believe in having two bob Mr and Mrs Kovacavic each way. For instance, take the Maralinga nuclear test site. I table a copy of a Senate Mr PITT (Mulgrave) (11.21 p.m.): Tonight, Hansard dated 17 September 1986. Two of I rise to put on record information integral to the royal commission recommendations, the understanding of the eviction action taken which the Federal Government endorsed against the Kovacavic family of Edmonton on wholeheartedly at that time, state— Saturday, 25 September 1993. It was indeed an unfortunate outcome, and the unpleasant “3. clean-up Maralinga and Emu so sight of citizens being forcibly removed from that they are fit for unrestricted habitation the house they occupy is one which all parties by the traditional Aboriginal owners. concerned did their utmost to avoid. . . . To understand why this was necessary, 6. all clean-up costs for Maralinga, one must go back to 1985 when the previous Emu and Monte Bellos to be borne by Government, on the advice of the Department the United Kingdom Government.” of Education, issued a resumption order over I might add that the cost is $650m. Yet the Kovacavic property on lots 1 and 2 on they renege on their own responsibilities while RP704165 adjacent to the Hambledon State insisting on performance from the Brits. They School. have a heavy responsibility to pay for the Quite rightly, the authorities sought to clean-up of these areas, yet still the UXO make provision for the redevelopment of the remain. school, having come to the conclusion that On 21 May this year, I asked the Minister residential growth would increase the school for Environment and Heritage in this House population beyond the capacity of the current whether she had insisted on Federal site. Government assistance in this matter. The Government has a responsibility to Minister responded— provide infrastructure to meet the needs of the “We are negotiating with the Federal community. The decision by the previous Government and the Department of Government to expand the Hambledon State Defence specifically. We know where School site was totally correct and has been most of the UXOs are. We are trying to justified in light of the fact that a virtual negotiate funding to share the costs and population explosion is now occurring in the clear up the UXOs.” Cairns region, with much of that growth to the south of the city. It is my understanding that So, encouraged, I chased the Feds again the original offer to Mr and Mrs Kovacavic was to assist the Minister in this task by writing to in the vicinity of $100,000 for a double block my Federal member. I table a response from and an incomplete masonry block dwelling. Senator Robert Ray, the Minister for Defence, The Kovacavics objected, and after who replied on August 26. I will read a section considerable consultation a final offer was 5 October 1993 4724 Legislative Assembly negotiated up to a figure of $130,000. This fell case. The State of Queensland has put in far short of the amount requested by the place a process, covered by legislation, which family and was less than the figure of clearly defines the methodology to be $142,600 submitted by an independent valuer adopted in the case of resumption of property contracted by the family. for public purposes. This process has stood In the absence of agreement, the matter the test of time because it has been was referred to the Land Court in 1987. The recognised by successive Governments as court determined, after consideration of all being the most equitable method available. information, including property values and No one for a single moment would suggest sales in the vicinity at that time, that a figure of that the process does not bring with it $114,000 was reasonable compensation for emotional costs and no one would suggest the property in question. Although claims have that the State or its officers take any pleasure been made to the contrary, most people with out of having to disrupt the lives of its citizens, knowledge of real estate prices agree that the even though this may be done for the good of figure arrived at by the Land Court was a true the community as a whole. Since 1987, the reflection of values prevailing at that time. Kovacavic family have continued to occupy Even now, it is possible to acquire a modern the premises now legally the property of the home the equivalent of the Kovacavic Government of Queensland. They have residence, or perhaps an even more continued to do so with the State meeting the substantial residence, in one of the cost of rates and they themselves not being magnificent new developments in the charged any rental on the property. Edmonton area, for $130,000. Unfortunately, On Monday, 20 September, the bailiff the Kovacavic family were thwarted in their informed Mr and Mrs Kovacavic that the attempt to lodge an appeal against the actual possession of the property was decision because legal advice they had imminent, and requested the vacation of the obtained failed to process the application by property by the afternoon of Wednesday, 22 the due date. September. The family was given advice as to It should be pointed out that had an action in respect of the removal and storage appeal been lodged successfully, the variation of property. Mr Kovacavic became agitated in compensation would in all probability have and repeated his threats, including the use of been limited and unlikely to satisfy the firearms. In the light of the fact that the expectations of the family. Since the court authorities had reason to believe Mr decision, attempts under the previous Kovacavic would in fact carry out his threats, Government and under this Government to the police were requested to take action in secure the deeds and to make payment of order to maintain both public safety and to the compensation have been rejected by Mr protect Government officers in the lawful Kovacavic. During this period, the gentleman exercise of their duties. concerned has on a number of occasions I know that the involvement of the police made threats, including threats of violence, to in securing the maintenance of peace and officers charged with the progression of the safety on the morning of the eviction was resumption. These threats had raised in the disturbing to some sections of the community. community a degree of apprehension and However, these same people would have were taken quite seriously by departmental been highly critical had no precautions been officers and by the police. taken and had a departmental officer suffered At this point, it should be acknowledged injury or, indeed, had members of the public in that Mr Kovacavic and his wife had suffered adjoining properties been subjected to armed the excesses of “state” power in their native harassment. It must be stated that given the Yugoslavia prior to migrating to Australia. The circumstances members of the Queensland couple worked hard to establish their home Police Service, departmental officers, and and possession of freehold title was of great those charged with the duty of removal of significance to them. It is understandable, property and demolition of structures all therefore, that they should feel passionately carried out their responsibilities in the most protective of their property in a manner hard to professional and compassionate of manners. comprehend by many native-born Australians. With the Kovacavic property now available, added to adjoining property secured in the Be that as it may, the public welfare and mid eighties, the redevelopment of the the educational needs of our young people Hambledon State School, which will cost in the must take primacy. That is not to say that the vicinity of $800,000, can now proceed. There rights of individuals should be cast aside can be no doubt that this work is necessary indiscriminately. Obviously, that is not the and that it is vital that it be carried out with Legislative Assembly 4725 5 October 1993 some haste, as accommodation at the school has reached a crisis point. To not resolve this matter immediately would have had serious negative implications for the educational opportunities of up to 150 students of a school population projected to approach 600 in the very near future. I repeat—the need for the Government to take this action is indeed regrettable. However, I have made approaches to Mr Kovacavic through his relatives to the effect that I am prepared to assist him in any way possible to get his life back in order. Thus far, Mr Kovacavic has not directly sought assistance and has indicated his determination to stand by his principles. My offer of assistance remains open. While I can be sympathetic to the family in light of the stress they have suffered, I must honestly say that the predicament in which Mr Kovacavic finds himself is largely one of his own making. Motion agreed to. The House adjourned at 11.26 p.m.