65 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 66

I REFERENCE TO THE REPORTED STRIKE BY EIGHTY THOUSAND SCHOOL TEACHERS IN ORISSA SHRI LAKSHMANA MAHAPAT-RO (Orissa): Mr. Chairman, Sir, I will just take one minute only. Sir, the Orissa Assembly has commenced its session from the 28th. Eighty thousand teachers in Orissa are I on a strike and many are on a dharna also. It is still a Central subject. Let ( the Central Government intervene and ask the Chief Minister to start negotiations with 80,000 teachers of non- governmental schools, i SHRI SUNDER SINGH BHANDARI (Uttar Pradesh): Both the things cannot go together. You want more powers to be given to the States and you also ask the Centre to intervene. MR. CHAIRMAN: May I know the views of the hon. Members whether we should meet at 2 p. M. or earlier ! than 2 P.M.? SOME HON. MEMBER'S: Sir, we should meet at 2 P.M. only. MR. CHAIRMAN: All right. The House rises now and reassembles at 2 P.M. The House then adjourned for lunch at twenty-two minutes past one of the clock.

The House reassembled after lunch at four minutes past two of the clock. The Vice-Chairman Nizam-ud-Din. In the Chair THE CONSTITUTION FORTY-FIFTH ' AMENDMENT BILL, 1978—Contd. REFERENCE TO THE ALLEGED THE MINISTER OF LAW, JUSTICE PREVENTION OF MUSLIM MINO- AND COMPANY AFFAIRS (SHRI RITIES FROM PURCHASING HOUSES SHANTI BHUSHAN): Mr. Vice-Chairman, IN VARANASI Sir, as I said yesterday, I am very grateful to the hon. Memebers for the very general sup- port which they have given to the provisions of the Bill. I would like, very briefly, to deal with some of the points

67 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 68

[Shri Shanti Bhushan] which have been SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: That is the made and if I am not able to deal with all the fees he is paying you; privilege motion. important points which have been made by the hon. Members or to deal with each of them SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: But since he specifically, it is not that there is no force or has tried to lighten my burden I must deal merit in those points which needs consideration with the important point made by him first. but because I have a limited time at my Sir, this is in regard to preventive detention. disposal as the hon. Members would appreciate His complaint was that, when the and, therefore, I will try to deal with the points Constitution was being amended, why not as briefly as possible. do away with the article in the Constitution Now, Sir, if I might first take the which permits preventive detention points which have been made, parti although it purports to give certain cularly by Shri Bhupesh Gupta, for safeguards in the matter of preventive whom I have a lot of esteem, and not detention. Sir, I am not sure whether Mr. merely that, Sir, but he has made a Bhupesh Gupta, while voicing those valiant effort on my behalf, if I sentiments, has taken into account the may say so, in regard to the clause realities of the situation which are there in relating to referendum to convince the coun- those who were not convinced by try. I know he had certain other things in his what I had said in my opening speech, mind, but possibly, he lost sight of certain and I have no doubt that with his elo things to which I would like to call his quent style, he must have been able attention. Sir, we saw yesterday the anguish to convince everybody so that when and the anger that was voiced in this House we come to the stage of voting on this in regard to a very dastardly crime. I do not clause, perhaps, even on this referen think there is any single person in the dum, there would be unanimity. But country who does not hang his head in Sir, ___ shame in regard to that dastardly crime and who does not share all those feelings of SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA (West Bengal): anguish and anger. Sir, I was pained to read Some I have done. one hypothesis in the newspapers today. I do not know whether there is any substance in SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: In fact, I must that. But in regard to this crime, there is confess that I have, for myself, decided that if some hypothesis which has been suggested ever I were to be hauled up before a court and I which connects the commission of this need the assistance of a lawyer to argue my dastardly crime, the like of which this case, I propose to engage Shri Bhupesh Gupta country, I do not think, has seen before, with provided he gets himself enrolled by that some kind of smuggling activities and the time. activities of some smugglers. I do not think SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Next time, you anybody could be so heartless as to put appear against Mr. Raj Narain. You may those beautiful children, these innocent and choose me. handsome children and those accom- plished children, to such a brutal death SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: At the moment, unless those persons did not have any heart I have to defend myself from him. He has in them. To me, it seems, they are some brought a privilege motion against me. kind of professional killers. When "this SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Did you charge hypothesis is flashed in the newspapers that him fees? there is some smuggling etc., connected with it, the minds 0t all of us go to those SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: I do not chaifje fees in political cases. 69 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 70 smugglers who have held this coun- | try, the present the conscience of the nation, is not economy of this country and the life of this lacking in powers to deal with lawless elements country to ransom by such activities which can with the full might of the people behind it. only be compared with Mafia operations. Now, And, Sir, that has been the attempt of this the question arises: How are such criminals to Constitutional amendment, hotwsoever humble be dealt with? Are not some special powers, it might have been. The attempt has been t0 see needed to deal with such people who are that while in certain special situations to deal prepared to hold the entire society to ransom? with criminals of the mafia kind, etc., some Or, are the normal laws, are the ordinary laws, special powers may be needed, at the same are the normal legal processes, as we know it in time the misuse of those powers for other this country and also as we know in what shape purposes should not be possible. And this can it is today in this country, quite sufficient t0 only be done by strengthening the safeguards deal with every kind of nefarious activity against preventive detention. This is not the which can hold the normal civilised life of the time to ban preventive detention entirely and to country to ransom? Today, Sir, the position is wipe it off from the Constitution. I know India this. MISA has been repealed, lock, stock and has had a very glorious past. I am sure it is barrel. The only law enacted by this Parliament going to have a very glorious future and I am which is on the statute book, which provides sure that a time will come, and that this time for preventive j detention, is the one under will come in our life times and not later, which a I large number of smugglers are still in perhaps sooner, when it would be possible to detention. If today the amendment of Shri ban preventive detentions completely, when the Bhupesh Gupta or rather the proposal made by society is such, when the normal' processes him was to be accepted, I want to tell him that have been So strengthened to deal with this if preventive detention was to be banned today evil. I recognise that preventive detention is an by a constitutional amendment, the immediate evil, but I do not think that a stage has come result of that amendment would be that all the when we can completely ban it at this time. At smugglers who are in preventive detention will the moment, we can only strengthen the have to be set at large, let loose on society. I do safeguards against it so that misuse may not be not think Shri Bhupesh Gupta, even in his possible. Apart from that, in case of the right to wildest dreams, would like that to happen, and life and liberty an attempt has been not to make particularly in the light of what happened only it suspend-able even during emergency, the a few days before, which is so ! fresh in the consequence of which would be that a habeas minds of all of us. Entire population of this corpus would always be permissible in the country is agitated, small children are agitated, courts. The result of this would be that if it is girls are agitated. Then we need to ponder that shown that a detention is mala fide for the Constitution must not permit any extraneous considerations, not for legitimate victimization, whether political or of any other considerations, the courts will have the power character. Nothing to set aside that detention. But I am not should be done which would jeopardise satisfied with mere habeas corpus because after the security of a single citizen a^ habeas corpus is for limited purpose. It is only to a certain extent that the courts can go unless for good reasons. But at the same into the matter. They cannot go in to the time a golden mean has to be found that reasons on the basis of which while no abuse of the powers may take the detention order has been made against place, the State which represents or which a person. That is why we is deemed to re- 71 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 72

[Shri Shanti Bhushan] out reference t0 the Advisory Board, at the same time clause (7) was there which empowered have tried to strengthen the other important Parliament by an «i enactment to extend that safeguard. After all, if I call attention to the fact period of three months to any unlimited period that when a person who is suspected of having —and it had been done. Therefore, this committed a crime is arrested and detained in safeguard of an Advisory Board was not jail, what exactly is that kind of detention is the available. What we have tried to do is, apart question. Is it punitive detention? It cannot be punitive detention because a person has not been from the fact of reducing this period normally of adjudged guilt. At this stage, it can only be three months to two months, we have done away recorded as a preventive detention because the with the power of the Parliament to extend that idea is to prevent him from committing a crime period of detention beyond tw0 months without in future. The idea of that detention is to prevent reference to an Advisory Board. And we have him from doing certain things which might not done something more important also. Its be desirable, in the interest of the society. But importance might not be realised in cold print, but in reality it is a more important safeguard. why has not there been a voice against that kind 0I preventive detention? The reason is not far to Earlier the Advisory Boards were constituted by seek. The reason is because so far as that deten- the Government. The Government had the tion is concerned, pending trial and pending widest discretion to choose the personnel of the investigation, the final voice as to whether the Advisory Board. Obviously, that confidence in person shall remain in detention or shall be at the functioning of an Advisory Board of that liberty, is not with the executive, it is with the kind constituted by the Government would not judiciary. It is for the judiciary either to release be there as there would be in the case of an him on bail or not to release him and they are to Advisory Board constituted by the independent justify his detention. Therefore, there is an judiciary. Therefore, we have introduced a independent authority, the court, who wield that provision which would require that the Chief power and there is no possibility of the power Justice of the appropriate High Court would being abused. Of course, a mistake might be select the personnel of the Advisory Board. Of made. Every single citizen who is a part of the three members, the Chairman will have to be society sometimes, to some extent, has to be a sitting Judge to be selected by the Chief prepared to suffer in the overall interest of Justice; the other two members could also be society. To that ' extent, even if a mistake is either sitting Judges °r retired Judges who are made by the Courtj so long as it is an honest mis- well versed in the traditions of an independent take, the society does not raise its voice because judiciary and who can be expected to discharge to that extent it is justified, but there must not be their functions with an even eye, objectively and any deliberate victimisation. And that is why so on. All the three are to be selected by the there has not been any voice against detention of Chief Justice of the appropriate High Court. If a that kind. It is that principle which we have tried panel of three such persons, to be selected by the to import even in the concept of preventive Chief Justice of the appropriate High Court, detention. Earlier Art. 22 authorised, or rather which has not merely those limited powers gave powers to the Parliament to authorise the which a Habeaus Corpus Bench has but which* preventive detention of a person to an unlimited i has unlimited powers to '"view the grounds of extent. Although Art. 22 laid" down the period dentention and go into the material on the basis of 3 months normally wifh- I of which the detention 73 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 74 of a person has been ordered, comes to the SHRI G. C. BHATTACHARYA: conclusion that there is good f~ material to What we want to be clear about is whether you justify the detention of a person whose being at are contemplating any law which will enable large would be harmful to the society, then I detention of political workers. Safeguards expect and believe that the siciety will have come later on. confidence in this preventive detention. It might be an evil of course but it will be SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN; Not at all. I can regarded as not an unmitigated evil but as a assure my hon. friend that it would be the necessary evil which in the larger interests of farthest thing from anybody's imagination to the society has to be tolerated at least for some contemplate a law for the detention to ftme. Sir, with these words... contemplate a law for the detention of political workers or political opponents because there SHRI G. C. BHATTACHARYA (Uttar could not be a grosser misuse of any power of Pradesh): What about your assurance preventive detention and I don't think any law against the detention of social and political would be able to justify it at all. workers?

Coming to article 31C a lot has been said SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: All right, my because an amendment has been proposed by friend, who is a distinguished lawyer and a this Bill to this article. Sir, the sentiments very close friend of mine from Allahabad, which have been expressed by many hon'ble has raised a point which perhaps does not re- Members in this House seem to indicate that quire an answer. So long as the power of there is a belief in some minds that preventive detention is exercised bonafide— Fundamental Rights on the one side and I repeat bonafide of course during the period Directive Principles on the other side are in of emergency, all the safeguards had vanish- conflict with each other. The objectives of the ed; there was no habeas corpus; no Advisory two are absolutely not contradictory. Shri Board; no communication of grounds of Ramamurti is not here. I am happy that he has detention s0 it was possible to detain a tried to defend the proposal made in this regard. person mala fide and yet there was no relief As to what is the difference, with all humility, I available-dur-ing the normal period when the would like to submit it for the consideration of habeas corpus would be available, when the the hon'ble Members that there is no intrinsic Advisory Board consisting of independent clash between the Directive Principles and the persons to be selected by the Chief Justice of Fundamental Rights. The purpose of the two the appropriate High Court would be Chapters of the Constitution is entirely available, it would not be possible for any different. While the Directive Principles spell authority to detain a person on political out the goals of the Constitution, objectives to grounds or a political person. Art. 22 itself be achieved, in which direction the State has to provides in what circumstances it could be go, where has it to set its eyes and in what way, done and the preventive detention law lays it has to move to achieve it. In so far as down what kind of satisfaction is needed. So, Fndamental rights are concerned, they indicate therefore, that power can never be exercised the path, or the method of achieving these for political purposes, so long as there are directive principles. For instance, if I may be adequate safeguards and there are remedies pardoned for giving a very rather crude ex- available with the result that there is an ample, if a person's destination is in a particular institutional arrangement to answer that direction he has to be question. 75 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 76

[Shri Shanti Bhushan] told that he has to the time being lest I should offend the reach there and he is also told that he has to go sentiments of Shri Bhupesh Gupta and come by a car but that he must dri^e cautiously so in the way of his fundamental right. It is a that he may not trample upon somebody, s0 very valuable Directive Principle that the that he may not kill somebody on the way if State must take steps to raise the standards of he drove the car very rashly. But if somebody living of the people. And if article 31(C) says, "Lok here, this clashes with your remains in the form in which it was brought fundamental right," namely, telling him that about by the Forty-second Amendment , then he must drive the car cautiously and carefully any legislation which is enacting for the so that he does not trample upon somebody purpose of implementing this Directive but reaches his objective this is implementing Principle, namely, trying to raise the standards the Directive Principle. But the Directive of living of the people, then articles 14 and 19 Principle tells him that he must reach such and do not come in the way. Therefore, that such a place. The fundamental right comes in legislation, in whatever form it is enacted By the way which tells him that he must drive the the ruling party, which is supported by the car cautiously. But that is not the question majority in both the Houses, cannot be because you must achieve the directive questioned on the ground that it interferes principle in a particular manner so that you do with any of the basic freedoms which are not trample upon the people's right. If you guaranteed under article 19. Now some bring forward a provision and say that, "All government says that because the standards of right, so long as you are trying to achieve your living of the people have to be raised and if objective, well, you must drive your car the workers are allowed to go on a strike, cautiously when you are going to such and production suffers. When production suffers, such a place. Now you are going to Parliament the prices rise and people do not get their House. In that case because going to the necessities. Then how can their standards of Parliament, is very important, then the living be raised if the fullest production is not injunction of driving a car cautiously does not ensured? Therefore, give them less wages, come at all and you can run down any number prevent them from going on strike. Prevent .of people on the way because it is very them even from speaking out, resisting against important that you should be able to reach all these things, freedom of speech must be Parliament. Sir, I am trying to point out that curtailed. If that is the legislation, people will there is no clash between the two. I will just have to work from 6 o'clock in the morning to give one or two examples. 12 o'clock in the night every day without mur- mur and they will not be able to complain. He Perhaps, hon'ble Shri Bhupesh Gupta and would have to be content with so much of the other hon'ble Members would agree with wages. He will not have the right to strike or me as to what would happen if article 31(C), the right even to criticise because it is neces- as had been amended by Forty-second Am- sary to raise the standards of living. endment, had been allowed to remain, what He must be content with so much of wages, curious results it would have. he will not have the right to strike or the right even to criticise, because it is necessary to There are these Directive Principles. Some raise the standards of living of the people, we of them are. for instance, article 47, to "raise the standard of living of the people and also are trying to implement the Directive prohibition". I would forget prohibition for Principles. Therefore, article 19 is out of the way, article 14 is out of 77 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 78 the way. I would like to put a question to hon. that all these basic freedoms are useless, they Shri Bhupesh Gupta: would he support that and have no value, the working I class does not would he t say that it is good; because this legis- cherish these basic freedom which are lation can be justified as a legislation which tries guaranteed by article 19 and they would like to implement this Directive Principle of raising them to be trampled upon just because somebody the standards of the people, therefore, it is right could say that this legislation is for the purpose that the fundamental right... SHRI YOGENDRA of implementing a Directive Principle, that is a SHARMA (Bihar): How can there be any raising different thing. of the standards of the people by reducing the rights of the workers? Now, there is article 40, another Directive Principle, regarding organising the village SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Please ponder panchayats. Now organising the village over it, because I have seen even in the law panchayats is a very laudable objective. That courts that while enc is arguing one's case one can be done in two ways. One way of doing it does not realise that is arguing against oneself. I is: All right. All sections of the society, am not merely telling you a story. It happened in whether owing allegiance to one party or the the Supreme Court. A very distinguished lawyer other, will have an equal say in choosing the argued very vehemently and afterwards he panchayats. Everyone will have the right to realised that he had gone on arguing against his vote so far as the village panchayats are interests. That does happen. So I just want to concerned. Another way of organising the register this warning, that this is the kind of village panchayats is to say: No, the thing that will happen. Every law can be Communist Party is bad. Therefore, s0 far as justified as being for the purpose of they are concerned, they would neither be implementing one Directive. Principle or the entitled to put up their candidates nor be other. They are laudable goals. But those goals entitled to vote. Well, the village panchayats could be achieved in more than one way. Those would L be constituted. Now, 0f course, goals could be achieved either by trampling if upon the rights of workmen, by depriving them article 31C in its present form is there, then of their right to forming associations and trade the members of the Communist Party would unions, by depriving them of the right to speak not be entitled to challenge such a law which out against those injustices which are being provides for the constitution of the village caused, or in a manner which is consistent with panchayats by depriving the members of the rights of a trade union, the right of the the Communist Party the right to vote freedom of speech also, and the question is tint, and the right to candidature for even if the ph'lwophy behind the Constitution which article 31C is there, article 14 has been given a was framed by the Constitution-makers was that go-by. Then the law cannot be challenged on the it is not merely the end which Js important, the ground that it is discriminatory. Then, the means are also important. Therefore, while you Parliament, the ruling party has the right to must strive to achieve the=e goals of having an discriminate and constitute the village egalitarian society, and so on, a welfare society, panchayats. Would you like it in the village you do it in a manner that you do not oppress the panchayats or in all these institutions? workin'T neonle. you do not oopresR the masses, you ^n not dporive them of the tMngs which sr" Similarly, with regard to property also, so rpailv valuable for them. Of course if the hon. far as the re-distribution of property js Members feel concerned, the realloca- tion of property is concerned, for the purpose of reducing concentration of wealth nnd so on. it is a v»ry impor- tant Directive Principle- It can be 79 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA J Amdt.) Bill, 1978 80

[Shri Shanti Bhushan] done in two ways. Fundamental Right to property would be. One is: All right. If a ceiling is fixed, that Well, Article 19 (1) (f) is also a Fundamental ceiling is t0 be applied to everybody Right, and Articles 31 and 31C are also spoken irrespective of political affiliations. Another of. They are limited laws which are only for way would be all right. Let there be a the purpose of implementing those two ceiling only in the case of the persons who Directive Principles because those two owe allegiance to the Opposition parties. So Directive Principles can be implemented only far as those owing allegiance to the ruling by certain kinds of laws. So far as those laws party are concerned, they will be freed from are concerned, well, we did realise that it the law of ceiling. Such a law cannot be would not be right, particularly so long as the challenged if article 31C is there, because right to property is also a Fundamental Right article 14 cannot be brought into play for to put any kind of an impediment of the testing the validity of this law. Therefore, Fundamental Rights in their way. But Shri all these things can be done. I would not like Raju is very right, if I may say so with great to suggest that somebody tried to make this respect, that a State may come when one may form of article 31C deliberately for that have to think that particularly when the purpose. I would not like to suggest that. Fundamental Right to property has been But it should have been realised of course it deleted both from Article 19 and Article 31, is very easy to sort or excite the feelings of whether there is any need of a provision like the people and create a class between the Article 31C which says that when you are Directive Principles and the Fundamental trying to implement ar.y Directive Principle no Rights because obviously when we speak of Fundamental Right would be allowed to come the Directive Principles, we touch a very in the way, because then only two things important chord of sympathy in the hearts remain. After Articles 19 (1) (f) and 31 go, of the poor people; quite right—and it then it will be either Article 12 or the other should not be forgotten that by touching clauses of Article 19 which I would say are their heart, that chord of sympathy, if we trv innocuous. These are not for the purpose of the to do something which is undesirable and rich people and the vested interests and so on. against the interests of those very people. Equality is not in the interest of the vested tVien we are trying to misuse the interests. Equality is for the people who are constitutional provisions. poor. The right to equality is a very valuable [MR. CHAIRMAN in the Chair] right for the poor people, for the deprived people. Similarly are the freedoms, the SHRI V. B. RAJU (Andhra Pradesh) : freedom of speech, the freedom t0 assemble, You have retained Articles 39 (b) and (c) in the freedom to form trade unions and the 31C according to your amendment. But freedom to move from one place to another. what about Articles 38, 38 (a), 41, 42, 43 The freedom of movement, of course, is a and 43A.? They all actually relate almost to sacred right. If that Fundamental Right is done the same objective. away with for the ourpose of the Directive Principles, then the sacred right of the Hon SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: I Members to stage a walk-out would also understand it. Let me answer it. Article 31C disappear because that is aTso a part of the had been amended earlier, rather it had been freedom. Sir. brought about for the purposes of those two Directive | Principles, important Directive Prin- Sir, regarding Article 74, that the President ciDles. at a time when the Fundamental Right being bound by the advice of the Council of to oroperty was there. We do not yet know Ministers, two point? what the ultimate fate of tr-is proposal t0 delete the 8l Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 82 were made. I would very briefly deal with might be possible to interpret that even after them. One was made by Mr. Sankar Ghose. the Forty-second Amendment, it was possible for the President to ask for reconsideration, He said that this limited right which is being given to the President, namely, to send back a but in any case, it is not clear. Therefore, if it decision of the Council of Ministers for was sought to be taken away, then that right consideration once because an advice given which always was with the President, is after reconsideration is binding, would make sought to be restored; but if that right was still the President come in the arena of politics. there that it is sought to be made explicitly Sir, I submit that it has always been recog clear because there can be no doubt that this nised thiat the President is a very important is a very important role, a very valuable functionary, and tne manner in which the role—the Presi dent is not in the dim of day- electoral college elects him also ensures that to day politics—and, therefore, he must have he would be a very responsible functionary. the right to advise and caution. The ultimate And he is the Head of the State. He must have decision must, of course rest with those who are responsible to the Lok Sabha, namely, the this because after all nobody is infallible, even the Council of Ministers, I am prepared to Council of Ministers. admit, can make a mistake. There can be an oversight. They may not take into consideration certain other aspects of the matter. Therefore, when one such reconsi- Then, Sir, Mr. Dinesh Goswami raised a deration is given, if it occurs to the President few more points. He asked, was it that there that there are some valid reasons which have were no functions in which the President had been overlooked, and if these reasons are put an independent voice? He somehow had the before the Council of Ministers, perhaps the impression—I have great respect for him and Council of Ministers may come to a different also for his advocacy—that so far as the conclusion. This has always been recognised a determination of the age of a judge is part of the functions of the President all along concerned, the President has the power, from 1950. Even when this controversy was because the Constitution says that "the raised whether the President was bound by the President shall determine". Of course, all advice of the Council of Ministers or not in articles of the Constitution refer to the Presi 1950 by Dr. Rajendra Prasad, the dent—"the President shall do this, the Constitutional experts had examined the President shall do that" and so on. But position and came to the conclusion that he wherever the power is given ti the President, was a moral and Constitutional Head bound except in an exceptional situation, all those by the advice 0f the Council of Ministers. But functions are supposed to be exercised in this function was clearly recognised that he accordance with the decision of the Cotftocil could caution, that he could advise. He could of Ministers. It is for the Government, which caution the Council 0f Ministers; he could is responsible to the Lok Sabha, to decide, not advise the Council of Ministers. Thereafter for another functionary who is not responsible the ultimate decision will be a earn of the to the Lok Sabha. But there are two situations Council of Ministers. But this much was undoubtedly, t0 which he has called attention, always there. Even in the British and he has raised a doubt as to whether in parliamentary democracy, this function of the those situations also, the President has no Crown is also recognised. And that is why power. For instance, he mentioned choosing when by the EoH-"-se"ond Amendment, a of the Prime Minister. Now, article 74 and change WPS mnrle. it nut such a rolp also in article 75 are there. Article 74 is the normal jeopardy It is not clear. Perhaps it provision, and article 75 is an 83 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 84

[Shri Shanti Bhushan] exceptional and that the article which says that the Council of special provision. So far as the function 0f Ministers is responsible to the Lok Sabha choosing the Prime Minister is concerned, that ensures that it is only so long as the Council is conferred on the President by article 75. It is of Ministers is functioning in accordance with quite clear that so far as choosing of the Prime the constitutional provisions, till then only the Minister is concerned, that is a function which advice of the Council of Ministers is binding the President has to exercise on his own on the President. So, a defeated Council of individual judgment, not on the advice of an Ministers, whether defeated in General outgoing Council of Ministers. That is quite Elections or defeated on a no-confidence clear. That is not governed by article 74; that motion, has no constitutional power thereafter is governed by article 75. Similarly, he raised to advise the President, and the President will the other point: suppose the Lok Sabha is have the power, just as to install a new dissolved and fresh elections are taking place. Government, to dismiss that Government also Our Constitution does not contemplate that if it does not resign by itself. there shall be any Government without a Council of Ministers. The Council of Minis- ters remains there. Well, whether we call it a SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI : care-taker Government or not is immaterial; (Assam): Mr. Law Minister, so far as the age but it is there. He raised the point; suppose the of a judge is concerned, is it not a fact that the Supreme Court in Jyoti Prakash Mitter's case party whose Council of Ministers was func- 01 tioning during the time that the elections were held that in determining the age a judge of a taking place, happens to lose at the General High Court, the President acts quasi- Elections and yet that Council of Ministers judicially, in his own individual discretion, chooses to give an advice to the President to and the advice of the Cabinet does not come dissolve the newly constituted Lok Sabha in? The secon^ point is whether you have left again and to order fresh elections again: an option to the President to determine would such an advice be still binding on the whether the Prime Minister is acting within the Constitution or not. I think you are giving basis of article 74? I would like t0 assure the hon. Member that no such position would over-riding powers to the President again. arise because all the constitutional provisions Therefore, the whole argument is have to be read in harmony. There is the contradictory. constitutional provision saying that the Council of Ministers is responsible to the Lok SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: I have Sabha. I do not think he expressly stipulated understood your point. I am not doing that. this situation, but this situation was stipulated What I am saying is that once the Council of in the Lok Sabha also, in the other House, Ministers has been defeated either in a when the matter was being discussed, that is, General Election or has been defeated in a No when the Government, namely, the Council of Confidence Motion, then, thereafter its Ministers has been defeated on a no- function, its role, of advising the President confidence motion and after that no- comes to an end. In lhat situation the confidence motion has been passed against the President is fully-entitled, under article 75, to Government, yet the Council of Ministers, dismiss that Council of Ministers. That is instead of resigning, try to advise the what I am saying. President, for d°'n6 something and so on and so forth: then in that case, would that advice be still binding? I submit, Sir. So far as the question of quasi-iudicial is concerned, so many functions of the Government are quasi-judicial. Quasi- judicial means that 85 Constitution (Forty.-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 86 you give a hearing, you give a hearing to the functions. In the case of less important person affected before you come to a decision. It functions, a single individual Minister is d°es not mean that ' the President performs that entitled to take the final decision and the function in his individual discretion. In fact, in decision constitutes the advice to the Shamsher Singh's ct:se the Supreme Court has President on the basis of which the order of gone into the question very elaborately. All the the President comes to be made. On the other seven Judges came to the unanimous conclusion hand, there are functions which are allotted by that the defeated Council of Ministers, etc. are the Rules of Business to the Cabinet which only exceptions. Chief Justice Subba Rao tried to come within the Cabinet purview of advice. If create this theory, this doctrine, namely, there are we use the expression "Council of Ministers", two kinds of functions. For some functions he has then in that case even the question of to act on the advice of the Council of Ministers, in declaration of emergency would have been others he has to act in his individual discretion. In allotted to individual Ministers, let us say, the some cases, some view to that effect was Home Minister. He would be competent to expressed. When Chief Justice Subba Rao was take a decision as to whether an emergency there. But that doctrine has never been supported should be declared or not. It would be merely by jurists. Mr. Setalvad did not support it. Alladi a question of altering the Rules of Business Krishnaswamy did not support it. Others did not 'which are alterable. The Constitution pro- support it. with the result that it is now agreed on vides that no Rules of Business can give this all hands that the President is only a constitutional function to individual Minister, and so on. It head. TTe is bound bv the advice of the Council of must be done by the Cabinet. The concept of Ministers.. (Interruptions) 'Cabinet' is well-known, namely( that Ministers of the Cabinet rank constitute the SHRI V. B. RAJU; I raised a point: How Cabinet. Therefore, the requirements of article did you import the word Cabinet. 352 are that so far as such important matters are concernedj as the question of declaration of emergency, there should be a collective SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: I must not forget decision and then they should send a written to deal with it. Sir, a point has been raised that advice to the President. Sir,.... if in the other articles of the Constitution the expression 'Council of Ministers' has been used, why was it necessary to innovate and use the SHRI B. N. BANERJEE (Nominat expression 'Cabinet', so far as article 74 was ed) : When you have used the language concerned. I will immediately explain to you meaning that it should be the Union why it was so. In fact, article 72 says: "With the Cabinet, that is to say, the Council of aid and advice of the Council of Ministers. ." Ministers, Prime Minister and other All orders are made in the name of the Presi- Ministers, appointed under article 75, dent and are supposed to be made with the aid you specifically say that only the Ministers of Cabinet rank will be en and advice of the Council 0f Ministers. How the Council of Ministers should advise the titled to discharge these f unci ions, not President is laid down in the Rules of Business others ...... (Interruptions) which are framed under the appropriate article. In the Rules of Business, some distinctions have SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: That is well been made between one function and other recognised. So far as Cabinet decisions are concerned, only Ministers of Cabinet rank participate in them, even otherwise

Then, right to property. Certain doubts have been raised in regard to 87 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 88

[Shri Shanti Bhushan] vide for compensation or may not provide for fundamental right of property. 1 am compensation or may provide for market surprised that even distinguished lawyers value or may not provide for market value so should raise this doubt and then it occurs to me that when the fundamental right to property that perhaps the reason for their raising doubt has been taken away, obviously it is not is not that they are really doubtful but possible to say that any requirement of because they want me to say so expressly on compensation can at all be read in article the floor of the House. The doubt they have 300A. expressed is that even though the Some reference was made to small fundamental right article 31 is deleted agricultural holdings.... and 19(1) (If) is also deleted, yet 300A is introduced as a right, namely, that no SHRI D1NESH GOSWAMI: I raised this person shail be deprived of his property save question because my apprehension .... by the authority of law. What they are apprehensive about or at least what they say SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: May I they are apprehensive about is whether this suggest that we can discuss this when we take concept of market value of compensation up clause by clause consideration as might not come back by the back door which otherwise I may take too much of time? has been done away with by various amendments, particularly the last amendment There was a reference to small agricultural substituting the word "amount" for the holdings and an apprehension was word "compensation". When article 31 had a expressed.... clause saying that no property shall be acquired except for public purpose and on payment of compensation, there was a SHRI TRILOKI SINGH (Uttar Pradesh) : requirement. If you acquire a property, The Land Acquisition Act is there.... then you have to comply with two conditions) namely, it shall be for a public SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Land purpose and secondly there should be Acquisition Act is not a perpetual law. It is compensation paid. Since there was not a Constitutional law. It is amendable. You fundamental right to Jrompeinsation, in can amend it any time. You can have other 'that context the scope for interpretation laws for certain situations. The Land Acquisi- was possible. But so far as 300A is con- tion Act was there already when you enacted cerned, advisedly this language has been article 14. The principle which has been laid used. In fact an amendment was proposed in down is that if you have two laws operating the other House that it shall be either by in the same field and the two laws give you a due process of law or it should not be done choice either to acquire under this or that—it except by procedure established by law in is not a compulsory law to take away certain conformity with the language used in types of property —there is no question of article 21. But this was not accepted. If that land acquisition. That law provides for acquisition under those circumstances and language is used, then all kinds of concepts then the decision of the Supreme Court will could have come in by the back door. "Save not come in You have the discretion either to by authority of law" simply means that there acquire under this or under that. It can be must be an enactment to justify that done at your sweet will. If the Parliament deprivation. Not that enactment must does not allow that sweet will to the Govern- contain a provision for compensation— ment, but says that this shall be acquired either market value or otherwise. It is left to under this Act alone, then in the judgement of the legislature. The legislature in its wisdom, seeing as t0 what the situation is, may pro- 89 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 90 that case there is no question of article 14 I take it as a sign of everyone converting coming in because otherwise that argument himself to the views of the Janata Party and I could have been raised even when you had 31 am happy to note that the honourable in a way. Article 14 was still there. Obviously Members are getting themselves converted to when the fundamental right is being taken our views. ''Interruptions^. But I have no away, it does not enhance the right of any doubt that the Janata Party philosophy would person, it can only reduce the right of certain definitely convert even people like Mr. people. Bhupesh Gupta if he has not already been converted. Very soon he will be converted. Regarding small agricultural holding, an apprehension was expressed as to what will SHRI HARISINH BHAGUBAVA happen to a small holder or a small farmer. MAIUDA (Gujarat): Provided the Janata You have probably omitted to notice that Party exists. article 31A is being retained. And, Sir, so far as the agricultural holdings within the ceiling SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Sir, here I limits as imposed from time to time are would like to make it clear as to why it has not concerned, it guarantees them the right and been possible to include or incorporate the their rights have been preserved and the Fundamental Right to work at this stage. True, agriculturist cannot be deprived of his hold- we said that it would be brought and that the ings so long as they are within the ceiling Fundamental Right to property should go. I limits, without payment of the market value think it would be a mistaken notion to read compensation and that particular right has not that election manifesto to mean that the two been touched, because the small peasants do things must happen simultaneously. In fact, constitute the bulk of the people of this they cannot happen simultaneously. Whenever country and, as an honourable Member said, certain things are said in the manifesto, there Sir, if they do not produce, then, in that case, is always a suitable time for doing them and the entire country will perish. I agree with it they cannot be done immediately and it is not and, therefore, I agree that they have to be a mantram and it is not just by incantation that preserved and this is the preservation of their you can do it by saying, 'All right. Article 19 rights and this preservation has been in respect of the Fundamental Right to maintained. property should go and it shall be obligatory on the part of the State to give meaningful employment to everybody by way of a PROF. N. G. RANGA (Andhra Pradesh} : Fundamental Right to work and straightway, Under what article? the next thing, the State should do it." There are meaningful employment and meaningful SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: 31A. That jobs avail for everybody and they have merely right is given in 31A which is being to go to a court of law and the court of law will say, "All right. You will be a typist, you maintained and which is not being deleted. will be an engineer and you will be an architect," and so on. It is not like that. Certain Then. Sir, some honourable Members conditions have to be created, because, referred to the right to work and also referred otherwise, it would be like passing a decree. If to the election manifesto of the Janata Party somebody is satisfied in getting a decree and said that it has been said in that that while passed for Rs. 30 crores against a pauper like the right tc property would be deleted, the myself, for instance, then, in that case, you right to work would be affirmed. I am very would be very happy to have that happy and I feel gratified. Sir. to note that the Janata Party manifesto has evinced so much interest and 91 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 92

[Shri Shanti Bhushan] running without knowing as to what is to be decree. But the important thing is that a court done and how it should be done, then, in that decree against a pauper would be case, no results are possible because these unenforceable and the same would be the things cannot be solved just by slogans. A position then. So, the question is at what stage scientific approach is necessary and I am very the Fundamental Right to property should go happy to say that the Planning Commission and the other right should be there, because has applied a scientific approach and they the Fundamental Right is an enforceable right have been able to identify as to what has and you can go to a court of law and have it happened, what has gone wrong in the past, enforced it st-aightway; no defence, and the why it has not been possible to solve this State would not have to say, "Well, there is problem of unemployment, what reorientation this difficulty or that difficulty". It is at this is necessary, what new approaches are stage that you have to do it if you have to necessary and so on and so, this is not the basically solve the unemployment problem. occasion. Of course, there would be some people who would be unemployed. Then in that case, the SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Sixteen months Fundamental Right has to be there and, after the Janata rule, unemployment has connected with that right, the righl to increased by 12 per cent unemployment relief. Otherwise, if you write ... (interruptions) down the Fundamental Right today into the SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Sir, I am Constitution, it will be a dead-letter and it will reminded here of a case in which a factory- be an unenforceable right. That is why it has owner was going to instal a new factory, and been kept and it was kept in the Directive he said that he was going to have production Principles. But efforts are being made and I of 200,000 tonnes after four years. So a can assure the honourable Members that person after one year said: You said that in serious attention has been paid to this problem four years you would have a production of by the Planning Commission. I have myself 200,000 tonnes, so in one year it should be gone into it and I had obtained a note from the 50,000 tonnes; where is the production? The Planning Commission and I had made a machinery was being set up. So he wanted speech also.... even when the factory had not been installed, SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Mr. Shanti at least l/4th production should be there. He Bhushan, the Planning Commission, in the was not prepared to wait till the completion Draft Sixth Plan Report, envisages an of the factory.... (Interruptions) Are they increase in the middle-class educated threatening to stop the factory being unemployment and whatever figures they constructed? They do not want to solve the have given show that unemployment will unemployment problem? So long as the only rise. unemployment problem is there, you would thrive? No, no, we can't permit this. The SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: What I am unemployment problem shall be solved. saying is that certain strategies and certain policy orientations and certain things have Then, Sir, in regard to the office of profit, been decided upon. But, obviously, you cannot it was said that a good thing had been done by just come to this conclusion. If you want to the forty second amendment, leaving it to the effectively solve the problem of unem- convenience of hon. Members or potential ployment, then, first of all, you have to Members, so that they would know what scientifically study it, and then identify the exactly is an office of profit. Only those problem, identify the magnitude of the offices of profit which are specifically men- problem also and identify as what would be the tioned for the purpose of disqualification only possible way of solving it. Otherwise, if would alone be disqualified, not you just start | 93 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 94 other offices. On the other hand, the earlier office and that office gives me some re- condition which was sought to |>~ be restored was muneration one way or the other, then in that that every office of profit disqualifies, case I know that I am being appointed to an unless Parliament has provided that a particular office of profit. After all, the profit is well- office of profit does not disqualify. Now, what is known. What is profit? Any 3 P.M. pecuniary the difference between the two positions. A benefit is profit. (Interruptions) The parlia- very important difference. The idea is that it ment will disqualify after a long time. Till the is necessary for honest politics, where parliament goes to make the enactment and as politics cannot be polluted and cannot soon as the parliament disqualifies all these be diverted for other ends, namely, that a offices the Government will create other person, if he is a Member of Parliament, must offices. Therefore, the spirit of this provision not hold an office of profit, that is, an office under can be evaded if this kind of innocuous or the Government. Why? Because independent innocent-looging amendment was allowed to functioning must be ensured. Obviously, there has remain. to be some offices like those of poor Ministers and certain officers also. Therefore, certain offices of profit are exempted. But the ex- Then. Sir, I would skip certain things. I will emption has to be given by the Parliament take the time of the hon. Members on consciously, that: all right, this is the office administrative tribunals. I appreciate that there which is essential, therefore it must not have been delays in the High Courts, etc. disqualify. On the other hand, if you have a Therefore, this concept of administrative tribu- provision like the one which was brought up by nals appealed to them. But may I just ask the forty-second amendment, then the them, with great humility, whether they do not position, in brief, would be that an office of have the experience of similar delays even in profit could be created till the time the administrative tribunals. I can assure them that Parliament might apply its mind and specify there have been administrative tribunals and those offices, it would be possible for the Gov- administrative tribunals. (Interruptions) There ernment to keep on creating offices of is no such magic in administrative tribunals profit and say that this cannot disqualify. There that cases would not accumulate there. It all is thus vital difference between these two depends on who is the person, with what positions. The laws must come first and giving speed he functions, how many Judges are of office of profit must come later.... (In- there, how many Benches are there and what terruptions) work is there. Whether you appoint the same two Judges as a Bench of the High Court to SHRI V. B. RAJU: It is not very relevant deal with labour matters or you appoint the here. The question is of definition. ... same two Judges as a Labour Appellate (Interruptions) Tribunal, it would not make the slightest difference. It all depends on whether you have SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Perhaps the the requisite number of Judges with the re- hon. Member has not understood me. It is a quisite speed and capacity who do not allow wellknown concept; it does not require any the backlog to accumulate. If you allow the definition. The word "office" is wellknown. backlog, it can accumulate and has The word "profit" is wellknown. The word accumulated in various tribunals. I know of "Government" is also well known. If the some administrative tribunals clogged up with Government makes appointment of a person work and cases not coming up for years to an office which office securing profit, that together. So, the solution is not administrative is office of profit. It is very clear. If they tribunals because merely by calling appoint me to an 95 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 96

[Shri Shanti Bhushsn] somebody an SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: I have administrative tribunal, he does not get the understood your point. Let me dis capacity of working very fast. It is a question pose of his objection in two sentences. of taking a pragmatic look at things. And In Karnataka, what happened was the handicap of a tribunal is that the that certain administrative tribunals Government can appoint any person to these were created in regard to land re administrative tribunals. Any person can be form matters. I would not like to appointed in a partisan way and the say in what way those administrative Government can create any number of tribunals were created and how they administrative tribunals. Would you like functioned. I was only saying that your rights to be placed before every there should not be various tribunals administrative tribunal? Supposing for to deal with Shri Bhupesh Gupta income-tax matters, not this old Income-Tax packed with politicians and so on who Tribunal which also functions under the will decide not on facts but on the supervision of the High Court, etc., a new In- basis of other considerations. There come-Tax Tribunal was created today | and in Karnataka, the orders were being supposing we appoint two politi- ' cians given without any reasons, etc. They there to dispose of income-tax ; matters. were sometimes in favour of this per They would immediately I assess Shri son and sometimes in favour of that Bhupesh Gupta's income as Rs. 2 crore and person. The High ourt said that if impose a tax of Rs. 1.5 crores on him and the legal rights of the people were say: Yes, this decision is final. So, Shri being decided, then it must be made Bhupesh Gupta goes and Shri Bhupesh known as to why those cases had Gupta is not there in the Rajya Sabha only been decided in A's favour and why because an administrative tribu- I nal those cases had been decided in B's appointed by us, in its wisdom, chooses to favour. So, they quashed all those say: All right, yes yes it is the best judgement; orders. You must give a reasoned after all it is the best judgment. He makes such order. Again they decided them with eloquent speeches. He must be a very able out giving reasons. Such cases do not man and must be earning Rs. 2 crores. take much time to be decided in the Therefore, let us assess him at: Rs. 2 crores. High Courts, and it may be even 10,000 It becomes final. Would Shri Bhupesh Gupta cases can be decided in one day be like to have such a tribunal? cause all that the Judge has to ask the Counsel is, "All right, are all these SHRI YOGENDRA SHARMA: Mr. 10,000 writs cases in which no reasons Shanti Bhushan, your efforts will not have been given?" When he says, "Yes, succeed. the reasons have not been given", the SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: I know you Judge says, "Al right. Orders quashed." would not like them to succeed. Even in Karnataka, it has been rea SHRI L. R. NAIK (Karnataka) : The hon. lised____ Minister, in reply to my question, has said that a Judge can dispose of not more than 600 to SHRI L. R. NAIK: m Karnataka, the High 700 cases in a year. At that time, I had also Court is very rigid in disposing of cases and said that there were writ petitions to the tune of orders of the tribunals at the level of Taluks. 15000 in respect of Land Reforms Act in We have seen that action has been blocked by Karnataka and if he appointed one Judge, he the rigidity applied by the High Court in the would take about 22 to 25 years to dispose of matter of distribution of 4 or five lakh acres of those cases. Will you permit that sort of thing? surplus land to the Scheduled Castes and Scheduled Tribes. What have you to say about it?

SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Even in Karnataka, \ am happy to say that now this infirmity has been realised 97 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 98

and the right of appeal or revision to say that it is necessarily from external some impartial agency has now been aggression. But the whole question whether conceded there. So, that difficulty is over these powers are needed or not depends upon even in Karnataka. the objective situation, and it is not by Sir, so far as the emergency provi definition or by words that the misuse can be sions are concerned, there are just prevented. The misuse can be prevented by two or three small points which have ' safeguards. The words do not prevent the been referred to. One was the armed misuse. You use any words. Then if the rebellion. I would not like to take Government has to misuse, it will say that it is much time of the House. Some hon. I from external aggression. Mr. Bhupesh Members said, what is the difference Gupta's aggression may be said to be from between the internal distrubance and external aggression. Therefore, so far as the the armed rebellion? Now, the dif misuse is concerned, no words, even 'external ference is very obvious, because for aggression', that word, is not going to save the so many days I have seen internal j situation. It is an institutional safeguard. And disturbance in this House but I have that is why the attempt has been to strengthen yet to see an armed rebellion in the the institutional safeguards. Firstly, the House. So, the difference is very Cabinet advice... clear to see, namely, who can deny that there have been plenty of SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: You go to the days ----- next point. SHEI BHUPESH GUPTA: You will SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: He is see that when Mr. Ramamurti comes with convinced. I am grateful to him, Sir, that he a lathi, you will term it an armed has accepted this. rebellion. SHRi SHANTI BHUSHAN: Sir, Shri Sir, I need not take much time of Bhupesh Babu can be so ingenious as to call the House on article 356. It is well- that an armed rebellion. Firstly, there is no known. The safeguards have been rebellion. Then, Sir, there are no arms. And strengthened. this concept of armed rebellion is so well- known that by trying to define it you would, SHRI B. SATYANARAYAN of course, make it absolutely un- REDDY (Andhra Pradesh): I would like to understandable. One has clearly to recognise know whether you consider the agitation by an armed rebellion. But, Sir, it is said that if the Nagas in Naga-land as an armed rebellion the danger to the security of the country is or an internal disturbance. from outside, then emergency may be justified. But if the danger is from inside, SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Perhaps, the although the danger may be of the same hon. Member has not realised that armed magnitude, of the same character, and for rebellion alone is not enough. Armed instance, suppose some foreign power cleverly rebellion must pose a threat to the security of and in such a manner that you cannot show India or to the security of any part of India. it— and it is not visible—supplies arms and Even if there is armed rebellion but it does does something and, therefore, creates any not pose a threat to the security of the armed rebellion inside the country and you are country, then, in that case, the considitions for unable to show it objectively that the emergency are not created. inspiration and the help is from outside, then you can say, well, it is not an external Just ons void about the definitions of aggression which has posed a threat to the 'socialist' and 'secular'. security of the country because unless it can be shown, you cannot -1134 RS^l 99 Constitution (Forty-fifth, [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 100 SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Don't bother. two Houses purport to enact a Bill which says "Shri Antulay is a small girl", what SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Sir, he is happens? (Interruptions). Would Shri convinced. He does not want me to speak on Antulay say, well, they have done it under it. article 368, they have done it by a two-thirds majority and therefore nobody can question SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: What about it and therefore Shri Antulay is a small girl. referendum? But the question that the Supreme Court will SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN : Now, Sir, pose will be, whether calling Shri Antulay a about referendum, even though I had thought small girl amounts to an amendment of the that Shri Bhupesh Gupta had made a very Constitution? Does it mean to say that Shri convincing argument so far as referendum was Antulay is a small girl because it has been concerned, but since Shri Bhupesh Gupta done by a two-thirds majority of the two himself is desirous that I must add some more Houses and so it must be an amendment of the Constitution? strongth to all that he has argued, I would just take a few minutes. SHRI A. R. ANTULAY (Maharash tra) : If Parliament under article 368 SHRi BHUPESH GUPTA: I did not ask says that Shri Shanti Bhushan is an that. I do not know whether you will add the old girl, will the Minister------strength or take away the strength. SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: I will not SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Well, let me make an attempt and we will see what challenge it. happens. SHRI A. R. ANTULAY: Still the Supreme Court cannot go into it. That is Sir, a very pertinent question has been asked not my doubt. As you said, that is my by Shri Antulay and I wish that i had the time to reading of the Constitution and that is my deal with the points raised by him at length. conviction. (Interruptions). That is why I say that I do not have the time. Now, in any case, he has asked (Interruptions) whether in the Kesvanand Bharati case the Sup- SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I am quite reme Court had the jurisdiction to give that sure if the Supreme Court says that Shri judgment because it was an article 32 petition, Antulay is a small girl, he will welcome and he felt that article 32 is only for that. enforcement of fundamental rights, and asked further how does the Supreme Court get the SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Sir, jurisdiction to determine upon the constitutional article 368 gives the power of amending the validity of a constitutional amendment. Now, Constitution to Parliament. The concept of Sir, the answer is very simple. If article 368 amendment is so very clear to hon. Members. gives a power to Parliament, uses certain So many times it is said when a particular language to the effect that Parliament can amendment to a particular clause is moved, amend the Constitution, the question arises well, this is not an amendment to this clause, supposing something which purports to be an therefore this is beyond the scope of the Bill, amendment of the Constitution is enacted, but it etc. That is what exactly the Supreme is not really an amendment of the Constitution, Court did. what happens? May I gave an example? Sup- posing, a two-thirds majority of the Then, Sir, Shri Seervai, who was the greatest exponent of the theory that there can be no judicial review of a constitutional amendment, has also got converted after Mrs. Gandhi's case. He has written in the second I edition of his book that the two- 101 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG 1978 ] Amoc.) mu, ia

thirds majority of the Parliament could not be framers of the Constitution thought— you given absolute powers. The question is how a may go through the debates— and yet the constitutional principle etc. is created in a Supreme Court sat in judgment and whatever certain 'context, in a certain situation? Today, the hon. Law Minister is saying today, is Sir, the whole country is asking whether the certainly not going to be taken note of by the two-thirds majority of the two Houses must Supreme Court. He knows it as good as I do. have absolute powers, even the power of The only thing is, he is sitting on that side clamping a law to say that for the next 26 and this is his job. years there shall not be any election to either House of Parliament and only the casual SHRI B. SATYANARAYAN vacancies will be filled in? The question is REDDY: I want a clarification, Sir. He has whether democracy can be allowed to be not clarified about lowering of age from 21 scuttled even by this process and that is why years to 18 years and also about the right of this referendum clause is sought to be in- recall. troduced. The idea is not that the referendum will be used again and again. The very SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: I had a existence of this requirement of referendum question regarding referendum. I want to itself will be a guarantee that nobody will ever know whether I should put it now or at the propose an amendment... time of Clause-by-Clause consideration.

MR. CHAIRMAN: You may ask at the SHRI A. R. ANTULAY: Miscon- time of Clause-by-Clause consideration. ceived. SHRI U. R. KRISHNAN (Tamil Nadu): Sir, he has not replied to the point about the SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN:... which will right to recall. This is a general question and impair the democratic character of the he has not replied to it. Constitution. So, it is merely a safeguard. And, Sir, those who think that the Supreme MR. CHAIRMAN : The question is: Court should not have the judicial review, I "That the Bill further to amend the hope, would also welcome this referendum Constitution of India, as passed by the Lok because after this referendum is there, one Sabha, be taken into consideration." institution can certainly say that we can check the other institution but no institution can say that they can act as a check on the sovereign The House divided. people of the country. Thereafter it will not be MR. CHAIRMAN: Ayes—177 possible for the Supreme Court to say that Noes—Nil. even if a certain amendment had been ratified by the people of the country in a referendum, the Supreme Court will have the authority. AYES—177

Adivarekar, Shrimati Sushila Shank T With these words, Sir, I would not like to take more time of the House and would Advani, Shri Lai K. commend the Bill to the House. Amarjit Kaur, Shrimati Amla, Shri Tirath Ram SHRI A. R. ANTULAY: Mr. Law Anandam, Shri M. Minister, that is precisely what the Anjiah, Shri T. Antulay, Shri A. R. Arif, Shri Mohammed Usman Asthana, Shri K. B. 103 Constitutir.n (Forty-fifth I RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 I 04

105 Constitution (forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 106

Mohinder Kaur, Shrimati Saring, Shri Leonard Soloman Sarup Mcndal, Shri Ahmad Hossain Singh, Dr. Satchidananda, Shri Moopanar, Shri G. K. Schamnad, Shri Hamid Ali Sezhiyan, Morarka, Shri R. R. Shri Era Shahedullah, Shri Syed Mukherjee, Shrimati Kanak Shahi, Shri Nageshwar Prasad Shanti Mukherjee, Shri Pranab Bhushan, Shri 'Sharma, Shri Ajit Mulla, Shri Suresh Narain Kumar Sharma, Shri Anant Prasad Muthu, Dr. (Shrimati') Sathiavani Sharma, Shri Kishan Lai Sharma, Shri Naidu, Shri N. P. Chengalraya Yogendra Shastri, Shri Bhola Paswan Naik, Shri L. R. Sheikh, Shri Abdul Rehman Siddhu, Nanda, Shri Narasingha Prasad Dr. M. M. S. Singh, Shri Bhishma Narendra Singh, Shri Narain Nigam, Shri Ladli Mohan Singh, Shri J. K. P. N. - Nizam-ud-din, Shri Syed Singh, Shri Ng. Tompok Oza, Shri Ghanshyambhai Singh, Shri Shiva Nandan Pande, Shri Bishambhar Nath Sinha, Shri Indradeep Parbhu Singh, Shri Sinha, Dr. Ramkripal Parikh, Prof. Ramlal Sisodia, Shri Sawaisingh Soni, Shr.mati Ambika Patel, Shri Manubhai Sujan Sir;gh, Shri Pathak, Shri Ananda Sultan, Shrimati Maimoona Patil, Shri Deorao Sultan Singh, Shri Pattanayak, Shri Bhabani Charan Surendra Mohan, Shri Poddar, Shri R. K. Surjeet, Slui Harkishan SiDSh Pradhan, Shri Patitpaban Swu, Shri Scato Prasad, Shri K. L. N. Tama, Shri Ratan Prem Manohar, Shri Totu, Shri Gian Chand Rai, Shri Krlp Nath Tripathi, Shri Kamlapati Raj an, Shri Pattiam Vaishamr^yen, Shri S. K. Sajender Kaur, Shrimati Varma, Shri Bhagwati Charan Raju, Shri V. B. Varma, Shri Mahadeo Prasad Ramamurii, Shri P. Venigalla Satyanarayana, Shri Ranga, Prof. N. G. Venkatrao, Shri Chandalavada Rao, Shri V. C. Kesava Warjri, Shri Alexander Ray, Shri Rabi Yadav, Shri Ramanand Razack, Shrimati Noorjehan Yadav, Shrj Shyam Lai Reddy, Shri B. Satyanarayan *eddy, Shri K. V. Raghunatha NOSE—NIL Reddy, Shri Mulka Govinda The motion was carried by a majo-i ileddy, Shri R. Narasimha rity of the total membership of the itoshan Lai, Shri !toy, Shri Kalyan 3ahu, Shri Santosh Kumar Samad, Shri Golandaz Mohammed - husain A. 107 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 108

House and by a majority of not less than two- (The amendment also stood in the thirds of the Members present and voting. names of Shri Devendra Nath Dwivedi, Shrimati Ambika Soni and Shrimaflj MR. CHAIRMAN: Now the procedure to Leela Damodara Menon) be followed. We shall now take up clause by clause consideration of the Bill. Amendments PROF. SOURENDRA BHATTA- CHARJEE (West Bengal) Sir, I move: to the clauses may be moved, considered and : disposed of when that particular clause is under consideration. If any amendment is 4. "That at page 1, for lines 9 to 12, the following be substituted, namely: adopted by a simple majority, then that particular clause as amended will be put to '(a) in clause (1), for sub-clause (f), the vote immediately. For adoption of the clause following sub-clause shall be substituted, as amended, special majority as prescribed namely: — would be necessary. If the amended clause does not get the prescribed majority then that "(f) to gainful work and adequate means of livelihood; and.' " particular clause would be treated as negatived by the House. Thereafter all the clauses on (The amendment also stood in the which there are no amendments or on which name of Shri Amarprosad Chakra- amendments have not been accepted will be borty) put to vote together. In case member presses any particular clause to be put to vote SHRI P. RAMAMURTI (Tamil Nadu) separately voting on that clause will take place : Sir, I move : accordingly. 5. "That at page 1 for lines 9 to 12, I hope the House agrees with this the following be substituted, namely:—• procedure. '(a) in clause (1) for sub-clause (f), the SHRI BIPINPAL DAS (Assam): I want to following sub-clause shall be substituted, go on record that we want separate voting for namely: — clauses 35, 44, 45 and 47. "(f) to work and to an adequate means MR. CHAIRMAN: That is all right. It has of livelihood; and".'" been made clear it would be done. (The amendment also stood in the names We shall now take up clause by clause of Shri Harkrishan Singh Surjeet, Shri consideration of the Bill. Vishwanatha Menon and Shrimati Kanak Mukherjee) Clause 2 (Amendment of article 19) SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Sir, I SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: Sir, I move: move: 6. "That at page 1, for lines 10 to 12, the following be substituted, namely: 3. "That at page 1, for clause 2. the following clause be substituted, namely: '(i) for sub-clause (f), the following sub- '2. In article 19 of the Constitution, for clause shall be substiuted> namely: — sub-clause (f), the following sub-clause "(f) to work and earn a l;ving" wage; shall be substituted, namely: — and "(f) to work; and".'." (ii) in sub-clause (g), the words, "trade or business" shall be omitted." '" (The amendment also stood in the names of Shri Kalyan Roy, Shri Bit Chand Deb Burman, shri Bhola prasad* and Shri Lakshmann Mahapatro).

The questions were proposed. 109 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 110

SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: Sir, by this said in the earlier discussion, merely by amendment I have asked to amend the clause explaining that socialism means end of by introduction of 'right to work'. The hon. economic exploitation, economic exploitation Minister gave an illustration that if a person will not end in this blessed country of ours wants to construct a factory which should have where the power of capitalism is in full play produced 2 lakh tonnes of a certain thing in unless art obligation is undertaken to end it. four years, another man may ; complain as to Similarly a greater obligation would devolve why 50,000 tonnes could not actually be on the Government if this amendment is produced in a year. I can understand it. But the adopted to clause (f) of Art. 19. At the same difficulty is if you want t0 bring a machinery time, the people's movement for right to work for 2 lakh tonnes of production in four years, and end of unemployment will be further youn construction must show some amount of strengthened. I would, therefore, appeal to the progress. Our complaint is that the Law Minister to accept this amendment and I Government is functioning in such a way that would appeal to the House to pass it within one year instead of the concern showing unanimously. At least 27 years after the some kind of construction, the owner is adoption of our Constitution it is time that we beginning to sell out his land. accept it as a Fundamental Right of the people and as a fundamental obligation of the Government. [The Vice-Chairman (Shri Syed Nizam-ud- Din) in the Chair] THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED NIZAM-UD-DIN): Mr. R'ama- Our whole complaint is that not only you murti. have not been able to solve the problem of unemployment to a certain extent, as Mr. SHRI P. RAMAMURTI: I am not Bhupesh Gupta has pointed out, the question of unemployment is getting worse day by speaking. day. And it is not because of anything else ex- cept lack of commitment to the right to work. SHRI AMARPROSAD CHAKRA-BORTY That is why we have brought this amendment (West Bengal): I have got an amendment. because we feel that under the present context it is extremely essential that the right to work should form part of the rights available to the THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI individual; otherwise there is no hope SYED NIZAM-UD-DIN): Your name is whatsoever for the unemployed and not on this. Mrs. Ambika Soni. unemployed educated youths in this country. SHR'TMATI AMBIKA SO"TI (Punjab): I PROF. SOURENDRA BHATTACHA- would like to move this amendment because as R,JEE: Mr. Vice-Chairman, Sir, my the Law Minister just now said, if you want amendment is in a way self-explanatory saying production after 5 years in some big factory that the right to work or right to adequate vou cannot expect one-fourth of it aft?r only livelihood has not been included as one of our one year has elapsed. But certainly we want to Fundamental Rights. In a welfare State which see that the foundations are being dug, if not claims to have an egalitarian society, work to the output. Sir, he mentioned that the Planning all able-bodied person should be assured in the Commission is trying to create various interest of the nation and in the interest of the avenues for further employi->°nt. But Prof. individuals T am quite aware that merely by Raj Krishna, a Member of the Planning insertion of this clause, overnight employment Commission, has said recently that to won't be produced. As I guarantee full e^o^oyment it would be necessary to have an outlay of B.S. 3.300 crores, wh'"'1 is one- 111 (jonsntution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 112

I.Shrimati Ambika Soni] But taking care of that and the existing backlog, 60 per cent, would he got rid of in third of the total Plan outlay. It has als been 0 addition to the new unemployment which is made clear that this amount of money can be being generated in the first Five Year Plan and collected if adequate resources are mobilised in agriculture industry, trade and other by the end of the Second Five Year Plan there professions. What I mean to say is that unless would be no unemployment. it is incorporated in the Constitution that every one has the right to work, the very SHRI KALYAN ROY (West Bengal) Even motivation and the compulsion of in the public sector thousands of workers are Government to fulfil it will not be there. being thrown out. You are not only not opening new avenues of employment you are Another point that I want to make is that in throwing out workers. You are creating this Forty-fifth Amendment Bill, the hon. Law further unemployment. Minister has moved an. amendment for the definition of the word "socialism'' where he SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: At a stage has tried to define it as where there shall be no when new strategies are being worked out and 'exploitation, socially, politically or decided upon it is only when they are put in economically. I hold that if a person is not force that the results will come out. Until the guaranteed his right to work he is being new plans are in force and the new strategies exploited economically, socially and have been really implemented until then the politically. I, therefore, move that the right to results would not come out. work should be incorporated. THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SHRI AMARPROSAD CHAKRA- BORTY: For the last twenty eight years right SYED NIZAM-UD-DIN) Mr. Bhu-pesh : to work has been included in Directive Gupta. Principles but n thing has been done. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I have not much to say. No speech is needed. Right to SHRIMATI LEELA DAMODARA work should be included. What is there to MENON (Kerala): By this definition against speak? Let us save time. exploitation are not negating the provisions of the Constitution if you do not make it a SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: I appreciate positive one and give the people the right to and would like to respond to the sentiments work? You have a planned economy. You are expressed by Shrimati Soni and Shri getting all the resources also mobilised and if Goswami. I would entirely agree with the you do not do that it will not be a positive deflntion of ""socialism". It has been given thing. Why should it not be a positive thing? It that there shall be no exploitation of any kind. is a positive negation of rights. We have a It does include that if a person is unemployed planned economy and we have accepted a he is certainly being exploited by society. I socialist State and also a Welfare State. could not agree more. And that is why we are Therefore, why make it a negative thing and committed to removing unemployment negate your own Constitution? completely. I would like to assure the honourable lady Member that the Plans which SHRI K. K. MADHAVAN (Kerala): Just have been drawn up by the Planning one minute. You can reply together. Commission contemplate that the level of unemployment v-hich exists today would be SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Let me reply reduced by 60 per cent, at the end of the first to this first. I have already agreed with Five Year Plan because every year new Shrimati Ambika Soni unemployment is also being generated. 113 constitution (forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1973 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 114 that even though it is couched in a negative the other day I was reading the resolution language, there is a positive content in the which was taken up at the Lohia Vichar definition of socialism. When you say that Manch; I am referring to that —have said that there shall be no poverty, it is not a negative they have been greatly disillusioned by the concept; it is a positive concept, namely, that Janata rule. Therefore, these are the things evarybody will be well-provided for. It is a which have been agitating us. We are, question of concept. I have already agreed with therefore, saying that the right to work and the you that the concept of socialism is a positive right to a living wage should be provided for. concept.

SHKIMATI LEELA DAMODARA SHRI K. K. MADHAVAN: Sir, there is a set MENON: Let us not mitigate a thing when of amendments—amongst which there is an psople are not being given even a dole. attempt at the abolition of the private property. And the right to work is a corollary to the attempt at the abolition of the private property. I SHRI LAKSHMANA MAHAPATRO do not stand by the private property. I am (Orissa): I would just like to mention that totally opposed t0 the private property. At the the confidence of the working class is shaken same time, you have to ensure the right to work after the Bhootha-lingam Committee to the citizens; every able-bodied person should report which recommended only Rs. 100 have the right to work. That has to be assured. per month as the lowest wage whereas a The hon. Law Minister is making a mirage of Committee went into the matter of wages in the promises by saying that they will be doing this year 1939 and it recommended Rs. 150 per thing or that thing in future. Here is a month. Now. 39 years after that, there is a Government which speakes a confusing Committee which says that Rs. 100 should be language because of confused thinking. They the minimum wage. Therefore, we are talk of Socialism, they talk of Gandhi-ism, they not able t0 believe that the working class will be talk of all sorts of 'isms' and they are making all having a living wage to ensure what you sorts of confusions. By passing these said in the amendment. Therefore, not only amendments, can such a Government ensure the should there be a guarantee of work but also right to work? Can they ensure work at all? a living wage ensured to the people. The other thing I want to say is that now during the regime of this Ministry 18 lakhs SHRI SURENDRA MOHAN (Uttar unemployed people have been added on to Pradesh): Sir, I wish to make a submission. I the rolls of the employ- j ment exchanges; would only submit that, as the Law Minister and the number is going to increase further. has said, the Janata Party, in its election Mr. Biju Patnaik might say: I will take one manifesto, has accepted that there will be the lakh; of people. He has started it by shooting right to work. The Draft Plan says that 41 people at Bailadila ! How do you say that you million jobs will be created during the next five will put up factories in four years and then you years, and within ten years maybe everybody will be given employment. So the right to work, will provide employment t0 these people? Your factories are not going to cope with if it has to be realised, will have to be realised this problem because unemloyment will progressively. The problem is that, during the be ever increasing. You may be working on last two and a half decades, we have been it. you may work for years, but you will not be seeing a situation in which unemployment has able to get away from this thing, i.e. the rise increased. As everybody knows, when in the number of the unemployed people. This is the reason why so many youngsters even in the Janata group— I 115 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 116

[Shri Surendra Mohan] SHRI SURENDRA MOHAN: My only the Second Five-Year Plan was launch submission is that it is not a question either of ed, it was said that five million people promises or of statistics; it is a question, as I were unemployed; when the Third said, Q& finance and putting into practice an Five-Year Plan was launched, the alternative economic development strategy number was 9 million; and in any case has been defined: intensification of now it is 34 crores, i.e. 35 million, agriculture, building up of smaJl rural Now, if today you have in the Consti industries and cottage industries and also in a tution the right to work, then it means big way construction of rural infrastructure that we are going to reverse this whole without in any way diverting ourselves from process, a process in which unemploy the expansion of the public sector. This is the ment increased seven-fold in 20 years. strategy, and I think that this strategy will Can We do it with a stroke of pen? guarantee th3 right to work. Will this be realistic? That is one thing. And secondly I say that the SHRI G. C. BHATTACHARYA: One creation of employment will mean the clarification. definition of an entirely different eco nomic strategy from the one that has THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED been followed so far. The Janata NIZAM-UD-DIN): After the Hon. Minister Party has sought to define a certain has replied, there is no question. He has alternative strategy. That is why the replied already. You should have asked at the Janata Government and the Planning appropriate time. Commission say that during the next fivg years 41 million jobs will be creat SHRI G. C. BHATTACHARYA: I want ed, which will take care of some back- to know from the Hon. Member who has log of the unemployed. And may I supported the right to work, whether he can also say that every year 50 to 55 lakhs expect the State to guarantee the right to of people will find new jobs. They work and that too fundamental right to work enter the labour market. When we without the State having control over the say that the right of work is going to means of production? be made a Fundamental Right which is justiciable in a court of law, are we THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED sure that we will be able to give NIZAM-UD-DJN): That is true. employment every year not only to those 55 lakhs of new entrants but the SHRI G. C. BHATTACHARYA: That -was backlog of the unemployed who are a slogan-mongering. We should not waste 300 crores. Therefore, my submission the time on such slogan-mongering. is that, while I entirely agree with the sentiments that the right to work must THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED be recognised as a Fundamental Right, NIZAM-UD-DIN): 1 would like to know I think that writing it now will be whether you withdraw your amendment. unrealistic. Therefore, I would submit What about your amendment, Mr. Goswami? to the House ...... SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: Sir, we have SHRI KALYAN ROY: For the last 30 years made our point, and we have exposed the we have been hearing this. We have been told hollowness of the Janata Party's promise. that the time has not been right, that it has not THE VICE-CHAIRMAN^ (SHRI SYED been pragmatic, and the same thing is being NIZAM-UD-DIN): The Minister has not repeated now. accepted it.

THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYEn NIZAM-UD-DIN): The Hon. Minister has replied. Therefore, there is no question of the Members speaking now. 117 Constitution {Forty-fifth [31 AUG. 1978] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 118

SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: Sir, I THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED withdraw. NIZAM-UD-DIN): That is true.

The Amendment* (No. 3) was, by leave The question is: withdrawn. 4. "That at page 1, for lines 9 to 12s, the following be substituted, namely: — THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED NIZAM-UD-DIN): Prof. Bhattachar-jee, are '(a) in clause (1), for sub-clause (f), the you pressing your amendment or are you following sub-clause shall be substituted,, withdrawing? namely: — "(f) to gainful work and adequate SHRI AMARPROSAD CHAKRA- means of livelihood; and'" '" BORTY: We are not withdrawing. The motion was negatived. THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED NIZAM-UD-DIN): Mr. Chakraborty, you THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRr SYED please see, your name does not appear in the NIZAM-UD-DIN); Amendment No. 5. Mr. list of the amendment. Ramamurti, are you pressing your amendment? SHRI AMARPROSAD CHAKRA- SHRI P. RAMAMURTI: I am not pressing BORTY: Yes, it appears. it. THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED The amendment* (No. 5) was, by leave, NIZAM-UD-DIN): Do you not withdraw? withdrawn.

SHRI AMARPROSAD CHAKRA- THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRr SYED BORTY: No. NIZAM-UD-DIN): Amendment No. 6. Mr. Bhupesh Gupta, are you pressing it or withdrawing it? SHRI PRANAB MUKHER'JEE (West Bengal): If it goes in this way, I am afraid, it SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA; Take voice will take the whole night. Either you must vote. How can I withdrawn it? regulate in such a way or 1 think the Minister THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED of Parliamentary Affairs should see that on NIZAM-UD-DIN): The question is; important articles we can speak, and the rest of the things we can go on. Otherwise, the 6. "That at page 1, for lines 10 to whole night we have to pass. I have no 12, the following be substituted, objection, but it is for the Government to namely: — decide. I am prepared to co-operate. ' (i) for sub-clause (f), the following sub- clause shall be substituted, namely: — SHRI KALYAN ROY: Now the time has come when we should have a Government. "(f) to work and earn a living wage"; and THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED NIZAM-UD-DIN): Unless the Members co- (ii) in sub-clause (g), the words, 'trade or operate, it cannot be otherwise. business' shall be omitted." ' • The motion was negatived. THE LEADER OF THE OPPOSITION (SHRI KAMLAPATI TRIPA-THI): When THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED the Minister has olready made his speech on NIZAM-UD-DIN): Now, we take up clause 3. any amendments, after that nobody should There are seven amendments. speak. *For text of Amendment vide cols. 107 *For text Afendment vide col. 108 Supra. Supra. 119 Con&tittiUon (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 120

Clause 3 (Amendment of Article 22) (The amendvient also stood in the names of Shri Kalyan Roy, Shri Bir Chandra Deb SHRI HARKISHAN SINGH SUR-JEET Burman, Shri Bhola Prasad and Shri (Punjab): Sir, I move; Lakshmana Maha-patro) This is the amendment. It is self-explanatory. 7. "That at pages 1 and 2, for clause 3, the following clause be substituted, namely:— We want the provision empowering preventive detention to go. This is the '3. In article 22 of the Constitution,— amendment. No speech is called for. The question was proposed. "(a) in clause (3), sub-clause (6) shall SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA REDDY be omitted.' (Andhra Pradesh): Sir, I move; "(b) clauses (4), (5), (6) and 17) shall 10. "That at pages 1 and 2, for clause 3, the be omitted.'"" following clause be substituted, namely: — '3. In article 22 of the Constitution, The amendment also stood in the names of clauses (3), (4), (5), (6) and (7) 'shall be Shri P. Ramamurti, Shri ViFVsanatha Menon, omitted." Shrimati Kanak Mukh?rjeet Prof. sourendra Bhattn_ eharjee and Shri Amarprosad (The amendment also stood in the name of Chakra-borty). Shri Mulka Govinda Reddy) The question was proposed. SHRI MURASOLI MARAN (Tamil Nadu) : Sir, I move; 11. "That at page 1, line 19, before the words 'No law' the words THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED 'Notwithstanding anything in the NIZAM-UD-DIN): Amendment No. 8. Mr. Constitution, no law providing for Dhabe. He is not here. preventive detention shall operate in respect of any citizen of India Amendment No. 9. Mr Bhupesh Gupta. except during the period when Pro clamation of Emergency issued under SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Sir. I move: Article 352(1) is in operation and' be inserted." 9. "That at pages 1 and 2, for clause 3, the SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: Sir, I move; following clause be substituted, namely >- 12. "That at page 2. lines 8-9, for the words 'and the other members '3. In Eirticle 22 of the Constitution,— shal] be serving or retired Judges "(a) for clause (4), the following clause of any High Court' the words 'and shall be substituted, namely: — of the other members at least one shall be a serving Judge of any (4) No person who is arrested shall be High Court and another may be a detained without trial except under serving Judge of any High Court orders of the court and in accordance or a person qualified to be a Judge with the provisions of the law, for more but not a retired Judge' be substi than 24 hours.' tuted." (b) clauses (5), (6) and (7) shall be SHRI R. NARASIMHA REDDY (Andhra omitted."'" Pradesh): Sir, I move; 13. "That at page 2, line 11, after the words 'detention of any person' 121 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 122

the words 'merely and solely on had fought against this. Subsequently also for political grounds and' be interted.'" 30 years we have been fighting against it. The whole history shows that this has been used The questions were proposed. against the democratic movement of the country, especially the Left movement, and the working class has been deprived of their rights SHRI HARKISHAN SINGH SUR-JEET: by the use of this power, by putting their Sir, this is a very important amendment. leaders in prison. On the basis of this ex- Within one-and-a-half years the Janata Party perience, no protection, no safeguards will has forgotten its pledge and both the Congress work. The executive will do whatever they (I) and the Janata Party are joining together to want. And how is it done. Sir? Here at the see that preventive detention remains in the Centre, from the Home Ministry in the night Constitution. Sir, this has always been used instructions are sent. Papers are cyclostyled or earlier against the democratic movement, not printed. They are instructed to prepare a list against the black-marketeers, not against the first. And then immediately in the whole night monopolists, not against the big business the operation takes place throughout the houses, not against the landlords. We have got country, all the people are arrested, put behind the worst experience of its use. I myself, bars and all that, and subsequently everything Sir, had been kept under preventive is done. Earlier also if you see the Forty-second detention for seven years, under the British Amendment, they had the same provisions. The regime as well as under the Congress rule. present Law Minister also provided so many All the safeguards which the Law provisions, this and that. On this issue both the Minister has mentioned here would not be of Janata Party and the Congress-I are united. any avail. He says that instead of "three What they have been doing, they do not want months", it has been made "two to undo. During its 1' years rule now the Janata months", that there will be a review and Government says that this must be kept there. that it will be the judges who will decide and Why? Are not the present laws sufficient to so on. Earlier also all these promises had protect them? And protect whom? Whom do been there. Here in the House whenever such they want to protect? The big industrialists, the preventive detention measures were big landlords, have already been protected. It is brought, it was stated that they would not be only the working class people who have to used against the political workers. But suffer under this. So I again appeal t0 the they have always been used against the Government, if they want to adhere to their political people. Now, I could understand election pledge, if they want to assure the that after the economic situation became people, if they want to win the confidence of very difficult, the Congress had been using all the people, they must accept this amendment these provisions. But the Janata Party and do away with this black provision, this had given new promises to the people; they preventive detention, from the Constitution. had come forward with a solemn pledge to the people that they would not use it, that SHRI INDRADEEP SINGH they would do away with the MISA (Bihar): I would just like to refer to the Law immediately and so on. But now they Minister's statement here that preventive want to put the same thing in the Constitu- detention is necessary for detaining smugglers tion as a constitutional provision. I do and other criminal elements. The Law Minister not understand how the Law Minister knows as well as I do, that these smugglers and the Janata Party can justify this. I and criminal elements are do not want to repeat, but I again appeal to them to reconsider the opposition on this question because the whole national movement 123 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ EAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 124

[Shri Indradeep Singh] 4 P.M. maintained by certain social classes and it by providing for a Advisory Boards and politicians arising out of those classes. The other machinery. We realise that, this is a part other day a Minister of the Janata Government of the colonial heritage. During the British in Bihar declared openly and he declared it in days, the British Government depended the Bihar Assembly, that he harbours mostly on preventive detention in some form goondas, he maintains them because goondas or other. Though the arguments advanced by are necessary for capturing booths, election Mr. Shanti Bhushan appear to be rather booths, poling booths during elections, and impressive as far their content is concerned, jf securing victory in the elections. Honestly he you follow them to their logical conclusion; said it; others have not said it. So, who then even the very Constitutional amendment maintains these goondas and criminal can be got passed by a conniving and elements and smugglers? designing Government by a simple majority in the House by putting most of the members of SHRI P. RAMAMURTI: You must the opposition in jail.... thank that Minister. SHRI P. RAMAMURTI: It was SHRI INDRADEEP SINHA: Yes, we attempted in Kerala. have thanked him. He is a very outspoken man. So it is a certain social system SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA REDDY: which maintains these goondas, and your When the Forty.second Amendment was preventive Act will not prevent them from passed by both Houses of Parliament, it is not carrying on their nefarious activities. There as if all Wie Members of parliament were was a time when your great leader, present and voted. Where was the two-thirds majority? Even with a simple majority the Jayaprakash Narayan, went t0 the smugglers and wanted to convert them and change their Government can manage to get any heart. Smugglers are big patrons and amendment passed without any trouble. Last smugglers cannot be tackled by this method. time also some of the leading Members of the As a matter of fact, preventive detention is opposition were under arrest. Our present designed only to control the activities of the Prime Minister was himself in prison. I am leftist and democratic forces. 1 have my rather amazed that the Janata Government, experience. He talks of the Advisory Board. having learnt the lesson and with sufficient In 1965 when I was detained, we filed a experience of this should have thought it fit to continue this preventive detention provision. habeas corpus petition in the High Court and the High Court ordered our release. We Of course, Mr. Shanti Bhushan mentioned were released and just outside the jail gate we about criminals, smugglers and dacoits. I do not think that the ingenuity of human legal were again Arrested and again put int0 the jail. brain is such that it cannot provide other That is how your Advisory Boards are treated by the Government. So the only necessary means to deal with such criminals remedy is to do away with preventive detention and anti-social elements in this country. altogether. If you want a special law for dealing with Ministers who harbour SHRI P. RAMAMURTI: With political criminals or for smugglers or other anti-social will it can be done. elements, Parliament is competent to enact. SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA REDDY: But there can be no provision in the Political will and determination of the law Constitution for any type 0f preventive enforcing machinery should be there. They detention. should be patriotic enough and then they can SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA REDDY: certainly eliminate these criminal activities This is rather a draconian part of the from the country, 0f course, Constitution though the honourable Minister tried to soften 125 Constiiuticn {Forty-fifth [31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 126 with the public support. Experience in the past think, Sir, that many even in the Janata Party has shown that preventive detention was used are not for preventive detention. When they only to deal with political opponents and not wanted to bring in the MISA as a part of the to deal with majority of criminals operating in Criminal Procedure Code, they had to face this country. terrific opposition and they had to drop it. I do not know how the Janata Party members are SHRI MURASOLI MARAN: I am totally allowing this, are permitting this situation. I against preventive detention. It is an illegal want to bring to the notice of the honourable law. We know there was a time when there Minister and also the House what a Janata was no preventive detention at all in our Party member himself said in the Lok Sabha. country. When Mrs. Gandhi wanted to bring in Sir, one Janata Member, Mr. B. p. Mandal, preventive detention law, after its life had has said; expired, the DMK Party and the CPi did not give their support to the measure. At that time "The Bill may prove to be the Waterloo she was heading a minority Government. Pre- of the Janata Party in the next elections." ventive detention then came to an end in the midnight of December 31. 1969. For one and That is all Sir. half years from then there was no preventive detention. The heavens did not fall because SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: Sir, my India did not have this law. It is very strange amendment is only that retired Judges should that after Mrs. Gandhi had a massive mandate not be put on the Advisory Boards. I think in the election, she brought in prevention many eminent jurists expressed their views detention. Many of the Janata leaders are against the appointment of retired jurists, Any former detenus. They know that prevention way, the general feeling is that the detention was used against the RSS, the appointment of retired Judges on this type of socialists, the communists and the labour Boards is not a very healthy practice. I hope leaders. It is very strange that the former the honourable Minister will say something detenus, after getting a massive mandate of the on this and accept it. people are bringing in another provision for preventive detention. It is a shame. When irt SHRI R. NARASIMHA REDDY: Sir, this 1950 they brought in preventive detention law, problem of preventive detention must be they said it was to suppress Telengana looked at in my view, from a practical and a movement. In 1961 when Rajaji was the realistic point of view and not from merely an Home Minister he said it Was to suppress emotional angle. Human beings being what Communists. We know how the law was they are, I do not think that the human society; misused. Even though I am for total negation the human beings, whether in this country or of preventive detention, yet as a compromise I in any other country, would become angels have moved an amendment. If you think and that no law would become necessary. I do preventive detention is inevitable, use it only not think that the human beings would become during emergency and according to me so much conscious of their duties and other emergency should not be declared for armed things that there would be no necessity for a rebellion. Nowhere in the world in any State or for laws, j do not expect this situation. democratic country there is preventive When we cannot visualise such a situation, we detention during peace. Even in Britain or in have to look at this problem from a practical America, only during a war, Sir, the Govern- point of view and, therefore, I am striking a ment is given such powers. That is why I midway. I say that this is an enabling beseech the honourable Minister to consider provision in th Constitution and my request and I e 127 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 128

[Shri iR. Narasimha Reddy] this Preventive In 1952, when that order of detention was Detention clause should be there. But herein executed and when I was given the charge- comes the most important thing; The previous sheet, it said: history has been that this has been misused against political opponents on political grounds "He incited the peasants of Coim-batore, and on political grounds they have the tenants of Coimbatore, to fight for giving been arrested. I was one of those who their share to the landlords in government- were detained ior political purposes and on stamped measures and to receive their wages political grounds. The Law Minister has said in Government-stamped measures." that this is a necessary evil and that there are safeguards. There are plenty of safeguards This was one of the charges given to me and, therefore, these safeguards will see to then; I can go on giving such examples. In jt that this is not used for political purposes. spite of that, Sir, the Advisory Board This is what he has said. But, Sir, | I confirmed - that detention. Similarly, you all would like to know whether this 1 prevents know, that in 1962 and in 1965, we were all any Legislature from passing I a Preventive detained, just because we said that there Detention Act where, certainly, these political must be a peaceful solution of the grounds could be brought in. In such cases, problem with China, that there should be a what is it that your Advisory Boards can do? peaceful solution to the Sino-Indian border dis- These Advisory Boards can eo into 1 the pute, because we could not go to war with cases and can go into the causes j and the them and that a war could not be there. In reasons according to the Act that is there 1965, Sir, we said that we must improve our and they have I to go by the Act relations with China, we must send our am- only. Therefore, I have moved this bassador from here to China and start amendment saying that preventive detention getting their ambassador here so that things merely and solely on political grounds could become better later and things would should not be there. and once this is there, improve later on. For that reason only, for once this is incor- 1 porated in the that only reason, we were put in jail in 1965. Constitution, no legislature can misuse this We all know that whatever might be your Act, and we will have the power to use it safeguards, I know that in spite of all these against the smugglers, against the blackmar- safeguards, it does not work in practice. keteers and against the spies. I This can be used against leaders of the therefore, request the honourable Minister working class, leaders of the peasantry, to consider this. leaders of the down-trodden people and their SHRI P. RAMAMURTI: Sir, Mr. Shanti political opponents and particularly people Bhushan talked of safeguards that have been who stand for a new kind of society. It is not provided for preventive detention. I would there in any democratic country. like *Q remind him that previously also there Therefore, this is absolutely unnecessary. had been safeguards. We were also given This clause must go. charge-sheets not after three months, but even within a month. We been given the SHRI GHANSHYAMBHAI OZA charge-sheets within a month and there had (Gujarat;": My feeling is, my apprehension is, also been 3 sitting Judges of the High Court that if the matter is examined by a sitting who were appointed on the Advisory Boards. judge, along with other judges, and they hold I will give you nv own experience. In 1948, I that the preventive detention is all right and was ained Actually, they could not execute then the matter goes before the the detention order till 1952. 129 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 130

131 Constitution (Forty-fijth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 132

NOES—140 Joshi, Shri Jagdish Joshi, Shri

Adivarekar, Shrimati Sushila Shan- Krishna Nand kar , , Joshi, Shrimati Kumudben Manishan-ker Advani, Shri Lai K. Alva, Shrimati Kadershah, Shri M. Margaret Amla, Shri Tirath Ram Anandam, Kakati, Shri Rabin Shri M. Anjiah, Shri T. Antulay, Shri A. R. Kalaniya, Shri Ibrahim Arif, Shri Mohammed Usman Asthana, Shri Kamble, Prof. N. M. K. B. Bagaitkar, Shri Sadasiv Baleshwar Kameshwar Singh, Shri Dayal, Shri Balram Das, Shri Banerjee, Shri Kesri, Shri Sitaram Jaharlal Bansi Lai, Shri Basavaraj, Shri H. Khan, Shri Ghayoor AH R. Bhabhda, Shri Harishanker Bhagat.Shri Khan, Shri Khurshed Alam Ganapat Hiralal Bhagwan Din, Shri Bhandari, Khan, Shri Maqsood Ali Shri Sunder Singh Bhattacharya, Shri G. C. Khan, Shrimati Ushi Bhim Raj, Shri Bose, Shrimati Pratima Khaparde, Shrimati Saroj Chandrasekhar, Shrimati Maragatham Khobragade, Shri Bhaurao Devaji Chatterjee, Shri Pranab Chattopadhyaya, Prof. Krishna, Shri M. R. D. P. Chaurasia, Shri Shivdayal Singh Das, Krishna, Shri E. R. Shri Bipinpal Desai, Shri R. M. Dinesh Krishnan, Shri U. R. Chandra, Shri Swami Dinesh Singh, Shri Kureel, Shri Piare Lall urj Piare Lall Dutt, Dr. V. P. Dwivedi, Shri Devendra Talib Lakhan Singh, Shri Lokesh Chandra, Nath Gadgil, Shri Vithal Gupta, Shri Ram Dr. Lotha, Shri Khyomo Mahanti, Shri Lakhan Prasad Habibullah, Shrimati Hamida Bhairab Chandra Mahida, Shri Harisinh Hegde, Shri Ramakrishna Jagbir Singh, Shri Bhagubava Majhi, Shri Dhaneswar Jamuna Devi, Shrimati Jha, Shri Kamalnath Makwana, Shri Yogendra Mallick, Shri Jha, Shri Shiva Chandra Joshi, Shri Harekrushna Manhar, Shri Bhagatram Jagannathrao Mathur, Shri Jagdish Prasad Maurya, Shri Buddha Priya Mehrotra, Shri Prakash Menon, Shrimati Leela Damodara Mishra, Shri Kalraj Mishra, Shri Mahendra Mohan Mody, Shri Piloo Mohanty, Shri Surendra Mohinder Kaur, Shrimati Mondal, shri Ahmad Hossain Moopanar, Shri G. K. Morarka, Shri R. R. Mukherjee, Shri Pranab 133 Constitution (Forty-ftfth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdi.) Bill, 1978 134

Munuswam'y, Shri V. P. Singh, Shrimati Pratibha Singh, Shri Muthu, Dr. (Shrimati) Sathiavani Shiva Nandan Sinha, Dr. Ramkripal Naidu, Shri N. P. Chengalray» Sisodia, Shri Sawaisingh Sujan Singh, Naik, Shri L. R. Shri Sultan, Shrimati Maimoona Sultan Narendra Singh, Shri Singh, Shri Surendra Mohan, Shri Totu, Nigam, gjhri Ladli Mohan Shri Gian Chand Tripathi, Shri

Oza, Shri Ghanshyambhai Kamlapati Varma) Shri Bhagwati Pande, Shri Bishambhar Nath Charan Varma Shri Mahadev Prasad Prabhu Singh, Shri Venka, Shri V. Venkatrao, Shri Parikh, Prof. Ramlal Chadalavada Warjri, Shri Alexander Patel, Shri Manubhai Yadav, Shri Ramanand Yadav, Shri Patil, Shri Deorao Shyam Lai Pattanayak, Shri Bhabani Charan The motion was negatived. Pradhan, Shri Patitpaban Prem Manohar, Shri THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED Rai, Shri Kalp Nath NIZAM-UD-DIN): Now Amendment No. 9 by Shri Bhupesh Gupta. Rajinder Kaur, Shrimati The question is: Raju, Shri V. B. Rameshwar Singh, Shri 9. "That at pages 1 and 2, for clause 3, the following clause be substituted, Ranga, Prof. N. G. namely:— Rao, Shri V. C. Kesava Ray, Shri Rabi '3. In article 22 of the Constitution,— Reddy, Shri B. Satyanarayan "(a) for clause (4), the following clause Reddy, Shri R. Narasimha shall be substituted, name- Roshan Lai, Shri iy:- Sahaya, Shri Dayanand "(4) No person who is arrested shall be detained without trial except under Samad, Shri Golandaz Mohammed- orders of the court and in accordance husain A. with the provisions of the law, for more Saring, Shri Leonard Soloman than 24 hours.' "' Sarup Singh, Dr. "(b) clauses (5), (6) and (7) shall be omitted."' Satchidananda, Shri Schamnad, Shri Hamid Ali The motion was negatived, Sezhiyan, Shri Era THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED Shahi, Shri Nageshwar Prasad NIZAM-UD-DIN): Amend, ment No. 10. Shanti Bhushan, Shri Sharma, Shri Ajit Kumar Sharma, Shri Anant Prasad Sharma, Shri Kishan Lai Shastri, Shri Bhola Paswan Singh, Shri Bhishma Narain Singh, Shri J. K. P. N. Singh, Shri Ng. Tompok 135 Constitution (Forty-filth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 136

SHRI K. V. RAC^UNATHA RED-DY: Amendment *(No. 13) was, by leave Sir, I am not pressing my amendment and I withdrawn. am withdrawing it. THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED The amendment* (No. 10) was, by leave, NIZAM-UD-DIN): The question is: withdrawn. "That clause 3 stand part of the Bill'. SHRI MURASOLI MARAN: Sir, I want voice vote on my amendment No. 11. SHRI B. N. BANERJEE: Sir, may I bring something regarding the procedure to the THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED notice of this House? NIZAM-UD-DIN); The question is: 1 will take two minutes only. I am 11. "That at page 1, line 19, before the helping you. I can understand that words 'No law' the words 'Notwithstanding in respect of those clauses where anything in the Constitution, no law there are no amendments, we are providing for preventive detention shall putting them to vote together. Now, operate in respect of any citizen of India in case of clause 2, the amendments except during the period when were moved; many of the amend Proclamation of Emergency issued under ments were negatived and, Sir, you article 352(1) is in operation and' be did not put clause 2 to vote, mien inserted." we come to clause 2, there are am'encl- ments; some of thenoarer pjat-, to weft The motion was negatived. and negatived and you rejected,the amendments, and then you are putting THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED clause 3"to-vote. Why is this different NIZAM-UD-DIN): Amendment No. 12— procedure fcrting rfollowed web Shri Dinesh G-oswami is not here.

12. The question is: finds THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI —.r.oti SYED NIZAM-UD-DIN)- It is be-use some of flftPSftfe.3 Members wanted that clause 3 "That at page 2, lines 8-9 for the words 'and should be put to the other members shall be serving or retired vote separtely. Judges of any High Court' the words fand of the other members at > least one I shall be a . serving Judge of any ! High Court and another, may-be a serving Judge of any High SHRI SUNDER^ S, INGH BHANDA-RI Court or a person qualified to be a Judge but (Uttar Pradesh): All other Articles not a retired Judge' be substituted." wheneAthfetfe«is no objection, are to be taken up together. The motion was negatived. SHRI B'.'N. BANERJEE: In case of clause SHRI R. NARASIMHA REDDY: Sir, I 2, the^re are amendments which have beeh withdraw my Amendment No. negatived. -rrCtetise iio. 2 is kept there and is not put to vote. Whyr then in.case of clause 3, where the amendments are negatived you are putting- straightaway clause 3 to vote? I cannot understand it.

*For the text of the Amendment vide cols. 120-21 supra. •For the text of the Amendment vide col. 120 surjr¥irrloT 137 Constitution (forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 1 38

THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED Dinesh Singh, Shri NIZAM-UD-DIN): The question is: Dutt, Dr. V. P. "That clause 3 stand part of the Bill". Gadgil, Shri Vithal Goswami, Shri Sriman Prafulla The House divided. Gupta, Shri Bhupesh THE VICE-CHAIRMAN; Ayes—160; Gupta, Shri Ram Lakhan Prasad Noes—14. Habibullah, Shrimati Hamida Hegde, Shri Ramakrishna AYES—160 Jagbir Singh, Shri Jamuna Devi, Shrimati Adivarekar, Shrimati Sushil Shankar Janardhanaim, Shri A. P. Advani, Shri Lai K. Jha, Shri Kamalnath Alva, Shrimati Margaret Jha, Shri Shiva Chandra Amarjit Kaur, Shrimati Joshi, Shri Jagannath Rao Amla, Shri Tirath Ram Joshi, Shri Jagdish Anandam, Shri M. Joshi, Shri Krishna Nand Anjiah, Shri T. Joshi, Shrimati Kumudben Manishan-ker Arii, Shri Mohammed Usman Kadershah, Shri M. Asthana, Shri K. B. Kakati, Shri Robin Bagaitkar, Shri Sadasiv Kalaniya, Shri Ibrahim Baleshwar Dayal, Shri Kamble, Prof. N. M. Balram Das, Shri Kameshwar Singh, Shri Banerjee, Shri B. N. Kesri, Shri Sitaram Banerjee, Shri Jaharlal Khan, Shri Ghayoor Ali Bansi Lai, Shri Khan, Shri Khurshed Alam Barman, Shri Prasenjit Khan, Shri Maqsood Ali Basavaraj, Shri H. R. Khan, Shrimati Ushi Bhabhda, Shri Harishanker Khaparde, Shrimati Saroj Bhagat, Shri Ganpat Hiralal Khobargade, Shri Bhaurao Devaji Bhagwan Din, Shri Krishna, Shri M. R. Bhandari, Shri Sunder Singh Krishnan, Shri E. R. Bhattacharya, Shri G. C. Krishnan, Shri U. R. Bhim Raj, Shri Bose, Shrimati Pratima Kureel, Shri Piare Lall urf Piare Lall Talib Chandrasekhar, Shrimati Maragatham Lakhan Singh, Shri Chatterjee, Shri Pranab Lakshmanan, Shri G. Chattopadhyaya, Prof. D. P. Lokesh Chandra, Dr. Chaurasia, Shri Shivdayal Singh Lotha, Shri Khyomo Das, Shri Bipinpal Madhavan, Shri K. K. Desai, Shri R. M. Mahanti, Shri Bhairab Chandra Deshmukh, Shri Bapuraoji Marotraoji Mahavir, Dr. Bhai Dinesh Chandra, Shri Swami Mahida, Shri Harisinh Bhagubava 139 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 140

Majhi, Shri Dhaneswar Bay, Shri Babi Makwana, Shri Yogendra Bazack, Shrimati Noorjehan Mallick, Shri Harekrushna Beddy, Shri B. Satyanarayan Manher, Shri Bhagatram Beddy, Shri K. V. Baghunatha Mathur, Shri Jagdish Prasad Beddy, Shri Mulka Govinda Maurya, Shri Buddha Priya Beddy, Shri B. Narasimha Mehrotra, Shri Prakash Boshan Lai, Shri Mehta, Shri Om Sahaya, Shri Dayanand Menon, Shrimati Leela Damodara Sahu, Shri Santosh Kumar Mishra, Shri Kalraj Samad, Shri Golandaz Mohammedhu- Mishra, Shri Mahendra Mohan Sian A. Mody, Shri Piloo Saring, Shri Leonard Soloman Mohanty, Shri Surendra Sarup Singh, Shri Mohinder Kaur, Shrimati Satchidananda, Shri Mondal, Shri Ahmad Hossain Schamnad, Shri Hamid Ali Moopanar, Shri G. K. Sezhiyan, Shri Era Morarka, Shri B. B. Shahi, Shri Nageshwar Prasad Mukherjee, Shri Pranab Shanti Bhushan, Shri Munusamy, Shri V. P. Sharma, Shri Ajit Kumar Muthu, Dr. (Shrimati) Sathiavani Sharma, Shri Anant Prasad Naidu, Shri N. P. Chengalraya Sharma, Shri Kishan Lai Naik, Shri L. B. Shastri, Shri Bhola Paswan Nanda, Shri Narasingha Prasad Narendra Singh, Shri » Nigam, Shri Ladli Mohan Singh, Shri Bhishma Narain Singh, Shri J. K. P. N Oza, Shri Ghanshyambhai Singh, Shri Ng. Tompok Pande, Shri Bishambhar Nath Singh, Shrimati Pratibha Parbhu Singh, Shri Singh, Shri Shiva Nandan Parikh, Prof. Bamlal Sinha, Dr. Bamkripal Patel, Shri Manubhai Sisodia, Shri Sawaisingh Patil, Shri Deorao Soni, Shrimati Ambika Pattanayak, Shri Bhabani Charan Sujan Singh, Shri Pradhan, Shri Patitpaban Prasad, Shri K. Sultan, Shrimati Maimoona L. N. Prem Manohar, Shri Bai, Shri Kalp Smltan Singh, Shri Nath Bajinder Kaur, Shrimati Baju, Shri Surendra Mohan, Shri ' V. B. Bamamurti, Shri P. Rameshwar Totu, Shri Gian Chand Tripathi, Shri Singh, Shri Banga, Prof. N. G. Rao, Shri Kamlapati Vaishampayen, Shri S. K. V. C. Kesava Batan Kumari, Shrimati Varma, Shri Bhagwati Charan Varma, Shri Mahadeo Prasad Venigalla Satyanarayana, Shri Venka, Shri V. Venkatrao, Shri Chadalavada ! Warjri, Shri Alexander 141 , Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 142

Yadav, Shri Ramanand Yadav, 16. "That at page 3, for clause 8, the Shri Shyam Lai following clause be substituted, namely: —

NOES—14 '8. in Article 310 of the Constitution for the words and figures "article 14, article Bhattacharjee, Shri Sourendra Bhola 19 or article 31", the words and figures Prasad, Shri Chakraborty, Shri Amarprosad "article 14 or article 19" shall be substi- tuted.' Deb Burman, Shri Bir Chandra Kumaran, Shri S. Kunjachen, Shri P. K. Lakshmanan, (The amendment also stood in the name of Shri Mulka Govinda Reddy) Shri G. Maran, Shri Murasoli Menon, Shri Viswanatha Mukherjee, Shrimati Kanak SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : Sir, I beg to Pathak, Shri Ananda Raj an, Shri Pattiam move: Shahedullah, Shri Syed Surjeet, Shri 17. "That at page 3, line 8, for the words, Harikishan Singh brackets, letters and figures 'clause (b) or clause (c) of article 39' the words, figures The motion was curried by a majority of the and letters 'articles 38, 39, 39A, 41 42, 43, total membership of the House and by a majority of not less than the two-thirds of the 43A, 44, 45, 46 and 51 of Part IV of the members present and voting. Constitution' be substituted." THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SYED (The amendment also stood in the names of NIZAM-UD-DIN): Now, clauses 4 and 5. Shri Kalyan Roy, Shri Bir Chandra Deb There are no amendments. We shall take up Burman, Shri Bhola Prasad and Shri clause 6. There is one amendment, Lakshmana Maha-patro) amendment No. 14 by Shri Devendra Nath Dwivedi. SHRI V. B. RAJU: Sir, I beg to move: SHRI DEVENDRA NATH DWIVEDI 18. "That at page 3, line 8, for the words (Uttar Pradesh) : Sir, I am not moving. and figures 'in clause (b) or clause (c) of THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI article 39' the words, figures and letters 'in SYED NIZAM-UD-DIN>: There are no article 38, 39, 39A, 41, 42, 43, 43A, 45 and amendments. We shall take up clause 8. 46, be substituted." Clause 8—Amendment of article 31C. The questions were proposed. SHRI VITHAL GADGIL (Maharashtra) : SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: Sir, I am not Sir, I beg to move: moving my amendment, amendment No. 19. 15. "That at page 3, clause 8 be deleted." SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Sir, I beg to (The amendment also stood in ths names of move : Shri Pranab Mukherjee, Shri A. R. Antulay 28. "That at page 3, lines 12 to 15 and Shri Shyam Lai Yadav.) be deleted." (The amendment also stood in the names of Shri Kalyan Roy, Shri Bir Chandra Deb Burman, Shri Bhola Prasad and Shri Lakshmana Mahapatro).

SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA RED- Sir, this is one of the amendments on DY: Sir, I beg to move : which we propose to press for divi- 143 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 144

145 , Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 146

Kalaniya, Shrl>r

Bhagubara Makwana, Shri Yogendra Manhar, Shri Bhagatram Maurya, Shri Buddha Priya Mehrotra, Shri Prakash Mehta, Shri Om Mishra, Shri Mahendra Mohan Moopanar, Shri G. K. Mukherjee, Shri Pranab Naik, Shri L. R. Pande, Shri Bishambhar Nath Patil, Shri Deorao Rai, Shri Kalp Nath Raju, Shri V. B. Ranga, Prof. N. G. Rao, Shri V. C. Kesava Ratan Kumari, Shrimati Reddy, Shri K. V. Raghunatha Roshan Lai, Shri Roy, Shri Kalyan Satchidananda, Shri Sharma, Shri Anant Prasad Sharma, Shri Kishan Lai Sharma, Shri Yogendra Singh, Shri Bhishma Narain Singh, Shrimati Pratibha Sinha, Shri Indradeep Sisodia, Shri Sawaisingh Sultan, Shrimati Maimoona Sultan Singh, Shri Totu, Shri Gian Chand 147 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 148

Tripathi, Shri Kamlapati Venkatrao, Krishnan, Shri E. R. Shri Chadalavada # Yadav, Shri Krishnan, Shri U. R. Ramanand Kunjachen, Shri P. K. NOES—111 Lakhan Singh, Shri Advani, Shri Lai K. Lakshmanan, Shri G. Amarjit Kaur, Shrimati Lotha, Shri Khyomo Anandam, Shri M. Madhavan, Shri K. K. Asthana, Shri K. B. Mahanti, Shri Bhairab Chandra Bagaitkar, Shri Sadasiv Mahavir, Dr. Bhai Baleshwar Dayal, Shri Majhi, Shri Dhaneswar Balram Das, Shri [ Mallick, Shri Harekrushna Banerjee, Shri Jaharlal Maran, Shri Murasoli Barman, Shri Prasenjit Mathur, Shri Jagdish Prasad Bhabhda, Shri Harishankar Menon, Shrimati Leela Damodara Bhagat, Shri Ganapat Hiralal Menon, Shri Viswanatha Bhandari, Shri Sunder Singh Mishra, Shri Kalraj Bhattacharjee, Prof. Sourendra Mody, Shri Piloo Bhattacharya, Shri G. C. Mohanty, Shri Surendra Bose, Shrimati Pratima Mohinder Kaur, Shrimati Chakraborty, Shri Amarprosad Mondal, Shri Ahmad Hossain Chatterjee, Shri Pranab Morarka, Shri R. R. Chaurasia, Shri Shivdayal Singh Mukherjee, Shrimati Kanak Das, Shri Bipinpal Munusamy, Shri V. P. Deshmukh, Shri Bapuraoji Marotraoji Muthu, Dr. (Shrimati) Sathiavani Dinesh Singh, Shri Naidu, Shri N. P. Chengalraya Dwivedi, Shri Devendra Nath Nanda, Shri Narasingha Prasad Gupta, Shri Gurudev Narendra Singh, Shri Gupta, Shri Ram Lakhan Prasad Nigam, Shri Ladli Mohan Hegde, Shri Ramakrishna Nizam-ud-Din, Shri Syed Imam, Shrimati Aziza Oza, Shri Ghanshyambhai Jagbir Singh, Shri Parbhu Singh, Shri Jamuna Devi, Shrimati Parikh, Prof. Ramlal Jha, Shri Shiva Chandra Patel, Shri Manubhai Joshi, Shri Jagannath Rao Pathak, Shri Ananda Joshi, Shri Jagdish Pattanayak, Shri Bhabani Charan Kadershah, Shri M. Poddar, Shri R. K. Kakati, Shri Robin Pradhan, Shri Patitpaban Kameshwar Singh, Shri Prasad, Shri K. L. N. Khan, Shri Ghayoor Ali Khan, Prof. Rasheeduddin Prem Manohar, Shri Khan, Shrimati Ushi Qasim, Sayyed Mir Khobragade, Shri Bhaurao Devaji Raj an, Shri Pattiam Krishna, Shri M. R. Rajinder Kaur, Shrimati 149 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 150

Ramamurti, Shri P. THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SHYAM LAL YADAV): Amendment No. 19 has not Ray, Shri Rabi been moved. So we shall take up amendment Reddy, Shri B. Satyanarayan No. 20 by Shri Bhupesh Gupta. Reddy, Shri Mulka Govinda Reddy, Shri R. Narasimha SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I would like to Sahaya, Shri Dayanand withdraw my amendment. Sahu, Shri Santosh Kumar The amendment i(No. 20) was, by leave, Samad, Shri Golandaz Mohammed- withdrawn. busian A. Saring, Shri Leonard Soloman Sarup Singh, Shri THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SHYAM Schamnad, Shri Hamid Ali Sezhiyan, LAL YADAV): I will now put clause 8 to Shri Era Shahedullah, Shri Syed vote. Shahi, shri Nageshwar Prasad Shanti Bhushan, Shri Sharma, Shri Ajit The question is: Kumar Shastri, Shri Bhola Paswan "That clause 8 stand part of the Bill." Siddhu, Dr. M. M. S. Singh, Shri J. K. P. N. Singh, Shri Ng. Tompok Singh, The House divided. Shri Shiva Nandan Sinha, Dr. THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SHYAM Ramkripal Soni, Shrimati Ambika LAL YADAV): Ayes—116; Noes—68

Sujan Singh, Shri Surendra Mohan, Shri Surjeet, Shri Harkishan Singh AYES—116 Varma, Shri Bhagwati Charan Varma, Advani, Shri Lai K. Shri Mahadeo Prasad Venigalla Satyanarayana, Shri Venka, Shri V. Amarjit Kaur, Shrimati Warjri, Shri Alexander The motion Anandam, Shri M. was negatived. Asthana, Shri K. B. Bagaitkar, Shri Sadasiv THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SHY AM LAL YADAV): We shall now take up Baleshwar Dayal, Shri amendment No. 18 by Shri V. B. Raju: Balram Das, Shri SHRI V. B. RAJU: Sir, it is the game Barman, Shri Prasenjit amendment and it will have the same fate. So Bhabhda, Shri Harishanker I would like to withdraw my amendment. Bhagat, Shri Ganapat Hiralal Bbandari, Shri The amendment * (No. 18) was, by leave, Sunder Singh Bhattacharjee, Prof. withdrawn. Sourendra Bhattacharya, Shri G. C. Bose, Shrimati Pratima Chakraborty, Shri Amarprosad Chatterjee, Shri Pranab Chattopadhyaya, Prof. D. P. Chaurasia, Shri Shivdayal Singh

*For the text of the amendment vide col. 142 supra. *For the text of the amendment vide col. 142 supra. I5i Constitution (Forty-ftth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 152

Das, Shri Bipinpal Morarka, Shri R. R. Deshmukh, Shri Bapuraoji Marotraoji Mukherjee, Shrimati Kanak Dinesh Singh, Shri Munusamy. Shri V. P. Dutt, Dr. V. P. Muthu, Dr. (Shrimati) Sathiavani Dwivedi, Shri Devendra Nath Naidu, Shri N. P. Chengalraya Goswami, Shri Dinesh Nanda, Shri Narasingha Prasad Gupta, Shri Gurudev Narendra Singh, Shri Gupta, Shri Ram Lakhan Prasad Nigam, Shri Ladli Mohan Hegde, Shri Ramakrishna Nizam-ud-Din, Shri Syed Imam, Shrimati Aziza Oza, Shri Ghanshyambhai Jagbir Singh, Shri Parbhu Singh, Shri Jamuna Devi, Shrimati Parikh, Prof. Ramlal Janardhanam, Shri A. P. Patel, Shri Manubhai Jha, Shri Shiva Chandra Pathak, Shri Ananda Joshi, Shri Jagannath Rao Pattanayak, Shri Bhabani Charan Joshi, Shri Jagdish Poddar, Shri R. K. Kadershah, Shri M. Pradhan, Shri Patitpaban Prasad, Shri K. L. N. Kakatii Shri Robin Kameshwar Singh, Shri Prem Manohar, Shri Khan, Shri Ghayoor Ali Rajan, Shri Pattiam Khan, Shrimati Ushi Rajinder Kaur, Shrimati Khobragade, Shri Bhaurao Devaji Raju, Shri V. B. Krishna, Shri M. R. Ramamurti, Shri P. Krishnan, Shri E. R. Ray, Shri Rabi Krishnan, Shri U. R. Razack, Shrimati Noorjehjn Kunjachen, Shri P. K. Reddy, Shri B. Satyanarayan Reddy, Shri K. V. Raghunatha Lakhan Singh, Shri Lakshmanan, Shri G. Reddy, Shri Mulka Govinda Lotha, Shri Khyomo Madhavan, Shri K. Reddy, Shr; R. Narasimha K. Mahanti, Shri Bhairab Chandra Sahaya, Shri Dayanand Mahavir, Dr. Bhai Majhi, Shri Dhaneswar Sahu, Shri Santosh Kumar Mallick, Shri Harekrushna Maran, Shri Murasoli Mathur, Shri Jagdish Prasad Samad, Shri Golandaz Mohammed- husian A. Saring, Shri Leonard Menon, Shrimati Leela Damodara Menon, Soloman Sarup Singh, Dr. Schamnad, Shri Shri Viswanatha Mishra, Shri Kalraj Hamid Ali Sezhiyan, Shri Era Mody, Shri Piloo Mohanty, Shri Surendra Shahedullah, Shri Syed Shahi, Shri Mohinder Kaur, Shrimati Mondal, Shri Nageshwar Prasad Shanti Bhushan, Shri Ahmad Hossain Sharma, Shri A jit Kumar Shastri, Shri Bhola Paswan Siddhu, Dr. M. M. S. ! Singh, Shri J. K. P. N. 153 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 154

155 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 156 SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Sir, a other way, to secure remunerative price for consequential amendment would be needed of each major agricultural produce having regard a routine nature. May I move that to, inter alia, , the cost of production consequential amendment at the appropriate including minimum wages to be paid to the time? agricultural labourers under any law.' " THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SHYAM SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE: Sir, I LAL YADAV): Yes. We now move to clause move; 9. 25. "That at page 3, lines 22—23, after Clause 9 (Amendment of article 38) the words 'engaged in different vocations' SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA REDDY: the words 'and no law passed by Parliament Sir, I move; or a State Legislature to give effect to the said objective shall be called in question in 21. "That at page 3, for lines 19 to 23, the any court of law' be inserted." following be substituted, namely; — (The amendment also stood in the names of '(2) The State shall, in particular strive to Shri A. R. Antulay and Shri Kalp Nath Rai). minimise and eliminate the inequalities in wealth, income and control over means of The questions were proposed. production and distribution, status, facilities and opportunities, not only amongst SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA REDDY: In individuals but also amongst groups of article 38, the clause that is proposed by the persons residing in areas or engaged in Government is: different profession, trade or business, for "'The State shall, in particular, strive to bringing in socialistic economic order."' minimise the inequalities in income, and (The amendment also stood in the name of endeavour to eliminate inequalities in Shri Mulka Govinda Reddy) status, facilities and opportunities, not only SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Sir, I move,- amongst individuals but also amongst groups of people residing in different areas 22. "That at page 3, line 19, the words or engaged in different vocations." 'strive to' be deleted." As the Directive Principles of the 23. "That at page 3, lines 21—23, the Constitution, the wording of this clause words 'not only amongst individuals but appears to be a kind of a pious wish. I have also amongst groups of people residing in moved an amendment which seeks to different areas or engaged in different substitute this clause. I have suggested a vocations' be deleted." comprehensive amendment; (The amendment Nos. 22 and 23 also stood "The State shall, in particular, strive to in the names of Sarvashri Kalyan Roy, Bir Chandra Deb Burman, Bhola Prasad and minimise and eliminate the inequalities in Lakshmana Maha-patro.) wealth, income and control over means of production.." SHRI DEORAO PATIL (Maharashtra) : Sir, I move: Without the fetter of controlling the means of production it is a pious wish that they will be 24. "That at page 3, after line 23, the able to remove inequalities of income. And following be inserted, namely: — mere control of production will not do. There has to be control over distribution and wealth '(3) The State shall take steps, by and income. Therefore, I have suggested this suitable legislation or in any amendment 157 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 158 in order to make the amendment suggested by SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE: the Government more comprehensive, more (Interruptions) That will come later on. meaningful, more purposeful and more practical. That is why we have suggested this amendment. 1 think if the Government is very SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Well, so far as serious and they will be able to accept our amendments are concerned, they are this amendment. written. So no speech is called for.

[Mr. Chairman in the Chair]

SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I do not wish to read what is written there, which is self- explanatory. I want to improve upon it. Only two points I should like to make in regard to this clause, relating to the amendment. First of all, I want to make, it absolutely clear that 38. "The State to secure a Social we want the President to be bound absolutely order for the promotion of the and unconditionally by the advice of the people ...... " Council of Ministers.

AN HON. MEMBER; Not this.

SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: If we go beyond that, the President may create some lobby in Parliament, as has happened in other countries, like the King's lobby.

AN HON. MEMBER: You are on some other amendment. "That at page 3, after line 23, the SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: As far as our following be inserted, namely: — amendment is concerned, it is self- explanatory. The "only thing is that Mr. Pranab Mukherjee wants that the advice of '(3) The State shall shall take steps, by the Council of Ministers to the President... suitable legislation or in any other way, to secure remunerative price for each major SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE: That will agricultural produce having regard to, inter come later on. alia, the cost of production including minimum wages to be-paid to the SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I will not have agricultural labourers under any law." a chance to speak. I am speaking on my amendment. I do not know. They have the chance. Here the provision is a good one. 5 P.M. Advice must be of the Council of Ministers, must not be that of the Prime Minister.

SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Which clause?

to the workers forr | I 47 «F Duty of the State to raise the standard of living. 159 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 160

161 Constitution (Forty-ftth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 162

The question is: Arif, Shri Mohammed Usman Bansi 22. "That at page 3, line 19, the Lai, Shri Basavaraj, Shri H. R. Bhagwan words 'strive to' be deleted." Din, Shri Bhim Raj, Shri Bhola Prasad, The -motion, was negatived. Shri MR. CHAIRMAN; The. question is: Chandrasekhar, Shrimati Maragatham Chattopadhyaya, Prof. D. P. 23. "That at page 3, lines 21-23, Deb Burman, Shri Bir Chandra the words 'not only amongst indivi duals' but also amongst, groups of Desai, Shri R. M. people residing in different areas or Dinesh Chandra, Shri Swami engaged in different vocations be Gadgil, Shri Vithal deleted.'' Goswami, Shri Sriman Prafulla The motion was negatived. Gupta, Shri Bhupesh MR. CHAIRMAN: Amendment No. 24. Habibullah, Shrimati Hamida Mr. Deorao Patil, are you pressing it? Jha, Shri Kamalnath SHRI DEORAO PATIL; Yes. Joshi, Shri Krishna Nand Joshi, Shrimati Kumudben MR. CHAIRMAN: Now, before putting it to vote, I would like to bring to the notice of Manishanker Kalaniya, Shri Ibrahim the hon. Members the clauses on which Kamble, Prof. N. M. Kesri, Shri Sitaram separate voting will take place. They are Khan, Shri Khurshed Alam Khan, Shri clauses 9, 11, 12, 14, 35, 38, 39, 43, 44, 45 and 47. Maqsood Ali Khaparde, Shrimati Saroj KumSran, Shri S. Kureel, Shri Piare Lall urf Now, the question is: Piare Lall 24. "That at page 3, after line 23, Talib Lokesh Chandra, Dr. Mahapatro, the following be inserted, namely: Shri Lakshmana Mahida, Shri Harisinh '(3) The State shall take steps, by Bhagubava Makwana Shri Yogendra suitable legislation or in any other way, Manher, Shri Bhagatram Maurya, Shri to secure remunerative price for each Buddha Priya Mehrotra, Shri Prakash major agricultural produce having Mishra, Shri Mahendra Mohan Moopanar, regard to, inter alia, the cost of production including minimum wages to Shri G. K. Mukherjee, Shri Pranab Naik, Shri be paid to the agricultural labourers L. R. under any law'." Pande, Shri Bishambhar Nath Patil, The House divided. Shri Deorao Rai, Shri Kalp Nath Raju, MR. CHAIRMAN: Ayes—67; Noes— Shri V. B. 113.

AYES—67 Adivarekar, Shrimati Sushila Shankar Alva, Shrimati Margaret Amla, Shri Tirath Ram Anjiah, Shri T. Antulay, Shri A. R. 1134 RS—6. 163 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 164

Ranga, Prof. N. G. Rao, Shri V. C Das, Shri Bipinpal Deshmukh, Shri Kesava Ratan Kumari, Shrimati Bapuraoji Marotraoji Reddy, Shri K. V. Raghunatha Dinesh Singh, Shri Dutt, Dr. V. P. Roshan Lai, Shri Dwivedi, Shri Devendra Nath Roy, Shri Kalyan Goswami, Shri Dinesh Satchidananda, Shri Sharma, Shri Anant Prasad Gupta, Shri Gurudev Sharma, Shri Kishan Lai Gupta, Shri Ram Lakhan Prasad Hegde, Shri Ramakrishna Sharma, Shri Yogendra Imam, Shrimati Aziza Singh, Shri Bhishnra Narain Jagbir Singh, Shri Singh, Shrimati Pratibha Jamuna Devi, Shrimati Sinha, Shri Indradeep Janardhanam, Shri A. P. Sisodia, Shri Sawaisingh Jha, Shri Shiva Chandra Sultan, Shrimati Maimoona Joshi, Shri Jagannath Rao Sultan Singh, Shri Joshi, Shri Jagdish Totu, Shri Gian Chand Kadershah, Shri M- Tripathi, Shri Kamlapati Kakati, Shri Robin Venkatrao, Shri Chadalavada Kameshwar Singh Shri Yadav, Shri Ramanand Khan, Shri Ghayoor Ali Yadav, Shri Shyam Lai Khan, Shrimati Ushi Khobragade, Shri Bhaurao Devaji NOES—113 Krishna, Shri M. R. Krishnan, Shri E. R- . Krishnan, Shri U. R. Advani, Shri Lai K. Kunjachen, Shri P. K. Amarjit Kaur, Shrimati Lakhan Singh, Shri Anandam, Shri M. Lakshmanan, Shri G. Asthana, Shri K. B. Lotha, Shri Khyomo Bagaitkar, Shri Sadasiv Madhavan, Shri K K. Baleshwar Dayal Shri Mahanti, Shri Bhairab Chandra Balram Das, Shri Mahavir, Dr. Bhai Banerjee, Shri JaharM Majhi, Shri Dhaneswar Barman, Shri Prasenjit Mallick, Shri Harekrushna Bhabhda, Shri Harishanker Maran, Shri Murasoli Bhagat, Shri Ganapat Hiralal Mathur, Shri Jagdish Prasad Bhandari, Shri Sunder Singh Menon, Shrimati Leela Damodara Bhattacharjee, Prof. Sourendra Menon, Shri Viswanatha Bhattacharya, Shri G. C. Mishra, Shri Kalraj Bose, Shrimati Pratima Mody, Shri Piloo Chakraborty, shri Amarprosad Mohanty, Shri Surendra Chatterjee, Shri Pranab Mohinder Kaur, Shrimati Chaurasia, Shri Shivdayal Singh Mondal, Shri Ahmad Hos^ain 165 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 166

Morarka, Shri R. R. Mukherjee, Singh, Shri Shiva Nandan Sinha, Dr. Shrimati Kanak Munusamy, Shri Ramkripal Soni, Shrimati Ambika Sujan V. P. Muthu, Dr. (Shrimati) Singh, Shri Surendra Mohan, Shri Sathiavani Naidu, Shri N. P. Surjeet, Shri Harkishan Singh Varma, Chengalraya Nanda, Shri Narasingha Shri Bhagwati Charan Varmg, Shri Prasad Narendra Singh, Shri Nigam, Mahadeo Prasad Venigalla Shri Ladli Mohan Nizam-ud-Din, Shri Satyanarayana, Shri Venka, Shri V. Syed Oza, Shri Ghanshyambhai Parbhu Warjri, Shri Alexander Singh, Shri Parikh, Prof. Ramlal Patel, The motion was negatived. Shri Manubhai Patbak, Shri Ananda MR. CHAIRMAN: Are you pressing your Pattanayak, Shri Bhabani Charan amendment No. 25? Foddar, Shri R. K. Pradhan, Shri SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE: I am not Patitpaban Prasad, Shri K. L. N. Prem pressing my amendment. I withdraw it. Manohar, Shri Rajan, Shri Pattiam Amendment* (No. 25) was, by Rajinder Kaur, Shrimati Ramamurti, leave withdrawn. MR. Shri P. CHAIRMAN: The question is: Rameshwar Singh, Shri "That Clause 9 stand part 0t the Bill" Ray, Shri Rabi Razack, Shrimati The House divided. Noorjehan Reddy, Shri B. Satyanarayan Reddy, Shri Mulka Govinda Sahaya, MR. CHAIRMAN: Ayes—181; Noes — Shri Dayanand Sahu, Shri Santosh NIL. Kumar Samad, Shri Golandaz Mohammedhusian A. Saring, Shri AYES—181 Leonard Soloman Sarup Singh, Dr. Sezhiyan, Shri Era Shahedullah, Shri Adivarekar, Shrimati Sushila Shankar Syed Shahi, Shri Nageshwar Prasad Advani, Shri Lai K. Shanti Bhushan, Shri Sharma, Shri Ajit Alva, Shrimati Margaret Kumar Shastri, Shri Bhola Paswan Amarjit Kaur, Shrimati Siddhu, Dr. M. M. S. Singh, Shri J. K. Amla, Shri Tirath Ram P. N. Singh. Shri Ns. Tompok Anandam, Shri M. Anjiah, Shri T. Antulay, Shri A. R. Arif, Shri Mohammed Usman Asthana, Shri K. B. Bagaitkar, Shri Sadasiv Baleshwar Dayal, Shri

*For the text of the Amendment vide cols 156 supra 167 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 168

Balram Das, Shri Joshi, Shri Jagdish Joshi, Shri Krishna Banerjee, Shri B. N. Nand Kakati, Shri Robin Kalaniya, Shri Banerjee, Shri Jaharlal Ibrahim Kamble, Prof. N. M. Kameshwar Bansi Lai, Shri Singh, Shri Kesri, Shri Sitaram Khan, Barman, Shri Prasenjit Shri Ghayoor AH Khan, Shri Khurshed Basavaraj, Shri H. R. Alam< Khan, Shri Maqsood Ali Khan, Bhabhda, Shri Harishanker Prof. Rasheeduddin Khan, Shrimati Ushi Bhagat, Shri Ganpat Hiralal -Khaparde, Shrimati Saroj Khobragade, Bhagwan Din, Shri Shri Bhaurao Devaft Krishna, Shri M. R. Bhandari, Shri Sunder Singh Krishnan, Shri E. R. Knshnan, Shri U. R. Bhattacharjee, Prof. Sourendra XT OU •

Bose, Shrimati Pratima Lakhan Singh, Shri Chakraborty, Shri Amarprosad Lakshmanan, Shri G. Chandrasekhar, Shrimati Maragatham Lokesh Chandra, Dr. Chatterjee, Shri Pranab Lotha, Shri Khyomo Chattopadhyaya, Prof. D. P. Madhavan, Shri K. K. Chaurasia, Shri Shivdayal Singh Mahanti, Shri Bhairab Chandra Das, Shri Bipinpal Mhapatro, Shri Lakshmana Deb Burman, Shri Bir Chandra Mahavir, Dr. Bhai Desai, Shri R. M. Mahida, Shri Harisinh Bhagubava Majhi, Deshmukh, Shri Bapuraoji Marotraoji Shri Dhaneswar Makwana, Shri Dinesh Chandra, Shri Swami Yogendra Malick, Shri Harekrushna Dinesh Singh, Shri Manher, Shri Bhagatram Maran, Shri Dutt, Dr. V. P. Murasolj Mathur, Shri Jagdish Prasad Dwivedi, Shri Devendra Nath Maurya, Shri Buddha Priya Mehrotra, Gadgil, Shri Vithal Shri Prakash Menon. Shrimati Leela Goswami, Shri Dinesh Damodara Menon, Shri Viawanatha Goswami, Shri Sriman Prafulla Mishra, Shri Kalraj Mishra, Shri Gupta, Shri Bhupesh Mahendra Mohan Mody, Shri Piloo Gupta, Shri Gurudev Gupta, Shri Ram Lakhan Prasad Habibullah, Shrimati Hamida Hegde, Shri Ramakrishna Imam, Shrimati Aziza Jagbir Smgh, Shri Jamuna Devi, Shrimati Janardhanam, Shri A. P. Jha, Shri Kamalnath Jha, Shri Shiva Chandra Joshi, Shri Jagannath Rao 169 Constitution (.Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 170

Mohanty, Shri Surendra Mohinder Kaur, Sahaya, Shri Dayanand Sahu, Shri Santosh Shrimati Mondal, Shri Ahmad Hossain Kumar Samad, Shri Golandaz Mohammedhu- Moopanar, Shri G. K. Morarka, Shri R. sian A. R. Mukherjee, Shrimati Kanak Saring, Shri Leonard Soloman Sarup Mukherjee, Shri Pranab Munuswamy, Singh, Dr. Satchidananda, Shri Sezhiyan, Shri V. P. Muthu, Dr. (Shrimati) Shri Era Shahedullah, Shri Syed Shahi, Sathiavani Naidu, Shri N. P. Chengalraya Shri Nageshwar Prasad Shanti Bhushan, Naik, Shri L. R. Nanda, Shri Narasingha Shri Sharma, Shri Ajit Kumar Sharma, Prasad Narendra Singh, Shri Nigam, Shri Shri Anant Prasad Sharma, Shri Kishan Lai Sharma, Shri Yogendra Shastri, Shri Ladli Mohan Nizam-ud-Din, Shri Syed Oza, Shri Ghanshyambhai Bhola Paswan Siddhu, Dr. M. M. S. Singh, Shri Bhishma Narai Singh, Shri J. Pande, Shri Bishambhar Nath n K. P. N. Singh, Shri Ng. Tompok Singh, Prabhu Singh, Shri Shrimati Pratibha Singh, Shri Shiva Nanda Parikh, Prof. Ramlal n Sinha, Shri Indradeep Sinha, Dr. Patel, Shri Manubhai Ramkripal Sisodia, Shri Sawaisingh Soni, Pathak, Shri Ananda Shrimati Ambika Sujan Singh, Shri Patil, Shri Deorao Sultan, Shrimati Maimoona Sultan Singh, Pattanayak, Shri B'labani Charan Shri Surendra Mohan, Shri Surjeet, Shri Poddar, Shri R. K. Harkishan Singh Prasad, Shri Patitpaban Prasad, Shri K. L. N. Totu, Shri Gian Chand Tripathi, Prem Manohar, Shri Shri Kamlapati Vaishampayen, Shri S. K. Varma, Shri Bhagwati Charan Rai, Shri Kalp Nath Rajan, Shri Pattiam Varma, Shri Mahadeo Prasad Venigalla, Raju, Shri V. B. Satyanarayana, Shri Venka, Shri V. Ramamurti, Shri P. Venkatrao, Shri Chadalavada Rameshwar Singh, Shri Warjri, Shri Alexander Ranga, Prof. N. G. Yadav, Shri Ramanand Rao, Shri V. C. Kesava Yadav. Shri Shyam Lai Ratan Kumari, Shrimati Say, Shri Rabi NOES—NIL Sazack, Shrimati Noorjehan teddy, Shri B. Satyanarayan teddy, Shri K. V. ' Raghunatha teddy, Shri Mulka Govinda teddy, Shri R. Narasimha toshan Lai, Shri 'oy, Shri Kalyan 171 Constitution (.Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 172

The motion was carried by a majority of the 28. "That at page 4, for lines 3 to 6, the total membership of the House and by a following be substituted, namely: — majority of not less than ttuo-thirds of the 'Provided that where the President Members pre. sent and voting. considers that the advice goes against the Clause 9 was added to the Bill. provisions of this Constitution, he shall give his reasons in writing and may MR. CHAIRMAN: Clause 10. There are no require the Council of Ministers to recon- amendments. sider such advice, either generally or otherwise, within a period 0I five days, Clause 11—Amendment of article 74. and the President shall act in accordance with the advice tendered after such MR. CHAIRMAN: We will now go to the reconsideration'." next clause. There are no amendments to clause 10. So, we will now go to clause 11. (The amendment also stood in the names of There are four amendments. Shri Kalyan Roy, Shri Bir Chandra Deb SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: Sir, I beg to Burman, Shri Bhola Prasad, and Shri move: Lakshmana Maha-patro_)

26. "That at page 4, for clause 11, the The questions were proposed. following clause be substituted, namely: — 'In article 74 of the Constitution,— SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: Sir, I am not moving my amendment No. 29. (a) in clause (1) the following proviso shall be inserted at the Sir, only I was pointing out that there are end, namely: — two amendments in my name, that is, No. 26 and 29 and that I am moving only my "Provided that the President may amendment No. 26 and not No. 29. require the Council of Ministers to (Interruptions). Sir, will you please bring some reconsider uch advice, either generally or s order in the House? So far as this clause is con- otherwise, and the President shall act in cerned, I had raised some points in the First accordance with the advice tendered after Reading of the Bill and the honourable such reconsideration:" Minister has replied to it. I am not repeating (b) in clause (2), after the 'Pre. those points though I am not satisfied with it. sident', the words 'and whether the Now, So far as this amendment is concerned, I President required the Council of would only like to have a clarification from the Ministers to reconsider such ad honourable Minister. My amendment is only vice, either generally or other this: Under clause of article 74, nobody can wise' shall be inserted."' question in a court of law the advice the Council of Minister gave to the President. SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE: Sir, I beg Now, under the amended provision the to move : President has been given a constitutional right 27. "That at page 4, line 3, after the word to refer back matters to the Council of Ministers 'President' the words 'on the advice of the for reconsideration and the Council of Prime Minister' be j inserted." Ministers is constitutionally bound to consider such advice. I would like to know from the (The amendment also stood in the names of hon. Minister, since no amendment has been Shri A. R. Antulay and Shri Kalp Nath Rat) made to clause 2 whether it will be open for a person now to question SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA • Sir, I beg j to movft : 173 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 174 in a court of law about the advice that the it to the discretion of the President. The President might have given to the Council of President may feel that a matter should be Ministers for reconsideration or to complain reconsidered. Actually, a situation may arise that the Council of Ministers did not consider when the Prime Minister and the President do the ad- j vice expressed by the President, a con- not see eye to eye. In that case, he can send stitutional right being provided in terms of back almost every issue for reconsideration at letters of law. Is it desirable that whatever least once. Such a situation may arise. In that advice the President gives the Council of case, a situation will be created in which the Minister for reconsideration should also be Prime Minister would not be able to render any made immune from scrutiny of the court. My service. On the other hand, he enjoys the amendment seeks to remove this lacuna. confidence of the House. He is the Leader of the Council of Ministers. Therefore, in order to avoid such a situation, I have suggested that the SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE:; President and the Prime Minister must act in My amendment is very simple, though Bhupesh complete harmony. Therefore, if the President Babu suggested that it should not be there. The feels that certain matters should be whole Cabinet revolves round the Prime reconsidered by the Council of Ministers, he Minister. The Law Minister was trying to should at least convince the Prime Minister visualise a certain situation in which he made about the necessity of it. That is the purpose of out his point and said that if a situation may my amendment. arise, if the House of the People expresses no confidence, then why should not be the SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : Sir, first of all I President go according to the advice given by make it very clear that I wish that the that Council of Ministers. He is quite clear that Government had not disturbed the existing the President is going to accept that advice. But provision. I think it is a solid principle that the the convention which has been practised in this President shall be guided according to the country and which has been practised in other advice of the Council of Ministers. The matter parliamentary forms of Government have never should have ended there.. Now, they have bee questioned. In England, the practice has n brought in this reconsideration concept, that is been that dissolution has become and is treated to say, that as the prerogative of the Prime Minister. Here a new idea is being injected in. We visualise a the President can send back certain things t0 the scheme where the President will have to go Council of Ministers for reconsideration. Then according to the advice of the Council of my friend, Mr. Pranab Mukherjee, brings in Ministers. The Council of Ministers is something else. I will speik about that later. accountable to Parliament and through First of all, I want the original position to Parliament to the people. They are going to remain. insert a clause where the President has the right t0 send it back t0 the Council of Ministers for its re-consideration. It j is ensured in parliamentary SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE : I have no democracy that the President should not act objection if you go back to the original without the advice of the Council of Ministers. position. He should at least take the Prime Minister into confidence, and if the Prime Minister also feels SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Now, Sir, if you that the matter should be reconsidered by the bring in this concept of the President asking for Council of Ministers, then the Presi- j dent can reconsideration, what happens in some do it, otherwise cannot leave countries will happen here. The President may have his own opinion for a short while Anyhow, the real situation will be that there will be a President lobby over 175 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 176

[Shri Bhupesh Gupta] about him. After all, going through the certain matters. That lobby may not be experience of the emergency and also what is identified in the formal sense. But we know that happening now, Sir, I would say: save us from under similar arrangements what is called 'The the great personality of the Prime Minister and President's Lobby' does operate. The President better go by the collective responsibility. Of disagrees with the Council of Ministers and course, Mr. Pranab Mukherjee, I do not know, I send a matter back to the Council of Ministers. hear, that there is nothing called 'collective Then almost automatically he will try to responsibility'. But our whole thing is based on influence some Members of Parliament and also collective responsibility. So, I say that Mr. some Ministers. This position is not very I Pranab Babu need not press it. I am also not good. So, the original pasition is better. Now, pressing the amendment for vote. I think we Sir, if ycu must have it, then we want to make it have expressed our views. If we win by voice a little binding by saying: vote, we will win. If we lose by voice vote, we lose it. Sir, the original position would have "Provided that where the President been better. But if you do not accept our considers that the advice goes [ against the amendment and if you put this re-consideration provisions of this Consti. j tution, he shall clause for vote, then I will vote against that give his reasons in writing and may require clause. I want the original position. the Council of Ministers to reconsider such advice, either generally or otherwise, within a SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Sir, so far as the period of five days, and the President shall amendment proposed by Shri Pranab act in accordance with the advice tendered Mukherjee is concerned, Shri Bhupesh Gupta after such reconsideration." has already replied to it on my behalf. So, I need not deal with it. So far as his own If you must have this doctrine of re- amendment is concerned, may I say that it is consideration, which in my view is a very introducing this complication, namely that the dangerous doctrine, then I want this kind of President should first apply his mind to the protection. What has our friend, Mr. Pranab question whether the advice goes contrary to Mukherjee, said? He says that if the some provisions of the Constitution and the President sends something for controversy between the Council of Ministers reconsideration, he will consult the Prime and the President would arise as to who is going Minister. It is illogical. The Prime Minister constitutionally, etc.—and that Shri Bhupesh will give the advice and then the Prime Gupta will not press it? He has also made it Minister will also agree to reconsideration. It clear that he wanted to make a speech. From cannot be. It is illogical. After all, the Prime time to time, he must make a speech and, Minister sends matter- to the President. His therefore, I appreciate that idea, and he will not advice has been given. The President does press it. not agree. Then again the Prime Minister comes into the picture. Will the Prime Min- isler say: All right, send it back to me for Sir, so far as Mr. Dinesh Goswami's consideration? In that case, the amendment is concerned, Sir, I appreciate the Prime Minister need not have given that objective behind it. But may I say that that advice. amendment is not necessary because, Sir, the SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE : The purpose of clause 2 of article 74 is that when a President cannot send anything for Government has made an order which is an reconsideration. effective order, then a question arises, and sometimes people want to raise a question as SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA : I know that. to whether the Well, you may talk about the British Prime Minister. I won't talk 177 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 178 rules of business were followed or not, | as to goes against the provisions of this what advice was tendered by the Council of Constitution, he shall give his reasons in Ministers in the legal sense , and whether the writing and may require the Council of order is in accordance with that advice which is Ministers to reconsider such advice, either under the rules of business deemed to be an ad- generally or otherwise, within a period of vice. But that question arises only after the final five days, and the President shall act in order of the Government has been made. So accordance with the advice tendered after long as the stage for reconsideration, etc. is such reconsideration.' " going on, the question of going into that does not arise. Therefore, never such a question can arise before a court of law. It is only after The motion was negatived. reconsideration when the final decision has been made, when the final order has been MR. CHAIRMAN: Now we will go to made, then only the question arises. Therefore, clause 12. There is one amendment (No. 30) that amendment is also not neces. sary. by Shri Pranab Mukherjee. SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE: Sir, I am MR. CHAIRMAN : Now Amendment not moving my amendment No. 30. No. 26. MR. CHAIRMAN: Now clause 13, There SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: Sir, I am not are no amendments. pressing my amendment. I am withdrawing it. Clause 14—Substitution of new article for article 103 The amendments (No. 26) was, by SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE: Sir, I am leave, withdrawn. not moving my amendment No. 31. I SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE: Sir, I am SHRI SHYAM LAL YADAV (Uttar not pressing my amendment No. Pradesh): Sir, T beg to move: 27. I am withdrawing it. 32. "That at page 4 after line 25, the following sub-clause be inserted, namely: The amendments (No. 27) was, by leave withdrawn. '(3) The question as to whether a person, found quilty of corrupt practice at an election to a House of Parliament under MR. CHAIRMAN: Amendment No. any law made by Parliament, shall be 28. Mr. Bhupesh Gupta, are you press disqualified for being chosen as, a Member ing it? of either House of Parliament, or of a House of the Legislature of a State, or as to SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I do not move the period for wfiicH he shall be so amendments which I easily withdraw. disqualified, shall be decided by the Court finding the person guilty of such corrupt THE CHAIRMAN: The question is: practice.'" 28. "That at page 4, for lines 3 to 6, the following be substituted, namely.

'Provided that where the President considers that the advice

fFor the text of the Amendment vide col. 171 supra. 179 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 180

as introduced by the Fortysecond Amendment and the one which was there before, and which is proposed to be re-introduced, is that the President, before the Forty-second Amendment, was bound by the advice of the Election Commission. So far as the matter of disqualification was concerned, virtually the power of taking a decision was with the Elec- tion Commission and not with the Government. But by the Fortysecond Amendment this effective power had been given to the Government. The Election Commission was only to be consulted. The advice or the views of the Election Commission were not to be binding on the Government.

Sir, the hon. Members would appreciate that in a democracy, when Governments are formed by political parties, it would not be right, in matters of disqualification, to have a provision, which would affect either an opposition Member or a Member of the ruling party, which would give the final decision making authority to the Government of the day. Rather the Election Commission, which is an independent authority, constitutional authority, must be given this final effective voice and, therefore, this position is being restored.

MR. CHAIRMAN: Mr. Yadav, will you press for it?

SHRI SHYAM LAL YADAV: Yes, Sir.

MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is: 32. "That at page 4, after line 25, the following sub-clause be inserted, namely: '(3) The question as to whether a person found guilty of corrupt 181 Constitution (.Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 182

practice at an election to a House of tion can be questioned, though on that the Parliament, under any law made by majority did not give any opinion. That is Parliament, shall be disqualified for why an express provision was made in article being chosen as, a Member of either 123(4) to the effect that notwithstanding House of Parliament, or of a House of anything in this Constitution, the satisfaction the Legislature of a State, or as to the of the President mentioned in clause (1) shall period for which he shall be so be final and conclusive and shall not be disqualified, shall be decided by the questioned in any court of law. I would like to Court finding the person guilty of such know from the Law Minister what the view of corrupt practice." the Government was. Is it the Government taking up a position that the President's The motion was negatived. satisfaction can be questioned in a court of law. Or, is it simply because that you feel that MR. CHAIRMAN: Next is clause 15. it is redundant, that you want to delete it? My There are no amendments to it. Then there is submission is that when the minority view of clause 16. There is one amendment by Shri the Supreme Court expressed some doubt, Dinesh Goswami, No. 33. why is it that you want to delete the clause, which was, by way of an abundant caution, Clause 16—Amendment of article 123 introduced in article 123. SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: Sir, I move: 33. 'That at page 4, for clause 16, the The further amendment that I have suggested is that the Presidental questioned in following clause be substituted, namely, a court of law but it satisfaction should '16. In article 123 of the Constitution, for normally be not questioned in a court of law clause 4 the following clause shall be but it should be questioned if one can prove substituted, namely: — that it is an Ordinance as a result of mala fide. We know that during emergency—it was the (4) Notwithstanding anything in this allegation of the opposition, and sometimes Constitution, the satisfaction of the quite rightly, that a number of Ordinances President mentioned in clause (1) shall were promulgated which were promulgated be final and conclusive and shall not be not bona fide but mala fide. Therefore, I have questioned in any court on any ground suggested as a matter of abundant caution that except on the ground of malo-fide.' " Presidential satisfaction cannot be questioned Sir, this amendment is again of a technical in a court of law except on the ground of mala nature. Sir, if the President issues an fide. It is almost giving recognition—if I am Ordinance, his satisfaction cannot be wrong, the Law Minister will correct me—to questioned in a court of law. Now, that was tne minority view which was expressed the position even previously to 42nd earlier. amendment namely, that the satisfaction of the President regarding the promulgation of The question was proposed. and Ordinance could not be questioned in a court of law. But, for the first time, if I am SHRi SHANTI BHUSHAN: I appreciate correct—if I am wrong, the Law Minister will the sentiments behind this amendment correct me—I think in the Bank Nationalisa- moved. But, Sir, the amendment proposed by tion Case the minority judgment of the him is totally unnecessary, if I may say so, Supreme Court expressed some views to the with all respect, because that will have effect effect that the satisfac- on the deletion of clause 183 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 184

[Shri Shanti Bhushan] proceed to 'clause 30. There are two 4. Clause 4 could have prevented the amendments Nos. 35 by Shri Goswami and 36 power being exercised even when it by Shri Dhabe. was found that it was exercised mala fide. So far as the Government is Clause 30—Amendment of article 226. concerned, the Government would not like to affect the power of the court SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: Sir, I move: in a case of provide mala fide but 35. "That at page 7, after line 32, the so far as sitting in judgment over following proviso, be inserted, namely: — the satisfaction of the President in other matters is concerned, it is an 'Provided that if the application is not established law that whenever a disposed of within a period of two weeks power is given based on a condition, for reasons beyond the control of the which is a subjective satisfaction, contesting parties, the stay order will even then the subjective satisfaction continue to be operative, if in the discretion of the Government cannot be replaced of the court such extension is necessary for by subjective satisfaction of the court. ends of justice.' " So the court cannot say that it is bona fide. Therefore, the amendment The question was proposed. is not acceptable. 1 MR. CHAIRMAN: Amendment No. 36 by MR. CHAIRMAN: Mr. Goswami, do Shri Dhabe. He is not here. you press for voting? SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: Yes, Sir. SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: Sir, I have moved amendment No. 35 and I will beg of Mr. MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is: ! 33. Shanti Bhushan to accept this amendment. Sir, "That at page 4, for clause 16, the the present position is—after the amendment of following clause be substituted, namely: — the Law Minister, as suggested, to Article '16. In article 123 of the Constitution, 226—that if a person gets an order of stay in a for clause (4) the following clause shall High Court and if the respondent files an be substituted, namely: — objection to the order of stay and if the applica- 1 tion is not disposed of in 14 days, the stay cder (4) Notwithstanding anything in this gets vacated though the parties may not be at all Constitution, the Satisfaction of the informed. Supposing a tenant gets a stay order President mentioned in clause (1) shall be in the High Court. The landlord flies an final and conclusive and shall not be ques- application for vacation of the stay and within tioned in any court on any ground except 14 days the application does not come up for on the ground of mala-fide.'' hearing for no fault of the tenant, automatically on the 15th day, that stay order will get vacated. The motion was negatived. Mr. Shanti Bhushan, with his experience in the Bar, knows that one can create a situation by MR. CHAIRMAN: Clause 17 to 22. influencing the office so that the applications do There are no amendments. We proceed to not come up for disposal within 14 days and clause 23. There is one amendment No. 34 thus a rich landlord will be always in an by Shri Dinesh Goswami. advantage. I can tell him my personal experience of the High Court where sometimes SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: I am not moving. we had only one judge—

MR. CHAIRMAN: Clauses 24 to 29. I There are no amendments. Now we 185 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 186 because there are so many Benches— and the parties are there. It is only a miscellaneous judge could dispose of only one application in a application, stay application. There is not the day. The result-will be that for no fault of slightest reason why that application cannot litigants, in very many cases, the stay order will be heard and disposed of either in favour of get vacated. That is why I have suggested a very this party or that party within a periodi of two reasonable amendment. The amendment is that if weeks. Two weeks is quite a large period. It the application is not disposed of within a period could have even been shorter. Once the of two weeks for reasons beyond the control of provision is there, there would be no the contesting parties—if the application is not difficulty in passing the order one way or the disposed of because the court did not say so or other. because there are so many petitions and the court could dispose of only two petitions a day—then SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: Sir, I am the stay order will continue to be in operation, if pressing my amendment. in the discretion of the court such extension is necessary for ends of justice. MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is:

I feel, Sir, that the Government should not 35. "That at page 7, after line 32, the stand on prestige because, I think, there will following proviso be inserted, namely:— be lot of complications. I feel, this 'Provided that if the application is disposed amendment should be accepted. of within a period of two weeks for reasons beyond the control of the contesting parties, SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Sir, I am not the stay order will continue to be operative, in a position to accept this amendment for this if in the discretion of the court such reason. The hon. Member referred to my extension is necessary for ends of justice.' " experience °f courts. If he is really prepared to rely on my experience, I would request him to The motion was negatived. withdraw this amendment for this reason. There have been lots of complaints that MR. CHAIRMAN: Now, we will go to the petitioners go and obtain interim orders and next clause. Clauses 31 to 33. There are no thereafter they do not want that, after hearing amendments. We shall now take up clause both the parties, the stay matter should be 34. There are four amendments. Shri V. B. heard. That has been the complaint against the Raju. judiciary and even against the exercise of the writ jurisdiction. Even in this House, voices SHRI V. B. RAJU: Sir, on a point of order. have been heard on this and that is why these Now, clause 34 refers to article 300A. Article administrative tribunals and so on have been 31C is retained as it was. Now, article 31 is suggested. These are the reasons why it has also there. It is bad tactics that the vote of the been proposed. So far as this is concerned, House was not taken first for the deletion of there should be absolutely no practical article 31. Now, not only article 31C is there, difficulty. The petitioner has obtained an but also article 31. consequentially, i do not interim order. He is available. His version is know whether I am clear. (Interruptions) We available. Then, the other party, after serving have rejected the amendment in respect of a copy of the notice of his application for article 31C. Therefore, the original article vacation of the stay order files his version. 31C is there. In article 31C, article 31 is Both the parties are available. The versions mentioned. Article 31 continues. of both the SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: That is why I have given notice of a consequential amendment. 188 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 189

SHRI V. B. RAJU: Now, my question is, is ment, that is to say, clause 8 is rejected, in my amendment relevant or not? If you are clause 8(b) there is a reference to article 31 for deleting article 31 and if you are keeping deletion. Now, suppose, the House does not article 300A, the new article 300A, then, 1 agree for ' the deletion of article 31 there, what have said that this article should be sub- will be the position? stituted in the following manner. What is exactly article 300A? SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: If the House does not agree for the deletion of article 31... "No person shall be deprived of his property save by authority of law." SHRI V. B. RAJU: That has yet to come. The House has not yet agreed for the deletion That is the new article. Then, I have of article 31. added: SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Not so far "No property shall be compul- because it has not been put to vote. sorily acquired or requisitioned save for a public purpose and SHRI V. B. RAJU: When it is not put to save by authority of a law which vote I am not sure whether that will be provides for acquisition or re accepted or not by the House. quisitioning of the property for an amount ____" SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: After the fate of article 31 has been decided, then only the This was there originally. Now, if article question of the consequential amendment 31 is going to continue... will come in. SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Article 31 is not going to continue. Clause 8 which has Clause 34 may be taken up after clause 6 been voted down is in respect of article 31C. has been voted because if that clause is Now, you say that reference to article 31 is adopted only then this clause will be there in article 31C. I have moved a necessary. If clause 6 is defeated, a different consequential amendment. Since clause 8 has situation my arise. been voted down, 1 have given notice of a consequential amendment that clause 7 A should be added to the Bill which will delete SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA REDDY: I the reference to article 31 in article 31C. may submit that by virtue of restoring article (Interruptions) May I explain? Clause 6 deals 31C to its previous position, article 31 is also with the deletion of article 31. This is clause 6 mentioned in the body of article 31C. In other of the Bill. That is yet to be put to vote. Now, words, the Parliament has voted for the if that is put to vote and passed, then, in that restoration of article 31 also indirectly. Therefore, it necessarily follows that unless case, article 31 would not at all be there in tbe Constitution. The discrepancy you have article 31 is removed, it will be of no use to go pointed out is that, although article 31 would to article 300A. If this clause is passed prior to be deleted, reference to it would continue in taking up the clause relating to article 31, it article 31C. I That is the reason why as soon as would lead to a ridiculous position. Suppose clause 8 was defeated I have given a notice of we accept amendment to article 300A, then a consequential amendment. It wil] serve that again it will lead to confusion. Therefore, let purpose, namely, it will delete the reference to us take the clause relating to article 31 so that article 31 and article 31C. this matter may be very clear, Instead of creating any more confusion. SHRI V. B. RAJU: I want to know the legal position when an amend- 189 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 190

SHRI V. B. KAJU: You will kindly excuse 6 P.M. me for a second. In clause 8 whatever has been struck down by the Supreme Court has SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Consideration been put in as 1 an amendment by the of clause 34 can be postponed to after clause Government. Now the House says, retain it. 6 alongwith the other clauses has been What is the consequence? adopted. I have no objection.

SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA REDDY: Clause 35—Omission of Part XlVA The Supreme Court may revise its decision. MR. CHAIRMAN: We will go to the next SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: It will remain clause—clause 35. There are two infructuous. It was merely written there but by amendments. Amendment No. 41 is by Shri the agreement of the previous Government. It Shyam Lai Yadav. He is not here. was struck down by the Supreme Court. Even on behalf of the Government this has been SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Sir, they only stated in Keswananda Bharti's case that we do negative the clause. Therefore, these are not not support the validity of this. That was amendments. struck down on a concession. Yet also, if people want to retain it, let it remain there in MR. CHAIRMAN: But they have a right to golden letters. speak. Shri Shyam Lai Yadav is not here. Then amendment No. 42 is by Shri Pranab SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA REDDY: Mukherjee. At that time the Government itself wanted to remove this. SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE: Sir, I am not speaking on it. MR. CHAIRMAN: Yes, Mr. Gos-wami. MR. CHAIRMAN: Now I will put clause 35 to vote separately, as per request of the SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: Sir, I move toon. Members. my amendment, but it is the same thing, we will take it up along with other clauses. The question is: "That clause 35 stand part of the Bill." MR. CHAIRMAN: It will be put along with other clauses. The House divided. MR. CHAIRMAN: Ayes—94 Noes— 96. SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: After the other clauses have been taken up, this clause AYES—94 can be taken up. Advani, Shri Lai K. Asthana, Shri K. B. SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: Along with Bagaitkar, Shri Sadasiv Baleshwar all the other clauses on the same subject. Dayal, Shri Bhabhda, Shri Harishanker Bhagat, Shri Ganapat Hiralal Bhandari, SHRI NARASINGHA PRASAD NANDA (Orissa): We have also proposed two Shri Sunder Singh Bhattacharjee, Prof. amendments to the same article. The two Sourendra Bhattacharya, Shri G. C. amendments Nos. (37) and (38) should be Bhola Prasad, Shri Chakraborty, Shri taken up later on when clause 6 is voted. Let us first know what is the fate of clause 6. Amarprosad Chatterjee, Shri Pranab 191 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 192

Chaurasia, Shri Shivdayal Singh Parikh, Prof. Ramlal Deb Burman, Shri Bir Chandra Patel, Shri Manubhai Dinesh Singh, Shri Pathak, Shri Ananda Gupta, Shri Ram Lakhan Prasad Pattanayak, Shri Bhabani Charan Hegde, Shri Ramakrishna Poddar, Shri R. K. Jain, Shri Dharamchand Pradhan, Shri Patitpaban Jamuna Devi, Shrimati Prem Manohar, Shri Janardhanam, Shri A. P. Rajan, Shri Pattjam Jha, Shri Shiva Chandra Rajinder Kaur, Shrimati Joshi, Shri Jagannath Rao Ramamurti, Shri P. Joshi, Shri Jagdish Rameshwar Singh, Shri Kadershah, Shri M. Ray, Shri Rabi Kakati, Shri Robin Razack, Shrimati Noorjehan Khan, Shri Ghayoor Ali Reddy, Shri B. Satyanarayan Khobragade, Shri Bhaurao Devaji Reddy, Shri R Narasimha Krishna, Shri M. R. Sahaya, Shri Dayanand Krishnan, Shri E. R. Samad, Shri Golandaz Mohammed- Krishnan, Shri U. R. husian A. Saring, Shri Leonard Kunjachen, Shri P. K. Soloman Sarup Singh, Dr. Schamnad, Shri Lakhan Singh, Shri Hamid AH Sezhiyan, Shri Era Lakshmanan, Shri G. Shahedullah, Shri Syed Shahi, Shri Nageshwar Prasad Shanti Bhushan, Shri Lotha, Shri Khyomo Sharma, Shri Ajit Kumar Siddhu, Dr. M. Mahanti, Shri Bhairab Chandra M. S. Singh, Shri J. K. P. N. Singh, Shri Mahavir, Dr. Bhai Ng. Tompok Singh, Shri Shiva Nandan Majhi, Shri Dhaneswar Sinha, Dr. Ramkripal Sujan Singh, Shri Mallick, Shri Harekrushna Surendra Mohan, Shri Surjeet, Shri Maran, Shri Murasoli Harkishan Singh Swu, Shri Scato Tama, Mathur, Shri Jagdish Prasad Shri Ratan Varma, Shri Bhagwati Charan Menon, Shri Viswanatha Varma, Shri Mahadeo Prasad Venka, Shri Mishra, Shri Kalraj V. Warjrj, Shri Alexander Mody, Shri Piloo

Mohanty, Shri Surendra Mohinder Kaur, NOES-96 Adivarekar, Shrimati Morarka, Shri R. R. Mukherjee, Shrimati Kanak Munusamy, Shri V. P. Shrimati Sushila Shankar Muthu, Dr. (Shrimati) Sathiavani Naidu, Shri N. P. Chengalraya Narendra Singh, Shri Nigam, Shri Ladli Mohan Nizam-ud-Din, Shri Syed Oza, Shri Ghanshyambhai Parbhu Singh, Shri 193 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 194

Alva, Shrimati Margaret Amarjit Khan, Shrimati Ushi Kaur, Shrimati Amla, Shri Tirath Khaparde, Shrimati Saroj Ram Anandam, Shri M. Anjiah, Kumaran, Shri S. Shri T. Antulay, Shri A. R. Arif, Kureel, Shri Piare Lall urj Piare Lall shri Mohammed Usman Balram Talib Lokesh Chandra, Dr. Madhavan, Das, Shri Shri K. K. Mahapatro, Shri Lakshmana Mahida, Shri .Harisinh Bhagubava Banerjee, Shri Jaharlal Makwana, Shri Yogendra Manher, Shri Bansi Lai, Shri Bhagatram Maurya, Shri Buddha Priya Barman, Shri Prasenjit Mehrotra, Shri Prakash Menon, Shrimati Basavaraj, Shri H. R. Leela Damodara Mishra, Shri Mahendra Bhagwan Din, Shri Mohan Mittal, Shri Sat Paul Mondal, Bhim Raj, Shri Shri Ahmad Hossain Moopanar, Shri G. Bose, Shrimati Pratima K. Mukherjee, Shri Pranab Naik, Shri L. Chandrasekhar, Shrimati Maragatham R Chattopadhyaya, Prof. D. P. Nanda, Shri Narasingha Prasad Pande, Chaudhari, Shri N. P. Shri Bishambhar Nath. Patil, Shri Das, Shri Bipinpal Deorao Prasad, Shri K. L. N. Rai, Shri Desai, Shri R. M. Kalp Nath Raju, Shri V. B. Ranga, Prof. Deshmukh, Shri Bapuraoji Marotrao- N. G. Ra-o, Shri V. C. Kesava Ratan ji Dhulap, Shri Krishnarao Narayan Kumari, Shrimati Reddy, Shri K. V. Dinesh Chandra, Shri Swami Dutt, Dr. V. P. Raghunatha Reddy, Shri Mulka Govinda Dwivedi, Shri Devendra Nath Gadgil, Roshan Lai, Shri Roy, Shri Kalyan Sahu, Shri Vithal Goswami, Shri Dinesh Shri Santosh Kumar Saleem, Shri Goswami, Shri Sriman Prafulla Gupta, Mohammad Yunus Satchidananda, Shri Shri Bhupesh Gupta, Shri Gurudev Sharma, Shri Anant Prasad Sharma, Shri Habibullah, Shrimati Hamida Imam, Kishore Lai Sharma, Shri Yogendra Shrimati Aziza Jha, Shri Kamalnath Shastri, Shri Bhola Paswan Joshi, Shri Krishna Nand Singh, Shri Bhishma Narain Singh, Joshi, Shrimati Kumudben Mani- Shrimati Pratjbha Sinha, Shri shankar Indradeep Kalaniya, Shri Ibrahim Sisodia, Shri Swaisingh Kamble, Prof. N. M. Kameshwar Singh, Shri Kesri, Shri Sitaram Khan, Shri Khurshed Alam Khan. Shri Maqsood Ali 1134 R.S.—7 195 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 196

Soni, Shrimati Ambika 47. "That at page 10, for lines 34 to 38, the following be substituted, namely: — Sultan, Shrimati Maimoona (c) clause (4) shall be re-numbered as Sultan Singh, Shri clause (9) and in the clause so Totu, Shri Gian Chand renumbered, the words "or internal disturbance" in both the places where Triloki Singh, Shri they occur shall be omitted'." Tripathi, Shri Kamlapati [The amendments also stood in the names of Vaishampayen, Shri S. K. Shri Kalyan Roy, Shri Bir Chandra Deb Venigalla Satyanarayana, Shri Burman, Shri Bhola Prasad, Shri Lakshmana Mahapatro, Shri P. Ramamurti, Venkatarao, Shri Chadalavada Shri Harkishan Singh Surjeet, Shri Viswanatha Menon, Shrimati Kanak Yadav, Shri Ramanand Mukherjee, Prof. Sourendra Bhatta-charjee. Yadav, Shri Shyam Lai Shri Amarprosad Chakra-barti and Shri Murasoli Maran.] The motion u-as not carried by a majority of the total membership of the House and by a SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA majority of not less than two-thirds of the REDDY; Sir, I move: Members \ present and voting. 44. "That at pages 8 and 9, for lines 31 to 33 and 1 to 8, respectively, the following be SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Since substituted, namely: — clause 35 has not been adopted a '(a) in clause (1),— consequential amendment would be necessary to clause 47. So I am giving (i) the words "or internal disturbance" notice of the consequential amendment to shall be omitted; and be taken into consideration. (ii) the following Explanation shall be inserted at the end, namely:- MR. CHAIRMAN: Now we go over to the next clause. For clauses 36 and 37 there "Explanation.—A Proclamation of are no amendments. So we proceed to Emergency declaring that the security of clause 38. There are eight amendments. India or any Part of the territory thereof is threatened by war or by external Clause 38—Amendment of article 352 aggression may be made before the actual occurrence of war or of any such aggression if the President is satisfied that SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Sir, I move: there is imminent danger thereof" ' " 48. "That at page 10, for lines 34 to 37, 43. "That at pages 8 and 9, for lines 31 the following be substituted, namely:— to 33 and 1 to 8, respectively, the following be substituted, namely: — '(c) clause (4) shall be re-numbered as clause (9) and for the '(a) in clause (1), the words 1 "or internal disturbance" shall be omitted'." 197 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 198

clause as so re-numbered the following SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Sir, this is a shall be substituted namely:— very important clause. This clause relates to the issue of Emergency. My amendment is "(9) The power conferred on the to the effect that there should not be—and President by this Article shall include the shall wot be—any internal Emergency power to issue different Proclamations on under any pretext, not even under the different grounds, being war or external pretext of dealing with 'armed rebellion'. aggression or imminent danger of war or Emergency should only be for dealing with external aggression, whether or not there external aggression, or threat of external is a Proclamation already issued by the aggression. Now, Sir, as you see, we the CPI President under clause (1) and such | group and the CPI(M) group, the Forward Bloc, Proclamation is in operation." ' " RSP, AIADMK and others, have given this SHRI KHURSHED ALAM KHAN amendment. What I would like to point out (Delhi): Sir, 1 move: here, and it should be known, is that I am a little pained and distressed that in the course 45. "That at page 8, lines 32-33, of the discussion with the Prime Minister, after the words 'armed rebellion', we of the Opposition parties, if I remember the words 'or organised mob-violence aright, agreed that there should not be any against a section of society' be inserted." internal Emergency. In fact, when Mr. Morarji 46. "That at page 10, line 33, Desai and the Government came with the sug- after the words 'such resolution' the gestion of keeping alive internal Emergency words 'and at least seven days' under some pretext like 'armed rebellion', there was protest against it from the Opposition notice shall be given to the mem bers to 'attend such session', be in leaders—most of them. Publicly also, serted." several Opposition leaders pertaining to my party and others have spoken against internal SHRI MURASOLI MAR AN: Sir, I move: Emergency in any form. Sir, unfortunately, I am at a loss to understand why 49. "That at page 10, after line there should not be amendment of this type 37, the following be inserted, na from Mr. Kamlapati Tripathi, our dear friend mely:— Bhola Pas-wanji. Well, it is very '(cc) after clause (9) as so renumbered, difficult to understand. the following clause shall be inserted, namely:— AN HON. MEMBER: They are supporting ""(10) A Proclamation issued 1 you. under clause (1) shall be revoked within thirty days after the termination of war or external aggression." ' " SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: You are living I under an illusion. If they do it, I will welcome 50. "That at page 10, after line j it. I still appeal to them to vote for it. Sir, if you keep internal Emergency provision, you 38, the following be inserted name will not have learnt the biggest lesson of the ly:- Emergency because internal Emergency, in '(dd) Notwithstanding anything in whatever form you like, is likely to be the Constitution, the Supreme Court misused. It maintains the spirit and carries alone shall have the jurisdiction to forward under false pretence the internal decide about the validity of a Emergency of 19 months. Sir, we Proclamation issued under clause (1).'"" The questions were proposed 199 Constitution (Forty-fijth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 200

[Shri Bhupesh Gupta] to you. I know that during the emergency you thought that they would say a good bye to were against many of the things. I know, even internal Emergency. Shrimati Indira Gandhi after the emergency you have spoken against hag said that for a thousand of years there the emergency. Am I to bear the sight that you shall not be any internal Emergency I do shall be voting with Shanti Bhushan Ji? I not think our amendment will last up to a thousand years. Certainly, for ten centuries it cannot understand. will not last. Before that, much of the show will be over. We will be living in another world. If Shrimati Indira Gandhi thinks Sir, the national mood is that the internal that internal Emergency would not be there for a thousand years, let us at least emergency provisions- must go. Any situation provide against it for the next fifty years, or at can be dealt with without such a provision in least ten years. At least 10 years? I am a written Constitution. Sir, we say that we surprised, I do not know what our friends fight against Authoritarianism. But how will sitting there, honest friends, smiling and all that, would say. What do they say now? Is you fight it out if you keep the internal it the way of implementing the thousand- emergency provision alive? years-no-internal-emergency pledge? Then who will take them seriously? Well, in the public meetings you will say that there would Now, I come to the last point. I want to be no emergency for a thousand years, and finish very quickly. Our friend says, "armed here, perhaps, you take the side of the rebellion." He gave a theory. Wonderful. Mr. Government. I would request them to Shanti Bhushan says, '"We do not have reconsider. Take a little time to speak to 'internal disturbance', but 'armed rebellion'." your leader. You can telephone your Well, armed rebellion is a vague term. leader, Prime Minister Indira Gandhi. Ex- Anything can be taken advantage of to say that Prime Minister. You see, even now I it is an armed rebellion. We know, in Bengal, committed a mistake by saying, 'Prime in 1948, the charge against the Communist Minister.' I appeal to them, Shrimati Party was that we were organising armed Ambika Soni and other ladies sitting here not to rebellion in the country. We were fighting for back internal emergency. Many of them d0 the peasants and for the workers, and we were not like it. What has happened? What accused of organising armed rebellion. Fan- revolution has taken place somewhere that they tastic lying documents were published by the do not support this amendment? Sir, Ministry of Home Affairs at the Centre. We internal emergency must go. It is an instru- know it. Then he will say, 'no armed rebellion' ment which built authoritarian power. but only when it threatens the security of the Well, I need not say very much. Enough country. 'A sweepers' strike threatens the we have spoken. Only I am intrigued t0 find security of the country. We have seen how the out. ti?at the champions of no emergency for MISA and the Preventive Detention Act have a e thousand years, perhaps will not mCV with been misused by cooking a theory that the a us, for taking it out even for short time. security of the State had been threatened. Well, After al£ after some years many things will there are many people sitting here, who were change. in jail for months and months on the ground t.^at they were threatening the security' of the country.. We know how Now, Sir, I appeal to the Congress friends. Paswan Ji. I would appeal 201 Constitution {Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 202 you will use it. Not only that, there may be the if Internal Emergency was not accepted. But peasants' struggle in certain areas of a village he had negotiations and it does appear that he or something like that against the oPPi'essi°:l has successfully negotiated. I will not, against the Harijans, and you may say that the however, congratulate him. Now, here our armed rebellion has started and that the good friends are sitting. On many things we internal emergency should he put on the whole are voicing our demands together here. This country. Well, Sir, therefore, I say that this Internal Emergency is a challenge to our argument is very much dangerous, and I will conscience. Let the country know that the ask my friends here to say 'no' to it. ' Perhaps majority in the Rajya Sabha has done away they think they will come to power again, with Internal Emergency. Therefore, I am some of them.... appealing to you. You may come to power or may not come to power; I do not know. But SHRI G. LAKSHMANAN (Tamil today life has taught us that we must do away Nadu): And you are there to support them. with Internal Emergency. All of us are for the security of the country, the unity 0f the country SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Please stop and the independence of the country. But for this. They may be thinking of advance that, we do not need Internal Emergency. We booking. But if you do this thing here, well, have seen what Internal Emergency creates. you will be doing something which will Therefore, I do not wish to say very much. I wil negate many of the good things. We have a hope some others l speak on this subject. Our very interesting experience today. On the friends, Mr. Ramamurti—where has he gone? preventive detention clause, the Janata Party He was here. Anyway he will also speak. and the two Congress Parties voted together. On Emergency, perhaps they will vote together. Sir, I am appealing to them, especially the On preventive detention, they have voted to- two major parties in the Opposition. Let it not gether. On President's rule—we want | its be said that the two majority parties in the abolition—I am sure they will vote together. Opposition had it open to them to do away Can you blame us if after that we say that a with Internal Emergency but they threw their third alternative is needed in this country? weight on the side of the Government to You are no alternative to each other. You preserve and maintain Internal Emergency are complementary to each other. This is under some other guise. This is not the position. I would ask my friends, Mr. dismantling the Emergency. To our Marxist Bhola Paswan Shastri and Mr. Kamlapati friends. Mr. Harkishan Singh Surjeet and Tripathi to disabuse our minds of that others, I would say, here is their democracy. apprehension. Well, Sir, today if they will Here is how they defend democracy. vote together like that, the day after they may form a coalition Government also. Well, SHRI HARIKISHAN SINGH SURJEET: I he is smiling because he knows that what I We know. You must know that. am saying is God's own truth. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: For defending SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: I cannot democracy, some other "forces must emerge. help smiling whenever I listen to you or I know there are very good people, look at you. democratically minded, on this side and on that side also. I would appeal to them also: let SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: He can us together vote against the Internal smile. He himself was very much afraid that Internal Emergency would go altogether. Then he thought he would not move the Bill in the House 203 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978' 204 [Shri Bhupesh Gupta] Emergency clause and Party also. It is the economic situation which is responsible for it. If not tackled, it will again make it a red-letter clay in the history of free create such a situation. What is going t0 happen India's Parliament. Thank you. tomorrow? One cannot understand the arguments put forward by the Law Minister. He SHRI HARKISHAN SINGH SUR-JEET: said, somebody from-outside will supply some arms and with that some armed rebellion might Sir, I do not know how after going through be created. In a country like India, if has got any the experience of Emergency, my friends of experience of a revolt and something happening the Janata like that, like an armed rebellion, then, he must Party have brought this amendment know that it is not on the basis of some arms supplied by some secret agency that some with the argument that they have ! changed the disturbance can be created, not in today's world. wording: earlier it was "internal disturbance" It will happen only when you are not able to and now it is "armed rebellion". If they have manage the affairs of the country, if you are not able to tackle the acute economic and social gone into the experience of "internal problem. Then nobody can save you. This is disturbance", they must understand that "the the situation in the country. If the economic words "armed re- , bel'-ion" also can be used in situation goeg on worsening as happening now; the same way the words "internal disturbance" then no Emergency can stop it. That is whr I say, after having gone through the experience of were used. What was the "internal disturbance" Emergency, the worst part of what the Janata in the country? Railway j strike, JP movement, Government has brought forward here is that people rising in defence of their interests; that they are asking us to give our sanction in the name of an armed rebellion. Tomorrow they was called an internal disturbance. And to will say, some ten people in the forests of Bihar protect their own rule the whole Emergency are creating some trouble, they have got arms in was imposed. Many of them had to go to their hands, so a disturbance has occurred, or if prison. We are used to it. We don't bother about some tenants are defending their land against the attacks of the landlords, they will say, it is it. Therefore, we know why it is being brought an armed rebellion. Now, who will judge it? again; it is being brought mainly for us. That is Who is to say what it is? It is the Government in why both of them are voting together . .. power, it is the party in power which becomes the judge to say, now there is an armed rebellion SHRI HARISINH BHAGUBAVA as they had done earlier that an internal MAHIDA: Are you-'going to create disturbance was created. I would, therefore, request the Law Minister even at this stage to disturbances again? withdraw this Clause and accept our amendment. I would also ask those SHRI HARIKISHAN SINGH SUR-JEET: Congressmen who, like us, also suffered under No. But they created it. the policies pursued the Emergency—we know how the Emergency by the Congress thepolicies pursued by the affected their internal party functioning, Congress Government. So. to suppress the democratic functioning of that party, how they working class movement, that measure was suffered under one person rule; they brought. It is a chronic situation in the country which Is not being tackled by the Janata

205 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 206 were all affected—I would appeal to them not against the State in the Indian Penal Code for to vote for this provision so that this country which many of our friends sitting here had been detained, imprisoned and punished. has not to say again that this power is being Similarly, armed rebellion can be interpreted used like earlier. to mean any offence covered under the Arms Act. This is the most dangerous thing that the Janata Government has thought of. I would SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA RED-DY: appeal to the conscience of the Janata Party Having gone through a gruesome experience members who had suffered during the of the Emergency, having got some personal emergency, and who had come out with the knowledge of how Emergency provisions have election manifesto that they would liberate been implemented, I consider it my duty to India from any emergency provision and to the oppose Emergency in whatever form it might people of India who voted them to power with appear in the Constitution. I have seen the the hope that the emergency provision would agony of my DMK friends who had been be done away with for all time to come and I arrested during the period of Emergency appeal to their conscience and good sense to without any rule or rhyme or cause. I have also think seriously about it. Please do not think for seen many distinguished leaders being taken a moment that you are going to remain in away, including members of the Congress power for all time to come. Those wh0 brought Working Committee, without the knowledge emergency to this country, notwithstanding of the Congress Party or the Council of their pious hopes and assurances, the people of Ministers. This is how the provisions of India did not allow them to continue. After all Emergency were implemented, and to you are going to be in power for a few years detriment of democracy and democratic more—not beyond that. For the purpose of principles. I thought having gone through this imposing emergency again this can be hell, the Janata Party would have realised the misused. It is very easy to say that there is need to remove the emergency provision once armed rebellion because this provision is not and for all from the statute. But unfortunately subject to judicial interpretation at all. Armed they want to replace the words 'internal distur- rebellion is a very imprecise expression even bance' by the expression 'armed rebellion'. It for interpretation. Therefore, as in the case of looks as though they want to replace a milder internal disturbance, armed rebellion can be expression like 'internal disturbance' by a used as a camouflage to declare emergency. wilder expression like 'armed rebellion' so that That is why I appeal to my friends and it might find acceptance among the people. members of the Janata Party who had the Internal disturbance can be easily interpreted experience of the emergency to have second as armed rebellion and armed rebellion can be thoughts on this provision. I apepal to the good easily interpreted ag internal disturbance. For sense of my friends to vote down the that there is no difficulty at all. In fact internal emergency provision. I appeal to Mr. Shanti disturbance can be engineered and equally Bhushan to withdraw this clause so that he will armed rebellion can be engineered by the not give an opportunity to others to restore powers that be if they want to declare an "internal disturbance" again in this country. emergency. Apart from that, even for a judicial determination of the expression 'armed re- SHRI KHURSHED ALAM KHAN: I am bellion', I would submit it is very imprecise sorry that I do not agree with the views like the term 'waging war expressed by the hon. members from the other side because 207 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 208

[Shri Khurshed Alam Khan] strike. Or, unfortunately, there may be a condition in which class struggles may be fanned by certain I have my own say about this matter. The parties endangering the life and property of 1 a change in the amendment proposed by the Government in the original provision is not large section of the people as has been done in free from complications and implications and Marathwada very recently... (Interruptions). It was we have certain doubts about it which we done in Telengana very recently... (Interruptions® have to express before this august House. .. and what will be in Bihar very recently and it was done in West Bengal very recently... ^Interruptions).. .and what will be the remedy in What has happened recently in the case of this sort of a situation? How are you going to Harijan troubles starting from Belchi tackle it? (Interruptions). spreading to Agra, Ma-rathwada and even upto Tamil Nadu. What is this? You had to SHRI G. LAKSHMANAN: Your definition call the army to quell the trouble and bring of internal disturbance is the railway strike? Is peace. Is it armed rebellion or worse than it your idea of internal disturbance? Was the that? Maybe some occasions may arise when railway strike conducted in 1974 an internal there may be an armed rebellion or a situation disturbance? may arise which may be considered as armed (Interruptions) rebellion. SHRI KHURSHED ALAM KHAN: I am not saying about the railway strike. But you But there may be certain situations which may remember that in certain parts of the may be very disastrous and very damaging for country trains were available and in certain certain communities, particularly the minority other parts trains were not available and the communities, and also the weaker^ sections of trains could not go from one part of the society and then it may not be possible for country to the other and you were not able to them to really face that kind of situation. go from one part of the country to another Therefore, I very earnestly appeal to the Gov- part. If thjj people have the right to strikeL I ernment and to all the Members that this have nothing to say. But should be retained. I am not in favour of any internal emergency or anything of that sort. one thing I want to tell you and that is thak Surely, we want certain safeguards for the such special situations have to be I kept in security and safety of the weaker sections and view. Now, the question is this; What are you the minorities. Now, Sir, surely, there can be going to do in this sort of a situation which I certain situations which would not or cannot mentioned just now? Unfortunately, be strictly termed as an armed rebellion. But determined and calculated efforts may De the consequences may be as disastrous, as I made for creating widespread communal riots, have said, as the consequences of an armed wide-spread communal trouble. Now, in the rebellion or anything of that sort. For instance, country, what are you seeing? How are ypu there may be a situation when certain persons going to put them down? Are ybu not going to may be determined to paralyse the administra- put down such troubles, this sort of tive set-up of the country in order to jeneate atmosphere and this sirt of a condition in the chaos and qjonfusion as was done by some country? And, if you allow this, will it not b4 people in May 1974 when they had threatened disastrous for the whole nation? What to completely paralyse the Government as a happens in the eastern part of the country result of a threatened railway now? What is happening there? It may not be te- 209 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 210 chnically an armed rebellion. But the. situation is why, Sir, I once again request the is almost the same which is not really very honourable Law Minister and also the Janata tolerable. So, my appeal to you is this: I have Party Members to reconsider the situation and nothing to !>ay against the strike and I have to reconsider position. Again. I have given an nothing to say in favour of internal security. amend the situation and to reconsider their But I have only to say that we want safeguards position. Again, I have given an amendment, and we want the security to life and property Amendment No. 49. Thsre should be some for ourselves and that is the amendment of time-limit even if the emergency is declared mine which seeks to make this necessary for the purposed of war or external provision for meeting such a situation as I aggression. What happened when the first have -mentioned above. emergency was declared in 1962; it was removed in 1968 alone For six years it con- tinued. The second emergency was declared SHRI MURASOLI MARAN: Sir, after in 1971; it continued up to 1077. So, during the eloquent appeal of Mr. Raghunatha 28 years of our Republic, 12 years' period we Reddy, I do not have much to say and I do went through emergency. That is why I say not have many words to convince the that there should be some kind of time-limit honourable Minister and the Janata Party even if there is an emergency on account of Members. We are totally against any %var or external aggression. Sir, he has pro- kind of internal emergency. The honourable vided certain definite safeguards. They are Minister has said that the Constitutional not enough. That is why I have given another amendments are made because of certain amendment that declaration of emergency compulsions and circumstances and should be justiciable in the Supreme Court. In experiences. But, Sir, what is our the United States this is the situation. I would experience? We have gone through the request the hon. Minister to consider my darkest period in history. So, even after amendment. that, the Janata Party comes forward to .substitute the words "armed rebellion" for "internal distrubance" and it is very vague SHRI SOURENDRA BHATTA- also. Sir, I want to say only one thing: CHARJEE; I would request the Law Minister Even if the words "armed rebellion" were to consider whether by this amendment he not there in the original Constitution, we would not deny in a way the very existence, could have had the emergency. For ex- the very basis of existence, of Janata Party, ample, Sir, at that time, Shri Jaya-prakash which was born out of emergency. It is a pity Naryan was telling that the police and the army that the Janata Government had to bring should not obey any illegal order. Sir, it forward this amendment as a concession to could have been construed as a threat of these who were responsible for imposing this army rebellion and the emergency could internal emergency. If they were unable to have been declared. That is why I say that a amend it, perhaps that would have been a lot of abuse is possible. If the Government better situation. We have gone through the commands a majority and a two-thirds worst type of emeregncy for 19 months. The majority in the Rajya Sabha and also in Law Minister should have noted it. This should the Lok Sabha, they can declare the emer- be an eye-opener to the Janata Party. Please gency. Then, Sir, after declaring the look to the dangerous potentiality of this clause. The list that he has given emergency, with the use of money power very clearly indicates that it would b» used and with the use of the police and the army, against the working class the referendum provision also can be manipulated. That 211 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYASABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 212

[Shri Sourendra Bhattacharjee] SHRI P. RAMAMURTI (Tamil Nadu): Sir, I would like to remind the struggle, against the toiling people. A new Janata Party leaders of the time when the 42nd concept has been brought today. If the Amendment was being consi iered and whe we Government are unable to defend ^the n could not discuss it in the entire country, minorities or the weaker sections in the but ; some low or the other we could ma- absence of internal emergency, that nage to have a convention in Delhi. That Government has no right. So, I appeal that the convention was addressed, among others, Law-Minister should consider this seriously. I by Mr. Charan Singh and Mr. Ashok Mehta. would most earnestly appeal to you and the The convenor was Mr. Krishan Kant. A poem, friends of Mr. Raghu-natha Reddy and those a powerful poem was read in Hindi. It was on the other side too at least now accept that sent by Mr. Vajpayee who now adorns the internal emergency was a wrong thing. the ministerial gaddi. All tiese people They must prove the courage of conviction categorically stated that there shall be no and vote with us in favour of this amendment. emrgency for any reason whatsoever. I want to remind them of the promise that they SHRI AMARPROSAD CHAKRA- made that if they come to powe:- at any BORTY (West Bengal): Sir, if you time, they will delete this provision of internal remember the days of double emergency, you emergency undei any circumstances. That is cannot do so. The Janata Government and its all. They were not in power then. I understand leaders were against it. Now, he has it. You were frank enough. It is clear that introduced this clause in the what was said at that :ime was only for the Constitution (Amendment) 'Bill. This is a consumption of the people. They were not strange thing. The real thing comes from him. in power then. The moment they came This is how they suppress the progressive to pojwar, they said: We are going to movement and this how they suppress the substitute the words 'armed rebel ion' for progressive Government under the garb of the words 'internal distuibance'. So, it is some rebellion or internal disturbance. They clear that on this juestion, the Congress (I) are creating public opinion and they are not and the Janata Party are the birds of the allowing the other affairs to go into the same feather. There is no distinction country. It is a kind of idea. It is the principle whatsoever. The class cha-ractei of these for which we are fighting. We are fighting two people is the same because they continuously. We are thankful and grateful to come from the same class. Mr. Gupta. Mr. Gupta supported the emergency and today they are giving SHJI PILOO MODY: Cultural- their support to us who are against the character. emergency and who have suffered much at the time of emergency. I do not know how this clause comes in this Amendment Bill. It was not expected from the Janata Government SHU P. RAMAMURTI; It is class and we did not expect it from the Law character because they are afraid that if the Minister. Sir, on behalf of my party, on behalf people of this country rise in revolt against of the Forward Block, we strongly object to certain policies, it will always be open to this. This clause should be omitted. We make them to say that this is an armed rebellion to a firm appeal to our friends in this House not put down the people. When Hitler came to to allow this clause to go down on the Statute powerj. he himself created the trouble and Book. Sir, with i these words, I conclude. put it on the communists and became a dictator. Therefore, Sir, it is 213 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 214. not difficult for anybody to wants to i become a dictator to manoeuvre j things. (Interruptions) Therefore, it 5s not at all difficult for any would be dictator to manoeuvre an armed rebellion. If you want it, they can manoeuvre an armed rebellion. The CPI knows it very well. With their suppor^ it will be quite possible to manoeuvre the so-called armed rebellion. After all, an armed rebellion is not a justiciable thing, as he has pointed out. i Anybody can d0 anything. And we also know as a result of the Commissions of Inquiry that have been going on through the whole question of Emergency in 1975, that it was promulgated on the basis of that internal disturbance, and it has been found that no internal disturbance report had come from any State whatsoever or even from the Police establishment. Therefore, who can prevent this kind of a thing? Therefore. I would appeal to the conscience of the Janata people, all those people who had at that time stated in a strident voice that there shall be no internal emergency, to stick to their words and not to betray the trust of the people that they have got.

215 Constitution {Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 216

SHRI KAMESHWAR SINGH (Bihar): Sir, on a point of order.

THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SHV.AM LAL YADAV): What is it?

SHRI KAMESHWAR SINGH: Sir, the ^ok Sabha has adjourned sine die. Ever if we sit here till 2 o'clock in the morning to pass this Bill...

THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (SHRI SHYAM LAL YADAV): This point has been discussed so many times. There is nj point of order. Mr. Mulka Govinda Reddy.

SHRI MULKA. GOVINDA REDDY (Karnataka): Mr. Vice-Chairman, Sir, internal emergency should be opposed after having gone through the nightmare of emergency for 20 months, when important national leaders, like Shri Jayaprakash Narayan and others, were arrested and ill-treated in the jail and even their representatives werei threatened.

[Mr. Chairman in the Chair] I cannot understand how the Janata Government which came into power mainly because they opposed emergency are now proposing this emergency in case of armed rebellion. Whether for reasons of armed rebel- lion or for internal disturbances, this emerjgency should never be imposed. In case of external aggression or war, 217 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 218 everybody in this House will support provision consciousness. They are the representatives for emergency. Sir, after .having gone through of the capitalists and the bourgeois. Sir, the reports of the Shah Commission on the during the Emergency, when i was a member of atrocities that were committed, demolitions that the ruling party, I brought to the notice of the took place, arrests that were made and the Government many Emergency excesses. But treatment meted out to the political leaders, we they did not do anything. Now, Sir, they are all feel ashamed that we were in the Congress introducing this 'armed rebellion'. There Party at that time when this emergency was im- have been many armed rebellions in many posed. We had lost our courage tc oppose these places, many local struggles. But they have illegal provisions of the emergency and persons been subdued a long time ago. There was the like Chawlas, like Dhavans and like Jag Naga trouble. It was subdued. Then, there Mohans took the law into their own hand in was the Mizo trouble. Sir, I suspect there is imposing all sorts of indignities on the Indian a motive, a very bad motive. This 'armed people. Therefore, Sir, after having gone rebellion' reminds us of those days. If you in- through such a period, it is impossible, for any troduce this 'armed rebellion', people will be honest and right-thinking man to support emer- constrained to resort to armed rebellion—they gency provision here again. There are enough will exercise their right—when they find that powers under the law whereby we can tackle there is an unjust order, there is an oppressive Government, there is a dictatorial Government. such of the offences. If there is any armed rebellion, the armed forces are there. With the They will rebel against such a Government. It help of the armed forces, we can put down any is their birth-right to rebel. They will rebel armed rebellion. I do not think there is any against any injustice or against any need for this Emergency provision, whether for Government which oppresses them. They will 'internal disturbances' or for armed rebellion. rebel against a Government which is a capitalist Government. Now, Sir, they were accusing others of being fascists. But they are now SHRI SRIMAN PRAFULLA GOS- behaving like fascists. Not only that. If you WAMI (Assam): Sir, it is shocking to me that are inserting this provision, this will encourage the Janata Government which came to power the people. They will become conscious. They by the ballot box, by non-violent methods and will resort to armed action if necessary. I which pledged to remove internal Emergency warned you about this yesterday. If you are not has now brought this provision with a hypocritical, don't do this. If_you dare and if sugar coating. Instead of 'internal you have the courage, go to the people. disturbances' they say 'armed rebellion'. I Dissolve Parliament and go to the people. Let do not know whether you are going back to the us see whether the people will accept this or old days when the British ruled us. We not. revolted against it. We had a national movement. We revolted against the British imperialists. We had the 1942 movement. Even at that time, the British imperialists did not have such a provision as 'armed rebellion'. There were ample provisions then. They had sedition and other thingc which they could control. Now, Sir, this word armed rebellion' is shocking. By this amendment, they are exposing their class character. They are afraid of class

219 Constitution {Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 220

DR. V. P. DUTT (Nominated): Only one minute, Sir. If the Law Minister permits and if he is willing to hear, I WDuld like to say. some of us have ri i to speak becaus3 our esteemed colleagues, Shri Bhupesh Gupta and Shri Harikishan Singh Surjeet, asked the question as to what our position is on this. I said, well mv esteemed colleague, Mr. Mulka Govinda Rflddy, has already made the posi tion clear. So far as we are con cerned, we are against the retention of any provision for internal emergency. There is no question about it. Our position is clear and categorical on thj|s. The only question was whether certain technical problems compelled Us to vote with the Government or not. That is a different matter. But go far as tthe issue itself is concerned, we are against it. I would like to say to the Law Minister that he teaches law, he practices law, I teach history and noli- tical systems and institutions. When does an armed rebellion take place in a country? When doek an armed rebellian occur in any country in history? I would like to say that it occurs only when the social conditions hav; deteriorated beyond the point of tolerance, when people's sufferings and misseries go beyond the acceptable limits and when there is hunger and starvation in the country and finally—that is most impertant- when the central authority collapses. Thai is when an armed rebellion takes place in any country. Now if theyj are afraid that the central authority \s going to collapse in this country, that they are not even going to be ablejto rule or govern, then perhaps they are right. In fact, what we pre seeing is the process of the collapse of 221 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 222

the central authority and maybe that the will power. You need the will power, not is why they want to have the provision the laws, to meet that kind of a situation. That for internal emergency so that they will power is lacking unfortunately. You have can impose it in order to be able to to have that. Therefore, we appeal, alongwith rule. Otherwise, hon'be Law Minister, other sections of the House, to the hon. Law you have not given any cogent reason Minister to accept this. This is the general for the retention of this provision and feeling here as well as in the country. You you have not mentioned what is the don't need any provision for internal emer- difference between 'internal distur gency. bance' and 'armed uprising'. What is this nice distinction? You are SHRI K. K. MADHAVAN: Sir, it is a very serious subject. It is a matter to be trifled very good at making nice dis with. There is a mistaken notion about the tinctions—like you have made the dis saying that the right to revolt against tinction between 'blast' and 'explosion'. tyranny or oppression is sacred. As a dictum, I do not understand what is this difte it is all right. But let us look at the present rence between 'internal disturbance' day conditions. We are towards the close of and 'armed uprising'. So far no the twenieth century. I think every right cogent reason has come. What you thinking Member of this House should support have said is that you are providing for this amendment because ours is a certain safeguards. That is an entirely democratic State having democratically elected different matter. What we are wyiur people where people are free to work out a is more fundamental. Your present revolution by their willing consent. That is powers are sufficient and abundant. the condition, whatever be the social You have even now sufficient powers atmosphere prevailing in this country. In under the external emergency which is action, ours is a democratic State. Are we there. There ar tremendous e interested in importing revolution? Are we powers being given to the Govern interested in having a revolution by armed ment under external emergency. insurrection or armed rebellion? We are not In fact they can also be misus for that. This country is not for that. The ed. Some slight incident can culture of this country is not for that. This be created on the border and you can amendment seeks to amend this particular say. "there is external aggression" and article by the substitution of a word. In declare external emergency and use article 352, in place of the word "internal all the provisions under the external disturbance" the word "disturbance" is sought emergency. Therefore, it is not as if to be substituted by rebellion". Armed you have not sufficient powers. Even rebellion is a dfferent question. There is under the present laws, you have tre a world of difference between the two mendous powers to control. It is for words because this can be misinterprat-ed in the first time that we are hearing this any manner. argument in this House that for the MR. CHAIRMAN: Please conclude. sake of the protection of the weaker sections we need internal emer SHRI K. K. MADHAVAN: It is precisely gency provisions. I have great this word that this amendment seeks to replace. It reduces the possibility of respect for you. My friend misinterpretation. Therefore, I support the and colleague, Mr. Khurshed amendment and I hope all hon'ble Members will support this amendment. Alam Khan also pointed this out, but I cannot imagine that you need internal emergency for j the protection of the weaker sections. You have plenty of powers available under the laws at present to be able to meet the situation provided there is 223 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 224.

SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Sir, Shri SKRi SHANTI BHUSHAN: On the ques' Bhupesh Gupta is the greatest champion of ion of armed rebellion in the coun:ry he finds Parliamentary democracy that I have ever himself almost in isolation. Of course, he has known. a few friends still left. But I am not surprised because in democracy when peop|e have the SHRI MOHAMMAD YUNUS SA-LEEM freedom to remove the government whom (Andhra Pradesh): How many compliments they io not-like,] they can propagate, they can are you going to pay him today? educate and they can persuade the people to remove that government by ballolt, by their SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: That was also sweet will, as they have shown that in this proved when he wanted that so far as country the people-can Remove the Parliamentary democracy is concerned, not government through peaceful means. They do merely democracy should be preserved and not need any armed rebellion. You can per- protected, even by being included in the suade the people against the government if guarantee of referendum 1 hope Parliament- you do not like it. But please do njot think of ary democracy also includes democracy in armed rebellion. This country does not believe Parliament. Sir, I am sorry for him, and I in armed rebellion. The Government must would like to sympathise with him when have ampje powers to deal with armed re- today I found him so desolate. He is having a bellion feeling that he is being deserted by all his people, either belonging to the right parties or SI|RI BHUPESH GUPTA: Did Mr. Geoige to the left parties. Fernandes not believe in it when he associated himself with the Bare da Dynamite SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: No. no. We are case? a"ll together. (Interruptions) SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: I believe even SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: They are the Mr. Bhupesh Gupta appears to be convinced parties on the right and we are the parties on now. I need not take more time of the House. the left, to the right of Shri Bhupesh Gupta and to the left of Shri Bhupesh Gupta. Sf RI YOGENDRA SHARMA: I had put two or three questions to which; he has not SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Here, Sir, there replied. is emergency to my left and emergency to my right. SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Sir, because there is a complaint that a specific qaestion was put by an hon. Member tend I have not SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Sir, he is feeling deserted and he is looking for friends replied to it, let me ijepry. He referred to the all round. He does not And any friends on the election manifesto. I am glad that he has read right and he does not find any friend on the the election manifesto, but in which language left. he has read it, I do not know. I hape it before me. It clearly shows that two promises were On the question of having an armed made: to lift the Emergency; and to amend rebellion in the country, Sir, I am sorry that article 352 pf the Constitution to prevent its he is not having many supporters. Even, Sir, abusk in the interests of an individual or a in his block the Member who keeps constant group. Therefore; we are carrying (jiut the vigil from behind, Mr. Madhavan, has pledge to its full. We had never said that even demolished all his arguments. on the ground of external aggression, even if there is a threat to the security of India, under SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: He has supported me very valiantly on this question. 225 Constitution {Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 226

10 circumstances, can Emergency be Chattopadhyaya, Prof. D. P. declared. Of course, "internal disturbance" was too weak a thing, but an "armed Chaudhari, Shri N. P. rebellion" can create the same situation Deshmukh, Shri Bapuraoji Marotraoji which "external aggression" :an create. Dutt, Dr. V. P. Dwivedi, Shri Devendra Nath (Interruptions) Goswami, Shri Sriman Prafulla SHRI YOGENDRA SHARMA:And, 3ir, Gupta, Shri Bhupesh my second question was about Mr. George Gupta, Shri Gurudev Fernandes. Imam, Shrimati Aziza

MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is: Kameshwar Singh) Shri 43. "That at pages 8 and 9 for lines 31 to Khan, Shrimati Ushi 33 and 1 to 8, respec-pectively, the Kumaran, Shri S. following be substituted, namely: — Kunjachen, Shri P. K. 'Ca) in clause (1>, the words "or Lakshmanan, Shri G. internal disturbance" shall be omitted.' " Mahapatro> Shri Lakshmana 47. "That at page 10. for lines 34 to 38, Maran. Shri Murasoli the following be substituted, namely: — Menon, Shri Viswanatha '(c) clause (4) shall be re-numbered as Mukherjee, Shrimati Kanak clause (9) and in the clause as so re- Nanda, Shri Narasingha Prasad numbered, the words "or internal disturbance" in both the places where Pathak, Shri Ananda they occur shall be omitted.' " Rajan, Shri Pattiam Raju, Shri V. B. SHRI BHAURAO DEVAJI KHOB- Ramamurti, Shri P. RAGADE; How can you put both simultaneously? Reddy, Shri K. V. Raghunatha Reddy, Shri Mulka Govinda MR. CHAIRMAN: Yes, yes, the Members Roy, Shri Kalyan desired. Saleem, Shri Mohammad Yunus The House divided. Shahedullah, Shri Syed MR. CHAIRMAN; Ayes—41; Noes— Sharma, Shri Yogendra 143 Sinha, Shri Indradeep Soni, Shrimati Ambika AYES—41 Surjeet, Shri Harkishan Singh Triloki Singh, Shri Amarjit Kaur, Shrimati Anandam, Shri Venigalla Satyanarayana. Shri M. Balram Das, Shri Bhattacharjee, Shri Sourendra Bhola Prasad, Shri Bose, Shrimati Pratima Chakraborty, Shri Amarprosad 1134 RS—8. NOES—143 Adivarekar, Shrimati Sushila Shankar Advani, Shri Lai K. Alva, Shrimati Margaret Amla, Shri Tirath Ram Anjiah, Shri T.

Antulay] Shri A. R. 227 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 228

Arif, Shri Mohammed Usman Khan, Shri Maqsood Ali Khaparde, Asthana, Shri K. B. Bagaitkar, Shri Shrimati Saroj Khobragade, Shri Sadasiv Baleshwar Dayal, Shri Bhaurao Devaji Kiishna, Shri M. R. Banerjee, Shri Jaharlal Bansi Lai, Kiishnan, Shri E. R. Kiishnan, Shri U. Shri Barman, Shri Prasenjit R. Basavaraj, Shri H. R. Bhabhda, Kureel, Shri Piare Lall uri Piare Lall Talib Shri Harishar.ker Bhagat, Shri Lfkhan Singh, Shri Ganapat Hiralal Bhagwan Din, Shri Lckesh Chandra, Dr. LcJtha, Shri Bhandari, Shri Sunder Singh Khyomo Madhavan, Shri K. K. Bhattacharya, Shri G. C. Bhim Raj, Mahanti, Shri Bhairab Chandra Shri Mahavir, Dr. Bhai Chandrasekhar, Shrimati Maragatham Mahida. Shri Harisinh Bhagubava Mnjhi, Chatterjee, Shri Pranab Shri Dhaneswar M;:kvvana, Shri Yogendra Chaurasia, Shri Shivdayal Singh Miillick, Shri Harekrushna Manhar, Shri Das, Shri Bipinpal Bhagatram Mathur, Shri Jagdish Prasad Desai, Shri R. M. Maurya, Shri Buddha Priya Mflhrotra, Shri Dinesh Chandra, Shri Swami Prakash Dinesh Singh, Shri Menon, Shrimati Leela Damodara Gadgil, Shri Vithal Mifehra, Shri Kalraj Goswami, Shri Dinesh Miihra, Shri Mahendra Mohan Gupta, Shri Ram Lakhan Prasad Mi:tal, Shri Sat Paul Habibullah, Shrimati Hamida A.'charity, Shri Surendra Hegde, Shri Ramakrishna Mchinder Kaur, Shrimati Jagbir Singh, Shri Mondal, Shri Ahmad Hossain Jain, Shri Dharamchand Mcopanar, Shri G. K. Jamuna Devi, Shrimati Morarka, Shri R. R. Janardhanam, Shri A. P. Mukherjee, Shri Pranab Jha, Shri Kamalnath Munusamy, Shri V. P. J ha, Shri Shiva Chandra Mujthu, Dr. (Shrimati) Sathiavani Joshi, Shri Jagannath Rao Joshi, Shri Jagdish Na du, Shri N. P. Chengalraya Na k, Joshi, Shri Krishna Nand Shri L. R. Narendra Singh, Shri Nigam, Joshi, Shrimati Kumudben Manishar-ker shri Ladli Mohan Nizam-ud-Din, Shri Kadershah, Shri M. Syed Ozck, Shri Ghanshyambhai Kakati, Shri Robin Paitde, Shri Eishambar Nath Paibhu Kalaniya, Shri Ibrahim Singh, Shri Pai'ikh, Prof. Ramlal Kamble, Prof. N. M. Kesri, Shri Sitaram Khan, Shri Ghayoor Ali Khan, shii Khurshed Alam 229 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 230

Patel, Shri Manubhai S'vvu, Shri Scato Patil, Shri Deorao Tama, Shri Ratan Pattanayak, Shri Bhabani Charan Totu, Shri Gian Chand Poddar, Shri R. K. Tripathi, Shri Kamlapati Pradhan. Shri Patitpaban Varma, Shri Mahadeo Prasad Prem Manohar, Shri Venka, Shri V. Rai, Shri Kalp Nath Venkatrao, Shri Chadalavada Rajinder Kaur, Shrimati Warjri, Shri Alexander Rameshwar Singh, Shri Yadav, Shri Ramanand Ranga, Prof. N. G. Yadav, shri Shyam Lai Rao, Shri V. C. Kesava The Motion was negatived. Ratan Kumari, Shrimati Ray, Shri Rabi MR. CHAIRMAN: Now I put to vote amendment Nos. 44 and 48 by Shri K. V. Razack, Shrimati Noorjehan Raghunatha Reddy. Do you press ihem? Reddy, Shri B. Satyanarayan SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA REDDY; I Reddy, Shri R. Narasimha am pressing the amendments. Sir. Roshan Lai, Shri Sahaya, Shri MR. CHAIRMAN: The a_uestion is: Dayanand Sahu, Shri Santosh 44. "That at pages 8 and 9, for lines 31 to Kumar 33 and 1 to 8 respectively, the following be Samad, Shri Golandaz Mohammed- substituted, namely::— busian A. '('a) in clause (1>,— Saring, Shri Leonard Soloman (i) the words "or internal disturbance" Ssrup Singh, Dr. shall be omitted; and Satchidananda, Shri (ii) the following Explanation shall be Sezhiyan, Shri Era inserted at the end, namely: — Shahi. Shri Nageshwar Prasad '•Explanation—A Proclamation of Shanti Bhushan, Shri Sharma, Shri Emergency declaring that the security of A]it Kumar Sharma, Shri Anant India or any Part of the territory thereof is threatened by war or by external Prasad Sharma, Shri Kishan Lai aggression may be made before the Shastri, Shri Bhola Paswan Siddhu. actual occurrence of war or of any such Dr. M. M S. aggression, if the President is satis-fled that there is imminent danger thereof."' " Singh, Shri Bhishma Narain Singh, Shri J. K- P. N. Singh, Shri Ng. 48. "That at page 10, for lines 34 to 37, the following be substituted, namely:— Tompok Singh, Shrimati Pratibha Singh, Shri Shiva Nandan '(c> clause C4) shall be re-numbered as clause (9) and for the clause as so re- Sinha, Dr. Ramkripal Sisodia, Shri numbered the following shall be Sawaisingh Sujan Singh, Shri substituted, namely.— Sultan, Shrimati Maimoona Sultan "(9) The power conferred on the Singh, Shri Surendra Mohan, Shri President by this Article shall in- 231 Constitution (Forty-fijth [ RAJYASABHA ] Amdt.) BUI, 1978 232

[Mr. Chairman]' elude the power to issue The Motion was negatived... different Proclamations on different grounds, being war of external MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is: aggression or imminent danger of war or external aggression, whether or not there 50. "That at page 10, after line 38, the is a Proclamation already issued by the iollowing be inserted, namely:— President under clause (1) and such '(dd) Notwithstanding anything in the Proclamation is in operation." ' " Constitution, the Supreme Court alone The motion was negatived. shall have the jurisdiction to decide about the validity of a J 'reclamation MR. CHAIRMAN: Amendments 45 and issued under clause 46. Mr, Khurshed Alam Khan, are you u:." pressing? The Motion was negatived... SHRI KHURSHED ALAM KHAN: Let MR. CHAIRMAN; Now, I shall put there be voice vote, clause 38. MR. CHAIRMAN ; The question is: The question is: 45. "That at page 8, lines 32-33, "I hat clause 38 stand part of the after the words 'armed rebellion', Bill. ' the words 'or organised mob-violence against a section of society' be in The House divided. serted." MR. CHAIRMAN: Ayes—171; Noes— 7. The Motion ivas negatived ,

MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is: AYES—171 46. "That at page 10, line 33, after Adivarekar, Shrimati Sushila Shankar the words 'such resolution' the words 'and at least seven days' notice shall Advani, Shri Lai K. be given to the members to attend Alva, Shrimati Margaret such session', be inserted." Amar.it Kaur, Shrimati The Motion was negatived... Amla, Shri Tirath Ram Anandam, Shri M. MR. CHAIRMAN: Amendments 49 and Anjiah, Shri T. 50. Mr, Maran, are you pressing them? Antulay, Shri A. R. SHRI MURASOLI MARAN : Yes. Arif, Shri Mohammed Usman Asthana, Shri K. B. MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is : Bagaitkar, Shri Sadasiv 49. "That at page 10, after line 37,. the Balesjhwar Dayal, Shri following be inserted, namely:— Balram Das, Shri '(cc> after clause (9) as so re-numbered, Banepee, Shri B. N. the following clause shall be inserted, Banerjee, Shri Jaharlal namely: — Bans! Lai, Shri "(10) A Proclamation issued under Barnjan, Shri Prasenjit clause (1) shall be revoked within thirty days after the terminal'">n of war or Basai;araj, Shri H. R. external aggression.".' " Bhabhda, Shri Harishanker Bhagat, Shri Ganapat Hiralal Bhagfwan Din, Shri 233 Amdt.) Bill, 1978 [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Constitution (Forty-fifth 234

Bhandari, Shri Sunder Singh Khaparde, Shrimati Saroj Bhattacharya, Shri G. C. Khobragade, Shri Bhaurao Devaji Bhim Raj, Shri Krishna, Shri M. R. Bose, Shrimati Pratima Krishnan, Shri E. R.

Chandrasekhar) Shrimatj Maragatham Krishnan, Shri U. R. Chatterjee, Shri Pranab Kunjachen, Shri P. K.

Ohattopadhyaya, Prof. D. P. Kureel Shri Piare Lall urf Piare Lall Talib Chaudhari, Shri N. P. Lakhan Singh, Shri Chaurasia, Shri Shivdayal Singh Lakshmanan, Shri G. Das, Shri Bipinpal Lokesh Chandra, Dr Desai, Shri R. M. Lofcha, Shri Khyomo Deshmukh, Shri Bapuraoji Marotraoji Madhavan, Shri K. K. Dinesh Chandra, Shri Swami Mathanti, Shri Bhairab Chandra Dinesh Singh, Shri Mahavir, Dr. Bhai Dutt, Dr. V. P. Mahida, Shri Harisinh Bhagubava Dwivedi, Shri Devendra Nath Majhi, Shri Dhaneswar Makwana, Gadgil, Shri Vithal Shri Yogendra Mallick, Shri Goswami, Shri Dinesh Harekrushna Manhar, Shri Bhagatram Gupta, Shri Gurudev Maran, Shri Murasoli Mathur, Shri Gupta, Shri Ram Lakhan Prasad Jagdish Prasad Maurya, Shri Buddha Habibullah, Shrimati Hamida Priya Mehrotra, Shri Prakash Hegde, Shri Ramakrishna Menon, Shrimati Leela Damodara Menon, Imam, Shrimati Aziza Shri Viswanatha Mishra, Shri Kalraj Mishra, Jagbir Singh, Shri Shri Mahendra Mohan Mittal, Shri Sat paul Jain, Shri Dharamchand Mohanty, Shri Surendra Mohinder Kaur, Jamuna Devi, Shrimati Shrimati Janardhanam, Shri A. P. Jha, Shri Kamalnath Mondal, Shri Almad Hossain Mopanar, Shri G. K. Morarka, Shri Jha, Shri Shiva Chandra Joshi, Shri Jagannath Rao R. R. Mukherjee, Shri Pranab Munusamy, Shri V. P. Joshi, Shri Jagdish Joshi, Shri Krishna Nand Muthu, Dr. (Shrimati) Sathiavani Naidu, Shri Joshi, Shrimati Kumudben Manishan-ker N. P. Chengalraya Naik, Shri L. R. Nanda, Shri Kadershah, Shri M. Narasingha Prasad Narendra Singh, Shri l Kakati Shri Robin Nigam, Shri Ladli Mohan Nizam-ud-Din, Shri Kalaniya, Shri Ibrahim Syed Kamble, Prof. N. M. Kameshwar Singh, Shri Kesri, Shri Sitaram Khan, Shri Ghayoor Ali Khan, Shri Khurshed Alam Khan, Shri Maqsood Ali Khan, Shrimati Ushi 235 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA p Amdt.) Bill, 1978 236

Oza, Shri Ghanshyambhai Pande, Shri Singh, Shrimati Pratibha Singh, Bishambhar Nath Parbhu Singh, Shri Shri Shiva Nandan Sinha, Dr. Parikh, Prof. Ramlal Patel, Shri Ramkripal Sisodia, Shri Sawaisingh

Manubhai Patil, Shri Deorao Soni, Shrimati Ambika Sujan Singh, Pattanayak, Shri Bhabani Charan Shri Sultan, Shrimati Maimoona Poddar, Shri R. K. lultai Singh, Shri Surendra Mohan, Pradhan, Shri Patitpahan Shri Swu, shri Secato Tama, Shri Prem Manohar, Shri Ratan Totu, Shri Gian Chand Triton Singh, Shri Rai, Shri Kalp Nath Rajan, Shri Pattiam Tripalthi, Shri Kamlapati Rajinder Kaur, Shrimati Vaishampayen, Shri S. K. Raju, Shri V. B. Varrra, Shri Mahadeo Prasad Ramamurti, Shri P. Venigalla Satyanarayana, Shri Rameshwar Singh, Shri Ranga, PROF. N. G. Venka, Shri V. Rao, Shri V. C. Kesava Venkatrao, Shri Chadalavada Ratan Kumari, Shrimati War j-i, Shri Alexander Ray, Shri Rabi Yada/, Shri Ramanand Razack, Shrimati Noorjehan Reddy, Shri B. Satyanarayan Yada/, Shri Shyam Lai

Reddy, Shri Mulka Govinda NOES—7 Reddy, Shri R. Narasimha / Roshan Lai, Shri Bhattacharjee, Prof. Sourendra Sahaya, Shri Dayanand Sahu, Shri Santosh Kumar Chakraborty, Shri Amarprosad Saleem, Shri Mohammad Yunus Goswami, Shri Sriman Prafulla Samad, Shri Golandaz Mohammed Mukherjee, Shrimati Kanak Pathak, Shri husian A. Saring, Shri Leonard Ananda Soloman Sarup Singh, Dr. T Satchidananda, Shri Sezhiyan, Shri Era Shahodullah, Shri Syed Surjejet, Shri Shahi, Shri Nageshwar Prasad Shanti Bhushan, Shri Sharma, Shri Ajit Kumar Harkishan Singh Sharma, Shri Anant Prasad Sharma, The motion was carried by a majority of Shri Kishan Lai Shastri, Shri Bhola the total membership of the Hous\i and by a Paswan Siddhu, Dr. M. M. S. Singh, majority of not less than \two-thirds of the Members present \and voting. Shri Bhishma Narain Singh, Shri J. K. p. N. Singh, Shri Ng. Tompok Clause 38 was added to the Bill. Clause 39—Amendment of Article 356. SHkl K. V. RAGHUNATHA REDDY: Sir, I move: 237 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 238

51. "That at pages 10 and 11, for clause 39, consisting of three serving Judges, among the following clause be substituted, namely: whom one shall be the Judge of the '39. in article-356 of the Consti-tion,— Supreme Court, who shall be the Chairman of the Commission and two from among the (a) in clause (4),— Judges of the High Courts, to enquire and advise him whether the report of the (i) for the words, brackets and figure Governor is made in good faith or the "one year from the date of the passing of information received by him otherwise for the second "of the resolution approving the his satisfaction is founded on sufficient Proclamation under clause (3)", the words evidence; and, on the advice of the "six months from the date of issue of the Commission, the President may revoke the Proclamation" shall be substituted; Proclamation, (ii) in the first proviso, for the words (d) the Judicial Commission "one year", the words "six months" shall be shall submit its Report within a substituted; period of two months. The Judi (iii) in the second proviso, for the words cial Commission, jn expressing its "one year", the words "six months" shall be view, shall consult the opinion of substituted; the Members of the Legislative Assembly and/or the Members of (b) for clause (5), the following clause shall the Legislative Council, as the case be substituted, namely:— may be, "(5) notwithstanding anything contained (e) notwithstanding anything in clause (4), a resolution with respect to the contained in the Constitution, no continuance in force of a Proclamation Assembly shall be dissolved before approved under clause (3) for any period the expiry of a period of three beyond the expiration of one year from the months after the Proclamation date of such Proclamation shall not be under clause (1)".'" passed by either House of Parliament unless,— (T/ie amendment also stood in the name of Shri Mulka Govinda Reddy.) (a) a proclamation of Emergency is in operation, in the whole of India or. as SHRI P. RAMAMURTI: Sir, I the case may be, in the whole or any part move: of the State, at the time of the passing of such resolution, and 52. "That at pages 10 and 11, for clause (b) the Election Commission 39, the following clause be substituted, certifies that the continuance in force of namely: — the Proclamation approve-ed under clause (3) during the period specified jn '39. Article 356 of the Constitution such resolution is necessary on account shall be omitted.'" of difficulties in holding general elections to the Legislative Assembly of The amendment also stood in the names of the Slate concerned. Shri Harkishan Singh Surjeet, Shri Viswanatha Menon, Shrimati Kanak (c) notwithstanding anything Mukherjee, Prof. Sourendra Bhattaclwrjee, contained in this Constitution, if the Shri Amar-prosad ChakrabOrty, Shri Bhupesh President is satisfied, he may appoint a .Gupta, Shri Kalyan Roy, Shri Bir Vhandra Judicial Commission Deb Burman, Shri Bhola '.Prasad, Shri Lakshmana Mahapatro and Shri Miirasoli Maran.)

SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Sir, 1 move: 239 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABIfA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 240

[Shri Bhupesh Gupta] irjprning at his invitation. I asked the Gpvernor as to what was all that atbout 54. "That at page 10, line 43, for the that was going on: Was there amy real words, 'six month' the words 'two months' be substituted." reason for the apprehension about the way in which the administration was going on 55. "That at page 10, line 46, for the there? Was there ajiy cause for alarm? words 'six months' the words 'two months' The Governor said, except some kind be substituted." of certain administrative problems here and tftere in one or two districts, there 56. "That at page 10, line 48, for the was absolutely nothing; the Chief Minister words 'six months' the words 'two months' enjoyed the confidence not only of the be substituted." legislature but of her own legislature party.

57. "That at page 11, line 6, for the This was what the Governoi tf)ld me. words 'one year' the words 'six months' be And a few days later instead of substituted." settling the internal problems of the party with the good offices of the political (The amendments also stood in the names leadership, the Cabinet decided to of Shri Kalyan R°V, Shri Bir Chandra Deb introduce Presi dent's rule, and after Burman, Shri Bhola Prasad and Shri the Cabine decision had been taken, a Lakshmana Maha-patro.) message had been sent to the Chief The questions were proposed. Minister "either you resign or you will b< c ismissed, with all the consequence SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA df a dismissal" Probably it wa: REDDY: This is a matter relating to planned to take her to Rohtak. Yoi know proclamation of President's rule in that famous Rohtak, you knov why it is so the States. Of all persons in the famous. Rohtak is knowi to everybody, House, you will kindly pardon me if why it is famous i' this context. Then, I say, you have got a very intimate with regard fc knowledge of the way in which MK Government: Not that th MK President's rule is promulgated in the Government did not commi me of the things States. This is an Article which had which they wer cused of, but still the been put to a lot of misuse for pur problem witl e dismissal of the DMK poses of settling political quarrels of Governmen as a political problem which ha< political parties. Very often we also thing to do with administratior 1 many know that the so-called reports of accusations were levelle< ainst the DMK Governors are written in Delhi, and Government in Tami idu. It was dismissed as not by Governors ______a result 0 e Emergency to which rathe dly-— AN HON MEMBER: Were you not a party to this Emergency provision-to which the to that? Janata Government ha JSow become a party. iThis Emergenc power was invoked and even SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA REDDY: I some c pur colleagues like Mr. Muraso have some knowledge, I was not a party to it. Maran were victims of that Emei gency. Sir, you also know that whenever even the Notwithstanding all this.... internal problems of a political party have to be settled, proclamation of President's rule is resorted to, instead of settling those problems SHRI YOGENDRA of the political party internally. You are also MAKWAN.Gujarat): What were you fully aware, to illustrate my point, of how doing iIhose days? Did you not have Governor's rule had been brought in Orissa, for instance. As you are aware, I happened to thirourage to say this thing in those days visit that State just before the Governor's rule You could have resigned. was imposed there. I happened to meet the Governor in the 241 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 242

SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA REDDY: nise that sometimes there may be some As I said the other day, we have been emergency situation in a particular State. If in members of a community of sinners who such cases the President's rule is felt inevitable, are quite a number in this House. We had to then I have suggested an amendment saying fight against such tendencies in our own that a judicial Commission consisting a way. Now you have combined with the Supreme Court Judge as its Chairman and two Janata Party. These twin brothers of right High Court Judges as the Members should visit reaction are emerging hand in hand today that State, take evidence of people there and we have to fight this battle with our including members of the legislature and own technique without falling prey to the submit a report to the President independently emergency provision. giving advice what the President must do. Sir, the Chief Ministers were not safe and no Then the President can exercise his discretion State Government was safe and we all know and revoke the President's rule in the State. how these provisions were implemented in This acts as a corrective against the Governors those days when even the Cabinet was a who write their reports at the behest of the captive Cabinet. Even the Parliament was Central Government. This may give some captive in those days. ... protection to Parliamentary Democracy and Party Governments especially in a federal SHRI YOGENDRA MAKWANA: What structure. This is absolutely necessary. This is prevented you from resigning? a simple amendment and I hope the House will appreciate this amendment and commend its SHRI KALP NATH RAI (Uttar acceptance. Pradesh): Why did he not resign?

MR. CHAIRMAN: You ought to have asked him at that time, not now. SHRI HARKISHAN SINGH SUR-JEET: Since 1954, in the history of this country, [The Vice-ChaJrman (Shri Syed Nizam- article 356 has often been misused for narrow ud-Din) in the Chair.] political ends of the Party ruling at the Centre whether it was PEPSU, Travancore-Cochin or SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA REDDY: Sir, any other State in this country. I hope I do not want Governor's rule or President's everybody will agree on this. Wherever some rule in any State. But if it becomes inevitable disagreement was there in the past or some and if it is considered necessary to have this difficulty was there in any particular State, this provi- 1 sion, then it must be in a modified article has been misused to see that the mono- form. There must be an independent machinery poly of power of the Party ruling at the Centre to judge whether the Governor's report has remains in tact and not broken. I do not know been sent in good faith or it has been drafted in why the Janata Party required it. They have got Delhi and sent to the Governor who is forced 1heir own problems, enough number of to sign it. I know of one of the Gov ernors who problems. Is it by using this article that they paid glowing tributes the government of his want to consolidate themselves? I think this State, but when he came here he made all sorts article is unwarranted and the whole of malicious allegations against that State. This experience shows that even if it is one year, one year also plays disaster so far as the does not add to the dignity of the office of the democratic functioning of the institutions are Governor. This happened in the South. If that concerned. That is why I propose that they is the case there must be some kind of should accept this amendment and adhere to guarantee against the manipulation of the princi- Governors' reports. I am not in favour of the President's rule. But I recog- 243 Constitution (Forty-fijth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 244

[Shri Harkishan Singh Surjeet] pies which Kamlapatiji was told, or his followers were they have been advocating and they should tald, ''Better resign; otherwise. President's see that this article completely goes away. Rule is coming". And, Sir, the arrangement was that Mr. Kamlapati Tripathi would step SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Naturally. Sir, down in favour of another Congressman and it has been spoken upon. I am at least in he woi Id resign. Being a saintly man and no; agreement with the one amendment which going in for trouble he thought it woad be wants the deletion of article 356. My second better to get out. So, he left and the amendment comes later. If you delete this, President's Rule was imposed lor some time. then, Sir, Mr. Shanti Bhushan will not be troubled with my next amendment. SHRI G. LAKSHMANAN: He is coming now, Mr. Gupta. Sir, we are fully in favour of the deletion of article 356, that is, we are for the abolition of SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Mr Tripathi, I the provision in the Constitution which am saying that in this House itself toe saw empowers the Central Government to you were becoming a victim of article 356 intervene at will and to do away with the and that victim happens to be the Leader of elected government and to impose what they the Opposiion here today. That is what I am call the President's Rule. Sir, we have at least siying. in this House two former Chief Ministers and one of them is sitting here and the other is Mr. SHRI KAMLAPATI TRIPATHI: Thank Kamlapati Tripathi. you very much. SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA REDDY: SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I know you wi'l The third one is there, Mr. Bhola Paswan not deny it. Shastri. SHRI P. RAMAMURTI: Where is the SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: But he is not a question of his denying it? He is thanking victim of this provision. Now, two former you. Chief Ministers are here. I know about it and I was here. Sir. here are the victims of inter- SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I know why h: party manoeuvres and manipulations. Sir, Mr. is thanking me, because he cannot tell the Tripathi is not here now and I would like to truth, not that he is not a truthful man. say this in his presence. You know, in 1973, he suddenly resigned. What was that for? Now, Sir, I say that he was removed in Ihe President's Rule came there. How? The name of resignation which, just like Assembly was suspended and was not emergency in the name of armed rebellion; dissolved. The decision was taken in New was engineered. This is what I say. We all Delhi in the Congress Party that Mr. Tripathi knew it. We knew tnat he was going and that now the leader of the Congress(I) here, should the President's Rule wa£ being planned in a be replaced by another leader of the UP particular Secretariat and that emissarjies had Legislature Party, that is, another Chief been sent and later, Sir, out good friend: Shri Minister should be there. His friends were Kamlapati Tripathi; went out. This is how the aware of it and everybody knew about it. Mr. President's Rule came there. Who succeeded Raghunatha Reddy, did you know it? You you as the Chief Minister there, Mr. Tripathi? must have known this and everybody knew Sir, the Assembly was suspended and not about it and it is an open secret. Everybody dissolved. He had a <[lear majority. He had a knew that plans were prepared to see that Mr very clear majority in the UP Assembly and Tripathi was squeezed out. How? there was no manipulation to reduce hi;: majority. Nothing was there. 245 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 246

So, they imposed the President's Rule. Was the President's rule is a bogus method. I know he President's Rule meant for the internal affairs of will give the argument; The Centre is there , a political party. t Here is another example of there is to be unity of the country. But what Mr. Oza, Chief Minister... about the States? Why only the "Centre? What is wrong there? SHRI GHANSHYAMBHAI OZA: President's rule came long after I left. Sir, about the Governor, the less said the SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Anyway, there better. Governor's institution should really go. is the example of Mrs. Nandini Satpathy. Governor's are just the agents of the Centre. It When some people demanded that is true. Charan Singh dispensed even with the Nandini Satpathy should go, telephone went: Governor's report. Some of the reports used to You resign, otherwise President's rule is be written in Delhi, signed by the Governor. coming. And then she had to resign, and the They would send for the Governors to Delhi. President's rule came and some arrange- Mr Charan Singh would say: I am satisfied, ment was made, another Chief there must be President's rule. President's rule Minister was found. Well, within 13 days came by a stroke of pen in nine States. That is the President's rule was revoked there. So how it all happened. Therefore, I say that this many examples are there. Fifty times is an antidemocratic arrangement. It does not President's rule had been imposed. If you conform to democratic standards. There ;ire examine them, on most occasions they had other countries also where, if then; is some been imposed either for subverting democratic constitutional difficulty, elections are held and institutions or for handling internal the problem is settled that way, going to to circumstances of Congress Party. We the people and asking them. became the first victim in Kerala. We had the 8.00 P.M. majority—United Communist Party in 1957. In 1959 it was removed. Nothing could be Sir, something has be done here. As long as done. President's rule came. We had the the President's rule remains, the pressure of majority and they ordered President's the Central Government on the State rule by making some excuse of the vimochan Governments will also remain and the struggle. In West Bengal, President's rule was Government of the State will be at the mercy imposed. Comrade Surjit said: We want of the Central Government. They misuse it. to take the country out of the jungle. Now, because the democle's sword of President's how will you handle the situation. You rule under one pretext or the other will always can hold mid-term elections. Mr. Charan be available to the Central Government. They Singh has shown that when he wants he can misuse it. They have misused it. Everybody hold elections—within 40 days. So the knows it. Therefore, Sir, I think that our Government that is in power can amendment is the most sensible amendment. function as a caretaker Government. Kamlapati Ji will not support it. What can I do? He is the biggest victim of it and still he SHRI SUNDER SINGH BHANDARI: Not will not support it. in the rainy season. (Interruptions) SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: That is the SHRI KAMLAPATI TRIPATHI: period required for notification, for Everybody else joined the Janata Government announcement. Therefore, it can be easily except myself. I am here. done. But that was not done. It all depends on how the ruling party behaves. In Madhya SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Kamlapati Ji, Pradesh, Mr. D. P. Mishra was a clever man. anyway I must say one thing. If President's He was the 'Chanakya' of the Congress raj, he rule had not been there. knew how to handle the situation. I can give many instances. 247 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 248

[Shri Bhupesh Gupta] Kamlapati Ji would catae the brown Sahibs. It was very useful for have never come to the Centre. Nobody them. So, they are keeping it. I am sorry that would have found you on our side in the even the Janata Government continues to opposition. It has been a long-term gain. It have it. It mians that there is a kind of imperi- was in 1973 and we gained you in 1977, after alism going on here. That is why they w;nt four years. I say, Sir, that this provision is a this provision for their exploitation. 1 am very bad provision. Sir, there are other things sorry, I cannot understand that the hon. also. I will not seek division on them. But this Minister the other day said that even the is a very crucial provision. I say: Hands down President's rule is a kind of representative with the President's rule and hands down with Government be;ause it is goverend by article 356. Parliament. I (fannot understand. If it were so, wrJy are you going to award statehood to SHRI MURASOLI MARAN: Sir, Delhi? It is against thl federal concept. It is a article 356 is a much misused article pistol pointed at the States in order to black- in our Constitution. Is antidemo mail them. If you believe in democracy, if cratic and anti-federal Sir, Mr. you believe in federalism, thin please take this Raghunatha Reddy and Mr. Bhupesh article out of the Co istitution. Gupta were saying how the reports of the Governors were prepared. Sir, we £!HRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Sir, 1 do not have practical knowledge about it. have to say much on this clause. But I entirely When Mr. K. K. Shah was the Gover agree with Shri Bhupesh Gupta that this nor of Tamil Nadu, he was praising the provision has been veijy much misused in the then D.M.K Government of the day at past by the previous Government. Sir, we a function in the morning. But the have a gjalaxy of victims even in this House. President's rule was declared in the But, Sir.. . evening. [Mr. Chairman in the Chair] SHRI A. R. ANTULAY: Sir, the hon. Law Perhaps he was not a ware when he was Minister went on the AIR to convince the praising the Government that at Delhi, in the people of India as to how the Government Home Ministry, the report was being was right in dismissing all the State prepared. He was asked to sign a report for Governments. That was the biggest misuse. which he was not the author. That is how the reports were prepared. Sir, there is a word SHRI KALP NATH RAI: That was the 'otherwise' in article 356. The Central slaughter of democracy by you. Yon Government does not believe the Governors slaughtered democracy. also. Supposing the Governor is a SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Sir, I was1 conscientous man, then e';en without the only wondering whether Shri Bhupesh Gupta Governor sending the report, the President did really try to analyse as to how it had can dismiss the Government. That is there. become possible for a Government to misuse Cruel situation it is. We all know that it is its powers under article 356. Sir, if he had borrowed, textually copied, from Section 93 been vigilant in regard to his parliamentary of the T935 Act. When there was interim functions in checking the Government from Parliament and there was the Constituent doing a wrong thing. I am sure, he would Assembly, this section was not there in the have been able to prevent that Government 1935 Act as it was amended then. Later, when from doing wrong things. we became a republic and we had our own Constitution, this provision was transplanted. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: That is why I Sir, it is a pity that when the white Sahibs cannot prevent you now. were there this section was there. Later 49 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 250

SHRI SHANTl BHUSHAN: No. You are not I Mahapatro, Shri Lakshmana supporting us. You were supporting them. That Maran, Shri Murasoli was the trouble, [f you had really been checking them, perhaps, all that abuse would not have Menon, Shri Viswanatha taken place. Sir, 1 have seen that he can check Mukherjee, Shrimati Kanak and check so strongly and valiantly that he is Pathak, Shri Ananda like a road-block and nothing can go through. So, Sir, when he had given up his function of Rajan, Shri Pattiam that road-block, the speeding-cars, rash driving, Ramamurti, Shri P. etc. were allowed to take place without using his Roy, Shri Kalyan road-block. Then all that misuse occurred. Sir, Shahedullah, Shri Syed now that the road-block is alive and kicking, no abuse is possible. And that is why we have made Sharma, Shri Yogendra an attempt to impose restrictions, limitations on Sinha, Shri Indradeep i Surjeet, this power of imposing the President's Rule. Shri Harkishan Singh MR. CHAIRMAN: Now I put amendment NOES—162 No. 51 to vote. Adivarekar, Shrimati Sushila Shankar SHRI P. RAMAMURTI: Sir, may I say one thing? You first put amendment No. 52 to vote Advani, Shri Lai K. because, if this amendment is passed, the other Alva, Shrimati Margaret amendment does not arise. Therefore, Sir, you Amarjit Kaur, Shrimati put this to vote. Amla, Shri Tirath Ram MR. CHAIRMAN: I will put amendment No. Anandam, Shri M. 52 to vote. Anjiah, Shri T. The question is: Antulay, Shri A. R. 52. "That at pages 10 and 11, for clause Arif, Shri Mohammed Usman 39, the following clause be Aslhana, Shri K. B. substituted, namely:— Bagaitkar, Shri Sadasiv '39. Article 356 of the Constitution shall Baleshwar Dayal, Shri be omitted.' " The House divided.' " Balram Das, Shri MR. CHAIRMAN: Ayes—20; Noes— Banerjee, Shri Jaharlal 162 AYES—20 Bansi Lai, Shri Barman, Shri Prasenjit Bhattacharjee, Prof. Sourendra Vasavaraj, Shri H. R. Bhola Prasad, Shri Chakraborty, Shri Amarprosad Bhabhda, Shri Harishanker Deb Burman, Shri Bir Chandra Bhagat, Shri Ganapat Hiralal Gupta, Shri Bhupesh Bhagwan Din, Shri Kumaran, Shri S. Bhandari, Shri Sunder Singh Kunjachen, Shri P. K. Bhattacharya, Shri G. C. Lakshmanan, Shri G. Bhim Raj, Shri Bose, Shrimati Pratima Chandrasekhar, Shrimati Maragatham Chatterjee, Shri Pranab Chattopadhyaya, Prof. D. P. Chaudhari, Shri N. P. Chaurasia, Shri Shivdayal Singh Das, Shri Bipinpal 251 Constitution (Forlij-jijth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 252

Desai, Shri R. M. Mlahanti, Shri Bhairab Chandra Deshmukh, Shri Bapuraoji Marotraoji MJihavir, Dr. Bhai Dhulap, Shri Krishnarao Narayan Mkhida, Shri Harisinh Bhagubava Dinesh Chandra, Shri Swami Majhi, Shri Dhaneshwar Dinesh Singh, Shri Makwana, Shri Yogendra Dutt, Dr. V. P. Maillick, Shri Harekrushna Dwivedi, Shri Devendra Nath Mannar, Shri Bhagatram Gadgil, Shri Vithal Myithur, Shri Jagdish Prasad Goswami, Shri Dinesh Milurya, Shri Buddha Priya Gupta, Shri Gurudev Mahrota, Shri Prakash Gupta, Shri Ram Lakhan Prasad Manon, Shrimati Leela Damodara Habibullah, Shrimati Hamida Mi|shra, Shri Kalraj Hegde, Shri Ramakrishna Mishra, Shri Mahendra Mohan Imam, Shrimati Aziza Mittal, Shri Sat Paul Jagbir Singh, Shri Mdhanty, Shri Surendra

Jain, Shri Dharamchand Moainder Kaur, Shrimati Jamuna Devi, Shrimati Mopdal, Shri Ahmad Hossain Janardhanam, Shri A. P. Moppanar, ,Shri G. K. Jha, Shri Kamalnath Mofaka, Shri R. R. Jha, Shri Shiva Chandra Muiherjee, Shri Pranab Joshi, Shri Jagannathrao Mulhu, Dr. (Shrimati) Sathiavani Joshi, Shri Jagdish Naiiiu, Shri N. P. Chengalraya Joshi. Shri Krishnanand Naic, Shri L. R. Joshi, Shrimati Kumudben Manishan-ker Narida, Shri Narasingha Prasad Kadershah, Shri M. Narendra Singh, Shri Kakati, Shri Robin Nigam, Shri Ladli Mohan Kalaniya, Shri Ibrahim Nizam-ud-Din, Shri Syed Kamble, Prof. N. M. Oza Shri Ghanshyambhai Kesri, Shri Sitaram Pande, Shri Bishambhar Nath Khan, Shri Ghayoor Ali Parlbhu Singh, Shri Khan, Shri Khurshed Alam Parikh, Prof. Ramlal Khan, Shri Maqsood Ali PateL Shri Manubhai Khan, Shrimati Ushi Patii, Shri Deorao Khaparde, Shrimati Saroj Patt mayak, Shri Bhabani Charan Khobragade, Shri Bhaurao Devaji Podilar, Shri R. K. Krishnan, Shri M. R. Pradaan, Shri Patitpaban Krishnan, Shri E. R'. Krishnan, Shri U. Prem Manohar, Shri R. Kureel, Shri Piare Lall urf Piare Rai, Shri Kalp Nath Lall Talib Lakhan Singh, Shri Lokesh Chandra. Dr. Raju Shri V. B. Lotha, Shri Khyomo Ramcshwar Singh, Shri Madhavan, Shri K. K. Ranga, Prof. N. G. Rao, Shri V. C. Kesava Ratan Kumari, Shrimati 253 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 254

Ray, Shri Rabi Razack, Shrimati Noorjehan Venka, Shri V. Reddy, Shri B. Satyanarayan Reddy, Shri Venkatarao, Shri Chandalavada Warjri, Mulka Govinda Reddy, Shri R. Narasimha Shri Alexander Yadav, Shri Ramanand Roshan Lai, Shri Sahu, Shri Santosh Kumar Yadav; Shri Shyam Lai The motion

Saleem, Shri Mohammad Yunus Samad, was negatived. Shri Golandaz Mohammed-husian A. SHRI MOHAMMAD YUNUS SA-LEEM: We shall go for dinner, Sir. We are very Saring, Shri Leonard Soloman Sarup hungry... (Interruptions). Singh, Dr. Satchidanda, Shri MR. CHAIRMAN: Now, clause 39. Schamnad, Shri Hamid Ali Sezhiyan, Shri Era Shahi, Shri Nageshwar SHRI MOHAMMAD YUNUS SA-LEEM: We shall go for dinner and come back. Prasad Shanti Bhushan, Shri Sharma, MR. CHAIRMAN: My request is that Shri A jit Kumar Sharma, Shri Anant when the third reading starts, we can go and Prasad Sharma, Shri Kishan Lai take food. Shastri, Shri Bhola Paswan Siddhu, Dr. SOME HON. MEMBERS: No, No. . . M. M. S. (Interruptions) Singh, Shri Bhishma Narain Singh, SHRI KAMLAPATI TRIPATHI: My request is, Sir, to continue it and finish it as Shri J. K. P. N. Singh, Shri Ng. early as possible. I request that Members may Tompok Singh, Shrimati Pratibha be requested not to make long speeches. Singh, Shri Shiva Nandan Sinha, Dr. Ramkripal Sisodia, Shri Sawaisingh Soni, Shrimati

Ambika Sujan Singh, Shri Sultan, Shrimati Maimoona Sultan MR. CHAIRMAN: I now put amendment Singh, Shri Surendra Mohan, No. 51 by Shri K. V. Raghunatha Reddy to Shri Swu, Shri Scato Tama, Shri vote. The question is: Ratan 51. "That at pages 10 and 11, for clause 39, Totu, Shri Gian Chand Triloki Singh, the following clause be sub-situated, namely:— Shri Tripathi, Shri Kamlapati Vaishampayen, Shri S. K. Varma, Shri '39. In article 356 of the Constitution,— Mahadeo Prasad Venigalla (a) in clause (4),— (i) for the words, brackets and figure 'one Satyanarayana, Shri year from the date of the passing of the second of the resolution approving the Proclamation under clause (3)", the words "six months from the date of issue of the Proclamation" shall be substituted; (ii) in the first proviso, for the words 'one year", the words "six months'* shall be substituted; 255 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] g Amdt.) Bill, Wth 256

[Mr. Chairman] Members of the Legislative Assembly (iii) in the second proviso, for the words and/or the Members of the Legislative ''one year", the words "six months" shall be Council, as the case may be; substituted; Oe) notwithstanding anything (b) for clause (5J, the following-clause contained in the Constitution, no shall be substituted, namely:— Assembly shall be dissolved before the expiry of a period of three months after '(5) Notwithstanding anything contained the Proclamation under clause (D'l" in clause (4), a resolution with respect to The motion was negatived. the continuance in force of a Proclamation approved under clause (3) for any period MR. CHAIRMAN; Amendment No. 53 by beyond the expiration of one year from the Siiri Dhabe. He has not moved. Amendments date of such Proclamation shall not be Nos. 54 to 57 are by Shri Bhupesh Gupta. passed by either House of Parliament unless,— SHRI BHUFESH GUPTA: Sir, I withdraw (a) a Proclamation of Emergency is the amendments. in operation, in the whole of India, or as Amendments* Nos. 54, 55, 56 and 57 the case may be, in the whole or any part were, by leave, withdrawn. of the State, at the time of the passing of such resolution; MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is : (b) the Election Commission certifies that the continuance in force of the 'That clause 39 stand part of the Bill." proclamation approved under clause (3) The House divided. during the period specified in such resolution is necessary on account of MR. CHAIRMAN: Ayes—173; Noes —2. difficulties in holding general elections to the Legislative Assembly of the State concerned. AYES—173

Adivaresar, Shrimati Sushila Shankar (c) notwithstanding anything contained in this Constitution, if the Advani, Shri Lai K. President is satisfied, he may appoint a Alva, Slirimati Margaret Judicial Commission consisting of three Amarjit Kaur, Shrimati serving Judges, among whom one shall be the Judge of the Supreme Court, who Amla, Shri Tirath Ram shall be the Chairman of the Commission Anandafn, Shri M. and two from among the Judges of the Anjiah, Shri T. High Courts, to enquire and advise him Antulay, Shri A. R. whether the report of the Governor is made in good faith or the information re- Arif, Shri Mohammed Usman ceived by him otherwise for his Asthantl Shri K. B. satisfaction is founded on sufficient Bagaitkar, Shri Sadasiv evidence; and on the advice of the Commission, the President may revoke Baleshwar Dayal, Shri the Proclamation; Balram Das, Shri (d) the Judicial Commission shall Banerjc?, Shri B. N. submit its Report within a period of two months. The Judicial Commission, in ♦For text of amendments, vide cols. expressing its view, shall consult the 23?) supra. opinion of the 257 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 258

Banerjee, Shri Jaharlal Bansi Lai, Shri ' Kalaniya, Shri Ibrahim Kamble, Prof. N. M. Barman, Shri Prasenjit Basavaraj, Shri H. R. Kameshwar Singh, Shri Kesri, Shri Sitaram Bhabhda, Shri Harishanker Bhagat, Shri Khan, Shri Ghayoor AH Khan, Shri Khurshed Ganapat Hiralal Bhagwan Din, Shri Bhandari, Alam Khan, Shri Maqsood Ali Khan, Shrimati Shri Sunder Singh Bhattacharya, Shri G. C. Ushi Khaparde, Shrimati Saroj Khobragade, Bhim Raj, Shri Bose, Shrimati Pratima Shri Bhaurao Devaji Krishna, Shri M. R. Chandrasekhar, Shrimati Maragatham Krishnan, Shri E. R. Krishnan, Shri U. R, Chatterjee, Shri Pranab Chattopadhyaya, Prof. Kureel, Shri Piare Lall urf Piare Lall D. P. Chaurasia, Shri Shivdayal Singh Das, Shri Talib Lakhan Singh, Shri Lakshmanan, Shri G. Bipinpal Desai, Shri R. M. Lokesh Chandra, Dr. Lotha, Shri Khyomo Deshmukh, Shri Bapuraoji Marotraoji Madhavan, Shri K. K. Mahanti, Shri Bhairab Dhulap, shri Krishnarao Narayan Dinesh Chandra Mahavir, Dr. Bhai Mahida, Shri Chandra, Shri Swami Dinesh Singh, Shri Dutt, Harisinh Bhagubava Majhi, Shri Dhaneswar Dr. V. P. Makwarta, Shri Yogendra Mallick, Shri Dwivedi, Shri Devendra Nath Harekrushna Manhar, Shri Bhagatram Maran, Gadgil, Shri Vithal Shri Murasoli Mathur, Shri Jagdish Prasad Goswami, Shri Dinesh Maurya, Shri Buddha Priya Mehrotra, Shri Goswami, Shri Sriman Prafulla Prakash Menon, Shrimati Lee] a Damodara Gupta, Shri Gurudev Menon, Shri Viswanatha Mishra, Shri Kalraj Gupta, Shri Ram Lakhan Prasad Mishra, Shri Mahendra Mohan Mittal, Shri Sat Habibullah, Shrimati Hamida Paul Mohanty, Shri Surendra Mohinder Kaur, Hegde, Shri Ramakrishna Shrimati Mondal, Shri Ahmad Hossain Imam, Shrimati Aziza Moopanar, Shri G. K. Morarka, Shri R. R. Jagbir Singh, Shri Mukherjee, shrimati Kanak Mukherjee, Shri Jain, Shri Dharamchand Pranab Munusamy, Shri V. P. Jamuna Devi, Shrimati Janardhanam, Shri A. P. Jha, Shri Kamalnath Jha, Shri Shiva Chandra Joshi, Shri Jagannathrao Joshi, Shri Jagdish Joshi, Shri Krishna Nand Joshi, Shrimati Kumudbhen Mani- shanker Kadershah, Shri M. Kakati, Shri Robin 1134 RS—9. 259 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 260

Muthu, Dr. (Shrimati)- Sathiavani Sharma, Shri Ajit Kumar Naidu, Shri N. P. Chengalraya Sharna, Shri Anant Prasad Naik, Shri L. R. Sharna, Shri Kishan Lai

Nanda, Shri Narasmgha Prasad Shas;ri) Shri Bhola Paswan Narendra Singh, Shri Siddhu, Dr. M. M. S. Nigam, Shri Ladli Mohan Singh, Shri Bhishma Narain Nizam-ud-Din, Shri Syed Singh, Shri J. K. P. N. Oza, Shri Ghanshyambhai Singh, Shri Ng. Tompok Pande, Shri Bishambhar Nath Singh Shrimati Pratibha Parbhu Singh, Shri Singh, Shri Shiva Nandan Parikh, Prof. Ramlal Sinha, Dr. Ramkripal Patel, Shri Manubhai Sisod.a, Shri Sawaisingh Pathak, Shri Ananda Soni, Shrimati Ambika Patil, Shri Deorao Sujar Singh. Shri , Pattanayak, Shri Bhabani Charan Sultai, Shrimati Maimoona Poddar, Shri R. K. Sultan Singh, Shri

Pradhani Shri Patitpaban Suren dra Mohan, Shri Prem Manohar, Shri Swu, Shri Scato Rai, Shri Kalp Nath Tama, Shri Ratan Raju, Shri V. B. Tctu, Shri Gian Chand Ramamurti, Shri P. Trilohi Singh, Shri Rameshwar Singh, Shri Tripa hi, Shri Kamlapati Ranga, Prof. N. G. Vaish impayen, Shri S. K. Rao, Shri V. C. Kesava Varmii, Shri Mahadeo Prasad Ratan Kumari, Shrimati Venigilla Satyanarayana, Shri Ray, Shri Rabi Venka, Shri V. Razack, Shrimati Noorjehan Venkatrao, Shri Chadalavada Reddy, Shri B. Satyanarayan Warjr , Shri Alexander Reddy, Shri K. V. Raghunatha Yadav, Shri Ramanand Reddy, Shri Mulka Govinda Yadav, Shri Shyam Lai Reddy, Shri R. Narasimha NOES—2 Roshan Lai, Shri Sahu, Shri Santosh Kumar Bhattacharjee, Prof. Sourendra Saleem, Shri Mohammad Yunus Chakraborty, Shri Amarprosad Samad, Shri Golandaz Mohammed- The motion was carried by a majority of husian A. Saring, Shri Leonard the total membership of the House and by a Soloman Sarup Singh, Dr. majority of not lesa than t too-thirds of the Satchidananda, Shri Schamnad, Shri members present ai-d voting. Hamid Ali Sezhiyan, Shri Era Clause 40—Amendment of article 358 Shahedullah, Shri Syed Shahi, Shri MR. CHAIRMAN: We shall now take up Nageshwar Prasad Shantl Bhushan, Shri clai se 40. There is one amendment, amendment No. 58 by Shri Bhupesh Gupta. 261 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 262

SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Sir, I beg to Sir, this is another Emergency clause move: which should go. 58. "That at page 11, for clause 40, the MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is: following clause be substituted, namely::— 59. "That at pages 11 and 12, for '40. Article 358 of the Constitution shall clause 41, the following clause be be omitted'." substituted, namely: — [The amendment also stood in the fiames of '41. Article 359 of the Constitution shall be Shri Kalyan Roy, Shri Bir 'Chandra Deb omitted'." The motion was negatived. Burman Shri Bhola Prasad, Shri Lakshm,ana > Clause 42—Amendment of article 368 MR. Mahapatro, Shri P. Ramamurti, Shri Harkishan CHAIRMAN: We shall now take up clause Singh Surjeet. Shri Viswanatha Menon> Shri- •mati Kanak Mukherjee, Prof. Souren-dra 42. There is one amendment, amendment Bhattacharjee and Shri Amarpro-sad No. 60 by Shri Bhupesh Gupta. Chakraborty.] SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA; Sir, I beg to Sir, I do not wish to make any speech. These move: are deletions. These are omissions. You can put 60. "That at page 12, for clause 42, it to vote. Voice vote will be sufficient. the following clause be substituted, The question was proposed. namely: — MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is: '42. Article 360 of the Constitution 58. "That at page 11, for clause 40, shall be omitted'." the following clause be substituted, Chandra Deb Burman, Shri Bhola .namely: — Prasad^ Shri Lakshmana Mahapatro, '40. Article 358 of the Constitution shall Shri P. Ramamurti, Shri Harkishan be omitted'." Singh Surjitj Shri Viswanatha Me non, Shrimati Kanak Mukherjee, The motion was negatived. Prof. Sourendra Bhattacharjee and Clause 41—Amendment of article 359 Shri Amarprosad Chakraborty.} 1 [The amendment also stood in the MR. CHAIRMAN: We shall now take up names of Shri Kalyan Roy, Shri Bir clause 41. There is one amendment, amendment No. 59 by Shri Bhupesh Gupta. Sir, this is the last of the Emergency clauses which should also go. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA; Sir, I beg to The question was proposed. move: MR. CHAIRMAN; The question is: 59. "That at pages 11 and 12, for 60. "That at page 12, for clause 42, the clause 41, the following clause be following clause shall be substituted, substituted, namely:.— namely: — '41. Article 359 of the Constitution shall '42. Article 360 of the Constitution be omitted'.'' shall be omitted'." The motion was [The amendment also stood in thenames of negatived. Shri Kalyan Roy, Shri Bir 'Chandra Deb MR. CHAIRMAN: Now, clause 43. Burman, Shri Bhola Prasad, Shri Lakshmana There are no amendments. Mahapatro, Shri P. Ramamurti, Shri Harkishan Clause. 44:—Amendment of article 366 Singh Surjeet. Shri Viswanatha Menon, Shri- mati Kanak Mukherjee, Prof. Souren-dra SHRI S. K. VAISHAMPAYEN: Sir, I Bhattacharjee and Shri Amarpro-sad do not move my Amendment No. 61. Chakraborty.] PROF. SOURENDRA BHATTA- CHARJEE: Sir, I move: The question was proposed. 62. "That at page 13, lines 6 and 7, for the words 'in which there is equal respect for all religions; and', 263 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 264

[Prof. Sourendra Bhattacharjee] {The amendment also stood in filename o: the words 'in which the State ad- Shri Nageshwar Prasad Shahi) ministration as such is not identified with SHRI VTURASOLI MAR AN: Sir, I any particular religions denomination and there is equal respect for all religions; and' move: be substituted." 65. 'That at page 13, line 7, after the word 'and' the words 'a republic which shall 69. "That at page 13, line 10, after the make no law respecting-an establishment of words 'political and economic', the words religion or prohibiting the free exercise 'and in which there is public social ownership of all means of production, thereof, where leither any religious test distribution and exchange through the State shall be required as a qualification for any and through cooperative or collective forms office nor any discrimination shall be made of social organisation' be inserted." en grounds of religion and' be inserted." '(The amendments also stood in the name of SHRI |C. V. RAGHUNATHA RED-DY : Shri Amarprosad Chakra-borty) SirJ I move : SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA; Sir, I 67. "That at page 13, for lines 8 to 10, the move: following be substituted, namely: — 63. "That at page 13, lines 6 and '(2) The expression 'REPUBLIC as 7, for the words 'there is equal res qualified by the expression 'SOCrALlST' pect for all religions; and' the words means a Republic in wiich the means of 'all citizens irrespective of their reli production and c.istribution and financial gious beliefs or not shall have equal institutions are owned and controlled by rights and opportunities; and' be trie State, and all forms of exploitation, substituted." social, political and economic for private benefit are eliminated and a society based 66. "That at page 13, for lines 8 to 10, CJ$ principles of scientific socialism is the following be substituted, namely: — created'." '(2) the expression "REPUBLIC" as (The amendment also stood in the name of qualified by the expression Shri Mulka Govinda Reddy.y "SOCIALIST" means a republic in which there shall be social ownership of SHRI P. RAMAMURTI: Sir, I move: all means of production, distribution and 68. "That at page 13, line 10. after the exchange, and there shall be freedom weirds 'political and economic' the words from all forms of exploitation, social, 'and in which there is public ownership of political and economic'." all means of production, distribution and (The amendments also stood in the names 0/ exchange' be inserted." Shri Kalyan Roy, Shri Bir Chandra Deb (The amendment also stood in the names of Burman, Shri Bhola Pra~ tad and Shri Shri Harkishan Singh Sur-jeet, Shri Lakshmana Mahapatro.) Viswanatha Menon and Shrimati Kanak SHRI SYED SHAHEBULLAH (West Mukherjee). Bengal): Sir, I move: The questions were put and tha motions were negatived. 64. "That at page 13, lines 6-7, for the words 'there is equal respect for MR. CHAIRMAN: The question Is: all religions', the words 'there is equal respect for right to belief in, "Thai clause 44 stand part of the Bill." and practice of, any religion, and freedom to pursue one's faith' be substituted." 265 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 266

The House divided. Morarka, Shri R- R- MR. CHAIRMAN: Ayes—86; Noes— 198. Mukherjee, Shrimati Kanak AYES.—86 Advani, Shri Munusamy, Shri V. P. Lai K. Asthana, Shri K. B. Bagaitkar, Shri Muthu, Dr. (Shrimati) Sathiavahi Sadasiv Baleshwar Dayal, Shri Bhabhda, Naidu, Shri N. P, Chsngalraya Shri Harishanker Bhagat, Shri Ganapat Narendra Singh, Shri Hiralal Bhandari, Shri Sunder Singh Nigam, Shri Ladli Mohan Bhattacharjee, Prof. Scurendra Nizam-ud-D,in, Shri Syed. Bhattacharya, Shri G. C. Chakraborty, Shri Oza, Shri Ghanshyambhai Amarprosad Chatterjee, Shri Pranab Parbhu Singh, Shri Chaurasia, Shri Shivdayal Singh Dinesh Paril^i, Prof. Ramlal Singh, Shri Gupta, Shri Ram Lakhan Patel, Shri Manubhai Prasad Hegde, Shri Ramakrishna Jagbir Pathak, Shri Ananda Singh, Shri Jain, Shri Dharamchand Pattanayak, Shri Bhabari Charaa Jamuna Devi, Shrimati Janardhanam, Shri Poddar, Shri R. K. A. P. Jha, Shri Shiva Chandra Joshi, Shri Pradhan, Shri Patitpaban Jagannath Rao Joshi, Shri Jagdish Prem Manohar, Shri Kadershah, Shri M. Kakati, Shri Robin Raj an, Shri Pattiam Khan, Shri Ghayoor Ali Khobragade, Shri Rameshwar Singh, Shri Bhaurao Devaji Ray, Shri Rabi Krishna, Shri M. R. Razack, Shrimati Noorjehan Krishnan, Shri E. R. Reddy, Shri B. Satyanarayan Krishnan, Shri U. R. Reddy, Shri R. Narasimha Kunjachen, Shri P. K. Lakhan Singh, Shri Lakshmanan, Shri G. Lot ha, Shri Samad, Shri Golandaz Mohammedhu-sian Khyotno Mahanti, Shri Bhairab Chandra A. Mahavir, Dr. Bhai Majhi, Shri Dhaneswar Saring, Shri Leonard Soloman Sarup Mallick, Shri Harekrushna Maran, Shri Singh, Dr. Schamnad, Shri Hamid Ali Murasoli Mathur, Shri Jagdisn Prasad Menon, Shri Viswanatha Mishra, Shri Sezhiyan, Shri Era Shahi, Shri Kalraj Mohanty, Shri Surendra Mohinder Nageshwar Prasad Shanti Bhushan, Kaur, Shrirr.Eiti Shri Sharma, Shri Ajit Kumar Siddhu, Dr. M. M. S, Singh, Shri J. K. P. N. Singh, Shri Ng. Tompok Singh, Shri Shiva Nar.dan Sinha, Dr. Ramkripal Sujan Singh, Shri Surendra Mohan, Shri Swu, Shri Scato Tama, Shri Ratan Varma, Shri Mahadeo Prasat Venka, Shri V. Warjri, Shri Alexander 267 Constitution {Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 268

NOES—88 Kureel, Sri Piare Lall urf Piare LalL Talib Adivareloar, Shrimati Sushila Lokesh Chandra, Dr. Shankar Alva, Shrimati Margaret Amarjit Madhavm, Shri K. K. Kaur, Shrimati Amla, Shri Tirath Ram Anandam, Shri M. Anjiah, Shri T. Antulay, Mahapalro, Shri Lakshmana Shri A R. Arif, Shri Mohammed Usman Mahida, Shri Harisinh Bhagubava Balram Das, Shri Banerjee, Shri Jaharlal Bansi Makwana, Shri Yogendra Lai, Shri Barman, Shri Prasenjit Basavaraj, Manher, Shri Bhag-atram Shri H. R. Bhagwan Din, Shri Bhim Raj, Shri Bhola Prasad, Shri Bose, Shrimati Pratima Maurya Shri Buddha Priya Chandrasekher, Shrimati Maragatham Mehrotia, Shri Prakash Chattopadhyaya, Prof. D. P. Chaudhari, Shri Menon, Shrimati Leela Damodara. N. P. Das, Shri Bipinpal Deb Burman, Shri Bir Chandra Desai, Shri R. M Mishra, Shri Mahendra Mohan Deshmukh, Shri Bapuraoji Marotraoji Mittal, Shri Sat Paul Dhulap, Shri Krishnarao Narayan Dinesh Mondal, Shri Ahmad Hossain Chandra, Shri Swami Moopanar, Shri G. K. Dutt, Dr. V. P. Mukherjee, Shri Pranab Naidu, Shri Dwivedi, Shri Devendra Nath N. P. Chengalraya Gadgil, Shri Vithal Naik, Siri L. R. Goswami, Shri Dinesh Pande, :5hri Bishambhar Natb Goswami, Shri Sriman Prafulla Patil, Siri Deorao Rai, Gupta, Shri Bhupesh Shri Kalp Nath Gupta, Shri Gurudev Raju, Siri V. B Habibullah, Shrimati Hamida Ranga I'rof. N. G. Imam, Shrimati Aziza Rao, Shri V. C. Kesava Jha, Shri Kamalnath Ratan Kumari, Shrimati 'Joshi, Shri Krishna Nand Reddy, Shri K. V. Raghunatho Joshi, Shrimati Kumudben Manishan- Reddy, Shri Mulka Govinda ker Kalaniya, Shri Ibrahim Roshan Lai, Shri Kamble, Prof. N. M. Kameshwar Roy, Shri Kalyan Singh, Shri Kesri, Shri Sitaram Sahu, Siri Santosh Kumar Khan, Shri Khurshed Alam Khan, Saleem, Shri Mohammad Yunus Shri Maqsood Ali Khan, Shrimati SatchidE nanda, Shri Ushi Shahedtllah, Shri Syed Khaparde, Shrimati Saroj Sharma, Shri Anant Prasad Kumaran, Shri S. Sharma, Shri Kishan Lai Sharma, Shri Yogendra Shastri, Shri Bhola Paswan Singh, Shri Bhishma Narain Singh, Shrimati Pratibha Sinha, Shri indradeep Sisodia, Shri Sawaisingh Soni, Shrimati Ambika Sultan, Shrimati Maimoona Sultan Singh, Shri Totu, Shri Gian Chand Triloki Singh, Shri Tripath , Shri Kamlapati 269 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 270

Vaishampayen, Shri S K. Venigalla Council of Ministers to the Parliament Satyanarayana, Shri Venkatrao, Shri and the multiple political party Chadalavada Verma, Shri Shrikant Yadav, system'." Shri Ramanand Yadav, Shri Shyam Lai (The amendments also stood in the name of Shri Mulka Govinda Reddy) Zakaria, Dr. Rafiq MR. CHAIRMAN: Amendments Nos. The motion was not carried by a majority of 72, 85 and 88—not moved. the total membership of the House and by a majority of not less than two-thirds of the SHRI P. RAMAMURTI: Sir, I move: Members present and voting. 73. "That at page 13, line 17 after the word 'democratic' the words 'or Clause 45.—Amendment of article 368 federal' be inserted." SHRI B. N. BANERJEE; It appears that both (The amendment also stood in the \ names of the Congress Parties will turn down this clause. Shri Harkishan Singh Sur-jeet, Shri Therefore, what is the need of wasting the time Viswanatha Menon, Shri-mati Kanak •f the House by moving the amendments? Mauherjee, and Shri Murasoli Mar an) The SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: No, that we question was proposed SHRI DINESH cannot accept. GOSWAMI: Sir, 1 move: SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA RED-DY: Sir, 74. "That at page 13, line 17, before I move; the word 'secular' the words 'socialist or' be inserted." 71. "That at page 13, for lines 17 and 18, the following be substituted, namely: — (The amendment also stood in the names '(i) impairing the secular, demo of Shri Devendra Nath Dioiuedi and cratic or socialist character of the Shrimati Ambika Soni) Constitution or any of the objec 76. "That at page 13, after line 23, tives of the Preamble'." the following be inserted, namely: — 75. "That at page 13, for lines 19 and 20, '(iiia) compromising the egalitarian the following be substituted, namely: — character of this constitution; or'." SHRI '(ii) abridging or taking away the rights DEVENDRA NATH DWIVEDI: Sir, I of citizens under Part III, except right to move: practise any profession or to carry on any 77. "That at page 13, line 24, after the occupation, trade or business, occurring in word 'judiciary' the words 'and power of clause (g), of Article 19 for achieving any judicial review' be inserted." of the objectives mentioned in the Preamble or Directive Principles or for 78. "That at page 13, after line 25, the following be inserted, namely: — strengthening secular) democratic and socialist character of the Republic'." '(v) changing the Parliamentary 80. "That at page 13, after line 25, the system of Government; or following be inserted, namely: — (vi) changing the basis of Fed- '(v) altering the parliamentary system as eralism; or*. contained in the Constitution and th« responsibility of the (The amendments also stood in the name of Shrimati Ambika Soni) SHRI P. RAMAMURTI: Sir, I move: 79. "That at page 13, after line 25, the following be inserted, namely: — 271 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA) ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 272

[Shri P. Ramamurti] cordance with the other provisions '(v) altering or impairing or affecting of this article shall not be, called or abrogating the Parliamentary and :n question in any court'.' Republican system 01 Government under this Constitution; or . (vi) affecting or abrogating the I reserve my right to speak on my ameidment principle of collective responsibility of No. 87. the Council of Ministers to the House of The questions were proposed. the People; or'." SOI K. V. RAGHUNATHA REEDY; I (The amendment also stood in the names of fully appreciate the feelings of my colleagues Sh>ri Harkishan Singh Surjeet, Shri here. Viswanatha Menon and Shrimati Kanak Mukherjee.) Ml. 'CHAIRMAN; The reporters are not hearing anything. Order pleaie. They cannot SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Sir., I move: take down. Ord< r please. 81. "That at page 13, after line 25, the folowing be inserted, namely: — SHRI K. V. RAGHUNATHA REEDY: MR. Chairman, Sir, '(V) imparting or weakening in any (Interruption) If you do not want to hear my manner the Cabinet-ctim-Parliamentary speech I can stop—this clause goes to the basic system under this Constitution; or problem of the Indian Constitution and some of (vi) impairing or weakening the the basi: features of the Indian Constitution for principle of collective responsibility of the purpose of protecting a democratic the Council of Ministers to the House of institution and also not to allov any change in the People; or'." the objectives; mertioned in the preamble of the (The amendment also stood in the names Constitution and the parliamentary system and of Shri Kalyan Roy, Shri Bir Chandra Deb the Cabinet system sought in t le Preamble by Burman, Shri Bhola Prasad and Shri any Constitutional amendment. For that there Lakshmana Maha-patro.) must be some guarantee. And that guarantee ' can only be the people of India. MR. CHAIRMAN; Amendments Nos. 82 and 83—not moved. We have seen in recent years how the SHRI MURASOLI MARAN: Sir I move: Constitution has been amended, sometimes 84. "That at page 13,— rightly, sometimes wrongly, very often wrongly, and the only waj in which this (i) in line 40, after the word 'poll' the malpractice can be prevented is to go back to words 'in each State' be inserted; and the people of India as the Preamble itself (ii) in line 42, after the word 'poll' the says:— "We, THE PEOPLE OF INDIA words 'in each State' be inserted." HEREBY ADOPT, ENACT A ND GIVE SHRI B. N. BANERJEE; I am not moving TO OURSELVES THIS amendment No. 86. Sir, I move only CONSTITUTION." amendment No. 87. 1 not the Parliament that has given a 87. "That at page 14, after line 4, the Constitution, but it is the people of Ind a who following be inserted, namely— have given the Constitution to ;hemselves. And '(7) An amendment of the Canstitution if the people of Ind a are not supreme and if approved by the People of India at a sovereignty does not rest in the people of India referendum under clause (4) and made in what is the use of a Parliament and, therefore, ac- the Parliament can lot be accepted by the people. Therefore, ultimately, it is the people whl will have to decide in what mariner the basic features of the 273 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 274

Constitution have to be adopted. The Parliament SHRI P. RAMAMURTI: Sir, I do not want to cannot do so. Therefore, Sir, as an additional argue the question. I have argued enough... guarantee, apart from the provisions that are (Interruption) I have got a right t0 speak. I do contained in the Constitution, there are basic not want to argue this question. I have already matter- considered in the democratic talked about it yesterday. The only point that I institutions such as democratic processes, want to make is that it is a very unfortunate the character of the country's economy. The position that in the consultations which took Parliament itself js the creature of this place between the leaders of all the parties— at Constitution. If the Parliament has got the that time the Congress Party was a united right to dissolve itself, the Parliament has got the party; it was represented by Shri Kamlapati right to demolish itself within the Tripathi, by Mr. Chavan and Dr. Syed Ahmad. framework of the Constitution and the All the three of them were present—after a people would not .tolerate such a situation. good deal of discussion we persuaded them to If a mad person omes to power and wants to accept the position. And after having accepted demolish the political system and the they did not raise the question again. They Cabinet, the Government and the could have called a meeting and said that they responsibility of the Cabinet to this had no second thoughts. They never did such a Parliament and the very democratic thing. This is the way in which this party has institution called Parliament itself, in such a case behaved. Therefore, whether any trust cap. be if the Parliament becomes a captive Parliament placed in that party which does not honour its and becomes a victim of such a manipulation, own thing is a thing tc be considered. then the people of India alone can be a guarantee to save such a situation tinder (Interruptions) such circumstances. I do not suggest that for SHRI B. N. BANERJEE: Sir, my all the procedural matters the Parliament amendment is very simple. I have said that must go to the people. But on all basic when you are associating the people with the matters Parliament must go to the people for Constitutional amendment process, you have their sanction. Therefore, the sovereignty rests my support. But I insist on the amendment with the people and they must give the because my support is conditional on the sanction before a drastic change is made in acceptance of this amendment, namely, that an the Constitution. This will be additional amendment of the Constitution approved by guarantee so that any mad man does not run the people of India at a referendum and made amack as far as the Constitution is in accordance with the provisions cf the article concerned. Therefore, 1 whole-heartedly shall not be questioned in any court of law. Sir, support the refern-dum clause. I want our honesty to be tested, whether we consider the wisdom of the court superior to the wisdom of Parliament—and ratified by the It has been said that it is very difficult to State Legislatures and approved by the people, have referendum in this country. If a turbulent whom we are supposed to represent; and we country like Italy can have referendum in loudly say that the sovereignty rests with the certain matters ^md if the people can exercise people. Sir, I do not accept the statement o' the their vote and decide the iate of the Gov- Law Minister that this is implicit in the article. ernment and the Parhamnet ,it is impossible to . Sir, we are not fools. imagine, rather farcical to imagine, that the people of India cannot take a wise decision on matters concerning them in all basic matters regarding the Constitution.

275 Constitution (Fifty-fifth [RAJYA SABHA] (Amdt.9 Bill, 1978 276

changes have taken place suddenly— fromjthe Parliamentary system to the Presidential system. Here everybody knowk that there are people in the? Government who stand for the Presidential system. Mr. Charan Singh,. even! after becoming the Minister,, gave an interview and told that he preferred the presidential system. Mrs. j Chandrawati, the Janata Party leader, made a public statement that she ivants the presidential system. We want protection. We want Parliament-cum- Cabinet system to be protected, and also we want collective respo isibility of the Council of Ministers 0 the House of the People pro- tectee , SHSI MURASOLI MARAN: My amendment is to make the amendment process rigid by making every State to have a say in this process. Accoiding to my amendment, the referendum should have a majority in every one of the States. That means, a Muslim majority State like Jammu & Kashmir can repel an imposition of the religion of the majority of the Stated of India. In the same way, Sir, a State like Tamil Nadu can repel the

measures to impose Hindi language. That is SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA; Sir, I do not why, Sir, according to that principle, I want to wish to go into the details. The only thing give a veto power to evsry one of the States. is that, while supporting referendum, I want to Then only you dan clear the doubts and fears lay stress on the fact that the Cabinet- of the South Indians. cwm-Parliamentary system should also be covered under it. That is my amendment. SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI; Mr. And the principle of collective responsibility of Ramajmurti made a point regarding the sjtand the Council of Ministers to the House of taken by my party during the consultation. It is the People, ahould also be enshrined as one not a very health|y precedent to bring to the issue •on which referendum will have to be notice of the House the discussions that look sought. These are the two things. As far as the place outside. Mr. Chavan is no! a Member of other things are concerned, I do not wish to say this House. It is improper on his part to take much. I would not enter into any controversy. the name of Mr. Chavan. His party could have The only thing I can say is that the raised it in the other House; and Mr. Chavan referendum item was written by Shri Y. B. could have replied to the pointi. Chavan in his own hand-writing—those are So far as our party is concerned, this past things—to the Prime Minister at the meeting with the Opposition leaders. We question of referendum was discussed thought that we had come to an agreement. threadbare in the working committee, in the But people are liable to change their views. executive committee and in the general body, and then we w|ent with a proposal to the GOT- They changed their views. Let us take it as it is. But, Sir, I would like the Government to accept the Cabinet-cwm-Parliamentary system as a point of referendum like the question of secular and democratic character of the State. Sir, in Ceylon, 277 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 278: srnment asking it to delink the question of Part HI, except right to practise^ any referendum from this Bill, iind after delinking profession or to carry on any occupation, it, to bring a separate Bill, many of the trade or business, occurring in clause (g), of lacunae to which Members have expressed Article 19 for achieving any of the objectives their views. Therefore, Sir, I think, on behalf mentioned in the secular,, democratic and of my party I should set the record straight. I socialist character of the Republic'." have pointed out various lacunae. The Janata Party considers that if the secularism and the 80. "That at page i3, after line 25, the democratic characters are impaired, there following be inserted, namely: — should be a referendum, and if the socialist character is impaired, they are not for a *(v) altering the parliamentary system as referendum. My point is that the egalitarian contained in the Constitution and the character of the Constitution in the present responsibility of the Council of Ministers to context of the Indian economy, with 80 per the Parliament and the multiple political cent of the people living below the poverty party system'." line, the most important concept, the most im- The motions were negatived. portant criteria to ask for a referen- j dum, and the thing which should be safeguarded is that MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is: no Government can touch the egalitarian 73. "That at page i3, line 17, after character of the Constitution. Sir, we also have the word 'democratic' the words 'or technical difficulties. I am not going into the federal' b inserted." details. Mr. Shanti Bhushan knows that the e eminent jurist, Justice Mathews, has written The motion was negatived. an article in Hindi where he has shown the entire falacy oi the amendment Shri Shanti MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is: Bhushan has brought before the House. As 74. "That at page 13, line 17, be time does not permit; I «m not going for a fore the word 'secular' the wc\;ds detailed discussion on it. I thought that I 'socialist or be inserted." should say this to put the record straight. 76. "That at page 13, after line 23, SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN.- I have the following be inserted, namely: — nothing to say because I have already said enough so far as this question of '(iiia) compromising the egalitarian referendum is concerned, character of this Constitution; or'." MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is: The motions were negatived. MR. 71. "That at page 13, for lines 17 and CHAIRMAN: The question is: 18, the following be substituted, namely:— 77. "That at page 13, line 24, after the word "(i) impairing the secular, de- 'judiciary' the words 'and power of judicial mocratic or socialist character of the review' be inserted." Constitution or any of the objectives of the Preamble'." 78. "That at page 13, after line 25, the following be inserted, namely:— 75. "That at page 13, for lines 19 and 20, the following be substituted, '(v) changing the Parliamentary system of namely:— Government; or (vi) changing the basis or Federalism; '(ii) abridging or taking away tha 1 rights of citizen* under I or ." The motions were negatived. 279 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 280

MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is: accordance with the other pr ' visions of this article shall r be 79. "That at page 13, after line 25, the called in question in a: court' " following be inserted, namely: — Those in favour may please si "Aye". '(v) altering or impairing or affecting or abrogating the Parliamentary and SOME HON. MEMBERS; Aye. Republican system of Government under this Constitution; or MR. CHAIRMAN: Those ag^in may please gay "No". (vi) affecting or abrogating the SOME HON. MEMBERS: No. principle of collective responsibility 0f the Council of Ministers to the House of MR. CHAIRMAN; I think tl "Noes" have the People; or'" it... The motions were 7iegatived. SHRI B. N. BANERJEE: Tl 'Ayes" have MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is: it. I want a divisio Sir, even one Member is entitled 1 :all for a division and you will ha\ 81. "That at page 13, after line 25 the ;o order a division. Let me see ho many following be inserted, namely: — respect the judgment of tl people, how many '(v) imparing or weakening in any respect the wisdoi )f the people. And let it manner the Cabinet-aim-Parliamentary be recorder

system under this Constitution; or MR. CHAIRMAN; Mr. Banerje. now the (vi) impairing or weakening the slight difficulty is, th machine... principle of collective responsibility of SHRI B. N .BANERJEE: I kno^ it. I want the Council of Ministers t° the House of to have it recorded as t low many believe in the People; or'" the wisdom c the court in preference to the The motion was negatived. wishe cf the people. MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is: MR. CHAIRMAN: I will take voic \ote. 84. "That at page 13,— SHRI B. N. BANERJEE; I pres, f)r a division. You have to order i division under (i) in line 40, after the words 'poll' the the rules. words 'in each State' be inserted; and MR. CHAIRMAN: The only diffl calty is, (ii) in line 42, after the word •poll' the after two votings, we wil have to go to the words 'in each State' be inserted," Lobby and take al the trouble. Therefore, I am The motion was negatived. asking if I take voice vote, will you agree? MR. CHAIRMAN: Amendment No 87. SHRI B. N. BANERJEE; Sir, if the House Mr. Banerjee, are you press-ing it? wishes that there should be no division, as one who has served the H 3use for many years, I SHRI B. N. BANERJEE: Yes. would not press for it. MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is: The motion was negatived. 87. "That at page 14 after line 4, the 4 MR. CHAIRMAN: Now, the question is; following be inserted, namely: — '(7) An amendment of the Constitution "That clause 45 stand part of the . Bill". approved by the People of India at a referendum under clause (4) and made in 281 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 J Amdt.) Bill, 1978 282

The Rouse divided, Mallick, Shri Harekrushna MR. CHAIRMAN; Ayes—91; Ndes— Mar an, Shri Murasoli Mathur, Shri Jagdish Prasad AYES—91 dvani Shri Menon, Shri Viswanatha Lai K-sthana, Shri K. B. agaitkar, Shri Mishra, Shri Kalraj Sadasiv aleshwar Dayal, Shri tiabhda, Mohanty, Shri Surendra Shri Harishanker dagat, Shri Ganapat Mohinder Kaur, Shrimati Hirala^ handari, Shri Sunder Singh Morarka, Shri R. R. tiattacharjee, Prof. Sourendra Mukherjee, Shrimati Kanak nattacharya, Shri G. C. hola Prasad, Munusamy, Shri V. P. Shri hakraborty, Shri Amarprosad Naidu, Shri N. P. Chengalraya hatterjee, Shri Pranab haurasia, Shri Narendra Singh, Shri Shivdayal Singh eb Burman, Shri Bir Nigam, Shri Ladli Mohan Chandra inesh Singh, Shri upta, Shri Nizam-ud-Din, Shri Syed Bhupesh upta, Shri Ram Lakhan Muthu Dr. (Shrimati) Sathiavan Prasad egde, Shri Rarr.akrishna agbir Oza Shri Ghanshyambhai Singh, Shri amuna Devi, Shrimati 1a, Parbhu Singh, Shri Shri Shiva Chandra jshi, Shri Parikh, Prof. Ramlal Jagannath Rao Patel, Shri Manubhai ashi, Shri Jagdish Pathak, Shri Ananda akati, Shri Robin Pattanayak, Shri Bhabani Charan Poddar, Shri R. K. han, Shri Ghayoor Ali Pradhan, Shri Patitpaban Jian, Prof. Rasheeduddin Prem Manohar, Shri ihobragade, Shri Bhaurao Devaji Raj an, Shri Pattiam Irishna, Shri M. R. Ramamurti, Shri P. Irishman, Shri U. R. Rameshwar Singh, Shri [umaran, Shri S. Ray, Shri Rabi lunjachen, Shri P. K. Reddy, Shri B. Satyanarayan .akhan Singh, Shri Reddy, Shri K. V. Raghunatha akshmanan, Shri G. Samad, Shri Golandaz Mohammed- ,otha, Shri Khyomo husian A. Saring, Shri Leonard lahanti, Shri Bhairab Chandra Soloman Sarup Singh, Dr. Sezhiyan> lahapatro, Shri Lakshmana Shri Era Shahedullah, Shri Syed Shahi, lahavir, Dr. Bhai Shri Nageshwar Prasad Shanti Bhushan, Jajhi, Shri Dhanes^ar Shri Sharma, Shri Ajit Kumar Sharma, Shri Yogendra Siddhu, Dr. M. M. S. Singh, Shri J. K. P. N. 283 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 284

Singh, Shri Ng. Tompok Singh, Shri Joshi, Shrimati Kumudben Manishan-ker Shiva Nandan Sinha, Shri Indradeep Kalaniya, Shri Ibrahim Sinha, Dr. Ramkripal Sujan Singh, Shri Kamble, Prof. N. M. Surendra Mohan, Shri Surjeet, Shri Harkishan Singh Kameshwar Singh, Shri Swu, Shri Scato Kesri, Shri Sitaram Tame, Shri Ratan Khan, Shri Khurshed Alam Varma, Shri Mahadeo Prasad Khan, Shri Maqsood Ali Venka, Shri V. Khan, Shrimati Ushi Warjrij Shri Alexander Khaparde, Shrimati Saroj NOES—86 Kureel, Shri Piare Lall urf Piare Lai .Adivarekar, Shrimati Sushila Shankar Talib Lokesh Chandra, Dr. Madhavan, Shri .Alva, Shrimati Margaret K. K. Mahida, Shri Harisinh Bhagubava Amarjit Kaur, Shrimati Makwana, Shri Yogendra Manhar, Shri Bhapatram Maurya, Shri Buddha Priya Amla, Shri Tirath Ram Anandam, Shri M. Mehrotra, Shri Prakash Menon, Shrimati Anjiah, Shri T. Leela Damodara Mishra, Shri Mahendra Antulay, Shri A. R. Mohan Mittal, Shri Sat Paul Mondal, Shri Arii, Shri Mohammed Usman Ahmad Hossain Moopanar, Shri G. K. Balram Das, Shri Mukherjee, Shri Pranab Naik, Shri L. R. Banerjee, Shri Jaharlal Nanda, Shri Narasingha Prasad Pande, Barman, Shri Prasenjit Shri Bishambhar Nath Patil, Shri Deorao Basavaraj, Shri H. R. Rai, Shri Kalp Nath Raju, Shri V. B. Bhagwan Din, Shri Ranga, Prof. N. G. Rao, Shri V. C. Bhim Raj, Shri Kesava Ratan Kumari, Shrimati Reddy, Bose, Shrimati Pratima Shri Mulka Govinda Roshan Lai, Shri Chandrasekhar, Shrimati Maragatham Sahu, Shri Santosh Kumar Saleem, Shri Chattopadhyaya, Prof. D. P. Mohammad Yunus Satchidananda, Shri Das, Shri Bipinpal Sharma, Shri Anant Prasad Sharma, Shri Desai, Shri R. M. Kishan Lai Shastri, Shri Bhola Paswan Deshmukh, Shri Bapuraoji Marotraoji Singh, Shri Bhishma Narain Singh, Dhulap, Shri Krishnarao Narayan Shrimati Pratibha Dinesh Chandra, Shri Swami Dutt, Dr. V. P. Dwivedi, Shri Devendra Nath Gadgil, Shri Vithai Goswami, Shri Dinesh Goswami, Shri Sriman Prafulla Gupta, Shri Gurudev HabibuHah, Shrimati Hamida Imam, Shrimati Aziza Jha, Shri Kamalnath Joshi, Shri Krishna Nand 285 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 286

Sisodia, Shri Sawaisingh Soni, Shrimati 90."That at page 14, after line 19, the Ambika Sultan, Shrimati Maimoona following be inserted, namely:—

Sultan Singh, Shri Totu, Sri Gian Chand '(iia) for entry 3, the following entry hall be substituted, namely:— Triloki Singh, Shri Tripathi, Shri s Kamlapati Vaishampayen, Shri S. K. "3. Administration of justice; constitution and organisation of all courts Venigalla Satyanarayana, Shri except the Supremo Court and the High Venkatrao, Shri Chadalavada Yadav, Courts; Officers and servants of the High Shri Ramanand Yadav, Shri ShyHm Lai Courts; procedure in rent and revenue courts; fees taken in all courts except the Supreme Court.' " The motion was not carried by a majority of the total membership of the House and by a 95. "That at page 14, for lines 32 to 38, majority of not less than two-thirds of the the following be substituted, namely: — Members present and voting. '(i) entry 11A shall be omitted.'" MR. CHAIRMAN: We will now go to the (The amendments also stood in the names next clause Clause 46. There are no of Shri Harkishan Singh Surjeet, Shri amendments to this Clause. So we proceed to Vishwanatha Menon and Shrimati Kanak Clause 47. Mukherjee.) SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Sir, I move: Clause 47—Amendment of the Seventh 91. "That at page 14, lines 20 to 24 be Schedule deleted." (The amendments also stood in the names MR. CHAIRMAN: There are 11 amendments. Mr. Vaishampayen, are you of Shri Kalyan Roy, Shri Bir Chandra Deb moving your amendments, 89, 93 and 98? Burman, Shri Bhola Prasad, Shri Lakshmana Mahapatro, Shri Devendra Nath Dwivedi, SHRI S. K. VAISHAMPAYEN Shrimati Ambitalka Soni, Shrimati Leela (Maharashtra): No, Sir, I am no! moving Damo-dara Menon and Shri Jaharlal them. Banerjee.) SHRI JAHARLAL BANERJEE (West MR. CHAIRMAN: Amendment Nos. 92 Bengal): Sir, I move; and 96 in the name of Shri Pranab Mukherjee. These are negative amendments. Then, 99. "That at page 14, for line 42, the amendments Nos. 94 and 97 in the name of following be substituted, namely: — Mr. Dwivedi... '25. Education, including universities, subject to the provisions of entries 63, SHRI DEVENDRA NATH DWIVEDI; 64, 65 and 66 of List I; vocational and No, Sir, 1 am not moving them. technical training of labour.'"

MR. CHAIRMAN; Mr. P. Rama-murti, are (The amendments also stood in the names you moving your amendments? of Shri Devendra Nath Dwivedi, Shrimati Ambika Soni and Shrimati Leela Damodara SHRI P. RAMAMURTI: Sir, I Menon.) ™ove: SHRI SHANTl BHUSHAN; Sir, I move: 287 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 288

104. "That at page 14, lines 28, 29 and SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: They cannot be 30 be deleted." taken together. I want education to remain in the Concurrent List and I want forest in the 105. "That at page 14, lines 32 to 38 be State List. deleted." SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE: The questions were proposed. Amendments 92 and 96 are negative amendments. MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is: SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN; It is not 90. "That at page 14, after line 19, the merely confined to education and forest. following be inserted, namely:— There are other things such as deployment of police froce, army, etc. All these are in clause (iia)for entry 3, the following entry shall 47. You have to have your amendment voted. be substituted, namely:— SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE: "3. Administration of justice; Amendments 92 and 96 are to delete clause constitution and organisation of all courts 47. except the Supreme Court and the High Courts; Officers and servants of the High SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN; No. Courts; procedure in rent and revenue MR. CHAIRMAN: Shall I put 92 and 96 courts, fees taken in all courts except the together to vote? Supreme Court'".'". SHRI DINESH SINGH (Uttar Pradesh) : The motion was negatived. Voice vote will do.

MR. CHAIRMAN: The question i«: SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: What about 91? What you say is not clear. This is not a 95. "That at page 14, for lines 32 to 38, negative amendment. I do not want deletion of the following be substituted, namely: — the whole thing. Amendment 9l should be separately put to vote. You are confusing the (i) entry 11A shall be omitted'." whole thing. I do not know why this confusion. Clause 47 speaks of List 1 and List The motion was negatived. 9 P.M. II. All these things are there. We are not asking for the deletion of the entire clause. We SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA; On this are asking "Education, including universities, amendment I want division. I want education subject to the provisions of entries 63, 64, 65 to remain in the Concurrent List. and 66 of List I and entry 25 of List III" to be deleted. That particular clause should go. SHRI P. RAMAMURTI: The original amendment is that education should be taken SHRI B. N. BANERJEE: You have to put away from the Concurrent List. Therefore, Bhupesh Babu's amendment first and then Bhupesh can oppose it. Shri Pranab Mukherjee*s amendments. SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: In this clause, MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is; apart from education and forest, there are other changes also. So far as education and 91. "That at page 14 lines 20 to 24 be forest are concerned, if amendments 92 and 96 deleted." are taken together, that will serve the purpose. The motion was negatived.

SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE: My amendment No. 92 should be separately put to vote. 289 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 290

MR. CHAIRMAN: Now I put amendment MR. CHAIRMAN: Once again I am No. 92 of Mr. Pranab putting amendment No. 91 to vote.

Mukherjee to vote. The question is; The question is: 91. "That at page 14, lines 20 to 24 be 92. "That at page i4, lines 20 to 27 be deleted." deleted." The motion was negatived. The House divided. SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: It cannot be MR. CHAIRMAN: Ayes—13; Noes— done like that. I protest against it. 1 protest 156. against it because it deals with "Forests". I am prepared to vote for "Education" to be in the Concurrent List. But I am not prepared to vote AYES—13 Bhola Prasad, for "Forests" being in the Concurrent List. Shri Deb Burman Shri Bir Chandra Dhulap, Therefore, I have been suggesting that amendment No. 91 should be put to vote first Shri Krishnarao Narayan Gupta, Shri Bhupesh and separately. Khan, Prof. Rasheeduddin Kumaran; Shri S. Mahapatro, Shri Lakshmana Muthu, Dr. MR. CHAIRMAN: I have already put it to vote. (Shrimati) Sathiavani Ramamurti, Shri P. Reddy, Shri K. V. Raghunatha Sharma, Shri SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: You cannot do Yogendra Sinha, Shri Indradeep like that. You cannot just force me to accept something which I do not want "Forests" I Vai>hampayen, Shri S. K. wanted in the State List and I wanted NOES 156 Adivarekar, "Education" to be retained in the Concurrent List. I have been saying it again and again. I Shrimati Sushila Shankar Advani, Shri Lai do not know how you say that it should be K. Alvaj Shrimati Margaret Amarjit Kaur, together. You see the amendment; the lines Shrimati Amla, Shri Tirath Ram Anandam, are like that. I cannot understand this and we cannot vote for it. Shri M. Anjiah, Shri T. Antulay, Shri A. R. (Interruptions) Arif, Shri Mohammed Usman Asthana, Shri K. B. Baleshwar Dayal, Shri Balram Das, Shri SHRI P. RAMAMURTI: I think you want a Banerjee, Shri Jaharlal Barman, Shri Division on that, Mr. Bhupesh Gupta. But it has been put to vote. Prasenjit Basavaraj, Shri H. R. Bhabhda, Shri (Interruptions) Harishanker Bhagat, Shri Ganapat Hiralal Bhagwan Din, Shri SHRI DINESH SINGH: All that Mr. Bhupesh Gupta wants is a Division only.

SHRI P. RAMAMURTI; Sir, amendment No. 91 has been put to vote. But Mr. Bhupesh Gupta wants a Division.

SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Yes, I want a Division. SOME HON. MEMBERS: All right. 291 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 292

Bhandari, Shri Sunder Singh Khaparde, Shrimati Saroj Khobragade, Shri Bhattacharjee, Prof. Sourendra Bhaurao Devaji Krishna, Shri M. R. Bhattacharya, Shri G. C. Bhim Raj, Krishnan, Shri U. R. Kunjachen, Shri P. K. Shri Bose, Shrinati Pratima Kureel, Shri Piare Lall urf Piare Lall Chakraboity, Shri Amarprosad Talib Lakhan Singh, Shri Lakshmanan, Shri G. Chandrasekhar, Shrimati Maragatham Lokesh Chandra, Dr. Lotha, Shri Khyomo Chatterjef, Shri Pranab Chattopadhyaya, Madhavan, Shri K. K. Mahanti, Shri Prof. D. P. Das, Shri Bipinpal Bhairab Chandra Mahavir, Dr. Bhai Mahida, Desai, Sh.fi R. M. Bapuraoji Marotraoji Shri Harisinh Bhagubava Makwana, Shri Deshmukh, Shri Bapuraoji Marotraoji Yogendra Mallick, Shri Harekrushna Manhar, Dinesh Chandra, Shri Swami Shri Bhagatram Maran, Shri Murasoli Dinesh Singh, Shri Mathur, Shri Jagdish Prasad Maurya, Shri Buddha Priya Mehrotra, Shri Prakash Dutt, Dr. V. P. Menon, Shrimati Leela Damodara Menon, Dwivedi, Shri Devendra Nath Shri Viswanatha Mishra Shri Kalraj Mishra, Gadgil, Shri Vithal Shri Mahendra Mohan Mittal, Shri Sat Paul

Goswami, Shri Sriman prafulla Mohanty, Shri Surendra Mohinder Kaur, Gupta, Shri Gurudev Shrimati Mondal, Shri Ahmad Hossain Moopanar, Shri G. K. Morarka, Shri R. R. Gupta, Shri Ram Lakhan Prasad Mukherjee, Shrimati Kanak Mukherjee, Shri Habibullah, Shrimati Hamida Pranab Munusamy, Shri V. P. Naidu, Shri Hegde, Shri Ramakrishna N. P. Chengalraya N;ik, Shri L. R. Imam, Shrimati Aziza Nanda, Shri Narasingha Prasad Narendra Jagbir Singh, Shri Singh, Shri Nigam, Shri Ladli Mohan Jamuna Devi, Shrimati Nizam-ud-Din, Shri Syed Oza, Shri Jha, Shri Kamalnath Ghanshyambhai Parbhu Singh, Shri Jha, Shri Shiva Chandra Joshi, Shri Jagannath Rao Joshi, Shri Jagdish Joshi, Shri Krishna Nand Joshi, Shrimati Kumudben Manishan-ker. Kakati, Shri Robin Kalaniya, Shri Ibrahim Kamble, Prof. N. M. Kesri, Shri Sitaram Khan, Shri Ghayoor Ali Khan, Shri Khurshed Alam Khan Shri Maqsood Ali Khan, Shrimati Ushi 293 Constitution {Vorty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 294

Parikh, Prof Ramlal Sultan, Shrimati Maimoona Sultan Palel, Shri Manubhai Singh, Shri Surendra Mohan, Shri Pathak, Shri Ananda Surjeet, Shri Harkishan Singh Swu, Patil, Shri Deorao Shri Scato Tama, Shri Ratan Totu, Shri Pattanayak, Shri Bhabani Charan Gian Chand Triloki Singh, Shri Poddar, Shri R. K. Tripathi, Shri Kamlapati Varma, Shri Pradhan, Shri Patitpaban Mahadeo Prasad VenigalTa Satyanarayana, Shri Venka, Shri V. Prem Manohar, Shri Venkatrao, Shri Chadalavada Warjri, Rai, Shri Kalp Nath Shri Alexander Yadav, Shri Ramanand Rajan, Shri Pattiam Raju, Shri V. B. The motion was negatived. Rameshwar Singh, Shri MR. CHAIRMAN: I would like to draw Rao, Shri V. C. Kesava your attention to one thing. Ratan Kumari Shrimati Ray, Shri Rabi SHRI DINESH SINGH: Sir, there is one point now. There is one point in amendment No. 91. Reddy, Shri B. Satyanarayan According to that, "Education" would have Reddy, Shri R. Narasimha been in the Concurrent List. Now that it J has Roshan Lai. Shri been voted down, how can it be raised again in Sahu, Shri Santosh Kumar amendment No. 92? (Interruptions) 'Saleem, Shri Mohammad Yunus SHRI P. RAMAMURTI; I wish to point out Samad, Shri Golandaz Mohammed- that the House has already decided on it. husian A. (Interruptions'). The \ House has already decided that Education must be in the State Saring, Shri Leonard Soloman List. It has rejected the amendment. The House Sarup Singh, Dr. has decided it. Therefore, you cannot put it to Satchidananda, Shri vote again. You have to separate that. You cannot vote again on the question of Schamnad, Shri Hamid Ali "Education". You can separate "Forests" from Sezhiyan, Shri Era that and I can understand it. Shahedullah, Shri Syed (I?iterruptions) Shahi, Shri Nageshwar Prasad SHRI B. N. BANERJEE: Sir, let us put Shanti Bhushan, Shri Sfrarma, Shri our heads together. (Interruptions). Hon. Agit Kumar Sharma. Shri Anant Members of the Congress (I) have made a mistake. The only way he can recover from Prasad Sharma. Shri Kishan Lai that is to move at once for recession of the Shastri, Shri Bhola Paswan Sidhu, Dr. decision on the previous amendment and M.M.S. Singh, Shri Bhishma Narain even vote for Mr. Bhupesh Gupta's Singh, Shri J. K. P. N. Singh, Shri Ng. Tompok Singh, Shrimati Pratibha Singh, Shri Shiva Nandan Sinha. Dr. Ramkripal Soni, Shrimati Ambika Sujan Singh, Shri 295 Constitution (Forty-fijth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 296

[Shri B. N Banerjee] says: in List I—Union List, entry 2A ( shall be amendment and amend Mr. Pranab omitted. What is 2A? Entry 2A in the Union Mukherjee's clause by deleting reference to List reads thus: lines 21 to 24. That is the only way. "Deployment of any rmed force of the SHRI BIPINPAL DAS: Sir, we have a Union or any other force subject to the decided to vote against clause 47 as a whole. control of the Union or any contingent or (Interruptions) unit thereof in any State in aid of the civil power; powers, jurisdiction, privileges and SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE: We are liabilities of the members of such forces going to oppose clause 47 in toto. while on such deployment." (Interruptions)

MR. CHAIRMAN: May I know from the Now, let the hon. Members decide... honourable Members whether I can go to the clause itself instead of the amendments? SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE: We know it and in my speech I supported that the SOME HON. MEMBERS: Yes. Central Government should have this power.

SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Sir, I would SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Then that is like to submit that even though there might be different. But my amendments which I have a little embarrassment, etc., technically, the moved have to be taken into consideration. amendments which have been moved by Shri May I indicate what they are? Pranab Mukherjee can still be moved and still be put to vote because the amendments are SHRI ANANT PRASAD SHARMA: If more comprehensive. If one amendment is clause 47 is voted down, where is the question more comprehensive than the amendment of explaining your amendments? which has been negatived, it can be put to vote. The mere fact that one amendment has SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Before that been negatived does mean that it cannot be amendments to clause 47 have to be taken into done. It is not identical and it is of a different consideration first. These two amendments I nature. So, Sir, Mr. Mukherjee's amendments have moved for the reason because one of the can still be put to vote. That is my submission. clauses of the Bill has been turned down by (Interruptions) this House. That relates to clause 35 and clause 35 relates to Administrative Tribunals SHRI AN ANT PRASAD SHARMA: Put in Part XIVA of the Constitution. This is clause 47 to vote. sought to be deleted by this Bill. Now it (Interruptions) remains. Clause (1) of article 323A gives ex- clusive power to the Union t0 set up SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE: Sir, I am Administartive Tribunals in regard to services not pressing my amendment. I am requesting either of the Union or the States. If that is the Chair to put clause 47 to vote. retained, this consequential amendment is necessary because these Entries were SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Before the consistent with the amendment. Now this pro- hon. Members decide as to what they wtnt to vision is retained and this cannot be in the do, let me indicate the implications of the Concurrent List. By this article the power to total defeat of clause 47. For instance; set un administrative tribunals in regard to clause (a) services of the 297 Constitution {Vorty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 298

Union as well as the services of the State is clause 47 is voted down and Part XIV-A is exclusively assigned to the Union. I think the retained? Then we go to the entire position of hon. Members will now appreciate the the Forty-second Amendment. Therefore, if implications of the total defeat of clause 47. After Part XJV-A is retained and if clause 47 is / all, Constitutional Amendment is a serious voted down, then the proposition of conse- thing. It should not be that outside this House quential changes which you are contemplating people of this country have a feeling that would not arise. something has been done by this House which is not consistent. You can take any decision but SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: I won't pre- whatever decision you take, d it appropriately in 0 suppose. These amendments have to be put to the Constitution in a consistent manner, so that the vote first. provisions of the Constitution may not conflict with each other. Therefore, I would appeal to the hon. Members that in their excitement and SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE: That I know, but the anomaly which you emotion, they may not d0 something which may bring discredit to the House as a whole, contemplate will not arise because we will arrive exactly at the position which obtained which may make people say that this august body has made an amendment which does not make before these amending provisions were any sense, that one part is omitted and the other suggested because Part XIV-A remains. part is retained, something which is not consistent. SHRI ANANT PRASAD SHARMA: Therefore, clause 47 should be put to vote. SHRI A. R. ANTULAY: You should not have moved your amendments at all. SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: I am pressing SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Clause 35 was my amendments. Let them be put to vote. brought before us for deleting Part XIV-A. If part XIV-A had to he deleted, then certain amendments were also required in the entires SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: I suggest that Mr. Pranab Mukherjee, with your permission, because in that case this item could be put in can move his amendment. Whereas I have the Concurrent List and it was "being put in covered lines 20 to 24, he can cover now lines the Concurrent List, namely, that the 25 to 27. He can do that with your permission. administrative tribunals could be set up either by the States or the Union. Now that you have SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE: I have retained Part IV-A, which provides that these clearly explained my views. I am not going to administartive tribunals have to be created make any addition or only by the Union, whether they relate to the Amendment to it. services of the States or of the Union, then the entries must be consistent with the main body of the Constitutional provision. Therefore, the MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is: entries have to be rearranged. That is why a consequential amendment has to be moved. 99. " That at page 14, for line 42, the following be substituted namely.— SHRI PRANAB MUKHERJEE: \ would like t0 ask for one clarification Now, what '25. Education including universities, subject would be the position i to the provisions of entries 63, 64, 65 and 66 of List I; vicational and technical train- ing of labour.' "

The motion was negatived. 299 Constitution (Forty-fijth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 300

MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is: Majhi, ghri Dhaneswar 104. "That at page 14, lines 28, 29 Mallick, Shri Harekrushna and 30 be deleted." Maran, Shri Murasoli 105. "That at page 14, lines 32 to 38 be Mathur, Shri Jagdish Prasad deleted. Menon, Shri Viswanatha The House divided. Mishra, Shri KaTraj MR, CHAIRMAN; Ayes—88; Noes— Mohanty, Shri Surendra 84 Mohinder Kaur, Shrimati Ayes—88 Morarka. Shri R. R. Mukherjee, Shrimati Kanak Advani, Shri Lai K. Munusamy, Shri V. P. Asthana, Shri K. B. Muthu Dr. (Shrimati) Sathiavani: Bagaiikar, Shri Sadasiv Naidu, Shri N. P. Chengalraya Baleshwar Dayal, Shri Narendra Singh, Shri Bhabhda, Shri Harishanker Nigam, Shri Ladli Mohan Bhagat, Shri Ganapat Hiralal Nizam-ud-din, Shri Syed Bhandari, Shri Sunder Singh Oza, Shri Ghanshyambhai Bhattacharjee, Prof. Sourendra Prabhu Singh, Shri Bhattacharya, Shri G. C. Parikh, Prof. Ramlal Chakraborty, Shri Amarprosad Patel, Shri Manubhai Chatterjee, Shri Pranab Pathak, Shri Ananda Dinesh Singh, Shri Pattanayak, shri Bhabani Charani Gupta. Shri Ram Lakhan Prasad Poddar, Shri R. K. Hegcie, Shri Ramkrishna Pradhan, Shri Patitpaban Jagbir Singh, Shri Prem Manohar, Shri Jain, Shri Dharamchand Raj an, Shri Pattiam Jamuna Devi, Shrimati Ramamurti, Shri P- Janardhanam, Shri A. P. Rameshwar Singh, Shri Jha, Shri Shiva Chandra Ray, Shri R'abi Joshi, Shri Jaganath Rao Razack, Shrimati Noorjehan Joshi, Shri Jagdish Reddy, Shri B. Satyanarayan Kadershah, Shri M. Reddy, Shri R. Narasimha Kakati, Shri Robin Sahaya, Shri Dayanand Khan, Shri Ghayoor Ali Khobragade, Shri Bhaurao Devaji Samad, Shri Golandaz Mohammedhu- Krishna, Shri M. R. sian A. Krishnan, Shri E. R. Saring, Shri Leonard Soloman Krishnan, Shri U. R. Sarup Singh, Dr. Kunjaehen, Shri P. K. Sezhiyan, Shri Era Lakhan Singh, Shri Shahedullah, Shri Syed Lakshmanan, Shri G. Shahi. Shri Nageshwar Prasad Lotha, Shri Khyomo Shanti Bhushan, Shri Mahanti. Shri Bhairab Chandra Sharma Shri A jit Kumar Mahavir, Dr. Bhai Siddhu, Dr. M. M. S. 301 Constitution {Vorty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 302

Singh, Shri J. K. P. N. Singh, Shri Ng. Jha, Shri Kamalnath Joshi, Shri Krishna Nand

Tompok Singh, Shri Shiva Nandan Joshi, Shrimati Kumudben Manishan-ker sinha, Dr Ramkripal Sujan Singh, Shri Kalaniya, Shri Ibrahim Kamble, Prof. N. Surendra Mohan, Shri Surjeet, Shri M. Kameshwar Singh, shri Kesri, Shri Harkishan Singh 3wu, Shri Scato Tama, Sitaram Khan, Shri Khurshed Alam Khan, Shri Ratan V'arma, Shri Mahadeo Shri Maqsood AH Khan, shrimati Ushi Prasad ^enka, Shri V. Warjri, Shri Khaparde, Shrimati Saroj Kureel, Shri Piare Alexander Lall urf Piare Lall Talib

Lokesh Chandra, Dr. NOES—84 Madhavan, Shri K. K. Adivarekar, Shrimati Sushila Shankar Alva, Mahida, Shri Harisinh Bhaguba^ Shrimati Margaret Amarjit Kaur, Shrimati Makwana, Shri Yogendra Amla, Shri Tirath Ram Anandam, Shri M. Manhar, Shri Bhagatram Anjiah, Shri T. Antulay, Shri A. R. Arif, Shri Maurya, Shri Buddha Priya Mohammed Usman Balram Das, Shri Mehrotra, Shri Prakash Banerjee, Shri Jaharlal Barman, Shri Prasenjit Menon, Shrimati Leela Damodara- Basavaraj, Shri H. R. Bhagwan Din, Shri Mishra, Shri Mahendra Mohan

Bhim Raj, Shri Bose, Shrimati Pratima Mittal, Shri Sat Paul Chandrasekhar, Shrimati Maragatham Mondal, Shri Ahmad Hossain Chattopadhyaya, Prof. D. P. Das, Shri Moopanar, Shri G. K. Bipinpal Desai, Shri R. M. Mukherjee, Shri Pranab Deshmukh, Shri Bapuraoji Marotraoji Naik, Shri L. K. Dhulap, Shri Krishnarao Narayan Dinesh Nanda, Shri Narasingha Prasad Chandra, Shri Swami Dutt, Dr. V. P. Dwivedi, Pande, Shri Bishambhar Nath Shri Devendra Nath Gadgil, Shri Vithal Patil, Shri Deorao Goswami, Shri Dinesh Gupta, Shri Gurudev Rai, Shri Kalp Nath Habibullah, Shrimati Hamida Imam, Ranga, Prof. N. G. Shrimati Aziza Rao, Shri V. C. Kesava

Ratan Kumarij Shrimati Reddy, Shri Mulka Govinda R'oshan Lai, Shri Sahu, Shri Santosh Kumar Saleem, Shri Mohammad Yunus Satchidananda, Shri Sharma, Shri Anant Prasad Sharma, Shri Kishan Lai Shastri, Shri Bhola Paswan 303 Constitution (Forty-fijth [RAJYASABHA] 304

Amdt.) Bill, 1978 300 Joshi, Shri Jagannathrao

Singh, Shri Bhishma Narain Singh, Joshi, Shri Jagdish Shrimati Pratibha Sinha, Shri Indradeep Kadershah, Shri M. Sisodia, Sfcri Sawaisingh Soni, Shrimati Kakati, Shri Robin Ambilca Sultan, Shrimati Maimoona Sultan Singh. Shri Totu, Shri Gian Chand Khan, Shri Ghayoor Ali Tripathi, gfcri Kamlapati Vaishampayen, Khobragade, Shri Bhaurao Devaji Shri S. K. "Venigalla Satyanarayana, Krishna, Shri M. R. Shri Venkatrao, Shri Chadalavada Krishnan, Shri E. R. Yadav, Shri Ramanand Yadav, Shri Krishnan, Shri U. R. Syam Lai Kunjachen, Shri P. K. Lakhan Singh, Shri The motion wag adopted. Lakshmanan, Shri G. MR. CHAIRMAN: I now put amended clause 47 to vote. Lotha, Shri Khyomo The question is: Mahanti, Shri Bhairab Chandra "That clause 47, as amended, stand Mahavir, Dr. Bhai part of the Bill." Majhi, Shri Dhaneswar Mallick, Shri Harekrushna The House divided. Mr. Chairman: Ayes— Maran, Shri Murasoli 91; Noes—87 Mathur, Shri Jagdish Prasad AYES—91 Advani, Shri Lai K. Menon, Shri Viswanatha Asthana, Shri K. B. Bagaitkar, Shri Sadasiv Mishra, Shri Kalraj Baleshwar Dayal, Shri Bhabhda. Shri Mohanty, Shri Surendra Harishanker Bhagat, shri Ganapat Hiralal Mohinder Kaur, Shiimati Bhandari, Shri Sunder Singh Morarka, Shri R. R. Bhattacharjee, Prof. Sourendra Mukherjee, Shrimati Kanak (West Bhattacharya, Shri G. C. Chakraborty, Bengal) Shri Amarprosad Chatterjee, Shri Pranab Munusamy, Shri V. P. Dinesh Singh, Shri Gupta, Shri Bhupesh Muthu, Dr. (Shrimati) Sathiavani Gupta, Shri Ram Lakhan Prasad Hegde, Naidu, Shri N. P. Chengalraya Shri Ramakrishna Jagbir Singh, Shri Jain, Narendra Singh, Shri Shri Dharamchand Jamuna Devi, Shrimati Nigam, Shri Ladli Mohan Janardhanam, Shri A. P. Jha, shri Shiva Nizam-ud-din, Shri Syed Chandra Oza, Shri Ghanshyambhai Parbhu Singh, Shri Parikh, Prof. Ramlal Patel, Shri Manubhai Pathak, shri Ananda Pattanayak, Shri Bhabani Charan Poddar, Shri R. K. Pradhan, Shri Patitpaban Prem Manohar, Shri Raj an, Shri Pattiam Ramamurti, Shri P. 305 Constitution {Vorty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 306

R'ameshwar Singh, Shri Basavaraj, Shri H. R. Ray, Shri Rabi Bhagwan Din, Shri Razack, Shrimati Noorjehan Bhim Raj, Shri Reddy, Shri B. Satyanarayan Bose, Shrimati Pratima Reddy, Shri K. V. Raghunatha Chandrasekhar, Shrimati Maragatham Reddy, Shri R. Narasimha Chattopadhyaya, Prof. D. P. Sahaya, shri Dayanand Das, Shri Bipinpal Samad, Shri Golandaz Mohammedhu- Desai, Shri R. M. sian A. Saring, Shri Leonard Deshmukh, Shri Bapuraoji Marotraoji Soloman Samp Singh, Dr. Schamnad, Dhulap, Shri Krishnarao Narayan Shri Hamid AH Sezhiyan, Shri Era Dinesh Chandra, Shri Swami Shahedullah, Shri syed Shahi, Shri Dutt. Dr. V. P. Nageshwar Prasad Shanti Bhushan, Dwivsdi, Shri Devendra Nath Shri Sharrna, Shri Ajit Kumar Siddhu, Gadgil, Shri Vithal Dr. M. M. S. Singh, Shri J. K. P. N. Goswami, Shri Dinesh Singh, Shri Ng. Tompok Singh, Shri Goswami, Shri Sriman Prafulla Shiva Nandan Sinha, Dr. Ramkripal Gupta, Shrj Gurudev Sujan Singh, Shri Surendra Mohan, Shri HabibulTah, Shrimati Hamida Surjeet, Shri Harikrishan Singh Swu, Jha, Shri Kamalnath Shri scato Tama, Shri Ratan Joshi, Shri Krishna Nand Varma, Shri Mahadeo Prasad Joshi, Shrimati Kumudben Manishan-ker Venka, Shri V. Warjri, Shri Kalaniya, Shri Ibrahim Alexander Kamble. Prof, N. M. NOES—87 Adivarekar, Shrimati Sushila Kameshwar Singh, Shri Shankar Alva, Shrimati Margaret Amarjit Kesri, Shri Sitaram Kaur, Shrimati Amla, Shri Tirath Ram Khan, Shri Khurshed Alam Anandam, Shri M. Anjiah, Shri T. Antulay, Shri A. R. Arii, Shri Mohammed Usman Khan, Shri Maqsood Ali Balram Das, shri Banerjee, Shri Jaharlal Khan, Prof. Rasheeduddin Barman, Shri Prasenjit , Khan, Shrimati Ushi Khaparde, Shrimati Saroj

KureeJ, Shri Piare Lall urf Piare Lall Talib Lokesh Chandra, Dr. Madhavan, Shri K. K. Mahida, Shri Harisinh Bhagubava Makwana, Shri Yogendra Manhar, Shri Bhagatram Maurya, Shri Buddha Priya 307 Constitution (.Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Ainai.) am, i»«o 308

Mehrotra. Shri Prakash the House and by a majority of not less than two-thirds of the Members present and voting. Menon, Shrimati Leela Damodara MR. CHAIRMAN: Now we go to th next Mishra, Shri Mahendra Mohan Mittal, e clause 48. There is one amendment No. 100 Shri Sat Paul Mondal, Shri Ahmed by Shri P. Ramamurti. Hossain Moopanar, Shri G. K. SHRI P. RAMAMURTI: I am not moving. Mukherjee, Shri Pranab Naik, Shri L. R- Nanda, Shri Narasingha Prasad Pande, Clause .49—Amendment of the Constitution (Forty.second Amendment) Act 1976. Shri Bishambhar Nath Patil, Shri Deorao r MR. CHAIRMAN: Clause 49. There are Rai, Shri Kalp Nath Raju, Shri V. B. two amendments Nos. 101 by Shri V. B. Raju Kanga, Prof. N. G. Rao, Shri V. C. and 102 by Shri Bhupesh Gupta. Kesava Ratan Kumari, Shrimati Reddy, SHRI V. B. RAJU: Sir, I move : Shri Mufka Govinda Roshan Lai, Shri 101. "That at page 15, line 4, the Sahu, Shri Santosh Kumar Saleem, Shri figures '19 and 32' be deleted." Mohammad Yunus Satchidananda, Shri SHRI BHUPESH GUPTA: Sir, I move: Sharma, Shri Anant Prasad Sharma, Shri 102. "That at page 15, line 4, the Kishan Lai Sharma, Shri Yogendra figures '21 and 34' be deZeted." Shastri, Shri Bhola Paswan Singh, Shri (The amendment also stood in the names of Bhishma Narain Singh, Shrimati Shri Kalyan Roy, Shri Bir Chandra Deb Pratibha Sisodia, Shri Sawaisingh Soni, Burman, Shri Bhola Prasad and Shri Lakshmana Maha-ptro.) Shrimati Ambika Sultan, Shrimati The questions were put and the Maimoona Sultan Singh, Shri Totu, Shri motions were negatived. Gian Chand Triloki Singh, Shri Tripathi, MR. CHAIRMAN The question is: Shri Kamlapati Vaishampayen, Shri S. : K. Venigalla Satyanarayana, shri "That clause 6 stand part of the Bill." Venkatrao, Shri Chadalavada Yadav, The House divided. Shri Ramanand Yadav, Shri Shyam Lai MR. CHAIRMAN: Ayes—181; Noes— NiL The motion was not carried by a AYES—181 majority of the total membership of Adivarekar, Shrimati Sushila Shankar Advani, Shri Lai K. Alva, Shrimati Margaret Amarjit Kaur, Shrimati Amla, Shri Tirath Ram Anandam, Shri M. Anjiah, Shri T. Antulay, Shri A. R. 309 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 310

Arif, Shri Mohammad Usman Asthana, Shri K. Joshi, Shri Jagannathrao B. Bagaitkar, Shri Sadasiv Baleshwar Dayal, Joshi, Shri Jagdish Shri I'Balram Das, Shri Banerjee, Shri B. N. Joshi, Shri Krishna Nand Banerjee, Shri Jaharlal Barman, Shri Prasenjit Joshi, Shrimati Kumudben Mani- Basavaraj. Shri H. R. Bhabhda, Shri Harishanker shanker Bhagat, Shri Ganpat Hiralal Bhagwan Din, Shri Kadershah, Shri M. Bhandari, Shri Sunder Singh Bhattacharjee, Kakati, Shri Robin Prof. Sourendra Bhattacharya, Shri G. C. Bhola Kalaniya, Shri Ibrahim Prasad, Shri Bose, Shrimati Pratima Kamble, Prof. N. M. Chakravorty, Shri Amarprosad Cfrandrasekhar, Kameshwar Singh, Shri Shrimati Maragatham Chatterjee, Shri Pranab Kesri, Shri Sitaram Chattopadhyaya, Prof. D. P. Das, Shri Bipinpal Khan, Shri Ghayoor Ali Deb Burman, Shri Eir Chandra Desai, Shri R. Khan, Shri Khurshed Alam M. Khan, Shri Maqsood Ali Deshmukh, Shri Bapuraoji Marotraoji Khan, Prof. Rasheeduddin Dhulap, Shri Krishnarao Narayan Dinesh Khan, Shrimati Ushi Chandra, Shri Swami Dinesh Singh, Shri Khaparde, Shrimati Saroj Dutt, Dr. V. P. Khobragade, Shri Bhaurao Devaji Dwivedi, Shri Devendra Nath Gadgil, Krishna, Shri M. R. Shri Vithal Goswami, Shri Dinesh Krishnan, Shri E. R. Goswami, Shri Sriman Prafulla Gupta, Krishnan, Shri U. R. Shri Gurudev Gupta, Shri Ram Lakkhan Kumaran, Shri S. Prasad Habibullah, Shrimati Hamida Kunjachen, Shrj P. K. Hegde, Shri Ramakrishna Imam, Kureel, Shri Piare Lall urf Piare Lai! Talib Shrimati Aziza Jagbir Singh, Shri Jain, Lakhan Singh, Shri Shri Dharamchand Jamuna Devi, Lakshmanan, Shri G. Shrimati Janardhan Shri A. P. Jha, Shri Lokesh Chandra, Dr. Kamlanath Jha, Shri Shiva Chandra Lotha, Shri Khyomo Madhavan, Shri K. K Mahanti, Shri Bhairab Chandra Mahapatro, Shri Lakshmana Mahavir, Dr. Bhai Mahida, Shri Harisinh Bhagubava Majhi, Shri Dhaneswar Makwana, Shri Yogendra Mallick, Shri Harekrushna Manhar, Shri Bhagatram Maran, Shri Murasoli Mathur, Shri Jagdish Prasad Maurya, Shri Buddha Priya Mehrotra, Shri Prakash Menon, Shrimati Leela Damodara Menon, Shri Viswanatha 311 Constitution (.Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Ainai.) am, i»«o 312

Mishra, Shri Kalraj Reddy, Shri R. Narasimha MishFa, Shri Mahendra Mohan Roshan Lai, Shri Mittal, Shri Sat Paul Roy, Shri Kalyan Mohanty, Shri Surendra Sahaya, Shri Dayanarid Mohinder Kaur, Shrimati Sahu, Shri Santosh Kumar Mondal. Shri Ahmad Hossain Saleem, Shri Mohammad Yunus Moopanar, Shri G. K. Samad, Shri Golandaz Mohammedhu-sian Morarka, Shri R. R. A. Mukherjee, Shrimati Kanak Saring, Shri Leonard Soloman Mukherjee, Shri Pranab Sarup Singh, Dr. Satchidananda, Shri Munusamy, Shri V. P. Schamnad, Shri Himid Ali Muthu, Dr. (Shrimati) Sathiavani Naidu, Shri N. P. Chengalraya Sezhiyan, Shri Era Naik, Shri L. R. Shahedullah, Shri Syed Shahi, Shri Nageshwar Prasad Nanda, Shri Narasingha Prasad Shanti Bhushan, Shri Narendra Singh, Shri Nigam, Shri Ladli Mchan Sharma, Shri A jit Kumar Sharma, Shri Anant Prasad Nizam-ud-Din, Shri Syed Oza, Shri Ghanshyambhai Sharma, Shri Kishan Lai Sharma, Shri Yogendra Pande, Shri Bishambar Nath Prabhu Singh, Shri Shastri, Shri Bhola Paswan Siddhu, Dr. M. M. S. Parikh, Prof. Ramlal Patel, Shri Manubhni Singh, Shri Bhishma Narain Pathak, Shri Ananda Singh, Shri J. K. P. N. Patil, Shri Deorao Singh, Shri Ng. Tompok Singh, Shrimati Pratibha Pattanayak, Shri Bhabani Charan Poddar, Singh, Shri Shiva Nandan Shri R. K. Pradhan, Shri Patitpaban Prem Sinha, Shri Indradeep Manohar, Shri Rai. Shri Kalp Nath Raj Sinha, Dr. Ramkripal an, Shri Pattiam Soni, Shrimati Ambika Raju, Shri V. B. Sujan Singh, Shri Rameshwar Singh, Shri Sultan, Shrimati Maimoona

Ranga, Prof. N. G. Sultan Singh, Shri Surendra Mohan, Shri Rao, Shri V. C. Kesava Ratan Surjeet, Shri Harikishan Singh Kumari, Shrimati Swu, Shri Scato Ray, Shri Rabi Tama, Shri Ratan Razack, Shrimati Noorjehan Totu, Shri Gian Chand Reddy, Shri B. Satyanarayan Trilok Singh, Shri Tripathi, Shri Kamlapati Reddy, Shri K. V. Raghunatha Reddy, Shfrj Mulka Govinda Vaishampayen, Shri S K. Varma, Shri Mahadeo Prasad Venigalla Satyanarayana, Shri 313 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 314

Venka, Shri V. Venkatrao, Shri MR. CHAIRMAN : We can coffiid-r clause 34 just now and then we will put all the clauses Chadalavada Warjri, Shri Alexander together. Yadav, Shri Ramanand Clause 34:—Insertwn of new Chapter IV in NOES—Nil. Part XII. The motion was carried by a majority of SHRI V. B. RAJU: Sir, I move: the total membership of the House and by a majority of not less than two-thirds of the 37. "That at page 8, for lines 23 Members present and voting. and 24, the following be substituted,. namely: — Clause 6 was added to the Bill. '300A. (1) N0 person shall be deprived SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: May I have of his property save by authority of law. your permission to move a consequential amendment? Now that Article 31 has been (2) No property shall be com-pulsorily acquired or requisitioned save for a public deleted by adoption of clause 6, reference t0 Article 31 in Article 31C is inappropriate. purpose and save by authority of a law Therefore, I am moving amendment No. 103: which provides for acquisition or requisition ing of the property for an. 103. "That at p*ge 3 after line 4, the amount which may be fixed by such law or following new clause be inserted) namely: which may be determined in accordance — with such principles and given in such manner as may be specified in such law; '7A. I Article 31C in th Constitution for n e and no such law shall be called in question the words and figures | "Article 14, Article in any court on the ground that the amount 19 or Article 31" the words and figures so fixed or determined is not adequate or "Article 14 or 19" shall b substituted'." e that the whole or any part of such amount SHRI B. N. BANERJEE : On a point of is to be given otherwise than in cash.' " order, Sir. I am not opposing that amendment, the new clause proposed by the SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: Sir, I move : Law Minister, but this is not the stage. You 38. "That at page 8, line 23, article have got to adopt all other clause and then 300A be renumbered as clause (1) the new clause can be taken. That is the thereof and after clause (1) as so- practice. renumbered, the following be in SHRI K. K. MADHAVAN: The hon. Law serted, namely:— Minister has presented a consequential 'Provided that notwithstanding anything amendment No. 103. I may point out that an contained in Part III of the Constitution, if amendment like this has to apply to Article any property is com-pulsorily acquired or 31A also because there is a mention there requisitioned for an amount fixed by law on also. which may be determined in accordance with MR. CHAIRMAN: May I now put to vote such principles and given in such manner as clauses 2, 4, 5, 7, 7A, 10 to 34, , 36, 37, 40 to may be prescribed in such law; no such law 43, 46, 48, 49, Clause 1, the Enacting Formula shall be called in question in any court on the and the Title. ground that the amount so fixed or determined is not adequate or that the whole SHRI DINESH GOSWAMI: So far as clause or any part of such amount is to be given 34 is concerned, there are two amendments. otherwise You have to consider ; them. After clause 31 you did not consider because clause 31 was not amended.

315 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 316 than in cash or that such law is voict Bhabhda, Shri Hanshanker Bhagat, Shri on the ground that it is inconsistent Ganpat Hiralal Bhagwan Din, Shri Bhandari, with or takes away or abridges any Shri Sunder Singh Bhattacharjee, Prof. of the rights conferred by Article 14, or Article 19(1) (g). Sourendra Bhattacharya, Shri G C. Bhim Raj, Shri Bhola Prasad, Shri Bose, Shrimati (2) No such law as is referred to in clause 300A(1) made by a legislature of a Pratima Chakraborty, Shri Amarprosad State shall have effect unless such law, Chandrasekhar, Shrimati Maragatham having been reserved for the consideration of the President has received his assent.'" Chatterjee, Shri Pranab Chattopadhyaya, Prcf. D. P. (The amendment also stood in the names of Das, Shri Bipinpal Shri Devendra Nath Dwivedi and Shri Narasingha Prasad Nandu). Deb Burman, Shri Bir Chandra Desai, Shri R. M. The questions were rmt and the motions Deshmukh, Shrj Bapuraoji Marotraoji were negatived. Dhulap, Shri Krishnarao Narayan MR. CHAIRMAN : I now put all the clauses Dinesh Chandra, Shri Swami to vote. The question is: Dinesh Singh, Shri Dutt, Dr. V. P. "That Clauses 2, 4, 5, 7, 7A, 10 to 34, 36, Dwivedi, Shri Devendra Nath 37, 40 to 43, 46, 48, 49, Clause 1, the Enacting Formula and the Title stand part Gadgil, Shri Vithal of the Bill." Goswami, Shrj Dinesh The House divided. Goswami, Shri Sriman Prafulla Gupta, Shri Bhupesh MR. CHAIRMAN: Ayes—185; Noes-Nil Gupta, Shri Gurudev AYES—185 Gupta, Shri Ram Lakhan Prasad Adivarekar, Shrimati Sushila Shankar Shankar Habibullah, Shrimati Hamida Advani, Shri Lai K. Alva, Shrimati Hegde, Shri Ramakrishna Margaret Amarjit Kaur, Shrimati Imam, Shrimati Aziza Amla, Shri Tirath Ram Anandam, Jagbir Singh, Shri Shri M. Anjiah, Shri T. Antulay, Shri Jain, Shri Dharamchand A. R. Arif, Shri Mohammed Usman Jamuna Devi, Shrimati Asthana, Shri K. B. Bagaitkur, Shri Janardhan Shri A. P. Sadasiv Baleshwar Dayal, Shri Jha, Shri Kamlanath Balra.n Das, Shri Ban 2rje.fi, Shri B. Jha, Shri Shiva Chandra N. Bansrje,e, Shri Jaharlal Barman, Joshi, Shri Jagannathrao Shri Prasenjit Basavaiaj, Shri H. R Joshi, Shri Jagdish Joshi, Shri Krishna Nand Joshi, Shrimati Kumudben Manishan-kar Kadershah, Shri M. 317 Constitution {Forty-fijth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 318

Kakati, Shri Robin Mondal, Shri Ahmad Hossain Kalaniya, Shri Ibrahim Moopanar, Shri G. K Kamble, Prof. N. M. Morarka, Shri R. R. Mukherjee, Shrimaii Kanak Kameshwar Singh, Shri Mukherjee, Shri Pranab Munusamy, Shri V. P. Kesri, Shri Sitaram Muthu, Dr. (Shrimati) Sathiavani Naidu, Khan, Shri Ghayoor Ali Shri N. P. Chengalraya. Naik, Shri L. R. Khan, Shri Khurshad Alam Nanda, Shri Narasingha Prasad Narendra Khan, Shri Maqsood Ali Singh, Shri Nigam, Shri Ladli Mohan Nizam- Khan, Prof. Rasheeduddin ud-Din, Shri Syed Oza, Shri Ghanshyambhai Khan, Shrimati Ushi Pande, Shri Bishambar Nath Parbhu Singh, Khaparde, Shrimati Saroj Shri Parikh, Prof. Ramlal Patel, Shri Khobragade, Shri Bhaurao Devaji Manubhai Pathak, Shri Ananda Patil, Shri Krishna, Shri M. R. Deorao Pattanayak, Shri Bhabani Charan Krishnan, Shri E. R. Poddar, Shri R. K. Pradhan, Shri Patitpaban Krishnan, Shri U. R. Prem Manohar, Shri Rai, Shri Kalp Nath Kumaran, Shri S. Rajan, Shri Pattiam Raju, Shri V. B. Kunjachen, Shri P. K. Ramamurti, Shri P. Rameshwar Singh, Shri Kureel, Shri Piare Lall urf Piare Lall Talib Ranga, Prof. N. G. Rao, Shri V. C. Kesava Lakhan Singh, Shri Lakshmanan, Shri G. Ratan Kumari, Shrimati Ray, Shri Rabi Lokesh Chandra, Dr. Lotha, Shri Razack, Shrimati Noorjehan Reddy, Shri B. Khyomo Madhavan, Shri K. K Mahanti, Satyanarayan Reddy, Shri K. V. Raghunatha Shri Bhairab Chandra Mahapatro, Shri Reddy, Shri Mulka Govinda Roshan Lai, Shri Lakshmana Mahavir, Dr. Bhai Mahida, Roy, Shri Kalyan Sahaya, Shri Dayanand Shri Harisinh Bhagubava Majhi, Shri Sahu, Shri Santosh Kumar Saleem, Shri Dhaneswa Makwana, Shri Yogendra r Mohammad Yunus Samad, Shri Golandaz Mallick, Shri Harekrushna Manhar, Shri Mohammedhu-sian A. Bhagatram Maran, Shri Murasoli Mathur, Shri Jagdish Prasad Maurya, Shri Buddha Priya Mehrotra, Shri Prakash Menon, Shrimati Leela Damodara Menon, Shri Viswanatha Mishra, Shri Kalraj Mishra, Shri Mahendra Mohan Mittal, Shri Sat Paul Mohanty, Shri Surendra Mohinder Kaur, Shrimati 319 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 320

Saring, Shri Leonard Soloman Clause 2, 4, 5, 7, 7A, 10 to 34, 36y 37, 40 to Sarup Singh, Dr. 43, 46, 48, 49, Cloture 1, the Enacting Formula and the Title were added to the Bill. Satchidananda, Shri Schamnad, Shri Hamid Ali SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Sir I move: Sezhiyan, Shri Era "That the Bill, as amended, be Shaheduilah, Shri Syed passed." Shahi, Shri Nageshwar Prasad The question was proposed. Shanti Bhushan, Shri Sharma, Shri Ajit Kumar MR. CHAIRMAN: I hope nobody is trying Sharma, Shri Anant Prasad to speak on the third reading. Without Sharma, Shri Kishan Lai speeches if you can finish, we can go for dinner. Sharma, Shri Yogendra Shastri, Shri Bhola Paswan SHRI SHANTI BHUSHAN: Sir, I am very grateful to the hon. Members and I thank them Siddhu, Dr. M. M. S. profusely and I commend that the Bill, as Singh, Shri Bhishma Narain amended, be passed. Singh, Shri J. K. P. N. MR. CHAIRMAN: The question is: Singh, Shri Ng. Tompok Singh, Shrimati Pratibha "That the Bill, as amended, be passed." Singh, Shri Shiva Nandan Sinha, Shri Indradeep The House divided. Sinha, Dr. Ramkripal MR. CHAIRMAN: Ayes—182 Sisodia, Shri Sawaisingh Noes—1 Soni, Shrimati Ambika Sujan Singh, Shri AYES—182 Sultan, Shrimati Maimoona

Sultan Singh, Shri Adivarekar, Shrimati Sushila Shankar Surendra Mohan, Shri Advani, Shri Lai K. Surjeet, Shri Harkisaan Singh Alva, Shrimati Margaret Swu, Shri Scato Amarjit Kaur, Shrimati

Tama, Shri Ratan Amla, Shri Tirath Ram Totu, Shri Gian Chand Anandam, Shri M. Triloki Singh, Shri Tripathi, Shri Anjiah, Shri T. Kamlapati Vaishampayen, Shri S. K. Antulay, Shri A. R. Varma, Shri Mahadoo Prasad Venigalla Satyanarayanaj Shri Arif, Shri Mohammed Usman Venka, Shri V. Venkatrao, Shri Asthana, Shri K. B. Chadalavada Warjri, Shri Alexander Bagaitkar, Shri Sadasiv Yadav, Shri Ramanand Yadav, Shri Baleshwar Dayal i Shyamlal Balram Das, Shri NOES—Nil The motion was carried by a majo. rity of the total Banerjee, Shri B. N. membership of the House a,id by a majority of Banerjee, Shri Jaharlal not less than two-thirds of the Members pre- Bansi Lai, Shri sent and voting. Barman, Shri Prasenjit 321 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 322

Basavaraj, Shri H. R. Bhabhda, Shri Kakati, Shri Robin Harishanker Bhagat, Shri Ganapat Kalaniya, Shri Ibrahim Hiralal Bhagwan Din, Shri Bhandari, Kamble, Prof. N. M. Shri Sunder Singh Bhattacharjee, Prof. Kameshwar Singh, Shri Sourendra Bhattacharya, Shri G. C. Bhola Kesri, Shri Sitaram Prasad, Shri Bose, Shrimati Pratima Khan, Shri Ghayoor Ali Chakraborty, Shri Amarprosad Khan, Shri Khurshed Alam Khan, Shri Maqsood Ali Chatterjee, Shri Pranab Chattopadhyaya, Khan, Prof. Rasheeduddin Prof. D. P. Chaurasia, Shri Shivdayal Khan, Shrimati Ushi Singh Das, Shri Bipinpal Deb Burman, Khaparde, Shrimati Saroj Shri Bir Chandra Desai, Shri R. M. Khobragade, Shri Bhaurao Devaji j Deshmukh, Shri Bapuraoji Marotraoji Dhulap, Krishna, Shri M. R. ! Krishnan, Shri E. Shri Krishnarao Narayan Dinesh Chandra, Shri R. Krishnan, Shri U. R. Swami Dinesh Singh, Shri Dutt, Dr. V. P. Kumaran, Shri S. Dwivedi, Shri Devendra Nath Gadgil, Shri Kunjachen, Shri P. K. Vithal Goswami, Shri Dinesh Kureel, Shri Piare Le.U urf Piare I. all Goswami, Shri Sriman Prafulla Talib Gupta, Shri Bhupesh Lakhan Singh, Shri Lakshmanan, Shri G. Gupta, Shri Gurudev Lokesh Chandra, Dr. Lotha, Shri Khyomo Gupta, Shri Ram Lakhan Prasad Madhavan, Shri K. K. Mahanti, Shri Habibullah, Shrimati Hamila Bhairab Chandra Mahapatro, Shri Hegde, Shri Ramakrishna Lakshmana Mahavir, Dr. Bhai Mahida, Imam, Shrimati Aziza Shri Harisinh Bhagubava Majhi, Shri Jagbir Singh, Shri Dhaneswar \ Makwana, Shri Yogendra Jain, Shri Dharamchand Maliick, Shri Harekrushna Manhar, Shri Jamuna Devi, Shrimati Bhagatram Maran, Shri Murasoli Mathur, Janardhanam, Shri A. P. Shri Jagdish Prasad Maurya, Shri Buddha Jha, Shri Kamalnath Priya Mehrotra, Shri Prakash Menon, Jha, Shri Shiva Chandra Shrimati Leela Damodara Menon, Shri Joshi, Shri Jagannathrao Viswanatha Mishra, Shri Kalraj Mishra, Joshi, Shri Jagdish Shri Mahendra Mohan Mohanty, Shri Joshi, Shri Krishna Nand Surendra Mohinder Kaur, Shrimati Joshi, Shrimati Kumudben Manishan- ker Kadershah, Shri M. Mondal, Shri Ahmad Hossain 323 Constitution (Forty-fifth [ RAJYA SABHA ] Amdt.) Bill, 1978 324

Moopanar, Shri G. K. Saring, Shri Leonard Soloman Sarup Morarka, Shri R. R. Singh, Dr. Satchidananda, Shri Mukherjee, Shrimati Kanak Sezhiyan, Shri Era Shahedullah, Shri Mukherjee, Shri Pranab Syed Shahi, Shri Nageshwar Prasad Munusamy, Shri V. P. Shanti Bhushan, Shri Sharma, Shri Muthu, Dr. (Shrimati) Sathiavani Ajit Kumar Sharma, Shri Anant Naidu, Shri N. P. Chengalraya Prasad Sharma, Shri Kishan Lai Naik, Shri L. R. Sharma, Shri Yogendra Shastri, Nanda, Shri Narasingha Prasad Shri Bhola Paswan Siddhu, Dr. M. Narendra Singh, Shri M. S. Singh, Shri Bhishma Narain Nigam, Shri Ladli Mohan Singh, Shri J. K. ?. N. Singh, Shri Nizam-ud-Din, Shri Syed Ng. Tompok Singh, Shrimati Oza, Shri Ghanshyambhai Pratibha Singh, Shri Shiva N and an Pande, Shri Bishambhar Nath Sinha, Shri Indradeep Sinha, Dr. Parbhu Singh, Shri Ramkripal Sisodia, Shri Sawaisingh Parikh, Prof. Ramlal Soni, Shrimati Ambika Sujan Singh, Patel, Shri Manubhai Shri Sultan, Shrimati Maimoona Pathak, Shri Ananda Sultan Singh, Shri Surendra Mohan, Patil, Shri Deorao Shri Surjeet, Shri Harkishan Singh Pattanayak, Shri Bhabani Charan Swu, Shri Scato Poddar, Shri R. K. Toma, Shri Ratan Totu, Shri Gian Pradhan, Shri Patitpaban Chand Triloki Singh, Shri Tripathi, Prem Manohar, Shri Shri Kamlapati Vaishampayen, Shri Rai, Shri Kalp Nath Rajan, Shri Pattiam S. K. Varma, Shri Mahadeo Prasad Raju, Shri V. B. Venigalla Satyanarayana, Shri Ramamurti, Shri P. Venka, Shri V. Venkatrao, Shri Rameshwar Singh, Shri Chadalavada Warjri, Shri Alexander Ranga, Prof. G. Yadav, Shri Ramanand Yadav, Shri Ray, Shri Rabi Shyam Lai Razack, Shrimati Noorjehan Reddy, Shri B. Satyanarayin Reddy, Shri K. V. Raghunatha Reddy, Shri Mulka Govinda Reddy, Shri R. Narasimha Roshan Lai, Shri Roy, Shri Kalyan Sahaya, Shri Dayanand Sahu, Shri Santosh Kumar Saleem, Shri Mohammad Yunus Samad, Shri Golandaz Mohammedhu-sian A. 325 Messages fro?n [ 31 AUG. 1978 ] Lok Sabha 326

NOES—1 (II) 1 Rao, Shri V C. Kesava "I am directed to inform Rajya Sabha that The motion was curried by a majority of Lok Sabha, at its sitting held on Thursday, the the total membership of the House and by a 31st August, 1978, has adopted the enclosed majority of not less than two-thirds of the motion concurring in the recommendation of Members pre. sent and voting. Rajya Sabha that Lok Sabha do join in the Joint Committee of the Houses on the Visva- Bharati (Amendment) Bill, 1978. The names MESSAGES FROM THE LOK SABHA (I) of the members nominated by Lok Sabha to

The Press Council Bill, 1978 \ serve on the said Joint Committee are set out in the motion. (II) The Visva-Bharati (Amendment) Bill, 1978 MOTION 'That this House do concur in the (ni) The industrial Relations Bill, 1978 recommendation of Rajya Sabha that the House do join in the Joint Committee of the (IV) The Hospitals and Educational Houses on the Bill further to amend the Visva- Institutions (Conditions of Bharati Act, 1951, made in the motion Service of Employees and Set- adopted by Rajya Sabha at its sitting held on tlement of Employment Dispu- the 25th July, 1978 and communicated to this tes) Bill, 1978 House on the 27th July, 1973 and do resolve that the following 22 members of Lok Sabha (V) The Employment Security and be nominated to serve on the said Joint Miscellaneous Committee, namely:— Provisio (1) Shrimati Renuka Devi Bar-kataki ns (Managerial Employees) Bill, 1978. (2) Shri Bedabrata Barua (3) Shri Tridib Chaudhuri [The Vice-Chairman (Shri Shy am Lai (4) Shri Dhirendranath Basu Yadav) in the Chair.] (5) Shri Rudolph Rodrigues (6) Shri C. K. Chandrappan SECRETARY-GENERAL: Sir, I have to (7) Shri Ajitsinh Dabhi report to the House the following messages (8) Shri Raj Krishna Dawn received from the Lok Sabha, signed by the (9) Shri V. Kishore Chandra S. Deo Secretary of the Lok Sabha: — (10) Shri R. D. Gattani (I) (11) Shri Samar Guha (12) Shri V. G. Hande "In accordance with the provisions of (13) Shri Nirmal Chandra Jain (14) Shrimati Rule 120 of the Rules of Procedure and Conduct of Business in Lok Sabha, I am Mohsina Kidwai directed to inform you that Lok Sabha, at its sitting held on the 31st August, (15) Dr. (Shrimati), Sarojini Mahishi 1978, agreed without any amendment to (16) Shri P. Rajagopal Naidu the Press Council Bill, 1978, which was passed by Rajya Sabha at its sitting held (17) Shri K. A. Raju on the 7th August, 1978." (18) Shri Ramjiwan Singh