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JOINT REVIEW PANEL FOR THE ENBRIDGE NORTHERN GATEWAY PROJECT COMMISSION D’EXAMEN CONJOINT DU PROJET ENBRIDGE NORTHERN GATEWAY Hearing Order OH-4-2011 Ordonnance d’audience OH-4-2011 Northern Gateway Pipelines Inc. Enbridge Northern Gateway Project Application of 27 May 2010 Demande de Northern Gateway Pipelines Inc. du 27 mai 2010 relative au projet Enbridge Northern Gateway VOLUME 63 Hearing held at Audience tenue à Sowchea Elementary School 2649 Sowchea Bay Road Fort St. James, British Columbia July 19, 2012 Le 19 juillet 2012 International Reporting Inc. Ottawa, Ontario (613) 748-6043 © Her Majesty the Queen in Right of Canada 2012 © Sa Majesté du Chef du Canada 2012 as represented by the Minister of the Environment représentée par le Ministre de l’Environnement et and the National Energy Board l’Office national de l’énergie This publication is the recorded verbatim transcript Cette publication est un compte rendu textuel des and, as such, is taped and transcribed in either of the délibérations et, en tant que tel, est enregistrée et official languages, depending on the languages transcrite dans l’une ou l’autre des deux langues spoken by the participant at the public hearing. officielles, compte tenu de la langue utilisée par le participant à l’audience publique. Printed in Canada Imprimé au Canada HEARING /AUDIENCE OH-4-2011 IN THE MATTER OF an application filed by the Northern Gateway Pipelines Limited Partnership for a Certificate of Public Convenience and Necessity pursuant to section 52 of the National Energy Board Act, for authorization to construct and operate the Enbridge Northern Gateway Project. HEARING LOCATION/LIEU DE L'AUDIENCE Hearing held in Fort St. James (British Columbia), Thursday, July 19, 2012 Audience tenue à Fort St. James (Colombie-Britannique), jeudi, le 19 juillet 2012 JOINT REVIEW PANEL/LA COMMISSION D’EXAMEN CONJOINT S. Leggett Chairperson/Présidente K. Bateman Member/Membre H. Matthews Member/Membre Transcript Hearing Order OH-4-2011 ORAL STATEMENTS/EXPOSÉS ORAUX Peter Erickson Jorgen Christensen Louise Burgener Dennis Cumberland Lionel Roy Conant Louise Evans-Salt Betsy Leon Susan Crookes Jana Gainor Selina Lazarre Kandace Kerr George LaBrush Anne Sam Rosemarie Sam Lillian Sam Keith Prince Chad Lantz Glenda Olson Catherine Coldwell Shelley van Erp Loretta Turgeon Joanne Vinnedge Lisa Burgener Denis Wood Bryan Muloin Transcript Hearing Order OH-4-2011 TABLE OF CONTENTS/TABLE DES MATIÈRES (i) Description Paragraph No./No. de paragraphe Opening remarks by the Chairperson 10890 Oral statement by Peter Erickson 10920 Oral statement by Jorgen Christensen 10949 Oral statement by Louise Burgener 10965 Oral statement by Dennis Cumberland 10981 Oral statement by Lionel Roy Conant 10991 Oral statement by Louise Evans-Salt 11006 Oral statement by Betsy Leon 11041 Oral statement by Susan Crookes 11060 Oral statement by Jana Gainor 11070 Oral statement by Selina Lazarre 11096 Oral statement by Kandace Kerr 11104 Oral statement by George LaBrush 11140 Oral statement by Anne Sam 11166 Oral statement by Rosemarie Sam 11192 Oral statement by Lillian Sam 11202 Oral statement by Keith Prince 11225 Oral statement by Chad Lantz 11238 Oral statement by Glenda Olson 11259 Oral statement by Catherine Coldwell 11297 Oral statement by Shelley van Erp 11320 Oral statement by Loretta Turgeon 11370 Oral statement by Joanne Vinnedge 11396 Oral statement by Lisa Burgener 11425 Oral statement by Denis Wood 11450 Oral statement by Bryan Muloin 11480 Transcript Hearing Order OH-4-2011 LIST OF EXHIBITS/LISTE DES PIÈCES (i) No. Description Paragraph No./No. de paragraphe Transcript Hearing Order OH-4-2011 Opening remarks --- Upon commencing at 9:01 a.m./L’audience débute à 9h01 10890. THE CHAIRPERSON: Good morning, everyone. 10891. Just before we get underway, we’re honoured to have -- Ms. Sam agreed to start our session with an opening prayer, so we’ll begin with that. --- (Opening Prayer/Prière d’ouverture) 10892. MS. SAM: Heavenly father, we come before you today. We ask your guidance and blessings upon all our intentions and for our people. We pray that all things will work out for us. We ask you to guide us in all these important matters pertaining to the pipeline. We ask this in Jesus’ name. Amen. 10893. THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much, Ms. Sam, for honouring us with the opening prayer. Thank you very much. It’s wonderful to be back in Fort St. James and on such a lovely day. 10894. My name is Sheila Leggett. On my left is Mr. Hans Matthews, and on my right is Mr. Kenneth --- 10895. MEMBER BATEMAN: Morning. 10896. THE CHAIRPERSON: --- Bateman. 10897. Also, you will have met some of our staff as you were coming in, particularly if you’re presenting an oral statement today, and they’re all wearing name tags. And if you have any process-related questions, they would be the people to address those questions to. 10898. In addition to our staff, we have two contractors with us. We have our court reporter, as well as our sound IT technician. 10899. The session today is being broadcast live on the Panel’s website, which is the normal practice for our oral hearings. The process for this joint review includes two sets of hearings. 10900. There are the community hearings of which we’re here today to hear oral statements from people who have previously registered to provide them, and then later this fall we will be going into the final hearings, which is the component Transcript Hearing Order OH-4-2011 Opening remarks where questioning of the evidence will occur and, ultimately, in the end, arguments will be presented. 10901. Oral statements are an opportunity for participants to present their personal knowledge and views about the proposed project. In order to help provide a reference point for participants, those who are speaking will have been shown a couple of maps when you came in, and those maps are available -- one is on the screen now and we can switch to the other one if you would like to refer to that one instead. 10902. In one of our procedural directions we outlined what the Panel would expect to hear in oral statements, and that includes who you are and how the project will impact or benefit you, your views on whether the project is in the public interest, your position on the decisions that the Panel should make, any terms and conditions that should be applied if the project were to proceed, and any other information that supports your position. 10903. The timeframe for each oral statement is a maximum of 10 minutes, and we do that to be fair to everybody who’s registered to present both within this timeframe, as well as all the people who are presenting oral statements to us in many different locations. 10904. At the -- there’s a box here and at the seven-minute mark there will be an audible sound and a light and then again at the 10-minute mark there will be an audible sound and a light. 10905. So with that, we’re ready to get underway, and Chief Erickson, would you please begin with your oral statement? 10906. MR. PETER ERICKSON: Can I ask one question before we start? 10907. THE CHAIRPERSON: The questions would go to the -- to the Panel staff if you have any questions about process and that sort --- 10908. MR. PETER ERICKSON: Yes. 10909. THE CHAIRPERSON: --- of thing. Maybe -- would it be a good idea --- Transcript Hearing Order OH-4-2011 Oral statements Exposés oraux 10910. MR. PETER ERICKSON: Well, you outlined the -- I just -- you just outlined the rules and I’m allowed 10 minutes here, and that was the extent of my presentation. However, I’ve -- there was a person here that presented to you prior here. He also presented in several other locations throughout B.C. Why was that -- like, I’m allowed 10 minutes; he’s allowed 10 minutes at every location in British Columbia. 10911. THE CHAIRPERSON: Chief Erickson, I’m not familiar with the situation that you’re talking about. We have been having the same set of rules for everybody as we’ve had all the oral statements. So if there’s something you’d like to follow up later with as far as procedural fairness, you could do that. 10912. I wonder if it was the oral evidence as opposed to the oral statements. It could be --- 10913. MR. PETER ERICKSON: Somebody claiming our territory that has no business in this territory. 10914. THE CHAIRPERSON: I don’t know. 10915. Chief Erickson, are you ready to proceed --- 10916. MR. PETER ERICKSON: I am ready --- 10917. THE CHAIRPERSON: --- with your oral statement? 10918. MR. PETER ERICKSON: --- to proceed. 10919. THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much. --- ORAL STATEMENT BY/EXPOSÉ ORAL PAR MR. PETER ERICKSON: 10920. MR. PETER ERICKSON: My name is Sowchea, and my English name is Pete Erickson. 10921. And I want the -- this project is of extreme concern to our people, and I’ll go through a -- starting off with our knowledge of the land. And just to put forward that in past presentations and presentations done by people in the media and the Canadian government that somehow First Nations people just want to be whimsically chasing moose through the bush and that we have no knowledge that Transcript Hearing Order OH-4-2011 Oral statements Exposés oraux would stop this project. 10922. The Pinchi Lake Fault runs from the San Andreas -- the one that runs down off of the coast of British Columbia and it runs right through our territory and the community of Cumulus is at Pinchi Lake which is within about 30 kilometres of us.