Brian Gathy interviewed by John Davis March 25, 2020 Phone interview 0:00:00 to 0:31:38 ______

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John Davis: Today is Wednesday, March 25th, 2020. My name is John Davis. I am the Interim Curator of Special Collections in Performing Arts at the University of Maryland, speaking to Brian Gathy of Yet Another Unslanted Opinion fanzine, which I believe ran for five issues. Is that right?

Brian Gathy: That’s correct.

Davis: And that was about ’85 to ’86 or so?

Gathy: Yeah. That sounds right. I feel like we did a sixth issue that was kind of just a quick hodgepodge, but my memory could be wrong. We'll just say five, to keep it safe.

Davis: So before we kind of get into the zine itself, could you tell me about how you got interested in punk in the first place, and what it was like growing up around the D.C. area at that time? Was it D.C. punk that got you first, or was it punk from outside of D.C. and then you learned about what was happening here? What was it for you?

Gathy: It’s kind of interesting, ‘cause I literally just talked about this topic on my podcast. But I moved to D.C. in ’83 from Virginia Beach, and I had gotten into punk in Virginia Beach. I had some friends at school that—a group of kids that would play music on the bus, and they had stuff like Black Flag and all that sort of thing, playing on a boom box. And at first, it just sounded so abrasive, and like not even music to me after hearing—you know, being used to hearing Boston and Journey and all the radio crap. But something was intriguing, and so like primal and raw about it, that I kind of got curious and needed to know more. So I had them record me some stuff. I started going out and buying my own records. Yeah, I just fell in love with first the energy, but also the rebelliousness, the philosophy. The kind of self-empowerment and do-it-yourself philosophy kind of came along. All that stuff, it was intoxicating, really. As for D.C. music, I kind of fortuitously happened upon it right before moving to D.C. Oh, yeah, I should go back and say that I was about 12 when I first was hearing this stuff, and moved to D.C. when I was 13, in ’83.

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So I was skateboarding at this skate park called Mount Trashmore, and this other kid that was dressed in a punk shirt and flannel over it, whatever, came up, and we started talking about what bands we liked, et cetera. And he had told me how he’s trying to get rid of these records, see if I want to trade him anything, because he hated straightedge and how lame it was, et cetera.

And it turns out—so I trade him my Bad Religion, Into the Unknown; Fear, The Record; and one other thing, for SSD, Get It Away, and the comp. And the Flex Your Head comp, I just—actually both of them, I fell in love with, but to be D.C. specific, it was like getting dropped in this other universe of—I don’t know, just like a portal into this world that I wanted to be a part of, I had to be a part of. So I wore that thing out.

Yeah, I even—on the insert, Void had their phone number on there, and just being a young kid, I wanted to—I was like, “Well, that's crazy. I wonder if I’d get a hold of them.” And I called and talked to a couple of guys in Void for a few minutes. And they were trying to see if I could set them up a show, but you know, I was, God, barely 13. [laugh] I was just stoked that they actually would have a conversation with me.

So yeah, that’s what’s got me into it. And from there, I started seeking out all things D.C., especially Dischord-related. And my mom moved us—she worked for the military, for the government, and so we moved to D.C. just a handful of months later.

Davis: You were out in the suburbs, right? Was it Burke, or where were you?

Gathy: Yeah, yeah. Burke, Virginia. Exactly. Suburbs outside of—

Davis: I've seen flyers for shows out there, but was that something that you helped to realize? Or was that happening before you were—?

Gathy: Yeah, me and—no, we kind of—me and my friend started doing shows out there, at like the Burke Community Center and a couple other places. But yeah, it was me, my friend Sohrab Habibion— he’s in Savak now; he was in Edsel, et cetera—Sean Lesher, who I did the magazine with; me and him were pretty much the two architects of that zine.

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But yeah, yeah, we rented out the community center in one of our neighborhoods and got all the D.C. bands, as well as 7 Seconds, as well as—ah, God, I can’t even remember—a few other out-of- town bands to play there. And this is when we were about 15. [laugh]

Davis: What zines were you reading? I assume you were reading zines before you decided to start your own.

Gathy: Oh, for sure. So Maximum Rocknroll was probably the first thing I saw, and somewhere I've got that first issue that I bought, which I guess had to be 1982.

Davis: I think it is, yeah.

Gathy: Yeah, and it had MDC in it. It had some other things. It was just fascinating. Like I started sending away to mail-order records from reading reviews or what ads looked cool, even just by that. And so it was Maximum Rocknroll, Flipside were the two first ones I saw, for sure. But yeah, then as time went on, things like Ink Disease and this one called Leading Edge that Martin Sprouse used to do. We used to trade zines. Yeah. And of course, once I moved to D.C., the WDC period and—oh god, what was it—Truly Needy? I really liked that one.

Davis: Right, and I was going to ask about the ones from D.C. Like did Thrillseeker or any of those types of zines kind of make their way out to you?

Gathy: Yeah.

Davis: But you were going into the city, also, to see shows, I assume.

Gathy: Oh, for sure, yeah. Yeah, we would take the bus into Georgetown to buy records. Then we would go down into D.C. to see shows, absolutely. I don’t know how or why [laugh] my mom agreed to drive us into these horrible parts of D.C. at the height of the crack epidemic and murder capital of the [laugh] country, but you know, she was really—she would drive me and a whole carful of kids down there, and go to the Wilson Center or wherever, 9:30, all kinds of halls or whatever. And invariably, I would always go past curfew, because the shows would be so late that I’d be grounded for the next handful of shows. So I never got to see Black Flag or Minutemen, a couple of the bands that I was really into, just because I would always be grounded.

3 Davis: [laugh] So starting your own zine, what was it that made you want to do that? And how did you get something like that started?

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Gathy: Well, luckily—I'm trying to think what the actual impetus was, besides wanting to actually—I mean, I was playing music already at that point, but yeah, I just wanted to be a part of the scene, in any way possible. So I thought that’s a great way to be able to talk to the bands I love, and that sort of thing. So my grandfather owned a local version of that car classified magazine called the Autotrader, and so he had a whole operation, a whole warehouse with a printing press and darkroom and layout rooms, all that sort of thing. And I would work there sometimes, for him, so that kind of gave me an idea of how to do it.

Because, yeah, it’s crazy to think nowadays, but we would have these huge sheets of paper, and have to lay everything out kind of mathematically—like I can’t even remember—like four or six or eight pages at a time. Like basically the first page and last page together, et cetera, on down the line. And then take it down to a printer, not just Kinko’s, et cetera. It was a whole to-do. And of course, by the second issue, we discovered half-toning and that [laugh] sort of thing.

Davis: Did you feel comfortable approaching bands for an interview? Was that intimidating to you, especially with how young you were?

Gathy: At first it was, but I grew more and more—I don’t know what the word is—emboldened? I don’t know. Just ‘cause everybody seemed—once you actually approached them, they were so approachable. It just never ceased to amaze me. I remember the first band people I talked to in person I want to say was—it was probably Kenny from Marginal Man, like right after one of their first shows. And not for the zine, but just after the show, and couldn't have been a nicer guy. So I don’t know, I reached out to Ian, for that first issue, and he was super, super nice about it, invited me down to Dischord House, et cetera. Fed me when I was there.

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I took public transportation, and amazing to me, at that age, like— and it just shows what kind of person he is—once the interview was done and he heard I was going to take public transportation back, he took me in his car and drove me home himself, like back to where I lived in the suburbs. So yeah, it was a really cool

4 experience, a good learning lesson about integrity and authenticity, all that sort of thing.

Davis: When you were doing like say the first issue, how many copies would you make, and where would you go to make those copies?

Gathy: So I want to say either just [sigh]—I've got the information somewhere, I'm sure, but it was no more than 200. It might have just been 100 copies of the first issue. And we did that—we just looked up in the phone book a place that printed magazines and did it that way. Just took it to them and brought back boxes of the finished product.

Davis: I assume you were selling those at shows. Did you also sell them at records stores, and which stores did you rely on?

Gathy: That’s a good question. I know that we had some at Smash. I'm trying to think where else we had some issues. I don’t know if we had them directly anywhere specific, regularly anyway. We mostly sold them at shows, and through mail order. We got a lot of mail order after the first couple issues, because we’d send them out to other zines and get reviewed, and get mail orders that way, et cetera. But yeah, mostly shows. And it really helped, because bands like—it was cool; I heard an old recording of not long ago, and like in between songs, Guy says something about, “Pick up the new issue of Yet Another Unslanted Opinion.” I'm like—

Davis: [laugh]

Gathy: —“Oh my god, I forgot that—” [laugh] You know? So, yeah, those sort of things helped.

Davis: What were some of the interviews that stood out to you from the five issues?

Gathy: For me personally, definitely—I mean, one, because it was my first, was the first Ian interview. And just because of the whole experience of being in Dischord House for the first time, et cetera.

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It was just—yeah, it was a really cool experience, and really moving. And also just that, kind of like you said, I was a kid, a little kid, [laugh] a little scrawny kid. And that these guys would have serious conversations with me, not condescending in any way, shape, or mean, it was—it meant a lot to me. But yeah, that

5 Ian interview, for sure. The one with Beefeater, that one was really cool, with Tomas and I think Dug.

But I remember it really stood out to me that I think—yeah, that was the one where I saw Tomas’s room at Dischord House, and he just had a rock for a pillow. It was a pretty—and super spare room. Super—it just really kinda impressed me with his discipline to his aesthetic and his evolving spiritual wisdom, I guess. Not to mention that first interview, too, is where I—with Ian I think is where I found out about Rites of Spring, because he just couldn't stop talking about them, and went up and showed me—I think it was Eddie’s room, at Dischord House, and the original painting for the cover of the that was going to be released et cetera. It was—yeah. I would say those are the most memorable.

Davis: And so within the scene, considering you were essentially a music critic in many ways, was there ever friction with any bands or other people, or zines, that you recall? Or was it pretty peaceful the whole way?

Gathy: It was mostly pretty peaceful. I don’t think we caused too many waves or were too controversial, honestly. Yeah. I mean, I know we gave some not totally positive reviews occasionally, but I don’t think we were ever—I mean, god, we were young teenagers, but I don’t think we were ever too critical or too outright mean about anything, enough to ruffle feathers too much. I do remember—it wasn’t friction, but I remember we had trouble with—which I hear wasn’t uncommon—we did a couple ads for Olive Tree Records, H.R.s thing—

Davis: Right.

Gathy: —and, yeah, never got any kind of comp…paid or even trade for that stuff. But, you know, so it goes. [laugh]

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Davis: And how would you say the zine changed over the course of those five issues? Did you feel the writing changed or got better, or the layout got better, or anything—did it evolve or devolve?

Gathy: Maybe a little of both. Definitely I feel like the layout—I don’t even—so to be honest, I don’t even own—I'm the worst self- documenter. I don’t own half the recordings I've been on. I did just find a number three issue of the magazine, and I think I have number four somewhere, but that’s it. But yeah, absolutely the layout I think got a lot better as it went on. The writing I think was kind of similar throughout the whole thing. We were teenagers

6 expressing ourselves, so there’s some [sigh] maybe charming enthusiasm, but there’s no—there’s not gonna be any Hemingway allusions there, or anything like that. I'm just happy when I was rereading that some of it wasn’t as embarrassing as I thought it might be [laugh] to rehash.

Davis: And did the circulation tend to stay the same? Would you just do, whatever, the 100? Did it grow?

Gathy: Oh, no, it definitely grew. I think we might have done like 300 the second one, and I think the top we got to was maybe 500 for the last couple issues.

Davis: And it was still just the same thing of getting it out at shows and mail order, and the occasional record store?

Gathy: Yeah, yeah. We would drop into stores and drop them off for consignment, I think, if anything, but I don’t think we had like a regular thing going with any stores, to be honest.

Davis: So what led you to stop doing the zine?

Gathy: Oh, just bein’ [exhale] restless, volatile kids. Me and Sean I think—we were best friends, and kind of just—kind of got sick of each other for a little while, and had slightly different visions, maybe, for how to proceed with the magazine. I think he wanted to inject more humor and more kind of snarkiness, perhaps, and I wanted to just get a little deeper with it.

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But, he was responsible for a lot of the really good layout, as it improved over time, for sure. And just being a kid, life stuff. I had started getting involved with Positive Force actually from the first issue on, and started up a Positive Force group at my high school, and we were doing the shows, and I was trying to do bands. You know. I guess just all that kind of let it get away from us.

Davis: As far as playing music, tell me a bit more about the music that you did.

Gathy: Well, Sohrab was in our first band in Burke. Oh, I should go back, actually. There was one band before that called Lebenslust, which is German for “lust for life,” I guess. And that was with a guy named Larry, who I think I had met in Positive Force, and Nicky, who later played drums in . And we just played a few shows. Played a show with , and a couple others, but not too many.

7 Then the second project was a thing with Sohrab and a couple other friends. We were called Inside Out. And obviously there has been a few different bands with that name. [laugh] But which morphed into this other band. We played with a lot of amazing bands, and we were—okay. Not terrible, but not on par with half of the bands that we played with at the time. And then later on, I played with [John] Stabb after Government Issue in a band called Weatherhead for a little while.

Davis: Right. I've seen the flyers.

Gathy: But that would be about my—yeah, that would be about my D.C. bands, really.

Davis: And when did you move away from the area?

Gathy: I moved away in ’90 or ’91—I think it was ’91—came back for a year, around—no, I moved away in ’90, sorry, came back in late ’91 for just a little bit, then moved to Colorado and just kept going westward from there.

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Davis: Toward the end of the zine period, were there other D.C. zines that you felt—you mentioned some of the ones that were there at the beginning. And then a year or so later, were there any other ones that kind of sprung up as well, like yours, or ones that you felt any camaraderie with, or competition, or anything like that?

Gathy: Not really. There was a couple Maryland zines that we’d either get through trades or through buying at shows. And I really wish I had my—well, I've got multiple boxes of zines, but I wish I had them handy, because I've still got a couple. I remember one was called Seizure. That one was pretty cool.

Davis: What was it called?

Gathy: I think it was called Seizure. And there was another one from Maryland that is the same time period as us and had a really good—I don’t know, just it actually had a really good sense of humor and was well written. I wish I could remember the name of that one, but I can’t.

Davis: [laugh]

Gathy: So locally, I don’t recall any that we had like any kind of brotherly bond with, much less rivalry with, or any of that. It was more zines around the country that we kind of had correspondence with and

8 would trade with regularly. Like I said, Martin’s Leading Edge in California—just really liked what he was doing, because it was really positive and thoughtful, and I think it was really well laid out.

Davis: When you stopped doing the zine, I guess it was around ’86 or so?

Gathy: Yeah.

Davis: What did the music scene feel like at that point? Did it feel like it was kind of ebbing out again after the peak of Gray Matter, Rites of Spring, Embrace, all that stuff? Or did it still feel like it was going strong, and you just weren’t doing a zine anymore? Or what was the situation?

Gathy: I don’t feel like there was any break in always being good bands, but it definitely wasn’t as vibrant as right when we just got dropped into the whole Revolution Summer era. That was like—I don’t know, that was just amazing, and every day was exciting to find out what the hell was gonna happen, who was doing what where. And community-wise, too, there was so much politics mixed in with it, or community activism, or whatever you want to call it.

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But, yeah, it felt like a little ebb, but not like—not so much—I feel that honestly for me happened kind of around the time I moved away, as far as my interest in a lot of the D.C. bands. I still had bands I really liked, but when it hit the early ‘90s, it was a confusing time in music. There was all the major label stuff starting to happen, and I don’t know, a lot of the Dischord bands went from a very like heated, hot, amped-up sound to—or the thoughtful post punky influenced hardcore to like almost a little bit too sterile-sounding stuff for me. So yeah.

Davis: I suppose the last question I have at this point is—the year or two that you were doing the zine, and when you were really actively involved in the scene during that period, what would you say the impact on you today is from that? How is that a part of who you are today?

Gathy: Yeah, yeah. I'm glad you asked that. It’s funny, because I've been doing that for the last couple months, started that podcast where I interview people from all the Dischord bands and document each release. And that’s a question I always make sure to ask, so it’s interesting to have it turned around.

9 I would say just that I guess the creative impulse, the reaching out, the creation versus destruction mentality, that sense of—just the empowerment of doing something that you're—just, I don’t know, that empowerment of being able to put something you think about and care about and you might feel vulnerable about, but being able to put that out there and just be okay with that, as well as like the connections that were made from back then. The sense of urgency—that’s something I try to keep in my life. I try to keep that eye on—not eye on the prize, but that sense of fire in my belly, I guess, for what it means to be alive, what it means to be a conscious human in this culture.

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Davis: Well, that’s all I have. Are there any other things you think we should talk about, that we didn't cover?

Gathy: Hmm. No, I mean, I'm just eternally grateful to have had the opportunity to have some small part in that scene, that time period, because it really did shape everything about how I view life. I mean, I became vegan around that time, around when I started in the scene, maybe a little before—no, vegetarian, sorry; not vegan ‘til years later—but it’s something I've been my whole life. As well as views on things like drugs and things like just that you don’t have to wait for someone else to articulate something in your name. Just that you can do it. And there’s this whole network of people that are always doing something to make the world a better place. I don’t know. Yeah.

Davis: Thank you for talking to me about this.

Gathy: Yeah.

[End of recording]

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