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Monday, May 30, 1994 VOLUME 133 NUMBER 074 1st SESSION 35th PARLIAMENT OFFICIAL REPORT (HANSARD) Monday, May 30, 1994 Speaker: The Honourable Gilbert Parent HOUSE OF COMMONS Monday, May 30, 1994 The House met at 11 a.m. the results of our current debate, the House shares my eagerness to hear what Canadians will say to the task group. _______________ Over the coming weeks we will be asking Canadians to share Prayers their experiences and make suggestions with respect to the tax treatment of child support. The task group will provide feedback _______________ and advice on this issue to our government colleagues. We have worked out a schedule to reach a cross–section of PRIVATE MEMBERS’ BUSINESS Canadians, including representatives of custodial and non–cus- todial parents, child advocates, women’s organizations, law- yers, accountants, community groups and others concerned [English] about this issue. INCOME TAX ACT We have set out a schedule of meetings in Regina, Montreal, The House resumed consideration of the motion. Vancouver, Winnipeg, Moncton, Toronto and Ottawa and are providing ways for those not in those cities also to participate Mr. David Walker (Parliamentary Secretary to Minister of and make their views known to the task group, to the govern- Finance): Mr. Speaker, it is with a great deal of enthusiasm that ment, and to the House. I join in this debate on the private member’s motion first presented to the House by the member for Nepean. The task group will listen to Canadians with an open mind, guided by a number of clear principles. Our over–arching The need for change to the child support system is recognized principle is that the child’s needs come first. Tax rules for child by Canadians and the government. As many in the House have support must place paramount importance on the welfare of noted the question of child support touches deeply and in many children. respects is a very personal issue. It relates to family responsibi- lities and to the well–being of our children. Second, we are committed to the principle of fairness. That includes fairness between custodial and non–custodial parents (1105) as well as fairness to other taxpayers. We must treat all family situations equitably whether there has been a marriage breakup Accordingly the government is committed to broad consulta- or not. tions with those Canadians most affected. That is why as task group of MPs has been formed to conduct a series of open round Third, while tax equity demands that tax be paid on income, table discussions on child support. this exercise is not at all about increasing government revenues. [Translation] The issue surrounding child support payments encompasses more than just their tax treatment. Questions relating to levels of As many of you will have noticed, the subject of child support support and enforcement are critical as well. It is a sad fact that a payments raises, when it comes to parental responsibilities and great majority of single mothers in Canada receive no support the well–being of our children, questions which are deeply felt payments at all for their children and that the great majority of and which in many respects are very personal. support orders are not obeyed. This is why the government is committed to broad consulta- Our goals therefore are broader than those of the current tions with those Canadians most affected. It has, therefore, set motion. We want to create a more equitable system for child up a task force of members to hold a series of open round table support determinations. That includes generally increasing the discussions on the subject of child support payments. value of child support awards, simplifying the process, provid- [English] ing similar awards in similar family situations. As a member of that task group I welcome the deliberations of I can understand that Canadian women affected by the Thi- the House. They constitute a thoughtful and highly valued baudeau decision may be sceptical of the government’s intent. I source of advice. At the same time I am confident that whatever want to reassure them that although the decision is being 4549 COMMONS DEBATES May 30, 1994 Private Members’ Business appealed the government recognizes the need to improve the The broad perception is that the tax treatment is not fair. I child support system. have a fair amount of personal experience in this because I have been paying maintenance payments, as many people have, for The fact remains, however, that the court’s ruling has led to years. My ex–wife and I have talked at great length about this. tremendous uncertainty and possible chaos in Canadian family We have come to an agreement outside the judiciary on how we law. As well, in dealing with only the income inclusion and not would handle it. the deduction the ruling has created an unbalanced system. The real problem was alluded to in a presentation by the hon. We expect to achieve significant progress toward a better member who preceded me. It is that the vast majority of people system by the end of this year. That includes reviewing the tax who are required to make maintenance payments do not and they system, legislating child support formulas to simplify the sys- skip. When we are looking at this we have to look at it in the tem and finding more effective ways to enforce support orders. broader context. How do we get the deadbeat parents to accept responsibility for looking after the children that they brought [Translation] into the world? Why is it that every time we turn around in our country we are able to escape whatever responsibilities we We hope to be able to make significant improvements by the should have as individuals and pass them off to the state? end of the year, specifically through revision of the tax system and legislative measures on child support formulas in order to The broader question is how do we go about nailing the simplify the system and with a view to finding more efficient deadbeats, whether they are male or female. Perhaps we should means of enforcing support orders. look at changing the income tax structure so that if money is paid by the state, then the people who owe it have to pay it back. (1110) If the individuals owed the tax department the money, would [English] they get away with it? I think not. If they do not make their payments and look after their responsibilities we as a people, as a nation, are forced to look after their responsibilities. I am confident that the insights Canadians will provide the task group will make a major contribution to this important work. As we go down this road it is going to be very important not only to consider what is fair to the people who are involved, but what is fair to the taxpayers and to once again inculcate the sense I thank the hon. member for her motion and the House for the of responsibility to people when they bring children into the opportunity to speak today. world to look after their responsibilities. Mr. Ian McClelland (Edmonton Southwest): Mr. Speaker, I The problem is interprovincial because if people skip from too am very happy to speak to this motion and I wish to one province to another, they have to be tracked. It is a question congratulate the hon. member for Nepean for bringing it to the of will. If people involved in the breakdown, in the divorce, are floor. rancorous and do not want to pay, how do we go about doing this with a sense of fairness so that they will pay? It is the children The motion, for those watching this on television, has to do who are involved that we want to protect. with the taxing of child support payments. It states that taxes on child tax support payments should be paid by the payer rather I would like to read briefly from a very thoughtful letter I than the recipient. On its face it tends to make sense, but when received from a constituent on this issue just the other day. Her we delve into it a bit deeper we find a host of interrelated name is Zanne Cameron and she wrote quite a long and involved considerations. letter. It is very touching: This bill is particularly timely following as it does the As a single parent receiving support payments, I was immediately bumped into a 33 per cent tax bracket. The GST was introduced the same year, and I have seen Thibaudeau decision recently received from the Supreme Court. health care premiums increase from $80 in 1983 to $180 quarterly in 1994. A middle This decision has caused a general review of the whole situation class income is no longer $35,000 a year. It is somewhere over $45,000 or more. of tax status and the support paid to families after a marriage Yep, it is tough out there. You know what, though? It is not tougher for me than for breakdown. married couples or single people with no children. Making a living is not easy. I have a couple of insights I would like to bring to this debate (1115) and to the broader debate, but I want to assure those watching on television that whether this bill survives or passes the Com- In the broader context of doing what is right, we have to do mons, this is not the end of the story. It will go on. Parliament what is right for the family.
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