LOK SABHA DEBATES (English Version)

Ninth Series, Vol. VII; No. 52 Wednesday, May30, 1990 Jyaistha 9,1912 (Saka}

Second Session (Ninth Lok Sabha)

( Yol. VII eontain.r NoJ. 51 IO 60)

LO.K SABHA SECRETARIAT NEW DELHI Prlr� · R.6, 6.00 CONTENTS

[Ninth Series, Vol. VII, Second Session. 199011912 (Saka)}

No. 52, Wednesday, May 30, 1990/Jyaistha 9,1912 (Saka)

CoLUMNS

Papers Laid on the Table 3-26 312

Message from Rajya Sabha 27

Committee on Absence of Members from the Sittings of the House 27 Minutes-Laid

Coal India (Regulation of Transfers and Validation) Bill-Introduced 27-28

Salaries and Allowances of Officers of Parliament 28-29 (Amendment) am-Introduced

Matters Under Rule 377 29-44

(i) Need to allot more rice to Kerala for distribution through 29-30 'Public Distribution System'

Prof. K. V. Thomas

(ii) Need to relax the Foreigners (Protected Areas) Order, 31 1958 to promote tourism in M8ghalaya

Shri Peter G. Marbaniang

(iii) Need to allow Land Development Banks to resort to functional 31-32 improvements as permitted under the Banking Regulations Act,1949

Shri Sudhir Grj (ji)

CoLUMNS

(iv) Need to look into cases of harassment to drug manufacturers 32-33

Shri Vasant Sathe

(\I) Need to announce more incentives to sugarcane gorwers, 33 particularly of Maharashtra

Shri Balasaheb Vikhe Patil

(vi) Need to provide more facilities at Gaya railway Station 33-34

Shri Ishwar Chaudhary

(vii) Need to set up small and cottage industries in Malihabad, 35-36 Unar Pradesh, and to provide credit facilities there at low rate of Interest

Shri Sarju Prasad Saroj

(viii) Neet to set up a separate subsidiary coal company for 36 the State of Orissa

Shri Ravi Narayan Pani

(ix) Need to provide financial assistance to the Government 37 of Rajasthan for drought relief and to relax the Forest Law to enable the Scheduled Tribes and farmers to earn their livelihood

Shri Guman Mal Lodha

Constitution (Sixty·Sixth Amendment) Bill 44-116 Motion to consider 248-300

Shri Guman Mal Lodha 45-46 74--87

Prof. P.J. Kurian 47 87--95

Shri Shopa1 Singh Makkasar 95-100 (iii)

CoLUMNS

Shri Yamuna Prasad Shastri 100-102

Shri Bhogendra Jha 103-107

Shri Ram Krishan Yadav 110-112

Shri B. Shankaranand 112-114

Shri Devi Lal 114-116

Clauses 2 and 1 248-300

Motio to Pass Shri Upendra Nath Verma 265-283

Constitution (Sixty-Eighth Amendment) Bill 116-247 Motion to consider

Clauses 2 and 1 132-247

Motion to Pass

Shri Ram Vilas Pas wan 135 139-142

Welcome to Shri S. Solarz, Chairman of the Foreign Affairs 248 Committee of the U.S. Congress

National Commission for Women Bill 300-312 Motion to consider

Shrimati Usha Sinha 300-303

Shrimati Jayanti Navinchandra Mehta 303-310

Shri Harish Rawat 31 0-312 LOK SABHA DEBATES

LOKSABHA a wrong statement in the House? (Interrup- tions)

THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRYOFPARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS Wednesday, May 30 19901 Jyaistha AND MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINIS- 9, 1912 (Saka) TRY OF TOURISM (SHRI SATYA PAL MALIK): Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would like to make a submission through you that h was scheduled for today but it could not be circulated to the members. Being ~ so the mem- The Lok Sabha met at Eleven of the Clock bers would have objected to it. It has been discussed with you ... (Interruptions) [MR. SPEAKER in the Chai~ SHRI MADAN LAL KHURANA: You may [ Translation] distribute n now with the permission of the House. It was said on the 12th April that it SHRI MADAN LAL KHURANA (South would be presented within 1-2 days. Since Delhi): Mr. Speaker, Sir, an assurance had then many days have passed by but nothing been given to grant statehood to Delhi but to has been done in this regard. Tomorrow is this date nothing has been done in this the last day of the session. Now, when will regard. What a fun? (Interruptions) you take it up?

MR.SPEAKER: Mr. Khurana, please SHAI KALKA DAS: Yesterday hon. take your seat for a while. Home Minister had said that nwould be done but nothing has been done. It is to betray the SHRI KALKA DAS (Karol 8agh): Mr. people of Delhi. Speaker, Sir, hon. Home Minister had said it in your presence that they would do Hvery SHRI MADAN LAL KHURANA: If you soon, buy nothing has been done so far. He introduce it today, tomorrow you can have a has misled the House ... (Interruptions) discussion on h. For that, you can issue a supplementary agenda. (Int'ffuptions) MR. SPEAKER: Please speak one by one. THE PRIME MINISTER (SHRI VISH· WANATH PRATAP SINGH): Mr. Speaker, Sir, Wthe House agrees, the Government is SHRI HARIN PATHAK (Ahmedabad): ready to bring h today itself. There is no Mr. Speaker, Sir, nothing has been done in hinderance on the part of the Government. this regard so far. After all, when will you We are ready to bring it today itself. (Inter- bring h? ruptions)

SHRt KALKA DAS: Why do they make MR. SPEAKER: In this connection, I 3 Papers Laid MAY 30,1990 Papers Laid 4

would like to say only this much that it should Projects Construction Corpo- reach in the hands of all the Members. The ration Limited, New Delhi, for Minister had talked to me in my Chamber the year 1988-89 along w~h and I would like to say that tomorrow morn- Audited Accounts and com· ing you will be getting the copy of this Bill ments of the Comptroller and which will be introduced tomorrow. If you so Auditor General thereon. desire, it can be passed tomorrow. (2) A statement (Hindi and English SHAt MADAN LAL KHURANA: I would versions) showing reasons for like to say that you may get it introduced by delay in laying the papers men- the evening after getting supplementary tioned at (1) above. [Placed in agenda issued to that effed. Library. See No. LT -1038190]

SHRI KALKA DAS: You may get it Review. on the working of and Annual introduced by the evening after getting a Raportsof Regional Engineering College, supplementary agenda issued to that effed. Kurakshatra, Regional Engineering col· lege, Rewrkela, Regional Institute of SHRI MADAN LAL KHURANA: How Technology. Jamshedpur for 1988-89 etc can it be done tomorrow as it is the last day etc. of the session. THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINISTRY OF HUMAN RESOURCES DEVELOPMEN: (SHRI CHIMANBHAI 11.05 1/2 hrs. MEHTA): I beg to lay on the Table-

P;~PERS LAID ON THE TABLE (1) (i) A copy of the Annual Report (Hindi and English versions) [English] of the Regional Engineering College, Kurukshetra, for the Review on the working of and Annual year 1988-89. Report of National Projects Construction Corporation Ltd. New Deihl for 1988·89 (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi . and statement for delay In laying these and English versions) by the papers Governmenl on the working of the Regional Engineering THE MINISTER OF STATE OF THE College, Kurukshetra, for the MINISTRY OF WATER RESOURCES (SHRI year 1988-89. MANUBHAI KOTADIA): i beg to lay on the Table- (2) A statement (Hindi and English versions) showing reasons for (1) A copy each of the following pa- delay in laying the papers men- pers (Hindi and English versions) tioned at (1) above. [Placed in under sub-section (1) of section Library. See No. LT -1039190] 619AofthecompaniesAct,1956:- (3) (i) A copy of the Annual Report (i) Review by the Government (Hindi and English versions) on the working of the Na- of the Regional Engineering tional Projects Construction College, Rourkela, for the Corporation Limited, New year 1988·89. Delhi, for the year 1988~89. (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi (ii) An nual Report of the National and English versions) by the 5 Papers Laid JYAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) Papers Laid 6

Government on the working University, Act, 1985. of the Regional Engineering College, Rourkela, for the (10) A statement (Hindi and English year 1988-89. versions) showing reasons for delay in laying the papers minuted (4) A statement (Hindi and English at (9) above. [Placed in Library. versions) showing reasons for See No. LT -1043190] delay in laying the papers mentioned at (3) above. [Placed in (11 ) A copy of the Annual Accounts Library. See No. l T-1040190] (Hindi and English versions) of the University of Delhi, Delhi, for (5) (i) A copy of the Annual Report the year 1988-89 together w~h (Hindi and English versions) Audit Report thereon. of the Regional Institute of Technology, Jamshedpur, for (12) A statement (Hindi and English the year 1988-89. versions) showing reasons for delay in laying the papers me~- (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi tioned at (11) above. [Placed in and English versions) by the Library. See No. LT-1044l90] Government on the working of the Regional Institute of (13) (i) A copy-of the Annual Report Technology, Jamshedpur, for (Hindi and English versions) the year 1988-89. of the Indian Council of Philo- sophical Research, New (6) A statement (Hindi and English Delhi, for the year 1988-89 versions) showing reasons for along with Audited Accounts. delay in laying the papers men- (ij) A copy of the Review (Hindi tioned at (5) above. [Placed in and English versions) by the Library. See No. LT -1041/90) Governmer'\t on the working of the Indian Council of philo- (7) A copy of the Annual Accounts sophical Research. New (Hindi and English versions) of Delhi, for the year 1988-89 the Aligarh Muslim University, [Placed in Library. See No. Aligarh, for the year 1988-89 to- LT -1045/90] gether with Audit Report thereon under sub-section (4) of section (14) (i) A copy of the Annual Report 35 of the Aligarh Muslim Univer- (Hindi and English versions) sity Act, 1920. of the Indian InstHute of Ad- vanced Study, Shimla, forthe (8) A statement (Hindi and English year 1988-89 along with the versions) showing reasons for Aud~ed Accounts. delay in laying the papers mentioned at (7) above. [Placed in (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi Library. See No. LT-1042190] and Eng~sh versions) by the Government on the working (9) A copy of the Annual Accounts of the Indian Institute of Ad- (Hindi and English versions) of vanced Study, Shimta, tor the the Indira Gandhi National Open year 1988-89. [Placed in University, New Delhi, for the year library. Sge No. LT-10461 1988-89 together whh Audit Re- 90] port thereon under sedien 29 of the Indira Gandhi National Open (15) A copy each of the following pa- 7 Papers Laid MAYlO,1990 Papers Laid 8

pers (Hindi and English versions) (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi under sub-section(1) of section and English versions) by the 619A of the Companies Act, 1956:- Government on the working of the Maulana Azad CoJlege (i) Review by the Government of Technology, Bhopal, for on the working of the Educa- the year 1988-89. tional Consultants India Lim- ~ed, New Delhi, for the year (20) A statement (Hindi a'ld English 1988 .. 89. versions) showing reasons for delay in laying the papers men- (ii) Annual Report of the Educa- tioned at (19) above. [Placed in tional Consu~ant9 India Lim- Library. SHNo. LT-1049/90] ~ed, New Delhi, for the year 1988-89 along wnh Audhed (21 ) A copy of the Annual Accounts Accounts and comments of (Hindi and English versions) of the Comptroller and Auditor the North-Ea:;,tern Hill Univers~y, General thereon. Shillong, for the year 1987 -88 together with Audit Report thereon. (16) A statement (Hindi and English versions) showing reasons for (22) A statement (Hindi and English delay in laying the papers men- versions) showing reasons for tioned at (15) above. [Placed in delay in laying the papers men- Library. See No. LT-1047/90] tioned at (21) above. [Placed in Library. 599 No. LT -1050/90] (17) (i) A copy of the Annual Report (Hindi and English versions) (23) A copy of the Annual Accounts of the University Grants (Hindi and English versions) of Commission, New Delhi, for the Regional Engineering College, the year 1988-89 under Rourkela. for the year 1988-89 section 18 of the Univers~y togetherw~h Aud~ Report thereon. Grants Commission Act. [Placed in Library. 599 No. LT- 1956. 1051190]

(ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi (24) A copy of the Annual Accounts and English versions) by the (Hindi and English versions) of Government on the working the Regional Engineering College, of the University Grants Kurukshetra, for the year 1988-89 Commission, New Delhi, for togetherwnh Audn Reportthereon. the year 1988·89. [Placed in Library. 599 No. LT- 1052190] (18) A statement (Hindi and English versions) showing reasons for (25) A copy of the Annual Accounts delay in laying the papers men- (Hindi and English versions) of tloned at (17) above. [Placed in the Regional Institute of Technol- Library. 598 No. LT -1048/90] ogy, Jamshedpur, for the year 1988-89 together wtth Audit Report thereon. [Placed in Library. (19) (i) A copy of the Annual Report S99 No. l T-1053190] (Hindi and English versions) ofthe Maulana Azad College, (26) (i) A copy of the Annual Report of Technology, Bhopal. for (Hindi and English versions) the year 1988-89. of the Central Insthute of 9 Papsrs Laid JVAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) Papers Laid 10

Buddhist Studies, leh forthe (Hindi and English versions) year 1984-85. of the Jawahar Lal Nehru Univershy, New Delhi, forth. (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi year 1988-89. and English versions) by the Government on the working (iI) A copy of the Annual Ac- of the Central Inst~ute, of counts (Hindi and English Buddhist Studies, Leh, forthe versions)of the Jawahar Lal year 1984·85. Nehru University, New Delhi, for the year 1988-89 to- (27) (i) A copy of the Annual Report gather wnh Audit Report (Hindi and English versions) thereon. by the of the Centrallnstnute of Buddhist Studies, Leh, for (iii) A copy of the Review (Hindi the year 1985-86. and English versions) by the Government on the working (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi of the Jawahar Lal Nehru and English versions) by the Univers~y, New Delhi, for the Government on the working year 1988-89. of the Central Inst~ute of Suddhist Studies, Leh, for the (32) Two statements (Hindi and Eng- year 1985-86. lish versions) showing reasons for delay in 1aying the papers men- (28) (i) A copy of the Annual Report tioned at (31) above. [Placed in (Hindi and English versions) Library. See No. LT -1055/90] of the Central Institute of Buddhist Studies, Leh, forthe (33) (i) A copy of the Annual Report year 1986--87. (Hindi and English versions) of the Banaras Hindu Univer- (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi s~y, for the year 1988-89. and English versions) by the Government on the working (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi of Central Institute of Bud- and English versions) by the dhist Studies, Leh, forthe year Government on the working 1986-87. of the Banaras Hindu Univer- sity, for the year 1988-89. (29) A copy of the Annual Accounts (Hindi and English versions) of (34) A statement (Hindi and English the Central Institute of Buddhist versions) showinQ reasons for Studies, Leh, for the years 1984- delay in laying the papers men- 85 to 1986-87 together with Audit tioned at (33) above. [Placed in Report thereon. Library. 5'9 No. LT -1056/90]

(30) A statement (Hindi and English (35) (i) A copy of the Annual Report versions) showing reasons for (Hindi and English versions) delay in laying the papers men- of the Sardar Vallabhbhai tioned at (26) to (29) above. Regional College of Engi- [Placed in Library. 5" No. LT- neering andT ichnology, 1054190) Surat, for the year 1988-89.

(ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi (31) (i) A copy of the Annua' Report and English versions) by the 11 Papers Laid MAY 30,1990 Papers Laid 12

Government on the working New Delhi, forthe year 1988- of the Sardar Vallabhbhai 89. Regional College of Engi- neering and Technology, (40) A statement (Hindi and English Surat, for the year 1988-89. versions) showing reasons for delay in laying the papers mentioned at (39) above. [Placed in (36) A statement (Hindi and English Library. See No.lT-1059/90] versions) showing reasons for delay in laying the paper men- (41) (i) A copy of the Annual Report tioned at (35) above. [Placed in (Hindi and English versions) Library. 599 No. l T-1 057/90J of the Allahabad Museum Society, Allahabad, for the (37) (i) A copy of the Annual Report year 1988-89 along with (Hindi and English versions) Audited Accounts. of the Board of Practical Train~ ing, Calcutta, for the year (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi 1988-89 along wrth Audited and English versions) by the Accounts. Government on the working cf the Allahabad Museum (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi Society, Allahabad, for the and English versions) by the year 1988·89. Government on the working ofthe Board of Practical Train- (42) A statement (Hindi and English ing Calcutta, for the year versions) showing reasons for 1988·89. delay in laying the papers mentioned at (41) above. [Placed in (38) A statement (Hindi and English library. 599 No. LT-1060/90] versions) shOWing reasons for delay in laying the papers men- (43) (i) A copy of the Annual Report tioned at (37) above. [Placed in (Hind; and Engiish versions) library. See No. LT-1058/90] of the Indian Council of So- cial Science Research. New (39) (i) A copy of the Annual Ac· Delhi for the year 1988-89 counts (Hindi and English along with Audned. versions) of the Kendriya Vidyalaya Sangathan, New (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi Delhi, for the year 1988·89. and English versions) by the Government of the working (ii) A copy of the Annual Ac- of Indian Council of Social counts (Hindi and English Science Research, New versions) of the Kendriya Delhi, for the year 1988-89. Vidyalaya Sangathan, New Delhi, for the year , 988-89 (44) A statement (Hindi and English together with Audit Report versions) showing reasons for thereon. delay in laying the papers mentioned at (43) above. [Placed in (iii) A statement (Hindi and Library. 589 No. l T-1061/90] English versions) regarding Review by the Government (45) (i) A copy of the Annual Report on the working of the Ken- (Hindi and English versions) driya Vidvalava Sanaathan. of the Board of the Board of 13 Papers Laid JYAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) Papers Laid 14

Apprenticeship Training. delay in laying the papers mer1'- Kanpur, for the year 1988·89 tioned at (49) above. [Placed in along with Audited Accounts. Library. 598 No. LT-1064/901

(ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi (51 ) (i) A copy of the Annual Report and English versions) by the (Hindi and English versions) Government on the working of the Regional Engineering of the Board of Apprentice- College, Waranga', for the ship Training, Kanpur, forthe year 1988-89. year 1988-89. (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi (46) A statement (Hindi and English and English ve,'sions) by the versions) showing reasons for Government on the working delay in laying the papers men- of the Regional Engineering tioned at (45) above, [Placed in College, Warangal, for ths Library. See No. LT -1062190] year 1988-89.

(47) (I) A copy of the Annual Report (52) A statement (Hindi and English (Hindi and English versions) versions) showing reasons for of the National School of delay in laying the papers men- Drama, New Delhi, for the tioned at (51) above. [Placed in year 1988-89 along with Library. See No. LT -1065/90] Audited Accounts. (53) (i) A copy of the Annual Report (Ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi (Hindi and English versions) and English versions) by the of the Regional Engineering Government on the working College, Calicut, for the year of the National School of 1988·89. Drama, New Delhi, for the year 1988-89. (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi and English versions) by ~he (48) A statement (Hindi and English Government on the working versions) showing reasons for of the Regionai Engineering delay in laying the papers men- College, Calicut, for the year tioned at (47) above. [Placed in 1988·89. Library. 598 No. LT-1063/90] (54) A statement (Hindi and English (49) (i) A copy of the Annual Report versions) showing reasons for (Hindi and English versions) delay in laying the papers men- of the Regional Engineering tioned at (53) above. [Placed in College, Durgapur, for the Library. Se8 No. LT -1066/90} year 1988-89. (55) A copy of the Annual Accounts (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi (Hindi and English versions) of and English versions) by the the Regional Engineering College, Government on the working Durgapur, for the year 1988-89 of the Regional Engineering together with Audit Report college, Durgapur, for the thereon. [Placed in Library. See year 1988--89, No. LT-1067/90]

(50) A statment (Hindi and English (56) A copy of the Annual Accounts versions) showing reasons for (Hindi and English versions) of 15 Papers Laid MAY 30, 1990 Papers Laid 16

the Regional Engineering College, foundry and forge Technol- Warangal, for the year 1988-89 ogy, Ranch;, for the year togetherw~h Aud~ Report thereon. 1988~89. [Placed in library. 59' No. LT- 1068190] (61 ) A statement (Hindi and English versions) showing reasons for (57) A copy of the Annual Accounts delay in laying the papers men- (Hindi and English versions) of tioned at (60) above. [Placed in the Regional Engineering College, Library. SH No. LT-1071/90] ea licut , for the year 1988-89 along w"h Aud~ Report thereon. [Placed (62) A copy of the Annual Accounts in Library. 5e8 No. LT-1061190] (Hindi and English versions) of the Maulana Azad College of (58) (i) A copy of the Annual Report Technology, Bhopal, for the year (Hindi and English versions) 1988~89 together with Audit Re- of the National Book Trust, port thereon. [Placed in Library. India, New Delhi, for the year See No. LT -1072190] 1988-89 along with Audited Accounts. (63) (i) A copy of the Annual Report (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi (Hindi and English versions) and English versions) by the of the Sangeet Natak Government on the working Akademi, New Delhi, for the of the National Book Trust, year , 988-89 along with India, New Delhi, for the year Audited Accounts. 1988-89. (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi (59) A statement (Hindi and English and English versions) by the versions) showing reasons for Government on the working delay in laying the papers men- eM the Sangeet Natak tioned at (58) above. [Placetj in Akademi, New Delhi, for the Library. See No. LT-1070/90] year 1988-89.

(60) (i) A copy of the Annual Report (64) A statement (Hindi and English (Hindi and English versions) versions) showing reasons for of the National Instnute of delay in laying the papers men- Foundry and Forge Technol- tioned at (63) above. [Placed in ogy, Ranchi. for the year Library. See No. LT-1073/90] 1988-89. (65) (i) A copy of the Annual Report (Ii) A copy of the Annual Ac- (Hindi and English versions) counts (Hindi and English of the technical Teachers' versions) of the national In- Training Institute, Chandi- stnute of Foundry and Forge garh. for the year 1988-89 Technology, Ranchi, for the along wnh Audited Accounts. year 1988-89 together w~h Audit Report thereon. (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi (iii) A copy of the Review (Hindi and English versions) by the and English versions) by the Govemment on the working Government on the working of the Technical Teachers' of the natfOnal Institute of Training Institute. Chandi- 17 Papers Laid JVAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) Papers Laid 18

gam, for the year 1988-89. Library. Se9 No. LT -1076190]

(66) A statement (Hindi and English (71) (i) A copy of Annual Report versions) showing reasons for (Hindi and English versions) delay in laying the papers men- of the Asiatic Society, Cal· tioned at (65) above. [Placed in cutta, for the year 1987·88 Library. 588 No. LT -1074190] along w~h Audited Accounts.

(67) (i) A copy of the Annual Report (il) A copy of the Review (Hindi (Hindi and English versions) and English versions) by the of the Technical Training Government on the working Institute, Bhopal, for the year of the Asiatic Society, Cal- 1988-89 along w~h Audbed cutta, for the year 1987-88. Accounts. (72) A statement (Hindi and English (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi versions) showing reasons for and English vers;ons) by the delay in laying the papers men- Government on the working tioned at (71) above. [Placed In of the Technical Teachers' Library. 589 t!o. LT-1077/90] Training Institute, Bhopal for the year 1988-89. (73) (i) A copy of the Annual Report (Hindi and English versions) (68) A statement (Hindi and English of the Navodaya Vidyalaya versions) showing reasons for Samiti, New Delhi, forthe year delay in laying these papers 1988-89. mentioned at (67) above. [Placed in Library. 588 No. LT -1 075/90] (ii) A copy of the Annual Ac- counts (Hindi and English (69) (i) A copy of the Annual Report versions) of the Navodaya (Hindi and English versions) Vidyalaya Samiti. New Delhi. of the CentraJ Jnstitute of 10r the year 1988-89. Hind i, Ag ra, for the year 1988- 89. (iii) A copy of the Review (Hindi and English versions) by (ii) A copy of the Annual Ac- Government on the working counts (Hindi and English of the National Institute of versions) of the Centrallnsti- Educational Planning and tute of Hindi, Agra, for the Administration, New Delhi. year 1988-89 together wbh Audit Report thereon. (74) A statement (Hindi and English versions) showing reasons for (iii) A copy of the Review (Hindi delay in laying the papers men· and English versions) by the tioned at (73) above. [Placed In Government on the working Library. 589 No. LT -1078190] of the Central Inst~ut6 of Hindi, Agra, for the year 1988- (75) (I) A copy of the Annual Report 89. (Hindi and English versions) of the National Inst~ute of (70) A statement (Hindi and English Educational Planning and versions) showing reasons for Administration I New Delhi, delay in laying the papers men- for the year 1988-89 along tioned at (69) above. [Placed In with Audited Accounts. 1~ Papsrs Laid MAY 30,1990 Pap8rs Laid 20

(iI) A copy of the Review {Hindi Training Institute (Eastern and English versions) by the Region). Calcutta, fortheyear Government on the working 1988-89. of the National InstHute of Educational Planning and (80) A statement (Hindi and English Administration, New Delhi. versions) showing reasons for delay in laying the papers men· (76) A statement (Hindi and English tioned at (79) above. [Placed in versions) showing reasons for Library. See No. LT-1081/90] delay in laying the papers men· tioned at (75) above. [Placed in (81 ) A copy of Notnication No.G.S. R. Library. SgeNo.lT-1079/90] 39 (Hindi and English versions) published in Gazette of India dated (77) (i) A copy of the Annual Report the 20th January, 1990 making (Hindi and English versions) certain amendments to Statute 1 of the Technical Teachers' of the Indira Gandhi National Open Training Institute, Madras, for UniversIty Act, 1985, under sub· the year '988-89 along with section (2) of section 40 of the Audited Accounts. said act. [Placed In Library. See No. LT -1082/90] (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi and English versions) by the (82) (i) A copy of the Annual Report Government on the worki~ (HIndi and English versions) of the Techntcal Teacher ' by the Government on the Training Institufe. Madras, for working of the Khuda Bakhsh the year 1988-89. Oriental Public Library, Patna, for the year 1988-89. (78) A statement (Hindi and English versions) showing reasons for (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi delay in laying the papers men- and English versions) by the tioned at (77) above. [Placed in Government on the working Library. 5ge No. LT-108C/90] of the Khuda Baksh Oriental Public Library, Patna, for the (79) (i) A copy of the Annual Report year 1988-89. (Hindi and English versions) of the Technical Teachers' (83) A statement (Hindi and English Training Inst~ute (Eastern versions) showing reasons for Region) for the year 1988- delay in laying the papers men· 89. tioned at (82) above. [Placed in library. 598 No. l T-1 083190] (ii) A copy of the Annual Ac- counts (Hindi and English (84) (i) A copy of the Annual Report versions) of the Technical (Hindi and English versions) Teachers' Training Institute, of the Rampur Raze Library Calcutta, for the year 1988- Board. Rampur. for the year 89 together with Audit Report 1988-89 along with Audned thereon. Accounts under sub-section (2) of section 22 of the Ram- (iii) A copy of the Review (Hindi pur Raze library Act, 1975. and English versions) by the Government on the working (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi of the Technical Teachers' and English versions) by the 21 Papers Laid JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Papers Laid 22

Government on the working ofthe Visvesvaraya Regional of the Rampur Raze Library College of Engineering, Board, Rampur, for the year Nagpur, for the year 1988- 1988·89. 89.

(85) A statement (Hindi and English (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi versions) showing reasons for and English versions) by the delay In faying the papers men- Government on the working tioned at (84) above e. [Placed in ofthe Visvesvaraya Regional Library. Sge No. LT -1 084190] College of Engineering, Nagpur, for the year 1988- (86) (i) A copy of the Annual Report 89. (Hindi and English versions) of the Raja Rammohan Roy (91 ) A statement (Hindi and English Library Foundation, Calcutta. versions) showing reasons for for the year 1988-89 along delay in laying the papers men- with Audited Accounts. tioned at (90) above. [Placed in Library. See No. LT-1087/901 (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi and English versions) by th~ (92) (i) A copy of the Annual Report Government on the working (Hindi and English versions) of the Raja Rammohan Roy of the Indian Institute of Library Foundation, Calcutta, Management, Ll1cknow, for for the year 1988-89. the year 1988-89 along with Aud~ed Accounts. (87) A statement (Hindi and English versions) showing reasons for (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi delay in laying the papers men- and English versions) by the tioned at {86} above. [Placed in Government on the working Library. See No. LT -1085/90] of the Indian Institute of Management, Lucknow, for (88) (i) A copy of the Annual Report the year 1988-89. (Hindi and English versions) of the Regional Engineering (93) A statement (Hindi and Engli9h College, Hamirpur, for the versions) showing reasons for year 1988-89. delay in laying the papers mentioned at (92) above. [Placed in (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi Library. S88 No. LT-10BBI901 and English versions) by the Government on the working (94) (i) A copy of the Annual Report of the Regional Engineering (Hindi and English versions) College. Hamirpur, for the of the Malaviya Regional year 1988-89. Engineering CoJlege,Jaipur, for the year 1988-89. (89) A statement (Hindi and English versions) showing reasons for delay in laying the papers men- (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi tioned at (88) above. [Placed in and English versions) by the library. 599 No. LT-1086190] Government on the working of the Malaviya Regional (90) (I) A copy of the Annual Report Engineering College, Jaipur, (Hindi and English versions) for the year 1988-89. 23 Papsrs Laid MAV30.1990 PapsfS Laid 24

(95) A statemen1 (Hindi and English WELFARE (SHRI RAM VILAS PASWAN): versions) showing reasons for On behalf of Shri Subodh Kant Sahay I beg delay in laying the papers men- to lay on the Table a copy of the Notification tioned at (94) above. [Placed In No. U. 14011/160190·Delhi (Hindi. and Library. 599 No. LT-1089/90) English versions) published in Delhi Gazette dated the 5th May, 1990 making certain (96) (i) A copy of the Annual Report amendments to Notification No. U. 140111 (Hindi and English versions) 160189 Delhi dated the 6th January. 1990 of the Motllal Nehru Regional issued under SUb-section (1) of section 490 Engineering College, of the Delhi Municipal Corporation Act, 1957. Allahabad, for the year 1988- [Placed in Library. 588 No. LT -1092190] 89. [English] (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi and English versions) by the POlt Office Time Deposit (Amendment) Government on the working RuIIS, 1990, National Savings Certlfl· of the Motilal Nehru Regional cates (Vllluul) (Amendment) Rulls, Engineering College, 1990 and Notifications under Industrial Allahabad, for the year 1988- Finance Corporation Act, 1948 89. THE DEPUTY MINISTER IN THE (97) A statement (Hindi and English MINISTRY OF FINANCE (SHRI ANIL SHAS- versions) Showing reasons for TRI): I beg to lay on the Table- delay in laying the papers mentioned at (96) above. [Placed in (1) A copy of the Post Office Time Library. See No. LT-1090/90] Depos~ (Amendment) Rules, 1990 (Hindi and English versions) pub- (98) (i) A copy of the Annual Report lished in Notification No. G.S.R. (Hindi and English versions) 507 (E) in Gazette of India dated of the Karnataka Regional the 23rd May;"1990, under sub- Engineering College, Sura- section (3) of section 15 of the thkal, for the year 1988-89. Government Savings Bank Act. 1873. [Placed in Library. See No. (ii) A copy of the Review (Hindi LT-10931.90] and English versions) by the Government on the working (2) A copy of the National Savings of the Karnataka Regional Certificates (VII Issue) Amend- Engineering College, Sura- ment) Rules, 1990 (Hindi and thkal. for the year 1988-89. English versions) published in Notification No. G.S.R. 508(E) in (99) A statement (Hindi and English Gazette of India dated the 23rd versions) showing reasons for May, 1990. under Sub-section (3) delay in laying the papers men- of section 12 of the Government tioned at (98) above. [Placed in Savings Certificates Act, 1959. Library. See No. LT-1091/901 [Placed in Library. SH No. LT- 1094190) (T tans/ation ] (3) A copy each of the following Noti- NotHlcatlon Und.r Deihl Municipal fication (Hindi and English ver- Corporation Act, 1957 sions) under sub-saction(3) of section 43 of the Industrial Fj· THE MINISTER OF LABOUR AND nanee Corporation Act, 1948:- 25 Papers Laid JYAISTHA 9.1912 (SAKA) Papers Laid 26

(i) The Industrial Finance Cor- the various assurances, promises and un- porationof India (Staff) Regu- dertakings given by the Ministers during the lations. 1974 as amended various sessions of lok Sabha:- upto 27th October, 1986 published in Notification No. (1) Statement No. XXIV- Fourth Ses- 10187 in Gazette of India sion.1985 [Placed in Library. See dated the 12th September, No. l T-1096/90] 1987. (2) Statement No. XXVII-Fifth Ses- (ii) Notification No. 6/87 pub- sion, 1986 [Placed in Library. See lished in Gazette of India No. LT-1097/90] dated the 9th May, 1987 making certain amendments (3) Statement No.XiX-1l Part of Eighth to Regulation 138 of the In- Session, 198.1 [Placed in Library. dustrial Finance Corporation See No. LT -1098/90] of India (Staff) Regulations, 1974. (4) Statement No.XVIII-Ninth Ses· sion, 1987 [Placed in Library. See (iii) Notification No.14/87 pub- No. LT -1099/901 lished in Gazette of India dated the 26th September, (5) Statement No.XVI-Tenth Session, 1987 making certain amend- 1988 [Placed in Library. See No. ments to Regulations 33(2) LT-1100190] and 117 of the Inustrial Fi- nanc~ Corporation of India (6) Statement NO.XII-Eleventh Ses- (Staff) Regulations, 1974. sion, 1988 [Placed in Library. See No. LT-1101/90] (iv) Notification No. Admn. 135/ 88-157 published in Gazette of India dated the 8th Febru- (7) Statement No.IX-Twelfth Ses- ary, 1988 making certain sion, 1988 [Placed in Library. 588 amendments to Regulations No. LT-1102/90] 3(e) and 66 of the Industrial Finance Corporation of India (8) Statement No. VIII· Thirteenth (Staff) Regulations, 1974. Session, 1989 [Placed in Library. [Placed in Library. See No. Se8 No. LT-1103/90 LT -1 095/90] (9) Statement NO.V-Fourteenth Ses- sion, 1989 (Placed in Library. See No. LT-1104/90] Statement showing action taken by Government on various assurances, Ninth Lok Sabha Promises Undertakings given by the Ministers during various 88,,'onl of (1) Statement No.III-First Ses- Lok Sabha sion,1989 [Placed in Library. See No. LT-1105/90j

THE DEPUTY MINISTER IN THE (2) Statement No. If-Second Session, MINISTRY OF PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS 1990 [Placed tn Library. 598 No. (CH. JAGDEEP DHANKHAR): ,beg to lay LT-1106190} on the Table a copy each of the following statements (Hindi and English versions) showing action taken by the Government on 27 Message from R. S. MAY 30,1990 Sal. &All. of officers of 28 Pari. (Amend.) Bill 11.07 hr •• "That leave be granted to introduce a Bill to empower the Central Govern- MESSAGE FROM RAJYA SABHA ment to direct the transfer of the land, or of the rights in or over land or of the [Eng/ish] right, title and interest in relation to a coal mine, coking coal mine or coke SECRETARY-GENERAL: SIr, I have over plant, vested in the Coal IndIa to report the following message received Limited or in a subsidiary company to from the Secretary-General of Rajya any subsidiary company of Coal India Sabha:- Limited or any other subsidiary company and to validate certain transfers "In accordance with the provisions of of such land or rights". rule 127 of the Rules of Procedure and Conduct of Business in the RaJya MR. SPEAKER: The questIon IS: Sabha,1 am directed to inform the Lok Sabah that the Rajya Sabha. at its "That leave be granted to introduce a sitting held on the 29th May, 1990, Bill to empower the Central Govern- agreed w~hout any amendment to the ment to direct the transfer of the land, Gold (Control) Repeal SIll, 1990, which or of the fights in or over land or of the was passed by the Lok Sabha at its right, title and interest in relate to coal srtting held on the 24th May, 1990." mine, coking coal mine or coke over plant, vested in the Coal India LImited or in a subsidiary company to any 11.07 1/2 hrs. subsidiary company of Coal India Limited or any other subSidiary com- COMMIITEE ON ABSENCE OF MEM- pany and to validate certain tr.ansfers BERS FROM THE SIITINGS OF THE of such land or rights". HOUSE The Motion was Adopted MlnLrtes MR. SPEAKER: The Minister may in- [English] troduce the Bill.

SHRI A. CHARLES (Trivandrum): I beg SHRI ARIF MOHAMMAD KHAN: Intro- to lay on the Table Minutes (Hindi and duce the Bill. English versions) of the sitting of the committee on Absence of Members from the Sit· tings of the House held on the 24th May, 11.09 hr •. 1990. SALARIES AND ALLOWANCES OF OFFICERS OF PARLIAMENT (AMEND- 11.08 hr •• MENT) BILL·

COAL INDIA {REGULATIONS OF [English] rRANSFERS AND VAllDATIONt BILL THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE [English 1 MINISTRY OF PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS AND MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINIS- THE MINISTER OF ENERGY AND TRY OF TOURISM (SHRI SA TV A PAL MINISTEROF CIVIL AVIATION (SHRIARiF MALIK): On behalf of Shrl P. Upendra, I beg MOHAMMAD KHAN): I beg to move: to move:

'Published in Gazette of India, Part II, Section 2, dated 30.(.90. 29 Matters Under JVAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) Rule 377 30

"That leave be granted to introduce a Supplies Minister has assured that from May, Bill further to amend the Salaries and 1990,1,60,000 tonnes of rice will be allotted. Allowances of Officers of Parliament But so far. the assured rice has not been Act, 1953." allQtted to Kerala. I request the Central Government to immediately allot 1,65,000 MR. SPEAKER: The question is: tonnes rice to Kerala.

'That leave be granted to introduce a Bill further to amend the Salaries and MR. SPEAKER: Shri PeterG. Marinad- Allowances of Officers of Parliament ing. Act, 1953."

The Motile was Adopted SHRIMATI SUBHASHINI ALI (Kanpur): Sir, what happened to the Zero Hour? MR. SPEAKER: The Minister may introduce the Bill. [Translation]

SHRI SATYA PAL MALIK: I introduce** MR.SPEAKER: What about Zero Hour? the Bill. [English]

SHRI SOMNATH CHATTERJEE 11.10 hrs. (80Ipur): There is no official Zero Hour ...... (Interruptions) MAnERS UNDER RULE 3n [ Translation] [Eng/ish] MR. SPEAKER: Every body wants to (I) Need to allot more rice to Ker- raise the matter under rule 377. We have to ala for distribution through go by the list of business because it is 'Public Distribution system' necessary. Please taka your seat...... (Inter- ruptions) PROF. K.V. THOMAS (Ernakulam): As statutory rationing is prevailing in Kerala, [Eng/ish] Central Government has to give the entire rice for c,;stribution systems. For giving full SHRI AMAL DA ITA (Diamond Har- ration i.e. 220 gms. per person per day- bour): Sir, I have told you that I want to raise Kerala needs 1,65,000 tonnes of rice per a matter of great concern to everybody. month. In 1989, Central Government allot- (Interruptions) ted 1 lakh ton rice per month, as the procurement of rice was not adequate. There was a MR. SPEAKER: I Know the issue you promise at that time that when the procure- want to raise is important and urgent, Mr. ment improves in November, Kerala will be Amal Babu. But what can I do? I am now on given the fun, quota. From January, 1990, Matters under Rule 377. Take your seat the quota has gone upto 1,25,000 tonnes of rice. In February, Kerala Government as well as all the MPs from Kerala have repre- (Interruptions) sented to the Central Government to allot 1,65,000 tonnes of rice, as the procurement of rice has improved. Han. Food and Civil

··Introduced with the recommendation of the President. 31 Matt9rs Unde, MAY 30,1990 Rul,377 32

11.12 hr •• have the rights and responsibilities which Banks enjoy under the Banking Regulation MAnERS UNDER RULE 377-CONTD. Act 1949, why then the Land Development Banks should be deprived of the same while [English] competing very seriously in the present GdyS. (II) Need to r.lax the Foreign .... I WOUld, therefore, urge upon the Gov- (Protect ad Araas) Order, 1958 ernment to take necessary action urgently to promote tourism In Megha· 'eye so as to allow the Land Development Banks to resort to the functional improvements as permitted under the Banking Regulations SHRI PETER G. MARBANIANG (Shil- Act. 1949. long): Meghalaya is endowed with beautiful flora and fauna. The State has a peaceful (IV) Need to look Into cases of law and order situation and the people are harassment to drug manufac- friendly. The State Government have under- turers taken many schemes to attract tourists. Tourism will generate self-employment for SHRI VASA NT SATHE (Wardha): It is the educated unemployed youths. However, learnt that the Department of Chemicals Meghalaya continues to be a restricted area have r~opened the DPEA cases 'covering for foreigners under the Restriction Area the penod from 1979to 1987. This is causing Order of the Foreigners (Protected Areas) lot of harassment to a large number of drug Order, 1958. This has been a big disincen- manufacturers. The basic idea of DPEA was tive for foreign tourists and has deprived the to encourage local production in the country nation of valuable foreign exchange. This at a time during which there was very little Order has also created a fear psychosis to bulk drug produc.1ion in the country. The domestic tourists to visit Meghalaya. It is concept of DOPA was evolved to compen- urgently required to relax the said Order to sate those manufacturers whose cost of include individual tourists also. All parts of production would naturally be higher vis-a- Meghalaya should be opened to them. Per- vis imported material. When a .nanufacturer mits, H required to be issued, should be utilitie~ such material for which different prices available from State Government's offices in were fixed and when such material was used New Delhi and Calcutta as well as within the in the formulation, the prices of which were State. Even better would be a relaxation of also fixed by the Government on the basis of . the rules as prevailed prior to 1979. higher rates of raw material, then the Gov- ernment should consider appropriate set of rules to compensate the manufacturers for (III) Nead to allow land Develop- the losses incurred for the purpose of equali- ment Banks to Resort to func- zation so that the prices of pharmaceutical tional Improvements 8S permitted under Blnklng Regula- products are kept steady. I am sure that the Government would do justice to the large tions Act, 1949 number of manufacturers on the merits of their cases. SHRI SUDHIR GIRl (Contai): Land Development Banks have been serving the rural India for a long time by way of providing While it is true that some manufacturers could have made some unintended benefits long t~rm development credit to the people mainly on account of consumption of lower especially to those living at the bottom of the social strata. After the introduction of the cost of raw material, at the same time prices muHi agency systems in the operation of the of number of bulk drugs and its formulations were not fixed because of the administrative banking activities, the Land Development Banks have been facing keen competklon. If bottleneck. Also, whenever such prices were the Cooperative Banks of the country can fixed, in qu~e afew casas it did not reflect the 33 Matters Under JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Ru19377 34 true cases. I am sure the Government will pendente. Despite repeated demands made seriously look into all these matters. to the Railway Administration over the years, nothing fruitful has come out. That is why the (v) Need to annOU.1Cl more In· local people have decided to stag. a mas- centlve. to sugareame grow· sive dhama and to start 'rail roko agitation' .rs, particularly of Mahar.sh· under the aegis of some of the Members of tra the Parliament and the State Legislative Assembty w.e.f. 3rd July, 1990 in support of SHRI BALASAHEB VIKHE PATIL their referred to below demands. The Rail- (Kopargaon): Sir, in Maharashtra, sugar way Adm inistration will alone responsible for factories started early sugarcane crushing this agitation. The Sudha-Vishnu Express operations which will oontinue up to the end trains be introduced from Gays In to all of June, but the incentives announced by the diredions, 98 kms. long ~aya-Patna single Government for late crushing of sugarcane line be doubled and eledrified: are not adequate. Government is already aware that recovery of sugar has gone down Gaya-Kiul single line be doubled and sharply from 11 per cent to 8.5 per cent and express trains be introduced on this section; the incentives announced by the Centre are too inadequateforthe sugarfactories as well In view of heavy rush of passengers and as for the farmers to recover the losses increasing number of accidents. overbridges incurred by them. In the first week of June, be construded on crossing No. 1-2 and recovery is likely to go down to 7 per cent. In Bageshwari crossing; order to help the farmers and sugar facto· ries, 100 per cent free sale of sugar should Platforms and sheds be constructed on be allowed. At the same time. 100 per cent all the stations; excise duty on levy and free sale of sugar should be waived off so that the losses A halt station by the name of Manipur incurred by the sugar factories may be mini· Bazar be provided between Gaya and mised and the farmers are paid reasonably. Manipur junctions;

Government should take immediate Large scale pilferage of railway proper- steps to announce fresh additional incen- ties and goods at Gaya Jn . and other sta- tives for late crushing season; otherwise tions under Mughalsarai division be checked there may be morethan one milliontonnesof whh the co-operation of railway police; sugarcane likely to be carried over whereby condition of farmers will be worsened. It is Gaya railway station be modernised my humble submission that Government from all. points of view; should take the remedial measures whhout any further loss of time to save la.khs of On the western side of Gaya station at farmers. Delhi a par. a ticket booking counter be opened; [Translation) Two minutes stoppage for Rajdhani (vi) Need· to provide more faclll- Express be provided at Gay. In. 18 It was U•• at Gay. A.'IW~y Station done on 19th May f 1990;

SHRI ISHWAR CHAUOHAAY(Gaya): A separate bogie be mail and expr881 Gaya, which is sHuated on the Eastern Rajl- train passing through the route at Gay. In.; way, is an internationally famous p1ace. Time is a lot of resentment among the people in Improv.,nent should be brought about Gay. as no development has taken pl_ in in the deplorabtt condition of footpath abng rallw.~s thls area in r.. pect of afte', inde- the railway In, OV., tht railway bridge on 35 Matters Under MAY 30,1990 Ruie3n 36

[Sh. Ishwar Chaudhary] youths in these areas get employment. river Falgu so as to check accidents; [English]

Cold drinking water be provied all the (vIII) Need to set up a separate platforms at Jahanabad, Newadah and subsidiary coal company for Aurangabad Road stations by installing water Orrlsa coolers there; SHRI RAVI NARAYAN PANt (080g- A railway line be laid from Rajgir to arh): Sir, Talcher and Ib Valley coalfields Ranchi via, Gaya, Bodh Gaya, Sherghati, emerged in the national scenario about seven Chatra, Hazaribagh and Palamau; and to eight decades ago when it was discovered that the largest coking coal resources in Asia Express trains be introduced from are available in these two premier coalfields. Dhanbad to Gaya and Mughal Sarai. Out of the total 3189 sq. kms. coal bearing areas only 5,405 sq. kms. has so far been I would like to request the Central Gov- geographically explored. The development ernment to consider the above demands and production of coal resources have also seriously and immediate action be taken in not been paid much attention by the Depart- order to avert the ensuing agitation to be mentofcoal sofar.lnviewofthe urgent need started w.e.f. the 3rd July. for development of these coa~ields as well as to increase the production, it is very (vII) Need to set up small and cot· necessary to create a separate coal com- tage Industries In Mallhabad, pany in Orissa. But this proposal has been Uttar Pradesh and to provide rejected by the Government on the plea that credit facilities there at low rate a separate coal company cannot be set up of Interest unless the production of coal is raised to 20 million tonnes. The same criterion was not SHRI SARJU PRASAD SAROJ (Mo- applied when a separate coal company was han!a! Ganj): Mr. Speaker, Sir, through the set up at Singrauli and also in Assam where august House, I would like to draw the atten- the production was hardly 10 to 12 million tion of the Government towards Malihabad and much below 5 million tonnes respec- in Uttar Pradesh, where large number of tively. So, the plea is not justified. weavers reside. Carpets, coarse cloth and chikan embroidery work done by them are [DR. THAMBI OURAi-in the Chai~ very much in demand in the country as well as abroad. 11.22 hrs. Besides this, combs, buttons, pen, clips and bangles made from bones in Hasanganj Abbas Khera in Uttar Pradesh are also very With the creation of a separate coal much in demand in foreign countries. But company in the State, about 20,000 addi- due to shortage of power and lack of other tional employment avenues are likely to be input, economic condition of the people is generated my 2,000 A.D. Besides, the de- not improving. velopment of coal resources will be under- taken systematically under the direct super· I, therefore, would like to request the vision of the company. Central Government to set up small and cottage industries at those places and to give loans to these people at low rate, so that As such. I demand that a separate economic conc:Ntion of these people could subsidiary coal company should be set up In improve and thousands of unemployed the State exclusively for Orissa forthwith. 37 Matters Under JYAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) RuJe377 38

[Translation] AN HON. MEMBER: What will we do till then? (Ix) Need to provide financial aa· slstanee to the Government of THE MINISTER OF LABOUR AND Rajasthan for drought relief WELFARE (SHRI RAM VILAS PASWAN): and to relax the Forest Law to Till then, a discussion will be held on the enable the Scheduled Tribes Land Reforms Bill. At 2.30 p.m. both the Bills and farmers to earn their IIv. will be put to vote ... (/nte"uptions) ... IIhood [English] SHRI GUMAN MAL LODHA (Pali): Mr. Chairman, Sir, I would like to draw the atten- MR. CHAIRMAN: Will you please re- tion of the House to the menace caused by peat? 'Neelgays' numbering in thousands. These 'Nilgays' are destroying crops in the fields in [Trans/ation ] Desuri, Marwar junction, Raipur and in Bali tahsil of Pali district. The Game Sanctuary SHRI SATYAPAL MALIK: Discussion is and Reserved Forests have further brought going on the 66th Constitutional Amend- misery for the Tribals and village population ment Bill. After the Debate is completed and of the area as they been deprived of their the Minister's reply is over, both the Consti- land, forest wealth as well as source of tution Amendment Bills will be put to vote water. They are facing a lot of problems due together. to expansion in the area of Game Sanctuary and reserved forests. Even the roads lead- [English] ing to temple are closed by the officials of reserved forests. So these people have MR. CHAIRMAN: I hope the House will decided to launch an agitation to invne the accept it .... (Interruptions) ... attention of the Central Government for redressal of their grievances. Thousands of [Translation] people are suffering from drought and scar- city of water. There are no facilities for irriga- SHRI RAM VILAS PASWAN: All the tion and tt is giving rise to unemployment. I Members will come today, so you can go. would like to request the Central Govern· We do not need your support. ment to provide funds to the Rajasthan Government for drought relief and the offi- [Eng/ish 1 cers of the Forest and the Game Sanctuary should be directed to relax the Forest Law for We are capable to protect the interests Adivasis and peasants so that they can earn of the Scheduled Castes and Scheduled their livelihood and utitise the land and wood Tribes. We do not want support from your of. the forest. side.

[T rans/ation 1 [ Translation] SHAI DAU DAYAL JOSHI (Kota): Mr. THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE Chairman. Sir, I am on a point of order. The MINISTRY OF PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS Congress Party is regretting for whatever AND MINISTER OF STATE IN THE MINIS- they did yesterday... (/nte"utJtions) ... TRY OF TOURISM (SHAI SATYAPAL MALIK): Mr. Chairman, Sir, discussion on [Eng/ish] the (Sixty-Sixth) Consthution Amendment Bill is going on I suggest that both the Sills be MR. CHIRMAN: It will not go on record. put to vote together at about 2.30P.M. I have not allowed .... (Int8"Uptions) ... 39 Matters Under MAY 30,1990 Rule 377 40

MR. CHAIRMAN: Don't waste the time MR. CHAIRMAN: Please continue. of the House. Please take your seat. SHAI DINESH SINGH: I was giving time to all the han. Members to show their loyalty to the Prime Minister. (Interruptions) MR. CHAIRMAN: lam going to allow only two parsons Mr. Dinesh Singh and Mr. THE PRIME MINISTER (SHAt VISH· Amal Datta because the Speaker has told WANATH PRATAP SINGH): Loyalty is on this. (Int9"Uptions) that side. 1t does not come here. Here, it is comradeship. MR. CHAIRMAN: Do not waste the time. SHRI MADAN LAL KHURANA(South Delhi): I am on a point of order. (Interrup- tions) SHRI DINESH SINGH (Pratapgarh): Mr. Chairman, Sir, in the Times of India today, SHRI VISHWANATH PRATAP SINGH there is a report. (Interruptions) I would :Loyalty is only on that side. tt does not come request the Prime Minister to pay a little here. Here it is comradeship. (/nt8"uptions) attention to me. There is a re~rt in the Times of India today which says Rnd I quote: (Inter- MR. CHAIRMAN : Please take your ruptions) seat. I am on my legs. Take your seat. Now I think already we have come to an under- MR. CHAIRMAN: Mr Amal Datta, please standing through our Parliamentary Affairs go to your seat. Minister regarding the Zero Hour. If you take up this issue of Zero Hour once again, there (Interruptions) are so many problems that are going to come then we ~nnot take up any other SHRI DINESH SINGH: I was saying business today. tt will prolong like that. We that there is a report in the Times of India have got only one more day. Therefore, if today and I quote from that: you all come to an agreement. then we can get rid of this Zero Hour and take up the "That Prime Minister, Mr. V.P. Singh, business. Why I allowed Mr. Dinesh Singh ... said the Congress decision not to cooperate with the Government even SHRI MADAN LAL KHURANA: Only w~h regard to legislate measures in- one sentence. tended only to help the weaker sections clearly showed that the party's MR. CHAIRMAN: If you say, then all the sympathy for the poor was only skin- 500 Members may like to say and then what deep. This was a" the more unfortu- can I do? (Interruptions) nate ...

(Interruptions) MA. CHARIMAN: When the Speaker was in the chair, you raised an issue at that MR. CHAIRMAN: Please order. and the Minister also replied to that. Please cooperate with me. Everybody has got his (Int9"Uptions) own problems. Why I am allowing Mr. OJ- nash Singh is, when the Speaker was in the SHRI DINESH SINGH: They are not Chair, he said that after matter under rule even willing to listen to what their Prime 3n was over, h. was going to caU Mr. Minister has said. Danesh Singh and Mr. Amal Datta. That is way, I called him. Ple.e cooperate with me. ( Int.rruptions) (In'.""."ions) 41 Matters Unde, JVAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Rule.177 42

MR. CHAIRMAN: For everything, there aware of your loyalty and we are feeling p~y is a limit. If you go on raising a point of order, for it. (Interruptions) . everybody can raise tt on any issue. Is he going to express his views or go on (Interruptions) reading the newspaper? (Intsrruptions) . They themselves have planted it in the press. MR. CHAIRMAN: I want to listen to what (Interruptions) . he says. [English) (Interruptions) SHRI DINESH SINGH: I am sorry that [Translation] Shri ram Dhan is getting so impatient. He has to wait till 2.30 anyhow for the Bill to SHRI JANARDAN TeWARI (Sewan): pass. So. he can. in the meantime, listen to In his clarification, why he is quoting from the us. (Interruptions) I was saying that there is newspaper. (Interruptions) a news item today in the Times of India which says this and for the convenience of the SHRt MADAN LAL KHURANA: Hany- House, since there was a disturbance, I shall one wants to quote, he should quote from the just read it briefly again. proceeding of the House. because ~ is treated as official record. AN HON. MEMRFR: Please do not read it again. MR. CHAIRMAN: Nothing will go on record. SHAI DINESH SINGH: All right, then from where I left, I shall continue. (Int8rrup- (Jnterruptions) * tions) The Prime Minister is reported to have said that I this was all the more unfortunate MR. CHAIRMAN: He is only giving a because the party representative Mr. Dinesh personal explanation. Singh had promised support for these Bills at the Business Advisory Committee meeting (I nterruptions) on May 25'. I would like to inform the Prime Minister and the House that I am not a MR. CHAIRMAN: Please do not waste member of the Business Advisory Commit- any time. He is not raising any issue new tee; I Glid not attend the meeting of the Shri Dinesh Singh may continue now. Business Advisory Committee; and I did not give any assurance in the Business Advisory ( Interruptions) Committee. The difficuhy in all these things is, Sir, that somebody probably conveys SHRt DINESH SINGH: Sir, I was trying wrong information to the Prime Minister and to read this for a personal explanation. The he goes on making statement on that basis. dHficutty is that hon. Members are not willing (Interruptions) .1 am not raising a privUeg. to listen even on a personal explanation. issue. I am only trying to point out to this This is the whole difficulty. They all want to House and to the Prime Minister that this prove their Ioyahv to the Prima Minister and kind of misleading the House or the country therefore they are not willing to listen to what is not going to help. (Interruptions) somebody else says. SHRIVISHWANATHPRATAPSINGH: ITranslation] There has bean no misleading on this .id•. I think there is some misreading on that side. SHRI RAM DHAN (Lalganj): W. are (JntelTUptions) eNot raoorded. 43 Matters Under Rule 377 MAY 30,1990 Const. (66th Amend.) Bill 44

[Sh. Vishwanath Pratap Singh] Minister in charge 01 Civil Aviation to take immediate steps because the safety of the The only proper document to be read in passengers is involved in this. Vayudoot is the House regarding any Member's state- not maned by experience engineers and the ment are the proceedings the House and not maintenance facilities are very poor and newspapers. May I tell honourable Dinesh whatever facilities are there are not being Singhji that I did not even mention his name? used properly. ThereforS, the passengers I do not know how and by what imagination are in great danger. Is the Government he thinks that' have mentioned his name. waiting for a crash to take place? I warn the You see the proceedings here. You should Government that unless thoy take immedi- have gone to the library and seen the pro- ate steps to stop the mismanagement in- ceedings there. (Interruptions) . I did not cluding the extravagant expenditure, the even mention your name her~. I do not know passengers will be in danger. Most of the how you are under that impression. (Inter- persons in driving pockets have been ap- ruptions) pointed during the last regime and they are still continuing to do whatever they were MR. CHAIRMAN: Mr. Amal Datta. (In- doing. So, the Government should take notice terruptions) of these points and do something about this matter to ensure the safety of the passen- SHRI SOMNATH CHATTERJEE gers. (Interruptions) (Bolpur): I have a personal explanation to make Sir. MR. CHAIRMAN: Iwanttoknowfrom all MA. CHAIRMAN: You give whatever of you as to whether you want me to proceed explanation want to give. I will listen ~ all the with the business of the House or you want Members will listen to you. (Interruptions) time to listen to everything you are saying ( Interruptions) MR. CHAIRMAN: Have you given notice to raise this point? SHRI SOMNATH CHATIERJEE: Not everything but important things. (Interrup- SHRI SOMNATH CHATIERJEE: I am tions) giving notice now. (Interruptions) MR. CHAIRMAN: I will straightaway go . MR. CHAIRMAN: You give notice and to the business of the House. then I will see. (Interruptions)

SHRI VISHWANATH PAATAP SINGH: Kewalji has raised a point about the Mandai 11.44 hrs. Commission. I assure the hon. Members of the House that in the first six months, we CONSTITUTION ON (SIXTY-SIXTH have covered quite a bit of our National Front AMENDMENT) BllL-CONTD. manifesto and during the coming six months, the Mandai Commisston will be given the top [English] priority to start with (/nte"uptions) MR. CHAIRMAN: The House will now SHRI AMAL DATTA (Dimond Harbour): take up discussion on the motion for consid- Sir,l want to mention a very important matter eration of the Constitution (Sixty-Sixth before the House. A very disturbing and Amendment) moved by Shri Upendra Nath frightening information has come about the Verma on 29th May, 1990. Shri G.M. lodha mismanagement which is and has been going may continue his speech. on in affairs of VayudootAirlines ... (Inte"up· lions) ... 1want the Prime Minister and the ( IntBrruptions) 45 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 46

SHRI GUMAN MAL LODHA (Pali): Mr. MR. CHAIRMAN: There is no point of Chairman Sir ... (Interruptions) ... order. 1am asking Shri Lodha to continue his speech. (Interruptions) SHRI HARIN PATHAK (Ahmedabad): If you allow Mr. Sathe to speak, then you have MR. CHAIRMAN: Order please. I have to allow us also to speak. (Interruptions) called Shri Lodha only.

MR. CHAIRMAN: I will allow only those [Translation 1 Members who want to speak on the business taken up by the House, i.e., Constitu- SHRI GUMAN MAL LODHA(Pali): Mr. tion (Sixty-5ixth Amendment) Bill and not Chairman speaker, I would like to remind my otherwise. congress friends the words uttered by Pand~ Jawahar Lal Nehru on the issue of land (Interruptions) reforms when the Fiest Constitution Amend- ment Bill was being passed. He had said that SHRI HARIN PATHAK: If you allow Mr. would tantamount to betrayal of crores of Sathe, then we also have some urgent is- farmers if the land reforms were delayed sues to be raised in the House. (Interrup- even for a day. (Interruptions) ...... He had tions). said so in this very House. (Interruptions)

MR. CHAIRMAN: Satheji, do you want [English] to say anything on the Constitution (Sixty- Sixth) Amendment Bill? MR. CHAIRAMN: I have ruled out your point of order. We have already started with SHRI VASANT SATHE(Wardha): I want the next item on the Agenda. to indicate our atlitude on the business of the House ... (Interruptions) (Interruptions)

I am on a point of order .... (Interrup- tions) [Translation]

MR. CHAIRMAN: He is on a point or order. I will be listening to his point of order SHAI VASANT SATHE: We will not sit only. unless we have had Our say. They cannot mislead us like and make us s~ like this. You SHRI VASANT SATHE: My point of must first listen us. (Interruptions) order is that before the business is taken uP. and the Constitution Amendment Bills moved SHRI VASANT SATHE: The Congress by the Government are taken uP. I would have betrayed the nation. Mr. Chairman, once again request the Prime Minister to Indian masses will never forgive them. I agree to lay the Bofors papers on the Table would like to remind them that when first of the House ...... (Interruptions) Constitution Amendment relating to land reforms was brought forward in this very MR. CHAIRMAN: There is no point of House. Pt. Jawaharlal had said that such order. You can only speak on the business land reform measures are not only neces· before the House. sary but inevitable for the poor and landless labourers. The landlords and contractors (Interruptions) have exploited the poor and downtrodden people. Mr. Chairman, Sir. I would like to SHRI VASANT SATHE: If you do not request the congressmen that they should at place the Bofors papers on the Table of the least follow the path shown by Jawaharlal House ... (Interruptions) Nehru. (inte"uptions) 47 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 48

[English] SHRI P.R. KUMARAMANGALAM (Sa- lem): Unless the Minister apologises or with· PROF. P.J. KURIEN (Mavelikara): We draws hi$ statement. .. (/nte"uptions) are not obstructing them. It is they who are obstructing the proceedings of the House. MR. CHAIRMAN: I cannot allow all You allow Mr. Sathe to speak. (Ints"uptions) these things. Please allow me to conduct the business. Nothing will go on record. MR. CHAIRMAN: Yes, what is your point of order? (Interruptions ).

SHRI VASANT SATHE: Sir, I would MR. CHAIRMAN: Nobody ca n sayar say ... (Interruptions) . Sir, I mUSl have my ask the other han. Members to go out. Please say. We will allow them also to speaK. (Intsr- listen to me. The House belongs to every .. ruptions) one. Nobody can say like that. Nothing will go on record. [Translation] (Interruptions) • Sir, this House has not yet turned into their private property. W~ are also equally entitled MR. CHAIRMAN: No han. Member can to put forth of views. You will have to first ask anyone to go out. If anybody has said like listen to us and thereafter to whatever you that, then I would say ~ is wrong. lik. (Interruptions) (Interruptions)· [English] MR. CHAIRMAN: Mr. Paswan, I We will not allow this House to function have never allowed you. Please take unless the papers are laid on the Table. your seat. (Interruptions) (Interruptions)· You cannot cow me down. (Interruptions) MR. CHAIRMAN: Mr. Minister, please [Translat;on] take your seat.

. You cannot escape, you have got to listen to us or we would not leave this place. 12.00 hr •.

(English] ( Interruptions)·

MR. CHAIRMAN: Please take your seat. MR. CHAIRMAN: Mr. Ram Ohan, please (Inte"uptlons) take your seat.

MR. CHAIRMAN: Please take your seat. (Interruptions)· I would request alt the hon. Members to take their seats. I appeal once again to the House MR. CHAIRMAN: Mr. Vasant Sathe, and to the han. Colleagues that ~ you want to please take your seat. transact the business, then you have to cooperate with the Chair ... (Interruptions)·

SHRI VASANT SATHE: They don't MR. VASANT SATHE: We must have want to co.aperat •. (/nte"uptlons)

-Not Recorded. 49 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 50 an apology from the hon. Minister. Can the ask any other Member to go out, because Minister say that ehher we must vote in everyone has the right to be here. In the support, or get out? We are not here at their noise, I could not listen to what had hap- mercy. (Interruptions) This House is not their pened.lde not know, because of lot of noise; property. whoever has said h, it is wrong. That is what I can say. I did not listen, because of the SHRI B.SHANKARANAND (Chikkodi): noise. I could not hear. That is all. I cannot Let the Minister not be so arrogant. (Interrup- compel anyone. I can only sat that whoever tions) We will not allow it. (Interruptions) has said h, ~ is wrong. Therefore, I once again appeal to all of you to try to cooperate MR. CHAIRMAN: Please take your with the Chair. to transact the whole busi- seats. ness.

(Interruptions) (Interruptions)

MR. CHAIRMAN: Please take your PROF. P.J. KURIEN (Mavelikara): He seats; take your seats please. has asked us to go out. (Interruptions)

(Interruptions) MR. CHAIRMAN: That is why there is this demand. h is a wrong thing, if it has SHRI VASANT SATHE: Twice or thrice happened. he repeated it. (Interruptions) (Interruptions) MR. CHAIRMAN: Please take your seats. MR. CHAIRMAN: h is a wrong thing. They have no right. (Interruptions) (Int8rruptions) SHRI VASANT SATHE: Does the Prime Minister approve of this? I would like to MR. CHAIRMAN: I did not notice, be- know. Sir, please ask the Prime Minister. cause of a lot of noise. So, I do not know. (Interruptions) ( Int~ffuptions) MR. CHAIRMAN: Please take your seats. PROF. P.J. KURIEN: Sir. I think you should react to it. Let ~ be the Minister, or (Interruptions) anybody else ... (Inteffuptions)

MR. CHAIRMAN: Take your seats first, MR. CHAIRMAN: I never called him to please; all of you take your seats. speak. Therefore, whatever he said, I did not hear. (Interruptions) ( Interruptions) MR. CHAIRMAN: Mr. Kamal Chaudhry, please take your seat. Order please ... MR. CHAIRMAN: I never called him to speak. (Int8rruptions) (Int9"uptions) MR. CHAIRMAN: I once again appeal to all the hon. Members: please try to cooperate with the Chair. We have to transact of Now please listen to the Minister. Mr. a lot of business. Nt) Member has the right to Yadav. (Int9rruptions) 51 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 52

( Translation] Minister speak. (Interruptions)

THE MINISTER OF TEXTILES .~ND [English] MINISTER OF FOOD PROCESSING IN- DUSTRIES (SHRI SHARAD YADAV): Mr. He said: if you do not want to support it, Chairman, Sir, I am sorry to say that the han. you get out. (Interruptions) Members of Opposition are not taking the comments of Shri Ram Vilas in right per- [ Trans/ation] spective. We do not want to hurt their feel· ings in anyway or show any disresped to THE PRIME MINISTER (SHRI VISH- them ...... (Interruptions) ...... 1 would WANATH PRATAP SINGH): We can fold like to say a little about him. He simply said out hands as well as fight for the poor. If that nwill be very good if you support the bill folding hands does not work, we will fight for' and if you do not want to support it, then it. their cause .. (Interruptions) ... (Interruptions) &HRI VASANT SATHE: It will be better [English] ~ you first take your fight within the Govern· ment and with Tau to a logical conclusion. SIiRI KAMAL CHAUDHRY (Hoshiar- pur): He said: if you do not want to support it, SHAI VISHWANATH PAATAP SINGH: you get out. (Interruptions) It seems he is not interested in reply. So I take my seat. [ Translation] SHRI VASANT SATHE: We have seen SHAISHARAD YADAV: Mr. Chairman, your all the three fights the Fatehpur, the Sir, I would like to submit and our Prime Sweden and the one relating to Tau. (Inter- Minister also pleaded with folded hands ruptions) yesterday in the House that we should not make it an issue. Even today ...... (/nter· THE MIN ISTER OF FINANCE (PROF. ruptions) ...... Mr. Sathe, Please listen you MADHU DANDAVATE): Please listento him, have been speaking for a fairly long time ...... Shri Sathe, there is no harm in listening. (Inte"uptions) Mr. Sathe, I am :adressing (Inte"uptions) you and I would like to say that we would be extremely happy if Congress extended us SHRI VISHWANATH PRATAP SINGH: spoort in this regard. Therefore, I would like Let Satheji cooldown before I speak .... to say ...... (Interruptions) .... Sir, Satheji raised the issue of fight and accounted many of them but he SHAI VASA NT SATHE: No one other ingnored the foremost one the cosequences that Prime Minister can speak on behaH of of which are before the House ... (Interrup- Government. Who are you to speak? Who tions) has authorised to speak? On whose behaH, you are speaking? [English}

SHRI SHARAD YADAV: I am speaking MR. CHAIRMAN: The Prime Minister is on behalf of the Government. on his legs. Listen to him. What is this?

SHRI VASANT SATHE: The Prime (Interruptions) Minister is sitting. He can speak on behalf of thb Government. In the presenctt of a Cabi· [ Translation] net Minister, the other Minister has no right to speak. What do you want to say. Please sit SRI VISHWANATH PRATAP SINGH: I down. Let the Prime Minister or Deputy Prime am commenting on the points raised by hon. 53 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9.1912 (SAKA) Bill 54

Satheji,lt is he who raised the issue of fights. SHRI VAS ANT SATHE: Place the Bofors not me. He would have bten silenced had he papers. Only then the House will proceed ... received the answer to his point of fight. .. (Interruptions) (Interruptions) ... SHRI SOMNA TH CHA ITERJEE: Iqu~e SHRI M.J. AKBAR (Kishanganj): It were appreciate that they are a little upset be- you who used the word fight... (Interrup- cause Ram Vilasji has made certain obser- tions) vations. I do not know whether they have got the clearance from their leadqr to take part in [English] voting or not... (Int8ffuptions) But before they ask Ram Vilasji to apologise, will they SHRI P.R. KUMARAMANGALAM apologise to the House to the people of this (Salem): First you ask your Minister to apoli- country, specially to the poor people, the gise. Scheduled Castes and Scheduled Tribes for their conduct yesterday? (Interruptions) i Translation] SHAI HARtSH RAW AT (Almara): We SHRI VISHWANATH PRATAP SINGH: have never appeared that Bill .... (Interrup- Secondly. Sir. if the han. Members sitting in tions) the opposition are under the illusion that we have requested for some thing personal. SHRI SOMNA TH CHA TIERJEE. What then they are grossly mistaken ... (Interrup- has appeared in one of the newspapers tions) .... today is wrongly attributing to me a statement that I had said that they should be [English] kicked out. I did not say that. I said, 4the people have already kicked them out.' There- MR. CHAIRMAN: Nothing will go no fore, they should apologise to the people of record. this country and to the Scheduled Castes and Scheduled Tribes. The people are wait- ( Interruptions)· ing for the land reforms legislation to be passed by this House. Therefore, I request [ Translation] them at least, if they have not got the clearance from their leader, let them find out SRI VISHWANATH PRATAP SINGH: before disturbing like this. There should be Please keep quiet so that may speak ... an end of juvenile delinquency .... (Interrup- (Interruptions) ... tions)

Sir, they do not seem to be interested in [Translation] ~ listening to my view point and if this is what they want, 1better sit down. (Interruptions) SHAI VISHWANATH PRAT AP SINGH: Sir, the papers relating to Bofors were never [English] made an issue when they were in the possession of the member at his house. Again MR. CHAIRMAN: Nothing will go on these papers were not make to stand in the record. way, when the Budget and the Finance Bill of the present Government were brought be- (Interruptions) • fore the House. Now that when it is the question of Indian poor an attempt is being 12.17 hr •• made to put obstacle in hs way. (Int8"up- lions) Tell me, tell me, did the oppositions put JMR. DEPUTY SPEAKER in the Chai~ any obstacle by way of consideration of, this *Not Recorded. 55 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 56

[Sh. Vishwanath Pratap Singh) wants to say and then make your observa- tions, Hany. (Interruptions)

Budget, the Bills and the Finance Bills were MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: It will be in brought in the House. Same was the case gooO taste H you keep your cool for some when other Government business was taken time. up. But when there came the issue of Sched- uled Castes and Scheduled Tribes or that of [English] the Land Reforms, they are trying to evade these on the pretext of Bofors Gun Deal. If SHRI DINESH SINGH: I would like once they think that this Bofors paper Gun Trick of again to repeat that ~ is not a fact that we are theirs can befool the country's poor, they are opposing this Bill. (Interruptions) sadly mistaken. The poor people have already thrown them out of power and even MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Let him today they are strong enough to give them a complete. befitting reply. It is, therefore, advisable that they should allow the Bill to be passed In a SHRI DINESH SINGH: I am saYing that peaceful manner. (Interruptions) it is not that we are opposing this Bill. We are in support of this Bill that has been brought I would like to add one thing more here by Shri Ram Vilas Paswan. that Shri Ram Vilas Paswan remarks never meant to hurt the feelings of hon. members. Sir, we are, as I said, in full support of the At the same time it is true that the poor Ram Ohan Bill. But, he will have to wait till people have voted us to power and they 2.30 P.M. to get what he wants ... (Interrup- have voted for you too. If we do not uphold tions). Sir, the Government have sufficient the cause of the poor in this House, we have strength to pass these Bills. " it was our no right to be here anymore. (/ntsrruptions) intention to oppose the Bills, we would have voted against it. But the very fact that we are MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I wo~ld liketo not voting against it is an indication that if the urge upon all the hon. Members that they Government has a majority, it c..an pass can, by all means, express themselves here these Bills. Our whole pomt was that ~ the H they so desire, but the proceedings are Government is looking for our cooperation to • likely to be gravely impeded if they continue pass these Bills as they do not have suffi- to resort to mud-slinging on one another. I cient number of members present io the would, therefore, urge upon al: of you not to House, then it IS a question of seeking coop- indulge in such thing. Secondly, so far as I eration, we have also been wanting coop- understand may be other differ w~h me, both eration from the Government to place the the sides intend to pass thiS Bill. So, in view Bofors papers on the Table of the House .... of this, no objedionable remarks should be ( Interruptions) made from e~her side that may create an air of uncertainty about the passage of the Bill, SHRI VISHWANATH PRATAP SINGH: due to conjecturs and guesses in this regard. The Constitution Amendment Bills that are There are regalittes an excitements too over on the Agenda, are for giving statutory status here and h becomes very diflicult at times to to Scheduled Castes and Scheduled Tribes run the House smoothly in view of all these Commission and to put Land Reforms in the obstructions. I would like to request all the 9th Schedule. That is the Agenda. What you hon. Members that it would be better Hthey are saying in a separate issue. On that you proceed with the business keeping this thing can fix the time and we can discuss it. butt let in mind. (Interruptions) us not take the time of the House on this at this moment. .. (Interruptions). MR. DepUTY SPEAKER: Now Shri Dinesh Singh to speak first listen to what he SHRI DINESH SINGH: Sir, we would be 57 Const. (86th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 58 very happy if you allot the time to discuss it ... THE MINISTER OF FINANCE (PROF. (Interruptions) MADHU DANDAVATE): I am on a point of order Sir. SHRI VISHWANATH PRATAP SINGH: Why are you insisting on ~ at this time? Why MR. SPEAKER: Yes, please ... are you bringing it here now? (Inte"uptions) SHRI OINESH SINGH: What the Prime Minister has raised, exactly what I am trying PROF.MADHU DANDAVATE: Mr. to explain that we would be very happy to Deputy Speaker, Sir, nany Member wants to have a debate, provided we have access to lay any document or a paper on the Table of the papers that the Prime Minister is holding the House, firstly, he has to give a notice, close to his chest. And &t the end of the last secondly, he has to authenticate it and then Session, the Prime Minister read out a min- you have to perm~ him. I want to know ute from what the then Prime Minister had whether you have permitted him to lay the recorded. We had requested him to place document on the Table of the House. We will that paper on the Table of the House along be too happy ff the documents come. with the file. The Prime Minister promised that, but it has not yet been placed. There- MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Papers can fore, Sir, I have an extract from the rest of the be laid on the Table of the House only by file which will establish that the then Prime follQwing the rules prescribed for it. Mr Saffud- Minister did not take any unilateral decision. din Choudhury. There was full basis for ~. SHRI SAIFUDDIN CHOUDHURY [ Trans/ation] (Katwa): Sir. what the Prime Minister has said is very slgnHicant that Hwe fail to pass SHRI RAM DHAN (Lalganj): Kindly tell these two bills for the poor, .. (Interruptions), him not to take my name. I will disclose all his then there will be no meaning of our being in secrets if he does so. the House. So, this kind of stalemate will not only be harming the Congress(l) but people [English] will lose faHh Ol'l our being here. By bringing extraneous matters here, they are really MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: You are going trying to create a deadlock ... (Interruptions). at a tangent. Sir, we have some other Bill that will be coming tomorrow. 'do not understand why ...... (Interruptions) (Interruptions).

SHRI UINESH SINGH: The cancella- SHRI VISHWANATH PRATAP SINGH: tion at that time would have meant a loss of Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir ... (Interruptions). 300 CI Jres plus whatever we may have had to give to the Bofors. So, it is not that we are SHRI AJIT PANJA (Calcutta North-East) talking in the air, Sir. If they place the papers Have you seen the papers? on the Table of the House, then wecsn have a meaningful debate. We cannot have a SHRI VISHWANA TH PRA TAP SINGH: debate when the papers are not available to Just hold on. You will see much more than us. That is what I am saying. Sir. Hyou give the papers. Sir, now much do has been me permission. I will be happy to place these done. May I ask hon. Panaji-he is making papers on the Table of the House. lot of noise-4hat when the Members oppo- sn. were here on this side, why did they not SHRI HARtSH RAWAT: He should be produce the papers then. They have no allowed to lay it on the Table.... (Intenvp- moral righl to go on making such a noise tions) about il? That Is number one. Number two, 59 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 60

[Sh. Vishwanath Pratap Singh] able to give us further information regarding the several questions we have sent to the about it? That is number one. Number two, Swedish Government about the Bofors on those very papers, Shankaranandji, you payment, the commission payment and had a look. You did not have a full look at h, whatever payments have been made, of you could not have a full look at it. On these whatever natural. They have categorically very papers. this present Government could said "if you disclose it, will not give further go the Swiss authorities and get the bank information." This is what they wanted, accounts frozen. So, they owe an answer to namely, to dry up our source of information. the nation why on the same documents they This is precisely their game. This is precisely could not, for three years, go and get the what they want. (interruptions) We were bank accounts frozen. What was the rea- able to get accounts frozen. Why did not they son? Why did they not do it? Thirdly, Sir, it do it? They wanted to canceal...... (Interrup- was constantly the pursuit of the present tions) Then, Sir, may I say about one thing? Government due to which we could get the When the C & A.G. asked the previous secret part of the Swedish Audit Report also. Government constantly for papers and the files, they did not send them.They opposed This very fact exposes the previous it. The present Government came and we Government as to what was possible, they have sent all the files of the Bofors to the C did not do, they did not want to do, they did & A.G. Why did they not send them to the C. not try to do. We have proven this. They are &A.G.? Why did they refuse to do so? They totally naked and exposed in the fact that we owe an answer to the House. When the C. & could, with the same documents, get the A.G. was asking forthe files. why did not they bank accounts frozen and that is why they send the Bofors papers and all the files? owe an explanation to the country why with When we have come, we have sent al: the those papers they could not take action. And papers. There is no concealment. We have they are not the people who are ignorant of sent all the files to the C. & A.G. Now. their the papers. Yesterday I have said that the sole aim is to dry to up our sources of Swedish Government had categorically said information and to create doubts in the minds that H those papers which have got the of the Swedish Government and thereby go information that they have sent, are dis- on with the game of putting a curtain on the closed they Will not be able to give further truth, which they were playing when they . information. And we have asked them ques- were on this side. They are playing the same tions. It is in the telex which I have read in the game when they are Sitting on that side House and it has expressly said ... (Interrup- (Interruptions) tions) SHRI L.K. ADVANI (New Delhi): Yes- S:-fRI SOMNATH CHA TIERJEE: They terday, I had an occasion to express my want to stop further information from com- unhappiness with what the Minister of Par- ing. (Interruptions) liamentary Affairs had said and I had observed that it seemed to me not easily under- SHRI VISHWANATH PRATAP SINGH: standable as to why we should share some We, on the 26th May, sent a telegram to the papers with this House only if the Swedish Swedish Government that we want to lay the Government permitted. This was myobser- papers on the Table of the house which they vation yesterday and" was an observation have sent, that is, the secret report. The as a lay person who had fought the elections reply we got from the Swedish Government on the basis of the demand that we should was ... (/nt."uptions) know fully about the scandal. (/nt9"tJPtions) Mr. Deputy-Speaker, Sir, I hold that the They replied that if the Government of people of this country want to know the full India goes a head and discloses the papers, truth about Bofors and Wthey want to know h, then the Swedish Government will not be ~ is not as a matter of ideal curiosity or only 61 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bi/I 62 order to see that those who have been guilty [ Translation] in this matter should be punished for that. (Interruptions) SHRI HARIN PATHAK (Ahmedabad): Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, Klooks strange that It is only when I heard the Prime Minister the Congress is opposing the Bill for the last last evening, I am very happy that he shared two day and has chosen to act against the with the House this whole matter which had poor though it is these people who have sent been addressed to the Government of India them here ... (Interruptions) by the Swedish Government and which made it very clear that there are certain inquiries [English] made by the Government of India about the facts which they would be willing to share SHRIVISHWANATHPRATAPSINGH: with us only if they treat this Audit Report The CBI has filed FIR. There are many who secret and confidential. If they do not do it, are caused in it. They have to be interro- then it would be deemed a breach of trust by gated and perhaps Mr Win Chadha is to be the Government of India. Now, in a situation interrogated. Now it is known that Hevery- of this kind only a person who is keen see thing is made public, ~ goes to the benef~ of that there is no further information forthcom- the accused person to find out and chalk out ing ... (Interruptions). his way. And this advantage will prevent it from coming or arriving at the truth. I think Sir, I would still appeal to Mr. Sathe this advantage we should not give to those because I am sure that Mr. Sathe has noth~ people against whom an FIR has been ing to do with the scandal. (Interruptions). lodged. (Interruptions). Therefore, I would appeal to Mr. Sathe: Please don't relate Bofors to a question SHRI P. CHIDAMBARAM (Sivaganga); which pertains to Scheduled Castes and Sir I I wish to respond to the Prime Ministerfor Scheduled Tribes. (Interruptions). Please I what he has said about this report. Sir, I tell you that it is not merely for the sake of distinctly remember that the Prime Minister, Scheduled Castes and Scheduled Tribes Shri V.P. Singh, when he was in this chair that I say this, but I am saying it in your here, specHically alleged that Mr RajivGandhi interest also. (Interruptions). Yes, because I had an Account in Switzerland,; he gave the wa~t the Congress Party, even though it has Account number. h is a speech he had made been ousted from power, to function as a outside the Parliament. It was widely re- responsible Oppostion Party and jf they ported in the newspapers. (Interruptions). commit this suicidal act which started yesterday and which they seem bent upon pursu- [ Translation] ing today, there will be a big vacuum in the Opposition. (Interruptions). SHRI POOL CHAND VERMA (Shajapur): Let Shri Rajiv Gandhi testHy to it. He is unnecessarily defending his leader. He Mr. Speaker, Sir, therefore, I would plead should come here and defend himself. (In'9f- w~h you that so far as the guardian of this ruptions) House is concerned, all Members of the House have been informed that voting will MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Varmaji. will take place at 2.30 p.m. and the debate was you take your seat. started already, Mr. Guman Mal Lodha was called upon to speak in this debate. Let the ( Int9ffU{Jtions) debate continue and H the debate is not allowed to be held by the Opposhion, then I [English] plead with you that at 2.30 p.m. precisely both the Bills should be put to vote. (/nt9rrup. SHRI P. CHIOAMBARAM: Sir, chal- tions) lenged Mr. V.P. Singh to authenticate or 63 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 64

[Sh. P. Chidambaram1 PROF. N.G. RANGA (Guntur): Sir, you should give him an opportunity. You have stand by his statement and make the allega- allowed the Prime Minister three times. tion in Paliament. He retreated and left Par- liament and never returned to Parliament MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Why are you except now, when he returned after the jumping at conclusions? election. For three years, Mr. V.P. Singh and his party carried on a campaign on a single (Interruptions) issue, Bofors, the SNAB report on which we are discussing now. Let us get the records SHRI P.CHIDAMBARAM: Sir, Mr. N. straight. The SNAB report on which we are Ram and Ms. Chhra Subramaniam pub- discussing now. Let us get the records lished, in October 1989 what according to straight. The SNAB report, an excised them were, the excised portions of the SNAB version-a version in which some parts were report and then in Parliament, there was a withheld-were sent to the Government. That demand that we should get the entire report SNAB report is available with the Govern- from Sweden. It was the previous Govern- ment now. The then Opposition, the present ment which wrote to Sweden saying, now Ruling Party demanded day in and day out that 'The Hindu' has ... (Interruptions) and paralysed Parliament for several days that we must move to get the entire SNAB [ Translation] report and disclose the entire report~ Mean- while ... SHRIMATIJAYAWANTI NAVINCHAN- ORA MEHTA (Bombay North East): Mr. SHAI VISHWANATH PRATAP SINGH: Deputy Speaker, Sir, I am on a point of order Could you get the Bank accounts frozen on regarding the Bill which was brought for the those papers? Could you get the Bank ac- welfare of Scheduled Castes and tribes, and counts impounded? (Interruptions) which is to be followed by an important Bill pertaining to the National Women Commis- SHRI P. CHIDAMBARAM: Sir, I have to sion but ironically for the last two hours complete my statement. I am not yielding. Bofors seems to be the centre of the discus- (/nt9"uptions) Sir, please ask them to sit sion. It does not figure anywhere in today's .down. What are they agiating about? I am agenda and ~ seems as though they are not going to waste my throat. (Interruptions) unwilling to allow a discussion on SchedtJled The Prime Minister has to hear me; the Castes and tribes or welfare of women. All Deputy Prime Minister has to hear me; the women members are keen to express their Finance Minister has to hear me. How can views on the floor of the House regarding they heckle me like this? (Interruptions) women Commission Bill but superfluous issues are being raised here in order to MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Mr Chidam- prevent discussion on it. Therefore I request baram, we are not discussing that issue here you to disallow any discussion relating to right now. (/nt9"uptions) Please do not get Bofors so that other important Bills can be up like this. Prof. Rangaji, let me complete. discussed. (Interruptions) Why are you jumping at conclusions before a sentence is completed? I am trying to MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: It is true that facilitate your speaking and you are jumping as you said discussion on two Bills is under- at conclusions. Now supposing an issue has way but another subjed has emerged here been raised, if somebody has said some- on which some members have expressed thing and if you are reptying to it, you should their views and the third is a point of order. reply it briefly.1 am allowing other Members We are trying our level best to come back to also to say something. But you are jumping the first one and quit the second and third. at conclusions and you are disturbing your Therefore, please do not raise too many own seH. points of order. 65 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) 8111 66

(Interruptions) SHRI RAM DHAN: On a point of order. (interruptions) SHRI PHOOl CHAND VERMA: Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, you ask Shri Chidam- SHRI P. CHIDAMBARAM: I am yielding baram to s~ down. We do not want to listen only to the point of order. (Interruptions) to Chidmabaramji. (Interruptions) [ Trans/ation] SHRI P.R KUMARAMANGALAM (Sa- lem): Why won't you allow Chidambaramjito SHRI RAM DHAN: Mr. Deputy Speaker, speak. After all we have also been elected. I am on a point of order. You first listen to my (Interruptions) point of order. (Interruptions)

[English] MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Yes, Ram Dhanji, what is your point of order? SHRI P. CHIDAMBARAM: I have to completed my sentence. I want to complete. (Inten-uptions) Please ask him to sit down. (Interruptions) SHRt RAM DHAN: Mr. Deputy Speaker, MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I am hearing Sir, when hon. Shri Thambi Durai was in the you. You complete it. Chair he started the proceedings as per the gagenda and asked hon. Guman Mal Lodha SHRI P. CH IDAMBARAM: It was the to make a statement on the Bill relating to the previous Government which asked Sweden amendment of land reform in the Ninth to give the full SNAB report. (Interruptions) Schedule. He had started his speech and The Prime Minister cannot control his thereafter the Congress people started rais- Members! ing hue and cry so that the Constitution Amendment Bill is prevented from being Day before yesterday, Mr. Ram sent an passed. They are repeating what they did article in the Hindu saying what the Govern- yesterday. They are behaving as if they are ment has received is an exact copy of what enemies of Scheduled Castes and tribes. he published in October. 1989 and Sweden They are doing it in order stop the Bill from has confirmed that what appeared in the being passed. They tried their best to stall Hindu authored by Ram and Chitra the proceedings of the House. I request you Subramaniam is the same. Now, Sir .... to conduct t~e proceedings of the House as per the agenda. (Interruptions) SHRI SOMNATH CHATIERJEE: Sir, what is happening? Are we to hear the entire SHRI BABANRAO DHAKNE (Bead): story of Bofors? (Interruptions) Many new members have come to this House for the first time. All that we heard about Shri SHRI P. CHIDAMBARAM: He has got Sathe was that he was a senior leader. and the SNAB report wnh him. (Interruptions) a seasoned parliamentarian but here we SNAB report will exonerate ever single per- found Shri Sathe to be interrupting the pro- son in the Congress Party and that is why he ceedings frequently. The proceeding of this is afraid. Why is he not placing the report? House should run according to rules. We Ths Hindu has got the repot. The Indian have been in the opposition benches through- Exprsss has got the report. The Prime Min- out our lives and he have no regrets about it ister has got the report. If they have wanted but Satheji is getting impatient although he the report and have got the report, place the has been out only recently (/nte"uptions) I report on the Table of the House. am developing my point so as to make him understand. Some rules and traditions have On 31 st of December, he promised to to be followed in the House. When the leader place ...... (/nts"uptions) 67 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY30,1990 8ill 68 bers are supposed to be seated and when [ Translation] the Prime Minister stands to speak all the members whosoever he may should be in SHRI MADAN LAL KHURANA: My point their seat. But since the last two days we are of order is this that when a decision has been observing that all our colleague stand up to given in this House by the Speaker, why is speak in between. (/ntsrruptions) PI$ase this issue regarding Bofors being repeated accept my point of order because we rarely today where it has already been raised get a chance. The person who gets up has a yesterday? When the Speaker has already chance to speak whether he is in power or given a decision, then how can they raise it not. let us request Satheji. he is a member again? of this House and he knows the rules. The Bofors issue can be brought in a different MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: All right, I manner. The proceedings of the House have followed your point of order. should go on. [English]

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I have under- SHRI P. CHIOAMBARAM: Has he fin- stood your point. Shri Babanrao Dhakane: ished his point of order? Mr. Deputy Speaker, rules should be followed. SHRIINDRAJITGUPTA (Midnapore): I am asking you to allow me.

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER. Do not ask 13.00 hrs. for a ruling. by ruling WIJI not go in your favour. (Interruptions) It you give everything [ Translation] as per procedure then only you can raise a POint of order. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Basu;i. you please s" down for a minute. The points of SHRI PHOOL CHAND VERMA: Shri order that are being raised here .... Guman Mal Lodha made a request and you allowed. [English]

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: You ptease I think, have a substance in them. take your seat. [ Translation] SHRI PHOOL CHAND VERMA: Why are you not carrying out thiS discussion fur- I would ask Chidambaramji. to finish in ther? one or two minutes. Thereafter I shall call tndrajit Guptaji and Lodhaji. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: You discuss with him, why are you discussing with me? [English]

(Interruptions) SHRI P. CHIDAMBARAM: The SNAB Report ... (Int9"uptions) What is this? I have MR DEPUTY SPEAKER: You first take been allowed to speak. (InterruptIOns) you seat. I will take all the points of order simuHaneously . SHRI AMAR ROYPRADHAN (Coach Behar): He is on a point of order. [English}

SHAI P. CHIDAMBARAM: Is his point SHAI CHinA BASU (Barasat): Rule 74 of order ovar? Let ma complete. relates to the consideration of the Bill. 69 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) Bill 70

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Which por- But suppose one Member in the House tion of Rule 74? raises some Issue which is not really con- neded to the subject and if the other Mem- SHRI CHinA BASU: Rule 74 says: ber is replying to ~, I cannot just say Ino' to him. Why do you want a decision on those "When a Bill is introduced or on some points? subsequent occasion, the member in charge may make one of the following (Interruptions) motions is in regard to his Bill, namely:- MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: You do not have to quarrel wHh the presiding officer. (i) that is be taken into considera- You please allow him to conduct. I can tion" understand the feelings of the Members. I am trying to regulate H. That is why I I said Mr. Now the Constitution (Sixty-eighth Amend- Chidambaram will speak, then Mr. IndrajH ment) Bill is LInder consideration. This mo- Gupta will speak and after that Mr. Lodha will tion is before the House. Unless this motion speak. What more you want. is disposed of, why are the other extraneous issues being brought? I want your ruling. (Interruptions)

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I have given MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Discussion a ruling already. Probably, you have not between the Members will finish or not. Why heard it, that the matter has to be relevant. are you delaying it? Only then, it can be discussed. SHRI P. CHIDAMBARAM: The unexer- (Interruptions) cised SNAB Report is available to this an Indian Express, available to the Hindu. We MR. OEPUTY SPEAKER: I am going a have got it now. The Prime Minister is not ruling. placing it on the Table of the House because the SNAB Report win completely exonerate (Interruptions) every single person against whom they made allegations. Now, Sir, on the PMO file on SHRI CHITA BASU: ConstHution (Sixty· 21st December, the Prime Minister prom- eighth Amendment) Bill is under considera- ised to place all the papers. Every single tion. Unless this motion is disposed of, no newspaper in the country carried it. Why is other business can be taken it. (Interrup- he not placing that. The Swedish Govern- tions) ment can place an embargo upon the SNAB Report. I did not know the Swedish Govern- SHRI BASUDEB ACHARIA (Bankura): ment can place an embargo even on the How do you say that what Mr. Chidambaram Prime Minister's Office files. Thus, he placed has said is all relevant? (/nt8ffuptions) two papers. The answer to those two papers placed was a separate issue. If the PMO fil. SHRI P.R. KUMARAMANGALAM: How comes here, it will show that the two docu- do you say that whatever the Prime Minister ments placed by the Prime Minister were has said is relevant? (Interruptions) distorted, taken out of context and only to carry on his campaign of insinuation. This campaign must stop. Now this campaign of MR. OEPUTY SPEAKER: Mr. inSinuation must slop. He must place PMO Kumaramangalam, 4am on my legs. Please papers. H. must place the SNAB Report. His do not raise points of order every now and campaign must stop her. and now. His then. In substance, I have given a decision campaign of insinuat;on must stop here and before that the discussion has to be relevant. now. (/nt'mJptions) 71 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 72

SHRt BASUOEB ACHARIA: Sir, as you MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I have al- have allowed Shrl Chidambaram, you please ready given my ruling. allow Shri Somnath Chatterjee to speak. (lnt9rruptions) MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I have al· lowed Shri Indrajit Gupta to speak. SHRIINDRAJITGUPTA: Sir, last week, when a big discussion was going on, in (Ints"uptions) which I also had an occasion to participate- in the BAC, in the Minister's room etc where SHAI INDRAJIT GUPTA: Mr. Deputy we discussed about whether the House Speaker, Sir, it is extremely difficult to main· should be extended or not, at that time, these tain one's patience at what is going on here. hon. friends from the Opposition were very You will e)(cuse my saying so. There is such vocal in saying-in the beginning, they were a thing as 'List of Business', ,before the opposing thefour days' extension-that these House. And you said that, II have to deter- two Constitution Amendment Bills which hare mine whether what is being said here is absolutely non-controversial ... relevant or not relevant to the ~em before us.' But, you will excuse my saying so, there MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Please do is a competition going on here in irrelevancy not discuss what happened there. as far as the List of Business is concerned. Mr. Chidambaram and his friends are guilty SHRI INDRAJIT GUPTA: But, now, of it; the Prime Minister is also guilty of it. another item has been injected here, into the (Int9"Uptions) Sir, you will notmind my saying Agenda in order to obstruct what they had so-you are permitting this irrelevancy to go agreed to last week. (Int8"Uptions) That is on. what is happening. I want to know from you, as the Presiding Officer, as to what are we MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: This is also discussing now? Are we discussi ng items 10 irrelevant. It is not for the Member to say this. and 11 of the Order Paper or have we set It aside and started discussion whatever the SHRIINDRAJIT GUPTA: Please do not Opposition wanted to inject? if they want to take it am iss. have a discussion it can be held. But it cannot be held now. Therefore, I say that- MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I am tal

SOME HON. MEMBERS: No.

SHRI INDRAJIT GUPTA: The only SHRIINDRAJIT GUPTA: And it is you question here, which has been raised and duty, if I may humbly say so, which is relevant, I say, is the question of the confidentiality. (/nt9"uptions) It has been MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Don't go on disposed of yesterday. The message of the saying this. Swedish Government~he telex messag&- has been read out here, in the House. (Inter- ruptions) Now, it is upto them to challenge SHRI INDRAJIT GUPTA: Why? You that. Hthey want to, they can challenge it and are in the Chair. say, 'we do not bother about all these conti- dentialisties; we do not bother, whether we get any more information or not; we must be MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I have al- comm~ted to go on obstructing this discus- ready said that after your speech, Mr. Lodha sion.' (/nt9rruptions) will speak. 73 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 74

SHRIINDRAJIT GUPTA: Hthey do not SHRI VASANT SATHE: The whole allow the items to be carried on, then it is for country knows what you are doing ... (Inter- you to bring them to order. ruptions) ... We do not want to listen to anything. First. let the papers be laid. (Inter· MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: It is for you ruptions) also to control yourself. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: No please. SHRllNDRAJfT GUPTA: Kindly do not Not like this. allow such things. Already an hour has gone. (Interruptions) People in this country will not ( Interruptions) rest until the truth about Bofors comes out. (Interruptions) Whoever has a share in the MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Rules are booty will ultimately be unmasked and pun- violated. ished. (Interruptions) You must not obstruct the investigation. You must not try to prevent ( Interruptions) or obstruct now. (Interruptions) What your Government failed to do, this Government is SHRf SOMNATH CHATTERJEE: Sir, doing. Sir, I beg of you, please rule out this he is threatening to obstruct the proceedings irrelevancy and allow the discussion to pro- of the House. ceed, on this two Constitution Amendment Bills which they had promised to support and PROF. P.J. KURIEN: Sir, I am not threat- which they are obstructing now. (Interrup- ening. (Interruptions) tions) [ Translation] SHRI SOMNATH CHATTERJEE: Sir, I want to speak for a minute. SHRI GUMAN MAllODHA (Pali): Mr. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: No, Please. Deputy Speaker, Sir. in the wake of 66th Amendment which has been placed before SHRI VASANT SATHE: I Must tell you the House, yesterday I was narrating the frankly that unless Mr. Ram Vilas Paswan plight of crores of poor people I the downtrod- withdraws his remarks which he has made den, the opresed people. the landless farm- and the Government lays the papers on the ers, poor labourers and the farm labourers Table of the House, we are not going to who have not so far been given land. Our cooperate and listen to the Members. (Inter- country is primarily an agricultural country. ruptions) While welcoming the move of the present Government to bring forward this amend- SHRIINDRAJIT GUPTA: Do they want ment relating to welfare of the farmers and to to Blackmail the House? Land Reforms, I would like to submit that those who are trying to b~truct in anyway, SHRI VASANT SATHE: There is no are betraying the cause of 80 crore people of question of blackmailing the House. We want the country. h is a betrayal on their part with the papers to be laid on the Table. (Interrup- the downtrodden and the opressed people. tions) These poor people have not been allotted land for the last 42 years. In the name of SHAI SOMNATH CHAITERJEE: Sir, Land Reforms only a drama was being played let them be candid as to what is their real before them during the the last 42 years. I intention so far as these two Constitution would like to tell them that when the Su- (Amendment) Bills are ccncerned. Let us preme Court repealed the Land Reforms Act know their real intention .... (Interruptions) in 1951, Pand~ Jawahar Lal Nehru came to You are holding the House to ransom. (Inter· the House and he had said at that time that ... ruptions) My hon. friends, please listen to me .... 75 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 76

[Sh. Guman Mal Lodha] occasion. but once a number of occasions amendments to Ninth Schedule of the Con- [English] stitution have ben made. These amendments became necessary in view of the fact Every day 01 delay in passing these Bills that even after enading the Land Reforms will bring dangers to the people. Act and the Zamindari Abol~ion Act. the farmers were forced to go the courts of law. "If there is one thing to which we as a As a result of this they were not able to avail party have been com mitted in the past of the benefits of the above acts. Now I would generation or so it is the agrarian re- like to explain to you as to how the farmers form and the abolition of the zamindari remained deprived of the benefits of the system. Land Reforms Ads. Dr. Biplab Dasgupta. Professor of Economics, Calcutta University Now, apart from our commitment, a had said in the Klsan Sabha that out of 78 survey of the world today, a survey of lakh acres of surplus land. only 451akh acres Asia today will lead any intelligent of land had been distributed. This matter person to see that the basic and the concerns the farmers. This issue relates to primary problem is the lad problem farm labourers. He said that ... today in Asia, as In India. And every day of delay adds to the difficulties and [English] dange. s apart from being an injustice in itse~." "... Allindia Kishan Sabha took a serious view that so far only 78 lakh acres had [ Translation] been declared surplus and of this 45 lakh acres had been actually distributed. This I would like to appeal to you to listen to accounted for just. 2.14 per cent of the total me. I want to say that- cultivated land in the country being declared surplus and only 1.25 per cent being actually [Eng/ish) distributed." (Interruptions)

Every day of delay adds to the difficul- [ Translation] ties and dangers to the teeming millions of our people. apart from being an injustice in J would like to tell my han. friends that itself. they have been playing with the interests of the farmers till today. Amendments so far "We have brought it forward now after made in the Ninth Schedule by our hon. that care. In the best form that we could friends did not include land Reforms whereas give It. because we thought that the in the first amendment carried out in 1951 ~ amendments mentioned in this Bill are was specifically mentioned that Land Re- not only necessary. but desirable. and forms would be Included in the Ninth Sched- because we thought that ff these ulo. But It was replaced by MISA by our hon. changes are not made. perhaps not friends (Interruptions). only would great ditflculties arise as they have arisen in the past few months. [Eng/ish] but perhaps some of the main purposes of the very Constitution may be deteated or destroyed." MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Is it the pleasure of the House that we sit through the lunch [ Translation] hour?

Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. I would like to submit that since 1951. ~ is not the first MANY HON. MEMBERS: Yes, yes. 77 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) 8111 78

MR. DEPUlY SPEAKER: We would [ Translation] skip the lunch hour. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Lodhaji, heis [ Translat;on] raising a point of order.

SHRI GUMANMAL LODHA: I would like [English] to subm~ that the Supreme Court has said that- PROF. P.J. KURIEN: Sir,l am on a point of order. If you are to do away with the Lunch [English] Hour, ~ should be the decision of the House. No decision has been taken in the House. I "Article 39 of the Constitution directs by would like to know who has decided it. Where Clauses (b) and (c) that the ownership and is the consensus of the House? Did the control of the material resources of the Minister move the motion? communHy are so distributed as best to subserve the common good; that the opera- THE MINISTER OF INFORMATION tion of the economic system does not result AND BROADCASTING AND MINISTER OF in the concentration of wea~h and means of PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS (SHRI P. production to !he common detriment." UPENDRA): Yes. (Interruptions)

[ Translation] PROF. P.J. KURIEN: Sir, he should move a motion. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, while making and amendments his the constitution ~ is all MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: On these the more necessary he see that the law is small points let us not try to ask for this. If you implemented. It should be implemented ef- insist, I shall have to do it but these are the fectively. points on which we have not been doing it.

[English] (Interruptions)

The Report of the Working Group on SHRI P. UPENDRA: Sir, I propose that Land Reforms 1978 (Ministry of Agricutture the Lunch hour be skipped. and Irrigation, Department of Agriculture) says that it was widely recognised that the MR. DEPUlY SPEAKER: Is it the de- imposition of ceiling on agricultural holdings sire of the House that the Lunch Hour is and tenancy reforms constHutes the sub- skipped? stance of the agrarian reform movement and that, concentration of land in the hands of a SOME HON. MEMBERS: Yes. small group inhibits production, encourages concealed or irregular tenancies and results SEVERAL HON. MEMBERS: No. in unequal accesses to facil~ies of production in the rural sector. ( Interruptions) ( Translation]

He has put this thing in writing. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: 00 you want a devision on this? (Int9rruptions) [English] SHRI P.R. KUMARAMANGALAM: Sir, AN HON. MEMBER: On a point of or- we are goin; for lunch and then W8 will come der. back. (/nt9trUptions) 79 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 80

[ Translation] Ye bade bade samrajya raj,

SHRI GUMAN MAL LODHA: Mr. Dep- Yug-yug se ate chale aaj, uty Speaker, Sir, this Bill relates to Land Reforms and Concerns the welfare of farm- Ye singhasan, y9 takth taj, ers. The entire economic condition of the country is totally dependent. On the farmers. Ye kile durg, garh shastra laj, In order to supplement. My views started above, I would like to quote national poet. In rsjyon ki int mahan, Shri Sohanlal Dwivedi who has made a vivid description of this shuation in the following In rajyon ki neewen mahan. words- Inki diwaron ki uthan, HYe nabh chumbi Prasad bhawan. Ink; prachiron ke udan, Jinme mand;t mohak kanchan. Wah teri haddi par kis.1fJ y8 chitrakala kaushal darshan, Wah ter; pasal; par Kisanl ye singh-pour, toran, vandan, Wah teri anton par kisan! Grih takavate virman, Wah teri tanto par Kisan! grih jinka sab atank man, Yadi hil uth too o. Sheshnagl Sir jhuka samajhate dhanya Pran, ho dhwashtha pajak may Tajya bhag. Ye aan-wan, ye sabhi shan. Samrat niharren, neend tyag, wah teri dsulat par kisan! hai kahin mukul, to kahin pagl Wah teri mehnal par kisan I Samant bhag rahe bacha jan, Ye Indraprasth ke rajya sadan, Santari bhayakul, (upta jnan, Pataliputra ke bharya bhawan. Senayen hain dhendhati tran, ye Magadha. Ayodhya, Rishipattan, Uda gaya hawa me dhowaj nishanl Ujjain, Awanti ke prangan, Maa ne tajh par asha bandhi, Vaishali ka Vaibhav mahan, too de aapne bal ki Kandhi, Kashi-Prayag 1<9 I

Wah teri dau/at par kisanJ Tujhse Subhash hai bhashman,

Wah teri mechna/ par kisanl Tujhse Moti ka bacha maan; 81 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9.1912 (SAKA) Bill 82

Too jyoti Jawahar ki mahan. Dhu/ dhusari, ho jawegi,

udata nabha par spana nishan, Mitti me tab mil jawegi,

Wah teri takat par Kisan, Yeh katil chal wa san ban n

Wah teri Kuwat par kisanl SHAI HARISH RAWAT: If they are hell- bent on this point and ins-un us, I alone Wah teri juraal par Kisan, would be enough to face the challenge.

wah te,; himmal par kisan, [English]

Too madwalan se bhag-bhag, If you are challenging us, we are ready to face your challenge also. (Interruptions) soye kisan, uth! jag jag! MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Rawatji, what Nishthura shasan me /age agg, are you doing?

ga mahakranti ka abhaya rag/ SHRI HARISH RAWAT: Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, you are our custodian. We will MR. DEPUTYSPEAKER~Sir, Igetsome follow as per our interests. That is not fair. inspiration from this poetry in contrast to We are not going to be directed by them. what happened yesterday. In this, connec- ( Interruptions) tion I would like to present the following lines:- [ Translation]

''janata ki hai yeh jan-sattaa. Please refrain from this type of talks. The manner in which you are talking, does Jai ka prakash shyama ke tatvagyan not entitle you to remain in the ruling party (Interruptions). One of the ministers says Atal, Lal, Lohia mahan, "you get out! Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, you are not saying anything in this regard. How De vi. Pratap. Madhu, Pas wan , far is it justifiable? It is absolutely illogical. If any of our hon. Members gets up and starts Rajiv Congress ka kafan bana, moving out of the House, hon. Members from the treasury benches pass remarks Janmabhoomi ka yeh apaman, and thus they are doing a wrong thing. tt ;s agianst the dign~y of the House. Mr. Deputy Jah jag utha ajagen kisan, , Speaker, Sir, their behavours should be deplored, otherwise, it is not a good thing. Keellagegi tere kafan me. (Interruptions).

Girijan, Harijan ka naya jna, [Eng/ish]

harijan ayog sanshodham ka. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Mr. Rawat, I have already said that. Tumne jo kiya ghrinit apaman, SHRI HARISH RAWAT: Sir. you have not said that. They are not going to comply Bhumi sudhar sanshodha birodha S9, with your orders.

Vip/aba Jawega yeh kisan, 83 Canst. (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 84 not hearing me. I have already told that. would like to congratulate n. Even after blow- ing the trumphe of progression they were not SHRI HARISH RAWAT: They are not able to abrogate this Article during the last 40 respecting your observation. years. Butthe Janata Government. Scrapped h whh one stroke of pen. Instead of com· THE MINISTER OF FINANCE (PROF. mending the Government for taking such a MADHU DANDAVA TE): We want that all of dynamic, pragmatic and revolutionary meas- you remain present in the House. The Gov· ure, they are staging a walk one, raising ernment also wants that you should be pres- technical questions and point of order. The ent in the House. We would like to make an people of not only the country but also the appeal that all of you should participate in the world over are watching their action. process of passing the Bill and have the Resolution passed unanimously. It is our Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would like to req uest to you. know from the Government as to what are the obstacles before the Government to [Eng/ish] acquire land under the existing land reform laws and allot the same to farmers. I would SHRI S. KRISHNA KUMAR (Quilon): like to give the figures. A large number of We have made it repeatedly clear that we poor people are in dire need of land In are supporting the Bill. Andhra Pradesh there are one lakh hundred eighty one large stretches of land which [ Tra.ns/ation] cannot be distributed to landless farmers because the matter is sub·judice. Similarly SHRI HARISH RAWAT: All the Minis- there are 961092 stretches of land in Assam ters are not that sensible like you. Besides, and 1,10,771 in Bihar which are lying undis- more than half of your members have lost tributed.ln this state, not only once but twice their wisdom. They think as if they are fight- the farmers ...... (Interruptions) ing on the road. It is the Parliament. They should behave like a Parliamentarian. The SHRI RAM NAIK (Bombay South): The behaviour you are showing is not at-ell proper. hon. Member has came to this side leaving (Interruptions). his seat even their Lodhaji's speech is not audible. [English] MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: If he wants to MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: You have speak, he can do so from his seat. He can sit made your point now. What is the point is there. But there should be no disturbance in saying all these again? Do you want a re- his sitting there. mark from the Chair against you are what? I do not know what you want. SHRI GUMAN MAL LODHA: Mr. Dep- uty Speaker, Sir, it is a matter of serious (Interruptions) concern there in a country live India the economy is dependent on agriculture and [ Trans/ation1 progress is dependent on economy. There are large number of landless farmers in this SHAI GUMAN MAL LODHA: Mr. Dep- country who are eagerly looking forward for uty Speaker, Sir, I would like to congratulate a piece of Land for their livelihood. On the the Government tor the abrogation of a Ar- other hand the Land Reforms Ad has not ticles 31-A and 31-C. The most progressive been brought to the notice of the counts. As work that the Janata Government did in such Land cannot be allotted to farmers on 19n-88 is to incorporate ·right to property- account of the stay order issued by the in the Consthution. Now the Government courts. Large number of such cases are scrapped articte 31 for good for which I pending in the law courts. Large stretches of 85 Const. (66th Amsnd.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 86 land numbering about 1,23.09986 in the reasons. One is that the Schedule consists entire country remain undistributed because of a particular type of legislation, generally court cases are pending flnalisation in re- speaking, and anothsrtyps should notcoms gard thereto. Crores of people living along- in ... tt was double-barrelled protection wnich side these land crores cannot be get two was intended to be provided to this category Ie aves of bread a day. I would like to tell you of legislation, since it was designed to carry 1hat there are poor farmers in the country out agrarian reform which was so essential who live on trees, eat leaves 01 trees pass for bringing about a revolution in the socio- their days in the juggis. There are some economic structure of the country.· families in which both the daughter in law and her mother in law cannot came one at a [ Translation] time for want of two sarees for their individual use. One has in want for the other till she Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would like to returns from her work. The Land Reforms submit that in Vaman Rao case they had Act cannot be implemented in our country. clearly sated this and the hon. judges had Had the Government come up with a resolve again quoted Jawahar Lal Nehru as under: to have the Bill on Land Reforms passed, it would have already been passed by the "We have brought it forward now after House. The Bofors case could have been that care, in the best form that we could taken up later on. give it, because we thought that the amendments mentioned in this Bill are MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Please speak not only necessary, but desirable, and on the Bill. because we thought that ff these changes are not made, perhaps not SHRI GUMAN MAL LODHA: I would only would great difficulties arise, as like to say that the in connection with the they have arisen in the past few Minerva mills case the supreme court had months ... " expressed this view and quoted Pt. Jawahar Lal as under: ·' ...... but perhaps some of the main purposes of the very Constitution may [Eng/ish] be defeated or delayed.

~ is there in Supreme Court A.I.R. 1980 The Directive Principles of State Policy (VoI.67)-Minerv~ Mills Ltd. vs Union of represent a dynamic move towards a India-SC-1789-Page No. 1830, para 97. certain objective. The Fundamental h says: Rights represent something static, to preserve certain rights which exist." "The 9th Schedule of Article 31 B was not intended to include laws other than those [ Trans/ation] covered by Art. 31 A. That becomes clear from speeches of the Law Minister and the Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir Jag irdars these Prime Minister during the disclJssion on the Zamindars and Jagirdars have been explo~ Consitutions (First Amendment) Act, 1951. ing the farmers for centuries for their selfish Dr. Ambedkar admitted of the 9th Schedule ends. I have already expressed my view that prime facie In is an unusual procedure' point. I gave the instances of Vamanrao's but he went on are laws that fa" under Art. case, Shim Singh's case and Minerva Mills 31 A'-JawaharlaJ Nehru also told Partia- case. In pursuance of the above principle, I ment. would like to say that miraculous chan~es could be brought in the liking conditions of "It is not with any great satisfaction or the farmers through Land Reforms and pleasure that we have produced this long impediments coming in the way of land re- Schedule. We do not wish to .dQ to it, for two forms could be removed. if the Land Re- 87 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 88

[Sh. Guman Mal Lodha] MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Again you have started creating a noise. forms Act is included in the Ninth Schedule of the Const~ution. If one goes through this PROF. P. J. KURIEN: They are blaming Act, one mill come across that in Land Re- us saying that we are not interested in ~. So, form Act is being implemented in States like I have to answer to that also. Rajasthan, Bihar, Assam and other places. It will be seen that in these States efforts have Yesterday, they could not muster even been made to provide Land to the farmers a simple ~ajorityto get ~ passed. Yesterday, under the Tenacy Act. For example let us without our cooperation, they could have take the Colonisation Act which is in opera- passed the Scheduled Castes (Amendment) tion in Ganganagar district. One bigha of Bill, nthey had brought all their members to Land in this district can produce crops worth the House. So, a government which could lal,hs of rupees. But the poor and landless not bring all the members to the House to farmers have no land to till. As such, ~ we pass their Bill, how can they blame us. It is really have a little compassion and good will not our responsibility. (Interruptions) We for the downtrodden and opressed people wanted you to pas~ the BiII.( Interruptions) who are being exploited for centuries that they should get two square mills a day, we THE MINISTER OF INFORMATION must 'pass this Bill. Today's social system AND BROADCASTING AND MIN ISTER OF bears the brunt of past dualism when the PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRES (SHRI P. Britishers enforced imperialism in the coun- UPENDRA): But you wanted to divide the try which was followed by the oppression by House. That is what we said. Today, you will the Kings, Zamindars and Jagaridars. They see h. We will pass it whether you are here explorted the farmers to a great extent. I or not. would like to cite and example of their sufferings. Nathu Ramji is not hero. Oevilalji is PROF. P. J. KURIEN: Yesterday, it was present. He knows how the Dabra incident announced that the Bill would be passed at took place. How the people were shot dead 2.30 P. M. But at 4 O'Clock they could not who were demanding their rights? When the pass ~ because they did not have the requi- question of providing them protection in the site majority. country comes up, it becomes a matter sor- row and anguish for us. I WOUld, therefore, SHRI P. UPENDRA: No. That is not like to request that other speakers should be correct. (Interruptions) . given fullest opportunity. The Bill should receive support from all sections of the House, PROF. P. J. KURIEN: We walked out. because it is a progressive step. It will help (Intsrruptions) include the Landless people, farmers, agrj· cu"ure labours who do not get minimum SHRI P. UPENDRA: We wanted to give wages, in the Ninth Schedule and provide you time ...... (Interruptions) them protection under article 13 (1) (b). I have to say this much only. PROF. P. J. KURIEN: You listen to me and then you can say whatever you want to say. I am taking only my party's time. Please [English] listen to me.

PROF. P. J. KURIEN (Mavellkara): Two MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Your state- Consthution (Amendment) Bills were placed ment is rebutted by the Minister. That is all before the House for voting. An impression right. You come to the point. was created that we were tryJng to obstruct the passage of the Bills. (/nt,rruptions) That PROF. P. J. KURIEN: I agree to that. is why I am not obstructing it . (/ntetrUptions) But we walked out leaving the floor to them 89 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9. 1912 (SAKA) 811 90 to pass the Bill. We did not obstruct. That is is always guaranteed. the question. That is the point I want to make. We walked out leaving it to them to pass the PROF. P. J. KURIEN: Mr. Upendra Bill. knows very well that we had a meeting on this Bill about the passage of this very BiB. He DR. BIPLAB DASGUPTA (Calcutta had requested for our cooperation. We of- South): You must be grateful to us for ~. fered the cooperation subject to their placing certain papers on the Table of the House. PROF. P. J. KURIEN: I do not yield. We heard the Prime Minister today. Why do you to control them? They can reply to me, when their time comes. SHAI INDRAJIT GUPTA: conditional cooperation I MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: You can reply to those points when you speak. PROF. P. J. KURIEN: Ves, yes. You call it like that. We heard the Prime Mini~ter ( Interruptions) here saying, today, that the NAB Report could not be disclosed because of the Swed- MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Voucometo ish Government's objection. But we have not the point, Mr. Kurien. asked forthose papers only. We also wanted the PMO files which the Prime Minister had PROF. P. J. KURIEN: I am on the sub- assured in this House, to be placed on the ject. Again, in so many words, it was ex- Table of the House, on December 31st asen. pressed that we are bringing extraneous There is no Swedish government's objection considerations before this Bill. It is not that. or anybody's objection in placing those Mr. Upendra knows very well that last week papers on the Table of the House. The we had a meeting on the passage of this Bill. House is well aware of that. (Interruptions) I am on the subject. Please listen to me. Mr. Upendra knows very well THE MINISTER OF INFORMATION that we had a meeting on this very question AND BROADCASTING AND MINISTER OF of passing of this Bill and he wanted our co- PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS (SHRI P. operation. We had offered the cooperation UPENDRA): I am on a point of order. Parties subject to that you know their placing those are allotted time to discuss particular bills papers on the Table of the House. (/nts"up- and members from those parties are sup- tions) It is my party's time I am taking. It is not posed to speak on those bills. One cannot your time. Has our party got no time? say, III have got forty minutes. For forty minutes I will recne poems and tell stories. • SHRI RUPCHAND PAL (Hooghly): It is To you allow him to speak? But it is irrelevant also the time of the House. to the subject under discussion. How do you allow it? (Interruptions) PROF. P. J. KURIEN: It is my party's time. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Probably he is trying to explain the stand their Party has MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: If you do not taken. agree to what he is saying, you can reply to him later on. Now he has taken the time 10 (Interruptions) speak on this Bill. He is making the points. Within his time he may say certain things. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: All of you You note those points and you rebut them can use your wisdom. You can use your when you reply. Please do not interject. inteUigence to rebut the point which he is making. THE MINISTER OF FINANCE (PROF. MADHU DANOAVA TE): Right of irrelevancy (Interruptions) 91 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY30,1990 Bill 92

SHRIINDRAJIT GUPTA: Sir, you have PROF. P. J. KURIEN: That point I am yourul lIid that • must be relevant to the making. It is not that extraneous considera- bu8l,.... StHI you are allowing him to say tions have been brought here. Thera was an everything •• ( interruptions) assurance in the Leaders Meeting ... (/ntsrruptions) MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: He is trying to explain why their Party has taken this MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Would you stand. like to repeat all those points which have already been made? (Interruptions) PROF. P. J. KURIEN: I want to make MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: You will have one point every clear to help them more time to rebut his point H you do not only .... (Inteffuptions) Interject. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: What is dis- PROF. P. J. KURIEN: Sir. I believe. as cussed in the Committee Meeting. we do not a Member, I have every right to explain why quote here. I support or do not support a Bill. I am talking ontha Bill. I am only doing that.. (Interruptions) PROJ:. P. J. KURIEN: I am referring to what the Prime Minister has said. He said SHRIINDRAJIT GUPTA: You have not that on the NAB Report, there is some re- said a word about the Bill. striction from the Swedish Government. But we had also asked for the PMO file which he PROF. P. J. KURIEN: I believe I have had promised ... (/nt8rruptions) every right to explain why I support or do not support a Bill ...... (/nterruptions) PROF. RAMGANESH KAPSE (Thane): Sir. I am on a point of order .. (lnteffuptions) MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Why are you showing your intelligence in interjecting? MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I am haaring Why do you not show your intelligence while his point of order. replying? (Interruptions) (Interruptions) [ Translation] PROF. P. J. KURIEN: At least the House has now cooled down. We are not MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Listen, in objecting to it. Why do you now object us so sp~a of my repeated request you are trying that you want us to object again? (IntBrrup- to control the House from your seat. You can tlons) see that whenever you try to speak from your seat, House remains disturbed. Then it became difficu~ for the chair to control the PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: You go House. Let the chair control the House. You ahead. Otherwise you will take more time. will also be given time. l

PROF. P. J. KURtEN: You advise your [English] Members. " you are interrupting an the time, you MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Mr. Kurien. are also disturbing the House. Mind It. please come to the point. ( Int.tnf'tlons) SHRIINDRAJIT GUPTA: Come to the point, he said. PROF. RAM GANESH KAPSE: The 93 Const. (16th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9. 1912 (SAKA) BIll 94

Prime Minister has appealed to the Opposi- Ram Ohan that this Bill has beln brought. tion that let us finish the matters on the Because he could not accommodate Mr. Agenda and whatever we want to discuss Ram Ohan in the Council of Ministers, he about Bofors, we will decide .. (lnt9"uptions) wants to give his some higher status. There is nothing which will help the Harijans and MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: What proce- the poor. Hthere is anything. you are fre8 to dure has been violated? explain that. Please go through the Bill. This is only Mr. Ram Ohan's Bill. And comment- PROF. RAM GANESH KAPSE: If he ing that this is for the poor and the Harijans, wants to refer about Bofors, the Prime Min- they are only shedding crooxJile tears. I ister had already appealed to the Oppos~ion would again request the Government that H ... (Interruptions) ~ wants to ensure our cooperation. please give us some cooperation also. We are asking MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: What is your for the file which the Government can easily point of order? on the Table. Please give us cooperation. Secondly, they say that we are objeding the PROF. RAMGANESH KAPSE: My point passage of this Bill. We are not against the of order is that no matters about Bofors passage of this Bill. We are only not giving should be raised over here by Mr. Kurian and our cooperation because you are not giving he should speak on the Bill. us cooperation. Even now there is time for the Government to come forward with that MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I have under- cooperation before the voting takes place. stood. Now your point of order I am over- ruling.lf he is explaining as to why he is going PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: I only to vote or not going to vote or going to abstain want to know whether your support on these from voting, he is well within his right and I two Bills-one regarding the Land Reforms am allowing him. If you have any other point, and the second about SC & ST is conditional you can refer it in your speech. I request Mr. so that we can tell the country that even your Kurien to be very brief. support to the SC & ST Bill is conditional.

PROF P. J. KURIEN: The Government PROF. P. J. KURIEN: It is not a ques- has asked our cooperation in passing this tion of SC & 5T Bill or any other Bill. What we Bill. We have offered our cooperation with have said is that our cooperation to the the request that these papers, not only NAB Government is subject to these cond~ions. report but also the PMO's files which the We are neither against SC & ST Bill nor land Prime Minister has assured will be placed on Reforms Bill. But Hthe Government wants the Table, should be placed on the Table. our cooperation, they should do this. But we But unfortunately, forthose files even though are not opposed to these Bills. there is no Swedish Government restriction, the Government is walking out of the prom- PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: Is your ise, the Prime Minister is walking out of the voting on SC & ST Bill conditional or will you promise made to this House. This is our vote for this Bill uncond~ionally? complaint that this Government wants to hide these files and continues w~h ~s image PROF. P. J. KURIEN: When you have tarnishing operation. That we strongly ob- requisite majority you do not want our ooop- ject. eration. You can easily pass these Bills. You remember, we did not vote against the these Coming to this Bill, everybody including bills yesterday. We only walked out. You the Prime Minister were saying that the SC & could have passed it. Sir, we ara prepared to ST Bill is very much for the poor,and that it is cooperate with the Government but, they gOiAg to be a Magna Carta for the poor. What should also cooperate by placing the papers is that BiH? It is only to accommodate Mr. on the Table of the House especially the 95 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 96

[Prof. P. J. Kurian] that after independence they would become land owners. After drawing inspiration from Bofors file, the A.. 320 file and also the terms this slogan thousands of young sons of the of reference w~h regard to the appointment poor laid down their lives. I remember that of a Judge In the Meham case. day when I came to know that Ch. Devi Lal and Aruna Asif Ali were coming to our vil- PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: I only lage. The share croppers and landless la- want to tell my hon. friend that when we were bourers had strong desire that Britishers s\tting in the Opposition and we were carry- should leave their country and monarchy ing on a fierce fight against Bofors issue, and feudal system should be abolished. even at that time when the Bills on Sched- These were their desires. uled Castes and Scheduled Tribes and such other Bills came, we always gave an uncon- 14.00 hr •. ditional support because we stood for these elements throughout the country. At that time I had seen 50,000 poor people of Punjab and Rajasthanthere. Today [ Translation] I would like to know from those people who are opposing the Amendment BIll as to what SHRI SHOPAT SINGH MAKKASAR they want. Why the Congress Party mem- (Bikaner): Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir an behalf bers, who are not present in the House are of the CPI (M) I welcome the Sixty sixth not joining us in passing the Bill? It is not a const~utional (Amendment) Bill which is question of Bofors butthe question is thatthe meant for in-elusion of the land reform laws Government did not implement the land re- in the Ninth Schedule. Some time back a forms honestly. They had made only tall seminar was organised in which the condi- promises only as a result of which the big tion of the poor in the country was discussed. land lords managed to protect their land from I would like to readout 2-3 lines from there. acquisition. Even before the announcement uAccordingtothe 1951 census the number of of these measures they leaked the informa- agricultural labourers in the country was 275 tion to the landlords about the possible fall lakhs and according to 1981 census this out and asked them to save their land from number increased to 644lakhs. In 1951 the acquisition and join the congress. Now they percentage of landless, small, marginal and do not have abstinence from anything. To- poor farmers was 28.3 which per cent in- day Shri Birla is the member of their party. creased to 38.5 percent in 1981." It means Now they do not feel shy of anything. Earlier that during 42 years of Congress rule the Shri Birla was not given the party ticket but poor, whether they are in rural area or urban this time has been elected to Rajya Sabha araa, have become poorer. The number of on congress party ticket. At that time they poor has as also that of the rich has in- had some hesitation about ~. The Congress creased. It is clear from the statistics which party under the leadership of Nehruji and were given by the Congress Government Indiraji fought for socialism but now under and not by the present Government. I re- the leadership of Shri Rejiv Gandhi" hates member my childhood days when I was socialism and loves Birla Saheb. They are all studying in a school in 1946. Our Deputy land grabbers. Today they have not run Prime Minister, Shri Oevi lal belongs to away because of Bofors but they have some Choutala Village, About sixty years ago a other motive behind it. The big landlords slogan IIZamin uski jo jote" (land belongs to have transferred their land in fictitious names tillar) was given in the Congress session. to maintain their possession ..... *.. *...... is The slogan which created feelings of anger my neighbour and my relative also. He is my against the Br"ish spread like a wild fire all father in law ... (lnterruptions) over the country. This slagon gave new hopes to share croppers who used to cuhi- SHRI HARISH RAWAT: Sir, he has said vate the land of Rajas and big Zimindars, objectionabtethings-firstly he has mentioned -Not recorded. 97 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 98 the name and secondly he used the word have made mechanized forms and now no chor. (Interruptions) one can acquire their land. They have also made the God as minor. Thousands of acres MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: of land is there in the name of every 'Devast· ...... name will not go on han'. Nathdwara temple has lakhs of acres record. of land. Similarly other temples have also lakhs of acres of land. The poor cuhivators SHRJ SHOPAT SINGH MAKKASAR: I who used to cultivate it have been dispos- am talking about my father in law. sessed. The God of Nathdwara will remain minor for ever and that is why no body could MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Mr. acquire that land. The God may be of thou- Makkasar, you will not be given any chance sand years old but for their own hunger of to defame even your father in law. land they have shown the God as minor. Their Gods will remain minor for ever. I SHRI SHOPATSINGH MAKKASAR: If remember that is 1970 when Rajasthan canal you take it ill, I will not mention the name. I was constructed in my area the Government know congress leaders who have one thou· had lakhs of acres of land in its possession. sand bighas of land Today they talk about At that time Indiraji was in power in the the poor. They have their farms not at one Centre and had parted ways with synopti- place but at different places in Punjab, U.P. cally. In Delhi a resolution for socialism was and Rajasthan. The persons who had earlier passed and there was talk about land re- no land in their possession have now ac· forms. At that time late Shri Sukhadia was quired huge properties. The absence of the the Chief Minister of Rajasthan and he work Congress men shows that they want more the decision to auction government land. All land. They apprehend that their land may not the opposition parties opposed this more go out of their hand. I would also like to say and said that we would not allow the auction to the Janata Dal leaders to implement it of land and the land should be given to effectively. Only then the poor section of the farmers because land is the mother of farm- society will be with them. The people have ers. During that agitation 15 persons were elected them for five years and during this killed in firing and 20,OOOfarmers, our sisters period they should serve the people. They and daughter went to jails. We came to Delhi should implement it honestly. The Congress and met Indiraji. At that time our camarade party has distributed only 45 lakh acres of Gopalan and Comarade Ramamurti were land among the poor during the last 42 years members of the Parliament. Our party leader whereas six crore acres of surplus land Camarade Surjit in tervened and besides should have been distributed. The land dis· other leaders Late Shri Charan Singh also tributed among the poor was waste land took interest in the matter and said that the which was left by the landlords. Leave aside agitation should end and the Government the questions of land ceiling and land re- should distribute the land among the poor forms implementation the Government have and landless farmers. Martial law was de- dispossessed all the poor share croppers clared in Ganganagar district. At last, Shri who used to cultivate the land and earned Sukhadia adm~ted his mistake and apolo- their livelihood. I know because I also belong gized in the State Assembly and declared to aZaminderfamily.ln my childhood, I have that the Government of Rajasthan would not seen in 1945-46 that there was hunger in the auction the land in future . The land was houses of big land lords who did not cultivate distributed among the farmers. 161akh acres their own land. There was poverty among of land having irrigation facilhies was distrib- them. I have seen poverty in my own house. uted among onelakh landless farmers at the Today their poor camels and bullocks have rate of Rs. 17,000 for 25 bighas and the been replaced by tractors. The big land lords amount was realised in 20

-Not recorded. 99 Canst (86th Amend.) MAY 30.1990 Bill 100

[Sh. Shopat Singh Makkasar] and they apprehend that as soon as this Bill is passed, their surplus land will be acquired. instalm.nts ..... (/nt9"uptlons) I am not say- Therefore, this government should do it. It ing such. Today there is coalition Gov.rn- should not only be passed but should also be ment of Janat. Oal and BJP in Rajasthan. implemented. I would like to say that this law Today land is being auctioned there in the would strengthen the hands 01 the landless name of special allotment which should be and the poor cultivators and at the same tima stopped. Hthe Government is serious about strengthen the Government also. this Bill, Hshould take decision not to auction the govemment tand and it should be distrib- SHRl YAMUNA PRASAD SHASTRI uted among the poor . Today there are lakhs (Rewa): Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir h Is a of landless farmers in Rajasthan whereas revolutionary 8i11 which has been introduced lakhs of acres of land is lying unused in in the House. During pre-independence days Jaisalmer and Barmer districts of Rajasthan. a promise was made to the landless and Now Canal has reached there and water is poor people during the Congress Session at available for the farmers but cultivators are Krachi in 1930 that after independence they not there is that area. The Congress Govern- would be given land. The land would be ment wanted to auction the land through taken away from those big landlords who did allotment. Therefore, through you. I would not plough their own land and that would be like to say that the Government should direct given to the cu~ivators who actually toil in the the State Government today itse" to distrib- fields. This promise was made i" 1930-31. ute thts land among the land less Scheduled This gave new Inspirations to the poor, lan- Castes, down bodder and poor and ~ should dless and downtrodden people and they be implemented strictly. sacrificed their everything for the freedom struggle and at last country became inde- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sirthecondition is pendent. After that constitutions was framed Rajasthan is very condHion is very peculiar. but right to property was included in the I would like to tell as to what is happening Fundamental Rights. There were two great there. I would like to tell the Government as socialist leaders in the Constituent Assem- to what the Congress Government had done. bly namely Seth Damodar Sawaroop and Patwaris do not enter the names of the Shn Saramdhar Dass who refused to sign cu~lvators in the revenue record and write the. Copy of the Constitution because it only the name of the land owner. Two three included the Right to property in the funda- years back it was decided in the Revenue mental rights. They were of the view that so Ministers conference that names of the cui- long as right to property is there as Funda- . tivators should be entered in revenue rec- mental Right Government would not be able ords only then they can be saved. Girdavl is to bring about any economic reforms in the done in the names of land owners and the country. The Government would not be able poor cu~ivators and agricultural labourers to acquire surplus land and distribute that work like bonded labourers In their fields. among the landless workers. This would not They wori<. at the mercy of the owners. They allow the Government to acquire this surplus may keep them or may remove them from land. work. Th~,~ names are not entered in rev~ nue reco~ and only the owners, name IS entered t~re. You should take h seriously It was proved that they did to sign it. and take ~me decision in this regard. The After the abolition of Zamindari system the Congress \Government have not imple" socialists started a movement in this country mented land reforms during the last forty to get the promises made fulfilled. They years, so th~ present Government should do demanded that surplus land should be dis- tt because now ~ Is their responsibility. They tributed and that a ceiling on the agricultural are shying away from Hand we can under- land should be fixed. Earlier, Congreaslead- stand that most of them are land grabbers ers made a fun of it and said thal .•..... 101 Canst. (66th Amsnd.) JYAISTHA 9.1912 (SAKA) BIll 102

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Please do ers. They do not have land even for con- not narrateotharthings; confine your speech structing their houses. to the provisions of the Bill. Voting is to take place at 2.30 PM. Besides you, other mem- Land Ceiling Laws have been made bers also have to speak. from time to time but our Government has taken an historical decision and amended SHRI YAMUNA PRASAD SHASTRI: I .the Const~ution to include Land Reform Laws shall finish soon. The law enacted in 1960 in the Ninth Schedule of the Constitution. provided for ceilings but ~ remained on papers only and the lands of big people and big The question is not of only Jand ceilings. zamindars were not acquired. The situation the question is also of giving ownership of continues to be the same. Once, as a Chair- land to the tillers. Bengal has really done an man or convenor of a committee of Planning historical work in this regard. This has not Commission, Shri P.S. Appu had said that if been done anywhere except in Bengal. any big fraud had been commnted in the Therefore, all the Land Reform Laws and the country it was in connection with land ceiling laws relating to social justice should be in- laws. The land ceiling laws were made for cluded in the Ninth Schedule so that they namesake. They are absolutely meaning- may be out of the jurisdiction of courts; no less. There was no will or pomical will to body may challenge them in courts and enforce them and land could not be distrib- nobody may deprive the poor of social jus- uted to the poor under them. Thousands of tice. Keeping this in view, a provision has acres of land is still owned by the big people. been made to include these laws in the Ninth Once, in the case of Golak Nath, Supreme Schedule. Even today, the s~uation in the Court had passed a judgement that no law country is that 70 per cent of land is held by can be enacted to curtail the fundamental only 15 per cent landlords. Only 30 per cent rights. Right to property is a fundamental of land is held by 85 per cent landless labour- right. You cannot curtail it. Later our leader ers and marginal farmers of the country. late Shri Nath Pai brought a Constitution That is the reason why production of Amendment Bill to empower Parliament to foodgrains is not increasing in the country. amend fundamental rights. That Bill was Production and productivity of foodgrains passed. Later in 1977 Janata Party Govern- can be increased by pr.oper distribution of ment came to power and the right to property the lanet The production and productivity was deleted from fundamental rights and we increase where the land is less. Japan has had been able to implement Land Reform very little land but produdiv~y is 7200 Kg. Laws retrospectively. But that Government per hectare. In India, even in States like fell and the old practice continued, big land Punjab, productivity is 2200 Kg. per hectare. holders continued to hold the lands in ficti- The people of this country can not prosper till tious names. On papers they passessed the landless and poor are given the owner- land acoording to the land ceiling law but in ship right of land. I support the Bill which has reality, They are owners of thousands of been brought to give a such right to the poor acres of land. The Raja of the district to which and hope that all hon. Members will support I belong, holds thousands of acres of land. It this Bill and pass it unanimously. This will is known to all. But in lease papers and bring a new hope for crores of landless poor Government papers ~ has been registered in people of the country. different names. Such conspiracy and big fraud take place in the country and no action [English] is taken in the matter.

There are erores of people in this CX)un- SHRI HARISH RAWAT: I am on a point try who are deprived of land and social of procedure. (/nte"uptions) Only one justice and are living below the poverty Un •. Member he. spoken from our Party. M per Today. there are 8 crora agricutturaJ labour- our strength in the House, half of the time 103 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30, 1990 Bill 104

[Sh. Harish Rawat] the States so far, excepting two-three States like Kerala, Bengal. Tripura, have always consumed by this House on this Bill should favoured the law bntaker landlords against be given to us. the law abiding poor. This is the history till date. Evan than. I would like to draw your MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: If time isther., attention towards one thing. Aconference of I will allow. I have called Mr. Kurien. I have Revenue Ministers ot the country was called called one member each from CPM, Janata in Delhi in 1985. The Government of India Dal and now CPt I will call you also, if there took some decisions in tt. Those decisions Is time. were ratified in November, 1986 and again in 1987. I would like that my friends who will SHRI HARISH RAWAT: It is as per your take part in discussion, would also speak on wish. the decision which was taken unanimously as to whether even one percent effort was MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: If everybody made to implement that decisions. That stands up and challengeS', what will the chair decision is still with me. If you like I will read do? If the time is there, I will call you. it out because I doubt that the press of the country have not co"ered it. It has not per .. Shri Bhogendra Jha. vaded political atmosphere of the country. H is essential that the people at large know [ Translation] about it. But I shall come to it later.

SHAI BHOGENDRAJHA: (Madhubani): Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I am reading Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, Irise to support the out a small portion of the written reply given 66th Constttution Amendment Bill and I also by our Agriculture Minister Chaudhary Devi support the amendment which stands in the Lal ji in this House in his reply to a written name of hon. Minister Shri Upendra Nath question on 12th April last. Verma. because it is also very important. liThe consensus arrived at in the Con~ Sir, before expressing my views I would ference of Revenue Ministers held in 1985 like to say that we should not be penalised for and 1986 were sent to State Governments the time which has been demanded by Shri fortheirconsideration and necessary action. Rawatji, which has been wasted. I want that Some of these recommendations alongwith I should be given time to speak on hbecause other proposals for effective implementation I want to express my views on it. We should of Land Reforms are proposed to be dis- . pass b unanimously. I would not like to cussed w~h the Chief Ministers of State repeat what others have said about the land Governments/U. Ts. shortly." reforms. For the persons like me the question of land reforms has remained linked with This reply was given on 12th April and struggle for independence since 1937-38. I now it is the end of May. The conference of would not go Into the background of this. We Chief Ministers has concluded and it was not know very well that land reforms are not discussed therein. I understand that the going to be implemented by only enacting conference of Chief Ministers is going to take the laws. Until a mass movement is built up place again on 11 th and 12th and there is and strengthened the law will have little also the same doubt that ~ may not be effect. Since our administrative structure and discussed there also. I have my deep appre- our politics are controlled by influential land- hension that landlords of both sides, on lords, though they are very few in number, ruling and opposition sides what that ~ should they create obstructions in enacting and not be implemented implementing such laws and when the people stand to implement them the Governments Therefore, the unanimous decision of which have come in power in the Centre or in the Revenue Ministers of the country has not 105 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 106 been implem ented at all. I would Iike that an tive State Governments to implement the assurance should be given in this House law. Somebody has referred to the issue of today about the steps being taken to imple· minors also. There is a provision In land ment it. , would like to give some examples reforms law which had been passed in 1978 about implementation. In Kerala 4,000 and tha1 those who were minor at that time will in West Bengal 1,000 cultivators still have not get any share in the land when they more than 25 acres of agricultural land de- become adult. The Ministers of Revenue spite the present ceiling of 25 acres under had made a unanimous &uggestion in this the existing laws. Among the other States regard in 1985. Booth capturing is also in- Andhra Pradesh is on the top. Our friends dulged in by these very persons who had should keep it in mind as to how it should be land under their illegal possession. They are implemented. In Andhra Pradesh alone people of so called higher castes who com· 1,96,000 landlords have 24,94,000 acres of mit social atrocities, but now even the people land in their possession. In Bihar52000 land of lower castes are also committing atroci· lords have 8,25,000 acres of land in their ties. One can go though the cases right from possession I am talking about encroach- Belachhi to recent happenings, they would ment of land which is above the law. Gujarat be found involved in such crimes. These is a small State, but there are 1,42,000 people are indulging in centralisation of land, landlords who have more than 25 acres of illegal possession of land, usury, cornering land holdings. They have 20,59,000 acres of of loans from banks, comm itting atrocities on land in their possession. Haryana is also a caste basis, booth capturing and rigging of very small State, but there are 60,000 land- elections. It is affecting production of the lords who have more than 9,02,000 acres of country adversely. I am saying on the basis land in their possession which IS more than of my personal knowledge about the country that of Bihar. This is the case of illegal that number of absentee landlords is in- possession of land. creasing. Even though we have no connection with cultivation, but we claim our share SHRI K. D. SUL TANPURI (Shimla): in the land whether we are in the foreign Please tell about Himachal Pradesh also. country, embassies, Parliament, politics or in Government service. Wp will not give any SHRI BHOGENDRAJHA: I Will tell about share to our brother from our provident fund it later on. Punjab is under the Central rule. a~d pension, but we must have our share in there are 74,000 such landlords who have the land. The entire educated class In indulg· 97,90,000 acres of land in their possession. ing in cheating and still this class believes I feel W steps are taken to implement land they are not doing so. Asa result, agricuttural reforms laws in Punjab even at this stage, production of our country is decreasing. the terrorists and secessionists will get a set Those who are actually tilling the land are not back and people of lower class and other the owner of the land and those who are people will get united in factor of it and thus owners of the land on papers, never cultivate they will help in strengthening the unity of the their land and their sons or grandsons also country. In Rajasthan 5,000 land lords have will not do it. This problem is increasing, 97,90,000 acres of land which is in their particularly for middle class. The laws re- illegal possession. I have given examples of garding crop sharing have caused blood States ruled by ruling party, opposition party shed in Bihar and the Government of Bihar and by the leftist parties, so that we may think dropped its implementation. I would like to over ~ and we make take steps to implement convey my thanks that the Government has n. I would like to urge the Government that accepted the suggestion of the Government keeping in view the unanimous view ot the of Bihar and supported it. The big landlords house, the Government should make an are also not ready to accept it. Therefore, I announcement today itself that nwould take would like to urge that the government should steps to implement it. The speakers who make an announcement that its implemen- express their views should ask their respec- tation will be announced in the conference of 107 Canst. (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 108

[Sh. 8hogendra Jha1 House agrees to allow two or three more Members to speak. the Ministers of Revenue. With a view to (Interruptions) avoid fhigation. it would be appropriate to keep such land laws in the Ninth Schedule. [ Translation] But problem will not be over merely by keeping the land laws in the Ninth Schedule. They SHRI BHOGENDRA JHA: Mr. Deputy can file writs under fundamental rights and Speaker, Sir, a lot of our time has been the Government can not prohibit them from wasted, now h should not be wasted any- this. I am not talking about prohibiting them. more. I would like to say that Hpolitical will is there and administrative steps are taken alongwith SHRI RAJENORA AGNIHOTRI ~, we will get the land reform laws imple- (Jhansi): Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, W they mented through mass movement. I would want to give their support, it is a welcome like to urge my friends in all the parties that feature. they should not take assistance of police and remain neutral, where their party is in power. SHRI CHANDRA SHEKHAR (Ballia): The poor people will themselves implement Mr. Deputy Speaker. Sir in my opinion both the laws, land reform laws and we will imple- these bills are very important. One is related ment crop sharing laws, because the police to harijan and tribals and other is related to and leaders have caused blood shed there. landless and small farmers. H one or two I would like to say this much only about members express their views about these violators of laws. I do not want to give several bills and both of these bills are passed unani- examples. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, we will mously, we should acclJpt their request and pass thiS Bill unanimously in the Parliament. I would like to request the leaders of the Our hone Deputy Prime Minister has come. I opposition not to divide this House at least had urged him also and want to mention that on these issues. All parties should pass it here, I would like to hear from him the reply unanimously. Mr. Deputy speaker, Sir we which he had been given to me in the confer- leave it to you to give as much time as you ence of Food Ministers. heclaims himseH as desire. (Interruptions) 'Tau' of the poor and he had said that he would get the land reform laws implemented. SHRI SHOPAT SINGH MAKKASAR: He had said that he would pursue the State They have wasted full days. We do not want governments to implement the decision taken their co-operation. (lnt8rruptions) unanimously in the Conference of the Food Ministers. It can be started from Haryana, Punjab or other States. , would like to say MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Mr. that ~ should be passed in the House unani- Makkasar, you please take your seat. J agree mously. I do "ot want to take much time of with the views of the hen. Member Shri the House. Therefore whh these words, I Chandra Shekhar and I would like to say that conclude. (/nt8rruptions) the Government is also agreeable. I would like to tell all the hone Members that perhaps [Eng/ish) all of you have unanimous views in this regard. W~h such an expression only ten- MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: It was de- sion will increase. We should not hurt the cided that the voting woufd taka place at 2.30 feelings of one another. If we want to pass p.m. t have beem told that one of the Mem- this BUt unanimously. we should not have bers from the opPOSitIOn Party wants to any problem to provide some more time. I make a helpful statement. And I have a long am giving soma mota tima by using my .. of other members also who want to d;acretion. Plea.. taka your seat and do not apeak. Now I would like to know whether the . talk with each other. I hope that aU parties will 108 Const. (86th Amend.) JVAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) Bill 110

extend their O(H)peration for smooth func- these Constitution (Amendment) BHIs.1 want tioning of the House. to clarify It that we will support those bills, which h,v8 been introduced in the House for (Intsffuptions) the welfare of the poor as appealed by Shrl Chandra Shekhar and others, but nobody MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Shri Kapse should remain under this Impression that we has stated very Correctly that time limit should do want to assert our rights. I want to say It be fixed. lam not giving much time. All of you very clearly and I hope that those Parties may please Continue to sit here. Speeches which are seeking support on this issue, and voting will be 'over very shortly. You should also support us in getting the papers need not go outside. laid in the House.

( Inteffuptions) MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Shri Ram Krishan Yadav. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I would like to appeal to the entire House, that when any [Eng/ish] Member is speaking here, you may please not express your views by sitting in your seat SHRI NIRMAL KANT I CHA lTERJEE and do not use such language which may (Dumdum): Sir, rest of the House should prolong this discussion. Shri Vasant Sathe, congratulate them (interruptions) It is better Please speak without using Hs and buts. (ate than never. (lntsrruptions) cowardice has overtaken them for agreeing to vote in SHRI VASANT SATHE(Wardha): Mr. favour of the Bill (int8ffuptions) Deputy speaker, Sir, we have been expressing our feelings about this issue for the last PROF. P. J. KURIEN: We never said, two days. We had said ...... (Interruptions} we will not vote. (Interruptions\ We have stated very categorically that we are not against these bills, We want that SHRI RAM KRISHAN YADAV these bill should be passes. (Inteffuptions) (Azamgarh): Hon. Mr. Deputy-Speaker Sir, We regret also that those important docu- personally and on behalf of my party I wel- ments must have been placed before the come and support the constitution (Amend- House ...... (/ntsrruptions) ment) Bill regarding land reforms. All the parties in the country had raised the slogan We will certainly urge to lay those docu- of land to the tiller' but this slogan could not ments on the table of the House. We have 0 be implemented because of the influence of the same feeling with regard to that Issue the capitalist class. Today cap~aljsts and and it is very clear also. We do not want to pol~icalleaders have thousands of acres of create any doubt in th~ mind of the poor, the land. They have no intention of letting this farmers and the members of the Scheduled land slip into the hands of the poor, landless castes and Scheduled Tribes that we are in labour who have till now tilled this land. It is any way opposed to their felt that once the labourers get the land they interests. (Interruptions) That is why we held will stoJJ working. The landlords will not let go a meeting w~h our leadertoday and we have of their land which is tilled by Scheduled come to this conclusion ... ( Inte"uptions) Caste and Scheduled Tribe people. The landlords themselves never work on their MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: This is not land and the Government does not intend to proper to interrupt in between. Please take let this land go into the hands of people vourseal. belonging to the poor and backward classes. The Government's laws are also such that SHRI VAS ANT SATHE: We have had a they impede the distribution of land among meeting with our leader and we have de- the poor. I woukt lik. to say that the intention cided to extend our cooperation in passing of of this Bill is not very good. The Bftl says that 111 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30. 1990 Bill 112

[Sh. Ram Krishan Yadav] can at best be called reformative, not revolutionary. This Bill will certainly not lead to a some Acts should be included in the Ninth revolution in the field of land reforms. With Schedule. It means that only some of the these words I end my speech (Interruptions) land reforms are being included in the Ninth Schedule. In this way the Government has [English] not fulfilled its promise. There are Rajas and capitalists in the Janata Oal and the Con- SHRI B. SHANKARANAND (Chikkodi): gress (I) (Interruptions) Mr. Deputy Speaker Sir, we have made it abundantly clear that we are in support of MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Please s~ these two Constitution (Amendment) Bills. down. The Members who have spoken yesterday in this debate from out side have also said SHRI RAM KRISHAN YADAV: I repeat that we are in support of these two Bills. that there are rajas both in the ruling party None of us has said the we are opposing and in the opposition. That is why the voice these two Bills. I do not think that any party of those who favour the poor and backward can say that what the Congress has done- class is not heard. Merel~ passing this Bill is rignt from Gandhiji up to Rajiv Gandhi-forthe not enough and the Government must intro- Scheduled Castes and Scheduled Tribes duce a law that provides forthe acquisition of has also been done by them. (Interruptions) land from capitalists and political leaders so as to distribute ~ among the poor people who MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Please do till the land (Interruptions) not disturb the good atmosphere.

[Englistl] ( Interruptions)

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Nobody SHRIB.SHANKARANAND:MRDe~ should leave the House now please. uty-Speaker, Sir, to be honest, I do not find any difference regarding the const~utional ( Interruptions) authority for protecting the interests of the scheduled castes and scheduled tribes. The [ Translation] existing constitutional authority is an officer under Article 338. In place of one officer, the amending Bill says that there would be SHRI RAM KRISHAN YADAV: If the Chairman, Deputy Chairman or Vice-Chair- Scheduled Castes and Scheduled Tribes man, and three Members. It is going to be a stop working in the agricu~ural rector, not a mutti-member authority. Except that I do not single grain will be produced in this country. think there is anything in the Bill which gives I demand the introduction of a law which more powers to this authority. In any case, provides for the acquisition of all uncu~i we are supporting this Bill. Let not Shri vated land for distribution among the Har- Paswan take credit ..... {/nterrupt'Ons) ijans and the poor. But even this much is not clear in the Bill. People wrth money power MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Please help and muscle power can afford to follow a case the House. upto the level of the Supreme court and such cases are not disposed off for years. This Bill SHRI B. SHANKARANAND: t must say may Improve the situation to a small extent that the scheduled castes and scheduled but widespread change will come about only tribes of this country must be grateful to the when the entire land area in the country is Congress Party and its leadership. No other dadared as national property. Until this Government has done so much for these happens we cannot 8Xped a significant people. History speaks for itself. (/nte"up- change in the present sftuation. So this Bill tions). 113 ·Const. (66th Amend.) BillJYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA)Const (68th Amend.) SRI 114

[ Trans/ation] a Cabinet Minister. I am sorry if he has not found any berth in the Cabinet at least. he SHRI RAM DHAN (Lalganj) A portra~ should have been sufftclent power as a could not be hung in the Central Hall. There Chairman of the Commission. (Interruptions) are three portraits of the Nehru family. [Translation] [English] SHRI RAM DHAN: Mr. Deputy Speaker MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: You wilt Sir. as hon. Shri Shankaranand ~s said please not interfere and help the House. some thing about me. I would like to say that when I was General Secretary of his partY, I SHRI B. SHANKARANAND: I still as- did not accept the offer in protect against bert that this Bill does not provide anything refusal of ticket to SC/ST in the Rajya Sabha. more for the community. It is my challenge. Hon. Shri Rajiv Gandhi is present and he If anybody wants to say that the Comm iss ion knows about this. (Interruptions) has got more authority to protect the interests of the scheduled castes and scheduled THE DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER AND tribes, I am not going to accept it. Let the MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE (SHRI DEVI Prime Minister say that. But still we are going LAL): Sir, 1am pleased to say that we started to support it. Even though the Bill has no an agitation against the speaker in 1936. In substance, we are going to support it be- those days there were tenancy laws which cause let them not play the mischief in con- the landlords flouted at will. The landlord veying a message to the people that we are used to remove the tenants as he against this Bill. fancied ...... is my relative. We made the Government acquire his land because Regarding the land reforms, it is to for he used to remove the tenants and employ the first time that this Government is bringing absentees in their place. these Bills in the 9th Scheduled. Sir, from the very Bill itself you can see that it star!s with [English] 203 and ends at 257 which means that already there have been 202 land reforms SHRI SONTOSH MOHAN DEV (Tripura Acts in the Ninth Schedule right from 1951 till West): Sir, ...... as not a member of the now. This Government should nottake credit. House. His name should not form part of the We say that all these land reforms were record. already there. It is not something new which the Government is doin(). (Interruptions) MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Yes, Hwill not form part of the Record. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: You address the Chair. [ Trans/ation]

SHRI B. SHANKARANAND: Sir, these SHRI oevi LAL: I am happy that this Bill land reforms were already there in the Ninth is being introduced in the presence of the Schedule of the Constitution and their Speaker. About 25 days back there was a number is 202. This Bill starts with 203 and meeting of the National Front in which our ends at 257. We are not saying that you are leader said that ours is a minority Govern- doing something wrong but our grievance is ment relying on the support of Left and Right that you are not giving enough power to this parties. I had told him then that ours was a National Commission which my friend. Mr. majority government, not a minority 0118. Ramdhan would have enjoyed in the rank of Today'sdecision. I am happy to say, proves

·Not recorded. 115 Const. (66th Amend.) Bill MAY 30, 1990 Const. (68th Amend) 81 118

(Sh. Dey; lail Rs. 100 was granted to aged persons and concessional travel facility was provided to my point. At that time I had also said that In senior citizens. All this led to an awakening • House of 442 members, 318 were from among the rural population in North India. rural areas and in the Congress out of 193 We have the strength to overcome the ob- members there are only 80 members from stacles being put in our way. rural areas. By their revo" they have shown that they are not in favour of the poor. They I don't think there is need for any more would not have protested if they had the discussion on this subject. The decision was weHare of the backward classes at heart. taksn at 2.30 p. m. and they have had ample The Opposition raised the issue of Bofors. opportunities to express their views. I think Our han. Prime Minister said that they could opinions should be sought so as to know raise this issue later and there was no point how sympathetic they'are (Interruptions) in harming the interests of the poor underthe cover of the Bofors issue. SHRI BHAJAN LAL (Faridabad): Sir, people were killed in Mehan, democracy I don't consider it appropriate to say was murdered ...... (/nterruptions) As far as much on this subject. According to the facts tho Bill is concerned. we have always voted and figures given by hon. Shri Guman Mal in favour of mass welfare Hon. Shri Devi Lal Lodha, there are 1,23,99,000 tillers in our says that loans have been waived in Har- country against whom there is a stay order. yana. I would like to state in this House that Apart from this he cited the example of Haryana is close to Delhi and it would be Andhra Pradesh where there are 1.32 lakh better ff we go to Haryana and see the actual such persons. Responsible persons help situation for ourselves. them on the basis of money power. The poor person is not able to reach the level of courts. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Please sit down, Shri Bhajan lal. I don't see anything lacking in the Bill presented by hon. Shri Ram Vilas Paswan I SHRI BHAJAN LAl: These things were have also listened to the objections raised by said by Shri Devi lal. E:arlier he had said in the other side. All their objections are aimed the House that the Bofors document3 would at denying this help to the poor. For two days be laid on the Table of the House. The they stalled the proceedings of the House on Session is going to end tomorrow but we account of the Chautala affair. It was our have yet to see the documents. weakness that we let such a thing happen. We can prove ourselves even by resigning. But the leader of the Opposition will not resign from Amethi and so they are raising 15.00 hrs. the same issue again. The Opposition is not boycotting the proceedings because they [English] are under pressure from some of their members who are from rural areas. The CONSTlTUTlON (SIXTY ..EIGHTH Congress (I) had staged a walk--out. I am AMENDMENT) BllL-CONTO. happy to say that Bofors. was not the lone issue in the previous general elections. If MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Now, Mem- Bofors had been the only issue then the bers will take their seats. The House will first Congress would not have won in Andhra take up the ConstHution (Sixty-Eighth) Pradesh or Karnataka. They have won in Amendment Bill, j 990 for vote. Shri Girdhari thosE' States as they took up the problems Lal Bhargava has moved an amendment to being faced by :armers. We had formulated th. motion for consideration of the Bill. I will a scheme in Haryana under which loans put the same to the vote of the House, unless upto Rs. 10,000 were waived, a pension of he wants to withdraw the same. 117 Con.t. (68th Amend) JYAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) Bill 118

SHRI GIRDHARI LAL BHARGAVA The Lok Sabha divided. (Jaipur): I seek leave of the House to withdraw my amendment. AYES

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Has the Hon. Division No. 6 Member leave of the House to withdraw his amendment? 15.12 hra.

SEVERAL HON. MEMBERS: Yes. Acharia, Shri Basudeb

The Amendment No. 1 was, by leave, Advani, Shri LK. withdrawn Agarwal, Shrl J.P. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Before I put the motion for consideration tothe vote of the Agnihotri, Shri Rajendra House, this being a Constitution (Amend- ment) Bill, voting has to be by division. Let Aher, Dr. Daulatrao SonuJI the Lobbies be cleared- Ahmed, Shri Anwar Now the lobbies have been cleared. Before I put the Motion, I would like to read Ahmed, Shri Kamaluddin out, as to how the voting has to be done in the House, for the benefit of Members. I would Ajit Singh, Shri like to request each Member to make sure that he is sitting in his assigned seat. Each Ali, Shrimati Subhashim Member is requested to take special care to see that he votes ab initio correctly as 'Yes', Amat, Shri D. 'No' or 'Abstention' as the case may be, so that there IS no occasion for making correc- Antulay. Shri A.R. tions. Argal, Shri Chhaviram I may briefly recall that as soon as the automatic vote recording equipment is made Arunachalam, Shri M. active, or an announcement is made by the Chair 'Now Division', a gong sounds, which Asokaraj, Shri A. is a signal to the Members to cast their votes. Each Member has to press, push a switch Athithan, Shri Dhanuskodi R. and then operate one of the three buttons, i.e. IAye', 'No' or 'Abstention', according to Baga Reddy, Shri M. his own choice. The push switch and the push button must be kept pressed simulta- Baig, Shri Arif neously until the gong sounds for the second time, after ten seconds. The kind coopera- BaHha, Shri Mahendra tion of the Members is solicited. Bala, Dr. Asim The question is: Balaraman, Shri L. "That the Bill further to amend the Const~ution of India, be taken into consid- Banatwalta, Shri G.M. eratior•. "

Now Division. Ban.ra. Shri Hamendra Singh 119 Const. (68th Am~Jnd.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 120

Bankhels, Shri Kisanrao Baburao Chatterjee, Shri Nirmal Kanti

Bansi Lal, Shri Chatterji, Shri Somnath

Barman, Shri Palas Chaudhary, Shri Ishwar

Basu, Shri Anil Chaudhary, Shri Rudrasan

Basu, Shri Chitta Chaudhary Shri Kamal

Bega Ram, Shri Chauhan, Shri Prabhatsinh

Bahara, Shri Bhajaman Chavan, Shtimati Premalabai

Bengali Singh, Dr. Chavda, Shri Khemchanbhai Somabhai

Bhagat, Shri H.K.L. Chaudhary, Shri Lakanath

Bhagey Gobardhan, Shri Choudhury, Shri Saifuddin

Bhajan Lal, Shri Dandavate, Prof. Madhu

Bhardwaj, Shri Parasram Danwe, Shri Pundlik Hari

Bhargava, Shri Girdhari Lal Das, Shri Anadi Charan

Bhartiya, Shri Santosh Das, Shri Bhakta Charan

Bhatia, Shri Ram Sewak Dasgupta, Dr. Biplab

Bhattacharya, Srimati Malini Datta, Shri Amal

Bhattacharya, Shri Nani Delkar, Shri Mohanbhai Sanjibhai

Bhosla, Shri Prataprao Saburao Dennis, Shri N.

Sirender Singh, Aao Deora, Shri Murli

Bopche, Dr. Khushal Parasram Deshmukh, Shri Anantrao

Brahm Dutt, Shri Deshmukh, Shri Chandubhai

Bulara, Shimati Rajinder Kaur Dev, Shri Sontosh Mohan

Chakravorty, Shri Susanta Davi Lal, Shri

Chand Ram, Shri Dhakane, Shri Babanrao

Chandra Shakhar, Shri Dhankhar, Ch. Jagdeep

Charles, Shri A. Dhawan, Shri Harmohan 121 Const. (68th Amend.) JVAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) SUI 122

Dhumal, Prof. Pram Kumar Jag Pal Singh, Shri

Dikshit, Shri Narsinghrao Jai Parkash, Shri

Dome, Dr. Ram Chandra Jamod, Shri Shashibhai

Fernandes, Shri George Jangde, Shri Rasham Lal

Fernandez, Shrl Joss Jaswant Singh, Shri

Gajapathi, Shri Gopi Nath Jatav, Shri Than Singh

Gamit, Shri Chhitubhai Devjibhai Jatiya, Shri Satynarayan

Gandhi, Shrimati Maneka Jayamohan, Shri A.

Gandhi, Shri Rajiv Jeevarathinam, Shri R.

Gangadhar, Shri S. Jena, Shri Srikanta

Gangwar, Shri Santosh Kumar Jha, Shri Bogendra

Giri, Shri Sudhir Jhikram, Shri Mohanlal

Gujral, Shri I.K. Jorawar Ram, Shri

Gupta, Shri Dharmpal Singh Joshi, Shri Oau Dayal

Gupta, Shri Indrajit Ju, Deo, Shri Dilip ~ingh

Gupta, Shri Janak Raj Kabde, Dr. Venkatesh

Handoo, Shri Piyare Lal Kale, Shri Sukhdeo Nandaji

Hannan Mollah, Shri Kalvi, Shri Kalyan Singh

Hansda, Shri Matilal Kambla, Shri Arvind Tulshiram

Harish Pal, Shri Kaps9, Prof. Ram Ganesh

Harsh Vardhan, Shri Kataria, Shri Gulab Chand

Heara Shai, Shri Kauishtk, Shri Purushottam

Hat Ram, Shri Keshari Lal, Shr;

Hota, Shri Shabani Shankar Khan, Shri ArH Mohammad

Inder Jit, Shri Khan, Haji G. U.

Jaffer Sharief. Shri C.K. Khan, Shr; Sukhendu 123 Canst (68th Amend.) MAY 30, 1990 Bill 124

Khan, Shri ZuHiquar Ali Meghwal. Shri Kailash

Khandelwal, Shri Pyarelal Mewar, Shri Mahendra Singh

Khatique, Shri Shanker lal Mirdha, Shri Nathu Ram

Khurana, Shri Madan Lal Mishra, Shri Balgopal

Kirpal Singh, Shri Mishra, Shri Janeshwar

Kotadia, Shri Manubhai Mishra, Shri Raj Mangal

Krishna Kumar, Shri S. Misra, Shri Satyagopal

Kumaramanglam, Shri P.R. Mohammad Shafi, Shri

Kundu, Shri Samarendra Mukherjee, Shrimati Geeta

Kurien, Prof. P. J. Mukhopadhyay, Shri Ajoy

Mahabir, Prasad, Shri Multan Singh, Chaudhary

Mahadik, Shr; Vamanrao Muraleedharan, Shri K.

Mahajan, Shrimati Sumitra Murthy, Shr; M.V. Chandra Shekara

Mahajan. Shri Y.S. Muthiah, Shri R.

Mahala. Shri lIIaribhau Shankar Naik, Shr; Ram

Mahata, Shri Chitta Nandi, Shri Yellaiah

Mahato, Shri Shallendra Narayanan, Shri K.R.

Makkasar, Shri Shopat Singh Naravanan, Shri P.G.

Malhotra. Shri Vijay Kumar Navak. Shri Nakul

Malik, Shrl Purna Chandra Negi, Shri C.M.

Malik. Shri Satya Pal N~ish Kumar, Shri

Malltk, Shri Mangaraj Odeyar, Shri Channaiah

Mandai, Shri Sanat Kumar Oraon, Shrmati Sumati

Marbanlang, Shrl Pater G. Pal, Shri M.S.

MHna, Dr. Kirodi Lal Pal, Shri Rupchand

Meena. Shri Nandlal Pand., Shri Rajmangal 125 Const. (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 126

Pandey, Prof. Yadu Nath Potdukhe, Shri Shantaram

Pandeya, Dr. Laxminarayan Prabhu, Shri R.

Pani, Shri Ravi Narayan Pradhani, Shri K.

Panja, Shri Ajit Pramanik, Shri Radhika Ranjan

Panwar, Shri Harpal Singh Prasad, Shri Hari Kewal

Paraste, Shri Oalpat Singh Prasad, Shri R.S.

Paswan, Shri Chhedi Puroh~, Shri Banwarilal

Paswan, Shri Ram Vilas Raghavji, Shri

Paswan, Shri Sukdeo Rahi, Shri Ramlal

Patel, Dr. A.K. Rai, Shri, M. Ramanna

Patel, Shri Chandresh Rajdev Singh, Shri

Patel, Shri Maganbhai Manibhai Raje, Shrimati Vasundhara

Patel, Shri Natubhai M. Raju, Shrl M.M. Pallam

Patel, Shn Prahlad Singh Rajveer Singh, Shri

Patel, Shri Ram Pujan Rakesh, Shri R. N.

Patel, Shri Shantilal Purushottam Das Ram Ohan, Shri

Patel, Shri Somabhai Ram Prakash, Ch.

Pathak, Shri Harin Ram Sagar, Shri (Bara Banki)

Patil, Shri Balasaheb Vikhe Ram Sagar, Shri (Saldpur)

Patil, Shri Basavaraj Ram Sajiwan, Shrl

Patil, Shri Uttamrao Ram Singh, Shri

Patil, Shri Uttamrao Lakmanrao Ramakrishna, Shri Y.

Patnaik, Shrl Sivaji Ramamurthy I Shr K.

Penchalliah, Shri P. Rameshwar Prasad, Shri

Peruman,. Dr. P. Vallal Rana, Shri Kashiram Chhabildas

Phundkar. Shri Bhaoosaheb Pundlik Rang&, Prof. H.G. 127 Const. (68th Amend.) MAY 30. 1990 Bill 128

Rao, Shri, J. Chokka Saini, Shri Gurdial Singh

Rao. Shri K. Rama Mohan Sa", Shri Ibrahim Sulalman

Aao, Shri K.S. Sanyal, Shri Manik

Rao, Shri R. Gundu Saran, Shri Daulat Ram

RIO, Shri Srinivas Saroj, Shri Sarju Prasad

Rasheed Masood. Shri Sartaj Singh, Shr.

Rathva, Shri Narayanbhai Jamlabhai Sarwar Hussain, Shri

Rathod. Shri Uttam Sathe, Shri Vasant

Rathor, Dr. Bhagwan Dass Save, Shri Moreshwar

Rawat, Shri Harish Scindia, Shrimati Vijayaraje

Rawat. Prof. Rasa Singh Sekhar, Shri M.G.

Ray. Dr. Sudhir Selvam, Shri Kanei Panneer

Raychaudhuri, Shri Sudarsan Selvarasu, Shri M.

Reddy, Shri 8. N. Shah, Shri Babubhai Meghji

Reddy, Shri Kotla Vijaya Bhaskara Shah, Shri Jayantilal Virchandbhai

Reddy, Shri M.G. Shakeelur Rehman, Dr.

Reddy, Shri P. Narsa Shakya, Dr. Mahadeepak Singh

Reddy, Shri R. Surender Shakya, Shri Ram Singh

Reddy, Shri Rajamohan Shankaranand, Shri B.

Routray, Shri Nilamani Sharma. Shri Chiranji Lal

Roy, Shri A.K. Sharma, Shri Dharm Pal

Roy. Shri Haradhan Shastri, Shri Anil

Roypradhan, Shri Amar Shekhada. Shri Govindbhai Kanjibhai

Sahay, Shri SutxJdh Kant Shingada, Shrl D.B.

Sai, Shri A. Larang Shiwankar, Prof. Mahadeo

Sai, Shri Nand Kumar Shukla, Shri Vidyacharan 129 Const. (68th Amend.) JVAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 130

Sindal, Shri S.B. Soren. Shri Shibu

Silvera, Dr. C. Soz, Prof. SaH-udoodln

Singh, Shri Ajay Subedar, Shri

Singh, Shri Dhanraj Sunanpurf, Shri K.D.

Singh, Shri Har Govind Suman, Shri Ramji Lal

Singh, Shri Hari Kishore Sumbrui. Shrl Bagun

Singh, Shri Jagannath Sundararaj, Shri N.

Singh, Shri K. Manvendra Tandel, Shri D.J.

Singh, Shri L.V. Tarif Singh, Shri

Singh, Shri Lokendra Tarwala, Shri Amratlal Vallabhdas

Singh. Shri Mandhata Taslimudin, Shri

Singh. Prof. N. Tomb; Thakore, Shri Gabbhaji Mangaji

Singh. Shri Radha Mohan Thambi, Durai, Dr.

Singh, Shri Ramashray Prasad Thomas, Prof. KV.

Singh. Shri Ramdas Tiwari, Shri Brij Bhushan

Singh, Shri Sukhendra Tiwari, Shri Janardan

Singh. Shri Surya Narayan Topdar, Shri Tarit Baran

Singh. Shri Tej Narayan Tyagi, Shri KC.

Singh, Shri Uday Pratap Urna Bharati, Kumar;

Singh, Shri Vishvendra Umbrey, Shri Laeta

Singh. Shri Vishwanath Pratap Unnikrishnan, Shri K.P.

Singh Oeo, Shri A. N. Vaghela, Shri Shankersinh

Sinha, Shnmati Usha Varma, Shri Dharmesh Prasad

Sodhi, Shri Mankuram Varma, Shri Ratilal Kalidas

Solanki, Shrl Surajbhanu Varma, Shri S.C.

Sonkar, Shri Kalpnath Vekaria, Shri S.N. 131 Const. (68th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 132

Verma, Shri Phool Chand Vadav, Shri Surya Narayan Verma. Shri R.L.P. Vadava, Shri Ramjilal Verma. Shri Sheo Sharan Vadvendra DaU, Shri Verma. Shri Upendra Nath Yazdani. Dr. Golam Verma, Shrimati Usha Yuvraj. Shri Vijayaraghavan, Shri A. Zainal Abedin. Shri Viswanatham, Dr. NOES Wadiyar, Shri Srikanta Datta Narasimha Raja -NIL- MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Subject to Yadav. Shri Chhotey Singh ·Correction, the resu~ of the DivisIon is:

Yadav, Shri Chun Chun Prasad Ayes 360

Yadav, Shri Devendra Prasad Noes Nil

Yadav, Shri Hukumdeo Narayan The motion is carried by a majority of the total membership of the House and by a majority Yadav, Shri Janardan of the not less than two-thirds of the members present and voting. Yadav, Shri Kailash Nath Singh The motion was adopted Yadav, Shri Mitra Sen

Yadav, Shri Ram Krishan MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: The House Vadav, Shri Ramendra Kumar Ravi shall now take up clause-by-clause consideration of the amending Bill. Yadav. Dr. S.P.

Yadav, Shri Sharad Clauae-2-Amendment of article 338

·The following members also recorded their votes for Ayes: Shri Yam una Prasad Shastri, Shri Yusuf Beg, Shri Pratap Singh. Shri Bhabani Shankar Hota, Shri Kalka Das, Shri Guman Mal Lodha, Shri Bh. Vijay Kumar Raju, Shri Dasai Chowdhary, Shri Manjay Lal, Shri Kapil Dev Shastri, Shri Ram Bahadur Singh, Shri Ramesh Bais, Shri Balwant Manvar, Shri Ram Naresh Singh, Shri Arjunbhai Patel, Shri Gopal Pacherwal, Smt. Jayawanti Navinchandra Mehta, Dr. Shailendranath Shrivastava, Shri Prem Pradeep, Shri Rameshwar Patidar, Shri Resham Lal Jangde, Kumari Mayawati, Shri C. Srinivasan, Shri Paul R. Mantosh, Baba Sucha Singh, Shri Sudam Dattatrya Deshmukh, Shri Manoranjan Sur, Smt. Bimal Kaur Khalsa, Shri Kankar Munjare, Dr. Chinta Mohan, Shri era Anbarasu. Shri Raja Ambanna Nayak Dore. Shri S. Benjamin, Shri Basavapunnaiah Singam, Shri Bolla Venkata Reddy and Shri A. Venkata Reddy. 133 Const. (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA g, 1912 (SAKA) Bill 134

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: There are after their being duly elected by Mem- certain amendments moved by a number of bers of lok Sabha" (3) members. I will call out their names and I would like to know whether they are moving SHRJ K.D. SULTANPURI (Shimla): their amendments or not. beg 10 move

Are you moving your amendments? Page 1, line 18,-

SHRI JOSS FERNANDEZ (Nominated after "Chairperson" insert- Anglo-Indian): No. "who shall be from Scheduled Castes MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Shri Paul R or Scheduled Tribes commun~ies" (12) Mantosh-Not present. Page 1, lines 18 and 19,- Shri Anadi Charan Das, are you moving your amendments Nos. 25 and 26? omit aVice-Chairperson (13)

SHRI ANADI CHARAN DAS (Jajpur): Page 1, line 20,- No. omit "Vice-Chairperson (14) MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Mr. Thomas are you moving your amendment No. 27? Page 1, line 23,-

PROF. K.V. THOMAS (Ernakulam): No. omit "Vice-Chairperson" (15)

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Shri Anadi Page 1, line 25,- Charan Das are you moving your amendments Nos. 28 and 29? add at the end,-

SHRI ANADI CHARAN DAS: No. "for a period five years" (16)

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Mr. Ram Page 2,- Dhan, there are amendments suggested by you-30, '31,32 and 33. Amendment nos. after line 11, insert- 30, 32 and 33 have been moved by other members also; so, they are identical amend- "(bb) to ensure that the quota reserved ments. So, you will have no opportunity to for Scheduled Castes and Scheduled move them. You can move only amendment Tribes in lower courts, public sector no. 31. This I am making clear to you. undertakings, State and Central Gov- ernment Offices is filled up;" (17) SHRI P. R. KUMARAMANGALAM (Salem): I beg to move Page 2,-

Page 1, line 19,- after line 19, insert-

for "three" substitute "en" (2) "(dd) to direct the State Governments Page 1, line 25,- to remove all impediments coming in the way of economic weWare of Sched- add at the end,- uled Castes and Scheduled Tribes and also to take action against those Stat.,s '1rom amongst Members of Lok Sabha for non compliance;" (18) 135 Const. (68th Amend.) MAY 30, 1990 Bill 136

SHRI RAM VILAS PASWAN: I beg to ments; move: (f) any other matter which the Presi" Page 1. line 19,- dent may, by rule, determine.

for 'hree" subst~ute '1ive" (20) "(9) The Union and every State Gov" ernment shall consult the Commission Page 2, line 9- on all major policy matters affecting Scheduled Castes and Scheduled for"examlne·subst~ute "inquire into" Tribes." (23) (21 ) Page 2, line 37,- Page 2,- for "(8) substttute" (10) (24) after line 11 insert- SHRI RAM DHAN (Lalganj): I beg to lI(bb} to participate and advise on the move: planning process of socio-economic development of the Scheduled Castes Page 1, line 19,- and Scheduled Tribes and to evaluate the progress of their development under for "three" substitute "six" (31 ) the Union and any State;" (22) SHRI P.R. KUMARAMANGALAM: This Page 2,- Bill basically does not bring about any change except replacing the Special Officer by a after line 36, insert- National Commission. We have always called ~ "Ram Ohan Bill" and we will continue to call "(8) The Commission shall, while in- ~ so. We have no objection to that. We are vestigating any matter referred to in happy to note that he has been given some sub-clause (a) or inquiring into any constitutional status. But we are sorry to find complaint referred to in sub-clause (b) thatthere are only three members other than of clause 5, have all the powers of a the Chairperson and the Vice-Chairperson. civil court trying a suit and in particular in respect of the following matters, Regarding the Commission, wefeel that namely: there should be more members. I am sure the Government also feels like that. The (a) summoning and enforcing atten .. Government ttseH has moved an amend- dance of any person from any part ment to increase the number. Instead of of India and examining him on three, they have suggested seven and we oath; have suggested ten. The workload is such that ten members are totally justified and (b) requiring the discovery and pro- required. duction of any document; This Bill does achieve no other objec M (c) receiving evidence on affidav"s; tive than ensure that instead of one officer, we have a team, a commission, a group, a (d) requisitioning any public record or comm~tee to look after this job. And why copy thereof from any court or have only three? Why have three or seven? office; Whythisarb~raryfjxationofthefigureshould be there? Why not have ten, whereby we can (e) issuing commissions for the ex- cover a larger number of inquiries and larger amination of Witnesses and docu- amount of business and work can be done? 137 Const. (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 138

The other issue is, in the same clause, Sir. when han. Shri Shankaranand was at line 25, nis said.- speaking I said that I was speaking on the Amendment and not giving a reply. Previ- ... that the President by warrant and ously he used to do this thing. So I request under his own seal will appoint.- him to sit down.

We feel that it would be more democratic if MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: You say the Members of the Commission. Chairman what you want. This prolongs the discus- and the Vice-Chairman are elected by the sion. Lok Sabha so that real democratic representation is given and it is not by sheer executive SHRI RAM DHAN: Sir. I want you to power that they manage to get their persons have our full co-operation. But instead of co- into the Commission which will have no operating they are just play-acting. representative character at all, unless of course if it is somebody we are all reasona- My amendment is important because bly fond of. that is Mr. Ram Ohan and his Bill. there must be full representation of Sched- I would like to press this amendment and uled Castes and Scheduled Tribes in this request the House to consider it in the light of Commission. Earlier too these has been a the fact that fundamentally we have no differ- demand from hon. Members belonging to ence of opinion on this Bill in principle. Scheduled Tribes for a separate Commis- sion. If the number of members in the Com- SHRI K.D. SUL TANPURI: I don't see mission is just five, then they will not be much of a difference between fhe law which sufficiently represented. Considering their is being framed and the Amendment intro- problems and their population they should duced by me. Additional facilities should be get equal representation on this Commis- provided to Scheduled Castes and Sched- sion. , have raised this point in the context of uled Tribes. The Commission should consist the point on Scheduled Tribes raised by han. of members who belong to Scheduled Castes Shri Mahale who is a Scheduled Tribe and Scheduled Tribes, because others member. You accepted all the three amend- cannot protect the interests of these sec- ments moved by me, so you should have no tions of our society. So I would suggest that objection in accepting this suggestion too. this amendment be accepted. I request the But even after accepting the suggestion here, han. Minister to appoint persons belonging ~ is not put into practice. That is why I feel to Scheduled Castes and Scheduled Tribes pained. Thus ~ is imperative that besides the as members of this Commission. Chairman. there should be six members in stead of three. A proviSion for Viee-Chair- [English] man for the Commission has been made in the Bill. But neither the U.P.S.C. nor any MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Mr. Ram other bodies has such provision. (/nt8ffup- Ohan may speak on his amendment. tions) You are free to express your views but I would also like to be heard by you. (Inter- SHRI B. SHANKARANAND (Chikkodi): ruptions) Thus I would like to submit that...... The hon. member who has given the amend- (/ntB"Uptions) ...... Yesterday, I submitted ment has spoken. The Minister has to re- that commission be given status of a depart- spond. He is not the Minister. ment of the Ministry of Welfare. Earlier. this commission was headed by a Joint Secre- MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: He is speak- tary. Congress Govemment made this ar- ing on his amendment. rangement. Vesterday, I clarified the point. Again I would like to submit that nothing ( Translation] should be done which may create obstacle in the smooth functioning of the Commission. SHRI RAM DHAN: Mr. Deputy-Speaker, No political intervention should be ther •. 139 Const. (68th Amend.) MAY 30, 1990 Bill 140

(Sh. Ram Ohan1 Hence the Government does not agree to this suggestion. This suggestion was made during the days of Shri Bhola Paswan Shastri. SHAI VASANT SATHE: Are the Lok Sabha Members not dedicated? [English] ( Interruptions) MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Please be brief. SHAI RAM VILAS PASWAN: Sathe Sahib, they can and intact, they have been [ Translation] dedicated. But we do not want to restrict the choice from the Members of the Lok Sabha SHRI RAM DHAN: Alright, let me speak. only. I think that there are a number of Yesterday, I submitted that flrst of all ~ was persons who are not the members of the Lok Shri Bhola Paswan Shastri who mooted the Sabha but still command respect and I do not idea of appointing a Chairman for the Com- think that we by virtue of our being the mission. The Government should accept Member of Parliament are the only dedi- this. The number of members should be cated persons in the society. In this country, increased from three to six, in addition to a a number of people, though they are nat the Chairman. I want that there should be no members either of the Lok Sabha or the Vice-Chairman. The Government should Rajya Sabha are dedicated to the social agree to it. work. They have inclination for h. Thus I do not consider it appropriate to impose such SHAt RAM VILAS PASWAN: Mr. condition. Deputy Speaker. Sir, in the amendment moved by Shri Kumaramangalam, it has Shri Sultanpuri and Shri Aam Dhan been suggested that the number of mem- have asserted that there should be na Vice- bers should be increased from three to ten. Chairman to the Commission. As you know, the number has already been increased to five. In a vast country like ours, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, actually with even H the number is increased to 100, it reference to their demand. I would like to would not be sufficient. Thus the most impor- submit that k is a Scheduled Castes and tant thing is that the Com~ission should be Scheduled Tribes Commission. Problems of a cohesive body so that it functions effec- Scheduled Castes and Scheduled Tribes tively. Therefore, I think that five members are different from each other. In no way we with a Chairman and a Vice-Chairman would want to give lesser importance to the prob- be suffice to accomplish the whole work. The lems of either of them. (Interruptions) That is number has already been increased from why I have submitted to evolve an arrange .. three to five. So there is no justnication of ment under which n in one term the Chair- increasing the number further. man is appointed from the people belonging to Scheduled Castes. the Vice Chairman will Secondly, he has opined that only the be from the people belonging to Scheduled members of the Lok Sabha should be ap- Tribes and in the second term the position pointed as the members of the Commission. will be vice .. versa. In this way there would be I don't see any rationale behind this sugges- no possibility of discrimination. I think that in tion. Members belonging to different parties this manner the Commission will function are sitting here. They may agree to kthatthe efficiently and no controversy will arise, rather Chairman and the members of the Commis- they would supplement each other. (lnt.,- sion should be appointed amongst the per- ruptions) Thus this amendment does notfind sons who are dedicated and willing to devote favour to me. full lime to the work of the Commission. So this suggestion does not stand to reason. Suttanpuri ji has given yet another 5Ug- 141 Const. (68th Amend.) JVAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 142 gestion that the tenure of the Chairman or in this regard will be taken into consideration. the Chairperson, as the case may be, should (/ntsnuptions) I accept all those amend- be of five years. The bill does not provide for ments which have been moved by me as a any time-limn. However, when rules will be Minister on behalf of the Government and framed under the Act, we will see as to urge the hon. Members to withdraw their whether the tenure should be of five years or amendments. (Interruptions) three years. We will fix the time-limit deems to be found fit. Thus there is no need of any [English] amendment on this score. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Now I will put I was very much astonished to hear Shri the amendments moved on behalf of the Shankaranadji who was reading out from the Government, to the vote of the House first. original Bill. If he goes through the amend- The question is: ments circulated along with the Bill, 'everything will be clear to him. "That amendments No. 20, 21 t 22, 23 and 24 moved by Shri Ram Vilas With reference to Amendment No. 18, Paswan, han. Minister ... which makes mention of State Government at one place, I would like to submit that the (Interruptions) amendment proposed by us covers his point also, SHRI P. CHIDAMBARAM (Sivaganga): Sir, we would liketo know whatthese amend- SHRI K.D. SUL TANPURI: How many ments are. These amendments are on the members should be there in it? same subject. One amendment says five, one amendment says ten. So, please ex- SHRI RAM VILAS PASWAN: Kindly go plain to us nthe Government amendment is through clause 5. Most of the Members put to vote and assuming it is carried, will opined that there is no difference between these amendments be put to vote thereafter. the old Commission and the new Commis- We want to know this. Please teU us the sion. In this regard, I would like to state that procedure. had it been the old one there would have been no need to bring this amending Bill MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Well, proba- before the House. bly you are trying to test me and not understand the procedure. The procedure is if the So far as vesting powers to the Com- amendments which are moved by the Gov- mission is concerned, it would be wrong to ernment are identical with the amendments say that the Commission has not been en- moved by other Members, those amend- dowed with adequate powers. We are ready ments a.re treated as having been adopted. to give more powers to the Commission, if it They are not put to the vote again. It is not is so required. There is provision in the Bill to necessary. But supposing the amendments this effect. Hthe President deems it fit, he will which are moved by the hon. Members are vest the Commission with more power. different from the amendments moved by the Minister, they are put to the vote. First, The Commission enjoys power to make the procedure is, we put to the vote the recommendations about or investigate into amendments moved by the Minister and the projects to be launched by the Central then we come to the amendments which are Government as well as State Governments. moved by other Members and put to the This Commission has been lashed with all vote, if they are not identical. these powers: h is not like any other ordinary committee or commission. " anybody has SHRI P. CHIDAMBARAM: Sir, you any doubt in this regard, he should tell us. we please tell us whether they are identicaJ or will clear the doubt. Any suggestions offered not. 143 Const. (68th Amend.) MAY 30, 1990 Bill 144

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: You please moved by the hon. Minister I asks for five do not ask for that detail. I am first putting instead of three, while my amendment-the those amendments to the vote of the House first one-asks fe .en instead of three. I which are moved by the Government. Those request that the Amendment No. 20 be put amendments which are not identical will be separately so that we can vote for it clearly. separately put to the vote of the House. You are very well-versed wtth the procedure. MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: Yes, we are doing that. I think the Members are very well- PROF. P.J. KURIEN (Mavelikara): Sir, versed with the procedure and everything. H please tell us also whether our amendments there is a slight difference between the are identical with the Government amend- amendments moved by the Government and ments or not. Otherwise, how do we know, the amendments moved by the Members how do we vote? For the purpose of voting they will be put separately to the vote of the we should know whether Government House. As far as the procedure is con- amendments and our amendments are iden- cerned, we have been in the House for pretty tical or not. Why don't you tell us? Otherwise. long time. We know the Constitution, we how do we vote? know the rules and we know the conventions also. Now, the consideration, clause by MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Well, Mr. clause by reading and passing are done as Kurien, let us not take the time of the House per the procedure by doing voting by divi- on small points. You are very knowledge- sion. Now, voting by division is not neces- able Member of the House and very studious sary in the case of Amendments. This is Members also. All amendments have been done by simply voice vote. This is a very circulated. Probably they have been received small matter and let us not take more trme.on by you and they have been studied by you. this. Now. I am putting the amendments So, it is not necessary for the Chair from here moved by the Government to the vote of the to explain to you what the amendments are. House, that is, Amendment Nos. 20, 21,22, 23 and 24 together. SHRI KAMAL CHAUDHRY (Hoshiar- pur): Sir, you please explain how the voting SHRI P.R. KUMARAMANGALAM: Sir, procedure would be ... (/nts"uptions) how can you put those amendments together? We want that the Amendment No. SHRI MADHAVRAO SCINDIA (Gwal- 20 should be put to the vote of the House ior): Sir, the amendments may be similar in separately. substance, but in detail there is a d~ference. The Government amendments ask for five MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: Mr. and the other han. Members who have moved Kumaramangalam, your amendments will their amendments. are asking for ten. So, be put to the vote of the House separately. they may be same in substance but in detail there is a difference. We would not like five, (Interruptions) we would like ten. So, they are not identical. PROF. P.J. KURIEN: Sir, you will ap- PROF. P.J. KURIEN: Sir, 'identical' is preciate our problems. Hyou put the amend- an elastic word. There is a numerical differ- ments to vote of the House together, what ence on the number in the Government will happen to our amendments? amendment and our amendment. They are asking for five whereas we are asking forten. MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: Your amend- nyou say they are identical, that would not ments will be put to vote of the House . •• rv. the purpose. ( Interruptions) SHRI P.R. KUMARAMANGAlAM: Sir, I am on procedure. The amendment No. 20 SHRI P.R. KUMARAMANGALAM: H 145 Const. (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) Bill 146 you put all the six amendments together, The question is: than I cannot distinguish my amendment. I would like to distinguish the amendment No. Page 1, line 19,- 20 which has to be put to vote separately. If you put them together, how can I distin- fo"hree· substitut9 "five" (20) guish? The Lok Sabha divided MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: Now, you have said that they shouJd be put separately AYES because they are different from your amendments. Your amendments are going to be Division. No. 7 put to the vote of the House and yet if you want each oftha amendments moved by the 15.43 hr •. Government to be put separately to the vote of the House, I can do that. Acharia, Shri Basudeb

SOME HaN. MEMBERS: Yes, Sir. Advani, Shri L.K.

MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: Iwilldothat. Ahar, Dr. Daulatrao Sonuji

(Interruptions) Ahmed, Shri Anwar

SHRI MADHAVRAO SCINDIA (Gwal- Ajit Singh, Shri ior): In principle they have also agreed. So, my suggestion is to have it a little mora Ali, Shrimati Subhashini broad-based, they can be put to the vote of the House separately. Amat, Shri D.

THE MINISTER OF FINANCE (PROF. Argal, Shri Chhaviram MADHU DANDAVATE): I think this difficulty will be solved ~ you put all the four Govern- Baig, Shri Arif ment amendments separately. I think that will satisfy the House. (Interruptions) Bais, Shri Ramesh

MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: Indeference Baitha, Shri Mahendra to the wishes expressed by the Members, I am putting the Government Amendments Bala, Dr. Asim separately to the vote of the House. I think there should be no d~ficuhy on this. Now, w_, Banera, Shrl Hamendra Singh value the substance and we do not value the procedure as much. The procedure has to Bankhele, Shri Kisanrao Baburao help the substance. Now, I will put Amend- ment No. 20 to the vote of the House. Barman, Shri Palas

SHRI VASANT SATHE (Wardha): Sir, Basu, Shri Anil we want division. Behera, Shri Bhajaman

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: The Lobbies Bengali Singh, Dr. are already cleared. Hyou agree, t will take the vote by division. Benjamin, Shri S.· ·Wrongly not. for Ayes. 147 Const. (68th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 148

Bhagey Gobardhan~ Shri Devi Lal, Shri

Bhargava, Shri Girdhari La! Dhakane, Shri Babanrao

Bhatia, Shri Ram Sewak Dhankh~r, Ch. Jagdeep

Bhattacharya, Srimati Malini Dhawan, Shri Harmahan

Birender Singh, Rao Dhumal, Prof. Prem Kumar

Bopche, Dr. Khushal Parasram Oikshit, Shri Narsinghrao

Bulara, Shimatr Rajinder Kaur Dome, Dr. Ram Chandra

Chakravorty, Shri Susanta Fernandes, Shri George

Chand Ram, Shri Fernandez, Shri Joss

Chandra Shekhar, Shri Gandhi, Shrimati Maneka

Chatterji, Shri Somnath Gangwar, Shri Santosh Kumar

J I Chaudhary, Shr; Ishwar Giri, Shri Sudhir

Chaudhary, Shri Audrasen Gujral, Shri I.K.

Chauhan. Shr; Prabhatsjnh Gupta, Shri Dharmpal Singh

Chavda, Shri Khemchanbhai Somabhai Gupta, Shri Indrajit

Chaudhary, Shri Lokanath Hannan Mollah, Shri

Choudhury, Shri Saifuddin Hansda, Shri Matilal

Chowdhary, Shri Oasai Harish Pal, Shri

Dandavate, Prof. Madhu Harsh Vardhan, Shri

Danwe, Shri Pundlik Han Heera Bhai, Shri

Das, Shri Anadi Charan Hat Ram, Shri

Das, Shri Bhakta Charan Hota, Shri Bhabani Shankar

Dasgupta, Dr. ~ipIab Inder J~, Shri

Datta, Shri Amal Jag Pal Singh, Shri*

Delkar, Shri Mohanbai Sanjibhai Jaswant Singh, Shri

Deshmukh, Shri Chandubhai Jatav, Shri Than Singh

·Wrongly note for Ayes. 149 Const. (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 150

,Iatiya, Shri Satynarayan Mahato. Shri Shailendra

Jana, Shri Srikanta Makkasar, Shri'Shopat Singh

Jha, Shri Bogendra Malhotra. Shri Vijay Kumar

Jorawar Ram, Shri Malik, Shri Purna Chandra

Ju, Oeo, Shri Oilip Singh Malik, Shri Satya Pal

Mallik, Shri Mangaraj

Kabde, Dr. Venkatesh Mandai, Shri Sanat Kumar

Kale. Shri Sukhdeo Nandaji Manvar, Shri Balvant

Kalka Das, Shri Masudal Hossain, Shri Syed

Kalvi. Shri Kalyan Singh Mayawati, Kumari

Kapse, Prof. Ram Ganesh Meena, Dr. Kirodi lal

Kataria, Shri Gulab Chand Meena, Shri Nandlal

Kauishik. Shri Purushottam Meghwal, Shri Kailash

Keshari lal, Shri Mehta, Shrimati Jayawanti Navinchan- dra Khan, Haji G.M. Mewar, Shri Mahendra Singh Khan, Shri Sukhendu Mirdha, Shri Nathu Ram Khandelwal, Shri Pyarelal Mishra. Shri Balgopal Kha1ioue. Shri Shanker lal Mishra, Shri Janeshwar Khurana, Shri Madan lal Mishra, Shri Raj Mangal Kirpal Singh, Shri Misra, Shri Satyagopal Kotadia, Shri Manubhai Mukherjee, Shrimati Geeta Kundu, Shri Samarendra Mukhopadhyay, Shri Ajoy Mahadik, Shri Vamanrao Mu~an Singh, Chaudhary Mahajan, Shrimati Sumitra Nalk. Shri Ram

Mahale, Shri Haribhau Shankar Nayak, Shri Nakul

Mahata, Shri Chitta Negi, Shri C.M. 151 Const, (68th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 152

Nitish Kumar, Shri Patnaik, Shri Sivaji

Pacherwal, Shri Gopal Phundkar, Shri Bhaoosaheb Pundlik

Pal, Shri M.S. Pramanik, Shri Aadhika Ranjan

Pal, Shri Rupchand Raghavji, Shri

Pande, Shri Rajmangal Rai, Shri, M, Aamanna

Pandey, Prof. Vadu Nath Rajdev Singh, Shri

Pandeya, Dr. Laxminarayan Aaje, Shrimati Vasundhara

Pani, Shri Ravi Narayan Raju, Shri Bh. Vijayakumar

Panwar, Shri Harpal Singh Rajveer Singh, Shri

Paranjpe, Shri Baburao Ram Awadh, Shri

Paraste, Shri Dalpat Singh Ram Ohan, Shri

Paswan, Shri Chhedi Ram Sagar, Shri (Bara Banki)

Paswan, Shri Ram Vilas Ram Sagar, Shri (Saidpur)

Paswan. Shri Sukdeo Ram Sajiwan, Shri

Patel, Dr. A.K. Rana, Shri Kashiram Chhabildas

Patel, Shri Chandresh Rasheed Masood, Shri

Patel, Shri Maganbhai Manibhai Rathva, Shri Narayanbhai Jamlabhai

Patel, Shri Natubhai M. Rathor, Dr. Bhaawan Dass

Patel, Shri Prahlad Singh Rawat, Prof. Rasa Singh

Patel, Shri Aam Pujan Ray, Dr. Sudhir

Patel, Shri Shantilal Purushottam Das Raychaudhuri, Shri Sudarsan

Patel, Shri Somabhai Routray. Shri Nilamani

Pathak, Shri Harin Roy. Shri A.K.

Patidar, Shri Rameshwar Roy. Shri Haradhan

PatU, Shri Basavaraj Roypradhan, Shrl Amar

Patll, Shrl Uttamrao Lakmanrao Sahay, Shri Subodh Kant 153 Const (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) 8ill 154

Sai, Shri A. Larang Singh, Shri K. Manvendra

Sai, Shri Nand Kumar Singh, Shri L.V.

Saini, Shri Gurdial Singh Singh, Shri Lokendra

Sanyal, Shri Manik Singh, Shri Mandhata

Saran, Shri Daulat Ram Singh, Shri Pratap

Saroj, Shri Sarju Prasad Singh, Shri Ram Bahadur

Sartaj Singh, Shri Singh, Shri Radha Mohan

Sarwar Hussain, Shri, Singh, Shri Ram Prasad Save, Shri Moreshwar Singh, Shri Ramashrary Prasad

Scindia, Shrimati Vijayaraje Singh, Shri Ramdas

Selvarasu, Shri M. Singh, Shri Sukhendra

Shah, Shri Babubhai Meghji Singh, Shri Surya Narayan

Shah, Shri Jayantilal Virchandbhai Singh, Shri Tej Narayan

Shakeelur Rehman. Dr. Singh, Shri Uday Pratap

Shakya, Dr. Mahadeepak Singh Singh. Shri Vishvendra

Shakya, Shri Ram Singh Singh, Shri Vishwanath Pratap

Shastri, Shri Anii Singh Deo, Shri A.N.

Shastri, Shri Kapil Dev Sonkar, Shri Kalpnath

Shastri, Shri Yamuna Prasad Soren, Shri Shibu

Shekhada, Shri Govindbhai Kanjibhai Subedar, Shri

Shiwankar, Prof. Mahadeo Suman, Shri Ramji lal

Shukla, Shri Vidyacharan Tandel, Shri D.J.

Singh, Shri Ajay Tarif Singh. Shri

Singh, Shri Dhanraj Tarwala, Shri Amratlal Vallabhdas

Singh. Shri Hari Kishore Taslimudin, Shri

Singh, Shri Jagannath Thakore. Shri Gabbhaji Mangaji 155 Const. (68th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 156

Tiwari. Shri Brij Shushan Yadava, Shri Ramjtlal

Tiwari, Shri Janardan Yadvendra, Datt, Shri

Tyagi, Shri K.C. Yuvraj, Shri

Uma Bharati, Kumari Zainal Abedin, Shri

Unnikrishnan, Shri K.P. NOES

Vaghela, Shri Shankersinh Agarwal, Shri J.P.

Varma, Shri Dharmesh Prasad Ahmed, Shri Kamaluddin

Varma, Shri Ratilal Kalidas Anbarasu, Shri Era

Vekaria, Shri S.N. Antulay, Shri A.R.

Verma, Shri Phool Chand Arunachalam, Shri M.

Verma, Shrj R.L.P. _ Asokaraj, Shri A.

Verma, Shri Shea Sharan Athithan, Shr; Dhanuskodi R.

Viswanatham, Dr. Baga Reddy, Shri M.

Yadav, Shri Chhotey Singh Balaraman, Shri L.

Yadav, Shri Chun Chun Prasad Banatwalla, Shri G.M.

Yadav. Shri Devendra Prasad Bansi Lal, Shri

Yadav, Shri Hukumdea Narayan Bhagat, Shri H.K.L.

Yadav, Shri Janardan Bhajan lal, Shri

Yadav, Shri Kailash Nath Singh Bhardwaj, Shri Parasram

Yadav, Shri Mitra Sen Bhosle, Shri Prataprao Baburao

Yadav, Shri Ram Krishan Brahm Dutt, Shri

Yadav, Shri Ramandra Kumar Ravi Charles, Shri A.

Yadav, Dr. S.P. Chaudhary, Shri Kamal

Vadav, Shri Satyapal Singh Chavan, Shrimati Premalabai

Yadav, Shri Sharad Chidambara~, Shri P.

Yadav, Shri Surya Narayan Chinta Mohan, Dr. 157 Const. (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 158

Dennis, Shri N. Narayanan. Shri P.G.

Deora, Shri Murli Odeyar. Shri Channaiah

Deshmukh, Shri Anantrao Oraon, Shrimati Sumati

Dev, Shri Sontosh Mohan Panja, Shri Ajit

Dinesh Singh, Shri Patil, Shri Balasaheb Vikhe

Gajapathi, Shri Gopi Nath Patil, Shri Uttamrao

Gamit, Shri Chh~ubhai Devjibhai Penchalliah, Shri P.

Gandhi, Shri Rajiv Peruman, Dr. P. Vallal

Gupta, Shri Janak Raj Potdukhe, Shri Shantaram

Handoo, Shri Piyare Lal Prabhu, Shri R.

Jaffer Sharief, Shri C.K. Pradhani, Shri K.

Jamod, Shri Shashibhal Prasad, Shri R.S.

Jayamohan, Shri A. Purohit, Shri Banwarilal

Jeevarathinam, Shri R. Rahi, Shri Ramal

Jhikram, Shri Mohanlal Raju, Shri M.M. Pallam

Kamble. Shri Arvind Tulshiram Rakesh, Shri R.N.

Khan, Shri Zulfiquar Ali Ram Prakash, Ch.

Krishna Kumar, Shri S. Ramamurthy, Shri K.

Kumaramangalam, Shri P.R. Ranga, Prof. N.G.

Mahabir Prasad, Shri Rao, Shri K.S.

Mahajan, Shri Y.S. Rao, Shri R. Gundu

Marbaniang, Shri Peter G. Rao, Shri Srinivas

Muraleedharan, Shri K. Rathod, Shri Uttam

Murthy, Shri M.V. Chandra Shekara Rawat, Shri Harish

Muthiah. Shri R. Reddy •.Shri B.N.

Narayanan, Shrl K.R. Reddy, Shri Bojja Venkata 159 Canst. (68th Amend.) MAY 30, 1990 Bill 160

Reddy, Shri Ketla Vijaya Bhaskara Singh, Prof. N. Tombi

R8d~y, Shri M.G. Sodhi, Shri Mankuram

Reddy, Shri N. Narsa Solanki, Shri Surajbhanu

Reddy, Shri R. Surender Srinivasan, Shri C.

.Reddy, Shri Rajamohan Subanpuri, Shri K.D.

Sa~, Shri Ibrahim Sulaiman Sumbrui. Shri Bagun

Sathe, Shri Vasant Sundararaj. Shri N.

Scindia, Shri Madhavrao Thambi Durai, Dr.

Selvam, Shri Kanci Panneer Thomas, Prof. K.V.

Shankaranand, Shri B. Umbrev. Shri Laeta

Sharma, Shri Chiranji Lal Wadiyar, Shri Srikanta Datta Narasimha Raja Sharma, Shrl Dharm Pal Yazdani, Dr. Golam Shingada, Shri D.B. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Subject to Stdnal, Shri S.B. *correction, the resu~ of the Division is:

SUvera, Dr. C. Ayes 255

Singam, Shri Basavapunnaiah Noes 101

*The following members also recorded their votes:

Ayes:

Shri Upendra Nath Verma, Smt. Usha Sinha, Shri Baga Ram, Shri Har Govind Singh, Shri Har Kawai Prasad, Shri Yusuf Beg, Shri Santosh Bhartiya, Shri Narainbhai Jamlabhai Rathwa, Shri Guman Mal Lodha, Shri Rajendra Agnihotri, Shir Ram Singh, shri Manjay Lal. Shri Kailash Nath Singh Yadav, Shri Ram Naresh Singh, Shri Arjunbhai Patel, Shri K. Ramamohan RBO, .hir Nirmal Kantl ~hatt8rjeat Dr. Shailendranath Shrivastava. Shrl Pram Pradeep, Shri R.sham Lal Jangda, Shri A. Vijayaraghavan, Shri Dau Dayal Joshi, Shri Tar~ Baran Topdar. Shrl Nani Bha1tacharya, Shri Chitta 8asu Shri Mohammad Shafi, Baba Sucha Singh, sHrl Sudam Dattatrya Deshmukh, Shri Manoranjan Sur, Smt. Simal Kaur Khalsa, Shru Kankar Munjare, Shri Jagdish Singh Kusjwaha and Shri Jai Prakash.

Noes:

Smt. Usha Verma, Shrl Jagpal singh, Prof. P.J. Kurien, Shri J. Chokka RAo, Shri V.lJaiash Nandi, Shri S. Benjamin, Shri A. Vankata Reddy and Shrl S. Gangadhar 161 Const. (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) Bill 162

SHRI P. CHIDAMBARAM: Sir, It is a THE ·MINISTER OF INFORMATION matter of shame that this Government can- AND BROADCASTING AND THE MINIS- not muster a simple major~y on its own even TEROFPARLIAMENTARYAFFAIRS (SHRt now. Every time when the Constitution P. UPENDRA): Sir, please announce the (Amendment) Bills come, ~ cannot muster a correct result of voting on Amendment No. simple majority. They have no moral author .. 20 to Clause 2 moved by Shri Ram Vilas ity to talk. (/nt9"Uptions) What are you Paswan. talking about? What right have you got to bring Constitution (Amendment) Bills? (/n- MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I will an- tsrruptions) nounce it. Don't worry.

PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: There (Interruptions) are many corrections that are coming. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Okay, I will PROF. P. J. KURIEN: Sir., they do not do that. have even a simple major~y. In the morning Shri Ram Vilas Paswan asked us to go out. (Inteffuptions) He said that they can pass the Bill without our support. Heshould apologise now. They are MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: In deference passing only it with our support. He should to the Parliamentary Affairs Minister's re- get up and apologise. (Interruptions) quest, I am announcing:

SHRI P. CHIDAMBARAM: They have Ayes *287 no moral right to bring any Constitution Amendment. The Minister must apologise. Noes *107 (Intsrruptions) The amendment No. 20 is adoptee SHRI P.R. KUMARAMANGALAM: You because nhas not to be adopted by simple should withdraw the remark made against majority. us earlier. (Interruptions) The motion was adopted PROF. P.J. KURIEN:Wewantthe Bill to be passed. That is why, we are supporting. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Now I am Now, it has been proved that without our putting amendment No. 21 moved by Shrl support, they cannot pass this Bill also. That Ram Vilas Paswan to the vote of the House. is the important point. This morning, the Hyou want to test your strength on the floor Mover of the Bill, hon. Minister Shri Ram of the House, you can do at the next time. Vilas Paswan said, you Congress people get out; we will pass it without the Congress The question is: people. (Interruptions) Now ~ is proved with our support only, the Bill is being passed. He Page 2, line 9,- should apologise. (Intsffuptions) We are cooperating. They want us to cooperate for"examine" substitut9"inquire into" further in regard to other Constttutional (21 ) Amendment Bill also. Let them apologise for what they have said. (Interruptions) The motion was adopted

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: You have made the point. It is not necessary to stretch I shall now put Government Amend- beyond that. ment No. 22 to the vote of the House.

*As corrected-Ayes 288 Noes 109. 163 Canst (68th Amend.) MAY 30. 1990 Bill 164

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: the question (f) any other matter which the Presi .. is: dent may. by rule. determine.

Page 2.- (g) The Union and every State Gov- ernment shall consuh the Com- .(terline 11. inset1- mission on all mRjor policy matter affeding Scheduled Castes and ·(bb) to participate and advise on the scheduled Tribes." (23) planning process of socia-economic development of the Scheduled Castes The motion was adopted and scheduled Tribes and to evaluate the progress of their development under Now I put Government amendment No. the Union and any State;· (22) 24 to the vote of the House.

The motion was adopted MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: The question is: MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Now I put amendment No.3 moved by the hon. Minis- Page 2, line 37,- ter to vote. for "(8) substitute "(1 0) (24) The question is: The motion was adopted Page 2.- MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: There are after line 36, insert- other amendments moved by the hon. Members. 1l(8) The Commission shall, while in- vestigating and any matter referred to Shri Kumaramangalam, are you within sub-clause (a) or inquiring into any drawing your amendments? complaint referred to in sub-clause (b) of clause, 5, have all the powers of a SHRI P.R. KUMARAMANGALAM: I do civil court trying a su~ and in particular not wish to press the amendments. in respect of the following matter namely:- MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Has Shri P.R. Kuumaramangalam leave of the House to (a) summoning and enforcing atten- whhdraw his amendments Nos 2 and 3? dance of any person from any part of India and examining him on SEVERAL HON. MEMBERS: Yes. oath; The Amendments Nos 2 and 3 were, by (b) requiring the discovery and pro- /gave, withdrawn duction of anv document; MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Shri K.D. (c) receiving evidence on affidavits; SultanP\Jri, are you withdrawing your amendments Nos. 12 to 181 (d) reqUisitioning any public record or copy thereof from any court or SHAI K.D. SULTANPURI: Yes. office;

(e) issuing commissions for the ex .. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Has Shri K.D. amination of witnesses and docu .. Sultanpuri leave of the House to withdraw ments; his amendments? 165 Const. (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) 817/ 166

SEVERALHON.MEMBERS:V•. amendments moved by me. I would 'ike to know his views on these amendments. The Amendments Nos 12 and 18 W9f9, by leave, withdrawn [English] .

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Shri Ram MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: He has al· Dhanji, you have moved amendment No.3. ready replied. He has replied to that already.

(Int8ffuptions) [ Translation]

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: In deference SHRI RAM DHAN: But he stated noth· to the Parliamentary Affairs Minister's re- ing about my amendments. (Interruptions) I quest, I am announcing: Ayes 287 and Noes. requestthethe hon. Minister to accepted my 107. amendments which are absolutely required.

( Interruptions) MR. DEPUlY SPEAKER: Are you ready to w~hdraw your amendments? MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I will not allow the Members to stand up in their seats [English] and ask other Members to leave ~. It is against the dignity of the House and I hope SHAI RAM DHAN: I am pressing my that you will see to it ...... amendment. (Interruptions)

(Interruptions) MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: You please take your seat. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: You peace sit down, not that way. The have made their (Interruptions) point, you have made your point. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER; Please take (Interruptions) your seats.

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Makkasarji, PROF. P.J. KURIEN: I am on a point of they have made their point, you have made order. Every Member in the House has a your point. It is against the ethics, against he right to act according to his conscience, and dign ity of the House for any Member to stand you are the protector of the rights of the up and say that other Members should leave. Members of this House. An han. Member And please, for God's sake, don't do that. Shri Ram Ohan had openly said "I am mov· Now, let the atmosphere which is created ing the amendment." It is seen that in this here continue. very House, he is pressurised and intimi- dated. Is it the way they are treating the ( Interruptions) Scheduled Castes? (Interruptions)

[English] I would request you to protect the rights of Members. (/nt8rruptions) MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Mr. Ram Dhanji, are you wnhdrawing you amend- SHRI CHANDRA SHEKHAR (8allia): ment? Mr. Deputy Speaker, SSir, I fully agree w~h the views placed by the hon. Members of the • [Trans/ation] other aide but I may say that as the hon. Membar has a right to move the amendment, SHRJ RAM DHAN: I would like the han. equally the other Members have the right to Minister to give a clarification in respect of persuade the Member to withdraw it. But I 167 Const. (68th Amend.) MAY 30, 1990 BiU 168

[Sh. Chandra Shekhar] ( Translat/on) agree with him that there should not be SHRI RAM DHAN:Today Shrl .•.•..•...... intimidation. The scene that has been cre- is being expelled from the party, "1lM4y both sides of the House, does not add to the dignity of the House. Better we [English] observe certain rules and maintain certain decorum in the House. I. as a Member of this MR. DEPUlY SPEAKER: It is not part Hous., ,equest Shrl Ram Ohan to withdraw of the record. the amendment and there should not be any pressure. (/ntsrruptions) [ Trans/at/on]

[ Translation] SHRI RAM DHAN: Let me conclude ...... (Inte"uptions) I w~hdraw my amendments. SHRI RAM D:~AN: Mr. Deputy Speake,. Sir, Shri Kurian has stated about me that I am SHRI HARISH RAWAT (Almora): Once under pressure. , have always acted on the an amendment is moved. ~ cannot be with- dictate of my conscience. drawn wtthout the leave of the House.

[English] [English]

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKEA: Please be MA. DEPUTY SPEAKER: That is right. relevant to the point I uphold your point of order. I would say that no Member should be subject to any [ Translation] presssure from any side. But the members in this House, each one of them, do have a right SHRI RAM OHAN: Mr. Deputy Speaker. to request to behave in a particular manner Sir, I would like to make this fact clear to the and this withdrawal can be done with the House that I am not a timid person. Nor have permission of the House. I ever shown timidness. The people of the country know that I have always acted on the ( Interruptions) dictate of my conscience. I would like to tell those who have level such charges against MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Mr. Vasant me that when I was the General Secretary of Sathe, generally we take the sense of the the Congress Parliamentary Party. Shrimati House and allow the wtthdrawal.lf you insist, Gandhi put me in Haryana jail during the we can take the vote of the House and we will emergency, Shri Bhajan Lal was the Chief allow the withdrawal. Minister at that time. Mr. Deputy Speaker. Sir, this is an aspersion on me and I cannot MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: The question tolerate such aspersion cast on me by Shri is: Kurien and the way these people have put it. is not good· ...... Attacked me in this House. "Has Shri Ram Dhan 'eave of the House to wtthdraw'his amendment No. 31- [Eng/ish]

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: The name Those in favour may say 'Aye' • ...... does not form part of the record. SEVERAL HON. MEMBERS: 'Aye'

-Not recorded. 169 Const. (68th Amend.) JVAISTHA 9, 1012 (SAKA) BiN 170

MR. OEPUTY SPEAKER: Those against Ba~ha. Shri Mahendra may say 'No'. Bala, Dr. Aslm SOME HON. MEMBERS: INo' Banera, Shri Hamendra Singh MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I think the 'Ayes' have ~, 'Ayes' have it. Barman, Shri Palas

SOME HON. MEMBERS: The 'Noes' 8asu, Shri Anil have ~. Basu Shri Chitta MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Let the Lob- bies be cleared. Beg Shri Yusuf

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Now the Bega Ram, Shri lobbies have been cleared- Bahera, Shri Bhajaman The question is: Bengali Singh, Dr. '-That leave be granted to Shri Ram Ohan to withdraw his Amendment No. 31" Bhagey Gobardhan, Shri

The Lok Sabha divided Bhargava, Shri Girdhari Lal AVES

Division No.8 Bhartiya, Shri Santosh

16.10 hrs. Bhartia, Shri Ram Sewak

Acharia, Shri Basudab Bhattacharya, Shrimati Malini

Advani, Shrj L.K. Bhattachary, Shri Nani .

Agnihotri, Shri Rajendra Simal Kaur, Shrimati

Aher, Dr. Daulatrao Sonuji Sirender Singh, Rao

Ahmed, Shri Anwar 8opche, Dr. Khushal Parasram

Ajit Singh, Shri Bulars, Shimati Rajinder Kaur

Ali, Shrimati Subhashini Chakravorty, Shri Susanta

Amat, Shri D. Chand Ram, Shri

Argal, Shri Chhaviram ·Chandra Shekhar, Shri

8aig, Shri Arif C,handrasekhar. Shrimati M.

Bais, Shri Ramesh ChlUerjee, Shri HimaJ Kanti

·Wrongly voted for Ayes. 171 Const.' (68th Amend.) MAY 30, 1990 Bill 172

Chatterji, Shri Somnath Gangwar, Shri Santosh Kumar

Chaudhary, Shri Ishwar Giri, Shri Sudhir

Chaudhary, Shri Rudrasen Gujral, Shri I.K.

Chauhan, Shri Prabhatsinh Gupta, Shri Dharmpal Singh

Chavda, Shri Khemchanbhai Somabhai Gupta, Shri Indraj~

Chaudhary, Shri Lokanath Hansda, Shri Matilal

Choudhury, Shri SaWuddin Harish Pal, Shri

Chowdhary, Shri Dasai Harsh Vardhan, Shri

Dandavate, Prof. Madhu Heera Bhai, Shri

Danwe, Shri Pundlik Hari Het Ram, Shri

Das, Shri Anadi Charan Hota, Shri Bhabani Shankar

Das, Shti Bhakta Charan Inder Jit, Shri

Dasgupta, Dr. Biplab Jai Parkash, Shri

Datta, Shri Amal Jagde, Shri Resham Lal

Delkar, Shri Mohanbai Sanjibhai Jaswant Singh, Shri

Deshmukh, Shri Chandubhai Jatav, Shri Than Singh

Deshmukh, Shri Sudam Dattatrya Jatiya, Shri Satynarayan

Dhakane, Shri Babanrao Jena, Shri Srikanta

Dhankhar, Ch. Jagdeep Jha, Shri Bogendra

Dhawan, Shri Harmohan Jorawar Ram, Shri

Dhumal, Prof. Pram Kumar Joshi, Shri Dau Dayal

Dikshn, Shri Narsinghrao Ju Deo, Shri Dilip Singh

Dome, Dr. Ram Chandra Kabde, Dr. Venkatesh

Fernandes, Shri George Kale, Shri Sukhdeo Nandaji

Fernandez, Shri Joss Kalka Das, Shri

Gandhi, Shrimati Maneka Kalvi, Shri Kalyan Singh 173 Const. (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9.1912 (SAKA) Bill 174

Kataria, Shri Gulab Chand Meena, Shri Nandlaf

Kaushik, Shri Purushottam Meghwal, Shri Kailash

Kashari Lal. Shri Mehta, Shrimati Jayawanti Navinchan- dra Khan, Haji G.M.

Khan, Shri Sukhendu Mewar, Shr; Mahendra Singh

Khandelwal. Shri Pyarelal Mirdha, Shri Nathu Ram

Khatique, Shri Shanker Lal Mishra, Shri 8algopal

Kh~rana, Shri Madan Lal Mishra, Shri Janeshwar

Kotadia, Shri Manubhai Misra, Shri Satyagopal

Kundu, Shri Samarendra Mohammad Shafi, Shri

Mahadik, Shri Vamanrao Multan Singh, Chaudhary

Mahajan, Shrimati Sumnra Munjare, Shri Kankar

Mahala, Shri Haribhau Shankar Naik, Shri Ram

Mar.ata, Shri Chitta Nathu Singh, Shri

Mahato, Shri Shailendra Negi, Shri C.M.

Malhotra, Shri Vijay Kumar Nitish Kumar, Shrl

Malik, Shri Purna Chandra Pacherwal, Shri Gopal

Malik, Shri Satya Pal Pal, Shri M.S.

Mallik, Shri Mangaraj Pal, Shri Rupchand

Mandai, Shri Sanat Kumar Panda, Shri Rajmangal

Manjay Lal, Shri Pandey, Prof. Yadu Nath

Mantosh, Shri Paul R. Pandeya, Dr. Laxminarayan

Manvar, Shri Balvant Pani, Shri Rav; Narayan

Panwar, Shri Harpal Singh Masudal Hossain. Shri Syed

Mayawati, Kumari Parast8, Shri Dalpal Singh

Meena. Dr. Kirodi Lal Paswan, Shri Chhedi 115 Const. (88th Amend.) MAY 30, 1990 Bill 176

Paswan, Shri Ram Vilas Ram Ohan, Shri

Paswan, Shri Sukdeo Ram Sagar, Shri (Bara Banki)

Patel, Dr. A.K. Ram Sagar, Shri (Said pur)

Patel, Shri Chandresh Ram Sajiwan, Shri

Patel, Shrl Maganbhai Manibhal Ram Singh, Shri

Patel, Shri Natubhai M. Rana, Shri Kashiram Chhabildas

Patel, Shri Prahlad Singh Rasheed Masood, Shri

Patel, Shri Ram Pujan Rathva, Shri Narayanbhai Jamlabhai

Patel, Shri Shantilal Purushottam Oas Rathor, Dr. Bhagwan Oass

Patel, Shri Somabhai Rawat, Prof. Rasa Singh

Pathak, Shri Harin Ray, Dr. Sudhir

Patidar I Shri Rameshwar Raychaudhuri, Shri Sudarsan

Patil, Shri Basavaraj Routray, Shri Nilamani

Patil, Shri Uttamrao Roy, Shri A.K.

Patnaik, Shri Sivaji Roy, Shri Haradhan

Phundkar, Shri Bhaoosaheb Pundlik Roypradhan, Shri Amar

Pramanik, Shri Radhika Ranjan Sahay, Shri Subodh Kant

Prasad, Shri Hari Kawai Sai, Shri A. Larang

Pram Pradeep, Shri Sai, Shri Nand Kumar

Raghavji, Shri Saini, Shri Gurdial Singh

Ral, Shri, M. Ramanna Sanyal, Shri Manik

Rajdev Singh, Shri Saran, Shri Daulat Ram

Raje, Shrimati Vasundhara Saroj, Shri Sarju Prasad

Raju, Shri Bh. Vijayakumar Sartaj Singh, Shri

Rajveer Singh, Shri Sarwar Hussain, Shri

Ram Awadh, Shri Save, Shri Moreshwar 177 Canst (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9. 1912 (&AKA) Bill 178

ScJndia, Shrimati Vijayaraje Singh. Shri Ramashray Prasad

Selvarasu, Shri M. Singh, Shri Ramdas

Shah, Shrl Babubhai Meghji Singh, Shri Sukhendra

Shah, Shri Jayantilal Virchandbhal Singh, Shri Surya Narayan

Shakeelur Rehman, Dr. Singh, Shri raj Narayan

Shakya, Dr. Mahadeepak Singh Singh, Shri Uday Pra1ap

Shakya, Shri Ram Singh Singh, Shri VlShvendra

Shastri, Shri Anil Singh, Shri Vishwanath Pratap

SMstri, Shri Kapil Dev Singh- Deo, Shri A.N.

Shastri, Shri Yamuna Prasad Sinha, Shrimati Usha

Shekhada, Shri Govlndbhai Kanjibhai Sonkar, Shri Kalpnath

Shiwankar, Prof. Mahadeo Soren. Shri Shibu

Shrivastava. Dr. Shailendranath Soz, Prof. Saif-ud~

Shukla, Shri Vidyacharan Subedar. Stvi

Singh, Shri Ajay Sucha Singh. Saba

Singh, Shri Dhanraj Suman. Shri Ramji Lal

Singh, Shri Har Govind Sur, Shri Monoranjan

Singh. Shri Hari Kishore Tandel, Shri O.J.

Singh, Shri L.V. Tartt Singh, Shri

Singh, Shri Lokendra TarwaJa. Shri Amratlal Vallabhdas

Singh, Shri Mandhata Taslimudin, Shri

Singh, Shri Pratap Thakorl, Shri Gabbhaji Mangaji

Singh. Shri Ram Bahadur Tiwari, Shri Brij Bhushan

Singh, Shri Radha Mohan TIWari, Shri Janardan

Singh, Shri Ram Naresh Tyagi. Shri K.C.

Singh, Shri Ram Prasad Urna Shard. Kumari 179 Const. (68th Amend.) MAY 30. 1990 Bill 180

Unnikrishnan, Shri K.P. Yuvraj, Shri

Vaghela. Shri Shankersinh Zainal Abedin, Shri

Varma, Shrl Dharmesh Prasad NOES

Varma. Shri Rattlal Kalidas Division No. 8

Varma, Shri S.C. Agarwarl, Shri J.P.

Vekarla, Shri S.N. Ahmed, Shri Kamaluddin

Verma. Shri Phool Chand Anbarasu, Shri Era

Verma, Shri R.L.P. Antulay, Shri A.R.

Verma, Shri Sheo Sharan Arunachalam, Shri M.

Verma, Shri Upendra Nath Asokaraj, Sh ri A.

Vijayaraghavan, Shri A. Athithan, Shri Dhanuskodi R.

Yadav, Shri Chhotey Singh Baga Reddy, Shri M.

Yadav, Shri Chun Chun Prasad Balaraman, Shri L.

Yadav. Shri Devendra Prasad Sanatwalla, Shri G.M.

Yadav, Shri Hukumdeo Narayan Bansi Lal, Shri

Yadav, Shri Janardan Benjamin, Shri S.

Yadav, Shri Kailash Nath Singh Bhagat, Shri H.K.L.

Yadav, Shri Mitra Sen Shajan Lal, Shrl

Yadav, Shri Ram Krishan Bhardwaj, Shri Paras ram

Yadav. Shri Ramendra Kumar Rav; Bhosla, Shri Pra1aprao Baburao

Yadav. Or. S.P. Charles, Shri A.

Yadav, Shri Satyapal Singh Chaudhary, Shri Kamal

Yadav, Shri Sharad Chavan, Shrima1i Premalabai

Yadav, Shri Surya Narayan Chidambaram, Shri P.

Yadava, Shri Ramiilal Chinta Mohan. Dr.

Yadwndra, Datt, Shri Dennis, Shri N. 181 Const. (68th Amend.) JVAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 182

Deara, Shri Murli Mallikarjun, Shri

Deshmukh, Shri Anantrao Marbaniang, Shri Peter G.

Dev, Shri Sontosh Mohan Murthy, Shri M.V. Chandra Shakara

Dinesh Singh, Shri Muthiah, Shri R.

Gaikwad, Shri Udaysingrao Nanasaheb Narayanan, Shri K.R.

Gajapathi, Shri Gopi Nath Narayanan, Shri P.G.

Gamit, Shri Chh~ubhai Devjibhai ·Netam, Shri Arvind

Gandhi, Shri Rajiv Odeyar, Shri Channaiah

Gangadhar, Shri S. Oraon, Shrimati Sumati

Gounder,• Shri A.S. Panja, Shri Ajit

Gupta. Shri Janak Raj Patil, Shri Balasaheb Vikhe

Handoo, Shri Piyare Lal Patil, Shri Uttamrao

Jaffer Sharief, Shri C.K. Peruman, Dr. P. Valla'

Jag Pal Singh, Shri Potdukhe, Shri Shantaram

Jamod, Shri Shashibhai Prabhu. Shri R.

Jayamohan, Shri A. Pradhani, Shri K.

Jeevarathinam, Shri R. Prasad, Shri R.S.

Jhikram, Shri Mohanlal Purohit, Shri Banwarilal

Kamble, Shri Arvind Tulshiram Rahi. Shri RamlaJ

Kaul, Shrimati Sheila Raju, Shri M.M. Pallam

Khan. Shri Zuffiquar Ali Rakesh, Shri R.N.

Krishna Kumar, Shri S. Ram Babu, Shri A.G.S. 0( Kumaramanga]am, Shri P.R. Ram Prakash, Ch.

Kurian, Prof. P.J. Ramamurthy, Shri K.

Mahabir Prasad, Shri Rang, Prof. N.G.

Mahajan, Shri Y.S. RIO, Shri J. Chokka 183 Canst (68th Amend.) MAVlO,1990 Bill 184

Rae. Shri K.S. Singh. Prof. N. Tombi

Rao, Shri R. Gundu Sodhi, Shri Mankuram

Rao, Shri Srinivas Solanki, Shri Surajbhanu

Rathod, Shrl Uttam Srinivasan, Shri C.

Rawat, Shri Harish Sultanpuri, Shri K.D.

Reddy, Shri A. Venkata Sumbrui, Shri 8agun

Reddy, Shri B.N. Sundararaj, Shri N.

Reddy, Shri Bojja Venkata Thambi Durai, Dr.

Reddy, Shri Kotla Vijaya Bhaskara Thomas, Prof. K.V.

Reddy, Shri M.G. Thungon, Shri P.K.

Reddy, Shri P. Narsa Umbrey f Shri Laeta

Reddy, Shri R. Surender Verma, Shrimat Usha

Reddy, Shri Rajamohan Vishwanathan, Dr.

Sa~, Shri Ibrahim Sulaiman Wadiyar, Shri Srikanta Datta Narasimha Raja Sathe, Shri Vasant Yazdani, Dr. Golam Scindia, Shri Madhavrao ( Interruptions) Sekhar, Shri M.G. SHRI P. CHIDAMBARAM: The figures Selvam, Shri Kana Panneer are bogus. (/ntBrruptions)

Shankaranand, Shri B. PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: The correction sUps are coming. Please wait and Shanmugam, Shri P. check it up. (/ntenvptiom) Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sit, every time there have been Sharma, Shri Chiranji Lal gaps between the original figure and the figure, after the correction were made. (inter- Sharma. Shri Dharm Pal ruptions) Sir, I would like to submit that even a former Prime Minister had made an incor- Shingada, Shri O.B. rect recording of the voting and it was corrected later on. (Interruptions) Sidnal, Shri S.B. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon. Mem- bers may please take their seats. Silvera, Dr. C. (lnt.nupt/ons)

Singam. Shri Basavapunnaiah MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Before I 185 Const. (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9.1912 (SAKA) Bill 186 announce the results of this voting, I will read there are 116 Members in the House who do out, for the benefh 01 the Members, the not want that the leave should be given. So, particular provision of the pertinent rule. It I have no option, but to put the question to the says: House and it may be negatived. That was probably the stand taken by the han. Leader itA Member who has made a motion of the Opposition also, at the beginning. may withdraw the same by leave of the Now, we have gone through two stages, one House. by trying to collect the sense of the House and the other by dividing the House and The leave shall be signified :1ot upon collecting that. But, it is very clear that there question but by the Speaker taking the is a dissenting voice. So, I have to put the pleasure of the House. The Speaker question to the vote of the House. shall ask: 'is it your pleasure that the motion be withdrawn?'. If no one dis- SHRt SOMNATH CHATTERJEE sents, the Speaker shall say: 'The (80Ipur): Which question to vote, Sir? motion is by leave withdrawn'. But if any dissentient voice be heard or a MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Amendment. Member rises to continue the debate, the Speaker shall forthwith put the ( Inte"uptions) motion." SHRI SOMNATH CHATTERJEE: How can it be? (Interruptions) You said. "If the Now, the difficulty has arisen because sense cannot be ascertained, Hthere is any the hon. Members, at the first instance said dissent, then the question will be put." (Inter- that he is moving. Then, at the request of one ruptions) Which question?,Whether there is of the hon. Members in the House, he said leave or not? (Interruptions) that he is withdraWIng. The question was, whether he should be allowed to withdraw. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Mr. Chatter- Now, the most important point involved here, jee, as a good lawyer, you will appreciate: is, if there is no dissenting voice, he is allowed to withdraw his motion. If there is a "If any dissentient voice be heard or a dissenting voice, the amendment has to be Member rises to continue the debate. put to the vote of the House. Now, here, we the Speaker shall forthwith put the have the voice vote as well as we have taken motion." the vote by dividing the House also. Now, I have the result with me, that those who want Now b is very clear. The Members said that the leave should be granted are 271 and that they did not want that this should be those who do not want that the leave should allowed to be withdrawn. Not only that, but be granted are 116 subject to .* correction. they voted also for not allowing the Member There may be changes. This means that to withdraw it.

··The following Members also recorded their votes: Ayes: Shri Manvendra Singh, Shri Raj Mangal Mishra, Shri Nukul Nayak, Shri Guman Mal Lodha, Shri Kirpaf Singh, Shri Jagannath Singh, Shri Arjunbhal Pate'. Shrf Kishan Rae Baburaa Bankhaie, Shrl K. Ramamohan Rao. Prof. Ram Ganesh Kapsa, Shri Hannan Mollah, Shri Karia Munda. Shri Shopat Singh Makkuar, Shri Ajoy MUkhopadhyay. Shri Tarip 8m'an Topdar. Shri Jagdish Singh Kushwaha. Shri Baburao parajpe. Noes: Shri B. Bajaravi Varma. Shrimati M. Chandrashekhar. Shri V.naiah Nandi. 187 Const. (68th AmtncL) MAY 30,1990 Bill 188

(Int."".,uons) doubly sure that there are no objections to thil, as a measure of precaution, I am putting SHRI SOMNAlli CHATIERJEE: Then. h to the vote of the House. There should not what was the object of thts division? This is be any difficulty for the Members belonging what is provided: That the question will be to the Government and the parties helping put to vote. the Government to vote it out if they want.

-whether leave is being granted or not-- SHRI SOMNATH CHATTEPJEE: This that is being put to vote. (Interruptions) will be a dangerous precedent. This will Otherwise, ~ is meaningless. (/nt~"uptions) create a precedent which is not contem- The question was whether there was major- plated by the Rules of Procedure. (/nte"up- ity in favour of granting leave or not. That has tions) Sir, you are creating a precedent. been ascertained by the vote. What is all this? (Interruptions) It cannot be. (Interruptions) MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Butthere was dissenUent voice. (Interruptions) MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Now, let us hear Mr. Advani. SHRI SOMNATH CHATTERJEE: In that case even Hone Member said Ino', that was SHRI L.K. ADVANI (New Delhi): Mr. sufficient. Then, what was the division for? Deputy Speaker, Sir, there is perhaps the (/nte"uptions) By the division, you have precise phraseology of this Rule 339. It is ascertained that a majority of the Members somewhat unhappy, and therefore, this kind are in favour of granting leave for withdrawal. of interpretation which can be put by some You have put the question to vote. (Interrup- one. But then, this House should not have at tions) And n has been ascertained now. all been subjected to this kind of divsion. Otherwise, ~ will be meaningless. After all, when we divided, it was a division on whether leave should be granted to Mr. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: You know, I Ram Dhan to withdraw his amendment or should have put this motion to the vote of the not. And the House having. by majority. House at the first instance itself. First, he granted leave, how can it be denied? Other- wanted to move tt. He did not want to with wise this should not have been put to vote draw It at the first instance. Then, he said. he and the Chair could have taken the view on wanted to withdraw it. You appreciate the the basis of this Rule that even if one person difficu~y which is created. says I no', he should not be permitted and immediately it should be put to vote-that (Interruptions) amendment itseff.

SHRI SOMNATH CHATIERJEE: Having divided the House, I think that Therefore, that difficulty is resolved by ob· the Chair would be acting against the deci- taining the sense of the House by the division of the House. And it would be forcing a sion. (Interruptions) Member to vote against his own amendment Therefore, there should have been no MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: You can vote division at all. On th. basis of the interpreta- against the motion as well. tion that the Chair is presently putting under Rule 339, you could have said, II' have no (Interruptions) option but to put the original amendment to vote.· MR. OEPUTY SPEAKER: Please take your.eat. Therefore, I would plead with you that haYing tak.. the vote of the House, not the (IntMnf)tiDns) general ..,. but the opinion ~ the House and the Houae is altha opinion that Mr. Ram MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Now. to be Chan ,houId be permitted to withdraw his 189 Const. (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9.1912 (SAKA) SRI 190 amendment, I think, in fairness to the wishes ment) Bm as well. The Constitution (Amend- of the House, he should be permitted to ment) Bill, within the meaning and scope of withdraw his amendment. a BiD as per the Rules of Procedure, II a Bill originating in this House. Therefore, Rule 87 SHRI SAIFUDDIN CHOUDHURY -alone is applicable here and no other rule (Katwa): Sir, the word 'dissenting voice' relating to motions, resolutions and other means there-is some difference of opinion. business of the House. J can challenge you on this point and I can provide the prece- There is no question of ascertaining it dents. I do not mean any offence. I can again by dividing the House. There were provide precedents if you will give me time. sufficient number of dissenting voices. To But only Rule 87 applies here. (Int9rrup- find out whether there is majori1y or not for tions) allowing him to withdraw his amendment. we have to divide the House and not to ascertain SHRI VASANT SATHE: Rule 87 is not whether there is any dissenting voice or not. relevant here. (/nt.nuptions) This is the difference. We did not divide the House in order to ascertain whether there is PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: Mr. any dissenting voice or not. The dissenting Sathe, will you please listen to our argu- voices were sufficiently clear. But we divided ments? ... (Interruptions) . .. Mr. Kamal the House in order to allow him to w~hdraw Chaudhry, please listen to me. Mr. Deputy hIS amendment by major~y vote. Speaker. there have been many number of precedents in this House. I may point out that MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: If one firstly. as far as possible, we request the Member says that he should not be allowed Member to withdraw his amendment. I want to withdraw, then will he not be allowed to to bring to your notic&-Since you were also withdraw? a Member of the last lok Sabha, you might recall a numberof occasions-that Mr. Dags. SHRI SAIFUDDtN CHOUDHURY: a Member of the then ruling party used to Then. you have to put it to the vote of the submn a number of amendments on various House. You have to divide the House to Bills and Resolutions ...... (Int9ffuptions) .. . allow him to wHhdraw his amendment. (Inter- He did not withdraw always. Whenever he ruptions) said in the beginning that he does not want to w~hdraw, a number of times, the Mem- THE MINISTER OF SURFACE TRANS- bers rushed to him and requested him to PORT (SHAI K.P. UNNIKRISHNAN): Sir, I withdraw his amendments. (/nt8"uptions) am speaking as a Member of this House after a fong time. I am sorry to say that what SEVERAL HON. MEMBERS: No, no. you have said just ow does not fit good at all. What applies now, in this context, is Rule 87. (Intenvptions) It deal specnically with amendments to all legislations and all Bills originating in this PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: I have House. No other Rulefits here. Rule 87 says: seen that. Let the Deputy Speaker say so. Not only that. On the contrary, the Members IIAn amendment moved may, by leave of the ruling party and the Treasuty Benches of the House but not otherwise be used to do what Chandra Shakha~i got up wkhdrawn on the request of the Mem- and did today. They used to request him to ber moving it." kindly withdraw his amendments. And W8 never objected. W. used to say that after ai" When it is provided specifically in this Rule, the Members of the ruling party. as Chandra you cannot go to other residuary ClaUMI ShIkharji 11M done, have the right. and take shelter under them. What appIiII for a BiD applies for a Conatitution (Amend .. Second,. as ,. • Imendmenta .,. 191 Const (68th Amend.) MAV30,1990 Bill 192

(Prof. Madhu Dandavate] to the exercise of dividing the House, I think that particular procedure is irrelevant. there- concerned, on a number of occasions, the fore, I would suggest that you invoke only point ~ich Shri Unntkriahnan has raised Rule 87, so that the entire matter need not be was made in this very House, that as far as reopened. Rule 339 is concerned, it is applic.able to the general motion. MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: Please explain to me that Wone Member says that no MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: It is a mo- leave should be given, is tt not sufficient? tion. Supposing there are 116 Members saying that no leave should be granted, what should PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: Just as be done? I do not interrupt you, I would also request you to kindly allow me to have my say. PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: As I Similarly, it was pointed out that as far as said, that particular exercise is irrelevant amendments are concerned. they are not altogether. One can express one's dissent, guided by Rule 339, but they are solely but there is no question of going through all guided by Rule 87. that. Having gone through this exercise, in effect you have also sought their opinion MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: I am not about the amendment, and therefore, again interrupting you; I am trying to understand. Is putting ~ to vote is completely irrelevant. it a motion or not? MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: One thing is SHRI K.P. UNNIKRISHNAN: H is a that one Member by voice vote says that he motion in pursuance of the Bill to amend the is not in favour of allowing n. Now, 116 Constitution. Members say that they are not in favour of allowing it. In that case what should be PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: There done? is a distinction between whatever is rslated to Bill and the general motion, otherwise SHRI SOMNATH CHATIERJEE: Rule 87 would not have been framed by the Under Rule 87, you should take the sense of framers of the rules. Rule 339 would also the House. have applied there. , will give a further iIIus- . tration. Take for instance the adjournment MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: ls" a motion motion. It is a definite motion. Whenever any or not? Member of the Opposition gets up and says: I want to move an adjOurnment motion; I i am reading hto you from the Directions seek the consent. Though the ruling party by the Speaker. On page 25-it says: never want to support the adjournment motion, yet they keep quiet. In that case, the "Amendments-They are subsidiary Speaker takes it for granted that there is no motions which interpose ...... " objection, and, therefore, the procedure of going through allowing 50 Members to get The gineral provisions relating to the mo- up does not come. Therefore, there are tions are given in Chapter 14 of the Rules of different types of motions and different rules. Procedure. My contention is that even Wone person from the opposition party was to get up and say that he objects, the sense is very clear. One PROF. MADHU DANDAVATE: Shri Sathe is sufficient from the opposition. Speaker's directions are always supposed When he says he is opposing, the sense is to be consistent wbh the rul.,s, and It is the very clear that there is dissent, but in spite of rules which will be supreme in case there are that when you asked the entire House to go any conflicting views ..•... (Interruptions) 193 Const. (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) 8i/1 194

SHAt CHANDRA SHEKHAR: May I get SHAI NIRMAL KANTI CHATTERJEE a clarWication whether the House has got the (Dumdum): Sir, let me read Rule 339 and try authority to amend the rules or not? If the to persuade you. Rule 339 says: House has got the authority to amend the rules and the House in ns wisdom has given Ills it your pleasure that the motion be the leave to withdraw the amendment, in withdrawnr-This motion refers to the effect, the rule, if it applies, has been amenam.nt. I no one dissents, the Speaker amended. If your version is taken, what will shall say: 'The motion is by leave wnhdrawn.' happen to the voting that has taken place in But If any dissentient voice be heard or a the House? What will happen to the opinion member rises to oontinue the debate, the of 271 Members who have expressed them- Speaker shall forthwith put the motion. selves on this particular question. Can you delete the whole proceedings from the Now, what is the motion? Motion is: Is it Record of the House? let me know this. You your pleasure that the motIOn be withdrawn?' are also a Parllamentanan. This cannot be a The motion here refers to this particular non·event in the whole thing. Whatever Mr. statement. Therefore, Sir, this makes it Unnikrishnan has said With regard to Rules unambiguously clear that this can be put to 87, His a clear comment about the amend· the vote of the House and the leave can be ment of the Bill. So, It should be applied. granted by a vote. I think Shri Vasant Sathe Suppose the House today decides that this will agree that motion here refers to tne leave rule should be amended here and now and being granted to withdraw. We read it spe· the majonty amends the rule here, what will cifically after you made us to think about it. I you do and what will be the position of the request you to read it also and help the ruling of the Deputy Speaker? Deputy Speaker to rethink about it.

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Iwilldispose SHRI K.P. UNNIKAISHNAN: Sir, I of the poInt made by him and then I will allow presume that we are now discussing Item you to speak. no. 10 on the list of Business and that is that the Bill further to amend the Constitution of (/nte"uptions) India be taken into consideration. So, let us be clear on what we are discussing. And. as MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: let me deal per Article 368 (1) and (2) of the Consthution, w~h the point which is made by the han. which provides the modality. the modality is Member. only through the Bill initiated here. You please or refer to Chapter 10 of the Rules of Proce- Please Mr. Kurian. dure. Legislation, Bills originating in the House and Rule 87 refers to amendments on such PROF. P.J. KURIEN: Sir. we are dis- Bills which includes Bills to amend the Con· cussing about Mr. Ram Dhan. Where is he? stitution of India. So, there is no question. It seems that he has been chalked out. It Motion is only in pursuance. lat us not seems that he has been asked to withdraw confuse with it. It has nothing to do with this. from the House. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Enlighten MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: That is a side me on one point. Is not an amendment a issue. motion?

SHRI K.P. UNNtKRISHNAN: Motion is: ( Interruptions) Billa be pasud Of biUs betaken inta c0nsid- eration, amendment be pasMd or amend- MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: L. m. dis ...... be taken no conaicMraIton or the pose of the point whCtl has been f1IiIed ." ...... 10 ...... ,.... the bon. Member. • what a maIian is and _the BIOI ••• 1as Const (68th Amend.) MAY30.19go 861 196

[Sh. K.P. Unn~nar,) I am inclined to agree he,.: In Rule 339 I is sard: -The Speaker shall forthwith put the u • whole. Thwefore, Rule 87 alone is motion.· Here the Motion is, whether leave appIcIbIe In this case and no other Rule. be granted to Shri Ram Dhan, to withdraw or You know. 81 a Jurist, when there is a not. That is his Motion. That Motion has baen specific Rule Provided for, other subsidiary put and decided upon. (/nt.mJ(Jtions) Rules will not apply. SHRISOMNATHCHATTERJEE: There SHRI LK. ADVANI: Mr. Deputy are two provisions in our Rules regarding Speaker, Sir, my friend Mr. Unnikrishnan withdrawal. Firstly, Rule 87 which Mr. Un- h.. drawn attention to the Rule referring to nikrishnan I subm~ has rightly and appropri- withdrawal of Amendments whereas, you ately referred to. This Rule 87, specifically relied upon in your judgement on a Ruie deals w~h the withdrawal of Amendments to referring to withdrawal of Motions. To my Bills. It is there in Chapter 10 which is related mind I do not draw dlstinc1ions between the to Legislation. The other Rule which you two aven though, Rule 339 is more elabo- have been good enough to mention and rate, whereas the Rule relating to withdrawal referto is Rule 339. Nqw. you kindly see this. of Amendments is not elaborate. But, if the This is in Chapter 27 which deals with the interpretation that has been given just now or general Rules of Procedure. You are aware suggested just now by the Chair is to be of the very well-established proposnion in 8CQ8pted as a precedent, the consequence law Generalis Spgcialibus non derogant. It would be that every Member of this House means that if there is a particular special would have a veto in respect of any Motion or provision, that will not be affected by the any Amendment that has once been moved. general provis!on. What is the general provi- If It is once moved, thereafter that particular sion relating to a Motion? This is a particular Minister or Member would have no right to specific provision relating to Amendments to wfthdraw It IY,n ~ a siugle Member says Bills. Otherwise, Rule 87 becomes otiose, 'No'. I do not concede to the Member any totally inapplicable. in any case, it can apply. right. any veto on the whole House. If by This is not the way. No interpretation should majority. the House decides that this particu- be made to make a particular provision of the lar Motion or this particular Amendment rules unnecessary or otiose. should be withdrawn or may be w~hdrawn by the Member I then I do not think any interpre- MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: You tell me tation of the Ru~e which confers upon every one thing Mr. Chatterjee. Have we not been single Membar. a veto to prevent that Minis- foUowingtheprocedureoffindingoutwhether 1er or Member to withdraw His necessary. the withdrawal should be allowed or not?

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Just I min- SHRI SOMNATH CHA TIERJEE: That ute. We have been following thlsama pr0- II there under Rule 87. cedure, 8XactJy the same pf'OC8dura ••• single Member says 'No', then ~ is put to the MR. DEPUlY SPEAKER: Even if one vote of the House. Member says 'No' have we not been disal- lowing him? What is the pf'OC8dure? SHRIl.K. ADVANI: If a single Member I.YS 'No', then he has a right to say lall right. SHRI SOMNATH CHATIERJEE: In divide the Houat' but not further. He can my humble 20 y..,.. experience I do not divide the Houle just u he says and the remember an occasion when a question of Houle II cIwIded. But, today if this interpre· withd_ grM of leaVl haa been put to • tatiDn iI put. thin. means that the wilhea of DMaion ...... _ be undone by a IingIt ...... ,.. would be a wrong precedent MFl DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thlt II not .....RuII. the poIIC. 117 Canst (68th Amend) JYAISTHA 9. 1912 (SAKA) BII 198

SHRI SOMNA TH CHATTERJEE: This SHR1 DINESH SINGH (Pratapgarh): is the point. I am making that point. You There is a consensus in the House to try to kindly see Rule 87. You have to give an pass th_ two Constitution (Amendment) interpretation to Rule 87. Bills. There are many views now being expressed on the question of amendment, and MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: After hear- ~s wbhdrawal, which is not really terribly ing you, I will give the decision. material to the passing of the BUI, because there is a majority to pass the Bill. Thera are SHRI SOMNATH CHATIERJEE: You mary learned lawyers, hon. Members of this have to give a meaning to Rule 67. You House, who will have different views. My kindly read Rule 87. You kindly see page 43 request would be that instead of going into of the Rules. this, YOL. take the sense of the House, and if everybody is agreeable, let us proceed w"h k says: the main Bill and pass that, instead of getting entangled into all these arguments ... (Inter- "An amendment moved may, by leave ruptions) of the House, but not otherwise, be w~hdrawn, on the request of the MR. DEPUTY SP~KEA: This is a vety Member moving it." pragmatic suggestion.

Hthere is an amendment to an amendment, SHRI G.M. BANATWALLA (Ponnani): that is different. But an amendment, assum- Rule 87 and rule 339 are all complementary; ing that this is a motion, is governed by rule there is no contradiction whatsoever. Rule 87. An amendment has been moved earlier. 87 merBIy provides thIt • person who has We have seAn ~. Then ~ is said that by leave moved an amendment in the case of a Bill, of the House it should be withdrawn. Then, has a right to withdraw. The right has been when the leave of the House was contested- given to a person who has moved an amend- you say so-and they had asked for a divi- ment, to withdraw. Now, the question is, how sion how to ascertain whethor the leave of is that right to be exercised. So. rule 87 is a the House was there in favour of the w~h rule which give. the right; it does not regulate drawal? That was to be ascertained by a the procedure. It says two things viz. the right division, and you took the division. And a to wbhdraw depends upon (1 ) ~ is the mover preponderant majority says the leave should who must seek the right to withdraw. Th. be granted. Then what remains of rule 87? mover, viz. Shri Ram Dhan has already don. Therefore, there is a specific motion. That is that part; and (2) the withdrawal is to be by why this is a particular rule, what is called- leave of the House. How is the leave of the in law-a specHic procedure, a particular House to be granted-is not mentioned over procedure. And in Chapter XXVII there is a thet'e. It is left to the presiding authority. The general procedure. General procedure can presiding authority is guided ... (Interruptions) never over·rule a particular procedure. W~h regard to amendment to Bills, a particular SHRISOMNATHCHAITERJEE: Why procedure has been provided. Therefor., a is rule 87 there than? general procedure cannot over-ride a particular procedure. SHP' G.M. BANATWAlLA: Rule 87 is there in order to provide for the substantive Rule 339 contemplate. a different situ- right of • person, to withdraw hi. amend· ation. But where there is a specKic provision ment. (lnt.nvption,) How is that right to be regarding amendments, It has to be apptied; exerci$ed? Two conditions: firstty, that right and rule 87 does not put any restriction. You is to be exercised (IntemJptions) by the mcMr have ascertained the leave 01 the House by of the amendment, viz. Mr. Ram Dhan: and division: otharwiM. rule 87 can nev8r apply. secondly. that right haa to be ex8tCiMd ~ (Int.",.".",., asking fOr leave of wtIhdrawal Oft the leave 199 Const (68th Amend.) MAY 30.1990 Bill 200

[Sh. G.M. BanIlWllla) him to withdraw it also. 1could say that I (X)uld not have neglected that also. At the specific " 01 withdrawal, the Speaker has to ascertain request, he later said that he would withdraw the .nat of the HoUH. tt. The question is this. Once he said that he was moving ~; again he said that he was Rule 339 says that the sense of the withdrawing it. What should be done? So, a HoUI. is ascertained by asking a question question was put to the House and some whether leave Is granted. Now the point is members in the House said, put it to the vote that since a dissenting voice was already of the House and we put ~ to the vote of the there, there ought not 10 have been a divi- House; and the House agreed to grant leave sion. What Is your ru1ing on taking adivision? to Mr. Ram Ohan to w~hdraw the motion. Rule 339 clearly says that when there is a Now, if Mr. Ram Ohan wants to withdraw the point of dissent, immediately the matter has motion, he can withdraw the motion; W he to be decided bv the Chair and the question does not want to withdraw it, I shall put it to cannot be put to the House. But then the the vote of the House and finish ~. question was put and the division was taken. The division Is irregular. I ask that the divi- (Intsrruptions) sion be declared not In ordar and you proceed with the dissenting voice and declare MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: I shall now that leave is not granted. put amendment no. 31 moved by Shri Ram Chan to the vote of the House. SHRIVASANTSATHE: We have heard the learned counsel of West Bengal. Rule The question is: 339 and Rule 87 must be read together. I am vary clear on them. Just now, Mr. Banatwalla "Page 1, line 19,- has pointed out that Rule 87 only gives a right of enquiry. (Ints"uptions) All that Rule for ,hree" substitute Ilsix" (31) 339 says is this: you ask a question, is ~ your pleasure that the motion be withdrawn? That Those in favour will please say 'Ayes' is aut the leave. All you did was to ascertain the dissent. Now the dissent even by a SEVERAL HON. MEMBERS: 'Ayes' voice vot, could have been ascertained. By way of abundant caution. you took a division MA. DEPUTY ·SPEAKER: Those on I. That is only a dissent, whether it is by against will please say 'Noes' ont vote or 116 votes or any numbers. The . MCtion is very clear. It says that the motion SOME HON. MEMBERS: 'Noes'. mUll be wbhdrawn. This is more relevant to thiI. Rule 339 on page 137 read as follows: MR. SPEAKER: I think the 'Ayes' have I, the •Ayes' have it. 'But • any dissent voice by heard or a member rises to continue the debate PROF. P.J. KURIEN: The INoes' have (WhIther by division or otherwise) the Spe .... shall forthwith put the mo .. •• tan. .. MR. DEPUTY -SP.EAKER: Let the lob- bias be cIeat1P. He ..puI the .... m01ion thII has bien ...... (~) MIl DEPUTY-sPEAICEA: t... MMI MIl rJEPUTY-8PEAKER: The IabbiIs ...... an tIiI. I would not ...... _..... ~wlgoan.....t...... AIm Chan InIIiII ,...... 1. Certai\ ,1'MlftbIm ...... MIt DEPUlV-8PEAKER: Now, the 201 Const. (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9. 1912 (SAKA) Bill 201

Lobbies have been cleared. I shall now put Ahmad, Shri Kamaluddin amendment No. 31 moved by Shri Ram Ohan to the vote of the House. Ajit Singh. Shrl

The question is: Ali, Shrimati Subhashini

Page 1, line 19,- Amat, Shri D.

for flthree" substitute "six· (31 ) Antulay, Shri A.R.

SOME HON. MEMBERS: Yes. Argall Shri Chhaviram

SEVERAL HON. MEMBERS: No. Arunachalam, Shri M.

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: The 'Noes' Asokaraj, Shri A. have it. Athithan. Shri Dhanuskodi R. The motion was negatived Baig, Shri Arif MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: J am going to put Clause 2, as amended, to the vote of Bais, Shri Ramesh the House. Before I put Clause 2 to the vote of the House, I would like to say that this Baitha, Shri Mahendra being a Constitution (Amendment) Bill ,voting has to be by division. Bala, Dr. Asim

The Lobbies have already been cleared. Balaraman, Shri L.

The question is: Banatwalla, Shri G.M.

'That clause 2, as amended I stand part Banera, Shri Hamendra Singh of the Bill.· Bansi Lal, Shri The Lok Sabha divided Barman, Shri Palas AYES Buu, Shri Anil Division No. 9 Sasu, Shri Chitta 16.57 hr •. Beg, Shri Yusuf Acharia, Shri Basudeb 8ega Ram, Shri Advani, Shri LK. Bahara. Shti Bhajaman AprwaI. Shri J.P. Bengali Singh. Dr ...... ~ Shri Rajendra Benjamin. Shri S. At.. Dr. DauIaIrao Sonuii

AMIed. SIvi Anwar Bhagat. Shri H.K.L 203 Canst (68th Amend.) MAY 30, 1990 Bill 204

Bhagey Gobardhan, Shri Danr.lavate, Prof. Madhu

Bhajan Lal, Shn Danwe, Shri Pundlik Hari

Bhardwaj, Shri Paraaram Das, Shri Anadi Charan

Bhargava, Shri Girdhari Lal Dasgupta, Dr. Biplab

Bhartiya, Shri Santosh Datta, Shri Amal

Bhatia, Shrl Ram Sewak Delkar, Shri Mohanbhai Sanjibhai

Bhattacharya, Srimati Malini Dennis, Shri N.

Bhattacharya, Shri Nani Oeshmukh, Shri Anantrao

Shosle, Shrl Pratapro Baburao Oeshmukh, Shri Chandubhal

Brrandsr Singh, Rao Deshmukh, Snri Sudam Dattatrya

Bopche, D~. Khushal Parasram Dev, Shri Sontosh Mohan

Chakravorty, Shri Susantn Devi Lal, Shr;

Chano R&m, S~ri Dhakane, Shri Babanrao

Chandra Shekhar, Shri Dhankhar, Ch. Jagdeep

Chandrasekhar, Shrimati M. Dhawan, Shri Harmohan

Charles, $hri A. Dhumal, Prof. Pram K~mar

Chatterjee. Shri Nirmal Kanti Dikshit, Shri Narsinghrao

Chatterji, Shri Somnath Dinesh Singh, Shrl

Chaudhary, Shri Rudras&n Dome, Dr. Ram Chandra

Chaudhary. Shri Kamal Dore, Shri Raja Ambanna Nayak

Chauhan, Shri Prabhatsinh Fernandes, Shrl George

Chavan. Shrimati Premalabai Gaikwad, Shri Udaysingrao Nanasaheb

Chavda, Shrt Khemchanbhai Somabhai Gajapathi, Shri Gopi Nath

Choudhary, Shri lokanath Gamit, Shri Chhitubhai Oevjibhai

Choudhury. Shri'saHuddin Gandhi, Shrimati Manaka

Chowdhary. Shri Ouai Gandhi, Shri Rajiv 205 Const. .,Amend.) JYAISTHA 9.1912 (SAKA) Bill 206

Gangadhar. Stm s. Jha, Shri Bog.ndra

Gangwar, Shri SantGsh Kumar Jhlkram. Shri Mohanlal

Giri, Shri Sudhir Jorawar Ram. Shri

Gamange. Shri Giridhar Joshi, Shri Dau Dayal

Gujral. Shri I.K. Kabde, Dr. Venketesh

Gupta, Shri Dharmpal Singh Kale, Shri Sukhd80 Nandaji

Gupta, Shri Janak Raj Kalka Das, Shri

Handoo~ Shri Piyar. Lal Kalvi, Shri Kalyan Singh

Hannan Mollah, Shri Kemble, Shri Arvind Tulshiram

Hansela, Shri Matilal Kapsa, Prof. Ram Ganesh

Harish Pal, Shri Kataria, Shn Gulab Ciland

Heara Bhai, Shri Kaul. Shrimati Sheila

Hat Ram, Shri Kaushik, Shri Purushottam

Hota, Shri Bhabani Shankar Keshar; Lal. Shri

Inder In, Shri Khan, Haji G.M.

Jaffer Shariaf, Shri C.K. Khan, Shri Sukhendu

Jag Pal Singh, Shri Khan, Shri Zulfiquar Ali

Jal Parkash, Shri Khandelwal, Shri Pyarelal

Jamod, Shri Shashibhai Khatique, Shri Shanker lal

Jangde, Shri Resham Lal Khurana, Shri Madan Lal

Jaswant Singh, Shri Kotadia, Shrl Manubhal

Jatav, Shri Than Singh Krishna Kumar, Shri S.

Jatiya, Shri Satynarayan Kumaramangalam, Shri P.R.

Jay.mohan, Shri A. Kurlln. :»waf. P.J.

Jeevarlthinam, Shri R. MIhabIr Prasad, Shri f JenI. 8bri Srikanta MINjan, Shrimati Sum". 207 Const. (68th Amend.) MAY 30, 1990 Bill 208

Mahajan, Shri Y.S. Misra, Shri Satyagopal

Mahala, Shri Haribhau Shankar Mukherjee, Shrimati Gaeta

Mahata, Shri Ch~ta Mukhopadhyay, Shri Ajoy

Mahato, Shri Shallendra Multan Singh, Chaudhary

Makkasar, Shri Shopat Singh Munda, Shri Karia

Malhotra, Shri Vijay Kumar Munjara, Shri Kankar

Malik, Shri Purna Chandra Muraleedharan, Shri K.

Malik, Shri Satya Pal Murthy, Shri M.V. Chandra Shekara

Mallik, Shri Mangaraj Muthiah, Shri R.

Mallikarjun, Shri Naik, Shri Ram

Mandai, Shri Sanat Kumar Nandi, Shri Vellaiah

Manjay Lal, Shri Narayanan Shri K.R.

Mantosh, Shri Paul R. Narayanan, Shri P.G.

Manvar, Shri Balvant Nathu Singh, Shri

Marbaniang, Shri Peter G. Nayak, Shri Nakul

Masuda' Hossain, Shri Syed Negi, Shri C.M.

Mayawati, Kumari Netam, Shri Arvind

Meana, Dr. Kirodi Lal Nitish Kumar, Shri

Meena, Shri Nandlal Odeyar, Shri Channaiah

Meghwal, Shri Kailash Oraon, Shrimati Sumati

Mehta, Shrimati Jayawanti Navinchan- Pacherwal, Shri Gopal dra Pal. Shri M.S. Mewar, Shri Mahendra Singh Pal, Shri Rupchand Mirdha, Shri Nathu Ram Panda. Shri Rajmangal Mishra. Shri 8atgopal

Miahra. Shri JaneshWar Pandey. Prof. Yaiu Hath

..... Shri Raj IItarIgaI Pandeya. Dr. Laxminarayan 209 Const. (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 210

P,ni, Shri Ravi Narayan Prabhu, Shri A.

Panja, Shri Ajit Pradhani, Shri K.

Panwar, Shri Harpal Singh Pramanik, Shri Radhika Ranjan

Paranlpe. Shri Baburao Prasad, Shr; Hari KawaI

Paraste, Shri Dalpat Singh Prasad, Shri A.S.

Paswan, Shn Chhedi Prasad. Shri V. Sreanivasa

Paswan, Shri Ram Vilas Prem Pradeep. Shri

Paswan, Shri Sukdeo Raghavji, Shri

Patel, Dr. A.K. Rahi, Shri Ramlal

Patel, Shri Arjunbhai Rai, Shrj, M. Ramanna

Patel, Shri Chandresh Rajdev Singh, Shri

Patel, Shri Maganbhal Manibhai Raje, Shnmati Vasundhara

Pat91, Shri Prahlad Singh Raju, Shri Bh. Vijayakumar

Patel, Shn Ram Pujan Raju, Shri M.M. Pallam

Patel, Shri Somabhai Rajveer Singh, Shri

Pathak, Shri Harin Ram Babu, Shri A.G.S.

Patidar, Shri Rarr.eshwar Ram Prakash, Ch.

Patil. Shri Balasaheb Vikhe Ram Sagar, Shrl (Bara Banki)

Patil, Shri Basavaraj Ram Sagar, Shri (Saidpur)

Patil, Shri Uttamrao Ram Sajiwan. Shri

Patil, Shri Uttamrao Lakmanrao Ram Singh, Shri

Patnaik, Shri Sivaji Ramakrishna, Shri Y.

Panchalliah, Shri P. Ramamurthy, Shri K.

Peruman, Dr. P. Vallal Rana, Shri Kashiram Chhabildas

Phundkar, Shri Bhaoosaheb Pundlik Ranga Prof. N.G.

Potdukhe, Shri Shantaram Aao .. Shri J. Chokka 211 Const. (68th Amend.) MAY30,1900 SRI 212

Rao, Shri K.S. Sanyal. Shri Manik

Rao, Shri R. Gundu Saran, Shri Daulat Ram

Rao, Shri Srinivas Saroj, Shri Sarju Prasad

Rasheed Masood, Shri Sartaj Singh, Shri

Rathva, Shri Narayanbhai Jamlabhai Sarwar Hussain. Shri

Rathod, Shri Uttam Sathe. Silri Vasant

Rathor, Dr. Bhagwan Dass Save, Shri Moreshwar

Rawat. Shri Harish Sayeed. Shri Mufti Mohammad

Rawat, Prof. Rasa Singh Scindia, Shrimati Vijayaraje

Ray, Dr. Sudhir Sekhar. Shri M.G.

Raychaudhuri, Shri Sudarsan Selvam, Shri Kanci Panneer

Reddy, Shri A. Venkata Shah, Shri Babubhai Meghji

Reddy, Shri Kotla Vijaya Bhaskara Shah. Shri Jayantilal Virchanrlbhai

Reddy, Shri M.G. Shakeelur Rehman, Dr.

Reddy, Shri P. Narsa Shakya, Dr. Mahadeepak Singh

Reddy, Shri R. Surender Shakya, Shri Ram Singh

Reddy, Shri Rajamohan Shankaranand, Shri B.

Routray. Shri Nllamani Shanmugam, Shri P.

Roy, Shri A.K. Sharma. Shr; Chiranji Lal

Roy, Shri Haradhan Sharma, Shri Dharm Pal

Roypradhan, Shri Amar Shastri, Shri Anil

Sahay. Shri Subodh Kant Shastri. Shri Kapil Ow

Sai, Shri A. Larang Shastri, Shri Yamuna Prasad

Sai, Shri Nand Kumar Shekhada, Shri Govindbhai Kanjibhai

Saini. Shri Gurdial Singh Shingada. Shri O.S.

Sait, Shr; Ibrahim Sulaman Shiwankar, Prof. Mahadeo 213 Const. (68th Amend.) JVAISTHA 9,1812 (SAKA) BUI 214

Shukla, Shri Vidyacharan SodhI. Shrt Mankuram

Sidnal, Shri S.B. Solanki. Shri 9urajbhanu

Silvera, Or. C. Soren, Shri Shibu

Singam, Shri Basavapunnaiah Soz, Prof Saif-ud.cJin

Singh, Shri Ajay Subedar, Shri

Singh, Shri Dhanraj Sucha, Singh, Baba

Singh, Shri Har Govind Sultanpuri, Shri K.D.

Singh, Shri Hari Kishore Sundararaj, Shri N.

Singh, Shri Jagannath Tandel. Shri D.J.

Singh, Shri K. Manvendra Tarif Singh. Shri

Singh, Shri L. V. Tarwala, Shri Amratlal Vallabhda~

Singh, Shri Lokendra Taslimudin, Shri

Singh, Shri Mandhat& Thakore, Shri Gabbhaji Mangaji

Singh, Prof. N. Tombi Thambi Durai, Dr.

Singh, Shri Ram Bahadur Thapa, Shri Nandu

Singh, Shri Radha Mohan Thomas, Prof. K.V.

Singh, Shri Ram Naresh Thungon, Shri P.K.

Singh, Shri Ram Prasad Tiwari, Shri Brij Bhushan

Singh, Shri Ramdas Tyagi, Shri K.C.

Singh, Shri Sukhendra Uma Bharati. Kumar;

Singh, Shri Surya Narayan Umbrey, Shri Laeta

Singh, Shri T8j Narayan Unnikrishnan, Shri K.P.

Singh, Shri Uday Pratap Vaghala, Shri Shankersinh

Singh, Shri Vishwanath Pratap Varma, Shri Dharmesh Prasad

Singh Deo, Shri A.N. Varma. Shri Ratilal Kalidas

Sinha, Shrimati Usha Varma. Shri S.C. 215 Const. (68th Amsnd.) MAY 30, 1990 Bill 216

Vekaria, Shri S.N. Vuvraj. Shri

Verma, Shri Phoot Chand Zainal Abedin. Shri

Verma, Shri R.L.P. NOES

Verma, Shri Sheo Sharan ·Singh, Shri Pratap

Verma, Shri Upendra Nath MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Subject to tfI correction, the resu~ of the division is: Verma, Shrimati Usha Ayes 368 Vijayaraghavan, Shri A. Noes 001

Viswanatham, Dr. The motion is carried by a majority of the total membership of the House and by a majority Wadiyar, Shri Srikanta Datta Narasimha of not less than two-thirds of the Members Raja present and voting.

Yadav, Shri Chhotey Singh Tha motion was adopted

Yadav, Shri Chun Chun Prasad Clause 2, as amended, was added to the 8i/l Yadav, Shri Devendra Prasad Clause 1-Short Title and Commence- Yadav, Shri Hukumdeo Narayan ment Amendment made: Yadav, Shri Janardan Page 1, line 3.- Yadav, Shri Kailash Nath Singh For"Sixty-eighth" substitute-"Sixty- fifth" (19) Yadav. Shri Mitra Sen (SHRI RAM VILAS PASWAN) Yadav, Shri Ramendra Kumar Ravi MR. DEPUTY SPEAAKER: Before I put Clause 1, as amended, to the vote of the Yadav. Dr. S.P. House. this being the Cvnstitution (Amend- Yadav. Shri Sharad ment) Bill, voting has to be by division. The lobbies have already been cleared. Yadav. Shri Surya Narayan Yadava, Shri Ramjilal The questions: "That Clause 1, as amended, stand Yadvendra, Datt, Shri part of the Bill.· The Lok Sabha divided Yazdani, Dr. Golam

·Wrongly noted for Noes. ··The following Members also recorded their votes for Ayes: Shri Hat Ram, Shri Satya Pal Singh Yadav, Shri Harsh Vardhan, Shri Pratap Singh. SFtri Guman Mal Lodha, Shri fshwar Chaudhary. Shri Kalpnath Sankar, Shri Dilip Singh Ju Oea, Shri Kirapl Singh, Shri Prakash Koko Brahmbhatt. Shri K. Ramamohan Roa. Dr. Shailendranath Shrivastava, Shri Tant Baran Topdar, Shri Nathubhai M. Patti, Shri Indrajit Gupta, Shri Mohammad Shafi, Shrl Joss Fernandez. Smt. Rajendra Kaur Bul.a. Shri Vamanrao Mahadik, Shri M. Selvarasu, Shri Jagdish Singh Kushwaha. Kumari Kamalji Karaddula. Shri era Anbaraau, Shri 8aga Reddy. Shri A.S. Gounder. Shri Banwarilal Purohl. 217 Const. (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) Bill 218

AYES Barman, Shri Palas

Division No. 10 8asu, Shri Anil

17.01 hr •. Basu, Shri Chltte

Acharia, Shri Basudeb Beg, Shri Yusuf

Advani. Shrl LK. Bega Ram, Shri

Agarwal, Shri J.P. Bahera, Shri Bhajaman

Agnihotri, Shri Aajendra Bengali Singh, Dr.

Aher, Dr. Daulatrao Sonuji Benjamin, Shri S.

Ahmed, Shri Anwar Bhagat, Shri H.K.L

Ahmed, Shri Kamaluddin Bhajan Lal, Shri

Ajit Singh, Shri Bhardwaj, Shri Paras ram

Amat, Shri D. Bhargava, Shr; Girdhari Lal

Anbarasu, Shri Era Bhartiya, Shri Santosh

Antulay, Shri A.A. Bhatia, Shri Ram'Sswak

Argal, Shri Chhaviram Bhattacharya, Srimati Malini

Arunachalam, Shri M. Bhattacharya, Shri Nan;

Asokaraj, Shri A. Shosls, Shri Prataprao Baburao

Athithan, Shri Dhanuskodi R. Bimal Kaur, Shrimati

Baig, Shri Arif Birender Singh, Rao

Bais, Shri Ramesh Bopche, Dr. Khushal Parasram

Saitha, Shri Mahendra Srahmbhatt, Shri Prakash Koko

Bala, Dr. Asim Bulara, Shimati Rajinder Kaur

Balaraman, Shri L. Chand Ram, Shri

Banatwalla, Shri G.M. Chandra Shekhar, Shri

Banera, Shri Hamendra Singh Chandrasekhar, Shrimati M.

Bansi Lal, Shri Charles, Shri A.. 219 Canst (68th Amend.) MAY30,1990 881 220

ChsUwjM, Shri Nirmal Kanli Diksh~, Shri Narsinghrao

Chatterji, Shrl Somnath Dinesh Singh, Shri'

Chaudhary, Shri Ishwar Dome, Dr. Ram Chandra

Chaudhary, Shri Rudrasen Dore. Shrl Raja Ambanna Nayak

Chaudhary, Shri Kamal Fernandes, Shri George

Chauhan, Shri Prabhatsinh Fernandez, Shri Joss

Chavan, Shrimati Premalabai Gaikwad, Shri Udaysingrao Nanasaheb

Chavda, Shri Khemchanbhai SOmabhai Gajapathi, Shri Gopi Nath

Choudhary, Shri Lokanath Gamit, Shri Chhnubhai Devjibhai

Choudhury, Shri SaHuddin Gandhi, Shrimati Manaka

Chowdharv. Shri Oasai Gandhi, Shn Rajiv

Dandavate, Prof. Madhu Gangadhar, Shri S.

Oanwe, Shri Pundlik Hari GanQwar, Shri Santosh Kumar

Das, Shri Anadi Charan Giri, Shri Sudhir

Oasgupta, Dr. 8iplab Gomange, Shri Giridhar

Datta, Shri Amal Gujral. Shri I.K.

Dennis, Shri N. Gupta, Shri Dharmpal Singh

Deora, Shri Murli Gupta, Shri Indrajn

Deshmukh, Shri Anantrao Gupta, Shri Janak Raj

Deshmukh, Shri Chandubhai Handoo, Shri Piyare Lal

Dev. Shri Sontosh Mohan Hannan Mollah, Shri

Devi Lal, Shri Hansda, Shri Matilal

Dhakane, Shri Babanrao Hatish Pal, Shri

Dhankhar. Ch. Jagdeep Harsh Vardhan, Shri

Dhawan, Shri Harmohan H•• ra Bhal, Shri

Dhumal. Prof. Prem Kumar Hel Ram. Shrl 221 Const. (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 222

Hota, Shri Bhabani Shankar Kaul, Shrimati Sheila

Inder J~, Shri Kaushik, Shri Purushottam

Jaffer Shariaf, Shri C.K. Keshari Lal, Shri

Jag Pal Singh, Shri Khan, Haji G.M.

Jai Parkash, Shri Khan, Shri Sukhendu

Jamod, Shri Shashibhai Khan, Shri Zulfiquar Ali

Jangde, Shri Resham Lal Khandelwal, Shri Pyarelal

Jaswant Singh, Shri Khatiqu9, Shri Shanker Lal

Jatav, Shri Than Singh Khurana, Shri Madan Lal

Jatiya, Shri Satynarayan Kirpal Singh, Shri

Jayamohan, Shri A. Kotadia, Shri Manubhal

Jeevarathinam, Shri R. Krishna Kumar, Shri S.

Jana, Shri Srikanta Kumaramangalam, Shri P.R.

Jha, Shri Bogendra Kurien, Prof. P.J.

Jhikram, Shri Mohanlal Lodha, Shri Guman Mal

Jorawar Ram, Shri Mahabir Prasad, Shri

Joshi, Shri Dau Dayal Mahadik, Shri Vamanrao

Ju, Dea, Shri Dilip Singh Mahajan, Shrimati Sumitra

Kabde, Dr. Venkatesh Mahajan, Shri Y.S.

Kale, Shri Sukhdeo Nandaji Mahale, Shri Haribhau Shankar

Kalka Oas, Shri Mahata, Shri Chitta

Kalvi, Shri Kalyan Singh Mahalo, Shri Shailendra

KImble, Shri Arvind Tulshiram Makkasar, Shri Shopat Singh

KIpae, Prof. Ram Ganesh Malhotra, Shri Vijay Kumar

Karaddula, Kumari Kamalaji Malik, Shri Purna Chandra

Kauria, Shri Gulab Chand Malik, Shrl Satya Pal 223 Con.t (68th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 224

Malik, Shrl Mangara) Naik, Shri Ram

Millikarjun, Shri Nandi, Shri Yellaiah

Mandai, Shri Sanat Kumar Narayanan Shri K.R.

Mantoah, Shri Paul R. Narayanan, Shri P.G.

Manvar, Shri Balvant Nathu Singh, Shri

Marblnlang, Shrl Peter G. Nayak, Shri Nakul

Muudal Hossain, Shri Syed Negi, Shri C.M.

Mayawati, Kumari Netam, Shrl Arvind

.....n •• Dr. Kirodi Lal N~ish Kumar, Shri

MMna. Shri Nandlal Odeyar I Shri Channaiah

Mlghwal. Shri Kailash Oraon, Shrimatl Sumati

Mehta. Shrimati Jayawanti Navinchan- Pacherwal, Shri Gopal dra Pal, Shri M.S. U,war, Shri Mahendra Singh Pal, Shri Rupchand Mirdha, Shri Nathu Ram Pande, Shri Rajmangal Mishra, Shri 8algopal Pandey, Prof. Yadu Nath Milhra, Shrl Janeshwar Pandeya, Dr. Laxminarayan Milhra. Shri Raj Mangal Pani, Shri RaVi Narayan Misra, Shri Satyagopal Panja, Shri Aj~ Mukhe~8e, Shrimati Geeta Panwar, Shri Harpal Singh Mukhopadhyay, Shri A;,y Paranjpe, Shri Baburao Muban Singh, Chaudhary Parasts, Shri Oalpat Singh Munda, Shri Karia Paswan, Shri Chhedi Munjare. Shri Kankar Paswan, Shri Ram Vilas Muraleedharan, Shri K.

Murthy, Shri M.V. Chandra Shekara Paswan, Shri Sukdeo

Muthiah. Shri R. Patel. Dr. A.K. 225 Const. (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9. 1912 (SAKA) Bill 226

Patel. Shri Arjunbhai Raghavji, Shri

Patel. Shri Chandresh Rahi, Shri Ramlal

Patel, Shri Maganbhai Manibhai Rai, Shri. M. Ramanna

Patel. Shri Natubhai M. Rajdev Singh, Shri

Patel, Shri Prahlad Singh Raje, Shrimati Vasundhara

Patel, Shri Ram Pujan Raju, Shri Bh. Vijayakumar

Patel, Shri Somabhai Raju, Shri M.M. Pallam

Pathak, Shri Harin Rajveer Singh, Shrl

Patidar, Shri Rameshwar Ram Babu, Shri A.G.S.

Patil, Shri Balasaheb Vikhe Ram Ohan, Shrl

Patil, Shri Basavaraj Ram Prakash, Ch.

Patil, Shri Uttamrao Ram Sagar, Shri (Bara Bat*i)

Patil, Shri Uttamrao Lakmanrao Ram Sagar, Shri (Saidpur)

Patnaik, Shri Sivaji Ram Sajiwan. Shri

Penchalliah, Shri P. Ram Singh. Shri

Peruman, Dr. P. Vallal Ramakrishna, Shri Y.

Phundkar, Shri Bhaoosaheb Pundlik Ramamurthy, Shri K.

Potdukhe, Shri Shantaram Rana, Shri Kashiram Chhabildas

Prabhu, Shri R. Ranga Prof. N.G.

Pradhani, Shri K. Rao. Shri J. Chokka

Pramanik, Shri Radhika Ranjan Rao, Shri K.S.

Prasad, Shri Hari Kewal Rao, Shri R. Gundu

Prasad, Shri R.S. Rao, Shri Srinivas

Prasad. Shri V. Sreenivasa Rasheed Masood, Shri

Pram Pradeep, Shrl Rathva. Shri NarayanbhaJ JamJabhai

Prurohit, Shri Banwarilal Rathod, Shri Uttam 227 Const. (68th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 228

Rathor, Dr. Bhagwan Oass Shah, Shri Babubhai Maghji Rawat, Shri Harish Shah. Shri JayantilaJ Virchandbhai Rawat, Prof. Rasa Singh Shakeelur Rehman, Or. Ray, Or. Sudhir Shakya, Shri Ram Singh Raychaudhurl, Shri Sudarsan Shankaranand, Shri B. Reddy, Shri A. Venkata Shanmugam, Shri P. Reddy, Shri Kotla Vijaya Bhaskara Sharma, Shri Chiranji lal Reddy, Shri M.G. Sharma, Shri Dharm Pal Reddy, Shri P. Narsa Shastri, Shri Ani! Reddy, Shri R. Surender Shastri. Shri Kapil Dev Reddy, Shri Rajamohan Shastri, Shri Yamu.,a Prasad Routray, Shri Nilamani Shekhada, Shri Govindbhai Kanjibhai Roy, Shri A.K. Shingada, Shri O.B. Roy, Shri Haradhan Shiwankar. Prof. Mahadeo Roypradhan, Shri Amar Shrivastava. Or. Shailendranath Sahay, Shri Subodh Kant Shukla. Shri Vidyacharan Sai, Shri A. Larang Sidnal, Shri S.B. Sai, Shri Nand Kumar Silvera, Or. C. Saini. Shri Gurdial Singh Singam, Shri Basavapunnaiah

San, Shri Ibrahim Sulaiman Sin~h, Shri Dhanraj

Sanyal. Shri Manik Singh, Shri Har Govind Saran, Shri Daulat Ram Singh, Shri Hari Kishore Saroj, Shri Sarju Prasad Singh, Shri Jagannath Sartaj Singh. Shri Singh, Shri K. Manvendra Sarwar Hussain, Shri Singh, Shri L.V. Sathe. Shri Vasant Singh, Shri Lokendra Sav., Shri Moreshwar Singh, Shri Mandhata Sayead, Shri Mufti Mohammad Singh, Prof. N. Tombi Scindia, Shrimati Vljayaraje Singh, Shri Pratap s.khar, Shri M.G. Singh, Shri Ram Bahadur Selvam, Shri Kana Pann •• Singh, Shri Radha Mohan Selvarasu, Shri M. Singh, Shri Ram Narash 229 Don.t (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 ($AKA) Bill 230

Singh. Shri Ram Prasad Varma, Shri Dharmesh Prasad Singh. Shri Ramdas Varma, Shri Ratilal Kalidas Singh. Shri Sukhendra Varma. Shri S.C. Singh. Shri Surya Narayan Vekaria, Shri S.N. Singh. Shri Tej Narayan Verma. Shri Phool Chand Singh. Shri Uday Pratap Verma, Shri R.L.P. Singh. Shri Vishwanath Pratap Verma, Shri Shea Sharan Singh Deo, Shri A.N. Verma, Shri Upendra Hath Sinha, Shrimati Usha Verma, Shrimati Usha Sodhi, Shri Mankuram Vijayaraghavan. Shri A. Sonkar. Shri Kalpnath Viswanatham. Dr. Soren, Shri Shibu Yadav. Shri Chhotey Singh Soz. Prof. Saif-ud-din Yadav, Shri Chun Chun Prasad Subedar, Shri Yadav, Shri Devendra Prasad Such. Singh, Baba Yadav, Shri Hukumdeo Narayan Sultanpuri. Shri K.D. Yadav, Shri Janardan Sundararaj, Shri N. Yadav, Shri Kailash Hath Singh landel, Shri D.J. Yadav, Shri Mitra Sen Tanf Singh, Shri Yadav, Shri Ram Krishan Tarwala, Shri Amratlal Vallabhdas Yadav, Shri Ramendra Kumar Ravi Taslimudin. Shri Yadav, Dr. S.P. Thakore, Shri Gabbhaji Mangajl Yadav. Shri Satyapal Singh Thambi Durai, Dr. Yadav. Shri Sharad Thapa, Shri Nandu Yadav, Shri Surya Narayan Thomas, Prof. K. V. Yadava, Shri Ramjilal Thungon. Shri P.K. Yadvendra. Daft, Shri Tiwari, Shri Brij Bhushan Yazdani. Dr. Golam lyagi, Shri K.C. Yuvraj.Shri Ums Bharati. Kumar; Zainal Abedin, Shri Umbrey. Shri Laeta NOES Unnluiahnan. Shri K.P. ·~a Reddy, Shri M. V..... Shri Shankersinh -wtonotJ valid for Noes. 231 Canst. (68th Amend.) MAY30,1990 Bill 232

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Subject to passed, to the vote of the House, this being ·correction, the result of the division Is: a Constbution (Amendment) Bill voting has to be by division. Lobbies are already cleared. Ayes 382 The question is: Noes 001 "That the Bill, as amended, be passed- The motion is carried by a majority of the total membership of the House and by a Th9 Lok Sabha divided majority of not less than two-thirds of the Members present and voting. AYES

The motion was adopted Division No. 11

Clause 1, as amend8d, was add8d to th8 17.04 hr •. Bill Acharia, Shri Basudeb 17.00 hr •• Advani, Shri L.K. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: The question is: Agarwal, Shri J.P.

M"fhat the Enacting Formula and the Agnihotri, Shri Rajendra Long T~le stand part of the Bill." Aher, Dr. Daulatrao Sonuji Th8 motion was adopt8d Ahmed, Shri Anwar The Enacting formula and the Long Title W8r8 added to th9 Bill Ahmed, Shri Kamaluddin

[ Translation] Ajit Singh, Shri

THE MINISTER OF LABOUR AND Amat, Shri D. WELFARE (SHRI RAM VILAS PASWAN): I -beg to move: Anbarasu, Shrj Era

"That the Bill, as amended, be passed." Antulay, Shri A.R.

[English] Argal, Shri Chhaviram

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Before I put the motion that the Bill as amended be Arunachalam Shrl M.

* The following Members also recorded their votes for Ayes:

Shri Bhagey Gobardhan, Shri AJay Singh, Shri Manjay Lal, Shri K. RImamohan Rao, Shrimati Subhashini Ali, Dr. Mahadeepak Singh Shakya Shri Susanta Chlkravorty, Shri Tartt Baran Topdar, Shri Moh,mmad Shafi, Shri Mohanbhai Sanjibhal Dllcar, Shri Jagdish Singh Kushwaha, Shri Srikanta Datta Naruimharaja Wadiyar, Shrl SU,...... u SoIanki, Shri Mullappally Ramachandran, Shri M. BIg. Reddy. 233 Const. (68th Amend) JYAISTHA9. 1912 (SAKA) Bill 234

Asokaraj. Shri A. Bhattacharya, Srimati Malini

Athithan, Shri Dhanuskodi'R. Bhattacharya, Shri Nani

Baga Reddy, Shri M. Bhasle, Shri Pratap Rao Baburao

Baig. Shri Arif Birender Singh, Rao

Bais, Shri Ramesh Bopche, Dr. Khushal Parasram

Baitha, Shri Mahendra Brahmbhatt, Shri Prakash Koko

Bala, Dr. Asim Bulara, Shimati Rajinder Kaur.

Balaraman, Shri L. Chakravorty, Shri Susanta

Banatwalla, Shri G.M. Chand Ram, Shri

Banera, Shri Hamendra Singh Chandra Shekhar, Shri

Bansi Lal, Shri Chandrasekhar, Shrimati M.

Barman, Shri Palas Charles, Shri A.

Sasu, Shri Anil Chatterjee, Shri Nirmal Kanti

8asu, Shri Chitta Chatterj;, Shri Somnath

Beg, Shri Yusuf Chaudhary, Shri Ishwar

Bega Ram, Shri Chaudhary, Shri Rudrasen

Behera, Shri Bhajaman Chaudhary, Shri Kamal

Bengali Singh, Dr. Chauhan, Shri Prabhatsinh

Benjamin, Shri S. Chavan, Shrimati Premalabai

Shagat, Shri H.K.L. Chavda, Shri Khemchanbhai Somabhai

Bhagey Gobardhan, Shri Choudhary, Shri Lokanath

Bhajan Lal, Shri Choudhury, Shri Saifuddin

Bhardwaj, Shri Parasram Chowdhary, Shri Oasa;

Bhargava, Shri Girdhari Lal Dandavate, Prof. Madhu

Bhartiya, Shri Santosh Danwe. Shri Pundlik Han

Bhatia, Shri Ram Sawak 011, Shri Anadi Charan 235 Cons', (68th Amend.) MAY 30, 1990. Bill 236

Dasgupta. Dr. Biptab Gamaogo, Shri Giridhar

Datta, Shri Amal Gounder, Shri A.S.

Delkar, Shri Mohanbai Sanjibhai Gujra~ Shri I.K.

Dennis, Shri N. Gupta, Shri Dharmpal Singh

Deara, Shri Murli Gupta, Shri Indrajit

Deshmukh, Shri Anantrao Gupta, Shri Janak Raj

Deshmukh, Shri Chandubhai P.andoo, Shri Piyare Lal

Dev, Shri Sontosh Mohan Hannan Mollah, Shri

Deyi Lal, Shri Hansda, Shri MatUal

Dhakane, Shrl Babanrao Harish Pal, Shri

Dhankhar, Ch. Jagdeep Harsh Vardhan, Shri

Dhawan, Shri Harmohan Heera Bhai, Shri

Dhumal, Prof. Prem Kumar Het Ram, Shri

Dikshit, Shri Narsinghrao Hota, Shri Bhabani Shankar

Dinesh Singh, Shri Inder Jil, Shri

Dome, Dr. Ram Chandra Jaffer Sharief, Shri C.K.

Fernandes, Shri George Jag Pal Singh, Shri

Fernandez, Shri Joss Jai Parkash, Shri

Gaikwad, Shri Udaysingrao Nanasaheb Jamod, Shr Shashibhai

Gajapathi. Shri Gopi Nath Jangde, Shri Resham Lal

Gamit, Shri Chhitubhai Devjibhai Jaswant Singh, Shrl

Gandhi, Shrimati Manaka JataY, Shri Than Singh

Gandhi. Shri RajiY Jatiya, Shri Satynarayan

Gangadhar, Shri S. Jayamohan, Shri A

Gangwar, Shri Santoah Kumar Ja8varathtnam, Shri R.

Girl, Shri Sudhir Jena, Shri Stikanta 237 Const (68th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 238

Jha, Shri Bhogendra Mahabir Prasad, Shri

Jhikram, Shri Mohanlal Mahadlk, Shri Vamanrao

Jorawar Ram, Shri Mahajan, Shrimati Sum~ra

Joshi, Shri Dau Dayal Mahajan, Shri Y.S.

Kabda, Dr. Venkatash Mahala, Shri Haribhau Shankar

Kalka Das, Shri Mahata, Shri Chitta

Kalvi, Shri Kalyan Singh Mahato, Shri Shailendra

Kamble, Shri Arvind Tulst:iram Makkasar, Shri Shopat Singh

Kapsa, Prof. Ram Ganash Malhotra, Shri Vijay Kumar

Kataria, Shri Gulab Chand Malik, Shri Purna Chandra

Kaul, Shrirnati Sheila Malik, Shri Satya Pal

Kauishik, Shri Purushottam Mallik, Shri Mangaraj

Kashari Lal, Shri Mallika~un, Shri

Khalsa, Smt. Bimal Kaur Mandai, Shri Sanat Kumar

Khan, Haji G.M. Manjay Lal, Shri .

Khan, Shri Sukhendu Manvar, Shri Balvant

Khan, Shri JuHiquar Ali Marbaniang, Shri Peter G.

Khandelwal, Shri Pyarelal Masudal Hossain, Shri Syed

Khatique, Shri Shanker L&I Mayawati. Kumari

Khurana, Shri Madan Lal Meana, Dr. Kirodi Lal

Kirpal Singh, Shri Meana, Shri Nandlal

Kotadia, Shri Manubhai Meghwal, Shri Kailash

Krishna Kumar Shri S. Mehta, Shrimati Jayawanti Navinchan- dra Kumaramangalam, Shri P.R. Mawar, Shri Mahendra Singh

Kurien, Prof. P.J. Mirdha, Shrl Nathu Ram

Lodha, Shri Guman Mal Mishra, Shri 8aigopal 239 Canst (68th Amend.) MAY 30.1990 Bill 240

Mishra. Shri Janeshwar Pandeya, Dr. Laxmlnarayan

Mishra. Shri Raj Mangal Pani. Shri Ravi Narayan

Misra. Shri Satyagopal Panja, Shri Aj~

Mukhe~ee, Shrimati Geeta Panwar, Shri Harpal Singh

Mukhopadhyay. Shri A1JY Paranjpe, Shri Baburao

Muttan Singh, Chaudhary Paraste, Shri Dalpat Singh

Munda, Shri Karia Paswan, Shri Chhedl

Munjare, Shri Kankar Paswan, Shri Ram V:las

Muraleedharan, Shri K. Paswan, Shri Sukdeo

Murthy, Shri M.V. Chandra Shekara Patel, Dr. A.K.

Muthiah, Shri R. Patel, Shri Arjunbhai

Naik, Shri Ram Patel, Shri Maganbhai Manibhai

Nandi, Shri Yellaiah Patel. Shri Natubhai M.

Narayanan, Shri P.G. Patel, Shri Prahlad Singh

Nathu Singh, Shri Patel, Shri Ram Pujan

Nayak, Shri Nakul Patel, Shri Somabhai

Negi, Shri C.M. Pathak, Shri Harin

Netam, Shri Arvind Patidar, Shri Rameshwar

NHish Kumar, Shri Patil, Shri Balasaheb Vikha

Odeyar, Shri Channaiah Patil, Shri Basavaraj

Oraon, Shrimati Sumati Pati, Shri Uttamrao

Pacherwal, Shri Gopal Patil, Shri Uttamrao lakmanrao

Pal, Shri M.S. Patnaik, Shri Sivaji

Pal, Shri Rupchand Paul, Shri R. Mantosh

Pande, Shri Rajmangal Panchalliah, Shri P.

Pandey. Prof. Yadu Nath Peru man, Dr. P. Vallal 241 Const. (68th Am9nd.) JYAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) Bill 242

Phundkar, Shri Bhaoosaheb Pundlik Rana, Shri Kashiram Chhabildas

Potdukhe, Shri Shantaram Ranga, Prof. M.G.

Prabhu, Shri R. Rao, Shri J. Chokka

Pradhani, Shri K. Rao, Shri K.S.

Pramani~ Shri Radhika Aanjan Rao, Shri R. Gundu

Prasad, Shri Han Kewal Rao. Shri Srinivas

Prasad, Shri A.S. Rasheed Masood, Shrl

Prasad, Shri V. Sreenivasa Rathva, Shri Narayanbhai Jamlabhai

Pram Pracieep, Shri Rathod, Shri Uttam

Puroh~. Shri Banwarilal Rathor, Dr. Bhagwan Dass

Raghavji. Shri Rawat, Shri Harish

Rai, Shn, M. Ramanna Rawat, Prof. Rasa Singh

Rajdev Singh, Shri Ray, Dr. Sudhir

Raje, Shrimati Vasundhara Raychaudhuri, Shri Sudarsan

Raju, Shri Bh. Vijayakumar Reddy, Shri A. Venkata

Raju, Shri M.M. Pallam Reddy, Shri Kotla Vijaya Bhaskara

Rajveer Singh, Shri Reddy, Shri M.G.

Ram Babu, Shri A.G.S. Reddy, Shri P. Narsa

Ram Ohan, Shri Reddy, Shri R. Surender

Ram Prakash, Ch. Reddy, Shri Rajamohan

Ram Sagar, Shri (Bara Banki) Routray, Shri Nilamani

Ram Sagar, Shri (Saidpur) Roy, Shri A.K.

Ram Sajlwan, Shri Roy, Shri Haradhan

Ram Singh, Shri Roypradhan, Shri Amar

Ramakrishna, Shri V. Sahay, Shri Subodh Kant

Ramamurthy, Shri K. Sai, Shri A. Laran; 243 Const. (68th Amend.) MAYlO,1990 Bill 244

Sal, Shri Nand Kumar Shastri. Shri Yamuna Prasad

Saini, Shri Gurdial Singh Shekhada, Shri Govindbhai Kanjibhai

Sah, Shri Ibrahim Sulaiman Shingada. Shri D.B.

Sanyal, Shri Manik Shiwankar, Prot. Mahadeo

Saran, Shri Daulat Ram Shrivastava, Dr. Shailendranath

Saroj, Shri Sarju Prasad Shukla. Shri Vidyacharan

Sartaj Singh, Shri Sidnal, Shri S.B.

Sarwar Hussain, Shri Silvera. Dr. C.

Sathe, Shri Vasant Singam, Shri Basavapunnaiah

Save, Shri Moreshwar Singh. Shri Ajay

Sayaad, Shri Mufti Mohammad Singh, Shri Dhanraj

Scindia, Shrimt ~i Vijayaraje Singh, Shrl Har Govind

Sekhar. Shri M.G. Singh, Shri Hari Kishora

Selvam, Shri Kanci Panneer Singh, Shri Jagannath

Selvarasu, Shri M. Singh, Shri K. Manvendra

Shah, Shri Babubhai Meghjl Singh, Shri L.V.

Shah, Shri Jayantilal Virchandbhai Singh, Shri Lokendra

Shakeelur Rehman. Dr. Singh, Shri Mandhata

Shakya, Dr. Mahadeapak Singh Singh. Prof. N. Tomb;

Shakya. Shri Ram Singh Singh, Shri Pratap

Shankaranand, Shri B. Singh, Shri Ram Bahadur

Shanmugam, Shri P. Singh, Shri Radha Mohan

Sharma. Shri Chiranj! Lal Singh, Shri Ram Narash

Sharma, Shri Dharm Pal Singh, Shri Ram Prasad

Shastri, Shri Ani! Singh, Shrl Ramdas

Shastri, Shri Kapil Oev Singh, Shri Sukhendra 245 Const. (68th Amtmd.) JVAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) SOl 246

Singh, Shri Surya Narayan Uma Sharatl, Kumari

Singh. Shri lej Narayan Umbrey. Shri Laeta

Singh, Shri Uday Pratap Unnikrishnan. Shri K.P.

Singh, Shri Vishwanath Pratap Vaghela, Shri Shankersinh

Singh Oeo, Shri A.N. Varma, Shri Dharmesh Prasad

Sinha, Shrimati Usha Varma. Shri Ratilal Kalidas

Sodhi, Shri Mankuram Varma, Shrl S.C.

Solanki, Shri Surajbhanu Vekaria. Shri S.N.

Sonkar, Shri Kalpnath Verma, Shri Phool Chand

Soren. Shri Shibu Verma. Shri R.L.P.

Soz. Prof. Saif-ud-din Verma, Shri Shea Sharan

SUbedar. Shri Verma. Shri Upendra Nath

Sucha Singh, Baba Verma. Shrimati Usha

Sunanpuri, Shri K.D. Vijayaraghavan, Shri A.

Sundararaj, Shri N. Viswanatham. Dr.

Tandel. Shri D.J. Wadiyar, Shrl Srikanta Datta Narasimha Raja Tarif Singh. Shri Vadav, Shri Chhotey Singh Tarwala. Shri Amratlal Vallabhdas Yadav, Shri Chun Chun Prasad Taslimudin. Shri Yadav. Shri Devendra Prasad Thakore. Shri Gabbhaji Mangaji Yadav, Shri Hukumdeo Narayan Thambi Durai, Dr. Yadav. Shri Janardan Thapa Shri Nandu Yadav, Shri Kallash Nath Singh Thomas, Prof. K.V. Yadav, Shri Mitra Sen

Thungon, Shri P.K. Vadav, Shri Ram Krishan

Tiwari, Shri Brij Bhushan Yadav, Shri Ramendra Kumar Ravi

Tyagi, Shri K.C. Yadav. Dr. S.P. 247 Const. (68th Amend.) Bill MAY 30,1990 Const. (66th Amend.) Bill 248

Yaelav, Shri Satyapal Singh 17.08 hra..

Yadav, Shri Sharad WELCOME TO SHRI S. SOlRZ. CHAIR· MAN OF THE FOREIGN AFFAIRS Yadav, Shri Surya Narayan COMMITIEES OF THE U.S. CONGRESS

Yadava, Shri Ramjilal [Eng/ish]

Yadvendra, Datt, Shri MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Han. Mem- bers, I have to make an announcement. Shri Yazdani, Dr. Golam S. Solarz. Chairman of the Foreign Affairs Committee of the U.S. Congress is on a visit Yuvraj, Shri to our country on invitation of the Govern- ment of India as our honoured guest. He is Zainal Abedin, Shri not seated in the Special Box. I, on behaH of the House and on my own behalf, extend him NOES and his colleagues our warmest felicitations and hope they will enjoy their stay in our * Dore, Shri Raja Ambanna Kayak country.

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Subject to We would wish to convey through him "correction, the resu~ of the division is: our greetings to the Government and the friendly people of the United States. Ayes 385

Noes 001 17.10 hrs. The motion is carried by a majority of the total membership of the House and by a CONSTITUTION (SIXTY-SIXTH AMEND- majority of not less than two-third of the MENT) BILL - CONTO. members present and voting. [English) The Bill, as amended, is passed by the . requisite majority, in accordance with the MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Before I put provisions of Article 368 of the Constitution. the motion for consideration of the Constitu- tion (Sixty-Sixth Amendment) Bill to vote, this being a Constitution Amendment Bill, Th9 motion was adopted voting ha's to be by Division. _.. " - Let the Lobbies be cleared.

·Wrongly voted for Noes.

~ * *The following Members also recorded t!'leir votes:

Ayes:

Shri Dilip Singh Ju Deo, Shri K. Ramamohan Rao, Smt. Subhashini Ali, Shri Sukhdao Nandji Kale, Shri Tar~ Baran Topdar, Shri Chandresh Patel, Shri Mohammad Shafi, Shri Jagdish Singh Kushwaha, Kumari Kamalji Karenddula, Shri Raja Ambanna Nayak Oore, Shri K.R. Narayan, Shri Ramlal Rahi. 249 Const. (66th Amsnd.) JYAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) Bill 250

Now the lobbies are cleared. The ques- Bala, Dr. Asim tion is: Balaraman, Shri L. "That the Bill further to amend the Constutution of India, be taken into consid- Banatwalla. Shri G.M. eration." Banera, Shri Hamendra Singh The Lole Sabha Divided aankhele, Shri Kisanrao Baburao AYES Bansi Lal, Shri Division No. 12 Barman, Shri Palas 17.12 hrs. Basu, Shri Anil Achana, Shri Basudeb Basu. Shri Chitta Advani, Shri L.K. Beg, Shri Yusuf Agarwal, Shri J.P. Bega Ram, Shri Agnihotri, Shri Rajendra Behera, Shri Bhajaman Aher, Dr. Daulatrao Sonuji Bengafi Singh, Dr. Ahmed, Shri Anwar Benjamin, Shri S. Ahmed, Shri Kamlauddin Bhagat, Shri H.K.L Ajit Singh, Shri Bhagey Gobardhan, Shri Ali, Shrimati Subhashini Bhajan Lal, Shri Arnat, Shri D. Bhardwaj, Shri Paras ram Anbarasu, Shri Era Bhargava, Shri Girdhari Lal Antulay, Shri A.R. Bhartiya, Shri Santosh Argal, Shri Chhaviram Bhatia, Shri Ram Sewak Arunachalam Shri M. Bhattacharya, Srimati Malinl Asokaraj, Shri A. Bhattacharya, Shri Nani Athithan, Shri Dhanuskodi R. Bhoale, Shri Pratap RIO Baburao Baig, Shti Arif

Bais, Shri Ramesh Bimal Kaur, Shrimati

Baitha, Shri Mahendra Birender Singh, Rae 251 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 252

Bopche, Dr. Khushal Parasram Oeshmukh, Shri Anantrao

Brahmbhatt, Shri Prakash Koko Deshmukh, Shri Chandubhai

Bulara, Shrimati Rajinder Kaur Deshmukh. Shri Sudam Dattatrya

Chakravorty, Shri Susanta Dev, Shri Sontosh Mohan

Chand Ram, Shri Devi Lal, Shri

Chandra Shekhar, Shri Dhakane. Shri Babanrao

Chandrasekhar, Shrimati M. Dhankhar, Ch. Jagdeep

Charles, Shri A. Dhawan, Shri Harmoha(l

Chatterji, Shri Somnath Dhumal, Prof. Prem Kumar

Chaudhary, Shri Ishwar Dikshit, Shri Narsinghrao

Chaudhary, Shri Rudrasen Dinesh Singh, Shri Dore, Shri Raja Ambanna Nayak Chaudhary, Shri Kamal Fernandes, Shri George Chauhan, Shri Prabhatsinh Fernandez, Shri Joss Chavan, Shrimati Premalabai Gaikwad, Shri Udaysingrao Nanasaheb Chavda, Shri Khemchanbhai Somabhai Gajapathi, Shri Gopi Nath Chaudhary, Shri Lokanath Gamit. Shri Chhitubhai Devjibhai Choudhury, Sh'N Saifuddin Gandhi, Shrimati Maneka Chowdhary, Shri Dasai Gandhi, Shri Rajiv Dandavate, Prof. Madhu Gangadhar, Shri S. Danwe, Shri Pundlik Hari Gangwar, Shri Santosh Kumar Das, Shri Anadi Charan Giri, Shri Sudhir Dasgupts, Dr. Biplab Gomange, Shri Giridhar Datta, Shri Amal Gounder. Shri A.S. Delkar. Shri Mohanbhai Sanjibhai Gujral, Shri I.K.

Dennis, Shri N. Gupta, Shri Dharmpal Singh

Deara, Shri Murll Gupta, Shri Indrajit 253 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 254

Gupta, Shri Janak Raj Kabde, Dr. Venkatesh

Handoo, Shri Piyare Lal Kale Shri Sukhdeo Nandaji

Hannan Mollah, Shri Kalka Oas, Shri

Hansda, Shri Matilal Kalvi, Shri Kalyan Singh

Harish Pal, Shri Kamble, Shri Arvind Tulshiram

Harsh Vardhan, Shri Kapse, Prof. Ram Ganesh

Heara Bhai, Shri Kareddula, Kumari Kamalaji

Het Ram, Shri Kataria, Shri Gulab Chand

Hota, Shri Bhabani Shankar Kaul, Shrimati Sheila

Inder Jit, Shri Kaushik, Shri Purushottam

Jaffer Sharief, Shri C.K. Keshari Lal, Shri

Jag Pal Singh, Shri Khan, Haji G.M.

Jai Prakash, Shri Khan, Shri Sukhendu

Jamod, Shri Shashibhai Khan, Shri Ju~iquar Ali

Jangde, Shri Resham Lal Khandelwal, Shri pyarelal

Jaswant Singh, Shri Khatique, Shri Shanker Lal

Jatav, Shri Than Singh Khurana, Shri Madan Lal

Jatiya, Shri Satynarayan Kirpal Singh, Shri

Jayamohan, Shri A. Kotadia, Shri Manubhai

Jeevarathinam, Shri A. Kumaramangalam, Shr; P.R.

Jena, Shri Srikanta Kurien, Prof. P.J.

Jha, Shri Bogendra Lodha, Shri Guman Mal

Jhikram, Shri Mohanlal Mahabir Prasad, Shri

Jorawar Ram, Shri Mahadik, Shri Vamanrao

Joshi. Shri Dau Dayal Mahajan, Shrimati Sumitra

Ju Oeo, Shri Oilip Singh Uahajan, Shri Y.S. 255 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 256

Mahaie, Shri Haribhau Shankar Mukherjee, Shrimati Geeta

Mahata, Shri Chitta Mukhopadhyay, Shri Ajoy

Mahato, Shri Shailendra Mu~an Singh, Chaudhary

Makkasar, Shri Shopat Singh Munda, Shri Govinda Chandra

Malhotra, Shri Vijay Kumar Munda, Shri Karia

Malik, Shri Purna Chandra Munjare. Shri Kankar

Malik, Shri Satya Pal Muraleedharan, Shri K.

Mallik, Shri Mangaraj Murthy, Shri M.V. Chandra Shekara

Mallikarjun, Shri Muthiah, Shri R.

Mandai, Shri Sanat Kumar Naik, Shri Ram

Manjay Lal. Shri Nandi, Shri Yellaiah

Mantosh, Shri Paul A. Narayanan, Shri K.R.

Manvar, Shri Balvant Narayanan, Shri P.G.

Masudal Hossain. Shri Syed Nathu Singh, Shri

Mayawati, Kumari Nayak, Shri Nakul

Meena, Dr. Kirodi Lal Negi, Shri C.M.

Meena. Shri Nandlal Netam. Shri Arvind

Meghwal, Shri Kailash Nitish Kumar, Shri

Mehta, Shrimati Jayawanti Navinchan- Odeyar, Shri Channaiah dra Oraon, Shrimati Sumati Mewar, Shri Mahendra Singh Pacherwal, Shri Gopal Mirdha, Shri Nathu Ram Pal, Shri M.S. Mishra, Shri 8algopal Pal, Shri Rupchand Mishra, Shri Janeshwar

Mishra, Shri Raj Mangal Pande, Shri Rajmangal

Misra, Shri Satyagopal Pandey. Prof. Yadu Nath

Mohammad Shati, Shri Pandeya, Dr. Laxminarayan 257 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 258

Pani, Shri Ravi Narayan Prasad, Shri Harl Kawai

Panja, Shri Ajn Prasad, Shri R.S.

Panwar, Shri Harpal Singh Prasad, Shri V. Sreenivasa

Paranjpe, Shri Baburao Prem Pradeep, Shri

Paraste, Shri Dalpat Singh Purohit, Shri Banwarilal

Paswan, Shri Chhedi Raghavji, Shri

Paswan, Shri Ram Vilas Ral, Shri, M. Ramanna

Paswan, Shn Sukdeo Rajdev Singh, Shri

Patel, Dr. A.K. Raje, Shrimati Vasundhara

Patel, Shri Chandesh Raju, Shri Bh. Vijayakumar

Patel, Shri Natubhal M. Aaju, Shri M.M. Pallam

Patel, Shri Prahlad Singh Rajveer Singh, Shrt

Patel, Shri Ram Pujan Ram Babu, Shri A.G.S.

Patel, Shri Somabhai Ram Ohan, Shri

Pathak, Shri Harin Ram Prakash, Ch.

Patidar, Shri Rameshwar Ram Sagar, Shrl (Bara Banki)

Patil, Shri Balasaheb Vikhe Ram Sagar, Shri (Saidpur)

Pati, Shri Uttamrao Ram Sajiwan, Shri

Patil, Shri Uttamrao Lakmanrao Ram Singh, Shri

Patnaik, Shn Sivaji Ramakrishna, Shri V.

Penchalliah, Shri P. Ramamurthy, Shri K.

Peruman, Dr. P. Vallal Rameshwar Prasad, Shri

Phundkar, Shri Bhaoosaheb Pundlik Rana, Shri Kashiram Chhabildas

Potdukhe, Shri Shantaram Ranga, Prof. N.G.

Pradhani, Shri K. Rao, Shri J. Chokka

Pramanik, Shri Radhika Ranjan RIO, Shri KS. 259 Const (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 260

Rao, Shri R. Gundu Saran, Shri Daulat Ram

Rao, Shri Srinlvas Saroj, Shri Sarju Prasad

Rasheed Masood, Shri Sartaj Singh. Shri

Rathva, Shri Narayanbhai Jamlabhai Sarwar Hussain, Shrl

Rathod, Shri Unam Sathe, Shri Vasant

Rathor, Dr. Bhagwan Oass Save, Shri Moreshwar

Rawat, Shri Harish Sayeed, Shri Mufti Mohammad

Rawat, Prof. Rasa Sing h Scindia, Shrimati Vijayaraje

Ray, Dr. Sudhir Sekhar, Shri M.G.

Raychaudhuri, Shri Sudarsan Selvam, Shri Kanci Paneer

Reddy, Shri A. Venkata Selvarasu, Shri M.

Reddy, Shri Kotla Vijaya Bhaskara Shah, Shri Babubhai Meghji

Redy, Shri M.G. Shah. Shri Jayantilal Virchandbhai

Reddy, Shri P. Narsa Shakeelur Rehman. Dr.

Reddy, Shri R. Surender Shakya, Dr. Mahadeepak Singh

Reddy, Shri Rajamohan Shakya, Shri Ram Singh

Routray, Shri Nilamani Shankaranand, Shri B.

Roy, Shri A.K. Shanmugam, Shri P.

Roy, Shri Haradhan Sharma, Shri Chiranji Lal

Roypradhan, Shri Amar Sharma, Shri Oharm Pal

Sahay, Shri Subodh Kant Shastri, Shri Anil

Sai, Shri A. Larang Shastri, Shri Kapil Dev

Sai, Shri Nand Kumar Shastri, Shri Yamuna Prasad

Saini, Shri Gurdial Singh Shekhada, Shri Govindbhai Kanjibhai

Sa", Shre Ibrahim Sulaiman Shingada, Shri o.B.

Sanyal, Shri Manik Shiwankar, Prof. Mahadeo 261 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) SRI 262

Shukla, 5hri Vidyacharan Sinha, Shrimati Usha

Sidna, Shri 5.B. Sodhi, Shri Mankuram

Silvera, Dr. C. Solanki, Shri Surajbhanu

Singam, Shri Basavapunnaiah Soren, Shri Shibu

Singh, Shri Dhanraj Soz. Prof. Saif-ud-din

Singh, Shri Har Govind Subedar, Shri

Singh, Shri Hari Kishora Sucha Singh, Baba

Singh, Shri Jagannath Suhanpuri, Shri K.D.

Singh, Shri K. Manvendra Sundararaj, Shri N.

Singh, Shri L. V. Tandel, Shri D.J.

Singh, Shri Mandhata Tarif Singh, Shri

Singh, Prof. N. Tombi Taslimudin, Shri

Singh, Shri Pratap Thakore, Shri Gabbhaji Mangaji

Singh, Shri Ram Bahadur Thambi Durai, Dr.

Singh, Shri Radha Mohan Thapa Shri Nandu

Singh, Shri Ram Narash Thomas, Prof. K.V.

Singh, Shri Ram Prasad Thungon, Shri P.K.

Singh, Shri Ramashray Prasad Tiwari, Shri Brij Bhushan

Singh, Shri Ramashray Prasad Tyagi, Shri K.C.

Singh, Shri Ramdas Uma Bharati, Kumari

Singh, Shri Sukhendra Umbrey, Shri Laeta

Singh, Shri Surya Narayan Unnikrishnan, Shri KP.

Singh, Shri Tej Narayan Vaghela, Shri Shankersinh

Singh, Shri Uday Pratap Varma, Shri Dharmesh Prasad

Singh, Shri Vishwanath Pratap Varma, Shri RatUal Kalidas

Singh Dea, Shri A.N. Varma, shri S.C. 263 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 264

Vekaria, Shri S.N. Vadav, Shri Surya Narayan

Verma, Shri Phool Chand Yadava, Shri Ramjllal

Verma, Shri R.L.P. Yadvendra, Datt, Shri

Verma, Shri Sheo Sharan Yazdani, Dr. Golam

Verma, Shri Upendra Nath Yuvraj, Shri

Verma, Shrimati Usha Zainal Abedin, Shri

Vijayaraghavan, Shri A. NOES

Viswanatham, Dr.

Wadiyar, Shri Srikanta Datta Narasimha Nil Raja MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Subject to Yadav, Shri Chhotey Singh ·correctioo, the result of the Division is:

Vadav, Shri Chun Chun Prasad Ayes 386

Vadav, Shri Devendra Prasad Noes o

Vadav, Shri Hukumdeo Narayan The motion is carried by a majority of the total membership of the House and by a Vadav, Shri Janardan majority of not less than two-thirds of the Members present and voting. Vadav, Shri Kailash Nath Singh The motion was adopted Vadav. Shri Mitra Sen MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Now, there Vadav, Shri Aam Krishan are amendments to Clause 2 of the Bill. One amendment is in the name of Shri Somnath Vadav, Shri Aamendra Kumar Aavi Chatterje9. There is Government amendment moved by the hon. Minister, Shri Upen- Vadav, Dr. S.P. dra Nath Verma. Now, Mr. Upendra Nath Verma please move his amendment. Vadav, Shri Satyapal Singh Clause 2 Amendment of the Ninth Sched- Vadav, Shri Sharad ule

* The following Members also recorded their votes for Ayes:

Shri Bal Gopal Mishra, Shri Kalpnath Sonkar, Shri Basavar8J Patil, Shri Amratlal Vallabhdas Tarwala, Shri Lokendra Singh, Shn Arjunbhai Patel, Shri K. Ramamohan Rao, Shri Nirmal Kanti Chatterjee, Dr. Shailendranath Shrivastava, Shri Janardan Tiwari, Shri Tar" Baran Topdar, Shri Manoranjan Sur, Shri Jagdish Singh Kushwaha, Shri Raj Ambanna Nayak Oore. 265 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 266

[ Translation] was withheld. Then after this Government came to power, the assent has been given. THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE Now, ~ has become the law and as soon as DEPARTMENT OF RURAL DEVELOP- it has become the law, it has been chal- MENT IN THE MINISTRY OF AGRICUL- lenged in the Calcutta High Court saying that TURE (SHRI UPENDRA NATH VERMA): I this is ultra vires the Constitution. beg to move: Now, a legislation for public interest for "Page 2, line 4, - public benefit is being challenged for no omH ("Chapter VII - A Sections 49 reason because of the greed of the land- to 49)" (4) lords. They want to make the acquisition as part of property which the Government re- [English] quire for public purposes impossible to be achieved. Now, that law has to be protected. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: The This Ninth Schedule contains also the Land question is: Acquisition Act, in item No. 194. Kindly see "Page 2, lines 7 and 8,- Item No. 194. Bihar Land Acquisition Act is omit "(Chapter VII-A-sections 49 AA part of this Ninth Schedule-Item 194. Then to 49)" (4) why this law which also provides for land acquisition for puboic purpose-it is not for The motion was adopted private benefit; for public purpose a legisla- SHRI SOMNATH CHATTERJEE tion is being made, that is being challenged. (Bolpur): I beg to move: I request the hon. Minister, I was a little late "Page 4,- in reminding him, probably that should not be "258. The Land acquisition (West ben- the reason for rejecting it. It should be re- gal Amendment) Act, 1986." (3) jected or accepted on merits. Just becuase Sir, there are several provisions and somebody has shaken his head from some legislations regarding the Land Acqustion by distance indicating 'Please don't do that', it the State for purposes of public benefit. should not be rejected, it should be ac- Now-a-days, there are muni-storeyed build- cepted, and I request the hon. Minister: ings. They are huge properties. If the Gov- Please don't say 'no' without knowing it, not ernment wants one flat or portion of a build- like that. The previous governm~nt used to ing to be acquired for the purposes of State reject our amendments without reading them. or for public purposes, that cannot be done Therefore, I would request you ... (Interrup- because of the existing land Acqusition Act tions). The Minister is here, please tell him. Section 49 which prohibits part acquisition It will not go against anybody's Interest, I can unless the consent is given by the owner to assure you. part acquisition, if the owner insists that the (Interruptions) entire building has to be acquired, whether Government wan'ts one flat or two flats, it THE PRIME MINISTER (SHRI VISH- cannot be acquired. Now, this is misused. In WANATH PRATAP SINGH): We Wilt con- West Bengal, it has happened in Calcutta sider it. This is not for flats, this is for land- that for the purpose of a Government body lords. one flat has been acquired, but the landlord insisted that the entire property should be [ Translation] acquired, otherwise it cannot be granted. Now, in view of the previous law. the High THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE Court said that partial acquisition cannot be DEPARTMENT OF AURAL DEVELOP- permitted. The eitire huge house costing MENT IN THE MINISTRY OF AGRICUL- crores of rupees will have to be acquired for TURE (SHRI UPENDRA NATH VERMA): the purpose of only one flat. Then the West Now you are requested to withdraw it. We Bengal Government amended the Land will considored it later on. Acquisition Act for part acquisition without SHAI SOMNATH CHAmRJEE: Will the owner's consent. In 1986, the Bill was you consider it after the adjou rnm ent? (Inter- passed. Mr. Rajiv Gandhi Government never ruptions) gave their assent for four years. The assent Alright. consider it sympathetically. 267 Const. f66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 268

[English] Antualay, Shri A. R. Argal, Shri Chhaviram MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Do you like to w~hdraw your amendment? Arunachalam Shri M. SHRt SOMNATH CHA lTERJEE: I seek leave of the House to withdraw my amend- Asokaraj, Shri A. ment NO.3 in view of the Prime Minister's Athlthan, Shri Dhanuskodi R. assurance. Baig, Shri Arif MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Is hthe pleasure of the House that the amar.dment moved Bais, Shri Ramesh by Shri Somnath Chatterjee be withdrawn? Baitha, Shri Mahendra SEVERAL HON MEMBERS; Yes. Bala, Dr. Asim Balaraman, Shri L. Amendment No.3 was, by leave, withdrawn Banatwalla, Shri G.M.

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Before I put Banera, Shri Hamendra Singh clause 2, as amended, to the vote of the Bankhele, Shri Kisanrao Baburao House. this being a constitution (Amend- ment) Bill, voting has to be by division. Bansi Lal, Shri Barman, Shri Palas I am informed that the lobbies are already cleared. Now. I put clause 2, as Basu, Shri Anil amended, to the vote of he House. Basu, SHr Chitta MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: The question Beg, Shri Yusuf is: Bega Ram, Shri H"fhat clause 2. as amended, stand part of the Bill." Behera, Shri Bhajaman Bengali Singh, Dr. Th9 Lok Sabha divided AYES Benjamin .. Shri S. Bhagat. Shri H.K.L. Division No. 13 Bhagey Gobardhan, Shri 17.25 hr •. Bhajan Lal, Shri Acharia. Shri Basudeb Bhardwaj, Shri Paras ram Advani, Shri L.K. Bhargava, Shri Girdhari Lal Agarwal, Shri J.P. Bhartiya, Shri Santosh Agnihotri, Shri Rajendra Bhatia, Shri Ram Sewak Aher. Dr. Daulatrao Sonujl Bhattacharya, Srimati Malini Ahmed. Shri Anwar Bhattacharya, Shri Nani Ajit Singh. Shri Bhosle, Shri Prataprao Baburao AU, Shrimati Subhashini Bimal Kaur, Shrimati Amat, Shri O. Anbarasu. Shri Era Birender Singh, Rao 269 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 270

Bopche, Dr. Khushal Parasram Deshmukh. Shri Sudam Dattatrya

Bulara, Shimati Rajinder Kaur Dev, Shri Sontosh Mohan

Chakravorty, Shri Susanta Devi Lal, Shri

Chand Ram, Shri Dhakane, Shri Babanrao

Chandra Shekhar, Shri Dhankhar. Ch. Jagdeep

Charles, Shri A. Dhawan, Shri Harmohan

Chatterjee, Shri Nirmal Kanti Dhumal, Prof. Prem Kumar

Chatterji, Shri Somnath Dikshit, Shri Narsinghrao

Chaudhary, Shri Ishwar Dinesh Singh, Shri

Chaudhary, Shri Kamal Dome, Dr. Ram Chandra

Chauhan, Shn Prabhatsinh Dare, Shri Raja Ambanna Nayak

Chavan, Shrimati Premalabai Fernandes, Shri George

Chavda, Shri Khemchanbha, Somabhai Fernandez, Shri Joss

Chaudhary, Shn Lokanath Gaikwad, Shri Udaysingrao Nanasaheb

Choudhury, Shn Saifuddin Gajapathi, Shri Gopi Nath

Chowdhary, Shri Dasai Gamit, Shri Chhitubhai Devjibhai

Dandavate, Prof. Madhu Gandhi. Shrimati Maneka

Danwe, Shri Pundlik Hari Gandhi. Shri Aajiv

Dss, Shri Anadi Charan Gangadhar, Shri S.

Dasgupta, Dr. Biplab Gangwar, Shri Santosh Kumar

Datta, Shri Amal Gavit, Shri Manikrao Hodlya

Delkar, Shri Mohanbhai Sanjibhal Gomango, Shri Giridhar

Dennis, Shri N. Gounder, Shri A.S.

Deora, Shri Murli Gujral, Shri I. K.

Deshmukh, Shri Anatnrao Gupta, Shri Dharmpal Singh

Deshmukh, Shn Chandubhai Gupta, Shri Indrajit 271 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 272

Gupta, Shri Janak Raj Kabde. Dr. V~nkatesh

Handoo, Shri Piyare Lal Kale. Sukhdeo Nandaji

Hannan Mollah, Shri Kalka Das, Shri

Hansda. Shri Matilal Kalvi, Shri Kalyan Singh

Harish Pal, Shri Kamble, Shri Arvind Tulshiram

Harsh Vardhan, Shri Kapsa, Prof. Ram Ganesh

Heara Bhai, Shri Kareddula, Kumari Kamalji

Hat Ram, Shri Kataria, Shri GuJab Chand

Hota, Shri Bhabani Shankar Kaul, Shnmati Sheila

Inder Jlt, Shri Kauishlk. Shri Purushottam

Jaffer Sharief, Shri C.K. Keshari Lal. Shri

Jag Pal Singh, Shri Khan, Haji G.M.

Jai Prakash. Shri Khan, Shri Sukhendu

Jamod. Shri Shashibhai Khan, Shri Zulfiquar Ali

Jangde. Shri Resham Lal Khandelwal, Shrj Pyarelal

Jaswant Singh. Shri Khatique, Shri Shanker Lal

Jatav, Shri Than Singh Khurana, Shri Madan Lal

. Jatiya, Shri Satynarayan Kirpal Singh, Shri

Jayamohan. Shri A. Kotadia, Shri Manubhai

Jeevarathinam, Shri R.

Jana, Shri Srikanta Kumaramangalam, Shri P.R.

Jha, Shri Bhogendra Lodha. 5hn Guman Mal

Jhikram, Shri Mohan Lal Mahabir Prasad, Shri

Jorawar Ram, Shri Mahadik. Shri Vamanrao

Joshi. Shri DIu Dayal Mahajan, Shrimati Sumitra

Ju Dea, Shri Dilip Singh Mahajan. Shri Y.S. 273 'Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) Bill 274

Mahala, 'Shri Haribhau Shankar Mukherjee, Shrimati Geeta

Mahata, Shri Ch~ta Mukhopadhyay, Shri Ajoy

Mahato, Shri Shailendra Multan Singh, Chaudhary

Makkasar, Shri Shopat Singh Munda, Shri Karia

Malhotra, Shri Vijay Kumar Munjare, Shri Kankar

Malik, Shri Purna Chandra Muraleedharan, Shri K.

Malik, Shri Sa~~.pal Murthy, Shri M. V. Chandra Shakara

Mallik, Shri Mangaraj Naik, Shri Ram

Mallikarjun, Shri Nandi, Srh Yallaiah

Mandai, Shri Sanat Kumar Narayanan, Shri P.G.

Manjay Lal, Shri Nathu Singh, Shri

Manvar, Shri Balvant Nayak, Shri Nakul

Masuda' Hossain, Shri Syed Nagi, Shri C.M.

Mayawati, Kumar; Netam, Shri Arvind

Mayakar, Shri Gopalrao Nitish Kumar, Shri

Meana, Dr. Kirodi Lal Oraon, Shrimati Sumati

Meana, Shri Nandlal Pacherwal, Shri Gopal

Meghwal, Shri Kailash Pal, Shri M.S.

Mehta, Shrimati Jayawanti Navinchan- Pal, Shri Rupchand dra Pande, Shri Rajmangal Mewar, Shri Mahendra Singh Pandey, Prof. Yacfu Nath Mirdha, Shn Nathu Ram Pandeya, Dr. Laxminarayan Mishra, Shri Balgopal Pani, Shri Ravi Narayan Mishra, Shri Janeshwar Pan war, Shri Harpal Singh Mishra, Shri Raj Mangal Paranjpe, Shri Baburao Misra, Shri Satyagopal

Mohammad Shafi, Shri Paraste. Shri Oalpal Singh 275 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 276

Paswan, Shri Chhedi Prem Pradeep, Shri

Paswan, Shri Ram Vilas Puroh~, Shri Banwarilal

Paswan, Shri Sukdeo Raghavjl, Shri

Patel, Dr. A. K. Aahi. Shri Ramlal

Patel, Shri Chandresh Rai, Shri, M. Ramanna

Patel, Shri Natubhai M. Aajgev Singh, Shri

Patel, Shri Prahlad Singh Raje, Shrimati \ ':!~undhara

Patel, Shri Ram Pujan Raju, Shri Bn. Vijayakumar

Patel, Shri Somabhai Raju, Shri M.M. Pallam

Pathak, Shri Harin Rajveer Singh. Shri

Patidar, Shri Rameshwar Ram Babu, Shri A.G.S.

Patil, Shri Balasaheb Vikhe Ram Ohan, Shri

Patil, Shr; Basavaraj Ram Prakash, Ch.

Pati, Shri Uttamrao Ram Sagar. Shri (Bara Banki)

Patil, Shr; Uttamrao Lakmanrao Ram Sagar, Shri (Saidpur)

Patnaik, Shri Sivaji Ram Sajiwan, Shri

Paul. Shri R. Mantosh Ram Singh, Shri

Penchalliah, Shri P. Ramakrishna, Shri Y.

Peruman, Dr. P. Vallal Ramamurthy, Shri K.

Phundkar, Shri Bhaoosaheb Pundlik Rana, Shri Kashiram Chhabildas

Potdukhe, Shri Shantaram Ranga, Prof. N.G.

Pradhani, Shr; K. Rao, Shri J. Chokka

Pramanik, Shri Radhika Ranjan Rao, Shri K.S.

Prasad, Shri Hari Kawai Rao, Shri A. Gundu

Prasad, Shrl R.S. Rao, Shri Srinivas

Prasad, Shri V. Sreenivasa Rasheed Masood, Shri 277 Const. (66th Am8nd.) JYAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) 8ill 278

Rathva, Shri Narayanbhai Jamlabhai Sathe, Shri Vasant

Rathod, Shri Uttam Save, Shri Moreshwar

Rathor, Dr. Bhagwan Oass Sayeed, Shri Mufti Mohammad

Rawat, Shri Harish Scindia, Shrimati Vijayaraje

Rawat, Prof. Rasa Singh Sekhar, Shri M.G.

Ray, Dr. Sudhir Selvam, Shri Kana Paneer

Raychaudhuri, Shri Sudarsan Selvarasu, Shri M.

Reddy, Shri A. Venkata Shah, Shri Babubhai Meghji

Redy, Shri M.G. Shah, Shri Jayantilal Virchandbhai

Reddy, Shri P. Narsa Shakeelur Rehman. Dr.

Reddy, Shri R. Surender Shakya, Dr. Mahadeepak Singh

Reddy, Shri Rajamohan Shakya, Shri Ram Singh

Routray, Shri Nilamani Shankaranand, Shri B.

Roy, Shri A.K. Shanmugam, Shri P.

Roy, Shri Haradhan Shastri, Shri Anil

Roypradhan, Shri Amar Shastri, Shri Kapil Oev

Sahay, Shri Subodh Kant Shastri, Shri Yamuna Prasad

Sai, Shri A. Larang Shekhada, Shri Govindbhai Kanjibhaj

Sai, Shri Nand Kumar Shingada, Shri O.B.

Saini, Shri Gurdial Singh Shiwankar, Prof. Mahadeo

Sait, Shri Ibrahim Sulaiman Shrivastava, Dr. Shailendranath

Sanyal, Shri Manik Shukla, Shri Vidyacharan

Saran, Shri Oaulat Ram Sidnal. Shri S.B.

Saroj, Shri Sarju Prasad Silvera, Dr. C.

Sartaj Singh, Shri Singam. Shri Basavapunnaiah

Sarwar Hussain, Shri Singh, Shri Ajay 279 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY30,1990 Bt1I 280

Singh, Shri Dhanraj Subedar, Shri

Singh, Shri Har Govind Sunanpuri. Shri KD.

Singh, Shri Jagannath Sundararai. Shri N.

Singh, Shri K. Manvendra Sur, Shri tvtanoranjan

Singh, Shri L.V. Tandel, Shri D.J.

Singh, Shri Lokendra Tarif Singh, Shri

Singh, Shri Mandhata Tarwala, Shri Amratlal Vallabhdas

Singh, Prof. N. Tombi Taslimudin. Shri

Singh, Shri Pratap Thakore, Shri Gabbhaji tvtangaji

Singh, Shri Ram Bahadur Thambi Durai, Dr.

Singh, Shri Radha Mohan Thapa Shri Nandu

Singh, Shri Ram Naresh Thomas, Prof. K.V.

Singh, Shri Ram Prasad Thungon, Shri P.K.

Singh, Shri Ramdas Tiwari, Shri Brij Bhushan

Singh, Shri Sukhendra Tiwari, Shri Janardan

Singh, Shri Surya Narayan Tyagi, Shri K. C.

Singh, Shri Tej Narayan Umbrey, Shri Laeta

Singh, Shri Uday Pratap Unnikrishnan, Shri K.P.

Singh, Shri Vishwanath Pratap Vaghela, Shri Shankersinh

Singh Oeo, Shri A.N. Varma, Shri B. Rajarani

Sinha, Shrimati Usha Varma. Shri Dharmesh Prasad

Sodhi, Shri Mankuram Varma, Shri Ratilal Kalidas

Solanki, Shri Surajbhanu Varma, Shri S.C.

Sankar, Shri Kalpna1h Verma, Shri Phool Chand

Soren, Shri Shibu Verma, Shri R.L.P.

Soz. Prof. Saif-ud .. din Varma, Shri Sheo Sharan 281 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 282

Verma, Shri Upendra Nath Zalnal Abedln. Shrl

Verma, Shrimati ~sha NOES

Vljayaraghavan, Shri A. Nil

Wadiyar, Shri Srikanta Datta Narasimha MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Subjects to Raja *correction, the resuh of the division is:

Yadav, Shri Chhotey Singh Ayes: 376

Vada'l, Shrl Chun Chun Prasad Noes: 0

Vadav, Shri Devendra Prasad The motion is carried by majority of the total membership of the House and by a Yadav, Shri Hukumdeo Narayan majority of not less than two-thirds of the members present and voting. Vadav. Shri Janardan The motion was adopted Yadav, Shri Kailash Nath Singh Clause 2, as amend9d, was added to the Vadav. Shri Mitra Sen Bill

Vada", Shri Ram Krishan MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: There ;s an amendment by the Government to Clause 1. Yadav, Shri Ramandra Kumar Ravi Is Shri Upendra Nath Verma moving the amendment? Vadav, Dr. S.P. SHRI UPENDRA NATH VERMA: No. Yadav. Shri Satyapal Singh MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: The question Yadav, Shri Sharad is:

Yadav, Shri Surya Narayan l'That clause 1 stand part of the Bill".

Yadava, Shri Ramjilal The motion was adopted

Vadvendra, Datt, Shri Clause 1 was added to the Bill

Yazdani, Dr. Golam UR. DEPUTY SPEARER: The question is: Yuvraj, Shri

*The following Members recorded their votes for Ayes: Shri Hari Kishore Singh, Shri Anwar Ahmed, Shri Govinda Chandra Munda, Shri Prakash Koko Brahmbhatt, Shri Arjunbhai Patel, Shri K. Ramamohan Rae, Kum. Uma Bharati, Shri Rudra Sen Chaudhary, Shri Tar~ Baran Topdar, Shri S.N. Vekaria, Shri R. Muthiah, Shri Ramashray Prasad Singh, Shri Jagdish Singh Kushwaha, Smt. M. Chandrasekhar, Shri Kamaluddin Ahmed, Shri Channaiah Odeyar. Shri Darm Pal Sharma. Shri K. Vijaya Bhaskara Reddy, Shri K.R. Narayanan, Dr. Vishwanathan Kanithi. 283 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30,1990 Bill 284

"That the Enacting Formula and the Aher, Dr. Daulatrao Sonuji Long Thle stand part ot the Bill". Ahmed, Shri Kamaluddin The motion was adopted Ajit Singh, Shri The Enacting Formula and the Long Title were added to the Bill Ali, Shrimati Subhashini MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: The Minister may now move that the Bi", as amended, be Amat, Shri D. passed. Anbarasu, Shri Era ( Translation] Antulay, Shri A.A. THE MINISTER OF STATE IN THE DEPARTMENT OF RURAL DEVELOP- Argal, Shri Chhaviram MENT IN THE MINISTRY OF AGRICUL- TURE (SHRI UPENDRA NATH VERMA): I Arunachalam, Shri M. beg to move:

IIThat the Bill, as amended, be passed". Asokaraj, Shri A.

[English] Athithan, Shri Dhanuskodi R.

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Before I put Baig, Shri Arif the motion that the Bill, as amended, be passed, to the vote of the Housel this being Bais, Shri Ramesh a Const~ution (Amendment) Bill, voting has to be by division. The Lobbies are already Baitha, Shri Mahendra cleared.

The question is : Bala, Dr. Asim

IIThat the bill, as amended, b9 passed." Balaraman, Shri L.

The Lok Sabha divided Banatwalla, Shri G.M.

Banera, Shri Hamendra Singh AYES Bankhele, Shri Kisanrao Baburao Division No. 14 Bansi Lal, Shri 17.28 hr •• Barman, Shri Palas Acharia, Shri Basudeb Basu, Shri Anil Advani, Shri L.K. Basu, Shri Chitta Agarwal, Shri J.P.

Agnihotri, Shri Rajendra Beg, Shri Yusuf 285 Const. (66th Amend.) JY AISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) Bill 286

Bega Ram, Shri Chatterjee, Shri Nirmal Kanti

Sahera, Shri Bhajaman Chatterji, Shri Somnath

Bengali Singh, Dr. Chaudhary, Shri Ishwar

Benjamin, Shri S. Chaudhary, Shri Kamal

Bhagat, Shri H.K.L. Chauhan, Shri Prabhatsinh

Bhagey Gobardhan, Shr; Chavan, Shtimati PremaJabai

Bhajan Lal, Shri Chavda, Shri Khemchanbhai Somabhai

Bhardwaj, Shri Parasram Choudhury, Shrl Saifuddin

Bhargava, Shri Girdhari Lal Chowdhary, Shri Oasai

Bhartiya, Shri Santosh Oandavate, Prof. Madhu

Bhatia, Shri Ram Sewak Danw8, Shri Pundlik Hari

Bhattacharya. Srimati Malini Das. Shri Anadi Charan

Bhattacharya, Shri Nani Das, Shri Bhakta Charan

Bhosle, Shri Prataprao 8aburao Dasgupta, Dr. Biplab

Bimal Kaur. Shrimati Datta, Shri Amal

Sirender Singh, Rao Dslkar, Shri Mohanbai Sanjibhai

Bopche, Dr. Khushal Parasram Dennis, Shri N.

Brahmbhatt, Shri Prakash Koko Deara, Shri Murli

Bulara, Shrimati Rajinder Kaur Deshmukh, Shri Anantrao

Chakravorty, Shri Susanta Oeshmukh, Shri Chandubhai

Chand Ram, Shrl Deshmukh, Shri Sudan Dattatrya

Chandra Shekhar I Shri. Dev, Shri Sontoah Mohan

Chandrasekhar, Shrimati M. Oevl Lat, Shri

Chartes, Shri A. Ohakane. Shri Babanrao 287 Const. (66th Amend.) MAV30,1990 Bill 288

Dhankhar, ChI Jagdeep Hannan Mollah, Shri

Dhawan, Shri Harmohan Hansda, Shri MatUal

Dhumal, Prof. Prem Kumar Harish Pal, Shri

Dikshit, Shri Narsinghrao Harsh Vardhan, Shri

Dinesh Singh,Shri Heera Shai, Shri

Dome, Dr. Ram Chandra Hat Ram, Shri

Dor., Shri Raja Ambanna Nayak Hota, Shri Bhabani Shankar

Fernandes, Shri George lnder Jit, Shri

Fernandez, Shri Joss Jaffer Sharief, Shri C.K.

Gaikwad, Shri Udaysingrao Nanasaheb Jag Pal Singh, Shri

Gajapathi, Shri Gopi Nath Jamod, Shri Shashibhai

Gamit, Shri Chhitubhai Devjibhai Jangde, Shri Resham Lal

Gandhi, Shrimati Manaka JaStwant Singh, Shri

Gandhi, Shri Rajiv Jatav, Shn Than Singh

Gangadhar, Shri S. Jatiya, Shri Satynarayan

Gangwar, Shri Santosh Kumar Jayamohan, Shri A.

Giri, Shri Sudhir Jeevarathinam, Shri R.

Gamange, Shri GlrkJhar Jana, Shri Srikanta

Gounder, Shri A.S. Jha, Shri Bogendra

Gujral, Shri I. K. Jhikram, Shri Mohanlal

Gupta, Shri Dharmpal Singh Jorawar Ram, Shri

Gupta, Shri Indrajh Joshi, Shri Dau Dayal

Gupta. Shri Janak Raj Ju Deo, Shri DUip Singh

Handoo, Shri Piyare Lal Kabde, Dr. Venkatesh 89 Con.t (66th Amend.) JVAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) 861 290

Kale, Shri Sukhdeo Nandaj; Mahala, Shri Harlbhau Shankar

Kalka Das, Shri Mahata, Shri Chitta

Kalvi, Shri Kalyan Singh Mahato, Shri Shailtndra

Kamble, Shri Arvind Tulshiram Makkasar, Shri Shopat Singh

Kapsa, Prof. Ram Ganesh Malhotra, Shri Vijay Kumar

Kareddula, Kumari Kamalaji Malik, Shri Purna Chandra

Kataria, Shri Gulab Chand Malik, Shri Satya Pal

Kaul, Shrimati ShaUa Mallik, Shri Mangaraj

Kauishik, Shri Purushottam Mallikarjun, Shri

Kashari Lal, Shri Mandai, Shri Sanat Kumar

Khan, Haji G.M. Manjay lal, Shrl

Khan, Shri Sukhendu Manvar, Shri Balvant

Khan, Shri Zulfiquar Ali Masudal Hossain, Shri Syed

Khandelwal, Shri Pyarelal Mayawati, Kumari

Khatiqua, Shri Shanker Lal Mayakar, Shri Gopalrao

Khurana, Shri Madan lal Meena, Dr. Kirodi Lal

Kirpal Singh, Shr; Meena, Shri Nandlal

Kotadia, Shri Manubhai Meghwal, Shri Kailash

Kumaramanglam, Shri P.R. Mehta, Shrimati Jayawanti Navinchan· dra Lodha, Shri Guman Mal Mewar, Shrj Mahendra Singh Mahabir, Prasad, Shri Mirdha, Shri Nathu Ram Mahadik, Shri Vamanrao Mishra, Shr; Balgopal Mahajan, Shrimati Sumitra Mishra, Shri Janeshwar

Mahajan, Shri Y.S. Mishra. Shrl Raj, MangaJ 291 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30.1990 Bill 292

Misra. Shri Satyagopal Panda, Shri Rajmangal

Mukherjee, Shrimati Geeta Pandey, Prof. Vadu Nath

Mukhopadhyay, Shri Ajoy Pandeya, Dr. Laxminarayan

Multan Singh, Chaudhary Pani, Shri Ravi Narayan

Munda, Shri Govinda Chandra Panwar, Shri Harpal Singh

Munda, Shri Karia Paranjpe, Shri Baburao

Munjare, Shri Kankar Paraste, Shri Dalpat Singh

Muraleedharan. Shri K. Paswan, Shri Chhedi

Murthy, Shri M.V. Chandra Shakara Paswan, Shri Ram Vilas

Muthiah, Shri R. Paswan, Shri Sukdeo

Naik, Shri Ram Patel, Dr. A.K.

Nandi, Shri Yellaiah Patel, Shri Arjunbhai

Narayanan. Shri K.R. Patel, Shri Chandresh

Narayanan, Shri P.G. Patel, Shri Natubhai M.

Nathu Singh, Shri Patel, Shri Prahlad Singh

Nayak, Shri Nakul Patol, Shri Ram Pujan

Negi, Shri C.M. Patel, Shri Somabhai

Netam, Shri Arvind Pathak, Shri Harin

Nitish Kumar, Shri Patidar, Shri Rameshwar

Odeyar, Shri Channaiah Patil, Shri Balasaheb Vikhe

Oraon, Shrmati Sumati Patil. Shri Basavaraj

Pacherwal, Shri Gopal Patil, Shri Uttamrao

Pal, Shri M.S. Pati! Shri Uttamrao Lakmanrao

Pal, Shri Rupchand Patnaik, Shri Sivaji 293 Const. (66th Amend.) JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Bill 294

Paul, Shri R. Mantosh Ram Sagar, Shri (Saidpur)

PenchaJliah, Shri P. Ram Sajiwan, Shri

Peruman" Dr. P. Vallal Ramakrishna, Shri Y.

Phundkar, Shri Bhaoosaheb Pundlik Ramamurthy, Shr K.

Potdukhe, Shri Shantaram Aana, Shri Kashiram Chhabildas

Pradhani, Shri K. Ranga, Prof. N.G.

Pramanik, Shri Radhika Ranjan Rao, Shri, J. Chokka

Prasad, Shri Hari Kewal Rao, Shri K.S.

Prasad, Shri R.S. Rao, Shri Srinivas

Prasad, Shri V. ~reenivasa Rasheed Masood, Shr;

Pram Pradeep, Shri Rathva, Shri Narayanbhai Jamlabhai

Purohit, Shri Banwarilal Rathod, Shri Uttam

Raghavji, Shri Rathor, Dr. Bhagwan Dass

Rah;, Shri Ramlal Rawat, Shri Harish

Rai, Shri, M. Ramanna Rawat, Prof. Rasa Sjngh

Rajdev Singh, Shr; Ray, Dr. Sudhir

Raje, Shrimati Vasundhara Raychaudhuri, Shri Sudarsan

Raju, Shri Bh. Vijayakumar Reddy, Shri A. Venkata

Raju, Shri M.M. Pallam Reddy, Shri Kotla Vijaya Bhaskara

Rajveer Singh, Shri Reddy, Shri M.G.

Ram Babu, Shri A.G.S. Reddy, Shri P. Narsa

Ram Ohan, Shri Reddy. Shri R. Surender

Ram Prakash, Ch. Reddy, Shri Rajamohan

Ram Sagar. Shri (Bara Banki) Routray, Shri Nilamani 295 Const. (66th Amend.) MAY 30. 1990 8111 296

Roy, Shri A.K. Shankaranand, Shri B.

Roy, Shri Haradhan Shanmugam, Shri P.

Roypradhan, Shri Amar Sharma, Shri Charm Pal

Sahay. Shrl Subodh Kant Shastri, Shri Ani!

Sal, Shri A. larang Shastri. Shri Kapil Dev

Sai, Shrl Nand Kumar Shastri, Shri Yamuna Prasad

Saini, Shri Gurdial Singh Shekhada, Shri Govindbhai Kanjibhai

Satt, Shri Ibrahim Sulaiman Shingada, Shri D.B.

Sanyal, Shri Manik Shiwankar, Prof. Mahadeo

Saran, Shri Daulat Ram Shrivastav8, Dr. Shailendranath

Saroj, Shri Sarju Prasad Shukla, Shri Vidyaeharan

Sartaj Singh, Shri Sindal, Shri S.B.

Sarwar Hussain, Shri Silvera, Dr. C.

Sathe, Shri Vasant Singam, Shri Basavapunnaiah

Save, Shri Moreshwar Singh, Shri Ajay

• Sayeed, Shri Mufti Mohammad Singh. Shri Dhanraj

Sclndia, Shrimati Vijayaraje Singh, Shri Har Govind

Sakhar, Shri M.G. Singh, Shri Hari Kishore

Salvam, Shri Kanei Panner Singh, Shri Jagannath

Selvarasu, Shri M. Singh, Shri K. Manvendra

Shah, Shri Babubhai Meghji Singh, Shri L.V.

Shah, Shri Jayantilal Virehandbhai Singh, Shri lokendra

Shakya, Dr. Mahadeepak Singh Singh, Shri Mandhata

Shaky., Shri Ram Singh Singh, Prof. N. Tombi 297 Const. (66th Al7I9nd.) JYAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) Bill 298

Singh, Shri Pratap Tar;f Singh, Shrl

Singh, Shri Ram Bahadur Tarwala, Shri Amratlal Vallabhdas'

Singh, Shri Ram Naresh Taslimudin, Shri

Singh, Shri Ram Prasad Thakore, Shri Gabbhaji Mangaji

Singh, Shri Ramashrary Prasad Thambi, Durai, Dr.

Singh, Shri Ramdas Thapa, Shri Nandu

Singh, Shri Sukhendra Thomas, Prof. K. V.

Singh, Shri Surya Narayan Thungon, Shri P.K.

Singh, Shri Tej Narayan Tiwari, Shri Srij Shushan

Singh, Shri Uday Pratap Tiwari, Shri Janardan

Singh, Shri Vishwanath Pratap Tyagi, Shri K.C.

Singh Deo, Shri A.N. Urna Bharati, Kumari

Sinha, Shrirnat Usha Umbrey, Shri Laeta

Sodhi, Shri Mankuram Unnlkrishnan, Shri KP.

Solanki, Shri Surajbhanu Vaghela, Shri Shankersinh

Sonkar, Shri Kalpnath Varma, Shri B. Rajarav;

Soren. Shri Shibu Varma, Shri Dharmesh Prasad

Soz, Prof. San-ud-din Varma, Shri Ratilal Kalidas

Subedar, Shri Varma, Shri S.C.

Sucha Singh, Baba Vekaria, Shri S.N.

Sultanpuri, Shri K.D. Verma, Shri Phool Chand

Sundararaj, Shri N Verma, Shri R.L.P.

Sur, Shri Manoranjan Verma. Shri Sheo Sharan

Tandel. Shri D.J. Verma. Shri Upendr. Hath 299 Const. (66th Amend.) Bill MAY 30, 1990NstionaJ Comm. for Women Bill 300

Verma, Shrimati Usha NOES

Vijayaraghavan, Shri A. -NIL-

Viswanatham, Dr. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Subject to ·correction, the resutt of the division is: Wadiyar, Shri Srikanta Datta Narasimha Raja Ayes: 385 Noes: 0 Yadav, Shri Chun Chun Prasad The motion is carried by a majority of the Vadav, Shri Devendra Prasad total membership of the House and by a majority of n"t less than two-thirds of the Vadav, Shri Hukumdeo Narayan Members pesent and voting.

Vadav, Shri Janardan The Bill, as amended, is passed by the requisite majority, in accordance with the Vadav, Shri Kailash Nath Singh provisions of Article 368 of the Constitution.

The motion was adopted Vadav, Shri Mitra Sen

Vadav, Shri Ram Krishan

Vadav, Shri Ramendra Kumar Ravi 17.29 hr ••

Yadav, Dr. S.P. NATIONAL COMMISSION FOR WOMEN BILL Vadav, Shri Satyapal Singh [English] Vadav. Shri Sharad MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Now, wetaka up the next item, that is, National Commis- . Vadav, Shrl Surya Narayan sion for Women Bill.

Vadava, Shri Ramjilal [ Translation1

Vadvendra Dan, Shri THE DEPUTY MINISTER IN THE DEPARTMENT OF WOMEN AND CHILD Yazdani, Dr. Golam DEVELOPMENT IN THE MINISTRY OF WELFARE (SHArMATI USHA SINHA): Mr. Yuvraj, Shri Deputy Speaker, Sir, the I National Commis- sion for Women Bill, 1990', has already been introduced in the House. Women play an Zainal Abedln, Shri

-The following Members also recorded their votes for Ayes: Dr. Shake.lur Rehman, Shri Anwar Ahmed, Shri Ram Singh. Shrl Chhotey Singh Yadav, Shri Radha Mohan Singh, Shri K. Ramllnohan Reo, Shri Lokanath Choudhury, Shri Rudra Sen Chaudhary. Shri Tarh Baran Topdll. Shri Mohammad Shafi, Shri Jagdlah Singh Kushwaha. Prof. P. Kurten, Shri Jai Prakash. 301 National Comm. for JYAISTHA 9, 1912 (SAKA) Womer. Bill 302

important role in the economic and social raise a fundamental question of status of development of any country and tt is more women in the society as a whole. Dispite Important in a developing country like ours. constitutional provisions for equality of status But even after the forty years of independ- and opportunity and social justice and safe- ence, the condition of women has been an guard of the interests of women, they are still issue of concern in the country. Though 8Xplo~ed be it their father's home or in-laws there has been some definite improvement hom. or the society or places of their work- in the situation, yet there are some negative ing. In our Constttutlon, justice, freedom, aspects, which have been a matter of con- equality and fraternity has been assured for cern for the Government and the policy- all the citizens, but women don't get any makers. The high death-rate of girl child and benef~ from those const~utional provisions. young women, lack of education in women Discrimination in any form has been abol- and little opportunities available for them at ished under the Constitution and a number decision making level and in gainful employ- of other legislations were also made to safe- ments are some of the important problems guard the interests of women and special faced by them. These are the indicators provi3ions have been made for women in which prove that they do not still enjoy equal labour laws. After independence, many laws status in the society. Women belonging to all were made and administrative steps were class, castes and creed are still discrimi- t,ken to ensure the rights of women. This nated and fewer employment opportunities Commission has been set up to look into the are available tor them and discrimination is complaints of women. This is an important done to them in matter of wages also. They Commission. The successive Commissions are exploited. They do not get permanent on Women have also made recommenda- employment. tions in respect of condition of women. They have also noted the unequal status of women In the election-manifesto of the National obtaining in dUferent sphere of life and had Front, it has been promised that a National suggested the setting up an agency to fuHil Commission for Women will be set up. This the surveillance functions as well as redres- commission will work for removing discrimi- sal of their grievances. In deference to the nation of women and redressing"their griev- persistent demands of several women vol- ances as also it will strive for providing due untary organisations and women activits to representation to them in all spheres of life. set up Commission for women, the Govern- This Department was directed to prepare a ment decided to set up the National Com- draft proposal with consultation of various mission for women, conSisting of six mem- women organisations. Accordingly, on 5.2.90 bers and a Chairperson. The main task of the a conference was held. h was attended by Commission shall be to study and mon~or all various women-organisations, eminient matters relating to the Constitutional and persons and women activits. The matter was legal safeguards provided for women, to discussed with them and a draft note in this review the existing legislations and suggest regard was sent to the Prime Minister for amendments, wherever necessary. It will approval by the Minister for Human Re- also look into the complaints and take suo source Development. Thereafter the note moto notice of the cases involving depriva- was circulated to different Ministries. De- tion of the rights of women in order to provide partments and State Government for their support legal or otherwise. to hapless women. comments and approval. Wherever it was The Commission shall monitor the proper considered appropriate, their reoommenda- implementation of all the legislations made tions and comments were indudad In the to protactthe rights of women so as to enable Cabinet note which was approved by the them to achieve equality in all sphere of IWe Cabinet on 18.4.90. The incidents of crime and equal participation in the development and atrocities on women are not limited to of nation. The Commission will consist of a any particular class or community. They Chairperson and six Members including the raise a question mark on our values and they Secretary. The Commission may appoint 303 National Comm. for MAV30,199O Women BIR 304

[Smt. Usha Sinha] that in the last 40 years even Wthere had been some developments certain fields such committees as may be necessary for regarding women h has contributed in ag- dealing such special issues as may be taken gravating their miser as adequate progress up by the Commission from time to time. has not been made where ~ was required. Rules have also been made to implement the provisions of the Bill. With these words, 17.37 hr •• I beg to move :- [DR. THAMBI DURAl in the Chai~ ''That the Bill to const~ute a National Commission for women and to provide In the women's year of 1975 a Parlia- for matters connected therewith or mentary report was published under the incidental thereto, be taken into oon- caption "Sta~us of Women". As per the facts siderations" . published in the said report it has become certain that the literacy rate of women went MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: The ques- you decreasing day·by-day. Not only this, tion Is: the number of Women representatives have also gradually decreased,. Before this, dur- "That the Bill to const~ute a National ing the regime of the Congress Government Commission for women and to provide the number of women representative was for matters connected therewhh or more but even being a woman they did not incidental thereto, be taken into con- voiced their support against the atrocities sideration". committed on women on all occa,ions they voted in favour of the party and even today [English] not even a single women representative of congress party is present here. MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: There is an amendment given by Shri Girdhari Lal Bha,- SHRI KAMAL CHAUDHRY (Hoshlar- gava. pur): Shrimati Basava Rajeshwari is present here. Please do not humiliate her. [ Trans/ation] (Interruptions) SHRI GIRDHARI LAL BHARGAVA: I beg to move: SHRIMATJJAYAWANTI NAVINCHAN- ORA MEHTA: There is no need to get ex- "That the Bill, be circulated for eliciting cited on this. Out of the entire elected women opinion thereon by 24th August. 1990". members only one is present. You need not (2) speak in between. Only one women mem· ber is present here. During the last elections SHRIMATI JAYAWANTI NAVINCHAN- tall claim.s and declarations were made and ORA MEHTA (Bombay North·East): Mr. h was said that women would set 30 per cent Deputy Speaker, Sir, on th maiden session representation but Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would after the formation of the new Government a like to ask them as to why they did not fuHiI reference regarding the formation of women's what they had said? They gave only 5.5 per commission was made in the President's cent tickets to woman and so far as Mahar· Address here and the new government has ashtra was concerned tickets were given to moved this bill on the floor of the House as three women only and even those tickets per "s commhment and I welcome and ex· were withdrawn. Congress Party has II· tend my support to the said bill . After forty ways democratised the power of women. years of attaining independence we are talking about the .stablishment of this National Otherwise, there w. absolutely no need Women's Commission. Thisel.arly indicates to say so much regarding the presence of 306 NatJon.J Comm. for JVAISTHA I. 1812 (&AKA) Women BIll 306 one woman. Even then, I do not wish to women living in the rural areas are also involve myself much in that discussion. The multifaceted. Some are labourers, whether formation of women's commission was ex- they do the work of stone locating or work in tremely necessary in the present circum- the fields as farmers or do other physical stances because in this country nobody had work they have their own problems. On the paid any attention towards the problems of other hand the women living in urban areas women whether they are the poor or rich and serving as teachers, nurses and office women all are in misery. Both are encounter- employees have distinct problems. In order ing different problems. It is a matter of great to solve their problems it is essential to take shame that even after forty years of inde- into consideration both the aspects and pendence the woman do not find them- keeping this in view the committees should selves in a securad poSition. In this country be constituted Mr. Speaker. Sir I would like to , Smt. Indira Gandhi has remained Prime say in very clear terms that our society has Minister for quite some time but Mr. Speaker, beoome male dominated and in this kind of Sir in her regime also you must have seen a society the rights of women to live as a overwhelming increase in the atrocities women has been seized. They are the vic- committed on women. None the Govern- tims of different kinds ot atrocities and ment has changed and the people belonging considered as items of luxury. which is great to every community of the society are having injustice towards women. We hear many many expectations. This government wants things in the country and at times voice for to take certain steps for the fuHilment of the women liberation is raised. My submission is hopes and aspirations of everybody in the this that women can never be obsolved of direction of Social transformation. Keeping her duties. In the name of women liberation this objective in view this bill for the formation if we talk do-away w~h our culture, no one of a National Women's Commission has can tolerate k. Every woman wants to have been presented before this august House. her right to live wnh pride. Simultaneously which will certainly prove to be very appropri- she never backs out from her role as a ate. It has been said in the objedives of this mother. She wants to play her role after Commission that various groups and com- achieving the rights equal to their menfolk mittees will be formulated for solving the and at many places women have exhibited problems of women. They would individually this feeling. You are all aware of the prog- consider the problems. Mr. Speaker, Sir. I ress being made in the field 01 science in the support this proposal whole heartily: Sepa- world today. but simultaneously we are also rate groups for women and Employment. aware of the increasable misuse of science. women and industries, women and law, The example of Maharashtra is before us. women and Education. Women and health The law relating to sex determination text etc. will be formed, and all the problems of was passed there and tt')ereby steps to pre- women would be taken into consideration. In vent abortion of female foetus were taken. I order 10 extend justice to women it has would like to make an appeal to the Govern- become extremely necessary under the ment to consider that this law should be present circumstances to constitute such introduced at Central Government level and committees. I would like to draw the attention to enforce the same should the country. So of the han. Minister towards some important that no injustice is done against women folk. issues which should be kept in mind while const~uting the National women's commis- Ther. is no doubt regarding this fact that sion. It should have two wings: One should a woman is first of all a women irrespective attend the developmental activities of the of her religion. There may be different per· women living in the rural areas for solving sonallaws applicable to them in different their problems. The second ~hould study the religions. I do not want to express my disbe- problems related to women belonging to the fief or dtsreapec.1 towards any religion hera. urban areas and finding solution for the but I want to say one thing very clearly that same. tn our country the problems of our Mustim sisters are also women after all. 307 National Comm. for MAY 30,1990 Women Bill 308

[Smt. Jayawanti Navindhandra Mehta] not being impleme"ted in the right manner. My submission is this that the rights given to They are driven out of their homes merely by women under the law should be unHormly the utterance of word Talaq. thrice. Mr. observed by the government. When a girl is Chairman, Sir I would like to mention here born in a family she is treated in a different that she too is a woman and has certain manner a~er five-six years. It is said that problems of her own. In Maharashlra and in since she is to be married off there is no need many other parts of lndia their opinions were to give her higher education. As such, in obtained and surveys were conducted on order to increase the literacy rate it was said the basis of groups. The survey report has that women should be given free education. revealed that no muslim woman wants this But women cannot be educated merely by sort of atreatment since they are also women framing laws. It is essential to bring a social after all and have their our problems. They enlightment to this effect that women cannot have problems related to the education of progress without education. Unless this fact their children and their livelihood. If we to is taken into consideration women cannot be solve all these problems then h is very es- educated. In the recent times, women are sential to make universal laws for women facing many sufferings. You must have seen irrespective of their religious as only then we and read that small girls in South India are can give her a place in the society. The married to Arabs of the age group of 50-55 government should consider ~, this is my years and thereafter they are sent outside request. I also want to say that 50% of the the country as their wives. They do not think population comprises of women and one about her future. Small girls are sent abroad fourth is believed to be that of children. As for the simple reason that they are poverty such the development of the nation solely Stricken and they are on the verge of Starva· depends on the development of the mother tion. This is a not a good thing, in fact it is and child. Efforts should be made to in· something disgraceful. Keeping this in view. ':rease the status of woman in the society. a law should be framed under which such But different types of atrocities are being marriages should be banned till the girl is sen comm~ted on them. Today we come across reliant and has the power of reasoning and is many incidents In wnlch women become the ripe in age. victim of divorce it she is unable to cope with her husband within a few days of her mar- We should see to it that they are not sent riage. Why does this happen? There is a there forcibly. I would like to say that Devdasi very. important reason behind ~. Man has practice has become a grave problem in become very seHish and the rate of for bear- Maharashtra. Likewise Yellamma practice enee in man has decreased. Due to lack of has assumed serious proportions in South forbearence in man, divorce cases are in- India. As per an ancient belief small girls are creasing day by day. If we think about the dedicated or offered to Gods and afterwards problems faced by the married women we they are subjected to misuse and immoral come across many such problems which acts. Thus the dream of these girls to get prevents them from leading their lives wnh themselves married, have their own home seW respect. The laws in this respect do not and Children are shattered and they are give them full justice. I would like to remind forced to indulge in various immoral acts. you that there is a law regarding dowry. In 1985 the Parliamentary Committee made I would like to tell you about an incident efforts to improve the laws by giving various which took place in the Bhandup region of suggestions. But even now that law is there my own constituency. There the police con· to harm the women. Even after forty years of ducted a raid to arrest 1500 girls hailing from independence. brides are burnt for n01 Tamilnadu. tn a bid to hide those girls they begging adequate down the woman. Apart were forced to stand in a pit and soil was put from social reasons this fact is also clear that over them. Had they not been searched out the taws framed in the interest of women are by the Police within 10 minutes they would 309 National Comm. for JYAISTHA 9,1912 (SAKA) Women Bill 310 have died of suffocation. This is the way in problem in the field of education, medicine, which they are tyrainnzed. The sale and employment and law. I would like to add that purchase of women has been encouraged this commission must accomodate the by middlemen. I would like to assure you that people's representatives. It should aecomo- this "National Commission ofWoman"would date members of Parliament in its Central be supported by all the sections of society ff Committee, members of State legislatures this commission intends to work for a glori- in its State Committees, and village repre· ous and honoured place for women in the sentativ9s in village committees. Only with existing social set up. Again, I would like to such prevision the National Commissiot\lor appeal all the parties that they should rise Women will be able to work with greater above their petty party politics as for as success. I would like to exhort my sisters in National Commission for woman is con- cities to go to rural areas and work for their cerned. In this context, J would like to add upliftment. Therefore, the people's repre- that if this commission is supported and co- sentatives and voluntary organisations like operated by all the parties and kept above Mahila Mandai, Bhagine Samaj and other politics and the women corne forward then women organisations should also be asked (Jur coming generation would be so strong for suggestions in this regard. that there could be no dangor to our country in future. Mr. Chairman, Sir, two or three days ago a seminar was organised on Anti·pros· Mr. Chairman, Sir, I have already stated titution which stressed the need of rehabili- that dowry as well as Sati-practice are bad if tating their children and giving them the they are forced upon the women. It is very facilities so that they may become honour- bad if one uses force In these cases. There able ci~izens. One thing is quite clear that are legislations against dowry and SatL But country's development is possible only if these legislations are neV9r implemented. women are defendQd and allowed to prog- Strict actions should be taken in such cases ress. If women remain undeveloped then and this Commission should also be em- there would be several hurdles in the devel- powered togiven protection to women against opment of the nation. Therefore, I think that the persons who try to force them tor such we should work for the accomplishment of acts. This is my suggestion. this task by givirg representation to the women of every section in this proposed Mr. Chairman, Sir, thefewprogrammes National Commission for Women so that the telecast about health are of not much use. women are able to achieve distinctions in Most of the women are ignorant about the every field. In the end I would like to say: achievements of medical science. I would like to request that the poor Harijan and "Abala Nahin Kaha ja Sakta Ab Sharat Girijan women, \!ho are pregnant, should be ki Nari ko, provided nutritions diet and also adequate Rakh Samajhana bhul bahut hai, ch· medicare so that they may give birth to hiphui chinagri ko". healthy babies. The Commission should be given the right to look into such matters also. SHRI HARISH RAWAT (Almora): Mr. Mr. Chairman, Sir, again as far as Chairman, Sir, yesterday my party's honour· employment is concerned the principle of able women member ..... (Interruptions) ..... aqual pay for equal work does not operate at many places. A women labourer is given Rs. [English] S while her male counterpart receives As. 7. This is a great injustice to woman. Therefore, this National Commission would be sue· MR. CHAIRMAN: Vet the male mem- cesslul in hs objective only Hit is provided bers also support you. Why are you discrimi- with separate wings to look after the women's nating now? (/ntsrruptlons) 311 National Comm. for MAY 30.1990 Psp9fS Laid 312 Wom.n Bill [ Translation] these issue which could not be raised by them. They are also happy at that fact that a SHRI HARISH RAWAT: I would like to Congressman is voiceing their resentment emphasize that this Bill has been introduced to the bill and cr~icising the Government. here w~h an objedive to oversee and monitor the implementation of the programmes I agree with Sathe ji that not only provi- meant for the WeKare of Women, but b does sion should be made for more funds in the not confer adequate powers on the Commis- Bill, but more powers should also be con- sion to enable b to ensure that the pro- ferred on the commission in order to enable grammes are properly implemented and even b to discharge its functions properly. Priority if some powers have been given, there is no must be fixed as to what Immediate steps provision for a proper machinery, in the should be taken for the weHare of women. absence of which the Com mission will not be in a position to ensure the proper implemen- [English] tation to Women Welfare programmes. The functions enumerated in the Bill are too MR. CHAIRMAN: You may please memerous and the machinery provided Is continue tomorrow. too meagre. The Commission is supposed to safeguard almost all the interests of the women under various laws. But no provision has been made for creating proper machin- 17.59 hrs. ery forthe Commission to discharge its functions properly. Hhas been introduced to seek PAPERS LAID ON THE TABLE only pol~ical mileage and I can understand the difficutty of my sister belonging to Shar- [fnglish] tiya Janata Party as she is obliged to support the bill. But we are in a d~ficult predicament. Inter-State Council Order, 1990 We have been forced to attract the attention of the House towards the loopholes of this THE MINISTER OF INFORMATION Bill. You can see it yourself. The commission AND BROADCASTING AND MINISTER OF has been provided w~h just Rs. 2 crores for PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS (SHRI P. one financial year and assig ned to alleviated UPENDRA): On behalf of Shri Mufti Maham- and abolish almost all the ills that beset the mad Sayeed, I beg to lay on the Table a copy entire women folk. Is it not a cruel joke? His of the Inter-State Council Order, 1990 (Hindi a joke wnh our women as well. These people and English versions) published in Notifica- have belied the hopes of the countrymen. tion No. G.S.A. 512(E) in Gazette on India While introductng this bill ~ has been said dated the 28th May, 1990 issued under that this was one of the promises in the article 263 of the Const~ution. [Placed in mennesto. But if this bill is the resu~ of your Library. See No LT -1107190] promise, I thank your wisdom. If we are supporting your this so called gHt to women 18.00 hr •• which is in fact a joke then tt is only due to the fact that women are involved in h. Try to think The Lok Sabha then adjouffled till El8ven on our line and ask these women sitting on of the Clock on Thursday, May 31, 19901 that side like hon. Subhasiniji. and Geetaji. Jyaistha 10, 1912 (Saka) They are all happy inwardly as they think that at least their brother an this side is raising

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