Announcer: Welcome to the Ideas That Change the World podcast with Rabbi Manis Friedman, ​ ​ where we make sure your life will be changed for the better one idea at a time. Rabbi Friedman is the number one voice of clarity on moral and social issues. So what are we waiting for, let's go change the world. If you want to support Its Good to Know and the work of Rabbi Manis Friedman please visit it'sgoodtoknow.org/support to join the community. In this episode Rabbi Manis Friedman talks to Rabbi .

Rabbi Friedman: Ideas that can change the world, well here's one to start with. What is the essence of morality? The essential statement of all morality is, I may be stronger than you, but I may not take advantage of that. I may be more informed than you, I may not take advantage of that. The basic statement of morality is that the rich may not abuse the poor, the strong may not abuse the weak and those who know may not abuse those who are ignorant. Do not place a stumbling block before the blind.

So what it's saying is, in this world people are not equal. Some have all the advantages and all the benefits and some have none. Well, when you find yourself in a position of privilege, when you find yourself in a position of power, you may not use that against someone who doesn't have that power. That’s it. That's basic morality. To try to believe that all people are equal and that there is no difference between us almost sounds like a substitute for morality. It's almost like saying if I ever believed that I was stronger than you, I would beat you up. If I felt that I was more informed and I was more intelligent than you I would mislead you, I would lie to you, I would misinform you, I would play with your head.

So since I don't want to do that, I have to convince myself that I don't know any more than you do. I'm not stronger than you. I'm not the fastest gun in the West because if I was, I would probably shoot you. Which means we're living in a moral society. Morality does not dictate our behavior. So what can change the world for the better is to go back to the principle of morality. The rich may not take advantage of the poor. To make everybody rich is not a moral solution even if it were realistic. How do you like that for an idea? Rabbi Shais: It's a very interesting idea because you know that you are speaking some bias. I think you're very influenced.

Rabbi Manis: By privilege.

Rabbi Shais: No, I wasn't thinking of that but you're speaking very Jewishly and you’re…

Rabbi Manis: I’m sorry I didn't mean to do that.

Rabbi Shais: Well, you’re taking for granted that your Jewish definition of morality is universal.

Rabbi Manis: How about the biblical?

Rabbi Shais: Yeah, well the Biblical is just euphemistic for Jewish.

Rabbi Manis: Oh okay.

Rabbi Shais: That’s why we don't want to say Jewish, we say biblical. Do you know that the basis for mystical anti-Semitism according to Hitler [Yiddish 4:12] was precisely your definition of morality? He writes about it in mind counts.

Rabbi Manis: What did you say, the mystical definition?

Rabbi Shais: Yeah, the mystical definition, right. There was the economic argument but there was also a mystical argument which is like this. First of all the Nazis weren't Christian, they were pagans. In fact, Hitler saw Christianity as a Trojan horse for Jewish ideas, it's just Judaism in disguise. And what did he believe? He believed in the power of nature. Pagans worship the power of nature.

Then rabbi speaks about this by the way in the [Yiddish 4:55] in an open letter. The rabbi would write open letters periodically. One of them was always before Pesach or for the rabbi's birthday which is two days before Pesach. And there's a letter that speaks about why does the say that the Exodus happened in chodesh ha-aviv, the month of the spring? And one of things the ​ ​ rabbi says is because the spring is the height of the pagan year. That’s when you see that nature is an unstoppable force because even though it goes dormant during the winter but everything revives in the spring, so Hashem specifically chose to devastate Egypt at a time when Paganism is most strong in the world at any rate.

So if nature made me stronger than you, then it's only right, so it's a different way of defining morality. It's only moral that I use that strength. If nature gave me the ability to do something then it's only right to use that ability. That's the worship of nature. Nature gave me an ability and not only would it be cowardly to not act on it but it would be immoral from a pagan standpoint, from a nature worshipping standpoint. They say that Nietzsche would be horrified by Nazism but obviously a lot of the basis for this idea is the idea of Nietzsche about…which is also influenced by or influenced sort of the philosophy of Darwinist. Darwinism is a theory but it's also a cultural zeal. Survival of the fittest. So what's the moral implications of survival of the fittest is that it's moral to outdo the competition.

At any rate what I'm saying is you're saying to me that morality is not to explain weaknesses. I'm saying that's a very Jewish definition of morality. There’s another definition of morality which is morality is precisely the exploitation of weaknesses so that strength, natural strength, can flourish. And then that worlds view might makes right is not sense cynically whatsoever. Might makes right is said like we say in Torah like we say [Yiddish 7:47]. It said no inflection with no hint of sarcasm. Might makes right. And if you don't believe, well trust your senses look in the world. If power was in doubt to a certain force or people or individual or tool then trust what you see. The world is telling you that this thing ought to prevail and whatever it can eliminate ought to be eliminated. What he said that?

Rabbi Manis: Thin the heard.

Rabbi Shais: Thin the heard? That’s right, that's right. It would be immoral to not allow the weak to be thinned out. You’re going to create a crisis and you're going to, you know, it's not pleasant. Nobody likes to do it.

Rabbi Manis: Yeah, but somebody has got to. Rabbi Shais: Somebody's got to do it. If you don’t let the hunters shoot the dear then it causes disease. Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

Rabbi Manis: Yeah, well it's a strange use of the word morality. Like you are obligated to do that. Obligated. First of all, obligated by whom? And secondly…

Rabbi Shais: By nature.

Rabbi Manis: If survival of the fittest is a natural process just sit back and watch it happen.

Rabbi Shais: No, but that's the thing that people are so perverse they can thwart nature. They could thwart nature. They could not allow nature to take its course.

Rabbi Manis: So, human beings are above them.

Rabbi Shais: Do you know what Judaism teaches? To thwart nature. Do not allow nature to take its course. Judaism puts into place all these rules that tell us don't let nature take its course.

Rabbi Manis: Which is expressed in the statement be fruitful and multiply through the world and conquer it. Harness nature. I think I like the Jewish definition better.

Rabbi Shais: I told you, you were biased. There's a famous scene in the movies in the 40s. Think of the 40s or 50s there's this African Queen. African Queen is a boat and the captain of the boat is Humphrey Bogart, and he's an alcoholic in this movie. There's this one scene where he's just finishing a bottle and he throws it out to the river, and there's this lady she's a missionary and she chastises him. This is Catherine Hartburn, she chastises him, Humphrey Bogart for drinking. And he says but it’s only natural, it's only human nature to drink. And she says Captain, human nature is what we were sent here to overcome.

Rabbi Manis: She didn't chastise him for polluting the river or the ocean?

Rabbi Shais: No, no.

Rabbi Manis: That hadn’t come up yet. So, what is your idea to change the world? Rabbi Shais: I like your idea.

Rabbi Manis: An idea that can make a big difference.

Rabbi Shais: Well, I'll stick with your idea but I think that there's a prerequisite to that which is that in order to appreciate morality as you've just described it a person has to be able to think abstractly. You have to think in terms of ideas and not in terms of things. Because if you're locked into concrete thinking and you can only relate to things, then the world view that nature is to be preserved and to be worshiped really is very compelling. Unless you have some other values that are not to be learned through your senses. If you only have the five senses and basically yeah whatever is physical, is real and whatever's real should prevail. So you need to have an ability to even think abstractly. You know, right and wrong are abstract concepts. That's why you don't find right or wrong in the animal kingdom because animals are thinking concretely.

So I think before we can even talk about morality the way that you're defining morality which is a very abstract notion of morality and a very unnatural definition of morality, we need to have the capacity to sink beyond just sensorial input. And I would argue that there's a big lack of that. Have you ever had the experience where you're trying to explain something to somebody and you realize that it's too philosophical? So you give them a metaphor, right? You give a metaphor. And you say, you know, it's like a guy and he's driving a car on the highway and he’s gunning it, and he's trying to pass another cop. What I'm using as a metaphor and then the person says what color is the car?

And you realize I'm using this as a metaphor. They’re not hearing a metaphor, they heard a story about a car. It has nothing to do with the car. I’m not talking about the car. The car is an illustration of a principle. What principle? A principle is an abstraction, a car is a thing what color is that thing? So I think there's a language problem and a thinking problem that comes before we can even discuss morality.

Rabbi Manis: Well that reminds me of another interesting concept. What really is the unique nature of a Jew or of a human being? What makes the human being different from the rest of creation besides the fact that he pollutes nature, besides the fact that he can ruin everything? So here's a very interesting maybe somewhat poetic definition. The mineral, the vegetable and the animal are perfectly content being what they were created to be and they are loyal to it. They never digress, the mineral is always a mineral. The vegetable is always a vegetable. The animals always an animal and if you don't interfere, if you allow them their space or their needs, they’re perfectly happy. The definition of a human being is that the human is never content being what he was created to be. He has a need to add something. To contribute something beyond what he was given. So the definition of a human being is that he is never content being human.

That’s the difference between the human being, the animal, the vegetable and the mineral. So if a human being says just give me a little space, a little freedom to roam, a little freedom to explore and I'm going to be happy. Well then you're an animal. If you say just don't step on me, don't choke me, don't neglect me and I'll be happy, you’re sounding like a flower or a plant. And if you say just don't destroy me, you're sounding like a mineral. The human being is not human if he is content with what he is given.

So you're right the human being is always looking for something that is not physical. That is not apprehensible by the senses. Is that the right English? Apprehended by the senses. He's looking for something super human, otherwise he's not content to be just human. And then you go looking. What is there besides human? I don't want to deteriorate to an animal but I'm not content being a human, where do we go? And that's where the Torah comes in. God introduces himself and gives us an out let, gives us an opportunity to be something more than human. We can be somewhat divine and the beginning of that is morality.

Rabbi Shais: No it's not thinking all this, it says that the Jewish people are beloved because they're called Hashem’s children. Not only are they call the Hashem’s children but they know that they're called Hashem’s children. So that's talking about the Jewish people [Yiddish 17:27]. Your children to go to the Lord your God. But then there's another thing to pick up a sense, right after that which is that humanity in general, so this isn't distinctions, this is not uniquely Jewish, humanity were created in the image of God. It's Tzelem elokim. And that's a show of love, that Hashem loves humanity. He created them in his image and not only does he create them in His image but he lets them know.

He lets them know he created them in their own image. So what does it mean that we we're creating the image of God because, obviously you know anthropomorphism is … I shouldn’t say obviously but according to my mind of certain principles we don't have an anthropomorphic God. So what is the meaning of we were created in Hashem’s image? Physics explains that the Tzelem elokim, the image of God which is in every human being, it's not uniquely Jewish is the [Yiddish 18:29], the intellectual soul.

What's the difference between the nefesh [Yiddish 18:36] and the nefesh habehamit, the intellectual soul and the animal soul? When I say animal soul, obviously you understand, I don't mean the soul of an animal I mean the animalistic soul in a human. So the animalistic soul in a human, nefesh habehamit, is exactly what you described it wants comfort, it wants things to be okay. [Yiddish 18:59] is not okay with being okay. So nefesh [Yiddish 19:02] the intellectual soul is always searching for something more. It’s unsettled.

And in [Yiddish 19:11] the teachings, it compares it, I guess in juxtaposition or in contrast to the animal soul which you will be probably surprised that they got their animal soul as metaphorically described as an animal. The intellectual soul is metaphorically described as an bird. It flies and what does that mean, it means that there's an image of God that celalakim in every human being that's never content just to be content. It's always looking for something higher. Now that doesn't necessarily mean godly, that's another discussion but something spiritual, something abstract, something otherworldly. It can't just be content to be physically comfortable. And that's what's uniquely human about humans.

Rabbi Manis: Yes, I think the meaning you are special because you are God's children and you are uniquely special because you are told you were God's children. Why does that make us any better to be told? Because we're entrusted. God has actually has the confidence in us that by telling us that we are His children we are not going to take advantage of that and abuse others who are not God's children. Human beings are special because they're created in God's image and there is something really special about the fact that they are told that they are created in God's image. And by telling them God is trusting the human being not to use that advantage and not be cruel to animals.

Rabbi Shais: So let me offer you a spin on that. Knowing that I'm a human being means knowing that I can't just be content with nature. For me the natural is unnatural. I can't just be content with creature comforts. Knowing that information, I'm not going to take advantage of that information and exploit the rest of creation. So let me put a spin on it. What's the best way to assure that I'm not just going to be the most dangerous predator, the top of the food chain? An animal that's able to out think and therefore outlive every other animal. The best way to ensure that is to teach me that I'm not just an animal. So by teaching me that I'm human and that there's something more than just the physical world, there's something spiritual that actually is what makes me compassionate upon the rest of the world. Animal, plants, inanimate environment, whatever it might be.

So it's not just that He gives us that information and trusts us not to misuse it but maybe even more than that, by giving us that information that's what really guarantees that we're going to be stewards and not exploitators

Rabbi Manis: Good point. What idea would you like to talk about?

Rabbi Shais: How do you convince humans that they're human?

Rabbi Manis: Treat them like an animal.

Rabbi Shais: How do you get a Jew to tell you how Jewish they are? Question their Jewishness, it always works. So you're not really that Jewish, excuse me? Right? Reverse psychology.

Rabbi Manis: But what really is the unique message of Judaism today. Not a matter of theism. We gave that away a long time ago. What does the world need to know? Rabbi Shais: That they can't get anywhere else. That the world can't get anywhere else. Like, what marketing do we still have a corner on after all these centuries and millennia of…

Rabbi Manis: Of sharing?

Rabbi Shais: Yeah. What do we still have left that's unique? I'll tell you and it's based on an experience that I had. I used to study with this guy who was a Buddhist priest. Why I did a study with him? Because he was a Jewish boy who became a Buddhist priest. And of course when a Jewish boy becomes a Buddhist you can't just be a regular Buddhist, he has to be a Buddhist priest. And he wasn't just a regular Buddhist priest, he was one of the world's foremost translators of Tibet. He was brilliant. I used to study [Yiddish 24:14] with him and just to give you an insight into his brilliance, when he would study a concept not only would he understand the concept immediately, he'd be able to converse about the concepts but he would immediately be able to tell jokes that were actually funny about the concept that he had just learnt. That's a level of depth. To be able to get the kinds of so well you're already able to make jokes that are actually funny and correct about the subject matter. This guy was amazing.

Rabbi Manis: So he was a Jew, he was a Buddhist, he was a priest, he was a comedian.

Rabbi Shais: He was even more things than that but amazing guy, just an amazing guy. I have many stories about him. One of the stories that I think about all the time was we were learning and all of a sudden he got so excited. Excited is not the word, agitated. He got agitated. He says nobody says this, nobody says this, nobody says this. And I said, what if nobody said? You guys, you guys are the only ones who say this, nobody says this. So I’m thinking to myself, this guy has a PhD in Philosophy from Princeton, this guy is a Buddhist priest, he's saying nobody says this. I think I should listen and find out what it is that we're the only ones who say because this would let me know this is a pretty big idea. So I said what, what is it? What does nobody say? What are we the only ones who say?

He says, nobody says this. Everyone else says the purpose of this world is that it's not real to overcome the illusion of the world or maybe some will say, okay there is some reality to the world but it's only an intermediary phase in order to gain passage into a higher world. Nobody says that the point of it all takes place in this world. Nobody says this.

Rabbi Manis: And what do we say?

Rabbi Shais: We say that. The Hashem created the world because he desired to have a dwelling place in the lower realms. And you know the Rashab, fifth rabbi of beginning of that [Yiddish 26:48], he goes through the different classical reasons that explain creation and they all have validity. You know, kind of [Yiddish 26:54] is good and therefore the ultimate expression is goodness is to create and not just to create but to create in a way that we can be partners with them and not have shame or begin [Yiddish 27:06] in order that he should be known. He wants to be known. There is no other, there is no one can know him or in [Yiddish 27:15] that Hashem cannot just remain potential everything has to come to actuality.

So creation is an expression of that potential and he goes through all these different classical reasons that all have their sources and he explains their validity but he says there's one detail that none of them explain and that is, every one of these explanations for creation can be true if Hashem would have stopped with the spiritual worlds. It doesn't explain why he kept going and made a physical world because any of those other explanations can be just as true if Hashem had just created any semblance of a creative reality, even a very ethereal creative reality and it would have been enough. The only explanation and the source of it is the [Yiddish 28:10]. The only explanation that explains why there is a physical world is the idea that he desired a dwelling place in the lowest hype of reality.

Rabbi Manis: And what is the explanation for that? What is the attraction for the lowest possible existence?

Rabbi Shais: Well, as I'm sure you know [Yiddish 28:35]. That would somebody desire something you can't force them to defend it rationally because that's the whole point of a desire. Is that I'm not claiming it's practical. If it were practical maybe I could articulate why it's important but this is deeper than that. I can't articulate it. So it is a deep desire. It is in fact the deepest desire. Rabbi Manis: I understand that but the desire for what? What exactly is he desiring?

Rabbi Shais: The one way to say it is he's desiring the ultimate paradise. The ultimate paradise. He is perfection but he wants, not his own perfection. He wants perfection that comes from imperfection. That's the ultimate paradox. Not just the perfection can exist alongside imperfection but that imperfection can produce a greater perfection or put it this way, to say that the infinite is infinite is not a paradox. Even to say the infinite has room for the finite is not a paradox, but to say that the infinite can come from the finite, that's a paradox. So if you want to put it in philosophical terms, what is this attraction he has? It's the attraction to this ultimate paradox.

Rabbi Manis: You're using imperfection and finite?

Rabbi Shais: Yeah, yeah. Because the infinite is perfect. It’s everything, it’s got everything, lacking nothing. The finite is always imperfect and your finite is always something you're missing.

Rabbi Manis: Namely infinity.

Rabbi Shais: That covers pretty much all the things you're lacking. Then that's compounded with the fact that it's not just object of imperfection but He actually gave us the free choice to DO damage.

Rabbi Manis: And how do you reconcile a perfect God having passion or a desire? Is that metaphorical?

Rabbi Shais: You're saying if we make it metaphorical then we don't have to really deal with it because it doesn't mean what it's saying. That's one way to deal with every question. Symbolism.

Rabbi Manis: It’s just a manner of speech.

Rabbi Shais: No he really, really desires it. He really desires it.

Rabbi Manis: Any explanation for that? Rabbi Shais: Well let me let me throw it back to you and say like this, why does it require an explanation, isn't it enough that he desires it?

Rabbi Manis: I'm really glad he does. And I'm not complaining

Rabbi Shais: That's what he desires because personally if he has desires, he could have found a way to get them met without involving me. So I have a little complaint like the two guys in [Yiddish 31:59] who were once philosophizing and wants it, you know, seeing as how difficult life is sometimes I think it would be better to never have been born. The other guy from Crown says yeah but honestly how many guys do you know who are that lucky? 1 out of 100.

Rabbi Manis: Actually said that [Yiddish 32:20]. So I think we can compare it to what you were saying before about not being content with things or not pursuing things but something more than things. In the physical world what can we relate to as more than a thing besides concepts or abstractions? I think the desire to have another in your life, the attraction to another, a human being is not a thing, and if I'm not trying to get something from you but really are interested in you, that's beyond things. That's actually God-like because God also needs nothing and yet desires to have someone besides himself, which is us.

Rabbi Shais: But then the question is why couldn't He have had that relationship with angels or spiritual beings? What did they lack?

Rabbi Manis: Because they're just more of him, they’re not other. They have no freedom of choice.

Rabbi Shais: In other words they're lacking being a thing.

Rabbi Manis: Being other than.

Rabbi Shais: But what makes them more otherly. What makes a person be other than an angel? The will?

Rabbi Manis: The ability to either accept God or reject God. Rabbi Shais: What's the difference between [Yiddish 34:20]? Revelation and essence? A revelation knows it's source because it just traces itself back up to a source. If you're seeing the beam of light, just follow it up, you'll find the luminary. But a thing you can't trace it to its source, it hides its source. So he's attracted to the thingness of this world. So what I said before is that, you know, we have a problem of getting wrapped up in concrete thinking and only relating to things and we lack the ability to think abstractly and think about ideas. I didn't mean that we should go exclusively into the world of ideas.

To the contrary the uniqueness of the Jewish perspective is that although ideas are incomparably more valuable than things, the greatest expression of any idea is it's manifestation as a thing. So what's more important? Surrendering your thoughts or a piece of leather? And yet the ultimate expressions of surrendering your thoughts are through a piece of leather, through the tefillin. And ​ ​ ultimately that's the paradox. The paradox is the ultimate expression of any abstraction is in the concrete.

If you look at the concrete just as a thing and it doesn't represent more than that. I'll give you an example. A couple of years ago there was this guy. This [Yiddish 36:22] guy in Williamsburg, he put his tefillin down next to the sink and he went into the bathroom and there were security cameras that caught it. When he came back he couldn't find his tefillin and he searched everywhere. He didn’t realize that it fell off into the garbage. And the tefillin got taken out with the trash and actually they didn't realize that a few days. You remember this a few years ago? And they went up to Rochester, I think that's where it was, upstate New York and they went to the dump and the nine Jewish people there, the locals, were combing through that garbage dump trying to find this guy’s tefillin. That right there shows you the human capacity to appreciate something more than just the physical object. Because if it's just a physical object, tell me how much it's worth and we’ll replace it.

So that they understand that it's holy, maybe some of them. At the very least they understood it had a personal value to this person. Maybe it was sentimental, but the point is that it was a good example of human beings having the ability to value the abstract. And yet they were looking for the physical tefillin. It wasn't enough just to value what they represent, they wanted the physical tefillin and I don't think they found it by the way in the end. But the point is that that was even something that human beings would take their time to do, something unpleasant, going through trash. So that's a good example of appreciating that marriage between the abstract and the concrete which really if you think about it is every Mitzvah. Every Mitzvah there's a marriage between the abstract and the concrete. Spiritual and material.

Rabbi Manis: So introduce the human element here. The human being is certainly not the thing and it's not the thingness in the human being that God wants.

Rabbi Shais: But he wants us once we're in bodies. The body is a thing.

Rabbi Manis: And capable of free choice, which is not a thing.

Rabbi Shais: But its thingness that makes us capable of free choice. Angels live in a world of ideals. They can't violate those ideas. We live in a world where thingness covers up ideals and therefore we can choose what tastes good instead of what's kosher for instance.

Rabbi Manis: We have another option but the choice and the ability to choose is certainly not a thing. It's a human almost divine freedom.

Rabbi Shais: It's an idea. It's a power. It's an energy.

Rabbi Manis: So in some way, the idea that God wants a dwelling place in the lower world which is what the [Yiddish 39:37] revealed to the world as being the ultimate reason for creation or as you said the creation of the lower world. What do you need a dwelling place? A dwelling place meaning a private place. God is the creator and the king of the whole world why would he want a private place? The metaphor doesn't seem appropriate. So a private place is necessary if you're having a private relationship. So when God says make me a dwelling place, he doesn't mean build me an apartment. He's just being subtle. Like if a man would say to a woman let's build a house. He doesn't mean help me build it and go home. Let's make a house together. Otherwise, I don't need a house. Rabbi Shais: Or perhaps to be a little bit more crass, when you tell a couple strangers come on, get a room. It’s not about the physical space, it's about what you're doing needs a place, private place.

Rabbi Manis: The sacred needs a sacred place. So we are mimicking God, actually following the image in which we are created that for some inexplicable reason or for no reason at all actually. Even when I need nothing, I still have a desire for someone. Just as God needs nothing and yet has a desire for someone. And then if you ask why does he have that desire? The answer is why do you have your desire? It's a desire but at least now we know what the desire is for. It's not just for an apartment. And that's what the Torah is saying get quite explicitly, build me a house so I can dwell with you, not with it. These are these are pretty earth shaking, life changing. Anything else?

Rabbi Shais: You know the [Yiddish 42:14] talks about one of the detail of…It’s talking about [Yiddish 42:22]. It's talking about the [Yiddish 42:23] story. Esther, it was just her mosel that when it was her turn to be tested out by the king it was [Yiddish 42:33] is the coldest month of the year. So the wording there is that it's the [Yiddish 42:43] the month [Yiddish 42:45]. That a body gets benefit from another body because it’s cold. So you need somebody else is 98.6. [Yiddish 42:58] talks about the king [Yiddish 43:01] the king is a by word for the king of the whole world. The body gets benefit from a body.

Obviously Hashem has no body in the sense of physical body but what it means is what [Yiddish 43:17] explains it is that Hashem’s essence, not the glow, not the ray of godliness but his essence of being as he is, gets pleasure from having a relationship with something that is seems to be as autonomous as he is and that's the embodied soul. Not the soul in heaven, the embodied soul. The pleasure comes when the soul is in a body. When the idea of you which is your soul meaning all you potentials and all your talents and all your abilities and your mission. That's the idea of you, is placed into this thing called you. William Mayo from the Mayo Clinic he wrote an article in the American Medical Journal back in the 30S and he spoke about how a human being is worth 34 cents. He said if you take all the chemicals you know the phosphorous, the potassium and the sodium and you sell them that's come out of these on the open market, human being's are worth 34 cents. Okay, so with inflation today I think it's like 8$. He meant the tongue in cheek but the idea is if you're pure materialists and you only see the thingness of physicality then human life is cheap, in fact there is no human lives. Just some bodies are walking around and somebodies are dead.

And yet if you do the reverse, if you make the reverse error, the reverse error would be not over focusing on the thingness of the person but over focusing on the idea of the person. So in that case you could be a brain in a jar. We’ll upload your brain to a computer and we’ll bury your body and we’ll keep it going because the idea of you will continue.

And the Hashem wants to have a relationship with the idea of you as it is in the thing, the body of you. That's his desire. Things normally cover up ideas. You know, it's like you’re having a deep discussion but then you remember you're hungry and you have to deal with your physical needs and then you forget about the discussion. Or you know your body has a desire so you forget momentarily about right and wrong and you don't ask yourself is this keeping with my principles. You just think well it feels good.

So things cover up ideas. And yet maybe it's precisely because things normally cover and conflict with ideas that the ultimate expression of an idea is when it manifests as a thing which is why a Mitzvah is really only a Mitzvah when it's physically an action. And it's also why you as the beloved of Hashem are really only you not when you are the idea of you. The idea of you existed before you were born. In fact, the idea of you existed before the world was created. Hashem created the world more to have a physical form within which to have a relationship with you in a body. So the idea of you is old and wasn't enough. It didn't satisfy the desire.

He wanted to meet you as a body. You could fall into either extreme. You know when you look at someone just as a body, as a piece of meat like. You know that’s the most crass. You're just looking at somebody for their physical body. But then there's not just their body but like the things they own their possessions. They're rich or maybe a little bit more abstract, their social standing. But these are all body-related thing. That has to do with your thingness, the thing of you.

And then the idea of you is like well you know what's abstractly important about you? Like you know, what's the purpose of your life? What's your mission in this world? So you know if I were to tell you I only want you for your body I don't care about what your life is about that's obviously not a relationship. What if I would tell you I only want to know what your life is about? And it doesn't have to take place in physical terms. You can be conceptual. Maybe for us humans we would see that as holy because, you know, we have such a weakness for getting overly…the occupational hazard we tend to get more wrapped up in the physical and forget spiritual. We don't tend to have so much a problem getting wrapped up in spiritual and forgetting material. They’re both dangers but to be honest the ones that we are more liable to have problems with is the former and not the latter but at any rate we neither of them are what God wants.

So another way to say this is that, maybe this is a side point, maybe this is the point, but God really…I called it a paradox before, you can also call it a high risk investment because if you want to know who I really am, let's not get distracted with thingness. It could consume our attention to the point where we lose sight of what it's really all about. And let's keep it pure, let’s keep it platonic you know like in the sense of Plato, philosophy, platonic relationship. Just two philosophers hanging out talking about ideas.

And let's not dirty it up with anything carnal. Yet Hashem shows the Jewish bodies and Hashem gave the Torah in this world. And then the Torah talks about all these things that we do in this world with our bodies. What's up with that? I mean, I think this is what's uniquely Jewish. Is that we can't have one without the other.

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