Ubah Jama Narrator Ahmed Ismail Yusuf Interviewer May 6, 2014 Minneapolis, Minnesota Ubah Jama -UJ Ahmed Ismail Yusuf -AY AY: Okay. We’re going to start it over. We are in Minneapolis, Minnesota. It is May 6, 2014. I am Ahmed Ismail Yusuf, recording for the Minnesota Historical Society Somali Oral History Project. Here with me is Ubah Jama, widow of the late Hussein Samatar, who just passed away eight months ago, of whom his biography will be at the end of the recording. Ubah, thanks for agreeing to the interview, and welcome to the interview as well as my house. UJ: Thank you, thank you. Thank you very much for inviting me. It’s a pleasure to be with you today. It’s a long day—work and kids and hospital, and then right in your house. AY: [chuckles] Well, I know you are making me feel guilty now, because you just woke up early in the morning, you’re just herding your kids around—mother and father—and it’s about five o’clock now. And, yes, I can understand that. UJ: Yep. Play those roles, yeah. AY: Yes, actually we are not going to be able to avoid it, so when were you born and where were you born? [both laugh] UJ: Where I was born. You know, I was born in Somalia—Mogadishu, the capital city of Somalia. The hospital I was born in is called Martini, and I was born 1971, April tenth. That’s the real age. AY: [chuckles] You didn’t fake yours, huh. UJ: Yeah, it’s not under the tree, or it’s not a fake to come to the United States. I was born April 10, 1971. We were in Somalia, in Mogadishu, the capital city of Mogadishu. I’m a city girl. That’s why I live in South Minneapolis. AY: Yeah. Not far away from downtown. UJ: Yeah. I have to see the high buildings. 1 AY: Okay. So how many brothers and sisters? UJ: Actually, my family is kind of unique. We are four sisters with no brother in first my mom, but my stepmom has also four girls and one boy finally came. AY: Wow, one boy. UJ: Yeah. My dad was well known in his community and his family. But as you know, in our culture, boys are very important. And the name, carrying the name, although my— AY: Yeah, the name of the family. UJ: The name of the family. Because we, as women, we get married, and we carry the name, but we don’t have kids that has our own last names. So eight girls and one boy. Whoo! AY: [chuckles] So where are they all now? UJ: It’s amazing. I’m the oldest, and, of course, I’m here in the United States. My second sister lives in Canada. My third one lives in Sweden. The fourth lives in Canada. The other four and my brother, half brother—they call half brothers in America, but we don’t know half brothers, we’re just brothers and sisters—they live in Somalia. Actually, two of them, the two oldest ones—one is eighteen. Can you believe my oldest one is eighteen? And my half sister is eighteen year old and seventeen. I was having kids when my dad was having kids. So they live in Turkey now. AY: What is it? The oldest of the stepmom… UJ: Is eighteen years old. And my son is eighteen years old. They are one month apart. AY: Go figure. UJ: Go figure it out. But my two other stepsisters live in Turkey to get educations, because they finished high school in Somalia. So the rest of the three and my stepmom, they live in Somalia. My dad passed away in 2007. He was killed, assassinated—his own people. AY: In Mogadishu? UJ: In Somalia. No, in the northern part. That’s where my family originated from. AY: In Galkayo [Gaalkacyo]? UJ: Galkayo. My family originated from Galkayo. So my dad came to Somalia and my mom came to Mogadishu, southern part, when they were teenagers, and we were born there. AY: When Somalia was Somalia. 2 UJ: When Somalia was Somalia. AY: So wherever you go, any city you go, it was just yours. UJ: Yeah. Now I haven’t been in Somalia, actually, my hometown, which is Mogadishu, for the last twenty-three years old. AY: Where in Mogadishu? UJ: I lived in Baar Ubax. They call Howlwadaag, Baar Ubax. Laanta Xaawo Taako [monument to Xaawo Taako (Hawo Tako)]. There is a small laanta [area of the city]—what do you call Laanta Xaawo Taako? It’s a bunch of… AY: It’s a bunch of—yes, yes, in that area. UJ: That area. So I was born in Hodan, but I was raised in Baar Ubax. AY: You know, the funny thing is every person that I almost interview has something to do with Hodan. UJ: Hodan, yeah, yeah. That’s where the city—Waaberi and Hodan was the biggest areas… AY: Middle class areas. UJ: Middle class area. AY: Particularly the northern part. No—I mean people who came from the north. UJ: But now, after when I was born, people were moving to suburbs. So Baar Ubax was suburbs. New homes, new buildings, new street, new neighbor, you know. If you have money to buy lakers, you can buy lakers and live there. AY: Lakes. UJ: Yeah. AY: So just tell me, what do you remember about growing up in Mogadishu? UJ: You know, it’s amazing. I told my kids all the time, it’s exactly in the United States. My dad and my mom—my dad, especially, was well educated in religion side and Westernized education. What do you call Westernized? AY: Western education. UJ: Western education, that’s what you call it. So my dad makes sure that we have educations, although we were girls. My dad never believed that girls don’t go to school. Education was 3 number one priority for our family. My mom, she is from nomad, but she went to seeraale, what’s called high school, like adult GED [General Education Development] class. But she was always part of the religion side. She always learns religion more than her own culture, language, or all that. My dad was an engineer. He was a teacher-engineer. AY: What kind of engineer? Do you know? UJ: He builds homes. AY: Civil engineer? UJ: Civil engineer. He builds homes, apartments, and sells later on. That was his business. So he was also a very bright man. He knows how to be a business without connecting in the government. He was well known to our old president, well known in our community. My dad was an engineer, my uncle was a banker. So, they always want him to, “Oh, come and work for us, come and work for us.” But for the politician side, my dad was always, “I’d rather do it by my own business. I have nothing to do with politicians, clients, all that.” So he always tried to stay away from them. So we went to Somali school, which is public school, since we were in fifth grade. I was in fifth grade. Then Egyptian private school, which is Sheekh Suufi, they call Sheekh Suufi. The high school and elementary was called Sheekh Suufi. So, we started fifth grade until they called i‘dadi to thanawi [intermediate to secondary school]. Fifth grade, which is middle to high school, we went to a private school which is Arabic. And the teachers were from Egypt, so Egyptian language, which is from Cairo—Arabic. My dad took us every morning. We were three of us— our fourth sister was young, she was seven when the civil war started—so three of us. I was fifth grade. No—I was seventh grade, fifth grade, and they were like six years apart—nine month apart, so they were together. So three of us, we always—beep, beep, the car is ready. He waits for us, my dad. We are ready, we will put uniform, we get in the car. While we were driving in the car, he asked us multiplications. “What’s this and this, and what’s that, and what’s one by one?” And then he asks us in Arabic, because he’s fluent in Arabic, German, Italian, and Somali. AY: How many languages? Five? UJ: German, Arabic, Italian, and English, and of course Somali. Five. Arabic, it was his own home language, so he will ask us biology, math, chemistry, physics in Arabic while we are driving to go to school. He drops us off, makes sure that we are in the classroom. AY: So was it he was making it as though you were playing a game? UJ: What kind of game? AY: I mean, meaning, just to entice you. UJ: No, no. We were not playing a game. He was asking us what we learned yesterday. 4 AY: I mean, he was just making it—to entice you. Meaning, just to make it interesting. UJ: Interest in education? Oh yeah, yeah. So he was like he wants to make fun, and then he drives. Usually my dad, he talks to us and he sings. “And what kind of sound cow makes?” “Moo, moo.” “What’s ari [goats], you know, goats make?” “Maa, maa.” “Ariyoow, what’s ariyoow?” “Wad maashaq mashaq maashaq.” You know, the way the goats eat the grass. So he always made fun of it, but always education.