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Inter Art actuel

Thirty Years of Living in Quebec City A Dialogue Between You and I Lisanne Nadeau et Guy Sioui Durand

Ville de Québec 1978-2008 Quebec City 1978-2008 Numéro 100, automne 2008

URI : https://id.erudit.org/iderudit/60201ac

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Éditeur(s) Les Éditions Intervention

ISSN 0825-8708 (imprimé) 1923-2764 (numérique)

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Citer cet article Nadeau, L. & Sioui Durand, G. (2008). Thirty Years of Living in Quebec City: A Dialogue Between You and I. Inter, (100), 56–68.

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Cet article est diffusé et préservé par Érudit. Érudit est un consortium interuniversitaire sans but lucratif composé de l’Université de Montréal, l’Université Laval et l’Université du Québec à Montréal. Il a pour mission la promotion et la valorisation de la recherche. https://www.erudit.org/fr/ various auditoriums were known 9 Côté and Gaudreault were interested in not teach anything to an art historian sometimes be an encounter, a by all. The professors' participation the masculine majority at documenta. like you, all divisions are arbitrary. reading, a street, a work of art, and Martel was questionning Beuyes' kept the pedagogical teams alert, It is however important that we the tale is born, curiosity starts importance and performed Le troité de and, in poetry at F.-X. Garneau (with la farine. Haché performed inside the remember that this history of friendly something... and the imagination is Pierre-André Arcand and Jean- Yves museum by sleeping in a corner. St- agents is also ours. at work. Let's go for it! Frechette) in visual arts and photo­ Hilaire recited traditional German tales What do you think? Guy graphy in Sainte-Foy (with André in the streets, turning the scope to more Regards. Bécot, Jocelyn Gasse, Lucie Lefebvre, political international issues. At last, Guy Haché, St-Hilaire and Vanderborght (one Alain-Martin Richard and myself), in of the French participants) were making 1978-1988 sound in Limoilou (with Gilles Arteau fun of documento, naked on the front lh and Louis Ouellet). Many professors of the Frédéricianum Museum. At last, Stoneham, Friday January 25 Sunday January 27,h of the Écoles des arts visuels, inclu­ Durand was busy observing and writing. Guy, Guy, If one wants to know more on this issue, ding Marc Dugas, Michel Labbé and I am glad that you wish to look I am going along with this game. see number 17 of the review Intervention. Richard Mill, actively participated in at this history from the point of I am now in 1978.1 have to say this adventure from the beginning. ' Jean-Claude St-Hilaire has been view of our personal experience. that haunting to me is this image teaching art history for 20 years at the Looking at it from a distance, Before you left, when we discussed of the hole that was Saint-Roch. We CEGEP Sainte-Foy, and communications the frictions that caused the break it together, I was suddenly aware and multimedia design for the last could see it from my office window up of the first group of La chambre 9 years. In Quebec City and elsewhere, that our first encounter with « art at La chambre blanche, located at blanche enabled the opening of he pursues his artistic research in the actuel » was determinant in our number 549, on Charest. The urban modes of diffusion and artistic field of performance and art installation. respective itinerary. I was telling development was in crisis at the time, productions. Each of these groups He has observed the cultural milieu all myself that it would be interesting in this area. This area will become his life. He has been a contributor to occupied a territory with well- to talk about these experiences, in the core of the city's art scene. You the collective Inter/Le Lieu (1978) for the first place. What do you think? established boundaries. We saw many years. He is one of the founder remember, Robert Lepage made that when the frictions disappeared, of the review inter, art actuel (1978) and And this history would then emerge of this open wound in the city his the maturity prevailing in the of the artists center Le Lieu (1982). He from our complementary point Trilogy's catalyst... It is indeed in this artists' communities and centers collaborates with these two entities by of views, similar yet different: two quaint little space, an old office space rapidly forced a collaboration that writing articles and by his own artistic voices testifying to the distinct with terrazzo flooring(l) that I fell in practice. has since not ceased to grow. It is angles of this development of art love with art actuel for the first time. the most important aspect of this actuel in Quebec City. Of course, it is I had not seen anything like this. exercise in art actuel in Quebec City: important to fulfill our mission and Someone had invited me to write on the friendships and collaborations look back at these important dates, an exposition of artists' book, in 1982. between the diverse groups make THIRTY YEARS because it seems that we have the They also presented an installation viable this fascinating adventure. OF LIVING ART responsibility to revisit this trajectory by Françoise Girard in a space This adventure of the art movements which might vanish into oblivion exclusively allocated to residences in in the beautiful city of Quebec. IN QUEBEC CITY at any moment. Already, younger situ. I have no idea if you remember people are completely unaware And what if, instead of humming A DIALOGUE BETWEEN this, but in this space artists were and hawing, we would get together of the important actors that have free to intervene as they pleased, on to celebrate the civil birth of our YOU AND I made today's milieu possible. A walls, floors and all. And they could basic Google search confronts us to also keep the traces and elements country, in our big village...?• BY LISANNE NADEAU the terrible reality that centers like left by their predecessors. We AND GUY SIOUI DURAND* Obscure are for many a memory of a Notes were witnessing, from one work to nd distant past. another, a form of palimpsest. It was 1 Extract from Engramme, see on website Banff, Tuesday January 22 2008 www.meduse.org/engramme. Dear Lisanne, You start all of this with 1978, the In situ in its first phase where the main point was to consider, before 2 These two years have seen the From my window, I observe the and that speaks to me directly. It emergence of a generation of artists. tops of the Rockies. The tremendous was the year of the founding of anything else, the architectural Many artists involved at Comme Galerie drifting snow, lifted by the winds, La chambre blanche, a center for specificity of each space, and then to became known in Quebec City, to works to amalgamate the sky to artists where I have been active integrate a poetic element to it. This mention Raymonde April, François Joly, the valley in a milky fog. It is very for many years, as you know. This was a way of questioning the status Jean Lantier, Raymond Lavoie, Jean- sectioning of time, in decades, is very of the work of art as an object, and Marie Martin, Joëlle Morosoli, Serge cold. Even this far out, this horizon also the traditional and neutral Utopia Murphy and Michèle Waquant. Also, two liberates my reflections: how to productive because I think they were professors at the Écoles des arts visuels tell the story of living art which moments of distinct developments inherent to the way we hang them. I also exhibited at the Galerie Comme, has now 30 years with the City as with distinct objectives. Going remember that we were all interested namely Claude Girard and Michel Labbé. its real subject? What can we say back and revisiting mentally this in the works done by Lapointe and 3 The Comme Galerie became Galerie about « art actuel » in Quebec City, trajectory makes me realize that we Fleming and their investments in Comme to make the name more in 2008? Furthermore, how to be up are coming from very far, coming dilapidated spaces in Montreal. "French". This was one of the conditions for the challenge of writing, in duo, out of the seventies' formalism to When I was young, I had been to to obtain the right to incorporate as a multidisciplinary approaches, even non-profit organization. a narrative which relates its artists to the Galerie Joliette and the Galerie the Cité: the interdisciplinary of today's world. du Musée (which was previously 4 André Bécot is a sculptor that taught I will tell you my story. We will see at the Arts Department of the CEGEP First, it seems wise to start called I'Anse-aux-Barques), two Sainte-Foy. He is now retired and still with a kind of remembrance of if yours meets mine on the way... essential spaces for their diffusion owns a space in Saint-Rock. things past, going back in time Lisanne of contemporary arts in Quebec City 5 See Yves Robillard in Le jour, Montreal, until, maybe, 1978, isn't it? I have at the time. But then, Françoise's April IS* 1977. always given some importance Banff, Saturday January 26'" installation was something else. The 6 See Jean Royer, in Le soleil, February 12, to transition periods, shifts from Lisanne, transformation of the small room 1977. one time to another. In this case a With this e-mail, I am telling you into an immaculate white space 7 See Jean Tourangeau, « Jean-Claude decade to another. Also, as we start that I utterly accept your proposition. opened the way to an untold visual St-Hilaire », in Vie des Arts, vol. 21, Spring this correspondence and for clarity I like this idea of beginning with and physical experience. At the time, issue 1977, p. 86. purposes, I suggest that we keep in the "first experiences". Even installation, like René Payant was 8 See Jean Tourangeau, « Galerie Comme: mind these chronological blocks as better, during this exchange, such saying, was coming out of painting. Entrevue avec Odette Ducasse et Jean- landmarks: from 1978 until 1988, « confidences » will do nothing else This sensation of being IN troubled Claude St-Hilaire » in dérives, Montreal, from 1988 until 1998, and from 1998 but stimulate. I catch a glimpse me profoundly. I had the will to l'Enmieux, n° 10-11,1977. until 2008.1 know, and there I will of this lived experience. It will become more engaged as a member. It was another time! Computers prolongation into Lockwell Street. I signifier and signified of works of I find myself at the public were nonexistent. I had wanted to go from door to door, take the pen art needed to be considered in the audiences, young, naive and change our press releases and some and write in « L'opinion du lecteur ». contexts in which they appeared and exalted... this happened, I believe, in members told me that we should Surprise, I received words of participated. 1979... if my memory is correct. The not look like a commercial gallery. congratulations from my neighbors. That said, because I have new generation will not remember When we look at their history, we see My meeting with Richard Martel was been one of the organizers and what happened, and it seems that centers for artists have moved a landmark. He introduced me to the participants, the event Art et société important to return to this history. from an alternative status to their review Intervention and to the world has been, in my opinion, the second The Ministry of Cultural Affairs, in full recognition. We will have to of art action. shift helping me to understand fact, M. Vaugeois opened public see, together, this evolution and its Between 1977 and 1982,1 better the arts' mutations, namely audiences in order to present and consequences. At the beginning of circulate with curiosity and interest in 1) political art leaving behind evaluate reactions to project of the eighties, many people moved the various creative "dematerialized" its militant aspects to become a the Musée de l'homme d'ici. It was to Montreal. Many creators like milieu. In the Faubourg, we find form of activism 2) the world of an idea issued by the high levels Raymonde April, Serge Murphy, the Atelier de réalisation graphique performances of art vacillating of the government. The objective Fabienne Bilodeau, Michèle Waquant (ARG, 1972), La chambre blanche between the social and the body and was to transform the Musée du and Francine Guay (today at the (a photo studio in 1978 which will 3) the Conference at the Canadian Québec in a Musée de l'homme, 1%) had already left to Montreal. I become a parallel gallery in 1978) Institute (with its 300 visitors coming that is a space open to the relations remember rubbing shoulders with the Galerie Comme (from 1974 until from others parts of Quebec) between art and ethnology, and Bernard Bilodeau, Isabelle Bernier, 1977), the Atelier André Bécot (1978) confirms, in this moment, the impor­ therefore associate Quebec City to Monique Mongeau, Guy Pellerin, Le Lieu (dedicated to social art and tance of networks. its patrimony. This also encouraged a Michel Asselin, Francine Chaîné and performance, 1982) and Obscure Guy centralized vision of the tools serving Chantai Boulanger. All of them left. (audio, video and multidisciplinary to the diffusion of contemporary Then Hélène Rochette and Helga arts, 1982). The center VU (1982) Wednesday January 30"' art and art actuel in Montreal. The Schlitter left. André Pelletier and rented a space on Garneau Street, in Guy, expression « Musée de l'homme Sylvie Gagné have unfortunately the Upper City. I am learning now that you were d'ici » was also retrograde. I was stopped their productions. Saint-Jean Street is the lively involved in the movement opposing a very young feminist and I was They were outstanding artists. quarter of the Faubourg Saint-Jean the refurbishing of Parliament Hill. raging at its machism and its François Lachappelle also. She had Baptiste. The exhibit called Reliques, Political and social actions really ethnocentrisms. Finally, the students coordinated a section of art actuel at by Jean-Claude St-Hilaire at André punctuate your career... your first in art history and La chambre Quebec City's celebration in 1984, for Bécot (1978), at the crossings of article written for Intervention was blanche (it was the first time I heard La chambre blanche. I did not know anthropology and body art, had also on the cultural scene of the of this collective) and other groups anything, as many of my colleagues. impressed me as much as did this Saint-Jean-Baptiste area. We are have submitted their reports. The That said, we could see all the work interdisciplinary department at the now hoping to do the same thing, tone was unanimous and loud, thank that needed to be done in a city CEGEP Limoilou (i974-i977). I had together. This is incredible... you you very much. like ours and all the possibilities for studied there at the college level, are right, Jean-Claude St-Hilaire's Thankfully, this project never explorations. During the years I was close to Gilles Arteau. I will see him recollections of the seventies, in this materialized. I learned that René active in the collective, and the main again later, at some point alongside dossier, will be very important. It will Lévesque himself had ultimately drive was to serve art in situ. It is the experimental music group called also be important not to forget, in decided. All the money (20 millions) still important today, as a matter of Bruit TTV, or at another time with the this reading of cultural mappings, which was supposed to go to fact. My understanding of in situ has theater group known as Arbo Cyber the infiltration happening in Saint- develop the Musée du Québec was changed, of course, but I cannot deny theater (?) I was also participating Roch and its many dilapidated given to the project of the Musée the profound impact of this period. to a radio show at CKRL-MF, run for buildings invested, in the seventies, de la Civilisation. It is certain that Lisanne a while by Arteau. The adventure by artists such as Jocelyn Gasse. this has stopped the growth of our of the center Obscure, and, as I will Indeed, I would like to insist on art museum. It is also certain that mention later, the founding of the the importance of the presence this is a testimony to a past time Tuesday January 29,h Regroupement des centres d'artistes of artists, individually, in the of our history, and fortunately the Lisanne, autogérés du Québec (RCAAQ) and of area. Their action is as crucial and consciousness has changed since. The intimate tone of your letter the cooperative Méduse are indeed complementary as the ones offered I was on the front. It was exalting. warmed up my recollections of indissociable. by centers by creating an artistic I have seen the most experienced these times. These "first impressions" At the end of 1977,1 participate milieu in sync with urban life. We artists with the sharpest tongues. It will also, I imagine. It will make few at the founding meetings of the will see it later on in the nineties is there that I have seen how words people remember. It will also wake review Intervention (which became and recently with Saint-Roch's have incredible power. Le Lieu also up the spirit of younger people inter, art actuel later on), appearing revitalization. At last, it will also participated to all of this. when they will be reading about this on the scene for the first time on be important to mention the law Small parenthesis here, it is recent past, which is not very often March 4,1978.1 had the impression concerning the artist's status, dating also at that time, more precisely mentioned. Two of "these situations" of joining a true community and from 1988. A law that will help the in 1981, that we have seen certain comes to mind, at the beginning of neighborhood epic of the city. I development not only of the tools newspapers screaming scandal for the seventies. First, there was the also remember that people such of representations, but the defense the wood sculpture done by David need to join the community life, the as François Begin, Jean-Claude St- of royalties given to authors. We will Naylor, at the Musée du Québec. Art one taking place in the new spaces Hilaire, Diane-Jocelyne Côté, Chantai talk. actuel was not popular in the media, dedicated to arts in the Faubourd Gaudreau, Pierre-André Arcand, Lisanne but the public (I was an animator Saint-Jean-Baptiste (such as Patrick Altman, Richard Martel and at the Museum at the time) was described by Jean-Claude St-Hilaire Francine Bergeron were present. wondering what was so scandalous in his brilliant essay in this edition) Thirty years later, I can honestly Friday February 1'' - and that was extremely reassuring and, secondly, the happening Art et say that it was not by fate if my first Guy, it's me again... to me. société. article to appear in Intervention was Simultaneously, I had in my head I would like you to write back Living there, I am taking part in on the sociocultural and artistic life the other "milestone" - to use your to me concerning the Musée de various issues of the Faubourg's life, of the Faubourg Saint-Jean-Baptiste. expression. I was telling myself that l'homme d'ici. I suppose that on your particularly the latest refurbishing This "spirit" of the time of art shifting we should not forget this historical side things worked out differently. of Parliament Hill. You also have the in Quebec. It meant that for the moment. I have no problem Lisanne highway projects compromising sociologist and art critic's views, qualifying this file of the Musée de Saint-Gabriel Street and their all analysis of content and form, l'homme d'ici as "atrocious"! nd Saturday February 2 diffusion did not have the room, the analysis of the relations between constitution of the Regroupements Lisanne, equipment nor the money to present the various components of the des centres d'artistes autogérés du Indeed, this history had an impact extensive projects like this one. Also, world of arts. However, and it is the Québec, the RCAAQ. on the future of the Musée. That said, the collective that conceived Art et first object of our exchange, I think, Guy this crisis also revealed the link that société will start Le Lieu only in 1982. this networking reality captivates united Quebec artists to their only art Indeed, during this period in the me as a driving force, in the art institution. The "affair" will become a 70's, and later in the 8o's, the Galerie development in the city. After this Monday late evening national public debate. Most artists du Musée (I'Anse-aux-Barques) at community effervescence and the Guy, and groups in Quebec will take the Place-Royale was managed like crisis of the Upper City, at the end This mention of the RCAAQ part in it, with reports to testify and a real contemporary art Gallery. of the seventies and beginning of brings this remark to me: I cannot maintain the artistic vocation. The Andrée Laliberté-Bourque was close eighties, the urban evolution of art count the representations structures review Intervention will have a special to the milieu. She discussed with actuel is moving. The Gabrielle Roy to which I gave my time: the issue about it, no. 5. artists, was open to suggestions. Library, which opens in 1981 at Place Conseil de la Culture, the deceased That said, Lisanne, this complex The physical distance with the Jacques-Cartier, plays the role of a ANNPAC-RACA, the RCCAQ (where relation of local artists to institutions museum institutions allowed it pioneer institution. It offers not only you there in 1986 at founding appears to me paradoxical. It is a to act not as a sacred space, but access to books, films and discs but meeting in Vancouver?). It is often sentiment of dissonance, which rather as a space of living art. In this also to works of arts via its artothèque. in such occasions that solidarity was presides to my first socio-artistic respect, Guy, Laurent Bouchard was It also operates an auditorium for or blossoming or annihilated. It is implications. For many people like recently reminding me that it was shows, and an exhibition place. also there that we have acquired a me (who subscribes to the views the Ministry of Public Works that Indeed, many have seen in this discourse, a force of reckoning, that of self-management of means of had given its house to the Musée. Library, in Saint-Roch, the prototype we mastered our actions for a better productions, reflections and diffusion Maybe they thought they would for what would be the Grande diffusion of the body of works, got of art in society) the Musée and other create an "heritage" space - even if Bibliothèque Nationale du Québec, better conditions for artists. May I institutions was a living proof of the museum still had the mandate to in Montreal, 20 years later! But it is remind you that it is thanks to the an opening towards the emerging serve ethnology... the emerging centers for artists that centers for artists that museums milieu. Aside the gallery of I'Anse-aux The Musée had thus the Museum will set the fire for the socio-artistic have begun, during the 8o's, to give Barques that you have mentioned, Gallery, far enough to maintain change happening afterwards. decent royalties to artists? under the impulsion of educative its freedom, and the CPOA, as In fact, these collectives of artists Reading your letter, I see that services, the Musée had shown a real you mention it, which somewhat have given themselves some "tools" while we add almost no support concern for the arts in the present intervenes at the margin of regular of assembling, creation and non­ from official systems when it came by programming Conferences and diffusion activities. Furthermore, profit diffusion. Their modalities to recognize the value of local artists, Symposiums with themes such as in 1989 (and always in respect to were cooperative, not to mention people in Quebec City were on their teaching the arts at the University what concerns our interactions the "parallel" galleries leaving Saint- best behaviour with the national (Constat, 1978), and the role of in the museum culture) centers Jean Baptiste for the "growing" City, structures of representation. Getting art reviews and the wheels of the organize a collective to celebrate in its lower sectors (such as the old together passed first and foremost contemporary art market. the 150 years of photography (we harbour) and literally the Lower city by concerted political action. In this respect, I remember the will talk about this later). The Musée (in Saint-Roch). Since 1976, for La Secondly, we had to learn to work very interesting conference given puts together the event Paysages chambre blanche (photographers together and collectively to help by Yves Robillard, art historian, critic verticaux on the plaines. For me, this and residences in situ) Saint-Roch diffusing the arts, which was slower. and "artor"on the adventure of the was a very important event. Louise was home, on Christophe-Colomb We are doing it with success today. underground scene in Montreal, in Déry worked at the Galerie du Musée Street. It would become the "in" I am stopping myself here before the 6o's and 70's. The topic (which and later as a curator in art actuel place of conceptual art, performance, going further, because we have to was supposed to be the art market at the Musée until 1992. It was just videos and conference such as end this portrait of the first years. in Quebec) rapidly shifted to the before the radical slowing down Robert Filliou. It would later move Lisanne importance, for the system, of of actions at the Musée, and also on Saint-Jean Street and return what sociologist Pierre Bourdieu in art actuel. A kind of depression on Charest Boulevard in 1981. was calling at the time "the scope lasting for the following 10 years. The atelier of graphic realisations Monday February 4*, almost of art". We were many to digress She had conceived this event. But (the ARG, which would become midnight with Robillard in a dubious bar on the community, if you remember, Engramme, in 1990) and VU find Yes, yes, Lisanne, close to the Cartier Street, talking about self- had expressed some frustrations locations near the Place-Royale. magic of the arts and its poetics you management by artists! to the effect that only one artist In 1986, Obscure is relocating on will find, as always, the political and We also should remember that from Quebec City was part of the the côte d'Abraham and L'Œil the economic aspects. I was not in at the beginning of the eighties, selection. The recognition of Quebec de Poisson, the youngest of all Vancouver in 1986 but I was in Alma, more precisely in 1982, the Musée, City's artists as major agents in the these centers for artists, is born in the previous year, and you were also in collaboration with the Ministry of art actuel's evolution was anything 1985 in Saint-Sauveur. Few other there. The ANNPAC-RACA, that is the Cultural Affairs at the time, starts its but sure at the time. We were organizations and collectives such as Association of National Non Profit Collection prêt d'oeuvres d'art (CPOA) swimming between this frustration Folie/Culture (social art), Réparation Artist-Run Centers or Regroupement - one that includes, in 2008, over and the joy of witnessing the birth of de poésie (oral poetics) or the Centre des artistes de centres d'artistes, was 2000 works representing 700 artists! impactuels events. textuel ofSaint-Ubald (contextual getting together in the Lac-Saint- Regards. Lisanne art), around Jean-Yves Frechette. Jean region. This was a significant Guy The latter will realize few great wind of change in itself. Sitting close projects in the city such as Le Lieu dit to Gilles Arteau and René Payant, Monday February 4* le lieu (1982) and G mon soleil sans who was sick, we had a conversation Sunday February 3"1 Lisanne, complexe (1983). All these projects which, to my "native" sensibility, was Guy, Thanks for your precisions were attached to the core of the no less than one of "transmission". Many events from the eighties, about the complexities of the Saint-Roch area. These power relations with the such as Art et société and Réseau art- relations between the milieu and I will end here by mentioning a State will develop themselves, find femmes, were indeed presented at the institutions, here, in this case, structuring element of visibility, at a better structure, one that is also the Musée du Québec, something the Musée. It was in part what I the scale of Quebec and testifying to larger than our words here. But it is that may be viewed today as was hoping to bring to light, when its effervescence. In the middle of the important since you bring it into our surprising. We have to remember I have written on the feelings of eighties, centers for artists in Quebec discussion. that the spaces reserved for dissonance and ambivalence in the City will play an important role in the Guy Thursday February 7 grouping together are not part of of common, and, mostly, to create Indeed, I am telling you an Dear Guy, the centers' landscapes composing and diffuse art. It is about using hypothesis, by saying that it is in I took some days to write to the visual arts networks at the time. the modes of participation outside the favor of the art event creation you. This meeting of the Canadian We will have to return to these the models of exhibiting as such. that the whole dialogue between Association in Alma has its similarities, ways of belongings and The projects and themes opened various agents from Quebec City's importance. The event is memorable. coexisting which have grown over themselves to the dematerialization scene in art actuel will structure We were a whole group from Quebec time. The definition of art actuel and of practices, going from conceptual themselves progressively - some City in the Saguenay. The energy its diffusion has known rapid and art to environmental sculptures, not would say slowly. Hence the case of was palpable, and it is there that the important developments. Obscure to mention performances. It is in this some manifestations at the end of idea of being autonomous, in the will have an important role in the sense that I can say that the inter/ the eighties and the beginning of difficulty of finding oneself in front evolution of our identities by its regional and international networks the nineties, such as Mirabile Visu: de of this inevitable cultural dichotomy, explicit multidisciplinary mission. were established, as always, in favor la performance à la manoeuvre and took shape. In Vancouver, the The center begins to be more of a creative output nourished by the the Première Biennale d'art actuel de following year, the regroupement explicitly active in the diffusion of Utopia of total art. Québec. québécois was founded under the visual art in 1984. And, as far as The have such names: L'objet I would like to have your name Regroupement des centres the video is concerned, it begins fugitif (1978) by the collective of thoughts, knowing that you lived d'artistes autogérés du Québec in 1989, in another perspective La chambre blanche, an event in through the first event. (RCAAQ). marked by a background « multi ». conceptual art, communal and Guy The organizational life of the L'Œil de Poisson begins its atelier- audacious. Then would come Art et centers for artists that you mention, photo in 1985. It becomes another société in Quebec City (1981) and as always, implies a lot of elements space of diffusion proposing Art et politique: Attention à l'art, in Sunday February io,h speaking to me: the successive projects associated with the Kassel, Germany, at the margins of Yes, Guy, appearance of centers which have young generation. Art becomes an documenta (1982) and realized by As much as I would like to return survived to this day. Also, how occasion for festive events. The years the review Intervention. In the wake to the events at the beginning of the they have defined their respective 1984-1985 brings a new impulsion, of feminism, Quebec City will be eighties - it was then common -1 will mandates, the question of networks, after a period of important exode. at the core of Réseau art-femmes move further towards the beginning structures of representation that You are evoking the spaces (1982) which takes place in six of the next decade. It is because a have given rise to all centers, and a of establishment of centers. It is regions in the province of Quebec. crucial moment of this evolution, of good kick to our partners, at last a important to note that VU was a bit We will also see, one year later: this emergence of networks between series of event that have emerged at the margins, in the eighties, with Art et écologie: Un temps, six lieux, centers in our City, is without a doubt during the eighties in centers, etc. its location on Garneau Street. Later organized by the Atelier Insertion the happening, and all the collective Ouf! on, it has moved on Dalhousie Street, in Chicoutimi in collaboration with works which brought to reality This question of networks, so in this small house falling apart. We Le Lieu, in Quebec City (1983. We Mirabile Visu: 150 ans après. We are cherished by you, is extremely were never sure if, at an opening, will also have 76 heures:Marathon in 1989, with all people involved and significant. I would like to come back the floor would not collapse under d'écriture (1983) happening at Place- under VU's impulsion, I would say of to it first. In fact, connections with the weight of the many visitors! Fleur-de-Lys, which will surprise. Gaétan Gosselin who had replaced other regions in the province were There has been, it seems, a change And Le Lieu will start its festival of Christiane Jobin at the coordination made, notably in your sector. We will of climate, a singular energy during performance art (with the events In level. We see a will to work together have to talk about this again. We will this period. For instance, the center memoriam Georges Macianus, 1984; that goes beyond the simple have to wait another decade before founded under the initiative of Espèces nomades, 1986). I think that anniversary of the photo medium. speaking of a real network of centers Christiane Jobin and Lucie Lefebvre, again, the hybrid manifestation I see, as far as I am concerned, the for artists in Quebec City. It will be a asked for collaboration with Obscure Enformances... ou les 120 heures at seeds for a new way of thinking in very long process, one that will be for the loan of its equipment among Laval University (1987). networks, on the local scene, a will nourished by various elements and other things. It is important to Because I have been part of to work together after 1 o years of circumstances, in relation to which, mention the close net of relations it, I would like to insist on a fact. preparations. today, we have some distance. In established with other organizations While these new actors, collectives You are right to say that in 1986, this regard, you may remember the and galleries also specialized in and centers have had leaders - I the founding of RCAAQ was funda­ Conference that I had organized at photography, on the national and am thinking of Serge Murphy and mental. But on the level of our action the ten anniversary of La chambre international scenes. VU has thus Fabienne Bilodeau for the Marathon in the field of practices of art diffu­ blanche in 1988. The Conference was created its own networks outside d'écriture and Richard Martel at sion in themselves, Mirabile Visu was on the network of parallel galleries, Quebec City, like Le Lieu. the review Intervention -, for most a first. The RCAAQ had its leaders, its like we used to call it, even then. The The multiplication of centers has of these events and programs, political action, but Mirabile Visu was climate was not so warm. There were forced us to formally and explicitly an authentic process of dialogue something else. I had left La chambre still tensions between Le Lieu and La define our mandates, act and be and realization was also assumed, blanche and I had the chance to join chambre blanche during this period. consistent. I don't know if it was collectively. In all cases, it was the the team in the role of coordinator. During the eighties, the Atelier entirely positive, but this certainly reality at the review Intervention, It was like a fresh breath of energy, de réalisations graphiques, La allowed us to work with confidence and at the beginning of Le Lieu: a year where it was possible to chambre blanche, VU, and Le Lieu and avoid a certain type of Pierre Monat's graphic design will share, in spite of our differences, our work more in a vase clos, with utterly competition. Maybe a saner climate have been groundbreaking at the passion and commitment to shared distinct approaches and mandates. was created. review, as much as the contribution causes. I don't know if this « mission » We were all fighting to survive. The Lisanne of people like Diane-Jocelyne Côté, is still alive in the attitude of people fights for grants was not helping Chantai Gaudreault, Pierre-André who are now running self-managed the development of a cohesion and Arcand, Jean-Claude St-Hilaire, centers, but during that period, we complicity on the level of a common Friday February 8,h Jean-Claude Gagnon, Alain-Martin were motivated by it. I think that vision of our needs nor on the More than interesting, Lisanne, Richard, Patrick Altman, Jean-Yves my generation, the one of Claude level of sharing about great issues are these details. They help us clarify Frechette and Nathalie Perrault. Bélanger, Richard Martel, Christiane touching the practices' evolution. our own views. I want to pursue This self-management will finally be Jobin, Gaétan Gosselin and Gilles My point of view might differ from in this direction by mentioning a spread too thin. The task divisions will Arteau, Réjean Perron and Hélène yours here, since I have worked second driving force, complementary become more and more professional Doyon was animated by an indefec­ in a center. We can note that La to the constitution of the network's and complex by the appearing roles tible passion pushing us to give to Bande Vidéo (1977) and Spirafilm mechanisms. It is about these of coordinator and curator. We will be no end and without counting. We (1977) still exist to this day. These occasions to meet, to explore in discussing this later on. had indeed, in the context of this event, invented almost all agents the sociological view doesn't offer it possible that all these events artists hope to consolidate their of the cultural scene. Gaétan saw very often because only the socio- happened is such a short period of working conditions. They are getting things in a big way. It was for him the artistic facts do matter. This idea of a time? You can see some comments together to buy the building they opportunity to affirm the undeniable dialogue on our city and its arts will that come to mind regarding occupy, and it will be the founding place of artists centers in the network contribute, I hope to give a place to the event De la performance à la of La Maison longue, an important diffusion of art actuel. the necessary emotive dimensions of manoeuvre, and the Ateliers ouverts moment in 1993.1 will need to The fact that centers invite a plural history, one that we're only and also some comments on the take few lines here to mention museums to participate to one of approaching on the surface. From absence of a curator for art actuel at the program which assisted artists their events was to demonstrate how this "great wind of effervescence... the museum at the time. All of these in purchasing property (atelier- we had gained an undeniable profes­ also fragile", as you rightly mention are facts that have made the art residences). To this day, Quebec sional level, how we were adamant it, which comes out of the networks scene, in the nineties, in Quebec City. City will be a model because of this to affirm loud and clear the crucial at the beginning of the nineties, I am happy to see that you program, in this domain, on the role we were now playing. This is can we see there a creative time mention this manifestation coming national and international scenes. not a small thing. It is an important and space that, paradoxically, will out of the Première Biennale... we can In 1996, Quebec City initiates step that we can easily forget. The be as intense but in a different way? see again this desire for a dialogue, this program to assist artists in perception that many people had, Many hypothesis, many angles a need to create an event bringing purchasing property. It allows many thinking that artists centers were of interpretation on these links people together. Each center for artists to establish their studio or exclusively forced to play the role of produced or neutralized between all visual arts tempted to initiate studio-residence, essentially in the a springboard for young creators (a art agents in Quebec City, during the the movement in its own way. I Saint-Roch area. Studio complex will perception which was almost a given nineties, will have to be considered. remember that for this event, Florent then emerge. Associated with grants at the time) was weakening at last. This will be captivating! Cousineau had conceived, with the for renovations, this program helped This great wind of effervescence Thanks for insisting on what collaboration of few members of La revitalizing many industrial offices was also fragile, because we have happened behind the scene at chambre blanche, a crazy project which were disused -ten of them in tried to revisit the idea of an event the event Mirabile Visu. Thanks called Opération liaison, taking the the area. It encouraged artists with that mobilized people. We tried to for reminding me about the local shape of a fictitious radio program meager means to become owners. create another Mirabile Visu, some issues and the beginning of a great inspired by Hitchcock. This link with This program is unique and many years later, and it failed. In Gaëtan's climate which will take a decade to the team working at Le lieu had cities here and elsewhere (I have had absence, the different points of view structure itself. Indeed, the following pleased us. In fact, in writing to you, I French civil servants visit because around the table became bigger, and year, in 1990, the Première Biennale realize that it was important to make they were interested in this program) it is at this moment that I realized d'art actuel in Quebec, under the the auditors believe that a bundle of see an example to follow. We have that we had still a lot of work to do theme « De la performance à la wood was walking in the city from also seen the birth of collaborations to be able to work harmoniously. manœuvre » initiated by Le Lieu and one center to the next, testifying to with artists which were neighbors, Claude Bélanger, who was still at sponsored by most of the centers a desire to make the existence of dancers, actors, and musicians. This L'Œil de Poisson, was extremely for artists, will stand as a landmark a network concrete. I was in Banff presence of artists living in the area disappointed by this failure. In fact, of this phenomenon. It will have myself. To each their turn! helped to reduce the violence in the Mirabile Visu was the germ of what no immediate effect except for the At another level, I agree with neighborhood. In 1988, beer bottles would become the Manif d'art, intentions to create a major event. you, it is important to go back to were thrown to people and the almost a decade later. There were Installations and other creations in this question of the artists actions syringes were littering Christophe- in between a number of attempts, situ as well as more residences for outside the centers. You speak of Colomb Street. At the end of the often futile, sometimes difficult. creation are the most popular option atelier ouverts. In fact, the event is nineties, the area becomes a cultural To be sarcastic, this passage for works programmed to be viewed born in 1984, under the initiative of sector with an undeniable quality. from Art et société to Mirabile Visu in exhibit rooms. And by welcoming Helga Schlitter and Francine Chaîné. The residents have thus benefited in the network of centers for artists many artists from Quebec and the Additional participants included from this change of climate, and, at seems to me significant afterwards. world, Quebec City becomes a Guy Pellerin, Monique Mongeau, last, artists have stopped being the The passage to the nineties is, and I center for major international events thus people close to me, a group speculation's victims! can't wait to talk about it with you, a according a lot of importance to of artists of La chambre blanche. This evolution is evidently the passage from an underground reality the renewal of artistic practices. For Afterwards, Odette Théberge played result of the will of the mayor L'Allier, to an institutionalization of the struc­ instance, audio art is blossoming an important role by improving the ex-minister of Culture. We should tures of diffusion. Centers became at the Festival Évitez le bruit structure of what had become an remember that he has seen the more professional over the years. The (1989) and media arts emerge at important event. Videre, founded in potential between new technologies, absolute moment of this movement manifestations such as Le corps 1991, will take over. We can consider teaching institutions (among which will be, as far as I am concerned, the amplifié: L'informatique appliquée aux these actions as a will to create a the Écoles des arts visuels of Laval creation of Méduse. For instance, arts (1993) and La parallaxe (1996) dialogue between artist. A will that University, which was relocated in the the shift of L'Œil de Poisson from organized by Obscure. is in sync with the gradual closeness Dominion Corset Building in 1984) a center organizing festivals and I also remember the success between agents, already noticed by and the artists. The artists centers disjointed events into an old space, of the Ateliers ouverts, a circuit of centers during the same period. will also see their living condition to a center with secure financing and visiting artists workshops. Videre, 1988 is an important year. getting better by the nineties, with later occupying a space as good as the association of professional Especially when we analyze the tools the Méduse complex whom, in 1994, a museum is noteworthy. And they artists of Quebec, was one of its best used for dialogue and the artists' allowed the consolidation of about were not the only ones! But in saying advocate. claims outside the self-managed ten self-managed centers. We will that, we enter into the nineties. Yet another sign of this vitality. centers. It sees to the establishment talk about this later. And you have to Lisanne Guy of the law on the professional status remember that La chambre blanche of artists and ethical pressures in buys its building in 1992. order to constitute an organization Lisanne 1988-1998 Wednesday February i3,h of unique representation. You Dear Guy, know this history full of harrowing Wednesday February 13* Limoilou, February i2,h I have been really busy with the battles between artists of different Hello to you, Lisanne, Manif, these last days. Sorry. Both of venues. This goes beyond our actual Your precisions are important, Back to the Kabir-Kouba River us are feeling that time and space discussion. But finally, in 1992, the Lisanne. They force me to pursue (Saint-Charles), I read your phrases are missing to make a portrait of Regroupement des artistes en arts about this climate of synergy and with pleasure. You add this inner these three very dynamic decades. visuels (RAAV) was created. On the collaboration between acting sensibility to acts and events that Yes, indeed, the nineties. How is local scene, we feel otherwise that networks, in their urban contexts. Although the progressive move respect, how can we not mention the the project Chambres d'hôtel with Saturday February i6'h of many centers for artists and unbelievable quality of such creation your husband and your baby!" I was Dear Lisanne, the appearance of a municipal project put forward by La chambre flabbergasted! I have never lost this I have always loved infiltration program to assist in the purchasing blanche, called Chambres d'hôtels utopie desire to make people aware projects in the city, contaminations of studios give a new face to the (1993) and the art photography which of new works. Let's say that, this in non-lieu of the everyday by the urban landscape (what we started becomes and open zone for the time, it was a success. arts. I see in it the concrete heritage calling the Saint-Roch space), it creation of Trois fois 3 paysages (1997- In situ allowed me to see the of the revolutionary Utopia that the is important for me to mention 1998) here and there in the city? possibility of making an event from venerable Marxist sociologist Henri personal contributions. For one, Guy the works. And following that, this Lefebvre (whom I had the chance the continuous work of Florent insertion in the urban texture forced to meet in 1981 when he came Cousineau who, with his sculpture me to look at the question of the Quebec City) shared for a while projects, residences and manoeuvre Friday February 15* public. How do we intervene in with the international situationists. I such as Opération liaison that Guy, as always, you radically the street, in the everyday, without had the privilege to meet with him. you mentioned, and more, was open a door on an effervescent thinking about the person looking, He was really interested in all the remarkable. Hasn't he made of urban period. As I read, striking is what without reflecting its presence, self-managed projects criticizing textures and built environments its you mention about the îlot which is still a pertinent question centralist forms, among which our privilege material for creation to Fleurie, where collective gardens today. At the moment where we had adventure of centers for artists. make sure that renovated buildings introduced a natural environment to return to La chambre blanche's Lefebvre thought that the revolution dedicated to artists become real in with ephemeral sculptures and coordination, François Valléee and could not be anything else than the area? We only have to mention some more permanent. This was an myself had radicalized the center's urban, « manifestive ». He has the building « Roulement à billes » incredible collective empowerment. mandate: In situ and residences. remained one of my mentors. Then, near the École des arts visuels, It is evident that later, the City cannot Then, in 1998, we had established to have witnessed and to be invited and, later, the one of « La falaise go back: it will become later the very the Rencontres internationales by Florent Cousineau to live through, apprivoisé » to understand the scope site of the Saint-Roch Gardens. en arts visuels (RIAV) which had in situ, one of these "hotel rooms" of his interventions. While we return to the event « communication » as a theme, as a situation was remarkable. Many Indeed, it is hard for the Chambres d'hôtel, which you also and strangely enough, because I artists were my guests during that sociologist not to mention this core have lived through, I would like to am actually putting together and night: Pierre-André Arcand came to of humble citizens of a dilapidated go deeper in this venue, that is the event on human communication in write a poem, Jean-Claude Gagnon Saint-Roch (that you mentioned in role of in situ as far at this notion is the context of the Manif 4. Taking to play the saxophone, and others, your 1s' letter). Citizens that have important to my whole career. It is another way, the relational aesthetic and the door semi-opened to the (from 1991 onwards) given back a indeed interesting to see how artists current was starting. We had invited other, the improbable, what could dignity to this area by creating the and centers for artists have invested a Serbian artist who had placarded not be situated... îlot Fleurie under the leadership the city, the new cultural center of the city. François Lamontage But one should not move away of sculptor Louis Fortier and few Saint-Roch. I have always believed opened a small studio where he from the more and more complex voluntary gardeners. We will find that Quebec City, because of its invited visitors to dress objects while realities of art in Quebec City, in the there more than the basic popular scale and geography, was facilitating putting them in regulated relations. nineties. premises important to the planning events where the public is invited to Murielle Dupuis-Larose showed her For instance, as symbolic as of the place (where we today find circulate from one space to the next, first video installation... in 1998, the city's recognition, in 1994, of Saint-Roch gardens and the park of the way the event of Manif d'art is we had also conceived an event in January 17th as the Art Anniversary the Grande Place at the bottom of doing it. the old jail of the Maison Gomin. (an initiative of Le Lieu ) might Méduse and the côte d'Abraham). You have often spoken to People were lining up to see the look, it was all about promoting a In fact, from 1995, while the series me about your passion for the prison. We could not believe the mark in the calendar of this attitude of events such as Émergences were event Chambres d'hôtel. It was 15 events, thousands of people and addressed to "a universal and eternal taking place and despite its two interventions in situ, in as much hotel a lineup... it is important to say network between the artists of moves (they will have to be moved rooms in the city. Michel Goulet, that Robert Gilet had done a stellar the world". This attitude was put up to the access roads of the Dufferin Patrick Altman, Guy Pellerin, Claudie advertising job. Many questions forward by the influential artists Highway in 1998) the îlot Fleurie Gagnon and many others have come to mind: where they coming Fluxus Robert Filliou and others, like will become a unique zone for the participated to this event. I have to the see the art or the space? Was the poet Jean Dupuy, whom will art actuel scene. Many international participated to it on many levels. it conceivable to seduce a public surprisingly join the commandos tribunes dedicated to landscape Chambres d'hôtel was to celebrate not so much interested in art and nomades in 2003.1 will return to architecture will be most interested. the 15 years of La chambre blanche, give it its first contact with today's this later. I know that I insist a lot Founded on this dynamic closeness and we had dreamed collectively practices? You will maybe remember on that, but at the margins of the between community groups, cultural to this project, with Sylvie Fortin the wonderful interventions done main institutional pathways, it organizations and centers for artists, and Carl Johnson, responsible for by Michel Saint-Onge and Patrick seems to me that Quebec City has gardening workshops, gardens the coordination. We wanted to Altman? Then RIAV's second edition simultaneously showed itself as a surrounded by sculptures, evenings intervene in the city, where we called Temporalité will happen in the point of reference from which the with poetry and music, picnics, could touch a larger public. It is year 2000. centers for artists will make many graffitis and murals will coexists, in important to remember that we Following these events in the city, networks possible, in the regions as the summer, along with performers had just moved. The loss of our few other interventions were born well as on the international scene. and activists. palimpsest type of space, when we before. I am thinking of the exhibition The sustained critical mass will We will enter in the year two moved in 1988 in the Saint-Roch put together by students graduating become such that these relations thousands, which I will return to area, was a rupture. A positive from the École des arts visuels at will allow a circulation and more later. rupture. We had to realign ourselves the Gauvreau-Beaudry Building, in diffusion of the artists' works. It will The intensification of the to this notion of in situ, in constant the old harbour, in 1987.1 refer also also stimulate the imagination for permanent presence of workshops evolution. The repetitive infiltration to the remarkable Lignes de suites thematic and art ideas in a period and its public spaces - like the of dilapidated sites or public spaces realised by the collective Arqhé (with where the narratives of the museum mall and many dilapidated spaces opened another venue. And it was Luc Lévesque, James Partaik and and the gallery will be discreet, the available in Saint-Roch - will then the whole question of urbanity Michel Saint-Onge), their Gazon de "void" which you mentioned earlier. motivate many artists to invest these was enlightened. One day, many luxe (1993). This centrifugal art in the The photographic manifes­ spaces during events. However, years later, I was sitting at a café city will evidently keep going while tations of international scope, of this tendency does not limit itself and a woman came to me and said: we passed the year 2000. the center VU are also many with to this area only, far from it. In this "I recognize you, you were part of Lisanne expositions such as: 04 50: La mission photographique, in Bruxels (1992), in the decentralization of our art a particular status, noticeable in the morphosis experienced by technolo­ Behold the Mon/Hommes nus in Scot­ history. On the level of our relations arts. On the one hand, we have seen gical arts and interdisciplinary. land (1993), Mujer x Mujer/Femmes outside Quebec City, there was all it, the socio-artistic agents in Quebec Until later. x Femmes in Mexico (1993) and these exchange realised with Latin City have affinities with artists groups Guy Les contes de Slovaquie (1994). VU America and Mexico. Many artists working in regions. In this respect, also organised major photographie from Quebec City never exposed the relations with the Saguenay- events and has helped the circulation in Montreal, but exhibited in Lac-Saint-Jean will be significant but Wednesday February 20'h of exhibitions on the national and Mexico and Buenos Aires, or even also with the Galerie Sans Nom in Dear Guy, international scenes, mostly Michel in Marseille and Cracow, thanks Moncton where, with Hélène Laro- You have mentioned Obscure's Campeau: Les tremblements du coeur to these exchanges organized by che's invitation (now at the CALQ, in role in this relation with the media (Canada, 1988) Faire image: Penser la various centers in Quebec City. This Quebec City) Obscure, Le Lieu, L'Œil arts and Méduse. You mention photographie (Québec, 1990), Le réel disregard of Montreal is difficult to de Poisson will visit. On the other La parallaxe, an event of creation et ses simulacres (Bruxel, Saint-Malo, understand for people who belong hand, I agree with your hypothesis and reflection, held in September Paris, Dieppe, 1991-1992; Canada to official networks. But we can't hide that it is also because of this surpas­ 1996. It is also the swan song of the (1992-1996), La traversée des mirages it, it is a reflex of a certain generation, sing on the international scene that cooperative Obscure, which closed (Champagne-Ardenne, 1992), Les maybe the one that left for Montreal Quebec City's artists hope to resolve its doors in 1996. Yes, a cooperative rencontres internationales de Plovdiv in the eighties, because of this this evident cultural tension with is such a singular way of functioning, (Bulgarie, 1995) and Du poétique au absence of recognition of our artists Montreal, that the exode of so many chosen "for the values of economic politique: Ambivalence des territoires by the Montreal scene, and even our artists exemplified. For the genera­ solidarity that it promotes". We (Basse-Normandie, 1996-1997). Let's own museum at a time in its history. tions today, I think that idea of going should also speak of Obscure's not forget the series Rencontres, at La Guy, am I in the woods? I would like everywhere is more important, crea­ impact, of these important pioneers: chambre blanche. to hear your views on the topic. It ting new comings and goings, as far Arteau, Robert Faguy, Réjean Perron, As far as the specific domain would be interesting to find out how as the place of origins is concerned. Jocelyn Robert, Robert Morin, Hélène of the art action is concerned and the young see their visibility outside I will talk about this later in the Doyon. It was the first center to put which I have closely analysed, the Quebec City. context of globalization of the scope forward multidisciplinary and the series of manifestations like Immedia Till later of arts and that the proliferation of new media arts at the time. Then concerto (1988), Interscop, Pologne Lisanne the biennials around the world - we came the video in the eighties, and, (1990), Oralités -Polyphonix (1991 ) are now counting 225 of these - will in the nineties (from 1993 onwards), and Interzone (1992), the Symposium implicate. what we would call "computer des sculptures in Saint-Wendel in Tuesday February 19"" This dialectic between the capital science applied to the arts". Many Germany (1993) and the one of Art Thanks Lisanne for mentioning and the métropole, I tend to see it centers or group existing today are, actuel in Amiens in France (1994), my travels as a "columnist" of art in the mid-nineties, between 1994 it is fair to say, Obscure's children: Art et nature (1996) and the editions actuel on the ground, in the regions. and 1996 to be precise. It take place we think of La Bande Vidéo, the of Rencontre internationale d'art This logic of networks participated around two events: in Montreal, we Productions Recto-Verso (1984) and performance (1994-1996), welcoming and helped to redefine the relations have the 1995 edition of the IDEA Avatar (1993). artists from many countries which between art and society. It has been, while in Quebec City, the cooperative Obscure has adopted a critical will circulate in various places if I might say, the main topic of my Méduse opens and Obscure presents attitude towards the State, such as Alma, Chicoutimi, Granby, book: L'art comme alternative: Réseaux there La parallaxe. This brings us to particularly in regards to grant Victoriaville, Montréal or Matane will et pratiques d'art parallèle au Québec, a domain that we should not forget. programs which were nonexistent reinforce this tendency which will 1976-1996, published in 1997. Today, I am able to say that I think I at the time. Such grant programs keep growing until de year 2000. As far as the rapport between had underestimated it at the time, will start, help to finance its « multi » Guy generations over the years are because it will become a new para­ activities and acquire equipment. concerned, you are certainly right digm for art actuel: I am referring And I think that it was an excellent when you speak about a sort of to the importance of the media arts way to "warm up" to negotiations Monday February i8'h conducts-situations, testifying to which are linked to new technologies. concerning Méduse. Of course, Guy, I don't want to forget an a reading of the intercultural rela­ The era of the media arts is Gilles Arteau had an unbelievable important point that surfaces a tions particular to each generation. beginning. charisma and tongue, but we should lot during our exchange. While on The cultural agents, including the I still remember the passage of not forget Gaétan Gosselin, and my side, I was trying, along with artists, have been influenced by Stelarc at Obscure and its "third tech­ Jocelyn Robert in this matter. Le Lieu François Vallée, to establish relations the critics of centralism, and for the nological arm" (1993). The coopera­ and La chambre blanche were part with other countries by inviting whole spectrum of life in society. tive Méduse which opens in 1994, of the first meetings of discussions, individual artists from Europe at La Generally, it is fair to say that the under the leadership of Gilles Arteau but have finally decided to keep chambre blanche, VU, for instance, networks of self-managed centers and Gaétan Gosselin, is not only one their autonomy. We should also was participating at a series of for artists which have emerged in of the main piece of this reconfigura­ say that they both occupied spaces exchanges or at the diffusion of a anti-cultural mode, at the end of tion of urban art in Saint-Roch, by its corresponding to their needs. photographers from here, in the the seventies and in the eighties, grouping around 12 centers - Avatar, From this moment, it is the defi­ francophonie (Bruxels, Saint-Malo, would become more professional in Engramme, L'Œil de Poisson, Anti­ nition of what we were expecting Paris, Dieppe, Champagne-Ardenne, the nineties. That movement comes tube, La Bande Vidéo, the Produc­ from art actuel, in itself, that became Basse-Normandie...). Le Lieu after the creation of the CLSC in the tions Recto-Verso, CKIA-MF and the contentious. We can see an unavoi­ developed an international network, health sector, the CEGEPS and what Ateliers de la Mezannine - it will dable movement where the centers but it also gave a lot energy to formed the Université du Québec, become, at some artistic level, a interested in sound experimentation regional networks. Amongst all art in various regions, in education, and point of reference for production and and video production/diffusion are critics in Quebec, critics of Montreal also many community initiatives in all diffusion. Méduse participates here more explicitly integrated to the are concentrating on Montreal. regions in the province. All of these to this passion for new technologies visual arts networks. This is some­ Here in Quebec City, you were one components, seen as vague impulse in the arts, and is now a major player thing that would have been unthin­ of the first to circulate all over the of self-determination of communities, all over the province (for instance, at kable in the eighties. Remember that province and you had, I think, a share two major points: they resist to the ISEA, at SAT and the Fondation La Bande Vidéo and Recto-Verso had certain influence. Who was talking the only big city that exist in Quebec, Langlois in Montreal, at La Filature in then few contact with the centers about what was happening in Montreal, and to the techno/ bureau­ the Outaouais, at the gallery Sagamie in visual arts such as La chambre Beauce or in Amos? Inter, which was cratic centralization of the State. In et Séquence in the Saguenay-Lac- blanche and VU. your principal vehicle of expression, this respect, Quebec City, the Capital Saint-Jean). In this regard, it will be On the infrastructure level, the and it has played an important role where the government is located, has fundamental to the powerful meta­ hopes of centers, here and there th in the province, will change. With 1998-2008 Friday leap year February 29 Quebec City. Some centers have the the financing helping to buy La I am sure you know this, Guy, opportunity to play this role. But the chambre blanche (bought by its Thursday night February 28"' I don't have much distance when centers for artists have to always keep collective members) and the Méduse Lisanne, it comes to this Manif. All I know is consistent with their critical mission. project, doors were opened to other I am just coming from L'Abraham that Jérôme Delgado was writing I am stopping here because we will significant gestures and claims, to Martin café. Walking here to write recently in Le Devoir that it was THE discuss the state of the network, later. make sure that the center's life were to you, Lisanne, many recent facts biennale in the province of Quebec. Let's return to this idea of maintained. Outside Quebec City, we about art and about the decade of The question here is not to debate commissionership in Quebec City. think of the planning of Axe-Néo 7 at the year 2000 rushed in my head. which one is the best between the Lisanne La Filature in 2002. For instance, the « 5 à 7 », the press biennale of Montreal or the one in This concentration effect by conference informing all about the Quebec City. Each have their role to Méduse is still asking the question of fourth edition, in May, of the Manif play. And the triennial of the Musée Saturday March 1" property. In this respect, on the side d'art, an event always long-awaited d'art contemporain has to prove Lisanne, of La chambre blanche, it is important here, in Montreal and in the rest that, in this existing landscape, it My understanding of the to mention that we bought the of Canada. And, in February, for will respect all the work previsouly independent curator's role, more building that we occupied in 1992. the last nine years now, the media done... with means that are not than what distinguishes it from the Le Lieu will do the same in 2003. art programming of the Mois Multi in the same league. The question role of art critic, is to me closer to a All of this « Méduse » effect that which takes over at the cooperative is how to come to terms with the kind of challenge than the profession you mention... How can I say? Of Méduse. I have also reflected that fact that Quebec City doesn't have, of the specialist. Having been an course, we can say that this decade in few days, on March 4"1 to be in the eyes of the establishment of auditor at many conferences in the was marked by a will, on the part of exact, the review Inter will celebrate Quebec's art, this image of a city- last years, and where the subject our financing partners, to support its 30 years in print - in this year museum having the heavy burden was as much theory, art criticism or our infrastructures and consolidate of incomparable festivities for of history where the art actuel commissionership, I have often heard the network. It is also to make sure the 400th year anniversary of the scene would be an exception, an Rainer Rochlig's formulation (in Feu that the new center/landlords, or founding of the City. isolated endeavor of few people. The de la critique d'art), saying that the next step will be to receive a more whom ever benefits from contracts Few hours ago, I have function of the independent curator balanced share of grants, if we want and advantageous long-term leases, appreciated the refined enthusiasm will have overridden the role of art to maintain the course of things. This are not becoming white elephants with which you have played the role critic and theoretician. This should problem of state subsidies doesn't for which the Council of Arts and of the invited independent curator be nuanced. In the production and only hurt the events. In fact, while Letters had signed contracts in the for the Manif d'art 4, proposing the promotional phases of an event or I have constantly seeked to put nineties, with countries such as them « Toi/You » as an invitation an exhibit, it is more than normal in parallel the centers and artists Finland, Mexico and the Catalogue... to surpass the cleavage of "art of that the discourse of its protagonist, working on an individual basis, where centers were becoming relation vs. multimedia arts" and in the curator or the artistic director in let's mention here that the number privilege organizations welcoming order to reintroduce a shift in art charge, be ideologically oriented, of artists of Quebec City which international artists. And in Quebec sensibilities performed in Quebec functional, and on the side of self- have received, in the last 3 years, City, we have been well served in City. There, among the compact promotion. The critical dimension is money for their creation is indecent, this respect. Of course, this is also crowd, listening to you speaking of in general irrelevant. It will come for considering how dynamic the art part of an official recognition of self- satellite activities at the main exhibit, the external observers. That said, we scene is. And the jury in Quebec City managed centers as major agents on I have wondered if the collaboration should not forget the before and the knows artists coming from Montreal the cultural scene. between all agents involved (for after: the role taken, the vision and and the region. The contrary is rare. Today, I am an independent instance the Musée that produces a the selection ruling the conception curator for the Manif d'art, and see Sylvie Cotton and many other artists Fortunately, Diane Landry's are, on the one hand, readings on how far we have come... we have from all over, from Chili, Mexico and participation at the Biennale de art happenings in the present, to both participated in many debates Europe) was not, at last, a common Montréal (2000), the solo exhibits be done or to exhibit. On the other during this period. Pages are many, character of the 30 years adventure of BGL and, more recently, Yannick hand, when there is publication, the and there is still much to say once we of art actuel in Quebec City. Pouliot (2008) at the Musée reflections and analyses following also participate to the vast critical embark together on the last decade. I But here I think I anticipate. d'art contemporain as well as an knowledge. In fact, it is a debate will await your next letter. Like we have done for the two important participation of Quebec between the thinking on arts that Lisanne previous decades, I am submitting artists at the exhibit L'envers des take action and theoretical thoughts, my reflections, my intuitions which apparences (2005-2006), done by aside, even academic. are also open questions. My first Gilles Godmer, are important signals Thursday February 21'' intuition for a dialogue could be to the effect that things can change. It is moreover the event Lisanne, about the confirmation of this The success of the Manif d'art is not projects or group manifestations, When we look at this fin-de- organizational tendency, which, after foreign to this recognition. We have symposiums or other zones become siècle, and at the beginning of this taking form in the previous decade, already mentioned that the Manif events that will stir me as an invited new century, it appears to me that consolidates all scopes of art. I testified to the synergy of the whole curator. In Quebec City, in the year all the venues we have talked about, want to talk about the importance milieu, which is mostly singular 2000, there was the Arboretum, at the in the last week, demonstrate how of the invited curator's role in the in the whole art actuel landscape Maison Hamel-Bruneau, Émergence the nineties were rich in experiences institutions, the centers for artists in the province (you know my ortsoc/'a/attheîlot Fleurie in 2000 but also full of hopes. They created and the events. Isn't this intellectual chauvinistic side). The next step is and Les commandos nomades, for the the conditions for the beginning of and artistic division of roles not certainly a more adequate financial Manif d'art 2, in 2003. My interest will the new millennium: the creation questioning the self-managements support and, eventually, finding a go more for the manifestations "in of the editions of Manif d'art, of the orientations, creation in collective permanent space for the Manif. The context", exterior, in the cité, or on Mois Multi, of the social events at the as much as the relations between organization will then be able to the territory than for exhibitions only îlot Fleurie and of the continuation reflections and practices? pursue the presentation of important in "black and white cubes". These exhibitions, like it has done with of the Rencontre internationale d'art I am first sharing this with you. larger zones of events seemed to Paul-Émile Borduas prize. We need performance in an area that has found Guy allow experimentations of new ideas, its urban dignity again, all of which to have a great tool of diffusion, "extreme" situations (to paraphrase being an echo, suggesting new complementary to centers for artists. my friend Paul Ardenne) or to find stakes. And the addition of these tools this junction between popular With my salutations, shed new light on the mandates. identification and high art, native Guy There are no exhibition centers in contemporary art, social politically charged art. It is in some ways the its importance for the visibility of the legitimization of works that we initiative of Folie/Culture in Quebec heir, if we can say, of the bygone our artists in Quebec City. There is estimate pertinent in the course City. This is a dynamic organization period of conception, collective and a commitment on the part of the of history. I have to say that I have which constantly invites artists to self-managed event realizations. centers which is extraordinary. But always felt a responsibility to support come and create around mental And I see the ethical responsibility of for the curators there isn't much Quebec City's artists in my curator's health issues and situations at the an independent curator as a "living room. I would say that Habiter ( done projects or in my writing on art. It is, margins, such as in 2006. Here is art maker" for, amongst and with by VU, 2006) was an exception in this I believe, a situation that art critics the opening of arts for you. I would audiences: a public. It is the bias, I sense that we have identified Giorgia in Montreal don't experience and like now to go back to the exhibi­ think, that comes across, one which Volpe's contribution. That said, there which belongs to a consciousness of tion Déclics: Art et société, because I have tried to make my city's artists would be more thematic exhibits, the need, of the necessity to be also my collaboration also shows this associate with, on many occasions. more space for reflection with the committed in this respect. Exhibits tension, in the understanding and Indeed, here was my works, by the works, if there were an and events in Quebec City don't exhibition of art. This is where the collaboration for the Manif d'art 2: opening and more requests to inde­ have the coverage that they should importance of Montreal is palpable. Bonheur et simulacres, in May 2003. pendent curators. I know that here have in art periodicals, and art critics This request came from Marie-Char­ More than organizing a conventional we have a different point of view. We are still in demand, to this day. We lotte de Koninck. For each exhibit, conference in auditoriums, I have will need to talk about it again. can actually only name another the Musée de la civilisation asks, in thought the ideas of « commandos For instance, I would say that one, aside both of us, Nathalie most cases, experts from Univer­ nomades » - like thinkers of art in 1985,1 have proposed a project Côté, whose work is rigorous and sities to come together around a actuel. I have chosen this wandering which would have a curator (Mobilier generous. There is a form of art designated theme. In the case of the formula with a clear goal to "bring d'artistes). Excluding conceived journalism but few critics, which Déclics exhibition, Marie-Charlotte, closer critical thinking and manifest projects in the contexts of my is distressing and disturbing. And when realizing that not only most of art, by encouraging to reflect". background at La chambre blanche, it is evidently related to the scarce the exhibit's works coming from the The first team was composed of I have never worked since for any numbers of independent curators in collection of the Musée d'art contem­ Anne-Marie Ninacs, Patrice Loubier, centers. I have worked in Quebec Quebec City. porain was from Montreal, and that André-L Paré, Sonia Pelletier and City for the Musée du Québec Lisanne the views of the team of specialists Jean-Michel Ross, and the second (Paul Lacroix 1998-1999 and Annie of this period (the 6o's and the 70's) of Nisk Imbeault, Anthony Kiendl, Thibault, 2001 ) at the Maison was also all Montréalers, she asked Pierre-Raphaël Pelletier, Sylvie Hamel-Bruneau (for Paysages et Monday March 3"1 me to write, in extremis (I have had Cotton, Jean Dupuy, and... Lisanne autres fictions, 2002), and at this Lisanne, only two weeks to write) an essay Nadeau. year's Manif d'art The practices Our dialogue could degenerate on the socio-artistic practices in the This seems enough to clarify my of commissionership are almost into a debate. However, other regions. It is how I came to publish position, I think. But you, Lisanne, the inexistent in Quebec City. I have aspects of the first eight years of Des projections libérantes? Les lieux commissionership, how do you see been isolated for many years, being art in Quebec City, in this new de transgressions de l'art, in the book it, live it? the only one of my generation with a millennium, are intriguing. They about the exhibit. Guy background as art historian, that has also require that we dialogue As far as the Musée du Québec stayed in Quebec City and chosen to about them, dear Lisanne. My first is concerned, I have in memory the specialize in art actuel. Fortunately, point concerns our museums: the year 2002. The institution gains Sunday March 2"'1 there is generation learning, but we Musée de la civilisation and the then the status of Musée national Guy, are now in 2008!!! Musée national des beaux-arts du des beaux-arts du Québec, making First of all, the term «commis­ Guy, you have mentioned your Québec. As much as we have given official the permanence of the works saire » came to us in the nineties interests in collective events. I have perspective to elements of openness of Jean-Paul Riopelle in a few rooms from our French cousins. This term personally chosen to work closer in the milieu, as much we have to - and all around the immense tryptic is indeed not used in English (they to one artist in order to push my remember the generalized attitude Hommage à Rosa Luxemburg. For use more the term independent understanding of the stakes in place of centralization, of concentration the occasion, there is festive night in curators). I always had reservations in one practice. I think that this is which persists in spite of remarkable company of Loco Locass, a rap group towards this terminology. A curator there that I experience emptiness. openings. to which I have been associated. The is someone, he or she, in charge of Impossible to reduce one practice As far as the Musée de la civilisa­ meeting between rap and visual arts temporary functions, someone in to prefabricated visions. There, tion is concerned, the institution has was not as « bizarre » as we might charge of a dossier. This dimension in the intimate contact with the programmed in 1999-2000, in agree­ think. For instance, Biz, is the most of reflection, of conceptualization work in progress (and even with its ment with the Musée d'art contem­ articulate. He is the son of the poet is not implicit to this terminology... contradictions) it is an extremely porain de Montréal, the exhibit and performer Jean-Yves Frechette, Many individuals, in fact, have said fertile challenge for thoughts. You Déclics: Art et société. Le Québec whose works I have mentioned they were « commissaires » in the often work at the macro level, I work des années 1960-1970. In 2000, if I earlier. That very night, I have felt context of event preparations. As far more in the proximity. remember correctly, it presented a the importance of "interdisciplinary" I am concerned, I have never felt my And then there are the words. multimedia conference organized by relations and of the « interstices », role in the place of the production Writing is a fascinating medium La chambre blanche. It gathered, via these light signals of change director facilitating projects to take which I have explored - that I explore new technologies, Daniel Buren who which seemed to accelerate in this place. Actually, money is rare for since 1981!!! Is it possible? Some was in Tel Aviv and Jocelyne Allou- beginning of the new millennium in projects. We often ask the curator to texts, more rational, in Parachute, cherie in Lethbridge with the Quebec the art scene. I have also noticed that go and seek grants on an individual to the catalogue Comme des îles (on audience - and I had to monitor this no matter if we were in a museum, basis to pay for publications, for Richard Baillargeon's production in "virtual" conversation, replacing you in a center for artists, in the street instance. This annoys me. It seems 1991) which is more lyrical, to the on the spot. All that considered, I or in front of a computer: "inter- that my role is more to propose words of La chutes des mots... on the have a tendency to give credits to generations", "inter-discipline", venues to reflect... in short, there is building of Le soleil. We can't neglect the centers for artists for this initia­ "inter-relations" and "inter-activities" a lot of work to do. The budgets of the importance of writing on the tive, this presence of art actuel in between young and older people, centers for artists are not sufficient arts. I have worked a lot to give a the institution. In 2000-2001, there men and women, spaces and non- to pay curators. In Quebec City, we place to artists' creations in Quebec was the exhibit Métissage, under spaces of art, images, sounds, all arts see that many collective projects of City. As you have done. I have also Robert Lepage's proposition. Claudie were there, together! diffusion or exchanges are signed done it with very young artists who Gagnon participated to it. When the If I have collaborated with by collectives. And the community had no texts. I knew I was helping Musée gave his best room for Diane the two museums. You, Lisanne, spirit testifies to this positive situa­ them and I stress the commitment Landry and Nicolas Reeves' installa­ have also have worked with Annie tion. We have already underlined to diffusion, here again, but also tion at the event DSM-V+, it was the Thibault at the Musée des Plaines. Can you talk about it, and, can you before the process of creating a 2008. Also, we can mention the strategies, in short, to create the tell me your reflections on your view of the events in the museum. exhibition/expedition Québec Gold, self-managed centers for artists. rapport to institutions, in the entry of We could see what has been done organized by L'Œil de Poisson in In the nineties, a second wave of Quebec City on the art scene, during very audaciously at the Musée de la Reims, in the context of the regional organizations and groups will focus the years 2000. civilisation, as you have mentioned. activities of the 400th years of Quebec on experimentation of new forms Guy The place of art in our two museums City's founding. As you can see, and art practices in the networks (for is very interesting for this type of collaborations, local, inter/regional instance Folie/Culture, which will reflection. and international networks are produce in 2006 the amazing event Tuesday March 4'" Guy, for the past decades, we included. DSM-V+, Doyons/Demers, Arkhé Guy, have spoken almost of art network. Guy - Luc Lévesque, James Partaik and 1 think, as 1 have mentioned Let's maintain this venue. How do Michel Saint-Onge -, and you have earlier, that we have reached a very you see its actual state, since 2000? mentioned their importance, and, sane professional level. In spite of Lisanne Thursday March 6th, in the morning of course, let's not forget the sacred our distinct approaches, 1 would Dear Guy, and famous trio of the country, BGL). say thanks to our clear differences, You are forcing me to refine my Following them, we can see in the collaborations seems more possible Wednesday March 5"* reflection about the state of network. first years following 2000, an intense between centers, on the one hand. Dear Lisanne, I have to say that I am fascinated third wave of artistic « indisciplines », and between the centers and the Two strong macro sociological by all the things happening these put forward by new duos, trios and organizations of the present, on the facts are important in the network days. I see the Manif working for groups. We observe it by looking at other. We have learned to grasp evolution in the arts, in the last eight international exchanges. I see Le installations such as the one of the the possibilities of our institutions. years in Quebec City: recurrence of Lieu which has contact with the sœurs Couture and the art-action When 1 was working at La chambre manifestations, annual or biannual, Biennale de La Havane... but I of the Fermières Obsédées. On the blanche, we wre very aware that and international reach. would like to come back to our local side of contextual art which is also P our spaces were not convenient First fact: there is not only dynamic. I think that some centers socially involved, I would like to point when it came to welcoming a vast abundance, but also recurrence. have the role of exhibition centers out the influence of the Collectif public at conferences. We knew There is the 4th edition of the Manif (I have mentioned the absence pour un Québec sans pauvreté, here, some people were more attracted d'art (2001, 2003, 2005, 2008) of such structure in Quebec City), in Quebec City, and its famous "red by museum auditoriums, explicitly - with Claude Bélanger in control while others have kept more easily square" - a collaboration of artists E public, to assist anonymously to any - the continuation, every 2 years, an experimental approach. The which will be used by the student V« event. These collaborations always of the Rencontre internationale d'art important thing is to always have, movement in 2004, the editions of vary according to the individuals in performance (RIAP 2002, 2004, 2006) in this landscape, the presence of the Réclame ta rue movement, the place. The Musée de la civilisation at the Lieu. Add to this the Vidéastes specific action to self-managed grand photographs done by Doyon- has always been very open to recherchés of La Bande Vidéo, which centers: this critical dimension, this Rivest, and the ones, social, of the collaborations with the milieu. In takes place now in the sphere capacity to always question the DéclencheurEs, this other new group. the context of the Manif d'art, 1 have of influence of the cabaret Kino, modes of operations and the way we I add to this the mediatic sculpture wanted to hold the Conference at Wapikoni Mobile and others. And 1 exhibit in art actuel. In this respect, L'atopie textuelle est une cause qui the Musée national des beaux-arts, would also like to point out here the it is also interesting to see new se perd (2001) of the collective because 1 am convinced that we have artistic influence of someone like collectives such as Ex-Muro or Wagon Causes perdues, and the installation/ to find a larger public. The Manif Boris Firquet - or the nine editions starting their journey and offer an sculpture, iconoclastic, of the duo will be more visited by a non-expert (2000-2008) of Mois Multi- Emile image of what is needed these days, Cooke-Sasseville, whose studio is public if we try to reach people Morin being a key element - go in or a new conception of intervention also a place of informal gatherings. which are not finding themselves at the same sense. In second, we can that artists of the new generation It is difficult, le nez collé dans ease, in such events, but are open only notice this intensification of want to have in their milieu. And la vitre (when we have the nose to art actuel. 1 have never felt that 1 the international, when it comes to it does not obviously translated in in the window) to decipher these was doing dangerous compromises the event contents and exhibitions planning formal exhibit spaces. "weak signals" of change from the in being sensitive to this opening put forward by or around centers Helping to produce you have transformations which will survive. dimension. of artists from Quebec City. To L'Œil de Poisson, with its wood Especially when we know that we At another level, if you want to really show this idea of critical workshop, VU, with its recent will be able only to assess them... talk about our museum, 1 am asking mass, which creates a significant equipment acquisitions and La 30 years later, because there are myself this fundamental question: phenomenon other than the ones chambre blanche which allow artists other elements structuring the how the museum can adapt itself to 1 have mentioned, and without to grasp the art réseau, La Bande art networks. But 1 think that the the reality of new works, interactive, making here a lists, 1 will name a Vidéo, also. contribution of new groups would in situ, multidisciplinary? The few in a non exhaustive fashion: the Lisanne be a good theme for a Conference, institution of the Musée will always international exhibition Torun:Full for an organization like Les arts dans resist these forms. It is a stigmatized of Colour of Engramme in 2003 and la ville which has a window on the space. 1 think that works of this type La disparition/Zanikanie reuniting Thursday in the evening street in Quebec City. It would be are always out of contexts when they Engramme, VU, L'Œil de Poisson and Dear Lisanne, you put in useful to know how to examine, in its enter the museum. All works exhi­ the galerie Rouje in 2004. Of course, perspective the new generation. excellent conferences, the long-term bited in a museum are transformed you can find also attached to these, This brings me to mention the evolution of this adventure. by it, and should assume their the international twinning organized phenomenon of new groups, in Guy tranformations. In this respect, 1 am by Inter/Le Lieu such as Latinos numbers in Quebec City, and their impatient to see how Sylvie Cotton del Norte, Québec/Mexico (2001), contribution to change. Indeed, will resolve this paradox at the Manif RWNT: Québec-Whales/Québec- between zones and actors of art Friday March 7'h d'art. You will say that this debate Cardiff (2003), Villes anciennes/Art actuel in Quebec City, this tendency Guy, is outside our topic, but in fact, we Nouveau, Québec/Cracovie (2004) to create collectives, typical of the Another element that we should have, in Quebec City, two museum and Habanart à Québec: art cubain city since the eighties, remains the underline, is the centers' adaptation contexts. They are very distinctive actuel/Arte de Quebec en la Habana same in the year 2000-2008. to their professional status. It is and both offer an analysis of the (fall 2007 and spring 2008). For this We have seen that in the totally paradoxical - but also most actual practices' situation in the last project, Le Lieu was associated seventies and eighties. We have natural - to realize that centers museum. We could also however with La chambre blanche in Quebec witnessed the first wave of which were founded by newcomers, analyze the artists' collaboration City and the center Séquence, collectives, interested in sharing to in their time, needed to ask in the conception process, thus in the Saguenay, for this spring gain some spaces, tools and creative themselves the question of the place they were giving to young artists. daily life, the urban environment, to des Amériques in the Upper City of the loyears... I have conceived, It is also a phenomenon of the last others. We are leaving a conception and the Sommet des peuples in the in a different context, collective art decade, an immediate consequence of the "white cube" of art. That Market at the bassin Louise, placing events in public areas. I have even of the aging teams in place and of allows to question engagement l'îlot Fleurie in a kind of tension, participated to the conception of the development of structures. In in art, political art and social art, between two types of manifestations. a work of integrated art (La chute this respect, I see how the awards by counting on the general social In September will follow the event des mots). "Public Art", "Art in Public given year after year to finishing contingencies. I would call it the Émergences: Famille done by the Places", signified, only few years students of the École des arts centrifugal energies of the works collective l'îlot Fleurie. The famous ago still, an art of the State. The visuels of Laval University, are most which permeate, activate, manifest soeurs Couture will participate to term is much more open today. structuring. These awards consist not themselves outside conventional this event. This will be followed by Public art, ephemeral, furtive, only of an invaluable recognition, spaces, with some care for the Incube in October, bringing together temporary, eternal... and in Quebec they also ensure that resources other, the others, the milieu of life. performers and people from Quebec City, a phenomenon takes place: from various organizations will be In this respect, there was always and France doing installations in organizations or private companies readily available. Often, there is also some art links in the city. As far as response to the event Arts d'attitudes launching contests or predict orders an exhibition. We are indeed taking I am concerned, in the first year (the whole event was organized of art integration (the SSQ, the CAA care of the needs of the newcomers, of 2000, Saint-Roch is vibrant of by Le Lieu). In 2002, BGL will be in collaboration with the City of needs that are always the same in its ideas and "zones of events", part of the edition of Émergences Quebec and the Commission de spite of the decades passing by: which perpetuate this constant with a festive « manège » made of la Capitale-Nationale). The City of the needs for production and the interest for the development of garbage. And, in 2003, La chambre Quebec proposes to artists, more necessity to diffuse the work outside multimedia installations in situ and blanche will produce La nef des and more, open contests. A public the school. These awards have been art-action modalities (performances, fous at the opening of activities of park is now coming along on the really popular, and today, many manœuvres, relational aesthetics) in its 25th anniversary. Personally, I promenade Samuel-de-Champlain centers are involved in this respect. the city. have been a friend of the edition with a "resolute contemporary The pedagogical activities of Indeed, the city continues Émergences: Art social in 2000, under stance". This project, close to my the Écoles des arts visuels, and the to be the "landscape" of many Paryse Martin's invitation - a person heart and for which I have worked, relations it entertains with the milieu creative social art experimentations, whose contribution we don't always will bring near the river the works of are maybe much more important that performatives, photographic or in acknowledge in the milieu - and I Jean-Pierre Morin, Pierre Bourgault, we had foreseen. We only have one situ. In the first year of 2000, adding am part of the collective of young Yves Gendreau and, very soon, a University giving the formation in to the « zones » already mentioned, women artists (such as Julie Picard, work from an artist from Quebec visual arts. If the student's production other events such as Sur les toits Hélène Matte and Fanny Giguère). City. The City of Montreal is giving is weak, the whole chain is affected. (2002), of La chambre blanche, Diane Landry, Doyon/Demers and Quebec City, for its 400 years, a work And I am often surprised that Parcours et débordements of L'Œil Pierre Bourgault will add their works of integration conceived by Michel exchanges are not frequent between de Poisson (2003), Les vertiges de to the thirty sculptures populating Goulet. The image of the city is school and the centers' network. The l'évidence (2004), Habiter (2006) and the place already, among them Don sensibly changing with the presence École des arts visuels is one extremely 06 émissaires: Québec 2008, the new Darby, one the most underestimated of all these works from the present. important link in the chain. And I am "photographie mission in the city" sculptor in Quebec City, and also Of course, the reactions are in very happy to work with students as (2008), the last three of VU. Other someone which has been much numbers (see the debate concerning interns, in the context of the Manif artists that you were mentioning involved in the community. the work of Pierre Bourgault done d'art, this year. Richard Martel, on his to me, on the phone, have also I am sure that these notions for the Promenade Samuel-de- side, also gives a class in contextual invented the city as landscape/ of landscape and inhabited Champlain, which is not without art and forms young people to art- territory. What can we say of the territory make you think of works reference to the Naylor case in 1981). action. The centers provide formation repetition of the collective Arqhé of art, or different situations The artists see art, in integration, to the young. which will propose an exceptional maybe completely opposed to as a space of investigation of the I have the intuition, Guy, that manoeuvre, in the contexts of the my conception, which believes in landscape... and/or in the light of naming actors and events resonate Rencontres internationales of La the progress of conceptual and what we have illustrated, of the in you this preoccupation of the chambre blanche in 2000?! You were committed art... urban territory. For creators, the time city's evolution as a background. also passionately mentioning to me Guy when public art was a production Lisanne with that Giorgia Volpe whom, in done in parallel to research is over. 2001, intervened (Le nom des arbres) The lasting elements of the works are on the wintery envelope of the trees Saturday March 8lh not negligible. They testifies to an Friday March 7* in the evening in the Pare Saint-Roch. At last, we Guy, undeniable recognition of our artists. Lisanne, should also not forget the Massacre à I like this distinction between Lisanne I observe the dual city, at once la scie in 2004, this event regrouping landscape and territory, which landscape and territory. Speaking spontaneously, during a weekend, reminds me of a round table sociologically, the notions of territory young artists in a building meant to discussion on Action-Art, where Sunday March 9,h and landscape differs entirely. The be destroyed and where you can find we both were, and it was about Lisanne, territory is inhabited. It takes us in now the domesticated La Falaise. this question. Landscape and My interest for this notion of some spaces, zones, and areas of Evidently, the îlot Fleurie's territory... the landscape marked territory implies some aesthetic life where economy, politics and evolution, between 2002 and 2007, by the imagination, the territory understanding, for the changes of culture are intertwined. Otherwise, would be for many such as Luc inhabited and connected to life. The the city as such. In fact, I have started the landscape can be invented: Lévesque, Patrice Loubier and myself, interventions in situ, would be on the our dialogue by imagining the City reproduced, framed, and virtual. It an urban « zone » connecting these side of invented landscape or about of Quebec in itself, as a real subject. belongs to the imagination. It is in notions of landscape and territory. a taking possession of a territory in Doesn't the city possess a global this sense that, with the immobility Between the event Émergences: Art order to mark the city of gesture of evolutional aesthetic showing the of the historical and patrimonial Social in September 2000 and the arts? character of the urban planning of city, there is a shifting landscape of occupation of the Boulevard Charest I know that you hope we will areas and roads, promenades or Quebec City thanks to its painters, by Réclame ta rue from September talk about public art. You know to public spaces, of its monuments engravers, sculptors, people 2007, under the "access roads" of the which extend this topic interests and works of public art as they are which are doing installations and Dufferin Highway to be demolished, me. I have directed the edition of integrated to the architecture? These manœuvres. many artistic and even political a publication on the 20 years of elements are « architextures », to The notion of territory, applied to manifestations have taken place. what we commonly call the 1%, take the term developed by Luc urban space, signify art connected to The year 2001 will see the Sommet and I have worked on a summary Lévesque. And to borrow Hervé Fisher's expression, they are "citizen Samuel-de-Champlain, is one I am glad to have the power of our of the tasks of the historian, that is sculptures", determinant to the example. dreams, somewhere, and to dream always reading and re-reading the environment of daily life where we Guy, we have been together more! But if you asked me, if you facts in the light of new elements, walk, work and play. Even better, at the Largo resto-club to finish insisted, Lisanne, to find a word trajectories. Indeed, when I arrived where we create and live with art this narrative about art actuel in of synthesis, I would risk the word at La chambre blanche, we were altogether. Quebec City, and you make, you, MANIFESTIVE. Moreover, of the same saying that we were the first parallel I will not insist here on the the sociologist, an interesting link: idiom as the name given to the gallery. Of course, there was the surroundings, the river and the the Largo Foundation. Outside Manifeste of the Galerie Comme in ARG, but the mode of diffusion, the mountains, and even less on the the centers for artists, outside the 1977, or like the abbreviated Manif, type of art that we wanted to diffuse urban spreading which has resulted museum, who will be tomorrow's to name a great event of 2008, was stopping us to have this large in the fusion of various cities. They actors? I have spoken of initiatives doesn't it define one of the principal perspective showing many points form the district cutting the Capitale- in the private sector, in the context elements of specificity of the artistic of view. I have always found that in Nationale. I will not mention the of art integration. It could be taking life in Quebec City? The spirit of the province of Quebec, we always immutable "old historic capital" different forms. We have to work making things happen, together, had blind spots. If an artist doesn't which makes Quebec City the 6th in this direction, make foundations collectively. And because it has create in the mainstream, it's over. destination the most appreciated by aware of the importance of an action meant something, during 3 decades, I hope this section of this dialogue, tourists on 116 tourist places in the in the cultural sphere, etc. the adjective manifestive qualifies it without pretense, will have at least world! No. I will narrow my views to In this great voyage, we have for me. demonstrated that art actuel has the core relations between arts and not really spoken about private If I needed to find a formula to benefited, in our city, from the the city, namely, the links between galleries. Yes, the absence of an art synthesize the evolution, define 30 presence of different people and the Faubourg which links the market is clear in Quebec City and years of specificity in art actuel in that it was most productive in this Montcalm quarter to the Musée, in influences all our actions. Estampe and from Quebec City, I would chose respect. the Upper City, on the one hand, and plus (1984-2007) has closed its the plural by applying it to three In conclusion, in respect to this the Lower City, on the other hand, in doors few months ago after 23 years important notions: the collective, the reality and this need of history, I the area that goes from the river to of existence. Together, let's make collaboration and the network. I insist would like to mention the question Saint-Roch. The aesthetic perception a list of the commercial galleries here on the fact that these groups in of publications. La chambre blanche of public art is made of conflicts, that have punctuated the art collectives, as well as the founding has its bulletin, since 1981, VU critics and divergences. This also, it's actuel's history: the Galerie Joliet of regional and international founded a publishing house in 1999, the city and its art which breathe the (possibly 1976-1981), the Galerie networks have sustained the artistic J'ai VU, the Manif d'art also needed to challenges to come. René Bertrand, whom, in 1984 and life of Quebec City, since 1978. This act in the same way. And the conver­ These "citizen sculptures" 1985, was crucial for newcomers, attitude has prevailed in spite of gence of our exhibits should occupy - unless seen from the air, even if the Galerie André Bécot (1976-1992, the move from the Upper City to our energies in a more obvious way. it is possible to see all the works and recently reopened), the Galerie the Lower City, from the Faubourg We also have to think about the of public art in Quebec City, from Lacerte (Galerie Lacerte-Guimont in Saint-Jean Baptiste to Saint-Roch, future, the continuity and the diffe­ the installation by Pierre Granche 1981, then Galerie Lacerte, in 1986), as a center, and despite this rences . The makings of history from on University Laval's campus to the Galerie O Matière (opened in progressive move of community another angle. Books. We have to Ferland's park in Limoilou, where 1989), the Galerie Charles et Martin and cooperative strategies towards think about traces, in this sense. BGL have installed friendly "sculpted Gauthier (very active from 1990- more experimental, plural, relational, Lisanne clothes lines" - remain, to my eyes, 1998). I have not mentioned Rouje multimedia and contextual practices. signs of confrontations between which operates differently, nor With some distance, how can we not conceptions of arts, culture and ways the Galerie Esthesio (2002-2006). be surprised to see this interesting Wednesday March 12th of life. It is still the case, now, vis-à- Without a doubt, it is the Galerie paradox between the autonomous Lisanne, vis the realist murals, very clean and Joliet, and then, the Galerie Lacerte, discourse of some agents and the One word calls for thousands. imitation/historic - which seem to which will have the most significant solidarity on the ground, each time This two-pen essay would not have taken the place of the statues impact on the art milieu in Quebec an opportunity arose? be so intense if it did not possess and monuments - and created by City. Guy the desire to bring all readers to all companies here and there in the city, There are also the hybrid spaces: the numbers of reviews, catalogues, as public art. The last in the list is the the persistent Galerie Le 36 run by conference proceedings, all essays projet for the "Bank of Montreal". Marcel Jean on Couillard Street, Tuesday March 11* and archived documents now It is supposed to represent, in front open to young talents like Francis Dear Guy, available on CD, DVD, and internet of the chapel Bon-Pasteur near the Arguin, Christian Messier. Both have It was our mandate, as sociologist sites. I am thinking of the 100 Complexe G, the history of the ten contributed to the recognition of a and historian, to put some facts numbers of the review Intervention, provinces of Canada, for the occasion resurgence in paintings. Over the on paper. The publishing medium which became Inter, artactuel, of the th of the 400 years of the founding of years, the galerie Rouje, as we know, has this particularity of living long. short existence of the review Noir Quebec City! has also become, between 2001 and We expose, we debate, we are also d'encre, which you have founded Guy 2007, a festive center. This space, at posing art gestures, but if all of this with Daniel Béland at the beginning once gallery, bar and multifunctional is not recollected, all is lost. And I of the nineties, of the Bulletins of La room, has renewed the rapport have suffered vertigo, recently, when chambre blanche, of the newspaper Sunday March 9'h artist/gallery by offering exhibit a young curator told me that she Droit de parole, or of the very new Guy, spaces in location, something that is did not know some major players review Bazzart. And we have very It is indeed important that we not common in Quebec City. in this history. It was like received important books, offering summaries, position ourselves in relation to Lisanne a slap in the face. It was for me a such as Art Performance: Anthologie this multiplications of portraits. I great realization that history has to au/in Canada, 1970-1990 and Art have appreciated your reactions be done, in this moment, when the action 1958-1998, Résidence, 1982- against these totally anachronic in Conclusion founding members and creators 1993, which you have coordinated murals which we have seen grow of this adventure of art actuel can the edition yourself. Books such as in numbers, all around us. But I am Monday March io'h still share their stories. And I would L 'art comme alternative: réseaux et very optimistic, the sensibilities Lisanne, have had the pleasure to see again, pratiques d'art parallèle au Québec have improved in 2008. Utopia? No. 30 years have passed. verify and rediscover, hear people 1976-1996 that I have authored I see results. The recent works done I am rejoicing about the vitality about the Comme Galerie, when (1997), or Nouveau terrioires de l'art: by the Commission de la Capitale- of these times, to have witnessed I was not yet in the circuit. I could Régions, réseaux, place publique Nationale, on the promenade the change of the millennium. revisit my perceptions, which is one written by sociologist Andrée Fortin (20oo) or Art-Action, born of the THIRTY YEARS OF opposition to this movement, they an exuberant vertical modernity, writings of Richard Martel (2005). have lost a great deal. All proportions juxtaposed to a rigorous horizontal We also have to mention the many URBANISM IN considered, Boston is the American residential areas, at once urban catalogues and quality publications city that most closely resembles and Victorian, among the most accompanying events such as QUEBEC CITY Quebec City. beautiful in the world (North End, Mirabile Visu, L'année photographique A CITY HIT BY A In 1950, these two cities had Beacon Hill, Back Bay). In fact, à Québec, Trois fois 3 passages, had almost 350 years of history. the public opinion uprising has Temporalité, Art d'attitudes, Bonheur TRAUMATISM THAT AIN'T From an "urbanist" point of view, tempered the renovation endeavors et simulacres, the publications THE ONE WE THINK IT IS their two downtown core are similar of the "planners", hence protecting of the editions J'ai VU, DVD's of in their compact quarters. These downtown's residential life. BY MARC BOUTIN* different editions of the Rencontre quarters have clear boundaries, they internationale d'art performance of are socially distinct and densely A Simple Concept... Quebec City's urban history was Le Lieu or the studio art Avatar, and populated. They cover most of the or Simplistic? marked by a major event which is the videos done by La Bande Vidéo, central territory, to the exception In Quebec City, the U.R. not the Conquest nor the Battlefields without mentioning the websites and of some great urban parks such as (politicians at the time had of Abraham. It is not to exaggerated the blogs of today's world. the Boston Common and the Plains associated the idea of progress to speak here of a cataclysm around They stand as the true memory of of Abraham. This is a distinctive to the extent that to be against it which stands the history of many art actuel in Quebec City, since 1978. mark of urbanity: each square meter meant that you were "retrograde") areas downtown. Indeed, it explains They are so rich of details. Others, available is occupied, and there has taken, from 1967 onwards, the the morphology and the structure of we can only hope, will be interested is basically no space for random forms of a street fight between the metropolitan region. Its impact to find out more, as soon as you will planning. We have to count on filling urbanists feeling entitled to power, on our daily life's organization is have dropped the last word of our the surrounding low waters to get and a certain civil society in a from far more important than all dialogue... more space. At the beginning of desperate plight. Statistics allow other local historical phenomenon the fifties, first in Boston and then [us] to understand the magnitude of Thanks for your complicity of the last 400 years. Nevertheless, in Quebec City, problems started to these fights, ending in 1978, when Guy our valorous tourist guides are not occur. Narrow streets are congested tired of these everlasting wars, the mentioning it and historians rarely th to the point that commerce is in City gave up on transforming Saint- Thursday March 13 discuss it in this respect. It is, without decline. The pressure for a radical Gabriel Street as a way to access Guy, a doubt, because the stir it has move exists. The U.R., along with the Place-Québec. Between these two I write. And the words help me to generated is yet to calm down. To urbanist's response to this pressure, dates, some 10 000 people had think. I have proposed this dialogue say the least, the public as well as is becoming a panacea for the been dislocated, fourteen public to you to destabilize my habits, to experts often mistakes it for its timely business world. It is the beginning schools were demolished or closed, destabilize myself, to open doors. corollary, the Quiet Revolution. This of the great malls at the periphery of more than 4000 rental apartments And we have succeeded, I think. event is called "Urban Renovation" the city - something most daunting were sacrificed. In terms of its You have written: the writing like (U.R.). "dusts on the City"... leaving you to for inhabited areas. demography, the agglomeration Like a natural catastrophe, the that? literally exploded. Indeed, the U.R. hit North America without any Lisanne The Urban Renewal average density has passed from warning. Each city had to cope with In Boston, between 1950 and 10000 people per Km- to less than it in its own terms. Younger cities P.S. Thanks for all of this. • 1960, urbanists made their first 1000, and that, despite the fact that like Winnipeg and Edmonton, in mistakes under the name of the the total population has passed from Canada, adapted rapidly. It was Urban Renewal. Scollay Square is 365,000 to 620,000 people. It is fair Lisanne Nadeau lives and works in Que­ for them a form of rapid growth bec City. Historian and art critic, she is the central location amongst the most to say that the dimensions of the considering their short past and Director of the Galerie des arts visuels of lively and welcoming. It is typical contrasting zone was multiplied by some infrastructures already in place. Laval University. Working for many years of the open minded and burlesque twenty. No city, with the exception at the center La chambre blanche, she In 1950, Boston and Toronto, cities quarters surrounding it. It was to of some third-world megapolis, has coordinated many events, confer­ viewed as the most dynamic today, Boston what was once the Place has suffered such an impact. From ences and publications dealing with resisted the temptation to get rid d'Youville in Quebec City: a popular the most densely populated city installation practices and in situ. She of their tramways. But Montreal publishes regularly in various specialized gathering place. All of it, including in Canada, Quebec City has now and Quebec City, wanting to be publications and was the coordinator its residential neighborhood, was become the most spread out modern, were eager to get rid of it. of the Summary of 20 years of thei%, in destroyed and replaced by the so- metropolitan region. Even today, we 2004, for the Ministère de la Culture et Today, Toronto is part of the avant- called Government Center, a huge are seeing a few striking contrasts. des Communications. Lisanne Nadeau garde with a vast rail network and The Faubourg Saint-Jean, for has been the independent curator for the agora in red brick, testimony to a its costs are easy to absorb. Quebec instance, keeps a density difficult to Manif d'art 4, in the spring of 2008. bureaucratic austerity as cold as can City is still hesitant to go ahead 2 be. It is also next to a monumental surpass, at 17,500 people/km while Guy Sioui Durand is a Huron-Wendat. He with a new network which would City Hall that would have made many suburbs are barely capable is also a sociologist (Ph. DJ, art critic and include structures that existed not a Hitler's architect Albert Speer very of reaching the national average of indépendant curator who has scrutin­ long time ago. It is important to be ized Quebec's art actuel'scene and given proud. Another example which countries like Belgium - which is 330 careful: to be of your own time. most of his time to the understanding of evokes Dufferin-Montomorency: a people/km-. If the average density, political art and contemporary native arts. suspended highway runs through before 1950, was to be viewed He is one of the founders of the review Boston: Our Close Urban the core of the city. It is indeed the today on the whole agglomeration, Inter, art actuel and the center for artists Relative Quebec City would virtually be as Le Lieu: a space dedicated to the art actuel same highway that was transformed The compact built environment populated as Paris with its 8 millions scene in Quebec City. Durand has written into a tunnel for an outrageous cost of North American cities, such as for many periodicals and publications. He (16 billions $US). people. Quebec City, Boston, New Orleans is the author of three books: L'art comme Nevertheless, in Boston, On an era that has 350 years of alternative: Réseaux et pratigues d'art and San Francisco served as a first resistance has been beneficial. history, we have instigated a develo­ parallèle au Québec (1997), Les très riches protection against the assault of Indeed, most living quarters in pment model that did not consider heures de Jean-Paul Riopelle (2000) and the U.R. But these cities were fast to Riopelle: L'art d'un trappeur supérieur. Indi- downtown, with the exception of how delicate the urban structure understand that a kind of passive dnité (2003). He also has authored articles the one surrounding Scollay Square, in place really was. In terms of the resistance would not be enough. and chapters in other monographies, remained intact. Since the 50's, circulation network structuring it, the such as the recent Aimititau ! Parlons- Eastern cities like Quebec City, Boston's center is an example of city has broken away from the stages nous ! (2008). Celebrated as a stimulating indeed the most directly European, the striking contrast between two of the commercial street to invest in speaker, his conferences and perform­ had the most to lose. And even if styles of urban planning. There is the realities of the highway, without ances are always greatly appreciated. they were the most vivid in their