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Parliamentary Debates (Hansard) Monday Volume 553 19 November 2012 No. 70 HOUSE OF COMMONS OFFICIAL REPORT PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES (HANSARD) Monday 19 November 2012 £5·00 © Parliamentary Copyright House of Commons 2012 This publication may be reproduced under the terms of the Open Parliament licence, which is published at www.parliament.uk/site-information/copyright/. 291 19 NOVEMBER 2012 292 Mr James Gray (North Wiltshire) (Con): As the Home House of Commons Secretary correctly says, it is possible to do more with less, as the recent crime statistics have demonstrated. Does she agree that the election of PCCs, such as the Monday 19 November 2012 excellent Angus Macpherson in Wiltshire—the first ever to be announced—is central to deciding how we can use scarce resources to best effect in tackling crime? The House met at half-past Two o’clock Mrs May: I congratulate Angus Macpherson on his election; indeed, it was good to see that as the first PRAYERS result. My hon. Friend is absolutely right that PCCs will have an important role to play in ensuring that police forces are delivering against their budgets in a [MR SPEAKER in the Chair] way that we all want, which is by ensuring the protection of services such that we can continue to cut crime. Yvette Cooper (Normanton, Pontefract and Castleford) Oral Answers to Questions (Lab): In last week’s elections for the Home Secretary’s flagship policy, 85% of the public decided not to vote. She chose to spend £100 million on having these elections and this transition, which could have been spent on HOME DEPARTMENT 3,000 police officers this year. She chose to hold the elections in November, to get the Home Office to run them and to deny the public proper information. She The Secretary of State was asked— was warned in the Commons and the Lords, and by the Electoral Commission and the Electoral Reform Society, Front-line Police Officers that those decisions were wrong. Given the overwhelming public message she received last week, will she now tell 1. Mr Andy Slaughter (Hammersmith) (Lab): What us which of those decisions she regrets? change in the number of front-line police officers there has been since May 2010. [128813] Mrs May: The right hon. Lady really needs to get her story straight on this. She complains about the amount The Secretary of State for the Home Department of money that was spent on the police and crime (Mrs Theresa May): May I take this opportunity first commissioner elections, yet in the same breath she to welcome the 41 police and crime commissioners wants more money to be spent on them. Which is it: too who were elected last Thursday? They have important much money or too little? responsibilities and will be an important voice for people in their force areas in policing local communities. Police Yvette Cooper: That was not an answer to the question. and crime commissioners take up their office officially The Home Secretary has to take some responsibility for this Thursday. I look forward to working with them in the shambles that she has created. In April she got the future to do everything we can to ensure that we can decision and the date wrong over Abu Qatada by accident; continue to cut crime. in November she got the date wrong on the elections Between March 2010 and March 2012, the total number deliberately. By not holding them in November, she of front-line officers fell by 6,778. could have saved £25 million alone, but she chose not to. People did not want these elections last week. They said Mr Slaughter: There are more people here than voted it was a waste of money, they said they did not know for police and crime commissioners. anything about it, they objected to the policy and they The Mayor of London has cut 3,500 police officers did not want to vote in the dark. She did not listen to and police community support officers in the last two those warnings and she is not listening to the public years. The Metropolitan police is getting rid of borough now or the message that they sent last week. Why does commanders and neighbourhood sergeants, and closing she not listen to them and apologise for the shambles 65 police stations to the public across London, including that this Home Secretary and her decisions have created? Shepherd’s Bush in my constituency and South Norwood in Croydon North. Does the Home Secretary think that Mrs May: I make no apology for introducing police will make the public in London feel safer or less safe? and crime commissioners, who have a democratic mandate for the first time. For the first time, the public know that Mrs May: Of course, the Metropolitan police has put there is somebody who has been elected who is visible, forward some proposals today in relation to its budget, accessible and accountable to them. PCCs have replaced including proposals to cut central costs significantly invisible, unaccountable, unelected police authorities. and actually increase the number of constables. Neither I think police and crime commissioners are going to the hon. Gentleman nor those on his Front Bench are make a real difference to cutting crime in this country. able to get it yet. The Opposition have continually claimed that it is not possible to cut budgets without John Penrose (Weston-super-Mare) (Con): Last week damaging front-line services or without crime going up; there was also a parliamentary by-election in Manchester yet budgets are being cut, front-line services are being Central, where the turnout was 18%, yet I notice that protected, the number of neighbourhood officers is nobody is arguing that it was in any way a shambles or going up and crime is falling. that there was a lack of a democratic mandate. Does my 293 Oral Answers19 NOVEMBER 2012 Oral Answers 294 right hon. Friend agree that all this says more about the that has wanted to hire a skilled worker who meets the Opposition’s party political point scoring than about requirements has been unable to do so. Our policies are any concern for police matters? sound: we are keeping control of immigration but contributing very successfully to economic growth. Mrs May: My hon. Friend makes an important point. I would also point out to the shadow Home Secretary, Meg Hillier (Hackney South and Shoreditch) (Lab/ the right hon. Member for Normanton, Pontefract and Co-op): I represent Tech City, and in my regular meetings Castleford (Yvette Cooper), that I believe that there was with representatives of those technical businesses, a freepost in that by-election, although it did not seem immigration comes up as one of the main challenges. to drive up the turn-out. I have heard no comments For all the Minister’s comments just now about there about the legitimacy of the individual who has been being no cap, he is causing confusion and complication elected as a Member of Parliament. in a sector that could be driving the British economy. When will he rethink? Immigration Rules Mr Harper: I really do not think that the hon. Lady is 2. Paul Blomfield (Sheffield Central) (Lab): What plans right. We have a cap on skilled migration, but we have she has to review the timing, frequency and communication not come anywhere near it. We have a clear system for of changes to the immigration rules and associated businesses being able to bring in skilled workers. If she guidance. [128814] has specific examples from businesses in her constituency, I would be delighted to meet the people involved so that The Minister for Immigration (Mr Mark Harper): I can set out clearly what our policies are, and if there Changes to the immigration rules and associated guidance are genuine issues, I will absolutely look at them. are scheduled twice each year, with additional urgent changes being made when required. Guidance explains Mr James Clappison (Hertsmere) (Con): Will my how the rules must be applied, and it may be updated hon. Friend give me an assurance that all changes will more frequently. We keep the need for changing the be properly announced? In particular, I should like an rules and the guidance under constant review. assurance that there will be no repeat of what happened from 1997 onwards, when there was a massive increase Paul Blomfield: I thank the Minister for his reply, but in the number of work visas granted to non-EU workers, he will know that there have been 15 changes to the UK without proper announcement, and the implementation Border Agency’s guidance to the higher education sector of a de facto open-door immigration policy—even though in relation to tier 4 sponsors over the past couple of it sounds very much as though the Opposition would years. Does he acknowledge the concern on both sides like to do the same thing again. of the House and beyond at the inclusion of international students in net migration targets? Will he also acknowledge that, despite the damage that that has caused to university Mr Harper: I can give my hon. Friend that assurance. recruitment, the Government said in their response to We want to ensure that we have firm but fair immigration the Lords Science and Technology Committee that they controls, and that we have a cap on immigration, not were committed to the growth of the university sector? least so that businesses can give British workers a proper Will he commit to a period of stability in relation to opportunity to get into employment.
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