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Henrikh Dudnik. Full, unedited interview, 2012

ID FL003.interview PERMALINK http://n2t.net/ark:/86084/b4bz61b2w

ITEM TYPE VIDEO ORIGINAL LANGUAGE RUSSIAN

TABLE OF CONTENTS ITEM TRANSCRIPT

ENGLISH TRANSLATION 2 CITATION & RIGHTS 12

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Henrikh Dudnik. Full, unedited interview, 2012

ID FL003.interview PERMALINK http://n2t.net/ark:/86084/b4bz61b2w

ITEM TYPE VIDEO ORIGINAL LANGUAGE RUSSIAN

TRANSCRIPT ENGLISH TRANSLATION —Today is November 29, 2012. We are in Miami, meeting a veteran of the Great Patriotic War. Please introduce yourself and tell us when and where you born.

My name is Henrikh Yakovlevich Dudnik, and I was born in 1920 in Tulchyn, Vinnitsa [Vinnytsya] Oblast, Ukraine.

—What was life like in Tulchyn before the war?

It was not too bad. Most people were craftsmen. There were five factories. It was a small town with a population of 20,000-30,000, if I remember correctly. I graduated from a ten-year school in Tulchyn.

—Was this a Jewish school?

No, it was Russian. There was one Jewish school and the rest were Russian.

—Were there many Jews in Tulchyn?

Yes . . . almost the entire town was Jewish. However, there were not only Jews, but also Russian and Ukrainians.

—How did everyone get along?

They got along fine.

—Did the children play together? Was there no . . .

No, there was no ethnic tension at all. Everyone got along.

—Did your parents speak Yiddish?

They knew it and spoke a mix of Yiddish and Russian to each other.

—Did you have any siblings?

Yes, I had a younger brother. He passed away.

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Henrikh Dudnik. Full, unedited interview, 2012

ID FL003.interview PERMALINK http://n2t.net/ark:/86084/b4bz61b2w

ITEM TYPE VIDEO ORIGINAL LANGUAGE RUSSIAN

—Did you celebrate Jewish holidays at home?

Yes, thanks to my grandfather who was very religious. We mostly celebrated the holidays at my grandparents’ home. The table was laid out with Jewish dishes. We ate Jewish . . . it was very good. There was more at my grandparents'. My grandfather was a tailor while my grandmother took care of the home. They observed and celebrated all the holidays.

—What did your parents do?

My mother took care of the house and my father was an accountant. He was not born in Tulchyn, but in Berdichev [Berdychiv]. My mother was a native of Tulchyn; all her brothers were also born there and got their education there. There's nobody left now.

—You completed ten grades?

Yes.

—When did you graduate?

In 1938.

—What did you do after that?

I finished the ten-year school in Tulchyn, but I spent seven years in school in Kharkov [Kharkiv]. We also lived in Kharkov because my father worked for the security services.

—What did you do after you graduated?

I went to study at the Automobile and Highway Institute in Kharkov. However, I was seriously in love with a young woman, so I left Kharkov to follow her to Odessa [Odesa].

—When were you drafted?

In 1939.

—Was this when Timoshenko’s order about universal conscription was issued?

Timoshenko? May he be forgotten. He introduced a rule that there would be no special allowances during

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Henrikh Dudnik. Full, unedited interview, 2012

ID FL003.interview PERMALINK http://n2t.net/ark:/86084/b4bz61b2w

ITEM TYPE VIDEO ORIGINAL LANGUAGE RUSSIAN military drills. For example, when we were on guard duty, we could not lower the flaps of our hats even when it was really cold, because the rules forbade it. Back then we wore Budyonny hats. There was an order to draft those born in 1920 and also those who were twenty-seven or twenty-eight years old but had not served due to various reasons. Timoshenko . . . I did not know how people respected him. I personally did not. The classroom where everything was taught to us had a clear rule that no shortcuts or exceptions could be made at any time.

—What type of unit did you serve in?

In a tank unit. I was drafted and served in Luga. I was drafted toward the end of the war with Finland and I caught the tail end of the war.

—So you served at the front there?

Yes.

—In which unit?

I was a tank commander and sometimes a gunner. All the crew members knew how to perform every task in the tank. I could easily do the job of the driver-mechanic or the gunner and radio operator. We had universal skills. I did not spend a long time there. Then I served in Luga, which had been nicknamed Luga the Drunk because a long time ago merchants would gather there and have parties. I also served in a tank unit there. I was the commander of a tank and the driver-mechanic. I also spent some time as a tank repair technician.

—Were these light tanks?

You could say that. A large-caliber machine gun could pierce the armor. I had additional armor because the front section where the driver sits has extra protection. The armor was spaced so there was a pocket of air between the two slabs of armor. This air pocket helped dampen the shells. We also had two-turreted tanks, which could be pierced clean by a machine gun. A good friend of mine burned to death in one of them.

—How many people were in a tank crew?

Three: the commander, driver-mechanic, and the radio operator and gunner.

—You are Jewish, what about the other two?

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Henrikh Dudnik. Full, unedited interview, 2012

ID FL003.interview PERMALINK http://n2t.net/ark:/86084/b4bz61b2w

ITEM TYPE VIDEO ORIGINAL LANGUAGE RUSSIAN

There were not too many Jews in my unit.

—The crew was made up three men . . .

One was Russian, the other Ukrainian.

—How did you get along?

Pretty well. How could it be otherwise? Back then everyone got along. We loved our neighbors. We lived in Tashkent; we actually came here from Tashkent. We were surrounded by Uzbeks. My wife learned Uzbek and I picked up a little too. I have forgotten it now, but we understand Uzbeks. They are not a bad people.

—Where were you when the war began on June 22, 1941?

I was serving in my unit near Leningrad, in Pushkin.

—What happened when it was announced that the war had begun?

I was washing my footwraps . . . I took part in the war from the very first day. I was sitting on the riverbank washing my feet. At night it was announced that we were at war. The sentry came running and told me the war had started. I laughed. We were sure that there would be no war because Stalin and Molotov had signed an agreement. It turns out that it was not worth the paper it was written on. Hitler did not follow the terms of the deal and violated every single clause. I did not believe him and told him to leave me be. What war?! He tried to tell me the news again. A few hours later the bombing began. We were based in Pushkin, opposite of the Catherine Palace. Our main positions were a few kilometers away. During combat or during an air raid we had a backup position. Our backup positions were in Pargolovo. When the war began, that's where we started. Our tanks were kept in barns that once housed the horses of the 49th Cavalry Regiment. We all went to retrieve our tanks in Pargolovo.

—What happened next?

There was a muster point in the forest where we all gathered. We were issued uniforms and weapons, including semi-automatic rifles. The tankmen had pistols because rifles are unwieldy in a tank, but pistols are quite easy to use.

—Where did you go from Pargolovo?

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Henrikh Dudnik. Full, unedited interview, 2012

ID FL003.interview PERMALINK http://n2t.net/ark:/86084/b4bz61b2w

ITEM TYPE VIDEO ORIGINAL LANGUAGE RUSSIAN

We traveled to the Karelian Isthmus. First our positions were close to Leningrad at Pushkin and Krasnoye Selo. Later we were moved further out toward the outer lines of defense.

—What was an average day there like?

If there was no combat, things were pretty quiet. People tried to get a bite to eat in the morning and wash up. Not everyone could wash up because there was not enough water. It was freezing. We would melt snow in an old oil drum. We kept warm by burning logs soaked in diesel. We had the diesel because it was the fuel for our tanks. There was no shortage of diesel.

—How were you fed? You mentioned breakfast, what did it consist of?

The breakfast . . . had to be drawn. We only had crackers, so we ate those.

—Was there any combat where you were based?

Yes, we both attacked and defended. Our tanks got hit and burned. We had light tanks, tankettes.

—Where were you sent after that?

First we were on the Leningrad Front and then on the Volkhov Front. There was heavy fighting there. There are some settlements near Leningrad like Gatchina, and there were a few battles there. Most of the fighting was in Tikhvin, on the Finnish side, Mga, Lyuban.

—What was the mood like in 1941-42? Were your spirits dampened, or did you continue to believe in victory?

We were raised in Soviet times. The young people . . . were all patriotic. I made an inscription on my tank that read “For the Motherland.” We believed in victory.

—You have two medals “For Courage.” Do you remember what you were awarded for?

Yes, let me think about it . . . This was at the railway station in Mga, a large railway junction. There were battles there and I took part in the capture of a German dugout. I remember throwing a grenade down the chimney. The dugout did not collapse, but I did kill some Germans. Some of the men inside were killed and the rest were taken prisoner by us.

—What about the Order of the Red Star?

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Henrikh Dudnik. Full, unedited interview, 2012

ID FL003.interview PERMALINK http://n2t.net/ark:/86084/b4bz61b2w

ITEM TYPE VIDEO ORIGINAL LANGUAGE RUSSIAN

This was at the railway station in Lyuban and I took part in destroying the tracks around it.

—Where were you sent after the Volkhov Front?

To the hospital.

—You were wounded? When?

In 1942.

—When you were in your tank?

Yes. The tank was pierced and a shell fragment hit me . . . I was even on fire, I still have a mark on my arm. In 1942 my leg was hit so badly that it hung on by a thread. This was all near Leningrad.

—How did you get out of the tank?

Through the top hatch.

—On your own, or did you get help?

When I got hit in the leg? They pulled me out.

—Did you return to your unit after you were wounded?

The first two times I did, but the third wound was too serious. I was sent to a hospital in Pavlodar, Kazakhstan. After I was discharged from the hospital, I was given forty-five days of leave to rest up. This was in 1942-43. I was then transferred to Tashkent. I stayed in Yangiyul with my parents for half a year. My uncle was also there. They had been evacuated there. They lived in a hut. It was cold and there was no food. The conditions were terrible. There was a kerosene lamp and I stayed in the same room as my mother. It was a small room with a clay floor. My mother lived with my brother and my aunt with her small child lived across from them. There was also a goat there, which slept in my room and was tethered to the bed with a rope. I slept on my trench coat and the goat occasionally came to cuddle with me for warmth. So life was great. My leave then ended and I reported to the Yangiyul draft office. I worked there as chief of the 4th Department. We were in charge of teaching pre-draft boys the basics of how to shoot and march. Then I was transferred to the Tashkent draft office. Those were hungry years. We only got 600 grams of bread as rations. In Leningrad people only got 250 grams.

—Were there any Uzbeks in your unit when you served near Leningrad?

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Henrikh Dudnik. Full, unedited interview, 2012

ID FL003.interview PERMALINK http://n2t.net/ark:/86084/b4bz61b2w

ITEM TYPE VIDEO ORIGINAL LANGUAGE RUSSIAN

No, not in our unit.

—You mentioned after you threw the grenade some people were killed and a few were taken prisoner.

Yes, we captured the few remaining survivors.

—What did you do with them?

We sent them down the line, there was a convoy.

They were covered in lice . . .

—The Germans?

Yes. We were even weary of . . . going into their dugout. It was better to sleep outside on the snow than in their dugout. The walls were lined with logs and there was a small stove by which they kept warm, but they were infested with lice.

—The Red Army also had issues with lice.

No, the Red Army did not. Only in one dugout did I get lice after spending a night there. They were terrible lice. I'd scratch my skin until it bled. They even got into the belt buckle. In Volkhov I ran into a friend of mine who was serving in a delousing unit. Since he knew me, he would get me new uniforms. But as soon as I returned to my barracks I would be covered in lice again. After a few changes of underclothes I managed to get rid of them. Do you know how we did laundry at the front?

—How?

I would take a bucket of gasoline and soak my clothes in it. The clothes became clean, but had a yellowish hue. Back then we were outfitted with T-26 tanks, which had gasoline engines that were taken from aircraft. So we would use the aircraft fuel for laundry. There was no real need to wash it because you could just dip it in, put it on a tree, and then put it on in half an hour. This is how we avoided lice.

—Did you live in Tashkent the whole time?

Yes, I became an Uzbek. My wife knows Uzbek well and I used to speak it, but I no longer remember it.

Henrikh Dudnik. Full, unedited interview, 2012

ID FL003.interview PERMALINK http://n2t.net/ark:/86084/b4bz61b2w

ITEM TYPE VIDEO ORIGINAL LANGUAGE RUSSIAN

—When you worked at the draft office, did you see many Uzbeks being sent to the front?

There were not that many Uzbeks from urban areas. They mostly sent people from the peripheries and the collective farms.

—Did they know Russian?

Not all of them. We spoke to them in Russian, though. We taught them to assemble and disassemble rifles. There were not many PPSh submachine guns back then. In general, the army did not have many of them. Our unit did not have any. They only came later.

—Were you afraid during your first battles with the Germans?

How can I put it? You are in a tank driving toward the battlefield. It is unpleasant. You fear getting hit any second. With heavy tanks, the armor was a bit thicker, but it could still be pierced with thermite shells.

—Did you ever use T-34 tanks?

Yes.

—When did you receive them?

We got a few in 1942, but not many. They were still light tanks around. Their crew had five people.

—Were you the only Jew in your crew?

Yes.

—Who were the rest?

Different ethnicities.

—Did you get along?

Yes, we all drank our 100 grams of vodka together.

—Did you receive it before battles or every day?

Every day. Every day the sergeant major received enough for fifty people, but by evening there were fewer

Henrikh Dudnik. Full, unedited interview, 2012

ID FL003.interview PERMALINK http://n2t.net/ark:/86084/b4bz61b2w

ITEM TYPE VIDEO ORIGINAL LANGUAGE RUSSIAN of us than that. When a new temporary company would come in, many of the men got killed the same day.

—These were infantry soldiers?

Yes.

—Did they come with the tanks?

Sometimes the rode on top and other times they marched behind the tanks. So many men were killed. More in the infantry. The tankmen were killed too, but not in numbers like that. We were also given 100 ml of vodka, bread, and canned meat. The field kitchen cooked us porridge.

—You have two children?

Yes, a son and a daughter.

—When they were of school age, did you tell them about the war that you saw firsthand?

Yes. When they got older, they were not as interested.

—What about your grandchildren?

One of them was always interested. The second . . . not so much. I was even invited to speak at a school in Yangiyul and Tashkent. I told my story.

—Did the children ask you questions?

There were lots of questions about how we fought, how we were dressed, how we were fed, where we slept, whether we saw any Germans. They were interested in almost every aspect of the war.

—Thank you very much. Do you remember for what you received your second “For Courage” medal and the Order of the Patriotic War?

I do not remember . . .

—Thank you very much.

And thank you for not forgetting about us.

Henrikh Dudnik. Full, unedited interview, 2012

ID FL003.interview PERMALINK http://n2t.net/ark:/86084/b4bz61b2w

ITEM TYPE VIDEO ORIGINAL LANGUAGE RUSSIAN

Henrikh Dudnik. Full, unedited interview, 2012

ID FL003.interview PERMALINK http://n2t.net/ark:/86084/b4bz61b2w

ITEM TYPE VIDEO ORIGINAL LANGUAGE RUSSIAN

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