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Sara Parcak Interview Part One SARA PARCAK INTERVIEW PART ONE NOTE: This transcript was generated by the service Rev.com, and though it’s quite good, it is imperfect. If you would like to quote anything from this episode you are welcome to! But please find the point in the audio where the quote originates, and verify that the transcript is accurate. If Rev’s transcript is inaccurate, we ask that you only post or publish a version of the quote that you deem correct (because your ears are awesome!). Hello Ars Technica listeners. This is the latest serialization of an episode of the After On podcast here at Ars. We’re splitting this one into three segments, starting today. And I’ll be talking to Sarah Parcak - who is a world-class astroarchaeologist. And isn't that the best title ever? Sarah's other titles include or have included professor of archeology, TED Fellow, National Geographic explorer, and National Geographic Fellow. And what may be disappointing news for some folks, it was for me, I'll note that space archeologists don't dig up the sites of ancient civilizations on Mars, although Elon Musk may fix that someday. Rather, they use satellite imagery to discover, monitor, and learn more about ancient sites on Earth. And though space archeology first emerged over 20 years before Sarah finished graduate school, she's very much a pioneer of this field, which has made huge strides over the past decade, as ever higher resolution images have become available at ever cheaper prices. Sarah's work has pinpointed thousands of likely ancient sites, which were previously unknown in Egypt alone. And she may have taken us a giant step closer in locating one of the ancient world's most significant lost cities, a long- time capital of Egypt. She later led an amazingly comprehensive effort to detect and document archeological looting in the years leading up to and following the Arab spring. In 2016, Sarah won the million dollar TED prize to further her work. She used both the money and the platform that TED gave her to launch a citizen scientist platform, which has enlisted over 50000 people in a project identifying previously unknown sites throughout Peru. That platform and the organization Sarah founded to run it have a very bright future, although that's all that can be said for now, Rob says mysteriously. Just two days before posting this episode, I was down in Alabama where Sarah teaches learning far more than I'd previously known about her work, which is saying something because as you'll hear in the interview, we first met over five years ago. We were both about to undergo the terrifying process of speaking on the main stage at the TED conference. Though she was still in her earliest thirties at that point, her credentials were already astonishing, and I watched her career with ever-growing astonishment ever since. And with that, it is a great delight to bring you a fascinating conversation with Sarah Parcak. (TRANSITION MUSIC) Rob Reid: Sarah, it is great to be here in your adoptive town and state of Birmingham, Alabama. This is my 49th state that I have visited in my lifetime. Sarah Parcak: Great to have you here, and I'm glad that we are proving our reputation with hospitality. Breakfast this morning, I think was barely acceptable. Rob Reid: Possibly the best french toast I've ever had. Ironically, not at the french toast House, but at the Pancake House, which is across the street from the Waffle House. Sarah Parcak: Of course it is. Rob Reid: Yeah, of course it is. I don't know if there really are french toast houses anywhere, but that was mind-blowing stuff. And I'm gonna throw a crazy suggestion at you. [foreign language 00:03:22]. Sarah Parcak: [foreign language 00:03:29]. Rob Reid: [foreign language 00:03:37]. Sarah Parcak: [foreign language 00:03:41]. Rob Reid: [foreign language 00:03:44]. So back to English. For those of you who are wondering what that was, it's a little repartee in Egyptian Arabic because both Sarah and I happen to speak that better than most non-Egyptian, non-Muslim, non-Arab Americans, by [inaudible 00:03:56] of having spent a great deal of time in Cairo. Now, we may end up talking about what first brought me to Cairo, but Sarah, why don't you start out by telling us why you spent so much time there. Sarah Parcak: Because I have probably an unhealthy obsession with ancient Egypt that I have had ever since I was a small child. I am an Egyptologist. Rob Reid: And you are also a space archeologist. Sarah Parcak: That's right. I wear multiple hats, all of them slightly different shades of Fedora brown. Rob Reid: Got it, got it. Now to start briefly with a definition of space archeology, by the way, I don't know why, but I'm always wanting to say astroarcheologist because somehow that just sounds more crazy. And I will add, astroarcheologist does not get a red squiggle in Gmail. It does in Microsoft word, but I started writing that for some reason and then you corrected me. It is space archeologist, right? Sarah Parcak: That is correct. So I guess the more formal academic term would be a satellite archeologist, or even a landscape archeologist, someone that uses satellite imagery to map large areas that you go and explore. But I blame NASA for inventing this term. NASA actually has a space archeology program that funds people like me. So essentially, the definition is an archeologist or scientist who uses different types of satellite imagery, both large scale resolution and high resolution imagery that you might see on something like Google Earth. And in processing the data, you may find sites, features, ancient environmental features like rivers or dried up lakes. And then you go out and you survey or excavate said features. And these are things that typically you wouldn't be able to see unless you use satellite or other imagery taken from on high. Rob Reid: Got it, got it. And the field got started in 1984, right? There was a very specific moment where there was a meeting of sorts, a pow wow where this all came together. Sarah Parcak: Yes, so I credit my good friend professor Tom Seaver, who for years was NASA's official archeologist and now he's a professor at the University of Alabama at Huntsville. At the time, Tom was an archeologist working for NASA and he had this conference in 1984 where he brought together a diverse set of archeologists and said, "Hey, we've got all these cool technology applications. You all should consider using satellite imagery. I think it could really help you find sites and map sites." And at the time, virtually no archeologists were really using it, so after his conference, a lot of archeologists started applying satellite imagery, and a lot of the first papers started coming out a couple years later. And thus, the field was born. Rob Reid: This was 1984, so he was done with his legendary run pitching for the Mets. I think it was 311 wins, 61 shot outs, over 3500 strike outs, Mr. Tom Seaver, right? Sarah Parcak: Yes. And hundreds of ancient sites. Rob Reid: Different Tom Seaver than the pitcher for the Mets, I just had to make that little joke. Sarah Parcak: I appreciate that, I'm sure he does too. Rob Reid: I'm sure he does too. Now actually to get to your own path here, where the University of Alabama in Birmingham, you mentioned he's in Huntsville. So Alabama is a veritable hotbed for space archeology it seems. Sarah Parcak: Who knew. So when I came here in 2006 to start my job at UAB, I kind of put two and two together, and reached out to Tom. He's about an hour and 20 minute drive north of us, so I got to go, and time to time I'll go and visit him. He'll usually have visiting colleagues. When I first started at UAB, we had a cooperative agreement with NASA. They were very generous, and provided some funding for my research and to help out with our students. So yeah, totally random that we both ended up in Alabama. Rob Reid: To get to your own path to Alabama, I'd like to go all the way back. You are from Bangor, Maine. Sarah Parcak: Yes. Rob Reid: Very different climate, very different state. Sarah Parcak: Very, very different. Rob Reid: And your fascination with Egypt and Egyptology goes back to a tooth fairy's gift, as far as that? Sarah Parcak: Yes. So most Egyptologists will tell you that they cannot tell you why they started being interested in ancient Egypt. It usually starts at ages three, four, or five. Rob Reid: Really? Across the field, that's a common- Sarah Parcak: Across the field, everyone just gets obsessed with Egypt at a really, really young age. And when I was growing up, this was Maine in the early timid 1980s, this was pre-cable, pre-internet. Did I see a National Geographic story and get interested? I don't know. I can't remember the moment when I became interested. My mom tells me that out of the blue, I just started asking her about mummies and pyramids, and she went, "What?" There's no reason for it.
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