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Home , Bo Bice, Criteria Studios, Desmond Child, Dude (Looks Like a Lady), It Feels So Good, John Kalodner

Desmond Child in 1978, the year he joined ASCAP

Desmond Child has a great laugh. It is heartfelt, energetic and infectious. The same could be said for his career and his commitment to his craft. As a and producer, Child has spent more than two decades as one of the music indus - try's most successful creative forces, racking up over 70 Top 40 singles while generating a mind-boggling 300-million-plus sold worldwide. His collaborators have been some of the biggest names in music – KISS, , , , , , and more, and with them Child has created some of the most popular and enduring music of our time. As Child celebrates his 30th anniversary as an ASCAP member, he remains as in-demand and ambitious as BY ERIK PHILBROOK ever, working recently with , Meatloaf (Desmond produced III , , and his old pals Bon Jovi while also pur - suing exciting new projects in musical theatre, film and TV. On June 19th, the Hall of Fame inducted Child into its prestigious ranks. It was another big night in his extraordinary career, and he celebrated the special occasion by reuniting and performing with his original band, Desmond Child and Rouge. From his home, Child recently spoke with Playback’s Erik Philbrook by phone about his art, his great collaborations, his passionate commitment to the music com - munity and his current projects.

DESMOND CHILD CELEBRATES 30 YEARS AS AN ASCAP MEMBER AND INDUCTION INTO THE

Jon Bon Jovi, Cher, Desmond Child and

41 PL★ I CREATE AMUSIC Y WEEKBCREATAES OPPCORTUKNIT Y★ SUMMER 2008

ASCAP @ TRIBECA FILM FESTIVAL

LICENSE TO THRIL L: PHILLY’S WORLD CAFE LIVE

Desmond Child in 1978, the year he joined ASCAP Desmond Child CHI LD ’S Celebrates 30 Years of DE ST INY Hitmaking ASCAP AWARDS COVERAGE: POP, FILM & TELEVISION MUSIC, CHRISTIAN MUSIC; SXSW, CREATOR’S TOOL BOX, TAKE ME OUT ASCAP MEMBER TO THE BALL GAME, HOWLING RAIN, DOWNTOWN PUBLISHING MAGAZINE DESMOND CHILD

opening act was Jerry Lewis and Dean Martin when she played the Stork Club when she was 16 years old. She was also the first Hispanic woman to get her own solo show at Carnegie Hall. My uncle was a in a singing group, Los Corsarios, that sang in five-part harmony. They sang at the Tropicana and all the best clubs in Havana. He was still performing when they left Cuba after the revolution. So, I grew up in a show business family.

What happened after you moved to the states? When we hit Miami, we were very poor and we lived in the projects, but we always had a . My mother would spend the little money that we had getting arrangements done of her songs, and then she would go with a demo cassette down to the nightclubs on the weekends. She'd always have her music with her. If she saw an artist, she would run up and give them her new song. She had Desmond Child, and in the studio a lot of cuts but made no money. When I was 14 years old, I met Lisa Wexler, Your mother was a songwriter. How did her artists that work for me that are training, who was a snowbird girl who was going to experience as an artist affect your that if you're not feeling it at every vertical boarding school in Massachusetts. Then she approach to music? moment, if you're not feeling a feeling, then would come down to Miami with her parents. I didn't know that not everyone just gets up you're not doing anything, because that ver - Her dad, , was making a lot of in the morning and starts writing a song tical moment of a song when there's at Criteria Studios. And I would go about how they feel and what they're going going on or a feeling carrying through and hang out, and we'd be in her room, and through. That’s what I grew up with. I would between phrases, and it's completely dead, she actually played me the music of Laura sit on the floor next to the piano where my the audience will turn off and they'll switch Nyro before it ever came out. From that mother would be songwriting, and eventual - stations. moment on I knew that that’s what I wanted ly, once I understood words, I started to to do. make suggestions on the lyrics that she was Tell me about your Cuban musical heritage. writing (laughs). Then as soon as I could My uncle married the most famous singer in Was Jerry able to help you in any way? climb up on the piano bench, I started imi - Cuba, alongside Celia Cruz. Her name is I didn't tell him about my ambitions because I tating and writing these long concertos that Olga Guillot. She's made 87 albums in her was very shy. Lisa would have to pull me away would start one place and end completely life. There's an Olga Guillot Boulevard as from the dinner table every night where Jerry somewhere else. The next day I'd go and part of Calle Ocho in Miami. She was hon - would be with Ahmet Ertegun and Arif practice again and I'd play the same melody. ored this year by the Latin Grammys with Marden and . Dowd would give me So it wasn't just random improvisation. I also the Lifetime Achievement Award. She was rides back to my house in the projects where grew up in the age of . So the con - like the Judy Garland of Cuba. She sang I lived, in Liberty City. cept of a band writing their own songs was with Piaf. She sang with . Her just part of my makeup.

Do you remember when you wrote your first song? I wrote my first song when I was 14 in junior high – my first pop song. I never looked back. I just kept writing and writing and writing.

You must have had a certain insight into good song structure. Especially having a mother that was a songwriter. I think it was instinctual. I just would feel the emotion. A song is an expression of emotion. I liken it to when somebody is telling you about something terrible that happened and then all of a sudden they a little more intense, and then all of a sudden they just start boo-hooing (laughs). That’s how it works in pop songwriting. You know, there's the verse that's usually short little phrases, and then comes a little bit more emotional intensity in the transition towards the cho - rus, and then when the chorus comes in, it’s all hell breaks loose. That matches human communication, emotional communication. That’s why I always tell my students, or the Ricky Martin with Desmond Child

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Despite being shy, you obviously were dri - er to make a solo record for me. He had an have the actors act and then you score behind ven to go pursue this as your career. apartment in where he lived, but them. That's the reason why in a song like Well, I’ve always felt I had both ambition and he had a separate apartment on the other “Livin' La Vida Loca,” you'll hear that there integrity in me. I never wanted Lisa to feel, as side of town, on West 56th Street, that was are alot of bells and whistles that are empha - my friend, that I was using her to get some - just for songwriting. We'd meet at a little sizing what the lyrics are saying. where. So I never went to Atlantic, never went restaurant called Coq au Vin for its lunch spe - The perfect example: Going into the sec - to Jerry and played that card. Now, looking back, I realize how dumb I was, because I could have gone to Jerry and said, “Can I be “THOSE OF US IN MUSIC ARE SO BLESSED your assistant?” He would have let me hang out at the studio. I just didn't know to do that. THAT WE'RE IN SOMETHING LIKE THIS THAT But I made it anyway. Although just imagine all the sessions I missed. HAS EMOTION AND SPIRITUALLY AND

I’ve heard you say that for the most part HUMANISTIC VALUES ATTACHED TO IT.” your songs develop out of the creation of a title or a single idea, but that earlier in cial. That was at noon. And then by 1 o'clock ond verse, where it says, "Woke up in New your career you didn't quite write that way. we'd be sitting at the piano, and we would go York City in a funky cheap hotel" – it opens How did you develop your best approach? until 6pm, and that would be the end of it – with a gong. And the gong indicates kind of Originally I would write songs by just playing with very few breaks. like waking up in Chinatown somewhere with chords and singing melodies and kind of There was only a piano, a piano bench and beaded curtains and incense. mumbling along, hoping that the melody this stool that had arms on it. There was no would speak out of some sequence couch. There was no armchair. And that's Works beautifully. that sounded like certain words that I could what I did for two years, Monday through To me the lyric indicates the orchestration. It then string together and make sense out of it. Friday, without fail. dictates the style. It dictates everything. I notice that a lot of people now writing to Once I started writing that way, I started real - tracks do that. That’s the complete opposite Sounds like that was your boot camp. ly having a lot of hits (laughs) – not just a hit of what I was taught by , who was That was boot camp, because he taught me here and there. It also helped me to help my mentor for two years. We wrote 38 songs to come up with a concept for the song first. artists to express themselves. Because after in that period of time. Come up with a title. Come up with a reason getting to know artists and getting them to I already had hits with my group Desmond to open your mouth and sing. He also taught tell me the story of their life, then I would pull Child and Rouge. After we broke up, the idea me that the music is a slave to the lyric, that from that the things that I felt instinctually was that Bob and I would write songs togeth - the music is the score to the script. First you needed to be said – for their own sake. I was writing a song just this week, and where the song was going was negative. I told my co-writer – he's a young, upcoming song - writer – we can't have an artist keep saying that. If the song's a hit, then for the rest of the artist’s life he’ll be saying this negative thing that then will be reinforced in his own sub - conscious, and he’ll fail. We don't want our artists to fail. We want them to think that they're winners. I learned that from KISS, because, you know, when I'd be writing KISS songs, I wouldn't understand why Paul would say, “I could never sing that,” because the characters in KISS always have to be winners. They can't be losers. And so that applied then to Bon Jovi and to Aerosmith. The only exceptions are and Meatloaf, because their charac - ters are such monsters that they have to fail to be punished for their evildoings (laughs).

One of your earliest collaborations with of KISS was “I Was Made for Loving You.” At the time, that was, stylis - tically, quite a different song for them. Your influence, I assume. I have to take credit for that because, you know, the music that I was making at the time with Desmond Child and Rouge was kind of foreshadowing the mixture of dance and pop and rock that happened in the '80s. That was also the advent of machine drums. So the whole concept of a kind of mechan - ical march that was danceable with rock gui - tars over it was a fusion that drew me in. There was a lot of resistance. But they lis - tened to me, and it became one of their biggest-selling hits of all time.

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Was that a game changer for you in your career? “TO ME THE LYRIC INDICATES THE Well, it was the number one song all over the world. And so for me, yes, all of a sudden it ORCHESTRATION. IT DICTATES THE STYLE. wasn't just me being an artist. I started to get a whole different kind of respect. IT DICTATES EVERYTHING. ONCE I STARTED That success created a kind of career that many people after me jumped on, because WRITING THAT WAY, I STARTED REALLY before that time guys in bands did not write with outside writers. They wrote with produc - HAVING A LOT OF HITS.” ers or maybe their girlfriend. Paul Stanley was generous enough to invite me in, and ple in the business that I've ever experienced. things, start playing. We can get in a creative that created a career for me. For the most part, everybody that is with zone instantly together, and then we're in the So then Jon Bon Jovi, with his band Bon them are the same people that were there moment, creating. There's a flow between our Jovi, were touring in Europe, opening for from the beginning. minds, and our subconscious batteries are KISS. Paul recommended that they co-write hooked into each other. with me. Jon called and we got together, and That is an amazing accomplishment, espe - I have that kind of soulful relationship with on the very first day we wrote “You Give Love cially in the music industry. other people as well, but the relationship with a Bad Name.” That's their strength. We have a relationship Jon and Richie is something that we are very based on truth, which is something that was proud of, as well as the fact that our songs, Obviously, your collaboration with Jon and a big topic in our discussions from the very particularly “Livin' on a Prayer,” have Richie Sambora has been so prolific and beginning. endured and have become anthems for two successful. Why do you think it's been generations now. Working on a third. such an enduring relationship? When you collaborate with them, do you lit - Well, I think there's chemistry between the erally sit in a room and say, “okay, what Bon Jovi's success then led you to three of us, and individually between us as ideas do you have, what are you feeling?” Aerosmith. well. When the three of us get together, it's Yeah. Sometimes Richie and I have gotten Yes, because , who was working fun, and everybody takes their position. And together ahead of time and done some starts with Cher and Aerosmith, saw the success of it really works. to present to Jon. Sometimes Richie and Jon Bon Jovi. He brought me in to work with Cher. It’s also about loyalty and friendship, have done starts that they present to me. And I brought Jon and Richie in. We did a cou - because those guys are the most loyal peo - And sometimes we start thinking about ple of songs that we co-produced for her together and wrote for her – like “.” I had a very good relationship with Kalodner, who really was a visionary. He insist - ed that Aerosmith meet me. So I went there, and it was initially a chilly reception. They did not want it at all.

You mean they didn't want to work with an outside writer? No. They didn't. And particularly one that had success with another band (laughs). But I was just so different because I was - n't like a rock ‘n' roll person. I also think me being gay kind of helped. I wasn't a threat and they could feel good with me being around their wives, talking about decorating and all this kind of stuff. I was able to lend a different kind of advice. Also, because of my experience in the gay culture I come from, I was able to help them with “ (Looks like a Lady).” Because they were going to call it “Cruisin' for the Ladies.”

That’s an instance where your title alone is a grabber. Well, the title was the original title of Steven Tyler’s improvisation, because their song ini - tially came about because they had gone to some club and they had seen at the bar. Steven was making fun of him and said, “you know, hey, that dude looks like a lady.” Then he started going, “dude, dude looks like a lady. Dude looks like a lady.” That's a case where the rhythm engendered the track. On their own they said, “Oh, well, we can't Child at the sing, dude looks like a lady. That's crazy. What first-ever does that mean?” So then they changed it to ASCAP “I Create Music” "cruisin’ for the ladies." And then I came in EXPO in 2006 and changed it back.

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Killer song. Let’s talk about another: “Livin' Ricky's manager at the time, who asked me Martin. And then that gave people the idea collecting music, of collecting albums, and in Broadway musicals. I'm working on an ani - It's happening. And you know what? If you La Vida Loca.” You lived in Miami and you to write a Spanglish song, something that to sign , and on and on. It an absence of music education, we're getting mated motion picture. I'm working on tele - own your own music and you sell 250,000 were surrounded by Spanish-American had Spanish words and English words. And it continues to this day. Look at . Had to hear the songs of Broadway. We're getting vision shows about songwriting. I'm starting copies, you've just made a million bucks. mixes of music and language. But for the really was difficult because I speak Spanish there not been a Ricky Martin, there would to hear the songs of the Beatles. They're to get traction here and there. I have a lot of That's not so bad – instead of being unre - greater populace, that song really spear - fluently, but to have it be something that an not have been a Shakira. telling the young people who the Beatles are. ideas for musical films and I'm developing couped a million bucks (laughs). headed a whole Spanish crossover in music ordinary English-speaking-only American treatments for those and, and going out Well, it was two songs. The first song was citizen would understand, I pretty much had Now, you've also written material for some I love that answer. and pitching. Well, the possibilities are there now and “,” which Ricky Martin sang at the Taco Bell menu to choose from (laughs). of the breakout performers. You know when performed on So the last six months I've spent very little growing. the Grammys. We had written that as the You know, in terms of words, “pollo loco,” What's your feeling about the show in gen - American Idol , that was it. The gauntlet was time writing and 90 percent of my time out I'm just hoping that the powers that be pro - World Cup theme. It was Number One in 22 which is kind of where I got the word “loco.” eral? down and every – anybody cool, from Gwen countries but really hadn’t taken off here. And so then I started thinking about pollo You know what? I love it, and I was on board Stefani to Maroon 5, could then be on the show. Then his performance at the Grammys was loco, pollo loco. Livin' la vida loca. And that's from the very beginning. I produced one of “THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN JON BON really the bomb that launched the Latin where I got it. Kelly Clarkson's first singles, “Before Your In addition to being a songwriter, you're also music explosion. If you think about it, there It’s funny. At the time, the head of the Love.” And then later on I worked with Clay a producer and a publisher. Why did you take JOVI, RICHIE SAMBORA AND MYSELF IS would not be a Latin Grammys today had record company asked, after he heard the Aiken, I worked with Fantasia, I worked with on these other roles? there not been that performance. song, “oh, sounds great, but can you do it in and . And this year Being a producer helps to guarantee my SOMETHING THAT WE ARE ALL VERY PROUD It's fun that I have been a part of three English now?” And it's, like, it is in English. I produced , and we're getting songs on records – that's from the business major movements. One is the KISS song, And so, if you saw the first Billboard ad of ready to release his record in July. side – and it also helps to get them, from the OF, AS WELL AS THE FACT THAT OUR which brought dance music to rock. Then the “Livin' La Vida Loca,” he insisted on putting I love it. You know why? Because in an age creative stance, to turn out better, or at least next one was when I helped Bon Jovi bring underneath, "(Livin' the Crazy Life)." when music programs have been stripped they turn out like they please me better SONGS, PARTICULARLY ‘LIVIN' ON A singer-songwriter storytelling to heavy from our public schools and private schools, when I'm producing them. It's frustrating metal music. Thanks to my training with Bob I do remember seeing that. and only the rich who can afford music lessons when you hear something and you go, well, PRAYER,’ HAVE ENDURED AND BECOME Crewe, I made sure that all the inner rhyming We knew that there were a lot of crossover and instruments for their children after that's so lackluster. And I think sometimes was tight in the songs, which helped the Latin projects in the works, like Jennifer school, at home or in academies, are the only producers that are producing songs that ANTHEMS FOR TWO GENERATIONS NOW.” songs endure. Then, bringing all the experi - Lopez, Marc Anthony. We also sort of got ones that are getting music education, I think they did not write maybe aren't giving it the ence I had with KISS, Bon Jovi and also right in there with Santana, which wasn't Idol is doing a hell of a job informing people on spit and polish that they would if they had Desmond Child and Rouge, which had Latin really what we were doing, because Santana the great American songbook. written the song. there pitching, hoping to get traction. The tect those possibilities. I've gone to beats and horns and all of that back in the was bluesy and more rock-oriented. This was The whole thing is like a global village. world now belongs to people that can do it all Washington to fight for songwriters' rights, '70s...to Ricky Martin. really bringing the tropical sound back. There's the audience. There's the stage. What are you working on now? themselves, those who are intriguing artists, for copyright protection. It's unbelievable Nothing had happened like this since There are the lights. It’s like it brings us into a I'm going through a transition because, you that can write songs and, with a small group that there’s even a question, when we live in What was the origin of “Livin’ La Vida , and that was 15 years primordial place where the town talent gets know, with children, I have to be home. I of people, produce records on the cheap in what is supposed to be the most inventive Loca”? before. So all those years had gone on and up and belts one out. I love that. also need, at this point in my life, to create their home studios and get their music out to country in the history of mankind, that if That was a request from Angelo Medina, nothing had crossed over until Ricky I think that in the absence of a culture of works with longer arcs. So I am working on people on a grassroots level. somebody creates something that it doesn't

Congratulations Desmond!

I am proud to be a part of your team for over two decades.

Joel Weinstein Attorney at Law [email protected]

48 PLAYBACK 49 DESMOND CHILD belong to them. I mean, it's so crazy. So, I'm He's going to have to print a sign. This year marks your 30th Anniversary as involved in that way to help pave the way for Some people think that you can just an ASCAP member. What does ASCAP the future. bang a song out on an old acoustic mean to you? sitting on your back porch, and that is as I love being a member, and my friends at Further to that, I wanted to mention your much expense as you have to put into it. So ASCAP are just incredible. Brendan Okrent. participation in ASCAP's “I Create Music” I tell people, set this up as a business. Find Loretta Mu ñoz. Karen Sherry. John EXPO, because obviously ASCAP is trying a place to do your music that is a busi - LoFrumento. Marilyn Bergman. These people to respond to the changing nature of the nesslike atmosphere. Get business cards. have stuck with me through thick and thin. business by developing more business- Get a website. Get a fax machine. Spend They've supported me. They've helped me. savvy songwriters. And you've been so time on the phone hooking up with people They've backed me. I just love all the things generous with your time and talent at all and keeping your relationships alive. Show that they do. I was also just recently three EXPOs. What do you enjoy about up to everything. Connect and mingle and approached to create the Desmond Child participating? talk to people and be interested in what Foundation through ASCAP’s Foundation. I just love the energy that I get from the other people are doing. When other people young people that are there. And the people perform, show up and make sure they What will it do? that made the effort to come to the EXPO are know that you came. We're coming up with a program that's going the ones that are the winners, because they I've done a lifetime of that. It never to help up-and-coming music creators. We made the effort to come. They didn't just stops. I love the showcase in L.A. at a place have a lot of different ideas about how that read about it. They showed up. They put up called Mark's – called Upright Cabaret. I saw should look. I told them, well, hey, can I have it whatever they had to put up to be an active the most astounding singer there – Spencer be like specific to Cuban gay songwriters from participant. They're going to absorb the infor - Day. I just can't believe that he's not signed. Miami Beach? (laughs). mation. It feels so good to feel an audience It’s just killing me. He writes the most responding. incredible songs, sings better than I've You're being inducted into the Songwriters I always try to talk shop and reveal what’s heard anybody sing. I make myself go to Hall of Fame. What does this particular behind the scenes and how it really is, these things and then, once I'm there, I'm so honor mean to you? because, from the outside, the business could happy to see new talent, and I'm re-inspired. This is the highest honor for songwriters. I'm look a certain way. And so I like telling them I have a friend who is a publicist, and he's just so excited and proud. And I will use this what it takes. well into his 80s. He was there giving his busi - title and this membership to really help to It’s astounding that people don't under - ness card out (laughing). That's the whole promote all the good things that we've talked stand that this is a business, like starting a thing. It's like those of us in music are so about. People do stand up and listen if you're vegetable stand. You know, that guy that blessed that we're in something like this that a member of the Songwriters Hall of Fame. starts a vegetable stand, you know what? has emotion and spiritually and humanistic Suddenly, it's different. He's going to have to buy those refrigerators. values attached to it.

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