ITuesday, 24th April, 1979) 5999

go the extra mile. I regard myself as being Iiuigitatinr (foui particularly fortunate in having shared six years Tuesday, the 24th April, 1979 of Cabinet life with Sir David as Premier. When one looks at his achievements as a politician it is easy to see why he will be The PRESIDENT (the Hon. Clive Griffiths) remembered as one of Western Australia's great took the Chair at 4.30 p.m., and read prayers. Premiers. He was elected to the 18th Parliament as the member for Greenough on the 27th - THE LATE SIR DAVID BRAND October, 1945. He resigned almost 30 years later, Condolence: Motion on the 21st August, 1975. He was appointed THE HON. G. C. MacKINNON (South- Honorary Minister for Housing, Forests, and Government, on the 7th October, 1949. On West-Leader of the House) [4.32 p.m.] I seek Local leave of the House to move, without notice, a the 6th April, 1950, he was appointed Minister motion in relation to the death of the Hon. Sir for Works, Water Supplies, and Housing. Seven David Brand. years later, on the 1st March, 1957, he became Leader of the Opposition. On the 2nd April, 1959, Leave granted. he started his record term as Premier for I I THE HON. G. C. MacKINNON (South- years, I I months, and one day. He was also West-Leader of the House) [4.33 p.m.]: I Treasurer and Minister for Tourism. He was the move- Leader of the Opposition from the 3rd March, That this House expresses its deep regret 1971, to the 5th June, 1972. He was created a at the death of the Honourable Sir David KCMG in 1969. Brand, K.C.M.G., a former member of the As you can see, Mr President, Sir David had a Legislative Assembly for the Greenough very imposing record, not only as a Premier but Electorate, and a former Premier of the also as a member of Parliament. State, and places on record its appreciation We extend to Lady Brand and her family our for his long and meritorious public service, utmost sympathy, and trust they will ind some and tenders its profound sympathy to his consolation in the knowledge that their sadness is widow and the members of his family in their shared by all. For me it was a very sad personal bereavement. loss, because I had for Sir David Brand not just The sudden death of the Hon. Sir David Brand, the admiration one shares for a very gifted and KCMG, on Sunday, the 12th April last, can be talented leader but a deep and abiding affection. regarded as a sad personal loss not only to his THE HON. D. K. DANS (South wife and family, his many friends, and his colleagues, but also to the people of Western Metropolitan-Leader of the Opposition) (4.36 Australia in general. I seek the indulgence of the p.mn. ]: It does not give me pleasure to second the House to pay tribute to this great Western motion moved by the Leader of the House, Australian and to express profound sympathy to because it is a sad occasion. I knew the motion his wife and family in their bereavement. was coming forward and in the first instance it was my intention to write something down. Then I Much has already been said on the passing of thought perhaps it would be better just to reflect this man, whose fine personal attributes matched for a few moments on a man who gave a great his distinguished political achievements-a man deal to this State. whose human qualities touched everyone who knew him, a man whose name is assured of a high I first met David Brand before I came near this place in the State's history. On any judgment, Sir Parliament-in fact, before I ever thought I David Brand would have to rate as one of the would be here. As a matter of fact, at the time I greatest sons this State has produced. We regard first met him, I would have thought I would be a his loss as not only premature but also as a sad backslider if I ever came here. However, chat is blow to Western Australia. history. No man really knows what is in front of The fact that Sir David elected to spend 35 him. years of his life in politics allowed him to give full When I met David Brand, before he was scope to those very special gifts with which .he was knighted, one of the things that impressed me was endowed. He was of inestimable benefit to his sincerity and the fact that he was very Western Australia in particular and Australia in forthright. He was a very easy person to speak to. general. To work with him was a delight. He had He could get his point over without resorting to a natural faculty that made those alongside him threats, hysteria, or extreme language. I admired (500 600[COUNCIL] him for that. I also admired him because he was a On behalf of my party I say we regret his man above all else. passing as a marn. We offer our condolences to When I came into Parliament we assumed Lady Brand and her family. Government and he was the Leader of the THE HON. M. MeA LEER (Upper West) Opposition. I renewed my acquaintance with [4.42 p.m.j: As one who represents the Upper him-it was not a great acquaintance but he West Province, which includes the Greenough certainly had not forgotten me-and I used to electorate, as one who is a member of his old enjoy introducing people to him. When he went electorate, and as one who has been associated out of Parliament it was my pleasure on a number with Sir David Brand during all my political life, of occasions to have a talk with him, sometimes in I would particularly like to speak to this motion. my own office at the end of the passage. One In the Greenough electorate most people of my could always learn something from him. I did not generation, and certainly those who are younger, agree with his political philosophy-I would be a would have no personal recollection of a member hypocrite if I said I did-but I admired him as a for Greenough before Sir David Brand. Certainly man and I think his passing is a great loss. very few of us came into contact with a Premier I want to make one observation; that in view of of Western Australia before he became Premier. the fact that politics is a very complicated He made a unique place for himself both as a business today, with the great pressures which are member and as a Premier. brought to bear particularly on leaders, not only Sir David's genuine interest in people and their of the national or Federal Government but also of welfare was striking, and there would not be one the State Governments, 1 firmly believe Dave person who met him who could forget him. He Brand was its victim. was friendly and approachable and had a great He gave gift of, once having met a person, being able to unsparingly of himself almost 24 hours recall that person on the next occasion he met a day for nearly 12 years. In my very small role as him, even though many years later. This was an Leader of the Opposition in the upper House I endearing trait which emphasised his great find it sometimes very very difficult to fulfil concern for people, which transcended mere party com mitments outside this Chamber-something politics. I think the lack of political bitterness in which many people in the community do not our region can be traced largely to his influence. appreciate. I know that Sir David did not spare himself one little bit in fulfilling his role as he saw Sir rDavid Brand belonged to Greenough in a it; and whether he saw it differently from Me is Of very personal way. He used to claim Dongara, no consequence. The fact is that he was required Northampton, and Mullewa as his home towns, to be where he was and the toll was very hard and those towns quarrelled for the honour of upon him. being his birthplace. He was able to claim them as his home towns because he lived in them as a I think people should take note of that, because boy. In fact he was born in Dongara, and lived it is a popular pastime to shoot arrows into those there after his marriage to Lady Brand before who give some service to the community no becoming a member of Parliament, but he matter what side of the coin they represent or established a personal relationship with every whether it be service on councils, committees, district throughout the Greenough electorate. voluntary organisations, or in Parliament. People Indeed, there was not one district which could not should note that there is a price to pay. If I am rightly feel it had a special claim to his attention correct, Sir David was only 66 years of age, which and interest, whether it was Morawa, Coorow, is not all that old these days. Into his 12 years as Eneabba, or Yuna. Premier probably he compressed almost a lifetime He took a special interest throughout his of effort. career-ven during his time as Premier-in the I am, indeed, very sorry to see his passing. I people and their family happenings, in their was very happy to attend the church service, but comings and goings, in business and farming, and it was my great regret that I could not attend the in local government. funeral due to another commitment. It is rnot A great Australian and a great Western every funeral that one wishes to attend;, Australian, Sir David Brand was also a great sometimes one attends as a duty. However, I want representative of Greenough. There is not a single to place on record that I really wanted to attend district which cannot point to roads, bridges, Sir David's funeral and it is my regret that I schools, or a hospital which it does not owe to could not do so. -representations made by David Brand. [Tuesday, 24th April, 1979160 601

The great years of land development made a later. That advice concerned a subject that I now particular impact in the electorate of Greenough. know particularly well: co-operation of one with The difficulties that occurred in farming in the the other. 1960s do not invalidate the worth of the work that I learnt more than merely to appreciate David. was done then, and the land that was opened up I suppose it may be wrong for a man to say that at that time has become a permanent part of the he loved another man, but when one absolutely primary resources of this State. It is easy to forget admires a person more than anybody else he that at the time the Brand coalition Government works with--even though not necessarily agreeing came to power in 1959 land was probably the only with the policies of that person, but knowing full large known resource this State had. well what he was trying to achieve and the clever Sir David Brand's achievements have been way he was going about it and the humane widely acknowledged, but I think the most manner in which he treated everyone-then moving acknowledgment and recognition he perhaps that encompasses my feelings towards Sir received was during his short years in retirement. David. He was invited all over the State. He had a No-one was more upset than I when I found I constant stream of engagements in Perth, and he was unable to attend his funeral. When Mr Lewis was the most sought after guest for every function rang me to tell me when the funeral was I found I throughout the Greenough electorate. had to attend a meeting up north which could not Perhaps it is not strange that, just as he made be cancelled, and I was quite upset. his first policy speech as leader of the Liberal The late Sir David Brand stayed at our farm Party at the beginning of a successful campaign when he was in the area. Everybody is welcome at in 1959 at Dongara, so he also made his last our place, but Sir David had a nice way of public appearance at the Dongara races on Easter dropping in, enjoying his dinner, and perhaps Saturday, when he presented his own cup to the staying a little longer, finishing by staying for the winner. It was, in a sense, his last gift to people night. whom he had supported through good times and He was a great man. He was a man none of us bad times and who in turn supported him and will ever forget. I do not believe I have ever heard gave him wholehearted affection. a word said against Sir David Brand. I certainly The personal appreciation of Sir David Brand never said a word against him. The members of in the Greenough electorate is tremendous. It our party never said a word against him. unites the electorate in a very special way in the Although there were times when we had to sympathy of its people for Lady Brand and her disagree with him most strongly, we always had family. the feeling of being upset at having disagreed with THE HON. H. W. GAYFER (Central) him. Nevertheless, disagreement was the name of [4.47 p.m.]: I join with others in their remarks of the game. respect concerning the late Hon. Sir David Brand. Sir David and Lady Doris Brand were a great I worked with Sir David for 12 years in the team. I think it is the great team of Sir David and Assembly, and I knew the man very well. Lady Brand that we will remember most of all. I recall when I first came to this place, still They were a great couple. Now the team is bearing the battle scars of an election, I wondered broken up. However, Lady Brand will continue in exactly who was friend and who was foe in the her own inimitable style-a style that has House. As one of the Ministers on the front bench endeared her to a lot of people. Like her, we will will recall, I went to my first combined party miss her companion. meeting and raised a certain matter. I did not I believe there will not be anybody who will realise then that when one becomes part of a quite take the place of Sir David Brand. I coalition team one must realise that the first job is remember the way he used to come into this to get the work done, and that a coalition is made House and speak to the messengers outside. In up of compromise and many other things. fact, since he retired, I have seen him sitting in I knew none of that at the time. Indeed, it was the office at the front door, talking to the Sir David Brand who pointed this out to me very messengers. He would walk along and enter the forcibly at the first meeting I attended. I was not offices of members, no matter who they were, and a very turbulent type, but I well remember raising just say, "Good day," to them. an issue and being chopped off in midstream by I think the death of Sir David Brand is a great Sir David who told me that if I liked I could talk pity. He was a great man, a terrific person, and a to him in his office later. It was, indeed, a kindly great statesman. There is no doubt about that. piece of advice that he gave me when I saw him I support the motion. 602 602[COUNCIL]

THE HON. D. W. COOLEV (North-East THE PRESIDENT (The Hon. Clive Griffiths): Metropolitan) [4.53 p~m.]: Of all the members on Iwould like to endorse the remarks of the Leader our side of the House. I think I would probably of the House, the Leader of the Opposition, and have known Sir David Brand as well as anybody other honourable members who have spoken to else. When my daugher-in-law rang me and this motion. advised me of his passing, a great sadness My family and f considered it a very great descended upon me. privilege to have ranked among those who were I was the President of the Trades and Labor closely associated with the latc Sir David Brand. Council for seven years' of Sir David's One of the great milestones in my life was the premiership, and for several years when he was opportunity that I had to serve as one of Sir the Leader of the-Opposition. During that time, David's team during the final six years of his we conversed quite frequently. I did not know Sir record term as the Premier of Western Australia. David in his private life, but in his official life I I am sure that Lady Brand and her family are well knew the type of person he was. well aware of the deep respect that we, as On many occasions I had the privilege of members of this House, had for Sir David. They receiving invitations to functions that were sent to would be aware of the sincerity which we extend me singly, and sometimes with my ,wife, over the on this vote of sympathy. name of Sir David. At many of those functions I Honourable members, I would ask you to carry would possibly have been the only person present this motion and pay tribute to Sir David Brand by who believed in my political philosophy. However, standing in silence. on those occasions Sir 'David never railed to speak Question passed, members standing. to me and my wife, if she was there, and make us feel comfortable. That is one of the matters for LEGISLATIVE REVIEW AND ADVISORY which I remember Sir David. COMMITTEE The second matter for which I remember. Sir Report: Tabling David was when I sat in the Speaker's Gallery during a major industrial dispute. I was in that THE PRESIDENT (the Hon. Clive Griffiths): gallery with an executive member of the Trades I have the following paper to lay on the Table of and Labor Council, who was a well-known the House: the Legislative Review and Advisory communist. Sir David, who was the Leader of the Committee report relating to the by-laws of the Opposition at the time, left his seat, came into the Town of Canning. gallery, greeted us with our Christian names and sat between the two of us. He tried to find out QUESTIONS Cram us, at first hand, what we thought was the Questions were taken at this stage. basis of the problem. The third matter for which I remember Sir JUSTICES ACT AMENDMENT BILL David-and it will always be dear to my Second Reading heart-happened at the opening of the bus station in Wellington Street. 1 had been endorsed by the THE HON. 1. G. MEDCALF Labor Party for the seat T now hold. Sir David (Metropolitan-Attorney General) [5.13 p.m.]: I congratulated me and said, "Well, Don, if the move- seat has to be Labor, I am glad it is you." I That the Bill be now read a second time. thought that was a very nice gesture. That came There are two matters contained in the Bill which from a man who had a natural affinity with is now before the House. The first concerns the people who came from humble beginnings. acceptance of written pleas of guilty which can be The State lost a great asset when Sir David tendered in Courts of Petty Sessions. Brand retired from the position of leader of his Magistrates have, by long-standing custom, party and when he left his seat in Parliament. The accepted pleas of guilty by endorsement of a State is very much worse off for not having Sir summons or by letter as an indication of the David at this time. defendant's intention. There are no statutory Although I have conveyed to Lady Brand in a provisions to sanction this action, and the very small way the deepest sympathy from my amendment proposed in the Bill will give legal wife and myself, I do wish to have it recorded standing to this custom. here that I feel the deepest regret at the passing The ability of a defendant to signify his of Sir David Brand. admission of guilt in writing instead of by [Tuesday, 24th April, 1979] 6030 personal attendance at court in response to a Although Magistrate Syddall made the final summons, is seen primarily as being convenient to decision in accordance with the law, the practice the defendant and, secondly, to any witnessess which he developed no doubt laid the groundwork who might otherwise be called. for what was eventually to follow. Safeguards are, however, provided. Even In 1973, Magistrate Syddall left the Broome although a defendant may have made an endorsed district but, at his own request, was transferred plea of guilty, no sentence of imprisonment may back there at the end of 1976. be imposed on him in such circumstances in his In 1977, with Magistrate Syddall's absence. concurrence, the Government requested him to Further, section 136A of the Justices Act conduct an inquiry on its behalf into aspects of provides machinery for the review of a decision Aboriginal tribal law and as to whether a plan made in the absence of a defendant, so that any could be formulated to improve the understanding person convicted in his absence would not be of the law by Aboriginal communities. unduly disadvantaged. For this purpose, arrangements were made to The second matter is to rectify a minor detach him from his regular magisterial duties, omission which occurred when the Justices Act and an anthropologist from the Community was amended in 1977. The purpose of that Welfare Department (Mr Mikael Capelle) was amendment was to make Family Court judges seconded to assist him. and certain acting judges justices of the peace. It was regarded as important that Magistrate However, in the course of drafting that Syddall's inquiry should be essentially a practical particular amendment, the previous reference in rather than a theoretical exercise and be related the Act to members of the Executive Council was particularly to local communities and Aborigines overlooked. Clause 3 of the Bill will rectify that in the Kimberley area. omission and back date its provisions to the 7th It was thought that any decisions resulting November, 1977. from the inquiry could be extended later to other I commend the Bill to the House. areas of the State if necessary and this principle Debate adjourned, on motion by the Hon. is, in fact, embodied in the Bill now before the Grace Vaughan. House. Essentially, however, the studies were directed to the Aboriginal communities in the Kimuberley area. ABORIGINAL COMMUNITIES DILL As work progressed and discussions were held with the Aboriginal people, the idea began to Second Reading develop that a way could be found to increase THE HON. I. G. MEDCALF both the responsibility for and control over (Metropolitan-Attorney General) [5.15 p.m.]: I Aboriginal people by their own community move- -leaders using the institutions and services which That the Bill be now read a second time. are presently available to all Western Australian In introducing this Bill, it would seem appropriate residents. that I should give members some appreciation and The idea met with more than a passing interest background to how this proposed Act came into and, consequently, meetings were held with existence. various community groups in the Kimberley area A stipendiary magistrate (Mr Terry Syddall) to discuss the subject. had for some time been undertaking a personal From these meetings, two points stood out and private study of Aboriginal tribal law. quite clearly: Firstly, the tribal Aborigines had In 1970, after being posted to Broome, he very little understanding of the law which introduced the practice of inviting tribal elders to affected their lives and, secondly, many of them sit with him in the court room while Aboriginal failed to distinguish between arrest and trial, defendants were being dealt with. The whole idea charge and conviction. of this was to enable the elders to see at first hand They also recognised that abuse of alcohol was how the law operated. a prime cause of many of the social problems In the event of the defendant being convicted of which had developed in their communities in an offence, he would outline to the elders the recent years. various options available to the court by way of It became quite clear to Magistrate Syddall and penalty and then ask them which penalty they Mr Capelle that by and large the communities in considered the most appropriate. the Kimberley favoured having the power to 604 604[COUNCIL] restrict, rather than prohibit, the use of alcohol (2) To provide penalties for a breach of a within their communities. At present, there is no by-law by a fine or a term of power for the communities to enforce either imprisonment, or both, but with a restriction or prohibition. maximum in each case. What is proposed in the Bill now before the (3) To enable a court to order a person to House is that if the community makes a voluntary pay compensation for damage done to the property of the community or any resolution to restrict or prohibit the use of alcohol, person not exceeding $250. then provision can be made in the by-laws to (4) To provide that by-laws made by the enable their wish to be enforced. Whether they council of a community will apply only make that decision or not will be for the within the defined boundaries of that communities individually to decide and not the community. Government. The PRESIDENT: Order! Members will recal I would like to make it quite clear that the that previously I have ruled that it is out of order ordinary law of the land will continue to apply for members to read newspapers in the Chamber. over the community areas; namely, the Criminal I refresh the memory of members on that point. Code and the Police Act and other laws which The Attorney General. govern the conduct of individuals towards one The Hon. 1. G. MEDCALF: Members will also another. note that money received by way of fines will be These laws will, however, be supplemented so paid into a community fund, rather than to the as to cover offences committed within the Crown. The reasoning behind this is that, in these community area such as- fairly isolated area, persons who commit acts the regulation of the bringing-in, sale and harmful to the community should make consumption and distribution of liquor; atonement to the community for their actions. providing a punishment for drunkenness; To successfully implement the proposals in the Bill, it has also been necessary to appoint certain the prohibition of disorderly conduct; members of the community as justices of the the regulation of the use of motor vehicles; peace, bench clerks, and honorary probation and and parole officers. associated matters. In addition, police aides will be stationed at It is also important to note that all persons in the Lombadina and La Grange, Legislation already community area will be affected, not only exists to permit these appointments. Aborigines, but also any other people who reside Over the past few months, those persons there, including visitors and, of course, intruders. selected for appointment as justices of the peace The proposals contained in the Aboriginal have been undergoing a training programme Communities Bill will be introduced on an conducted by Magistrate Syddall, during which experimental basis in the two Aboriginal time the magistrate has continued to preside in way, but the justices have sat with him communites at La Grange Mission and One Arm the normal and gained experience. Point. In a similar manner, the bench clerks have had If the experiment succeeds, as I sincerely hope the opportunity to learn their duties. Honorary it will, then the possibility of extending the probation officers will be appointed and trained to operation of the Bill to other interested assist in the process of ensuring the carrying out communities can be considered. In this of community service orders or probation orders connection, it is pleasing to note that interest has and in the rehabilitation of offenders. already been expressed by other communities in the northern part of our State. Earlier on, I mentioned that Mr Syddall had found that many Kimberley Aboriginal people did In essence, the proposals in the Bill are as not understand court proceedings and saw no follows- distinction between arrest and trial, charge and (1) To permit the council of an incorporated conviction. To assist in their understanding of the community body to make by-laws court routine, Magistrate Syddall has produced a relating to the community lands. There manual explaining the laying of a charge and must, of course, be adequate provision court procedure; that is to say, what happens from for consultation with the members of the the time an accused person is brought into the community. court until the trial is concluded. [Tuesday, 24th April, 1979) 6050

This manual sets out in the form of a story trade and shipping. Appointments were first made what happens in the court and the parts played by by the Pope and later in England by the justices and others, and was produced in a rather Archbishop of Canterbury. unusual way. The latter still makes the appointments in many Mr Syddall wrote the first draft himself, in parts of the world, including some Australian simple English, and this was then translated by States. Appointees were not always legal members of the Fitzroy Crossing Mission into the practitioners, but now they generally are. Walmadjeri language. In Western Australia since 1902 all This translation, which embodied the concepts appointments of public notaries have been made from the point of view of the Aborigines, with by the Full Court of the Supreme Court on the emphasis on matters of significance for them, was recommendation of the Chief Justice. then translated back into simple English. Notaries still have a significant role throughout The manual will be available in either the the world particularly in relation to shipping and Walmadjeri language, which is felt to be the most banking transactions, identification of persons, commonly used language and the one which the and attestation of documents having international majority of Kimberley Aborigines will significance. It is important that their role and understand, or in its simplified English translated functions be understood and their appointments form. adequately controlled. In conclusion, I would like to emphasise that The Bill now before the House sets out more this is an experiment in bringing an clearly the requirements and manner of understanding of the law to the people in these appointment of public notaries and provides for two communities, and it is hoped that it will help the continuation of those who are presently them to help themselves in safeguarding the peace appointed. and harmony they desire in their communities. It had been intended merely to amend the 1902 It depends entirely on voluntary acceptance by Public Notaries Act, but on the advice of the communities. I have personally visited a Parliamentary number of the communities and am satisfied that Counsel it was decided that it it will be well received. would be preferable to repeal that Act and introduce a completely new Bill. I promised the communities that I would place This Bill the legislation before Parliament to help their contains most of the features which genuine efforts to secure order and good conduct were contained in the 1902 Act together with in their community areas. some important amendments to which I shall refer. The experiment has attracted widespread interest in law reform circles throughout All of those persons who are presently Australia, and details of the proposals have been appointed as public notaries can exercise their made available to the Commonwealth Law powers in any part of this State. What is now Reform Commission and the Northern Territory proposed is that there should be two separate Government. categories of public notaries. I sincerely commend the Bill to the House. The first of these would be general public notaries who would be able to exercise their Debate adjourned, on motion by the Hon. Lyla powers in identical fashion with those already in Elliott. existence anywhere in Western Australia. It is proposed that all persons who are currently PUBLIC NOTARIES BILL appointed as public notaries will become general Second Reading public notaries under this new legislation and that any future appointments of practitioners who THE HON. 1. G. MEDCALF practise in the metropolitan area would also be (Metropolitan-Attorney General) (5.25 p.m.]:I general public notaries. move- The second category would be district public That the Bill be now read a second time. notaries who may specify the magisterial district It is possibly not generally known by many people or districts for which they seek appointment and that public notaries play an important part in the then exercise the same powers in such magisterial life of the commercial community and others district -or districts as defined under the whose interests cross international boundary lines. Magisterial Districts Act. This will enable public The history of public notaries goes back to notaries to be appointed more in relation to the earliest times. They had an important role in needs of particular areas of the State. 606 606[COUNCIL)

In the event of a person applying to be In addition to these proposals, there are several appointed as either a general public notary or a other important amendments proposed to cover district public notary, he must satisfy the Chief inquests where a body is, for one reason or Justice of the Supreme Court that he meets the another, unable to be located or recovered, but various requirements referred to in clause 7 of the death is suspected; and also an extension of the Bill. jurisdiction of the Coroner to meet problems that One of these is his competence to act as a arise where the body of a deceased person lies in notary; another is that there is a need for the one State, but the cause of death occurred in appointment. another. So as to assist the Chief Justice in his The power for the Attorney General to order assessment of these and other requirements, it is such an inquest already exists in England in considered desirable that some formal channel of somewhat similar circumstances and was recently advice should be available, and for this purpose it endorsed in a report by the committee on death is proposed to give the Attorney General standing certification and coroners in that country, under the Act. This proposal wilil also require an amendment The Attorney General may report to the Chief to the registration of Births, Deaths and Justice on request or intervene in any proceedings; Marriages Act, and that will be dealt with and may consult any body of notaries established separately. for such purposes. Discussions have taken place The following amendments are proposed to with notaries who are members of the Law overcome administrative difficulties which have Society and it has been arranged that the society become apparent as a result of experience over a will have available a small group or committee of number of years. public notaries for consultation with the Attorney The first one, in clause 7, is to provide that an General should this be required. affidavit sworn outside the State may be sworn Members may also notice that the schedules before any person authorised to take affidavits in which appeared in the 1902 Act concerning the the place where it is sworn. certificates of the registrar and the fees payable Clause 17 deals with an inquest or inquests on appointment have been omitted, but clause 17 involving a number of medical practitioners such of the Bill makes provision for these matters to be as a multiple road fatality accident, to give the covered by rules of court. Coroner the power to summon such practitioners In this way, the rules can prescribed more without obliging him to do so where it is conveniently and with greater flexibility. considered unnecessary. I commend the Bill to the House. Members will no doubt appreciate that in Debate adjourned, on motion by the IHon. D. K. country areas particularly a practice has grown Dans (Leader of the Opposition). up over the years of notifying clerks of courts when a person dies. The clerks of courts do not CORONERS ACT AMENDMENT BILL make the decision as to whether a postmortem examination is necessary, but do draw attention to Second Reading the necessary requirements of the Act. THE HON. I. 0. MEDCALF It is proposed, in clause 19, to give these (Metropolitan-Attorney General)' [5.30 p.m.]:I functions of the clerks legal sanction. move- Clause 19 provides the power to order a That the Bill be now read a second time. postmortem examination will also be extended to The Coroners Act is an important and essential an analysis of any part of the body or the contents part of this State's legislation and it is just as thereof. important that it should operate efficiently and Members will also note that section 40 required effectively. that any direction to a medical practitioner to Apart from some consequential amendments carry out a postmortem examination must be in resulting from the Acts Amendment (Road writing before the termination of the inquest. Traffic) Act in 1974, no amendments have beep In practice, it is far more convenient for this to made to the Coroners Act since 1960. be done by telephone, and, in addition, the need As a result of his considerable experience, the may arise to order an examination after the City Coroner (Mr W. G. Wickens) has made a termination of the inquest because of subsequent number of suggestions which will1 improve the evidence. It is proposed in clause 19 of this Bill to administration of this Act. empower the Coroner at any time to direct, not [Tuesday, 24th April, 1979] 6070 necessarily in writing, that a postmortem The law does not at present provide for an examination be made. The regulations will adequate resolution of these matters and it is felt contain a safeguard in order to prevent false that some amendment is long overdue. It is instructions. therefore proposed that the Coroner shall have There has also been some doubt expressed the power to hold an inquest in certain cases about the application of the Justices Act to where a person is missing or the body cannot be proceedings in a Coroner's Court, and it is now recovered or has been destroyed. In such events. proposed to reenact in the Coroners Act section the Attorney General can direct that the Coroner 77 of the Justices Act. Clause 20 will compel should hold an inquiry into the suspected death. witnesses to answer questions which are It should be emphasised at this point that death considered necessary in the pursuit of justice, but could not be presumed where any doubt exists, also provide for the usual protection of persons but there could be, and are, cases such as in who may otherwise incriminate themselves. mining accidents or drownings where, despite the There are also occasions where the Coroner absence of a body, death is certain. vacates his office for one reason or another when Clause 7 provides that the Coroner, if satisfied, the inquest is only part heard. Circumstances can can certify that death has been established arise where it would be preferable for another beyond reasonable doubt. In the event that death Coroner to continue the inquiry rather than have is not established to the Coroner's satisfaction, the whole matter reheard, as happens at present. then the Coroner would be able to make a finding This very much depends on the particulars of accordingly; that is, that death has not been each case, but clause 21 contains an amendment established. to allow another Coroner to continue and this is It is felt that the need for, firstly, the Attorney felt to be a wise precautionary move to overcome General to he reasonably satisfied that a person any future problems. has died in such circumstances and, secondly, the At present, the Coroner has jurisdiction to Coroner after proper inquiry to be so satisfied will conduct an inquest only where the body of the provide adequate safeguards for cases of "faked" deceased is lying within the State. It is proposed, deaths or amnesia. in clause 4, to increase his jurisdiction to cases There is a further amendment to which I where a person has died outside the State if that should draw attention. It is considered person was a State resident, or if death or the appropriate that, where a person dies from an cause of death occurred within the State. injury received in the course of his employment or The matter of extended jurisdiction has been by reason of an industrial disease, then a discussed at recent meetings of the Standing representative of that person's trade union should Committee of Attorneys General, and agreement be permitted to appear in the Coroner's Court has been reached for all States to have similar with the approval of a member of the deceased's provisions included in their Acts where this is family. The members of the family who may needed. In the case of the territories, this already make such a request are referred to in the Bill and exists. provision has also been made to cover the situation where there is no family or they cannot It could happen that a person who has lived all be contacted. his life in one State, goes to another State for some special treatment and subsequently dies. Finally, the existing definition of "building" which defines the place of employment has been As the law stands at present, the Coroner in the changed to bring it into line with the "place" of State of origin cannot hold an inquest although it employment in the new Machinery Safety Act. may be considered desirable to do so in certain circumstances. I commend the Bill to the House. Most of the other amendments in this Bill deal Debate adjourned, on motion by the Hon. with the suspected death of a person where, Grace Vaughan. although the body has not been recovered, death is reasonably certain. REGISTRATION OF BIRTHS, DEATHS It should be pointed out that as the law now AND MARRIAGES ACT AMENDMENT BILL stands an inquest can be held only where there is Second Reading a body. This often works great hardship on relatives and others as a death certificate cannot THE HON. I. G. MEDCALF be obtained thereby impeding the winding-up of (Metropolitan-Attorney General) [5.37 p.m.]: I estates hnd the settlement of personal affairs; move- including sometimes problems of remarriage. That the Bill be now read a second time. 608 608[COUNCIL)

As mentioned during the second reading speech The Bill now before the House has four basic on the amendment to the Coroners Act, this Bill purposes- is complementary to the proposal to permit the Firstly, to allow the land and buildings at Coroner to make a finding that, in cases of Swanleigh to be used for the purpose of a suspected death where a person is missing or the hostel for the accommodation of students body cannot be found or is irrecoverable, the attending Government educational death has been established beyond reasonable institutions. doubt. Secondly, to use the balance of the land as The amendments proposed to the Registration described in the second part of the schedule of Births, Deaths and Marriages Act will enable to the Bill, or the proceeds from any sales, the Registrar General to register the death in the for general ecclesiastical purposes. records of his office. Thirdly, to place the endowment moneys, I commend the Bill to the House. currently held in trust for orphans, in trust Debate adjourned, on motion by the Hon. for general child and family care purposes. Grace Vaughan. Fourthly, to make provision for the proceeds of the sale of land and buildings at Swanleigh as described in the first part of the schedule. If they are sold at some future ANGLICAN CHURCH OF AUSTRALIA time, the proceeds will be placed in trust for (SWANLEIGH LAND AND ENDOWMENTS) general child and family care purposes. BILL Under the provisions of clause 3 (1) (e), general Second Reading child and family care purposes will include the THE HON. I. G. MEDCALF care, maintenance, education and benefit of (Met ropol itan-Attorney General) (5.39 p.m.]: I orphaned, neglected, and deprived children, and move- the counselling, help and care of families in difficulties. That the Bill be now read a second time. It would be remiss of me if I did not express at This Bill is for a private Act of Parliament which this stage the appreciation of both this and has been requested by the Diocese of Perth in previous Governments for the work the diocese connection with certain lands and buildings which has carried out in caring for orphans over such a are known as Swanleigh. long period of time. Most members will be familiar with the work of Whilst there is no need for such an institution the diocese over many years in caring for orphans today, it would seem to be most appropriate that and giving them a firm basis on which to build the lands and money marked for purposes their future lives. associated with orphans should now be applied for Since the end of World War [1I,the number of the purposes indicated. orphans admitted to Swanleigh has declined and These purposes are not very far away from the they have been cared for in other ways, such as by original intentions of the trusts. placement in foster homes, or by adoption. I commend the Bill to the House. The diocese has recognised that an orphanage, Debate adjourned, on motion by the Hon. Lyla as such, is no longer required and considers that it Elliott. is, in fact, no longer desirable to house orphans in this type of institution. The last orphans left the home in 1976 and the buildings at Swankeigh are now being used as a hostel to accommodate students attending ADDRESS-EN-REPLY: SIXTH DAY Government educational institutions. motion The land on which the hostel stands is subject Debate resumed, from the I11th April, on the to a trust that it be used for the purpose or following motion by the Hon. N. F. Moore- purposes associated with an orphanage. That the following address be presented to In addition, the diocese is holding funds His Excellency- accumulated over the years which have come May it please Your Excellency: We from several sources, but which are all to be used the Members of the Legislative Council only for purposes associated with orphans. of the Parliament of Western Australia [Tuesday, 24th April, 1979]60 609

in Parliament assembled, beg to express which Western Australians expect, and the rules our loyalty to our Most Gracious and laws of our State are clearly and properly Sovereign and to thank Your Excellency administered. for the Speech you have been pleased to Therefore, I take exception to Federal shadow deliver to Parliament. Ministers, particularly Mr Paul Keating, casting THE HON. 0. N. B. OLIVER (West) [5.42 doubt over the potential of these projects and p.m.]: I rise to support the motion so ably moved saying what will happen "if" the people on the by the member for the Lower North Province, the Opposition benches in Canberra were ever Hon. Norman Moore. returned to Government. The Leader of the I have noticed that some previous speakers have Opposition spoke about a terrible decline in the expressed scepticism about the comments of His workforce and quoted from a Liberal policy Excellency in regard to the new wave of document about how many jobs-were going to be development that is coming to Western Australia. created. By interjection I asked what he was The Leader of the Opposition was one of the main quoting from and he replied, "The figures are sceptics, but I believe confidently that the present back at the office, but they were produced by the period could be likened to that in the United Australian Bureau of Statistics." States when the great saying was, "Go West, I have searched at great length to try to young man." establish on what basis the Leader of the Frankly, I am envious of the members Opposition arrived at those figures. I have since representing the North Province, the Hon. John discovered that he made the unfortunate error of Tozer and the Hon. Bill Withers. Members quoting from the monthly summary produced by the Australian Bureau of Statistics relating to the opposite will note that we confidently expect an civilian labour force. The summary takes into announcement will be made by November that the North-West Shelf gas project will go ahead, account people who are self-employed, and we can visualise the income and development subcontractors, principals, and partners. The Leader that will flow from that project. It will mean of the Opposition quoted the figures for January. Unfortunately, however, it was the first income not only from gas but also from oil time this information had been gathered for the development; and the construction of pipelines month of January and seasonal factors operating will bring associated opportunities for right across Australia influenced the figures. employment, This project will mean a great deal to the people who are unemployed at the present I wondered how the Leader of the Opposition time, and especially to the unemployed youth. could arrive at that figure, so 1 went back to the bureau and found that he was referring to figures A great challenge is facing Western Australia relating to a very unusual month and, in fact, that in regard to development in the north-west. As the figures were collated only because the month well as the North-West Shelf project, there will was so unusual. I suggest to the Leader of the be development in other minerals such as Opposition that it is very unwise to quote such diamonds and copper. As we move south, there igures in isolation. will be increased bauxite mining and, as I have just been reminded by Mr Moore, the Veelirrie I well remember Mr Clohessy, who was project will go ahead; furthermore a joint venture Secretary of the Building Workers Industrial fisheries development is planned, and there will be Union before he was removed for some unknown increased opportunities in the field of tourism. reason. I have spoken previously on the The Hon. F. E. McKenzie: He was not subject of tourism, and said that prior to the removed. How do you know he was removed? Liberal-Country Party coalition coming into The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: He is a very power in 1959, and the great wave of development unhappy man. Mr Ray Clohessy used to talk to which occurred in the 1960s, if one were to me on certain issues. arrange with Thomas Cook and Company or The Hon. Grace Vaughan: What nonsense! He American Express to visit Australia, I am would not talk to you. absolutely certain Western Australia would not The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: I do not know have been included in the itinerary unless one whether the Hon. Grace Vaughan has employed a specifically made such a request. In those days, a private detective to follow me around for her to visit to Australia did not necessarily include a make such a statement. I can assure the visit to Western Australia. honourable member that at least tince in every Quite the reverse is the situation now. The four or five weeks I would spend a little time Government is giving tremendous leadership, talking with Ray Clohessy. Quite often we would (20) 610 610[COUNCIL] meet socially. I have quite a deal of respect for America will have exhausted its own supplies of Mr Clohessy and I believe that feeling is mutual. bauxite. By 1981, we are told, the United States The Hon. Grace Vaughan: That is really will be dependent on other countries for its scandalous. alumina requirements. This State will -benefit The IHIn. D. K. Dens: I reckon he is a nice from this Government's decision not to delay the bloke, don't you, Mr Oliver? project but to move ahead, and the people will thank this Government for the responsibility it The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: The Leader of has shown. the Opposition referred to the record of this Government, and I felt it appropriate I should The Hon. D. K. Dens: Yet a $500 million examine the facts and figures, and put the record refinery will be built in New South Wales. straight. The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: The Leader of The Hon. D. K. Dans: I hope you are not the Opposition should not misquote figures in this suggesting I told lies. House again. The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: I am very glad The Hon. R. F. Claughton: Just a moment: Are Mr Dans is in the Chamber. I should like to quote you calling Mr Dens a liar? from Catalogue No. 6213.0 produced by the The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: I am claiming Australian Bureau of Statistics, Canberra. Mr Dens misquoted the figures. The Hon. D. K. Dans: Did you get that from The Hon. D. K. Dans: Not one of the figures the State statistician? was misquoted. The PRESIDENT: Order! The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: If I am touching The Hon. D. K. Dens: He made me tell him, a tender nerve, I offer my apologies. Mr President. The Hon. R. F. Claughton: You should not tell The PRESIDENT: Order! lies about other members. The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: Page 4 refers to The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: I refer now to the civilian employees and defence forces. During the construction industry. Over the past two or three three-year period to which Mr Dans referred, months we have seen a rise not in the number of Western Australia's civilian work force increased approvals-because they are not important during by 5.698 per cent, while not one other State in a low level of activity in the building Australia could manage an increase in its work industry-but in the commencement rate for new force of even 1 per cent. In fact, the Australian dwellings. average was only .091 per cent. Even then, the The Hon. D. K. Dams: That will be fixed up figures relating to Western Australia are very shortly by the rise in interest rates. depressed, because beside them appears the The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: It appears that it notation "h". We are informed at the foot of the may not; I could not speculate on what will page that the figures were affected by an happen to interest rates. industrial dispute, Members of the Press in this case the strike in our have been speculating for some time but their power industry, which effectively reduced our speculations generally are proved to civilian work force by 1800 personnel. I have not be about 50 per cent wrong. adjusted those figures, but I would say they would be closer to a 6 per cent increase in our work I am concerned that the number of loans force. approved for the purchase of established homes The Hon. Grace Vaughan: By what percentage for 1978 was 825, almost treble that far 1977. So, did unemployment rise during the same period? the activity' in the established home market has trebled in 12 months. However, finance -approvals The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: When this for the construction of new dwellings increased by Government decided to go ahead with bauxite only 12, from 265 to 277 dwellings. mining, the Opposition opposed it. I am concerned for the tradesmen, who have The Hon. Grace Vaughan: We still do, completed apprenticeships and technical training The Hon. 0., N. B. OLIVER: We were and who look for stability in their employment. I criticised for a project which will provide hope this imbalance between the number of employment opportunities for the youth of this approvals for established homes and the number State. The Wagerup refinery is going ahead and, for new dwellings does not continue next month. during the time it takes for the project to come on As it is, the number oif approvals for the purchase stream, a journal issued by the Department of of established homes,in 1978 was a record; I just Trade informs us that the United States of hope this trend is not repeated next month. [Tuesday, 24th April, 1979]61 611

Another matter which concerns me is the Victoria, so what happens in Western Australia is growth of bureaucracy. We often talk about the a source of concern to me. dead hand of socialism, but I am starting to worry The Hon. Grace Vaughan: It all seems to be about the dead band of Government. As members happening in the east and not in the west. probably are aware, Canberra is a city of some 216 000 people, which boasts the highest average The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: The need to fill family income in the nation of $s 000o~ per annum in all of these statistics has got out of hand and the greatest number of cars per family. completely. There does not seem to be any co- However, late last yea r, public servants ordination whatsoever between the various bodies. threatened strike action because some of them In 1974 I was co-opted into a committee of were required to travel a mere 15 kilometres over Cabinet to deal with the shortages of materials the border into the neighbouring New South and labour in Western Australia. It was an era in Wales town of Queanbeyan. which the State was expanding; the previous The I-on. D. K. Dans: Would you say that was Labor Government had been defeated, and the the growth of proletarian power? Liberal-Country Party Government had to tackle The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: No, it is the the problem of sh6rtages. growth of bureaucracy. I wish to refer now to a survey of 145 Sitting suspended from 6. 01 to 7.30 p. m. companies carried out by the public relations firm Eric White Associates, which is a very respectable source. In an article contained in The Bulletin of the 9th January, the following statement The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: Prior to the tea appears- break I was referring to a committee formed to inquire into shortages in the area of labour and In a survey of 145 companies the PR firm Eric White Associates found management materials when the Brand Government came to time in dealing with State and Federal office. When serving on the committee there was regulatory bodies had doubled between 1971 a requirement to gain information on the State's and 1977 and staff time had trebled. Costs of exports and imports. The committee was under monitoring and replying to regulatory the control of the Department of Industrial agencies had increased by three or more Development. At one of the committee's meetings times. I asked what items were in short supply due to exports, and requested that at the next meeting One questionnaire was "so out of touch with reality that no one could have answered the in formation be made available. I expected a it" complained a company. This does not responsible well-paid officer of that department only apply to business. Canberra bureaucrats would have had that information available, but demanded that farmers tell them how many this was not so. At the next meeting we were told miles their tractors had done. The answers the information was confidential. I walked out-of indicated nothing. What is relevant about the Superannuation Building and went across to tractors is the hours they have done. the Bureau of Statistics where I was able to get hold of a complete computer print-out which gave The Hon. H. W. Gayfer: That would be information about every stick of timber available elementary to everybody but an academic. within the State. It gave details of who was The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: Mr Gayfer is so exporting timber, and so on. right. It is unbelievable to contemplate the frustrations, the lack of co-ordination, and the If a public servant does not have the ability to number of various State and Federal authorities get that information and hand it to such a with which private enterprise now must deal in committee, I am surprised. This is difficult to what often is one of the smallest areas of a comprehend when the State statistician is also the project. Commonwealth statistician. A friend of mine in Victoria, who is involved in I note that the Government is pursuing the the packaging and marketing of milk, decided to objective of qualifying and updating town undertake the construction of a temporary planning and metropolitan region town planning. freezing plant of 20 000 cubic feet capacity for a I commend the Government for this. I would like period of approximately eight months. To gain to quote from a Press statement by Mrs Craig, approval for that required an approach to I I appealing for a complete re-appraisal of the "user regulatory bodies, which makes me wonder that pays" philosophy dated the 1st March, as such things are happening in Canberra and follows- 612 612[COUNCIL)

The issue to be resolved is whether the The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: The conclusions standards imposed by Government, loca in the report of the Committee of Inquiry into government and semni-Government bodies Housing Costs, volume I stated that it was were the standards the public expected, or anxious to see a reduction in Government whether they were standards imposed for the involvement and interference in the development convenience of government. of land. I will not mention all the Mrs Craig went on to say that her recommendations, but recommendations one to department and the Government as a whole six all concern administration involvement by would make a thorough study of the situation Commonwealth, State and local bodies in the to see what could be done to ease the burden development of land. If this is not back-to-front without abandoning standards which were thinking in attempting to combat rising land clearly expected by the general public. costs, then other members will have to tell me If the Government can bring some sanity to this how they will work. sort of planning, it will have to be congratulated. Another area of inefficiency is in our railway When dealing with such matters one has to satisfy system. I will leave the honourable Mr McKenzie the requirements of various town planners. One to his railways this evening when he makes his has to deal with the Metropolitan Water Board or speech. the country water supply authority as to whether The Hon. F. E. McKenzie: I have already or not a certain plan meets their requirements. spoken. One may then have to deal with the Metropolitan The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: Region Planning Authority. There is no way Mr McKenzie will not talk about railways again. Just recently a town planning board publication However, I would like to relate experiences I had arrived on my desk with information on how one when travelling by train. It is truly amazing. should go about this sort of thing and how people could be advised and the manner in which they The Hon. D. K. Dans: Very shortly you will be could pursue planning development. It had going to England by windjammer. recommendations listed one to six, in a The Hon. R. T. Leeson interjected. publication titled, "A Mansion or No House" The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: Obviously when subsidised by the Urban Development Institute of Mr Leeson used the Prospectortrain service there Australia. Having looked at it there seemed to me was a different clientele. I will come now to to be no relationship between the another form of bureaucracy which is absolutely recommendations one to six. Six comes before stifling this country. A particular constituent of one, four follows three, five should be the first, mine is in the business of furniture removals. and three could be last. It is so complicated and Naturally there can be possibilities of loss and complex that the various officers in the town damage in the transport of furniture. Members planning area have either gone on long service can imagine if a contractor is given the task of leave or have retired before any project could carting certain goods either from one State to reach fruition. another or intrastate that the owner of the goods The other interesting fact relates to the would be at the delivery point to make inspection. committee inquiring into housing costs. The way If Mr Dans wished to move his goods he would we are going it seems we have Government by be interested to see that the goods arrived without question mark. We have government by inquiries being and this started during the period that the damaged. This does not apply with public Whitlam Government was in office when it servants. The owner has no obligation to inspect instituted so many inquiries. the goods. The contractor has no right to be there when the goods arrive. IHe cannot get a release for The Hon. D. K. Dans: You should have got rid. 48 hours and during this period he is unaware of of those bad habits. whether or not he has a claim for damages. It The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: I -tried to could be that after the 48 hours a person could ascertain how many inquiries there have been, but find a scratch on a certain item which was not the task was impossible. However, there have obvious prior to that time. One might think the been 28 inquiries commissioned over the last 12 agent would be brought into this; however, in no years----either by Labor or Liberal-National way is his interest protected. He is not allowed to Country Party Governments-into the Western inspect the goods. There is no way the assessr is Australian housing industry. able to inspect the goods of a person for whom the The Hon. D. K. Dans: it would be good to have insurance premium has been paid. This is the way parliamentary inquiries. the bureaucracy handles this matter. [Tuesday, 24th April, 1979J]1 613

The functions of the tribunal are akin to industry or commerce and make a living, judicial functions and the outcome of its decisions they would be kicked to pieces. clearly affects the rights of the contractor. One There is here, a lack of sophistication and would expect that the onus would lie with the an elitism, a Brahminism, which needs to be Commonwealth or the State to prove negligence well and truly broken up. on the part of the contractor; however, that is not the case. The contractor is not advised of the date That statement was made in Canberra by the late and place of the hearing. Rex Connor in 1972. The Hon. D. K. Dans: That is, if a I will give an example in the area of Commonwealth civil servant gets his furniture immigration, and it concerns a constituent in my shifted? Province. I wrote a letter to the Minister for The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: That is right. Immigration and Ethnic Affairs on the 24th This person is not given any correspondence January, of this year. I will quote only the relating to the claim. He is not permitted to make relevant contents of the letter. It has to do with a any verbal submissions to the tribunal and there is group of children from Rhodesia who wished to no right of appeal following the tribunal's obtain visitors' visas to Western Australia. The decision. This is so whether or not the decision is children of one family had already been here unanimous. The decision of the tribunal could not previously, and the father of the other family had be regarded as impartial as the tribunal is formed also been here. My letter reads-- from within the department; in this case, the However, due to a degree of urgency in Department of Administrative Services. relation to a current request for visitors' I would like to state the rules of natural justice visas, I am writing to you direct for advice set forth in HaIsbury, Laws of England, 3rd rather than arranging for applications to be edition, volume 30, at page 718, which provides directed in the normal manner through that all persons exercising judicial or quasi Departmental Officers in Pretoria. judicial functions must have due regard to the In this regard, I would appreciate your dictates of natural justice. These require that the consideration to the granting of visitor's visas parties to the preceding shall be- for a period of approximately six to twelve Duly notified when and where they may be months for two (2) families of children, heard. travelling of British passports, from Shall then be given the full opportunity to Salisbury, Rhodesia, for which relevant state their views. information is attached. The matters in dispute being decided Obviously, in view of the disturbed honestly, impartially and without- bias, by a situation in Rhodesia at the present time, it tribunal, no member of which has any would be desirable if the children could be interest either pecuniary or otherwise in the removed temporarily to Australia. matter. Their grandparents, together with an aunt The structure and the operation of this and uncle, both resident in Kalamtinda, Government tribunal satisfies none of the Perth, Western Australia, are prepared to principles of natural justice. It shows that the accept full responsibility during their stay basic fundamentals of justice are thrown out the here until the current situation in Rhodesia window, because bureaucrats are out of touch has stabilised and they can rejoin their with reality. parents. Whenever there is criticism of the bureaucracy Departmental records will substantiate in the Federal sphere, Ministers draw on an that the . . . family visited Perth in December unlimited stock of well-trodden phrases to praise 1975 and . .. in February 1978. the high standards, diligence, and excellence of ..is a qualified electrical engineer departmental officers. Many of the people's employed as Assistant Chief Engineer of the representatives are subservient to the bureaucratic Municipality of Salisbury, and his brother- interests. in-law ... the Deputy Chief Health I will qoute from The Bulletin of the 9th Inspector, also with that authority. January, 1979, as follows- In view of their employment, and the long We have had father, son and grandson, service conditions applicable to their and in administrative terms, the people here engagements, it is their intention to remain are mentally inbred. If they had to go into in Rhodesia irrespective of the administration 614 614[COUNCIL]

elected to government following the This survey contains something like 360 forthcoming April elections. questions which are directed -to various subjects The eldest child, . . . (aged 19 years) will and deal with most extraneous matters. What most likely remain in Rhodesia; however, they have to do with a graduate surveyor is of should he wish to visit Australia, he little consequence. understandably would not seek work, but The final matter I wish to discuss was also undertake additional tertiary education at no referred to in the Governor's Speech, and it deals cost to the Australian taxpayer. with industrial relations. I understand members In conclusion, whilst appreciating that are aware that currently a full study is to be made visitors' permits are processed promptly, the of the current Industrial Arbitration Act in circumstances surrounding this application Western Australia. Also, there has been a review may require a policy decision, and in this of workers' compensation by Mr Justice Dunn. I regard, therefore, I look forward to your do not know whether or not members are aware early and favourable consideration. that Western Australia-before Federation-was as the first State to enact industrial arbitration On the 5th February, I received a reply legislation. follows- The main aim of that legislation was to enable associations of employers to get together In the absence of my colleague, the Hon. in order to advance working conditions. I think it M. J. R. MacKellar, I am writing to thank was in 1898. you for your personal representations of 24 Over a period of some 80 years the legislation January, 1979 on behalf of . . . .. and has been amended. In fact, when some concerning their children visiting Australia. amendments came off the press they were already I have arranged for enquiries to be made out of date. However, within our industrial in regard to the matter raised and association of employees today exist people who * immediately these have been concluded the are completely out of step with the rank and file Minister will write to you. of the trade union movement. I will speak to this Since then I have made a series of telephone calls matter later when legislation comes forward. but I received no satisfaction. The Hon. D. W. Cooley: What review are you It seems to me that one type of letter from referring to? departments states that the matter is under The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: I presume that if consideration, and it probably means that the Aile Mr Cooley had read the papers he would have is lost and the department is unable to make any known that a review was mentioned in the decision. Next, one is advised-in a form of Governor's Speech to update the industrial roneoed letter-that a decision will be made arbitration legislation. I imagine that Mr Cooley, within a certain period. I presume that means the with his experience, will make a great file has then been found. contribution to it. I have previously spoken about technical The Hon. D. W. Cooley: We do not know what training, and this matter was, also mentioned in it is about yet. the Governor's Speech. I have commended the Government previously The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: I do not know on the basis of the what its contents are but I presume it will deal additional $9 million which is to be spent. with the Industrial Arbitration Act. Recently, a job analysis survey by the Education Department Technical Education Division on The Hon. D. W. Cooley: Perhaps it will set up surveying and cartography was brought to my an industrial relations bureau similar to that in attention. I have already stated that what is being the Federal sphere. taught must have relevance to the particular The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: As I was saying, subject. What I have read in this document is within the association of employers there is a unbelievable. It has no relevance to our certain section of the hierarchy which is out of educational system in Western Australia; it is touch with the rank and file of the unions. On really relevant to what may ultimately be taught. many occasions I have referred to the McNairn I have previously stated on many occasions that Anderson reports. I do not intend to elaborate on certain subjects are taught according to particular those tonight, but I will draw on a document syllabuses. Then, after a period of four or five which was produced in 1917 by the Department years one goes back to the past student to rind out of Economics of the University of Western the relevance of the application and the Australia. The document refers to "Partners at implementation of the programme to his Work", and is a survey of building workers, their employment. union, and their employers. [Tuesday, 24th April. 1979] 6151

The Hon. D. K. Dans: Ray Clohessy's union. officials would go ahead and'do what they liked, The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: He held an whether or not the person concerned went along. executive position on the union at one time. A total of 16 per cent suggested that officials The ACTING PRESIDENT (the Hon. R. J. always domina ted meetings, and no-one listened L. Williams): Order! to individual points of view; 12 per cent suggested that union officials had become too distant from The Hon. F. E. McKenzie: What is the date of rank and file, and that there was no way of the document? communicating with them; and 12 per cent The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: I have already suggested that they were so satisifled with the quoted the date. work of the union there was really no need for The Hon. D. W. Cooley: You did not quote the them to attend. A total of 9 per cent suggested date. they did not like attending meetings at any time; The ACTING PRESIDENT (the Hon. R. J. 9 per cent suggested they would rather watch L. Williams): Order! The Hon. Neil Oliver his television; and 5 per cent suggested it was too far quoted the date. to go to a meeting. The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: I said it was I am saying quite frankly that the hierarchy is dated 1977. It is interesting to look at the out of touch with the functions of the unions and document under the heading, "Union their members. Membership and Involvement in Union - The Hon. D. K. Dans: Have you any statistics Activities". The reasons which some people give to show how much the shareholders have to do for belonging to unions are unbelievable. The with that? survey showed that 36 per cent belonged to unions because they thought unionism was compulsory; The ACTING PRESIDENT (the Hon. R. J. L. Williams): Order! The Hon. Neil Oliver. 22 per cent belonged because others did and it was expected of one; and 7 per cent had a -firm The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: The executive is belief in unionism. completely out of touch with the rank and file of The Hon. D. W. Cooley: That is 121 per cent the trade union movement. I commend this already. document to Opposition members, and I also commend to them the publication, "Management The Hon. 0, N. B. OLIVER: I did correct my and Workers at the Crossroads". first figure from 85 per cent to 36 per cent. To continue the results of the survey, 3 per cent I want to make it quite clear where I stand with belonged because of the protection workers gel regard to associations of employers and from the union; another '3 per cent belonged employees. I am of the opinion that if we have because of funeral benefits, etc.; and I per cent associations of employers we should have belonged for political reasons. associations of employees. Why should there be The B-on. D. W. Cooley: That does not sound any discrimination between the two? I also like a very authoritative document to mec. believe that at the point of hire, all things being equal, the preference should go to the member of The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: It was compiled the union. That is my stand and I want to make it with the co-operation of the Building Workers quite clear to the Opposition. Industrial Union. The Hon. F. E. McKenzie: The I-on. D. K. Dans: I hope they correct that You are a much position. better fellow than I thought you were. The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: At page 88 of the The Hon'? 0. N. B. OLIVER: Now here comes document another table deals with "Reasons the "but". I would like to see these surveys suggested to subjects likely to prevent them from coming up which show that the executives of attending union meetings". The table shows that unions are not out of touch with reality and with 20 per cent considered that union meetings were their rank and file members. Until that situation boring. is reversed, how can we deal with people who are The Hon. D. W. Cooley: You come to this totally irresponsible? They stick their noses into place, and it is boring. every matter, other than employees' working conditions. The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: It is obvious I have not touched Mr Cooley's sensitive nerve Several members interjected. otherwise he would bring this place to life. The ACTING PRESIDENT (the Hon. R. J. Returning to the table, 17 per cent gave a reason L. Williams): Order! Members are making it very for not attending meetings as being that union difficult for the H-ansardreporter. 616 616COUNCIL]

The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: Reference has Ministers might do a lot of good if they stood been made to shareholders' meetings. I have not on their "dig" occasionally, and I am sure the been present at BHP meetings but I know that lower echelons of the Public Service would make company has some very unhappy shareholders, a name for themselves if they stood on their "dig"1 because the return on their money is about half and dealt with suggestions put to them in the way the bond rate, and they give their directors and they should be dealt with. However, I think the the chairman a very difficult time. majority of public servants are first-class people. The Hon. D. K. Dans: And then that guy rolls I find I would like to support all that the up with all the proxy votes. previous speaker said about Rhodesia and South The Hon. 0. N. B. OLIVER: The Hon. Don Africa, and I would take it a little further. Let us Cooley has had a tremendous amount of cease to be wishy-washy. On the question of experience of unions and the industrial arbitration South Africa and Rhodesia, our present Federal system, and if there were more people of his Government is nearly as bad as the Whitlam calibre I believe there would be no disputes. I look Government. forward to the contribution he will make should The Hon. D. W. Cooley: this legislation come forward in the future. Don't tell mec you support South Africa? People who are not of the calibre of Mr Cooley and who are not responsible towards the members The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Of course I do, of their unions should not have a double-headed because, but for a little bit of luck, there go Mr penny; that is, if they want to be registered and Cooley and 1. Our forebears came to Australia; become part of the industrial arbitration and other people went to South Africa. South conciliation system, they should abide by the law Africans are of the same stock. They are the same as everybody else does. If that comes to pass, I types of people as we are, and they are as honest believe we will see responsibility in unionism; we and loyal to the Crown as we are. They have the will see responsible union executives, and we need same problems as we have. For instance, when the not worry about whether or not unionism is empire was at war, Rhodesia- compulsory. The union movement will gather Several members interjected. members behind it. The ACTING PRESIDENT (the Hon. R. J. On that basis I support the motion. L. Williams): Order! I remind members that THlE HON. A. A. LEWIS (Lower Central) interjections make reporting very difficult. I am [8.04 p.m.J: First of all, I would like to prepared to tolerate them so far and no further. congratulate the Hon. Norman Moore on the The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I will say I support speech he made in moving the Address-in-Reply. apartheid. I think it was the best Address-in-Reply speech I have ever heard in this place. I do not mean any The Hon. D. K. Dans: You know what insult to other members who have moved the happened to the Federal Minister who said that. Address-in-Reply but his was a very good speech He was a Minister for only a day. which was well put together and very thought- The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: It was very interesting provoking-something this House needs. to hear the comments from the other side of the I was a little horrified at what the previous House. I wonder how many of those members speaker said about the bureaucracy and public have been to South Africa. I wonder how many of servants. I have found the standard of public those who are crying "Shame" have even seen the servants to be extremely high and I believe their situation there. Their silence brands them. attitude is one of giving good service. Perhaps the The Hon. D. K. Dans: I do not support separate Public Service needs to be looked at, and perhaps development and I do not support South Africa. it needs some redeployment. That is one matter in which I am on side with The Hon. ft. T. Leeson: Another inquiry? Malcolm Fraser, the United Nations, and the The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I would certainly not United States. have another inquiry. Perhaps there is trouble The Hon. W. ft. Withers: This country has the with certain unions, and the task must be defined. greatest apartheid in the world. But I believe the average public servant is an The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: We in this country honest employee of the Government and does a support the greatest apartheid in the world- very good job, particularly those in the higher echelons of the Public Service and some of the The Hon. W. R. Withers: You are dead right. authorities. I dissociate myself from the previous The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: --started by the speaker's remarks about the bureaucracy. Whitlamn Government. [Tuesday, 24th April, 1979) 6171

The Hon. D. K. Dans: Your own Premier The Hon. D. K. Dam: How long has he been would not even attend a meeting with the Prime here? Minister on land rights for Aborigines. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: He has applied for The ACTING PRESIDENT: Order! 1 will not permission to stay here and has been refused it. remind members again about rowdy interjections. The Hon. D. K. Dans: In Derby or Darwin he The Hon. A. A. Lewis. has no problems. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Thank you, Mr The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I could not think Mr Acting President. As I was saying, the people of Dens is dinkum. The point of my argument is that South Africa and Rhodesia are of the same stock if one comes in a collapsed old boat, cannot speak as Australians. the language, struggles off, has to be fumigated as The Hon. D. K. Dans: We bad a war with the one comes ashore, and has customs and Afrikaaners. What is wrong with you? immigration officers looking one up and down, The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Let me remind one is accepted with open arms, even when one members opposite that Rhodesia had a higher does not have enough money to keep going. But a percentage of troops supporting the old British person who sails out here- Empire than any other country in the British The Hon. R. F. Claughton: I cannot understand Empire. So we, like dogs with our tails between why he wants to leave this marvellous country of our legs, turn against the people who fought a South Africa. common enemy. Members opposite show The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: While Whitlamn was themselves in their true colours when they wipe in office I was thinking very seriously of off Rhodesia and South Africa and talk about migrating to South Africa. apartheid. They have never been there and do not The Hon. D. K. Bans: I wish you had gone and understand the situation. stayed there! The Hon. D. IK. Dans: I did not hear the The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: It is a magnificent Governor speak about the problems of South country with magnificent people. I want to deal Africa and Rhodesia. He spoke about the with Mr Dans' point about the war at the turn of problems in this State. the century. I had a relation who fought in it. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I will link up what I The Hon. D. K. Bans: I was not in that war, I am saying with the problems in this State. As Mr must admit. Withers said, this country has the greatest The Hon. D. W. Cooley: How long have you apartheid in the world. been in South Africa? The Hon. F. E. McKenzie: What are you doing The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I have been there about it? Give us a solution. three times. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Let me say that one The Hon. D. W. Cooley: For what periods of day-some of us are a little too old-we will time? realise how silly the Australian nation and successive Prime Ministers have been in rejecting The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Six or seven weeks. South Africa and Rhodesia. The Hon. R. F. Claughton: Now you are an The Hon. D. W. Cooley: Every white country expert. in the world rejects them, too. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: It gives me as much The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: That is absolutely insight into South Africa as Mr Cooley has into hypocritical. I will give an example. A gentleman DHP. He has never worked for that company. Do in South Africa built a boat, put his family on it, not give me that sort of argument. He opens his sailed across the seas, and landed in Australia. It mouth where angels fear to tread. was a very good boat, too. Up to now, that The Hon. Dr. K. Dens: I would like the Acting gentleman has been refused Australian President to explain that little phrase to me. citizenship. Even worse, he has been told to leave The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Mr Acting President the country. (the Hon. R. J. L. Williams), would you like me The Hon. R. T. Leeson: That is the to sit down while you explain that phrase? Government you have in Canberra. The Hon. D. K. Bans: "Open his mouth where The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I could not agree angels fear to tread"! more, but the previous Government set the The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Anything that he can pattern. bite. 618 618[COUNCIL]

Let us consider South Africa. On my last visit I whether we encourage our native people to play noticed great changes had occurred since my football. previous visit 10 years earlier. The Bantu were The Hon. D. K. Dans: Look at the South better dressed, they were happier people, and they Fremantle Football Club. were responsible people in their work. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: That is right. The Hon. D. W. Cooley: How did their wages However, what percentage of Aborigines do we compare with those of white people? take in? Do we go to the missions and develop the The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I can tell Mr Cooley sport of football? Like hell we do; we take away that. the good footballer and bring him to Perth and we The Hon. D. W. Cooley: Can you tell me where forget about the rest. The South Africans do not a white person can be treated by a black doctor, do that; they go out and train all the people. They or where a black person can ride in a white accept responsibility for all. So let members of ambulance? this House reflect on what is being done and not The ACTING PRESIDENT: Order! I suggest be scathing about apartheid, because I believe the that the Hon. D. W. Cooley allow the Hlon. A. A. South Africans are doing a good job with a Lewis to make his own speech. difficult problem. Certainly they are doing a far better job than the United States or the United The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: The interesting point Kingdom has ever done. However, I was led into was that the responsibility of the Bantu towards that part of my speech by the Hon. Neil Oliver. their work had improved greatly. The point I really want to make is that 10 years ago there was The Hon. D. K. Dans: Did he mention South deep feeling between people of Dutch and British Africa? descent; far greater than the feeling between The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Yes, and also people of black and white descent. Rhodesia. In respect of Rhodesia, I have in my The Hon. D. K. Dans: Do you reckon that is electorate a husband and wife whose grandparents why the Americans were spying on them? are in Rhodesia. The grandparents would like to see their grandchildren; they would like to visit The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Now people of Dutch, them here for a month or two. Even that has been British, and Bantu descent are all welded refused because the grandparents have Rhodesian together. There are a couple of hatreds. They passports. have a hatred of Carter, and they have a hatred of Callaghan. They also have a hatred of Fraser. The Hon. D. K. Dants: That is a little tough. The Hon. G. C. MacKinnon: They are not too The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: It is worse than that; fond of Andrew Young, either. it is shameful. It is about time the Federal Government reconsidered this matter. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: That is so. They do not want people to interfere with their country. May I now refer to the two "Ds". If some They want to live their own lives and they are action does not take place in the next 12 months doing so particularly well. Dantu schools and this Government will be branded the "two VD hospitals are being developed. They are getting Government". I might even make the branding away from the old-fashioned idea of Mr Cooley, iron myself. It will not take much imagination on which is at least 10 or 12 years old to the best of the part of members opposite or on this side to my knowledge, because when I was in South realise what are the two "Ds". Africa in 1969 one could ride anywhere one liked The first "D" has already been mentioned twice on a bus and the same ambulances brought in in this Address-in- Reply debate. It has been black and white people. mentioned by the Leader of the Opposition and The Hon. Tom McNeil: Can you play football by the Hon. V. J. Ferry. It is the Dumbleyung wherever you like? Police Station. I do not make any threats in this The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: They are beginning place, but if we do not get a police station at Dumbleyung then Address-in-Reply and Budget to. debates will continue to contain at least one The Hon. Tom McNeil: I do not know about mention of the matter; I can assure the House of that. that. I must admit that the Minister for Police The Hon A. A. LEWIS: Well, Mr McNeil can and Traffic has visited Dumbleyung and said he ask questions and ascertain for himself the way will do the best he can in the next Budget. The integration is proceeding. Let us look at our own way members laugh when I mention the subject is situation-the Hon. Tom McNeil could well look a little hdrrifying in itself, because it is a serious at himself in this respect-and think about matter. [Tuesday, 24th April, 1979] 6191

The Hon. D. K. Dans: It is serious when you Regional Hospital be the appropriate hospital for talk about a washing machine that nearly shakes them to use? the place to bits. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: That may be so, but The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Not only does the mothers in particular-because fathers do not washing machine almost shake the building to have babies-like to have their babies in their pieces, but also the salinity in the water, which own town with their own doctors. was mentioned by Mrs Piesse, is causing the The Hon. D. K. Dans: It must be a very machine to be corroded; so with all that thumping hazardous business if the Minister has to wear a and the salinity of the water, we are in big tin hat in a hospital. trouble. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: That is right, but The Government must consider priorities. I women will continue to have babies in the know we need lovely police complexes in Donnybrook Hospital- Fremantle, Wanneroo, and Perth; and maybe The Hon. D. K. Dans: Tin hats and all? Bunbury needs a courthouse. However, The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Yes, that is how Dumbleyung must get a police complex this year. rugged they are in my electorate. They are trying As I have told the House before, the police station to keep up the bed average in an endeavour to get is a transportable with the most expensive pavi ng an unsympathetic Government to build a new in this Slate. It cost $400 for 21 slabs, laid by two hospital. men who came all the way from Narrogin. If we are prepared to waste that sort of money, let us May I now move on to a subject that has been get on with the job and provide the new complex. widely publicised in the last few weeks and months. I refer to salinity and clearing controls on The other "D" is, of course, that white ant- certain river catchments. Let me commence by riddled, galvanised iron-coated hospital at reading the following quotes made in a speech on Donnybrook. I will not bore the House by the Bill which was introduced last year- speaking at length on this matter. The Minister The Bill provides that anyone seeking to has seen the hospital; we even gave him a hard clear land in these four additional catchment hat to wear, because the building is unsafe and we areas will need to obtain a permit. The would not like a young Minister to be killed by underlying need for this requirement falling timber. probably is obvious to everybody; it is to The Hon. D. K. Dans: In the hospital? enable a check to be made on the increasing The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Yes, in the hospital. salinity in our waterways. The walls of the building are of corrugated In the case of the Wellington Dam galvanised iron; and this is in a so-called civilised catchment area, when the Government community. I am sure no other member in this introduced the provision that a clearing place has in his or her area a hospital which is so permit would be necessary before clearing dilapidated in a community with such a record of operations could take place, it was found a development. Houses are being built rapidly in number of farmers already had taken in Donnybrook. People are commuting to Bunbury bulldozers and cleared fairly extensive areas, and the town is developing at a terrific rate. There areas which were never properly cleared up is a need for a hospital. and put down to pasture; a great deal of this cleared land was never put to the use for It is amazing that, when I take Ministers to which it was intended. Dumbleyung and Donnybrook and show them the conditions about which I speak in the House, they ... Indeed, the Opposition does not raise never seem to write those gorgeous little notes any objection with regard to any part of the saying that the matter is being looked into or that Bill itself. my remarks in the Address-in-Reply debate have ... Although there is no objection to the been noted. Hopefully the Leader of the House first portion, there is some little apprehension will make sure I receive some response on this as to some of the results that could occur as a occasion. consequence of lack of consulation with the farmers in the areas of the four water The Hon. D. K. Dans: How far from Bunbury catchments which are already listed. That is is Donnybrook? not a reservation; it is just a matter I refer to The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: It is 25 miles away. the House. The Hon. D. K. Dans: If people comimute from Those comments were made by the member for Donnybrook to Bunbury, would not the Bunbury Warren in another place. However, the heat 620 620[COUNCIL]

increased and the water got fairly warm, as the The H-op. D. K. Dans: Are you not going to Leader of the House knows because he attended have another look at the legislation? meetings and heard what the people had to say The Hon. G. C. MacKinnon: No. about the Minister, the Government, and everything else. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I would be opposed to In the Warren-Blackwood Times of the 4th having the regulations changed. In relation to the April. it was reported that Mr H. D. Evans moved guidelines. I will deal with the aspect later. I a motion in the State Parliament calling for a realise this is an extremely difficult subject for study into the State Government's controversial city members to understand. However, by the amendments. Members will recall that I have just time I have finished I hope the Leader of the read out some quotes from Mr Evans' speech on Opposition can understand the whole of it. the matter. Then we had another article which The Hon. D. K. Dans: I have been down to see said that a Labor move to debate the issue was the research into salinity by the Forests defeated. That referred to the occasion when the Department a long time ago; but that is not what Opposition tried to introduce the matter as an we are talking about. urgency motion. The Hon. D. K. Dans: Are you for or against The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: The member for the legislation? Warren continued- The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I am right behind it, Conciliation has been denied them. This is because it is necessary. I do not like bans or one of the reasons for urgency. controls being placed upon people's property; He also said- however it is essential to do so for the benefit of The individual farmers should not be the majority of the people of the State. required to accept the full loss which is The Hon. D. K. Dans: Do you think it is the incurred. right thing to do? And further- The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I am sure it is, and I This matter is of grave concern to the think time will bear me out. farmers in this area; it is an unsettling The Hon. G. C. MacKinnon: He has made it thought to realise that individual farmers clear at every public meeting that he thinks it is could be completely ruined because of the right. ban on clearing. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Let me now quote the He continued- comments of other members who were a little If that young man is going to be simply frightened of the heat. One said- handed a cheque for the land he cannot clear This indicates a total absence on the basis of its unimproved capital value of research there is no way he will be able to continue before the legislation was introduced. farming. Those are the comments of the member for He also said- Warren, who was formerly the Minister for Lands and Forests. To the best of my knowledge, Endeavours have been made to get the forestry research into salinity started in 1922. As various Government departments to act a member of the Opposition in the other place, I harmoniously and in unison, but to date there was shown forestry research into salinity in the is no indication as to whether there is to be Perillup area. an independent consultant, who he will be, what his qualifications will be. and whether Without taking into consideration what the he will be satisfactory. Department of Agriculture had'done, what the Public Works Department had done, what the These are fairly outrageous situations. Another CSIRO had done, and what his own department member of the ALP, in trying to make political had done, the former Minister said that this capital, went on to say- indicated a total absence of research before the I know of a farmer in the electorate of the legislation was introduced. How could we believe Minister for Agriculture who is going broke. that sort of statement? He continued- The member for Warren said that the urgency It is quite apparent from that statement had arisen because of the absence of research, and that Mr Whittington has been deprived of that the blame for this could be sheeted home to sufficient finance to put his system into effect the Government. That is very interesting. in the Wellington area. [Tuesday, 24th April, 19791 6212

And further- The Hon. R. F. Claughton: This has been a I have objected to the Minister in relation disgraceful personal attack. to the plight of one farmer. Scrub has The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: It is typical of the overgrown the farmer's pasture lands, but he ALP. That is not a personal attack. cannot obtain a permit from the department to clear the scrub from his farm. Ultimately, The Hon. Rt. F. Claughton: The member is not the scrub will take over. even in the Chamber to defend himself. He also said- The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: If Mr Claughton wishes to talk about that sort of thing, 1 could Members of the Wellington Dam quote numerous occasions on which certain Catchment Area Committee were in members in another place attacked me when I attendance. They have asked me to support was not present. I do not winge and whine about Mr H. D. Evans' motion because of the it. I will answer my critics when my time comes. I complete lack of action by the Government. will answer them, as I have always, with practical That member had been to one meeting of the knowledge of the subject and with common sense. Wellington Catchment Area Committee. That Commonsense was not used in the original was when the Minister was meeting with the shire allegations against me. The referable dams issue in Collie. was one of those where members opposite tried to I have been attending nearly all the meetings. I stir up matters and failed. They will fail on this receive the minutes of all of the meetings. There occasion. is no mention in the minutes which indicates that Obviously, somebody has made statements that member was asked to support the member which have been read to this House, and he then for Warren's motion. I rang the president of that changed his mind because the going became a committee, and he said, "No, we haven't asked little tough. I would like to know what the policy him to support it." of the Labor Party is in relation to salinity. I believe that the Opposition in another place is The Hon. R. F. Claughton: You have copies of trying to stir up the farmers. The Opposition is our platform. not going in and saying, "Well, let us have a look The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I do not read the at your problem, and let us see what we can do platform of the ALP. I am busy enough reading with it." It has purposely gone out to stir up my farmers. That is the typical ALP approach to any own. rural problem. Opposition members interjected. The Hon. R. F. Claughton: Let us get the facts The PRESIDENT: Order! right. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I believe that under The Hon. A.. A. LEWIS: The typical ALP the ALP policy the metropolitan area and country approach to anything to do with the bush is stir it towns, such as Collie and Kittanning. could expect up into a big pottage, and leave it for somebody to have reasonably potable water. I am not one of else to clean up. the people who damns the Labor Party. I think some of its policies, when they have been The Hon. R. F. Claughton: You could not find developed a little, could be quite good. Of course, a finer gentleman than the member for Warren. political history in Australia is that the Labor The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: The Opposition says Party has always been five or six years behind the it is wooing rural votes. Liberal Party in the formulation of policy. The Hon. D. K. Dans: But we did not introduce The Hon. D. K. Dans: Whether you like it or the legislation. not, you have done the soft shoe shuffle on this The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: The Leader of the Bill. You sat down with me at the Pastomalists and Opposition in another place is making weekly Graziers Association opening when the Premier broadcasts, but unfortunately most of them are a said he would have another look at this, and you fortnight or so out of date. did not get up and challenge him. The PRESIDENT: Order! Honourable The PRESIDENT: Order! members will refrain from interjecting. Will the The Hon. D. K. Dans: You have your dancing honourable member on his feet direct his shoes on tonight. comments to the Chair? The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I do not need to have The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Certainly. I have not Mny dancing shoes on. My electorate contains most departed from directing my comments to the of the farmers who are racing these problems. Chair. Who do they come to? They come to Mrs Piesse 622 622[COUNCIL] and myself, because they cannot go to the other one set of guidelines. When there is a progressive people. The other people have changed their Government which cares for people, new minds too often. It is disgusting to see that. One guidelines will always be drawn up and would think that a member of Parliament would implemented. That is the difference between an try to do the best he could for his constituents. authoritarian Government, as is the desire of the The Hon. D. K. Dans: That Bill slipped Opposition, and the compassionate Government through here without proper research. Both sides which is running this State at the moment. should admit that. The Hon. R. F. Claughton: You know all about The Hon. D. W. Cooley interjected. authoritarian Governments. We know you support The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Do I have to make it the Rhodesian and South African Governments. completely clear to the Hon. Desmond Dans and The Hon. D. W. Cooley interjected. the Hon. Don Cooley that I support everything The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: When has not this that was in that Bill? Do I have to make it Government, when presented with the serious completely clear- problems confronting people such as cyclone The PRESIDENT: Order! The Hon. member "Alby", got off its tail and done things for has to make it completely clear to the Chair only. people? When has the Government not been far The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Could I make it ahead of the ALP in doing things for the small completely clear to you, Sir- people of this world? The Hon. D. K. Dans: Pretty difficult! The Hon. D. W. Cooley: Give us one instance. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I regard that as a The PRESIDENT: Order! reflection on the Chair. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: This Government has Could I make it completely clear to you, Sir, always shown itself to be a compassionate one. that I know a lot more about this subject than The Brand Government had always shown itself either of the two people who are yelling and to be a compassionate Government. shouting from the other side? The Hon. R. F. Claughton: That is the sixth The Hon. D. W. Cooley interjected. time you have made that speech this evening. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: There was no need for The Hon. A. A.- LEWIS: We are not like a me to speak when the Bill was in the House. It certain Premier on the other side who wanted was capably handled by the Hon. Robert workers' compensation because he became ill and Hetherington, who agreed with everything that left the job. was in it- The Hon. D. W. Cooley: You are getting a bit The Hon. D. K. Dans: That is right. thick now. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: -and by the Hon. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: If Mr Cooley wants to Winifred Piesse. There is no need to bore this talk about these things, I will talk about them. House with repetition. The Hon. D. W. Cooley: What about Senator The Hon. R. T. Leeson: Well, wind it up! Greenwood? The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I will wind up in a The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Senator Ivor minute. This is a subject that had been thoroughly Greenwood died in office, and his widow was researched, although the Leader of the Opposition awarded an amount of money. in this place says that it had not- The Hon. D. W. Cooley: In addition to a lump- The Hon. D. K. Dans: I did not. sum payment from the superannuation fund, and The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I suggest that the weekly payments. Leader of the Opposition read Hansatdlater. The PRESIDENT: Order! The member for Warren has changed his views The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: The Federal because electorally, at one stage, matters looked a Government has a requirement that that be done. little warm. That is a shocking thing for him to If the Hon. Don Cooley had been in this place do. I would like to quote a little from the latest long enough, 'I would have taken him apart. He guidelines- does not know what he is talking about. It is a The Hon. D. K. Dans: There are some more poor situation for a Premier to resign, receive a guidelines now, not the original guidelines. golden handshake of $205 000 or $190 000, and The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: One would think that then put in his claim for workers' compensation an intellingent person like the Hon. Desmond when he is also receiving an income from his Dans would have known that there was more than cookery books. [Tuesday, 24th April, 1979] 6232

I return to the guidelines on salinity. These May I make my views known on the guidelines are not intended to be rigid rules. They subject of income tax deductions in regard to will be reviewed progressively on the basis of salt affected land or land which could experience and the future results of research possibly become salt affected. One must work. That means that the Government will keep remember that in this State alone, the area the matter continually under review. That is what affected and removed from production has a good Government should do. gone from 73 000 ha. to 163 000 ha. in the I have dealt with the problems of the people in last fifteen years, and the problem is still these catchment areas. I have probably dealt with growing. more of these problems than has any other When one considers the problem on a member, because I have been involved in the practical basis, there are many ways of situation a lot longer. I believe that the implementing a cdintrol scheme. The Government has not handled the situation as fast engineering methods, interceptor banks and as it could. It has not acted as quickly as it could. such like give a control on land reclamation, The Government has worked on the problem, but but not on stream salinity which is also it has not been as speedy in its movements, as an important in a country so short of water. answer to my question this afternoon indicates. The person that decides on this method The legal profession is involved in the can get a total deduction in the year of conveyancing transaction when a property is expenditure. Unfortunately the person who transferred and this seems to take a long time. I decides to reclaim by other methods, such as am assured by people who are international fencing off the area and planting salt tolerant experts that this State is amongst the most species, is only allowed to claim over a period advanced countries in the world as far as salt of ten years, and I believe is doing a job control is concerned. We have heard outrageous equal to the person who is putting in banks statements made by some people as to what we etc. have and have not done. I do not believe there is It would appear to me that owing to the one simple solution to the problem. I believe there problem being Australia wide and the fact are some mechanical solutions, such as that the losses to the economy are increasing interceptor banks. I believe Mr Whittington's steadily, every effort should be made to scheme can achieve a great deal as far as salt amend the law to allow all salt reclamation encroachment on the land is concerned; but I work as deduction in the year of expenditure. doubt whether it will do very much for stream The problem is not just a simple one of salinity. As a matter of fact, I believe his scheme agricultural production, but also one of water may even increase the salinity of streams. conservation for Australia's future urban and It may be a good idea to use the Blackwood and industry needs. Frankland Rivers as drains for salt. The Hon. W. I would hope that yourself and Cabinet Mv.Piesse made a Press statement about strip would give thought to this amendment as planting of trees and agro-forestry. I believe that future generations will be needing both the has a place also. I do not think there is only one water and the agricultural production. If simple solution. there is any supplementary information you I have approached the Federal Treasurer, need, I will be only too willinj to try and get because some members may recall that the Apex it for you. Club of Western Australia took up the matter of The Hon. H. W. Gayfer: What date was that tax deductions for salt-land reclamation at its letter written? State conference. I received a number of letters The. Hon. A. A. LEWIS: It was written on the from the Minister who was helping the Treasurer, l8th April. but I did not receive a letter from the Treasurer *himself. The Hon. H. W. Gayfer: This year? As you know, Sir, when I get the bit between The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: It was written this my teeth I do not let a matter go. I wrote again to year, after I had received approximately 17 the Treasurer. I should like to quote fully from replies from the Minister assisting the Treasurer. my latest letter, because I believe it sets out the I can give the member every one of those replies. matter in a better form than I am capable of The Hon. H. W. Gayfer: You do not need to, doing off the cuff. The letter is addressed to the because the deductions were approved in Treasurer and it reads as follows- November. However, we shall leave it this time. 624 624[COUJNC IL)

The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: The deductions were The Hon G. C. MacKinnon: It must have been approved for engineering methods only; not for a gale of laughter. fencing. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: -by the innane sort The H-on. D. K. Dans: I hope the Federal of people who are interjecting at the present time. Minister is not misleading you. Whenever I am the first person to refer to a The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Every Federal particular matter in this place, I am laughed out of member in this State received a letter and I hope the House, because they think I am crazy. that those who replied to me are not being misled The Hon. D. K. Dans: You said it, not If also. Same excellent booklets have been produced The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Here is the Leader of on the problem of salinity and what to do about it. the Opposition interjecting. I should like tonight The Department of Agriculture, the CSIRO, and to refer to the situation in relation to cougars. other organisations have carried out a great deal The Hon. D. K. Dans: The cougar is always of work on this subject over the years. It is a pity good for a laugh. that members who are jumping on the bandwagon The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: It is not good (or a do not go out and look at the research material laugh from my point of view. The Leader of the which is available. Opposition has said that the cougar is good for a The H-on. H, W. Gayfer: That is right. laugh. I anm afraid I have gone beyond the The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I should like now to laughing stage as far as cougars are concerned. turn to a small tourist matter in regard to the The Hon. R. T. Leeson: Are you referring to Perth Airport and the reception given to "Coujars"? international travellers. I shall give one or two The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I am referring to examples of it. I had to wait in a plane in mountain lions, cougars, call them what members Singapore for 1 'h hours whilst passengers like. These animals are killing sheep and cattle. embarked. I arrived at Perth and was made to The Hon. R. T. Leeson: Yes, the member for wait in the plane for 35 minutes so that we could Collie told me about it. be sprayed, because another plane had arrived at the same time. This is a little ludicrous. Surely The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: The member for two of the stewards could walk down the aisles of Collie found out about the matter in the last week the plane, followed by the man from the or two only. When has he ever referred to the Department of Public Health. This could be done matter or written to the Minister about it? Twelve when two planes arrive at Perth Airport at the months ago I mentioned this matter in the House. The Leader of the House believes that there is no same time. such animal in this area. He maintains it is a feral I believe the porters at the airport should take a cat or a big bird, but it is not a cougar. slightly different attitude to returning trollies for The Hon. G. C. MacKinnon: Dogs and cats. people wishing to remove their luggage. I do not wish to be racist, but a person of a particular The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: It is fascinating. nationality spat on a Porter three weeks prior to The Hot- 0. C. MacKinnon: I will believe it my arriving at the airport. One man out of the when someone in Australia shoots a cougar or thousands of people who travel through Perth puma and brings it in for everyone to see. Airport spat on a porter, and as a result, all the The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I should like to see porters refused to return the trollies so that Mr Ferry bring in a cougar. Mrs Piesse and I will incoming passengers could remove their luggage. bring in a cougar and table it. We cannot do that, We are only courting trouble if, as a nation, we because of Hansard,but we will put it on the floor permit this sort of situation to occur at a time under the Leader of the House. when we are trying to encourage tourism. I make The Hon. G. E. Masters: I hope you will kill it passing reference to that matter only. I have first. spoken to the Federal Minister in relation to it The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: With any luck we can and I believe he has taken note of the matter. I put it there last! When you, Sir, see the casts of shall see whether the situation is any different footprints and compare those casts with a beast of next time I return to Perth. this type- About this time last year I was nearly laughed The Hon. G. C. MacKinnon: They are called out of this House- "Pug marks", are they not? The Hon. D. J. Wordsworth: Never! The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I thought the pug The Hon. R. T. Leeson: Which time was that? marks were what was put in the clay. I am [Tuesday, 24th April, 1979]12 625 referring to the casts, not the pug marks. When sane men and they are good bushmen. They are members see the number of these cats, when 600 asked to lead the parties which look for children or 700 lambs are killed on one property, and when who are lost in the bush. The police ask for the the Government does nothing about it, it is time help of these people when the State Emergency to mention the matter in this House again. The Service is alerted, and yet members laugh at them Government has done nothing at all about the when they say such an animal is killing the stock. matter. It has treated it as a laughing matter. It The Hon. G. E. Masters: Have they tried using has not, as was mentioned in a letter to one of my hunting dogs? colleagues, put on a red alert. The Department of Fisheries and Wildlife and the APB should be The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: They are tr~ining a pack of hunting dogs now. The normal dog turns examining what is killing the stack. I should like with terror when he hears the screams of these to quote from the Collie Mail of the 4th April. A public meeting was held and approximately 120 animals. people attended. It can be seen that no-one is The Hon. G. E. Masters: There is a certain worried about the matter! breed of dog which can be brought in. The people attending the meeting formed a The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: If the Hon. Gordon committee and invited an American to come to Masters recalls, I suggested last year that the area. Last year I suggested the Government something along these lines be done. However, should provide the finance to bring in an nothing has been done about the matter, so I shall American expert. The community has done this continue to mention it. and I congratulate it on that. When the The Hon. D. K. Dans: They would have to be community is proved to be right I shall be very quarantined for so long that they would forget pleased to tell the Government about it, because it what to do. could have saved livestock valued at hundreds of The Hon. G. E. Masters: Is there a particular thousands of dollars. More than one of these breed? animals exist. I should like to quote a comment in relation to the screams of these animals. It reads The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Apparently the breed is not so important, but dogs can be trained to do as follows- it and a pack is being trained now. Perhaps during Their scream is indescribable, but for those the next Address-in-Reply debate I wi!l bring in a who have heard it say that it is about 10 pack of dogs to help the Opposition. times louder than a torn cat, but "puts the The Hon. D. J. Wordsworth: The Minister for shivers up your spine". Agriculture has come to listen to you. The Hon. D. K. Dans: It might be a giant tom. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I know he is here. I The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I hope nobody here believe he is doing his best to sort out the bears that noise, because if he does and if it is 10 problem. I do not think he realises what it is times louder than the cry of a torn cat he will costing the State but he will realise it when he have a cougar very close to him. reads my speech. The Hon. 1.G. Pratt: Or a tiger by the tail. I have been accused of many things, including The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: There have been being heartless for believing in apartheid. But I many instances of claw marks on trees. Although wonder what members of the Opposition think it sounds humorous, this is a deadly serious about the sentences imposed on people who extort matter. I have seen the way the farm animals are money and leave bombs around. I am talking killed. I know most of the farmers, if not all of about the Collie bomber. I have the greatest them. I know they are good bushmen. I know that sympathy for the man himself, but I believe three'- if it was an ordinary dog killing sheep, these men years and six months, which is the term he will would deal with the nnitter themselves. It is all serve unless he is given further remissions, is not very well for members to grin about this matter. an appropriate sentence for a man who has held a However, it is costing this State at the moment whole town to ransom. approximately S50 000 to $60 000 per year in Let us recapitulate. This man left what stock killed. appeared to be a half carton of cans on the main If the APB and the Department of Fisheries steps of the Crown Hotel in Collie. Had it gone and Wildlife cannot control such matters, they off in that position it would have killed everybody should admit it and accept the suggestion that we in the saloon bar, because it would have blown bring in someone from overseas to attend to the through the wall. A very brave policeman threw it matter. I am heartily sick of the laughter and the outside and it did only $7000-worth of damage to suggestions that it is a feral cat. These people are the back of the hotel. Extortion calls followed, 626 626(COUNCIL] which put the fear of God into every publican. The Hon. R. T. Leeson: You look more like The publicans had to evacuate their children; they Tom Hartrey every day, the way you are had previously seen what this man had done with standing. his bomb. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: 1 take that as a Our courts showed magnificent leniency, which compliment. If I could use words as well as the I hope will be justified. I hope this man is never former member for Yilgarn-Dundas, I would be seen in court again after he is released. But be very well pleased. He was a superb orator. held a whole community to ransom and I think this is a matter which should be brought threatened peple's lives, It was only a stroke of to the notice of the House, because it is a Matter luck that the policeman moved the bomb. Had he which worries my constituents. waited for the bomb disposal squad, the explosion The Hon. D. K. Dans: How are you going to would have killed the children upstairs. amend the law? Yet in no way can I get an appeal against this The Hon. A. A. LEWIS:. We must rely on the sentence. 1 have approached the Attorney judges, but I do not think they get down to the General, who has had advice from his grass roots very often; they do not hear what the department, and I believe he is very sincere. average person in the community thinks about However, something must be done to protect the these matters. So we in this place should mention citizens in these communities. If a man can hold a what is happening in the community so that the whole town to ransom for as long as the Collie judiciary will know what the average member of bomber did, we have in this society a malaise the community thinks. Should we be afraid to put which must be cured by very harsh methods, and forward our own opinions just because a judge I do not believe three years and six months is a makes a certain decision? harsh sentence. The Hon. D. K. Dans: No, I am not saying T he Hon. D. K. Dans: I probably agree with that. You are implying that if you speak long you, but I do not think you should Use this time to enough and loud enough you will influence the criticise the courts, which are in possession of all course of justice. the facts. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: That is not what I am The I-on. A. A. LEWIS: I do not like trying to do. lam sorry if I have led the Leader of criticising the courts. I believe the court system the Opposition to that conclusion. What 1 am should have been given another go and the Crown trying to say is that the people of Collie felt that should have appealed. The Attorney General after being held to ransom for so long they should disagrees with me, and the only place where I can have seen some sterner treatment of that person. say what I think about the situation is here. Perhaps it is an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth mentality. The Hon. D. K. Dans: Should he have been given 10 years or should he have been shot? The Hon. D. W. Cooley: He may be a good member of the community in three years' time. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Let us look at the four charges against him. One was inexplicably The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I hope he is. dropped by the Crown; the defence did not even The Hon. D. W. Cooley: They used to send know it was to be dropped. On another charge, people out here for stealing a loaf of bread. the ,maximum sentence. On two other charges The Hon. D. K. Dans: We did not reform very seven years each was the maximum sentence. many of them. The Hon. D. K. Dans: Isn't it a fact that had The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: We do not want that the media played a more responsible role the man sort of harshness today. When I brought the would have been apprehended 10 or 11 days matter up I said it was a difficult subject. earlier? The Hon. D. K. Dans: If you do not abide by The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: That may well be so; the umpire's decision, what other decision do you I do not think we can make an assessment of it. have? But would it not still have been too long? The The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: The umpire's decision crimes would still have been committed. includes a right of appeal by the Crown. The Hon. D. K. Dans: He would not have been The Hon. D. K. Dans: Why didn't it appeal? wandering around for another 10 or IlI days. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: The Attorney General The I-on. A. A. LEWIS: In that time he did or his department has reasons for not appealing, not commit any crimes. which I do not accept. [Tuesday, 24th April, 1979162 627

I wish to mention two or three further subjects. Boyup Brook happened at 3 o'clock in the Firstly, I believe the State Housing Commission morning and the RTA was not there. Usually should start considering pensioner housing in during the day drivers obey the rules, and in my some towns. Members may recall that when I first opinion such action on the part of the Road became a member of the other place the State Traffic Authority is overdoing it a bit. Housing Commission had written off the town of I now turn to another matter that I have raised Bridgetown, because the railway depot was to be constantly, both in this House and in writing. I closed. With the help or Mr McKenzie, again make a plea for some way to pay fines and Bridgetown is thriving, but we need some other fees in a police station which is no( equipped pensioner accommodation. I believe the State with a cash register. Are members aware that one Housing Commission should make surveys of cannot pay a speeding fine or pay one's gun large country towns to see whether pensioner licence in such a police station? One can pay for a accommodation is needed. The needs of towns driver's licence and obtain a little receipt for the change. I leave it at that for the moment. payment, but that is the only fee that such a The next subject is one about which I have police station will accept. approached many Ministers for Transport and Many local authorities are equipped with cash Police; that is, the 10 per cent deviation from axle registers, and they would be quite happy to accept loading which is allowed in the carting of this money and forward it to the department livestock. Several members in this House know concerned. The person paying the money would something about the matter, but I am sure there receive a receipt with the cash register imprint on is no way they could judge the weight of stock it. over any specified axle to within 10 per cent. People are being pulled up by the heavy haulage The Treasury Department has never allowed local authorities to accept money on squad and drivers and owners are being behalf of the summonsed, because a truck they have loaded has RTA or the Police Force, Perhaps the Minister been overweight on a specific axle. will realise that the person paying a speeding fine and the person licensing his gun are actually Do we want to impose a further charge on the consumers, and it would assist these consumers to producer by insisting on underweight trucks? I do pay these moneys at the local shire office. I can not believe it is possible to judge within 10 per see no sane reason for the refusal to allow this cent. It may be possible to judge within 15 or 20 procedure to operate. However, I believe I have so per cent, but in my opinion 10 per cent per axle far been knocked back I I times in this regard. with stock moving around in the compartments of I have a brief complaint I would like to direct a truck is not possible. I hope that in the future some Government will have the intelligence to say to the Minister for Education. I wonder whether he is aware of the situation of female school to the heavy haulage squad, "Give these drivers a go." They are teachers in GEHA accommodation in country saving the consumer money as the and remote areas. Fortunately so far there has stock will get to slaughter cheaper, and they are been no serious incident, although many of these saving the farmer money, because he will not have more truck space, and in that margin young school teachers have been frightened by to pay for hooligans. On quite a number of occasions the they are not damaging the roads one little bit. I people causing the nuisance could have been think it is about time idiotic regulations of that apprehended sort were removed from the list. if the units had been equipped with a telephone. The girls would be far happier with a White I am dealing with the RTA, I want to telephone and I do not think any of them would make some quick complaints about the RTA and worry about a few extra dollars a week in rent. the police. I give the example that the week I would like to move on to the town of Wagin, before last the Boyup -Brook Co-op had a monster was the first sale of this type that had and perhaps Mrs Piesse will be a little annoyed sale, which with me for mentioning this matter, but I believe been held in a small town for many years. We she will support my comments. have heard of the problems the country shopkeeper has in trying to woo people into the The IHon. W. M. Piesse: I am certainly not town. Under new management, the Boyup Brook annoyed if you say something good about it. store tried a new way to encourage people. And so The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Mrs Piesse was a help me Bob, in came the RTA, looking for keys councillor when this matter was first raised, and in the ignition, scuffed tyres, parking offences, of course I am referring to the introduction of and what-have-you. What would drive people out courses of a technical nature at Wagin. I would of a small town quicker? The only accidents of like to mention Councillor Ernie Hotker who has any consequence that I can recall happening at trained students in various aspects of farm 628 628[COUNCIL] machinery. Other individuals have taken part in The H-on. D. W. Cooley: Our unemployment is various vocational studies. From what I have the highest in Australia. heard it appears certain that some courses will be The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: This map shows introduced at Wagin, and this has been brought clearly that our high level of unemployment has about by the great efforts of the Wagin Shire been caused by migration into the State. Council, the Tractors Dealers Association, and, of The Hon. R. T. Leeson: What about the people course, that very well known organisation, the who leave the State? Farm Machinery Dealers Association. These courses will be of great benefit to the farmers, and The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: The Figures set out here show the net migration into the State, and it if the courses develop in the proper way there will is the net migration that has created our whole be operators' courses, farm mechanics' courses, problem. The trouble is that we cannot make and owners' courses. The Farm Machinery people see when they will not look. Dealers Association will have apprenticeship courses going on in certain centres, and so we The Hon. 0. N. B. Oliver: There are none so could build up a complete centre in Wagin around blind as those who do not see. farm machinery. This is the only country town The Hon. D. K. Dans: There are 40 people where there is a farm machinery manufacturer. looking for each job they can see in Western Pederipks has been established in Wagin for a Australia. long time, and it will be there for a long time to The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: What about the come. People have said, "Why not Merredin, immigration? Katanning, or Narrogin?" However, Wagin is the The Hon. D. K. Dans: Look, we are an only town with an established farm machinery Australian nation. manufacturer, and so this would be the sensible The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Why then does Mr choice. The Tractors Dealers Association and the Cooley say that our unemployment is the highest Farm Machinery Dealers Association were in Australia? Mr Cooley says one thing, and Mr unanimous on this point. I hope by the start of the Dans tries to get him out of it, but while getting 1980 school year this will be a growing and him out of it he puts him in further. This is why thriving course for the future. the Opposition stays in opposition. Its members I would like to mention briefly the subject of are not really concerned, and they do not look at Tincurran wheat, and I would like my comments the figures, 1 am glad that Mr Dans agrees. passed on to the Minister for Agriculture. If we The Hon. D. IK.Dans: Ha! are to release a species of wheat into certain The Hon. R. F. Claughton: You are doing your areas, then let us ensure that Co-operative Bulk best to avoid looking at figures. I-andling-or some such organisation-will take The Hon.- A. A. LEWIS: I would like to it from those centres. It appears to me that the comment on the magnificent job the Government farmers in the Boyup Brook area are the best has done in Collie and the way it is showing the growers of this type of wheat, and so CBH ought lead in research, in exploration, and in new ideas, to take it from them. I suppose it hurts the Opposition, because its We have heard the knockers talk a great deal of members never thought of doing these things. nonsense about unemployment, whereas they The Hon. R. F. Claughton: Oh come off it! should be concentrating on employment. Tonight The Hon. D.-W. Cooley: We had only 7 000 we heard the lHon. Neil Oliver speak about the people unemployed when we were in Government. number of jobs created by this Government. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: When I was a The H-on. D. W. Cooley interjected. member in another place, I asked some questions The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I would like the Hon. of the Tonkin Government. Don Cooley to take notes while I am talking, or The H-on. D. K. Dans: The Liberal Government perhaps he could look at H-a nsard. I would refer knocked off $80 million of the State's money by him also to a book entitled internal Migration in handing it to the oil companies. Australia written by D. T. Rollin. I have here a The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Mr Don Taylor is a map which appears in that book, but very good friend of mine, and I asked him- unfortunately I cannot have a map recorded in Hansard. This map shows the migration that has Several members interjected. occurred in Australia, and we can see that many The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Order! people from other States have come to Western The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I asked Mr Taylor Australia to seek work. why the Brand Government had left the steel rods [Tuesday, 24th April, 1979J 6292 out at the end of the Muja power station, and Mr The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: He made sure that Taylor, being the honest man he is, said that it the Collie Miners' Union- was to enable expansion. At that stage the Labor The Hon. D. K. Dans: After all, he is the members were saying it was their Government Premier of the State. He is supposed to go out which was extending the Muja power station, but among the people. Mr Don Taylor was honest enough to admit that The Hon. G. C. MacKinnon: Not just supposed the Brand Government had made allowances for to-he does. this extension. The IHon. D. K. Dans: That is what I just said. The Hon. D. K. Dans: How much would it cost The Hon. R. T. Leeson: I hope Mr T. H. Jones to change Kwinana back to coal? reads this speech. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I would not have a The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Well, I do not think clue. [ do not live in Kwinana. he will bother. The Hon. G. C. MacKinnon: Don't you think The Hon. D. K. Dans: Neither do 1. we should change it? The Hon. R. F. Claughton: I do not think the The Hon. D. K. Dans: If you had listened to Collie miners will bother either. Mr T. H-.Jones you would not have made it oil in The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Legislation will be the first place. That was a scandal-$80 million. introduced shortly to see that Collie will be looked The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: We have listened to after for another 40 years. That legislation will be Mr T. H. Jones on many occasions, and so did the introduced by a Liberal Government. It has taken Tonkin Government. We have listened to his the imagination of a Liberal Party Government to statements about research. The member for Collie do this. knows that no Government has undertaken much The Hon. D. K. Dans: I am very glad to hear research in Collie, and no Premier has discussed you say that, because I heard a lot of torn toms what is going on in Collie with the miners' around the place saying that they can land New union- South Wales and Queensland steaming coal in The Hon. R. F. Claughton: That conflicts with Fremantle cheaper than they can bring it from the answers your Minister gave me. Collie. I hope they are wrong. The Hon. D. W. Cooley interjected. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Maybe they are. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I challenge either of The Hon. G. C. MacKinnon: We will have to the two members to go to the Collie Miners' reduce the price we pay to the Collie coalminers, Union and ask them which Premier has consulted won't we? with them more than any other Premier. I am The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: New South Wales sure that the answer will be Sir Charles Court. will continue to export its coal, and it may happen Our Premier never goes to Collie without meeting that we will have to become an importer. Under with union representatives. the present regime in New South Wales, the coalminers will generate enough industrial action The Hon. D. K. Dans: Not long ago you had to produce their coal, so we will take their coal him out planting pine trees. willingly. We are one Australian nation; I think I The Hon. D. W. Cooley: There was 100 years' heard the Leader of the Opposition say that a supply of coal, and yet you changed to oil. moment ago. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: We do not make a The Hon. D. K. Dans: That is right. fuss about such matters as the Labor Party does. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Let the Eastern The Premier has a quiet meeting with union States contribute something to the gross earnings representatives without politicians being present. of the nation, as Western Australia is doing. It The Hon. D. K. Dans: Without politicians? does not give me the horrors to think about taking The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Just the Premier and a little bit of New South Wales coal. the union representatives. The Hon. D. K. Dans: If I were a member representing that area, I would be horrified at the The Hon. D. K. Dans: I think that is a very line prospect. thing, and I should commend him for it. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: We know, and the The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I thank the Leader of people of Collie know, that because of the Liberal the Opposition, and [ believe the Opposition Government their future is secure. Collie has a should commend him for it. 42-year contract. It is amazing to hear members The Hon. D. K. Dans: I just said that. opposite interject; they know that this 630 630[COU NC!IL]

Government has taken this step for Collie and has The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: They were, but there gone ahead on behalf of Collie. Members of the are times when policemen should show a little Opposition are only screaming in the dark. leniency. The Hon. R. T, Leeson: See how many votes The Hon. D. W. Cooley: Do you think we you get in Collie. should bend the law? The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Mr Leeson may be The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: If we sat in this place very surprised. Does he realise that the people and rigidly adhered to the Standing Orders, we who represent Collie comprise one Labor would not interject. Mr Cooley is bending the law member, two Liberals, and one National Country by interjecting. Therefore he condones bending Party member?-The member for Collie quivers the law a little bit, just as I do. whenever I go down to Collie. I think he probably I conclude on this note: This Government is votes for me, anyway. doing an outstanding job. The people of Western This Australia appreciate it is doing an outstanding Government has been a progressive job, and no amount of knocking from the Government. It does not matter how much the Opposition will convince the public there is any Opposition knocks and screams. alternative to the present Government. The Hon. R. F. Claughton: You are making I support the motion. pretty heavy weather in trying to convince the House of it. THE HON. IR.T. LEESON (South-East) [9.34 p.m.]: I wish to raise a matter which, virtually, is The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: We do not w orry a carryover of a Bill which went through this about people like Mr Claughton; however, the House last year to ratify an agreement concerning more intelligent members of the Opposition I do the Ycelirrie uranium plant in the north-west of worry about. Members have only to consider this the State. The Australian Labor Party's position Government's record over the years compared on this matter has been expressed clearly both with the records of other Governments around inside and outside this House. Australia to know that we are on the right track, However, a problem has arisen in that the and that the Court Government is looking after agreement was drawn up in an open-ended all sections of the community. We are not fashion, allowing the company itself to decide horrified to help unions; in fact, I have given through which region it would transport its members one example. freight. The Hon. D. K. Dans: The Government is not As soon as the Bill to ratify the agreement giving you much help to catch that cougar! passed through this House, the local governing The H-on. A. A. LEWIS: The Government is bodies in my area-and, I believe, in other areas not helping me do many things; it is not helping of the State-began preparing a case 1o present to me to get a new police station at Dumbleyung or the Government and to Western Mining Donnybrook; and, it is not helping me to catch the Corporation to encourage them to use their cougar. particular region over which to transport freight to and from the project at Yeelirrie. I expressed The Hon. R. T. Leeson: You are always reservations at the time this Bill was going knocking policemen. through the House at the open-ended nature of The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: I am not always this clause. What has happened in fact is that the knocking policemen; I simply think that it is bad Government has created a dog Fight between two public relations for policemen to go into a small progressive areas of this State;, namely, the town which is having a monster sale to remove Esperance-Goldfields area and the Geraldton keys from cars, and to book people for having region, for the privilege of being able to ship this scuffed tyres, and so on. I think that shows a lack much-needed freight through their particular of common sense and good public relations. areas. The Hon. D. W. Cooley: They have to uphold The Hon. N. F. Moore: I thought the company was going to decide. the law. The Hon. R. T. LEESON: The agreement gave The Hon. A. A. LEWIS: Everyone must the company an open-ended right to decide which uphold the law. I do not intend to be drawn into area it wanted to use, and I said at the time this an argument about BHP. was quite wrong. It has misguided many people in The Hon. D. W. Cooley: They were only doing my area and in the Esperance region-and, their job, weren't they? indeed, in the area represented by the member for [Tuesday, 24th April, 1979) 6313

Lower North Province-into thinking the freight yellow cake which goes with it, so I do not will be carted through their areas. suppose a bit more yellow cake will make much The HaIn. N. F. Moore: Both come through my difference. area. I thought the member for Lower North The I-In. R. T. LEESON: Well, we have no Province would support my case, because Menzies need to worry about the member for Lower North and Leonora would benefit by the transport of Province; he is as sweet as a nut. I will worry only freight through the region. At present, the about the people in my area and the area the standard gauge railway line is virtually a white Minister for Lands represents. These regions are elephant; I do not think there are two ounces of lobbying for the access route to be taken through nickel a week being transported over that 620 their area. kilometres of line. We are in the unfortunate situation where the salt operation at Lake Lefroy The Goldfields- Esperance Regional De- has just been closed down, and no salt is being yelopment Committee has discussed this transported on that line. So, virtually nothing matter at length, because it was always of the is being transported on that line. opinion that the freight was to come through that area. However, I was told six months ago by The H-In. H. W. Gay fer: Do not forget the Western Mining Corporation officials that grain. Geraldton was to be the venue. As members can The Hon. R. T. LEESON: Yes, there is a little see, what is happening is that a big dog fight has grain from Salmon Gums. However, it is a lot of been started between two large areas of Western standard gauge line for a small amount of wheat. Australia. Perhaps this may have been the This line should be put to use, and the equipment intention of the Government, to sidetrack people and whatever else is necessary at Yeelirrie should away from the agreement when it was originally be freighted through this region. before the House. People in my electorate were It has been suggested that a bitumen road saying, "This is going to be a wonderful thing for continuing through Leonora up to Kalgoorlie." They did not realise that Yeelirrie Leinster-which has quite a large nickel was about 250 aerial miles north-west of operation--could be utilised. In addition, there Kalgoorlie and that, because the agreement was are other nickel operations which could be so open-ended, it was possible that Kalgoorlie developed in the area if the price of nickel may not form part of the route over which the remains at its present level. freight will be transported. It is unfortunate that, at present, this line is not At present, we have a standard gauge railway being used for the purpose it was -originally line of some 620 kilometres stretching from constructed; namely, the cartage of nickel and Esperance in the south to Leonora in the north. It other ores. I believe the civic leaders and other cost many millions of dollars to construct, and at people in my electorate will put up a good pase present very little freight is being transported over both to the Government and Western Mining it. Corporation to have the Esperance-Kalgoorlie- The Hon. N. F. Moore; I hope you are not Leonora avenue used to transport freight to getting involved in the dog ight. Yeelirrie. However, as members no doubt will be The Hon. R. T. LEESON: I most certainly am quick to point out, the Geraldton area probably going to support- will put up equally strong a case. Under the open- ended wording of the original agreement, The Hon. N. F. Moore: You do not want yellow Geraldton has as much right as the Kalgoorlie- cake going through Kalgoorlie, do you? Esperance region to lay claim to this freight The HaIn. R. T, LEESON: I am talking about traffic. the estimated 150 000 tonnes of freight which As I said, this is going to create a lot of fighting must be transported to Yeelirrie. At the same in these areas when, with a little forethought and time, why does the honourable member think I do guts on the part of the Government and not want yellow cake transported through WMC-they know what they are about-7a lot of Kalgoorlie? The Bill he supported provides for a this could have been avoided. With that, I support pilot processing plant to be constructed at the motion. Kalgoorlie in the next six months. THE HON. M. McALEER (Upper West) The Hon. N. F. Moore: You do not like that, [9.'45 p.mn.]: In supporting the motion I would like either. to congratulate the IHIn. Norman Moore on the The Hon. R. T. LEESON: We have been way he moved the Address-in-Reply to the forced to accept this pilot uranium plant, and the Governor's Speech. As usual, I listened with 632 632[COUNCIL) interest to the member and I agree with the Hon. houses and business premises destroyed and A. A. Lewis and other members, who have others who had their sheds or farm buildings indicated that it was a very fine speech. destroyed. Mr Moore acknowledged in a very eloquent Three Government Ministers were almost manner the contribution made by people in immediately in the area and an emergency pastoral and farming areas to the settlement of committee was set up. Shires were supplied with this State. Like him I would like to see the 150th information covering disaster relief. They were anniversary celebrations mark a permanent able to supply people with forms and help the improvement in their situation. people fill in those forms to seek assistance. There I hear a great deal from members representing was a great deal of enthusiasm shown by the the south-west about how swingingly the 150th shires. anniversary celebrations are going. Given the At the same time Government instrumentalities difference in population and distances involved, pulled their weight and Westrail was able to people in the Upper West Province are doing their supply tarpaulins to people with damaged roofs. best to celebrate this great year. It is difficult to The damaged buildings in the Mingenew and choose among the many events that have taken Northampton towns made them look like walking place, but I would like to make mention of the re- wounded. The PAD was prompt to assess enactment of the landing of Lieutenant George damages to public buildings, especially schools, Grey at Kalbarri, which was followed by a walk and repairs were carried out in miraculously along the route taken by his party from Kalbarri quick time. The SEC had large problems to cope to Geraldton. This journey was undertaken by with, yet it was able to reconnect the towns and school boys in the Gcraldton area and taken up by farms in very quick time. Telecom worked hard to other boys from the Dongara school who put up broken telephone lines. undertook a route from Chapman Valley to Irwin The River. It was a great effort physically and it was spirit of the people in the area was superb. The towns were cleared of the debris and people of great interest, because they compared their who had themselves been hard hit were prepared observations with those in Grey's journal and to assist others. Many people had frightening added something to our knowledge of this event. experiences during the storm when houses were To the people in the northern wheat belt in the unroofed or crumpled. in the towns and on the upper part of the province last year was a better farms some of the people were able to escape to year, but for most it was not a really good year. safe quarters. Others were cut off by debris and For some it was the third year of a drought. The fallen power lines Or had nowhere to go when the Western Australian Government has been air was full of flying iron. It is a wonder, and one prepared to declare as drought affected the we must be grateful for, that, to my knowledge, properties of some 150 people in the first instance, no-one was seriously hurt. and then to reconsider the cases of other people who were inadvertently overlooked. There are as I would especially like to acknowledge the many again and perhaps double that number who courage shown by so many people, and above all are in the most difficult of circumstances. the courage shown by those who were already disastrously affected by drought and whose There is a serious problem of high indebtedness situation was greatly worsened by the cyclone. As as shown by the Federal Government's reluctance members will realise, it was not just houses which to make a further grant of $200 000 to those who were damaged; sheds and fences were also had already received $40 000 over the previous damaged, and even the paddocks themselves were two years. The problem has been made worse by in some cases destroyed, especially in light-land the effects of cyclone "Hazel". The Western areas. Some paddocks were in such a state that it Australian Government supported drought- was impossible to drive vehicles on them. affected areas by representations to the Commonwealth, which were partially successful. Disaster relief may take care of the houses, but The Federal Government has been prepared to in some cases that will not help people to stay on grant people with higher indebtedness an extra their farms unless it is generous enough to enable $20 000 if they live iR what is known as normally them to put a crop in. There are many calls on the safe areas. The drought relief committee has, in Government-that is, the taxpayer, or the my experience, been very prompt in supporting community-to support this and that deserving cases brought to its attention. The Government causes, but I believe the victims of such a disaster was prompt in bringing relief to people affected really are worthy of help. by cyclone "Hazel". It was able to ease Although the past year has been difficult for immediate worries of those people who had their many people in the towns and the country, signs [Tuesday, 24th April, 19791 6333 of improvement in both business and farm by the Government, were due largely to the hard incomes and an overall steady upgrading of public work done by the locals. These people raised large facilities are evident. The improvement is due to amounts of money. the better seasons and prices and to the improved Of course, problems remain, but overall the economic climate. It is also due to the measures Government's record in the province is good and taken by the Government to tide the people over there is every reason to suppose it will press on such a difficult period, provide a sound base to and continue in this way. work on, and quicken the provision of amenities and facilities. The Leader of the Opposition released a Press statement in Geraldton a couple of weeks ago in For instance, people in Moora are very grateful which he called on the Government to undertake that extensions to the hospital have been approved a major programme to upgrade community and the work commenced. A very important facilities in country areas. When I read this repair and renovation programme has been agreed statement I felt grateful for his interest but to for the Morawa Hospital. Unfortunately there thought it rather belated, 'because this is, in fact, is still a delay with the extensions to the Three what the Government has'been doing since it Springs Hospital.There is no immediate prospect came to office. I do not think even the ALP could of those projects being undertaken. claim to do everything at once. But I was very The Hon. N. F. Moore: Leonora has been glad to know that Mr Davies was proposing fixed. discrimination in favour of country people. I The Hon. M. McALEER: I am well aware of expect that in line with this we will not be that and I am sorry that the Three Springs attacked by the ALP any longer about the one project was not next on the list as we hoped. The area where this favourable discrimination is Minister called at Three Springs when doing a clearly the case already; that is, the value of votes tour of hospitals in the Greenough area and he in country areas. heard a strong case put by the people in the I hope it would not be ungrateful for me to district; the residents of sundry shires. I hope this suggest that the Labor Party would not be has encouraged him to try harder to speed up this expounding its new-found interest in country very necessary project. areas if it had not at last decided to win some It is true that the Donnybrook Hospital is in a country electorates instead of continually very sad state but it is only 25 miles from a larger complaining about how the party is disadvantaged centre. While Three Springs is 100 miles tither by them. north or south of a larger hospital it is 100 miles Having said all this, there are some specific to Geraldton but 200 miles from Perth. matters I would like to raise. The first is the The Government has done well by the people in hostel for the Morawa High School agricultural my province, and new schools have been erected wing. As the Minister is well aware, the advisory at Kalbarri, Coomberdale, Wagrakine, Cervantes committee for that agricultural wing has been and Leeman. trying to establish this on a proper basis; firstly. There, are only a few areas where water is a by proper utilisation of the farm which is attached serious problem. Bindi Bindi has suffered much in to the school; secondly, by adequate programmes the past, although many words have been spoken for the students; and, thirdly, as accommodation about its problems. However, its prospects have for students who live outside the Morawa district. now improved in that it will be supplied with The first of these two objectives are well on the water from the Agaton scheme. People are way to being accomplished, thanks to the advisory pleased the Government has given it priority and committee's work and to an enthusiastic principal. is to make a submission to the Federal As well as this, 19 students are actually housed in Government. The SEC has kept up its a temporary hostel in the town. This is, in fact, programmes and the number of unserviced areas the Western Mining Corporation men's quarters is diminishing. and mess which are rented by the advisory When Geraldton was desperate for assistance committee for $5000 a year. While this, is the programme for provincial cultural centres was satisfactory to a point, it is only a temporary brought forward. A very big effort was made by measure, because the lease is on an annual basis, the Government to assist the building industry in and Western Mining retains the right to the Geraldton and the contact for the Leonora buildings; it will use them again if the iron ore is hospital went to a Geraldton firm. Smaller areas worked in the district in the future. It is also have not been neglected. Both Badgingarra and possible, I suppose, that Western Mining might Eneabba have social centres which, while assisted remove the buildings elsewhere. 634 634COUNCIL]

It is understood that the Education Department was well established. However, if the fine new has committed itself to enlarging the Cunderdin technical school is to serve an area wider than the Agricultural School Hostel, and that there are no Geraldton town itself, obviously there is a need funds currently available for Morawa. But the for accommodation to be provided. Morawa people are seeking acknowledgment of It is well known--certainly in Geraldton-that their agricultural hostel with the understanding Geraldton is a difficult town when it comes to that a building-even a small one-will be finding single accommodation. In addition, a provided in the future, preferably on the farm. number of potential students would be fairly The northern wheatbelt is di -fferent in character young and should not be tossed out to fend for from the area around Cunderdin as far as farming themselves. is concerned. The distance to Cunderdin is The principal of the technical school is keen to considerable and I believe the need for the hostel establish a catering course-a sort of hostel has been established. If a permanent building apprenticeship. He envisages that the hostel were established, then it could be provided with would be run by the catering students. I do not facilities which would allow girls as well as young know whether this is practical, but the advisory men to be accommodated. Already this year three committee and the principal are keen to establish girls have applied, but their applications had to be the new technical school as a local institution with knocked back because the accommodation was its own character, serving the regional interests not adequate. which are agriculture, fishing, and building, and The Morawa people support the project as is as an institution making a distinct contribution to evidenced by the money spent on it and by the the overall technical education of the State. work they have done on it. It is also supported by I understand that it is not possible to undertake the regional advisory committee which is backing a catering course outside Perth. The idea is it strongly. The committee would rather the supported by the regional development committee Morawa project succeed than have all the and deserves to be seriously examined. I hope the facilities centralised in Geraldton. Specifically it Minister will do this. would like the agricultural educational facility to Before I leave the subject of education I would be a regional facility centred at Morawa. like to thank the Minister for the attention he has One could say a great deal about the different given to the Wanneroc High School. It is a source systems of regionalisation and decentralisation, of satisfaction to all associated with it that the but I believe that one way, among others, to middle school will be ready by the second term stabilise the population in rural areas is to provide and that planning is actively in hand for the smaller country towns as well as regional towns fourth stage. I am aware that funding is crucial, with facilities when it can be demonstrated those but in view of the steady increase in the facilities will be used. A school is an industry. It is population of the area as well as the innovative valuable to a country town as an employer, for the nature of the school itself I hope that the money it puts into the community, and as an Wanneroo High School will be high on the attraction to people to use the town as a business priority list for funds. centre. Before dealing with a small personal matter With the adjunct of the hostel, Morawa, which which has been irritating me for some time I has survived the loss of the iron ore, would be in a would like to refer to the speech made by Mr Ron better position to withstand the ups and downs of Leeson in which he dealt with Yeelirrie and the rural industries, and at the same time supply a agreement. He blamed the Government for the real need to the northern area. I hope the fact that the agreement is open-ended. I think he Ministe r for Education will give the matter said that it was misleading and had raised false further consideration and not limit his interest to hopes, but that in any event Esperance ought to Cunderdin. be the port in order to make use of th~e railway. I Still on the question of hostels, I refer to the am not unbiased, because I think Geraldton ought need for a hostel for the Geraldton Technical to be the port. I cannot really find fault with the School. Last week the Minister cautiously Government, because it does not firmly bind answered a question concerning the prospect of Western Mining to one port or another when such the establishment of the hostel. It was not a very a decision might well be against its economic encouraging reply. While it has always been interests. Proposed in a general way that there should be a I have spoken about the matter before, but I hostel for the technical school, it was fair enough say again that Yeelirrie lies in the Greenough to delay its construction until the technical school region and if we mean anything by regionalisation [Tuesday, 24th April, 1979]63 635 then the resources of the region ought to be used That the House at its rising adjourn until to the benefit of the people. On the face of it, it 2.00 p.m. on Thursday, the 26th April. would seem to me to be foolish to take the Question put and passed. resources from one region to another simply in order to subsidise a railway line. In addition the House adjourned at 10.12 p.m. Geraldton port, which has just had a fifth berth added, is extremely capable of handling the QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE shipping which would result from the Veelirrie FUNERAL FUNDS project. The whole port, from the authority itself to those who work on the wharf, is anxious and Legislation and Registration wilting to have this particular trade. 1.The Hon. LYLA ELLIOTT, to the Attorney Like many country members I do a great deal General: of driving, and naturally some of it is at (1) Does legislation exist in this State nighttime. Some time ago, after I had bought a covering the administration of funeral new car, I was embarrassed when the drivers of funds? oncoming cars either refused to dim their (2) If so, what is it? headlights or did so and then raised themn again. (3) Is there any body or department with In due course, I discovered that my headlights whom funeral funds must be registered? were too high and so I had them adjusted. Now I (4) Can the Minister inform me- am not only embarrassed but annoyed that the same thing is occurring and that the lights of (a) how many of these funds exist in oncoming cars are just as bright as before. In this State, many instances this is because their headlights, (b) the names of the funds, like those of my car, are obviously badly adjusted. (c) their assets? This may seem a small matter, but when one is The Hon. 1. G. MEDCALF replied: driving at night and for a long time the situation (1) and (2) There is no legislation in this becomes dangerous. I appeal to the RTA to State dealing particularly with funeral caution motorists in this regard and insist that funds. their headlights be examined. The Friendly Societies Act, 1894-1975, There is one final small matter which slipped permits a society to conduct a funeral my memory before, and it deals with Cabinet's fund for its members. Such societies are policy on air-conditioning of hospital staff subject to the supervisory and audit buildings. I understand from the Minister that it provisions of the Act. is Cabinet's policy not to supply airconditioning to There is also the Superannuation, Sick, staff quarters situated below the 26th parallel. Death, Insurance, Guarantee and This policy applies also in regard to schools, and Endowment (Local Governing Bodies' has caused a lot of anxiety. Nowadays air- Employees) Funds Act, 1947. This Act conditioning has become what one might refer to permits local authorities, boards under as commonplace and therefore it is a great the Parks and Reserves Act, and the mistake on the part of Cabinet to persist with its Road Traffic Authority to establish policy which is far too rigid and does not take into funds of the kind mentioned in the title account the number of places which have trying of the Act. Funeral funds would climates, and the buildings which are perhaps old probably be included. This Act provides and are not built with coolness in mind. that the provisions of the Act under It is important to hospitals that their staff be which the bodies mentioned are happy and therefore Cabinet should reconsider its constituted, relating to the keeping and policy to make it more flexible and suitable to the audit of accounts, shall apply in respect conditions which obtain. of the funds mentioned. I support the motion. (3) Friendly societies are registered under the Friendly Societies Act which come Debate adjourned, on motion by the Hon. W. under the jurisdiction of the Chief M. Piesse. Secretary. Under the Superannuation, Sick, Death, Insurance, Guarantee and Endowment ADJOURNMENT OF THE HOUSE: SPECIAL (Local Governing Bodies' Employees) THE HON. G. C. MacKINNON (South- Funds Act, the bodies mentioned have to West-Leader of the House) [10.11 p.m.]: I be approved by the Governor. move- (4) Not known. 636 636COUNCIL]

ENERGY: SEC (2) Is this criticism warranted? After-hours Services The Hon. 0. C. MacK iNNON replied: 2. The Hon. TOM McNEIL, to the Attorney (1) Yes. General representing the Minister for Fuel (2) No. Having regard for the need to assess and Energy: properly the amount of compensation (1) Is it a fact that the SEC is payable, there have been no undue contemplating alterations to the after- delays. Eleven claims have been received hours services as they currently apply in and of these one has been settled by country areas? purchasing the property, two offers to purchase have been made but have not (2) If so- been accepted, five claims have been (a) What are the benefits to be derived assessed and offers are being prepared, from such alterations? and the remaining three claims are (b) Will consumers be disadvantaged in being examined. any way? It is the Government's policy to expedite (c) Will the SEC running costs be the settlement of claims and if the curtailed if such alterations are honourable member has a specific implemented? complaint it is suggested that he let me The Hon. 1.0G. MEDCALF replied: have details so that the matter can be followed up. (1) The SEC is not contemplating a change in the level of services, but is proposing to change the manner in which the services are provided. ()(a) Primarily, an improvement in efficiency of SEC operations in country areas and an easing of the burden placed on SEC employees in country areas in dealing with after- hours call outs. (b) No. (c) The changes are not expected to have any significant effect on the commission's overall running costs. EDUCATION: SCHOOL

Mt. Tarcoola WATER SUPPLIES: CATCHMENT AREAS 4. The Hon. TOM McNEIL, to the Leader of Land Clearing: the House representing the Minister for Denmark, Kent, and Warren Rivers Works: 3. The Hon. A. A. LEWIS, to the Leader of the Has the landscaping map been prepared House representing the Minister for Works: for the Mt. Tarcoola Primary School in Oeraldton and, if the answer is "Ycs", (1) Is the Minister aware that there is some would the Minister table the document? criticism from landholders affected by clearing controls in the Kent, Warren, The Hon. 0. C. MacKINNON replied: and Denmark Rivers catchments Yes. Plan is tabled. because of the delay in the payment of compensation? The plan was tabled (see paper No. 148). [Tuesday, 24th April, 19791 637

QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

RECREATION Further to my question No. 20 of the, 5th April, 1979, regarding the hearing Youth, Sport and Recreation Committee of objections to mining on Herdsman Lake- 54. The Hon. R. Hetherington (for the Hon. R. F. CLAUGHTON), to the Minister for (1) Was this opportunity given in a Lands representing the Minister for Warden's Court hearing? Recreation: (2) If so, when did this court sit? Will the Minister advise the names of (3) If not, what was the nature of the persons appointed to the Youth, Sport opportunity provided? and Recreation Committee? (4) Will the Minister advise on what date a Warden's Court will sit to The Hon. D. J. WORDSWORTH replied: hear the claim for a mining permit on Herdsman Lake? Mr Henry W, Dettman--Chairman Mr Ron F. Coffey The Hon. 1. G. MEDCALF replied: Professor John Bloomfield Dr Dennis Ladbrook (1) Objections to applications for min- Mrs Pat Barbiett ing tenements on Herdsman Lake Mr John Wood will be heard in the Warden's Mr John Graham. Court on 16th May, 1979. (2) Answered by (1). (3) Not applicable. TRANSPORT: BUS (4) Answered by (1). Mfl': General Administration Expenditure SESQUICENTENNIAL CELEBRATIONS 55. The Hon. F. E. McKENZIE, to the Min- Aboriginal Author's Play ister for Lands representing the Minister for 57. The Hon. R. Hetherington (for the Hon. R. Transport: F. CLAUGHTON), to the Leader of the Referring to question No. 29 on Tues- House: day, the 10th April, 1979, concerning (1) Has the Minister received a request for General Administration Expenditure a grant to allow the play "Kullark" by (Rail) as published in the MTT annual Aboriginal author, Jack Davis, and reports, will the Minister advise how produced by the National Theatre much of the $939 000 labour costs especially for the 150th celebirations, to for the year ended the 30th June, 1977, have its season extended by six days in is attributable to the salary of the Com- response to public demand? missioner of Railways? (2) If so- The Hon. D. J. WORDSWORTH replied: (a) will he advise if the grant has been approved; and As it is not practicable to identify the (b) if not, for what reasons? contribution to the suburban rail pas- senger services by administrative and The other stall indirectly associated with the Hon."0. C. MacKINNON replied: operations, these costs are recovered (1) Yes. from the MTT on the basis of a per- centage loading of 15 per cent applied (2) (a) No; to the directly allocable labour costs, (b) the matter is to be considered by It is therefore not possible to indicate how much of the commissioner's salary the 150th Anniversary Bo~ard. is included in the labour component of the administrative charge. EDUCATION School: Mullaloe Heights 58. The Hon. R. Hetherington (for the Hon. R. F. CLAUGHTON), to the Minister for MINING Lands representing the Minister for Educa- tion: Herdsman Lake: Katanning Holdings (1) Is the Minister aware that no rood has 56. The Hon. R. Hetherington (for the Hon. been constructed to permit parents. R. F. CLAUGHTON), to the Attorney vehicle access to the Mullaloo Heights. General representing the Minister for Mines: primary school? 638 638[COUNCIL]

(2) Will the Minister advise what is causing ing to road construction, cost of services delay in construction of an access road? and the price of the site are expected to be resolved shortly. (3) Will the Minister advise when parents can expect a road to be constructed? ROAD The Hon. D. J. WORDSWORTH replied: Beach Road-Mfarniion A venue Intersection (I) Yes. 60. The Hon. R. Hetherington (for the Hon. R. (2) A sewer main has to be constructed in F. CLAUGHTON), to the Minister for the road reserve before the road is built. Lands representing the Minister for Trans- (3) A temporary access road to the school port: has ben provided already. (1) 'Has the Minister agreed to a design for the intersection of Marmion Avenue and Beach Road that will allow the Shire of Wannerco and the City of LOCAL GOVERNMENT Stirling to complete construction of Wanneroc Shire Beach Road? 59. The Hon. R. Hetherington (for the Hon. (2) 11 not, what are the reasons still delay- Rt. F. CLAUGHTON), to the Attorney ing a decision? General representing the Minister for Urban Development and Town Planning: The Hon. D. J. WORDSWORTH replied: (1) Has a decision been made that will (1) Marmion Avenue and Beach Road are allow transfer to the Shire of Wannerog the responsibility of the local authori- of the site on which its new administra- ties; namely, Stirling City Council and tive building is being constructed? Wanneroo Shire Council. (2) If not, what matters have still to be These authorities have joint responsi- resolved before this decision can be bility for the intersection in question made? and have differing views on how it should be treated. The Hon. 1. G. MEDCALF replied: The alternative designs are now being evaluated by the Metropolitan Region (1) and (2) Negotiations between the Shire of Wannerco and the corporation are Planning Authority. proceeding. Outstanding matters relat- (2) Answered by (1).