FINN IN THE HOUSE Speeches August to December 2017

Published by Bernie Finn MP Member for Western Metropolitan Region Shadow Assistant Minister for Melbourne’s West Shadow Assistant Minister for Autism Spectrum Disorder Shadow Assistant Minister for Electoral Integrity

Suite 101, 19 Lacy Street, Braybrook Vic 3019 Telephone (03) 9317 5900 • Fax (03) 9317 5911 Email [email protected] Web www.berniefinn.com

Authorised and printed by Bernie Finn MP, Suite 101, 19 Lacy Street, Braybrook. This material was funded from the Parliament Electorate Office & Communications Budget. FINN IN THE HOUSE Speeches August to December 2017

CONTENTS Electricity supply...... 3 Minister for Roads and Road Safety...... 22 Children and Justice Legislation Amendment Youth justice centres...... 22 (Youth Justice Reform) Bill 2017...... 3 Gap Road and Horne Street Sunbury...... 22 Buckley Street level crossing...... 4 Opal Seahaven...... 22 Disability Amendment Bill 2017...... 4 Legal services commissioner...... 23 Sentencing Amendment (Sentencing Government performance...... 23 Standards) Bill 2017...... 5 Wyndham preschool services...... 28 Buckley Street, Essendon, level crossing...... 6 Wyndham kindergartens...... 28 Fire Services Bill Select Committee: interim report...... 6 Voluntary Assisted Dying Bill 2017...... 28 Bulla gas supply...... 7 Literacy...... 31 Ravenhall tip odours...... 7 Buckley Street level crossing...... 31 Calder Freeway...... 7 Buckley Street, Essendon, level crossing...... 32 RSPCA Victoria...... 7 Hume Councillor residential arrangements...... 32 Claude Ullin...... 8 Voluntary Assisted Dying Bill 2017...... 32 Australian Labor Party...... 8 Hyde Street, Footscray, scout hall...... 35 City of Wyndham councillor...... 8 Sunbury youth advisory council...... 35 Point Cook Road...... 9 Buckley Street level crossing...... 36 Fire Services Bill Select Committee: final report...... 9 Autism Plus...... 36 City of Wyndham councillor...... 10 Australian Labor Party...... 36 Electorate office budgets...... 10 Williamstown sky rail...... 36 Ravenhall tip health impact...... 10 Voluntary Assisted Dying Bill 2017...... 36 Major Sporting Events Amendment (AF Northcote by-election...... 41 Grand Final Tickets) Bill 2017...... 10 Sunbury medical services...... 41 Australia Day...... 11 Voluntary Assisted Dying Bill 2017...... 41 Hume City Council...... 12 Don Burke...... 46 Traffic gridlock relief...... 12 Sunbury third railway crossing...... 46 Electorate office budgets...... 12 Commercial Passenger Vehicle Industry Wyndham Councillor...... 12 Amendment (Further Reforms) Bill 2017...... 46 Autism services...... 13 Les Twentyman Foundation...... 47 West Gate tunnel commitment...... 13 West Gate tunnel EES anger...... 47 Government performance...... 13 West Gate tunnel project...... 48 Fire Services Bill Select Committee: final report...... 17 2017...... 48 Doctors in Secondary Schools...... 17 Sunbury Road congestion...... 48 Richmond Football Club...... 18 Crimes Legislation Amendment (Protection of Vietnamese community...... 18 Emergency Workers and Others) Bill 2017...... 48 Richmond Football Club...... 18 Graffiti...... 49 Environment Protection Bill 2017...... 18 Reference...... 50 Tullamarine Freeway congestion...... 19 Hume City Council...... 51 Sunbury Road upgrade...... 19 Transport Legislation Amendment (Road Safety, Children, Youth and Families Amendment Rail and Other Matters) Bill 2017...... 51 (Youth Offenders) Bill 2016...... 19 West Gate tunnel motorists’ tax...... 53 Jacksons Hill Sunbury...... 20 Drugs, Poisons and Controlled Substances Williamstown level crossings...... 20 Amendment (Medically Supervised Injecting Williamstown sky rail...... 21 Centre) Bill 2017...... 53 West Gate Tunnel project...... 21 Domestic Animals Amendment (Puppy Farms CityLink-Tullamarine Freeway widening...... 21 and Pet Shops) Bill 2016...... 54 Sunbury development...... 21 Hoppers Crossing level crossing...... 55 VicForests operations...... 21 Victoria University Sunbury site...... 55

Suite 101, 19 Lacy Street, Braybrook Vic 3019 • Telephone (03) 9317 5900 • Fax (03) 9317 5911 Email [email protected] • Web www.berniefinn.com

IN 2 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE COUNCIL | Members statements what we have seen — the youth riots, the must not have been an election coming up; 08 August 2017 destruction of Parkville, the breakouts at that is the only thing that you can say to Malmsbury — has all happened on her explain there being not one Labor member shift. There is no denying that, and she in that huge crowd that engulfed the centre surely cannot deny that with any credibility of Werribee earlier this year. As I say, the Electricity supply — not that she has got a great deal anyway. minister did not show and she was not on Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) We heard Mr Melhem finish off with a her own. — Victoria is blessed with vast natural flare. I think it was a flare. He told us how We have had this situation where resources. For our state to be facing an much money the Andrews government without consulting anybody the energy crisis is nothing short of criminal. was spending on this particular matter, and government went out and announced Skyrocketing power bills make the lives I thought to myself, ‘Where have I heard that this youth jail was going to be put of working families a misery, and many this before? Where have I heard a Labor in Werribee South. This outraged the pensioners and low-income earners government get up and tell us how much community, but despite the fact that Mr cannot afford to heat their homes in the they are spending?’. What they never tell Pallas said on a number of occasions that coldest winter we have experienced in us is the results they are getting. That is he did not particularly care about what the some years. Some are spending most of the my judgement. I judge on how effectively locals thought — nor would he because he day in bed just to keep warm. a dollar is spent and on the result that it does not live in Werribee or anywhere near This is a national scandal. We used to gets, not on how many dollars you actually Werribee — the government had to turn be the home of cheap, plentiful electricity. spend. around and do a backflip. The government It gave Victoria the edge in industry and We just have to go back to earlier this had to do a backflip. produced jobs for hundreds of thousands. year when Minister Mikakos announced Ms Mikakos — On a point of order, Sadly, this is no more. I have to say I a new youth justice centre for Victoria. I Acting President, whilst we have heard commend my federal colleague Senator vividly remember the day I heard about this speech from Mr Finn before and he is Jane Hume on the work she is doing to this because I was contacted by a number seeking to make false claims about what ensure we properly utilise our natural of people in my electorate who said, the Treasurer has said in the past, these resources. ‘They’ve announced a youth justice centre. matters do not relate to the subject matter Victorians are suffering when they need You’ll never guess where’. I said, ‘Well, of the bill in any way. I ask you to direct the not do so. The imminent blackouts need I would assume it would be down near member to come back to the contents of not occur. If only the Andrews government Bacchus Marsh Road, where the current the bill. That might be a first for Mr Finn, had not shackled itself to an extremist prisons are, or up near Ravenhall’. There to actually talk about a bill or the contents hard-left green agenda. The great irony is are a number of places around where of a bill. that many Victorians are freezing to stop you could have a jail and where it would Mr FINN — On the point of order, something that does not actually exist. make sense. But they said, ‘No, you will Acting President, whilst I can understand There are quite a few of us who would kill not believe this’, and fair dinkum I did the minister’s discomfort with what I for some global warming just about now. not, and I still have trouble believing it: am saying, the fact is I am relating my This is a heartless government that this government decided to put a youth comments directly to the contents of the puts its hardline leftist ideology ahead jail in Werribee South — next to Point bill because if it were not for what they had of the needs of Victorians. It is a cruel Cook, next to housing, next to the tourism done earlier this year, this bill would not be government, and Victoria deserves precinct that is the highlight of the City necessary. better — much better. A Matthew Guy of Wyndham and right next to the new The ACTING PRESIDENT (Ms Patten) government will deliver it in spades. development in Werribee South. This is — Thank you, Mr Finn. If you would like just absolutely staggering. to continue your contribution with some I think I took more calls that day than I mention of the bill, that would be great. COUNCIL | Second reading have taken on any day that I have been in 08 August 2017 Mr FINN — This bill is the Children this house. I took hundreds of calls. People and Justice Legislation Amendment were outraged. Ms Crozier and I attended (Youth Justice Reform) Bill 2017. As I was a huge rally in Werribee just a few days saying, the government did not care what Children and later; I think it was less than a week later. happened in Werribee. I sat in question The uprising among the local populace time in the other place day after day was instantaneous. There was fury, be they watching as the Treasurer laughed and Justice Legislation Liberal voters, Labor voters or even Greens cackled away while his constituents were voters — we have got a couple down there. outraged at what was going on. It was Amendment (Youth They all came together in fury against the a total disregard for what the people of minister’s decision. Unfortunately on this Werribee thought, but in the end even the Justice Reform) Bill occasion the minister was unable to join Premier, the man they call Despot Dan, us, and that disappointed the 7000 or 8000 had to back down. Even he had to back 2017 people who had gathered in the centre of down and do a backflip. Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — In Werribee on a cold and wet Tuesday night, as I recall. Ms Shing — On a point of order, Acting rising to speak on the Children and Justice President, much as I am enjoying Mr Legislation Amendment (Youth Justice An honourable member interjected. Finn’s commentary, I think that the term Reform) Bill 2017 I am tempted to give a Mr FINN — It is very, very interesting he has used to describe the Premier is prize for the question that has been asked that I am asked that question, because unparliamentary. I would seek that he the most in 2017. I would suggest that the the fact of the matter is there was not one withdraw it. winner of that prize would be the person single Labor member of Parliament there, The ACTING PRESIDENT (Ms Patten) who has asked the question the most, ‘How despite the Labor Party representing that — Members must refer to the Premier by does Jenny Mikakos keep her job?’. That is entire area. the right title, so I would ask Mr Finn to the one question that has been asked of me Honourable members interjecting. withdraw. time and time again. As this government Mr FINN — No, Mr Pallas was not there. just moves from one stuff-up to another, Mr FINN — I am happy to withdraw. Mr Languiller from the Assembly was not I apologise. I have been listening to the minister for pizza and Coke keeps her there; in fact we are not sure where Mr job. We on this side of the house, or indeed my constituents again, and that is Languiller was just at that time. We know unfortunately what they call him. I have anyone anywhere else in the state, cannot where Mr Nardella from the Assembly was. understand how she keeps her job. I could got to stop doing that. I have got to be more And of course Ms Hennessy was missing — like members opposite and not listen to my make some assumptions — I could make I was going to say ‘in action’ but it is more them publicly here today — but they might constituents at all. That would be more like missing in inaction in her particular case. we have come to expect. be highly unparliamentary, and that is not Mr Melhem has gone, which is very sad. something that I would wish to be involved We now have, after the outrage of earlier Mr Melhem was not there. Mr Eideh was this year, a youth detention centre being in. not there — he was probably nicking out It really is quite extraordinary that over built somewhere. Apparently at some stage to get a visa. It was quite extraordinary that Dick Wynne, the Minister for Planning, two and a half years after this government you had thousands and thousands of local came to office Minister Mikakos over will give it — well, he might or he might people in Werribee and the Labor Party not depending on what is discovered down there still refuses to take responsibility was not interested in talking to them. There for her job. She refuses to accept that there. I understand there are a number of

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 3 things down there that will prevent it from for Public Transport. I refer the minister be extremely difficult at times. They love being built at Cherry Creek. to the ongoing public outrage about the him nonetheless. Irrespective of what he Ms Crozier interjected. government’s flawed plan to dig a dirty, does to them and irrespective of how he Mr FINN — There are a number of great ditch under the railway line at acts, they love him nonetheless. In fact I environmental and Aboriginal heritage Buckley Street in Essendon. On 6 June think sometimes the more he acts up, the issues that again the minister and the this year the member for Essendon in the more they love him. I am not sure how government are not particularly concerned Assembly told the other place that John that works, because it is a challenge to me about. Holland and KBR had been awarded the at times, I have to tell you. Certainly they The bill is I suppose some indication contract to remove the Buckley Street level meet the challenge that they face on a daily that after almost three years in office the crossing. Revelations since then indicate basis almost with a degree of joy. government is taking some responsibility, that that might not be strictly correct. Will I cannot begin to tell you how proud I because what we have seen over the last the minister clarify the contractual position am of them. A 19-year-old, who should be two and a half years is a remarkable, for this level crossing removal? out having the time of her life, is totally and dramatic and disturbing increase in the absolutely committed to her 16-year-old number of young people involved in crime COUNCIL | Second reading brother with severe autism — totally and in this state. Representing the western 08 August 2017 absolutely committed. God help anybody suburbs and coming from that area, I who even suggests that institutionalisation have seen that far too often. I have seen might be some solution to the problems my constituents, indeed many of them that we face, because that is when the Finn quite often young people, who have been Disability would really fire up. That is not a pretty assaulted, who have been robbed by sight, as I am sure some in this house other young people. That is deeply, deeply might attest to. His younger sisters are just distressing. You have got to wonder what Amendment Bill as committed to him. When I consider hope some of these young people who are some of the injuries that he has caused engaged in these sorts of activities have. It 2017 to each of them at some stage, it makes it Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) even more extraordinary. is my very strong desire that anybody who — In rising to speak on the Disability arranges for a child to commit a crime — Amendment Bill 2017 I have to tell the I use my family not to blow up my own as is happening with home invasions and house that I was one of those members of tyres but to hold them up as an example of car thefts and car hijackings — and those the Family and Community Development families right across the state. I see them adults involved in that process feel the full Committee who sat through the hearings, all the time, and they amaze me. As I have brunt of the law. Indeed it would be my held predominantly last year, that led to said in this house before, I leave some very, very strong wish that they not see the this bill today. That was pretty harrowing, places and I am almost skipping with joy, light of day again for a very, very long time, I have to say. It shocked me to my very which again is not a pleasant sight. It is but unfortunately our magistrates and core. I had absolutely no idea that such gives me such heart that there are such judges — some of them, anyway — might dreadful things were happening to the wonderful people around who do such have other ideas on that subject. That is a most vulnerable people in our state. It tremendous work not just with their own matter for another day. shocked me, it disgusted me, it appalled families but with others as well. The people of Victoria have had enough me and a lot of times it deeply, deeply One group that I visited recently was of what this government has done with distressed me, so I am very, very pleased Spectrum Journeys out in Chirnside youth justice. I know the people in my to see this bill here today. We have to say to Park. I had never been to Chirnside Park electorate have well and truly had enough. the community as a Parliament — not just before; it was a new experience for me. They have had more than a gutful of what as a government, not just as an opposition But I went out there, and I visited them this government has allowed to occur over — that we have zero tolerance for abuse. with Kate Johnson and a group of young the past three years. They are concerned It is beyond my comprehension how women, most of whom are parents of about the sort of money that is going to anybody could do some of the things children with autism themselves. They be used to pay for the Parkville rebuilding that we heard about during the course of were working their tails off to help others, — it is rebuilding, really, is it not? It is the inquiry, how somebody could treat giving up their time and giving up their rebuilding at Parkville. largely defenceless people in the way that resources. Everything that they do they Ms Crozier — They trashed it. they were treated. It was and it is — you fund themselves. It is just amazing. They Mr FINN — They have, as Ms Crozier would like to think it is not happening are just typical of so many people across says. It has been trashed and the anymore, but I doubt it — bullying to the this state that I am so proud to say I have government has allowed it to be trashed — nth degree as to what is happening and met and seen in action. There is a lot of plus side to the disability sector. I hate that Ms Crozier — Multiple times. what has happened. I cannot fathom how we can treat anybody in this situation as a word ‘sector’, but I will use it. Mr FINN — Multiple times — and we Ms Shing — Community. have had multiple youth riots in both second-class citizen, and that is what has Parkville and Malmsbury. And who could happened over the years far, far too often. Mr FINN — The community, thank you. ever forget the day we had the big breakout Just because somebody has a disability I knew Ms Shing would come in handy one at Malmsbury and they took off up the does not take away any of their humanity. day, and she has. She has come up with a Calder Freeway heading towards Bendigo? Just because somebody has a disability good word, so I thank her for that. They went everywhere — it was a pretty does not mean they are any less important As I say, there are so many good things scary time for a good number of people than anybody else. happening, but I know there are also so in that area. You would hope that one day I have spent a fair bit of time with the many bad things that are happening. It is this minister might actually do her job and disability sector, if I could use that term — sad. As I read this legislation and pick it get this system under control. She might it sounds a bit impersonal — and certainly up — you know, we have got 60 pages in actually like to take some responsibility for with people with disabilities in my own this bill — it is sad that we actually need the job that she has. She is not there just to family and in other families that are close it. It is sad that we would have to have a fill a spot — apparently — but she needs to me and, more recently, with families disability services commissioner to protect to do her job, and I ask her to at some across the state that I have gone to meet as those who need protection. Unfortunately stage consider doing that, because Victoria shadow parliamentary secretary for autism there are some people around who — I deserves better than what we are getting spectrum disorder. It is both uplifting and nearly used a word which would have had now. distressing, because you see the distress me rebuked most severely — are not very that can be caused by the disability pleasant and are not very fair. They do involved but at the same time you see the show the side of humanity that we all wish COUNCIL | Constituency questions extraordinary courage, the extraordinary did not exist. This might be the basis of 08 August 2017 strength and the inspiration that parents another speech that I make on another bill and family members show in looking after later this year. children, and sometimes adults, with I absolutely support this bill. It might disabilities. not go as far, as has been said, as I would Buckley Street level I know in my own family — and they like, but it is a damn good start. Certainly will hate me for saying this — my three it gives me enormous satisfaction. Having crossing girls are just the most extraordinary people spent most of last year working on this Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My that I think God ever put breath into for report for the Family and Community constituency question is to the Minister what they do with their brother, who can Development Committee, it is great to

IN 4 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE know that it has not been taken and used I support the bill and I wish it a speedy robbed, are having their homes invaded, as a doorstop somewhere as so many passage. where people cannot even get public committee reports are prone to do. I am Ms Shing — Hear, hear, Mr Finn! transport without fear of being bashed and sure there is a room somewhere. I am not Mr FINN — Can we get that in Hansard? robbed. sure whether it is in this building or in 1 Ms Shing — On a point of order, Acting Victoria at the moment is not a safe place Treasury Place, or it might even happen President, can I put on the record my to be, and that is the sad fact of the matter. to have its own building — it might need gratitude for Mr Finn’s acknowledgement The government finally accepted that we its own building in fact — where there are that I have in fact managed to contribute have a problem and they decided that parliamentary reports upon parliamentary something positive to the chamber and they were going to put some police on the reports just piled up. They were put in endorse the views that Mr Finn has streets, but it is going to be some three or there, have never been seen since and will expressed today in his contribution — four years before we get the full number of never be seen again. But I am very pleased another first, perhaps, for this place. police that the government has promised. that the report we put together last year The ACTING PRESIDENT (Ms Dunn) So what is going to happen on our streets has gone a significant way to contributing in the next three or four years? You fear to this legislation here today. — Thank you, Ms Shing. You would be well aware that is not a point of order, but to think given what has happened over I commend this bill, and I sincerely hope probably Hansard has picked up every the past two and a half years, given what that it sends a message to every person single word you have just said. has happened to people who cannot even with a disability in this state and to every drive their own cars. Two and a half, three carer in this state. The carers, let us face years ago who ever heard of carjackings in it, are just critical. Without the carers we COUNCIL | Second reading this state? They were as rare as hen’s teeth, would have no hope of looking after the 08 August 2017 to use an old term. The fact of the matter is numbers of people that are looked after. now they are very much on the books for I am hoping that this legislation and the consideration by anybody who is driving fact that both sides are supporting the through any toffy suburb. legislation — all sides in fact — will send Sentencing I recall earlier this year I was invited a — to speak at the Toorak branch of the Dr Carling-Jenkins — Thank you. Amendment Liberal Party. This was not something that Mr FINN — I see Dr Carling-Jenkins happened every day, it has to be said, and I from the Australian Conservatives is (Sentencing would suggest it probably will not happen supporting the bill. I think that is a again either. When I got into my car marvellous thing in her first vote as an Standards) Bill 2017 afterwards and I was driving home through Australian Conservatives MP. I think that is Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Malvern, I made the point of actually a marvellous message to send — that she The Sentencing Amendment (Sentencing locking my doors because it is places like too supports those people with disabilities Standards) Bill 2017 is I suppose an Malvern where some of these groups — to the carers, to the families and to attempt by the government to do gather who like to pinch cars. Whilst I was those who do really, really care about something about a real problem that we only driving a humble Ford, it is a relatively people with a disability. As I said before, have in this state, and that problem is a late model Ford, which many of us in this we can concentrate a little bit too much lack of confidence among the general house have. I thought to myself, ‘You can’t sometimes on people who possibly should community in our legal system. I say take any chances in the state anymore’. You be strangled but we do not highlight the advisedly the legal system, because there cannot take any chances in Melbourne, extraordinary work, the amazing spirit, has not been in this state for many years and you certainly cannot take any chances the stamina — call it what you will — of so a justice system. And the bloke who in a place like Malvern, where the socially many people across Victoria and across destroyed the justice system in this state unfortunate may gather to pinch your Australia who spend their lives, commit is a former Labor Attorney-General, Rob car, to actually drive you off the road or their lives to, helping others with disability. Hulls, who for 11 years appointed his to bump you as you are driving along and We saw just this week with the death of mates, his cronies and civil libertarian allow you to become disarmed so they Betty Cuthbert — an extraordinary woman types to the benches of the various courts can actually take your car. Can you believe who spent most of her latter years in a throughout Victoria. that is happening in Victoria in 2017? But wheelchair because of multiple sclerosis That has given us a system in which it is; it is a fact of life. It is happening all — that she had a friend over in Perth who we can say with absolute confidence that too regularly, and it is happening directly was just committed to looking after her the justice is just about dead in this state. as a result of the policies of a government whole time. That is going on everywhere, People talk about the pub test. If you go which is soft on crime and soft on and if there is one thing more I would like into any pub anywhere across Victoria criminals. to see than this legislation, it is perhaps and raise the issue of our court system, of As I said, Mr Rich-Phillips has circulated more support for carers, who are largely our ‘justice system’, then people will laugh a number of proposed amendments, and selfless. I have seen so many of them who you out of the place. The people out on the those amendments will make the bill give up any personal aspirations, who give ground know that the last place they ever substantially stronger. There are also some up their own social life, who sometimes want to go near is a court, because they proposed amendments from our friends give up their own personal space to help know that justice is such a rarity in one of the Greens — from Ms Pennicuik. I do not somebody else. That is probably the those places. It is usually a result of the fact wish to labour the point here, if I can use ultimate thing that anyone can do, and I that Rob Hulls was the Attorney-General that term, but we have to point out, and really think that we as a Parliament and for those 11 years and made appointments I am sure most people in this house and whoever is in government should provide which may have perplexed some, but given most people in the state would accept more support for those carers. I am not just that they were made very much in his this, that if there is one group of people talking about throwing bags of money at image, it is not surprising that we have the who are even softer and weaker on crime people, although that is handy; I think we result that we do today. than the Labor Party, it would be the need to tell them that they are appreciated We have this bill before the house Greens. We have a set of amendments — and in various ways show them that that and we also have some amendments 14 amendments from the Greens — and appreciation is very, very real and that we from Mr Rich-Phillips. I have to say the those amendments would largely make the encourage them in the work that they do. amendments that he has put forward bill useless. If you are going to pass these I take this opportunity to publicly pay will strengthen this bill, and this bill does amendments, why you would even bother tribute to them today and to give them a need strengthening. It significantly needs putting the bill up? The Greens proposed huge thankyou for the work that they do, strengthening because this bill is coming amendments would make the bill next to because without them, as I said earlier, from a government that is soft on crime. useless. It is not great now, but it would be there is no way that those people with Soft on crime, soft on criminals — that next to useless if the Greens amendments disabilities could be properly looked after is what we have come to expect from the were carried. I can assure you that is not or looked after anywhere near as well as Labor Party, and not just this government something we on the side of the house are they are. So I pay tribute to those carers but Labor governments over the years. keen to see happen. and those families who do put in so much They have shown themselves to be soft on A little earlier Mr Ondarchie was talking hard work and effort to ensure that their crime in so many ways, and that has led to about Mr Guy’s policy of a zero tolerance family members or those in their care what we see in this state at the moment as approach to crime. I have been banging are well looked after. Acting President, a crime tsunami, where people are being on about this for how long now? How long bashed in their own homes, are being

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 5 have I been in here? It is a bit more than 12 up with them anymore. We need to send of traffic congestion and problems to the years. a message to criminals, whether they are nearby education precinct as well with a Mr Ondarchie interjected. thieves — whatever they might be — that number of very prominent schools there. Mr FINN — He was; indeed. For a long they will not be tolerated; firstly, they will Confusion has been added to the outrage. time now I have been talking about zero be caught by the police, and secondly, they Mr Jennings — Insult to injury? tolerance. In fact I think in my maiden will be dealt with by the courts in a severe Mr FINN — It is insult to injury indeed. speech to this house — sorry if I am being manner. Mr Jennings — I thought I’d help you. un-PC in referring to a maiden speech — I At this moment what we have seen far Mr FINN — I need a bit of help just spoke about a zero tolerance approach too often is the police doing their job and at the minute; it has been a long day. to crime then. From my perspective it catching these crims. The police take the The member for Essendon in the other is wonderful to see the next Premier of crim to court, and the next thing you know place, Mr Danny Pearson, on 6 June told Victoria talking about what his government they are out on bail and are committing the the other place that the contract for this is going to do after the election next year same crime again that night. I know what particular project had been signed. We to ensure that we do have a zero tolerance it does to the police. It devastates them. I all assumed that was the case, given that approach to crime, because that is what spoke to a number of police who just feel we assume Mr Pearson is a man of high the Victorian people want. Wherever you like giving up because, as they have said honour. Unfortunately it appears, given go — and I travel around a fair bit talking to to me, ‘We’re doing our job, we’re holding that there has been some study and FOI a lot of people — the biggest issue for many up our end, but we get it to court and they process looking at this since, that that is people is crime. It does not matter whether just let them go’. If I hear once more about not actually the case. It would seem to not you are in the city or the regional towns in a criminal who has committed some sort of be the case. This is where the confusion the country, it is something that people are heinous act who is out on bail, I think I am comes in: we have a member of Parliament deeply concerned about. going to scream. who was saying that the contract has been I can fully understand that because I You can almost put the house on it that signed, but we have FOI information hear about people being bashed in their when you are driving around listening and other information coming from the own homes. Can you imagine what it to the radio, the news will come on and minister’s office that tells us that the would be like being in bed at 4.30 in the somebody will have done something contract has not been signed. So you can morning, dead to the world, and the next dreadful, and the next line is, ‘And they understand why people in the Essendon thing you know your front door is being were out on bail’. What is going on in area are totally confused. They are not just kicked in and you have a mob of hooligans this state when that happens? We had a confused, they are totally bamboozled, to running through your house screaming situation last week where a bloke who was tell you the truth. at the top of their voices, threatening you out on bail committed an act, and he was I think it is only fair to them, given that with assorted weapons — with knives, with actually on bail because he had committed this project will have such a huge impact axes, maybe with guns? The next thing you a breach against his bail. That is just on their daily lives — it will wreck the know they have beaten you up and they extraordinary stuff — just amazing. Is it any centre of Essendon as we know it — that have taken your car keys and your car. Can wonder that in desperation people have they be given a straight answer. So I am anybody imagine what that would do to just given up on our legal system? I think asking the minister to provide information the average person? What would that do to that is a major challenge that faces the next on the status of the contract and, if it has members if that happened to them in their government. not been signed, to provide information on own homes? We must restore the faith of the public when she expects that signing to occur. Very recently I spoke to people in my in our legal system, and we must make own electorate who have actually sold up our legal system a justice system. We must and moved to get away from the house make it a system where people go and they COUNCIL | Statements on reports where this had happened to them, because get justice, whether they be criminals or and papers, 09 August 2017 they could not be there anymore. It would whether they be victims. Whoever goes have such a devastating psychological to those courts must expect and must impact that really it would take some get justice. At the moment that is not considerable time to recover from. I note happening. I do not think this bill will do Fire Services Bill that whilst there is some support available too much to assist that, but I am hoping for victims of crime, it would go nowhere that the amendments put forward by Mr Select Committee: near what is needed to recover from such a Rich-Phillips will pass and we will indeed traumatic and horrific experience. be able to make this bill a little bit stronger. interim report One incident that I have raised in the I sincerely hope that we can change the Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — house before, and one that haunts me situation in Victoria, and I know that Thank you, Mr Acting President. I too continually, is the story of a young lad, Matthew Guy will do that when he is congratulate you on your appointment, a 16-year-old, who has autism. He was Premier. and I wish you all the very best and hope catching the bus in Tarneit; he had gained that you have a long and successful term a degree of independence for himself. I COUNCIL | Adjournment as Acting President. The report that I know for a fact that for a kid with autism, 08 August 2017 wish to address today is the interim gaining independence is a pretty exciting report of the Fire Services Bill Select thing; it is something to celebrate. But on Committee inquiry into the Firefighters’ this occasion he was attacked by a gang Presumptive Rights Compensation and on the bus. He was bashed and he was Buckley Street, Fire Services Legislation Amendment robbed. Not only was he robbed of his (Reform) Bill 2017. This has been a fairly phone and his money, but he was robbed interesting report to my way of thinking, of his independence as well. He was Essendon, level predominantly made up of transcript, robbed of his self-esteem, he was robbed of it has to be said, but it is still a very his confidence, and since that occasion he crossing interesting report, because a couple of Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I matters that sprang to my attention and has not been able to do the sorts of things wish to raise a matter for the attention that he had been building up to. have been of great interest to me over an of the Minister for Public Transport, and extended period of time have been firstly When we talk about these heinous it concerns her plan to basically destroy crimes, it is not just a matter of a car the — the centre of Essendon with a dirty great Mr Leane interjected. being pinched or a phone being stolen or ditch which her government is preparing a television or whatever. We are talking to build under the railway line at Buckley Mr FINN — I am not Jack Rush, Mr about real and devastating impacts on Street in Essendon. There is a great deal of Leane. Calm down, you are not talking to people. We are talking about incidents public outrage about this, and I may have Jack Rush now. The culture of the Country that people do not recover from for a expressed this in this house from time to Fire Authority (CFA) is something that I very long time — if they ever recover at time. hold very dear. It is something that is not just important to the CFA: it is important to all. That is what we need to stomp on. We Mr Jennings interjected. need to stomp on these criminals who country Victoria and indeed it is important are committing these acts. The situation Mr FINN — Well, Minister, it is going to Australia. My father was in the CFA and that we have in this state at the moment is under. It will destroy the centre of my grandfather was in the CFA. We go desperate. We need to send a message to Essendon. It will destroy Rose Street as a back some generations in the CFA, so it is criminals in this state that we will not put shopping precinct, and it will cause no end something that I do hold very dear.

IN 6 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE It was interesting reading the transcript COUNCIL | Adjournment COUNCIL | Adjournment of the hearing of Mr Andrew Ford, the chief 09 August 2017 10 August 2017 executive officer of Volunteer Fire Brigades Victoria. He said: The culture that we talk about is a culture that recognises, values and empowers Bulla gas supply Calder Freeway in this case volunteers, or paid people, Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I based on their training, based on their wish to raise a matter tonight for the wish to raise a matter for the attention of experience, based on their proficiency Minister for Energy, Environment and the Minister for Roads and Road Safety, regardless of their pay status. That is Climate Change, and it concerns an issue and it concerns representations I have number one — to treat people equally based on what they can do, not their that I have had a great deal of interest in received recently from the Calder Action pay status. The other important cultural for a number of years now, and that is the Group, which is a group of people who aspect in CFA is one of empowering and issue of natural gas, or indeed the lack have gotten together over a period of time supporting people to do their work, not thereof, in the township of Bulla. Bulla and campaigned for improvements to the just dictating, controlling and monitoring. is a small community halfway between Calder Freeway — improvements we most Mr Morris — He was talking about the airport and Sunbury — in fact it is 5 certainly need. Marshall. minutes from the airport, which makes The increasing population in Sunbury Mr FINN — I think he might have been it even more extraordinary that this little and the increasing population in the talking about Mr Marshall. We will get township has no connection to natural surrounds of Hillside and places such to Mr Marshall in a minute if I have got gas. We look around the state and we see as that have meant that the traffic levels enough time. Mr Ford said: natural gas being connected to a whole have also risen significantly. It is not range of towns — some hundreds and unusual at all to see huge numbers of cars The other important part of CFA’s culture perhaps even thousands of miles from is it is not an agency that simply delivers banked back, trying to get off the Calder services to the community; it is an agency Melbourne — but here we are 5 minutes at Calder Park Drive. Indeed it can be embedded in the community, working from the airport and Bulla is still on the gas quite dangerous, particularly on a wet day, with the community, building community canisters, and of course that is extremely sailing along up the Calder; you might sail capability to share responsibility for their expensive. It has to be said that this year up the back of a car that has stopped to get own safety. That is a big description of the has been a particularly cold winter — there off at that particular road. culture, but it is important. is no global warming in Bulla, I can assure Calder Park Drive was not much more What is just as important as that is the you — and as a result of that the amount than a goat track in days not all that fact that we have a government in this of gas that has been used has been quite long ago, but it is now one of the main state, a Premier in particular, who has set extreme, if I can use the term that is used thoroughfares of a booming part of the out to destroy that culture and indeed by some others. western suburbs. It is, I think, worth giving to destroy the CFA as we know it. I have I have noticed in recent times that Cr some consideration to an overpass at this watched with astonishment over the last Jack Medcraft, a councillor who represents particular road, Calder Park Drive. Calder two years as Premier Daniel Andrews the Bulla area on Hume City Council, has Park Drive is of course right next to the has gone about his war on the volunteer come out in support of connecting Bulla to Thunderdome, as we lovingly know it, and firefighters in this state. It is something natural gas, and I very much welcome that that adds to the pressure on it when there that, I have to say, leaves me cold but also because, as I think I have said before, it is are gatherings at that particular venue. leaves me perplexed to say the very least. long overdue. In 2017 to have a community As things stand at the moment, the And I have to ask the question: what does so close to Melbourne not connected to population continues to grow at a rapid Mr Marshall from the United Firefighters natural gas is extraordinary. It is something rate, and the traffic levels are making it Union (UFU) have on the Premier? that most Victorians take for granted; they not just difficult but very dangerous for Because it seems that whatever Mr just assume that that is their entitlement, motorists on the Calder Freeway and on Marshall wants, Mr Marshall gets from this but unfortunately it is not for the good Calder Park Drive to access that part of the Premier, and I think we are finding in this people of Bulla, and I must declare my western suburbs, where many of them live. report that that is exactly the case indeed. interest here: I am one of them, and I know I ask the minister to have a look at the It is interesting that Mr Ford says, ‘That how much we have to spend just to keep traffic numbers, to have a look at the culture is founded on respect’. That is the warm in winter. I am asking the minister problems that have been created as a last thing that the Premier is offering the to take this on board and to give her full result of a population increase without an volunteer firefighters of Victoria. They have support to the connection of natural gas infrastructure increase and to give some received absolutely no respect at all from to Bulla asap. As I say, it is long overdue. very serious consideration to what can be this Premier during the course of what has I welcome Cr Medcraft’s support for this done to build an overpass at Calder Park been a diabolical war against volunteer ongoing campaign, and I am very, very Drive. I have no doubt that if he were to firefighters. They have received absolutely hopeful that this campaign will very soon give that the serious and due consideration no respect at all from a Premier who come to an end with the connection of that is needed, he would come to the view, should know better, given his background, gas to Bulla. There will be great rejoicing as have my constituents in the Calder but clearly there are other things at play in the streets, I can assure you, and the Action Group, that a Calder Park Drive here, and clearly there is some reason that government would be welcomed warmly overpass is needed. Mr Andrews owes Mr Marshall. if indeed they were to facilitate the We can assume that that may have connection of gas to Bulla. something to do with the last state election COUNCIL | Economy and Infrastruc- campaign, when members of the UFU COUNCIL | Constituency questions ture Standing C’tee, 22 August 2017 were very active indeed. Many of them 10 August 2017 were actually bullying people at the polling booth and — Mrs Peulich — It is the Labor way. RSPCA Victoria Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) Mr FINN — It is the Labor way, Mrs Ravenhall tip odours presented report, including appendices Peulich, and we are now seeing the Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My and extract of proceedings, together with government paying them back and again constituency question is to the Minister for transcripts of evidence. the Labor way on display. I think it is a Energy, Environment and Climate Change. tragedy for Victoria that we are seeing this It has come to my attention that Cleanaway Laid on table. war on volunteer firefighters, and I look has been letterboxing residents in Caroline Ordered that report be published. forward to seeing the final report when it is Springs, Deer Park and the surrounds of Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I presented. the Ravenhall tip urging locals to report move: odours to that company instead of to the That the Council take note of the report. Environment Protection Authority Victoria. In moving to take note of this I ask the minister: what is the government’s particular report from the Economy and policy on this company attempting to Infrastructure Committee, I would like subvert a system designed to protect to thank my fellow committee members my constituents from foul smells from for their very enthusiastic contributions Cleanaway’s stinking tip? to this committee report. I would like to thank Mr Gepp, who is a new member to

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 7 the committee. It is his first report, and My great concern is that the charges I congratulate him on that. I also thank COUNCIL | Members statements relate directly to his role as a councillor. Mr Bourman, who was an enthusiastic 22 August 2017 Many, many community members have and wise contributor to the committee come to me and suggested very strongly proceedings; Mr Eideh; Mr Nazih Elasmar, that he step aside until these legal matters who — well, he was there a minute ago are resolved, and I agree. Cr Khan should but he is not anymore; Ms Hartland; Mr Claude Ullin step aside from the council responsibilities Shaun Leane, whose inimitable style Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I pending the court case. This, as I say, contributed to the report no end; and Mr join with Ms Fitzherbert in paying tribute reflects not his guilt nor his innocence Luke O’Sullivan and Mr Craig Ondarchie to Claude Ullin, and there would be many but just the fact that these charges relate for their very important contributions. people associated with the Richmond directly to his role as a councillor on I should also, perhaps more importantly, Football Club in particular who will be very Wyndham City Council. thank the committee staff. Lilian Topic, saddened by his passing. Ms Pulford — On a point of order, who I have spoken of in the past in President, the matter that Mr Finn is relation to other reports, is a very keen raising is a matter before the courts. It taskmaster. She ensures that things are COUNCIL | Members statements is a matter that relates to an individual done properly at all times, and God help 22 August 2017 councillor, and I would have thought that anybody who does not. Matt Newington, at the least it is beyond the normal rules of the inquiry officer, has done a marvellous the adjournment debate. job in putting the wording of much of this Mr FINN — On the point of order, together. Also, Caitlin Grover, who is the Australian Labor President, I had not actually got to my research officer of the committee, I thank request. As I said, I have absolutely no very much for the work that she has done Party intention of interfering with the court before. Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Einstein is credited with giving the case, and I have said quite clearly that Cr Animal cruelty is something that I am definition of insanity as doing the same Khan has a right to the presumption of sure every member of the house finds thing the same way over and over again innocence, as we all do. What I am asking abhorrent. It was of particular importance and expecting a different result. If that is the minister to do has absolutely nothing that this inquiry go ahead because there so, members of the ALP in Melbourne’s to do with the court case but indeed his had been some concerns, there had been west should be locked up for their own role as a councillor. some complaints, that the RSPCA had protection. For most of this year Labor Ms Shing — On the point of order, perhaps been involving itself in activities has been under attack in the west for President, just taking up the points that that it should not have. Basically what we its failure to represent electorates in the you raised today in your ruling in relation found as a committee was that yes, in the western suburbs with members who live to sub judice, I note that considerations past that may well have been the case, but in their electorates. This, of course, has around the public interest and around a since the Comrie report some time ago the been topped off by the rorting members potential for influence of an outcome once RSPCA has very largely got its act together for Tarneit and Melton in the Assembly, charges have been laid where the subject and cleaned its act up. That is a very good who lived many kilometres from their matter connects in any relevant way to thing indeed, because the RSPCA is a electorates and rorted to the taxpayer by the matters that are before the courts may much-loved organisation in our state and doing so. indeed, on the tests outlined by you in in our nation. When we think of the RSPCA that ruling, fall foul of the sub judice issue. we think of our own domestic animals — I noted with interest on the weekend a candidate has put her hand up to challenge I note that in this regard — and it may Ms Shing — Bobby Dog! Telmo Languiller in the Assembly for not be Mr Finn’s intention to do so given Mr FINN — We do think of Bobby Dog, preselection in Tarneit. I was particularly that he has referred to the presumption Ms Shing. We think of a whole range of interested because, despite representing of innocence — Mr Finn has indicated pets that we have had in years gone by. We some or all of Melbourne’s west for over that he agrees with views expressed to are appalled by those who commit acts two decades, this candidate’s name was him that Mr Khan should stand aside. On of cruelty against them. I think of some of not one I was familiar with. I asked around. that basis I would seek your guidance as the acts of cruelty that have happened in Nobody knew who she was. I even asked to how the ruling that you issued today recent times, and I have to say: you really some of my friends in the ALP. They did affects the capacity of Mr Finn to be raising have to wonder what direction the world not know either. After the turmoil created this matter in the way that he is in this is going in when this sort of thing can be by absent MPs this year, it seems the ALP particular adjournment matter. perpetrated against innocent animals. I am may be preparing to replace Mr Languiller Mr Davis — On the point of order, almost speechless when I think of some with someone who does not only not live President, Mr Finn has actually been very of the more appalling acts of cruelty that in Tarneit but, until very recently, did not careful on this, and he has made the point have been perpetrated against these little even live in Victoria. These characters truly that the criminal matters are one issue. creatures — and perhaps not so little ones are insane. What are they thinking? The A second issue, in one sense related but as well. ALP has abused Melbourne’s west for far in another sense quite a distinct matter, This committee report should be a timely too long. is what happens at council level whilst reminder to the RSPCA of the importance these criminal charges proceed, and of the role that it has in the community and that is a matter for the Minister for Local the importance of the RSPCA not abusing COUNCIL | Adjournment Government, and perhaps for the Special that role. As such, in recommendation 2 we 22 August 2017 Minister of State in terms of his integrity have urged that: functions, as to whether there is a process … RSPCA Victoria ensure that it to stand aside a councillor whilst those investigates cruelty to commercial matters are considered appropriately by animals in emergency situations only … City of Wyndham the legal authorities. That is something that I think a lot of Ms Shing — Further on the point of councillor order, President, perhaps in asking for people were very concerned about — Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My that the RSPCA was going beyond its that particular action to be taken by the adjournment matter this evening is for minister Mr Finn could in fact just seek scope. It was a bit like the Yarra or the the Minister for Local Government, and I Darebin councils, in their own particular that that be engaged in as a general form of must relay to the house and to the minister assistance being sought from the minister area, going well beyond their scope. the enormous concern expressed to me That is something that we have found as without in fact passing commentary or about the future role of Cr Intaj Khan of giving context, which I appreciate Mr Finn a committee — that it largely does not Wyndham City Council. Cr Khan currently happen anymore. We have urged the sees as relevant to the adjournment matter, faces nine charges of breaching the Local that might otherwise fall foul of the public RSPCA to ensure that that does not occur, Government Act 1989, and I cannot because as I say, the role of this particular interest matters that you have raised in emphasise enough my view that he is the course of charges which Mr Finn in organisation is an extremely important one deserving of the right to the presumption and anything that brings the RSPCA into ill his contribution has indicated do have a of innocence, as indeed we all are. The relationship to the matter at hand before repute is something we certainly would not courts will do their job in due course, and I support, particularly if it was coming from the house this evening. have no desire in any way, shape or form to The PRESIDENT — On the point of the RSPCA itself. I commend the report to interfere in the judicial process. the Council. order, I think Ms Shing’s comment is

IN 8 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE actually valuable in terms of referring to there is not a great deal of confidence setting out a DPC directed process for this type of circumstance where somebody in the community that that will occur. If making submissions to the committee. is perhaps defending charges and them Cr Khan refuses to step aside, I believe The DPC letter stated in part: standing aside. In fact the general public the minister has a role to play and a The government considers that the convention is that if somebody is involved responsibility to remove him from the select committee’s deliberations, and the in proceedings, they would normally stand council, however temporary that might outcomes of its inquiry, would be better aside from their duties, frankly. If I was be. That is particularly important given his informed if public sector employees were provided with the opportunity to input charged with something, I would stand closeness to the Premier of this state. I ask into the whole of government submission aside. I would obviously stand down. There the minister to do that. I ask her to protect and provide their views via DPC, directly is some greyness around this, but in terms the integrity of the Wyndham council to the select committee. of public integrity and the expectations of process, such as it is. If Cr Khan will not In order to provide for that the the community today, I think that most step aside from the council voluntarily, I government invites MFB employees people who were involved in a situation ask her to stand him down until this matter wishing to make written submissions to where they were needing to defend some is resolved. provide them to DPC, which will then charges would actually of their own lodge them with the select committee. volition stand aside to allow those charges COUNCIL | Constituency questions That is quite an extraordinary way of to proceed and be defended and their 23 August 2017 going about things. The letter went on to innocence established in a general sense. say: In terms of the matter today — and it is DPC will provide you with the email interesting that this one has come up after address for staff to forward their we did discuss sub judice this morning Point Cook Road submissions tomorrow morning. I — I was listening very intently and I can Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My would encourage you to advise staff of understand the concerns that have been constituency question is to the Minister this arrangement as soon as possible. raised in the points of order put by both for Roads and Road Safety. Point Cook Submissions should be emailed to DPC the minister and indeed Ms Shing, who no later than 5.00 p.m. Wednesday, 5 July Road continues to be a daily nightmare 2017. I think made a very positive suggestion for thousands. Every morning locals’ at any rate. Coming back to the specifics patience is put to the test as they crawl The committee report then goes on to and the way in which Mr Finn put this along Point Cook Road for the joy of then say: matter, I do not think that he is breaking crawling along the Princes and West Gate In summary, through its communications the sub judice rule in the sense that he is freeways. It is an intolerable situation that to MFB, DPC warned MFB employees not entering into the matter of the charges impacts on the livability of large portions of their responsibilities under the and the legal proceedings per se. We code of conduct if they were to make a of Melbourne’s west. What is the minister submission, then invited them to forward have not heard his action yet, and I may doing to ease congestion on Point Cook their submissions to the government in need to rule again once I have heard his Road, and when can we expect to see accordance with a deadline set by DPC, action, but from what he has said I think action on this? not the committee. he is questioning whether or not there is a It is a great thing that the Department process by which the minister can direct of Premier and Cabinet is not running — or whether she has the power to direct COUNCIL | Statements on reports and papers, 23 August 2017 football matches, because they would be or encourage in some way; she possibly telling the umpires what to do as well. It does not — the gentleman to stand down is the most extraordinary intervention — until those proceedings are concluded. interference, in fact — by the Premier’s That is a separate matter, and I do not think department. it offends sub judice, but if there is any Fire Services Bill venturing into the actual charges, then that Mr Eccles, when questioned by Ms would not be appropriate. Select Committee: Hartland as to the motivation for this, said: I do take the matters raised by the The motivation was entirely honourable minister and Ms Shing about some of final report in that we were trying to give comfort Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I to those who may have felt constrained, the context, or Mr Finn’s agreement with including the constraint that was residents about some matters pertaining too wish to speak on the inquiry into suggested by the CEO. the Firefighters’ Presumptive Rights to this, as something to be careful about, That would have to be one of the greatest notwithstanding that again the remarks Compensation and Fire Services Legislation Amendment (Reform) Bill twists we have seen in quite some time. made by Mr Finn did not infer guilt in the In fact you would have to say that very making of those remarks, either by him or 2017. Having had a good read of this legislation I want to commend those much fits in with the general attitude of indeed by those residents. But the question the Premier and the government towards raised in the whole matter is: should members who put so much time into examining this most important matter this whole issue. They have acted in what I somebody continue to vote and participate regard as an entirely reprehensible way in in proceedings if in fact they are facing and also the staff who were put under enormous pressure to produce this report this matter from day one. The committee some other proceedings that might well be goes on to say: judged by the courts? in a relatively short period of time. Ms Shing — On a point of order, There is one section of the report that The committee believes that rather concerns me enormously, I have to say, than providing ‘comfort’ to submitters, President, for avoidance of any doubt I DPC’s interposition between public also want to make sure that both you as and that is chapter 5, which is titled sector employees and the committee the Chair and those in the chamber at the ‘Interference in the committee’s inquiry’. caused some employees concern. moment were not under any assumption As somebody who has chaired a number It was reasonable for employees to that this point of order or the discussion of parliamentary inquiries, I can say that conclude that the system devised by was being raised as anything other than a interference is something that obviously DPC was intended to, firstly, bring to the point around process and that in fact there we do not take well to, particularly when employer’s notice the identities of those it is interference from the Department of employees making submissions, and is no cavilling with the capacity for Mr Finn secondly, deter staff from submitting their to raise matters of a general nature in this Premier and Cabinet. I quote from the views in a candid manner. report: regard, and it should not be assumed that This is just an extraordinary way for it was anything more than that. On 3 July 2017, Mr Chris Eccles, Secretary the Premier’s department to carry on, The PRESIDENT — I think the points of the Department of Premier and Cabinet (DPC) wrote to Mr Higgins — particularly when we consider that later of order have been taken in good faith, in the report, on page 74, there is some and I agree on process. Mr Finn, I will who was then the CEO of the suggestion that the Premier’s department not direct you in terms of what further Metropolitan Fire Brigade (MFB), and actually omitted submissions that they remarks you might make, but certainly it as we know, there have been a number had received to go to the committee. might be appropriate to go to the action of CEOs of the MFB in recent times, and The committee has suggested that the so that we are able to understand that the in fact there are more bodies scattered Legislative Council refer the department action is quite separate to any sub judice around this particular issue than you to the Legislative Council Privileges infringement. would find in Melbourne General Committee. From what I can see here, that Mr FINN — I understand that Cr Cemetery; it is just extraordinary the way might not be such a bad idea. Khan has the ability to step down of his the Premier and the government have own volition, but in this particular case carried on in this regard —

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 9 COUNCIL | Adjournment Herald Sun Victorians are entitled to tell you — as indeed I am every year until 23 August 2017 ask, ‘Just how corrupt is the Andrews such time as they prove me wrong. I am government?’. After the great red shirt very hopeful that they will not prove me rort of 2014 and the subsequent rorting of wrong this year. I have been a Richmond taxpayers money to stop the Ombudsman supporter for over 50 years. It saddens City of Wyndham investigating its corruption, Victorians me to tell the house that in the course have a right to know if their government is of that time Richmond have won five councillor comprised largely of crooks. premierships but I am yet to see one. The Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I I challenge each and every member of only game that I missed out on in 1980 was wish to raise a matter this evening for the the government in this house to seek leave the grand final, and that was only because attention of the Minister for Education. to stand to publicly deny that they are one I could not get a seat. So I can relate to It concerns correspondence that I have of the corrupt Labor MPs referred to in people who feel the frustration of not received from a constituent in Taylors Hill. today’s Herald Sun. Victorians have a right being able to get into the grand final on the The correspondence informs me that their to know if these allegations are true. If so, biggest day of the year. children had been: they want to know who the crooked MPs The fact of the matter is most … attending Springside College since are. members of football clubs buy tickets kinder and are now in prep, grade 2 and These allegations — from within the on the understanding that there are no grade 3. We along with other parents have ALP, I might add — are of shysterism of guarantees. For example, the Richmond been campaigning for a number of years the highest order. This is theft, pure and Football Club has over 73 000 members, about the lack of secondary schooling simple. Victorians are entitled to know which is not a bad effort for a club that options in our area. who the thieves are — who the charlatans has not won a premiership for 37 years. They were very pleased indeed when are — who have pirated taxpayers money Most clubs have around 40 000 to 50 000 the Taylors Hill Secondary College was for their own corrupt purposes. Here is an members. This year, for example, if it was given the go-ahead. That school has opportunity for members opposite to clear a Richmond-Adelaide grand final, you recently changed its name to Fraser Rise their names once and for all. They should would actually need to have a ground Secondary College, but unfortunately the stand up and declare their innocence — if that could hold about 160 000 people to zoning of Fraser Rise Secondary College they can. Victorians deserve an honest, get everybody in, and that is without the does not provide ongoing education truthful government, not the corrupt, hangers-on who like to show up on grand facilities for many Taylors Hill residents, crooked rabble that we have now. We in final day. and that clearly is a cause of some distress the west thought the corruption of the I might say it would be really good, to those residents and some considerable Brimbank council was bad, but it is now and we might be able to avoid this sort of disappointment. To begin with, Taylors Hill clear that that was only the beginning. legislation in future, if the AFL got its act residents petitioned for a high school, and Labor, thy name is corruption. together a little bit. I know that they love now that there is a school being built most to make a dollar out of this, and I can fully of Taylors Hill is excluded from the zone understand that. The AFL is a business; where the school is being built and indeed they have a right to earn a dollar — I am that it services. Taylors Hill residents were COUNCIL | Constituency questions not knocking anybody’s right to earn a promised a high school, but the majority 06 September 2017 dollar. But when I see the AFL doing what are now not zoned for the new school. they accuse others of doing — that is, According to my constituent: basically legal scalping — and when they Most of Plumpton and Rockbank are say, ‘Yes, we’ll throw in a ticket if you give included in the zone but the needs Ravenhall tip health us $4000. We’ll give you lunch, we’ll give and pleas of Taylors Hill residents for a you a few drinks at half-time and we’ll give secondary school have been ignored, impact you a ride to the ground from wherever despite the campaigning over many Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My you might be — give us $4000 to $5000’, years leading to the investment that is constituency question is to the Minister delivering Fraser Rise Secondary College. it is really frustrating to me. I just wonder for Health. I refer the minister to the how many people who buy those packages According to my constituent: question I asked on 20 June this year, the are at the G on the big day for the very first This speaks to the lack of planning for answer to which I have just received. My time. Is that the first time, and possibly the a new school being built that cannot question came from a deep concern about last time, they have ever been to the footy? cater to the widely known growth pocket the health of my constituents living in the that we live in and this bandaid solution I have the ability to attend the grand vicinity of the Ravenhall tip. I am loath to final, but I have not done so. I have not already has the signs of failing, making suggest the minister does not care about apparent the lack of poor planning and taken it up for many, many years because the lack of community consultation and the locals’ health, but her response could I could not live with myself if I knew that I inclusion. easily be taken that way. The minister had taken the place of a fanatical supporter has come nowhere near answering the We have a real problem for the people of of whatever club might be playing. I think question. That being the case, I ask the that if you barrack for a club — you go Taylors Hill. I ask the minister, as a matter minister again: will she conduct an of urgency, to take up the concerns of my every week, rain, hail or shine — and your investigation into the health impacts on team makes the grand final, then you constituent and other constituents — I communities surrounding the Ravenhall have to say, this constituent is certainly not deserve to be there. As I said, we cannot tip that will include investigation into change the situation to make everybody on his own — with regard to this matter, leukaemia, Parkinson’s disease, chronic because this is causing considerable get in because the place just is not big breathing complaints, asthma in children enough. Whilst the Greens might like us to distress to a good number of people in and all forms of cancer? Taylors Hill. I ask the minister to take these live in a Greens-Socialist utopia, the fact concerns into consideration, to review of the matter is that the AFL is a private the zoning of this school and to provide COUNCIL | Second reading company. You cannot tell them what to the sort of secondary education that the 06 September 2017 do. You cannot tell them how they should people of Taylors Hill have long craved run — and thought that they had but now do not. Ms Springle — Of course you can. I ask the minister to do that as a matter of Mr FINN — No. You cannot tell them urgency so that these people can plan for Major Sporting how to run their business. I know the the next school year. extreme Socialist Left — these people over Events Amendment here in the corner; they are to the left of the COUNCIL | Members statements Labor Party in more ways than one in this 06 September 2017 (AFL Grand Final chamber — think that you can tell private businesses whatever you like, tell them Tickets) Bill 2017 who they can admit, tell them what they Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I can do any day of the week, but that is not Electorate office rise very briefly to speak on this bill. I the case. We live in a country that is based should declare my interest in this matter: I on private companies having the ability to budgets am a long-term member of the Richmond make decisions which they believe are in Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Football Club. I am very enthusiastic their own best financial interests, and the After perusing the front page of today’s about the Tigers’ chances this year, I can AFL is no exception. I would dearly love, as

IN 10 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE I said, to see every member of competing wanted to, we could sit around and we laid down their lives, in many instances, clubs able to get into the MCG on grand could list the things that are wrong with so that we can enjoy the freedoms that too final day, but it is physically not possible — Australia. Australia is not perfect. many of us take for granted. unless of course we have Gold Coast Suns Mr Jennings — That is what Wednesdays Citizenship ceremonies are one of the playing Greater Western Sydney Giants, are for. more pleasurable parts of being a member in which case you could fire a cannon and Mr FINN — Isn’t it amazing? I said ‘the of Parliament, because they are always you would not hit anybody. things that are wrong with Australia’, and joyous events. I am sure that members Richmond-Geelong this Friday night right on cue Mr Jennings stepped into the who attend those citizenship ceremonies is going to be a huge game. We will have breach. I want to thank him for that. It was on a regular basis will agree with me. We 100 000 people there. There will be very, beautiful timing. He has not lost it and I see people gathered from the four corners very few empty seats at the MCG. I am think that is impressive, because timing is of the earth, from various nations, and looking forward to it like you would not everything, as he knows. certainly in the western suburbs they do believe, and I am prepared to sit in the rain Let me assure you, and I speak as come from right across the globe. One all night if I have to. I was down at the club somebody who is a long-time member night, as I recall, in Brimbank there were yesterday — and former executive member of the something like 32 nations represented Ms Dunn interjected. Australia Day Council (Victoria), that I am in the group of people who were about Mr FINN — My word I’d pay to do it. I exceedingly proud to be an Australian. to become Australians. These people are was down at the Richmond Football Club, That is not to say that I believe Australia is totally committed to Australia in a way that and I bought ponchos for myself and two perfect — it is not. One of the reasons that perhaps those of us who were born here of my daughters. We will be there on Friday I am in politics is to change the things that never fully appreciate. They are totally and night, and we will sit in the rain if we have I believe need to be changed, so clearly absolutely committed and thrilled to be to. If Richmond wins, it will be well worth there are some things that I do not believe Australians. every moment of it. If we lose, I will not be are satisfactory or appropriate. I will very That is something that I think many of so happy — it has got to be said. much continue to work to overcome those us who were born here can learn from. We The sad fact of the matter is that you problems. can take on board the enthusiasm and the cannot get everybody into the MCG when I really think that Australia is head and sheer joy of those people, many of whom you want them there. That is the simple shoulders above just about anywhere else have escaped tyranny and many of whom fact of the matter. Legislation like this is in the world. They say that travel broadens have escaped with their lives alone — they not going to change that. You could pass the mind, and I think it is very true. have escaped with nothing. They have a law every day until you were blue in the Mrs Peulich — It broadens the mind and come here to build a new life with their face, but the fact of the matter is it would shrinks the purse. families, or they have come here to build not change the reality of the fact that the a new life and have a family; they are just Mr FINN — Well, it does shrink the delighted to become Australians. MCG just is not big enough for the number purse, Mrs Peulich — there are no two of people that want to enter the ground. ways about that. One of the things that So when I hear people, the black It was a futile try, I have to say, but a good frustrates me enormously is the criticism armband brigade as they are known, try. I hope and pray that I can come back in that invariably accompanies the overseas talking down Australia, telling us to be October with a very, very big smile on my travel of politicians. I think it should be ashamed of ourselves and what we stand face, draped entirely in yellow and black. compulsory for members of Parliament for, I say that is nonsense; it is total, Just to please the Greens I might even give to travel overseas and see what other absolute nonsense, because what this Oh We’re From Tigerland a bit of a burst countries offer their citizens in terms of country stands for is opportunity. What during the adjournment debate. lifestyle. Also inevitably that brings a fuller this country stands for is a way of life that appreciation of what Australia offers. is the envy of the world. Most importantly, what this country stands for is freedom. COUNCIL | Australia Day I have to say to you I remember many Anybody and everybody who has not had 06 September 2017 years ago my first overseas trip. It was a that freedom appreciates it so much more five-week trip overseas. Whilst I am not a than those of us who just take it as a daily huge fan of Sydney, when I looked out the fact of life. window of the plane as we were flying over Australia Day Sydney Harbour and saw the bridge and I speak to those people so often and not Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I the Opera house, I do not think I have ever just at citizenship ceremonies. Out in the am particularly happy to follow Mr Barber, been happier, because I knew I was home; western suburbs there are many people who has left us with a thought that may I knew I was in Australia. who have fled tyranny and situations stay with me for quite some time, and that where their lives are under threat on a There are some very nice places that you daily basis. They are the ones who, more is the prospect of a Greens barbecue and would really like to see overseas; there is what that might entail. How many little than anybody else, fully appreciate what no doubt about that. I have been to the Australia stands for. They are the ones who burgers can you cook in one afternoon? I Colosseum, I have been to Rodeo Drive, I imagine it would be a place that would be on Australia Day, on 26 January, every have been to London and a whole range year really celebrate. There are a few of sausage, chop and steak free, where they of places. The Trevi Fountain and all those stand around perhaps sipping on mulled us around who might have a barbecue sorts of places are all very interesting, and a few beers — it has been known wine and discussing whether they are but there is nothing like coming home to ashamed to be Australians or not — that is to happen — but they are the ones who Australia, because Australia offers people really celebrate what Australia is, because indeed if they are Australians. I think some something that is not offered by too many of them are still citizens of the Soviet Union they have embraced Australia. As I have other nations on this earth. It is not for no said to candidates for citizenship at these — or that might be just in Sydney, I do not reason that people are queueing up to get know. ceremonies over many years, ‘If you into Australia; we see that every day. That is embrace Australia, Australia will embrace It is quite extraordinary that we have why we have a border control problem So you’. I believe that to be very, very true. in this country people who tell us that we many people are trying to get to Australia have much to be ashamed of and that this because it is such a great place. It is wonderful to see people who have country is something that it is not. The come here, often as refugees, to build One of the most important things — a new life succeed. It is particularly fact of the matter is that, yes, many, many no, the most important thing — that years ago there were problems, there were wonderful out my own way to see the Australia offers is of course freedom. That people in the Vietnamese community, who issues and there were things done that is something that we should celebrate, were by any standard totally unacceptable. escaped from the tyranny of communism not just every Australia Day; we should in Vietnam, come here and work hard — But the fact of the matter is you cannot celebrate freedom every day. We should change the past; you can only change the and, by God, do they work hard. They work give thanks to those who have paid the incredibly hard. They built their homes, future. My old mate Ron Jones, who I see ultimate sacrifice — over many years every Australia Day at the Moonee Valley they built their businesses, and now you people have paid the ultimate sacrifice — see the second and the third generations citizenship ceremony, is a Wurundjeri for us to have that freedom. They have paid elder. It is always good to see him. He and I coming along and they are doctors, they the ultimate sacrifice so that we can have are physicists, they are dentists and they often discuss the futility of debating when our own points of view. They have paid Australia Day should be and what Australia are a whole range of professional people the ultimate sacrifice so that we can come achieving because they work hard. They Day means and so forth. He is just as happy and sit in here, we can debate and we can as I am to celebrate all the great things, appreciate what they have got because discuss and we can even sometimes have they have not always had it, and they are all the good things, that Australia is. If we harsh words with each other. Those people

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 11 working hard. They are the ones, more and then claimed it was on the street. I the Tullamarine Freeway and Western than anybody else, who celebrate Australia know, as indeed we all know, that Hume Ring Road this morning made the usual Day with such fervour and enthusiasm, council does not have a huge regard for the horrendous trip from Melbourne’s north- and who can blame them. people of Sunbury, much less the Sunbury western suburbs an absolute nightmare. When I see councils such as Yarra township itself, but for this to happen is, Traffic was gridlocked in every direction and Darebin — and such as Banyule to say the very least, both baffling and as far as the eye could see. This sort of previously, until they stuck their finger in amusing. scenario has become all too common for the air and realised the wind was blowing Having had an experience myself some my constituents, and I ask the minister on the wrong way — making decisions, years ago, I know it is illegal for cars to be their behalf: instead of preparing to flush particularly decisions that are based on the parked on nature strips. I do not know why $5.5 billion away on the discredited and views of such a small number of people, that is the case, but it is. But for someone to entirely dodgy West Gate tunnel project, then I say to these councils, ‘You’re off with park a car on their front lawn, well within will the minister give some thought to the fairies. You’ve got no idea what this is their property boundary, and to be booked providing genuine relief to the long- about. You have got no idea what Australia for that seems to me a total outrage. It suffering motorists of Melbourne’s west? Day means to so many people’. is something that I believe the minister I feel sorry for those residents of Yarra needs to look at. It seems to me that the COUNCIL | Questions without notice and Darebin who will no longer have officer from Hume council has significantly 08 September 2017 citizenship ceremonies and Australia Day abused his position. The council has celebrations on 26 January. They will be rejected my constituent’s complaints and the poorer, and they know that. I have appeals. We now have a situation where I spoken to a number of people. As you believe an individual is being persecuted Electorate office would imagine, I have a number of friends, — I do not think ‘persecuted’ is too strong particularly in Richmond, who are getting a word — for daring to park his vehicle on budgets a bit carried away just at the minute. They his own land. To my way of thinking that is Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) have expressed to me total disgust at what insane. — My question is to the Leader of the the Yarra council has done to Australia I am asking the minister to conduct an Government. Minister, is Mr Eideh, a Day, particularly as it has been done, I inquiry into this matter — I am very happy member for Western Metropolitan Region, understand, after consulting — and what a to provide the details to the minister — to being investigated for employing a staff consultation process this is — 81 people. get to the bottom of this and see if Hume member, paid from his electorate office Mr Barber interjected. council has indeed abused its position in budget, who was one of the election Mr FINN — That might be a huge this regard, and to provide justice for my red-shirted Community Action Network consultation process for the Greens, but constituent in Sunbury. This is a matter members and never actually worked in his let me tell you that for the rest of us that that I believe strikes at the very core of electorate office? is a con and that is something that is private property rights in the state. I think shameful. The anger of many people in the people should be able to park their car on Supplementary question municipality of Yarra and the municipality their own property without fear of being of Darebin is palpable. Those councillors booked. I ask the minister to investigate. Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I will be held responsible for what they Ms Mikakos — On a point of order, thank you, Minister, for that answer. have done, because what they have done Acting President, in relation to Mr Finn’s Minister, given that Mr Eideh was required is damage local government in this state, adjournment, I think the matter he raised to sign the Parliament’s employment and they have certainly damaged their own on behalf of his constituent is obviously a time sheet forms for his staff member who municipality and they are causing harm very valid one and is a matter of concern was paid as an electorate officer, and given to citizens of their municipality. These to his constituent, but he asked that the that Mr Eideh was required to sign off on people in these municipalities — in Yarra Minister for Local Government conduct an all printing invoices from his electorate and Darebin — want to celebrate Australia inquiry into a local parking infringement office, does the government accept that Day. They want to be proud and they want issue. I would think that this matter would in both these cases the buck stops and to celebrate what Australia is. I know that probably fall well outside the ability of responsibility lies with Mr Eideh, who two or three barbecues have already been the minister to investigate. It really is a authorised the forms? planned for the steps of the Collingwood local government issue, and I am just The PRESIDENT — The problem that town hall and the Richmond town hall for seeking some guidance about this. I would I have with the supplementary question Australia Day. So it will be very interesting have thought this matter really should be is that we have not established that in to see just how many show up to celebrate outside the minister’s responsibilities. fact a staff member was participating in the great day in Yarra on 26 January. Mr Finn — On the point of order, that election campaign under that guise. I commend Mrs Peulich for bringing Acting President, as I understand it The first part of the question did refer this motion to the house. I sincerely the Minister for Local Government is basically to whether or not there was an hope that all good-minded people, all responsible for local government. As this investigation of a staff member. Could you proud Australians, will support this is a local government matter, surely it is reword it, please? motion. Certainly it gives me a great deal her responsibility. The fact of the matter Mr FINN — Minister, given that Mr of pleasure in supporting it, urging that is that local government is a statutory Eideh was required to sign the Parliament’s the flag fly high on Australia Day and responsibility of state government. She has employment and time sheet forms for expressing my pride in being an Aussie. a legal responsibility for what happens in any staff member who was paid as an the local government area, and that is what electorate officer, and given that Mr Eideh has happened on this occasion. was required to sign off on all printing COUNCIL | Adjournment The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr invoices for his electorate office, does the 06 September 2017 Purcell) — I do not uphold the point of government accept that in any of these order. The minister is the Minister for cases the buck stops and responsibility lies Local Government and obviously has with Mr Eideh, who authorised the forms? Hume City Council responsibility for local government issues. Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I I think it is a reasonable adjournment COUNCIL | Constituency questions wish to raise a matter for the attention of request, and it should go to the Minister for 19 September 2017 the Minister for Local Government, and Local Government for consideration. it concerns an issue that has been raised with me by a constituent in Sunbury. The COUNCIL | Constituency questions complaint involves a parking infringement 07 September 2017 Wyndham issued for a vehicle that was actually parked on the property of this constituent. Councillor To say that the constituent is unimpressed Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My would be somewhat of an understatement Traffic gridlock constituency question is to the Minister because the car was actually parked well for Local Government, and in doing so off the street and on the property, as I said, relief I welcome her to her new portfolio and of this particular constituent. The Hume Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My assure her she will be hearing from me City Council officer has gone onto this constituency question is to the Minister on a regular basis. I have on a number of constituent’s property and booked his car for Roads and Road Safety. Accidents on occasions referred to my grave concerns

IN 12 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE about activities surrounding Wyndham special school, but private assessments the government is corrupt. They are aware City Council, and in particular certain by the Cairnmillar Institute showed the that the government is corrupt, but they councillors on that council. Cr Intaj Khan resounding conclusion was that both boys are asking: just how corrupt is it? That is a has been the subject of considerable were way under 70 points and should 100 question that perhaps we might not be able controversy over an extended period of per cent be in a special school. So we have to answer this afternoon; we might not time. He is now facing a number of charges a real problem. As my constituent writes: be able to answer it until such time as the relating directly to his role as a councillor. Our worry is that neither child will attend Ombudsman conducts her investigation This is causing extensive community school if it’s mainstream and are falling so into the government, if indeed we get concern, and Cr Khan continuing in his far behind it will get to a stage where it is an investigation into the latest set of role is undermining public confidence in almost unrecoverable. allegations as well. the council. This is, unfortunately, as I say, not an But there is one thing that the people of In the interests of good governance and unusual incident. I ask the minister to Victoria are aware of, and that is that the the public perception of good governance, intervene personally on my constituent’s Labor Party is still the guilty party. They will the minister do her job and stand behalf. I will provide this letter to the were the guilty party 25 years ago, and down Cr Khan as a councillor until such minister, and I ask him to intervene and they are still the guilty party a quarter of time as the charges against him are heard? to provide a satisfactory solution for this a century later. You have got to give the family. Labor Party points for consistency. They COUNCIL | Adjournment are right on the money. They were guilty back then, and they are still guilty now, and 19 September 2017 COUNCIL | Constituency questions 20 September 2017 everybody is aware of it. It is not just this government; you have got to realise that. It is the Labor Party, Autism services because the Labor Party has running Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I West Gate tunnel through it a thick vein, which is a culture of wish to raise a matter for the attention of corruption. It goes back to what you would the Minister for Education, and it concerns commitment call, I suppose, institutionalised corruption a matter that I have had some dealings Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My within the Australian Labor Party. It is in with over the last few years concerning constituency question is to the Minister the DNA of the ALP to have corruption. If education for children with autism. This for Roads and Road Safety. The mystery you were to extract DNA from the Labor is an all-too-familiar problem that I have surrounding the government’s West Gate Party and examine it closely, you would heard of from a constituent. He began: tunnel project grows deeper by the day. find corruption oozing from every pore, if indeed DNA has pores. As some background, our eldest son … The proposal by the then opposition started his school life lasting six days at a leader, now the Premier, was described This culture of corruption was probably mainstream school before being sent to before the last election as ‘shovel-ready’. best summed up by a former senator from Western Autistic. Once there he was able The West Gate distributor became the New South Wales, who Minister Jennings to receive a lot of help and intervention western distributor and is now the West might not be familiar with, a bloke called and was then able to transition into Graham Richardson. He may not be Mr mainstream school … Gate tunnel. We should not be surprised if another name change were on the cards. Jennings’s cup of tea, I am suggesting — For the first few years he struggled but The secrecy surrounding the involvement well, not his political cup of tea anyway. He managed to get through up until the of Transurban continues, even though wrote a book a few years ago in which he start of grade 6, where it seemed that the said, ‘Whatever it takes’. That is what it was school’s attitude towards children on the the company would appear to be the spectrum had shifted and they no longer sole beneficiary of the project. So-called called, Whatever it Takes, and that is the seemed interested in some of the more consultation with local residents has been philosophy of the ALP. Across the factions, challenging students, our boys being two cursory at best, and they are as much in federal or state, whatever it may be, that of them. the dark as anyone else. Will the minister is the philosophy of the ALP. They will lie, At this point the way the boys were dealt come clean on what the government has they will steal, they will cheat, they will do with changed dramatically, resulting in already committed to with the West Gate whatever they have to do, whatever it takes the boys having a huge meltdown at the tunnel and what it has in store for locals to win, and that is what we have seen time beginning of the school day towards the and motorists alike? and again under this government. end of first term this year and refusing to Indeed one of the most appalling actions go to class. When the teachers could not by any government in recent years, the verbally persuade them to go they then COUNCIL | Government scrapping of the physically manhandled them — performance, 20 September 2017 quite extraordinary — east–west link, was a classic example of that, because that was expenditure of and dragged our youngest into class public moneys to the tune of $1.2 billion whilst pinning the eldest to a wall. to try to save some Labor seats in the inner As I say, just extraordinary. Government city. That did not even work; they still lost As a result of this incident we had to the seat of Melbourne. If the Labor Party remove them from the school as they performance are going to use that sort of money, at least point-blank refused to go at all and this Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I move: use it effectively. But the Labor Party does has been what we have been facing ever not care very much about that. It is not since. That this house notes the rorting of their money. They do not care, and if it is The effect that this has had on both taxpayers money by members of the somebody else’s money, they will use it for children has been profound and has Andrews Labor government for political and personal benefit, including: whatever they like, and we have seen that caused untold damage to their self- again and again throughout the life of this esteem and their trust of teachers in (1) the rorting of staffing entitlements to government. general. employ Labor Party campaign workers; As I said a moment ago, the culture of I should say that is not at all surprising. (2) the rorting of ministerial vehicles to corruption runs deep within the ALP. We He goes on to say: chauffeur pet dogs; just have to go back probably 10 years, We have tried to get the boys into Hume (3) the rorting of the second residence maybe a little less, to the Brimbank City Valley special school … allowance by the former Speaker and Council. Ms Shing might not remember the And it is here where they have requested former Deputy Speaker; Brimbank City Council, so I will enlighten my assistance. They investigated sending (4) the rorting of electorate office her, and I am very happy to do that. She the boys to Hume Valley, a special school printing budgets to fund Labor Party may have been too young to remember which specifically caters for children like branch stacking; and what happened with the Brimbank City theirs. They asked the particular school (5) spending on failed Supreme and High Council, but I will put money down that their two children were attending to do Court actions to block the Ombudsman’s Mr Jennings remembers what happened at a Vineland test on both boys to test their investigation into Labor staffing rorts. Brimbank. He was in this house in fact, and IQ levels, and of course we all know that Victorians are more than entitled to ask: we spoke at length about the Brimbank the 70 cut-off point is the magic number. just how corrupt is the Andrews Labor council to the point where the Labor Party The results came back showing that they government? It is interesting that they was so embarrassed that they actually were over 70, which would not allow them would ask that question. They do not ask: sacked the council. The trouble is that they to go to Hume Valley or indeed any other is the government corrupt? They know that sacked the wrong council. The council that

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 13 did all the dirty deals, the council that did his influence and his power even into the There is an interesting chap out in the people of Brimbank in the eye, they got federal cabinet room during the Rudd and Wyndham. He is a councillor, apparently, away totally clean — the Gillard governments. Even now, the called Intaj Khan, the King of Bling. You An honourable member — Scot-free. man who sees himself as being the next might know him, Mr Jennings. Do you Mr FINN — Scot-free, that is it; thank Prime Minister of Australia according to know the man at all? I know the Premier you. The new council that replaced them the polls, Bill Shorten, was put there by knows him. He is very close to the Premier. were the ones that were sacked, and Hakki Suleyman’s numbers. So there we I will not make reference to the charges they had not actually done anything. had a bloke, Hakki Suleyman, working that this particular councillor is currently It was quite extraordinary. It is quite out of Justin Madden’s office — a minister facing, but he is involved in a stoush extraordinary the way the Labor Party treat of the Crown in a Labor government — out there with his federal colleague, the people who are found guilty of the sort of running a council, running preselections, member for Lalor, Joanne Ryan, who called corruption we saw in Brimbank — the sort doing numbers, stacking branches and Cr Khan out for being the undesirable of corruption we have seen in so many doing all the things for which the Labor individual that he is. Ms Ryan is apparently instances in the Labor Party over the years. Party is so well known. He was directly going to be sued by Cr Khan, so that is There was a family involvement, let responsible for the preselection of Bill going to be good. How do you defend that? us say, in Brimbank that was quite often Shorten in the seat of Maribyrnong. You have got to have a character before described as the Suleyman empire. We We had a situation where Hakki you can be defamed, so I do not know how had Hakki out there. Hakki was working Suleyman not only got his daughter into he is going to get away with that, but good from the office of former Minister for Parliament but could get Bill into the luck to him. Planning Justin Madden. I do not know Lodge. If that is not a culture of corruption, That is what we have come to expect whether Justin Madden actually knew I do not know what is. That is a culture of from the Labor Party in this state. Out in this because Justin I do not think actually corruption that has the show by the throat. the west that is the way of life; that is just knew where his office was out in Keilor. It is beyond all understanding how this the way they are. When you talk about But Hakki certainly did because he was could happen. branch stacking, it is a way of life for many directing traffic from it and he was branch Next door there is a bloke called Josh — it is a pity that Mr Somyurek is not here, stacking, he was recruiting and he was Bull, who is the member for Sunbury. as he might be able to tell us a little bit playing games with money from the There are bulls all over the place out there. more about it — and it is a way of life for council and all sorts of wonderful things. Josh Bull has recently — the ALP. In this particular instance the And of course his daughter was the mayor An honourable member interjected. rorting is of each other. They are rorting of Brimbank during that time. She was the Mr FINN — Mr Bull. Yes, J. Bull. Mr Bull each other — and I use the word ‘rorting’ mayor of an entirely corrupt council. The has recently put out a couple of letters. This — and cheating against each other in Ombudsman’s report into the Brimbank has been circulating — preselections. It is quite amazing to see what they do to each other. council only touched the surface. It Mr Jennings interjected. totally condemned the council, but it only There is a chap called Bob Kernohan, Mr FINN — This is something that you who I think Mr Melhem might know. I touched the surface of what the council might find interesting, Mr Jennings. This had done. have had a couple of chats with him, and has been circulating in Sunbury among the he is quite a learned man on the ways of When it was exposed and the younger groups, and it has been brought government of the day, the Brumby the ALP. He has a number of stories that to my attention by my daughter. Mr Bull really should go into a book. I look forward government, went on to dismiss the sent out a letter — this is Josh; we do not Brimbank council, what do you think to buying that book if and when they ever want to get our bulls confused. There is do. I think that would be well worthwhile, happened to that mayor? You would Bull Shorten. There is a lot of bull out there; imagine that somebody who oversaw and I would be first in line to buy a copy there is no doubt about that. Mr Josh Bull of that book. Sometimes Liberal Party the degree of corruption and shysterism has sent out two letters. The first is one that was afoot on that council would be preselections are a bit mysterious, but I welcoming new voters to the roll. We all do have to say that Labor Party preselections regarded by any reasonable person with that. That is fair enough, and a very good contempt. They would treat them with are quite awesome in the true meaning of thing it is too. But he has also sent out a the word; they fill me with awe. contempt and they would shun them; I letter recently urging his constituents to certainly would. If I knew somebody who vote yes in the postal survey. You see what goes on in the ALP at preselection time, and you say to yourself, was involved in that sort of thing, I would Mr Ondarchie interjected. shun them. I would condemn their activity ‘How did they do that?’, and then you and I would send them to Coventry. Mr FINN — It is a federal matter totally, think to yourself, ‘How do they get away Mr Ondarchie, paid for by Victorian with that?’, but they do every time. And But what did the Australian Labor taxpayers. I think it is totally unwarranted Party do? They gave her the safe seat of St some of the people that come out of those and not something that should be preselections and are elected to Parliament Albans. They gave her one of their safest endorsed. But interestingly enough when seats in the state, can you believe it, if you are just extraordinary. You just have to one compares the signatures on the two look around some of the chambers of the do not mind, umpire? It is just absolutely letters, they are totally and completely extraordinary that we would have a parliaments in Australia to see some of the different. One Josh Bull signature is quite people that are products of preselections, situation where a mayor is found to be legible, and another one is hieroglyphics. If leading a council which is totally corrupt, most of them put there by dodgy backroom I was unkind, I would suggest that Mr Bull deals and crooked factional warlords totally crooked, and she is rewarded by the has a signature for each face, but I would ALP by being given a safe Labor seat. giving their largesse and paying off people not say that. It is just extraordinary to me here, there and everywhere for their I have been told by local members of the that here is a member of Parliament who Labor Party — who were not all that happy support. clearly has a situation where somebody is Mr Jennings interjected. about this, it has to be said — that it was forging his signature. Mr FINN — I have not mentioned former not a preselection, it was more a — Mr Ondarchie interjected. Ms Fitzherbert interjected. federal member Stephen Conroy once, Mr FINN — Indeed, I had not thought of Minister, so I wish you would not raise his Mr FINN — It was more an anointing. that. Mr Ondarchie points out it may well As Ms Fitzherbert says, it was an anointing name. be a part of the printing deal. It is not far I think what happens in regard to from above. Along came Ms Suleyman from Keilor and in the Socialist Left faction, and into St Albans she went. The locals, as preselections within the ALP is indicative so it may be a part of the Mammarella deal of the level of ingrained corruption and I said, were not very happy. When I asked that they have put together out there, and why the Labor Party would do this in St deceit that the ALP seems to thrive on. The they may have gotten a bulk purchase. more corrupt it is, the more deceitful it is, Albans for somebody who had basically Perhaps we could examine that a little bit disgraced themselves — they disgraced the the more dishonest it is and the stronger it later on. seems to become. That is, as they say in the council and they disgraced the ALP — it Corruption of course is something that was explained to me thus: ‘Hakki knows classics, the Labor way. That is something we have come to accept as part of the ALP we have come to expect over many a long where the bodies are buried. Her father in the western suburbs. It runs through knows where the bodies are buried’. That year. various councils, it runs through members For the life of me I do not understand was the explanation that was given to me of Parliament and of course it runs through by the local members of the Labor Party. why certain members of the Labor Party preselections that we see in the Labor Party — and I have spoken to these people out It is not just the state Labor Party that quite frequently. we are talking about here, because Hakki in the western suburbs, particularly in the Suleyman controlled numbers that took Wyndham area — stick with the Labor

IN 14 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE Party, despite the fact that they are treated is going to happen to this bloke, because cost of the driver of the dogs? In my abysmally. You have got to remember that he has spent far, far more trying to cover own portfolio interest area of autism we there is a preselection, for example, going up his misdeeds than he did originally in could use that money. God, could we on out in Tarneit at the moment. This is to the red shirt incident. They have been to use that money! That would just do so replace a bloke who had to resign because the Supreme Court of Victoria to stop the much for so many. It is just a criminal he was rorting the taxpayer. We will get to Ombudsman investigating this action. waste. It is an outrageous waste, but I that in a little while. Ms Shing — You could use the word will go with ‘criminal waste’ because I Mr Jennings — That’s on the motion. ‘imbroglio’, perhaps. think it is criminal. I think that it should You’ve got to the motion. Mr FINN — We will get there. When be investigated fully and we need Mr FINN — No, we are talking about the Supreme Court decided that indeed full accountability and transparency. things that are included in this. This the Ombudsman had an absolute right to This government likes to talk about preselection is to replace a bloke who was investigate this matter, did the Labor Party accountability, but that is all it does: rorting the system big time. Of course who accept it? Did the government accept it? talk. When it comes to actually being puts his hand up for this preselection? Not on your nelly. They went straight off accountable, when it comes to actually None other than Intaj Khan. So you could to Canberra to the High Court of Australia. being transparent, forget it. It is not even have a situation where you have got one How much would it cost? I do not know, mildly interested. Is that surprising? If bloke who is on the way out for having but it would cost a fortune. You are a I was as crooked as they are, I would his snout in the trough to be replaced by lawyer, are you not, Ms Shing? You could not be interested in accountability or another one who is going to do it even tell us how much. A good QC would cost transparency either. I would want to cover better. That, I suggest to you, is the Labor probably $70 000 a day or something. up my crimes and my misdeeds. My very way. They have got an extraordinary talent These are huge sums of taxpayers money word, I would. for putting people into Parliament who for this cover-up, going to the Supreme I mentioned before the crimes and asked know how to rort the system, rip off the Court and the High Court. the question: how do these people in the taxpayer and milk things for all they are There must be a lot on the line here. Labor Party think they can get away with worth, all for their own benefit without a There must be some really dirty deeds, it? The big question hangs over this one, thought for what is good for the state or unfortunately not done dirt cheap on this because we had the rorting of the second what is good for the people of this state. occasion, because it is costing us all an arm residence allowance by the former Speaker That is the Labor way. and a leg. We must be looking at millions and the former Deputy Speaker. It has to I well remember a former minister in the of dollars now in legal fees to cover up this be said that they lost their positions over Cain and Kirner governments when I was appalling act. I am hopeful that we might this. Mr Languiller fell on his own sword; first elected — a long time ago now — and get to the bottom of this at some stage, Mr Nardella is still screaming like a stuck he was actually done over for preselection hopefully before November next year, but pig over there that he did not do anything by said gentleman. He said to me, straight I suspect that if that is not the case then wrong. Well, I think the majority of people out, ‘This bloke’s a crook’. He picked it years the Guy government will after the election in this state have a very different view. You ago. discover the truth and expose the Labor talk about the pub test — this does not An honourable member interjected. Party for their corrupt and crooked actions come anywhere near passing the pub test. In fact you would not get through the front Mr FINN — No, it was not Peter Spyker. of which they are guilty. They will receive justice. There are no two ways about that. doors of the pub with this one. It stinks to Peter Spyker was not a crook, he was just high heaven. stupid. That would be 20 years ago, so, as Whether it be before the election or after I said, this is not new. This is something the election makes no difference to me, but Interestingly enough Daniel Andrews is that has been going on for a very, very long they will all receive the justice that is their over there in the other place taking their time. It is a culture that is rooted within the due. There is no doubt about that at all. votes every day — accepting the votes and AL P. Then of course we had one of the more, accepting the support of Mr Languiller and Mr Nardella. He is condemning them and Ms Shing — I knew you’d get there would you say — Ms Fitzherbert — Colourful? saying, ‘Come on, friends, let’s go’. While eventually, Mr Finn. Mr Nardella has apparently left the Labor Mr FINN — It is true; it is rooted within Mr FINN — No, I would not say Party, he still votes with them, he still dines the ALP. We are talking about the rorting of colourful. with them and he still drinks with them. He staff entitlements, and we saw that before Ms Fitzherbert — Dodgy? is for all intents and purposes a member of the last election. Mr FINN — I would not even say dodgy. the ALP. That is the bottom line. Until such Ms Shing interjected. It was bizarre. I think ‘bizarre’ would time as the government moves to expel Mr FINN — No, I am speaking on the probably be the best word. We had the Mr Nardella from the Parliament, then we motion, Ms Shing. rorting of a ministerial vehicle for the can assume that he is still in bed with the Ms Shing interjected. transport of dogs to and from the country ALP. It is just one of the more blatant and Mr FINN — You should calm down; it compound of a minister. Not only that, but outrageous rorts that I can ever remember, is all right. What we saw before the last we had the minister directing his driver conducted by two people who hold a election was just amazing. Here we had a to walk the dogs. You wonder what else responsible position, people who would group of people putting their hand up to be the minister directed the driver to do. You normally be presenting the face of the the government of Victoria. They said, ‘We would understand how the driver felt; the Parliament. want to look after the interests of Victoria driver is employed to drive a minister. All Ms Fitzherbert — A position of trust. and Victorians’; however, they went out of a sudden he or she finds themselves Mr FINN — They are in a position of of their way to rort the system, to rip off behind the wheel of a car with a couple of trust, as Ms Fitzherbert points out. They the taxpayer, to ‘employ’ — and I use that woofers in the back. abused that trust, and they misused that term in inverted commas — people in It is just extraordinary to think that the trust. That did not pay anywhere near electorate offices for MPs, and of course Labor Party and a minister of the Labor the price that they should have, and the the MPs never met them. They put red government thought they could actually government is still benefiting from the fact shirts on these people and sent them out to get away with this. That is the thing about that they hold their seats. campaign for the ALP. the Labor Party — not that they commit We could talk about — and I have just When this was discovered it was referred these crimes, but that they actually think touched on it a little — what is happening to the Ombudsman. The Ombudsman they can and they will get away with it. And in Mr Languiller’s seat at the moment as said, ‘Oh, this is very interesting’, and she on this occasion clearly the minister did the Labor Party rip into each other during decided that she would investigate it, and think that, but he was wrong, as he was on the preselection process in Tarneit, and that is not surprising given that that is her so many other things. He was totally and we could talk about what is happening job — that is her responsibility — to which absolutely wrong, and strangely enough in the ALP in Melton, which is a doozy. the Premier had kittens on the spot. He he is no longer in this house. He lost his The Mammarellas, as we know, have went to, and still does go to, extraordinary ministry and is no longer in the house. We been eyeing the seat of Melton for many lengths to hide what he did. So not only do not miss him greatly, but he now has years. I should give a bit of background do we have the corruption of the original plenty of time to take Patch and Ted for a on Mr Mammarella. Mr Eideh’s eyebrows act; we have the cover-up. As we know, walk whenever he wants to. are raised all of a sudden. Mr Robert and as we saw with Watergate all those Can you imagine the amount of money Mammarella — who I have to say I know years ago — there is another classic case of that has been spent and what we could and is quite a nice bloke — of course works corruption — it is not the original act that have used it on just in those last two for Mr Eideh and has worked for Mr Eideh gets you; it is the cover-up. And that is what incidents — in the legal costs and the for some years. He has been working

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 15 ‘assiduously’ — and again I put that word leave, to Mr Finn’s suggestion. I take to the the street and the average voter in Victoria in inverted commas because he has been floor to actually say: I do not know what do not muck around when referring to the more than working. He has been stacking, you are asserting I know. government, and they certainly do not and he has been doing all sorts of weird Mr FINN — Well, you should have a chat muck around when referring to a Premier and wonderful things out in Melton in to Mr Eideh. He knows a fair bit about it, who they, quite frankly, despise. I do not order to get his son Justin Mammarella, because it has been happening under his think that is too strong a word. This bloke a former mayor of Melton, preselected. roof for quite some time. But truly, why has built up a reputation for himself that is Again I know Justin Mammarella, and he should the people of Victoria have to fund second to none on a number of fronts, and is quite a nice bloke. But you have got to this nonsense? Why should the people of average people out there detest him. put the personal side to one side, because Victoria, who are out there working as we An honourable member interjected. on this occasion there are things afoot speak to pay tax, allow this sort of corrupt Mr FINN — Most of them over the other here that involve taxpayers money. There nonsense to continue? Why should the side do as well, that is true. I do not know are things involved here where the Labor people of Victoria be expected to put their whether it is too late to dump him before Party and members of the Labor Party are hands in their pocket to pay these shysters the next election. Is it too late now? I do not again rorting the system. They are again for their activities? What is the reasonable know whether it is too late. Mr Jennings is ripping off the Victorian taxpayer. That is standard that this government is setting? indicating that it may not be. We will see. something that we should not tolerate. There is none. They have no standards. As An honourable member interjected. Mr Jennings — On a point of order, I said earlier, they will do anything. It is the Mr FINN — I do not know whether Acting President, Mr Finn should be aware Labor way to do whatever it takes, and on Minister Allan would knife a colleague. that I have been particularly generous in this occasion, to win the preselection of Would she knife a colleague? I suppose allowing him to say whatever he likes up Melton and probably Tarneit as well, it will knifing colleagues in the Labor Party is until this moment. I think we should all be very much a case of whatever it takes. pretty much a way of life. That is the way be mindful of unsubstantiated matters Mr Leane — It’s on tonight. it operates. As I was saying a moment ago, that are in the public domain and are Mr FINN — It’s on tonight, is it? the average person in the street has had a subject to investigation. So if Mr Finn Mr Leane — I don’t know. You’re telling gutful of this government. They have had a wishes to assert allegations as fact, I think the story. gutful of the rorts, they have had a gutful of he should reflect on that and if need be, Mr FINN — I am interested to know. I the cover-ups, and I tell you what, this last seek the guidance of the Chair in relation one of going to the Supreme Court and the to him transgressing by repeating what tell you what, can somebody ring Sportsbet and get the latest odds, because I would High Court to stop the Ombudsman — the are allegations and stating them as fact. independent umpire — from investigating No facts have actually been provided, as I like to know. Mr Ondarchie interjected. what is possibly the greatest rort of all is understand it, in relation to these matters, something that sticks in the neck of every and he is asserting — Mr FINN — I would not be surprised to hear that Mr Mammarella is unbackable, Victorian. Mr Ondarchie — What is the point of the To anybody over there on the other side point of order? because his old man is very good with the numbers. When a branch is stacked by a of the house, do not think that the people Mr Jennings — The point of order is that of Victoria will not be reminded about this Mr Finn is effectively — I have not said he Mammarella it stays stacked. You know that, Mr Eideh. They are very, very good at in the lead-up to the next election, because is lying, but he could be lying unless he has we as an opposition will gently tap the substantive evidence. it, and there is no shortage of people out in the western suburbs who I have spoken people of Victoria on the shoulders and Mr FINN — On the point of order, Acting to who know that to be true. There is no say, ‘Don’t forget your government, the President, there is no point of order. That is shortage of people who will testify that Labor Party, is corrupt. It is crooked. Don’t clearly a point of debate, and Mr Jennings certain people, in fact quite a number of forget what they have done. Don’t forget is well within his rights after I have finished people, in the ALP out that way are up to all the dogs, don’t forget the staffing rip- my contribution to get up and refute the sorts of shenanigans, which is how I think offs, don’t forget the rorting of electorate point that I made. So I would suggest to we would describe them. office printing budgets, don’t forget you with humblest respect that there is no Telmo Languiller and don’t forget Donnie point of order involved at all. I move now to the last paragraph of this motion, and I might have already covered Nardella and his caravan down at Ocean The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr Elasmar) it a little bit, which is: Grove’. I have to say on that one, in terms of — Order! My understanding of the point its ingenuity: criminal mastermind. That is of order raised by Mr Jennings is that you (5) spending on failed Supreme and High something it would never have occurred to should just be aware, Mr Finn, of what the Court actions to block the Ombudsman’s me to do, I have to say. It would never have situation is. I am aware of it and everyone investigation into Labor staffing rorts. occurred to me. I like the beach a lot, but I in the house is aware of what is going on I mentioned the pub test. This is a do not think if I had sat down and thought around it, so just come back to the subject relatively new thing in the public arena about it for years I could have come up without concentrating on the other matter. whereby journos are sitting around with a scheme that would have seen me Mr FINN — I would refer you, Acting discussing an issue on camera and paid extra to live outside my electorate by President, to paragraph (4) of the motion they throw in the pub test, which asks the beach at a caravan park that does not that refers to the rorting of electorate what is acceptable in the eyes of the allow long-term residents anyway. office printing budgets to fund Labor average person. If by some extraordinary As I said earlier, it is in their DNA. For Party branch stacking. That is allegedly a circumstance the average person were to us on this side of the house, it would not direct result of an attempt to win Mr Justin accept that what the ALP did before the occur to us to do those sorts of things. It Mammarella the preselection for Melton. last election was okay — that is, rorting the is absolutely incredible, as I have said on Is it on tonight? taxpayer to employ people so they could be a number of occasions now, not only to full-time campaigners — there is no way Mr Ondarchie interjected. think that they would do it but to think on this earth that anyone could possibly that they would actually get away with it. Mr FINN — It is not on tonight? That accept that it was okay to spend millions is perhaps an ongoing matter. Mr Leane To try it on in the way that they have is of taxpayer dollars going to the Supreme just awe-inspiring. It is more gall than all is highly amused over there, and I can Court and High Court of Australia to stop understand why, because he knows what is of France, you would have to say. It is just an investigation. It goes to the very heart of extraordinary what they have done. going on out there. I challenge Mr Jennings accountancy and transparency. to get up in the house — he can do it now The people of Victoria see their roads The average person in the street might deteriorating. via a point of order, and I will give him not use those terms. In fact they might leave to do it if he likes — put his hand on be far more direct. They might refer to Mr Ondarchie — Western distributor? his heart and say that he knows for a fact somebody who was involved in such Mr FINN — Don’t start me on the that the Mammarellas are not involved in activity as a thief, they might refer to them western distributor. That is another any branch stacking in Melton. I think Mr as a charlatan, they might refer to them as one. Remember before the last election, Eideh was laughing out loud. I mention a crook or they might refer to them as any when the Premier, the then Leader of the branch stacking and the Mammarellas, number of things. In fact some of the things the Opposition, was running around and Mr Eideh laughs out loud. I mean, that I have had to delete from my Facebook saying anything and everything, usually that says it all. Everybody over there knows page have been from people describing without the knowledge or consent of his exactly what has been going on, whether this government in a way that, even for colleagues? He said, ‘We’ve got a West Gate they choose to admit it or not. you, Mr Jennings, would curl your hair. distributor ready to go. It is shovel-ready’. Mr Jennings — On a point of order, They do not muck around. The people in Well, I know what he was shovelling, and Acting President, I am responding, by it had nothing to do with the road. But he

IN 16 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE said at the time it was shovel-ready. Here what their views were. And they are just led to the receipt of hundreds of duplicate we are nearly three years later and there is one section — submissions, impeding the committee’s nothing — absolutely nothing. An honourable member interjected. processing of all submissions; But there is something humming Mr FINN — Yes, indeed. It was heard in may have deterred some witnesses from along in the background, and I can hear Williamstown, so Mr Pallas did hear it. making submissions by misleading them Transurban and the boys in the boardroom into believing submissions had to be Ms Lovell — What a lovely spot. made via DPC; and at Transurban thinking that it is Christmas. Mr FINN — It is a lovely spot, and Mr They are sitting around, and they have may have deterred some witnesses from Pallas will tell you all about it if you give making submissions by misleading them got their plans for what is now the West him half a chance. Gate tunnel. It went from being the West into believing submissions had to be An honourable member interjected. made two days earlier than the actual Gate distributor to the western distributor, cut-off date. and now it is the West Gate tunnel. But Mr FINN — You cannot walk down the it is only Wednesday, so there is an Strand on a Saturday morning without I feel like I am continuing on from where opportunity for a name change yet this tripping over Labor MPs. That is very true. I left off a little under half an hour ago, week. The government is in league with Ms Lovell — Does Wade Noonan know because this action that the Department the boardroom at Transurban. They have where Williamstown is? of Premier and Cabinet, and presumably the Premier’s office, has been involved just let that boardroom have their way, Mr FINN — Wade would not have a clue, and they are rubbing their hands together. in seems to me on the face of it to be an no. I think he lives in Werribee South; I am act of corruption of the process. Indeed The only thing you can hear down in the not sure. But that would not surprise me. Transurban head office is singing from the recommendation 10 of this report is a We have a government that has lost the recommendation that the: boardroom — It’s Beginning To Look A Lot respect of the electorate. The people of this Like Christmas. Legislative Council refer the Department state do not trust this government. The of Premier and Cabinet to the Legislative They honestly believe that because the people of this state detest this government. Council Privileges Committee for only beneficiary of the West Gate tunnel They detest the Premier. They just want this investigation of its interference with the is going to be Transurban, because it is government gone because they know that committee’s inquiry. not going to do anything for the people of this government is corrupt. As I said at the I have been reading these sorts of reports the western suburbs. It is not going to do beginning, it is not a question of whether for many years, and I think this is the most anything for the people who live around this government is corrupt; it is a question serious condemnation that I have ever there. It is not going to do anything for of: how corrupt is this government? I seen in any report. To suggest that the traffic congestion for either east–west or would suggest to you very strongly that house refer the Department of Premier and south–north travel. It is not going to do this government is extremely corrupt. It is Cabinet to the Privileges Committee, with a anything for anybody except the people corrupt to the core, and it is something that possible charge of contempt of Parliament who run Transurban, who it is going to the people of Victoria are going to scream hanging over it, is I think extraordinarily make very, very rich — or, should I say, very, very loudly about in November next serious. Unfortunately it is reflective of much, much richer than they already are. year. the whole attitude of the Premier and his They are going extraordinarily well. Business interrupted pursuant to office, and the government I should say, to Mr Ondarchie interjected. standing orders. this whole issue. From day one this whole Mr FINN — Mr Ondarchie reminds me, issue has been marked by heavy-handed and I am glad that he did, of the Werribee COUNCIL | Statements on reports tactics — by bullying and by actions which South youth justice centre, which was and papers, 20 September 2017 are to say the very least untoward and I a classic example of a government that believe in most instances quite unethical. really decided that its safe seats do not We are talking about the sacking of a matter. ‘Werribee? Doesn’t matter’ — minister, the sacking of the board and the that is their attitude. I remember the day sacking of a CEO. Wherever the Premier they announced this. I was listening to Fire Services Bill has gone on this particular issue the the radio, and they said, ‘There’s a big bodies have marked the way. It concerns announcement coming. There’s going to Select Committee: me enormously that we now have a report be a youth justice centre, and it’s going to which is recommending that the Premier’s be in Werribee South’. I said, ‘What? That final report department actually be investigated by the can’t be right. I must have misheard that’, Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) Privileges Committee. — I rise this afternoon to again speak so I went to the net, and sure enough they I have lost any faith that I ever had in said indeed it was going to be in Werribee on the final report of the inquiry into the Firefighters’ Presumptive Rights this government. It is a government that South. proves again and again and again — and it Mr O’Donohue interjected. Compensation and Fire Services Legislation Amendment (Reform) Bill has done so in this particular instance — Mr FINN — In the electorate that Tim 2017. I have to say that I am deeply that it cannot be trusted. This government Pallas allegedly represents and, rumour disturbed by this report, by the seeming cannot be trusted with the Country Fire has it, he has been seen in from time to attempt by the Department of Premier Authority, and it cannot be trusted with time, maybe twice or three times in the and Cabinet to interfere in this process the legislation that is currently before the last 10 years. He has been there, but as and indeed obstruct the committee and house and that we might vote on sometime for actually living there, you have got to by the suggestion that the Premier’s office before Christmas next year. It cannot be remember he is in the Labor Party and he and department are indeed in contempt of trusted on anything. This is a government is in the western suburbs, and that does Parliament. that has to go. not work. On page 75 of the report, in point 5.3.3, Ms Lovell interjected. it states: COUNCIL | Adjournment Mr FINN — Indeed. That is the way. Parliamentary privilege, which extends to 20 September 2017 We all live in our electorates, but in parliamentary committees as delegates terms of electoral integrity and actually of the Parliament, protects persons from representing their constituents the ALP is repercussions for what they write in a not all that interested in doing that. This submission. It is a contempt of Parliament Doctors in instance of the Werribee South youth to interfere with or obstruct a person detention centre is a classic example of from giving evidence to a committee that. We saw, when I was down in Werribee or to take action against a person for Secondary Schools giving evidence. This, for example, Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My one cold and wet Tuesday night, some protects a person from their employer adjournment item this evening is for the 7000 or 8000 people out in the streets of disadvantaging them for contributing Minister for Education. I received earlier Werribee — as I said on a cold and wet to (or attempting to contribute to) an today a very angry call from a constituent Tuesday evening. They gathered in very inquiry. in Werribee. Both he and his wife last large numbers to let the government know The report goes on to say that in the view night, they informed me, attended an that they were angry and they were not of the committee: information session on the general going to put up with being treated in the The actions of DPC constitute a material practitioners in schools program that is way that this government treats the rest of obstruction of the processes of the about to begin. They informed me that Victoria. They sent that message right here committee, including the giving of under this program children from 11 years to Spring Street. They were very loud, they evidence, insofar as they: of age can access the school GP without were very vocal and they made it very clear their parents’ knowledge or consent and

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 17 that visit can be charged through the comprised of barbarians who use violence Bill 2017, I have to say that of all the parents’ Medicare. They informed me that and terror to suppress freedom in their complaints that I receive in my office children from 11 on can be referred to land. about government departments, the specialists without their parents’ consent Many friends and relatives of members Environment Protection Authority Victoria or knowledge. They also informed me that of the local Australian Vietnamese (EPA) tops the poll. The EPA is by far and a child — and I say ‘child’ advisedly — can community are suffering under the dead away the most unpopular government be given medication without a parent’s hand of a regime that treats its people like instrumentality in the state so far as my consent or knowledge. dirt beneath their feet. I stand shoulder to constituents are concerned. This program is an outrageous attack shoulder with my friends in the Australian Mr Davis interjected. on families and the rights of parents to Vietnamese community in calling for Mr FINN — Mr Davis has suggested raise their children as they see fit. This freedom in the nation of Vietnam, and I VicRoads might be there, and I have to say government is implementing a series of assure my friends that I will continue to VicRoads is up there, there is no doubt hardline, left-wing, ideological assaults on fight with them for that freedom. about that, but the EPA does shade it. I our children and on families in general, The PRESIDENT — Can I suggest, Mr have to say that clause 1 on page 1 of the and it has to stop. This has caused great Finn, that when you are contemplating bill sets out the main purposes of the bill, distress in the Werribee community among your wardrobe of a morning you might and the first is: those who attended the information actually check in with Ms Fitzherbert, (a) to provide for the continuation of the session last night and those who found because there is a distinct colour clash. … Authority … out about it today because, as you would imagine, there has been a great deal of There would be a good number of people discussion in the Werribee area as a result COUNCIL | Members statements in my electorate who would be absolutely of what they were told last night. As I was 17 October 2017 and totally opposed to that, and I am informed today, parents right across that duty-bound to inform the house of their region are fuming. They are very angry, and feelings on this occasion. Basically most of my view is that they have every right to be the complaints come about because of the angry. Richmond Football Ravenhall tip, the Cleanaway dump that Minister Wynne, the Minister for Planning, This is an assault on parents’ rights has just approved to be made possibly the to raise their children, to protect their Club biggest tip in the Southern Hemisphere, children and to do the right thing by Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — We all know the importance of Australian if not the world — it can be seen from the their children, and — not just on behalf moon and various other planets as well. of the constituents who raised it with me football to many, many people in this today but every responsible parent across state. It can send many of us spiralling into My constituents, particularly in Caroline Victoria — I ask the minister to act now depths of despair — and I speak from a Springs, Deer Park and places around to stop this program, to ensure that this fair bit of personal experience on that one. those suburbs, have been complaining program is not implemented and to ensure Alternatively, it can bring joy, euphoria, to me for an extended period of time that the rights of parents to protect their inspiration and indeed delirium, as it did about the lack of action by the EPA to children in the way that they see fit are on Saturday, 30 September 2017, when I stop the stench that they have to live with. protected in this state. joined a smidge over 100 000 others at the They have complained of illness, they MCG to see Richmond take out the Holy have complained of nausea, they have Grail: the AFL premiership. complained of headaches — and they COUNCIL | Members statements I have previously seen my Tigers lose have complained about a whole range of 21 September 2017 a grand final twice, in 1972 and 1982. I physical manifestations of the stench that remember leaving the G after the 1982 loss the Cleanaway tip provides those suburbs. thinking, ‘Well, at least we’ll be back next Despite many, many, many calls to the year’; 35 years later we finally made it, and EPA, no joy is coming from them. Still the Richmond Football after a 37-year drought we had our 11th people in Caroline Springs, Deer Park and flag. surrounds are left to cope with the horrid Club I will never forget the scenes at the stench that they are so often subjected to Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I ground as the siren signalled the ultimate from the Ravenhall tip. join Mr Leane in wishing all the very, very victory, or what followed on the streets It is quite astounding, when you consider best to the Richmond Football Club for a of Richmond for hours after. I am very that we have the EPA established to protect very, very big week ahead. glad I went to Bridge Road and not to people from these environmental outrages, Swan Street. My joy was only added to by that it will not do it. Why will it not do it? COUNCIL | Members statements having my 19-year-old daughter next to Why will the EPA not do its job? That is 21 September 2017 me. We saw our first Tigers premiership something that totally mystifies me. It is together, and it was quite an overwhelming mysterious in the extreme. The anger of experience. the local community is increased even My very warmest congratulations and further by Minister Wynne’s decision when Vietnamese gratitude go to coach of the year, Damien we consider that when the tip is expanded Hardwick; the captain, Trent Cotchin; of course the stench will increase and the community and every player, official and volunteer horrific nature of that landfill, that tip, will Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — One of the Richmond Football Club. A special increase as we see the size of it increase as of the great joys of my time in this chamber mention must go to the president, Peggy well. If the EPA will not do anything about has been getting to know the Australian O’Neal, and the CEO, Brendon Gale. They it now, one can assume fairly safely that Vietnamese community throughout much have performed a miracle, and they are it will not do anything about it once the of Melbourne’s west. They are great people, now legends. The tears that thousands expansion occurs. hardworking people, community-minded of us shed throughout the state a little We on this side of the house have made people, people who never take Australia over two weeks ago have dried, but it clear that we will not oppose this bill, for granted because they remember why the celebrations go on and on. Indeed and just maybe — we live in hope — this they and those before them fled Vietnam hundreds of thousands of Victorians will bill will do something to improve the level and the welcome that they received in their forever celebrate 2017 as the Year of the of effectiveness of the EPA, but the only new home. Tiger — we ate ‘em alive! reason that my constituents will be holding I am very proud of my friendship with their breath is that they cannot stand so many members of the Australian the stench. I have said to them, ‘If you’re COUNCIL | Second reading expecting great things from the EPA, don’t Vietnamese community, and it distresses 17 October 2017 me greatly to see them hurting, and hurting hold your breath’, but on most occasions they are. Today I am attending in this they actually cannot help it. They cannot building a briefing on human rights abuses even hold their breath — in Vietnam. The Vietnamese government Mr Ondarchie interjected. might like us all to think modern Vietnam Environment Mr FINN — I remember the Tullamarine. is a responsible, decent citizen of the Protection Bill 2017 That is going back to when I dealt with it in world, but sadly that is far from the truth. Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — In an earlier life, and indeed the EPA was not The Communist government in Vietnam is speaking to the Environment Protection a lot better then. But certainly the EPA now with regard to the Ravenhall tip has a huge

IN 18 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE amount to answer for. It is a non-effective to point out right at the beginning that the because let me say that if this government organisation. It is an organisation which is people of Sunbury and surrounds of the was serious about community safety, if chewing up government funds — taxpayers north-western suburbs have put up with a this government was serious about youth money — for a purpose, and it is just not great deal over the course of the widening justice in this state, they would dump this delivering. So just maybe this bill will get of the Tullamarine Freeway. We have come minister. She would already be out the the EPA’s act together. I sincerely hope it across a situation where the freeway has door. She would be an ex-minister because does, because as I said, at the moment been closed at regular intervals. We have she — from where I stand the EPA is very much constantly been subject to changing speed Ms Crozier interjected. a waste of taxpayers money; it is in fact limits, where we may be going from 80 to Mr FINN — Indeed. As Ms Crozier points a criminal waste of taxpayers money. 60 to 40, back to 80 and down to 40 again, out, she totally ignored the no-confidence Despite the best efforts of my constituents all in the space of 150 metres. motion that was passed, and she laughs to get to the minister, to get to anybody This is not a rare event at all about it. The Parliament condemns her. who will bring about some action to fix the unfortunately, but I really have to draw The Parliament passes a motion of no conditions under which they live, they get to the minister’s attention the state of confidence, and the arrogance of the nothing. the Sunbury Road extension onto the minister over there as she just sits there Mr Ondarchie interjected. Tullamarine Freeway. The surface could and laughs, as no doubt she laughs at the Mr FINN — The waste from the Metro probably best be compared to a Third victims of the youth crime wave that we Tunnel is another thing. I could talk about World goat track. It is nothing short of have seen in this state — what we are subjected to on Sunbury Road, disgraceful. It is causing a number of Ms Mikakos — On a point of order, which is pretty horrendous, I have got to vehicles damage, and I just cannot believe Acting President, I take offence at the tell you, but I will leave my comments that anyone could expect my constituents comment that Mr Finn has just made there in the hope that the bill will pass and to travel on this road. We know that in relation to laughing at the victims of might actually provide some improvement Sunbury Road has its own set of problems crime. I think if you look at my record and to what we have come to expect from the created by the government’s refusal to if you look at the youth justice legislation EPA, which is sadly all too little. duplicate that road, and we know that our government has just passed, which It is a sad situation that we face in the added traffic from Sunbury and the the coalition tried to scuttle, the record Victoria when we have an organisation Macedon Ranges to the airport is creating speaks very strongly for our government’s set up to protect the people from major problems there, but the extension support for victims of crime. I ask Mr Finn environmental vandalism and the EPA itself onto the Tullamarine Freeway, I have to withdraw that comment. will just not do that job. I hope that we do to say, is probably the worst surface I have The ACTING PRESIDENT (Ms Dunn) see some action on this front very, very ever seen on any road. — Thank you, Ms Mikakos. I would ask soon. I hope so for the sake of the EPA, It is truly disgraceful. I do not know if Mr Finn to withdraw his comments in and I sincerely hope so for the sake of my it is VicRoads and I do not know if it is relation to laughing at victims, without thousands of constituents in Caroline Transurban who are doing this, and quite qualification. Springs, Deer Park and surrounds who frankly I do not care. I just want it fixed, Mr FINN — Look, I am happy to have to put up with that stinking, rotting because this has been going on now for withdraw, but I ask: exactly what was hole in the ground at Ravenhall. It is many weeks. I do not know exactly how or the minister laughing at? If she was not beyond imagination what they have to with what they have caused the surface of laughing at the victims, what was she put up with from time to time, and it is this road to be the way it is. They must have laughing at? When we were referring — put a lot of time and a lot of effort into it, beyond imagination why the EPA has failed The ACTING PRESIDENT (Ms Dunn) monumentally to protect them. and if they put that much time and effort into creating this shocker of a road, then — Mr Finn! I ask you to withdraw without surely they can put a little bit of time into qualification. COUNCIL | Constituency questions fixing it. Mr FINN — There was no qualification, 17 October 2017 I am asking the minister to ensure that a Acting President, and I have withdrawn. proper surface is restored to Sunbury Road The ACTING PRESIDENT (Ms Dunn) — where it meets the Tullamarine Freeway, You will proceed with your contribution, and if the minister would like me to line and thank you for that withdrawal. Tullamarine up thousands of people who are prepared Mr FINN — It seems we have one rule to give evidence as to the state of the road for one side and a different rule for the Freeway congestion and the state of the surface of the road, other side. That is fair enough, I suppose, Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) then I am very happy to do that as well. But as long as — — My constituency question is to the I ask the minister as a matter of urgency to Minister for Roads and Road Safety. This The ACTING PRESIDENT (Ms Dunn) — ensure that a proper surface is restored to Mr Finn! That comment was out of line and morning as I sat in stationary traffic on the Sunbury Road and Tullamarine Freeway. Tullamarine Freeway I wondered what my a reflection on the Chair. I would bring you fellow motorists were thinking. As traffic back to the bill you are talking about. crawled a few metres and then came to a COUNCIL | Second reading Mr FINN — As long as we are aware of further standstill, I wondered if my fellow 18 October 2017 the rules that we are working under. This motorists were wanting a solution to the minister is a disgrace. She is a disgrace, daily gridlock they face. As we continued and I do not think there is anybody in this to crawl toward the city, I wondered if state or anybody on the other side of this my fellow motorists were grateful for an Children, Youth house, if they were honest, who would extra lane to sit in every day and were not agree with that summation of her. She infuriated by the $1.3 billion wasted to and Families is a disgrace. She has gone from disaster stop a road that even Sir Rod Eddington to disaster in this place on youth justice says we desperately need. On behalf of my since she took over as the minister. She is fellow motorists this morning, I ask: what Amendment (Youth lovingly referred to around the place as the plan does the minister have to alleviate Minister for Pizza and Coke because she is Offenders) Bill 2016 responsible for basically trying to pay off the appalling traffic congestion on the Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — In Tullamarine Freeway? young offenders — rising to speak to the Children, Youth and Ms Crozier — Bribe them. Families Amendment (Youth Offenders) COUNCIL | Adjournment Bill 2016 I commend Ms Crozier for Mr FINN — bribe them indeed, Ms 17 October 2017 bringing this legislation to the house. I Crozier — with takeaway food, which you can express the support of huge numbers would have to say is a novel approach. It of my constituency who are very much has not worked, but it is a novel approach. looking forward to Ms Crozier taking over Ms Mikakos interjected. Sunbury Road this portfolio after the next election. She Mr FINN — Look, calm down. Just calm will be an outstanding minister. I was going down. If you put as much energy into your upgrade to say that she will be a lot better than the portfolio as you do into interjecting, you Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My current minister, but that is damning her would go a lot better. You would go a lot adjournment for this evening is to the with faint praise, I would suggest to you better, let me tell you, and we would all be Minister for Roads and Road Safety. I have very strongly. You would not have to try better for it. We heard Ms Shing banging too hard to be better than this minister, on for close to 45 minutes. It was a tribute

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 19 to her capacity for talking nonsense — and four-legged creatures is really appropriate wrong faction in the ALP or indeed if you I cleaned that up significantly. But the to the debate we have before us. challenge the Premier in any way. But the bottom line is even she ran out of steam Honourable members interjecting. fact of the matter is that this incompetent, after about 45 minutes — even she could The ACTING PRESIDENT (Ms Dunn) disgraceful minister is kept in her place not keep going. She continued with the — Order! Ms Crozier! Ms Mikakos, I am by a Premier who is merely looking after government’s narrative that we do not trying to rule on your point of order at the his mates. In the same way that he looks have a crime problem in Victoria. Now if moment. If I have to get on my feet, I will, after Peter Marshall, John Setka and all the the government is seriously suggesting but I should not have to. Mr Finn, I ask others, he is just looking after his factional that we do not have a crime problem in you to withdraw your comment — it was mates. As a result, youth justice in this Victoria, can I suggest to the minister, can unnecessary. I draw you back to the bill state has gone to hell in a handcart. It is a I suggest to the Premier, can I suggest to before us today. direct result of the Premier’s protection of any member of the government that they Mr FINN — I am happy to withdraw. this incompetent minister — this minister go out and they talk to Victorians? They I was merely quoting a former prime who is clearly way out of her depth in should go out to the western suburbs and minister, who I understand Minister this portfolio and possibly any other, but talk to people, go out and talk to people Mikakos idolises — same faction and all. It certainly in this portfolio — that youth who have had their homes invaded, go out is all very well for the Socialist Left to use justice has just totally deteriorated in and talk to people who have been robbed, the dreadful word ‘poodle’. There, I said it: this state to the point where down in the who have been carjacked. poodle. Should I spell it? It is all right for Parkville youth detention centre we have Ms Crozier — Like being home invaded. the Labor Party to dish it out, but when had the riots and the destruction of the Mr FINN — Indeed; it is a real issue. I we use that dreadful word ‘poodle’, we are place. I understand it is being rebuilt at a have to say to you it is the single biggest asked to withdraw. What a nonsense! But cost of millions of dollars. The damage bill issue that we have faced in the last two it is indicative of what this minister has was millions of dollars as a direct result and a half years; there is no doubt about done to her portfolio. The whole thing is a of what this minister did or indeed what that at all. And the government sat on its nonsense. she did not do. Perhaps she did not get the pizzas there fast enough on that occasion. hands and did nothing. It is now claiming Ms Mikakos interjected. credit for putting some sort of plateau Perhaps it was Coke Zero and not the Mr FINN — And if she kept her mouth strong stuff; they might have objected to on the crime figures. The reality is that shut for long enough, she might actually we would not have had the crime issue if that. hear what I am saying. She is sitting over So I very strongly support this bill. I the government had actually done its job there yapping like a — to start with, and I am talking about the commend Ms Crozier again for bringing Minister for Police, I am talking about the The ACTING PRESIDENT (Ms Dunn) this bill before the house. I, like the Attorney-General and I am most certainly — Mr Finn, I draw you back to the motion overwhelming majority of Victorians, talking about Minister Mikakos. She has before us. cannot wait until November next year been requested time and time again to Mr FINN — Look, I am very happy to when Ms Crozier takes over this portfolio. do her job properly, and unfortunately go back to the bill before the house, but Once again we will have in this state a for Victoria and unfortunately for us all — I would ask you, Acting President, to ask minister for youth justice who actually more so than for her — she has not been the minister to cease interjecting. She is has the ability to do the job and is not able to do that. over there just carrying on, as I said earlier, incompetent. I almost used the p-word, I recall earlier this year meeting with like a two-bob watch — and I hope that is but I will not do that. Ms Mikakos is just a family from Hoppers Crossing in my not offensive to anybody. She is over there totally incompetent, and the overwhelming electorate. Their son has autism. Over throwing mud left, right and centre. I ask majority of Victorians cannot wait to see a period of time he had built up the you to ask her to refrain from her particular her out the door. confidence and the ability to actually catch behaviour, and then I will not be forced to the bus under his own steam — to get on use the p-word again. COUNCIL | Constituency questions the bus. He had gained some degree of Ms Mikakos — You’re a clown; no-one 18 October 2017 independence, and it was not easy. It is takes you seriously anyway. not easy for a young fellow with autism Mr FINN — You are not serious at all. to do that, but he had done that. He was The fact of the matter is that underneath assaulted by a gang on that bus: he was Ms Mikakos’s regime youth justice in this Jacksons Hill robbed, he was bashed. And of course state is stuff-up central. That is what it is: not only was it an immediate crime — it is stuff-up central. She has gone from Sunbury obviously the crime of theft and physical one disaster to another. Day to day, week Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My violence — but it destroyed his confidence, to month she has just stumbled from constituency question is to the Minister it removed his independence. It was a vile one disaster to another. She has totally for Planning. I refer the minister to the and a vicious act that occurred on that bus stuffed up her portfolio. If she was not in ongoing disintegration of the buildings in Hoppers Crossing not so long ago. These the Premier’s faction, she would already atop Jacksons Hill in Sunbury that are the sorts of issues that this government be out the door. If she was not under the previously housed a Victoria University does not want to know about. These are protection of the Premier’s faction, she campus. Since the closure of the university the sorts of incidents that the government would be out like one of her parolees. campus during the years of the Brumby seems to be in denial about. She would be on the street. It is just government the grand buildings have sat More than any other minister, Minister sickening to so many Victorians to see this idle, and they are rapidly falling into a state Mikakos does not want to know what is minister continue on. I have to say one of of disrepair. The time has passed for action going on in the real world; she just does the questions that has been asked of me to protect these buildings and put them not want to know. When we point it out to time and time again is, ‘How does Jenny to good use. I ask: what plans does the her, she jumps up and she feigns outrage. Mikakos keep her job?’. That is what people minister have to put these buildings back She carries on like a two-bob watch more ask me. I tell you what, if I had a dollar for into service for the benefit of the Sunbury often than not. every time I have been asked, ‘How does community? Ms Crozier — She attacks everyone. Jenny Mikakos keep her job?’, I would be a very, very wealthy man. I would be a very Mr FINN — Yes, as Ms Crozier says, she wealthy man, let me assure you. COUNCIL | Adjournment attacks everyone. She clearly believes that 18 October 2017 attack is the best form of defence, and she Ms Crozier — We know the answer. often gets in first. The fact of the matter is Mr FINN — We do know the answer, that she has been a disaster of a minister. Ms Crozier. The fact of the matter is she is Ms Mikakos interjected. under the protection of the Premier. She is under the protection of the Premier Williamstown level Mr FINN — And she is sitting over there because she is a member of the Socialist yapping away like a little poodle of some Left faction. If she was in Labor Unity, if crossings type. She is — she was in the National Union of Workers Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I Ms Mikakos — On a point of order, or if she was in any of the other factions in wish to raise a matter this evening for Acting President, I just think the language the ALP, she would be out the door. the attention of the Minister for Public Transport, the Honourable Jacinta Allan. It that the member is using is really Ms Crozier — Ask Mr Somyurek. unnecessary. I ask him to come back to the concerns the very real worry that a growing motion we have before us. I do not think Mr FINN — Yes, we should ask Mr group of people in Williamstown have — referring to members as being in some way Somyurek what happens if you are in the that they are about to have sky rail inflicted

IN 20 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE upon them. The removal of level crossings COUNCIL | Constituency questions I ask the minister to use whatever at Williamstown, particularly at Ferguson 20 October 2017 influence he has with Transurban to Street, is something that does not concern ensure that that regime, the new regime these good people significantly enough of reducing the tolls in direct correlation for them to have formed themselves into with the reduction in the speed limit, is an official group and to have lobbied local West Gate Tunnel introduced as soon as is possible. I believe MPs, but they have certainly come to see that it is long overdue, and I believe it me and have kept me in contact with project would go some way towards reducing the problem over a number of months Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My the inconvenience felt by many tens of now. Whilst they have been prosecuting constituency question is to the Minister thousands of people in the north-west of the case they have also been attempting for Roads and Road Safety. The $5.5 billion Melbourne. to gain a meeting with Minister Allan. West Gate Tunnel project is still largely a That unfortunately has not come to pass. mystery to the general community and COUNCIL | Petitions I understand that they have tried just in particular to the residents in the west 31 October 2017 recently again through the member for directly impacted by this dog of a project. Williamstown, Mr Noonan, who has, I The role of Transurban, as the biggest and am reliably informed, not been able to probably sole beneficiary of the project, is organise such a meeting. also one of the great mysteries of our time. It seems to me that this is an issue that In order to settle concerns expressed by Sunbury does impact a huge number of people locals, will the minister make public the development in the Williamstown area. The people role of Transurban in the West Gate Tunnel Legislative Council electronic petition: of Williamstown are seeing what is project and the time lines of any contracts happening on the Caulfield line in some or memoranda of understanding either The petition of certain citizens of the state of Victoria draws to the attention of the areas Carnegie-way over on the already signed or under consideration? of the Legislative Council the Jacksons other side of town, and they do not want Creek valley, Sunbury, Victoria, Australia, to see that happen in Williamstown. COUNCIL | Adjournment from Rupertswood Mansion to the Emu Williamstown is a great place; it is a very, Bottom wetlands needs to be saved very nice place. I wish I could afford to live 20 October 2017 from being built on. This historic valley there, in fact, but it seems the only people has 1000-year-old Aboriginal rings. Our that can afford to live there these days are first European settlers came here. We Labor MPs — have the state-significant Canon Gully CityLink- and many endangered fauna species. Mr Ondarchie — Not in their electorates. It’s the same valley that Victoria’s oldest Mr FINN — Not in their electorates, homestead is located in. Sunbury has but that is beside the point. My concern Tullamarine 19 000 homes planned, and this valley has is that Williamstown will be ruined by a 406 planned. That’s only 2 per cent of the sky rail or sky rails. That is something that Freeway widening total that needs to be stopped to ensure Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I this beautiful historic valley is saved for all also obviously is of great concern to the wish to raise a matter for the attention of future generations of Victorians to enjoy. people of Williamstown. So I am asking the Minister for Roads and Road Safety, The petitioners therefore request that the minister, given that she obviously has and it does concern the ongoing widening a very, very busy schedule and it is a tad the Legislative Council call on the process on the Tullamarine Freeway. By government to ensure no housing or other impractical to expect her to meet every way of example, last night I was on my way buildings other than a tourist-museum- one of these people in Williamstown home up the Tullamarine Freeway and education centre (not a school) in the individually, to join me at a public meeting for most of that trip we were travelling at a Jacksons Creek valley from Jacksons Creek in Williamstown to meet with the local speed limit of 40 kilometres an hour. I have at the rear of Rupertswood Mansion to the community. They say that they have not boundary of the Emu Bottom wetlands to say to you that I abided by the speed across to Racecourse Road and 400 been consulted at all, and I understand limit and was actively looking for anybody that to be correct. Here is an opportunity metres east of the well-defined ridge line who was actually doing any roadworks. I that follows Jacksons Creek, Sunbury, and to hear not from the Liberals — because failed to see anybody for the space of about the green wedge and rural conservation I know the minister is going to say, ‘Oh, 3 or 4 kilometres. zones to remain. this is all a Liberal plot to stop the removal There were no roadworks going on on By Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) of railway crossings’ — but from the (609 signatures). community. I ask the minister to make that occasion, and as I have explained a time, and I will make a time, so we to the house before, travellers on the can meet with the local community in Tullamarine Freeway are frequently faced COUNCIL | Economy and Infrastruc- Williamstown to hear their concerns. with speed limit changes from 80 to 40 ture Standing C’tee, 31 Oct 2017 to 60 and back down to 40 again and so forth. This obviously has caused enormous COUNCIL | Constituency questions disruption to traffic on the Tullamarine 19 October 2017 Freeway, and it would not at all surprise me to learn that there are people who have VicForests actually missed their planes as a result of operations having been caught on the freeway with Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) Williamstown sky these really weird speed change patterns. presented report, including appendix, It occurs to me that a good way of extracts of proceedings and minority rail perhaps discouraging Transurban from report, together with transcripts of Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) conducting what may well be a strange evidence. — My constituency question is to the social experiment is to ensure that the tolls Laid on table. Minister for Public Transport. Many of my on the Tullamarine Freeway are reduced constituents in Williamstown are deeply by exactly the same amount as the speed Ordered that report be published. concerned about the impact of sky rail on limit. So if the speed limit is reduced by 60 Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I their suburb. They are most keen to tell per cent, the tolls should be reduced by 60 move: the minister firsthand of their concerns. I per cent; if it is reduced by 80 per cent, the That the Council take note of the report. am just as enthusiastic about facilitating tolls should be reduced by 80 per cent; and In moving this motion, I point out that a meeting between Williamstown locals of course if the freeway is closed altogether, a great deal of work has gone into this and the minister to discuss this matter. as we have seen, and it is after the tolling report. I commend my fellow committee Following on from my adjournment point, there should be no toll at all. I think members, who whatever their views may contribution of yesterday, when Minister that is a more than reasonable thing, and I have been came to this committee table Dalidakis refused to pass on my request think that it would be very, very popular. I with the best of intentions and advanced for such a meeting, will the minister make know it probably does not affect the people their arguments in a civilised, decent and herself available to visit Williamstown of Northcote, but it certainly would affect respectful manner, which is always a big to meet with worried locals about the the people of the north-western suburbs, tick. Indeed it is always a very big tick, as I proposed level crossing removal? and they would be very, very pleased if the am sure Mr Jennings will agree. minister were to take action to ensure that that regime was brought into play.

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 21 I would like to commend the deputy at all. In the case of the Heyfield mill, whilst believed. chair, Mr Gepp, Mr Bourman, Ms Dunn, it was welcome in the immediate sense, Freedom of information documents Mr Eideh — although he was not there in the long term you have to ask if that is a previously denied in full for months by the much — Mr Leane, Mr O’Sullivan and viable way of doing things. Department of Health and Human Services Mr Ondarchie for their contributions to We do need the government to get its act have been released by the Department of this report. I also commend the staff of together on this one and VicForests to get Justice and Regulation and show evidence the committee: Pamie Fung, the inquiry its act together, and the forest industry task — real evidence — that stockpiling of officer, and Caitlin Grover, the research force might actually like to do something medication in youth justice cells occurs. officer, who both put a great deal of work full stop. That would be a really good start. Minister, when were you made aware of into putting this together; Prue Purdey, the I recommend the report to the house and this practice occurring in youth justice, administrative officer, who does a great suggest to the house that it is a particularly or will you still claim the Sergeant Shultz job; and Lilian Topic, the secretary of the good read. defence of knowing nothing? committee and chief slavedriver — as we have come to know her with a great deal Supplementary question of affection, and, as you say, Ms Crozier, in COUNCIL | Members statements the nicest possible way. 31 October 2017 Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I This report looks at the important thank the minister for her fascinating and complex area of supply of timber to response, and I can only assume having industry in compliance with regulatory listened to that that she travels to Sydney standards. Obviously we have some Minister for Roads via Perth. My supplementary question is: significant issues in a number of timber Minister, further on contraband in youth areas throughout the state, and my focus and Road Safety justice centres, drug paraphernalia, white throughout this inquiry has been on Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — If powder, methadone and ice were among employment within the timber industry ever there was a government that has some of the items also seized from youth and the need to ensure the sustainability of completely lost its way, it is the Andrews justice centres under your watch. jobs. We are not just talking about people’s Socialist Left government. They are not Ms Mikakos interjected. jobs. We are talking about families’ happy with just wasting billions of taxpayer Mr FINN — That is right. Minister, you livelihoods and we are talking about dollars, multiple acts of shysterism have previously also denied these items communities’ livelihoods. We are talking and backflips on issues as far apart were in the youth justice system. Will you about the future of townships that are on as euthanasia and shooting galleries. now advise the house that in fact these the line just at the minute. We know they have totally lost it when items are in our youth justice centres ministers of the Andrews government start and indicate how many of these items of The forest, fibre and wood products giving up on their own portfolios. industry directly employs around 21 000 white powder, ice, white crystals and drug people across the state, and indirectly Despite bedlam on our roads on a daily paraphernalia have been seized in 2017 so supports another 40 000 to 50 000 jobs basis and the desperate need for action far? through flow-on economic activity. A from the government, the Minister for lot of people depend on the future of Roads and Road Safety, Luke Donnellan, yesterday threw his hands in the air and COUNCIL | Constituency questions the industry, to put not too fine a point 31 October 2017 on it. I believe to ensure the long-term told motorists, ‘Take public transport’. How sustainability of jobs the forest, fibre pathetic is that? That is totally pathetic. A and wood products industry would minister of the Crown publicly admitted benefit from improved management and defeat. A minister of the Crown publicly accountability by VicForests. We need admitted that it has all got too much for Gap Road and more robust planning by the Victorian him. Perhaps Minister Donnellan thinks government for the long-term transition that, like him, we all live in the inner city Horne Street of the industry. We also need ongoing with a tram at the door. That is not the case transparency and accuracy around the at all. He really needs to get out more. He Sunbury supply of timber so that the industry has might even like to get out as far as Narre Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My a clear understanding about what it can Warren from time to time, which is a long constituency question is to the Minister achieve in any given period. We need way from Fitzroy, I can tell you. for Roads and Road Safety. Minister, on a certainty from the government with regard The motorists of Victoria need a minister number of occasions I have asked about to this area. who is serious about his portfolio; they the government’s plans to remove the roundabout of fortune — or is it misfortune The forest industry task force was need someone who understands what needs to be done and will do it. As they sit — on the corner of Gap Road and Horne established by the state government in Street in Sunbury. As Sunbury continues November 2015. The task force includes in traffic gridlock right across Melbourne they want a congestion beater not a to grow, so does the traffic volume, as representation from the forestry industry does the danger level of this particular and union and environmental groups, and minister hiding under his desk waving a white flag. He might like to blame the roundabout. As we approach the end of was formed with the purpose of reaching 2017, will the minister confirm when the a consensus on recommendations and Premier, but the fact is the buck stops with him. Minister Donnellan should now physical construction of this removal will proposals to government about issues begin and when it will be finished? facing the timber industry, job protection, resign. economic activity and protection of threatened species. However, we have COUNCIL | Questions without notice COUNCIL | Adjournment heard very little from this task force, which 31 October 2017 31 October 2017 is yet to provide recommendations to government. It is my very strong view that funding may be better spent elsewhere on assisting those working in the industry Youth justice Opal Seahaven or on supporting measures to enhance Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I the industry’s competitiveness within the centres wish to raise a matter this evening for the global market for fibre and wood products. Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My Minister for Consumer Affairs, Gaming These are issues that need addressing question is to the Minister for Families and Liquor Regulation, and it concerns by government, and the fact that the forest and Children. Minister, contraband is an a matter that has come to my attention industry task force is yet to actually put ongoing issue in our youth justice centres, very recently. A major 110-bed nursing forward an idea after two years seems, to and you have been previously questioned home exists in Inverloch and is the home me, incongruous to say the very least. It is as to why medication was being put of elderly and, in many cases, feeble indicative of a situation where people in through the slots of cells and if young and immobile residents. It is owned and the industry, right throughout the state, offenders were stockpiling medication. At operated by Opal Aged Care and is known really do not know what is in their future. the time you dismissed this, stating, and I as Opal Seahaven, Inverloch. Many of the They really do not know from one week to quote: residents are between 90 and 100 years of age and are very frail. the next what the government is going to … post-Trump, post-truth world where decide, what recommendations will be put they effectively just make things up Over recent months a refurbishment of forward and indeed if they have any future and hope that some of it is going to be 40 bathrooms has been underway at this facility, which has involved stripping out in

IN 22 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE their entirety six bathrooms at a time. The none of the undersigned owner-occupiers — that is, the attitude of Australians strip-out removes all toilets, handbasins ever received any such notice, thereby and indeed Victorians to government in and showers, then the floor tiles are depriving them of the opportunity to seek general. There is no doubt that the average jackhammered out. You can imagine the advice and respond; voter, the average Australian — and I do noise, the dust and the mess. The residents on 15 December 2014 the court made a not use that term in a pejorative sense, are woken early and removed from their declaration ‘that the plaintiffs had given because to be an average Australian is a rooms at 7.00 a.m., allowing tradies to the notifications as required’; and great thing and something that everybody work unrestricted all day up to 4.00 p.m., on 26 February 2016 Associate Justice should be very proud of — does not have following which, amazingly, residents are Nemeer Mukhtar granted the application, a very, very high opinion of politics and returned to their rooms. Unfortunately the having decided, ‘Since those last orders, politicians. I used to say when Mother cleaners at this facility finish their shift at the plaintiffs have still not received any Teresa was alive that if she came to written objections to the application by 3.00 p.m. That is something that is of major any person. The application is unopposed Australia today she would be hailed as concern. …’. one of the great humanitarians of our time It was with disbelief that I learned that and a living saint but if she announced The petitioners also draw to your attention the day after that that she was entering these elderly, vulnerable residents are that the legal services commissioner will still occupying these rooms whilst this not entertain complaints about lawyers Parliament she would become a dirtbag several-week renovation takes place. Much from anyone other than the clients of in the view of the average Australian. That of the day, all night and all weekend they those lawyers. is unfortunately the truth of the matter. are living in their room with no toilet, no The petitioners therefore request that People out there think we are all on the handbasin, no shower — zero facilities. the Legislative Council inquire into their take — they think we are all thieves and This is a disgrace. concerns with a view to reporting its shysters — and they think the country is We recently had a long weekend here findings and making recommendations. full of thieves and communists. Looking in Victoria, as I am sure members would By Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) (20 at the Andrews government, you can be aware. For these residents it was three signatures). understand why they have that attitude. days and three nights straight without a Arrogance and bullying are two things that are clearly marks of this government toilet, handbasin or shower. It beggars COUNCIL | Government belief, does it not, and I believe that Opal and particularly this Premier, who has must be held to account. That there are performance, 01 November 2017 bullied, I think, just about everybody he elderly people sleeping in Inverloch can find from his own cabinet ministers tonight without facilities of any kind to people on the street. His arrogance is something which will outrage most knows no end. His arrogance is quite people and certainly outrages me. In their Government extraordinary. Here is a man who in his twilight years, having lived through the own mind can do no wrong. Here is a man Great Depression and World War II, in performance who knows everything about everything. which some of them served, they have now Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I This is our Premier, Daniel Andrews. How been reduced to living below Third World move: dare anybody question him on anything? standards. We need to stand up for them That this house notes the ongoing crisis in He is the depositary of all knowledge — and fight for what they believe is a basic the Andrews government, including, but Mrs Peulich — Repository. not limited to — standard of living. These people have been Mr FINN — ‘Repository’; I am sorry. It treated in a disgusting and inexcusable (1) the Ombudsman’s investigation into could be the depositary as well! manner by Opal Aged Care, who clearly the Labor red shirt electorate officer rorts scandal; Mr Ramsay interjected. put profit before people. A full inquiry by Mr FINN — I know there are a few the state government is needed to ensure (2) the Fair Work Commission people, Mr Ramsay, who would like to that this situation is rectified and, perhaps investigation into the former Government Whip, Cesar Melhem; make a deposit in or around the Premier, just as importantly, that it is never allowed but in fact he is the repository of all to happen again. (3) the Victoria Police investigation into knowledge. How dare anybody question I ask the Minister for Consumer the rorting claims of a second residence him at all? The fact of the matter is that Affairs, Gaming and Liquor Regulation allowance by the former Speaker and Deputy Speaker; he leads a government which is very, very to investigate what is going on at Opal open to charges of corruption. He leads a Seahaven in Inverloch to ensure that the (4) the IBAC investigation into the government that, if it was in Queensland, situation is rectified and to ensure that Deputy President and printing invoices for membership scandal; and would already be under investigation by this sort of disgraceful situation is never more bodies than you could poke a stick at. allowed to happen again. (5) the IBAC investigation into Victoria In fact if Daniel Andrews was the Premier Police’s handling of the collision involving the now Premier’s taxpayer-funded of Queensland, he probably would have COUNCIL | Petitions vehicle in January 2013. been sacked by now and there would have 01 November 2017 been an investigation, but unfortunately The Minister for Health, Ms Hennessy, — and I say that advisedly — he is the may think otherwise, but the Andrews Premier of Victoria, and we are stuck with government’s favourite four-letter word him. He is absolutely getting away with is ‘rort’ — that is the fact of the matter. murder. Legal services I understand that Ms Hennessy is now doing a little bit of work for the Northern Mrs Peulich — And he will increase that. commissioner Territory tourist commission, but we will Mr FINN — He will increase that — To the Legislative Council of Victoria: leave that where it is. my word he will. You think he is bad The petition of certain citizens of the state Victorians from one end of the state to now. What would he be like if he won of Victoria draws to the attention of the the other are asking themselves: ‘Is this in November next year? God help as all! Legislative Council that: government corrupt? Do we have a mob of What would he be like as Premier of this on 29 July 1919 a Collins Street estate crooks on Spring Street running this state?’. state, given how he treats his own people, agent, Edward Vernon Jones Esq., sold Increasingly the response to that question members of his own party, if he happened lot 3 of a 103-lot subdivision to a Mrs is yes. The Andrews government has been to fall over the line next November? Caroline Mary Curran, then of Parkville, Mrs Peulich — He is frightening. under covenant that she would not build in office now for almost three years — more than one dwelling house on that God, it seems like a hell of a lot longer! Mr FINN — It is frightening. lot (now known as 73 Raleigh Road, They have built up quite a reputation for Mrs Peulich — No, he is frightening. Maribyrnong); themselves — an extraordinary reputation Mr FINN — He is very frightening. In fact on 26 August 2014 an application was for incompetence, an extraordinary I saw him yesterday, and I complimented made to the Supreme Court of Victoria by reputation for waste and an extraordinary him on the Halloween costume that he the current co-owner of Mrs Curran’s lot, reputation for shysterism. It is the latter was wearing. He informed me that in fact Footscray solicitor Luke Luat Thien Tran, — the shysterism, the shonkiness, the he was not wearing any costume at all. But to change the 1919 covenant to instead dodginess, the sniffiness — that we are that is another point altogether. allow ‘three dwelling houses’ on the lot; having a look at in this motion here today. This government is a government that, on 26 September 2014 the court made It is something that I have been as I said, is open to charges of corruption. orders requiring notice of this application concerned about for a very long time, Certainly when people look at this be given to landowners having the benefit and it falls in with my other great concern of the covenant; government it is not surprising that they

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 23 have no faith in politicians, because this government was incompetent. They had If it is not in the millions, I would be Andrews government has given nobody in no idea what they were doing. They in fact staggered, because we all know that QCs this state any reason to have faith in this stuffed the state. do not come cheap. We all know that our Parliament, it has given nobody any reason Mr Ondarchie — Tony Sheehan. brothers and sisters in the legal fraternity to have faith in the government and it has Mr FINN — Well, Tony Sheehan, Tom know a good gig when they see one, and given nobody any reason to have faith in Roper — you name it. They were all there. this most certainly was from their point of members of this Parliament. That I think is Mr Ondarchie — Peter Spyker. view a good gig, but it was not a good gig very, very sad indeed, because everybody in the view of the Victorian taxpayer. We in this country — everybody in this state — Mr FINN — I will get to him in a minute. have a situation here where not only has has a right, I believe, to have a belief that I well remember the day I found out that the Andrews government ripped them off the government and the Parliament are Tom Roper had been made Treasurer. I had — ripped off the Victorian taxpayer — it doing the right thing by them. Everybody to check the diary. I looked at the calendar, has then, to add insult to injury, used the has that right. But they cannot and do not and I said, ‘It’s not April the 1st, is it?’. I victims’ money to try to cover it up. could not believe it. But back then you had have that right here in Victoria, because Mr Ondarchie — It sounds like a joke. they know — indeed we all know — that people like Peter Spyker. He was I think the transport minister back in those days, and Mr FINN — Well, if Monty Python the first and foremost beneficiary of came up with it, you would not believe it, everything that this government does is he was just hopeless. I mean he was a nice chap, but fair dinkum, he had no idea what would you? You would not believe it. If P. J. itself. That is what it is all about. They are O’Rourke wrote a book about it, you would all about themselves. They do not care. he was doing. But nobody was saying back then that Tom Roper, Tony Sheehan, Joan say, ‘That’s a bit far-fetched’. You would. They do not care about the people of this But here in Victoria it is reality. Comedy state. They do not care about, it seems, Kirner, John Cain or Rob Jolly — Mr Ondarchie interjected. is reality in Victoria, because here is a their own reputation. All they care about is government that has no qualms at all, not winning a quick vote. All they care about is Mr FINN — Haermeyer was after them; a worry in the world, about ripping off the looking after their mates. And God knows, that is right. He came in in 1992 as well I taxpayer — to the tune of God knows how have we not seen a few incidents of that think. much — and then trying to cover it up by over the journey. But nobody was saying that any of those spending 10, 20, 30 times as much. It is a And of course right now with the ministers prior to 1992 were corrupt. They fascinating way to do business, but that is Northcote by-election in full swing we see were saying that they were guilty of gross the Andrews government here in Victoria. a Premier who should be on the Olympic incompetence that left the state almost One of these days the truth will come diving backflip team, he is doing such an bankrupt — very close to bankrupt. In out about this. It may well be post- extraordinary job of backflips on just about fact if the cabinet of the day had been November next year. It may well be the Guy every issue known to man. a company board, they would not have government that exposes the truth as to Mrs Peulich — It’s called lying. just been sacked, Mr Ondarchie, they what the Andrews government has been Mr FINN — Unfortunately, Mrs Peulich, would have been locked up. They would up to over the past three years. You cannot I cannot use that terminology because — have been charged, and they would begin to imagine what they are going to get have been locked up for trading while Mrs Peulich — I can. up to over the next 12 months, because we insolvent. That is the fact of the matter. know that, come election time — and I am Mr FINN — Yes, I think you just did, and What was happening back then was just I hope Hansard picked it up. But I cannot sure even the Greens will agree with me on extraordinary. We had train drivers being this one — the ALP will do anything and use that because that would be grossly paid with cheques from the Gas and Fuel unparliamentary, and that is something, as they will say anything. As we saw at the last Corporation of Victoria and all sorts of election, they will rip the taxpayer off using I am sure the house would be aware, that I weird and wonderful things going on. would never indulge in; that is for sure. staff, who nobody has ever seen before So we had that classic example of and probably has not seen since, to bolster But we have before the house a what the Labor Party does while they number of issues under discussion at their campaigns. They will put them in the are in government, and they were most marginal seats. Possibly, at times, when the moment, related but not limited to certainly guilty of gross incompetence and the Ombudsman’s investigation into the they are not dressed in red shirts, they may of trashing the state and its reputation. well put them in firemen suits and firemen Labor red shirt electorate officer rorts We well remember — and I am sure Mr scandal. The Ombudsman has this under helmets and put them on polling booths Ondarchie does; he will join me in saying — all courtesy of the Victorian taxpayer. So investigation, so I am a bit loath to go into this — ‘What is the capital of Victoria? too much detail, but I think the people if they did that prior to the 2014 election About 7 cents’. We remember those jokes. — that is when they were in opposition — of Victoria have a right to feel that they It was an embarrassment as a Victorian have been cheated. I think the people of can you imagine what they are going to do to travel interstate, because wherever you in government in the lead-up to the 2018 Victoria have a right to feel that they have went people would drag that out and have been ripped off. It is clear, even from the election? a good laugh at your expense. But there Mr Ondarchie interjected. most cursory glance at what has happened were never at any time accusations of here, that there has been shysterism afoot corruption on the part of the Cain or the Mr FINN — Well, the old story is that the by this government. In fact they would Kirner governments. Labor Party gets 97 per cent of the vote at not be the government without the sort the Fawkner cemetery booth — you might Move on to 2017 and look at the Andrews remember that, Mr Ondarchie — and the of shysterism that we are talking about. government. It is not just the same But putting that aside, as I said, that is a other 3 per cent, I am not sure, might have level of incompetence as the Cain and fallen down a hole. matter for the Ombudsman, and I am sure Kirner governments but another level of she will do a very good job in reporting on corruption that we are seeing. It is not just Mr Ondarchie — Literally. this. What I think is probably worse than corruption but a cover-up mentality. There Mr FINN — Quite literally. We have a the red shirt scandal is the attempts by this is the fact that they have not only taken government here that is prepared to do government to cover up — the attempts the Ombudsman to the Victorian Supreme anything to stay in power — or anything by this government to hide what they have Court — you would have thought that any to get elected, as it did prior to 2014. But done. government that was trying to hide what we know that over the next 12 months Mr Ondarchie — Guilty. they were doing would be happy enough we will have to watch this crowd like a Mr FINN — They are guilty; indeed they with taking the matter to the Victorian hawk. Let me warn the government — let are very much, Mr Ondarchie. They are the Supreme Court — but of course when they me warn the minister and let me warn guilty party. lost in the Victorian Supreme Court, where other members of the government in Mrs Peulich — The guilty party is back. did they go? They were off to Canberra. the chamber — that we will watch this Mr FINN — The guilty party is back, Mrs Mr Ondarchie — With whose money? government like a hawk, because we know Peulich. The guilty party is most certainly that the Andrews government cannot be Mr FINN — You suspect that Mr trusted by anyone to do the right thing. back. And I tell you what, those of us who Andrews has always wanted to go to were elected in 1992 — Mrs Peulich was If you are talking about trust and the Canberra, but in this instance he went to Andrews government, boy, have you come one of them, I was another and there are a Canberra using our money. He went to few of us still left around the place — well to the wrong place, because there is no the High Court of Australia, and I would connection between the two at all. It is remember the strength of the ‘Guilty Party’ be fascinated to know how much this television and media campaign. That was something that you would only dream government has spent of taxpayers money about, and then you would probably have directed at a Premier who was not corrupt. taking this matter to the Supreme Court of Certainly she was incompetent, and her to get some psychoanalysis afterwards to Victoria and to the High Court of Australia. recover from it.

IN 24 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE Speaking of psychoanalysis, I move on appointed as Government Whip. He former Deputy Speaker go out of their way to the Fair Work Commission investigation jumped the queue — to rip off the taxpayer in quite imaginative into the former Government Whip, Cesar Mr Ondarchie — He got the numbers. ways. I will give credit where it is due. I Melhem. Now I have to say that I did not Mr FINN — He got the numbers. He is have to say that I would never in a million know Mr Melhem prior to him coming into clearly very good at getting the numbers. years have come up with the way they this Parliament. There is nothing like a good branch stack, ripped off the taxpayer. Perhaps my mind Mr Ondarchie — I did. is there? My word, there is not. He is just does not work that well. It certainly Mr FINN — Mr Ondarchie tells me he damn good at getting the numbers, is Mr does not work that way, but maybe it does did, and says so quite knowingly, I have Melhem, and he did it on this occasion to not work that well. Perhaps they regard to say. He is looking and shaking his head become Government Whip. This surprised it as a badge of honour to come up with over there like a man who knows what us on this side of the house because we are imaginative ways to rip off Victorians. They he is talking about. Mr Melhem of course genteel people over here. We do the right did that, and Mr Languiller has said that he was, prior to his election to Parliament, the thing. We respect others. If somebody has has paid it back. I am not sure whether that state secretary of the Australian Workers ability, then we — is the case; I have not seen any evidence Union (AWU). Oh, dear me. You have Ms Lovell — We recognise it. that that is the case. got your shonks and you have got your Mr FINN — We recognise it. If they I was just talking about you, Mr Melhem. shysters. I am not sure which category the do not have ability, then we obviously He has just walked into the chamber. That AWU fits into, but it may well be both. I am do not recognise it. But we have in this is disappointing because I just had a fair not suggesting that the AWU is perhaps situation Mr Melhem coming into the discussion about Mr Melhem. He has in the category of criminality in the same Parliament, straight out of the AWU office, joined us now, and that disappoints me way that the CFMEU is, but certainly the the back of his car full of brown paper enormously. You really should read the AWU is renowned for shyster deals, for all bags presumably — for lunch, because it Hansard, Mr Melhem. sorts of shonkiness, for bags of money, for is important that you do have lunch; as Mr Melhem — Did you say nice stuff? branch stacking, for all manner of ungodly Christine Nixon once said, ‘You’ve got to Mr FINN — Oh my very word. Mr acts that they have been up to. You just eat’ — and within minutes being made Melhem, I would suggest to you that what have to have a look at the foundation of whip. He did not last all that long as whip, I said about you was the nicest thing that an organisation that is in the news at the it has to be said. Talk about a meteoric rise! anybody has said about you for a very, very moment, an organisation called GetUp!. He was up there, and he was down like a long time — GetUp! is an extreme left-wing organisation shooting star; he was a shooting star, and Ms Springle — Oh, that’s nice. which is all about supporting extreme he crashed big time. My understanding Mr FINN — Yes, it is, and it is true. But left-wing candidates, surprisingly enough. was that he was not very, very pleased with going back — It was founded with a very large donation the way he was dealt with by the Premier. by the Australian Workers Union. Now Ms Springle — True? That’s nasty. It may well be that he was another victim Mr FINN — No. You should hear what this was when Mr Melhem was assistant of the Premier’s bullying tactics. That may secretary of the AWU. Who, I wonder, at the the others say about him — I tell you what. well be the case. If so, the irony should not No, it is true. Going back to the former time was the state secretary of the AWU? be lost on anyone. For Mr Melhem to be a Mr Ondarchie — Bull? Speaker and the Deputy Speaker, both of victim of bullying by the Premier is ironic them of course resigned over this abuse Mr FINN — No, it is true. It was none indeed. of their position. The former Deputy other than ‘Bull’, Bill Shorten — the man But here we have Mr Melhem, with all Speaker was particularly reluctant to resign who says he wants to be Prime Minister his connections through the AWU and the and even more reluctant to pay back the at the next election, whenever that might federal Leader of the Opposition. I do not money, and I suspect — and please prove be; the man who says, ‘Trust me. I want to think it is unparliamentary to suggest he me wrong if you will or indeed if you can do the right thing by Australia’. Here is the is dodgy, because it is pretty true. I think — that that money will never be seen in bloke who was the boss of a union that you there are a lot of people who Mr Melhem the coffers. I do not suspect that the former can only trust to do the wrong thing — and could tell us all about. I am quite looking Deputy Speaker would be in any position they do, on a constant basis. They are a forward to his book when it comes out. I at all to pay that back anytime soon or group of individuals that you would not think it will be a ripper. There is another indeed ought to be in any position to pay turn your back on in a pink fit, because you chap called Bob Kernohan — that back anytime soon. know what would happen: they would do Mr Ondarchie — Big Bob Kernohan. you in. Of course Mr Melhem is renowned The fact of the matter is that both of Mr FINN — Big Bob Kernohan. He those individuals, the member for Tarneit in Australian Workers Union circles as could tell us a fair bit about Mr Melhem. somebody who I think they would describe and the member for Melton, are still One of these days I am going to buy Bob a members of the Legislative Assembly. as ‘a very good leader’ of the AWU. They beer and perhaps he will tell me all about might regard it as a compliment but I do They are still members of the other place. Mr Melhem, in which case I will come in They are still being paid every fortnight to not, because I think to describe somebody here and share it with the chamber. That is as a very good leader of the AWU is to be members of Parliament. What we are going to be something that people should seeing is a government that is still relying make all sorts of allegations, said and not miss. unsaid, about that person. on their votes to remain a government. We So there we have Mr Melhem. I am not saw a Premier who pursued in the course Mr Melhem probably has got a fair bit to exactly sure about his legal status at the of the last Parliament one member to the answer for at some stage. It may well be, minute. I do not think he has been charged ends of the earth. He pursued him to the if the Fair Work Commission has its way, with anything. I do not know if he is going ends of the earth because of a bit of petrol that he will have an opportunity to answer to be charged with anything, but I would and the use of a car. Here we have two various allegations. It may well be that he hate to see his lawyer’s bill. No doubt the members who have ripped off the taxpayer will not recall. AWU will be kicking in for that anyway. to the tune of hundreds of thousands of Mr Ondarchie — I’m sure the Clean Then we move on to part 3 of this motion dollars, and this arrogant Premier says, Event people don’t see him as a good — the Victoria Police investigation into ‘That doesn’t matter’. leader. the rorting claims of the second residence An honourable member interjected. Mr FINN — I am sure they do not, but allowance by the former Speaker and Mr FINN — That is what he says: ‘It it may well be that he does not recall. My Deputy Speaker. Again, I do not know doesn’t matter’. Here we have Mr Nardella. recollection — and I have not got a great about the status of the Victoria Police He supposedly left the Labor Party — or memory, but it is a damn sight better than inquiry into this matter, but what we do did he? I do not think he did, because Mr Melhem’s — is that he said that quite know is that the government has lost a anybody who is wandering around here a bit when he appeared before the royal Speaker and it has lost a Deputy Speaker knows that he still eats with the Labor commission. He said, ‘I don’t recall’. He for exactly the same thing. Party, he still drinks with the Labor Party — did not recall much at all, in fact. Indeed, if When you hold the position of Speaker, An honourable member — He votes with they were faced with the sorts of difficulties Deputy Speaker, President or Deputy that Mr Melhem was faced with at the royal them. President, it is a position of authority. It is a Mr FINN — He votes with the Labor commission, I would suggest that most position where you are expected to uphold people would not actually recall what they Party — the standards of this Parliament. You are An honourable member interjected. were involved in, nor would he want to. expected to be almost pure in every way. But here we have a bloke, the right Well, what did we see in the other place? Mr FINN — Well, I am not sure about hand of Bill Shorten, who came into We saw both the former Speaker and the that; we will leave that alone. He is of this Parliament and was immediately the Labor Party, by the party, and he is

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 25 still supporting the Labor Party to stay upholding the highest possible standards got to pay your debts, and anybody who in government. So when you are talking of the Parliament, forced to resign due to knows where the bodies are buried has to about rorts, when you are talking about their own misdeeds. I think that is very have his debts paid particularly quickly. the purity or otherwise of the Andrews sad indeed and reflective of a culture, a We well remember what Ms Suleyman government, just remember that. They mindset, within the Labor Party that it is did when she was mayor of Brimbank City are staying in government by virtue of the okay to rip people off, that it is okay to rip Council. votes — the taxpayer off, and I think that is a very, The PRESIDENT — Order! I draw the Mr Ondarchie — Tainted votes. very sad reflection on the Australian Labor member’s attention to his motion, which Mr FINN — Tainted votes indeed, Mr Party, it is a very, very sad reflection on the has no reference at all to Mr Suleyman Ondarchie. They are staying in government Victorian government and perhaps most or indeed to the member in the other by virtue of the tainted votes of two rorting of all, because of his protection of those place, and of course accusations against a MPs that they have not got the guts to two members, it is a very sad reflection on member in the other place would require deal with. What a pathetic deal we have the Victorian Premier. He really needs to a substantive reference in a motion. So I seen dished out to Victorian taxpayers as practise what he preaches in this regard. think that in that sense it might be better a result of this. The people down at Ocean He should act to expel Mr Languiller and to be a little bit more compact in terms of Grove might have got a boost to their Mr Nardella not just from the Labor Party, the motion. I think the points have been tourism campaign — as I understand that Mr Languiller is still in made. I have actually been a bit concerned An honourable member interjected. the Labor Party, but from the Parliament as about the references to Mr Suleyman in the well. That is something that I do not expect Mr FINN — Well, I know. I am not past context, but I have allowed those to will happen, but it is something that the proceed. The matter has been covered, and talking about him, but everybody knows Premier certainly should take on board. where Ocean Grove is now. Indeed the I think perhaps there are other matters that caravan park down there — We move to item (4) of this motion: the member might well cover. Ms Lovell interjected. the IBAC investigation into the Deputy Mr FINN — I take on board what you President and printing invoices for say, President, but I also point out that the Mr FINN — Except Don. Don did not membership scandal … first line of the motion says: know where the caravan park was, but I am aware, of course, that the IBAC everybody else does. So we have this That this house notes the ongoing crisis in investigation into this matter is ongoing, the Andrews government, including, but extraordinary situation where two Labor so I am loath to go into the details — I do not limited to — members of Parliament, two rorting not think that would be a very good idea, Labor members of Parliament, are and then lists the matters that you as I do not want to spend the next three or referred to. actually propping up this government four years in jail. I will just mention that, and propping up this Premier who gets up Mr Ondarchie — It is broad. as far as I can see, Mr Eideh has made one Mr FINN — It is a very broad motion; there and likes to be holier than thou. He is particularly big mistake: something that far from it. What a shonk! That is what he is, it could cover just about anything. But I the rest of us actually take for granted, was just referring to the mistake that Mr and that is what this government is based but in his case it was a big mistake — he on. It is very sniffy. It is — Eideh has clearly made in trusting his trusted his office manager. Because he office manager in much the same way that was not from the western suburbs of Mr Madden trusted his office manager Business interrupted pursuant to Melbourne, Mr Eideh did not realise what sessional orders (Questions without notice). some years ago. I personally — and I do Mr Mammarella was capable of doing. He not know whether it is the right thing to Debate resumed. was not aware of the culture of corruption say — do not believe that Mr Eideh is within the ALP of the western suburbs; he corrupt or in any way underhanded; I find Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I was not aware of what happened. him quite a decent chap, to tell you the will endeavour to make my points as Mr Eideh should have learned from truth. But I think he made a very, very bad quickly as I can. We will see how we go. history, because if he had looked at what mistake when he trusted an operative of Prior to question time I was referring to happened a few years ago just down the western suburbs ALP, because I tell the government and the Premier relying the road a little bit at an office in Keilor, you what, there are some shonks out there on tainted votes to remain in office, he would have seen what happened to — I cannot begin to tell you — and a lot of with the former Speaker and Deputy Justin Madden, a predecessor in Western those shonks are responsible for putting Speaker remaining in the Parliament and Metropolitan Region, who basically people into Parliament, ministers of this propping up the government with their handed his office over to his office government and federal shadow ministers votes. I remember that for a very, very manager in much the same way that Mr — long time during the course of the Baillieu Eideh did to his office manager. Of course Mr Ondarchie interjected. government and the Napthine government Mr Madden ended up with the same problems, the same difficulties, because in Mr FINN — Indeed. Indeed the federal the then opposition leader, Mr Andrews, Leader of the Opposition, Bull Shorten, is carried on like a two-bob watch about one that situation Mr Madden handed it over to Mr Hakki Suleyman, who is, I think it somebody who has got, let us say, debts to tainted vote, as he described it, back in pay that I would not want to be carrying those days. Here we now have a Premier would be safe to say, a big wheel in the ALP in the west and in fact is largely responsible around. I would not want to be carrying who is reliant upon two tainted votes — those debts around. But he has got them, Mr Ondarchie — And one in here. for the preselection of any number of MPs, federal and state, to say nothing of and no doubt he will pay those debts if he Mr FINN — And one in here indeed — local councils right throughout the west of becomes the Prime Minister of this nation. two tainted votes to remain in government. Melbourne. God help us all if that were to occur. So it seems to me that the hypocrisy of Mr Gepp — On a point of order, the Premier has to be seen to be believed. In fact at one stage we had the Brimbank City Council scandal hit us, and of course President, you brought Mr Finn back to his The hypocrisy of the Premier is right up motion just a few minutes ago, and again there with his arrogance and his bullying. Hakki Suleyman was very much at the heart of that. That was a very sad reflection he has wandered down a path of talking He is building up quite a reputation for about people who are not contained in the himself on a number of fronts. So I am on the attitudes or mental processes of the ALP in Melbourne’s west. I think the motion. I would ask you to bring him back. very much hoping that we might see a Mr Ondarchie — On the point of order, bit of consistency from the government Brimbank City Council scandal in itself was something that brought disgrace President, this is a wideranging take-note on this at some stage and indeed that debate that goes to the heart of the rorting Mr Languiller and Mr Nardella may not just upon the council but upon local government in this state and most certainly in the Andrews government and that of the be actually held accountable for their western suburbs of Melbourne. When Mr actions and actually kicked out of the upon the ALP. Mind you, not that they ever apologised for it — in fact the Suleymans Finn is talking about the western suburbs Parliament. My understanding is that the of Melbourne he notes the members that police investigations are continuing, so are still at it. Mr Ondarchie — Suleyman empire. exist in the parliamentary process for the it may well be that after the police have western suburbs of Melbourne. It is quite made a decision, we will then have the Mr FINN — The Suleyman empire relevant to the matter before us. government in a position to act upon the continues in its own way. We see, for recommendations of Victoria Police. example, Hakki Suleyman’s daughter The PRESIDENT — At the moment representing the ALP in this Parliament in Mr Finn is getting towards the end of But it is a sad, sad thing — a very sad his contribution, and I think he has thing — when we have two high officials a particularly safe Assembly seat that, you would have to say, if merit had anything to acknowledged my request. He will contain of this Victorian Parliament, people who the remarks, I am sure. were charged with the responsibility of do with it she would not hold. But you have

IN 26 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE Mr FINN — Thank you, President. Yes, is just not quite right — in many instances, the former Speaker and former Deputy I was just expressing my concern about more than not quite right. In fact during Speaker of the Legislative Assembly. I do the influence of corrupt elements within the lunchbreak I was out speaking to a not wish to interfere, of course, in a police the ALP in the western suburbs and their rally on the steps. People from Essendon investigation, but the fact of the matter is influence within the government, which had gathered at the rally on the steps that the former Speaker and the former may or may not be seen to be borne out in of Parliament to protest against the Deputy Speaker have lost their jobs for the actions of the Premier or the ministers government’s plan to build a dirty great rorting the taxpayer, yet they are still sitting of the government. That is of course very ditch through the centre of Essendon in the other place, using their votes to prop central to this motion that we are debating instead of doing what has been suggested up the government. What does that say here today. by the council and doing the Buckley Street about the government? The fact that we To move on to item (5) of the motion, it — have a Premier in this state who keeps his reads: Mr Gepp — On a point of order, Acting job courtesy of two tainted votes — two the IBAC investigation into Victoria President, not for the first time has Mr Finn votes of rorters sitting over there in the Police’s handling of the collision involving in this so eloquent speech strayed a long other place. That, to my way of thinking, is the now Premier’s taxpayer funded way away from the motion. Before lunch shameful and it reflects badly not just on vehicle in January 2013. he was brought back to the aspects of the the government but on the people in the I have to say that as I have gone around motion, and I would invite you to do the government. over the past week or two this been same again. I mentioned the Deputy President and something that has been somewhat of a Mr Ondarchie — On the point of the printing invoices for membership barbecue stopper. Unfortunately I have order, Acting President, sometimes the scandal. Again we have that influence of not been to too many barbecues of late, truth hurts. Let me just say that this is a corruption and that influence of shysterism but certainly if I had I am sure it would wideranging motion, and I refer Mr Gepp within the government, this time coming have stopped them. This is a barbecue to the very start of the motion, which talks from the western suburbs of Melbourne. stopper. This is something that people are about: I am unfortunately only too familiar with stopping me in the street to talk about. I … the ongoing crisis in the Andrews the level of corruption that is within the can understand that, because I recall some government, including, but not limited ALP in Melbourne’s west. That is on display years ago I was involved in a pile-up on the to … whichever way you look at it in terms of West Gate Freeway. This take-note motion is a wideranging preselections and in terms of some of the An honourable member interjected. motion, and Mr Finn should have the candidates they put up. Indeed some of the Mr FINN — Indeed; now it is just capacity to stray within the boundaries of members of Parliament that come from normal. But it was a pile-up in those days, that first bit of the motion. the west will tell you that the ALP in the west has a real problem. In fact the Labor and the government car that I was driving The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr Morris) — was a write-off. I was very lucky to actually Party in Tarneit and Werribee, for example, I do not uphold the point of order, as it is a cannot find a local to represent them. get out as uninjured as I was. The police wideranging motion. at that time were exceptionally good — That is a problem, particularly for them Mr FINN — Thank you, Acting President. and particularly for the people of the local exceptionally efficient. They breath-tested The point that I was making with regard me, and they breath-tested I think the area. I think it is a form of dishonesty in its to this is that, for example, the people own way to say that you represent people several other drivers that were involved in who were out the front, the people from the incident. That was fine. but refuse to live there, and that is what is Essendon, regard this government as being happening. exceedingly dodgy. They are talking about The ALP in Tarneit is in the process, I Sitting suspended 1.00 pm until 2.02pm consultation about the Buckley Street understand, of choosing a candidate who (lunch). level crossing. There has been very little has just come from interstate and who consultation, if any. A decision has clearly has landed in Tarneit via Williamstown. Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — As been made. The minister has not been She lives in Williamstown, I understand, I was saying before lunch, I was involved telling the truth to the people of Essendon. as do a good number of ALP members of in a traffic accident some years ago — a The local member has just disappeared Parliament. It is just like a little commune big pile-up on the West Gate Freeway altogether; we do not know where he is. down there in Williamstown. They seem to on one of the off ramps there. Each of The minister certainly has been misleading gather together and then go back to their the drivers in that particular accident the people of Essendon, and that just adds electorate from time to time — if at all. That was breathalysed, and a very strong to the general feeling of people in the is again taking the constituents of those investigation was conducted by Victoria community that this government is not electorates for a ride. That is again showing Police as to exactly what happened. In fact quite right, that this government lives off, contempt for the people who elected them, I was told by one officer of the law that — well, dishonesty, I think it would be safe in much the same way that they have to say; it breeds standards that one should shown contempt for the people of Victoria Ms Mikakos interjected. not be encouraging. Mr FINN — No, I passed the breath for the past three years, because whichever What we should expect from our way you look at it the past three years in test with flying colours, let me assure government is what we would expect from you. There was not a drop of alcohol this state have been very dark years. They anybody else. Whether we be in business have been very black years in terms of in my blood, which disappointed me or whether we be an employee working enormously — a little bit — but anyway, honesty and transparency. They have been for an employer, we expect some respect; very, very dark years. that is beside the point. A little bit later we expect a high standard of treatment. on I met with an officer of Victoria Police, I cannot recall any government that I suppose in terms of governments what has the sort of record on honesty and who explained to me that the reason that we expect is a higher standard than they had investigated this so thoroughly transparency that this government has. perhaps we would get elsewhere, because I cannot recall any government in my was that I was involved in it and I was a the government has a responsibility in member of Parliament. I thought to myself, lifetime which could be accused of being many ways to lead from the front, but totally and thoroughly corrupt. I cannot ‘Well, that’s a bit odd. Shouldn’t everybody unfortunately with regard to a whole range get this sort of treatment for this sort of recall one; I do not recall one at all. As of issues, many of which I have canvassed I said, that is something that not only behaviour?’. It just baffles me to think that I today, this government is not doing so. had been given, certainly, the breathalyser reflects badly on the government but also treatment, the investigation, the interview In the Ombudsman investigation into reflects badly on each and every one of afterwards and all that sort of thing, so why the Labor red shirt electorate officer rort us — would the Leader of the Opposition’s wife scandal, Labor has failed — totally and Mr Gepp — Richmond won a flag under not get the same thing? That just does not absolutely failed. This government is this government. shameful with regard to this. There was the seem fair to me, and it does seem a little bit Mr FINN — Richmond did win a flag odd. I have to say that the fact that Daniel Fair Work Commission investigation into Cesar Melhem and the failure there. What under this government, and that is to the Andrews’s wife was not breathalysed just club’s credit. I would suggest that if the does not pass the pub test. A lot of people is going on? Can people explain exactly who has done what to whom and how government is trying to claim credit for out there are raising their eyebrows at that Richmond’s flag, then I think I might send and saying, ‘What is going on there?’. many times and what is going on there? No, they cannot — another failure. Dustin Martin and perhaps Jake King That is just another element of the around to see you one night and you can government’s way of dealing with things Then there is the Victoria Police explain to them that Dusty had nothing to that makes people believe that something investigation into claims of the rorting do with it. But that is by the by. of the second residence allowance by

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 27 What we desperately need in this state defeat of the previous government, that Allowing someone to die cannot be taken is a government that is going to be straight has reverted to form. So there has been lightly in any way. No matter can be more with the people. What we desperately need massive growth in the west and, as I say, serious. If passed, this bill will not only in this state is a government which is going we have missed out on a great deal of the change the law but change our definition to be up-front with the people, which is infrastructure that we need for basic life. of medicine. Indeed it will change the going to be honest with the people, which The most important infrastructure for culture that we live in. is going to treat the people of Victoria families is what is needed for their kids. In Thinking about this bill and preparing with the sort of respect they deserve. That somewhere like Wyndham, for example, for this debate today I have revisited some government will be led by Matthew Guy, there are huge numbers of young families of the most painful times of my life: the because that is something that the people and there are huge numbers of young time when I saw my father die at the age of of Victoria crave. That is what they crave. children, and more babies are being born 44, the time when I held my mother’s hand They crave somebody who is going to be in Wyndham than in most other places when she died at the age of 50, times when honest, who is going to be up-front, who is in Victoria. This growth and this demand I was reminded of my dear friend — my not shifty, who is not involved in the sort of will continue for quite some time to come. closest friend in the world — who died at shysterism that we have seen from the ALP Unfortunately it is not being met at the 48 of cancer. They are times that I suppose right across the board — moment. Williams Landing, for example I do not think of every day, but this bill has Mrs Peulich — It does not leave many on — and I have raised this in the house on given me an opportunity to do that, and I that side. a number of occasions — has no schools am not sure whether I welcome that or not, Mr FINN — Well, there is a whole at all, which is just an appalling situation. but I will make reference to those times range of things, Mrs Peulich. The people But with regard to the needs of the younger later in this debate. of Victoria know that they have just a children, the situation with kindergartens This matter in fact is so significant little over one year to wait and then they is a real problem. It is so bad in fact that that we have a number of former prime will have a new government, and that is mayor Henry Barlow — ministers who are actually lining up to something that they are excited about. Ms Crozier — It has been neglected. condemn it. I cannot help but observe that Certainly it is something that I am excited Mr FINN — It has been neglected, Ms this may well be one of the very few times about and it is something that I believe Crozier. The mayor of Wyndham, Henry that Malcolm Turnbull and Tony Abbott every Victorian who believes in honesty Barlow, actually had to go and publicly have been in agreement in about the past and decency in government is excited express his frustration at the lack of four or five years, but they are certainly about. I wish I could tell you exactly; I think kindergartens and the quality and the in agreement on this matter. When you it is about 387 days, from memory. It is not quantity of them at a press conference throw in Paul Keating and Kevin Rudd far to go now, but for many Victorians it yesterday. That is a major problem that that is quite a mixture, but they are all in is too long. We look forward to the day — Wyndham faces, and it must be serious agreement. very soon — when we will once again have for the council to risk embarrassing the It is not every day that I refer to or indeed a government in this state that we can be government. There are very few councils quote Paul Keating, but I would like today proud of. that are more devoted to the state to quote some of the remarks that he government than Wyndham, I would made in the Sydney Morning Herald on 19 COUNCIL | Constituency questions have thought, but even they have had to October on the issue. 01 November 2017 come out and say, ‘Excuse me, this is just He said: not the done thing’. So I am asking the There is probably no more important minister to do whatever is necessary to issue in contemporary bioethics or a provide adequate preschool services for more serious ethical decision for our communities across Wyndham. It is an parliaments than that raised by the Wyndham extremely important issue. It is something Voluntary Assisted Dying Bill 2017 that is preying on the minds of many being debated this week in the Victorian preschool services Parliament. Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) thousands of people across Wyndham — My constituency question is to the and is something that needs her urgent Under this bill, conditions and safeguards Minister for Families and Children. The attention. are outlined that will allow physicians to The PRESIDENT — I am happy with that terminate the life of patients and to assist population of Melbourne’s outer west is patients to take their own life. This is a booming. Wyndham is one of the fastest item as such, but in terms of phraseology threshold moment for the country. No growing municipalities in Australia, and I do have concerns when members have matter what justifications are offered for the Werribee Mercy Hospital has one of used in the past ‘whatever is necessary’ as the bill, it constitutes an unacceptable the busiest maternity departments in the part of an action. The improvement of the departure in our approach to human state. In short the City of Wyndham is services is certainly a valid action, and I do existence and the irrevocable sanctity that bursting with young families and clearly not have a problem; I am just indicating should govern our understanding of what young children. The problem is that both that members need to be careful about it means to be human. the quality and quantity of kindergartens framing an adjournment item by saying to … What matters is the core intention leaves a fair bit to be desired. What does a minister, ‘Do whatever is necessary’. Mr of the law. What matters is the ethical the minister intend to do to provide Finn actually did continue to an action, so I threshold being crossed. What matters was satisfied with that. is that under Victorian law there will be satisfactory preschool services for the people whose lives we honour and those Wyndham communities? we believe are better off dead. COUNCIL | Second reading He went on to say: COUNCIL | Adjournment 02 November 2017 One of the inevitable aspects of debates 01 November 2017 about euthanasia is the reluctance on the part of advocates to confront the essence of what they propose. In this case it means Voluntary Assisted permitting physicians to intentionally kill patients or assisting patients in killing Wyndham themselves. Understandably, the medical Dying Bill 2017 profession is gravely concerned by this Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — In venture. kindergartens rising to speak on the Voluntary Assisted Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I He finished off by saying: wish to raise a matter for the attention of Dying Bill 2017, it is with an extraordinary the Minister for Families and Children. sense of responsibility that I stand here Opposition to this bill is not about The people of the outer west I think over a today — an overwhelming sense of religion. It is about the civilisational responsibility. This is a bill about who lives ethic that should be at the heart of our long period of time have had a pretty rough secular society. The concerns I express deal. A classic example of that is Point and who dies. This is not just another bill. are shared by people of any religion or no Cook, which has been allowed to grow We all take seriously the issues that we religion. In public life it is the principles over a period of time — there is enormous discuss every day — education, transport, that matter. They define the norms and growth in that area — without any or with community services. We obviously put a values of a society and in this case the very little infrastructure until the election fair bit of seriousness on those. We have principles concern our view of human life of the previous government. The then a great sense of responsibility for those itself. It is a mistake for legislators to act Minister for Planning, Mr Guy, put a great as well, but the responsibility on our on the deeply held emotional concerns shoulders today and possibly in the weeks of many when that involves crossing a deal of effort into ensuring that Point Cook threshold that will affect the entire society was looked after. Unfortunately, with the ahead is, as I say, quite overwhelming.

IN 28 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE in perpetuity. had better get this right — we had better caused by repeatedly feeling like you They are comments that are well put. get this right. are a burden are a real risk regardless of the safeguards in place. This story is They are comments that I totally and As a contrast to the threat that this unfortunately quite common. absolutely agree with. Paul Keating makes bill presents, I support the far greater the point from which we cannot escape: utilisation of palliative care. I cannot help We are often called into nursing homes this bill is about killing patients. It is not but think, as I hear stories from members by staff who are concerned that families are pushing for their loved ones to receive about turning off machines; it is not about in this house today and from some others medications that are not indicated. giving doses of morphine or some other who tell about the agony and the pain that People in nursing homes are some of medication that will shorten life. It is about they have seen others suffer as they died, our most vulnerable, and conditions the deliberate, premeditated killing of that if we had proper palliative care in this are deteriorating due to the lack of another human being. state that would not happen — that would resident-nursing ratios and often a lack I want to refer now to the editorial of not be necessary. The fact of the matter is of appropriately trained staff. Sometimes we do not have proper palliative care in facilities only have one registered the Herald Sun the day after this bill was nurse to 100 to 150 residents. Families, passed in the other place. It begins by this state. often with good intent, ask doctors and saying: I was greatly comforted by a professor of nurses to increase medications such The sanctity of human life is protected palliative care who said in this house just as morphine et cetera as they feel their under Victorian law and must continue to a couple of weeks ago that palliative care loved one is suffering. The majority be guarded as sacrosanct. can control all the pain and deliver relief of the time they are comfortable and until death inevitably knocks. The problem dying a normal death. Often doctors feel That ongoing protection is not based on pressured to increase morphine as the tradition or religious conviction. Laws is, as I say, Victoria has nowhere near the family is distressed, and palliative care preventing the taking of a life are a central palliative care services that we need in this services are called in because the person tenet of who we are as a society — that state. I refer to an email I received from becomes agitated and distressed, which human life is valued above all else. Kathryn Bennett. She is a palliative care is often caused by medications and not In medicine, under the Hippocratic oath’s nurse practitioner, and she says: the underlying disease or process. When medications are increased when there is ‘do no harm’ origins of 2500 years ago — … I am writing to express my concerns which predated Christianity — doctors no pain or symptoms they can experience regarding the Voluntary Assisted Dying issues such as hallucinations, agitation, declare their commitment to patients, the Bill being debated in the upper house this profession and to humanity. constipation and urinary retention, and week. this in turn increases suffering. This In 2006, the Australian Medical There are many emotive stories saturating scenario is common and often occurs Association also adopted the World our media in regards to the pain and with patients with underlying conditions Medical Association’s Declaration of suffering Victorians are experiencing, and such as dementia and when families are Geneva, a commitment for all members although they are often horrific stories, the decision-makers. to, among other things, ‘maintain the many of them are stories where optimal This is a matter of the upmost utmost respect for human life’. palliative care wasn’t being provided adequately. I understand that the intent of importance. It is so important that we Of course, it can be argued that in serving give dying Victorians the palliative care patients and the wider principle of being this bill is a compassionate one, and that a humane, compassion has a role to play. small number of people may benefit from that they need. I commend the Leader this bill. However, I work with the dying, of the Opposition and Ms Wooldridge in But the Victorian Parliament, in a historic aged and disabled every day and see the this house for the work they have done vote yesterday, took one step too far potential risks of this bill on our most on the palliative care policy which was toward altering the balance in favour of vulnerable citizens. subjective compassion taking precedence announced recently. I think it is a $140 over human life. … million package that they have proposed if indeed the election goes our way next year. The Voluntary Assisted Dying Bill 2017 Many people who are diagnosed with a will, if it passes the upper house next terminal illness become depressed and The greatest problem with palliative care month, fundamentally change the value withdrawn, especially when the disease is is not in Melbourne; in fact it is in regional we place on human life as a society and advanced — Victoria. There is a huge dearth of palliative a state. and I am sure we can all understand care in country Victoria. I want to refer to A little later on it says: that — a document from Palliative Care Victoria. It states: Federal AMA president Michael Gannon It is often seen as a normal response and three former Victorian branch and many are not referred for specialist At least 10 000 Victorians who died this presidents, doctors Murkesh Haikerwal, treatment of their depression. We had year will miss out on needed access to Stephen Parnis and Mark Yates, have a young person who was referred to palliative care. They do not have access personally spoken against it, calling for our service who had attempted suicide to palliative care when and where they greater resources for palliative care. after being diagnosed with a terminal need it. illness several months before. They were … referred to a palliative care service for Inequalities in access to palliative care are the first time after this attempt and with greatest among Victorians living in rural The bill, modelled on expert panel regions. recommendations chaired by former adequate psychosocial support they went AMA president Professor Brian Owler, on to have the best 12 months of their New data released today by Palliative contains 68 safeguards to prevent duress life and never again wanted to end their Care Victoria shows the extent of these and ensure only terminally ill adult life prematurely. There is no requirement inequalities: in this bill for people to be referred to a patients access a lethal drug after two Victorians in the Hume, Gippsland and medical assessments. psychologist or a psychiatrist if there is a suspected or known psychiatric illness Loddon Mallee regions have the worst But, put simply, the need for dozens of such as depression. I fear that if VAD was access to palliative care — the average safeguards is, itself, a clear admission available, this young person may have palliative care funding per death in of the risk that ill people might be missed out on what they described as the 2016–17 in those regions was between subject to pressure, real, subtle or even best year of their life. 22 per cent and 29 per cent … less than imagined, from family members or others the average for all Victorians … None that their time has come to die. With a Recently we cared for a woman who had of the rural regions received palliative rapidly ageing population, the threat a terminal condition. Her symptoms were care funding per death equivalent to that of misinformed decisions, inaccurate well managed and she was comfortable provided in metropolitan areas. but deteriorating slowly over several terminal prognosis, a belief held by Victorians in the Barwon south-western some elderly or sick they have become a months. Her daughter, who usually lived overseas, had been here for three months and Gippsland regions face significant burden, legalised euthanasia presents as a inequalities of access to community dangerous, ethical slippery slope. and was growing increasingly frustrated that her mum was ‘taking so long to die’. palliative care. The palliative care funding Modern pharmaceuticals and advances She regularly spoke of the burden of not per death in those regions is 39 per cent in palliative care can manage pain and being able to return home in front of her lower … compared to the state average … sedation at the end stage of life. Greater mum and said that if she was in America Only the Hume region received palliative resources for and access to palliative care ‘they would have given her a pill by now care funding per death higher than the must be Victoria’s focus. and it would be over’. This lady had to state average … TheHerald Sun believes MPs in the upper listen to these comments over several This data was based on 2016–17 house should reject the euthanasia bill in weeks and absolutely felt like a burden, palliative care funding by the Victorian coming weeks. and if VAD was available, she may have government and data from the Australian opted to convince medical practitioners Bureau of Statistics on the number of Again, I agree with that entirely. So much that her suffering was sufficient for her to is at stake, so many lives are on the line, we want to end her life prematurely. External deaths in 2016 in Victoria by region. This coercion and especially internal coercion demonstrates that there is a lack of genuine choice for Victorians with life-limiting

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 29 illness in relation to access to palliative it — yes, we can amend it — but no disgusts me, I have to say, because as far care; that supply constraints on palliative number of amendments will make this bill as I am concerned he is not much better care are impeding access by Victorians worth passing. This is a stinker of a bill. — well, his views are not much better than who would benefit from palliative care You cannot pass a bill that is based on a somebody who is a Nazi. prior to their death; and that there are concept that is flawed to the degree that It is almost a dead certainty, if I can significant regional inequalities in access this bill is. use that term, that if this bill is passed to palliative care when and where it is One of the propositions that this bill is Philip Nitschke, that well-known purveyor needed. based on is the view that doctors do not of death, will be setting up his shingle These findings reinforce the need for make mistakes — that they can say, ‘In 12 somewhere in Melbourne. I have no doubt urgent action on the recommendations by months you’ll be gone’ or ‘In six months about that at all. It will be Philip Nitschke’s the Victorian end-of-life choices inquiry you’ll be gone’ or ‘In 18 months you’ll one-stop killing shop. That is what we will and the Victorian Auditor-General to be gone’. Well, they do make mistakes, have. You can put your life on it — quite improve equality of access to palliative care and I want to refer to a couple of my own literally. and to increase access to palliative care at experiences. My father was diagnosed Seventy per cent of the emails that I have home. There is simply not enough funding with cancer when I was three years of received from people who support this for palliative care in Victoria to meet the age. I have no recollection of him as a bill have not actually made reference to current need — 55 per cent of palliative well man. He was 27 years of age when the bill. They have an expectation that this care services report they are unable to he was diagnosed. He was at that time bill will allow euthanasia or a euthanasia meet current demand. That is appalling; given 12 months to live. Clearly under this regime which is much wider than what that is simply appalling. That is something legislation he would be eligible, given the this bill is currently offering. They want to that we should hang our heads in shame pain levels and so forth, for assisted suicide have a euthanasia regime which impacts over. Residents of regional Victoria have — not of course that he would ever have the disabled, the aged — it goes on — and every right to feel very angry with what is taken that option. He lived for a further 17 that is what we can expect if this legislation surely the ultimate discrimination. years, giving proof that when doctors say is passed. The right to die will for many What the government is saying to that you have got six months to live, you become the duty to die. My role as shadow country Victorians is this: ‘We will not give have 12 months to live, you have two years assistant minister for autism has bought you the same sort of palliative care that to live or whatever, it is quite often not a me in contact with many Victorians in your metropolitan cousins have. We will lot more than an educated guess. That is the autism community, and I know many not give you the palliative care that you the fact of the matter. There are so many of them are very much afraid of this need. Take a lethal dose of drugs instead’. people walking around today who have legislation and where it will lead us. They That is disgraceful in every way. If suicide been told by their doctor that they should are very, very concerned, and as the father is all we offer people, then that is what they be dead, and if they had listened to their of a child with autism, so am I. Because will take. If that is what we are offering and doctor, under this legislation, they may under this legislation and the extensions of that is all we are offering, then in most of well be dead. That is not something that we it, the sick, the disabled and the aged will the country areas of Victoria, after this bill should regard as being acceptable. be under pressure to do the right thing. is passed — if indeed it is passed — that is My own mother was another one who I have here an extensive letter from all we will be offering and that is what they felt doctors were making mistakes. She was a number of geriatricians, and I would will take. For this bill to come before the told by a senior surgeon in this town that love to read it to you but I do not think Parliament while palliative care services it was a cyst. It was no cyst; it was cancer. I have enough time, unfortunately. But are so lacking, particularly in country A few years later I held her hand as she it is expressing their deep opposition to Victoria, is an obscenity. It is an obscenity. died from that cyst. So doctors do make this bill and asking us as members of this How dare we put people so far down the mistakes. As my mum was always fond of place to vote against this bill. They have rack that we will offer them suicide, we will saying, ‘ Doctors bury their mistakes’. We said this on top of the 101 oncologists who offer them a box of poison, ahead of proper do not want to make the same mistake signed a similar document. There are 100 palliative care. It is, as I say, an obscenity. here; we do not want to go down that path palliative care specialists also who have I ask this question: could it be that here, because there is too much at stake. done similarly. There is a great deal of euthanasia is cheaper than funding proper There are two sorts of people who opposition in the palliative care, aged and palliative care? We are left to wonder. support this bill. The first are a group of oncology communities — a great deal of Even if one is supportive of voluntary people who are genuinely concerned opposition indeed — to this bill. euthanasia there must be enormous about their own experience — about their This bill, as I said before, will change the concern about the details of this bill. own future if they were to contract a fatal definition of medicine as we know it. Now, This is a bill that is deeply, deeply flawed. disease. They are genuinely concerned; at this point in time hospitals and doctors Now, I could go on for the rest of my time they do not want to die in pain. I have an surgeries are places of healing. That is speaking about the flaws in this bill — enormous amount of sympathy. I have what we expect them to be. But if this bill is could very easily go on for quite some time carried far too many coffins of far too passed, hospitals in particular but doctors — but I just want to mention a few. many loved ones not to have a great deal surgeries as well will be places where some There is no regard to treatable of sympathy for people in that position. lives are more important than others. There depression or other mental illness that Indeed I might be tempted to reconsider will be some who we will do everything to may be driving a request to seek suicide, my non-support of this bill if we could save, but there will be others who are there so long as the patient has decision- come up with a way to make it totally to be disposed of. This bill encourages making capacity. The bill does not ensure foolproof. If we could do that, yes, I would value judgements on others’ lives — not patients are properly informed about seriously look at it, because I do believe in that some need encouragement. what palliative care can do for them, let choice. That is one of the reasons I am in My eldest son, when he was born some alone ensure all Victorians have access the Liberal Party; I do believe in choice. But years ago, was born with spina bifida. We to the palliative care that they need, as I we cannot allow it, because there is just had a constant battle with the doctors at previously mentioned. too much danger in this bill as it currently that hospital to keep him alive. They put The regime is available to any Australian stands — far too much. enormous pressure on young parents — resident willing to rent a flat in Victoria for The second group is the one that and I mean very, very young parents — the few days needed for their assessment worries me particularly. This is a group with a newborn not to perform the surgery and death. About 6000 people living in that will use this bill to kick down the that would have kept him alive. We fought residential aged-care facilities would door and introduce a much wider regime them, and he is still alive, and for that I meet the eligibility criteria at any time due of euthanasia. These perhaps are best am eternally grateful. But I often think of to chronic illness and would be highly represented by the Peter Singers of this the couple in the room next door from vulnerable, due to loneliness, lack of world. Professor Peter Singer is a man who country New South Wales who had a child support and poor palliative and other care has long been of the view that euthanasia in exactly the same situation. They made in many nursing homes. I could go on. is a great way to control things. He said the decision that they would let the child Doctors are required to assess and that children in the first three months after go. It took a few days, and every day they certify a patient for suicide even if they do birth are not really human at all, and if came in and they sat with the child. They not practice in the patient’s field or have they are not up to scratch, well, you can kill bonded with the child. They learned to expertise or experience in that field and them. He said that. He is apparently one love the child. One day they came in and even if they think suicide is not medically of the greatest bioethicists in this country. they said they had changed their minds. indicated or is premature for the patient. Indeed he has been given the highest They wanted the operation to close the This bill is fatally flawed. We can amend honour this country has to offer, which lesion, but in the meantime that child had

IN 30 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE contracted meningitis. That child died a place of death. It was a very good clinic, it who have died in pain and have suffered that afternoon. I often wonder how they was a very good service that they provided a great deal during the dying process. I do must feel even to this day, all these years my father, but it was very cold, it was very not want that for anyone — for no-one — later, and I still think about them and what clinical and it was very medical-like, I but nor do I want anyone to die a wrongful they went through and indeed what they suppose. I have to say I have not been back death. We have got to strike a balance must still be going through. I recall at that to Peter Mac since my father died; I have here. It is as simple as that. But I come time that every time I left the hospital I had no desire to do that and I am really to the view that dying with dignity is not was concerned what would happen to my hoping that I never will have any reason about suicide, assisted or otherwise. Dying son while I was gone. I did not trust the to go to Peter Mac. But recently I visited with dignity involves comfort. It involves doctors. I do not want to ever — ever — the Olivia Newton-John cancer centre support and preferably a good deal of love. go through that again. And I do not want in Heidelberg. I must say I was a bit toey This bill is a leap — a giant leap — in the anybody else to ever go through that. Can about going to that as well, because I did wrong direction. I ask members to join me you imagine having somebody you love not really want to go to a cancer hospital, in offering comfort, in offering support, in hospital and not knowing whether you given my experiences. There was a new and yes, love, to those at the end of their can trust the doctors? Well, that was the positive approach abroad. It was a warm, earthly journey. I implore members to join thinking back then, and it is even more in welcoming feeling, and here were people me in voting against this bill and giving place now. This legislation will open that with cancer who were not dying but those people who deserve it the support, up even more and make it more acceptable they were living with cancer. It was just the love, that they should have. and more open to abuse. extraordinary to see that. There is a new positive attitude among cancer sufferers On a positive note — and I am really COUNCIL | Questions without notice looking for positives here just at the and their families. This bill flies in the face minute, I can tell you — this bill allows us of that attitude. People need support; they 03 November 2017 a chance to look away from death and to do not need suicide — that is for sure. re-evaluate how we view the sick, the aged, Something that particularly concerns me the disabled and of course the dying. It is the secrecy element. I am sure members Literacy gives us an opportunity to re-evaluate how will have received this email last night that Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My we respect and support them. It gives us an I will briefly refer to from Trevor Poulton. question is to the Minister for Training and opportunity to show them the respect that He begins by saying: Skills. Minister, a common complaint from they deserve, and it gives us an opportunity I am a member of the ALP. employers is that often new employees do to give them much, much more than a I read that and I thought, ‘Well, we have not have basic literacy skills and struggle death sentence in a locked box. It raises the all got our problems, haven’t we?’. to write coherent sentences without simple question also of what is in the locked box spelling errors. Minister, what are you — this area of medication. It is simplistic and naive for parliamentarians to endorse the bill doing as the Minister for Training and We know that doctors are trained to heal; simply on the basis of sentiment without Skills to address this important issue? they are trained to cure. Will they need to any insight into the ‘safeguard’ provisions be trained to kill? I refer to an Age article in the bill itself. It appears at least from Supplementary question of 8 October which refers to a great deal of the public debate our parliamentarians concern expressed by a number of people have no interest in the lack of public Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — about the new regime that this bill would transparency contained in the legislation Minister, I look forward to your next put in place for the medication — the regarding the state killing suicides. All answer. Minister, following your clumsy, the events surrounding the deaths are drugs — that would presumably, hopefully, intended to be secret. There will be no error-ridden written response yesterday, if this bill goes through, kill the people who accountability apart from three signed to evaluate the effectiveness of these are taking it. declarations and a final death certificate problems firsthand have you considered Even Dying with Dignity vice-president — undertaking a literacy course yourself? Rodney Syme, a man who has been very I should add the final death certificate active in this area for a very long time, will be largely a piece of fiction as well — COUNCIL | Constituency questions said that whilst he supported the bill, and of course it will be the last signature 03 November 2017 which should not be of any surprise to of a single medico that will in fact clinch anyone, he was incredibly disappointed the deal. that the government would consider a new He goes on to express deep concerns concoction rather than negotiating with about the secrecy provisions in the Buckley Street level the commonwealth to allow doctors to legislation which mean: prescribe Nembutal should the bill pass later this year. Even Philip Nitschke — Dr … that there can be no public or even crossing family scrutiny of all the events, medical Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Death himself — questioned the proposal, reports, interviews that take place My constituency question today is for telling Fairfax media: throughout the procedure, and including the Minister for Public Transport. As The last five years have seen the manner in which the person has died consultation undertaken by the Andrews unprecedented demand (in people and if there have been any complications government is again a popular topic of wanting to access Nembutal) and the use and consequential suffering during the discussion, the people of Essendon would of a second-rate drug combination won’t killing process. make any difference to that. like some. The views of the Moonee Valley He has an exceptionally good point. If Council and the Essendon community So here we have one of the great this is going on behind closed doors, how have been ignored by the government exponents of euthanasia in this country can we be assured, given that the only way when it comes to the removal of the talking about a second-rate drug you can prove that something has gone Buckley Street level crossing. Locals are combination. What happens — and this wrong or that something untoward has keen to ensure that the government gets is something that this bill or any of the happened is by evidence from somebody this right and are very enthusiastic about speakers to this point have not referred to who is no longer with us, that this program telling the minister how this can be done. in any detail at all — if the drugs do not as set out by this bill is actually occurring Will the minister change her attitude to work? What happens, for example, if you properly? We cannot. There is no way to consultation and speak and listen to the take the drugs, they give you a stroke and safeguard the innocent in this particular Essendon community on this particularly you cannot speak? What happens then? instance. important matter? You are stuck between the devil and the Now, I do not want anyone to die in pain. deep blue sea. According to this bill, that is I have had a lot of mail; we have all got a lot it — you are stuck that way. So a lot more of mail. I want to thank people from both thought has to go into this bill before it can sides of the fence who have emailed me be passed — a hell of a lot more thought. in very large numbers, as I am sure they This area of ‘medication’, and I use that have emailed everybody else. I know Mr term extremely loosely, is one that has to Ramsay is still receiving a great deal of mail be given a great deal more thought. today. I want to say to those people that I I spent much of my childhood at the do not want anyone to die in pain. I have Peter MacCallum clinic in Little Lonsdale seen far too much of that. I have seen my Street. Some might remember it; I will father, I have seen my mother, I have seen never actually forget it. It was pretty much a number of uncles and a couple of aunties

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 31 COUNCIL | Petitions COUNCIL | Committee stage very decent proposal. He is merely asking 14 November 2017 14 November 2017 that we have the time to examine the amendments before we go further into this debate. And, yes, this debate will be a very long Buckley Street, Voluntary Assisted one, but I tell you what, it is going to be a lot longer if we do not know what we Essendon, level Dying Bill 2017 are doing, because that is something that obviously the Leader of the Government crossing Contributions duing the has not taken into consideration. I would Legislative Council electronic petition: Committe stage of the Bill have thought that in having an educated debate the first thing we would need to do The petition of certain citizens of the state of Victoria draws to the attention of Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I is actually understand the amendments the Legislative Council the fatally flawed very strongly support the proposal put that the government is attempting to put proposed ‘road under rail’ design at the forward by Mr Davis. This legislation if forward to this legislation, so I urge the Buckley Street level crossing in Essendon. passed does not actually come into being committee to support Mr Davis’s proposal. The petitioners therefore request that the or will not be put in place until the middle We do need time to examine these Legislative Council of Victoria call on the of 2019. So I have to ask the question: amendments. We need time to understand state government to commit to: why the rush? Why do we have to rush what these amendments are about, because I am not exactly sure what is in (1) not proceeding with the significantly into this today when we have a whole flawed proposed ‘road under rail’ crossing list of amendments here that we do not clause 72 or clause 89 or clause 28, and if I at the Buckley Street level crossing in know anything about? Obviously some had time, I would be able to find out. That Essendon; people know a lot more about them than is what this proposal is about, and I urge (2) fully explore Moonee Valley City we do — and they are not all members of the committee to support it. Council’s ‘rail under road’ proposal, the government. Certainly members of ______noting this particular design does not the opposition have had these dumped include any acquisitions of private on us from a very great height. It is only property, while meeting the long-term Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My fair and reasonable that we be given the concern, as I have expressed previously, is needs of all residents, businesses and opportunity to actually understand what users of the area; very much about the impact this legislation we are talking about. will have on people with disabilities and (3) providing as much financial As has been pointed out by a number of investment in the Essendon level crossing the feeling that there will be a lot of people removal as those in marginal electorates people in this house over some days, this who will be judged to have a life that is not (such as the Frankston line); bill is an extraordinarily important piece of worth living. That is something that clearly legislation. This bill is about who lives and is abroad. It is a thought that is abroad. (4) not proceed with any proposal who dies. There is nothing more important. without support of the immediate There are a lot of people who will often community and consideration of the We can be debating nothing more express the view, when seeing a disabled long-term consequences. important. To have these amendments person, that their life is not worth living. By Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) (42 thrown at us at the 11th hour, or just as That is just not good enough. signatures). the debate began, I think is an insult. I just want to quote something to the It is almost as insulting as Ms Patten’s minister before asking him about this. It comment that this is some sort of delaying is from a letter that I think we all received COUNCIL | Constituency questions tactic, because it is not. It is merely from Dads4Kids, and I just want to quote a 14 November 2017 members of this house wanting to know small section of that letter: what we are debating and what we will be voting on. Quite frankly, I do not know. I Dads4Kids has a dream to help children lead better and more fulfilling lives. have not had time to go through them all Dads4Kids primary work is to work with Hume Councillor — and that is what I want. As Mr O’Sullivan Dads to encourage them to be the best said, we need to get independent advice they can be for their children and to residential from people who know about these things, love their children’s mother. Dads4Kids who are expert in their field and who is also concerned with all public policy have the sort of prowess that we do not decisions that affect our children’s lives arrangements necessarily have. in a detrimental way. We believe this to Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) be the case with the proposed euthanasia — My constituency question is to the The other thing that we need to examine and assisted suicide bill. Wherever Minister for Local Government. I am — Mr Jennings looks at me with intensity euthanasia has been introduced, because sure the minister will agree that the role — and delve into a little bit more is what of the slippery slope reality, children have of municipal councillors in representing happened between the other house and always suffered deeply, as they are the local communities is one of great this house. Last sitting week the Premier most vulnerable members of our society. importance. This is particularly so in stood in that other house hand on In 2001, Belgium introduced euthanasia growing areas such as Sunbury, where heart and said, ‘This is a perfect bill. We for adults. On 2 March 2014, Belgium councillors need to be on top of local have done everything right. We are not became the world’s first country to lift issues and very much in touch with their accepting any amendments’. They were all age restrictions on euthanasia. In communities. It therefore came as quite the words that he used: ‘This is a perfect September 2016, a minor has become the first child to be euthanised in Belgium a shock to hear last week that one of the bill’. Now we have here the Leader of the since age restrictions were lifted in councillors of the City of Hume is now Government and perhaps a very close the country. The child had asked for apparently living in Queensland and flying cohort of the Premier — perhaps we might euthanasia. How can a child cognitively down for council meetings. I ask: will the say that — who is taking a diametrically ask for such a thing? Dads4Kids minister inquire as to the truth about the opposed position. believes this is child abuse. In 2002 the councillor’s residential arrangements and We have here on an extraordinarily Netherlands followed Belgium and take the appropriate action to ensure this introduced euthanasia. On a downhill run difficult and extraordinarily important from Belgium, the Netherlands included councillor is fulfilling her duties? piece of legislation, I should say, two very children over 12 years of age. senior members of the government who are at odds. We have the Premier who is Minister, this is an extremely disturbing saying, ‘This legislation is perfect’, and and distressing situation. It is my very we have the Leader of the Government strong view that the bill that is currently in the upper house saying, ‘Well, it’s not before the house will inevitably lead to perfect at all. We need to drop five pages the sorts of situations that we have seen of amendments on the house’. I think in Belgium and that we have seen in the that alone, given the importance of this Netherlands, particularly with attitudes legislation, needs to be discussed at to people with disabilities not necessarily length and needs to be examined, but the changing but hardening. That is something amendments also need to be examined. that does concern me enormously. So I think that what Mr Davis is proposing Has the government given any is a very reasonable, a very logical and a consideration to providing some sort of

IN 32 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE public support for people with disabilities reasonable thing to do, given that it is the to specifically rule us out. who may be feeling threatened? I note that government that has actually put these While the ink has barely dried on the tomorrow the government is providing people — these very vulnerable people, Victorian government’s Voluntary counselling and support for public I have to say — in a situation where they Assisted Dying Bill, the legislation servants who may be distressed by the feel that their very lives are under threat. I introduced by Premier Daniel Andrews result of the gay marriage plebiscite — ask the minister to give us an undertaking appears to have embraced the totality of postal vote; call it what you will. That that proper counselling will not be given the recommendations of the report of the is interesting. I am just wondering if just to an individual who may walk in off Victorian ministerial advisory panel. the government is going to give any the street and who we may be aware of This is troubling given those consideration to providing support or but that proper counselling may be given recommendations bring people with counselling along the same lines for people to an entire community of people with disability clearly into scope. The panel recommends that disability ‘does not with disabilities who are feeling threatened disabilities, many of whom — if indeed not satisfy the eligibility criteria for access by this legislation. most of whom — are living in fear of what to voluntary assisted dying, nor does ______this legislation will mean. disability exclude a person from eligibility to access voluntary assisted dying’, while ______the bill says that a person is not eligible Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) ‘only because the person has a disability’. — I ask the minister to go back to his Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Confused? Well, you’re not the only one. response to my previous point, and that is Thank you, Acting Deputy President — and This troubling recommendation, that regarding the fear that many people with I still reckon you should get the job, but euthanasia should be a choice for us disabilities are now feeling as a result of anyway. Give him the pay. Give him the without meeting the eligibility criteria, this legislation. I am referring particularly money. Come on! misunderstands the factors which make to one letter that I have, and I am going to Honourable members interjecting. too many of us eligible in the first place. refer to this at much greater length later on. The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr Elasmar) As I write this I can easily picture the The letter says: — Get to the question. comments underneath — ‘it’s a choice’ Our main concern is that the Victorian bill and ‘if you don’t want it, don’t ask for Mr FINN — I am sorry; I do apologise. it’. They’re understandable, but they brings this clearly into scope in a way that The last thing I would want to do would be is insidious, frightening and dangerous. gloss over justified and reasonably held to embarrass you, Acting Deputy President. concerns. This is how people with disabilities feel. I have to say that I was listening to Ms They are scared, they are worried, and their The reality is that people like me don’t Crozier’s questioning with a great deal of get choices in too many areas of our families are feeling the same way, I can interest, particularly early on when she lives. That includes a preventative and assure you. got the minister to admit that he actually tertiary health system that is staggeringly The minister has said to me and to did not realise the impact that this bill was unfriendly to us, even if people with the house that it is not the government’s having on a huge number of Victorians. disability and/or chronic conditions intention to create that sort of feeling I made some reference to this a little bit should be their best customers. for people with disabilities, and it might earlier, but I think it is probably time to When the panel was trying to grapple not be. I sincerely hope it is not the revisit it. It might be time that I revisited with the issue of where to draw the line government’s intention, but it is the reality; it because clearly the minister does not for people with disability, they used an it is actually what is happening in real realise that this bill is having a huge example which perfectly crystallises this time. There are people out there probably lack of meaningful choices in the health impact on a huge number of people in the system and makes euthanasia such a listening to this debate as I am speaking community of disabled people. worrying threat to our lives. who are fearful and who are very scared To give him some idea of what I am Recommending against excluding people of what this legislation will mean for them talking about, I want to read him an article or their family members. What will the with disability from euthanasia, the panel from the Guardian. This will carry some gave the example of Tina, a 43-year- government do to ensure that those people weight with him, I am sure, because it old woman with cerebral palsy. ‘Fully feel that they are safe? This legislation is from the Guardian. I am quoting the employed as a disability advocate and clearly puts a whole range of people in the Guardian. This will carry some weight with educator, Tina lives independently and gun, if I can use that term. It may be an the minister because I understand it is the communicates using a communication unfortunate term, but that is the reality of only publication that he reads. It is by a tool. Six months ago Tina was diagnosed the situation. with an aggressive cancer for which she chap called Craig Wallace. Craig Wallace has now exhausted all treatment options’. Will the government in some way — and is the convenor of Lives Worth Living, a I am not sure how they are going to do it disability advocacy group. The article was The panel felt that Tina should be offered — go to some lengths to ensure that those euthanasia because her request was published on 27 September of this year, ‘voluntary and enduring’. people who are currently living in fear as and it begins by saying: a result of this legislation are put at ease What’s also enduring but decidedly Offering people with disability euthanasia involuntary is the chronic lack of access to and made to feel that they are full human is no act of equality. It’s a cruel one-way beings? our health system for many people with a exit when we’re locked out of basic health disability like Tina’s. care. ______Back in 2003 a community advocacy The article continues: group, Access for All Alliance, undertook Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Legislation has been introduced into a survey of all general practices around Minister, I am far from aware of every the Victorian and New South Wales Australia to identify which provided person who is affected by, impacted by or parliaments seeking to become the first access to adjustable-height examination living in fear of this legislation. I have been jurisdictions to legalise euthanasia since beds. The survey showed that of the 3553 the Northern Territory’s brief window in responses there were just over 14 000 contacted by a number of organisations the 1990s. who have expressed that view, and they fixed-height examination beds and Like the rest of the community, people only 719 adjustable-height examination themselves would have a number of beds. An open letter from the Human members of their organisation who would with disability debate euthanasia with many views, but a number of us are Rights Commission found that in many be feeling that way. Some might even say genuinely concerned that legalised situations patients, particularly women it is very cute of you to offer that. I take suicide will encroach on our rights and with disability, do not get a service at all that in good grace, but there are, without see the vulnerable among us subjected because of the inaccessibility of fixed- doubt, an enormous number of people out to financial, social, emotional and other height examination beds. One woman pressures to take our own lives. had not had a Pap smear for 10 years there who I am not aware of and who I do because her doctor could not transfer her not know who are living in fear and who We have cause to be concerned about on to the fixed-height examination bed. are very scared of what this legislation will perverse outcomes if euthanasia is mean for them or their families. adopted in Australia. In some countries The National People with Disability where it has been introduced euthanasia and Carers Council’s Shut Out report What I am asking, and I think it is in 2009 also gave a sobering account of a very reasonable thing given that has been offered to people with mental illness, people with dementia, twin the exclusion of disabled people from the government is very keen to offer brothers who were deaf, and even a primary and tertiary health care including counselling to just about anybody on woman with severe tinnitus. comorbidity arising from a lack of access any given subject, is that the government to yearly check-ups and health screenings. My challenge to advocates of voluntary offer support and counselling to those euthanasia who insist that here in Eight years later the national disability people who are currently living in fear Australia it would ‘never be about strategy reports very little sustained and of this legislation. I think that is a very someone like you’, would be to ask them meaningful improvement in our access

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 33 to health care including for people with Minister, can you now see the impact that requiring 24-hour care. Having to rely physical disability or communication this bill is having on people with disability on someone else to wipe your bum issues. While the national disability in this state? may not be something anyone aspires insurance scheme (NDIS) is starting to to, but I’m quite sure it’s never killed make a difference in specialist supports, it ______anyone. Perhaps our discomfort with this won’t fix the health system. kind of thing is why we don’t hear the Business interrupted pursuant to counterview in reports about assisted Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I dying. standing orders. thank the minister for most of those Sitting extended pursuant to standing comments. When he says that the job is not Often we hear supporters of euthanasia orders. and assisted suicide talk about wanting done, I think that is probably somewhat of to avoid the pain and suffering that The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr Elasmar) an understatement. The job is a long, long often comes with imminent death. — Before I call you, Mr Finn, I want to way from being done, and there are still a But more often, we hear stories like remind members of my opening remarks, lot of people out there who are saying to Barbara Harling’s, which are more about which were that we are not dealing with me, to us as parliamentarians, ‘Why are wanting to avoid a loss of autonomy and the second-reading speech. I know you you offering us death when you don’t offer independence. need to elaborate, but I think we need us a decent living?’. That is something that Minister, I think the two stories that I to make it a bit shorter and get to some we have to face as a Parliament and indeed have related to you tonight, the one from questions. as a society. Craig Wallace and the one from the late Mr FINN — Acting President, I make I just want to finish with a much shorter Stella Young, show a real humanity of the point to you that I am only reading quote from the late Stella Young, who I am people with disabilities but also a real fear this because of what the minister said in sure the minister would be familiar with. of how they are being treated and indeed response to questioning from Ms Crozier. She was a comedian, writer and disability how they will be treated with a new regime That is the only reason that I am now activist and quite an extraordinary woman. of euthanasia. You may call it anger, but reading it. I was going to do it much later, She wrote, on the implications of legalising let me assure you it is driven by fear. It is but I am doing it now because the minister assisted suicide for people living with a driven by fear because they know, as Stella made it very, very clear to everybody in this disability: Young said: chamber and everybody listening that he As a disabled person, I’m accustomed to As a disabled person who has had a lot did not actually realise the impact of this conversations about quality of life and to do with the medical profession, I can bill on people with disabilities. dignity. Specifically, I’m accustomed tell you that this is the space in which to assuring people that my life is worth I’ve experienced some of the very worst I will continue to read from the article by disability prejudice and discrimination. Craig Wallace. He said: living. I’m short-statured, a wheelchair user, and I frequently have bone fractures. I have seen that too. I have heard that On the ground, I hear from people who All the visual cues that make me ‘the from doctors — from very, very senior can’t be examined by their GP because other’ are front and centre. People make doctors — as I said before, talking about they don’t have a height-adjustable exam all sorts of assumptions about the quality table. Clinics, primary care, dentists, of my life and my levels of independence. my children in a way that disgusted me holistic health and the tertiary health They’re almost always wrong. beyond words. Unfortunately that is the system still have significant barriers to way that a lot of people think. I think the access, especially in regional Australia. I’ve lost count of the number of times I’ve been told, ‘I just don’t think I could live disabled community, if I can call the good If Tina has aggressive cancer there is a like you’, or ‘I wouldn’t have the courage people with disabilities that, have a great very good chance that she couldn’t even in your situation’, or, my favourite one to deal to fear from the ramifications of this get a proper medical exam or the kinds overhear (and I’ve overheard it more than bill, and they know it. They know it, and of screening recommended for women once), ‘You’d just bloody top yourself, they are very, very fearful. So, Minister, I her age. She probably couldn’t even find wouldn’t you?’. do hope that you will take that on board, a clinician with the time and capacity to It sounds very familiar, I have to say. because they are as a community very, very communicate with her. What we as a society think we know about fearful of what this bill will mean for them In the real world someone like Tina is what it means to live as a disabled person and their lives. also very unlikely to have a job and to be comes from cultural representations of ______able to afford private health insurance disability seen through a non-disabled or even find the informal supports that lens. And we, as people with disability, other people could call on following a life- rarely get to tell our own stories. Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — changing health diagnosis. As a woman Minister, I take on board what you say, but with disability she’s also far more likely Also, social attitudes towards disabled to be facing various forms of violence or people come from a medical profession I express the very strong view that, yes, abuse that make life seem intolerable. that takes a deficit view of disability. their rights are very, very important, but This is a really important point: their right to live outweighs their right to Choice? What a joke. kill themselves, and I think — well, Stella Sitting in Tina’s wheels people with … social attitudes towards disabled cannot agree — Craig would agree on that disability are entitled to ask members people come from a medical profession one. of Parliament: why are you hurrying to that takes a deficit view of disability. grant us the ‘choice’ to die when you This is my major concern with legalising Moving on to an area that is very close never lifted a finger to fix the barriers that assisted death; that it will give doctors to my heart, and that is the area of autism. made our lives miserable or gave us equal more control over our lives. This is one that is very, very difficult, and I access to preventative health? As a disabled person who has had a lot do not doubt that for one moment. Some Until every person with disability has to do with the medical profession, I can people might think that they know a fair equal access to screening, prevention and tell you that this is the space in which bit about autism, but as somebody said treatment in our health system, suicide I’ve experienced some of the very worst to me some years ago: when you have prevention resources, and meaningful disability prejudice and discrimination. met somebody with autism, all it means alternatives to ending it all, offering Doctors might know about our biology, is you have met somebody with autism. us euthanasia isn’t an act of generous but it doesn’t mean they know about our lives. It does not mean that you actually know equality. It’s our Hobson’s choice — a a lot about autism, so I want to give a fake, cruel one-way exit for vulnerable Media reports on assisted dying feed people locked out of basic health thumbnail sketch of autism. Autism these misconceptions. ABC News Spectrum Australia has put this together, care and other social and community reported this week on the case of Barbara infrastructure that others take for granted. Harling, a Queensland woman with and I just want to read this to the minister Minister, this is a plea from the heart motor neurone disease who said that she before asking my question, because I think from a disability advocate who is one of would consider moving to Tasmania if the it is important that we have a reasonable many who is terrified by this legislation, voluntary assisted dying bill had passed. understanding of what we are dealing with Harling is quoted as saying: ‘Well, let’s here: and with damn good reason — with put it this way. I can use my left hand, my very good reason. I know for a fact just right hand is just about useless. If I can’t Autism is characterised by marked how hard people with disabilities have use my left hand to wipe my bottom, then difficulties in behaviour, social to fight every day of their lives for basic I can do nothing else for myself. That interaction, communication and sensory services, for their basic rights, and now means someone has to do everything for sensitivities. Some of these characteristics me. I couldn’t bear to live like that’. are common among people on the we have a piece of legislation which may spectrum; others are typical of the even threaten their lives. Is it any wonder The thing is, a lot of people do live like disability but not necessarily exhibited by they are scared? Is it any wonder they that. I know many, many people who all people on the autism spectrum. depend on personal assistants for all are terrified? Is it any wonder they are so … vehemently opposed to this legislation? of their daily living tasks, some of them

IN 34 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE For people on the spectrum, rigidly That, I suppose, in a nutshell is autism How can we support a bill that does sticking to routines and spending their or the characteristics of autism. Autism, not protect the most vulnerable, the most time in repetitive behaviours are ways for of course, is a spectrum. I have seen innocent members of our community? them to reduce uncertainty and maintain the predictability of their environment. people on that spectrum who are the most Minister, how can we do that? brilliant people on the face of the earth, Other behaviours may include: who have minds like steel traps, who could COUNCIL | Adjournment be rocket scientists, surgeons or whatever unusually intense or focused interests; 14 November 2017 stereotyped and repetitive body they like. On the other hand I have seen movements such as hand flapping and others on the spectrum who were sitting in spinning; the corner rocking backward and forward and banging their head against the wall. repetitive use of objects such as Hyde Street, repeatedly switching lights on and off or So it is a wide and varied spectrum. Like lining up toys; so much of that spectrum, much of the problem is thereabouts in the middle. We Footscray, scout hall insistence on sticking to routines such can make a judgement about the genius Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I travelling the same route home each day — that he or she can make up their own wish to raise a matter for the attention and doing things in exactly the same of the Minister for Youth Affairs, and it order every time; mind as to what they want to do. We can make a judgement that the person sitting concerns my visit last week — it is an unusual sensory interests such as sniffing on the floor rocking backward and forward annual event actually — to the Kariwara objects or staring intently at moving scouting region annual general meeting objects; and hitting their head against the wall is in no position to make a sound judgement. (AGM). It is a source of great delight to sensory sensitivities including avoidance Both are clear. But there is a large group in me because the scouting movement is of everyday sounds and textures such as a movement that I have an enormous hair dryers, vacuum cleaners and sand. the middle, and the education system is constantly struggling with this — not very amount of respect for and an enormous I am starting to feel a bit homesick just well, I might say — about whom we just do amount of time for, and they do a reading this, I have to say. With regard to not know where the line is, if indeed there tremendous amount of good work for social interaction: is a line, as to when they can make their young people in the community. I was People with autism have difficulty own decisions and when they cannot. again last week asked to say a few words at establishing and maintaining the AGM and was delighted obviously to be Now, how is this bill going to affect able to do so. relationships. They do not respond them? How are we going to judge who on to many of the non-verbal forms of The thing that concerned me about it communication that many of us take for the autism spectrum, in that central area that I am talking about, has the ability to was the state of the scout hall. This is the granted like facial expressions, physical scout hall in Hyde Street in Footscray gestures and eye contact. They are make that judgement that they wish to often unable to understand and express access suicide and who does not have between the police station and the railway their needs just as they are unable to the ability to do it? It is about cognitive station in fact. It is a delightful old building interpret and understand the needs understanding, I suppose, but it is an — a heritage building, I would suggest — of others. This impairs their ability to extraordinarily difficult issue and one but it is not in the best nick. I was shown share interests and activities with other gaps in the floor between the floorboards people. For this reason they may appear that, if this bill goes through, we are going to have to deal with. It is really very, very and in the walls, and they are getting distant and aloof. Because they are often worse as the years go on, obviously, and delayed in their speech and struggle to basic. Minister, over to you. I ask you make sense of other non-verbal forms of to cast your grey matter at solving this causing a great deal of issues for the many communication, they may withdraw into particular problem. scouting groups that meet there. There is repetitive play and behaviour and avoid a great deal of concern that they will not interaction. ______be able to continue meeting there because Their difficulties with social interaction of the state of that hall, so I have given may manifest in the following ways: Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Not an undertaking to the authorities in the since Barry Jones gave us ‘spaghetti nation’ Kariwara region that I will raise this with limited use and understanding of non- the minister in the hope that she might be verbal communication such as eye gaze, have we heard an explanation such as the facial expression and gesture; one you just gave the chamber tonight. able to provide significant funding for a Mr Jennings interjected. refurbishment of the hall. Basically I think difficulties forming and sustaining it probably needs to be not rebuilt but friendships; Mr FINN — I am not blaming you. Had he really rehearsed it? God strike me! certainly restumped at least, I would say. I lack of seeking to share enjoyment, am not an engineer, but I reckon that that interests and activities with other people; I had very, very deep concerns about is probably what it needs. It needs a lot of this bill, obviously, and how it would affect difficulties with social and emotional work anyway, and I would imagine that it responsiveness. people with autism before the minister’s would take a fair bit of money, but it is well explanation. Now there is no doubt in worth it. Finally, on communication: my mind that this bill leaves open a gap People with autism often have wide enough to ride 20 horses through As I say, these great people do some communication difficulties in one form that would allow people with autism to wonderful work in the community, and it or another. There are some people with be subject to wrongful death. I am just is great to see volunteers who are actually autism who speak fluently, others who are staggered by the response that I have doing the work that we all admire so speech impaired to varying degrees and much. They are deserving of our support, others still, who are unable to speak at all. just heard. As I said, I do not blame the minister because it is the bill that stinks. It as indeed they give their support to our Of those who can speak, they will often young people who are the future leaders of use language in a very limited or unusual is not the minister that stinks; it is the bill way. that stinks. He might not hear me say that our state and our nation. I ask the minister to take on board what I have said and to Often they will ask the same questions all that often, but it is the bill that is at fault here. provide the financial resources for the over and over. Again, I am feeling a bit scouting hall in Hyde Street in Footscray, homesick now. This bill is going to allow people so we can keep it in good nick, or get it into The quote continues: with autism to be killed. If that is the good nick, for many years to come. explanation, if that is the dividing line, if People with autism will usually only talk about topics that are of interest to that is where we make decisions and how them which makes the give and take we make decisions, people with autism COUNCIL | Questions without notice in communication difficult. They have are going to be killed whether they like it 15 November 2017 difficulty interpreting non-verbal forms or not, and some of them might not even of communication like facial expressions, know about it. Honestly, anybody with a hand gestures and other body language. disability listening to this debate tonight or Impaired communication is even watching it will have their worst fears Sunbury youth characterised by: confirmed about this legislation, because delayed language development; this bill, whilst it might be about the right advisory council to end your life and all that sort of thing, Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — difficulties initiating and sustaining gives no protection to those who want to My question is to the Minister for Youth conversations; live. It gives no protection to those who Affairs. One of the election commitments stereotyped and repetitive use of language are in no position to defend themselves. It of the Andrews Labor government was to such as repeating phrases from television. gives no protection. create a dedicated Sunbury youth advisory

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 35 council. I ask the minister: what is the My very great concern following a phone of the left in the Premier’s office and they current status of that particular youth call that I received from a very distressed made sure she paid the ultimate political council? constituent this morning is that this price. The downfall of Robert Mugabe company, Autism Plus, is being hounded shows that even the worst of despots can Supplementary question out of business by the department. That is be overthrown. There is hope for Victoria something of great concern to me because yet. Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — the company has over 200 clients and Minister, last week your colleague the it provides services for what we might COUNCIL | Constituency questions member for Sunbury in the other place call the most difficult cases — cases that detailed that the Sunbury youth advisory perhaps not too many others would be 16 November 2017 council is currently not active and told keen to take on. If the company was to local residents that for most of his election go under, it would provide enormous commitments there has not been enough problems for a large number of people, support from the Andrews government. He and that is of very great concern. Williamstown sky even went further and said he is looking Over the past two years there have been for bipartisan support from the Liberal seven reviews following some bad publicity rail candidate for Sunbury, Cassandra Marr, to Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My on television a few years ago, and not once consistency question is to the Minister for implement this 2014 election commitment. has there been a case of non-compliance. I ask: why has the Andrews government Public Transport. I know the minister is A few months ago KPMG conducted what not keen on speaking to people affected abandoned the youth of Sunbury and it described as a maturity test and came broken yet another election promise? by her sky rail, but as an optimist by up with 81 recommendations to improve nature, I will give this another try. Minister, the service, all of which were welcomed the people of Williamstown are deeply COUNCIL | Constituency questions by Autism Plus. They were in the process concerned about the impact of your sky 15 November 2017 of implementing these recommendations, rail on their delightful suburb. They have but two months ago the department expressed a very strong desire to discuss stepped in and began a campaign of what their concerns with the minister and have I would describe as harassment, quite asked me to facilitate a meeting with her. Buckley Street level frankly. Now we have a situation where I ask again: will the minister join me in the minister is proposing to appoint an Williamstown to meet with local residents crossing administrator without giving Autism Plus to have a full and frank discussion on this Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My the opportunity to do what they want to do. most important matter? constituency question is to the Minister I ask the minister to give this company the for Public Transport. I refer to the most chance that it needs, the time that it needs, recent response by the minister to my to actually get those recommendations in COUNCIL | Committee stage recent question on the Buckley Street level place and to allow the company to provide 16 November 2017 crossing removal in Essendon. I assure the services that it does so well. the minister there are very real problems ahead on this issue, and her flippant COUNCIL | Members statements politically motivated put-downs of anyone 16 November 2017 Voluntary Assisted expressing genuine concern on this matter are disgraceful. I ask: will the minister put Dying Bill 2017 party-political games to one side and listen to the local community in a bid to avoid Contributions duing the her imminent stuff-up on Buckley Street? Australian Labor Committe stage of the Bill Party COUNCIL | Adjournment Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — The Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I 15 November 2017 political thuggery and bullying by the rise to support the motion put forward Andrews government is becoming quite by Mr Morris. I do believe that we must infamous. Anyone who crosses the Premier have time to carefully consider this bill. in any way is likely to meet a political sticky As has been said a number of times, and Autism Plus end very quickly. Mr Somyurek found that as I suspect will be said many more times Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I out early in the piece. His former cabinet before we are finished with this legislation, wish to raise a matter for the attention of colleague Jane Garrett in the Assembly this bill is a particularly important one. It the Minister for Housing, Disability and was done over as well, and overnight the is one that has a far-reaching impact on Ageing, and it concerns a company called Premier’s bovver boys finished her off — human lives. We are not just talking about Autism Plus, which services my electorate. presumably the bovver girls as well. some sort of sideways push or something Autism Plus has branches in Melton and like that. This is actually about who lives We know when the Labor caucus is and who dies, so we really need to get also in Westmeadows that both service meeting because the stench of pure hatred Western Metropolitan Region. Autism Plus, this right. I will say that again and again wafts through this building. Labor detests and again if I have to: we really need to as it describes itself, is a unique support volunteers. Labor loathes the Country service that provides qualified staff with get this right. For us to get this right we Fire Authority. Labor is not at all keen on actually have to know what we are doing. specialised skills and knowledge to support the rule of law, but its members reserve individuals within the autism and disability At this point in time I cannot actually say intense hatred in its purest form for each that that is the case. I do not believe that sector. This unique support service ensures other. Extraordinarily, those who perhaps that individuals’ personalised goals and is the case. Every time we come in here should feel the wrath of the Premier get the government throws another lot of aspirations are the main objective of their off scot-free, particularly if they are in his service delivery. The directors have over 40 amendments at us, and if the government Socialist Left faction. does not know what it is doing, how are we years of practical experience in community A classic example is the overnight and disability services and have developed supposed to know what it is doing? preselection of a bloke called Justin An honourable member interjected. models of support for complex behaviours Mammarella in the seat of Melton. both in their positive support units and Replacing Donny Nardella in the Assembly Mr FINN — The clerks do a great job, in home and community environments, with Justin Mammarella, son of Mr Khalil I have to say, but they are facing a major with amazing outcomes. Autism Plus can Eideh’s former office manager — I think he challenge just at the minute, as indeed manage an individual’s funding package is former; I am not sure — ensures Labor’s are members who are trying to keep from the Department of Health and reputation in the west will continue to be up with a government which is, as Mr Human Services, the national disability a running joke. Everyone I have spoken to Morris so correctly said, making policy insurance scheme and any other funding was appalled by last night’s Melton result, on the run. The fact of the matter is that body. They are able to ensure a flexible but as one local said to me this morning, this policymaking on the run has turned approach to accessing unique supports ‘Can we expect anything better? They’re all this debate into somewhat of a dog’s and mainstream or alternative services and crooks’. breakfast. You have got amendments and are committed to encouraging individuals so forth flying around all over the place. to have flexible control of their funding. Ms Garrett’s great sin may have been to I notice one here — and I would love a do the honourable thing by Victorians, but briefing on this one — on clause 19. This it also meant she stood up to the bullies

IN 36 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE is Mr Ramsay’s amendment. I will ask Mr world’s best at palliative care. They have the debate; he said that to me privately. Ramsay about this in a moment, given the committed their lives to helping others die But that did not stop him from popping chance. and giving others a good death or as good on the jackboots earlier this evening Mr Ramsay — Wait till we get to clause a death as one can have. For that I think we and stomping on freedom of speech in 19. should be exceptionally grateful, and we this house, curtailing the debate and Mr FINN — No, I am keen to know now. should be showing that gratitude in many breaking his word. So I must say that once The amendment reads: ways. somebody has lied to me, I really have a What concerns me is that I have heard lot of trouble believing them again. I find 6. Clause 19, line 31 omit “process.” and myself in the situation where I really have insert “process;”. over the last couple of months from a number of these practitioners that they a lot of trouble believing anything that Mr That is what it says. I am really keen to will walk away if this bill is passed. Their Jennings might say. On that basis, I really know exactly what that means, and we concern is clearly that the government had a lot of trouble coming up with any need time — has decided that palliative care is a very questions. Ms Crozier — It’s got a semicolon. expensive exercise, and it surely is. They On that basis, I move: Mr Ramsay — Yes. are of the view that the government That the Acting President report progress Mr FINN — Oh, it has got a semicolon, has gone down the path of supporting and ask leave to sit again on next day of has it? It has too. euthanasia or assisted dying — call it what meeting. The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr Melhem) you will — and that it is only a matter of In terms of doing that we need a little bit — Thank you, Mr Finn. Can I ask you to go time before palliative care itself becomes of breathing space after today. There has back to the clause. You have been drifting such an expensive proposition that the been some very highly emotional times in away a bit. money dries up for that as well. They have this house this afternoon. I do not think Mr FINN — I do not think I have, said to me straight out that they are going that we can debate such an important Acting President. With the greatest of to give up if this legislation is passed. They matter — and I think even the government respect — with every bit of respect that will walk away and that would be, to my regard it as an important matter — with you deserve — acting acting Deputy way of thinking, a tragedy. the degree of adrenaline pumping that we President, I am very keen to ensure that Now, I am aware of the government’s have at the moment. The way the house we fully understand the ramifications of announcement. I am not sure when the has been treated, the way that members the amendments that we have before us government made the announcement, but have been treated this evening, leaves a today, and in order to understand the I understand the government made the very, very bad taste in the mouths of us all. ramifications, we have to understand what announcement sometime in the last 48 In fact I think it affects how we feel, and it the amendments mean. As was mooted hours about added palliative care moneys. affects how we think. earlier, we will probably be sitting into I do not wish to speculate on why the These are very, very important matters the early hours of tomorrow morning. We government has made that announcement, that we are discussing. These amendments are all going to get very, very tired. It is although one could only assume it has a lot that we are looking at, these clauses that we very, very difficult to take all this in and to to do with actually getting this bill through. are looking at, are exceedingly important. consider the far-reaching implications of That does not change the fact that a good They will decide, in many instances, who these amendments in that situation. What number of practitioners in palliative care, lives and who dies. There cannot possibly we need to do at this point in time is for the who have helped an enormous number of be any greater responsibility on legislators. committee to report progress and for us to people in so many ways and over such a It is just not possible for us to be debating go away and have a bit of time to consider long period of time, will actually walk away anything more important than what we what is being put before us. I commend the if this bill is passed. are debating today. We can talk about minister, Mr Jennings, for being expansive What message, Minister, can you buses, we can talk about freeways, we can in his explanations — give them, to give them some degree of talk about jobs and the economy and all Mr Jennings — Many people tell me I’m satisfaction that their services are still very that. That is important — of course it is too expansive. much required and that their services important — but here we are in this house Mr FINN — Some people may well, but are still very much appreciated, given tonight actually discussing who should live I appreciate the candour — to a degree that they have personally said to me that and who should die. — that the minister is showing and I they will walk away if this bill is passed. I do not believe that many of us are in appreciate that he is attempting to give us I think it would be a tragedy for the state a fit state at the moment to do that given the answers that we seek. But we really do if we were to allow that to happen. I am what happened here earlier this afternoon need to know what these amendments are. very hopeful that, if this bill is passed, — that is, the total betrayal of trust of You can amend anything beyond — they may well change their minds. I am the house by the government and by the Ms Crozier — ‘Process’ by ‘process’. hopeful that the minister may be able to Leader of the Government and the way give some guarantee of sorts, or some Mr FINN — That is right. There are a that he did that. It does leave the house sense of comfort, to those palliative care and many of its members almost in a state whole range of things here that we could practitioners who find themselves in the go through. I am not sure whether the of shock, I think it would be safe to say. situation where they are thinking about I must say that at the dinner break I acting acting Deputy President will let walking away — indeed they have already me do that, but there are a whole range of went for a very long walk through the city. made up their minds that they will walk Whether or not that did my lungs any things here that we really do need to know away — if this legislation becomes law. about. We have got amendments moved by good, I do not know, but certainly I went Mr Jennings. Firstly, we had amendments ______for a very long walk to try to comprehend moved by Mr Jennings on Tuesday, and and process what had happened in this now we have come back in here today Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — house earlier in the evening. I have to and he has thrown a whole batch of Thank you, Acting President Elasmar; it is say I am still coming to terms with it. I do amendments at us again. great to see you back in the chair. I might not think that we should be expected to Mr Ramsay — One. say I have considerably more confidence debate matters of life and death why we are in you than I did in the last bloke. I think it still affected in the way that we are by the Mr FINN — It is not one at all. political thuggery that we saw here in this Mr Ramsay — It is. is a sad reflection on the government and the bullyboys in the Premier’s office that house earlier this afternoon. Mr FINN — It is ‘Further amendments to we have got to the stage where political It is, as I say, a very sad day for me and be proposed in committee by Mr Jennings’. thuggery is running the upper house of the a very sad day for the Parliament — not Mr Ramsay will not last long in politics if Victorian Parliament. What we have seen just for this house but for the Parliament of he cannot count. It is four. So I urge the tonight is certainly the most disgraceful Victoria. Here we have a Parliament made committee to support the motion moved thing that I have seen in my 18 years in up of members democratically elected by by Mr Morris. Parliament. I very much doubt if I will ever the people. Interestingly, the government ______see anything quite like it again, unless of of the time said, ‘This is going to give course it is introduced by this government. rejuvenation to the house of review’, and Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — We were given an assurance — I was that has happened to a large degree, I have Minister, as we have discussed a little given an assurance personally and publicly to say. bit today, we do have some exceptional — by Mr Jennings that there would be But in this particular situation the palliative care services in this state. We no curtailment of debate. He told me government, on one of the most important have some exceptional practitioners — that he was happy to discuss any matter pieces of legislation that we have ever had doctors, nurses and others — who are that we wished to raise. He said that in before this house, decided to shut down all

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 37 debate on a particular clause that we were It is central to this debate. Because whilst so. I am very hopeful that the committee debating. And there was a lot more that I we have members of the government will do that because I think, as I say, had to ask. There were a lot of matters that talking about choice, there can be no palliative care is a very central issue to this I wished to raise with the minister, and choice if there is no palliative care. And whole debate. unfortunately that opportunity was ripped unfortunately in much of Victoria, in I very strongly support, firstly, our ability away from each and every one of us. That metropolitan Melbourne and certainly to debate this amendment, and later on I is deeply, deeply regrettable. I think we do in country Victoria, there is little or no will also support the amendment, if indeed need a bit of breathing space here. I think palliative care. I have got to say I think it is we are given the right to debate it. I am it is only — appalling that we have a situation where hoping for that to occur in the interests Ms Crozier — What’s the rush? country Victorians are discriminated of freedom of speech, and we have seen Mr FINN — As Ms Crozier says, what’s against. freedom of speech have the living suitcase the rush? What is the rush? We are I am somebody who grew up on a kicked out of it tonight in here. I would talking about over 18 months before the dairy farm down near Colac. I am a Colac hope that we have actually now got back commencement of the bill. I have no idea boy — I am, and I remember. I feel very on track. Hopefully the government has why the government has taken the action strongly that country people deserve the got back on track and we might actually that it has tonight and has impacted the same rights and the same treatment that show some respect for those who are trying reputation of this Parliament and impacted those in the city get. I recall growing up to genuinely improve a bill which is so I think almost the emotional health of that there was a fairly strong view in the crook that it almost could apply for VAD many members. I have to say, as somebody minds of locals that they did not get a real itself. It is so bad, this particular bill. I am who believes in parliamentary democracy, good deal. When I look at it now, I have to very hopeful that this amendment will be I have been shocked. I think we should say they are probably right, particularly in able to be debated, and I look forward to report progress to give us some time to terms of palliative care. I do not know what participating in that debate and supporting recover and get ready for a proper debate. it is called now — is it Colac health? Is that it at the appropriate time. what it is called? It is Colac Area Health. It ______The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr Elasmar) used to be the Colac hospital when I was a — Order! Mr Finn, I was going to tell you lad, but it is Colac Area Health now. that we are debating amendment 1 moved Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — A I have been in the situation where by Mr Davis and that it is a test for his number of speakers tonight have given I have had very close relatives in the amendments 2 and 3. ample voice to the view of a number of final stages of their lives, including my ______other members who perhaps are listening father, my mother and another dear, dear in their offices and to a lot of people who friend — my second mother, I suppose. are listening and watching in their homes. I sat by her bed for some weeks while Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I know that there is a very big audience. I she departed this world. There was some Minister, the commencement date, as we had a chat earlier with somebody who was degree of palliative care. Or was it? Was it know, is 1 July — listening to the debate on his headphones palliative care, or was is it just what you Mr Jennings — No, 19 June. as he went for a run, which would have to would expect in a good country hospital? Mr FINN — It is 19 June, is it? be a first, I would have thought. There are I think it probably could have been a hell Mr Jennings — Yes. a lot of people who are very keen to see of a lot better, and I think that if somebody common sense prevail here. is going through a difficult situation at ______As has been pointed out by a number the end stages of their life, in the country of people, we are in need of a break. We they are going to get a rougher deal than Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — It is are in need, after what happened tonight in the city. That is something that needs to jumping ahead all the time. Inflation is a in particular — after the abuses of the be addressed, and that is why we need to wonderful thing. Could I ask the minister: parliamentary process that we saw here debate these amendments that Mr Davis how soon after 19 June 2019 does he expect tonight — of a break and a bit of a spell has put up before the committee tonight. the first victim to be killed? to collect our thoughts and to come back These are matters that are really of grave ______tomorrow refreshed and renewed to make concern to anybody. We have been talking the decisions that we need to make, and about palliative care, as the minister they are extremely important decisions. will tell us. We have been talking about Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) Whilst I know that there are certain palliative care quite extensively today. It — I am particularly concentrating my members in this place who do not really seems to me that if we are going to talk comments around paragraph (a) of care about detail, the fact of the matter is about palliative care, the least we can do is clause 5, which states, ‘every human life that this bill is a very complex bill and one actually debate some amendments which has equal value’. I have to say that when that we really need to be on our mettle with would include it in the bill. That would I woke up on Wednesday morning I was to get all the details right. I have said before make sense to me. So I am very hopeful almost depressed. I felt very, very down, that we need to get this right. that members might see common sense I have to say, and that was pretty much Honourable members interjecting. on this. I am very hopeful that members the way I felt the entire morning. I could Mr FINN — I know Ms Patten is might actually see that Mr Davis is making not quite work out why, and it struck me desperately keen to just get on with this a genuine attempt. He is having a red-hot about lunchtime of Wednesday that it was bill. She does not care about detail. That go at getting — as a result of the answer that the minister does not matter. She has never worried gave me with regard to who would be Mr Jennings — It is a red-letter day for able to be killed or who would be able to about detail. She just wants to get on with you to actually be doing this. it. But that is not something that concerns kill themselves under this legislation. It Mr FINN — It may well be, Minister, but concerned me enormously, as I expressed me. I want to get this right. I think we must I think you have got to give credit — get this right, because if we do not get it at the time, that there would be inevitably right, there are going to be a lot of people Mr Jennings — All of us — we all under this legislation those who have who will die but who should not die. understand the significance of what you disabilities, particularly mental disabilities, are doing. who may well be included in this regime. ______Mr FINN — You have got to give credit It also concerned me enormously that the where it is due, and Mr Davis has done minister did not seem to realise just how Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I a remarkable job in encapsulating what horrendous an impact this legislation is rise to support the amendment moved is needed in this bill. At the very least we having on those in the community who are by Mr Davis and to commend him for the should be in a position where we can disabled. That shocked me, I have to say. work that he has put into this and indeed debate these amendments and hopefully I found this article, and I was going to the work he has put into this debate. I improve the bill. I have made my view read it before we were cut off in our prime think he has done a fine job to this point, known that I think the bill is a stinker, last night. So here is the opportunity for me it has to be said. That is always a very and it really is a very untidy and a very to do exactly that. The article is written by good thing. Why would we need to debate dangerous bill, but at least if we were to Deborah Shurman-Kauflin, PhD, and it is this amendment when it is largely about include some components of palliative headed ‘Killing the disabled: the danger of palliative care? That is the bottom line. If care or some regulations pertaining the wolf pack mentality’. It reads: you wanted to encapsulate this motion in to palliative care, that may be some The disabled are better off dead. They two words, you would say ‘palliative care’. redeeming feature. I would hope that the suck up resources and contribute little to Palliative care is particularly central to committee would see fit to debate this. I society. With limited medical personnel, this debate. That is the fact of the matter. think it is extremely important that we do medications, and money, why should

IN 38 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE these parasites be alive? Why not kill It isn’t just parents who seek to kill off support without truly talking about what them? Shouldn’t we consider the impact the disabled. Family members and even they really want to do. How very clever of of keeping the disabled going? Would those with no connection seek to end the them. it be acceptable to euthanise those lives of those who don’t fit in what would with disabilities to decrease the surplus be considered a ‘normal’ life. Everything The disabled add much to the world population? from autism to quadriplegia, to MS, to and are an inspiration to those who pay attention. Living with difficulties can be These are the frightening words which mental disability is targeted. In short, if you are not in the norm, watch out. There challenging, to say the least. However, I hear with more and more frequency, are predators gunning for you. those who have been placed in the and they are absolutely sickening. You situation of dealing with disability often would think such words would be met with Almost invariably the death seekers have an amazing insight into what really disdain from the public; however, there is argue that they would never want to live matters in life. Trivial things mean very as invalids, so therefore, no-one should. little. A person’s heart and spirit are what growing support for this line of thought. They can’t see any value to such a life. matter, and no one exemplifies this more Increasingly there are articles and reports You will hear others say that in cases than those who find creative ways to do which vilify the disabled in the same way where communication is limited, if only things that others take for granted. that serial killers objectify their victims. the disabled could speak, they’d tell Those with disabilities are described as you they want to be killed. This is clear If you have ever had the privilege of projection on the part of the would-be working with or spending time with those burdens with nothing to offer. Worse, with disabilities, then you will see they they are referred to as parasites that suck killer. What such a person is really saying is that he would want to die, or at least he are not simply objects to be euthanised resources from financial and medical believes that he would want to die rather because they offend you. Just a smile from systems. There is very much an ‘us’ against than live in a certain condition. He is a disabled child can help brighten the ‘them’ mentality taking hold. Though few communicating for himself, not for the day of those nearby. Have you ever seen would ever admit it, it is clear that a large potential victim. the artwork of a quadriplegic? They can manipulate the brush with their mouths number … want nothing to do with those Few want to see those who are disabled to create amazing pictures. who have disabilities. Furthermore, there because it reminds them of what can is a wolf pack mentality taking hold which happen to them, and they don’t want Isn’t it interesting that there are rescue targets the weak for termination. The that. No-one wants to believe that they groups for unwanted pets to save them could end up with a disability, so they from euthanasia, yet there is an entire healthy, rich, and young are forming an coalition bent on euthanising humans alliance like a wolf pack intent on tearing objectify in order to distance themselves emotionally. Instead of being a child who have expressed no desire for death? apart its target. The targets are the disabled I continually hear people say that the who are least able to defend themselves. or a wife or a father, the person with a handicap is viewed as a ‘thing’. You disabled are suffering, so killing them is To be clear, these are people who have not will hear the truly psychopathic mutter humane. Would you like to know how expressed any desire to die. phrases like ‘he’s like a plant’, or ‘he’d be many serial killers have told me that? better off dead’. I interviewed a large group of female Ms Pulford interjected. serial killers, many of whom killed sick or Mr FINN — Minister, you might like to I have heard those sorts of phrases used disabled victims. They claimed they did try and shut me down, but my personal on my own children. it to put the victims out of their misery. view is that I owe the people in the Using such language makes it easier to Same words, folks. In truth, the serial disabled community the right to read this make the horrendous supposition that the murderers didn’t have the welfare of the particular article. This has everything to do disabled should be put down like dogs. victims in mind. They killed because they Some have said that the disabled have enjoyed it. It brought them power, money, with the bill — everything to do with the or stress relief. Sound familiar? bill. died anyway, so why not finish them off? Honourable members interjecting. This has been said about people who have Those seeking to condemn disabled view had strokes or are in wheelchairs. them as nothings to be thrown away, just Mr FINN — You are a bloody disgrace, like trash. For the people out there who you really are. It continues: Someone who wants to kill the disabled is speaking loud and clear. At the heart think it is noble to kill those with special The venom and hatred directed at those of his communication he is saying that needs, let me tell you something. There who are deemed to be physically or the disabled offend him in some way. is nothing honourable about killing off mentally — Whether he doesn’t want to spend the weak. I hear such phrases as ‘Don’t you judge me unless you’ve walked in Honourable members interjecting. money, whether he just doesn’t want to see them, whether he wants power my shoes!’. Funny thing is that the death Mr FINN — Let the record show that over life and death, or whether he is advocates clearly are not in the shoes whilst I am reading this article I am being simply making a pathetic attention grab of those they seek to kill. They are not heckled by ministers of the Crown of the for himself, the motivation cannot be putting themselves into those shoes. The Andrews government. Let the record show. assumed to be benign. Anytime killing truth is you don’t know how you will react until you are placed into any situation. It goes on: others is discussed, you have to ask the question ‘Why?’. Why is it so important to You may spout off that you wouldn’t want The venom and hatred directed at kill off certain people? What is in it for the to live a certain way, but things become those who are deemed to be physically killer? What benefit is to be had? When it much different when you are on the other or mentally unworthy is staggering. gets down to it, the truth typically involves end of the death needle. Now more than ever, we hear stories money and/or emotional benefit. In the UK a young quadriplegic starved of scientists, doctors, and those in herself to death because she stated that government arguing that it is acceptable What is the emotional benefit? Ending stress can be the reward. For someone her family routinely tormented her by to euthanise those who are not physically saying what a burden she was to them. or mentally in the norm. Some would like who is tied to those with special needs, the process can be stressful, and for a The comments from the public were to grab their organs while others simply staggering. People praised the girl for want to be relieved of a responsibility. handful of those relatives or caretakers, killing is preferable to allowing the victim offing herself because to them she was a Human beings are being objectified in worthless burden. They wouldn’t want to order to make it easy to kill them. to live. No victim … no stress. No victim … no mess. Offing the disabled allows the have to take care of a family member in Parents who love their disabled children executioner to wrap things up in a neat that situation. It would cut into their fun have big hearts. They work hard to make little package. Not only does he remove time, and after all, seeing someone in that sure their loved ones have what they his problem, but he gains attention and state was depressing. Better to kill them need. Nurturing and caring, these parents sympathy at the same time for his ‘loss.’ off than have to watch them, and certainly see value in their kids. Then on the other if it is not legal to kill them, then bullying hand we have reports of parents who You have to carefully watch these them into suicide will work too. predators because they are clever in how have killed or seek to kill their disabled Remember that the Nazis went after children simply because they don’t want they pre-emptively strike out against anyone who may question their motives. the disabled. Then they moved to the to deal with them anymore. In at least nondisabled, lest you think that you one of these cases, the parent seeking They begin with a ‘Don’t you even glance my way to say I’m a bad person for could never be on the chopping block. to become executioner has not been Psychopathic behaviour is psychopathic financially or physically responsible for wanting to kill. I’m the victim here!’. They will work hard in an attempt to garner behaviour, and a true monster will never the children for many years. Despite this, stop with just one victim. There will she still wants them dead. sympathy for themselves in order to distract you from the fact that they want always be a reason to vilify a human But it gets worse. In cases where parents to kill someone. This is a ploy meant to being. Now it is disability. Next it might be or care takers have actually committed objectify the potential victims while at socio-economic status. Beware of those homicide, they show no remorse. Instead the same time humanising themselves. peddling death as a solution. of hanging their heads in shame the This is strange because while desperately A person is no less valuable because he is defiant killers loudly announce their trying to humanise themselves, they in a wheelchair or bed bound. A person ‘accomplishment’ as if it were an honour, take away a disabled person’s humanity. is not less valuable because an illness as if they had done something wonderful They do so by changing the victims into has robbed him of the use of his body. A in snuffing out a disabled person’s life. things instead of people. They seek to get disabled person is no less human because

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 39 he must wear an adult undergarment. This is where we get into doctor I speak with a very, very heavy heart. I A human being is not less desirable shopping, because what we are going to looked at that and I thought to myself, because he has a mental handicap. In see — and it will not take too long for this ‘God almighty, civilisation as we know it is many ways the disabled can be viewed as exceptional. They fight simply to survive to happen — is people who are going to leaving us, when you can apply for a permit which makes them strong in ways that set themselves up as euthanasia doctors. to top yourself’. At that point I think all even they do not realise. As I mentioned earlier, we are going to see human decency is starting to disappear. Philip Nitschke’s one-stop killing shop, and I know in this environment there will In terms of what would appear to be be many who don’t like this article. we will see people flying in from interstate, some safeguards, they mean nothing. They Psychopaths are abundant, and darkness people hiring flats in East Melbourne or mean nothing because there is nobody always hides from light. People don’t like somewhere — to enforce them. If you cannot enforce a having mirrors held up to them because Mrs Peulich — Boarding rooms. law, it means nothing, and that is what this when that happens, they have to look at Mr FINN — Well, maybe boarding clause is. It is a nothing — it is meaningless the ugliness staring back at them. And — and I certainly will be voting against this I am not talking about their physical rooms. In the broadest of terms, they will appearances. If you are a psychopath, you be within the boundaries of the legislation, clause. I think it is almost insulting in its may be able to fool some of the people but in fact the whole thing will be an abuse naivety, and I urge the committee to take some of the time. But you sure as anything of this legislation. We will see. Somebody those words into consideration, because are not fooling me. said to me that the prospect or the thought this is at the very heart of the legislation, The author is Deborah Schurman- that everybody has their own medical and if you have at the heart of legislation Kauflin. She is a PhD, and that was practitioner is a very middle-class concept, a clause as flawed as this, then the whole published on the website www. because there are a lot of people out there thing really is going to end in tears. psychologytoday.com. who do not have their own medico, they do ______Mr Atkinson — Was it self-published? not have their own doctor. They go to the Mr FINN — I do not know whether it local bulk-billing doctor and they get — Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I was self-published or not, but that is the Mrs Peulich — You are in and out in 10 rise to support Mr Morris’s amendment. I reality of life for people with a disability, minutes. think the amendment that Mr Morris has whether Mr Atkinson might like to think Mr FINN — Yes, in and out in 10 put forward before the committee this about it or not. That is why, Minister, minutes. I have got a very, very good morning is reflective of the depth of deep there are so many people in this state who doctor, who I might say is horrified, concern within the medical community. I have disabilities who are terrified of this absolutely horrified, by this legislation. He have spoken to many, many doctors who legislation. The fact that we have in this bill is an exceptionally good doctor — are very concerned that they will be forced that the: The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr Melhem) to participate in patient killing or assisting … Act must have regard to the following — Mr Finn, I hate to interrupt. Is a question patients to kill themselves. They want every principles— coming? assurance they can possibly get that that (a) every human life has equal value — Mr FINN — No, I am speaking to the will not be the case. I even spoke to one doctor who said that if he has to participate there is a hell of a lot of irony in that for debate and I am speaking to clause 6. I am just talking about the need — in this, he will retire. He has been a doctor a huge number of people with disabilities for a very long time, he has a good many and their families. I cannot express to the The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr Melhem) — I am just mindful that the second- patients, and he serves his community minister and to the committee too strongly exceptionally well. But he said that if he is the impact that this is having on so many reading debate has already happened. Mr FINN — Yes, it has, and it was very forced to participate in this, he will give it people. They are literally in fear for their away — he will walk away. lives. I am not suggesting that the minister, good too, I might say. or anybody else, has done that deliberately, The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr Melhem) I think it is a very worthwhile exercise for but it most certainly is happening, and I — Can you come to the question, please? Mr Morris to put forward the amendment ask the minister to please take that into Thank you. to give those doctors who are concerned about this far greater comfort than they consideration in further discussion of this Mr FINN — I am speaking on clause bill. might have now, because let me assure you 6, Acting President, and will hopefully there are a lot of doctors out there — in fact ______continue to do so if the government does I know without doubt there is one listening not get its way. But we are going to see a as we speak; the medical fraternity is by Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — situation where these words mean nothing and large opposed to this legislation. There Well, it sounds great, doesn’t it? You read — they mean nothing — because it is all is a huge number of doctors who are just clause 6 and you think to yourself, ‘How done in secret. It is all done in secret. There looking for every bit of reassurance that could anybody disagree with that? That is no way that this clause, this regime, they can get that they will not be forced to sounds like a marvellous, marvellous can be implemented because it is done in participate. What is that? secret. It is all done in secret. When you thing’. But then you think about it, and Mr Jennings — It is the sun. The sun has trying to actually put this into practice is wrap something up in secrecy, then at that point it loses its steam. risen. going beyond the realms of possibility. The Mr FINN — The sun came out, Minister, fact that this process, if I can call it that, Mrs Peulich — Are they going to dob each other in, the doctors? about 20 minutes ago, as I understand. You is done in secret ensures that this clause can go and sunbake on the steps if you like. means nothing, because the only person — Mr FINN — Oh, yes, the doctors will dob each other in — for sure, yes — but it will Mr JENNINGS — Unlikely. They will be the only person — who can actually assist in the shade. in the prosecution of somebody who has become quite a profitable business. done the wrong thing is dead. Not even the Mrs Peulich — Very profitable. Mr FINN — Well, that’s a fair point. minister, I am sure, would be able to bring We’ll still be sitting when they’re not in the Mr FINN — Yes, I have no doubt about shade, don’t worry. a witness back who is deceased. That is that at all. It will be possibly the boom something that I think is a flaw rather than industry of — The amendment put forward by Mr Morris is a very worthwhile one. lying at the basis of this bill. It all sounds Mrs Peulich interjected. great, it all sounds wonderful, but in reality I commend him for taking the action Mr FINN — Well, some may have shares in bringing it to the house, and I urge you just cannot do it. It is impractical. in it, and it may be that the Minister for Look, for example, at clause 6(b). We see members to support that when it comes to Small Business may be able to talk about the vote. that it says: one of his great achievements as setting up the person has been assessed as eligible the death industry in Victoria. ______for access to voluntary assisted dying … I have to say also, looking at paragraph ‘Eligible for access’; it is like going to (g), ‘the person is the subject of a voluntary Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I Luna Park, isn’t it? Such fun. assisted dying permit’, did anybody in just have one question for the minister — They would be: this Parliament ever think we would be to begin with anyway. Looking at clause 8(1)(a) (1)(b), I am absolutely intrigued to … eligible for access to voluntary assisted talking about legislation to give somebody dying by— a permit to either kill themselves or be know from the minister how he envisages killed? Did anybody ever think that that this law will be enforced, given this whole (i) the co-ordinating medical process will be done in secret. practitioner for the person; and would happen in the Victorian Parliament? It is an incredibly sad day — an incredibly ______(ii) a consulting medical practitioner for sad day — that we have come to this. the person …

IN 40 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — to providing this much-needed service in ______Let me just say that this clause is just Sunbury? a useless piece of fluff that I will be Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — opposing because, quite frankly, if a law COUNCIL | Committee That is disappointing, Minister, I have to is unenforceable, it is a bad law. I will be 21 November 2017 say, because I think it is something that is most certainly voting against this clause going to come back and bite people rather because it is just a total nonsense. It is severely. I refer to clause 9(3): ridiculous, and I cannot begin to imagine A person is not eligible for access to what has got into the government’s mind voluntary assisted dying only because that they would be trying to put this into Voluntary Assisted the person has a disability, within the legislation. meaning of section 3(1) of the Disability Dying Bill 2017 Act 2006. COUNCIL | Members statements Contributions duing the As the minister, I am sure, will recall, I 21 November 2017 Committe stage of the Bill raised last week the position of people on the autism spectrum and how we make proper judgements as to whether they Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I have the capacity to make informed and wish to raise a matter with the minister proper decisions with regard to this matter. Northcote by- concerning clause 9(1)(d)(iv). For those What about those on the spectrum who do who are listening, it states that for a person have some considerable decision-making election to be eligible for access to voluntary capacity but whose judgement, because of Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I assisted dying the disease must be: have to wonder if the events in this house their autism, is distorted? That is a problem last week impacted at all on the results of … causing suffering to the person that in many aspects of their life, and I certainly cannot be relieved in a manner that the would be very, very concerned in this the Northcote by-election on Saturday. It is person considers tolerable. worth asking if the heavy-handed attitude particular instance that it might be a major I think particularly the words ‘that part of their death as well. So I just ask the of the ALP in here last week disgusted the person considers tolerable’ are Northcote residents to the point where minister if there is some way to ensure worth having a look at here because the that distorted judgement of people on the they deserted Labor in their thousands. subjectivity of this line could actually The Andrews government already has quite spectrum is taken into consideration with mean anything at all. There is no way of regard to this legislation. the reputation for bullying, belligerence measuring it; there is no way of defining it and political thuggery. That thuggery was in any way. It is just a matter of somebody’s ______on full display in this house last week, opinion on what they regard as tolerable and it just might be that the good people treatment. I would be interested to hear Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I of Northcote noticed Labor closing down what the minister thinks of the prospect can only say that I for one am extremely debate and bullying members on both that this could be used as a loophole disappointed with Mr Jennings’s decision sides. Perhaps they share my view that the for access, either with the doctor and not to display some of the gestures that we gag in this place is a threat to democracy. the patient working together to access would anticipate he could do. I think there This of course would have added to euthanasia or assisted dying, or, perhaps would be very few in this Parliament who the reality of the bullying coming from worse, it could be used as a way of a doctor would be more capable of providing those this government: bullying of volunteer wrongfully killing a patient. It seems to me gestures than Minister Jennings. firefighters, bullying of parents, bullying of this loophole is very wide open to all sorts Mr Jennings — But so few of us taxi operators and even bullying of Labor’s of possibilities, none of which are very demonstrate restraint. own cabinet ministers and backbenchers. pleasant. Mr FINN — Indeed, and that disappoints Australians do not like bullies, and it is ______me greatly. I just put that on the record. clear that this is flowing through to a deep Under division 2, clause 11(1) states: dislike of Daniel Andrews. It clearly takes something special for a political leader Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I A person may make a request to a return, Minister, to clause 9(1)(d)(iv), registered medical practitioner for access to lose a seat his party has held for 90 to voluntary assisted dying. years. The bullying and belligerence of the and I suppose I am going in to bat for Andrews government is the sort of ‘special’ the medical profession. If relatives of Minister, is there anything surrounding that will see the whole damn lot of these a deceased person who had taken the this clause or indeed in this bill which bullies and political thugs thrown into option that is being proposed in this bill would prevent a group of doctors — two, the street come 24 November next year. accused the doctor of wrongful death and three, four; however many doctors — Victorians know there is something deeply, of taking advantage of the ill person at setting up shop as, I suppose, a one-stop deeply wrong with this government, and the time, what proof would that medical euthanasia shop where people could go Victorians know they deserve so much professional have to produce to defend and register themselves with a medical better. himself or herself? Given that we are practitioner? The medical practitioner talking about suffering that the person could then call their colleague in to get considers intolerable, is there any option a second opinion, and then the process COUNCIL | Constituency questions for that person to put it in writing, that would be underway. Is there anything in 21 November 2017 indeed they find that intolerable, or is it this bill to stop that from happening, given just left up in the air and just between that that in this clause it seems that a request to person and his or her doctor? register seems to be very straightforward but after that it is all a bit blurry and a little Sunbury medical ______bit ambiguous perhaps? services Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — How ______Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) would it be recorded? Is it going to be in — My constituency question is to the writing? What if that person does not have Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I Minister for Health. Sunbury is about the ability to have it recorded in writing? have no doubt, Minister, that you would to become a major growth centre and is Will it just be a matter for the doctor to try listen to the Acting President. Often the already growing at a steady rate. It is a and prove, somehow, they have done the similarities between the two are quite community with many young families, right thing? clear to me. I would have thought it to be which obviously brings an urgent need a very simple yes or no answer — is there for extended medical services. I have ______anything in this bill to stop somebody or long been a proponent of an after-hours a group of doctors setting up a one-stop public emergency clinic in Sunbury, Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I shop? probably based at the day hospital in will just ask one last question on this Mrs Peulich interjected. Macedon Street. The clinic would provide clause. Given the possibility for loopholes The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr Melhem) an after-hours emergency service not just in this law and abuse in this section, will — Mr Finn, if I may interrupt you. Mrs for Sunbury but for Bulla, Diggers Rest the minister consider amending this Peulich, I would like you to withdraw and indeed the Macedon Ranges. Will subclause to tighten the law to prevent the the commentary you have just made in the minister give serious consideration sort of thing that I have been referring to reflecting on the Chair. over the last few minutes from happening?

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 41 Mrs Peulich — Could you please mind of a person on the spectrum in most sitting in front of them. They do not know illuminate me? instances, I think it is asking too much their circumstance, they do not know their The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr Melhem) to ask any medical professional person mental state from one hour or one day — You know exactly what you said — that to make a call on this. I do not think that to the next, so you could have a situation is, a royal commission. anybody would volunteer to do it, to where the son, who is after the house, Mrs Peulich — I was actually directing tell you the truth, because it is a big ask. who is after the land, who is after the those questions to the minister at the table, Autism is something that we really do not inheritance — whatever — can take mum the Special Minister of State. know much about, despite the fact that we to the doctor on a good day and the mum The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr Melhem) talk about it a lot and we do discuss a lot of can register for euthanasia, and of course — Mrs Peulich, you were reflecting on the the needs and a lot of the concerns and a once that is underway, half the game is up Chair. whole range of things. If you speak to most, as far as the son is concerned. How do we if not all, medical professionals, they will prevent that from happening, Minister? Mrs Peulich — I do apologise if I tell you it is something that we just do not Ms Shing — There is a lot in that. reflected inadvertently on the Chair, understand. Given that those — as I say but my comments were directed to the even expert — medical people would not ______minister at the table. touch this with a barge pole, how do we The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr Melhem) draw the line as to who can make a call as Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I — Thank you, Mrs Peulich. to whether they can access euthanasia and rise to support the amendments moved Mr FINN — I am just asking one who cannot? by Mr Morris, which probably will not question — a yes or no; it will not take come as a surprise to many. I believe long. Is there anything in this bill or this ______that this conscientious objection clause clause to stop a group of doctors setting up is an extremely important one. When we a practice which specialises in euthanasia Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I are dealing with life and death matters, in this state? agree with the minister on that. I think in when we are dealing with doctors being most circumstances it would be extremely put in a position where they could well ______unlikely that somebody on the autism be pressured by either their peers or their spectrum in the sort of situation I have superiors into involving themselves in Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — If it described would be able to be put in the this sort of activity, I think it is very, very was answered, I would love to know what clear, and particularly be put in the clear in important that the law be very strong, be the answer was. Mr Jennings accuses some an unambiguous claim section, but there very clear and be very protective of the on this side of the chamber of filibustering. is nothing in this legislation which protects rights of those doctors — hopefully the It seems he is doing a bit himself just at the people of that nature who have autism, majority of doctors — who would feel that minute, because I asked for a one-word who are on the spectrum who might be killing a patient is wrong. I think that to response and he has given me a couple in that situation. There is nothing that not protect those doctors who feel that of hundred. I suppose that is up to him. actually protects them there, and that does way not just undermines the credibility of I assume from what the minister has not concern me significantly and I know it the medical profession but undermines said that clearly there is nothing in this concerns a number of other people. the ethos of the medical profession. It bill to stop people setting up one of these Just onto another matter, and again undermines the medical profession as a euthanasia shops that we are referring to. coming back to ‘clear and unambiguous’, whole. Going back to something that we did I can recall my grandmother in her latter As I have said before, this legislation, if discuss last week, and I have to say that I years. On some days she was as clear as passed, will change medicine as we know it remember this one extremely well. It was a bell, her mind was like a steel trap. On in this state. It is important that we protect the spaghetti nation Barry Jones job that other days she did not know who she those doctors who feel that they do not Mr Jennings did to us when I asked about was or where she was or even who I was, want to be changed. I think it is important the autism spectrum and who on the which was pretty upsetting at the time. My that we protect those doctors who are of autism spectrum would be in a position to mother, I recall, had a brain tumour as a the view that they went into medicine, make a call on whether they were eligible result of secondaries of a breast cancer. In they became doctors, to heal, to cure and for euthanasia or not. I have to say I am the last days of her life I would be speaking not to kill. I think it is important for the still at a loss. I know that the minister did to her. We would be involved in a full-on sake of not just them but for our medical go at some length through an explanation. conversation about something and she facilities and our medical system that those I think we would probably need Mr Dalla- would just wander off into another sphere. doctors be protected. If indeed they are Riva and some of his people from the fraud What happens and who makes the call not protected, if indeed they are forced squad, or the forensic squad anyway, to for people in this situation where one into this unfortunate activity, then there investigate this because I could not quite minute or one day or one hour they are will be a good number of them who will follow it, and I am still befuddled as to absolutely fine and the next they do not walk away, and that would be very, very exactly where the line is drawn on the know where they are? Who makes the sad indeed, because as we know, we do autism spectrum as to who can call the call? If a person in that situation goes to lack doctors, particularly in the country shots for their own situation. the doctor on a good day and they register areas. There is a real problem with a lack More importantly, when looking at their request, is that acceptable given of doctors in the bush, and that is not somebody on the autism spectrum who that the following day, maybe even the something that we should encourage. can make that judgement that somebody following hour, they might be in a situation I think the amendments that have been on the autism spectrum is in a position to where they do not know which way is up? moved by Mr Morris would strengthen the make an informed decision on their own ______legislation significantly, and I commend future? Could the minister enlighten me, him for bringing these amendments to and please do not go with the spaghetti Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — the house. I believe, as I have said before, nation thing because that not only did not that this bill is a bit of a mishmash. It is enlighten me but it concerned me very, Could you foresee a situation where a son, for example, would see his mother and not real flash, but these amendments do very much and distressed me very, very strengthen this particular clause, and for much? In fact I did lose sleep that night, know that she is in the situation where she has good days and she has bad days and that reason I believe we should all support which was not good because I did not get Mr Morris’s amendments on this occasion. much the following night either. I think on a good day that son takes mum along it is important. There are a lot of people to the doctor knowing full well that if she who have asked me about it, and I ask requires or requests euthanasia on that ______the minister to put it in words that we can day, he is likely to agree to that, but on understand so that people are aware of another day of course he would not in a Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — The exactly where the line is drawn and who million years, given that not everybody has question of training concerns me greatly has the capacity to draw that line. their own doctor? There are a lot of people because it seems to me that we are going around — in fact I would say almost the ______to have a situation here where if a doctor majority of people these days — who go knows how to kill somebody properly, to the bulk-bill doctor. They get whichever Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — he or she is going to have to be trained doctor they get; they do not have their in order to do that. Is assisted killing Minister, given that even the most expert own doctor. They do not know the doctor of professionals would not go so far as to now going to be a part of the training they see, and the doctor does not know program of doctors in our universities, say they could say what is going on in the them. All they know is the person who is

IN 42 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE in our medical schools, in Victoria if this the person who is being coerced, or is the legislation goes through? Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I person who is being coerced just fobbed ______commend Mr Davis for bringing this off to the next one until they find a doctor amendment to the house. This amendment who will assist them to partake of death? Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — is a real test of the government. We have ______Minister, what protection would be offered heard a great deal from the minister over to medical practitioners and particularly the last week or so — probably a few weeks Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — to medical students who find killing a now — about how flexible he is about Minister, we have heard the expression human being abhorrent and refuse to take amendments and how willing he is to ‘Hope springs eternal’, and from listening the training that you are proposing they do accept amendments and suggestions for to you tonight it seems that is the case. You take to involve themselves in this particular improvement. It is just a marvellous thing. are hoping for a whole range of scenarios regime that this bill puts in place? What We have almost been in utopia listening to to come about, but it seems to me that that protection are they offered that they will him about how open he is to suggestions hope is not exactly turning into action. My not be discriminated against, persecuted and to amendments. concern is that a son, a daughter or even and indeed effectively banned from the Ms Crozier interjected. a grandchild might take Mum or Dad or medical profession? Mr FINN — He’s the fixer. No, that’s Nanna to the doctor, having convinced another bloke, a South Australian. The ______Mum or Dad or Nanna that indeed they real intent of the government will be are a burden on the family, with the hope decided here because here we have an of getting hold of their $3 million home in Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — amendment moved by Mr Davis which the not-too-distant future; and of course Minister, I will give you an example of is very clearly aimed at improving this Mum or Dad or Nanna go to the doctor, something that is not entirely out of the legislation. My personal view is that there the doctor assesses Mum or Dad or Nanna question at all. We have somebody who is is no amendment that will make this and comes to the view that they are being a very enthusiastic supporter of euthanasia legislation worthy of being passed. But coerced. That is where hope kicks in, I who is appointed head of a medical school. this amendment will actually improve understand, but what I am really looking That individual — he or she — makes it this legislation. The government has for is some mandate whereby a doctor very clear that unless every student is an opportunity. By supporting this will be forced to take action — a bit like prepared to take on being involved in this amendment the government has an mandatory reporting, if you will — to regime, then there is no place for them opportunity to send a message to the ensure that the interests of that person in that medical school or indeed at the community about elder abuse. are protected from the son, the daughter, university. What protection is there for What we are going to see in a very short the grandchildren or whoever is doing students who are conscientious objectors period of time is whether the government the coercing, so that when the process is in that situation? Do they have to either will take that opportunity or not. I do not terminated with this particular doctor they go elsewhere or drop out of medicine know why they would not. It would make are not taken from one clinic to another in altogether? no sense to me that they would ignore the hope of getting this process kicked off ______that opportunity or that they would walk again. away from that opportunity. This is a very I am very hopeful that we might actually real opportunity for the government to see some action in the legislation — maybe Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — send a message about elder abuse — and I will ask one more question, for the a late amendment. I will not put it up, particularly in connection with this bill, because I know that if I put it up, you will moment anyway, and that is whilst I am which I would suggest is a key risk factor sure that those students and potential not accept it. But if you were to put it up, for elder abuse from this point on, or then we would accept it because we have students are absolutely delighted to hear certainly from 19 June 2019 onwards. of your concern, what they really need is the best interests of Victorians at heart. your protection. What protection are you My humble suggestion to the minister That is something I sincerely hope the offering those conscientious objectors would be that he take on board the minister will take very seriously, because who may well be excluded from medical amendment moved by Mr Davis and that if you have old, frail and vulnerable people school or university on the basis of their he join with I think every member of the who are being coerced and the doctor conscientious objection? house in condemning elder abuse and realises that they are being coerced but improving this legislation, particularly with does not actually act upon that, then I The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr Elasmar) regard to fighting what is an evil blight on think we have got a bigger problem than — The minister has answered this question our society — one that we see every day we might otherwise have had. So I ask the a couple of times. and one that I have seen in my own family. minister to give that consideration and Mr FINN — I do not think he has When you see it in your own family you maybe give some undertaking that he answered it. realise that it can happen anywhere. It is will come back to the committee with an The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr Elasmar) something that we should all condemn, amendment to that end. — I will give the call to the minister if he and I hope that the minister will join with ______would like to add to it or we will move on. us in supporting Mr Davis’s motion in ______order to send that very, very important message to the community. Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Yes, they are indeed liable under clause 85 to Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I ______be charged, found guilty and convicted, just have one question for the minister but there is no obligation on the doctor to on amendment 8. This ‘encouragement’ Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) ensure that that comes about. That is what that the amendment refers to, why is it not — Minister, if the medical practitioner I am asking about. I am not asking about mandated? If you have a registered doctor assesses the person who is fronting what happens to the son, the daughter who is not your normal doctor, why would the doctor for the first time for the or the grandchildren; I am asking about it not be mandated that the doctor you first assessment and at the end of that the role of the doctor in ensuring that the are seeing to be assisted to die contact the assessment that doctor comes to the view person who is being coerced is properly family doctor? that the person who is in front of him or protected. That is the point that I am her is in fact being coerced — now, we making — the role of the doctor — because know that all the process stops; it is very the doctor is the one who has made the ______clear in subclause (2)(a) that the process assessment that this person is being stops — what happens in terms of a holistic coerced. As things stand at the moment, Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — If approach to the welfare of the person who that doctor is perfectly within their rights the matter is mandated in the schedule, is being coerced? It is all very well for the to send Nanna, Mum or Dad or whoever why would it not be mandated in the law? doctor to say, ‘Well, I’m not going to help on their way and Nanna will pop up at the ______you with what you apparently want’, and next doctor’s surgery in the hope of getting that is all over, but we all know that that hold of a locked box full of poison at some person could well go to the next doctor, stage. What I am really asking for is some Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — who will not perhaps be as conscientious — and I think a lot of doctors would act Would the minister be kind enough to give as the first doctor. Is there anything in on this — mandated action by the doctor, me a definition of ‘choice in drafting’? the legislation which suggests or indeed, as I said before, like mandatory reporting, ______as this legislation is so fond of saying, to ensure that the people who are being encourages the first doctor to actually help coerced are properly protected.

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 43 ______and perhaps even on the other side of the difference. Why did it mean that last week house, say that this legislation just does and this week we can get away with those Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — not stack up. This is really, really sloppy. sorts of errors? It just makes no sense to What happens if the doctor does not We are talking about people living and me at all and, as I say, it is indicative of the actually report it? The doctor, as you say — dying and coercion and a whole range of sloppiness of this legislation. I really think, and I accept what you say — has to report things. We are talking about ‘appears to be’ Minister, that if you want to have legislation this coercion to the medical board. What and all that sort of stuff. You would never that you can go out there and sell and be if the doctor does not? Is there any penalty get away with it anywhere else. I do not proud of, you really need to get it right. for the doctor if he or she does not actually see why you would get away with it in the Clearly the fact that we have a clause 42 in report that coercion? Parliament of Victoria. I certainly find it the bill means that you have not got it right. totally unacceptable, and my very strong ______suggestion, and I say this in a heartfelt way in an attempt to assist the minister, is to Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — take this back to the drafter and ask them Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Minister, on clause 21(2), within seven to fix it. Minister, I am still very concerned about days after completing the first assessment this clause 42. Could you list the sorts of — and I do hope this question has not ______errors that is referring to, please? been asked; I am very, very hopeful ______this question has not been asked — the Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Minister, there is a game that I am coordinating medical practitioner must Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — complete the first assessment report form particularly fond of that is very much open to interpretation, as indeed this clause is Minister, I refer to the voluntary assisted and give a copy of that form to the board. dying substance, and I must commend Why? very much open to interpretation, but we are not talking about free kicks or 50-metre whomever came up with that name. I ______penalties or the odd goal that might go the would like to meet them one day because wrong way on this occasion. We are talking I think they have got a great future in Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I about people’s lives. Now, in my view, if ‘Euphemisms R Us’ or some such place. have one question, and it concerns the you are talking about people’s lives, you Once the person is on death row, if you can inability in the case of somebody who have got to have a bit more certainty than call it that, they have been approved for the is not able to speak but is still able to ‘appeared to’. There is no room for the sort last time and they have the poison but they communicate in some way and has of subjectivity that you seem to think is fine change their mind, what happens then? indicated that they would like a declaration and dandy. I do not accept that. Do they return the poison to the pharmacy made on their behalf. How would that or do they just put it in the back room and I think when you are talking about leave it there for future reference? happen? How would that be brought people making decisions as to whether about? What process would be used, and they actually stay alive and when you are ______would it be possible for somebody with talking about people making decisions as perhaps a vested interest to put words to whether people are being coerced into Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — into a person’s mouth and then sign the an early demise, these are issues where This clause should perhaps be called the declaration on their behalf? we need certainty. My view is that there is George Orwell clause, because we have a ______no room for a great deal of interpretation. situation where suicide cannot be referred There is no room for a great deal of to as suicide, poison cannot be referred Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Just subjectivity. We need to make a straight- to as poison, and we are talking about to be absolutely sure, Minister, it would up-and-down decision. We need certainty. governments issuing permits for people have to be a professional person who We need to strengthen this, and I really either to kill themselves or to be killed. So is responsible for the communication believe that the minister needs to take this it is quite an extraordinary and amazing facilitation, as I think you described it; it back from whence the legislation came day in the history of this Parliament would not be able to be a family member and ask the draftspeople to fix it, please. and the history of this state that we are who claims to be able to facilitate that Can the minister see the concerns that discussing matters such as this, and this communication themselves. Mrs Peulich and I have with regard to this may be — no, it most certainly is — a new clause and if he can see what the problem low for our civilisation. ______is, is he prepared to take it on and get it Mr Dalidakis — I think you’ve given that fixed? speech before as well. Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Minister, I really want to help here. I have ______Mr FINN — Well, you are, generally heard what Mrs Peulich has said — speaking, a new low for our civilisation every day, Mr Dalidakis. Mr Jennings interjected. Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Minister, clause 42 states: Minister, it seems to me that one Mr FINN — I am trying to be of genuine group that is involved in this process assistance here, because I too, before The validity of the request and assessment process is not affected by any minor or that has been ignored to a degree is the Mrs Peulich got up, had a look and on technical error in a final review form or a pharmacists. I know that the role of the six occasions the words ‘appeared to’ are form referred to in section 41(1)(a). pharmacist was discussed in clause 13 in clause 36. We did raise earlier this day It seems to me that we have a trend. or somewhere around there. I know that the issue of subjectivity, and it seems to was discussed, but I have some comments me that clause 36 is absolutely riddled We have a trend of sloppiness, we have a trend of accepting subjectivity and, in this here from the Victorian branch of the with subjectivity. As we are talking about Pharmaceutical Society of Australia that I a document which decides who lives and particular situation, we have a trend of accepting errors. To my way of thinking, think are worth pointing out, not in terms who dies and whether somebody actually of conscientious objection but just in terms stays with us or goes to wherever they given the importance of this subject, that is just not good enough. We have to get of the ability to make this thing work. The might end up going, it seems to me that society says: subjectivity is something that we really this right. I do not know how many times I should try to avoid. We really need to have have got to say that we have got to get this The legislation and the final report some certainty in this particular clause. right. It is not good enough to say, ‘We’re spend a lot of time focusing on acquiring close enough’. It is not good enough. We approval to access voluntary assisted My suggestion to the minister would be to dying, but it does not have a lot of depth take this clause back to the draftsman, or have to get this right. For us to accept the sloppiness that is inherent in clause 42 is on the issues of dispensing or acquiring draftswoman; I am not sure whether it is the substance that will be used by still the same. something that should horrify all of us. the individual. In the final report, it is I think it is quite extraordinary that in a Mr Jennings — Woman. suggested that a pharmacist will know piece of legislation this important we have that the prescription before them is for An honourable member — Draftsperson. a clause which basically says any technical a VAD supply, simply by the nature and Mr FINN — Draftsperson or non- errors or typos or anything like that — I dose of the item ordered. gender-specific drafter — or take it back assume that is what we are talking about — This is a critical misunderstanding of to whoever wrote the thing — and say, do not impact anything at all. the role of a pharmacist in dispensing ‘We really need to do a bit better than this’. We heard last week, when we debated medication. It is hard to comprehend This unfortunately is the sort of stuff that this at length, that a comma or a full stop how a document can so effectively create makes people on this side of the house, in the wrong place can mean a world of a structured process of ensuring safe

IN 44 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE prescribing of a substance but then expect Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Mr FINN — I will ring the TAB and see if that the dispensing of this substance can Over the page on page 40 subclause 46(c) we can get some money on it. We will see be adequately performed in a manner (v) states: how we go. that requires the pharmacist to make the person is administered the voluntary Mr Jennings — It was somewhere assumptions — guesswork should never assisted dying substance — around 10. be a part of any health intervention, and I love that term — Mr FINN — I will have a look. it is particularly inappropriate in the immediately after making the Nonetheless, whatever time it was, I find delivery of voluntary assisted dying, or in this a particularly important issue, because a jurisdiction where VAD is available to be administration request. Why the hurry? Why must that be done I do not want and I would think it appalling prescribed. to have a situation where medical students The coordinating medical practitioner immediately after the administration request has been made? and potential doctors who have genuine and the consulting medical practitioners conscientious objections to euthanasia — are both required to submit several ______and I imagine that there are a significant forms and pieces of information to the number of doctors and medical students VAD board, yet none of these forms are Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — who do have such conscientious objections required to be provided to the dispensing Minister, thank you for that, but it does — were locked out of the universities pharmacist. seem to me to be undue haste. Do you and medical colleges on the basis of that It finishes off by saying: accept that the wording of 46(c)(v) is conscientious objection. What protection To satisfy the intent of the legislation, unfortunate in that it is almost as if the is there for those, particularly medical and the requirements of a pharmacist patient must be given the poison before he students, who do have such conscientious when performing their clinical role, the or she changes their mind? That is the way objections and who do not wish to pharmacist should be provided with I think a lot of people would read it. Do you participate in such training? all of the documents generated by the see that the wording of that is particularly Ms Shing interjected. assessment process, and the pharmacist unfortunate? should provide a third and final ______assessment of the appropriateness of the ______individual to access the VAD service. Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Minister, do you believe the government Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Minister, where in the bill is the sort of has taken appropriate notice of Minister, once the medical practitioner has protection that you are alluding to offered? pharmacists and the pharmaceutical administered the poison, what is the role of It does not seem on my reading to be there, industry or, as I suspect, have you largely that medical practitioner at that point? but you may well be — hopefully you are ignored them? ______— on top of this bill to a greater degree ______than me. You might be able to tell me Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — where those freedoms are protected in this Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) Would part of those responsibilities be to legislation. — Minister, do you accept, given the ensure that the patient dies immediately? ______pharmacists are actually at the coalface, We have heard many horrific stories of as it were, and they actually hand over the patients who have lasted for hours and Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — poison to the victim or the patient — I am sometimes days. I think the worst one Minister, when do you anticipate the not sure what you would call them — that I have heard about was four-and-a-bit training, as outlined in this clause, will if they feel that they have a contribution days — a man who died in agony as a begin? to make to this process they should be result of the administration of such a listened to? Do you believe that they do poison overseas, and this I understand is have a contribution to make apart from not a particularly unusual circumstance Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — merely handing over the poison that has overseas. If the patient does not die How far out from 2019? been prescribed, or do you believe that immediately, will the medical practitioner they should just do as they are told and just be given a second go to finish that patient Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — get on with it? off properly? Minister, when do you anticipate the ______government — or whoever is responsible for the particular poison substance in the locked box — will tell us what is in Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) Minister, there are mentions here of a the locked box? Because it would be very — Minister, how would the medical difficult, I would assume, to train any witness who would witness the signing practitioner do that if indeed he had used of the documents and also witness the medical professional with regard to this all the poison in the first attempt to kill the matter without actually knowing what administering of the voluntary assisted patient? dying substance, the poison. Are there any poison they were dealing with. restrictions on who that witness would ______be? And in terms of family members Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — or beneficiaries from wills, is there any Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Minister, do you anticipate that the poison specific exclusion of anybody from that Minister, earlier this morning — I am not substance that will be used in this process position of being a witness? exactly sure when it was, but it was much will be named in time to allow this training earlier this morning — that you are outlining in this clause to Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Mr Jennings — Tell me what it is and I’ll occur before June 2019, when this law Minister, where in the legislation does tell you what time it was. commences? it stipulate that the witness must be a Mr FINN — On the question of training, ______medical practitioner? I asked you about whether teaching medical students not just how to cure but Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — how to kill as well would permeate the Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Are Minister, you mentioned before that any medical schools and what the reaction protection for student doctors with regard there any restrictions on who that witness would be to a student who, on grounds of can be? to conscientious objection would be a conscientious objection, refused to partake commonwealth matter. Indeed education in such training. It seems to me that that is in regard to universities and so forth is a Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — So a particularly — commonwealth matter. Have you had any they could very easily be beneficiaries of Mr Jennings — That would have discussions at all with the commonwealth the patient’s will? occurred — I reckon you could check government to ascertain its view on Hansard — between 10 and 11 o’clock last providing the sort of training in medical Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — night. colleges and in universities that you are You do not see that as being a conflict of Mr FINN — You reckon it was last night? proposing in this clause? interest? Mr Jennings — I am absolutely confident ______that it was. Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — Minister, clause 115(1) states:

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 45 The Minister must cause a review of the can say with total certainty that he is wrong have seen in this state for a very long time. operation of this Act to be conducted. — indeed weak and cowardly — to use the What we have seen is a lot of families lose I do not anticipate that the minister autism spectrum as some sort of shield. their homes; we have seen a lot of families would be aware of a name, because we After Don Burke apologises he might lose their incomes; we have seen a lot of are looking at six years down the track if like to do a little study and discover for families lose their superannuation; and indeed this legislation is passed and of himself how out of line he is, and if he sadly, as was referred to by Mr Ondarchie, course the current government will not cares, try to imagine the hurt and pain he we have seen a number of them lose be there at that time. I am just wondering has caused to so many. Don Burke stands members of their families who in fact what sort of individual do you envisage will condemned as someone who has misused have committed suicide, and that is most be appointed to conduct such a review? a community that does not deserve this certainly the most distressing and most ______derision. I was stunned when I heard him tragic element of this tragedy in three parts. blame Asperger’s, and I was not alone. I do It is just unbelievable that a government not care what was going through his head could do this to a group of people in the Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) when he said it; what I want to hear now is community, with such dreadful impact. — I have enormous difficulty with the him saying clearly, ‘I’m sorry’. I have just had handed to me some proposal that Mr Jennings has put forward, amendments which are to be moved unfortunately. I was hoping that he would COUNCIL | Constituency questions by Mr Davis. I understand they are now in fact rectify the situation that we have ready to be circulated, so I ask that they had up to this point where the Premier 28 November 2017 be circulated on behalf of Mr Davis at this in the other place has not just been point. supportive of falsifying death certificates but where, in the case of those insurance Opposition amendments circulated for companies that do not pay out on suicide, Sunbury third Mr DAVIS (Southern Metropolitan) by Mr it could be foreseeably argued that the Finn pursuant to standing orders. Premier and the government may well railway crossing Mr FINN — I would like to take this have been facilitating fraud because a Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My opportunity to offer my condolences to death certificate saying that somebody constituency question is to the Minister those who have lost family members as a has died of cancer or somebody has died for Public Transport. As I am hoping the result of the changes in the taxi industry — of motor neurone disease or whatever minister is aware, Sunbury is a rapidly those who either lost their lives via suicide it is when in fact they died from a lethal growing community that is about to or indeed had heart attacks or other overdose of some poison is obviously experience a major population explosion. health problems that cost them their lives. telling the insurance companies something A third railway crossing in the town has I cannot help but think just how tragic it that is incorrect, that is wrong. If they been on the agenda for many years and was, because it was so unnecessary. pay out on that, that is fraud. To have the locals are now expecting action. Cassandra As chairman of the Economy and government of this state involved in that Marr, the next member for Sunbury in the Infrastructure Committee, I and other sort of thing I just find astonishing. other place, informs me that the Sunbury members sat and we listened and we As I mentioned — I think it was earlier community is losing its patience. The two gathered. This was a committee with this morning — this is the George Orwell railway crossings currently servicing the members across the parties, from all legislation because there are a whole town are just not enough. I ask: will the sides of the house — we had Liberals, we range of things that we cannot mention. minister review the plans for Sunbury’s had Labor, we had the Greens, we had The poison is the ‘substance’, the suicide third railway crossing and put it firmly on the Shooters, Fishers and Farmers Party. is the ‘VAD’ and now the cause of death her list for action? We had people from across the political has been hidden and obscured as well. spectrum. I have to say, going back to I unfortunately cannot support Mr that time a few months ago, that I did COUNCIL | Second reading not think we would have a hope in hell Jennings’s amendment. I was really, really 28 November 2017 hoping when I heard about it originally of actually agreeing on anything. But we that he would put forward an amendment did. We actually put aside our partisan that would rectify the wrong this legislation political views and we put forward proposes to put in place. Sadly that is not recommendations which would have the case, so unfortunately I will have to Commercial benefited not just the operators and the oppose the amendment. owners but indeed the entire state. Passenger Unfortunately the Minister for Public Transport and the Premier just wiped COUNCIL | Members statements Vehicle Industry those recommendations, totally ignored 28 November 2017 those recommendations. It just goes to Amendment show what an arrogant Premier we have in this state, and I have to say also a bullying Premier, because he was going to get his Don Burke (Further Reforms) way come what may. He did not care and Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I still does not care what happens to the do not know Don Burke. Given everything Bill 2017 Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) operators. He does not care what happens I have heard about him this week, I am to the owners. I mean, he could show probably glad I do not know Don Burke. — I rise to speak this afternoon on the Commercial Passenger Vehicle Industry just a little bit of sympathy for those who By his own admission he is a particularly are suffering. He could show a little bit of unpleasant individual. I also do not know Amendment (Further Reforms) Bill 2017. It is a great pity that I actually have empathy with those who are suffering. But, if all or any of the allegations against this no, not Daniel Andrews, because Daniel man are true or false. What I do know is to speak on this particular bill because the fact that this bill is before the house Andrews, like he does on everything else, is that to use Asperger’s syndrome as an bullying his way through. He does not care excuse for this deplorable behaviour is in today is a sure and complete indication that the government has stuffed this up. about people who have lost their homes. itself despicable. He does not care about people who have Mr Burke may have amazing abilities We would not need this bill today if the government had actually got it right. They lost their livelihoods. He does not care of self-diagnosis, but his knowledge of about people who have worked all their Asperger’s leaves an enormous amount spent two and a half years working this through, thinking about it, sitting there, lives only to have their superannuation to be desired. Having Asperger’s does not ripped from under them, so people in make anyone a filthy, perverted sleazebag. cogitating and contemplating their navels about this particular matter, and then they their 70s and in their 80s are now living It does not lead to sexual assault. It does in poverty. He does not care about that. not lead to the sort of activity Mr Burke got the legislation to the Parliament and they realised — well, I do not think they And he does not care about the people stands accused of. Mr Burke owes the who have lost their lives. He does not care Asperger’s community of Australia a realised, but everybody else realised — that they had got it so terribly, terribly wrong. about the families who have lost members huge apology. They have enough to deal through either taking their own lives or with without having to put up with a feral I have to say that I think what has happened to the taxi industry and the health problems. It amazes me. desperado getting on national television I cannot help but think in this particular and slandering them. I am in no position to families who have owned and operated taxis in this state over a long period of situation of my grandfather, who was a judge Mr Burke’s guilt or otherwise of the Labor man to the back teeth, a staunch tsunami of allegations swamping him, but I time is one of the great tragedies that we

IN 46 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE Labor man. I got him to vote Liberal once, attitudes to one side and worked for what does in the western suburbs of Melbourne. and that was in 1992. That was the year was best for the community. A lot of people I have spoken of him and the work that he that I was elected. Even though he was in society, not just in Australia but across does on a semiregular basis, I suppose, not in my electorate, he said he would the Western world, look at politicians now in here for some years. But I have not vote Liberal. He said, ‘If my grandson’s with disdain and with distrust. I think if spoken at any length at all on the work going to be one, I suppose I’d better vote we saw more of what the Economy and that his foundation, the Les Twentyman for the mongrels’. It may have been a bit Infrastructure Committee was able to do Foundation, does. It is doing some stronger than that, but we did get him to on this particular issue, we would all have a extraordinary things not just in the western vote Liberal just that once. In 1996 he went great deal more respect in the community suburbs but beyond as well — certainly in straight back from whence he came, and than we do now. There were no games the western suburbs but well beyond the that is the way he voted until — well, I do being played. It was all about taking into established home ground, as it were. not think he got another chance after that. account the genuine issues and the very The Les Twentyman Foundation is not My grandfather was your typical Labor real concerns that people had. That was just saving kids but also actually turning man, the old-style Labor man. He was a what was driving our decision-making them into community leaders. It is turning butcher, he was a carpenter; he was a bloke process, and that was what gave us, in the them into leaders of communities that who worked with his hands. He was quite end, something that we could all, right quite frankly have been floundering creative, I suppose, in his own way. Indeed across the political spectrum, agree on. due to a lack of leadership. They are he built the house that I grew up in. But It is very, very sad that we had the predominantly young people from quintessentially he was a worker, and back solution — it was not perfect, but it countries that have been ripped apart by when he was a lad that is who the Labor was a damn sight better than what the war who have escaped quite often in fear Party represented: they represented the government has proposed — but Daniel of their lives. What the Les Twentyman workers. He would be horrified at what Andrews and Jacinta Allan just walked Foundation is doing is getting those young the Andrews government has done to this away. They did not want to know about people, turning them into something group of workers. He would be horrified it. I feel for those in the taxi industry, special and showing them what leadership to think that the Andrews government who have suffered and are suffering and skills they have and what leadership skills would destroy an industry in the way that will continue to suffer as a result of that can do for them and their communities. it has. He would be horrified to think that particular decision by a government, as It is in fact empowering young people in a the Labor Party that he supported in every I said, that sat on its hands for two and a way that a lot of these young people have election, except one, for his entire life had half years and then, when it finally made never been empowered in before. They done this to people whose only crime had a decision, decided just to push it through are not just changing individual young been to work hard. That is all they have without thought for anyone — without people’s lives; they are changing whole done all their lives — work hard — and this thought for the people who were being communities as a result of what they are is the way they are treated by the Labor affected the most, whose livelihoods were doing. What they are doing is absolutely Party in 2017. It is a very, very long way being affected and whose families were remarkable, and I have visited them from what he knew as the Labor Party. I am being affected. No consideration was given many times. I have seen, spoken with and not sure what he would call it — in fact it to them at all. met these young people myself, and you might be very colourful what he would call When the history of this government is cannot help but walk away with enormous this modern Labor Party — but it is not a being written — and I think that history admiration not just for them but for those party of workers anymore, no way. There is can start being written in November next who are turning their lives around. no way that the Andrews Labor Party can year — there will be a decidedly black Having discussed this with some be described as the party of the workers, mark on this particular episode. It sticks of the people down there lately, I can not after what they have done to these in my throat to think that we actually had understand why they are concerned. They people. a solution and we could have fixed this if are getting nowhere near the government What they have done to these people only the government had listened and if support that some of the other groups is despicable and disgraceful. The Labor only the government had done the right and charitable organisations are getting. Party has walked away from its history. It thing by the hardworking people of this Quite frankly I think that stinks. Given that has walked away from what it has always state whose only crime, if you can call it the Les Twentyman Foundation is doing stood for. This Labor Party is a Labor Party a crime, was actually to work hard, save, such a remarkable job, I think it is only of the people, of the workers, no more. look after their families and pay taxes — to fair and decent that they get a fair slice of You just have to go and talk to some of do the sorts of things that everybody who government funding. So I ask the minister the people about the place — people is normally considered a model citizen to take that on board and to provide some that I have spoken to and people that would be doing. But on this occasion they sizeable funding to the Les Twentyman Mr Ondarchie, I am sure, knows in his have been punished abysmally, savagely, Foundation. electorate. These people have voted Labor viciously and cruelly by the government all their lives. and by a Premier who just wants to bully COUNCIL | Constituency questions his way through. Mr Ondarchie interjected. 30 November 2017 Mr FINN — And they are being bullied; I have to say I do not understand the my word they are being bullied. But they mindset that does that to people. I do have voted Labor all their lives, and they not understand what can lead somebody are being treated abysmally. They are to be almost bloodthirsty in the way the West Gate tunnel being treated like second-class or third- Premier is with regard to so many things. class citizens. And why? Because Daniel To savage an entire industry in the way EES anger Andrews must get his own way at all costs. that he has on this occasion is to my way of Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My I think it is a tragedy, as I said before. If thinking totally shameful. If ever there was constituency question is to the Minister for only the government had listened to the an example of the Premier dividing and Planning. The minister’s signing off on the Economy and Infrastructure Committee. conquering — we know just how much he environment effects statement (EES) on I see Mr Leane over there; he was on loves to do that — it is with this industry the West Gate tunnel project this week has the committee, and I commend him for and this legislation. As I said, I offer my caused outrage among residents groups the work that he did to find an equitable sympathy to those in the taxi community, and local government in the western solution to this problem. Mr Eideh was on and I wish them all well for the future. suburbs. Many residents are angered and that committee, and I commend him on believe that they have not been listened the work that he did to find an equitable COUNCIL | Adjournment to, with the view being expressed that the solution. Mr Ondarchie was on the 28 November 2017 EES on this project had a predetermined committee — outcome. Locals believe the die was An honourable member — Mr Morris. cast well before the process began. They Mr FINN — Was Mr Morris on that are concerned they are victims of a committee then? He might have done a Les Twentyman government hell-bent on bullying them runner by that stage. on this matter. What will the minister do to An honourable member interjected. Foundation ensure the views of locals in Melbourne’s Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My west are listened to and actually heard on Mr FINN — He was there for a little this issue? while. I commend those fellow members adjournment matter is for the Minister of the committee that I chaired because, as for Youth Affairs. We are all aware of the I said before, we put our partisan political wonderful work that Sir Les Twentyman

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 47 COUNCIL | Adjournment Christmas. Matthew Guy has continued COUNCIL | Second reading 30 November 2017 to stand up for victims at a time when 12 December 2017 many of them have just about given up on the system. The date 30 September 2017 will be forever celebrated as the day the West Gate tunnel Richmond Football Club broke its longest Crimes Legislation ever premiership drought — an early project Christmas present for all of us. Amendment Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I On the other side of the ledger, battlers wish to raise a matter for the attention of across the state have been forced to suffer the Minister for Planning, and it concerns spiralling power prices by a government (Protection of his recent ticking off of the environment driven by hard-left ideology. It is insanity effects statement (EES) for the West Gate for Victoria to be forced into an energy Emergency Workers tunnel project. crisis. Even the Parliament suffered from Mr Ondarchie interjected. the bullying of the Andrews government. and Others) Bill Mr FINN — Don’t get me started, Mr The forms of this house were abused in Ondarchie, on consultation. Labor’s an unprecedented and brutal way by a 2017 Labor government that did not want a Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — definition of consultation is ‘Shut up and Thank you, acting Deputy President. We do as you’re told’. That is Labor’s definition proper examination of the most important legislation considered by this Parliament are going through that again, are we? of consultation. But what concerns me Acting Deputy President, thank you very as much as the fact that this project is for some years. It was perhaps topped by today’s announcement by the Premier much — give him the title and pay him, for a stinker is that local people have been God’s sake. That is what I say. treated in an appalling manner. I have that he has signed the contract to build the been contacted by a number of people in West Gate tunnel. This bullying Premier I rise to speak on the Crimes Legislation the last few days who are absolutely furious has not just shown his middle digit to Amendment (Protection of Emergency that they have been treated in the way that locals who oppose this project but he has Workers and Others) Bill 2017. Whilst this they have been. They believe that they have rushed headlong into spending God knows bill does go some way toward alleviating not been listened to. They believe that the how many billions on a road that will have the concerns that many of us have with whole thing was a farce. They believe the only one beneficiary — that is, Transurban. regard to the protection of police and whole thing was a set-up. So sniffy is the relationship between the emergency services workers, it is clearly government and Transurban that no-one not everything that we would desire. Mr Ondarchie interjected. should be surprised if it is one day proved You have got to ask: if the government Mr FINN — And indeed, as Mr by IBAC. is so serious about protecting police Ondarchie says, it was a sham. They I will finish on a positive note: this in this state, why it did not support Mr believe that in fact the EES process was is Daniel Andrews’s last Christmas O’Donohue’s bill back in June, and — cooked. It was decided before the process as Premier. This time next year his Mr Gepp — Because it was deficient. actually began. This is a process that has government will be a steaming wreck completely ignored the needs of locals in Mr FINN — It was not deficient, Mr and Premier Matthew Guy will be leading Gepp. It was not. What is deficient is Hobsons Bay, Brooklyn and Altona and Victoria onward. around areas such as those, and it is going the government. What is deficient is to hurt them big time. They want a say, and the Minister for Police. That is what is you can understand that. This is something COUNCIL | Constituency questions deficient, and that is very sad. that is going to affect them, their families, 12 December 2017 Mr Morris interjected. their homes and their way of life, and they Mr FINN — As Mr Morris just pointed want to have a say. That is only fair and out, some four and a half months ago — reasonable. They thought they were going Mr Morris — One hundred and twenty- to have a say. Clearly the minister had Sunbury Road six days. other ideas, and unfortunately he has gone Mr FINN — One hundred and twenty- down the path of so many other ministers congestion six days, was it? I will go with four and in this government of bullying and just Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My a half months anyway. Some four and a stampeding over the rights of ordinary folk. constituency question is to the Minister half months ago the Minister for Police Mr Ondarchie interjected. for Roads and Road Safety. The north-west said this matter would be coming to the Mr FINN — The youth justice centre is of Melbourne has a traffic hotspot that house soon. Well, here we are in the last another classic example. But we are seeing the minister may not be aware of, and sitting week before Christmas and they are in this particular instance something I am strongly of the view that it is time trying to cram it in before we all head off that is going to hurt a huge number of he was. Every morning the roundabout to see Santa. What a pathetic government! people in the inner western suburbs of at the intersection of Sunbury Road What a pathetic government that we have. Melbourne. What I am asking the minister and Oaklands Road gives motorists a Sadly it just reflects the attitude that this to do is to reopen the EES process. I know wonderful opportunity to view planes government has towards law and order that that is perhaps a little unusual, but landing at Tullamarine airport. However, and indeed any form of authority, because given the unusual nature of the way this is for those wanting to get to work, all it you have got to realise that the people being conducted, I believe it is a fair and provides is frustration. A steady stream of who are in our government are controlled reasonable thing. I think the people of the traffic down both roads leads to gridlock by the same people who are down on the western suburbs, and the inner west in at the intersection and down Sunbury wharves at the moment beating up on the particular in this instance, have a right to Road right up to the Tullamarine Freeway. police and beating up on anybody else be heard. I ask the minister to reopen that It is bad now and will only grow worse who wanders past who might disagree with process so that their voice can be heard with explosive population growth in the them. They are the ones who control this and the government can actually listen to immediate area very soon. What plans government, so it is not surprising that the them. does the minister have to solve congestion government has no respect for law and at this intersection and along Sunbury order and has no respect for the rule of Road? COUNCIL | Members statements law, and that is something that comes to us time and time and time again. 12 December 2017 Quite frankly, it is time. It is well and truly time. I will use that term, and I know that members opposite will appreciate it. It 2017 is time the Labor Party got its act together Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — As in this regard. It is time the Labor Party 2017 draws to a close it is worth pondering showed some respect for law and order the events of a most exhausting year, both and indeed showed some respect for our good and bad. On the plus side it was an police. honour to again meet so many families One thing that we have to point out in with autism and share their trials and their this debate is that an assault on a police triumphs. I wish them all a very merry officer is an assault on us all. It is an assault on every single one of us. It is something

IN 48 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE that we cannot tolerate. Unfortunately Mr FINN — Were you listening? It wasn’t This bill is an important bill. It does in this so-called tolerant society that we bad, was it? On that occasion I had the not go as far as I would like, but it is an live in we seem to tolerate all the wrong opportunity to interview Wayne Gatt, the important bill, and as an important bill you things, and unfortunately assaulting police secretary of the police association, and he would have to ask one question: why does officers and showing disrespect for police expressed his view as to what should be it commence on 31 October 2018? That is officers are things that we do tolerate far happening with regard to the resources 11 months away. The minister was saying too easily. I see on television from time that he believes police officers on the beat four and a half months ago that she was to time police being spat on and having should receive. I was very happy to support going to bring this bill to the Parliament objects thrown at them at demonstrations him on that occasion and expressed a imminently. Here we are, four and a half by unions and indeed by ferals from the view — months later, and we have finally got there, extreme left and so forth, and the police An honourable member interjected. and now she is adding another 11 months are expected to put up with that. I do not Mr FINN — I did say that. I said the to the period before the bill will actually believe that they should have to put up police association is one of the very commence. Why would the government with that. I think if you show that degree of few unions that is actually worthwhile. and why would the minister not be disrespect for a police officer, if you spit at Do you know why? It is because the providing the sort of support that this bill a police officer, if you throw an object at a police association actually looks after its provides on a much faster scale? police officer, you should be in the back of members. It does not play politics; it is not We have seen in recent times that the divvy van. That is where you should be. busy worrying about preselections and when the government wants to the And you should be before the courts, you who is going to go into which seat and all government can get anything through should be charged and indeed you should that sort of thing. Parliament — sitting night and day, sitting be jailed. That is my starting point. If we do Mr O’Sullivan interjected. 24 hours a day if they want to. They can not have a system that respects those who Mr FINN — What the police association get anything through. They can bully their are protecting us, then the system is not way through, and we have seen them going to work. It is as simple as that. is concerned about is, as Mr O’Sullivan says, actually doing its job — looking after do that. If they have done that on other Unfortunately we have a government in the members. If only we had a trade union pieces of legislation, what message does this state that is soft on crime. It is soft on movement across the board that was doing it give Victoria Police and the Victorian crime and it shows that every day with its that — that was looking after its members community when this bill has taken four attitudes. It does not support our police. — instead of doing dirty deals behind the and a half months to get to this point and Well, it does — it is coming up to that time scenes that Bill Shorten was once caught will not actually commence until the end in the cycle when it does support the police out doing and so many others have been of October next year? because there is an election coming. There caught out doing as well. What a pity I think it is very clear what the is an election coming and this is the time Mr Melhem is not in the chamber at the government’s view is of the police in this that the Labor Party discovers the police. moment to tell us about that. state, and I think it is a disgrace, quite It discovers law and order. On this side of frankly. I think it is disgraceful, and I think the house, in the coalition, we talk about To get back to the bill, the police association does a very good job. anybody who has respect for law and order law and order, we talk about police and we and who has respect for police in this talk about victims’ rights 365 days a year. Occasionally of course there will be disagreements, but by and large I think state would never consider supporting a We talk about it constantly. But over on the government that has such little regard for other side, the only time we hear about it it does a sensational job. It is to be commended on the role that it plays in those who protect us on a daily basis. from the Labor Party is when there is an The men and women who are out there election in the air. providing support for its members, support for the rule of law and support for law and every day are people I respect totally and Of course we never hear about it from order in this state. I said it on radio on absolutely. They put their lives on the line. the Greens. Do not worry about that. Law Sunday and I will say it again in this house When they say goodbye to their husbands, and order is something to be overthrown today: it is one of the very few trade unions wives, partners or whatever in the morning as far as the Greens are concerned. that I actually have any time for, and I or in the evening when they go off to work, I think what has happened with this wish we had a few more like it. I wish we they are not sure whether they are going to government is the attitude that it has had a few more unions that actually cared come back. Most of us are pretty sure we presented over the entirety of its three about their members the way the police will come back alive, but they never are. years in office has filtered down to association does. You do not see anybody They are true heroes. some very unfortunate sections of the in the police association going interstate As far as I am concerned my view of community. They are saying to themselves, with a credit card and hopping into bed anybody who shows them disrespect, ‘If we have a government that doesn’t with a roomful of hookers. You do not see anybody who assaults them, anybody respect the police, if we have a government that with the police association, but you do who rams their police cars — as has been that doesn’t respect law and order, if we see it with a good number of other unions. mentioned here today, and as we have have a government that doesn’t respect That seems to be the way they operate, and seen in the media over so many months authority, why should we?’. I thank the Lord that the police association now, the ramming of police cars has I see the hoons that the police are having does not. I can safely say that I am sure become quite an epidemic in this state to face up to almost on a nightly basis. I they would never ever do that. — or anybody who involves themselves see people who are committing heinous As I said, we need to provide the in anything like that is very, very clear: crimes, again almost on a daily basis. They necessary resources to our police; that lock them up. Put them in jail. They have see no reason to respect the police if the is extraordinarily important. But we also forfeited the right to walk among us. They government does not. The government need to provide them with the authority need to be sent a message. The community has to realise that it has a very important to do their job, and unfortunately what needs that message to be reinforced with role, not just in legislating but in dictating this government has failed to do is to every single individual. Whilst I support attitudes and sending messages out to give the police the authority. We have this bill, I really wish it was much, much the community. Unfortunately on this seen instances of that even this year — stronger so that indeed we could lock them occasion it has sent the totally wrong major instances. I do not want to go into up. message out to the community, and that areas that are currently under coronial has been heard and acted upon. investigation or about to be, but we have COUNCIL | Adjournment I have long been a supporter of seen instances around the place over the 12 December 2017 providing both the resources and perhaps last year or two where the police have not more importantly the authority for police acted because they have been unsure as to do their job. It is obvious that police cars, to whether they have the authority to do weapons, handcuffs and all of those sorts what they know they should do. That is Graffiti of things are needed by police; that just something that disturbs me enormously, Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I goes without saying. I support the police, not only for those police officers involved wish to raise a matter this evening for the and I think the Police Association Victoria but for the community, because the attention of the Attorney-General. We all in fact has a very important role to play in community is not being fully protected loathe graffiti I think it would be safe to say. providing support for its members. I do not as it should be by those police who know Sometimes the graffiti is ugly, sometimes know if anybody was listening to 3AW on they should act but have to kneel to the it is obscene, sometimes it is offensive and Sunday morning. politically correct command that we have sometimes it is just sheer mindless, just Mr O’Donohue — I was, actually. seen return to Victoria Police over the last nonsensical. We often see it, particularly couple of years, which is rather sad. those of us who use public transport, on a

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 49 wall or on a sign, and that is bad enough, on me, because I am actually going to inclination that he wants to know what he but it goes to another level when graffiti support this motion. I am going to support is doing. becomes vandalism of an important or the motion moved by Mr Ondarchie Mr Ondarchie interjected. sacred symbol in our community. I was because I have a certain curiosity, and Mr FINN — Mr Ondarchie makes a very shocked over the weekend to be notified this investigation will hopefully satisfy my good point — an exceptionally good point. that the cannons of Williamstown, well sense of curiosity. Mr Dalidakis seems to think that he is in known to every resident in Williamstown My first question is: does Minister the ministry for frequent flyer points. That and I think over many generations, as Dalidakis know anything about seems to be the reason he thinks he is a some would — LaunchVic? That, I think, is a really minister. It is so that he can head out to Ms Lovell interjected. important question, one that we have not Tulla — and he is welcome in my electorate Mr FINN — As Ms Lovell, in fact, would been able to establish in this house at this anytime — and he can get onto the plane be very happy to attest to. These cannons point. As far as we know he does not even and turn left. That is what he likes to do. have been vandalised by, as I say, low- know what LaunchVic is. He has not the More than anything else in the world he life scum, who painted swastikas on first idea what LaunchVic is. For all intents likes to get on a plane and he likes to turn them. These cannons are a reminder of and purposes, that would appear to be the left. The movie, the champagne, the whole Williamstown’s past. They are a reminder situation as it stands at the current time. thing — he reckons it is Christmas. Every also of the role that Williamstown played As chair of the Economy and week with him it is Christmas because he is as a part of Melbourne’s defence in years Infrastructure Committee I would love to always getting into business class. If he can gone by and of defending this country, get Mr Dalidakis before the committee get into first class he will, but I am not sure and they are in fact from Fort Gellibrand. to sit across the table from me and other if they make pyjamas in his size. But if he They are a very important part, in my view, members and I would like to ask him, ‘Do cannot get into — of Australia’s heritage and certainly of you know anything about LaunchVic?’. I An honourable member — You can talk. Williamstown’s heritage, and it is totally would be fascinated to know; I would be Mr FINN — I don’t know — I honestly unacceptable in every way for anybody to fascinated to receive an answer from him don’t know. I am doing all right, thank be defacing these symbols of community and hopefully a more satisfactory answer you very much. I have to say I have never and civic duty, as I see them, particularly than he has been able to give this house travelled first class. I have heard about by painting such an offensive symbol as a to this point because, quite frankly, the these pyjamas, but I have never actually swastika on them. answers he has given to this house to this travelled first class so I cannot actually So I think there must be a way. I am not stage have been pathetic. They have been put my finger on it. That is what this bloke asking for a change in the law, because of absolutely pathetic and have left us in is on about. He thinks the more frequent course that would not be permissible in the significant doubt as to whether he has any flyer points you attain is in some way adjournment debate, but I am asking for idea what is going on in his own portfolio. indicative of your success as a minister. the minister to take into account that the That leads us to the second question That is the way he thinks and that is the sort of activity that I have described tonight that I would like to ask the minister. That way he operates. That, unfortunately for is way above and beyond the normal question is clear: does he know anything at the small business community of this state, levels of graffiti and perhaps vandalism all about his portfolio?. That is something is what they are stuck with, at least until that we have come to expect in certain that again we need to ask because over an November next year, when we will have places. There must be a way that we can extended period of time in this house he some people in charge who do know about emphasise the importance of the symbols, has shown, let us say, less than a firm grasp small business and who do care about whether they be war memorials, whether on the details of his portfolios — it does not small business. they be the cannons I speak of tonight — matter whether it is innovation and it does The small business community can whatever they may be. For these important not matter whether it is small business. Get certainly look forward to 24 November community symbols there must be a way him on small business and he has not got next year when we have a change of that the government can emphasise to the a clue. That is a fact, and it is rather sad to government in this state and we have community their importance. I ask the see. people in charge who know and care about minister to take that on board, to set up a I have an enormous amount of respect the importance of small business to this review and to come up with an answer to for the small business community. state. So that is the second question that I solving the riddle that I have put to him Small business is the engine room of want to ask the minister in that committee this evening. the Australian economy. Without small hearing: does he know anything at all business the nation would be stuffed, and about his portfolio? COUNCIL | Economy and Infrastruc- to have this minister as Minister for Small There is a third question, and I think ture Standing C’tee, 13 Dec 2017 Business is, I think, an insult. I think it is an exceedingly important question, that an insult to every small business person I want to ask him. I want to look him in in this state. It just goes to show how the eye and I want to say, ‘Minister, can serious the Andrews government is about you give a straight answer to anything?’, Reference small business. They have no regard and because I have seen absolutely no Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I they have no time for those people who evidence in this chamber since he has have to say at the very beginning that stick their necks out, open up their own been a minister that he has the time, the I am very tempted to vote against this businesses, work like dogs night and day, inclination or anything else to answer motion. In fact I was asked not so long often seven days a week for 12, 15, 18 questions in a straightforward, frank and ago by the Leader of the Government hours a day. These are people who should honest manner. I would really love to see if indeed I would vote with him on this be respected; these are people we should his reaction in that committee. occasion, and I said that I would keep my hold up high as people to be admired in Mr Ondarchie interjected. the community. These are great Australian options open. The time has come for me Mr FINN — Mr Ondarchie points out to make a decision. I have to explain why heroes; small business people are great Australian heroes. that we might not get a straight answer I am keeping my options open on this. then either, but it is worth a try. I am an Basically the Economy and Infrastructure But what does this government do in eternal optimist, and I hasten to remind Mr Committee is absolutely snowed under terms of putting up a minister? They put up Ondarchie that after 37 years Richmond for work. We are investigating a number Philip Dalidakis. I talk about Mr Dalidakis won the premiership this year and I never of projects which are exceedingly dodgy, as small business minister; I actually lost faith. So if I can stick with Richmond none more dodgy than the West Gate mention small business and Mr Dalidakis for 37 years and they win a flag for me tunnel project. That alone would keep us heads for the door. He is out of here. He is after all those years, I reckon we can get a busy for the next 12 months without taking headed for the door. He may be going to straight answer out of Mr Dalidakis. anything else on. There are more questions look it up, he may be reaching for the Funk surrounding the West Gate tunnel and who & Wagnalls as we speak to look it up and Mr Ondarchie interjected. has done what to whom and how many to see exactly what small business is and Mr FINN — I know it could be. When times than we strictly have time for. When to discover for himself exactly what his job the time comes, Mr Ondarchie, we will get I say I am tempted to vote against this is. That would be, I would suggest to you, a you before the committee and I know we motion, I do that through a sense of — very significant advance on anything that will get a straight answer out of you. I know Mr Jennings — Deja vu? he has put forward to this point, because that, and that is something I am looking forward to, I have to say. It will be good to Mr FINN — No, not deja vu — through a he has shown no indication that he knows what he is doing and he has shown no deal with you as the appropriate minister. sense of perhaps necessity. But if curiosity But I want to get this Philip Dalidakis chap killed the cat, it may have the same impact

IN 50 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE before the committee and just ask him be fascinating. I think Mr Leane, Mr Gepp COUNCIL | Second reading straight out if he is capable of answering and Mr Elasmar would enjoy dealing with 14 December 2017 a question in a straightforward manner. I the minister on this committee. I support have to say that to this point in time I have the motion moved by Mr Ondarchie. seen absolutely no evidence that he knows anything about LaunchVic, I have seen no COUNCIL | Adjournment Transport evidence that he knows anything about his portfolio and I have certainly seen 13 December 2017 absolutely no evidence at all that he can Legislation give a straight answer. Anybody who even Amendment (Road casually listens to or views question time Hume City Council in this place will see Minister Dalidakis Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I in action. They will see his abusive, raise a matter this evening for the attention Safety, Rail and belligerent and arrogant manner towards the Minister for Local Government. members of his own party. Municipal councils pride themselves on Other Matters) Bill Mr Mulino interjected. being local government. Some in fact Mr FINN — I think Mr Mulino is adding say that it is the most important level 2017 another couple of words there that perhaps of government because it is local. It is Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — I should not be picked up by Hansard, the closest level of government to the rise to speak on the Transport Legislation because I do not think they are very people, as we are often told. It seems to Amendment (Road Safety, Rail and Other complimentary. Nonetheless he may have me very clear that representatives in local Matters) Bill 2017. It is not so much a bill a good point, because the fact of the matter government should be just that — they as a book, it has to be said. It is well bound is that members of the minister’s own party should be local. The matter that I raise and probably excellent reading, and I cannot abide him. In a quiet moment they tonight has been a matter of some rumour will leave it to Mr Morris to read over the will say, ‘God, I wish he’d go away’. They and discussion around Sunbury for quite summer break. Mr Morris can get some of will say he is a giant pain in the butt. That is some months. The first I heard about it those, wrap them up for Christmas and put what they will say. was in April, and at the time I dismissed them under the tree — something to look Mr Melhem — How would you know? it as fanciful, thinking that nobody would forward to there, I would have thought. Mr FINN — Mr Melhem comes in just at have the gall to actually try this on. But it This is clearly an important bill, but I the appropriate time. It is good to see him seems, given the evidence that I have seen think one of the things that is going to here. That is what they say about Minister over the last few days, that in fact there is make our roads safer in the not-too-distant Dalidakis. Perhaps that is another question significant evidence to lead me to raise this future is something that is not in this bill we can ask him in the committee: why do matter for the minister this evening. but that we will see introduced by the Guy members of his own party loath him so? It is now clear that a councillor on the government post-November next year, Why would members of his own party Hume City Council, Cr Ann Potter, not and that is the removal of a number of like him to go away and not ever come only does not live in the municipality of dangerous intersections across this state. back? That is putting it in a very polite Hume but does not even live in the state I know in my own area there are going form considering some of the things that of Victoria. She spends more than half to be at least two. There are a number, have been put to me by members of the her time in Cairns. I have no objection to but there are two that I want to refer to Labor Party when talking about Minister people living in Cairns. I find the northern in particular in the Sunbury electorate, Dalidakis. beaches of Cairns to be quite a nice spot, and they are ones that I am very familiar with. One is the Gap Road–Horne Street Mr Dalidakis, world-famous for his particularly in winter, but I would have thought that if you wanted to live in Cairns intersection, which is hell on legs, I have to exceptional impersonation of Sir Les say. It is currently a roundabout. One takes Patterson, has a tremendous capacity and you wanted to be involved in local government, perhaps you should run for one’s life into one’s own hands when one to get people offside because, unlike Sir actually tries to traverse that roundabout. Les, he is not funny and nobody finds the Cairns Regional Council and not the Hume City Council. It is a nightmare. The Guy government humour in what he says or what he does. is going to remove that intersection Unfortunately he is doing it courtesy of the This leads me to believe that the people of Sunbury, those in Jacksons Creek ward altogether. We are not going to remove Victorian taxpayer, and that makes a hell the roundabout and put in lights; we are of a difference. As I said, it is little wonder in particular, are being short-changed by the fact that Cr Potter is not spending going to do a lot more than that. We are that members on both sides of the house actually going to remove the intersection find him abrasive, extraordinarily difficult her time in Hume, much less in Victoria, representing her constituents on the altogether. I would hope that not only to deal with and impossible to get an would we remove the intersection but we answer out of. I notice that members of the Hume council, as indeed she should. This is a matter that I believe should be would also remove the level crossing which government have gone very quiet while I is not far away from that intersection. am saying this, and I think that tells a story investigated by the minister. It is a matter in itself. that absolutely shocked me. As I say, I did All in all it is going to be a big win for the Sunbury community when Matthew Mr Jennings interjected. not think anybody would try something like this on, but clearly Cr Potter has had Guy becomes Premier and introduces Mr FINN — If Minister Jennings wishes these changes. I know that there are a lot to refute what I have to say — and I doubt other ideas and is doing just that. So I ask the minister to investigate and ascertain of people in Sunbury who are very much he can — he would be very welcome to do looking forward to that. I received an email so. But I do not think he will. I do not think without doubt exactly what the position of Cr Potter’s residence is. If she is proven just this morning from a very prominent he will get up and say that what I have group within the Sunbury community been saying here for the last few minutes is to be living even for the majority of the time in Cairns, then I ask the minister to who have expressed their very, very wrong, because he knows the Labor Party strong support for Cassandra Marr, who only too well and he knows what members step in and dismiss Cr Potter from her position on the Hume council and to find will be the next member for Sunbury. It of the Labor Party think of Minister will be good to see her in the Parliament Dalidakis. an appropriate local replacement for that position. advocating for her community in a way As for people in the general community, that Sunbury has not been advocated anybody who has dealings with him in the for since 1999. I am very much looking general community almost unanimously forward to seeing the Sunbury community — in fact I have to say unanimously, backed up by their local member, because because I have not yet come across it has been a while since that happened. anybody who has a different view — Mr Morris — Do they have one at the regards him as somebody who is totally moment? self-absorbed, somebody who regards their Mr FINN — I am not sure if they do. concerns as unimportant and somebody The current member for Sunbury seems who is looking at something that is totally to enjoy himself just a little bit more than different to what actually matters to people he should and is not doing much for the in the Victorian community. community at all, which is a bit sad, really. These are issues that I would like to An honourable member interjected. see put on the table by the Economy and Infrastructure Committee. I think it would

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 51 Mr FINN — He will be next year. The suppose you would call it, or perhaps you this state. Thankfully this time next year he other intersection of course — and I do not would call it Dan’s Melbourne tax — it is will be gone, and that is something we are know if absolutely guaranteed to get its own name, all very much looking forward to. He will members are familiar with this — is the and there is a fair chance we will not be be gone — my very word he will. We very Mickleham Road–Broadmeadows Road able to repeat it in this house — to enter much look forward to that. intersection. It is a roundabout, and it is the city, but we are going to have an added In the meantime we are stuck, it would also a shocker. Matthew Guy’s government tolled structure for a further 12 years on the seem, with this West Gate tunnel. I will will remove that intersection as well. Monash and the Tullamarine freeways. be attending a protest rally this Sunday at That is going to be something that a lot of I should mention that as we speak the the Braybrook reserve. I am very hopeful people not just in my electorate but also Tullamarine Freeway is closed due to high- that there will be a good number of in Mr Ondarchie’s electorate will welcome tension wires which, I understand, have people there just to let the government with open arms. It will be a very good thing come down. know that the local people in the western indeed. We will have a lot of good things Mr Ondarchie — Thanks, Lily! suburbs are not one little bit happy, not happening when Matthew Guy becomes Mr FINN — Ms D’Ambrosio has a lot happy at all, with what is going on with Premier of this state in November next to answer for in so many respects. We are this project. They have been shafted year. We very much look forward to that. seeing — by this government. They have been One of the things that will not make Mr Ondarchie — Electrifying the roads. ignored. The government’s consultation process involves telling people, ‘Do what our roads any safer is the building of the Mr FINN — Mr Ondarchie refers to the appalling and outrageous West Gate tunnel you’re told and shut your face’. That is the new policy of the government electrifying government’s consultation process. We that the government signed the contract for the roads, and that may be something this week. It is quite a horrendous project, have seen so many times. The sky rail is a we can look at in our inquiry into electric classic example. actually. I do not know where the Premier’s vehicles. That may be Lily’s contribution to brain is sometimes, because it is very, very that. We will get back to you on that one. Mr Ondarchie — The youth justice clear that Transurban saw him coming and centre. said, ‘Here is an opportunity for us to make It is worth noting, by the way, that where vehicles are being diverted onto Moreland Mr FINN — The youth justice centre! a lot of money’ — and they will make a lot We could talk about the youth justice of money in this project; there are no two Road from the Tulla is of course after the tolling point. So I would like to know if centre. Ms Mikakos will remember this: ways about that. In fact, as I have said on the thousands and thousands of people a number of occasions, the only winner motorists who are using the Tullamarine Freeway today are in fact paying the toll who gathered on a wet Tuesday night in — the only beneficiary — in this project is the middle of Werribee to protest against Transurban. Transurban is going to make a only to be diverted immediately thereafter onto Moreland Road, because if they are the government. What a debacle that was, killing. They will make billions and billions and what an embarrassing backdown by of dollars out of it. It will not improve paying the toll, as far as I am concerned that is fraud. So I am very hopeful that the minister — another stuff-up from a access for people from the western minister who is so good at stuff-ups, and suburbs. It will not improve the congestion Transurban will drop the toll on the Tulla while this incident is resolved. Perhaps on this occasion she really outdid herself. problem that people in the western To have to back down in the way that she suburbs have to face on a daily basis. I am an optimist in hoping that, but I sincerely hope that will occur. Certainly did must have been embarrassing. I see In fact it is actually going to introduce a that she is a little bit sheepish. You could specific tax on the people of the west to they can afford it. After this week they can afford anything. They certainly are already, almost shear her she is so sheepish today get into the city. It is just extraordinary. when I talk about the stuff-up with the Anybody who uses this tunnel and wants but they will be swimming in cash. They will have more money on them than you youth detention centre in Werribee. Of to get into the city will have to pay an extra course they are talking about building tax. Not only does that clearly affect people can poke a stick at — I was going to say more money than the government had another one. I do not know if it will ever in the western suburbs, it also affects happen. Certainly they will not be in people in Geelong and it affects people after the privatisation of the port, but they have spent the lot. The government has government when it is built, so she need in Ballarat, Warrnambool and the entire not worry too much about that. western half of the state. spent the lot from the privatisation of the port. There is none left. Can you believe it? Ms Mikakos interjected. An honourable member interjected. Was it $9 billion? Mr FINN — She is getting a bit excited Mr FINN — Colac, indeed — even Beeac Mr Davis — There was a 46 per cent today, isn’t she? I tell you what: if I had and Warrion, and Coragulac too, and we blowout on the level crossings. been responsible for the sorts of stuff-ups could even mention old Cororooke. Mr FINN — As Mr Davis says, there are a that she has been responsible for, I would Mr Morris — Yambuk. whole range of blowouts. In fact if you look be getting a bit excited too. It is just quite Mr FINN — Yambuk as well. I had not at the major projects that this government remarkable. thought about that. I have not been to has put in place over the last three years, The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr Ramsay) Yambuk for a while. we are looking at a combined total of $24 — The bill, Mr Finn. Mr Ondarchie — Dunkeld. billion just in blowouts. That is $24 000 Mr FINN — Oh, yes, the bill. I forgot. Mr FINN — Dunkeld — we will leave it million — a huge sum of money. Can you The bill is not perfect, but it is something there. For people right across the western believe that any government would be so that will probably help in some ways. I half of the state we are going to have a incompetent? They cannot get it right to could talk about the regional rail, which is situation where they will be forced to pay the tune of $24 billion. I could go on for a very important part of Melbourne’s and a specific tax to enter the city. That is just quite some years about what we could Victoria’s rail infrastructure. Of course it beyond words. In fact it was suggested to spend $24 billion on. I will not, because I was a Liberal government that built that. I me just today by an expert in such matters want to refer to a couple of other things, know that down through Tarneit and at the that this issue should be referred to the but it just seems to me — back of Werribee there are huge expanses human rights commission, because this An honourable member interjected. of land put aside for car parks, and they is something that clearly impacts on the Mr FINN — The east–west link! How are full every day. By 7 o’clock every day human rights of people in the west — not many could we build? We could build they are full. There are huge numbers of just in the west of Melbourne but right four east–west links with $24 billion. It people who are using the regional rail. across the western parts of Victoria. is just extraordinary. That was part of We can thank the Baillieu government in Mr Morris — Call the UN. the blowouts of course — $1.3 billion. particular for the regional rail. There are Mr FINN — The UN is pretty useless, so I Nobody believes this when I talk about it so many things we have to be thankful for would not get too carried away about that. interstate. When I go interstate and talk the previous Liberal governments for, and It is the most corrupt body on the face of about this nobody believes that we have there is so much to look forward to under the earth, the UN, so we might leave them a Premier here in Victoria who spent $1.3 the next Liberal government, the Guy out of it. They are probably on the take with billion of taxpayers money to stop a major government, post-November 2018. Transurban. piece of infrastructure being built. He did The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr Ramsay) I am absolutely appalled that the people not spend the money to build the thing; — Mr Morris, I think you might have of the west are being put in this situation. he spent $1.3 billion to stop it. Nobody unintentionally misled the house earlier. It is worth remembering that not only will believes that. They think I am having a lend In fact it was Richard Donner who directed people from the western part of Melbourne of them, but it is true. I have to convince The Goonies, not Steven Spielberg. and the western part of the state have to them that it is actually true. We have a Mr Morris — Really? pay tolls and this new Melbourne tax, I Premier who has done that to the people in

IN 52 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE The ACTING PRESIDENT (Mr Ramsay) Liberal and Labor, people will always go am talking about drug lords — the people — Yes. He wrote it, not directed it. I am just for the real thing. They will go for the Labor at the top of the tree; the people who correcting the record. Party. If they think that the Liberal Party is are making millions from other people’s just a pale imitation of Labor, they will go misery. They are the scum of the earth, and COUNCIL | Constituency questions for the real thing and they will go for Labor. I would imagine that many of them are Just as in this situation, if the ALP is just a respected businesspeople. I would imagine 14 December 2017 pale imitation of the Greens, as happened that some of them are people we might in Northcote, they will go for the real thing even see regularly in our newspapers, too. perhaps in the gossip columns in the Can I suggest that the strategy that has weekend papers that show people going West Gate tunnel been adopted by the Premier and the to fancy parties, getting dressed up and government with regard to this legislation standing posing for photos in front of motorists’ tax and a range of other issues is politically sponsor boards. I imagine that they are the Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My sort of people we are talking about here. constituency question is to the Minister for stupid. It has been totally ineffective and has actually caused his government to be I am not suggesting for a moment that Roads and Road Safety. I refer the minister everybody who does that is a drug lord, to the government’s appalling decision to defeated resoundingly in Northcote. It will not save Richmond, Brunswick or any of but I would imagine that that is the sort of push ahead with its even more appalling people we are talking about here. West Gate tunnel project. In particular those seats where the ALP is under threat I refer him to the new tax that motorists from the Greens. The only way that they I think we have an obligation and a duty from Melbourne’s west who use the tunnel are going to do that is to go back to their to protect our kids. As the house is aware, I will be expected to pay for the honour of roots — go back to fighting for workers, spend a good portion of my life fighting to entering the city of Melbourne. Minister, go back to fighting for the battler — not protect children. In this particular situation why is the government discriminating this nonsense of a safe injecting room and I believe that capital punishment for these against my constituents with this tax, or is all the sorts of nonsense we have seen people — and I use that term very loosely it intending to impose a similar tax on all from this government over a period of — is indeed warranted. motorists entering the city at some future three years. I hope he does not listen to As for the war on drugs, we hear — and point in time? me, because if he does not listen to me, I am sure we are going to hear today — this government is doomed, and if ever people say that we have lost the war on there was a government that deserves to drugs. I am sure we are going to hear that be doomed, it is this one. It is not just the from someone, and I have got a fair idea COUNCIL | Second Reading worst government in the history of Victoria who it is going to be, but it is coming. I 14 December 2017 but, I would suggest to you, the worst have no doubt. The reason that we have government we have seen in this country. lost the war on drugs is that we never It is an absolute shocker. fought it. We never fought the war on To go to the heart of this bill is to drugs. If you are going to fight a war, you Drugs, Poisons contemplate what makes people think that put everything into it. We did not. We sat you can get people off drugs by facilitating back and we watched. We said, ‘There’s a and Controlled drug use. I cannot work that out. What we war on drugs’. You do not have a war on need to be doing is not helping people drugs simply by saying you have got a war shoot up; what we need to be doing is on drugs; you actually have to fight the war, Substances helping people get off the stuff. It seems to and we never did. That is what we have to me that rehabilitation is the answer to that, do: we have to go in and fight the drugs — Amendment not helping them shoot up on a daily basis destroy them at their base if we have to. — rehabilitation. There was a story some years ago where (Medically If we had the resources to do it, President George H. W. Bush — Bush 41; mandatory rehabilitation would be Bush, Sr — was going to bomb the poppy Supervised a very good thing. I think it would be fields and destroy them. I thought it was a something that would be of huge benefit great idea. Injecting Centre) to an enormous number of people, not Ms Patten — He did. just young people either, I might say, but Mr FINN — Well, he didn’t do it enough. Bill 2017 people right across this state, because we When Bill Clinton was elected, of course Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — do know that drugs destroy lives. I am that program disappeared — surprise, In rising to speak to the Drugs, Poisons not just talking about the drug users. I am surprise. It is actions that count here, not and Controlled Substances Amendment talking about their families. I am talking words. If we are serious about protecting (Medically Supervised Injecting Centre) about those who are in a relationship with our kids, if we are serious about getting rid Bill 2017 I cannot help but make the a drug user. I am talking about those who of the scourge of drugs, then we will take observation that, if ever there was a piece are in any way involved with drug users. It actions and we will take extreme actions of legislation that proves that the Premier destroys their lives. sometimes. We have to. cannot be believed and cannot be trusted, One of the most tragic things that I have I tell you what, I am serious about this is it. seen in my time in Parliament is families protecting our kids. I am very serious Ms Crozier interjected. that have been pulled asunder by drug use, about it. I have contempt for drug dealers, Mr FINN — He has got a track record. Ms that have been destroyed, that have seen for those who make money out of the Crozier points out that he has got a track child pitted against parent as a result of misfortune and the misery of others. They record. This is a classic case of a Premier drug use. It is heartbreaking in the extreme, are the lowest of the low. I think it is about who went to the people of Victoria — he and it is so unnecessary. In my view we time we started handing out life sentences was not Premier at the time; he was the have an obligation as legislators to ensure for some of these people. We need to be far Leader of the Opposition — and said, ‘No that we do everything we can to get people harsher with our criminal justice system way will we have safe injecting rooms in off the stuff. across the board but particularly when it this state while I am Premier’. Three years I have expressed in the past my very comes to drugs, because there is so much later he was in a spot of political bother, strong view that drug dealers should be dependent on it. and in trying to curry favour with the good dealt with much, much more harshly than I understand that in certain areas there people of Northcote he did a complete they are now. I have expressed the view, is a great deal of demand for drugs. That is backflip. That has not worked. and I will express it again now, that those not something that can be easily tackled. This is a bit of political advice for the who are at the top of the tree, those who You have to tackle the supply. Because if Premier; he may or may not be interested are making millions and millions of dollars, you have not got the supply, it does not in this, because he does not listen. Acting those who are being made very rich by matter what the demand is; it cannot be President Melhem, I am sure, would be the sale of drugs, should face the death met. Get rid of the supply. Nobody can very aware that the Premier is not fond penalty. I think we have an obligation to use drugs if they are not there. That is of listening to people. He seems to think defend ourselves against these people, and something that we have to do. To actually that he knows all about everything. But I I think in that situation the death penalty is facilitate drug use, as this legislation is will give him a bit of advice. I have always warranted. proposing, to my way of thinking, is insane. said that when we have a situation where I am talking about drug lords. I am not It is absolutely insane. people cannot tell the difference between talking about the dealers themselves. I

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 53 As I have said before, how can you get all. Mr Leane’s speech was a bit like this bill in September. I went down there with people off drugs by facilitating drug use? — not based in fact, extreme and does not my four kids. Let me tell you they are By setting up these injecting rooms you make a great deal of sense at all. vehemently against the sort of puppy are actually saying to people, ‘Drug use is As we know, Minister Pulford stuffed farms that we have heard about tonight okay’. You are actually saying that because up the first time. The government had to and in recent years. They are fanatically the government is endorsing it. You are withdraw the bill the first time because against puppy farms — and let me tell you not only endorsing it, but you are actually she stuffed it up so badly. When first they loved Banksia Park. They thought it providing somewhere where people can reading the bill I thought to myself, ‘She was wonderful, as did I. In fact I reckon go and shoot up. That is a nonsensical has stuffed it up again’, and then I thought, I have been into nursing homes that are scenario, in my view. That is something ‘You couldn’t get this so wrong twice’, but not as good as Banksia Park is for those that just makes no sense at all. she has. I thought that maybe it is not just dogs. Those dogs are cared for in a way I know we are going to hear later on a stuff-up. I do not wish to be a conspiracy that is just quite extraordinary. Anybody today about harm minimisation. The most theorist, but maybe it is because she has who comes into this house and says that effective form of harm minimisation is no been listening to people who have perhaps Banksia Park and places like Banksia Park drugs. The most effective form of harm an extremist ideological view of animal should be shut down, as the minister and minimisation is to get the drugs off the rights, and there are some people in our the government are proposing, has got it streets, to keep kids away — and not just community who have that. The Greens, for absolutely and totally dead wrong. kids, because there are a lot of adults on example, believe that animals are more This is part of an extremist ideological drugs as well, unfortunately. We need important than human beings. That has push. The government does not really to get everybody off these drugs. This pretty much been an established fact for a care about what it is proposing to do to legislation will not do it. This legislation very long time. Unfortunately the minister legitimate breeders. The government will not help in any way at all. This has been listening to people with a similar does not care what it might do to Banksia legislation in fact does the very opposite view. Park and some of the other really good to what we should be doing. I cannot There has been no consultation with the operators. They are the ones who are going express my opposition strongly enough to people in the industry who actually do care to suffer as a result of this. this bill and the concepts that lie behind for animals. As we know, this government’s We know that there are some who do it, because this is to my way of thinking idea of consultation is to tell people to shut mistreat their animals, who do have dogs something that is going to hurt our society their faces and do as they are told, and in conditions which are despicable. We a great deal. that is common right across the board. It should use the full force of the law that is I can understand some of the residents is something the government has been already there. We do not need extra laws to and the retailers in Richmond who are doing in just about every area since it came lock these people up, to shut them down having difficulties with drug users on their to power in 2014. The fact of the matter is and to protect those animals. We do not streets and so forth. What we need to do that we already have laws against cruelty need the extra laws. We do not need this is we need to send the police in to pick in the state. The laws to protect animals are one in particular. these people up and take them away and already there. I urge the government to get fair dinkum put them in rehab. That is how you fix it I have to say that when Mr Leane said and to use common sense. I know they — get them off the stuff. Do not help them that none of us on this side of the house say that common sense is not all that take it. That is madness. For the life of me, care about animals, he was most certainly common, but on this occasion I am I do not understand this. I have thought exaggerating things enormously in order hoping that it may prevail; I am hoping this matter through so many times. I do to understate what he was doing. In my that common sense will prevail over not understand how we can seriously say own instance I have my dog at home, a ideological extremism. It may be that that we oppose drugs, that drug abuse is pugalier called Bobby. She has been with the minister is angling for Animal Justice a bad thing, and at the same time provide us for a bit over seven years now. She is a Party preferences for the next election. I a facility such as the one that is being member of the family. In fact my children understand that she is very keen to deal proposed in this bill. It is just not possible. often suggest to me, sometimes in not too with those and has been very keen to deal It is saying one thing and doing the other. friendly terms, that I think more of her than with those of recent times. But the fact of That is what we are doing. I do of them — that is surely not the case, the matter is that this legislation will close I ask members of this house to ask but they have made the point nonetheless a number of extremely good operations themselves: are we serious about stopping on many occasions. We got her from the that are run by people committed to the drugs? If we are serious about stopping Lort Smith Animal Hospital. She was in welfare of the dogs that they raise and they drugs, we will vote against this bill. It is her last days at that establishment. She sell. That is the simple fact of the matter. simple as that: we will vote against this bill. was almost at the end of the road when we It is not going to have much of an impact I hope that we will see a consensus, not just walked in and she picked us. She made a at all on those swine who mistreat their in this house but across the community, beeline for us, and it was one of the best animals, because we already have the laws that illegal drugs must be eliminated from things that she has ever done and I have to close them down and to have them our society. This bill will not do it. We really ever done. She is just the most delightful prosecuted in a fairly big way. need to get serious, to fight drugs, and the dog, and I could not imagine life without There is a far greater agenda behind this only way to win is to fight hard. her. I have had dogs all my life. Growing legislation. It is obviously the direct result up on a dairy farm, I dealt with dogs. I of pressure from extreme lobby groups COUNCIL | Second reading remember in years gone by we had a lot of that the minister has taken on board, and I cats too, to say nothing of cows. We had a 14 December 2017 think that is very, very sad indeed. lot of animals on that farm. As has been mentioned there are a The fact of the matter is that if you do not number of amendments which I think care for animals and you are in an industry will make the bill better. I urge the house Domestic Animals that is based on animals, you are going to to consider those amendments very, lose. It just does not make sense to mistreat very carefully and to take those on board, animals, because they are your living; because if we do get this legislation, it Amendment (Puppy they are a part of your business. So if you needs to be amended significantly to take mistreat animals, you are just not doing off some of the more outrageous aspects Farms and Pet your job properly. It is quite insane. For Mr that we are speaking about in this bill. Leane to get up and carry on the way he I will not be voting for the bill, but I will Shops) Bill 2016 did this evening was just quite amazing. Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — In be voting for the amendments put forward Mr Jennings — Did you know what you by Mr Davis and Mr Bourman. I urge the rising to speak on the Domestic Animals were going to say until he spoke? Amendment (Puppy Farms and Pet Shops) house to take those on board and to ensure Bill 2016 I have to say that Mr Leane’s Mr FINN — Well, I had a fair idea of what that, as I say, common sense does prevail, contribution to this debate a little earlier I was going to say, but Mr Leane captured that we do get the right results and that we was stunning; that is a fair description. my imagination, Minister. As much as are not dictated to by extremist elements in There have been many colourful he was using his, he captured mine. For our community who are pushing a line that contributions from Mr Leane over the anybody to say that we on this side of the is just meant to hurt people. I think that years that I have witnessed, but that one house do not care about animals is just an is the bottom line. I ask the house to take just about outdid the lot. When he stacks absolute nonsense. my comments, and the comments of other on a turn, he really knows how to do it. The As a number of members have, I went members on this side of the house, into fact is that it made absolutely no sense at down to Banksia Park in Gippsland consideration.

IN 54 AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 FINN THE HOUSE COUNCIL | Constituency questions The master plan has landed, and I hate 15 December 2017 to tell the minister that the master plan is in fact dead on arrival. The arrival of the master plan was greeted with horror by the Sunbury community; in fact it was Hoppers Crossing greeted largely with disgust by the Sunbury community. It provides a whole range of level crossing things which are totally unsatisfactory and Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My go against the express desires of many, constituency question is to the Minister for many people in Sunbury and surrounds Public Transport. In light of the Auditor- over a long period of time. General’s scathing criticism of the Andrews I think the time has come, given that we government’s level crossing removal have waited a long time for this to occur, program, there are further questions my for the minister to take this matter back constituents would like answered. After to the drawing board, to pulp this master failing to heed the pleas of the Essendon plan and to direct the Victorian Planning community to change the flawed plan Authority to start again. Even better, to remove the Buckley Street crossing, a perhaps he can conduct the master plan plan which will split that community and development himself in the hope that we make traffic problems abundantly worse in might be able to get a half-decent one the area, and her flat refusal to meet with sometime next year. So I am asking the Williamstown residents to discuss their minister to do that. As I say, the Sunbury concerns about a sky rail in their suburb, community is disgusted with what the I am hopeful the minister will provide an VPA has proposed. There has to be a much answer to my question today. I am, after better way for this site than what has been all, a born optimist. Will the minister proposed in this master plan — I have no explain to the Wyndham community, doubt about that at all — and I am asking including the mayor and council, why the minister to ensure that that plan is she refuses to include the dangerous and developed properly and we do get the sort congested Hoppers Crossing level crossing of result that we need and we deserve on on the list of level crossing removals? Jacksons Hill in Sunbury. I finish by wishing every member and COUNCIL | Adjournment every staff member and their families a very, very merry Christmas and all the very 15 December 2017 best for 2018 — particularly on this side of the house for 2018. I sincerely hope that each and every member will remember on Victoria University Christmas Day to have one for me. Sunbury site Mr FINN (Western Metropolitan) — My matter is for the Minister for Planning. Whenever I have raised this matter about the government’s plans for the future of the former Victoria University site on Jacksons Hill in Sunbury — I have raised it on a number of occasions over the last year or two — the minister has told me that there is a report on the way. I have been told that the Victorian Planning Authority (VPA) is preparing a master plan and we should all prepare ourselves for that because that is going to solve every problem we have ever had.

IN FINN THE HOUSE AUGUST TO DECEMBER 2017 55 FINN IN THE HOUSE Speeches August to December 2017

Published by Bernie Finn MP Member for Western Metropolitan Region Shadow Assistant Minister for Melbourne’s West Shadow Assistant Minister for Autism Spectrum Disorder Shadow Assistant Minister for Electoral Integrity

Suite 101, 19 Lacy Street, Braybrook Vic 3019 Telephone (03) 9317 5900 • Fax (03) 9317 5911 Email [email protected] Web www.berniefinn.com